MFM Minisode 465

This week’s hometowns include a hitchhiking 12-year-old and a girl scout field trip to visit a cult. For our sources, please visit https://www.myfavoritemurder.com/episodes. Support this podcast by shopping our latest sponsor deals and promotions at this link: https://bit.ly/3UFCn1g. Head to social media to share your favorite moments from this episode. Instagram: instagram.com/myfavoritemurder http://instagram.com/myfavoritemurder Facebook: facebook.com/myfavoritemurder http://facebook.com/myfavoritemurder TikTok: tiktok.com/@my_favorite_murder http://tiktok.com/@my_favorite_murder Watch full episodes of My Favorite Murder on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@my_favorite_murder Send your hometown stories to [email protected] mailto:[email protected]. Join the Fan Cult to access ad-free episodes of My Favorite Murder. Members also receive merch store discounts, exclusive audio and video content and more! Visit www.fancult.supercast.com http://www.fancult.supercast.com/ to join. Shop for My Favorite Murder and other Exactly Right merchandise here: www.exactlyrightstore.com https://www.exactlyrightstore.com. Rate, review and follow My Favorite Murder on the iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you like to listen. See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This is exactly right.

• 0:06Speaker 00

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• 0:36Georgia Hardstark?

  Everyone loves the idea of spending an afternoon curled up with a good book.

• 0:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Well, grow up, because it's almost impossible.

• 0:42Georgia Hardstark?

  Luckily, you can take your next great story with you on Audible.

• 0:46Karen Kilgariff?

  Audible has a massive selection of titles to choose from, including This American Life, new books by Michael Connelly, along with classics from Magathah Christie, and so much more.

• 0:55Georgia Hardstark?

  Whether you want a mystery, a true crime story, or something completely different, there's always something new to listen to.

• 1:00Karen Kilgariff?

  New members can start listening with a 30-day free trial at audible.com/mfm.

• 1:05Georgia Hardstark?

  Audible, stories that speak to you. Goodbye.

• 1:08Speaker 03

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• 1:55Karen Kilgariff?

  Hello and welcome.

• 1:57Georgia Hardstark?

  To my favorite murder.

• 1:58Karen Kilgariff?

  That's Georgia Hardstark.

• 1:59Georgia Hardstark?

  That's Karen Kilgore. It's the minisode.

• 2:01Karen Kilgariff?

  This is the minisodes.

• 2:02Georgia Hardstark?

  We knew that.

• 2:02Karen Kilgariff?

  This is the minisode.

• 2:03Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 2:03Karen Kilgariff?

  If you're listening to the minisode, you don't need to know who we are. What's important is the emails.

• 2:08Georgia Hardstark?

  For some reason, we're not going to tell you who this is.

• 2:10Karen Kilgariff?

  It's a secret.

• 2:11Georgia Hardstark?

  When it's a minisode. Okay.

• 2:12Karen Kilgariff?

  You go first.

• 2:13Georgia Hardstark?

  Hitchhiking story. To the women that have gotten me through it all. I want to start off with a confession. I'm not even that into true crime. I am still, however, a day one listener, not because of my obsession with true crime, but because of my obsession with each of you and the inspiring friendship you share. I am being so serious when I say that this is the only podcast I listen to. Who wrote this? My mom. And I have listened to every episode at least three times.

• 2:42Karen Kilgariff?

  Wow.

• 2:43Georgia Hardstark?

  But in the interest of everyone's time, let's get into it.

• 2:45Karen Kilgariff?

  Every episode three times doesn't like true crime. We need to send this person a gift basket.

• 2:49Georgia Hardstark?

  Truly.

• 2:50Karen Kilgariff?

  Jesus Christ.

• 2:51Georgia Hardstark?

  It's like a spa day or something.

• 2:52Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, so sorry.

• 2:54Georgia Hardstark?

  The year is 2011. I'm in sixth grade and it's my first time taking the school bus alone. My divorced and working mother had just started the 4:00 AM shift at her job at our local grocery store. So it was now my responsibility to make sure I woke up, fed myself, and made it to the bus stop before the 6:45 pickup. Why do we make children wake up so fucking early?

• 3:16Karen Kilgariff?

  Get them ready for factory work. That's what it's all about.

• 3:19Georgia Hardstark?

  It's sickening to me.

• 3:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Bells early morning.

• 3:22Georgia Hardstark?

  Stop it, everyone.

• 3:23Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah. It's based on like farm handwork. It's like you gotta be up before the sun is up.

• 3:27Georgia Hardstark?

  I mean, honestly, like half of my issues with school, I think, were because I was so fucking tired because we had to get up at 6:00 in the fucking morning.

• 3:34Karen Kilgariff?

