#1191 Darius Dale On Global Liquidity & Bitcoin Halving

Darius Dale is the founder & CEO of 42Macro. In this conversation, we talk about global liquidity, bitcoin, halving, what institutional investors are doing, and the President of the United States impact on financial markets. ======================= Pomp writes a daily letter to over 235,000+ investors about business, technology, and finance. He breaks down complex topics into easy-to-understand language while sharing opinions on various aspects of each industry. You can subscribe at https://pomp.substack.com/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Anthony Pompliano?

  What's up everyone? This is Anthony Pompliano. Many of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, which is my effort to find the most interesting people in the world and sit with them for hours while I ask questions in an effort to learn. We have no advertisers on this podcast, so it would mean the world to me if you would subscribe to the show on your favorite audio platform, watch episodes on YouTube, and tell your friends and family about the podcast. My goal is to help millions learn from the world's most interesting people. So let's get into today's episode. Darius Dale is the founder and CEO of 42 Macro. In this conversation, we talk about global liquidity, Bitcoin, halving, what all the institutional investors are doing, and why the president may or may not matter to financial markets. I always enjoy talking

• 0:46Anthony Pompliano?

  to Darius, and I hope you guys enjoy this conversation. Here is my conversation with Darius Dale.

• 0:54Speaker 01

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• 1:22Speaker 02

  Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only.

• 1:45Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, guys. Bang, bang. I've got Darius here in studio, just swagged out. My number one question, like we talked about last time, is global liquidity. If global liquidity increases, asset prices go up. If it drains, asset prices go down. I am a simple, simple man. Which direction are we headed right now?

• 2:03Speaker 03

  So let's take a trip down memory lane and talk about where we've been with global liquidity, because I think that really sets the stage for Or kind of the the near term and medium term outlooks for the for this particular variable. And there's a lot of variables, by the way, that drive asset markets. This for the past, let's call it two or three years, has been the primary driver. So obviously, it's a big deal. So if you go back into, so let's just take a step back and what the hell is global liquidity, right? We talk about liquidity all the time as investors, but we don't really have a, you know, real true academic consensus on what the concept of global liquidity is. So in the context of trying to understand this and understanding this from my quantitative economics background, you know, I think there's a few statistics that we like to focus on that give you a general sense of kind of where this kind of squishy concept of global liquidity are.

• 2:46Speaker 03

  Number one, you look at the aggregated central bank balance sheet, you know, particularly across the major, you know, kind of G20 economies, US, you know, the ECB, the Fed, the Bank of England, PBOC, the Bank of Japan, Swiss National Bank, et cetera. These kind of, at least if you, those six central banks, they account for more than 90% of the total central bank balance sheet. So if you're going to spend any time aggregating this stuff, definitely start there and focus on there. The number two metric we would talk about is what I would consider to be private sector liquidity. So that's public sector liquidity, liquidity coming from central banks. There's private sector liquidity, liquidity that comes from commercial banks. And the best way to track that, it's not necessarily direct proxy, but the best way to track that is through M1 money supply, narrow money supply.

• 3:29Speaker 03

  Narrow money supply includes the monetary base, but it's primarily driven by bank deposits, demand deposits in banks. And so if you look at both of those metrics, there's other metrics as well, like world FX reserves is less relevant, but those kinds of things do matter. When you go back and you look at the central bank, global central bank balance sheet, at right around 30 trillion, it had increased a couple trillion off the lows of late 2022. And so that, you know, part of what we've seen in this kind of year to date ramp in Bitcoin, kind of the bottoming in the S and P type exposures, risk assets since, you know, kind of October of last year, has really been a function of that uptick. Well, the one thing I would call out on that is that we've actually reversed negatively in recent months. In fact, it kind of peaked out in late January, early February at the previous year to date high

• 4:14Speaker 03

  in the S and P, and we have yet to kind of recover on that level. If you look at global narrow Money supply, it's actually continuing to trend lower if you if you look at it on a year over year basis, both are trending lower world narrow money supplies, very narrow modestly negative at minus zero point three percent domestic narrow money supply because of the deposit outflow that we're seeing primarily from regional banks, but it's not just regional banks, it's large commercial banks as well here in the US. That's down about six percent on a year over year basis, and that's about as sharp as a contraction as you're ever going to see. And so the improvement in global liquidity that was primarily driven by this inflection central bank balance sheets, primarily driven by the Bank of Japan defending its yield curve control policy and the PBOC kind of trying to give, you know, the the Chinese economy a little

• 4:58Speaker 03

  push when it was coming out of zero COVID a few months ago. That stuff's kind of reversed. It's kind of peaked out and topped out, and we are now starting to see global liquidity drain on a trailing through month basis, kind of, you know, in data through March, data through April.

