Marques Colston the Super Bowl Champion who played for respect over fame, reveals secret to playing with Drew Brees, Sean Payton's spot on vision, breaks down failure, gets real about loss, fatherhood and life after the NFL

“Drew is one of those people, he has such a mastery of the game, that you have to figure out how to see the game through his eyes to earn his trust.”Marques Colston On this episode of The Pivot Podcast, Marques Colston joins the conversation to reflect on a remarkable journey built on perseverance, discipline, brotherhood, and purpose. From being a seventh-round draft pick out of Hofstra to becoming a New Orleans Saints legend, Colston shares the story behind a career that earned the respect of teammates, coaches, and football fans everywhere. The conversation goes beyond the numbers, exploring the personal loss that helped shape the man behind the jersey. Losing his father at just 14 years old changed his life forever, and the lessons, memories, and influence he carried forward became part of his foundation as both a player and a man. Colston also reflects on playing alongside Drew Brees, whose vision, preparation, and leadership helped elevate the Saints' offense, and working under Sean Payton, whose offensive creativity and competitive mindset helped transform New Orleans into a championship team. Together, they built something special — culminating in a Super Bowl XLIV victory that forever changed the franchise's history. Despite never receiving the household recognition often associated with the NFL's biggest stars, Colston's production, consistency, and reliability established him as one of the defining receivers of his era. His story is a reminder that greatness isn't always about the spotlight — sometimes it's about showing up, doing the work, and earning the trust of everyone around you. But the conversation doesn't end with football. Colston opens up about fatherhood, the importance of being present for his family, and the challenges of transitioning into life after the NFL. After spending years competing at the highest level, he shares what it means to build a new identity, pursue opportunities beyond the game, and find purpose in the next chapter. From losing his father as a teenager to becoming a Super Bowl champion and building a life beyond the field, Marques Colston's story is about more than football. It's about resilience, legacy, and understanding that the greatest victories often happen away from the stadium. Truly a special conversation and full video episode is streaming on Netflix now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome, that's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up require compatibility and availability varies 18 plus.

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Marcus Coleston carries a quiet confidence you don't often see in an elite wide receiver. He isn't loud, boastful, or brash. There's a calmness about him that says, I know who I am, and I'll show you, I don't have to tell you. His play earned him a place in Saints history, but his character and demeanor made him a leader. Growing up in Pennsylvania, Marcus loved sports. He loved his family. Then during his freshman year of high school, his world was robbed by the loss of his father. Since then, he's carried the lessons of the man he idolized, using them as motivation to become the best player, but more importantly, the best man he could possibly be. We talked about that day that Marcus's life changed forever, the responsibility of becoming the man of the house,

• 1:07Speaker 01

  and how growing up alongside foster siblings shaped his perspective on family. We've had to get into football, obviously. The journey of a player who wasn't considered a great high schooler or college wide receiver. The uncertainty of draft and early struggles in New Orleans that shaped the rest of his career. We get into the arrival and the greatness of Drew Brees, the emotional significance of rebirth night and Steve Gleason, and ultimately bringing a Super Bowl to the Big Easy. Now he's an entrepreneur, an endeavor that started during his playing days. And the rest of his focus is on being a father and a husband. Marcus Colston could have easily been a star, but instead, he chose to be what his father was to him.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Present, steady, and reliable. So Pivot fam, please help me welcome Marcus Colston to the Pivot.

• 2:19Ryan Clark?

  Hey, man, this is a hometown legend, though. Right, as you say this name in the N.O., everybody know it. Marcus Colston, man, welcome to the Pivot. This is Fred Taylor, that's Channing Crowder, Ryan Clark. Pivot fam, thank y'all for pivoting with us. And now, man, like when we were texting about getting this together, like I was really serious. What you and your era of the New Orleans Saints means to my hometown, man. I can't thank you enough for what you guys gave the city, both on and off the field.

• 2:47Speaker 03

  Man, it's a two-way street, man. Like, especially for a guy like myself, having the opportunity to go down there and just feel like it's home, and just be embraced. And as you know, it's just a special time and place. So, you know, at 10 years of my life, I'm always gonna cherish, man. So, great to be with y'all, boys, and I appreciate y'all having me.

• 3:03Ryan Clark?

  You know, speaking of those 10 years, man, you got drafted, although very late, you got drafted, because some of us don't get drafted at all. You got drafted to New Orleans, man. It's such an interesting time. Team had played their games in San Antonio the year prior, but you got to be there the night the Superdome opened, see Steve Gleason block the punt. They called it the rebirth game. Just tell me what the energy was like that night in New Orleans.

• 3:32Speaker 03

  It's hard to explain. And you got to realize for me, this is literally my first home game. Because we played the preseason, all of our home games were like neutral site games, because the dome wasn't ready yet. So this is literally my first experience in the dome, period. So just to be able to feel that emotion, be able to feel how much bigger than football that night was, it's something that at 23, it probably should have overwhelmed you, but you had just been kind of embedded in the community enough that you really understood how important it was. So it was something that kind of fueled you. And then, you know, obviously, just to start the game with Gleason and the blocked punt, and it was a buzzsaw, man. It was nothing, it was nothing Atlanta could have done that night that was gonna work.

• 4:15Speaker 03

  It was nothing, it was no outcome outside of the one that we saw that was gonna happen that night. So, again, just to be a part of something like that and really kick off my Superdome experience that way, I don't think it'll ever be top NFC Championship game included. It was that special.

• 4:29Channing Crowder?

  And like you said, being a young dude and knowing the tragedy and all that stuff, but it's being more than football.

• 4:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 4:34Channing Crowder?

  Like, we go back now, and people still talk about like, that they had to attach themselves to something. And there's some mid-20-year-old dudes out there playing ball. Was that, I won't say intimidating, but you ain't just catching passes, you're representing a city in hope.

• 4:48Speaker 03

  It's crazy, because it never felt like pressure. It really and genuinely felt like a privilege to be in that position. And I think that's why it never felt like pressure. So just to be in that dome at that time and, like, I can feel it as I'm having a conversation. It was just, it was just one of them, one of those moments in time that you'll never replicate it. It was football, but it was, football almost took a backseat.

