#165 Chris Bledsoe - The Episode We Never Censored

Chris Bledsoe is a UFO encounter claimant. He reported a UFO experience in 2007 while fishing, which he says cured an illness and led to spiritual awakening. Bledsoe speaks at events, writes, and is studied by scientists. Government agencies and religious groups have shown interest in his case. Bledsoe published "UFO of GOD: The Extraordinary True Story of Chris Bledsoe" in 2023. The book describes his encounters with UFOs, orbs, and spiritual entities. He reports ongoing phenomena at his home. Defense, intelligence, and military branches continue to investigate his claims. Shawn Ryan Show Sponsors: https://amac.us/srs https://shopify.com/srs https://meetfabric.com/shawn http://hillsdale.edu/srs https://betterhelp.com/srs https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/SRS https://ShawnLikesGold.com | 855-936-GOLD #goldcopartner This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/srs and get on your way to being your best self Please leave us a review on Apple & Spotify Podcasts. Vigilance Elite/Shawn Ryan Links: Website | Patreon | TikTok | Instagram | Download Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 0:28Speaker 01

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• 1:06Shawn Ryan?

  Chris Bloodso, welcome to the show.

• 1:08Speaker 03

  Thank you for having me, Sean.

• 1:10Shawn Ryan?

  I can't wait to dive into what we're about to talk about. But, so, gotta give Sean Webb credit again. He has introduced me to some of the most fascinating people that I've ever met, and just a great human being. I love Sean. And also, I was with Brandon Fugel about a month ago, and went and toured. He gave me a private tour of Skim Walker Ranch, and I told him that me and you were potentially doing an interview, and he got really excited about that, and told me a little bit about what you guys were doing out there, so I'd love to touch on that.

• 1:52Shawn Ryan?

  But all in all, Chris, I'm just ecstatic that you made the trip and was able to meet your son Ryan, and been really excited to do this.

• 2:02Speaker 03

  It's the same here, my friend. We've been so excited, and I'm just, I'm honored.

• 2:10Shawn Ryan?

  Thank you, thank you. All right, well, everybody starts with a introduction, so...

• 2:19Shawn Ryan?

  Chris Bloodso, you had a life-changing UFO experience in 2007 after the financial crisis that saved your life and cured you of your chronic illness. What was that chronic illness?

• 2:32Speaker 03

  Crohn's disease.

• 2:33Shawn Ryan?

  Crohn's disease.

• 2:34Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:35Shawn Ryan?

  Since then, you've dedicated your life to sharing your story and how it impacts your faith, which I can't wait to dive into that. You are the author of the New York Times bestseller, UFO of God: The Extraordinary True Story of Chris Bloodso. And since then, your UFO experience, you've talked to CIA, NASA, the History Channel, they've all been studying you and your experience. And from what I understand, trying to figure out what's going on with your consciousness.

• 3:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 3:10Shawn Ryan?

  So, I have a lot of questions. But, and then, we have a Patreon account, they've been with us since the very beginning. They're our top supporters, and without them, I wouldn't be sitting here, and neither would you. And so, one of the things that I do is I offer them an opportunity to ask each quest, each guest, a question. And so, there's some really good ones on here. This one is from Kathy. How do you view death now, since your experience?

• 3:49Shawn Ryan?

  Is it a soul departure, or a rebirth, or finality as your true being dies?

• 3:57Speaker 03

  It's completely, to me, the real world is the unseen world, where there's no time. I think we're in some sort of matrix here, where we experience time from the physical body, right? And once you're born, it starts decaying, right after it grows, and it's a cycle. But the eternal world is alive and around us. And I have been able to experience that and have shared it with a lot of others, this hidden world around us. I think our loved ones are on the other side,

• 4:41Speaker 03

  cheering for us to get through to the other side. I'm stronger in my faith than I ever have been, but...

• 4:50Shawn Ryan?

  Here's a question that just came to mind on the subject. Talking about where we go after we die and what you think happens after we die. Where do you think we are before we're born?

• 5:04Speaker 03

  I don't know, but the Bible says, "And I knew you before you were born." So if you're eternal, we were part of God. In other words, we're consciousness, the word consciousness, leads back to one. So you've got all these people talking about consciousness now. Well, that just means God, right?

• 5:24Shawn Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 5:25Speaker 03

  So I think we're all a part of God. And He breathed the life into every one of us, and we return back to that, unless we fail, you know, there's consequences.

• 5:39Shawn Ryan?

  So when you say consciousness is God, what exactly does that mean? Because all of our consciousness is different. We don't see eye to eye on things. We have different perceptions. We view the world through different lenses. And so is this a... Do you think consciousness is one big collective?

• 6:02Speaker 03

  I think it's like a wireless internet, basically. All the information to every living thing is around us. In fact... I read studies from NASA, and I have a couple that are pretty interesting, where it talks about the green light that shines from the sun, the way it angles on Earth, the light is in the green spectrum, which is the color spectrum, the center. And in that green light is, it affects this chemical called ADT, which is in all living things, hemoglobin in a human to plant life, chlorophyll.

• 6:45Speaker 03

  And when that light hits that chemical, it creates the energy which starts life. So something is telling every cell in your body what to do. You're not. And the grass, and the trees, and the bugs, it's all created by this field of information around us. And I think we're just receivers that this is how we're able to remote view. This is how you're able to do a lot of that kind of stuff, because we can tap into it. This consciousness around us is like a wireless network.

• 7:28Speaker 03

  So it's complex, and I'm just guessing. Just like everybody, we speculate of what is real, even God. We all speculate, because we really don't know.

• 7:42Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 7:42Speaker 03

  Right.

• 7:43Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah. Were you, it's a personal question, but it sounds like the experience that you had in 2007, which we'll dive into here in just a couple of minutes, it sounds like that really, I don't know if it made your faith stronger or just brought you to faith in general, but

• 8:06Speaker 03

  Stronger.

• 8:07Shawn Ryan?

  Stronger, so you were always a Christian?

• 8:09Speaker 03

  I was, yeah. My wife, I was a deacon in the Pentecostal in a church. I was raised in the Baptist church. And I married my wife forty-two years ago.

• 8:24Shawn Ryan?

  Congratulations.

• 8:25Speaker 03

  And we're still in love and happy.

• 8:29Speaker 03

  And she says, "You're gonna marry me, you're gonna go to the church with me, you're not gonna drink and all that." So I agreed. I was twenty years old, twenty-one, and we got married. I joined the Pentecostal church. I became a deacon in the church. And then I ran into trouble when I had this experience with the UFO. And that, that created some problems for me.

• 8:55Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting, interesting.

• 8:57Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 8:58Shawn Ryan?

  So, did you come to faith because of your wife? You had to make a deal?

• 9:03Speaker 03

  No, no.

• 9:04Shawn Ryan?

  Or was it always?

• 9:05Speaker 03

  No.

• 9:07Speaker 03

  When I was a little boy, my neighbors, I lived out in the country. I was born and raised on a farm, right? My dad was a carpenter. My, I worked in tobacco and hay and, you know, sometimes on a dairy farm, my neighbor had one. But all the kids wanted to go to the local church. We had a little seventeen-hundreds church that was in the Civil War. It was a hospital, this old dirt driveway is still there. And all those kids wanted to go to church because that's where the only, we could get together and have fun. And so I was deep rooted in the Baptist church until I married her.

• 9:50Speaker 03

  And I had to convert from Baptist to Pentecostal, which was, which is different. I'd never seen speaking in tongues and walking on the tops of the pews and shouting and all that.

• 10:05Speaker 03

  But that's where I ended up, Pentecostal church. So I'm deep rooted in my faith. I know the Bible pretty good.

• 10:13Speaker 03

  But I see it differently now because I have seen something that changed my life.

• 10:22Shawn Ryan?

  Were you into?

• 10:25Shawn Ryan?

  Before this experience, were you into UFOs or extraterrestrial life or any of that? Were you? Nothing?

• 10:34Speaker 03

  No. Back in those days, I was a builder. My dad, I'm actually a commercial pilot. That was my first love, was to be a pilot. I swore I wasn't gonna be a carpenter. I wanted to be something different, so my wife encouraged me when we got married to get into flying, and I did. I studied 12 years. I actually taught weather for pilots. I was certified, college level. So that was my life until we had the third baby. And when the third baby come along, I had to make a decision. Do I become a dad that sees my kids two days a week? And basically not a part of their lives?

• 11:19Speaker 03

  Or do I want my children to love their dad? And so I changed my whole career to look after my children. Got into the building business. And long about 2001, the World Trade Center disaster happened. And when that happened, I was caught with 72 houses under construction. We're building 100 a year, 120 houses. My wife had the RE/MAX company in Fayetteville, and she was, I think her last year, they closed $40 million worth of homes, new and existing. But when they crashed the World Trade Center, Fort Bragg went on big alert. That's where I live, Fort Bragg.

• 12:01Speaker 03

  I work with the soldiers, who buys the houses mostly. And I saw it all, a slow-motion train wreck coming. Because back in those days, the interest rate on construction money was 8%, 9%, which it is now, which is terrible. That's the worst thing they could do to kill the housing business, which is happening right now. I have friends in the building business and family that are crying about that. But what happened, I had a hundred thousand dollars a month going out in interest and overhead. And by the time two thousand and five come along, it had bled me of all life savings,

• 12:46Speaker 03

  twenty years' worth of work. And my disease that I had been fighting since twenty-five years old, twenty-six, Crohn's, got worse and it got worse and real worse to the point that we sold the company. I couldn't even get out of bed.

• 13:04Shawn Ryan?

  Oh, man.

• 13:05Speaker 03

  I was that sick. And so I'd never thought about a UFO. I was too busy raising children and building all these houses and dealing with the, now I'm in depression. I'm sick. I'm in the restroom twenty-five times or twenty times a day. And it was, it was, I thought I was gonna die from it. I mean, really. So that's where my brain was in two thousand and one, right on up to when it actually happened in oh seven.

• 13:42Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting.

• 13:42Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 13:44Shawn Ryan?

  Well, before we get into the incident, everybody on the show gets a gift.

• 13:48Speaker 03

  Oh, wow. Thank you for that.

• 13:51Shawn Ryan?

  Hey, you're welcome. Any guesses?

• 13:53Speaker 03

  I love it. Love it. These are the famous gummies.

• 13:58Shawn Ryan?

  That's it?

• 13:59Speaker 03

  I love it.

• 13:59Shawn Ryan?

  The Jones Lee gummy bear is made right here in the USA and still legal in all fifty states.

• 14:05Speaker 03

  I love it.

• 14:07Shawn Ryan?

  So, but, well, Chris, let's, let's dive in to the incident. Let's dive into what happened on the Cape Fear River.

• 14:21Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 14:23Shawn Ryan?

  What was, what were you doing that day?

• 14:26Speaker 03

  Well, I'd sold the business, right? And there for a year, there's a part there that,

• 14:37Speaker 03

  it's in my book, I write about this. Leading up to that incident, I'd had this near-death experience in the hospital from being over-medicated from some, from the medicine they were giving me. They weren't checking my vitals and my liver like they were supposed to. And I went into just toxic poisoning and unconscious. And so now I'm, I've sold my business because of all what the crash. And, and here I am, sick, really bad sick. So I'm recovering from this, this disaster.

• 15:19Speaker 03

  And so we fast forward to 06, in about October of 06. I had gotten better enough that my dad convinced me to get out and try to, to work. And remember, I'd lost everything, everything. We were living in an 8,000 square foot home, on a golf course with a pool out back. 20 years, we were doing great. And now I'm living in a mobile home and I'm having to apply for free lunch for my kids.

• 15:49Shawn Ryan?

  Oh, wow.

• 15:49Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 15:51Shawn Ryan?

  Wow. So you really ate it.

• 15:59Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an Ultra. Because it's not just a Superior Light beer. It's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 16:34Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends, like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an Ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser-Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 17:10Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends, like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an Ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser-Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 17:41Speaker 03

  So, um, I had looked after a house for Dad for about four months, late 2006. And it was, it was, it was finished up just before Christmas, but we had a punch list to do. So we all came back. And then, uh, right after the first, July of the first, I mean, January the first, they, the crew went back down to the coast to, to do the punch list. And I told them, I'm not coming. Uh, just bring a check when you get done. So on the, the seventh, um, January the eighth of that year, they called me.

• 18:25Speaker 03

  Uh, we had finished. We got it all signed off and we got your check. So I said, we'll bring it on to the house and give it to Dad and he'll pay you. And so they got their checks about one or two o'clock or twelve thirty or one o'clock. They went to town, couched them and come back and called me and said, hey, boss, let's celebrate. Would you take us fishing? And I knew what that meant because these guys were just construction workers. They worked with my dad for years and years, but when they wanted to go fishing, that meant I had only four-wheel drive truck and where they wanted to go, we had to go down in the woods to a river bottom, right? And it's gnarly going down in there. So I said, yeah,

• 19:09Speaker 03

  why not? Chris Jenner was at home. My wife was out of town with the other three children. And so about two thirty in the day, they came back. We loaded up this fishing gear and took off to the river, only three miles away. So we pulled up, parked. And if I can give you an idea of where we were, Cape Fear River, it's not a big river. It's only like sixty yards wide where we were. And the, the main road, when you, if you come up on a big field on the left, there's a two-rut road that crosses this field, it's two hundred yards across to the wood line. When you get to the wood line, there's a gate and it goes

• 19:54Speaker 03

  downhill a hundred feet to the river, about an eighth of a mile. And then you make a right and you end up in a cul-de-sac, another eighth of a mile. It's important, I tell you this, so you get what, what happened. So we're now sitting on the river bank, parked, about two thirty or quarter to three. And I wasn't into fishing. My mind, it wasn't into fishing at all. In fact, I was struggling with everything. My thoughts, I'm broke. How can I support my children? I'm forty-six years old. I have this disease that's killing me. You know, this Crohn's disease was, is a terrible thing. And

• 20:42Speaker 03

  And so that's where my brain was. While these guys were excited and Chris Jr., I made sure they were sitting on the bank and everything's taken care of. Because in my mind, I'm gonna walk away and go meditate in the forest somewhere. And so, once they started fishing, I said, "I'm gonna walk down in the cul-de-sac to about an acre of grassy area, just around, a round acre is where that road did end. And then the very back of it is where I'd walked down along the river to a gully, and I sat beside a tree till about four o'clock, and it got very dark." Not letting these guys know what I was thinking, right? That I'm depressed and I'm thinking very bad thoughts.

