La La Anthony ON: Breaking the Cycle of Self- Sabotage & Ways to Turn Rejection into Redirection

Can we transform rejection into a powerful force for redirection? What if setbacks were not roadblocks but rather signposts pointing us toward growth? Today in On Purpose, we have a special guest, La La Anthony, whose story is a shining example of self-discovery, resilience, and making a positive impact on the world. La La Anthony is a talented actress, TV personality, bestselling author, and a passionate advocate for prison reform. She's not just about the glitz and glamor but also about creating positive change. In this episode, we'll dive into La La's life, her experiences, and what she's learned along the way. We'll discover the importance of being true to yourself, even when the world tries to push you in different directions. From personal challenges to finding one's authentic self, La La's journey is a lesson in self-acceptance and embracing who you are. We'll explore her efforts in supporting prison reform and how she empowers children to express themselves. La La's story is a reminder that you can overcome obstacles and pursue your dreams while staying true to your authentic self. Join us as we journey through La La Anthony's remarkable life, filled with resilience, compassion, and the transformative power of being yourself. In this interview, you’ll learn: How to prioritize self care without feeling guilt The unique balance of being both a parent and a best friend to your child The transformative power of love and a change in environment Insights on coping with criticism and negativity Remember, each of us has the potential to overcome challenges, prioritize self-care, and achieve our dreams while staying true to our authentic selves. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty Thank you to Soho Works 10 Jay in Dumbo for hosting us for this episode. What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 01:37 Healing is Messy 04:33 Creating Your Own Happiness 07:33 The Reality Behind the Spotlight 09:31 True Friendship in Life's Ups and Downs 14:01 Prioritizing Self-Care Without Guilt 19:20 Becoming Your Child’s Best Friend 25:17 The Passion of Creating and Producing 28:33 How Rejection Shapes Success 35:51 Breaking Free from the People-Pleasing Cycle 41:23 La La's Prison Reform Advocacy 51:21 Navigating Life's Unexpected Turns 58:09 Discovering Self-Love and New Beginnings Episode Resources: La La Anthony | Instagram La La Anthony | Twitter La La Anthony | Facebook See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jay Shetty?

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• 0:44Jay Shetty?

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• 1:29Jay Shetty?

  AG1 Next Gen is one of those easy habits to keep. It's the clinically-backed, comprehensive daily health drink that supports your gut health, energy production, and foundational nutrition all in one scoop. AG1's ingredients are sourced from quality partners for absorption, potency, and nutrient density to deliver the foundational nutrition your body needs. And alongside a proper diet, AG1 Next Gen meets 94% of nutrient requirements and it's clinically shown to enrich the gut microbiome. For a limited time, save 20% on your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro at drinkag1.com/onpurpose. That's drinkag1.com/onpurpose.

• 2:17Jay Shetty?

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• 3:50Jay Shetty?

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• 4:31La La Anthony?

  I grew up in a world where it's so competitive. Even if I'm not the most talented, I'm the hardest worker. Until you're burnt out and you don't have anything else to give, and then what? Look, I'm trying to talk to you about a job opportunity. Do I look unemployed to you?

• 4:43Speaker 02

  You are emerging in Hollywood in such a real way.

• 4:46La La Anthony?

  Give it up for Lala Anthony. When my whole marriage came crumbling down and I was in that bed, I was there by myself. Nobody gets married and says, I'm getting divorced. You get married because you feel like you found your person and this is what the rest of your life is going to be like. What can I do? I have to adjust.

• 5:01Jay Shetty?

  Before we jump into this episode, I'd like to invite you to join this community to hear more interviews that will help you become happier, healthier, and more healed. All I want you to do is click on the subscribe button. I love your support. It's incredible to see all your comments and we're just getting started. I can't wait to go on this journey with you. Thank you so much for subscribing. It means the world to me.

• 5:23Speaker 02

  The bestselling author and host. The number one health and wellness podcast.

• 5:27Speaker 03

  On Purpose with Jay Shetty.

• 5:30Jay Shetty?

  Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose. Thank you so much for trusting me with your ears and eyes and for spending your valuable time here to listen, learn, and grow. Today's guest is someone that we've had on the show before, but she came on the show so early on as an avid supporter, someone who is cheering me on. I was so grateful to have that conversation. Clips of it have gone viral over the years, again and again and again. And I'm so grateful that I get to sit down again with her right now in New York City. Lala is an actress, producer, New York Times bestselling author, and entrepreneur. Lala is best known for her role on the hit show Power, which wrapped its sixth and final season on Starz in 2020.

• 6:13Jay Shetty?

  Lala joined the cast of Showtime's The Shy in 2020 and later received an NAACP Image Award nomination in the Outstanding Guest Performance category in 2022. Lala has teamed up with Issa Rae to executive produce the forthcoming horror comedy for Universal Pictures, Juju. Please welcome to the show, Lala. Lala, thank you so much for doing this. Honestly, like.

• 6:38La La Anthony?

  I will always show up for you.

• 6:39Jay Shetty?

  You literally, like, you came on the show when, like, I don't even know anyone knew what the show was. And you, I think we just connected online and we'd started messaging and I was so grateful when you came on and since then we've stayed in touch.

• 6:51La La Anthony?

  Yeah, we've always stayed in touch.

• 6:53Jay Shetty?

  It's just, yeah, thank you.

• 6:53La La Anthony?

  And I always say you're my friend and someone I could depend on and you always. Say the right things at like you just said something to me right now. I was like, I needed to hear that. I needed to hear that. Like today's been sometimes one of those days. And I was like, I needed that. You always like know exactly what to say.

• 7:10Jay Shetty?

  You're very sweet and I appreciate that. And I wanna, let's start there actually. Like one thing I've been encouraging my friends to do, people that I love, people I care about, is reflecting on difficult things they've got through. Difficult things they've broken through because I think often we do a lot of difficult things. And I realized this through my mom, actually. So my mom is a superwoman. She has done so many difficult things in her life, but she sees them as normal.

• 7:36La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 7:36Jay Shetty?

  So she never stops to think, oh, I'm powerful and I'm strong.

• 7:39La La Anthony?

  It's just the part of life.

• 7:40Jay Shetty?

  Just a part of life. So what's something difficult or hard that you've done in the last 12 months or recently that you want to take a moment to just honor yourself for?

• 7:50La La Anthony?

  That is so nice. I should honor myself. I think, you know, learning that healing is messy. That's something that I'm dealing with and it comes and goes. It's not always there, but understanding that there's no time limit on healing and giving myself credit for healing and going through everything that I've been through. And learning that I don't always have to act like everything's okay. If it's not, I have a tendency to do that. Like it's one thing to not let people see you sweat, which I do understand that and you don't need to put all your business on social media or whatever. But it's okay to feel things and understand that healing is messy. So my mom sent me something recently that was like, you know, be kind to yourself.

• 8:35La La Anthony?

  Give yourself grace because healing is messy. As soon as you think like, oh, I'm done with that. I'm over that. All of a sudden it's like, well, why is this still making me feel like that? Or you hear something or see something and like, why am I still a little bothered by that? And I hear you talk about this, you know, there's no like timeframe, like, okay, once it's been two months, you're done with whatever the difficult thing was. You shouldn't even be thinking about it anymore. It could be years and something could still pop up and trigger you or whatever. And being kind to yourself during those periods. So I want to honor myself for just finally understanding healing is messy and not being so hard on myself on certain things to not say, you should have been done with that already. Why are you still thinking about that? Or why did that still bother you? It's life. We're human. We have feelings. Things happen.

• 9:18Jay Shetty?

  As you said when you walked in, life is life.

• 9:20La La Anthony?

  Life is lifeing. Life is lifeing. And you know, there's so many blessings in this beautiful life and I'm blessed to have the life that I have. And I'm constantly, you know, thanking God for this beautiful life. And sometimes you feel ungrateful or like, what do you have to complain about? Like, you have a beautiful life, you're doing well, might not have some of the financial troubles or issues that a lot of people are going through. That I have had, you know, before in my life. But it doesn't shield you from feelings and going through things. And I think a lot of time, people kind of confuse that.

• 9:55Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I think different platforms and different levels have different problems. And they keep changing.

• 10:02La La Anthony?

