#598 - Joaquin Phoenix

Joaquin Phoenix is an actor known for his many popular roles in films like “Joker”, “Walk the Line”, “the Master” and more. His latest movie “Eddington”, from director Ari Aster, is in theaters now. Joaquin joins Theo at the Hotel Chelsea in NYC to talk about how the chaos of 2020 inspired his new movie, the influence his dad had on his characters over the years, and why he feels so compelled to speak up on human rights issues. See “Eddington” in theaters https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL6jZqExlIk ------------------------------------------------ Tour Dates! https://theovon.com/tour New Merch: https://www.theovonstore.com ------------------------------------------------- Sponsored By: Celsius: Go to the Celsius Amazon store to check out all of their flavors. #CELSIUSBrandPartner #CELSIUSLiveFit https://amzn.to/3HbAtPJ DraftKings: Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app right now and use code THEO. That’s code THEO for new customers to get $150 in bonus bets instantly when you bet just five bucks. Only on DraftKings. The Crown Is Yours. https://draftkings.com Liquid IV: Go to https://LIQUIDIV. COM and get 20% off your first order with code THEO at checkout. Shopify: Go to https://shopify.com/theo to see how easy it is to start your business today. Rocket Money: Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster at https://rocketmoney.com/theo Perplexity AI: Ask anything at https://pplx.ai/theo and download their new web browser Comet at https://comet.perplexity.ai/ ------------------------------------------------- Gambling problem? Call 1-800-Gambler. In New York, call 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369). In Connecticut, Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg dot org. Please play responsibly. On behalf of Boot Hill Casino & Resort (Kansas). 21+ plus age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction. Void in Ontario. New customers only. Bonus bets expire 168 after issuance. For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see DKNG.co/AUDIO ------------------------------------------------- Music: “Shine” by Bishop Gunn Bishop Gunn - Shine ------------------------------------------------ Submit your funny videos, TikToks, questions and topics you'd like to hear on the podcast to: [email protected] Hit the Hotline: 985-664-9503 Video Hotline for Theo Upload here: https://www.theovon.com/fan-upload Send mail to: This Past Weekend 1906 Glen Echo Rd PO Box #159359 Nashville, TN 37215 ------------------------------------------------ Find Theo: Website: https://theovon.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/theovon Facebook: https://facebook.com/theovon Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thispastweekend Twitter: https://twitter.com/theovon YouTube: https://youtube.com/theovon Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TheoVonClips Shorts Channel: https://bit.ly/3ClUj8z ------------------------------------------------ Producer: Zach https://www.instagram.com/zachdpowers Producer: Trevyn https://www.instagram.com/trevyn.s/ Producer: Nick https://www.instagram.com/realnickdavis/ Producer: Andrew https://www.instagram.com/bleachmediaofficial/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Coca-Cola. For the big, for the small, the short and the tall. Peacemakers, risk takers. For the optimists, pessimists. For long distance love. For introverts and extroverts. The thinkers and the doers. For old friends and new. Coca-Cola. For everyone. Pick up some Coca-Cola at a store near you.

• 0:30Theo Von?

  Today's guest is a legendary actor. One of the greats, they'll say, I'll say it. People are saying it. He's had so many hit, so many amazing roles in The Joker, Walk the Line, The Master, Signs. Eddington is his new film, which I got to take a peek at before we got together. We caught up at the Hotel Chelsea in New York City. Today's guest is Mr. Joaquin Phoenix.

• 1:19Theo Von?

  Yeah, do you have any, you okay if we start, Joaquin?

• 1:21Speaker 02

  I am. Why are you looking at the ground? What's going on?

• 1:23Theo Von?

  I don't know. I just feel like I'm a little bit nervous.

• 1:25Speaker 02

  Oh, cause it seems like, it seems like the assassin, like before he's about to fuck people up. He's just like staring, like getting in the zone. It's like, let's do this. I was like, okay, yeah, I mean, start, sure, man, start.

• 1:38Theo Von?

  Okay, okay. I think, yeah, I'm waiting for like the coaches in my head to show up and be like, you can do this, you know?

• 1:44Speaker 02

  Wait a minute, you can do this. You can definitely do this.

• 1:48Theo Von?

  Thank you.

• 1:49Speaker 02

  I'm questionable. But Coach is like, he's questionable. We're not sure he's gonna play.

• 1:57Theo Von?

  Hey, that's not Jimmy Chitwood, okay? We gotta sit that guy on the bench, you know? Oh, it was the guy from Hoosiers, remember? Who comes in and makes the show?

• 2:06Speaker 02

  I don't, I don't remember.

• 2:08Theo Von?

  Thank you for telling me you don't remember instead of pretending like you do that. So I keep talking about it.

• 2:13Speaker 02

  You're welcome. Yeah, it's gonna happen a lot. There's a lot that probably don't know.

• 2:17Theo Von?

  Well, we're gonna find out. Thank you for your time, man.

• 2:22Speaker 02

  No, thank you.

• 2:23Theo Von?

  I appreciate it. I really appreciate it. And thank you for all your beautiful work over the years. It's been nice to witness and consume as just a regular person in the world.

• 2:32Speaker 02

  Oh, man. Thank you. You're very sincere. It's it's very nice and refreshing and also slightly uncomfortable.

• 2:40Theo Von?

  Yeah, sorry.

• 2:41Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:42Theo Von?

  I know you're married, so I'll keep it just as sincere, you know, we won't get physically sincere because that can be it's outlawed in some territories, but um but no, thank you for your time, man. And yeah, thank you for all the cool work and helping us think and stuff like that, just as viewers, you know?

• 2:59Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's funny how sometimes like life or God or whatever uses like a person as like a an instrument, you know? And yeah, you just have such a great way of like, yeah, just being able to do something that we can't, so many people can't do, but then it helps us, the rest of us reflect on how we do things and live. So does it make any sense even?

• 3:17Speaker 02

  It's very nice. I mean, I don't know, all, all, all I'm hearing is, um, all I want to say is like, no, everyone can do it. I don't have anything special. I don't do anything special.

• 3:28Theo Von?

  Well, you're a lucky guy then. You've been fortunate.

• 3:30Speaker 02

  I've been very fortunate. I've worked with great, great people.

• 3:35Theo Von?

  What'd you do this summer? Did anything fun?

• 3:39Theo Von?

  I feel like I was getting serious for a second.

• 3:41Speaker 02

  No, no, it was? No, it wasn't.

• 3:43Theo Von?

  Okay, good.

• 3:44Speaker 02

  What did I do? When does the summer start?

• 3:47Theo Von?

  I guess the summer starts in, I would say mid, I would say June 1st.

• 3:51Speaker 02

  June, okay.

• 3:54Speaker 02

  No, nothing fun. I, um, I just have this movie coming out, so we started, you know, I think somewhere like the 10th or something like that started press.

• 4:03Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  So it did some press in LA and then flew to London and suppressed, so, so that's it. Nothing, nothing terribly exciting.

• 4:11Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 4:11Speaker 02

  Well, I'm not, we're not like those kind of, we're not like, like, you know, like go vacation people.

• 4:16Theo Von?

  That's not your life?

• 4:17Speaker 02

  No.

• 4:18Theo Von?

  Oh. Yeah, you always, I think when you picture like, um, actors, you always picture them in like a little bit of like, kind of like a Rapunzel castle or like somebody's having shrimp, you know, like that kind of thing. I think that's like a romanticizing of the, of the

• 4:33Speaker 02

  Right.

• 4:34Theo Von?

  Of the people.

• 4:36Speaker 02

  I mean, maybe I should.

• 4:37Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 4:37Speaker 02

  I mean, maybe that's what's missing. Um, but, uh, but no, it's not, um, I mean, I have.

• 4:44Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 4:45Speaker 02

  But it's not a regular thing. It's definitely not like, oh, here's summertime. Let's, let's do that summer experience.

• 4:50Theo Von?

  Got it.

• 4:51Speaker 02

  But yeah, I, I have that like fantasy sometimes, like sometimes I see myself like in slow motion, jumping off a pier into a lake and shit. But I haven't done it.

• 5:00Theo Von?

  Oh, okay, okay. So if you're not even living out the fantasies you're supposed to be doing, then what the hell am I frigging sitting over here parading them around?

• 5:09Speaker 02

  I know. What do you, what do you do? What, what do you do with your summer?

• 5:12Theo Von?

  That's a great question.

• 5:14Speaker 02

  What's your question?

• 5:15Theo Von?

  Thanks.

• 5:19Theo Von?

  Oh, this is a real pickleball game here. I like it.

• 5:22Speaker 02

  No, no.

• 5:23Theo Von?

  No, it's good.

• 5:25Speaker 02

  I just didn't want credit for something. It wasn't my question. So I just felt like I had to acknowledge that.

• 5:31Theo Von?

  No, well, well said. Um, yeah, that's a great question. I didn't, I think, yeah, I didn't do that much. I just kind of like worked, I guess. And, uh, oh, I did get to see my niece graduated, uh, from high school. So that was pretty cool. Just to watch somebody go through that moment where they're kind of like, you know, where the training wheels kind of come off of life a little bit, you know?

• 5:57Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 5:57Theo Von?

  So I thought that was pretty neat. And I watched Eddington the other day.

• 6:01Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 6:01Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 6:03Theo Von?

  Really cool.

• 6:03Speaker 02

  Cool. I never graduated.

• 6:05Theo Von?

  You didn't graduate high school?

• 6:06Speaker 02

  No.

• 6:08Speaker 02

  To be honest, I'm not sure I even made it to high school.

• 6:10Theo Von?

  Right. Okay.

• 6:13Theo Von?

  That explains things so much better than I think watching you. You're like, oh, this guy didn't even went to high school.

• 6:18Speaker 02

  Right.

• 6:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, I want you to have all the information, like I'm an open book and I just want you to really understand what you're dealing with here.

• 6:27Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 6:28Speaker 02

  As we move forward, okay?

• 6:29Theo Von?

  Um, well, let's talk about Eddington first because, um, it was awesome, man. It was just like, one of the neat things that I thought, and this is just me being kind of judgmental, just so we can frame this for the conversation is, um, you want some water?

• 6:44Speaker 02

  I was thinking about it. I was deciding in my head, I was going, how thirsty are you? How much plastic do you want? What, what are we gonna do here?

• 6:53Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 6:54Speaker 02

  That, that's, that's, that's what, that's what you saw. So I was like, I looked at the bottle, I said, it looks good, I need the water, but it's got a lot of plastic in there.

• 7:02Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 7:02Speaker 02

  I have glass here. And I was trying to decide, no, no, that just feels like, then I just feel like I'm.

• 7:08Theo Von?

