964 NFL Star Michael Bennett: Activism, Racism in Sports, & Making a Difference

"It’s time for us to put our titles down and acknowledge that we’re all human beings."Lewis is joined by Super Bowl Champion Michael Bennett to discuss the NFL's response to the protests against racial injustice, Michael's opinions on the relationship between athletes and activism, and whether he had any fear of backlash when he began publicly supporting Colin Kaepernick. They also discuss Michael's journey from undrafted free agent to Pro Bowl defensive end, what he's learned from being a father to three daughters, and his new podcast, "Mouthpeace."-For more: lewishowes.com/964-Check out: Lewis' impactful interview with Reverend Michael Beckwith-Text: 614-350-3960 to start a conversation with Lewis Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 964 with Super Bowl champion and New York Times bestselling author, Michael Bennett. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. LeBron James said, "I will definitely not shut up and dribble. I mean too much to society. I mean too much to the youth.

• 0:43Lewis Howes?

  I mean too much to so many kids that feel like they don't have a way out and they need someone to help lead them out of the situation they're in." And author Sonya Parker said, "Don't spend all of your time trying to find yourself. Spend time creating yourself into a person you'll be proud of." Welcome to this episode. I'm very excited to share my interview today with NFL star, Michael Bennett. The defensive lineman is a three-time Pro Bowler and Super Bowl champion with the Seattle Seahawks Legion of Boom. All that despite being undrafted out of college. He's also one of the more outspoken players in the NFL and a true leader in his community.

• 1:24Lewis Howes?

  When Colin Kaepernick started kneeling in protest of racial injustice, Bennett immediately joined in support and he became a New York Times bestselling author of his book, Things That Make White People Uncomfortable. Now he's hosting a podcast with his wife, Pele, that's called Mouthpiece, which encourages difficult conversations on a wide range of topics. And in this interview, we discuss the evolving relationship between athletes and activism, how Michael has dealt with criticism both on and off the field, the mental tools that helped him go from undrafted free agent to NFL superstar, what he's learned from being a father to three daughters, and if he wishes, he had boys, and so much more.

• 2:07Lewis Howes?

  I hope you enjoy this episode and make sure to share it with a friend if you find this resource helpful. And without further ado, let me introduce to you the one, the only, Michael Bennett.

• 2:22Lewis Howes?

  All right. Welcome everyone back to the School of Greats Podcast. We've got the inspiring Michael Bennett in the house and I want to start off by saying how much I appreciate your career and all the things that you've overcome in your life to get to where you're at. And I want to talk about that. I want to talk about your podcast with your wife, which I heard some episodes which were interesting. And also just what's going on in the world in America right now. And so, thank you so much for being here.

• 2:48Speaker 01

  Thank you, man. I think it's, I'm excited to be on here. I know you only have the greatest thinkers in American history on here. So.

• 2:54Lewis Howes?

  In the world, man. In the world. What's, what's this week been like for you? It's been obviously a crazy week for a lot of people. What's this been like for you?

• 3:03Speaker 01

  I think it's really crazy week because the emotions are overwhelming, right? You're dealing with this weight that's been bearing down on America for a long period of time. And the side of the weight is starting to lift up and everybody's starting to see what's been underneath the, been underneath the souls of, of America, right? And so it's overwhelming to see people die and, and, and what's happening. And then you look at the president and you look at all these things that are dying. You, you seem like it's, it's just overwhelming. You're like, what is the reality of what's happening? What are, where are we going? What is happening to this, our society? I mean, there's a lot of things in this society that are, or that are, that need to be challenged that are being challenged. And how are people

• 3:46Speaker 01

  going to respond ultimately is the question that I have.

• 3:50Lewis Howes?

  You know, obviously this has been happening for a long time. And do you feel like this is different now than four years ago, two years ago, eight years ago? Or do you feel like it's kind of all been the same feeling and energy?

• 4:01Speaker 01

  It may be different for white people. I think, I think white people are finally having to pay attention, right? Here, you have companies, you have all these people who are making statements. Like, where were those statements four years ago? Michael Brown died and all these other people died. And, and why did it take so many people to die to wake people up, right? So I think we've been living and existing in this trauma of America. If you think about the historical place of African Americans in American history, the fabric of who we are, in the essence of our contribution to America. And we've been definitely living with trauma for long periods of time. If you look back at some of the pictures and think people experienced in the forties, the twenties, the sixties, the seventies, the eighties, the nineties, the two thousands, the two thousand and ten.