  The most trouble I ever got into was, I think I was a junior, and I got up, took a shower, and I remember because my mom had new bath sheets. So they were really big. So I had one in my hair and one around my body. And I sat back down on my bed, fell over and went back to sleep. And she came by because she was always trying to get to work.

• 3:51Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 3:51Karen Kilgariff?

  And was like, God.

• 3:53Georgia Hardstark?

  Damn it.

• 3:53Karen Kilgariff?

  But I was like, obviously, there was something going on with my system.

• 3:58Georgia Hardstark?

  That child is tired. That's not something you should get in trouble for.

• 4:01Karen Kilgariff?

  Why am I so tired? Could you figure it out? You work at a goddamn hospital.

• 4:05Georgia Hardstark?

  I would fall asleep in class every fucking day in like, fourth grade, and no one said shit about it. That's not okay.

• 4:11Karen Kilgariff?

  Maybe I'm anemic.

• 4:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Maybe I'm anemic. Maybe I have sleep apnea. Hey, I do have sleep apnea. I found out when I was fucking thirty. Like, what the, do you have ADHD? Oh, yeah, I do too.

• 4:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah.

• 4:21Georgia Hardstark?

  What the fuck, everyone?

• 4:22Karen Kilgariff?

  Sugar sensitivity and I'm filled with corn pops before I come to school.

• 4:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Right. I'm allowed to drink soda? Okay, that's, let's digress, shall we? But that's our, that's our platform.

• 4:32Karen Kilgariff?

  That's our problem.

• 4:34Georgia Hardstark?

  Look at us now. I don't wake up till eleven o'clock every day. I arrived at the bus stop on time, proud of my newfound agency, and I began to wait and wait and wait. After about fifteen minutes, I began to panic. I fucked up my first day of taking care of myself, and now I had no way to get to school. Had the bus come earlier than usual? Is the pickup spot different from last year? My young mind raced as I thought of the consequences of missing school because I couldn't get to the bus stop on time. As I sat sobbing on the sidewalk outside of our apartment complex, a man pulled his car over and asked if I was okay. "Yes," I responded cautiously, since it is two thousand and eleven after all, and stranger danger had been instilled in me since I could remember. "What's wrong?" he asked, since I was clearly in distress.

• 5:19Georgia Hardstark?

  "I've missed the school bus," I responded sheepishly, foolishly aware of the danger I was in. Maybe it was the fact that he claimed to work at our apartment complex, and then it says textbook serial killer life. Or maybe it was because he scolded me the moment I accepted to never do this again. But for some unknown reason, I trusted this random man to drive me to school.

• 5:39Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh.

• 5:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Shockingly, I arrived at school unscathed. He says, "Do you want a ride?" She says, "Okay." He gets in the car and goes, "Never do this again."

• 5:47Karen Kilgariff?

  Never do this again.

• 5:48Georgia Hardstark?

  You're so lucky. I'm fucking normal.

• 5:50Karen Kilgariff?

  That's what happened long ago when my ex and I picked up these two, like, thirteen-year-olds at a gas station at one AM. We were driving up to Petaluma, and they were standing around trying to make phone calls, and there was all these men that I could, they were just watching them at this, and I was like, "Girls, what are you doing? Why are you here this late?" And they're like, "Our ride left us." I'm like, "Get into the car. Never get into anyone's car, but get into my car." And I was like, "Do you know Ms. Kilgariff over at Lou Sutton?" And they were like, "Oh, yeah." So it was like, thank God, it was Novato.

• 6:20Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, like the middle of nowhere.

• 6:22Karen Kilgariff?

  I was so mad at these girls. I was just like, what are you doing?

• 6:25Georgia Hardstark?

  What are you doing? Luckily, they got you. Ashamed I had done something so risky, but relieved I wouldn't have to deal with the ridicule of missing the bus on my first attempt, I shoved my anxiety aside and reached for the entrance to my school, but it was locked. As it turns out, as it turns out, I actually hadn't missed the bus due to my own 12-year-old negligence. That particular Monday happened to be a two-hour late start, meaning the bus I sobbed over would be arriving an hour and a half from the moment of my realization. Not only had I risked my life because of a clerical error, but I was now stranded at school. I ultimately walked to my friend's house that lived near the school and the rest of the day went accordingly. But holy

• 7:05Georgia Hardstark?

  fuck, I risked being abducted for what? Middle school? Insane. SSTGM and don't risk your life for middle school, Vanessa.

• 7:15Karen Kilgariff?

  Vanessa, the pressure of doing the bus correctly.

• 7:18Georgia Hardstark?

  It's not on you.

• 7:19Karen Kilgariff?

