CC Sabathia's storied path to baseball Hall of Fame as the pitching ace opens up on fame, family, marriage, sobriety, lessons from Derek Jeter, Jay Z, being a Black icon in MLB to his pinstripe legacy in NY as a World Series Champion

“I was in control of this whole thing, that was the most appealing part of being in NY- just pitching in the Bronx, having that energy and knowing it starts and stops with you is incredible.” CC Sabathia On this episode of The Pivot Podcast, hosts Ryan Clark, Fred Taylor, and Channing Crowder welcome pitcher CC Sabathia, as the guys dig into his storied career, personal journey, and the transition from elite athlete to mentor and icon. The conversation leads off recognizing Sabathia as a first-ballot Hall of Famer with a World Series Title capped by impressive career stats—250+ wins, 3,000+ strikeouts, a 3.74 ERA across 19 MLB seasons—as he talks about the baseball memories and personal journey from Cleveland to Milwaukee to New York and now in Cooperstown with baseball royalty. With his path rooted in family, starting with his father and mother's support from a young age to meeting his forever partner, Amber, as a teenager to growing his family and career together- it's not lost on CC that walking across the Hall of Fame stage is because of those close to him who's held him down through the highs and lows of life. With fame and success, comes a story of personal struggle and inner demons CC managed his entire baseball career. From a high school player to late in his career, the 6x All-Star and 2007 Cy Young winner talks about his addiction to alcohol, not seeing it as a problem and opens up on what finally made him enter rehab in October of 2015, stepping away from the game at a time his Yankees were making a final playoff push. He reveals his fears and struggles during that emotional time and shares how he was able to return to baseball better and stronger while remaining sober for the past decade. Ryan, Channing and Fred highlight Sabathia’s famous workhorse identity: a fierce competitor who often took short rest to support his teams. CC explains why teammate loyalty and responsibility always outweighed self-preservation but being available to play was always a priority. He talks about playing along side his Captain, Derek Jeter, and reveals aspects of Jeter that many don't talk about, calling him his best teammate he ever had. The life of the Big Apple and the spotlight that came with it from celebrity circles to high pressure to pure bliss.... He shares how he has no regrets and that there was no better feeling than pitching in the Bronx in front of thousands, knowing that he was in control with it all starting and stopping with him. CC reflects on what it means to be one of only three Black pitchers in history to reach both 250 wins and 3,000 strikeouts, joining legends like Bob Gibson and Fergie Jenkins. He goes on to share how baseball has always been a sport for black athletes but not always black culture, which is something he is dedicated to increasing with his new role working with the MLB player alliance. He speaks on redirecting his leadership—once reserved for the mound—to his kids, sharing insights into fatherhood, sobriety, and purpose beyond baseball. This conversation is beyond baseball, it humanizes a legend through transparency and raw honesty. Comment below and share what you took away from this episode, for us, it unpacked a lot. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 0:29Ryan Clark?

  C.C. Sebastian would be immortalized with his Hall of Fame brethren in Cooperstown, New York this weekend. But his road wasn't paved with gold. When Jack O'Connell called C.C. to tell him he was a Hall of Famer, his first thought was about his pops, his first coach, his first mentor, and inspiration. But also, his mother, and the village of women that helped turn the left-hander into a superstar. He started drinking around the age of 14, and I'm not saying just one drink, I'm saying that first drink, always turning into a bender. And then finally, in 2015, he checked himself into rehab and hasn't taken a drink since. His wife, Amber, has been a huge part of his journey. She was there when Cleveland drafted him out of high school, a short stint in Milwaukee, and when he became a World Series champion with the great New York Yankees.

• 1:13Ryan Clark?

  We learned about controlling the mound, and controlling his drinking. Hall of Fame teammates, childhood baseball inspirations. I'm telling y'all, this man loves the game. But don't think that means he could be bought by the league. On Sunday, the man-born Carsten Charles Sebastian will walk across the stage. First, to represent his parents, but you better believe, he'll have Vallejo, California, on his back. Get ready to step into the batter's box with Hall of Fame pitcher, C.C. Sebastian.

• 1:43Channing Crowder?

  What up, my boy?

• 1:44Speaker 03

  What's good?

• 1:45Channing Crowder?

  My man.

• 1:46Speaker 03

  Big dog.

• 1:47Ryan Clark?

  What's up, baby? How you doing? Congratulations.

• 1:50Channing Crowder?

  What's up, bro? Yeah, sir. Bro, I'm still laughing, old boy saying you was looking like a black and mom.

• 1:55Speaker 03

  He did, though. He said, "Lose C, they had no calf muscles." For the longest time, though, I mean, I'm from the West Coast, so I didn't think I was gonna wanna live here, but I love it.

• 2:07Channing Crowder?

  Really? But Jersey different.

• 2:09Speaker 03

  Jersey, out here is different.

• 2:10Channing Crowder?

  Jersey, yeah, like, there's more country.

• 2:12Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yeah, you got, like, I got deer in Turkey in my backyard and shit, and like...

• 2:17Channing Crowder?

  Let me come out there with my...

• 2:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, you come out there with a bow, yeah, them motherfuckers back there.

• 2:22Ryan Clark?

  Light some ass up.

• 2:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:24Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Bro, why you always trying to kill something? That what I do, that what country niggas do, man.

• 2:29Speaker 03

  That's what Chuck, Chuck be back there, he be like, "Let me come in your backyard with a bomb." I'm like, "Nah, I can't."

• 2:34Ryan Clark?

  I wanna tie something up, yeah.

• 2:36Channing Crowder?

  It's calling, culling the stock. Culling the stock? You gotta cull them, because there's so many, you gotta, you gotta, you gotta knock down a couple of them and then...

• 2:45Speaker 03

  That's where the deer are right now, so many like deer, just, they just run around like random.

• 2:49Channing Crowder?

  So the dummies, it's a natural selection. So the dummies that can just sit in the field and look around, you shoot their ass, and the smarter, bigger ones... Continue to grow. And will mate, and then they gonna make smart, big ones, and then, because you gotta knock off the dummies.

• 3:02Ryan Clark?

  Like, like sports.

• 3:03Speaker 03

  Makes sense.

• 3:04Channing Crowder?

  So like, if it was like a, so if it was like a people thing, you wouldn't be here no more?

• 3:08Ryan Clark?

  Who, me?

• 3:08Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, you'd be out of here if it was a people thing.

• 3:10Ryan Clark?

  Man, I, I'm gonna be the man.

• 3:14Ryan Clark?

  I'd be skee and everything.

• 3:16Channing Crowder?

  Oh, here you go. C.C. Sebastian, welcome to the show.

• 3:41Ryan Clark?

  Hey, man, welcome to the Pivot, C.C., man. Congratulations on the Hall of Fame. This is Fred Taylor. This is Channing Crowder. I'm Ryan Clark. Pivot fam, thank you for pivoting with us. Man, first of all, congratulations. Just an illustrious career, man. Nineteen seasons, Cy Young winner, World Series champion, six-time All-Stars, shoot 3,000 strikeouts, 250 games won, just so many milestones that you were able to accomplish throughout your career, which obviously lands you in Cooperstown. Bro, being a kid from Vallejo, California, man, when Jack O'Connell from the Baseball Writers Association calls you and tells you, "You be headed to Cooperstown," what was your first thought?

• 4:22Speaker 03

  My real first thought was my dad be super happy. My dad was the one who started me playing baseball. Uh, he was a coach before I was born. So, he was determined to make me an athlete. You know what I'm saying?

• 4:36Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 4:36Speaker 03

  And I just feel like I, I lived up to what I was supposed to for him. I felt like that when I first made it to the big leagues. And then I felt like that when I played for the Yankees. And then I got that feeling again, you know, when I got the call to the Hall of Fame. And it was just a real feeling, you know? Like you said, being from Vallejo and the odds of me making it to Cooperstown from there are slim to none. And I think Pedro said it best first. He said, "If a kid like me can make it, or a kid like him can make it from the DR, from, from Vallejo, then anybody literally can make it to the Hall of Fame." And, um, that's how I feel.

• 5:08Channing Crowder?

  Well, anybody can make it to the Hall of Fame.

• 5:13Channing Crowder?

  I ain't even, we be pointing in this next question, but no, no, no. It's something special. It was something, it's something about you, bro. We all watched you, like, you know what I'm saying? There was something that you did different. There was something that your dad did different. There was something that made you be on the show. Like, to go to the Hall of Fame. What was like, what was that when you look back now in retrospect? Little C.C. And what building up, you know, and, and being the guy that you are now, a Hall of Famer?

