True Grit with Stavros Halkias

We love to pull the cork. Comedian (and probably the biggest Greek-American entertainer of our time) Stavros Halkias joins us to chat about 2010’s True Grit, the Coens’ true attempt to cash their post-Oscar blank check. We’re talking about Hailee Steinfeld’s incredible performance. We’re talking about Jeff Bridges’ distinctive mumbly delivery. We’re talking about how this film is a considerable upgrade over the John Wayne original in possibly every way. We’re also talking about how everyone probably smells awful in this movie. And we’re talking a lot about the Morris Chestnut network TV show “Watson” for some reason. Join us by the campfire, it’s a fun time! Check out Bugonia https://www.fandango.com/bugonia-2025-236951/movie-overview Read David’s Interview with Yorgos https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2017/09/yorgos-lanthimos-killing-of-a-sacred-deer-interview/538902/ Check out the profile of the owner of Panathinaikos B. C. https://www.ynetnews.com/culture/article/skr00ph7m0 Check out Charles Portis’ other books https://www.goodreads.com/author/list/27034. Charles_Portis Watch Booboo Kills Yogi" ending https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6w0r-ScEG4 See Stavvy Live https://r.search.yahoo.com/rdclks/dWU9N2NxY3ZmdGtldnZoaiZ1dD0xNzYwNTU4NjQzNDM0JnVvPTgxMTU3ODM3NDk1MjQwJmx0PTImcz0xJmVzPTNHZEhHSGRhZEdrQVkwYUUyN1V4b0wuV3Z0eXBCdnZ3YzdCZ3BZT0FPbm5mMkFPNThjOGVCeGhXOWRkMTNFV181VFFrYkJCU0xoazdFLmct/RV=2/RE=1763150643/RO=14/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.bing.com%2faclick%3fld%3de83txxd6eaYWRptq4azctlUzVUCUzLucJ3LF6JRSRPHuB_0Ik78ItEksYGPUF8jmr_WGlRv9Z5n6q39i5XskLVySGBrbpuqH0sFhaQeyW370gypGPWpIrGukA0AHroIgu7ujRCzvKQ1ABdFHOz9YT47LvcoDvH_UWfyJ9sIFw5P6B99Mi_bI5x1wPDUOAz5kuiZAZaNw%26u%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%26rlid%3d53f1ccf3a93f1f68f5eca41c570c3b89/RK=2/RS=GqOlvGVnhJpokA8F_qrcmAa5mpk-;_ylt=Awril9Qz_u9oBwIAx9oPxQt.;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzEEdnRpZAMEc2VjA292LXRvcA--;_ylc=X3IDMgRydAMw? IG=0ae297d4b2954bcd95024d861321e183 Sign up for Check Book https://blankcheckpod.substack.com/welcome, the Blank Check newsletter featuring even more “real nerdy shit” to feed your pop culture obsession. Dossier excerpts, film biz AND burger reports, and even more exclusive content you won’t want to miss out on. Join our Patreon for franchise commentaries and bonus episodes. http://www.patreon.com/blankcheck Follow us @blankcheckpod on Twitter https://x.com/blankcheckpod?lang=en, Instagram https://www.instagram.com/blankcheckpod/?hl=en, Threads https://www.threads.net/@blankcheckpod?xmt=AQGzctAh4mbWTwYzCV1pzNT6AMV9o99EOfymi8TLR5mTde0 and Facebook https://www.facebook.com/blankcheckpodcast/! Buy some real nerdy merch https://kinshipgoods.com/blankcheck Connect with other Blankies on our Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/blankies/s/gpcOkQr8Sv or Discord https://discord.gg/Q6YGSR3JrA For anything else, check out BlankCheckPod.com https://www.blankcheckpod.com/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Griffin Newman?

  David.

• 0:03David Sims?

  Yep.

• 0:03Griffin Newman?

  We did a live show.

• 0:04David Sims?

  Yeah, remember?

• 0:05Griffin Newman?

  Ranking Scorsese at the Bell House in Brooklyn. We did the definitive power ranking of Martin Scorsese things.

• 0:12David Sims?

  Uh, it was so fun. Uh, it was very silly.

• 0:15Griffin Newman?

  Ben and Marie were with us and they're with us right now.

• 0:18David Sims?

  Yeah, hey.

• 0:18Speaker 02

  Hey, everyone, or should I say, oh? Oh.

• 0:22Griffin Newman?

  And thanks to our friends at Dynasty Typewriter. It was livestreamed for the first time ever. But also, the replay is still up there, but only until October 30th.

• 0:31Speaker 03

  So just a few more days.

• 0:33David Sims?

  Yes.

• 0:33Speaker 03

  You can get it at dynasty.tv.

• 0:36David Sims?

  Dynasty.tv.

• 0:37Speaker 03

  It's $20. We had a blast and the Spreadmaster really got to work.

• 0:43David Sims?

  Oh, yeah. I was moving things around.

• 0:45Griffin Newman?

  Laptop was on.

• 0:46Speaker 02

  I don't know if I'd have seen you that happy.

• 0:48Griffin Newman?

  You were thrilled. You were like a pick and share.

• 0:50David Sims?

  I was locked in.

• 0:51Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, very locked in and you were funny.

• 0:53David Sims?

  Thank you. You were funny. You were also funny.

• 0:56Griffin Newman?

  Oh, thank you.

• 0:57David Sims?

  And if you want to see like, you know, Griffin's shine box on camera, it's the only way to see it.

• 1:02Griffin Newman?

  You might see me shine Marie's shoes.

• 1:04David Sims?

  Exactly.

• 1:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, if you're into that sort of content.

• 1:07Griffin Newman?

  If that gets you off.

• 1:09Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:10Speaker 03

  So once again, that's at dynasty.tv.

• 1:39Griffin Newman?

  You must pay for everything in this world, one way or another. There's nothing free, except the grace of pod.

• 1:45David Sims?

  Okay, so you're.

• 1:46Griffin Newman?

  Cast. You didn't let me finish.

• 1:47David Sims?

  Oh, sorry. Uh, you're doing like a sincere, kind of like thoughtful, kind of like, you know, sticks with you moment.

• 1:54Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. You know why I chose that strategically? Cause I feel like we're gonna spend most of the next three hours going, ahh, damn.

• 2:00David Sims?

  Right, right. A saucy line will not get you far with me is, is, is something I say to people all the time.

• 2:06Griffin Newman?

  Well, you say it that way?

• 2:08David Sims?

  No.

• 2:08Griffin Newman?

  How do you say it?

• 2:10David Sims?

  Well, I can't. Can you do LaBeef? Do LaBeef?

• 2:13Griffin Newman?

  Well, this is what I finally cracked watching it this time.

• 2:15David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:16Griffin Newman?

  It's Damon doing half a McConaughey.

• 2:18David Sims?

  Okay.

• 2:19Griffin Newman?

  Damon has a perfect McConaughey.

• 2:21David Sims?

  Put in McConaughey.

• 2:22Griffin Newman?

  He'll break out McConaughey on talk shows as like his party trick.

• 2:25David Sims?

  Okay.

• 2:25Griffin Newman?

  And his McConaughey is the best I've ever heard.

• 2:27David Sims?

  Sure.

• 2:27Griffin Newman?

  And this is him being like, I can't go full Mac.

• 2:30David Sims?

  I can only do McConaughey saying MRI in, uh, in inner stuff.

• 2:34Griffin Newman?

  MRI.

• 2:34David Sims?

  MRI.

• 2:35Griffin Newman?

  MRI. MRI.

• 2:38David Sims?

  Is that one moment? Uh, yeah. Okay. So go ahead and go, go be LaBeef.

• 2:41Griffin Newman?

  Uh, let me see. I'm looking for a line here.

• 2:44Speaker 03

  Maybe hold your tongue.

• 2:46Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. Do you know how he did that? This is another, I've watched, I've watched a lot of Damon interviews, not for this, just generally.

• 2:53David Sims?

  He talks. That guy run his mouth.

• 2:55Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. Why is he a podcaster? Um, he couldn't figure out how to do it and they couldn't figure out how to like build a prosthetic or anything to help him with it. Cause it's the fucking tongue. Like nothing's gonna stick. And he was like helping his little daughters get ready for school and they had like elastic hair bands.

• 3:11Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 3:12Griffin Newman?

  And he was like, oh, let me try this. And he was like, I just put three around my tongue.

• 3:15Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 3:16David Sims?

  That's so weird.

• 3:17Griffin Newman?

  Isn't that weird?

• 3:18David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 3:18Griffin Newman?

  But he was like, it was the only thing that stuck. That wasn't like toxic.

• 3:21David Sims?

  Interesting.

• 3:21Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. I'm looking, I'm looking for a good LaBeef line here. I mean, what's the one about the lashings?

• 3:27David Sims?

  Uh, well.

• 3:28Griffin Newman?

  Where he says that he was, he was fixing for a kiss.

• 3:30David Sims?

  Uh, you give out very little sugar with your pronouncements is something, you know, while I sat.

• 3:35Griffin Newman?

  I can't, I can't do it. You, you had it better. Yeah.

• 3:37David Sims?

  While I sat there watching, I gave some thought to stealing a kiss, though you are very young and sick and unattractive to boo. I'm just loving, the way they talk, man.

• 3:44Speaker 03

  It's awesome.

• 3:45David Sims?

  Can we just talk like this again?

• 3:47Griffin Newman?

  I had this thought. The dumbest character in this movie speaks better than the current poet laureate of the United States, who I believe is Ben Hossley. No, but it is like the guys who are about to be hung.

• 4:00David Sims?

  Like, right. Yes. Yeah. And they're still like, yeah, if I'd shot the rec guy, I'd be, and I'm like, yeah, this is the fucking discussion run for Congress. Like, I love this guy. Yeah.

• 4:10Griffin Newman?

  Every line in this movie, I mean, they've talked about the main reason they remade this is because they loved the book so fucking much. And they were like, we think Portis is like American Shakespeare.

• 4:20David Sims?

  He is.

• 4:21Griffin Newman?

  And like, if you just literally put the book on screen and transcribe every line of dialogue, people will be firing pistols up in the air in the audience, which happened.

• 4:31Speaker 03

  Someone went.

• 4:32Speaker 02

  That's like a benevolent Joker.

• 4:34Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 4:34Speaker 02

  Just like shooting a gun.

• 4:35Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 4:36Speaker 02

  To celebrate.

• 4:38Speaker 03

  Maybe we should bring that back.

• 4:39Griffin Newman?

  We should bring that back.

• 4:40Speaker 03

  You can have a gun.

• 4:42Speaker 02

  Fire.

• 4:42Speaker 03

  And fire it up.

• 4:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, a gun that only fires up.

• 4:46Griffin Newman?

  I'm pro.

• 4:47Speaker 02

  Maybe you have, maybe you have like a.

• 4:49Speaker 03

  If it's like this.

• 4:50Speaker 02

  What's a level or whatever?

• 4:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly.

• 4:51Speaker 02

  You know what I mean?

• 4:52Speaker 03

  A little bubble.

• 4:53Speaker 02

  A little bubble level. And if it's going up, you can fire it.

• 4:55Griffin Newman?

  It won't activate.

• 4:57David Sims?

  Movie is so heavy on guys firing a shot in the air to mean something.

• 5:02Speaker 02

  Right.

• 5:02David Sims?

  To be like, all right, I'm out of here.

• 5:04Speaker 03

  How is not everyone fucking deaf?

• 5:06David Sims?

  I think they kind of are.

• 5:07Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 5:07Speaker 03

  They should all be then constantly screaming at one another, basically, to hear what each other is saying.

• 5:13Speaker 02

  That is true.

• 5:13David Sims?

  I mean, he like, he empties his revolver at snakes in like a cave, like one inch from her head. I don't know how she ever hears again.

• 5:23Griffin Newman?

  Brewster in particular keeps using his gun as like a multi-tool.

• 5:26David Sims?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 5:27Griffin Newman?

  Sometimes he used it to like, cut a piece of paper, you know, to tie his shoes.

• 5:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. I think, I thought you were gonna go with, I heard you were a man of podcasts.

• 5:38Griffin Newman?

  Oh, sure.

• 5:40Speaker 02

  And that way, we just go, we just take the title and this.

• 5:43Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, who knows if perhaps my instincts have dulled at this point. But I feel like there's a, there's a tough balance of, there's a level of sweatiness where the actual line has become so abstracted by the way I put podcast in there.

• 5:58Speaker 02

  Right.

• 5:59Griffin Newman?

  That is funny to me, or it needs to be the line as mostly intact.

• 6:02Speaker 02

  Right.

• 6:03David Sims?

  If you would like to podcast in a coffin, that would be all right.

• 6:08David Sims?

  That guy rocks.

• 6:09Griffin Newman?

  This is another thing, every guy in this movie rocks.

• 6:12David Sims?

  This is a movie though, about how being a guy back then was pretty weird. Cause it's like, if you're the coffin guy in like the Wild West, that's a weird job.

• 6:20Griffin Newman?

  Not only kind of weird, but like, basically sucked.

• 6:23David Sims?

  Everything sucks.

• 6:24Speaker 02

  Everyone's life is bad.

• 6:26David Sims?

  And like, my favorite character is the guy she trades with, right?

• 6:30Speaker 02

  So good.

• 6:30David Sims?

  Dick and Matthew.

• 6:31Griffin Newman?

  Who I always, right, I.

• 6:32David Sims?

  You always say that he's the one who says he likes to pull the cork.

• 6:35Griffin Newman?

  It's not.

• 6:35David Sims?

  But it's another guy who says that.

• 6:36Griffin Newman?

  We'll talk about it. But Dick Matthews has the two literal horse trading scenes.

• 6:39David Sims?

  Right. And like, just where he's just like, can I be real with you? Living in this town is sucks. I have like, I'm ill all the time. I'm sure I'm gonna die because I've moved beyond civilization. And all I do is like haggle about the cost of a horse. Like, I'm just gonna fucking die.

• 6:56Griffin Newman?

  One of our great American philosophers, a poet laureate in his own right, made the profound statement, there are a million ways to die in the West and all of them are terrible. Seth MacFarlane made an entire movie about this. And it was too trench shit for America.

• 7:09David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 7:09Griffin Newman?

  They couldn't handle it.

• 7:11Speaker 02

  Really ahead of his time.

• 7:12Griffin Newman?

  Have you seen that movie?

• 7:13Speaker 02

  No.

• 7:13Griffin Newman?

  I think it's pretty good.

• 7:14Speaker 02

  I have no desire.

• 7:15Griffin Newman?

  I think it's pretty good.

• 7:16Speaker 02

  I've come around, I don't know. I've come around, I did a lot of watching Family Guy.

• 7:20Griffin Newman?

  Hmm.

• 7:21Speaker 02

  On tour, I bought, I was on a bus and I bought DVDs.

• 7:24Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 7:25Speaker 02

  And I bought early Family Guy and then I bought the Star Wars Family Guy. I could, whatever, I would just find DVDs at a grocery store.

• 7:31David Sims?

  But that's so funny that it's DVDs.

• 7:33Speaker 02

  It's DVDs.

• 7:34David Sims?

  Like, you're not, like, streaming shit.

• 7:35Griffin Newman?

  Because they have the built in. No wifi, built in TV DVD comma. You were just saying every town you stopped and you go to Goodwill.

• 7:42Speaker 02

  I would go to Goodwill and I would find.

• 7:44Griffin Newman?

  The next four days of entertainment are defined by what they have.

• 7:47Speaker 02

  Yes. And actually, Coe, the Coe's were big. Those were probably the only good movies we allowed ourselves. Because it was a lot of dog shit. It was a lot of like, late period Seagal. It was a lot of like, it was a lot of like, you know, we had some Chuck. You get a lot of three packs with Seagal.

• 8:02Griffin Newman?

  Oh, sure.

• 8:03Speaker 02

  A lot of four packs.

• 8:03Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 8:03Speaker 02

  A lot of Chuck Norris three packs that you can find at a Winco in Eugene, Oregon.

• 8:08David Sims?

  We're talking like Seagal, like Russia, Russia, Order of Lenin Seagal, right?

• 8:13Speaker 02

  It's right at the beginning of that.

• 8:15David Sims?

  Okay, so not the now where he like does it in a chair.

• 8:17Speaker 02

  No, exactly. It's not chair, which is a great, yes. The, I believe my boy Nick said the donut, he's got a goatee that's like a donut. Like a black, like a chocolate donut, not chocolate donuts ago. Right before that, like in, when he's trying to figure out.

• 8:31David Sims?

  When he's like, shit, I'm out. I'm direct to video now. Like, what is this?

• 8:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 8:35Griffin Newman?

  I feel like Chocolate Donuts Segal also has a thing where like, there'll be a stunt chase with a guy on a motorcycle and the guy's wearing a helmet.

• 8:42Speaker 02

  The helmet is big.

• 8:43Griffin Newman?

  Literally superimposed his face over the helmet.

• 8:46Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes, yes. They've done that.

• 8:47Griffin Newman?

  Or just printed it out and taped it on front of the helmet.

• 8:50David Sims?

  Do you remember his energy drink?

• 8:52Griffin Newman?

  Segal?

• 8:53Speaker 02

  I don't remember.

• 8:53David Sims?

  Steven Segal's lightning ball energy and it had two flavors. I have to look them up because they're so funny. Asian experience and cherry charge. I think about Asian experience all the time. The flavor is Asian experience.

• 9:07Griffin Newman?

  Do you know what's the most interesting thing? That that guy, look, he has his quick rise and fall, right? And in the late eighties, the early nineties.

• 9:13Speaker 02

  Ten years.

• 9:14Griffin Newman?

  Right. And then it's sort of like this guy, he went crazy. He may, you know, he wanted, what, Undeadly Ground is the one that he directed.

• 9:22David Sims?

  Uh, yeah, Undeadly Ground is the one where he's like, we're gonna save the environment.

• 9:26Griffin Newman?

  Right. And everyone was like, this guy's cooked. And then like three years later, Joel Silver takes him out of the junk pile and is like, here's the formula. If we put you with a rapper.

• 9:36David Sims?

  Yes, any rapper.

• 9:37Griffin Newman?

  And he had like four hit Segal plus a rapper movie.

• 9:40David Sims?

  What's crazy about those movies is like DMX acts him off the screen. DMX is like out of his gourd.

• 9:48Speaker 02

  I saw the DMX one in theaters.

• 9:49Griffin Newman?

  That's Exit Wounds.

• 9:50David Sims?

  Exit Wounds is the DMX one. It is pretty good.

• 9:52Griffin Newman?

  And then Cradle to the Grave.

• 9:54David Sims?

  Cradle to the Grave.

• 9:56Griffin Newman?

  Oh no, is that DMX and Jet Li?

• 9:58David Sims?

  That is DMX and Jet Li.

• 10:00Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 10:01David Sims?

  Yep, yep. I never saw that one.

• 10:02Griffin Newman?

  But then there's a, what is it called? Half Pass Dead?

• 10:05David Sims?

  Yeah, which is a great title. That's what Ja Rule.

• 10:06Griffin Newman?

  Ja Rule, yeah.

• 10:07Speaker 02

  Oh, I gotta, I gotta throw that out. If only we had come across that in the, in the DVD pile.

• 10:12David Sims?

  Right, that's Ja Rule and Morris Chestnut.

• 10:15Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 10:15David Sims?

  So who's the real actor?

• 10:16Speaker 02

  By the way, I've been talking about stuff that sucks. I love, another thing we would watch on tour is Watson, Morris Chestnut, sort of like, what if House was also? Well, what if House was Watson from Sherlock Holmes? It's tied into the shit.

• 10:34Griffin Newman?

  And it's Morris Chestnut.

• 10:35Speaker 02

  It's Morris Chestnut and he goes back to being a doctor and Moriarty is, is, is.

• 10:41Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 10:41Speaker 02

  Involved and like it's.

• 10:43Griffin Newman?

  I think is Randall Park Moriarty.

• 10:45Speaker 02

  Randall Park is Moriarty.

• 10:46David Sims?

  Moriarty, fuck.

• 10:47Speaker 02

  And and like and you know, the they have twins for no reason like they do the classic. Two of the people, two of the hot shots, two of the hot shots, doctors that.

• 10:56David Sims?

  Oh, my God, yeah, this guy plays identical twins.

• 10:58Speaker 02

  It's it's and it's so bad, but I can't stop.

• 11:02Griffin Newman?

  They can't.

• 11:02Speaker 02

  America can't stop watching.

• 11:03David Sims?

  It's so funny that we I know it's because Sherlock Holmes is like public domain or whatever. That like every two years, someone's like, what if we do something with Sherlock?

• 11:11Griffin Newman?

  We we literally did this rant.

• 11:13David Sims?

  Okay, is it set in like Baker Street? And it's like, no, it's set in Chicago.

• 11:17Speaker 02

  It's like Pittsburgh, actually.

• 11:19Griffin Newman?

  We did this rant on a recent episode. But like, first of all, you're saying that Watson is what if House was was Watson?

• 11:30Speaker 02

  What if Watson, yes, what if Watson was a sexy black guy? Oh, no, what if House was a sexy black guy that used to also be Sherlock Holmes assistant?

• 11:37Griffin Newman?

  But you know the whole bit.

• 11:39David Sims?

  Sherlock Holmes, like they say, like, I used to work in London.

• 11:41Griffin Newman?

  Right in the in the show Watson, he's dead.

• 11:44Speaker 02

  I had, I did miss the first 12 minutes of the pilot.

• 11:47Griffin Newman?

  Oh, huge.

• 11:48David Sims?

  Apparently, it's one year after Sherlock Holmes fell down a waterfall.

• 11:53Speaker 02

  So that's so that's the thing. I I caught it because it was playing after the NFL playoffs.

• 11:57David Sims?

  Okay.

• 11:58Speaker 02

  You know, they were like, oh, after the AFC championship, we got to hit them. This is we're gonna have a lot of eyeballs. We got to make sure people watch Watson. I had gone, you know, I was pissed off. The Ravens lost and I had gone and been fucking sad and whatever. I left. And then or actually, wait, we we lost to we lost before to the Bills. Actually, the tie in to Hailee Steinfeld, unfortunately. Makes it makes that's the only thing that that does tarnish my fandom is that it's another reminder of the rate. Every time I look at her, it's like, oh, the Ravens haven't haven't gone to the Super Bowl. Like the bill to her husband has beaten us multiple times anyway.

• 12:33David Sims?

  The Bills haven't got to the Super Bowl either. You guys are joint losers.

• 12:36Speaker 02

  I do like Josh Allen, unfortunately. Like, that's that's it reminds me of the grudging respect I have for a great rival of the Ravens, you know? Because even even his wife is like insanely talented, you know, and it's like, anyway, whatever. To let's let's wrap up the. Watson convo before moving on to, I, you know, it's important we finish this, but I missed, I missed the first 12 minutes, but I was so, the context clues, think, this movie, this, this show makes no sense with all the information, but imagine being thrust into it and being like, wait a second, what? He's fucking Watson? Sherlock Holmes, where the fuck is Sherlock? And then you're like, oh, he died, Mori already threw him off a, I'm now finding a waterfall. I didn't realize it was a waterfall. I did see some, there are some aquatic flashbacks.

• 13:20Speaker 02

  So this actually makes, thank you so much, uh, for, for making that clear, David. But yes, I, and I decided I'm never going to find out how it starts. I just need to figure out through beautiful, the economy of storytelling of Watson, I'm going to figure it out.

• 13:33Griffin Newman?

  That's how fucking television used to work. It's the craziest thing to think about.

• 13:37David Sims?

  Television used to be, you started the episode of Law and Order midway through and you're like, I guess this guy's the guy who did it. I don't know.

• 13:44Griffin Newman?

  And you're like, I guess I start watching the show from this point on.

• 13:47David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 13:48Griffin Newman?

  And maybe reruns are playing at some point and like seven years into watching reruns, you might be like, oh, this is the first episode.

• 13:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:55Griffin Newman?

  There's no Wikipedia. You can't like just quickly backfill it.

• 13:58Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 13:59Griffin Newman?

  You've got that fucking Simpsons episode guide. You're like thumbing through it, being like, I hope the B Sharps one comes on someday.

• 14:05Speaker 02

  Yes. No, I hope someday 12 years from now I am on Tubi and the pilot episode of Watson comes up. It auto plays and that's when I will finally watch it.

• 14:13Griffin Newman?

  But it has to happen by chance.

• 14:15Speaker 02

  Has to happen by chance. No, that's, I've become a Luddite basically where it's like, I'm on Tubi and I'm just letting, or I'll go to those random movie channels and I'll just like, you know, Inglourious Basterds was on one of those random movie channels. That's what I'm fucking watching right after.

• 14:29David Sims?

  Yeah. This is my whole thing. I don't need to detonate society. I just want to take us back to the nineties. You know what I mean?

• 14:35Speaker 02

  I think you could make so much money if the criteria on random is a little too random because it's like, look, I don't want to watch some fucking black and white Dana shit. You know what I mean? Like I, but if I don't want the rant, like half the random shit on there is like, all right, I get this is important or whatever.

• 14:50David Sims?

  Oh, let me throw it on and like, it's just like Jesus carrying a cross.

• 14:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 14:54David Sims?

  Like a silent movie and you're like, well.

• 14:57Griffin Newman?

  They just have the one like criterion 24 seven, right? They need a couple. To be like channels.

• 15:02David Sims?

  Right. They need like seventies noir or whatever. Yeah.

• 15:06Speaker 02

  I think you would make so much fucking money if you, my big idea and someone's gonna steal it is just essentially a hard drive. And you load it up with a hundred bangers, right?

• 15:16Griffin Newman?

  It's a randomized.

• 15:16Speaker 02

  Absolute fucking bangers. And of course, for me, it would be like, you know, dumb guy core. It's like, give me every fucking, give me all the, the, the Scorsese's with guns in them. Give me, give me all the.

• 15:27Griffin Newman?

  None of the Scorsese with.

• 15:29Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 15:30David Sims?

  Take a lot of Daniel Day-Lewis to be like, ooh.

• 15:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. No disrespect to Age of Innocence, but that ain't going on my fucking hard drive. I'll watch it, but it's not what we're talking about here, right? Give me Michael Mann, give me like the Seagulls, all the rapper Seagull. Like, you should be able to click a box and be like, or click a list and be like, I want 200 movies randomly playing on this hard drive and I could just hit component. And it's essentially gives you like a, I think that would be, you would make so much fucking money. Criterion should even do it. Criterion should release random boxes.

• 16:01Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 16:01Speaker 02

  And just be like, and I want it to be physical, right? Cause also I want the quality to be good. You don't want streaming to be a problem. You don't want buffering all this shit.

• 16:09Griffin Newman?

  Curated Roku stick.

• 16:11Speaker 02

  Yes, exactly right. Exactly right.

• 16:13Griffin Newman?

  Fucking scanning through is a nightmare. I gotta close the loop on this, on this Watson talk, okay? And I want to just make it clear, we absolutely did this run at some point in the last four months and have already forgotten it.

• 16:24David Sims?

  Totally forgot about it. Cause he already played some other hot doctor called like Redwood or what you like. Morris Chestnut just has a show every five years where you're like, he still has an age? Cool.

• 16:34Speaker 02

  He looks, he looks incredible.

• 16:36David Sims?

  He's insane looking.

• 16:37Griffin Newman?

  Did he play Ironside? We figured this out.

• 16:39David Sims?

  No, no. Blair Underwood played Ironside. Who's another guy who basically didn't crack.

• 16:44Speaker 02

  Talk about piece of ass.

• 16:48Griffin Newman?

  But Morris Chestnut did play Redwood or whatever the fuck his name is.

• 16:51David Sims?

  Called, I'm gonna find, Rosewood. Dr. Beaumont Rosewood Jr. And it's like, what's it about? And it's like, he's a doctor. I don't fucking know. Get over it.

• 16:59Griffin Newman?

  This is the point I want to make. House is based on Sherlock Holmes.

• 17:04David Sims?

  Yes.

• 17:04Griffin Newman?

  The premise of House was, what if Sherlock Holmes was a doctor today?

• 17:08David Sims?

  Fuck, yeah.

• 17:09Griffin Newman?

  And there are all these fucking illusions and the number. On his office door and the address.

• 17:14Speaker 03

  Addict too, right?

• 17:15David Sims?

  It's all supposed, it's basically like he's asocial. He's, he's got a weird computer brain. He's super smart, but he's also tough to be around.

• 17:23Griffin Newman?

  It's a fucking ten things I hate about you for Sherlock Holmes, right? And then that leads to the 2010s where you have the two Downey Jr. Movies.

• 17:30David Sims?

  Right.

• 17:31Griffin Newman?

  You have Cumberbatch, Martin Freeman Show and you have.

• 17:33David Sims?

  So like the Downey Jr. Movies is right. Downey Jr. Is like, what if Sherlock was a boxer?

• 17:38Griffin Newman?

  Big boxer, eh?

• 17:40David Sims?

  The, the, the fucking Cumberbatch is like, what if he had a BlackBerry? Right? Like that was his big thing. And then the elementary was just like, just Sherlock Holmes in like Chicago.

• 17:48Speaker 02

  And I want to be clear, the only media based on Sherlock Holmes that I have ever, including books or movies, is Watson on CBS. I have never seen a single, I've never read, I guess maybe the Wishbone episode where he's Sherlock Holmes.

• 18:03Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, it's probably Sherlock Holmes or something like that, right? He has to be.

• 18:06Speaker 02

  If there's, I've, I don't know if it was Sherlock, but I distinctly remember Wishbone in a little hat and the pipe.

• 18:10Griffin Newman?

  Absolutely.

• 18:11Speaker 02

  That and Watson.

• 18:12Griffin Newman?

  Baskerville.

• 18:13Speaker 02

  Yeah. Oh, maybe that. Exactly. Maybe.

• 18:15Griffin Newman?

  Probably both. They probably did both.

• 18:16Speaker 02

  Either way, if there's a Wishbone, Sherlock Holmes, that and Watson, I've never read a book. I've never, so that's all, Ben, you know what? I love it that way. So to me, I'm like, whoa, this is pretty fucking good.

• 18:27Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 18:27Speaker 02

  Watson's fucking cool.

• 18:29David Sims?

  Like Louis Chestnut just looks like an AI filter where you're like, it can't be.

• 18:33Griffin Newman?

  It's too symmetrical.

• 18:33David Sims?

  So smooth. Everything's so perfect.

• 18:35Speaker 02

  You know, it looks like that the guy i- in the newest, uh, Solnier movie, the Rebel Ridge?

• 18:40Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 18:40Speaker 02

  Oh, that guy. That guy is.

• 18:42Griffin Newman?

  His facial features are so extreme.

• 18:44Speaker 02

  He's literally, to me, that's the uncanny valley.

• 18:48David Sims?

  Yes, it almost hurts to look at him.

• 18:49Speaker 02

  It's trying to beat off to like Dead or Alive volleyball. You know what I mean? It's like, he's too hot.

• 18:55Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 18:55Speaker 02

  This like, I'm, it's pissing me off. How hot is it?

• 18:58Griffin Newman?

  You can't come looking at Aaron Pierre.

• 19:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:01David Sims?

  Dead or Alive volleyball is such a good example. Like that is just the pure nonsense where they're like, no, it's a volleyball.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  It's a volleyball.