  It's so awful. And especially then, when you're like, because the first thing they said was ridicule.

• 7:26Georgia Hardstark?

  I'm going to get in trouble. You're going to get in trouble for not getting there on time, but you're also going to be in trouble if you accept a ride from someone.

• 7:32Karen Kilgariff?

  It's so much pressure for a young mind who can't handle that level. That's how you know they're too young.

• 7:38Georgia Hardstark?

  Isn't logical, doesn't know like A to B to C.

• 7:41Karen Kilgariff?

  Can't go, if the bus isn't here, it's not my fault.

• 7:44Georgia Hardstark?

  Totally.

• 7:44Karen Kilgariff?

  And I don't have to solve the fact that the bus isn't here. I just go back home and go, the bus never came.

• 7:49Georgia Hardstark?

  Right.

• 7:50Karen Kilgariff?

  But they don't know that. That's what a 14-year-old would do.

• 7:53Georgia Hardstark?

  Right. A 12-year-old.

• 7:54Karen Kilgariff?

  Nope.

• 7:55Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God. This is why I could never have children. I could just couldn't let them go out into the world. I'd be like, I haven't taught you everything.

• 8:02Karen Kilgariff?

  You're at work typing. I'm getting a weird feeling.

• 8:04Georgia Hardstark?

  I wonder if she's out in the world.

• 8:06Karen Kilgariff?

  I hope she's not crying in a man's car somewhere. Okay. I'm not going to read you the subject line of this. It says, Dear Karen in Georgia. I grew up in a small coal town in northeastern Pennsylvania, right outside of Scranton. Yes, like the office. My dad grew up in that same small town in the 70s and 80s. He was friends with a kid named Joe Alessio, who just didn't seem quite right. My dad will be the first to tell you that he got into a lot of trouble as a teen, but will also tell you that this kid was on a different level. Animal abuse, setting fires, et cetera, et cetera. Long story short, 1981, when he was 15 years old, Joe killed two children. Cheryl and Christopher Ziemba. They were eight and four years old.

• 8:49Karen Kilgariff?

  And then he rolled their bodies into a carpet and dumped them down a mine shaft up in the mountains behind my dad's childhood home.

• 8:56Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God.

• 8:57Karen Kilgariff?

  The entire town went looking for these children. My grandma tells me that she can still hear the townspeople yelling their names and not hearing anything back. And guess who was part of the search party? That's right. Joe. The part that gets me is when they found the bodies, Christopher was wearing his favorite Superman T-shirt. And Joe had recently tried to claim that Cheryl's death was an accident and that he killed Christopher out of panic. He tried to appeal his life sentence, but got turned down. He will not be eligible for parole until 2041. Thanks for everything you do. I saw you in Denver recently, and it made my year. SSDGM. Thanks.

• 9:37Georgia Hardstark?

  Man, those are the stories that like your town just never gets over.

• 9:40Karen Kilgariff?

  No.

• 9:41Georgia Hardstark?

  It stays with everyone.

• 9:42Karen Kilgariff?

  The entire town's looking for a brother and a sister.

• 9:45Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 9:46Karen Kilgariff?

  I mean, awful.

• 9:47Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God. That's like when I picture the 70s and 80s. I'm like, well, everyone was just looking for missing children.

• 9:53Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes.

• 9:53Georgia Hardstark?

  All the time.

• 9:54Karen Kilgariff?

  And always baffled and kind of like, what's going on?

• 9:57Georgia Hardstark?

  And then why would this happen?

• 9:58Karen Kilgariff?

  Yep.

• 9:59Georgia Hardstark?

  Let's blame Satanists.

• 10:01Karen Kilgariff?

  Well, let's blame Satanists because the idea of that the guy that did it is in the search party is beyond comprehension until, what, the last 15 years?

• 10:11Georgia Hardstark?

  Because you don't understand what evil looks like. It looks like everyone else. It looks like you and me.

• 10:19Georgia Hardstark?

  The holidays are right around the corner, which means people are about to do a lot of shopping.

• 10:23Karen Kilgariff?

  And if you have a small business, they could be shopping with you.

• 10:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Get your business ready with Shopify.

• 10:28Karen Kilgariff?

  Shopify is the platform for a record-breaking, reliable holiday selling season at every stage.

• 10:33Georgia Hardstark?

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• 10:38Karen Kilgariff?

  Shopify's pre-built website themes make it easy to launch a beautiful, professional-looking store without ever touching a line of code.

• 10:44Georgia Hardstark?

  And Shopify's mobile app lets you run your store from anywhere, from tracking inventory to customer support to handling payments and more.

• 10:51Karen Kilgariff?

  If you're ready to launch your business before Black Friday, go to Shopify.com/murder to start your free trial.

