Kevin McCarthy

It's a special Happy Sad Confused cross-over episode with fellow film enthusiast and master interviewer Kevin McCarthy! Josh and Kevin trade interview stories, podcasting techniques, and movie hot takes, and more! Check out Kevin's podcast, On Film with Kevin McCarthy. Check out the ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Happy Sad Confused patreon here⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠! We've got discount codes to live events, merch, early access, exclusive episodes, video versions of the podcast, and more! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:31Speaker 01

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• 1:00Speaker 02

  Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, sad, confused, begins.

• 1:07Josh Horowitz?

  Hey guys, it's Josh. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Today on the show, this is an unusual one. This is a crossover episode. Josh Horowitz, Kevin McCarthy. Is it Happy, Sad, Confused? Is it On Film? What's the name of this podcast? I don't know, but this is a fun one. Hey guys, welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. We're trying something a little new out today. If you follow my work, you may know the name Kevin McCarthy. I'm virtually certain most of you do. I certainly do. I've known Kevin for, I don't know, 10, 15 years at least, probably. Kevin is fantastic at what he does, and what he does is actually what I do. We travel in the same space.

• 1:53Josh Horowitz?

  He's a film journalist, film host, film interviewer. He is formerly out of DC, now in Los Angeles, making it big there, and has recently started his own podcast called On Film. This episode is indeed a crossover episode. This is going to be available on Kevin McCarthy. On film feed, it's available on my Happy Sad Confused feed. And we've been talking about having a chat for a long while. As I said, he recently started a podcast when he moved out to LA. And I've been giving him, I don't know, I don't want to say I've been giving him tips because Kevin knows what he's doing. He's killing it many ways better than I am. But I've got a couple of years on him and I'm always there for him to give advice. He's always there for me to give advice.

• 2:37Josh Horowitz?

  And it's a rare thing when we can kind of, you know, it's a weird thing to find someone in the industry, I think, that you can lean on and, and talk shop. And Kevin is one of those guys. And we decided to have this conversation as opposed to our usual chats on text or over the phone, in front of cameras and on mics for you guys. This is a really fun chat about movies, about journalism, about interviewing technique. And I certainly got a lot out of it. I hope Kevin did, and most importantly, I hope you guys do too. If you haven't checked out Kevin's work, look him up. Kevin McCarthy on Instagram, TikTok. On Film is the name of his podcast. He's been getting amazing guests. His first guest, I think, was Josh Brolin.

• 3:21Josh Horowitz?

  And since then, he has been just, just, as I say, killing it. He's a, he, he, he comes at interviews from a different vantage point than I do, which I think allows for us to root each other on. He's more into the technical aspects of filmmaking. We're both geeks in our own way, but I think our styles couldn't in many ways be more different. So I think we complement each other very well, and I was excited to have this chat with him. If you love what I do, if you love what he does, if you love movies, if you love watching movie interviews, I think you're going to get something out of this conversation. So if you haven't already, subscribe not only to this channel, but subscribe to Kevin McCarthy's YouTube channel, subscribe to his podcast on film.

• 4:07Josh Horowitz?

  And yeah, more fun content for your ears and eyes, courtesy of Kevin McCarthy. I hope you guys enjoy this. Perhaps we'll do this again sometime. As always, I'll remind you guys, if you like what I do and you want to support it, go to our Patreon. Patreon.com/happysayconfused to get early access to all our shows, all our discount codes for all our events, merch, all sorts of fun stuff. So Patreon.com/happysayconfused is your home for all things Josh Horowitz and Happy Sad Confused.

• 4:36Josh Horowitz?

  And without any further ado, this is a conversation shot actually on Kevin's home base. I kind of let him drive the ship here because it was his home base in Los Angeles. I was visiting over the long weekend, going to The Critics' Choice, snuck some time in to see Kevin. So this is really Kevin's podcast, but I thought I would sneak it into my feed here. I hope you guys get something out of it. Enjoy me and the one and only Kevin McCarthy, everybody.

• 5:01Speaker 04

  Welcome to On Film with Kevin McCarthy, right?

• 5:08Josh Horowitz?

  My logo's up there, Kevin. It's my show. This is Happy Sad Confused.

• 5:11Speaker 04

  My logo's right next to it.

• 5:13Josh Horowitz?

  My people were supposed to tell your people. This is my damn... I did the podcast way before your podcast, Kevin.

• 5:20Speaker 04

  Your logo is first, by the way.

• 5:22Josh Horowitz?

  I am on your set, though, to be fair.

• 5:24Speaker 04

  It's true. We're here in Los Angeles.

• 5:26Josh Horowitz?

  This is happening, Kevin. You ready for this?

• 5:27Speaker 04

  I am beyond... First of all, I get to be a guest on Happy Sad Confused.

• 5:31Josh Horowitz?

  I get to be a guest on film with Kevin McCarthy.

• 5:34Speaker 04

  This is like the greatest crossover ever.

• 5:36Josh Horowitz?

  The internet's either gonna be very excited or no one's gonna care about our families or friends.

• 5:40Speaker 04

  I think people are gonna be really excited about this. Honestly, and Josh and I, we know each other for how long now? Over 15 years.

• 5:46Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I would say, right?

• 5:47Speaker 04

  And we met originally through the junket circuit, right?

• 5:50Josh Horowitz?

  Lot of long years with four to eight-minute slots on junkets. And when you meet a kindred spirit, someone that actually knows what they're talking about, cares, you bond.

• 6:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, and we've been in hallways together.

• 6:04Josh Horowitz?

  That sounds weird.

• 6:05Speaker 04

  But it's so funny. Director Park Chan Wook was just sitting there five minutes ago, talking about the hallway scene in Old Boy.

• 6:11Josh Horowitz?

  Right. We have our own hallway scenes.

• 6:13Speaker 04

  We have our own hallway scenes.

• 6:14Josh Horowitz?

  Yes. To be clear, most of our careers have been spent in the hallways of like the Four Seasons Hotel, waiting to talk to movie stars and directors and be really nervous and to talk to each other about how nervous we are before walking into a room.

• 6:26Speaker 04

  Yeah. And for people out there listening to us, if you're not familiar at all with what a press junket is, so Josh and I came up in the press junket circuit. We'll get into our histories. Josh's podcast, I think it's turning 11.

• 6:38Josh Horowitz?

  Nearly 12, yes.

• 6:39Speaker 04

  Well.

• 6:39Josh Horowitz?

  We're gonna run this on both Happy Second Fuse, so Happy Second Fuse listeners, viewers, welcome to the show, and Kevin's running this on his. So this is a very cool first for Happy Second Fuse and first for you, I guess, a crossover episode.

• 6:50Speaker 04

  100%. I mean, I just started my show in August and honestly, like Josh has been a great person to speak with about the podcast process because you've been doing it for much longer than I have. And I think one of the things I mentioned with the junket process, for people out there who don't know, essentially movie studios do these big press junkets where they bring the actors and filmmakers to essentially hotels and press go in and out of these rooms for four to six minutes at a time. So I started this show primarily to get into those longer form discussions, I would imagine.

• 7:20Josh Horowitz?

  Same thing for me.

• 7:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, what was, do you remember the initial idea of Happy Second Fuse?

• 7:24Josh Horowitz?

  It's exactly what you're talking about, just because I'm a little bit older than you, I started it a little bit earlier perhaps, but like, yeah, so like about 12 years ago, I'd been doing, you know, my day job for many years and to a degree still, has been covering movies for MTV. So like doing the red carpets and the junkets and everything, and amazing, like what opportunities and very cool experiences, but at a certain point, I was getting like numbed to like, you know, MTV actually gets like a decent amount of time at junkets, but again, for those that don't know, a decent amount of time at a junket is like eight minutes, which is not.

• 7:55Speaker 04

  Eight minutes is like gold. If you, if you have eight minutes.

• 7:59Josh Horowitz?

  Kevin back in the day used to be like, you got eight minutes?

• 8:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, because, because I mean, when I, when I started junkets, four minutes was the standard.

• 8:05Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 8:05Speaker 04

  And so.

• 8:06Josh Horowitz?

  It was the standard for most people.

• 8:07Speaker 04

  It is, but when Josh would be like, I have, I have eight, I'm like, how is that possible? He goes, well, I work for MTV. And I'm like, but that's incredible. And I never even thought to think like, oh, I'm gonna be, I can sit down with Ethan Hawke for an hour?

• 8:21Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 8:22Speaker 04

  That's possible? How do I even get to a stage like that?

• 8:25Josh Horowitz?

  And this is, this was not the dream, but it was certainly an antidote to what I was doing. By the way, I still actually don't mind doing like a shorter form, a 10 or 12 or 15 minute interview, because that kind of has its own challenges that are unique to to the format. But um, yeah, like I started it, the podcast in my office at MTV, kind of off the grid. I was not supposed to be doing it. I literally just bought like a single microphone, didn't know what I was doing and started to book folks that I knew. Um, my first guest was Kate Mara, Robert Rodriguez.

• 8:56Speaker 04

  Like Kate Mara was your first guest?

• 8:57Josh Horowitz?

  Very first guest, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 8:58Speaker 04

  Okay, that is the weirdest thing because Kate Mara just followed me on Instagram last night. Like I woke up this morning with a follow, that that is a universal sign right there. Wait, that was your first guest?

• 9:09Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, she did me a solid, so I will always be grateful to her and um.

• 9:13Speaker 04

  And mine was Josh Brolin and like, and so that's interesting. So was the show called Happy Sad Confused at the time?

• 9:19Josh Horowitz?

  It was so back, uh, Happy Sad Confused, the name predated the podcast because, you know, on the junket circuit, often journalists would sometimes do photos with with the uh, the folks that they're interviewing. And it always felt a little like silly and awkward to do that kind of thing. You know how how that vibe is, but I still kind of wanted to memorialize the moment in some way. So I had this stupid idea at the time, which actually turned out to be a good idea, which was like, I'm gonna ask a celebrity to do a happy photo, a sad photo and a confused photo with me. And um, ironically, the first time I ever did it was for the least like fun movie ever. It was for Zero Dark Thirty. Jessica Chastain was my first victim of the photo series.

• 9:59Speaker 04

  And did you, when when you did that, did you have to pitch it to her team first? Or did you just say, hey, I'm doing this thing? Do you pitch it to Jessica directly?

• 10:07Josh Horowitz?

  No, I was always back in the day, especially like earlier, we've talked about this before, I think, like the kind of stuff I used to do. Cause I also have like a comedy side to my career. I was very like, I don't know, ballsy, I don't know what the word is, just to like, go for it and and assume consent and try stuff out.

• 10:22Speaker 04

  What's that word, it's like, like ask for forgiveness late, or what is it?

• 10:24Josh Horowitz?

  Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 10:25Speaker 04

  Not permission?

• 10:26Josh Horowitz?

  I don't know, we will, whatever. But um, but yes, you know, I did not vet it with publicists. I never used to vet like games I would do back in the day and most of the time it worked out, sometimes it didn't. I'm much more, I don't know if I'm conservative now in in what I do, but like. I I think I have a better gauge for what I can get away with during interviews and hopefully people trust me now not to make fools of them. Um, but yeah, Jessica was game and yeah, the photo series kind of took off. And then when I started the podcast, I had no better ideas, honestly.

• 10:53Speaker 04

  How long was your first episode?

• 10:54Josh Horowitz?

  Do you remember? It was probably like forty five minutes if I had to guess.

• 10:56Speaker 04

  And you shot it in your office.

• 10:58Josh Horowitz?

  I didn't shoot it. It was audio. Truly Happy Side Confused was audio up until the pandemic and.

• 11:04Speaker 04

  Really?

