292. The Blue Moon Killer

After a family of three is found dead in their Florida home, investigators follow a trail of strange evidence that hints at witchcraft behind the tragic murders. Links: Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/murderwithmyhusband NEW MERCH LINK: https://mwmhshop.com Discount Codes: https://mailchi.mp/c6f48670aeac/oh-no-media-discount-codes Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/themwmh Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/murderwithmyhusband/ Watch on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@murderwithmyhusband Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-dark/id1662304327 Listen on spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/36SDVKB2MEWpFGVs9kRgQ7?si=f5224c9fd99542a7 Case Sources: CourtTV.com - https://www.courttv.com/news/accused-blue-moon-killer-facing-death-penalty-in-murders-of-mother-brothers/ WEARTV.com - https://weartv.com/news/local/breaking-escambia-county-man-donald-hartung-found-guilty-of-triple-murder Mirror.co.uk - https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/real-life-stories/police-blamed-murders-blue-moon-21982823 WildHunt.org - https://wildhunt.org/2015/08/florida-triple-murder-ignites-witchcraft-media-frenzy.html MyFox8.com - https://myfox8.com/news/florida-blue-moon-killer-arrested-in-murder-of-mother-brothers/ PNJ.com - https://www.pnj.com/story/news/crime/2020/02/07/donald-hartung-blue-moon-murder-case-pensacola-death-life-in-prison-jury/4690843002/ WHNT.com - https://whnt.com/news/blue-moon-killer-man-accused-of-ritualistic-murders-in-pensacola/?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=socialflow WKRG.com - https://www.wkrg.com/true-crime/blue-moon-killer-man-accused-of-ritualistic-murders-in-pensacola/ AETV.com - https://www.aetv.com/real-crime/blue-moon-killer TheGuardian.com - https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/aug/05/wicca-florida-sheriff-triple-murder-witchcraft Oxygen.com - https://www.oxygen.com/family-massacre/crime-news/why-blue-moon-killer-donald-hartung-killed-family TheLedger.com - https://www.theledger.com/story/news/crime/2020/01/30/jury-finds-florida-man-guilty-of-killing-mother-brothers-in-blue-moon-murder-case/1796162007/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Into the wild, the Caltier Panther encounters a shimmering crocodile, a lonely lovebird, a breathless zebra, and a restless tiger.

• 0:15Speaker 01

  Welcome to the 50th Hunger Games.

• 0:17Speaker 02

  Witness the beginning of the revolution.

• 0:20Speaker 01

  Hey Mitch, you've been trying to take down these games from the start.

• 0:22Speaker 02

  Filmed for IMAX.

• 0:24Speaker 01

  Make them remember you.

• 0:27Speaker 02

  The Hunger Games: Sunrise on the Reaping, November 20th, rated P13.

• 0:30Payton Moreland?

  You're listening to an Ono Media Podcast. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. This is Murder with My Husband. I'm Payton Moreland.

• 0:37Garrett Moreland?

  And I'm Garrett Moreland.

• 0:38Payton Moreland?

  And he's the husband.

• 0:39Garrett Moreland?

  I'm the husband. Welcome back. Another week, another episode. Thank you for supporting. Thank you for listening. And thank you for buying our merch. Thank you for being you. It's starting to get cold.

• 0:53Garrett Moreland?

  Fall's kicking in. Winter is coming. Side note, I hope everyone has seen Games of Thrones. If you haven't, go and check it out. Other side note, I was thinking about it. I love Cheesecake Factory. Love Cheesecake. If there's anybody out there, anybody, that happens to work for corporate or wants to just sponsor me, I'll do it. Not, maybe for free. If I get free cheesecake, I'll do it. I just, I love Cheesecake Factory. They have so many options. I think I've realized that cheesecake is officially my favorite dessert.

• 1:30Payton Moreland?

  Really?

• 1:31Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I think so. Not yours. Yours is ice cream.

• 1:34Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 1:34Garrett Moreland?

  Anyways, I love Cheesecake Factory. I hope all you guys love Cheesecake Factory. Little update on bagels real quick. We're getting there. I'm supposed to be signing a lease and then the build out will start. And I hope you guys all come to my grand opening. It's a few months away. It's a lot to do, but.

• 1:52Payton Moreland?

  I feel like it's a lot of months a bit.

• 1:54Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, things are gonna start happening fast. It's gonna get crazy. Peyton's actually going to be one of the head bakers at the bagel place.

• 2:03Garrett Moreland?

  So you guys can come say hi to her as well. Yeah. What do you have to say about that, babe?

• 2:08Payton Moreland?

  I have a full-time job. Murder with my husband.

• 2:11Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, but aren't you gonna bake bagels?

• 2:13Payton Moreland?

