22 Shawn Johnson: The Mindset of an Olympic Champion

Do you know what it feels like to be a world champion and Olympic gold medalist? Most of us will never make the Olympics, but what if you could LEARN and APPLY this same mindset to your business, career, health and relationships? If you're like me, you know it would be a powerful mindset to […] Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 22 with Shawn Johnson.

• 0:07Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:32Lewis Howes?

  What is up, all you beautiful greats out there? I hope you're having a fantastic week, wherever you are in the world. And a quick shout out to our Fan of the Week, Johnny Jensen, who tagged a picture on Instagram from Maidstone East Railway Station in Maidstone, England. So, big shout out to you, Johnny. Thanks for posting and listening in. I appreciate you. And there's lots of pictures you guys have been posting on Instagram and on Twitter and on Facebook of where you're listening to the School of Greatness. So, keep on posting. I appreciate it. We've got a huge episode this week. It's with the one and only Shawn

• 1:13Lewis Howes?

  Johnson. Now, if you've been living under a rock for the last four or five years, you wouldn't know about Shawn, but she is basically America's sweetheart. She won an Olympic gold medal in Beijing in gymnastics, and she won a number of silver medals as well. She also won a show called Dancing with the Stars a few years ago. And she's just an amazing individual, a pleasure to be around. And she actually beat me in CrossFit this last week, which was a little bit embarrassing. But there was a gymnastics element to it. So, I mean, you've got a 6'4" guy that has no clue what he's doing in gymnastics, and you have the world champion in gymnastics. She better be able to beat me. But, other

• 1:57Lewis Howes?

  than that, I did beat her at another exercise. So, we're even now, and we're going to keep the competition going. I think she's probably going to dominate me long term. But it's been fun hanging out and at least beating her one time at something. Now, I'm excited to share with you guys this interview, because Shawn has some amazing insights. Now, when you get to perform at the hardest level of sports, the Olympics, and all the pressure's on you. Millions and millions of people watching you all around the world and you're only 16 years old and you come out with a gold medal. You've got something inside you that should be shared with the world.

• 2:40Lewis Howes?

  So we're going to learn about what Shawn thought about right before these big moments and how she was able to focus in when all the pressure from the world, family, friends, town, state, country was all on her. How could she target in and harness her greatness and let it out at the right moment? She's going to talk about that. She's also going to talk about her experience with Dancing With The Stars and a lot of other cool things she's been up to. I'm very excited to share this interview with you. So make sure to stay tuned and listen to the entire thing. You're not going to want to miss out. She is spectacular. I want to share the quote of the week before we get into the interview.

• 3:20Lewis Howes?

  And I've been doing a lot more lately of pushing myself and stretching myself and really going for it. Not playing small in the world anymore, but really stretching to see how far I can really go in all senses of the word and how much I can get done and how much I can create in a shorter amount of time as opposed to giving myself longer deadlines, giving myself shorter deadlines and actually seeing what is possible when I put a little pressure on myself and what I can actually create. So the quote of the week is this. It's from Mario Andretti. He says, "If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough."

• 4:05Lewis Howes?

  So think about it right now. How is your day, your week, your month going? Do you feel like, ah, it's pretty good? It's pretty easy, pretty relaxed, you know, nothing too challenging for you? If so, why don't you start putting some pressure on yourself to create more, to play bigger in the world, to start dominating in your industry, in your workouts, with your, whatever you're trying to create, whatever you're trying to accomplish, start pushing yourself, stretching yourself to actually create it faster, to get it done, to make it bigger. To change the world more. So that's what I want to challenge you guys with this week.

• 4:41Lewis Howes?

  And make sure to tweet that out if you like that quote. But here we go, guys. This is what you've all been waiting for. This is with the queen, America's sweetheart. All the other cool words you want to say about her. But I'm excited to introduce you to the one and only Shawn Johnson.

• 5:06Lewis Howes?

  All right. What's up everyone? Lewis Howes here and I've got a new good friend Shawn Johnson who's in the studios with me today. What's up Shawn?

• 5:13Speaker 01

  What's up?

• 5:14Lewis Howes?

  We were just salsa dancing a little earlier and Shawn was teaching me a little bit of her moves, but she can turn and move it.

• 5:21Speaker 01

  Not really. I just be pushed on the floor.

• 5:24Lewis Howes?

  You just like to be pushed around the floor?

• 5:25Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 5:26Lewis Howes?

  So we were just talking about where Shawn is from because she said that's what usually is like the most boring question she gets. But she's actually from West Des Moines, Iowa, not Des Moines, Iowa. So we just want to make that distinction here. And for those that don't know Shawn Johnson, she is a superstar. She's Olympic gold medalist, silver medalist in like six events and world champion, national champion. Just pretty much everything. You've won everything, right?

• 5:53Speaker 01

  Nah, sure. I don't know.

• 5:56Lewis Howes?

  She's, she's super humble too. So she's probably never going to brag about it, but extremely talented. I'm, I'm excited to talk to you. We've been hanging out for about the last hour. And she's been making fun of how tall I am. She's about 4'11", right?

• 6:11Speaker 01

  Hey, come on. Just say five foot. It sounds better.

• 6:14Lewis Howes?

  But I think she's probably 4'11".

• 6:15Speaker 01

  I'm probably 4'11".

• 6:16Lewis Howes?

  Which is like, isn't that like technically under, isn't that midget size?

• 6:20Speaker 01

  No, it's not. It's 4'7". Now it's been Googled because people have talked to me so much about this.

