Chad Johnson most lovable guy? Talks Growth, Keith Lee, Deion, NFL & Losing It All Before Having It All

FOLLOW THE PIVOT PODCAST: MERCH | https://pivotpodcast.com YOUTUBE | https://www.youtube.com/thepivotpodcast INSTAGRAM | https://instagram.com/thepivot TWITTER | https://twitter.com/thepivot TIKTOK | https://tiktok.com/@thepivot FACEBOOK | https://www.facebook.com/thepivotpodcast This show hits a little differently with us as Chad is someone who was our first guest we had on The Pivot when we started but more than that, he’s our brother, friend and a supporter since day one. Chad has walked the path with us first on the field through the wins and losses of football and then life after as we experienced the highs & lows and have all been tested at our peeks as humans. This conversation covers growth, family, careers and how things work out the way they are supposed to be even when they seem to be off track at first. The vulnerability and raw emotion shares between Chad, Fred, Ryan and Channing resonates with us all as the men talk about how life humbles them when they least expect it and how the success they achieve now is often tested with more freedom and opportunities. The guys commend Chad that through his career and life he’s managed to uphold a positive persona and be one of the most liked people in sports. Ryan starts the conversation bringing up the recent Keith Lee situation and how the first time he saw the majority of folks mad at Chad and the guys get into the story as Chad explains his perspective and why he said and felt what he did. Chad understands how difficult it is for men and women of culture to succeed and how any little thing can knock them down to a point where some can’t recover and he always tries to come from a place of building up not tearing down. Talking about new age of coaching with Antonio Pierce’s role with the Raiders and how the post locker room celebrations shocked some, the guys discuss it was more about the team bond and fresh start than the actuality of winning a game. Switching over to talk about Deion and how the hype has slowly quieted as Colorado has not been winning and so many people are quick to call Deion a failure and the guys discuss why he could never been considered one and the impact he’s making with young people far surpasses his persona on and off the field. Chad opens up about how he had to lose the things he loved most in order to understand he may be moving the wrong way and that when the train falls off the track it’s a humbling process but a necessary one. Having football end before Chad was ready to hang up his cleats has always been a tough point in his life but he attributes the events surrounding that time as his biggest teaching moment to get discipline back in his life. Fred talks about losing loved ones and reflects on Chad losing his mom and how the recent passing of his grandma has impacted him as well. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest, or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer, it's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 0:28Ryan Clark?

  Fellas, the season, bruh, it's tough, man. I'm coming from the west coast to the east coast, but I love the fact that now on YouTube TV, you can get the NFL Sunday Ticket. I get the multi-view, and now I'm watching four games at one time. I got something on my iPad, something on my TV, and it's all thanks to YouTube TV.

• 0:47Channing Crowder?

  Man, I used to be so scared, traveling like we do, and I could say, you know what? Now, I log into YouTube TV, I can watch whatever games I need to watch for any job I have at any device I want. It is beautiful what they got, and 50% off.

• 1:00Fred Taylor?

  I was about to say, the most important thing is it's 50% off, it's Sunday out-of-market games. It's amazing. You gotta get YouTube TV.

• 1:07Ryan Clark?

  YouTube TV and NFL Sunday Ticket. It is your place to catch all the games, even the out-of-market ones are there for you. Watch your favorite teams' out-of-market Sunday afternoon games now on YouTube and YouTube TV. No two-year contract required. Bundle and save on NFL Sunday Ticket with YouTube TV to get 100+ live TV channels. Starting at $174 for the rest of the 23 season on YouTube TV with base plan. 50% off compared to full season price. Terms and embargoes apply. No cancellations.

• 1:40Fred Taylor?

  That's what Ojo and To had in DR for them 17 piece.

• 1:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, 17, 17 women in 12 hours. Wait, what happened? I was just playing around. You know how to take me a little smoke break before you start? To was on my lap, I clicked him in, and he starts talking about, I told him I'm trying to find Uncle, a woman. So me and Unc did the show yesterday with the Virgin, the 39-year-old Virgin. I say, Uncle...

• 2:04Ryan Clark?

  From the East of Ray Show.

• 2:05Speaker 04

  Okay. Whatever that is. So I told Unc, man, listen, I got one for you. You're 55, you know, and you ain't got it right. You ain't got it right together. You ain't got it together all these years, but we got somebody that's pure. That's walking in the righteousness of Christ.

• 2:22Speaker 04

  And he talk about, nah, I want me a center.

• 2:24Ryan Clark?

  What about, bro, hey, I was, I went to old girl Paige, her Twitter, the one that hit Unc up and said she could be, Unc could be on her OnlyFans.

• 2:34Speaker 04

  Miss Be Nasty. Oh, you went to her page?

• 2:37Ryan Clark?

  I should've. On the plane, I was on the plane. I said, oh no. I started leaning on, you know how you lean over your phone? I said, oh, boy.

• 2:50Speaker 04

  Listen, but he called, he called the girl out again. Say, nah, I can't do nothing with her, man. Bring me Miss Be Nasty. I say, man, yeah, just came out of hip surgery. Now you gonna fuck around?

• 3:01Ryan Clark?

  Throw that old hip out again.

• 3:03Fred Taylor?

  So then they gotta be on that, what's his, La Portier cognac?

• 3:06Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 3:07Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, he gotta be on them shots before that.

• 3:09Ryan Clark?

  Well, so he better be on that yak, eh, whatever Maurice said. Take it. On your date.

• 3:40Ryan Clark?

  Hey, man, Ocho, welcome back to the Pivot.

• 3:43Fred Taylor?

  No, no, no. It's welcome to Inside the Pivot, and I am the guest.

• 3:51Ryan Clark?

  Welcome, Freddie. Welcome, Freddie. Hey, we're glad to have you.

• 3:54Fred Taylor?

  Appreciate it.

• 3:55Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, because we've all been here all day.

• 3:56Fred Taylor?

  I know, right?

• 3:57Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, we had work.

• 3:57Fred Taylor?

  I love to see it.

• 3:58Ryan Clark?

  Ocho, you were our first guest. You were our first Friday show.

• 4:02Speaker 04

  Yay.

• 4:03Ryan Clark?

  We sat down with you. I can't even remember where we, we did it in Miami, but it was in like a dark back bar. Bar, yeah. It was crazy. But I think the cool thing is, man, we've all come a long way since then. The show's come a long way. You know, and I text you last week after the show, man, just... Individually with all the stuff that you're doing, you know, you've come a long way in growing in this business. You know, we'll probably get to it as well. Come a long way as a man.