• 21:27Speaker 03

  I was struggling with, you know, how am I gonna make it? How I'm gonna support my kids? And about four, or ten after four, it started getting the sun going down. Which, about 5:30 in January, the sun sets, right? And so, I made my way back out of the woods because the canopy had made it dark and I didn't have a flashlight. I walked right up to these guys, and they were my son, Chris Jenner, and these men. They're grown men, you know? They run crews, have families. And I said, "You guys wanna fish some more? You wanna go home?" And they were, "Well, we just got here, boss. We wanna fish." I said, "Well, it's gonna get cold tonight. Let's get a fire going." So, we went around that acre, all of us,

• 22:11Speaker 03

  and we gathered up all the dead wood we could find and got a fire going right on the riverbank. And it was about ten after five now. And I said, we had a hint of daylight still. You could see the, you know, just blue skies still. I said, "I'm gonna walk up to the gate." Meaning, I'm going the opposite direction to the way we came in. And I'm gonna sit at the gate by the field, and I'm gonna watch for deer, coyote, turkey. So, I was born and raised a hunter. And I was a big into hunting, hunted all over the country. From Montana to Texas. And shot my first deer at five years old. Was shot point-blank in the back with a shotgun at 10.

• 22:56Speaker 03

  Little hole in me this big, right in my shoulder here. I have lead, you can see on this side. That was another near-death experience when I was 10.

• 23:08Speaker 03

  And so I left them walking. I looked back and they're sitting there by the fire and I felt like they're taken care of, I'm gonna keep walking. So all I'm doing, Sean, is crying out to the heaven. "Help me, what do I do? Give me the answers." And I was a spiritual guy then, in the church, and I'm praying as I'm going along. And when I got within, um, here's the weird thing. I was just part of the way down, parallel in the river, when I heard something in the woods beside me. I thought it was a deer to start with. And so I stopped and I'm looking, trying to look through this big brush and couldn't see anything.

• 23:53Speaker 03

  So I walked some more and when I started walking, it started walking. Scared me then. I don't never get scared in the woods. I mean, I'm in the Boone and Crockett record book for shooting one of the biggest black bears in this, in North America. Back then, it was one of the records, 660 pounds, and I shot him from six foot away. I mean, that's how, you know, I wasn't afraid then. It was too quick to be afraid. It'd come out at me and, but I got afraid. Something, this sound started sounding like two feet. And so I stopped and I got down on my knees and I looked under the brush, because along the edges, it's really thick.

• 24:37Speaker 03

  Once you get in the woods, it'll open up, right, because of the tree canopy. Never could see what that was. Three times, it had me to stop and to get down to see what was that tracking me. So when I got to the curve, or to the, to the, to the point where the road turned west and started up the hill. The sound stopped. And I'm looking up at a sky that I thought the sun was still about the top of the trees or so on. But I couldn't tell because I'm looking uphill at a metal gate, cattle gate, at the top of that hill.

• 25:19Speaker 03

  And it's a long haul up there, about a hundred feet to go up. And it's ruts, muddy ruts and grass, you know, some places knee-high, so I'm having to watch every step. And it's starting to get dark. And the closer I got to the top of that hill, I'm not hearing this in the woods beside me now. And I wanted to tell you that because it'll come back in the picture here in a second. I got about thirty feet from the top of that hill, and I began to see what I thought was the sun, the top of it, just the very top of it. Over the horizon? Yeah, over, just, you know, I got a gate. I'm looking up at a gate, a metal gate. The road goes up.

• 26:01Speaker 03

  And I could see the sun just barely above that gate and the top of the trees. Which I, for the first, when I first glanced at it, I didn't think much about it. I looked down to take another step because I didn't want to walk in the mud. And about three more steps up that hill, there it was in full view. And it was this blood-red, tangerine-orange ball of fire, about forty or fifty feet around. And I was like, oh my God, what is that? I could see the flames going around it, and the tips were shooting off. This thing's huge, like, big. And it's only three hundred yards away.

• 26:44Speaker 03

  It's just beyond the road and just at the top of the trees and sitting there. It kind of frightened me a second, but I'm curious. I walked up two more steps, and when I did, now my, my field of view's gotten wider because I don't have the trees of the road, you know, I'm looking up to shoot now, I can see more. And there's a second one right beside it. And that's when... Chills came over me, so you want, I couldn't explain it. I dropped to my knees because by doing that, I'm using the hill to hide from them. So I had raised my head up and I could see they were there. And I'm sitting here on the ground thinking, what in the world is this?

• 27:26Speaker 03

  I knew it wasn't nothing from this world or from the military. You know, I'm trained in, in, in that. In fact, I have military manuals that were given to me for, you know, they used to get you to train on different types of aircraft from Russian to, so that's been my world of aviation. So I automatically knew what I'm looking at wasn't a helicopter. It wasn't something of ours. So I'm hiding there and I crawl over to the ditch into these reeds, you know, reeds that are growing wetlands.

• 28:09Speaker 03

  And so I'm kicking through these reeds, thinking I'm hiding from what I'm seeing, not realizing they'd see me. And I start making my decision to run. I gotta run because I'm thinking about Chris Junior back behind me down the hill. I've gotten frightened. I sit there long enough that it, it really frightened me bad. So I made a plan to run and I turned my body. I'm sitting on the ground on my knees, hiding, right? So I raised up and I turned my body to run. I'm in the motion to run and I look back one more time. I gotta see what's up there. And when I did, straight above me, a third one appeared and it went,

• 28:54Speaker 03

  shot right down beside the other two. And I knew then, I knew it saw me. I knew I was on its radar and that's a different feeling. You know, somebody could see a ball of light fly by. Oh my God, I saw a UFO and that does something to you. But when you see it and it responds to you and it's the way that did, I knew I felt like a rat, a lab rat, or, or I was, you know, I'm in trouble. So I, that's the next thing I know.

• 29:28Speaker 03

  I'm about fifty yards from the fire. And I'm kind of walking through this mud. And I have no recollection of what happened coming down that hill. I only could remember the last fifty yards of going up to the fire. These three men are standing there around the fire. They're no longer fishing. Fire's burned down to a little small fire. And they're looking down, talking. They couldn't see me coming because I didn't have a flashlight. I'm coming out of the dark because I could see them from the fire. And I snuck up on them. And I said, hey, guys, you won't believe what just happened. And the first thing, one said, where, Andy? And I'm not going to use the words they use, but where have you been?

• 30:13Speaker 03

  I said, I was just up at the hill. What do you mean? I told you I was going up to the field. They said, you've been gone all night. I said, no, I haven't. I've been gone twenty minutes. And we're arguing this, and I notice Chris Junior's not there. And I told him, you won't believe what I just saw up top of that hill. These three balls of fire. Then immediately, where's Chris Junior? Well, he went looking for you two hours ago, and we can't find him now. He walked into the cul-de-sac, and so far into the cul-de-sac where you had gone earlier that day, searching for you. And I panicked, oh, my God. These woods are huge. You know, sixty miles to Wilmington from where we are, and nothing but forests along that river. And all I could think is he's lost in there.

• 30:57Speaker 03

  Seventeen years old, no flashlight. And they're telling me that one stayed at the fire while the other two took my truck. And they even pointed out my truck had been moved from where I parked it. They said, we've been everywhere looking for you all night. And so I immediately took off running to the back of that cul-de-sac, shouting for Junior. I was worried about what happened to me up there. I was freaked, right? And here's my son, Mason.

• 31:29Speaker 03

  And I started making my way into the woods. And around the edges of any field, especially where we live, it's real thick because it's just shrubbery, right? Same, and so I'm parting this stuff and I'm calling out for Chris Turner and I get about 10 feet in there and I hear him. He wasn't answering me until I walked right up, almost stepped on him. And he come up out of these bushes and he grabbed me and he's weeping. This is your son? Yeah.

• 32:09Speaker 03

  It's traumatic because of the struggle he had. And it wasn't because of that so much, it was after, right? Which was a lot of trouble after that, that he went through. And we'll talk more about that in a second, but to see your son in shock, eyes like this, shaking. So, he's like, "Why did you leave me?" What was your initial thought when you saw your son like that? What did you think happened? I was freaking out.

• 32:52Speaker 03

  I didn't want to tell him what had happened to me because he's talking out of his, he's saying things like, "These creatures, Dad, these creatures. Why did you leave me? Why did you leave me?" I said, "I didn't leave you, son. I've been gone for 20 minutes." He's, "No, Daddy, you've been gone all night." And... How old was he at the time? Seventeen. He's just a baby, you know, the babies at that age. And...

• 33:19Speaker 03

  And so he began to tell me. I grabbed him, all he wanted to do was go home. He wanted to go home, he didn't want to know more what happened to him.

• 33:28Speaker 03

  And so what he happened was where he was at the back of that cul-de-sac, he could see all the way down, parallel the river, to the end where I made the turn and started up the hill. So it's a quarter mile he could see, all the way down. And he's over there on the edge of the forest, calling out for me while they're driving the truck. One guy's sitting at the fire, and the fire is between, you know, he's got to walk toward, you know, toward what he saw coming to get to the fire. So he sees these two red lights cross the road, and he thought they were flashlights, like military, I used to have a military flashlight that had a red on it, right? And he remembered those.

• 34:14Speaker 03

  And so that was his first thought. There were, there were some bodies walking with these red flashlights. So they crossed the road over to the riverside, disappeared. So he takes off and he runs back to the fire, and he tells these guys about these two lights he saw. And then he turns and he goes back to the back of that cul-de-sac, still calling for me. And about that time, these two red lights come back out of the riverside, back out in the road, and they start towards him. Now, these two balls of light, they look like this big, and they're floating, three feet off the ground, coming all the way down that road. And as they got closer to him, he got scared and he started hiding.

• 34:59Speaker 03

  So he laid down on his stomach and crawled up under, backed up under them thick as shrubs. And they came up within 20 feet of him. And what he saw were these two little glowing beings that were yea high, probably three, two and a half, three feet tall. And they had these bright red eyes. And the whole time, one was staring at him. He couldn't shout, he couldn't move. He was in such terror, he was frozen. And I don't know if they had the power to keep him from. He thought that they had that power over him. As long as they were looking at him, he couldn't speak. So he was gone a total of two hours. And he, I don't know how long exactly,

• 35:43Speaker 03

  he was there with these little beings walking around him, but it really, it put him in shock. And so I led him back to the fire. And these guys were freaked out too, because they had heard what happened. They didn't know what happened. They knew that I'd been gone all night, and Junior's talking about creatures. And I'm talking about balls of fire at the top of the hill. So these men's starting to get spooked real bad. And one of the guys looks up and points, "Oh, look at that." And we all look up, and it looked like the brightest star, Venus, in the night sky, when it's just as brightest. It was eight or nine of these just appeared,

• 36:28Speaker 03

  and they just came on. And they went out away from one another, and they came back in a circle. And they made this big circle, and they were putting on a show. And then three of these things came all the way down and landed across the river. Sixty yards to the other side of that river. They were up on the other side of it. In a cut-down, it had timbered the place out. So you can imagine pantomime set in at that moment. We left out of there with fishing poles still there, coolers, everything we brought. We didn't even wait to touch it. And we jumped in that truck, and I'm taking off up through this muddy road. And one of the guys is beating on the back of my seat, saying, "Go, go, go."

• 37:12Speaker 03

  And there's this red ball of light coming up behind us, following the truck. So undoubtedly, it came out of the back of that cul-de-sac, was still in there, and was coming up behind the truck. They were screaming to the top of their lungs. But the weird thing is, Sean, I was like numb to it. I wasn't afraid. I'd lost all fear from where I was when it appeared on the top of that hill. To now, I'm not afraid. So we make the turn and we start up that hill and I'm going so hard with that Ford truck up that hill and it's wallowing in the ruts and you know the shrubs on either side are brushing the mirrors down in the swamp.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  And when I crossed the top of that hill, that gate, it was almost like, I liken it to an old Streets of San Francisco movie where the cars would jump when they go over the hills. We almost went airborne, that's how fast we were trying to depart that place. But when we topped that hill, those three orange orbs, two of them were still in the exact same spot. Are you serious? Yeah. Now we got three forty foot balls of white light on the riverbank behind us and something, an orb, which I know what it was, it was one of those beings that their eyes from a distance looked like a little ball of light, you can't really tell.

• 38:34Speaker 03

  And so now we're faced with two forty foot balls of fire, three hundred yards and about two hundred feet in the air in front. And the third one is the one that took me. That's the one that appeared above me and shot down. That thing now is sitting in the road and it's halfway between us and the highway. So it's a hundred, a hundred and fifty yards away. And when I went over that hill, I slammed on brakes because of that. It's sitting there, it looks like a football now. It's going white, it changed from red to white and it's sitting sideways in the road, it's hovering about five feet off the ground and it looks like a, an egg or a football.

• 39:16Speaker 03

  About that time, we heard gunshots and we all heard them and we thought immediately, one of these country boys has pulled out a shotgun and they're shooting at this thing. So it just pivots and it starts towards us, it's coming down the road at us, five feet off the ground, then it starts up.

• 39:36Speaker 03

  But I want to back back one second. Before we heard gunshots, there was this mobile home in the back of that field. And there were two cars there. And one of the guys with me says, I know who that is. That's Shane. He's, I play softball with him. So let's go to his house. Nobody had a phone. I didn't have a cellphone. I couldn't afford one. Nobody had one. And we just wanted somebody to see this with us, right? So I drove across the ditch, up in this man's yard, pulled my truck right up to his front door. And the storm door's open. I mean, it's closed, but the front door's open. So we could see the TV playing through the door, two cars in the yard. And one of the guys gets out, knocks on the door. Nobody answers.

• 40:23Speaker 03

  And I even blew the horn. My truck's, you know, six feet from the front door. Headlight's blaring in. And I'm looking back through the window and this thing's sitting in the road behind us, right? Because the mobile home was facing the way out. And we had turned up to the door and that orb stood, I mean, this football was still there, 100, 150 yards. Nobody answers. So I backed back out and I pull back out in the road. Now I'm about 40 or 50 yards closer to this thing. Because we had to go forward to get to this mobile home. About that time, the three gunshots happened. And then it starts and it comes and it comes. And when it gets to my truck, I opened the sunroof on it.

• 41:07Speaker 03

  And it crossed over the top of my truck and it was probably six feet up. I could have shot it with a homemade slingshot and it hit this thing. No sound, just glowing white light that was doing this. Did it look solid or did it look kind of translucent? It looked, um, and once it got that close to us, it looked almost, um, it was blinding from the light. But at a distance, it looked like an egg. And it's, it's hard to tell it was translucent because of the light coming off of the thing. But it, it was definitely shifted from a red ball of fire to a football or an egg. Or a Tic Tac.

• 41:51Speaker 03

  And I'll tell you how I got involved with government. Because when I reported that thing, I'll tell that in a minute. So here this thing comes over my truck.

• 42:03Speaker 03

  Right when it got above-

• 42:04Shawn Ryan?

  Was it passing through things, or was it moving around things?

• 42:08Speaker 03

  It moved up and over a tree in front of me. There was a-

• 42:11Shawn Ryan?

