Alex Cooper: The World's No.1 Female Podcaster Finally Opens Up! (Call Her Daddy)

You can call her daddy but you can also call her Alex Cooper. You could call her Father Cooper the podcaster, or you could call her Alexandra Cooper, the head of a multimillion dollar brand. No matter what you call her Alex defies labelling and expectations. But before she was the media mastermind signing multi-million dollar contracts, she was learning the lessons that would help her become the industry leader she is now. Whether that was perfecting her craft of content creation or learning radical empathy from her psychologist mother, these have all been used in her unmatched interviews with the world’s biggest celebrities. In this expansive conversation Alex discusses her journey to becoming Daddy. From overcoming childhood bullying and self-doubt, hustling and taking advantage of every opportunity that presented itself, Alex has grown and evolved into the icon she is today and taken her devoted Daddy Gang along for the ride. Alex Cooper: Instagram: http://bit.ly/3TVKMg7 Podcast: https://spoti.fi/40NQqD0 Follow me: https://beacons.ai/diaryofaceo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  I don't think they knew the impact it was having, but it was destroying me inside.

• 0:07Speaker 00

  Oh my God. Sorry. I didn't expect for this to happen.

• 0:17Speaker 00

  What is up Daddy Gang? Alex Coon.

• 0:20Steven Bartlett?

  The Acast host of Call Her Daddy. The most listened to female podcast in the world. Hundreds of millions of downloads every month. Why you?

• 0:28Speaker 00

  I do everything for my audience. It's a very dumb industry to be a part of. Morally, I don't know if I should be saying this, but it just keeps getting bigger the more that we keep saying wild. But exploiting my life for four years, there is a cost. The last year or so that I had a co-host, I was really struggling. Call Her Daddy was the biggest show ever and everyone was like, these girls are the best of friends. And it was all crumbling behind the scenes. Why was I like getting people out of bed, managing like drugs and alcohol, trying to be the fixer? Someone's gonna be the victim and someone's gonna be the villain and I was the villain. You can get down a really dark path if you do have a goal.

• 1:12Speaker 00

  It's not worth losing yourself to get the prize.

• 1:16Steven Bartlett?

  If today were your last day and I slid you a phone and said, you're gonna have a conversation with your former partner, would you dial the number?

• 1:23Speaker 00

  I struggled so much wanting to tell the full story and wanting to tell the truth. How do I say this?

• 1:38Steven Bartlett?

  Alex.

• 1:39Speaker 00

  Hi.

• 1:41Steven Bartlett?

  What is the earliest thing, the earliest piece of context that I need to know about you to understand the person that's sat in front of me today? And all that she's accomplished?

• 1:51Speaker 00

  Oh my gosh, Stephen.

• 1:57Speaker 00

  Oh, that's a hard question. I would say I think that the experience I had growing up watching my father and what he did for a living. My dad is a sports television producer. And I remember when I was younger, my mom would take my sister, my brother and I into Philadelphia. And we would go to the Philadelphia Flyers games because that's what he would produce. And we would stay in the stands watching hockey for like a period. And then after the first period, we would beg my mom like, please, can we go see dad? Can we go see dad?

• 2:38Speaker 00

  And my mom would be like, okay, like, let's go. And she'd be like, you have to be quiet. And so she would bring us down to the television studio. And every single time it would like take my breath away watching my dad because I would walk in and he would be at the dead center at the front of the room with like 20 people behind him. 70 plus cameras in front of him and he would be producing and directing a live sporting event. And that's like my earliest memory of realizing like, holy shit, I want to do this. Like, I want to do what my dad does. And

• 3:11Speaker 00

  I think it was always instilled in me also, like, my dad loved what he did. So I know a lot of my friends, their dads would be like, gotta go to work. And like, I get that. That's like a lot of people in the world, but I was so fortunate to watch my dad was the first one in the arena. Like, he was the first one there. He had his notes. He was ready to go. And then I would watch him like produce this live show of like, roll camera A, go to the announcers, roll the graphic, like, hit the color. And I just was so enthralled by that world that from a very young age, I was able to quickly locate. That's what I want to do. That's what I I want, not only just like the actual act of producing,

• 3:52Speaker 00

  but the way that my father engaged with his work, like it wasn't work. My dad never complained about going. He was always so enthusiastic. And so to see your your parent and a figure above you that you respect so much, be so in love with what they're doing. I always was like, I want my passion to become my purpose, to become what I do in life. And I do think that kind of then makes sense as to like where I am now. Like, I love what I do. And I really accredit a lot of that to like watching my father be so in love with his career and his job.

• 4:28Steven Bartlett?

  What about your mother?

• 4:29Speaker 00

  My mother is a psychologist. So it's like the perfect storm. Growing up, I was like, Mom, stop being so smart. Leave me alone. Why do all of the other kids' moms would be like, oh, yeah, go to the movies, sweetie. And my mom would be like, you're not going to movies. You're going to a party. Tell me what's happening. Where are you going? I'd be like, why do you know these things? So it was frustrating. I think when I was younger, my mom and I had a really interesting dynamic, because I always liked to push the boundaries. And I was the youngest. So I was kind of like the wild child. And I loved that my mom was a psychologist, but I hated it because she was like too insightful and too with it, that I wish I could have gotten away with more. But I do think as I started to come into my own, having her have this background in psychology

• 5:14Speaker 00

  allowed me to really put more of an importance on connection, connecting to your emotions, EQ versus IQ. Like, my parents cared about our grades, but they also were more like, do you know how to interact in a room? Like, do you know how to read the room? Like, do you know when your friend is upset? Are you being honest with yourself of how you're feeling? So like, my household was always like, how are you feeling? What's going on? And I'm like, can we stop talking about our feelings for one fucking second? But it really was like the perfect storm of, I now on my show, am so interested in just talking and having engaging conversations, because I think my mother, it was like a prerequisite in our house of like, no, no, you can't leave the house before I know, like, how are you doing?

• 5:59Speaker 00

  I'm like, I'm fine. But like, so I think I really admired her. But in my like angsty teen years, I was like, fuck off. Like, stop asking me how I'm feeling. I want to go drink and have fun with my friends. But she's amazing. And she's been like, Probably the most instrumental person in my life in terms of like my personal development as a human being.

• 6:22Steven Bartlett?

  When she asked you how you were feeling when you were a kid, were you always honest with her?

• 6:28Speaker 00

  No, oh god, no. I was really, um, I had a hard time with like wanting to make my parents really proud. I think they saw a lot in me and I was very like doing a lot of things. I was really good at soccer. I was like good at making movies and films and all the things, but I like really struggled in school. And so I never wanted to tell my parents that because I felt like, I think I was like embarrassed because like who I was at home was so not who I was at school. And so I was almost like, I'm still working through this in therapy, so I don't really know the full answer yet, but what I do know is I was like embarrassed to explain to my parents that I was like getting bullied at school or having a hard time because when

• 7:11Speaker 00

  I got home, I then was my actual real self where I was outgoing and goofy and happy. But then when I would go to school, I never wanted to tell them actually like that I was struggling, which is really strange. And I am still working on trying to figure out like why I didn't feel that way because my parents were so loving, would have gone to school and like talked to the teachers or the parents of the little shits that were bullying me. But I just had this like internal

• 7:41Speaker 00

  way of compartmentalizing school struggles and then like being at home and trying to engage in things that I loved and made me happy. And I just like to like separate the two.

• 7:57Steven Bartlett?

  As you were saying, I was trying to like figure out why that is sometimes, why we, but and my brain said like, we almost don't want to taint our, our happy place or our safe place with the, with the unhappy place. It's like we'd almost poison that place. It'd bring that energy into the, into that safe place.

• 8:12Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think that's a good point, like. I really struggled with people being so mean strictly. It was just all about my appearance. Like I was a very awkward kid. I think I had a hard time also coming out and talking about it on Call Her Daddy because I feel like the persona that I am putting out into the world is very like blonde, bombshell. She's got her life together and people are like, you got bullied. And so that dichotomy, I think, is like hard for people to understand. But like, I still feel like the girl that was bullied in middle school, elementary school. So I, I think, yeah, I think there was like a pride thing of like, they can do that to me at school, but when I get home and

• 8:54Speaker 00

  I'm going to go in the basement and I'm going to make my films, like, they can't touch that. Like, that's for me. And that's what honestly, like, saved my life, to be honest. Like, creating content was like the one thing that kept me going and like happy and I was able to find my purpose because school was like just so awful for me.

• 9:14Steven Bartlett?

  When you say saved my life, do you mean that?

• 9:17Speaker 00

  Yeah, I actually found like a journal. I'm not crying, but my, I just will not stop watering, or maybe I am. I found a journal of mine. It was so fucking sad to read. I was really going through a hard time in school. I think when you go through bullying, you feel so fucking isolated. And unfortunately, or I hope, like, I actually don't think the kids that were bullying me, and most of them were boys, I don't think they knew the impact it was having. Like, it was like a casual, mean comment at recess, but it was destroying me inside. And so I found a journal

• 9:58Speaker 00

  that broke my heart because it was basically me saying like, oh, this is, if, I was like, if I killed myself, maybe then they would realize like how fucked up all the comments that they were saying to me. Oh, my God. Sorry. I didn't expect for this to happen.