• 5:14Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 5:14Speaker 03

  Right, you just rode the wave of the energy, rode the wave of emotion. Yeah, man, it's, you just get chills thinking about it, man, 20 years later.

• 5:22Fred Taylor?

  2006 draft night, seventh round, 252nd pick, Horro. Channing talks about getting drunk while waiting to be drafted. I got a call pretty quick. So our experience was different. RC just mentioned that he wasn't called at all. But you, what do you remember most about that day?

• 5:45Speaker 03

  For me, it was, it was a combination of anticipation and embarrassment at the same time. Right, because like coming out of Hofstra, I had a couple of people that I knew that were kind of, they knew what was going on. So I'd heard anything from second round to free agent, which is a crazy range.

• 6:04Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 6:04Speaker 03

  So at that point, the draft was two days. You have one through three on day one, and then four through seven on day two. So day one, you know, I had people over at the house, wasn't really tripping about it. Knew it was a long shot I was gonna go on day one. So you're just kind of chilling, just kind of watching the draft, which is something I did anyways. But day one ends, and my guy calls me. I think he was at Yahoo Sports at the time. And he set the tone, he was like, you should be going pretty early tomorrow. So in my mind, now there's an expectation there.

• 6:32Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 6:33Speaker 03

  Right, so fourth round comes and goes, no phone call. Like, all right, whatever, cool. Fifth round comes and goes, starting to get a little antsy. People at the house, you didn't told people that, you know, I might be going early. So people just kind of, you could feel the eyes on you. So fifth round comes and goes, no problem. Sixth round comes and goes, like, all right, what's going on here? Starting to get a little antsy. Seventh round comes, now I'm in that place where I'm like, I gotta go to a spot in the house by myself for a minute. I just gotta regroup, recalibrate. Like, all these people here are supporting you. So you don't, you don't want them to feel like, you don't want them to feel pressure, you don't want them to feel like you're disappointed, but at the same time, you're disappointed as hell.

• 7:18Speaker 03

  So seventh round starts, we get about midway through the seventh round, still no call, like nothing, radio silence. We get to, I want to say right in the 230s, 240s, I get my first phone call, but it's from a team that has no picks left. And it's the free agent conversation. So in my mind, I'm like, all right, let me just get ready to be a free agent. Let me start kind of surveying the land and seeing where I might fit. You know, where's the opportunity I can go in and start picking my spot. So then finally, with one of them compensatory picks, you see that 504 number pop up and had the opportunity to talk to Mickey, had the opportunity to talk to Sean. And everyone's happy, everyone's excited, but at the same time, like you don't know what to do with this.

• 8:02Speaker 03

  It's like this duality of the moment of, like, damn, I just had, I'm 252 or 255, like, I know the odds that come with that. But then at the same time, it's like, damn, I'm one of 300 that gets this opportunity. Right, so this is duality that you're kind of balancing, you're trying to figure out what to do with those emotions. You know, you put it in the man's hands upstairs and tend to feel like it worked out.

• 8:25Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I mean, you go, you know, it's 10 years to become a Super Bowl champion, you're New Orleans Saints Hall of Famer. You leave as the all-time leader in touchdown receptions and receptions and yards. You and Drew are actually, well, when you retired, I'm sure it's changed now, but you guys were sixth amongst any duo that's ever played in this league in the history of football. So what you accomplished is far beyond how it started at 252, but I think that's part of the journey as well.

• 8:57Channing Crowder?

  Say, bro, do y'all remember when Klay Matthews got his looks maxed? I mean, talking about like ridiculous jawline, balloon biceps, them huge calf implants, which, by the way, I wouldn't be mad if I could get some of those.

• 9:13Fred Taylor?

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• 9:18Channing Crowder?

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• 9:27Ryan Clark?

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• 9:30Fred Taylor?

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• 9:37Channing Crowder?

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• 10:16Ryan Clark?

  You know, whenever we have these conversations about draft night, family always comes up.

• 10:21Speaker 03

  Hundred percent.

• 10:22Ryan Clark?

  Your father was your idol. He set the tone for you. You lost him at 14. How were you able to process that at such a young age? Losing somebody that was a large human, but also larger than life in the way he factored into who you were?

• 10:39Speaker 03

  I mean, the real answer is, I don't think you do ever fully process that. Right, there's a part of, it's 1997. There's a part of that that still lives in me that I'm still processing. But it's one of those things, man, the way that I thought about life changed in that moment. I'm gonna take you back to 1997. Like, at the time,

• 11:00Speaker 03

  The night before he passed, we had got into this little riff. And when I say riff, like, he was always on me about work. And I had this routine that I had to do before I went to school every day. It wasn't a lot, but it was just that discipline and letting it compound. The night before he passed, I hadn't done my work that day. So we got into it before I went to school. And a lot of times, I'd come home from school, you know, do my thing. But he would be out at organizational meetings for the football teams and a lot of the sports teams that he was a big part of. I go up to school one day. We're not in the best space. Come home from school, don't see him that night. Literally wake up the next morning,

• 11:43Speaker 03

  and something felt off. And the way the rooms are set up, my room is here, my brother's room is right here. So I wake up, and I'm walking past my brother's room to go to the kitchen to eat breakfast. And out of the corner of my eye, I see my entire family in his room just kind of huddled up. And at that moment, I didn't know exactly what it was, but I knew it wasn't good. So I go in there, they dropped the news on me. And it was one of those moments that you're just frozen in time. At 14, you can't really process that. All you know is that the people that you care the most about, they need you in this moment. You need them just as much. And I think a lot of that process for me was how getting through something like that

• 12:28Speaker 03

  is just that nucleus of people around you. We struggled through it together. We probably still struggle through it together. My mom at the time, I have no idea how she was able to gather the strength that she did in that moment, because this is her partner of 25 years at that point. So thinking back on it now, like I said, you don't really ever fully process that. I say it this way, and I say this all the time. To have what I had in 14 years and to be able to, me at 43 years old, still be able to pull some of those lessons that I learned in those 14 years. As more time passes on, I realize how special that man was and how much he's been able to still guide my life,

• 13:13Speaker 03

  even today. And it's weird, in a full-circle moment, my son is now 14, and is freshman year in high school. So there's some days I wake up just in this fucked-up headspace. Like, I don't know. It's some days, it kind of puts this urgency on you to really try to pour into him and pour into my family, my kids, my wife, in a different way. Because I know, when I was his age, exactly what he's going through right now, I knew the person that meant the most to me in my life was gone.