• 19:12David Sims?

  And there's like 18 guys by computers like doing food physics or whatever.

• 19:16Griffin Newman?

  But you think back to like the nineties and the early two thousands and just the like getting. Horny for just the abstract hint.

• 19:24Speaker 02

  Didn't take much.

• 19:25Griffin Newman?

  Just being like, look, we, we have not cracked this technology at all.

• 19:29Speaker 02

  No, we're, and that's definitely another form of being a Luddite. We gotta get, there's gotta be a streaming box of that as well. Where it's like, you don't get pornography, you get boobs from a Sears catalog. You get, you know, you get like, uh,

• 19:41Griffin Newman?

  We have to roll a factor.

• 19:41Speaker 02

  The seasons of Friends where they weren't wearing bras. You know what I mean? Like Charmed, Charmed was big.

• 19:47David Sims?

  Caroline in the city, man. Just every eighth episode of that.

• 19:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 19:53Griffin Newman?

  You just think back to what a like cultural revolution it was of like, oh my God, Lara Croft is so hot. They have made the first fuckable video game character. And you look at that first game and she looks like a cyber.

• 20:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

• 20:05Griffin Newman?

  And people were like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 20:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. You could do the cheat code to get those triangle nippleless tits out. And it's like, and at the time you're like, yeah.

• 20:14David Sims?

  You're just like, it's so hot. And you're like, oh, what's the game? It's like, you mostly jump on rocks trying to like, it's so annoying.

• 20:20Speaker 02

  It's kinda Zelda, I guess. It's like hot Zelda.

• 20:23David Sims?

  Really, really extended puzzle solving. Yeah. Whatever, man.

• 20:27Speaker 02

  All right. I gotta ask, Watson fucks? What? Um.

• 20:31David Sims?

  Yeah, he's taking another girl?

• 20:32Speaker 02

  Watson's ex-wife, uh, has left him, but she's a piece of ass too. And now she's, she's also bi, I guess. And now she's with a hot woman. So it feels like, oh, it feels like Watson's kinda trying to fuck them both, but he's out.

• 20:46Griffin Newman?

  Interesting.

• 20:48David Sims?

  This is something that network TV is doing more and more of without anyone talking about it. Cause like I threw on that show, Dr. Odyssey.

• 20:55Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, but now canceled, R I P.

• 20:56David Sims?

  R I P. Like, um, but that was like a show where it's like, yeah, it's the love boat with doctors. And you're like, I get it. And they're like, three episodes in, they're like, I think they're, they're gonna be in a throuple.

• 21:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:06David Sims?

  And then like five episodes in, they're like, they're fully in a throuple and one of them's pregnant. Like it's just, and I'm like, don't grandmas watch CBS? This is on CBS. This is the Columbia broadcasting system.

• 21:17Griffin Newman?

  That is what they are.

• 21:18Speaker 02

  Well, I will say Watson is a little more chaste. Like I think he wants, I think he, he misses love, right? And I think that's really like, and so he's really focused. He's also dealing with some kind of, kind of mysterious brain ailment that

• 21:32Griffin Newman?

  Perfect.

• 21:32Speaker 02

  Moriarty seems to be making worse through his nefarious agents. Yeah. They hit him with a Havana syndrome gun.

• 21:39David Sims?

  Shooting weird waves at him.

• 21:41Griffin Newman?

  Moriarty infected him with the woke mind virus.

• 21:44Speaker 02

  Exactly right. Uh, yeah, I watch it as he, they, and that's his big problem, you know? Uh, but yeah, there's not an, I, they use Morris Chestnut, but they don't make him explicitly. He's just so focused on medicine.

• 21:57Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 21:57Speaker 02

  And, you know, piecing his life back together that I think he's not, hopefully his season two, maybe, you know, he's made peace with his ex-wife, leaving him for a hot woman. Then he can move forward and he can fuck in season two, but I think right now it's about solving, you know, the mysteries that come his way and maybe thwarting Moriarty as well.

• 22:16David Sims?

  It's been renewed. Seven million viewers a week.

• 22:18Griffin Newman?

  We wish him all the best.

• 22:19Speaker 02

  And I'm one of those, I am one of those seven. I'm one of those seven mil.

• 22:23Griffin Newman?

  Hey, uh, this is a blank check with Griffin and David.

• 22:27David Sims?

  I'm David.

• 22:28Griffin Newman?

  It's a podcast about filmographies, directors who have massive success early on in their careers. They're giving a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion projects they want. Sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce. Baby, this is a mini-series on the films of Joel and Ethan Cohen, together and separately. It is.

• 22:45Speaker 02

  Oh, you're doing separate.

• 22:46Griffin Newman?

  We're doing the separates.

• 22:47Speaker 02

  Interesting. Cool.

• 22:48Griffin Newman?

  We're doing the separates. Uh, it is called Pod Country for Old Casts. Today we are talking about True Grit, their blockbuster.

• 22:57Griffin Newman?

  People forget.

• 22:57Speaker 02

  That's insane. I didn't realize that. Yeah.

• 22:59Griffin Newman?

  Fucking big this movie was. This movie made a hundred and seventy million dollars domestic. Their second highest grossing film, I believe, is No Country, which made seventy.

• 23:09David Sims?

  Yeah, no, it's.

• 23:10Griffin Newman?

  This is their only like fucking four quadrant smash.

• 23:14David Sims?

  It's not just that. It's like that they, th- this is them cashing the No Country check. They win best picture and they go to Scott Rudin, normal guy. And they're like, hey, we want to do True Grit. And he's like, that's like a famous movie that won an Oscar.

• 23:30Griffin Newman?

  Why would you do that?

• 23:31David Sims?

  With John Wayne in it.

• 23:31Speaker 02

  Wait, that won a, the first one won an Oscar?

• 23:33David Sims?

  John Wayne won, it was kind of like, it was kind of like a retirement Oscar.

• 23:36Griffin Newman?

  Okay.

• 23:37David Sims?

  You know, it's kind of like a year old.

• 23:38Griffin Newman?

  I did as well.

• 23:39Speaker 02

  It was a piece of shit.

• 23:40David Sims?

  It's a bad movie. No, no. And like, that's the thing. They're like, yeah, but that movie sucks and we love the book and we want to do it. And he's like, okay. And they're like, and it can be like a PG 13 Western. I mean, he's like, okay. And then it's a huge hit. Like they were totally right. Like, like this, like weird niche pitch they throw. And they're like, no, but maybe families will go see it, release it at Christmas.

• 23:59Griffin Newman?

  But their pitch was, hey, the languages in the book is really great. We want to make a more faithful adaptation of the language.

• 24:05Speaker 02

  We want a more literary Western.

• 24:07Griffin Newman?

  Right. And then he also was like, the book is solely from the perspective of the little girl. And the movie kind of centralizes it more around John Wayne. We want to tell it more from the little girl. And Scott Runcie's like, great. So now we got to find some fucking 12 year old who can talk fast and ride a horse and shoot a gun.

• 24:24Speaker 02

  That's an insane pitch because this movie is an absolute banger and it does not work. I mean, Hailee Steinfeld is so, like, when I first watched it, it blew my fucking mind. I, I watched it in the, in the context of like, we weren't a huge movie family, like, kind of growing up and I, I had this summer where I was, I worked at Blockbuster on the way out and Oh, like The Dying Days. The Dying Days. I'm a freshman in college.

• 24:50Griffin Newman?

  I can never be our woman days.

• 24:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Actually, yeah, it started, it started when I was in, still in, in high school. And so this is like 2007, right? Like, right before, when, No Country was, was that year?

• 25:00Griffin Newman?

  Was 2007, yeah.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I got into the, like, the Coen Brothers were a bit of a blind spot for me and I, I, like, I, I went through and, like, watched a bunch of their shit. And I watched this movie as just sort of after that, after No Country, where I was, I, I, I, actually, you know, it's funny, I weirdly, which is a bad take in hindsight, but I watched all their sick movies, right? I watched their bangers. I watched, you know, Lebowski,

• 25:28Griffin Newman?

  Fargo.

• 25:28Speaker 02

  Fargo, uh, the, the, uh, Blood Simple. And I'm like, holy fuck, these guys are incre- and then No, I see No Country in theaters. I'm like, these guys fucking rock. What the fuck else is next? And then Thank You, uh, or, um,

• 25:40Griffin Newman?

  Burn After Reading is the next one.

• 25:42Speaker 02

  And now I love that movie.

• 25:44Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 25:44Speaker 02

  But as a fucking idiot, as a 19 year old idiot who wanted fucking sinister killers and shit, I'm like, what the fuck is this bullshit? And it turned me off of, of, so I didn't see True Grit in theaters.

• 25:55Griffin Newman?

  Okay, because that's the next one after Burn.

• 25:57Speaker 02

  Right. So it pissed me off. And I, and then so I watched it later as just sort of like, all right, I was, I was wrong about Burn After Reading. Let me fuck, after I've been scorned, let me go back and watch all this shit I missed. And I just thought it was gonna be solid, but not as good as No Country for Old Men, whatever. Because it's like, it feels almost like AI generate Coen Brothers movie where it's like Western, cool cast, what, you know, revenge, whatever. It, the second she's on screen, I'm like, what the, I didn't even consider the kid actor being like a part. I, I, I thought that would be the worst part of the movie. Right. You're like, I'm here to see Bridges with a gun, drinking whiskey. Yeah. You see, you see a little kid on the fucking poster, you're like, this, I hope she's not into that much. And, and it's like,

• 26:41Speaker 02

  And then she's fuck, she is so breathtaking, just her manner, her the, her power. She's like this, like, there's like, her power level, like a Dragon Ball Z, you, you put the reader on her, dude.

• 26:52Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 26:53Speaker 02

  She's fucking, her power levels are out of control, just standing there, just having a conversation. And it blew me away more than any other aspect, which I don't think is a hot take, is that, I think, did she get nominated for this?

• 27:03Griffin Newman?

  She did. They put her in supporting, the thing they always do with kids, even though she is the lead of them.

• 27:09Speaker 02

  I mean, without question. And that, that blew me, and a movie that fucking rules, she is so fucking good. So anyway, I just.

• 27:15Griffin Newman?

  Astonishing.

• 27:16Speaker 02

  It was cra- and the mo- the fact, thinking about you, think about them pitching this, and they're like, oh yeah, and obviously it's gonna star a kid, like, who the fuck let them make this movie? It's crazy.

• 27:26Griffin Newman?

  Because.

• 27:26Speaker 02

  Was she even an act? Like, who?

• 27:27Griffin Newman?

  No, they just found her. She had like two, like, sitcom guest spot appearances. I believe she's on an episode of Back to You.

• 27:34Speaker 02

  Oh, hell yeah.

• 27:34Griffin Newman?

  Um, but yes, no, it was like, that's the craziest part of the pitch, right? Is that like Burn After Reading, I believe they're already, they already have in the can before No Country Wins All the Oscars. They were on a like one a year movie clip. So Burn After Reading comes out like six months after No Country sweeps the Oscars. But this is the movie they set up with the Oscar cachet.

• 27:56Speaker 02

  See, I see if, if it had been right after No Country, this might have been like my favorite movie I saw in theaters, like in the 20s.

• 28:02Griffin Newman?

  But that was like, they already had that in the can, they go this pitch, and then it's the craziest part of the pitch is like, and by the way, we can't start making the movie until we find the kid, right?

• 28:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 28:10Griffin Newman?

  Like, I feel like they get Damon and Bridges attached really quickly, they've announced this, and then I think the status, they said they auditioned 15,000?

• 28:19David Sims?

  No, they got 15,000 tapes. They didn't audition 15,000, but the crazy thing is they didn't find her until three weeks before shooting.

• 28:27Griffin Newman?

  She was.

• 28:27David Sims?

  They sifted through like so much shit.

• 28:30Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 28:30David Sims?

  They said, I mean, the Coens were obviously like, we didn't watch that, like, our casting person did. Like, most of it was just immediate, like, no, no, this isn't an actor. And then they find her really late in LA, because they're looking across the country, they're like, let's find some southern kid.

• 28:43Griffin Newman?

  Her name is Hailee Steinfeld. This sounds right on paper.

• 28:47Speaker 02

  Right.

• 28:47David Sims?

  And she's actually like a quarter Filipino or whatever, like, it's like, nothing about her.

• 28:51Griffin Newman?

  And like a quarter African American. That's part of the sinners thing. Yes, she's talking about this.

• 28:57David Sims?

  It's true in the sinners.

• 28:58Griffin Newman?

  No, no, that's true in real life.

• 28:59Speaker 02

  I think it's true. I think, I think.

• 29:01David Sims?

  Sure.

• 29:01Griffin Newman?

  It might be one a.

• 29:03David Sims?

  She's got a mixed descent.

• 29:04Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, she has. Yes.

• 29:05David Sims?

  Um, and they were like, yeah, but she could, she could read the language. Like, that was the whole thing. Immediately, like, it's like, it's this complicated, weird language.

• 29:13Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 29:14David Sims?

  And she's just nailing it. And then there's that story Damon has where he's coming aboard a couple of weeks in. The Coens come in, they do a take, the Coens come in, give her a crazy, complicated adjustment. They do the next take, she nails it, and Damon goes over to Roger Deakins and he's like, is she, this is what she's like? She's this good? And Deakins is like, yeah, this is what she's like.

• 29:33Griffin Newman?

  Right out of the box.

• 29:34David Sims?

  Like, she's like, just fucking nailing everything.

• 29:36Griffin Newman?

  You know, in the, in the John Wayne movie, and by the way, our guest today is Daryl's hockey.

• 29:40Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, right.

• 29:42Speaker 02

  How we doing?

• 29:43Griffin Newman?

  From Begonia.

• 29:44Speaker 02

  That is true.

• 29:45Griffin Newman?

  Which will be coming out around the time this episode comes out.

• 29:47Speaker 02

  Comes out around Halloween, yeah.

• 29:48David Sims?

  Oh, fuck it. Yeah, you're right. Wait, this is perfect. Yeah, this is perfect.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  And they're gonna need this. They'll need me doing promo for it, for sure.

• 29:56Griffin Newman?

  They're expecting you to pull the train.

• 29:59Speaker 02

  They were like, listen, man, if you can swing Blank Check around the release of the movie, we'll let you get the part. And that was a big risk for me because we didn't even know each other.

• 30:08Griffin Newman?

  No, no.

• 30:09Speaker 02

  When I got the movie.

• 30:10Griffin Newman?

  No, this lined up very well.

• 30:12David Sims?

  Yeah, Yorgos is like, so you can do Blank Check?

• 30:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:15David Sims?

  And you're like, yeah, man, whatever. I can dance, I can do eight accents, I can fence.

• 30:20Speaker 02

  I can jet ski, whatever you need, big dog, put me in the fucking movie.

• 30:24Griffin Newman?

  But you can hang with the two friends?

• 30:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:27David Sims?

  Is Yorgos chill? I interviewed him once a long time ago, and he's the, one of the only interviews I got where the press person called me before him being like, hey, just so, by the way, just so you know, he's really weird.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  Interesting.

• 30:37David Sims?

  Like, just like, get ready for like, a really weird guy. Now, that was a long time. I think now he's not as awkward.

• 30:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, look, I, the context is different. I mean, I can't imagine, like, doing press sucks dick. So if you're, if you're like, an auteur who'd like, well, I don't fuck, even though, you know.

• 30:53Griffin Newman?

  And like, not a performer.

• 30:54Speaker 02

  And it's like, performer, yeah.

• 30:55David Sims?

  It's like the lobster era where I feel like the first question everyone probably has still is like, hey, why does every character in your movie talk like a weird robot? Like, what's the vibe? What's going on?

• 31:04Griffin Newman?

  So what were you smoking and where can I get some? I assume he just got years of those questions.

• 31:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, I mean, he was the man. And look, I, I'm, I know, I know art kids and I know Greek people. And so like, you know, I grew up around both of that type of, type of guy. And so it's like.

• 31:20Griffin Newman?

  He's your ultimate guy.

• 31:21Speaker 02

  And he's a bad, he's a hoops guy. He played hoops. Like, we had a lot. He's big. He played hoops in, yeah, there was a big part where we were talking about, uh, we talked about like hoops and he's, he's a big, uh, European hoops.

• 31:33David Sims?

  Like he still follows him.

• 31:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. He literally, he thinks, which is an insane take, but, uh, yeah.

• 31:38David Sims?

  Oh, he thinks it's better?

• 31:39Speaker 02

  He thinks it's better than the NBA.

• 31:40David Sims?

  Do you ever see the, I mean, like, isn't that like where the arenas are just filled with people like shooting off fireworks every 30 seconds?

• 31:46Speaker 02

  Okay, the vibes are way better. Don't get me wrong. Like, people give a fuck.

• 31:48David Sims?

  Basketball is bad.

• 31:49Speaker 02

  Basketball is just not as open. I, I like a more open game, but what can I say? That was when I really was like, wow, I am Greek American, not Greek.

• 31:55David Sims?

  Like you actually like to spread the floor. You don't like bang bodies.

• 31:59Speaker 02

  And now has three point shooting gotten a little out of control?

• 32:01David Sims?

  Yes, it has.

• 32:01Speaker 02

  I think it definitely has. So as a, so maybe I could see what he's talking about in that, like, the games are harder fought, but at the same time, I don't want to go back to, you know, Pistons Spurs finals. Where it's like 63 to 71. Griff, you, you agree, right?

• 32:16Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. Well, here's what I was gonna say that I actually can contribute to this.

• 32:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:19Griffin Newman?

  I don't know if you know this.

• 32:21David Sims?

  His brother works in European basketball.

• 32:23Griffin Newman?

  My brother works in European basketball. He works in the French Basketball League, but his team has also now become part of the Euro Basketball League.

• 32:29Speaker 02

  Oh, they got in the Euro.

• 32:29Griffin Newman?

  And the French Basketball League, I feel like has its own contempt. This thing we're seeing of like every basketball fandom culture is different in every country, right?

• 32:37Speaker 02

  Incredible.

• 32:37Griffin Newman?

  And like, I go to the Parisian games and there's a drum circle. There's like, he's like, those are the drum guys.

• 32:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:43Griffin Newman?

  They always buy this corner and they come with 20 drums and they're just banging them. And that's what they do, right? And I'm like, is this a Paris thing? It's kind of a France thing. But then they'll play the Euroleague games and like Turkey will come over and Turkey will be throwing smoke bombs.

• 32:56David Sims?

  Yeah, dude.

• 32:57Griffin Newman?

  And they're like, what is this?

• 32:59David Sims?

  Say Turkish.

• 32:59Griffin Newman?

  And they're like, yeah, that's their culture. Any Turkish basketball game you go to, people are throwing smoke bombs. Like anytime they have a visiting team from a different European country, and some of them are not European countries, but they go into the Euroleague because there's nowhere else to go. They all have their own thing where it's like, yeah, these guys love to throw marbles on the court.

• 33:17Speaker 02

  The Greek championship series was suspended by the police this time like the

• 33:25David Sims?

  It's so funny that it's essentially like division two basketball.

• 33:28Speaker 02

  Like the owners were like banned from being that like there's like they literally this has happened multiple times. And it sucks for me because I'm an Olympiakos fan and Panathinaikos unfortunately has been better recently and they're the ones that the that the Kumbo brothers play for and they have like a There's a there is a great profile about the Panathinaikos owner who's just an insane guy and you should look at it's very funny.

• 33:49David Sims?

  I grew up in England and it's it's very interesting to hear you pronounce that correctly because like

• 33:54Speaker 02

  Panathinaikos.

• 33:56David Sims?

  We're playing fucking Parthenikos or whatever, you know, because like they're that's the same the football team's the same name, you know.

• 34:02Speaker 02

  Olympiakos.

• 34:03David Sims?

  Oh yeah, fucking Olympiakos, Galatasaray, you know, all these like sort of like I know, I know, I know. Every time Arsenal would play Galatasaray, it would be one of those things where like one fan would die.

• 34:15Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 34:16David Sims?

  Like once a year, like some fan gets stabbed because he like stayed out too late, went to the wrong bar after or whatever. And you just be like, that's like, that's fucking welcome to the NBA, baby.

• 34:24Speaker 02

  And I do love those vibes.

• 34:25Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, I'm trying to remember which country it was, but there was some home game of my brother's team that I went to where they made all of the away fans sit behind their basket.

• 34:39David Sims?

  Yeah, they gotta be in like a cage.

• 34:41Griffin Newman?

  And no, they truly put a net around. And they had riot cops.

• 34:45David Sims?

  Because like both ways it's bad, you know, like everyone's going to try and attack them and they might start fights.

• 34:50Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 34:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 34:51David Sims?

  And then like, yeah, it's just this whole thing in America where it's like, well, what's your thing? It's like, well, we have a brass band in Britain. It's like, what's your thing? It's like, we're racist. We're like allowed to be. It's like culturally acceptable for us to be like screaming Jewish epithets or whatever, like something like that.

• 35:06Griffin Newman?

  You're not a real fan if you have all your teeth.

• 35:08David Sims?

  Right, it's like

• 35:09Griffin Newman?

  You gotta lose them in a fistfight during.

• 35:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, hooligan is a great term.

• 35:14Griffin Newman?

  Hooligan's a great term.

• 35:15David Sims?

  And it's just like this country where their emotions are not allowed out until they're in a football stadium and then they just become maniacs.

• 35:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:27Griffin Newman?

  David.

• 35:28David Sims?

  Hmm.

• 35:28Griffin Newman?

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• 35:36David Sims?

  Lisa.

• 35:37Griffin Newman?

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• 35:44David Sims?

  Yeah, I have a Lisa too. They've got a lineup of beautifully crafted mattresses tailored to how you sleep.

• 35:50Griffin Newman?

  Mm hmm.

• 35:51David Sims?

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• 35:57Griffin Newman?

  Maybe you hear eco-friendly and you go, oh, but I'm gonna sacrifice comfort.

• 36:01David Sims?

  No.

• 36:02Griffin Newman?

  Nope.

• 36:02David Sims?

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• 36:50Griffin Newman?

  David.

• 36:50David Sims?

  Yes.

• 36:51Griffin Newman?

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• 36:55David Sims?

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• 37:00Griffin Newman?

  I love that. It's very convenient.

• 37:02David Sims?

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• 37:09Griffin Newman?

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• 37:17David Sims?

  Uh, best stocking stuffers, maybe.

• 37:20Speaker 02

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• 37:22David Sims?

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• 37:41Griffin Newman?

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• 38:10Griffin Newman?

  Here's the thing I'm gonna say, going back to True Grit.

• 38:13Speaker 02

  Yes, please.

• 38:13Griffin Newman?

  Uh, to the point of them finding Hailee Steinfeld so late and her being like such a miracle. Months and months of auditioning people. I guess, right. At a certain point, they were just like, we just have to put this thing into motion and hope that we find the kid. I had a friend who was kind of like, had a pin in her for months. She must have been 20 or 21, but looked kind of young. And they were just sort of like, we're keeping you on hold in case we don't find an actual kid.

• 38:44Speaker 02

  Right.

• 38:45Griffin Newman?

  There was this notion of like, there might not truly be a child who can do this dialogue, carry the emotional weight and handle the stunts.

• 38:54Speaker 02

  Right.

• 38:54Griffin Newman?

  And so like, I'm sure they had a couple of those, you know? But it was that close of like, if we can't find a kid, it might be you.

• 39:01Speaker 02

  And it could still be a good ass movie if it's a like 1917, whatever year old, but it's not the same.

• 39:07Griffin Newman?

  It's magical. It's like magical that you're watching a child do. And I also think the ending, which to me is the whole thing that makes this movie profound, doesn't work if it isn't actually a kid at the beginning.

• 39:16Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 39:16Griffin Newman?

  And you watch the John Wayne movie, which is really hokey, but one of its biggest issues is that it's, it's, what's her name? Kim Darby?

• 39:23David Sims?

  Kim Darby. She's like 25 or whatever.

• 39:25Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 39:25Speaker 02

  She looks young, but yet not like a literal child.

• 39:28Griffin Newman?

  It is a grown up playing a kid. Right? And in like a sixties film with like, you know, without a sense of like naturalism in its performances, you can kind of get away with her wearing a wig and being like, gee willikers, yeah. Please, Mr. Rooster. But you read like, it was supposed to be Mia Farrow.

• 39:46David Sims?

  Wow.

• 39:46Griffin Newman?

  And then she turned it down after Rosemary's baby. She was, this was supposed to be her follow up to Rosemary's baby. Could you imagine after Rosemary's baby, Mia Farrow showing up and being like, hi, I'm a 12 year old. Right? And then they go.

• 40:00David Sims?

  I just got fucked by.

• 40:01Speaker 02

  Fucking insane.

• 40:02Griffin Newman?

  Right. They go through like Sandra Locke, Tuesday Well, John Lehman, Karen Carpenter. They offered it to Sally Field, all of them over 20 years old. And then you end up with Kim Darby, who at least had the benefit of being an unknown, where there wasn't the previous association in the same way of like, I've seen this person play a grown up yet. But it does totally change the vibe of the movie versus this movie starts with her. And you're like, who the fuck is this kid? Which is what the whole story is driven by, that like, this is a girl who you believe can like trick fucking Deacon Matthews into buying back, selling her at a discount the horses she just sold him at an up charge.

• 40:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. And what I love about those, I mean, the early feeling of like, they show how powerful this character is because basically when she's dealing with people that will deal with her at, like, the danger here is that she's a child, she's a girl, right? It's like two people, like the kind of people that are not treated well in the fucking wild west. And when people will deal with her as a human being, well, just a guy trading with her and it's wits versus wits. She's more, she's fucking, she's better than everyone. Like she's tougher. She, her only dangers are the most fucked up things possible, which is like

• 41:15David Sims?

  Someone could pick her up and strangle her.

• 41:16Speaker 02

  Violence, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, yeah. Like, yeah, exactly. Exactly. And so that, it was really cool to, they established her as like, yeah, this, only some really fucked up shit can stop this person. And she knows she's susceptible to it. She's constantly walking this tightrope and she doesn't give a fuck because, you know, it's bigger than her. She has a, she has a, you know, she has a real goal here.

• 41:36David Sims?

  Not to go all thesis, but like, what is so magnificent about this movie? Cause in the movie I saw in theaters and I was like, that rocked, love that, Western, like had a great time. And then as I kept watching, I kept being like, this might be the best movie they ever made. This might be like one of the best movies of the. Century or whatever is I'm just like, it's like, America then, right? Is like kind of civilizations kind of arrived, but everyone who lives out here is basically just a weirdo or a criminal or a drunk or some like diseased person or an immigrant who can only operate like, you know, out here in the wild or whatever. And, you know, bad shit happens all the time. Someone argues over a dog and gets shot.

• 42:18Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 42:19David Sims?

  And it's like, yeah, it sucks and we'll kind of deal with it. And she's just like, a great wrong has been done. And I like, I want this addressed because like a bad, this is not fair, like that this happened to me. And like, she just slowly infects everyone in the movie. Like, right? The beef is in it for money, like, and he and pride and like, you know, being a, you know, showboat, right?

• 42:43Speaker 02

  The beef is very, I'd love to really crack.

• 42:46David Sims?

  We're gonna talk. Rooster's in it for whiskey and money and just like, he just can only do this, right? Like, you know, and it's like, by the end of the movie.

• 42:53Griffin Newman?

  And everyone's driven by ego as well, the idea of reputation in the West and being seen as a big man and a tough man.

• 42:58David Sims?

  Which is what matters out there. And like, by the end of the movie, Rooster is like this, like, he, he won't say it out loud, maybe, but you can tell that he's like, this is important that we like do this.

• 43:07Griffin Newman?

  I don't want to say this always works for me.

• 43:09David Sims?

  And it's like, just this like glimmer of civilization, you know, like in a lawless.

• 43:14Griffin Newman?

  I don't want to say it always works for me because.

• 43:15David Sims?

  That's what America is, which is not a great country. I think it is a great country, actually, with no problems. But no, no, but like, that is what is going on.

• 43:23Griffin Newman?

  You have to execute it well. I'm not going to go for the shittiest version of it that you haven't earned, but anytime you actually put the muscle into building properly, guy who doesn't give a shit about anything or anyone.

• 43:36David Sims?

  Right.

• 43:37Griffin Newman?

  And then at the end, he won't say it, but he'll do something that shows.

• 43:41David Sims?

  When his ass is running like, you know?

• 43:45Griffin Newman?

  The end of this movie gets me so worked up every time. And it is like, John Wayne plays the part a lot more sentimental and they treat it much more like this nice guy is helping this little girl, right? And they have this sort of begrudging, like, okay, little girly, but it does feel like the two of them are much more like, we have to help. The whole thing in this movie is that these two guys are just like, fuck you. And then both of them keep accidentally showing their hand. LaBeef is cornier, right? Like he'll, he'll open up and give her the respect increasingly over the course of the film.

• 44:14David Sims?

  He'll say it a lot because he's a man of gab.

• 44:16Griffin Newman?

  But Rooster will never fucking say it.

• 44:18David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 44:19Griffin Newman?

  And him just running with her in his arms.

• 44:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, her and Rooster really is. I mean, that's the pure shit. That's the, and, and like, LaBeef is interesting to me, like, your point, David, about it really to me feels like the Rooster and Matty relationship is where you really see it because he is, he really just is a piece of shit. Like, he's awesome, but he's maybe one of the worst guys of all time, right?

• 44:42David Sims?

  Yeah, I mean, he's on trial and at first you're like on, you're like, yeah, Rooster, tell him. And then you're like, it does kind of sound like he just shot a bunch of fucking guys.

• 44:50Speaker 02

  He definitely killed him.

• 44:51David Sims?

  Because he was so drunk.

• 44:52Speaker 02

  And also like, it's later revealed that they're both, right? Both are heroes or Confederate guys, right? But he's the type of Confederate that like, the other Confederates were like, these are bad guys. Like LaBeef was like, oh, you were that kind of Confederate, like, which is fucking hilarious. Like, they give you, and then even at the end, as soon as that motherfucker, like, he sobers up, he takes the money, whatever. Then there's the hilarious part where he finds a little whiskey and he's a piece of shit immediately, right? Like, he immediately gives into his vices, even though he might have been slowly on the path to like, you know, helping her and growing. The second he gets a fucking bottle of whiskey, that's done. And he's like, fuck you bitch.

• 45:29David Sims?

  I washed my hands of it.

• 45:29Speaker 02

  Get the fuck out of here. You go, you and LaBeef, whatever.

• 45:32Griffin Newman?

  A bottle. He's, he's put down three or four. Dare I say this man loves to pull the cork?

• 45:38David Sims?

  I also love the random.

• 45:39Griffin Newman?

  Favorite line in the history of movies.

• 45:41David Sims?

  Three quarters of the way into the movie where, where he's like, I did rob a bank one time and she's like, what? And he's like, I don't know. Like, who fucking cares?

• 45:48Griffin Newman?

  Fucking wife wanted me to be a lawyer.

• 45:50David Sims?

  And he's like, yeah, that's what they thought.

• 45:52Speaker 02

  And then there's the story about what a badass he was where he's charging at seven guys or whatever. It's like, he's in the wrong there.