• 4:47Speaker 01

  You can put those pictures side by side and there'd be a lot, the color will change, the cars could be different, the, the, uh, the way that the pictures taken, but the race issue is still the underlying issue of American society. And so I think for me as an African American man, it's just been the way in the trauma, the history of what a, a African American parent tells his child and what a white person tells their child has been different for a long periods of time. I think we're finally with the state where I feel like white people are having a conversation with their children about race and how do they fit into the, the world's issue, what's, what's happening.

• 5:25Lewis Howes?

  You've got three kids, right? Three daughters?

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:28Lewis Howes?

  What, what are some of the conversations you, you've had with them in the past?

• 5:31Speaker 01

  I think I've had the conversation about over policing and, uh, toxic masculinity. What does it look like to have a man with daughters and how proud you can be to have daughters because I think if you look at the world before Kobe died, being a girl dead was not cool. You know, people thought brought up and it's like, I mean, it's unfortunate that waves in our society is, uh, is, uh, I would say followers mostly, right? Most people in the world are followers at this point. And so we follow the trends and the waves of the world, but right before then, being a girl dead, if you had daughters, people look at you and the first thing they say is, oh, you need to protect them. They don't see that they are people and that they have voices and that they could be something great, right? They just assume that they're on

• 6:14Speaker 01

  protection. So I've had conversations about that and about, you know, race and how, and also them being a woman in society, what are their gender ceilings and how they have to break those ceilings and, and what they need and how a father in the male plays a role in that. So I've had so many different conversations, you know, about race and, and sex and, and gender.

• 6:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and what I'm hearing is I don't have kids, so I don't I don't understand from that perspective. But what I'm hearing you say is most white parents don't have to teach their white kids how to protect themselves or be aware when they enter a room or if a cop is following them. They're not having those conversations.

• 6:52Speaker 01

  But the thing too is what you said, and I think that is the most important thing that I think everybody in America is missing right now. What you said to me is the most one of the most powerful things that that needs to be elevated is that I can't understand, right? I don't I don't have kids, so I wouldn't know from that perspective. I think a lot of times people are trying to talk about their perspective instead of listening. And I think that's important because I think so many people are trying to make statements and say things, but they don't have the right words to say because they haven't had any experience to really have the education to really be putting out a statement. How did the Washington Redskins put out a statement about race? It's impossible. Like, how can the NFL say something about race when they've been dealing with racial tension within the league?

• 7:32Speaker 01

  It's like we haven't acknowledged to even listen to ourselves and our fellow man to really make a true distinction of what they're really feeling, right?

• 7:40Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. What's your opinion on the uh with the Redskins put a a black image to blackout Tuesday, right? What's your what's your thoughts on that?

• 7:48Speaker 01

  I think it's funny because you have here's Dan Snyder and he's been a Trump follower. He's been donating to his campaign. He's refused to change the name of his organization. He refused to change the logo. He's refused to do that, and that perpetuates a certain cycle of what indigenous people have felt in American history, right? He thinks it's a proud thing and something like that that calls somebody to acknowledge somebody by their skin. What if a team was called the White Skins? What people would be in outrage, but indigenous people don't have that voice that really would change the idea of the Redskins. If he really wants to be a part of the change of racial injustice, he would just change the name of his team.

• 8:26Lewis Howes?

  What's he changing?

• 8:28Speaker 01

  There's so many different names. We could name the Washington Trumps. What's wrong with that? He loved Trump so much, why didn't he name it Washington Trumps?

• 8:36Lewis Howes?

  Now, I love this, uh, this podcast you did, uh, recently, eight minutes, forty six seconds long, same amount of time the officer had his knee on George Floyd's neck. What did you want to say in that special episode?

• 8:48Speaker 01

  I think it was just to, to really reclaim the humanity of George Floyd, right? Reclaim what it is that this man took from him. He took his life. He took his family. He took his existence away. And where do we as human beings stand on that moral line of righteousness, right? What is it we have to deal with to really reclaim the humanity of our fellow man, right? And that's really what that's about. It's not about me. It's not about me. It's about how we as individuals have really taken the dignity away and specifically the police department, they have really taken the dignity away for African-American people for such a long time. But I don't think people really understand to see a man lose his life, to

• 9:31Speaker 01

  ask for his mother, to ask for his children. That's just him reclaiming, trying to reclaim or remind him that this person's human. But for some reason, this man continuously put his knee on his neck to he, this man no longer exists. That's truly an issue and was a true issue with the moral and spiritual side that we have really disconnected from as human beings and disconnected from American society.

• 9:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah. I, I thought it was beautiful. I think everyone should go listen to that episode. And you really asked a great question at the end for all of us to think about as well, which I thought was really inspiring. You know, we talked about you having three daughters and, um, you know, now it's cool to be a girl dad. Do you think you'd be a different man if you had three sons?

