454: Meghan Markle’s Dad CSAM Bust, Collin Gosselin Book Bombshells, & Horsch Horror House Updates

Join Annie as she breaks down what’s happening in true crime this week.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Annie Elise?

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• 0:27Speaker 01

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• 0:57Speaker 02

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• 1:29Speaker 03

  with an estimated time of death about two and a half weeks before she was discovered.

• 1:34Speaker 04

  Colin Goslin says what millions of viewers saw each week was far different than what he says happened in his childhood off camera.

• 1:42Speaker 05

  The FBI and the Philadelphia Police homicide unit have now wrapped up their forensic search of the alleged House of Horrors in Albany.

• 1:49Speaker 04

  All quiet now after weeks of work. One says all signs point to Thomas Markle, Sr. being a possible sex offender of the grossest kind.

• 2:07Annie Elise?

  Hey, true crime besties. Welcome back to an all new episode of Seriallessly.

• 2:29Annie Elise?

  Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to an all new episode of Seriallessly with me, your host, Annie Elise. Happy Thursday. I hope you are having a fantastic week so far. Halloween is coming up. I don't know if you are dressing up or if you have kids. I have parades I'm getting ready for. So it's been a busy week doing all, you know, the last minute costume tweaks and buying all the candy that I always wait last minute for, but hope you are having a fantastic week. Instead of just day, I'm probably about to ruin your week. There is a lot to go over today. A lot of new cases also, things that have been on my radar and in my social media feed that I just have been super curious about and I knew I wanted to like talk through it with all of you

• 3:13Annie Elise?

  guys. And I've seen some of your DMs coming through as well. So there is definitely a lot to go through. As a reminder, two deep dives already available right now for you. If you need something to binge, on Monday, we released a deep dive on this feed, on the Seriallessly feed. And then on Tuesday, a deep dive in on the 10 to Life feed, which is the second true crime podcast feed. I know we have a lot of new listeners this week, so just giving you a little bit of a breakdown, some housekeeping. Two, I have two separate true crime podcasts. This one is Seriallessly, which is more conversational, a lot of cases that are in the news right now. New episodes every Monday and Thursday. Monday is the deep dive. Thursday is headline highlights,

• 3:56Annie Elise?

  where we go through everything happening this week in true crime. And then on my second true crime podcast feed, it is called 10 to Life. And there it's more deep dive storytelling, all sorts of different cases, older cases, cold cases, notorious cases, the twists and turns and all of that. So if you are new, a new listener, and you weren't sure about that, there are two separate ones. Make sure you're following them because between the two, you get new episodes every Monday, Tuesday, and Thursday. So today we are doing headline highlights and I'm actually really excited, guys, because today's a little bit different of a day where the guest who's going to be joining us flew in specifically for this episode from Snatchville,

• 4:40Annie Elise?

  Pennsylvania. Please welcome to the show Amy Collette and her snatched teeny tiny waist in her cryptrop.

• 4:48Speaker 06

  I know, I got hazed when I came in today.

• 4:50Annie Elise?

  No, it's because you look great.

• 4:51Speaker 06

  So I'm just hiking up my pants now so you can't see it.

• 4:53Annie Elise?

  Show the world.

• 4:54Speaker 06

  I'm definitely not showing the world.

• 4:56Annie Elise?

  Stand up, do a twirl.

• 4:57Speaker 06

  It's so nice to be here in studio.

• 4:59Annie Elise?

  I know. You know what? How was the flight?

• 5:01Speaker 06

  It was very quick.

• 5:03Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 5:03Speaker 06

  Yeah, it felt like it just flew by.

• 5:05Annie Elise?

  Yeah. And let me ask you this. When you put on the crop top today, was your bare skin touching the airplane seat?

• 5:13Speaker 06

  Absolutely not.

• 5:15Annie Elise?

  For those of you who don't know, this is Amy. She is a reoccurring co-host here, but I always like to welcome her in a fun and new way. And she didn't fly here. She lives down the street. But yeah, she walked into the office today looking great in her head to toe espresso outfit with her.

• 5:32Speaker 06

  Well, thank you. I'm trying to feel fall.

• 5:34Annie Elise?

  I know, just rocking it.

• 5:36Speaker 06

  Even though it's like 90 degrees here.

• 5:38Annie Elise?

  I know, but not 98 degrees. I do cherish you. No, I'm just kidding. Um, yeah. Are you ready for Halloween?

• 5:48Speaker 06

  I keep forgetting it's Halloween and I'm just living to see the kids and what they are dressed up as because your kids though don't have a really like, they can't go for a long time on Halloween. I feel like they get over it very soon.

• 6:02Annie Elise?

  That's because their bedtime is 7:00 PM sharp.

• 6:04Speaker 06

  That's true. They're exhausted.

• 6:06Annie Elise?

  I know. They're like, the sun's going down. What?

• 6:09Speaker 06

  Not to mention your children grew up having Christmas decorations on Halloween. So they don't really understand the holiday, I don't think.

• 6:16Annie Elise?

  That is true. Here, let me just walk you through this. Okay. I don't decorate for Halloween. That is true. And I used to decorate for harvest. Like, I hate that word, but I used to decorate for harvest. But then it's like such a quick turnaround after Thanksgiving where then you put Christmas up and you don't get to enjoy Christmas decorations for very long. So in my mind, starting what, what was that, like five years ago, my logic became, we're going to skip harvest. We're just going to decorate for Christmas. But then also, since I don't decorate for Halloween, let's just start Christmas early. So to your point, our Christmas tree is up.

• 6:50Speaker 06

  And she doesn't just decorate for Christmas. She'll choose a theme. So one year I briefly lived with her during COVID and she went gingerbread house, which, okay, that's fine. The entire house. Then there was a live nut, live sized nutcracker, which I still stand by. That was a great purchase.

• 7:09Annie Elise?

  Although that nutcracker doesn't really make it into the house anymore because it doesn't really match since I.

• 7:14Speaker 06

  Because you have a new theme.

• 7:15Annie Elise?

  No, because my whole house is wallpapered. And so it needs to be like golds and whites. But yes, I, you know what? I do it for the children. Okay. I do it for them, even though they're confused on what holiday it is and when Santa comes. And they're like, is Santa coming? When we go home from trick or treating?

• 7:31Speaker 06

  Exactly. Honestly.

• 7:34Annie Elise?

  Are you doing anything for Halloween?

• 7:36Speaker 06

  Well, I was, I guess I was waiting for the invite to come trick or treating with you guys. So no, no, I'm not.

• 7:41Annie Elise?

  We're finding a new route this year because as you know, our neighborhood is dead during Halloween. It's like darkness. So I think we're going to go with some school friends this year, hit some areas in OC. I'm not going to tell you guys.

• 7:53Speaker 06

  That was her light, her way of lightly telling me, I'm not going.

• 7:57Annie Elise?

  No, you can, but I'll tell you offline where we're going.

• 8:00Speaker 06

  Well, I was thinking too, I think Jay's neighborhood could be fun because they probably take the golf cart out.

• 8:05Annie Elise?

  Totally. When I was down there this weekend, our brother lives in San Clemente and we went out on the golf cart. Every single house is like so excited for Halloween. So they have like the big skeletons, the bats. I was like, this probably like goes off during Halloween. And yeah, the golf carts are probably out in full swing with lights and like so much fun.