  Oh, I'm not baking, but I'll like help at the place.

• 2:17Garrett Moreland?

  No, I'm just kidding.

• 2:18Payton Moreland?

  I don't think anyone wants my bagels. I'm not like good at baking, so.

• 2:22Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, that's okay. That's kind of what I got for my 10 seconds. Before we jump into it, side note, if you want some bonus content or ad-free content, you can join our Patreon or Apple subscriptions or Spotify subscriptions. Oh, real quick. So Daisy swims a lot and a couple of weeks ago, we went, we took her swimming for like three days and all she did for three days was swim. I think the chlorine like fried her coat, like her hair. So we're getting her groomed again next week. Huh, babe? But it's like fried.

• 2:56Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, which it wasn't our pool, so I didn't know how much was in. And the pool that she grew up swimming in didn't have chlorine, so I wasn't as worried about it. But now I'm like, how much water did she swallow? Like, it had to have been so high. This has never happened before.

• 3:14Garrett Moreland?

  It's more just like it wrecked her coat.

• 3:16Payton Moreland?

  How does she know we're talking about her?

• 3:18Garrett Moreland?

  I don't know. She just knows. Anyways, all right, that's enough about us. Let's get into today's case.

• 3:26Payton Moreland?

  Our sources for this episode are courttv.com, wearTV.com, mirror.co.uk, wildhunt.org, myfox8.com, PNJ.com, WHNT.com, WKRG.com, AETV.com, The Guardian, Oxygen, and The Ledger.com. So, most of us follow a certain belief system. The idea that there is some power out there bigger than ourselves that pulls the strings and controls certain outcomes. Whether that's religion, God, karma, or even magic, witchcraft, these systems all have one thing in common. It is basically the idea of good versus evil.

• 4:07Payton Moreland?

  Not always, but usually. For many, these ideologies can be a roadmap, a lens through which we see the world and find ways to navigate it. But in some cases, These heavy beliefs can also lead people astray. It can cause us to see things that aren't really there, to lean a certain way. Because life isn't black and white. Life isn't just good versus evil. It is nuanced. It is complicated. And when you believe that someone else's ideology is inferior to your own, is more dangerous than your own, that's when things can get twisted.

• 4:49Payton Moreland?

  Especially when you're a police officer meant to solve a complicated triple murder. So today, I want to take you to this area in Florida, known as Escambia County. In the westernmost part of the Florida panhandle, it is right next to the Gulf of Mexico. And for many, this area is a vacation destination. Beautiful sand beaches, dolphin cruises, a vibrant shopping scene, museums, a minor league baseball team. But behind this coastal charm is a darker story. This is a county that has been jokingly nicknamed "The Twilight Zone Vortex",

• 5:34Payton Moreland?

  for its famous and very gruesome connection to true crime. For example, this was where Byrd and Melanie Billings, the millionaire couple who had 16 children, were murdered in their home in 2009.

• 5:49Garrett Moreland?

  16 children?

• 5:51Payton Moreland?

  It is also where Ted Bundy was finally caught and arrested after a multi-state manhunt back in 1978. But in 2015, Escambia County experienced a crime unlike anything they had ever dealt with before. So that year, 2015, the Smiths are living a quiet little life in a suburban part of Pensacola. 77-year-old Von Seale, also known to her nieces and nephews as Aunt Bonnie,

• 6:23Payton Moreland?

  Doesn't really venture out of the house much anymore. At 77, her health had been on the decline for some years now. She used to love vacationing with her husband and her two sons, getting out, going on adventures, staying active. And her nieces and nephews idolized her, saying she was their favorite aunt. With her big southern drawl, she was always calling everyone "sugar" or "honey" or "sweetie." They said that she had a way of making everyone feel special and loved. But ever since the death of her husband some years earlier, things just hadn't really been the same. Now Aunt Bonnie mostly keeps to herself.

• 7:04Payton Moreland?

  She likes to spend the days on the couch, ordering things off QVC. This is kind of what is bringing her joy at this point in her later life. That and her sons, of course. Both of them actually still live at home for their own reasons. John, who is now 47, has an intellectual disability. He's worked at the local Walmart for the last 20 years. Everyone there loves him. He's always smiling. He has a childlike sense of wonder to him. His coworkers called him "the little brother" of the group. They actually remembered how every Christmas, John would come to work with these holiday pins that he would give out to his friends. He just seemed to make people

• 7:43Payton Moreland?

  smile. And Von Sil, aka Aunt Bonnie, had actually dedicated her life to caring for John. And then her 49-year-old son, Richard, was also living with them, and he had dedicated his life now to caring for the two of them, his mother and his brother. Richard was an IT specialist with the Department of Homeland Security. Specifically, he was in the crypto department, and not like cryptocurrency.