• 4:33Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 4:33Ryan Clark?

  You know, we were having conversations about that this morning. But I want to talk about the first time I've seen people in the world mad at Chad Johnson.

• 4:42Speaker 04

  The first time?

• 4:43Ryan Clark?

  This is the first time I've ever seen people mad at you. You are one of the more universally liked people.

• 4:48Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 4:49Ryan Clark?

  And loved people I've ever met, right? Like, it's the reason people, like, it's the reason everybody wants you involved in their stuff. Because they know they're effed up. But the way people love you, it's gonna kind of mess it, like, it's gonna erase a little bit of that. They're gonna be like, "Oh, well Chad rock with him."

• 5:03Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 5:03Ryan Clark?

  Like, everybody feels that way. So, we had the joint post with NFL Films, right? As you talk about hitting Ray Lewis. And people were coming to that post just to be mad at you about Keith Lee.

• 5:15Speaker 04

  Yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah.

• 5:16Ryan Clark?

  Just to be mad at you about, about your opinion on what he was doing. Now, so you came around, you did your research.

• 5:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 5:23Ryan Clark?

  You showed love to the brother who is doing a lot of great things. Was that a point, though, where you realized, "Hold on, people are paying attention to what I'm saying a little bit differently than I ever thought"?

• 5:34Speaker 04

  Well, no, I understood that people pay attention to what I say, but I don't think they understood where I was going with it. The vision, for us, for any of us to own anything, understand how difficult that is. We're already behind the eight ball in everything that we doing. Everything that we do in general, especially ownership, when it comes to ownership. When it comes to the restaurant business, you understand how difficult that is. And I'm coming from on the other side of ownership, so I understand, I know how it works. You know how hard it is for you to create something, you to create something, and you to create something, and have people continue to support you? And if you do have a business, they expect you, everything has to be immaculate, perfect, A1. Everything has to be five-star this, five-star that. Customer service, this and that.

• 6:18Speaker 04

  But if it was, if it was Gucci... If it was goddamn Louis Vuitton and whatever the service might not be up the park, you're still gonna support.

• 6:27Fred Taylor?

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:28Speaker 04

  Every time, every time. The five-star restaurants, oh, we love that because it's a symbol of status. Regardless of how the customer service is, sometimes, sometimes people have bad days. You go to Poppy Steak, you go to Chris Ruth or Ruth Chris, whatever, whatever the hell that shit call, and all these other fancy places. Are they, is the service perfect all the time? No.

• 6:48Fred Taylor?

  But you want to be in that spot, so you accept it.

• 6:51Speaker 04

  Because it's a symbol of status. Oh, look, I got money. But then when it comes to the black restaurants, when it comes to our shit, they want everything to be perfect. It ain't gonna be perfect all the time. The customer service not gonna always be A1. And all I was saying, I love what Keith was doing. I love what he's doing. Obviously, even if his intent is not to insult those restaurants, black-owned restaurants, obviously, when he was in ATL. Just the simple fact that anything with that type of popularity and influence, any inclination of anything negative, you know how we operate. Oh, he said it, oh, well, we ain't fucking with that restaurant no more. And I was just thinking at it from a broader perspective, well, damn, with his influence and that kind of power, that can actually take away from that business.

• 7:36Speaker 04

  You know, in a sense. I was looking at it from that sense, but again, he's done so much good. The little bit of bad, I was thinking about, well, damn, even though people might not see it as bad, because, oh, he's critiquing, has to be honest with his critiques, but also that could hurt on the back end. That's all I was saying, because I like what he does.

• 7:55Fred Taylor?

  And at what point in doing your research, because you later came back and, you know, you showed love? And doing that research, at what point did you say, okay, I gotta show this brother love? When you found out that he was a boxer and he can put them hands on you?

• 8:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, I like that, I like that part. So actually, when I did my research and I found out he did MMA, that would have been, it would have been nice, we can rock, man, you know, I like that. We can, if he wanna come out of retirement, I know he don't do that no more, we can get in there and go. I've done a little bit more research on what he's been doing and how much he's helped a lot of people in such a short amount of time was really good. But I also understood, and he has a responsibility to... And it's just, it's just, it's really, it's really difficult on his end too because you got to be honest and you know how we are, we fickle man.

• 8:39Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 8:39Speaker 04

  We fickle man, as a community, it's hard to get us to support each other consistently and if we do, everything you do has to be goddamn perfect.

• 8:50Channing Crowder?

  Does it get to you? You say everybody love you until everybody love you, leave thousand, two thousand dollar damn tips, which I think is crazy. But when you do get criticized in them small windows, does it get to you?

• 8:59Speaker 04

  Nah, nah, not at all because they're not seeing it from my viewpoint. I see it on both sides. For one, I love what he doing, I love what he doing, but then I'm also like, well, sometime your honesty can actually hurt the establishments. Cause we are fickle man, we follow any little trend, any little trend there is, where if they said anything good, guess what we doing? Oh, we ain't fucking with that shit.

• 9:19Ryan Clark?

  I asked a question and maybe, you know, one of you guys could answer it, is that when you start, when you build the following that he has, it's very similar to the following you gain being good at your job, you gain from the way that you play ball now doing this. The same with both of you, it's like our voices can elevate the culture and the people in it, or it could tear them down, even when it's not necessarily what we're intending to do. And what I mean by that is, it's you giving your honest opinion about Russell Wilson and saying what you said was honest and in some cases, true.

• 9:59Ryan Clark?

  And there are people who agree with it and people who don't agree with it, but those who don't agree with it immediately go to attacking you because you're not supposed to speak on a black man like that. You're supposed to approach it in a different way and it made me think about if Keith Lee now, and I'm not saying that he needs to change anything that he's doing, this is just a conversation. If Keith Lee now said, okay, if I go to a restaurant and I don't have... A positive review of it. If now I speak to the restaurant owners and talk to them about what my experience was, how that experience could be better, and I keep from sharing that with the people. And what I do now is, when I do have positive experiences, I shine a light on those.

• 10:44Ryan Clark?

  That if I do have a negative experience, it's not something that I share, right? I deal with that personally with the people. Like he said it, I try to send my family in because I get treated differently because now I got a certain level of followers. I don't want that experience. I want to pay for my food, all of those things, but that's real life. You got money, you get treated differently because you have a platform, because you have a brand. Same with you, same with you, same with me. That's just the way it works. And so, do you think once we reach a certain level of status, a certain level as a voice, we do have to change the way we approach speaking about things in order to not tear down?

