Facebook in space

Nilay and Dieter bring back science reporter Loren Grush to take on this week's news in science and tech; discussing Facebook's F8 developer conference, SpaceX, and Telsa's Model S. Racked senior reporter Nicola Fumo engineers the hype matrix once again for this spaced out episode of Vergecast. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:04Nilay Patel?

  Hello and welcome to The Vergecast, the flagship podcast of The Verge.com. It's a good podcast.

• 0:09Speaker 01

  Worst flagship ever.

• 0:10Nilay Patel?

  It's a fine, it's, I mean, it's, it's 200 episodes deep.

• 0:15Speaker 02

  We're still afloat.

• 0:15Nilay Patel?

  We're afloat.

• 0:16Speaker 02

  That's the point of a ship.

• 0:18Nilay Patel?

  People, when they see us, they remember the good times, I guess. I don't know. Anyhow, The Vergecast is brought to you by Sis Vodka, a vodka brand that I made up and then I'm just gonna keep talking about.

• 0:28Speaker 01

  Where's the bottle?

• 0:29Nilay Patel?

  It's over there.

• 0:29Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 0:31Nilay Patel?

  I'm just gonna keep talking about it until somebody makes it happen. So if you have more money than sense, call me. Sis Vodka, cup of the night. It's good. It's working. People are tweeting at me all the time. If I could pay for a vodka brand and tweets.

• 0:43Speaker 02

  Can we, can we get Tanya to move from her job?

• 0:46Nilay Patel?

  Poor Tanya. She's gonna come up again today.

• 0:49Speaker 02

  I'm sure.

• 0:49Nilay Patel?

  So we have some news.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  You gotta introduce people.

• 0:51Nilay Patel?

  Oh, damn it. All right. Well, that's Dieter.

• 0:53Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 0:54Nilay Patel?

  Lauren Grush is here.

• 0:55Speaker 02

  Hi.

• 0:56Nilay Patel?

  She's doing great. Rockets landed on boats.

• 0:59Speaker 02

  It's true.

• 0:59Nilay Patel?

  We're gonna get into it.

• 1:00Speaker 02

  I mean, I reported on it.

• 1:02Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03Speaker 02

  Didn't do it, but I reported.

• 1:05Nilay Patel?

  Well, you know, media has a validating function. If something happened and the media doesn't touch it, did it happen? Nicola Fumo is here.

• 1:12Speaker 03

  Hello.

• 1:12Nilay Patel?

  What's up?

• 1:13Speaker 03

  Oh, you know, just TikToking along, waiting for spring.

• 1:16Nilay Patel?

  So we're, we have a big update, but then I want like a Nick, I want a deep Nicola update before we begin.

• 1:22Speaker 03

  Okay. What do you want to hear about?

• 1:23Nilay Patel?

  Well, just wait. You think about it while we do this one.

• 1:25Speaker 03

  All right.

• 1:26Nilay Patel?

  Okay, we have news.

• 1:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28Nilay Patel?

  Big Dieter news.

• 1:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30Nilay Patel?

  You wanna share it with the world?

• 1:31Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:31Nilay Patel?

  Dieter's moving to San Francisco.

• 1:32Speaker 01

  I'm moving to San Francisco. That's true.

• 1:34Nilay Patel?

  No one's happy about it. I'm like emotionally broken.

• 1:38Speaker 01

  I don't, I don't have emotions, so it works fine for me.

• 1:40Nilay Patel?

  You staying with The Verge?

• 1:41Speaker 01

  Yes, of course I'm staying with The Verge.

• 1:43Nilay Patel?

  Do you want to talk about why, so we can talk about the other thing?

• 1:44Speaker 01

  I will be, I will be on The Vergecast in some way, shape or form. But yeah, I moved to San Francisco because I, my wife was kind enough to move out to New York with me and now she got a job, so I'm moving out to San Francisco so I can stay married.

• 1:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:59Speaker 01

  To her, which is an important thing to me. And the, the news about that, that makes, makes this job complicated is she is working for Oculus.

• 2:09Nilay Patel?

  Which is really cool.

• 2:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a very cool job. Oculus.

• 2:12Nilay Patel?

  I'll trade her jobs. I'd go work for her.

• 2:14Speaker 01

  And she, Oculus is of course part of Facebook.

• 2:16Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 2:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:17Nilay Patel?

  Which owns, which is the internet. Basically, it's really, so Dieter can't use the internet anymore. Happily, we have experience at The Verge, the people just ghosting completely from the internet. Now, Dieter's gonna stay on, obviously, he's gonna remain our executive editor. We have, if you actually look at his bio on the website right now, we have put up a first rough cut at his ethics disclosure, which will put on anything that sort of touches this stuff. Facebook, Oculus, we've decided that Dieter won't review VR headsets.

• 2:46Speaker 01

  I won't review VR headsets, I won't report another of those companies, but I may say, I may express an opinion about Facebook from time to time.

• 2:54Nilay Patel?

  For example, on this podcast.

• 2:55Speaker 01

  For example, on this podcast, as long as it's a tap, but I will always disclose so that everybody knows.

• 3:00Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, and then you can make up your own mind.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  There you go.

• 3:02Nilay Patel?

  But happily, Lisa hasn't started Facebook yet.

• 3:04Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 3:05Nilay Patel?

  And this week was F8, Facebook's developer conference, so.

• 3:08Speaker 01

  Right in under the radar, guys.

• 3:09Nilay Patel?

  So what you want, look, life is a series of uncomfortable gray areas, and you just have to find them and then just squish around them.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  I mean, I have never been comfortable in my entire life, ever.

• 3:21Nilay Patel?

  I mean, isn't it? I feel like, you know.

• 3:24Speaker 02

  I think it'd be smooth.

• 3:25Nilay Patel?

  Great, you know, like, the outsides of the lines are smooth, you're sailing on your flagship podcast. But in the gray area, that's more of a muck.

• 3:35Speaker 01

  I feel like the gray area doesn't work because, like, Tanya didn't do a good job with the design spec for the color of the area, and she just.

• 3:45Nilay Patel?

  This is a really deep callback. It's like, whenever Lauren's on the show, an imaginary Samsung engineer gets shit on her for an hour.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  People tweeted, like, respect for Tanya for weeks after that.

• 3:58Speaker 01

  So if you, if you missed the episode, this is a while ago, we went super deep on some imaginary product managers and engineers at Samsung, and how terrible they were at their job.

• 4:07Speaker 02

  Our own Samsung fanfiction.

• 4:09Speaker 01

  They had some, like, inner-office romance going.

• 4:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, well, Tanya has children.

• 4:13Speaker 02

  Right.

• 4:14Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 4:14Speaker 02

  She has a family to provide for.

• 4:16Nilay Patel?

  Still sucks at her job.

• 4:17Speaker 01

  That's what I'm just saying.

• 4:19Nilay Patel?

  Sometimes you just do the work, sometimes you just take the gig.

• 4:20Speaker 01

  I thought it was Gary that was terrible, but Tanya was, like, trying to rise above.

• 4:24Speaker 02

  Gary's a good enemy.

• 4:26Speaker 03

  And then there was Stephanie who was trying to get out so desperately.

• 4:29Speaker 01

  I mean, wouldn't you?

• 4:30Nilay Patel?

  It's a deep, again, a very deep callback.

• 4:32Speaker 03

  I don't have kids.

• 4:33Nilay Patel?

  But if you explain, but it does explain, I think, at least metaphorically, how Samsung works. All right, Nicola, I want a Nicola update.

• 4:43Speaker 03

  All right. Well.

• 4:45Nilay Patel?

  Where have you been? Tell me about some wacky adventures.

• 4:48Speaker 03

  I took a road trip. I went to Charleston, South Carolina, and many places along the way, which was cool, kind of nice to get out of it. I learned what it's like to listen to a podcast in a car, which you always tell me about.

• 5:03Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 5:05Speaker 01

  Was it good? Like a revelatory experience?

• 5:07Speaker 03

  Well, when have I done that? I have no car.

• 5:10Speaker 02

  Did you drive or were you a passenger?

• 5:12Speaker 03

  A little of both.

• 5:13Nilay Patel?

  Ooh. What kind of car?

• 5:15Speaker 03

  A smart car, actually.

• 5:17Nilay Patel?

  Like one of the little ones? How long was this road trip in a smart car?

• 5:21Speaker 03

  12 hours.

• 5:22Speaker 01

  How does a smart car handle on an American freeway where everybody's going 75 miles an hour?

• 5:26Speaker 03

  I went 90, baby.

• 5:30Speaker 03

  You can feel the wind. You have to like kind of adjust your body.

• 5:33Nilay Patel?

  That's like, that's like rally racing in a smart car. You like you, you need your entire body.

• 5:38Speaker 03

  Thing is that like when I told my friend, like other friends about this trip, they were like very weirded out by this and I didn't question it all. I was like, yeah, cool. We're going.

• 5:47Nilay Patel?

  In a smart car. Was it like a car to go?

• 5:50Speaker 03

  No, no, no.

• 5:51Nilay Patel?

  Somebody, so you know somebody who owns a smart car?

• 5:53Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 5:53Nilay Patel?

  Wow. Were they, are they super into it?

• 5:55Speaker 03

  What do you mean, super into it?

• 5:57Nilay Patel?

  I feel like you, to be a smart car owner, you have to aggressively pursue the smart car lifestyle.

• 6:05Nilay Patel?

  You're the kind of, you know how like Ferrari owners buy Ferrari keychains and tote bags?

• 6:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 6:09Nilay Patel?

  And custom luggage to fit in the boot of their Ferrari.

• 6:12Speaker 03

  No, this is more of a practical, kind of like a practically, actually filling this thing up was only $18.

• 6:18Speaker 01

  Who puts keychains in the boot of their Ferrari?

• 6:20Nilay Patel?

  No, you buy the custom luggage.

• 6:21Speaker 03

  Right.

• 6:22Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 6:22Speaker 02

  It's like, it's like if, if you bought a smart car and did you tell anyone about it? Did you really buy a smart car?

• 6:28Nilay Patel?

  Did your smart car land on a boat like so? And did Lauren report on it?

• 6:32Speaker 03

  But it's kind of nice because you know, I hate excess. So it's literally a door. Like it's like you open the door and it's like, oh, the car is over.

• 6:39Nilay Patel?

  I checked this car.

• 6:41Speaker 03

  Um, I thought it was elegant and practical.

• 6:44Nilay Patel?

  Oh.

• 6:46Speaker 03

  Loved it.

• 6:46Nilay Patel?

  What color?

• 6:47Speaker 03

  Black.

• 6:47Nilay Patel?

  Alright.

• 6:48Speaker 03

  Nice. A little sleek.

• 6:49Nilay Patel?

  So it looked even smaller.

• 6:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was the only one we saw in the whole South.

• 6:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 6:53Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 6:54Speaker 01

  It was the only one.

• 6:55Speaker 03

  The back part was like being at this, uh, like roadside, like food counter in North Carolina and just like roll. You know what I look like. You know, like looking like.

• 7:05Nilay Patel?

  You know what I look like.

• 7:06Speaker 03

  Well, you know, maybe you don't, but looking like blatantly northern like city person. Like just looking like a New Yorker in this like, like northern city person.

• 7:17Nilay Patel?

  Like literally people were throwing bottles of like Tabasco sauce and salsa. You'd be like, New York City.

• 7:22Speaker 03

  Wow. Um, the city.

• 7:24Nilay Patel?

  Another, it's a, it's literally a paste picante joke.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  I was about to say get a rope because I.

• 7:29Speaker 03

  Like there's no inside of this.

• 7:30Nilay Patel?

  Did anyone try to steal your car by loading it into the back of their pickup truck?

• 7:35Speaker 03

  No. Okay. So then what was also interesting was, you know, I was experimenting with SoundCloud Go as my primary music source.

• 7:43Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 7:43Speaker 03

  Um, which is good because I saved a bunch of stuff offline, which was nice, but I made, I actually canceled my Spotify and I'm, and signed up for Apple Music instead.

• 7:53Nilay Patel?

  Wow.

• 7:54Speaker 03

  Just turn it for another month. See what happens.

• 7:57Nilay Patel?

  You're just skating by and one month three tries.

• 7:59Speaker 03

  Well, because, well, I was talking to Mica of your staff and we were talking about, we were talking about, um, he was like, yeah, I pretty much can't believe it, but all I rely on title and Apple Music now. And I didn't think I was going to say that. And I was like, me too. Like, I don't know what Spotify is serving me anymore. And it took going to SoundCloud to make me realize that I don't know if I need Spotify and I'm such a Spotify stan. Now things are changing.