• 10:57Georgia Hardstark?

  That's Shopify.com/murder.

• 10:59Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to Shopify.com/murder today to hear your first

• 11:04Georgia Hardstark?

  goodbye.

• 11:05Speaker 00

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• 11:35Georgia Hardstark?

  The Hulu original series Phony is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+.

• 11:39Karen Kilgariff?

  Sonny's life is pretty great, until he wakes up from a car accident to a world that looks exactly like his with one exception: his mom.

• 11:47Georgia Hardstark?

  To everyone else, she's the same Ellen they've known their whole lives. But for Sonny, he knows something is off.

• 11:52Karen Kilgariff?

  As his relationship with his mother begins to crack in unsettling ways, he's forced to question what happens when the perfect mom becomes a perfect stranger.

• 12:00Georgia Hardstark?

  Is this all in his head or is there really an imposter in his house?

• 12:03Karen Kilgariff?

  Starring five-time Emmy nominee Connie Britton and Sam Nevola, this small town is hiding the mother of all mysteries just beneath the surface.

• 12:11Georgia Hardstark?

  Watch the Hulu original series Phony.

• 12:13Karen Kilgariff?

  Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+ for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

• 12:18Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 12:21Georgia Hardstark?

  This is an "or so we thought" story. Hey, MFM crew, I've always wanted to tell this story, and now is my time. In 2020, I met my husband, David, during the pandemic. We both got COVID right after meeting and quarantined together for two weeks. Being sick like that after just a few weeks of knowing each other was so crazy, but we made it out alive. After a few weeks of getting better, we decided to go for a three-day weekend trip to an Airbnb in a little town in West Virginia. On our second day there, I was lying down near a window and saw a dog. It was really cold, so I went outside to see if the dog had a collar. He did have a collar, but he was filthy and didn't seem like he had a tag. My husband and I stayed with this dog outside for most of the day and thought about bringing him inside.

• 13:04Georgia Hardstark?

  There was a walkable grocery store nearby, so I headed there to get the dog some food. The cashier saw me looking at dog food and said, "Is Axel over there? He likes to play with all the tourists that come by." Begging for food, "I'm starving."

• 13:18Karen Kilgariff?

  "Oh, I'm just a lizard dog."

• 13:19Georgia Hardstark?

  "Hi, I'm Axel." She then showed me pictures of Axel and other dogs that like to come around frequently. Oh, my God, the suckers at the Airbnb, the fucking coastal elite.

• 13:29Karen Kilgariff?

  Where they're just kind of like, if you make your eyes wide enough, you'll get a full dinner in the middle of the day.

• 13:34Georgia Hardstark?

  Tail between legs, you're golden. Oh, my God. She called him a "street dog" gang leader. She also told me that Axel was almost taken by a previous couple who were staying at that Airbnb, but they ended up leaving him behind. She told me he had an owner, a Penny somethings. I can't remember the exact name. I bought dog food and dog shampoo washed because he was dirty. My husband and I took the dog inside, gave him a warm bath, and gave him dinner. That sounds like my ideal vacation. Find a stray dog.

• 14:01Karen Kilgariff?

  Find a couple that will bathe you and dine you.

• 14:05Georgia Hardstark?

  That's actually the other way around. Yeah, I love it. "We gave him dinner." We hung out with this one blue-eyed dog for the rest of the evening. We found a kitten outside an Airbnb in Lake Arrowhead once. We let him stay inside, even though it was against the Airbnb rules. Now, it was the final day of our trip, and we had to decide what to do about Axel. He was still there and not looking to be leaving or walking back to his home. My husband and I talked about taking him, but were worried he wouldn't get along with our other dog, Murphy. We looked at each other and decided not to take Axel. We packed our things in the car and drove off. We'd been driving for not 30 seconds, and we realized Axel was running behind the car.

• 14:45Karen Kilgariff?

  Does he do that for everybody?

• 14:47Georgia Hardstark?

  I don't know. We looked at each other and said, come on, babe. My husband began driving faster to see if that would stop him from running, but it made Axel run even faster.

• 14:56Karen Kilgariff?

  Pull over.

• 14:57Georgia Hardstark?

  That's when we decided we had to take Axel with us.

• 14:59Karen Kilgariff?

  Yay.

• 15:00Georgia Hardstark?

  He clearly wanted to come. A little bit of letting the dog decide. So we pull over and my husband goes to the trunk to get a blanket to lie down in the backseat. He opens the back door and Axel jumps right in. When suddenly, a rusty red pickup truck sees us and thinks our car is broken down and asks, in a southern Appalachian accent, "Are y'all okay? Do you need help?" And we began to explain that we were trying to get the dog into the car. And he says, in a southern Appalachian accent, "Is that my dog? Axel, get in here." Axel jumps out of our backseat into the red pickup truck and they set off into the sunset.