• 11:22Channing Crowder?

  I believe so. And I believe so like for the culture part of it. And I get criticized a lot for it because it's like, you know, you're supposed to be moving forward. And I'm goofy as hell. All I do is joke around. So it's usually a lot of older black men, older black women will come up to, especially after the Russ thing, like, "How can you beat down another black man?" And I was like, I was just messing around, talking trash. We're talking trash on the show. And I think sometimes people get, look at me like this goofball way, and they think that hurts the pushing forward of black men. And I'm like, even talking to Desi and talking to some other guy, Spice Adams, and I even bring this up with him, like, you know, do you ever feel as if you need to be this strong, deep, you know, activist almost at all times, which I can't be?

• 12:07Channing Crowder?

  I support all the black businesses. I'm gonna support everything we do. I got on my Howard stuff now, you know, my wife be pushing that Howard on the H U, the real H U.

• 12:15Ryan Clark?

  And the other part is too, why do people from Howard act like they're not an HBCU like the rest of the people?

• 12:20Channing Crowder?

  Because they're the first one and they're the top notch. I don't fucking know, man.

• 12:29Channing Crowder?

  I don't about to answer that motherfucking question like I really know. I just know that the Howard swag is through the goddamn roof. I have found out that my voice has gotten bigger over the years. And I do try to be more responsible when I talk about serious topics. I can play around, joke around, but when you talk about serious topics, you need to get, you need to have a more, I guess, conscious thought of how many people you're reaching, especially young people. How many young people you're reaching and how many people respect, you know, respect you. And as a, you know, a comedic figure, personality, I'm still looked at on a higher pedestal with the fame, with the football, with the TV shows and all that stuff. And I have become more conscious of that through the last year, so.

• 13:09Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, I agree with you. You have to be open-minded and thought-provoking. And within that responsibility that you have, you still also have to be true. You know, I think so, you know, when it comes to our community, there's already a heightened level of sensitivity, right? So you, it's like damned if I do or damned if I don't. Because they're gonna comb through whatever you say. If you, if you give a thousand great compliments, right? Some people will just pull out that one and that's what they want to pound on. So it really comes down to, with, I guess with Keith, he, he has to critique. He has to be himself. He has to understand the power of his platform. But he also have to understand that, you know, people are just gonna be people.

• 13:54Fred Taylor?

  You know, so you, you make your comment and keep it moving. Make sure that it's true.

• 13:59Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 14:00Fred Taylor?

  Without his comments, he don't, he'll lose followers if he's bullshitting. You know what I'm saying? He has a responsibility to just keep it a thousand. Otherwise, people won't follow him and then now that affects his backing, his money, his platform. But he does have a responsibility to the people, more so than anything.

• 14:20Channing Crowder?

  I think that's, that's what I, what I saw most. And why I did come back and say what I did say. I hadn't done my research. Shannon asked me a question. What do you think about this individual saying this? And then I'm seeing the Atlanta restaurants being upset. And then it just stray to, why are you critiquing? What qualifies you to do that? I hadn't done my research because I didn't know. I didn't know about the followers. I didn't know who he was. I didn't understand his background. But he answered that. Forget the answer he gave to me personally. I did my own homework. I said, oh boy, that boy doing something nice. He doing something nice. And in a sense, we just a goddamn like.

• 14:55Speaker 04

  As far as on the giving back and the blessing part, but I don't do it that way because I'm not a foodie. I eat at the same goddamn six restaurants the past, you know, goddamn 30 years.

• 15:04Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 15:04Speaker 04

  But still, the intent is the same as his. His is just, you know, it's a different avenue. And after seeing that and understanding, shit, I told Shannon, shit, I'm Ocho Lee. I'm Team Lee. My daughter, my daughter hit me like, uh, listen, daddy, you my daddy and all, but we Team Keith Lee over here.

• 15:22Ryan Clark?

  My daughter is in culinary school.

• 15:25Speaker 04

  Yeah, oh.

• 15:26Ryan Clark?

  Right, and she loves Keith Lee. So I'm in the kitchen, uh, Thursday. She said, Dad, I need you to tell Chad Johnson, we got beef. He said, he said, tell him, do not come for Keith Lee.

• 15:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 15:40Ryan Clark?

  I said, man, I said, I don't think my boy was going. I was like, I don't think he understood it like that. I think he was speaking from the perspective of how just that one particular voice in that moment

• 15:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 15:52Ryan Clark?

  affects black businesses. I said, it wasn't necessarily him looking at the whole of who Keith Lee is and having a negative perspective or a negative opinion on him. It was saying, when you say something like this, when you have that sort of platform, that's how it can affect that one place.

• 16:08Fred Taylor?

  No, I just wanted to add real quick because I know we kind of talked about it in our Hot Takes Show, I believe, last Friday or two weeks ago. Uh, Ocho, you know, there have been guys, you know, on television, uh, and they talk, they have to analyze the game or what's going on. Some people pull out, you know, their comments and say, well, why are you attacking the former player? You know, or the black man or this or that. Why are we like that?

• 16:33Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't know. I don't know, and I'm one of the few, I'm one of the few who's very critical and able to analyze without actually doing it. Ryan, you're good at doing it. You don't give a fuck who you motherfucker talk about. Shannon Sharpe, oh, he's good at doing it. I am not comfortable, and that's something I've got to learn. I got to, I got to learn what you have. There's a certain savviness, there's a certain aura in delivery and approach to you where you can do it where it's not very malicious. Shannon Sharpe, oh, he don't care. Boy, this motherfucker here. Oh, he don't care. He gonna tell you, this is what it is. You suck. So what? Run it down. Why you suck A, B, C, and D? I can't do that, Ryan. It just feels uncomfortable. That used to be me.

• 17:14Speaker 04

  I used to drop balls. I used to have bad games. There used to be situations where it was third down and that day we needed that catch and I didn't make that catch. The world, the weight of the world is on my shoulders. We lost that game because of Ocho. I know what that feels like. So now, on the back end, I'm done playing. I'm in a position where I have to be critical and analytical of players. I know what that feels like. Now I gotta be critical of it. I just can't bring myself to do it. Yet. I'm trying to navigate and find a way to do it in a way where it's not malicious because the players in today's era are extremely, extremely sensitive and take everything they're seeing as hate.

• 17:48Fred Taylor?

  But that's the gift and the curse and it goes back to your authenticity. And that's why they love this dude. That's why they love Unc. You know what I'm saying? And people will give you a pass, "Oh shit, you the most likable person in the world in 2011."

