Red Flags That Scream, “I’m Bad With Money”

💰 Which side hustle is right for you? Get personalized recommendations from our Side Hustle Quiz. https://ter.li/8u8nzi 📈 Are you on track with the Baby Steps? Get a free personalized plan. You can’t judge a book by its cover, but can you judge someone’s ability to build wealth by their financial habits? In today’s episode, Rachel Cruze and George Kamel are waving their red flags at things that scream, “I’m bad with money.” Next Steps: 🎥 Watch our video How to Spot “Beige Flags” in Money and Relationships. 🍸 Follow Smart Money Happy Hour on TikTok: @smartmoneyhappyhour 📱 Submit a Guilty As Charged question for Rachel and George! Send a DM to @rachelcruze or @georgekamel on Instagram! Be sure to type “GUILTY?” at the top of your message so we don’t miss it. 💵 The simplest way to budget. Download the EveryDollar app for free! Connect With Our Sponsors: Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. Get up to 40% off with code SMARTMONEY at Cozy Earth. Today’s Happy Hour Special:🍹Easy Watermelon Margarita • 4 cups frozen watermelon • 1/2 cup tequila • 1/4 cup triple sec• 1/3 cup fresh lime juice • 2 tablespoons honey • 1 cup ice Instructions: Cut up your watermelon and freeze it on a baking sheet for at least six hours. Add watermelon, tequila, triple sec, lime juice, honey and ice to a blender. Blend until completely smooth. Pour into salted rim glass and serve with lime. Enjoy! Explore More From Ramsey Network: 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🧠 The Dr. John Delony Show 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05George Kamel?

  Start stretching those wrists, people, because today, we're waving our financial red flags.

• 0:10Rachel Cruze?

  This may be more common than I think it is.

• 0:13George Kamel?

  It doesn't shock me. I'd honestly rather that than you holding a fish. That's a red flag. Especially if you're dating. So, homeboys, the girl is running.

• 0:26Rachel Cruze?

  Hey, guys, I'm Rachel Cruz.

• 0:28George Kamel?

  I'm George Kamel.

• 0:30Rachel Cruze?

  And this is Smart Money Happy Hour.

• 0:39Rachel Cruze?

  This is the show where two friends who have new money experts talk about what you're talking about. Everything from pop culture, current events, and money.

• 0:47George Kamel?

  Before we get to the red flags, let's talk about this red drink we are imbibing this hour. This is a watermelon margarita, frozen, I'll have you know.

• 0:55Rachel Cruze?

  It's just so impressive.

• 0:56George Kamel?

  Very impressive.

• 0:57Rachel Cruze?

  That we can make these cocktails. Isn't that so nice?

• 0:59George Kamel?

  I know, like, I don't have the energy to even think about making this.

• 1:02Rachel Cruze?

  Genuinely, is it a Vitamix that does this? Like, where, how do you?

• 1:05George Kamel?

  It's definitely a blender situation.

• 1:06Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, it's gotta be.

• 1:07George Kamel?

  Maybe a Ninja, a Bullet? I don't know what they call them these days.

• 1:10Rachel Cruze?

  I like them.

• 1:11George Kamel?

  Stick around till the end. We're gonna give you our rating on this drink and reveal the cost per glass. You don't wanna miss it. Okay, Rachel, we've raised a flag or two on the show before. We're no stranger to raising a glass or raising a flag.

• 1:22Rachel Cruze?

  Ah, there you go.

• 1:23George Kamel?

  Back when the internet was obsessing over beige flags, we did that one. We talked about good, bad, and neutral habits to look out for in money and dating.

• 1:30Rachel Cruze?

  That's right. But today, we're gonna talk specifically about the red flag. When you see it, your red flags should go up, which means...

• 1:38George Kamel?

  Stranger danger.

• 1:39Rachel Cruze?

  Caution, caution, caution. Don't get in the ocean yet. Right, ocean flag, red flag?

• 1:44George Kamel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:44Rachel Cruze?

  And they raise the different flags?

• 1:45George Kamel?

  Double red is extra scary.

• 1:47Rachel Cruze?

  Holy, and we got two flags here. So, we're gonna talk about it because there are a lot of things out there that you need to watch out for. And not just, you know, there's the dating relationships, which we're gonna talk about.

• 1:56George Kamel?

  That's one category we'll cover.

• 1:57Rachel Cruze?

  There's also, like, the workplace. There's also family. There's also friends, like, some, there's some...

• 2:02George Kamel?

  Financial industry.

• 2:03Rachel Cruze?

  The industry has some red flags you wanna watch out for, so...

• 2:06George Kamel?

  We're gonna react and share our honest thoughts as we go. And we want you guys to be a part of the conversation. So, join us in the comments. Let us know your thoughts if you think these are red flags. Or maybe you love them. I don't know. Maybe you're a weirdo like that.

• 2:17Rachel Cruze?

  Maybe you're a green flagger. And you're like, listen, that's like, that's not bad.

• 2:21George Kamel?

  Yeah, some people see the green in every red.

• 2:25George Kamel?

  Tweet that. Put that on a high school poster.

• 2:29Rachel Cruze?

  Are you more likely to talk yourself out of a red flag? Or are you more likely to see more red flags than exist?

• 2:33George Kamel?

  I think as a recovering pessimist cynic, I tend to only see red flags. I must be convinced that anything is green.

• 2:42Rachel Cruze?

  Okay, yeah.

• 2:43George Kamel?

  Head on a swivel. Everything is risk.

• 2:45Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, and I'm the opposite.

• 2:46George Kamel?

  Yeah, you're like, everyone's so nice.

• 2:48Rachel Cruze?

  I am to the point that like, I'm gonna get screwed one day. To be like, they were just so kind. Like, I just thought that everything was fun, you know? And then it's like, no, that was not good.

• 2:56George Kamel?

  I think we both could do better in leaning each other's way.

• 3:00Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 3:00George Kamel?

  You go a little my way, a little more, you know, on edge?

• 3:04Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 3:04George Kamel?

  And me a little less on edge.

• 3:06Rachel Cruze?

  I think that's good. I think I need a, yeah, I need a little more street smarts.

• 3:09George Kamel?

  And I need a little more Rachel smart, whatever that is.

• 3:12Rachel Cruze?

  I'm not gonna say that. I'm gonna say my-

• 3:13George Kamel?

  You're very street smart.

• 3:13Rachel Cruze?

  My street smart's pretty good.

• 3:14George Kamel?

  You're actually book smart, too.

• 3:15Rachel Cruze?

  I just see the good in people a lot. Not book smart.

• 3:19George Kamel?

  Wow, but you read a lot of books, I guess is my point.

• 3:21Rachel Cruze?

  I do, I do read a lot of books.

• 3:22George Kamel?

  Not smart books, but like, fun books.

• 3:25Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, right. Books about red flags, actually.

• 3:28George Kamel?

  If it's a part of a book club, you're here for it.

• 3:30Rachel Cruze?

  Hundred percent. Love it all. Um, okay, well, let's start off with the red flags that I feel like most people think of, dating.

• 3:37George Kamel?

  So, dating red flags. The first one on the list.

• 3:41Rachel Cruze?

  This is a good one. A toxic tipper.

• 3:46Rachel Cruze?

  Ooh, you get the bill at a restaurant, and you lean over and you realize, they didn't, they didn't really tip.

• 3:52George Kamel?

  They didn't leave a tip.

• 3:53Rachel Cruze?

  Or a good tip, like, they're kinda cheap.

• 3:55George Kamel?

  Yeah. Or they say things like, "They were awful. I'm not tipping. It took forever for them to come back and get our check." You know, I get it. We've all had bad service at restaurants, and it's okay if you don't wanna tip 25% because there was bad service, but not leaving a tip at all or being spiteful when you don't know the full story, that's, that's a red flag. Especially if you're dating. So homeboys, the girl is running if you're a bad tipper.

• 4:19Rachel Cruze?

  Yep.

• 4:19George Kamel?

  Girls like a generous man.

• 4:20Rachel Cruze?

  Did you see the Friends episode where Rachel Green and her dad and Ross went out to dinner?

• 4:25George Kamel?

  No, I don't recall.

• 4:26Rachel Cruze?

  And the dad didn't like, he left like a really stingy tip and Ross went back and left some money. And then gets caught. It was like this whole thing. I was like, oh my gosh.

• 4:33George Kamel?

  That is something that I would do.

• 4:35Rachel Cruze?

  Be Ross, you know, in a situation. Be Ross.

• 4:37George Kamel?

  Cause what does it point to? Let's go deeper one layer.

• 4:39Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, yeah, because I think it's a, uh...

• 4:42George Kamel?

  If you're stingy when it comes to tipping someone who has served you, you're probably gonna be stingy in a lot of other areas of your life.

• 4:48Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah. And I'm gonna say a probably pretty critical person too.

• 4:51George Kamel?

  Very tit for tat.

• 4:53Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 4:53George Kamel?

  Keeping score.