• 46:00Speaker 02

  He's just such a fucking irredeemable piece of shit.

• 46:03David Sims?

  But that is what she's like, I need a Terminator. I need like a.

• 46:07Speaker 02

  And it's cool that she, because she, when they, when they described the three potential. Marshals.

• 46:12David Sims?

  Right.

• 46:12Speaker 02

  The bet is like one's a good tracker.

• 46:14David Sims?

  It's like Final Fight.

• 46:17Speaker 02

  Oh yeah. Give me the piece of shit that kills people. That's right. And she knows that, which to her credit is awesome. She's like, I'm willing to deal with this kind of guy. He's a tool I can wield. But yes, that's why seeing him become essentially a good guy, not good, but doing the good thing.

• 46:33David Sims?

  Scenes are the beginning of the quest where he watches her take the horse over the river, right? And it's just the simplest cinematic language possible. Cut to Rooster, cut to horse, cut to Rooster. There's nothing complicated going on at all. Every time you cut back to Rooster, 5% more in Jeff Bridges are like, damn, she's really fucking going across the whole ass river. And that, no, with what he does say, when Labiche starts spanking her is like, I don't think I will let this happen. And it's basically like, yeah, you've earned me enough of my respect here.

• 47:05Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 47:05David Sims?

  And then by the end of the movie, yes, he loves her like a child, like he, you know, because he was mean to his actual child.

• 47:11Speaker 02

  Yes. Right. Another thing.

• 47:12David Sims?

  If you pick out his monologues, you're like, what?

• 47:17Speaker 02

  And he's like, well, I guess I was a piece of shit. My boy didn't care for me. And me, he's like, I guess I did treat him like shit.

• 47:23David Sims?

  But he was so clumsy.

• 47:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. And he broke so many of my glasses.

• 47:27David Sims?

  I'm like, you're clumsy.

• 47:29Speaker 02

  And this guy who's killed 30 guys, imagine what he thinks is treating someone bad. What he will even admit is treating someone bad. Like, oh my God.

• 47:37David Sims?

  One of the funniest things, right? He's like, I don't know. I've killed like 12 to 15 guys. The guy's like, I have the number here. He's like, yeah, I guess it's like 25.

• 47:44Speaker 02

  You got me. The court scene rules too, where he's, where he's getting them, where he realizes people are laughing and he's kind of leaning into it. That little like Jeff.

• 47:53David Sims?

  Tend to go backwards. Yes. Go ahead, Chris. All right.

• 47:55Griffin Newman?

  As we said.

• 47:55David Sims?

  I get so fired up about this movie.

• 47:57Griffin Newman?

  Uh, John, John Wayne, winning the Oscar for this was kind of like a gold watch retirement.

• 48:03David Sims?

  That's exactly what it was. It was a. Hey, you're, you're, you're kind of, it's a sentimental.

• 48:07Griffin Newman?

  It was only his second nomination ever. He dies like seven or eight years after this.

• 48:11David Sims?

  Yeah. But in my, in my head, I'm like, oh, he died right after. And it's like, no, actually he made a fucking True Grit sequel.

• 48:18Griffin Newman?

  They made a movie called Rooster Cogburn. That's him dealing with Catherine Hepburn. And she's like, ah, well.

• 48:23David Sims?

  That is the vibe.

• 48:24Speaker 02

  He is so, I mean, he sucks in it.

• 48:27David Sims?

  John Wayne is an awesome actor. He not good.

• 48:29Speaker 02

  And listen, I mean, what's his last, was the shoot?

• 48:32Griffin Newman?

  The shoot is this is last.

• 48:33Speaker 02

  He's incredible in that.

• 48:34Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 48:35Speaker 02

  That's what, if he was that, if he did that performance, that's the kind of performance this movie needed.

• 48:40Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 48:40Speaker 02

  He's pretty, he's much closer to what Bridges does here.

• 48:43David Sims?

  The whole thing with John Wayne is that like when I'm getting into movies, I think of him as a square, right? Cause that's what you hear about John Wayne. It's like, oh yeah, he was, you know, a conservative and he supported the war and all that shit. And then you're like, watch any John Ford movie that he's in, you're like, I would fucking, I'll vote for Reagan.

• 48:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 49:00David Sims?

  The coolest guy I've ever seen, but it's those movies where he's like,

• 49:02Speaker 02

  He's incredible.

• 49:03David Sims?

  He's incredible. He's like stoic and vile. He's amazing in The Searchers. But True Grit is kind of what he's bad at, which is like, you know, broad, kind of goofy shit.

• 49:11Griffin Newman?

  Well, so the thing I was gonna identify is the moment that people, I think, give credit to winning him the Oscar is the 69 movies version of that monologue of explaining how he's fucked up his marriages and his son, which in that movie is played as like a real, this guy has let his guard down. John Wayne is showing emotions, right? He's like getting vulnerable on camera and they're around a campfire. And he's sort of looking off to the middle distance and being like, I guess I wasn't a good father, you know?

• 49:41Speaker 02

  But it's so corny.

• 49:42Griffin Newman?

  And then they announce, okay, Coen Brothers doing True Grit with Jeff Bridges. At the moment they announce it, Crazy Heart has not come out yet. So people were like, Jeff Bridges is one of these great overdo, this guy needs an Oscar dudes. It would make so much sense that True Grit is kind of the movie that wins him an Oscar in the same way. Then Crazy Heart comes out of nowhere.

• 50:01David Sims?

  Then it would be like playing Joker. It's like, you want to win an Oscar? Fucking play Rooster Cogburn. Yeah.

• 50:05Griffin Newman?

  Right. Crazy Heart comes out of nowhere. He wins. And people are like, and can you believe he's got True Grit next year? Is he gonna win two years in a row? And then the movie comes out and everyone's like, oh, he's playing it like a grotesque. He's not doing the obvious thing you would do to try to win an Oscar.

• 50:20David Sims?

  Sweetheart shit. No.

• 50:21Griffin Newman?

  Which is also like, I feel like what's in the text of the movie is like, this guy's kind of a monster. And not only that, he's like aggressively unsavory.

• 50:29Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 50:30Griffin Newman?

  He's like unpleasant. He smells bad.

• 50:32Speaker 02

  But I mean, Obviously, Steinfeld is the absolute A number one like secret. But the second thing for me, what they're incredibly good at is all their movies, all the little characters, all the world, it's like, it feels so, all of them are so realized, they're so real. And they're, and everyone is disgusting. Everyone is what? A guy in that time, they're all sweaty, everyone looks like shit. Uh, I mean, the scene where they come across the guys in, um, in the little hut and the guy, you know, he shoots the guy in the, they, they look so disgusting. And especially when you compare it to the, the original, which is a Looney Tunes cartoon.

• 51:12Speaker 02

  It's like fucking in technicolor type shit that you're like, you're like, I, this is, this world is fucking terrifying.

• 51:21Griffin Newman?

  I also think the choice they make with that monologue of Rooster's like backstory dump is that it's delivered as if he's doing like a fucking deaf comedy jam.

• 51:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 51:32Griffin Newman?

  Routine to her largely disinterested, right?

• 51:36Speaker 02

  It's kind of like, yeah.

• 51:37David Sims?

  It's how he occupies himself, right?

• 51:40Griffin Newman?

  And he's not like, this is not me being vulnerable. This is me being like, yeah, I fucked up that marriage too.

• 51:45David Sims?

  He's like fucking Abe Simpson, like just talking to nobody.

• 51:48Griffin Newman?

  Which tells you even more about him that this guy is revealing his greatest failings in life as like, sort of like weird material.

• 51:57Speaker 02

  And it's also, but I also think, to me, it feels like it's nothing to him.

• 52:01Griffin Newman?

  Exactly.

• 52:01Speaker 02

  He doesn't give a fuck.

• 52:02Griffin Newman?

  Which tells you everything that this guy is like.

• 52:05David Sims?

  Again, he's not like, I rock. Like when she's like, hey, I'll give you, he's like, I sleep in a Chinese grocery store.

• 52:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 52:11David Sims?

  On like robes.

• 52:13Speaker 02

  This is just what I do. I happen to be an awesome murderer. I have, like, that's how I get whiskey. So yeah, people call me a fucking legend. It's a little, I mean, there's a little unforgiven to this movie too.

• 52:25David Sims?

  But Unforgiven is so serious. Like, I love that movie so much. Yes.

• 52:29Speaker 02

  But I mean, absolutely, they're different, but I just mean, there's a little, there's, I actually feel a little unforgiven in both Rooster is Clint Eastwood, obviously. And then LaBief to me feels like a little bit of the guy.

• 52:39Griffin Newman?

  The Morgan Freeman?

• 52:40Speaker 02

  No, no, no.

• 52:40David Sims?

  Uh, the guy, English.

• 52:42Griffin Newman?

  Richard Harris.

• 52:42Speaker 02

  No. No, no.

• 52:43David Sims?

  It was Bob, right?

• 52:44Speaker 02

  The kid who's a complete fraud.

• 52:46David Sims?

  Oh, yeah, that kid, right.

• 52:48Speaker 02

  To me, LaBief feels so mu- like, the big question I have about LaBief is like, is he good at any of this shit? Is he a complete fraud?

• 52:56David Sims?

  Right.

• 52:56Speaker 02

  I mean, in Unforgiven, it's way more, it's so much clearer that that character-

• 53:00David Sims?

  He's never killed anybody.

• 53:01Speaker 02

  Is a pure fraud, right?

• 53:02David Sims?

  Right, right.

• 53:02Speaker 02

  And it doesn't feel that way with LaBief, right? LaBief has definitely gone through some shit. It's almost like, maybe if that character had to go through war and like, maybe figure shit out, but he's not, he's not made of the same stuff Rooster is.

• 53:14Griffin Newman?

  He doesn't have, he doesn't have true grit.

• 53:16Speaker 02

  He doesn't have true grit.

• 53:17Griffin Newman?

  He doesn't have true grit.

• 53:17Speaker 02

  There's no chance LaBief has true grit.

• 53:19Griffin Newman?

  His outfit.

• 53:20Speaker 02

  You can't have true grit.

• 53:21Griffin Newman?

  He looks like a Toy Story cowboy, right?

• 53:23Speaker 02

  Yes, he does.

• 53:23Griffin Newman?

  Like, everything about him is like, a little too performative.

• 53:26Speaker 02

  And he's trying to, he's trying to intimidate a child and he can't do it.

• 53:29Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 53:29Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? Even though it's like the craziest-

• 53:31Griffin Newman?

  I can't decide if I want to intimidate or seduce you.

• 53:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 53:35Griffin Newman?

  But I'm trying to figure out what a guy should do in this situation.

• 53:37Speaker 02

  And I'm pathetic at both.

• 53:39Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 53:39Speaker 02

  I don't really, you can tell I don't really want to do either of it.

• 53:42Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 53:43Speaker 02

  And it's, but so it's like, he's such a fraud in so many ways. And even, you know, not to skip it at the end, it's like, you don't, I, I love that, I mean, I know it's a hard shot, and even if you just take it at face value, there is like, narrative value to him being like, he did this, he claimed he could shoot from far away, Rooster told him he couldn't, he pulled off the shot to save Rooster's life, that has its value? I, I, I watch it, I'm like, he doesn't know, he, this is a complete coin flip.

• 54:10Griffin Newman?

  No, she keeps telling him to take the shot, he goes to, they're too far and they're moving too fast.

• 54:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 54:15David Sims?

  And then finally, the guy, Barry Pepper, stops.

• 54:18Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 54:18David Sims?

  And he gets the shot, and it is, you're like, yeah, good job, buddy.

• 54:21Speaker 02

  Good job, but also-

• 54:22David Sims?

  Bully shot.

• 54:23Speaker 02

  But also, completely lucky is how it felt to me, you know what I mean?

• 54:26David Sims?

  He never does anything particularly impressive, but he does like, go all the way to fucking wherever the fuck that, you know, deep into Indian territory.

• 54:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 54:35David Sims?

  Like, he's fine, he can like, he's fine.

• 54:37Speaker 02

  I, I think his life outside of this, he, you could make him, you could read the characters impressive and, and whatever, but in this movie, he's a fuck, he's a complete loser. And like, just gets got at every turn.

• 54:49David Sims?

  And of course, like, the number one thing, as Haley, as Maddie keeps saying, is like- Like the guy they're chasing is like adults.

• 54:55Speaker 02

  Right. When you meet him.

• 54:56David Sims?

  Sucks. Like he's bad at everything.

• 54:59Speaker 02

  Dude, exactly.

• 55:00David Sims?

  And Brolin's so amazing. I mean, we're going all over the place.

• 55:02Speaker 02

  He's so good. But no, you're right. That part where she's where, where he meets her and she's like, you couldn't even catch this fucking, you wait, you've been tracking this idiot for three months?

• 55:11David Sims?

  Across three states.

• 55:12Speaker 02

  I'll find him in four days. Like if, and, and at the, at the time I'm like, she's so good at like shitting on people.

• 55:18David Sims?

  Right.

• 55:18Speaker 02

  And then you meet the guy and you're like, wait, how did this guy outsmart LaBief for fucking four months? He is a complete.

• 55:24Griffin Newman?

  But you're like, it's random.

• 55:25David Sims?

  It's wild west. You could just be like, well, I'll just go to this like a hundred million square acre area that no one lives in.

• 55:32Griffin Newman?

  It's like the deflation.

• 55:33David Sims?

  Dentist with a bear hat.

• 55:35Griffin Newman?

  You're like, this is awesome.

• 55:36Speaker 02

  That guy rules. That guy fucking rules.

• 55:38David Sims?

  Now would have like a podcast.

• 55:41Speaker 02

  A hundred percent. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 55:42Griffin Newman?

  That guy has his own supplements.

• 55:44Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yes.

• 55:45Griffin Newman?

  Uh, every Coens movie has like five guys like that where when they're on screen, you're like, is this the best performance I've ever seen in my life?

• 55:52Speaker 02

  Incredible. Yeah.

• 55:53Griffin Newman?

  The guy fucking.

• 55:54David Sims?

  The guy who does the animal noises? Love that guy.

• 55:56Griffin Newman?

  Oh, sure.

• 55:56David Sims?

  No explanation of why he does that.

• 55:58Speaker 02

  That guy's awesome.

• 55:59David Sims?

  Eats it dead. That's the end.

• 56:01Griffin Newman?

  So good.

• 56:02David Sims?

  I just like the idea of Barry Pepper being like, I need an idiot, kind of like a cold blooded murderer. Can we get like an animal guy in here just to keep it lively? Like in my little posse?

• 56:12Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 56:13Griffin Newman?

  You didn't get to see this in theaters, but I remember the, the feeling in the audience when Brolin came on screen. Because I mean, the posters for this movie are Bridges, Damon, Brolin, right?

• 56:24David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 56:25Griffin Newman?

  And they had him in the trailer. They have his face on the poster, but they didn't let him speak. And you know, the whole movie is structured around like, here's the big bad that they have to go and get revenge on, right? Like a, a, a, a.

• 56:37David Sims?

  Yeah, he's the.

• 56:38Griffin Newman?

  The bill must be settled, right? With this man. And then you get to him and like the Kerber well score is swelling and she sees him, she clocks him. The second he starts talking, the audience just exploded with laughter.

• 56:50Speaker 02

  Incredible.

• 56:50Griffin Newman?

  And it just, this immediate communication of, oh, this guy's like nothing.

• 56:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:54Griffin Newman?

  This guy is nothing. What are you doing here?

• 56:57Speaker 02

  It's like the reverse Spacey and Seven.

• 57:00Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 57:00Speaker 02

  It's like the absolute reverse of like.

• 57:02Griffin Newman?

  Where you're like, this guy's so much more terrifying than I could have imagined.

• 57:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 57:07Griffin Newman?

  And you're just like, this is some random guy who like shot a dude because his ego was threatened. He was a little scared.

• 57:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. And, and yeah, even the way he's like, he allows, he's like, hey, what are you doing here? You know, like the, the friendly conversation he's having with this girl who, who's dad, he knows he killed.

• 57:23David Sims?

  He knows he killed her dad. She's looking at him like death and he's like, murder?

• 57:28Speaker 02

  Hey.

• 57:28David Sims?

  And he like, literally is like, let me put my gun away.

• 57:32David Sims?

  And then my favorite thing is when she like points the gun at him, he's like, nothing goes right for me.

• 57:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:36Griffin Newman?

  He's such a sad sack.

• 57:39David Sims?

  Like he expects her to be like, I know, man. Yeah, it really sucks to be.

• 57:42Griffin Newman?

  And that's basically, he reveals the only reason he killed her father was because he felt like he made him look weak.

• 57:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 57:46David Sims?

  Right.

• 57:47Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 57:47David Sims?

  Yeah, he felt a little whatever, cucked by Mattie Ross's dad, who I guess the, the implication in this character is that her dad must have been an exemplar to her in some way. Like, I don't think like she had some like complete loser dad, right? Like, there's some sort of stiff Protestant kind of, you know, like frontier like character in her that must be from her dad. Cause she's like, yeah, my mom's home with the babies and she's indecisive, like.

• 58:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:13Griffin Newman?

  You also, the, the Wayne movie opens with her sending her father off.

• 58:17Speaker 02

  You meet the dad, which I thought sucked.

• 58:19Griffin Newman?

  It sucks. It's so much better when he's a mystery. It's so great that this movie just opens with.

• 58:22David Sims?

  Have any of you read the book, by the way?

• 58:24Speaker 02

  No, I don't want to.

• 58:25David Sims?

  I highly recommend it. It is basically this movie. The Coens are really good at adaptation in that they just put the movie on the screen. Like you're saying, like the only thing they really add is the stuff with Dakin Matthews. That's pure Coens.

• 58:37Griffin Newman?

  Uh huh.

• 58:38David Sims?

  Um, and.

• 58:39Griffin Newman?

  There's a version of that scene in the original.

• 58:42David Sims?

  Yes, they, they, uh.

• 58:44Griffin Newman?

  They imp it off.

• 58:44David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 58:45Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 58:46David Sims?

  And I highly recommend all of Portis's books because it's, they're all, there's only like five of them. They all rock.

• 58:52Speaker 02

  They're all westerns?

• 58:54David Sims?

  No, most of them are. His first book, Norwood, you would absolutely love, uh, which is like a weird road trip movie about, uh, like a guy who got discharged from the Marines and just like meets a bunch of weirdos.

• 59:04Speaker 02

  Love that. I just watched, uh. Uh, what's the Nicholson movie where he's taking young Quaid to jail?

• 59:11David Sims?

  Uh, fucking Last Detail.

• 59:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, which is kind of similar to what?

• 59:14David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 59:15Speaker 02

  Kind of the vibe you're talking about there.

• 59:16David Sims?

  But like, it's just like every piece of dialogue in his books is so cool. And that's what this movie is like. Anytime anyone talks, you're just like, put that on a postcard and hang it on the wall.

• 59:26Griffin Newman?

  I, I will admit, when I saw this movie the first time, I was a little disappointed by it. And I think it was like, Coens runs such a heater run in my mind.

• 59:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 59:36Griffin Newman?

  I was really in, I forgot, of course, a, a serious man happens in between. Oh, right. So that's, that's their other cash in of like, what's the least commercial movie we can come up with?

• 59:46Speaker 02

  I watched those two, those two back to back.

• 59:49Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 59:49Speaker 02

  Later. And I was like, these, these guys are so good.

• 59:51Griffin Newman?

  The era where you stepped away because you were like, are they doing silly shit now?

• 59:54Speaker 02

  Exactly, exactly.

• 59:55Griffin Newman?

  But I was, I was so into those three that I felt a little disappointed by this because it felt so much more straightforward to me. Where I was waiting for the weird Coens twist on it. So a second time in theaters immediately was like, what the fuck is wrong with me? It is a movie that like, if I can't sleep, I will just like, open iTunes and just scrub to any random part. And be like, let me just watch 15 minutes until I pass out.

• 1:00:17David Sims?

  It has also the most beautiful music.

• 1:00:20Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 1:00:21David Sims?

  Like the score is so perfect. It's so good looking.

• 1:00:23Griffin Newman?

  Deacon's on fire. It looks incredible.

• 1:00:26Speaker 02

  So good.

• 1:00:26Griffin Newman?

  And the dialogue is just like, music.

• 1:00:29David Sims?

  Yeah, no, it is.

• 1:00:34Griffin Newman?

  David?

• 1:00:35David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:35Griffin Newman?

  This episode is brought to you by XYZ Films and the acclaimed new documentary, Capturing Bigfoot.

• 1:00:41David Sims?

  Hmm.

• 1:00:41Griffin Newman?

  On October 20th, 1967, Roger Patterson captured 59 seconds of film showing a creature walking through the Northern California woods. I wonder if you can log that on Letterboxd?

• 1:00:52David Sims?

  It is an iconic video.

• 1:00:54Griffin Newman?

  Footage that became the most analyzed and debated in history. 59 years later, a reel of 16 millimeter film discovered in a safe, changes everything. Capturing Bigfoot reveals the untold story behind the world's greatest mystery told for the first time by Patterson's own son and the people who were there. This is a story about family legacy, broken friendships, and how far people will go to protect a secret.

• 1:01:16David Sims?

  Of course, you got the classic, what they call Patterson Gimlin film everyone knows, a Bigfoot out in the woods, like the famous Bigfoot picture. This has other stuff shot by him that no one's ever seen. That's what makes this movie different.

• 1:01:28Griffin Newman?

  But we're also talking brand new 4K scans of the original film taken from the Patterson family archives that some historians have called the best rendering of the footage ever seen.

• 1:01:37David Sims?

  I feel like we've all seen that footage as like grainy.

• 1:01:40Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 1:01:40David Sims?

  You know, that you see, you know, whatever, you see it in a documentary for two seconds. But this is restoring it and making it look much more clear.

• 1:01:47Griffin Newman?

  There's also a companion podcast, the Capturing Bigfoot Podcast, which goes deeper into the legend and lore of Bigfoot and the Patterson Gimlin film, featuring weekly episodes with experts in cryptozoology, urban legends, and filmmaking.

• 1:02:01David Sims?

  I'm something of an expert in cryptozoology.

• 1:02:03Griffin Newman?

  Well, of course, yes, but that's more of a hobby.

• 1:02:06David Sims?

  Yeah, this podcast, Capturing Bigfoot Podcast, is hosted by the director of the film, Mark Evans, and it's available for free on YouTube and Spotify with exclusive episodes and content available on Patreon to members of the Capturing Bigfoot Society.

• 1:02:21Griffin Newman?

  Capturing Bigfoot is now available to rent or own on Amazon Prime Video. Learn more about Capturing Bigfoot at capturingbigfoot.com.

• 1:02:37Griffin Newman?

  David?

• 1:02:38David Sims?

  Yes?

• 1:02:38Griffin Newman?

  He lurks in shadow. He slips into dreams. He casts no reflection. Audible presents Bram Stoker's Dracula, a new full cast audio thriller starring Ella Purnell as Mina Harker, Jonathan Bailey as Dracula, and an A-list cast, including Maggie Gyllenhaal as Van Helsing, Amy Lou Wood as Lucy, David Johnson as Dr. Seward, and many more that is an all-star cast.

• 1:02:59David Sims?

  Yeah, this new full cast thriller locks Mina Harker in a battle of minds with the Count. When Mina's fiance, Jonathan Harker, Louis Partridge, vanishes in Transylvania, Mina pieces together letters, diary entries, and chilling testimony to hunt the predator stalking those she loves, only to discover Dracula's already hunting her.

• 1:03:19Griffin Newman?

  Joined by the enigmatic Van Helsing, Mina and a small fearless band race against time to stop this ancient terror. Using her intellect, her resolve, and a gift for drawing the unseen lines between clues, Mina may just hold the key to bring down the Count if he hasn't already found his way inside her mind.

• 1:03:35David Sims?

  Featuring a haunting original score by Elon Eschery and a spatial dolby Atmos sound design, Audible's Dracula invites you to welcome literature's most shadowy figure into your home. Feel the terror of being haunted and the thrill of the hunt. Don't miss this year's best new audio thriller, Bram Stoker's Dracula, Audible's new full cast original adaptation, written by Robin Ahern, now on Audible. Listen to The Darkness. Go to audible.com/listen to Dracula.

• 1:04:10David Sims?

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• 1:04:52David Sims?

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• 1:05:19Speaker 04

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• 1:05:38David Sims?

  Um, let me open the dossier just to tell you, like, the thing about a serious man, Griff, is they're like, we had that set up before we won the Oscar. The Coens are very upfront, like, no, this is us trying to leverage our Oscar.

• 1:05:51Griffin Newman?

  Even still, this movie only cost 40 million dollars.

• 1:05:54David Sims?

  And like, you know, they don't, they don't go over the top ever, really. But yeah. Scott Rudin wanted them to adapt.

• 1:06:01Griffin Newman?

  The Jewish Policemen Union.

• 1:06:03David Sims?

  He ever read that book?

• 1:06:04Speaker 02

  That's a good ass book.

• 1:06:05David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:05Speaker 02

  I love that book.

• 1:06:06David Sims?

  And like, it feels obvious, like, Rudin reading that, being like, well, yeah, the Coens gotta make this. Like, what a weird concept. Like, they'll be, and like, I think they worked on it, but may have kind of been like, this is actually too obvious for us. Like, there's a reason it never happened.

• 1:06:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:21David Sims?

  No, no, what do you want to say, Stavri?

• 1:06:22Speaker 02

  No, no, I think that's, I think, I was just gonna say, that's, they are right about that. It is a little too, oh, that's like what an idiot is like, the Coens gotta do that. It's like alternate history of like Jewish Alaska. It's like that. I want to see that.

• 1:06:34David Sims?

  It's a super cool idea.

• 1:06:35Speaker 02

  And it is, it is cool. And by the way, you make that, I'm watching it. But, but the thing is, I think there is a ceiling to that, because they can't, I don't know, can you squeeze any, can you, what can you do to make that next level awesome? I don't know. The way they took this, and it, this feels, now, I haven't read the book, but it feels elevated, particularly after watching the original.

• 1:06:55Griffin Newman?

  Yes. But also, Rudin pulls them out of their flop era, right? Like, Rudin enters the picture.

• 1:07:01David Sims?

  He's the one who's like, do no country, come on.

• 1:07:03Griffin Newman?

  And Lady Killers, they do no country. He's sort of like got them at this point. I imagine at the point he first throws it to them, they're still feeling like, we kind of gotta win our way back in the public consciousness. By this point, they have nothing to prove. They don't need to make a movie that someone else wants them to make.

• 1:07:19David Sims?

  And they, in classic Coens fashion, apparently both of them read this book to their children.

• 1:07:26David Sims?

  And that's where they're kind of like, we should make this a movie and we should center it on the girl, which the, the Wayne movie doesn't do. Wayne movie Wayne is the main character.

• 1:07:36Griffin Newman?

  Right. But also, why would you rewrite any of this dialogue is their other big thing of like the, the Wayne movie lost so much of that. They do talk so much about reading books together in a way I always find funny. And I'm sure in reality is what's, it's what you're describing of. They both go like, hey, want to read this next? And it's like a brother's book club. But yeah, always in the way they talk about it, even like same with No Country where they were like, we were both reading the book and we thought this would make a good movie. I imagine them like Bert and Ernie in parallel beds with matching pajamas.

• 1:08:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, they got the fucking cap, the dangly cap.

• 1:08:09Griffin Newman?

  One big book dangling between their two beds.

• 1:08:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:12Griffin Newman?

  Alternating pages.

• 1:08:13Speaker 02

  With their finger.

• 1:08:14Griffin Newman?

  Exactly.

• 1:08:15David Sims?

  This movie, they're like, it needs to be PG 13. Now, this movie does have someone's like fingers getting cut off and someone getting shot in the face.

• 1:08:22Griffin Newman?

  Kind of gnarly shit.

• 1:08:22David Sims?

  But they're kind of, I feel like.

• 1:08:23Speaker 02

  Until you said that, I didn't even, I didn't even think about it.

• 1:08:25David Sims?

  I know.

• 1:08:26Speaker 02

  I thought, I just assumed it's R.

• 1:08:27Griffin Newman?

  It's one of their only PG 13 movies?

• 1:08:29David Sims?

  Their other ones are, Oh Brother is PG 13 and weirdly Hail Caesar, although that's not a family movie really, but it's just not that lurid a movie.

• 1:08:37Griffin Newman?

  Yes. Lady Killers is R and Talbot Cruelty is PG 13.

• 1:08:40David Sims?

  And Talbot Cruelty is PG 13.

• 1:08:42Griffin Newman?

  And Hudsucker Proxy is PG.

• 1:08:44David Sims?

  Cause that movie is, yeah.

• 1:08:45Griffin Newman?

  For, you know, for kids.

• 1:08:46David Sims?

  For kids. Yeah.

• 1:08:46Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:48David Sims?

  But yeah, largely, obviously they don't care about that. But this one, they're consciously like, no, no, no, we want this to be a movie teenagers can see.

• 1:08:55Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. Cause it's about a teenager.

• 1:08:56David Sims?

  Yes. A hundred percent. Like that is like, I know this sounds so silly, but like that is, that, you know, they basically are like, Maddie is a pill, but like we're drawn to her. She's so admirable. We love that, like Presbyterian Protestant ethic. And they are very clear. Like we saw that John Wayne movie when we were kids. We did not revisit it and we told everyone not to watch it. Like costume designers, productions.

• 1:09:21Griffin Newman?

  We're doing the book.

• 1:09:22David Sims?

  Do not watch that movie.

• 1:09:23Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:24David Sims?

  They're pretty obviously disdainful of it, though. Like, they're not just like, oh, it's a legendary movie, but who cares? They're like, no, no, no, no, like, we don't like that movie.

• 1:09:32Speaker 02

  I mean, it sucks.

• 1:09:33David Sims?

  It's not good.

• 1:09:34Griffin Newman?

  It's surprisingly bad.

• 1:09:36Speaker 02

  Fucking sucks.

• 1:09:37Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:37Speaker 02

  And now it's like, but they also, it sucks in ways they're like, like the way like old Kung Fu movies, night would clearly be day and they just turn the fucking exposure down. They do that in this fucking movie.

• 1:09:48Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:49Speaker 02

  It's a fucking John Wayne movie in the sixties. You can't shoot at fucking night? I have to look at this blue ass bullshit? Like, it's crazy how much it sucks, dude. It's like, I know that's, this looks exactly like fun Kung Fu movies that are pretending it's nighttime. It's like, it was, yeah.

• 1:10:05David Sims?

  We need some scope here. We need like, this to feel epic.

• 1:10:08Speaker 02

  I mean, it's a mistake to watch, you watch one after the other. It's like, this is crazy. How much better it is.

• 1:10:14David Sims?

  True grit is a movie to watch TV on TV, the original, on TV some afternoon. And you're like, okay, no, it's bad.

• 1:10:20Speaker 02

  If you wanna, if you wanna bond with your racist grandfather, you throw that on, you know what I mean?

• 1:10:25David Sims?

  But then just watch The Shootist or The Quiet Man or some other John Wayne movie.

• 1:10:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, I agree.

• 1:10:31David Sims?