• 18:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:01Fred Taylor?

  You got the most likable sports influencer in the world award, 2011.

• 18:08Speaker 04

  Because he's a likable Mickey Ficky.

• 18:10Fred Taylor?

  You'll get a pass. People know like you're fun. You're real. You tell the truth. So I think in your observations or your analytical observations, like you'll be pretty great at what you do. I mean, even finding yourself here right now, does it surprise you?

• 18:29Speaker 04

  A little bit. Because I think to be in this position, or, well, here is not as bad. I don't think I could do what Ryan does. I couldn't. I can't. I can't do First Take. I can't do ESPN. I can't because there you got to go. You got to go. It ain't no all that, all that pretty shit and all that trying to beat around the bush. I can't do that. I can't do what he does. I can't do what Dan, Dan does or Swag U. I, no, man, I can't. I can't because it just, it makes me uncomfortable to talk about the next man that's doing something when, that's messing up or not playing well. I know what that feel like. I know what that feel like. But I don't think, I think you are...

• 19:08Ryan Clark?

  In some way misunderstanding it, or in some way you don't understand, you actually wouldn't have to do that. The, it's just about truly who you are. Like, you're just not a negative dude. Like, you just aren't. And when you are critiquing, or when you are analyzing film, and you see something that you feel is true, it's okay to say it, but you actually don't have to. If your way of watching and analyzing ball is gonna be, I'm gonna talk about what is good. You know, if I'm watching Tua Tagovailoa on the Miami Dolphins, and I don't think Tua played well, well, I'll find something they did do well. And I'll still say that the other team did this well, which effect, you know, and so you can still do it.

• 19:52Ryan Clark?

  But I think the coolest part about that is, is that that's who you are.

• 19:56Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 19:57Ryan Clark?

  You know what I mean? The fact that it does make you feel a certain way is a good thing. Because that's who God made you as a human. I'd be lying to you if I didn't tell you that sometimes when I say something that I don't necessarily feel is negative, that I think I've watched on film, and that I believe, and that I can prove, and I say it, but it's saying that a player didn't do well, or a team isn't good enough. And the response, I'd be lying if I say it doesn't bother me sometimes. Right? Because my thought is, I went through all the preparation I needed for this to be a well-thought-out opinion. Right? I watched the games multiple times.

• 20:41Ryan Clark?

  I watched a certain play over and over. I looked at the all 22. I called people in the organizations. I had conversations with dudes on the team about that. You know what I mean? And even in doing all that, when I said it, this is how the world received it. You know, and Channing may be one of the few. Shannon may be there as well. It's difficult to not care what people think about your true authentic self. Because I don't play a character on TV. Like if I played a character, like I wouldn't care. Like if my, like, you know, like Stephen A. loves to troll cowboy fans. And because he's intentionally trolling them, their opinion of him does not matter.

• 21:24Channing Crowder?

  Right.

• 21:24Ryan Clark?

  Right? But when Stephen A. is giving us his true self and his true thought, and he feels like that's being misunderstood, he'll re-explain himself. Like, we were talking about Dak, and he was saying something about, "It's right here, it's in the heart." You know what I mean? And I was just like, "Man, I'm not gonna say that Dak Prescott doesn't have the heart because of what he's going through as a man." And I feel like as you are built up as a man, you can also be built up as a player. He told the producer and the director, "Bring it back so I can clarify." Because his thought was, "I was saying that because of what he's saying." It wasn't that, I was just playing off of it. But he wanted the world to know, "I'm not questioning his heart, I'm not questioning the man, I'm talking about the play."

• 22:07Ryan Clark?

  So I think we all have that, and that's as difficult as your voice amplifies.

• 22:11Channing Crowder?

  But isn't that why people get paid so much money to play sports? It's because of the fact that it is mesmerizing, people wanna watch, that's why they get these billion-dollar deals. So, if you evaluate your teacher, if your kid's teacher suck, you're not gonna let your kid go to that teacher anymore. Your dentist, fuck his mouth up, you're not gonna go to that dentist anymore. Like, everybody gets evaluated, and being an athlete, you're on the platform for analysts to analyze you. And I think, honestly, I don't think it's good analysis if everything's positive.

• 22:40Ryan Clark?

  I agree.

• 22:40Channing Crowder?

  Because you see, you can see the negative. If this receiver balls out, that corner didn't do his job. I'm not allowed to speak about the corner, but I can just talk about the receiver. I think it's both sides, it's why the X's and O's are there, but it's the people that are playing that game. So I will, and the one thing I always gotta say, and I hate, I have to do it on radio all the time, I gotta do it on this show sometimes, I'm about to say something to criticize this man's job, but I gotta say...

• 23:05Ryan Clark?

  I have no problem with him. He's a good person. He does charity work. He's a philanthropist. I don't think you have to though, like I don't. Like I'm gonna be honest, like I don't do it. And after a while, people just get used to the fact that you ain't gonna do it. And it is what it is. You gotta be so consistent in it, consistent at doing it, that they just accept you. Right? Like the first time, people gonna push back on it. Right? You know what I get? Like I used to get all the time? You ain't no Troy. Mother F of duh.

• 23:35Ryan Clark?

  I knew it then. Why you think I accepted my job? Cause I knew I wasn't. Right? And then when he wasn't playing and they let me do it, I was damn good. And then when he came back, guess what happened? Okay Troy.

• 23:48Ryan Clark?

  You know what I'm saying? Troy went back to being Troy. Yeah, like that was, but that was the life. And I understood it. You know, like when Miami tried to get me to come down there, they was like, you gonna get to do all the stuff Troy does. Like, we know you can do it. Me too. But man, it's really comfortable doing it with him and them, so I'm gonna go back. But could you have made more plays? Could you have won the more Pro Bowls? When, the year he was out for the longest time was the best year of my career. Not that, like I, I may have been better at doing the other job at times, but far as like impact on the game, opportunity to make plays, absolutely. And I had fun and I enjoyed it. And short story and a long story, he came back and I went back to playing, just playing free safety. And it was like two and a half quarters, I didn't do anything.

• 24:33Ryan Clark?

  Like I didn't touch a person. I like, I didn't get around any plays. And I remember, it was like two plays in a row, I think I like missed a tackle and a guy caught a ball. And I was like a grown man, bro. And I was just on the side and I just started crying. Not that I was purposely trying to cry. Like it just happened. And he walks up to me and he goes, he was like, you go down. Right? Cause he understood for like, the last eight weeks, I had been doing everything. And because he was back, I was now back in a position where like, I was just, I didn't get a, I didn't, wouldn't get a chance to make plays. And so, when you get one play in three quarters, it's like Chad said, and you miss it, it stays on you. You know, but like that was part of it. But I was starting that to say though, like if I critique-

• 25:17Ryan Clark?

