Pat Boone | The Magnificent Others with Billy Corgan

The indomitable Pat Boone joins Billy Corgan for a remarkable conversation about surviving fame, making history, and keeping faith through more than seven decades in entertainment. Pat reflects on breaking Billboard records, selling more than 50 million records, and rising alongside Elvis Presley as one of the defining stars of the 1950s. He shares unforgettable stories about their friendship, Elvis' private struggles with faith,​ performing for Queen Elizabeth II, and witnessing the birth of rock & roll. Along the way, Pat revisits the near-fatal accident while filming Journey to the Center of the Earth, the Harry Belafonte controversy that led him to walk away from his own hit television show, and the extraordinary pressure of becoming one of America's biggest stars before the age of 25. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

  At that young age, it was miraculous that I could just keep walking straight. I mean, it was all so much pressure, but I just took each moment as it came.

• 0:42Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. You still have the Billboard record 220 weeks on the chart consecutively. You had at least one record in the charts.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  One going up, one going down.

• 0:50Billy Corgan?

  That is insane.

• 0:52Speaker 01

  It was just miraculous, the things that kept happening to me.

• 0:57Billy Corgan?

  It always struck me that you had a particular optimism for life.

• 1:00Speaker 01

  I do. I really do.

• 1:02Billy Corgan?

  Even sitting here in 2026 with you, it's still unbelievable.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07Billy Corgan?

  The success you had.

• 1:10Billy Corgan?

  Pat Boone, what an honor to have you. It's nice to see you.

• 1:13Speaker 01

  I'm honored to have you say that.

• 1:15Billy Corgan?

  Thank you. 91 years young.

• 1:18Speaker 01

  91 years young.

• 1:19Billy Corgan?

  Born in 1934.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, you did some homework.

• 1:23Billy Corgan?

  Okay, let me give a little bit of a resume to start.

• 1:25Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:25Billy Corgan?

  Because I think for people who don't know your music like I do, and didn't grow up with you, 70 years plus in the business.

• 1:33Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:34Billy Corgan?

  50 million records sold.

• 1:36Speaker 01

  They tell me.

• 1:36Billy Corgan?

  Roughly.

• 1:37Speaker 01

  I didn't get paid for that many, but I...

• 1:40Billy Corgan?

  Different world that you grew up in in terms of how they paid artists.

• 1:42Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 1:43Billy Corgan?

  38 top 40 hits.

• 1:45Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:46Billy Corgan?

  Six number ones. You still have the Billboard record 220 weeks on the chart consecutively. You had at least one record in the charts for 220...

• 1:55Speaker 01

  One going up, one going down.

• 1:56Billy Corgan?

  That is insane. Billboard itself ranks you as the number two most popular artist in the 1950s, behind a little guy named Elvis Presley.

• 2:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, whatever happened to him?

• 2:06Billy Corgan?

  They forgot about him. Seventy-eight studio albums, roughly. And somewhere in the neighborhood of 2,300 plus songs recorded.

• 2:17Speaker 01

  We got up to 2,700 now.

• 2:19Billy Corgan?

  Really? Well, congratulations on that.

• 2:20Speaker 01

  And I'm still at it because I'm recording still and got two or three records on the charts in meager ways, but they're...

• 2:27Billy Corgan?

  I was gonna ask you this later, but I think it's a good place to start. What do you think defines your life? Because at least from an observational point of view, and I've been watching you on television and hearing your music my entire life, I'm 59 years old. So I'm very familiar with who you are.

• 2:44Speaker 01

  Good.

• 2:45Billy Corgan?

  And it always struck me that you had a particular optimism for life.

• 2:49Speaker 01

  I do. I really do. And I've had many knockdowns, many things to recover from, but a happy marriage, wonderful family, church life. And really, when I've been really backed into corners and I thought I was maybe done for financially, miraculously, I've been delivered from the problems. And so I am, I have reason to believe spiritually and just normally that everything's gonna work out okay. I'm gonna make it.

• 3:30Billy Corgan?

  Do you think, I know you're a man of deep faith. Do you think that optimism is something that, I don't wanna say God rewards, but God maybe recognizes the spirit of optimism?

• 3:40Speaker 01

  Definitely. And it just, well, obviously, if you feel like you're the younger brother of or related to Howard Hughes or to some giant, you know...

• 3:54Speaker 01

  Entrepreneur who's got all the, say, all the money in the world practically, then you, you feel optimistic about your future. I, I, as a young boy, had a good dad, mom, and happy family, played in the sports, sang, was asked to lead singing in church. And, and so I had a happy, positive life, married at nineteen, because Red Foley, my father-in-law, the Country Music Hall of Fame singer, was taking his three girls, his wife had died, my wife's mama, of rheumatic fever, and was taking the three girls, including nineteen-year-old Shirley,

• 4:38Speaker 01

  to Springfield, Missouri, to start what became the Ozark Jubilee.

• 4:43Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 4:43Speaker 01

  A big country, successful television, country music show. But he was taking his three girls with him, of course. And Shirley and I had been in love since we were sixteen, in high school. Very much in love, even to the point, we were talking about how many kids we might have when we got married, and the names, and so on. And now he's taking her away.

• 5:05Billy Corgan?

  Ah, I didn't know this part of this.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  To Springfield, Missouri. And to me, that might as well have been, been, you know, some foreign country, yeah. And I said, honey, I can't stand it. I know, I believe if he takes you to Springfield, and it might as well have been some faraway place, we were in Nashville. And you're too attractive, the guys are gonna be hovering around you, and somebody's gonna take you. No, she said, I, I love you, nobody's gonna... I said, why don't we get married? And we were both surprised at even the thought, but as we thought about it, hey, we're nineteen, I can get by, we'll figure out, but, anything but you going away from me.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  I don't want you to be gone.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  So we had to ask her dad, Red Foley, we sat in a

• 5:59Billy Corgan?

  Who, for those who don't know, Red's career of music was a big star.

• 6:03Speaker 01

  Very big country music artist, but his wife had died. In fact, his first wife had died too. And so I sat Red Foley down and and they had a much nicer home than ours out on Lone Oak Road. And I called him Mr. Red. I said, Mr. Red, you know, I love your daughter Shirley. He said, I I know you do. And he said, I think you must feel the same about him, don't you, honey? To Shirley, I do, Daddy. Well, what can I do for you? He said, well, I'm asking. I've asked her already. I know you're leaving soon. You're leaving Monday for Springfield. This was a Friday.

• 6:45Speaker 01

  And we just can't stand it. I'd like to ask you your permission for us to get married. And that took him back a little way. And he said, you're going to take care of my daughter? I said, yes, Mr. Red, I will. With God's help, I will. And he said, is this what you want too, honey? And she said, yes, Daddy. And I swear tears rolled down his nose into his coffee. And he said, well, if this is what you want,

• 7:17Speaker 01

  I give you my blessing. I'll buy you rings. Really? And so we, and he said, well, now, when are you thinking of it? We said, tomorrow.

• 7:29Speaker 01

  It was

• 7:30Billy Corgan?

  Amazing.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  This was Friday and he was going to leave Monday for Springfield. So Saturday, we went down and bought little, little rings like this. It is this little simple one that just a little gold ring.

• 7:43Billy Corgan?

  That's the ring?

• 7:44Speaker 01

  That's the ring. Kept us married for 66 years now.

• 7:49Speaker 01

  And um, and then we bought a nicer ring, but we still love that one. And uh, and so we, we, we married the next, uh, high school principal, who was also a minister. He back, he, he married us and his wife was the maid of honor. But in Davidson County, uh, you didn't get a marriage license that quick. So we went to another county and got married by a justice of the peace.

• 8:16Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  And uh, I was married, we were married twice that day. We were double married and we took it that seriously too, so.

• 8:25Billy Corgan?

  Well, maybe you needed to be double married to get to the end, right?

• 8:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. And so we, we got married at nineteen.

• 8:31Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  But then by twenty, uh, I was in, I had moved to North Texas State and was in college. They're music, big music school where I wanted to know more about music, how to play an instrument, play music. I was a song leader and a singer already. Uh, I had won some talent contests, the Ted Mack Amateur Hour and the Arthur Godfrey Show, national shows, but nothing, no offers for anything came from winning these two big.

• 8:57Billy Corgan?

  Wow, that's crazy.

• 8:58Speaker 01

  Talent shows. So I thought, well, I can't count on that as a career.

• 9:02Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 9:04Speaker 01

  And uh, and so I'm going to be a teacher preacher, I thought. And Shirley was thrilled with it, thinking of picket fences and summers off and quiet life. Her dad was a entertainer, gone a lot.

• 9:15Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, she'd already grown up in the business.

• 9:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, and she was not, didn't even want to think about me being an entertainer.

• 9:21Billy Corgan?

  She didn't know what she was getting into.

• 9:22Speaker 01

  She didn't, neither did I. So then we got married and that's, but anyway, and when we were, by the time we were in our, in our twenties, almost twenty-one, we had our first child out in Texas. And um, and then, then, then in that order, in four years, we had four kids. I mean, we did find out what was causing it eventually, but uh, no, we knew, I'm kidding. But, but, but by the end of the fourth year, we were of our marriage, I was doing the, the Pat Boone.

• 9:56Billy Corgan?

  Sure.

• 9:57Speaker 01

  The show, the Chevy showroom on television. I had hit records, that string of, of four and a half years had begun of never being off the chart.

• 10:06Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 10:07Speaker 01

  And uh, and, and a career and, and went by the time we were twenty-three.

• 10:13Billy Corgan?

  It's amazing.

• 10:13Speaker 01

  So it's that kind of life.

• 10:17Speaker 01

  Uh, if you're together and we stayed together.

• 10:20Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 10:21Speaker 01

  Uh, it makes you feel sort of insulated if you and nothing but good's gonna happen in your life.

• 10:28Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 10:29Speaker 01

  So I've always been an optimist.

• 10:31Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. Can you, um, first of all, I love, uh, old country music. Um, and my father, uh, was born in Southern Illinois.

• 10:40Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 10:41Billy Corgan?

  And he was a rock and roller. So he kind of saw country music as the, not so much the music he wanted to get away from is the culture he wanted to get away from. Cause he, uh, my grandmother and he had moved to the big city of Chicago.

• 10:55Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 10:56Billy Corgan?

  Where I showed up, but, but, um.

• 10:58Speaker 01

  And that's where Red and Shirley, Shirley's mama married in Chicago.

• 11:01Billy Corgan?

  I didn't know that. Um, and so my father's dismissive attitude towards country music is sort of like, you know, that's what your, your relatives listen to. That's hick music. You know, I know you know all that stuff.

• 11:14Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 11:14Billy Corgan?

  But I, so I was very late to coming to country music as a fan. And then I, I discovered this incredible, rich vein of music. And as you know, it's, it's incredible. I mean, you can go down so many rabbit holes.

• 11:25Speaker 01

  I'm gonna take these off.

• 11:27Billy Corgan?

  So I'm a, I'm a fan of Red's and, um, I have a, a 45 in, in my jukebox. I have a jukebox in my kitchen. So when, when I have dinner with my kids, we listen to country music and it's all old country music.

• 11:38Speaker 01

  Still?

• 11:39Billy Corgan?

  Oh yeah. Yes, sir.

• 11:40Speaker 01

  Good.

• 11:41Billy Corgan?

  And I've got, uh, uh, Red's version of Satisfied Mind.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 11:46Billy Corgan?

  It's so beautiful.

• 11:47Speaker 01

  I recorded eventually, I did a whole album called I Remember Red.

• 11:51Billy Corgan?

