Julie Piatt On Why The Heart Will Never Fail You

How do you navigate transformation? What does it mean to live with integrity? And why is it important to cultivate intuition? Joining me today to grapple with truths big and small is my in-house spiritual guide, Julie Piatt—aka SriMati. My partner in every definition of the word, Julie excels across an impressive variety of disciplines. She is a serial entrepreneur. She’s the founder and CEO of SriMu, her plant-based cheese enterprise, and soon-to-be empire. She’s a musician. An artist. A designer. A devoted mother to four. Most relevant to today’s conversation, Julie is also a yogi and lifelong, devoted pursuer of spiritual wisdom, which she insightfully practices and instructs by way of her online spiritual community, Water Tiger. In this exchange, Julie shares actionable ways to celebrate your lived experience, amplify your awareness, and elevate your consciousness as we emerge from the pandemic and the multitude of experiences that period wrought. Julie also shares ways to inject entrepreneurship with spirituality. With the holiday season soon upon us, we also discuss how to gracefully navigate the emotional complexity of family gatherings. We conclude with valuable business insights from the front lines of growing her *not* cheese brand. Watch: YouTube. Read: Show notes. I think you’ll come away from this exchange inspired, enlightened, and armed with a few tactics to infuse your life with more purpose, passion, and joy. Julie tends to have that effect on people. Peace + Plants, Rich Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Rich Roll?

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• 0:44Rich Roll?

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• 1:05Julie Piatt?

  The heart will never fail you, and that's been my experience. So it doesn't mean that you're going to have the trajectory that you think that you're going to have in your mind, or in whatever you thought your life was going to be. The key is inside the heart, and it's in each one of us. Because if we can activate what that natural expression is, that is so beautiful, so divine, so profound, and it might not be seen by anyone. It's not about being famous or having like a big reach. It's about doing what is authentic and reminding ourselves that creating art and music and dance with sacred intention is the greatest gift we can give humanity.

• 1:48Julie Piatt?

  And instead, we've been reversed to think that you can only be an artist if you're in a certain circle, or if your art sells for a certain amount of money, or if you're, you know, one of the greats. That's not true. The biggest thing we have to do is live in resonance with our heart. The heart will not leave you.

• 2:18Rich Roll?

  The Rich Roll Podcast. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the podcast. My guest today is somebody who has appeared on the show more than any other guest in the 10-year history of this podcast. In fact, she was my very first guest, all the way back on episode one. Her name is Julie Piatt, aka Shrimati. And as many of you already know, she also happens to be my wife, my partner in all things and every definition of the word, and somebody who excels truly across an impressive variety of disciplines. Julie is an entrepreneur. She's the founder and CEO of Shrimu, which is her plant-based cheese enterprise and soon-to-be empire. She's

• 3:01Rich Roll?

  also a musician, an artist, a designer, a mom to four. And most relevant to today's conversation, she is a yogi. She actually has an incredible course on the iFit platform, and lifelong devoted pursuer of spiritual wisdom, which she insightfully practices, teaches, and instructs by way of her online spiritual community called Water Tiger. And today, she's going to tell us all about it. But first.

• 3:36Rich Roll?

  Okay, in this discussion, we dive into how to elevate your lived experience, your awareness, your consciousness. As we emerge from this pandemic and everything that that experience wrought, we discuss how to inject your entrepreneurship with spirituality, how to gracefully navigate the pitfalls, the vicissitudes, the fraughtness of the family gatherings that are part and parcel of the impending holiday season. And Julie shares some valuable insights from the front lines of growing her not cheese brand. I think you guys are going to come away from this exchange inspired, enlightened, armed with more than a few tools, tactics, and strategies to hopefully improve your life. Julie tends to have that effect on

• 4:21Rich Roll?

  people. And before we get into it, Final note, in a gesture of gratitude for listening and watching, Julie is kindly offering all of you guys a special discount on Shrimu. Visit shrimu.com and enter our code RRP18 at checkout and you'll get 18% off. If you are ordering for Thanksgiving, please make sure to place your order on or before November 13th. If you want it delivered in time for Christmas, the order deadline is December 11. Again, that's S R I M U dot com, promo code RRP18. Okay, here is me and Julie Piatt doing the thing.

• 5:06Rich Roll?

  Well, here we are again.

• 5:08Julie Piatt?

  Here we are again.

• 5:09Rich Roll?

  I'm here with no agenda. We're going to spin the spiritual roulette wheel and see what comes up. It's always intriguing and an adventure when I get to sit down with you. We haven't done this in a little while, so I guess this is our, we do this like twice a year. I can't remember the last time that we did a podcast together, but it's been a

• 5:28Julie Piatt?

  minute. I think it's been like six months.

• 5:29Rich Roll?

  Has it been that long?

• 5:30Julie Piatt?

  I think so.

• 5:30Rich Roll?

  So we're right on cue.

• 5:32Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 5:32Rich Roll?

  We're heading into the fall season. We have holidays upon us. You always have wisdom about how to effectively navigate the pitfalls and vicissitudes that the holidays always seem to surface for everybody. So I imagine we'll talk a little bit about that. But what is top of mind for you? What do you want to talk about?

• 5:53Julie Piatt?

  First of all, evolution.

• 5:54Rich Roll?

  You have the floor.

• 5:55Julie Piatt?

  Evolution is at hand because it was funny because we, we met in our kitchen this morning with our usual Rich saying that, you know, what are we going to talk about? We need to decide what we're going to talk about.

• 6:07Rich Roll?

  This is the trope.

• 6:07Julie Piatt?

  This is the way it goes.

• 6:08Rich Roll?

  This is the dance that we've been doing since day one 10 years ago, where I'm like, we need to sit down and map it out. We got to decide what the topics are going to be. And you, you got like almost, you got, you were starting to get activated. You're like, I don't want to do that. Like we're, it's always fine. Like relax.

• 6:26Julie Piatt?

  No, no. Yeah, no, because I, I had this great flow of a lot of inspirations and meditations about the Energy and how amazing it was and how this was going to be a really meaningful conversation. And then you were like, tell me what it's going to be. And I was like,

• 6:41Rich Roll?

  don't I didn't say that.

• 6:42Julie Piatt?

  I was like, don't kill the vibe. Don't kill the vibe. Just let it be.

• 6:45Rich Roll?

  All right.

• 6:46Julie Piatt?

  No, but evolution is at hand because you just came and said, you're open ended.

• 6:50Rich Roll?

  Well, I'm taking a cue, you know, you started, then you started to talk about it. And I was like, okay, don't like, that's fine. I just want to feel like we have

• 7:00Julie Piatt?

  that there is, that there is maybe That there is some security.

• 7:03Rich Roll?

  There's a plan. I'm always thinking about the audience.

• 7:06Julie Piatt?

  You're always in it.

• 7:07Rich Roll?

  Deliver value for everybody, things that they can think about and implement into their own lives that will be helpful. Not that you are, you know, bereft of that. That's what you do. So as I said, the floor is yours.

• 7:21Julie Piatt?

  How do you feel? How do you feel, Rich?

• 7:24Rich Roll?

  I feel nervous. I feel out of control. Like my, my impulse to, you know, control all aspects of this show is being, is being activated.

• 7:35Julie Piatt?

  But you know, we're never really in control, right?

• 7:37Rich Roll?

  I know that.

• 7:38Julie Piatt?

  Anyway, yeah. So no, it's so cool. So, I mean, I feel, I feel really good right now. I think it's a really beautiful moment after, you know, the world and all of us, I'm including the listeners in this thought and is in this idea that, you know, we've been through a lot of change. We, you know, everyone has been. It doesn't matter who you are, where you live, you know, anything. We've all been through transformation. And, but I do feel like we've come through the most constricted part of it. And I feel like we've, we've sort of emerged through the birth canal and we're still unsettled.

• 8:21Julie Piatt?

  You know, most people that I speak to talk about that they're going through a transformation, that a lot of stuff is up in the air, that they're not quite sure. It's, it's kind of like the new hasn't exactly settled in.

• 8:33Julie Piatt?

  But the extreme separation and a lot of the very violent energy that I felt during that entire experience, I think is transforming into an open field of creative possibility, of expanded opportunities. And as I always say, I believe in humanity. I believe in us. I deeply, deeply believe in the human heart. And I think we are on the precipice of new ways of living, of being, of communing, of creating, that we have never seen before. And I feel uplifted quite a bit.

• 9:13Rich Roll?

  You're feeling that in your own life, or you're witnessing that in the people that you're interacting with, or you're just sensing that there has been a vibe shift, an energy shift, across the culture that is kind of dissipating some of the tension and intensity of what we've all kind of endured over the last couple of years? Is that what you're getting at?

• 9:37Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, all of the above. I mean, all of the above, because I'm not an island. I'm living in a community, and in a society, and in a family, and in a planetary experiment. So I think it's on all levels. I'm just excited to talk about the new possibilities and the creativity and the expansion, rather than all of the problems and the issues and the suffering and all of this.

• 10:04Rich Roll?

  Yeah. So what are those possibilities?

• 10:06Julie Piatt?

  So those possibilities, I mean, they're, well, they're really endless. I mean, I feel like, I mean, this is a unique moment in planetary history. It's unlike any other. This is an opening, an expansion of our planetary realm into reclaiming our connection with nature, with divinity, with aspects of ourself that we've been separated from for eons of time. And so I think it's like, there is no predicted future. You know, life is in the moments, and we are all going to co-create this experience together through our desires, our hearts, our dreams, the things that are meaningful to us, and, you know, really

• 10:47Julie Piatt?

  all for the purpose of evolution. So our life is about evolving.

• 10:53Rich Roll?

  Well, that's a beautiful thought. I would share that sentiment, that sensibility. Like, I feel really good. I feel... In a certain creative flow, I feel a little bit lighter than I have in recent months. And there does seem to feel like there is a bit of a lifting in that kind of heaviness and intensity.

• 11:16Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, I mean, let's take our own, let's start with our own relationship. Let's just go there. Let's just go right into the vortex. We've, you know, I was on Almost 30 podcast and Krista interviewed me yesterday. Those girls, Lindsay and Krista are so amazing. And she thanked me for you, you and me, you're in my service to actually doing this podcast throughout our entire relationship and sitting down and sharing where we, where we're at. And, you know, it's been, you know, a meaningful guide for her and for many others. So while it's a little scary and a little revealing, I think it's meaningful. And it's been definitely meaningful in our lives. I was joking that, you know, we've had our most meaningful conversations

• 12:01Julie Piatt?

  on your podcast and, you know, joking about that, you know, we were sort of trying to figure out how we could have that same level of intimacy not on the podcast.

• 12:13Rich Roll?

  I've been endeavoring to do that. We've made some progress there. It would be interesting to go back and listen to some of the very early podcasts that we did together as a gauge of where our relationship was then versus now.

• 12:26Julie Piatt?

  Yeah. And I mean, I feel, this is what I'm talking about. I mean, this is the opening that I, that I'm feeling right now. And I have to say that the energy that I feel with you is one of a deepened intimacy that I haven't felt for quite a few years, maybe two years, you know, since the pandemic. So to come out and have this level of communication, of intimacy, of friendship, and of understanding that we are two souls here in this experiment on the planet, but also in an experiment of a relationship. And we're evolving through it and we're changing. We've been together over 20 years. We've raised four kids together. We've been through financial collapse and death and rebirth and expansion and success.

• 13:11Julie Piatt?