  Okay, so it wasn't like it was passing through-

• 42:14Speaker 03

  No.

• 42:15Shawn Ryan?

  -trees, or trucks, or-

• 42:16Speaker 03

  Although they do-

• 42:17Shawn Ryan?

  Any-

• 42:18Speaker 03

  They do that.

• 42:19Shawn Ryan?

  It was doing both?

• 42:20Speaker 03

  No, this one, it came down the road and there was one tree between us and it, to the side. It went up and over, and when it came over the truck, uh, it cleared the trees behind me. There was always standing woods behind me. So it had to been about eighty feet at the most to clear them trees. And then it turned, it pivoted, and shot off to the north. So I hit the gas. And now I'm flying out of there, and these guys there, this is the end of the world. We're being invaded. Where's the military? Where's Fort Bragg? Get me home so I can see my wife before this war's over. I mean, it was just drastic. Now I'm no longer afraid.

• 43:04Speaker 03

  I, I wasn't afraid, like they were. They were all terrified. So I'm sitting back, kinda numb, watching this take place. I wanted to get out the truck and look at it, you know? They're like, having nothing to do with that. So we take off and we start toward dropping these guys off. One of them live, or two of them live side by side about two and a half miles away. The other one live about six miles away, seven miles. They were fighting who got to go home first. So bad that the, this guy that lived seven miles away went out. So we had to drive to him, drop him off, and turn around and come back to drop the other two off. Right?

• 43:47Speaker 03

  But on the way, we had orbs, balls of light, tracking us alongside the truck, crossing over in front of us. And, um, one of the most-

• 44:00Speaker 03

  These kinds of details, I'm gonna tell you now, all played a major part in my understanding of what was going on. Because halfway there, between where we were and the home of the first two guys, two and a half miles, right? Halfway there is a dead man's curve. I mean, it's a sharp curve. It's like, if you go through it at 35, you're having a hard time. Your car just, you could lose it real easy. In fact, my first wife was killed there, in that curve, and I found her.

• 44:46Shawn Ryan?

  What do you mean, you found her?

• 44:49Speaker 03

  It was a weird thing.

• 44:51Shawn Ryan?

  You found her that night?

• 44:52Speaker 03

  No, I'm gonna tell you. 1981 or '82. We'd been married 11 months and 28 days. So we had two days before our wedding anniversary. And I had gone deer hunting to the coast with my dad. And we were hunting islands with dogs, right? And my neighbor, friend, growing up, we had a hunting club out in the middle of nowhere, on 4,000 acres of land. Dad had it for 25 years. And that's where all the young kids would go and party on Friday night or Saturday night. They'd have a keg party or whatever. And I'd gone hunting, and they all called me, "You gotta come to the party."

• 45:35Speaker 03

  And so my wife said, "I'll meet you there." She went to the party. I got home about 8 o'clock from the coast, got dressed, and took off down to the party. And she had left the party and went through that curve too fast and rolled in over and into somebody's front yard.

• 46:03Speaker 00

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• 46:37Speaker 01

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• 47:11Speaker 03

  And I saw the car laying on its side when I went by going to this party. And the wheels were still turning. I didn't recognize the car. I got out and the people were in at the front door of their house, opened the door and looked out right when I walked up in the yard. They heard it. So I was there within 60 seconds of it happening. And I said, "Have you seen the person driving this car?" And they said, "No." I said, "You better call 911. It looks pretty bad." And I'd envisioned whoever was in that car because the car's laying on its side and the wheels are still turning. The motor's running. Nobody's in the car. All the windows are broke out. So I walked back toward the highway and that's where I found her. Had no clue. Aw, man.

• 47:57Speaker 03

  And um, she died right there, me over there. And so, I lived a long time stressed over that. Never could get over it. You know, her, you know, I should have been there. You know, it was my fault. And so, I lived with that. Well, that night coming home from the river.

• 48:19Shawn Ryan?

  What was your wife's name?

• 48:21Speaker 03

  It was Dana. And that, that whole incident on the river, on the way home, we approaching that dead man's curb. Right over the spot where she was killed is this big thing hovering right over top. I slammed on brakes. I saw it immediately where it was. And, and I wanted to get out and, and look at it up under it. I mean, it was right above us. It was just above this big high tension power line. Well, they were fighting me bad. They're not having none of this. And, but what I wanted to say was that, that um, at that moment, it spoke to me telepathically or whatever.

• 49:06Speaker 03

  And said, you need to not worry about her. She's in, she's in good hands. And so, I take these guys on home, right? I never told them this, what happened. I only wrote about it years later. But that's when I got peace from the whole incident. After fifteen or twenty-five, thirty years or twenty years at least. I can't do the math. It was in two thousand and seven. We're married in eighty-two. Um, I finally got peace from that. Everybody's terrorized by UFOs, orbs, fire, lights. And I'm thinking about this relief from what.

• 49:51Speaker 03

  So I'm in a different world from them now, right? And I still don't know what happened to me. I had no clue what happened for four hours. Couldn't believe it. So I dropped these guys off. Chris Junior and I head back home. Now he's, I'm worried about him. He's panicked. He's going through the house, locking it down. Every room, he'd close the door and lock, even the bathroom. And he'd turn the lights on. Run up, shut the blind, turn all the lights and lock the door. I'm in my study, looking on TV to try to find news. You know, there's an invasion happening. We just knew this. It was crickets. I couldn't find anything. So Junior finally comes to the room and says, "Have you found anything?" I said, "No, son."

• 50:36Speaker 03

  And then about that time, we hear something come over the house with this humming noise. I thought it was a helicopter. Because it was coming from Bragg's direction, which is only, you know, 20, 15 miles from me, from the base, 20 miles. And it's heading exactly towards the river. And suddenly, every, it, once it goes out of hearing, every dog in our kennel started barking. Now, my dad raised dogs all his life. He had a hundred at the time when I'm growing up. And even then, he had 15 hounds in that kennel. And they're all, these old hounds got a loud mouth right? And they're barking as loud as they can. And what it sounded like was they were afraid.

• 51:19Speaker 03

  And dogs can bark different sounds. And you can, anybody who knows hunting knows what a dog say. I knew they were scared. They were seeing something. They didn't know what it was. I said, "Junior." Only thing I could think of is where Dad's kennel was is in the forest behind his house, back in the head of woods. And he had a double car, separate garage next to the kennel. So the dogs could see the kennel. I thought somebody had come from the road and Brooke was breaking into his shop. And the dogs saw. And that was what was going on in my head. And Junior is like, "We're not going out there." I said, "Dad." I said, "Junior, we'll use a flashlight.

• 52:03Speaker 03

  We'll sneak down in there and we'll use Rosie." I had a 110-pound Chesapeake Bay retriever sitting on the back steps. And her hair was standing up. She's watching towards the kennel in the woods. And this awful racket, right?

• 52:21Speaker 03

  And I finally convinced him to go with me, or stay, whichever he wanted. And he was scared to be by himself. So he grabbed me by the back of the shirt. And I'm walking real slow. I walked out the door and Rosie took off toward the kennel, ran out of sight. We walked across the lawn to a two roped road, went down in the woods, got to the back of that kennel. And now, all these dogs, and imagine, they're very loud. And we're standing there looking at 15 hounds in a kennel, barking as hard as they can towards the woods in the back. Oh, this is weird. These dogs should be looking toward the grass. And I'm whispering to Jenna, and Rosie's right there in front of us, pointing in the woods.

• 53:04Speaker 03

  Her hair's standing up, barking every breath. I said, Jenna, I said, it must be a bear. Dogs not scared of deer. But they will do this on a bear sometimes. The scent, it gets scared. So I said, I'm gonna put Rosie in on whatever's in there, and she'll run them out. We're gonna run back to the yard, go to the back of the property. We made a plan, and we're gonna hide behind this giant oak tree, and hope we can cut her off before she runs through. So as soon as I bumped her on the butt, she jumped in the woods, and Jenna and I took off running.

• 53:45Speaker 03

  We had to go to the end of that road, make a left on the yard, and go to about 400 feet, 500 feet. It was a big yard, six acres there, to cut whatever's in there off. And I just knew it would be a bear, or deer, or something. So when I made the left turn, it was, the grass was a little, now we got frost, right? It was cold that night. We're talking about 11 o'clock now.

• 54:12Speaker 03

  He pulled loose from me. So I thought I'd just pulled away from him when I slipped a little bit. But what happened was, he had had enough. He took a right, went back to the house. He's in the back. I didn't know that, though. And I'm running to the back hard as I can.

• 54:29Speaker 03

  Ran up to this big tree, and I ran so hard. I was trying to be quiet. And I'm trying to catch my breath, so I'm panting. Trying to be quiet with it, right? And I stopped myself against the tree. And so I turned around after about a few seconds of stopping and panting. Dog's coming straight at me. He's coming through the forest. And I looked back to see if Chris Junior was gonna come up. And when I did, that was a little... It's the same thing he described on the river. This little glowing being about yay tall with glowing red eyes. And it was glowing the color of the moon. It looked like a child. It looked like a four-year-old child, about that size.

• 55:13Speaker 03

  Didn't look like a gray alien or none of that, what people report. It looked like a glowing little child. But the details, it's shiny. This thing was glassy. It was gleaming. The body looked like it had glass on it.

• 55:31Speaker 03

  And about that time, when I turned back and saw it, it frightened me so bad that my hair stood up. Every cell of my body went, "Oh, my God, I'm dead." So I went toward the trees to turn around instead of where I was standing, because I didn't want to get no closer to it. So I leaned into the tree, and I turned and put my back to the tree. And I said, "I surrender. I don't mean you harm." And it said to me in this thunderous voice. It said, "You don't understand. I'm not here to hurt you. We're here to help you." About that time, Rosie comes on through, and this thing vanishes in front of me and see it anymore.

• 56:15Speaker 03

  I walked up to the house, trying to figure out why it just happened and how not to tell Chris Junior what I had just seen, because he didn't want that around him any longer.

• 56:27Speaker 03

  And next morning, when I get up, about 10 o'clock that day, I hadn't had my medication. And I'd been taking medication for 17 years for Crohn's.

• 56:41Speaker 03

  And if I missed it one day, it was supper time. Yeah, I'd take it every day. If I missed a day, for the next three days, my system would get out of whack and it was more restroom, right? And I didn't feel the normal sickness that I'd normally have. I didn't feel the nausea. I didn't feel any of it. And I thought, this is weird. You know, I've been living with this every day and now I don't feel it. And from that point forward, I never had another symptoms of Crohn's disease. It was completely gone. I've been to Chapel Hill University.

• 57:17Speaker 03

  I've had specialists check me out from top to bottom and there is no marker for Crohn's being there. And see, I come down with rheumatoid years later, 2009.

• 57:31Speaker 03

  And I've been treated since then for rheumatoid arthritis. And they thought it was the Crohn's that had come back. But it wasn't. The Crohn's didn't come back as rheumatoid. There's no marker there. And RA was a different story. But, long story short, that was the the end of the January 7th initial encounter. Walking back to that house and trying to get my son settled down from the shock that he'd been through. And now I'm kinda, I'm in shock basically myself, but not.

• 58:12Speaker 03

  Because of seeing this stuff and trying to process it. It's not natural. It's not normal.

• 58:22Shawn Ryan?

  What was your first conversation with your son afterwards?

• 58:26Speaker 03

  I told him, I said, "Son," I said, "I believe they're angels." He said, "No, Daddy, they had to be." He couldn't even get it out, "They were demonic entities." I said, "No, they weren't, son, they were angels. They healed me." So we battled that for months. And here's the thing, it never left me. I mean, it never left, and to this day, it's still with me. And I mean, stronger today than it was back then. This is why the government has studied me. They've studied me more than any human in existence. From DIA, CIA, DoD, the Ministry of Defense in England.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  The CIA, Jim Simmivan wrote the foreword to my book. He's the Director of Operations for the CIA. John Alexander wrote the foreword, or introduction. They both shared in rights. So we went through the longest time trying to convince him, I did, that it was positive, and it got worse for him. Because from that point forward,

• 59:41Speaker 03

  this is where I want to say, if I could say this word, this is where hell set in for me. Because I'm telling everybody. They put it in my head that night, that I had to tell the world. So I compared myself to Richard Dreyfuss on Close Encounters of the Third Kind, where he was making the mashed potato devil's tower on his table. He could see it, and he was completely obsessed with this phenomenon. And I was as well. All I wanted to do is tell everybody. Well, that was the worst thing I did, because now the church comes down on it. You're playing with demons.

• 1:00:26Speaker 03

  It's gotta be demonic entities. Like, "No, it's not."

• 1:00:30Shawn Ryan?

  Who was the first person you told?

• 1:00:33Speaker 03

  Probably my wife. She came home a couple of days later. She'd been gone and of course, we'd called her and all, but she goes. Let me say, her family are the, they brought the Pentecostal movement to North Carolina. They went to California. They were at Exeter Street. Her, you know, ancestors, they brought it back to Falken, North Carolina, built orphanage. So I had the weight of the whole conference on me, not just some local church down the street. So there was a lot of power there.

• 1:01:16Speaker 03

  And other churches, the local churches, my mother, my very religious lady, all at that time, they all automatically resorted to, it's the devil, it's demonic, you know. And, and I'm saying, but they healed me and that wasn't what I experienced. And they got so bad that they tried to take my children from me. They wanted to divide my family. They were telling my kids that I'm playing with the devil. He's going to ruin them children. Somebody called social services on me. I had to deal with that, with the government to try to, just to keep my kids, right?

• 1:01:58Speaker 03

  And so, yeah, that started a really hard time.

• 1:02:04Shawn Ryan?

  You had mentioned that the third object that appeared seemed to know your thoughts.

• 1:02:11Speaker 03

  It does.

• 1:02:12Shawn Ryan?

  Now, what is that, what exactly does that mean?

• 1:02:18Speaker 03

  These things can read your mind. They're connected to our thoughts. This is why, one thing I can promise you, if you're a God-fearing man and you know the Bible, one thing that the church knows is they always preach. You'll hear it all the time. Only God can read your thoughts, only heaven. Not that the devil can't read your thoughts, right? So this is something taught to all Christians from early on. The devil can whisper in your ear, but he can't read your mind. Well, they read your mind and they know every... They're connected to us. They're connected to our thoughts. They know your heart, they know your intentions.

• 1:03:01Speaker 03

  And somehow or another, Sean, they have the ability to stop the timeline, to manifest things, to make things happen and to... I've seen it a thousand times. People come to see the phenomenon with. I've been many, seventy-five with me at the time and it appears. But there are certain people, if they're afraid or if they're skeptical. I can tell you skeptical people about this phenomenon will never see anything. They're left out. Because they know your free will.