• 4:55Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, probably a lot of that, right? And if you just, I don't know. In my head, if someone serves you, and I get it, it may not be the best service and maybe you go down to 18% or whatever, but like, I don't know, I just feel like you have an obligation to tip. And so it'd be really hard for me if they're like, ah, I can't believe this, we're not tipping. I'd be like, oh man. I mean, unless you got like cussed out or something, right? Like...

• 5:14George Kamel?

  Does that happen?

• 5:15Rachel Cruze?

  I don't think so.

• 5:16George Kamel?

  I mean, I've had people be rude to me, but not cussed at.

• 5:19Rachel Cruze?

  No.

• 5:20George Kamel?

  Yet.

• 5:21Rachel Cruze?

  No, but what if? Would you tip if someone cussed you?

• 5:23George Kamel?

  Depends if I deserved it, honestly.

• 5:25Rachel Cruze?

  Okay, that's fair.

• 5:26George Kamel?

  I would check with my wife. Like, was that warranted? She'd be like, yeah, you deserved that.

• 5:29Rachel Cruze?

  Oh my gosh.

• 5:30George Kamel?

  I don't know what I would do. I'm very nice.

• 5:32Rachel Cruze?

  I know, yeah.

• 5:33George Kamel?

  You know, especially when I have my baby there. If they're nice to my baby, extra tip.

• 5:37Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, okay. Good to know.

• 5:39George Kamel?

  You know, if they like try to interact in a nice way. Not too overbearing.

• 5:42Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 5:42George Kamel?

  Don't get my baby crying, but...

• 5:44Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, yeah. Don't behold my baby.

• 5:45George Kamel?

  We went out this weekend to brunch and they were super sweet to her.

• 5:48Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, talking to her and...

• 5:49George Kamel?

  Like getting her little, her water, plastic water cup and all that stuff. Getting her crayons.

• 5:54Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 5:55George Kamel?

  She throws them all on the ground.

• 5:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, I hear it.

• 5:57George Kamel?

  That's a win.

• 5:57Rachel Cruze?

  Okay. Uh, next. Never wants to talk about money.

• 6:02George Kamel?

  Ooh, that's a big red flag.

• 6:04Rachel Cruze?

  I know, I think so too.

• 6:05George Kamel?

  We get that a lot on The Ramsey Show.

• 6:06Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 6:07George Kamel?

  Where someone calls in and says they just won't talk about money, especially like dating is one thing. It's way worse when it comes to marriage.

• 6:13Rachel Cruze?

  Right, yeah. You're married and your spouse won't talk about like what they make or like, they don't want to talk about money at all. Big red flag, for sure. But especially, yeah, dating. And I get if it's not like the first date. Like, we always joke and it's true, like, don't ask for someone's like...

• 6:26George Kamel?

  You don't need to show them your budget.

• 6:27Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, 401K balance and like tax returns. Like, no, we're not going crazy here. But as the relationship moves along, naturally... I feel like it's a topic of life that's gonna be brought up, should be brought up, I should say. Just like other important topics, talking about like in-laws and work and I mean like life, right? And money is a part of life. So if they don't, if they want to avoid that subject, and I would say any hard subject, they just want to avoid talking about.

• 6:52George Kamel?

  Yeah, that's a good point.

• 6:53Rachel Cruze?

  I wanna go red flag. Red flag.

• 6:55George Kamel?

  Cause that tells me, number one, they could be hiding something that they don't want you to know, which not a great sign because relationships are built on trust and communication.

• 7:04Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 7:05George Kamel?

  But then the other piece is if there's maybe some trauma or baggage there, or shame or guilt, again, if they're unwilling to deal with that, or at least be open to talking about it with someone they might be in a long-term relationship with, that also scares me. That's not gonna bode well for the relationship.

• 7:19Rachel Cruze?

  That's right.

• 7:20George Kamel?

  Long-term.

• 7:21Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, for the subject of money itself in the relationship, but then also other subjects that they probably wanna avoid too, right? So I'm like, no, no, we gotta, we gotta talk about this. So if they avoid you, I'm gonna say red flag with the money conversations.

• 7:35George Kamel?

  And I always tell people as they get, as they start heading toward marriage, it's a wise idea to go through something like Financial Peace University, our flagship money course, because it sort of forces you to have these conversations, forces you to have common language, which I think is much more helpful than just a cold, let's talk about money.

• 7:51Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, for sure.

• 7:52George Kamel?

  What are your thoughts on debt?

• 7:53Rachel Cruze?

  Totally.

• 7:53George Kamel?

  Versus going through a course that you go, hey, what'd you think about that lesson?

• 7:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, yep. Especially if it's earlier.

• 7:58George Kamel?

  Don't you find that people who don't deal with this when they're dating, it just gets so much worse? It gets amplified.

• 8:03Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, man.

• 8:04George Kamel?

  When you're married, and you think, well, maybe when we're married, things will change because we'll combine our lives, and then they stay the same. Separate bank accounts, and they won't let you have access or transparency into what's going on. Those are the real-life calls we get on The Ramsey Show where we go, this is

• 8:18Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 8:19George Kamel?

  Late in the game. Like you need some emergency counseling to try to resolve this.

• 8:22Rachel Cruze?

  That's right, that's right. So yeah, do it early, folks, if you can. All right, next red flag. You ready? Not generous.

• 8:30George Kamel?

  Oh, that ties in with that tipping one.

• 8:32Rachel Cruze?

  It does.

• 8:33George Kamel?

  Generous in spirit, generous in money.

• 8:35Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I think in all of it, just in conversation and time. Like someone that's just like a selfless person is usually gonna be a great companion, a great spouse later in life.

• 8:44George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 8:45Rachel Cruze?

  But the generosity, the money piece, I think would be hard if they just like wanna just hoard and keep, keep, keep. You know, I think more and more like financial influencers keep coming up on my feed, maybe because I just keep clicking on them, but I keep seeing. And there's a good bit of them, George.

• 8:58George Kamel?

  What are they doing?

• 8:59Rachel Cruze?

  At least from the videos that I keep showing, that I keep being brought to me. It can feel like, and I think it is more common that I realize, again, I see the green flags in everyone, more common of like, oh yeah, I'm gonna win with money, I'm gonna get rich and it's gonna be awesome, I'm gonna have all this stuff. And it's like me, me, me, me, me, me. A lot, there's not a lot of people that talk about giving.

• 9:20George Kamel?

  That is true. And when you do talk about it, people like shut down.

• 9:24Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 9:24George Kamel?

  Like when I make videos about giving on my channel, nobody cares.

• 9:27Rachel Cruze?

  They don't do well, they're gone.

• 9:29George Kamel?

  You need to care.

• 9:29Rachel Cruze?

  I know, I know.

• 9:30George Kamel?

  They don't see the value in it.

• 9:32Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I guess. So I would say like, I would not want, I would not wanna be in a long-term relationship with someone where their money goals are all about them.

• 9:40George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 9:40Rachel Cruze?

  So the generosity piece, I really think is huge. But what I'm saying is, this may not be, this may be more common than I think it is. Like I always feel like everyone gives.

• 9:49George Kamel?

  Oh, yeah.

• 9:50Rachel Cruze?

  Does it make sense? Like I'm like, oh yeah.

• 9:51George Kamel?

  Well, you're the exception.

• 9:52Rachel Cruze?

  I'm in a, I'm in a world where we, we love to give. Like giving is like one of the goals of all of this. Like, yes, give. And then the fact that people don't, again, I think it's more common that people don't than they do.

• 10:03George Kamel?

  And maybe they just, that they didn't grow up in an environment where that was the norm and so it's not normal for them growing up. But I think it's really important to make that a habit and include it in your Every Dollar budget. Have the giving line items of, maybe it's to your local church, maybe it's to a nonprofit that you're passionate about, maybe it's to the person on the side of the road. But it just, it changes you more than it does anything else. And I've just found the most healthy people are the ones that have made it a habit to give.

• 10:28Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, I think so too.

• 10:29George Kamel?

  So I wanna, you'd wanna date those people, find them.

• 10:31Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah. And then I've even changed my tune about this, can I tell you?

• 10:34George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 10:34Rachel Cruze?

  Why do I feel like I'm like attacking you on this episode, George?

• 10:36George Kamel?

  No, it's fine.

• 10:37Rachel Cruze?

  You said it makes you feel good. All this, I've now changed my tune and like, I used to be like, yeah, and the benefit is you feel good about it. But I'm kind of to the point in my life, George, I'm like, I don't care what I get out of it. Like, you should just do the right thing.

• 10:48George Kamel?

  Yes. You don't do it for some sort of feeling.

• 10:51Rachel Cruze?

  Feeling, that's right.

• 10:51George Kamel?

  But it's a natural byproduct.

• 10:52Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, you will. I think you will. I think there's a beautiful thing. When you help people, you will feel joy. But I used to even frame it in that way of like, oh, yeah, you know.

• 11:01George Kamel?

  Like, if I leave a big tip, I'll feel good about myself.

