"Being Canceled is a Choice" | Replit CEO with a16z

Recorded live at the New Media Summit, Erik Torenberg sits down with Replit founder and CEO Amjad Masad to discuss founder-led storytelling, building in public, and the role of media in company building. Masad reflects on Replit’s decade-long journey, including the years before the company’s recent breakout growth, and explains why communicating a vision can be just as important as executing on it. He argues that for many founders, especially those building ambitious products ahead of the market, telling a compelling story is often necessary to attract talent, capital, and early believers. The conversation explores social media, authenticity, public communication, company-building, and how founders can develop a voice that resonates beyond their product. Along the way, Masad shares lessons from building Replit, navigating controversy, and why he believes founders should think carefully about when to go direct and what story they're trying to tell. Timestamps: 00:00 - Intro 00:52 - How Going Direct Saved Replit 02:38 - Improv, Exposure Therapy & Making Mistakes Early 05:20 - Build in Public & the Power of Authenticity 08:40 - Being Uncancellable: Why Retreating Is the Real Risk 13:21 - When to Respond & When to Let It Go 17:39 - Does Every CEO Need to Be an Influencer? 19:38 - Platform Strategy: X vs Instagram vs YouTube 22:53 - Understanding the Meta: How to Actually Go Viral Resources: Follow Amjad Masad on X: https://x.com/amasad Follow Erik Torenberg on X: https://x.com/eriktorenberg Stay Updated: If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to like, subscribe, and share with your friends! Find a16z on X: https://twitter.com/a16z Find a16z on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/a16z Listen to the a16z Show on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5bC65RDvs3oxnLyqqvkUYX Listen to the a16z Show on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/a16z-podcast/id842818711 Follow our host: https://x.com/eriktorenberg Please note that the content here is for informational purposes only; should NOT be taken as legal, business, tax, or investment advice or be used to evaluate any investment or security; and is not directed at any investors or potential investors in any a16z fund. a16z and its affiliates may maintain investments in the companies discussed. For more details please see http://a16z.com/disclosures.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Amjad Masad?

  Being canceled is a choice. You can choose to get canceled and retreat from the public eye. But I think if you're still out there, at some point, honestly, the haters kind of give up.

• 0:09Erik Torenberg?

  Some people ask, hey, how should I think about X versus other platforms?

• 0:12Amjad Masad?

  You have to understand the meta, because the way to go viral is to dress up your argument, your worldview in the current conversation. Twitter's influence is amazing, but it tends to be elite, kind of inside group influence. I think Instagram, Facebook still, YouTube is where you get to the early majority.

• 0:31Erik Torenberg?

  Does every CEO need to become an influencer now?

• 0:33Amjad Masad?

  Look, I think there's so many paths to success. I don't think there's one. Replit would have probably died if I wasn't telling a story that is larger than the company itself. Dario is an example where he's not playing the social media game. The product sort of speaks for itself. So I think it comes down to the...

• 0:50Erik Torenberg?

  For years, Replit wasn't the overnight success people see today. Long before the company's recent growth, Amjad Masad spent years communicating a vision that many people thought was too ambitious, too early, or simply unrealistic. That experience shaped his belief that for founders, storytelling isn't separate from company building. In some cases, it's a prerequisite. Recorded live at the New Media Summit, Amjad and I discuss why founders should build in public, how to develop a public voice, and what it takes to communicate a vision before the rest of the world can see it. We also talk about authenticity, social media, founder-led media, and why some of the most important company building happens long before the business itself is obvious.

• 1:37Erik Torenberg?

  Amjad, thank you for joining us.

• 1:39Amjad Masad?

  Of course.

• 1:40Erik Torenberg?

  So Replit is a 10-year-old company. For the last two years, it's gone absolutely vertical. But there was a period of time well before that where the company was in the zeitgeist, partially because of your go-direct efforts. And you're one of the best CEOs on X. You're also now getting big on Instagram and other platforms. What is the business impact been of your efforts going direct? And does every CEO need to become an influencer now? Or how have you sort of conceived this?