• 8:09Garrett Moreland?

  Oh.

• 8:10Payton Moreland?

  He was like a cryptologic technician, basically working on all the codes that they teach naval officers. So it was clear, Richard was kind of taking care of the house. At this point, he kind of stepped into his dad's role. He would wake up at 5:00 a.m. every morning, get his brother ready and off to work at 7:00 a.m. Then he would come home and get himself ready. And because of how dedicated Richard was to his family, he really didn't have much of a personal life. He was never married, no real romantic interests or big groups of friends. What free time he did have, he actually dedicated to his love for University of Alabama sports. His coworkers said his office walls were actually covered with posters and memorabilia.

• 8:54Payton Moreland?

  And that didn't mean he didn't want a life outside of his family. He did once tell a coworker that he dreamed of one day having a wife and kids of his own. But he always just kind of felt like it was impossible because he was just kind of the caretaker for his brother and now his mother. Which is what makes the events of that July 2015 just that much more heartbreaking. So on Tuesday, July 28th, both Richard and John went to work that day as usual. No one reported any behavior out of the ordinary from either of them. And then at 6:46 p.m. that night, Richard made an outgoing call, though I'm not sure to who.

• 9:39Payton Moreland?

  But the following day, neither Richard nor John show up to work. Now, for 49-year-old Richard, this is highly unusual, especially when two more days went by and he still didn't come into the office. So it is now July 31st, when one of Richard's bosses really begins to worry. So they actually called the sheriff's department and say, "Hey, can you just go do like a wellness check on my employee, but also his family, because I know he lives with his brother and his mother?" So the police stop by their house that afternoon. They knock on the door, there is no answer. So they call another family member, and that family member gives them permission to enter the home and check on them.

• 10:24Payton Moreland?

  So police go inside and they see the home is pretty cluttered. Now remember, Von Seal ordered a lot of stuff from QVC, so there are just boxes and items everywhere. But they notice something else. It's a smell. And they also see what looks like a foot sticking out from under a pile of blankets and clothing inside the house. And when they pull back the edges, they see a female hand underneath and then the body of seventy-seven-year-old Von Seale Smith.

• 11:03Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 11:04Payton Moreland?

  Now unfortunately, it doesn't end there. Police obviously look around the house for evidence and the sons. They find another body buried in the clutter, forty-seven-year-old John, and then eventually forty-nine-year-old Richard, too.

• 11:18Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 11:19Payton Moreland?

  It doesn't take long for the medical examiner to determine that all three had been dead for a few days now.

• 11:25Garrett Moreland?

  Wow.

• 11:26Payton Moreland?

  Likely, they were killed the night they were last seen. So about three days earlier, he made that outgoing call. That would be Tuesday, July twenty-eighth. Something happened that night. Three days go by, the police go. Von Seale and John have been beaten to death with a blunt object. And their throats had each been slashed. But Richard had been shot in the head. His throat was also slashed. What's interesting is there is no sign of forced entry. Von Seale appeared to have been attacked in the chair that she always sat in, in the family's living room. And detectives thought she might have been asleep or just sitting in the chair and didn't see the attacker coming.

• 12:09Payton Moreland?

  Though she did appear to attempt to fight back, she had some defensive wounds on her hands. John, however, had no defensive wounds on him. So detectives thought he probably didn't even have the chance to fight off the attacker. Someone just walked right up to him, likely while he was asleep.

• 12:27Garrett Moreland?

  And shot him?

• 12:28Payton Moreland?

  Well, this is John, so they just beat him in the head.

• 12:31Garrett Moreland?

  Oh my gosh.

• 12:32Payton Moreland?

  Before he could react. So maybe he was killed first? It's possible Richard saw it coming, though, which was why he was shot, unlike his other family members. So as detectives keep digging, they find a few other items of interest around the home, like a bloody claw hammer, and in the trash outside, bloody paper towels and some cigarette butts.

• 12:56Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 12:57Payton Moreland?

  Police also find it interesting that whoever had committed the murders, then spent the time wrapping and hiding the bodies under blankets in their own home? It's not like it's in public.

• 13:10Garrett Moreland?

  Isn't that usually a sign of like, um?

• 13:12Payton Moreland?

  Remorse.

• 13:13Garrett Moreland?

  Remorse.

• 13:14Payton Moreland?

  Typically, that's what they say.

• 13:15Garrett Moreland?

  Spectish, as weird as that sounds.

• 13:18Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 13:18Garrett Moreland?

  So it's probably somebody I would assume that the family knows.

• 13:21Payton Moreland?