• 15:37Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, Axel.

• 15:38Georgia Hardstark?

  Axel. My husband and I are literally speechless trying to explain how that just happened. Truly one of the funniest stories I have to tell. It makes me laugh and cry at how many things had to line up for that to even happen. Thank you all for everything and thanks for always speaking up about mental health and how immigrants make this country great. SSDGM Catherine N. Do I have a picture of Axel?

• 15:59Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh.

• 16:00Georgia Hardstark?

  Yes or no?

• 16:04Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, my God.

• 16:04Georgia Hardstark?

  Like, that's a fucking hound dog.

• 16:07Karen Kilgariff?

  That's the most stealable dog of all time.

• 16:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Immediately.

• 16:10Karen Kilgariff?

  Are you out of your mind?

• 16:11Georgia Hardstark?

  Look at the face. "I guess I'm really hungry. I haven't eaten in a while."

• 16:14Karen Kilgariff?

  I don't know. I seem abandoned, even though this is a brand new red collar.

• 16:19Georgia Hardstark?

  Axel?

• 16:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah.

• 16:20Georgia Hardstark?

  Axel, damn it.

• 16:21Karen Kilgariff?

  Car. That is amazing. I love it. Okay.

• 16:27Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay, your turn.

• 16:28Karen Kilgariff?

  Subject line of this email is "The Time I Lived in a Haunted Cabin." Dear Karen in Georgia, During my senior year in college, I did a study away program near Ashland, Oregon. We lived on a small campus surrounded by wilderness where we lived in cabins instead of dorms. It was awesome. That kind of sounds amazing.

• 16:44Georgia Hardstark?

  Cabins, yeah.

• 16:45Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah. The area that is now our campus was once a small town built around a 1920s lumber mill. The best way I can describe it is that it feels like living on Walton's Mountain. The cabins were-

• 16:56Georgia Hardstark?

  What does that mean?

• 16:57Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, the Waltons?

• 16:58Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah. Oh, got it, got it.

• 16:59Karen Kilgariff?

  So it's like, everything's better part-

• 17:01Georgia Hardstark?

  That TV show's The Waltons?

• 17:02Karen Kilgariff?

  The Waltons. It's so old.

• 17:05Georgia Hardstark?

  I think I'm like that much too young for it.

• 17:07Karen Kilgariff?

  I was too young. Like, I remember my parents watching it, just at the end, they all go, "Goodnight, John Boy, goodnight, Grandpa", and it was just the outside shot of the-

• 17:17Georgia Hardstark?

  Got it.

• 17:17Karen Kilgariff?

  -house. It was real homey. It was almost like grown-up Little House on the Prairie.

• 17:22Georgia Hardstark?

  That's what I was thinking. Is that word Little House on the Prairie?

• 17:24Karen Kilgariff?

  It was, years later-

• 17:25Georgia Hardstark?

  Got it.

• 17:26Karen Kilgariff?

  -in a higher mountain.

• 17:28Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay. Time and place, here we are.

• 17:30Karen Kilgariff?

  Little House on the Prairie was like Minnesota, I believe.

• 17:32Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay.

• 17:32Karen Kilgariff?

  And then, I believe Waltons is Appalachia.

• 17:35Georgia Hardstark?

  Did you grow up like that? Tell us how it was.

• 17:37Karen Kilgariff?

  Yes. Did you make the walls of your own home out of mud and clay? Please write in. Okay. "The cabins were where the mill workers lived, and our library was their general store." Pretty rad. That's incredible, actually. "I lived in a cabin with three other girls. Everything was fine for a while, but then we started noticing strange things were happening. Silverware would go missing, doors opened and then closed on their own. My roommate kept a flashlight in her desk drawer and opened the drawer more than once to find the flashlight turned on."

• 18:04Georgia Hardstark?

  Creepy.

• 18:05Karen Kilgariff?

  "We would wake up in the morning to find our alarm clock unplugged, when we knew it had been plugged in when we went to bed. Our porch light flickered for the entire semester. Two of our professors tried to fix it with no luck." Ghosts?

• 18:17Georgia Hardstark?

  That's not, no.

• 18:19Karen Kilgariff?

  "I spoke to two girls who did the program the year after me, and Anna told me that she was coming out of the bathroom one day and heard footsteps. She thought it was one of her roommates, and she said she felt like someone was standing outside the door. So she yelled out, 'Wow, very funny, guys, you're just trying to hear me pee.' She stepped out of the bathroom, and she said she got pushed backwards. The force was so strong that she hit her back on the bathroom sink."