• 5:42Speaker 03

  I think just being able to, to go through adversity. I think just being able to keep going forward. You know, no matter what was happening off the field, in my life, as a kid, whatever. When I got onto the baseball field, or the football field, or basketball, like, that was where I knew what, you know, I could predict the outcome most of the time. Especially if I'm on the mound. From the time that I was like nine years old, I figured I was like, "Oh, this all starts and stop on me." Like, I'm in control of everything. And like, me being the only child and wanting everybody's attention, like, that's a perfect, perfect spot for me to be in the middle of the diamond, you know what I'm saying? So, once I figured that out, I just kind of like... Just gravitated towards that and I've loved being in those big moments.

• 6:23Speaker 03

  Whether I failed or succeeded, I just wanted to be out there and that was the way I could perform. You know, if you ever hear like comedians performing in front of their family or rappers performing in front of their family in the living room, that was like my performance. Like all my family was there, all my parents were there, all that stuff. And that was the way I felt like I could perform as a kid.

• 6:44Fred Taylor?

  Right. First off, happy belated birthday.

• 6:46Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 6:46Fred Taylor?

  Perfect birthday gift, right? But no, I heard you delayed knee surgery.

• 6:52Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 6:52Fred Taylor?

  So you can walk across the stage, right? What does that walk represent for you and who are you doing it for?

• 6:58Speaker 03

  I think the walk represents, for me, I feel like Vallejo. Like my hometown is so rich in like talent and sports history. And like when I was a kid, I only wanted to be just the best from my hometown. Like I went to the high school games as a kid and I was the ball boy for the football team. And all these different things, like I wanted to be that guy. And to be able to walk across the stage and say I'm from Vallejo, it just, you know, feel like I represent the city and all the talent that comes from that city. And I delayed the knee surgery more for golf than...

• 7:34Ryan Clark?

  He said, "I'm gonna get the knee surgery when it get cold."

• 7:36Speaker 03

  I was like, "Man, who the fuck get knee surgery in the summertime? That shit don't make no sense."

• 7:39Channing Crowder?

  That what old rich guys do. They play golf a lot.

• 7:42Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, we don't do that. You know, you mentioned your father right away. And I thought that was extremely telling just based on what he did to get you here in your career. But also, he passed when you were relatively young, you know, being 23 years old. And I read somewhere, you said, "You don't feel like you processed it right away." Do you feel like moving forward now you've processed that to a place where now, in sharing this moment with him or thinking about him in this moment, you can think about the good things?

• 8:13Speaker 03

  Yeah, for sure. I mean, you said it perfectly. I never processed him passing away at 23 years old. My son, my oldest son's 21 now. He was just born at the time. And it was just so much going on. Like, I was still trying to establish myself as a big leaguer. I was super young. I still needed his guidance. And then I was becoming a father. So I was angry for a long time and just didn't understand what I was going through. And I think that's what led to all the drinking. I mean, I think I had a drinking problem from the start, but I think that's what pushed me over the edge. And I don't think I ever processed it until I actually went to rehab and had a chance to, like, sit down, let my brain shut off, and like, really, honestly, try to figure out why I'm drinking so much.

• 8:57Speaker 03

  And being able to go through that process, go through the grieving process, really, at 35, 12 years later, and then understand what he meant to me, what he means to me. And there's not a day that goes by that I don't think about my dad. But now, like you said, I can think about him in a good way, you know?

• 9:13Ryan Clark?

  One of the greatest pictures of his era, when he finally realizes he needs help. What's the process of truly coming forward and seeking that help and spending that month in rehab?

• 9:28Speaker 03

  It was something that was kind of like boiling over for like two years, three years. I was, I knew I had a drinking problem. I knew I was destroying my family. I just didn't care because I was more selfish and still worried about how I'm gonna sleep at night or how I'm gonna get to the next day. And I think in 2015, I was just literally tired. I was fed up. Like, I couldn't stop. And that was the first time where I really realized, like, oh, this is a problem. I can't stop if I wanted to. And, you know, I spent that weekend in Baltimore. We had a rain out, and I spent the weekend in Baltimore drinking nonstop. And I went into the office and talked to Joe Girardi. And Chad Bowling was our mental conditioning coach at the time.

• 10:14Speaker 03

  And we called Brian Cashman and they were on board. But the two people that I always give credit to the most is Dillon Batances and Chris Young. I'm always, I'm forever in debt to them because they knew my struggle and what was going on as a teammate. And I went to them first and told them what was happening and they both right away was like, "You're making the right decision. You're doing the right thing for your family. Don't worry about us. You need to get right." And it was the best decision I could have ever made. And I'm so thankful for everybody that was there in that moment. I'm thankful for my family, my wife, obviously. But the Yankee organization for being able to support me and, you know, my teammates being able to have my back. It was a good moment for me.

• 10:55Channing Crowder?

  Bro, it's something I asked recently to Kirk Franklin because he said he had a porn addiction. And I was like, a porn addiction? Like, I like looking at naked people too. I like looking at, like, I enjoy porn. Like, what? Like, an addiction? So for you, but for you to say, "I'm an alcoholic, but I just can't enjoy a couple of drinks." Like, what's the difference between, I can go out, I had me a couple glasses of wine with the wife, and that now I'm an alcoholic?

• 11:22Speaker 03

  No, for me, I was never going out to just have a couple of glasses of wine. Like, every time I was going, I was going to get fucked up. Every single time. From the time that I started drinking though, like at 14, the first time I had a drink. I mean, that, like, by the time I was 14 though, I had already been like, you know, my grandfather passed away and, you know, all these different, my parents had split up. I'm going through all these different things. And I had a drink and the very first night I got fucked up and I was like, "Oh, yeah, this is, this is where I'm at." You know what I'm saying? This is it. And it was from that time until I was 35, so basically 21 years, I never had a drink just with the intentions of it being a good time or I'm just going to sip this. Like, it was always, I'm having seven to nine drinks, Long Island, whatever it was.

• 12:07Speaker 03

  It was never just, you know, for a good time. It was always to get fucked up. Always.

• 12:11Channing Crowder?

  How did you recognize that? Because I drink.

• 12:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 12:14Channing Crowder?

  He stopped drinking.

• 12:16Speaker 03

  I didn't know.

• 12:17Channing Crowder?

  We'll have a couple of drinks. We'll hang out. We're going to get on the flight. We'll grab us a cocktail.

• 12:22Speaker 03

  See, like, if we were all together, and we were in the airport back when I was drinking, and y'all, we would go to the bar, have a couple of drinks, like, you would have to carry me off the plane. There was no stopping me from getting up at the bar, or I could have missed the flight. You know what I'm saying? Like, it was always too far. Like, everybody else could go right here, my, I could, I could never stop. It was always going too far. And it took me forever to recognize that. And yeah, I mean, that's why, that's why it took me to thirty-five to be able to go to rehab and say, yo, I, like, I need help and maybe this is something that I can't do. And I think I was drinking, you know, social anxiety, different things. You think you need to show up and be, you know, the light in the room and all these different things. And once I stopped drinking,

• 13:08Speaker 03

  one, I had way more fun, and two, I have more fun socially. I have, I don't have any anxiety going out socially because of myself. You know what I'm saying? And I know I'm not gonna ruin a night or say something fucked up and, you know, be trying to call and y'all, man, what happened last night? You know what I'm saying?

• 13:24Fred Taylor?

  Nah, real talk.

• 13:24Speaker 03

  I was one of those guys. So.

• 13:26Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, I, I don't wanna pound a way at it too much, but, uh, you know, you mentioned being in Baltimore for it, and you go to Joe Girardi. But you guys have a wild card game the next day, right? And you're in the midst of your career. The team is depending on you as a leader. How difficult was it to actually say, you know what, I'm gonna go to rehab now and I'm not gonna hold out?

• 13:47Speaker 03

  You know what was crazy? It, it, it wasn't, but every moment up until that moment, I had made every decision for baseball. And in that moment, that was the first time I made a decision for my family and myself.

• 14:00Fred Taylor?

  Got it.

• 14:00Speaker 03

  During my career. Every other decision I ever made was for baseball to get better, to do everything on the field. And at that moment was the first time I ever made the decision for my family, for myself, to, to be a better person. I didn't even hesitate. And like I said, the way my teammates and everybody reacted uh, made me feel like I made the right decision. They could have been like, nah, let's just wait. Let's wait, you know what I'm saying?