• 13:45Ryan Clark?

  Do you work through it or keep yourself focused on making sure you're present? Because you truly don't know what tomorrow is. I guess the question I'm asking is, how often do you think back to, man, my dad was gone right now. I gotta make sure that I make today the day I pour the most I can possibly pour into my family?

• 14:10Speaker 03

  I think it's embedded in how I live. All of these things show up in the decisions that you make, right? And for me, the work that I'm doing now, how I do that work, the work that I choose to not do so I can be present, so I'm not on the road all these times, I think that's where I see it the most. It's the opportunities that I choose to take on, the things that I choose to build, the things that I choose to embark on, I think are a direct reflection to that, especially in this moment in time.

• 14:36Channing Crowder?

  As a 43-year-old, is a different thought than that of 14-year-old. Was, like you say, your family is around you, but did you, like, how did you adjust to pops not being there? In that situation, because I lost my dad at 43. I'm 43, I got kids too, so it was way different than losing them at 14. How was that transition? Did you act out? Did anything happen? Or did you deal with it like, you know, you're a very intelligent dude, but you were different at 14?

• 15:03Speaker 03

  I think I went inward. So I think the version that's sitting in front of you probably started at that time. One, you just kind of stayed busy at that point, right? And sports became super important to me just because it was something that I could do that we shared. So it was always, sports was a huge part of my life because it was something that I kind of still had a piece of him as I was playing my sports. But I think that was really a pivotal moment in my life where I think I just started to go inward. Because you gotta grow up. You gotta grow up fast. I mean, this is the person that was literally spoon-feeding me lessons on a daily basis, just from personal experience. And when that disappears, you don't feel that void. You know, my mom did the best that she could, and she did a hell of a job.

• 15:48Speaker 03

  That's when her and our relationship became, it kind of, it changed, right? We leaned on each other in different ways because at that point, my sister, I have two older brothers, an older sister. My older sister was the only one at home at the time. Everyone else was away. When she had graduated that year after, it was me and my mom. Me and my mom, my younger brother. So for all intents and purposes, I was the man in the house at 15 in a role that I didn't want. But we trying to figure it out together.

• 16:19Fred Taylor?

  I always look at my boys and ask the question, how are they gonna be when I'm not here? And every time I ask myself that, I don't know, like, obviously I don't know, but I look for an answer in that moment. And I think life is weird in a way that I'm using this conversation to be the answer. You know what I'm saying? I think they're gonna be okay. Just looking at you, it's the weirdest thing that I felt, but that's what I feel in this moment. I just want to mention that. But I read somewhere that you grew up over the years with 20 to 30 foster kids in the home. A lot of background, a lot of different personalities.

• 17:03Fred Taylor?

  How did that experience in itself shape the person that you are? And how has that helped you along your journey in terms of being compassionate, giving back, et cetera, et cetera?

• 17:16Speaker 03

  Well, first and foremost, I really appreciate what you said before you asked your question, man. It means a lot. It really taught me gratitude at a whole different level. Because this was something that my parents did when they were together. And then when my father passed, my mom didn't stop. I think it gave me this sense of reality to where everybody talks about nature versus nurture, right? But when you see people come into your household that have a different background, that have a different lived experience, have different levels of resources and different levels of access, our house was, kind of became the control. But some of the people that came in and throughout of the house, like, the outcomes were vastly different in a lot of senses.

• 17:59Speaker 03

  What I learned through that period was, again, like, that sense of gratitude to understand how rooted I was and how rooted my family and my community was. But also, there are some things that are just, no matter how much you can try to control the environment, there's some things embedded in you, and there's some behaviors that are embedded in you that can take you either way. And, you know, having the ability to see that from, you know, children that would come into the house in what's called respite care for maybe a day or a weekend, all the way through, like, groups of siblings that would live with us for multiple years. It was an experience that I didn't know at the time would kind of mold just the way that I saw opportunity,

• 18:43Speaker 03

  the way that I saw what it meant to have that anchor at home. It molded me in ways. And again, it's one of those things that it kind of continues to show up even the way I raised my kids, right? Just trying to expose them to different things, getting around different, you know, people from different walks of life. Because I think that kind of becomes central to how you navigate life. You're never going to be in a situation where you're around people that you're always comfortable with, around people that you always have something in common with. But the ability to find that common ground is what I learned through that process and what I try to instill in my kids.

• 19:18Fred Taylor?

  Any of them hit you up for a Super Bowl ticket?

• 19:21Speaker 03

  So interestingly enough, the last two kids that came in as foster children, they were actually premature babies. And this was, I'm in my latter years of high school. So this is my junior, senior year. So it's my mom on her own. She took those kids in that was supposed to start as a weekend. Eventually, they just became a part of our family. She adopted them. My sister, Chanel, is, you know, just hanging with the rest of the crew back in Harrisburg. And my brother, Darnell, is in the army right now. So, you know, that last bunch,

• 19:59Ryan Clark?

  That is really dope, man. And too, you know, your father, sir. So like, it's just cool that all those things kind of come together and come full circle. He mentioned a Super Bowl ticket. Tracy Porter is my dog. That's like my little brother, right? When TP picks off that ball, bro, and he running down with the... What, in that moment, what's your initial thought as you see Tracy Porter cross the goal line?

• 20:28Speaker 03

  It's hard to explain because it's Peyton on the other side. And it's like, damn, it's over, but is it really over? But no, it was one of those things where it was almost kind of like this release, this relief. Because I think when you get to that moment, when you get to that pinnacle, and you put so much into it, and I'll be anxious to hear what your experience was like. When you, for me, get into that pinnacle, you had so much that you put into it, it was almost like, oh, shit, it's over.

• 20:58Ryan Clark?

  I'm just relieved that we didn't lose.

• 21:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, no, it's a crazy, it's a crazy, because you watch the games and when you finally get to that pinnacle, it's like, damn, it's finally over. I can take a deep breath. I can relax finally because you're just on edge.

• 21:12Ryan Clark?

  What's the conversation with Sean Payton at halftime? Let's all know you're finna do an onside kick to start the second half.

