ROLLUP: All Time High Debate | New ETF Record | Wormhole Airdrop

Weekly Rollup 2nd Week of March ----- ➡️ Apply to the Cartesi Grants Program here: https://bankless.cc/Cartesi ------ 🎧 Listen On Your Favorite Podcast Player: https://bankless.cc/Podcast ------ BANKLESS SPONSOR TOOLS: 🐙KRAKEN | MOST-TRUSTED CRYPTO EXCHANGE https://k.xyz/bankless-pod-q2 ⁠ 🦄UNISWAP | SWAP SMARTER https://bankless.cc/uniswap 🔗CELO | CEL2 COMING SOON https://bankless.cc/Celo 🗣️TOKU | CRYPTO EMPLOYMENT SOLUTION https://bankless.cc/toku 🛞MANTLE | MODULAR LAYER 2 NETWORK https://bankless.cc/Mantle ⚖️ARBITRUM | SCALING ETHEREUM ⁠https://bankless.cc/Arbitrum https://%E2%81%A0https//bankless.cc/Arbitrum ------ TIMESTAMPS & RESOURCES 00:00 Start 00:46 Fake All Time Highs? https://twitter.com/iamdcinvestor/status/1765320979679699285?s=46&t=2ZINVXJQKx6xO_6Wiiu_2g https://twitter.com/iamdcinvestor/status/1765320979679699285?s=46&t=2ZINVXJQKx6xO_6Wiiu_2g https://x.com/RyanSAdams/status/1763324643635835082?s=20 05:18 MARKETS https://twitter.com/GayatriPC_/status/1765441708383486109?s=20 https://twitter.com/kobeissiletter/status/1763553807298875568?s=46&t=LKBC7Qtm18FnZ380xCF2pA https://twitter.com/kobeissiletter/status/1763553807298875568?s=46&t=LKBC7Qtm18FnZ380xCF2pA https://x.com/EricBalchunas/status/1765121689036427654?s=20 https://www.ccn.com/news/bitcoin-etf-gold-btc-aum/ https://twitter.com/AP_Abacus/status/1763264513220964715?s=20 https://twitter.com/EricBalchunas/status/1763910750026793199?s=20 08:25 Biggest BTC Monthly Candle Ever https://twitter.com/intangiblecoins/status/1763390416307519840 17:58 ETH ETF? https://twitter.com/EricBalchunas/status/1763910750026793199?s=20 https://twitter.com/jchervinsky/status/1763705594949570757?s=20 24:05 Rise of The Memecoins https://www.coingecko.com/ 33:55 SEC vs Shapeshift https://www.sec.gov/files/litigation/admin/2024/34-99676.pdf?utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery https://www.sec.gov/files/litigation/admin/2024/34-99676.pdf?utm_medium=email&utm_source=govdelivery https://x.com/ErikVoorhees/status/1765411276497293365?s=20 36:28 Ryan and David Screenplay Acting https://twitter.com/RyanSAdams/status/1765463226781774048?s=20 https://www.sec.gov/news/statement/peirce-uyeda-statement-a-crypto-world-turns-03-06-24 https://x.com/0xdef1cafe/status/1765466419649540269?s=20 https://x.com/TrustlessState/status/1763607417105867050?s=20 41:12 Wormhole Airdrop https://wormhole.com/w-airdrop-explained/ https://airdrop.wormhole.com/ https://www.bankless.com/claimables?ref=no-address 47:06 Eigenlayer Passes $1 Billion https://app.eigenlayer.xyz/ 48:27 Coinbase Smart Wallets https://www.coinbase.com/blog/evolving-wallets-to-bring-a-billion-users-onchain https://twitter.com/jessepollak/status/1763583352391500103 https://x.com/RyanSAdams/status/1765481895448428882?s=20 52:14 Record CryptoPunk Sale https://warpcast.com/ecr/0x4a44d2a6 54:19 Saylor Buys More Bitcoin https://twitter.com/JanWues/status/1764788016206286996 57:17 Permissionless III https://twitter.com/Permissionless/status/1765030038905463132?s=20 https://x.com/JasonYanowitz/status/1765040063086231695?s=20 59:32 ETH Denver Uber Driver Recap https://twitter.com/moo9000/status/1765321693503832471?s=20 1:05:29 Moment of Zen https://x.com/songadaymann/status/1765838218388222375?s=20 ------ Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures⁠ https://www.bankless.com/disclosures%E2%81%A0

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  Bankers Station, happy 2nd week of March. Welcome to the bull market. Have we welcomed them enough times?

• 0:10David Hoffman?

  You've said that too many times.

• 0:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  Look, I don't think we can say that too many times, David, because people are excited about this. And it needs to be celebrated every single week of the bull market, because we gotta enjoy these times, David. We don't know how long they're gonna last.

• 0:24David Hoffman?

  That's how you burn out in a bull market.

• 0:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  Speaking of which, did you know, David, Bitcoin hit all-time highs this week for like 3 seconds?

• 0:31David Hoffman?

  It glanced it at us. It's a glancing blow.

• 0:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  Are we gonna have the debate about this right now?

• 0:39David Hoffman?

  The all-time high is still preserved. We have not crossed all-time highs.

• 0:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so I thought that we did cross all-time highs. Because I actually don't know what all-time highs are for Bitcoin. 69,000 something, I recall that much, and then everyone was saying we hit all-time highs.

• 0:59David Hoffman?

  Well, no, because all of the Twitter influencers want to have the banger tweet that goes off and gets 10,000 likes.

• 1:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, that's why I did it.

• 1:06David Hoffman?

  Yeah, but like, we touched all-time highs, maybe?

• 1:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  Touched it.

• 1:11David Hoffman?

  On Kraken, it was 69,100 and something. In my mind, all-time highs is 69,420. But really, we're not gonna like confidently be above all-time highs until like probably 70,000.

• 1:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  I wasn't saying we were confidently. I'm wondering, I'm asking a question whether it technically counts. Because if it's above the last all-time high, then it technically counts. And I will concede-

• 1:34David Hoffman?

  It technically counts, but it's cringe to celebrate.

• 1:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  No, it's not. If it technically counts, then we did. Then we did.

• 1:41David Hoffman?

  No, no. We are not in spirit, we have not crossed all-time highs.

• 1:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  But you're saying it doesn't technically count. You're saying it wasn't actually technically hit. And I'm trying to find the truth of that. On like what chart? What's the canonical all-time high number?

• 1:54David Hoffman?

  There is a number, because like Kraken has their number, Coinbase has its number, like Binance has its number.

• 2:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, and the David Hoffman definition-

• 2:03David Hoffman?

  And the David Hoffman number, which is the canonical version.

• 2:06Ryan Sean Adams?

  You just, okay, you picked the highest ones. You picked the highest ones.

• 2:09David Hoffman?

  69,420.

• 2:11David Hoffman?

  Which we did not touch.

• 2:12Ryan Sean Adams?

  So according to David, we did not hit all time high.

• 2:15David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 2:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  According to Ryan, we did for three seconds.

• 2:18David Hoffman?

  People in my Twitter DMs all agree that it's a mulligan, it's a do-over, we did not cross all time highs.

• 2:24Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's your Twitter followers. Of course they agree with you. That's like-

• 2:27David Hoffman?

  My Twitter followers are the best followers.

• 2:31Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, we'll let the bankless nation decide whether we hit all time high or not.

• 2:34David Hoffman?

  Those are my Twitter followers.

• 2:35Ryan Sean Adams?

  I'm fine. I'm fine waiting for another week, another two weeks, because I can start this episode again by saying, welcome to the bull market.

• 2:43David Hoffman?

  At the beginning of last week-

• 2:44Ryan Sean Adams?

  Crowd goes wild.

• 2:45David Hoffman?

  I think it was actually the day before this happened. It was like Wednesday or something. And I think it was like you, Josh, a few other people were all in a bankless call together and we're like, oh yeah, we're hitting all time highs tomorrow. And I'm like, we're not hitting all time, like we are at $67,500 and you guys were like, yeah, we're hitting all time highs tomorrow. I'm like, guys, it's not, it's gonna be next week. Like, it's not happening this week.

• 3:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  So, wait, but, but to me, that's more evidence that we actually hit all time high and you're, you're in denial, maybe, David? Because you've, you've already called it. You've already implanted this in your psychology that we're not hitting it to next week. Maybe we actually hit it.

• 3:19David Hoffman?

  We did not hit it.

• 3:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  Or is this, is this part of your, is this part of your plan to, to do the quiet?

• 3:23David Hoffman?

  To calm people down? Yeah. It would be better for the industry if we were hitting it later.

• 3:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right. Well, that's one thing we're going to talk about a little bit, this all time high question. What else, David? We've got some records that broke as well. The spot ETFs broke another record. We talked about that. And also, I want to talk to you about the Ethereum ETF, because some people are saying that we are a little too excited about the ETF. And we should cool our jets a little bit. What else we got?

• 3:49David Hoffman?

  Wormhole announcing their airdrop. Who is eligible? We got a summary for all the details, but we're gonna need more details out of Wormhole in the future. We'll talk about that. Eigenlayer surpassed $10 billion. Yowzer. And also, the SEC is going after Shapeshift. Commissioner Hester Purce drops a screenplay and United States Attorney General has called the SEC a regulatory power grab. The SEC drama does not continue. Before we get into all of those details, we got a message for you from our friends and sponsors over at Cartezzi. I don't know what Cartesi is, is a modular execution layer that runs Linux. So if you want a chain, an app chain that runs Linux as the virtual machine, an alt virtual machine,

• 4:34David Hoffman?