• 1:03:43Speaker 03

  They don't want to change your... You know, go against your free will. But they can appear in a group of fifty people standing beside me and that one skeptical person will look that way for one second and it'll appear in front of everybody else. I've seen it a thousand times. It knows how to... It knows where you're gonna look before you look.

• 1:04:14Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting.

• 1:04:15Speaker 03

  Yeah, seriously.

• 1:04:17Shawn Ryan?

  You had mentioned, I believe you had two near-death experiences before this incident. What, at age ten?

• 1:04:24Speaker 03

  Ten, I was shot point-blank with a shotgun.

• 1:04:27Shawn Ryan?

  What was that near-death experience?

• 1:04:31Speaker 03

  Well, it was New Year's Day, 1972.

• 1:04:38Speaker 03

  After hunting season, season had gone out on the 31st. And so it was fix the roads on Saturday and cook a hog. So we got all these men, that's part of the club, were out preparing the roads and all the farm, right? And my grandfather and the farmer that owned the land was at the club tending to the hog on the cooker. So myself at 10 and my best friend and my first cousin grabbed shotgun, took off about a mile away, three quarters of a mile. We walked to the back of a cornfield and we spread out and we were going to shoot doves, right? It was dove season.

• 1:05:20Speaker 03

  And this bird came over, my neighbor, he shot at it, missed it, came right over. And I shot it and it turned and it went away and landed in the woods. I knew I'd hit it. So I took off across the field, walking.

• 1:05:37Speaker 03

  Double barrel shotgun in my hand. I walked up to the edge of the woods and I saw him in there, in a pile of briars, flipping, fluttering around. I thought, I better put a shell in my gun, in case it gets up and flies away. So I cracked that double barrel open and I pulled two shells out of my coat and I put one in and dropped the other. Did not know that my friend wanted to claim that he shot the bird, right? And ran across the field behind me. I didn't know he was there. Ran up right behind me. And when I reached over and picked that shell up, he was going to shoot over me and shoot that bird claim. Kids, when I stood up, it hit me right square in, right here in the shoulder, blew a hole this big.

• 1:06:21Speaker 03

  I have a scar that big on my back. Now imagine a 10-year-old, I was only this tall.

• 1:06:28Speaker 03

  It felt like a sledgehammer hit me. It drove me about ten feet forward and face down in the, in the forest. And the first thing, I felt blood running everywhere. And I said, dude, why did you shoot me? And now my cousin's coming across the field and they're fighting. They're screaming at one another. Go get help. He's my cousin. I'm staying with him. He's my best friend. I'm gonna stay. And that's what they were doing. And I'm laying there bleeding to death. And so the farmer heard them fighting. And here he comes down that cornfield in an old pickup truck. It was a blue and white Ford from the sixties.

• 1:07:09Speaker 03

  And he runs in the woods, picks me up like a sack of potatoes and threw me in his truck. Took me to the hospital. Next thing I know, I'm up in space looking down from, from way up high. I could see the earth getting smaller and smaller and smaller. And then I wake up and I'm in, I'm out of surgery. And I'm in an X-ray room. Back then, I had so much lead in me from birdshot that I still have seventeen pieces. In here, you can see it on this side, all in this shoulder and this front.

• 1:07:53Speaker 03

  And I set the airport X-ray machine off. They'll pat me down most every time I go through because of that. But all I remember is, is seeing the earth from above and being out of my body in total peace. I wasn't cold. I wasn't afraid. I was just at a marvel of looking at all this. And then when I came back too, there's my mom looking through the window crying.

• 1:08:24Shawn Ryan?

  What about the, what was the other one? You had too much medication for the Crohn's disease?

• 1:08:29Speaker 03

  Well, I'll tell you what they did. And this is in the book. There's a whole lot in this book I've not covered. I've glossed over.

• 1:08:39Speaker 03

  Along about 2004, my Crohn's was so bad. I mean, it was in bad shape. And I was in such depression because I had lost $19 million in savings and net worth. Gone. I sold every apartment building or house I had, rentals. Had a lot of them, just to pay interest. And we sold the business to a really big builder from North Carolina. Builds 1,500 homes a year. And my doctor is treating me. He's like, you know, he would just hug me and cry with me. As we'd been friends forever.

• 1:09:23Speaker 03

  He said, I'm sorry for getting emotional here. Thinking back is hard. Today, it's wonderful and joyful. It's a different world today, but those old memories are tough. But he said, look, there's a new study out. There's this antidepressant medicine called Paxil that's supposed to show help for Crohn's because stomach problems are exacerbated from stress. The more you worry, the worse it gets. And I was so bad that my whole inside was inflamed and was very painful. And so he puts me on Paxil.

• 1:10:04Speaker 03

  And he tells me I should probably have somebody to talk to. So he sends me to a psychiatrist, right? Never thought about anything like that. And I was embarrassed to go, but he convinced me, you need to do this. So I go to this psychiatrist. And I thought it was odd when I walked into his room. He was smoking a cigarette and laughing and talking to me. And he only spent five minutes with me. He looks at my paperwork and what the doctor prescribed. And he said, oh, you're on all the wrong stuff. He didn't take me off that. He added more to it. He just added a couple of prescriptions that said, take this and come back in five days or, you know, next week or seven days. Every week, I had to go back once a week.

• 1:10:47Speaker 03

  And within sixty days, I didn't know who I was. And I had gone into, uh, I was unconscious. And what he did, he had put me on something called lithium. I didn't know what it was. I didn't know even what the scribble was. He didn't tell me that's what it was. He just wrote these prescriptions. And the thing, when you take that, you're supposed to test your liver for metals. And all your system, your organs can fail because of toxic metal poisoning. Well, that's what happened to me. I woke up in the hospital. I was laying on a stretcher, completely covered from head to toe.

• 1:11:29Speaker 03

  And I come up out of my body and I was at the ceiling and I could see down my wife, sitting there. Three doctors walked into the room and she was crying. And I never forget, I heard the doctor's name, which I won't say it now because of his privacy. But the guy said, "Good evening, doctor. This is the one hundred and thirteenth patient that this physician has injured or put in the hospital." Come to find out, the guy that was treating me had gone off the deep end and was taking his, taking medication himself. I don't know what he was taking, but he overdosed and died while I was in the hospital.

• 1:12:09Speaker 03

  He'd put one hundred and thirteen patients of his in the hospital and overdosed and died. This happened, this is in the book. And, you know, wow. It's like getting shot. I didn't want that, I didn't ask for it, it just happened. And now here it is, somebody else is, is poisoning me. Or it was always, it just seems like everything that's happened to me has been out of my hands. I mean, there's a lot in this book that I've been through from third degree burns, catching on fire when I was two years old. I had big scars up my legs. So a brand new Trans Ammon seventy-nine blew up. Two thousand miles in the radiator, it overheated and radiator exploded

• 1:12:53Speaker 03

  and put, put me in the hospital with third degree burns from my neck out to this arm. I had skin grafts.

• 1:13:01Speaker 03

  I brand new car. So I thought all my life, something's trying to keep me from being here or keep me from doing something one day.

• 1:13:10Shawn Ryan?

  So the near-death experience was you witnessing the conversation between the doctor and your wife?

• 1:13:16Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:13:17Shawn Ryan?

  Anything else?

• 1:13:18Speaker 03

  That's all I remember. It was, uh...

• 1:13:21Shawn Ryan?

  And then you're back in your body?

• 1:13:22Speaker 03

  I'm back in my body and miserable now, you know? Recovering and... Yeah.

• 1:13:30Shawn Ryan?

  All right, Chris, well, let's, let's take a, uh, let's take a quick break.

• 1:13:34Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:13:34Shawn Ryan?

  And then we'll move on to what happened afterwards.

• 1:13:36Speaker 03

  Okay. Uh, yeah.

• 1:13:51Shawn Ryan?

  All right, Chris, we just, uh, went into the event.

• 1:13:54Speaker 03

  Right.

• 1:13:54Shawn Ryan?

  And what happened there? Thank you for the very descriptive event. I was hoping, well, I guess I shouldn't say I was hoping. I was wondering if anything had happened in those near-death experiences that might relate to this, but it doesn't sound like there was really anything that related to this.

• 1:14:11Speaker 03

  It all relates.

• 1:14:12Shawn Ryan?

  It does?

• 1:14:13Speaker 03

  Yes. It all relates to it. In fact, I believe that, um, when I was 10 years old, when that happened to me, it was so traumatic. You know, I grew up with a gun in my hand, five years old.

• 1:14:29Speaker 03

  Um, you know, it's just part of being where I was raised, you know? 10 years old, I'm carrying a gun and got shot. So my whole life changed to, um...

• 1:14:43Speaker 03

  to a different perspective. And I didn't realize it until this event happened in 2007. But I can look back, and I write about this in the book, a lot of things.

• 1:14:59Speaker 03

  In other words, I began to see, after this doctor poisoned me the second time, the weirdest thing happened. My family, all of them can tell you. I would be sitting in my kitchen... And this is after, right after the thing in the hospital. I was seeing things that my family couldn't see in my house. And I'd tell them, and they thought I was going nuts. They thought I was still on drugs, but I had completely gotten off all that. And I'm, as I'm, and it took a long time to get back to where I felt halfway normal. But I could see things.

• 1:15:42Shawn Ryan?

  What things?

• 1:15:43Speaker 03

  Well, I could see this little being in the house. He'd walk by, and I'd tell them, and they were filming me, and they couldn't see it. So I know it opened something up on me.

• 1:15:53Shawn Ryan?

  Who was filming?

• 1:15:55Speaker 03

  My wife and kids would film me talking about what I'd see in the house. This, this little being, it would be about this tall, looked like Gazoo, you might say, from Fred Flintstone, just, he could hover in the house. And I began to wonder, am I going crazy? Am I seeing things?

• 1:16:13Shawn Ryan?

  Did it look human?

• 1:16:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, it sure did.

• 1:16:16Shawn Ryan?

  Did you interact with it?

• 1:16:18Speaker 03

  I did, I'd be talking to it.

• 1:16:20Shawn Ryan?

  What would you talk about?

• 1:16:21Speaker 03

  It was named Johnny, is what I called it. My kids would say, they would laugh, they thought I was completely, that I'd just come out of the hospital too, and I was heavily medicated. But I knew that opened me up to the spiritual world, to the, to the other side.

• 1:16:39Shawn Ryan?

  What would you interact with the being about?

• 1:16:43Speaker 03

  We'd have conversations. He was always watching over me, protecting me. And my wife's like, who are you talking to? And I'd say...

• 1:16:54Shawn Ryan?

  Do you remember any of the conversations specifically? Are there any conversations that stick out?

• 1:17:00Speaker 03

  Not in detail, other than it, I knew it was there watching over me. It wasn't a scary thing, it wasn't like it was there to harm anybody. It was there to, to get me through what had just happened. It was protecting me.

• 1:17:18Shawn Ryan?

  What would the conversations be about?

• 1:17:22Speaker 03

  It was always positive about healing and reinforcement that I was gonna be alright. Because I'd just come through near death.

• 1:17:35Speaker 03

  And that eventually faded away after a few months and I stopped seeing it. But it was always there and it was very real to me. And it later showed up after the 2007 incident. This was in 04 and 05. In 07, when this thing happened. And I'll tell you something else too. This was really weird. In 05, we were forced to move because we'd sold out and lost everything. Moving from a big house to a mobile home.

• 1:18:09Speaker 03

  We were having Thanksgiving dinner at my mom's. We built the new house, or the mobile home. We restored it. It was an old one I had as a rental property. I moved it on their lot next door, out in the country, beside mom and dad. It was Thanksgiving Day night and our whole family was there. From sisters to everybody, right? And I guess it was 9 o'clock at night, 9:30. A couple of the guys smoking went outside to smoke. And eventually I went outside to conversate. And we looked right over to where we were gonna set the mobile home.

• 1:18:50Speaker 03

  Before we even put it there, there is a football field long glowing cigar, maybe 200 feet above the lot, right over top of the trees. And it was barely moving. And my kids, myself, my mother, all of us watched it. You could walk beside it, it was so slow, no sound. And it really didn't register with me at that time. But that was before the river event.

• 1:19:20Shawn Ryan?

  So with the being, how would it converse back with you?

• 1:19:24Speaker 03

  It's, well, the first couple of times was I could hear it audible speaking, but it didn't move its mouth. It's like you could hear it.

• 1:19:33Shawn Ryan?

  Was it English?

• 1:19:35Speaker 03

  Yeah. Very deep voice, very loud. But now, today, it's more telepathic. It's images, it's...

• 1:19:45Speaker 03

  And we've proven that, that on television, on the History Channel, that's my brain is communicating with this phenomenon.

• 1:19:54Shawn Ryan?

  Would, could you be a little more descriptive of what the being looked like?

• 1:20:00Speaker 03

  Um, uh, yeah, it looked like a, like a four-year-old child.

• 1:20:05Shawn Ryan?

  A four-year-old?

• 1:20:06Speaker 03

  Four-year-old, about like a three, four-year-old, a little toddler. Uh, not much more than, um, three feet tall. Glowing softly like the color of the moon with these, uh, red eyes. And it had a triangle shape underneath it. It was glowing, gleaming from head to toe. It had this triangle on its chest, right here. And that turned out to be a pretty big symbol for some people in the government.

• 1:20:38Shawn Ryan?

  What, what is that symbol?

• 1:20:40Speaker 03

  Well, there's one right here from NASA. That's the triangle on that pin. Wonder how it got that.

• 1:20:47Speaker 03

  They were the first ones to come wanting to know about that little being with the triangle on its chest.

• 1:20:52Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting.

• 1:20:52Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:20:53Shawn Ryan?

  Did it wear clothing?

• 1:20:55Speaker 03

  It was gleaming so bright. It had something on, but it looked like the outer layer of it was just glossy, gleaming, brilliant. And there's a, there's a description that Daniel gave in chapter 10 in the Bible, where he describes an angelic being that his encounter. And he says that it was, its body was gleaming like topaz, and it had torches fire, red glowing eyes. This is Daniel's description, straight out of the Bible. And it was given to me by scholars to read.

• 1:21:33Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting.

• 1:21:34Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:21:34Shawn Ryan?

  Interesting. How many times, I mean, man, I've got a lot of questions. How many interactions a day?

• 1:21:46Shawn Ryan?

  Would you have with this?

• 1:21:48Speaker 03

  Well, I would say today is more than ever. Today it's gotten to where, um, let's say at that time back then, after it happened, after the initial counter and all my kids come home. And I'm being told not to talk about it because it was scary and it was, they had my wife believing it's demonic and for a long time, which is understandable when you're raised in the church. You know, they all say this is demonic. Well, they don't know. They have no clue. Nobody does. I'm telling you, not even the Pope, they don't know. Everybody imagines what's out there, speculates.