• 18:44Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh my god.

• 18:45Karen Kilgariff?

  "Anna lived in the same bedroom in the cabin that I lived in the previous year. I asked if she'd ever felt anything, and she said she was doing her hair in the mirror and saw a person standing behind her near the bunk bed. When she screamed and turned around, there was nothing there."

• 18:58Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, nightmare, ghost, nightmare. Stop it.

• 19:01Karen Kilgariff?

  It's like, straight out of a Blumhouse horror movie. Another girl told me that she often saw a ghost when she was walking home from the library at night. She described the ghost as a lumberjack man who carried a chainsaw. He never did anything to me, but I always saw him.

• 19:16Georgia Hardstark?

  Cool.

• 19:17Karen Kilgariff?

  What does he have to do past

• 19:18Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye.

• 19:19Karen Kilgariff?

  Carrying a fucking chainsaw at you?

• 19:21Georgia Hardstark?

  I'm a college dropout now. Goodbye.

• 19:23Karen Kilgariff?

  Goodbye. That's when I started jogging away from college. It makes sense for an area that was a lumber mill town. Our professor told us that the ghost who haunts Cabin Eight is a lumberjack too. Maybe it's the same one. Thank you for everything you do and for always bringing humor to shitty situations. Love y'all. And also Anna sadly passed away in 2022. R.I.P. Anna. S.S.G.G.M. Becca.

• 19:49Georgia Hardstark?

  I'm so sorry.

• 19:50Karen Kilgariff?

  I know. Sad.

• 19:51Georgia Hardstark?

  Wow. Ghost stories, I want the push stories more than the light flickering stories. You know what I mean?

• 19:57Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, because if it's like a cabin in the twenties, then you're like, that's an electrical issue.

• 20:02Georgia Hardstark?

  In the fucking middle of nowhere.

• 20:03Karen Kilgariff?

  Just get someone out there. It's those old electrical cords wrapped in cloth.

• 20:07Georgia Hardstark?

  Exactly.

• 20:07Karen Kilgariff?

  Get rid of them.

• 20:08Georgia Hardstark?

  Because they're gonna start a fire, a haunted fire.

• 20:10Karen Kilgariff?

  A haunted fire, but somebody pushing you into the sink?

• 20:12Georgia Hardstark?

  That's fucked up.

• 20:16Speaker 04

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• 20:46Georgia Hardstark?

  The Hulu original series Phony is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney+.

• 20:51Karen Kilgariff?

  Sonny's life is pretty great until he wakes up from a car accident to a world that looks exactly like his with one exception: his mom.

• 20:58Georgia Hardstark?

  To everyone else, she's the same Ellen they've known their whole lives, but for Sonny, he knows something is off.

• 21:04Karen Kilgariff?

  As his relationship with his mother begins to crack in unsettling ways, he's forced to question what happens when the perfect mom becomes a perfect stranger.

• 21:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Is this all in his head or is there really an impostor? In his house.

• 21:15Karen Kilgariff?

  Starring five time Emmy nominee Connie Britton and Sam Nivola. This small town is hiding the mother of all mysteries just beneath the surface.

• 21:23Georgia Hardstark?

  Watch the Hulu original series, Phony.

• 21:25Karen Kilgariff?

  Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus for bundle subscribers. Terms apply.

• 21:30Georgia Hardstark?

  Goodbye. As an adult, making dinner isn't the hard part.

• 21:33Karen Kilgariff?

  The hard part is deciding what to make every single night for the rest of your life.

• 21:36Georgia Hardstark?

  But with Hungry Root, you can make that decision a whole lot easier.

• 21:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Hungry Root is like having your own personal shopper and nutritionist all wrapped up into one. They'll take care of weekly grocery shopping and recommend groceries and meals tailored to you.

• 21:49Georgia Hardstark?

  Once you tell them about your goals and preferences, they fill your cart with personalized recommendations. And those recommendations get smarter as Hungry Root learns more about what you did or didn't like.

• 21:59Karen Kilgariff?

  Most of Hungry Root's recipes can be made in just 15 minutes or less. I mean, of course, it's always great to have delicious and very healthy groceries delivered to your house, which they can do, but I love the fact that Hungry Root will also just make you dinner so you can have it sitting there waiting. They make a classic chicken, corn and Mexican rice bowl, and they have all kinds of variations on those themes. So that's one that I love to reach for. And all these options, so you're getting really healthy meals.

• 22:26Georgia Hardstark?

  For a limited time, get 40% off your first order plus get a free item in every box for life.

• 22:31Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to hungryroot.com/mfm and use code MFM.

• 22:34Georgia Hardstark?