• 5:10Anthony Pompliano?

  So there was a lot of debate about, let's say, the ECB, and they were bucking the trend of the Fed. So the Fed was saying one thing, and the ECB was kind of fighting it, saying, yeah, we're not going to do that. They eventually capitulated, and now they're pretty much moving at least directionally in lockstep in terms of, you know, creating tighter financial conditions. Now, we saw out of Asia, that wasn't the case. We actually did, as you mentioned earlier this year, see them increasing the liquidity in the market. Who's in charge? Does the Fed lead kind of the global central bank, you know, strategy session, if you will? Does China or the BOJ or somebody else? Like, how do we think about, like, is there one central bank to look at? And what they say will basically then ripple through the rest of the central banks?

• 5:52Anthony Pompliano?

  Or are each one of these central banks actually making individual decisions for themselves?

• 5:56Speaker 03

  It's a little bit of both. So no one's in charge, right? Like, let's be honest here, right? The Fed, you know, the Fed is primarily, partially in control of the dollar, obviously, with alongside the US Treasury Department. And so you could say that, given that we are on a global dollar reserve system, and probably will be for an extended period of time, the Fed is technically in charge. But the reality is, A, none of these central banks is actually in charge of global liquidity. They all contribute individually, you know, to varying degrees and at various points in the cycle, based on their own economic drivers. You know, why would a central bank either add or subtract? Liquidity from its own economy, you can obviously infer, you know, the reasons for that growth being above or below trend, inflation being meaningfully above or being through below trend, et cetera, and unemployment situation being pretty adverse.

• 6:41Speaker 03

  And what we're seeing right now, particularly with respect to the European economy, particularly with respect to the Chinese economy, these economies are actually improving, you know, pretty markedly in recent months. And so the probability that we need to see any sort of liquidity provision out of these localities is actually diminishing at the margins. In fact, the ECB balance sheet continues to be in pretty meaningful contraction. It was the PBOC's balance sheet and the Bank of Japan's balance sheet that really contributed to that meaningful uptick in global liquidity. I want to say on a trailing three-month basis, it peaked in January at around 1.4 trillion dollars, but on an aggregate, it was somewhere around plus $2 trillion off the lows of last year. And so, you know, you can, a lot of folks want to make it easy, you know, again, so much of investing is like people trying to find shortcuts and cut corners.

• 7:26Speaker 03

  And I just want to remind viewers, you know, there are people spending billions of dollars on research and trading and all this stuff. It's not easy. I wouldn't try to cut corners, but in the context of this global liquidity discussion, I think you can, to some degree, you know, kind of focus on these primary large major central banks, these primary large major economies, because that's going to get you to at least 90, 95% of the total, total outcome.

• 7:48Anthony Pompliano?

  So we've seen to the start of 2023, Bitcoin was the best performing asset in Q1. It's up about 70% or so. And we saw a lot of assets going up, right? It wasn't just a Bitcoin or a cryptocurrency thing. Should there be a belief that similar to what we saw coming out of 2020 into 2021, like when all asset prices rise, Bitcoin is just kind of, you know, an asset price on steroids and it's going to go up more? And then if you go through the long tail of all the crypto assets, like have higher and higher price appreciation? Or is there something different in the way that you analyze Bitcoin versus maybe some of the traditional assets?

• 8:23Speaker 03

  I will say, since the March regional banking panic here in the US, there has certainly become a greater store of value bid in the Bitcoin asset class than I think had had previously before. And I don't know that we can say what percentage of Bitcoins price change, price fluctuations are being driven by store value versus risk appetite, global liquidity, et cetera. But I certainly think that whatever that pie chart looked like in terms of global liquidity, global risk appetite, you know, global or, you know, sort of store value. I think the pie slice associated with the shore value has certainly increased in recent months. And part of the reason we're seeing that is because, you know, we have various metrics that kind of track whether or not, you know, hey, you know, is liquidity improving? Is, you know, risk appetite improving vis a vis sector and style factor dispersion?