• 10:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think I would be a different man. And I think there's this ability to where you said, and I'll go back to what you said, right? Because I think like I said, it's a fundamental issue in America, right? If I was a man, I could never have the experiences. To see what a girl goes through, right? So it's like when I have these girls and these daughters, I literally get to see their experiences. And what does it do for me? It allows me to have a better understanding and understand their journey and what they're experiencing, what they're going through, what's happened to them. And so I think it makes me a stronger person because it allows me to really dig into the other side of me and really put out a side of me that isn't allowed as a man in America, right? It's not allowed to be in the moment, right?

• 10:55Speaker 01

  So it's allowed me to really develop my full human being scale, right? So I think that's important.

• 11:03Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you seem like a gentle giant. You're this big, strong NFL guy, but you got a gentle heart and I love that about you. Do you think you would be a, I don't want to use the word better, but I'd say a different type of football player if you had three sons same ages as your daughters and not having three daughters? Would you be different, better, worse? What do you think?

• 11:22Speaker 01

  I don't think so. I think football to me, I've always been able to like decipher and break up the boundaries between being an athlete in my real life. So the football field is what I've been doing since I was a young kid. And that's just who I was as an individual and what I believed in and how I played the game. But being a father, it takes a lot more work. So I think it would have been, I think I'd play be the same player because it's just different. It's two different things. I think what kids do to you and whether it's male or female, they allow you to realize that life is more than just about yourself, right? For me personally, that's what's happened and made me realize that I kept, when I went out there, I was playing for something a little bit bigger than myself. I was playing for my children. So that's kind of how I connect children to what really impacts my career, impacted my career.

• 12:07Lewis Howes?

  And your mom had you when she was young, I think she was 16 when she had you and she had five kids by 20, is that correct?

• 12:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, five, yeah, by 21, yeah. So it was very difficult, right? I think. When when I look into myself, when I look back into that, right, I I look as a parent, I'm like, man, I have everything to like, take care of kids, right? Mo- momentarily, uh, uh, monetarily, and it's just like, okay, it's not about money when it comes to kids. It's really about, you never know the burden of what it takes to raise a child. I'm not gonna imagine what my mother was feeling at sixteen. And within that journey of like, seeking myself and seeking uh, the reason for being, right? It's just one of those things that being able to forgive, because such a young person having a young kid is can only be devastating to their career and what they really wanted to accomplish in life. But because they have to sacrifice for kids, it's just a different experience.

• 12:56Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Did you, I know your parents didn't end up working out. Who would you say is the greater teacher for you growing up? And who taught you, what was the greatest lesson each one of them taught you that you use today as a parent?

• 13:09Speaker 01

  I think all of them are are equally uh, been impacted in my life. I think um, living with my father, it allowed me to understand how to be a husband, how to be a, how to be a how to be a comforter, how to be a protector, how to be different things and different things that required of being a husband, right? And of being a father. And I think both my mothers just taught me about love and passion and the part and the and the importance of community, right? So this like, it's true what they say, it takes a village to raise a child. And I truly believe it takes a village to raise a child. So I think every one of them have really impacted me uh, in a certain way.

• 13:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, with Copperneck and everything that he's been taking an E for since four years ago, you chose to immediately support him in your own way.

• 13:53Speaker 01

  So I have been like, talking about blackness and I feel in blackness in the career my whole life, right? My mom was a teacher, she went to a historical black college, I grew up in a small town. So I've always had the historical context of what it means to be African American in this society and the people who have. Fought for freedom and what they stand for. So it was easy to be a part or or help Colin's voice be amplified and myself because I truly believe in what he was doing, right? I truly believe in the freedom and the liberation of people who have been oppressed. So it's easy to connect to that. And I think um over the whole time, I was finding different ways to connect with different people, not just African American people too, right? We have our struggle. I connected with people in indigenous community all over the world.

• 14:37Speaker 01

  So it's it's definitely a eye opening experience. Four years ago, I think it was the first time on mainstream since the sixties that we really were elevating the racial tensions and the racial divide in America.

• 14:50Lewis Howes?

  It seems like it started to be amplified with the media and with athletes really getting on board in a bigger way. And I know you you talked to John Carlos on your podcast, who famously raised his fist during the nineteen sixty eight Olympics. And you asked him if he felt afraid what would happen afterwards if he did that. And I wanted to ask you the same thing. Did you ever feel afraid that, hey, if I take a stand in my own way for this, what I believe in, did you feel like maybe I could get fired or maybe I'd get criticized or judged or bullied? Did you ever have that fear?