• 11:03Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, but that part of me is like, I've changed my tune about it. I'm like, I don't even want to say that. You should just give because like, there's people that need help. So be a giver.

• 11:11George Kamel?

  That's it.

• 11:12Rachel Cruze?

  Be a giver.

• 11:12George Kamel?

  That's it.

• 11:13Rachel Cruze?

  Because it's the opposite.

• 11:14George Kamel?

  You are able to help, so help.

• 11:16Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, I know.

• 11:17George Kamel?

  So help me, God.

• 11:18Rachel Cruze?

  So help me, God.

• 11:19George Kamel?

  That's a good one.

• 11:20Rachel Cruze?

  All right, there's where it's like.

• 11:21George Kamel?

  Next and last on our dating list of financial red flags, credit score obsessed.

• 11:26Rachel Cruze?

  George, are you so excited about this one?

• 11:28George Kamel?

  So excited.

• 11:29Rachel Cruze?

  You love bashing the credit score.

• 11:32George Kamel?

  Well, I found out that guys.

• 11:33Rachel Cruze?

  And you have a chapter of it in your book.

• 11:34George Kamel?

  I do have a whole chapter on credit score. So I guess, am I credit score obsessed?

• 11:38Rachel Cruze?

  You love anti-credit scores. I mean, talk about passion.

• 11:41George Kamel?

  Just such a weird flex. Like, the fact that a bank is willing to loan you $60,000 on a line of credit. That's a flex today?

• 11:48Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 11:49George Kamel?

  Like, that's what you're bragging about?

• 11:50Rachel Cruze?

  I heard on dating apps, do people put their credit scores? Is this a thing?

• 11:53George Kamel?

  I've heard this. The ladies can vouch, but.

• 11:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, and I heard, yeah, we're getting some nods. Can you believe that?

• 12:00George Kamel?

  It doesn't shock me. I'd honestly rather that than you holding a fish. I'm gonna be honest. That's actually better.

• 12:07Rachel Cruze?

  Okay, I'm opposite. Really?

• 12:09George Kamel?

  You'd rather see the fish?

• 12:10Rachel Cruze?

  I'm like, look at Harrison fishing with his like, you know, this is great.

• 12:14George Kamel?

  I wish it was a Harrison.

• 12:15Rachel Cruze?

  Harrison's outdoors. Good for him, you know? Out on the land.

• 12:19George Kamel?

  Well, here's what I found. So Professor Scott Galloway has a whole bit where he talks about what women look for in a man. He talks about kindness, intelligence.

• 12:25Rachel Cruze?

  I love him, by the way.

• 12:26George Kamel?

  He's great. And the last one, outside of kindness and intelligence, was a man's ability to signal future provision for the woman.

• 12:34Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 12:34George Kamel?

  So then I go, oh, the fish makes sense. The woman's going, I'll never go hungry. The man knows how to fish. And so my thing is, the credit score is him trying to signal in a very toxic, unhealthy way that he is able to provide. Because he is financially stable.

• 12:49Rachel Cruze?

  Look at you looking for the green flag.

• 12:51George Kamel?

  That's my, my heart is out there for Harrison.

• 12:54Rachel Cruze?

  Wow, yeah, I would want to fish, you know?

• 12:58George Kamel?

  I just, I can smell it through the app.

• 13:00Rachel Cruze?

  My gosh.

• 13:01George Kamel?

  I go, this guy's taking a stinky fish home. And we don't know, does he even know how to like, skin it, debone it?

• 13:06Rachel Cruze?

  Did you?

• 13:06George Kamel?

  Clean it, cook it, I don't know. He knows how to catch them.

• 13:09Rachel Cruze?

  Knows how to catch it, he may throw it back in, it's for the sport.

• 13:11George Kamel?

  So the credit score doesn't actually signal how well you're doing financially. All it does is signal how good you are at playing the debt game, paying your debts back. Which sure, is better than not being able to pay your debts back and having a low credit score. Sure, that's better. But to me, the ultimate sign is, do you have money in the bank? Are you investing for the future? Do you have a fully funded emergency fund? Are you out of debt? Those are much better signals of future provision.

• 13:36Rachel Cruze?

  That's right.

• 13:37George Kamel?

  If you're on a dating app, so.

• 13:38Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, for sure.

• 13:38George Kamel?

  Choose wisely, ladies.

• 13:39Rachel Cruze?

  I love it. Um, all right, let's go into the financial industry, shall we?

• 13:43George Kamel?

  It's time, we just almost got there.

• 13:45Rachel Cruze?

  Red flag number one for the financial industry, store credit cards. So listen.

• 13:51George Kamel?

  I could not wave harder.

• 13:52Rachel Cruze?

  The whole.

• 13:53George Kamel?

  I could be in color guard with how hard I'm waving.

• 13:55Rachel Cruze?

  Can you like, yeah. It, and to save like, 10%, 20%, right?

• 14:01George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 14:01Rachel Cruze?

  On a pair of jeans that are $60.

• 14:05George Kamel?

  I'm shocked they still do it.

• 14:06Rachel Cruze?

  I don't, um, shop in stores anymore. I'm online.

• 14:10George Kamel?

  Well, you can't be seen in a store. You'd never make it out, there'd be a signing line before you left.

• 14:15Rachel Cruze?

  No, George, that is not true. No, I, but I do, I shop all online right now, in life. So, I've not been, I mean, the pop-up ad, you know, to save 10% or whatever. But that's more like the mailing list.

• 14:27George Kamel?

  It's easier to fall for at checkout, because you go, I could save 15% right now, the person in front of me just asked.

• 14:32Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 14:32George Kamel?

  This happened to me recently at a J.Crew factory.

• 14:34Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, yeah.

• 14:36George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 14:36Rachel Cruze?

  And they wanted the store credit card?

• 14:37George Kamel?

  I politely declined.

• 14:38Rachel Cruze?

  Okay, for the J.Crew factory, is it the factory credit card or just J.Crew?

• 14:42George Kamel?

  I assume it's just the J.Crew card.

• 14:44Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 14:44George Kamel?

  I don't know. But I'm not, I'm not intrigued.

• 14:47Rachel Cruze?

  You can only use that credit card at those places.

• 14:49George Kamel?

  No, you can use it anywhere.

• 14:50Rachel Cruze?

  You can use it anywhere.

• 14:51George Kamel?

  But you get benefits if you use it at that store.

• 14:53Rachel Cruze?

  At the store, that's the big benefit of it, yeah, yeah.

• 14:56George Kamel?

  That's a tough one.

• 14:57Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, man.

• 14:57George Kamel?

  And it's always some like well-meaning 18-year-old.

• 15:00Rachel Cruze?

  I know. I wonder if the interest rate is higher on store credit cards?

• 15:03George Kamel?

  I believe it is, because whenever I've looked, it's like 29% or APR or something crazy. There's always a range, but generally the higher end of the range is higher than a normal credit card.

• 15:12Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, yep.

• 15:13George Kamel?

  So don't fall for this, and don't think, "Well, I'll get the 15%, then I'll cancel it." Most people don't, and they lure you back in with another offer, another promise. So just politely decline, and if they start, you know, really drilling down, of like, "Why won't you open it? Why would you not want to save?" Then just name-drop Dave Ramsey, that'll shut them up real quick.

• 15:30Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, they don't like that.

• 15:31George Kamel?

  They don't like that.

• 15:32Rachel Cruze?

  That'll help you. Okay, next is 0% interest loans.

• 15:37George Kamel?

  Oof.

• 15:37Rachel Cruze?

  So, red flag here. So they will try to get you on that of like, "It's 0% interest. You're not paying any extra, you're just paying the payment."

• 15:43George Kamel?

  This happens with cars, with furniture, with appliances, even buy-now-pay-later products now.

• 15:49Rachel Cruze?

  Totally, yep. So for some of these loans, not all of them, but some of them, usually a lot of them, in the fine print, when you sign the contract, it's basically if you miss one payment, they backlog all this interest and all, like it puts you in a horrible spot if you have like a hard month. Like if you lose your job and you can't pay that one month, they will like backtrack everything. So like, it's a horrible setup. And then there's always something, George, I still, I live by this. I think it is so true. There is something about paying for things that are already done. Versus if you just pay in the present, you are like literally living in the present or looking at the future. I mean, there's constant living behind you.

• 16:26George Kamel?

  Put it on a tab.

• 16:27Rachel Cruze?

  With all these payments, you know, the student loan that I already went to college for, and yeah, the credit card, all of this stuff, you're paying for things. You're using your present money, not for your future self, but for your past self. It's already lived that life. So just stay in the present, look forward. Like, let's live in those categories, you know, with our money, not the past.

• 16:44George Kamel?

  Beautifully said. And with cars, this is especially bad, because they'll lure you in with, "Hey, we have a 0% offer," and you get in and you don't qualify, of course. But then you're already there, they've already lured you in.

• 16:54Rachel Cruze?

  That hurts. Ow, yeah.

• 16:55George Kamel?