• 11:05Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I never shot any Happy Side Confused episodes. Um, and it was really out of doing it over Zoom over during the pandemic and I had video and, you know, I was shooting video anyway, thanks to Zoom. And I was like, okay, I might as well use the video. Um, I had friends and colleagues, you might know Christian Harloff, I don't know if you know him or not, he was always encouraging me to start a YouTube channel. Um, and I did, and I was so late to the game on that. At least you were doing that right from the start, very wise.

• 11:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, but I'm also starting in a more modern era of podcasting where it's become, I mean, as you know, and I think you and I can both gauge this, that like filmmakers and actors really do love these longer form conversations to dive into craft and just in general have a flowing conversation, but like podcasting has really become one of the stops that a lot of actors and filmmakers are doing on their press tours now.

• 11:55Josh Horowitz?

  Totally. It's it's replaced kind of like the late night talk show to a degree. I mean, they still exist, but um, I mean, I'm so excited for what you've already carved out. Like you're very early in this run and the fact that you start off with someone like Brolin speaks volumes of your like.

• 12:09Speaker 04

  That's all Brolin. Brolin, Brolin made that happen. I mean, and we're gonna dive into this because I want this episode and for both of us to be kind of an inside look into how this works because Josh is somebody who cares so much about what we do for a living and it's it's it's just cool to find somebody who genuinely cares so much about it. And with Brolin, for example, like you and I have talked about about this relationships over the years. And we can get into this in the conversation about how we would meet publicists at press junkets. I would always go up to a publicist and introduce myself. Hi, I'm Kevin. Thank you so much for your time with your with the with your client. And that.

• 12:49Speaker 04

  Was something I just did early on, and I think you did that as well, where and you just start to form relationships and friendships as well. And Brolin was somebody who I just became friendly with through the junket scene. Like, we met on a few movies. I think Sicario was the one where we really kinda hit it off and had a lot of fun with that one. And then we just became friends. So by the time I left local television, so Josh was saying he worked for MTV, or still works for MTV. My outlet was a local television station in DC, WTTG. And that's where I would do my four-minute junket slots for. And now, as of June of 2025, my wife and I moved out to LA.

• 13:30Speaker 04

  I started this show, and Brolin, who I'd built a relationship with over the years, great guy, love you, Josh, if you're listening, was, hey, man, I'll be your first guest. Let's do this. And it was just incredible. We were at a weapons press junket. I'd just done a five-minute press junket interview with him. I stood up, and he was essentially like, when are we doing the longer one? I'm like, hey, let's meet for 30 minutes. He goes, no, let's do 90. And I'm like, 90? I've never even, like, thought about doing 90 minutes with especially someone of that caliber and the filmography that Josh has. And so, yeah, we recorded that episode in Santa Barbara at a recording studio that I found. I mean, for people who don't know, I'm just gonna put this out there. I currently produce, edit, host, book,

• 14:14Speaker 04

  and pay for my own, my whole show. So there's nobody working for the show but me. And so that's been a bit of a challenge. And I know you're at a stage with your podcast where you have, you could have editors and you can have people helping.

• 14:27Josh Horowitz?

  I have editors at least. But it's funny you say that, because I get questions all the time, like, first people are very kind, like, oh, can I join the team? Or like, who's on the team? And I'm like, team? That's very sweet. But, um, yeah, I mean, I've told you this. We've had so many conversations about sort of like the ins and outs of what we do and just like, um, how to do what we do. I think you know this, like, the first, like, six, seven years of the podcast, I wasn't making any money. Literally, I wasn't making any money from it. I didn't even, it didn't even really occur to me to try to monetize it. It was a true passion project. It was like you're It was just like born out of like love and curiosity. And I think that's often where the best projects come out of. I had to do it. I wanted to do it.

• 15:09Josh Horowitz?

  And and and the the financial part of it is is great that like Happy Second Fuse is at a place now where like, yes, it can sustain me. And I can pay for some editors, but like, no one's booking the show. No one's prepping any questions. No one's choosing the guests. And you know, you'll you'll get to a place, I'm sure, where you can hopefully get a little bit more. Help just to like relieve your brain a little bit because it's, you know, the way you and I approach interviews. The the necessity of a long form conversation is it's a lot of prep. Like, I I I know you're like me. You don't want to like walk in here, even though you could, both you and I could just riff with somebody for an hour. I don't like that feeling. I like to feel way over prepared.

• 15:52Josh Horowitz?

  Like, I mean, I this morning I was prepping for, you know, two podcast interviews. I'm sure you're already prepping for the next.

• 15:57Speaker 04

  Who do you who you prepping for?

• 15:58Josh Horowitz?

  I'm doing Tom Hiddleston in two days. I'm Jennifer Lawrence in three days.

• 16:02Speaker 04

  And Josh does these live shows. So just to timestamp this, we're recording this on Sunday, January 4.

• 16:09Josh Horowitz?

  Yes. Day of the Critics' Choice Awards, which is why I'm in New York based, Kevin's LA now, as you heard, and I'm in LA for Critics' Choice. And we've been talking about doing something like this for a while and our schedules lined up to to fit this in.

• 16:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, and I wanted to mention that because by the time this episode comes out, the Oscar nominations will probably be out. So just in case you're listening to this, this is January 4, but we're gonna try.

• 16:31Josh Horowitz?

  Tron Aries got all the nominations.

• 16:34Speaker 04

  Geraldo already won Best Actor. It's it's over.

• 16:37Josh Horowitz?

  I watched it on the plane, which is why I have Tron Aries on the brain. I watch every Geraldo movie on a plane now.

• 16:42Speaker 04

  Really? Morbius was on a plane?

• 16:44Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, yeah.

• 16:45Speaker 04

  Dude, the Nine Inch Nails score in that movie is amazing.

• 16:48Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, in Tron.

• 16:49Speaker 04

  In Tron. I thought it was in Morbius, too. I'm going back to Tron Aries, but yeah.

• 16:52Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 16:53Speaker 04

  But but Josh does these amazing live shows and obviously check out his social media. We're on his channel and my channel as well. But you have live shows with Tom Hiddleston and Jennifer Lawrence. And you record those for the podcast.

• 17:04Josh Horowitz?

  I do. I've recorded a lot of those for the podcast. I've been recording, when I get out to LA, I've done events here. Gary Oldman, Seth Rogen and Ben Stiller, which you came to.

• 17:14Speaker 04

  Is there a different prep for a live show versus a show you do on your own?

• 17:18Josh Horowitz?

  To a degree, and you do, I mean, I know you haven't recorded live for the podcast exactly yet, though I see you've repurposed a couple of things, right?

• 17:24Speaker 04

  No, I did one with Hugh Jackman and Kate Hudson and Craig Brewer. I did it at the DGA and it was recorded as a podcast episode.

• 17:32Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 17:32Speaker 04

  And I guess, I don't know if I prepared it differently, but I, I tried to think about the audience there and then my audience listening.

• 17:40Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 17:40Speaker 04

  So when you're doing like a, when you're doing like a Jennifer Lawrence live show, you're thinking about Happy Sad Confused listeners? Are you also thinking about the audience there?

• 17:49Josh Horowitz?

  It's less change in prep than in change in how I conduct the interview in front of an audience. I don't know if you feel the same way, but like, I, it's a different vibe for me. I'm playing, I'm playing to, my, my most important audience is the guests, right? Like it's that interaction, but there, there are times when you, at least I feel like I want to play to that audience and reference the audience and involve them in the conversation to a degree. And it's, it's, it's kind of more of a performance, at least for, for me. You know, it's, it's laying back and letting the, the, um, the lines that elicit, you know, laughs, sit and, and, and, and lay there for a second. It's, it's, it's more about timing and kind of interacting with the audience to a degree. But it's, I don't really change the questions or the format.

• 18:33Josh Horowitz?

  It's more about just like changing how I'm conducting the conversation in the moment, if that makes sense.

• 18:38Speaker 04

  And you keep in like audience laughter, you keep those beats in as well as, as, as the edit for the, for the podcast. Cause I'm assuming, and I've listened to it before, but like you're saying it off the top where you are, like what you're doing. And so the audience already expects that you're in front of a live audience.

• 18:53Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 18:53Speaker 04

  And the audience listening at home knows that.

• 18:55Josh Horowitz?

  Yes. I don't think they both, they, they all have their pros and cons. Like sometimes it's nice to just sort of like. You know, one on one, no pressure of anybody watching except for the guest. But it's also great, I find, and you've moderated a ton of things. Like, the good thing about that kind of thing is the guest, it's incumbent upon them to be entertaining and charming. No one wants to like embarrass themselves in front of 500 people.

• 19:17Speaker 04

  Right.

• 19:17Josh Horowitz?

  So it kind of like puts a little bit more onus on them to be like big and fun and, and, you know, just entertaining. Um, whereas like, you know, they're generally going to be charming with us anyway, because again, it's all being recorded. But like one on one, I think there's less pressure on them to be like big. That makes sense.

• 19:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, no, it's an interesting, it's interesting. And you talk about prepping, like, like we prep days in advance for, for a lot of these things. And especially if we have multiple ones coming up that are back to back. Like, I'm prepping, like tomorrow I have Paul Tazwell, who's the costume designer for Wicked, and then also Amanda Seyfried tomorrow. Uh, for, uh, for the new movie, uh, The Testament of Anne Lee.

• 19:54Josh Horowitz?

  She's great.

• 19:54Speaker 04

  Which is just an incredible performance. But, but it is fascinating because, and as we sit here in the studio right now, it's interesting to sit across from somebody who does what I do.

• 20:03Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 20:03Speaker 04

  And what we do for a living. But obviously, you know, going back to that first episode you did with Kate. Yeah, and then going forward in the 11, 12 years of the show, how much has the show evolved? Because like, like I'm still finding my show.

• 20:16Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 20:16Speaker 04

  Like, when I sat down with Brolin, I remember someone saying to me, like, what, what exactly is the show? And I'm like, well, it's a longer form, craft driven podcast that is hopefully helping to give, uh, um, audiences an inside look into all the decisions that filmmakers make.

• 20:32Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 20:32Speaker 04

  Uh, whether it's movement, physicality, cinematography, editing, sound design, score. Like, how does, how are all the different people who collaborate on a film affected by everybody else's work?

• 20:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 20:42Speaker 04

  And I was like, okay, that's where the, the root of the show is. Cause I grew up on DVD features, right? That was my film school. Like, I would watch Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings featurettes about how Andy Serkis was performing as Gollum in Sméagol. It was just unbelievable. That's how I learned about filmmaking. And I was like, well, what if there was like a longer form podcast that kind of acted like DVD features in a way? But I'm sitting there talking to the artist who actually made the work. And so that's kind of where I had it. And then so I did Brolin, I'm like, what's my show exactly? I'm still figuring it out. I'm six months in, because like I had Sam Worthington on, right?

• 21:18Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 21:18Speaker 04

  Sam Worthington walks into the studio, into this exact studio. First thing he says to me is, I've watched every episode of your podcast. And I'm like, whoa, so does he know what kind of questions are about to come at him during the interview? And then we sat down and the interview became more of a conversation rather than an interview, right? And there are certain guests where that works and there are certain guests where that doesn't work.

• 21:41Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 21:42Speaker 04

  With Sam, it became like this, like, oh, I love this vibe. This is a much different vibe than my typical question and answer. But not every guest is gonna be like that.

• 21:51Josh Horowitz?

  I think that's, that's key. It's like, I, for me, you can only impose a format to a degree. Like, I, I think you're, you are so ahead of the game in terms of like the show. And I've watched most of the episodes and you know, I've told you this off mic, but I'll say it on, like, you're, you're killing it. And I knew you would, when I told you, you know, credit to myself, I was saying to Kevin,

• 22:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:11Josh Horowitz?

  this movie is gonna be great for you.

• 22:12Speaker 04

  Josh.

• 22:12Josh Horowitz?

  This podcast is gonna be great for you. There's nobody I have more confidence in. You are so respected in the industry and the quality, the level of guests and the level of conversations you've been doing in the first few months. So proud of you.