  Ah, I didn't know that. I gotta look that up.

• 11:53Speaker 01

  Bunch of his, piece in the valley, closer walk with thee.

• 11:56Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 11:57Speaker 01

  Chattanooga shoe shine boy, which Bing Crosby and Frank Sinatra both covered, but Red Foley had the record of Chattanooga shoe shine. So it was, it was very active at all that time, but yeah, country music. I would have thought I would have followed a country music career.

• 12:14Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. So the question I was after is, you know, there you are in Nashville as a young person. Country music is certainly popular in Nashville, but as you know, country music wasn't necessarily popular. In in the American culture like it later became.

• 12:28Speaker 01

  It's a separate genre.

• 12:30Billy Corgan?

  Absolutely, and it was and it was and it was often dismissed by the New York critics.

• 12:33Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:34Billy Corgan?

  So, uh, did you grow up listening to Grand Old Opry? Was that sort of part of your world?

• 12:38Speaker 01

  Not really, no. I um, I did listen to country music, of course. I even, my first song that I wrote was, I just can't believe it, dear, until you tell me so. They say you've been untrue, that from the start you've done me wrong. They say that we are through, that I'm a fool to tag along. They say another has your love, and that I'll be the last to know, but I just can't believe it, dear, until you tell me so. Well, I surely let me play that for Eddie Arnold.

• 13:10Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 13:10Speaker 01

  Who was very nice and said, well, that's nice, man, he said, not for me, but uh, but keep writing. He said, I think you have a talent. So that's the way Eddie Arnold was nice to me. But you're not, country music, I thought I might have gone that way.

• 13:27Billy Corgan?

  And how did you and your your your wife meet? I I feel like I saw it somewhere, but I can't recall a talk.

• 13:32Speaker 01

  Well, her mom, as I say, was sick and eventually died of rheumatic fever. So Red Foley had to put his older daughter into David Lipscomb School, which was college and high school, but had a dormitory. She went to the girls dorm, although she was in high school, a junior in high school then. And we met under the grandfather clock in Old Harding Hall. She was talking to the basketball captain, big tall guy named Bill Brown. And I said, who's this, Bill? And he said, well, this is Shirley Foley, Red Foley's daughter. And uh.

• 14:08Billy Corgan?

  That was it?

• 14:09Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, we both felt something. Fortunately, she felt the same thing I did. And that was where the romance began. And then, of course, I was not listening, I was listening to pop radio. My my only records at our house were my parents' favorite Bing Crosby.

• 14:27Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 14:28Speaker 01

  So I listened to Bing Crosby.

• 14:29Billy Corgan?

  More crooners.

• 14:30Speaker 01

  Frank Sinatra, and then uh, and then the Big Demone, and I and I got into pop music. So that when I was doing some singing in school programs, whatever. And, uh, and when some, a, um, ladies' club, sewing club, or men's, a businessman's luncheon, wanted somebody to sing pop tunes for them, well, I, I had become known as Blue Moon Boon. They call me Blue Moon.

• 15:03Billy Corgan?

  Blue Moon Boon.

• 15:04Speaker 01

  Blue Moon because.

• 15:05Billy Corgan?

  It rolls right off the tongue.

• 15:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, because when, uh, we, the, the, all of us kids would be together and they'd ask me to sing a song. I would sing, "Blue Moon, you saw me coming alon-, uh, saw me standing alone without a dream in my heart."

• 15:21Billy Corgan?

  Who, who is it? Was it?

• 15:22Speaker 01

  Bing Crosby.

• 15:23Billy Corgan?

  Oh, Bing Crosby.

• 15:24Speaker 01

  Blue Moon, Blue Moon.

• 15:26Billy Corgan?

  I'm thinking of Blue Moon of Kentucky with.

• 15:27Speaker 01

  Oh, Blue Moon of Kentucky, yeah.

• 15:29Billy Corgan?

  I know Blue, I know the other Blue Moon too.

• 15:30Speaker 01

  But I should sing Blue Moon, it was no accompaniment, and the girls liked it and the guys didn't mind it. And so, and so I was known as Blue Moon Boon, and then I, of course, kept up with all the pop tunes.

• 15:43Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 15:44Speaker 01

  Crosby and all the others, Demone and Sinatra. And I could sing those songs. A lady named Ruth Maury played piano. And, and I was supposed to take piano from her, but I practiced basketball instead of piano. So, so.

• 16:00Billy Corgan?

  What was your basketball game?

• 16:01Speaker 01

  The basketball game was good. In fact, I, you may know, I, I helped start the ABA.

• 16:07Billy Corgan?

  I did see that.

• 16:08Speaker 01

  And I owned Oakland Oaks with Rick Barry. We won the championship.

• 16:11Billy Corgan?

  You've had such an incredible life, we can't cover it all.

• 16:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:15Billy Corgan?

  So I'm mostly focused on music, because that's my, my jam.

• 16:18Speaker 01

  Definitely. So anyway, I, and I understand that, um, but my music interests were pop, really.

• 16:27Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 16:28Speaker 01

  I, I liked country, but my music interests were pop.

• 16:30Billy Corgan?

  Maybe I assumed too much. So, uh, tell me a little bit about, because I found this interesting, but you know, it's the internet, information is kind of, depends on who's talking. But I saw where you were performing in what was called Centennial Park.

• 16:44Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 16:44Billy Corgan?

  And there was kind of these bandshell concerts.

• 16:46Speaker 01

  Yes, it was, yeah.

• 16:47Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 16:47Speaker 01

  You're right. That's good homework.

• 16:50Billy Corgan?

  Did you, did you, did?

• 16:52Speaker 01

  I was artist of the week. A local boy, I'd been a, on a, on a one talent show at that time, the Ted McAmateur Hour, which I won three weeks in a row, singing pop songs.

• 17:03Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 17:03Speaker 01

  I'm walking behind you, Eddie Fisher.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  A Perry Como song and I forget what the other was. Oh, no, I believe Frankie Lane singing, I Believe. And but nothing happened of it, except I was popular in Nashville.

• 17:21Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 17:21Speaker 01

  And in demand for singing. And then that summer series, they'd pick out some Nashvillian, who a guy named Snooki Lanson on the hit parade was also from Nashville and he was artist of the week one summer. But this particular summer, they made me artist of the week and I sang some of the same songs I had sung on television. And that seemed like a big thing, but it was very local. The only thing was in Gallatin, Tennessee, a man named Randy Wood had started a record company called Dot Records.

• 17:56Billy Corgan?

  Dot, okay.

• 17:57Speaker 01

  And it was growing. It was coming on strong.

• 18:00Billy Corgan?

  But weren't you signed to Republic first?

• 18:02Speaker 01

  Yes. Yes, I was. Bill, a guy named Bill Beasley started that.

• 18:08Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 18:08Speaker 01

  Label. And I made one, I think I did two records, but they got played locally.

• 18:15Billy Corgan?

  These are just singles.

• 18:16Speaker 01

  Singles.

• 18:17Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, okay.

• 18:17Speaker 01

  And eventually I heard one on a jukebox in Dallas after Shirley and I moved out to Denton, Texas to go to school. But it was all just small.

• 18:31Billy Corgan?

  Small, yeah.

• 18:32Speaker 01

  It was nice. I was gratified, but beginning to see that that you don't just jump into a singing career in the music business and certainly not pop music. And so I given up that idea.

• 18:46Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 18:47Speaker 01

  I mean, I had a wish or a dream, but but it was not going to happen.

• 18:50Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 18:51Speaker 01

  And Shirley, I got married and I said, in my thinking, I settled down. I'm going to be a teacher preacher.

• 18:56Billy Corgan?

  Yep. So when was the first moment that it seemed to you that, okay, wait, this is actually going to click, you know? Because once you started having success, you went like this.

• 19:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was unbelievable, which is why.

• 19:09Billy Corgan?

  I mean, even sitting here in 2026 with you, it's still unbelievable.

• 19:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:14Billy Corgan?

  The success you had.

• 19:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, I got a call from Randy Wood dot records.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  Almost a year after I'd won those contests and I was now was preaching in a little country church in a wheat field, about 30 members, and they didn't pay me except I tied on my 4450 I was making from two TV shows I was doing on WFAA in Fort Worth. At 20 years old, I was hosting the Beulah Bar and Dance Country Music Show on Friday night and a newly put together foremost teen times teenage talent show from three states coming together in a jukebox set or a soda shop set. And I'm hosting that at 20 and they're paying me 4450 a week, $44.50 a week.

• 20:04Speaker 01

  And I'm driving 30 miles from Denton into Fort Worth and back twice. And so I tied on that 4450, I put five bucks in the.

• 20:14Billy Corgan?

  10%.

• 20:15Speaker 01

  Collection plate, yeah. And it was, I say, only a small, little congregation and they might give me 15 to 20 bucks for preaching on Sunday. Well, I wasn't doing it for the money, of course, but I thought I was preparing for.

• 20:33Billy Corgan?

  A life in the ministry.

• 20:34Speaker 01

  A teacher preacher.

• 20:35Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 20:36Speaker 01

  But then I get a call from Randy Wood and why aren't you making records? And I said, nobody's given me an opportunity.

• 20:44Billy Corgan?

  The phone isn't ringing.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  I had done Republic Records in that mix, but nothing much happened. So with that record or those records.

• 20:52Speaker 01

  And he said, well, I've got a song, a rhythm and blues song that I think you could sing. You want to go to, want to do it? I'll send you a plane ticket to Chicago.

• 21:03Billy Corgan?

  Wow, I didn't know you recorded in Chicago.

• 21:04Speaker 01

  I recorded in Chicago with about three musicians and three singers. A song by The Charms on the DoTone label. One heart, not enough, baby. Two hearts will make you feel crazy. One kiss will make you feel so nice. Two kisses take you to paradise. Two hearts, two kisses make one love.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  And it was, it was, we were calling it rock and roll. I mean, that was the beginning of what we call rock and roll.

• 21:33Billy Corgan?

  Absolutely.

• 21:34Speaker 01

  That was just a phrase in R and B music.

• 21:36Billy Corgan?

  And, and just so people who are younger than you and I, this is the nascent days of rock and roll. There is no rock and roll on the charts.

• 21:44Speaker 01

  No, no, there wasn't. There were just R and B. It was called, more often called race music.

• 21:48Billy Corgan?

  Race music, yeah.

• 21:49Speaker 01

  All black, and yet, two or three music producers were finding hooky, commercial songs like Shaboom and things like that.

• 21:58Billy Corgan?

  Great songs.

• 21:58Speaker 01

  Yeah. And they'd do their pop versions. In fact, that song, Two Hearts, Two Kisses, I recorded it till one in the morning. It was all mon-oral, no punch-ups, no anything, just mon-oral.

• 22:11Billy Corgan?

  All live.

• 22:12Speaker 01

  Oh, and then, and then I get a call in the morning from Randy Wood saying, we got a problem.

• 22:16Billy Corgan?

  Oh, no.

• 22:17Speaker 01

  Frank Sinatra just recorded that song. Doris Day just recorded that song. The Castro Sisters and the men's group, and so we're gonna, I'm sending you on a promotion. It sent me to 20 cities in 18 days to promote my record. And the nation's number one DJ, Bill Randall, in Cleveland, they called him the professor because he knew everything there was about music and the artists. And, and he proclaimed my record of Two Hearts, Two Kisses, the record, not Sinatra, because you could tell he didn't even enjoy singing it. And Doris Day, I never heard her record. But mine had the spirit of

• 22:58Billy Corgan?

  Of this coming.

• 22:58Speaker 01

  Of the song and the music.