• 9:08Speaker 03

  I mean, the equity market, we could certainly look at the bond market, whether it be yield curves or forward spreads or et cetera, to give us an idea, okay, is, you know, growth expectations rising? Are people wanting to take more risk and want to speculate more? And the reality is, we've not seen all those traditional drivers of the Bitcoin price, you know, really improve. In fact, I would argue, we've seen it actually deteriorate in recent months. Obviously, this negative inflection in global liquidity from kind of the January, February highs of that, of those time series, has actually gotten worse. We've seen, you know, degradation in fixed income curves and money market curves. We have this really nasty record inversion in the one-month T-bill, minus three-month T-bill. It's signaling a lot of stress in the collateral system, in the repo system, in the repo market.

• 9:50Speaker 03

  So I would argue global risk appetite has not really improved either alongside global liquidity. Global liquidity is down, risk appetite at best is flat. But we've seen the Bitcoin price rally pretty sharply off the March lows of the March lows of 2023. And in our opinion, I think that's, it's gotta be some deposit flow. Instead of saying, hey, just give me an Uncle Sam piece of paper, a money market T-bill fund, let me put some of this in a digital asset like Bitcoin as a longer-term store of value. And it's no surprise to me that this is happening, given the Bozett situation at Silicon Valley Bank, right? Signature Bank. These are institutions, these are companies and people and individuals and founders who believe in these assets from a longer-term perspective. So I think they came to a fork in the road and said, well, if my depository institution's going bust,

• 10:35Speaker 03

  where do I put all this money? I can put some of it in T-bills, but I can also put some of it in something like Bitcoin.

• 10:40Anthony Pompliano?

  Earlier, we were talking about Bitcoin and the halving. That's about a year away or so. And you'd mentioned some things in the analysis that you've done in terms of Bitcoin's price and the volatility going into the halving. Talk a little bit about that.

• 10:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, so, so one thing that's kind of really made, you know, so we talked about this a couple of weeks ago, and I was last on the program, which is, you know, we have this concept of the phase two credit cycle downturn ahead of us. And for those of you who, I don't want to rehash it for too much, but the reality is, when you go into a recession, particularly in the US economy, because we are the world's dominant economy, dominant asset markets, dominant reserve currency, typically what happens, you have this sort of nasty blowout in credit spreads, you have this really nasty sort of repricing in sector and style factors versus in the equity markets. And of course, you have a crash in the equity markets themselves, and risk assets tend to correlate with that, with that outcome. So that's an outcome that we still see ahead of us, you know, more than likely commencing in the second half of this year, probably by late Q3, given the timing with which we anticipate a recession to develop

• 11:37Speaker 03

  in the US economy. We have a bunch of different models on, on kind of timing where we are in the business cycle here in the US. And the kind of the modal outcome of that, of those models suggests Q4 is probably the, the highest probability starting point for a recession. So we were assuming that, you know, sometime in Q3 and Q4, we're going to be in the middle of pricing, or at the beginning of pricing in that phase two credit cycle downturn. One thing that sort of has me with respect to Bitcoin specifically, that has me sort of concerned about anticipating that's going to spill over into Bitcoin in the context of this kind of store value discussion, is the fact that we have a halving next spring, right? I want to say in April or May of 2024. And obviously, halvings tend to be this, you know, very, very bullish event for Bitcoin. And at least that's what I thought initially

• 12:19Speaker 03

  in my, in my speculation. So I'm, I'm sitting here thinking, is Bitcoin even going to go down in this phase two credit cycle downturn? Let's say this buy gets to, you know, down 20% from here, it'd be like 3200 or something. Does Bitcoin go to 17.5 again? Or does Bitcoin stay where it is, or even appreciate? Because that'll be very close to that, you know, springtime halving. So I did a little work, you know, this morning, kind of trying to identify, okay, is there a history of volatility in Bitcoin heading into the halvings? Or is the kind of the halving the catalyst for the kind of record appreciation on the other side of that? And the You know, the results of the the the study that I did suggests that there's tends to be a lot of volatility in the year into Bitcoin.