• 21:19Speaker 03

  He didn't bury the hook. Like, he led with it. Like, this is, we got into that halftime. You know, it's a longer halftime.

• 21:26Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 21:27Speaker 03

  He's just like, we're gonna ambush. And we had worked on it for the last two weeks. So I think, I think he has this really innate gift to, he's a really good communicator. And I think what he did in telling us, literally, one of the first things that he said when we got in the locker room at halftime, was like, you know what's coming. There's no more suspense. There's no more surprise. We done worked on this for two weeks. Go execute. And I think when you don't hold, when you don't hold that information to the last minute and you let grown men go out and do with that information what they need to do with it, prepare how they need to prepare. I think that's one of his, one of his superpowers, man. Just his ability to communicate the right thing at the right time.

• 22:11Channing Crowder?

  Did you know Sean Payton was, like, right now, I think as a coordinator, he's one of the top points per game callers in the history of football. Did you know that in the moment that you were, you were getting coached under a legend or he was, damn, shit, that was a good play? He know it was something. Like, did you know he was a historically good play caller?

• 22:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, you knew it was special at the time. And it was the way that he would always had this thing. He's like, he would always had this vision for a player. And nine times out of 10, that vision was spot on.

• 22:38Ryan Clark?

  Really?

• 22:39Speaker 03

  Like, to take somebody like me, and most people don't understand this, I played in an offense in college where we was a four-wide team. I played the left wideout for four years. I didn't take a snap in the slot. I didn't take a slot on the right side of the field. I played the left wideout for four years.

• 22:56Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 22:57Speaker 03

  Caught 200 balls as the left wideout. I get into the league and I'm playing in the slot for the first time. Because this dude had a vision to put me in these different positions and create these different mismatches. And basically, take some raw clay and put him in position that he'd never, he'd never seen me execute any of these routes before I got to New Orleans. So he was somebody that, that when he has a vision for you as a player and he tells you he has a vision for you as a player, you trust the hell out of it.

• 23:27Ryan Clark?

  So how did you get from that sorry mini camp you had when you first started to play in all these positions?

• 23:35Speaker 03

  A lot of highlighters, man.

• 23:38Ryan Clark?

  What was, what is that like, though? You go, you're talking about playing with a genius, but being a part of Sean Payton's offense that is holistically different from anything you've ever done. And you're also doing it with NFL players or NFL caliber players. What was sort of your process to get from, okay, I'm 250 second pick. I'm trying to learn all of these new things, plus playing at a totally different level than I ever have and not succeeding right away?

• 24:13Speaker 03

  I was scared to death after that first mini camp. Because, I mean, you know, coming in, and this, I wasn't the first receiver taken in that draft. Like, we took, we took Mike Hass, who just won the Balitnikoff out of Oregon State. So I get down there and that Louisiana Heat jumps on your back. It's different. So that first, that first rookie mini camp, my back had locked up and I really couldn't do a whole lot. So I left that weekend. You roll right into mini camp. I left there, like, for the summer, feeling like I'm just, I'm just happy as hell that I didn't get cut.

• 24:48Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 24:49Speaker 03

  So when I got back to the house, back to PA, and that break between mini camp and training camp, I just, I was like, all right, the number one thing I gotta do, I just gotta get in shape and show that I can run, show that I can do these things. Because I knew, I knew who I was, just as somebody who studied the game. I knew if you gave me enough opportunities and you gave me enough reps, I was gonna figure it out. So that, that five weeks before training camp was just like, let me get my body ready for this Louisiana Heat. And it was one of the special moments in time where Sean's first year, Mickey's just kind of brought Sean in. So this is kind of his first project. And obviously, we had Drew. You know, we all came in the same year together.

• 25:34Speaker 03

  And they would always have this saying, and it only works if you actually execute it. Sean would always say, it doesn't matter how you got here. All that matters is what you do when you get here. Right? So you knew as a, as a seventh round pick,

• 25:47Ryan Clark?

  You knew it.

• 25:47Speaker 03

  I'm gonna get opportunities.

• 25:48Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 25:49Speaker 03

  And what I do with these opportunities is gonna dictate what I, what I become in this league. So we get into that Millsaps training camp in July, and it's 120-some days on that turf. And I'm just like, I gotta survive. And there's guys that don't want to take reps. Cool, I'll take them. And that's how I ended up starting to play these different positions. I played the X. I learned the Z. I learned the F. I learned the Y. Had my little, you know, colored highlighters, a different color for every position I was learning. And I just had to learn the entire system so that I knew, so that they knew I could be trusted.

• 26:24Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 26:25Speaker 03

  And once, once you trust you, all bets off.

• 26:28Channing Crowder?

  You were worried about the Louisiana Heat. I trained in '05 with Tom Shaw in Kenner, Louisiana. You're a, you're a child of great people. You were raising foster kids. You went to Hofstra. You're from a little town in Pennsylvania. Then you get to New Orleans. You talking about the Heat. What about them streets? How did you, did you, how did you adjust to being in the city like that?

• 26:53Speaker 03

  I'm a homebody.

• 26:54Channing Crowder?

  You ain't, but you, you,

• 26:56Speaker 03

  I'm a homebody.

• 26:57Channing Crowder?

  I was about to say you had bread, but back then, we didn't really make no crazy money on salary and you was a seven-rounder. But you still playing for the Saints and you in New Orleans.

• 27:06Speaker 03

  I'm a homebody. And, and I, I think that's one of, that's one of the, the things that allowed me to play at that level. Because I just, I was laser focused on, on the job. I literally treated it like a job. To where people would laugh at me. I would call my teammates my coworkers. Like, I'm going to crunch the clock. I'm going to work. And I'm taking my ass home. And I'm gonna come back and get in and do it tomorrow. Like, I wasn't really in the streets. I've never really been like that. So that, that part of it was easy for me to navigate because I'm just not gonna be seen.

• 27:37Ryan Clark?

  You didn't go to Club 360?

• 27:40Speaker 03

  I went, I went to 360 once.

• 27:41Ryan Clark?

  Okay, at least you went to 360 one time.

• 27:43Speaker 03

  360 and what's the other one? Metro?

• 27:47Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 27:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:48Ryan Clark?

  Okay, at least you gotta know one time.