  Definitely.

• 10:03Jay Shetty?

  The problems you have today weren't the problems you had then, and the problems you had then are not problems you have today. I feel like healing is an interesting word because everyone's looking at what happens on the outside. But what do you think you're trying to heal on the inside? Like, what have you discovered about what you are trying to heal?

• 10:19La La Anthony?

  I think on the inside, I'm just trying to heal a person who probably has dealt with feelings of like abandonment. A person who has dealt with feelings of not feeling good enough or definitely always having the questions of like, why me? Why did this have to happen to me? Why me? Why did I have to go through this? I give so much good in the world. I do so much for so many people. Like, why do I have to suffer or go through what I feel like at times is some of the hardest things to go through, but still keep a brave face? Still keep a smile. So, understanding that, like, I really do believe when people say, you know, that God gives his toughest battles to his strongest soldiers. And I remind myself of that, like, you went through it because you could and you come out better and people can learn from you.

• 11:04La La Anthony?

  And this can help somebody else. And I just have to remind myself of those things because you do get caught up in the why me? And like, look at everyone else. They have this, they have that. Why me? Why am I? You know, whatever it is. So just getting better at that, I think.

• 11:18Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. And when you talk to people, because I'm assuming that, you know, sometimes when we have that view of like, oh, they have it all, or they have it all. I'm sure you talk to people behind the scenes and realize they don't have it all.

• 11:29La La Anthony?

  Right, right.

• 11:29Jay Shetty?

  And so then how does that make you feel when you realize, oh, wait a minute, they don't have it all?

• 11:33La La Anthony?

  Yeah, I mean, it doesn't make me feel good. I'm not wishing for anyone to be struggling or not happy, but you just realize that things are just not always what they seem. And you know, in the world of social media, in the world of just constantly like looking at everyone else, whether it's how they look, their bodies or their lives and saying, oh, I wish that could be me. It's like, it's not reality. You don't know what people are dealing with. You don't know what people go home to. You don't know what's happening on the inside. And sometimes you do know because you'll hear things or see things and you're like, oh, I thought this person had like the perfect life. Now they're whatever, you know? So it's just like really honing in on making yourself happy, figuring out what it is that you need and not comparing or always looking at something else. Because

• 12:16La La Anthony?

  if we do that, I just feel like you'll never be happy and you'll never be satisfied because there's always going to be somebody that looks better, dresses better, younger, more talented, whatever it is. Like, so if you're looking for a reason to knock yourself down, you're gonna find it. Like, it's not that hard. You're gonna find it. So you have to be whole within yourself. And I am confident within myself. I'm not insecure. I'm confident. And I do walk with a certain level of confidence. So that part I'm good at. Dealing with the kind of just like, wow, like, why me? Do certain things happen to? I'm still, you know, pushing through that and learning every day. Like, life is about learning. I don't think you're supposed to ever have it all figured out. You strike me as somebody that has it all figured out, but you're learning every day. And I think when we have these

• 13:01La La Anthony?

  conversations, you learn from us and vice versa. Like, it's a constant learning experience.

• 13:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I'm constantly trying. It's really interesting, isn't it? When you are in a position of influence, people often assume that you do have it all figured out.

• 13:15La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 13:15Jay Shetty?

  And I'm constantly, I think people who listen to the podcast, they know me very deeply and intimately because they hear me say, I struggled with this this week, or this is something I'm going through. But if someone just sees a post on social media, they think, oh, yeah, everything must be perfect. And I find that. I encourage everyone, and this is why you coming on the podcast is so great, because I encourage everyone to study people they follow a bit deeper. Not to take them down or to think happy that they've got problems too. Not that reason, but the reason of like, when you really study someone or you get to know someone, you start to realize we're all actually in a much more similar place.

• 13:50La La Anthony?

  Right, it's so true. And what I've learned in my journey of life is you start realizing, no matter how much money, how much status, or whatever, like my friends that I grew up with when I had, you know, nothing, are going through similar issues as friends of mine who have all the money in the world, all the success, all the... People are people. What you deal with every day is what you deal with every day. Money, status doesn't change that. And I think we live in a society where people automatically assume money fixes everything, or influence fixes everything, or fame fixes everything, not understanding that there are so many amazing things that come with it. I'm not gonna sit here and be like, oh, being successful, being famous, being whatever is like the worst thing in the world. I'm not that person. I'm so grateful for my success, my fame, my influence, and I don't, I don't take it lightly.

• 14:35La La Anthony?

  But it doesn't mean that it protects me or stops me from dealing with other things. And fame, influence comes with other sets of problems. You know, people feeling like they can criticize you, people feeling like your life is an open book and they can say anything. A lot of us, when we go through things, the whole world doesn't have to know about it. When people like us go through things, it's open for discussion for the whole world and everyone has an opinion. And that's not easy either. So you just have to continue to kinda strengthen yourself to be able to deal with, you know, all of that that comes with it.

• 15:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I love what you said there. Like, I've thought about that a lot too, because, you know, last time you came, we were tracking your whole career journey. Like, you've done, you've hustled, you've worked hard, you've done so much to get to where you are today, and I wanna get to that. But for me, as I've been on this journey, I've been reflecting on what's changed over time as my external situations changed, and what makes me feel protected, and you use that word protection. And I've realized that, of course, we have to have our internal protection of how we feel about ourselves, our confidence, our own practices. But I've found that the thing that makes me feel the most protected... Is knowing the people around me who really know me and how much closer we get through that process.

• 15:50La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 15:50Jay Shetty?

  Like, I have to take so much strength in the fact that the people around me, not only do they have my back, but they actually know me and understand me at a core. And I kind of take a lot of energy from that. Do you do the same?

• 16:01La La Anthony?

  I take so much energy from that. I'm like, the people who know they know, the people that I need to depend on, they're always there. I'm blessed to have an amazing family, amazing group of friends that are like, ride or die, that I know are there no matter what. And it's something that I don't take lightly. So it's not about proving to the world anything. Like, if my core group gets it, knows me inside and out, knows my ups, knows my downs, and are there for me, that's the energy I pull from as well.

• 16:28Jay Shetty?

  I want to talk to you about friendship. I think a lot of people feel quite, even when you're close friends, and I'm sure you've felt this, it's hard to open up about things that are going wrong in your life. And I think a lot of people who are listening or watching, that's something that they can relate to, where it's like, I have my friends, but I don't know how to tell them

• 16:44La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 16:45Jay Shetty?

  that I'm going through this. Or, I know they'd care about me, but I don't want them to feel sorry for me.

• 16:49La La Anthony?

  Yeah, that's it too.

• 16:50Jay Shetty?

  Or maybe they're going through so much stuff that I don't want to put my stuff on them.

• 16:54La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 16:54Jay Shetty?

  How have you managed to keep strong relationships as you've grown in life, as you've built your career? How have you managed to keep that core instead of losing it as you get more busy?

• 17:06La La Anthony?

  I think that my friendships have gotten even stronger because of those moments. I don't base my friendships off of, you know, this person has only been around when everything's been great. Or we only talk about sunshine and flowers and cupcakes. Like, friends have to be there through everything. And you have to be able to be okay with being raw and real with people that you consider your friend, and don't throw that word around lightly. If you're saying, "This is my friend, this is my go-to", you should be able to share whatever's happening in your life, whether it's good or bad. And those are the things that bond you, you know, through those. I remember the friends that were there for me when I was going through my divorce, when I was publicly, you know, going through what I was going through as a result of what happened in my marriage. Like, I remember my friends that were there.

• 17:49La La Anthony?

  I remember when my son was really young and had to have surgery and who was there in that moment. Like, I remember all of that, and those were... The strengthening moments of our friendship. Now, the fun stuff is great, too. I remember my friends who've been on vacation with me and got drunk and had a great time. But it's a balance. You know, the real friendships had a mix of all of that stuff. Because that's what life is. Life is not always just fun and games. Life is up and down and up and down. That's what life is.

• 18:18Jay Shetty?

  Was there anything that a friend said to you or guidance you heard when you were going through a divorce that really helped or that really stayed with you or that you kind of carry around in your heart?

• 18:28La La Anthony?