• 2:05Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, I think Replit would have probably died if I wasn't telling a story that is larger than the company itself. The company wasn't successful commercially, but we've been very successful fundraising, recruiting. And I think if you build a company that's successful right out of the gate commercially, you might not need to do all of that. But if you're trying to meme a dream into reality, I think you have to play that game. And so, yeah, I think otherwise we would have not existed, because we had to do that for so many years before... I mean, it turns out everything I said was true, but at the time, it wasn't real. It was a dream.

• 2:46Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. And I mean, you, at one point, decided to go big on this. You weren't always big on Twitter. I mean, you started, and a lot of people here, a lot of people who are CEOs, maybe it doesn't come supernaturally to them and they have to make a decision of like, you know, I'm going to do this, and if so, how do I get good at it? What was your journey to saying, hey, I'm really going to invest in this, and I'm going to get good at this?

• 3:07Amjad Masad?

  Well, I think the journey starts outside of Twitter even. It's like, how do you get good at communicating? How do you get good at public speaking? And so I always wanted to be able to be an influencer, for lack of better words. And I remember I was in New York when I first came to the States, and I had a terrible stage fright. I'd be sitting here and my heart rate would be like 150. I'd be sweating. And I thought, how do I deal with this? How do I get better at this? And I went and took improv classes in New York, and then took a storytelling class. And I'm like a big fan of exposure therapy. Anything you're afraid of, just go do more of it until you're desensitized. And the best way to get desensitized is to just make a fool of yourself every day doing improv.

• 3:52Amjad Masad?

  And I ended up doing shows and got pretty good at it. And then I think the benefit that I had is Replit didn't blow up right out of the gate. My personal profile had this very linear growth to it. And so I could make mistakes with very little attention on me. And I made a lot of PR mistakes. I think still, if you go to Hacker News, sort by the top 10, we had a PR crisis in Hacker News, where I had an issue with some ex-intern at Replit, where I just totally botched that communication on that. But still, that wasn't large enough. I was still within the Hacker News community, which they still hate me, which is fine. They'll hate you anyways.

• 4:31Amjad Masad?

  That's like the rite of passage. Hacker News loves you, then they hate you, then you become successful. And then, so you kind of make mistakes, and they're not at the public stage just yet. And so the stakes get higher as I'm able... It's sort of a progressive overload in powerlifting. You're sort of carrying more weight. It never gets easier, but you're able to do more and more over time. And so, you know, I feel for the founders that are just now kind of like, their company is blowing up, they're in the public eye. And you can see founders are big, now trillion-dollar companies. They're really fucking up on a massive stage. But getting the reps in has been super helpful.

• 5:11Erik Torenberg?

  And so is that your advice? People want to get you just exposure therapy, just one tweet a day? Or what's the best way to get started to get really good at this?

• 5:16Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, so I think a few things. One is the concept of build in public. It wasn't coined when I started doing it, but the idea is that, look, as a CEO, you're going to do a good amount of writing and communicating to your employees, your investors. You can just do it publicly, right? I mean, I've always been this believer that there aren't really a lot of secrets that you need to keep inside a company. And so a lot of your otherwise writing that would be in private, you can put it public. And that way, you carry people in the journey with you, and you're getting the reps in. So whenever there's a piece of communication or story I want to tell,

• 6:00Amjad Masad?

  and there's a choice between public and private, I might bias towards public. I often write something publicly and then paste it on Slack. I just say, this is what I wrote. And so that's been helpful. The other thing is authenticity. I think being yourself is kind of like a big radical thing that maybe started happening with Elon maybe 10 years ago. But CEOs were supposed to be this very polished thing. They had to kind of be filtered through this prism of PR. And journalists are kind of the way to get to the public. But you see kind of Elon being the first kind of building a public platform. And I think Zuck to some extent as well. Just seeing Zuck at some point, when journalists kind of turned on him,

• 6:45Amjad Masad?

  he started going direct. And you start following their stories, and it's like, Zuck changed the entire narrative around him by just being himself and actually talking directly to people. And I think the story of Trump is also very illustrative. I think Trump was successful despite the negative bias in the press. And it was mostly Twitter initially. People forget that, but Trump had amazing bangers. What was my favorite one? I've never seen a thin person drink Diet Coke. Which is true.

• 7:19Amjad Masad?