• 1:22:31Speaker 03

  But till you see it and you interact with it, you're speculating, you're questioning. But it immediately followed me home and these orbs would appear, a ball of light flash. And out steps these shadowy figures and they would walk through the house and walk through walls. It looked like a human, same size and all.

• 1:22:57Shawn Ryan?

  This is, this is before?

• 1:23:00Speaker 03

  No, this is right after the event, 2007.

• 1:23:03Shawn Ryan?

  Let's try to just, let's just keep it before the event for right now.

• 1:23:07Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:23:08Shawn Ryan?

  And so, did it have hair?

• 1:23:13Speaker 03

  I didn't see any hair. It just, there's just so much gleaming there, it's hard to get the detail, the brightness of this thing standing four feet away. I could see its eyes, because they were red, right, and they were glowing and this triangle shape. I actually drew it and painted it in 2009. But they're, they're, um, did this little glowing, glowing little entities.

• 1:23:43Shawn Ryan?

  And these are the same type of eyes that you saw at the river?

• 1:23:47Speaker 03

  Yes, yes.

• 1:23:50Speaker 03

  What my son described. Now, the being that I was telling you about when I come out of the hospital for a few months there, I kept seeing this little being. It didn't have red eyes. It looked like a person, a little, small person, but it floated about.

• 1:24:05Shawn Ryan?

  Okay, that's what I was referencing. So Johnny?

• 1:24:09Speaker 03

  Johnny, he looked like a little person, just a little.

• 1:24:13Shawn Ryan?

  And he had a triangle?

• 1:24:14Speaker 03

  No, the one in the river that scared Chris Jr. In 2007, the one that night that I saw, didn't look like Johnny. Johnny looked, just looked like a, just glowing, so bright that the detail is hard to.

• 1:24:35Shawn Ryan?

  Still, I'm talking about Johnny.

• 1:24:37Speaker 03

  Right.

• 1:24:39Shawn Ryan?

  Johnny, so Johnny was not glowing?

• 1:24:42Speaker 03

  Nope, it looked like a little, a small person, but it didn't look.

• 1:24:46Shawn Ryan?

  Could you differentiate between a regular three-year-old, four-year-old child and this?

• 1:24:53Speaker 03

  Yes, because it seemed to be grown or an adult, but small. It spoke like an adult, it interacted with me like an adult. But that didn't last long. This is after all this medication a daughter put me on.

• 1:25:09Shawn Ryan?

  So what, what did you think that was?

• 1:25:13Speaker 03

  I thought it was a guardian angel.

• 1:25:15Shawn Ryan?

  Right away, you thought it was a guardian angel? And the entire family said that it was demonic?

• 1:25:21Speaker 03

  Not then. They didn't say anything, they just were listening and filming. This was in '05.

• 1:25:28Shawn Ryan?

  What were they filming?

• 1:25:30Speaker 03

  Me, they were recording.

• 1:25:31Shawn Ryan?

  Interacting with?

• 1:25:32Speaker 03

  Interacting, yeah.

• 1:25:33Shawn Ryan?

  So, can I have access to any of that film?

• 1:25:36Speaker 03

  I'd have to get my wife to dig it up, but she has, she has a lot of stuff she recorded, all my kids after the event on the river.

• 1:25:46Shawn Ryan?

  So what does that, what do those films look like? Does that look like you interacting with thin air?

• 1:25:51Speaker 03

  Well, yes, probably some of them, yeah, I'm sure.

• 1:25:55Shawn Ryan?

  I would love to get some of that footage if possible and.

• 1:25:59Speaker 03

  I will see.

• 1:26:00Shawn Ryan?

  Insert it.

• 1:26:01Speaker 03

  I'll see if she can do that.

• 1:26:03Shawn Ryan?

  How many?

• 1:26:06Shawn Ryan?

  Ryan, sorry, you're in the, you're now on the Sean Ryan Show. (laughing) Have you seen these films?

• 1:26:13Speaker 04

  Well, I was there.

• 1:26:14Shawn Ryan?

  What, I mean, what did it look like? What does it look like to see your dad interacting with thinner?

• 1:26:22Speaker 04

  I was ten years old, so I understood it the way that my mother explained it to me, which was that he was, you know, going off the deep end. So I, we just thought it was funny, like, oh, he's on medicine, he's

• 1:26:34Speaker 03

  Hallucinating.

• 1:26:35Speaker 04

  imaginary friend. And we, I don't know, I mean, I, you can't really understand what's happening when you're ten, so I just kind of laughed, you know?

• 1:26:43Speaker 03

  They all thought I was nuts, and rightly, I had been over-medicated and still, but that medication opened me up to something that two years later came out of the sky and took me.

• 1:26:58Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh, we'll get there.

• 1:27:00Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:27:01Shawn Ryan?

  What about this being made you think that it was a guardian angel and that it had your best, best interest?

• 1:27:12Speaker 03

  The way it was talking to me, it was there, it'd tell me, it was there to protect me, it was watching over me and that I was gonna be fine. Because, you know, I'd just come through a hard time and life, and I'm still sick, I'm still with Crohn's, I'm still really bad shape, and, uh, and then you got shot with, basically, it's like, shot with a gun with this medication, and I'm still sick, and now I've got this to deal with, and, yeah.

• 1:27:44Shawn Ryan?

  Did you ever try to make contact, like physically touch?

• 1:27:49Speaker 03

  I never did.

• 1:27:50Shawn Ryan?

  You never did.

• 1:27:50Speaker 03

  Because it would be brief, it would appear, and it won't be there long, it would be there, you know, just a little bit, a few seconds or long enough to maybe, maybe a minute, and then it was gone, it would just vanish in front of me. And they all thought, and rightly so, that I had lost my mind.

• 1:28:08Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 1:28:09Speaker 03

  Now this just didn't happen. And this exacerbated the 2007. Two years later, when I come home talking about it, my wife's like, he's still lost it. He's not, he's going crazy. And the whole community said, he's crazy. And then, when everybody started experiencing it with me and the family, now it's demonic. It's really happening to this guy. But he's bringing the devil into his house. This is where it ended up.

• 1:28:40Shawn Ryan?

  When did it disappear for good? Before the incident?

• 1:28:45Speaker 03

  Within six months, maybe.

• 1:28:49Speaker 03

  Late 2005, I'd say, is when it ended. I didn't see it anymore. And then a year later, remember, I'm on the river. And that's when it come out of the sky. And that's when it healed me and said, we're not here to hurt you. We're here to help you.

• 1:29:06Shawn Ryan?

  Did you respond to that?

• 1:29:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:29:08Shawn Ryan?

  What did you say?

• 1:29:10Speaker 03

  Well, I didn't really speak, other than I surrender. I'm sorry, I don't mean you any harm. And it's telling me this in my head. And I felt this greatest joy and a sense of relief that I understood now. The more fear. And that's why immediately when I reported it, I knew it was these same angelic beings. But it didn't look like this little being I'd seen two years prior. But I related it all in the same thing. You know, there's a lot of different things that can appear around you. It can appear any way it wants to.

• 1:29:51Shawn Ryan?

  So after the incident, when you described this to your family? Did they put two and two together that this has happened? Not this exact thing, but he's

• 1:30:05Speaker 03

  Well, yeah.

• 1:30:06Shawn Ryan?

  That you had been in contact with some type of being before?

• 1:30:10Speaker 03

  Well, yeah, they thought I was, first off, they didn't want to believe me.

• 1:30:14Shawn Ryan?

  And now you have another family member, your son, who also experienced it.

• 1:30:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's corroborating it. And they still tried to think this can't be true, it just can't be true. And that's what was making me so emotional about Chris Junior. He struggled so hard and he comes home telling what he saw and nobody wanted to believe him. They're just like, he's crazy like his dad. Like, yeah, I run an eighteen million dollar, twenty million dollar a year company. And I went through a terrible time with sickness and a doctor. And I come out the other side and now I'm crazy, right? This guy's crazy. And so the whole community, basically, started mocking my family.

• 1:31:03Speaker 03

  And this is after the oh seven incident. And it turned into five years of what I call in the book, five years of darkness from twenty seven to twenty twelve. And when that twenty twelve came, everything changed.

• 1:31:21Shawn Ryan?

  Who, who did you contact about this incident with afterwards?

• 1:31:27Speaker 03

  Well, I didn't for the first ten months because of me when I came home. And I was told this immediately. My wife trying to keep peace in the family and her little whole world right now. Chris has come home telling this big tale and got Junior telling it with him. And, and nobody wanted to believe it. My dad made fun, he must be on drugs, still on drugs, you know? And I was only on medication and the doctor gave me, um, won't drink and alcohol, none of that. And here, um, everybody started that. And then within a few months or weeks.

• 1:32:10Speaker 03

  My wife would take the kids out to see her mom or go to church. I wasn't going to church anymore. I'm at home in my study in complete depression because nobody did believe me, what happened. And now, nobody's believing my son. Pushed us away from the church. But she would be in town coming home and kids running the door. Oh, my God, Dad, you won't believe what we saw on the way home. There was a big triangle thing in front of the car, flying right down in front of us, you know, following us home. So now my kids are coming home and I just sat back and I'd smile. Thank you. Thank you, Lord. Because I was praying every day. Lord, let my family, let my children experience what I did so at least they would believe me.

• 1:32:54Speaker 03

  And I'll never forget, and I'll tell you in a minute, what my wife said when the first investigator come.

• 1:33:03Shawn Ryan?

  Who, who did you call?

• 1:33:07Speaker 03

  In October, this was in January when it happened. Ten months later, October, I saw on the television a show called UFO Files. And there was this Stanton Freeman, a physicist on there, and he's talking about UFOs. I'd never seen any of those shows. And it come across, "Report your sighting to MUFON." So I quickly got their email address and I wrote them.

• 1:33:38Shawn Ryan?

  What does MUFON stand for?

• 1:33:39Speaker 03

  It's a mutual UFO network. It's where, it's a data, it's an investigation

• 1:33:45Shawn Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:33:45Speaker 03

  thing that people report sightings to. And a pretty big outfit, international, right? So that's the go-to. If you have a sighting, you go to MUFON. I'd never heard of it until I saw it on TV. So I made the report. And I was so afraid to send it that I didn't send it for two weeks because I just knew if I did, I'd lose my family. Because I was told never to talk about it again. Well, I didn't know what happened to me for two, for four hours. If I tried to think about it, I'd, I would pass out. My family would see it. If you started questioning me and I tried to think, I'd pass out. And so I sent it two weeks later. It was the 13th of October.

• 1:34:30Speaker 03

  And immediately they wrote me back, "Oh, we want to talk to you." Well, I got scared. I said, "Nah, this is too real now. I don't want to lose my family." So I told them, "No, I just wanted to report it, but I don't want to interview." January comes along, they write me again. "We're going to close the case, but we really want to talk to you." By then, it's been a year now. I'm, I can't, I can't function. My head had some kind of block and, and I couldn't think at all.

• 1:35:03Speaker 03

  And so I said, "Okay." And in February, they sent some, a guy from, a local investigator from Raleigh, North Carolina. And he came in there. And that's when my wife said, "You ever heard of, what do you know about shadow beings?"

• 1:35:21Speaker 03

  And, um, now, we'd never talked about the UFO thing, but she'd been seeing these in the house. And I got shoved a couple of times, just to get her attention. I was praying every day, "Lord, let her see it." And she looked at me and said, "Don't ever pray for me like that again." So, but it was in the house. It was interacting with the kids, orbs over the house, outside. But I could never share it with anyone except my immediate family.

• 1:35:50Shawn Ryan?

  So at this point, the entire family is witnessing this?

• 1:35:53Speaker 03

  My whole family, my three, four children, my daughter, she was 10 years old then. Ryan was 13. Jeremy, he was 15. Chris Junior was 17. And Emily, she's the only girl, she's the baby. And now they're being told by the church, "Your dad is, is dealing with demons." Well, and, and they didn't want to believe it because they were seeing it with me. So it was, it was a horrible place to be when the whole community come down on us there. And it continued for five years. But what happened was...

• 1:36:37Speaker 03

  The community didn't let up. The church didn't let up. And I don't mean just my wife's side, but all the churches around, even the original ones, the people were talking. And the boys that were with me, their children were catching a fit.

• 1:36:53Speaker 03

  Let me back up. In 2007, I reported it. 2008, the investigator come. And immediately, they saw me on doing a show on Discovery Channel. You gotta do it. We'll vindicate you. You do this show, everybody will believe you. So I agreed to it. I had to beg Junior to take, participate. Well, they did their show. And immediately, they set me up. They set me up to... They were coming to my house to do an interview and called me. Can you come to the hotel and sign all the paperwork? And then we're gonna go from there. Well, when I got in that hotel, they had a guy from the FBI there with a lie detector thing set up and cameras pointing at it completely.

• 1:37:37Speaker 03

  I did 34 questions for two hours. They just over and over and over. And then on the show, they called me. They said he was lying about seeing an entity.

• 1:37:48Speaker 03

  Now, things got really bad. The whole community. And now the school, my children's school. They're being made fun of. Their dad's crazy. They're laughing at my kids. It nearly ruined my voice. They were all, you know, thinking girls, dating. Now, everybody's laughing at them in the hallways, calling them out in the school class and making them tell the stories. And so, five years goes by of that, of pure nightmare. But NASA shows up. A friend from NASA, Dr. Hal Pogden Meyer.

• 1:38:25Shawn Ryan?

  A friend?

• 1:38:26Speaker 03

  Well, he's a friend. He's like a... He wasn't a friend then, no. I didn't know him. In fact, my son Ryan calls me, Dad, there's somebody here from NASA. He wants to talk to you. I said, well, tell them to stick around. I'll be home by the hour. Six foot five, huge man. We were afraid of the government so bad because MUFON and the UFO world said the men in black was on TV then. They'll kill you. The government will kill you. Don't ever talk to, you know, different ones. The names they would use. And so now we're terrified. The government's knocking on our door. He comes in and

• 1:39:09Speaker 03

  he became a father figure to my children. And he died in 2019. He'd been to my daughters and my children's birthdays. He would come from Cape Canaveral all the way down to the piano recitals, to graduations, to birthdays. And we've become best friends. And they studied me. And about 2012, 13, another guy comes for me.

• 1:39:35Shawn Ryan?

  What was the initial guy's name?

• 1:39:37Speaker 03

  Dr. Hal Povendmeyer. He was at NASA 59 years when he died.

• 1:39:44Shawn Ryan?

  What were they studying?

• 1:39:46Speaker 03

  First off, he wanted to know about that little glowing being with the triangle on his chest. And he first, when he first came, his mission, he told us, my mission was to debunk you. So he came and initially met us, then he left on his own. And we didn't know where he went back home, but he didn't. He was searching records from the sheriff's department to the FAA, to knocking on every door in that community out there, asking, did you see something? And he found out that eight other people that night all witnessed it fly over their houses and stuff. One guy was 70 years old, sitting on his front porch, and it went 20 feet over his house. And so Hal knew then that this was real.

