Kenyon Martin Sr. former NBA All-Star known for his aggressive defensive play, tone-setting leadership, navigating life after basketball, an outspoken sports voice, player vs the man and shares pride as father watching son play in the NBA

“Trying to change that perception has been the most challenging thing post career…It was K-Mart the player and Kenyon the person. I didn’t let a lot of people know Kenyon the person.” Kenyon Martin Sr The former NBA All-Star, No. 1 overall pick, and one of the most relentless competitors of his era, Kenyon Martin Sr. sits down with The Pivot Podcast for a powerful, unfiltered conversation about basketball, family, and the evolution of manhood. From his rise out of Dallas to leading the New Jersey Nets to back-to-back NBA Finals, Kenyon reflects on the edge and intensity that defined his playing career—and how that same fire often shaped how he was perceived. Now, with greater perspective, he opens up about the difference between being seen as a player versus being understood as a man. He opens up about the power of his voice now, how he strives to speak from experience and how his biggest post-career challenge is being able to show the world the difference from K-Mart the player vs Kenyon the person.... The conversation takes on new depth as Kenyon discusses watching his son, Kenyon Martin Jr., carve out his own NBA journey. He speaks candidly about fatherhood, pride, restraint, and the responsibility of letting your child become their own person while still standing firm in loyalty and protection as a parent. Beyond the game, Kenyon shares lessons on accountability, family-first values, standing on principle, and how growth sometimes requires rewriting narratives—both public and personal. This episode is about legacy, love, and learning when to pivot without losing who you are. 🎙️ Raw. Reflective. Real. Kenyon Martin Sr.—beyond the jersey. Pivot Family, let us know what you think, don't forget to like, comment and hit the subscribe button, we appreciate you sticking with us! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 0:11Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Semaglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 0:30Speaker 01

  We gonna have to include him in the podcast.

• 0:32Ryan Clark?

  No, they can't. They can't play. No, they can't play.

• 0:35Channing Crowder?

  We can't have guests?

• 0:36Ryan Clark?

  They can't play.

• 0:37Channing Crowder?

  What up, D?

• 0:38Speaker 01

  What up, brother?

• 0:38Fred Taylor?

  We need to do a liability waiver or something.

• 0:40Ryan Clark?

  If we do something else, if we do something else, we can include Ken. We can't include him in a hoop game, a 3-on-3 game.

• 0:46Channing Crowder?

  Oh, we had guests on.

• 0:47Speaker 01

  Oh, that's the thing now, right?

• 0:49Ryan Clark?

  So that's the new conversation, man. Podcast.

• 0:51Speaker 01

  I saw that. I said, um, because they didn't mention us, so I was like, um...

• 0:56Channing Crowder?

  Nah, you coming over. We coming over. Shaq down low, you know what I'm saying? You up top, we good.

• 1:02Speaker 01

  Shaq can't move this way no more.

• 1:04Channing Crowder?

  At all.

• 1:05Speaker 01

  The statue.

• 1:06Ryan Clark?

  Hey, at all. But he also, though, he got, he got Gil, though. Gil can still hoop.

• 1:12Speaker 01

  He still a bucket.

• 1:13Ryan Clark?

  Gil can still... Nick fat, but he can still hoop, too.

• 1:16Speaker 01

  Rashad a bucket still.

• 1:18Ryan Clark?

  He also built like a backer right now, too.

• 1:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:21Ryan Clark?

  So he go post game, too.

• 1:22Speaker 01

  And then BJ Young, I'm saying Brandon Jennings still young.

• 1:25Ryan Clark?

  Oh, he young.

• 1:26Speaker 01

  So...

• 1:27Ryan Clark?

  We, we...

• 1:29Channing Crowder?

  Hey, we didn't play all the same.

• 1:30Speaker 01

  I'm just screening, man. I'm just...

• 1:31Channing Crowder?

  Nah, we bowling at shows, bro.

• 1:33Speaker 01

  I'm gonna get my Rudy Gobert on. Just turn and screen, though.

• 1:37Ryan Clark?

  Yes, sir. Yes.

• 1:58Ryan Clark?

  Sure, man. Ken Martin, man, welcome to the Pivot. This is Fred Taylor, Channing Crowder, Ryan Clark.

• 2:02Speaker 01

  Appreciate you guys for having me.

• 2:03Ryan Clark?

  Pivot fam, thank y'all for pivoting with us. I mean, shoot, we've been kind of communicating about this for years now, man. So excited to get it done. You know, normally, I'm like, I always try to start the show with something fun. You don't really have fun in your background.

• 2:20Ryan Clark?

  You even like you Google Kenyon Martin fun, no nothing pop up. It be the first time Google AI Chat GPT let you down. You know how the AI talk to you? Unfortunately, we were not able to find a smile.

• 2:32Channing Crowder?

  Little lady shrugged her shoulders.

• 2:35Ryan Clark?

  Proud to change that. I'm proud him to work on changing that, man.

• 2:41Ryan Clark?

  But now, man, for you, though, you know, you talked about that on court persona. And that was part of how you got to where you were. But how much does it affect you that people do see you in that one way all the time? So much so, man, you kind of went on your own social media and said, look, like, that's who I was. That's who I had to be. I'm working to get away from that.

• 3:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, trying to show you that's perception has been the most challenging things post-career, right? So I just have to tell people like when I leave the gym, like I'm not at home shaking, like hanging off the chandelier and kicking the dog, man, like, like I'm not like I'm a person. Like I, I cry, I have emotions, I have feelings, like all of those things exist. It's just not why I played, right? So that was the, the thing that people, the most vivid memory of me was that, right? But, but yeah, now for me to go places and, and that's like, oh my goodness, shit. Hey, don't mess with him, man. Don't, don't, I'm like, I'm cool, man. I own no problems, man. Like I'm, I'm respectful.

• 3:54Speaker 01

  I speak to people. I'm outgoing, but it just, I drew a line like a long time ago. But for me, it was like you said, it was Kmart the player and then Kenyon the person. And I didn't let a lot of people know Kenyon the person, right? Everybody just knew Kmart, right? So we were at, so to your point, we were at a season ticket holder event in Denver. Older lady was, she been season ticket holder forever, right? So she, she come, I'm at, she come up, she looking up at me, she like, because she sure been acting with people this, that and the third. And I'm just like, she engaged with me like Ken, I'm a big fan, da, da, da, da. She engaging and no, I'm giving her my, I'm yes, ma'am. I'm south, yes, ma'am, no, ma'am, thank you, da, da, da, da. And she like.

• 4:39Speaker 01

  Right out of her mouth. For the longest time, I thought you were the biggest asshole, right?

• 4:46Speaker 01

  Like, she like, no, you're a sweet young man, like, you well, like, you, and it's so, it's that. When people don't know, and if they don't have access to it, then they're gonna be ignorant and naive to it, right? So, and I don't help it being in the space that we're in now, right? Because I am, I'm the elder statesman on the couch, right? And I tell it how it is, with people, face, behind you, whatever it is, I'm, I just, I'm black and white. So I've lacked that gray area for a long time, and it's rubbed some people wrong.

• 5:20Ryan Clark?

  It's like being around Pitbull. You know what I'm saying? You be like, shit, I think he cool, I think it's good.

• 5:25Channing Crowder?

  Bruh, I was gonna say, it's like Mike Tyson's like that. Where you don't know, and I've never, I've been around you before, you know, I don't wanna tell the areas, different clubs, but I've never talked to you like this. So when, when I met you, I was like, is this motherfucker crazy? Because you came off as crazy, but you even said it, you said Kenyon and Kmart. I don't know if Kenyon would be famous. I know personally that Kmart got famous, and what you did, you know what I'm saying? So you created a person, or let me know if I'm wrong, you created a person, a persona, a physical being that imposed on people, and Kenyon would've never got there, Kenyon would've never been famous and rich.

• 6:09Speaker 01

  Kenyon's shy. Kenyon's an introvert. Kevin Gates put it perfectly, man, I'm an introvert, but it come off, but it come off as aggression, right? I'm a perfect imperfection, that's the name of the song, right? And I listen to this song constantly because it's so fitting, right? I'm that, like, I'm, I'm...

• 6:30Speaker 01

  Like I'm to myself, with my family, like I'm all of those things. Kmart played basketball, man, like hard and in a certain way. That got me a scholarship. That got me out of Oak Cliff. Being Kenyon, to your point, wouldn't have got me out of Oak Cliff. Shy, don't want to deal with people, don't speak in front of people, like really standoffish at times. So, yeah, absolutely, that, it. In the words of Bob Huggins, man, I haven't seen a kid play with that kind of aggression in a long time. And that was Kmart. That got me to school, that like.

• 7:10Ryan Clark?

  Got you to first overall pick?

• 7:12Speaker 01

  All of that, right? But on the, there's two sides to that coin.

• 7:17Fred Taylor?

  Going back to people don't know who you are until they meet you. I just defended this guy today online in the comments. They say he's an asshole uncle that won't stop talking. I was like, no, he's actually an amazing person. You just got to meet him. But he's like you, it's just black or white. He gonna tell you how it is and some people can't tolerate that.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  A lot of people can't.

• 7:38Fred Taylor?

  Right, and that's their, you know, own imperfection as human. But I wanted to ask you, between Saginaw and Oak Cliff. Tough. And I can see why you probably were like you are, but I want you to say like, what was, you know, growing up in those different places like? And what was young Kenyon like?