  But anyway, so yeah, Hailee Steinfeld, not a seasoned pro, but she is a kid from LA. Like, after they've been like searching across all of the Southern United States for their Maddie, they saw a tape of her four weeks outside of production. They cast her three weeks before they, Steinfeld's like a red on a Saturday, got a cool on, call on a Tuesday and like a week later, I was basically going to set. And, you know, it's one of those things where I didn't, obviously, she was unknown to me, right? And then like after this, I kinda.

• 1:11:02Griffin Newman?

  I wanna, I wanna talk about Hailee Steinfeld.

• 1:11:03David Sims?

  Okay, we'll talk about her later, I guess. Yeah, okay.

• 1:11:05Griffin Newman?

  We can talk about it now. I just wanna talk about it.

• 1:11:06David Sims?

  Well, just after this, I was like, oh, is it gonna be like Keisha Castle Hughes from Whale Rider where it's like, oh, they, what a lightning in a bottle thing? And like, that's not an actor who's gonna have a long career.

• 1:11:15Griffin Newman?

  Felt for a number of years like she was fucking it up, right? In a way where like, if someone's this good in something that's this big, when they're that young, out of nowhere, you're like, well, how do you ever? Get past this, right? And she starts like a pop career and it's like All of that. Kind of bad. You're kind of like, I mean, good for you, but like this sucks. It just felt like, right, this hits so hard. She gets an Oscar nomination and then it was like, actually what I want to do is music and also Pitch Perfect sequels. And she did like the bad Romeo and Juliet that no one saw. And it felt like everything between True Grit and Edge of Seventeen kind of was a whiff, right? You seen that movie? It was Little Seen. It's great. It's so fucking good. It's like her one good teen movie and it's basically like her doing like.

• 1:11:59Griffin Newman?

  It's about a girl who's just seventeen and is like having a nervous. The opening of the movie is. But not in like a crazy way. It's just like. Woody Harrelson is her like cynical, like disaffected teacher, kind of her Rooster Cogburn. And she walks in during his lunch break and is like, I want to kill myself. I'm on suicide watch. And he's like, let me finish my sandwich. Yeah. And then the movie is like her recounting how bad her life is. But it's just like. In a very like teen girl. It's normal. It's like her dad died and her best friend's sleeping with her brother. I mean, I guess it's not normal, but it's like, you know, it's like teen shit. Sure, sure, sure. It's such a good movie. But it's like her doing like the female version of like. Right. Eighties, John Cusack. And then she did Bumblebee, which she's like good in. And it's good. It's like low key good.

• 1:12:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, that's the thing. So I saw this, like I said, later and I was like, what the fuck is like, I gotta see with this girl. And then I probably looked, I wasn't interested in Pitch Perfect. You know what I mean?

• 1:12:48Griffin Newman?

  No, you didn't want to.

• 1:12:49Speaker 02

  Not, not my thing, whatever, which no disrespect. And, and then, and then everything I saw was like Bumblebee and then she was fucking Hawkeye or whatever the fuck.

• 1:12:58Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 1:12:58Speaker 02

  And I'm like, what? Like, I remember getting pissed because I was like.

• 1:13:01Griffin Newman?

  What happened?

• 1:13:02Speaker 02

  This person fucking rules. And then I guess the Dickinson show, but I don't, weirdly, I just never had Apple TV.

• 1:13:08Griffin Newman?

  This is the thing, right? She did two seasons of an Apple TV show that kind of doesn't exist, right? Three seasons. Three seasons. It exists. I, I, I'm going to stick up for Dickinson. I like that show. I, I think it is kind of forgotten right now. Well, all those fucking streaming shows.

• 1:13:20Speaker 02

  But it was like.

• 1:13:21Griffin Newman?

  But it was a thing.

• 1:13:21Speaker 02

  You can't get one other, like every kind of, and, and I guess like, I guess Bumblebee and Hawkeye, whatever is enough to kind of keep.

• 1:13:29Griffin Newman?

  She's around.

• 1:13:30Speaker 02

  Stoking the flames.

• 1:13:31Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:31Speaker 02

  But I, I was so fucking pissed. I was like, she is, is someone who has that in them. And it's like, yes, either it's lightning in a bottle because it could have been so special. Cause there is something about like that kind of childlike confidence that you don't know any better.

• 1:13:46David Sims?

  Yes, like the camera's barely been on you before. So you're just.

• 1:13:49Speaker 02

  Exactly. Like I remember my, like I, when I was a fat little child in theater, I was like, bro, before I was like in middle school, I was like, I'm actually a jock. Which is hysterical. Like I quit, I quit and like, look how my life has turned out. I'm clearly a performer, but you know, I'm like five, five, fat as shit. I'm like, I'm going to be in the NBA. I'm going to quit being in plays. So I'm, if you had put me in a fucking, I think I thought I was like the fucking most talented.

• 1:14:14David Sims?

  Sure. You had.

• 1:14:15Speaker 02

  Nine year old in the world.

• 1:14:17David Sims?

  The prepubescent, like the world hasn't knocked you down yet. You know, like, I mean, obviously she's like fourteen, but you know what I mean? Like, yeah.

• 1:14:23Speaker 02

  There's some, there's some like, oh, okay. This unfortunately could have just been so, you know, the perfect storm of one of the best performances ever. But you hope that's not going to happen. And then obviously I think Sinner's was like, it's so great when somebody that fucking good, well, you know, a director that good just is like, this is an underutilized talent. I'm going to just fucking line something up for her. That's because it, that allowed her to be, to do everything, right?

• 1:14:49David Sims?

  That was the thing.

• 1:14:50Speaker 02

  Incredible acting, hot as shit, scary as fuck.

• 1:14:53David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:54Speaker 02

  And then even like a little action. It was like such a perfect movie star, put this girl on performance. So I'm, I'm pumped to see what happens.

• 1:15:01Griffin Newman?

  It's kind of like a start of a second era. It feels like, I mean, I had always just had this feeling of like, has she kind of dropped the ball? Because.

• 1:15:08David Sims?

  Or does she maybe not give a shit? Like, you know.

• 1:15:10Griffin Newman?

  Sometimes these people also are really good and have really bad taste. Like you meet them and they're idiots and you're like, oh, you don't know what a good movie is. That's why you keep picking bad ones.

• 1:15:19Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 1:15:19Griffin Newman?

  But this performance is so skillful that you're like, it's not just that she's charismatic. It is so complicated what she's doing here. In such a high level movie that it's like, it can't be an accident.

• 1:15:31Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 1:15:32Griffin Newman?

  And then I'm just, right. There's so many of these I like forgot about after True Grit, but it's like, right. Begin Again, the John Carney movie where she's like Ruffalo's precocious daughter. Right? Romeo and Juliet, Hateful Love Ship, Ender's Game, Three Days to Kill.

• 1:15:46Speaker 02

  Bad in any of these.

• 1:15:47Griffin Newman?

  Costa's precocious daughter, right? Then there's barely lethal. And there was also the one term life that she did with Vince.

• 1:15:54David Sims?

  I actually wrote and directed barely lethal.

• 1:15:56Griffin Newman?

  There's like five or six years where you're like, this all is doing nothing for her.

• 1:15:59David Sims?

  The other thing with her not to sound insane is that she was in the Taylor Swift verse. Like she was one of her friends.

• 1:16:04Speaker 02

  Oh, really?

• 1:16:04David Sims?

  And that's when everyone was obsessed with like Taylor Swift's whole like cadre.

• 1:16:07Griffin Newman?

  But the pop star thing, you're like, why are you trying to do this?

• 1:16:10David Sims?

  She also dated one of the One Direction guys. Like she had a whole like.

• 1:16:14Speaker 02

  So she was a celebrity. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:16:15David Sims?

  Yeah, she was never gone from the public eye.

• 1:16:17Griffin Newman?

  It felt like she was chasing something.

• 1:16:18David Sims?

  She's the voice of Gwen Stacy.

• 1:16:21Griffin Newman?

  Oh, yeah. That's sort of when it starts coming back.

• 1:16:23Speaker 02

  I agree.

• 1:16:24Griffin Newman?

  Right. Cause it's like Edge of Seventeen was sort of like, here we go. And then she's good in Bumblebee, but Bumblebee ends up sort of being a franchise dead end. She's great in the Spider verse movies.

• 1:16:33David Sims?

  The thing with Dickinson was that it was like, hey, Apple has a show. It's a fucking Emily Dickinson, but it's like Gen Z. And you're like, that sounds like I want to like drink glass. Like I, I can't, I like, no, no, you don't get it. John Mulaney plays Ralph Waldo Emerson. And I'm like, no, no.

• 1:16:48Speaker 02

  Oh, I'm Mulaney, dude. All right, man.

• 1:16:49David Sims?

  But you're just like, what are we doing? Oh, no, he's sorry, please. He plays Thoreau. I take it back.

• 1:16:53Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:16:53David Sims?

  Yeah. Wiz Khalifa plays Death. And you're like, this sounds like someone spinning some like torture wheel.

• 1:16:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:59David Sims?

  And then you watch the show and you're like, unbelievably, this is tolerable. Like this is not that bad. And it's largely hers. She's so goddamn charismatic.

• 1:17:07Griffin Newman?

  I think she kind of doesn't miss in terms of her actual ability.

• 1:17:10David Sims?

  Not really. She's always good in the thing.

• 1:17:13Griffin Newman?

  Yes. And it, it feels like she's now very selective. But there was that thing in Sinners where you're sort of like, you've kind of now set the table perfectly for the next 10 years of your career. Cause you've reintroduced yourself as an adult. That is like the first time she has played as a grown up in a movie. And as you said, showed a little bit of everything and she feels very exciting again now.

• 1:17:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, especially in like a time where it's like, how the fuck do you even? There are no movie stars. She's kind of positioned to be like. I mean, who in her age group, what, you know, what woman is like, who are the real deal bona fide young, you know, female movie stars? Like, there's a little bit more dudes that come to mind, but even,

• 1:17:53Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, I mean, like, in, in the twenties class, it is like, it's Florence Pugh.

• 1:17:58Speaker 02

  Sure, of course, of course.

• 1:17:59Griffin Newman?

  Uh, it's Saoirse Ronan, who kind of, I guess, Saoirse Ronan sort of had the run that I think people thought Hailee Steinfeld was gonna have the American version of, of like, you're a child prodigy, you got an Oscar nomination, and you were just gonna continue being a serious actor first and foremost. Like, even if you're gonna do things that are fun and commercial, they are like prestigious movies. And Seinfeld did feel was doing the kind of like, I need a blockbuster, I guess I should do a Marvel. You know, she's fucking great on Hawkeye, but it's one of those like,

• 1:18:30Speaker 02

  It's fucking Hawkeye.

• 1:18:31Griffin Newman?

  That's the thing. By the time it comes out, you're like, why is Hailee Steinfeld doing six episodes of a Disney Plus show for the least important Avengers?

• 1:18:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, come on.

• 1:18:40Griffin Newman?

  On fire in it. I remember watching and being like, right, Hailee Steinfeld. She's good in it, but I watched that show. Florence Pugh, and you're like, this is like fucking Pacino and De Niro going at it. And you're like, why is this being wasted on Hawkeye?

• 1:18:53Speaker 02

  Put her on fucking Wandavision, the one everybody was like excited to see. By the time Hawkeye comes around, everyone's like, oh, wait, this fucking sucks.

• 1:18:59Griffin Newman?

  And now she'll like show up and end credits and be like, I don't know, maybe I'll come back. Like, they've just kept her on the burger now? You look like you were about to say something, Ben. Or were you just leaning in? I was just leaning. I mean, I don't know.

• 1:19:10David Sims?

  Come on, Ben, lean in.

• 1:19:12Griffin Newman?

  Zendaya, Zendaya's in the same group.

• 1:19:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:19:14Griffin Newman?

  I'm trying to think of the under thirty, over twenty.

• 1:19:16David Sims?

  Zendaya is the example of someone where it's like,

• 1:19:19Speaker 02

  Sydney Sweeney, I guess?

• 1:19:20David Sims?

  Yeah, Sydney Sweeney, what's up with her these days? Yeah. But like, Zendaya is someone where she's like, she's got really good taste, she's seeking out big directors she wants to work with, right? She's doing the kind of the movie star plan. Sydney Sweeney's a little bit more like, she's got some taste, she's not a bad actor, but she'll also be like, should I smell my bath water? You know, like, where you're like, okay, so you're sort of in the influencer space.

• 1:19:42Griffin Newman?

  She's like an operator where she's like, look, I wanna make good stuff.

• 1:19:45David Sims?

  She's like, exactly, like, you know, these twenties ain't gonna last forever.

• 1:19:49Griffin Newman?

  Things to try to get my good thing made, and she's like, open about that.

• 1:19:53David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:54Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:54David Sims?

  Uh, anyway, look, Jeff Bridges, just to just circle around to the rest of the cast, obviously the Coens know, know him well.

• 1:20:00Griffin Newman?

  But only the second time they work together.

• 1:20:03David Sims?

  And they're like, we wanna make a Western. He's like, I'll do a fucking Western. And they're like, it's gonna be true grit. And he's like, He initially, he is kind of like, what the fuck?

• 1:20:11Speaker 02

  Why would I?

• 1:20:13David Sims?

  That's John Wayne, man. And then he's like, I read the book and I read the script and I was just kind of like, I get it. Like they're just doing something different. I didn't think about John Wayne anymore. I don't really care. I mean, this is an Ethan Coen quote here, like a lot of people might take umbrage, but I'm not sure that's an iconic performance from John Wayne. To think of an iconic because of the Oscar is a mistake. Like they're upfront being like, fuck that movie.

• 1:20:36Speaker 02

  Right, yeah, yeah.

• 1:20:37Griffin Newman?

  It's also funny that-

• 1:20:38David Sims?

  And they're like, and John Wayne's good in other movies. Like, we're not saying John Wayne sucks.

• 1:20:42Speaker 02

  We're not John Wayne haters, this movie just sucked.

• 1:20:43Griffin Newman?

  But it's also funny that they only do two movies together, The Coens and Bridges, right?

• 1:20:47David Sims?

  He's a specific guy.

• 1:20:48Griffin Newman?

  Oh, absolutely. I'm not saying like, there are other roles that make sense that he could have slotted into.

• 1:20:53David Sims?

  Not totally.

• 1:20:53Griffin Newman?

  But he's such a good star for them in two very distinct performances that are so different from each other.

• 1:20:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:20:59Griffin Newman?

  But in certain ways have become at least like the two big pillars of adult Bridges.

• 1:21:06Speaker 02

  Definitely.

• 1:21:07Griffin Newman?

  Right? Like, I mean, there's like young hotshot Bridges, right? But to a certain degree, it's like Chilston or Dude and Billy Goat Gruff.

• 1:21:13David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:13Griffin Newman?

  Right? And they've like come up with the two defining performance for him in many ways, even though he wins his fucking True Grit Oscar for Crazy Heart. I, I think at the moment they announced he was doing this, Lebowski was such a big flop at the time, they kind of announced this at like peak Lebowski.

• 1:21:31David Sims?

  Everyone's like, right, iconic.

• 1:21:33Griffin Newman?

  By that time, the idea of he's working with them again was like lightning in a bottle exciting.

• 1:21:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's crazy because again, I didn't even know that it was a flop. You know what I mean? Like, for me, it was like the thing everybody talks about in college.

• 1:21:45David Sims?

  You go to college and everyone's like, this is one of the five movies.

• 1:21:47Speaker 02

  Right. Yeah, you have-

• 1:21:48David Sims?

  Boondock Saints.

• 1:21:49Speaker 02

  I know, of course, don't even get, when you guys do the Boondock Saints episode, I got dibs on that.

• 1:21:55David Sims?

  Please come back.

• 1:21:56Speaker 02

  I have watched Boondock Saints so recently, it's hysterical. I watched. If it's in the last 15 years, it's pretty funny. Boondock Saints like tw- back to back. I watched it once on the bus. You had it on the bus. And then we, we watched, me and my buddy watched it the day. We were like, oh, we're probably gonna end up watching some shitty movies like Boondock Saints. And then he started playing it and I'm like, haha, very funny. Watch the whole fucking thing. The second you put that shit on, dude, I remember being like 12 and being like, me and my little brothers having an earnest conversation where we're like, okay, it's Godfather two is still better, but Boondock Saints is like. Nipping on its heels. Because it is in the conversation.

• 1:22:32David Sims?

  It is actually a movie that is like the point of view of a 12 year old boy.

• 1:22:36Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:22:37David Sims?

  Where you're like, that's actually how you should approach life and crime and like, you know, clean up the streets and protect your bar or whatever the fuck they're doing in them.

• 1:22:45Speaker 02

  Portrayal of what gay people are like.

• 1:22:47David Sims?

  It's a woke movie. We're supposed to be gay.

• 1:22:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:22:51David Sims?

  Movie's got its head on its shoulders.

• 1:22:53Speaker 02

  God damn. Yeah. The Troy Duffy, uh, is that his name?

• 1:22:57David Sims?

  Yeah, that's his name. And he keeps being like, I got three ready to go.

• 1:23:00Griffin Newman?

  Did he make three? Am I wrong?

• 1:23:02David Sims?

  They keep saying they're gonna do it.

• 1:23:04Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no. I looked this up recently. It's been in development hell.

• 1:23:08David Sims?

  I mean, the whole thing is that Norman Reedus is like stringy haired ass is more famous than ever. Like they should cash in on it.

• 1:23:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:15Griffin Newman?

  But yeah, he's never directed a non Boondock movie, right?

• 1:23:19David Sims?

  No.

• 1:23:19Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:20David Sims?

  Uh, who's the other guy? It's Norman Reedus. Who's the other guy?

• 1:23:22Griffin Newman?

  Uh, Sean Patrick Flannery.

• 1:23:24David Sims?

  That guy must be like, come on. Like, cause like Norman Reedus is like, I'll go do another Death Stranding and Walking Dead.

• 1:23:29Griffin Newman?

  But then they'll also show up in other shit like The Bike Riders and basically just be the same thing.

• 1:23:33David Sims?

  He's in a ballerina.

• 1:23:35Griffin Newman?

  Right. He just shows up with the same look on a motorcycle.

• 1:23:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:23:39Griffin Newman?

  And does his thing and leaves.

• 1:23:40Speaker 02

  Respect, dude.

• 1:23:41Griffin Newman?

  Uh, no, I, I think them announcing Bridges felt like, oh, De Niro and Scorsese are doing The Irishman together, right? It was like, they're, they're coming back together.

• 1:23:53David Sims?

  But you know what? I want to watch that.

• 1:23:55Griffin Newman?

  And that's a perfect old man part for him.

• 1:23:57David Sims?

  Um, Damon, this is the first Damon Cowens?

• 1:24:01Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, and the only.

• 1:24:02David Sims?

  It's the only, it's just so funny that every time they get like an oceans guy, like Clooney, Damon Pitt, they're like, yeah, you're a buffoon.

• 1:24:09Griffin Newman?

  You played like a. I mean, they love making traditional.

• 1:24:12David Sims?

  And Damon's like, I get it. The way he puts it is he's like, I want a guy, this guy is like, presentation of Tommy Lee, hilarious that that's who he's thinking of. The like charm of Bill Clinton, no substance. Like that's how, that's my approach with this guy. Like he's slick, he's put together, he's a zero, like.

• 1:24:31Griffin Newman?

  He's so fucking goodness and I, we've litigated it before. I'm always like, it is astounding. He didn't get nominated because he's such a big star in such a like killer.

• 1:24:41David Sims?

  It's a stacked year.

• 1:24:42Griffin Newman?

  Supporting role in a huge hit movie, but it's yeah, incredibly stacked.

• 1:24:45Speaker 02

  So this is, they're catching Damon when chronologically.

• 1:24:48David Sims?

  That's a good call. When is it?

• 1:24:50Griffin Newman?

  He's finished the Bourne trilogy and in theory that's in the backseat. I mean, this is a period where he keeps saying, I want to direct. I think I want to transition more directing, which ends up being more of a move that Affleck does.

• 1:25:02David Sims?

  This is a weird timeframe because you're right. Like the last born is oh seven. In oh eight, he like pops into fucking the Jay movie for a second. All right, you know, in oh nine, he puts on.

• 1:25:12Griffin Newman?

  Youth without youth.

• 1:25:13David Sims?

  Yeah. In oh nine, he puts on a bunch of weight and he does the informant, which he's great in.

• 1:25:17Speaker 02

  Oh, the informant's good.

• 1:25:19David Sims?

  Yeah. And then he somehow loses all the weight, but plays a rugby player in Invictus, which is like a bad movie, but he's fine.

• 1:25:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:26Griffin Newman?

  Gets an Oscar nomination for that.

• 1:25:27Speaker 02

  But that also was kind of like the, Invictus was like, it feels like just such a prestige for prestige shakes.

• 1:25:34Griffin Newman?

  Yes, it's an empty movie.

• 1:25:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, I remember that. Yeah.

• 1:25:37David Sims?

  And in 2010, he has a really weird year. He does Green Zone, which is a giant bomb, which is sort of his like.

• 1:25:43Griffin Newman?

  Him with green grass again.

• 1:25:44David Sims?

  Without Born.

• 1:25:45Griffin Newman?

  Can we, then we do Bourne, but now it's really about the Iraq war.

• 1:25:48David Sims?

  Right. That's the tail end of them being like, you don't want like a really serious movie about Iraq is fucked up. And America's like, no.

• 1:25:54Speaker 02

  Everyone's so dumb with them.

• 1:25:55David Sims?

  Not interested. Is Iron Man there? No?

• 1:25:59Speaker 02

  Not interested.

• 1:26:02David Sims?

  Hereafter, the Clint Eastwood movie, which is, in my opinion, an incredible movie.

• 1:26:06Griffin Newman?

  But he's not really the lead in it.

• 1:26:08David Sims?

  Well, it's like a trip dick, right? Yeah, he's all right. You know, he's good in it. He's actually really good in it. It's an amazing movie, but it's people are just like, what the fuck is this? It's about like psychics and tsunamis. It's so weird. And then True Grit. The next year he does Adjustment Bureau, Contagion, We Bought a Zoo. He's definitely in it kind of like, what's my deal?

• 1:26:29Griffin Newman?

  Right. Margaret finally comes out in Happy Feet 2 as well.

• 1:26:33David Sims?

  And then he's like, he's like, all right, can I not be an action star? Can I make like, you know, proper dramas and stuff? And like, some of them are good. Some of them are we bought a zoo.

• 1:26:42Griffin Newman?

  I need to throw out the other two factors at play here in this era. Okay. One is that he says, I want to direct. Promised Land, which Gus Van Sant ends up directing, that he co-wrote with Krasinski and still stars in, was supposed to be the first movie he directed. And there were a couple of other scripts he bought that he had announced he was going to direct. And in this era, very overtly in the press, he keeps saying, I think I want to transition more directing. So when I do a movie now, it's really based on me wanting to learn from other directors. So there's a certain amount of checklist, like, am I thrilled about doing Invictus? I gotta work with Clint. Right? True Grit, I need to have a coins in my back pocket. I'm trying to study all these people now. So he's sort of going director first.

• 1:27:23Griffin Newman?

  And then there's a lot of him returning to his regular soda bird, green grass, repeating his guys. Right? The second thing is, in this exact era, these are the movies he did instead of Avatar, where he was the first choice for Avatar.

• 1:27:36David Sims?

  And Cameron's like, you get a ton of money. You get a piece of the movie. You do have to live in New Zealand for like three years.

• 1:27:42Griffin Newman?

  I can't give you the money because the tech is so expensive, but I can give you 10% of the film.

• 1:27:46Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, dude.

• 1:27:48Griffin Newman?

  And he's like, that's going to take me off the board for like three years.

• 1:27:52Speaker 02

  But it was for these fucking movies? Because he would, I mean, look, no disrespect to, you know, Jake Sully, but Damon's Jake Sully is better.

• 1:28:01Griffin Newman?

  It's this weird thing of Damon would have been great. And I almost wonder if the movie, I think.

• 1:28:07Speaker 02

  I don't know, he's good enough to, he's good at becoming a blank.

• 1:28:10David Sims?

  I'd love to see it.

• 1:28:10Speaker 02

  Dude, that's, one of his weird talents is like, he more than other stars, I think can kind of disappear a little bit.

• 1:28:17David Sims?

  I agree.

• 1:28:18Speaker 02

  Into a role.

• 1:28:18Griffin Newman?

  Oh, it's, it's a thing we love to talk about that like you could just program two different Damon series and one is Damon leading man using his movie stardom. And then Damon, supporting actor is as good a career as his leading man career. The top tiers of both are unbelievable and True Grit is such a good like snapshot of that.

• 1:28:38Speaker 02

  I mean, this, that's the only, for me, the only absolute banger in this, the only banger in this era.

• 1:28:43Griffin Newman?

  I'd agree with that, but.

• 1:28:44Speaker 02

  What's his next act? Okay, I know, but what's his next like?

• 1:28:46Griffin Newman?

  Well, Danny kinda has, right, so then it's behind the candelabra, which he's incredible.

• 1:28:51Speaker 02

  Is a banger, watch that with, my mom came to visit New York and for some reason, we watched that with her.

• 1:28:57David Sims?

  Prodigal.

• 1:28:57Speaker 02

  We just do that while I'm hitting a fucking weed pen surreptitiously.

• 1:29:01David Sims?

  Hell yeah.

• 1:29:02Speaker 02

  Way too high and I'm like, oh, why am I watching this movie with my mother?

• 1:29:05David Sims?

  Matt Damon's like, I mean, like, Michael, it's like shave another 5% off.

• 1:29:11Griffin Newman?

  Sky.

• 1:29:11Speaker 02

  But I'm too high to change it anyway.

• 1:29:14Griffin Newman?

  Then he does Elysium, which on paper.

• 1:29:16David Sims?

  Elysium is him being smart and unfortunately the movie's dog shit.

• 1:29:20Griffin Newman?

  Similarly, Monument Men, same deal, right? Then Interstellar, which he's unbelievable, but it's a secret performance.

• 1:29:28David Sims?

  Right, that's him doing a little bit. That's him being a go throw up later.

• 1:29:31Speaker 02

  That is definitely a bit.

• 1:29:32David Sims?

  He's good at that shit.

• 1:29:33Griffin Newman?

  Then he does The Martian.

• 1:29:35David Sims?

  The Martian is.

• 1:29:35Speaker 02

  And it's like. The Martian is the first one.

• 1:29:37David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:38Griffin Newman?

  But that's, yeah, that's 2015 and then he does the two movies after The Martian that felt like his, I need to get a surefire hit.

• 1:29:45David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:46Griffin Newman?

  And both of them don't work.

• 1:29:47Speaker 02

  Where's Great Wall?

• 1:29:49Griffin Newman?

  And Great Wall are both 16.

• 1:29:50David Sims?

  But Jason Bourne made a ton of money.

• 1:29:53Griffin Newman?

  It did.

• 1:29:53David Sims?

  It's just no one remembers it. Great Wall did okay, that movie's ridiculous and I unfortunately hurt his feelings and I feel really bad about it.

• 1:30:01Speaker 02

  Oh no.

• 1:30:02David Sims?

  I wrote like a snarky article when everyone was making fun of him.

• 1:30:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:30:05David Sims?

  And then he in some interviews like. I fucking love The Atlantic and like Tom Cruise coats that I saw like even they were going after me and I'm like, sorry Damon.

• 1:30:14Speaker 02

  You're like, hey, it's me. It's not any of the intellectuals.

• 1:30:20David Sims?

  But like I, he cares about this shit. And he's smart and he reads.

• 1:30:25Speaker 02

  He made the movie because so you would make a billion dollars in China. What the fuck are we talking about?

• 1:30:29David Sims?

  And he was like, I wanted to work with Zhang Yimou. And I'm like, I get it. But you also wanted whatever.

• 1:30:34Griffin Newman?

  Martian was such a big hit, right? And gets him another Oscar nomination.

• 1:30:37Speaker 02

  And it's such like, what's good about him?

• 1:30:39Griffin Newman?

  Is a movie built on his raw star power, all of his strengths, right? The fact that Great Wall and Jason Bourne are the year after that tells me that like two years earlier, he was panicked.

• 1:30:53Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:30:53Griffin Newman?

  Of like, I have not had a movie star hit since Born ended and who knows what the Martian's gonna be? So here's like a Zhang Yimou, like China co-production at a time where China's taking over Hollywood. And let me go back to Born. And by the time the Martian comes out, it's like, oh, fuck, he's got like,

• 1:31:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:31:12Griffin Newman?

  two unnecessary movies coming up.

• 1:31:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:31:14Griffin Newman?

  Which as you said, Born like made a ton of money, but in a way that was like people showing up for jury duty.

• 1:31:18Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 1:31:19Griffin Newman?

  And then we're like, yeah, he shouldn't have gone back.

• 1:31:20David Sims?

  Someone gonna say, oh, my God, that's Jason Bourne. Someone said it. Great. Cool.

• 1:31:25David Sims?

  I mean, I love him. I feel like he's in a good spot now. Like Ford versus Ferrari spotted him into his new, like, kind of like, right, I'm just the best.

• 1:31:33Griffin Newman?

  Great in Oppenheimer.

• 1:31:34David Sims?

  Kind of dad.

• 1:31:35Speaker 02

  Great Oppenheimer.

• 1:31:36David Sims?

  He rocks in.

• 1:31:37Speaker 02

  And listen, I, am I mad?

• 1:31:38Griffin Newman?

  He rocks in. He rocks in.

• 1:31:40Speaker 02

  Am I mad that no Greek people have been cast in The Odyssey? Yes. And maybe if this had happened, like I'm pissed because I feel like maybe if this had happened, maybe even two years later.

• 1:31:50Griffin Newman?

  You would have been in there.

• 1:31:50Speaker 02

  I get to just be like in the background, you know, some guy that gets killed so fast.

• 1:31:55Griffin Newman?

  Can you be Dionysus? Can there be like a cut up to the heavens and you're looking down?

• 1:31:59Speaker 02

  Dionysus, dude.

• 1:32:00Griffin Newman?

  Being like, this shit's crazy.

• 1:32:01Speaker 02

  Well, first, here's where I'm positioned for.

• 1:32:03Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:03Speaker 02

  The scary movie version of The Odyssey.

• 1:32:06Griffin Newman?

  There we go.

• 1:32:06Speaker 02

  When they do the Nolan, when they get the, when we get the band back together and they do like a spoof of Nolan's movies, I get to be killed in the Odyssey part of it.

• 1:32:16Griffin Newman?

  Friedberg and Seltzer's. Nolan moving.

• 1:32:18Speaker 02

  Let's get the Seltzers back. Yeah, absolutely.

• 1:32:20David Sims?

  It is. Now that I'm looking at it, it is funny that it's like, can't just fucking get Benny Safdie and John McGuizamo and shit.

• 1:32:29Speaker 02

  And look, at the same time, it's mythology. It's cool that it's no one is from anywhere. Everyone is one of everything, but it's like, it should be like the Olympics where the home country gets one, even if they're bad at, you know what I mean?

• 1:32:40David Sims?

  Not to be rude about Greece, though, but isn't this what Greece pulls once in a while?

• 1:32:46Speaker 02

  It's our artistic Olympics. Where it's like the home country, even if like, you know, even if.

• 1:32:51David Sims?