  Just not to blame myself. You know, this isn't your fault, not to blame myself. That always kind of stuck with me because it's easy to just blame yourself or get down on yourself or what was it, you know, that I did? And when I say not blaming yourself, I'm not saying don't take accountability for whatever you might have had to do with the situation. Like, it's important to sit back and say, okay, where could I have been better? Because life is about being better and learning. You don't want to just say, oh, this happened, it had nothing to do with me. You want to understand, like, where could I have done better? Or where did maybe I fall short on some things? But that's different than blaming yourself for what happened. And I think by taking accountability,

• 19:09La La Anthony?

  I was able to grow and become a better person for whatever happens in my life in the future. You don't go through these experiences not to learn. Then what was the point? Like, you don't go through these experiences to then duplicate the same issues in your next relationship or your next marriage or whatever it is. That's not what that was there for. It was to learn, to get better, and then to apply that knowledge to the next situation, whether it's a friendship, relationship, marriage, whatever it is.

• 19:36Jay Shetty?

  I love what you brought out there, and I want everyone to just take note of that because I think we think we either have to take full responsibility or no responsibility. So we either blame the other person or we blame ourselves. And it's only either or. And the truth is, it's so much more balanced where it's like... I don't want to blame myself and beat myself up because that's going to send me down

• 19:59La La Anthony?

  Yeah, spiral.

• 19:59Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, terrible spiral. At the same time, I'm not going to sit here and just blame everything on the other person because that's not true. And there's accountability on both sides. And so let me look at, how can I be better? But how can I not beat myself up? What is it that you think you learned? Or what about you do you think has become better or healed? Or what have you worked on because of that shift in your life?

• 20:21La La Anthony?

  Um, just a balance, you know, understanding balance. I'm such a career driven, work driven person that that could just take over my life. And that becomes what's, you know, the most important to me outside of my son. There's never been anything that's more important than Cayenne. And you know this, you just get caught up in the work and next thing you know, friends or partners or whatever are feeling neglected or like, I just feel like you never have time or you're not making them feel special in their, you know, moments and, and being there for them. Cause it's like, you gotta film one more podcast. I gotta go to set. I gotta film one more episode. I gotta go do this really fast, but it'll be quick and I'll come right back, you know? And then you realize when people, friends as well, are feeling like neglected in those departments, problems can happen because of that.

• 21:04La La Anthony?

  You start looking for other ways to fulfill that void and that, that need. And that's how things happen. So again, it's not blaming myself, but just being aware of things that happen and, and finding that, that balance and getting better at that balance. And I need the balance, Jay, for myself. It's not even for a partner, for myself, because I should be okay with having a personal life and a professional life and not feel guilty. I was the person that if I went on a vacation, I felt guilty, like, I gotta work. I can't be doing this. Like, I don't want people to think I'm just having a good time. I should be on set. I should be doing, and like really beating myself up. Meanwhile, I work my ass off. I should be able to take a vacation. If I want to take a month off, I should be able to do that. I've worked, I've been in this industry since I was 16 years old.

• 21:49La La Anthony?

  I should be able to do that. I have enough equity in the game with all I've given it to be able to do that. But I still would feel so guilty over that. So that's the balance that I'm talking about.

• 22:01Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, no, I'm really glad that you went that step further of like, it's giving yourself to your friends, a potential partner, but also to yourself.

• 22:08La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 22:08Jay Shetty?

  What do you think it was for you that blocked? You from giving yourself that permission. And the reason I asked that is because I was looking at the studies in the U.S. And it was saying how so many people don't take all of their leave.

• 22:19La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 22:20Jay Shetty?

  From work, like most people are not taking their leave. And there's not even that much leave in the U.S. to take. So when I was in the U.K., you get like thirty days off a year.

• 22:28La La Anthony?

  Wow.

• 22:28Jay Shetty?

  And like, I think.

• 22:29La La Anthony?

  That's awesome.

• 22:30Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, and here it's not that many. And so when I moved here and I remember looking at that and I was thinking, wow, and still people aren't taking time off. I think that's something people can relate to, that a lot of people struggle.

• 22:40La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 22:41Jay Shetty?

  To think, well, maybe when I come back, I'll have so many more emails. Oh, my God, I'm gonna be so behind. Oh, my gosh, I won't get promoted this year. Oh, my gosh, I might get let go. I'm competing with this person. I may become irrelevant.

• 22:50La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 22:51Jay Shetty?

  I have to stay on top of stuff.

• 22:52La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 22:53Jay Shetty?

  What was it for you that kind of, do you think, stopped you from giving yourself permission to have a balance?

• 22:58La La Anthony?

  Definitely a fear. And you and I always talk about fear, a fear of someone's gonna come and take my job or someone's gonna come and take my place. Or I used to take so much pride in being like, you know, even if I'm not the most talented, I'm the hardest worker. No one can outwork me. And that was like my badge of honor, like I will outwork everyone. Until you're burnt out and you don't have anything else to give, and then what? They move on to the next person anyway. So it's like, you have to take care of yourself. And I had to learn that because I would just go until I couldn't go anymore and then not have anything to give to anyone because I didn't have that balance. But that was all because of fear and not also believing in myself enough to say, I'm enough. And if someone is able to just come and take this from me, it was never mine to begin with.

• 23:43La La Anthony?

  And really being okay with that. But I just think we, well, I grew up in a world where it's so competitive. And it's like, you know, you can't take your foot off the gas. As soon as you do it, somebody else is coming. Or don't even give, you know, somebody else a chance to take your spot, whatever that even means. But that's the culture I grew up in and what I was conditioned and brainwashed to always believe. So it was like, go till you can't go anymore. And now I'm like, I'm not doing that anymore. Have I reached the place where I found the perfect balance? No, but I am getting better at it. I just told you, I took a trip. I was at a couple of different places. Prior to that, I took Cayenne to the Cayman Islands and we had a great time. And I felt happy, I felt.

• 24:25La La Anthony?

  Not guilty for doing that and I felt okay with posting about it, not thinking like, "Oh, they're gonna think this girl, she's always on vacation," or something like that. I felt good about that because I deserve it and I need to do it.

• 24:36Jay Shetty?

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• 25:21Jay Shetty?

  Visit MazdaUSA.com to learn more. Consumer Reports does not endorse products or services. This episode is brought to you by Amtrak. You know that feeling when you're already tired and you haven't even gotten there yet? That's where Amtrak comes in. Leave the driving behind and settle into a comfortable seat with plenty of room to stretch out. Catch up on work with Wi-Fi, grab a snack at the cafe car, or just sit back and enjoy your favorite podcast. Choose a seller or Northeast Regional and get there without the stress of getting there. Visit Amtrak.com to plan your next trip. This episode is brought to you by Orange Theory Fitness. One of the best investments you can make is in your own strength.

• 26:04Jay Shetty?

  The choices you make today can help shape how you feel for years to come. Orange Theory Fitness provides a one-hour workout to build strength, burn fat, and build muscle, with an expert coach guiding you every step of the way. Head to orangetheory.com/onpurpose to learn more and get your first class free. Orange Theory Fitness, helping people live longer, more vibrant lives. Terms and conditions apply. See webpage and studio for details. Absolutely, absolutely. And I love hearing the practical ways in which it's actually taking part. It's really interesting. It's so much about like what we get our significance from, like what makes us feel worthy. And for some of us, it's overworking. For some of us, it's overgiving. For some of us, it's oversharing. And it's like, what makes you feel worthy?

• 26:49Jay Shetty?

  Today, what makes you feel? Worthy and happy today.

• 26:53La La Anthony?

  Definitely my son, like, he makes me so happy because you start really seeing the influence you have over your child at a certain age where it's like, wow, everything I've taught him or things I've tried to drill in his head, now I'm seeing it actually come to fruition, or he's repeating things to me that I'm like, oh, he was listening to me when I said that, or he is following my guidance or advice. You know, he's 16 years old now and he's making a career and a lane for himself in basketball. And, you know, he's doing so well, but I just see how humble he is, how kind he is, how he's all about, you know, giving back to the community and all the things that are so important to me. Now I'm just seeing him take on all of that same stuff and that makes me so happy.

• 27:37La La Anthony?