  No, I think you should, let's get in it. I believe, look, I agree. I think everybody's about to try to stop drinking out of plastic.

• 7:15Speaker 02

  Right, but this is

• 7:18Speaker 02

  special water.

• 7:20Theo Von?

  Oh, it's artesian, artesian, artesian? That's nice.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  It's nice.

• 7:25Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 7:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's nice.

• 7:26Theo Von?

  Oh, that came down on a Sherpa's back or something, that was definitely.

• 7:30Speaker 02

  So now this, that, that counteracts the plastic, I think.

• 7:35Theo Von?

  Yeah, I think everybody's worried about like microplastics and everything. Recent studies have revealed that glass bottles now contain significantly more microplastics than plastic bottles.

• 7:45Speaker 02

  Thank you so much, I did not know that I was gonna get an education here, thank you.

• 7:50Theo Von?

  So crazy.

• 7:51Speaker 02

  I like it.

• 7:52Theo Von?

  Um, speaking of so crazy, man, let's talk about Eddington, dude. It was so intense, the stakes kept rising, like, um, because you have like this, it's kind of like a time capsule moment. This is what I felt like, to me, it felt like this time capsule moment from very recently. Where you have the COVID mandates, you have the BLM movement going on. You have a change in, um, the overlords of media. So now like information is coming out of everywhere, right? So there's a lot of like new, but also errant information in the world. You have all of these things happening at the same time. Then you have this sheriff, Joe Cross, who's kind of like an authority figure, right? You know, that's who you look to when there's something going on, but.

• 8:38Theo Von?

  Also, at the same time, everyone's challenging authority. So it's just, and then he starts to lose authority over himself. So there's like, there's so much going on. My question, I'm gonna get to it too. When there's so much going on like that, as an actor, are you thinking like in each scene? Are you thinking, I have to embody all of these like little tributaries or at once? Or do you take that like scene by scene or moment by moment? What's that like? Cause I mean, it got so intense, this is a viewer, you're like, I don't even know if I can watch this, much less trying to be the guy who's, uh, you know, spreading the jam, you know?

• 9:19Speaker 02

  Mm hmm. Um, I think it probably, I think it changes. I think there, there are days where, um, you're probably hyper aware of the, the arc and you're, you're kind of like following this trail that you're creating. Um, and there's other days where that gets in the way and you just go like, shut the fuck up. And just like, listen to what this other person say right in front of you and just react to that. Like, we're not, in our own lives, we're not always aware of like our arc. Right? So I think it's like, you're just trying to balance it out. And sometimes you can be so in the moment that you do, you forget that it's like, you just came,

• 10:01Speaker 02

  and we're not, we're shooting the scene in six weeks, but you just have come from whatever. It's a, you know, intense emotional situation and now you're coming to this scene. You gotta, we have to carry that over. So I think that it, um, it changes us, like something that is just like, uh, alive and moving and changing. And of course, you have like a partner, which is the director, and in this case, the writer-director, Ari Aster, um, who just like knows the script, obviously, inside and out and the characters. And we had been working, going through the script. You know, for a year prior to shooting, um, we'd get together, um, I think we were actually

• 10:46Speaker 02

  in, in New York primarily and just read through the scripts, um, and talk about things. So you're kind of going through and you're developing, you're developing the, the character and you're following this kind of plan that you have sometimes in your head, some things you've discussed, some things you're just spontaneously coming up with.

• 11:10Speaker 02

  And, and then you just, then you just hope for the best. You just go, at some point you go, well, cause here's the thing, this is the crazy thing about it. You'll like, you'll have this fucking plan that you're like, fucking clever. I figured this shit out. Goes from this scene, then I go do that and that scene, I'm doing that and that scene. You have this brilliant fucking plan and you're like, I'm kind of like a genius. Yeah. And then in editing, they'll like pull two of those scenes out, like take them out or like put them somewhere else. And then it's like, it's much better. And you're like, I'm not a genius. I don't fucking know anything. Like if this shit works, it's because the fucking director, uh, is making this work. Yeah.

• 11:54Speaker 02

  You know, so like that's the, it's like, it's something very humbling about that process, right? And you have to do the work. You have to do the work as if every moment is part of this character's life. And then there's moments that aren't even in the script and on screen that you're trying to, I don't know, uh, you think about and feel and kind of like take on as, as, as your experience, but you don't really know what's gonna end up in the movie. Hmm. So yeah, it's, it's, um, it's, I mean, it's a pretty cool experience. It's, it's kind of like life. Yeah. Like you plan all this shit and you plan your day and your life and your year and,

• 12:38Speaker 02

  and then shit happens, it changes, things get moved around and sometimes their characters, they just get like. You're taken out.

• 12:45Theo Von?

  Yeah, and sometimes you have a plan, like you're gonna show up to like a something and you're everything's gonna be perfect. You're gonna have flowers for the this and you're gonna have the best thing to say. And then next thing you know, you're running late or you get there, your plane gets delayed and now you show up and you're the you're you're getting there as everybody's leaving and you're the last person and you've brought the 30th thing of flowers and everything's different.

• 13:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, exactly.

• 13:06Theo Von?

  Yeah. Oh.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:09Theo Von?

  Can you tell at your with your level of experience, can you tell when you stuck the landing on a scene? Like, can you like, is there a moment when that thing cuts and you just like, can be like, that was pretty good? Like, I serviced it well?

• 13:23Speaker 02

  I've had that feeling before and it always turned out to be terrible and I was wrong. Like, anytime, my experience is that anytime I'm like, fuck yeah, okay, got it. It's terrible. And the times where I'm like, I don't, I don't know, I don't know if I even landed, I'm not sure what's, I'm not sure what happened. That's usually when things, when I like look back at it and I go like, oh, I think that was good. That's just my experience. I don't know what other actors are like, but yeah, I guess maybe because

• 14:01Speaker 02

  I, I don't know, I don't know if the things that I like are like, capturing something that's like feels like intangible and hard to define. And like, when you kind of like nail it, I don't really like that kind of acting, or maybe I'm not good at it, like, you know?

• 14:28Theo Von?

  Yeah, maybe there's a sense of bravado that comes with that, that's not as true to life, you know? Because it's very rare in life, maybe you just feel like you kind of nail it, probably?

• 14:37Speaker 02

  Maybe. I mean, I don't know. I guess there's some people that walk around the world like nailed it.

• 14:44Theo Von?

  I know. For example, Hulk Hogan.

• 14:48Theo Von?

  Who else?

• 14:54Theo Von?

  Who else is somebody that really frickin nailed it? Oh, Nicolas Cage in Family Man. Have you seen that movie?

• 14:59Speaker 02

  Uh-uh.

• 15:00Theo Von?

  God. We got to sit together on a plane one time. Um, you know what was interesting about, and thanks for talking about this with me, man? Cause it's, uh, you know, it's just cool to get to like, like it's rare you get to look at a piece of art and you get to talk to the paint, you know? The interesting thing about Joe Cross, who the character that you played, is that there were moments I'm like, am I cheering for this guy? Like, I just felt, I was like, how do I feel? Cause he's who you're, you're kind of going through the, the, the film with, through Eddington with. I'm like, how do, like, do I feel for him? Do I feel against him? The whole time I just like, I just knew, I just felt, he made me feel, right?

• 15:44Theo Von?

  Are, are you thinking about that as we're going, as you're going through it, like how you're trying to make us feel? Or that's not something that an actor is doing?

• 15:53Speaker 02

  So, something that Ari and I talked about, something that was very important to me from the beginning, was that, uh, that Joe challenges like the audience's preconceived idea of what like a conservative, small-town sheriff is.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  And, uh, I didn't know how, you know, I didn't really know how or what that really meant, what that, what that really looked like. And I think at some point, I just, um, I just wanted to care about him. Like, I just wanted to, I just wanted to like take politics or philosophy or anything like that out of the picture and just go like, what's the, what's the man? And I think that I really, I think that we found that through, uh, his relationship with his, his wife.

• 16:50Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 16:50Speaker 02

  Cause I think that's really where, um, he's like most, uh, like his, his power or authority is like threatened or nonexistent.

• 17:02Speaker 02

  And so that it becomes like the catalyst for his kind of desire for more authority and power. It's one of the things, as you said, there's, there's several things kind of happening.

• 17:16Theo Von?

  Mm hmm.

• 17:17Speaker 02

  But then, once you start working, I think maybe you're thinking about that less, it's less becomes about, it's almost like you, that you start the process almost like an audience member yourself, because you're kind of outside this thing looking in, you're reading the script, and he's kind of like, it feels like it's like this, this character over there, you know what I mean? And you're trying to get to it, or bring it to you, or whatever that process is, I don't fucking know. And so you're, you're starting like, like that, and you're kind of going like, oh, how do I feel standing back here when this guy does this? And like, if he, if he said that line in this way, how does that

• 18:00Speaker 02

  make me, how would that make me feel? And then like somehow throughout this like process, you hopefully start coming together and kind of merging to some point where it's not me standing outside of the character saying, not like some bullshit, like I'm the character way, but just like, you're just, um, hopefully experiencing something versus like telling an audience what they should feel.

• 18:29Theo Von?

  Right.

• 18:30Speaker 02

  Um, and I think ultimately, the director's probably most responsible, is totally responsible for telling the audience how they should feel.

• 18:40Theo Von?

  Hmm.

• 18:41Speaker 02

  Right? So I think it's part of me is like to, just to take on the, the experience and be honest in that, that moment.

• 18:46Theo Von?

  So you have to really trust that director then, huh?

• 18:49Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Fuck, yeah.

• 18:51Theo Von?

  Fuck. Or he's outside, I think he does not want to be mentioned in here. He's trying to edit from outside, he just bleeped his own name out.

• 18:58Speaker 02

  Dude, totally, totally.

• 19:00Theo Von?

  Wow. But that just shows you how locked in he is to being on the ones and twos. Um, a lot of times with acting, the actors get blamed for when things go bad, right? I feel like as a viewer, you're like, oh shit, you know?

• 19:14Speaker 02

  Right.

• 19:15Theo Von?

  Like Rodney Dangerfield sucked in that, you know, or whatever.

• 19:18Speaker 02

  Well, yeah.

• 19:19Theo Von?

  But it's really the directors, the director doesn't take as much heat, I don't feel like.

• 19:24Speaker 02

  Um, well.

• 19:28Speaker 02

  So the actor is the one that you're looking at. So like, if you're like hating a movie and you're just looking at somebody's face, you're just gonna blame them, right? But conversely, like, if you're also like, this rules, this is the best time, they get the credit, right? So like actors oftentimes, I think more often than not, the actors are getting credit and the director's like, I fucking made all of this work.