• 22:24Speaker 04

  And that means the world to me. And I'll say the same thing about you because Josh is somebody I've looked up to since I first started in this industry. Because you were paving a way of like, oh, I wanna get to a point where I have longer time. But then Josh is also the nicest guy. We talk about movies, we geek out about things. When I was leaving my job in DC to come to LA to start this show, you and I got on the phone. We had a lot of conversations. There was an idea at one point where we were gonna do a show together. That might happen at some point, you never know. Um, but yeah, continue what you were saying, but yeah.

• 22:54Josh Horowitz?

  Well, I was gonna say, I think, I think you're ahead of the game because I think you've already dialed into, you're smart, like, you're playing to your strengths, like, what you, and, and this is, I think, partially why, like, you know, we, we've talked about this also off mic, like, I think one of the things we enjoy is that we, like, there's always gonna be, I wouldn't say there's competitiveness, but like, I get, you know, excited or like, like, oh, Kevin got somebody that I want. And I'm sure you feel the same way.

• 23:14Speaker 04

  Of course.

• 23:14Josh Horowitz?

  That's always gonna happen.

• 23:15Speaker 04

  Yeah, but, but it's a respectful thing. Like, I'm never like jealous. It's more of like, oh, I wish I would've gotten, you know, Guillermo del Toro for Frankenstein. What would I have asked him? But then I'm also, at the same time, happy that you- You got him. I'm just confused and sad that I didn't.

• 23:31Josh Horowitz?

  But it's also, the good thing is, and the thing that I think probably makes us both feel good is, we do way different kind of interviews, even though we occupy, and I'm sure a lot of the audience overlaps, but you are so focused and have such knowledge and respect for every department and the craft behind it. And I have that to a degree, and I can hang with a DP and a composer to a degree, but it's not the level of immersion and obsession that you have. And I think that the fact that you're dialing into that is really smart and finding your own niche. But you're not going to have that same kind of conversation with Sam Worthington, who's an actor and an artist and has a certain level of expertise

• 24:16Josh Horowitz?

  or knowledge of cinematography and costuming. But I guess what I was going to say is, I think you're already finding your unique way into conversations. But I think for me, my conversation with a Tom Hiddleston is going to be way different than with the Duffer Brothers or with Jennifer Lawrence. And so I'm going to certainly have the kind of topics and approach that I always take.

• 24:40Speaker 04

  Based on the person.

• 24:41Josh Horowitz?

  I'm going to always tailor it to the person. I know Jennifer's going to be fun, and I'm prepping to epe around with her a bit.

• 24:51Josh Horowitz?

  We'll be right back with more Happy, Sad, Confused.

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• 26:00Speaker 04

  Someone told me this a while back and I learned this, not the hard way, but I learned this in the junket world. When I would be lucky to interview somebody multiple times and it took a while to figure somebody out. Like Harrison Ford, I don't think I figured out Harrison Ford, how to interview him until like my fifth time.

• 26:16Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, same probably.

• 26:17Speaker 04

  And it was, and, and he's such a nice guy. He's great in an interview, but he's a craft guy. He loves craft and acting and filmmaking and discovering a character. And I remember when I first met him, I wanted to geek out. I'm like, oh my gosh, it's Han Solo or Han Solo. And I'm like, it's Indiana Jones and that's not his vibe. He's, he's an actor who creates a character. Those characters happen to become legendary and iconic. And so how do you meet these people where they're at? And I was like, oh, on the fourth or fifth time I got him, I'm like, oh, I, I understand what he likes and what, what he's interested in talking about. He was always nice to me, but I, but I, but I never felt like I got to a connected level

• 26:58Speaker 04

  of craft conversation until I really understood, oh, he's passionate from about everything with character development.

• 27:05Josh Horowitz?

  I think that people often say to me, and I take it as a high compliment, like, oh my God, everybody seems so comfortable with you. They, they trust you. They go places, they went with other people. And a lot of that, part of it is, I know what I'm talking about and I have hopefully an affable vibe and I'm listening and I'm engaging, whatever. But a big part of it is just having history. Like exactly what you're saying.

• 27:23Speaker 04

  He's one of my favorite people to talk to now. Harrison Ford, every time I book him, like I, I know now what I have to, what I, where I have to go with it. Because at the end of the day, and I think you would agree with this as well, my questions come from a genuine place of curiosity.

• 27:37Josh Horowitz?

  Which is huge differ, you would think that's not a differentiating point between most folks in the business. But it is so invaluable because again, I'm sure you get this a lot, you should get this a lot. I get the compliment of like, oh, you actually, you care, you're genuine. And that's Should be a baseline.

• 27:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:54Josh Horowitz?

  It's not sadly, not to denigrate other folks that do what we do, but there are folks that just like are reading off a card and they come and go. And I think the folks that last really live and breathe this. And, and I think hopefully your conversations, my conversations, people can sense like, we love this.

• 28:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 28:11Josh Horowitz?

  We absolutely live and breathe this. Like, we both grew up in different ways, obsessed with what we are now making our living.

• 28:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 28:17Josh Horowitz?

  And I think that the passion comes through in every conversation.

• 28:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, and it's interesting because I, my goal at the end of every show is that if one person listens to the episode and learns something that enhances their experience with that film.

• 28:32Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 28:33Speaker 04

  I've done my job. And I go back, cause I started as a film critic, and I go back and look at, I look at older reviews I used to give. Like, I remember reviewing Shutter Island on TV, and my entire review was focused on the cinematography.

• 28:47Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 28:47Speaker 04

  The music choices, the performance, the movement, the twist. And I'm, I'm like, oh, I was already kind of setting myself up in a way where I just translated film criticism.

• 28:57Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 28:57Speaker 04

  Into interviewing. Like Park Chan Wook, who was just in here, uh, he used to be a film critic.

• 29:02Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 29:02Speaker 04

  Years and years ago. And so like, I, I just find it really interesting that like tho- that it was almost like I didn't realize this was gonna be the dream, but I was setting myself up for what that was gonna be.

• 29:13Josh Horowitz?

  Same thing in a different way for me. It's like, I, I think my interviews reflect everything that I love, which is like, there's a certain level of geekiness and obsession. Um, there's a certain level of like, I, you know, people like give me crap sometimes, like, oh, you're always asking about superheroes or, or auditions or things they didn't get. I'm like, I'm asking that because I love that stuff.

• 29:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:32Josh Horowitz?

  I love hearing the what ifs. Like, what did you almost get? This project that like famously never happened.

• 29:39Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:39Josh Horowitz?

  What was the audition? Like, I love listening to that. That's why I'm asking. It's not for clickbait. I swear to God.

• 29:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're coming from a genuine place. Like, and that's why you get the answers. Because I would argue.

• 29:51Josh Horowitz?

  Cause if someone is fishing for some, for that news.

• 29:53Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 29:53Josh Horowitz?

  They can detect that and they're not gonna give it to you.

• 29:55Speaker 04

  Dude, the body language is everything. Like, I'll, if you wanna sit across from somebody and have a genuine conversation, and you're coming from a real place.

• 30:02Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 30:03Speaker 04

  That person knows it and they want to come from a real place as well. That's, and I think that's the key, in my opinion, like you have to come at it from an actual genuine place of curiosity and then that will. People love people who are passionate.

• 30:17Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 30:18Speaker 04

  One of the best, uh, uh, comments I ever got on anything I ever did was, I don't even watch any of the films you talk about. I just like watching you talk to people about their passions.

• 30:29Josh Horowitz?

  I see that, I can get, I get that.

• 30:30Speaker 04

  That's interesting.

• 30:31Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 30:31Speaker 04

  Like, they don't even, like, I remember being at a Q and A event and this woman came up to me afterwards and she's like, I haven't seen any of the films that you guys were just talking about, but I was blown away by the conversation. I'm like, that's interesting to me. I'm like, why would that be interesting to somebody if they haven't seen the films?

• 30:45Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 30:45Speaker 04

  It's because they're people talking about things they love.

• 30:49Josh Horowitz?

  I want to, I want to hear about, because we, we've talked before this, it's funny, we came up with like 25 different topics. We're going to get to like three of them, we're not going to have enough time. But like, looking ahead, because we always like to geek out about movies and filmmakers and actors and stuff. Should we talk a little bit about just like the dreams, the ones that we're still chasing, the ones, should we try to manifest for each other this year?

• 31:06Speaker 04

  Let's do a manifesting of a moment here, a moment of gratitude and manifestation.

• 31:10Josh Horowitz?

  I'm very grateful for everybody I've had, I was, because you were asking me like, oh, let's think about like our favorite interviews and like, at least the ones for me that I think of, like, are the filmmakers I grew up loving, like yourself, I'm sure. It's like, for me, like, we both had a lot of Tarantino time, Tarantino very meaningful for me, Nolan meaningful for both of us.

• 31:28Speaker 04

  I think this year.

• 31:29Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 31:29Speaker 04

  Spielberg has to be like one of the, one of the top seeds. Because it's interesting, like, in this year, we have new Spielberg, new Nolan.

• 31:38Josh Horowitz?

  Hmm? Denis.

• 31:39Speaker 04

  Denis. Inuritu?

• 31:42Josh Horowitz?

  Fincher.

• 31:42Speaker 04

  Fincher. Yeah, so is, is Fincher your number one?

• 31:46Josh Horowitz?

  I think Fincher might be my number one.

• 31:47Speaker 04

  Over Spielberg?

• 31:49Josh Horowitz?

  Um, I think, maybe.

• 31:52Speaker 04

  Neither have been on the show before.

• 31:53Josh Horowitz?

  Neither have been on, I've interviewed both. Um, Spielberg very little, like small junkets kind of things. And Fincher, I've done a couple, actually, I moderated a couple of things. I, I like Fincher for a number of reasons, because, you know, I like. His films I'm obsessed with, of course, needless to say. But I also like who he is as like a human being. He is very dry.

• 32:13Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 32:13Josh Horowitz?

  Very funny.

• 32:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 32:14Josh Horowitz?

  He's dark, he's twisted. These are things I respond to.

• 32:17Speaker 04

  And Josh, that's one thing, like you're talking about me being like versed in the craft.

• 32:22Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 32:22Speaker 04

  Josh has, you have a great ability to stay, to stick with a comedic and conversational bit going back and forth. Like, I would be afraid to go comedic with David Fincher.

• 32:32Josh Horowitz?

  But you would be amazing on craft level with Fincher. So our two Finchers would be way different and both amazing.

• 32:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 32:38Josh Horowitz?

  Cause you would go so hardcore on craft.

• 32:40Speaker 04

  Like, tell me about the score in this shot and the color grading in this scene. Like, I couldn't keep up with like the dry humor. It would, I just wouldn't be able to do it.

• 32:47Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, and I would be like joking about like the what's in the box and like the, all the, all the crazy dark stuff. Oh my, yeah, and the gloves and the killer, like, yeah, all that stuff. Um, but yeah, Fincher, Fincher is definitely my vibe. He's one of my spirit animals and I just obsess with his work, so.

• 33:00Speaker 04

  Hypothetical.

• 33:01Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 33:02Speaker 04

  You're, someone comes to you, you have an hour with Spielberg, hour with Fincher.

• 33:07Josh Horowitz?

  It's hard.

• 33:07Speaker 04

  And you have to choose.

• 33:10Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I don't, here's the concern on Fincher. Uh, have we talked about this? He, he infamously did Marc Maron and never let Marc Maron run the episode.

• 33:19Speaker 04

  Are you serious?

• 33:19Josh Horowitz?

  Which is so Fincher.

• 33:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 33:22Josh Horowitz?

  Which is so, cause he's so meticulous, he's so like, you know, control driven. So I would have fear that I would do Fincher and then he would be like, cut all this out, never run it. So maybe I go with Spielberg then. Cause of, I mean, we're all children of Spielberg. I mean, I, and where do you?