  Cartesi is a place for you. It's a place where you can build DApps that leverage all the traditional open source library and tooling that exists in the Linux space. Linux, maybe you've heard of it. And so there is a $1 million ecosystem grant from Cartesi that is now live and they want to give you some of that money. They want to give you money. So you can apply for that money with a link in the show notes, banklist.cc/cartesi, C-A-R-T-E-S-I.

• 4:59Ryan Sean Adams?

  The world runs on Linux. Why shouldn't our blockchains, I guess, David? That's where we're going. Let's talk about Bitcoin price right now. Now, I will agree with you. We are not at all time high at the time of recording.

• 5:12David Hoffman?

  Recording, yeah.

• 5:13Ryan Sean Adams?

  What do we have on the week, David?

• 5:14David Hoffman?

  Okay, we started the week at $62,300, up $5,400 on the week, 8.5%. We are currently at $67,800.

• 5:25Ryan Sean Adams?

  Can we talk about this, this big red candle down?

• 5:28David Hoffman?

  Yeah, how we got $1 billion of people getting liquidated?

• 5:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so what is up with this? By the way, we're looking at these glorious prices on the Kraken Pro charts, which is a fantastic place to go buy your crypto assets this cycle. But we, okay, here's where some people called the all time high right here. And then just after that, we just tanked, like double digit.

• 5:55David Hoffman?

  Such obvious price action.

• 5:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  Double digit candle down. What happened? Why did that happen?

• 6:00David Hoffman?

  Because a bunch of D gens levered up and too many of them all joined on the same trade. And then it was too frothy, too quickly, and then everyone got liquidated. And then the crazy thing is, we spiked right back up. So we went right back up to like $68,000. I mean, leverage is a rite of passage. Leverage is a part of the bull market. So like when I say degens, I don't mean it like in a derogatory fashion. It's just, I only mean it when there's too many of them. We can't all be degens.

• 6:31Ryan Sean Adams?

  You only mean it when it becomes a problem.

• 6:33David Hoffman?

  Yeah, exactly. We all, we all need to take healthy turns being degens.

• 6:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  Slow down. Don't celebrate your all time highs before they happen, right?

• 6:41David Hoffman?

  Don't, don't take leverage right before all time highs. Like, come on.

• 6:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  It was funny.

• 6:45David Hoffman?

  The fact that we spiked right back up is like one of the most bullish like price actions I've ever seen. Like a bunch of degens gets liquidated and then we just resume like right where we lost.

• 6:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Resumessent?

• 6:57David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 6:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  You know, some people are actually panicking about this and you know, like I saw some tweets joking, oh, bear market's over. Pack it in, boys. That was it. We hit all time high. That's it. See you in 2028. This is DC investor echoing your sentiments. Look, I'm no expert, but when something suddenly retraces 15% and then sets a new cycle high the next day, it's pretty effing bullish.

• 7:20David Hoffman?

  New cycle high. These are the words that you need to be using right now. DC said it well.

• 7:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right. Good job, DC.

• 7:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  Also, David, did you know this? All right. So here's something I will say that I am actually knowledgeable about with respect to Bitcoin all time high is the real all time high, at least in fiat terms, inflation adjusted is actually not 60,000, 69,000 Bitcoin, 69,420 or whatever your number is. The real time, all time high, when you adjust for inflation, is actually 77K Bitcoin. Because we've had a whole lot of inflation since the last time Bitcoin hit all time high. So I think what that means is we can celebrate it twice.

• 8:04David Hoffman?

  Dude, your all time high measures are weird. Okay. So it was basically one November of 2021 Bitcoin was worth $77,000 in today's dollars.

• 8:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. Look at the buying power.

• 8:17David Hoffman?

  Right. Okay. So we have fiat all-time highs at 69,420 and then we have real purchasing power all-time highs at $77,000. One of the crazy things that happened, I put out a tweet that was, the last two weeks are going to go down and like one of the most bullish two weeks in crypto history, simply straight due to price action. The February 2024 Bitcoin candle was the largest monthly candle in Bitcoin history, going from like $4,250 up to $61,000. Yeah. Yeah.

• 8:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wow. Let's just take a look at that.

• 8:52David Hoffman?

  That's impressive. And the thing is, is like, that's now the floor. Like, we're going to have, if, you know, bull markets repeat themselves, which they do, that, we're going to have at least a few more of those.

• 9:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  Few more best, like, February's or best months, you mean?

• 9:07David Hoffman?

  Few more biggest candles ever.

• 9:09Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 9:10David Hoffman?

  And so like, how big is that candle? 42 to 61? So almost a $20,000 candle. We get, I'm calling it, we get at least two more $20,000 candles in Bitcoin this cycle.

• 9:20Ryan Sean Adams?

  So just to put some numbers on the uncharted territory that we're, we're in right now, even if we're not at all-time high, we're real close.

• 9:29David Hoffman?

  We are, we are not crossing all-time highs, we are in price discovery.

• 9:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yes. Bitcoin has only spent five days above the current price and the current price at the time of this tweet was about 65K. So this is pretty close to alt, like, uncharted territory, price discovery phase.

• 9:49David Hoffman?

  We're, we're in uncharted territory, I would say.

• 9:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. David, the reason for this, it feels like, is once again, the Bitcoin ETFs, because we got another record on this. What are we looking at?

• 10:00David Hoffman?

  Bitcoin ETFs that registered the largest net inflows since day one. So new record. So that is the new all-time high, Ryan. You can celebrate that all-time high. I will allow, I will allow you that one.

• 10:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  You're so generous.

• 10:11David Hoffman?

  $648 million in one day. That's net inflows. $648 million came into the Bitcoin ETFs.

• 10:20Ryan Sean Adams?

  All of them, right?

• 10:21David Hoffman?

  Collectively, all of them. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So like, that's just like, we're just, Bitcoin has $640, $50 million of daily buying pressure. I mean, that's an all-time high record, but like, we keep breaking all-time highs in daily buying pressure from TradFi.

• 10:37Ryan Sean Adams?

  Your all time high?

• 10:38David Hoffman?

  Tell me.

• 10:39Ryan Sean Adams?

  Blackrock ETF just hit 10 billion and that is-

• 10:42David Hoffman?

  Well, that's up only. Has it ever lost any Bitcoin? It's up only.

• 10:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  I think it's been all time high just about every week we've recorded, actually. It's a impressive amount of Bitcoin and value. Eric Balchunas says that this is a milestone. He said the 10 Bitcoin ETFs did 10 billion in volume. Now, he's talking about volume, smashing previous record set last Wednesday. Volatility and volume go hand in hand with ETFs, so not totally surprised. That said, these are bananas numbers for ETFs under two months old. Under two months old. It's a newborn. ETFs are new, brand new.

• 11:19David Hoffman?

  So, we can talk about another flippening. Usually, we talk about ETH flipping Bitcoin, but that's not looking like it's happening anytime soon. Not with this kind of price action. But the thing that is probably going to happen, hopefully, if you're a crypto bull, gold being flipped by Bitcoin, the gold ETF in the lead with $92 billion in the gold ETFs. Where are we at with the Bitcoin ETFs and the total AUM in Bitcoin ETFs?

• 11:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  About half that, David.

• 11:45David Hoffman?

  Half that?

• 11:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yep, half that. So, we're at like 40, 45, getting close to 50. And all we have to do is double the price of Bitcoin and then we're above gold.

• 11:55David Hoffman?

  Dude, gold is getting flipped so soon. Not only are we going to double the amount of Bitcoins in the ETFs over this coming year, Bitcoin price is also doubling.

• 12:04Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, exactly. It seems like a lot if you're like, oh, we have to get, you know, like double amount of buying. No, you don't. You just have to get a little bit more, you know, buying and then price just needs to go up. And it has been going up. I mean, think about it, though. Like, who, do you know anyone your age? I mean, maybe this is an unfair question because your social network, I'm sure, is so plugged into crypto.

• 12:24David Hoffman?

  Yes, I have zero non-crypto friends.

• 12:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is a terrible data point, but just, I just, I can't imagine being like a millennial-

• 12:32David Hoffman?

  Who the F is buying gold?

• 12:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  And you're just like, you know what I'm bullish on? You know, just gold. Give me all that gold.

• 12:39David Hoffman?

  The only reason why you would be bullish gold over Bitcoin is if you think the internet is gonna have structural problems.

• 12:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  If the internet has structural problems.

• 12:50David Hoffman?

  We have structural problems.

• 12:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's a, that's a, um, at this point, I mean, we are so plugged in, like electrical grid goes down, internet goes down. What are you gonna do with your freaking gold? I'd rather have like weapons than that, than gold at that point.

• 13:05David Hoffman?

  Yes, buy guns.

• 13:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so, uh, that's a little update for you. And, uh, our friends over at Wells Fargo, David, you know, they're getting in on this Bitcoin action.

• 13:16David Hoffman?

  They're the best people over there.

• 13:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Merrill Lynch, Wells Fargo, um, my personal bank, by the way. I've banked at Wells Fargo since like, I was a kid.

• 13:23David Hoffman?

  Yep, that is my first, is my first bank.

• 13:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  Really? And it still is. It's funny how, like, I just haven't changed banks. It's always been my...

• 13:31David Hoffman?

  Why would I do that?

• 13:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  I just use it a lot less now.

• 13:34David Hoffman?

  They're all equally shit.