  That's hungryroot.com/mfm, code MFM to get 40% off your first box and a free item of your choice for life. Goodbye.

• 22:45Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay, here's my last one. It's short.

• 22:46Karen Kilgariff?

  Okay.

• 22:47Georgia Hardstark?

  Okay, it's lighthearted. "To my favorite murder gals, I am currently in the trenches of parenting two girls, both under the age of two, which means most of my days are spent breaking up would be baby cat fights, cleaning up crushed Cheerios and listening to Wheels on the Bus way too many times. The other day, my youngest daughter was extremely upset over something, teething, am I right? And launched into a full blown meltdown at the breakfast table, like first thing in the morning.

• 23:13Karen Kilgariff?

  Mm hmm.

• 23:14Georgia Hardstark?

  And my older daughter immediately rushed to her side, tried comforting her, and looked up at me with two wide eyes. She uttered, "Maybe a hot dog would help." I was immediately confused. These girls have never seen or even had a hot dog ever before in their short lives. But then I realized they have heard about hot dogs when we are driving in the car, listening to your podcast.

• 23:40Georgia Hardstark?

  Stay sexy and know that yes, a hot dog always helps. Mary and two pint-sized fans.

• 23:46Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh.

• 23:47Georgia Hardstark?

  Maybe a hot dog would help?

• 23:49Karen Kilgariff?

  Maybe I should have a hot dog and know, figure out what they are?

• 23:52Georgia Hardstark?

  Hot dogs all around?

• 23:53Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, that's so cute.

• 23:55Georgia Hardstark?

  I love it. I love that. That's our legacy.

• 23:58Karen Kilgariff?

  I know, yes. Let, teach the children well. They're like, there's too many nitrates in this for you to actually eat.

• 24:04Georgia Hardstark?

  You shouldn't be eating them.

• 24:05Karen Kilgariff?

  We've gotten so many cute hot dog.

• 24:08Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, my God.

• 24:08Karen Kilgariff?

  Keychains.

• 24:09Georgia Hardstark?

  Hat toys.

• 24:11Karen Kilgariff?

  You know, hand-stitched.

• 24:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Crochet.

• 24:13Karen Kilgariff?

  Many things, yeah.

• 24:13Georgia Hardstark?

  Earrings.

• 24:14Karen Kilgariff?

  Oh, so cute. And people walking up with like, hot dog print dresses on.

• 24:19Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 24:19Karen Kilgariff?

  So good. Okay. My last one is pretty great. It starts Heidi Ho, Murderino's. I am not a fitter inner. I've only been concerned about standing out for two of my 52 years. And of course, those years were in junior high. God, it's bad. It's just so bad. No one's ready.

• 24:37Georgia Hardstark?

  Tucked my shirts into my shorts.

• 24:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Well, they were so big and long. You had to put them somewhere. Ah, the 80s, the golden age of bullying.

• 24:46Georgia Hardstark?

  Truly.

• 24:47Karen Kilgariff?

  It's so true.

• 24:48Georgia Hardstark?

  That's why we're here today.

• 24:49Karen Kilgariff?

  Truly, it's like you either bullied, or you got bullied. And that those were the only two modes of existence in the 80s. When there are only four approved brand names of clothing at school, and at least three of them involved convincing your parents to drive you three hours over a mountain pass to a real mall. Oh, and then beg you to buy them the Guess or a Spree shirt of your choice, if you could fit into it. Yes, yes, and yes. I really tried to blend and go unnoticed by the cool kids, but the clothing rules kept changing. And then, the Rajneshis moved to town.

• 25:19Georgia Hardstark?

  Ah.

• 25:20Karen Kilgariff?

  Mm-hmm. The Bhagwan Sri Rajneesh and his pals started their own settlement in central Oregon in the early 80s. Though the commune would later be known for more nefarious deeds, when I was in 6th and 7th grade, the school bullies would focus on the color palette the cult members chose to wear. The Bhagwan's followers, called Rajneshis, only wore the colors of the sunset, capital C, capital S. And suddenly, wearing any shade of red could get you on the wrong side of a dodgeball. Not to mention the vicious chants of Rajneeshi Rajneeshi echoing for weeks.

• 25:52Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, God.

• 25:53Karen Kilgariff?

  So you're just like a 12-year-old girl going to school, like, I just got this cute reddish breeshirt.

• 25:57Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah.

• 25:58Karen Kilgariff?

  Here I go. The cult was unwelcome in their tiny town of Antelope, just over an hour from where I grew up in Bend. But the mistrust and suspicion spread all over the area with Rajneeshi Hunter bumper stickers and parody songs on the radio about the Bogwan's right-hand woman, Sheila. There didn't seem to be a sympathetic or even neutral stance on them anywhere in the state. Of course not.