• 10:21Speaker 00

  I just like, I think I realized like, I'm like, fuck, like they would then realize like the impact that their comments had on me. And I really don't think that, like I'm saying, like, I don't think those kids actually knew, like, damn, like, and so I think almost the way of thinking about killing myself was like, then they would realize the impact. And so I had a lot of dark thoughts that like, I, I'm, I'm like, I feel really bad for myself in that moment, because I think a lot of times people are like, I wouldn't take it certain things back because like, it made me who I am. I would take that back. I think what, what I felt in those moments, I would absolutely take back. Cause it just like, I don't, I think I could still be where I am and not have gone through that type of pain.

• 11:07Steven Bartlett?

  Have you had to have a conversation with that, that girl, the younger version of Alex in therapy and stuff too?

• 11:14Speaker 00

  Yeah, um, it's been weird because our job is so weird where like, I remember, do we have a tissue?

• 11:22Steven Bartlett?

  No, sorry.

• 11:23Speaker 00

  No, you're fine. I'm like, whoa, I didn't expect to cry this soon. I wasn't even expecting to cry. Um, I think why I'm so emotional too is like, I'm kind of like currently working through this in therapy and I think our job is very strange where I remember when I took the show on my own, um, and I was doing like solo episodes and I kept realizing I had like these people pleasing tendencies and I wanted to share it on my show, but I'm like, I have to give context to the daddy gang, my fans, like why I have these tendencies. And so I remember telling my fans in the world that I was bullied before I even told

• 12:03Speaker 00

  my therapist. And I do sometimes think there's like something beautiful about that of like, I knew by me saying that I was gonna immediately connect with so many of my fans and like, we were gonna be able to have an even deeper connection. But I haven't really worked through all of it. So like, I think sometimes when you bring up things you went through and you're not fully healed or whatever, like, I'm still kinda in the middle of processing all of it. But I have started to think about that younger self, but I, I think it's still so raw of like even unpacking like how it's affected me in adulthood that I'm having a hard time like going through all the layers of it still.

• 12:50Steven Bartlett?

  Have you seen sort of imprints that remain on you as an adult? I think about my own experience being, I mean, talked about this a lot on this show. So people know, but being the only like black kid in an all white school, being the poorest family in the area and that constant feeling of like ongoing shame like.

• 13:03Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think back and I've realized in my adult life, like I always would say how I'm so comfortable being alone. I love my alone time, but I think that comes from the initial inception was like such pain and hurt and isolation. Um, when I was young, I would go into my room and I would cry, but I would make sure my parents couldn't hear me crying again, because like I wanted to be like the cool soccer player, creative girl when I'm home and I didn't want them to know what I was going through. So I would be crying and writing in a journal and I realized like I got so, I went through

• 13:46Speaker 00

  like hating every single thing about myself externally. Like I would look up remedies of like how to get rid of my cystic acne. Like I would literally envision taking like a razor and like taking it off my skin. Like I thought of so many things and I, I just like was constantly trying to change myself because I was getting bullied for like the way that I looked. And I think it's really detrimental when you're at an age where like all you care about is peer approval. All you care about is people liking you. And so I think the part of me that like, yes, hated myself, I did get really comfortable being alone because those were the moments where I allowed myself to have all of the

• 14:30Speaker 00

  thoughts, like bottling up and not telling anyone that I was going through this. I remember a friend of mine that I've been friends with since like fourth grade. She was like, Alex, I can't believe you never told me because I was going through something really similar. She has red hair and freckles and she was like, I got so bullied and we were in the same school and we were best friends and we didn't even know we were both going through it. And I can't even imagine how much easier my life would have been if I at least like grabbed onto her and we had each other. But I think bullying is very hard to explain unless you've gone through it where like you're so alone, you hate yourself.

• 15:13Speaker 00

  You almost like, yeah, you hate the bullies, but you almost like some, you just internalize it. So you hate yourself. You don't even hate them as much as you hate yourself. You want to change yourself. You want to be able to fit in. You want to hide. You, and so you do certain things where like even my, my mannerisms or my posture was so like defeated and awkward. And now I look back and it's like my adult life, I have, I am working on, working through extreme people pleasing tendencies because I just wanted people to like me when I was younger. And so even sometimes I see things on the internet where I'm like, oh, he's being like too annoying or extra. But it's like, I feel like I just want people to like me.

• 15:56Speaker 00

  And sometimes that's all I'm thinking about, that I can imagine that comes off in a way that's maybe not as likeable, but it's like, I really am just trying to connect. And then I think the, the loner thing, like I've had so many,

• 16:15Speaker 00

  I had a lot of issues in romantic relationships where I would be like in love with someone, but they would be like, what? I didn't even know you liked me. And so I think I would avoid getting hurt and rejected because I was rejected in those years of feeling the ultimate rejection of again, when you're like, all you care about is peer dynamics, friends, like who's in who's top five, like boys were like repulsed by me. And so I was like, I hated myself. I didn't think I was good enough. And so when I would get someone, I tried to like, have a defense almost against like,

• 16:55Speaker 00

  they can't hurt me because like, I'm already setting myself up to know it's going to be over before they can like reject me.

• 17:03Steven Bartlett?

  You know, when I sit here with people and I learn about their early years, I think there's always, and probably I had this assumption before I started doing this, that when we reach the moment of success or whatever, when our circumstances change, the trauma goes out the door with it. And I, I've come to learn from doing this that it stays. And I've actually, I feel like I've never met a person who has managed to take their early upbringing, the early adverse upbringing to zero. I've never met the person.

• 17:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 17:30Steven Bartlett?

  I'm guessing you've made progress on these things.

• 17:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, I have.

• 17:36Speaker 00

  I think like, when I was so young.

• 17:42Speaker 00

  Being in school, I I started to really struggle with my grades because it would be like I'm getting bullied in school and I would run home and I started to compartmentalize so well that creating content to me was like literally what kept me going, right? And so I would go into my basement and my dad gave me this like big, huge, clunky Sony camera. And I was obsessed with creating these characters, creating these storylines. Like I laugh now because I didn't even put it together, but I would force all my friends, all my soccer friends to participate in like making videos with me. And we remade The Devil Wears Prada. And you would think immediately of what I'm telling you, like, who would I play? I would play Anne Hathaway's character.

• 18:28Speaker 00

  I played Meryl Streep. I I was fricking Miranda Priestly. I'm like, I'm the farthest thing from that at that point in my life, but it was like, I loved playing characters that like it like ignited this confidence in me where I could feel for a minute like I I am this boss, like I am this like strong, confident woman. Um, and so creating content for me was like this outlet that allowed me to almost like become the thing that internally I always did have this confidence and I knew I had this fun personality and this spark, but it was so tainted by the minute I walked out the doors of my house.

• 19:10Speaker 00

  When I was struggling in school, I think I started to realize like, I don't want to do math. I don't want to do history. Like, I just want to create content. And I think it was really hard for me to focus in school because I almost was like so focused on the goal of like, let me just keep creating content. And I can't explain it, but it was like the driving force for me to just keep going and to keep dealing with a lot of the bullshit that I was struggling with.

• 19:38Steven Bartlett?

  Therapy. I'm thinking about that alignment you're talking about between being being able to show up as yourself everywhere you go, whether it's in school or whether it's, I don't know, on your show or wherever.

• 19:52Steven Bartlett?

  Also, it was quite clear that in school in your earlier years, you weren't able to show up as yourself.

• 19:56Speaker 00

  Hmm.

• 19:58Steven Bartlett?

  What role has therapy played in helping you to become Alex when you're on camera, off camera, in school, in social settings, wherever you go?

• 20:08Speaker 00

  Well, at first, it wasn't changing my life and my therapist was like, had a hard conversation with me. I think it was like two months into us working together and she was like, Alex, I need to say something to you. And I'm like, am I in trouble? She's like, you can't, you pay me, like, you're not in trouble, but I need to be honest with you. I can tell you're not, you're not being honest. You put on this facade that everything is good, everything is okay. And like, the point is to come here and be emotional and you can trust me to not

• 20:42Speaker 00

  tell anyone, judge you. And I think I had kept this hard exterior for so long that it was

• 20:52Speaker 00

  really foreign to me to open up and talk about my insecurities and what I'd struggled with because when you're bullied, you eventually create this armor that is like completely sealed shut. You, you wear it and you like know the pain, but you eventually have to survive and keep going. And so I think in therapy, my therapist was like, what is, why can I not like get in there? And I eventually,

• 21:27Speaker 00

  I didn't, I didn't even say anything in that session. I was like, I don't know, like I'm telling you the truth. And then weirdly, that was when I ended up opening up on my show about it. And then I came back to her and I was like, okay, here you go. And I just spilled everything because I was at least attuned enough to therapy from my mother of like, I know in order to actually have change within myself and for this to work, I have to be honest. But there was still like, I was still embarrassed to tell my therapist. Because I knew she would look at me differently and I thought she thought I was like this well put together person and I just was like, holy shit, I've created such a facade that like, everything is perfect

• 22:07Speaker 00

  exteriorly with me that I'm not going to be able to actually undo the damage that was done if I don't actually start talking about it. And so that was like a really pivotal moment for me where therapy finally broke down that layer, but my therapist had to chip away. And now she jokes about it with me all the time. It's like, do you remember when you would come in and I'd be like, so, and eventually she was like, why are we here?

• 22:31Steven Bartlett?

  Whose decision was it to go to therapy?

• 22:33Speaker 00

  Me.

• 22:34Steven Bartlett?

  Did you go with with a particular focus or just generally?