• 23:00Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:00Speaker 01

  And then the next record, and that was in January, in, in March or May, I had to do a second record because Two Hearts to the Kid went to number 10.

• 23:11Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 23:11Speaker 01

  And I had to record something else. So it was Fat's Domino's.

• 23:14Billy Corgan?

  Ain't that a shame?

• 23:15Speaker 01

  Ain't that a shame? Now, I was getting pulled into this music.

• 23:19Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:20Speaker 01

  By Randy Wood, who knew I could sing it or found out I could.

• 23:23Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. Had you had much exposure to R and B music before that?

• 23:26Speaker 01

  No. My brother, younger brother than me, liked it. And there was a station in Nashville he listened to, but I didn't care much for it. I was, as I say, I was into pop music.

• 23:36Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  And was singing pop music.

• 23:38Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:38Speaker 01

  And, but he was, he was intrigued by the rhythm and blues.

• 23:43Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:46Billy Corgan?

  So ain't that, ain't that a shame?

• 23:47Speaker 01

  Ain't that a shame? Went to number one.

• 23:49Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  My first million selling number one record was my second record.

• 23:53Billy Corgan?

  And you were, and how old, you're?

• 23:54Speaker 01

  Twenty three, that was twenty, at that point, twenty.

• 23:57Billy Corgan?

  Twenty two, twenty three?

• 23:58Speaker 01

  Twenty two, twenty two.

• 23:59Billy Corgan?

  Okay, yeah.

• 24:00Speaker 01

  And.

• 24:01Billy Corgan?

  Not everybody has a number one when with a twenty two.

• 24:03Speaker 01

  Right, and then, and then, and then it began to be number ones and, and chart records from then on for four years.

• 24:09Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, Ivory Joe, Almost Lost My Mind.

• 24:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, and, and so many great, great songs.

• 24:15Billy Corgan?

  And April, uh, April Love.

• 24:17Speaker 01

  But now is making movies.

• 24:19Billy Corgan?

  Don't jump ahead, cause I, cause, cause I want to talk about movies too.

• 24:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:22Billy Corgan?

  But I think this is such a, I think it's hard for us as musicians today to understand how primitive the conditions were, how the takes were live.

• 24:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:31Billy Corgan?

  Like, here's the song, you're in a session for a couple hours, and that's it. You either make magic or you don't.

• 24:37Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 24:37Billy Corgan?

  The record either hits or it doesn't.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  That, exactly right, in fact, a song I did later called Moody River, I was recording in the afternoon. It was a country song by a guy named Chase Webster. It had become a country hit. Randy Wood called me, said, I'm, and I want you to go down to United Recorders, we're going to record.

• 24:57Billy Corgan?

  Is this in Chicago?

• 24:58Speaker 01

  No, that was in LA, we moved to LA by then. And, and he said, I want to record a song called Moody River. I'd never heard it. I go to the studio and they, he purposely had Billy Vaughan who arranged it.

• 25:10Billy Corgan?

  Oh, Billy Vaughan, great arranger.

• 25:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, and he, he put in a slightly higher key, cause it, I don't want to sound like a ballad or a crooning thing. This is, this is a sad tale of a girl that jumps in the river and drowns.

• 25:23Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 25:23Speaker 01

  And left this note by the river. And, and so I sang the song, it, and it was obvious that it was in a higher, I sounded more plaintive. And, and Randy Wood says, I, he says, I think we got a smash. And he says, I had to go to the friend's house to pick up my wife and go home to dinner. And he says, I'm gonna take this over to Chuck Bloor at KFWB, which was a big, um, big pop station, big station, and see what he thinks of it, so. I go pick up Shirley with my friends and my arms around her waist and we're at the door and I hear ba ba ba da ba ba da ba ba da ba ba ba da ba ba da the intro to Moody River. I said, wait a minute.

• 26:08Speaker 01

  And, and I hear Chuck Bloor, who was the, the owner of the station, or the director, anyway, uh, said, and now for the first time anywhere, our new pick hit of the week, Pat Boone's Moody River. I'm not home from the studio from recording it. And it's pick hit of the week and it, it went to number one real quick. And so that, as you say, it's, and as I've said, it was just miraculous, the things that kept happening to me. And of course Elvis and I then met in, in October of 55.

• 26:43Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 26:44Speaker 01

  And that was a sock hop in Cleveland with Bill Randall, the DJ.

• 26:47Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 26:48Speaker 01

  He had brought him up, he got Colonel Parker to bring him up from Shreveport, where he was doing the Supri, it was a

• 26:54Billy Corgan?

  It's where Hank Williams used to do the

• 26:57Speaker 01

  Hank Williams, uh, yeah.

• 26:59Billy Corgan?

  Shreveport Music Hall or something.

• 27:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was like Opryland.

• 27:03Billy Corgan?

  It was Opry, but the, the Louisiana version, yeah.

• 27:06Speaker 01

  And Elvis was singing country songs, but trying to make them sound the best he could, rhythm and bluish.

• 27:12Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 27:13Speaker 01

  Which is what he was into at that point. So he showed up backstage in the, uh, at the W E R E, I think it was, I think it was, I guess it was a TV studio, not, not the station. And I'm there to, to, to sing Moody River. And, and Ain't That a Shame and those other songs. And in walks Elvis Presley and, and with a couple of the musicians. And we pantomimed a sock hop. You didn't play the music and you couldn't do that.

• 27:45Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 27:46Speaker 01

  So you pantomimed or sang along with the song. So in he comes and I said, hi Elvis, Pat Boone. Oh, nice to meet you. Soft voice and I, and he didn't shake hands. He let me shake his hand.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  Nobody was teaching him some of these

• 28:02Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 28:02Speaker 01

  niceties of politeness. And, um, and so I said, Bill Randall thinks some big things may be head for, I don't know, but, but I hope so. And he leaned against the wall and Buddy's toes, then I could see he was shy.

• 28:17Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 28:19Speaker 01

  And when Bill Randall introduced him to the audience, he said, now, kids, it was about 600 kids, sock hop, and he'd be playing the records. I want you to give a nice welcome to, you haven't heard from him yet, but RCA Victor has just signed him and they think he's going to go somewhere. Let's give a nice welcome to young Elvis Presley. The name Elvis Presley was peculiar to it. It was not a usual sounding name. So out he comes and the girls liked the way he looked right away. I could see that looking

• 28:53Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 28:54Speaker 01

  the curtain, looking through the curtain. And he's saying, blue moon of Kentucky, keep on shining. Well, that was not country, that was not rock and roll at all.

• 29:03Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 29:03Speaker 01

  Which he made it, tried to make it sound rhythm and bluesish, which made it an interesting

• 29:10Billy Corgan?

  He's right on the knife edge.

• 29:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. But then when he finished that and the girls gave him a nice hand, they weren't screaming yet. And he wasn't wiggling yet either. So he said, uh, thank you very much. I'd like to do the other side of that record for you. Hope you like it. And he's saying, that's all right, mama.

• 29:26Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 29:27Speaker 01

  That's all right with me. Anyway, you please. And that was rhythm and blues. And, and I heard right then what Colonel Tom Parker and what RCA heard.

• 29:37Billy Corgan?

  Did you get it right away?

• 29:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I, and I, and then, and then when he finished, he left. And I went out and sang my three million selling hits at that time.

• 29:48Billy Corgan?

  Not bad.

• 29:48Speaker 01

  And later, when we were both, not much more than a year later, we were both renting homes in Bel Air.

• 29:55Billy Corgan?

  Ah, very good.

• 29:56Speaker 01

  And I go to see him and the boys, they had a pool table and, and, um, and I had dinner with him that night. He'd brought a couple in from Memphis to cook for him. And then we had chicken fried steak and we had turnip greens and

• 30:11Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 30:11Speaker 01

  and stuff that he really liked and I liked too. And um, and we, our friendship took up from then on.

• 30:18Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 30:19Speaker 01

  And we were two boys from Tennessee, me Nashville and Memphis. We stayed in touch, we kept, you know, we looked at each other's, uh, what was happening on the charts. We swapped positions on the charts for two or three years.

• 30:33Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 30:34Speaker 01

  And uh, and so we got to be friendly on a Sunday afternoon. It was not unusual for him to come over with one or two of his buddies and just walk in the backyard and find us in the pool.

• 30:45Billy Corgan?

  Ah.

• 30:45Speaker 01

  And my four girls get out, they didn't know he's a big star, but they, they get up and run over to see their friend and started jumping up on him. I said, girl, stop that, you're getting them all wet. Leave them alone, man, I like it. And I could tell he, the reason he was coming over to see me on a Sunday afternoon was I had something he wanted.

• 31:04Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 31:05Speaker 01

  He, he wanted a wife and he wanted kids too. Tom Parker wasn't having any of that. And, and so he never did really get that.

• 31:14Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 31:15Speaker 01

  But my friendship with, with him was that of a buddy, a fellow Tennessean, fellow recording artist.

• 31:21Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 31:22Speaker 01

  And just a friend.

• 31:23Billy Corgan?

  Well, you probably wouldn't know, I was friends with his daughter.

• 31:25Speaker 01

  No.

• 31:26Billy Corgan?

  At least I sang at her funeral and still, still stay in touch with the family.

• 31:30Speaker 01

  Gosh.

• 31:31Billy Corgan?

  So it was nice to get to know Elvis through his daughter's eyes.

• 31:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:36Billy Corgan?

  We had many, many conversations about her father.

• 31:38Speaker 01

  Wow, now, wait, Lisa Marie?

• 31:39Billy Corgan?

  Lisa Marie, oh yeah.

• 31:40Speaker 01

  Oh Lisa, yeah, I was with Lisa Marie soon, shortly before she died with, with her daughter.

• 31:47Billy Corgan?

  Oh Riley, yeah.

• 31:49Speaker 01

  Wait a minute.

• 31:50Billy Corgan?

  Well, they're, they're two twins. There's three daughters.

• 31:52Speaker 01

  There was one who.

• 31:53Billy Corgan?

  Riley's the one who's the actress and there's two twins, they're.

• 31:56Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm, I'm confusing with his wife.

• 31:58Billy Corgan?

  Oh, you're confusing with Priscilla, yeah.

• 32:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I, but I was with uh,

• 32:04Speaker 01

  with the daughter shortly before she passed.

• 32:06Billy Corgan?

  Ah.

• 32:08Speaker 01

  And you sang, you said?

• 32:09Billy Corgan?

  At Lisa's funeral, yeah.

• 32:10Speaker 01

  What did you sing?

• 32:12Billy Corgan?

  Uh, one of my songs, and I'll tell you a story if you don't mind me telling you.

• 32:16Speaker 01

  Please, I wanna.

• 32:17Billy Corgan?

  So, uh, uh, after Lisa passed, um, uh, you know, when, when you go through the emotions of losing someone that you, that you love, you know, you, you think a lot of things, you know, and Lisa passed, I think at fifty-four years old.

• 32:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:33Billy Corgan?

  So of course, there's that feeling of a life cut short.

• 32:36Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 32:37Billy Corgan?

  And I certainly had concerns about Lisa's family because, uh, Lisa's son had killed himself and that was super painful to Lisa, as you imagine. And I knew the son since he was a little boy. And then, of course, your daughter Riley's gone on to a lot of success in Hollywood. Uh, so my thoughts, of course, turned to the family. And as can often be the case, it's like, um, I didn't know what to do with what I was feeling.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 33:03Billy Corgan?

  And I didn't want to be that person who calls up and says, can I come? Because I assumed it was gonna be very much a private thing, which it turned out to be.

• 33:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:14Billy Corgan?