• 1:40:31Speaker 03

  And he became like a father figure. He would come and entertain my kids more than he would me, because they were, he's just that kind of guy. And so.

• 1:40:49Speaker 03

  All throughout the five years after an event happened, Hal was the one there. There were other military people calling from the Air Force, sending letters, wanting me to interview, wanting me to draw pictures and all this stuff. And I would just stay away from it. I was still scared of Hal. I didn't know who this guy was yet. It was just five years into it. But we loved, my kids loved him, but I'm still, you know, who he is. And so in 2012, at Easter of 2012, this is when everything changed. This is really what got the US government knocking on my door.

• 1:41:34Speaker 03

  This is where, why I'm here today. 2012, Saturday night, Easter. Sunday morning's Easter, right? At 3 o'clock in the morning. So it's actually Easter Sunday morning. 3 o'clock in the morning. I'm asleep in the bed, dead asleep. That night before, I'd had all I could stand. Seeing my kids coming home crying and the whole community making fun of the family and my dad. Now, they've been experiencing this stuff. They know it's happening. But they couldn't contest adults, right? They went tall back, knew better. But it was, it really, my little girl coming home crying

• 1:42:18Speaker 03

  from people picking on her. So I walked outside that night. And I remember I had this desire to tell it to everybody. I had to tell it. It's like the Richard Dreyfuss Close Encounters thing. So I walked outside that night at 9:30, and I looked up to the sky. I said, "Thank you for ruining my life. My children."

• 1:42:40Speaker 03

  I said, "Thank you for healing me and proving to my family that you're real, but this life is worse off now for my whole family. I'm better physically, but now my family is in shambles, all because of me." And I shouted it to the heavens, and I see these things, they're coming, you know? These orbs are always around, and I knew it hurt me, I knew it was... So I went to bed. 3 o'clock in the morning, I hear the same voice, the same little being that spoke to me, and she said, "I'm here to help you and not hurt you." I heard that same voice, and it sounded like a man, really deep. And it said, "Arise." That's all I heard, that quick word, "arise."

• 1:43:25Speaker 03

  And it was so deep, it was like thunder in my room. I jumped up from laying in the bed, dead asleep, to sitting up in my bed, and it's dark, I can't see. And it was 3 o'clock on my... Back then, we had a clock, alarm clock, and it said 3 a.m. Next thing I know, I see movement in the room. Whatever they did to me, it caused me to get dressed and fall out the door. Now I'm outside, and I'm walking towards my dog kennel at 3 o'clock in the morning, fully dressed, clothes from being asleep. And suddenly, this figure hands me something.

• 1:44:08Speaker 03

  As far out as this sounds, now I'm telling you, this sounds crazy. It took me two weeks to tell it, because they all labeled me crazy, and I'd stopped talking about it. Now, five years later, it just happens. And what happened was, it handed me this object, and it felt like a living creature, like a squirrel, maybe, or something that size. But I couldn't see or feel legs or a head. It felt just like a tube of furry, and it kind of prickly. And said, and handed it to me and said, "You must keep this." Immediately, I dropped it, because I know what it was, and it was prickly.

• 1:44:51Speaker 03

  And his words came again, "No, you must pick this up. You must keep this." So I reached down to pick it up. When I did, this bean that was standing there is now gone. And I'm at the dog kennel, so I'm juggling it in my hand. I know I need to see what this thing is. It's dark, so I open the kennel and put it in and close the door. And the very second I did that, this blast of air come directed. It wasn't in the woods and around us. It was right straight in front of me. A blast of air hits me and blew me over, the wind. Later on, I understood the Holy Spirit. The word "spirit" means the

• 1:45:33Speaker 03

  wind. The Holy Spirit means the breath of God. So I had to put this in there. But it was the wind. A physical force blew me over. And as I hit backwards on the ground, I saw what appeared to be a translucent cow, a bull, run over me. And I could see stars inside of it, up through it.

• 1:45:56Shawn Ryan?

  That's what they had handed you?

• 1:45:58Speaker 03

  Well, what they handed me, I put in the kennel.

• 1:46:00Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 1:46:01Speaker 03

  When I locked the door, or closed the door, now a blast of air next to the woods hits me. And out of that wind, when the wind hit me and blew me over, with that wind was a translucent cow, or bull, a big one.

• 1:46:14Shawn Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:46:14Speaker 03

  Went over me, and it didn't hurt me. But I could see it clearly. I could see the stars inside. This is really strange, because I just...

• 1:46:25Shawn Ryan?

  It's definitely strange.

• 1:46:27Speaker 03

  I'll get back to this in a minute, right? Of something I just saw, discovered by the guy that studies Egypt, Dr. Robert Grant. He discovered that bull inside the king's chamber. There's never been an inscription in that pyramid nowhere. So he goes in with light on, and there's that bull, celestial bull, with stars inside of it. And I just...

• 1:46:56Speaker 03

  Worked this thing out. He'd seen it. He shared it with me. And when I told him what happened to me, he got some other clues out of that. But it was exactly what I saw. But now, listen, when the bull went over, I land on my back, and I'm getting up to run. So I roll over. Now I'm looking this way. And behind me, there's no cow anymore. There's a woman there. She's about three feet off the ground. She's glowing just as color of the moon. There's a circle of light on the ground. And she looks at me and she says, "You know why I'm here?" And I knew. I was crushed, basically, because I'd had this overwhelming desire

• 1:47:36Speaker 03

  to tell the world what I'd seen. And then that night, I cursed at the heavens and said, "I'm never doing that. I'll never speak again." And now she's like, "You know why I'm here. This is your burden you must bear." She said that. She said, "If you'll tell this story, I'll always be with you. I'll allow you to share our presence with others and film us." So helped me. I never had a picture of anything for the previous five years. Only inside the house would people see this, or out in my children. Now, everybody's coming to the house, and it appears overhead.

• 1:48:17Speaker 03

  It appears around us. And it's greater today than it was then. And magic started happening. And when that word got out, then comes this government. They want to know about this lady.

• 1:48:33Shawn Ryan?

  Let's pause right there. I have questions.

• 1:48:36Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:48:36Shawn Ryan?

  So the initial, what was, what was it that you were handed?

• 1:48:42Speaker 03

  I've been asked that a million times. I don't know. It was like a living creature.

• 1:48:47Shawn Ryan?

  It was living. It was moving around?

• 1:48:49Speaker 03

  It was, but it had no head or legs. It felt like if you had a squirrel in your hand, or a hedgehog, that prickly, it felt like it was living, but it had no head or tail. And I asked the lady what this was, and she told me it was symbolic of humanity. Had lost its direction. Had no head or no tail. It completely lost its direction.

• 1:49:20Speaker 03

  And it vanished.

• 1:49:21Shawn Ryan?

  They're right on the money with that.

• 1:49:23Speaker 03

  Well, exactly. And she told me a lot of stuff that I never revealed to this day. I haven't revealed a whole lot of it because I don't want to sound like a prophet or any of that. I just don't. My goal is to share this story with everyone and share the phenomenon, which I have been able to do.

• 1:49:43Shawn Ryan?

  What did the figure look like that handed you the object?

• 1:49:48Speaker 03

  It was a shadowy being, like a shadow being. So when you see these, you see this shadow of a human figure, but you can't really see the details. It's like a shadow. It's like a ghost, you might say. And I have pictures of, I have pictures of these little beings and they look like ghosts. I have a pitch, I have a video of one of these beings coming out of an orb.

• 1:50:14Speaker 03

  Flash.

• 1:50:15Shawn Ryan?

  Can I see that video?

• 1:50:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, I'll give you one. It's six foot tall, seven foot tall. And when it did that night, a young lady with me was healed from cancer. This happened in 2015. But, um, so.

• 1:50:30Shawn Ryan?

  What did the bull represent, do you think?

• 1:50:32Speaker 03

  I had no clue.

• 1:50:33Shawn Ryan?

  Because you worked with, you worked with Robert Grant?

• 1:50:37Speaker 03

  Robert Grant is who I was with last in, at Contact in the Desert a couple of months back. And Robert was showing the Oculus to me about what he had discovered in the pyramid. So he put these goggles on and he does this light orb. And there, biggest daylight, is a bull on the side of the wall in the king's chamber. You only can see it with this technology has, and the stars are inside. And above it is a helix, a DNA. And then on the sarcophagus in the king's chamber is the Alpha and Omega symbol.

• 1:51:15Shawn Ryan?

  What do you think that represents?

• 1:51:18Speaker 03

  Well, Apokalypta is God, the beginning and the end. The bull is the celestial bull. To me, the lady that came, to me, is the Holy Spirit.

• 1:51:37Speaker 03

  The breath of God, the wind, the Virgin Mary, Hathor, Demeter, Diana, Provolite. In every culture, on every continent, they all have a mother figure, all of them, including the Egyptians. They believed in the Trinity. You read the Egyptian stuff, in the beginning, it was Pitta was the father, Met was the mother, and then they had a change to Ra, and then Hathor, and then Horus. It's just a divine trinity. They have a triad.

• 1:52:16Speaker 03

  And I think that the lady, the women, the feminine, was taken out of the equation by a bunch of men 2,000 years ago, and oppressed all the women, kicked them out, and said, "You can't be in the church. It's only a boys' club, right?" And so, from that point forward, the women have been oppressed. They're made to wear things over their face and head.

• 1:52:47Speaker 03

  Even up in the 60s and 70s, me growing up, there was some great oppression on the women.

• 1:52:54Speaker 03

  But that's my belief, and it doesn't matter. In Christianity or in any religion, none of us really know.

• 1:53:03Shawn Ryan?

  And so, how did the government get involved?

• 1:53:10Shawn Ryan?

  And what is it? Let me rephrase that. What is it that caught the government's attention?

• 1:53:17Speaker 03

  Okay. So now, this happens at Easter of 2012.

• 1:53:24Shawn Ryan?

  Let me, let me ask another quote, I'm sorry.

• 1:53:27Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:53:27Shawn Ryan?

  Do you think there's any significance to this happening on Easter?

• 1:53:30Speaker 03

  A hundred percent.

• 1:53:31Shawn Ryan?

  And what is that?

• 1:53:33Speaker 03

  Well, you tell me what Easter means and...

• 1:53:36Shawn Ryan?

  The resurrection.

• 1:53:37Speaker 03

  Yeah. Every year, every year at Easter, either she comes back or some, something miraculous happens. Every year at Easter.

• 1:53:52Shawn Ryan?

  Every year since 2012?

• 1:53:53Speaker 03

  Every year since then, every year, including this year. And my son Ryan and his wife, and my grandson Teddy. Of course, my wife was a little bit scared, so she turned her head and ran in the house. But we all got to experience it this year at Easter. And exactly when I told them, at 8:30, it's going up here. And we ran to the restaurant to eat, and I'm fussing, we gotta be home, we gotta be home by 8:30. And when we drove up in the yard, it was 8:30. When I opened the door, it appeared behind the car. And here it come, this big glowing, bluish-white ball of light through the forest, going in and out of the trees, it was approaching us. And my wife freaked out and ran in the house.

• 1:54:36Speaker 03

  But it's always something like that miraculous on Easter. And it just feeds more into my understanding of the phenomenon, the whole thing. She's always comes in threes. Not always, but it's overwhelming. Three is very meaningful in this, three. And I thumbed it over and over, three orbs, you know, together. They'll line up like a triangle, they'll fly through the sky in a triangle. I said, "Well, if I didn't, I'll give you a video of that." I have multiple videos of that. It's always showing that symbol of three.

• 1:55:20Shawn Ryan?

  Now, what is it that caught the government's attention?

• 1:55:23Speaker 03

  So, one of the things it did is in October of 2013, I get a call from a professor, a woman, about, she's a religious scholar, very famous. She's written several books, and you'd probably know her if I said her name, Dr. Diana Pasoca. She lived an hour and a half from me, and she was given 2,000 reports by MoveOn to investigate why 2,000 people reported angels, angelic beings, that year.

• 1:56:06Speaker 03

  They were seeing these. Now, you only ever hear about the bad stuff. You only ever hear about somebody being on a table with multiple instruments and all this stuff, abduction, the bad. But overwhelmingly, 95% of all of it, people come away with angelic, their experience is heaven. That's one of the things that you will never hear about. But, October, I walk outside, I was a smoker then. I was watching TV with my wife, I pause the TV at 9:30, I said, "I'm gonna go out and smoke." So I walked out on the back patio, and she comes out a few minutes later,

• 1:56:48Speaker 03

  and out in the back of our property, about 100 yards back, in the dark, all of a sudden, we see sparks come from the ground and go up in the air. And she said, "What's up with that tree?" I said, "I don't know, but I see it." And suddenly, it had rained for two days, the ground was wet. This tree erupts into flames and goes shooting fire 13, 14 feet up in the air. Burnt a hole inside it, it burnt from the inside out. Well, that got the attention of government. And, you know, Hal was there. And now this other player from NASA wants to come see this tree.

• 1:57:29Speaker 03

  And he's codenamed the Dragon. He runs all the launches for NASA. He's the head guy. He's National Reconnaissance Office. So that got me involved with the NRA. Next thing, I'm in Cape Canaveral, sitting with these guys, half a dozen of them. And that expands into a whole lot more. You know, now I'm dealing with two people from NASA. And this gets into medical study, stem cell research. And that happened a year later. And I'll tell you what got me there. Here's really what got the attention of the government. They heard about the tree. They all wanted to come see it.

• 1:58:14Speaker 03

  And they started. But I get a phone call in early 2013, Easter, Easter of 2013. I write about it, the whole experience in my book. I'm, I have experience with the lady. Two weeks later, this journalist comes from Canada, calls me, I want to come see that burning tree. He'd heard about it. He's heading to Florida, so he stops by on the way. I live right along 95. Stays the night, goes Florida, and he comes back, comes again, wants to see more of the tree and get more story. So my kids are all home, it's 5 o'clock in the afternoon, he drives up the driveway.

• 1:58:59Speaker 03

  He pulls up, gets out with his camera, no clothes, no bags, he just gets out, he wants to go see this tree and film it before dark. He's out there at the tree, I'm with him. There's a Labrador, my dog, it's Nellie, a full grown female, lay in there beside us. Everywhere I'd walk, she'd walk. We get back to the house, we stop just short of the door, and Nellie stops, and she's laying there, and Grant and I are talking, you know, just glad to see one another. And I'm like, you want to stay the night? I get the kids to get your bags. And they were all out there, there was six or eight more people outside. He said, "Yeah, that'd be, I'd love that." So he's between me and the back door. The house is open, the back door is open and windows.