• 22:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, it was a particular focus. It was

• 22:41Speaker 00

  about like the last year or so that I had a co-host. I was really struggling. And

• 22:51Speaker 00

  I was like, my mom kept being like, I need to be your mom. I can't be your therapist. Like, you, you need to talk to someone. And that was when I finally, so that was about like twenty

• 23:01Speaker 00

  five, twenty four. And I finally was like, okay, I'm just gonna get a therapist. And it was in New York City and I would go in person with her. And that it felt very

• 23:13Speaker 00

  at first, it felt very like, why am I here? Like, I don't need this. But then eventually it like, cracked and it was really helpful. But it was not easy. I will say, I think a lot of people think therapy is like, sit down and tell your secrets. Like, it's so awkward at first if you're not, even I had a psychologist as a mother and I'm still like, I don't want to do this. But I think it's all in your head because once you open the floodgates,

• 23:37Speaker 00

  they never close.

• 23:38Steven Bartlett?

  You were struggling?

• 23:41Speaker 00

  Yeah. Are you asking me with what?

• 23:43Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah. You said you were struggling. So you probably, from what you said, you were going to your mother and explaining that there was a struggle. That struggle, is that, is that a social struggle with a friend? Or is that a psychological struggle or?

• 23:55Speaker 00

  I think in business, there was a lot happening where I was living with someone I was doing business with. We were struggling with business. Like, there were so many things happening and I was

• 24:12Speaker 00

  How do I say this? I was struggling

• 24:16Speaker 00

  to take care of myself in an environment that was really unhealthy. And was

• 24:26Speaker 00

  like, the show was priority, but behind the scenes, it was a disaster. And so I was like compromising on a lot of things that like morally I didn't agree with, or mentally I wasn't feeling good about. And it was at a really weird time because Call Her Daddy was like the biggest show ever. And everyone was like, these girls are the best and they're the best of friends and they're the best. And like, that's life. Like you, it's almost like how everyone talks about like Instagram. We put our best foot forward and it was all crumbling behind the scenes. And it was terrifying to me because I worked my whole life to like, get to a point like this where I'm producing a show and it just felt very scary to me

• 25:10Speaker 00

  that I didn't have control of all the aspects going on.

• 25:13Steven Bartlett?

  And the symptoms were psychological for you?

• 25:15Speaker 00

  Psychological, I was basically in a codependent relationship. Like it was so unhealthy for both of us. And I think psychologically, yes. I even think physically it was taking a toll on me.

• 25:35Speaker 00

  And then it was also taking a toll on my other relationships because like the partner I had at the time was like bearing the weight of me complaining about so much going on in my life because I couldn't go at the person that I had to get up every morning with and record, right? Like I couldn't be, I had to keep the show going. So it was like very detrimental to, yes, psychologically and my like mental health. Like the show came first before, I think, both of our personal needs.

• 26:05Steven Bartlett?

  What was the advice you, you, you needed most at that moment but didn't get?

• 26:10Steven Bartlett?

  Or maybe just before that moment happened because that's kind of like, that's when things start falling.

• 26:15Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 26:15Steven Bartlett?

  But if you'd got advice, maybe a couple of years earlier,

• 26:19Steven Bartlett?

  it would have prevented you getting into that situation. So what is that advice that, and I'm saying this because of, there's someone at home now who's, you know, they want to follow in your footsteps and whatever career or industry it might be. But when you get into business and things start going well, you wish, you just fucking wish that someone had told you.

• 26:38Speaker 00

  Fuck. I mean,

• 26:46Speaker 00

  maybe that

• 26:51Speaker 00

  it's okay to leave. It's okay to leave a situation for both people involved.

• 27:01Speaker 00

  It's okay to want to hold on to something because

• 27:07Speaker 00

  in some aspects, it's really working. But if you are compromising

• 27:14Speaker 00

  your morals and your mental health and at one point your sanity, like it ain't worth it.

• 27:23Speaker 00

  But again, I think like, even if someone had told me that, I had to live through it because

• 27:31Speaker 00

  I worked my whole, my whole life for this. Like I finally got the show and I was producing and I was doing what I loved, but I then started to hate it. And that to me was when I was like, I didn't need anyone to tell me at that point that I should

• 27:50Speaker 00

  leave. It was like, oh, I've loved this my whole life. Something's off. Like if I'm this miserable, there's a better way.

• 28:00Steven Bartlett?

  From that, you must have learnt the factors that need to be in place professionally for you to love work. Because you, you got to experience head on all the factors that make a passion turn into misery. So on the flip side, what are the factors that you need and you believe people generally need for them to like, love their work?

• 28:19Speaker 00

  Yeah. I think that the first thing is like, business is so, there's so many different layers. It's so, so complicated, even if it's just you. So then add another person in. It's almost impossible. And I think like, it was so difficult. My partner and I at the time had such different wants, such different, you know, envisionments for our career in the future. And that is so okay. But I think the issue is like, if you have the ability to sit down before you begin, which we didn't really have, like I remember, I came home.

• 29:03Speaker 00

  One day, or she came home from work one day. She was the third roommate to me and my best friend from childhood. We had met her, like, it was like a very random, like, hey, we need a third. Do you want to come live with us? We'd lived together for like, a couple months, if that. And I was like, do you want to do this podcast with me? I had no idea it was going to be the biggest podcast in the world. I had no idea her wants and what truly she was interested in, what she was passionate about. We were passionate about such different things. So it's like, I think in business, you do have to actually believe that this could become the biggest thing. You have to put your mind there. And one, that's incredible for your self-confidence to be like, if you're starting a business,

• 29:47Speaker 00

  pretend it's about to be Apple. Envision and, and who you're sitting next to. Do you want to be there with them? Or for yourself, are you willing to get there and sacrifice certain things in your personal life to get there? Like whether it's a duo or a singular person, like, you actually have to envision yourself at the end line and at your goal, because you have to mentally start to function that way. Because then all of a sudden, you could get there. And then you're like, oh, fuck, I didn't plan for this. And I think that's kind of what we both felt. We were like, we don't even really know each other. Three episodes in, this is the biggest show in the world.

• 30:28Speaker 00

  Like, we're drinking buddies. Like, what, this is not a, this is not supposed to be a business. And we are way in over our heads. And I think that's okay. But I look back and I'm like, I had no idea what we were getting ourselves into. But I do think in business, it's like, you gotta think big. Cause once you get there, you better be prepared. And I wasn't.

• 30:53Steven Bartlett?

  Do you know what? That's actually the advice that I wish I'd got before I started in business, which is imagine the day when someone comes along and offers you a hundred million. How are your contracts?

• 31:05Steven Bartlett?

  Because when you start, you'll be tempted by, oh, my God, fifty thousand pounds, ten, five thousand pounds. Here you go, everything. I'll sign anything. And then, and you do that often in your desperation and naivety. But then you get five years down the line, things are big and you just absolutely fucking wish and dread that you didn't think like this. So there's going to be a lot of people listening that are either starting out in their business journeys that really need to get into that difficult mindset. The thing is, what you said also applies to relationships generally. This idea of like, making sure from the jump that your visions are aligned.

• 31:40Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah. I also love that you said, you know, we wish we could have told ourselves. But then I'm also in life like, no, that was supposed to happen because now, when I went and signed my Spotify deal, you best believe, I was like, who's around me? Do I own these trademarks? Do I own this IP? Do I own like, everything that felt like I had not focused on in the beginning that I was like kicking myself for the second time around, I was like, damn sure that I had like, everything locked in. And I still even made like, a couple mistakes. But like, I think that that's also just life of like,

• 32:24Speaker 00

  you're gonna have, you can try to be as prepared as you can. You're never going to be fully prepared. But having some ability to reflect on what you wish you had done differently or better or the same. There were some things that I was like, I'm sticking exactly that course. I think you just have to think about it and be cognizant of those steps. And I think sometimes you rush quickly. Like, that's like our world today. It's like, go, go, go, go. Like, take the new job. Don't take a minute to pause. That's where I think you get screwed over within yourself of not recognizing like,

• 33:02Speaker 00

  What's going to be different this time? You're miserable over there. How's it going to be different? So I wouldn't take it back. I just think, of course, there's things I wish I had done differently, but then I did them differently for my next deal. And I am exponentially happier with the way that I'm handling business, who I'm surrounding myself with, how I'm hiring, you know, who touches the product. Like, there's everything now I've formulated. And I think a lot of people think like, oh, Spotify, like, she's so many people around her. I have two or one people, one person in my office every day. Like, I've kept it pretty small because that's what I always wanted. I want to produce. I want to edit. I want to direct. I want to do as much as I can in a smart way.

• 33:47Speaker 00

  But you just have to know what you want. And then when you get away from it, then you really know what you want. Because they're like, wait, I want to go that way. And that's a great thing.

• 33:58Steven Bartlett?

  There's an interesting point here, though, about being a people pleaser. When a people pleaser strikes it big, it's hard to, like, put up those boundaries and start, like, saying what you want and what you need and having. Because even the conversation we had a little bit a while ago about aligning and communicating what you want from the jump so that further down the line, you don't mess things up and regret it, requires a difficult conversation at the start.