• 33:35Speaker 04

  Where do you start?

• 33:36Josh Horowitz?

  Where do you start?

• 33:36Speaker 04

  Where do you even start? I, I, I had Macaulay Culkin on the show a couple of months ago and I only got through half of his life.

• 33:44Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 33:44Speaker 04

  And I was like, and then to think of.

• 33:46Josh Horowitz?

  You didn't get to Richie Rich?

• 33:47Speaker 04

  No, we got to, Richie Rich was where we got to. Because after Richie Rich, he, he stopped acting.

• 33:52Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 33:52Speaker 04

  And went back to high school.

• 33:53Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, so you didn't get to like to 54 maybe and other stuff later on?

• 33:56Speaker 04

  Party Monster, I didn't get to Saved, but, but thinking of that, like.

• 34:00Josh Horowitz?

  Was it Party Monster, not 54? I think I got confused.

• 34:02Speaker 04

  I think it's Party Monster.

• 34:02Josh Horowitz?

  They came out at the same time, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 34:03Speaker 04

  But, but Spielberg, yeah, where would you even begin? Because I guess you would have to like, okay, where's my focus? Because, so Disclosure Day is his movie that's coming out this year. It's a Universal film, it's a UFO film, so clearly.

• 34:14Josh Horowitz?

  Close Encounters, you do that.

• 34:15Speaker 04

  Right.

• 34:16Josh Horowitz?

  That's what you would do, you connect it there, because that's gonna be a big part of the conversation. Um, yeah, but yeah, he would be a dream. You've interviewed him, I know a couple of times too. Like, he, he's the one that like you showed a short to, you're short to.

• 34:26Speaker 04

  Dude, this, my Spielberg.

• 34:29Josh Horowitz?

  You have so many crazy stories.

• 34:30Speaker 04

  Story is insane. I'll keep it brief, but back in 2011, he was releasing Tintin and Warhorse.

• 34:37Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I did that junkie. Yeah, yeah.

• 34:38Speaker 04

  Right, in New York.

• 34:39Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 34:39Speaker 04

  And he was shooting Lincoln in Richmond, I believe.

• 34:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 34:42Speaker 04

  And I think he was coming up to New York on the weekends to promote Warhorse and Tintin.

• 34:47Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 34:48Speaker 04

  So I got him two weeks in a row. I got him four minutes for Tintin, for Warhorse, four minutes for Tintin. And then I've been lucky to get him over the years. I got him for The Post. I got him for Ready Player One. I got him for The Fableman's. I've been extremely lucky, but the first time I sat down with him, I wrote 17 questions for a four-minute conversation.

• 35:09Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 35:10Speaker 04

  I got to three. When the interview ended, we stood up and took a photo, and I remember we took four pictures because the lighting wasn't right. He was essentially directing the guy in the room.

• 35:20Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 35:20Speaker 04

  In a way to like, we'd get the best-looking photo. But yeah, him and I weirdly had a interestingly cool connection. Like, he was telling me he wanted me to make a short film. I did make a short film. I sent it to him. It was a really interesting whole full circle, but to get him on the podcast would be remarkable. But is, so is he, so Fincher aside, is he your number one this year?

• 35:43Josh Horowitz?

  I guess so. I haven't thought about, I mean, I only thought about it because we were texting about this, Thea, recently. I guess he's probably top of the list because I've done Denis a couple of times. I've done Nolan a few times.

• 35:52Speaker 04

  Dude.

• 35:53Josh Horowitz?

  We're both gonna do Nolan. It's gonna happen, obviously. You've done him a bunch before.

• 35:56Speaker 04

  When Josh calls Nolan Chris, I, I, I, I'm like, I couldn't do that.

• 35:59Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, yeah. So, yeah, for context, a couple of times in the interviews, sometimes this is a real thing. It's like.

• 36:04Speaker 04

  This is really funny.

• 36:05Josh Horowitz?

  Like, what do you call the person?

• 36:06Speaker 04

  I say Mr. Nolan.

• 36:07Josh Horowitz?

  And I know you, and like Jake is always nice, our friend Jake Hamilton is always like very deferential, Mr. This, Mr. That. And that's part of like his southern, like, you know, thing. And, but I don't, it would be very rare for me to just call somebody Mr. And maybe I'm a jerk that way.

• 36:20Speaker 04

  No, it's funny. You actually, dude, you pull it off. I can't pull off calling him Chris. I just can't.

• 36:26Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 36:26Speaker 04

  I can't do it. It's not my, it's.

• 36:28Josh Horowitz?

  It's funny. I've had success with, with, you know, that kind of ingratiating, maybe overly so thing a couple of times. I think, because it made me just think of when you said that, there's a moment in one of the Gary Oldman things I did. I've done a couple of events with him and he's just, oh my God, talk about the best, amazing. And he. At one point, he was talking about like not being proud of his like Harry Potter performance and like the entire audience was like, oh, and I, and I, and I literally like interrupted him like, Gary, are you kidding me? Like something like that? And the fact that I was saying that, like, I grew up, I was talking about people I was obsessed with growing up, like I memorized like the script for Bram Stoker's Dracula as a kid.

• 37:08Speaker 04

  The shadow work in that film, to this day, I would love to geek out with him about how he filmed the shadows.

• 37:13Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, yeah. Well, Coppola was a huge one. I did Coppola last year and that was.

• 37:17Speaker 04

  From Megalopolis?

• 37:18Josh Horowitz?

  That was a bucket list, or two years ago. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 37:20Speaker 04

  But it's funny, like you find the right moments to do it. And, and what I'm referring to is you were interviewing Christopher Nolan for Oppenheimer.

• 37:26Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 37:26Speaker 04

  And I think you were talking about Bond or something and you're like, come on, Chris, or whatever it was. But it was so funny. And I'm like, I could never get away with that.

• 37:34Josh Horowitz?

  I take, I do take pride in like, again, because people, I'm sure they ask you all the time, like interview techniques and I have my own, you know, you know, approach and, and things I think are valuable. I, for, for instance, like I am, people always ask me like, you know, how do you prep? What's most important? I always say, questions are important and listening is way more important. Anybody can read a good question, listening and responding and being in the moment. And what you're talking about is a good example of that is like, being able to interject and even interrupt sometimes and call somebody out and say like, Chris, Gary, and like get them to kind of like respond to me responding to them often will elicit, I think, the best response.

• 38:12Speaker 04

  Hundred percent. I mean, it's awesome to see because it, it really kind of grounds the moment, right? Because interviews.

• 38:18Josh Horowitz?

  It's an interaction.

• 38:19Speaker 04

  Interviews are high stakes in a way, right? And like, I think you cut through that with having a bit of a comfortability.

• 38:25Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 38:25Speaker 04

  With saying that, because you're not saying it disrespectfully.

• 38:28Josh Horowitz?

  I hope not. It's not meant that way.

• 38:30Speaker 04

  No, it's funny. It's like, it's like, come on, come on. We're just hanging out here. It's just funny.

• 38:34Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 38:34Speaker 04

  And so it's cool. So prep though is interesting because you and I probably prep similarly. But again, like you said, it's guest to guest to guest.

• 38:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 38:43Speaker 04

  So you're prepping for Jennifer Lawrence right now and you're prepping for.

• 38:46Josh Horowitz?

  Hiddleston.

• 38:47Speaker 04

  Hiddleston. And so those are two people you've talked to a lot before. What do you do when you've basically asked somebody everything?

• 38:55Josh Horowitz?

  Such a good question. Cause like, I'm literally in the middle of that with Hiddleston. I have done Hiddleston. This is gonna be, I think, his sixth time.

• 38:59Speaker 04

  Or Sam from, um, from Outlander.

• 39:02Josh Horowitz?

  Sam Heughan, same kind of thing. Oh my God, what's left?

• 39:04Speaker 04

  What else do you have to ask him? Like it's crazy. So what do you do? Like, like, I'm, I'm, I'm not at a point yet where I've had enough guests repeat because I'm just starting. But like, when you have someone back on for a longer form chat, obviously their new project.

• 39:17Josh Horowitz?

  New project will eat up some of the time. Um, it's challenging. I'm not gonna lie. I mean, like Hiddleston luckily is a talker. So I don't need to give him that much.

• 39:27Speaker 04

  You can play with Hiddleston too, because you know him.

• 39:29Josh Horowitz?

  I do know him and I can play with him and we can, we can riff about his return to like Avengers. He's only gonna say so much. I can do that kind of thing.

• 39:35Speaker 04

  And that becomes funny in itself because you know they can't answer it and you try to play with it that way.

• 39:40Josh Horowitz?

  I also like, you know, to your point about like finding a format, finding repeatable, like what your way in into the podcast is. Like I know you've been like, you know, repeating questions, which you absolutely have to do, should do, because it gives it some consistency.

• 39:53Speaker 04

  But does that, when does it become old for the audience? Like, for example, if you have a repeatable question, like sometimes they'll get a comment going, "Hey, maybe ease up on that, on that legacy question you're asking." I'm like, "Yeah, but that's kind of a staple of the show as to where the, because all the answers are so different."

• 40:08Josh Horowitz?

  I think if you like it, if you find you're getting different answers, keep at it. There are always gonna be people that are gonna give you crap. I get that. So I do like the profoundly random questions, which I'm going to give you before we end this.

• 40:17Speaker 04

  I'm gonna give you a few of mine. We got thirty minutes. Yeah.

• 40:19Josh Horowitz?

  Um, and, uh, and I love doing it because it does open up people in different ways.

• 40:25Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 40:26Josh Horowitz?

  But Hiddleston's done it. Like, and like, you know.

• 40:29Speaker 04

  Yeah. So what do you do? You don't do it again, do you?

• 40:31Josh Horowitz?

  I sometimes will swap something in. I'm actually toying with the idea, maybe if we have time, I'll, I'll try this out on you. Um, I'm toying with the idea of swapping out profoundly random questions.

• 40:42Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 40:43Josh Horowitz?

  Um, at least for repeated guests with a new kind of more movie centric, don't worry, it's not, unlike similar to your stuff, but similar, no movie rapid fire thing that kind of like gauges people's.

• 40:53Speaker 04

  Like this or that kind of thing?

• 40:54Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, a little bit. Um, so I might try that on Tom. Yeah, it's like, it's just trying stuff out. I have like a, kind of like a, kind of a mini game thing that I might try to,

• 41:03Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:03Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, you know, try on him. Um, yeah, it's just, but it is, that's kind of the most challenging is I find. Yes, you have the, the benefit of knowing the guest knows you, they'll be comfortable, but there is, um, yeah, you can't do the same stories. Although on the other hand, it's, it's, I find, I'm my own worst critic where like. I don't know if you find this, approaching an interview, I researched so much and I listened to so many interviews, and I don't want to hear the same stories.

• 41:32Speaker 04

  Sure, but sometimes your audience doesn't know those stories.

• 41:35Josh Horowitz?

  They don't, and they generally don't.

• 41:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:37Josh Horowitz?

  They really don't.

• 41:38Speaker 04

  And that's okay, and honestly, and that's what's interesting, and I struggle with this too, because I want, I don't set out to ask different things.

• 41:46Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 41:46Speaker 04

  I set out to ask things I want to know the answers to. But if the guest has answered something similar before, I'm still, I still want to know. And like, like I had Matthew Lillard in here recently, and I'm sure he's told the Scream story a million times, but I wanted to know.

• 42:01Josh Horowitz?

  Or Park Chan Wook dissecting the hallway sequence.

• 42:04Speaker 04

  Exactly.

• 42:04Josh Horowitz?

  But you have to, because you, you know, you care about that, and I want to hear him talk about that on your show.

• 42:08Speaker 04

  Or Macaulay Culkin, like, you know how many times he's talked about Home Alone?

• 42:12Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 42:12Speaker 04

  I'm still gonna ask him, and that's, that becomes interesting. My, my wife is, was really the, the help in this. She's like, Kevin, not everybody listens to every single interview out there.