• 15:21Speaker 01

  I think criticism is a part of my job. I've always been in a position where criticism was a part of my performance. When we didn't perform good, the criticism was was was high. When I perform, when I perform great, the criticism was low. So for me, it was more about like the fear, like the fear of living, right? Because, you know, you say something like race is such a strong issue in America, right? It's been people have died because of race. We can look back at the facts. These are facts. People have lost their life because they have brought up race in America. They've been killed by the government. They've been killed by um left wing organization organizations. So there was a fear of having this.

• 15:59Speaker 01

  Of being ridiculed at a high level, right? You really are really are bringing attention to something that people don't want attention to. So I think there is a fear, and I think what John Collins was referencing, his, his experience and what he's been through. I think it's important that we reference these things and when people take stances, what can come with stances, right? Because we look at the glory of Martin Luther King and Malcolm X, but we don't look that they die, right? That's not something people really bring up all the time, right? They bring up like, look at this quote, but we like, every time we bring up this quote, it's a man who was executed. We think about Jesus and we say, we bring up course of Jesus, but then we think about Jesus. Jesus was killed by the government, like, so it's like, it's like, we have to know that that is possible.

• 16:39Speaker 01

  And I think sometimes people don't know that, and I think even with protests right now, a lot of people are getting hit and beat by the police. They're like, you gotta know that that's a part of it, right? And that's a part of you taking a stance that you're going against the grain of society. So with that comes resistance and with resistance comes battles and you gotta be able to withstand the battles individually, spiritually, mentally and physically.

• 17:01Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm. So I love that you say that, you know, you're used to being critiqued on the football field, but this was a different type of, of worry and concern for your health, your safety and your life, standing up for this. Now, I played, I played college football. I was a receiver. I played in the arena league for a little bit as well. So I know all about the locker room and I know about, you know, I've played on where I was, one of the only white guys in the team in Huntsville, Alabama, and mostly black teammates. I've been on teams where it's mostly white guys and a few black teammates in Ohio. I've, I've seen kind of both sides and personally, I never saw any type of racism, at least in my bubble of the locker room personally.

• 17:42Lewis Howes?

  Do you feel like there's racial divides in locker rooms in the NFL that you've seen?

• 17:47Speaker 01

  I think there's racial divides on issues, right? I don't think there's racial divide on where we are, because when we come in the locker room, we all see each other as football players and we kind of just like, oh man.

• 17:58Lewis Howes?

  Let's get the job done.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  The divide in the battle to have a position, right? But at the same time, to underline the issues of what they're happening within our communities, I think that's where the divide comes, right? Because that's when we finally see the divide, right? Before, we don't really see it because we have a quarterback. We say quarterback receiver one, going about a receiver one. But it's when stuff like taking a knee comes out that we really start to see the social divide between. Who and where people were raised because as football players, there's only one ideology that is winning and winning at a high level. But when it comes to race, there's so many different ideologies. And I think the racial disparities would come, we start to see the racial inequality when we start talking about race. And I experienced it personally when we talk about, we talked about taking you as a team that was, we saw the divide, we

• 18:44Speaker 01

  saw the fear of African American players of not having an opportunity and what that feels like. The Seahawks were more of the more consciously aware team in the NFL. We were more in the most, we were probably the most famous team outside of the Patriots as far as players, individual glory. I think the Patriots were more a team glory and Tom Brady glory, right? But it's the Patriots, I mean, the Seahawks glory of all types of players were superstars. And most of the superstars came from African American neighbors. And we kind of never forgot our blackness. So we were, we forced the team to do what they did. We were the leaders of our team. See, a lot of teams, they get led in direction by the ownership and tell them what to do. But as we were, we were one of a kind team, right? We were a different team. We were the outlaws of the NFL, you would think.

• 19:25Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And Pete Carroll has been getting some, I guess, some backlash lately. But what was your experience of him and supporting the team?

• 19:33Speaker 01

  I think Pete Carroll wants to do right. I think any coach wants to do right, right? They want to do right to do right by their players. But I think the thing that Coach Pete Carroll was coming back with, the thing that he doesn't realize too is that, okay, you want to do right, but there's evidence of you doing wrong. And so by you saying the words, if you're right, the evidence is, as the court would say, the evidence against the prosecution would say that there's evidence that says that you're not who you say you are, right? So that's what people are really trying to like argue. So you had opportunities on Kaepernick, but you didn't do it right. But then it's like, well, you're saying one thing and you actually do another. That's what makes people mad. And it's feel like people feel like you've been a hypocrite. But I don't think Coach Carroll has a bad heart. I actually think Coach Carroll is one of the most progressive coaches I've ever

• 20:16Speaker 01

  been a part of. And his philosophies were very, we talked about a worldly of things of any team I've ever been on. So I just think when he didn't sign or he didn't give Kaepernick the opportunity, that's kind of left the door open for other people to scrutinize him for his beliefs.