• 1:59:44Speaker 03

  It was in May, it was May the 11th or May the 5th. It was only two weeks after Easter. Nellie stands up and starts toward the door when Grant turns. And when she walks by him, I see blood come out of her neck. And it shot way out, like a stream of blood. And I was freaked out and Grant saw it. And she sprayed blood all over his pants when she went by. And she ran in the back door bleeding, bleeding all over the floor. And I ran and tackled her and took her outside and laid her on the concrete. And I was going through my head, "Oh, my God." And Grant's filming this from above and all my kids are gathered around.

• 2:00:25Speaker 03

  And she's got a hole inside of her neck, crossed her jugular vein that long. And I could stick my finger in it that deep and blood just shooting out in her heartbeat. And I had my hand on it, blood coming up through my fingers there. And I knew, I knew she was gonna die. They were 30 minutes from a vet, about in the country. No, couldn't call an ambulance. I went through all this in my head. I said, "She's gonna die." And everybody's freaked out. And I just looked up to the heavens. I said, "Lord, help her."

• 2:01:03Speaker 03

  She went limp.

• 2:01:06Speaker 03

  And so I picked my hand up and that hole was gone. Everybody saw it, disappeared perfectly, like nothing had happened. She stood up, waggled her tail and walked away. He filmed it all. And it didn't take long that word got out. Next thing, I get a call from somebody connected to CIA. And he says, "What are you doing this week? What are you doing tomorrow?" I said, "This is 2014." I says, "July 4th, it's Friday, the day's the 2nd. My kids are coming home from college. We're gonna have a party, you know, for the family." He said, "Well, I need you in DC." I said, "DC?" He said, "Yeah, there's a young boy up there that's really sick."

• 2:01:53Speaker 03

  And they've lost, they've tried everything they can to help him. And there's, he's got to make a wish. In fact, Barack Obama gave him his make a wish. And we have all the photos of him shaking Barack Obama's hand. Michael Morell, Deputy Director of CIA, put him in his book, wrote about him. So you can imagine, this young boy is in the midst of all these power brokers in Washington. And his mom's a doctor, his grandpa's a cardiologist in New York. And they just spelled, they were out of options. And so, I agreed to go.

• 2:02:34Speaker 03

  He flew me up there, picked me up, took me to Arlington, to where they had the Fourth of July parades and all this, flags and stuff. I had no clue who I was meeting, I had no idea of what I was doing. I'd seen a dog miraculously get healed, and I didn't know what happened and how that happened. But these people thought, at least we had tried something UFO guy that healed a dog, to help this child. So I was terrified, I didn't know what to say, I didn't know what to do. I was praying silently while I'm sitting here in front of this little boy. He's got a feeding tube, and they're telling us he's not going to live another year.

• 2:03:19Speaker 03

  And I'm with his mom and dad and him. And I prayed all night, "Lord, help me, what do I do?" So I stayed till 1 o'clock that morning. And this child had mitochondrial DNA disease, meaning he could never eat. If he ate food, he'd throw it up profusely. He couldn't make nutrients from the food, so he was dying. And once they get the feeding tube, it's over. Usually, they're dead right away. And I stayed till 1 o'clock in the morning, and this...

• 2:03:52Speaker 03

  It wasn't an audible voice. It was like this message came, this telepathic knowing. And I said, it said, "Just hug him." So when I went to leave, I reached out and hugged him at 1 o'clock. His mom asked me to stay the night. And I said, "No, I've got a hotel down." And the guy that brought me there, he's reading a book, sitting in the back room. He stayed with me. And 1 o'clock in the morning, his mom calls me and says, "He's eaten, he's eaten second plate." And so... This was the next morning? That night at 1 o'clock. I left at 1:30. His mom called me and said, "He's eaten two plates of food." 30 minutes later? Yeah.

• 2:04:37Speaker 03

  What's this kid's name? Well, to be respectful of the family, I'd rotate that off-camera, right? But his first name's Brandon. Are you still in touch with him? Yeah. He was at my house. I just spent last Memorial Day, Jim from the CIA, the Deputy Director, called me. Brandon's now 21 or 2 years old. And he's going off to exchange school overseas. And he'd never been away from home, right? And they wanted me to be with him before he left. And they told me, "We know you're good for him, to be around him." But let me tell you another one. Now he's 13.

• 2:05:22Speaker 03

  When he turns 13, he's having a bar Mitzvah. First time I've ever been in a Jewish celebration, right? And it was the most amazing thing. This child has given a speech up in this big church in New York City on 48th Madison. We're in a basement, and everybody that's anybody, from the Deputy Director to the Director of Operations to CIA and all in between, were there. A whole lot of important, 200 people at least. My son, Ryan, and they're out dancing on the floor. And he's, you know, and I'm thinking back, all these people at home that's giving me such a hard time.

• 2:06:06Speaker 03

  If I could only tell them what I'm experiencing right now with my family. This is just a moment for me.

• 2:06:13Speaker 03

  Suddenly panic happened. The music quit. And the crowd come off the dance floor. And I'm still sitting at my table with one other person. Everybody's going out dancing. And my wife is sitting at the table behind me. She had gotten up and she's with Debbie, Jim's wife.

• 2:06:31Speaker 03

  Very powerful people.

• 2:06:37Speaker 03

  Crowd got around me so much they're standing over me. And I feel a person grab me on the shoulders and pulled me through the crowd and said, "You gotta help him, you gotta help him." Well, at their table, this elderly man had passed out. Bored. And was totally pale white. I mean, he was ghost white. All these people trying to revive him, trying to wake him up, couldn't do anything. He dragged me through the crowd to him and said, "You gotta save him." And I put a hand on his shoulder and when I did, he went, "Hm." And he stood up, he sat up. And a whole room saw it. And so you can imagine what that did.

• 2:07:21Speaker 03

  And that was way back in 2014. And it has only gotten more involved with government from there, from its senior service members.

• 2:07:34Shawn Ryan?

  Who was that man?

• 2:07:36Speaker 03

  Who was?

• 2:07:37Shawn Ryan?

  The man that you revived?

• 2:07:39Speaker 03

  I knew who he was. He was the father-in-law of one of the people that, the guy that actually took me to DC the first time to help that little boy. We were all invited to the party, right, to his bar mitzvah. And it was his father-in-law that, whatever happened to him, he was totally unconscious there.

• 2:08:04Speaker 03

  And so that set me on a path

• 2:08:09Speaker 03

  that I had no clue I'd be going down. People, you know, suddenly I've got hundreds saying, "I'm sick. Can you help me?"

• 2:08:21Speaker 03

  And that's been the hardest thing for me to try to, to, to help people. And, and because I never intended it to be that way. And I don't know that I can do anything. In fact, I don't do anything. It's, it's something greater than I, and, and it's, I think, it's when I think of the, the divine world, it just comes.

• 2:08:46Speaker 03

  But, you know, there's a whole lot in my book about different ones that have experienced this, from cancers gone to, um,

• 2:08:58Speaker 03

  this is a long list of people that have had blessings from this.

• 2:09:02Shawn Ryan?

  Could you introduce me to one that would be willing to be on the show?

• 2:09:07Speaker 03

  I will try.

• 2:09:10Shawn Ryan?

  How many people have you saved?

• 2:09:12Speaker 03

  Well, I don't know that I've saved anybody. I don't, I don't like to think like that, but there's-

• 2:09:16Shawn Ryan?

  How many people have you been a part of this?

• 2:09:18Speaker 03

  Dozens.

• 2:09:21Speaker 03

  Dozens of people, every day. It's every day I can show you. But now I just, I don't, I just pray for them. Or I just, you know, you, if you know somebody that's sick, they might send me a photo now. And I just take the photo out and I hold it up to the heavens and I ask the angels, God. I never pray to angels. I pray to God. And I ask for this, help for this person. And I get these letters back. I'm, uh, doctor don't know, and it goes for dogs. I had two last month, dogs that, one was 16 years old and total kidney failure. And the doctors are like, "We don't know what happened."

• 2:10:04Speaker 03

  They're, they're putting it in their journals, trying to figure out what happened. He sees back completely functional kidneys and normal.

• 2:10:13Shawn Ryan?

  Are there people out there talking about this?

• 2:10:15Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:10:18Speaker 03

  I've been private, Sean. I haven't shared this. In fact, I hate sharing this publicly because it's going to cause a whole lot more people to come. But it's still part of the story that tells the phenomenon with me, the experience with it. This is why I know it's from the divine world. It's not something with teeth and a ray gun coming here to get us. It's connected to our thoughts. It'll appear a lot when I ask it, and in front of me and you and others. Not every time, but pretty much, pretty much all the time. Sometimes 50, 70 orbs will appear. Sometimes it's a little fire that'll appear right beside me, like a candle. I've seen it.

• 2:11:02Speaker 03

  I'll look over and, oh my God, it's right there, and then it'll shoot off over my head. And a lot of people have seen this. Rock stars, very big rock stars. So, without saying their names, I've been to my house and have witnessed this, up, close and personal.

• 2:11:20Speaker 03

  Senior service members of the DIA, SES-19s, have been to my house with their families and have experienced it. You know, a lot, it's a lot of people that have witnessed it and seen it, still to this day.

• 2:11:43Shawn Ryan?

  How did the government get more involved?

• 2:11:51Speaker 03

  Well, they wanted to study it, right? They wanted to see this for themselves. Because it's the most elusive thing in the world to walk out and look up at the heavens and ask something to come, and all of a sudden hear these lights pop on and they come flying by you.

• 2:12:10Speaker 03

  So, there's a lot of them wanting to see that and study it.

• 2:12:15Shawn Ryan?

  And you allow them to do that?

• 2:12:17Speaker 03

  Yeah. I allow anybody that is... I couldn't allow just anybody because I'd be overrun with people. But the, at my personal house, I've had the heads of the, you know, people from NASA, people from the DIA, the DoD, the CIA. And I had three from Washington there last week, three guys, diplomats.

• 2:12:42Speaker 03

  That have experienced it with me. I was in Washington for fifteen days last month. And I filmed orbs in the daytime. And at night. And with a lot of important people. Really important, you know, and government and stuff. NSA.

• 2:13:02Shawn Ryan?

  Can you name any of these people by name?

• 2:13:05Speaker 03

  I don't have permission, but, you know, Jim Semivan. Everybody would research him. He's in my book. John Alexander. John was with me, 2015. He, in fact, the first chapter of my book, How I Met John, was about the Pope. You know, I'm out by the burning tree. And this lady from Wake Forest University, a scientist, was doing this investigation of this tree. And she has a spirit box, she called it. I'd never heard of such a thing. It makes this noise. And supposedly spirits come through it and talk. Well, she hands it to me. I'm leaning against the tree.

• 2:13:48Speaker 03

  And my wife and my niece and her and her assistant were there looking at me from about ten feet away. And suddenly, this voice comes through that box and said, "Chris, the Pope's in danger. You must help." And it kept saying that. And it kept saying that. And we recorded all this. We recorded 350 audio clips. 350. And multiple voices come in this thing. And they were saying my name. Call me by name. And so I sent that message to the very guy that was involved with the child in the beginning. And it was my contact, right? And he's like, "Oh, my. You need to be here tomorrow, next day."

• 2:14:33Speaker 03

  And so in a couple of days, I was at his house. And when I walked into the door, there was John Alexander. That's when I met him. And immediately, we took a tour of Philadelphia, the Congress Hall. John got me into remote viewing. I started reliving this thing. And I began to give details about this, a couple of terrorists that wanted to explode a bomb on Congress Hall when the Pope was there. And they got the Secret Service involved and they intercepted emails and calls and found this kid and arrested him.

• 2:15:18Speaker 03

  Sure did. And they shut the whole Ben Franklin Bridge down where people would come across. But that was, that's just another notch and that's the first chapter of my book about the Pope. And I've been investigated by them, by the Vatican.

• 2:15:38Shawn Ryan?

  You've been investigated by the Vatican?

• 2:15:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:15:42Shawn Ryan?

  How did that go?

• 2:15:43Speaker 03

  Well, I was very sick at that time, 2017, with Crohn's, I'm not Crohn's, but rheumatoid. It came, it come on me. And I was on all this chemotherapy and these biologics. And so my professor friend, works with the Vatican, got permission to go in the Vatican Archives. Well, my friend from NASA that I was working with, from the NRO, wanted to be a part, so he was allowed to go with her. And the three of them went to the Archives.

• 2:16:22Speaker 03

  And when they, I was there, they were texting me and sending me pictures of angels coming out of orbs that are painted on the wall in the Vatican and a message from the Pope that, he said, "We know that there are angels and that they don't mean you no harm, but if you get too close to them, don't let them get too close because their energy can cause damage to your body." And in fact, we know that Saint Francis of Assisi had an orb get too close to him and zapped him and he died two years later from his wounds. And he's, she said, "We know for sure, in today's lenses, it was rheumatoid arthritis, the same thing you got."

• 2:17:07Speaker 03

  And so there's a lot of, I've got all the photos and stuff of that. You can see, they, they had a ceremony in my honor. They put my picture in the Pope's picture at the entrance of the Vatican Archives. They placed my picture between the books of Galileo and Copernicus in the Archives to be there forever. So there's a whole lot that's going on from every angle throughout those. Very clear.

• 2:17:42Shawn Ryan?

  Man, this is fascinating stuff.

• 2:17:44Speaker 03

  Yeah, so now you know.

• 2:17:47Shawn Ryan?

  Why do you think you are the one?

• 2:17:53Speaker 03

  I've been asked that a million times. And I don't like to think I'm the one or any of that. I'm just a simple guy that had a miraculous experience that continues to this day. And.

• 2:18:12Shawn Ryan?

  With all the government, with all the government contact and studying and the Vatican, had anybody ever given you insight as to whether or not there are more human beings that have had similar experiences to you?

• 2:18:32Speaker 03

  Yeah, and they all relate them back to biblical times. As far as anybody now, I haven't heard, but they probably are. But they always used, you know, Saint Francis or these different people throughout the Bible that had these experiences with orbs. And, you know, the reason NASA wanted to go to be a part of that, getting into Archives, they wanted to study levitating saints. How come it is a person can take off and fly to the village next door? You know, it really happens. People levitate. So there's more to this world than we, we got blind or saw. We're blinded. And, uh, yeah, but we're awakening now.

• 2:19:16Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah, I personally believe that we are the ones that put the limitations on ourselves.

• 2:19:24Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 2:19:24Shawn Ryan?

  Everything.

• 2:19:28Shawn Ryan?

  Maybe possible.

• 2:19:29Speaker 03

  A lot of those writings that got into this more detailed, early on, were deemed dangerous knowledge. So that it was removed from us, understanding all of this stuff. It's kind of like, that was priestly stuff.

• 2:19:48Shawn Ryan?

  Where do you think you were for the hours that you disappeared during the incident? In 2007?