• 14:27Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, let's wait.

• 14:28Speaker 03

  Let's wait until October. Nah, you know, wait, after the playoffs, then that would have made me feel like I'm hiding it. The biggest thing that, that, that helped me and that helps me stay sober is that everybody knows. So if I go to a bar in the Airbnb-

• 14:41Ryan Clark?

  And judged immediately.

• 14:42Speaker 03

  Yeah, some guys like gonna take a picture and be like, oh, I thought you were sober.

• 14:45Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 14:45Speaker 03

  Oh, you do all this work, you know what I'm saying? So the best thing that happened to me is that I didn't have to hide it and it was public right away. And now everybody knows and and now I'm naked. You know what I'm saying? Like I'm out here and this is me and I'm vulnerable and that's that's exactly what I needed.

• 14:59Fred Taylor?

  Did that support from the team and organization push that competitiveness within you to to not fail through your rehab journey?

• 15:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, you know, I felt like I didn't want to let people down. But then there were some people that were like, he's not gonna stay. You know what I mean? Like, he'll be there for two weeks. We need to prepare for what's gonna happen when he comes out of there or if he can't make it. And yeah, I mean, that kind of like, fuck you. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm here to make to get like to make myself better. Like, I am gonna see this through. And, you know, nine years later, I mean, it it does feel good. I mean, I'm glad you asked that.

• 15:34Fred Taylor?

  And the last thing on it, is there anything you can share for anybody out there that might be struggling?

• 15:40Speaker 03

  I think just to recognize it and not to run from it. Like, if you think you have a problem, then you have a problem. And for me, it wasn't like I wanted to wait until something happened. I didn't want to wait until I lost my family or a DUI or something is hit the news. Like, everybody rock bottom is different, right? And my rock bottom was me sitting in the room in Baltimore realizing I can't stop drinking this white Hennessy.

• 16:06Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 16:06Speaker 03

  And some people come to that realization, you know, at different times. But if you recognize that, then there's help out there for you. And a lot of people struggle with this. It's a disease. And I always tell people that's like, that month of rehab, I feel like as grown men, we should all we should all get like a month off to go or a week or two weeks to go work on yourself. You know what I'm saying? And like, reset, a vacation, do whatever. Like, we all under so much pressure. Y'all work so much, like, you know what I'm saying? Do you ever get a chance to like check in mentally, do different things? So that month was the like, everybody knew where I was at. I didn't have to have my phone and I was working on myself. It was the best month that I that I could have spent on myself.

• 16:46Ryan Clark?

  And that's beautiful. You mentioned that every decision you made was a baseball decision. This was the first. One for self, when you become a husband and a father, self includes your family. And I know that had to be a big piece of it, too. You just said, I didn't want to get to the point to where I lost my family. How much did they weigh into the decision as well? And how have you seen your self change as a father and a husband and your family as a whole since becoming sober?

• 17:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, I think it was a big, a huge decision. And I don't think I thought about that at the time. I think as I got into rehab and started, you know, doing the work and thinking about myself as a father and the age that my dad, he was 47 when he passed away. And just thinking about how much I still needed him, right? I was 23 and like I had the same age gap for my oldest son. And I'm like, I need to make sure that I'm here, I'm healthy, like my mind is sound to be able to help my son in the struggles that I had through my teens and twenties and all these different things when my pops passed away. So it made a huge impact on me, like making that decision for not only myself,

• 17:57Speaker 03

  but the way, you know, I can be a father, I could be a husband. I can parent my kids now without being so angry or having the patience now to understand what they're going through. At that time, Lil C was 12 when I went in, Carter would have been five. So none of them knew I was in alcohol rehab, rehab except for Carson. They all just thought I was going to rehab for my knee. Because that was something that, you know, they're used to. So he was the only one that kind of had to really live and go through it. But I do think it made me a better father and gave me a better perspective of what I need to be as a man for my kids going forward and what I missed in my dad, you know?

• 18:38Channing Crowder?

  We all look back as grown men, now we see 22-year-old C.C. And you can see it, brother, the fame of being the ace. How did that change you? Because I know you because I know like now with these young pitchers like I want to watch, I want to watch the ace go out there and do it. Bro, you was the ace.

• 18:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 18:58Channing Crowder?

  Like you gonna go out there and boom, boom, boom they ass.

• 19:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 19:02Channing Crowder?

  And everybody wants to see it. Like you just said it, sitting on that mound, the attention that you wanted, now you have. How did that change you to be the center of baseball? Bro, you were the center, I won't kiss nobody ass, bro. You were the center, you were the center of baseball for years.

• 19:18Speaker 03

  I guess it was hard to get used to because I was so young and, but I thought that's what I wanted. Like I thought that's where I was supposed to be. I thought, you know, once I got to be the ace that it was gonna be automatic, that I was gonna, you know, have these games where I go out and pitch well every single time. My, you know, life off the field was gonna be great and I had to grow through all of that stuff. You know what I mean? I feel like, I really feel like I always tell people I was born and raised in California, but I kind of grew up in Cleveland. I was there from the time I was 17 to I was 27. So, you know, I had three of my, four of my kids were there. I got married there. Um, I had some, I got robbed, I had some tough times. I got robbed there. My, my, my father passed away when we lived there. So I really did some, you know, living and, and do, do some trials and tribulations.

• 20:03Speaker 03

  Uh, I figured out how to become that ace and that pitcher in my later twenties. So, yeah, it was, it was something I had to grow into is what I'm trying to say. I didn't have playoff success right away. You know, I, I wanted to go into the playoffs and be that Pedro or that Randy, or Randy Johnson, Roger Clemens and go out and throw shutouts and that didn't happen. You know, I went out 2007, won the Cy Young during the regular season and kind of shit the bed in the playoffs. And if I, if I don't.

• 20:30Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 20:30Speaker 03

  We win the World Series. We're the best team. It was kind of all on me. It was, you know, sitting, you know, it was in my court. And then the next year I get traded to Milwaukee and I get to pitch down the stretch and I, and I learned from, in 07. And then the next year I come here and I'm down the stretch and we win the World Series. So I had to kind of grow into what I became.

• 20:48Ryan Clark?

  In Milwaukee, when you were pitching on three days' notice often.

• 20:53Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:53Ryan Clark?

  And, you know, Chan mentioned being the ace, you're about to go into free agency, which we know you ended up getting a landmark. Contract, what was it in you that you did learn in Cleveland? Or you learned in the playoffs when you didn't pitch as well that said, no, like if y'all need me to be on the mound, it doesn't matter if I don't have the right amount of time. I'm not looking to see what's gonna happen next year. Put the ball in my hand and I can lead you there. What was it about being in Milwaukee for that short stint? That made you so sure that's the way you needed to pitch?

• 21:26Speaker 03

  No, I think you said it right. And the question is, what I learned in Cleveland? And it was learning to be a good teammate and learning to be there. If I'm available and if I'm able to pitch, I want the ball. When I got traded, you know, I had never played in any other organization. I was scared to death. I cried, I didn't want to go. And Amber was, she was pregnant at the time. She was like, man, fuck that. Them people want you there. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, you gotta go somewhere where they want you. We had this conversation too every time in my career. But she was like, you gotta go where them people want you. Like, they called and was like, after I got traded on the Sunday, they were like, hey, you can take a couple of days and, you know, wait till you come. And she was like, no, you need to go. So I left on that, on that next day, pitched on Tuesday, then pitched on Sunday.

• 22:08Speaker 03

  And I felt like, soon as I walked into that clubhouse, I had been there for 15 years. It was Prince Fielder was in there, Ricky Weeks, Mike Cameron. I mean, it was so many different guys, Billy Hall. And I was like, oh, this is, this is great. I feel at home. And honestly, I didn't want the season to end. I was healthy, I was available, and everybody was freaking out because it was like, oh, you going to free agency? Why are you pitching so much? That was the only time in my career where I really felt like I knew that I was gonna win those games. So I'm like, I'm making myself more money. Like, I need the ball more times so I can show these motherfuckers, like, I can pitch in these big games. You know what I'm saying? So like, in my mind, I'm like, no, I'm not hurting my chances. I'm making more money. So that's, that's, that's all that was.

• 22:53Ryan Clark?

  I know, his agent was like, no!