  And, uh, about a week went by and somebody reached out to me and said, hey, the family wants to contact you and invite you to the funeral. Are you okay with that? And I was so touched, you know, because it's like.

• 33:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 33:27Billy Corgan?

  It's sort of, uh, it made me feel that they understood that it was important for me to be there.

• 33:32Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 33:33Billy Corgan?

  And again, this is a, this is part of, private part of the thing. Well, in the, in the interim, the family decided because it was gonna be at Graceland and they were getting so many requests that they wanted to have a private part of the funeral and a public part of the funeral.

• 33:47Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 33:48Billy Corgan?

  So, um, so then they turned and they said, would you be open to singing at the funeral?

• 33:52Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 33:53Billy Corgan?

  And so I was really touched by that.

• 33:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:57Billy Corgan?

  Um.

• 33:58Speaker 01

  What, cause she, was she a big fan? You knew that?

• 34:01Billy Corgan?

  Was Lisa a fan?

• 34:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:02Billy Corgan?

  Oh, Lisa was a huge fan of my music. Lisa and I even wrote songs together at one point.

• 34:06Speaker 01

  Really?

• 34:07Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, we were close and, and, uh, and I feel blessed because I got to know the real Lisa Marie Presley.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 34:14Billy Corgan?

  But also she let me into her world and told me how she felt about her father. And there's a lot of stuff I know that's, that's never been made public, you know?

• 34:22Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 34:22Billy Corgan?

  And of course, there's nothing I would ever share out of respect to the family.

• 34:25Speaker 01

  And the situation with the Michael.

• 34:28Billy Corgan?

  All of it, all of it. Anyway, to finish my, my part, my part of this interview, we're talking to you.

• 34:34Speaker 01

  Well, I want to know.

• 34:35Billy Corgan?

  Oh, thank you. Um, because you asked, um, I'd never sung at a funeral before. I think, oh, well, that's not true. I sang at a friend's funeral and I didn't know what to sing, so I sang some summertime by Gershwin.

• 34:47Speaker 01

  I sang at Colonel Sanders funeral at his request.

• 34:51Billy Corgan?

  Oh, okay.

• 34:52Speaker 01

  And preview before he died and I sang peace, um, uh, amazing grace and nearer my God to thee.

• 34:59Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 35:00Speaker 01

  And you sang what?

• 35:01Billy Corgan?

  Okay. Well, at the friend's funeral, this is before Lisa Marie, I sang summertime. So this is the second time I'm going to sing at a funeral, but I don't know what to sing. And I, and because I was close with Lisa, I knew she would want me to sing one of my own songs. So, you know, I've written hundreds of songs, so I'm not sure what to choose. So I chose a song from around the time when we were really close in the nineties. There was a period where we were together a lot.

• 35:27Billy Corgan?

  And, uh, you know, it's in front of Graceland. Now, this is the public part of the funeral, 3,000 people on the lawn. They're doing a live, live broadcast and there's, you know, in the front row, there's the family, there's Priscilla.

• 35:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:41Billy Corgan?

  So I come up and it's cold. It's a, I don't remember. It was still cold outside. So it's pretty cold. And I started singing a song of mine called Da Sheila. That wasn't a hit song, more of like a pretty folk song.

• 35:53Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 35:54Billy Corgan?

  And beneath me, cause I'm just focused on doing a good job.

• 35:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:57Billy Corgan?

  I hear people start to weep.

• 35:59Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 36:00Billy Corgan?

  And, uh, and, but I'm just assuming they're in grief. So of course they're weeping. Well, after the funeral and after everything happened, uh, her daughter wrote me and said, that was the song my mother used to play in the car over and over again.

• 36:17Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 36:18Billy Corgan?

  So when you started playing that song, it's like you knew the song to play. So that was God speaking.

• 36:23Speaker 01

  Guidance. Yeah.

• 36:24Billy Corgan?

  Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So somehow I chose the one song.

• 36:29Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 36:29Billy Corgan?

  That was healing to the, to the family because of the connection with hers.

• 36:33Speaker 01

  Oh, man.

• 36:34Billy Corgan?

  Thank you for asking.

• 36:34Speaker 01

  How wonderful that is.

• 36:36Billy Corgan?

  I know. Well, praise God on that.

• 36:37Speaker 01

  So neat. Um, the way those things do happen and, and you're grateful.

• 36:43Billy Corgan?

  Oh, I mean.

• 36:43Speaker 01

  I mean, when Colonel Sanders, he had, he had blessed.

• 36:49Speaker 01

  A relative of mine who gave him a franchise in Kansas City next to an airbase. What you can imagine.

• 36:56Billy Corgan?

  Oh, good business.

• 36:58Speaker 01

  Kentucky Fried.

• 37:00Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, next to an airbase, yeah.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  And, you know, he carried a bag of Limburger cheese with him everywhere he went. He loved Limburger. Well, of course, that gave him a particular aroma as well. But he, uh, but he asked me on the way to the, to my relative's car. I'd help pick him up at the airport, Colonel Sanders. He said, he said, I like the way you sing. Would you sing at my funeral?

• 37:23Billy Corgan?

  Goodness.

• 37:24Speaker 01

  I said, well, I will, but I hope it's not soon. I've got, I've got some things booked. I hope it's not right away. Oh, no, no, he said, I just, I just, if you would do it though, I'll tell my lawyer to contact you, which he did. And I think they were owned by Shenley, one of the big liquor companies by then, Kentucky Fried. And, um, and so, but I did sing this at his request.

• 37:49Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 37:49Speaker 01

  Those two songs.

• 37:50Billy Corgan?

  That's interesting.

• 37:51Speaker 01

  And, and I, that's a lovely thing for somebody to want you to do.

• 37:55Billy Corgan?

  Oh, what an honor. Yeah. Just to circle back to Elvis for a second, um, because you've had this incredible life and you knew the man, but you can also reflect on where he came from.

• 38:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:07Billy Corgan?

  Like yourself. The cult of Elvis in his death, here it is over 50 years later.

• 38:13Speaker 01

  It's like a shrine there.

• 38:14Billy Corgan?

  It's, but it's amazing that Graceland continues to be, I think, uh, I know, I know one of the people that's involved heavy with Graceland. He told me that outside of the White House, the Graceland is the second most visited home in America. There's a, there's a, I think the museum across the street is 275,000 square feet. We've had two Elvis movies released in the last five years or so.

• 38:35Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, boy, the last one, fabulous. This guy Austin did an incredible job.

• 38:42Billy Corgan?

  Have you seen the new one where it's all the live footage?

• 38:44Speaker 01

  No.

• 38:44Billy Corgan?

  It just come out like, like about a month ago.

• 38:47Speaker 01

  No, I will see it.

• 38:47Billy Corgan?

  They took all this footage and they've been able to clean it up. So it's behind the scenes footage, but also performance footage and put it in kind of one concert film. It's very dynamic. You might enjoy it.

• 38:56Speaker 01

  Oh, I know I will, I will.

• 38:58Billy Corgan?

  But how do you reflect, um, just from a perspective of, you know, again, you knew the man at the very beginning of this journey, that the institution of Elvis, the cult of Elvis, the mythology of Elvis just continues to grow.

• 39:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, it does, it does. Well, when he was at the International Hotel. I went to see him and there and see the show and then he had the whole upstairs, the penthouse was his dressing room.

• 39:26Speaker 01

  And of course, the show was dynamic. He was incredible, of course. And we were glad to see each other. He says, can we talk a minute? And we walked into a closet, closed the door.

• 39:39Speaker 01

  He said, I wish I could go to church like you do. I said, you can, why not? No, he said, I can't. He said, I go to a church. And the kids all want to make a big scene. They want autographs. I said, you know what? I've had a few hit records. It happens if I go to somebody else's church where I'm not a member. But do what I do. Just say, hey, kids. I'll sign your bulletins after church, but I'm here for the same reason you are. But he was just really uncomfortable socially. And he was afraid of interrupting or taking attention away from the preacher. So he just felt like he couldn't do it. So but then he said, do you know Earl Roberts? I said, sure.

• 40:23Speaker 01

  He said, I'd like to talk to him sometime. I said, let me give you a clue. Your name is Elvis Presley. Get on the phone, go to call Earl Roberts University, say, this is Elvis Presley. I'd like to talk to Earl Roberts. You'll be on, he'll be on the phone. He couldn't do it.

• 40:41Speaker 01

  Somebody had to go, be a go between. So I called Earl Roberts. He flew to Las Vegas. He told me later that they had an afternoon together. And that he said, the boy is spiritually starved. He's hungry for the church experiences he was having as a kid. He kept his musicians, Tony Brown and the others, and the quartets after many of his shows.

• 41:06Billy Corgan?

  Oh, he'd step all night singing gospel music.

• 41:08Speaker 01

  Gospel, and he knew all of the songs. He was, he wanted it, but his career, his concept of himself and what would kept him from having what he wanted. So I really felt terribly about that. And of course, the end of the movie. What is, I forget the song he's singing at the end. Was it? I think it was either, it was either Ebb Tide or How Great Thou Art. I forget which.

• 41:33Billy Corgan?

  Probably How Great Thou Art, yeah.

• 41:35Speaker 01

  And he sang it amazingly well. In spite of the weight, in spite of the fatigue, in spite of. So his soul was singing its hunger.

• 41:46Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 41:47Speaker 01

  Out and I, I knew that I've, I've hurt for him, but I, I feel like he's,

• 41:54Speaker 01

  he's in a good place now, I think.

• 41:57Billy Corgan?

  Maybe, I mean, you tell me, but it seems to me that he was dealing with so much more than we could have even imagined when he was alive. That level of celebrity and that level of attention and that level of focus.

• 42:10Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 42:11Billy Corgan?

  It's still to this point is singular. There's no, there's no other artist that has approached that level of fascination and attention and.

• 42:22Speaker 01

  I made a statement once when Lisa Marie died and, you know, he'd been, Elvis had been, had so much tragedy, broken marriage and, uh, you know, he's not getting like some of the things he wanted as much or more than his career.

• 42:40Speaker 01

  And I made the statement that the one thing that may be worse than having too little.

• 42:47Billy Corgan?

  Too much.

• 42:48Speaker 01

  Is having too much.

• 42:49Billy Corgan?

  Interesting.

• 42:50Speaker 01

  Because having too much can be more unsettling and even destructive in your life.

• 42:57Billy Corgan?

  Yes.

• 42:58Speaker 01

  And I don't have to expand on it.

• 43:00Billy Corgan?

  No, it's true.

• 43:04Billy Corgan?

  Let's go back a little bit because I love this period of music. I know you mentioned before the Ozark Jubilee, which your father-in-law hosted.

• 43:13Billy Corgan?

  I went to find some clips. I found a clip of you and, and Red singing together. I can't remember which song it was. I think it was that you, you sang a bit and then he sang a bit and then you guys sang together. I can't remember which song it was, but.

• 43:25Speaker 01

  Um, my memory's not.

• 43:27Billy Corgan?

  It was a hit, a big hit of his. It's okay, but, but, uh, but also I, I, I did this thing, you know, this, the amazing thing about the internet. I said, please list out all the guests that were on the Ozark Jubilee show and the list was like, it was incredible. So you being around that, I assume you went to

• 43:44Speaker 01

  I did.

• 43:45Billy Corgan?

  Some of the shows.

• 43:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I had him on my Pat Boone Chevy show. We sang together, um, I think it was, uh, I don't think we did Chattanooga Shoeshine Boy, but.

• 43:55Billy Corgan?

  I think it is something like.

• 43:56Speaker 01

  Y'all come.