• 42:21Josh Horowitz?

  I remind myself of that all the time.

• 42:23Speaker 04

  If you happen to have a similar question and you want to get a story from somebody, then, then ask it. Because it, it's, and it's, it's hard because you don't want the repeated answers. And we both know this, for people who watch press junket interviews before, a lot of actors have like canned answers, right? And, and like things they're, that they're saying on the press tour that speak to the film.

• 42:44Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 42:44Speaker 04

  And you obviously want to get around that and get the person to open up further than that. But sometimes you're just gonna get a cra- if there's a crazy story that happened on that set, and you have that guest in studio, and that story's already been out there, and you want them to expand on it, you ask it.

• 42:59Josh Horowitz?

  I've also learned this a lot from, and I know you do a lot of, more of this recently, Good For You, which is like moderating, which is like what I do too, a lot of, right? And those kind of events, like, that's, you are, you are there to service their story, their basic story. And again, for the audience, like, I I want, I don't want the audience to, I don't want to assume the audience knows everything I know. Because I'm the the 1% that knows everything about.

• 43:22Speaker 04

  And that's the biggest problem that we can have. We, we, we are so inundated with, with material and, and information. That we, the audience, like I was, I ran into a buddy of mine the other day, I was walking my dog. And I was, hey, I'm having Cynthia Revo on my show. Have you heard about this cool thing she does with perfumes? He goes, no, what do you mean? He goes, oh, yeah, so she was shooting Wicked 1 and 2, and she had different perfumes for each movie. So she could figure out where she was in the arc. I'm like, he goes, how, he goes, I know that. He goes, oh, I didn't know that. I'm like, oh, I probably should re-ask her that. Because my audience might not know that she does that. And I was like, okay, but maybe she's already spoken about it in different places. But I'm like, you know what? The answer she's gonna give me is gonna be different. And it's also coming from a place like, I just wanna know why and how she does it.

• 44:07Speaker 04

  You know what I mean?

• 44:08Josh Horowitz?

  And it's the beauty of long form. It's like you have time, so you can have some of that stuff in there. When I did my Duffer Brothers spoiler conversation, like, you know, I had already read a bunch of spoiler interviews they did the day before. And they talked a lot about like the final scene in the basement and how it was done. And I was like, I haven't seen them do it on camera. I haven't heard it for myself. It's a very important scene to the show. Like, I'm gonna spend three minutes on that.

• 44:29Speaker 04

  And you wanna know.

• 44:30Josh Horowitz?

  I wanna know.

• 44:30Speaker 04

  Exactly. And I think that's the key, is like, like, every single question you and I ever ask on our show is because we wanna know the answers to it. And that's kinda goes back to that. But it, it is fascinating, because you're right. It's like, we have to also think about our audience.

• 44:43Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 44:44Speaker 04

  Because we, we're an authority in a way, I guess, if you wanna put that, use that word. We're, we're hopefully, they're coming to us to learn and meet people at, at a different level than a normal press junket interview or a normal television interview. And our job is to, is to present that person in that way. Because I really feel like, and I, I would agree with you, I'm sure you'd agree with me. The person comes out more in a podcast.

• 45:08Josh Horowitz?

  Hundred percent.

• 45:09Speaker 04

  Not that the person's not there in the shorter form, form interview, but it's much more.

• 45:13Josh Horowitz?

  You can hide behind the canned answers way more easily in a six-minute interview than. Something, generally speaking, will, the real person will emerge, at least partially. Through forty-five minutes or an hour.

• 45:24Speaker 04

  When do you start hitting a flow?

• 45:26Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, that's, I mean, that that depends on the guest and the history and everything, right? Like, sometimes they can hit the ground running, but like, you know, I noticed this again. I was listening to the Tupper Brothers back and it was like, okay, about ten minutes in, we start, they they relaxed and we're kind of like, okay.

• 45:38Speaker 04

  Sometimes it's thirty minutes in.

• 45:39Josh Horowitz?

  Sure.

• 45:39Speaker 04

  Like, I'll be in an hour conversation and I'll start to feel the flow. It's like, the flow, and you know how, what it feels like. It's like you're you're just in tune.

• 45:49Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 45:49Speaker 04

  You're in tune with each other.

• 45:50Josh Horowitz?

  And you can feel their shoulders come down and they're and they're just like, okay, this person knows what they're talking about. I'm safe. I can be a little bit more open. And that can happen even with somebody you already know. It's just like, you know, it's just any kind of conversation, the length will be your best advantage. And I think that's why people respond so well to podcasts. More Happy Say Confused coming up.

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• 47:20Speaker 04

  One of the big questions I get a lot, and I had to navigate this early on, is what if you don't like the project that you're interviewing the person for?

• 47:28Josh Horowitz?

  Huge, yeah.

• 47:28Speaker 04

  My argument to that was always, I can still find things that I want to talk about. And I've been in plenty of situations where I've walked into a room, I didn't like the person's film. I don't sit there and go, "I didn't like your movie." You sit down and you have a professional conversation about the craft of what that movie did. So even if I don't like a film, I can go, "Hey, that score was great, that shot was incredible, the editing was great, the performance was good. Maybe the movie didn't work overall for me, but I can still find ways to ask about it and be respectful of the artist." Because I find that to be a different thing. Film criticism and interviewing are two different things.

• 48:06Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 48:06Speaker 04

  But ethically, for me, since I started off as a film reviewer, my movie reviews always had to be separate from the interview.

• 48:13Josh Horowitz?

  You must feel such a relief that you don't have to do that anymore.

• 48:15Speaker 04

  Not anymore, but there was lots of times where I would interview a cast and I have to come home and then, you know, the review, I would give a bad review to the film. And I don't like giving, you know, I don't like saying negative things about anybody's art. Because I feel like everybody struggles to make their art and a lot of work goes into what that art is. And I try to find a happy medium, but to me, those two were always separate. I never let the interview affect my review, but now I'm in a place where I'm just doing interviews, but...

• 48:45Josh Horowitz?

  It's also tricky though, and we've talked about this, is we know a lot of people now. We've been doing this a while and the lines get a little blurry.

• 48:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 48:52Josh Horowitz?

  Where like, you know, "Bro, wouldn't you consider a friend?" And there are people that I consider friends and people that I interact with or text with a little bit.

• 48:58Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 48:58Josh Horowitz?

  And it is like you do want to maintain, I actually really hesitate. I hate calling myself a journalist. I don't think I'm a journalist. I have too much respect for the profession of journalism.

• 49:07Speaker 04

  You're a journalist.

• 49:08Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, maybe or maybe not.

• 49:09Speaker 04

  I think we're in a hybrid state of journalism, I guess.

• 49:12Josh Horowitz?

  Everything is murky. I certainly don't consider myself, not that there's anything wrong with it, an influencer. I don't consider, I hate the term "content creator."

• 49:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:20Josh Horowitz?

  I'm a host. I'm an interviewer and host. And I do think I pride myself on authenticity, as we've discussed. And I do feel like I have found my way in to giving folks the truth about projects and and speaking truth to their careers more than 99% of folks in the business, meaning like I will, and it's funny because sometimes you'll get, you know, I read the comments too much like we all do, but like sometimes it'll be like, people will say like, oh, they should have asked this question, they should have like said this or that. I'm like, you don't know how, it's just not appropriate or polite to like be rude to somebody about a past something in their career. That being said, I'm not afraid

• 50:01Josh Horowitz?

  to like, again, depending on the comfort level, give them some crap about like every interview I've had with Will Arnett, I will bring up Jonah Hex and like Brolin too.

• 50:10Speaker 04

  But Brolin, those actors in there in Jonah Hex have publicly talked about how bad the film is.

• 50:16Josh Horowitz?

  And again, it's like a feel for it. How much do I know the person? How much do I know a sense of humor they have? I love the opportunities to be able to like, ask like Dakota Johnson and Citi Sweetie about Madame Web. Like, you know, it's tricky and you still have to be respectful, but like even being able to poke a little bit in a respectful way.

• 50:35Speaker 04

  But if you're interviewing Dakota for Madame Web.

• 50:37Josh Horowitz?

  No, of course, I would never.

• 50:38Speaker 04

  That's a very different situation because like you're not going to sit there and poke fun at it, you're going to have a conversation.

• 50:43Josh Horowitz?

  And I did do, I did Dakota for Madame Web and certainly I never came on there and said, what a masterpiece, you killed it. She also had admitted she had not seen the movie when we did the interview, so the writing was on the wall. But I found ways in to, as you say, talk about things, you know, production around the film, other aspects as opposed to saying like, starting out a baseline of like, you did it again.

• 51:07Speaker 04

  Yeah. But like privately, like you and I, we know a lot of actors and filmmakers privately, I've had discussions with actors off mic and off camera about films that I didn't like of theirs. And that's a completely normal conversation because when we meet in the middle on that way, I'm assuming you've been in that, in the same boat as well.

• 51:24Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. Wait, before the time gets, can I, can I test my, my new movie?

• 51:29Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 51:29Josh Horowitz?

  Q and A on you and I'll do the PR, the profoundly random questions. We call it PRQ in the business. I want to, I want to try my new questions on you because you're my guinea pig, okay?

• 51:37Speaker 04

  Okay. Let's do this.

• 51:39Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, so this is, I'm calling this for now, the Happy Say Confused Movie Matrix. And by the way, this is one of my pet peeves, is somebody reading their questions off an iPad or a phone. If you do it in the business, it's okay. I just hate it.

• 51:51Speaker 04

  I went to the Laugh Factory the other day and I, to see a comedy set and Nikki Glaser got up on stage and did her Golden Globes speech.

• 51:58Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 51:58Speaker 04

  That she's gonna do next Sunday and she was reading it off the phone, but she was doing it because the jokes were just freshly written. She was testing them to the audience.

• 52:06Josh Horowitz?

  And she killed it, you told me?

• 52:07Speaker 04

  Killed it.

• 52:07Josh Horowitz?

  Um, alright, wait, now I've lost it. Give me one second. Editing, editing. Okay, here we go. Alright, um, the movie ma- no, that's the wrong document. I'm so sorry, Kevin.

• 52:18Speaker 04

  No, don't worry about it.

• 52:19Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, the Happy Say Confused Movie Matrix, the first victim is Kevin McCarthy.

• 52:24Speaker 04

  This is huge.

• 52:25Josh Horowitz?

  Alien or Aliens?

• 52:27Speaker 04

  Aliens.

• 52:28Josh Horowitz?

  Me too.

• 52:29Speaker 04

  I'm a Cameron guy.

• 52:30Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 52:31Speaker 04

  But I also-

• 52:31Josh Horowitz?

  All respect to Alien.

• 52:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 52:33Josh Horowitz?

  Aliens, I would argue is the greatest action movie, along with T2.

• 52:36Speaker 04

  T2.

• 52:37Josh Horowitz?

  Never made.

• 52:37Speaker 04

  T2's my favorite movie of all time, but it's interesting, most people would say Alien.

• 52:42Josh Horowitz?

  A lot of people would, but-

• 52:43Speaker 04

  You're aliens too.

• 52:44Josh Horowitz?

  I'm totally aliens.

• 52:45Speaker 04

  Oh, hell yeah.

• 52:45Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, who's the best Spider-Man of all time?

• 52:48Speaker 04

  Peter Parker or Spider-Man?

• 52:49Josh Horowitz?

  No, meaning, uh, oh, I see. Um, ooh, you've already found a wrinkle.

• 52:54Speaker 04

  Because, because I feel like, when it comes to Batman, for example, I think Bale is the best Bruce Wayne of all time, but I think Keaton's the best Batman.

• 53:03Josh Horowitz?

  I thought you were an Affleck guy. You like that fight, you like that, that BVS fight, I know.

• 53:07Speaker 04

  You're right, I do love Affleck. Maybe, yeah, anyways, alright, Spider-Man. Um, I'm gonna go with Tom Holland.