  Because I feel like, you know, I did a great job and it's not like I'm done being a parent, but I did a great job thus far of being a parent and never allowing whatever was happening in my life or to affect my parenting or affect how I was with, you know, my child. That's something that makes me happy and something I'm really proud of. Because that's not easy, you know, to deal with day-to-day life and ups and downs and then come home and be, you know, there for your child and be willing to just listen to their needs and what they have going on. That's not easy.

• 28:10Jay Shetty?

  What's been the biggest thing you think he's taught you?

• 28:13La La Anthony?

  Definitely patience. Everyone says like, you don't experience love till you have a child. And you're like, well, what does that really mean? Like, I know what it's like to love someone, but it definitely is a different kind of love. So just unconditional love, patience. And, you know, I always say that my son is my best friend. Now, it's interesting because people will say that, and I don't know if you've read about this, Jay, I'm curious to know your take, people will say that your children should not be your best friend, that you should be a parent and your child should not be your best friend. I'm on the other side of it. My son is my best friend and I'm still able to be a parent and have him as my best friend. And best friend, I mean, I spend more time with my son than anyone else. I live with my child, so he's the person I live with, he's my roommate essentially

• 28:57La La Anthony?

  and knows me in every shape and form, the happy days, the sad days, everything. And there's nothing I don't feel like we can talk about on his side, on my side. To me, those are all the qualities of a best friend. Do I still parent him and discipline him? Of course I do. But there's a lot of, I read a lot of talk about that. And sometimes when I write, like, hanging with my best friends, like, ah, your son shouldn't be your best friend. Like, you should just be a parent. That's the problem these days. Parents trying to be their kids' friends and this and that. I come from a different.

• 29:26Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I, I mean, I can't, I'm obviously, I'm not a parent. So I can't answer it from that perspective. But if I think about it with my parents, I would say at this point, I'm good friends with my parents. I would say I wish we were best friends growing up.

• 29:39La La Anthony?

  Okay.

• 29:40Jay Shetty?

  And I felt that I was parented, which made me actually not tell them stuff and keep secrets and do my own thing and not really have that open relationship with them, which I wish, I think would have been healthier for me.

• 29:53La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 29:54Jay Shetty?

  And for them. And now I'm glad that it's evolved to where it has. But I agree, I would have liked to have been friendlier with my parents when I was younger, because I think I could have avoided a lot of the mistakes I made, had I had that relationship with them.

• 30:08La La Anthony?

  And felt comfortable talking to them about certain things.

• 30:11Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I was always scared to tell them anything.

• 30:12La La Anthony?

  You're like, I'm about to get in trouble.

• 30:13Jay Shetty?

  Exactly. And so, and, and I don't think that that was a healthy feeling as a child of, oh, I'm gonna get into trouble if I do. No, as a child, as a teenager.

• 30:22La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 30:22Jay Shetty?

  But not as a child, I was obedient anyway. But when I was a teenager, it's like, I think that's the age. If you can be friends with your 16-year-old, that's pretty dope.

• 30:28La La Anthony?

  Right, right. And being friends today doesn't mean he doesn't get in trouble. Because if he does something wrong, he gets in trouble or, you know, I have to sit down and talk to him. But I think it's the approach and the way, because sometimes just yelling or it's not effective. At least from what I've seen with other people parenting, you know, and I don't judge anyone's parenting, but yelling, screaming, like, they're not hearing you. So sometimes just having an honest conversation on why you shouldn't have done that or why that was wrong. For me, that gets me further than like, what the hell are you thinking? Why do they, like, they're, they're blocking you out. They're not hearing you anyway.

• 31:01Jay Shetty?

  I actually went through something like that the other day. So I bumped into someone and I was talking to their teenager. He was probably like, Maybe like fourteen, fifteen.

• 31:10La La Anthony?

  Okay.

• 31:11Jay Shetty?

  And his mom was like behind me, like telling him what to ask me. And it was almost like she was making it out like he wouldn't ask good questions.

• 31:20La La Anthony?

  Right, like not giving him the opportunity.

• 31:22Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, and the thing is, he was actually asking really smart questions and I was like really engaged, but I could see that she kept distracting him and he kept being like, mom, I'm talking.

• 31:30La La Anthony?

  I got it, I got it, right.

• 31:31Jay Shetty?

  And it was just really interesting and I'd look back and I'd smile and be like, he's cool. Like, you know, it's all right. And it was just really interesting to me, like she didn't trust that she'd actually been an amazing parent.

• 31:40La La Anthony?

  Right, and taught him well and put him in a situation where he can handle himself.

• 31:44Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, and he was doing great. And I turned, I said to her afterwards, I was like, I just want you to know, like, you must have raised your son really well because he was so present. He asked me, I was so impressed by a fifteen year old asking those kind of questions. Like, I wanted her to know that too, because I guess mom guilt and reflecting and like kind of feeling like it's never good enough must be a big part of what you carry too.

• 32:03La La Anthony?

  Yeah, for sure. That's a real thing, you know, mom guilt and just, everything you just said is just so real because again, we get in the habit of beating ourselves up for everything. So it's like blaming ourselves for everything. So, you know, my son's like this because of whatever. So it is nice when, I always say, the biggest compliment I've ever heard is when people tell me, your son's so well mannered, he's so humble, he's so down to earth, he cares about people. Like, that makes me feel better than anything, any award, any, any, you know, high rated TV show, what movie, anything. Like, someone to tell me that my kid is kind and humble and well mannered, that's like the best thing I could ever hear.

• 32:44Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's beautiful. I love hearing that. And I want to talk about your career because last time you came, we kind of did a full, like biography of like all the jobs and like how you started. We talked about your first job and how you broke through. What about, you're a driven, ambitious person still, despite everything you've achieved. What is that drive pursuing today? Like, what does that look like right now?

• 33:07La La Anthony?

  I'm always trying to figure out what my next thing is. I'm always working extremely hard. I think I still am close enough to remember what not having felt like to continue to push myself the way I do. I'm not that far removed from remembering what that felt like and it lives in me and it's close to me. So I'm like, I don't like that. I don't want to go back there. So that's the motivation and the drive to continue to push forward. And I enjoy it. Like, I like working. I mean, my mom tells me all the time, like, you don't think you should just, like, take a break? And I'm like, Mom, I like working. Some people like other things. I like working. Some people, you know, rather be at home and do certain things, which is fine. Everyone has a different motivation.

• 33:51La La Anthony?

  I like working. That brings me happiness. That brings me joy. So I push myself in that, in that department. But for me, I'm always trying to see what's next. Right now, you know, I'm, I'm heavy in the acting space, producing space. Really big on my prison reform charity, which takes up a lot of my time. And, you know, giving back in that way is so important to me. So those are kind of where my immediate focuses are right now. But there's always so many things, you know, happening.

• 34:18Jay Shetty?

  With the acting and production, like, what part of it right now do you feel most immersed and in love with? Because you've done both for a while now. It's like, what's the project that's kind of like bringing you alive?

• 34:28La La Anthony?

  So, you know, just finding projects that I'm interested in. Producing is so amazing because you can now bring something that you love to life. And you can be in control of that IP or whatever it is and bring it to life. So producing just puts you in control. For so long as an actor, you're waiting for someone else to give you an opportunity. You're auditioning with 10 other girls that look very similar to you and just hoping that, hey, pick me, pick me, I'm the right person for the role. And nine times out of 10, you never, you don't get picked. I mean, you get those lucky times, but for the most part, you don't get, you don't always get picked. So by producing, you're not waiting. Now you're creating. And you're also putting yourself in a position to create jobs and opportunities for other people.

• 35:10La La Anthony?

  And that's what I'm about, opening the doors for other people to come in and, you know, have these experiences and be able to give them, you know, a piece of what I have going on. So that's what I love about producing and just going out there and finding projects that mean something to me. And it's not always about like, oh, I want to produce this because I want it to be this huge success. Of course, you want things you do to be a huge success, but sometimes you want to do it for you. Like, this, I'm passionate about this. I want to tell this story. And whoever gets it, gets it. Maybe this is not the billion-dollar hit or whatever. Maybe this is just... For a small group of people that are into this, but that matters to me. So it that's what gets me excited from the producing standpoint and acting. I am on a show, so it's great to just have steady work and I love, you know,

• 35:53La La Anthony?

  the people I work with. I love the show I'm a part of. It's incredible and it's nice to just always have that kinda in the stash.