• 6:26Lewis Howes?

  You sure?

• 6:27Speaker 01

  It's 4'7".

• 6:27Lewis Howes?

  You get it all the time, don't you? Well, your Wikipedia, let me see what your Wikipedia says because that's like.

• 6:31Speaker 01

  Well, it's about 16. I was 4'7" when I competed at the Olympics.

• 6:35Lewis Howes?

  How it says? Let me see here. It says 4'9".

• 6:38Speaker 01

  Well, that was in my in-between stage.

• 6:40Lewis Howes?

  Okay. So she's 4'11" and you just turned 21 recently, right?

• 6:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, January.

• 6:47Lewis Howes?

  Okay. It's pretty amazing what you've done and. Basically, you're 21 and you've accomplished more than people are ever gonna accomplish.

• 6:55Speaker 01

  I know, I forget half the stuff that I've already done. Yeah, I like to look back at pictures and stuff, I'm like, oh.

• 7:00Lewis Howes?

  Like Beijing seems like forever ago.

• 7:02Speaker 01

  It does. London seems like forever ago. I mean, I didn't compete, but still getting to experience that, yeah. I was working.

• 7:08Lewis Howes?

  Working or for?

• 7:09Speaker 01

  Uh, I worked for the Today Show.

• 7:12Lewis Howes?

  Oh, did you?

• 7:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:13Lewis Howes?

  Every day you're doing like interviews?

• 7:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:15Lewis Howes?

  Oh, that's gotta be cool.

• 7:15Speaker 01

  I did all their social media work. It was pretty cool.

• 7:17Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 7:18Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:18Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Yeah, I was there. We didn't, we didn't qualify for Team Handball unfortunately, so I just pouted and watched the team that did go.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  Well, I didn't qualify either, so I was crowding a little bit too.

• 7:30Lewis Howes?

  Now, you were, uh, you got injured in 2010?

• 7:35Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 7:35Lewis Howes?

  Skiing?

• 7:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:37Lewis Howes?

  And you weren't supposed to ski?

• 7:38Speaker 01

  No.

• 7:39Lewis Howes?

  And I know you've talked about this a bunch.

• 7:41Speaker 01

  It's okay.

• 7:42Lewis Howes?

  But I wanna talk about comebacks and what it takes, uh, I guess mentally to like come back from an injury like that. Cause I've had major injuries where I've had to sit out a year of football and things like that, and I've had, I've had to retire as well. And when I watched some videos of you on YouTube competing before you got injured, you were like so in the zone when I would watch. Maybe they just showed the ones that you're in the zone when I saw, but you were so in the zone. And it was like, it was beautiful to watch. It was amazing. Because you had this look in your eyes before. I, I watched before you about to go out, you'd have this look in your eyes. But then when you were performing, it was like, you just had the whole package.

• 8:27Lewis Howes?

  Because you had the look, but you also had like the confidence, you had the energy, you had the smile. You weren't just like rigid the whole time. I wanna learn about what it was like when you came back from the injury. How did it feel, I guess, mentally, confidence wise, poised wise? Did you feel like you had that same mentality? But just the physical stuff, maybe you were a little off from the injury, or how did you feel?

• 8:50Speaker 01

  Um, I think I lost all of it.

• 8:52Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 8:53Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um.

• 8:54Lewis Howes?

  The mental side, the physical side of the confidence?

• 8:56Speaker 01

  I think it was still there, but up until I got injured, I had never been injured. I had sprains, strains, pulls, but I'd never been taken out of my sport for a longer duration than two weeks. And I almost had that sense of like invincibility. I thought I could do anything and.

• 9:18Speaker 01

  You kind of feed off that. I think my confidence feeded off of that and um when I got injured, it kind of stripped all of that away. I found that I was hesitant. I found a a fear kind of aspect that I'd never had before.

• 9:34Lewis Howes?

  You never felt fear before, really?

• 9:36Speaker 01

  You know, things made me nervous, but it was a thrill. I mean, it wasn't like a genuine fear of, you know, you could be laying in a hospital bed like you did the.

• 9:44Lewis Howes?

  So you're afraid of like pain, like injury?

• 9:46Speaker 01

  I was. I, coming back from my triad uh of my knee, it it was awful. I I am physically active every single day, all day, and having to lay in a hospital bed or a P T bed and kind of be humbled by the fact you had to start over.

• 10:06Lewis Howes?

  So humbling.

• 10:07Speaker 01

  It's, you go from the top of the world down to the bottom and I mean, there's things that can be a lot worse, of course, so I I hate to complain about that, but I remember coming out of surgery and them saying, well, we're gonna have to teach you how to walk again and the climb a stair. And I was like, I'm an Olympic athlete, you know, I'll be back in a couple of weeks, whatever. And, you know, I still struggle with it. It's been two and a half years.

• 10:29Lewis Howes?

  You struggle with walking or?

• 10:30Speaker 01

  No. With my knee, with my knee.

• 10:34Lewis Howes?

  You still feel pain? You still feel things you can't do?

• 10:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's just, again, it's frustrating because when I was competing, I felt like I was Iron Man. I mean, I even feel like I could, Iron Woman, like I could do anything. And after I got injured, it's, you just have that hesitation there and I just kept picturing myself tearing it again or feeling that pop and I would give anything to go back to my comeback and be able to take that hesitation away, but I literally couldn't find a way to do it.

• 11:04Lewis Howes?

  What do you think you would have need to do to overcome that fear after, when coming back from injury? Like if you could say, say you could go back now, you're like, I could do anything to go back, how would you change it so you could get back to the place when you were sixteen? That fearless young woman who?