• 19:52Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 19:53Speaker 02

  You fucking grateful shit. It must be like very frustrating.

• 19:58Theo Von?

  Like a parent almost with a child, you're like, this fucking thing looks handsome because I chased that lady down the street and he's just wandering around here with his good looks, fucking hiding important shit in the backyard.

• 20:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:12Theo Von?

  Because we bought him a shovel for his birthday, right?

• 20:15Speaker 02

  No, exactly. Yeah. And I mean, there's, you're talking about, you know, you're having multiple takes to choose from, right?

• 20:23Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 20:23Speaker 02

  And so, you know, director's going through and ultimately with the editor selecting this take, sometimes they're pulling the audio from another take they're putting in there. Just the, just like what, what lens is used and how it's lit and the angle and whether you cut to a wide shot or you're close, like all of those things, it just happens. Like even for me, I just watch a movie also. I'm not aware of the whole time.

• 20:49Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's a good point. It's not like you're a wizard watching it or something.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  I'm definitely not a wizard watcher. Yeah. But it's, so I imagine it's very frustrating, you know, for them. And I think anyone that's, that's in the business knows this, right? So when the movie, when the movie doesn't work, even if the, if the general public is like, you know, fucking so and so sucks.

• 21:14Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 21:16Speaker 02

  The director probably knows that they really mean them. So they, they carry that. I think it's probably, I think it's probably that, I imagine it's the hardest job.

• 21:28Theo Von?

  Being a director?

• 21:29Speaker 02

  I think, I mean, in, for making movies, yeah, the hardest job.

• 21:33Theo Von?

  You haven't directed?

• 21:34Speaker 02

  No.

• 21:35Theo Von?

  Did you ever think about it sometimes? Are there moments where you're almost there?

• 21:39Speaker 02

  I don't know that I don't know that I like to delegate and um and I'm really indecisive. So and it's like particularly under pressure and it feels like there's a lot, you know, it's you're constantly under pressure, I think, as a as a director, right? So but I don't I don't know that I think what's appealing about it, the idea is the collaboration with all of like the heads of the different departments. Is it after you, you know, you're collaborating with costume and hair and makeup and like props

• 22:22Speaker 02

  and stuff and then of course the director, but like the director is just like everybody and that's that sounds that sounds nice and appealing. I don't know, it might be a pain like oftentimes, you know, they're like, I'll call you back, but I have to choose which forks we're we're using for the dinner scene.

• 22:43Theo Von?

  Right.

• 22:44Speaker 02

  You're like, which fucking forks? Like, there's five forks to choose from, I gotta choose which which one we're using.

• 22:50Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 22:51Speaker 02

  Like, that that kind of sucks.

• 22:53Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. And it sucks if you're watching a movie and you see a fork that fucking is out of place, too. You're like, these people. This isn't the Titanic.

• 23:03Speaker 02

  You blame the actor.

• 23:04Theo Von?

  Oh, honestly?

• 23:05Speaker 02

  Because it's the actor's face and you're just like, I fucking hate this movie.

• 23:08Theo Von?

  Oh, you're like Dunkirk sucks. You see the silverware in that thing? That's how you feel sometimes.

• 23:16Theo Von?

  You know what was interesting, interesting to me? And if some of these questions are novice about acting and directing, thank you for entertaining them.

• 23:25Theo Von?

  One thing that was interesting to me about Joe Cross, about your character, well, for one, he was so imperfect, right? And yeah, when you saw him at night and he was like feeling like those feelings with when he come home from his day and he finally got to deal with what he really wanted to deal with, which was love, right?

• 23:42Theo Von?

  That just felt like so human to me.

• 23:46Theo Von?

  And he was his villain and his hero, right? He was he was the creator of his possibility and his um and his pain at the same time. And it was just so like. Ah, it was, fuck, it was just a lot to watch sometimes. Did that, does that just feel like regular life? Like, like, could you relate to him as a human? Does that make any sense?

• 24:10Speaker 02

  Yes, yeah, it does. First of all, I'm happy to talk about whatever. I also don't, I just realized like I was just talking about movies and directing. I don't fucking know anything. I have no idea what a director does. So I was just like, I don't want you to go like, ah, now I understand what, what director is like. Cause I guarantee you directors are like, this guy doesn't know shit.

• 24:38Speaker 02

  So I just wanted to clear that up.

• 24:40Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude, he's a, he's got some ideas. I'll tell you that, I'll tell you that about him. Well, you didn't walk in here like you definitely like had brought the weather with you. You know, you certainly came in here like a victim of the storm or just like a regular guy who had just gotten, you know, you kept, yeah. Anyway, go on, sir.

• 24:58Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no. Let me, let me educate you here, Theo. Let me teach you about filmmaking.

• 25:07Theo Von?

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• 26:57Theo Von?

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• 28:16Speaker 02

  Um, I'm sorry. I don't remember what.

• 28:19Theo Von?

  Yeah, I just felt like he was the cause of his own possibility and his own pain constantly. And it just, it made me think so much about life, but it was so real to see him that way. Um, could you relate to that in your own life? Like, or?

• 28:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course.

• 28:33Theo Von?

  Yeah. Just normal, huh?

• 28:34Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean.

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think all the, all the characters um in this, I, I felt when I read the script, I was like, oh, I kind of like, I recognize myself in all of these characters, actually. And sometimes it's like, you know, it's a, an embarrassing admission. And then, um, you know, there's just, there's things. Particularly that, that time. And I think in some ways, yeah. Maybe we're always.

• 29:11Speaker 02

  We're always, maybe we're always responsible for how we respond to what happens in the world, right? So we're not like, so much of like, just what happens in life, you don't have any control over. But how we respond to that, we have control over. And I know I constantly fail in, in my response. Or at least don't respond in the best way in the moment, right? Respond like emotionally. And so I definitely, I definitely identified with, with that. And that's, that's Joe. I mean, he kind of like, just keeps making mistakes.

• 29:56Speaker 02

  And he's so, like, he's, um.

• 30:03Speaker 02

  He's so desperate to like, have some control. Like, just like, let's just, he just wants, he's just like, you know that feeling when you're like, I just, I need things to just stop for a fucking second so I can breathe. And then like, your desire to like, make things stop, just make things ramp up more and more. And then you just like, trip and you fall down the stairs. It's just like, it's like that.

• 30:28Theo Von?

  Yeah, that escalation. Oh, I kept imagining the whole time. I'm like, oh my God, this guy is fucking just like. Has put too much cheese on his burger, dude. This guy is just, and then I kept imagining the whole time he has to take a pee and he can't even get to that. He's just dealing with like activists and people throwing things through wind. And then he gets home and he sleeps in his glasses. Like he literally gets up and just has to like bow and he's like, suddenly it's all in focus again and his brain has barely had time to rest. And I'm like, God, somebody fucking just put a sniper, shoot a Xanax into this dude or something. Just somebody fucking give him a damn Percocet suppository or something. This guy needs some relief, you know?

• 31:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:09Theo Von?

  And then it also was like, God, especially during that time, like a lot of mania came along with a lot of those different, like, things that were happening in the world, right? And there's still a lot of mania remnants from that. And I was like, God, everybody needed some relief, you know?

• 31:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:24Theo Von?

  It feels like that as a society, sometimes we need some relief sometimes. But we have everything we need, it feels like. So it's kind of a weird juxtaposition to be in.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  Yeah. So what's the plan?

• 31:35Theo Von?

  Yeah. What is the plan? I don't know. I don't know. It just feels like we're just doing the opposite of a hug right now.

• 31:42Speaker 02

  That's, that's right. That's right. And, um.

• 31:46Theo Von?

  Yeah. Did you feel when you watch that movie, like you got to the, like, you were like, this is a reminder, this will like help influence it, people in a better way. This could be like a seed of like where we've been and where we can grow from or?

• 31:59Speaker 02

  I don't know. I mean, I, I don't know. I, I don't know. Like, movies are surprising, those things that connect with people and actually influence culture. And sometimes they, they don't, there's not, I don't really know what it is.

• 32:16Theo Von?

  That's crazy to ask.

• 32:17Speaker 02

  You know, no, no, no. I think it's a fair question. And I think in some ways, um, I think all I can do is think about like myself versus like the, the effect that it has on, on me. And, you know, in some ways there was, um. There was like, I felt like I had permission to, um, to laugh at myself, like a way to like, I kind of evaluate some of that, like many, as you say, it's like, we're like fucking crazy. Like the summer of 2020, it was crazy. And people were, I love that you said it's the opposite of a hug and it really was like, everyone was so kind of fractured and fragmented and just, um, all isolated in our own worlds, like quite literally physically isolated.

• 33:02Speaker 02

  And then everyone was just so online and kind of fed their own.

• 33:07Theo Von?

  An algorithm.

• 33:08Speaker 02

  Fucking thing, yes. That just further kind of propelled them into their own lanes. It's like even people in the same houses, in their own place. And, and there was just like this, um,

• 33:21Speaker 02

  I remember everything felt so aggressive, like even there were like, there were like signs that were supposed to be like, like, we trust science and we, you know, we love all people. But some of it even not felt like confrontational.

• 33:39Theo Von?

  Right.

• 33:40Speaker 02

  Like, it was like, there's, it's like, it didn't, it felt like no matter what anyone said, everyone was like, this is my position and my position is fucking right and you go fuck yourself. Like, you know, it's just like, people went fucking nuts. Well, we, not people, not, uh, we did.

• 33:59Theo Von?

  Yeah, all of us. No, it doesn't seem like you're calling anybody out. It feels like we're all inclusive. I agree. It's amazing what a time, it was like the most recent time capsule that was the most insane. Like usually they're like, we found a can of ham from 1930, you know? And we're going to invite everybody over and the girls will sing and then we'll open it, you know? But this was like, Jesus Christ, we just found the most insane time capsule and we, the mud is still wet.

• 34:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:24Theo Von?

  Yes.

• 34:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:26Theo Von?

  But then it's like, it was a reminder, have we even recovered from all of that? Like what happens to the human being as we go through all that? And then you have all this pent up anger and confusion and everything.

• 34:37Speaker 02

  I think we wanted to forget or like pretending to, to forget.

• 34:42Speaker 02

  Because, yeah, it was, uh, it was ugly and, and it's, it was ugly. It was ugly, but it's also really, it was also really painful. And I think, um, I think a lot of people were like fucking scared and.

• 34:58Theo Von?

  But then also the character of the mother, I didn't even think about that of Joe Cross's mother because

• 35:03Speaker 02

  Mother-in-law.

• 35:04Theo Von?