• 12:57Speaker 03

  Um, yeah, I can just read these off, you know, sorry to not have these off the top of my head. I'm usually better than this, but you know, so into the November 2012 Bitcoin halving, we saw a minus 39% uh max drawdown in February of 202012. And so I'm looking at the year prior to the halvings. Um, and we saw a minus 27% drawdown in August of 2012. In the July 16 halving, we saw a minus 30% drawdown in August 15. We saw minus 25% drawdown in November 15. We saw a minus 20% drawdown in February 16, and we saw another minus 20% drawdown in June of 16. And then lastly, into the May of 2020 halving, we saw a minus 48% drawdown into December 19. And then another minus 53% drawdown kind of during COVID in March of 2020. So that's a lot of crashes, man, in the year leading up to the halving.

• 13:42Speaker 03

  And so I just want to put that out there and say, hey, look, I know this is going to be a very positive event. I think if we're having this conversation 18 months from now or 20 months from now, at the end of 2024, Bitcoin's probably at 200,000, if not higher. And I definitely would fully buy into that view. It's just the path to getting there, if you're trying to build a big position to take advantage of that, is likely to be very volatile. At least that's what history suggests.

• 14:06Anthony Pompliano?

  So basically, the idea would be, yes, when the halving occurs within 18 months or so of that halving, you have these kind of record price appreciation. But in the year before, the 12 months prior, there are these kind of big 20 to 40, 50% drawdowns in price. And so, again, history could serve as a guide. Maybe it's not, you know, perfect, but it would tell us that when you see those drawdowns, then those historically have been great buying opportunities versus, uh, you know, waiting till the halving or anything like that.

• 14:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, the the key take, the the key takeaway I'm trying to make is, we know, not we don't know, but we assume Bitcoin is probably going to be very much higher in price by in 20 months. The problem is, if you're buying it today at 30,000, you need to be aware that, hey, there's a here, a long time series history of these material drawdowns, very significant drawdowns, you know, capital destroying drawdowns into that event. And we also have this phase two credits. Downturn that is completely separate and apart from anything that's going on in the cryptocurrency ecosystem. So as a risk manager, and that's kind of what our clients, you know, kind of tasked us to do with 42 macro. The number one thing we're trying to preach right now is patience and prudence. We're not trying to get people to run out and short Bitcoin or short the stock market.

• 15:18Speaker 03

  What we're trying to do is to have them understand, hey, look, there's going to be a better buying opportunity ahead of us. Probably sometime in the next, call it two to three quarters and take advantage of that buying opportunity. But between now and then, the goal was not to get rich quick, it's to get rich smart over a longer period of time.

• 15:34Anthony Pompliano?

  I don't know if I agree with 20 months, but 24 months, which basically would give you one year till the halving. You know, give or take, so maybe actually even longer than that. And then 18 months, because like one of the things that's interesting to me, right, is like you get the price appreciation. We go back, uh, May of 2020, we get the halving and it took a couple of months, maybe till like August, September. And then you started to see, okay, here we go, right? And we went from 10K to 30K very quickly.

• 15:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 15:59Anthony Pompliano?

  And from 30 to 60 happened from, I think literally Bitcoin hit $31,000 on December 31st. Like it was going up a thousand dollars a day and it was like 27,000 on December 27th, 28,000 on December 28th, right?

• 16:12Speaker 03

  I remember that very well.

• 16:13Anthony Pompliano?

  It was crazy, right? It was crazy. And so it went from 30, 31,000 to 64,000 by March. And so in literally 90 days, it doubled in price, right? Which is this incredible run. Now it had a huge drawdown, 50%, but it kind of just returned right back to where it had been in December, right? Which was still 300% higher than where it had been at the halving point, maybe a little bit more. I think it was like $8,500 or so when it hit the halving. And if that had been the whole thing, it'd be like, wow, we went from, you know, $8,500 to 64,000. That is this, you know, really crazy, uh, kind of appreciation. But that drawdown happened to coincide with, uh, China kicking out a bunch of the miners and, uh, more than 50% of the hash rate going offline.

• 16:55Anthony Pompliano?

  Summer of 21 and all summer long, it basically was just flat, kind of hanging around $30,000. And then when we got into Q3, all of a sudden, here we go again. And we obviously at peak at 69,000 back in November of 21. And so when you look at that, what I always wonder is like, how much of the quote unquote, you know, price appreciation happened really between like September of 20 and March of 21? And that was driven by the halving versus if it had the full 18 months, like you actually get a little bit of a higher price. But if that hash rate getting kicked out of China doesn't happen, would it have gone higher? Would like, what would have been different? We'll never know.