• 13:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  I, I use it a lot less because I am banking less, you know, bank less.

• 13:40David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 13:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  Let's talk about ETH. Enough, enough about Bitcoin. Bitcoin's doing a big...

• 13:44David Hoffman?

  Did you say why we're talking about, uh, Wells Fargo?

• 13:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  I think I did. They, they're approving multiple Bitcoin ETFs, so...

• 13:50David Hoffman?

  Yes. Merrill Lynch, Wells Fargo approving multiple Bitcoin ETFs in their wealth management clients.

• 13:55Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 13:56David Hoffman?

  Which have trillions of dollars in assets, and these are just some of the many banks that are going to be doing this.

• 14:01Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, because banks have wealth managers on staff. Do you know, they'll, uh, they'll give you a call and they'll just be like, "Hey, can we help you invest your money? I see you have a lot of money in your savings account or your checking account." And they're like, "Can we help you buy some Bitcoin ETFs?"

• 14:11David Hoffman?

  I don't get those calls.

• 14:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, maybe, uh, maybe I'll send some, uh, Wells Fargo wealth managers your way, give you some advice, David. What are we at on the ETH price this week?

• 14:23David Hoffman?

  ETH price, extremely healthy performance this week. The ETH chart is just a straight, linear line.

• 14:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is so weird to see. Look at this.

• 14:31David Hoffman?

  It is the straightest, most linear line I have ever seen.

• 14:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Looks artificial.

• 14:35David Hoffman?

  Yeah, it looks oddly artificial. Yeah, can you, can you hit the one day candles? We're looking at four hour candles. Goes back from, it goes back one month. Hit one day candles. How long is that a line for? My god! It is a line from October.

• 14:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  The traders call that the stairway to heaven.

• 14:51David Hoffman?

  That, well, that is climbing a wall of worry. That's what that looks like to me. Yeah, okay, from October until February, we were at one degree, one Y equals MX plus B line degree. Uh, and now...

• 15:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  Good algebra, David.

• 15:04David Hoffman?

  You like that one?

• 15:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 15:05David Hoffman?

  From February, we're on a much more vertical line.

• 15:10David Hoffman?

  Okay, we started the week $3,863. Uh, excuse me, we started the week $3,430, up $420, nice, uh, to $3,863, up 12%.

• 15:22Ryan Sean Adams?

  Another double digit.

• 15:23David Hoffman?

  ETH actually gained 4% versus Bitcoin on the week, even when Bitcoin had $100 million of inflows just yesterday.

• 15:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wow, okay, is this quote-unquote alt season? I don't consider ETH an alt, by the way.

• 15:38David Hoffman?

  If you go look down the market cap stack, it is absolutely alt season. Have you seen the absolute shitcoins that crypto Twitter is peddling right now?

• 15:44Ryan Sean Adams?

  Is that alt season? That's something. That's narrative season, for sure, whatever the narrative de jour is.

• 15:50David Hoffman?

  You haven't even seen some of the degenerate, like, uh, 2024 election tokens that are pumping right now.

• 15:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  I've heard about them. I saw CoinGecko added a category called "political."

• 16:01David Hoffman?

  Yeah, political meme coins.

• 16:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's like Trump coin, and there's like four or five others, and I was like, that's an area I'm not even touching.

• 16:08David Hoffman?

  I don't even know how to pronounce it, like, the Biden one is like Job Boden, or something like this, and like, Trump has equally like misspelled and odd and weird. They're on Solana, and this is, Solana's actually having a fantastic price action week this week, too.

• 16:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did you hear, uh, did you read Travis Kling's tweets? He's just like, "The reason for this is a financial nihilism." That's a Dimitri Kofinas take, too.

• 16:29David Hoffman?

  100% is financial nihilism. Meme coins are the most financially nihilist, like, financial assets I can imagine, which is why they have so much product market fit with crypto.

• 16:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  The comment is basically because millennials, like, specifically younger millennials and Gen Z can't afford houses, and so what do they do? They just gamble it, uh, because they're...

• 16:47David Hoffman?

  It is funny. It is funny. And I will say like this, when you give...

• 16:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's GameStop. It's GameStop stuff.

• 16:52David Hoffman?

  When you give the people the power to produce financial assets permissionlessly, like, what's the first thing that we did on the internet? Cat pictures. Now we have dog coins, but now people are like, "Hey, I can make a meme coin about anything." Jacob from Zora had a really good tweet that I liked, which is, he said, "In the future, meme coins will just be memes." This is just, they're just memes, but now they just have a chart with them, and you can make or lose money on them.

• 17:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Buyer beware is all I gotta say, but it is kind of entertaining. Let's put the ETH number in perspective compared to Bitcoin. So the last time Bitcoin was trading at this level, so you know, 65K and above, ETH was trading at 4,878. There's a lesson in there, says croissant.eth. What do you think the lesson is?

• 17:37David Hoffman?

  The lesson is that this is just where we are in the market cycle. First Bitcoin pumps, then ETH pumps, and everything else pumps.

• 17:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  So we're implying ETH has some catch up to do, and it will do that catch up?

• 17:47David Hoffman?

  Well, it caught up by 4% this week. As we approach the ETH ETF, which despite what some of the content further on in this weekly roll up will say, is definitely coming.

• 17:58Ryan Sean Adams?

  Let's get to that content. Why spoil it? Okay, so the big question mark, I think, the thing that would send, I expect ETH to beyond all time highs, I don't know, to the moon, to somewhere else, to somewhere we haven't seen before.

• 18:12David Hoffman?

  The giga moon.

• 18:13Ryan Sean Adams?

  The giga moon, yeah.

• 18:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  Is the Ethereum ETF, all right? So the question is, when's it coming? The two people I know who probably know the best, have the best estimates on this, are Eric Balchunas and James Saifert. And by the way, we have invited them on the podcast. They're gonna, they're putting out new estimates. When they do, we're gonna have them on the podcast and give you the download. But the tweet I have on the screen is a quote tweet quoting Jake Trivinsky. Jake Trivinsky says, "I am a lot less confident about ETH ETF approval this year than many of you are. The reason: The SEC got a ton of political blowback for approving Bitcoin ETFs, even though the court basically forced it to. Now, animal spirits are in control of the market, and an ETH ETF would only add to that."

• 19:00Ryan Sean Adams?

  So the comment is basically Gary Gensler took it, you know, politically to the gut because he approved this. The anti crypto army did not like this.

• 19:10David Hoffman?

  Like

• 19:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  In some circles, not, not in our circles.

• 19:14David Hoffman?

  Okay.

• 19:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  In some circles.

• 19:16David Hoffman?

  Maybe Jake knows more about this. I do not see the political blowback for approving the Bitcoin ETFs. I think like Elizabeth Warren made some comments, a few other people made some comments, but like, I didn't see any of that.

• 19:25Ryan Sean Adams?

  But that's Gary's circle. That's Gary's network. You know how we were talking about in your network, you probably don't know anyone who would buy gold. In Gary's network, I mean, things are a lot different with the people Gary hangs out with and people that put Gary in power, right? So that's Jake's and like, so political punch to the gut for Gary, he's not going to do it. And now that the market is pumping, the SEC probably doesn't want to add to this. And let's recall.

• 19:51David Hoffman?

  Is that a reason for denying or delaying?

• 19:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  None of it's been a valid reason. It's however Gary feels, because remember, he's the, he's the third vote.

• 20:00David Hoffman?

  But it's not however Gary feels. It's who's going to sue him if he's being arbitrary and capricious.

• 20:06Ryan Sean Adams?

  True, true. And that's kind of maybe the counter to this, right? Is somebody's going to sue him, it forced his hand the same way they forced the hand of Bitcoin. But I don't know. I mean.

• 20:17David Hoffman?

  I think, I think he's got one shot of delaying it in May. And then he basically has to approve it by November, which is the latest deadline before shit really hits the fan, before the SEC gets sued. Like, it's the same logic as the Bitcoin ETF.

• 20:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  So there's two layers to this about our general excitement about the Ethereum ETF, right? Is the question of will it happen? Yes, no. And that's some, you know, probability. And by the way, Eric Balchunas and James Saifert said, the last time they put estimates out was greater than 50% that it would happen in 2024. I don't know what their revised estimates are.

• 20:52David Hoffman?

  The last numbers I heard was 60% in May, 95, 90 plus percent by November.

• 20:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  Sure. Okay. So that's, but that's layer one of the analysis, David, because layer two is when it comes out, will it matter? Right? It mattered in a massive way for Bitcoin, obviously. The inflows were beyond what anyone expected. But why does that necessarily apply to Ethereum? And for you and I, we're like.

• 21:15David Hoffman?

  The same inflows that everyone else?

• 21:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. Eric Balchunas again. He says, this is like, he's talking about the Ethereum ETF if it happens. It's like the opening act coming on after the headliner. Using Gen Z bands, it's like Sister Hazel trying to follow Nirvana. So this is basically like, you know, the opener act. We already had the kind of the Bitcoin is the rock star. So, and, and he justifies that by basically saying, like, look at ETH futures. ETH futures are paltry right now in terms of, of demand. And so he's saying it like it might not matter. It'd just be like a fart in the wind. No one cares about this.

• 21:54David Hoffman?