• 7:57Speaker 01

  So I was born in Saginaw, right? I have no recollection of it, right? We moved, my mom was born in Texas. My mom was born, she was from East Texas. So we had ties between Michigan and Texas. So I was born in Michigan, but she went to high school there. My sister was born in Michigan, so when I was maybe three or four, we moved to Dallas. I mean, we moved like back to the country, which was Longview. So we moved back to Longview and, you know, I had bad allergies as a kid. Like getting ate up by bugs, couldn't go outside. There's bad pine and shit everywhere. So she was like, I gotta get my baby out of here. Right. So we went to Dallas and Oak Cliff is where we landed. Grew up in the projects, man. I'm a project baby.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  With that comes with being around certain things, seeing certain things, being around certain people, developing certain language and demeanors when you're young. Being, yeah, being in the house, watching your mom and everybody play dominoes and cards and talk shit to one another and it's constantly this and like, so you see a lot of things, man, and you either, it's one of two ways to go. Like, I didn't see a middle ground with it. Like, I saw people that was aggressive and people that was passive. You just, you pick up on it. And it's either eat or be eaten. And me being someone who light-skinned, red dude, red all this, I stuttered.

• 9:21Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, look at y'all. No, talk shit to that big motherfucker. No, y'all talk shit to me. There we go.

• 9:28Speaker 01

  So it's that, man. Like, you getting picked on in school for stuttering and like, all of those things develop thick skin, right? And like I said, I, when I was maybe ten, like I drew a line in the sand. I was skinny kid, man. I was, I was frail, man. Like, I was skinny as a kid. I didn't get, till I got to college and Bob Huggins, like, you gotta lift weights. Like, cool. But I didn't lift weights in high school. When I was a kid, man, I was skinny. Just long, but.

• 9:59Ryan Clark?

  It must say too, though, you grew up single mom.

• 10:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:01Ryan Clark?

  You know, without your pops. Like, it's also some meals missed and.

• 10:06Speaker 01

  Oh, all of that. So things were good, man, until like, things got, my sixth grade year, like, hit the fan, right? Things got implemented around the hood and mom got to dabbling and things got, like, rough. Before that, like, things were okay. She had a decent job and all that, but I was still, I'm saying, I still stuttered, still getting all that. So, like I said, when I was like ten, eleven, man, I drew a line in the sand, bruh. Like.

• 10:36Speaker 01

  Drew it and it was permanent, like what no, do this, we do this. Like you tease, we do this. You say this, we do this. Like it just, it was a direct correlation. Anything that I deemed disrespectful or anything that wasn't on the line with me, it led to certain activities and me behaving a certain way.

• 10:56Channing Crowder?

  I get that.

• 10:57Speaker 01

  And I took it to college. From 10 years old on, I just, it's what it was, man.

• 11:02Channing Crowder?

  Was that where the monster was? I call it the monster. Because I didn't, I didn't have a name. I didn't go from King to Kmart. But like Fred said, if you meet me, I'm a nice dude. If you don't know me, there was a time because I told a story before to them, when I got locked up one time for fighting, just you call me a bitch in the club, I'm punching you in the face.

• 11:19Speaker 01

  For sure.

• 11:20Channing Crowder?

  I'm sure you go by that. If someone, if I come from Atlanta, I got to Gainesville, go to UF, and they'll call people bitches just real willy nilly. Call me a bitch, I'm gonna punch you in the face.

• 11:31Speaker 01

  Off time.

• 11:32Channing Crowder?

  And I get locked up. And I, when I get out of jail the next day, I read in the alligator, the, you know, the student newspaper, they should lock him in a cage and let him out on Saturday morning to play football. And bro, I remember at that moment, I, I know in my mind, I got to a point, I was like, man, to hell with what everybody thinks. I'm gonna go out here and bust some ass on the field and I'm not caring about nobody's opinion of me for the rest of my life. That was my turning point. So I think that's when my monster was created. You said 10 or 11, was that when Kmart was created? When, when was Kmart created where you just said, to hell with y'all?

• 12:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, man, probably. Around then, man, it was just like I said, things got hit the fan, because I didn't know what it was gonna be, man. Like 6th grade, 7th grade, 8th grade, 9th grade. Like them four or five years, bro, like it's a miracle that I'm here. Like shit was bad, bad. Like bad.

• 12:27Channing Crowder?

  But how, what was bad?

• 12:28Speaker 01

  Homeless bad. Like living in shelters was bad. Like dead ass, like watching dudes beat on your mom, bad. And you can't do nothing about it, right? Because you're a kid. And so it's that, getting up in the middle of the night, leaving. I don't have like childhood trophies and none of that. Like getting up and leaving in the middle of the night. So bad. Living in shelters, living in houses where you gotta go outside and turn the water on. Like them like so.

• 12:58Ryan Clark?

  Can you tell me about the fight between Danny Boy and Coach Phillips? And how that shaped the way you saw passion for, I'm not trying to.

• 13:08Speaker 01

  Y'all good.

• 13:09Ryan Clark?

  Passion for basketball. Can you tell me about that though?

• 13:11Speaker 01

  Y'all are good. That's really good. Like, that's impressive.

• 13:17Ryan Clark?

  Thank you.

• 13:17Speaker 01

  Great research, man. Nah, yeah, man. Like, so Coach Phillips was the dude, like, he didn't let us call each other niggas. He was one of them. Like, he the one, like, if you wanna be good, you gotta use your left hand. Like, that was the training back then. Like, you wanna be good, you wanna get the, gotta use your left hand to be a left-hand layup. Like, he was preaching that. And if we got into it, he used to put us in the room with gloves on. Like, it was one of them. So to see him have a physical art to, like, like, go at it. Cause Coach Phillips, he like bad knees, but he could hoop, like, really good. Like, but had bad will, but still was dogging dudes. But he didn't let you talk to him crazy.

• 13:58Speaker 01

  You know, around the hood, the same, that bitch word, man, it just, you get to talk crazy and everybody ain't going for it. And man, they was all on the coke machine fighting. Listen, it went from in the gym, on the floor, to the hall. You know, we wanna fight, we don't nobody wanna break it up?

• 14:15Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 14:16Speaker 01

  Cause it's a good fight, but you scared that you go like, oh.

• 14:19Ryan Clark?

  You gonna catch one?

• 14:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, it's one of them, and I'm a kid. I'm like 12. I'm like, yo, that's how grown men fight. And they fought as hard as it possibly could be.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  And then went back to hooping.

• 14:38Speaker 01

  I was like, oh.

• 14:40Ryan Clark?

  That was it?

• 14:41Speaker 01

  That did it for me. You can behave, you can do this and still get back to playing. It ain't gotta be personal.

• 14:49Speaker 01

  Bleeding, leaking, like, just go back to hoop and wipe it off and go back to playing. I'm like, oh, wow.

• 14:56Speaker 01

  So from that, man, listen.

• 14:58Ryan Clark?

  But when did, I get that that feels like that though, King, but there does come a point where you come from that. Like, we talk about it all the time. You get into a space where you realize that behavior and those behaviors aren't as cool or aren't as acceptable to other people in different spaces as they are to us. He talk about the locker room all the time. You square up, everybody lumped up, you dap off, you go to practice, you go to eat, whatever it is, you back at the dorm kicking it. You know, like, that was life for us. But then when you get in spaces when the camera's on you and you start to get a label. And then now that label carries over into how people treat you, how people see you. Do they give you money? Do they put you in ads? Or can you be the face of a franchise?

• 15:40Ryan Clark?

  When did that perception start to affect those things outside of Kmart?

• 15:46Speaker 01

  I couldn't tell you. Cause when I got to college, like, you have some people who they get a certain player, like, and they try to mold that or tame it, right? I was fortunate enough to go play for a man who thought and acted and behaved just like me.

• 16:07Ryan Clark?

  To a bat hug?

• 16:08Speaker 01

  Yes. So, there, like, that man was me. And I was, like, in a player form, like, I'm, people think I'm there when I said, if he could have molded a basketball player and did, like, from rawness to be able to

• 16:23Ryan Clark?

  To hoop hoop.

• 16:24Speaker 01

  I would have been it. Cause I was a clean slate when he got me. I just played hard. Had a bad attitude with it, like, meanest, like, played basketball through the wall, balls to the wall always. That got me a scholarship. And my freshman year, when I got to Cincinnati, man, one of my first few practices, I had been the starting center at the time he was a senior. And there was a loose ball and he pushed me.

• 16:52Speaker 01

  You know, on the floor, right? I'm scanning, like, and I hop up and I'm like, what the fuck you doing? And this is, I'm, this is one of my first few practices and he threw his hands up. Oh, it was like seven.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, with a seven piece?

• 17:11Speaker 01

  And instead of like, you think like, oh, she don't fit to get in trouble. I hear over my shit, god damn it, Jackson, protect yourself.

• 17:21Speaker 01

  Dang.

• 17:22Fred Taylor?

  Wow.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  You mean, I didn't get in trouble for this? Yeah. So. Wow.

• 17:29Speaker 01

  No one ever turned me off. Yeah. Right? No one ever like, no, that's too much. No, no, don't do that, don't. Even when I was in high school, teammates, bro, you throw elbows and I got a whip, pop, pop. Like, college, same thing, teammates, bro, every year, four years.

• 17:46Speaker 01

  Somebody got it.

• 17:48Speaker 01

  Real fact, somebody got it.