• 43:57Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 43:57Speaker 01

  Y'all come, y'all come, we all, we all get together, y'all come. And, um, and it was just a couple of good country songs on that.

• 44:05Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 44:06Speaker 01

  And then, of course, I'd already been on his show, which was strange, but wonderful that, uh, the kid that, that tentatively asked if he could marry his daughter.

• 44:17Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 44:17Speaker 01

  Was now selling hit records and having television and, and coming on his show. It was, uh, these two things, him on my show and mine, me on his were, were just wonderful moments in both our lives.

• 44:31Billy Corgan?

  But it struck me that at such a young age, through your father-in-law's show, you know, I mean, this incredible, I like, I, I found one clip of him singing with Bob Wills. I'm a huge Bob Wills fan.

• 44:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:42Billy Corgan?

  So here you got these incredible country artists. And then I looked at who you had on your, your show. Let me, let me throw some names at you.

• 44:49Speaker 01

  Good.

• 44:50Billy Corgan?

  Uh, 115 episodes of your show. It's called the Chevy showroom, right?

• 44:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right.

• 44:54Billy Corgan?

  Uh, Andy Williams, Ames Brothers, these are just, I'm just cherry picking.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:00Billy Corgan?

  Frankie Avalon, Tony Bennett, Count Basie, Ella Fitzgerald, Ginger Rogers, Johnny Mathis, the Mills Brothers, who were

• 45:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 45:07Billy Corgan?

  Incredible.

• 45:07Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 45:08Billy Corgan?

  Peggy Lee, Dinah Shore, Joe Stafford.

• 45:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:10Billy Corgan?

  These are just, I mean, Mel Torme, Harry, Harry Belafonte, we'll get to Harry Belafonte in a second.

• 45:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:15Billy Corgan?

  But, uh, just at such a young age, you were so immersed in all this incredible American talent.

• 45:21Speaker 01

  And I'm 21, 22.

• 45:22Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. Did you get starry eyed and all that?

• 45:26Speaker 01

  No, I, I, I was, I was nervous and actually, you know.

• 45:33Speaker 01

  For a guy who had had a lot of singing experience, but it was all local.

• 45:38Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 45:38Speaker 01

  But I discovered quickly that it was the same nationally. It was still a camera with red lights and I could be myself. And if these people were willing to come on my show with me, even though I was awed by Nat King Cole and I did a trio with Ella Fitzgerald and Nat King Cole and even scattered just for a second or two with Ella Fitzgerald and all these and you know Mel Tormaine, my wife was a big fan of his. He was the Velvet Fog.

• 46:09Billy Corgan?

  Incredible singer.

• 46:10Speaker 01

  And great singer and with Joe Stafford, she had perfect pitch.

• 46:15Billy Corgan?

  Ah.

• 46:15Speaker 01

  And my musicians didn't take that into account when we did a country medley with just a guitar. And it was a sizable medley singing and I'm thinking this, she never hits a sour note. She's perfect pitch, but I managed to sing well. I've heard it and seen it, you know, since then. And I really held my own. It was just, I don't know, some kind of inner brat, uh, braveness, you know, just that I'll do it. I'm asked to do it. I can do it. And I did. And so I'm amazed at myself, looking back because of the pressure, the

• 47:00Speaker 01

  one, there were things.

• 47:02Billy Corgan?

  Live television.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  Live television. One time, uh, the television is about to come on. I'm about to sing an Irving Berlin song and we had notified Irving Berlin. It's called Lazy.

• 47:14Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 47:14Speaker 01

  Lazy. I'd like to be lazy. I want to be lazy. And, and I was told it was one of his favorite songs of his. So we had a secretary call Irving Berlin, tell him, and the secretary said, well, what time, Mr. Berlin likes Pat Boone singing. What time is the show? It's nine o'clock. Oh, it's a little late for Mr. Berlin. But I'll tell him, perhaps he'll stay up and watch at nine. And now I've got the words on teleprompter, of course. And we've got a set that's a, looks like a riverbank. And I'm in overalls and I've got a straw in my mouth and a straw hat.

• 47:55Speaker 01

  And, and about 15 seconds before we hit air and the red lights come on, the guy comes down and starts shaking the camera. And I said, what's the matter? He said, the teleprompter stopped. What? The tele, and I, you know, I hadn't memorized the words. I had them on. That was one of the ways I could relax was I had teleprompter or cue cards. And, and the red lights come on and I have to sing lazy. I wanna be lazy. I wanna lie back in the grass and try to think of a word that rhymes with grass. I don't know what I sang. Somewhere we kept the film and I haven't looked at it. Oh, my goodness.

• 48:39Speaker 01

  We never heard from Irving Berlin, except that I did an album of Irving Berlin's songs. And he wrote the backliner for my album and said, I like the way Boone sings my songs. He sings the melody the way I wrote them. And, and there was a hand, like he had signed it, but it wasn't his hand. It was meant to look like Irving Berlin's hand on the back of the album. But those, those things happened one time and this was on bloopers and that show of Dick Clark's. But where I'm doing my opening song and the orchestra's going and the singers and everything, and you can hear the musicians, you can, but you can't hear my voice.

• 49:23Speaker 01

  And so it was a matter of the boom mic has gone out and I'm there singing faintly in the background. And so the musicians, or not musicians, but technicians or who are the stagehands tried to get another.

• 49:37Billy Corgan?

  Mic in place.

• 49:38Speaker 01

  Mic in place. Instead, they knocked the set down behind me. And, and I, I, I never, I never finished. I finished the song, but you never heard me till after the first commercial.

• 49:49Billy Corgan?

  Did you see the set getting knocked down?

• 49:51Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Oh, I knew it.

• 49:52Billy Corgan?

  Did you just showbiz?

• 49:53Speaker 01

  I just kept going until, till applause. The audience gave me a great hand and we went away to a commercial.

• 50:00Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 50:00Speaker 01

  Which was filmed and then when it comes back, I couldn't resist. So when the red lights came on again, I, I just act like I didn't, that the, and the poor sound man in the studio.

• 50:11Billy Corgan?

  Oh goodness, not again.

• 50:13Speaker 01

  I just couldn't resist, but I learned that I could, you take it as it happened.

• 50:19Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  You know, if it happened, it happened and you can't change it. So you go with it.

• 50:23Billy Corgan?

  Did you notice then the difference in, by being on television, you sort of wrecked the recognition faster factor on, on the street must've gone through the roof.

• 50:31Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, very much so. Yeah. That, that we got, when we went to Disneyland, we tried, my family and I, four daughters, she dressed her daughters like her in outfits. Well, she, she changed that up, but still four little girls and her and me. And I put some tissue under my lip so it stuck and I, and I got some good clothes from Goodwill and a hat and disguised ourselves as best we could. And we got away with it and I talked to my daughters like this, you know, and I've got padding in my lips and I thought I was disguised, but somehow I did it too much and, and I began

• 51:12Speaker 01

  to get recognized and we had to come home because we couldn't, we couldn't enjoy Disneyland with everybody wanting autographs.

• 51:20Billy Corgan?

  Is it, is it true that, that there was something happened with the network about Harry Belafonte and that's, is that, is that a true story?

• 51:28Speaker 01

  True story.

• 51:28Billy Corgan?

  Do you mind telling us?

• 51:29Speaker 01

  And I, it, I didn't think anybody was ever going to know this, but somehow it did get out when Jamie Foxx, um, coming out of the gym.

• 51:42Speaker 01

  Years later, and, and he said, let me ask you something. He said, I understand when you were doing your show, Harry Belafonte called him, wanted to be, or offered to be on your show. And, and you wanted him to do it, but Chevrolet wouldn't allow it. And ABC wouldn't allow it because of his

• 52:02Billy Corgan?

  Civil rights.

• 52:03Speaker 01

  Civil rights. They didn't want him to be on my show.

• 52:05Billy Corgan?

  Just to be clear, that he was, he was very out in public as a civil rights leader.

• 52:10Speaker 01

  Very much so.

• 52:11Billy Corgan?

  So that would have been, it wasn't simply that he was African American or

• 52:14Speaker 01

  Right, right. He was

• 52:15Billy Corgan?

  Caribbean American.

• 52:16Speaker 01

  And he was so outspoken that Chevrolet was suffering in the South. I mean, this was late 50s.

• 52:23Billy Corgan?

  Oh, I see.

• 52:23Speaker 01

  And, and, and so the ad agency and everybody had to quickly say, no, no, we can't have Harry Belafonte. I was stunned by it, you know, I, I'm from Nashville, I born in Jacksonville. And I knew what, what it was all about. But I said, look, it says it's Pat Boone's Chevy showroom, doesn't it?

• 52:44Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 52:45Speaker 01

  If Pat Boone has to say no to the guy that was currently the most popular performer in the world, Harry Belafonte, then it's not the Pat Boone show. And I'm going to have to ask you to take the show from here.

• 52:59Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 52:59Speaker 01

  I'm not going to, I'm not going to say no to Harry Belafonte.

• 53:02Billy Corgan?

  And you didn't tell that story at the time?

• 53:03Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no. Because we finally, they finally said, well, can you guarantee that if we have Harry Belafonte on, there won't be any civil rights statements or anything? I said, look, I know he's a gentleman. He, he had called me and said, I like the way you treat your guests. Well, he was referring to the guests like Ella and Johnny Mathis and the Mills Brothers and everybody.

• 53:29Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 53:30Speaker 01

  As guests on my show and loving them. And I said, I'm sure we will not make any civil rights statements, but I was still so uncomfortable. And they, but it was like, we only had about four shows left in that season. I just didn't renew.

• 53:48Billy Corgan?

  I see.

• 53:49Speaker 01

  I just said, I'm not going to keep doing a show if I can't have the guests I want to have on my own show. I'm aware of the problem, but I'm not going to perpetuate it. So.

• 54:01Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 54:03Speaker 01

  So we, I did quit my own show in effect and went to specials instead.

• 54:08Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 54:09Speaker 01

  And did well, but, and I, maybe it was a relief because it was to do that show every week, 39 weeks a year.

• 54:18Billy Corgan?

  That's a grind.

• 54:19Speaker 01

  It was a pull on me.

• 54:20Billy Corgan?

  Plus, you were probably still doing live gigs and movies, right?

• 54:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, in the summertime, I took summertime off, 13 weeks and two summers, I let Dick Van Dyke take over my, my time period.

• 54:34Billy Corgan?

  Whatever happened to him?

• 54:34Speaker 01

  That was his first, and this special and, on his great special recently, it shows him and me doing the scene from my, my show. And it was after that, that he, doing my show and he filled in for me that, that got his show.

• 54:50Billy Corgan?

  Dick Van Dyke show. I didn't know that. That's cool.

• 54:52Speaker 01

  And then Andy Williams, same thing. The next summer, I let Andy Williams.

• 54:56Billy Corgan?

  Yes.

• 54:57Speaker 01

  Who'd been a guest with me a couple of times. He took over hosting his own show. So Dick Van Dyke and Andy Williams both owed me in some small measure, the start of their own television hosting careers, because they filled in for me in my show. But all these things, as I say, at that young age, it was, it was miraculous that I could just keep walking straight. I mean, it was all so much pressure, but I just took each moment as it came.

• 55:29Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 55:30Speaker 01

  And managed to, to perform and had two command performances with the Queen. The first one went well. I was still in college doing rock and roll and I was invited to sing for the Queen and Prince.

• 55:45Billy Corgan?

  What song did you sing?

• 55:45Speaker 01

  Phil. Oh, I sang Ain't That a Shame and some of my, my country, I mean, my rock and roll songs. And I wasn't up to April Love yet.