  Okay. The comparison of Bitcoin futures to ETH futures, I think, makes sense. But it would have to be Bitcoin futures pre Bitcoin ETF. That's, but A, that, B, that's not what Sandy Cal said. Sandy Cal said is that the ETH ETF is going to be interesting to investors because it is a tech platform play. And that is what people like. ETH is a little bit more hard to understand. It has like dollar cost flows, which like Wall Street needs to like wrap their head around. But also, at the same time, ETH has one third the market cap of Bitcoin. So like, maybe we have one third of the demand that Bitcoin has, but we have three times the sensitivity to price movements that Bitcoin does because we're one third, we as Ethereum are one third the size.

• 22:37Ryan Sean Adams?

  I just think for this part of the analysis, though, this is Belchunis's take, and he does have a data point, which is ETH futures. And like, fair enough, they, they have it like, so I kind of factor that in. However, I will say, I think that people who are bullish Ethereum are going to be bullish demand for the Ethereum ETF. And if you're not bullish Ethereum, you're more bullish Bitcoin, then you're kind of like bullish Bitcoin ETF. I remember when the Bitcoin ETF launched, a lot of people said, there will be no demand. And these are generally people who are not like in the category of being bullish Bitcoin. So, you know, we'll have to see, I guess, but it's an interesting discussion. It doesn't, it doesn't dissuade me from being excited about this.

• 23:20Ryan Sean Adams?

  I'll say that, but maybe give some, some pause for thought. ETH Bitcoin ratio, David, what are we at on the week?

• 23:26David Hoffman?

  Yeah, we're up on the week, 0.0573 up on the week.

• 23:31Ryan Sean Adams?

  How about the crypto market cap?

• 23:34David Hoffman?

  Oh yeah, God, crypto is getting crazy. 2.6, 2.7 trillion dollars. We are getting a lot amount of a price, a total crypto market cap increase because of the number of degenerate shitcoins, excuse my language, that are, the long tail of crypto is getting a pump from the fat tail. This is what, this is the way that it always plays out. Bitcoin loads up its jet fuel and with all of the ETF flows and then people who want to go risk on get bumped out of Bitcoin and they start looking down tail. And now we have like, we'll talk about the movers of the week. Movers of the week, where are they? Pepe, Floki, Shiba Inu, Dogwith Hat.

• 24:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  Quality investments here.

• 24:15David Hoffman?

  If you were in any of these, congratulations, you had a fantastic week.

• 24:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  Like 100% triple digit up.

• 24:21David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 24:22Ryan Sean Adams?

  We're excited about our double digit up with Bitcoin and ETH, and this is triple digit up.

• 24:26David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 24:27Ryan Sean Adams?

  Right now.

• 24:27David Hoffman?

  138% on Shiba Inu.

• 24:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Ah, I mean, the question is, is retail back? I think you got a clip that you want to play us, but before we get to that, let's talk about layer twos as well, which are majorly up on the week. And of course, our layer two update is always brought to you by Mantle, which is a new and upcoming

• 24:44David Hoffman?

  Also up on the week, yeah.

• 24:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  That we enjoy very much. So tell me about this. Look at this, David. That is a...

• 24:51David Hoffman?

  Added like $8 billion, $7 billion in the last seven days. $37 billion total value locked in layer twos. We have a brand new layer two blasting onto the scene. It's called Blast. Number three roll up by TVL, $2.75 billion on day one. You gotta like tip your hat to the player of the game, Pac-Man. We're gonna get him on the show sometime soon.

• 25:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  What is, so this is interesting. The reason I love looking at Blast on layer two B, and it's almost at $3 billion as well, is because it shows you the stage, like the security stage and the decentralization. It is stage zero in the same way OP mainnet is. But the annotation on layer two B is it's full trading wheels and there's currently, there's no available node software that can reconstruct the state from L2 data, L1 data. Hence, there is no way to Verified that this system is a roll up. So not quite as

• 25:45David Hoffman?

  There's no, there's, there's no exit hash.

• 25:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  There's no exit hash that has been verified right now.

• 25:50David Hoffman?

  I mean, like, the whole strategy with Blast was like, go to market, get TVL, go to market, get TVL, get users, get projects, go to market, get TVL. And they executed on that part of the roadmap, like, like, honestly, study it. It was immaculate. They put, they got $2.75 billion on day one. Insane.

• 26:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  Did they cut corners, though? Is it risky?

• 26:09David Hoffman?

  100% they cut, they cut all corners possible. That's why there's $2.57 billion in there.

• 26:15Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, and there's, it's, it's a fine line between, wow, that was really smart, and like, oh, you guys, like, you just

• 26:22David Hoffman?

  Bad look, bad look.

• 26:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, bad look. And so, I don't know. I mean, as long as they don't get hacked, as long as nothing bad happens.

• 26:27David Hoffman?

  As long as they don't lose anyone's money. As long as they don't lose any of that $2.75 billion.

• 26:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  All right, so Blast now live. Also, on the Layer 2 side, Arbitrum transactions are going nuts. Did I see something about this?

• 26:39David Hoffman?

  Yeah, so go and go to the activity tab on Layer 2s, because we, we got some nice numbers here.

• 26:43Ryan Sean Adams?

  Arbitrum Nova, is this the one?

• 26:45David Hoffman?

  Yes, Arbitrum Nova. You want to know why, Ryan?

• 26:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 26:48David Hoffman?

  I was, Arbitrum Nova is like the second Arbitrum chain, extremely cheap fees, really putting in a new all-time high.

• 26:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  Because it's a Validium, right?

• 26:55David Hoffman?

  It's a Validium, off-chain data, yeah. So 40 to 50 transactions per second sustained. These are real transactions. No vote transactions, no, like, blah, blah, blah transactions. Real transactions.

• 27:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  Who's doing this?

• 27:06David Hoffman?

  40 to 50 per second. Over a million transactions, I think, in a very short amount of time. This, it's this, it's this brand-new project, which is a D-PIN project on Arbitrum. D-PIN stands for Decentralized Physical Infrastructure Network, called Airbus. Air, excuse me, Arbus, RBs, RBs, final answer, RBs AI. It's a D-PIN project working on AI compute. It's an AI compute project. It's a goddamn AI project. Of course it is.

• 27:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Of course it would be. Do you think that, by the, by the way, I, I tweeted this out, and I was just like, hey, I'm real, like, I've been worried about how much block space we're creating, who's gonna buy it? And the comment that I added this morning was like, oh, I see who's gonna buy it. It's the AIs, it's the robots.

• 27:50David Hoffman?

  It's gonna be AI.

• 27:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  Do you think that's real?

• 27:52David Hoffman?

  Hundred percent, hundred percent. Bankless listeners didn't listen to our AI meme coin episode that came out earlier this week.

• 27:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  It was so good.

• 27:57David Hoffman?

  One hundred percent listened to that, because, I mean, this is, 2017 was the ICO mania, 2021 was the NFT mania, 2024, AI frenzy, AI frenzy.

• 28:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, let's get back to the frenzy. And David, you have a clip that you wanted us to see. And this, you set this up first.

• 28:14David Hoffman?

  Yeah, let me tee this up. Yeah, so this is, I bet you like, less, less than half of bankless listeners will be kind of exposed to this. So just to let you know what's going on, this happened last cycle. This was also about to start happening this cycle. This is retail. This is what retail looks like. Let's go ahead and watch this TikTok video from Mr. Retail.

• 28:33Speaker 02

  So y'all seen my video yesterday, right?

• 28:35Ryan Sean Adams?

  No, I didn't.

• 28:36Speaker 02

  This was at a hundred dollars. It has gone up sixty seven dollars in 24 hours. Actually, oh, hold on. Today's return, sixty four dollars. Total return, a hundred and eleven. That's in four days. I invested in this four days ago, and it's, yes. Do not believe anybody. Everybody doubted Dogecoin and thought it wasn't going to amount to anything. And now look at it, almost twenty cents. Huh. This, this, three point eight million. Get it. Get it now before it goes up more. It is constantly steadily going.

• 29:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Get it now.

• 29:09Speaker 02

  Do not listen to these people saying it ain't going nowhere. It's going. It's happening now. Sixty dollars overnight. Thought y'all said it won't go and do nothing.

• 29:18David Hoffman?

  So when he says it's up sixty seven dollars, he put a hundred dollars in to Coinbase, bought a hundred dollars worth of Shib. It's up sixty seven dollars, and he's stoked. And he's telling all of his TikTok friends to also go buy Shib. This is what we're up against.

• 29:33Ryan Sean Adams?

  Cannot go down.

• 29:33David Hoffman?

  This is what we're up against.

• 29:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Here's the thing. I think for a lot of people, that guy sounds exactly like you and I, David, at the beginning of this episode. And that is the problem. It's hard to differentiate.

• 29:46David Hoffman?

  Yeah.

• 29:47Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's really hard for people to differentiate. So that's why you got to do your work.

• 29:50David Hoffman?

  Maybe we are the same, you know? Maybe, maybe we're no better. We just kill ETH and Bitcoin, but not so ETH.

• 29:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  We just like to virtue signal, that's all. That's the difference here.

• 30:00David Hoffman?

  Sniff our own farts.

• 30:01Ryan Sean Adams?

  A couple of other milestones here. Tether, over $100 billion now in Tether. So we just had the Tether CEO, Paulo, on the podcast. It was a great episode. I think we'll have Jeremy Lehrer on as well. So go check out that episode, but pretty big milestone. And also, this has started happening. So Coinbase is now breaking into the top 100 in the Apple App Store. And this is the first time since early 2022 that this has happened.

• 30:29David Hoffman?

  Because we have all these TikTokers telling people to go buy SHIB. They have to go re-download Coinbase.