  Yeah. And you get no deals. And so if you're trying to negotiate, not happening. You're gonna pay full MSRP on that car and get screwed on the deal, and you really shouldn't be buying a brand-new car anyways. Most people taking advantage of this are broke or have good credit, and so they go, "Well, I'm gonna do great." Another payment, who cares?

• 17:12Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, yep.

• 17:13George Kamel?

  Don't fall for it.

• 17:14Rachel Cruze?

  Don't fall for it. Um, all right, another major red flag.

• 17:20Rachel Cruze?

  Is when data brokers take your information, sell your information to other companies, and then you are exposed to phishing and scams and all this stuff. But Delete Me comes in and saves the day.

• 17:32George Kamel?

  That's what they do. They scour the internet for your personal info, and they wipe it, and they send you a report showing you what they've done and how much time they've saved you. And I sleep better at night for having it, so.

• 17:42Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah. It just like really grinds my gears, George, to think that my information, my email address, my phone number, all of it, like they're making money off of my information. I'm like, stop that. Don't make money off me. No, I don't want my stuff out there. And that, and they're getting more sophisticated.

• 17:56George Kamel?

  Oh, yeah. And there's more and more breaches.

• 17:57Rachel Cruze?

  The tech sense, yes, yep. So as much as your information can be removed, as much as possible, and having services like Delete Me that help you and do that, it is, oh, the better off you're gonna be. So really focusing on that these days, George, because in our, in the world we live in now.

• 18:13George Kamel?

  You can't be too safe.

• 18:14Rachel Cruze?

  You can't be too safe. They're everywhere.

• 18:15George Kamel?

  And they're giving our Smart Money Happy Hour fans 20% off any of their annual plans if you go to joindelete.me/smartmoney or click the link in the description below, and we'll take you there.

• 18:27Rachel Cruze?

  All right, next red flag. Debt settlement or relief companies.

• 18:31George Kamel?

  Aye, aye, aye.

• 18:32Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 18:32George Kamel?

  These people.

• 18:34Rachel Cruze?

  It, uh.

• 18:35George Kamel?

  Their marketing schemes are so aggressive. We get tons of calls on The Ramsey Show where someone says, "I signed up for this debt settlement company because they promised they'll get rid of my debt and make my life better."

• 18:44Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 18:44George Kamel?

  "And I'm trying to get out now because I realize it's kind of a scam."

• 18:47Rachel Cruze?

  Yes. So what I want to say to you, Sarah, out there, you can do it yourself.

• 18:51George Kamel?

  Yeah, Sarah.

• 18:52Rachel Cruze?

  Come on, Sarah. You got this. So that's the thing. They're doing something that you can do yourself. So do not pay them extra. Don't get stuck in a payment plan with these companies. Drags you along. Not worth it.

• 19:02George Kamel?

  Yeah, let's talk about how it actually works. So what they do is they say, "Hey, stop making payments on your debt. Let it go to collections. Instead, give us that payment, and then eventually we'll try to settle the debts and negotiate on your behalf, therefore lowering the amount you owe."

• 19:17Rachel Cruze?

  That's right.

• 19:17George Kamel?

  Here's the problem. That tanks your financial world, and the creditors can still come after you and sue you in the meantime. And the debt relief companies have no promise that they can actually get you out.

• 19:27Rachel Cruze?

  No, and a lot of them, like, like from a legal standpoint, are in the process. So you can't get them out. And that's terrible.

• 19:32George Kamel?

  Aren't they incentivized to just keep collecting your payment and just kick the can down the road for years?

• 19:37Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, because if you really can't pay it, and we get people that call The Ramsey Show a lot. And their debt is in collections. Well, you actually can negotiate that at that point. Like, you really can. But also, if you have the money to be paying it, you need to be paying it too. Like, the moral obligation of like, we signed up for this debt. And if you have the money to, you know, be paying it and to get out of debt, then we want you to do that. But for some people where it's gone to collections, or they're not, they literally don't have the money to pay, it probably will go into collections, but then you can settle it. You don't need a company to do that for you.

• 20:05George Kamel?

  So if you're in one of these, just cancel it and do the debt snowball method and call it a stupid tax and move on with your life. But the key is, you can do this yourself. You can negotiate bad debts that are in collections. You can do the debt snowball method and knock out the debt on your own.

• 20:18Rachel Cruze?

  All right, last red flag, George, of the financial industry: HELOCs.

• 20:23George Kamel?

  The old home equity line of credit.

• 20:25Rachel Cruze?

  Do you feel like they, like, just skyrocketed over COVID, or was that just me?

• 20:28George Kamel?

  Yeah, because everyone got so much equity in their homes.

• 20:31Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 20:31George Kamel?

  And they were still broke, so they went, well, just tap into our home like a piggy bank.

• 20:34Rachel Cruze?

  We're here, let's put in the pool, let's redo the renovation.

• 20:37George Kamel?

  And the marketing has been so aggressive. I mean, they'll send you, because they know exactly how much equity you now have. So they'll send homeowners, a bunch of mailers, saying, hey.

• 20:44Rachel Cruze?

  It is so tempting.

• 20:45George Kamel?

  Access 250 grand.

• 20:47Rachel Cruze?

  Right.

• 20:47George Kamel?

  Build that pool. You do you. Life is short.

• 20:50Rachel Cruze?

  Life is short.

• 20:51George Kamel?

  Oh, the marketing's gross on these.

• 20:52Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 20:53George Kamel?

  And this really puts you at risk, because the second mortgage on your home, so it's another lien against your house, they could take your home if you can't pay that HELOC. And the interest rates are terrible. They're usually variable on HELOCs, which makes them even worse. So stay away, don't fall for the trap. If you can't afford the renovation, or college, or you're gonna use it to pay off debt, unwise. Stay away from these and just save up and pay cash.

• 21:15Rachel Cruze?

  And it has you going backwards in your equity.

• 21:17George Kamel?

  Exactly.

• 21:18Rachel Cruze?

  And we don't want that. We want to be present or future oriented.

• 21:20George Kamel?

  You're robbing yourself.

• 21:21Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, don't go backwards. All right, let's get into parenting and family.

• 21:25George Kamel?

  Ooh, this one's dicey.

• 21:26Rachel Cruze?

  Oh my gosh, are you ready?

• 21:28George Kamel?

  Okay, give us the first red flag.

• 21:30Rachel Cruze?

  Fix-it parenting, meaning you'll automatically, immediately, fix something by just throwing money at the situation. I'll get this in.

• 21:41Rachel Cruze?

  For me, you know, I'm, yes, I was in a habit. This was, I don't know. Gosh, I probably could be more self-aware. It probably has been recent, too. But I was in a habit with my girls, like, something would break, and I'd be like, "That's fine, we'll just get," you know, a necklace breaks or whatever, and I'm like, "It's fine, girls, we'll just get another one." Because on Amazon, it's like $5.99 for 20 of them.

• 22:01George Kamel?

  They're not buying super-nice things.

• 22:02Rachel Cruze?

  No, but I, but I was a fix, I'm like, "Oh, yeah, we'll just fix the situation." And now, I've been so aware that I did that. And now, I'm like, "No, I don't care." It's not about the money, it's about the principle. But I always looked at it from a money standpoint. Like, "Oh, it's not, oh, we could, it's fine, it's not that expensive."

• 22:15George Kamel?

  The principle is you should take care of your stuff no matter what.

• 22:17Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, and if it breaks, you're still alive, like, we're okay. Like, you just keep on living.

• 22:23George Kamel?

  And adult life says, "I gotta save up and buy another one."

• 22:25Rachel Cruze?

  That's right, that's right. So, um, that, so hopefully, that was harmless, and hopefully, I didn't scar my children for life, I probably did. But also, a- as kids get older, this is where it can get even more toxic, because they're not learning resilience at all, at any level.

• 22:39George Kamel?

  Well, then, you become a snowplow parent, right? That's the term now?

• 22:42Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 22:42George Kamel?

  Where you clear the path to make it nice and smooth for little Johnny?

• 22:45Rachel Cruze?

  Smooth, yes, yeah, no bumps, no grooves, if you will, just easy. Just skate through life.

• 22:51George Kamel?

  Wow, must be nice.

• 22:52Rachel Cruze?

  What a terrible way to enter adulthood.

• 22:55George Kamel?

  Yeah, because then your kid has no clue how to survive on their own. Of course, they're gonna come back to you. For a bank of mom and dad to solve their problems.

• 23:01Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, or if anything hard happens at work, someone's not, you know what I mean? They're like, "Oh, my gosh," you know, there's a problem, and they're like, "I can't."

• 23:07George Kamel?

  You want to build a resilient kid. And so, you don't want to, you know, cause them undue pain and suffering. But there's some things where they just let them figure it out.

• 23:14Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, that's right.

• 23:15George Kamel?

  Kids are smarter than you think.

• 23:16Rachel Cruze?

  That's right, so, yeah, fix-it parenting, red flag. Don't fix everything with money.

• 23:21George Kamel?

  All right, next red flag for parenting and family is guilt-trip spending.