  If I were to critique Derwin James, and I said, "Well, Derwin gotta do this, you can't do that." Well, you was just the other safety. Like, you actin', you talkin' like you Ed Reed. And like, you get that. And visually, I had to be like, "Man, F all y'all. Y'all talkin' like y'all was me."

• 25:33Ryan Clark?

  You know what I mean? But it takes you to get to that point, though.

• 25:36Channing Crowder?

  Even these two dudes, two dudes that believe they wanna, they should be Hall of Famers.

• 25:40Ryan Clark?

  I agree, both of them.

• 25:41Channing Crowder?

  Right? It's all about numbers. Like, I know you had success with the Steelers, but if you would've gone to another team, your numbers would've been better.

• 25:49Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 25:49Channing Crowder?

  People would look at you differently.

• 25:50Ryan Clark?

  Yes.

• 25:51Channing Crowder?

  Was that a good business decision for Clark, for Ryan Clark? Not the Steelers, not your, "I know you got a Super Bowl, but you could've been somewhere else and been more respected as a player."

• 26:00Ryan Clark?

  Yes and no. And I'm gonna say this. There isn't a person who played offense or defense, who got to see me play a lot, or who got to see me play in person and didn't respect me. Had I gone somewhere else, my public perception to the fans may have been different. Right? But I think we've done this show long enough together, and we've done it with enough coaches who know me, enough players who know me. We've yet to have somebody who had a personal experience with me not respect who I was as a player. And maybe it was the way I came up in the game, and the fact that nobody drafted me, the fact that I was cut,

• 26:43Ryan Clark?

  the fact that you rather sign Archuleta than sign me, that made me this way. But your opinions were what started to matter to me, because it was the only positive ones I'd get. You know what I'm saying? And so, since I had all the negative everywhere else, it was just y'all. You know, like, when Chad would come up to me, "All right, RC, we ain't doing all that hitting today. I love you, bro." You know what I mean? Like, I knew what it meant. Like, he wasn't saying, like, "RC, I'm gonna come across the middle, chill out." But he was saying it. You know, and so I think that was how I just learned to find my worth.

• 27:13Fred Taylor?

  But that's truly what really matters, right? When a player talk, that player talk. You know, not the outsiders, not the guys who are out there watching it from afar, you know, that second lens, but the guys who are actually on the gridiron. You know, and prior to this, I ain't even realized you and Steve Smith went to Santa Monica.

• 27:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we was at Santa Monica together.

• 27:33Fred Taylor?

  He was always like that?

• 27:34Speaker 04

  Always, even back then, even back then, little bulldog, love to fight, had an attitude with everybody.

• 27:39Fred Taylor?

  So, so, okay, so you guys were in the same division for a while, Steelers and the Bengals?

• 27:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 27:45Fred Taylor?

  What were those matchups actually really, really like?

• 27:48Speaker 04

  I call those two, yeah, two chin strap games. You go into the game, you need two chin straps. That's what, yeah, no bullshit, and that is, that is what we labeled that week when we played the Steelers, because you needed two chin, two chin straps. Obviously, I kind of tried to set the tone for us offensively with my mouth, with my mouth. If everyone see, well shit, well Chad is up, he ready to go, everybody all feeds off that. I might say some little bullshit ball material throughout the week just to get everybody else going. For some reason, coaches, everybody goddamn ass tight, it's Steelers week, what we doing? So you know how I am, the same, I'm, I was, I was a character, but I was one that wanted to keep everybody loose as possible. Coach, you ain't got nothing to worry about, man. You ain't got nothing to worry, we, we good.

• 28:31Speaker 04

  And just, it's something about that Ravens week and Steelers week, everybody asshole like this. And I don't, I don't know what it was, it was, it was something about that.

• 28:39Fred Taylor?

  From that moment, I think it was your rookie year, and you know me from being down south, you ran up on me, what's up, I'm from the crib, I'm from the crib. So from that moment till just a month ago or so, when you were inducted into the Bengals Ring of Honor, did you ever like foresee, like envision something like as great as that or as good as that happening in your career?

• 29:01Speaker 04

  Nah, I was just like, they having fun. If you look, if you look at the totality of my career, it was based on one thing. And the one thing that's overlooked, obviously you spoiled to work hard, you spoiled to do all this stuff, but if you, the antics overshadowed everything, and that's exactly how I wanted it. Everybody love to say, oh, he worked hard, he did this, he did. Well, that's a part of the game, to even reach that level and have the consistency I had, all that is, that comes with it, you know, I got to do that, I live, eat, sleep, shit, football. Goddamn, me and A B trained, what, 10, 11, 12, something years, every offseason. All we knew was work, work, work, work, work. I added another dynamic, I want to add the entertainment value to the game. And the way I felt it should be played, as a little shorty, as a little jit in Miami.

• 29:45Speaker 04

  I was about talking shit and celebrating. I just happened to make it to the NFL, defeat the odds and the obstacles, even get to that point. And you think y'all gonna tell me how the game should be played because of these set of rules you got in place? Alright, I'ma show you. And I refused to change, refused to change. And you know, what's the one way to keep us in line? They take what they think we value most. They were taking my money. How we gonna keep this? I almost said it, my bad. How we gonna keep this young fella in line?

• 30:12Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 30:12Speaker 04

  We'll take his money because that's what they value most. You know, they play the game for the money. Man, go ahead and take that. I'ma make it back up.

• 30:18Fred Taylor?

  Even with the antics, Ocho, man, like, I was telling you outside, bro.

• 30:23Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior light beer. It's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com/superioraccess to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 30:53Fred Taylor?

  You had a great fucking career. Four-time All-Pro, All-Pro, six Pro Bowls, the most receiving yards in Bengals history. The antics definitely overshadowed like your numbers because you're all-time great. You know, and I don't know, you know, if people actually give you credit for it. But there was a moment when you was the baddest, one of the baddest out there, you know. And I think for me, bro, just in having this moment here and doing the research, I was like, fuck, Chad was really like that. You know what I'm saying? And with that, he mentioned the Hall of Fame talk.