• 22:55Speaker 03

  Oh, my agent was going crazy. He was pissed, he would just come to the games. Yeah, he was like, no. And like, and I would just, I would, I would go in there and tell them, like, yo, I'm pitching in three days. Like, it wasn't the Brewers, it wasn't anybody other than me telling them, like, this is my schedule. This is what I'm doing. And, you know, they were freaking out. Everybody was kinda on edge, but I was like, nah, this is, like, you, you, you know, like, when you in the zone, you like, I mean, this is the only time that I know that I'm gonna go out and win these games? Like, I'm taking the ball.

• 23:26Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, that competitive instinct just takes over. Question, your first catcher, still your favorite?

• 23:31Speaker 03

  Yeah, and my first catcher was Victor Martinez.

• 23:34Fred Taylor?

  No, I thought your mother was your first.

• 23:36Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 23:39Fred Taylor?

  Obviously, she's still gotta be your parent.

• 23:40Speaker 03

  Nah, that's a great one, yeah.

• 23:42Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, no, I just.

• 23:42Speaker 03

  That's a great one.

• 23:43Fred Taylor?

  Just, I wanna talk about her resilience and sacrifice, man, to be able to help, you know, in your journey to get you going.

• 23:49Speaker 03

  You know what's crazy about that, Fred, is like, my speech is basically about her and all the women in the village of women that raised me from my hometown. Like, the first question that you ask, right away, I always go to my dad, right? Like, that's the first person I think about when I think about my success or think about me being an athlete, but the way my mom raised me and the way, the advice that she gave me, the savviness that she had to be able to navigate the shit that we were going through off the field, you know, my, you know, my parents split up, my mom was trying to figure out a way, you know, for, for me to continue playing, for a place for us to live, we moved in with her sister, and then my grandfather passed away, and then we ended up moving in

• 24:34Speaker 03

  with my, my grandmother, and she was working nights and just trying to figure out, you know, any kind of way for me to, to be able to, to play sports, and, you know, she was my agent. When, when I got drafted, we went through the whole agent process and met with every agent from, you know, Scott Boris to whoever else, and she was like, I don't trust anybody. I, I'm gonna do this deal. So when I got drafted, like, she was the one that called the, called the Indians at the time and, you know, got me my signing bonus. You know, my senior year of high school, everybody wanted me to quit playing football, nobody wanted me to play basketball, cuz everybody wanted me to focus on the draft. You got a chance to get drafted in the first round, and my mom was like, you've been playing with these boys your whole life, these are your best friends, and if you're really gonna

• 25:18Speaker 03

  be this baseball player that everybody thinks you're gonna be, and you think you're gonna be, this is gonna be your last time playing organized football, your last time playing basketball with your boys, go out and have fun. And I'm so grateful that she was able to, like, have perspective and give me that advice, because, you know, growing up in the, in the situations that we grew up. You know, I, you know, I had a lot of friends that were probably better athletes than me, but I don't think had the infrastructure or the love from the, and the support from the house that I was getting. So, I'm always grateful for my mom and I always tell her, you know, I'll pick my mom in, in any lifetime, at any time.

• 25:54Fred Taylor?

  Man, that's awesome.

• 25:55Speaker 03

  You know, that, that's how, you know, how much she's meant to me and as a person and, and, you know, in my career.

• 26:01Fred Taylor?

  You were a multi-sport star. You just mentioned football. You had a scholarship to Cal.

• 26:05Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 26:06Fred Taylor?

  Bo Jackson, another multi-sport, sports star. What's the, what's the story behind the tat?

• 26:12Speaker 03

  I mean, growing up in the eighties and nineties, like, he was the guy, right? But more so for me, just like my inspiration. Like, I strive to be a great athlete. Like, like Bo Jackson was all over every wall, every poster, everything that I ever had. And I just, I wanted to be Bo Jackson.

• 26:31Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 26:31Speaker 03

  Like, I really, every day, left my house, going out in the summertime, you know what I'm saying? And that's who I was. So, everybody that's on this leg is an inspiration to me and I, I don't think that I would be here without him, for sure. This is my cousin who passed away in 2012, but probably the best athlete in my family. Not probably, for sure the best athlete in my family and who I originally wanted to be. So, everybody that I have tatted on this leg is somebody that's a, a huge inspiration to me and, and Bo was, uh, you know, probably number one.

• 27:03Fred Taylor?

  Man, look, I mean, you gotta be tall, though. My leg little and I'm five eleven.

• 27:08Speaker 03

  Nah.

• 27:08Fred Taylor?

  Hey, hey, you gotta go Bo leg.

• 27:12Fred Taylor?

  You gonna get them little baby tattoos.

• 27:16Speaker 03

  You gotta get that shit.

• 27:19Channing Crowder?

  He gonna have some yearbook pictures.

• 27:20Fred Taylor?

  They gonna see their face. Baby pictures, you know what I mean?

• 27:23Speaker 03

  He's got some yearbook pictures.

• 27:27Fred Taylor?

  Hey, see, man.

• 27:30Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 27:59Ryan Clark?

  And listening to you talk about your mother, and you mentioned the strong village of women that raised you and sacrificed, you know, for you. I've met you a ton of times. I've seen you a ton of times. And trying to get you on the show, we not texting you.

• 28:12Speaker 03

  No.

• 28:13Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? We're not putting you in charge of that. You know, your wife Amber, she's an agent, but also she's a massive support system. I don't know how many times you've mentioned her in just decision-making as it pertained to your career and your life. What has it meant to you to have a life partner as strong and supportive and loving as she's been?

• 28:33Speaker 03

  Man, I think it's, uh, it's the reason why I'm sitting here, I think. I think it's not, I think, I know. It's the reason why I was able to have a Hall of Fame career. Being able to have that type of support from somebody from, you know, a young age. You know, we met at 15 and 16 years old. I think she's seen right away kind of what I could be on both sides. So she was always keeping it real. From the time that we were young, you know, with the drinking and some of the bad decisions and all these different things, she was right there. And on the other side, you know, the time I got drafted, every contract that I signed, she was right in the middle of all those negotiations. So when it came time for, you know, us to move here, make the decision to, to come to New, to come to New York,

• 29:18Speaker 03

  this is again, us having this conversation about you going somewhere where people want you. At the same time, when I got traded, I was nervous to go to Milwaukee. When I came to New York, I had in my mind that I was going to play on the West Coast. I grew up in California, grew up in, in the Bay Area. I'm like, I want to play for the Dodgers. I want to play for San Diego, Anaheim. And the very first day of free agency, the New York Yankees offered me a contract. I'm like, fuck. You know what I'm saying? Like, this is the furthest place away from home. You got all this drama and shit out here. I ain't got nowhere to live. I gotta be in Central Park of the city and people rude and shit. I'm like, this is the worst decision we could ever make. And we go through the whole process and, you know, we're trying to figure out what we gonna do. Lil C was five.

• 30:02Speaker 03

  We had a three-year-old and we had a newborn. And she was like, wherever we go, we need to be our home. We need to plant roots. We need to raise our kids. And I don't give a if it's on the moon. As long as our family is together, we can play anywhere. And when she said that, I was like, alright. That make, you know what I'm saying? Like, that makes sense. Like, and again, she was like, the Yankees want you. You need to go somewhere where you want it. And it made that decision so much easier to be able to come here. And 16, 17 years later, best decision I ever made. But I have to give her a lot of credit in, you know, being there every step of the way and kinda, you know, getting my head out of the weeds and not wanting to come to New York. And, but having that support system is incredible.

• 30:47Speaker 03

  And I think my career ends up different if I don't get married young and if I don't have kids super young. I think my career is completely different.

• 30:54Channing Crowder?

  Your wife and my wife, they're friends and, yeah, and all that. I always say, get a co-pilot, don't get a passenger.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:01Channing Crowder?

  Is that's what Amber is?

• 31:02Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 31:03Channing Crowder?

  I know it's more, but if I go in a coma tomorrow, our kids, our life doesn't change.

• 31:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:09Channing Crowder?

  Cause Asia can run it. Is that a, is that a good thing? Or what advice would you get to young boys about?

• 31:14Speaker 03

  No, that's 100% right. I mean, you know, marry the smartest person you know.

• 31:21Speaker 03

  You know what I'm saying? You know, that's, that's, that's literally the advice I give everybody when I, young baseball players, I'm like, yo, marry the smartest girl you know. Somebody that's gonna have your back 100%. And I know, you know, I feel like every decision that we make is for us as a family and for us as our legacy, especially now going forward. Um, you know, everything, everything that we are doing now is for our kids and hopefully our grandkids and, you know, building that Sebastian name and that legacy.