• 17:50Ryan Clark?

  At some point, though, somebody gotta be a good teammate, and like, if Chan, the freshman, be like, hey, man, look. You came out of that practice, man, just let it be. Like, don't say nothing, don't put your hands up.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, but if we hooping, we hooping. It's just, it's just the other shit. Right? I ain't got no problem with us playing hard and we doing, we talking shit. Just don't call my name, and don't do, like, just don't swing no elbows, go up, you cut me up, like, all of that. Right, that's gonna lead to issues. Right. From high school on, boy, I got clipped, boom, hit my dude, me and the dude on the ground, face to face in high school, I kick him in his face, bow. Hey. It's like, nuts. So, you get to college and don't nobody turn that off? Right.

• 18:29Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 18:30Speaker 01

  Freshman, I ain't sophomore, you somebody do, like, dude, it's. So, by the time my senior year came around, Hugs was like, yo, King, go get your team. Get your guys, cuz he, by then, by my senior year came around, it was, hey, either we gonna do it this way, or y'all know what it is, man. I'm gonna put my hands on one of y'all.

• 18:49Ryan Clark?

  It didn't hurt, though, that you could put this over the rim.

• 18:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, a little more. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, that helped.

• 18:55Fred Taylor?

  That also explains his, uh, power forward conversation. But we'll, we'll get back to that in a minute. Uh, but I, I do wanna go back to, uh, your mom being raised by a single mom.

• 19:05Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 19:06Fred Taylor?

  But you mentioned Hugs, you mentioned, uh, the other coach.

• 19:09Speaker 01

  Coach Phillips.

• 19:10Fred Taylor?

  Coach Phillips.

• 19:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:11Fred Taylor?

  Right? And, and seeing your mother being abused, then I'm sure you probably didn't trust men. When were you able to trust men for mentorship? Was Hugs the first guy?

• 19:21Speaker 01

  Like I said, Coach Phillips was that to a, to a degree, right?

• 19:25Fred Taylor?

  Okay.

• 19:26Speaker 01

  He had his own family, his own boys and stuff, but he was, as much as he could for a lot of us, no. None of my immediate friends I grew up around, they had uncles. But no one had a dad in the house.

• 19:42Fred Taylor?

  See, I thought it was normal.

• 19:43Speaker 01

  Like, yeah, it's a normal thing, like, none of us, bro. And there was maybe eight, nine, 10 of us that hung out like regularly. I could just go down names of guys who I hung out with as a kid, and nobody had a dad in the house. So this is going to the record, uncles come by here and there. One of my, pardon us, his uncle used to come by because he was in the streets, come by bringing joys and Jordans come out. So he was the, he was the one everybody was like, it was that. But for the most part, yeah, Coach Phillips was that. There was another gentleman that, God rest his soul, Mr. Kinvik, he came in, he was from Florida. Gainesville Salvation Army was our, our YMCA rec. So we played at Salvation Army.

• 20:24Speaker 01

  He came in and changed the sports culture in that regard, but trusting men, probably hugs, man. Like, the first person that, like, I looked at as like, he care about me. Like, he really like, like, care about my well-being.

• 20:40Fred Taylor?

  Is that what allowed you to not get into any more shit that you got into? Thus leading to being the first pick selected overall?

• 20:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, he just got, yeah, just, just hoop, man. And then I was able, when I was in college, man, I had a girl. And I wasn't, I, I didn't hang out with my teammates, really. I was, I was, I'm different in that regard, man. I love my teammates when we playing, but I didn't feel I needed them outside of the court. Which maybe, ah, looked at in a way, but like I said, I'm introverted, man. I don't mind being by myself. I don't mind being over here. Crowd is over here, I don't mind being over here. And I'll stand back from the crowd, like, so they just observe. So I was just doing that, man, and stayed out a lot of shit in college. That, you do dumb shit in college, of course, man. I got locked up in the park with a chick trying to get some, you know what I'm saying? Like, after hours, like, yeah, all that, right?

• 21:36Speaker 01

  But don't nobody find, because I'm in and out, right? Two hours in, everybody, hey, man, follow this car, take this money, come pay this bail, man, whatever it is, right? So it's that, you do dumb shit like selling books and all, like, you do it. I'm saying, you ain't college, you living college life, but I was, I had him in my, and...

• 21:55Speaker 01

  It was a healthy fear of him, right? Yeah. Just didn't want to disappoint him because it gave me an opportunity, right? Respect, yeah. Because I ain't having no, grades wasn't the best coming out of high school, this, that, and the third, like, we gonna find a way. Like, you come here, we gonna find a way. I respect that. And he found a way for me to play my freshman year, man, so that was huge.

• 22:14Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 22:18Channing Crowder?

  We go D. We go D.

• 22:24Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Someaglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 22:39Channing Crowder?

  We go D.

• 22:43Speaker 01

  For me.

• 22:43Channing Crowder?

  And brother, thing like, don't trust men. And that's a, they say that, people say that all the time, but it brings me back to something that, because Steve Smith, we just had Steve Smith on, he was talking about how he saw his mama get beat too. And he was a fighter. I was a fighter, I saw my grandmama get hit. You were a fighter, you saw your mama get hit. Being out of control, and I didn't think about it back then, but being out of control physically, because I was like eight or nine years old, I couldn't grab my grandpa. But once I got to a size where I could grab me a motherf- Ain't nobody else in the world about to physically dominate me. Do you think, seeing that, the abuse, seeing domestic violence, kind of, I don't want to

• 23:24Channing Crowder?

  say made you a fighter, but made you not want anybody to fool with you, or knowing that you now can physically dominate people, that, nah, curtains for you.

• 23:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I never thought about it like that, bro, but yeah. Like, 1,000. Like, I'm physically capable now. So my family is off limits. Like, any, you can't talk sideways to them, you touch them, it's an issue. You talk sideways, it's an issue. I'm the one to speak up for my mother, my sister, my kids, my, I'm him, right? So, yeah, like, that part of it, right? It made, it turned me into something. Like, you see that, man, and it, it does something to you. Right? Whether you, you're not able to process it until you older, until you go talk to somebody, and you process those things, you start like, damn, that is wild. Like, the little boy in me is still, like, it's still there, but-

• 24:21Speaker 01

  I'm in a more, much more.

• 24:23Ryan Clark?

  That frame different.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  Frame different. Capable. Yeah, man, just transitioning to that into the way I play basketball. But yeah, life, man, it just, it was that. It turned me into that and it was never a second thought. Right? This is what it is now, man.

• 24:40Ryan Clark?

  Ken, how does that, what Channing said, because it is so profound, so powerful, that the, your experience shaped you, right? You see those things and you're like, okay, I'm to a point now I could protect myself, but also my family, you know? You got kids and your kids are older now, right? You got hoopers that have made it to the highest level. How did what you saw growing up shape you? Because, like you said, you or none of your closest friends had a father in the house with them, but you grow up to be that man. What decisions did, feeling what you felt growing up, what decisions did you make to make sure that wouldn't be the role that you took in your children's lives?

• 25:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, man, I have six beautiful children, man, three girls, three boys. So, um, but yeah, man, it's, it's that, man, like, didn't have it. Saw my dad once as a kid, 4th of July, when I was around that age where I drew that line, 10, 11 years old. Mom brought me a plane ticket. He lived out here in San Bernardino. He started another family and all that, so she brought me a plane ticket to come out here to see him. I had on the song, once, and just like, I ain't gonna be that.

• 25:56Speaker 01

  Like, whatever it was, didn't know if it was ever gonna be, come have kids or whatnot, but if I did, I vowed, I'm not gonna be that. I'm gonna be better than him. Whatever it was, I was gonna be better than him. And when KJ was born, man, like, I, of course, I'm out here, I'm doing, I'm 22 years old, bruh. I am, I'm about to be the number one pick in L.A. wild, right? I go back to Jersey, I leave a package here, right? I drop something off in L.A. I'm saying, before my rookie year.

• 26:32Ryan Clark?

  Had to go back and pick it up.

• 26:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know what I'm saying? So, I dropped the package off here before my rookie year, man, and so he was born my rookie year, KJ was born my rookie year, man, and he was at the time, man, the best thing that happened to me.

• 26:46Speaker 01

  And I spent every waking moment that I was free in the summer with him. My season was over in March because I broke my leg again my rookie year. The season was over in April, man, and I was on the first thing smoking.

• 27:05Speaker 01

  And just being around him, man, I was like, yo, this is dope. Right? And then you start to think like, how come dude didn't do this? Like, how can you not want this? How can you not feel like this?

• 27:22Speaker 01

  You never get those answers right then, but then it's just life start happening, right? I have KJ, then two years later, I have a little girl.

• 27:32Ryan Clark?

  Totally different experience.

• 27:33Speaker 01

  Totally different experience. So now, now I'm two in and then then I got a third. So I got, by the time I'm 20, I got three kids. Because I didn't, like, I'm thinking it's the way it's supposed to be, right? NBA, you do it this way, you got drafted, got, had kids, and I'm still young and I'm still learning all these things. I don't really know how to be a father yet, but I'm trying. Like, I'm doing everything that I think that is right. So, but yeah, man, I just vowed not to be that. Like, not, whatever, whatever came from it, like, when KJ was born, he said it off, but

• 28:09Speaker 01

  it's all of, has been a learning experience for me.

• 28:11Ryan Clark?