• 55:55Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 55:56Speaker 01

  Uh, those songs, I was just singing the rhythm and blues, rock and roll songs. And met the Queen after the, uh, after the performance and she was very nice. And I just learned that the men have to, uh, bow. And if she offers her hand, you take it. If you don't offer your hand, you, if she offers you hers and, and you say, your majesty. If you're a woman, you curtsey. But you know, that first time I was still in college at Columbia. But now I graduate and several years go by and one of my movies is, is being uh, seen there and it, I think somehow it got connected to another command performance.

• 56:38Speaker 01

  Maybe because I was there at the right time. And so I, I get in line after my performance, which went well. And now she's got to run the gauntlet afterwards of the guest and thank them for all performance. And Princess Anne and Margaret were fans. And so I'm, I'm feeling, I'm suave, you know, a little blasé. Peter Sellers is over here, Peter Finch is over here, uh, and, and Claudia Cardinal and all these are.

• 57:07Billy Corgan?

  Not bad, Claudia Cardinal.

• 57:08Speaker 01

  Right. And they've performed and they're so nervous. They want to be nervous about all I do is bow and say, your majesty. Well, but now as she gets close to me, I start feeling the flutter. I keep reminding myself, your majesty. So here she stands in front of me, even with her crown, she comes up to about here. And, and I said, your majesty, and I look up and she extends her hand. I take her hand, she says, we met before. I said, we did? I, I, I, I mean, you, you, you remember? I didn't think she would remember.

• 57:40Billy Corgan?

  Oh, wow.

• 57:41Speaker 01

  My first command performance, singing rock and roll.

• 57:44Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 57:45Speaker 01

  And, and it was so fu- out of my, I mean, I take her hand, what she offered. We met before. We did? I, I, I mean, now, how gauche can you get? Uh, to say to the Queen of England when she says, we met before. To say, we did. And there was a picture in London Times, I think it was, of her talking to Claudia Cardinal, Cardinal next. And they were laughing at something. Guess what they were laughing at? Uh, you saw me still looking over the Queen with this shocked look on my face. I had just said, we did?

• 58:23Billy Corgan?

  Speaking of Hollywood, because you brought it up.

• 58:28Billy Corgan?

  If all you'd ever done has been a successful TV host and a musician, you'd, you'd, there'd be plenty to talk about. But then add Hollywood on top of that. That must have been wild to get that call.

• 58:39Speaker 01

  All at once. I mean, it was all at once.

• 58:41Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. And your first movie, which was Bernadine, right?

• 58:44Speaker 01

  Bernadine, yes.

• 58:45Billy Corgan?

  I mean.

• 58:46Speaker 01

  Johnny Mercer wrote the song and.

• 58:48Billy Corgan?

  And you sang the title song, right?

• 58:49Speaker 01

  Title song.

• 58:50Billy Corgan?

  Johnny Mercer.

• 58:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, Johnny Mercer. Yeah. And.

• 58:54Billy Corgan?

  Because you get to hang out with Johnny Mercer.

• 58:55Speaker 01

  Well, no, but I got to meet him and he was a southern gentleman, as you know. And just a songsmith of the first order.

• 59:04Billy Corgan?

  Unbelievable.

• 59:05Speaker 01

  And so I, that was an honor. Now, the next is, is April Love. And Sammy Fain and Paul Francis Webster write the song for me. For title song of my second movie. And I'm, I'm wanting it to be something, it sounds like it could be a hit record.

• 59:23Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 59:23Speaker 01

  But it was a beautiful love ballad. And when Sammy at the piano, he plays it for me. April love is for the very young. Every star is a wishing star that shines for you. And, and I said to the guys. I can't believe it. I was saying it to them, these great, great songwriters. I said, you know, we're in, in a rock and roll time now. And this, and I want the song to be a hit. It's too pretty. It's, it's just a, it's a nice, it's a nice love song. It's not a, I can't imagine me singing a rock and roll beat to it. Can we at least do something in an intro, maybe to make it sound more?

• 1:00:08Speaker 01

  Interesting or exciting? They said, like what? I said, well. Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, April love. We can do that. Of course they can do that.

• 1:00:19Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 1:00:20Speaker 01

  And they did that. And then Connie Francis borrowed it. That intro, where the boys are. And I mean, there's nothing new about that.

• 1:00:31Billy Corgan?

  Sure.

• 1:00:32Speaker 01

  Those triplets, but, but to have the effrontery, really as young as I was, to say, can we do something?

• 1:00:38Billy Corgan?

  Well, that's the brilliance of youth. We think we know what we're doing. And somehow we did. In our.

• 1:00:43Speaker 01

  And it worked out because April.

• 1:00:45Billy Corgan?

  Kind of worked out, right?

• 1:00:46Speaker 01

  Became a huge hit and. The movie too.

• 1:00:49Billy Corgan?

  So, as I said already, there's so much of your life to talk about. So I'm cherry picking. So I was curious about Journey to the Center of the Earth. Because James Mason is a particular favorite of mine.

• 1:01:02Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:01:04Billy Corgan?

  If you could just talk about that a little bit.

• 1:01:06Speaker 01

  Well, sure. James Mason, I mean, I was. I won't say awestruck because I by now was realizing that all these major stars are just people.

• 1:01:17Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:17Speaker 01

  And yes, they've done some big things, but they're just people.

• 1:01:20Billy Corgan?

  Well, and they also at this point kind of know who you are. It's not like.

• 1:01:23Speaker 01

  Well, I was, yeah, I was having a good deal of success. So James was always very nice to me. He was standoffish, sort of. He spent his time in his trailer. He didn't. Spend a lot of time sitting around in director's chairs, schmoozing with the cast or anything else. He'd go in and read. I don't know what he did. We could hear him. He liked to hum a lot.

• 1:01:49Billy Corgan?

  He had that incredible voice.

• 1:01:50Speaker 01

  Maybe that's what getting ready for the sound of his voice. And, and so he and I got along fine, but I nearly. There was a scene that happened in that movie, which could have been extremely dangerous and was dangerous. But a scene where I'm separated, I'm now somewhere near the center of the earth, but which, you know, the center of the earth. We didn't depict it as it has to be. It has to be in Inferno. But it was a city of lost city of Atlantis. And but that was in the script. And so.

• 1:02:30Speaker 01

  Uh, there was a scene in which I've gotten cut off from everybody. I'm gonna be lost forever and I'm wearing wool pants and it's hot and I cut off, somehow I cut off my pants just to shorts and no shirt and, uh, and I'm sitting down doing that. Meanwhile, there's a pile of white, it turns out supposed to be sand, white sand and my camera or my, or, uh, or my canteen, one of the two, I forget, which slips away onto the top of this mound of white sand and the script calls for me to reach for it and when I do, it gives way and I fall and it starts me on a long, you know, foray down through

• 1:03:15Billy Corgan?

  You're going to the center of the earth, yes.

• 1:03:17Speaker 01

  Going down through tunnels and with white sand following me, but it wasn't sand. It was white gypsum crystals.

• 1:03:25Billy Corgan?

  Ah.

• 1:03:26Speaker 01

  It looked like sand. It wouldn't melt and, and, and it, the scene called, it was a plat- a trapdoor kind of thing.

• 1:03:36Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  It was on that and when I reached for it and got on it, it would fall and I was supposed to fall with it into this about four foot opening, three foot opening and I'd stay bunched up and the director was Henry Levin. He said, "Look, once, once that you fall, we can only do this once. So when it falls, you stay down until you hear me yell, 'Cut.'" Well, I did what he said. I reached for it and it fell and now more sand is coming from above. I mean, in great profusion and I'm, and I know I can't breathe. I don't want to breathe all that salt I thought it was and so I'm trying to hold my breath and not take anything in and I never heard him yell, "Cut." All I do hear

• 1:04:21Speaker 01

  him yell is, "Camera three, did you get it?" Uh, "Camera two," and he forgot to yell, "Cut."

• 1:04:26Billy Corgan?

  Goodness.

• 1:04:27Speaker 01

  And the guy up in the, in the catwalk, catwalk, said, "Mr. Levin, you better get Pat out of there quick." "Oh, yes, cut." And, and they, and they picked, picked me out of there. Those gypsum crystals, if I had somehow inhaled those, they would still be in my lungs right now. I mean, they could have caused me a lot of problems and who knows, it could have, I could have suffocated, but thank God it didn't. But James Mason, I just say he was, he was fun though. He was witty and, and we got along great. I thoroughly enjoyed having the experience of.

• 1:05:05Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:06Speaker 01

  Working with him.

• 1:05:08Billy Corgan?

  When you're in this kind of white hot middle of American success, and it's very particular. There's the English version, but the American version is very particular and, and you've stood there a few times.

• 1:05:21Billy Corgan?

  What gave you confidence or strength? Was it your, your marriage, what your family, your faith? Like what, what kept your feet on the ground? Because, you know, nobody has a cross word to say about you. You know, you live, well.

• 1:05:39Speaker 01

  I became great joke material, by the way.

• 1:05:41Billy Corgan?

  Well, that's kind of what I was getting at, you know?

• 1:05:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:44Billy Corgan?

  You, you, you were held up as.

• 1:05:45Speaker 01

  I was so square.

• 1:05:46Billy Corgan?

  So square, you were held up as the Paragon of Virgins.

• 1:05:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:49Billy Corgan?

  But now in the world that we live in now, your consistency stands out as a bright light. Where normally people get wrapped up in a lot of terrible things in this town.

• 1:06:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, it was my wife and my, my faith. And the fact that when Shirley and I moved to, to Beverly Hills from New Jersey, from Teaneck, New Jersey, it all happened so fast, but,

• 1:06:15Speaker 01

  but we, we had these four little girls and Shirley was thinking very practically, but so was I. But we need a house with bathrooms and, and bedrooms for four girls. And I never forget when the house where we, where I'm still living,

• 1:06:34Speaker 01

  it was a nice house on a nice piece of property at the corner, literally the corner of Beverly and Sunset.

• 1:06:44Speaker 01

  And, and the man wanted 200,000. Well, I was making some money, but I said, that's a fifth of a million dollars. And they said, yeah, but we'll, the realtor said, but we'll, you know, we'll, we'll haggle and, and offer him 159,000. I said, won't he be insulted? I mean, I didn't know about this. And he said, well, no, but then he may come down to 195 and then we'll offer him 165. And that's the way we do it.

• 1:07:12Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:13Speaker 01

  So we offered him 159 and he took it. And it turned out, we didn't know this, but they had raised three sons in this house, which was only 10 years old at that point.

• 1:07:23Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 1:07:23Speaker 01

  It had been built in 1950 and this was 60. And he had another business, Knickerbocker Toys in New York, and he wanted to get there. And he was afraid his wife was not want to leave. And so he took the 159.

• 1:07:37Billy Corgan?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:07:38Speaker 01

  And I don't have to tell you that the.

• 1:07:42Billy Corgan?

  You did well, right? With your investment.

• 1:07:44Speaker 01

  The value has, has appreciated. And so it was, but we were in church every Sunday, Sunday school. And as, as was our custom for a while, be at church on Sunday night. It got to be, I was too busy for that. On prayer meeting on Wednesday nights, I got to be always doing stuff, getting ready for the next TV show, that whatever the movie scenes. And so I would be excused, but Shirley and the girls kept up that schedule.

• 1:08:15Billy Corgan?

  Wow.