• 26:21Georgia Hardstark?

  Tough titties.

• 26:21Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah, because you've got a, there's a race issue. There's just a general new people in a country, territory issue.

• 26:29Georgia Hardstark?

  Doing something not Christian.

• 26:30Karen Kilgariff?

  Not Christian in the lea-, kind of opposite, and in a communi way. It's all the, it's a real perfect storm in Maroon. Oh, except for my Girl Scout leader. Yep, she put together a field trip for our troop to go visit the commune on one Saturday in 1984.

• 26:47Georgia Hardstark?

  That's progressive.

• 26:48Karen Kilgariff?

  Right? Finally, my curiosity would be satiated. If only I could get my mom to sign the permission slip. But you know what? That woman didn't even seem to consider it before telling me no. But, but, all my friends are going. I would be the only person who didn't go, who we would be chaperoned. Why are you being so close-minded, Mom? Why won't you let me go visit a cult? Her answer, though seemingly random at the time, would bubble up in my memory about 13 years later, when I was planning another uncomfortable conversation with her. Why wouldn't she let me go visit the Rajneesh Puram? And then the mother's answer, in quotes, because there were lesbians there.

• 27:26Georgia Hardstark?

  Oh, no.

• 27:27Karen Kilgariff?

  Although my FOMO felt fatal, I guess I wasn't that concerned about it, because I was almost 30 when I found out zero Girl Scouts went on that trip. Nobody's parents signed those permission slips.

• 27:39Georgia Hardstark?

  Wow.

• 27:40Karen Kilgariff?

  Now, when I came out to my mom in 1997, she was very loving and accepting. And I will never stop missing her since she passed 10 years later. But Jesus Christ, Mom, you don't need a permission slip to be a lesbian. Stay sexy and wear what feels good, Beth.

• 27:56Georgia Hardstark?

  That's such a great, like, full circle story. Why didn't you want me to go? Because you will become the thing you are. Oh, guess what?

• 28:05Karen Kilgariff?

  Yeah.

• 28:05Georgia Hardstark?

  I'm the thing that you didn't want me to see.

• 28:07Karen Kilgariff?

  You fear it for a reason. But also, did you know they also have machine guns there?

• 28:12Georgia Hardstark?

  Yeah, right.

• 28:12Karen Kilgariff?

  And all kinds of shit you would be very worried about.

• 28:15Georgia Hardstark?

  The lesbians with machine guns are like the least of your fucking worries, I promise you. Hey, lesbians with machine guns, thank you for listening.

• 28:24Karen Kilgariff?

  We'd love to hear from you.

• 28:25Georgia Hardstark?

  We truly would.

• 28:26Karen Kilgariff?

  What's going on in Bend?

• 28:28Georgia Hardstark?

  Let us know.

• 28:29Karen Kilgariff?

  And also, stay sexy.

• 28:30Georgia Hardstark?

  And don't get murdered.

• 28:32Karen Kilgariff?

  Goodbye.

• 28:33Georgia Hardstark?

  Elvis, do you want a cookie? Ah!

• 28:42Karen Kilgariff?

  This has been an Exactly Right production.

• 28:44Georgia Hardstark?

  Our senior producer is Molly Smith and our associate producer is Tessa Hughes.

• 28:48Karen Kilgariff?

  Our editor is Aristotle Lassaveto.

• 28:50Georgia Hardstark?

  This episode was mixed by Liana Scolacci.

• 28:52Karen Kilgariff?

  Email your hometowns to [email protected].

• 28:55Georgia Hardstark?

  Follow the show on Instagram at MyFavoriteMurder.

• 28:57Karen Kilgariff?

  Listen to My Favorite Murder on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 29:02Georgia Hardstark?

  Or watch us on YouTube. Search for My Favorite Murder and then like and subscribe.

• 29:06Karen Kilgariff?

  Goodbye.

• 29:13Karen Kilgariff?

  Vacation planning should feel like a breeze, not a deep dive into countless travel sites searching for the best deal.

• 29:19Georgia Hardstark?

  With CheapCaribbean's Budget Beach Finder, you can search every destination and every date, all in one search.

• 29:24Karen Kilgariff?

  You'll save time and money with the Budget Beach Finder.

• 29:27Georgia Hardstark?

  Say goodbye to endless scrolling and tab hopping and hello to Budget Beach Bliss at your fingertips.

• 29:32Karen Kilgariff?

  Go to CheapCaribbean.com to try out the Budget Beach Finder and see just how stress-free vacation planning should be. Goodbye.

• 29:40Speaker 03

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• 30:10Speaker 05

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