  Or Kanye. Kanye's banger is, I hate waking up in the plane and I see a bottle of water in front of me. No, I gotta take care of this shit.

• 7:28Erik Torenberg?

  I don't have a manager. I can't be managed.

• 7:30Amjad Masad?

  Right, can't be managed. You see these people come up and people start associating with them, and obviously, they're very authentic. And we're like, okay, there's this shift in people's minds where they crave authenticity.

• 7:42Erik Torenberg?

  Hunter Biden.

• 7:44Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 7:45Erik Torenberg?

  He's a fire now. But if you're a good poster, you can get away with it.

• 7:47Amjad Masad?

  He can post his way to presidency for sure.

• 7:50Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. Funny you mention the intern thing, because I remember that, but I also remember forgetting it too. And a lot of people say, oh, what if I say the wrong thing? What if I get my company into trouble in some sort of controversy or scandal? Is it just that attention spans are so short that it's just like the next situation? What do you say about that?

• 8:05Amjad Masad?

  Well, I think it's deadly. Like, PR crisis can be deadly if you retreat afterward. If you're not in the news, and I think the thing about, I think, Trump, Elon, et cetera, is that there is the next thing. And by the way, the next thing could be worse. But just the fact that you're still in there, you're still in the game, people will be like, oh, this guy's unkillable, uncancellable. Being canceled is a choice. So you can choose to get canceled and retreat from the public eye. But I think if you're still out there, at some point, honestly, the haters kind of give up. They're like, all right, I guess we can't do anything to this guy. Let's go to the next guy.

• 8:45Erik Torenberg?

  There's this great book, So You Think You've Been Shamed, and it chronicles the stories of a number of people who've gotten canceled over the past 15 years. And that's basically the takeaway is that the people who are truly canceled are just the ones who shut up, the ones who retreat. But the ones who just keep going and forgettable. I mean, there's so many people, Brian Johnson is an example, who just revived their image or just presented a whole new image. And people just forget the thing that they were almost canceled.

• 9:10Amjad Masad?

  I will say the mental aspect of it is pretty difficult.

• 9:13Erik Torenberg?

  I was gonna ask that next.

• 9:14Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, because I think that the story's been told a trillion times, but like in the Assessor Village, if you become an outcast, that's pretty deadly. Like, you can literally die. You can't find food. And so our limbic system, when you get this massive reaction online, you're kind of in this fight or flight, and it can really affect you, like you can't sleep. Some people can't eat, and it could be really damaging. But I think, again, exposure therapy helps a lot. Like, the first one's really hard. The second one is like, ah, it'll blow over. But also having good principles. Like, I think acting on principles is important. No matter what people think of what's happening on Anthropic, it's absolutely true, I think, in my mind,

• 9:57Amjad Masad?

  that they believe everything they're doing. They believe in safety. They believe in their mission. And I think that gives them incredible strength to keep going in... And obviously, oftentimes, principles and self-interest coincide, and that's a good thing. But you can ascribe what they're doing to some kind of cynical marketing ploy. But the strength that they have is based on their principles, and that really keeps them going.

• 10:27Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. I mean, earlier on, you were alluding to the stakes are really high with these... What advice might you have for Anthropic or OpenAI in terms of like some of the communication challenges or opportunities?

• 10:37Amjad Masad?

  It's obviously way above my grade. I've never, you know, battled with a United States government. Not yet. One day. Goals. But...

• 10:53Amjad Masad?

  Look, I honestly think it's a kind of a win-win for them. Like, it's really, if you game out what's gonna happen with Anthropic, Fable comes back, it's gonna be a huge flood towards Fable. It's kind of like, you know, this thing was banned by the government. Actually, Steve Jobs, um, once did this ad. They had a, they had a Mac, I don't know, the Big Towers of Mac Pro, I think it's called, where they had tremendous compute power that was subject to export control. So they had this, uh, this ad where it's like military tanks going and like surrounding the Mac and the Mac in the middle. And it's like showing that this thing is so powerful, the US government doesn't want, you know, doesn't, doesn't want you to have it, so you should go buy it.

• 11:38Amjad Masad?