• 27:49Speaker 03

  I know what they are.

• 27:51Channing Crowder?

  I approach it like a job, but people leave CVS and they go to the club.

• 28:00Channing Crowder?

  I clock in and I work hard, but when I clock out,

• 28:02Ryan Clark?

  Y'all go straight back to CVS.

• 28:04Channing Crowder?

  I'm about to hit the club quick. But, but that, that was the thing. But that's kind of like you saying, your upbringing.

• 28:11Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 28:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah. I think a lot of, a lot of it was, and, and look, the success that I had early, there was, there was also a piece of that, like, I can't screw this up. Like, I know how I got in here. And I got this imposter syndrome that I'm kind of navigating as I'm doing it. I'm not gonna be the one to mess this up.

• 28:27Fred Taylor?

  Mark, you talk about the success. You and Drew were a cheat code on Madden. In the days when I used to play, I'd do everything that Sean Payton do. Rain down the seam and throw deep balls. But it, it was, in preparing for this, though, I'm approached a lot. And people are surprised about the number of Pro Bowls that I made with the numbers that I put up. You in doing this, I look at six 1,000-yard seasons, almost 10,000 yards receiving, 72 touchdowns, but no Pro Bowls. Did that ever sort of motivate you in a certain way or sit with you in a certain way? Or are you good knowing that as long as I got the respect of the guys that I, that I faced?

• 29:08Fred Taylor?

  As well as now, I want to add, you're a New Orleans Saints Hall of Famer. Like, kind of, what's your mind or your thoughts on, on that piece of it?

• 29:18Speaker 03

  To sit here and tell you that I'm cool with the fact that I got no Pro Bowls, that would be crazy. Like, I know what I did. Like, I knew, and being somebody that studied the game, I knew what the numbers that I was putting up looked like versus the numbers that other people were, were putting up. And I knew I was in that conversation. For me, after like the second year, after year two, I just kind of checked out of doing the things that I thought people wanted me to do. And I knew that, look, the guys that, that make the Pro Bowl, they're, they're more visible people. And I didn't want to be that. And I'm not going to become that just so I can make a Pro Bowl. So I think after year two, I really started to understand how like those, how the recognition worked.

• 30:04Speaker 03

  And from that point on, I was just kind of checked out from it. Because for me, I, I never, being famous or being known was never, it was never important to me. It was that respect piece that you mentioned. It was always important enough for me. Like, the dudes that I'm playing against, the dudes that I'm playing with, is, if there's a level of respect there, that's enough for me. Because I, you, you start to understand. I think it really hit me after my rookie year, started to hit me. Because I knew the numbers that I was putting up and I knew where our team was at. So there is no, there is no logical explanation that you can, that you can,

• 30:41Speaker 03

  Have a conversation with me and I'm gonna walk away feeling convinced that I shouldn't have won Rookie of the Year. Right? I got hurt. I had a high ankle sprain. I think I was leading the league in receiving yards at the point when I went down. So, there's no logical explanation that you can tell me why I didn't win Rookie of the Year. So, when I started to understand how recognition worked, I was like, I don't know. I'm just gonna do my job. If my guys respect me, if the people I'm playing against respect me, that's all I really care about. Everybody else, y'all's opinions don't really matter to me.

• 31:10Ryan Clark?

  I remember it got later in my career when I finally made one, but I remember the first year, it really felt like I could make the Pro Bowl and I was an alternate. And I remember Coach Tomlin, maybe I don't know if it was on my face or if he felt that he walks up to me and he puts his arm around me. We were walking and he was like, he's like, "We can't put you in the Pro Bowl." He said, "But everybody in this building knows we get Pro Bowl caliber work every single day." He's like, "And I want you to know that." And I don't know why he said it, but it put me at ease because much like you, when you're undrafted and you feel like you've had to prove all of these things and you think you have, and then it's like another thing

• 31:52Ryan Clark?

  that they're withholding from you. You do have a little bit of that. Why, why is this happening? And I think that was the time where I was like, you know what? Whether it ever happens or not, I'm comfortable knowing that the people in this building respect what I do. But you did play with one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time. You know, you can't say the breeze is bad in New Orleans around people. And I didn't even be talking about Drew Brees with what he was able to do for that city, not only his play on the field, but who he was to that community. How did your relationship with him develop to the point where you guys both had that level of synergy and trust on the field?

• 32:33Speaker 03

  I always call it a thought partnership because Drew was one of those people that he has such a mastery of the game that you had to figure out how to see the game through his eyes to gain his trust. And if you look at all of the guys that had, that put up numbers consistently with him, it was that same kind of thing. It was ball placement. It was understanding where the, the small soft spot might be in the defense and getting yourself to that spot. And we had this, we had this saying down in New Orleans, like there's rules guys and there's guidelines guys, right? When you first come in and you're learning the offense, whatever it says in that playbook, that's what you're doing. Those are the rules. If it's a three steps, 45 degree angle, you're in the slant just like that.

• 33:18Speaker 03

  But once you kind of get to this place where you got enough reps, you got enough time on task, you start to read each other's body language. He knew where I was, he knew where I was going before I was going there. I knew where he was throwing the ball, whether he was throwing a corner route and it was gonna flatten me out. Or he knew the corner was undercutting. It was a high angle. Like you start figuring out those things and then, then you can kind of graduate to a guidelines guy to where it looks like that in the playbook, but if you're kind of out there freestyling and you make it work, then it might be in the playbook next week.

• 33:51Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, no doubt. And that's the, and that's the thing. You can tell though, the, the work he put in. And I would laugh about it as, as, as opposition, right? As the opposing team, when he throw the ball, it'd be like, ah, ah, ah, ah. But I knew in his mind, there was a progression that he was going through. And if he knew it like that, you had to know it like that because he wasn't gonna wait to throw it because he was gonna expect you to be open, expect you to be there. And I always said, that was the difficult part about playing you guys was you had to disguise, you had to move late, you had to move with urgency or he was gonna find that spot. And there were, there were always players that seemed to understand that with.

• 34:33Fred Taylor?

  Yeah. The first go ball you ever caught from Drew, you saw the ball first of Drew because he, the big lineman blocking him. I just want to know from your perspective, like, what'd you see first?