  The Olympics, everyone was like, these Olympics aren't that well run. And they're like, give us a break.

• 1:32:57Speaker 02

  Country. It will cripple our country for a generation. We have empty stadiums instead of fucking schools, but whatever. But every time you you host the Olympics, you automatically qualify for every sport.

• 1:33:07David Sims?

  Yes.

• 1:33:08Speaker 02

  There should be at least one Greek person in the Odyssey. You can't do the Odyssey without one Greek guy. And it doesn't have to be me.

• 1:33:14David Sims?

  Who are the big Greek guys in, uh, movies right?

• 1:33:17Speaker 02

  We don't really, I mean, we don't, I mean, uh, is it me?

• 1:33:23Speaker 02

  Accident. Is it me? But I mean, like, give us, give us like, you know, Greek, get Nia Fardalos in there, man.

• 1:33:30David Sims?

  Have you a Nia?

• 1:33:31Speaker 02

  We've DM'd a couple times. I gotta get. She's the dream. Absolutely. She's the dream Stavros World guest.

• 1:33:38Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:38Speaker 02

  She's a fucking icon. I mean, still the most profitable independent romantic comedy of all time.

• 1:33:43David Sims?

  We, believe me, we talk about.

• 1:33:45Griffin Newman?

  Still the most profitable romantic comedy, period. For many years, it was the most profitable comedy and the only thing that overtook it was Hangover Two.

• 1:33:53Speaker 02

  Oh, which is bullshit.

• 1:33:54Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:54Speaker 02

  That's crazy.

• 1:33:55David Sims?

  I mean, yeah, I'm trying to think of like Greek celebs.

• 1:33:58Speaker 02

  I mean, it doesn't have to be celebs.

• 1:33:59Griffin Newman?

  I did a little Google.

• 1:34:01David Sims?

  Get an art actor and get one of your guys in there. My favorite thing about Dog Tooth was I saw that movie.

• 1:34:06Speaker 02

  Get the cast of Dog Tooth.

• 1:34:11David Sims?

  Nolan's like, we're taking a break.

• 1:34:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, let's see the dad's cock again. That's, that was more disturbing than the we, the like, the siblings having sex, like, the dad's dick just hanging out, soft, watching porn. To me, that pissed me off more.

• 1:34:26David Sims?

  Dog Tooth is one of those things where I saw it and I was like, oh, this is depraved, but this is really interesting.

• 1:34:31Speaker 02

  Incredible.

• 1:34:32David Sims?

  That's an interesting movie. And then like you realize, you start, you know, and Greeks, Greece submits it, you know, and it gets the Oscar nomination. And then like someone was like, they threw like a parade in Greece for Dog Tooth. Cause like it was their first Oscar nomination for foreign film in like decades. And I'm like, just thinking about like the national government being like, we love Dog Tooth. What a great movie. Normal. We love like, we're spreading grease around the world, baby. Dog Tooth. That's what we got going on. That's in our brains.

• 1:34:59Speaker 02

  I'm a little worried that I've been able to hide my success from my Greek family. But being in a Yorgos movie, it's like, it's over, bro.

• 1:35:06David Sims?

  He's like fucking the king over there. Yeah.

• 1:35:08Griffin Newman?

  I'm doing a little Greek actor search.

• 1:35:10Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 1:35:10Griffin Newman?

  Jennifer Aniston.

• 1:35:11Speaker 02

  Doesn't count.

• 1:35:12Griffin Newman?

  Elias Codius.

• 1:35:14Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:35:14Griffin Newman?

  Costas Mandalore, David's favorite actor from the Saw franchise.

• 1:35:18David Sims?

  That guy, oh God, that guy stinks up the Saw franchise so bad.

• 1:35:22Speaker 02

  I don't even know. Yeah, I don't know these guys.

• 1:35:24David Sims?

  In the later Saw's, you know, when Saw, you know, fucking.

• 1:35:26Speaker 02

  Not a later Saw guy, unfortunately.

• 1:35:29David Sims?

  You're doing all right. I mean, you're doing good.

• 1:35:31Speaker 02

  I'm not a later Saw guy.

• 1:35:33David Sims?

  The whole problem Saw has is in Saw one, he's like, I have cancer.

• 1:35:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:35:37David Sims?

  So by like Saw three, he's dead. By Saw four, they're like, uh, we'll do an autopsy, but like, he's dead.

• 1:35:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:35:42David Sims?

  So by Saw five, it's like his protege, who's Costas Mandalore, who stinks.

• 1:35:47Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:35:48David Sims?

  And it's like three more of him.

• 1:35:50Speaker 02

  I'm gonna look.

• 1:35:50David Sims?

  Everyone's just looking up Greek actors now.

• 1:35:51Griffin Newman?

  I know, but this is my point is that you, you, there's not much of a battle to get to the number one spot.

• 1:35:55Speaker 02

  No, I'm trying, bro. I'm trying. Again, I don't know how it happened, but I'm trying. I mean, we're, this, the movie's gonna come out and I'm so bad in it.

• 1:36:03Speaker 02

  I've never allowed to fucking act in anything ever. They just take me off tires. I'm so bad.

• 1:36:07David Sims?

  Yorgos calls us, calls you between this. And then he's like, I replaced you in the movie. It was a bummer.

• 1:36:14Speaker 02

  Sorry, man.

• 1:36:14Griffin Newman?

  It's so funny that we've just identified, right, that like Damon clicked into his perfect, like, sort of middle age stage as movie star, which is the sort of like Ford versus Ferrari, Stillwater, Air, like, he's fucking polo tucked into khaki pants, kind of like, this guy just is comfortable being just like dad bod, you know, stuff shirt, whatever. Oppenheimer, same thing. And then it's like, right, no, next year, he is playing the lead in Nolan's fucking Oppenheimer follow up. He's a dysius. He's soul as hell. He's gonna like have his most dominant like movie star badass film ever.

• 1:36:56Speaker 02

  I mean, I am really, I'm so curious and excited because this is such a, it's such an insane throwback. Like this is like, it's so star studded. It's a, it's a fucking epic. It's a, you know, it's like, I think it'll be awesome, but I'm also like. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how it will be so good. It feels like a really hard thing to fucking pull off, but I believe everyone in it, I believe in and Nolan is the man. But I am re- it's not like I, I don't think it will fail, but I'm like, how are they gonna pull this off?

• 1:37:25Griffin Newman?

  Expectations are gonna be so.

• 1:37:26Speaker 02

  Expectations are gonna be fucking sky high.

• 1:37:27David Sims?

  The expectations are sky high. I have no doubt that it will like deliver visually, right? That it's gonna be like he's shooting in these beautiful locations on IMAX. It looks crazy. The production value is off the, you know, all that. The story of the Odyssey is cool and it's like episodic, so we can have all these

• 1:37:44Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:37:45David Sims?

  Fucking Zendaya drops in and does some shit and half the way is there, whatever. That's a cool idea, but like, I just don't know how he's gonna do the language. You know, like, cause you can do the thing that Troy did where it's like, yeah, it's like English.

• 1:37:58Speaker 02

  Classic British accent.

• 1:37:59David Sims?

  Right. You know, like just do that. And it's like, that's fine. But the whole magic of the, of the Odyssey, the poem is like the language. And I'm like, is he gonna try to crack that? It's not really Nolan's.

• 1:38:10Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 1:38:11David Sims?

  You know, strong suit exactly is like not, not dialogue.

• 1:38:15Speaker 02

  It's all gonna be Bane voice. Everyone's gonna do garbled Bane voice.

• 1:38:18Griffin Newman?

  And, and Bane masks.

• 1:38:20David Sims?

  Cosmo Jarvis had to drop out.

• 1:38:22Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:22David Sims?

  So they replaced him with Logan Marshall Green. I'm like, you're just taking one Tom Hardy guy and turning him into another Tom Hardy guy.

• 1:38:28Griffin Newman?

  There are different parts of Tom Hardy.

• 1:38:30David Sims?

  I know Nolan and Tom need to patch it up. Whatever happened there, whatever. They gotta squash the beef. I need Hardy to make a good movie again.

• 1:38:37Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 1:38:38David Sims?

  And I need Nolan to like, you know, have in place a weirdo.

• 1:38:40Griffin Newman?

  It's just like so funny that because, because of this beat that we have built for ourselves.

• 1:38:43David Sims?

  Do you think Nolan watches like the Venom movies?

• 1:38:45Griffin Newman?

  Nolan watches everything.

• 1:38:46David Sims?

  He does.

• 1:38:47Griffin Newman?

  Of course he watches the Venom movies. Uh, because of this beat we built for ourselves, right? It's like when Oppenheimer just keeps going up and up and up. We're like, how the fuck does he follow this? We've covered him years back. We think about his career a lot. And you're like, he does kinda have this oscillation between like him doing like nerdy little boy sandbox G whiz shit. And his more prestige stuff and a little bit of like one for them, one for me. And then Oppenheimer is like a one for me. That is him going like highbrow that plays like a fucking. Blockbuster and you're like, so does he do like a tenant now? Or does he do something even headier than Oppenheimer? We couldn't even conceive of what kind of thing he would try to do next. And when the tweet dropped, that was like

• 1:39:32Speaker 02

  Crazy, out of nowhere, too.

• 1:39:33Griffin Newman?

  Christopher Nolan, the Odyssey shot entirely in IMAX. We were like, yeah, you're right. It had to be this or the Bible. They were the only two things he could have done.

• 1:39:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:39:41Griffin Newman?

  In this position, if you're Nolan coming off of Oppenheimer, you gotta do one of those.

• 1:39:44Speaker 02

  But that's the thing. It's like, this feels like, you say the Bible, this feels like the fucking 10 commandments with Heston. This feels like Ben Hur, like, he, this is like some, some shit that like, is audacious. In the way that movies haven't really been audacious. Like, in the 30s, it's like, how the fuck are you gonna pull off a stadium full of people? You know, and they just would do it, whatever. Now it's like, we have all the technology, we have all this shit, but it's like, this is such a fundamental core text of Western civilization. So star studded, the language is hard. And by the way, the fucking length. Nolan's movies, you could argue are too long to begin with.

• 1:40:19Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 1:40:19Speaker 02

  How fu- I can't, that's more so than the language.

• 1:40:22Griffin Newman?

  Deeply episodic stories.

• 1:40:23Speaker 02

  More so than the language, it's like, is this gonna be 10 hours long?

• 1:40:25Griffin Newman?

  I know.

• 1:40:25Speaker 02

  What the fuck? How do we do this?

• 1:40:27David Sims?

  No one's gonna be like, hey Nolan, can we trim it? Like, he'll just be like, and they're like, yeah, yeah, you're right, you're right. You know what? Everything you do works.

• 1:40:32Griffin Newman?

  But I think he was right, that like, the level of cachet he has right now, if he's not doing that, he's playing it safe.

• 1:40:40Speaker 02

  Sure, sure.

• 1:40:40Griffin Newman?

  He's gotta go that hard.

• 1:40:42Speaker 02

  Sure, sure.

• 1:40:43Griffin Newman?

  What were you about to say?

• 1:40:43Speaker 02

  I was gonna say, fuck it, they made Wicked two fucking movies. The Odyssey is gonna be one fucking movie? I, like, that, that's crazy to me. This shit, if anything needs to be a universe, every, every dog shit I, no, just not, I'm not saying Wicked is dog shit. I'm just saying, like, every idea becomes like a fucking, a, a universe. Like, this literally is the universe of mytho- like, this is like, if anything needs to be four fucking movies, it's The Odyssey. I mean, even the movie that just came out with, um, uh, fucking, uh, what's his face? Who's playing old Odysseus?

• 1:41:18Speaker 02

  Uh, fuck.

• 1:41:19Griffin Newman?

  Why am I blanking on this?

• 1:41:20Speaker 02

  You know.

• 1:41:20David Sims?

  Old Avicius.

• 1:41:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, they just did that, the return with fucking.

• 1:41:23Griffin Newman?

  Oh, Refine.

• 1:41:24David Sims?

  Twenty years later.

• 1:41:25Speaker 02

  That's a movie.

• 1:41:26David Sims?

  Ends with a tease.

• 1:41:27Speaker 02

  That's the movie that's like the fucking last four pages of The Odyssey as a movie.

• 1:41:33Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 1:41:33Speaker 02

  How the fuck is the whole Odyssey gonna be one?

• 1:41:36Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:36Speaker 02

  Movie. So anyway, that's what I'm worried about. But now, if you told me we get 12 hours of Nolan's Odyssey, I'm the happiest guy in the fucking world.

• 1:41:44Griffin Newman?

  I'll do any version of this.

• 1:41:45Speaker 02

  I'm there. But any, like, they should at least have the Kill Bill treatment of, yeah, this should be one movie, really, but we have to, for whatever reasons, break it up. But anyway, all that being said, I will be there fucking day one in IMAX. I can't wait to see it. But I'm, I just am, am interested to see how they're gonna pull it off.

• 1:42:00Griffin Newman?

  Well, True Grit's kind of another version of that, where it's like, this is them cashing in all their chips for something that sounds like, why would you do this? And then it's so much more successful than anything else they've done, that they come off of this, and it's like, great, we'll make your fucking failed angry musician movie.

• 1:42:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:42:15Griffin Newman?

  You guys are invincible now.

• 1:42:16David Sims?

  It does give them some rope to do some weirder shit for a while.

• 1:42:20Griffin Newman?

  Cause this is the one that should have been their cash, and instead it's like a double guarantee.

• 1:42:25Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 1:42:25David Sims?

  And like.

• 1:42:27Speaker 02

  It's crazy that it's their most successful.

• 1:42:29Griffin Newman?

  It's by such.

• 1:42:30David Sims?

  And it's also crazy that in 2010, America was like, yeah, yeah, this is like the kind of Christmas entertainment we're after. Like, we want this.

• 1:42:38Speaker 02

  Totally. I think what I'm realizing is for me, this is such a cultural blind spot, cause just in my life, I think I was like, so depressed and pretending I was gonna take college ser-, there's the year I quit stand-up and like, was working really hard in college, and I didn't, I didn't see anything. That's, that's maybe also why I didn't see this shit in theaters. I like, you, you guys named all these movies that came out in 2010. I'm like, I don't even fucking remember those fucking.

• 1:43:01David Sims?

  So you were true, what were you studying? What was your major?

• 1:43:03Speaker 02

  Dude, I was a, I was a, I was a, a public affair, I was in a public affair scholarship program, and I was like, you know, just taking it ser-, taking like. You know, welfare policy, seriously, I was interning at the Maryland House of Delegates. I was like, you know, trying to lose, I was trying to get my life in order, trying to lose weight. I was, you know, finally, I was like, I gotta take shit seriously. I gotta be a good student. I gotta get a girlfriend who's a nice person and.

• 1:43:31Griffin Newman?

  That's always a tough one, finding.

• 1:43:32Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:43:33Griffin Newman?

  Nice person.

• 1:43:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, and she was, she was very nice, but I feel bad because we started dating and then in the year that I was lying about who I was, like, the guy she dated doesn't exist. A guy who does his work.

• 1:43:43David Sims?

  She's eating like a package.

• 1:43:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:43:46David Sims?

  Like, hey, check out this package.

• 1:43:47Speaker 02

  Does all, does all his homework, does all, you know, does all, you know, wears, literally wears a tie, whatever. And then like a year and I'm like, oh, can I crash at your place to do open mics and that? And not see you, I'm gonna come home fucked up at 3am.

• 1:44:01Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 1:44:01Speaker 02

  And then she's like, alright, well you.

• 1:44:03Griffin Newman?

  And like angry about my failure to locate a tag.

• 1:44:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:44:08Griffin Newman?

  You wanna hear me rant about this at 3 o'clock in the morning?

• 1:44:10Speaker 02

  Can you and your friends from grad school come see me bomb? At an open mic 40 minutes away, like, goddamn, I feel so bad, but, so yes, I think I was just like at a cultural, because before this, I was so, I was so into trying to figure, learn about movies, trying to do standup, starting over 18 to 20, and then 21 was, I was like, I have to fucking become a real citizen, but, so yeah, I'm, I'm kinda relearning all this, this blind. And then when you start talking about the rest of it afterwards, I'm like, oh yeah, this is when I start coming alive.

• 1:44:37Griffin Newman?

  Then you reconnect.

• 1:44:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:44:41David Sims?

  Would this movie be as big a hit today, Griff?

• 1:44:44Griffin Newman?

  I don't know, it's another thing, and we should talk a little more about the.

• 1:44:46David Sims?

  Yeah, we can talk.

• 1:44:47Griffin Newman?

  Let me say, a lot more about the meat of the movie itself, but David, glance at the clock.

• 1:44:53David Sims?

  A little glance.

• 1:44:54Speaker 02

  I don't know. I think we should know about Watson more.

• 1:44:56David Sims?

  What's up with that guy?

• 1:44:58Griffin Newman?

  It does feel like.

• 1:44:59David Sims?

  Barry is the voice of Sherlock Holmes, I'm finding.

• 1:45:01Speaker 02

  Oh, nice, hell yeah.

• 1:45:02Griffin Newman?

  There will be these types of movies every couple of years, right? Where like, everyone points to it and goes, see, there's an underserved audience, you're not making movies for red state America, you're not making movies for older men, right? There's this audience that will come out if you give them what they want, but anytime anyone tries to replicate it, it doesn't work, right? So there are the things like Passion of the Christ, An American Sniper. And Sound of Freedom and True Grit that feel like weird one offs where for whatever moment, for whatever reason, an entire audience was just like, actually, we've been waiting for this. That's supercharged what was already there. People who have kind of stopped going to the theaters, show up in droves for this. It's not like there were the entire audience for this, but clearly

• 1:45:44Griffin Newman?

  part of this movie doing so well was like eight year old John Wayne fans being like,

• 1:45:49Speaker 02

  Really? You think so?

• 1:45:49Griffin Newman?

  I think it has to be.

• 1:45:51Speaker 02

  I don't know, man. I think of all the movies you just said, True Grit obviously clears those movies. There's so, it's so much better.

• 1:45:58Griffin Newman?

  So much better.

• 1:45:59Speaker 02

  And, but you're right. Maybe there was some element to that, but I just think maybe it was the kind of thing of like, all the Coen bro, like, maybe it is just, even though they had two movies between this and No Country For Old Men, like, I don't know. I just feel like, it was, it was that. It was Coen Brothers stuff.

• 1:46:17Griffin Newman?

  I think there was another thing.

• 1:46:18Speaker 02

  But maybe it's Western. Maybe it is Western, right?

• 1:46:20Griffin Newman?

  Western and them being like, we're doing a classical Western, right?

• 1:46:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:46:24Griffin Newman?

  Uh, and this movie is so much more classical than any other film they've made. The other thing is that like, the Christmas box office is insane. There is like this 10 day corridor when basically everyone's off from work and school.

• 1:46:36Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 1:46:37Griffin Newman?

  And families are together.

• 1:46:38Speaker 02

  And it's a PG 13 movie.

• 1:46:39Griffin Newman?

  It's a PG 13 movie and like December.

• 1:46:42David Sims?

  And we'll do the box office game. The competition was bad.

• 1:46:44Griffin Newman?

  Well, this is what I was gonna say. That corridor, if you can get a movie in there that sort of becomes the default, I guess we all go see this. Like every day between December 20th and January 5th kind of plays like a Friday. You just have like a run of Fridays and the two big movies that people thought were gonna be the big blockbusters that Christmas were Little Fockers, which kind of disappointed.

• 1:47:07Speaker 02

  I did see that in theaters. So maybe I was a, that's the era of my life I was in. I was like, I'm a regular guy. Me and my girlfriend are going to see Little Fockers.

• 1:47:15Griffin Newman?

  Then we're going to like Ruby Tuesday.

• 1:47:18Speaker 02

  Absolutely, dude. We're going to Ruby Tuesday.

• 1:47:21Griffin Newman?

  Meet the Fockers had come out in this exact slot six years earlier and was humongous. Did fine, but it was not a cultural game changer. Wildly outgrossed it. And there was that thing where like Fockers opened bigger the first weekend and then True Grits overtook it the second weekend and stuck. The other movie that everyone thought was gonna kind of run the table at the end of the year. Just giving away the box office. But I have to do it, was Tron Legacy. Yeah, this is the weirdest shit. Jeff Bridges wins his Oscar. He wins his Oscar March 2010, right? And then I remember December 2010, he hosts SNL and he's like, hey, man, I got Tron Legacy and True Grit. And it was like, oh, he's got a big legacy blockbuster and he's got his like Art House Cohen movie.

• 1:48:00Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 1:48:01Griffin Newman?

  And then like True Grit and Tron Legacy end up at the exact same number.

• 1:48:06Speaker 02

  Since so weird.

• 1:48:07Griffin Newman?

  And Tron Legacy is seen as a disappointment and True Grit is seen as a sensation. But in both cases, like Tron opens really big, Little Fockers opens big, and then both of them drop off and True Grit just stays.

• 1:48:19Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:48:19Griffin Newman?

  And just kind of holds for weeks.

• 1:48:21Speaker 02

  And that's the, it sucks that the, a good movie needs so many things working in its favor to just do well. But I think it might, maybe it's as simple as that. Maybe it's not the like, cause the, you know, the like, they have a cult following built in. Maybe it's as simple as the two things it's up against on Christmas kinda suck.

• 1:48:39Griffin Newman?

  And here's the movie.

• 1:48:40Speaker 02

  They, and actually they suck in a way that's important because they suck in a way that gets people thinking about going to the movies. And they're like, that kind of was bad. Maybe I should go see a good movie.

• 1:48:49Griffin Newman?

  Or I liked the old one. I heard this one isn't great. And then suddenly there's a movie that quietly plays well for grandpa and granddaughter and everyone in between.

• 1:48:59Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 1:49:00Griffin Newman?

  I, I do think in the name value of it, but yeah, I don't know. I just like, I, I'm always, uh, Kind of like heartened by how successful this movie is when I watch it and I'm like, it's so deliberately paced, it's so thoughtful, it's so verbal, you know, it is like a movie that like doesn't.

• 1:49:18David Sims?

  It's not action packed.

• 1:49:19Griffin Newman?

  It's not.

• 1:49:20David Sims?

  It has stuff, but it's mostly walking around.

• 1:49:23Griffin Newman?

  But you start the movie, I mean, it takes like 15 minutes maybe before Rooster enters.

• 1:49:27David Sims?

  Right. You got the slow ramp up of her explaining who she is, her being a little.

• 1:49:31Griffin Newman?

  Her adult narration, which is from the book that it's framed by the adult version at the beginning and the end.

• 1:49:37Speaker 02

  But you, but you know what's funny? When you say it's not action packed, you're never, obviously you're never bored, but it's like, the way you, when you said it's, it's ra, it's rated PG 13, that kind of shocked me. When you say it's not action packed, that kind of even shocks me a little bit because so much shit is happening and she is, again, this, this performance is so electric that it almost feels like action movie scene. Her bartering feels like a, it's a fight scene essentially, you know what I mean?

• 1:50:05David Sims?

  I completely agree with you.

• 1:50:06Griffin Newman?

  That's the magic though.

• 1:50:07David Sims?

  That's right. Her bartering early on though, you're just like, I'm all in on this girl.

• 1:50:10Griffin Newman?

  It's why this movie.

• 1:50:10David Sims?

  All my chips are on, I want her to defeat this guy.

• 1:50:13Griffin Newman?

  And it's the magic that every great Scorsese movie has where he's just like, for me, it's just identifying the tension in every single scene.

• 1:50:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:50:22Griffin Newman?

  So every scene when you're watching it feels like the best scene you've ever seen in a movie.

• 1:50:25Speaker 02

  There's some, there's stakes to every scene.

• 1:50:27Griffin Newman?

  Exactly. That are like internal and that like cumulatively build to a greater whole.

• 1:50:32Speaker 02

  I mean, LaBief showing up in her fucking bedroom is so weird and fucked up.

• 1:50:36David Sims?

  Yes.

• 1:50:36Speaker 02

  That, I mean.

• 1:50:37David Sims?

  And it's like, that's just what she has to deal with and she knows it.

• 1:50:39Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:50:40David Sims?

  Right.

• 1:50:40Speaker 02

  She's not shaken, like that's nuts.

• 1:50:42David Sims?

  She has to sleep with a grandma, number one.

• 1:50:45Speaker 02

  Which by the way, those are comedically hysterical.

• 1:50:47David Sims?

  Yes.

• 1:50:47Speaker 02

  The cuts back to fucking her sleeping with the grandmother after she tries to rent a room, she's like, oh, it's okay.

• 1:50:53David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:53Speaker 02

  You can sleep with granny, whatever the fuck. This is so, so funny.

• 1:50:56David Sims?

  Uh, and then right, has to deal with this stranger coming in a room harassing her. Being mean and sort of threatening to basically cut in on her shit too. Like she's like, she's on a mission and he's gonna mess it up. The beef keeps messing up their mission.

• 1:51:11Griffin Newman?

  Yes. And also I love

• 1:51:12David Sims?

  Doesn't mean you half the time.

• 1:51:13Griffin Newman?

  Three times?

• 1:51:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:51:15David Sims?

  Yes.

• 1:51:15Griffin Newman?

  He has three different returns.

• 1:51:17David Sims?

  Yeah, they added some, in the book, he doesn't depart from them as much. I think they just thought it was like, it gives the movie a bit of

• 1:51:23Speaker 02

  I think it works. Yeah, I think it definitely works. But even just weird shit app, the bear guy, you know, where there might've been a lull. You get that guy to just mesmerize you. And then again, that scene where they come on, they come upon the like guys where it's like, uh, what's his face Gleason?

• 1:51:39Griffin Newman?

  Would it surprise you to hear this is the only Coen Brothers movie I've ever auditioned for is the guy who gets shot in the leg.

• 1:51:44Speaker 02

  Wow. That's fucking hilarious.

• 1:51:49David Sims?

  You want to crush that scene? It is cool that it's Dominic Gleason, like that you're like, oh shit. And I, I always forget that it's him and I'm like, wait, because he, he looks like shit. So you're kind of like, is that him?

• 1:51:59Speaker 02

  The only, the only cool parts of the original were that that part is played by

• 1:52:03Griffin Newman?

  Dennis Hopper.

• 1:52:04Speaker 02

  Dennis Hopper.

• 1:52:05David Sims?

  Right.

• 1:52:05Speaker 02

  And that

• 1:52:06David Sims?

  Who was like a Hellraiser.

• 1:52:07Griffin Newman?

  Robert Duvall is Barry Pepper.

• 1:52:08Speaker 02

  Barry Pepper. So that's the, those are the only two cool parts.

• 1:52:11Griffin Newman?

  It's also, it's not just that it's cool.

• 1:52:13David Sims?

  And famously Duval was a huge pain in the ass on set.

• 1:52:15Griffin Newman?

  Cause you're watching this handoff. Exactly. It's like Hopper and Duval are like starting the new Hollywood movement and different acting styles. And they're in a far more modern film than everyone else.

• 1:52:27Speaker 02

  Yes, for sure.

• 1:52:28Griffin Newman?

  It's like, well, that looks like a bad gunshot you got there.

• 1:52:31Speaker 02

  Yeah. Hopper's the only, even Duval's performance, Hopper's the one where I'm like, this is, he's actually good in it. And he's the one that would fully, you could swap him and fucking Gleason and, and it kind of makes sense.

• 1:52:42Griffin Newman?

  But that's part of what's interesting is it, it almost is a structure like The Odyssey where there is a clear end goal in sight. But from the beginning, everyone's telling her, this just might not be possible. No one's been able to find this guy. This guy's unimportant. You should just drop it. Right? She's got three people, including herself on this case and like, they're not making progress. And a lot of the scenes in this movie are like dead ends. They keep moving like geographically forward, right? They're moving further and further towards, uh, uh, Comanche territory?

• 1:53:15David Sims?

  Uh, Choctaw.

• 1:53:16Griffin Newman?

  Choctaw. But yes, there's this feeling of like, this might be in vain. And also these weird like sort of side quests that don't necessarily get them any closer to where they want to go. And then they do just stumble onto the guy.

• 1:53:28David Sims?

  You are not the beef.

• 1:53:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:53:30David Sims?

  One of the best.

• 1:53:32Speaker 02

  You are not.

• 1:53:32David Sims?

  Two of the funniest lines to me and I was like cackling and my wife was like, are you all right? Like this one is you're not a brief and the other is I do not know this man. After she cuts down the guy, which is like such an anti climax. He's like, no, no, let's move on.

• 1:53:49Speaker 02

  Another great one. That's not an action scene, but you're fucking, you're like, she's gonna die. You're like, someone's gonna find, yeah, so much tension, a little, a little, there will be bloody. Where it's like, even where nothing's happening, you're fucking like, whoa, something fucked up is right around the bend.

• 1:54:03David Sims?

  It's like they're on Venus. Like they're just in this alien landscape. Like, what is this place? Like, you know, and like, when, the first time I watched, the first couple of times, you're kind of like, yeah, they have a goal. They're going towards whatever. After a while, you're like, they're just in the middle of nowhere. And there's just like, it's basically the map is basically like, there's a river.

• 1:54:22Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:54:22David Sims?

  Like go to that. Like, that's kind of it. And like, if they get lost or someone breaks their leg or whatever, you're kind of just screwed. Like all this shit just feels so dangerous the more you watch it. And like, you realize like when, so when Rooster says like, fuck it, what, what, what's the thing he says over and over again? I, I withdraw. It's not that, but what's his, he has like a catchphrase.

• 1:54:45Griffin Newman?

  This is the thing. It's hard to quote this movie because the language is so precise that you can't paraphrase it.

• 1:54:50David Sims?

  Yeah. You know, that's him being basically like, I had one play, which was I go to my guys. I sniff out if these guys have been around and then I get to drop on them in classic Rooster way. I shoot them from far away and then maybe I get closer and shoot the rest.

• 1:55:05Griffin Newman?

  And if they don't have info, then I don't know.

• 1:55:07David Sims?

  I got spooked. I mean, they got spooked by LaBeef. Now I'm out of ideas. Like that was my one idea. I'd like to now return to my rope bed and my like whiskey.

• 1:55:15Speaker 02

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 1:55:17David Sims?

  And, you know, in the movie, it's a little bit like, oh, this is the, you know, this is the dip before our triumph and third act. Fine. But as you watch it again and again, you're like, no, yeah, he's just like, this is the extent of being a good tracker.

• 1:55:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I had the same thought of like the, on the rewatch this time being like, oh yeah, you know, oh. Yeah, here we go. The darkness before the dawn bullshit. But then you're like, you know what? This is fully earned. This guy's a fucking drunk. And and we've all been there, right? Where it's I've been there where it's like, you know, you've been you've been trying to go against your nature. And that's a lot of this here, right? It's like he's like, he doesn't want to do from the beginning. He doesn't want to do this. She convinces him. Part of it is about money, of course, but it's like, he still is doing something he doesn't really want to do. And then and you you give into your vices and it's like, you know what? Fuck this. I am it. I really am a piece of shit.

• 1:56:13David Sims?

  Right.

• 1:56:13Speaker 02

  I I'm an idiot for thinking I could be better. I'm gonna this now he's not made me better. I'm now worse.