• 31:48Channing Crowder?

  And they go argue now.

• 31:50Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean, you gotta give up control.

• 31:56Speaker 03

  That made my life so much easier. When I stopped trying to control and just was like, just show me where to go. Tell me where to go, tell me where to be. And I'm so much easier now.

• 32:05Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 32:05Speaker 03

  It's great. It's so much easier.

• 32:07Fred Taylor?

  CC, you mentioned coming to New York. Obviously, it turned into one of your best decisions ever. But the pressures that came along with coming to play for the Pinstripes. What was that like? Because the city is real crazy.

• 32:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, it is. Nah, the city is passionate. You know what I'm saying? And especially for Yankee fans. Like, they hold you accountable. They expect you to go out and go out and throw seven, eight innings every time out. That's what I expect out of myself. So, once I figured out, nobody could put more pressure on me than I already put on myself. You know, I can figure this out. And I think the biggest thing that people try to do here is come here and, you know, do too much. Try to turn into Superman. When you come to the Yankees, especially at the time when I came, if you look around, that team was probably one of the better Yankee teams that was ever assembled. You had A-Rod at third, Jeter at short, Cano at second, Tex Scher at first. Like, all you gotta do is just not fuck this up. And y'all go, you know what I'm saying?

• 33:05Speaker 03

  Y'all gonna win pretty much all of the games if you don't go out there and give up seven runs in three innings. So, once I figured out, like, oh, it's way less pressure because this team is a lot better than any team I've ever been on, it made it easier just to go out and be myself. And you kind of find a pocket where it's also fun to kind of find a pocket where you're not the superstar. Like, everything that happened, they're going straight to Jeter's locker. Then they go in the A-Rod's locker, then they go in the Mo's locker. I'm like the seventh dude on this list.

• 33:36Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 33:36Speaker 03

  Like, this is great. You know what I'm saying? So, it became, you know, fun and easy once I kind of figured out, oh, I can be myself and, you know, kind of fly under the radar here.

• 33:49Fred Taylor?

  You ever think about the umpire that didn't give you the error so you didn't get the no-hitter?

• 33:54Speaker 03

  Man, you know what?

• 33:57Speaker 03

  Me and Jason, so me and Jason Kendor are still really close. I see him all the time. And we were talking about this the other day. It happened so early in the game in Pittsburgh that I didn't pitch knowing that I was throwing a no hitter. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's a different thing, knowing, going to the sixth, seventh inning like, oh, he's got a no hitter. We just thought it was a one-hit game. You know what I'm saying? So I'm going out, kind of pitching without the pressures of throwing a no-no. Had it happened later in the game, then we get that kind of buildup and then I feel like it's more of a no hitter. So I don't, I don't, I don't think about that. I don't, I don't let that bother me.

• 34:33Channing Crowder?

  Well, bro, when you out, when you out there, like you say, you the man. You, you're running the game. And back then, they got a pitch clock. So now, whatever, but back then, the game don't start till you pitch. Like, that gotta be crazy to know that it goes and ends through me. The psychological side of that.

• 34:51Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:52Channing Crowder?

  You had to get used to that as a kid to move up because I see these dudes nut up all the time.

• 34:57Speaker 03

  I mean, that's something that my high school coach kind of taught me is that, like, you're in control. Like, if I want to walk around the mound, tie my shoe after every pitch.

• 35:09Channing Crowder?

  Little bag.

• 35:10Speaker 03

  After every single pitch, I can do that. You know what I'm saying? Like, I, I, I loved that part of it. Like, I always used to tell Hove, I was around Hove all the time and, like, watching him, like, from behind, like, rock a sta-, like, rock a stadium is like, that's how you feel. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's 50,000, I always say, it's 50,000 people in the Bronx on a random Tuesday, and this shit don't start until, like, I'm ready. Like, you know, like, it's 7:05, but I can start this motherfucker at 7:08 if I want to. I can start 7:00, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm in control of this whole thing and I think... That was the most appealing part about, you know, being pitching in the Bronx and being a pitcher,

• 35:54Speaker 03

  a starting pitcher in general, but just pitching in the Bronx and having that energy and knowing that it stops and starts on you is incredible.

• 36:02Channing Crowder?

  Are there pitchers that'll pitch better in Milwaukee or in Texas than they will with that pressure? Like, it seems like it's so much, they're very talented, even football-wise, very talented quarterbacks that's gonna nut up. There's very talented people that's gonna nut up. Like, why don't you nut up when you in them?

• 36:22Speaker 03

  Because I just explained that you have to understand, like, when you play for the Yankees, most times, your team's gonna be really good. They're gonna trade, they're gonna like, go sign whoever they can to make this team be a World Series contending team. So you don't have to do anything other than what you can do. Like, when I talk about 07 and the playoffs in Cleveland, I was trying to go out and have this performance like Randy Johnson, Curt Schilling. Like, I wanted to go out and have this epic performance every single timeout, eight innings, nine innings, and I didn't need to do that. All I needed to do is just go out and do my little part. You know what I'm saying? Like, stay in your lane, and if everybody stayed in the lane and do their part, kind of like the same thing on the football field.

• 37:06Speaker 03

  Like, everybody's gotta hit their assignment, everybody's gotta block, everybody gotta do the right thing, and in baseball, it's kind of the same way.

• 37:11Channing Crowder?

  I can give up three, but they'll get us four.

• 37:13Speaker 03

  Exactly. Just don't give up fucking seven.

• 37:17Channing Crowder?

  Well, they gonna pull you before that anyway.

• 37:19Speaker 03

  Just don't give up seven, man. I'm like, you know what I'm saying? Like, just don't complete it up, and we gonna win.

• 37:24Ryan Clark?

  You mentioned, uh, Watchen Hove Rocker Stage. I was like, small flex. I just let it go. He's like, I'm behind him. I was like, damn. Every time I go to the concert, I'm in the stands, so I'm in front of the people. I never really get to see, but...

• 37:39Channing Crowder?

  He's not where I sit.

• 37:40Ryan Clark?

  No, he ain't where I sit either. He ain't where I sit.

• 37:43Channing Crowder?

  He real close.

• 37:43Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, he real close. But the proximity to people like that is part of being in New York. And I think getting an opportunity to sit with people like you and others we've sat with that have accomplished and achieved greatness, it is inspiring. Who are some of those people, man, just like throughout your career or throughout your upbringing that, you know, you mentioned Bo Jackson already, that you looked at for inspiration as to this is the level of excellence you strive to in any walk of life?

• 38:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, you know who is a huge one for me is Dave Stewart. He pitched for the A's in the late 80s. He's from Oakland and at nine years old, he walked in my Boys and Girls Club. And in the late 80s, early 90s, the percent of black baseball players at his highest, it was like 18%. So every team had two or three guys. I mean, you guys know, we were about the same age. You can look on the TV and you can see a guy that looked like you. So I knew who Dave Stewart was, but the effect that he had on us in that Boys and Girls Club is something that I wanted. And that's the reason why I started my pitch in foundation and being in the neighborhood is I just didn't want to be a guy that you seen on TV or this major league pitcher.

• 38:54Speaker 03

  I wanted to be the guy that you see like Willie Mays in Harlem playing stickball with the kids. That's the effect that kind of Dave Stewart had on me as a kid and it's the reason why I do all the philanthropy work. And if I can just have one kid come up to me and say what I just said about me, about Dave Stewart, then it's all worth it. You know what I mean? Like it makes it all worth it. So that's the reason why I'm so visible. That's the reason why I'm in the Bronx Boys and Girls Club, in my hometown, in Cleveland and Milwaukee during the camps is because I want to have that effect that Dave Stewart had on me as a nine-year-old.

• 39:27Fred Taylor?

  The game is expensive. I learned that from Channing. His kid is in travel baseball.

• 39:32Channing Crowder?

  Goddamn $350 bats.

• 39:34Speaker 03

  And you gotta buy one twice a year.

• 39:36Channing Crowder?

  I need to drop six. Man, drop six, boy, you better go swing that bat.

• 39:41Fred Taylor?

  You know, like, looking back, man, like, young C.C., I'm sure it would be tough for you to have gone through this journey with the way things are. How do we get? Now, the current kids that want to go out there and play, how do we, what's the process of them being able to afford getting out there so they can live out there and drink?