  What's beautiful about that is you hear sometimes people use that as an excuse. When they aren't around their children, when they feel like they haven't made the right decisions, they say things like, well, I never got to see it. That doesn't mean you have to be that exact thing because you didn't see it. It also doesn't mean you're going to be perfect or make the right decisions. But I think what you said that matters is you tried. And we got to just keep trying. You got to keep showing up. Like, your kids will remember, man, that, damn, it wasn't perfect and I ain't always like him. He wasn't, I ain't feel like he was always right, but he was there. And so I love that, man, that you made that vow and that decision.

• 28:51Channing Crowder?

  And then, quickly, that's beautiful.

• 28:55Channing Crowder?

  But you act like you ain't know how them babies was made.

• 28:57Speaker 01

  Oh, no, I knew.

• 28:58Channing Crowder?

  You was going raw.

• 28:59Speaker 01

  Oh, no, shoot up the club.

• 29:03Channing Crowder?

  And then the daughter came, and then the next one came.

• 29:07Ryan Clark?

  He said, I thought that was how it was supposed to be. And when he said it, I knew he was being sincere. So I didn't want to interrupt him. I was like, I don't really think the NBA mean you can just keep leaving them people.

• 29:19Speaker 01

  But it was the same person, though. No, no, so the thing is, my first three, listen, I'm, so the thing about, I, I don't have six by six.

• 29:27Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 29:27Speaker 01

  No, six by five, right, I, I got, I'm saying?

• 29:31Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 29:31Speaker 01

  I got three by one.

• 29:32Channing Crowder?

  Mm-hmm.

• 29:33Speaker 01

  Then I got one, then I got two.

• 29:35Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, sure.

• 29:36Speaker 01

  So I got two in the house with me right now, you know what I'm saying?

• 29:38Fred Taylor?

  That's why this is the pivot. That's what I'm saying, that's why this is the pivot. I'm trying to echo some of RC saying, keep going in that direction.

• 29:45Speaker 01

  But show though, but absolutely.

• 29:47Channing Crowder?

  I think we gotta let everybody know babies don't pop up.

• 29:49Speaker 01

  Out here in LA, they wild on like a V-12 motor.

• 29:55Speaker 01

  Right? Out here, dog. I'm out here, man, and I was hurt when I first came out here. So I was getting catered to, I, I couldn't, I was nowhere, I didn't drive for the first eight weeks I was here. Month, two months I was out here. I was getting driven around. So I'm going to dinners, going to places, hanging out with Keyshawn Johnson, and this place, this place, and they, hey, babe, they rubbing my leg and all this shit, and I'm like, man, this what it's, this is what LA about? Man, I love LA.

• 30:22Fred Taylor?

  That's those experiences, but no, really, just to go back on two things. Just to double down what RC said, not having a father present makes it twice as difficult to, to know or learn how to be a father. Right? But earlier you said, your experience is, you have two, two choices to make. You can go this way or this way. You chose to be a better father, to be better than, you know, your father was. Which brings me to the, the moment you actually got drafted, draft night. What sense did you feel that night? Was it a sense of relief, you know, load off?

• 30:58Speaker 01

  Relief. Like, if you look at my reaction to it, I put my head on the table, bruh. Like, like I weak. Like, wasn't a childhood dream of mine to play in the NBA, bruh.

• 31:15Speaker 01

  Like to grad, where I'm, this is a real, to graduate high school where I'm from, big deal. Right. To go to a four-year university, unheard of. The only person that I knew of that was from my immediate era, area that went to a four-year university and is stuck, was Kelvin Williams that played for the Cowboys, kicked return and went to the UW, like, he was from Dallas, he was from Oak Cliff, he went to VELP. Like, my name, only person. Was successful, but wouldn't have access to them. So it's that, but then you, you don't know what to do, it's, it's that.

• 31:50Speaker 01

  So for you to not know what it looked like, and for me to make it at that regard, like, I was happy to go to school, bruh.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Like, go to college, like, I was ecstatic, like I said, I got eligible my freshman year, man, I, I found out I was eligible. My, on my birthday, my freshman year, I got eligible, December 30th, I found out I got eligible, right? I was 3.4 in college, my high school grades were terrible. I was studious in, when I, my freshman year, I was, hey, man, this is awesome, right? I'm here. Yeah. But I didn't, like, it wasn't a dream of mine to play in the NBA. And when I tell people that, and knowing, like, national college player of the year, number one pick and all that, they're like, how? Like, how you didn't want to do, like, if you don't see it, it's nothing tangible. Right. You know, I didn't see NBA players going up, the first NBA player I saw,

• 32:46Speaker 01

  I was in high school, man, Jim Jackson and Jamal Mashburn came to do the thing at my high school, they was playing for the Mavericks. Who's the who? First time, and I'm challenging them, hey, I bust y'all ass. Not knowing they in the league, giving Scotty and Mike 50, right? But I'm arrogant in that regard, but I'm thinking, but not knowing, they really, really good, but that was the first NBA players I saw. I didn't know nothing about rankings and who this, that, and the third, man, I got the AB, I went to ABCD camp. I don't know when, right? Called a Greyhound. From Oak Cliff to Newark.

• 33:21Ryan Clark?

  What on that tape?

• 33:22Speaker 01

  Like 20 hours, bruh. 18, 6'8" on a grayhound.

• 33:28Ryan Clark?

  And that little bitty bat on.

• 33:30Speaker 01

  Hey. Couldn't afford a flight.

• 33:34Ryan Clark?

  If you couldn't see it, Kmart, then you build yourself up to be national player of the year. It's already done.

• 33:43Speaker 01

  Consensus.

• 33:44Ryan Clark?

  Consensus. It was, I remember watching it like it was yesterday. And, you know, Coach Huggins tells you the year before, hey, man, you come back, you'll be number one overall pick. You, you come back and...

• 33:56Speaker 01

  Not even that, it'll be better. Like, draft's not gonna be better. Not even number, like, just mid-20s this year, it'll be better next year.

• 34:04Ryan Clark?

  And you come back and you do everything you have to do to not only put yourself in the best position to be drafted number one overall, but you're on the best team in college basketball. It's March 9th, 2000, it's probably like 17 minutes left in the quarterfinals, playing against a team y'all had beat by 43 points. You set a routine pick.

• 34:28Ryan Clark?

  I remember, I remember, you could hear it when it snapped. If you didn't have that dream of being in the NBA, it had to at least be part of your reality at that point. When you're sitting on the ground calling for people to come get you, what are you thinking?

• 34:46Speaker 01

  The NBA wouldn't even have thought, bruh.

• 34:48Ryan Clark?

  Even then?

• 34:48Speaker 01

  No.

• 34:50Ryan Clark?

  Ken, y'all about to go to the...

• 34:52Speaker 01

  I'm thinking about the tournament. No, we had lost in the second round for three years prior to that. Second round exits. We getting out of the tournament, we getting out of the second round. I don't what, listen, that is my goal, is to get us out of the second round. Because I feel we get out the second round, oh, we got a legitimate shot at winning this thing. That man came, Huggs came out there, man, all I kept saying, man, not now.

• 35:20Speaker 01

  Man, not now. Man, we didn't work too hard for this, man, not now. That's all I kept saying, not now. He's just like, Ken, it's gonna be, not now, man. Like, right now? Like, right, like, at this moment, like, right now? I just kept, I just kept repeating, like, right now?

• 35:36Speaker 01

  Like that, my feelings was hurt. Like, I didn't think about my feel, I was, my feelings was, I was like distraught with that, like, not now, man. Uh-uh.

• 35:46Ryan Clark?

  Did you feel like you let him down?

• 35:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. Big time. Cause I, there was, this was it. This is what we had, the time we had averaging three and a half points as a freshman. Barely playing, not eligible right away, didn't build, yeah.

• 36:03Speaker 01

  Big time, let that man down. Like, wasn't even thinking about the NBA. Like I'm saying, it wasn't, like.

• 36:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, throughout my senior year, of course, the notoriety started, right? Face everywhere around Cincinnati, buses, billboards, grocery store, you look, I'm there, right? I knew that, but I just thought it's a college thing, dog. I was, man, I didn't know, until agents start, people start showing up and start, like, people pulling you to the side, and, hey, man, who your agent, who you signing with, did you have him?

• 36:38Speaker 01

  What you talking about? Didn't know none of that, dog. Till my senior year, man, and then it just, then, as the year went on, man. Like, dead ass, man, this is a real thing, man. Like, AAU basketball, lucked up and got on an AAU team. Dudes told me they was going to hoop.

• 36:56Speaker 01

  You wanna come hoop with us? Yeah. Went out here and they, and the dude was like, man, who you play for? Like, what you, like, I'm in between schools. Wanna hoop with us? Got a team, travel team, traveling where? Fuck you mean? Can you get back out here tomorrow? Man, he was in a part of Dallas I had never seen. It was in Collin County, past Plano, had never heard of it. Dudes driving us, dude that driving, come in, man, where the hell we going? Naive, dog. Play basketball hard, that's it. By the time I, by the time I seen your camera, listen, don't know if you heard me, say, listen, man.

• 37:35Speaker 01

  Dunk shit, fight shit, block shit. That's high school, college, dog. That's how I got there. Listen, them orders, dunk shit, block shit, fight shit.

• 37:47Channing Crowder?

  Well, came up.

• 37:48Speaker 01

  Dog, dead ass, man, y'all think I'm joking.

• 37:51Channing Crowder?