• 2:19:56Speaker 03

  Well, I can tell you, I had no clue until 2008, when MUFON came and did the discovery show. They actually sent a guy from Harvard, trained psychiatrist that does hypnosis. And he hypnotized me first to say, "We're removing this block. And then we're gonna come back next week and find out what happened." So he did the first one. And immediately, I could think about it and not pass out or have a excruciating headache. So what he did work. And then my wife and kids started for the next, it was about two weeks before they came.

• 2:20:38Speaker 03

  They were startled because when I'd go to bed, which always went pretty early, they'd be up till late. I'd be yelling out in my sleep and screaming and talking. And they were in there filming me with cell phones and iPads while I'm doing this, saying stuff. Weird stuff, you know, like seeing beings on Mars and all kinds of weird stuff. So eventually, I began to remember some of what happened, not all. But what I can tell you, the four hours while I was gone was a virtual tour.

• 2:21:19Speaker 03

  I was inside a bubble, something that was solid that I could stand on. But I couldn't see the walls, but I could touch them. But I could see everything in every direction. And there were always three figures behind me that were shadowy, and they were narrating what I was seeing. And I saw North America from way up high. I saw the whole United States. And then I was taken to Egypt. And I saw the pyramids. And this Hathor's temple, I saw that. The spink's facing to the east. And then

• 2:22:03Speaker 03

  the lady comes back. Following year after all this. This was in 2013 is when I really got that message from her. Because this was when I was asked by the Pentagon, by two Air Force generals, to put it in writing what she told me. And I did. And this was on a request from NASA, a friend at NASA. So he come and got it and hand delivered it to these generals. And she told me that, she said that when the star of Regulus, she called it a red star. When you look at it, it looks blue.

• 2:22:45Speaker 03

  But she said, when Regulus is red on the horizon, in front of the gaze of the spink, before daylight. So in other words, when it's sitting right on top of the horizon, before the sun comes up, that that moment would mark a change in humanity's knowledge. And she showed me other things. War, us bombing Iran, us bombing Syria. And in them days, none of that had happened. So I put all that on, on this piece of paper. And now I've had so many write me back, oh, my God. You see, they just bombed Iran, or Iran just bombed us, you know? You were right the whole time.

• 2:23:30Speaker 03

  And I did that in 2012. And so what they did was, I gave them the date of 2026. Because they took that, that celestial event and ran it through these machines that showed that exact alignment will happen in 2026, at Easter.

• 2:23:50Shawn Ryan?

  What will happen?

• 2:23:51Speaker 03

  The star will, the alignment she told me about, that the star of Regulus would be on the horizon in front of the Spinks. At that moment, there'd be a new knowledge. Well, I had no idea if this was even possible, you know? But these astronomers run it through the machines and it comes out that that star is gonna come up on the horizon in Easter of 2026. And from that point forward, they started remote viewing this date, government did. And now you hear it all over TV. 2026, that's the big date. 2027, that year, something's gonna happen. Armageddon, you hear it all over, you know? You hear it on TV.

• 2:24:34Speaker 03

  If you, if you study, like, um, I've heard even, well, I won't say names, but...

• 2:24:42Shawn Ryan?

  Please do.

• 2:24:45Speaker 03

  Well, you know Lou Elizondo, right? Lou's mentioned that date. A lot of people have.

• 2:24:50Shawn Ryan?

  Easter of 2026.

• 2:24:51Speaker 03

  About the year 2026. I gave him the specific time.

• 2:24:57Speaker 03

  And it was with Robert Grant that I told him about this alignment and all. And then he's like, oh my God. He's been looking for this ruby. This little ruby you have to find and place it between the paws of Spinks to make this event that he knows is gonna happen in 2026. I said, Robert, it's not a ruby. It's the star of Regulus. And he looks, he's like, oh my God, that's, it's the King's stone.

• 2:25:28Speaker 03

  So what's gonna happen? I don't know. But I think it's possible that's the,

• 2:25:36Speaker 03

  that's the return of...

• 2:25:40Shawn Ryan?

  Christ.

• 2:25:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:25:43Speaker 03

  Or the lady and the whole heavenly host living with us, Jesus. That's the first time I've ever said that in my life publicly.

• 2:25:57Speaker 03

  You're the first. And a million people's asked me this. I think it's entirely possible that, uh... Because she told me. She told me that. She told me that when the suffering of a man comes, becomes too great, that they're gonna stop it. And they're gonna snuff out the darkness. That's why the military and the government all wanna know about this. Because they know it's real. They know this lady has been seen a million times. And when she comes, she's always warning of some big catastrophe. In the Native American world, they call her the White Buffalo Calf Lady.

• 2:26:42Speaker 03

  And she would come warning about, you know, some tribe coming to kill everybody or some big event. It's in every culture that way. But I'm as, you know... I wish I knew more.

• 2:27:00Shawn Ryan?

  What else do you know?

• 2:27:06Speaker 03

  I just, uh... I think we're living in the worst, the worst possible times right now. That, uh, if we don't make some changes, there, there's gonna be some major disasters about to happen. And it's man-made. It's not solar flare. It's not any of that. It's, it's, uh, it's a dark force. Because she told me. Well, I'll tell you what she told me. This is what I put in writing part of it. She says, "There are people in power." I put this in writing in 2012. She said, "There are people in power."

• 2:27:51Speaker 03

  And I'm not gonna say where she focused my thoughts on that, but there's script in the Book of Revelation to bring about Armageddon and the end of the world.

• 2:28:04Speaker 03

  They're doing it intentionally, and that's what she told me. And that's the very thing, the main meat of the whole message I sent to these generals. So it makes sense, right?

• 2:28:19Shawn Ryan?

  Who is "they"?

• 2:28:21Speaker 03

  I don't know who they are. I think they're Satanists. I think they're people that worship the dark force, that don't care for humanity and human life. In fact, they're the total opposite of, you know, they worship the devil. Or the, I don't know if there is a devil. I think it's a, it's a, it's a very dark force that is living, full of dark entities that feed on you parasitically. Like, they'd be non-physical. They, they shape-shift. They take your mind over. They make you do crazy things. They deceive you.

• 2:29:06Speaker 03

  Make you kill somebody, go crazy. Where the, the, the angelic world or the physical beings, they can come in here and light, these beings are made of light. The dark force is a parasitic race. And whoever's aligned with that is, according to the mother, the lady, is scripted in the book of Revelation. They didn't want it to happen.

• 2:29:39Shawn Ryan?

  Why did they want it to happen?

• 2:29:41Speaker 03

  I think it's the dark force. I think that they want to snuff out God. They don't want us to have God in our heart. Why do you think they did evolution? That's the biggest, dumbest thing I ever heard in my life. That, that, that every living thing come from a mud puddle, and it can't happen. It's just not possible. That's just, it's a laugh. It's a joke.

• 2:30:04Shawn Ryan?

  You know what I find interesting is, from the very beginning, when you saw the being that, that your family, and initially you, if I remember correctly, thought was just a medication. You...

• 2:30:23Shawn Ryan?

  I had some type of an intuition from the very get-go that this was a guardian angel of some type.

• 2:30:29Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 2:30:30Shawn Ryan?

  And it's natural, it has progressed.

• 2:30:34Speaker 03

  I knew I had one when I was 10. I just knew it. I knew something saved me. Because the doctor's like, "You shouldn't have lived through this." If I showed you the hole in my back and it led in front of me right here, you would be like, "How did this happen?" It was that close to my spinal column. And I'm leaning over a bit, it's that close to the back of my head and then directly in line with my heart.

• 2:31:01Speaker 03

  And I knew, I knew the doctor told me, "You're the luckiest guy in the world." And all I could think then was, it wasn't luck. It was something protecting me.

• 2:31:14Speaker 03

  In fact, in my regression, 2008,

• 2:31:20Speaker 03

  if you heard the regression, I said, "They said, 'We were with you when you were 10 years old, and we'll be with you right on.'"

• 2:31:29Shawn Ryan?

  You know what else I find interesting?

• 2:31:40Shawn Ryan?

  You are the only one,

• 2:31:44Shawn Ryan?

  to my knowledge, that I've spoken to on this subject, on the UFO subject, that believes in Jesus Christ.

• 2:31:52Speaker 03

  I do wholeheartedly. More today than I ever did.

• 2:31:56Shawn Ryan?

  That openly talks about it.

• 2:31:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:32:02Speaker 03

  More today than I ever. And that's been a problem of censorship and kind of putting me on the back burner and keeping me at bay publicly.

• 2:32:13Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:32:14Speaker 03

  It really has.

• 2:32:17Shawn Ryan?

  I'm not surprised. I'm not surprised when that-

• 2:32:21Speaker 03

  But I'd never told this message about what you just, we just talked about, until now, because now I think it's the time to tell it.

• 2:32:32Speaker 03

  12 years, 13 years, I've kept it secret.

• 2:32:38Speaker 03

  Only my family knew.

• 2:32:43Shawn Ryan?

  What do you think that day is gonna look like? If you thought you had to...

• 2:32:47Speaker 03

  It says in Michael, "In that glorious and beautiful day,

• 2:32:54Speaker 03

  he's coming back to save us all."

• 2:33:00Shawn Ryan?

  Do you look forward?

• 2:33:01Speaker 03

  To that day, absolutely.

• 2:33:03Shawn Ryan?

  Do you have any fear about that day?

• 2:33:04Speaker 03

  I fear my children and these crazy people that just can't get a hold of their... whatever they're doing. I'm sixty, almost sixty-three years old. I've been through eleven or twelve presidents. And people my age, and your age, but especially my age, everything's happening now is completely

• 2:33:27Speaker 03

  not normal. And we all see writing on the wall. We all see the players, some of these players. There's a lot behind the scene.

• 2:33:38Speaker 03

  That we, especially, you know, they're hidden. But we all see something ain't right. And, and there's gotta be a cleansing. And the only thing that can change people is God. And the phenomenon can change you inside. But there ain't gonna be no change of humanity without having some spiritual thing come in and changes from the inside out. And that's what's coming. And there's nothing nobody can do about it. They can squill and squirm and try to make it look negative and ugly all they want, but it's not gonna stop what's coming, according to her.

• 2:34:19Speaker 03

  And in the Book of Revelations, in the very last chapter, it says, "When the army surround Israel on all four sides,"

• 2:34:31Speaker 03

  that he's coming back to fight the battle and rid the world of evil. And then there'd be a time of peace, a thousand years.

• 2:34:44Speaker 03

  And that's what the lady told me. Same thing.

• 2:35:00Speaker 03

  I said a lot.

• 2:35:01Shawn Ryan?

  Thank you for sharing that.

• 2:35:03Speaker 03

  A whole lot. Eighteen years I've never told this, towards seventeen and a half years.

• 2:35:09Shawn Ryan?

  How does it feel to get it out?

• 2:35:12Speaker 03

  Right. Right. I'll get a lot of blowback from this, I promise. I just hope the world that has been told is the devil can wake heck up and see that a little bit of heaven's coming here to help us.

• 2:35:31Shawn Ryan?

  Would you be willing to come back on the show?

• 2:35:33Speaker 03

  I would love to, yes, sir. I'd be honored.

• 2:35:38Shawn Ryan?

  I could go deeper, but um, I think this is a, a good part to end this interview. But with that being said, I would love to get you back because I have a lot more questions, but I know it's been a rough day.

• 2:35:56Speaker 03

  Just say the word and I'll be here.

• 2:35:58Shawn Ryan?

  Thank you, Chris.

• 2:35:59Speaker 03

  I promise.

• 2:36:03Shawn Ryan?

  You know, there's been a lot of speculation on, on if UFOs are strictly a, some type of spiritual entity, or if they are nuts and bolts, or if it's both.

• 2:36:27Speaker 03

  There's a possibility there's both, but I haven't seen the other side. A whole, all these years' experience has been with the phenomenon, I call it, is a spiritual thing. It's like magic. They appear out of nowhere. In fact, Tim Burchett made a quote, and I saved it, that they believe that the The interdimensional world would be the angels. And so if there might be some star cruiser coming from some planet some far away and stopping over to resupply and get some gas or something, right?

• 2:37:11Speaker 03

  But I can tell you, there's not a reason in this world an alien would come down to the river where I'm crying out, "God, help me." Why would he even care? Why would they want to help me? Why would they help all these other people, even animals? Because they have compassion for us and love.

• 2:37:34Shawn Ryan?

  I know I already asked this, but I do want to ask it again. And I just want to hear what you personally think. I mean, of 2007 to 24, we're talking almost, what, 17 years now?

• 2:37:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:37:50Shawn Ryan?

  Why you? What is it that you believe that God saw in you in that moment of time? Lots of people look up.

• 2:38:01Speaker 03

  I think that the phenomenon, or God, or whoever,

• 2:38:09Speaker 03

  knew that I'm the kind of person that would never back down. Never, ever. Look at Paul in the Bible. Look at all the apostles, every one of them. They knew what they knew, and they went to death for it. They were boiled in oil and tortured and crucified and hung upside down and dismembered because they knew without a doubt. Paul, on the road to Damascus, it says, "And a flash of light flashed around him and blinded him." It was an orb, the ball of light. And that's exactly what comes out of the sky and interacts, or comes into my house or around us. It's just the light, and it answers to prayer.

• 2:38:57Shawn Ryan?

  How do you pray?

• 2:39:00Speaker 03

  I pray to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. The Holy Trinity.

• 2:39:05Shawn Ryan?

  How? Do you ask? Do you just talk to it? Is it ceremonial?

• 2:39:09Speaker 03

  No, it's a thought. I don't have to say a word. I can think and they come. They're connected to our thoughts 100%. Yours do? They know your thoughts. They know all of us. In fact, I believe everybody has guardian angels, probably at least two.

• 2:39:27Speaker 03

  And I've been quoted saying there's 15 around me at all times. My kids are like, "How do you know that, Dad?" Because I constantly see there's about 15 of them that'll appear. And sometimes they do it all at once.

• 2:39:41Speaker 03

  So I think you have them. All you got to do is acknowledge it.

• 2:39:45Shawn Ryan?

  I know I have them.

• 2:39:46Speaker 03

  You do?

• 2:39:47Shawn Ryan?

  I've talked about it several times on this show and given very, very detailed examples. And, uh...

• 2:39:57Shawn Ryan?

  The next time, I'll share those with you.

• 2:40:00Speaker 03

  I want to hear that, I really do.

• 2:40:02Shawn Ryan?

  But, well, Chris...

• 2:40:07Shawn Ryan?

  What a man. Thank you.

• 2:40:10Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 2:40:11Shawn Ryan?

  Thank you for what you're doing. And, um, thank you for being here. And God bless you, brother.

• 2:40:17Speaker 03

  I appreciate you, Sean, so much.

• 2:40:20Shawn Ryan?

  Appreciate you too. We'll see you soon.

• 2:40:24Shawn Ryan?

  God bless.

• 2:40:24Speaker 03

  Thank you.