• 34:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, I wasn't even like aware of how much I was people pleasing until it got to that breaking point where I was like,

• 34:31Speaker 00

  there were so many things I was doing to appease people around me to keep the show going that was so unhealthy that now I have, in hindsight, I'm like, what was I doing? Why was I, like, getting people out of bed? Like, why was I, like, managing, like, drugs and alcohol and like, trying to be this, like, fixer? And then it's like, just trying to put a show on. I think I was like, a little over my skis. I just said that because I was skiing this weekend. So that's, that's the only analogy. I'm like, over my head, I'm like, over my skis. You can get down a really, really dark path if you do have a goal in order to get there. And that is also advice I give people of like,

• 35:16Speaker 00

  It's not worth losing yourself to get the prize. Because what was hard for me is like, public perception. So I've talked to you about how much I care about people liking me. Now I'm on a world stage and there's comments and there's people. And there was like a public fallout with a woman. So there's like, someone's gonna be the victim and someone's gonna be the villain. And I was the villain. And I'm like, how did this happen? Like, to me, I think publicly, I struggled so much for a while of like, wanting to tell the full story and wanting to tell the truth and be like, I promise, like. But I'm also then, like, my character was like, I don't think anyone needs to know what happened

• 36:00Speaker 00

  behind closed doors and how dark it got. And, but I just know that I was proud of myself that I did. I know I'm a good person, but when you see the internet picking sides or doing this, like, it fucks with you. And I imagine for her, it fucked with her. Like, it was really hard, I think, for two women to go through something so big in a COVID pandemic. That people just wanted drama. But I think my people pleasing tendencies of like, wait, why are these people thinking something that I'm not? That ate me alive inside. And I had to have my boyfriend, my mother, my father, my therapist be like,

• 36:40Speaker 00

  you both know the real story. That's it. That's all you need to know. And so I think it took me a while, though, where I was like, I wanna clear the air. Like, how many times are we gonna go back and forth? Like, you know what I mean? But it can get exhausting trying to make people know your character and who you are. Especially when I've been talking on the internet for almost now five years. Like, people think, people have a perception of me and that's something I have to live with and be okay with, but it's hard.

• 37:10Steven Bartlett?

  I remember someone wrote in the diary of a CEO, this little book that I have in front of me, guess when they leave, they write a question for the next guest. Someone wrote in this book, if today were your last day and you had to have a 60 second conversation with someone in your life, what would you say to them and why? And I was just wondering, as you're saying all of this, this was clearly a really tumultuous, pivotal moment in your life, for better and for worse in many respects. Are there any words unsaid? If today were your last day, and I slid you a phone and said, you're gonna have a conversation with that person, your former partner.

• 37:43Steven Bartlett?

  Would you dial the number? Would you say anything?

• 37:47Speaker 00

  No, because I think in a weird way, like

• 37:53Speaker 00

  when there's time, I think both sides, and I acknowledge, both sides have their own story that then just keeps going on. Like, I'm like, what even is the reality anymore? We both have such different storylines of everything that happened. If I was like forced to, I would just say like, I hope you're healthy and you're well. But I think we're both like in a beautiful way. I said this to someone recently, I was like, it's so much better that we're both doing our own things. Like, that's the same thing in like romantic relationships. Like, I think a lot of times you try to keep making something work. It shouldn't be that difficult. It really shouldn't. If it's meant to work, it will be working. And I'm in the healthiest relationship of my life right now. And I'm like, this feels great.

• 38:38Speaker 00

  This is what it's supposed to feel like. So, no, I don't think that I would pick up the phone. Because I think we see things very differently and that's okay. That's life. Like, that's the world. That's politics. That's religion. That's friendships ending. That's marriages ending. Like, you're just gonna be like, I don't see it like you. And that's okay. I think the internet's probably a little bit more invested than even the two of us are. But, yeah, I think that would be just, I hope you're healthy.

• 39:11Steven Bartlett?

  Cool, hi Daddy.

• 39:14Steven Bartlett?

  You tell me where the boundaries are here. But how big is this show? You know, it's difficult to, it's difficult to get an idea of it because it's kind of a black box, the way it operates on Spotify. But what can you tell me about the size of the show? Because I want to go into what's made it successful. So give me the headline.

• 39:27Speaker 00

  I would say that it is

• 39:31Speaker 00

  the most listened to female podcast in the world.

• 39:33Steven Bartlett?

  Wow.

• 39:35Speaker 00

  Um, it's, and it's exclusive at Spotify. So that is wild to me that the numbers even being exclusive and you can only find it on one platform that it's as big as it is.

• 39:51Speaker 00

  It still doesn't really like register to me because when people say that I'm like podcasting's weird. Like I don't, I don't like, I'm not a singer seeing everyone in the audience. Like I just like talk and then I go and eat a sandwich and play with my dogs and go to sleep. Like sometimes it doesn't register, but the success of this show is wild to me because when we first released our first three episodes with Barstool Sports, it went number two right underneath Joe Rogan. And I think every podcast, if it has like a lot of traction, like the algorithm works where like if you have immediate engagement of like new followers, a lot of people are going to hit up in the top 10. But then by week three and then week four and then week 10 and then week 20, it

• 40:35Speaker 00

  was constantly just sitting right under Rogan. And then I remember like, I think it was maybe our 10th week or something, it went past Rogan and then we were back to second. And it was like, whoa, that wasn't, that wasn't the plan. Like of course the plan is to get big, but I just remember, um, I remember Erica Nardini, who's the CEO at Barstool came in and was like, just so you know, like, girls, your episode is like getting the same numbers as our biggest show at Barstool, uh, PMT or yeah. And I was like, really? Like, that's so cool. Like I, we didn't have like

• 41:14Speaker 00

  a concept, I don't think yet. So it went viral so fast. And again, that goes back to like, there was no plan. Like I knew in my mind, like I love doing this, but like there was no plan. I didn't even want to be a podcaster. Like I wanted to direct films and, and TV shows. And so then after that, the show only continued to grow and. It still doesn't feel real. Like, I think the craziest thing was when I signed my Spotify deal, it was very exciting for me that Spotify looked at me and was like, we really respect what you did in the past, but pitch us what's the future because that's why we're signing you.

• 41:54Steven Bartlett?

  Knowing a little bit about Spotify and the numbers in the podcasting game, I, I know you must be getting hundreds of millions of downloads and streams a month.

• 42:06Speaker 00

  It's wild.

• 42:10Speaker 00

  Like, don't tell me that because it's like, what? It's crazy.

• 42:14Steven Bartlett?

  Why, the most listened to female podcast in the world, hundreds of millions of downloads every month, there's millions of podcasts out there. There's loads of numbers knocking around. I read one recently that said there's almost three million podcasts. Why yours? Why, why you and why yours? You must have like slowly over time, which is kind of what we've tried to do, look back and tried to figure it out. Like, what's the subtle and obvious things that have made you be so successful?

• 42:50Speaker 00

  I think truly there is, and like, I'm obviously being biased, but I don't think that anyone has the relationship they have with their audience the way that I do. I think when you start a show talking about sex, especially for women, and it's so taboo, and there's so much shame, the amount of trust that that garnered for me and between me and them was unmatched. Like, I, still to this day, it shocks me that women come up to me

• 43:29Speaker 00

  in the street and will tell me about sexual abuse that they went through. And we've just met in 15 seconds. They're like, Alex, I have to tell you, you got me out of this really toxic abusive situation. All of a sudden, someone's coming to me being like, I married someone because of, like, it's like this relationship that I've built.

• 43:53Speaker 00

  I think is something that I will never be able to like really articulate, but I know it's also coming from a place because I need them just as much they need me. I think sometimes in the creator world, like it gets a little

• 44:10Speaker 00

  disconnected because we also are trying to run businesses, right? And you can't always do everything for your fans. Like, I can say I have been in huge meetings with a lot of executive people telling me what to do. And I'm like, I don't want to do that because the daddy gang won't connect that. And there's a lot of money on the table, or there's brand deals, or there's all these things. And I have really been intentional about like,

• 44:38Speaker 00

  I care more about the content than

• 44:44Speaker 00

  what public facing accolades we're going to get. And I think because I've focused so much on my relationship with my audience, it's then just garnered like a, oh, this shit just keeps getting bigger. And it is a huge show, but like,

• 44:57Speaker 00

  I can't explain it. Like, if I brought a daddy gang girl in here, she would be like, let me tell you our connection. Like, it really does feel like so crazy how connected we are. So I think that is one side of it. I do everything for my audience. I sacrifice my personal relationships. I have skipped out on huge family things to like, make sure, I'm like, no, I need to give the daddy gang something amazing this week. I've never put out an episode of Call Her Daddy that I'm not proud of. Every week I'm busting my ass to provide for them and it's

• 45:31Steven Bartlett?

  Do you delete episodes?

• 45:33Speaker 00

  No.

• 45:34Steven Bartlett?

  You've never deleted one episode?

• 45:37Speaker 00

  No.

• 45:38Steven Bartlett?

  Never recorded an episode and thought?

• 45:40Speaker 00

  Oh, I've deleted them, like not published them, but like if I've published it, I've never deleted it.

• 45:44Steven Bartlett?

  Oh yeah, so you've like had a conversation with someone?

• 45:47Speaker 00

  I've actually only had a conversation with one person that I've never released just because they didn't want to be there. I think their publicist fucked them over and they didn't know what they were coming in for. And I respectfully was like, this ain't it. But, um, oh, I've recorded like so many solo episodes that I've never pressed upload on, that eventually maybe I'll like put together and be like, these were my thoughts back then. But no, I've never, I've never deleted an episode that I've published. But oh my God, are you kidding me? My catalog of things I haven't pressed upload on? It's like a whole nother 100 episodes.