  Mother-in-law. Oh, that was his mother-in-law of the mother-in-law because then you you're you're like.

• 35:12Speaker 02

  Did it just change everything now for you to know that it's not his mother?

• 35:16Theo Von?

  No, it made it a little bit more crazy. I'm like, so you're telling me he teamed up with her mom and now they're the one it's just like, but then that is something a lot of people have in their life. Like, oh, well, I talked to my girlfriend's mom all day and now we're team or the or the, you know, oh, shit, man, that guy was screwed, dude.

• 35:36Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 35:37Theo Von?

  Joe Cross was fucking screwed.

• 35:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, but he but he did. He's he screwed himself.

• 35:45Theo Von?

  Yeah, he was the he was the holder of his possibility and his pain at the same time, you know, it was pretty crazy. Um, yeah, what was meeting Ari Aster like? I watched some interviews with him. He seemed like a charming guy.

• 35:57Speaker 02

  Um, yes.

• 36:02Theo Von?

  I met one of his partners, Lars Nudsen. You

• 36:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 36:05Theo Von?

  Dude, I had some video calls with him a few years ago. I just

• 36:09Speaker 02

  Really?

• 36:10Theo Von?

  I was looking it up.

• 36:11Speaker 02

  But why?

• 36:12Theo Von?

  We were just talking about something, maybe thinking about an idea. I had an idea about a um, a movie and David Spade and I just wrote a movie and made a movie. We paid for it ourselves that we made, right? So it's fucking very unique.

• 36:25Speaker 02

  It's done?

• 36:26Theo Von?

  It's done. We're editing it now.

• 36:27Speaker 02

  Right.

• 36:28Theo Von?

  And it's

• 36:29Speaker 02

  Are you in it?

• 36:30Theo Von?

  I'm in it. I'm like this his sidekick. He's like the main guy.

• 36:32Speaker 02

  Wait, so you know all about making movies and then you were just playing dumb, asking me questions, setting me up, setting me up to be like, well, let me tell you something.

• 36:42Theo Von?

  Not at all, dude.

• 36:44Speaker 02

  Here's here how here's how it's done.

• 36:47Theo Von?

  No, we fucking we have no idea what we have, dude. We may have a damn visual diorama that a couple of kids put together for their kindergarten class. You know, I was playing a busboy, you know, not Commodus, you know? So I think it's definitely this is way different. I think it's a different. This is a is that the right way to say it Commodus?

• 37:07Speaker 02

  I don't fucking know.

• 37:08Theo Von?

  Yeah, anyway, no, I didn't know anything. I mean, I'm just learning little things, but I mean, I get to talk to somebody who's been, you know, who has had a plethora of experience.

• 37:18Speaker 02

  So you talked to Lars. Lars is great. Lars is the producing partner of Ari.

• 37:22Theo Von?

  Yeah, I just realized that yesterday when I was looking it up. I was like, oh, wow. I had spoken with this guy before, but uh.

• 37:28Speaker 02

  When I, when I met Ari, uh, we didn't, we didn't meet. It was, we, we spoke on the phone. Um, and it was

• 37:39Speaker 02

  the summer of 2020 is when we first spoke. Um, and he had this, uh, film that he wanted to make called Bo's Afraid that he wanted to talk to me about. Um, and so I just, I spoke with him on the phone and I mean, the first time that I met him, this is so crazy. This is so COVID was, was when I got to Montreal to, to shoot that movie. Um, and, uh, it's so wild because it just was like normal. We just accepted it, but that's very strange, right? To not meet the director, for like the actor and the director not to like be in a room together until they're two weeks out from shooting.

• 38:21Theo Von?

  It seems risque.

• 38:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:24Theo Von?

  It seems risque to me to do something like that. It's like you could interview your cellmate or whatever, but you're like, now I'll just wing it in there, you know? You could have a little small Q and A with your cellie. Um, so was there something that inspired you or led you to think? Cause I think what's interesting also in, in, in the career of an actor is you start to realize, well, I only have so many times that I get to do this and times that I can afford to be away from family and friends and just take on such energy in my life. And so it's, I'm sure it starts to become a little bit more poignant, like the choices that you do make. So what was there something about him or his processes that made you think this is the right choice? Or how do you land on a choice like that?

• 39:08Speaker 02

  Uh, you never know if it's the right choice or what it is, right? You're just going, I mean, honestly, I, I just liked him. We started talking and the way that he talked about the film and the way that he talks about the character, I knew that it was personal and I could tell that, um, it meant so much to him that he loved making movies and it meant so much to him. And that he.

• 39:36Speaker 02

  Like, I think I just got a sense that he was tireless. And, and like, you know, you, the director like really has to be obsessed, right? Cause they do have to, they have to do so much. Which fork am I fucking choosing, right? Do you want them to actually care about that shit? Or else you're gonna be watching the thing Dunkirk and you're pissed off.

• 40:04Theo Von?

  They have plastic silverware?

• 40:06Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 40:07Theo Von?

  In fucking eighteen twelve?

• 40:10Theo Von?

  And I'm sure, I'm sure that wasn't the right year for Dunkirk either, so we're all bad.

• 40:14Speaker 02

  No, no, that's, that sounds good.

• 40:20Speaker 02

  So, so I think that that's, that's maybe what, you know, right away, I was like, okay, well, this, you know, he, he loves making movies. And I, I know that just from talking to him on the phone. And he's funny. I mean, I guess the biggest thing, sometimes you're just like, do I wanna hang out with this fucking dude?

• 40:40Theo Von?

  I'm sure.

• 40:44Speaker 02

  And it's like, cause you know, you go through a whole range of emotions to make a movie. I mean, yeah, it's a movie and you're, you're safe, but in the moment, your body doesn't know that it's not real. You know what I mean? It's just some shit that you're doing, right? And, um, so it can, you know, things can get like, there can be a lot of emotion or a lot of energy and, and, uh, and yeah, you know, having somebody that you really like feels important.

• 41:17Speaker 02

  And they paid me so much money.

• 41:18Theo Von?

  Oh, God. Give me some, I'll give you a little.

• 41:24Theo Von?

  Dude, side quest really quick. So my friend Josh used to live like, I think somewhere like in E, kind of like over by East LA. And, um, I've known who you were like a decent amount of my life, cause most of the world knows you, knows your name. But he said that you lived in his area and I was like, well, what if I opened up a shoe store called, uh, these boots are made for Joaquin, right? I was like, just to get to meet you. That would be the goal, the only goal of the whole store was to get to meet you. And, uh, anyway, that was just like something funny that we thought of one day. But if you saw that store, say if you'd driven by a couple of times, like, do you think you ever would have stopped in there?

• 42:00Speaker 02

  Absolutely. Yeah, and I would have just like cleaned the place out.

• 42:05Speaker 02

  For sure. Where was this?

• 42:06Theo Von?

  You just come in with a pistol.

• 42:08Speaker 02

  You're all mine. Oh, that's not what I meant by clean the place out. I was gonna do it legally.

• 42:13Theo Von?

  Oh, support the business?

• 42:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:15Theo Von?

  Thank you, dude.

• 42:16Speaker 02

  Yeah. Does clean the place out mean like I'm here to fuck shit up?

• 42:20Theo Von?

  I think the, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that term's changed over time.

• 42:24Speaker 02

  Oh, I didn't, I didn't mean it that way. I apologize. See, this, these are the, these are the mistakes you can make.

• 42:31Theo Von?

  But thanks for saying you would have stopped by, dude. That's awesome.

• 42:34Speaker 02

  No, it's, it's a great, how could I not? It's a great store. Maybe you should still put it together.

• 42:40Theo Von?

  I'll tell you this, one day if I make enough money and I can open up a small place that I could afford to do it on the side, as a thank you to you for coming on the podcast and talking with me, I'll open up a small one near you. And I'm, I'll surprise you.

• 42:56Theo Von?

  I feel like something like that would be pretty special. Um, when it comes to acting, um, has your approach to, has your approach to acting changed over the years? Like, has you noticed your own evolution with it? And if you get tired of talking about acting, we can talk about something else.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  Uh, has my approach changed? I don't, um, maybe and maybe not. Uh, I don't know.

• 43:21Speaker 02

  I, I don't, I don't, I don't think so. Um, you know, you're definitely more self-aware. It's just like.

• 43:30Theo Von?

  You are?

• 43:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's just, it's just like the nature of, of doing something, you know, that's like visible and you're out there for whatever, thirty fucking plus years or whatever.

• 43:46Speaker 02

  Maybe more than that, maybe forty-two?

• 43:48Theo Von?

  But are you, wow, that's a long time. But self-aware in the sense where you're like, um, you know, you, all your like, like, do you start to know all the, like, the, the palate you have as an actor? Or does that continue to evolve? Or does some of it get lessened because you're getting older and you can't, you know what I'm saying? You couldn't do the same thing. Maybe you could as a, as a twenty-seven-year-old actor, or twenty-one, or eighteen-year-old? Like, does that palate grow or does it dissipate, kind of?

• 44:22Speaker 02

  Um, I don't know, maybe, maybe both things and maybe sometimes it's maybe it just gets refined. Maybe just, you know, it's similar.

• 44:35Speaker 02

  It's just like, um, a richer color or, or less rich. I don't know what, you know, I don't know what it is. Maybe that's, that's what happens. Hopefully you have

• 44:48Speaker 02

  a director that also is familiar with your work and can like challenge you if, if you're not challenging yourself.

• 44:56Speaker 02

  But I think like, you know, it's like, I don't know, but I imagine, um, it was like when you're, uh, you know, it's like, it's like 20 year old basketball players coming out and, you know, he's just fucking, just going for it, trying to make a name, right? He's just doing the thing. And at some point, he becomes no, you know, he's suddenly like one of the guys on the team. It's a different kind of pressure of like taking that shot. Right? Cause it's like, when you're young, it's like, oh, it's scary. Cause it's like, oh, if I fucking miss, I don't, maybe I don't get another opportunity. But then when you're older and established, it's like, if I miss, it's gonna be a lot of pressure.

• 45:40Speaker 02

  And people are gonna be like, you got paid way too much money to fucking miss that shot.

• 45:43Theo Von?

  Yeah, that dude should not be missing at this point.

• 45:45Speaker 02

  Like get the fuck out.

• 45:47Theo Von?

  He wasn't even wearing sneakers. Like what kind of guy do we have here?

• 45:51Speaker 02

  So this is, you know what I mean? So I think like, that's what I mean by like being self-aware. Like it's, at some point, you feel pressure in a different way. Like I think it's always, in my, it's always like, you always feel the pressure, but, um, yeah, I think when you're 20 years old, it's, it's just, it's, it's, it's just different and,

• 46:13Speaker 02

  and nobody's really looking at you. You don't feel pressure when you walk on, on set.