• 1:56:19David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:19Speaker 02

  I'm the kind of guy who quits on a fucking little girl. I don't give a fuck. I'm drunk. That feels very real to me.

• 1:56:26David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:26Speaker 02

  And then Labiche event essentially being too much of a fucking pussy to do it. Also feels real to me. Cause it's like, this is your time to shine, Labiche. This is it. And it's like, oh, no, he's a fucking coward. He's a piece of shit. And it was just like, yeah, they would just abandon. These are this is the way these two guys would abandon this girl.

• 1:56:45Griffin Newman?

  Damon and Bridges both identify what the real versions of these guys would be, not the movie archetype versions of them.

• 1:56:53Speaker 02

  Yes, yes.

• 1:56:54Griffin Newman?

  Which is what's really smart where you're like, these are guys who fashion themselves characters.

• 1:56:58David Sims?

  I bow out.

• 1:56:59Speaker 02

  Bow out.

• 1:57:00David Sims?

  Yeah. He's just like 50 times. I bow out. Yeah, like like it like it's him saying I declare bankruptcy. You know what I mean? Where he's like, I I'm done. You find your own way.

• 1:57:10Griffin Newman?

  But like Labiche is all like sort of conscious forced iconography, right? That he is playing the role and talking the talk of a Texas lawman. And then Cogburn's the opposite way where you're just like, him having an eye patch isn't cool.

• 1:57:26Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 1:57:26Griffin Newman?

  It's not Snake Plissken.

• 1:57:27Speaker 02

  No.

• 1:57:28Griffin Newman?

  It's like this guy's broken, right? Like this guy's half of his body doesn't work.

• 1:57:32Speaker 02

  Of course, of course.

• 1:57:33Griffin Newman?

  Like he's like a fucking beaten down car.

• 1:57:35David Sims?

  That's why I like that in the cornbread shooting scene. He does get a couple of shots off.

• 1:57:40Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:40David Sims?

  And he also falls on his face one time and like gets tangled up in this horse one time. You're like, yeah, this guy's like a, you know, D and D character where it's like, you know, a good dice roll.

• 1:57:50Griffin Newman?

  He's kind of a joke, but he's not like, he also is legit in other ways.

• 1:57:55David Sims?

  And one way he's legit is that he's happy to just shoot someone's face off. Like, and he's not gonna be like,

• 1:58:00Speaker 02

  No qualms whatsoever.

• 1:58:01David Sims?

  Worried about that. And you do hear that, yeah, he fought with Quantrell. During like Bleeding Kansas, this is all like background that you don't have to think about that hard. And he's so unintelligible that the first time I saw the movie, I didn't know what he was talking about for half the movie. Like all of his monologues about New Mexico. I'm like, I don't know what he's saying. It's just funny. But like, he fought with Quantrill, who's like, a terrorist, like, who's just going around bleeding Kansas, like, doing insane shit. And it was like, yeah, he was like a hardened, crazy person. And that part of history is, it's what Ride with the Devil is about. Remember, we covered it long ago?

• 1:58:34Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:58:35David Sims?

  And, uh, like, Damon LaBeef is like this, like, Rooster's basically, I just need to keep going further and further away from civilization to do my shit. LaBeef is like, I'm from Texas, like, we're proud, like, this is a nation, like, you know, I'm a Texas Ranger, I have a badge, I'm proud of my badge. Rooster's like, I like my badge because it means I can legally steal whiskey.

• 1:58:57Speaker 02

  Right, right, right. And I'm a criminal, I'm a criminal with a badge, is Rooster.

• 1:59:01David Sims?

  Yeah, he's like, I'm an officer of the court, some asshole gave me this badge, it means I can take your whiskey. Like, and that is the force of law.

• 1:59:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:59:09Griffin Newman?

  The other, I mean, the part of this film that gets me, uh, so much emotionally by the end is that, like, I think this is a very fascinating, precocious child movie, right? And that the magic trick of her performance is that it doesn't feel like a kid trying to play a grown up. And that every scene, the innate tension is her being able to convince someone that she knows what she's talking about. As you said, it's why it helps to not see the father, that you're getting the sense to some degree.

• 1:59:36David Sims?

  Tableau right at the start, the corpse, that's it.

• 1:59:39Griffin Newman?

  You see his corpse, right. But you, you assume that she must be modeling behavior off of her father, that she must have learned things off of him. And that people at first interact with her as if like, oh, this is cute, this is a little girl who's memorized phrases that she's heard cowmen say before. And she can like parrot them back well. But it's like in her actions and her consistency and in her quickness, she shows to people like, oh, I guess I actually do have to treat her like a grown up. Because she's proving that she actually does know what she's talking about and can walk the walk, right? And where this movie gets to ultimately is by her being treated like a grown up. When she was a child and being validated in that way, and then having this insane experience.

• 2:00:22Griffin Newman?

  She basically is frozen amber for the rest of her life. Like, the sadness of the end of this movie is that you're just sort of like, well, she's just, she never grows past this. It's almost like that thing of people who get famous too young, and then you're like frozen at 15, because that's when you became a superstar. It's like the mix of like the highs and the lows of what she experiences in this week of her life, of being treated as an adult and then getting exposed to all of this, is like, she's just stuck there forever. And so, everything that's kind of like funny and charming about this, like, hard talking coming out of a 12-year-old, when you see it Elizabeth Marvel as a woman in her 40s at the end, you're just sort of like, wow, this woman's intense.

• 2:01:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:01:04Griffin Newman?

  But she's talking the exact same way she has talked in the beginning.

• 2:01:07David Sims?

  Also, we gotta point out, at this time, women didn't really have freedom.

• 2:01:10Griffin Newman?

  Correct.

• 2:01:11Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 2:01:11David Sims?

  So this is maybe an impactful moment where she actually really got to a taste of it, and there is kind of no going back for her.

• 2:01:18Griffin Newman?

  But then in the future, right, she's, you know.

• 2:01:20David Sims?

  She's gonna get some fucking husband who like tells her to cook dinner?

• 2:01:24Griffin Newman?

  Absolutely not.

• 2:01:25David Sims?

  Man, how many beans are in this movie? We haven't even talked about the beans.

• 2:01:29Griffin Newman?

  Talk about the beans.

• 2:01:30David Sims?

  What's, what's the thing, the harmony thing that they have?

• 2:01:33Speaker 02

  They're making for eight or whatever.

• 2:01:35David Sims?

  Right, where he's like, I like a big breakfast, it's like this like tankard of fucking beans.

• 2:01:40Griffin Newman?

  You know what's one of my favorite pieces of business in this movie? That he has the pack of tobacco with the string on it, almost like it's a teabag. So he holds that in his teeth while he makes the like, the roll.

• 2:01:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:01:51David Sims?

  Another tiny detail I love, when the lady offers to give her a flower sack for five cents to, to carry the gun, like, that's what I think the Wild West is, or like the sort of semi-Wild West is like, everyone is basically always like horse trading, like, every item is usable. It is like a video game where it's like you pick a flower and you're like, I could probably do something with this. Exactly, like, this has gotta go in my satchel, like, uh, everything's got to be used because like, it's not, there's nothing, you know, you wanna like get something from the east, it's gonna take like two months.

• 2:02:26Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 2:02:27Speaker 03

  Even a rotting corpse.

• 2:02:28David Sims?

  Yeah, well, that, that guy's like, I got the teeth, which is kind of my thing, if you want the rest.

• 2:02:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:02:35David Sims?

  I'll trade him back.

• 2:02:36Speaker 02

  I'm not gonna fuck it. You guys wanna fuck it, give me a quarter.

• 2:02:41David Sims?

  If you want me to watch you fuck it, that's two quarters, that's two bits.

• 2:02:46David Sims?

  No, I just love that guy also.

• 2:02:48Speaker 02

  Incredible guy.

• 2:02:49David Sims?

  I mean, the best, like where they're like, it's cold and he's like, yeah, well, I have my bear thing.

• 2:02:55Speaker 02

  My bear.

• 2:02:55David Sims?

  It's like, yeah, that's unspoken. We didn't need to.

• 2:02:58Speaker 02

  We see the fur, man.

• 2:02:59David Sims?

  We get the purpose of the bear.

• 2:03:01Griffin Newman?

  I also like that he, I feel like they're so good at knowing when to do this. It's the Cohen tone management thing, but that's the one scene where they kind of crank up the broad comedy of like, what if this guy just like, sounds like a King of the Hill character?

• 2:03:15David Sims?

  Dude, can we get away with two minutes of a guy being like, I'm the bear man?

• 2:03:20Speaker 02

  But dude, it's your, but that's the Cohen, it is the Cohen magic because it's not only broad comedy, but it's also like mystical. It's the most it feels like Dungeons and Dragons.

• 2:03:28David Sims?

  A hundred percent.

• 2:03:29Speaker 02

  Where it's like, who the fuck? Cause at first you're like, are they, is this guy a fucking, is a bear gonna kill them?

• 2:03:34David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:03:34Speaker 02

  Then is some bear wizard gonna kill them? Then it's like, oh, it's the funniest guy you've ever seen. He's actually so nice and helpful.

• 2:03:41David Sims?

  Right. He's like, yeah, that house over there won't be used right now. He won't mind much if you, you know, toddle over the river.

• 2:03:47Griffin Newman?

  I also think it's the key to a great Cohen's performance is like them being like, you know, it'd be really funny if a guy sounded like this.

• 2:03:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:03:54Griffin Newman?

  Or if like a killer had a Dorothy Hamill haircut, right? And then they hire the person, they're like, your job is to play this as seriously as possible, but I'm giving you something stupid to do.

• 2:04:03Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:04:04Griffin Newman?

  Here's a voice, here's a costume, here's a look, here's a characteristic, but then like try to actually ground it as if it's a real guy.

• 2:04:10David Sims?

  I think about every guy in this movie, like the guy who runs the, the bridge, you know, the damn thing, like that's that guy's job, the lawyer, like.

• 2:04:18Speaker 02

  The facial hair in this movie, their only form, their lives are torture and their only forms of expression are weird facial hair. That's all they have is it's so many mustaches and sideburns and like shapes you wouldn't even consider. It's crazy.

• 2:04:33David Sims?

  That lawyer is so good. That's what I would be, right? Like if you like, you know, cause like I watched Deadwood, right? Which is like the best show ever. And Deadwood is like 80% of people are basically like, well, I'm into like whoring, drinking, gambling. And it's like, that's what I do out here. But Soul Star is the guy who's like, these people need fucking hammers. I'm gonna sell them hammers. Like there's a couple of guys who are like, I'm just gonna go all the way out there and have a shop.

• 2:04:54Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 2:04:55David Sims?

  And I would be the guy who's like, well, I talk 10% better than everyone else. So I guess I'll be a Trixie lawyer, you know, like that'll be my job. Cause that guy's rocking it.

• 2:05:03Speaker 02

  He is. He's great.

• 2:05:04David Sims?

  He's like, how many steps are we talking about? He's out foxing Rooster by the end.

• 2:05:08Griffin Newman?

  It's pretty unshowy in its craft outside of just like, obviously, you know. The production design, the costumes and everything just being fucking immaculate. Right. Um, but you're introduced to Rooster. You have her knocking on the outhouse first or is that after the courtroom? Uh, that's first.

• 2:05:25David Sims?

  Yeah, that's the thing. We have a minute of Rooster before all the other stuff happens.

• 2:05:29Griffin Newman?

  Right. Behind a closed door while he's taking a shit.

• 2:05:31Speaker 02

  Oath has another hilarious moment.

• 2:05:32Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, absolutely.

• 2:05:33David Sims?

  You think Rooster spends like 90 minutes in there, right? Like that. He doesn't like, just like take care of business quickly.

• 2:05:39Griffin Newman?

  No, I think he's like, I think he's playing emoji blitz on the toilet.

• 2:05:43David Sims?

  Century were like a really intense experience.

• 2:05:46Griffin Newman?

  What he's having pop executive privilege time.

• 2:05:48Speaker 02

  Think about the types of hemorrhoids Rooster has.

• 2:05:52David Sims?

  Like, he eats like one fruit a year.

• 2:05:54Speaker 02

  It's crazy how fucked up his, his ass like, we're talking about a baboon's ass. This is a man who's had nothing but whiskey and beans for 40 fucking years.

• 2:06:03David Sims?

  He eats whiskey and beans. Occasionally he'll get, I think what they call back then a steak, which was like some like crispy piece of beef, right? That they like destroyed in a cast iron pan. And like more whiskey, more beans. I think beans are why people were alive. Because beans actually, right, they do enough for us.

• 2:06:21Griffin Newman?

  I've heard that the more you eat, the more you.

• 2:06:23Speaker 02

  Corn bread.

• 2:06:24Griffin Newman?

  That's what I've heard.

• 2:06:24Speaker 02

  Cornbread.

• 2:06:25David Sims?

  Peppers, maybe?

• 2:06:26Griffin Newman?

  Just raw peppers.

• 2:06:27David Sims?

  I don't know what else, what was people?

• 2:06:29Speaker 02

  Not a lot of greens, no.

• 2:06:31Griffin Newman?

  Stavi, my, my dad, when we were growing up, would wake my brother and I up and then go, and now I'm having pop executive privilege time. You guys just got to be ready to go in an hour.

• 2:06:41Speaker 02

  Awesome.

• 2:06:41Griffin Newman?

  And he had boxers with a bunch of paper towels stuffed in the back.

• 2:06:45Speaker 02

  Hell, yeah.

• 2:06:46Griffin Newman?

  Four newspapers under his arm, two mugs of coffee, goes into the bathroom, closes the door. An hour later, he comes out, he goes, it's time for school.

• 2:06:54David Sims?

  Two mugs of coffee is a move. It's like, I'm not coming out to refill.

• 2:06:59Griffin Newman?

  Post news in times, right? He's carrying like 15 inches of newsprint under his arm and the two mugs. And just go, you guys just figure it out for the next hour. Like, that's how Rooster Cogburn takes a shit.

• 2:07:14David Sims?

  I'm a dad. I can go, you know, into the bathroom with my phone.

• 2:07:18Griffin Newman?

  Executive privilege.

• 2:07:19David Sims?

  And I can like load up the Wikipedia page for fire and read it. You know what I mean? I have too many things at my face. It's too easy for me. Yeah. Back in the day, you needed like, yeah, like Newsweek. Yeah, right.

• 2:07:30Speaker 02

  The thing about, and here's the thing, why Rooster, it's, there's nothing. It's ju, he is just shitting that long.

• 2:07:36David Sims?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:07:37Speaker 02

  That's, it's just his body is that fucked up.

• 2:07:40Griffin Newman?

  Reading like a Tijuana Bible or some shit.

• 2:07:42Speaker 02

  No, it is him versus the outhouse. And it smells bad. He doesn't want to be there, but he's trying to get done as fast as possible.

• 2:07:50David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:07:51Speaker 02

  It's taking 40 minutes because that's just how it is.

• 2:07:54Griffin Newman?

  This is one of those movies.

• 2:07:56David Sims?

  Yeah. That pit is cooking.

• 2:07:57Speaker 02

  Terrible, dude.

• 2:07:59Griffin Newman?

  It's one of those movies where I think about how bad every character smells.

• 2:08:04Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:08:04Griffin Newman?

  Right? You're just like, this would be the stinkiest.

• 2:08:07Speaker 02

  And that's another reason why you don't think about it not being 13, like it feels rated R because it's gross. Because they look gross. There's a sheen to all them. They all smell like shit.

• 2:08:18Griffin Newman?

  They're all sweaty.

• 2:08:18Speaker 02

  The only person who's sort of clean is Matty, I guess.

• 2:08:22David Sims?

  Yes.

• 2:08:22Speaker 02

  You know?

• 2:08:23David Sims?

  Matty is basically put together and like knows it.

• 2:08:26Griffin Newman?

  Does he have some fucking like old cowboy cologne?

• 2:08:30David Sims?

  Pomade in his hair or whatever.

• 2:08:32Griffin Newman?

  Is he a Dapper Dan man?

• 2:08:33David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:08:33Griffin Newman?

  He's got the cowlick, of course.

• 2:08:35David Sims?

  But like, you know, one of the most touching little moments is when she puts the newspaper in the hat. Like she knows she has to look the part a little bit.

• 2:08:42Speaker 02

  It's the only time she's literally a cute little kid.

• 2:08:45David Sims?

  Right, right.

• 2:08:45Speaker 02

  Is when the hat goes under her eyes. It's adorable.

• 2:08:49David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:08:49Speaker 02

  But then she stuffs it in. She's like, and now she's back to being the character we've known the whole time.

• 2:08:53David Sims?

  And she looks like some Cormac McCarthy character, like the, where it's like, oh, who's that? And it's like, oh yeah, they call her like the cactus and it's like some 14 year old who like takes people's faces. You know, like she could, she's got like this stony intense face. But then I love the little moments when she realizes that the campfire that LaBief and Rooster are about to fight. And she's like trying to cheer everybody up. Right. I'll do all the parts. Someone has to be the caller.

• 2:09:18Griffin Newman?

  She starts to become like the child trying to stop her parents from fighting. And she understands that the only thing that unifies these two guys is they don't like the other one being mean to her.

• 2:09:27David Sims?

  Yes. And like, this movie is bad if she is just autistic, right? Like if she's just like a weird robot girl or whatever, you know, like then it's like, that's fine, but like, no, she's a kid. There's bits of kid in her, like of like whimsy, like that come out of her.

• 2:09:42Speaker 02

  There's innocence that she can't help.

• 2:09:43Griffin Newman?

  The movie makes news of you were. Do the same calculation that every character who meets her is doing of like, is it possible that she's for real? Yeah, for sure. You know, you're not calling bullshit on her, but you're, you're actually going, she might actually Yeah. Be what she's saying she is. Mm hmm. Yeah, absolutely. Which isn't even her framing herself as a wonderkin. It's just, I get it. You don't have to talk down to me. I can handle this.

• 2:10:06David Sims?

  Um, but yeah. Okay. So what are some other, you know, uh, that we talked about the taking Matthews, the, the trial?

• 2:10:11Griffin Newman?

  I keep, keeps kicking the kids off the porch. Just a fun little moment. Yeah. It just seems like he's done it a million times. Clearly have a rapport. I need to just call him out by name because I've misattributed so many times. Leon Russum is the sheriff who recommends the three trackers.

• 2:10:29David Sims?

  And says he likes to pull the cork.

• 2:10:31Griffin Newman?

  And says he likes to pull the cork. He's in Lebowski briefly.

• 2:10:34David Sims?

  Oh, yeah?

• 2:10:35Griffin Newman?

  He's in Star Trek six, the undiscovered country as chief in command. I don't remember what that part is, but it is just my favorite chunk of dialogue where she says, who's the best marshal? And he takes a pause and he goes, I'll have to weigh that. And the decision to just be like, let me actually think about this before I say it. And then it's William Waters is the best tracker. He's half Comanche and it's something to see him cut for sign. And he's playing it like he's like In his truth, it's like a video game level story. It's like, this guy's got the tracking skills. Rooster's the killer. Blanca's a big green guy and he's got electric power. Yeah, you gotta hit Y. Doll seam stretches really far. Yes, absolutely. Uh, the meanest is Rooster Cogburn. He's a pitiless man, double tough and fear don't enter into his thinking.

• 2:11:20Griffin Newman?

  Loves to pull a cork. He's moving on, right? The best is probably LT Quinn. He's like, you know what? Here's the answer. I've landed on it.

• 2:11:27David Sims?

  But then he says

• 2:11:28Griffin Newman?

  He brings his prisoners in alive. Now he might let one slip by now and again, but he believes that even the worst of men is entitled to a fair shake. And without missing a beat, she says, where can I find this rooster? Yeah, yeah.

• 2:11:38David Sims?

  She's like, uh, not interested.

• 2:11:39Griffin Newman?

  I'm just pumping my fist that whole exchange, everything that's happening. Yeah.

• 2:11:44David Sims?

  Um, so yeah, like she gets, all right. Like she gets Rooster on the, I'm just trying to think of stuff. I'm going through the plot, trying to think of stuff we haven't, stuff that happens.

• 2:11:52Griffin Newman?

  Stuff that happens in the movie.

• 2:11:53David Sims?

  Uh, you know, I talked about the scene where she kind of wins them over by fording the river.

• 2:11:58Speaker 02

  Awesome stunt. Looks like she literally did that.

• 2:12:00David Sims?

  Yeah, how did they? How do you make a horse look tired? At the end, when the horse is like dying and you're like, that horse is dead. Like, yeah, how do you like fake a horse being tired? You don't know. I don't know. Horses are crazy. That's another reason that, by the way, I want to live.

• 2:12:15Speaker 02

  The actual reason ketamine exists.

• 2:12:17David Sims?

  Right, yeah.

• 2:12:19Speaker 02

  We found cooler stuff for it, but.

• 2:12:20David Sims?

  It's not for billionaires.

• 2:12:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:12:24David Sims?

  That's why every, basically like, starting with, I don't know, the 1850s or whatever, I basically want to live in New York if I live in this time. Cause I'm like, I need railroads and shit. I'm not gonna learn to ride a horse. And then like feed the horse and like.

• 2:12:38Speaker 02

  Well, there's horse today, you know, even New York is that's, that's what they say. The brown, that's why brownstones have stairs. So you wouldn't, you weren't around shit.

• 2:12:45David Sims?

  Right, right. You're like, you're a little bit above the shit. That does make sense. That's the funniest thing about the Gilded Age, my favorite like gas leak show in the world, like, is like everyone in it is clean. And I'm like, they be dirty. This is a dirty place. It's still, it's the 19th century.

• 2:12:59Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:12:59David Sims?

  Like, there's no running, you know, there's no flush toilets.

• 2:13:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're, you're clean for two hours. Two hours a week, you're clean. If you're rich.

• 2:13:06David Sims?

  If you're rich, you can't like go home and be like, I gotta take a shower. Like, no, that's not gonna happen. You want to take a bath? Eight people have to like start getting shit ready.

• 2:13:16Griffin Newman?

  I was talking to my girlfriend about how much of a nightmare Burning Man seems to me.

• 2:13:20David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:13:20Griffin Newman?

  And even like any music festival as well, where I'm just like, my two favorite things in the world are sleeping in a bed with the air conditioning blaring.

• 2:13:30David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:13:31Griffin Newman?

  And taking the longest shits and showers in the world. That's all I care about.

• 2:13:36David Sims?

  Absolutely.

• 2:13:37Griffin Newman?

  A bedroom that's cold and a bathroom that's ready to go. Yeah.

• 2:13:41Speaker 02

  Day three at a music festival, it, the porta potters are rough.

• 2:13:46Griffin Newman?

  But it's my biggest thought when I watch this movie is I'm just like.

• 2:13:49David Sims?

  My god, they don't even have like Tempur-Pedic mattresses.

• 2:13:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, yeah, it's the other thing, like, what's Rooster's fucking back looking like? Like, dude, I I'm fat as shit and like if I sleep on the wrong hotel mattress,

• 2:14:02David Sims?

  Hundred percent.

• 2:14:02Speaker 02

  I'm ruined for a fucking.

• 2:14:03David Sims?

  What you just said is my life right now.

• 2:14:05Speaker 02

  It's crazy.

• 2:14:06David Sims?

  Every morning I wake up and I'm like, why am I in excruciating pain? And it's like, because you didn't move your body for a while.

• 2:14:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:14:12David Sims?

  And you're like tall and large.

• 2:14:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, like he's when he's sleeping in that rope bed, fucked up off whiskey. I'm like, this is crazy.

• 2:14:20David Sims?

  He's always drunk, right? Like, that's how he deals.

• 2:14:23Speaker 02

  They're in pain.

• 2:14:23Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, but even still, that makes the balancing act of it even more impressive that he's staying in there.

• 2:14:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. No, he is impressive.

• 2:14:29Griffin Newman?

  He refers to it as a rope bed himself. It's not like we're being rude.

• 2:14:33Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no.

• 2:14:34David Sims?

  Yeah, no, we're not being rude. He sleeps on a bunch of ropes.

• 2:14:37Speaker 02

  And that's the thing about Rooster as a character, it's like, what his greatness is eroding every second. Like, he probably was a specimen that could ride forever and and he could, the cornbread shot, if you catch him 30 years ago, he's nailing all those. Like, that's the thing about him is that he is the fucking remnants of a fucking Terminator.

• 2:14:58David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:14:58Speaker 02

  Like, when he's one of those terrorists or whatever.

• 2:15:00David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:15:01Speaker 02

  He's he's a fucking machine, but he's a piece of shit. But it's like, and yeah, he is, you're catching him at like, you know, this is the the last little bit of this guy being a fucking legend.

• 2:15:11Griffin Newman?

  Like, living in a world this tough, right? It's gonna break you down one way or another, right? You become evil, you kind of become broken and crazy like this. You know, or you become like LeBouf and you just sort of try to like, put your head above all of it and not really engage with it. But yeah, this is a guy who's just like, lived this life for so long that has kind of taken everything from inside of him, which makes his reveal gradually that he cares about her so touching to me. Because this guy almost thinks he doesn't have emotions anymore.

• 2:15:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:15:46Griffin Newman?

  You know, like, it's like, well, I just lost those back in the trail 10 years ago.

• 2:15:49Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 2:15:50Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:15:50Speaker 02

  And maybe he has, I mean, maybe he, yeah, he doesn't until he finds her. And then in terms of shit that just happened, it's like, so, you know, we've covered the little fucking, the shack, which is one of. My favorite scenes and then Labiche getting absolutely got just not even able to get one. Like, what did he think was gonna hap-

• 2:16:06David Sims?

  And getting dragged.

• 2:16:07Speaker 02

  Dragged.

• 2:16:08David Sims?

  And then like the humiliation of Rooster being like, uh, should I take your tongue out?

• 2:16:12Speaker 02

  Digging around in his mouth?

• 2:16:13David Sims?

  Yes, like.

• 2:16:13Speaker 02

  I don't know. Those dirty ass fingers we were just talking about completely in his fucking mouth?

• 2:16:18David Sims?

  Yes.

• 2:16:18Speaker 02

  Dangling away his already fucked up tongue. It's brutal.

• 2:16:22Griffin Newman?

  He leaves for the first time after the first night, right? So there's the campfire where they're fighting. And then the morning, the next, the argument about whether or not he can shoot.

• 2:16:30Speaker 02

  He leaves for the first time as soon as she forges the river.

• 2:16:33David Sims?

  Right. He's like, I'm out of here.

• 2:16:35Griffin Newman?

  They do the campfire that night, don't they?

• 2:16:37David Sims?

  I guess so. They do do a campfire.

• 2:16:38Griffin Newman?

  And then the next morning is when they do the shooting thing and then he leaves. He's like, I just fucking hate this guy. I'm sorry. I wish you all the best. Then, right, the, the bear man, the body hanging from the tree, the cabin with Domaglees and all that happens without LeBaf.

• 2:16:51David Sims?

  Right. And then he interrupts their like stakeout.

• 2:16:54Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:16:55David Sims?

  Unintentionally.

• 2:16:56Griffin Newman?

  And then comes out of it. It's so much worse for wear.

• 2:16:58David Sims?

  And then they're like, I guess they feel bad. They're like, they don't, they're like, okay, we have to like drag you around now.

• 2:17:04Speaker 02

  Well, she feels bad. That's, that's the moment where she starts to show some like.

• 2:17:08David Sims?

  Cause she's like, he, he like stood him down.

• 2:17:11Speaker 02

  Brave.

• 2:17:11David Sims?

  Yeah, exactly. Like he was gonna draw on, right, on the, what's that? Ned Pepper.

• 2:17:16Griffin Newman?

  And another incredible line is, it astonishes me that Mr. LeBaf has been shot, trampled and nearly bitten his tongue off. And yet not only does he continue to talk, but he spills the banks of English.

• 2:17:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:17:28Griffin Newman?

  Which is anytime Rooster says anything that eloquent.

• 2:17:33Griffin Newman?

  It's so much funnier.

• 2:17:34David Sims?

  He takes like four minutes to say a line like that. It's so, um, anyway. Uh, and then, yeah, we are kind of like, I guess the, the animosity kind of builds up again. And we lead to the, not the, the next big fight, the, I bow out.

• 2:17:51Speaker 02

  And which, which the funny thing is they were right. They were just a day early. Cause this whole plan, he's like, they're prop, my only hunch is they're going to the claim, their claim, and they just beat them there.

• 2:18:03David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:18:03Speaker 02

  Cause they're, they literally wake up.

• 2:18:05David Sims?

  Show up.

• 2:18:05Speaker 02

  If they don't have that fight, they're fully, and by the way, if, if he doesn't get drunk, probably there's no big deal, right? Cause the, the whole.

• 2:18:13David Sims?

  Cause then they would just show up.

• 2:18:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:18:14David Sims?

  Yes.

• 2:18:14Speaker 02

  Like, all right, let's get a night's rest and then.

• 2:18:16David Sims?

  We got the drop on these guys.

• 2:18:17Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 2:18:17David Sims?

  Right. And instead, Maddie finds Brolin, uh, what's Brolin, uh, Tom Chaney.

• 2:18:22Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 2:18:22David Sims?

  Shoots him.

• 2:18:24Speaker 02

  Awesome.

• 2:18:24David Sims?

  I love.

• 2:18:25Speaker 02

  So sick.

• 2:18:25David Sims?

  Right. Both times she fires a gun, she does get knocked on her ass, which is what happened, would happen to me if I fired a gun.

• 2:18:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:18:30David Sims?

  Like, cause that is what happens. And, you know, guns back then sucked. Like it's shooting like a dumb metal ball at you. It hurts. It doesn't necessarily like kill you. And he's just like, my life sucks. I hate you, but he grabs her and like, she's the hostage. And then you've got this like fantastic 10 minutes of Barry Pepper with the crazy.

• 2:18:51Griffin Newman?

  A little pepper on the dish.

• 2:18:52David Sims?

  Just being an absolute goblin.

• 2:18:54Griffin Newman?

  Looking like the Crypt Keeper.

• 2:18:56David Sims?

  And, and I just love it.

• 2:18:57Speaker 02

  Yellow. Is the gang called the Pepper Gang?

• 2:18:59David Sims?

  It's the Pepper Gang.

• 2:19:00Speaker 02

  Hysterical. It is playing the Pepper Gang.

• 2:19:02David Sims?

  I do like that he has the weird kind of Samurai thing with Rooster.

• 2:19:07Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 2:19:08David Sims?

  Like where they, he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not going to kill a girl. I'm not like a weirdo. I'm just like a bandit. I like steal shit and have money.

• 2:19:15Speaker 02

  No, no, it's, it's true. It's like, it's the most you kind of get the Roost, Roosters like, I've, we've come across each other as guys. We've each been on, you know, there's probably been a time where Pepper had a badge and I didn't have a badge. He was technically the sheriff and I was technically the criminal. Like they clearly have like this long, weird history. And yes, that, that Samurai type honor shit is pretty fucking, it is cool.

• 2:19:39Griffin Newman?

  It's the stuff that Chaney doesn't have, right? Like she's so angry at the idea of Chaney stealing her father. And yet it's like, his death was incidental. It didn't mean anything. This guy's got no strategy in his head.

• 2:19:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:19:50Griffin Newman?

  He's got no internal belief system.

• 2:19:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:19:53Griffin Newman?