• 36:01Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, absolutely. You spoke about rejection there again. Another thing I think people relate to, whether they're auditioning, applying for jobs. Like it's one of those things that we all face in life in different realms. And I think people often think that when you get to a certain level of success, you don't get rejection anymore.

• 36:16La La Anthony?

  That is not true.

• 36:17Jay Shetty?

  How does that feel like after having had you? I don't know how many auditions you must have done in your life.

• 36:21La La Anthony?

  Oh, my God, more than I could ever count.

• 36:22Jay Shetty?

  Right? Like how many like taped auditions, like in person?

• 36:26La La Anthony?

  In person, signing the contract before, thinking that I definitely had the job, just to find out that they're not going with me. I mean, I've had everything happen to me.

• 36:35Jay Shetty?

  Does it get easier? And how do you react to rejection differently today than you did 16 years ago?

• 36:40La La Anthony?

  So today I realize that most of the time it has nothing to do with you. There's so many other factors. And now being on the producing side, I see the other factors. Could be anything, could be height, just could be how you you stand next to your co-star. Could be a billion things that are out of your control. It's not a decision based on you weren't good enough or you weren't talented enough. And once I realized that, I got better with dealing with it. And also being happy and grateful for the person who did get the job. Cause for whatever reason, they were the right person for that job. Not feeling like, oh, why'd they give it to them and not me? Like actually leading with grace and kindness and realizing that because I started doing that, more good things started happening for me.

• 37:25La La Anthony?

  But in the beginning, it was like, oh, they don't like me. Oh, I didn't do a good job. Oh, they think I suck. I shouldn't be doing this. Like I was ready to give up on acting 100 times. I was like, clearly this is the one thing that's never gonna happen for me. Like I had to have one thing that just wasn't gonna go. This is it. But I just kept being persistent, kept learning, kept getting better. And then realizing now, a lot of the decisions are not based on talent. There's just so many other factors.

• 37:52Jay Shetty?

  When my videos were first seen like seven years ago, around a year later. A TV production company had reached out and said, we want to make a TV show about your work.

• 38:01La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 38:01Jay Shetty?

  And I was like, this is so cool. I never imagined in a million years that that would even be possible. And so we, we made the deck, da, da, da, da. We went and like pitched it to all these companies. And it was really interesting because no one took the show. I was really passionate about the idea we'd created. I thought it was really cool and different. And no one cared. Like it didn't even go beyond the first meeting. Like from the first meeting, I was like, we're not sure. And it's really interesting to me because I was talking about this with a friend a couple of weeks ago. And I was saying that one thing that happened was it built a number of long-term friendships. So everyone I met at those pitches, not everyone, but some of the people have become long-term friends that I actually still see now socially, even though we never did anything professionally.

• 38:41La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 38:41Jay Shetty?

  So there was a massive win. The other thing was it gave me a great experience of what that process is like. I'd never done it before and now I actually understand what that looks like and it was a complete learning curve. But the third one, which is the best one is I often say to people, had I had been given that show, I potentially may never have started this podcast. I potentially may never have written my book. I potentially may never have gone on tour this year. Because I wouldn't have had this opportunity to have to build my own work.

• 39:11La La Anthony?

  So true.

• 39:11Jay Shetty?

  That's what I want to remind people is like, just trust in the timing as long as you're moving forward.

• 39:17La La Anthony?

  That's it.

• 39:17Jay Shetty?

  And I think that's the mistake that we often make is that our disappointment slows us down or like our feeling of failure forces us to just switch off.

• 39:27La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 39:27Jay Shetty?

  And instead, when you're moving, shifting, figuring things out, discovering, anything's possible.

• 39:32La La Anthony?

  Yeah, it's so true. And it's funny because on our last podcast,

• 39:36Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 39:36La La Anthony?

  the, I'm telling you, it's been years. And you said that clip is still viral, but we talk about fear and we always say that people stop because they're disappointed or fear right before something great is gonna happen. Like you stop and don't even realize right past that. If you push past that feeling, if you push past that, amazing things are gonna happen. And because of our talk, I realized how much that resonated with people. Like, don't let the fear and disappointment stop you because you don't know what's gonna happen after that. Let it build you. Let it build your character. Let it build your armor to be strong and to go through these things so that you can keep, like you said, as long as you're moving forward. It's just so important.

• 40:16Jay Shetty?

  What, what fear are you trying to push forward from right now in your life?

• 40:19La La Anthony?

  I'm such a people pleaser and I've always wanted to. Even as a young kid, I've always wanted to be liked by everyone. I was that person, like, I wanted everybody to be my friend. And it's funny, because people will say all the time, "Oh, Lala's friends with everybody. Everybody loves Lala." Which is great. I don't think everybody loves me, but that's great. But also being okay with understanding that you'll never be able to please everyone. Especially in this day and age of, we talked about social media. Everyone now having a platform to comment, to tell you what you're doing wrong, and speak about who you are as a person, people that don't even know you. There was a time where that would have really rattled me and bothered me, because it's like, "Well, you don't even know me. You never even had a conversation with me. If you knew me, you would love me. You would see I'm this type of person." Now, it's like, I'm secure in myself.

• 41:04La La Anthony?

  Like, so I'm continuing to push through that fear of wanting to be liked, or the fear of someone not liking me. I should say that. The fear of someone not liking me. I've gotten so much better at that. And just embracing the people that love me and care about me. Another thing my mom's always told me, I quote my mom a lot. She's a very smart person. Another thing my mom always told me is, "Celebrate the people that are there." You know, you can have a party or a get-together, and the first thing you'll say is, "Well, why didn't so-and-so come?" Yeah. "Damn, I invited so-and-so. Why aren't they here?" You're not even acknowledging the 10, 15, 20 people that came to support you on your birthday, or whatever the occasion was. "Well, damn, I invited so-and-so. They didn't even come."

• 41:48La La Anthony?

  Like, I always remind myself of that. Celebrate the people who are there for your moments, who want to be there with you, and stop worrying about the person who wasn't there. Same thing with comments. Everyone, "Jay, we love you. You're the greatest. We send everything." That one person who's like, "Jay, what the hell are you talking about? You don't know what you're talking about." You're like, zooming in on that, want to find out. You want to respond. You want to go to their page, see how they look and all. But you just had a thousand comments about how wonderful you are, and that one will just... Throw people off. I've just gotten so much better at that.

• 42:17Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 42:18La La Anthony?

  I won't give somebody that much power over me. And again, I want to celebrate the people who are celebrating me. That's what I'm getting better at.

• 42:25Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, no, I love that. You said that. I I literally, it was a habit that I used to have where you'd see all these good reviews or good comments and you would literally just scroll past them. Just waiting for the negative one and I've changed to

• 42:38La La Anthony?

  That's so true.

• 42:38Jay Shetty?

  Literally, right? Like you're you're just you're treating the good ones like, oh, yeah, sure. Of course. I don't you don't really mean that. And then when someone says something bad and I've trained myself now, like I genuinely do this. And I talk about in the podcast a lot, I will sit there and I will read a positive review or read a comment, a positive comment. And I'll let it sit here.

• 42:57La La Anthony?

  It's so important.

• 42:58Jay Shetty?

  And I'll just let it sit there and I'll let myself accept it because for so long I just tried to like not let myself accept it. And I don't mean let it go to your head. I mean, like, feel it in your heart. Like, someone felt like telling you that your work or your words or whatever it was, your life or that clip of you on the last podcast, like that that made a difference in their lives. Let that just let yourself receive that. And I wish all of us would allow ourselves to receive love as seriously as we receive hate.

• 43:26La La Anthony?

  It's so true.

• 43:27Jay Shetty?

  When you see hate, you don't think that might not be true. You just accept that it must be true. Whereas when you see love, you think, oh, yeah, they didn't really mean that. Oh, it probably isn't that real, right? It's so interesting how we second guess.

• 43:39La La Anthony?

  And it's interesting because we'll believe that hate is true from someone who doesn't even know us.

• 43:45Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 43:45La La Anthony?