• 1:08:16Speaker 01

  And I can truthfully tell you that four daughters, raised in Beverly Hills, not one of them ever had an apartment of her own or lived alone. They lived at the house until some guy asked to marry them. And we said yes, and she said yes, what really wanted to marry. Like Debbie's married to Rosie Clooney's son, Gabriel Ferrer.

• 1:08:36Billy Corgan?

  Oh, I didn't know that.

• 1:08:37Speaker 01

  Yeah. And Jose Ferrer's son. And each one were, were chosen by and chose wonderful mates. And so I would take them to the wedding. There'd be the wedding and once or twice sang, but I, but I was so choked up, I didn't sing very well at all because I was so moved. But these, we kept our family life going.

• 1:09:00Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  And the church life going too. And in the midst of all these other performances, I would be called on to sing to youth groups and to, and to other, other groups who would want me to talk on spiritual terms as well as my career, even businessmen's luncheons. I always enjoyed it because I would talk about the things that they were interested in about my career, but always it would be questioned, how do you sandwich this with your, as you just asked, you know, with your, your faith? And that gave me the opening to talk about my faith, which I wanted to.

• 1:09:40Speaker 01

  I was never bashful about it. However, it, it was Johnny Carson one time said Pat Boone came home from a night out with chocolate milk on his mouth. Chocolate. His lips all brown from chocolate milk. I was on Phil Harris, Andy Williams show. Phil Harris, the comedian, Phil, uh, band director.

• 1:10:07Billy Corgan?

  Was married to Alice Fane.

• 1:10:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. And, and so Phil and Andy and I are talking and this was, this was in the script, except for the punchline. And they said, you, Phil said, you drink, don't you Pat? You do drink. You have a drink now. And I said, no, I knew he meant alcohol. Now, of course, I, I did have wine with milk, but I knew he was, I mean, wine with meal. But, but I, I know you wanted me to say, no, I don't drink. And you don't drink nothing never? I said, no, you know, why? He said to Andy Williams, can you imagine waking up in the morning, knowing that's as good as you're gonna feel all day long? That was

• 1:10:48Speaker 01

  the joke. So then, and I laughed and then he said, but then he said, come on, Pat, we, I, I, we kid you, we love you. We, you live the way you want to live and it's fine. And in fact, if I've had a son, I'd wanna have us, want him to be just like you till he's about three years old.

• 1:11:10Speaker 01

  And so I got all these, and Dean Martin would repeat that in his act.

• 1:11:14Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:15Speaker 01

  In his shows. That Booney's so religious. And you know, anyway, he, I, I forget all the jokes that they were making about me.

• 1:11:24Billy Corgan?

  Well, I remember.

• 1:11:24Speaker 01

  I just went with them and, and would repeat them in my own show. I was enjoying the jokes.

• 1:11:29Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:30Speaker 01

  And, uh, and, but the only thing was, there were several movie roles that I would like to have done. One was Sand Pebbles, which went to, um, uh, oh, go Sand Pebbles.

• 1:11:44Billy Corgan?

  Kim Novak?

• 1:11:44Speaker 01

  Motorcycle guy. No, no, the, the guy that.

• 1:11:47Billy Corgan?

  Oh, the guy. Marlon Brando?

• 1:11:49Speaker 01

  No, goodness. Steve McQueen.

• 1:11:51Billy Corgan?

  Steve McQueen?

• 1:11:52Speaker 01

  Steve McQueen. Uh, and, and the director, producer of the film, when I was proposed, it was Navy Lieutenant. I'd played a newbie lieutenant in a couple of films already. And, and, uh, he said, no, no, we don't want, he's too religious. Like, it's his image. We don't want his image.

• 1:12:10Billy Corgan?

  Too clean, yeah.

• 1:12:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. And, uh, and so that cost me, but, you know, I got to do a lot of other things and

• 1:12:17Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:18Speaker 01

  it was okay.

• 1:12:19Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. Did you, how can I put it?

• 1:12:24Billy Corgan?

  Because I remember, you know, I was born in 1967. So seeing you on television in the seventies, and you were on television in the seventies a lot.

• 1:12:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Commercials.

• 1:12:34Billy Corgan?

  Yeah. I mean, you, you, you know, at that point.

• 1:12:36Speaker 01

  And show, my show and specials.

• 1:12:39Billy Corgan?

  Sure. But I'm saying, uh, there's certain people that stick out in my mind of the seventies as, as being such big stars, they were sort of held up in a certain light. And you were one of those people. Bob Hope would have been another one where it's like,

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:52Billy Corgan?

  you guys are almost institutionally famous.

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  I appear with him on his shows. He let me do sketches and, and, uh,

• 1:13:00Speaker 01

  The feminine, female comedian that was Carol Burnett.

• 1:13:05Billy Corgan?

  Carol Burnett, yeah.

• 1:13:05Speaker 01

  She was a guest on my show, on the Chevy Show, going way, way back.

• 1:13:10Billy Corgan?

  When she was still young comedian.

• 1:13:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, and then she became the biggest, one of the biggest stars. She had me come on her show and do sketches with the cast and sing a long, long duet with her.

• 1:13:21Billy Corgan?

  Oh, wow.

• 1:13:21Speaker 01

  So, these were great. Yeah, those were good times as they were accepting me as Mr. Square. But, but still able to perform. And that's when the, when the stuff hit the fan, when I did a heavy metal album. I did an album of heavy metal classics.

• 1:13:41Billy Corgan?

  I, I think I heard about it at the time.

• 1:13:43Speaker 01

  Have you not heard the music?

• 1:13:44Billy Corgan?

  I have heard the music, yes.

• 1:13:46Speaker 01

  Because it was big band jazz is what it was. And I was treating those songs that all the, the writers of those songs.

• 1:13:53Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:54Speaker 01

  Loved it because I was treating their songs as real music.

• 1:13:56Billy Corgan?

  There's a lot of great songs there, yeah.

• 1:13:58Speaker 01

  And, and.

• 1:13:59Billy Corgan?

  We even had guests that are my heroes, Ronnie James Dio's one, Richie Blackmore.

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  He sang with me on Holy Diver, that high voice of his.

• 1:14:07Billy Corgan?

  Oh, credible voice.

• 1:14:08Speaker 01

  On my record of Holy Diver, they all treated me with respect and were glad.

• 1:14:12Billy Corgan?

  I'm sure they did.

• 1:14:13Speaker 01

  Was doing their song.

• 1:14:14Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:15Speaker 01

  In fact, Ozzy moved in next door, Ozzy Osbourne, next door, just over the hedge from me for about two years. And I had just done his song Crazy Train for the album. And he knew it. And, and so I go out to get the mail and here he comes shuffling down the sidewalk to get in an Escalade to go, and he said, I said, hi, Ozzy Pat Boone, through, through the gate. Oh, hi, Pat, nice to meet you. He says, I gotta go to an AA meeting and then when I get back, we'll get together and have some tea, okay? And so we did, we had tea together and we got to be buddies. Not all the time, but dropping.

• 1:15:00Billy Corgan?

  Sweet, sweet guy.

• 1:15:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, he was just a good neighbor. So that lately, recently.

• 1:15:05Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:05Speaker 01

  On one of my posts when he was. Called the Prince of Darkness. I said, that's not the man I knew. I'd call him the Prince of Kindness.

• 1:15:14Billy Corgan?

  As his son recently pointed out, my father was Christian and wore a cross every day of his life.

• 1:15:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:15:21Billy Corgan?

  And a family man.

• 1:15:23Speaker 01

  And, oh yes, family, his kids. And he had, he had crosses, although a lot of demon things too in, in his house. I mean, he, cause that's, that was part of his image. That was.

• 1:15:35Billy Corgan?

  But I, I think if you don't mind me interjecting, cause I, I know Sharon more and I know the family.

• 1:15:41Speaker 01

  Lovely woman.

• 1:15:43Billy Corgan?

  And, but I think, I think one thing that might illustrate something about Ozzy that maybe you wouldn't uh, maybe know is a lot of those kids, especially in Ozzy's case, that grew up in England post-World War II.

• 1:15:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:59Billy Corgan?

  They were still sort of haunted by the idea of planes and bombs.

• 1:16:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:04Billy Corgan?

  They grew up, so their embrace of comic book world, their embrace of scary things was their way of navigating the, the, the, the fear that they had in post-World War II Britain.

• 1:16:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:18Billy Corgan?

  So what seems sort of overtly negative is actually them sort of navigating their fear.

• 1:16:24Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. And, and he said, I remember him saying once, when he was young, I had two choices. I could be a musician or a criminal. And I was glad he chose music.

• 1:16:37Billy Corgan?

  Or more accurate, they, they were given the choice of working in the factories like their ancestors did. And this is, you know.

• 1:16:43Speaker 01

  But he didn't want that, so.

• 1:16:44Billy Corgan?

  Well, that's, that's why some of these great bands came out of the middle of, of, of America and also came out of the middle of Britain. If you grew up in this industrial society like I did, the Hollywood dream is like, that's, that's where you want to go. You don't want to end up working in a factory like you're unhappy uncle or something.

• 1:17:01Speaker 01

  Thinking Hollywood dreams, he was just thinking that people would listen to, to music. He could, maybe, maybe there were singers that were happening at that point. And Bono, the same, I met Bono when he and the group were just, I think they were, they were initially a gospel singing group, just briefly.

• 1:17:20Billy Corgan?

  Well, they they

• 1:17:20Speaker 01

  Before they were U2.

• 1:17:22Billy Corgan?

  Well, they were, they were in their early stages of coming out into the world as a, as a band that went on to fame. They, they talked very openly about their Christian faith.

• 1:17:32Speaker 01

  I've read his autobiography. It's that thick.

• 1:17:35Billy Corgan?

  Yeah, but their, their Christian faith in the beginning was treated as a negative. Because you, you're not supposed to embrace.

• 1:17:41Speaker 01

  You mean as far as performing was concerned?

• 1:17:43Billy Corgan?

  No, no, it's, it was, at the time, it's a little less so now, but at the time, it's like, rock bands don't sort of, if, if you, if you claim Jesus or you're a Christian, it's just something wrong with you. That's how rock culture treated it in the eighties. And less so now.

• 1:17:56Speaker 01

  That, that was, you're right. Perfectly true.

• 1:17:59Billy Corgan?

  So I think that's where you're.

• 1:18:00Speaker 01

  But that was, that was just in their very nucleus, as they were coming together, just doing a little music. Like when Paul McCartney and, and George were just getting started, they didn't even know Ringo yet.

• 1:18:13Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:13Speaker 01

  There were, there, there were things that happened in the early days. I happened to meet Bono and, and, and

• 1:18:23Speaker 01

  they called it.

• 1:18:24Billy Corgan?

  You said the guitar player Edge?

• 1:18:26Speaker 01

  Edge, yeah. Still odd for me to call a guy that, but, but I met them after they had just won not beautiful day, a beautiful.

• 1:18:37Billy Corgan?

  Probably correct, maybe I still haven't found what I'm looking for.

• 1:18:41Speaker 01

  And.

• 1:18:42Billy Corgan?

  Which really is a spiritual song.

• 1:18:43Speaker 01

  Yes, and I was, and I was at, it is a wonderful song. And I was coming out of, of the hotel when he came, we came to the same hotel. And I had done my heavy metal album and I was nominated but didn't get it, of course. But, but I had met them and he reminded me that we had met in London. And when they were just starting.

• 1:19:07Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:07Speaker 01

  And that I'd been nice to them, of course, and. And, and I, and he said, you wouldn't remember. I said, no, I frankly, I don't remember that. But then I told him I was doing a tribute to Billy Graham. I'd written a song about Billy Graham called, uh, Thank You, Billy Graham, a, a we of the world, not, well, a group scene tribute to Billy Graham. And I wanted him to be part of it. And he immediately gave me his number in Dublin. And, and so I've had these interactions with some of these incredible, great people. But they, they, we all grapple with some of the same things coming up.