• 20:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And what about, what about your thoughts on Drew Brees? Did you experience connecting with him throughout your time in the league and your thoughts on his post and his response to it?

• 20:41Speaker 01

  I think Drew Brees is just missing the whole gamut of what's happening, right? Here's a man who's trying to protect his privilege at every corner, right? But this requires you to drop your privilege. When you're talking about race, it requires you to drop your privilege. If you're a man talking about what women are going through, it requires you to drop your privilege and to listen to what's happening to women. Like, it's like when a woman's saying that she's been victimizing. She said something happened to her and she's been a victim of rape for sexual assault. It's like a man saying, what, what, what did you wear? What did you, what did you do? Why did you, how did he? It's like you're trying to victimize them and make them feel like, and you're trying to defend men instead of defending what's happened to this individual and how it has made them feel. And so when he's talking about his father and his grandfather, he's actually

• 21:24Speaker 01

  a defense mechanism to defend his privilege of why he should stand up instead of saying, you know what, I don't know what to say. So you know what? I don't know what's the right thing to say. I know talking about my grandfather is not this moment. I think talking about the trauma that African American my teammates have felt over the years that I haven't had the courage to stand up on, but I have the courage to donate and talk about different issues like COVID-19. Why can't I talk about COVID-19? Why? Because it's pertaining to everybody, so I don't be seen as I'm supporting just black people. But to stand up on this issue is that you're being an ally and you acknowledging that you've had privilege. I don't think Drew Brees really wants to acknowledge that he's had privilege because in his mind, he's worked hard for everything he's got. Maybe in football, that is true, right? Maybe in football, he's had, he's worked hard.

• 22:09Speaker 01

  But in life, he's not had worked hard to get the white skin that he has. He was born with that privilege and I don't think he's really wanted to acknowledge that being white is a privilege. And that's okay with him if that's what he truly believes. At least he's being honest, right? At least he's being honest and we can say there's some place to work on him, right? But the fact that he has, has such a disconnect with his black team, with his black brother is really the issue because he's saying that he still hasn't gotten to his mind that other people have experienced a different America than he has.

• 22:37Lewis Howes?

  What are your thoughts then on, I guess, people with a platform or athletes talking about it? If they, if they don't know what to say, like you said right there, like, maybe he should have just said nothing. Should people be speaking up and saying something? Is, are they, should they say nothing if they don't know what to say? What's your thoughts?

• 22:58Speaker 01

  I think they, I think they should say something if they feel the need to say something, to acknowledge. If they have a particular position, like, like Drew Brees has a particular position. He's an African-American driven leader, right? He's obligated to say something and his something should be in the manner of supporting his people who are 7% of that organization, right? So I think we people just need to make the most honest statement, right? The honest statement is not to try to like, find, it's just you coming at your heart and saying like, I don't know. I think that's a great statement saying, I don't know, but I want to know. Like, that's the kind of stuff, statements people have to make, right? And people have to understand, like, but this isn't just about being black. This is about like the system, understanding the system that has oppressed people of color for generations and generations at the time.

• 23:41Speaker 01

  When we're out, we talking about defending the police, but we talking about defunding the police and policing, right? But we also got to think about the, about the judicial system, which has plagued African-American people in American history, brown people in history. Look at the, look at the facts. There's more African-American and brown people in jail than any other race in history. We have more people in jail in America than any other country, right? We talk about marijuana, we talking about the country, the marijuana. So many people in jail for marijuana and, and they're being prison right now. But now marijuana is a business and is privileged and is ran by a white, white society. And there's a whole bunch of brown and black people who are in jail for smoking a J, right? And smoking a J, isn't that wrong with smoking a J? Want to get your mind right, you put some smoking a J, right?

• 24:26Speaker 01

  But at the same time, people are being persecuted for something, right? And so we have, the whole system is seeing how the cycle of racism has been perpetuated over the time. It really comes down to our consciousness. I really, that people have been unconscious, so they really haven't really had the opportunity to really look at the world through different eyes, right? Because they're so, they're so focused on one thing and then not focusing on somebody else's pain.

• 24:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. What do you think is going to happen in the NFL next year? When you guys start playing again, do you think there's going to be changes? Do you think there's going to be more protesting with, with athletes doing their own thing? What do you think's going to happen?