  He's just like some idiot with a gun.

• 2:19:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. Like if her dad had done something that warranted, made some kind of mortal insult to a guy and the guy shot him in a duel, she'd be sad, but she wouldn't try and find him. She would be like, That's life.

• 2:20:07Griffin Newman?

  The fact that it's meaningless is what gets her and the fact that when she meets him, it provides no answers or clarity to anything. It only makes it more meaningless. And then you're also like, yeah, and this guy's like the number five in this dude's pack.

• 2:20:19Speaker 02

  He's so stupid.

• 2:20:20Griffin Newman?

  He's like unimportant.

• 2:20:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:20:22Griffin Newman?

  I love that every time LeBeuf leaves, he also has like his version of the emotional Oscar scene. He keeps doing the thing that Rooster won't do, which is like, hit your special.

• 2:20:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:20:34Griffin Newman?

  I believe in you.

• 2:20:35Speaker 02

  Well, that's, oh, yes, I wanted to say that.

• 2:20:36Griffin Newman?

  And Damon like has like two monologues that feel like this is his last scene in the movie. And he plays them really straight, but like, here's the important words I have to leave her with, which makes it all the funnier when he comes back.

• 2:20:46Speaker 02

  Well, and I think to me, it shows you what a fucking blowhard.

• 2:20:50Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 2:20:50Speaker 02

  This kid like, cause it's when it's that time we were talking about earlier at the campfire where Rooster is being a piece of shit and he's like, fuck you, I don't, I'm not helping. And this is LeBeef's time to shine. And not only does he not help, but he gives some meaningless eloquent speech instead. And he thinks saying a, I guess, giving her a heroic speech, that your words are more, they couldn't be less useful. They are the most useless, even it's like the most politician, like, you know, we're gonna give a big speech about how hard it is to fucking to be, you know, to live in this, everything's too expensive, but we're gonna raise taxes on you. You know what I mean? Or we're gonna give billionaires a tax break.

• 2:21:32Griffin Newman?

  Exactly.

• 2:21:33Speaker 02

  It's the most two-faced bullshit. Your special, whatever, whatever. Not gonna help you, by the way.

• 2:21:38Griffin Newman?

  Well, it's like show, don't tell, right? Like Rooster is all action.

• 2:21:41Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:21:42Griffin Newman?

  And LeBeuf is all tell.

• 2:21:44Speaker 02

  All tell, yeah.

• 2:21:44Griffin Newman?

  He can't do anything without telling you why he's doing it and why it's impressive and why you should be impressed.

• 2:21:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:21:50Griffin Newman?

  And like the fact that Rooster never even has a moment of being like, eh, you're a good kid.

• 2:21:55Speaker 02

  Right.

• 2:21:56Griffin Newman?

  Like, he won't give her an inch verbally.

• 2:21:58Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 2:21:59David Sims?

  But he never, I mean, he fakes being like, oh, she's nothing to me. And like, you take her, why do I care?

• 2:22:04Griffin Newman?

  But in his actions, you can tell.

• 2:22:05David Sims?

  Of course.

• 2:22:05Griffin Newman?

  He respects her.

• 2:22:06David Sims?

  No, and he's going to go get her back. Like, and you're weirdly never, it's tense. It's scary that she's with Tom. And like, LaBief saving her is exciting, but you're also kind of like, yeah, Rooster's just got this.

• 2:22:20Speaker 02

  Well, also because you kind, I mean, that is the thing of like, starting with the adult. You know she lives.

• 2:22:26David Sims?

  Yes.

• 2:22:26Speaker 02

  You know what I mean? Like, that takes, I do think that it, that took the bite of like, does she actually die? Like, this movie's kind of fucked up. You know, you don't, but you don't know if Rooster dies, you don't know what happens to LaBief, you don't know what the fucking, what, what happens.

• 2:22:39Griffin Newman?

  What's also what she tells you at the beginning, which is like, everything, there's nothing free. Everything comes at a cost. There is some give and take in any action you do in this world, right? And it's like, what she doesn't understand is like, she got what she wanted, and it kind of maybe fucked her up forever. And the moment of her having the standoff with Chaney, and him trying to like, sort of Frankenstein walk towards her on the cliff, and she has the courage to like, stare him down and fire the gun. And the moment when he shoots, uh, not Gleason, but the big guy with Gleason, is so good because there's a really quick shot to Hailee Steinfeld of her being like, oh, I've witnessed a man being shot right in front of me. And you realize in that moment, this is the first time she's seen this.

• 2:23:19Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 2:23:20Griffin Newman?

  Right? This character, you see her going to a public hanging at the beginning of the film. It's not like she's never seen a dead body, she's seen her father's dead body.

• 2:23:27David Sims?

  No.

• 2:23:27Griffin Newman?

  But this kind of like standoff, you know, in a fiery cabin, she's never seen before, with like sweaty men. And so that moment where she's there with Chaney, even though we know she knows how to fire a gun, she knows how to do this, she knows how to do that, you wonder if she'll be able to do it in that moment. And she fires the gun, successfully kills him, but immediately also is like, pushed back into a ditch from the recoil because, right, immediately, she's a tiny girl. There's like a physical reality here, and now she's at the girl at the bottom of a pit surrounded by snakes, and it's like a child in danger. Like, as, at the peak of her triumph and her victory, she's knocked all the way back down to like, you are a child in a dangerous world.

• 2:24:06David Sims?

  Snakes are also really fucked up.

• 2:24:08Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 2:24:08David Sims?

  I said this to my wife. I was like, snakes feels like something I made up when I'm a kid like dragons and shit.

• 2:24:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:24:14David Sims?

  Like, those are just real?

• 2:24:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, little tubes that can kill you.

• 2:24:17David Sims?

  Right, that just like come out of nowhere.

• 2:24:19Griffin Newman?

  Do you get into these conversations?

• 2:24:21David Sims?

  Poison in them?

• 2:24:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, the poison's crazy.

• 2:24:23Griffin Newman?

  Do you get in these conversations with your daughter? I feel like look who's talking to as a version of this joke where it's like, wait, so which things are real and which things aren't?

• 2:24:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:24:30Griffin Newman?

  You're telling me dinosaurs were real, dragons are not, snakes are presently?

• 2:24:34David Sims?

  I'm not getting into that with her yet because I like that she just likes unicorns and I had a great convo with her the other day. Did I tell you this? Where like she's had bad dreams and I was like, dream about something nice. And she was like, what? And I was like, dream about unicorns. And she's like, okay. You want to know my unicorn's names? And I was like, hit me. And she's like, poop.

• 2:24:51Speaker 02

  Poop a unicorn.

• 2:24:52Griffin Newman?

  Pretty.

• 2:24:53David Sims?

  Johnny. And I was like, Johnny.

• 2:24:54Speaker 02

  Johnny and poop.

• 2:24:56David Sims?

  Poop Johnny? And Johnny poop. That was the four.

• 2:25:00Griffin Newman?

  Four beats. She did four beats.

• 2:25:02David Sims?

  And I was like, it's one of those things where I'm like, that's kind of funny. Like, oh, you're like doing slightly more complicated humor now.

• 2:25:08Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 2:25:08David Sims?

  Anyway.

• 2:25:09Speaker 02

  She's not leaving any meat on that bone either.

• 2:25:12David Sims?

  She found every combo.

• 2:25:14Griffin Newman?

  She worked out all four corners of the square.

• 2:25:17David Sims?

  But yeah, I don't want to tell her unicorns aren't real because like, I don't know, who do I care? Maybe they are real.

• 2:25:21Griffin Newman?

  But you're right, snakes do feel like a thing that should be.

• 2:25:24David Sims?

  They feel fake. They're like from the Bible and you're like, yeah, that's like a monster from the Bible. That's not real.

• 2:25:28Griffin Newman?

  Beyond that, here's this girl at the bottom of a pit, right? She's immediately scared and crying. Like she's showing vulnerability for the first time, basically in the entire movie. At just from being down there, being hurt, feeling stuck, calling out for rooster, not hearing any response, being like, there's a good chance no one ever finds me down here.

• 2:25:45Speaker 02

  And, and what's empowering her the whole thing is this, this absolute like mission, you know, locked in, the mission's now over. Now she is just a little kid in the fucking pit with nothing to drive her, no, nothing in their furnace. All the coal has been burned. You just fucking killed the guy.

• 2:26:03Griffin Newman?

  It's Jessica Chastain at the end of Zero Dark Thirty being like, what the fuck do I do now? I killed Osama Bin Laden.

• 2:26:08David Sims?

  He is the Osama Bin Laden.

• 2:26:09Speaker 02

  He's Osama. Yep. A hundred percent. And it's also, I will not, it's also the most on the nose. I mean, this, at the, at the core, this movie is one of my favorites of like, I'm a big revenge movie guy. And the lesson almost always is it's not worth it.

• 2:26:23David Sims?

  It's not gonna make you feel better.

• 2:26:25Speaker 02

  It's never worth it. It always fucks your life up more. And this is. And they they hit that in multiple ways. I mean, we we talked about it a little bit. I'm sure we'll talk about the end and a little more. But this in the moment is the most on the nose. The gun you fire to kill the guy backfires and leaves you in a pit of dead bodies and snakes.

• 2:26:44Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 2:26:45Speaker 02

  I mean, that's the most like granularly and in the biggest sense.

• 2:26:49David Sims?

  The metaphor is so loud.

• 2:26:50Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:26:51Griffin Newman?

  The whole thing that's been driving her has suddenly like dissipated and now she's got nothing and she's in danger until like a reach for a dead body while she's kind of like whimpering, right? Like she's clearly like, okay, but I still have enough wits about me to figure out how to get my way out of here.

• 2:27:06Speaker 02

  Gotta get the knife.

• 2:27:07Griffin Newman?

  You pull for a dead body. It's a fucking skeleton body with a knife and a sheath and then you reveal tummy full of snakes.

• 2:27:14Speaker 02

  Crazy visual.

• 2:27:15David Sims?

  It's not one snake.

• 2:27:17Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. A tummy full of snakes.

• 2:27:19Speaker 02

  Knifed corpse full of snakes is a fucked up, fucked up visual.

• 2:27:23Griffin Newman?

  Not just like, oh, there's one snake hiding here, but like a full belly of snakes.

• 2:27:27Speaker 02

  And they're all rattlers. You hear the rattling. You know, they're poison. It's not just you're gonna get bitten. You're gonna die.

• 2:27:32David Sims?

  You're gonna die. And like the I was, I am like, I was shocked when the first time I saw it, because I think I hadn't read the book yet, like. But I'm like, she loses her arm. It feels so cruel. Like I was upset the first time I saw this movie. Now you're just like, yeah, she needs that. Like, it's like her battle wound. And like, it means like she can just be this, like the woman she becomes, like rather than having to like deal with some gentleman call or whatever.

• 2:27:57Griffin Newman?

  Right. It's like Rooster comes down there, right? He shoots all the fucking snakes.

• 2:28:02David Sims?

  He is in Terminator mode then. Like then he's in full battle mode, like the last HP or the energy.

• 2:28:07Griffin Newman?

  He does the fucking clock, bang, bang, bang, bang. Yeah. He does the X over the snake bite with the knife, which I love. And then spits out, sucks and spits out the venom, right? Then pulls her back up. And then this thing where like the sky turns into this bizarre fantasia as the score is swelling.

• 2:28:23Speaker 02

  Those shots are like horseback, different levels of sunset. It's just like.

• 2:28:29Speaker 02

  On the nose, beautiful cinematography.

• 2:28:30David Sims?

  But like do it.

• 2:28:31Griffin Newman?

  But also part of the implications that she's like hallucinating, like it looks like starry night.

• 2:28:37David Sims?

  Yes, yes, yes.

• 2:28:37Griffin Newman?

  And she's just like looking up at the skies, this guy's riding along. And as he realizes like the horse is giving out, I gotta stab the horse. Because the panic from the stab will make it run a little bit faster for a short period. And she's calling out, don't do it. Don't hurt the horse. This world is too like cruel. Can't do it. Horse is fucking dead. He shoots the horse to put the horse out of its misery and then just fucking picks her up.

• 2:29:02David Sims?

  I know. It rocks so hard.

• 2:29:04Griffin Newman?

  And they like make it just in time for him to collapse. Fire a gun into the air just enough to get someone to walk outside.

• 2:29:10David Sims?

  I'm gonna start doing that when I show up at the studio. I'm just.

• 2:29:14Griffin Newman?

  And you're like, she just made it by a moment. And then you hard cut to she's an adult woman with one arm.

• 2:29:19David Sims?

  And has never seen him again. And it's that, I love the idea that it's like they had a bond or whatever. But it might've almost been too intense for them to see each other.

• 2:29:28Griffin Newman?

  But also like by the time she wakes up, the arm is gone and he is gone.

• 2:29:31David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:29:32Griffin Newman?

  She never communicates to him again.

• 2:29:33David Sims?

  He doesn't wanna like look her in the eye after that because he was vulnerable.

• 2:29:37Griffin Newman?

  It's too emotional. And he writes her.

• 2:29:39David Sims?

  Shout out fill your hand, you son of a bitch, which is like the coolest thing anyone's ever said in a movie. Uh, but yes, he, yeah, he.

• 2:29:45Griffin Newman?

  Taking the bit in his teeth.

• 2:29:46David Sims?

  But like, I loved it also at the end of the movie, what she's going to those wild west shows that would travel the country at the turn of the century. It's like, that is the end of the west.

• 2:29:54Griffin Newman?

  Which you saying like this is.

• 2:29:56David Sims?

  Now it's become this like fossil.

• 2:29:57Griffin Newman?

  We're dealing with the last like.

• 2:29:59David Sims?

  And it's like these old cowboys.

• 2:30:01Griffin Newman?

  Toughness this guy has in him.

• 2:30:02David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:30:02Griffin Newman?

  He's about to become a novelty.

• 2:30:04David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:30:04Griffin Newman?

  And he's gonna spend the rest of his life.

• 2:30:06Speaker 02

  He's fucking howdy duty after this.

• 2:30:06Griffin Newman?

  After this moment, yeah. Being like a children's entertainer, like a birthday party.

• 2:30:10David Sims?

  Those shows were just guys be like, I remember I saw Wild Bill Hickok three time. The first time he looked me in the eye and he said, you got any sugar, you know, whatever.

• 2:30:19Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, and then they shoot the bottle and everyone applauds. Right. And then they, a beard lady comes out.

• 2:30:24David Sims?

  Why? So she's mad that the other guy doesn't stand up? Is that why she calls him trash? Absolutely great that she just fires that off.

• 2:30:31Griffin Newman?

  The one guy takes his hat off.

• 2:30:32David Sims?

  And the other guy doesn't. The other guy's just like.

• 2:30:34Griffin Newman?

  Yes. But yes, no, he writes her a letter inviting her to come to the show. And by the time she gets there, they're like, he died three days ago.

• 2:30:42Speaker 02

  Brutal.

• 2:30:43Griffin Newman?

  And it's to this point in the same way that like- Too hot. Yeah. Like, they're like, it got kinda hot. Yeah. Not really a warm weather guy.

• 2:30:50Speaker 02

  If there was a breeze, then you might have made the, you would have reconnected with the most important person in your life. You were, I mean, the amount, and you get the sense that this is not a woman who, like, looks forward to a lot. And you, and her life has not been easy. And yes, I think the biggest tragedy is, the heartbreaking part of this is that she peaked. This was the best moment, this was the worst and best-

• 2:31:13Griffin Newman?

  How do you, how do you top this?

• 2:31:14Speaker 02

  Week of her life.

• 2:31:15Griffin Newman?

  It was the most alive she ever was.

• 2:31:16Speaker 02

  And to Ben's point, you're not, you know, like, she, this is the week that she triumphed over being a woman in the Wild West and being a child. She escaped the dangers that like, being, you know, that, being that kind of person, you were in danger and you overcame all of that. You earned the respect of like, tough fucking killer cowboys. You killed one. You personally fucking killed the guy that killed your dad. And the, your reward for that is, you'll never feel as alive, you'll never, you'll never feel, people won't, you won't be able to relate to people. You probably were kind of a weird person to begin with.

• 2:31:52Griffin Newman?

  Absolutely.

• 2:31:53Speaker 02

  Who does this girl even become if she doesn't do this?

• 2:31:55Griffin Newman?

  That's the thing.

• 2:31:56Speaker 02

  She's probably kind of annoying.

• 2:31:57Griffin Newman?

  An odd sister who does keeps the books. The only alternate path for her is if they successfully talk her out of going on this mission in the first place and go, now you gotta go to finishing school.

• 2:32:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:32:08Griffin Newman?

  You know, they're like, put down the fucking gun and the hat. We're gonna teach you how to talk and walk like a proper lady, become a school teacher, and then marry someone. And then like, the woman she is at this point, at the end of the movie, you're like, she could have been like, a sassy lady who owns a saloon and doesn't take any guff, but she's almost like, that's like a parody of a person. I'm just gonna be me, right? And there's no place for me in this world. And she's not, Elizabeth Marvel's so good with such little screen time in this, but like- She won't let on how excited she is to see Rooster.

• 2:32:41Speaker 02

  You can tell.

• 2:32:42Griffin Newman?

  In the same way that she feels like if I shoot Tom Chaney, it will resolve my anger about my father being taken from me. She clearly thinks if I get to have one final emotional conversation with Rooster, the conversation that wins Jeff Bridges the Oscar, this will all come together for me. And she gets in there like, no, it just by happens, so he died three days ago. This is a little too hot.

• 2:33:04Speaker 02

  Life sucks.

• 2:33:05Griffin Newman?

  And then she sort of says like, I heard that LaBeef's maybe still out there. He'd be 80 now, probably. I never got in touch.

• 2:33:11David Sims?

  Probably not. Right.

• 2:33:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:33:12Griffin Newman?

  Right. And then she just walks off and it's just time comes for us all.

• 2:33:16David Sims?

  That's the best thing that you're just like, oh, that's it. And then you're like, yeah, of course that's it.

• 2:33:20Speaker 02

  And there's nothing good.

• 2:33:21Griffin Newman?

  The ending line she delivers as if there's more to the sentence.

• 2:33:25David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:33:26Griffin Newman?

  She doesn't.

• 2:33:27David Sims?

  She's about to say one last profound thing.

• 2:33:28Griffin Newman?

  She goes, time comes for us all. And you're like, what's the end of the thought? Done. Walks off. Music swells. Directed by Joel and Ethan Cullen.

• 2:33:36David Sims?

  Um, it's a perfect movie in my opinion.

• 2:33:38Speaker 02

  It was, yeah, incredible. And yes, so heartbreaking. And yeah, and even the LaBeef thing, she's like, she, even in that, she's like, I would have, I kind of, she's still holding out hope that at least she'll see LaBeef. I think even in the way she says that, it's like, you can tell she wants this so bad. And that's, you're right, the actress's name, you said Elizabeth Marvel?

• 2:33:58Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:33:58David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:33:59Speaker 02

  It's so little screen time and you can, and she never says anything that tells you she wants this. And you, it's palpable how bad she wants it. And how much she's disappointed. And maybe a little bit, a little bit of it leaks out into the like, calling the guy trash a little. But even that feels more like, no, I just, I will disrespect anyone who's disrespectful towards me.

• 2:34:21Griffin Newman?

  I'm not gonna take off.

• 2:34:22Speaker 02

  I'm not gonna take off, but man, being able to communicate how devastating it is for her is, and yeah. And even it, life is bullshit and nothing good ever happens. And even if you have an adventure where you're the kid, you, you figure it out and you, you do everything you possibly want to. It ultimately doesn't make your life better. It probably, it makes it worse. You lose your fucking arm over it. Congrats. Now you don't have an arm and you're, you're, you're fucking pissed off. And then the end of your life also sucks.

• 2:34:49Griffin Newman?

  Well, here's the other, the other quietly.

• 2:34:51Speaker 02

  So awesome and true.

• 2:34:52Griffin Newman?

  Quietly profound and depressing thing that happens at the very end of the movie. I agree with everything you just said. The other quiet.

• 2:34:59Griffin Newman?

  And profound thing that happens at the end of the movie is that it hard cuts from her telling the guy who stayed seated with the hat on to go fuck himself, right? And then she says she got the casket. She tracked down Rooster's body. Right. So she goes try to bury him properly.

• 2:35:12David Sims?

  She got it out of that like random cemetery.

• 2:35:14Griffin Newman?

  Right. And what's written on the casket says, Cogburn, Yale County, hold that station. Same thing her dad's casket. Right. It's just got like a fucking shipping label on it. That's like trash, you know? But that's how they labeled her dad's casket. Totally. Yes. So she just gets the casket and then it hard cuts to her standing at his gravesite in the snow on top of this hill. And in that shot, she's aged another like 20 years. Right. She's got old age makeup on. So it's like 20 years after the moment where she, we're not seeing her bury him. We're seeing her return to the grave and you can just fill in the blanks and be like, I guess she probably just comes back here and checks on it a lot. That the closer she never got with this guy.

• 2:35:57Griffin Newman?

  She just comes back and was like, I need to have him in a place where I can go visit and just stare at him steely eyed and then walk away.

• 2:36:04David Sims?

  Right. And everyone's like, did they? You know, that's like she, did they?

• 2:36:09Griffin Newman?

  Right, right. Cause everyone's like, why would you take the casket of a man you didn't even know that well?

• 2:36:13David Sims?

  What is this?

• 2:36:13Griffin Newman?

  You knew for a couple of days.

• 2:36:14David Sims?

  They don't get it.

• 2:36:15Griffin Newman?

  They don't get it.

• 2:36:16David Sims?

  But I get it.

• 2:36:17Griffin Newman?

  It's another funny thing to consider is you think about how rough a shape Rooster's in for this movie. If she had gotten there three days earlier, he would have been bad. Yeah, true. Right?

• 2:36:31David Sims?

  That's like Rooster 25 years later.

• 2:36:34Speaker 03

  Yeah. I mean, at this point, he must spend, I don't know, three, probably a blank check episode worth of time on the toilet.

• 2:36:40David Sims?

  And he did like blank checking. He did listen to it a lot.

• 2:36:42Speaker 03

  I'll forget the BM's out. I'm a bit of a David dog.

• 2:36:47David Sims?

  This movie came out Christmas Eve, 2010, Griffin. Opens number two. You did say numbers one and three, but just to remind us.

• 2:36:56Griffin Newman?

  Fockers is one, Tron Legacy is two.

• 2:36:58David Sims?

  No, so Fockers is one.

• 2:37:00Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:37:00David Sims?

  True Dred is two.

• 2:37:01Griffin Newman?

  Oh.

• 2:37:01David Sims?

  Tron Legacy is three.

• 2:37:03Griffin Newman?

  Has been out for a couple of weeks.

• 2:37:04David Sims?

  Correct.

• 2:37:04Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:37:05David Sims?

  Those are the big three. It's not a great time at the movie theater. This is the whole thing where I'm like, True Dred rocks.

• 2:37:10Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:37:10David Sims?

  I defend Tron Legacy, but obviously it's like a basically baffling movie to release to a wide audience. Little Fockers, dog shit. Number four at the box office is the, I don't know, like third or fourth in like a fantasy series. I think in the last.

• 2:37:24Griffin Newman?

  It's not Voyage of the Dawn, Trey.

• 2:37:26David Sims?

  It is.

• 2:37:26Griffin Newman?

  That's three. They only made three.

• 2:37:28David Sims?

  Yeah, right. I can't remember like how many of those they made.

• 2:37:31Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:37:32David Sims?

  But like, that's something where everyone was like, sorry, no, we don't want this. They're like, the Chronicles of Narnia continue. I was like, no, man. We were kind of out on that from the beginning.

• 2:37:40Griffin Newman?

  I was talking to my dad about this last night and he was like, so is Greta Gerwig still doing like Narnia two? And I was like, no, she's making her first Narnia.

• 2:37:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 2:37:48Griffin Newman?

  And he was like, but wasn't there someone else made a Narnia like a year or two ago? And I was like,

• 2:37:53David Sims?

  Bitch, that was like,

• 2:37:54Griffin Newman?

  They made three Narnia.

• 2:37:55David Sims?

  Bush administration.

• 2:37:56Griffin Newman?

  Fifteen to twenty years ago. And he was like, did anyone like it? I was like, first one, huge hit.

• 2:38:00David Sims?

  Right.

• 2:38:01Griffin Newman?

  People flocking. And they were like, I guess this is the new Lord of the Rings. Second one, huge drop off. Disney abandons it. Fox is like, I guess there's still money in this, right? The kids don't cost much. What do you got to pay for a lion? And they put that one out and everyone's like, I don't know. Who gives a shit?

• 2:38:16Speaker 02

  Really?

• 2:38:16Griffin Newman?

  And just abandon it. It was like, due to lack of interest, they never finished the books.

• 2:38:20David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:38:20Speaker 02

  That's fucking hysterical.

• 2:38:21Griffin Newman?

  And she's now,

• 2:38:22David Sims?

  Those books only get weirder and

• 2:38:24Griffin Newman?

  But she's adapting different books, right? Isn't she doing Magician's Nephew in theory?

• 2:38:29David Sims?

  I have no idea.

• 2:38:30Griffin Newman?

  Okay.

• 2:38:30David Sims?

  Uh, that is canonically the first.

• 2:38:32Speaker 02

  Isn't that the most like, Harry Potter was a big hit. We have to just fucking, Yeah. That's the most classic Hollywood should have like,

• 2:38:40David Sims?

  Right. What else is out? What English magic shit can we dig up?

• 2:38:44Griffin Newman?

  Both launching the same year. It was like,

• 2:38:46Speaker 02

  Yeah. It was the same year. I didn't realize that.

• 2:38:48Griffin Newman?

  Both come out right after nine eleven.

• 2:38:50David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:38:50Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 2:38:50David Sims?

  And are both humongous. Thanksgiving, Lord of the Rings is Christmas and America is like, yeah, we love British people doing magic.

• 2:38:56Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. And defeating pure evil.

• 2:38:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I saw that. That's another, definitely saw Harry Potter. I was a big Harry Potter book guy when I was a kid.

• 2:39:05David Sims?

  We're this, I mean, you're, you're a couple of years younger than me, but like that's, I was too. I mean, the, the book was for our generation, like,

• 2:39:11Speaker 02

  And now I don't like the book as much, but I love J K Rowling's politics.

• 2:39:14David Sims?

  That's the thing. I kind of shifted my friends.

• 2:39:16Griffin Newman?

  You gotta separate the artist from the artist. I'm a big fan of the artist.

• 2:39:19David Sims?

  My problem with the books is that they don't talk about that stuff enough. Like, you know, like that's, I kind of, I'm flipping through the books and I'm like, yeah, but where's all the good Rowling shit?

• 2:39:27Griffin Newman?

  Really found their thing yet.

• 2:39:30David Sims?

  Oh.

• 2:39:30Griffin Newman?

  The thing that clearly makes you really happy. You sit back with a cigar and tweet and I go, what a happy woman you seem to be.

• 2:39:37David Sims?

  Right observation in the world, but like, can't she just buy a yacht?

• 2:39:40Speaker 02

  It's crazy, dude.

• 2:39:41David Sims?

  Like, get off your phone. You want to look at Twitter? That sucks.

• 2:39:45Speaker 02

  It's crazy.

• 2:39:46David Sims?

  That sucks for no matter, you, you can like buy anything you want. You could like, be like roast me a swan and someone will be like, I'm on it. Like, fine.

• 2:39:54Speaker 02

  In a weird way, it's the true grid shit of like, anyone who's got the making, who wants to be rich as fuck, can't chill.

• 2:40:03David Sims?

  Yeah, right.

• 2:40:04Speaker 02

  You have to be a fucking piece of shit that needs more money.

• 2:40:07Griffin Newman?

  To be president is innately kind of a psychopath.

• 2:40:10Speaker 02

  There's not one good person that's ever wanted to be president. Not one.

• 2:40:15David Sims?

  Uh, number five of the box office is, oh yeah. Okay.

• 2:40:20David Sims?

  Kids movie, adaptation of a kids cartoon.

• 2:40:23Griffin Newman?

  It's an adaptation of a kids cartoon. Is it like a?

• 2:40:25David Sims?

  It's another dog shit movie. This is dog shit time.

• 2:40:28Griffin Newman?

  Is it a continuation of a cartoon? It's like a later, it's like a Flintstones movie-esque.

• 2:40:32David Sims?

  That.

• 2:40:33Griffin Newman?

  Live action?

• 2:40:34David Sims?

  But with a, you know, cartoons.

• 2:40:36Griffin Newman?

  It's not Chipmunks. It's not a Smurfs.

• 2:40:39David Sims?

  It's not Smurfs.

• 2:40:40Griffin Newman?

  But it's one of these. It's like a, there's a CGI thing with some real people.

• 2:40:43David Sims?

  You know, wants to kill himself every night. It's not that, but again, you know.

• 2:40:47Griffin Newman?

  Tell me, the source material is like Saturday morning cartoon?

• 2:40:50David Sims?

  Uh, yeah, yeah.

• 2:40:52Griffin Newman?

  Yeah. December 2010. I'm trying to think of like what the shitty, and this is one that I imagine just didn't really work in the.

• 2:41:00David Sims?

  No, I mean, I don't think the movie is good, but I think it, you know, it probably.

• 2:41:03Speaker 02

  Land of the lost.

• 2:41:04Griffin Newman?

  It's Yogi Bear. It's Yogi Bear.

• 2:41:06Speaker 02

  Yogi Bear.

• 2:41:06Griffin Newman?

  Yogi Bear.

• 2:41:07David Sims?

  Quietly to hit. Ackroyd and Timberlake.

• 2:41:10Griffin Newman?

  Of course Dan Ackroyd and Justin Timberlake are the voices of Yogi Bear.

• 2:41:14David Sims?

  Who's the, who's the real life actor?

• 2:41:15Griffin Newman?

  Tom Cavanaugh's Ranger Smith, but then Anna Faris is like the reporter.

• 2:41:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, hell yeah. Shout out to Ferris.

• 2:41:21David Sims?

  What's the story she's breaking?

• 2:41:23Griffin Newman?

  I hear that they're stealing picnic baskets or whatever. Yeah, there's an incredible video. It's so well done that people thought at the time was this like a VFX artist on the Yogi Bear movie going rogue and it was just like posted by some anonymous account. But it is the end of, not the end, but the titular assassination of Jesse James.

• 2:41:43Speaker 02

  I've seen that, yes.

• 2:41:44Griffin Newman?

  Being done with the CGI models of Yogi and Boo Boo.

• 2:41:47Speaker 02

  That is very funny.

• 2:41:48Griffin Newman?

  It's really good.

• 2:41:49Speaker 02

  Uh, where is Anna Ferris, man? She's so funny.

• 2:41:52Griffin Newman?

  It is weird.

• 2:41:53David Sims?

  Sucks, man. I mean, she had the sitcom for a zillion years.

• 2:41:56Griffin Newman?

  Right. She had seven years of mom.

• 2:41:57Speaker 02

  I guess nobody makes comedies anymore.

• 2:41:59Griffin Newman?

  That's a big part of it.

• 2:42:00David Sims?

  Nobody makes comedies anymore. Nobody like takes women over 40 seriously in movies.