• 8:23Nilay Patel?

  Look, times change. It, winter is coming to an end. And it's time to let go of old relationships and start new ones with interfaces that are bad.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  You know what's going to happen to you is you're going to end up subscribing to all of them.

• 8:34Speaker 03

  And be one of those people who pays $50 a month to listen to music.

• 8:37Speaker 01

  Welcome to my hell. I mean, I'm paying, I'm subscribed to three right now.

• 8:42Speaker 03

  Oh, one more thing. Saturday. Oh, go on.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  Google, because it's YouTube Red.

• 8:46Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 8:47Speaker 01

  Uh, Apple and Spotify.

• 8:49Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, same.

• 8:51Speaker 03

  Saturday is Record Store Day.

• 8:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 8:53Speaker 03

  So go out, buy some physical music.

• 8:55Nilay Patel?

  Get it there.

• 8:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, I have a record player. That's how I usually listen to music.

• 8:59Nilay Patel?

  Really?

• 8:59Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean,

• 9:01Nilay Patel?

  I appreciate that.

• 9:01Speaker 02

  Music, well, okay, music's a big part of my life, I guess, but I would say I'd read more during my commutes. Like, I'm not usually listening to music as much.

• 9:09Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 9:10Speaker 02

  So it's more of like a nice thing to have when I come home, I'll put on a record and it'll be fine. But in terms of like having a playlist or like a subscription service, it's not really something I think about.

• 9:20Nilay Patel?

  You should try buying an Echo and just screaming for music, which is my new favorite thing. It's true. I've stopped. I'm gonna go to local music on the phone and then just yell at the Echo. That's my two, that's my big plan.

• 9:29Speaker 01

  So,

• 9:30Speaker 02

  Great.

• 9:30Speaker 01

  my new favorite thing is, um, while I'm away from,

• 9:35Nilay Patel?

  Are you just gonna troll me?

• 9:36Speaker 01

  You could like, you could just start playing the Echo from, from home.

• 9:39Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my God.

• 9:39Speaker 01

  It's pretty, pretty sweet.

• 9:41Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 9:41Speaker 01

  Oh, wait, no, I can't do it.

• 9:42Nilay Patel?

  Poor Lisa. This is why she got a new job.

• 9:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:44Nilay Patel?

  You understand? She's like, I can't be in this house anymore.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  Wow, I, I listened to, there we go, to discover weekly.

• 9:51Nilay Patel?

  We're just, we're literally just watching you use, listening to you use the Alexa. You have to narrate the whole time.

• 9:55Speaker 01

  I, I have, I have started the Alexa playing, uh, WNYC back at my apartment at home.

• 10:01Nilay Patel?

  All right, let's talk about Facebook. Let's just get into it. So Facebook had F8, which is their developer conference. It is fascinating to me that Facebook is now, and they're a huge company, so it's not too wild of an idea, but they, their developer conference is now as big a deal in the tech world as Apple's developer conference or Google's developer conference.

• 10:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, just in a slightly different way.

• 10:23Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 10:24Speaker 01

  Cause Facebook doesn't generally say, here's a new product you can go buy. They're like, here's all the hundreds of things we're doing.

• 10:30Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, here's all the stuff we're adding to the Facebook platform. And now they have a lot of Facebook platforms. And I was, there was a slide. The slide was incredible. I tweeted the part of it because it was labeled like Facebook product, Facebook platforms and the future. And you could have relabeled the future section with like weapons and tools of psychological control. Because it was drones, lasers, virtual reality, internet access for billions.

• 10:57Speaker 03

  Oh my god.

• 10:58Nilay Patel?

  It's all of the things that if you just relabeled it, weaponizable products.

• 11:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:03Nilay Patel?

  It would be drones with lasers are on that sheet. It's amazing. But they announced a whole bunch of stuff and it actually started with Zuckerberg coming out and basically giving a TED Talk.

• 11:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, he said, this is, well, first of all, like, he said, this is our 10-year plan for Facebook.

• 11:22Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 11:22Speaker 01

  Like, that's crazy, a 10-year roadmap. And then he gave like this happy inspirational, you know, Facebook, blah, blah, blah. And then he snuck in a Trump burn.

• 11:33Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. He's like, some people talk about building walls, but I talk about liking everything. I mean, Facebook's mission statement is now everyone should be able to share everything with everyone.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  But only inside Facebook.

• 11:46Nilay Patel?

  But only inside Facebook.

• 11:46Speaker 01

  Not outside Facebook. Trying to save anything outside of Facebook and your phone will explode.

• 11:51Speaker 03

  That's so funny because it wasn't Facebook kind of founded on like exclusivity.

• 11:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 11:56Speaker 01

  Facebook, no, Facebook was founded on not having incredibly shitty design like MySpace.

• 12:02Nilay Patel?

  Basically. But exclusively, they opened it up to certain colleges at once.

• 12:05Speaker 03

  I was one of those college students.

• 12:08Speaker 01

  Same.

• 12:08Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 12:09Speaker 01

  Got into college.

• 12:09Speaker 03

  I went to University of Texas.

• 12:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Well, no, I, so I was in grad school at Wisconsin, but they opened it up to University of Chicago. So it was not open at Madison, but I got in early.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  Old student email?

• 12:26Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, yeah, exactly.

• 12:27Speaker 03

  I was 16, had a summer, summer thing in New York, taking summer classes. And my new friends from Boston told me about this Facebook and we didn't have it yet. And I was like, whoa, what? And then it came out and I guess I signed up.

• 12:41Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 12:41Speaker 01

  It's been a while since anybody's tried to like launch an exclusive thing like we had.

• 12:46Nilay Patel?

  Now Peach, L O. No, but those were like invites and those were like last year. Like it's been a good six months before anything is like successfully launched with an invite system.

• 12:55Speaker 02

  You know what?

• 12:55Nilay Patel?

  It's a long time, man, six months.

• 12:56Speaker 02

  I think the reason, I mean, I've thought about this is like, I think about starting up a new profile and a new social media account. And it's just, I get really exhausted thinking about it. Cause think about how much you've invested in your Facebook page. Like there's all these pictures of you, there's, you've like filled out all the details and stuff like, do you really want to put all that time and effort into another social media platform?

• 13:18Nilay Patel?

  I barely want to put that time and effort into Facebook.

• 13:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 13:21Nilay Patel?

  Facebook for me now is it's, I share articles from the verge on it. And then I have another page that feeds my Twitter and I barely use any of it anymore. I've realized the Twitter app for Mac is so bad. I put in tweet bot and now my Twitter use has fallen to zero.

• 13:35Speaker 01

  Cause you hate tweet bot?

• 13:36Nilay Patel?

  I just don't like using it.

• 13:38Speaker 01

  I use tweet text still.

• 13:39Nilay Patel?

  Wait, I found, I found this slide from this presentation. So it's products, platforms and in platforms is WhatsApp, Instagram, all their other billion

• 13:48Speaker 01

  Right.

• 13:48Nilay Patel?

  user apps. And then this one is labeled technologies. And the first category is, and this is the 10 of the 10 year plan. The first one is labeled connectivity and I, I submit to you, this one should be relabeled weapons. Drones, satellites, lasers, terrestrial solutions.

• 14:05Speaker 01

  What?

• 14:05Nilay Patel?

  telco infra and free basics. Those are all weapons.

• 14:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:09Nilay Patel?

  Like fundamentally, all of those things can be weaponized. The next one is labeled AI. Again, could just be labeled weapons, a vision, language, reasoning and planning.

• 14:17Speaker 02

  Wait.

• 14:17Nilay Patel?

  Oh my god, Skynet.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  Oh my god.

• 14:19Nilay Patel?

  Fucking Skynet. And then the bottom VR AR, mobile VR, rift, touch, social VR, AR tech. That is, that is the matrix.

• 14:27Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 14:27Nilay Patel?

  Right, we're gonna like, what they have described is a world of universal connectivity by drone and satellite. They showed us the solar plane.

• 14:35Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 14:35Nilay Patel?

  Zuckerberg held up an engine.

• 14:37Speaker 01

  Tube, it wasn't the whole engine. It was like, it was a carbon fiber tube in which an engine goes.

• 14:42Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, that was a very strange stage.

• 14:43Speaker 01

  He just like, just randomly just picked up this giant tube and was like, look, I have an engine here.

• 14:47Nilay Patel?

  He's like, it's very light, I made it out of carbon fiber.

• 14:49Speaker 01

  And then it just sat there on the stage for the entire hour and a half.

• 14:51Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, he just sort of like awkwardly leaned it against the back wall. He's like, I got a lot of these for my drones and satellites that will beam my controlled internet to you.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  If Facebook does destroy the world, I think the only regret is that its name is Facebook.

• 15:06Speaker 02

  Like Skynet sounds kinda cool.

• 15:09Speaker 01

  What about Genesis?

• 15:10Speaker 02

  Skynet sounds like a good enemy. Genesis sounds kinda cool. If Facebook killed us all, I mean, I think we deserve to die.

• 15:17Nilay Patel?

  Like, you know, in the end, as you like, get into your like Rift matrix and you're like, well, the drones are raining hellfire over us. But as humanity, we deserve this.

• 15:28Speaker 01

  So the other reason that Facebook is definitely gonna take over the world is they snagged, they poached, they grabbed.

• 15:35Nilay Patel?

  Yes.

• 15:36Speaker 01

  The former head of ATAP, Advanced Technologies and Products at Google, who before that was the head of DARPA.

• 15:42Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 15:43Speaker 01

  Oh, I just.

• 15:43Nilay Patel?

  I just put this all together.

• 15:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:45Nilay Patel?

  This is actually happening. They hired the first.

• 15:48Speaker 01

  She is a killer, by the way.

• 15:50Nilay Patel?

  Literally. She ran DARPA.

• 15:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:52Speaker 02

  Well, yeah.

• 15:54Nilay Patel?

  I mean, she ran DARPA and then she went, they hired her at Motorola. Her name is Regina Dugan. Walt, huge fan of her. He, he's like, he met her when she was at DARPA, insisted that she become more public and go on stage at the D-conference. And then when she went to Motorola, insisted that she come back and be like, what are you doing at Motorola? And her whole thing was like, I've built contact lenses that augment your vision. Like, she's that person.

• 16:20Nilay Patel?

  She also had a van, the sides of us were covered in Velcro, and she convinced me to wear an entirely Velcro suit and jump against the van. So she's also a magician. She's like a hypnotist.

• 16:32Nilay Patel?

  But then Google bought Motorola and then Google sold Motorola to ATAP.

• 16:37Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:37Nilay Patel?

  There were a lot of rumbles of people at Google unhappy with ATAP because they have Google X, which is their own advanced crazy thing.

• 16:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:45Nilay Patel?

  And then now she's left and gone to Facebook, which again, I'm going to point out, Facebook is building drones, satellites, lasers, AI with vision language reasoning and planning, and a complete VR system that will lock you in an alternate reality. So basically, the world is over. I'm just putting it out there.

• 17:00Speaker 02

  It's the commercial DARPA.

• 17:01Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it's their, their commercial DARPA.

• 17:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:03Nilay Patel?

  And her job there is to build all this hardware around this stuff. So, so like, that was where they started. Like, Mark Zuckerberg comes out, he's like, look, I have this tube, I built a plane. Here's the Rift. It will like lock you in a virtual reality and our 10-year plan involves planes that can fly themselves and reason with you. So Facebook had a week. But then they transitioned.

• 17:28Speaker 01

  To bots.

• 17:29Nilay Patel?

  To bots, which is their big thing. And we talked about Microsoft's big bot plan a couple of weeks ago when they had Build.

• 17:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:37Nilay Patel?

  It's funny because Microsoft has a huge investment in Facebook. So you see how their their worlds sort of align.

• 17:42Speaker 01

  Or compete. I think that Microsoft investment in Facebook is no longer like a thing that matters.

• 17:47Nilay Patel?

  I think I think they just have like a friendly relationship.

• 17:50Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 17:51Nilay Patel?

  Right. I think it's just always been there and Facebook, you know, Facebook, for example, doesn't run on like Google Apps.

• 17:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:57Nilay Patel?

  They will happily use Outlook. It's which is strange, right? They mostly all their comms happens inside of Facebook.

• 18:01Speaker 01

  My general sense is that Microsoft has like a better long-term plan for bots in terms of them connecting up to each other.