• 25:04Speaker 01

  I think, I think more athletes going to take a stance. Is is I think we're gonna, I think there's gonna be a big change, right? I think there's gonna be more people standing up, right? Because now you really have your white teammates. When we were taking a knee, not a lot of white people wanted to be involved. But now you got people like Kirk Cousins and all these people trying to make statements and they're trying to be a part of the movement. So I think because there's gonna be more players willing to move and talk about the issues, I think the NFL is gonna be forced and obligated and it's gonna be subjected to its players' will. And I think there's gonna be more opportunity but to do that. But you know, to be honest, I think COVID-19 was really the factor in in in a lot of this, right? Because I think COVID-19 and Floyd are together, right?

• 25:49Speaker 01

  Because one one side, we see the disparities of color for policing, right? Then the other side, we see the racial disparity in healthcare, the central needs of America. And we're seeing on one side, we're seeing an issue that's facing with African-American people. But then on the other side, we see that we are dealing with poor people all across the world who are dealing with poverty and they have a system. So I think two of those things connect and we're realizing that all of this connected together. And I think we've seen that a lot of essential workers in America work for it with African-American and brown people.

• 26:26Lewis Howes?

  You know, I loved your your story about how you've become just a successful athlete, let alone being a great man, a great father, a great husband, but a great athlete. You were undrafted and yet you've been, you know, in the Pro Bowl, you've won a Super Bowl, you should have won two Super Bowls. How did that whole journey go for you from being undrafted to winning a Super Bowl?

• 26:48Speaker 01

  I think it's when you go, you're talking about school of greatness, right? I think it's really mindset, right? Because you get into a situation and you have to be able to find this grit and this will and this perseverance to overcome. And I think for me, that was the biggest thing that kept me going was like, okay, here's this opportunity to have this child. I have these, all these things just weighing on why I shouldn't succeed. But my mindset was on success and putting in more work, right? I think loving the game of football and actually having, loving the history of football and the knowledge of it and loving the actual X's and O's of it. It actually made me a stronger player, right? Because I love to study. I love to watch the games. I love to do different things. So I, I think it was definitely, uh, it was a great time and being on draft that really propelled me to have the success that I've had.

• 27:33Lewis Howes?

  You think if you were drafted, you'd have the same success? Or did that give you that extra hunger to, to work harder and prepare more?

• 27:39Speaker 01

  It gave me the extra, I think it gave me the extra hunger, right? It gave me the extra hunger. It's like I was already used to being the underdog, you know? Um, and now having that, um, was just another way to like continuously, like I was like, man, if I would have been drafted, would I have had the same hunger? I don't know if I would have had the same hunger. I think being on draft, it allowed me to keep a chip on my shoulder. It was that chip kept on my whole career.

• 28:02Lewis Howes?

  Do you feel like, uh, would you have changed anything? Do you wish you would have been drafted in the first round and got some big signing bonus? Or are you glad you've had to build it the way you have?

• 28:10Speaker 01

  I'm glad I had to build the way I had. I think a lot of people, when you go through the way I did, you built the story. And I think a lot of people connect to that story because it's always people are like, wait, uh, you, you did that? And so it's like, it's just a great connection.

• 28:24Lewis Howes?

  What about, uh, your legacy? What do you want your legacy to be? Do you want it to be more about being a great football player, being a, a great father, being a great activist?

• 28:34Speaker 01

  I think they're all the same. I think it's just overall just being a great man, right? Being a great man within everything that I tried to, everything I was a part of. I was a father. I was a great father when I was this. I think the most, the most hurtful thing is when you die and they only bring up your, uh, what your attributes or your stats in the NFL that, oh, he died here. This many sacks and this promotion and this whole thing. Think it's more about like, what is you contribute to your community? What did you contribute to yourself? And what did you contribute to life? I think that's the ultimate thing that I wanna be is to leave a great legacy of being a great contributor to all facets of life.

• 29:08Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and you have an amazing story about your relationship with your wife and how you guys met and how she's been a part of this journey with you. Was she always supportive of you for for taking a stand as an activist and an athlete? And and also, what brought about you guys coming together, co-hosting Mouthpiece? And doing the podcast together?