• 8:23Speaker 06

  Which I got invited to a party on Balboa Island, but it's underwater right now. So I'm like, I don't know if that's going to be happening, which is wild.

• 8:31Annie Elise?

  If you had to dress up, what would your costume be?

• 8:33Speaker 06

  I'm anti costume, so I wouldn't.

• 8:35Annie Elise?

  I know you are, but like if you had to, because you're going to a party.

• 8:38Speaker 06

  Princess.

• 8:41Annie Elise?

  Okay. Are you Emmy? No, you know what? You could totally pull off and it would be such an easy costume this year. Elizabeth Holmes.

• 8:49Speaker 06

  I'm not quite sure how to take that.

• 8:51Annie Elise?

  You have the blonde hair, you just get a black turtleneck, do the crazy eyes like this, and then red lipstick.

• 8:57Speaker 06

  I don't really wanna be here.

• 8:58Annie Elise?

  And say, hello, my husband sucks ass. And I think literally.

• 9:05Speaker 06

  I'm good.

• 9:06Annie Elise?

  I know, but you could be, that's an easy.

• 9:07Speaker 06

  What are you gonna be?

• 9:08Annie Elise?

  Nothing.

• 9:09Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 9:09Annie Elise?

  I don't dress up for Halloween either.

• 9:11Speaker 06

  You don't have like a family costume going?

• 9:12Annie Elise?

  No.

• 9:13Speaker 06

  I feel like I could definitely see Jared getting into it.

• 9:15Annie Elise?

  He could, maybe. Theo's gonna be an inflatable Pikachu, which I'm not trying to be a Pokemon. And then Emmy is gonna be Taylor Swift.

• 9:23Speaker 06

  Which era?

• 9:23Annie Elise?

  Enchanted version.

• 9:24Speaker 06

  Okay.

• 9:24Annie Elise?

  So it's the big ball gown that's like.

• 9:26Speaker 06

  Of course it is.

• 9:27Annie Elise?

  It's like the huge ball gown and the dazzled mic. Yeah. So that's gonna be fun. Sorry, guys. I know you're bored to death and you're like, shut up and get to it. So before we get into the main core cases that we're gonna be talking about today, a couple of things I do wanna update you on. One, I heard just earlier this week that the Gonzalez family of, in the Idaho four case is passing out defamation suits like it's trick or treating candy to like so many different creators. I think we're up to 15 right now. And I say, go for it.

• 9:58Speaker 06

  I was just gonna say, good for them.

• 9:59Annie Elise?

  I know. I like, obviously, you know, we spoke with Kaylee's dad at Crime Con. We've, I've covered that case literally since inception, since the moment that it happened. And I don't know if inception's the right word.

• 10:11Speaker 06

  I was gonna say, wow, you're really branching out in your vocab.

• 10:13Annie Elise?

  I know. I think it's the right word, whatever. But um, I've had a lot of thoughts about that case from day one. And I know a lot of people are divided on who knew what, who related what. There's people who are pro burgers who think that Brian's innocent and he's been framed. But at, at the core of it, because it was such a polarizing case, so many people were of course covering it and talking about it. However, there was this like sect of creators and podcasters who knew that it was so polarizing. So they only wanted to do the clickbaity stuff. And I'm talking some of the most vile stuff out there that I've seen on the internet. I know there's one creator, I'm not gonna say his name, but you probably know who I'm referring to.

• 10:57Speaker 06

  I don't, but I'm interested to get the info after.

• 11:02Annie Elise?

  Um, but like slandering the family, uh, just like making up so many crazy things that were never even true. And so I'm happy that they're trying to set a precedent here and like.

• 11:15Speaker 06

  Absolutely.

• 11:16Annie Elise?

  And say this is unacceptable. And we saw a little bit of that happen in this case already when the professor sued a TikToker who the TikToker had accused the professor of being involved in all of this. So I say, go for it. Go ham, like.

• 11:29Speaker 06

  I don't like the clickbait stuff. I just feel like it's using your platform for wrong and just, this is the, not the time or the place to be doing that.

• 11:37Annie Elise?

  I agree. It's just super reckless. And it's like, this is somebody's, yeah, this is their life, the worst day of their lives. And like the, even still now, especially now that Brian is now trying to flip his plea and Uno reverse it. It's like they're never, it's like this never ending cycle for them. So we'll see what happens. But yeah, I say, good for them.

• 11:57Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 11:58Annie Elise?

  Also, the Sandra Birchmore trial is continuing to go on and it's a federal trial, so it's not televised, but I do know a lot of people are putting recaps out there. So I posted something on Instagram earlier this week saying, hey, I've covered this case before it went to trial. I did the deep dive. I even did a updated deep dive last fall. But I basically put a question out there saying, do you want trial updates? Or do you want a deep dive into the bombshells of the trial? Or you know, what are you guys looking for? And a lot of you said yes, even though there is some coverage out there. And for those of you who aren't familiar with that case, it's really horrible. This

• 12:35Annie Elise?

  young woman, Sandra Birchmore, basically had, she had joined this young explorers program within the police department in Massachusetts as a 13 year old girl. And these officers started grooming her and preying on her and exploiting her and having sexual relations with her. And one of them, she ended up in this, I don't wanna call it a relationship because she was too young to consent to a relationship, but this sexual dynamic for years. And he was married, he had a family, he even had children on the way. And she wanted to get pregnant. He promised her a baby. It, I think, kind of just to appease her and make her, you know, quiet and complacent with the situation because she had threatened to expose him at that point.

• 13:18Annie Elise?

  So she ends up being pregnant, then he, she is found dead by apparent self harm. Come to find out, it was a staged scene. She, he is on trial for her murder right now. But, and she was pregnant at the time. It appeared that the motive was he killed her because of the baby and he didn't wanna get caught and everything. Come to find out, the baby actually wasn't even his. But it goes so much deeper than that. So many different cops involved, his brother involved and like so many things. So anyway, that trial's happening right now. So let me know too, in the comment section here, if you want me to dive into that a little bit more of just like pulling out what the need to know from the trial.

• 13:58Annie Elise?

  Because it's, of, as I said, not televised, it's federal and there is a lot there. Like three of the mistresses are now testifying. Um, the brother is being called to the stand. There's so much more that has come out.

• 14:11Speaker 06

  Well, that corruption's been brought up before from that department, so.

• 14:15Annie Elise?

  Oh, multiple times. And one of the officers involved with the um, investigation was also looped in with the Karen Reed stuff. So it's just like a shitstorm.

• 14:23Speaker 06

  There's definite, I remember during the Karen Reed case, people bringing up Sandra and saying like, look at this and pay more attention. So I think there's definitely more public interest in this.

• 14:33Annie Elise?

  Definitely. So yeah, let us know.

• 14:36Speaker 06

  Well, I have an update.

• 14:37Annie Elise?

  Ooh, an update.

• 14:38Speaker 06

  Yeah, this is an update on Destiny Daniels. So if you remember, she's the 24 year old woman that was found decomposing on her couch in her apartment in Quincy, Illinois, back on September 24th.