  That's usually the connection is that maybe they knew their attacker. Um, so this person took the time to cover the bodies rather than just fleeing the scene. Now, because of that, they wonder if the crime was more personal than just a robbery. With the state of the house already in complete disarray, it was really hard to tell if anything was missing. But there are some things police have to consider. And a big one is Richard's highly sensitive line of work. This was a big reason why Richard's coworkers were so worried about his absence. The information they were working with was top secret. Something someone else, like a foreign adversary, might want access to.

• 14:06Payton Moreland?

  So when someone like Richard turns up dead without explanation, it is a serious matter. It can even be considered sometimes a matter of national security, which is actually why the Department of Homeland Security sends some of their own agents out to aid in the triple homicide.

• 14:25Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 14:26Payton Moreland?

  And these agents discover something interesting. Richard's keys seem to be missing from the home. They also take a DNA sample from his front pants pocket and later find that this DNA sample they collected didn't belong to anyone in their databases. Though, after looking at the projects Richard was working on, it becomes apparent to the DHS that there's nothing so sensitive currently under his purview that would have been worth killing for.

• 14:59Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 14:59Payton Moreland?

  So, everyone just kinda ultimately rules out this theory.

• 15:04Garrett Moreland?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. There are plenty of reasons we put off getting support and for a lot of people, cost is one of them. With BetterHelp, insurance options may now be available nationwide with an average copay for eligible members of just $23 per session. And while we're reconsidering old assumptions, maybe there are a few others worth questioning too.

• 15:26Payton Moreland?

  Women inherit a lot of unwritten rules. Be ambitious, but not intimidating. Be there for everyone, but still make time for yourself. Have it all together, but don't look like you're trying too hard. And I have definitely fallen into all of these traps. But if you have been wanting to start therapy, BetterHelp works with more than 125 health plan networks and eligible members have an average copay of just $23 per session with insurance. If you don't have insurance or don't live in the United States, you can still get 10% off your first month.

• 15:58Garrett Moreland?

  And Peyton and I are big advocates for therapy. Give it a try. Life can be crazy. There's a lot going on, like we were talking about. Sometimes it feels like you need to have everything figured out. You don't. Go talk to someone, go see what's going on. Visit betterhelp.com/husband to explore your payment options. That's betterhelp, H E L P, dot com slash husband.

• 16:20Payton Moreland?

  This message is sponsored by Greenlight. You know, there were many times growing up in school where I was like, when am I ever gonna use this? And let me be real honest with you, a lot of those things have turned out to be true. But you know what I wish they would have taught in school? Financial literacy. So, Greenlight takes the mental load of family life and

• 16:44Payton Moreland?

  Kind of puts it all into one place. It keeps your whole family in sync, money, safety, and everyday life, all in one place. When you're using it, you can see what your kids are spending, right when they spend it. You can also easily send them money via Greenlight instead of like digging around for cash. And Greenlight just helps your household run smoother. Chores happen without nagging because you can do it all through the Greenlight app. There's also like a schedule that is up to date in real time. So when you're out of milk or someone needs new cleats, it just goes on this shared list that everyone can add to. Join the 6.5 million family members

• 17:27Payton Moreland?

  who trust Greenlight. Garrett has younger siblings. They've used Greenlight and it is so amazing to watch them learn about money in the safety of their home. You've got enough on your plate. Greenlight keeps it all in sync. Get started at greenlight.com/husband. That is greenlight.com/husband. Greenlight.com/husband. Go check it out now. So now police start speaking with others who knew the family, hoping to get more information. And one of the first people they reach out to is a man named Donald Hartung. So Donald actually last saw the family the night they were believed to have died. So Tuesday. That evening, he was

• 18:08Payton Moreland?

  over at the house cooking dinner for the family. But it's important to note, he is not just a friendly neighbor. He is actually Von Seale's son from a previous relationship, making him Richard and John's half brother. Now Von Seale actually had Donald when she was a teenager. Now, the 59-year-old lived just three miles away from the family and worked as a security guard at a local hospital. And according to Donald, he had a pretty good relationship with his mother and his half brothers. He says he always did. When he was brought in for questioning on the night of July 31st, he told police, "Yeah, that night I went over to my mother's

• 18:52Payton Moreland?

  house. I actually do it every Tuesday to cook for the family." And he said he would often help Von Seale and Richard take care of John when they needed it. But he also told police, "There were a few enemies the brothers had made over the years." He mentioned that Richard had actually been sleeping with a married woman. And that John once had exposed himself to a young person at the Walmart where he worked.

• 19:18Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 19:18Payton Moreland?

  Now, whether or not any of this is true, I can't find any confirmation. But the police didn't think Donald was someone to doubt, at least at first. He had no criminal record. He appeared to be cooperating with the investigation. He offered up a DNA sample and admitted to seeing the family on the night they died. Even said, "I'll take a polygraph. Like, I really don't mind." Though, interestingly enough, the officers denied to polygraph him, afraid that he would pass and then that could later be used to support his claims.