• 11:20Speaker 01

  I don't know. I I feel like especially when I was sixteen, I had a sense of just.

• 11:26Speaker 01

  I was naive. I was innocent. I had no idea.

• 11:29Lewis Howes?

  Never been injured, so you didn't know what it felt like?

• 11:30Speaker 01

  No, I, I mean, I, I kinda didn't even think for myself. My coach thought for me. He would tell me to go do something I would. Whereas when I got older, I, it, it, I understood the way things worked more. You know, he would tell me to go do a triple twisting double back. I'm like, okay. I have to think about that one now. And that sounds impossible.

• 11:49Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 11:50Speaker 01

  You know, it just registers different.

• 11:52Lewis Howes?

  Did you say a triple flip?

• 11:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've never done that.

• 11:54Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 11:55Speaker 01

  Slightly exaggerating for dramatic effect. Um, no, um, but it was, it's difficult. I don't know if there's anything I could change except for have been given more time to train, to hopefully train that out of me.

• 12:09Lewis Howes?

  Train it out of you.

• 12:10Speaker 01

  But

• 12:12Speaker 01

  I think it's just a mental thing that kinda gets, lack of a better word, broken.

• 12:16Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. Is there a way to get it back, you think?

• 12:19Speaker 01

  I think there definitely is. I'd say time.

• 12:22Lewis Howes?

  When someone's injured, you're just.

• 12:23Speaker 01

  No, I mean, not at all. I feel like there, you can definitely overcome anything, especially injuries of all sorts. People have come back and been extremely successful. I, I made it back into international competition. I medaled. I.

• 12:36Lewis Howes?

  Two thousand and eleven, right?

• 12:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, and.

• 12:37Lewis Howes?

  I saw the Visa championships, right?

• 12:40Speaker 01

  Um, yep, Visa and then Pan Ams.

• 12:43Lewis Howes?

  Oh, and you medaled?

• 12:44Speaker 01

  I medaled, yeah. Um, silvers. As always, always silver.

• 12:50Lewis Howes?

  You got gold in a couple.

• 12:51Speaker 01

  I got a few gold, yeah. Um. But I think it just in my case, I don't think my heart was in it anymore.

• 13:00Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 13:00Speaker 01

  I.

• 13:01Lewis Howes?

  You weren't like a hundred percent passionate?

• 13:03Speaker 01

  Um, I was passionate over the idea. But I was doing it for other people.

• 13:08Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 13:09Speaker 01

  I wanted for myself, I wanted to get back just to know I could.

• 13:14Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 13:14Speaker 01

  And it's like, as soon as I. I did make it back to Pan Am's and championships. I was successful and

• 13:21Lewis Howes?

  You didn't need to win.

• 13:22Speaker 01

  I didn't need it, no. And I I proved myself that my knee could last, but I always said the reason why I retired was my knee had issues. It was torn again and I needed surgery and didn't have time. But I remembered back in two thousand eight how much the Olympics meant to me. Like I lived it, I breathed it. It was my entire world. And had I continued without retiring, I had a chance of making the team, a decent chance.

• 13:53Lewis Howes?

  In London.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  In London.

• 13:54Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 13:55Speaker 01

  And I told myself that if I was given one of those places, knowing that it didn't mean that much to me anymore, I'd be taking it away from a sixteen year old who whose world that was. And that crushed me. I didn't think it was fair.

• 14:10Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. But what if you were more talented than a sixteen year old?

• 14:16Speaker 01

  I think

• 14:16Lewis Howes?

  More experienced, more talented.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  I think, well, first of all, they did pretty well. They won. Um, but I I I have always been a firm believer in like passion over talent. I think, you know, you can be the, you can be the biggest or the most talented person in the world. But if you don't love what you do, then it's not going to show and it's not going to work.

• 14:35Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  And you don't really necessarily have to have it, you know, the greatest talent. But if you work for it and you love it, then you'll have better results.

• 14:44Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you said once in your book, that life will be richer once you find your passion, but never lose sight of everything else. If one activity becomes everything to you, you may have nothing left if you lose it. So

• 14:57Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 14:58Lewis Howes?

  You have all these great lessons in your book.

• 15:00Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 15:00Lewis Howes?

  So you decided that even if you got it, you wouldn't do it? Or you thought you decided it wouldn't be fair if you got it?

• 15:05Speaker 01

  Kind of like I said there, I just, I knew it wasn't my passion anymore.

• 15:09Lewis Howes?

  It wasn't the main thing.

• 15:10Speaker 01

  I knew I had, I don't know, I felt like I could do more good going and being the team's cheerleader.

• 15:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 15:16Speaker 01

  Than I could going and competing. And it was something that just clicked one day. I knew I was done. I knew I couldn't go any further. I had images of me not being able to walk when I was thirty because I was, you know, killing my body so much and my knee and not putting my health first. And then I saw the other girls I trained with who Would literally do anything to be there and I just kind of as I was like in the mama role when I went back because I was so old. Um, I don't know. I just, yeah, I just couldn't see myself taking it from them.

• 15:51Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. Interesting. Now, I'm interested in here, your answer to this. I have a feeling what I know what you're gonna say, but if you could go back to the day you went skiing, would you not go skiing that day or would you ski still?

• 16:07Speaker 01

  I would still ski.

• 16:08Lewis Howes?

  That's what I thought.

• 16:09Speaker 01

  Everything happens for a reason.

• 16:10Lewis Howes?