• 14:49Annie Elise?

  That's right.

• 14:50Speaker 06

  So we did talk about this case a few weeks ago. And if you remember, there were still a ton of questions about what happened to her, especially after her friends and neighbors came forward saying nobody had heard or seen her in nearly seven months. So just to quickly recap, for those of you that may have not listened to that episode, Destiny was reportedly last seen back in February arguing with her boyfriend Colin inside of their apartment building. And since then, she just seemingly vanished and her friends and family actually feared that she had been dead that entire time. There were allegations going around that Colin had continued paying rent, using her bank cards and car, and possibly even staying at the apartment throughout all of those months since February.

• 15:31Speaker 06

  And to make matters even more suspicious, he reportedly went on this planned vacation the same week Destiny's body was found, which then only of course added to that speculation about whether or not he had something to do with her death. Well, Quincy police have now released the findings of their investigation and what they found has people asking even more questions than before, myself included. So on October 20th, the police chief released a statement saying that Destiny actually died of natural causes, just two and a half weeks before her body was found. And according to the autopsy, there were no signs of injury or trauma and toxicology testing came back negative for drugs. And investigators even found digital evidence showing that Destiny was still alive as recently as September 5th.

• 16:16Speaker 06

  And apparently that digital evidence also showed that Colin hadn't been to that apartment building since July. Which that was interesting considering all of those earlier allegations that he was using her card and had been paying the rent and utilities up until shortly before her body was found. Now, the statement itself was pretty brief. And at the end of it, Quincy police basically said that they're done talking about this case. They said that their investigation was based on witness interviews, forensic findings and digital evidence, and that their responsibility is to follow the facts rather than speculation or these unverified claims that they're finding online. Then they also added that they won't be providing any additional statements, interviews or comments moving forward.

• 16:58Speaker 06

  Which is interesting because if anything, now there's more questions here than answers because people are questioning, how did this 24 year old die of natural causes? And she had seemingly not been seen in months. And to be clear, police haven't explained what those natural causes even were. So that's something people are also questioning and trying to wrap their heads around. But another thing that people keep bringing up is the condition of Destiny's body. Because when she was found, she was so badly decomposed that the coroner had to use dental records to identify her. So people were wondering like, how is even possible that if she was only dead for two and a half weeks, how was she so badly decomposed? And actually, I looked into this a bit because I was curious about that.

• 17:42Speaker 06

  And apparently, depending on the conditions where the body is, a body can decompose pretty significantly in just a couple of weeks, even indoors. There are things like heat, humidity, ventilation, and also whether or not the air conditioning was running that can all make a difference. But it completely depends on those things and how badly it was. And if you remember correctly, there are a lot of interviews with the neighbors inside that building that were complaining of the smell for weeks. They, even one neighbor, if I remember correctly, was quoted saying it was unbearable. So I think people just kind of dismiss this smell. And so it sounds like it might've not even been coming from that apartment specifically. That could've just kind of been contributing to it.

• 18:25Speaker 06

  And as for Destiny's family, they're still not buying this explanation that the police have been given. They've been very, very outspoken since the body was found, but especially since this last statement came out saying they believe something went wrong with the investigation. They're also alleging that authorities are refusing to give them access to Destiny's body so that they can have a second independent autopsy performed. So that obviously has also gotten people talking because their family is here asking for more answers and wants more testing, but the police are shutting down the investigation and saying they have nothing further to say.

• 19:00Speaker 06

  So to be clear, everything that's coming from Destiny's family about Colin is speculation at this point. And the official findings are that Destiny died of natural causes and that he has been cleared. But I can also understand, which I'm sure you could imagine, why the family would have more questions and like want more answers to why this all happened. But as far as we know now, the police aren't commenting, commenting any further.

• 19:25Annie Elise?

  I'm gonna raise my hand.

• 19:26Speaker 06

  Comment, Annie Elise.

• 19:28Annie Elise?

  I have a thought. First of all, it's weird that a 24-year-old would die of natural causes and they're not saying what those natural causes are. Could it be something like we've seen in cases where people either inject air into the vein properly to make somebody die, or like, oh, you've, yeah, like, it's a thing. Unlike, there's so many different things where it can make it look like it's natural causes, but it's not. Also, I have covered a handful of cases where you were talking about decomp and how to expedite that. And yes, people will either turn the AC on, get a window unit, point, point the vent, or the foil, coil, whatever it is, directly out of the body to like, make, so that then, the goal with that is so that

• 20:08Annie Elise?

  when they come in, they can't determine a correct time of death, and sometimes, cause of death. So if he was still paying for utilities, and for that apartment, was one of those utilities, the air conditioner, was that running? Was he trying to keep it there because he was trying to decompose her body? And I'm not trying to say he's guilty, maybe he is innocent and natural cause.

• 20:26Speaker 06

  Man, your Brian, brain works in different ways.

• 20:28Annie Elise?

  I'm not trying, I'm not trying to go full conspiracy here, but there's something still, like,

• 20:35Speaker 06

  Fishy?

• 20:36Annie Elise?

  Yes, like, if it is natural causes, give us more information, give the family more information, allow them to do an independent autopsy. Why would you, like, why wouldn't you allow that? And normally, too, I would say, oh, maybe they're keeping it close to the vest because they are investigating and they don't want to spook him, or have somebody know they have the jump on him. I don't think they would say that it was natural causes necessarily, if that were the case. But the, the paying for the utilities and the place, even though he hadn't physically been there since July, then her decomp level being so severe, not in line with being dead two weeks, there's something going on.

• 21:12Speaker 06

  I know. My initial thought was just knowing how bad of condition this building was. I'm like, was there like, a carbon monoxide leak, or something like, she's laying on the couch, it's only been two weeks, but it's hot, it's like gross conditions, like, I don't know. But then, to your point, if this is someone's girlfriend, and it's like, you haven't talked to them in two weeks, and you're so close that you're paying utilities, like, who knows, maybe he just had access to her card, and he like, handled the bills or something. But regardless, you don't talk to someone for two weeks. That's questionable. And then, to go on a vacation right after.

• 21:47Annie Elise?

  Coincidentally, the same week they find her body.

• 21:49Speaker 06

  So I mean, there are definitely some weird things. And I guess, like, even that can be explained away, because they're young, and like, maybe he just couldn't cope or something, but then, the police not allowing them to do a second autopsy. I don't understand that. Why? And can't, don't they have a right to do that?

• 22:04Annie Elise?

  Yeah, well, and to play devil's advocate, I mean, I guess you could say, if she did die of natural causes, I mean, if it were carbon monoxide, I think they would have said that, yeah. But if, if she did die of natural causes, maybe she did die on the couch, watching TV or something, and had the AC on, or had the heater on, or whatever it was, that then just kept running and expedite him, possibly. Like, so I'm not trying to say this guy's guilty, if there's no evidence that he is guilty, but there is something that just doesn't feel complete.

• 22:33Speaker 06

  Like, if I was her family, I would be like, I want more information.

• 22:36Annie Elise?