  But you talk about goals. Dunk shit, fight shit, block shit is not a goal.

• 37:55Speaker 01

  Who had goals? I'm asking you, you ain't never had no goals? Who was gonna tell me what was tangible?

• 38:03Channing Crowder?

  Cause you watching the dudes that was the number one player in the nation? Go and do what they did. You watching dude number one play in college? Go and do what they did. You ain't watched the people that were in front of you do what they did before you?

• 38:13Speaker 01

  Dog, when I got to ABC, they, they and them motherfuckers talking about rankings? And I'm like, rank, ooh, where? Ranking, who's this dude? Like, why everybody falling him around? It was Kobe. Like, why everybody falling him around? Why he special? Like, this is dead ass, man. Like, them dudes went to the league in 1996, man. The year we graduated high school. All of us graduated 96 together. They did four years in the league. I did four years in Cincinnati. Same trajectory, but I was. Who was at that camp? Everybody. Class of 96. Kobe was the number one player in the class. Yeah, Ramel Lloyd, Shaheem Holloway, Lester Earl, Tim Thomas.

• 38:54Fred Taylor?

  Tim Thomas too, right?

• 38:55Speaker 01

  It was a bunch, yeah, that's what I'm saying, so. And you didn't know anything about any of those people? I caught a bus, man.

• 39:05Speaker 01

  I caught a Greyhound. I caught a, and the thing is, so, listen. Caught a Greyhound there, right? I played my, I got a flight home, dog. That's how well you played? Hard.

• 39:18Fred Taylor?

  So, explain this. How does taking a Greyhound 20 hours turn into 15 years in the NBA?

• 39:26Speaker 01

  Just don't deviate, man. Like, it was never built on skill.

• 39:32Speaker 01

  I would never built, don't like, the ticker, man. Like, whatever it's gonna be, like, throw the ball up. That's used to be my thing, throw the ball up, dawg.

• 39:44Speaker 01

  I'ma beat you to it.

• 39:46Speaker 01

  Throw it up, I'ma go get it. It's on the floor, I'ma go get it. Like, you ain't gonna play harder than me.

• 39:53Speaker 01

  You're not. It's just what it is. You don't know you was in the basketball game, dawg. Listen, and then let's keep it on the line. Let's hoop. Let's hoop. I wanna hoop, I wanna play basketball. And I just did it a certain way. For, for a long time, and I didn't, like, so when I got to school, man, I averaged, I shot thirty percent from the free throw line. And averaged three and a half points as a freshman at Cincinnati, man.

• 40:20Speaker 01

  I was terrible at the skill set of it.

• 40:25Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 40:25Speaker 01

  Right? Athletic, played hard, clean slate.

• 40:33Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time. We go V. We go V. Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Someaglutide injection, two point four milligrams a GLP-1. Call one eight three three four Wegovy or visit Wegovy.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait? We go V.

• 41:02Ryan Clark?

  With that, like, they always make fun of me because I didn't get drafted, right? And this joker got picked ninth. You know what I'm saying? He went, he went to- Makes fun of you, RC. Bro, he went to, he went to train- I do. He went to train for the combine, bro. And the man told him, "All I can do is mess you up, go home." That's how fast he was. He ran four two- It's a true story. Ran four two eight on grass. Like, I don't know, I don't know what that life is like. You know what I'm saying? You were recently called an underachiever.

• 41:29Ryan Clark?

  I don't believe you can be an underachiever if that's where you start and you play. The amount of time you play, you become the consensus player of the year. You're drafted number one overall, you become an all-star. I just don't believe you could be an underachiever and accomplish all of those things starting where you from. When you hear something like that, how does that digest for you? What are your initial thoughts in hearing something like that about yourself?

• 41:57Speaker 01

  So, the thing is, so when I first got wind, my son, so KJ called me, it was like 6 o'clock in the morning. Phone, I'm thinking something wrong, right? Him, what the hell you doing up at the?

• 42:10Speaker 01

  He like, you see what the dude said about you? I'm like, nah, he said this, so he sent it to me. My wife, she, so she listening to me talk to KJ. She on the phone, she texting me, like, why?

• 42:22Ryan Clark?

  Texted KJ?

• 42:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, why?

• 42:24Channing Crowder?

  You crack him up.

• 42:26Speaker 01

  Why? Early this morning before we, like, I can't even get the kids ready now. I'm, my mind going.

• 42:35Ryan Clark?

  Underachiever, like?

• 42:36Speaker 01

  So, and that's what got me with the whole statement, right? You say, with all, all those things that you said, cool, but that word? Not so much. Like I stated when I got my spill I gave. Yeah, if I, if I, what I got into it for was to play 15 years, once I got in? Like, how am I underachiever? Then you really start, like, so once I started really replaying it, right? My career, how it started and how it went, the injuries, all of that, and I'm like, dude, you got me all, you got me messed up, bruh, like? So, took some, couple people that's in my immediate, like, to breathe.

• 43:23Speaker 01

  Cause my initial was, I'm from the-

• 43:27Speaker 01

  I'm gonna take off and it ain't gonna be about basketball, right? My initial was.

• 43:31Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 43:33Speaker 01

  You know what? Let me go a different route with it. But, nah, not a, far from an underachiever, dog. Like, wasn't like, didn't, didn't set out to be this. Furthest thing from my imagination as a kid. Furthest thing from my imagination as a teenager.

• 43:52Speaker 01

  For it to be a real thing to, to buy my mom, to your point about my draft, right? To, my mom never owned anything. My mom never had a car. My mom never had a house. My mom, we used to have to catch the bus to go buy groceries. Right? My mom caught the bus to work when she, so we never owned anything. So that moment, draft moment. Changed it. Changed everything, so. Overachiever, brother, actually, from where I came from.

• 44:26Speaker 01

  So, to be able to buy her her first house. Buy my sister a house. Because I lived with my sister three of my four years in high school. My, three, my sister three years older than me.

• 44:40Speaker 01

  So it's a hell of a responsibility. I lived with my sister three of my four years in high school. Right? While she's taking care of a child.

• 44:48Speaker 01

  Not me, her own child.

• 44:52Speaker 01

  Buy her her first car and house, my mom, same thing, right? Nah, bruh. In the finals my second year, my third year. All-star, max contract. Come back from, the first person to come back from two microfracture surgeries. Under, and, come on, bruh. Like, nah, numbers and all that, cool. Like, you, success is success. Yeah, you, it's, it's all different forms and shapes and perspectives and all of it, right? But, nah, I'm not gonna let you say that. Like, you just wanna talk the hoops? Cool, you had, career was good, bruh, flowers.

• 45:38Speaker 01

  But, you're not finna use that. Not when, I'm. Nah, bruh. Like, from where I came from to the skill, nah, we not finna do none of that.

• 45:50Ryan Clark?

  Football players, right. I think we see basketball players differently. Right? It's a game where faking like you're injured or like you've been ran over is actually a plus. Right? Like if I flop, like if I get hit and I flop, then I might get the call. Like, we don't really know that life. You know what I'm saying? Like, anytime I got bumped or two in the game, I'm bumping back, or I'm hitting back, because I can't let you think that you in any way got the advantage of me.

• 46:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:17Ryan Clark?

  Right? When I was watching, y'all showed up today, one of your clips, and Gil was like, "Yeah, man, most people that scared don't want the physicality or the pain of what happens." And there was like, actual video, I've seen it obviously, of you fighting. Isn't everybody, mostly in basketball, a fake tough guy, though? Like, I don't, I don't, I don't, like, I don't look at ba-, I don't look at any basketball players than be like, "Hey, man, I think, like, I think he really bout that." Like, you, everybody knew. You know what I'm saying? It's like, hey, man, nah. Like, if you run up on him, you gonna have to see him. I feel like all basketball players, even the ones who behave in a necessarily tougher way, are sort of fake tough guys.

• 47:00Ryan Clark?

  So isn't that like a hard statement to like, label somebody in the game?

• 47:04Speaker 01

  It's what, you just look at the footage. Right? And it's how you play against everybody, and how you treat everybody, not select people. Right? When you stand on it, you stand on it.

• 47:19Speaker 01

  You don't deviate, you don't pick and choose. When somebody came across the middle, big tight end, you didn't, you didn't be like, "Nah, I'm not gonna do him." Like, no, you doing, like, I saw a clip recently after me and you spoke, like, listen, it was like a day after, I'm like, "Damn, RC." Like, you didn't deviate, you didn't deviate. If there was a linebacker in the hole, you were like, "Uh, let me get down." Like, no, you gonna, you trying to run through him. You gonna treat him just like he a DB.

• 47:46Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 47:46Speaker 01

  If it's a corner, you ain't, you ain't, no, you gonna boom, boom, here he move, alright, let's get it.

• 47:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, line him up.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  So, that, that's the way I look at it. Right? And it's, it's a lot of other people. I look at Mike, Michael Jordan, that same regard.

• 48:01Ryan Clark?

  Fake tough guy?

• 48:02Speaker 01

  No.

• 48:02Ryan Clark?

  Oh.

• 48:03Speaker 01

  Mike gonna get to it. You challenge him, you do something, he gonna get to it.

• 48:06Ryan Clark?

  Been like that.

• 48:07Speaker 01

  Been that way.

• 48:08Ryan Clark?

  Xavier McDaniel.

• 48:09Speaker 01

  Exa-, yeah. People look at X-Man as being one of them.