• 30:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, my God. Coinbase, there was a time where Coinbase would not be listing SHIB, but those are the old days, I guess.

• 30:38David Hoffman?

  Actually, I don't, I don't know if SHIB is on Coinbase, but it probably is.

• 30:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  Hell, like a Coinbase wallet to me. David, what do we have coming up next?

• 30:44David Hoffman?

  Coming up next, SEC sends a cease and desist to a crypto exchange shapeshift. Eric Voorhees does not blink. Meanwhile, Commissioner Hester Purce wrote a screenplay about the utter absurdity of the matter. Big airdrop coming that Garrett Genzer doesn't want you to have. The wormhole token is out, rewarding users across all these different chains. So we're going to get to all of this and more. But first, a moment to talk about some of these fantastic sponsors that make this show possible, especially Kraken, the exchange with 100% uptime this week. If you do not have an account with Kraken, consider clicking the link in the show notes if you want an exchange that doesn't go down.

• 31:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, wow.

• 31:16David Hoffman?

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• 32:01David Hoffman?

  Whether you're a complete beginner or a seasoned pro. Go to kraken.com slash bankless to see what crypto can be. Not investment advice. Crypto trading involves risk of loss. Uniswap is revolutionizing the DeFi space, not just by enabling swaps, but by empowering you to swap smarter with a comprehensive suite of products for faster, safer and more informed swapping. Say goodbye to pop-up wallet extensions. The Uniswap extension is coming soon and this extension is not a pop-up. It is a sidebar in your browser that persists no matter where you are on the web. This means you can swap, sign or send and receive crypto anytime, anywhere, without obstructing your browser window. But that's not all. The Uniswap web app now features limit orders. So you can buy and sell any token at your price, on your terms, without having to watch the market. And the best part, limit orders are built on Uniswap X, which means no gas fees.

• 32:46David Hoffman?

  Also new to the web app is the data and insights pages with real-time candlestick charts, price data, transaction logs and detailed pool data, all integrated into the Uniswap web app. All of these new releases come together to create one platform to help you swap smarter every time, no matter where you are, on web, mobile or on the extension. Click the link in the show notes to sign up for the extension waitlist and download the mobile app. Start swapping smarter with Uniswap. Are you launching a token? Is it already live? How are you managing the legal and tax obligations for providing token grants to your team? It's no secret that token management gets complicated. Between learning all the legal language and tax obligations in every country that your team is in, token grant management can feel like an obstacle course. But it doesn't have to. That's where Toku steps in. Toku provides practical tools to handle token grants,

• 33:30David Hoffman?

  allowing for effective oversight of token distributions and payroll tax compliance for employees, contractors, advisors and investors. They also handle tax withholdings through their real-time tax calculations that can be done by Toku or integrated into any payroll EOR providers in any jurisdiction. Toku is a trusted provider of Protocol Labs, DYDX Foundation, Mina Protocol and many more. Get started for free and make token compensation simple at toku.com slash bankless.

• 33:55Ryan Sean Adams?

  Another week, David, more SEC shenanigans. A couple of things we need to get into. All right, so you know Shapeshift, which was Eric Voorhees' exchange.

• 34:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  Mostly now a decentralized exchange, by the way. But there was a point in time where there was some counterparty risk with Shapeshift. Anyway, the SEC filed a cease and desist against Shapeshift. Basically, cease and desist serving US customers. And it alleged that Shapeshift was operating in 2021 as an unregistered dealer for cryptocurrencies that were securities. And they further said that they would accept a settlement offered by Shapeshift for a $275k fine. So.

• 34:33David Hoffman?

  A $275,000 extortion bribe.

• 34:37Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, basically.

• 34:38David Hoffman?

  To go away.

• 34:38Ryan Sean Adams?

  Good thing it's just, it's in fiat, you know, so it's not that much money. And this is pretty.

• 34:44David Hoffman?

  One Bitcoin.

• 34:44Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah. This is pretty similar to the accusation that the SEC is, of course, brought against other exchanges like Coinbase, Kraken, and Binance. It's all part of the same campaign here. Here's a comment from Eric Voorhees. What does he say?

• 34:59David Hoffman?

  Eric Voorhees says, a quote, "The commission's order, however, fails to identify which crypto assets were investment contracts and provides no explanation for its conclusion." We've seen this before. "In sum, Shapeshift is in trouble because the commission, nearly 10 years after the Shapeshift's platform started trading and more than three years after it changed its business model to be a DAO, now contends that some unidentified number of the 79 crypto assets that traded between 2014 and 2021 were investment contracts without explaining why. Notably, the commission does not allege any harm. Shapeshift and its customers voluntarily transacted, and now the order nowhere alleges that Shapeshift defrauded its customers. The standards are so opaque and arbitrary that the commission itself is unwilling to stand by its own analysis. The environment we have created for the crypto asset markets,

• 35:44David Hoffman?

  especially as it relates to secondary trading, is untenable. Cases like this do not protect investors. They intimidate innovators and entrepreneurs. We respectfully dissent." This has notes of Hester Purse all over it.

• 35:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, so this wasn't Eric Voorhees saying this. This was Eric Voorhees tweeting a quote.

• 36:02David Hoffman?

  Tweeting a quote, yeah.

• 36:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  Of a dissent from Hester Purse about this action. Commissioner Hester Purse. And who's the other commissioner?

• 36:09David Hoffman?

  Mark Yuda.

• 36:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  Mark Yuda. So, by the way, did you read this dissent, the full dissent?

• 36:16David Hoffman?

  I saw the parts that got secreted on Twitter, which I think you're about to lay up.

• 36:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  This was like, so.

• 36:20David Hoffman?

  Are we about to do this?

• 36:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  I was going through this story. I was going through this story and I saw this in the middle of Hester Purse's descent. She actually wrote a screenplay, David. Okay? And she teased it up. Do you want to actually do the screenplay?

• 36:31David Hoffman?

  Okay, who's gonna be who?

• 36:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Okay, I'll be the SEC. You be a shapeshift. Okay, so this is what Hester Purse wrote. She said, "One can imagine the dialogue for that scene in a future episode, the 'just come in and register' episode." So this is a future shapeshift. I'll be the SEC. David will be a shapeshift.

• 36:49David Hoffman?

  Do your best Gary Genzer. I'm Eric Forhees.

• 36:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  I don't have a Gary Genzer. I don't know what.

• 36:52David Hoffman?

  I'll try. Go for it. All right. You're first.

• 36:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  You're first.

• 36:57David Hoffman?

  Oh wait, no, I'm first. Okay, cut that out. Hello, I'm Eric Forhees and I would like to register as a dealer.

• 37:03Ryan Sean Adams?

  Um, why?

• 37:04David Hoffman?

  Uh, because I think some of the assets I plan to deal with might be deemed at some point by the SEC to be securities.

• 37:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, which ones?

• 37:12David Hoffman?

  Um, I'm not sure, because I can't really understand which criteria you use to decide whether a token offering is a securities transaction, and if it is, whether the token that was the subject matter of the investment contract remains a security in the secondary market transactions. Um, yeah.

• 37:27Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, if you don't know whether you're dealing in securities, you can't register. And by the way, if some of the assets you're dealing in are securities, you also can't register.

• 37:37David Hoffman?

  Uh, so can you help us think through which of the assets are securities?

• 37:42Ryan Sean Adams?

  No. We suggest you read the 2017 Dow report and it will all be clear to you. You can also look at our enforcement actions if you want.

• 37:51David Hoffman?

  Um, I've read it. I've read about your enforcement actions. I have further questions.

• 37:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Hire a lawyer.

• 37:58David Hoffman?

  Uh, I did, and my lawyers have further questions.

• 38:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Sorry. We can't help any more than we already have. We don't give legal advice here.

• 38:09Ryan Sean Adams?

  That was Hester Purse's screenplay.

• 38:11David Hoffman?

  Oh my god, give her the Emmy. Give her the Emmy. Well done, Hester.

• 38:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  You actually, you met Hester Purse recently, didn't you?

• 38:19David Hoffman?

  Yeah, she was at ETH Denver.

• 38:21Ryan Sean Adams?

  This is David Hoffman and Commissioner Hester Purse. She actually comes to the conference.

• 38:25David Hoffman?

  Boots on the ground, in the trenches with the crypto retail, all the people going to 20,000 innovators and investors and fanatics that are going to ETH Denver. And she was there with us.

• 38:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  You know, she has run out of Fs, hasn't she? She's just like writing screenplays now in the descent. I love that this is published on the SEC website. It's SEC.gov.

• 38:48Ryan Sean Adams?

  One thing to clarify about this whole Shapeshift thing is, even though there's a cease and desist out there, it actually can't be shut down. Because now Shapeshift does not take custody of anyone. They're not a counterparty, right? It's basically like a DEX aggregator. They use like Thor chain and that sort of thing.

• 39:04David Hoffman?

  Yeah, if you want to go cross-chain, it's basically a front-end and obfuscation abstraction layer for Thor chain. And if you're staying in Ethereum, then just DEX aggregators on Ethereum. And so it's not a counterparty.

• 39:16Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's now a DAO too, right?

• 39:17David Hoffman?

  This is the cool thing, is like Shapeshift is being sued from the periods of like 2017 to 2021, but not during the periods of when it just turned itself into a DAO, which is interesting.