  That's what I thought you'd say.

• 16:11Speaker 01

  And, you know, my comeback, the injury, everything was, I think, for the better. I mean, it taught me a lot, just it humbled me a lot, learning that I, you can be broken, but you can also get back up from it and, you know, making the comeback and deciding retire. I learned that I was doing it for the wrong reason. I was doing it not for me, but I also learned to make a decision based on, you know, it went against everything the entire world was telling me to do.

• 16:43Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 16:43Speaker 01

  And I made it for me and it was the best thing. So I, I learned lessons the hard way. My parents, they always learned lessons the hard way.

• 16:49Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure. A lot of us do.

• 16:51Speaker 01

  It's a fun way to do it.

• 16:52Lewis Howes?

  It is. It's more fun. Now, did you feel a lot of pressure going into 2008? Because you were like the world champion before then in 07, right?

• 16:59Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah.

• 17:00Lewis Howes?

  Did you feel like the weight of the world on your shoulders or the country? Or were you just kind of like, um, so passionate about the Olympics?

• 17:08Speaker 01

  I, I definitely felt pressure. I mean, if you ask anybody around me, I was a stress ball, pretty much.

• 17:14Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 17:14Speaker 01

  Um.

• 17:15Lewis Howes?

  You were like the golden girl back then, right?

• 17:16Speaker 01

  A little bit. They, they had me pegged to come home with six gold medals.

• 17:22Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my God. That's too much pressure.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, front.

• 17:24Lewis Howes?

  Sixteen year old, right?

• 17:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, front page of every newspaper. I was like, great. Um, but in, in a way, I loved it back then. I liked the motivation. I liked the challenge. Um, I think I was more capable of handling it back then than I am now. Such a people pleaser now that I'm like, oh, gosh, if I come back with one, they're not gonna be happy.

• 17:45Lewis Howes?

  Right, right, right. That's funny. Now, did you have more pressure the first time around or after you came back, you felt?

• 17:52Speaker 01

  I personally feel like I had more pressure the second time.

• 17:54Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, why?

• 17:55Speaker 01

  Um, because the last time people saw me compete was in two thousand eight. Being on top of the world.

• 18:02Lewis Howes?

  You came back in two thousand ten or two thousand eleven?

• 18:04Speaker 01

  I came back and competed for the first time in two thousand uh ten.

• 18:08Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 18:09Speaker 01

  And bombed.

• 18:10Lewis Howes?

  Before the injury?

• 18:12Speaker 01

  This is after the injury.

• 18:12Lewis Howes?

  After the injury, yeah, bombed.

• 18:14Speaker 01

  Bombed, fell on everything.

• 18:15Lewis Howes?

  I think I saw a couple of those.

• 18:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, probably.

• 18:18Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 18:18Speaker 01

  Um, but it's again humbling to know you have to start. You can't just walk back in where you were. You have to start over.

• 18:27Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  But people kind of put out their, I don't know, their own reason as to why I was coming back. And no one ever really asked what my reason was.

• 18:39Lewis Howes?

  They just assumed, right?

• 18:40Speaker 01

  And everything was because I didn't win gold in the all around. I was coming back for redemption.

• 18:46Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 18:46Speaker 01

  Had nothing to do with it.

• 18:48Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 18:49Speaker 01

  So I don't know, I feel like the, the pressure came back with. The only thing people expected to see was what I was in two thousand eight or better. And I was a different person.

• 18:59Lewis Howes?

  You're a different person, yeah, I think I remember you saying that in an interview. Now, one of the things is you said when you were training, when you were growing up, that you decided not to do the typical amount of hours, right?

• 19:10Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 19:11Lewis Howes?

  Was it normally like forty hours a week as most gymnasts do?

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Forty to fifty.

• 19:14Lewis Howes?

  And you said, I'm gonna have a balance in my life.

• 19:16Speaker 01

  Pretty much.

• 19:17Lewis Howes?

  And I'm gonna do twenty or twenty-five or?

• 19:19Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 19:19Lewis Howes?

  Half, basically.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 19:21Lewis Howes?

  Do you think if you would have done the forty, it would have changed anything? You think it would have been more pressure, more stress?

• 19:26Speaker 01

  I don't think I would have made it.

• 19:27Lewis Howes?

  You wouldn't have made it because it would have been too much, right?

• 19:29Speaker 01

  I think I would have broken.

• 19:30Lewis Howes?

  You were, you were more loose because you were only doing twenty hours a week, right?

• 19:33Speaker 01

  I had, I still had freedom. I still had a room to be a kid. I went to dances, I went to football games, I got to go play with friends and do homework and go to school and have friend, you know, just have a normal life. And I saw a lot of girls who didn't get that, who didn't make it. Because of it.

• 19:55Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 19:56Speaker 01

  And I think they could have.

• 19:57Lewis Howes?

  Because they were training so hard.

• 19:58Speaker 01

  Because they overtrain. You know, when you're, when you're 12 years old and living in a gym, doing 50 hours a week, you homeschool there, you do everything. You don't have friends outside.

• 20:07Lewis Howes?

  Homeschool at the gym?

• 20:08Speaker 01

  Homeschool at the gym.

• 20:09Lewis Howes?

  Did you do that for a while?

• 20:10Speaker 01

  No, never.

• 20:11Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 20:12Speaker 01

  My coach fortunately didn't believe in that. He wanted, he wanted an outlet. He wanted all of his girls to be able to get away from the sport. And he said, that's what kept your mind fresh. Well, when you see a 12 year old break because they're doing 50 hours. I mean, of course they're not going to go any further.