• 1:19:50Billy Corgan?

  Yes. So that's what I, I guess what I was after is, I remember in the seventies, you being held up, you know, half jokingly, but also in a form of mockery.

• 1:20:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:01Billy Corgan?

  As Mr. Goody Two Shoes.

• 1:20:02Speaker 01

  Yes, definitely.

• 1:20:03Billy Corgan?

  But now, in hindsight, I think you might appreciate that now that I'm older and I have my own family, I understand that what you believe in and what you've represented your whole public life.

• 1:20:15Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:20:15Billy Corgan?

  And in your music and in your faith, uh, including, you know, uh, you know, you basically written the, you know, the Jewish national anthem at this point, right?

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  Exodus.

• 1:20:25Billy Corgan?

  Yes, yes. And your, your connection with, with, you know, uh, charity, like basically Walk the Walk is what I'm trying to say.

• 1:20:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:34Billy Corgan?

  I think, I think my generation has a greater appreciation for your contribution because even though to our generation, you were held up as like, well, that's too clean cut.

• 1:20:42Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:20:43Billy Corgan?

  Part of us miss those times.

• 1:20:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:46Billy Corgan?

  Because it was a gentler, sweeter time.

• 1:20:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:49Billy Corgan?

  And the things that you represent to this day, I think mean more to my generation now than they could have at the time.

• 1:20:54Speaker 01

  But my lifestyle and many of the things I did were not quote, commercial. And I knew that. I mean, I, what could I do about it? I had. I did play a bad guy a couple of times. We just had a screen.

• 1:21:08Billy Corgan?

  I can't believe you played a bad guy.

• 1:21:09Speaker 01

  We, well, we just had a screening two nights ago.

• 1:21:12Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 1:21:12Speaker 01

  Of the Yellow Canary.

• 1:21:14Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 1:21:15Speaker 01

  And, and I also did a thing called The Pigeon. I don't know why there were two bird names with, with Sammy Davis.

• 1:21:22Billy Corgan?

  Right.

• 1:21:22Speaker 01

  On television.

• 1:21:23Billy Corgan?

  Okay.

• 1:21:24Speaker 01

  Where I played his co detective who turned out to have sold out because he needed money.

• 1:21:30Billy Corgan?

  Ah.

• 1:21:31Speaker 01

  And nearly got him killed. Instead, when the bullet came, I took the bullet.

• 1:21:35Billy Corgan?

  Oh, so you're the bad guy.

• 1:21:36Speaker 01

  What's that, that song of yours, Bullet with?

• 1:21:38Billy Corgan?

  Bullet with Butterfly Wings.

• 1:21:39Speaker 01

  I, I have never figured out, I haven't, a lot of, lot of what you've done, I can't figure out. I don't know.

• 1:21:46Billy Corgan?

  We could talk, we could talk about it off, when the camera lights are on.

• 1:21:49Speaker 01

  What, what you're saying, but huge, huge hits.

• 1:21:52Billy Corgan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:21:53Speaker 01

  And I could never do that. So I had to go with, with what I could do, country. Or right now, I've got a, a song that I wrote, Where Did America Go?

• 1:22:04Billy Corgan?

  I, I heard that.

• 1:22:05Speaker 01

  Patriotic. And it was meant to be a blowing in the wind kind of song. With just guitar and harmonica and tried to get Bob Dylan to help me with it, but he got on the road with the.

• 1:22:16Billy Corgan?

  The Never Ending Tour.

• 1:22:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, that, that tour. And so he couldn't, didn't feel like he had time to help me with that, that song. But it, but he got a whail of a lot of airplay and exposure.

• 1:22:26Billy Corgan?

  Yes. I guess that's kind of where I'm going. Um, just to kind of finish up.

• 1:22:34Billy Corgan?

  It's not so much to ask you about how you feel about America today. I know you love America like I do.

• 1:22:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:22:39Billy Corgan?

  But do you, do you, do you, do you think we're in a, a period of change and it's good change? Or are you, are you whimsical for maybe some of the things that we've lost in this new, these new eras?

• 1:22:51Speaker 01

  I have mixed feelings. Good question. Because I sure can't say yes or no, or this or that. Because it's always possible that we can come out of

• 1:23:07Speaker 01

  periods of great, great.

• 1:23:10Speaker 01

  Separation, division, people who hate each other because of their political views. We can't, we are losing the ability to have different viewpoints and still respect each other, especially publicly. And the Bible says, "A nation divided against itself cannot stand."

• 1:23:32Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:33Speaker 01

  I mean, that's a biblical principle, and we are seriously divided now. But that also could lead up to the time when, when those things continue and things get darker and darker, when God pulls the plug. I mean, there is going to come a time when this will all cease to exist the way it does. And no matter whether you believe it as a faith thing or not.

• 1:24:04Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:05Speaker 01

  Things do change, and empires do fall, and nations do fail. And, and if, if this continues, it can be very costly to us. I mean, we need, my latest posts are calling for people to pray and respect each other, and to, and not to say terrible things about the police, about who are doing what they, of course, unfortunately, some of the professions that we respect the most of don't always hold up to, even those professions. I mean, we're seeing the underside and the dark side, and the possibility of failure.

• 1:24:50Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:51Speaker 01

  And so, in times of great conflict, we've, we've managed to pull together and get saved because we, we pulled together.

• 1:25:01Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:01Speaker 01

  And we gave each other respect. We got to get back to that, is what I'm begging for.

• 1:25:07Billy Corgan?

  What would you say to people? And I ask you this because, like I said, you've walked the walk. You've lived a great, wonderful life, a family life, a Christly life. And, and yet, I know you love America.

• 1:25:21Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:25:22Billy Corgan?

  You are, you are, you are the embodiment of the, the American dream. I mean, you've done it all.

• 1:25:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:25:28Billy Corgan?

  Literally, you've done it all.

• 1:25:29Speaker 01

  More than we're talking about even, yeah.

• 1:25:31Billy Corgan?

  Sure. So what would you say to people who've lost faith in America?

• 1:25:36Speaker 01

  I'm sad for it. I would beg you to look at the plus side, to look at what's been achieved. Like with Israel, for example, I wrote a couple of columns when I was doing columns for WorldNet Daily and Newsmax, and one was Israel World MVP, and another one, Who Needs Israel Anyway? Which was being, that question was circulating through Great Britain, who needs Israel anyway? Why don't we get rid of that pesky little nation, make them move somewhere else and settle all these problems? Yeah. Not taking into account that God gave them that piece of land, and He gave it to

• 1:26:18Speaker 01

  them with a permanent tenancy, and He will protect them as He did before, even though there was a time when they went into slavery, but when they came back the last time, He said, you know, "You will never be taken from your land again." Yeah. And Gaza is in the Bible, in the Book of Deuteronomy and a couple of others, where Gaza was already there, a populous area, and the tribe of Reuben was given that, the 12 tribes, given the tribes, a division of what was then called Palestine, and that's Philistine

• 1:27:02Speaker 01

  as well, I mean, the same thing. And so Gaza was given to the tribe of Judah, which was the most important tribe of Judah, from whom the Messiah would come. So God's not gonna let anybody take Israel away, and if we can only come to some understanding that, that, you know...

• 1:27:27Speaker 01

  That desert land, I even proposed, tried to propose a solution to the Gaza-Israel conflict, which is Gaza, there is no Gaza at this point, it's all rubble, there is no Gaza, it's got to all be rebuilt. Don't rebuild it on that same piece of contested land because it belongs and will always belong to Israel. Go over on the Sea of Akaba, I even looked at the map and chose a place, and they can have a seaside resort, everything, it's only like 100 miles down from where Gaza is now on the map, 100, 150 miles, and build a whole new Gaza, it's got to be built somewhere, but don't build it on the same piece of land.

• 1:28:11Speaker 01

  Go over here and build it, and all of Europe and America and everybody will contribute, I think, to the rebuilding of Gaza, but not on that piece of land, which will always be contested. So anyway, I'm, I'm, and trying to answer your question, I try to write and talk about us trying to understand that people do feel differently, and we don't help each other or settle anything by calling each other names, accusing them all kinds. Now, that might bring us to the subject of our president, the mixed feelings about what

• 1:28:53Speaker 01

  he does and how he does it. But the Bible says that we are to pray for those in authority, and if we pray for those, not against them, pray for those in authority, like I've done with a couple of presidents that I didn't vote for, and I prayed for them and their family, and that God would give them wisdom while they were in that office, because that will benefit all of us if we do that. So, you know, that's a spiritual, but I think a real principle that needs to be

• 1:29:27Speaker 01

  Underscored that we will not solve our problems by calling names, throwing bombs, protests, it's not going to change anything, it makes things worse. In fact, I did call it, what was going on in, in, between Israel and Iran, like a cancer. It's a cancer that has to be either cured or, or taken out. This is cancer on my right bicep, and I used it in one of my boat posts, is that this is a cancer that had to be taken out. I couldn't just treat it, it would get worse.

• 1:30:08Billy Corgan?

  I see.

• 1:30:09Speaker 01

  It has to be removed and surgically and beneficially and with, with concern for all those who will be unsettled or whatever happens, but, but to just bomb and attack and protest and it's not going to get us anywhere. We've got to try to find out how we can reach out to each other, even if we have different, different methods and beliefs and tastes.

• 1:30:41Speaker 01

  We got to find ways to allow the other to breathe.

• 1:30:45Billy Corgan?

  Even though it seems far away at the moment, do you think we can get back to a place of kind of like general civility in this country?

• 1:30:52Speaker 01

  Well, it's possible, you know, that's why I try to plead for it, because I think we can and if we, but it's going to have to awaken something in people's minds and souls to realize that that will be the way for solving it. It won't be beating somebody, beat him up or just beat him even at the polls.

• 1:31:23Speaker 01

  We have to come to some human, humanity that other people can have different views. I mean, in my own family, for Pete's sake.

• 1:31:32Billy Corgan?

  Oh, I'm sure.

• 1:31:33Speaker 01

  Even among my own daughters, who never, who never had their own apartments and they, we were in absolute.

• 1:31:45Speaker 01

  Continuity, and not just continuity, we agreed with everything with each other. And now they've been with with some of the in-laws and all that. We've had to cope with differences, not just politically, but even spiritually. But they're my friends, they're my family, and I am theirs. And there can be enjoyment of each other and appreciation for each other. And so I guess Johnny Mercer's song, you gotta, I just thought of this, you gotta.

• 1:32:18Billy Corgan?

  Exhale to the positive.

• 1:32:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, exhale to positive and eliminate.

• 1:32:22Billy Corgan?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  Well, I forgot what it is you have to eliminate.

• 1:32:26Billy Corgan?

  Is it the negative?

• 1:32:26Speaker 01

  The negativity, yeah. It just came to me right now. That's Johnny Mercer was writing a great solution for us. But we've got to arrive at that. Otherwise, continued, I don't think there's a solution for.

• 1:32:42Billy Corgan?

  Or we gotta get on the Atchikin, Atchikin, Atchikin, San Antonio.

• 1:32:46Speaker 01

  San Antonio.

• 1:32:47Billy Corgan?

  Take the train out of town. All right. Thank you, Pat. Thank you so much.

• 1:32:51Speaker 01

  Thank you, enjoyed it.

• 1:32:52Billy Corgan?

  Thank you.