• 18:08Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 18:08Speaker 01

  But Facebook has them now and they're kind of bad. But they have Messenger, which people actually use for chat in a way that people I don't think, people use Skype for like conference calls.

• 18:19Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 18:19Speaker 01

  Like that's Microsoft's end is like, look, we're building the entire cloud infrastructure. And Facebook was like, us too. Also Messenger.

• 18:26Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. No, Zuckerberg, he's gotten really good on stage. He's like very comfortable with himself now in a way that he didn't used to be. But he just was very casual. He's like, so here's our plan. Here's how we do things. First, we find a technology that we like. We play with it till we decide we love it. Then we roll it out and then we give it to a billion people. And it's like, oh yeah, that's super. I'll just, I can do that, too. That's such a simple plan, Mark. But they've gotten really good at that monkey around, monkey around, roll it out to everybody all the time.

• 18:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:54Nilay Patel?

  And so their bots thing, they rolled it out to Messenger. Zuckerberg did a demo where he ordered flowers for.

• 18:59Speaker 01

  He ordered 1-800-FLOWERS without having to call 1-800.

• 19:02Nilay Patel?

  He was very proud of himself.

• 19:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:04Nilay Patel?

  Phone companies around the world quivered.

• 19:05Speaker 02

  Have you ever called 1-800-FLOWERS?

• 19:07Speaker 01

  I'm sure I have.

• 19:08Speaker 02

  They have a website.

• 19:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I've only ever used the website.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  1-800-FLOWERS.COM. Yeah.

• 19:11Nilay Patel?

  What happens if you?

• 19:12Speaker 02

  It's one of the best websites.

• 19:13Speaker 01

  Are you calling 1-800-FLOWERS right now?

• 19:15Speaker 02

  I'm gonna order flowers on the bot. Wait, is that even available?

• 19:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, can we race each other into flowers?

• 19:21Speaker 02

  I don't know how to use it at all.

• 19:23Nilay Patel?

  This is dumb.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  Let's do this together, everyone.

• 19:28Nilay Patel?

  There it is.

• 19:32Nilay Patel?

  What? You can't just talk to it?

• 19:34Speaker 02

  Maybe you want to return your flowers.

• 19:39Speaker 01

  They start with simply your funeral.

• 19:41Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my God.

• 19:42Speaker 01

  It's like it knows my number. It's been tracking me. It's like, this isn't for love.

• 19:47Nilay Patel?

  All right. Well, that was done. Yeah. I'm just saying 1-800-FLOWERS burned me and assumed that all I would.

• 19:51Speaker 01

  Look, I buy flowers for love.

• 19:54Nilay Patel?

  For birthdays.

• 19:55Speaker 02

  I don't think they're assuming that you wouldn't.

• 19:57Speaker 03

  What about some just because flowers? A just because bouquet?

• 19:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, 1-800-FLOWERS is like, oh shit, someone died.

• 20:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:02Nilay Patel?

  I gotta get home.

• 20:03Speaker 01

  They don't have a lot of just because. You don't buy a just because bouquet from 1-800-FLOWERS. You buy that from like the bodega the way home.

• 20:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:07Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, and now you can just text the bodega in Messenger.

• 20:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, right.

• 20:11Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, so they're just saying that they rolled it out and we have been, if Microsoft was like bots of the future, Slack is basically a company whose entire platform valuation is bots of the future and these integrations. Facebook is like bots of the future. And then we tried them yesterday and they were really slow and bad.

• 20:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:29Nilay Patel?

  But.

• 20:29Speaker 01

  Think about bots.

• 20:30Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 20:31Speaker 01

  Maybe you don't need to bot. Like, we've been making this argument forever. Like, you've been making this argument forever, that the companies that like didn't get to make the smartphone platform are trying to make the next platform and they're trying to say it's bots. And the reason that Facebook especially, I think, wants it to be bots is they control a huge messaging platform. And so then, instead of the iPhone being the platform, Messenger becomes the platform.

• 20:55Nilay Patel?

  And they can take a cut out of commerce and messaging.

• 20:56Speaker 01

  And they can start winning there.

• 20:57Nilay Patel?

  And this model exists in a much more developed, cool way in Asia, on services like WeChat Online and da, da, da, da. But those are actually like little internets inside of themselves.

• 21:09Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:09Nilay Patel?

  They're not, you're not just texting stuff. You're like going to interfaces inside of those apps.

• 21:14Speaker 03

  So what do they envision the main use of these bots would be for?

• 21:17Nilay Patel?

  So the.

• 21:18Speaker 03

  Is it just for getting information?

• 21:19Speaker 01

  It's for getting Domino's pizza. That's all anybody ever shows with bots.

• 21:22Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, we talked about this in the last.

• 21:24Speaker 01

  Okay, over there?

• 21:25Nilay Patel?

  Domino's, Domino's has now released an app that if you just open it, it orders a pizza for you. You don't even have to use it.

• 21:32Speaker 03

  I really want.

• 21:33Nilay Patel?

  You just push the button and it orders a pizza.

• 21:34Speaker 03

  What if you do it on accident?

• 21:35Nilay Patel?

  No, it's got a 10-second time countdown. So if you open it, it's like your pizza's gonna be ordered in 10 seconds.

• 21:40Speaker 03

  What if you're just like?

• 21:42Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 21:42Speaker 03

  Oh, no!

• 21:43Speaker 01

  What if you are drunk and stoned enough to be ordering Domino's?

• 21:47Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 21:47Speaker 01

  The answer is that you'll order some fucking Domino's.

• 21:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, what if you're just considering it and it's like done?

• 21:53Nilay Patel?

  No, you don't consider it.

• 21:54Speaker 03

  You're just like, I know.

• 21:55Speaker 02

  Never consider pizza. You either want pizza or you don't.

• 21:58Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Who considers pizza?

• 21:59Speaker 02

  I consider pizza.

• 22:00Speaker 03

  Well, among your options.

• 22:02Nilay Patel?

  You were the one who just argued you were drunk.

• 22:03Speaker 02

  No, that was, that was like me making fun of what you were saying.

• 22:05Nilay Patel?

  Oh, I see. Thank you. Thank you, Lauren.

• 22:07Speaker 03

  Well, what if you're like, actually, I want chicken fingers? Cause that's the state of mind you're in.

• 22:12Nilay Patel?

  Then I think you have other.

• 22:14Speaker 03

  And you're like, ooh, pizza, that could be good. What about toppings?

• 22:17Speaker 02

  Do you get to choose your toppings?

• 22:18Nilay Patel?

  See, this is, this is the dream, I think, is the third screen of your phone home screen is just buttons that correspond to foods. And if you push the buttons, the foods come.

• 22:27Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 22:28Nilay Patel?

  That's where we're going. If that's what's going to convince people to download apps in the App Store. I don't know what else can save it. Everything else is too hard. But one button that orders you bad food, I'm with you.

• 22:39Speaker 03

  I want a timeline of all of Domino's innovations of getting you pizza. I think it's a Verge eater crossover.

• 22:45Nilay Patel?

  Look, here's what I know.

• 22:46Speaker 03

  It's not done.

• 22:47Nilay Patel?

  You've already had one byline on the Verge and you can have a second. Domino's, the thirstiest pizza company.

• 22:54Speaker 03

  In oral history.

• 22:55Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, but we're done. Shutting this down. No, the vision for bots is any, it's weird. It's, the way I think about it is anything that you would otherwise talk to a voice recognition service, you might as well just type to, right? You, you're, you have a clearer shot at that. Or anything where you want a computer to just vaguely understand what you want, run away and do something and like deliver you some information or do something for you. And I, that is powerful. There's, I would much rather type to, I don't know, any phone tree than sit around talking and waiting for the phone tree.

• 23:31Speaker 03

  But I still feel like voice recognition services I hate more than anything.

• 23:35Speaker 01

  Right. So the idea is a bot is you could just type it in and you could skip all that crap because the voice recognition server isn't there. So the other thing that's great about bots is if we, like, at some point in the future, we're going to be in a world where you want to get something done, the computer can handle a bunch of that stuff instead of you going to the website, navigating the website, finding the thing, clicking the button, filling your stuff, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

• 23:55Speaker 03

  So they're like personal assistants in a way.

• 23:57Speaker 01

  Right. But they, the, the difference is, the thing that's cool about bots, especially the way that Microsoft sees it, and I guess to a lesser extent, the way Facebook sees it, is it's, they're, they're trying to build open platforms where like bots can like live anywhere. Microsoft calls them canvases or something?

• 24:13Nilay Patel?

  Messaging services are canvases.

• 24:15Speaker 01

  Right. And so you talk to Siri, you only get to know the stuff that Apple has a partnership for Siri with, right? But the way that Microsoft is doing with its intelligent assistant and the way Facebook is kind of doing. With Messenger is like, anybody can like plug in a bot and then you'll be able to talk to those things. So the openness of you can, anybody can make a website, do whatever the hell they want. The slightly less openness of anybody can make an app and do whatever the hell they want. It can come to whatever the future interfaces are. Whatever comes after point and click, whatever comes after a touchscreen is going to be some kind of conversational interface. And these are the tools that people are building so that that conversational interface can have the same like

• 24:55Speaker 01

  open vibrant ecosystem that we got on the web and then to a lesser extent, app stores.

• 25:01Nilay Patel?

  Right. And then the backend services are getting smarter too. So Google Calendar now, you can tell it, I have a goal, like I need, I need you to find time in my calendar for me to go to the gym or whatever. And it will intelligently locate that time in your calendar. So if you could tell a bot, like I need to go to the gym this week and the bot talks to Google Calendar and Google Calendar is like, I'm available to figure that out for you and it does it and it comes back and your bot is like, I did this for you. I talked to Google Calendar and you're going to go to the gym this week. That, that's like the, the layer of abstraction. So you have the assistant and then you have the things the assistants talk to. And that, the, that part of it, the bot part of it is where all the action is right now.

• 25:39Speaker 02

  So is there a way, I mean, probably not, but is there a way to have like one, like solid assistant that connects to all these different bots to your Facebook?

• 25:48Nilay Patel?

  Okay. That, so that's the dream. Cause whoever wins that battle wins.

• 25:51Speaker 02

  Right.

• 25:51Speaker 01

  Right.

• 25:51Nilay Patel?

  So if Microsoft wins and everyone is opening Cortana to talk to Cortana on their phones, or Amazon wins and everyone's just wandering around their houses demanding things from Alexa, which is fundamentally my dream.

• 26:03Speaker 01

  Well, so what's crazy is the two companies that won the last fight for the interface were Apple and Google. And they're the two companies that aren't really talking about this in a real way yet.

• 26:12Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, they're nowhere.

• 26:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 26:13Nilay Patel?

  And Google, the Google Now team, as far as I can tell, like folded basically, it just disappeared.

• 26:18Speaker 01

  They still have a team, but there, there's definitely a lot less action there than there ought to be by a huge margin.

• 26:24Nilay Patel?

  And Google's vision, which was as scary as Facebook's in many ways, which, which was, we'll just collect and search and sort all your information for you and predictively tell you everything that you want to know. Which is how Dieter's Walk should work, but I don't think does.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  No, Google Now has become less useful over time, like straight up.

• 26:42Nilay Patel?

  Are you using that thing with an iPhone?

• 26:43Speaker 01

  Yes, I am.

• 26:44Nilay Patel?

  Is it good?

• 26:44Speaker 01

  It's okay.

• 26:45Nilay Patel?

  Use a 360 in case you're.

• 26:47Speaker 01

  I have Moto 360 paired to an iPhone right now.

• 26:49Nilay Patel?

  That's good.

• 26:50Speaker 01

  And the reason I'm on an iPhone is not something I want to get into because it's heartbreaking.

• 26:55Nilay Patel?

  It's not that heartbreaking.

• 26:56Speaker 01

  It's super heartbreaking.

• 26:58Nilay Patel?

  Can I tell the people, it's actually hilarious.

• 27:00Speaker 03

  I want to know. Yeah.

• 27:02Nilay Patel?

  When Dieter first told me he was moving to San Francisco, he, and if you know Dieter, this is like a classic Dieter moment. He's like, we got, we have a lot of things to figure out, but the first thing I need to know is what messaging service are we going to use? Because I can't use the same one as everyone else to talk to you because you won't pay attention to me.

• 27:17Speaker 01

  Which is totally true.

• 27:18Nilay Patel?

  He wanted his own beep. He wanted his own notifications on fundamentally. And then, and then we went back and forth and I was like, anyone hang out Skype this, that? He's like, we're using fucking iMessage and he went out, rage bought an iPhone.