• 29:30Speaker 01

  My wife is as strong as me too, because she believes in a lot of stuff and she stands up for herself and what she believes in. So I think it's just us coexisting and growing up in the same area, right? We came, grew up in high school together, we dated in high school. So we saw a lot of the same thing, we saw a lot of the different tragedies, we saw a lot the great things in life and what it feels like to be at the bottom, what it feels like to be at the top. So we experienced a lot together. So for us, we both amplify each other's voice on what we experience. And I think with the podcast was an opportunity for husband and wife to come together and talk about real issues and talk about things that are happening in America. And when they're raising kids, this is a perfect opportunity to use our platform in a positive way. We'll talk about all the great things, like there's shortcomings of all of us, I think.

• 30:12Speaker 01

  In a world where we've become and we've fallen a lot of people, we're seeing a lot of their great moments and we're challenging their great moments against our great moments. And unfortunately, if somebody with sixty million followers, their greater moments are gonna seem more greater, right? And so it's good for us to be honest about our experience and be honest about what we need to work on as individuals and what we need to work on as society.

• 30:33Lewis Howes?

  Do you and your wife ever have disagreements about approaching the world, about approaching parenting, about approaching what you should be saying or not saying?

• 30:42Speaker 01

  Every day. Every day. I think that's the, I think that's the evolution of us as people, right? We are constantly battling and struggling with what we think is right, with the compromise. Where do we compromise it? What do we do? And I think we're doing it every day. We're constantly going up and challenging our thoughts. I think a great partner is somebody who can challenge and continuously grow. I mean, there's things that we agreed on fundamentally, but our approaches may be different. So that's, that's a normal thing, too.

• 31:11Lewis Howes?

  How do you find peace in between your disagreements to to not let it affect your kids or the relationship for too long? And how do you kind of resolve things?

• 31:22Speaker 01

  I think that's, I think that's, I think that's one of the hardest things a lot of people do because you're in a place where you become a part of the business and you become a part of the, you become a part of what you're doing. And I think for us, we just try to disconnect the two things. Like, and I think, like I said, we've had a great opportunity to do that because we've been in NFL, we've been able to disconnect from the NFL and then do something else. So I think this is just an evolution of that, honestly.

• 31:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I got a couple of final questions for you, and I appreciate you opening up and sharing all this, Michael. This question is called the three truths, and I ask everyone at the end the same question. So it's a hypothetical question. I'd love for you to imagine it's your last day on earth many, many years from now, and you've accomplished all your dreams. You've seen your kids grow up and achieve great things, and you've seen things move on in the world, and you've done it all. But it's your last day, and everything you've created in the world, you've got to take with you. So all of your podcasts and your book and, and all the posts you put out there, it's got to go with you to the next place. And you, but you can leave behind three things you know to be true about life, about experiences.

• 32:32Lewis Howes?

  And these will be the three lessons that we would all have to remember you by. What would you say are the three things you'd want to share with the world, three truths?

• 32:39Speaker 01

  I think the three truths that I would like to share with the world would be self-reflection. I think we all need to self-reflect on a daily basis and self-reflect into a way that we can manifest our self-reflection into something positive, I think is important. I think the second is to have a sense of, to understand about, for every luxury, there's somebody else that's sacrificing for us, right? Because every luxury, luxury creates a certain suffering for somebody else. Whether it's our iPhone, when we get an iPhone, we don't realize that somebody that has the iPhone, they, they, somebody that created iPhone worked in a factory. So it's like, or when you get your tomato, there's been a Hispanic person who's come from Mexico, who's picked it that didn't have a fair trade, fair trade system,

• 33:24Speaker 01

  right? So it's understanding that there's other people who are experiencing something and to understand that these luxury that we have, and people are suffering. So when the people are screaming that they need attention, we need to acknowledge their attention, right? And I think the third is being in the moment. I think a lot of times, we're so, when I say unconscious, I feel like we have become so unconscious as a society that... We get our realities mixed up with the other realities that are happening and then next thing you know, we don't know which one is real, which one's which one is fake. So I would say um being in the moment to when we were our children to like view what your children being a moment. I know it's the hardest thing too, because our phone allows us to be everywhere at once. But I would try to be in the moment, right? Being in the moment, because those moments are so

• 34:09Speaker 01

  we think they're so, we think they're so small and superficial, but those moments are really the most magnificent moments in your life when your child is trying to show you a picture and you're like, oh, yeah, okay, okay.

• 34:21Speaker 01

  I'm just like, who knows what that does to that character when they know that their parents love them. So being in the moment is something I think is important.

• 34:27Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you've got a, you've got your podcast, mouthpiece with your wife. That's super inspiring. You guys share some great stuff there. You've also got a book, uh, which I think is a great title. It's called Things That Make White People Uncomfortable. Why did you write a book with that title?