• 48:15Speaker 01

  Forehead to forehead with this dude. Yeah. But it's, you don't deviate from it. You don't pick and choose who you wanna be that way with. You don't get to do that when there's people I heard that really. About that. Yeah, like, no, I don't deviate, whoever it is, get it from nine, like I said, nine to ninety-nine, blind cripple or crazy, dawg.

• 48:35Speaker 01

  Not deviating, I'm saying, because you, you, no, no, I'ma stand on it. Win, lose, or draw. I'm saying, I ain't say I've won every one. No, but we gon', no, I'm not gon' separate. Ah, he play power, I'm not gon' do it to him, I'm gon' do it to the two, I'm gon' do it to the, no, no. You come across the land, I'm hitting your shit.

• 48:58Fred Taylor?

  That's the RC mentality.

• 49:00Channing Crowder?

  But, but I would say, cause I've asked this question a lot, of basketballers, cause that's one thing, I ain't gon' lie, football dude, we looking at basketball dudes. You six-eight, two-sixty, and a little motherfucker hit right in your chest and you flying to the third row.

• 49:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:14Channing Crowder?

  You can't, I'm not scared of you no more. I can't be scared of you no more, but. I, how many dudes, I don't need you to name, you know, if you wanna do a list, but. I don't think there's dozens of guys that play basketball that's really, you talking about?

• 49:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, not these days.

• 49:29Channing Crowder?

  That stand on business? When did that stop? When did stand on business stop? Cause I, I'm, we friends with Udonis Haslem.

• 49:35Speaker 01

  Two thousands.

• 49:35Channing Crowder?

  U, UD?

• 49:36Speaker 01

  UD stand on it.

• 49:37Channing Crowder?

  I believe, UD stand on business, but I done seen UD stand on business walking down Wynwood too. So I know UD stand on business.

• 49:43Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 49:44Channing Crowder?

  But, I don't think a lot of these dudes nowadays is like that.

• 49:47Speaker 01

  They're not, they don't want no problem, no confrontation, they, everything has been. Hey, um, unicorns and rainbows and glitter, dawg.

• 49:54Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 49:55Speaker 01

  Like, I didn't grow up that way. Like, they ain't what, who I, I've come a long way, trust me. But, nah, that ain't, it ain't, no, cause it's.

• 50:06Speaker 01

  Y'all sport, y'all built on competing every possession. Every time that ball snap, it's a competition, it's personal. It ain't that no more for a lot of people. And for the dudes who really didn't know how to deviate from it, those are the guys that was like that in the league. Like, there was no on or off switch with it. Once the, I used to tell people, man, once the ball go, I blackout. Yeah. But once we in that 94-50 and that ball go up. It's time to go. Yeah, like, I didn't need, like, people use certain things to rev them up, to hype themself up to play, to be this way, to do. No, once I tied, once I put them joints on and I tied, got taped,

• 50:49Speaker 01

  I turn around in my locker, dawg, like, I got my back to my team. I'm sitting in my locker, facing the locker. I'm ready. When that ball go up, I'm on 10. Like, it ain't no, look, let's get ready to play. Like, no, when the ball go up, I'm on 10. So, anything other than that, I'm 12, 15, like, people like, hey, can you went to 10, or can you start the game on 10? Like, I started the game. You could've tipped, jumped ball, and you say the wrong thing, the first, it's 2-0. Go! Wick, Wick was short, man, like, nonexistent, bruh.

• 51:30Fred Taylor?

  Kmart, I know this might be all kind of out of order, but I think it's necessary, because this is what I feel, because RC's son just got moved up to the active roster, Jordan. He's been working his ass off, so he's deserved it. Going back to draft night, though, I want to ask you, man, what was more special, hearing your name called on draft night or hearing KJ's name being called on draft night?

• 51:54Speaker 01

  Oh, Junior by far. Yeah, Junior, yeah, because it's a childhood dream of his. Like, it wasn't mine, like, I didn't have a childhood dream playing in the NBA, he did. Right, he wanted to follow in them footsteps. Yeah, so I was a wreck on draft day. On his? Yeah, I was a wreck. Like, I was ready for mine to be over. I was just, listen, man, it's gonna be one or two with me, like, one or two. Let's get this shit started, right? For him, it was a lot of uncertainty, right? Because of the path that he, that we decided to go for him. And, yeah, man, it was, I was, my wife was like, man, get away. Like, don't go outside, like, good, because don't let him see you like this.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  So, but to hear it, man, and, like, it's, it's a undescribable feeling. Right? And, and for it to even pan out even more, you're five years in and so far, and, yeah, nah, that's, yeah, it's like the birth, you know what I'm saying? Like, it's like seeing that, man, it's like, wow, like, it's, it's that emotion, right? And, and to be able to share it with him along the way of, I probably missed maybe one game with KJ's when he was in high school. AAU and all that, because I was playing in the Big Three and I had, they had a tournament. But other than that, I probably missed one game, bruh.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  So to be there, every step of the way to see it and to see the growth and to see, like, all of it, right? And for it to come, come all the way around for him, man, and, like, he, he, he wanted it. And the things that he did in high school, man, to get better, like, it was grind for him. A lot of people wouldn't have did it. Like, a lot of people would have been like, man, I'm not working out, it's hard, I'm not going to this place, I'm not doing this. But he, everything that I put in front of him to get better, he did, he listened, and, yeah, and it, and it worked out, man, and he, he is a, he's a special kid, man. He's a, he's a good person first and foremost, right? And you want good things to happen to good people, especially kids, right?

• 54:07Speaker 01

  Shit dope though, it's, it's a, it's a good feeling, man.

• 54:09Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, definitely. My son was drafted in, uh, 2016. It was a good, it was a good moment for everybody. But add to that, because you mentioned how your children changed you a bit.

• 54:20Fred Taylor?

  We always ask our guests their biggest pivot in life. It's that one moment you can look back on and say, because this happened to me or for me? That's the reason I am who I am today.

• 54:30Speaker 01

  My biggest pivot, man, has looking in the mirror, man, and, and being honest with myself on that.

• 54:41Speaker 01

  Need to talk to somebody.

• 54:43Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 54:43Speaker 01

  Right? Needed help. So, yeah. Wife was doing an excellent job, but still you need somebody. So my biggest thing was yeah, looking in the mirror and being honest with myself, man.

• 54:54Fred Taylor?

  We've done 400 shows, over 400 shows and we've never had... Every answer is different, but that's the... I think that's more profound than any of them. And everyone's unique, right? And deservedly so. But just to be able to say, "Look in the mirror," is the reason I changed everything. I think that's deep.

• 55:12Speaker 01

  Rough around the edges, bruh. Like real, real life shit.

• 55:17Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 55:27Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Someaglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 55:46Channing Crowder?

  So is the fighting totally out your system? Because you talk shit. And being a dude that fought in the past, I'm, I'm, I'm trying to get to a point where I can tell. Even my wife, I'm married 16 years. And my kids. Also, your children go back and look at the news cycle. Man. And I know that's tough on you because my kid's like, Daddy, you got locked up. You was... And I'm like, well, it was, it was detention.

• 56:12Channing Crowder?

  They dropped the felony.

• 56:15Channing Crowder?

  The felony got dropped to a misdemeanor two weeks later. But just, is it done? Because we talking about, like, you, you talk shit, you argue online and all, and we do it too. People argue me online. I don't feel as if I need to smack nobody in the head no more. Is the fighting out of your system? Is there anything? I won't say anything, if somebody grabbed your wife or kid or something.

• 56:34Speaker 01

  I'm finna tell you a real story.

• 56:35Channing Crowder?

  Okay, is the fighting out of your system?

• 56:36Speaker 01

  No. Because I'll... Monday before, Monday or the Tuesday before Thanksgiving, I was...

• 56:43Channing Crowder?

  You were about to lock up?

• 56:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, because dude, no, so we at Costco, bruh. Like me and my wife.

• 56:47Channing Crowder?

  You can't fight at Costco.

• 56:48Speaker 01

  No, okay, so I'm finna tell you the story and then you tell me yes and no. We, we... Carts, we, my wife's car is here, I'm parked here. There's an empty spot next to my wife's car. She's behind the spot with the basket. I'm putting the eggs and stuff in hers, in her car, in her front seat. Dude, don't he getting ready, some dude trying to back in the spot. He say, "Move bitch." Yeah, for sure. Yeah. And you, he sees you. No, he don't see me, he just see her. Mm-hmm.

• 57:23Speaker 01

  And I, I hear her like, "Who you calling a bitch?"

• 57:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, and then you walk out. Yeah, I guess. Come right from around the car like. So he had his sunroof, the vent cracked on the sunroof. I get up to the car, but listen, this is the grown me now. Yeah. The younger version of me, this would, no, it would've went a whole different way from the beginning. Yeah. The younger me, I know me, the younger me, I would've busted his window out and pulled him out the car. Yeah. That's the young me. The refined. The refined me let him get out the car and stand right over him. He probably left. First you lie, said you was on the phone. You fucking lie.

• 58:08Speaker 01

  She hurt you, I didn't, she hurt you. You go apologize. I get closer to it, you go apologize. Well, I'm sorry you thought, start over. She didn't think nothing, she hurt you.