• 23:25Rachel Cruze?

  Oof.

• 23:26George Kamel?

  So, making kids feel guilty for what you spend on their school, their sports, et cetera. It's kind of emotional manipulation happening there.

• 23:33Rachel Cruze?

  For sure, especially like a little kid, yeah.

• 23:35George Kamel?

  You kind of hold it over their head, and like, they can't fully understand.

• 23:38Rachel Cruze?

  Right, no, yeah, so definitely red flag there. And then, but as adults, parents to their adult kids. Well, I did this. You should come home for Christmas. I can't believe you're not coming.

• 23:47George Kamel?

  Oh, the quid pro quo.

• 23:49Rachel Cruze?

  We did so much for you. You know what I mean? They call back to what they did and how they were, how great they were. And so now the expectation is how you should be.

• 23:55George Kamel?

  We get calls like this on The Ramsey Show where someone says, "My parents want to move in with me and they feel entitled because they took care of us growing up."

• 24:02Rachel Cruze?

  Right.

• 24:02George Kamel?

  So now they want us to fund their retirement because they didn't prepare. I'm like, "That's not healthy."

• 24:07Rachel Cruze?

  No, no. A child needs to be taken care of because they're a child. That's it. Period. Period. Like, oh my gosh.

• 24:14George Kamel?

  So, teaching your kids about money is an important part of this. To go, "Hey, money comes from work. Having work ethic is important. You save up and buy things with money you have. If you don't have the money, you don't buy it. We invest for the future, save for the future."

• 24:27Rachel Cruze?

  And I'm the adult in the situation and I'm choosing to spend money on your sports.

• 24:31George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 24:32Rachel Cruze?

  You're not forcing that on me. I am choosing that. So like, don't put that over their head. Yeah.

• 24:36George Kamel?

  That's gonna, that's gonna cost them a lot in counseling later on. So spare them that cost.

• 24:41Rachel Cruze?

  That's right. All right. Next is gifting with strings attached.

• 24:46George Kamel?

  Ooh.

• 24:47Rachel Cruze?

  That's a hard one. Hey, I'm gonna give you this, but then I'm expecting you to X, Y, and Z, you know? If it's in it for them, the gift. It's not really a gift at that point. Not free and clear.

• 24:59George Kamel?

  Yeah. What are your thoughts about, like, what categories would this fall into? Where there's a gift, but it's like you have to use it under these terms?

• 25:05Rachel Cruze?

  Um, I feel like I hear this. Uh, I hear this like for wedding planning. Like, hey, we're gonna give you some money, but you're gonna have to do X, Y, and Z at your wedding.

• 25:13George Kamel?

  You need to have it here. You need to invite these people.

• 25:15Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah. They start to control. I think it's a controlling thing too, right? Like, um, or we're gonna take you all on vacation and so, but we expect you to X, Y, and Z with us. Or if we do this, then you should do this later in the year. I don't know. Like, it's this, yeah. Did you say quid pro quo?

• 25:30George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 25:31Rachel Cruze?

  Earlier? That's a good, yeah. I think that's it. That's the statement.

• 25:35George Kamel?

  If I do this for you, you gotta do this for me. So I think if you're going to do that, it's okay. It's not always malicious. You know, if it's like, hey, here's money, but you have to use it for college because it's for college. That's one thing. We're not talking about that kind of gift.

• 25:46Rachel Cruze?

  Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 25:47George Kamel?

  It's the, when it's done with an impure motive.

• 25:51Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, yes. Well, it's the keeping score mentality is what it kind of feels like. We did all this for you, so now you should do this with the gift, which isn't really a gift at that point.

• 26:00George Kamel?

  Yes, especially if it's borrowed money, which is not a gift, but we see this a lot when we take calls of the in-laws gave us this money to borrow for this thing, but now we want a vacation and they're judging us now because like, wait, you haven't paid us back.

• 26:13Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 26:14George Kamel?

  You're out here buying nice things, got a new car. So that can really hurt relationships. That's the key with all this stuff. It damages relationships. It's fine to accept gifts. It's fine to give gifts, but just do it with a pure heart.

• 26:27Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, and as freely as possible, because I think that that really does help. But a gift that I will always take freely, George, anything from Cozy Earth.

• 26:36George Kamel?

  Oh, I got my no-show Cozy Earth soft tone right now. You can't see them. They're invisible to the world, but I know. That's all that matters.

• 26:43Rachel Cruze?

  I know. Cozy Earth. I mean, I had some pajamas on recently on a family beach trip and all the girls were like, where did you get those pajamas? And I was like, Cozy Earth.

• 26:52George Kamel?

  Were they the sky toily ones?

• 26:53Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, with the print.

• 26:54George Kamel?

  Yes, because I got them for Whitney and then you were like, I wanted those.

• 26:57Rachel Cruze?

  That's right. They came in for Whitney. That's right.

• 26:59George Kamel?

  Technically influenced you.

• 27:00Rachel Cruze?

  You did influence me, George. I was like, okay, I want those because they are so cute, so cute.

• 27:04George Kamel?

  Yeah, they have tons of great stuff, like from bedding to the athleisure, to the sleep sets, to, I got the clogs in. Amazing. I'm a new man.

• 27:13Rachel Cruze?

  That's right. You were gonna do shoots. Yes.

• 27:14George Kamel?

  I'm a new man.

• 27:15Rachel Cruze?

  That's amazing.

• 27:15George Kamel?

  Move over, Crocs. Get out of here. My lake house clogs are in.

• 27:20Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, I love it.

• 27:20George Kamel?

  So I love everything they make. It's super comfy, great quality, great warranties on their products. They stand behind it. And you can save up to 40% off if you go to cozylearth.com/smartmoney and use the promo code SMARTMONEY. We'll also drop a link in the description below.

• 27:34Rachel Cruze?

  All right, George, we're leaving family and relationships behind.

• 27:37George Kamel?

  Where are we going?

• 27:38Rachel Cruze?

  We are going into work.

• 27:40George Kamel?

  Somewhere I love to go, to work.

• 27:41Rachel Cruze?

  Red flags on working. Ready?

• 27:44George Kamel?

  Yep.

• 27:44Rachel Cruze?

  No raises or toxic promotion norms.

• 27:48George Kamel?

  Ooh.

• 27:49Rachel Cruze?

  So. If you don't get a raise, never, ever, ever, ever, ever. And you're growing up, up, up, up, up, up.

• 27:56George Kamel?

  Yeah, you're busting it. You're killing the K R A.

• 27:59Rachel Cruze?

  But it's not being acknowledged, uh, with the, with the old Benjamins.

• 28:04George Kamel?

  Yeah, and eventually you're gonna lose good people because of that.

• 28:06Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, for sure.

• 28:07George Kamel?

  So it's a good note to anyone who owns a business, leaders out there. If you don't treat your people well, you don't give them a path for growth. Eventually they're gonna leave because humans are wired for growth.

• 28:16Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, and raises should be expected. Now, if their performance is lacking.

• 28:19George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 28:20Rachel Cruze?

  Then that's, that's understandable, but if they're doing great, performances should be in the normal curve.

• 28:24George Kamel?

  If the company's in a real bind or something where they go, hey, we're not doing any raises this year across the board. That's one thing.

• 28:29Rachel Cruze?

  Totally.

• 28:29George Kamel?

  But if it's consistent over a long period of time, while you've been killing it, I think it's time to go.

• 28:34Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, I know. There, there was someone we were talking to recently, was it Friends? I can't remember. And apparently they sold this big account and they were making a huge deal. They were like, you know, and everyone I think was supposed, I think was promised or said out loud, like getting a cut of something.

• 28:49George Kamel?

  Cut of the deal.

• 28:50Rachel Cruze?

  And after they're like, oh, we're not able to do that, but here's a pizza party.

• 28:53George Kamel?

  Oh, no.

• 28:54Rachel Cruze?

  And they were all like, oh my God. So, yeah.

• 28:57George Kamel?

  Nobody wants a pizza party.

• 28:58Rachel Cruze?

  Don't promise things that you can't deliver on either. That's not fun.

• 29:01George Kamel?

  Skip the pizza.

• 29:02Rachel Cruze?

  Yep.

• 29:02George Kamel?

  All right, here's another one, red flag, not getting paid consistently.

• 29:07Rachel Cruze?

  Mm-hmm.

• 29:07George Kamel?

  And you might be thinking, who are these people? These aren't commissioned people. We're saying like, you work at a job for someone else and they go, hey, not gonna be able to pay you this month. That's real life, we get those calls.

• 29:18Rachel Cruze?

  We get those calls, yeah. And if that, and again, if it's one time, something crazy happens and you're able to stick it out because you love the company, do what you gotta do. But if that's a consistent theme, like they can't make their bills and they can't make payroll.

• 29:31George Kamel?

  Yikes.

• 29:32Rachel Cruze?

  Red flag. And it's funny, like, people call us and like, I feel bad for leaving because they're struggling already.

• 29:36George Kamel?

  They're so nice to me.