• 46:20Speaker 00

  But I, and then I think the other side of why it has been successful is like, it just goes back to, without sounding like a egomaniac, like I am obsessed with this. It, it, I can't explain it. Like every single week I'm like, completely fixated on how I'm going to innovate, make it better, make it special. So I think naturally, like there are people that got into this industry that actually didn't really intend for it. And there's like producers handing them scripts and being like, sit down and talk like, I'm so obsessed and passionate about this that I do think that translates in

• 47:01Speaker 00

  how innovative the show has been and just like the growth because I love it and I love producing content. So it's been really easy for me in that regard. Like I've never had a doubt in my mind that this is what I'm supposed to be doing.

• 47:15Steven Bartlett?

  You touched a little bit there on the cost though, that people don't see the sacrifice. Families, relationships, all these other things. Part of the reason I started the show actually was to shed a, shed more of a light on the cost of like being a CEO. Because it's very glamorized. Everyone wants to do it. But then I think providing balance allows people to understand if it's actually the right choice for them. Away from the accolades and the followers and the clapping, like, is this really the right choice for you? So in your experience, what has been the material cost of your, your journey?

• 47:44Speaker 00

  I think something I've been really struggling with is first of all, with regard to business, I'm such a creative at heart that business wise,

• 47:56Speaker 00

  I'm really trying to work on recognizing like this has gotten so big, I need to be in these meetings. I need to be like, I need to be interacting with people on the business end of things. And like, my boyfriend always jokes, he's like, you're 99.9% creative all times. Like you need to dial it at least 10% to business, Alex. And I'm like, I don't need to answer the email. I'm, I'm just going to sit in the edit room and make the episode. So I think I've really, it's been a little bit of a challenge, like hiring people, personalities coming in, figuring out how to balance being the talent, the executive producer

• 48:40Speaker 00

  and the CEO and the owner of a company is like,

• 48:46Speaker 00

  Like it's it's a little, it almost like contradicts itself, like things that I should be doing as the talent, the CEO shouldn't be doing, like the conversations I'm having as the talent, I shouldn't be having, but I'm the CEO. So I'm like, I have to fire you. And then it's like, well, are you gonna go tweet about me? You know, it's like so strange where most companies like this, that person wouldn't be a public facing person. So like, and then my people pleasing tendencies, I've kept employees longer because I'm like, I can't fire this person, even though they're not doing their job, because like, I don't want them to go online and say I'm a bitch. And then my therapist is like, Alex, sweetie, if you're paying someone, they're not doing their job,

• 49:28Speaker 00

  you have to fire them. But I'm like, so it's like, I've struggled a lot with like, who I'm having around me. Then on the personal side of things,

• 49:40Speaker 00

  I don't want to say the word exploiting, but I'm just gonna say it, and I'm gonna take it right back. But like exploiting my life for four years, there is a cost of like,

• 49:51Speaker 00

  I don't expect a lot of people to relate to it. It's really weird that I've talked about my sex life and my breakups and my heartbreak and friend breakups and family issues and trauma and all the things you can possibly imagine. Like, that's not normal to be that open about it on the internet. So naturally, I think there's like a what's next, like always trying to one up yourself. And that can be really detrimental. And I think when I look back at the early days of Call or Daddy, like, I'm embarrassed by some of the things that I said, not that I'm embarrassed by the product, I think it was great, but there's some things that I was like, why did I say that on the internet? Like, that was mean, or that was, but it was all like, I don't think people

• 50:33Speaker 00

  understand, like, we were being rewarded by how much crazier it was. Every week, it was like, if you get crazier, the views go up, the clicks keep coming. So it was like, this really diabolical feeling in your head where it's like morally, I don't know if I should be saying this, but it just keeps bigger, getting bigger, the more that we keep saying wild shit. And I think in the beginning, we had a handle on it. And then when we hit like, episodes 50, 60, it was like throwing shit at the wall, because people just wanted to see us like dance. It was like, do something crazy again this week. And That's why I have some empathy for creators that have taken it too far,

• 51:18Speaker 00

  where you see that line is like, they push it, they push it, everyone loves right when you're teetering the line. They're like, oh yeah, oh yeah. The minute you cross the line, even though they've been encouraging you to go farther, farther, and you fall off. What's wrong with you? What? You're disgusting. Like, that's awful. You're a bad person. So it's like, it's a very, very fucked up industry to be a part of, because like, you're rewarded for the chaos, but if it's too chaos, then you're out.

• 51:46Steven Bartlett?

  Has it ever crossed your mind, being someone who publishes a lot of content and does it frequently at a certain cadence, you have a community that are expecting it from you,

• 51:57Steven Bartlett?

  that you probably can't stop, to some degree? Or the pressure that's, that exists to keep you going, keep publishing, keep going, keep going, keep going, means that there is in some respects, you could say, a bit of a lack of freedom. Like, you couldn't take six months off, right?

• 52:15Speaker 00

  I can't even take two weeks off. I, yeah, that has crossed my mind. There's,

• 52:25Speaker 00

  there's some days where like, the,

• 52:31Speaker 00

  the unforgivingness of this industry gets a little,

• 52:41Speaker 00

  it freaks me out a little bit, because I've found myself, like I just said, being like, wait, why did I do that? Because I'm so deep in it, and I'm so content focused, and I'm pulling myself out. I'm like the Alex with her family and her partner and her, her real life. Like, that's not who I am. I think, um, I actually think that's why I kind of pivoted my show for a minute to interviews. I needed like a break, because I was like, first of all, we don't need to keep hearing me talking. Like, let's give me a break. Like, you're all sick of me. Um, I wanted to just start to talk to other people for a second, because doing these solo episodes every single week, I needed something new and unique to say.

• 53:26Speaker 00

  And that can cause you to lose your fucking mind. Like, I don't think people understand, like, an hour of content. I was talking to my boyfriend about this. He's like, I make hour and a half movies that we work on for nine months. Like, every week you have an hour to fill. And if it's just you talking,

• 53:45Speaker 00

  it's, it's like, almost insane. Like, you're gonna start doing things. You're gonna start putting yourself in situations to get content, to talk about things. And I started to be like, this is unhealthy. There's other ways to entertain people and other ways to feel creatively stimulated. And that's when I just started to talk to other people. And, and then interviewing, I think, gave me like, a real sense of fulfillment, because

• 54:12Speaker 00

  it goes back to my childhood. Like, I love connecting with people. I love what we're doing right now. This is like, my jam. This is like, I could, let's go for five hours. Every time I do a podcast, people are like, that was the longest podcast we've ever done. I'm like, I can't stop talking. Because I love connecting with people. I love discussing topics. And right now, that's what I'm doing on my show. And again, like I said, who knows, maybe it will change in a year, but yeah, it's a, it's a weird feeling to be like, where is the end mark?

• 54:45Speaker 00

  I don't think there is an end mark for me, because maybe it will look different.

• 54:51Speaker 00

  But I, aside from all of like, the drama of what we're talking about, it goes back to me being like, I love this shit. And so, are there boundaries I can set with myself in order to make it healthier? Just like any person with any job. Like, you can get wrapped up in that, and it's not healthy.

• 55:10Steven Bartlett?

  A lot has been written about the financial deal you did with Spotify. A lot of people talk about that. What, what impact did that have, if any, on your life? There's, there's $60 million numbers flown around everywhere. You don't have to confirm or deny. But, um, did, did that change things in any material way?

• 55:27Speaker 00

  It was the craziest.

• 55:31Speaker 00

  Truly the craziest feeling that I've, I still can't really articulate of like, I never started this for money. I'm really fortunate how much my parents were like, keep it real, keep it normal. Like, what is all of this if you're about to be like this like, like, none of this matters. It could all be gone tomorrow. And so I've been fortunate to be raised by people that like, I just, it hasn't really affected me. I feel like the same person that I was in Pennsylvania, definitely a little bit more progressed in like, how I feel about myself and, and I feel smarter and, you know, more whole as a human being. But like, that number to, all it did to me was solidify that the brand that I built

• 56:13Speaker 00

  deserves to be where it is. And I haven't really let it get to my head. I'll let you know if it does. But like, for right now, I feel like, everyone keeps asking me, like, how did it change your life? It, for the rest of my life, will change my life and my kids' lives. And like, I get that. But in the immediate, I'm still working the way I always work. I hunch over at my computer. I, I like, I have the same keyboards. Like, people are like, how do you not have like, the keyboard with all that? Like, there's certain like, tech things that I could be doing. I don't give a shit. I want to do exactly what I've always been doing and keeping it real and tight to myself and like, a little janky. Like, I feel like it like, makes me feel like I'm still myself and it hasn't expanded in a way that maybe people think it

• 56:58Speaker 00

  has. And so I'm, I'm proud of myself that I've kind of stayed really grounded in who I am and why I started this. And I'm gonna continue to always be cognizant of like, why I started this, who I am. And none of this shit actually matters. Like, who gives a shit about a purse? Like, you could lose it. Like, I want to have real relationships. I want to be close with my family. I want to be respectful of people I'm around. I want people to like me. I want to make people happy. I want them to make me happy. I want to have fulfilling dynamics in my life. That is like, the richest thing I think about me right now is like, I've worked a lot of my relationships and I am, finally, I can say at a point where like, I'm happy in my life. And that, to me,

• 57:42Speaker 00

  like, there's no number you can put on that. I don't give a shit if they took that away from me tomorrow. Well, Spotify don't, obviously. But, well, you know what I mean? I'm like, it's, it's amazing. But-

• 57:53Speaker 00

  I still feel like the same person back in Pennsylvania.

• 57:57Steven Bartlett?