• 27:29Speaker 01

  Yep. Turn iMessage back on.

• 27:31Nilay Patel?

  Turn iMessage back on.

• 27:32Speaker 01

  And I will, I tell you what, I would say no fewer than like seven people that I haven't talked to in three or four months are now talking to me again because I'm on iMessage.

• 27:41Speaker 03

  You type that all day right from your computer.

• 27:44Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 27:45Speaker 01

  It's infuriating.

• 27:48Speaker 03

  It's all my communication.

• 27:50Speaker 01

  You can do that with Hangouts.

• 27:51Speaker 03

  I don't need to touch my phone.

• 27:52Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 27:52Speaker 03

  Unless it's Snapchat.

• 27:53Speaker 01

  No, Hangouts is on your desktop.

• 27:53Nilay Patel?

  No, Hangouts is a native app.

• 27:55Speaker 01

  What?

• 27:56Nilay Patel?

  The native app on the, it's like the argument for the native app on the laptop.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:00Nilay Patel?

  Right. Messages is not a great native app, but it is a native app. So people use it.

• 28:05Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 28:05Speaker 03

  The only people I can't talk to on iMessage are my dad because of his phone choice and my best friend in Mexico.

• 28:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 28:11Speaker 03

  Because of her phone choice.

• 28:12Nilay Patel?

  So you just never talk to them?

• 28:13Speaker 03

  Yeah. And I gotta call them both this weekend. I don't want to.

• 28:16Nilay Patel?

  Dieter and I practiced making phone calls. It was amazing.

• 28:19Speaker 03

  I hate phone calls. Worst app.

• 28:20Speaker 01

  We've made a, we've made a pact that we could just hang up.

• 28:23Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 28:23Speaker 01

  Like there's no like, okay, bye. There's no like, well, we just, we just hang up.

• 28:26Speaker 03

  I love still making phone calls. Like

• 28:28Nilay Patel?

  Super fun.

• 28:28Speaker 03

  After I leave work, I usually take a moment to like call somebody.

• 28:31Nilay Patel?

  Really?

• 28:32Speaker 03

  Yeah. Just because I've been online all day. I want to like have interface with somebody, you know, like, I don't know.

• 28:39Nilay Patel?

  Have you thought about texting a chatbot?

• 28:42Nilay Patel?

  So that was, that's like the big Facebook stuff, the bots, ATAP, their plans to build a weaponized drone army. But then there was like little stuff, which is actually somewhat more interesting. So Facebook now going through all of your photos and adding alt text. So it's more accessible to blind people, which is cool.

• 29:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:00Nilay Patel?

  But they're also using machine learning to look at all your photos and describe them in machine words.

• 29:05Speaker 01

  No, it's actually, it's, it's way less ominous than that.

• 29:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 29:09Speaker 01

  Like, it is, in fact, looking at the photos, but it won't put the tags on it unless there's not one there. And it will only put the tags on it if it is like, it, if it's sure that like, I'm 90% sure that this is a pizza. Then it will tell you it's a pizza, otherwise it won't.

• 29:26Nilay Patel?

  Okay.

• 29:26Speaker 03

  And so it would be like, man identified Dieter, man identified Nilay, standing next to tree in geolocation place.

• 29:34Speaker 01

  Right, which sounds lame, except that if you're blind, all you, all you ever had before was like, picture. Comment from Nicola, OMG, comment from Eli, ha ha. It's like, what do you do with that?

• 29:45Nilay Patel?

  So that's great. And then the next part is that they're also just gonna start auto-tagging all of your photos and videos.

• 29:50Speaker 03

  Which is like my nightmare. I hate that. I hate that so much.

• 29:55Nilay Patel?

  It's terrifying. Isn't that terrifying?

• 29:57Speaker 03

  There is nothing worse than getting a little notification that says your friend just tagged you in 20 photos.

• 30:03Speaker 03

  Like, I got that the other day at the gym and I was like, I have to leave right now and go like, check on all these things.

• 30:08Nilay Patel?

  My, um.

• 30:09Speaker 03

  Deadline no more. My vanity has called.

• 30:12Nilay Patel?

  I definitely have older family members who will just like, they'll just be at a party or like, it's like Christmas and everyone's just like sitting around looking tired and they, you don't even know, you don't even know they're taking photos. And then like, five minutes later, it's like Christmas 2014. It's like, what the fuck happened here, man? And so I don't even look good.

• 30:28Speaker 03

  No.

• 30:29Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, so it's, so now the computer's gonna do it for you.

• 30:31Speaker 03

  Great. Oh, cool. Great. Awesome. Good thing I'm not on Facebook.

• 30:34Nilay Patel?

  So you can share everything with anyone, anytime. That's like, that's their.

• 30:37Speaker 01

  But only in Facebook.

• 30:38Nilay Patel?

  But only in Facebook.

• 30:40Speaker 03

  That's why I don't get it.

• 30:41Nilay Patel?

  It's the whole thing. It's, you can share it one to one in Messenger, you can share it with a group of people in groups, you can share it with the whole wide world on Instagram. That's a whole spectrum that he built.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  But, but just, just try and get a Facebook link onto Twitter and you're doomed. Try and email a Facebook link and you're screwed.

• 30:56Nilay Patel?

  And then I wanted to ask you about this, Nicola.

• 30:58Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 30:59Nilay Patel?

  There, they revamped the explore tab in Instagram.

• 31:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:02Nilay Patel?

  What do you think? They added a bunch of video, a bunch of channels, da, da, da. Do you take play with it?

• 31:07Speaker 03

  I did, actually, just for this, for this purpose. Um.

• 31:12Speaker 03

  I'm not a big explore person. I know that certain people really like it and I really use it, but like, what? I hate videos also, so I don't know why I would want to watch them.

• 31:23Nilay Patel?

  Future of media.

• 31:23Speaker 03

  Um, I know, it's terrible. Um, but.

• 31:28Speaker 02

  But I'm not a big fan of videos on Instagram. I think that's it.

• 31:31Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, they don't, they don't seem to play, do they?

• 31:33Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 31:33Nilay Patel?

  I mean, like, as a, as a content type.

• 31:35Speaker 02

  No, it's like, I go to Instagram for pictures. Facebook is kind of where I want the videos to be.

• 31:40Nilay Patel?

  Is your Instagram used to declining or increasing?

• 31:43Speaker 02

  It's definitely declining.

• 31:44Nilay Patel?

  I feel the same way. I'm like.

• 31:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, I barely use it.

• 31:46Speaker 02

  Well, I think it's just when I'm out, the idea of like, oh, I need to like pose this image for people to see just doesn't come to my mind. Snapchat really killed Instagram for me.

• 31:58Nilay Patel?

  So it did for me once they started autoplaying stories. Cause then you could just open it and like, watch.

• 32:03Speaker 03

  Loving the autoplay stories.

• 32:05Nilay Patel?

  But so Casey said this thing on Snapchat and then I later stole his idea and tweeted it. Something about the autoplaying stories has made me realize that there are some people that are super bad at Snapchat and they treat Snapchat like it's Instagram. They're like snapping pictures of their food, like over and over again. Like, here's a story of my whole dinner. Like, no, no.

• 32:23Speaker 03

  That's terrible.

• 32:23Nilay Patel?

  Not doing that.

• 32:25Speaker 03

  But I feel like those people burn out pretty quickly. You know what I mean? They like, they do like the, I made a recipe and then they're like, wow, that takes so long to snap. I'm never doing that again.

• 32:33Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, no.

• 32:34Speaker 03

  I wish that there was a little like flash between the autoplay stories. Cause sometimes you're like looking at one thing and then the next thing happens, you're like, wow, oh, oh, oh, what's the difference? Oh, it's on to the next one.

• 32:43Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 32:43Speaker 03

  You know?

• 32:44Nilay Patel?

  They really are just making it into television. It's terrifying. Like Snapchat is just going to replace TV and one day we're all going to be sitting around talking about like the great new Snap, Snapchat, like, uh, like rom com special that they are, you know, like, they're going to start buying sitcoms and they're going to stick them in.

• 33:00Speaker 01

  And they're going to sell DVRs for Snapchat.

• 33:02Speaker 03

  And they only have them 10 seconds at a time.

• 33:04Speaker 01

  Uber for TiVo for Snapchat.

• 33:06Nilay Patel?

  Then they're going to put up tiny antennas in the air and broadcast the Snap stories over the air to other tiny little antennas. From the top of the Empire State Building. When did we get our Snapchat just turned into FM radio?

• 33:19Speaker 01

  That would be amazing.

• 33:20Nilay Patel?

  All right.

• 33:21Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 33:21Nilay Patel?

  That's enough of this.

• 33:22Speaker 01

  That's enough of this.

• 33:23Nilay Patel?

  Facebook garbage. Lauren, something amazing happened.

• 33:26Speaker 02

  Something amazing happened.

• 33:27Nilay Patel?

  Do you want to talk about it?

• 33:28Speaker 02

  I do. Okay, so SpaceX has been trying to land its Falcon 9 rocket first stage on a drone ship for, what, almost a year and a half now. They started for the first time, or they tried for the first time in January 2015. And they've tried four times with the ship. So for those who don't know, it's an autonomous drone ship that is like a big barge that they refurbished, and it goes out into the middle of the ocean to catch the falling rocket from the sky.

• 33:58Speaker 01

  Okay, so why is it a drone ship?

• 34:00Nilay Patel?

  It doesn't really catch it.

• 34:01Speaker 02

  I mean, it kind of does.

• 34:02Nilay Patel?

  If you're in the car, Lauren just raised her arms to the sky so she was gently catching a baby falling from a tree.

• 34:08Speaker 01

  But like, we finally explained this in a really clear way in a really good video. I don't want to, if people didn't watch it, like, can you explain why it's important that it's a drone ship? And why it's important that it's in the ocean?

• 34:18Speaker 02

  Yes, so SpaceX has already shown that it can land its rocket on land, which it did in December. We covered it and it was a big, big deal. But the problem is like orbital dynamics, basically. So when you're going into space, it's not like you're going straight up. You're going a curved path. So if you see those like long exposure photographies of rocket launches, it's why they have like this like curved beam of light. So when you're trying to come back, if you need to come back to land, you're already kind of like, this is hard to like show without you seeing me.

• 34:55Speaker 02

  So you've gone up and away from land. So if you need to come back to land, you kind of have to like,

• 35:01Speaker 01

  Come all the way back on the curve.

• 35:02Speaker 02

  You have to like do a 180 and like, that takes a lot of fuel to turn around and kind of get in the right position to land back on land. But if you just go and put the drone ship kind of in the right position, like if you think of it like throwing a baseball, that's why I say catch, it's because like the momentum is already in the right way so that it's like, you go set up the drone ship basically down range of where it's going to land anyway. I mean, there's still some, some engine maneuvering that you have to do in order to get it where it needs to be. But it's less fuel that you need to do that. That makes sense.

• 35:39Nilay Patel?

  No, absolutely. I think the question is, why was it so hard and how'd they get it right finally?

• 35:43Speaker 02

  So what was so hard about it, I mean, it is, so it's easier to do the maneuvering to get it to the drone ship, but landing it on the drone ship is hard because think about it, it's a small target in the middle of a choppy ocean, whereas if you want to land on land, it's like a huge expansive space that doesn't move at all.

• 36:05Nilay Patel?

  Let me ask a really dumb question.

• 36:06Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 36:07Nilay Patel?

  And I'm only comfortable asking it now that they've accomplished this goal. I'm gonna do it.

• 36:11Speaker 01

  Do it.

• 36:12Nilay Patel?

  Why isn't the drone ship huge and full of pillows? I've been wondering this for months, like fucking months.

• 36:19Speaker 01

  Or like, no, like a giant net.

• 36:21Nilay Patel?

  Cause they're trying to do it the hardest way, right?

• 36:22Speaker 01

  Why not just a big ass net? They're just dropping it in the water.

• 36:25Nilay Patel?

  Cause you watch the video and you're like, that is so technically impressive. Cause it, the rocket lands vertically, the legs extend, the water's choppy. And then it like lands and you're like, wow, that was great. And it's like, why not?

• 36:38Speaker 01

  Why didn't they build a Chuck E. Cheese ball pit? That's like, you know, 500 yards wide.

• 36:45Speaker 01

  And put it out in the ocean.

• 36:47Nilay Patel?

  And Elon Musk is just like, ow!

• 36:50Speaker 02

  Well, first of all, I think if it, if there's any like-

• 36:53Nilay Patel?