• 40:04Speaker 03

  The kid like me, the situation I grew up in, there's no chance I would make it in today's game. Being a multi-sport athlete, not having the funds to be able to get to a perfect game or whatever tournament, not being able to buy a drop six, not having the right equipment, not being able to have an outfielder's glove, a first baseman's glove, a pitcher's glove. Like, if you don't have the necessary tools, you feel less than and you may go off into another sport. So I know 1,000% that would have been me. I would have showed up probably to a tournament and there would have been kids with bats and gloves and all this different shit, and I show up with my one glove that I play fucking left field, first base, and I'm on the mound with. You know what I'm saying?

• 40:46Speaker 03

  And I'm using somebody else's bat. Like, so if I don't show up with that stuff, you feel less than and you, I'm going to football. I'm going to play basketball. Where my boys and my friends are. We have an organization called the Players Alliance that we started in 2020 that is addressing that. And through that, I feel like we have been doing a great job of just, you know, finding those kids throughout the country that need that support, need that help. When I was still playing, you know, they were telling me that the numbers were dwindling down. We talked about the 18% of black kids, black people playing the game when we were kids, it's about 6%. And when I was playing in like 2007, it was like 4%. And, you know, I made a statement. I was like, you know, this is a crisis and, you know, we need to

• 41:29Speaker 03

  do something about it. And everybody jumped down my throat. And I was just like, maybe kids aren't playing. Maybe black kids ain't playing baseball. And that's not the case. They playing it at a high level. We just got to give them opportunities. And we got to make sure that we are not discouraging the kids that are multi-sport athletes from playing baseball. And I think through the Players Alliance, we are addressing that. And, but it's something that we all think about. We consciously, you know, are trying to, trying to make better. Because I feel like a lot of the guys from my generation are, grew up in my situation, whether it's Gary Sheffield, or, you know, Kenny Lofton, or Jimmy Rollins. We all kind of came out of that same mold, and none of us would make it in today's game.

• 42:11Channing Crowder?

  Being in, in the major leagues as a black American. Because I see a bunch of Dominicans and I look at them like I look at y'all and then I say, "What's up, bro?"

• 42:20Ryan Clark?

  Then they talk.

• 42:21Channing Crowder?

  "What's up, bro?" "K?"

• 42:24Speaker 03

  I got a funny story about that.

• 42:28Channing Crowder?

  But tell the story, but even on that, like being a black American in baseball, like, and you were in a time when it was, I think we're more progressive now than we were when you played.

• 42:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, so my first team that I played, I got drafted, I'm 17 years old, I'm fresh from, literally going from high school, now I'm a pro. You know what I mean? Like, they throw you, you into the fire, like you go to the minor leagues. So I walk into the locker room and it's like two black, like two dark-skinned dudes over here, and then it's like, you know, the white dudes over here, but then in this corner, it's like seven dark dudes. I'm like, "Oh, like, we good, like, we locked in." So I go straight down there, like, to say what's up, and everybody down there speaks Spanish. It's the first time that I ever, ever met, like, Dominican guys, you know what I'm saying? They kind of look like me, they look like me, they start speaking Spanish, like, "K?" like, and then two black dudes grab me over there, I was like, "Yeah, nah, you gotta come to this corner over here."

• 43:22Ryan Clark?

  It's us three now.

• 43:23Speaker 03

  It's us three now. You stay out of that corner, you stay over here in this corner, but...

• 43:28Channing Crowder?

  NFL locker rooms are, what, 80, 90% black?

• 43:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:32Channing Crowder?

  MLB locker rooms, like you said, 10% black Americans. I don't know, 60% white boys, but then it's a Hispanic dude, so you're really a minority again.

• 43:41Speaker 03

  You are, it made it tough, um, you know, sometimes to be able to, just to be, sometimes I was the only black dude, you know, in Cleveland, it was just me. Um, in New York, I never had that, it was, you know, it was either me, Derrick, you know, Judge came along, whoever else. You know, like I said, when we were watching the game, it was, the number was so high, I feel like it's always been our game, you know what I mean? Like, even back to, you know, the Negro League days and Jackie Robinson days, like, baseball was black culture. Like, if you look at, you know, Hank Aaron and those boys when they started down at Rickwood, and, you know, some of the stuff that we're doing down there, like, that's central baseball, and that's black baseball, and those guys were the LeBron James, those are the Jalen Hurtses,

• 44:26Speaker 03

  you know, Satchel Paige is flying around in the 40s with decked-out suits, and he's got his own plane. You know what I'm saying? Like, these are the guys, so it's always been our sport. We just got to figure out a way to get back to... Our culture, if that makes sense. Like, baseball's always been good for black athletes. It hasn't always been great for black culture. And I think we need to get back to getting back to black culture. And starting in Atlanta with the All-Star game. I don't know if you guys seen any of that. With JD and Ludacris starting it off for us. And everything that we kind of did down there honoring Hank on the Home Run Derby Day. I think we're getting back to that.

• 45:05Ryan Clark?

  Did you have some influence and some conversations with that? With your role now in working with them?

• 45:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, so we started a group about four years ago of ex-players. And it kind of just started with, you know, I got a job there in '21. Raul Banyas is working with the league. He's one of my favorite teammates. And I'm like, if he's working over there, then it can't be that bad. You know what I'm saying? So I joined and started working with the league and just trying to change the narrative of, you know, players and the league not having a great relationship. And we started a group, Commissioner Ambassador's Program. And a bunch of those boys I just named, Jimmy Rollins, Ryan Howard, you know, Gary Sheffield, Fred McGriff. We're involved at a high level in trying to change the game,

• 45:55Speaker 03

  trying to bring the culture back. But yeah, I mean, a lot of the stuff that happened in Atlanta, the uniforms, the guys wearing 44 on the Home Run Derby. You know, that was our idea. A lot of the stuff that you see with the hats and the way that the guys are wearing their uniforms is our idea. We did a big game back in Rickwood, East West Classic, bringing back a Negro League Classic at the oldest ballpark in America. We did that. We refurbished the field and put it in Willie Mays's name. I mean, the Hank Aaron tribute that you saw after the sixth inning, that was all us. So, you know, we're just trying to change the narrative that players can't work for the league. And for me, if you just look at that program, it's all my friends. You know what I'm saying?

• 46:39Speaker 03

  Like, I get a chance to be like what you guys are doing. This is all a friendship. You know, I've watched you guys kind of, the way this evolved, and it's through friendship. And that's what that program is. It's us having a love for the game, having a love for the players, and through our friendship, trying to make the game better. And it's been a lot of fun to be able... To be on that side of it and bring my guys along with me.

• 47:02Ryan Clark?

  So just right now with the involvement, obviously you work with the league. How are you also involved with the union and trying to help things move forward there as well?

• 47:13Speaker 03

  Yeah, so you know, having my role with MLB, I'm trying to change the narrative. You know, it always being a fight, you know, the players against the league and you know, I think you know with the program I'm putting together, the Commissioner Abations program, we have enough relationships around the league and you know through clubhouses that if some of, if you know Mookie Betts or whoever else sees us working on this side, well, oh, maybe it's not that bad on that side, you know, and I think that's you know, what we're trying to do and you know for me, it's about having legends around the game. You know, the Gary Shefields matter, the you know Fred McGriff's, they matter and you know,

• 47:55Speaker 03

  suggests that you know to have us around is a bad thing.

• 47:59Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 47:59Speaker 03

  It's heartbreaking, you know, and it sucks to you know, kind of have that narrative out there that we're doing anything for money. I don't know if anybody knows me, but I don't do anything for money.

• 48:10Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 48:10Speaker 03

  You know, I'm doing this to try to help the game, to try to grow the game, and to try to help and change the narrative, you know, throughout the game and you know, I'm gonna continue to do that, you know, whether the union, you know, whether the union or whoever else likes it or not, I'm gonna continue to do what I know is right and continue to bring my friends around and give them access to the game that we love.

• 48:30Ryan Clark?

  But you're not involved in negotiations in any way, correct?

• 48:34Speaker 03

  No, it's not my job.

• 48:34Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, exactly. I think that's how people see it.

• 48:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's how people see it and that's why I'm trying to change the narrative. That for me, to see me around, you know, the commissioner and say, oh, he's on this side of this issue or whatever, makes no sense.

• 48:48Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 48:49Speaker 03

  I'm on the side of growing the game and trying to make the game better, and I think everybody in my group is a part of that.

• 48:56Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior like beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 49:25Ryan Clark?