  Is there, this is a conversation I've had previously with one of the very successful women on my podcast. You built an exceptional business. Is there a unique dynamic when a woman becomes incredibly successful as you have in terms of her relationships with a man? Some of my girlfriends have often said to me that they think men can often feel emasculated a little bit when their partner is incredibly successful.

• 58:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, I remember when I started Call Her Daddy.

• 58:31Speaker 00

  I was having a really hard time with dating just because as the show got bigger.

• 58:39Speaker 00

  Yeah, men were so insecure. But also that may have been because I was the next morning talking about them on the show being like, this is what his whatever looks like like, okay. But no, I really struggled to find genuine relationships of. Like, again, I still feel like the like awkward girl that like still at times looks in the mirror. And I'm like, hyper fixating on certain things about myself, like I'm still insecure. So like, yes, I'm the Call Her Daddy girl, but I'm also Alex from Newtown, Pennsylvania, that was bullied and awkward and insecure and like hated everything about herself.

• 59:19Speaker 00

  So like, I always wanted them to know that version of me that's worked on myself to have self-love, to respect myself, like that version is who I want them to love. But you also have to love my job and respect it and appreciate that this is my passion. My partner now, I remember meeting him and I was like, oh, he's the one because he's so successful in his own right. And the amount of times that he's been like, you could stop all this tomorrow. I would love you, but you are so talented. It's like the hottest thing about you. Like when you start talking about your job, I like melt for you because you're so engaged and passionate and excited. And I love how passionate you are.

• 1:00:04Speaker 00

  It makes me so happy to be your partner that I can watch you live out your dreams. And I was like, okay, you passed the test. But, but it's hard. Like, I think if you're in a relationship.

• 1:00:18Speaker 00

  It's not to say that you, there's gonna be moments where your partner's down, you're up financially, where they're at in their career, their status, like if you just got a promotion, your partner just got fired, like that's gonna happen, but overall, respect was a huge thing for me, where this means more to me than anything. And I need someone that can respect, that like, I'm gonna choose a lot of times, my career in moments, and I need you right now to ride with me on this wave of like, maybe in 10 years, it's not gonna be the same. And my partner, like, was the, this is the first partner I've ever had that is my biggest cheerleader, is, you know, we're potentially gonna do some stuff, um, work-wise together.

• 1:01:03Speaker 00

  And he's like, you be the face of it, you do, like, I don't, like, this is you, like, this is like, all you. And it's so refreshing to have someone have such an intact ego, that when we're going to bed at night, it's like, how was your day, how was your day? All the successes, all the issues, failures, ups and downs. We're like, we'll get through it together. And that is, I'm like, it's allowed me to probably be 10 times better at my job, because I have a secure partner, I have a really great relationship. And now, when I'm showing up to work, I'm feeling even more supported than just being supported by myself and my immediate family.

• 1:01:41Steven Bartlett?

  If your partner wasn't successful in his own right,

• 1:01:46Steven Bartlett?

  do you think it would work?

• 1:01:49Speaker 00

  I think you have to define success, because I actually had this conversation with him the other day.

• 1:01:56Speaker 00

  It's not about money, it's about, I couldn't be with someone

• 1:02:03Speaker 00

  that wasn't passionate about something, that didn't have their own sense of identity, their own sense of drive and want.

• 1:02:12Speaker 00

  That doesn't work for me because I'm a very passionate person where like I I've been on dates with guys where I'm like, I get it. Like you you're you don't feel I'm I'm like electric when I talk about my job and I think that's okay. I think you I need someone that equally has something in their life that they feel so driven and pulled by. That it allows two individuals to come and make a great couple. But we got our own things and so I don't give a shit if he's not making money. If it's every single day he's waking up, working for a nonprofit and he's like, I'm gonna change the world. Go off. Absolutely. Love that.

• 1:02:50Speaker 00

  It's success to me is more that like you're successful in working towards something that you're so passionate about. That it does consume you at times. Because I'm a workaholic and like I can't have someone that's like. I just want to chill like and there's nothing wrong with that. I'm just a really aggressive motherfucker and I'm like, I need to be working and I want to be fulfilled and I am fulfilled by my job. So it doesn't have to be your job, but you have to be successful in life of what you're aiming towards achieving. You have to have some type of achievement, some type of passion, some type of purpose or else we're not gonna have too much to talk about because I can't shut up.

• 1:03:32Speaker 00

  So like, yeah, yeah, even if it's like you're a teacher. You're a teacher and you love what you're doing. You're changing these kids' lives. You're showing up amazing. It's just you have to you have to have something because I've clearly got something. And it's my baby and it's called her daddy.

• 1:03:49Steven Bartlett?

  You've clearly got something, that's for sure. I told you a second ago that guests, when they leave here, they write a question in the diary.

• 1:03:57Steven Bartlett?

  What we did, because the conversations we have here tend to lean more towards the vulnerable side of of people is we turn them into these little cards. So you can play at home and no one's ever seen the question, who's written the question. They don't know who's written them and they don't know what the questions are. But this box has a couple of questions and I've taken about 60 of them out, but I've picked a couple for you.

• 1:04:15Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 1:04:15Steven Bartlett?

  So I'm going to slide it across the table.

• 1:04:17Speaker 00

  All right, Stephen, here we go.

• 1:04:19Steven Bartlett?

  And I would like you to pick a question out of the the conversation cards. Okay. I might ask you to pick more than one. So let's see how we get on.

• 1:04:26Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 1:04:28Steven Bartlett?

  Whichever one calls you.

• 1:04:29Speaker 00

  Oh, my God. I have two. Okay.

• 1:04:36Speaker 00

  What pain do you enjoy having?

• 1:04:41Speaker 00

  What? Um, oh my God.

• 1:04:49Steven Bartlett?

  We don't want to be demonetized on YouTube, so just.

• 1:04:51Speaker 00

  Oh, right, YouTube. Oh, I've cursed too many times.

• 1:04:53Steven Bartlett?

  No, no, it's fine. The casting's fine. The casting's fine. I mean, I'm concerned about what you're.

• 1:04:59Speaker 00

  Oh, you're like the Golladay girl's about to tell me some pain. She's experienced. No, no, no. I'm gonna get deeper than that. No pun intended. YouTube. What pain do you enjoy having? I think I've enjoyed the pain of

• 1:05:21Speaker 00

  experiencing true love. I thought I was in love in the past. I was in certain variations of whatever I could be capable of giving for love and receiving for love. But recently, I've really experienced the painful moments of loving someone, going through

• 1:05:46Speaker 00

  grief, loss, death with them, going through moments of disconnect, moments of not knowing if it was gonna work out. Like, I've felt such pain in moments, but also such happiness and joy that completely overrides the pain. But I don't think I've ever experienced it the way that I have with this partner in the beginning, that it was painful to get to where we are now. Now I don't experience that pain with my partner, but like, it was.

• 1:06:17Speaker 00

  Don't curse.

• 1:06:19Steven Bartlett?

  You can curse.

• 1:06:19Speaker 00

  It was a motherfucker in the beginning to try to align, is this gonna work? Because we both knew it was there, but we were at a little bit of different points in our lives. And I think that, yeah, I enjoy the pain of of love and like, real like, once in a lifetime, it feels like love. Daddy Gangs could be like, "You sappy bitch, what? We've lost you." I'm still here, it's okay.

• 1:06:46Steven Bartlett?

  Can ask you to pick another card, one more.

• 1:06:48Speaker 00

  Absolutely. I told you, I would be here for five hours if you let me say it. Like, I will just keep talking.

• 1:06:54Steven Bartlett?

  I'm not flying back to London today, so we.

• 1:06:56Speaker 00

  Okay, you've got a flight, you've got a flight.

• 1:06:58Steven Bartlett?

  I'm joking.

• 1:06:58Speaker 00

  Um. Oh. "Do you think your younger self would be proud look up to you now?"

• 1:07:08Speaker 00

  Yeah. Yeah, I do. Which is so crazy. If anything, I wish I could have shown my younger self in those really, really dark moments, like, "Bitch, you got this." Like, "Look what you're about to do, like, just wait, hang in there." I think I would be so proud of myself because I've stayed honest with myself. I've stayed loyal to what I've wanted and I've, I've gone for it. I've taken a lot of risks and I've put myself out there, which was not something I liked to do when I was younger. So I think my younger self would be like, "Damn, we did it."

• 1:07:48Steven Bartlett?

  That phone that I proverbially slid you earlier on, I said to call your, your ex-business partner if you had 30 seconds. If I slid you that phone now and I said, "You can have a conversation with eight, 10, 12-year-old Alex Cooper, and you can say anything to her and you've got 60 seconds to say it to her." Slid you the phone, you call her, what do you say?

• 1:08:12Speaker 00

  I know right now it feels like there's no getting out of the pain. I know you feel so alone, you feel unseen, you feel unloved, you feel unworthy. But I promise you, every single thing you're going through right now is gonna build you into the person that you're gonna be so proud to be in the future. And it's worth it, hang in there, ask for help, you don't have to do everything alone. And I love you.

• 1:08:45Steven Bartlett?

  What's next for you?

• 1:08:46Speaker 00

  Whew, um, a lot that is very exciting.

• 1:08:54Steven Bartlett?

  You're launching a business, aren't you?

• 1:08:55Speaker 00

  I can tell.

• 1:08:57Steven Bartlett?

  And it's, is it a product? Is it cosmetic? What is it?

• 1:09:00Speaker 00

  I think that.