• 53:15Josh Horowitz?

  Okay. What's the best comic book movie of all time?

• 53:19Speaker 04

  Dark Knight.

• 53:21Josh Horowitz?

  Who's your favorite James Bond?

• 53:26Speaker 04

  It's tough, because I think the best Bond movie I've ever seen is Skyfall.

• 53:33Josh Horowitz?

  Is it Connery or Craig? Is that the?

• 53:34Speaker 04

  It's gotta be Connery, but I prefer Craig and Pierce Brosnan's films.

• 53:41Josh Horowitz?

  Pierce Brosnan's films?

• 53:42Speaker 04

  Golden Eye is one of my favorite.

• 53:43Josh Horowitz?

  Golden Eye's a good one.

• 53:44Speaker 04

  Golden Eye is like top Bond for me, but I think Connery is the best actor to ever play Bond.

• 53:50Josh Horowitz?

  He certainly set the mold.

• 53:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 53:51Josh Horowitz?

  Um, scariest movie ever made?

• 53:54Speaker 04

  Sinister or The Shining.

• 53:57Josh Horowitz?

  Good ones. What's the funniest movie ever made?

• 54:01Speaker 04

  Either Blues Brothers or Dumb and Dumber.

• 54:07Josh Horowitz?

  What's a movie you can quote backwards and forwards? I know you can do a lot, but what's the one that comes to mind that you?

• 54:11Speaker 04

  Hmm, Terminator two and Interstellar and?

• 54:16Josh Horowitz?

  You're the wrong person because there are too many.

• 54:17Speaker 04

  A lot of them, yeah.

• 54:18Josh Horowitz?

  And finally, what's your go-to movie theater snack?

• 54:21Speaker 04

  Milk Duds, an icy mixed with blue and red. Popcorn buttered middle way through first and then more on top. And then depending on my mood.

• 54:33Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 54:33Speaker 04

  Nachos with an extra cheese or a hot dog with just mustard.

• 54:38Josh Horowitz?

  How are you alive? Do you still do this?

• 54:39Speaker 04

  Yeah, every day.

• 54:40Josh Horowitz?

  When's the last?

• 54:41Speaker 04

  My breakfast. I'm not joking, that's once a week.

• 54:45Josh Horowitz?

  I hate, I hate your metabolism.

• 54:46Speaker 04

  My cholesterol is not loving me right now. Wait, so where, where, what's your movie snack?

• 54:50Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, my movie snack is, um, see, I should answer this for myself. Yeah, it's a good idea. Um, I'm a, I'm a pretty basic. I'm a, I'm a Diet Coke, like a, uh, sorry, a Diet Cherry Coke. Cherry Coke Zero, whatever you want. And I'm, uh, Red Vines over Twizzlers.

• 55:04Speaker 04

  Okay, so I'm, I, I've, I've just really started my journey with Red Vines. Um.

• 55:10Josh Horowitz?

  It's a journey.

• 55:10Speaker 04

  Cause I'm, we're in LA and I go to the New Bev a lot and the Vista and Quentin's Theaters have a lot of older candies.

• 55:17Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 55:17Speaker 04

  And like, do you remember Goobers?

• 55:19Josh Horowitz?

  Sure.

• 55:19Speaker 04

  Oh, I miss Goobers.

• 55:21Josh Horowitz?

  Peanut involved though?

• 55:21Speaker 04

  Peanut, yeah. Yeah, you have peanut allergy.

• 55:23Josh Horowitz?

  No, I don't have a peanut allergy, but I'd never used to, growing up, I like hated chocolate and peanut butter. Now like I could live on it, but yeah, it was a thing.

• 55:30Speaker 04

  All right, let me ask you some questions.

• 55:31Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, go for it.

• 55:31Speaker 04

  Okay, so a movie you would love to re-watch again for the first time, the memory is gone. So this is an interesting question because the memory, I understand like where, where you may have seen it, who you may have been with.

• 55:43Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 55:44Speaker 04

  So put that aside and you get to watch the film not knowing anything about it again for the first time.

• 55:49Josh Horowitz?

  Two come to mind.

• 55:51Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 55:51Josh Horowitz?

  Um, maybe this has come up with guests already, uh, Matrix?

• 55:55Speaker 04

  That's like the, the biggest standard answer I get.

• 55:58Josh Horowitz?

  It was so mind blowing. It was like no one had seen anything like it.

• 56:01Speaker 04

  I mean, I was fourteen.

• 56:02Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 56:02Speaker 04

  And I, I remember where I was with my dad, my uncle, my brother.

• 56:07Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 56:07Speaker 04

  I remember we went to Pizzeria Uno afterwards and I was telling my dad, I'm like, I'm buying that movie. He goes, no, you're not. It's rated R. Kevin, you're fourteen. What, do you remember where you were?

• 56:15Josh Horowitz?

  I do remember. It was, uh, I think it was Lowe's eighty-fourth street in the Upper West Side with my brother.

• 56:21Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 56:21Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, most of my movie memories growing up are with my brother, my older brother. Um, the other one that comes to mind is a much different kind of movie, but I know, I'm sure you love it too. Speaking of Fincher, uh, I'd love to see Seven again for the first time.

• 56:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 56:32Josh Horowitz?

  Because it was so shocking.

• 56:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 56:35Josh Horowitz?

  That ending is still one of the best, most shocking endings ever. And I think just to experience like the visceral, I mean, constant surprises and edge of your seat, you know, John Doe coming out of nowhere. Uh, yeah, I think that would be remarkable to see again with no knowledge.

• 56:51Speaker 04

  And Seven's also an interesting, uh, interesting, uh, movie in terms of not showing the violence.

• 56:57Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 56:58Speaker 04

  Until the ending, you don't see any of the kills. That's all the aftermath and that, that's why I always felt like the lust scene was so effective because it's so horrifying to hear the character explain what happened.

• 57:10Josh Horowitz?

  Hyper ventilating, like the, oh my.

• 57:12Speaker 04

  Oh, it's, it's, it's worse than, it's worse than what Fincher could have shown us.

• 57:16Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 57:17Speaker 04

  Um, favorite shot in cinema history?

• 57:19Josh Horowitz?

  Oh my gosh, favorite shot, Kevin. Oh no, um.

• 57:27Josh Horowitz?

  What comes to mind? Um, I mean, the first thing that comes to mind is, um, Return of the Jedi?

• 57:36Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 57:37Josh Horowitz?

  The, um, when Luke kind of comes out, um, with like the, the lightsaber, like he, he, like Vader's taunting him.

• 57:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 57:44Josh Horowitz?

  And it comes out and those lightsabers clash in the darkness.

• 57:48Speaker 04

  Iconic, iconic.

• 57:50Josh Horowitz?

  Right?

• 57:50Speaker 04

  You're right.

• 57:51Josh Horowitz?

  I just got chills just talking about it.

• 57:52Speaker 04

  Dude, have you ever seen the Revenge of the Jedi poster?

• 57:55Josh Horowitz?

  Of course.

• 57:55Speaker 04

  Where it's like they're, the, the lightsabers are, are, the colors are switched.

• 57:59Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 57:59Speaker 04

  Oh. I think that's the shot.

• 58:01Josh Horowitz?

  I ruined, speaking of my brother and childhood, we had the novel, the comic novelization of Return of the Jedi before we saw it. And I, and I read it, I was seven years old and I ruined the ending. I remember screaming up to my brother when I was reading the comic book. I'm like, Darth Vader turns good. And he like wailed on me. He was so angry.

• 58:19Speaker 04

  Can you imagine if that happened during the social media times? That that would have been everywhere.

• 58:23Josh Horowitz?

  I know, I know.

• 58:24Speaker 04

  So, okay, that then brings up an interesting conversation then because I, I wanna, I wanna, I wanna do some hot takes here.

• 58:30Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 58:30Speaker 04

  Cause I weirdly like a lot of the third films in trilogies.

• 58:35Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 58:36Speaker 04

  So personally, Return of the Jedi is my favorite Star Wars film. And I don't know, I know, I know, but I don't, I don't know if this is an age thing. Cause I, I, I found films at, I found films sometimes at three. So Die Hard three, I saw before Die Hard one and two.

• 58:51Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 58:51Speaker 04

  Uh, I saw Back to the Future three before I saw one and two.

• 58:54Josh Horowitz?

  It's been very confusing.

• 58:55Speaker 04

  Very confusing, but I love Doc's love story. So those, a lot of the threes have become my favorites over the years. So, I'm a Return of the King guy.

• 59:03Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 59:03Speaker 04

  I love Last Crusade. I love Return of the Jedi. I love, you know, so I'm curious, not Godfather three, but I mean, I, I, I do love the Coda Cut. But I mean, like where, are you a three guy on any of those?

• 59:14Josh Horowitz?

  No, I would, as you went down that list, there would, there would be none of those that I would defend as better than the.

• 59:19Speaker 04

  I thought we were gonna be closer because you said aliens. I was like, okay, that's two over one.

• 59:23Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, so, and, and I, I'm a defender of Alien three, so we can go again, Fincher.

• 59:27Speaker 04

  I love Alien three, man. Come on. I don't understand the hate for that film.

• 59:30Josh Horowitz?

  You know, our guy Nolan, told me loves Alien three.

• 59:34Speaker 04

  We like it more than Fincher does apparently.

• 59:36Josh Horowitz?

  Definitely.

• 59:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 59:36Josh Horowitz?

  Definitely. That's again, I would have to bring that up with Fincher and he would immediately end the interview, probably.

• 59:41Speaker 04

  But then that goes back to what we were saying earlier. It's like, how many times has Fincher talked about what's in the box?

• 59:45Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 59:46Speaker 04

  How would you not ask that question?

• 59:48Josh Horowitz?

  Right.

• 59:48Speaker 04

  Of course you're gonna bring that up.

• 59:49Josh Horowitz?

  No, but going through this, I mean, look, I, I would say I love Back to the Future three, great. One is by far the best. Uh, Last Crusade, I've had this argument, I think with my wife actually, uh, and others. Um, a love class Crusade, don't get me wrong. Raiders is a perfect movie. Temple of Doom actually I think is remarkable. Culturally a little problematic nowadays, but still the opening sequence, arguably the best sequence.

• 1:00:12Speaker 04

  Yes, of any indie film. I think that's the best opening of the whole franchise.

• 1:00:16Josh Horowitz?

  Fantastic.

• 1:00:17Speaker 04

  Um, okay, all right. Are you, are you at least with me on Return of the Jedi being the best opening?

• 1:00:21Josh Horowitz?

  Return of the Jedi, this is best opening.

• 1:00:23Speaker 04

  Of the three.

• 1:00:24Josh Horowitz?

  Um, yeah, maybe I could do that.

• 1:00:26Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:00:27Josh Horowitz?

  Maybe I could do that.

• 1:00:28Speaker 04

  Thank you. Thanks for coming over to my side on that one. I appreciate that.

• 1:00:31Josh Horowitz?

  A Return of the King, good. I'm not the biggest, I mean, I love Lord of the Rings, but I'm not, I can't claim to be an expert. I think I'm a fellowship guy. I think it set it all up.

• 1:00:39Speaker 04

  You like the ones. You're a one guy.

• 1:00:40Josh Horowitz?

  I'm a one guy. I like setting up the world, I think.

• 1:00:42Speaker 04

  T2 or T1?

• 1:00:44Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, T2. I mean, I love Terminator, but like you have to kind of accept it for what it is, right? It's like, if it was a low, but it was an amazing B movie he made, essentially.

• 1:00:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:00:53Josh Horowitz?

  Um, but T2, he had all the tools. I mean, T2 was a game changer. That's one I vividly remember seeing for the first time. I know this is, you know, your bread and butter. That's the movie for you.

• 1:01:02Speaker 04

  It's everything.

• 1:01:02Josh Horowitz?