• 2:42:04Griffin Newman?

  I'm still pulling for the comeback. When I was in high school.

• 2:42:07David Sims?

  Toy Story 5?

• 2:42:08Griffin Newman?

  I'm aware. I believe she's playing the main villain.

• 2:42:10David Sims?

  Okay, that's fun.

• 2:42:11Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, Lily Pad, I think. Uh, I made a bet to my friend Jake in high school. I was like, she is going to win an Oscar.

• 2:42:18Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 2:42:19Griffin Newman?

  I'm like hauling it now like Anna Ferris.

• 2:42:21Speaker 02

  I'm a big Ferris guy, but I don't know that I would have made that one.

• 2:42:23Griffin Newman?

  It was because she had just had the small parts in Lost in Translation.

• 2:42:29Speaker 02

  She's awesome at that.

• 2:42:29Griffin Newman?

  And Brokeback Mountain.

• 2:42:31Speaker 02

  Oh, right.

• 2:42:31Griffin Newman?

  Where it's like she was in two fucking Best Picture nominees.

• 2:42:34Speaker 02

  She's got it. I guess you're right. She's kind of got it.

• 2:42:35Griffin Newman?

  Where she's got small parts and I was like, and clearly good directors recognize she's got more she can do. And I was like, someday someone's gonna find the perfect kind of like dramedy role and she'll win supporting actress. And it does feel like we've gone a little off course. I'm pulling for the comeback. There's a, there's like a very profoundly upsetting New Yorker profile on her when What's Your Number was coming out. And it was about how hard she had fought to prove that she was a movie star and how like she was the lead of four scary movies that were all big hits, but they were like, yeah, but that wasn't because of you. And she had to fight so hard to get the House Bunny. She was for so long playing like the best friend or the crazy ex-girlfriend or whatever it was, but never got to be the star of the movie. House Bunny was her thing. House Bunny

• 2:43:20Griffin Newman?

  was dumped. It was a big hit. And she was like, great, now I have fuck you power. They'll let me do what I want. And she sets up What's Your Number and the whole article is about how they were like, can you be less weird? Can you be kind of a little more?

• 2:43:33Speaker 02

  What even is what's your number?

• 2:43:34Griffin Newman?

  It's terrible.

• 2:43:34Speaker 02

  I don't even know it. It's terrible.

• 2:43:36David Sims?

  She's like, I had to marry one of the guys I've fucked.

• 2:43:39Griffin Newman?

  She finds out that she's fucked 20 guys. And they're like, if you haven't already found the one and you fuck 20 people.

• 2:43:47Speaker 02

  Body count discourse back in the day.

• 2:43:49Griffin Newman?

  You're a whore and you should be thrown into the garbage.

• 2:43:51David Sims?

  Right, so you have to pick from one of the 20.

• 2:43:53Griffin Newman?

  You can't meet a no guy. So she goes back to the previous.

• 2:43:55David Sims?

  Or whatever.

• 2:43:56Griffin Newman?

  No, it's so much worse. It's that Chris Evans is the new guy she meets who's her next door neighbor.

• 2:44:01Speaker 02

  Oh, but you can't fuck him.

• 2:44:02Griffin Newman?

  She can't fuck him because she already has 20. And then at the end of the movie, Aziz Ansari leaves a voicemail. And he's like, hey, I got your call. Actually, we never fucked. We just did hand stuff. And she's like, I'm at 19. I can fuck Chris Evans. It's directed by Mark Mylott.

• 2:44:19Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 2:44:19Griffin Newman?

  Who later becomes the main director of Succession, directs the menu.

• 2:44:23Speaker 02

  What?

• 2:44:23Griffin Newman?

  It is like the crassest, dumbest comedy. It's so fucking bad.

• 2:44:27Speaker 02

  That sucks.

• 2:44:27Griffin Newman?

  And it bombed. And they were like, never mind, you're not a movie star. And then she goes to CBS. And the crux of that article is she's like, my dream project is I have been developing comedy, single, white, female.

• 2:44:38Speaker 02

  Hell, yeah.

• 2:44:39Griffin Newman?

  And they keep going like, great, we'll give that a green light. You're of course going to play the Bridget Fonda part, right?

• 2:44:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. You'll play her grandmother.

• 2:44:46Griffin Newman?

  Right. And she's like, no, I want to be like the weird psycho. And they were like, no, you're a leading lady now. You can't play weirdos anymore. You have to be like a romantic lead.

• 2:44:55Speaker 02

  But what she would rock it.

• 2:44:56Griffin Newman?

  Whatever. She would rock.

• 2:44:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, let's bring Ferris back.

• 2:44:58Griffin Newman?

  Ferris back.

• 2:44:59David Sims?

  Uh, just to give you the other six is The Fighter, which is a great, like, like, time at the theater. That's another.

• 2:45:04Speaker 02

  Saw that with my girlfriend.

• 2:45:06David Sims?

  You guys have a good time?

• 2:45:07Speaker 02

  We did, we loved it. In fact, I remember I, it made, uh, Wahlberg's back gave me body dysmorphia. I was like, fuck, I want to have back like, I would, I was talking about how I wanted a back like Wahlberg in The Fighter for like, months after that.

• 2:45:20David Sims?

  You're like going to gyms, being like, how do I? And they're like, what are you talking about?

• 2:45:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:45:25Griffin Newman?

  Also, he's like our size. That's the other thing is he's short. He's a short king. Melissa Leo, of course, beats Hailee Steinfeld for best supporting actress.

• 2:45:34David Sims?

  Correct, correct. Number.

• 2:45:36Speaker 02

  Wow, I really, this is crazy how I thought I was checked out on culture. I don't know. I think I was just mad at Burn After, or Burn After Reading because I was dumb. How did I not see this?

• 2:45:46Griffin Newman?

  Because this year is like, uh, Social Network, King's Speech ends up winning most of the big awards. The Fighter.

• 2:45:52Speaker 02

  Best movie of all.

• 2:45:53Griffin Newman?

  Hundred Twenty Seven Hours, Kids Are All Right, True Grit. True Grit is one of the most nominated movies with zero wins.

• 2:45:59Speaker 02

  It's so weird that I missed this around this time. It's so weird. I don't know.

• 2:46:03David Sims?

  I mean, and it doesn't win because they had just, everyone had just won an Oscar. They're like, well, the Coens just won, Bridges just won. Like, you know, like, that's the reason.

• 2:46:10Griffin Newman?

  Scores disqualified because it uses so much traditional music. But like, it not winning cinematography, costume, art director.

• 2:46:17David Sims?

  Who won cinematography? Well, okay, cinematography went to Social Network, I'm pretty sure. Like, the thing is, Social Network's kind of the big.

• 2:46:25Speaker 02

  I mean, it's good, but I mean, the cinematography.

• 2:46:27David Sims?

  You're, you're.

• 2:46:28Speaker 02

  True Grit is.

• 2:46:28David Sims?

  No argument from me, my friend. I love this movie so much.

• 2:46:31Griffin Newman?

  Speech wins costume?

• 2:46:34Griffin Newman?

  Is that right?

• 2:46:34Speaker 02

  That movie sucks dick.

• 2:46:36Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:46:37David Sims?

  The whole thing with King's Speech is you're like, if that movie had won zero Oscars, then I would be like, yeah, it's a fun, the king has to do the speech. They were like, best picture of the, come on up, king. And you're like, no, come on. Like, especially a year this stacked.

• 2:46:50Speaker 02

  It's in the Green Book category.

• 2:46:51Griffin Newman?

  Yes.

• 2:46:52Speaker 02

  Of like, if it doesn't win anything, you're like, this is kind of stupid, but fun. Yeah, yeah.

• 2:46:55David Sims?

  I mean. Yeah, I mean, like, if Green Book had won the Oscars, I'd be like, that awesome movie where Vigo eats the whole pizza. Like, that was good.

• 2:47:04Griffin Newman?

  Do you remember that thing where there's?

• 2:47:05Speaker 02

  That movie's kind of good.

• 2:47:06Griffin Newman?

  The really weird room where they do the lessons in King's Speech that has those bizarre.

• 2:47:12Speaker 02

  Painting and all that.

• 2:47:12Griffin Newman?

  Cracked colored walls. Everyone's like, where did they find this location? And then guys on gay Twitter were like, uh, I know where they found it. And pulled up that there's like a ton of gay porn that was shot in that exact room.

• 2:47:23Speaker 02

  Awesome. That's fucking awesome.

• 2:47:26Griffin Newman?

  Just like Twitter was flooded with screenshots.

• 2:47:29Speaker 02

  Someone's got to do the like, the parody of a, the gay porn parody. Where every time the guy's about to suck dick, he like hesitates. And he's like, no, no, no, focus. Open your mouth and suck the dick.

• 2:47:40Griffin Newman?

  He's got a debilitating stutter that stops him from.

• 2:47:42Speaker 02

  From giving guys head.

• 2:47:45Griffin Newman?

  From deep throat.

• 2:47:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, from deep throat.

• 2:47:47Griffin Newman?

  He has to be.

• 2:47:48Speaker 02

  He can only get it in the top of his mouth.

• 2:47:50Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:47:52Griffin Newman?

  David, this is good.

• 2:47:53David Sims?

  It's very important.

• 2:47:54Griffin Newman?

  This is good.

• 2:47:55David Sims?

  I know. I agree. I'm not mad about it. I'm not at all.

• 2:48:00Griffin Newman?

  David's head is.

• 2:48:01David Sims?

  I just have to tell you that number seven at the box office is Tangled.

• 2:48:05Griffin Newman?

  Okay. Good movie. A great movie. I watch it all the time with my kid. Favorite movie of that era.

• 2:48:10David Sims?

  Number eight is, oh, right, new this week, Giant Bomb, the Jack Black Gulliver's travel.

• 2:48:14Griffin Newman?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:48:15David Sims?

  Movie.

• 2:48:15Griffin Newman?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:48:16David Sims?

  Nine is.

• 2:48:17Griffin Newman?

  Which he's said basically killed his career for like three.

• 2:48:19David Sims?

  This is such an interesting era because all the big movies I'm saying, Focker's, Gulliver's, Narnia, like suck. But then you have like True Grit, the fighter, and at number nine, Black Swan, which are like grown up ass Oscar movies that make a hundred million plus.

• 2:48:35Griffin Newman?

  You know, like the fighter got over a hundred.

• 2:48:37David Sims?

  Yes, like they're these like, you know, proper hits for grownups.

• 2:48:40Griffin Newman?

  Right.

• 2:48:40David Sims?

  Now they would all be 10 episode Hulu mini series.

• 2:48:43Griffin Newman?

  Yes, yes.

• 2:48:44David Sims?

  And number 10 at the box office, of course, is The Tourist with Jolie and Pitt.

• 2:48:48Griffin Newman?

  You're right, though. Like, the expected hits are all kind of bombing.

• 2:48:52David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:48:53Griffin Newman?

  And then actual.

• 2:48:54David Sims?

  So audiences are like, I guess I'll see the movie where the girl like rips her nails off and like makes out with Mila Kunis. This is a movie? Fine. I don't want to see Narnia.

• 2:49:02Griffin Newman?

  Humongous. That movie's awesome. That's like, this was.

• 2:49:05David Sims?

  It's just funny that mainstream America was like, ah, Black Swan, fine, I'll take a piece of that.

• 2:49:09Griffin Newman?

  It feels like this was a year where six out of the 10 best picture nominees made over a hundred million dollars.

• 2:49:14David Sims?

  It's a stacked year at the Oscars.

• 2:49:15Griffin Newman?

  Cause Black Swan, True Grit, King's Speech.

• 2:49:18David Sims?

  Yep.

• 2:49:18Griffin Newman?

  Toy Story 3, let's.

• 2:49:19David Sims?

  Fighter.

• 2:49:20Griffin Newman?

  We forget the fighter.

• 2:49:21David Sims?

  Toy Story 3. Social Network probably.

• 2:49:22Griffin Newman?

  Was like 90.

• 2:49:23David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:49:24Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:49:24David Sims?

  Of course, Winter's Bone made $400 million. Inception.

• 2:49:27Griffin Newman?

  Inception.

• 2:49:28David Sims?

  Like, there's a summer movie.

• 2:49:30Griffin Newman?

  Six of the nominees.

• 2:49:31David Sims?

  That is a huge, like, original hit, you know, and all that.

• 2:49:34Griffin Newman?

  But that's the thing that it feels like we've lost is like family together on Christmas and they're like, I heard Focker sucks. I guess we should go see the Coen Brothers Western instead.

• 2:49:43David Sims?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:49:44Griffin Newman?

  Today you'd be like, I heard Focker sucks. I guess we stay home and watch YouTube. Exactly. Yeah, you're right. Absolutely. This was the last gasp. Let's try seeing something a little off the beaten path. Yeah. Although Christmas still might be the one time.

• 2:49:57David Sims?

  Christmas is the best time.

• 2:49:58Griffin Newman?

  It's the one, because people are tired of staying at home. Yeah, yeah. With all the family. And it's such a tradition of like.

• 2:50:04Speaker 02

  Go see a movie.

• 2:50:05Griffin Newman?

  I mean, Nosferatu made a ton of money at Christmas.

• 2:50:07Speaker 02

  I loved it. I loved seeing that shit.

• 2:50:10David Sims?

  I'm so excited for that. Uh, like for.

• 2:50:13Griffin Newman?

  For what?

• 2:50:14Speaker 02

  For Vervolts.

• 2:50:15David Sims?

  Yeah.

• 2:50:15Griffin Newman?

  You're excited for Vervolts?

• 2:50:17Speaker 02

  See, that, that again, that to me is kinda like.

• 2:50:19Griffin Newman?

  Heredication.

• 2:50:20Speaker 02

  That, the way we're talking about the Yiddish policemen's eating is too on the nose.

• 2:50:24David Sims?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Him being like, they do fucking.

• 2:50:25Speaker 02

  Where we'll make, which by the way, I will, again, we'll be there day one, but it is like, where, like, it's not even.

• 2:50:32Griffin Newman?

  The announcement of next Christmas, Robert Eggers, fast-tracking, focused features, Volts with a V.

• 2:50:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:50:40Griffin Newman?

  I was just like, my guy, don't play into the.

• 2:50:42Speaker 02

  I know.

• 2:50:43David Sims?

  But that's all he wants to do.

• 2:50:45Griffin Newman?

  You're cruising for a.

• 2:50:46David Sims?

  What if he was like, I wanna make a movie about like, the black experience at the sort of Harlem Renaissance? People would be like, you don't wanna do like werewolves, maybe in like Eastern Europe?

• 2:50:56Griffin Newman?

  I do think sometimes, though, those kinds of guys gotta fucking whiff that hard, do something they shouldn't do so that when they go back to Volts, people are like, thank you.

• 2:51:05David Sims?

  Maybe the producer advice is like, hey, keep that in your pocket, do something weird.

• 2:51:10Griffin Newman?

  You want people asking flirt rather than like this shit again?

• 2:51:14Speaker 02

  And I, I love, I love Eggers and my favorite, but my favorite part is like, I wanted to just stay in the market that, uh, Holt is running through to get to work. Like, like, he is so good at making these worlds real.

• 2:51:29Griffin Newman?

  It's like the Coens in that same way where you're just like, fuck, I'm thinking about this guy in the background.

• 2:51:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, dude, the Roma shit, like that, the inn and they're dancing and all that shit like, oh, it's, that stuff is so, and the rest of the movies are great too, and you know, but goddamn, he is so good at the world, man. He's so good.

• 2:51:47Griffin Newman?

  Yeah, no, that's.

• 2:51:48Speaker 02

  In a way that he might, he might be one of the only guys that's better than the Coens at it.

• 2:51:51Griffin Newman?

  They're in the same zone.

• 2:51:53Speaker 02

  The Coens are better at the little characters being more fleshed out, but the actual like, setting and the design and all that kinda shit, he might, I think he's better.

• 2:52:03Griffin Newman?

  Well, he's also, I mean, his whole thing is just like obsessive research.

• 2:52:06Speaker 02

  Which is, it's awesome. That's my fit, you know, like even, like sometimes I want a little more action, a little more meat from his shit, but man, this, the worlds are so good.

• 2:52:15David Sims?

  Nosferatu for me, I genuinely enjoy, but the, the castle stuff, who going to the castle and getting fucked with? The weird villagers, the actual, all that shit, I was just like, this rocks. Once he went back and he was like, there's a vampire coming. I was like, that's fine. But I really just liked him going to see Count Orlok.

• 2:52:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was fucking awesome.

• 2:52:35David Sims?

  And then them having dinner in order like being like, that picture is so beautiful, your wife, you know, all that shit.

• 2:52:40Griffin Newman?

  And you know the thing about.

• 2:52:41Speaker 02

  Your wife's pussy hair. Did your wife bring any pussy hair for me?

• 2:52:48Griffin Newman?

  She kinda does, right? Yeah. Just walk in on your fucking dead wife entangled in a fucking Nosferatu's dead body.

• 2:52:56David Sims?

  They died fucking. Turbo cocked. Uh, good.

• 2:53:00Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:53:01David Sims?

  I guess we dealt with that. Bury them together.

• 2:53:07David Sims?

  All right, come on, let's wrap this up, man.

• 2:53:09Griffin Newman?

  You know the thing about Graff Overlock, though?

• 2:53:12Speaker 02

  What's up? He loves to pour the cork.

• 2:53:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's blood in there, though.

• 2:53:19Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:53:19Speaker 02

  Blood's in the thing.

• 2:53:20Griffin Newman?

  On top of pull the cork, another thing I love is anytime you watch an old timey movie where characters talk about drink.

• 2:53:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:53:28Griffin Newman?

  Singular.

• 2:53:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:53:29David Sims?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 2:53:29Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:53:30David Sims?

  You've resorted to drink.

• 2:53:31Griffin Newman?

  Well, he's addicted to drink.

• 2:53:33Speaker 02

  I mean, there was no water.

• 2:53:34Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:53:34Speaker 02

  You kinda had to just drink really shitty fucking water down beer and whiskey.

• 2:53:38Griffin Newman?

  But it's never me drinking, it's not he drinks a lot.

• 2:53:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:53:42Griffin Newman?

  He's a man of drink.

• 2:53:43Speaker 02

  He drinks, yeah, he's a man of drink, absolutely.

• 2:53:45Griffin Newman?

  Singular. Uh, Stavi, thank you for being here.

• 2:53:47Speaker 02

  Guys, thank you so much, yeah.

• 2:53:48David Sims?

  Truly, a pleasure.

• 2:53:49Speaker 02

  This was so fun, I love the show, I discovered it.

• 2:53:52Griffin Newman?

  Very absurd.

• 2:53:53Speaker 02

  I discovered it at a bad time and I always.

• 2:53:55David Sims?

  That's when people find blank.

• 2:53:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, I was at my absolute lowest. I had gone through every other possible podcast. It was the NBA offseason, there was nothing to, there were no pods to listen to.

• 2:54:05David Sims?

  Zach Closeout taking a break.

• 2:54:07Griffin Newman?

  I think Hattie started listening the second they took her arm off. That's how she got so miserable.

• 2:54:11David Sims?

  I actually wanna know, right, well, we're like, how did you find this season show?

• 2:54:14Speaker 02

  No, I literally was just like, uh, at a point where I had been, it was like, I had worked so hard for so long and I had gotten so, like, fat and addicted to drugs. And I needed to go dry out in Baltimore and I truly was, I couldn't be with my own thoughts. And I also am like, in the last couple of years, I've really, I've always been kind of a movie fan, whatever, obviously, like, being a little kid and my, we would go to the library and get movies that way, but, you know, my family was, you know, we're. Greek and all the media we consumed was not, we were never huge movie people. And you know, I I've been trying to get into it more and more. And so, yeah, that summer I was like, I have to lose weight. I don't want to be with my thoughts. I want to also maybe act a little bit. I want to learn how movies are made, whatever.

• 2:54:59Speaker 02

  I started, I would watch any, I would listen to like movie pods and you kind of, there's not that many of them. And then I just found, I was just looking up. That's how we get there, baby. Even though we have like afterwards, it's like, it's clear we have so many mutual friends. And it's kind of weird. There was never an intersection before that. And we, we were both kind of in that weird 2016. Like we started Come Town, the Doughboys. There's a weird 2016 wave of podcasts that we were all in. Second wave where we were all kind of like, there's a lot of podcasts, this won't work. Comedy Bang Bang and Maron already exists. It's like there's eight podcasts. This American Life, Comedy Bang Bang and Maron, nobody else. Yeah. There's no room for anyone else.

• 2:55:39Speaker 02

  We're all done. And so, but for whatever reason, and I found it and I just fucking, yeah, I love the show and any, you know, it also kind of, the way you guys go about it with the actual directors is really fucking cool. So, yeah, huge fan.

• 2:55:51Griffin Newman?

  We were, we were talking about how much we love you and how great you were on Doughboys. And then I was doing the Doughboys live show in DC. And you were in the lobby of the hotel and you were like, I saw the show was happening. I was visiting my parents. I'll just come by. And we ended up hanging out for the night with my father as well.

• 2:56:06Speaker 02

  The man, by the way.

• 2:56:07Griffin Newman?

  Who was in town for a funeral and immediately was like, this guy's the best. Who is this guy?

• 2:56:13Speaker 02

  Oh, man. You are a Pete face. Like, you're the kind of guy, people.

• 2:56:17Griffin Newman?

  Truly calls you his hero now, but you immediately said, I'm a fan of the podcast. And I was like, that's crazy. We'd have you on anytime. And I said, we're doing co-ins and you'd like grab me by the shoulders and you, I've been watching all of them on the bus. I'm so ready to go.

• 2:56:32Speaker 02

  I had just watched, yeah, we just watched No Country. We had just watched the one I, uh, Miller's Crossing. Yeah. Uh, which huge favorite, you know, uh, you got, I, I understand you got somebody with a similar, uh, who's a similar, a big deal in the movie world as I am. Kind of someone right around the same cachet.

• 2:56:48Griffin Newman?

  That episode has happened.

• 2:56:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, hopefully it's happened. Uh, but no, I, I love the Coen so much. And you know, and this was so, this was so. You gotta come back. I'd love to. You're the best. Anytime. You're a New Yorker, right? Yeah, I'm here, baby.

• 2:56:59Griffin Newman?

  I also say this too. I feel like.

• 2:57:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, hell yeah.

• 2:57:01Griffin Newman?

  I, I keep, I've heard several stories of very successful stand ups and people like you who have huge followings. Right. Who get offered like small parts in good movies with good directors and are like, why the fuck would I do that? I'd make more money on the road.

• 2:57:15Speaker 02

  Oh, I lose money acting without question.

• 2:57:17Griffin Newman?

  Exactly. But talking to you at the bar after the Doughboys show.

• 2:57:21Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:57:21Griffin Newman?

  You were just sort of like, why isn't ever my position wanting to do this?

• 2:57:24Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 2:57:24Griffin Newman?

  Why wouldn't you want to be a guy who can pop up for a week?

• 2:57:27Speaker 02

  Dude, that's.

• 2:57:28Griffin Newman?

  And be part of a fucking great movie and work with great people.

• 2:57:31Speaker 02

  It's the dream.

• 2:57:32Griffin Newman?

  And I love that you're entering that stage of your career. And I like watching all these Coen movies. I'm like, you're, you're the kind of guy.

• 2:57:39Speaker 02

  Polito is who I want to be.

• 2:57:41Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:57:41Speaker 02

  Like when I see him pop up, I'm like, that's the.

• 2:57:43Griffin Newman?

  I think you're on the runway.

• 2:57:44Speaker 02

  That guy.

• 2:57:45Griffin Newman?

  I think you're on the runway.

• 2:57:46Speaker 02

  Thanks, man. Yeah. I mean, by the time this airs, I'll have been panned and begone. I haven't seen it. I haven't seen it. So I am so worried. I'm real. I'm in the movie. It was so good. Ooh, this fucking.

• 2:57:56Griffin Newman?

  But you were telling me that you like went to your reps and you were like, is it crazy that I think I could be good at doing a couple of scenes in a drama?

• 2:58:03Speaker 02

  I think I could, yeah.

• 2:58:04Griffin Newman?

  Can you position me for this? Which I think people in your position today are not doing.

• 2:58:09Speaker 02

  That's my whole, like, it's crazy to have gotten this movie and I don't know, maybe my great grandfather owed Yorgo's great grandfather a goat or something. And that's the real story is fu- he's just like, uh, some villager debts have been cleared this way. But I thought if I'm lucky in 10 years, maybe I get to be, you know, a guy who has a very memorable scene in a diner in a PTA movie.

• 2:58:33Griffin Newman?

  Well, at least set the goal.

• 2:58:34Speaker 02

  That's the absolute dream of what I want to go to. And so I hope I didn't blow it and, uh, somebody else has let me in a movie that I don't know if that's out, you know, I don't know if that.

• 2:58:44Griffin Newman?

  But it's very exciting.

• 2:58:45Speaker 02

  But it's really cool.

• 2:58:46Griffin Newman?

  Yeah.

• 2:58:46Speaker 02

  And yeah, I love, cause yeah, dude, you grow the fir- your first, and even through comedy, your fir- my first exposure to comedy is comedy is John Candy is, is, you know, Chris Farley movies, Eddie Murphy. It's just like, and then you grow up loving Sandler.

• 2:59:01Griffin Newman?

  And then you basically reverse engineer, how did these people? People get there. Like for me, like discovering stand up and sketch and all these things was being like, so where does this guy come from?

• 2:59:09Speaker 02

  Where this guy come from?

• 2:59:10Griffin Newman?

  Why they just let this guy be in movies?

• 2:59:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:59:12Griffin Newman?

  Right. And you're like, he was in dirty, dirty clubs for 10 years.

• 2:59:15Speaker 02

  Absolutely. So, yeah, it's funny. It's, it's, I still don't, I don't understand how any part of my career has happened. And this, the least of all. It's like stand up. It's like, all right, you just fucking, you eat enough shit. And there's only, there's only like a hundred people who are this suicidal. And have decided they're willing to sacrifice everything that they'll just work clubs or, you know, do nothing else. Like you should just go get a regular job instead of do stand up. It's a horrible lifestyle.

• 2:59:43Griffin Newman?

  Oh, we're booking people.

• 2:59:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. But acting is, I don't understand how it's happening, but yeah, please, hopefully I didn't blow it in Begonia. And I would love to just be, and the Coens are the exact type of, I mean, there's so many dream.

• 2:59:55Griffin Newman?

  You need them, you need them to reunite just in time to ask for who, who's the polito of this generation?

• 3:00:01Speaker 02

  Dude, that's all I want, dude. I just some, I can play, I can play bully, like bullies or cocks. That's kind of my like, I can, that's my, that's my kind of, you know, zone.

• 3:00:12David Sims?

  I know, this is gonna sound rude, but it's not like you do have the vibe of some of the, your ghost like just dreamed up. You know what I mean? Like Yorgos is like, I'm gonna write down another weirdo. And it's like, he's just imagining you.

• 3:00:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I'm a, I'm a definitely a, the, I was toothless for a while. And that's when I was sure my acting career was gonna take off. I was like, I'm a fat weird toothless guy.

• 3:00:34Griffin Newman?

  It was a distant close.

• 3:00:35Speaker 02

  Throw me in there, but, uh, you know, whatever. I appreciate it, guys.

• 3:00:38David Sims?

  Getting your teeth fixed is an important part of becoming a movie star.

• 3:00:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And, uh, I don't know when this comes out, but I think.

• 3:00:45David Sims?

  It's in, uh, October, right? Right when the movie's coming out, October 19th.

• 3:00:48Speaker 02

  So I'm also gonna be in Austin, Texas, and I'm going to be in Boston at the, well, Austin, I'm gonna be in November. And Boston, I'm gonna be in December. Uh, so yeah, come see me. I'm also still working on a, on a special that I'm, oh, actually, I got a lot of stuff coming up, actually. I'm gonna be in fucking Memphis, Huntsville, Chattanooga, Knoxville, Asheville, Greensboro, Wilmington. Myrtle Beach. Yeah, I did a. Bus tour this year and I'm doing a minivan tour. Yeah, I was like, I did a really prestigious like bus theater tour, did the Chicago Theater, 3,000 people. Now I'm like, give me the fucking Comedy Cabana in Myrtle Beach. Let's get back to our roots.

• 3:01:28Griffin Newman?

  You're doing a little red wagon tour.

• 3:01:30Speaker 02

  Dude, it's gonna be, yeah, literally. Dude, I'm basically gonna be, I'm gonna be in a fucking minivan for you. I'm in the, I'm, I'm betting money it's gonna be a Chrysler Pacifica throughout the southeast and then Austin, Texas on the 22nd, Boston on the, uh, this, on December 12th and 13th. But yeah, come see me do stand up, watch a movie. I have a, if you got, you know, you guys have big movie fans, obviously. I made an indie movie called Let's Start a Cult. It's on Hulu. You can watch it there. Uh, so yeah, that's, that's where you can find me. Thanks, guys.

• 3:02:01Griffin Newman?

  You're the best and we look forward to having you on again.

• 3:02:03Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 3:02:04David Sims?

  Yeah, come back.

• 3:02:04Speaker 02

  Come do Stavi's World anytime, boy.

• 3:02:06David Sims?

  Happily. We gotta shout out Eldis.

• 3:02:08Speaker 02

  Eldis, yeah. You guys are in a, you, yeah, you're in a fraternity of elite producers with El, yeah, Ben and Eldis. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You got, please, come do, come do the pod. We're gonna be, we're gonna be moving into Manhattan, I think, soon. So.

• 3:02:21David Sims?

  That's fine. I'll go to the big city.

• 3:02:23Speaker 02

  Come to the Big Apple. Yeah.

• 3:02:26Griffin Newman?

  Thank you all for listening. Please remember to rate, review and subscribe. Tune in next week for Inside Lewin Davis.

• 3:02:33David Sims?

  Nope. Next week, I guess we're covering a House of Dynamite.

• 3:02:36Griffin Newman?

  Okay.

• 3:02:36David Sims?

  The new Kathryn Bigelow movie about nukes.

• 3:02:39Griffin Newman?

  At the time we're recording this, we think Kathryn Bigelow's Netflix movie is coming out around this time and if not, we'll have changed this and you won't be listening to this. Yeah. And as always, time comes for us all.

• 3:02:55Speaker 03

  Blank Check with Griffin and David is hosted by Griffin Newman and David Sims. Our executive producer is me, Ben Hostly. Our creative producer is Marie Bardy Salinas and our associate producer is AJ McKeon. This show is mixed and edited by AJ McKeon and Alan Smithy. Research by JJ Birch. Our theme song is by Lain Montgomery and the Great American Novel with additional music by Alex Mitchell. Artwork by Joe Bowen, Holly Moss and Pat Reynolds. Our production assistant is Minic. Special thanks to David Cho, Jordan Fish and Nate Patterson for their production help. Head over to blankcheckpod.com for links to all of the real nerdy shit. Join our Patreon Blank Check Special Features for exclusive franchise commentaries and bonus episodes.

• 3:03:40Speaker 03

  Follow us on social at Blank Check Pod. Subscribe to our weekly newsletter, Checkbook, on Substack. This podcast is created and produced by Blank Check Productions.