  This is the dumbest question. I know it's so dumb.

• 36:56Speaker 02

  Well, if it's not low, I'm pretty sure it's gonna explode. Like you've seen, even if it like falls down, it really needs to touch down gently and like not, it needs to be upright, you know? It can't like fall over on its side or there's, there's gonna be damage to it. So, so that's the way of like preserving it intact as most intact as possible. As for why the drone ship isn't bigger, that is a really good question.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  Like it's a tiny ship.

• 37:20Speaker 02

  I mean, it's, it's fairly large compared to you and me, but yeah, compared to the rocket, it is pretty small.

• 37:27Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I would hope it's large compared.

• 37:29Speaker 02

  Well, I mean-

• 37:30Nilay Patel?

  Just like a guy with a cup.

• 37:36Nilay Patel?

  It's like Dieter and I have a sheet. We're like, we got it.

• 37:42Speaker 01

  The rocket is the cat or the cartoon fireman at the bottom.

• 37:47Nilay Patel?

  I mean, that's every time you say catch, like, that's what I imagine. And then the thing actually, right, it's quite big, but it's not relatively big to the rocket.

• 37:56Speaker 02

  Uh, yeah, I mean, I think it's, I need to look at another picture. I mean, it's pretty big compared to the rocket. It's enough space. I think that's probably it. It's their way of being like, this is a ship that has enough space to catch this thing, but it's not going to take too much, you know, for us maneuvering from us on our end.

• 38:13Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 38:14Speaker 02

  But I don't know for sure. So that is a very good question.

• 38:16Nilay Patel?

  Are they gonna relaunch? So they relaunched, Blue Origin landed again on land.

• 38:19Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:20Nilay Patel?

  Um, but as you so excellently wrote and made a video about, their, their move was a lot easier. Like, they went straight up and came straight back down.

• 38:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 38:27Nilay Patel?

  Because they're, it sounds like they're basically a tourism company.

• 38:30Speaker 02

  For now, yeah. I mean, they have very lofty goals.

• 38:36Speaker 02

  I'm taking over Dieter's punning when he leaves.

• 38:40Nilay Patel?

  Oh, good. I'm so happy that that won't go away.

• 38:43Speaker 02

  So.

• 38:45Speaker 01

  I made a really good Constantine pun the other day. Let's let Lauren continue.

• 38:50Speaker 02

  Um, wait, what were you talking about? Oh, yeah, Blue Origin, for now, they're focused on tourism, but they are planning on making an orbital vehicle.

• 38:59Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 38:59Speaker 02

  Right now, their vehicle only goes so high, it gets you to suborbital space, which is basically like you can be weightless for four minutes and then you come back down. So what SpaceX does, it needs a lot more power and thrust to get into orbit. And so it's a very different vehicle.

• 39:16Speaker 01

  But so when, when is SpaceX going to actually reuse a rocket? Because right now they've landed, what, three?

• 39:22Speaker 02

  No, they've landed, this is their second one.

• 39:24Nilay Patel?

  Two, one on land and one on sea.

• 39:25Speaker 02

  They think they're gonna, they're gonna reuse this one. And Elon said as early as May or June. So it's coming up. Yeah.

• 39:31Nilay Patel?

  Wow.

• 39:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:32Nilay Patel?

  Do you think they're gonna land it again, or they're just like, let it float away forever?

• 39:35Speaker 02

  I mean, I would assume they would try to land it again. I think they said like it's gonna be like a couple of times that they can reuse these things, maybe like, I don't know the exact number, but it's more than two.

• 39:46Speaker 02

  And, but that would be really depressing if they tried to land it.

• 39:50Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it's like, I think that's why they saved the first one, right?

• 39:55Speaker 02

  They, yeah, they did. They're not, they're not gonna relaunch it. It was unique and they used it for testing and stuff.

• 40:02Nilay Patel?

  So what, so I gotta ask you this. Why, there's two questions. One is an important question about important things, and one is a super dumb question. That I've pulled from the YouTube comments. How do you know this isn't fake? The YouTube comments, the YouTube commenters all think it's totally fucking fake.

• 40:16Speaker 02

  I know, I know.

• 40:17Nilay Patel?

  It's incredible. They're all like, this is just in reverse.

• 40:19Speaker 02

  I sent those conspiracy theories to Sean, who is like loves SpaceX conspiracy theories. I mean, I guess, I don't know. I don't know how to verify it's not fake, but I mean, we've seen the rocket come back into port. Like I had, there is a webcam of people like working on this first stage. You know, they also have multiple angles of where it's coming. I mean, I don't.

• 40:41Nilay Patel?

  No, the YouTube commenters are like, it's fake. Like, they're like, whatever. I can't believe you're also taken in by this. Which is funny because they, I believe in my heart that they're the same people that when Elon Musk is like, "My new electric Toyota Corolla will destroy all cars." Like, yep, it totally will. All cars are fucked now. By the way, I think the Model 3 looks like a Toyota Corolla, in case that joke was too.

• 41:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, the Model 3.

• 41:04Nilay Patel?

  Model 3. He had a good week.

• 41:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:06Nilay Patel?

  The man had like an excellent week, right? He put out the Model 3.

• 41:09Speaker 02

  And then he landed a rocket.

• 41:10Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, he sold what, 385,000 Model 3, well, sold.

• 41:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:15Nilay Patel?

  He collected $385,000, or 385,000 pre-orders at $1,000 apiece.

• 41:21Speaker 01

  Right.

• 41:21Nilay Patel?

  For the Model 3.

• 41:24Nilay Patel?

  Everyone was like, all car companies are doomed. And then he was like, spoiler alert, this car's not coming out for two more years. I've just, I have a thousand dollars. Thank you for your two-year interest-free $1,000 loan, everyone. Which is clever.

• 41:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:38Nilay Patel?

  And I, just so you know, the next version of the Verge will be available shortly, and if you send me $1,000. Maybe you'll get it. Just putting it out there. So he did that and then he refreshed the Model S this week too, the new front end, the biohazard defense mode, which is basically just a super hot air filter they took from the Model X.

• 41:59Speaker 01

  I think new door handles?

• 42:00Nilay Patel?

  It charges faster. Yeah. So it's like, both of his cars are brand new, or the new car is new, his most popular car is brand new. And then he landed his rocket on a boat.

• 42:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:11Nilay Patel?

  And then tweeted, "I'm on a boat."

• 42:13Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 42:14Nilay Patel?

  And then deleted it.

• 42:14Speaker 02

  I don't know why I deleted it. That was so funny because I was, I went out that night to celebrate and I was like, "Guys, you all have to watch this." And everyone's like, "Oh, my God, that's amazing."

• 42:25Nilay Patel?

  So it was a video of-

• 42:26Speaker 03

  What kind of celebration did you do?

• 42:27Speaker 02

  Oh, we just went out. I went out with my boyfriend and our friends and I was trying, we ended up drinking a bit and I tried to explain to him how gravitational waves work and there's a Snapchat of that somewhere and I hope it never resurfaces.

• 42:39Speaker 03

  That's part of Snapchat.

• 42:40Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 42:41Speaker 03

  It's gone.

• 42:42Speaker 02

  I was like, "Okay, so imagine this is Earth."

• 42:45Nilay Patel?

  This is a video that we should have made.

• 42:46Speaker 02

  I love that you went out to celebrate that.

• 42:47Nilay Patel?

  You gotta go outside.

• 42:48Speaker 02

  Yeah. I'm trying to think about the last time I celebrated that didn't happen to me directly.

• 42:53Speaker 01

  But then, right after this exciting space, wasn't there like a space downer?

• 42:57Nilay Patel?

  No, Kepler.

• 42:57Speaker 01

  Didn't we lose Kepler?

• 42:58Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Oh, that's right. Well, it's not a downer anymore.

• 43:01Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 43:01Speaker 02

  We've recovered it. But it was a crazy-

• 43:04Nilay Patel?

  Lauren's like, "I was up all night hacking."

• 43:06Speaker 02

  I figured it out, guys. Don't worry. No, Friday, Friday was a crazy day. Like, I was a little delirious by the time I left work because I was like, "Wow, a lot of things just happened." So I'd been focusing all of my attention on SpaceX and then, right as it was kind of calming down, I saw the Kepler news that had gone into emergency mode. And if you know much about Kepler, it's this spacecraft, it hunts for exoplanets. It's had a pretty hectic life, like it, some of its hardware broke and so we weren't sure if we were gonna even use it anymore. So that was kind of depressing. And then after

• 43:45Speaker 02

  that happened, we got news that, like, ULA has indefinitely postponed its rocket launches.

• 43:52Nilay Patel?

  That's the United Launch Alliance.

• 43:53Speaker 02

  United Launch Alliance, yeah. They're a big competitor of SpaceX that is just nowhere near as sexy as SpaceX.

• 43:58Speaker 01

  Well, they're like, they're like the corporate boys.

• 44:00Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:01Nilay Patel?

  Right?

• 44:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 44:02Speaker 01

  It's like Boeing and somebody else.

• 44:04Speaker 02

  Uh, it's, or not Boeing, it's U L A SpaceX, and then you've got Orbital, but they're really only customer.

• 44:11Speaker 01

  Who's in the United Launch Alliance? Isn't it like two huge companies?

• 44:14Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, it's Boeing and Lockheed Martin.

• 44:16Speaker 01

  Right, so in the eighties movie, John Cusack is, would play Elon Musk.

• 44:23Nilay Patel?

  There's no way John Cusack plays Elon Musk.

• 44:27Speaker 01

  I'm just telling you, that's how it has to go.

• 44:29Nilay Patel?

  Wild the opposite ends of the, no, no, I won't have this.

• 44:32Speaker 01

  In the ski movie, when they're racing down the mountain, and there's like, the guys in like, the really expensive terrible sweaters, the blonde guys.

• 44:39Nilay Patel?

  I see what you're going, I see where you're at with the ski movie comparison.

• 44:42Speaker 01

  And we are stuck with John Cusack playing Elon Musk, and if you think about it.

• 44:45Nilay Patel?

  I think it could totally happen. I think you are fundamentally referencing the eighties classic ski school.

• 44:50Speaker 01

  No.

• 44:51Nilay Patel?

  Yes.

• 44:51Speaker 01

  Better off dead.

• 44:53Nilay Patel?

  Okay.

• 44:53Speaker 01

  Let's.

• 44:54Speaker 02

  There are multiple John Cusack ski movies?

• 44:56Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 44:56Speaker 02

  Oh, wait, yeah, Hot Tub Time Machine.

• 44:58Speaker 01

  Well.

• 44:59Nilay Patel?

  I'm done. The show is so old. I don't know what we're doing here.

• 45:03Speaker 01

  How do you pick anybody, if you're talking about little guy versus corporate giants, but the little guy squeaks out at the end, how do you not pick John Cusack to play Elon Musk?

• 45:11Nilay Patel?

  No.

• 45:12Speaker 01

  Who?

• 45:13Nilay Patel?

  First of all, Elon Musk, not a little guy.

• 45:16Speaker 01

  Well, fundamentally is a PayPal billionaire.

• 45:19Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 45:20Speaker 02

  He talks too much.

• 45:21Nilay Patel?

  If you're in the car right now, literally Lauren is making little talking faces with her fingers.

• 45:26Speaker 02

  This is why I'm not good for podcasts, because I talk a lot with my hands. No, uh.

• 45:30Speaker 01

  I'm not saying I'm happy that it's John Cusack, I'm saying that that's what the situation is.

• 45:35Nilay Patel?

  Also, Elon has like that weird South African tinge.

• 45:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, he's very.

• 45:40Speaker 01

  That's why he gets the Oscar for it, because he does the accent.

• 45:44Nilay Patel?

  You know, no eighties movie with John Cusack was ever gonna win an Oscar, accent or no.

• 45:49Speaker 01

  Who, what eighties actor plays Elon Musk?

• 45:52Speaker 02

  I don't know. I think we would need to turn him French.

• 45:56Speaker 01

  Judd Nelson.

• 45:57Nilay Patel?

  Judd Nelson. Ooh, Judd Nelson would be good.

• 45:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:59Nilay Patel?

  All right.

• 46:00Speaker 01

  All right.

• 46:00Nilay Patel?

  You need to turn him French?

• 46:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:02Nilay Patel?

  Are we just referencing movies and actors?

• 46:04Speaker 02

  Judd Nelson?

• 46:05Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, Judd Nelson does not look good.

• 46:07Nilay Patel?

  Nicolas Cassius movie.

• 46:10Nilay Patel?