  Exactly, 100%. All right, I feel like we need to just have an honest conversation here in the circle of trust. Can we talk about how literally, everything seems to be getting more expensive? Groceries, gas, rent, you name it. And apparently, your wireless bill wants to join in on that party, too. But here's the thing, it doesn't have to. Mint Mobile is making it so much easier to stop overpaying for wireless, with plans starting at just 15 bucks a month. And you're not sacrificing quality either. All plans include high-speed data, unlimited talk and text, and access to the nation's largest 5G network. You can also use your current phone and your current phone number. You just sign up online, and you are

• 23:16Annie Elise?

  good to go. Now, I changed carriers, probably a year and a half ago at this point, to Mint Mobile. And when I tell you, not only was it the best decision of my life, I now have, like, service in places my husband doesn't even have service, but it was so easy. It took me 15 minutes, kept my phone, kept my phone number, it was the best. So for a new wireless plan, starting at 15 bucks a month, go to mintmobile.com/ae. That's mintmobile.com/ae. $45 upfront payment required, equivalent to $15 per month. New customers on first three-month plan only, taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details. This episode is sponsored by Chime. Get more of your money with Chime. With the Chime card, you get 5% cash back

• 23:58Annie Elise?

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• 24:43Annie Elise?

  required. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for details. Today's episode is sponsored by Wayfair. Now, you guys know I'm constantly changing things out in the studio, at my house, everywhere. I always have some sort of room that I just want to refresh. I want to, like, do a little mini upgrade, change something out, flip it around. So recently, I wanted to change my kids' rooms. They have, they're growing, they need, like, full-blown hampers now, I need to organize their stuff more, so I went to Wayfair, knowing exactly that I was going to find what I needed. They spec it out for you, they have the exact measurements available, you can, like, see the reviews, and it's just, it makes it so easy to find something and feel confident about what you're buying. And I love it now, it, like, their rooms look so cute, they're so organized, love, love, love for

• 25:25Annie Elise?

  them. And Wayfair just makes shopping for your home so easy, because there are thousands of products across basically every style and budget. Their products also have been hand-vetted by product specialists using a 10-point quality inspection. Plus, you have those trusted reviews that will help you decide. So whether you're replacing one thing, or completely transforming a space, there is so much to choose from. Find pieces made for real life, and get even more value with Wayfair Rewards. Join Wayfair Rewards today and get 5% back on every purchase. Head to wayfair.com to shop all things home. That's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com. Um, okay, so this next case that we're going to talk about, isn't necessarily, like, a case, but it kind of actually is, I guess you could say. But it's one that has been fascinating me for the last couple of weeks. I've seen a lot

• 26:10Annie Elise?

  of you guys talk about it, too. And I'm sure a lot of you remember John and Kate +8, the TV show on TLC, back in the, what was it, like, 2000s, I think it was? Uh, it was a reality show, one of the very first reality shows, that followed John and Kate Goslin as they raised their eight kids. Well, now, one of those kids, Colin Goslin, just released a memoir on October 13th, and it's called In the Shadow of Eight. And the things that he is coming forward with, and some of the allegations of things that went down in his childhood, they are absolutely insane, and also completely unexpected to a lot of people. Now, to give you a little bit of backstory, back in 2016, Kate had

• 26:52Annie Elise?

  sent Colin to a psychiatric facility. She claimed that he had behavioral issues and also special needs, when she was only 11 years old at the time. He ended up spending about two years in treatment facilities, before eventually moving in with his dad, John. But Colin has always said that his mother's version of events isn't true. So now, he's finally telling his side of the story, including what he says was happening inside that home, long before he was sent away. Back when they were filming the show, leading up to it, and just kind of the aftermath, too, once the show started tanking. And I want to start with probably one of the most disturbing allegations in the entire book, which is that Colin says that his mother kept him locked in an unfinished basement for two years. It's kind

• 27:37Annie Elise?

  of giving, like, Jodie Hildebrandt and Ruby Frankie a little bit. She wasn't just sent to his room, or grounded, or things like that. He claims that he was literally sleeping on an air mattress in this particular section of the basement that had walls built around it, almost like it was a holding cell. And Kate allegedly had cameras set up that were there to monitor him, and it had a door that was locked from the outside, so he could not leave on his own. Which, I have a lot of thoughts about this, and unfortunately, it is not the first time we've heard of a situation like this, as I just cited, Jodie Hildebrandt, Ruby Frankie, we know that they did that with Ruby's son. Also, there was a couple here in, was it here, in San Diego, or Jupiter? I can't remember, one of the two.

• 28:20Annie Elise?

  And they had adopted a son, and they made a makeshift holding cell for him, which I'm like, why would you even adopt a child, if this is what you're going to do? And there have been a lot of cases where we've heard on, heard of that. Some of the parents say that the reason they did that is for the child's own perfection, protection, if they were going, if they were diagnosed with ODD, which is oppositional defiance disorder, or something like that. But more times than not, it was ruled that that wasn't the case, and I think it was just the easy excuse for parents to make. And I'm not saying that's what Kate was saying in this situation, but I'm just saying, like, it's obviously not new to us. We have heard things like this. Colin says that he spent about 70% of his time

• 29:01Annie Elise?

  down there, and that there were nights when he couldn't even get out to use the bathroom. That, when he was allowed upstairs, he says that he was either cleaning, eating by himself, or having to act like everything was perfectly fine whenever the cameras were on. Which, can you imagine? If this is true, and these are his allegations because it's being disputed on the other side. But if this is true, that means that Kate had kind of like the, no, I don't want to say courage. That's the wrong word, but like the audacity and the gall to do this while cameras were even rolling and put him down and like had the confidence that she could get away with it, even being on such a public platform, which is like wild to me.

• 29:42Speaker 06

  She talked to her husband that way? I mean, she talked to everybody that way.

• 29:45Annie Elise?

  She's the whole reason actually that, and I'm going to this for all my, any of my Gen Z listeners, the reason Karens, the term Karen exists with, not just Karen, but also the haircut.

• 29:59Annie Elise?

  Well, that's who you could be from.

• 30:00Speaker 06

  Oh, my gosh.

• 30:02Annie Elise?

  Bangs and like the spiky back and how they're like, oh, this is the classic Karen haircut. It's because that was the Kate Goslin haircut and she was the Karen, the Karen.

• 30:11Speaker 06

  The ultimate Karen.

• 30:12Annie Elise?