• 34:44Channing Crowder?

  It's just a ball flying.

• 34:47Fred Taylor?

  Cause you're looking back, right? You see the quarterback, you're like, hold on a second.

• 34:51Speaker 03

  It's, it's funny though, because it's real. It's real. Like you had to look up. Like when you're tracking the ball, like you have to look up and find the ball in the lights. It's like where it really got dicey was I, I spent so much of my career in the middle of the field. Like you running the in route and you can't see the quarterback and you just see a ball. Just, and you just gotta go get it and you've got to trust that he's throwing it to a spot. I can't see him. All I can do is, is trust the spot and trust that he gonna protect me. Right? So there was a lot, especially across the middle, like those crossers, those shallows, the, the basic crosses we used to run. There was a lot of times, man, you, you couldn't see him. You just saw the ball just emerge.

• 35:35Fred Taylor?

  That is super funny.

• 35:37Channing Crowder?

  I was watching the game this weekend and I think Brady was talking about JSN, we call it mail, mail boxing. Where he just put his hand up and Darnold would just throw it to him where, okay, we were running that play. Now they playing this. Hey, I'm out of here.

• 35:52Ryan Clark?

  You'd be depressed quick.

• 35:53Channing Crowder?

  Yeah. You read depressed, whatever. Did you and Drew have that? Is that, is that something for real where you could just, man, I'm out of here. Let's get it.

• 35:58Speaker 03

  That's a 4-3 guy thing.

• 36:02Channing Crowder?

  Okay. You, you a possession dude. You gonna be around with that.

• 36:06Speaker 03

  I'm a chain mover. Hey, we don't, we don't do that in the middle.

• 36:08Ryan Clark?

  You know, but you talked about the ball over the middle. You played this game when it was played differently in between the numbers. Right? It wasn't every time you get touched above your number, we throwing the flag or it's unnecessary roughness.

• 36:24Speaker 03

  You can say it. I played with dudes like you.

• 36:26Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 36:28Ryan Clark?

  Yeah. My, my thought process was I can't wait for him to throw this one. You know, how did you, with having a quarterback who was shorter, with having to track the ball, but also understanding, like you said, I hope he protects me or I have to expect him to protect me or believe and trust he can protect me. How did you handle the physicality of the game? Because even at your size, at that time, that didn't matter.

• 36:51Speaker 03

  No. For better or worse, I always knew who I was. And to your point, I ain't the 4-3 guy put my hand up running go routes. I put them city miles in.

• 37:02Speaker 03

  So, I knew I was gonna get hit. I knew guys like he was running downhill, trying to run through my face. And that was my role. That was my role in the offense. I'm gonna make the tough catches. I'm gonna make the contested catches. I'm gonna get blasted and I'm gonna put Humpty Dumpty together back again next week. And I'm gonna do it again next week. That, that's like, when you're a bigger body, most people think you can just absorb those hits. Like those are many car accidents, man. And when you're a bigger body, you've got more surface area to hit. So, I just, I knew who I was, man. I knew that, that I was gonna get blasted probably once or twice a game. I knew I had to hold on to it and come down with it because I gotta move the chains. That's, that's, that was my role in the offense.

• 37:45Channing Crowder?

  I want to ask him, let's be the old guys, the, uh, back in my day dude, you watch the game now and be like, I'd hit him for 20 racks if I was playing in this game.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  No, it's, it's definitely, it's different, man. But, but I do, I do feel for these guys getting their legs taken out because now that's the alternative. And if you ask me, do you want me, do I want to get a sternum shot or do I want to get hit in the knees? Hit me in the sternum twice. Like that's just what it is.

• 38:12Ryan Clark?

  Larry Fitzgerald would come up to you before the game and, and have that conversation when the rules started to change and catch started. Because it was the same exact velocity, the same exact angles, except for in places you truly couldn't protect yourself. And places that ended careers. And speaking of that, man, like we all got a time. Right? It's an expiration date on what we had a passion to do. And for you, man, you immediately switched in to being an entrepreneur. You immediately were able to start to grasp and learn business. When did you start to take those things seriously as part of what your second act would be?

• 38:54Speaker 03

  Believe it or not, I was, I had started laying the groundwork when I was still playing. And I'm not a dip your toe in the water kind of guy. If I'm gonna do something, I'm gonna do it. So, my first real entrepreneurial venture was, was probably, this is 2012. So, this would have been my.

• 39:13Ryan Clark?

  Your seven?

• 39:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, somewhere in there. I'd actually bought into an indoor football team in my hometown, back in Pennsylvania. The first year, I did it just kind of as like a passive investment. In my mind, I'm like, alright, I have this team. This can be a really interesting community outreach vehicle in my hometown, right? Create some jobs, create some, you know, camps, clinics around the team. So for me, it was community outreach. But then I watched that first year and I started to kind of fall in love with what was happening behind the scenes of the game that I was still playing. So after that first year, I bought my partner out and I took over the operations to where I was literally running the organization in the springtime.

• 39:58Speaker 03

  I go play my season in New Orleans in the fall, fly back to Harrisburg and like literally run the organization from top to bottom. From selling sponsorships to ticket sales to, we, it's a, we clearly don't own our venue, so we rent the venue. I'm in there helping the people, you know, put down, roll out the turf field. So that's when I really got started on the entrepreneur side and I did that for three years while I was still playing and then parlayed that into the Arena Football League. And that's when I really started to understand the connection between what you build, the career that you build as an athlete is literally the flip, is a flip side of a coin to an entrepreneur.

• 40:42Speaker 03

  When I think about the years that it took to get to that position, to get to the highest level, that's no different than an entrepreneur that has a vision for a company that now goes out and builds into that vision before anybody else believes in it, right? So I think having that experience of building that team falling on my face, because, look, I mean, I'm selling sponsorships and it's cool, they're gonna pick, they're gonna open the door because it's me and my hometown, but if the ROI is not there, I'm not getting a yes, right? So it was one of those times where even at the height of my career, I'm getting humbled in the business world because like, it's great that you're doing this, but if there's

• 41:25Speaker 03

  no, if there's no return for us, if the game is not engaging, it's not, I'm not buying a ticket. So you start to figure out, there's layers and there's levels to this, to where visibility is an entry point, but it's not it. Visibility gets you there, but what can you bring behind the visibility that can actually move the needle for other people? And once I started connecting those dots, then it became...