  I love to read. And so I want to ask you about a book. I think it's called Five O'Clock Comes Early. How did that book sort of change your perspective and outlook on yourself and life going forward?

• 49:39Speaker 03

  That book by Bob Welsh changed me because I didn't know if I was going to be able to play or pitch without alcohol. That sounds crazy. But it had been so much a part of my routine, so much a part of my life, that I was sitting in rehab like, I don't know if I can pitch without drinking. Like, this is like what I do. Like, I pitch, I drink that night, I drink the next night, drink three nights in a row, and then I take two nights off. And then, but like, that's like, it's like part of my life. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, so, but once I read that book and got an understanding of, you know, this is, I have a new routine, one, and, you know, this is what it's going to take for me to stay sober

• 50:24Speaker 03

  and stay on the track that I need to. And, two, he did it. You know what I'm saying? Like, he was able to go to rehab, and he was able to come back and pitch and pitch at a high level. It just gave me the confidence to be able to, the confidence and, I guess, the will to be able to want to play after coming out of rehab.

• 50:46Ryan Clark?

  I know functioning alcoholics. You know, I have family members who are actually like functioning drug addicts. None of them are going to the Hall of Fame in anything. I'm just, I'm just, I'm just being honest, you know, you mentioned just now, it just struck me. You said, "I didn't know if I would be able to pitch." I would feel like it's almost the other way around unless the drinking was such a way of life for you. How do you feel you were able to reach such heights with a lifestyle like that?

• 51:16Speaker 03

  It was like, I mean, it was just, I mean, it was functioning. I was a functioning, you know, I was a functioning addict. It was just something, like I said, I had did since I was 14. It was something that I did in high school when, if I felt like it was a big game and I was gonna be nervous, I would drink the night before, just so I could be hungover, so I would know I didn't have to worry about butterflies in my stomach. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's how, like, I had figured out how much alcohol could help me at that time. So it was just, it was literally just something that was like a part of my life. Like, I started doing, you know, I started drinking, because it would be a bunch of scouts that was coming to my games in my junior year.

• 51:58Speaker 03

  And I'd be like, you know what, fuck it, I'm gonna just get drunk the night before and I can wake up and just go play. I don't have to worry about nothing.

• 52:04Channing Crowder?

  I gotta, do you ever think about, to Ryan's question?

• 52:08Channing Crowder?

  You throwing 97.

• 52:10Ryan Clark?

  Is the glove glory?

• 52:12Channing Crowder?

  Hungover, like you throwing, "Bruh, we done all watched you, va, va, va the ass." And you out there rubbing your face and, like, did you ever think about, "Bruh, if I wasn't drinking, like, what I could do?" When you stopped, though?

• 52:25Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, I mean, no, I didn't, I like, I don't know. I mean, it's the same thing with my weight, right? Like, I was at my biggest, I was like 340. And I never thought about not being that weight. Like, it's just who I was or what I was. Like, I was offensive lineman, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm a fucking, that's just, that's just what I am. So no, I never, and I still don't even think that it would, it would've changed anything. I don't, I don't think so, you know?

• 52:55Channing Crowder?

  If you was pushing off that, off that back leg, or you left-handed, so you'd push off this leg.

• 53:01Speaker 03

  At lighter and not hungover. You could be a throw faster than. Yeah, yeah. But the question is, have you ever thought about it? Is there any regret in it? No, none. And that's, I think that's what I'm saying, none. Like zero. I don't like, I mean, for me, like being lighter, like health wise, like just living longer? Yes. Like I always always take care of myself way back then, yes. But like as far as like as an athlete, no. I don't think, I don't think I missed anything. I don't think it would change anything. But like for life, like just like now, you know, wanting to live longer and be around my grandkids and all of that shit. Yeah, I should have been taking care of myself a long time ago.

• 53:40Ryan Clark?

  If he was, if he was C.C. Sebastian that had to go back to Vallejo after three years in the minor league, it might be a different thing. Like he's going to Cooperstown. You know what I mean? I think, you know, a lot of people who have those regrets, it's when you're the hometown hero, the three sports star that doesn't make it, you know?

• 54:01Speaker 03

  I was always scared of being that too. I was always scared of like letting every, so that's why you, when you ask what I'm carrying when I walk across that stage. I'm carrying that I didn't let them people down. Being that three sports star and being that guy that everybody looked at. Like I was in the paper at nine, 10 years old. You're on the front of the sports page, you know what I'm saying? And to be able to kind of live that out and carry that out for my hometown, for my dad, for all of, you know, everybody that like threw that on my back, like that's, that's when I'm walking across the stage carrying.

• 54:36Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, I'm stuck in between asking about the movie Vallejo, right? That's gonna go back and follow your childhood versus asking about, um, you know, you pivoting throughout your career and changing from the big power thrower and adjusting your stuff to more finesse that created your longevity and obviously landing you in Cooperstown. You can go either direction with either one of those. Which one is most important to you?

• 55:03Speaker 03

  I'm, I'm super excited about the project, um, just because, you know, I talk about, you know, my hometown and how unique it was to grow up there. And, you know, I feel like if we did a show or a movie about it, it would be a cross between, um, The Sandlot and Snowfall. You know what I'm saying?

• 55:23Speaker 03

  Damn. Right, no, like, figure out, like, like, yeah, like, you know, really, really good young black baseball players in the middle of that type of shit going on. Like, we, I grew up in that, that eighties, nineties jungle, like, that's what the middle of what was going on at the park. But we had high level fucking baseball going on as like kids, you know what I'm saying? Like, my 12-year-old All-Star team probably should have went to the Little League World Series. We were just one pitch short, but like, best baseball team I've ever been on. You know what I'm saying? And it was all my homeboys and we were all black, you know what I'm saying? So, it, it, it would be exciting and fun to be able to kind of tell

• 56:07Speaker 03

  that story and let people understand how rich, like, the baseball is in my hometown and kind of where I came from and why I played the sport. So, yeah, I, I, I would be excited to be able to tell that story and, um, you know, going back to, to me being able to, to, you know, extend my career. I think that was, uh, just, just being lucky, being able to be in this Yankees organization and have, I had Mariano Rivera, I had Andy Pettit, and I had Billy Connors. And all three of those dudes have mastered the cutter. And, you know, when I was throwing hard, they all were like, hey, you need to think about throwing the cutter. I was like, no, I don't. Like, I fucking throw hard enough, you know what

• 56:48Speaker 03

  I'm saying? And as I lost my velocity, I started paying more attention and I couldn't have learned from three better guys to understand, you know, how to throw this pitch, when to throw this pitch, how to set it up. And, you know, extremely, you know, humbled and honored that I was able to, to extend my career. And it's the only reason I was able to go to Cooperstown is by being able to, to come in contact with those three men.

• 57:11Fred Taylor?

  It's amazing how the brain takes over when you lose that, that, just that rawness. We talk about it in football too. The longer you play, you start to lose a little bit of that, that stuff you really had. But this has to take over.

• 57:24Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 57:25Fred Taylor?

  Right?

• 57:26Speaker 03

  And then, and then it's like, man, I wish I was using this when I was... My shit was good.

• 57:30Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 57:31Speaker 03

  You know what I'm saying? But then that's when you see the Patrick Mahomes or whoever else it is.

• 57:35Channing Crowder?

  But you talk about your 12-year-old team and then to talk about when you had to adjust. Is baseball nature or nurture? Because you like, you don't look like a normal, like you don't look like the mother. But you bring up Randy Johnson, that bitch was 6'9". Like, and you a big dude, like, but they got these little dudes out here now that's throwing shit.

• 57:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, I mean.

• 57:56Channing Crowder?

  But they don't look the part. Like, is it nature or nurture?

• 57:59Speaker 03

  I think it's, I think it's a little bit of both. I think you can, obviously, one, like, yeah, I was born with this arm. And I always tell my wife, I was like, I knew I could throw hard when I was young.

• 58:10Channing Crowder?

  Throwing the grapefruits.

• 58:11Speaker 03

  Throwing the grapefruits. I didn't want to tell that story, but yeah, that's how I knew. Like, like, I'm sure people tired of hearing me throwing the fucking grapefruits, but that's a true story.

• 58:19Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 58:20Speaker 03

  Like, I knew I could throw hard. And, but there are people that, like you said, that are unassuming. Jose, Jose Altuve, one of the best hitters that we've ever seen, probably going to the Hall of Fame. And he's.

• 58:31Channing Crowder?

  Menace school.