  Yeah. So I think if you just think about that for a second, while everyone was at home watching this family on TV, for good, for bad, the ugly, all the things, reality TV, Colin says, that's what his life actually looked like. Well, not what was being displayed on the television, but him being locked away in this cell down in the basement for years. And it wasn't just the basement either. Colin says that Kate would also grab him by the ear and drag him around the house, or that she would slap him hard enough to leave bruises. In fact, he remembers a teacher noticing an injury to his ear and getting the, uh, children and youth services involved in all of that. But when they came to the house, he says that he was so terrified of his mom, Kate, and what she may do if he told them

• 30:57Annie Elise?

  the truth, that he denied that anything was happening. Eventually then, when Colin was 11 years old, he says he got to the point where he couldn't take it anymore. So he actually tried running away from home, but he realized that he had nowhere to go. So he ended up coming back. And according to Colin, Kate was absolutely furious over this. He claims that she zip tied his wrists and his ankles, threw him onto the floor and started screaming at him that he was a burden to the family. And Colin believes that that was the moment that Kate decided that she was done dealing with him at home, period. And he actually wrote, quote, "This was the last time that she ever put her hands on me," explaining

• 31:39Annie Elise?

  that he believes that his resistance convinced her to have him removed from the house entirely and sent away to that facility. So that's when he ended up being, as I just said, sent to that psychiatric facility where, according to Colin, the mistreatment didn't stop. He says that staff members physically mistreated him, made fun of his weight, prescribed him more than 13 different medications, including antipsychotics, antidepressants, and anti-anxiety medications, without even really understanding what he was already taking or what he was diagnosed with, which, I'm sorry, but we're talking about an 11-year-old child here. How is he supposed to understand what any of those medications are, let alone why he's

• 32:20Annie Elise?

  being given so many of them? So Colin eventually got out of the facility and then he went and lived with his father, John. But apparently even years later, he says that his mother's allegations about his mental health were still affecting his life. And this is actually what he says finally pushed him to write this book. Back in 2023, Colin was pursuing his own dream of becoming a Marine and he had already started training when apparently his mom, Kate, posted a statement online claiming that he, quote, "had multiple psychiatric diagnoses," or diagnoses, I never remember how you're supposed to say that, and that he also had a history of violent behavior. According to Colin, those claims eventually reached a military doctor. So because of that, he was discharged from the program.

• 33:06Annie Elise?

  Now, I don't know if that's because the doctor proved that there was validity with any of that, or if they were just being, you know, like taking the precaution and erring on the side of caution because Kate had disclosed that and they were going along with that and maybe he had things from the treatment facility where he was diagnosed by them, but maybe it wasn't accurate. I honestly don't know. But he has continuously denied everything that Kate has said about his mental health, even saying that he has had independent medical evaluations done, most recently in October of 2023, which found no psychological issues. So from Colin's perspective, he had finally moved on from his life. He was leaving things behind, becoming an adult and growing into his own, working towards something that he

• 33:51Annie Elise?

  really wanted for himself. But now he felt like these same allegations that he had been fighting since childhood had cost him that entire opportunity within the military that he was so passionate about. But he says, even though that got ruined for him at the time, he does plan to go back after graduating college and that he isn't looking for Kate's approval anymore.

• 34:10Speaker 04

  Kate has disputed some of the things you've said in the past. What would you want her to understand about how you experienced it and the way you're telling it through this book?

• 34:20Speaker 07

  I don't really look for her approval or her understanding today. Um, I've gotten multiple psychological evaluations and they've all said the same thing. I don't have anything. And, um, I've actually, and it's crazy even because I've gone in there with a list of, of diagnoses and I'm like, evaluate against these. And that's even harder than just going without any. So they've evaluated against those and ruled out any further diagnoses. So I've done that as an adult and it's unfortunate that I've had to do so much due diligence as an adult, try and clear my name. Um, but I, I don't look for approval and I've done my homework. And by the way, I have receipts of so many things that are yet to come out. And I got receipts, so more is to come.

• 35:03Annie Elise?

  Now, as for Kate, she hasn't really come out and addressed these new allegations directly or head on, but she has been responding to people defending her on social media. Someone left her a comment about all of the sacrifices that she made as a mother and encouraged her to not let any of this criticism get to her, which Kate responded saying, quote, "I know who I am and my kids know who I am and to me, that's all that matters." Meanwhile, Colin's father, John, has been standing behind Colin, saying that he couldn't be prouder of his son for sharing his story. He also said that anyone who continues to falsely claim that Colin is mentally ill would, quote, "be held accountable." And listen, obviously these are Colin's allegations, as I said, and Kate has previously defended

• 35:47Annie Elise?

  her decision to send him away. But now that Colin has put all of this out there in his memoir, I'm curious to see whether Kate is going to address any of these specific claims, if some sort of proof is going to come to light, or if maybe she's going to continue just responding to people on social media who are kind of giving her like an echo chamber and leave it at that. But what I do know is Colin's book made it on the New York Times Bestseller.

• 36:12Speaker 06

  Good for him.

• 36:13Annie Elise?

  Yeah. And a lot of people in the public are standing behind him, but it always does become a little bit of a dicey situation when mental health allegations are at play. But this is his truth. He's sharing it. I think we all witnessed this train wreck of a woman on the TV, which I get TV doesn't display everything. It's an edit, but also if even worse things were going on behind the scenes, like what is the truth? I don't know.

• 36:39Speaker 06

  I mean, I didn't ever watch the show. Obviously it was such a like phenomenon when we were growing up that I caught bits and pieces, but my first thought is just you're a mother and like, why are you going on social media or in public at all and talking about your children like that, regardless if it's true or not? I mean,

• 36:58Annie Elise?

  That's a good point.

• 36:59Speaker 06

  What's going on? Like, I can't imagine anything that like my niece and nephew could do that would make me go in public and have any sort of comment on anything about them personally.

• 37:10Annie Elise?

  I agree. I kind of think they can, she can rip a page out of the Beckhams book because obviously there's a huge feud between David and Victoria Beckham and their son right now. And, um, what's his name? Why can I not think of it? He's married to Nicole, the billionaire's daughter.

• 37:26Speaker 06

  Brooklyn.

• 37:26Annie Elise?

  Brooklyn Beckham. Yes, that's right. And, um, it is Brooklyn?

• 37:29Speaker 06

  I don't know.

• 37:31Annie Elise?

  I think it, whatever. But anyways, there's a feud going on with them that has been pretty public, mainly because he has spoken out on it. And anytime the parents make comments, they're like, we love our children, we stand by them and you know, we're here when they're ready. And so that, in my opinion, is the position to take. It's not to continue to like sensationalize or respond to these picky choosy comments where they're in your favor. So if you are a mother who truly does have unconditional love. So we'll see what comes of that, but. I don't know, it piqued my curiosity and it's fascinating and it does kind of remind me a lot of Ruby Frankie.

• 38:06Speaker 06

  That's what I was thinking a lot of unfortunately. And that's the thing, I mean, back then, I don't think people thought that it was gonna come to a head the way it did. And now, I mean, that was all documented, so. Okay, well, we also have some updates in the Horsch, House of Horrors investigation out of Philadelphia. And after spending weeks of digging up the yard and practically taking apart the entire house, investigators have finally wrapped up their search of the property. So let's talk a little bit about what they found. So on October 15th, the Philadelphia Medical Examiner's Office was called out to the house after investigators discovered bones buried in the backyard. And as a reminder, authorities have been trying to figure out what happened to at least seven women connected to R.C.

• 38:50Speaker 06

  Horsch and his property. And they believed that at least some of those seven women, if not all of them, may have been dead. So obviously, finding bones buried in the backyard was a pretty big deal. Now investigators were very clear right away that they didn't know whether these were human or animal bones, but given everything they were looking into, they weren't gonna be taking any chances. They brought in the medical examiner to collect them for testing while detectives continued digging through the yard, literally sifting dirt layer by layer. And at that point, they were about three feet down, and they had also uncovered the remains of an old brick outhouse, as well as seven opossum carcasses near the property. And they weren't just finding things outside either.