• 19:54Garrett Moreland?

  Kind of interesting. I mean, there's gotta be money involved somewhere. It's just one of those cases where there's no way money's uninvolved.

• 20:02Payton Moreland?

  Okay. Now, I wanna say the police denying the polygraph maybe makes sense because there was something kinda off about the way Donald was behaving during the interview. When police broke the news to him that his mother and half-brothers had been murdered, he showed little to no emotion about it at all. And he was very nonchalant when he asked, "Well, were they robbed?"

• 20:29Speaker 05

  Um, did they tell you, I mean, your folks, your family, they were killed? Killed? How were they killed? They looked like they were shot. Like, were they robbed? Um, but, um...

• 20:43Payton Moreland?

  Which is kind of a strange thing to be thinking about when you've just been told that your family has been murdered. But also, maybe you're just trying to piece it all together. And when police speak with other members of Von Seal's family that day, they kinda contradict some of what Donald had said. They mentioned, mm, he was kinda the black sheep of the family. He was mean and arrogant. He often picked on his half-brothers and their differences. That he was always reaching out to his mother to help him with his finances. And that she had actually disowned him for a while.

• 21:17Garrett Moreland?

  Wow, okay.

• 21:17Payton Moreland?

  Because he was involved with something that she did not agree with. And that was Donald was involved with witchcraft. Now detectives had learned that Von Seale, as a devoutly Christian woman, was extremely upset when she found out that her son Donald was a practicing Wiccan. She called it the devil's work. Donald made little mention of this in his interview with police that day. But the same night the bodies are found and he is called in, he tells the police they are more than welcome to search his home and so they do. And what they find there proves witchcraft is actually a really big part of Donald's life

• 21:59Payton Moreland?

  and was a pretty big part of his relationship with his mom. He was serious about it. They uncover plenty of relics, books, even an entire worship room, as police called it.

• 22:11Garrett Moreland?

  This guy is, he's a witch.

• 22:13Payton Moreland?

  Well, they find a Ouija board laid out and ready to go. I just want to clarify.

• 22:19Garrett Moreland?

  Don't use those.

• 22:20Payton Moreland?

  That doesn't necessarily mean it's tied to the religion. This is just something they find.

• 22:26Garrett Moreland?

  Don't do it.

• 22:27Payton Moreland?

  Apparently, they also find the clothes that Donald was believed to be wearing the night of the murders. And it's from there that detectives actually start putting together the pieces of the puzzle. Because they also realized that around this time, it was a rare blue moon. Now, this only happens once every two or three years. And the blue moon is a culturally significant time for Wiccan practitioners. It's considered to be a more heightened energy, which is ideal.

• 22:58Garrett Moreland?

  Wiccans, is that like a male witch? Or is that like?

• 23:01Payton Moreland?

  That's just what you would call someone who practices the witchcraft.

• 23:05Garrett Moreland?

  Not a witch?

• 23:07Payton Moreland?

  No. They are, they're referred to as Wiccans.

• 23:11Garrett Moreland?

  I'm gonna call them witches.

• 23:13Payton Moreland?

  Okay, you can do what you want.

• 23:15Garrett Moreland?

  Thank you. I think witches sounds a little cooler.

• 23:18Payton Moreland?

  So basically, this energy from the moon is ideal for manifesting and performing powerful spells. But police think Donald may have timed his crimes, if he did this, around the blue moon as some sort of ritual sacrifice. They're attempting to find a motive, and this is what they come up with for Donald.

• 23:38Garrett Moreland?

  This is gonna be wild if this is why.

• 23:41Payton Moreland?

  So after police searched Donald's house that night, they go back to the station around 1:30 a.m. It's now August 1st, and they ask him some questions specifically about his ties to the Wiccan religion. When asked who else he practices with, Donald says, no one. He's like, I'm not a part of any coven or anything like that. And when they accuse him of like, hey, well, if you murdered your family and this was part of some ritual, is there like a reason you would have covered the bodies or anything? And Donald's like, I have no idea what you're talking about. There's no ritual that would say to do that.

• 24:20Garrett Moreland?

  Okay, that's a smart answer.

• 24:22Payton Moreland?

  He just kind of suggests that the police know nothing about paganism, and they're just throwing things at the wall to see if Donald would come clean about the murders. But he doesn't. He maintains his innocence and says he has nothing to do with it. And with no confession, no concrete evidence, Donald is released later that morning. But police are far from done with this theory. Three days later, on August 4th, the county sheriff, David Morgan, holds a press conference about the triple homicide. And he openly says in front of cameras that the police truly believe this was a ritualistic killing tied to the blue moon.