• 20:31Lewis Howes?

  That's crazy. What do you think's the difference between a champion and second place?

• 20:37Speaker 01

  That's a hard question. Cause I have many, I have many different opinions on that. Um. I don't know. Given my past of like the all around coming in second place. I knew there was physically and mentally, nothing more I could have done. So I did. So to say that I could have given more.

• 21:00Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 21:00Speaker 01

  And the difference between champion and second is an effort of any sort.

• 21:06Lewis Howes?

  You gave your best.

• 21:06Speaker 01

  I mean, I lived it. I breathed it. I trained my entire life for it. I couldn't have done more. I mean, even if I went back and said I could have, I don't think that's the proper way to approach it.

• 21:18Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 21:19Speaker 01

  So that's difficult.

• 21:21Lewis Howes?

  Let's frame it this way. Let's frame it, someone who always gets first.

• 21:24Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 21:25Lewis Howes?

  And someone who always gets second or third, but just can't break into the first.

• 21:30Speaker 01

  It's because they don't believe in themselves.

• 21:32Lewis Howes?

  That's what you think it is?

• 21:33Speaker 01

  I don't think, yeah.

• 21:34Lewis Howes?

  Let's talk about the power of belief. Cause I've, I've done a, I did a show where I talked about the power of belief. And some of the greatest athletes in the world, I feel like have one of two things, in my opinion. They have a belief in either their faith in God, a higher sense of being. And they're so strongly believing in that. Nothing can break their faith in that.

• 21:55Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 21:56Lewis Howes?

  That their faith is helping them achieve, you know, higher levels of athletic ability. Or the other side of the spectrum is you see athletes who are so confident and believe in themselves so much. They're so egotistical. They're like, I'm the greatest gifts in the world, right?

• 22:12Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 22:12Lewis Howes?

  But they believe it. And they have so much certainty with that belief, either way, with God or themselves. You think that's true or no?

• 22:21Speaker 01

  I think if anybody has that strong of a belief, it gives them something to fall back on. It gives them reason.

• 22:29Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 22:30Speaker 01

  I I've seen the the belief in self that can be destructive because.

• 22:38Lewis Howes?

  You mean believing in yourself can be destructive?

• 22:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, definitely. I mean, if if you are that that person that says, I believe so strongly that I'm gonna win, and I believe so strongly, I've given my all, I've almost seen it as a cop out in some senses.

• 22:54Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 22:54Speaker 01

  Because if they believe so strongly and they've convinced themselves of that, then they're not opening themselves up to what other people are doing.

• 23:03Lewis Howes?

  Uh huh.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  And the actual competition that's out there.

• 23:05Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 23:07Speaker 01

  I think when you have a belief in faith, you're open to what else is out there.

• 23:13Lewis Howes?

  Sure. You have a strong belief in your faith, right?

• 23:15Speaker 01

  Yes. So I I don't know, it it makes it not about you.

• 23:19Lewis Howes?

  It makes it takes pressure off you, right?

• 23:21Speaker 01

  Yes, in a sense.

• 23:23Lewis Howes?

  Because it's not like, oh, it's all on me.

• 23:25Speaker 01

  No. I mean, I feel like the people who have that strong belief in themselves, they don't have any other greater reason.

• 23:31Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 23:32Speaker 01

  If you have a belief in faith, then you have, you know, a greater reason to work for it.

• 23:36Lewis Howes?

  Sure, right. What a, you've been a competitor your whole life.

• 23:40Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 23:41Lewis Howes?

  So what's your thoughts, or what's what's competition taught you about the human spirit in general? Whether it be yourself or just witnessing it, and other people, competitors, or teammates?

• 23:53Speaker 01

  I'm competitive in everything, everything I do.

• 23:56Lewis Howes?

  I don't think you could tip a cow as good as I could.

• 24:00Speaker 01

  Probably not, but I'll try as hard. Um, I don't know, I think, you know, in human spirit, it's just like, having like a competitive spirit, basically, I think, just gives you a daily goal to be better.

• 24:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 24:13Speaker 01

  I mean, if you don't have any drive to compete against yourself or even others, then you don't have a direction to go towards.

• 24:20Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 24:21Speaker 01

  And like, you would get kind of just complacent.

• 24:25Lewis Howes?

  That's true. That's true. Why do you think you never got complacent?

• 24:28Speaker 01

  Because I always want to be better. I always knew I was capable of doing better. I think, again, that's that belief side of it. I feel like. If you believe you can do more, then you're gonna push yourself to to prove you can.

• 24:43Lewis Howes?

  But where did that drive come from? Like, how did you, why were you so motivated every single day? To train, to perform, to compete, to win? Where does that come from? Does it come from parents? Does it come from watching sports on TV? Does it come from friends?

• 24:59Speaker 01

  I'd say a lot of people are either born with it or not, maybe?

• 25:02Lewis Howes?

  Think you're just born with it? That drive, that competitive spirit?

• 25:06Speaker 01

  I don't know, because I see people who don't have it. I'm like, I don't understand how you could not.

• 25:10Lewis Howes?

  Right?

• 25:10Speaker 01

  Um, I also, yeah.

• 25:12Lewis Howes?

  I hate to lose.

• 25:13Speaker 01

  So do I.

• 25:14Lewis Howes?

  More than I like, I hate it more.

• 25:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I don't know, because even when I started competing in gymnastics, I never won. I was, I was the girl at the, like, end of the floor that was getting that really hot pink colored ribbon that, yes, I never won.

• 25:29Lewis Howes?