• 46:19Theo Von?

  Right. So that kind of goes away, but there's a different pressure of like, it's really. That these overalls are hanging off my shoulders here.

• 46:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't understand that.

• 46:28Theo Von?

  Yeah, I don't either, actually. So to be honest with you, I was trying to be like a weight of the world on the shoulders. I was thinking of something that goes on shoulders and then overalls came out. I'm like, fuck dude.

• 46:38Speaker 02

  No, no, it was good. You should stick with it.

• 46:43Speaker 02

  It doesn't sound good. No, I just felt, I just felt stupid. I was like, oh, I was like, this is a really cool saying. I don't know it.

• 46:49Theo Von?

  Um, are there moments when you're acting where, cause I'll, there's little moments whenever I do stand up where I feel like people that are like relative or something. There'll be a moment where I feel like my brother, my sister. Like there's some times where I turn a certain way and it almost feels like my mom. Do you ever feel like you channel like certain parts of you, like people come out of you in certain moments? I think I notice it more as I get older too. Does it make any sense to you?

• 47:13Speaker 02

  Uh, sure.

• 47:14Theo Von?

  Like you ever turn towards your kids and say something, you're like, I am, that was just my dad. Like that wasn't even me doing that.

• 47:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, I, I mean, I definitely in my life have a lot of my dad, uh, in me.

• 47:28Theo Von?

  Really? Were you surprised that you got so much of it?

• 47:32Speaker 02

  I was, and I think, I think I was like the last to know. But it was like, yeah, like that, like that. And then like it's something I was like, they're saying like dad, like those are not good qualities. And so.

• 47:47Theo Von?

  Like sleeping in his car, dad, like dad.

• 47:51Speaker 02

  Right. And so I then became aware of it, but no, I think, I think my dad actually, um,

• 47:59Speaker 02

  I was aware from fairly young that, um, I, I think he's probably the greatest, uh,

• 48:12Speaker 02

  influence, or I was influenced by his life in my work. Um, I don't know if this is making sense.

• 48:20Speaker 02

  I think I modeled so many characters that I've played after him.

• 48:28Speaker 02

  He's, he's dead. He's been dead for a while, so I can talk shit about him.

• 48:32Theo Von?

  So yeah, so he can't disagree with you.

• 48:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was like, what are you gonna say?

• 48:37Theo Von?

  And if he is gonna do.

• 48:38Speaker 02

  I just like, cause I was like, I don't, don't say your dad died. It's fucked up. Make a joke about it and then go, that's even worse. So.

• 48:44Theo Von?

  No, we weren't sure if he died until you said it. I'll be honest with you.

• 48:46Speaker 02

  Don't, don't look it up. Cause he might not be dead.

• 48:51Theo Von?

  You channel him right now and just turn into him, that would be crazy. Um, wow, that's kind of interesting. Yeah, I think, you know what, sometimes I think I'm like my mom and I never thought I would be. And I was always even like rebellious against my mother and then I'm like, you gotta be, sometimes I look in the mirror, I'm like, you gotta be fucking kidding me, you know? But then at the same time, it's like, that was probably in my life, that was the connection that I wanted the most anyway. So it's interesting that that's what God gave me or that's how it, you know, that like, oh, it's like, this is kind of what I always wanted the most and it's oddly,

• 49:28Theo Von?

  that's part of the most of what I am, you know?

• 49:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:31Theo Von?

  Just interesting how sometimes things like that work out. Um, was your dad a funny guy?

• 49:36Speaker 02

  He's very funny. I mean, he was, um, he was a ham.

• 49:41Theo Von?

  Oh, he was?

• 49:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, like he loved, uh, doing skits for us kids.

• 49:47Theo Von?

  Really?

• 49:48Speaker 02

  And joke, yeah.

• 49:49Theo Von?

  That's cool of him.

• 49:50Speaker 02

  And like joking around, yeah, he's very, um, yeah, yeah, he was.

• 49:55Theo Von?

  And what would he do, like death of a salesman or death of, I don't know what he did for a job, death of like a

• 50:02Theo Von?

  employee somewhere?

• 50:05Speaker 02

  No.

• 50:06Theo Von?

  He would just have fun moments?

• 50:07Speaker 02

  One of his, uh, his favorites, which, which always made us laugh was the, was, it was only called the fly skit. Where he just was literally, he just was a guy reading a paper on a bench and a fly starts buzzing around. And he like waves it away. Then he tries to like hit it with the newspaper, you know, he like rolls it up and like hits it. And finally goes in his bag and he takes out some bug spray and he goes to spray it just as it lands on his nose and he sprays himself in the face. And then like gets, gets all fucked up from the, from the bug spray and falls over.

• 50:46Speaker 02

  And like, when you're like six years old, that's the most genius thing you've ever seen, especially because we didn't have like TV and shit when I was young. So that was like. High level entertainment.

• 50:58Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. Your dad was the damn History Channel when you were a kid back in the day. You know what I'm saying? Or they were, that's so funny to think about. I never thought of my parents were like the channels that we had like, because we had some channels, but it wasn't like that, you know, it wasn't like every moment was accessed. So really people were looked at as a lot more entertainment, like, oh, let me go poke this bear and see what I can get him to do a little bit, you know? Oh, that's cool, dude. My dad, um, oh, it's so funny, dude. My dad was very old when I was born. He was like, he was born in nineteen, uh, nineteen ten or whatever. And so he was like, everything was very like, you know, and my brother and I would go to,

• 51:38Theo Von?

  he ran a, the World's Fair was in New Orleans when I was growing up and he ran a, I don't know if he ran, but somehow they let him have the keys to go in there in the morning and he, it was like a souvenir shop for the World's Fair or postcards, stuff like that in the French Quarter. And he'd always pay this guy, this guy who was a clown, right? He'd be like, go get the kids a couple of, uh, wieners or franks, you know? Hot dogs. So we'd like, I just remember like one of my early memories is just being with my brother and this clown that my dad had given a couple of shackles to running us down the street to get us a couple of fucking hot dogs. And I was like, oh, this is gonna be a fucking interesting road.

• 52:19Speaker 02

  So how, how old were you, uh, when he moved on?

• 52:24Theo Von?

  When he moved on, I was sixteen and I was, it was weird because I was like embarrassed of my dad because he was older. So I didn't want to introduce him to people. I always had like this weird relationship. But then I think as a kid, it was fascinating to watch this older guy that, uh, that you love so much, but you're also trying to keep hidden, you know?

• 52:44Speaker 02

  So how, when you were sixteen, oh, dude, I'm not, I'm gonna fail at math.

• 52:50Theo Von?

  No worries.

• 52:50Speaker 02

  I'm trying to figure out, I'm trying to figure out if that's how my son is gonna think of me.

• 52:55Theo Von?

  Oh, damn, dude.

• 52:57Speaker 02

  I was forty-five when he was born.

• 52:59Theo Von?

  You'll still be fine.

• 53:00Speaker 02

  Huh?

• 53:01Theo Von?

  I think you're gonna be okay. It's gonna be, do not get a cane early though. If you get a cane early, he'll know.

• 53:09Theo Von?

  If you get, I thought about this. I was just thinking about yesterday because I gotta knock somebody up in the next two years because I need a family. But if you get a cane early, he's gonna know.

• 53:16Speaker 02

  Right. So that's, so I basically, when I, when I had my first son, I was your age. And, and it is something that I think about constantly, like, um, and I, cause I just want to be able to be a fun dad and not, and not be this. So did your dad die suddenly? Fast?

• 53:39Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's okay, man. Yeah, he got cancer and I didn't even know about cancer that much. And, uh, and he died pretty quick. It was pretty sad because suddenly he got like, yeah, it was just kinda sad. I mean, it's, it's all sad, but then it was, you know, I don't know. Well, of course it was sad. We might think we're fucking, you know, everybody was like getting the champagne out, but he was a ridiculous. But my dad couldn't see, he would drive, he would take us somewhere, but he couldn't see the lights or anything. So he'd be like, what it tell, is it red or green? And suddenly we'd get it wrong and he'd fucking just drive out it. It was all baffling.

• 54:12Speaker 02

  That sounds kinda cool.

• 54:14Theo Von?

  Yeah, I think he would have dug it.

• 54:15Speaker 02

  I gotta say.

• 54:19Theo Von?

  Wow. You would have dug it. Um, did your dad have cancer or no?

• 54:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, he did.

• 54:23Theo Von?

  He did?

• 54:24Speaker 02

  He did. Yeah. And here's something else that's fucked up.

• 54:27Theo Von?

  Okay.

• 54:27Speaker 02

  My sisters lost his ashes. No, yeah, we just, it's every couple of months, was it somebody will send out a text to the thread, be like, has anybody found dad's ashes?

• 54:42Speaker 02

  And, and it's, cause all you could do is fucking laugh because it's horrible.

• 54:50Speaker 02

  It's just horrible.

• 54:52Theo Von?

  It's almost really like his last performance. I mean, that's such a.

• 54:56Speaker 02

  Totally. It's a, it's a great bit. It's a fucking, that's, you're right. It's his best moment.

• 55:04Theo Von?

  Dad's, has anybody found? I love that text too, you know?

• 55:09Speaker 02

  Just randomly every once in a while, because it'll occur to one of us. I'll be like, yeah, which, where the fuck are dad's ashes? He sent that out and, um, still don't know. Here's the thing. I mean, I'm blaming my sisters. Yeah. Oh, it might have been me. That's true. I don't know. The thing is, is that it's one of those real like, you know, sometimes you have a vague memory of like, I know we were in here. Yeah, no idea. I have no idea.

• 55:37Theo Von?

  Like, yeah, do you ever walk in the kitchen? You're like, it's kind of like that thing, like, what was I in here to get? You know, what did, what did I put those, you know? Yeah. Oh, man. Thanks for sharing that. That's funny. I'm glad we even got to laugh about your dad today and my dad. That's cool. I think our, I think spirits, I think like, when you laugh about somebody from your like, life or something like that, I think they feel that on the other side. I think there's like a big connection there that we don't know about.

• 56:01Speaker 00

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• 56:32Theo Von?

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• 57:17Theo Von?

  with members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features.

• 57:25Theo Von?

  Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Go to rocketmoney.com/ Theo today. That's rocketmoney.com/ T H E O. Rocketmoney.com/ Theo. You know, the summertime has a lot of side hustles going on. You'll see somebody maybe out there, they out there picking strawberries and selling them. Or they got them a little lemonade stand over there popping off. And that's all, that's all most new business ideas are in the beginning is a side hustle. And then they start to pick up steam. And that's when you need Shopify.