• 41:49Ryan Clark?

  You get competitive in that too?

• 41:50Speaker 03

  A hundred percent. Because like, most people look at us and they want to talk the football side of it, as if football is not competition at the highest level with the best people in the world. And once you understand that, like I've gone and I've mastered this place where I'm dealing with the 1,800, 1,800 of the best people in the world at what they do. There's not many people you can walk outside and have that conversation with that's on that same level, apples to apples. Once you figure that piece of it out, it's like, alright, this is, this is not a, I'm equipped to do this, I just have to learn the skills to be able to do it at a high level. Once you make those connections, now you can act, now you can kind of reactivate everything that got you to the league in the first place, just with the skills behind it.

• 42:34Channing Crowder?

  Yeah. When anybody just transitions, easy? And you just said you ain't worried about the fame and all that stuff. The retirement was just cake? You just moved forward, it was, it was no missing, nothing with, with retiring football? It just going into business, you had no, no problem with transitioning?

• 42:51Speaker 03

  I knew I was done. Kind of going back to knowing who I was. Part of being that physical presence in the middle of the field meant like I had a bunch of surgeries. Like I'm 16 surgeries in.

• 43:03Ryan Clark?

  Seventeen.

• 43:04Speaker 03

  Eight knees, collarbone, wrists, hands. So I kind of knew at the end of year nine, they gave me a game ball, I think the last game of the season in Tampa. And I'm not an emotional dude, but in my mind, I was, that was it. Like, so I get that game ball, I'm kind of emotional, you know, we all like to make the people that don't like to talk, give a speech. So I kind of knew I was done after nine and I came back for year 10 and when I realized that I couldn't play at my standard, that's when it was easy for me to go walk away. Because it was, it was never, like just the way that I came into it, I'm playing against me the whole time. It's never about anybody else's standard. Y'all told me I couldn't play just based on where I got drafted, right?

• 43:49Speaker 03

  The Saints passed me seven different times, right? So y'all's perception of who I was never mattered to me because I'm going to exceed it and I'm going to play to my standard. And when I couldn't play to that standard anymore, then it became easier to walk away.

• 44:03Ryan Clark?

  You know, we all have kids that play sports. What type of sports dad are you? Right? Cause you, cause you already quiet and so I would expect that you do the same at sports games for your kids, but sometimes parents flip, man. They be like, yeah, like you could talk to me that way, but you ain't finna play with my children. You know, what kind of sports dad are you though?

• 44:24Speaker 03

  If they have coaches that know what they're doing and they truly care about the kids, then I'm cool. Then I can play the background and I can just be dad and my son might have a different, a different, he might have a different take on it. But, but I really, I really try to focus on the process with them because y'all know this, like there's already an expectation from other people about who you want your kid to become. And I just want my kids to be great at whatever it is they choose to do. And if it's sports, great, but I use sports as a way to teach process and teach the habits that you form compound into greatness, right?

• 45:06Speaker 03

  And sports is no, there's no better example than that, than sports, because it's visible right now. I hold them to the goals that they want, that they set. That's what I try to do, at least. If they tell me that they want to do something, I'm gonna hold you to that, but it's gonna be your idea, it's not gonna be my idea. Like my son, he's playing football at Saint Joe's Prep right now in his freshman year, so that's, that's a whole adjustment. My daughter, she plays lacrosse, flag football, basketball, field hockey, all of them. My older daughter, and then my younger daughter, she's three, she gonna play something. Just because she's just active and she's physical and so for me, it's just, it's a great teaching, it's a great place to just teach them, because they get the lessons right

• 45:48Speaker 03

  now, but the lessons are about life, they're not necessarily about...

• 45:52Ryan Clark?

  Who genetics they got? We talk about, we talk about this all the time. We had John Brown on the show, Amon Ra, Saint Brown's father. He's like, hey man, gotta watch who you breed with. Marcus, he wasn't even talking about marriage. He was like, man, y'all here, you breeding with a sharp woman, you gonna have...

• 46:12Speaker 03

  He's trying to tell you with it.

• 46:14Channing Crowder?

  Can't cut, can't cut the athleticism too much.

• 46:18Speaker 03

  Oh, that's funny. I think they have a lot of me, my older two have a lot of me, their body type is, I think, similar to mine and their demeanor is kind of similar to mine. The younger one, she takes, she takes after my wife a little bit more, she a little bit more, little bit more...

• 46:36Ryan Clark?

  Fired up?

• 46:37Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:37Ryan Clark?

  I see you trying to pick the right word.

• 46:39Speaker 03

  She the yin to my yang.

• 46:40Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I'm about to say, cause you know, whatever you say about the little one, your wife gonna be like, oh, so that's, that's the characteristic you gonna put to me?

• 46:48Channing Crowder?

  I gotta ask you, pops had the before school workouts, the protocol, do your kids have a protocol?

• 46:55Speaker 03

  It's an idea right now. We're not executing it well, but it's an idea.

• 47:00Ryan Clark?

  Man, that's so, it's so crazy, and we gotta ask our favorite question, you know, always have the conversation about my son. He's with the Jets now and in eighth grade, told a story tons of times on the show, but in eighth grade, he came to me and said, hey, look, pop, I want a college scholarship. And the greatest thing was about that was I could always use it to hold him accountable. And I never made him say he still wanted it, I just always asked him. And I told him, I was like, I mean, I love you so much that if you told me, pop, you know, at that, that day I wanted this and I no longer want it, I was like, I would never hold it against you. But every day when we'd get to the hard parts of the workout, like you said, the regimen

• 47:43Ryan Clark?

  that you and your father had the conversations about, every time that became a topic of discussion for us, I'd say, hey, do you still want the same thing? Well, this is the way to get it. And so I think it's cool, like you said, it gotta be their decision, not yours.

• 47:56Fred Taylor?

  You said, coaches gotta make good decisions. You talked about how great of a communicator Coach Sean Payton is. Is taking over the play calling a good decision? Or resuming the play calling?

• 48:09Speaker 03

  For him?

• 48:10Fred Taylor?

  Yeah.