  This is coming from someone who'd ever had a conversation with you, who knows nothing about you. So it's like, it's it's the wrong way to think. But you had to train yourself to think differently. I had to train myself to think differently. For me, a lot of times it's better for me just not to read anything because I still can get hyper focused on. So I don't I don't really get caught up in that. I get caught up in more like when people stop me and say, you know, love you a lot. Thanks for this or whatever it is. Those are my genuine, you know, moments and I do still sometimes, you know, take a peek, but I don't go too deep.

• 44:17Jay Shetty?

  That's safer.

• 44:18La La Anthony?

  Yeah, I just like peek in, but I don't I don't I don't go too deep.

• 44:21Jay Shetty?

  I think that's safer and and of and sometimes when I see criticism, I'll also allow myself, if I'm in a good space, because I agree with you. Like what I'm sharing is when you're in a good space. If you're really struggling with it, just turn it off and get away from it. I'm fully with you. But if I am in a good place, I'll look at criticism and I'll say, let me take the feedback and leave the criticism. Like, how do I do that? Like, how do I listen to this, allow it in, but then leave the part that that is kind of the venom in it? Or the spite or the ferociousness? Like, take that out and take the feedback, because there could be something for me to learn.

• 44:54La La Anthony?

  Right, a constructive, the constructive part of it, or constructive criticism part of it. I do understand that. I don't think all of us are there yet.

• 45:02Jay Shetty?

  Neither am I, I'm just, I'm just, I'm trying.

• 45:04La La Anthony?

  Yeah, exactly, we're trying and, and a lot of us, you know, are still struggling with understanding what being loved feels like. Or never being loved, growing up, you know, I work with so many people through my charity and just people I know who you realize some of the basic principles of just love. They've never experienced and don't understand what that is, but they do understand hate, being told you're not good enough, being ignored, not being paid attention to. So they gravitate more to that because that's what they're used to. So it's just about changing the narrative. And I talk about that with, you know, the group that I work with through, through my charity, three sixty all the time is like changing the narrative, changing those negative thoughts into positive thoughts. So those, that's really.

• 45:48Jay Shetty?

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• 46:31Jay Shetty?

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• 47:53Jay Shetty?

  What got you involved in the prison reform work? And what is the thing that you think would surprise us to learn about it? Because you've actually spent time, you're working with people, it's your charity, it's your project. What do you think would surprise us?

• 48:06La La Anthony?

  I think that people would be surprised how simply changing a person's environment and simply loving someone can be all you need to actually see a complete change in a person. Telling someone you love them, telling someone you're proud of them is sometimes enough to just completely change a person. And realizing that those simple words, a lot of people have never even heard before. It's mind blowing that I'll sit with the young men in my program, I mostly work with young men ages 18 to 21, and they will tell me they've never heard someone say, I love you before. They've never heard, definitely never heard someone say, I'm proud of you. What have I ever done for someone to be proud of me? Or definitely just never knew what.

• 48:51La La Anthony?

  Feeling important to somebody was. And when they start feeling that, the change you see in them. When I put them in situations, whether it's jobs or things to thrive, like how amazing they've been doing just because the environment is different. You can love somebody all you want and then put them back in that same toxic, you know, dysfunctional environment and then like, well, why are they acting like this? They shouldn't be acting like this. Why are they being a menace to society? I mean, but we wouldn't last one day in a household like that. You know, and just being compassionate. So love and a change in environment are like two of the key things that I've seen, where I've seen the most success and the most change for sure.

• 49:29Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that is, that is fascinating. And how do you get like, I guess the external perception is everyone would be quite hard in prison and be quite cold. How do you have a conversation about love and compassion and empathy with someone who hasn't had it before? Like, how do you even start that conversation? Because I think the perception would be they'd just be like, I don't need to be loved. Like, there'd be a certain like, kind of shield to it. Is that real? Is that true? Or do you find it's quite easy to talk?

• 50:01La La Anthony?

  When I first come in, it's not easy. There's like, if it's a new group, it's kind of the stone face.

• 50:06Jay Shetty?

  That's what I mean, yeah.

• 50:07La La Anthony?

  Yeah, we know La La, but what's she, what's she gonna talk to us about? But it's really just having real, authentic conversations. When you talk to somebody, Jay, you just have that talent to where they know you're speaking from a genuine place. When you talk to me, I'm like, I gotta listen to what Jay's saying. Like, I got, what would Jay do in this situation? You just have that. So it's like, when you're speaking from your heart and you're leading with love, people feel that, even the hardest people feel that. Because at everyone's core, what do we want? We want to be loved. Everyone wants to be loved, whether they've experienced it or not. At everyone's core, they want to be loved. So I'm gonna hit you in that place that just wants to be loved. And I'm also gonna make you understand that I understand what you've been through.

• 50:50La La Anthony?

  I understand why you may have made some of these choices. And guess what? I'm not judging you, but I'm pushing you to do better. And that's how I kind of run. My group and what we talk about. And once they hear that and feel that, it just melts away. They just want to hug. They just want you to tell them you love them. They just want to sit down and have some food with you. It just like melts away and it's it's emotional. It's incredible to see. And I wish that more people could be involved in the work and see this instead of just, you know, writing certain people off because of whatever they've been through. Because one thing I always say is, hey, these guys in my program are not going anywhere. So you've got two choices. They can either be an asset to our communities or they can be a problem. Which one do you want?

• 51:35La La Anthony?

  Because they're not going anywhere. So I'd rather mold them and work with them to be assets and great fathers and great community leaders and great workers in our community than be a problem. And sometimes all they really need is to feel supported and to feel loved. That's been my experience.

• 51:51Jay Shetty?

  What drew you to that work specifically? I mean, you could have started something about anything in the world. Why? What was it deeply inside of you that was like, this is where I want to put my energy and effort?

• 52:01La La Anthony?

  I think just just growing up, that's always been a part of life, like knowing someone who's in jail, seeing different things, but feeling helpless, like, well, what can I do? I can just go visit, write a letter here and there. I'm not in a position to do anything. You would see things that you wanted to change, but feel helpless. And now I'm in a position where I can actually make change. You know, I can actually use my voice and my platform to make a change and help people I care about who are still incarcerated or people who have been incarcerated, you know, help them change their experience and provide them with different things that people before us didn't have. So I'm going to use my platform for that.

• 52:42La La Anthony?

  And also, as a mom of a 16 year old, a young black man, I understand, you know, how all of us are. One decision or one bad moment away from being any of the kids that I deal with, who are incarcerated right now. How many of my kids was just wrong place at the wrong time? Hanging with the wrong crowd? We can relate to that. I have a son. Like, he could be at the wrong place at the wrong time. Trying to be cool, running with a certain group of kids. Anything can happen. So, I'm sympathetic to that. And I think that's where I draw my inspiration from to wanna do the work.

• 53:16Jay Shetty?

  Did you see the lack of support, like, breaking families? Like, did it, how bad did it get?

• 53:21La La Anthony?

  It got bad. It got bad. I saw it. It got bad. I had, you know, one of the closest people to me. His mother was incarcerated for many, many years. And just seeing what it was like for him to grow up without his mom, you know, being there. She was there in every way, but she was incarcerated. She was an amazing, she is an amazing mother, but she was incarcerated. And just watching what that felt like. And feeling like there's gotta be a way to still hold the family bonds even with this going on. So, just seeing things and like, this doesn't make sense. Or, this is supposed to be a rehabilitation, but there's no rehabilitation going on. Where are the programs? Where are the things so that people can come out and not do the same mistakes? Or be better equipped to make better decisions?

• 54:06La La Anthony?

  Like, what are we doing? And now, again, being in a position, I would see all of that.

• 54:10Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 54:10La La Anthony?

  But, again, feel helpless. Like, what am I gonna do? I can't do anything. All I could do is go visit on the visiting days, buy some food out the vending machine, and call it a day. Like, what am I gonna do? But now, I can do something. So, it's just what I've become so passionate about. And when I look at the young men in my program, I always say, I speak to them and look at them the same way I talk to Kayan, my son, who's 16 years old. Because they're 18. They're two years away from Kayan. And dealing with some of the same struggles and issues that I see Kayan goes through. You know, insecure, trying to fit in, trying to be the cool kid. You know, all of these things that, you know, sometimes can lead to bad decisions and trouble if you don't have strong family and strong support. And they don't have that.