• 58:06Theo Von?

  When your side hustle becomes a serious hustle and any step along the way, Shopify is there. When you're ready to roll, Shopify is the best way to get your product into customers' hands. It's easy. You can set up an entire store in one day and it's trusted by millions of businesses around the world. Shopify made it easy over the years. When my merch shop started out and we had a couple of fellas just printing our T-shirts over there in Akron. And then, then we evolved it and now it's a really, it's a functioning little shop we got going. Thank you for the support. Whether you're just wanting to test an idea out or you're getting serious about launching your own brand,

• 58:47Theo Von?

  it's never been easier to get started on Shopify.com/ Theo. That's it. Shopify.com/ Theo. Take your side hustle and see what you can do.

• 59:04Theo Von?

  Have you ever met someone and you were like, I could play that person? Like, is that, because that would be like, kind of like, I feel like if I were an actor, that would be like my power. Like you would corner somebody in a, in a room of a fucking party and be like, I could play you in a heartbeat.

• 59:18Speaker 02

  Huh.

• 59:19Theo Von?

  You know? Does that happen with the good actors?

• 59:21Speaker 02

  I, I don't know, you have to ask good actors. I think that I, um,

• 59:29Speaker 02

  that's what this is called this past weekend?

• 59:32Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 59:34Speaker 02

  How'd you come up with that?

• 59:35Theo Von?

  Because I just started on a Monday.

• 59:39Theo Von?

  To be honest.

• 59:42Speaker 02

  That's good.

• 59:45Theo Von?

  We didn't have a real drawing board there, Mr. Phoenix.

• 59:49Speaker 02

  I'm trying to think.

• 59:52Speaker 02

  I don't know that I don't know that there's ever been anyone where I was like, I have to, I have to play that. I've been, I've been inspired by like friend, like I've stolen shit from like friends and people that that I've met. But I've never, I don't think that I've ever like, like, I'm going to play.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  Who?

• 1:00:14Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:00:16Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah, you get to choose. You're the one who can do it.

• 1:00:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:19Theo Von?

  But that's the interesting thing. Yeah. I just wonder if you had that ability. Does that start to get into into some people? But then maybe that's like some ego in there, too.

• 1:00:29Theo Von?

  You play the broken so well, man. You really just have a, I mean, you are just like a harp that is missing some strings, you know? But it's really beautiful to watch a lot of times. What is that? Why do you think that you get attracted to those roles? It seems like you must in some ways.

• 1:00:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:50Theo Von?

  And sorry to just kind of like pigeonhole you and your abilities. I know you have a lot of abilities.

• 1:01:00Speaker 02

  I definitely, I don't know why, I guess, okay, so.

• 1:01:11Speaker 02

  My dad was, he was, he was a complicated dude and he

• 1:01:20Speaker 02

  there was like a lot of like, I want to say dichotomy, but I don't even really, I'm not entirely sure if that's, if that's the right thing, but it is like.

• 1:01:30Theo Von?

  Conflict or something?

• 1:01:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, and, and he's, he was really, he was complex or something very like

• 1:01:39Speaker 02

  sensitive and sweet and thoughtful about him. And he grew up in a pretty, pretty tough situation and

• 1:01:49Speaker 02

  you know, was in juvie, very young and had this very splintered family background and you know, it was like.

• 1:01:57Theo Von?

  Pretty affected.

• 1:01:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, like you, you know, it's what you'd call like a shit kicker. And he was like, so, but he also was like, he also was like. Like a fucking hippie was like, you know, was, you know, vegan and like, um, so, so I think like, I was really, I think he was like so fascinating to, to me, um, growing up because I think I, I saw the, those things and that, that existed inside the same person.

• 1:02:30Theo Von?

  Yeah, let's get fucked up and get a salad on.

• 1:02:32Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:02:35Theo Von?

  I mean, that's a crazy thing to even think, you know, and I'm sorry to say that just a little bit like.

• 1:02:41Speaker 02

  No, it's, it's, it's great. It was, it was great and it was perfect and I needed that moment.

• 1:02:48Speaker 02

  So I, I think like that was really, again, I think maybe I was, I'm not, you know, I don't know why, but I think I was attracted to those roles, maybe as a way of,

• 1:03:03Speaker 02

  whatever, you know.

• 1:03:04Theo Von?

  Connection or just a something.

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, just like.

• 1:03:06Theo Von?

  Familiarity?

• 1:03:07Speaker 02

  Just curiosity. You know what I mean? Like, I, like, he was kind of like the most interesting person to me. And I probably wanted to like, try and understand him more or something. I don't know. Maybe, or maybe not. I, I don't really know. Um, but so I think maybe that's, that's part of it. And then like, like, yeah, I just, I, I love, I was one of those people that whatever limited exposure I had to, uh, film or television when I was young, um, I loved like fucking drama. Like I, I loved conflict. I mean, I did. I loved when shit was like, you know, this is, don't, this is very bad.

• 1:03:50Speaker 02

  Everything's about to happen. This is very bad. Oh no, you are a fucked up person. I was fucked up. How could you have done that? Uh, I think that that was interesting to me and I think I also wanted to like, try to, um, I always was like curious.

• 1:04:05Speaker 02

  Uh, I didn't believe that there was like, uh, like good people and bad people. So like, I was like interested like, okay, well, this is somebody has made these like mistakes or bad decisions. How could that, how could that happen? Like, what are those, what led to that? I think it's just like a curiosity about that, maybe.

• 1:04:25Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:25Speaker 02

  Um, and then some of it, honestly, straight up, some of it also is like, it's not like I walk in and it's like the full fucking salad bar and I can choose whatever. There's like a full thing and then they come in, they're like, you have, you can actually just from here to there, you can have those four options. You go, but what about there? They go, no, no, you don't, that's not for you. So part of it is like, get in where you fit in, right? Part of it is like, I had a face that just oftentimes looked criminal from like very, from a very young age. I noticed that like, when I went into the luggage store with my friends, I was the one that was followed around by security. They like, were like, and I didn't understand why, but at some point, I think I kind of realized, I was like, oh, okay.

• 1:05:10Speaker 02

  So I'm getting, I'm getting these, these parts and like.

• 1:05:15Theo Von?

  Yeah, I'm the guy in the master. Yeah.

• 1:05:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, or, you know, playing Skeletor in the He-Man commercial, not He-Man.

• 1:05:23Theo Von?

  Oh, that's what you're saying. Like, oh, this is kind of interesting.

• 1:05:26Speaker 02

  I mean, so part of it is like, that's just also the reality, right? And there's things where you're like, oh, but I can do that. I want to do that. And they're like, no, you can't. And in some ways, maybe they're right. There's also like a point where you're like, okay, how do I, how do I achieve that thing that I'm chasing there in this, in this thing? Like, maybe that's the better route for me. Like, maybe that's the more honest thing. And like, I'm chasing an idea.

• 1:06:02Speaker 02

  That I think that somebody maybe has of me as an actor and I want to dispel that. No, what do you, who, that's not what's important.

• 1:06:12Speaker 02

  But maybe it's valuable to like chase that quality, but through this, this character's experience.

• 1:06:21Theo Von?

  That's fascinating, dude. Like the Joker. Yeah, like I could totally see exactly what you're talking about. Like, and I'll think a lot of times in life, we have this, we're chasing an idea of ourselves or a projection that we thought someone else had of us. Or even just the, um, the archetype. I can't even fricking remember that word, dude, from fricking science or whatever. The archetype of what we think something is, you know, like the high school quarterback or the prom queen. And for our whole life, we're like, instead of being like, well, why don't I just fucking put on this comfortable shoe? That fits, or why don't I try to be the quarterback? But he's in the fucking school play and he doesn't have a football, right? And he's a fucking lives in a dungeon or whatever and he has a hunchback.

• 1:07:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, cuz it's, it's probably good to like, challenge yourself and challenge expectations, right? To not just go like, oh, I guess I'm just that and I'll just be that, right? There was, I think I did have, um, an ambition. But really my ambition was about like an experience. I felt like, I don't want, I don't want my experience to be limited. Like, that's not, that's not fair that I don't want to just play this role in this way. Like, that's, I, like, I want, my appetite was bigger than that. Like, it was bigger than I think what I was, um, what I was told.

• 1:07:45Speaker 02

  I remember, I remember like, I remember when I was young, I remember doing this movie and that one of the other actor was talking to the director and he was like, Wouldn't it be cool if, you know, Joaquin did, you know, this kind of movie, you know, kind of like so and so, and he mentioned this other actor that was like my peer, who was like, like the actor, right? And the director was like, yeah, but I mean, Joaquin is no so and so. And, and he was like, and, and the other actor was like, dude, that's so fucked up. The director was like, oh, no, no, I just, I mean that in the best way, like you're a character actor.

• 1:08:20Theo Von?

  He's no Fred Armisen.

• 1:08:23Speaker 02

  Character actor, yeah, it's like, it's like kind of code for like, you can't really, like you're never gonna really get there, but you'll work. And, um,

• 1:08:34Speaker 02

  and that fucking pissed me off. Here's the thing, but it pissed me off because I was like, no, I ca- I have more, like, that's not,

• 1:08:46Speaker 02

  there's more that will come out, that will come out of me. And I just, um, but I think I ultimately appreciate it because it, it made me go like, well, how do I find that way, like, how do I find more? And, and yeah, damn, I'm not gonna be able to get in this door. And like, yeah, I shouldn't play the quarterback, like, it doesn't make sense. Like, if I walked out, then you're going like, well, this team, unless it's like.

• 1:09:14Theo Von?

  The defense is gonna be on the field a lot. Yeah. If this guy's a fucking quarterback, what's it gonna be?

• 1:09:20Speaker 02

  Unless it's like some eighties school comedy, like kids comedy where like, they're a disaster. You know, maybe that, maybe that version of it.

• 1:09:30Theo Von?

  Yeah, or unless they like siphon in a unique quarterback from another realm, kind of.

• 1:09:35Speaker 02

  Right, and his thing is, by the way, let's not give away too much because maybe this is

• 1:09:44Speaker 02

  something we should, we should work on.

• 1:09:46Theo Von?

  But no, I, I think there was something else you said in there and I forgot what it was a second ago, but it was really profound about, or as profound as people can be in a fucking motel somewhere, but, um, with.

• 1:09:57Speaker 02

  It's a hotel.

• 1:09:58Theo Von?

  You're right, actually.

• 1:10:01Speaker 02

  Well, just because in case they're listening.