• 48:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:12Speaker 03

  And I'm not talking about the Broncos. I'm not talking about the team. For Sean, yes, because Sean got to be involved. I don't see a world where he is going to be that CEO, head coach that delegates everything. He's just, he's not wired that way, I don't think, man.

• 48:28Fred Taylor?

  So you was right.

• 48:30Channing Crowder?

  He can't say you, you can't be that good and sit back.

• 48:32Speaker 03

  You can't.

• 48:33Ryan Clark?

  Not, not, not when it's going wrong.

• 48:35Channing Crowder?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 48:36Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? Like, if, if, if it's going the right way, I think you could say to yourself, okay, I've done everything I was supposed to do to put my team in the best position to succeed. But when it's not, and you know you accomplished what that dude accomplished, hell, yeah, I'm finna call the plays again.

• 48:51Fred Taylor?

  It's on me. It's still on me, right?

• 48:53Speaker 03

  And he got, we got four or five weeks of self-scouting in, in two, yeah. He gonna take that over.

• 48:57Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, he know what's going on, for sure.

• 48:59Fred Taylor?

  We always ask our guests, what's their biggest pivot in life? That's a moment or moments you can go back and look at and say, because of this, I am who I am today.

• 49:08Speaker 03

  Man, I knew this question was coming and it's still hard because there's so many. And I'm gonna get to the answer, I'm sorry. But I think one of the things that, that the outside world puts on us as athletes in that transition is that it's one transition. I think that is, that is how it's sold to us. That's how the programming tells us to think about it. That's how the people that don't know about the transition come in and talk to us as if it's like we just leaving a job. It's a little bit more involved than that. So for me, it's always been about this iterative process. Because look, I mean, you look around, most people, people are not keeping jobs, people are not walking in the career paths anymore.

• 49:52Speaker 03

  It's, people are cycling in and out of jobs every three, four years, right? So the expectation for us to pour our entire lives, our heart, soul, effort, energy, and everyone around us pouring into this thing for 20-plus years that it takes for us to get to that level, to just stop on a dime and go do something else, like, that's just crazy when you think about it from that perspective. So for me, I think that first move that I told you guys about with, with that indoor football team, I think was the most pivotal moment for me because it's easy to, it's easier to have imposter syndrome in a locker room because you have an opportunity to go out and put reps against it and gain confidence that way. That was, for me, the first time that I really stepped out into a new space

• 50:37Speaker 03

  that was super uncomfortable, that I wasn't sure that I had this tool set. I knew, actually, I was, I was sure that I didn't have the tool set and I didn't know what the outcome was gonna be, right? So, so for me to put myself in that level of discomfort that kind of matched what I was used to in football, but knowing that I would be evaluated in a totally different way, I think getting that first win under my belt, even though it wasn't, it might not have looked like a win on the surface to other people. Financially, probably it wasn't a win. I ended up having to shut it down after three years. So perception-wise, it probably still wasn't a win. But for me, it was putting myself out there in a way that was not anything that I would ever see myself doing,

• 51:22Speaker 03

  being able to pull the lessons from it, pull, pull the lessons forward, pull the experiences forward. That was pivotal in believing that I could do, I could bring that same passion, that same set of skills into something else that wasn't football and be successful on my terms. I think that, that set the stage for me to do everything else that I've done ever since.

• 51:43Ryan Clark?

  What was the most important thing you learned through failure? No, was it, was it that you could pour yourself into other things? Or what did those failures, whether it be through sport or in business, what did that teach you that you think to this day continues to help you?

• 52:03Speaker 03

  That's not final. For people like us that, that have ascended to the heights that we ascended to in our athletic careers, we don't do that absent a failure, right? Failure's a part of that journey. But I think when you fail outside of the confines of that, it just feels much more fatal. And I think learning that you can fail as an entrepreneur and that's part of the journey, that's still part of the journey. Learning that this business might not fail, but that doesn't mean that I'm a failure because of it. I think when I learned to apply the same mindset around, like, think about the weight room. You, you get stronger by pushing yourself to a point where you can't do anymore.

• 52:42Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 52:43Speaker 03

  Right, it's embedded in us. It's just embedded so deep that you don't, you don't unearth it like when you go do other things. So I think when I was able to kind of dig beneath the surface in some of these opportunities and find that that still existed in the entrepreneurial world, it's like, shit, all, everybody gonna fail. You get in the startup investing, 90% of the company that you invest in gonna fail. It doesn't make them founders failures. They gonna, they gonna pivot and do the next thing. So the rules around failure that applied to us and built us into the athletes and the men that we became, they still apply in entrepreneurship and people just don't talk about it that way.

• 53:19Ryan Clark?

  Now, that, that's a word, man. I don't, I don't know if you talk more now. You sure seem good at it, though. That wasn't one of those, we've had some, some interviews, some sit downs where you like, damn, I'm at the ask 17 million questions for us to get to 30 minutes. Nah, man, that was, that was thoughtful. It was, it was insightful and also inspiring. I think what we try to do is, is tell as much of a full story as you can in about an hour. It's hard to truly say you can encompass everything that somebody is in that time. But more importantly, what were you without a helmet? And who are you that the helmet is no longer the way that other people identify you, man?

• 54:04Ryan Clark?

  So thank you so much for, for sharing with us, for sitting down with us. This really, really was, man, a great conversation. I appreciate you.

• 54:11Speaker 03

  I appreciate y'all. And I'd be remiss if I didn't tell y'all congratulations, man.

• 54:14Ryan Clark?

  Man, thank you.

• 54:16Speaker 03

  That, that last question, that, that word pivot, man, y'all, y'all represented to the fullest. And just to see three, three people that I have a ton of respect for as peers, as colleagues, build a platform that I think is, is going to continue to help and inspire so many, just truly blessed and honored to be a part of it, man. And, and you guys are gonna keep crushing it, man.

• 54:36Fred Taylor?

  Appreciate it, brother.

• 54:37Ryan Clark?

  You'd have been a cool coworker.

• 54:42Ryan Clark?

  My dog said he called them coworkers. And the people were like.

• 54:47Fred Taylor?

  I appreciate that.

• 54:49Channing Crowder?

  We had to have a Christmas party at some of that job. He can't go home every night.

• 54:54Ryan Clark?

  Hey, honestly, though.