  And, you know, we've been through all different flavors of life. And so, you know, how does that feel to you as a, as a state of, of love or of partnership?

• 13:24Rich Roll?

  Well, I'm, I'm, you know, I'm deeply committed to you. And I love you profoundly. And it's also been hard amidst all of that. You can point out those high points and those low points. But we've had our clashes and we've had our challenges in how we communicate and relate to each other as two people who are very, very different. But as you are always quick to point out, there's something about those polarities that creates a certain kind of alchemy that's allowed us to co-create in many beautiful ways.

• 14:02Rich Roll?

  But it also makes it, the degree of difficulty, I think, is higher because we don't always share a worldview that's aligned. And so it's a dance to try to figure out how to relate to each other when some of those things don't always completely cohere or line up as precisely as it might in a relationship of two people who are very similar.

• 14:30Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, it's true. Yeah, definitely. And I mean, thank you for that. I love you also profoundly, deeply. And I think the one thing that we've had with each other from day one is a deep commitment. And that commitment has been really solid. So we're able to say, okay, your behavior is alien to me right now, or off-putting, or not what I would choose. But somehow, there is a bed of this soul connection where it's like, yeah, but it's you. So it's made us able to be in relationship in this extreme, very opposite experience

• 15:15Julie Piatt?

  of life of how we experience life. And yet, I think it's a wonderful example of practicing unconditional love.

• 15:25Julie Piatt?

  And of, you know, understanding and holding that your perspective, or I would say my perspective, or your perspective, or one's perspective, is not the only relevant lens in the room. And so it's been a heightened challenge. And I think we're both, you know, creators, we're artists. We have dreams and desires and we both manifest and build and express ourselves. And so because we both do that, we've been able to give each other also a lot of space. Like I was viewing your tent out my bathroom window today.

• 16:04Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 16:05Julie Piatt?

  Your luxury glamping tent that you have now. But then I looked over and I saw that my pyramid, my copper pyramid that I sleep in.

• 16:12Rich Roll?

  Yeah, what's weirder?

• 16:14Julie Piatt?

  No, but wait, but now.

• 16:16Rich Roll?

  Explain to people what that is first.

• 16:18Julie Piatt?

  Okay, but wait, but now, okay, yeah, so I sleep in a copper pyramid. It's a.

• 16:24Rich Roll?

  People think that my tent is like way off the reservation.

• 16:27Julie Piatt?

  Well, yeah, so let me finish my thought. So what I was gonna say is I was in my room and I was glancing out my window and noticing your tent, your beautiful tent. And then I was looking in my room, how my copper pyramid is now draped in this mosquito net, which it's kind of like a tent. And so just this morning, as I was looking.

• 16:49Rich Roll?

  It's literally a tent.

• 16:50Julie Piatt?

  I was like.

• 16:50Rich Roll?

  It's an indoor tent.

• 16:51Julie Piatt?

  We both have our own tents.

• 16:55Julie Piatt?

  Actually.

• 16:56Rich Roll?

  So Julie, and this is what you want. I can't remember whether it was your birthday or Christmas. You're like, I want this copper pyramid structure.

• 17:04Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 17:04Rich Roll?

  To layer over the top of my bed. And we, as a family, procured this item for you. And, you know, I would be lying if I didn't say like amongst the boys and I were like, yeah, your mom, your mom wants this copper. Pyramid for her bed.

• 17:22Julie Piatt?

  You guys are always making fun of me.

• 17:23Rich Roll?

  Spiritual artifact. But we went and got it and constructed it and it's, it's, you know, it's, what is it? It's four beams that, you know, sit so that they.

• 17:32Julie Piatt?

  It's like a three dimensional pyramid.

• 17:34Rich Roll?

  It's like this, like, you know, these, these poles, you know, that, that connect at the top to make a pyramid that sits atop your bed structure. And now it's draped with this, you know, beautiful linen mosquito net thing.

• 17:47Julie Piatt?

  It's so dope.

• 17:48Rich Roll?

  So it is pretty cool, but it's turned, you know, your sleeping layer into this kind of temple of rest.

• 17:55Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 17:55Rich Roll?

  Temple of repose, right?

• 17:57Julie Piatt?

  I love that. That's so cool.

• 17:58Rich Roll?

  And it is a tent, so it is kind of hilarious.

• 18:00Julie Piatt?

  It's kind of funny.

• 18:01Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 18:02Julie Piatt?

  And it's kind of, sort of, we could be defined by our tents, by the shape of our tents and the, the qualities, the characteristics. But the funny thing that always makes me laugh, this is one of my favorite stories about you making fun of me, because like on our, like our Netflix and stuff, like everybody has their like avatars and then they always make mine like the, the monkey, like the wise monkey, what kind of monkey is that, that likes, is like the meditating monkey?

• 18:27Rich Roll?

  Yeah, I don't know.

• 18:28Julie Piatt?

  Anyway, and it'll say like Shrimu of the galaxy or something like that. Like I'm always being made of fun of, which is really great. I mean, it's, it's wonderful, but one of my favorite jokes that you said about me, when you gave me the, the copper pyramid for my birthday, you said, I went to, I knew that's what you wanted, darling. And you said, I went to Crate and Barrel and I said, I've come for the Mahagaya healer copper sleeping pyramid. And then you go, and they didn't have it. And then he said, and then I went to Williams Sonoma and I said, I'm here for the Mahagaya copper sleeping pyramid and they didn't have it. So we were laughing quite a lot about that.

• 19:11Julie Piatt?

  But you guys know, many of you may know that I've suffered from very severe headaches for 30 years that have been a very, a very challenging part of my life. And so I acquired this pyramid.

• 19:26Julie Piatt?

  To offer me some energetic stabilization at night. Because I know that we are multi-dimensional beings and at night, we travel out of our bodies into other time spaces. And a lot of times I have a hard time getting back in my body or just managing these energies. And so it gives me some support. And in addition, I programmed it with crystals and it has geometric, you know, symbols at the top. And, you know, it changes with what I'm working on, but I quite enjoy it and highly recommend it to anyone who's resonating with us. It's a company out of Boulder. I don't even remember who it is, but you can find it. Just Google it online, Copper Pyramid. And it's very easy to get, so it's not, it's not a big deal.

• 20:09Rich Roll?

  But not available at Crate and Barrel.

• 20:11Julie Piatt?

  But not available at Williams Sonoma or other places you might be shopping for your wife.

• 20:17Rich Roll?

  So that just sort of punctuates the difference between Julie and I.

• 20:20Julie Piatt?

  So funny.

• 20:21Rich Roll?

  And it's beautiful and I celebrate this in you and I will happily, you know, support these endeavors on your behalf. And I think the struggle sometimes comes in when I'm like trying to connect with you on some of this stuff, but can't quite.

• 20:37Julie Piatt?

  Can't quite get there.

• 20:38Rich Roll?

  Can't quite, you know, I can get to the 10 yard line.

• 20:40Julie Piatt?

  That's right.

• 20:41Rich Roll?

  But, you know, I can't carry the ball across the goal, into the goalpost.

• 20:45Julie Piatt?

  But I mean, isn't it the same with you as well? Like, like I was just sort of musing about, you know, what would be like a kind of partner that you don't have in me? That would be something that you would enjoy? Like, I would never be able to like do an ultra race with you. Like, that's probably like never happening, right? And I can't go out on my bike and put my little, my little kit on with my clipity clock shoes.

• 21:15Rich Roll?

  You could.

• 21:16Julie Piatt?

  But I just, you know, it's probably not.

• 21:18Rich Roll?

  It's funny because you were in, you were in Telluride recently. And at this spa.

• 21:24Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, I was at Reset.

• 21:25Rich Roll?

  They put you in the Normatec boots and you sent me a photo of you in the Normatec boots.

• 21:28Julie Piatt?

  Well, that was the first thing I wanted to do.

• 21:30Rich Roll?

  Which I thought was the most hilarious thing. And I was like, you know, I have those.

• 21:33Julie Piatt?

  I knew you were going to be annoyed and also think it was funny. And that's why I asked them to take a picture. I'm like, take a photo right now so I can send this to Rich. But I like the Norma Tech boots. They were really awesome.

• 21:45Rich Roll?

  Yeah, they're pretty great.

• 21:46Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, and so, yeah, I was invited to reset Telluride. It's an amazing retreat experience. And Holly and Dylan, the founders, brought me out there. And they made me hike my butt off more than I ever have. And in the high altitude, it was definitely challenging. And just Telluride is one of the most beautiful, beautiful vortexes on earth. I love it dearly. And everything that they provided was just, you know, top of the line, amazing. So I did have the Norma Tech boots to help me. And foot massages and soaks and daily massages, which helped.

• 22:26Rich Roll?

  But I think to your point about the evolution of our relationship. I mean, one thing that you can't deny is that earlier in our phases of creation, you know, it was really, it was a much more integrated co-creation. Like, we did these cookbooks together. And we, you know, like, most of what we did was in partnership with each other. And over time, and particularly, you know, in the last couple of years, we've each found like our respective lanes or grooves and what nourishes us most or what we're, you know, interested in most. And as a result of that, and that's been great. Like, I feel like I'm super fulfilled doing what I'm doing right now.

• 23:09Rich Roll?

  I'm excited about the opportunities that I have and exploring those. And likewise, you've done the same. You've got your plant-based cheese company, Shrimu. You have your Water Tiger community. You have like all of these things that you're doing that are really not separate, but distinct from what I'm doing. And so that has, it hasn't necessarily moved us in different directions. It just means that what we're each doing isn't as enmeshed or as integrated as it once was. And I think there's things that are really healthy about that. But I think it also has meant That without sufficient attention and care, it's easy for us to kind of start to separate, right? Like, we're living separate lives.

• 23:54Rich Roll?

  And there's been a couple of occasions where we've both known, like, hey, look, we need to get together and communicate a little bit better, because otherwise, we're gonna wake up, and then we're gonna be, you know, not strangers to each other, but like, not as, you know, not as in intimate partnership as we could or should be or deserve to be, given like, how we feel about each other.

• 24:18Julie Piatt?

  Definitely.

• 24:19Rich Roll?

  And that's been like, the biggest kind of thing that we've experienced, and that we're kind of navigating currently.

• 24:25Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And so the big question, I think, for both of us is, and for everyone listening, because everyone that I've talked to is going through transformation in their relationship, in one way or another. The big question is, how do we want to evolve? How do you want to evolve? How do I want to evolve? What are the things that are on the deck, that are on the magic table, that are important, that are essential for your evolution, for your expansion? And the thing that I was really happy about today, or comforted about, when I was meditating on this conversation, and where we are,

• 25:08Julie Piatt?

  is that I know that you're there for me for that. And I know that I'm there for you for that. So whatever that means, I'm there till the end of this incarnation, and maybe beyond. So it's more like, how do we want to evolve? What is going on with our individual expressions that can cross, that can cross over and connect? How can we dance together, but yet be sovereign, independent individuals? And it just is a huge field of opportunity to expand the way that we view relationship,

• 25:51Julie Piatt?

  the way that we view the privilege of this human life that we're in right now, the sacredness of it, and the ability to actually, you know, I would just say, spontaneously affect an elevation of...

• 26:07Julie Piatt?