• 39:34Speaker 06

  As investigators continued taking the house apart, they reportedly found a safe hidden inside one of the walls. They also used luminol throughout the home and recovered human DNA in several locations, including the basement, which has since been sent off for further testing. So we'll see what that comes back as. Now investigators reportedly believe that R.C. Horsch may have used a process called alkaline hydrolysis to dispose of human remains, which is basically a chemical process that can break down a body. And according to law enforcement, R.C. actually wrote about how to do this in one of his books, where he described himself as an, quote, "empathetic serial killer," which is disgusting. I don't even know what to say about that when I read that. I'm like, who would ever describe themselves as that, an empathetic serial killer?

• 40:19Annie Elise?

  It kind of reminds me of who's the person in the O.C. surrogacy case, how he said the reason he wanted to have so many children is because he's so wealthy. I forget the word he used, but like, wanted to give them all a better life, but it was like altruism or something like that. And it was like, why would you describe yourself? Is that like, what are you talking about?

• 40:36Speaker 06

  I mean, that tells you a lot about that person.

• 40:37Annie Elise?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 40:38Speaker 06

  But investigators did actually recover chemicals from inside the house, and those have also been sent to labs to determine exactly what they are. So I do believe that could have actually been something that he was doing. But then going back to those bones that were found in the yard, about a week after they were discovered, authorities confirmed that they were in fact, animal bones, not human. But that didn't stop the search. At that point, investigators were more than halfway through excavating the backyard, and once they were finished there, they then moved on to the front yard. But by last Friday, though, the search was officially finished. Investigators finished up just before noon and were essentially leaving empty-handed. And after weeks of digging through the property, tearing apart the house, and searching for

• 41:22Speaker 06

  any sign of the missing women, they did not find any human remains. Now that doesn't necessarily mean that they didn't find anything useful inside the home. Investigators did collect several other items that are still undergoing testing, including that human DNA samples that were found during that luminol testing. And now that they're finished searching the property itself, investigators are shifting their focus to all of that digital evidence they collected throughout the investigation. Because if you remember, there was like, an enormous amount.

• 41:51Annie Elise?

  Yeah, there was so much, they had only gone through like, 3% of what they had found.

• 41:55Speaker 06

  Yeah, which was.

• 41:56Annie Elise?

  And they found like, video evidence, yeah, like.

• 41:58Speaker 06

  So I'm sure there's gonna be more coming from that.

• 42:01Annie Elise?

  Well, do you want to say what one of our producers said about the animal bones?

• 42:05Speaker 06

  No.

• 42:06Annie Elise?

  When we remember, in Slack, and I'm not gonna put her on blast and say her name, but as we were talking about all of this, when she like, she's all, everybody, every serial, or everybody knows that if you're trying to bury a body, you bury the animal bones on top so that they stop digging after that.

• 42:21Speaker 06

  That's right.

• 42:22Annie Elise?

  I was all, everybody knows that.

• 42:23Speaker 06

  It took me apart, I like, I'm like, whoa, okay.

• 42:25Annie Elise?

  I was like, I didn't know that. I know, I know.

• 42:28Speaker 06

  So yeah, I mean, the physical search is over, but they're still waiting to find out what all that forensic testing reveals, and to see if they can connect it to any of those missing women. Because that's a lot of missing women to be gone and connected to him, and there's no evidence. I'm actually very surprised there's no, was no physical evidence. What do you think?

• 42:44Annie Elise?

  I don't know, he had the drums of chemicals. They have seemingly been at this for decades, so I think there's a way that they have been able to get away with it and hide things or transport things. Maybe things are buried deeper below the surface. I know they're excavating and like, continuing to do all of that.

• 43:02Speaker 06

  Well, and like, a safe inside of a wall?

• 43:03Annie Elise?

  No, I know. And like, they found hidden compartments the first search, too, with like, all sorts of things. I'm somebody who very much believes Occam's razor, where there's smoke, there's fire, like, there's, I, I do not think we're at the end of this. I think there is going to be.

• 43:19Speaker 06

  Of course not.

• 43:20Annie Elise?

  A massive discovery. And these people freak me the fuck out. R.C. and Eugene look straight out of, I know I've said it, hills have eyes. They like, if you looked up serial killer in the dictionary, that photo would be there. Like, they are so creepy, they fit the bill, and I know, don't judge a book by its cover, but.

• 43:39Speaker 06

  I mean, it truly is a house of horrors.

• 43:40Annie Elise?

  I'm judging.

• 43:41Speaker 06

  That is scary.

• 43:42Annie Elise?

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• 44:26Annie Elise?

  And I ended up getting an amazing deal. So it makes shopping feel way more fun and also interactive. Whatnot is the number one live shopping app in the U.S. with incredible sellers live 24/7. You can shop name brands across makeup, perfume, clothing, handbags, jewelry, and so much more. So whatever you're looking for, there is always something new to discover. Download Whatnot today and get $20 off your first purchase. Search Whatnot, W-H-A-T-N-O-T, in the App Store, sign up and start finding the best deals on the products you love with $20 off your first purchase. Terms apply. Whoever says saving money is hard doesn't know that new customers who bundle and save with Progressive, save hundreds. Because switching your home and auto insurance is way better than cutting down on the things

• 45:11Annie Elise?

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• 45:29Speaker 02

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• 45:37Speaker 05

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• 45:40Speaker 02

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• 45:59Annie Elise?

  Speaking of judging, okay, this is a hot topic right now, and I'm kind of surprised that there is so much division out there with people's opinions on whether or not this is truthful, and if there's actually any merit to it. I believe there is, and I'm going to explain why, but that's just my opinion. It is something that's ongoing, it is just allegations at this point. So, like I always say, do your own research, form your own opinions, but we have to talk about it, and it's Meghan Markle's dad.

• 46:34Speaker 06

  I was just gonna say, I have no idea where you're going with this. Oh, well, let's hear it.

• 46:38Annie Elise?

  It's Meghan Markle's dad. So we have to talk about what's going on with her father, Thomas Markle, Sr., because over the last week, some pretty serious allegations have come out, and he's currently being investigated over the alleged possession of CSAM material. And if you don't know the acronym of CSAM, look it up, but it's basically explicit child material. And what's really interesting about all of this is that Meghan has also now come forward saying that she was actually made aware of these allegations against her father years ago, and that that, and that these allegations were the reason that she decided to keep him away from her children. So according to reports, Meghan's half-brother, Thomas Markle, Jr., recently made a disturbing

• 47:22Annie Elise?

  discovery while he was going through his father's belongings at his former home in the Philippines earlier this year. Thomas had lived in the Philippines for a while, I think he was, I know he was having medical procedures and things like that. And so, to my knowledge, Thomas, Jr., went there to grab some paperwork or to get some things when he made this discovery. Thomas, Jr. had also been helping care for his father, who's now 82 years old, by the way, and like I said, has dealt with some serious health issues, including a stroke back in 2022 and a leg amputation in December of last year. And so Thomas, Jr. claims that while he was going through some of the things that were left at the home, he found four large boxes containing hundreds, possibly even thousands,

• 48:05Annie Elise?

  of images and videos that he believed to be CSAM. He also allegedly discovered additional material on one of his father's old cell phones, along with pictures that he believed may have been taken at his father's former home in Mexico. And I'm going to play a clip for you in just a second here, but basically, he said that in one of these visuals, he saw the background of the home and knew that his father had taken the material. But listen to this clip of Thomas, Jr. describing.