  Never won?

• 25:30Speaker 01

  No.

• 25:30Lewis Howes?

  So when was the moment you started winning and realizing, I have an opportunity, potential to go to the Olympics?

• 25:36Speaker 01

  Well, I think that was the interesting part of, like, my career is I never focused on winning. Especially when I started out and I was in like thirty something place out of thirty nine people.

• 25:52Speaker 01

  It was never about winning. I just was always either frustrated because I made a mistake and I wanted to do better.

• 25:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 25:58Speaker 01

  But I could have cared less. I liked the hot pink colors.

• 26:01Lewis Howes?

  You like flipping around and?

• 26:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think the only thing, I think the only thing that really started to make me want to work more and kind of get on top of the podium was the feeling of pride you had when you were successful. It had nothing to do with a medal. That was kind of just, you know, extra. It was just knowing you had done your best and you were being acknowledged for it. But that's something my coach taught us when growing up was medals and scores have nothing to do with it. It's the, the, the feeling of knowing you couldn't have given anymore.

• 26:38Speaker 01

  I was thankful for that one.

• 26:39Lewis Howes?

  That's cool. What do you think was the most important lesson you learned from your coach?

• 26:43Speaker 01

  I'd say that.

• 26:44Lewis Howes?

  That one?

• 26:44Speaker 01

  Um, that it's, he really drilled into me that it's, it's not about what others think. It's about knowing at the end of the day that you worked as hard as you possibly could. And, you know, even if a score is worth the very last place, you couldn't be any happier.

• 27:05Lewis Howes?

  That's tough though, when there's so many people are telling you what they think and being critical and being detrimental and giving praises.

• 27:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:13Lewis Howes?

  Put that aside and be like, it doesn't matter what half the world thinks of me right now.

• 27:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it's difficult, but yeah, it's, it's liberating. I mean, I remember in the Olympics, like going back to that, what he taught me and like really thinking about that. Cause I came in second multiple times and.

• 27:31Lewis Howes?

  Like four or five times.

• 27:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I was, I was on a, I was on a roll.

• 27:37Lewis Howes?

  Silver's still pretty good.

• 27:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, right. But I remember just like the freeing feeling of knowing in myself that I couldn't have done anymore. But the reward being every time I finished, I would stand up and see 50,000 people in the arena on their feet. I mean, there's, there's no greater like satisfaction than knowing you've been like accepted pretty much.

• 28:00Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  And just because that one judge on the floor doesn't give you that score, you've kind of won over the world.

• 28:07Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 28:07Speaker 01

  It's, I kind of found my, I don't know, my reward in that instead of in the medal.

• 28:13Lewis Howes?

  And do you miss that feeling?

• 28:14Speaker 01

  I do.

• 28:15Lewis Howes?

  Performing in front of 50, 100,000, millions of people watching.

• 28:18Speaker 01

  I really do. I miss, I miss the stage. I miss performing. I miss that daily goal of working up towards that.

• 28:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 28:26Speaker 01

  You know, I don't know. It's, it's a, makes you feel awesome.

• 28:31Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing. It's the best feeling. What are you trying to do? Are you ever gonna try to compete again or anything?

• 28:36Speaker 01

  Um, I've, I would love to. I don't know what it would be.

• 28:40Lewis Howes?

  CrossFit, Mary?

• 28:42Speaker 01

  I don't know. I don't think I can do that one. But I would love to.

• 28:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Have you thought about any other sports? You thought about going to Olympics or something else?

• 28:51Speaker 01

  I would love to.

• 28:52Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. You haven't thought about any other sports though?

• 28:54Speaker 01

  I don't know what I'd be able to do. I don't know what. I'm not quite hand-eye coordinated.

• 29:01Lewis Howes?

  Nothing with balls.

• 29:02Speaker 01

  Can flip on a four-inch beam.

• 29:03Lewis Howes?

  What about the trampoline gymnastics?

• 29:06Speaker 01

  Oh, heck no.

• 29:08Lewis Howes?

  No?

• 29:08Speaker 01

  That thing is terrifying. Have you ever been to trampoline?

• 29:11Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 29:11Speaker 01

  I'm an Olympic gymnast and I hate the trampoline.

• 29:13Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 29:14Speaker 01

  I can do like one flip, but when you start doing like six or seven.

• 29:18Lewis Howes?

  I'm worried about breaking my legs or something.

• 29:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, thank you.

• 29:21Lewis Howes?

  Okay, so that's out.

• 29:22Speaker 01

  Diving, but.

• 29:23Lewis Howes?

  There you go.

• 29:24Speaker 01

  Then you have to think about, we land on our feet, they land on their heads.

• 29:28Lewis Howes?

  Oh, man.

• 29:29Speaker 01

  And I've turned everything around.

• 29:30Lewis Howes?

  Well.

• 29:31Speaker 01

  That might be a little difficult.

• 29:32Lewis Howes?

  I'm sure you'll figure it out if you want to. What's, uh, so there's a cool poem you wrote.

• 29:36Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh.

• 29:36Lewis Howes?

  I saw on your book.

• 29:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:38Lewis Howes?

  And there's a book, there's a poem you wrote in seventh grade.

• 29:42Speaker 01

  You prob- yeah.

• 29:44Lewis Howes?

  That's what it said on the bucket. It says like, a caring girl.

• 29:48Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh.

• 29:49Lewis Howes?

  Who loves.

• 29:49Speaker 01

  Are you gonna read this whole thing?

• 29:50Lewis Howes?