• 25:02Garrett Moreland?

  Wow.

• 25:02Payton Moreland?

  He then says with sheer confidence, quote, "It is witchcraft. I'll say that right now."

• 25:09Garrett Moreland?

  That's pretty, um...

• 25:12Garrett Moreland?

  Gutsy to say.

• 25:13Payton Moreland?

  Mm hmm.

• 25:14Garrett Moreland?

  I don't know if that's extremely smart, but I guess we'll see where this goes.

• 25:18Payton Moreland?

  It kind of shows that they have their eyes like set. Um, so this definitely isn't just like some theory they were trying to use to get a confession out of Donald. They really believe that Donald did this and this was his motivation for killing his family. The sheriff adds the quote, "Method of the murder, blunt force traumas, slit throats, positions of bodies, and then our person of interest has some ties to a faith or religion that is indicative of that." And obviously with this statement in 2015, the press goes wild. Publications all over the country start printing headlines like witchcraft suspected

• 25:59Payton Moreland?

  in savage murder of family and Florida triple murder tied to witchcraft. But Donald is not the only practicing Wiccan in Florida. There are a lot of people who see these statements and think, okay, just because this son believes like in this religion does not make them a murderer. One practitioner named Peg Aloy said, quote, "I'm fairly certain there is nothing in any book on Wicca that has ever been published on planet Earth that describes body positions consistent with ritual murder."

• 26:38Garrett Moreland?

  Black magic.

• 26:40Payton Moreland?

  And then Dr. Gwendolyn Reese, who was a specialist in contemporary paganism at American University, found the entire thing absurd. She said that if the police had done even the slightest bit of research, they would see this crime is not connected to a religion. Instead, this is just an outright prejudice against a subculture the police know nothing about. Others confirmed that ritual murder is not even a part of this religion at all. In fact, it goes against the ethical principles of Wicca. So basically you have all these people who also practice and are clapping back saying, how dare you blame a religion for such a horrific slang. It has nothing to do with us. Like, just why are you even bringing this up?

• 27:26Payton Moreland?

  What's even worse is this obviously completely distracts from the investigation itself. But I also want to clarify, none of this means Donald's innocent either. This just means that maybe they have the wrong motive for the wrong reasons. He is still the last person to have seen the three victims before they died. The family still says that Von Seale and her son had their issues with Donald over the years. And there were witnesses who saw Donald driving away from the house that night with the headlights of his car off, even though it was dark. So while they might have the motive wrong, it doesn't mean they have the wrong guy. They just needed more concrete evidence to prove this motive and their case.

• 28:10Payton Moreland?

  The issue is Donald's DNA is already all over the crime scene. He was having dinner at that house every week. He was going over there often. What's concerning is when his DNA turns up in places it really shouldn't have been, like the inside of Richard's belt buckle.

• 28:27Garrett Moreland?

  Oh.

• 28:28Payton Moreland?

  And on Richard's checkbook.

• 28:30Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 28:31Payton Moreland?

  This was important because detectives had asked Donald if he had ever touched any of Richard's belongings. And he said, no. Sure enough, though, Donald's DNA was all over Richard's checkbook. Though his reason for that was, well, I might have just like picked it up and moved it when I was like cleaning the kitchen table or something. You know, fair enough, but there was another detail that didn't look great for Donald. In the trash can outside of the house, like I said, detectives had found a bunch of bloody towels that appeared to be used to clean up the crime scene and then a few cigarette butts. Now, when they ran those for DNA, it was Donald's, which means Donald is likely the one who used those towels, cleaned up the crime scene and then had a cigarette.

• 29:15Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I'm not sure how you explain that one or get out of that one.

• 29:18Payton Moreland?

  Right?

• 29:19Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 29:19Payton Moreland?

  Of course, it takes investigators a little bit of time to get all of this DNA back. And ironically, it is just a few days before Halloween when Donald is finally arrested for the crime. On October 27th, 2015, police put 58-year-old Donald in handcuffs and charged him with three counts of first degree murder with a weapon. Unfortunately, it would be another four years till the case went to trial. And I think the big question people who were following this case had was, is the prosecution going to go to trial and use the religion?

• 29:56Payton Moreland?

  As the motive, like are they going to stick to the story the police were thinking? Or are they going to like go a completely different route?

• 30:04Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I feel like they need to come up with a different route because I feel like if they stick to all that, it's just not going to go well. People are going to see it as, I don't know, disrespectful or whatever. I don't know, just weird, whatever you want to call it. I just don't think it's going to go anywhere.

• 30:19Payton Moreland?

  Again, things are more nuanced than we think.

• 30:21Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 30:22Payton Moreland?