  The realm by being authentic and aligned to what is dear to us. You know, so it's not like, oh, it's this big, you know, sort of, you know, mission that, you know, that only we can do. Like, you know, I've been feeling a lot into the power of devotion and then the need for devotion as we move into these new challenges and experiences that we're going to face personally, in relationship, in community, and then planetarily. And the thing is, is that, you know, Mother Earth is a magnificent, you know,

• 26:52Julie Piatt?

  gigantic galactic star that is going through her own transformation, and we are riding on her. So the force or the One Breath or, you know, the Great One is not counting on any one of us individually to solve all these crises. And I think that devotion to that source, really feeling into that we are instruments of that One Breath that comes through each one of us in a very individuated way. That devotion keeps the hardness or the constriction or you might say ego or the, you know,

• 27:34Julie Piatt?

  this overwhelming crushing feeling of responsibility that we have to figure it all out and that we're, you know, we're worthless and we've destroyed the planet and, you know, which is all true, not that we're worthless, but, you know, we have participated in the destruction. But I guess what I'm saying is, at this point in time, devotion is a worthy magic trick, a worthy sort of workaround or Jedi move. And also being open to the fact that there will be miraculous appearances of things nobody saw coming.

• 28:19Rich Roll?

  What is the form or character of devotion for somebody who's listening or watching, who doesn't have experience with exploring that side of being human?

• 28:32Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, so I mean, it's a very relaxed, very natural state of understanding that we all are emanating from one breath. And that there is no life form that is better or worse than any other. Any intellectual ideas any of us have about superiority or importance, you know, all the earth has to do is just shake her back a little bit and we all go flying like ants in the wind. So it's the illusion of control, the illusion that we're orchestrating something. We can't really see the play from where we are in the human embodiment. And so it's really been a very beneficial practice for me

• 29:15Julie Piatt?

  and a beneficial gift for me to wake up in the morning and offer my life to that one breath. And then work and play and dance and fail and, you know, do all the things, but then at the end of the day, I just give it all back to her. So it's understanding that, you know, we're just part of this great force. And it doesn't have to be, it's not connected to an ism or a lineage or a guru or anything, but it's the core of Water Tiger, which is my spiritual mentorship group, online mentorship, is to allow people to fall in love with who they are at a natural state.

• 29:57Julie Piatt?

  And it starts with the personality, with all the things that make you unique. And then after you get through embodying that and really being there for yourself, really loving yourself, then your expression blesses all life.

• 30:13Julie Piatt?

  Because you understand there is no better or worse. There is no place for judgment of another life form and their choices. The Creator is taking care, like at some vast level. You know, and then we're, you know, there's, there's a universal accounting that is always in play. So, no one ever gets away with anything. You know, if we think that we're fooling somebody, or lying to somebody, or we're being inauthentic, you're only lying to yourself, because you'll never, you'll never get away from you. And whether it's accounted for in this lifetime, it might not be accounted for in this, in this timeline, it might be in another timeline.

• 30:57Julie Piatt?

  So, you know, we can just relax, and we can develop that devotional view, and that bava, it's a feeling, it's like a, it's like a reverence for the privilege of being in a life. And then we can just have a respect for all life, even things we don't agree with, or, you know, it's not our preference, we have preferences, definitely.

• 31:24Rich Roll?

  Everything that you just said resonates with me. The underlying principles are themes being humility, prayer meditation, ego death, you know, surrender, all of these things. And, and you know, the architecture which, through which, you know, I generally process this and, and practice these ideas is through the sort of 12 steps, right? So, you know, another way of articulating what you just said in a structure that feels like, you know, practical from my lived experience is in that, you know, in that kind of rubric, which is all about like, you know, how do you live a life of integrity and service

• 32:09Rich Roll?

  through humility and relinquishment of your self-will, turning it over, surrendering to the idea that you truly are not in control, and there are very few things that you do have control over, and trying to find a way of walking the earth in service to your fellow man and to humanity, right? And, and everything you just said is like, is, is sort of just a different version of that same thing.

• 32:37Julie Piatt?

  It's just the pyramid tent.

• 32:41Rich Roll?

  Versus the tent in the backyard.

• 32:43Julie Piatt?

  That's it. That's really all it is. I mean, it's not, you know, that's the thing is it's like, hmm, you know, are we really that different, you know, at a core level? Actually, at the ultimate level, we're not different at all. We're the same. It's the same one life that's individuated into two forms.

• 33:03Rich Roll?

  Right, but you have to override the default operating system of looping in your mind and, and the delusion that you're in control or that somehow you're, you know, you, you will be a permanent fixture here on planet Earth. Like all these kind of notions that comprise living in the modern industrialized world that are illusory, right? Like, we're only here for a short period of time. We're here to evolve, as you mentioned. We're here to, you know, serve the world in a positive way to the extent that we, you know, can leverage whatever talents we've been given and, and work ethic, et cetera,

• 33:44Rich Roll?

  to leave an imprint on the people that we love and perhaps, you know, a few other people beyond that. And it's just a moment. It's just a moment. And so much of what we concern ourselves with and worry about and, and obsess over is truly without meaning, right? And yet, we allow it to monopolize so much of our energy and time. And it's been, you know, kind of a beautiful experience doing this podcast because each person that I get to sit down with reminds me of, you know, some piece of that puzzle or equation that helps to ground me.

• 34:25Rich Roll?

  Like having Mike Fremont on, the 100-year-old guy who's just like, you know, he's been alive for 100 years and his, you know, his message and his wisdom.

• 34:36Rich Roll?

  Is serving as like, you know, this thing that I keep returning to and thinking about, which is just, you know, be of service to other people. Like, that's part of what has kept him young. Like, pursue the things that you, through which you find joy and try to give back what you learn along the way.

• 34:54Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 34:55Rich Roll?

  And yet, we overcomplicate it and we, and we suffer and we make ourselves miserable as a result of the intellectualization or over-intellectualization of so much. And in so doing, we opt out or short-circuit ourselves from participating in awe and wonder and the miraculous nature of what it is to truly be alive. Like, Pete Holmes talks about this all the time, comedian I've had on the podcast. Like, if you're just walking around, like, wearing your dockers and like, going to Starbucks and driving in your car, like, you're blind to the fact that we're on this spinning ball out in space with galaxies

• 35:40Rich Roll?

  around us and all this insanity. Like, all of it is totally insane, right? And yet, we have to be reminded of just how we, we, we annure ourselves to this. We normalize something that is just impossible for us to comprehend in order to just get through the day. But in truth, most of what we experience every day is truly miraculous and, and completely overflowing with awe and wonder if we choose to notice.

• 36:12Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And a lot of the things that excite me or that I like to share about are about opening those, those boundaries, pushing out what you think is possible, what you think, you know. So when I talk about, we are multi-dimensional beings having a simultaneous experience.

• 36:30Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 36:31Julie Piatt?

  So like, you're just like, what? You know, like, like, you're totally not thinking that we're on a spinning ball in the middle of space. You're just thinking like, why won't she put her dockers on and go to Starbucks?

• 36:42Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 36:43Julie Piatt?

  So, the thing, but the thing is-

• 36:44Rich Roll?

  But then I can watch Interstellar and I'm like, oh yeah, multi-dimensions.

• 36:48Julie Piatt?

  Right, exactly.

• 36:50Rich Roll?

  Time is bending.

• 36:51Julie Piatt?

  Right. So I think that, you know, as I've, as all of us travel on, on roads of discovery, you know, we find out the more we, the more we know and the more we mature, we find out the more we don't know, right? When you're young and you're 20, or even when you're, you know, 15, you think you know everything. You think you've figured it all out. So, you know, it's, we really don't understand that much about the play on planet Earth, about what's happened. You know, we're finding out now, you know, many of the histories that we've been taught, you know, that didn't really go down that way. And, you know, I can go all down that rabbit hole, which I won't do on this podcast. But, but one of the things, actually, I brought one of my friends from Dom and Her, this spiritual

• 37:36Julie Piatt?

  community in northern Italy. Her name is Espere De Ananas Ametista. And she is one of the original Dom and Herian members. She's been there, I think, over 35 years. And she's highly degreed. You would be very impressed with her degrees. I don't, I can't.

• 37:51Rich Roll?

  I like to be impressed by degrees.

• 37:52Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, she has lots of like doctrines and shit like that, that you care about. But she's really cool. And she wrote this book. Actually, this is a good time to shout it out. It's 33 Lives From The Book Of Time. And in this story, you know, Dom and Her has a process that are, that's in their university. And you can do it online now, thanks to COVID, because it opened up many, many things that weren't possible before. But they have a group of individuals who have been researching past lives, but I would call them simultaneous lives. They're not really past lives. And they go, they take photos of you, two photos of you, a photo that's two months old, a photo that's five years old. And this group

• 38:34Julie Piatt?

  of individuals go into the temples, which are these sacred chambers and, and really activated spiritual portals. And they retrieve the five lifetimes that are the most beneficial to what you are experimenting with in this lifetime, what you are creating in this lifetime. And so I've done a couple of those with them already. And they've been deeply meaningful and resonant to me. Like, it's like you reclaim parts of yourself that feel like a lost lover.

• 39:05Julie Piatt?

  Like, one of mine is an Argentinian male in the 18th century, who is a horseman, who wears a hat and a poncho. You guys see that I wear a hat and a poncho all the time. And it's never felt like an outfit to me. It just feels natural to me. And so, I understand these things more. Another one that I retrieved was as a priestess of the fire in an unidentified time period in Greece. So, as you know, I'm always with the fire. So, this gave me an expansion of something that I'm already connected to. In this book, Aspeti Day actually writes 33 stories of different human existences.

• 39:48Julie Piatt?

  And they're very vast and very colorful, very multicultural, some even planetarily, you know, in other planetary realms. But they're short stories, like three or four pages, that give you a little summary of a human life, or a life in another place, and what would be the characteristics of that life? And what would that person have experienced? And by reading it, it starts to open your awareness to, "Oh, I'm more than just this personality, living in this time-space." Like, and you'll know. It'll be things that are resonant to you. Like, you've always had this affinity to Italy, or you've always been connected to a certain lineage,

• 40:33Julie Piatt?

  or mountain climbing, or whatever it is. So, anyway, it's my favorite book right now, that I'm recommending, to allow that boundary to keep pushing out, you know, just as a magical thought. You know, how would you feel inside your being, in your daily life, as you go through your routine, or whatever you do in your life, if you knew there were other realities that were happening simultaneous? And how does that open your creativity, even your resilience, your power, your resolve, and your capacity to live, if you know, or if you could grab an inkling

• 41:18Julie Piatt?

  of some of that other scenario?

• 41:21Rich Roll?

  I'm trying to understand that. And what comes up for me is if there are simultaneous timelines in which I'm living a life right now beyond my perception, to me, it feels like, well, then what does it matter because I'm having these experiences in these other lives? Like, doesn't that undermine or denigrate like the preciousness of the experience that I'm having here right now?

• 41:50Julie Piatt?

  Not from my perspective.

• 41:52Rich Roll?

  If I'm off doing a podcast with somebody else right now in some other dimension?

• 41:57Julie Piatt?

  That's an interesting perspective. You really feel a constriction?

• 42:00Rich Roll?

  I don't, I don't know. Like, I'm trying, I'm trying to process it.

• 42:03Julie Piatt?

  Huh, that's interesting. See, for me, it's just like, oh, wow, look, like, look at the vastness. Look at the complexity of evolution. Look at how vast we are. Like,

• 42:14Rich Roll?

  But it's a, I think, like, my ego says, no, I'm the only one and I'm right here, right now. Like, I can't, my ego is fighting against the idea that there are different versions of me that are, that are having their own experiences that are outside the control of my ego.