• 31:31Speaker 04

  I put my own jacket on because I understand, I understand how they play. I understand how they play. Listen, if I wanted to play politics, I would have been a politician. Understanding how they work, understanding how the voters work. If the people vote me in. Are the ones I ain't played with, are the ones that actually played the game or had to play against me, I, my loony ass ain't getting in there? And they say, oh, well, your numbers ain't, man, child, please. The goalposts continuously move depending on who the individual is you're talking about. Calvin Johnson made it. Our numbers are equivalent. Michael Irvin made it. Our numbers are equivalent. But when you bring up those names, what they'll do is, well, they say, they nitpick.

• 32:14Speaker 04

  And they pick little things about those individuals on why they're in. Cool. That's the point of me putting my jacket on, because at that moment, when I crossed that 10,000-yard mark on that catch, I felt I was Hall of Fame worthy. And I was one, you know I am. I played the game a certain way, so the way I played the game, you know I'm not looking for validation from nobody. Cool, I'm great. I'm great. I inducted myself.

• 32:36Ryan Clark?

  I have a, I think that brings up a, a bigger question to you, though. I agree with you. Sometimes the antics did overshadow the play.

• 32:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 32:48Ryan Clark?

  Because I prepared for you twice a year. We ain't pay attention to none of that jacket putting on, no putt-putt.

• 32:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 32:54Ryan Clark?

  No dang fake proposals. We was like, hey, we going, we going cover six, cloud 85. And we playing man under.

• 33:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 33:03Ryan Clark?

  Somebody else gonna have to catch it. So we understood that. But are you as popular, as loved, as famous without the antics? Because there's a lot of

• 33:13Speaker 04

  No.

• 33:14Ryan Clark?

  very good football players that aren't thought of like Chad Johnson.

• 33:17Speaker 04

  No. I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be doing half the stuff I'm doing now. Not even close. Probably none of it.

• 33:23Ryan Clark?

  Was that, was that a part of your mindset then, Chad?

• 33:24Speaker 04

  I was setting myself up for life after football while I was playing. I mean, the NFL wasn't gonna market me. You know, I had to create my own. I got to about a year five, and I was thinking about long-term. How can I set myself up long-term so when I'm done playing, I can still keep that train rolling? And I figured out, I figured out how to do it by adding the entertainment value to it, the personality. And, and since, that was just me. That was me. Obviously, back then, the media, they, they vilified me. It was, it was frowned upon, but it made the game fun. It made me lovable in your stadium.

• 33:59Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 34:00Speaker 04

  It made me lovable at the Ravens stadium. Every away game, why are away fans cheering for a Bengal player? That's unheard of. Unheard of, and still to this day, that respect is still shown because I was never malicious.

• 34:13Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 34:14Speaker 04

  I always showed love back, and if you paid eighty dollars for a ticket, you gonna get eighty dollars worth of entertainment. Every time, and I stood on that.

• 34:23Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, how does it feel now though, man? Like, I love to see you at stadiums and watch these young players who are getting younger and younger. Like, eventually, it's gonna be people in this league who never saw you play.

• 34:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 34:36Ryan Clark?

  Who never truly, who didn't see Champ Bailey that night. Right? Who didn't understand that the number one receiver and the safety was gonna be following eighty-five. But how does it feel, man? Because you get opportunities as, you know, Madden, Madden Radiance and all these things, to be in these stadiums and still get to touch and be around some of these young dudes. All the love you get, how does that feel for you?

• 34:58Speaker 04

  It's a great feeling, it's a great feeling. And it's a testament for me and the feeling that I get from that and the fact that I didn't change while I was playing. Because that love wouldn't be the same if I had conformed to how the higher-ups felt I should have played the game and how I should have changed. Why don't you act like you've been here before every time you score? Why don't you act like you've been here? I haven't, I haven't, I haven't been here before. I got here once, I'm gonna get there again. And every time I stepped in there, I wanted to be that feeling as if, damn, you know what it took to even get to this level? You know what it took for me to sit in front of my grandma's house and see my name go across that goddamn ticker? Shit, you think I'm supposed to change that?

• 35:40Speaker 04

  It's a celebration every motherfucking year because of what it took to get there.

• 35:46Channing Crowder?

  And, bro, I told you before, you're a genius marketer. What you do is just genius because it's you and yourself and your authenticity, like we're saying, people love it. Is there anything you could have changed in your career that could have even blown it up more? Or like, I'm just saying, even leaving Cincinnati on your second deal?

• 36:03Speaker 04

  No, I like the way the story played out. I like the way it played out. I'm not sure if things would have been the same if I left that place. Obviously, on the back end, when you hit year ten, you know, everybody get traded. You know how that go unless you, you know, you're special, but... I like, I like the way it played out. I think I wish I could have honed in a little bit more and hadn't got to New England late. They, they traded me on, on the back end when it was really late. I didn't have a training camp. I didn't, I didn't have offseason program. So I hit, hit the ground running and obviously I wasn't able to build the trust with Tom in such a short amount of time to be the player we were used to seeing. Other than that, shit.

• 36:43Fred Taylor?

  I can vouch, that system.

• 36:44Speaker 04

  Great run. It was a great run.

• 36:46Fred Taylor?

  It's crazy.

• 36:47Channing Crowder?

  Cause you kept playing ball. You went, what was your country?

• 36:49Speaker 04

  Oh, I went to Canada. I went to Canada.

• 36:50Channing Crowder?

  But there was not an NFL team that was gonna let you run down and do something, third receiver, fourth receiver?

• 36:56Speaker 04

  Nah, it ain't happening, boy. It ain't happening, boy. You know, there, there, yeah, there's certain things you do. You ain't walking back through them NFL doors now. There ain't no sir. That ain't happening. But I went down to Canada. I said, I want to finish the game the way I'd like to. And I went down there. I'm thinking, I'm finna run through them boys. Oh, Canada? Oh, man, let me lace these. Man, I'm finna get these boys at work. Shit.

• 37:19Speaker 04

  Man, that first day of practice, I say, oh shit, boy, these motherfuckers can play. Cause there's nothing but a bunch of people here from the States. You got about nine, nine Canadians on the team. It's all a bunch of people here that didn't get the opportunity in NFL, number crunching, politics. Didn't get the opportunity coming to college, but just as good with the same talent to be able to play at the highest level. They were just in Canada. That's all. And that was such a surprise to me. Week in and week out, every team you played, whether it was Ottawa, Toronto. Damn, what the hell you doing here?

• 37:52Channing Crowder?

  Was it humbling?