• 39:30Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, maybe that court case is coming, David. Who knows what that'll be? How is he gonna round up all the DAO participants? Could be interesting. There's also on SEC news, you know, we were talking last week about Kraken versus the SEC, and they revealed some additional information. And they basically filed for the SEC to drop all charges. Well, apparently, I guess somewhat related to this, but kind of different, there are now eight US Attorney Generals, state Attorney Generals, I should say, from Montana, Arkansas, Iowa, Mississippi, Nebraska, Ohio, South Dakota, and Texas. They have come out with an amnichus brief, okay? And this is like legal speak for basically a legal position criticizing,

• 40:14Ryan Sean Adams?

  highly critical of the SEC's

• 40:18Ryan Sean Adams?

  stance on crypto. I'm not sure if they directly mention Kraken, but this is some of the the subtext here. They call what the SEC is doing with respect to crypto, a regulatory power grab. And they say that the SEC has appointed itself crypto regulator, and further that the SEC puts consumers at risk. These are attorneys general of eight US states, right? And they are going to a federal agency and just being basically like, you, you have no power here. You actually can't do what you're trying to do to the crypto industry. We don't want it. You're actually putting the citizens of our states at risk through your actions. So like, knock it off.

• 41:01David Hoffman?

  If you are a citizen of Montana, Arkansas, Iowa, Mississippi, Nebraska, Ohio, South Dakota, or Texas, congrats, your attorney general is based. We got an airdrop to talk about, Ryan. Wormhole just announced their token, W. Speaking of based, that is a based ticker handle.

• 41:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's just W?

• 41:20David Hoffman?

  Just W. Yeah. 10 billion tokens, initially, initial circulating supply of 1.8 billion. 82% of W are being initially locked and such tokens will unlock over the course of four years. It's an ERC 20 token on Ethereum.

• 41:35Ryan Sean Adams?

  You should tell them what, tell them what Wormhole is.

• 41:38David Hoffman?

  Oh, yeah. Wormhole is a, is a bridge. It's a bridge. If the name didn't imply that, yeah, you can go and you can go across Ethereum, Solana, Arbitrum, Optimism, Base is where the token will be initially be. You can also go across other Layer Ones as well. 6.17% of the tokens, so 617 million tokens are being dropped to almost 400,000 wallets. Pretty big airdrop, very hyped up airdrop. There, you can check eligibility at airdrop.wormhole.com or at bankless.

• 42:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  No, you can't. No, you can't. Not available if you're in the US. We're sorry to inform you that this site is not available in your region.

• 42:16David Hoffman?

  If you're in the US, use the bankless airdrop claim, uh, claimable.

• 42:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  No, it'll just bounce you to this. It'll bounce you to this.

• 42:21David Hoffman?

  Shit. All right. Well, we'll get the data out of the grid natively. When is claiming? Not announced yet. So we do not know. The snapshot was taken on February 6th, but this token is coming. It's gonna be interesting to see the valuation that this lands at. I mean, it's interesting to see all of the tokens that are being airdropped. Stark Knight is coming in at like $20 billion right now. I mean, we're just getting. The crypto industry is just getting hammered by

• 42:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's too many, it's so many airdrops.

• 42:48David Hoffman?

  Five to 20 billion dollar airdrops.

• 42:49Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's so much free money.

• 42:50David Hoffman?

  We're just getting a same amount of wealth effects.

• 42:51Ryan Sean Adams?

  I'm so exhausted by all of this free money. And honestly, I sort of am. Like, this is, uh, so, uh, I will plus one what you were just saying about the Bankless Claimables app, because if you want to keep tabs on what's dropping and whether your address is eligible or not, all you have to do is go to bankless.com/claimables, type your addresses, not, don't type them, copy, paste, whatever, put an E and S in, add your addresses to this tool, and it will, for free, this is a public service, it will, for free, tell you, alert you, send you an email when there is a claimable opportunity. Now, you gotta watch out for third-party phishing and scammers and that sort of thing, but if it's coming from the bankless.com website directly, then that is an official, like, claimable that you can go claim. It's a, it's a great way to just keep tabs on all this stuff.

• 43:36David Hoffman?

  Yeah, I found, uh, like, two of the most recent Optimism airdrop that happened, like, uh, last week on my wallets, which I would have never have seen that because I don't touch those wallets anymore.

• 43:45Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, and then with Optimism, too, they're just, like, airdrop, airdropping as they go.

• 43:49David Hoffman?

  Like, Optimism's got its fourth airdrop.

• 43:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  It's like seasons and, like, you, it's just impossible to keep up with all of it. All right, what do we got coming up next, David?

• 43:55David Hoffman?

  We're gonna talk about the Eigenlayer Milestone. We're gonna explain how Michael Saylor actually has infinite money and also Permissionless 3, Permissionless 3. But first, we're gonna talk to some of these fantastic sponsors that make this show possible, especially Mantle, the Layer 2 with all of the yields. Stake your ETH with Mantle, put it on Mantle to get your yield if you want to, try it out, there's a link in the show notes, let's go hear from Mantle right now. Mantle, formerly known as BitDow, is the first DAO-led Web3 ecosystem, all built on top of Mantle's first core product, the Mantle Network, a brand-new, high-performance Ethereum Layer 2 built using the OP stack, but uses Eigenlayer's data availability solution instead of the expensive Ethereum Layer 1. Not only does this reduce Mantle Network's gas fees by 80%, but it also reduces gas

• 44:37David Hoffman?

  fee volatility, providing a more stable foundation for Mantle's applications. The Mantle Treasury is one of the biggest DAO-owned treasuries, which is seeding an ecosystem of projects from all around the Web3 space for Mantle. Mantle already has sub-communities from around Web3 on-boarded, like Game7 for Web3 Gaming and Bi. For TBL and liquidity and on-ramps. So if you want to build on the Mantle network, Mantle is offering a grants program that provides milestone-based funding to promising projects that help expand, secure, and decentralize Mantle. If you want to get started working with the first DAO-led Layer 2 ecosystem, check out Mantle at mantle.xyz and follow them on Twitter at @zeroxmantle. Arbitrum is the leading Ethereum scaling solution that is home to hundreds of decentralized applications. Arbitrum's technology allows you to interact with Ethereum

• 45:22David Hoffman?

  at scale with low fees and faster transactions. Arbitrum has the leading DeFi ecosystem, strong infrastructure options, flourishing NFTs, and is quickly becoming the Web3 gaming hub. Explore the ecosystem at portal.arbitrum.io. Are you looking to permissionlessly launch your own Arbitrum Orbit chain? Arbitrum Orbit allows anyone to utilize Arbitrum's secure scaling technology to build your own Orbit chain, giving you access to interoperable, customizable permissions with dedicated throughput. Whether you're a developer, an enterprise, or a user, Arbitrum Orbit lets you take your project to new heights. All of these technologies leverage the security and decentralization of Ethereum. Experience Web3 development the way it was always meant to be: secure, fast, cheap, and friction-free. Visit arbitrum.io and get your journey started in one of the largest Ethereum communities.

• 46:08David Hoffman?

  Cello is the mobile-first, EVM-compatible, carbon-negative blockchain built for the real world, driving real-world use cases like mobile payments and mobile DeFi. And with Opera MiniPay as one of the fastest-growing Web3 wallets, Cello is seeing a meteoric rise with over 300 million transactions and 1.5 million monthly active addresses. And now, Cello is looking to come home to Ethereum as a Layer 2. Optimism, Polygon, Matter Labs, and Arbitrum have all thrown their hats in the ring for the Cello Layer 2 to build upon their stacks. Why the competition? The Cello Layer 2 will bring huge advantages, like a decentralized sequencer, off-chain data availability secured by Ethereum validators, and one-block finality. What does that all mean for you? With Cello Layer 2, gas fees will stay low, and you can even pay for gas natively using ERC20 tokens,

• 46:51David Hoffman?

  sending crypto to phone numbers across wallets using social connect. But Cello is a community-governed protocol. This means that Cello needs you to weigh in and make your voice heard. Join the conversation in the Cello forums. Follow Cello on Twitter and visit cello.org to shape the future of Ethereum. Eigenlayer passes $10 billion, completing the second of my five predictions for 2024. Off to a great start. One of those predictions is we're gonna burn 1 million ETH, and we are behind on that. But the trend rate, because gas fees are super high right now, is super, super good. That's basically the news.

• 47:26Ryan Sean Adams?

  David, you have 10 months to hit all your predictions. You don't need to rush it, man. You already got two down. I think you're making great progress.

• 47:33David Hoffman?

  I got nine more months.

• 47:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, you're making great progress. I mean, you should be happy with this.

• 47:37David Hoffman?

  Actually, I bet you one of them is actually complete. I just haven't bothered to count them, which is over 5 billion airdropped to users in 2024. That hasn't happened by the end of Q2. I won't be surprised.

• 47:47Ryan Sean Adams?

  After Wormhole, it probably will. This is so, so this is if you translate it.

• 47:51David Hoffman?

  Actually, one of those, one of my other predictions, ETH Layer 2 meta shifts towards optimized virtual machines. Shout out sponsor Kitezi for bringing Linux to the Ethereum Layer 2 space. I'm counting that partially checked. We'll see what happens when both Eclipse and Ellipsis and Monad launch.

• 48:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yep. So this is, by the way, translating that $10 billion in Eigenlayer into ETH terms, that's 3 billion ETH, so another over 3 billion.

• 48:18David Hoffman?

  3 million ETH.

• 48:19Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh, excuse me. 3 million ETH. What am I talking about?

• 48:22David Hoffman?

  No one has 3 billion.