• 1:09:02Steven Bartlett?

  Tell me Kylie Jenner, tell me. You're gonna be on Forbes.

• 1:09:05Speaker 00

  I think it's gonna make a lot of sense. Um, it's, it's staying in my space. It's, I'm never gonna be like, I'm coming out with a water. Like, it's like, I'm never gonna do something that people are like, oh, God, she sold out. It's within the next month, I'll be launching something that is just going to completely elevate and expand the Call Her Daddy brand. Everything that I'm passionate about, that I've talked about today, it's just expanding and it's gonna allow Call Her Daddy to live in so many new places. And you're gonna be able to experience Call Her Daddy and that brand and other things that I'm passionate about. You're going to be able to consume it.

• 1:09:48Speaker 00

  And there's just gonna be a lot more that you're gonna be able to

• 1:09:53Speaker 00

  watch and see.

• 1:09:56Steven Bartlett?

  You've achieved so much. You know, it's funny, because when I was, you know, thinking about this new venture that you're gonna be launching, something you said earlier was really thought provoking to me. You talked about how you've kind of just gotta ask the world and executives and people that you're meeting for what you want, even if you don't really know it, what you want. That like idea of like demanding from people what you want. I think you said this when you spoke to Jay as well on his show. And it rang, rang a bell in my head somewhere because I'd heard someone, a young member of my team, say that they, in some respects, felt like they're kind of faking it, but they needed to fake it to get the value that they deserve. And I reflect on that. I think in the conversation with Jay, you were talking about how women struggle with this more than men in business, because, because of that sort of reluctance to, or whatever.

• 1:10:41Steven Bartlett?

  How important do you think it is for people listening now that look up to you, for them to fake it before they make it? Or to, you know, like, demand from the world what they want, even if they don't feel like they deserve it?

• 1:10:52Speaker 00

  I think it's everything, because I don't want you to be disingenuous with yourself, but I also want you to realize like, Confidence is a word that feels so like, ah, just be confident. It is so hard to be confident. You can be confident in certain aspects of your life and very unconfident in others. You can be confident in your friendships, but when you walk into work, you're so unconfident or the complete opposite. I would say with business, I've learned like,

• 1:11:21Speaker 00

  if you know what you want, that is something you should be able to locate. What do you want? What do you, or what do you at least think you want? What makes you happy? What's, what is a goal you can at least put on the map? Cause if not, then like you take a little minute for yourself, like come up with something. Then when you're walking into these rooms, you can allow that to kind of be your compass. I know there's so many things for call her daddy that I've wanted to do for so long. And I know that my audience knows, like I have kept caller daddy in this bubble and it's almost like about to burst. Like I've just stayed with the podcast. I have my merch, but like, I don't do much. I don't really do anything other than it.

• 1:12:00Speaker 00

  So I think when I think about expanding in my mind, it needs to be so perfect, but also I'm like, but there's so many opportunities. What do I want to do? You don't actually need to know exactly like the into the weeds of it. Start having conversations leading with that compass of this is what I know I want and ask people for help, talk to people. Like I've been having so many meetings that I'm like, I hate meetings, just let me go create, but I've been having so many meetings about what I'm about to be launching. And there's been people that are able to ask me questions that I wouldn't have been able to think about had I been at home thinking. So it's like having a compass of what you know you are driving towards, and then opening

• 1:12:45Speaker 00

  it up for discussion around people that have complete different ideas and mindsets and you will be able to find help. But sometimes I think we think we have to do it all on our own in business. Like, don't let anyone know what you're up to. It's not, there, no one can actually take that away from you because whatever you're going to do is going to be unique to you. But I do think I had a hard time asking for help. And now finally I'm having meetings with people that are so brilliant and they're allowing me to think past what my brain was only able to see. And now it's opened up a world. So anyone in business, don't be afraid to even have like a, hey, can I pick your mind for like a little bit, like let's go to a coffee. I just have like some questions I want to ask you. All of a sudden, you're going to leave there and you're going to either know more about what you want to do, or it could have completely spun you in a different direction.

• 1:13:30Speaker 00

  Either way, you're going to take something positive from it. But I think a lot of times in business, especially as women, it's like, be hush, hush. Like, don't let anyone know what you're doing. Like, I think that's, I think it's, yes, of course, keep too close to the chest of like, an IP that you're working on that like someone can't steal and you haven't trademarked or something, but like, open yourself up to other people helping you. You don't have to do it all on your own.

• 1:13:54Steven Bartlett?

  Directionally then, you're talking about the compass there. Directionally, what does Alex Cooper want?

• 1:14:02Speaker 00

  I think I really am looking forward to doing what I always wanted to do, producing and directing. I didn't intend to be an on-host talent. Let me be so clear. I remember in college, my professors were like, you should be like a sports announcer. And I was like, no. And like, nothing against sports announcers, I just knew in my bones, I was like, I don't want to do that. I don't want it like, I always wanted to be behind the camera. Then it just so happened that I'm in front of it and like, I'm like, oh, I do like it. But produce, I'm like producing myself as I'm talking right now. Like, I'm naturally more of a producer than just like a talent. So I think what I want to be able to do is to explore past just the immediate producing of a podcast.

• 1:14:46Speaker 00

  What else can I produce?

• 1:14:52Steven Bartlett?

  Sounds like a media company or something, or a studio. The Alex Cooper.

• 1:15:01Speaker 00

  I don't know, Stephen.

• 1:15:04Steven Bartlett?

  That was a long sip.

• 1:15:06Speaker 00

  Chug the thing and keep drinking. What's your next question?

• 1:15:11Steven Bartlett?

  My next question comes from the book.

• 1:15:15Steven Bartlett?

  Let's see what has been left for you. The guests never know who they're leaving it for.

• 1:15:23Steven Bartlett?

  What is one thing in your life that is currently hindering your happiness? And what will you do to rectify it?

• 1:15:33Speaker 00

  This is really weird, but I actually was, I had something that was hindering my life a little bit and my happiness. And I spent the whole past weekend just trying to figure out like, how do I?

• 1:15:53Speaker 00

  Can I say this? There was something that I was not, someone in my life that was really bringing negativity to my life.

• 1:16:08Speaker 00

  And I've worked on boundaries with my therapist. And then my therapist's classic line is like, you love to set a boundary and you hate to maintain it. And I'm like, fuck. She's like, you're so good at being like, boundary. And then a week later, I'm like, how's the boundary? And you're like, it's gone. I'm like, oh, God. So I finally, for the first time, just kind of ended a relationship with a friend. It was really just like negative and toxic. And it just was like, why is, I, I felt that like weight that you're like, oh, my God, I'm waking up and thinking about this. Like, this is so negative in my life. And I, I was able to kind of put an end gracefully to a situation that clearly wasn't making

• 1:16:53Speaker 00

  either of us happy. And I was so proud of myself because, oh, trust me, I was like replaying the conversation, like practicing in front of my boyfriend, like, how do I say this? Like confrontation to me, I'd rather flip backwards and go into a different stratosphere than have confrontation. But I was proud of myself because I was feeling really, really icky about the situation. And I, I had a conversation that was kind of beautiful and ended a really toxic situation.

• 1:17:27Speaker 00

  Cheers.

• 1:17:30Steven Bartlett?

  Not easy, not easy, difficult conversations. You know, people ask me this question all the time because I'm a podcaster. They always say, and I'm sure you get asked this so often that you're fucking sick of it and you have a pre-written answer. But I, but I'm just personally interested. What, what to you now makes for a perfect interview on your show? Like, what are the core components of just a really great Call Her Daddy interview? What are you looking for from the guest?

• 1:17:54Speaker 00

  I'm looking for them first and foremost to show up with an open mind. Um, I told you before this, I was like, someone I just recorded with was like, everyone in the morning before I came and filmed with you was like, do you want a cocktail? Do you need a drink? And the woman was like, why do I need a cocktail? Like, you're freaking me out. Like, I think Call Her Daddy has now set a standard of like, we're gonna go there. We're gonna have really open, honest conversations. So I think I want people to come open-minded of, I'm not trying to exploit you, exploit your life. I'm actually in long form, trying to get to know you as a whole human being.

• 1:18:30Speaker 00

  And that's why I really respect your show and you're so good at what you do because you're just listening and you're trying to pivot with them to understand who they are and what makes them them. So I think coming in open-minded is the first bit because I think there's a lot online for Call Her Daddy that people are like, here we go. Like, this is about to get wild. I think the second thing is someone that is willing to

• 1:18:59Speaker 00

  express things that maybe they're not even comfortable saying, or they haven't even fully thought out. Because I feel like the show does a great job of holding someone in a space of like, we'll work through it, like, say it. And then let's like backtrack and, and I'm never gonna let someone say something that's wild. And then they're like, I didn't give context, like, we'll get the context. So I think someone that's willing to just speak very frankly and openly. I think sometimes, especially celebrities have been burned so many times in media that they are really closed off. And I actually think it does a disservice to them because then they come off. More rigid or or more unlikable or, you know, less authentic.

• 1:19:43Speaker 00

  And so I think my goal is always to have someone basically trust me, which is wild. I they are meeting me usually for the first time ever when they sit down with me. And I think that I've been able somehow to gain this rapport with people in the first like two minutes before we actually start where I think they feel like she's definitely not what I thought. I think when you meet me in person, it's very different than what you see online. I think people immediately soften and are like, oh, wait, like this feels different than what I expected. And then I just ask that they trust me that I'm I'm really here to have a really exciting and interesting conversation.