• 42:29Julie Piatt?

  You just want to be the only one.

• 42:31Rich Roll?

  Yeah, right, of course.

• 42:33Julie Piatt?

  I don't.

• 42:33Rich Roll?

  Really?

• 42:34Julie Piatt?

  Not at all, like, not at all. No, no, no. And there's an open eye meditation that we do in Water Tiger and that I've done on retreats where you're sitting open eye in a mirror and you're gazing at your third eye and you endeavor to keep your eyes open, but your eyes burn and then you'll have to shut them and open them again. And this is a very transformative practice for anybody who has interest or wants to go deep. But I actually see these identities appear. They, they come in and out and many, many people see, it's not, it's not like, wow, it's just, it happens. So it's, it's very, it's very relieving to me to understand that there's a lot more going on, that it's not just about this incarnation, this life.

• 43:19Rich Roll?

  Right, I get that part, that part, I'm down with.

• 43:21Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 43:22Rich Roll?

  Like, there's a lightness that comes with just embracing our innate lack of understanding and knowing. You know, we have this sense that we pretty much have everything figured out. There's a couple of things where we're still trying to solve. We've got to get to Mars or, you know, whatever it is. But for the most part, science has pretty much, you know, come up with an equation for most things that used to confuse us. And that's really the lie, right? Because the truth is, we really know almost nothing.

• 43:55Julie Piatt?

  Nothing.

• 43:56Rich Roll?

  You know, but in order to feel secure and grounded, we have to convince ourselves that we have a grip on what's happening. Like, I'm holding on to this table and this is real.

• 44:06Julie Piatt?

  Which is complete illusion. So, you know, it's just, there's so much mystery and there's so... And, you know, this brings me to the subject of, you know, illness and COVID and what we've gone through with the virus and all this stuff. And, you know, it has been brought forth in a perspective from Falco, the founder of Dahmenher, many years ago, that the grail, and the grail, so the grail is the undefinable, the, it cannot be defined, controlled, mutated, manipulated. It's that energy that we have sought after for eons of time. And it's normally represented in the form of the chalice. But what perspective was brought forth in 2008

• 44:49Julie Piatt?

  was that that form was changing and it was going to appear in the form of illness when it contacts this realm. And so, the wonderful transformational opportunity of COVID, of virus, just like you talk about any adversity, going through a challenge. And in, you know, a song that I'm writing that's on my album, you know, the lyric is about changing poison into wine. So, I mean, that's the opportunity as alchemists, as creative beings, as architects of our own existence, is that we can take something that is at its core... Maybe an anti-life force and we can interact with it and it can transform into wine,

• 45:32Julie Piatt?

  into the greatest thing that ever contacted you. And so it's interesting, the level of transformation that's going on. I have a friend of mine who got COVID, who had a very high fever, who went into the hospital. She flatlined and this is a very grounded individual. She's the life of the party, but she was not really wanting to embrace her spirituality so much, although she comes from a family that's very connected with spirituality. And she had an NDE and she was going to the light and felt amazing and completely free.

• 46:13Julie Piatt?

  And then her loved ones called her back and she came back in her body and she called me and she's like, I don't feel the same. And I went and spent time with her and she's not the same, meaning in a beautiful way. Like she gained this, I want to say wisdom, a presence, an embodiment. She's still her with all of her characteristics and everything that I love about her, but there's more of her. And it's this feeling that I think many of us and many people that I spoke to have emerged from this two years and this experience, more present, more powerful.

• 46:58Julie Piatt?

  And it was scary for all of us, like, you know, and some of us took transition. So we had our expansion come through, dropping the body and moving beyond this realm. But it's a very, this is what I'm talking to you about of the profound nature of this moment. It's not like any other time. It's like we can feel it, it can be felt. So it's a magical, mystical time.

• 47:27Julie Piatt?

  If we're open to receive the signs from nature, you know, appearances of animals, appearances of messages. And in my experience, teaching on retreat and mentoring in spiritual matters, humans are spiritual beings. It's not the other way around. It's not like you have to dig deep, you know? Every one of us has had that mystical experience in some way and some form. And I just, I think it's a profound, magical opportunity. And any of us that are in a body right now, it is like the best time of our lives.

• 48:11Julie Piatt?

  And probably why we incarnated is for this time right now.

• 48:18Rich Roll?

  To do what?

• 48:20Julie Piatt?

  Whatever is in your heart. So it doesn't matter if you are a gardener. You don't have to do something, you know, you don't have to affect lots of people. It's just what's authentic to you. What is your authentic life print? And what is that? What is your way of expressing in the world? That thing that only you can do in the entire omniverse.

• 48:45Rich Roll?

  Mm-hmm. I think as we emerge out of this period, a lot of people have been engaged in a deep self-reflection about how they've spent their time and how they want to spend their time going forward, right? It was this moment of forced repose where, because everyone was home all of a sudden and we were kind of compelled to look in the mirror in a way that we generally don't because we're busy. I think a lot of people took stock of like, why have I been, you know, in this job or doing this thing? And I've seen a lot of people make huge changes in their lives. But now, as the world has started to open back up,

• 49:27Rich Roll?

  it's like, oh, recession, inflation, political division. Like, there's a lot of noise out there that is fear-inducing. And there's good reason for that. And, you know, chances are, we are going into some kind of economic challenges at the moment that I think promotes a restriction of whatever. Sense of expansion might be percolating up in people. So maybe it would be good to talk a little bit about how to navigate that. And if you are feeling that sense of expansion or change or an impulse to more deeply explore what might be authentic to you and how to nurture that and bring it to life

• 50:12Rich Roll?

  and be more fully expressed and more authentic in how you're pursuing your life. Like, what are some strategies or practices or tools that you could impart to that person?

• 50:24Julie Piatt?

  Beautiful. Well, I mean, the heart will never fail you. And that's been my experience. So it doesn't mean that you're going to have the trajectory that you think that you're going to have in your mind or in, you know, whatever you thought your life was going to be. But I would say that this podcast is living proof and our journey, the heart will not leave you. It will not fail you.

• 50:53Rich Roll?

  This is a manifestation of a heart-centered impulse. Like, I didn't whiteboard, like, oh, I'm gonna have this podcast and it's gonna be this thing. There's nothing about this that was predictable in any way, shape, or form. It was the result of letting go more than self-will. Like, it was like, well, what are the possibilities? Like, and trying different things and not holding on to anything too tightly. And really just following my curiosity and what inspired me and more deeply connecting with my intuition and my sense of who I wanted to be in the world

• 51:37Rich Roll?

  in a very non-defined, kind of ephemeral way. But learning to tune into that and to listen to that and pay attention to that and take action on, you know, those impulses is what created this. It's not because I sat down and had a goal and said, "This is what I'm doing." It was the antithesis of all of that.

• 52:01Julie Piatt?

  Yes, it was all of that.

• 52:03Rich Roll?

  And you're the one who's always reminding me of that when I start to get, you know, too up in my head about stuff.

• 52:11Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, well, I mean, it was an entire spiritual ritual that actually activated this entire timeline. And it was based on no sensibility whatsoever, except my unwavering extreme faith that our heart would not let us down. And I knew that I had to support you to live and experience your heart's deepest desires. And so we were making decisions that made no intellectual sense whatsoever. You know, everybody knows the story, you know, with four kids and financial collapse and, you know, I had, you know, people pulling me aside, you know, telling me they were sorry that I was so mistreated by you. You

• 52:53Julie Piatt?

  know, like, just a whole lot of stuff. But, you know, we did a lot of ritual. I did a lot of ritual. I did a lot of sessions. I did a lot of fires. I did a lot of ceremony. I was doing all this stuff that you find so strange, all that time. But because we were so raw and we were so stripped bare, you were able to receive it. And then what happens when things click in and then it's working in a modern society way, you know, you have amnesia.

• 53:25Rich Roll?

  Snapback.

• 53:25Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, suddenly you're like, whoa, you're a weirdo, you know, or that's way out there. I can't get with that. I'm just like, dude, like, we've been doing this from day one. I mean, and you know it at your core because you were at our wedding, you were the other party in our wedding, that was full of like gospel singers and channelers and African wedding singers and a snake wrangler. And, you know, I mean, it was like the spiritual gospel concert of the of the decade, for sure. Yeah, so the heart doesn't lie. Now, serving the heart doesn't mean that you get to have health insurance. Serving the heart doesn't mean that you get to have your 401k and everything lined up the way that you want it to.

• 54:08Julie Piatt?

  And you know, Rich and I, when we were on our knees and we just hadn't gotten the relief and things hadn't broken through, even though we had been repeatedly serving our hearts and going through this experience, you know, I didn't have a bank account for four years. Like, I mean, there was like some major shit that happened. Like, if I did a job for somebody- It was total insanity for a long time. I'd have to ask somebody. I just got to be really good at communicating. I'd just be like, "Hey, you know, I'm gonna need to be paid in cash." And they were just, like, there would be a moment and I would just sort of joke through it and then they would be like, "Oh, okay, I gotcha. You know, now I, now I get it." But, so what I'm saying is, we are going through a planetary transformation and that means that a lot of these systems that have not been serving our hearts, we'll just say

• 54:52Julie Piatt?

  our hearts, are going to transform and they need to transform. You know, we need to stop starving our humanity on the planet. We need to stop destroying our planet. Like, there's many, many things, I'm not going to get into all of them, but the point is, is that at this point, if you were gonna make a list of all the crises, it's overwhelming. Like, how are, how are you going to mastermind the resolution of all of these issues? Of war, of pedophilia, of, you know, misogyny against women, of murder, of, you know, everything that we're dealing with, planetary destruction. I mean, it's overwhelming. So again, the key is inside the heart and it's in each one of us.

• 55:32Julie Piatt?

  Because if we can activate what that natural expression is, that is so beautiful, so divine, so profound, and it might not be seen by anyone, it's not about being famous or having like a big reach, it's about doing what is authentic and reminding ourselves that art, creating art and music and dance with sacred intention is the greatest gift we can give humanity. And instead, we've been reversed to think that you're, you can only be an artist if you're in a certain circle, or if your art sells for a certain amount of money, or if you're, you know, one of the greats. That's not true.

• 56:13Julie Piatt?

  Because art is a, is a language and a communication and poetry and music that is invisible to anti-life forces. It actually gets through, it makes a connection. So- The biggest thing we have to do is live in resonance with our heart. And it comes back to that question, how do you want to evolve? And what are you hiding? What are we still hiding from ourselves? And if we can refine that through many different ways, I will always go back to yoga. Oh bless the yogis of our civilization of many, many eons of time.

• 56:54Julie Piatt?

  I mean, the yoga practices literally are shelter from the storm. They are breathing practices. Many people are doing them in a modern way and they have breathing workshops. Those are all yogi techniques. So yoga practice, yoga breathing, this is what cultivates the presence, the awareness of the one that is breathing us. And in the end, we only have our consciousness. You have your consciousness. No one can ever take that from you. And we aren't in control of a lot of the other things that happen. So it's like, my prayer is for the people in Pakistan in these extreme floods, that when they transition, that the suffering is short.

• 57:39Julie Piatt?

  So short, that their creator, that their loved ones, that their guides are there to catch them. And that they've transitioned. You know, I don't want anyone to suffer. That is not, you know, it's not even reconcilable. Like how we would choose these human lives to come in here to face so much of what we face. And you know, we're in a very privileged, you know, life, of course. But you know, life will visit you wherever you are. If you have money, it will come in the form of disease. You know, it'll come in the form of divorce. It will come to remind you who you are.