• 48:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  True. There's a supply cap, right? Well, congrats on your prediction, David. Do you know another general prediction that I didn't make? Because I didn't make any predictions, but I'll claim this as a general bankless prediction, is that wallets are getting a level up this year, this cycle, okay? They're in desperate need. I mean, it's still really hard to onboard your friends and family. This is a post from Coinbase talking about the evolution of wallets. It includes this really cool demo. This is kind of like wallet as a service. But look how easy this is. In Browser Wallet, you just connect with a passkey on your machine, or you could use Face ID on your phone and basically just have a wallet.

• 49:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  And this is an account of Straction Wallet that Coinbase has built. They built a whole SDK on top of the base chain, which is kind of cool. And I had a take this week. About, oh, this is Jesse Paulak on this. The Coinbase Smart Wallet is the most important new product since Base and the most consequential consumer wallet launched in the last five years. It's the last piece to bring billions of people on-chain because it just works. See for yourself and you can go test this. We'll include a link in the show notes. It's super easy to use this wallet. And this is like innovation that Layer 2s can do, that Ethereum mainnet is just too slow to do. Like adding account abstraction type features, right? That make wallets super easy. And it brings me to kind of this take.

• 49:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  I really want to see Layer 2 ecosystems that own the full stack for user experience.

• 49:57David Hoffman?

  The full user experience.

• 49:58Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, and so I'm talking own the wallet UX, own the onboarding, own the fiat to crypto part of it, own the economics, make it so that users don't have to think about fees at all. Make it feel like Web 2. Own the apps on top, so launch with some kind of killer apps, a fully integrated UX and make it max consumer friendly. And I gotta say, I think that's what Base is actually trying to pull off with some of these innovations on the base chain.

• 50:24David Hoffman?

  Do you have Coinbase Wallet on your phone?

• 50:27Ryan Sean Adams?

  I do, yeah.

• 50:28David Hoffman?

  Do you have notifications turned on?

• 50:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  No.

• 50:30David Hoffman?

  Okay, you should because every once in a while, the Coinbase Wallet will send you notifications saying, "Hey, do you want to mint this NFT?" And it's usually like a Coinbase NFT. Like the last time I saw this, it was the Mint a Penny. And then there's also the Coinbase Stock Earnings. And I am, anytime Coinbase app shows up and it's always on Base, so the fees are like zero. And so anytime I get prompted by the Coinbase app to go like mint something or do something on Base, I go do it. You want to know why?

• 50:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Why?

• 50:57David Hoffman?

  Because Base is gonna have an airdrop.

• 51:00David Hoffman?

  I don't know this. I have zero alpha. I'm completely speculating. I am just shooting from the hip here, but here's how I think this goes.

• 51:06Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wait, wait, they already have a coin. It's called, it's a publicly traded company. It's coin. You don't think, you think they're gonna do another coin?

• 51:11David Hoffman?

  Coinbase has an asset. Base doesn't have an asset. And in this world, we like to tokenize stuff. My idea, so you know, so Circle and Coinbase used to have this like partnership, right? But then they were like, you know, let's just make this simple. Coinbase is just gonna own 20 25% of Circle and then we're just gonna go off and be our separate companies and that's the that's the alignment there. I think the same thing is gonna happen with Base. Base spins out, it's its own separate Base LLC. CEO Jesse Pollock, maybe it gets incorporated somewhere else.

• 51:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  Or like, or will it be like, could it be like the Base Foundation, basically?

• 51:45David Hoffman?

  Base Foundation, yeah.

• 51:46Ryan Sean Adams?

  Base Labs, something like that?

• 51:47David Hoffman?

  And then as soon as it is out from under the large, just gargantuan that is a publicly traded company, Base Token.

• 51:56Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wow, interesting, interesting. Not alpha, just David predictions.

• 52:01David Hoffman?

  I'm speculating, yeah. Anyway, the alpha is to turn on notifications on your Coinbase wallet and mint whatever they tell you to mint.

• 52:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, well, and start doing things on Layer 2s in general, particularly Layer 2s that you are bullish on. David, okay, are CryptoPunks back, man? Because there was a massive sale. Are you gonna say, you're gonna tell me they never left? But it seemed like they left the building for a while, but this is...

• 52:25David Hoffman?

  Well, NFTs left the building and Punks had a very respectable floor of 45 ETH at the lowest part of the bear market.

• 52:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  I appreciate that. This is Punk 3, 3,100.

• 52:37David Hoffman?

  3,100, yeah, that is the Alien Punk with a headband.

• 52:41Ryan Sean Adams?

  This thing.

• 52:41David Hoffman?

  Sold for $16.3 million, 4.5 thousand Ether, which is the second highest Punk sale of all time. $16.3 million for an Alien Punk.

• 52:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  Are the celebrities coming back? You know, like Jay-Z, Beyonce, Taylor Swift?

• 52:57David Hoffman?

  Who actually bought this? We don't know who bought it. Some anonymous Punk Bull.

• 53:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  NFTs have not yet had a bull market, like a full bull market. There's some...

• 53:07David Hoffman?

  Other than Pudgies, yeah.

• 53:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  There's some glimmers, right? Like Pudgies is kind of a standout, but it's not like last time. Do you think that's coming? Do you think that's still ahead?

• 53:14David Hoffman?

  I mean, in bull markets, we cycle through absolutely everything at least once. Will NFTs have an outsized focus this bull market? I don't necessarily think so.

• 53:27Ryan Sean Adams?

  We'll see, we'll see. Maybe, maybe it's just punks that are gonna catch a bid this cycle. David-

• 53:32David Hoffman?

  Hold on, we just had one sale.

• 53:34Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 53:34David Hoffman?

  We sold a 55 E4.

• 53:36Ryan Sean Adams?

  I don't know, I did, these JPEGs are your thing, okay?

• 53:39David Hoffman?

  My take is that punks track how cool Ethereum is. So like if Ethereum is cool, then punks will track that via the ETH price. And so I'm bullish on punks around the ETH ETF approval.

• 53:52Ryan Sean Adams?

  Huh. Maybe, maybe one of the TradFi shops will buy a punk and become cool with the ETH crowd.

• 53:59David Hoffman?

  Yo, VanEck boys, let's get this done.

• 54:02Ryan Sean Adams?

  Get your intern on this. Michael Saylor bought more Bitcoin.

• 54:05David Hoffman?

  Get your intern a punk, your intern needs a punk.

• 54:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  Oh my god. That'd be quite the gift. He deserves it though, or she deserves it.

• 54:12David Hoffman?

  He does deserve it, he does deserve it. Also Franklin Templeton Instagram accounts, or Twitter accounts. Both of you guys, get your guys' people's punks.

• 54:18Ryan Sean Adams?

  Uh, Michael Saylor bought some Bitcoin this week, of course.

• 54:22David Hoffman?

  Oh, I'm surprised.

• 54:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  But let's just zoom out and try to figure out what in the world he's doing. This is, this is an interesting tweet that I saw this week. And it's kind of like this infinite money glitch. It's not infinite because it just scales with Bitcoin price, but you know, Bitcoin price is doing pretty well. And we've always said on Bankless that Michael Saylor's trade, purchase of Bitcoin with his like-

• 54:43David Hoffman?

  It's going to work.

• 54:44Ryan Sean Adams?

  MicroStrategy kind of like equity play is going to work. Well, this is, this is actually how this fiat money glitch works. So his playbook is, number one, if you're ever curious, he issues a convertible senior note. So he has MicroStrategy, right? And this is publicly traded company. So he issues convertible senior notes, this debt denominated in US dollars, a currency that by design is losing value over time. It's true, by design, the dollar is going to lose money over time. And then he buys the scariest asset in the world, which is Bitcoin. Then he waits for the US dollar to lose value against Bitcoin, leading to a surge in company valuation. Okay? And that's just step one. And then, that valuation allows him to do what? Issue more convertible senior notes. And then he

• 55:28Ryan Sean Adams?

  rinses and repeats. So as a point of reference, MicroStrategy, the stock has surged by 20% in one day. Alone, that was March, March 4th. It was just 20% in that day alone and year to year to date. So in 2024, it's already up 92% and 435% over the past year. He was not drawing in these types of returns with MicroStrategy as like a business intelligence software company. It's all about the Bitcoin treasury and that's the play he's making and he's made it consistently. And it's almost surprising to me, David, that other corporate CEOs haven't followed him.

• 56:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  But I think part of the reason is they don't have as much governance over their stocks as, as Michael Saylor basically does because, you know, Michael Saylor has enough voting rights in MicroStrategy to just do whatever he wants and this is what he wants to do.

• 56:24David Hoffman?

  This next part of the weekly rollout brought to you by ETH maximalism. There's a website on blockchaincenter.net slash EN for English slash there is no second best and it is, what if Michael MicroStrategy had bought ETH instead? If he had bought ETH instead of Bitcoin, he would have $16 billion instead of the measly $12.2 billion that he has with Bitcoin. And if he had staked that ETH, he would have $17.6 billion.

• 56:50Ryan Sean Adams?

  Wow. He'd also have a form, he'd have more ETH than Eigenlayer has, David.

• 56:57Ryan Sean Adams?

  He'd have 4.5 million ETH staked, which would be pretty impressive. We don't, we don't have that kind of, like Ethereum doesn't have a Michael Saylor level.

• 57:06David Hoffman?

  We just have 1559.

• 57:08Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah.

• 57:09David Hoffman?

  We've got 1559.

• 57:10Ryan Sean Adams?

  Just the burn, you know?

• 57:11David Hoffman?

  Just the burn.