• 48:34Speaker 05

  Yeah, so, you know, a little time goes by and it comes up, my partner, one of her family members needed a cellphone. Now, I remember when I was packing the stuff in Mexico, I did see several cellphones in a bag, and so I just said, wait, yeah, don't, you don't have to buy one, I can get one of those old cellphones. And on the phones, and I pulled the phones and went back to my house, once recharged up, I think three different phones, I started going through, and basically, the first one I grabbed, I turned it on, and I'm looking, looked at the contacts, and yeah, there was like, I don't know, 10, 12 contacts on there, and a little bit of a call log.

• 49:18Speaker 05

  So I said, that's not big of a deal, so I went to the photos and the videos, and.

• 49:23Speaker 05

  It said four, four images or four, four items. And so I clicked on them.

• 49:31Speaker 05

  And I, I, I almost damn near dropped the phone and threw it away because I couldn't believe what I was looking at.

• 49:38Annie Elise?

  So Thomas Jr. Said that he was disgusted by what he allegedly found and that he felt betrayed by his father. He said that he knew that he needed to report it immediately. So on July 10th, he says he contacted the FBI hotline, the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, and also the state police in Pennsylvania. However, Thomas Senior is denying all of it. On October 23rd, he made a statement saying that he was shocked and hurt by his son's accusations, calling them complete lies and questioning why his son would want to destroy him like this. Thomas Jr., however, is standing by his claims and says that he is confident that the evidence that he turned over will speak for itself. So now the authorities in the Philippines are investigating.

• 50:21Annie Elise?

  On October 24th, one of the Philippine ministers confirmed that the police had seized a laptop allegedly belonging to Thomas Senior, along with material suspected to be CSAM. And according to new reports, they might have found way more than just a computer and a cellphone. Because the alleged list of what they found is actually very disturbing and kind of scary. With the help of an IT expert, Thomas Jr. Spent one day going through the four boxes of his, and he reportedly found at least one laptop, multiple cell phones, CDs, DVDs, VHS tapes, computer equipment, three or four hard drives, photographs, and also 35 millimeter film negatives.

• 51:05Annie Elise?

  And according to the reports, three of those hard drives were examined. And that is where the IT expert allegedly discovered hundreds, maybe even thousands of files suspected to contain the explicit material. The expert also reportedly found that the files they examined had been downloaded back in 2014 and also back in 2020, before Thomas Senior and his son moved to the Philippines in 2025. But that's not all that they allegedly found. Because mixed in with everything else were several books containing some pretty controversial and graphic images. Books with titles like Hollywood Lolitas, Lolita Angel, Lewis Carroll Photographs of Children.

• 51:49Annie Elise?

  And when Thomas Senior was questioned about these books, he claimed that they were simply part of his interest in Hollywood, history, and photography. But obviously it doesn't look good if you're being accused of having all sorts of CSAM material. And then you also have books on Lolitas and children. I mean, all of that goes hand in hand. Now, one of the most serious accusations involves a 35 millimeter film negative that was allegedly found tucked inside an old photography book. According to reports, the image appears to show Thomas Senior when he was in his late 40s or early 50s, and he was engaged in sexual acts with a girl who appears to be underage. Now, Thomas Senior has specifically denied ever being photographed in that kind of situation.

• 52:34Annie Elise?

  He claims that his son is trying to set him up. I've also seen Samantha Markle, Meghan's half-sister, come to her father's defense, saying, "I don't know why my brother is doing this."

• 52:45Speaker 06

  I mean, what son wants to make that up about their father?

• 52:49Annie Elise?

  Apparently, according to them, financial motivations because Thomas had been helping him financially. He wasn't anymore. But also, I give Samantha, you know, a grain of salt at best when I believe what she has to say. But anyway, yeah, he's denied that he was ever in that kind of situation. But reports say that investigators have seen the material that appears to contradict his statements. Although the identity of the man in the girl and the girl's age in that film negative have not yet been confirmed. Apparently, investigators, though, are just getting started. Sources familiar with the evidence have described what has been discovered so far as potentially being the tip of a huge iceberg. The Philippine minister said that investigators were conducting a forensic examination

• 53:32Annie Elise?

  and that they expected to have more definitive findings within about a week. He also acknowledged that there was a family dispute involved, so the authorities needed to consider all possibilities before coming to any conclusions. However, here's where things take another turn. Because Meghan Markle has now released another statement, and according to her, these allegations aren't exactly new. We know that she said that she was deeply distressed by the news and that her thoughts were with any of the children who may have been harmed. But she's also revealed that she was made aware of these allegations against her father several years ago, after a letter was sent to London's Metropolitan Police. Now, Meghan initially said that the letter was sent back in 2018,

• 54:14Annie Elise?

  but police have since confirmed that they received it in January of 2019. The letter was shared with Meghan and Prince Harry, and Meghan says that she was assured that the allegations were being investigated. According to the reports, the claims weren't substantiated at the time, and Meghan was advised against speaking publicly about them out of concern that doing so could interfere with a potential investigation. But Meghan says that this is why she ultimately decided to keep her father away from her children. In her statement, she explained that despite what the public perceived their relationship as over the years, her decision to distance herself from her father was all about protecting her children. And Meghan had already made that decision very clear to him before these latest allegations became public.

• 54:59Annie Elise?

  According to reports, Meghan allegedly sent Thomas Senior a letter back in December of 2025 while he was hospitalized in the Philippines after that leg amputation. And in the letter, she told him that he would never be allowed to meet her children and that it would be the very last time he ever heard from her. Meghan also confronted him about the allegations involving the sexual assault of minors, and she arranged for hospital staff to personally deliver the letter, have him sign a form saying he received it, and record the delivery. Which I would imagine that was in an effort to protect herself should ever, ever anything come out. Because she is famously quoted as saying, um, shoot, what is it?

• 55:43Annie Elise?

  I want to make sure I get it right. It's like, being complacent means you're being complicit or something like that. Let me, let me look this up really quick because it's going to bug me and I want to make sure I don't misquote it. And this was about something else unrelated. Oh yeah, she said, back in 2020 in a quote, "In people's complacency, they are complicit." Saying, "If you are complacent, you are complicit." And then now people, of course, questioning her of if she was silent or silenced and things like that. But, so I would imagine if she wanted the letter recorded, him signing it, she probably knew at one point or another it was going to be exposed. And she was probably trying to cover her own ass to be like, "I'm doing right by like, calling this out and doing that."

• 56:24Annie Elise?

  Although, it's all, I don't know, I get very protected and nuanced in a way. I don't understand why she hasn't publicly spoken out until now. And I get it that her advisors are probably telling her one thing or another. She doesn't want to interfere with an investigation. But she learned about this around the time that, what, they got married in 2018, right?

• 56:45Speaker 06

  Well, that's, I'm thinking, 2018, 2019, then this was reported back in July by The Sun. So I'm like, why are we just hearing about it in October?

• 56:54Annie Elise?