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• 31:05Payton Moreland?

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• 31:50Payton Moreland?

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• 32:35Payton Moreland?

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• 33:15Payton Moreland?

  So all this time behind bars for years really ends up helping the prosecution's case against Donald though. Because as the trial began to approach, investigators got a letter from one of Donald's fellow inmates. Again, it just take it with a grain of salt. He said Donald had told him some things that might be useful to their case. This inmate's name was Marlin Purifoy and he said Donald had confessed to him that he had killed his family. He also said that a lot of other inmates were kind of a bit scared of Donald because he told them he was a practicing witch. But that wasn't the reason why he killed his mother and siblings. The truth was, at least this is what the inmate said he told him, he had been planning these deaths for years.

• 33:59Payton Moreland?

  Allegedly Donald had told Marlin that one of the brothers had molested Donald's son when he was just three years old. And after his mother refused to take his side, Donald had held a real grudge against them. But the tipping point was when Von Seal left Donald out of her will. Her assets that were worth $900,000.

• 34:22Garrett Moreland?

  I thought you were going to say like $900 million. I was like, oh, man. That'd have been cool.

• 34:30Payton Moreland?

  But the only way Donald would ever get any of this is if both his mother and the sons slash his half brothers all died. It would then go to him.

• 34:41Garrett Moreland?

  I just find it so weird because it doesn't seem worth it to me to kill for a couple hundred thousand dollars. You know what I'm saying?

• 34:50Payton Moreland?

  I mean, nine hundred thousand.

• 34:52Garrett Moreland?

  All I mean, that's if he gets all of it and then taxes and it's just, I just find it so interesting because it's like, oh, so you kill for two hundred thousand dollars. Like, okay, you can go buy an apartment and then it's all gone. What I'm saying, like, it just seems crazy to me.

• 35:09Payton Moreland?

  I definitely think if the stories are true and you add in the trauma, the betrayal trauma, and then the money, I think we've seen worse motives. Like, I think that we've seen motives that are a little bit more.

• 35:23Garrett Moreland?

  I think what I'm trying to say is I ain't killing for less than a hundred million dollars.

• 35:27Payton Moreland?

  Okay.

• 35:28Garrett Moreland?

  I'm going big.

• 35:28Payton Moreland?

  You're not killing at all.

• 35:30Garrett Moreland?

  I'm not. I'm just saying, like hypothetically, if there was a really bad person and I was a superhero or something. Anyways, also what I'm trying to say is it all comes down to money, like I said earlier. Oh, it's always money.

• 35:43Payton Moreland?

  Law enforcement or government listening to this, I have no participation in.

• 35:48Garrett Moreland?

  No, they didn't understand.

• 35:50Payton Moreland?

  Hypotheticals.

• 35:51Garrett Moreland?

  No, they're not listening. They didn't know what I meant by killing, killing insects in the house.

• 35:56Payton Moreland?

  Okay.

• 35:57Garrett Moreland?

  Right?

• 35:57Payton Moreland?

  Right. For a hundred million.

• 35:58Garrett Moreland?

  For a hundred million.

• 36:00Payton Moreland?

  Then, in another surprising twist, Marlin also told investigators that Donald wasn't sure whether to go through with the plan or not. So he had consulted a Ouija board, which gave him the permission he was looking for to execute his plan. Now, here's the thing. Marlin is in prison for thirty years for attempted murder. He's obviously looking to strike a deal to get out early. So telling police this information benefits him. However, he knows things about the case that he really couldn't have guessed. He says that Donald told him he cut off his mother's pinky finger to get her to tell him the code to their safe.

• 36:39Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, my gosh, that's diabolical coming from a son or a kid.

• 36:45Payton Moreland?

  So the inmate says this.

• 36:48Payton Moreland?

  Anne Von Seale was missing her pinky finger.

• 36:51Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 36:51Payton Moreland?

  When the bodies were found. So like, it's like someone had to tell him that. So it kind of is backing the inmate's story. Donald also told him, he usually brought over his dog when he would go visit, but that night he didn't, which was also true. And the mention of the Ouija board is interesting because like I said, they did find one in Donald's home. So Marlin's story seems pretty strong for like inmate confessions, which meant now the prosecution had their star witness and the motive really isn't the religion. Shockingly though, by the time the case actually

• 37:29Payton Moreland?

  reached the courtroom, like I said, there is no mention of Wicca or paganism as a contributing factor. So this was solely what the police announced. And then when they get to trial, the state is like, yeah, that has nothing to do with this murder.

• 37:46Garrett Moreland?

  Which that's kind of embarrassing.

• 37:48Payton Moreland?

  Yeah. I just don't know why you would confidently, how does anyone ever really know a motive until you get to trial?