  Uh, and so it's like a tremendous marketing opportunity for them. It's already kind of their, uh, their reputation is pretty big. Uh, but, but even if, but even if they can't get Fable back on the, on the market, you know, they still win the PR game of like, we're a company that's kind of principled and doing the right thing and all of that. So I, I think just, uh,

• 12:03Amjad Masad?

  my advice would be not to stress out too much and not to,

• 12:10Amjad Masad?

  honestly, just sit back and let it play out.

• 12:13Erik Torenberg?

  You, you were describing the, the mental game is a lot of things we'll hear from CEOs is, oh, I don't want to have to tweet and then I'm in meetings. Now I have to think about the responses and I have to respond back and now I'm then sort of constantly.

• 12:22Amjad Masad?

  You don't have to respond back, that's the thing.

• 12:23Erik Torenberg?

  Right.

• 12:24Amjad Masad?

  You don't have to respond back at all. I mean, that's, that's another thing you have to learn is to, is to like not feed the trolls. It's, you know, that, that reply is like, oh, I gotta get back. It's like, uh, what's that, I think, New Yorker comic who's like, babe, come to bed. It's like, no, someone's wrong on the internet. Uh, and it's like, it's very tempting, but actually it's kind of the baller thing to do is like, oh yeah, yeah, the plubs can fight on my comments. I don't need to worry about it. So, uh, so I think it's a trap to think that anything you put out, you need to immediately defend. Obviously, if something is getting, um, a lot of airplay and people are misunderstanding you, I think you should, you should correct it.

• 13:10Amjad Masad?

  Uh, and again, you should do it in the principled way. You should do it because, hey, this is what I actually believe. Uh, here's what you got wrong, but don't be overly defensive about it. Like, don't appear that, oh, this is, this is something that you're getting emotional about. Because again, anytime publicly, if you, anytime you show weakness publicly, it actually feeds the trolls and feeds the haters because they feel like they can get to you.

• 13:36Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. What advice would you give for when companies are being dragged by, by, by someone on Twitter or, or in the, in the press? Or when to respond versus when, when, when not to engage?

• 13:47Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, I, I think that's, that's like a art thing. And I think it comes down to, um, like business impact. Like, will it actually have business, uh, impact on my business? You know, for example, like, uh, last year in July, we had this story with, um, the, you know, founder of Saster, Jason Lemkin, where, uh, Jason had just started vibe coding, had never vibe coded or coded anything before. And, uh, as he's working with Replit Agent, Replit Agent sort of misunderstood him or something like that, and then deleted the database. And at the time, we didn't have production development separation.

• 14:30Amjad Masad?

  And so the production database, now like we actually separate them by default. Like, the, the Replit Agent can't even write to production database, it can only read. Um, and, uh, and we, we have backups. We have snapshots, you can go back, you know, to a certain day or time or whatever. So the, the mistake that the Replit Agent did was one click away from being fixed. But from his perspective, he didn't know that. And Replit Agent started freaking out. Models at the time, like, used to get, like, really anxious, especially Claude.

• 15:06Amjad Masad?

  And he, he tweeted the screenshot where Replit Agent was like going kind of nuts. Uh, and, you know, it started gaining traction, gaining traction, gaining traction. And I, in my mind, I knew, like, we already fixed this issue, but, but like the story has become so massive. And, you know, obviously it's gonna have business impact and it's gonna be in the press. And so I could, I could go out and fight and just say, you know, we did nothing wrong. We had backups, you know, could be, I could say it's a user error, whatever. But I think the right thing to do was to own, own up to it. The fact that we didn't have development, production separation is a bad thing. And two days later, we rolled out that fix.

• 15:48Amjad Masad?

  And so my, my response got a lot of positive interaction and, and got a lot of airplay because I started with, hey, we messed up and this is what, what we could have, uh, done better. But, uh, sometimes you can give attention to things that you don't want to give attention to, especially once your profile grows.

• 16:09Erik Torenberg?

  Especially if you apologize.

• 16:10Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, especially if you apologize. So I, I would say just kind of focus on the business impact.

• 16:15Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. The, and you mentioned earlier.

• 16:18Amjad Masad?

  By the way, Jason is a huge fan now. He runs his entire Saster business, multimillion dollar business. With him, another employee and like 10 agents based on, based on Replit Agent.