• 37:53Speaker 04

  Yes. Humbling. And I got humbled on day two, early. And this is my team. And then seeing everybody else throughout the rest of the season. I'm like, oh man, these boys can play some ball. They just wasn't afforded the same opportunities or didn't get that, that chance or, or got cut or whatever it might've been. The person maybe in the NFL might've been better than him at, at the time, but man, the talent down there was up there. It's unbelievable.

• 38:17Fred Taylor?

  You can only imagine how hungry they must've been though.

• 38:20Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:20Fred Taylor?

  And you're, you're on the back end, what, year 11 at the time, I think?

• 38:23Speaker 04

  Yeah. Year, year or 12, one of them.

• 38:26Fred Taylor?

  Right.

• 38:26Speaker 04

  I enjoyed it.

• 38:27Fred Taylor?

  One of my old teammates, Chad Owens. He's a monster, man.

• 38:31Speaker 04

  Hey, the Hawaiian, Hawaiian, little Chad, yeah, yeah, he played for Toronto.

• 38:34Fred Taylor?

  He was so freaking good.

• 38:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:36Fred Taylor?

  But again, it's opportunity, number crunch. He said, "I'm gonna go over here and be a star," and he became a star.

• 38:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:41Fred Taylor?

  I believe they retired his jersey or something like that. But, real quick, he was talking about Madden. You the ratings adjuster.

• 38:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:48Fred Taylor?

  Who we gotta talk to about my speed on my ultimate part?

• 38:51Speaker 04

  Your speed is a 94.

• 38:52Fred Taylor?

  Is it now?

• 38:53Speaker 04

  It should be a 94.

• 38:54Fred Taylor?

  I think when they sent it, it was like 89 or something. That's crazy, for real, bro.

• 38:57Speaker 04

  Nah, nah, you see how I just said it off the top of my head?

• 38:59Fred Taylor?

  So, don't say nothing light-skinned. So, as you go...

• 39:03Ryan Clark?

  That was just Madden's speed.

• 39:04Channing Crowder?

  They gave me a 90. I wasn't that good. I appreciate you, bro.

• 39:10Ryan Clark?

  I don't think I'm...

• 39:11Channing Crowder?

  I saw my little card, I was like, "A 90."

• 39:14Fred Taylor?

  That must have been head size.

• 39:15Channing Crowder?

  That's overall, I was a 90.

• 39:17Fred Taylor?

  No, you're a 90 overall. Your speed, no, you definitely a 78.

• 39:22Ryan Clark?

  Hey, stop, my speed be like 78, don't do that. Like, when I was, Fred, T, when I was actually playing, my speed used to be like 78.

• 39:32Channing Crowder?

  You can run, but your little, your little bow legs and your big booty, you don't look like you can run, 'cause your body type, you're like an ant.

• 39:38Fred Taylor?

  His turnover don't look like it. Nah, you was actually fast, but you played fast.

• 39:43Channing Crowder?

  You stupid.

• 39:44Fred Taylor?

  Nah, you played very fast.

• 39:47Ryan Clark?

  You gotta be crying. Hey, also too, man, we're halfway through the season. I wanna shout out YouTube TV NFL Sunday Ticket. You can get it right now, 50% off. You can watch all out-of-market games, if there's anything. You can watch four games at one time. Like, it's the best way to catch football on Sundays. I wanna ask y'all a football question. I got people here who did it at the highest level, and I respect. We saw something transpire with Antonio Pierce and the Las Vegas Raiders that I think, I think brings on a broader question. Josh McDaniels is thought of to be a great football mind. This is the second time we've seen him fail as a head coach.

• 40:31Ryan Clark?

  This time, it went down in flames. The Devonte Adams of the world talking about the disconnect between coach and player locker room. Some of the stories of a come to Jesus meeting that happens where players are going at Josh McDaniels. Josh McDaniels is going at them. He says, "Hell with y'all. I ain't gonna do nothing." Antonio Pierce speaks about 2007 New York Giants and, you know, there's a feeling of some way that that Giants team beat the Patriots that year. So all of these things are going on. And then you watch the Las Vegas Raiders come out and play inspired football for Antonio Pierce. You see the locker room after the game, like, I didn't know that level of fun was...

• 41:14Ryan Clark?

  And I played for a great head coach. I didn't know that level of partying was even allowed in a locker room after a win. Chan, you famously told Mike T., "Hell, I'm jealous. RC got to play for you, and I played for damn Cam Cameron."

• 41:28Channing Crowder?

  Cam Cameron.

• 41:29Ryan Clark?

  When you see something like that, bro, what are your thoughts on the difference of leadership styles? And how we're seeing now in this new age of football, coaching has many different looks that can be successful?

• 41:42Channing Crowder?

  You said it. It's... I remember my last year when I found out somebody was born in the 90s on the team. Devonte Davis. I was like, "When were you born? 1990?" And they're just getting younger and younger and younger. And the kids, kids, the players, the young men are changing. And I think now, that old school Bill Belichick is the way it is. This is the way it is to go... Bro, I think it's dying. You looking at these successful coaches now, they're relatable. Even the older coaches, Pete Carroll, he's down to earth. John Harbaugh doesn't even call defense off. He's a special teams coach. But he knows how to relate with people and knows how to communicate with these young guys. So I think that celebration in the Raiders locker room, they weren't celebrating that win.

• 42:22Ryan Clark?

  They were celebrating old boy being gone.

• 42:24Channing Crowder?

  They were celebrating Josh McDaniels not being my head coach anymore. They probably would've smoked cigars and danced if they lost that game. Just because we don't have to deal with this sorry bastard no more. Like, and that's the thing, but I'm looking at like Mike McDaniel's down there in Miami. Sean McVay, a lot of guys we've had on the show. Like, you meet them and it's almost mind blowing to me. I'm like, oh, you, you just, you want us. Like, you cool, you down, you, you down there. So I think, I think that old school, what the, the Bill Parcells tree and all they say talk about, but I think that is a dinosaur in this league. As we're seeing Belichick struggle right now, too. I think that old school, my way or the highway, I think these kids ain't dealing with that. They'll, them kids, I coached high school. Them kids tell you kiss the ass now.

• 43:09Channing Crowder?

  I was scared of all my coaches. I don't know why. Like, you can't whoop me, but I just had this kind of like, Authority figure. Yeah, this authority figure, this like, Coach Saban, I say Nick Saban. Nick Saban did not last in the league. He's a genius mind. He could not get through his mind that we are coworkers. You're not my, you're not the superior and I'm this little, this little worker for you. And when Jason Taylor and Junior and Keith Traylon, all them boys I played with, all them vets, that, man, what the fuck are y'all doing? What the fuck he talking to?