• 17:33Anthony Pompliano?

  But like, to me, that is like one of the more under discussed things is just like, you basically had this price appreciation that was occurring kind of right on schedule.

• 17:43Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 17:44Anthony Pompliano?

  Then you get this external shock from China making this decision, 50% of the hash rate leaves, right? It's a pretty big deal, but yet you still even got another all time high before the end of the year.

• 17:54Speaker 03

  Totally.

• 17:55Anthony Pompliano?

  I mean, it's kind of crazy to think about now.

• 17:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, I mean, that was, that was a very wonderful time for me. Uh, you know, I bought my first Bitcoin in October of 2020. That was a good, that was a good run, a very good run. Um, yeah, I think I know, I mean, you and I were on your program back then saying, I think Bitcoin is going to 100,000.

• 18:10Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 18:11Speaker 03

  And quite frankly, I think it would have gone to 100,000 had it not had that, you know, you know, exogenous catalyst in China. Um, you know, so, you know, I think this asset class is going to be, you know, for a long period of time fraught with sort of exogenous events, whether it be regulatory. I mean, mostly regulatory, obviously that was a regulatory event in China, you know, they're not, we're not the only ones who can regulate, by the way. But this is, you know, I think the, the underlying message of the resiliency of the asset class, and I don't necessarily mean resiliency from the price appreciation standpoint. I mean, resiliency from the perspective of this thing ain't going anywhere, right? Like we had FTX and Celsius and Luna and all this other stuff happened in the last kind of 12 months. And not one time did I see anyone really question the longer term viability of Bitcoin throughout this entire process.

• 18:55Speaker 03

  I mean, we've seen people blow up and left and right, put in handcuffs, left and right. And it's, it's a, and to me, so I'm very proud of the asset class for that particular perspective. I just, I think, you know, just from a risk managed perspective, I think. You know, there's a the path to getting to this, you know, rainbow and puppy dog type outcome is, you know, you got to walk through the got to walk through the hood for a little bit.

• 19:13Anthony Pompliano?

  What are the institutions doing right now? Are they mostly in cash? Are they looking at Bitcoin or cryptocurrencies? Are they in equities, oil? Like, where are they kind of tactically looking?

• 19:23Speaker 03

  So that's a phenomenal question. So I'll bucket this into into different categories of institution investors. There's sort of your long only kind of, you know, you know, just, you know, longer term, you know, 12 to 18 month time horizon on any holding style investors. These are your kind of large mutual funds, pension funds. And then you have your sort of, you know, kind of hedge fund oriented strategies, you know, these people tend to, you know, they kind of generally need to be making money on a month to month basis at the bare minimum, not having, you know, drawdowns in excess of 3 to 5%, you know, particularly these large multi manager market neutral players. The latter category, these market neutral, pod shop type hedge fund vehicles, you know, to a man, woman and child, that everyone I talk to, and we have, you know, many clients across the space, they are all trading as with a higher

• 20:06Speaker 03

  frequency than they ever have in their entire career. Like the the short termism in that in that community of investors has never been more like ferocious. And I think that's part of like, why, you know, ignore Bitcoin for a second, just look at the chart of the S and P 500. You know, since May of 2020 of last year, it's going to almost be a year, we've been bouncing around more or less between, let's call it 20 4200 and 3800. You know, we went to 4300 in August, and then we went to like 3500 in October. But for the most part, we've been flat. You pull up a year long chart of the S and P, it basically hasn't gone anywhere. But what it has done is been very violent. You know, we've seen like a 10% rally, then a 15% drawdown, then a 20% rally, then a 10% draw. These are like annual returns. So we've had like five or six years worth of

• 20:49Speaker 03

  returns to carve out if you're a good trader, if you're a good active manager to take advantage of. So that community investors is extremely kind of narrowly focused on, you know, kind of what's really happening right in here and now. And that concerns me from a medium term perspective, because their their foresight on, you know, the phase two credit cycle downturn, some of these longer term, like kind of macro cycle risk that I think, you know, we would likely really start to rear their ugly head and towards the back end of the year. I just don't think you're going to have enough investors focused on that, which will allow you to have kind of a market crash style style comp. When you're talking about the long only institutional money managers, everyone is positioned for down dollar, you know, short the dollar and every derivative trade of shorting the dollar, whether