  Who plays Elon Musk in a movie?

• 46:11Speaker 02

  Elon, I don't see movies.

• 46:13Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 46:14Speaker 02

  You know that. I'm thinking of the bad guy from Ocean's Twelve.

• 46:17Nilay Patel?

  Why is my Wi-Fi turned off?

• 46:18Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, I could see that guy.

• 46:20Speaker 02

  I don't know why I wanted to be French so much.

• 46:22Speaker 01

  No, the next guy, the French guy.

• 46:24Speaker 02

  The French guy.

• 46:25Speaker 01

  The art thief.

• 46:26Speaker 02

  Or the guy from A Knight's Tale.

• 46:30Nilay Patel?

  What? Here's what I've learned about this conversation. We have watched wildly different movies.

• 46:37Speaker 02

  Hold on, hold on.

• 46:37Speaker 01

  If you know who should play Elon Musk in the inevitable biopic, please tweet it at us. I am at Backlon.

• 46:44Nilay Patel?

  I just don't think it's

• 46:45Speaker 01

  Lauren is at Lauren Grush. Rufus, Rufus Sewell.

• 46:47Speaker 02

  Sewell. He's always the bad guy. I don't know why Elon Musk could be a bad guy.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  You should know him as the guy from Dark City.

• 46:53Speaker 02

  You're right. You're so right.

• 46:55Nilay Patel?

  Here's what I'm saying to you guys. I understand the scrappy underdog story we're all trying to tell.

• 47:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:01Nilay Patel?

  Christian Slater.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:03Nilay Patel?

  I understand. I understand what we're trying to do here.

• 47:06Speaker 01

  Yeah. He's not a scrappy underdog, though.

• 47:08Speaker 02

  No way.

• 47:08Nilay Patel?

  Elon Musk is not a scrappy underdog. He is actually, and I'm just putting it out there, real chance he's actually the villain.

• 47:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's what, that's why I go with Rufus.

• 47:18Speaker 01

  The heroic corporations are trying to stop him?

• 47:21Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, that's the tough one.

• 47:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:22Speaker 02

  What about Jude Law?

• 47:23Nilay Patel?

  What about NASA?

• 47:24Speaker 01

  Wait, wait.

• 47:26Nilay Patel?

  Who plays like the heroic NASA administrator?

• 47:29Speaker 01

  You know who defeats him are the people that we haven't even

• 47:33Nilay Patel?

  Oh, that's a good one.

• 47:34Speaker 01

  That we haven't even thought of yet.

• 47:35Nilay Patel?

  Well, you know, because Tony Stark

• 47:36Speaker 01

  It's the four kids.

• 47:37Nilay Patel?

  Tony Stark is modeled on Elon.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:40Speaker 01

  It's the four kids in Ohio.

• 47:41Nilay Patel?

  Really, Robert Downey Jr. has been playing him the whole time. Lauren just did the hand mouth again.

• 47:46Speaker 02

  Robert Downey Jr. Talk, talk, talk. Elon has a very like soft quality to him. And I think that needs to be echoed in the person that portrays him.

• 47:55Speaker 01

  Elon Musk is defeated by

• 47:56Nilay Patel?

  Soft quality to him where he's like, I saw him on stage at the Code Conference and Kara was like, what's your dream? Kara Swisher was like, what's your dream? And he's like, I don't think humans should live on Earth. And then like he didn't say anything and everyone was just like, yep, that's, uh, that's your dream. Okay.

• 48:08Speaker 02

  Okay, Lizzie says Edward Norton.

• 48:11Nilay Patel?

  Edward Norton?

• 48:11Speaker 01

  No.

• 48:12Nilay Patel?

  Edward Norton?

• 48:12Speaker 01

  No.

• 48:13Nilay Patel?

  No, I'm sorry.

• 48:13Speaker 01

  But I figured out, I figured out who defeats him.

• 48:15Nilay Patel?

  We're just taking slack messages.

• 48:18Speaker 01

  It's the kids in the, the inertia proof bubble that they, they invent in their basement.

• 48:23Nilay Patel?

  How does?

• 48:23Speaker 01

  Ethan Hawke defeats Elon Musk.

• 48:26Nilay Patel?

  Sorry, you guys are gonna have to hear my

• 48:27Speaker 01

  Have you ever seen The Explorers?

• 48:29Nilay Patel?

  Oh.

• 48:30Speaker 01

  Read The Explorers right now.

• 48:33Speaker 02

  I've seen Gaga.

• 48:34Nilay Patel?

  Also, Caitlin, if you're listening, you need to watch Wayne's World. That's just a thing from earlier in the week that I need to bring up. Caitlin's never seen Wayne's World.

• 48:39Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 48:40Speaker 02

  What?

• 48:40Speaker 01

  What does that have to do with anything?

• 48:41Nilay Patel?

  Oh, well, for just telling people what movies to watch.

• 48:43Speaker 01

  I'm telling you, Lauren Grush, watch Explorers 1985. You'll love it.

• 48:47Nilay Patel?

  We need to go to the light round.

• 48:48Speaker 02

  It reminds me of Flight of the Navigator.

• 48:49Speaker 01

  He creates a, he creates a bubble that's immune to inertia and they use it to find space. It's so good.

• 48:55Nilay Patel?

  It's fair. It's, he's, Jeter makes a solid point. That movie is good.

• 48:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:00Nilay Patel?

  My computer turned itself off.

• 49:01Speaker 01

  Oh my God. Do you, do you want me, do you want to use mine for the lightning round?

• 49:04Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, let's go through this.

• 49:04Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 49:05Nilay Patel?

  Are you ready?

• 49:06Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 49:06Nilay Patel?

  Let's start with the movie theaters. Nicole, I'm gonna read you a quote.

• 49:09Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 49:10Nilay Patel?

  This is from, uh, I believe it's the CEO of AMC Movie Theaters. When you tell a 22-year-old to turn off the phone, don't ruin the movie. What they hear is, please cut off your left arm above the elbow. You can't tell a 22-year-old to turn off their cellphone. That's not how they live their life. This man is gonna build movie theaters that are cellphone-friendly. Would you go, would that drive you?

• 49:31Speaker 02

  No, they've already built movie theaters.

• 49:33Speaker 03

  What does the cellphone do there?

• 49:34Nilay Patel?

  Yes, indeed, they have already built movie theaters. They're gonna redo them.

• 49:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:38Nilay Patel?

  My, so I was not figuring out how this would work.

• 49:40Speaker 01

  Are there gonna be like giant hoods on the seat?

• 49:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, like what, what does this look like?

• 49:42Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, there's like that classic chair with the big round bubble over you.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 49:46Nilay Patel?

  I got married in one of these chairs. That's what I'm thinking about.

• 49:48Speaker 01

  Oh, I know what you're talking about. Yeah.

• 49:49Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. But like, it's like a big hood, or like a cone of silence. I was thinking they would just give people like really big jackets and then you would like turn up the collar of your huge jacket.

• 49:57Speaker 02

  Let's not even entertain this idea. First of all-

• 49:59Speaker 03

  Does this mean that 22-year-olds won't do virtual reality though if they can't put their phones away?

• 50:03Speaker 02

  No, the, okay.

• 50:04Nilay Patel?

  You can get notifications in the vibes, so.

• 50:07Speaker 02

  I think this is important. I tweeted out this quote today and I got pure rage from a bunch of 22-year-olds 'cause I think this quote is extremely condescending.

• 50:17Nilay Patel?

  Really? 'Cause 22-year-olds, as far as I know, are pretty dumb and selfish.

• 50:22Speaker 02

  Well then, I didn't say it.

• 50:26Nilay Patel?

  No, it is.

• 50:26Speaker 02

  It is.

• 50:27Nilay Patel?

  And I was, I personally was a dumb, selfish 22-year-old and I would have been insulted by this.

• 50:32Speaker 03

  I remember the first time I went to a movie theater and I noticed my friend didn't have their phone turned off and I was like, "Oh my God, that's against the rules. They have a whole thing about it."

• 50:41Speaker 02

  Oh yeah.

• 50:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, that's, that's why this is, this is why it's insulting to millennials, because millennials always follow the rules.

• 50:46Nilay Patel?

  They do.

• 50:47Speaker 01

  And so.

• 50:48Nilay Patel?

  That's why you've never seen any of these John Cusack movies we keep talking about.

• 50:51Speaker 01

  Right. Daisy's a rebel.

• 50:55Nilay Patel?

  But he's like, not even close.

• 50:57Speaker 01

  What?

• 50:58Nilay Patel?

  I don't know.

• 50:59Speaker 02

  John Cusack? No.

• 51:00Speaker 01

  You know, the funny thing is, my favorite in these movies has like, has like, John Cusack light, John Cusack wannabe.

• 51:05Nilay Patel?

  What's that?

• 51:05Speaker 01

  Patrick Dempsey in Can't Buy Me Love.

• 51:08Nilay Patel?

  So you, you were, you went off the John Hughes track, is what you're saying?

• 51:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 51:12Nilay Patel?

  There's like a whole, there's a lot here between you.

• 51:13Speaker 01

  I would say that's not my favorite, but anyway, what's, what's next in lightning round?

• 51:17Nilay Patel?

  Motor Trend today.

• 51:18Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 51:19Nilay Patel?

  Tommy, you two are in the media industry. Here's what Motor Trend did.

• 51:22Speaker 02

  We are?

• 51:22Nilay Patel?

  All day, yes, you are. Nothing happens unless you say it does. All day yesterday, Motor Trend teased pictures of the Apple car.

• 51:30Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 51:31Nilay Patel?

  And said, exclusive, what's coming tomorrow with like hilariously bad photo shops of a car.

• 51:36Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 51:37Nilay Patel?

  And then today, they released a Photoshop of not the Apple car, like, the most ugly car. It's like, you know, there's a color right between brown and gold that's just bad?

• 51:49Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:49Nilay Patel?

  It's that color.

• 51:50Speaker 01

  It's the color of an Anchor Steam label.

• 51:52Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but.

• 51:53Speaker 02

  A little darker.

• 51:54Nilay Patel?

  No, it's darker. And it's like shiny and reflective.

• 51:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 51:56Nilay Patel?

  It looks like that. It has like weird, it's, it's ridiculous. And they basically got a bunch of designers to sit around and like, dream of what the Apple car is. Lightning round, react to it. Is this cool? Is this a cool move by Motor Trend?

• 52:06Speaker 02

  Is it, is it rooted in reality whatsoever?

• 52:11Nilay Patel?

  No.

• 52:11Speaker 02

  Then what? I just don't see the point.

• 52:13Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it was very confusing.

• 52:14Speaker 02

  If it's based on maybe like rumors, or, you know, some kind of idea of like, the structure of the car, then maybe I could see some, you know, value in it.

• 52:23Nilay Patel?

  I think it's much more based on, what, what if, what if all of our hopes and dreams about Apple built a car? Like, what, what do we expect Apple to do based on what the iPad looks like? You know, it's like that kind of thought experiment. Chris Sigler tried to write a piece defending it today, and valiant effort.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  I just spent all day yesterday, every time Motor Trend tweeted about this, you know, to tease this thing, I would just reply with a picture of the Homer, the car that Homer built on The Simpsons.

• 52:48Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 52:48Speaker 01

  Cause it's like all your hopes and dreams in a car and oh yeah, guess what? That's not.

• 52:51Speaker 02

  I mean, if this is all my hopes and dreams in a car.

• 52:54Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, right. It's really bad, isn't it?

• 52:56Speaker 02

  It's so hideous.

• 52:57Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 52:57Speaker 02

  Like that's if the whole point of having like a car that you don't have to drive like wouldn't you want to make it look really awesome and like take out all the stuff that you don't?

• 53:06Nilay Patel?

  No, that thing, that thing looks like a Ford Edge that went through a really shitty body makeover.

• 53:10Speaker 01

  No, it's.

• 53:11Nilay Patel?

  Does anybody know what a Ford Edge is?

• 53:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know what a Ford Edge is.

• 53:13Nilay Patel?

  It looks really bad.

• 53:14Speaker 01

  I was, I was gonna say it looks like the, uh, the rejected redesign of the Pontiac Aztec.

• 53:21Nilay Patel?

  That's brutal. But maybe there's a new braking bad, they're gonna do some product placement. Okay, the Kindle Oasis, a $290 Kindle with a weird external leather battery cover. Um, I buy, buy every Kindle, so I'm almost.

• 53:35Speaker 02

  But $290?

• 53:37Nilay Patel?