  She knew about it and with the letter back in 2019. So yeah, like, why haven't you spoken out about it? And I get it, maybe you don't want to interfere, but like, I don't know, there's something there I don't love. And let's go back to that letter, actually, that was sent to the police in 2019. Because according to reports, the letter was written by Thomas Senior's first wife, Rosalynn. In the seven-page letter, she made several allegations against Thomas, including a claim that he had told her that he traveled to the Philippines and also to Thailand because, quote, "12-year-olds were legal there." Which is actually true. For context, the age of consent in the Philippines was 12 years old at the time, which I can't even fucking believe.

• 57:36Annie Elise?

  The country has since raised the age of consent to 16 back in 2022. But she's saying, yeah, he wanted to go there because he said that 12-year-olds were legal. That's the whole reason he moved to the Philippines, which I'm going to talk about in a moment here too. Um, but again, this is all Rosalynn's account of an alleged conversation that the two of them had. It hasn't been confirmed that Thomas Senior actually said that, and he, of course, has denied the allegations. But here's where the Metro Police are now facing some questions of their own. The department confirmed that it received Rosalynn's letter in January of 2019 and that they passed it along to Meghan and Prince Harry, like I said. But they did not share the allegations with other law enforcement agencies. So now, seven years later, police are trying to figure out how this letter was handled

• 58:21Annie Elise?

  and if it was even actually ever investigated at all. So at this point, there's obviously a lot of alleged information going around, a lot of speculation and a lot of he said, she said. Thomas Markle Senior is denying everything, denying he did anything wrong. And until investigators release their findings, the, you know, it all remains allegations. However, with the authorities expecting to have more information soon, they don't at the time of this recording, but maybe at the time the episode is published, they will. Um, we're just going to have to wait and see what comes out of the investigation. But when I first heard about this, what makes me likely or more likely to believe it

• 59:00Annie Elise?

  isn't because the IT experts said they found any, everything, not because The Sun said he found it, but because of the Philippines.

• 59:07Speaker 06

  That's what I thought. Philippines and Mexico are where these things are documented. Is that because it's looser rules and?

• 59:14Annie Elise?

  Well, not necessarily looser rules, but if you remember, I did an episode with CRC not too long ago, and the Philippines is one of the main hotspots for child trafficking.

• 59:24Speaker 06

  But that makes sense.

• 59:25Annie Elise?

  Right. It's like an impoverished area. There's different things like that. Thailand as well, a little bit too. But in the Philippines, and the case we had covered was from the Philippines. It's so big there, I guess you could call it, that it's not just children getting abducted or exploited or, you know, passed around and sold, but it's parents doing that to their own children and also making their own children participate in creating CSAM material. The children.

• 59:54Annie Elise?

  In CCM material together in an incestual way and then the parent is selling that or live streaming it. And that's the case that I had talked about with CRC a few months back. And so when I heard, oh, he not only wanted to travel to the Philippines a lot, which I know people travel there. It's beautiful. Hello, my husband's from the Philippines, but like, it's beautiful and they're like, people love doing that. But then, when his wife said in the letter, that it was because 12 years old is the age of consent, then he moved to the Philippines. Then some of the material was found allegedly contained Filipino children. Like, there's so much where I'm like, this makes it feel more true to me than if it was something, a different geography.

• 1:00:37Speaker 06

  Well, that's why when you first said Philippines, my thought was like, although very shocking and disturbing to find this, was it in fact illegal if the consent, age of consent was 12 back then?

• 1:00:48Annie Elise?

  Right.

• 1:00:49Speaker 06

  Um, which is obviously startling and I can't even imagine coming across that as someone's son. That would be awful. Um, but yeah, I thought, was that, was it being there, did that change things? But it sounds like he had a lot of that stuff.

• 1:01:07Annie Elise?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:07Speaker 06

  And it had been going on for a very long time.

• 1:01:09Annie Elise?

  And had been documenting it. And who knows if there was an exchange of material as well. Like if he was creating it, selling it, sharing it, because you know how those networks work. And I highly encourage you guys, maybe I'll link it in the show notes. Yeah, the episode with CRC, because on that, we pull up the maps where it actually shows you the red dots of where people are exchanging this, the hotspots and like go through statistics. But I want you to know ahead of time, that it is a very difficult listen, because it is a lot of information. And I think we only did that episode on YouTube. I don't think we did it audio. So, maybe I'll release it as a bonus episode on audio, actually, just because I do think it's so important to educate people. And some of those of you who follow me on Instagram know too, I had posted something last week about the statistics of, of just

• 1:01:54Annie Elise?

  child sexual assault in general and what those statistics look like. And I do believe knowledge is power. So, maybe we will do that as well. And we'll just release it audio as a bonus episode. But we'll link the YouTube in here for you as well. So yeah, a lot going on.

• 1:02:08Speaker 06

  I mean.

• 1:02:09Annie Elise?

  I'm going to follow this one very closely.

• 1:02:11Speaker 06

  It's crazy that these people have these arsenals of, it's disgusting.

• 1:02:15Annie Elise?

  It really is. Um, so yeah, I'll keep following this. I will let you know what we learn. To your point, Amy, it's like, imagine if all of this material was legally the age of consent at the time, which makes it just infuriating. But then still, I wonder what the legal ramifications are, once they changed that age to 16. And if he was still sharing that or participating in that after 2022, then like, is there at least something he would get caught for?

• 1:02:44Speaker 06

  And like, what was it specifically that prompted Megan to write that letter? Was it that? Or was it something else? And then, the fact that he has these 35 millimeter film hidden books. I mean, the guy is up to no good.

• 1:02:56Annie Elise?

  And books on Lolitas. And I mean, the writing is on the wall, I think. So yeah, more to come on that. As a side note, just as a reminder, merch is going to be closing soon. So grab your merch while you can. I have a couple of samples here. I'll show you guys really quick. And a portion of merch goes to CRC, to other organizations. We talked a little bit about our charitable contributions last week in the episode. But let me show you a couple of these real quick. This is obviously our best selling t-shirt. It comes in black and ivory. The, I hope you're having a nice day, because I'm about to ruin it. We are almost completely out of this one. And ahead of Christmas time, if you are a Hallmark movie watcher or Lifetime movie watcher, we have this in charcoal and also

• 1:03:37Annie Elise?

  this green that says, it's either true crime documentaries or Christmas movies. There is no in between. So this little comfy soft sweatshirt, little Stay Spooky sweatshirt, listen closely, and lots of other items. But the merch shop will be closing soon. So grab that now, annieelise.com. And yeah, anything else?

• 1:04:00Speaker 06

  No, I don't think so.

• 1:04:02Annie Elise?

  All right, guys. Well, thank you for tuning in to another episode of Headline Highlights. Can't wait to see who the guest is next week.

• 1:04:09Speaker 06

  Same.

• 1:04:10Annie Elise?

  Who, who is she?

• 1:04:11Speaker 06

  Who's gonna fly in?

• 1:04:12Annie Elise?

  Where will she be? Um, so thank you for tuning in. And until the next one, be nice, don't kill people, and just, don't be a freaking predator with children. Period.

• 1:04:23Speaker 06

  Agreed.

• 1:04:24Annie Elise?

  All right.

• 1:04:24Speaker 06

  Bye.

• 1:04:35Speaker 04

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