• 37:54Garrett Moreland?

  And that's crazy. Out of all things being like witchcraft.

• 37:57Payton Moreland?

  We found a Ouija board. It was definitely him.

• 37:59Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, it was a hundred percent witchcraft.

• 38:01Payton Moreland?

  Right. So when Donald's trial finally kicked off in January of 2020, he did not take the stand. And the defense holds pretty firm on the fact that there actually isn't much evidence to implicate Donald in the crime, other than his DNA at the home, which he admitted to being there for dinner. They argue none of his blood was found at the house. They never found the gun or a murder weapon. The police hadn't even really looked into other suspects before arresting him. They mentioned how the police refused to give him a polygraph test because they were afraid he would pass it. And no real eyewitnesses to the crime, other than the neighbors who said, yeah, we saw him drive away. Which he's already admitted to, his lights were off. That was the only weird thing.

• 38:43Payton Moreland?

  But I want to mention that this eyewitness account from the neighbor actually was a major point of contention because, remember, the bodies were discovered on Friday, July 31st. Investigators believe the murders were committed three days earlier on July 28th. This is the same day Donald was seen leaving the neighborhood. But the defense hired a medical expert who said, this is not accurate. That based on the body heat and level of decomposition that was recorded when the family was found, it was more likely that they were actually killed the following day. So, the next day after he had gone to dinner. They say, we think it happened on, well, this expert testifies it happened on Wednesday, July 29th.

• 39:28Payton Moreland?

  This is long after Donald left. It's also important to note, this expert was a big deal. Even the prosecution was worried about him because they said he'd been doing this for a long time. He really did know what he was talking about. The evidence in that regard did point to the murders happening the following day. But this is hard because Richard was found dead in the same clothes he was seen wearing at work on the 28th. So what did he do? Wake up and put the same exact outfit on and then get murdered in it? There is video footage of him wearing those clothes. It's just, unless he's being held hostage. But there were other issues with the prosecution's side. The state medical examiner who had first looked at the case

• 40:08Payton Moreland?

  had since resigned after he was accused of misusing state money, which isn't a good look at trial. The crime scene technician who collected DNA at the scene had also been fired because they were prosecuted for stealing drugs.

• 40:21Garrett Moreland?

  What is going on? Okay.

• 40:23Payton Moreland?

  So it's just not looking good. Like,

• 40:24Garrett Moreland?

  Freak?

• 40:25Payton Moreland?

  Even though, like, it kinda is pointing to him. Like, I will say circumstantial evidence really is pointing to him. The state's case is just falling apart. But there were some details that felt undeniable. Like I said, Marlin's statements, the inmate's statements really do hold up in court because he knew things he shouldn't have known that was never publicized. The DNA on Richard's checkbook and Donald's used cigarette butts on top of bloody towels.

• 40:55Payton Moreland?

  This appears to be enough for the jury. After three weeks of testimony, they returned a verdict. Sixty-three-year-old Donald was found guilty of three counts of first-degree murder. He was sentenced to three consecutive life terms in prison, but was spared from the death penalty. And ultimately, it was proved witchcraft never played a role at all. Which is why this story shows it is easy to point fingers at something that you don't really understand, to just blame the strange and the unfamiliar. But belief isn't dangerous. People are. And it's not what someone believes that defines them. It's what they do with it and then how other people perceive it.

• 41:40Payton Moreland?

  And that is the case of John Richard and Montseal Smith.

• 41:44Garrett Moreland?

  Interesting, because, I don't know. I mean, I guess there's enough evidence. But I was like, who else could it have been?

• 41:51Payton Moreland?

  And the inmate knowing about the pinky.

• 41:54Garrett Moreland?

  Who else could it have been? There was nobody else there. He was the last one to see them.

• 41:59Payton Moreland?

  Them wearing the same clothes.

• 42:01Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, I probably, if I was on the jury, I probably would have.

• 42:06Payton Moreland?

  The cigarette butts on top of bloody towels. How did those get there?

• 42:09Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, no, it didn't just happen. Yep, alright. Wow, it's insane.

• 42:14Payton Moreland?

  You're convinced?

• 42:14Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I think so. I think I'm convinced enough.

• 42:17Payton Moreland?

  I chose this particular case because it did have the Wiccan element for Halloween, as we know witches are a huge part. But I also did want to show that, like, just because a religion has a spooky outlook doesn't mean that we should immediately jump to they're the number one murder suspect because of it. Sometimes things are just spooky.

• 42:39Garrett Moreland?

  True.

• 42:40Payton Moreland?

  Alright, you guys, that is our episode, and we will see you next time with another one. I love it.

• 42:45Garrett Moreland?

  I hate it.

• 42:46Payton Moreland?

  Goodbye.