• 54:52Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Could you tell us maybe some of the stories that you've seen of people? You know, coming back into society and some of the moments where you're like, wow, this is like, it's inspiring and hope forgiving.

• 55:01La La Anthony?

  Yeah, so I did, I had a kid in my program, his name is Rondo. And while he was incarcerated, I bought someone who worked for Reform Alliance, which is founded by Michael Rubin, Meek Mill, Jay-Z. I had Jessica Jackson, who works really close with Kim Kardashian. So they came and they visited and Rondo just stood out to them. And I remember Jessica telling him, when you get out, I'm gonna have a job for you. You really have blew me away, won me over. And they waited and waited for him to come out. When he came out, he came out like on a Thursday. I was at the court when they released him. He came out on Thursday. He was in that office on Monday, starting his job, working so hard. And now, when you see this kid, Jay, it's unbelievable.

• 55:46La La Anthony?

  He's traveled the whole country. He's spoken on platforms with Kim, who's my best friend, obviously. So I'm like, Kim and Rondo, side by side, talking about prison reform, him speaking to the the Gen Z population about, you know, what needs to be done, his experiences. I'm just mind blown. I found this kid in Rikers Island, fighting, you know, dealing with so many different things. And now, he's side by side with Kim and Michael Rubin. Not too long ago, I'm like, he's at Michael Rubin's house, like hosting a panel and it's just, it's mind blowing. And what was it? Opportunity, change of environment, love that made the change. And we have others, you know, that are following in the same path. But it's amazing to see. It's like, it makes you just feel like it's all worth it.

• 56:29La La Anthony?

  Like you just like, everything I'm doing is worth it.

• 56:32Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing that with us. I think it's, it's hard sometimes to, you know, connect the dots. I was talking to, I think you probably know Scott as well, Scott Budnich.

• 56:41La La Anthony?

  Mm hmm, mm hmm.

• 56:42Jay Shetty?

  I was doing a Scott, I was at dinner with Scott like a couple of weeks ago and

• 56:44La La Anthony?

  He's so passionate.

• 56:45Jay Shetty?

  He's so passionate. And for those people who don't know, Scott made the three Hangover movies, but then also made Just Mercy.

• 56:52La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 56:53Jay Shetty?

  You know, that movie for him was all about prison reform and changing the narrative and trying to give people an opportunity and rethinking. You know, how we feel about people and how we how we treat people who've made certain decisions. And it's so phenomenal to hear that so many people also, all of you are collaborating.

• 57:12La La Anthony?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 57:13Jay Shetty?

  In order to do this.

• 57:14La La Anthony?

  You can't do this type of work alone, Jay. You need a support system. And my charity, again, is 360, and I'm so happy to have Reform Alliance as a partner, who really guide me and help me because I'm new to the space. I'm not new to the experience, but I'm new to the space. And just learning and navigating and them just really holding my hand through the whole thing has been great. You can't do it, you know, alone, but it's a challenging space, but such a rewarding space at the same time.

• 57:39Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Lala, what's, you know, you've had such a career in the public eye, life in the public eye. What's something about you that you think people don't know that you'd you'd love them to know?

• 57:49La La Anthony?

  People around me always say like, people don't know how funny you are. Like, I'm joking around all the time. Like, I'm always up for having a good time. Like, I want to be the life of the party, and I love seeing everyone around have a good time. Those are some things. Like, I'm just learning to just enjoy, you know, life and and the new chapter in my life. You know, it still is new, coming from, you know, being married not anymore. And just like, what does that look like? And that's why I said, you know, you can't put a timeframe on things. People would think, oh, by now she would already be in another relationship or be married again or whatever. And none of that has happened yet, and I'm OK with that. I'm just going with the flow in whichever way life takes me. I'm just I'm just going that way and just understanding that everything happens when it's supposed to.

• 58:34La La Anthony?

  Not rushing things, just enjoying the moment.

• 58:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I definitely found your humor came through when I first met you. And I was just cracking up at everything you were saying. And I was just like, you know, it's you. You definitely feel that when you meet someone. And it's it's interesting because, yeah, I feel like people say the same when I'm when I'm on stage or when I'm in person, I'm hopefully a lot funnier than I am on my social media page. When I'm with my wife, I'm definitely funnier because I'm borrowing from her because she's hilarious. But it's so hard transitioning, and it's so hard transitioning in the public eye because it's almost like you have all these opinions. You have other people's narratives. You're still trying to figure things out yourself. And it's almost like I almost liken it. I always say to people, imagine you're going through something and everyone in your family, everyone in your friend circle is talking about it, and everyone has their version.

• 59:22Jay Shetty?

  That's what you're experiencing at a news level or a world level.

• 59:25La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 59:25Jay Shetty?

  And and that's very difficult when.

• 59:29Jay Shetty?

  You are either in that space yourself, or you have friends in that space and you see how challenging it is. And you're saying you're trying to enjoy the moment and you haven't, obviously, like you're saying, you haven't just moved on and it's not as easy. Is the hardest thing about it that you thought life was going a certain way and then it didn't? Is that the hardest thing about it?

• 59:48La La Anthony?

  That's the hardest thing. You don't get married to get divorced. Nobody gets married and says, I'm getting divorced. You get married because you feel like you found your person and this is what the rest of your life is gonna be like. And you start building a life with this person. And then something changes that you weren't prepared for, that you don't have the tools and skills to... No one's gonna prepare you for divorce. You're married right now, Jay. Nobody's telling you, Jay, come sit down. Let me tell you what's gonna happen when you get divorced. Nobody's doing that. We're wishing you and your wife the best to ride off into the sunset forever together. So you're not equipped with the knowledge and the tools on what to do emotionally or anything when that happens. And then you just find yourself in a position to just figure it out. So that's really difficult. And life for me looks different right now.

• 1:00:33La La Anthony?

  And I still have those moments where I can be at home and I'm like, you could never told me that this would be my life right now. And I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I love my life right now. But, you know, owning a home by myself, my son and I, you know, living together, then on certain days, him going to stay with his dad. And then I'm home alone and it's still a family but separate in a sense, you know? And just, okay, well, what time you coming home today? Like, you could have never told me that that was gonna be my life. But what can I do? I have to adjust. Like, I have to adjust and be strong and figure out what the new norm is. This is my new normal. And I just had to adjust to it. Was it easy? Of course not. And are there still days where it can hit you and be really hard? Yeah, and I wanna be honest and tell people that.

• 1:01:18La La Anthony?

  Because it's been a while for me and you would really think that by now, like... That's something I never think about anymore. Of course I do. Had a family, like, a beautiful family. And now I still have a family, but it's just looks a little bit different. And I'm okay with that. But it's still your moments where you're like, wow, this is, this is different.

• 1:01:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, absolutely. And, and I guess it sounds like both of you have been able to be there for Kian so that he's having.

• 1:01:43La La Anthony?

  Yeah, the co-parenting is strong with us. And that's something I'm very grateful for because whatever happened between me and his dad, I don't feel like Kian should have to suffer because of that. So we try to do a good job at co-parenting and still, you know, leading with love. And, and kids are going to be a reflection of what they see. Like, I could tell them all day, oh, you know, no, me and your dad, but if he sees us arguing all the time or never around each other, then it doesn't matter what I say, but we make it a point for him to see us getting along and both being there for his moments, his basketball games, his school plays, you know, parent teacher conference, whatever it is. So he always feels supported because one day Kian's gonna have a family. And I want him to understand, you know, what having a family means. And even though mom and dad

• 1:02:27La La Anthony?

  might not have been able to figure it out in the traditional way, we still loved you. And my hope is that he can do better than we did.

• 1:02:36Jay Shetty?

  And you know what it is? What's really interesting about that is, I don't know, anyone whose life is actually traditional in the traditional way. Like, even, even people have stayed together forever. Like, I, I don't know, it's so interesting, right? Like how we have these stereotypes and these views of like, what a healthy, successful relationship looks like between a family, people, friendships. Like, my relationship with my parents is very different to what I would consider the traditional, perfect relationship with your parents. Because I just, that wasn't our way.

• 1:03:08La La Anthony?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:08Jay Shetty?