• 29:37Rachel Cruze?

  Well, and they're struggling already and if I leave, like, that's gonna leave a big hole. Like, people take on a lot of responsibility for other people's.

• 29:44George Kamel?

  They feel guilty.

• 29:45Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah. But sometimes y'all, you gotta work, you gotta do what's best for you.

• 29:49George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 29:49Rachel Cruze?

  Let's be honest.

• 29:50George Kamel?

  We always say, choose guilt over resentment, because you're gonna get real resentful.

• 29:53Rachel Cruze?

  Working for free.

• 29:54George Kamel?

  And it's gonna live in your head rent-free, and it's gonna go on way too long, because you're trying to be nice. Just do what you need to do.

• 30:00Rachel Cruze?

  That's right, that's right. Uh, next, fear-based layoff threats.

• 30:05George Kamel?

  Ooh, we see these lately, because there's a lot of scary stuff happening with the economy, and the will there, won't they, with a recession?

• 30:13Rachel Cruze?

  Well, government jobs especially, too.

• 30:14George Kamel?

  Government jobs went through it.

• 30:15Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I don't know if I'm gonna lose my job, if not, like, there's a lot of that, yeah.

• 30:17George Kamel?

  And so if you're, like, living in fear, this is a problem. If this is a pattern over a long period of time.

• 30:22Rachel Cruze?

  Especially a business, that, a small business, that you know the peo- you know, or I shouldn't even say that. But a corporation, I don't know, if there's always this constant, like, there's about to be a bunch of layoffs.

• 30:32George Kamel?

  Watercooler talk about who's next and what team is next.

• 30:34Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I know.

• 30:35George Kamel?

  That's not good.

• 30:36Rachel Cruze?

  I think that is pretty common in, like, corporate America, though.

• 30:39George Kamel?

  Yeah, I get certain industries.

• 30:40Rachel Cruze?

  They do, like, sweeping layoffs and stuff, you know, like, that does happen.

• 30:43George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 30:43Rachel Cruze?

  But if it's a continual thing, like, it's not worth the stress and anxiety, you know?

• 30:47George Kamel?

  No, I've got friends and family who work for, like, especially startups and tech. This happens a lot, is they have a lot of investor-funding money, and then the revenue's not there a few years in, and they, they are on the chopping block.

• 30:58Rachel Cruze?

  And they cut people, yeah, it's wild.

• 31:00George Kamel?

  Be careful out there.

• 31:03Rachel Cruze?

  It's a wild world out there, Wild Wild West. Oh, my gosh.

• 31:05George Kamel?

  Last one.

• 31:06Rachel Cruze?

  What a great movie, too.

• 31:07George Kamel?

  Wild Wild West with Will Smith.

• 31:08Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 31:09George Kamel?

  We finally found some common ground.

• 31:11Rachel Cruze?

  You like Wild Wild West?

• 31:12George Kamel?

  I never thought you would have watched Wild Wild West.

• 31:14Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, and the theme song is great.

• 31:17George Kamel?

  The Jim West Desperado one?

• 31:18Rachel Cruze?

  Uh, I had, is that it?

• 31:19George Kamel?

  Who would do Wild Wild West? Jim West, Desperado, Rough Rider. No, you don't want, okay.

• 31:25Rachel Cruze?

  Totally.

• 31:25George Kamel?

  She's a real one, in case you're wondering.

• 31:27Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, my gosh, yep.

• 31:27George Kamel?

  She's redeemed herself.

• 31:29Rachel Cruze?

  Man.

• 31:29George Kamel?

  I just threw my straw. They'll play that back in slow-mo.

• 31:38George Kamel?

  I like flicked it accidentally. Now I gotta...

• 31:41Rachel Cruze?

  Who knew you loved a cowboy movie, George?

• 31:43George Kamel?

  I didn't know anyone even liked an old Will Smith steampunk, high-concept

• 31:48Rachel Cruze?

  You know, listen, I know he punched someone on stage, which is not okay.

• 31:52George Kamel?

  It was a slap. It was a slap, to be fair.

• 31:55Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, yeah, not good. Like, can't do that.

• 31:57George Kamel?

  A punch is worse.

• 31:58Rachel Cruze?

  But Independence Day, great movie, you know?

• 32:00George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 32:00Rachel Cruze?

  He was in some great movies.

• 32:03George Kamel?

  Way to defend Will Smith for something that happened years ago.

• 32:07Rachel Cruze?

  I find the green flag and everything. I know, yep.

• 32:12George Kamel?

  Oh my gosh. I just got my sodium intake for the day with one sip with no straw.

• 32:18Rachel Cruze?

  Did you get all that salt?

• 32:19George Kamel?

  I have to.

• 32:20Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, do you feel like you just went in the ocean and swallowed a bunch of water?

• 32:23George Kamel?

  My tongue, I can't feel it. Oh, that's so much salt. Okay, we're done with that.

• 32:30Rachel Cruze?

  Can I say the salt is aggressive, too? It's like really thick.

• 32:32George Kamel?

  Yeah, it's like a... What's it called?

• 32:35Rachel Cruze?

  Like rock salt.

• 32:36George Kamel?

  Rock salt for rimming, which is a much thicker...

• 32:39Rachel Cruze?

  Well, and that's what this should be.

• 32:40George Kamel?

  Somehow saltier.

• 32:40Rachel Cruze?

  Is this... Oh, is that really it? I feel like this is like...

• 32:42George Kamel?

  Yeah, that's what they always use on margaritas.

• 32:44Rachel Cruze?

  Really? Okay. Oh, I'm...

• 32:46George Kamel?

  I don't know where you go. Where do they use table salt for their drinks?

• 32:50Rachel Cruze?

  It just, just, it's everything just...

• 32:52George Kamel?

  I prefer a tajine or tahin rim.

• 32:54Rachel Cruze?

  Tahin is great.

• 32:55George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 32:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yep.

• 32:56George Kamel?

  I still don't know how to say it. I can't get anyone to verify. I emailed the company.

• 33:00Rachel Cruze?

  I think it's tahin, right?

• 33:01George Kamel?

  You would think. But then someone of culture said, "No, no, no. It's tajine."

• 33:07Rachel Cruze?

  Tajine. Oh, gosh.

• 33:09George Kamel?

  Now I don't know.

• 33:10Rachel Cruze?

  Look, we look so American.

• 33:11George Kamel?

  But I imagine in Latin America it would be pronounced tahin, like the J would be a huh.

• 33:16Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 33:17George Kamel?

  Let us know in the comments. All right, last one on work. Financial red flag: remote work that has zero boundaries.

• 33:27Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, this is hard.

• 33:28George Kamel?

  So, working in an office has perks. We work in an office. I enjoy it. Working remotely also has its perks. But if you're in this work-from-home situation and you're expected to always be on, that's frightening.

• 33:39Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, that's hard, yeah. Yeah, and I think there's not great boundaries, whether you're in a physical office or not. But I do feel like in a physical office, there's still kind of that old-school mentality. When you leave... People, they don't see you, but when they can contact you all the time, like remote work, it's like they're so used to talking to you whenever. And so, there's a lot of people that work so many hours doing this, so.

• 33:58George Kamel?

  And if you leave an office, there's a physical distance that's created where you can actually leave work at work. It's hard when you're on the couch, you slam your laptop shut, and now you're like, I guess I need to still sit on the couch.

• 34:08Rachel Cruze?

  Right. Just turn on the Netflix instead.

• 34:10George Kamel?

  You need to create some natural separation.

• 34:12Rachel Cruze?

  Yes, for sure.

• 34:13George Kamel?

  That's a tough one.

• 34:14Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, that's good. Um, yeah, you know what, Jeremy Breland, our boss, our boss's boss, I guess we should say. Uh, he always said that, yeah, when you make, when you make yourself available, people expect you to be available. So sometimes there's these boundaries of like, you're not available, you know, just, you're probably not gonna hear from me, and I'm, so, that's the expectation.

• 34:34George Kamel?

  You know what's a good one too, and Dave has mentioned this, because Dave would, you know, sometimes he'll catch an email late, and he would fire off an email, and he was going, oh, the team expects that I also expect them to be working if I send an email at 10:00 PM.

• 34:46Rachel Cruze?

  Oh.

• 34:46George Kamel?

  They go, well, I guess this is the culture, and so he started scheduling emails to fire off at 7:00 AM.

• 34:51Rachel Cruze?

  Like in the morning, okay.

• 34:53George Kamel?

  The next day, to not create stress on the team or pressure that they needed to.

• 34:56Rachel Cruze?

  Oh shoot, I'm bad at that.

• 34:57George Kamel?

  And Rachel's always emailing, 9:30 PM, Rachel's like, looks great.

• 35:00Rachel Cruze?

  But I don't.

• 35:03Rachel Cruze?

  But I don't expect people to email back, but sometimes if I get behind, I'll just shoot off a bunch while I'm thinking about it, but I'm like, I'm not expect, I mean, I know it's at night, I don't expect people.

• 35:11George Kamel?