• 1:10:04Theo Von?

  I don't want them being upset, this is a very famous hotel where a lot of fucking important people have overdosed.

• 1:10:13Theo Von?

  And that is true, we're at the Chelsea Hotel and it is very unique and fun. This is a great place to be whenever you're in New York City, I think.

• 1:10:21Theo Von?

  You're tricking me now.

• 1:10:24Speaker 02

  No, I didn't set you up at all. No, I for real had paranoia and I was like, I don't want to be a person who's talking shit about them. And but Motel Chelsea also, it's kind of sounds dope, to be honest.

• 1:10:40Theo Von?

  Motel Chelsea?

• 1:10:41Speaker 02

  Yeah. It sounds better than Hotel Chelsea.

• 1:10:45Theo Von?

  Oh, it sounds like somebody my dad met. You know what I'm saying? That's a problem, dude.

• 1:10:52Speaker 02

  Sorry. So anyways.

• 1:10:54Theo Von?

  No, it's all fun. But I think you said exactly what you wanted to say there. And I think it's interesting. Yeah. Because I think it pertains just even outside of acting is how can we do more? How or like, how can I find a way to apply myself to this thing? How do I adjust? Like, what is a new way to do something? If I want to get to my goal? And if it's even going to be possible, is there another route? Right? Like rerouting when your app says that it's kind of like that, which I think is something that people do when they are, when they really have a goal that they want to try and attain, you know, I just think it's interesting.

• 1:11:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's like, of, of, of course, right? Resistance, right? Like, it's like, resistance is, is important. And, you know, just reading like, just been reading about dinosaurs, my kid. And, and you're like, oh, shit, motherfuckers were like, hold on, there's a very large dinosaur. It's got big teeth. It's nasty. It's mean. And what do I do? I'm just, I'm, I'm a fucking vegetarian dinosaur. What do I do? And just like, evolution is like, oh, you start growing spikes out of your back or fucking horns and shit. And it's just like, it's a reaction to the environment. Those motherfuckers, it took millions of years to like, react, to change

• 1:12:14Speaker 02

  and to evolve. And so sometimes when you're like, oh, yeah, the director was mean to me. This is all I mean. Like, yeah, well, it's fucking nothing comparative comparatively, right? So it's just, yeah, I think. Kind of meeting the challenge in some ways, like trying to get to a place of appreciating the resistance.

• 1:12:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:35Speaker 02

  And reacting to the resistance. I don't know what I'm saying about dinosaurs.

• 1:12:39Theo Von?

  No, because most of life is, but I think it's fascinating to think how badass a fucking vegan or vegetarian a fucking brontosaurus was.

• 1:12:45Speaker 02

  Brontosaurus is big. That that was the solution. It just got like bigger.

• 1:12:51Theo Von?

  Who was the biggest vegetarian dinosaur? Let's give them a little bit of shine here. You know, and I'm sure Josh Brolin will get to play them in a movie. But we won't.

• 1:13:02Speaker 02

  This is the the brontosaurus dip dip.

• 1:13:06Theo Von?

  Oh, the dreadnoughtus. Look at that limousine.

• 1:13:12Speaker 02

  Have not read about him.

• 1:13:15Theo Von?

  Um, how long, because you, how long have you been a vegan for? Vegetarian?

• 1:13:19Speaker 02

  Uh, vegan since I was three or four, three, three and a half years old.

• 1:13:24Theo Von?

  This has been a whole part of your life?

• 1:13:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:26Theo Von?

  Wow.

• 1:13:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:28Theo Von?

  Hmm. You know what I do like sometimes? Radishes.

• 1:13:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, I just, I just had some, you know, I just made it yesterday. I made radishes and jalapenos together. Fantastic. Lemon, salt.

• 1:13:41Theo Von?

  I like having some salt in water. I like fasting recently. I've been doing it a lot.

• 1:13:45Speaker 02

  Have you?

• 1:13:46Theo Von?

  And I really love it.

• 1:13:47Speaker 02

  Really? What, what did you do?

• 1:13:48Theo Von?

  Just nothing.

• 1:13:49Speaker 02

  Just water?

• 1:13:50Theo Von?

  Yeah, just water and a little bit of salt. Put some salt in your hand. But you even look forward to the salt. I would even go to the gym.

• 1:13:55Speaker 02

  Oh, wait, you went to the gym?

• 1:13:57Theo Von?

  I would go to the gym. I'd get home like, when I get home, I'm having my fucking pinch of salt.

• 1:14:01Speaker 02

  How long do you fast for?

• 1:14:02Theo Von?

  Seventy three hours is the longest that I did so far. But I'll just do an, a day. Like I did like thirty six hours the other day. I think, I feel like I'm doing like a day a week now, twenty four.

• 1:14:10Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's great. It's good for you. But are you sure you're, you should work out while you're doing it?

• 1:14:15Theo Von?

  No, I'm not sure.

• 1:14:16Speaker 02

  Uh, maybe look into that. I don't know. But, uh, I remember doing that. And then I didn't feel good. And maybe it's that.

• 1:14:25Theo Von?

  Oh, um, I want to ask you one more question before you leave, because I feel like we've had a nice conversation. So I don't want to push the bounds of it.

• 1:14:31Speaker 02

  Oh, push it. It's okay. You can do whatever you want. That's fine.

• 1:14:36Theo Von?

  Do you feel like, do you, did you like being a son?

• 1:14:39Speaker 02

  Is that a weird question? Cause I like being a son.

• 1:14:44Theo Von?

  Cause I never thought about it. I just thought about it like as we're sitting here thinking about that. We were both, you know, we had that in common.

• 1:14:49Speaker 02

  A lot of people. You have siblings?

• 1:14:50Theo Von?

  Yeah, I got three siblings, one boy and two girls.

• 1:14:52Speaker 02

  Oh, two girls, yeah. Well, I was the second son.

• 1:15:00Speaker 02

  And

• 1:15:03Speaker 02

  and my brother was like quite a force and was definitely like, I don't know, was like mythical or Shakespearean or, you know, maybe it's because he died or something, but he's like, you know, he was like the first son and he was, and he was, he was incredible and he was such a force within our family. He was kind of like the, the, the, um, the guiding light in some ways. He's the one that acted first and we used to sing on the streets and he played guitar and kind of like oversaw.

• 1:15:33Theo Von?

  He was like the lead singer?

• 1:15:34Speaker 02

  He was the lead singer and he was the guitarist and kind of oversaw everybody and he, and he was such a, like a, a strong but gentle force within the family. So I think in some ways, if I'm honest, a lot of my life, like growing up, I kind of was like, eh, you know, like.

• 1:15:55Theo Von?

  Right, what am I gonna do?

• 1:15:57Speaker 02

  Well, kind of like, you're like, and not, not a way of like, oh, this sucks. Just kind of like, cool.

• 1:16:02Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:03Speaker 02

  Like, cool, like feel secure.

• 1:16:05Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:05Speaker 02

  Shit's handled.

• 1:16:06Theo Von?

  That's taken care of.

• 1:16:07Speaker 02

  Yeah. Everybody's fucking handled.

• 1:16:09Theo Von?

  Three at last?

• 1:16:12Speaker 02

  And I have three sisters and and they're also like amazing and, and strong in the best way and like, you know, forces like each of them just brilliant. And, and I probably, yeah, for like,

• 1:16:31Speaker 02

  yeah, I don't know that I, um.

• 1:16:35Speaker 02

  You know, I just I didn't I never I never felt any weight or pressure about like being the son or anything like that, you know?

• 1:16:42Theo Von?

  Um, maybe it falls on the first child a lot. I never thought about that.

• 1:16:47Speaker 02

  I'm I'm sure, um, I don't know if it fell on him or if he just like took it. You know what I mean?

• 1:16:54Theo Von?

  Right.

• 1:16:54Speaker 02

  Sometimes, sometimes it's just like undeniable.

• 1:16:57Theo Von?

  You know what I mean? Like, um, uh, look, look at the two of us. I'm the son.

• 1:17:00Speaker 02

  Sometimes, you know what I mean?

• 1:17:04Theo Von?

  Working freelance over here. Okay.

• 1:17:06Speaker 02

  Like, it's it's kind of the truth, right? Um, and there was no like, I never, you know, we also, there was like a four year age difference between us. So I never, I never felt those things like, you know, in movies, it's like the brothers are like competing and like angry.

• 1:17:23Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:17:23Speaker 02

  Like Shakespeare.

• 1:17:24Theo Von?

  Step brothers.

• 1:17:25Speaker 02

  That was funny. You didn't intend that to be funny.

• 1:17:32Theo Von?

  Uh, yeah, I did not intend that to be funny.

• 1:17:33Speaker 02

  Really?

• 1:17:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:34Speaker 02

  It still was.

• 1:17:35Theo Von?

  Our brothers. Oh, thank you. Yeah, I'm trying to think of other brothers.

• 1:17:38Speaker 02

  Anyways, um, this is good.

• 1:17:40Theo Von?

  Jackson Five, maybe?

• 1:17:41Speaker 02

  This is a good, that's good.

• 1:17:43Theo Von?

  Um, but that's interesting. Yeah, I I don't know. I was just thinking about being a son. Cause I never really even thought about it myself that much. But yeah, if you have that brother, you kind of have that get out of jail free brother, you know? You're like, oh, this this guy's got that, dude. He's a fucking lead singer. I'll be back here, you know?

• 1:18:00Speaker 02

  Yeah. Are you or what?

• 1:18:01Theo Von?

  I'm the second bro. Yeah, I'm the second son. My brother was kind of like went AWOL. So I was like, oh, shit, I gotta fucking pick up. I gotta like, I gotta do some recycling here, you know?

• 1:18:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:18:11Theo Von?

  He's great now, but he he was just like, kind of like rogue, you know? He was like more of like a pro like troublemaker, just like lost. That's what I mean. He was like a lost.

• 1:18:20Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:18:20Theo Von?

  Like a lost guy. But now he's great. And now he's like my hero. He's like, you know, it's cool to like be able to still be like in like that everything changes over time.

• 1:18:29Speaker 02

  And what's the age difference?

• 1:18:31Theo Von?

  Two years. But yeah, he's like a brave. I what do I admire about him? He has a lot of empathy and he's good for like being patient with me. Um. Yeah, it's like, he has time for me, right? And that was something that I think growing up in our place, it was just like, I never, I didn't even know it was possible, you know? But yeah, he like, he makes time for me. He makes time for me.

• 1:18:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18:55Theo Von?

  And I think that that's pretty special.

• 1:18:57Speaker 02

  That's good.

• 1:18:59Theo Von?