  Same for me. Like, that rocked my world.

• 1:01:04Speaker 04

  Is that your pivotal opening? Like, I, I, I, I open my show every time by asking somebody like the pivotal film that gave them the understanding of the communal experience, mostly in the theater capacity?

• 1:01:15Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:15Speaker 04

  So do you have a, do you have a theater experience as a kid that meant a lot to you? And then do you have a film that opened up your world of movies for you?

• 1:01:23Josh Horowitz?

  I mean, I have such vivid, I went to the movies all the time as a kid. Like I said, my older brother, Adam, um, took me to the movies all the time.

• 1:01:30Speaker 04

  Who's a writer?

• 1:01:31Josh Horowitz?

  Who's a writer. He, he wrote on Lost and created Once Upon a Time, co-created that. Um, and yeah, I have so many vivid memories. I mean, it's funny, like, we keep returning to the same films, but like, uh, seeing Return of the Jedi on opening day, I will always remember. I remember I dropped the big, uh, thing of popcorn and my grandmother got really upset with me.

• 1:01:48Speaker 04

  You remember that. Isn't that crazy how vivid that memory is?

• 1:01:52Josh Horowitz?

  I'm seeing the trailer for Return of the Jedi, 1983.

• 1:01:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:01:55Josh Horowitz?

  May 25th, I think was the opening day. Um, yeah, I mean, I remember, I mean, you, you, yeah, so many memories. I mean, the first movie I remember seeing in a theater is Time Bandits, the Terry Gilliam movie, which is so effed up. The end of that movie is like so dark. Um, and I love Terry Gilliam. That was a huge one for me to talk to him on the podcast.

• 1:02:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:02:17Josh Horowitz?

  Um, yeah, so, so many. I mean, I remember like, the first time, this was, actually wasn't even a theater, but like, I remember the double VHS tapes of Godfather and Godfather 2 and like discovering those for the first time. And like, that was definitely an eye-opening moment of like, Oh, I need to see everything by this filmmaker. This is, this is Curly Cinema, uh, whatever that means.

• 1:02:37Speaker 04

  Were you a blockbuster kid?

• 1:02:38Josh Horowitz?

  I was a blockbuster kid. Certainly blockbuster, but blockbuster over like West Coast video wasn't around, but or like, um, Tower Video was a big one in New York, uh, and I used to rent movies, um, to such a degree that like I was really bad at returning them on time and I racked up so many late fees that my parents like, were ready to like send me to like Military Academy. Like it was insane how bad I was. Uh, yeah.

• 1:03:02Speaker 04

  What's your favorite movie of all time?

• 1:03:04Josh Horowitz?

  I don't really have.

• 1:03:04Speaker 04

  Have you ever answered this?

• 1:03:05Josh Horowitz?

  No, I don't, I don't have my go to. I mean, honestly, like.

• 1:03:09Speaker 04

  You don't have a T two?

• 1:03:10Josh Horowitz?

  T two and Aliens are kind of like, like my twin greatest action movies of all time. My favorite comedy of all time, I would say, is Young Frankenstein, the Mel Brooks movie. Made a huge impact and I still think it's the funniest movie ever made. Uh, Love and Death by Woody Allen, uh, problematic as he is, was a big one for me. Um, yeah, I mean, I could rack up so many, like De Palma was huge for me, uh, growing up, all of his films, but it's amazing. Untouchables, I actually really love. I saw that when I was like eleven. Um, um, yeah, The Godfather's Needles to Say, Empire Strikes Back, some, um, PTA, Magnolia rocked my world. Magnolia is my favorite of his.

• 1:03:46Speaker 04

  Yeah. Oh, that's your favorite PTA. Okay, let's get into some hot take territory here. I'm a Phantom Thread guy.

• 1:03:52Josh Horowitz?

  I love Phantom Thread. Don't get me wrong.

• 1:03:53Speaker 04

  I also love Licorice Pizza. And I know that's the one that people generally don't love as much.

• 1:03:59Josh Horowitz?

  No, Inherit Vice is the one that's.

• 1:04:01Speaker 04

  Yeah. I'm not a big, I'm, I'm not big on Inherit Vice. But I, I actually personally need to give it another try. I only saw it once.

• 1:04:10Josh Horowitz?

  I tried.

• 1:04:11Speaker 04

  Where are you on One Battle?

• 1:04:12Josh Horowitz?

  Love.

• 1:04:13Speaker 04

  That's like top tier.

• 1:04:15Josh Horowitz?

  Top tier.

• 1:04:15Speaker 04

  Are you a Phantom Thread guy?

• 1:04:16Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Um, I'm not like as much, I know there's the master obsessives. It's such a weird tone and so kind of enigmatic and it's, it's just a hard, it's not a fun, not that movies have to be fun. I wouldn't say Magnolia is a fun watch, but, I don't know, it's a tough one for me. I, I respect it. I love it. Uh, There Will Be Blood is a masterpiece, of course. I would put There Will Be Blood, Magnolia at top tier. Maybe One Battle, I need to give it. Like a year or two before I assess because it's like, you know, a Tarantino front like Once Upon a Time, and I think actually we share this. I remember you talked about this. It took me a minute to realize how amazing

• 1:04:51Speaker 04

  Three times.

• 1:04:52Josh Horowitz?

  I mean, I loved it from the start. But like it's top tier. It's it's it might be his masterpiece. It's up there with Inglourious for me.

• 1:04:59Speaker 04

  I think it's his masterpiece. I mean, I saw it twice on thirty five and then once on seventy and the seventy mil experience changed everything for me. Uh, number one, Fincher's seven for you?

• 1:05:09Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I think so.

• 1:05:10Speaker 04

  I might have to go with, um, I think Zodiac is the best movie he's ever made. But I'll never see it ever again.

• 1:05:17Josh Horowitz?

  I saw it recently, uh, uh, in a friend of mine, uh, rented out a theater and we watched it, uh, on the big screen and it was fantastic.

• 1:05:24Speaker 04

  The beach scene is, I can't get it. I can't, I can't watch that scene.

• 1:05:29Josh Horowitz?

  Again, it's not, I, I, I, I'm kind of with you on Zodiac. I think it's like arguably his masterpiece. It's epic in so many different ways. It's not like, I wouldn't say it's like a satisfying, seven is weird to say seven is satisfying, but seven is such like an elegantly made

• 1:05:43Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:05:43Josh Horowitz?

  Perfect construction for me. I find, I find it so, I, I often talk about movies that where I feel like satisfied, they're full meals. Like everything is like tied up. That's why no one films are so, they're so satisfying. He, he returns to the theme at the end.

• 1:05:57Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:05:57Josh Horowitz?

  He knows how to like, just like, set you out on the, like, walking out of the theater feeling like, oh, you drop the mic. He just like, end of Dark Knight, Dark Knight Rises, all his films, like, yeah.

• 1:06:07Speaker 04

  I saw Oppenheimer ten times and that's not a, that, that is a heavy film.

• 1:06:12Josh Horowitz?

  What movie have you seen the most in a theater?

• 1:06:15Speaker 04

  Probably Oppenheimer.

• 1:06:16Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:17Speaker 04

  What about you?

• 1:06:18Josh Horowitz?

  I think mine is The Phantom Menace. I think I saw Phantom Menace like twenty, twenty-five times.

• 1:06:23Speaker 04

  Dude, there are some really good scenes in that film.

• 1:06:26Josh Horowitz?

  I'll defend it.

• 1:06:27Speaker 04

  I don't mind defending the pod race is amazing. I, I, I, I have some, listen, I mean, there's things in that film I don't love.

• 1:06:33Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 1:06:33Speaker 04

  But you also have to give credit to the ambition.

• 1:06:36Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:06:36Speaker 04

  And it's a really, really, it's an ambitious film.

• 1:06:38Josh Horowitz?

  I always say, people, people are probably sick of me using this phrase on the podcast, big swings. I, I need a big swing.

• 1:06:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:06:45Josh Horowitz?

  I don't care about the doubles. I want the home runs. That's why I like, I like the cloud atlases of the world. Like Fury Road was like wild and insane and it worked. When they work. So satisfying.

• 1:06:56Speaker 04

  I'm glad it happened.

• 1:06:57Josh Horowitz?

  Yes. George Miller, by the way, that was, that's, that's a big one for me. He's done the pod a couple of times. And I think that guy's brain is just like another level.

• 1:07:04Speaker 04

  I mean, he's incredible. Isn't he in his eighties?

• 1:07:06Josh Horowitz?

  Probably by now, yeah.

• 1:07:07Speaker 04

  Who else is like, uh, I was trying to think of some filmmakers, because there's that famous quote from Tarantino about stopping after 10 films. And then you see certain filmmakers who are obviously excelling.

• 1:07:17Josh Horowitz?

  Yes.

• 1:07:17Speaker 04

  Way later in their lives as well.

• 1:07:18Josh Horowitz?

  I mean Ridley's still killing it, but Ridley's still hit and miss.

• 1:07:21Speaker 04

  Which number one Ridley?

• 1:07:22Josh Horowitz?

  Um, oh, good question. Um, maybe Blade Runner?

• 1:07:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think it ha- what do you think? Blade, has to be Blade Runner. Has to be. Or Gladiator, but I feel like that's too easy of an answer.

• 1:07:34Josh Horowitz?

  I, I love Gladiator, but I was never like a huge Gladiator guy, to be honest. It wasn't my-

• 1:07:39Speaker 04

  Ali- I don't know, maybe it's Alien.

• 1:07:41Josh Horowitz?

  Alien's pretty great.

• 1:07:41Speaker 04

  Number one Nolan?

• 1:07:43Josh Horowitz?

  Number one Nolan, I think, I, I think I would do Dark Knight.

• 1:07:47Speaker 04

  Interstellar.

• 1:07:48Josh Horowitz?

  A little basic. I'm not an Interstellar, I like, again, I like it. I know you're, you have the tattoo.

• 1:07:51Speaker 04

  That's the end of our podcast right there.

• 1:07:52Josh Horowitz?

  I know, I know.

• 1:07:53Speaker 04

  Interstellar is like, is-

• 1:07:55Josh Horowitz?

  You've got the Ewok tattoo and the Interstellar tattoo.

• 1:07:58Speaker 04

  Jabba the Hutt just sitting, sitting on my chest right here.

• 1:08:01Josh Horowitz?

  Wait, I promised you the, the profoundly random questions.

• 1:08:03Speaker 04

  Yes, yes.

• 1:08:03Josh Horowitz?

  Do we have time?

• 1:08:04Speaker 04

  Yeah, we're just, let's do this.

• 1:08:04Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, we're right here. Okay, okay, let's do it. Okay.

• 1:08:06Speaker 04

  Josh and I are up against the clock because we have to get to an award show that, which sounds insane to even say. We have to go to the Critics' Choice Awards and hang out with Leonardo DiCaprio.

• 1:08:16Josh Horowitz?

  I have to change out of my Big Trouble in Little China shirt. Uh, is that what I'm wearing? No, Buckaroo Banzai today. Okay.

• 1:08:21Speaker 04

  Buckaroo Banzai, that's a good one, man.

• 1:08:24Josh Horowitz?

  Talk about a movie that rocked my world.

• 1:08:25Speaker 04

  Hell, yeah.

• 1:08:26Josh Horowitz?

  I think I was eight or nine. Uh, dogs or cats?

• 1:08:28Speaker 04

  Dogs. I love cats, though, but my mom is allergic to cats. I never had cats growing up, so dogs are, are, are, is, is my default. And I love my dog, Murphy, and you love your dog as well.

• 1:08:38Josh Horowitz?

  He's the best. What do you collect, Kevin?

• 1:08:41Speaker 04

  Movie ticket stubs.

• 1:08:42Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. What's your favorite video game of all time?

• 1:08:47Speaker 04

  Either Donkey Kong for sixty-four or Mario Kart sixty-four.