• 58:23Speaker 01

  Dude kinda sore, yeah, muscles on, you tell he lift, cool. Now I get closer. Apologize. He apologized and he like, man, you really gonna, yeah, I'm gonna press you out, I don't give a about none of them muscles you got neither. Told him straight up. And normally, she's like, like she is, like, when you say like you got a better half? She is my better half, cuz without her dog, this thing would've been fell off the rails. Trust me. What, what's she doing? She's, this moment, she, she normally talk me off the ledge. She didn't say nothing in this moment. Cuz he was wrong. He was, they were wrong. And hat, and she, and right, as soon as he apologize, we, he do well. She like, "I'm glad you didn't have to go to jail today." Because I was gonna do it.

• 59:06Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 59:06Speaker 01

  Right then and there, dawg. Like, whatever would've came from it.

• 59:10Channing Crowder?

  It's, it is what it is.

• 59:11Speaker 01

  And I, because, you know, I'm, I'm, you know, bruh. So, no, to that point, because I don't bother nobody. That's the thing, like, I don't matter, listen. I hold the door open for people, man, I'm, yes, please, thank you, no thank you. I am him, dawg, I respect for people, time, I do. I am him, in that regard.

• 59:30Channing Crowder?

  Mm-hmm.

• 59:31Speaker 01

  My, like, we spoiled it before, my family on the limits, dawg. And he, listen, and he is lucky, he got the forty-seven, soon to be forty-eight-year-old me. Because the, the forty, seven years ago, he would've got it.

• 59:48Speaker 01

  We ain't talking about twenty-five, no, we talking about the forty-year-old dude. I would've gave him everything he was looking for in that moment. Did you just call my wife by that name, bro? You got me all the way bent.

• 59:59Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, I agree.

• 59:59Speaker 01

  I'm saying, like, no, that's, no, dawg. So, so to your point, no, dawg.

• 1:00:03Ryan Clark?

  Hey, six, ten. Could you imagine if you don't do something, though? And you go home, and you get into it with your old lady, she be like, you ain't say nothing when he called me up.

• 1:00:11Channing Crowder?

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 1:00:12Ryan Clark?

  That part, right?

• 1:00:13Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:00:15Ryan Clark?

  But, you ain't tell, you ain't tell buddy nothing.

• 1:00:17Channing Crowder?

  I'm thinking about Richard, that thought he was slick, calling that, calling his wife a bitch, and then saw this big motherfucker walk around the corner.

• 1:00:23Ryan Clark?

  He six, he come out there six-nine, too, though.

• 1:00:25Speaker 01

  So, just imagine if I'm not there, though. That's, so that's my whole thing, like, how many, who?

• 1:00:29Ryan Clark?

  What, what's the next step?

• 1:00:30Speaker 01

  I'm saying, you done did this to, like, some other woman before, like, you know, like, nah, ain't nothing cool.

• 1:00:35Ryan Clark?

  You tighten him up for the world.

• 1:00:36Speaker 01

  I want to know, you calling him, like, what you here for, and, like, what your purpose is in life, with certain things. I'm, I've come to the realization that I've been put on this planet to be that person with people. Because if you do something in that moment, I am gonna say something. Whether it's, like, if I hold the door open for you, and you don't say thank you, I am gonna say something.

• 1:01:01Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:02Speaker 01

  You too, I'm gonna say something, you, I'm gonna say something. If it don't, if it don't line up with my common sense, which a lot of times it don't. I'm gonna say something, man. Like, that's just what it is, bro.

• 1:01:16Ryan Clark?

  I have a question. When does it get to, when does it get to a point? Because I am, though only 5'11", very much like you, right? And I say it all the time, I'm extremely polite. I'm from New Orleans, right? We raised, my mama asked me a question. If I just said, "Yes," "Yes what?" "Yes, ma'am." Right, so I'm like that. I'm even more polite and generous and mannerable because I try to protect people from me.

• 1:01:38Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm, yes.

• 1:01:39Ryan Clark?

  Right, because I, I want to know you intentionally had to be an asshole. Right, because I, because if I do you something and you just responded, then that's on me.

• 1:01:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:48Ryan Clark?

  But if I'm holding the door, if I'm trying to move out of your way, if I'm being considerate and you still do me bad, then you went out of your way to do this. So, we deserve this altercation together. Right, this, this is for us to have. Right, like, that, that's just how I see it.

• 1:02:01Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:02:02Ryan Clark?

  Right?

• 1:02:02Speaker 01

  10,000.

• 1:02:03Ryan Clark?

  I was, we was put here in this place together to have this conversation. God sent me for you. But I also realize too, though, like, and he tells me all the time, it's like, some of it you do have to let go. Right, because, because you put yourself in bad situations where you're dealing with folks who don't have what you had to lose, who aren't in the place to, where they are taking care of everybody. And like, they don't have anything that registers with what you've accomplished. You know what I'm saying? So, I feel like I'm trying to work my way out of it.

• 1:02:33Speaker 01

  Why, why? People ain't earned that. People, listen.

• 1:02:36Ryan Clark?

  But you, you earned it, though.

• 1:02:38Speaker 01

  I did, so I carry myself a certain way, yes. But people ain't earned that, dawg. Like, people are horrible, man.

• 1:02:44Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 1:02:44Speaker 01

  Like, so my daughter, we in the car the other day, my 10-year-old, right? We going to PetSmart. I'm going to go buy the dogs some beds. I don't know what happened. I was like, "I really don't like people." And she said, "I know daddy." Yo, this is the 10-year-old, soon to be 11-year-old. She said, "I, I know, I know daddy." Dawg, people, man. Like, because I'm, like I said, I'm respectful, I'm considerate, I'm all, but, and when it don't line up...

• 1:03:09Channing Crowder?

  Because I, I think of myself as an ordained air marshal. I don't, I, if anything happens on the plane, I get up, I try to regulate it. Hey, sit down, don't argue with her, you know.

• 1:03:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:19Channing Crowder?

  But if something really goes down, I'm not putting my family's future on the line because they

• 1:03:23Speaker 01

  Oh, no, no, no, no.

• 1:03:24Channing Crowder?

  That's what I was saying. So if you smack that dude in the, in the Costco parking lot, the Martin family is negatively affected. You just slapped this dude, he suing people, their legal fees, there's so much stuff. You can mess up a lot more.

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  I hear you, but I can go home and look at my wife.

• 1:03:39Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I agree with that.

• 1:03:40Channing Crowder?

  I know, and you checked him. But if it got to physicality, it could have went a long way further to negatively affect your family.

• 1:03:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I thought, so that's, that's the growth.

• 1:03:50Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:50Speaker 01

  Right?

• 1:03:51Ryan Clark?

  That's why he didn't punch the window in.

• 1:03:52Speaker 01

  That's why I didn't break his window and pull him out the car, through the window, right?

• 1:03:55Channing Crowder?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:03:55Speaker 01

  So, growth.

• 1:03:57Channing Crowder?

  The growth is...

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  But still, you can still can...

• 1:03:59Channing Crowder?

  Still gotta tighten his ass up.

• 1:04:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, you still can, you do a certain thing, man, like, don't touch me, don't bother, don't do nothing to my family, we good.

• 1:04:05Fred Taylor?

  What that TMZ video looking like, though? You getting schooled or you gonna hit him with the Cincinnati seven piece?

• 1:04:12Speaker 01

  Hey, listen, man, whatever's gonna happen is gonna happen.

• 1:04:14Ryan Clark?

  Hey, I tell people all the time, man, the reason I'm okay with fighting is because I'm not, I'm okay with losing one.

• 1:04:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, of course, I've lost before.

• 1:04:21Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, most people who don't want to fight just don't want to lose.

• 1:04:23Speaker 01

  I've lost before.

• 1:04:24Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I've lost a fight.

• 1:04:25Speaker 01

  Lost a fight, lost before, so it won't be the first time.

• 1:04:29Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I tell, Chad say that all the time, too.

• 1:04:31Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, I don't want to see a seven piece, though. Bitch, after four, if I ain't got one off? K, K, come on, come on.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:04:39Channing Crowder?

  You done caught me with four, and I ain't even got one off?

• 1:04:41Speaker 01

  Back up.

• 1:04:41Channing Crowder?

  That man called seven?

• 1:04:43Ryan Clark?

  My last question for you, my last question to you will be this, bro. Because of the way media has gotten now, right? It's like, the thing that sensationalized is going to be your conversation with Draymond. Like, that's gonna be, that's gonna be everywhere. And it's going to be, in a sense, positive for marketing and for brand and for the show, for his show, all of those things, but I do feel like there's negativity to the interaction. Right? And I've been intentionally trying to work my way out of those things. Right? Even in how I asked you the question earlier, right? Because... You know, I don't, like, I don't play TV.

• 1:05:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's what people want.

• 1:05:26Ryan Clark?

  Right? You know what I'm saying? Like, if I, if it gets personal between us, and if you're, and I feel like you're intentionally trying to make it personal, and I am too, I'm comfortable with whatever happens with that. And I know other people are doing it for entertainment, so I try to stay out of it.

• 1:05:40Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:05:40Ryan Clark?

  As the, as we get into this business, right, and we are the OGs, and I know you're seen as one of the realest, like, the CP story, where you talk about, you know, what you, how you guys interacted on the bench, and you was like, nah, Denny, stay out of this. How do you weigh whether or not to tell that story, knowing the implications of what it'll say about, I guess, him, or how people will see you as the storyteller?