  You know, one thing that you guys talked about in Eddington was like, whose land it is, right? That was like a little bit of a theme. It was kind of a sub-theme, I felt like, with the Native American and you guys were like, the county or the township butted up against native lands. Where do you feel like? It's kind of so weird where we are in the world right now because I feel like people are still warring over lands, you know? You think that's, and like there's ice raids, like people are getting taken off of lands and like, you know? I don't know. I just feel like sometimes I thought we'd be further along in this.

• 1:19:35Speaker 02

  I don't really know Westerns, but I think that that's like a common thing in Westerns. At least that's the, that's the feeling I have when I think about Westerns. It might not be, but just like the idea of like, this is my land and I'm the protector of this land and I will fight for this land. And so I, I think that is something that comes up in, in Eddington. And I think that both kind of, both figures, the Sheriff Joe Cross and the Mayor Ted, played by Pedro Pascal, both believe that they're like fighting for the land, fighting for this town and that their, that their idea for this land is, is the right one.

• 1:20:18Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:19Speaker 02

  I was really moved by something that, that you said when you, you talked about the war in Gaza. And I think that's really courageous to, to speak about it. And you spoke about it like in such a like honest way that I just thought was like really beautiful and, and it's crazy because.

• 1:20:47Speaker 02

  Like what's going on is absolutely so fucking horrible. There's no justification for fucking children starving, starving to death in a conflict. Like it's that simple, right? You don't have to understand geopolitics or anything like that, just to, to get that. I know there are conflicts all over the world constantly. Um, but that's something that is, uh, I'm just, it's, it's shocking like how, um, maybe we're afraid to, to talk about it. Um, and oftentimes you're made to feel like you're stupid because you don't understand geopolitics. You kind of go like, well, I don't have to understand geopolitics. Like you should have to understand like hu- human rights.

• 1:21:31Theo Von?

  Yeah, feeling it feels like to me, you know? Uh, for me, yeah, I, I don't know. I don't care about, I, I don't know if I care about geo. I mean, but it's hard to say I live on a land that's kind of been taken from other people. But here I am saying like about geopolitics and I understand that. But then at what point do you not say something, you know? Like, yeah, and we're in a time and it just like in Eddington, kind of like, and I'm not comparing like any of these two things, but people are watching things on their phones and you can see for the first time, some of this like travesty in real time. And it just fucking hurts, man. It's like, and then you're like, am I crazy for not saying anything? But then here we are on a land where, you know, people are living in allotments now, Native American allotments and that sort of, you know?

• 1:22:16Speaker 02

  Um, yeah, and that's, that's a great deal of pressure and, and just honestly, just you saying that makes me fucking feel like, you know, under pressure. So like, okay, yeah, what, you know, what am I, what am I talking about? But I think sometimes not acknowledging it is, is wrong. Um, obviously I don't have the fucking solution, but war always fucking sucks, right? That conflict sucks, but what's happening, it just is, is crazy to me, crazy to me, just like. Just the food distribution that's happening now.

• 1:22:50Theo Von?

  Oh, yeah. They're locking, they're like hiding it from people or that they're tricking people or that they're they have to go so far to get it.

• 1:22:56Speaker 02

  Right, but and why is it like, why is it not the the organizations that are typically overseeing that and have, you know, half a century of of experience or decades of experience in the different NGOs and they're not the ones that are overseeing the food distribution. It's a it's a new um organization, the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation. And and so that is um, yeah, just really troubling and and heartbreaking. So it just feels like, how do we not acknowledge that and, you know, in some way. And so and I think that you did. And I um, I just like, I don't know, like, when you did that, if you were like, if that made you nervous doing it or.

• 1:23:41Theo Von?

  Yeah, I think I felt scared.

• 1:23:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, I was, it was, I think that it was it was courageous and it was meaningful. And I and I think it matters. And and um, so, you know, I'm I'm straight up, I'm really here today because I was I was so moved by what by what you said and just like the courage to do that.

• 1:24:01Theo Von?

  Yeah, I was wondering why you came, to be honest. To be very honest, in some ways, or not not in some ways, but but thank you, man. I can't even believe that you saw that. And uh, yeah, not thank you, but like, yeah, I think that shit just like, I don't know. It's just like, it's crazy to think like I'm laying in bed at night and I'm warm and I'm okay. And to think that there's like, like, some kid who's never gonna put these pieces together, you know? And even the kids who have to be alive or the people who still have to be alive, what life do they have, you know? Like, what like, I don't know. It makes me like, I don't know. And then you start to feel ashamed of your own existence in some ways.

• 1:24:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:38Theo Von?

  I don't know.

• 1:24:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:40Theo Von?

  You almost feel ashamed to be alive in some ways, in a little bit of a way. Does it make any sense, do you think?

• 1:24:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, I understand the feeling.

• 1:24:49Theo Von?

  Yeah, it's a feeling.

• 1:24:50Speaker 02

  I totally understand that, that, that feeling, but um.

• 1:24:53Theo Von?

  But thank you, man. Thank you for uh. Well, yeah, not thank you, but yeah, I don't know. It's, it's interesting. You know? But I think it's important today that we, that you do say something like you say. You know, and not to think that this isn't affecting people. You know? I think. Yeah, that we're human beings. We absorb what's going on. You know? And we watch the actors that are out there in the world and it affects us. It affects children. What are kids doing or seeing those things on TikTok? What happens to their brains and stuff, you know?

• 1:25:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:26Theo Von?

  So. But no, I'm grateful to be able to be in a place today and in a country where we can still say something. You know, and it's not mandated by some other power. And who knows if that's coming soon or what's happening?

• 1:25:39Theo Von?

  So.

• 1:25:41Speaker 02

  Do you have some inside information?

• 1:25:43Theo Von?

  I have nothing.

• 1:25:44Speaker 02

  Okay, I thought you were looking at me like, like that you knew some shit. Like, no, okay. Oh, that's good.

• 1:25:56Theo Von?

  Is there a?

• 1:25:59Theo Von?

  You know, I was thinking the other day, I missed Philip Seymour Hoffman. I missed him. I miss his acting. Is there somebody that you miss?

• 1:26:06Speaker 02

  Um.

• 1:26:09Theo Von?

  Like their acting? Or like a Philip Seymour Hoffman? I'm trying to think. Michael Landon I miss.

• 1:26:15Speaker 02

  Who's Michael Landon?

• 1:26:16Theo Von?

  He did Little House on the Prairie.

• 1:26:17Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course, of course. And then, uh, and then, um. What was the heaven?

• 1:26:22Theo Von?

  Highway to Heaven.

• 1:26:23Speaker 02

  It was Highway to Heaven.

• 1:26:24Theo Von?

  With Victor French.

• 1:26:25Speaker 02

  Right. Because I think that was one that I tried out for several times.

• 1:26:29Theo Von?

  You're lying.

• 1:26:30Speaker 02

  No, I'm sure. I'm sure.

• 1:26:32Theo Von?

  God.

• 1:26:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely in my memory, but that was one of the shows when I was a kid. That was, that was popular.

• 1:26:40Theo Von?

  Yeah, dude.

• 1:26:41Speaker 02

  Well, he, yeah.

• 1:26:43Theo Von?

  He was something special.

• 1:26:46Theo Von?

  He was a really special.

• 1:26:47Speaker 02

  Wow, so he was the, what's happening, oh.

• 1:26:52Theo Von?

  In between.

• 1:26:53Speaker 02

  What's this thing here that says nineteen eighty-four and then R I P. What is that?

• 1:26:56Theo Von?

  Well, apparently he took the highway to heaven. He was in the H O V lane in that picture. You know, that's all we can do. Um. Anyway.

• 1:27:04Speaker 02

  Hey, hey, listen, you're going, you're going back out on the road, right?

• 1:27:08Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:08Speaker 02

  Is, is it fun or is it grueling?

• 1:27:12Theo Von?

  Um, it, it was fun. Like, I think, like, I'm ready to stop doing this hour material. It's changed a lot. It's like probably sixty percent different than when I started. So it's evolved a lot and adjusted, but I am, I am, uh, I'll be happy to get it done. When I feel like we've gone to all the places that we can and like kind of, you know, you want everybody to have a chance to see it if they want. Um, but I'll be happy to have a chance for my brain to settle down and not always have to feel like I have to go do this thing every other week or every couple of weeks. Which is a blessing, but still it's like just this thing on the calendar. It's almost like you're always having to take a vacation. And so I'll be happy when then that, when that's done. So I can see what else do I want to think about and do like, you know, uh.

• 1:27:55Theo Von?

  We like, I work with this group called Valor that does like sex and love addiction, intimacy disorder, stuff like that. So I want to like, just have, just have a little bit more time to do stuff that's not just focused on myself, maybe, I guess. I don't know. So.

• 1:28:10Speaker 02

  It's, it sounds, um.

• 1:28:14Speaker 02

  I, I imagine it would be nerve wracking. I can't imagine having to do that.

• 1:28:19Theo Von?

  Really?

• 1:28:19Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, like getting up, like getting up, yeah, like standing, it's like just standing. Makes, that makes me fucking nervous. And then, but then you walk around, you have a microphone and you say shit and.

• 1:28:35Theo Von?

  You could do it, man. Dude, I'll tell you, and I, this is, I think, is the only way to end this is just these, these boots were made for Joaquin. So I think we have to.

• 1:28:46Speaker 02

  Perfect.

• 1:28:46Theo Von?

  Um, dude, thank you so much. And thank you for spending time with me today. Thank you for thinking with me today. And, um, and I just appreciate it. It's nice of you. And, uh, yeah, you just do a great job of like being able to like, you know, create things that the rest of us can't to make us feel. And so that's a gift that you have and, and. I feel lucky that you have it. And so, thank you for just bearing that gift.

• 1:29:09Speaker 02

  Oh, man. Thank you. That's, um, well, thank you. Thank you. It's just too, I know, I just get embarrassed. I just wanna go, I wanna dissect everything you're saying that's nice about me and tell you why you're wrong.

• 1:29:27Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:27Speaker 02

  But I won't do that. And look, let's just thank Motel Chelsea here.

• 1:29:32Theo Von?

  Thanks for having us.

• 1:29:33Speaker 02

  Epic.

• 1:29:34Theo Von?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:34Speaker 02

  Sweet here.

• 1:29:35Theo Von?

  And cheers to our dads, man. They're out there. Cheers to those guys, dude.

• 1:29:39Speaker 02

  We don't, my dad, we don't know where he is still. So that's, we're not sure. He's somewhere.

• 1:29:46Theo Von?

  TBD, guys.

• 1:29:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, you know, good luck. I hope you find your way.