• 57:11Ryan Sean Adams?

  That's the best we got.

• 57:12David Hoffman?

  Quiet burn in the background. It's easy to forget, it's very powerful. It's not in your face. All right. Permissionless 3 is back. All of our speakers that are so far on board, the 50 of them are announced. October 9th through 11th in Salt Lake City, Utah. Balaji, Sridhivasan, Lucanets from Pudgy Penguins, Legion from Variant, Nick White from Celestia, Zachimanian from Cosmos, Ben Spencer from Framework, Santiago from Parify Capital, Sandy Cool from Franklin Templeton, I could go on, Matt Hogan, I think I will, Muneeb Surirom, Blau, Mike Dudis. Kiony Han from Monad. Oh, God, the list of quality speakers is off the charts. And these are just the people that we've announced so far.

• 57:55David Hoffman?

  So Permissionless, if you do not have your ticket, get one because it only goes up in price. And if you're a Bankless citizen, you have 30% off with your perks in your perks. Bankless.com slash tools slash perks to get 30% off of your ticket. Me and Mike, we've been working on like some of the, what are we going to talk about at Permissionless? And one of the reasons why I think Permissionless is one of the best conferences out there is because we have podcasters who are setting the agenda. Like, if you've ever been to like a normie, normal conference, podcasters are not setting the agenda. It's bad. We've absolutely killed it with the list this week. Bitcoin Renaissance, AI crypto restaking, like the three big headlining themes. We also got modularity, gaming, layer twos, and NFTs.

• 58:39David Hoffman?

  And so there's something for everyone. It's a festival of crypto content. It's gonna be a ton of fun. Salt Lake City. We started Permissionless in Florida, at West Palm Beach. Then we went to Austin. Now we are in Salt Lake. Why? Because we're going west.

• 58:53Ryan Sean Adams?

  Nice. This is, this is the only conference I go to, crypto conference, and it is so worth it. And how could you miss a crypto conference like this in 2024? Like, don't miss the bull market.

• 59:05David Hoffman?

  Right.

• 59:06Ryan Sean Adams?

  Right?

• 59:06David Hoffman?

  It's gonna be so good, dude.

• 59:07Ryan Sean Adams?

  By the way, David, a big special guest, I'm not, we're not ready to announce right now. Just said yes to coming main stage to Permissionless yesterday. Really big freaking deal. I'm so excited about it. I think we're gonna get some massive names attending this event and speaking. It's all going to be the crypto content that, that you guys love. So go check that out and get a ticket early. Get a ticket now. David?

• 59:32David Hoffman?

  Up only.

• 59:32Ryan Sean Adams?

  Well, speaking of conferences, okay, you just came back from one at ETH Denver. And I realized, last week you were mid ETH Denver, right? You were recording from Denver when we, when we did the roll up. So rather than a meme of the week, why don't you just tell me about it? So how was ETH Denver?

• 59:47David Hoffman?

  ETH Denver had outsized focus on side events. I actually only went to the main conference one time during ETH Denver. But it was As exciting and like super high vitality as ever. I did a podcast with the Alpha Alpha Boys inside of ZK Sync's podcast. I don't want to call it a podcast booth. It was more like a podcast arena. There was like 60, 70 people in the audience. It was the first ever live audience I've ever had. Me and the Alpha Alpha Boys, really good conversation. We're going to have that out on the feed, probably the Bankless Premium feed sometime this coming week.

• 1:00:22David Hoffman?

  Really, really exciting. All of the side events, like there was an Eigenlayer side event every single day. I saw Ceri Ram talking like eight different times. There was a Bitcoin Renaissance day, which was just huge. Nick Carter was there, like a lot of the Bitcoiners were there. Munib from Stacks was there. I hosted a modulithic debate between Munib from Stacks, Nick White from Celestia, Neil from Eclipse, and then this one individual, I'm forgetting the name, from Jito Labs, Zano, I think. Really, really good. So yeah, big side event focus. The Bankless meetup was phenomenal. Had like 200 people at the Bankless meetup, all drinking beer. It was really, really great, really, really great.

• 1:01:05Ryan Sean Adams?

  So David, I don't know if you saw this tweet. This is, again, I didn't attend ETH Denver, but this was a tweet from what the Uber driver said about ETH Denver. This is Alex the Uber driver, and I don't know if it's his first exposure to the ETH Denver crowd.

• 1:01:22David Hoffman?

  I think it is, yeah.

• 1:01:23Ryan Sean Adams?

  But what does he say here? You should read some of this.

• 1:01:26David Hoffman?

  When I read this, I legit had a tear in my eye.

• 1:01:29Ryan Sean Adams?

  Really?

• 1:01:30David Hoffman?

  Just, it was, yes, it was really, really, because I've been to ETH Denver every single time and I've seen it develop. And crypto from the outside doesn't really have like a great brand. So this is Alex the Uber driver who went to the rEthereum Reddit page and dropped in a note to the Ethereum community. And so I want to read it out loud to the Ethereum community. Greetings. I'm an Uber driver in Denver. We recently held ETH Denver, a huge conference for our city, and I'd like to share my thoughts as an outsider. A passenger asked about my experience with attendees and she found it interesting and asked me to share this on this subreddit. Firstly, as an Uber driver, I always deal with one asshole a day. I'm glad to report that I did not have a single bad experience with you nerds over the whole week.

• 1:02:13David Hoffman?

  Not a single passive-aggressive remark, or worse, that I would normally get on the daily. Namaste. I probably drove a total of 300 different people from the conference. I'm very chatty and pretty well-versed in this space for a seeming outsider. I would say I discovered two types of attendees: career-oriented workers and crypto-fanatics. Career-oriented people were interesting, but shared the same skepticism that I do. They consisted of developers hoping for the best because their career rested upon it. Surprisingly, a lot admitted to big personal losses due to gambling behaviors. Yeah, that's part of crypto. I found it weirdly refreshing to share a somewhat embarrassing experience to a complete stranger as a warning. I got the strong impression that they saw crypto as a career path as opposed to a revolutionary

• 1:02:58David Hoffman?

  technology.

• 1:02:59Ryan Sean Adams?

  The mercenary crowd.

• 1:03:01David Hoffman?

  Yeah, they're just workers, like, career workers, right? They're here for the job. Fanatics were more interesting. I expected them to share a cult-like exuberance, which they did. The difference is the following, and this is the part that I thought was really cool. I was experiencing a call to action, as with all cults, but instead I only received calls to education. I must have spoken to 200-plus crypto-fanatics, but no one told me what they were working on specifically. No company, or specific coin, or project was shared. No one told me to buy X or invest your time in Y. The only call to action was educate yourself in the space, research your interests, think about how a blockchain could change it, join communities, share your values, find projects that align with your beliefs.

• 1:03:46David Hoffman?

  Are you all degenerates, the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama, or what? Is the question Alex, the Uber driver says. I must admit, the philosophy that was shared is refreshing, and it seems that everyone is trying to help me in an indirect way, which I found sweet and non-condescending. I've never judged a group of people as weirdly pacifist and revolutionary at the same time. And this gives me an unreasonable level of confidence. After this experience as an outsider, I have come to the conclusion that crypto is an anti-cult, and I am in. Wish you all the best, Satoshi. Just kidding, I mean Alex, the Uber driver. I thought this was so cool. Because crypto, we have a terrible PR problem to the outside world.

• 1:04:29David Hoffman?

  But at East Denver, we at least won the hearts and minds of this one individual Uber driver. And I think that reflects very well on the people that make it throughout a bear market, who are here for the right reasons, to show up in the right spot and believe in what they do. The line, "I've never judged a group of people as weirdly pacifist and revolutionary at the same time." That's going to stick with me forever. I really enjoyed this piece.

• 1:04:54Ryan Sean Adams?

  Yeah, that's great. This is definitely an experience, I think, the best of us and the best that crypto has to offer. So I'm glad that our crypto conferences bring that to people. And yeah, I'm glad. That's powerful, for sure. All right, well, you ready to end it here, David?

• 1:05:12David Hoffman?

  Let's do it.

• 1:05:13Ryan Sean Adams?

  Next week, all-time highs, shall we? Until then...

• 1:05:16David Hoffman?

  Next week, all-time highs, yeah.

• 1:05:17Ryan Sean Adams?

  Risky disclaimer, has got to let you know, of course, crypto is risky. You could definitely lose what you put in. But we're headed west. This is the frontier. It's not for everyone, but we're glad you're with us on the Bankless journey. Thanks a lot.

• 1:05:49Speaker 03

  Well, if you don't know, you're dealing in securities, you can't register. And by the way, I said, "No, but you deal with the law's securities, you also can't register." Can you help us figure out which assets are securities? No, you can't deny a report, or you can't ask a lawyer for your enforcement actions. I've read it and I've read about your enforcement actions, I still have questions. I'm a lawyer. I did, and the lawyer has even more questions.

• 1:06:32Speaker 03

  Sorry, we cannot help any more than we already have, we don't get legal advice, we don't get legal advice. Sorry, we cannot help any more than we already have, we don't get legal advice, and no, no, no.

• 1:06:56Speaker 03

  Call me up, 'cause I can really understand that you decide if the token offering is a securities transaction, and if it is, if the token that was the subject of the investment contract is still a security. The secondary market.

• 1:07:16Speaker 03

  The secondary market.

• 1:07:22Speaker 03

  The secondary market.

• 1:07:28Speaker 03

  The secondary market.

• 1:07:34Speaker 03

  The secondary market.