• 16:29Erik Torenberg?

  That's awesome.

• 16:29Amjad Masad?

  Yeah.

• 16:30Erik Torenberg?

  The, you, you mentioned earlier that you sort of developed a, a desire for this. For CEOs who are, you know, so locked in, they're just not that interested in, in doing this. Would you recommend that they cultivate the desire to do it? Or would you recommend that someone else on the team can do it? Or does it have to be the CEO? Or how would you think about this?

• 16:45Amjad Masad?

  Look, I think there's so many paths to, to success. I don't think there's one. Like, yeah, there are a lot of companies where this, it's not the CEO that's out there, like, um, Grok with a Q and, uh, like Sunny is the person on Twitter, but you know, the CEO is kind of not, not in there.

• 17:05Amjad Masad?

  And they, they've done a great job and obviously they kind of, uh, the company is great, IP is great. But they also, they memed it, they're kind of into success. Cause I think part of the story that's not being told there is that they actually had a lot of trouble fundraising in Silicon Valley. They had to kind of go to Saudi and, and all of that. And so that, that's an example, um, where the CEO is not out there. You, you look at Dario as an example where he's not playing the social media game. Kind of the product sort of speaks for itself and he's writing these big essays. So I think it comes down to the predisposition of the CEO. Like, do you actually enjoy it? Do you think you can be good at it?

• 17:44Amjad Masad?

  I think forcing people to do it where they, they can come out and be totally cringe and like be actually negative on the brand. Obviously, they can learn over time and do it, but, uh, but it really depends on the situation.

• 17:58Erik Torenberg?

  Have you gotten any leverage or way to lower the activation energy in terms of, or any help doing it? And is it possible for others too? Or is it just all you, just whenever you think of something?

• 18:07Amjad Masad?

  Well, I, I think I have the benefit of this long period of incubation. I think that if your company is already high profile, you don't want to kind of practice in public. And so maybe getting some, some coaching earlier on.

• 18:29Erik Torenberg?

  So some people ask, hey, how should I think about X versus other platforms? You know, maybe their customers aren't on X, et cetera. How do you think about that?

• 18:36Amjad Masad?

  Well, I, I think, uh, X is very good for the sort of Silicon Valley, for tech, for kind of the in-group messaging, for maybe one hop outside of Silicon Valley, which is kind of the early adopter, if you're targeting early adopters. And so I would also cluster hacker news within that as well.

• 18:59Amjad Masad?

  But it, it actually, once you want to go to late adopters or like early majority, if you think about this kind of bell curve of adoption, Twitter becomes actually not very impactful there. It can still be, be very important where, um, like, you know, just this morning, journalists reached out to me to, asked to talk to me about a tweet that I made about some of the stuff that's happening with Anthropic. Uh, and so like Twitter can still be a place where it is, it is the start of stories. And that's another thing, you know, back to the conversation of why this is important is the landscape shifted so much that journalists report on Twitter. So it's kind of starts on Twitter.

• 19:41Amjad Masad?

  So Twitter's influence is amazing, but it tends to be elite kind of inside group influence. I think Instagram, Facebook still, you know, YouTube is where you get to the early majority. And I think I was late to, to YouTube, uh, to sort of to Instagram. Like, um, you know, I just started focusing on it in like maybe, uh, February or something like that.

• 20:03Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 20:04Amjad Masad?

  And we're getting an insane amount of views and the followership kind of.

• 20:08Erik Torenberg?

  You started to build this clips machine of your, your interviews.

• 20:11Amjad Masad?

  Yeah.

• 20:11Erik Torenberg?

  The podcast's interesting because it's a medium that can be turned into every other format.

• 20:14Amjad Masad?

  Right, right. So I, I feel like I, I should have maybe done Instagram like a year or two ago.

• 20:21Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 20:21Amjad Masad?

  So I was like a little late on that. I, I thought it was gonna be harder, or it turns out.

• 20:26Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 20:26Amjad Masad?

  Could just like, you know, do these clipping and just grow, grow, not just your account. You can grow a lot of different accounts that way.

• 20:35Amjad Masad?