  But then the other person feels like, well, I guess I should also be responding at night, or this is normalized, so, the schedule button on Outlook, very few good things about Outlook, I'm not scared to sully their name, but the schedule button is a game changer.

• 35:25Rachel Cruze?

  Wow, well, I always do it on my phone, I email on my phone.

• 35:28George Kamel?

  Uh, I think you can still do it on the Outlook app.

• 35:31Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 35:31George Kamel?

  I can teach you after this.

• 35:32Rachel Cruze?

  I don't use that app, I use the mail on my phone.

• 35:34George Kamel?

  Oh. You're hopeless.

• 35:37Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I know.

• 35:37George Kamel?

  You're never gonna, we're gonna download the Outlook app now, that's not gonna happen.

• 35:40Rachel Cruze?

  Gross, no.

• 35:41George Kamel?

  Exactly.

• 35:42Rachel Cruze?

  I don't know.

• 35:43George Kamel?

  Okay.

• 35:44Rachel Cruze?

  What's the, what's my, what's that, what's this?

• 35:47George Kamel?

  What's this?

• 35:47Rachel Cruze?

  This is my, um...

• 35:50Rachel Cruze?

  That guy, right there.

• 35:51George Kamel?

  Yeah, yeah, the Apple Mail app.

• 35:52Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, the blue, white envelope.

• 35:54George Kamel?

  Loaded into.

• 35:55Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 35:55George Kamel?

  I don't think you can actually schedule from that.

• 35:58Rachel Cruze?

  See, told you.

• 35:59George Kamel?

  You know you can schedule text messages now?

• 36:01Rachel Cruze?

  No.

• 36:02George Kamel?

  Game changer.

• 36:02Rachel Cruze?

  Why would you schedule text messages?

• 36:04George Kamel?

  I do it all the time.

• 36:05Rachel Cruze?

  Why?

• 36:06George Kamel?

  If I need to remind my wife of something, but if I tell her now, she will never remember if I text it. So I can schedule the texts to send at a later time.

• 36:14Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 36:14George Kamel?

  In which, you know, it'll be of utmost importance.

• 36:18Rachel Cruze?

  Do you ever do reminders on your phone?

• 36:20George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 36:21Rachel Cruze?

  This is my new favorite feature.

• 36:22George Kamel?

  Do you do the voice to text reminders? Like Siri, remind me to?

• 36:25Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I won't say Siri, I just click that button. I just say like, yeah, remind me in two weeks to give Caroline her medicine or whatever.

• 36:31George Kamel?

  Yeah.

• 36:32Rachel Cruze?

  And then in two weeks?

• 36:33George Kamel?

  What a great mom.

• 36:34Rachel Cruze?

  What?

• 36:34George Kamel?

  Way to make it about Caroline. Is she okay?

• 36:38Rachel Cruze?

  She's fine. She had an antibiotic thing, but I was like, ooh, and the last thing, you're supposed to wait a little bit and then like.

• 36:43George Kamel?

  Oh, I was wondering, what condition would it be like two weeks from now?

• 36:46Rachel Cruze?

  That was like last night, yeah, that's that happened recently. But yeah, I love, I love the reminder.

• 36:51George Kamel?

  Game changer.

• 36:51Rachel Cruze?

  Game changer.

• 36:52George Kamel?

  These are the kind of tips you get on this show. You think, oh, we're gonna learn financial stuff now.

• 36:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, no.

• 36:56George Kamel?

  You're gonna learn some Outlook and Siri tips.

• 37:00George Kamel?

  You didn't want it, but you got it.

• 37:01Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, man, all right, George, what can we learn?

• 37:04George Kamel?

  What can't, did we learn anything?

• 37:05Rachel Cruze?

  From this whole episode?

• 37:06George Kamel?

  Don't be a red flagger.

• 37:07Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, and I think it's okay to recognize the red flags to like the Rachels out there.

• 37:12George Kamel?

  Yes.

• 37:13Rachel Cruze?

  That they're out there and that's okay. Like, you gotta be smart about this, right? You gotta be smart on this, in this life, head on a swivel, look around. And, and that it's okay to call it out, that if something doesn't feel right, it's probably because it's not right. You know what I mean? So like, so that's okay.

• 37:27George Kamel?

  To say no, to set the boundary, to push someone or something out of your life because it doesn't serve you.

• 37:33Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, and sometimes in the moment, the no is easier, just nope. Then drag a situation along and you feel the red flags and then later, it's always gonna be harder. Always gonna be harder.

• 37:44George Kamel?

  Trust your gut. Usually there's that thing where you're like afterwards, like, ah, I felt something, but I didn't do anything, I didn't say anything.

• 37:50Rachel Cruze?

  I know, I read a book called The Gift of Fear. So good. But it talks about for so many women, mm, no.

• 37:56George Kamel?

  Okay. Forgettable author, but grateful.

• 37:59Rachel Cruze?

  I know, I'm sorry for whoever wrote it.

• 38:02Rachel Cruze?

  Uh, but it was mostly about women. It was safety, like a kind of a safety book. And how the num- one of the number one reasons like we, something happens to women is because they feel bad.

• 38:10George Kamel?

  Oh, well, I mean abusive relationships are a great example.

• 38:13Rachel Cruze?

  Wow.

• 38:14George Kamel?

  Right?

• 38:15Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 38:16George Kamel?

  You stay in it.

• 38:17Rachel Cruze?

  We went real dark. Yes. Yes, George, real bad.

• 38:20George Kamel?

  Okay, sorry.

• 38:20Rachel Cruze?

  I'm talking about like at the gas station. Like you're pumping your gas, you feel uncomfortable, but it's like, you feel something in your gut, you're like, I just don't, I don't feel like good, right? You know what I mean? And it's okay to like, just pump your gas and get in your car, you know? Um, where a lot of women feel the need to like be nice and kind to everyone. And it's like, oh, it's okay, it's, you know, and then stuff happens, right? And so that's it. The gift of fear is what it's called. It's in there. You got something for a reason? Guy's trying to help you move up to your apartment, boxes, you know?

• 38:48George Kamel?

  And if you feel like it's sketchy.

• 38:49Rachel Cruze?

  This doesn't feel right, like just say no, thank you. You know, just, you can be strong on that.

• 38:53George Kamel?

  Yeah, that's why I aim to be a safe, a safe male.

• 38:58Rachel Cruze?

  Oh.

• 38:58George Kamel?

  Yeah. You can always ask me to move furniture. It's, um, God made me five, six for a reason. I'm not intimidating. You can take me in a fight.

• 39:06Rachel Cruze?

  People don't get weird vibes off of George.

• 39:07George Kamel?

  If you're over 11 and you have all your limbs, you can take me in a fight, no problem.

• 39:12Rachel Cruze?

  Even Harrison with the fish?

• 39:13George Kamel?

  Even Harrison, if you have, if you know how to fish, you can definitely take me in a fight. I'm not messing with that guy. You know, it takes a lot of muscle strength to reel up a old.

• 39:22Rachel Cruze?

  A hundred percent.

• 39:23George Kamel?

  Catfish.

• 39:23Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, for sure, for sure.

• 39:25George Kamel?

  I don't know what they're catching these days.

• 39:26Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, man.

• 39:28George Kamel?

  Ask Winston, he'll know. What the fish of the day is.

• 39:32Rachel Cruze?

  I don't know if this episode was, had any, anything for y'all out there in the world.

• 39:36George Kamel?

  Some episodes are just for us. And that was today's episode.

• 39:39Rachel Cruze?

  That was today's episode, okay. Before we get to guilty as charged, what are we sipping on?

• 39:43George Kamel?

  We are sipping on a frozen watermelon margarita.

• 39:45Rachel Cruze?

  Mm-hmm.

• 39:46George Kamel?

  That is or, very ornate, I think is the only word for it.

• 39:50Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 39:51George Kamel?

  It's got, I think we did about the same drink wise.

• 39:54Rachel Cruze?

  Mm-hmm.

• 39:55George Kamel?

  I would have had more, but my straw fell out. And I refused to drink all the salt. So this is, uh, gonna come in at three dollars and 37 cents per drink.

• 40:04Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 40:05George Kamel?

  It includes frozen watermelon, tequila, orange liqueur, lime juice, and honey.

• 40:11Rachel Cruze?

  Oh.

• 40:11George Kamel?

  Surprise, it's not agave. I'll have to ask, uh, mixologist Michael why he didn't use agave, which is more traditional in a margarita.

• 40:18Rachel Cruze?

  Wow.

• 40:19George Kamel?

  You didn't have concern about the honey? You thought that's a normal thing to put in a margarita?

• 40:24Rachel Cruze?

  I mean, it sweetens it up. It could be like simple syrup. Honey.

• 40:28George Kamel?

  But agave is what margaritas need.

• 40:32Rachel Cruze?

  And remind me, honey comes from bees, agave comes from the plant?

• 40:34George Kamel?

  The agave plant.

• 40:35Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, okay. And that tastes a lot different than honey?