• 21:32Speaker 03

  it be improving global growth, whether it be emerging market outperformance over US equities, whether it be commodities over, you know, hard assets, you know, commodity, our physical assets over digital assets, you know, we've seen a little bit of a crowding back into the tech space, but probably by and large, you know, those investors and I've been having these same conversations really for the past kind of four or five months, which is, you know, how do I take advantage of down dollar, up global growth without actually just being long China, given all the regulatory and geopolitical concerns that are emanating out of that economy. So there's a lot of consensus across, you know, kind of what I would consider traditional Wall Street right now, whether it be just like knife fighting for, you know, basis points on a daily, weekly basis, or whether it be just, you know, short the dollar. Both of those things I think could be proven very wrong. You get to the

• 22:16Speaker 03

  kind of one to two quarters from now, maybe not one quarter now, but certainly I think by the end of Q3, this concept of down dollar, you know, everything up global growth, I think will fall by the wayside. At least that's what our models are suggesting. And then the concept of I don't really have to worry about medium term risk, you know, being in the right exposures from a medium term perspective on the, in the kind of the shorter term pot shop exposures are head managers. That to me is a big worry to me because again, when you get into the back half of the year, everyone's going to start to recognize the deterioration in the labor cycle, you know, kind of, okay, we actually are might be heading into recession, but they can't all get out of the same pipes at the same time. You can't all go buy a Procter and Gamble at once and sell everything else you own because this is how markets crash. Markets are very, they've been very illiquid for a few years now.

• 22:59Anthony Pompliano?

  When you look at the current market situation, we are headed into next year, a presidential election. We know that the Fed, they are not an elected official. They are appointed. Does the president matter? We hear a lot of debate, Trump tax cuts or Biden this and sometimes it's tax positive things, tax negative things, both sides of the aisle. Like there's all these debates. Does the president matter?

• 23:29Speaker 03

  Increasingly so, but not at all on an absolute basis. On a relative basis, they're certainly gaining share. This really goes back to the Obama administration. Obviously, Trump kicked it in as steroids. But this concept of executive orders, and mostly because we've seen so much gridlock in Congress that you can't really get anything done that's from a lasting budgetary perspective. So executive orders have been kind of the way we've enacted policy here in the US for quite a long time now, for over a decade now. And so we're seeing Biden with the most recent executive order banning investment into Chinese industries, high-tech industries as well. I think we're going to continue to see more of that in the context of this hyper-grid locked DC economy. I mean, we have a potential US sovereign debt default on our hands in a few months,

• 24:12Speaker 03

  and neither side is willing to negotiate, or at least the Democrats are unwilling to negotiate, and the Freedom Caucus is unwilling to negotiate unless they get what they want, which is clearly not a negotiation. And so to me, I think, does the president matter? Yes. Do they really matter in terms of asset markets? Probably not. You know, in terms of ranking this, clearly, the Fed is sacrosanct to investments in the US economy, given they have control, but they materially contribute to the ebbs and flows of the liquidity cycle. Obviously, Congress would be number two in the context of them being the institution that determines the budget. They're the ones that determine the size of the budget deficit, the timing of payments, all this stuff, where the money is getting allocated in the economy, the redistribution or lack thereof in the economy.

• 24:57Speaker 03

  And so I think those two institutions, and for a long time, they're going to matter a lot more than the president. But the president matters as much as it has in my career, as much as it has today. Or today, it matters as much as it has ever in my career.

• 25:07Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, that's crazy. Where can we have people to find you on the internet?

• 25:10Speaker 03

  Oh, appreciate you, man. Always a pleasure to come top it up with you, man. I love the office, really proud of you guys. So come check us out, 42macro. You know, we do, as you can clearly tell, we do institutional research for every investor. That's our model.

• 25:22Anthony Pompliano?

  42macro.com.

• 25:24Speaker 03

  42macro.com.

• 25:24Anthony Pompliano?

  And then we're on Twitter.

• 25:25Speaker 03

  I'm on Twitter at 42macroweather. We have a private Twitter account, 42macroaware, for our subscribers.

• 25:31Anthony Pompliano?

  Awesome. I learn every single time.

• 25:33Speaker 03

  Appreciate you, man.

• 25:34Anthony Pompliano?

  42macro.com, everyone, go check it out. We'll do it again.

• 25:35Speaker 03

  Always a pleasure, man. Thank you.