• 58:32Speaker 03

  Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So it's, it's, it's fun. And, and I think baseball is cool in that way that anybody, you know, with enough skill and that can work hard enough can make it to the big leagues.

• 58:44Ryan Clark?

  You have so many special moments. You know, I listed those accolades when you sat down. What's a moment with a teammate or just with the team and environment that stands out to you? That was truly special that you got to experience throughout your 19?

• 58:59Speaker 03

  I think for me, one, winning the World Series. But I think the, the biggest moment that, that was for me with having a chance to experience was watching Derek get 3,000 hits. You know, he went 5-for-5 that day. He hit a, I think he had a grand slam to get the 3,000 hit. But just the lead up to that, you know what I'm saying? Watching him go through that, you know, being in the Yankee uniform, you know? Being his teammate, being close to him. It was incredible to, to kind of see that. And, you know, having my own. Kind of going for 3,000 strikeouts and having that build up and knowing what that was like. It was fun to see it on both, as a teammate side, like a little brother.

• 59:40Speaker 03

  And then to go through it, you know, yourself and then, you know, have my guy Dylan Batances do the same thing. You know, he was with me, you know, going through it and, but watching your teammate get a milestone like that, where you know he's going to the Hall of Fame is probably the coolest thing.

• 59:54Ryan Clark?

  I, um, the first baseball jersey I ever owned was a Derek Jeter jersey.

• 59:58Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 59:59Ryan Clark?

  I was, uh, I was number two my entire life, like high school, all that. And I was like, this is perfect. You know what I mean? Um, what was it like to be a teammate or just in that atmosphere, that vicinity with the captain and the New York Yankees?

• 1:00:16Speaker 03

  It was something that was real. You know what I'm saying? Like you, you see people wearing the C or you hear people being the captain and all of that shit. And it's like, eh, is he really a captain? Um, even outside looking in, when I was in, when I was in Cleveland, I was like, eh, what is, you know what I'm saying? Like.

• 1:00:35Channing Crowder?

  He ain't like that.

• 1:00:36Speaker 03

  I don't like to get it.

• 1:00:37Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, he like. That shit cute. Jeter ain't like that.

• 1:00:39Speaker 03

  But coming here, I get it. I understood. And, and, you know, from day one, day one of spring training, he called me, you know, and like I said, he just lets you be yourself. He lets you fly under the radar. He takes all the heat. Something needs to be said, he will say it. But just one of the, probably the best teammate I ever had. And leading the way he did by example and really, you know, kind of, he'll, he'll stand up and say whatever he needs to say in the clubhouse too. Um, but every single day, you know, he's ready to play and ready to try to win a game. So it, it was real. You know what I'm saying? Like if, if that makes sense, like some of it's not real, but, but his captain, I mean, that was real.

• 1:01:19Channing Crowder?

  I gotta add, it's personal. And my son, he obviously doesn't throw like you, but he pitches a little bit.

• 1:01:25Speaker 03

  He will.

• 1:01:28Channing Crowder?

  Well, bro, no, cuz I, do you know, like, do you, do you have guys? Do you know you got a guy before he walks out the dugout? Is there times in the thing where he just, I done, I done killed his ass so many times, he don't even gonna swing his back?

• 1:01:41Speaker 03

  And that's what I was saying about those times in Milwaukee. Like, I, I knew driving to the ballpark, like, you have no chance to win, and I never felt like that. Where I'm driving to the ballpark, I'm like, oh yeah, I'm, I'm winning this game today. You know what I'm saying? Like, there was no butterflies in my stomach, I, like, I know, soon as the game starts, I'm going 80 innings and we gonna win this fucking game. Like, there, there, there have been times, like, there's times that I feel like that when I'm driving to Yankee Stadium, and I'm out of there in the third inning, you know what I'm saying? But those, that two months in Milwaukee is when I knew that, yeah, like, yeah, this is, this is, this is my game.

• 1:02:16Channing Crowder?

  Did that window, in that window, did you know that you could be a Hall of Famer? When did you know, like, CC means something?

• 1:02:22Speaker 03

  Man, I never, ever, ever thought about me going to the Hall of Fame until, I think it was like 2013 or 14, I got into it with an umpire like I always do, and I was sitting on the bench, uh, next to one of my teammates, and he goes, he said something about like, "How you gonna do that to a Hall of Famer?" And I was, I was like, "Who the fuck you talking about?" You know what I'm saying? But like, that was the first time I had ever even realized that people thought of me like that.

• 1:02:49Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:49Speaker 03

  Like, I had never even, like, never crossed my mind, like, never, ever crossed my mind until I was sitting next to Ben Francisco and he, and he, like, just said that in passing, and I'm like, "Oh shit." Like, I, I mean, like, "Yeah, I guess," you know what I'm saying? Like, but it was, that was, I'd never, I'd never considered myself a Hall of Famer.

• 1:03:07Fred Taylor?

  All right, throughout your journey though, man, from Vallejo to the bigs, you know, finding success, finding struggle, finding growth, what, what's been your biggest pivot or your greatest pivot?

• 1:03:19Speaker 03

  I think my greatest pivot is...

• 1:03:23Speaker 03

  Just understanding myself, I guess, understanding, processing everything that kind of happened to me young and being able to apply that as a grown man and, you know, become a better father, become a better husband, because I was on the track of, you know, losing everything. I think in, you know, October of 2015 was my greatest pivot, being able to, you know, stop drinking and, you know, turn my life around.

• 1:03:54Ryan Clark?

  And this is just a pure question because I need education as a fan, right? And you seem to love, like, you love baseball.

• 1:04:02Speaker 03

  I do love baseball. I love sports in general, but I love baseball.

• 1:04:05Ryan Clark?

  And Chan was talking about pitching. I got to watch Paul Skeens. I went to LSU.

• 1:04:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:10Ryan Clark?

  When you see, when there's a young dude like him who's at the Pirates and I played in Pittsburgh, he's not the greatest run support, but when you watch someone like him, does that bring you joy that the game is in hands of guys like the Skeens and the Shohei Otanis and all of these people you're still advocating for while trying to build it up more for people like us too?

• 1:04:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, that's incredible to watch. Not only one like Skeens do what he's did in the big leagues, but do what he did at LSU. I think, you know, more kids, especially more black kids, need to know that that's a route that you can take, that's an avenue that you can take. You know, Mike Braswell was on that team, you know, so many different guys that you can name. I love the fact that he's able to take that success from the College World Series, LSU, and then bring that right into the big leagues. Like you said, it's tough getting the run support with the Pirates.

• 1:04:59Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:00Speaker 03

  But it's incredible to watch him, he's two years into his big league career, he's started the All-Star game twice.

• 1:05:04Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 1:05:05Speaker 03

  You know, he's probably one of the, he's gonna be one of the greatest talents that we've seen in a long time and our game is in a great spot. It is. We just need more players involved, you know, helping the league, you know, figure out how to, you know, build this culture up and build these moments up and...

• 1:05:22Channing Crowder?

  Just, just you bring up Shohei, who's an ace, and raking.

• 1:05:27Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:05:28Channing Crowder?

  Your big ass wasn't raking, was it?

• 1:05:31Ryan Clark?

  Hey, you hit home off of Channel Park though.

• 1:05:34Speaker 03

  I did.

• 1:05:35Ryan Clark?

  You got Channel Park. I said you brought a show here, I'm looking at you.

• 1:05:40Speaker 03

  I'm looking at you like 20 years too late.

• 1:05:42Ryan Clark?

  You got a Channel Park, he got what? Oh man, so I guess my last thing is, will they call you Carson Charles Sabathia? When you walk across the stage?

• 1:05:53Speaker 03

  I hope so, I hope it's Carson Charles, yeah. And again, to honor my father, you know, my son will be there, he's Carson Charles. So yeah, I mean, I'm gonna be walking across with that man on my back, so yeah, I hope they do call me Carson Charles.

• 1:06:09Ryan Clark?

  Man, thank you for your time, bro. This was absolutely amazing, man, we appreciate you and just congrats again, dog. I think it's amazing that not only you had the playing career that you have, but now in becoming the person that you are, you share your story, but you also give back by being present in many places where they don't get to see people like you. So appreciate you. Let's go grab a drink.

• 1:06:30Speaker 03

  Let's do it.

• 1:07:02Speaker 05

  Every game day you show up for your team, now it's your time.

• 1:07:12Speaker 06

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy, some maglutide injection 2.4mg a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?