• 58:21Julie Piatt?

  And if you're in a slumber and you're, you know, in the dockers, I guess. Not that we have anything against dockers.

• 58:28Rich Roll?

  Dockers are fine.

• 58:28Julie Piatt?

  But we don't wear dockers. No, so, you know, if you're in that illusion, you know, life will visit you. No one is immune. You didn't take a body to be immune and go, everything's great, super duper. It's fantastic, forever.

• 58:42Rich Roll?

  Right, I mean, everybody gets their wake up call in one form or another. And the question then becomes, are you present enough to heed that wake up call?

• 58:53Rich Roll?

  When you're visited with it, right? And if you choose to continue to ignore those gentle knocks and protect that thing that you're hiding from yourself or from other people, the knock just starts to get a little bit louder. It'll come again and it will persist until it knocks you on your ass and you have no other option other than to reckon with it. And so my sense is that the more present and aware that you can be through these practices, breathwork, yoga, meditation, mindfulness, physical exercise, all of these things that we talk about here to pursue self-care,

• 59:37Rich Roll?

  then the better condition you're in to heed that call when it's knocking gently. You can, I think, prevent that heavy call by heeding it early on. It's just that we're sort of wired to only pay attention when we're in, and I'm speaking for myself, when I'm in so much pain that I can't see any other avenue. There is no trapdoor exit and I'm compelled to confront the thing that I've been hiding from or really don't want to reckon with.

• 1:00:13Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And many people. And we have to say that it also could just come in the form of a kiss. You could just have a kiss and get it all as well. So it doesn't always have to come in that way. But yeah, I mean, I think this is the opportunity and we're all creating it together. And I had a cooking video on Shrimu recently where I was talking about community is the new currency. It's really about your community. That is where the wealth is, the richness is. And the rest of it, who knows? We're gonna have to walk through it. I ran into a friend of mine. Recently, and he said, you know, Julie, we only have two years left before we run

• 1:00:56Julie Piatt?

  out of water. And I was like, dude, like, we got to Jedi this. Like, you got to change your perspective. We're going to have to quantum this. There's going to have to be a miraculous appearance. Like, there's, you know, like, there has to be an evolution, you know, in some way. And it's not all riding on, you know, that one fact, or, and I don't know where he got that fact. But the point is, is, is, yes, we need to become conscious of what we're doing, you know, both individually and as a society. And at this point, of this sort of level of climactic crisis in every area, the heart will never fail you. And

• 1:01:37Julie Piatt?

  that, that may mean that, you know, I die in some, you know, some scenario, cancel that, because I'm not planning on it. But, you know, it's not about hanging on to any existence, but it's about being devoted and understanding that you are an eternal life form. And that the play is much bigger than what we see with our science. You know, there's a lot more going on.

• 1:02:06Rich Roll?

  With that, I think we should take a quick break and think about that, ponder it. And we'll be back with some recipes that you're going to share with us.

• 1:02:18Julie Piatt?

  Yay.

• 1:02:19Rich Roll?

  Cool.

• 1:02:19Julie Piatt?

  All right, cool.

• 1:02:27Rich Roll?

  And here we are. We've got this unbelievable layout of shrimu infused delicacies. Walk us through what we're looking at right now.

• 1:02:37Julie Piatt?

  Shrimu on the plate, yeah. Yeah. So one of the things that is so extraordinary about shrimu is it really fits that gap when you don't know what to eat.

• 1:02:48Julie Piatt?

  Because it's crafted with this amazing flavor and this high intention and energy, and it's just really a beautiful, beautiful food, it elevates whatever else you're creating in your kitchen. So I just wanted to present for the holidays, some recipes that we have on our site. And this is shrimu on the plate. So actually taking shrimu from the cheese board and incorporating it into recipes that you love. One of our favorites is this mushroom risotto. And it's extremely easy to make. You can make the risotto with even no oil.

• 1:03:30Julie Piatt?

  And at the very end, you finish it by adding in some of our elder flavor or our bertie flavor. And it just really elevates the risotto into a five star plate.

• 1:03:43Rich Roll?

  So we should point out for anybody who's brand new, or maybe this is the first

• 1:03:47Julie Piatt?

  What is shrimu?

• 1:03:48Rich Roll?

  Yeah, let me explain. What it is, shrimu is your not cheese brand. It's your plant-based artisanal wheels of cheese. It's a direct to consumer model based on a subscription box plan that you have. And I'll let you describe it. But from my perspective, you are somebody who's been in the kitchen laboratory for like, I don't know, eight years at this point, trying to figure out how to craft the next level of plant-based cheese. My experience with vegan cheeses is that none of them are really good. Some of them are tolerable. They all kind of taste the same. Most of them have a lot of preservatives

• 1:04:31Rich Roll?

  and different types of ingredients in them that don't do well with my digestion or my energy levels. You have elevated this art form to a whole new place because what you've created, it really are like these incredibly tasty and distinctive flavors of artisanal cheeses. Think fine European cheeses that you would have with your with your fine wine. And you get a sense of what this is, but all dairy free. And all of these flavors do taste different from the other ones. That's the other thing with a lot of plant-based cheeses. Like, no matter what flavor it says on the label, it all kind of tastes pretty much the same. That is not the case here.

• 1:05:15Rich Roll?

  So I just wanted to celebrate what you've accomplished and achieved, because I think you're pushing the outer envelope of what's possible in this world. And this creation, which goes back to what we were talking about, this heart-centered, you know, kind of expression. That's truly what this is, and it's a really beautiful offering. And it's lovely to see all of this out here today. So again, back to the risotto, or whatever it is that you want to say about Shrimu before we get into the specific recipes.

• 1:05:44Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, thank you so much. So, um, yeah, it is, uh, it is pure. It is crafted with intention. We actually don't touch the cheese until we've done a meditation breathing practice. And it really is just whole food ingredients. So there's no fillers. There's no gooey creepy, like, I don't know what I'm eating, sort of sensation. And I call it the next evolution of cheese, because it rivals dairy cheese. So I didn't create something that is asking you to give up your love of cheese. I simply made it better. And I'm very, uh, very happy to say, after, you know, hundreds, nearing thousands of customer reviews,

• 1:06:26Julie Piatt?

  it's just a pretty unanimous review of the product.

• 1:06:30Rich Roll?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:31Julie Piatt?

  So they're not all wheels. Um, we have a new offering called Awe and Wonder, which are, um, jars. One is, uh, smoked almond cheddar, which is called Bonfire. And that is an amazing spread on toasties. You can put it in tacos. You can make meatless meatballs and pasta. And it has this just really delicious, satisfying flavor to it. And it's a, it's a great thing when you don't know what to eat. I know when I became plant-based, the thing that I used to eat when I didn't know what to eat was usually eggs. You know, some sort of scrambled eggs, some sort of, you know, egg thing. And, um, Shrimu is so packed with protein.

• 1:07:16Julie Piatt?

  It's like high-density power food that's made with pure ingredients and sacred intention. And it really, really, we say, it floats through your digestive tract like a prayer. So I'm highly sensitive to nuts. If I eat a handful of nuts, I'm going to have a stomach ache immediately. I have never had any digestive issues with Shremu. I never feel like I've eaten too much. It literally, your body can really, really digest it and get the nutrients that you need from it. While providing your taste buds with a beautiful experience of just delicious food.

• 1:07:56Rich Roll?

  If I may, interject quickly, I think another kind of beautiful aspect of this is that, yes, this is plant-based cheese. We're plant-based people. This is an offering for the plant-based community, but you don't have to be plant-based. You can be lactose intolerant, or on a low carb diet, or even on a keto diet. Like this kind of fires on all cylinders for everybody. And I think no matter what diet you're on, most healthy diets recommend avoiding dairy or ditching dairy altogether. And there are a lot of people that really struggle with that because dairy is in almost everything that we eat.

• 1:08:35Rich Roll?

  And there's something about dairy and cheese specifically that makes it very hard to quit, right? Like I know when I was going plant-based, removing dairy from my diet was much more difficult than ditching the meat. Like I just crave that cheese. And I know a part of your creation is inspired by that notion of like so many people love their cheese. If I can figure out a way to serve that in a healthier way, that would be, you know, a beautiful offering. And you've done that.

• 1:09:05Julie Piatt?

  Definitely. Thank you. Thank you for that. Yeah, I say Shremu is universal. So it's plant-based, it's paleo, it's dairy-free, gluten-free. And it's raw, actually, because it's dehydrated under, at like 92 degrees. So it's an amazing product. We are arms open wide inviting anyone in to experience Shremu. It's largely a subscription product offering, and we have many, many different varieties now. We have most exciting or exciting. We have an eternal box that has our three new four-ounce wheel flavors, which are everything, which is reminiscent of an everything bagel, fire, which is reminiscent of pepper jack.

• 1:09:51Julie Piatt?

  And Imagine, which is this beautiful blue color that you see on the top there. That is made with butterfly pea powder. So this box is under $50, so it's $48. But we have many, many other varieties. And also, don't miss out on the Fresh Mozzarella Cloud 9, which is in our On Wonder box. You can pair it with the Bonfire, the smoked almond cheddar, or you can specify two mozzarellas or two smoked almond cheddars. So there's more customization now. In a couple of the boxes, you can vary the wheels a bit. But we have 10 flavors to choose from. And here we have in this salad is a blue cheese dressing

• 1:10:35Julie Piatt?

  that you can make with the Spire flavor. You can also just garnish it with the wedges. And then again, the risotto has the birdie or elder in it. And you just make risotto, you know, we have the recipe on the website, but in the same manner that you would make it. And then at the end, you just fold in the shrimu and it literally takes it to a five-star dish.

• 1:11:00Rich Roll?

  Right, you can make like almost an Alfredo sauce.

• 1:11:03Julie Piatt?

  You can, that's right. Yeah, the fettuccine Alfredo is insane as well with any kind of pasta that you like. And then again, just the toasties. I mean, it's so satiating. And so many times I come home and I'm not sure what to eat. And, you know, I'll make sort of like an open baguette or, you know, some version of a toastie with really any of the flavors. The gold flavor on the cheese board is called Gold Alchemy. And it's one of this beautiful synergy of elements which create something that are more than the sum of the ingredients. So it really sort of hearkens to a ham, cheese, and mustard sandwich. So it's very nourishing, nurturing, it's nostalgic. And it's been an amazing experience so far.

• 1:11:48Julie Piatt?

  And not only are we devoted to our community of subscribers, community is the most important thing to us. So we're very limited in wholesale right now. We're working out some meal planning partnerships that I'm not going to speak about right now, but I can in the future. And really building a community within Shremu. So, one of the amazing things that are on the horizon is we're moving our production to the vertical community of Crosstown Concourse in Memphis, Tennessee. I spoke about it on a previous podcast.

• 1:12:22Rich Roll?

  Yeah, we talked about that the last time.

• 1:12:23Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, but it's just, it's an extraordinary opportunity to actually create community, be a part of a community. And for us, it's about really developing meaningful relationships. So, this is much more than a product in a box. It is an offering, a devotional offering for life, knowing that each individual has beauty within them to express and share, and we just want to be a part of all of it.

• 1:12:51Rich Roll?