  And, and it's so interesting because you kind of almost always make yourself feel guilty or shamed for not having the traditional thing. But then when I actually think about like, who has the traditional setup?

• 1:03:18La La Anthony?

  No one has it. And I think the more you go through life, you start understanding and realizing that. And now my saying is like, whatever works for them, like whatever, like, who am I to judge and say, it shouldn't be this way? It should only be this way? I mean, nothing is traditional anymore. People just have to figure out what works for them and what that looks like for them. Like, if it works for you, that's what matters. Because at the end of the day, I always say, when you're going through something, when you're down, when you're depressed, More times than not, you're dealing with that alone. You have your friend support, but I'm saying in those critical moments, when you're in that bathroom, looking in that mirror, and you're crying and going through stuff, you're going through that alone. So make decisions that make you happy and not worrying about what everybody else is gonna say or how people are gonna view me. Because in those quiet moments,

• 1:04:03La La Anthony?

  you are by yourself. And you have to face yourself, whatever that looks like. And I had to learn that because again, the people please earn me. What is this one gonna say? Or is this one gonna be mad if I do this? I gotta make this one happy. And it was always about everybody else and putting myself last. And then when I, when my whole, you know, marriage came crumbling down and I was in that bed, I was there by myself. And I had to deal with that by myself.

• 1:04:26Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's the truth. What does being loved by yourself and someone else look like now for you? What have you learned about how you wanna be loved by yourself? And potentially by anyone else?

• 1:04:37La La Anthony?

  Um, words hold so much power. Getting better at like, speaking nicely to myself, being kind. Not that I used to just like, beat myself up and say negative things, but like, "Wah la, look how much you've accomplished. Look how many people you've helped. Look at the son you've raised. Like, you've done really, really good. In the public eye, you've never like, just crumbled and fell apart. You were able to keep it together. You went through something that would break most people. Like, what I went through would have broken a lot of people. And I handled it with as much grace as I possibly could. And afterwards, it didn't make me change how I feel about like, love. I don't know if marriage is still in the cards for me. It's kinda changed my perception on that.

• 1:05:20La La Anthony?

  One of my friends was like, "You cannot go on podcasts and say you're never getting married again." I'm like, "So, I'm open. I'm just saying that I don't know if that's in the cards, but I'm being open to whatever happens. And being loved by somebody else at this point to me is just really aligning with somebody that makes me feel happy, makes me feel like I can be myself. And somebody who I just enjoy being around. It's not like I'm looking for someone to... Take care of me. It's not like I'm looking for a father for my son. And we have all of those things. Now it's about how are you connecting with with me? How are you making me feel? And I get excited when I think that or believe that that person is out there somewhere and who

• 1:06:04La La Anthony?

  is it gonna be like? And when are they gonna come find me? Like, you know, I get excited about those things because who doesn't want that in their life? I don't think you're meant to just go through life alone. Like, who doesn't want that?

• 1:06:16Jay Shetty?

  There's so much of what you've said today, which is so relatable to so many, so like, connected to so many people's hearts.

• 1:06:23La La Anthony?

  Well, you bring it out of me, Jay. You just make it so comfortable. And I just, I mean, I follow you. I follow your words, your podcast. I'm on your page all the time. I'm always looking for quotes from your page. But there's sometimes I gotta be careful because I'm like, if I post this quote, they're gonna think I'm talking about someone. So like, I'm always like, because some of your quotes are just so spot on. I'm like, that's exactly what I was thinking. So I'm always going to your page, finding quotes. I have a million screenshots of your quotes in my phone. But just thank you for being there for all of us in the way that you are and just making everybody feel so comfortable and loved. And, you know, I've read your book. I follow what you say. In some of my hard moments, I refer to your podcast and different things, and it

• 1:07:07La La Anthony?

  just really helps me. So I just appreciate that.

• 1:07:10Jay Shetty?

  You're just gonna pick up the phone.

• 1:07:11La La Anthony?

  Yes, I gotta pick up. I'm always, I don't wanna bother you.

• 1:07:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, just call me.

• 1:07:14La La Anthony?

  Okay, so then I'll pick up the phone.

• 1:07:16Jay Shetty?

  No, I just really, really, really believe that if we just look at the essence of the humanness in everyone that we meet, and you just realize like, everyone is so beautiful and wonderful and powerful and phenomenal, but we just, we've missed it because we've all been covered over

• 1:07:35La La Anthony?

  Right.

• 1:07:36Jay Shetty?

  by everything else. And even that person may not be able to see that in themselves. And I just, I try and see people through the eyes that I hope one day they'll be able to see themselves through. And that's my only goal, really, in in how I try and live. I don't wanna live to to judge or criticize or compare or be better than anyone or holier than anyone. Like, it's If we could always look at each other as equals, like true equals, because we are at our essence.

• 1:08:01La La Anthony?

  It's so powerful.

• 1:08:01Jay Shetty?

  We're exactly the same. Every single person.

• 1:08:04La La Anthony?

  Every single person.

• 1:08:05Jay Shetty?

  Every single animal being on this planet is exactly the same in the essence and the pure sense of it all. And I think all we can do for each other is provide a safe space. The world's hard enough anyway.

• 1:08:15La La Anthony?

  It's so hard.

• 1:08:16Jay Shetty?

  It's all hard. It's all hard enough anyway. So, thank you for saying those kind words. But thank you for always opening your heart with me, opening your mind. And I know this is gonna help so many people who listen to it. Is there anything that I didn't ask you that you wanted to share that?

• 1:08:29La La Anthony?

  We always get right to it. I sit in this chair and it's like, and we get right to it. I think we hit on so many points and I just hope anyone listening, watching can take something away from this. I'm not perfect. I've been through a lot, still figuring life out. I don't think you ever just have it figured out. And just be kind to yourself, be patient with yourself, love yourself. It is so important. And definitely, one thing we talked about is, you know, don't blame yourself. You know, we're all doing the best we can with what we have.

• 1:08:59Jay Shetty?

  No, you can hear that in your voice. It's not even, today, it's not just about what you've said. It's like, you can hear that genuineness and that sincerity in your voice. It's like, I think it's really gonna land with people. So, I hope everyone listens to this not once, but twice.

• 1:09:12La La Anthony?

  Yeah, same, twice.

• 1:09:13Jay Shetty?

  And everyone who's listening and watching, make sure that you cut the bit, I know you guys do a great job cutting stuff for TikTok yourself, Instagram. Like, cut the stuff that really resonated with you, that connected with you, and share it with someone. Because I'm sure you've got friends who are going through breakups. Maybe they're going through a divorce. Maybe they're raising a kid on their own. Maybe, you know, everything that Lala's going through, there are so many things that I know so many of you are connected to in your ecosystems and your lives. And I hope that you'll clip the bits that stand out to you, that connect to you, and I hope you'll share it with others. Because sometimes we just need to feel seen, heard, and understood. And I think today, a lot of people will feel seen, heard, and understood.

• 1:09:50La La Anthony?

  Thank you, Jay.

• 1:09:51Jay Shetty?

  Thank you, Lala.

• 1:09:51La La Anthony?

  Love you, appreciate you, of course. Thank you.

• 1:09:54Jay Shetty?

  Pick up the phone.

• 1:09:55La La Anthony?

  I will, I promise.

• 1:09:56Jay Shetty?

  You have to.

• 1:09:57La La Anthony?

  I will.

• 1:09:58Jay Shetty?

  I mean it. If you loved this episode, you will also love my interview with Kendall Jenner on setting boundaries to increase happiness and healing your inner child.

• 1:10:08Speaker 05

  You could be reading something that someone is saying about you and being like, that is so unfair, cuz that's not who I am. And that really gets to me sometimes. But then looking at myself in the mirror and being like, but I know who I am. Why does anything else matter?

• 1:10:20Speaker 06

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• 1:10:36Speaker 03

  What would happen if I stopped drilling? You stop, you freeze to death, that's what.

• 1:10:41Speaker 06

  With great power comes great deniability.

• 1:10:44Speaker 03

  I'm not the first then.

• 1:10:45Speaker 06

  Digger. See the trailer online. Only in theaters October 2nd. Rated R. Under 17. Not a minute without terror.