  I'm just gonna read the last few sentences that you wrote.

• 29:52Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 29:53Lewis Howes?

  And in the poem, you wrote, this is seventh grade. So you're twelve, twelve, I think, in this, and when you wrote this. In the poem you say, "I understand that nothing is easy. I say everything happens for a reason. I dream of one day the world is in peace. I try to see the good in everything. I'm a caring girl who loves to flip." So has anything changed since seventh grade?

• 30:16Speaker 01

  No, it's pretty spot on.

• 30:17Lewis Howes?

  It's pretty spot on.

• 30:18Speaker 01

  Um, I don't tend to flip too much anymore.

• 30:22Lewis Howes?

  Not all?

• 30:23Speaker 01

  Every once in a while.

• 30:24Lewis Howes?

  Every once in a while, you just do like a.

• 30:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, just flip backwards, right? I tend to run on like anything that looks like a beam.

• 30:31Lewis Howes?

  Run on it?

• 30:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, like if I'm going for a run, like there's a curb, why not run on it?

• 30:35Lewis Howes?

  On that curb?

• 30:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:36Lewis Howes?

  That's interesting. Okay, now, I ask this question a lot, and I'm curious if you are more afraid of failure or success?

• 30:49Speaker 01

  I'm terrified of failure.

• 30:52Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 30:52Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 30:53Lewis Howes?

  No, why?

• 30:54Speaker 01

  I don't know. I personally don't think that's abnormal for any elite athlete or elite mindset. Because you're no, you know, you're capable of success, but you've been taught that anything but perfection isn't okay. I know, you know, perfection is kind of like a drug. It's addicting. And knowing that you were only rewarded in your career, you know, in any Olympic career. You're really only rewarded if you are perfect.

• 31:23Lewis Howes?

  If you win.

• 31:23Speaker 01

  That if you lose, that's not acceptable. So.

• 31:27Lewis Howes?

  Not remembered.

• 31:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:29Lewis Howes?

  Right?

• 31:29Speaker 01

  And add on top of that, I'm a people pleaser. I, I love to make people happy and I want to make myself happy and proud. The idea of not succeeding or living up to someone's expectations scares me.

• 31:43Lewis Howes?

  Hurts you, right? Hurts inside, scary.

• 31:46Speaker 01

  As soon as it happens, I'm like, I want to do it again. I want to fix it.

• 31:49Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 31:49Speaker 01

  And I don't know, I think there's something about that as well, though, that's not quite right. I think people should be allowed to

• 32:01Speaker 01

  fail.

• 32:02Lewis Howes?

  Well, I think failure is necessary in order to succeed.

• 32:05Speaker 01

  Definitely. But being scared of it can be a good thing because it motivates you, but it's also normal.

• 32:14Lewis Howes?

  You don't want to control you, though.

• 32:15Speaker 01

  No, not at all.

• 32:17Lewis Howes?

  Hold you back and like cripple you.

• 32:19Speaker 01

  No, I don't think it holds me back, but it definitely.

• 32:22Lewis Howes?

  Makes you think, second guess everything or?

• 32:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:24Lewis Howes?

  A little bit?

• 32:25Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 32:26Lewis Howes?

  So what, uh, what's the, what's the future for you now? So you're 21. You, you're sponsored, you got sponsored by Nike and a couple of other cool sponsors. What are you thinking is the next chapter for you, the next few years?

• 32:39Speaker 01

  I feel like I'm just now finishing my gymnastics career. I mean, getting out of all of that and dancing with the stars, of course.

• 32:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:46Speaker 01

  And. Finally at a point where I have to choose a path, you know, a lifestyle. Cause gymnastics is no longer involved. And I don't know, I work a lot with kids, which is my favorite thing to do. And of course, health and fitness, but it's pretty much as specific as it gets.

• 33:08Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. So you're open to new opportunities.

• 33:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, I try anything. I, I love when people approach me with things that I would never would have thought of because it challenges me to step out of my comfort zone.

• 33:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah. You like to tackle challenges.

• 33:21Speaker 01

  I really do. I really do.

• 33:23Lewis Howes?

  Of course. But tell me about Dancing with the Stars. What was that like?

• 33:26Speaker 01

  Uh, fun.

• 33:27Lewis Howes?

  And you won in two, what was the eighth season or ninth?

• 33:29Speaker 01

  Two thousand nine, season eight.

• 33:31Lewis Howes?

  You won it all, right?

• 33:32Speaker 01

  I did.

• 33:32Lewis Howes?

  Congratulations.

• 33:33Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 33:34Lewis Howes?

  Was it an amazing experience?

• 33:35Speaker 01

  It was. It was probably one of the best things I've ever done.

• 33:39Lewis Howes?

  Next to the Olympics, you're like performing, you're competing, you're...

• 33:42Speaker 01

  But it was the first time I did something outside of gymnastics. So it was the first time I proved to myself that I could be more than a gymnast, which was a big deal for me.

• 33:53Lewis Howes?

  Big step.

• 33:54Speaker 01

  Cause I didn't think I could be anything but a gymnast.

• 33:56Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 33:57Speaker 01

  And going back the second time was even better. It was...

• 34:00Lewis Howes?

  Well, you went twice?

• 34:01Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 34:02Lewis Howes?

  Oh, it was like the All-Stars? Is that what it was? So what was it? So it was a whole season?

• 34:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:07Lewis Howes?

  And you, you didn't win that, did you?

• 34:08Speaker 01

  Came in second.

• 34:09Lewis Howes?

  Second.

• 34:09Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 34:11Lewis Howes?