  Yeah, beautiful. And it's cool that you have all of these recipes. So, if you go to shremu.com, you can find all these recipes. Also, if you're a member or a subscriber to our Plant Power Meal Planner, there's tons of recipes that are Shremu infused there as well. And for people that are looking for more diversity in their plant-based recipe, you know, Rolodex, you know, you should check out the Meal Planner, because I think there's thousands of recipes that you can customize based upon your preferences.

• 1:13:21Julie Piatt?

  Definitely, definitely. And also, on the Meal Planner, there's cheese recipes if you, you know, live international and you can't get Shremu.

• 1:13:30Rich Roll?

  Right, because that's the big thing, shipping.

• 1:13:32Julie Piatt?

  Right, exactly.

• 1:13:33Rich Roll?

  As soon as we start talking about this, why don't you ship here? Why don't you ship there?

• 1:13:37Julie Piatt?

  Well, I know, and we're working on it.

• 1:13:38Rich Roll?

  Shipping is like the whole game. It's so hard to solve that puzzle.

• 1:13:41Julie Piatt?

  But it's a, you know, I'm still working on Europe expansion, so I haven't forgotten, but we're moving there. But also, just so you guys know, I wrote a cookbook called This Cheese is Nuts, which is, well, Matthew Kenny called it the most developed resource on plant-based cheese. So, I've already created, you know, 70 recipes for you guys in there if you want to try to make cheese on your own.

• 1:14:06Rich Roll?

  You can create your version of Shremu.

• 1:14:08Julie Piatt?

  Right, of course, it's not...

• 1:14:09Rich Roll?

  A lot of people, "Well, why can't I get it?" Well, I'll get the book and you can make it yourself.

• 1:14:12Julie Piatt?

  It's not exactly...

• 1:14:13Rich Roll?

  But then people are like, "Yeah, but I don't want to make it myself. Can't you just make it?" Get it, I'll buy it, which is why this company exists, right?

• 1:14:19Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:19Rich Roll?

  So it's a

• 1:14:20Julie Piatt?

  Well, we're growing and

• 1:14:21Rich Roll?

  Vegan chicken and the egg kind of situation.

• 1:14:24Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, but we're growing and we're expanding and yeah, we have intention to go far and wide. So, so I just want to mention that for your listeners, we're going to give you a code, of course. We usually, we have sold out the last two years in Thanksgiving and Christmas. So it's, it's, we do about 60% of our business in the last three months of the year. So get your orders in early. If you're going to order for Thanksgiving, you have to order by November 13th, because this is a perishable product and we ship it, you know, right before. And then for December, if you order, you got to order by December 11th, I think, if you want it in time for that Christmas date.

• 1:15:05Rich Roll?

  So what's the code?

• 1:15:06Julie Piatt?

  The code is going to be RRP18. And that gives you 18% off of any, any subscription, any box, anything you want.

• 1:15:15Rich Roll?

  So S R I M U dot com.

• 1:15:17Julie Piatt?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:15:18Rich Roll?

  And then slash RRP18, or you enter the code?

• 1:15:22Julie Piatt?

  You just enter the code at checkout, RRP18.

• 1:15:25Rich Roll?

  All right, great.

• 1:15:26Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:15:26Rich Roll?

  Awesome. So on the subject of food holidays, there's two things that I want to talk to you about. One is preparing ourselves for the holidays. Holidays are upon us. This episode's going to go up in mid-October. People are starting to think about that phase of the year, where we're going to be engaging with relatives and loved ones and things become social as the days become longer and the perilous nature of time shared with people we care about and buttons getting pushed and things going sideways and all the kind of treachery that is Potential during this time of year. And then second to that, the idea of, and we kind of talked about it before the break,

• 1:16:12Rich Roll?

  this idea of sacred commerce or spirituality in business. Like you're an entrepreneur, you're also this spiritual being. How do you, as a leader and as a builder, infuse this commercial enterprise with the sensibility and the energy that is so precious to you and is part and parcel of like who you are? And what can we learn about how to participate in the capitalist economy, but do it from perhaps a higher perspective as leaders, as consumers, as employees, et cetera?

• 1:16:51Julie Piatt?

  Which one should I start with?

• 1:16:52Rich Roll?

  What do you want to start with?

• 1:16:53Julie Piatt?

  I'll start with the sacred commerce. Yeah, thanks for asking that question. So in my experience, it all comes down to alignment. So again, going back to the awareness that each of us were created in a very specific way for a specific, maybe way of expressing ourselves. And so through the yoga and meditation and self-discovery and seeking and they could say about me, "You left no rock unturned." I've always been an entrepreneur. I've had an entrepreneurial view. I was not as successful as I wanted to be early in my years. And I thought I was going to have realized everything by the time I was 30.

• 1:17:33Julie Piatt?

  And that's been a very difficult sort of game of having to have patience and understanding that I see a much bigger picture, but oftentimes the current timeline doesn't fold into what that picture is, what my personality is considering. But for me, it was all a very organic process. And going back to our choice to serve our hearts, it was you who brought food sort of foremost into the picture because I was raised on game meat in Alaska. My mom was, I love my mom, and she was just not a good cook at all. Like food was not prepared well in our house growing up. And I grew up in Alaska, there were hardly any vegetables in the long winters.

• 1:18:18Rich Roll?

  Except in the summers, you would get these gigantic. Versions of what we're used to, right?

• 1:18:23Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, they have these like super uber gigantic carrots and things in the summer because the sun never sets. So it's just amplifying this kind of crazy Alice in Wonderland vegetable crop. But you know, that basically is, you know, food was not a thing for me. I've always been an in person, so I never sort of dieted for weight. And then later in my years, I got to have an experience of healing myself, of a cyst in my neck through Ayurveda. I decided not to have surgery and to heal it myself. And I was successful in that after a two-year process. But really, I started cooking to feed you because I wanted

• 1:19:04Julie Piatt?

  to love you, because I wanted to support you in your racing and in Ultraman. And it was you who went vegan. I was Ayurvedic. So I was eating predominantly plant-based, but also some milk and some ghee, you know, in medicinal ways. And that was very supportive to my body and is a science and a lineage that I incorporate into my life today a lot. But I started for you. I was like, he's into it. He's really trying to create something. So I started just making recipes and it was very organic because it wasn't, it was just from that center point of I could really help him. I could really, I could really

• 1:19:49Julie Piatt?

  help him. I could really love him and I could support him in realizing one of your dreams. And so every time you came back from training, there was this huge spread. So likewise, as we continued down the journey and then I would come to create almost, I don't know, 400 plant-based recipes and publish three cookbooks that were all my recipes. And then I had just realized that what I was creating with this plant-based cheese was extraordinary. It far surpassed what I thought was possible. And I started to get very interested in it and very intrigued by it. And when my European friends started freaking out over the product, I started to realize that I had really hit on something.

• 1:20:34Julie Piatt?

  And if I am good at anything, I'm good at simplifying things. So I was never one that felt like I had to Go to a school or learn a technique to be able to do something. I approach it through a very organic experience of interacting with whatever the medium is.

• 1:20:54Rich Roll?

  What's sort of a beginner's mind approach? Like, you're not bogged down by some tradition created by French laundry. Like, you can go into it without all of that and innovate, you know, from a fresh perspective.

• 1:21:08Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And, you know, everything for me, you know, I like to experience life as art. So it's just another form of art. I'm using the medium of food and to express. But I had been a fashion designer earlier in my life. In 1996, I closed a garment company that I'd had for, I don't know, six years. And I just worked myself until my fingers bled and, you know, gave birth to the two boys during that time. And it was really a heartbreak when I had to close that company because of what I had put into it. And so I had to get over that sort of PTSD that I had from, you know, wanting to be an entrepreneur

• 1:21:49Julie Piatt?

  and also being in fashion and seeing, you know, the level of waste and just, you know, the way that that industry and the way that it's created just sort of rapes and pillages everything that it touches. So I thought long and hard about it. I took my time. But when I created it, I created it from a very authentic place. So it means I didn't go out and look at other cheese brands and see what they were doing. I don't consider what others are doing. I try to go in as much as I can. And because of that, I'm sitting here with a branding that is extremely unique, a name that is very unique. So Shri Moo is Divine Cow, right? It's Sri Moo. I like M U better than M O O.

• 1:22:32Julie Piatt?

  And it's also a little nod to my spiritual name, Shrimati, which I'm Shrimati on Instagram and in the music that I create. So Shri Moo, I figured no one else would have that name.

• 1:22:42Rich Roll?

  Definitely not.

• 1:22:43Julie Piatt?

  No one else would have that.

• 1:22:44Rich Roll?

  A lot of competition for.

• 1:22:45Julie Piatt?

  Not a lot of competition for Shri Moo.

• 1:22:47Rich Roll?

  The company umbrella.

• 1:22:49Julie Piatt?

  But again, this is the authenticity, right? That we each have something that is within us. And I named it Devotional Offerings for Life. And if you look at Ohara's branding that he created for the brand, the braiding, which creates a modern hieroglyph, says Devotional Offerings for Life. After that, I had a Vedic chart reading. I've had many, but I had never touched on this point before. And my astrologer pointed out that my birth chart, the symbol of my natal birth chart in Vedic terms, is connected to a cow's udder and a devotional flower, those two things. So I had named it devotional offering for life, not even understanding

• 1:23:32Julie Piatt?

  in my personality just how profound that is for me. So then, fast forward, due to the blessings of the people that listen to this podcast, and that a lot of people had eaten my cheese at events and on retreats, and had seen it on Instagram, and when I announced the launch, I was blessed enough to receive, you know, over 400 orders before I had even gotten the factory and started it. So it's because of you guys that you helped launch me into that, into the space. But anyway, did so very successfully, and you know, just the product is stable, it's consistent, it's delicious, it's like, and

• 1:24:12Julie Piatt?

  because of the podcast, because of we, because we'd been sharing for so many years, my team found me through the podcast. So, in the true sense of the word, Shrim is a mission. It is a mission of Global Awakening, and the people that work with me are aligned with me at that level. So it's different than any other business or company that I've been involved in, because they know me, and they know that I mean it, and they share this alignment with me in different ways. So the big thing, though, for me, was when I went to raise money, I spent quite a bit of time, you know, over a year, exploring plant-based venture, you know, structures and different opportunities with, you know,

• 1:24:56Julie Piatt?

  partners, and, you know, thinking, again, always that someone else knows how to do it better than you do. You know, when we're young in business, or when we're going, I think a part of us really wants that partner, that is that magician that's figured it all out.

• 1:25:09Rich Roll?

  Right. Oh, that person will validate it. That person can put their stamp of approval on it. They know how to do this. I need that person to guide me. And yeah, we all need guidance. I think the thing is the, I mean, look, this is all set against the backdrop of an explosion in interest in plant-based foods and meat and dairy analogues. And with that, there's a whole kind of sub-economy around financing these startup ventures where founders are developing these products of which you are one, right? So it puts you in this position where suddenly you're on the receiving end of a lot of attention from people who want to give you money. And then it becomes a

• 1:25:53Rich Roll?

  challenge of discernment, like, because you don't, it's not about just raising money. It's like, who are the people that I'm aligning with? Are they in alignment with me in terms of the mission? What is the cost that I'm incurring by accepting outside investment? And who are the people that, you know, I could partner with who can be those guideposts or those mentor, you know, personalities, but not at the cost of, you know, sort of the quick path towards an exit in that traditional sense of like, how this kind of startup thing works for a lot of people?