• 1:08:51Josh Horowitz?

  Classic.

• 1:08:52Speaker 04

  Street Fighter II Turbo II.

• 1:08:54Josh Horowitz?

  Um. This is the Dakota Johnson Memorial Question. She asked me this. I will ask you. Would you rather have a mouthful of bees or one bee in your butt?

• 1:09:03Speaker 04

  Oh, my gosh. Probably the butt because I like more bees makes me nervous.

• 1:09:08Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:08Speaker 04

  And I got stung fifteen times when I was a kid when I was mowing the lawn, so.

• 1:09:12Josh Horowitz?

  At once?

• 1:09:12Speaker 04

  Yes, at one time.

• 1:09:14Josh Horowitz?

  You have history.

• 1:09:14Speaker 04

  So just give me one bee.

• 1:09:15Josh Horowitz?

  I get it.

• 1:09:16Speaker 04

  Yeah. Where are you on that?

• 1:09:17Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, I'm with you. I want to be in the butt. Get it over with. What's, uh, what's the wallpaper on your phone?

• 1:09:23Speaker 04

  My wife and I and my dog. Yours?

• 1:09:25Josh Horowitz?

  Um, what? Oh, it's Lucy. Yeah.

• 1:09:27Speaker 04

  There you go.

• 1:09:28Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, last actor you were mistaken for. Do you ever get mistaken for anybody?

• 1:09:32Speaker 04

  Okay, I don't understand this. People say Bradley Cooper. I don't see it at all. Someone said the other day I look like Bradley Cooper and John Grzinski together.

• 1:09:40Josh Horowitz?

  Like, like, like a Brundle fly, like a combo? Oh, that's a movie. We could talk about the fly. That's a perfect movie for me.

• 1:09:45Speaker 04

  Cronenberg. What, what, what's your mistaken actor for you?

• 1:09:49Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, well, I was mistaken for you recently. I told you that.

• 1:09:51Speaker 04

  You, you went with it, didn't you?

• 1:09:53Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:56Speaker 04

  Someone's.

• 1:09:56Josh Horowitz?

  Someone complimented me on my, my scoop with Sean Levy, uh, getting Thomas Newman doing the score. Like, but the funny thing is like, there was like a preamble. He was like, I'm such a fan of your work. You're amazing. I'm like, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm like playing it off like great, great, great. He's like, you know, in that recent, the Sean Levy.

• 1:10:13Speaker 04

  Cause you were past the player no return. You couldn't tell him then that it wasn't me. Great. Oh, that's good, good.

• 1:10:19Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, I guess I can't do worst noted director has ever given you, so we'll skip that. Uh, in honor of Happy Second Fuse, who's an actor who always makes you happy?

• 1:10:27Speaker 04

  Jim Carrey.

• 1:10:29Josh Horowitz?

  Movie that makes you sad?

• 1:10:32Speaker 04

  Marley and Me, which I will never watch again. Do you remember how they marketed Marley and Me? It was like a Christmas movie.

• 1:10:39Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:10:40Speaker 04

  I'm like, what?

• 1:10:41Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, it's cruel.

• 1:10:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:10:42Josh Horowitz?

  And a food that makes you confused?

• 1:10:44Speaker 04

  Brussels sprouts.

• 1:10:45Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, really?

• 1:10:46Speaker 04

  Yeah. What about you? What's a food that makes you confused?

• 1:10:48Josh Horowitz?

  Um, I have, I have a bunch. I always say beets. Anything beet related ruins, ruins the whole experience for me.

• 1:10:54Speaker 04

  Huh. Okay. And then, wait, I have a couple of things. We have to get out of here.

• 1:10:58Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, all good.

• 1:10:59Speaker 04

  Let me think here. There's a couple of things I want to ask you. Movie you've watched the most in your life. It's probably Phantom Menace.

• 1:11:05Josh Horowitz?

  It, it, it's probably, again, like growing up, like a, a, a big old nerd of like Star Wars and Star Trek. Like I went to sci-fi conventions, like

• 1:11:12Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:11:13Josh Horowitz?

  Just the sheer volume of like Star Trek. In my, my brain. I've seen all those movies, All Stars and Star Trek, like way too many times.

• 1:11:20Speaker 04

  Ratha Khan is the best Trek movie, right? There's no question on that, right?

• 1:11:26Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I would say so.

• 1:11:26Speaker 04

  So you're a two over one guy on that one?

• 1:11:29Josh Horowitz?

  Three's good, but not, not, uh, yeah, yeah, Searcher Spock, okay.

• 1:11:33Speaker 04

  Did Nimoy direct three?

• 1:11:34Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, and four. Let's not go on Final Frontier with Shatner.

• 1:11:39Speaker 04

  As we reach the end here, let's, let's put this out into the world. So we touched this a little bit in the beginning. The dream guest for 2026.

• 1:11:48Josh Horowitz?

  We're manifesting.

• 1:11:49Speaker 04

  You have to choose the one.

• 1:11:50Josh Horowitz?

  Okay, well, I think we should do different ones. So you're, you're Spielberg.

• 1:11:53Speaker 04

  I'm gonna go Nolan.

• 1:11:55Josh Horowitz?

  But you're getting Nolan. You don't need to, it's happening.

• 1:11:57Speaker 04

  I never assume, I never assume I'm, I'm getting anybody. I have been to the theater to watch the prologue four times. Christopher Nolan is my favorite filmmaker ever. And like, to think that he could possibly sit here on my show. I obviously did a show prior to this called Real Blend. We did have him on for that. I've sat down with Christopher Nolan before in press junket situations, but I can't fathom him sitting here for my show. So I'm not gonna say it's gonna happen. I'm hoping it happens. That's my number one.

• 1:12:30Josh Horowitz?

  He's gonna be sitting in this seat with a 64 ounce mug of tea.

• 1:12:36Speaker 04

  And I'm gonna be crying.

• 1:12:37Josh Horowitz?

  You're gonna be crying.

• 1:12:38Speaker 04

  Yeah. What, uh, you have, you have to choose.

• 1:12:41Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I mean, I don't think it'll happen because he, like I said, if he, if he killed the Maron one, it's not gonna happen. But I might as well shoot for the stars. Let's, let's make Fincher happen. And it's for, for folks that don't know. He's directed this Tarantino script, this, uh, this Cliff Booth movie.

• 1:12:54Speaker 04

  Yeah, and it's apparently like an episode. So.

• 1:12:56Josh Horowitz?

  I am tight with Netflix takes good care of me. It's a Netflix movie. Might help.

• 1:13:01Speaker 04

  Okay, so Netflix called you right now and they say, Josh, you're confirmed for Fincher. What's the first thing you do to, to, to prepare?

• 1:13:10Josh Horowitz?

  He's one that I might like. Do a rewatch of virtually everything. I mean, he's worth it. Like, and I, I, what a, what a joy, joyous, you know, assignment, like, to rewatch all these movies.

• 1:13:21Speaker 04

  I love the game. Game's so good.

• 1:13:23Josh Horowitz?

  I've been searching for years. Well, end of this. Um, we're over, but like, um, I've been searching for years. I love the, uh, T-shirt that, um, that Sean Penn brings out at the end. You know what I'm talking about? I was left for dead and, uh, in, in Mexico and all I got was this lousy T-shirt. I just, now that I got the cruise cake, I want that T-shirt in my life.

• 1:13:40Speaker 04

  Wait, we, okay, we can't get out of here without discussing the cruise cake. So, hold on. So Josh, Josh has been so passionate about getting this cruise cake.

• 1:13:49Josh Horowitz?

  Sad is another word.

• 1:13:50Speaker 04

  I was on the carpet with him in New York for the last mission.

• 1:13:54Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:13:54Speaker 04

  Where you made the pitch.

• 1:13:56Josh Horowitz?

  That was, by the way, a last minute idea. I was, that was not planned. I'm very proud of myself in a sad way. I, yes, for context, um, like yourself, we've covered a lot of mission premieres. We've gotten a chance to interview Tom a lot. He's so gracious with his time on carpets. Usually carpet interviews are like 10 seconds. He actually gives a decent amount of time. I've hosted, been very privileged. I hosted the world premiere of Top Gun Maverick. I hosted the world premiere of, um, Dead Reckoning, uh, part one at the time. No longer part one.

• 1:14:24Speaker 04

  And Tom Cruise landed in a helicopter on, on the, on an aircraft carrier from Top Gun and then went right over to Josh.

• 1:14:29Josh Horowitz?

  Insane.

• 1:14:29Speaker 04

  It was unbelievable.

• 1:14:30Josh Horowitz?

  Insane.

• 1:14:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:14:31Josh Horowitz?

  Um, so I've, I've had history with Tom. He probably would recognize me to a degree. I wouldn't say I'm besties with him. So, and I've been joking for years, the famous Tom Cruise cake, for those that don't know, he gifts many people in his life, friends, colleagues, et cetera, a holiday chocolate, uh, coconut, white chocolate coconut cake, um, every holiday season. And I'm like, I've hosted two world premieres. I've done him like 15 times. Why am I not on the coconut cake list? Come on. I know a couple of journalists that are. I'm like, come on. Um, so I did, I made my pitch in person at the last premiere on the carpet and I said, I was very proud of myself, again, very impromptu. I said, the only, Tom, by the way, as I'm entering, ending the interview, the only thing I love more than Tom Cruise movies are coconut cakes. And he laughed and he goes, that's a good hint. Good hint. And then.

• 1:15:16Speaker 04

  Do you think he really remembered?

• 1:15:18Josh Horowitz?

  I don't know. I truly don't know.

• 1:15:20Speaker 04

  How is that possible?

• 1:15:21Josh Horowitz?

  I don't know how he got my address. I don't know who did it, but.

• 1:15:25Speaker 04

  Wait, wait, you didn't send your address to anybody? They, it just showed up?

• 1:15:28Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. Kevin. Kevin, it was a miracle. It was a Christmas miracle.

• 1:15:32Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:15:33Josh Horowitz?

  Dreams can come true. That's what I'm saying.

• 1:15:35Speaker 04

  That's mind blowing.

• 1:15:36Josh Horowitz?

  That's my gift to you and the audience.

• 1:15:38Speaker 04

  Okay. Well, obviously I have tears in my eyes. So we have to wrap this up.

• 1:15:43Josh Horowitz?

  We'll do this again. We'll figure out more. We've been talking about doing this or other things. And hopefully we'll do more.

• 1:15:47Speaker 04

  I love this. I'm happy we did it.

• 1:15:50Josh Horowitz?

  Me too.

• 1:15:50Speaker 04

  I'm sad it's over and I'm confused why you don't love Return of the Jedi. So we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna go ahead and just end on that.

• 1:15:56Josh Horowitz?

  Destroy your set now.

• 1:15:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:15:58Josh Horowitz?

  I'm gonna burn it all down.

• 1:15:59Speaker 04

  Thank you, Josh.

• 1:15:59Josh Horowitz?

  Thanks, buddy.

• 1:16:02Speaker 02

  And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Remember to review, rate and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley and I definitely wasn't. Do this by Josh.

• 1:16:21Speaker 06

  You've got your favorite blanket, a freshly poured drink and a cold case burning a hole in your streaming queue. You're not just watching true crime, you're running the investigation from the comfort of your couch. Welcome to Murder She Watched, the podcast where we recap, dissect and slightly overanalyze some of the best and craziest true crime documentaries on our favorite streamers. Did the spouse do it? Why is the shady neighbor wearing leather gloves in July? Why did this guy agree to be interviewed in this documentary? We ask the tough questions that you're often just screaming at your TV. So every week we break down the twists, red herrings and absurd documentaries that have kept you up all night.

• 1:17:05Speaker 06

  It's high drama, cozy vibes and absolute couch detective energy. Grab your throw blanket and hit subscribe. Search Murder She Watched wherever you listen to podcasts and let's solve this thing together.