  Here's the thing about buying every Kindle. You don't get a choice. All right. When Jeff calls me, I'm like, hey, Beesee. And he's like, what's up?

• 53:44Speaker 02

  Are you?

• 53:46Nilay Patel?

  Wait, yeah, I just.

• 53:47Speaker 01

  Zuckerberg is the only billionaire without a rocket.

• 53:49Nilay Patel?

  What?

• 53:49Speaker 01

  What's he doing?

• 53:50Speaker 02

  Maybe that's what he brought on stage.

• 53:52Nilay Patel?

  Elon has a rocket.

• 53:54Speaker 01

  Who else has a rocket?

• 53:54Nilay Patel?

  I'm sure Tim Cook is like, you know what? We should get a rocket.

• 53:57Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, I would if I were Tim Cook.

• 53:58Nilay Patel?

  I mean, but Zuckerberg is like legitimately like I, he just doesn't, he hasn't none of that stuff. He's in the, he's in the drones, AI space. He might as well have a rocket.

• 54:06Speaker 02

  I think Zuckerberg kind of pitched his ride to that star shot idea. It came out this week.

• 54:11Speaker 01

  He doesn't have a rocket. He's got lasers in space.

• 54:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:14Nilay Patel?

  Powering, powering tiny spaceships. All right. Doesn't Google have some sort of rocket idea? Am I crazy? I mean, they're trying to, Google's like, we have a company that will make you live forever. Yeah, they have microsatellites to do internet around the world.

• 54:26Speaker 02

  As for a vehicle, I don't think so.

• 54:27Speaker 01

  Here's my thing with the Oasis. I would buy it in a heartbeat if it cost twice as much, if it were waterproof.

• 54:34Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 54:34Speaker 01

  But it's not. So what the hell?

• 54:37Nilay Patel?

  What makes you upgrade a Kindle?

• 54:39Speaker 01

  I bought, I, I'm the guy who bought the Voyage even though I had a Paperwhite.

• 54:42Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 54:43Speaker 01

  And I'm really happy about my decision to buy the Voyage.

• 54:46Nilay Patel?

  I love the case of my Paperwhite. Bought a Voyage, never used the Voyage because I preferred the case on the Paperwhite.

• 54:53Speaker 01

  Well, I don't, I hate cases on Kindles. I want them as thin and light as possible. So I'm, I'm considering buying the Oasis because it like, might feel better in one hand. But the idea of the case that comes with it for the battery infuriates me.

• 55:08Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 55:08Speaker 01

  I don't want that.

• 55:09Nilay Patel?

  Lauren, you have a Kindle, right?

• 55:10Speaker 02

  I do, but I just see absolutely no reason to get another one.

• 55:13Nilay Patel?

  Which Kindle do you have?

• 55:14Speaker 02

  The Paperwhite.

• 55:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's no reason for you to get another one.

• 55:16Nilay Patel?

  Do you have the first Paperwhite or the new one with a slightly higher resolution screen?

• 55:19Speaker 02

  I think it's the new one with the.

• 55:20Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, see that one's like perfect. It's basically a perfect.

• 55:23Speaker 02

  I mean, think about what a Kindle is. All you need is text to show up on a screen. Like you don't really need that much.

• 55:28Speaker 01

  There's like so many debates about the page turning method.

• 55:31Speaker 02

  Whatever.

• 55:32Speaker 01

  I mean, the Oasis has buttons.

• 55:34Speaker 02

  All you gotta do is press the green and then the page turns and that's all you need.

• 55:37Nilay Patel?

  You're burnt.

• 55:40Speaker 02

  This is the problem when people try to, this is my problem with technology is they, they try to make it more complicated than it needs to be.

• 55:46Speaker 01

  So the thing about the Oasis that's cool is they're like, they're, it's unapologetically like, this is a really expensive, nice thing. You can get the exact same thing in the cheap thing, but this is really nice, expensive, nice thing. And Sam Byford actually explained it perfectly. Like, this is the cork in the wine bottle instead of the screw cap wine bottle. The screw cap wine bottle is actually just fine.

• 56:05Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 56:06Speaker 01

  If you feel like you want the cork, go ahead and spend the money.

• 56:09Nilay Patel?

  You get, corks start happening at like eight dollars.

• 56:12Speaker 01

  Well, you know.

• 56:13Nilay Patel?

  It's not like $290.

• 56:15Speaker 01

  It's the experience of it.

• 56:16Nilay Patel?

  There's also expensive.

• 56:17Speaker 02

  Where you're like, oh, this is more real wine because it has cork in it. Yeah, I know what you're saying.

• 56:21Nilay Patel?

  Like a true millennial, Dieter.

• 56:23Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 56:24Speaker 02

  I don't like that they stamped the Amazon on these, but they look nice.

• 56:26Nilay Patel?

  The Amazon logo on the front. Not cool.

• 56:28Speaker 02

  It's just like, oh.

• 56:30Nilay Patel?

  Okay. Uh, Nicola, is that your lightning round reaction to the, would you buy a $290 Kindle?

• 56:36Speaker 02

  Why? How much was the Paperwhite?

• 56:39Nilay Patel?

  A hundred and some.

• 56:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean.

• 56:40Nilay Patel?

  Twenty, hundred and thirty? Yeah. I love my paperboy, it's great. Uh, three million teens have vaped with e-cigarettes.

• 56:46Speaker 03

  What does that mean? How do you, how do they know that?

• 56:48Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, they did some surveys.

• 56:49Speaker 03

  How do they get that number?

• 56:50Nilay Patel?

  They hit some teens up on Snapchat.

• 56:52Speaker 02

  It's surveys, yeah. They, they ask teens, I don't know the exact methodology for this one, but it's like they ask them when, and usually within the last couple of months or months when they've vaped. And then they use that to project to the entire population.

• 57:06Speaker 03

  So, so three million teens have used a e-cigarette?

• 57:12Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 57:13Speaker 03

  I mean, how many are using regular cigarettes? Isn't smoking for teens down like dramatically?

• 57:18Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but overall tobacco use has flat to rising because of e-cigarettes.

• 57:21Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 57:23Nilay Patel?

  Overall nicotine, whatever you want to call it.

• 57:25Speaker 03

  You shouldn't do it.

• 57:26Nilay Patel?

  Nicotine's a hell of a drug. I don't know.

• 57:29Speaker 03

  I'm immune to it.

• 57:30Nilay Patel?

  You're immune to nicotine?

• 57:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 57:32Nilay Patel?

  You're immune to a drug that's more addictive than heroin?

• 57:34Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 57:34Nilay Patel?

  Alright, if I gotta vape for you.

• 57:37Speaker 02

  I have the Juul. I mean, yeah, I'm not a smoker myself either. And I've tried it, but never got hooked or anything.

• 57:44Speaker 03

  Same.

• 57:46Nilay Patel?

  Cigarettes are wonderful.

• 57:50Speaker 02

  Kids, don't listen.

• 57:51Nilay Patel?

  I need to write about how bad of an addictive product the Juul is. Yeah. And how crazy addictive it is, but I don't want to write about it because I don't want my mom reading it.

• 58:04Nilay Patel?

  So, if you're ever wondering why some pitches die. It's because you don't want your mom.

• 58:09Speaker 03

  It's horrible, horrible Indian guilt.

• 58:11Speaker 02

  Oh my god.

• 58:12Nilay Patel?

  Uh, Dieter, react to the HTC 10.

• 58:17Speaker 01

  That's it. No, it's, okay, it's like.

• 58:19Nilay Patel?

  It's ugly as shit.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  It's a really good phone. I think it looks really ugly, but like, it's a fine camera that's too slow. The rest of the phone is great. HTC basically gave up on Sense. Uh, it's very minimal. Like, I will say that everybody on the YouTube is real mad at us for not saying this phone is the second coming, but, um, man, it's too expensive. Like, they made a really good phone that, uh, is not much better than a Nexus 6P, which is way cheaper.

• 58:48Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 58:48Speaker 01

  And doesn't give you the benefits of a better design and the gear that you get with a Samsung.

• 58:55Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I would definitely rather buy an X6P.

• 58:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:57Nilay Patel?

  In fact, I already have.

• 58:59Speaker 01

  Also, it looks like garbage.

• 59:00Nilay Patel?

  It looks terrible.

• 59:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:02Nilay Patel?

  Dan's like, they get a trophy of participation, which is like, yep, good job, guys.

• 59:05Speaker 03

  I like the styling on these photos.

• 59:08Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah, the photos are beautiful.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  It's nice.

• 59:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, James took nicer photos for the HCC10 than it deserved.

• 59:13Speaker 03

  James and I worked together this week.

• 59:15Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah, it's a feature for next week.

• 59:17Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 59:17Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, there's some saucy photos of Nicola from outside next week. I've seen him. Good, a little off-the-shoulder action going on.

• 59:24Speaker 03

  Oh, wow.

• 59:25Nilay Patel?

  No, they're good. And, uh...

• 59:27Speaker 03

  I think they're gonna be beautiful, but yeah, it was a little, it was a little interesting photo shoot.

• 59:31Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 59:31Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh, I'm so excited.

• 59:32Nilay Patel?

  Well, I mean, I won't give away the piece, but it's, it's an incredible piece and the photos are gonna be beautiful. And Nicola has, like, photo shoot face, and it's like a really good photo shoot face. I don't have to say, like, you have this, like, very serious, contemplative look on your face.

• 59:45Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 59:46Nilay Patel?

  It's good.

• 59:46Speaker 03

  It's all James' direction.

• 59:47Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 59:48Speaker 03

  Close your eyes, relax your mouth, open your eyes.

• 59:50Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, no, James...

• 59:51Speaker 03

  And it's perfect.

• 59:52Speaker 02

  James' direction is the best. No, I'm serious, like, his, his, he's got that beautiful, uh, British accent, and so you're just like, yeah, I'll do whatever you say.

• 59:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. I watched him do it with the First Lady of the United States.

• 1:00:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:00:03Nilay Patel?

  He did exactly, I'm sure he did the same thing he did with you. He told her to look down and close her eyes, and he was like, "Look up," and she was like, "I will."

• 1:00:12Nilay Patel?

  It was great. Um, what else is on this list? Four sequels to Avatar are coming. Remember Avatar? Avatar happened 15 years ago.

• 1:00:20Speaker 01

  Oh, you've seen Avatar.

• 1:00:21Speaker 02

  I've seen Avatar.

• 1:00:21Speaker 01

  That's the one movie you've seen.

• 1:00:23Speaker 02

  I've seen Avatar. I'm sorry, it was a mistake, too.

• 1:00:28Nilay Patel?

  I'm sorry.

• 1:00:29Speaker 02

  I hate Avatar so much.

• 1:00:30Nilay Patel?

  It's super bad.

• 1:00:31Speaker 02

  It's one of those movies that I hate because it is so bad and other people like it.

• 1:00:34Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 1:00:35Speaker 02

  So it makes my hatred more than it needs to be.

• 1:00:38Nilay Patel?

  And it is a tremendously bad movie.

• 1:00:39Speaker 02

  It is.

• 1:00:40Nilay Patel?

  My favorite review of Avatar was, um, it came out on VHS and Gizmodo reviewed it on VHS.

• 1:00:46Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:00:47Nilay Patel?

  And they were like, "This movie, once you strip away, like, IMAX 3D, is basically the world's shittiest cartoon."

• 1:00:53Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh.

• 1:00:54Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:54Speaker 02

  And the worst part is all the subtitles are in papyrus.

• 1:01:02Speaker 02

  Like a paper menu at a bad Italian restaurant. Yes.

• 1:01:06Speaker 01

  Oh my god. Avatar is one of like, if you're-

• 1:01:08Speaker 02

  That's messed up. It's just like one step below Comic Sans. Yeah.

• 1:01:13Nilay Patel?

  You know Avatar 3 is gonna be Comic Sans.

• 1:01:14Speaker 01

  If you're hanging out with somebody and you're like, oh man, I think I want to be friends with this person. Just ask them, so Avatar.

• 1:01:19Nilay Patel?

  And you see?

• 1:01:20Speaker 01

  If they're like, oh yeah.

• 1:01:21Speaker 02

  So papyrus.

• 1:01:23Nilay Patel?

  So papyrus. You like, you hand someone a business card in papyrus to see if they immediately shrug away.

• 1:01:28Speaker 02

  What's your go-to fancy font? If they say papyrus, this friendship is not going anywhere.

• 1:01:32Nilay Patel?

  I can't believe, I can't believe Cameron has ideas for three more of those movies.

• 1:01:35Speaker 01

  He didn't have ideas for the first one.