• 1:26:31Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And I mean, I was excited because I'm always the one that makes the thing that's not scalable, that's completely ridiculous. Like, oh, that's beautiful, but that, and it makes no sense. So, you know, in my fashion company, I was designing 36-piece jackets, you know, with 36 pattern pieces and, you know, Austrian crystal buttons. And, you know, it was very complicated and very hard to scale and very, you know, just very, very intense. And, and so finally, I'm in, I'm in the space. And also, you know, I have an intention to build a very profoundly expansive company. Like, I'm going all the way. Like, I'm not, you know, here to do farmers markets and just, you know, impress my friends. Like, this is truly a global mission of awakening through each individual

• 1:27:16Julie Piatt?

  that experiences the product and feels themselves and remembers who they are and finds a vibration that supports them in expanding, as well as, you know, the ultimate sort of why of Shrimu, which is to support the indigenous of the planet and fund, you know, an expansion in Dhammeha of their already existing temples, which is an indigenous sort of museum that is on the deck. So, but getting back to, I was taking these Different meetings with different venture people and different people in the space. And I heard this, I didn't hear it, it wasn't a voice, but I got this telepathic question that was dropped into me as I was walking through our living room.

• 1:27:59Julie Piatt?

  And it was, "Why are you not applying the same spirituality, originality, and creativity to the financial raise of Shreemoo as you did to the formulation of the product?" And I was kind of like, "Yeah, good question, why am I not?" And it was because I was immature, because I hadn't gone into those venture meetings before. I had a lot to learn, I had growing to do. But after I sussed it all out, I realized they're just making it all up. It's all a creative story that they spin and they make up. So, why am I letting another person make up my story when I'm creating the story of Shreemoo? So, I went back to what I know, went back to the fire, went back to my spiritual ritual,

• 1:28:41Julie Piatt?

  and I created a guardian offering inviting humanitarians in to support me in this mission of creating community, of truly shifting the world, of honoring our animals and giving some love and honoring to these beings that we've been brutalizing, you know, pretty radically for a while. And also honoring the earth and our children and ourselves. And so, I did this crazy thing, and I kind of knew from that exploration that about 3.3 was what I wanted to raise, that would allow me to scale, you know, into about 30 million in volume. And then I established my valuation at 13 million.

• 1:29:25Julie Piatt?

  And lead investor, Tom Lawrence, beautiful Tom Lawrence, came in and invested. And he and his wife Ellie have been an amazing support to me and champions for me. And they're the ones who live part-time in Memphis. And so, we were sitting around talking in Telluride one day, and you know, we were talking about the challenges with shipping, and suddenly it became clear that we should check Memphis out. So we went to Memphis and they rolled out the red carpet and took care of me. I've told this story before, but so Crosstown Concourse is where we are going to be. It's going to be Shreemoo's home and Staley and Sabine, who are the investors who recreated

• 1:30:08Julie Piatt?

  Crosstown Concourse, have welcomed us and worked with us to create, you know, a deal that is mutually beneficial and, you know, we're just so excited to go in there and to expand creating the community. So When is the move scheduled to take place? Well, we're scheduled to have construction done February, but so maybe February, March, we're thinking, but we're already working with teams at FedEx. We've cut our shipping costs by 50%. You know, we're getting five times the space for less than the amount of money that I pay here for 750 feet. California, so insane. But there's many, many opportunities, but for me, and you know, I've been, you

• 1:30:51Julie Piatt?

  know, sort of reviewing like what is the core mission of Shreemoo and what is important to us. And, you know, the truth of the matter is it's the community, it's the connection, it's the messaging. So, you know, Shreemoo is a beauty brand. There will be many other things that come up, you know, after, after the cheese, more food products, more skincare products, supplements, this type of stuff. But we care about the community and the most exciting thing for me is to go to Memphis and co-create something that creates meaning in people's lives on every level. You know, the people that make it, the people that we co-create it with, our vendors and our suppliers, and also our beloved subscription community.

• 1:31:33Julie Piatt?

  So we're, you know, we're choosing the wholesale outlets very selectively, but for us, it really is about the community.

• 1:31:44Rich Roll?

  It reminds me of that video that I shared with you the other day of Alex Honnold and the Honnold Foundation collaborating with Memphis Rocks to put solar on top of that facility to make it solar powered, which is pretty cool. And there's a analogous version of that story in the potential of Shrimu to be integrated in the Memphis community and to impact that community and to basically celebrate that community and do some powerful storytelling around it.

• 1:32:18Julie Piatt?

  Definitely. And we've already been meeting with some of the kids, they're not really kids, they're just younger than I am, at Memphis Rocks and also Tom Shadieak. And we're very keen to collaborate with them. To be able to provide a life stream of experience and to sort of co-create and merge with the community and create something more expansive for everyone is very exciting to me, as is exploring even new sort of structures of what a new business looks like. Like, what is the future of business?

• 1:32:59Julie Piatt?

  And so far, I mean, to your point of looking for somebody outside of you that has a title or even experience where you think that they're going to know everything, problems and solutions and opportunities are found in the moment by the people that are there, that are working with the product, that are smart, intelligent, heartfelt, connected, devoted. This is my team, all the way down to the person who's washing dishes. We had a company lunch at Cafe Gratitude downtown recently, and I was just almost in tears with gratitude at the way they receive me, the way they love me, the way they work

• 1:33:42Julie Piatt?

  for the company, and the way that they're getting meaning in their life from being connected with this new potential, this new experiment. And so, it has this deep meaning. And for me, it really just is all about... That that connection. If I could snap my fingers now and, you know, and have it like be in every wholesaler, you know, in the US without that community connection, that would not be my choice.

• 1:34:16Rich Roll?

  It's beautiful.

• 1:34:17Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:17Rich Roll?

  Good, man, I'm excited for you.

• 1:34:19Julie Piatt?

  Thank you.

• 1:34:20Rich Roll?

  Entering into a really cool new chapter.

• 1:34:22Julie Piatt?

  Mm hmm. Thank you.

• 1:34:23Rich Roll?

  Well, let's shift gears and talk about the holidays a little bit before we close this thing down.

• 1:34:30Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, so this is an interesting one because I'm, I'm really just in a different place with a birth family and the holidays. And I guess I want to propose an expansive perspective to maybe ponder if you're one who has intense interactions with your birth family. I certainly do. You know, there's a saying that if you think you're, you're realized or you're spiritual, go spend a weekend with your family and then you'll find out that it's not true. You know, or, but I guess one of the things that I think is true is that, you know, we are not necessarily tied to our families.

• 1:35:14Julie Piatt?

  You know, even though, you know, you know, we're brought up like, yes, it would be good to love your family. Yes, it's good to respect those people in your lives. But honestly, I think what is up right now is more frequency. Like, there's a lot of different frequencies that are operating on the planet and not all of them are resonant with each other. And that's fine. Like, it doesn't mean that you have to go into family situations if it's not in alignment for you. And I would bring more to that, that you are created for a very specific expression. And if those type of relationships are unable to support you in your evolution or in

• 1:35:59Julie Piatt?

  Your joy or in your love and nourishment, if they are patterns that are repeatedly dragging you down or causing constriction, you know, I would say that we have the freedom to choose not to interact with them.

• 1:36:13Rich Roll?

  Right, it's, it can be easier said than done though, right? Because there are occasions and situations where there's expectations around family gatherings. And I think we're in a moment now, as the world has started to reopen, where people are going to be traveling to see members of their family that perhaps they haven't seen in two years, three years at this point. And there's something really beautiful about that. But I think it's also a situation that can heighten the pressure and the expectations of what that experience may or may not be, that can load it with so much that it could be potentially more explosive, right? If you're not careful.

• 1:36:56Rich Roll?

  So it's about, yes, you know, to the extent that you can or should like opt out to protect yourself. But for those that are sort of going into it nonetheless, saying, well, this could be tricky, but I miss my family and I haven't seen them in a couple of years and I'm looking forward to seeing them. But I also have some trepidation. How do you, you know, help to protect yourself or to flex a healthy boundary and take advantage of some tools to perhaps ensure maybe a better outcome than historically you've received in these situations? Does that make sense?

• 1:37:36Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, that makes sense.

• 1:37:36Rich Roll?

  That was very wordy. I could have said that more concisely.

• 1:37:39Julie Piatt?

  It's okay.

• 1:37:39Rich Roll?

  But go ahead.

• 1:37:40Julie Piatt?

  No, I got you.

• 1:37:43Julie Piatt?

  So, yeah, so if your welcomed, your secretly welcomed sabbatical from your family brought on by COVID has now come to a close.

• 1:37:55Julie Piatt?

  Then, you know, I think the first thing that is really helpful to me is understanding that it's frequency. So rather than getting into the dynamics of, you know, where you are in the pecking order of your siblings, or any relationship that you have with your parents, if you can just relax your body and just understand that it's just frequency, it's not personal, you know, it's not, you don't have to drop into those old patterns and those old buttons unless you're dragged there like I was a couple weeks ago. So maybe you can avoid it. I think the neutrality of understanding that there's nothing to prove, that there is no better and no worse, there's no one for you

• 1:38:38Julie Piatt?

  to convince to be other than they are. It's simply to wrap yourself in blankets of pink light, because pink light can be more pleasing to others if you have an energy that's abrasive to somebody, or you have somebody who is easily explosive. So wrap yourself in, visualize that sort of cocoon around you before you go in, ignite a state of neutrality within you, and understand that there's nothing for you to solve, change, convince, you know, or even, you know, get your day about. Like, just let it go, relax, and understand that

• 1:39:22Julie Piatt?

  everything is frequency. You may never have a close, connected relationship with a family individual like we think we should. You know, it just doesn't land that way. So, some of us have very close family relationships with our birth family, and our siblings, and our parents, and others of us don't. Or, you know, probably more commonly, we have charges with certain individuals within the, within the group. But I guess what I would say is, take care of yourself first. One thing that I'm doing a lot, I forgot it today, but... I'm carrying with me a picture of myself when I was six years old.

• 1:40:05Julie Piatt?

  And the reason that I carry that with me is so that I can remember to advocate for her first, before anyone, before you, before the kids, before anything. Because she is my most important relationship. And if I make sure that she is held and nourished and cared for and seen, then I have more capacity to create, to also be more loving in my relationships and my community. So I think that's a really, really good thing to do. Also, because most of us that are going back into family situations, it's reducing into a family pecking order, or old things that happened, or old agreements that were, you know,

• 1:40:49Julie Piatt?

  that were made that you weren't even aware of, you know. So it's these old contracts that are looping that are just over. I mean, we are not, certainly at my age, and you know, likely at, you know, any age, you're not the person who was born into that family line. And you don't have to play that role in that way.

• 1:41:09Rich Roll?

  Right. We all sort of snap back or revert into those roles. Like, we become, you know, the 12-year-old version of ourselves when we return home. And it's tricky and it's complicated. Like, I think most people are probably somewhere in the middle. Like, they love their family and they're looking forward to seeing their family. But they're also aware that there are these patterns at play that can be fraught and tend to activate people. And suddenly, things become explosive out of the blue. And then you're left wondering like, well, how did that happen? Like, I don't even, you know, and there's drama, et cetera. So how do we, you know, if we're going to venture into those scenarios, like, how do we take care of ourselves? I'd love that idea of carrying around a photo of you as a, as a young person.

• 1:41:54Rich Roll?

  I think that's a beautiful sentiment and, and very like... Visceral.