• 1:20:25Speaker 00

  And I'm not trying to ruin your life and we let's see where it goes. But most of the time when people then come in are vulnerable and open and are willing to go there. That's what makes the best episode. We're all going through most of the same shit, themes wise, different levels. But the human emotion is the human emotion. I don't care if you're sitting in one country or the other, or it's all going to be different, but it is all relatively similar that we can at least be like, I can kind of connect to that. I can kind of connect that. That's always the goal. It's like, just speak and I'll do the job to wrap it in a bow to make sure that everyone feels somehow connected to this person.

• 1:21:05Steven Bartlett?

  Where's your line? In terms of earlier on, you said it took you a while to share with your audience that you had been bullied when you were younger. Do you still have things now where you go? I'm not quite ready to share that yet, or I'm thinking about sharing this part of my life with with my audience.

• 1:21:25Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, I've been like really open. I do think there's a couple things that I am only just keeping more close to the chest because I want to formulate them with a little bit more insight than just an immediate throw it up. Like, I think that the Podcasting is amazing because I can sit for an hour and talk. So I think it's a way more stimulating to hear someone speak from. In the first day that it happened to me, I was dealing with this. A month later, I, I felt like this. So I, I think there's a couple of things in my life that I'm just trying to experience a little bit more before I speak on it.

• 1:22:07Steven Bartlett?

  Anything off limits?

• 1:22:10Speaker 00

  No. I am like, I feel like I've said everything on the internet that now as I progress, anytime I'm like, should I say that? I'm like, I, I really, I don't know why, but I'm very

• 1:22:25Speaker 00

  unafraid to ju- like you could ask me anything and I'm like, I'll answer your question. Like there's never, I don't have publicists with me. Like I don't, I don't really care.

• 1:22:35Steven Bartlett?

  That sounds like a challenge.

• 1:22:38Speaker 00

  I gotta go.

• 1:22:40Speaker 00

  Time to go.

• 1:22:41Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah, I, I think, um, okay. So the, the question I'm going to ask you then, seeing as you challenged me, and this is my last question to you, is it's actually one of those cards in there. It says, I, I reflected on it when I was picking the cards that I wanted you to, to, to have. It was, um, your arms are crossed.

• 1:22:58Speaker 00

  Why did I say that?

• 1:23:00Steven Bartlett?

  Um, slide me the, slide me the card. I'll show you which card it was. It was all in here. I thought, oh, that's a, that's an interesting one.

• 1:23:06Speaker 00

  That's a doozy.

• 1:23:08Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah, this one's a real stitch up. Let me find the one it was. Ah, it's this one.

• 1:23:16Steven Bartlett?

  I'll put it back in there and I'll wrap it up just so you can uncover it. There you go.

• 1:23:20Speaker 00

  It'll be the first one.

• 1:23:22Steven Bartlett?

  There's only one in there.

• 1:23:23Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 1:23:27Speaker 00

  Oh. No.

• 1:23:34Speaker 00

  Tell me something you have never told anyone before.

• 1:23:40Speaker 00

  Oh, I'm gonna have to sit here for an hour and think about this. I, as you know, I can never shut up, so I'm pretty open. Something I've never told anyone? Oh my God.

• 1:23:57Speaker 00

  I don't know if this is gonna be anticlimactic, but I would say that I don't think I ever

• 1:24:06Speaker 00

  express

• 1:24:10Speaker 00

  how, as, as great as everything I've been talking about is, like, that

• 1:24:18Speaker 00

  my career scares me at times. Like, I don't think I've ever said that out loud to anyone, because I think I come off with like, a lot of confidence and I'm, I love what I do, but like, it, it's scary in moments.

• 1:24:34Speaker 00

  How do I explain this and like, take this out of my brain?

• 1:24:40Speaker 00

  Like, we're, we live one life, we're here, and I'm kind of like, this is what I chose to do, and I'm 28 right now. It's a little scary to think

• 1:24:56Speaker 00

  of how publicly I've decided to live my life.

• 1:25:02Speaker 00

  And I try not to think about how scary it is at times, like, because I don't think, it's a very relatable thing to say, like, when I'm producing my show, I'm always like, that doesn't sound relatable, like, talking about like, your comment section, like, it's really fucking scary how much every week I just keep putting myself out there, and I

• 1:25:33Speaker 00

  it's almost like, there's no time to stop and like, wonder, like, am I,

• 1:25:39Speaker 00

  is this what I should be doing, or would I be happier doing something else, like, because I, I am really happy, but it's like, this public world?

• 1:25:52Speaker 00

  Isn't exactly what I wanted in terms of like producing content. You can do while not being a public facing person. So I think I I get it freaks me out sometimes and then I just try to not think about it because I don't think.

• 1:26:12Speaker 00

  Just like anyone, if you're if you're going through something like I can't really explain the feelings. Maybe unless you're in the situation, which I know is like, oh boo who you chose this, but like. It's really fucking weird having millions of people. Watching you, listening to you. Taking your advice.

• 1:26:34Speaker 00

  Lit like living out what you're telling them to do like. Sometimes I'm like fuck like. Am I doing it right like? Am I?

• 1:26:47Speaker 00

  I think social media like it's a little. It's just a little. Weird because I don't think it's. Natural. So I just struggle sometimes with that. This is really fucking scary. Like we're sitting here right now, but it still doesn't register me that so many people are going to listen to this like. I'm half blacking out in this interview, but I'm like, oh shit. And then like. These are like my high thoughts always, but I'm like the perception that people have of me on the internet. I'm like, I kind of feel like that is who I am, but like, is that who I am like? You have to perform when you're in front of this microphone like I'm not talking all day.

• 1:27:30Speaker 00

  Contrary to what I've said, I never shut the fuck up, but like. It just is a little unnatural and so it's scary to. Reflect sometimes and be like. Have I taken this too far like? What am I doing? And then the other side of me is like, go like you're living your dream, like get after it. But I'm like, but like. Would it be better if all these people weren't watching and I picked something a little bit more behind the scenes? I don't know, I'm I'm I have to figure that out, but it's.

• 1:28:04Speaker 00

  It's scary as hell.

• 1:28:06Steven Bartlett?

  It's hard to undo, right?

• 1:28:09Speaker 00

  Because it's also intoxicating and it's addicting and it's unrelenting every single week. What's the new episode? What's the new episode? You put out one that people don't like to guess. That was shit. What's your next one? You're like, oh, my God, oh, my God. And it's like, not a normal job to have to be like, please, please, please, give, give, give, give, give. Oh, my God, be better, be better, get the next one. Like, make it, make sure it has this many views. Get like, you're literally like, what? Like, in bed at night, I'm like, what is the next thing? And so it's a little, it's like thrilling and exciting as hell as a creator, but also as a human being.

• 1:28:49Speaker 00

  It's scary.

• 1:28:50Steven Bartlett?

  How are you truly feeling?

• 1:28:53Speaker 00

  Right now, in this moment, or in life?

• 1:28:55Steven Bartlett?

  In life.

• 1:28:56Speaker 00

  Um, I'm really happy. I really am like, probably the happiest I've ever been. And I think that's probably why I'm able to be just so like, all over the place, open right now. Because I love to, though, think about what's next? What am I doing?

• 1:29:19Speaker 00

  But I feel very happy. And if you would ask me that, like, eight months ago, I'd be like, no. So I'm happy. I'm just constantly in my head, thinking like, I can't stop. It's like, 2 AM and I'm like, picking up my phone, writing notes. Like, um, so I, sometimes I'm like, please stop. My brain never is like, silent. So I think that's where, when I start having conversations like this, now I'm going to be home like, huh, whoa, like, this is giving me a lot to think about. But, um, no, I am really happy.

• 1:30:02Speaker 00

  I just, this job is very fucking weird. So I'm trying to figure it out. I'm 28. I've been doing this for only four years publicly, which it seems like it's been a lifetime. Literally, it feels like it's been, I feel like I've been doing this my whole life. And then to think of how big the show is and how many millions of people are watching me every day. And I'm like, I've been doing this for four years.

• 1:30:29Speaker 00

  That is actually a really short amount of time, but it feels so much longer than it actually is. So.

• 1:30:40Speaker 00

  Woo.

• 1:30:42Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:30:43Steven Bartlett?

  Well, this is why, this is why you're brilliant, isn't it? That obsession. And with that obsession comes the cost of the 2am note section in the iPhone. That's the cost of the brilliance, right? And there's always a cost to our brilliance. But thank you so much for the inspiration. You've been an inspiration for me on this show when I'm trying to figure out which way to go and trying to take cues on like why, you know, you've managed to build such an intense, immense connection with your audience. And yeah, I'm so excited to see this production company launch, the Alex Cooper Studios and your movies and all of these things you're going to do in the future. Cause they're gonna, if they, if they have the same principles as your current show, they're, they're going to be equally as awesome. And I'd love to invest in that if you're ever looking for an investor.

• 1:31:24Speaker 00

  Oh, yes. No, thank you so much, Stephen. Like you are so talented at what you do. And I don't think I've ever had a conversation with cameras around this honest. And I really appreciate whenever people are getting vulnerable and talking about their feelings. It does take a very specific type of human being for someone to open up. And I felt immediately comfortable with you and you're so talented. So thank you for having me on because this was a pleasure. But now also I'm going to be not stopping thinking about all the things I just said for the rest of the weekend. I'm like, shit. No, thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

• 1:31:59Steven Bartlett?

  Thank you so much, Alex.