  And, but, but, but I would, I would start with Twitter because the, again, that's where the news starts to happen. This is where you can have outsized influence.

• 20:45Erik Torenberg?

  And are you, are you bullish on the platform? Do you, do you think that in the next, you know, three to five years, that that will stay the same?

• 20:50Amjad Masad?

  I, I think it is actually kind of risky, uh, because the algorithm changes so much. And, you know, you might do something that angers the power that, powers that be. And, you know, very, you know, without anyone knowing, things might change for you in terms of your reach on X. And so I think there's like less transparency than Twitter 1.0.

• 21:18Amjad Masad?

  So it is, it is a little, it is a little risky, but I think the platform has so much staying power.

• 21:24Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 21:24Amjad Masad?

  Like, it's really hard to replace. Like, you can, you can change the name, you can destroy the brand and you, and the platform will still be.

• 21:33Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 21:33Amjad Masad?

  Very valuable. Like, it is, it is, uh, it is, it is one of those things that I think there's no way you can avoid it.

• 21:44Erik Torenberg?

  Who, who are some CEOs or leaders, um, that inspire you in terms of how they go direct? Or that you've learned from looking at what would they do?

• 21:55Amjad Masad?

  Obviously, we were all in the school of Balaji. Balaji and Lulu, we had this group in a pandemic. What was it called?

• 22:03Erik Torenberg?

  Going Direct.

• 22:04Amjad Masad?

  Yeah, in going direct. Yeah, and so we kind of talked about strategies and and kind of critiqued some of our approaches or other people's approaches. So that was that was very, very useful. I think Balaji was kind of earlier this stuff. I think where I might disagree with Balaji is that I don't think you should be antagonistic to reporters. There's no reason to. Like, you can actually be friends with them and they can be positive towards you. You can you can help them out. They're just humans at the end of the day and they respond to incentives. And I think we've done pretty well in maintaining our relationships with. And obviously, Sharon has recently joined us and that upleveled our game

• 22:46Amjad Masad?

  with with reporters and more of that type of media. So so I think, but studying that is very important. I think there's enough content out there to get started with. But let's see who else.

• 23:08Erik Torenberg?

  Palmer, Alex Karp, Elon.

• 23:11Amjad Masad?

  Obviously, I mentioned Elon. You know, I think I think Satya is doing such a great job.

• 23:18Erik Torenberg?

  What about what he's doing? You?

• 23:19Amjad Masad?

  I think it is much less tweet length things, but he's able to put out very well reasoned arguments that playing to the zeitgeist in a very smart way and advance their point of view, like the essay he put out over the weekend. You've got 20, 30 million views, like very few essays kind of get that much attention. But it it comes at a time where everyone is thinking about token costs. Everyone is thinking about, and this is important thing about going direct. You can go direct and get zero views. Like, it's really easy, like, not not pay attention to you. You have to understand the meta.

• 24:01Amjad Masad?

  And I think that's the thing that's more time consuming than posting. Posting is not time consuming. The thing that's time consuming is understanding what is the larger debate? Because the way to go viral is to couch or dress up your argument, your worldview in the current conversation.

• 24:21Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah.

• 24:23Amjad Masad?

  And I thought that what Satya did with his essays is very much at the heart of like what the discussion is today. And then he advanced the point of view of of Microsoft.

• 24:34Erik Torenberg?

  Yeah. And it's a good place to to wrap. Please give it up, Ramjan.

• 24:38Amjad Masad?

  Thank you. Thanks, Sam. See you.

• 24:44Speaker 02

  Thanks for listening to this episode of the A16Z Podcast. If you like this episode, be sure to like, comment, subscribe, leave us a rating or review and share it with your friends and family. For more episodes, go to YouTube, Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Follow us on X at A16Z and subscribe to our Substack at A16Z.substack.com. Thanks again for listening and I'll see you in the next episode. As a reminder, the content here is for informational purposes only, should not be taken as legal, business, tax or investment advice, or be used to evaluate any investment or security, and is not directed at any investors or potential investors in any A16Z fund. Please note that A16Z and its affiliates may also maintain investments in the companies discussed in this podcast.

• 25:28Speaker 02

  For more details, including a link to our investments, please see A16Z.com/disclosures.