  Who won that one?

• 34:12Speaker 01

  Uh, Melissa Ryecraft.

• 34:13Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:15Lewis Howes?

  Which was a better experience, first one or second one?

• 34:17Speaker 01

  Um, I'd say the second one. I absolutely loved the first one. Don't want to take anything away from that or my partner, because it's a different partner.

• 34:23Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 34:23Speaker 01

  Um, but the second time I was...

• 34:26Lewis Howes?

  You won the first one.

• 34:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:28Lewis Howes?

  It's gotta feel good.

• 34:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I'd say the first one, I let myself go more. Or the second one.

• 34:32Lewis Howes?

  You did so well.

• 34:33Speaker 01

  I, I...

• 34:34Lewis Howes?

  Relaxed.

• 34:34Speaker 01

  Yeah. I allowed myself to try new things.

• 34:38Lewis Howes?

  Enjoyed.

• 34:38Speaker 01

  Whereas the first one, I was really reserved and it was also sixteen, so.

• 34:42Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 34:43Speaker 01

  And I was in the company of like thirty, you know, everybody was, I couldn't relate to anybody.

• 34:48Lewis Howes?

  No way.

• 34:49Speaker 01

  Whereas the second time, I, I got along with people a lot better and I could actually have a voice in stand-up and have an opinion.

• 34:56Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 34:56Speaker 01

  But it was just, it was a better experience.

• 34:59Lewis Howes?

  That's crazy. Okay, so final question. And that's what I ask all my guests.

• 35:04Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 35:05Lewis Howes?

  So what's your definition of greatness then?

• 35:08Speaker 01

  Definition of greatness can be a lot of things.

• 35:12Lewis Howes?

  Everyone's got their own thoughts.

• 35:16Speaker 01

  Self greatness or just greatness?

• 35:18Lewis Howes?

  Just greatness in general, what's it mean to you, what's it mean to achieve greatness to you?

• 35:25Speaker 01

  I would say

• 35:26Lewis Howes?

  It's mean like winning at everything, does it mean, you know?

• 35:29Speaker 01

  No, I'd say it means having pride in yourself and knowing you couldn't have done anything more.

• 35:34Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 35:35Speaker 01

  I don't know, I think that's a huge kind of issue society has is as long as if you're not holding a gold medal or at the top of anything, then you haven't achieved greatness. But if you're happy with yourself and you're proud and you've worked for something, I think that's greatness in itself.

• 35:54Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, that's cool. What's your message to young girls then?

• 35:58Speaker 01

  That you can do and be anything you want to be and there is no limitation.

• 36:04Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 36:05Speaker 01

  And that it's okay to be different.

• 36:07Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 36:08Speaker 01

  Society makes a mold and girls think they have to live by it.

• 36:13Lewis Howes?

  Did you feel like you were molded?

• 36:15Speaker 01

  Um.

• 36:16Lewis Howes?

  Society was trying to mold you.

• 36:17Speaker 01

  I think, I think people, I think of course, society tried, but

• 36:21Lewis Howes?

  They can't hold you back.

• 36:22Speaker 01

  No, I luckily was surrounded by a family that wanted me to be different. They wanted me to be me and no one else, so.

• 36:30Lewis Howes?

  Awesome, awesome. Well, where can we find you online? What's the best place? Twitter?

• 36:34Speaker 01

  How about Twitter?

• 36:35Lewis Howes?

  Twitter?

• 36:35Speaker 01

  We're working on, yes.

• 36:37Lewis Howes?

  We're working on your website, we're gonna get it updated soon, but

• 36:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:40Lewis Howes?

  At Sean Johnson on Twitter.

• 36:41Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 36:42Lewis Howes?

  You're on Instagram all the time too, I've been following you there.

• 36:44Speaker 01

  Sean Johnson as well.

• 36:45Lewis Howes?

  Sean Johnson, a Facebook fan page or what?

• 36:47Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 36:48Lewis Howes?

  Sean Johnson?

• 36:49Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 36:49Lewis Howes?

  Sean Johnson everywhere.

• 36:50Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 36:51Lewis Howes?

  Thanks so much.

• 36:52Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 36:53Lewis Howes?

  For sharing your thoughts and make sure to check her out. Go check out her book also. And appreciate you Sean.

• 36:59Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 37:06Lewis Howes?

  And there you have it. Big shout out and thank you to the lovely Talented Shawn Johnson. Make sure to follow her on Instagram, on Twitter, on Facebook. It's all @shawnjohnson. Go check out her book. She's got some amazing things she's working on. She's got some amazing sponsorship deals, partnering with a lot of different companies. Make sure to follow her every single move because she is a sweetheart and she's always putting out inspiring messages to the world. So I hope you guys enjoyed this as much as I did and you're gonna see some big things from Shawn in the near future. With that,

• 37:45Lewis Howes?

  guys, thank you so much for coming on the show this week. We've got some huge episodes coming up in the next few weeks. I'm talking big, big, big. So make sure to check those out. And also, if you enjoyed this episode, go over to iTunes and just subscribe to the podcast. That way you get notified each and every week of a new episode. So go ahead and subscribe to the podcast. Leave us a review on iTunes. We'd love to hear your feedback. And let me know where you're listening to this in the world. Go ahead and post a picture on Instagram and tag me @lewishowes on there and hashtag #schoolofgreatness so I can see where you're at in the world, where you're listening to it. And I appreciate all the

• 38:29Lewis Howes?

  mentions out there. With that, guys, I hope you enjoyed this episode and make sure to do something great.