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't understand where to go from here.

• 1:01:40Nilay Patel?

  I just, here's what I don't understand about Avatar, and it's a little risque, but I'm just gonna say it. The method by which the characters have sex is the same method by which he gains control of a horse.

• 1:01:49Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:01:50Nilay Patel?

  Right, he like takes his hair, when they like, when they bone, they like link their hair up and they're like, I feel you. And then he's like, later on, he's like, I gotta ride this horse dragon.

• 1:01:58Speaker 02

  It's like the hair you have speedport.

• 1:02:00Nilay Patel?

  It's very confusing.

• 1:02:02Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:02:03Nilay Patel?

  And it's just like, I get it, like all living things are connected and this is the way that we express it, but it's, hmm.

• 1:02:07Speaker 02

  It's a little weird.

• 1:02:08Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:09Speaker 02

  It's a little weird.

• 1:02:09Nilay Patel?

  Maybe, maybe do something else. James, maybe show some other weird ideas that you have. Anyway, it's a weird cartoon.

• 1:02:15Speaker 01

  Unobtanium.

• 1:02:16Speaker 02

  Unobtanium.

• 1:02:17Nilay Patel?

  Uh, the Rogue One trailer came out.

• 1:02:19Speaker 01

  Looks good.

• 1:02:20Speaker 02

  Looks really good.

• 1:02:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:21Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, except for when she's like, I'm a rebel.

• 1:02:24Speaker 01

  That's great.

• 1:02:24Speaker 02

  I don't care.

• 1:02:25Speaker 01

  I rebel.

• 1:02:26Speaker 02

  I love Felicity Jones, so she can do whatever.

• 1:02:28Speaker 01

  No, no more Star Wars movies with male leads either.

• 1:02:31Nilay Patel?

  Well, I'm sure, they're gonna make like 50 more Star Wars movies.

• 1:02:33Speaker 01

  They're gonna make the Boba Fett movie and they're gonna make the Han Solo movie and whatever, but like.

• 1:02:36Nilay Patel?

  No, it's good.

• 1:02:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:38Nilay Patel?

  I'm excited. I always think that no story spends enough time in act two. So there's like act one, it's like here are the characters, then act two is like, we gotta rush through it to get to the conflict. And then there's like a lot of that.

• 1:02:48Speaker 02

  Kinda like the reasons for worse.

• 1:02:50Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it's like, yeah, we're done, like, we'll spend no time in this universe that we've spent elaborately creating.

• 1:02:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:02:56Nilay Patel?

  Like the Batman movies, the, the, um, the Christian Bale Batman movies, uh, Christopher Nolan Batman movies. It's like, can you just be Batman for a little bit? Like, I would really like it if we could just watch you be cool for a while, but instead it's like, I have to, my back is broken, I must leave this. It's like, oh fuck, I thought you were gonna be Batman for a while. It's awful. Anyway, you don't, you didn't feel that?

• 1:03:16Speaker 01

  I feel that.

• 1:03:17Nilay Patel?

  You wouldn't have taken entire TV series set between The Dark Knight and whatever, Rising.

• 1:03:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:24Speaker 02

  That was a terrible movie.

• 1:03:25Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 1:03:26Speaker 02

  Speaking of another Batman movie.

• 1:03:27Nilay Patel?

  But you wouldn't have taken entire, like, 10-episode Netflix series set in that moment.

• 1:03:31Speaker 01

  Like, in between when he just gets to be Batman?

• 1:03:34Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:34Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:03:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:35Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, and the shit.

• 1:03:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:37Nilay Patel?

  All right, that's all I'm saying. This is what I want in the world. I just want endless Act Two. That's my club.

• 1:03:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:42Nilay Patel?

  Act Two.

• 1:03:43Speaker 02

  Just like a constant battle.

• 1:03:44Speaker 01

  Just nothing but empire all the time.

• 1:03:47Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, no, it's like, you know, it's like little, little, small stakes. It's like Batman's cool, he's got a car, he's got a helicopter, he's running around, he's, anyway. That's, but that's the Star Wars movies. They just exist sort of in Act Two.

• 1:03:57Speaker 01

  Uh, counterargument.

• 1:03:58Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  Temple of Doom.

• 1:03:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:00Speaker 01

  Not that good.

• 1:04:01Nilay Patel?

  Wait, that's the best one.

• 1:04:02Speaker 01

  No, the best.

• 1:04:03Speaker 02

  Oh, my god, Neelai.

• 1:04:05Speaker 01

  The best, oh, come on.

• 1:04:06Nilay Patel?

  What's the best one?

• 1:04:07Speaker 02

  Oh, my god.

• 1:04:08Nilay Patel?

  Okay, I love Temple of Doom, but I think it's just because I was excited that some people are scared of Indian people.

• 1:04:16Nilay Patel?

  He's a young boy in the 80s, you know?

• 1:04:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, alright.

• 1:04:21Nilay Patel?

  Uh, what's, what's else on this? Game of Thrones?

• 1:04:22Speaker 01

  What else you want?

• 1:04:23Speaker 02

  I'm so excited!

• 1:04:25Nilay Patel?

  It's Sunday, right?

• 1:04:26Speaker 02

  It, no, it's next Sunday.

• 1:04:27Nilay Patel?

  Next Sunday. Game of Thrones is happening. The trailers are just all over the place all the time.

• 1:04:30Speaker 02

  Something important about me. I'm, as much as I'm obsessed with space, I'm also just as obsessed with Game of Thrones.

• 1:04:36Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my god.

• 1:04:36Speaker 01

  Are you playing the game of Game of Thrones?

• 1:04:37Speaker 02

  I am.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 1:04:38Nilay Patel?

  Oh, it's coming back, by the way. And, uh, if you know what I'm talking about, Emily Yoshida runs the game of Game of Thrones, which is Game of Thrones fantasy series.

• 1:04:45Speaker 01

  Fantasy League.

• 1:04:46Nilay Patel?

  Fantasy League.

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Because Game of Thrones is itself a fantasy series.

• 1:04:48Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 1:04:49Speaker 01

  So it's a game of, it's a, it's a fantasy series fantasy league.

• 1:04:53Nilay Patel?

  Glad we got through that.

• 1:04:54Speaker 02

  Really clever.

• 1:04:56Nilay Patel?

  But last year she ran it and people wanted to play. This year she's partnered with a company, I think, called something?

• 1:05:01Speaker 02

  Uh, Fanizer?

• 1:05:03Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. And it will be interactive, so if you wish to play in our fantasy series fantasy league, you may do that with us. And Lauren is one of the featured cast members.

• 1:05:11Speaker 02

  Featured. Do you want to know my team name? Extremely cool. Can I tell my team name, or should I wait?

• 1:05:15Nilay Patel?

  Tell, tell them.

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  Have you already picked your names?

• 1:05:17Speaker 02

  I've picked my team name.

• 1:05:18Nilay Patel?

  What is it?

• 1:05:18Speaker 02

  It's Maester of None.

• 1:05:20Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my god.

• 1:05:20Speaker 01

  Wow!

• 1:05:22Nilay Patel?

  We're done. We're seven minutes over time, and I think we've come to a close on this episode of the Verge. It's pretty good.

• 1:05:27Speaker 01

  That's incredible.

• 1:05:29Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I think that's it.

• 1:05:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think that's enough.

• 1:05:31Speaker 02

  Alright, alright.

• 1:05:32Nilay Patel?

  Maester of None.

• 1:05:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:33Nilay Patel?

  That's pretty good. I'm gonna be Maester of Puppets. It's awful.

• 1:05:37Speaker 02

  It's real bad. Let's go!

• 1:05:39Speaker 03

  Let's leave.

• 1:05:39Nilay Patel?

  Let's leave. Okay. Nicola, do you want to tell the people where they can find us on social media?

• 1:05:43Speaker 03

  Sure. Yeah. You got a verge pretty much everywhere.

• 1:05:48Nilay Patel?

  Nicola, you're just gonna start promoting Ract?

• 1:05:49Speaker 03

  Verge on Twitter, verge on Snapchat, verge on Instagram. It's pretty easy.

• 1:05:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. What's your favorite one?

• 1:05:54Speaker 03

  Of your guys'? Actually, I actually really like the Instagram. It's beautiful. It's all original photography.

• 1:06:00Nilay Patel?

  It is. James Ferriman and Amelia.

• 1:06:03Speaker 03

  Well, even before him, though, you know, they've been, they've been, I like it. I think it's undersung. Also, the award-winning verge Tumblr, of course.

• 1:06:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:10Speaker 03

  And all the side Twitters, verge cars, verge teens.

• 1:06:13Nilay Patel?

  Verge teens are real.

• 1:06:15Speaker 02

  I'm saying verge teens.

• 1:06:17Nilay Patel?

  Verge teens are super real.

• 1:06:18Speaker 03

  You should go follow verge teens.

• 1:06:18Speaker 01

  Who is running verge teens?

• 1:06:20Speaker 03

  Who do you think?

• 1:06:21Nilay Patel?

  I don't think we're allowed to know.

• 1:06:22Speaker 03

  I know. I think we can all know.

• 1:06:24Nilay Patel?

  Start with a K? Yeah.

• 1:06:27Speaker 03

  No?

• 1:06:28Speaker 02

  Do we know? I don't know.

• 1:06:29Nilay Patel?

  Is it Castrenakis, comma, Jake?

• 1:06:31Speaker 03

  Yes, it's Jake. Oh, Jake reviews teens.

• 1:06:37Nilay Patel?

  Feel bad.

• 1:06:39Speaker 03

  Okay, yeah. And then we've got Twitter for all of ourselves.

• 1:06:44Speaker 03

  I'm Nicola underscore Fumo.

• 1:06:46Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:46Speaker 03

  You've got Bakalon for Dieter.

• 1:06:48Nilay Patel?

  Yep.

• 1:06:48Speaker 03

  Reckless for Neelai.

• 1:06:50Nilay Patel?

  Same way.

• 1:06:51Speaker 03

  Lauren is with an O. It's hard to remember. L O R E N.

• 1:06:56Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:06:56Speaker 03

  Grush G R U S H.

• 1:07:00Speaker 02

  Got it. Nailed it.

• 1:07:01Speaker 03

  Ooh.

• 1:07:01Nilay Patel?

  Well done.

• 1:07:02Speaker 03

  Thanks.

• 1:07:03Nilay Patel?

  There's also like 500 other podcasts to listen to.

• 1:07:05Speaker 03

  There are many more.

• 1:07:06Nilay Patel?

  Yep.

• 1:07:07Speaker 03

  You can find them on iTunes dot com slash the verge. It's one place you don't want to just type verge.

• 1:07:12Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:13Speaker 03

  You also don't want to type verge into your, just your browser because it goes to a weird site.

• 1:07:17Nilay Patel?

  Really?

• 1:07:17Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:07:17Speaker 02

  Oh, let's go.

• 1:07:19Speaker 03

  I do it all the time.

• 1:07:20Nilay Patel?

  Thanks, Nicola. Oh, this is a really.

• 1:07:23Speaker 03

  Gandhi dot net.

• 1:07:24Nilay Patel?

  That's weird. This used to be owned by the Bonnier Corporation, which is a huge magazine publisher. Yeah. Oh, because that was at Popsai?

• 1:07:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, that owns Popsai.

• 1:07:32Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:32Speaker 02

  Which is my former employer.

• 1:07:34Nilay Patel?

  They didn't sell it to us when we were starting the verge. Because we wanted just verge dot com. And they're like, no. And then literally, we had a moment like, what about the verge? And theverge.com was like a super late 90s internet service provider that was defunct.

• 1:07:49Speaker 03

  Oh my gosh.

• 1:07:49Nilay Patel?

  But they were like, "We'll sell you 14.4K baud internet." It was awful.

• 1:07:54Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 1:07:54Nilay Patel?

  It's somewhere on the internet, you can find it. Anyway, that was it. That was our show.

• 1:07:58Speaker 03

  Goodbye.

• 1:07:58Nilay Patel?

  I think it went well.

• 1:07:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:59Nilay Patel?

  Yeah?

• 1:08:00Speaker 03

  Let's close it off.

• 1:08:01Nilay Patel?

  I always have a good time. No, I just want to keep lingering.

• 1:08:03Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:08:03Speaker 01

  Rock and roll, Paul.

• 1:08:04Nilay Patel?

  Paul.

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  Paul, rock and roll.

• 1:08:06Nilay Patel?

  Goodbye.

• 1:08:06Speaker 03

  Bye.

• 1:08:07Nilay Patel?

  Next week.