• 40:39George Kamel?

  Yes, honey has a very

• 40:41Rachel Cruze?

  Sweet.

• 40:42George Kamel?

  Intense sweetness. Agave is a little more neutral, I would say, a little less sweet, depending if you use light agave or dark agave.

• 40:49Rachel Cruze?

  Okay.

• 40:50George Kamel?

  I don't want to get into it. It's for a different episode.

• 40:52Rachel Cruze?

  I know. I could take us real off track, and I'm going to, I may edit this out, but this is the this is the episode with random facts. Have you seen the bee girl on Instagram?

• 40:59George Kamel?

  No.

• 41:00Rachel Cruze?

  Save the bees. Yes.

• 41:02George Kamel?

  Is she like a bee influencer?

• 41:04Rachel Cruze?

  She will go in and find beehives that are like in people's houses, and she like pulls back everything, and it's like this insane colony of bees, and she doesn't get stung, and she like removes, but the way

• 41:15George Kamel?

  Is she wearing the bee suit?

• 41:16Rachel Cruze?

  Not always, not always, and the way she talks, like, and then I remove, you know, this, and so then she'll

• 41:22George Kamel?

  Bare hands?

• 41:22Rachel Cruze?

  And so then she'll eat the cone, and she finds the queen.

• 41:26George Kamel?

  The honeycomb?

• 41:26Rachel Cruze?

  I found the queen bee, and I put her in a clip, and they bring her into the thing, and they're following her to the new colony, and I

• 41:33George Kamel?

  Wait, does she talk like that?

• 41:34Rachel Cruze?

  It's another great day of saving the bees.

• 41:38Rachel Cruze?

  It's her. You've got to find her, George. She's so fun to watch.

• 41:42George Kamel?

  Wow, should we have her on the show?

• 41:43Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, my gosh, I would just have her talk the whole time, because her voice

• 41:47George Kamel?

  Is it a pleasant, calming voice? Like, how would you describe her voice?

• 41:50Rachel Cruze?

  It's like this. I mean, maybe like 10%, like, oh, gosh, everything okay? You know, like, but 90% very calming.

• 41:59George Kamel?

  It's giving a little bit of like Britney Spears on Instagram. Like, are you, are someone forcing you to do this?

• 42:03Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no, it's, but it's so good. Anyways, when I see her eat the cone, and like, there's honey, you're like, oh, that looks great. So if that's what's in my drink, I'm happy.

• 42:14George Kamel?

  Does she know that you can just like buy honeycomb? Like, you don't have to go to those lengths?

• 42:17Rachel Cruze?

  She rescues the bees out of situations and puts them somewhere else.

• 42:20George Kamel?

  Were they in dangerous way?

• 42:22Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, in like people's homes, or like in a barn or something, but there's like

• 42:26George Kamel?

  So if I have a bee's nest in my house, she will come over

• 42:29Rachel Cruze?

  Yes.

• 42:29George Kamel?

  And save the bees and save me.

• 42:32Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, I think she lives in Texas, but yes, it's a great account to follow. It's another great day of saving the bees. And she finds the queen in like two seconds, every time.

• 42:42George Kamel?

  It feels difficult. Is the queen the biggest?

• 42:43Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, sort of, but I mean, like, not really. And she's like, I spotted the queen, and you're like, how? How did you spot the queen?

• 42:50George Kamel?

  Wow, I'm fascinated by this.

• 42:52Rachel Cruze?

  I know.

• 42:52George Kamel?

  Truly intrigued.

• 42:53Rachel Cruze?

  I'm gonna send you, I'm gonna send you a video, cuz it's so fun to watch.

• 42:56George Kamel?

  Thank you.

• 42:56Rachel Cruze?

  Alright, uh, gosh, I mean, nine out of ten. I'm not a big frozen drink, cuz you see what's happening right now? It's all melted now.

• 43:03George Kamel?

  It gets a little bit melted.

• 43:04Rachel Cruze?

  So I'm gonna go nine out of ten. Because the fl- everything else was great about it.

• 43:09George Kamel?

  Yeah, I'm going nine out of ten as well. I could've used a little more lime, a little more sour.

• 43:14Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, yep.

• 43:15George Kamel?

  A little more sour watermelon, sour, sour watermelon. It's all that salt, it just hit all at once.

• 43:20Rachel Cruze?

  I love a salt.

• 43:21George Kamel?

  That's great. Alright, thank you for, uh, for this wonderful drink. Get the recipe in the show notes. Give it a try this weekend. You can always, uh, make a mocktail version and omit the, uh, the liquor if you wanna do that. Still be a great drink.

• 43:34Rachel Cruze?

  Alright, now it's time for Guilty as Charged. And this is where we ask each other a guilty as charged question every week, and if we're guilty, we take a sip. Alright, George, have you ever been secondhand embarrassed because of something your parents did or said?

• 43:50George Kamel?

  Oh my goodness.

• 43:52Rachel Cruze?

  Oh man.

• 43:53George Kamel?

  Where do you start? Where do you start? I mean, this is definitely my dad. I don't think my mom has ever said something that has embarrassed me secondhand.

• 44:01Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, no, it would be, it would be my dad. I think Dave can't hear. Did you know this? He has like the hearing of an eighty-three-year-old, like, he got it tested.

• 44:10George Kamel?

  Let's make clear, because of thirty-something years of doing radio and blasting speakers and stages and feedback.

• 44:17Rachel Cruze?

  So he, he's had hearing aids for probably the last decade, I'd say. It's been a while. But still, if he gets in a bad echoey room or a restaurant that's really loud, like if he's in a situation, and sometimes not, sometimes just in the kitchen, you know, over there, you know? You have to like really-

• 44:31George Kamel?

  It's one ear specifically that's worse.

• 44:32Rachel Cruze?

  You really gotta like shout, like, "Dad!", you know, you know? But sometimes, like, he's out in public, and like a waiter is like asking a question, and he's like-

• 44:42Rachel Cruze?

  Like, "Dad, Dad." He's like, "Huh, huh, huh." And you're like, "Oh, my God." People just talk to you, you know what I mean? And like, he doesn't hear.

• 44:50George Kamel?

  And they think like, he's being rude or something.

• 44:51Rachel Cruze?

  I don't know, I mean, it looks rude.

• 44:53George Kamel?

  Yeah, because either he's not responding, or he's barking, yelling at them.

• 44:56Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, "What, what?"

• 44:58George Kamel?

  That's amazing.

• 45:00Rachel Cruze?

  So, yeah, I'd say that sometimes.

• 45:02George Kamel?

  That's a good one.

• 45:03Rachel Cruze?

  Yep.

• 45:04George Kamel?

  Uh, mine, Max Camel, a famous car negotiator. But you do not want to be at the dealership when he's negotiating a car, because it is that embarrassing and cringe-worthy

• 45:15Rachel Cruze?

  Wow.

• 45:15George Kamel?

  as he tries to secure the deal. And so, I have had to leave, along with my mother.

• 45:20Rachel Cruze?

  Because you get just so embarrassed.

• 45:21George Kamel?

  It's just too, too tough to watch.

• 45:23Rachel Cruze?

  Okay. Is it because it's awkward?

• 45:25George Kamel?

  But he gets the deal. I mean, the man, if you need a car, go with Max. That's where I get it from, is his negotiating skills. I'm probably just as cringe-worthy.

• 45:33Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 45:33George Kamel?

  But I'm just younger and hipper, so I guess it comes off a different way than...

• 45:36Rachel Cruze?

  Got no-show socks on.

• 45:37George Kamel?

  My Middle Eastern dad with a little accent, like, "Hey, man." You know, it's how he sounds. It's how he sounds.

• 45:43Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 45:44George Kamel?

  But yeah, anytime I'm with him, if he's interacting with other people...

• 45:47Rachel Cruze?

  He's always haggling for a deal.

• 45:48George Kamel?

  Yeah. Or just the small talk can be awkward.

• 45:51Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, really?

• 45:52George Kamel?

  Yeah. To where I'm like, "Sorry, that's just how he is." We love him. Because, you know, he's always making jokes, but if you're a comedian, eight out of 10 jokes don't land.

• 46:01Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah.

• 46:02George Kamel?

  You're aiming for those two that do.

• 46:03Rachel Cruze?

  Yeah, and sometimes they miss.

• 46:05George Kamel?

  Sometimes it falls flat on the audience.

• 46:07Rachel Cruze?

  Oh, man, I love it. I love it.

• 46:09George Kamel?

  That's parents for you.

• 46:10Rachel Cruze?

  Yep, well, if you guys have a guilty charge question, make sure to DM us, @rachelcruz and @georgecamel. We always love to hear what you have to say. And if you enjoyed this episode, make sure to leave a review. But all of this is just the tip of the iceberg, because there's a lot of other flags out there, beige flags, if you will. So, check out our episode, "How to Spot Beige Flags in Money and Relationship." That's coming up next, and we'll put a link down below. So, we'll see you guys next Thursday on an all-new episode of Smart Money Happy Hour.