• 1:06:11Speaker 01

  I give it thought. I've learned from being in your, like, the TV space, right? Me doing ESPNs, the Foxes, having a radio show and certain things. I've learned what, how to be PC when I need to be, and how to give people the unfiltered truth on camera, you know what I'm saying? So, and that's why I would say, like, the things that's how, it can be research, right? If people really want to know, they can research. If they're like you do, if you really want to know the things that I'm saying are accurate, and when I'm talking of the CP thing, right? I'm not speaking of things that people don't already think.

• 1:06:50Ryan Clark?

  Okay.

• 1:06:50Speaker 01

  Right? So I'm not putting anything extra on it. I'm giving my own, if I have an experience in this moment with a situation or a person, I think that's the value that I've gained with me being in this space, right? My experiences, and being able to articulate them and share them, no matter how it comes across. Because you're gonna have some of the population that loves what I'm saying, some of them go, you think you're tough, some people go, hate it, so it's, right? But me giving people a story of, like, then why they do that to CP, right? Because everybody, they did CP wrong, like, but you don't know the person.

• 1:07:34Speaker 01

  So, if I have something to maybe clear a little bit of it up, good or bad.

• 1:07:41Speaker 01

  The fans I feel deserve some of it, not, I'm saying like,

• 1:07:45Ryan Clark?

  I got you.

• 1:07:45Speaker 01

  But that's why I try not to speak on other people's doings and dwellings with people. I'm saying their experiences, because I have 15 years of them to share. Good, bad, or indifferent, dealing with different people throughout that tenure, right? And it's just, most of the time, things that come out is when the controversial things that people want to hear. And I've either put myself in situations, or situations have arisen that I didn't shy away from, that I have those stories to tell.

• 1:08:22Speaker 01

  Like, if people thought Chris Paul was a saint and all these things, then I wouldn't share my story. Because it ain't on me to change people's image about him.

• 1:08:33Ryan Clark?

  So you're saying if Chris Paul was thought of as this easy to get along with guy, this teammate, that's a certain way, and your story was opposing those things?

• 1:08:44Speaker 01

  Off camera, I'm gonna tell y'all.

• 1:08:46Ryan Clark?

  But you wouldn't do that publicly?

• 1:08:47Speaker 01

  Not on camera, because y'all athletes, y'all athletes, so around people, around people, like the general public?

• 1:08:53Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:53Speaker 01

  No, I don't tell stories that people shouldn't hear.

• 1:08:57Ryan Clark?

  Got you.

• 1:08:57Speaker 01

  Because you don't deserve that, you wasn't in, you wasn't here with us.

• 1:09:00Ryan Clark?

  You wasn't with us, right.

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  So whether it was y'all like or my like, I don't know. I mean, he's a good dude, man, he cool. I mean, what about, he cool.

• 1:09:07Ryan Clark?

  And poor.

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, he, he, but us, I mean, what was the other, off camera? Man, that man, that man, that, that, he did, did, that, that, that, that. But that's us, everybody can't get that.

• 1:09:20Channing Crowder?

  The same way, when CP was on with us, I told him, I was like, bro, you a perception of asshole. He was kind of like, it is what it is, he explained it out. So that's the best thing, and I think in our platform, we could talk about. My thing too, you talking about the Draymond stuff, basketball players seem to use numbers when they, when it benefits them and not, and don't when it doesn't.

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:39Channing Crowder?

  So, Draymond, four-time All-Star, Dwyane Wade of the year, All-NBA, what, five first team, four second, whatever it is and all that stuff, you could look, put that down, then you talking about points per game he's put up because he ain't a scorer and all that stuff. What, what, how do you evaluate a player? Is it all eye test? Because I, and I'm not talking about, you know, I'm talking about period NBA players. Numbers don't mean nothing to y'all when it doesn't benefit y'all argument.

• 1:10:04Speaker 01

  Yes, for me, I don't, I can care less. The dudes that did it, they did it. I will give you your flowers here, first and foremost. Flowers. Yeah. I played against you.

• 1:10:19Speaker 01

  I watched you play. I watched you tuck tail. I watched these things. I watched you not approach. I'd seen these things.

• 1:10:28Speaker 01

  From experience, I did it. I played at the highest level, experienced the highest level, played on the same, all of it. So, when I speak on it.

• 1:10:38Speaker 01

  It's thing, real, so. It's, it's eye test. Eye test, but y'all, y'all watch film? The same way. Y'all watch more film than anybody. Yeah. So, and you watching live games and live action, right? And you know what to look for. You know.

• 1:10:57Speaker 01

  Linebacker, you know what to look for, dawg. Safeties, you know what to, dude ducking certain things and certain dudes coming through the hole and he could've, and he go block a dude or some shit, right? You, you see these things, everybody else might not see it, but this dude. Right, yeah, like, or, or, so you see these things and you, you able to, like, process it in real time, like, man, look at this dude. Or you watching the game with somebody, you, this is my thing, if something happen. The beauty of things about rewinding things now. Look, my, look, my wife's so well versed in, man, look at this motherfucker, right? I'll get the.

• 1:11:36Speaker 01

  He start Tim Legler. Yes, I'm pausing it, man, look at this, look, look, look at this, watch this. Yeah. Watch him duck this person, watch, watch him not do, like, leave him alone. Like, shit, listen, leave him alone. She like, man, leave him, let it go. Yeah, but I'm just, yeah, I, I just, I'm very observant, right? And it's, when I speak on it, like, it ain't everything, but it's just.

• 1:12:02Speaker 01

  From certain things or from experience, right? And firsthand knowledge of it. Yeah, I don't, I don't speak on flopping because I didn't do it. I don't know how. So I can't give you a masterclass in that. I can't speak on that. I can't speak on the nun, the, the freedom of movement thing that they play in the NBA nowadays. I can't, all of the, I can't speak on that. Cause it wasn't a thing for me, it wasn't a thing when I played. And so I, I'm speaking on, when I'm watching.

• 1:12:32Speaker 01

  Oh, man, you don't want nothing, man. Nah, you don't want nothing. You like you, like you, man, you ain't gonna kill nothing or let nothing die.

• 1:12:40Ryan Clark?

  Hey, I tell her all the time when I see her. Hey, when I see the boy, they be like, what's up? I'm like, man, shit, I ain't gonna kill nothing, I ain't gonna let nothing die. I ain't about no action today, I'm chilling.

• 1:12:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm with it, but nah, man, once you, so like I said, if you portray it, then that's...

• 1:12:54Ryan Clark?

  You gotta be it.

• 1:12:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's what I, like, other than that, then cool. Nah, just be who you are, man. Like, there's nothing wrong with that.

• 1:13:03Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:04Speaker 01

  There's nothing wrong with, cool, but it once, like I said, once you being selective and once you, people look at you different. Like, you go ask other dudes who, before me, that's still around, that played a certain way, that did a certain way during my time. Go ask, it's the same, I'm telling you.

• 1:13:21Ryan Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:13:22Speaker 01

  It's the same status, 100% across the board.

• 1:13:25Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:26Speaker 01

  Oh, man, dude, man, come on, man. Like, it ain't, nah, man, he wouldn't have, it's just everybody's story gonna be how they would have handled the situation.

• 1:13:34Ryan Clark?

  But they knew, they knew it was gonna be a situation.

• 1:13:36Speaker 01

  I'm not gonna start it, but if you keep, I'mma put you in a situation to make you wanna do something. To your point, I know what I'mma do. So, I'mma put you in a situation to make you wanna do something.

• 1:13:47Ryan Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:13:48Speaker 01

  So, let's avoid those.

• 1:13:49Ryan Clark?

  Karl Malone didn't ask for that.

• 1:13:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, he did.

• 1:13:53Channing Crowder?

  He didn't ask for that.

• 1:13:54Speaker 01

  Hey, so you didn't see Zeke leaking?

• 1:14:00Ryan Clark?

  Can you?

• 1:14:00Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:14:01Ryan Clark?

  You can't hit people in the face for other people. Beef is not transferable. That is not how it works.

• 1:14:07Speaker 01

  Well, Isaiah, Zeke thought different.

• 1:14:09Ryan Clark?

  He was...

• 1:14:09Speaker 01

  So, when I saw Zeke, laid on, Zeke like, appreciate you, big dog. Hey, yeah, Zeke like, yes. See, Zeke was trying to trade for me when he was in front, I was with the Knicks. He was trying to trade for me, like, man, I need him.

• 1:14:20Ryan Clark?

  Man, we appreciate you, dog. Carl Malone did not answer that. Hey, hey, hey.

• 1:14:26Fred Taylor?

  I love it.

• 1:14:27Ryan Clark?

  My dog Carl was just playing basketball.

• 1:14:29Speaker 01

  That man was minding his business.

• 1:14:30Ryan Clark?

  He was minding his business, man. He did a wind up side call head, man.

• 1:14:34Speaker 01

  Carl was minding his business, man. Yeah, he was. I ain't gonna even lie to you.

• 1:14:38Ryan Clark?

  Bro, had a flashback.

• 1:14:39Speaker 05

  Hold up. Limitless, niggas send me kinda pinning it. I fought the head to witness it. Got my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling got me up. On the mission got me up. Knowing me, I got the key. Only vision I can trust. Trust. Limitless, niggas send me kinda pinning it. I fought the head to witness it. Got my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling got me up. On the mission got me up.

• 1:15:04Speaker 00

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 1:15:08Speaker 06

  We go V. We go V.

• 1:15:14Speaker 00

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Semaglutide injection, 2.4mg a GLP-1. Call 1-8334-WEGOVIE or visit wegovie.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?

• 1:15:29Speaker 06

  We go V.