• 1:41:58Julie Piatt?

  Very visceral.

• 1:41:59Rich Roll?

  Yeah, right?

• 1:42:00Julie Piatt?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:01Rich Roll?

  Some of the things that I think have been helpful to me have been that self-care piece, like you've got to take care of yourself first. You're not going to be able to go into a tricky environment where your buttons are going to get pushed by the people who installed them, which ensures that they're going to get the reaction, right? Like that historical reaction, like, how can I have that button pushed and not react the way that I always have historically that leads to, you know, a not-so-good result? Well, take care of yourself first, whether that's exercise, meditation, some kind of mindfulness practice, good nutrition, sleep, all those kinds of things I think are super important. And then, you know, I try to envision, thinking about boundaries, like I try to envision

• 1:42:43Rich Roll?

  myself in some kind of, you know, translucent bubble, right? So whatever is coming towards me, if it's not, you know, in service, or it is that thing that might trigger me, it bounces off. Like, just creating a visual field of where I'm imagining it. It's almost like, in the service of trying to be non-reactive and neutral in all situations, can I pretend like I'm watching this unfold on television? Like, if it's happening on TV, I'm not going to take it personally. So if there's a screen, or when something is happening that is provocative to me and is going to activate that, that young, emotional, wounded body inside of me, what if it was just a character on television saying those lines?

• 1:43:27Rich Roll?

  Like, I'm not going to have that same reaction. So I try to conjure up some version of that, you know, visual cue to help dissipate the intensity of those situations. But I think always reminding yourself to be neutral and to take a breath before reacting so that you can respond more consciously is also super helpful. And understanding that this shit's hard, and, you know, you're going to get it wrong more often than you're going to get it right, and to be kind to yourself. Back to that piece of like, how do you take care of yourself? You have to, you know, exert or express that kindness towards yourself.

• 1:44:09Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. Definitely agree.

• 1:44:15Rich Roll?

  Why are you laughing?

• 1:44:16Julie Piatt?

  No, it was good. It was good. It was beautiful.

• 1:44:18Rich Roll?

  You know, this stuff's hard.

• 1:44:20Julie Piatt?

  It is.

• 1:44:20Rich Roll?

  I love my family. Like, I'm not, I'm not, this is not in disparagement of my family at all. Like, I, you know, I like seeing them, but I think like most people, there are these historic patterns that get, you know, calcified and play out time and time again. And you're like, why did that thing happen again? Because you're doing the same thing that you've always done and they're doing the same thing they've always done. You're playing these roles over and over and over again and getting the same result. And if you want a different result, it's incumbent upon you. The onus is on you to behave differently or to do something different to interrupt that pattern.

• 1:44:56Julie Piatt?

  Yeah, definitely. And it is. It's super, super challenging. So, you know, the one thing that I wanted to offer, this is like the super secret technique that, you know, I say it all the time, I'm gonna say it again, is this warm oil Abiyanga self-massage. So if any of you are feeling anxiety-ridden, unsettled, scattered, stressed, afraid, out of sorts, out of alignment, you can get some organic hot sesame oil. You're gonna get the organic sesame oil and heat it up in like a French press. So you put the bottle inside very hot water. And you're gonna go in your shower with a bunch of towels.

• 1:45:41Julie Piatt?

  You have to be very careful because it's very slippery. So please be careful when you do this. But what you do is you pour the hot oil over, warm oil over your scalp and you literally give your entire body a self-massage. Now shift your attention to what you're telling yourself while you're doing it. So this is a great opportunity for you to speak to your body as a living intelligence. Like, "Thank you. Thank you. I love you. Thank you for everything you do for me. I love you. You're beautiful. I appreciate you." All of these things. So after you've massaged your entire body and some of the oil will start to absorb

• 1:46:24Julie Piatt?

  in, before you turn the shower on, put shampoo directly in your hair. If you, okay, so let me remind you, you have oil in your hair. Warm oil has come down your scalp. So before you turn the shower on, you put shampoo right on top of your hair in the oiled hair with no water. And get enough in there that it's kind of distributed. Then at that point, carefully, probably standing on the side of a towel that's going to be wet in the bottom of the shower, turn on the hot water and allow that oil, that hot water to open your pores and the oil goes in your pores.

• 1:47:08Julie Piatt?

  Now, your hair now will have, you know, the lather and you'll be able to wash it out and you can wash it a second time, but you'll be able to get the oil out. About 45 minutes after you do this Abhyanga process, your entire nervous system will drop three stories. You will feel as if you had a four-hour massage. And it is in just such an invaluable experience. It affects your sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system. I'm saying sesame oil because it's probably the most universal, but if you're a kapha person, meaning more heavy, you might want to use coconut oil.

• 1:47:52Julie Piatt?

  If you're a pitta person, which is more fiery, you might want to use coconut oil. But most of us have vata imbalance, which is the wind, the windy dosha in Ayurveda. And that is sesame oil is very good for that. So we want to treat the imbalance, which is vata, which means you're forgetting things, you're irritable, your digestion isn't working, you can't sleep, you're traveling, you're erratic, you can't finish one task. These type of sort of symptoms are vata imbalance. And I had a friend of mine, who's a very...

• 1:48:34Julie Piatt?

  Very sharp person with a lot of creativity and she's extremely vada. And she was very, very afraid to fly. She had two friends die suddenly at age 50. Unexplainable, unexplainably. And she was having anxiety from getting on the plane and she called me and I was like, "Do this." And she couldn't believe, she was like, "That just helped me so much." And so this is something that I do at least once a week. You're witness to the residue in the shower.

• 1:49:06Rich Roll?

  Yeah, I get in the shower and I'm like, "Why is it so greasy and slippery in the shower?"

• 1:49:11Julie Piatt?

  Yeah. But it really is literally a lifesaver and I know a lot of us are experiencing a lot of anxiety and a lot of fear and a lot of just discomfort from expanding. So that abayanga, like if I was leaving the planet and I had to leave like one body care technique, that is the secret. That is an amazing, amazing process. And you know, a bottle of oil costs, I don't know, three bucks or five bucks and you don't need anyone to massage you, you can massage yourself. And then it brings you into communion with your own body. Like, what is your body? What is this body vehicle? What is this technology? What are all the functions that the body does for us every day without us asking for it, just automatically?

• 1:49:54Julie Piatt?

  So, you know, the greatest miracle exists within the human body. The ascension is happening inside. It's an insension. We're not going anywhere. We're activating more of who we are.

• 1:50:08Rich Roll?

  That's beautiful.

• 1:50:08Julie Piatt?

  Don't be, don't be like you.

• 1:50:09Rich Roll?

  No, I'm gonna try that, actually. I've never, I've never done that myself. I have done, I have done coconut, I have like lathered in coconut, like and tried to like be indulgent in that self-care, but I haven't done that specific technique with that intention.

• 1:50:27Julie Piatt?

  You've lathered in coconut oil? Tell me more about that.

• 1:50:30Rich Roll?

  I have done that.

• 1:50:31Julie Piatt?

  That's something I would, I would have missed that question on a dating game.

• 1:50:36Rich Roll?

  The final thing that I would offer that's kind of more of a grounded, super practical tool, if you're going into these family gatherings, to the extent that you're kind of entering these situations from a perspective of like, "They need to treat me this way," or like, "I'm tired of being talked to in this way." In other words, entering with expectations about what you feel you deserve, to just abuse yourself of that and instead focus simply on like, how you can be of service. Like, "I'm not coming into this situation to look for what I can extract from it, purely instead from a perspective of how I can contribute."

• 1:51:19Rich Roll?

  And I think when you can inhabit that mindset and then follow that up with simple behaviors that demonstrate that, it will shift the energy of the situation, and to the extent that some of those historical patterns end up playing out nonetheless, it's a little bit of a buffer in how that will be processed by you, because you're looking through a different lens.

• 1:51:42Julie Piatt?

  Definitely. That's good advice. And of course, there's always the potential that you could do all these things and it could still be a shitstorm. So just be gentle on yourself.

• 1:51:53Rich Roll?

  Right.

• 1:51:54Julie Piatt?

  I know that that's how it goes.

• 1:51:55Rich Roll?

  "I got the oil. I did the thing. And it's still..." Yeah.

• 1:51:59Julie Piatt?

  It's literally like the biggest mystery.

• 1:52:06Rich Roll?

  And then it just becomes compassion for others and compassion for self in the aftermath.

• 1:52:11Julie Piatt?

  Definitely. Definitely.

• 1:52:13Rich Roll?

  All right. Well, I think we did it.

• 1:52:15Julie Piatt?

  Thank you so much.

• 1:52:16Rich Roll?

  How do you feel?

• 1:52:17Julie Piatt?

  I feel good. Thanks for having me on, Rich Roll.

• 1:52:19Rich Roll?

  Always a pleasure to experience the Shrimati Spiritual Alice in Wonderland Rabbit Hole. I think we went there today.

• 1:52:29Julie Piatt?

  We definitely went there.

• 1:52:30Rich Roll?

  I love you and I look forward to more of these. In the meantime, check out Shremu, shremu.com, code RRP18 for 18% off if you want to explore the beautiful world of Naatzis, the devotional offerings of Shremu. You can find Julie Shrimati on Instagram. And where else?

• 1:52:53Julie Piatt?

  Where else?

• 1:52:53Rich Roll?

  Water Tiger.

• 1:52:54Julie Piatt?

  JuliePiet.com, Water Tiger is on there. So if you want to go deeper and you want to explore some spiritual techniques that will, may assist you to embody more of who you are, you can join that beautiful international community. Yeah. And what else?

• 1:53:14Rich Roll?

  I don't know.

• 1:53:15Julie Piatt?

  I think that's it.

• 1:53:16Rich Roll?

  Yeah, for now.

• 1:53:17Julie Piatt?

  For now. Thanks, Rich. Love you, babe.

• 1:53:20Rich Roll?

  Peace.

• 1:53:22Julie Piatt?

  Namaste.

• 1:53:28Rich Roll?

  That's it for today. Thank you for listening. I truly hope you enjoyed the conversation. To learn more about today's guests, including links and resources related to everything discussed today, visit the episode page at richroll.com, where you can find the entire podcast archive, as well as podcast merch, my books, Finding Ultra, Voicing Change, and The Plant Power Way, as well as the Plant Power Meal Planner at meals.richroll.com. If you'd like to support the podcast, the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is to subscribe to the show on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, and on YouTube, and leave a review and/or comment.

• 1:54:12Rich Roll?

  Supporting the sponsors who support the show is also important and appreciated. And sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is, of course, awesome and very helpful. And finally, for podcast updates, special offers on books, the meal planner, and other subjects, please subscribe to our newsletter, which you can find on the footer of any page at richroll.com. Today's show was produced and engineered by Jason Camiolo, with additional audio engineering by Cale Curtis. The video edition of the podcast was created by Blake Curtis, with assistance by our creative director, Dan Drake. Portraits by Davy Greenberg and Grayson Wilder.

• 1:54:53Rich Roll?

  Graphic and social media assets courtesy of Jessica Miranda, Daniel Solis, Dan Drake, and A.J. Akpodiette. Thank you, Georgia Whaley, for copywriting and website management. And of course, our theme music was created by Tyler Piatt, Trapper Piatt, and Harry Mathis. Appreciate the love, love the support. See you back here soon. Peace. Plants.

• 1:55:18Julie Piatt?

  Namaste