• 34:41Speaker 01

  I think it's one of those things where I wanted to make people uncomfortable because the conversation that we have now is not a comfortable conversation. That's why there's chaos. Because if it was comfortable, it's easy for us to judge. The NBA, LeBron, you took that final shot. Like, that's easy. That's a comfort thing because it brings, it brings life and it brings this, but having uncomfortable situations and conversation is where we truly go, right? That's what I talk about when you have those teeth and those, when you have those limbs growing, it's uncomfortable when you're growing. But at the end of the day, you have growth, right? And I think we just needed to have an uncomfortable conversation. And there's a lot of things that is, it's important that we need to have those conversations because it's too late when we have a war and then we want to have peace. We need to have peace before we have the war, right?

• 35:23Speaker 01

  Because once we have the war, there's casualties, right? There's too many casualties. And peace, when the war that comes with peace is just, just too many people have died, millions of people have died. But we had the peace before the war. We don't have to have the war because we'll have peace, right? The war would be just about well, morals and morality. But this moment, we have to, uh, this book is about being uncomfortable and not to be reactive anymore because now we are reactive soc- society and what comes with a reaction? Un- unwanted action, right? You just, you just react in a way that you don't even know, right? Because it's like, boom, you just react. So that's really where I wrote the book.

• 35:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And what would um? What would you respect about your teammates, both your white teammates and black teammates? Moving in from now into next season, what would you respect about them the most if they did what?

• 36:11Speaker 01

  I think I respect everybody. We just kind of just stood up on what we believe in, right? The purpose of our living, the purpose of our existence. I think I respect most of us that we could put our titles down, right? Titles are meant to divide us. Everybody has a title and people, a person could be a regular person, right? And we run into those people and we just pass them. But if they have a title, we acknowledge them, right? So it's time for us to put our titles down and acknowledge that we're just a human being. We exist with these people. We are family, man. We bleed and we eat and shit the same way. Just because we have money doesn't make us exist. We witnessed Paul Elliott be one of the richest people in the world, but die at 50 something, right? Because as of today, we are just human beings. Money is the thing that breaks our barriers, but at the same time, it also builds more barriers.

• 36:56Lewis Howes?

  Wow, that's powerful. I want to acknowledge you for a minute, Michael, for being a stand for what you believe in, for being a stand for other people, for being a stand for your life and your family and change. You're doing some amazing work, man. I appreciate your voice and well, hopefully I can come watch a game. Wherever you're playing this year, I'd love to come watch a game sometime and support you. So you get that 70th sack in the bag, man. Final question for you is what's your definition of greatness?

• 37:22Speaker 01

  My definition of greatness is to be different. I think the greatness is such, it's like there's tiers of being something, right? And I think it's like average, but there's good, better than greatness is like the highest thing that you can be. I think it's because you're different. I think the ability to be different is the most important thing, right? I think greatness is a difference because they, people who are great do different. They become outliers in everything. They become conscious to their being. And I think there's a very few people who actually reach greatness and enlightenment in life.

• 37:55Lewis Howes?

  Michael Bennett, man, I appreciate your wisdom. Thanks for coming on and sharing it all, man.

• 37:59Speaker 01

  Thank you, man. Appreciate you.

• 38:00Lewis Howes?

  Appreciate it, man. Have a good one. And if I can help you with anything, just let me know.

• 38:03Speaker 01

  All right. Thank you. Bless you, man.

• 38:04Lewis Howes?

  Thanks, man. You too, brother.

• 38:09Lewis Howes?

  Thank you so much for listening to this episode with Michael Bennett. If you haven't yet listened to my podcast last week with Reverend Michael Beckwith on racial justice and spiritual healing, it was so profound, I highly recommend you check it out. And I'm going to put a link to that episode in the description of this episode of the podcast. Please connect with me on all social media. I'm at Lewis Howes everywhere except for on TikTok now, at Lewis. And I want to have a dialogue with you. I want to hear from you. You can also text me questions. You can text me to the number 614-350-3960 as I send out inspirational messages there to help you with your week. So make sure to text me and

• 38:54Lewis Howes?

  share this episode with a friend. If this is your first time here on the School of Greatness Podcast, welcome to the community. We have over 200 million downloads, going over seven years, almost 1,000 episodes. And we bring on some of the most incredible leaders of our time to share what it takes to be great and their process for getting there. Make sure to subscribe, leave a review if this is your first time here as well, and if this empowered you in any way. And I want to leave you with this. Author William Faulkner said, "Never be afraid to raise your voice for honesty and truth and compassion against injustice and lying and greed." I love you all so very much. I want to remind you how much you matter today. And as always, you know what time it is. It's time to go

• 39:38Lewis Howes?

  out there and do something great.