• 43:41Channing Crowder?

  And like, it used to blow my mind when they'd be like, I know that bitch ain't talking to me. I'd be like, damn, take it easy. A lot of those guys can't get it through their mind when they don't have that dictatorship over top of people. And I think, but I swear, I, in my heart, I think that's dying in all of coaching. And it's gonna start trickling down to colleges as well.

• 43:58Speaker 04

  Listen, coaches like Mike McDaniel, Sirianni, Zach Taylor, Pete Carroll, even though he's much older, he's still, he's still very relatable. I, I call them, um,

• 44:07Channing Crowder?

  Player friendly coaches.

• 44:08Speaker 04

  Player friendly. I couldn't get it out. Mike Tomlin is like that. And Mike Tomlin got a bit of, a bit of both. He got a bit of both. One of the few coaches that have a bit of both and can relate to the players extremely well. And that dictatorship or stern coaching is not gonna work with them young boys. Not with them young boys. It's, it's not gonna work. And what you saw, I'm not sure how Mike, I'm Mike McDaniel's. I'm not sure how Josh McDaniel's coaches over there when he was with the Raiders. But for you to lose the locker room that fast and that soon, some.

• 44:37Ryan Clark?

  Wasn't there, there was a disconnect somewhere?

• 44:39Fred Taylor?

  Yeah, and I think players only relate to that if they're winning. Then they're able to accept it. If you're coaching real hard and stern, the Belichick way, or that former Patriot way, you know, I was in that locker room, you was there Chad, so you kind of know how it goes. The focus, attention to detail, the sense of urgency, that's all needed. But if the results, you're not getting those on the back end, then everybody's gonna think, you know, you're full of shit, it's bullshit. So I think with AP, Coach Pierce now, the players relate to him, they respect him. It's hard to get somebody to do something if they don't respect you. But it's a mutual respect. You know, so they went out there and they did their thing for him. And as Channing said, they probably would've smoked cigars had they lost.

• 45:23Fred Taylor?

  But the one thing I do know is in that when you have a player-friendly coach, or a coach who's a former player as well, we had Jack Del Rio. You know, when he came to Jacksonville, that first year, things were more lax. Coach Coughlin had just departed, you know, and things were more lax and chill. So guys like, yeah, we good. So we went all out for him. Then eventually, when the transparency starts to slip, when the gray areas start to come in, we were so used to white and black, you knew what you were getting. I think AP understands that as a player, as a guy who played for Coach Coughlin. You know, he's a guy who understands, I can be respectful, I can have a relationship with my guys,

• 46:05Fred Taylor?

  but I can also coach them hard and let them know, this is the fine line. This is where we meet, I'll get you to respond a bit better that way. So I think as a former player, he has that, and guys respect that. As a former player who played for a hard coaching Coach Coughlin, who had to kind of step off the gas a little bit in order to be a better coach, and be a Hall of Fame coach as a matter of fact, with two Super Bowls for the Giants. I think AP, he was able to absorb that, and now he's gonna give it back to his team. And I hope those guys really turn their, you know, turn their organization around. Because if they don't, all of that shit is just smoke and mirrors. And, you know, another guy who's just letting it all hang out and having fun right now. But I wish him success.

• 46:49Ryan Clark?

  I have a question for both of you guys, because y'all got an opportunity to be in New England. And I'll bring it to you first, Freddie T. How much of...

• 46:59Ryan Clark?

  The Patriot way benefited from having Tom Brady.

• 47:04Fred Taylor?

  You have to have a certain type of structure. And then, I'm in year 12 when I first got to New England. So I was looking for what made them tick. Why are they so successful? And it was easier for me to buy in because of what they had already done. Right? Some guys kind of fought that, you know, but I come from a tough coach. And then I had a coach in the middle, that player coach, that we had some success, but it sort of kind of, you know, outplayed itself eventually. And then to land back, you know, in New England with Coach Belichick and the Patriot way, for me, I respected it. And he was hard on everybody, even Tom, and it was fair. And he taught you how to be a pro.

• 47:48Fred Taylor?

  So I think the Patriot way is why, the reason they're a dynasty. Also Tom too, but it all goes hand in hand. You know, I don't think you can have one without the other. I don't know how great Tom would have been.

• 48:01Ryan Clark?

  But that's the other thing too, with Freddie T. Other people are trying to have one without the other. Matt Patricia, Matt Patricia tried to have one without the other. Romeo Cornell has tried that. Bill O'Brien has tried that. Josh McDaniels has tried that. You know, we've seen Mike Raver be a little successful.

• 48:18Fred Taylor?

  The common denominator goes back to Tom.

• 48:20Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 48:21Fred Taylor?

  You know, but Tom also had to learn the Patriot way. And I think that made him a better pro and a better player, a person. Look how he does his interviews. Do you think Tom will do interviews like that? He was, he was a bit more loose and older when he got to Tampa and more mature and a lot more smart. Like, would Tom have been interviewing that way, knowing how to dodge the questions? Belichick taught guys that way. When you walk in the door, it says, you know, do your job. And the sign leaving the door says, you know, basically fuck the outside. You know what I'm saying? Be mindful. Of what you say on the outside and the distractions.

• 48:58Channing Crowder?

  Tom Brady wouldn't have been Tom Brady if he didn't know how to dodge media questions?

• 49:02Fred Taylor?

  No, I did not say that.

• 49:03Channing Crowder?

  I'm just saying like what like the Patriot way, I'm saying like teaching him how to manipulate the media. Tom Brady is the best quarterback ever played this game.

• 49:11Fred Taylor?

  Become a better pro. These things help you.

• 49:12Channing Crowder?

  By being closed mouth when the media comes in the locker room, like that don't help nobody.

• 49:16Fred Taylor?

  I know when they said he was closed mouth.

• 49:18Speaker 04

  They did teach that though.

• 49:19Channing Crowder?

  But really?

• 49:20Fred Taylor?

  When they said he was closed mouth.

• 49:21Speaker 04

  What do you mean they taught that? Keep keeping stuff in house. Things that are going on.

• 49:24Fred Taylor?

  Distraction. You want to minimize the bullshit.

• 49:26Speaker 04

  Minimize all that bullshit. You keep everything in house.

• 49:28Fred Taylor?

  Even with your family. Like you tell your family, look, we're in football mode for for six to eight months. Look, y'all can't tell me shit about my job. I know you want to criticize this. You don't know what the fuck, you don't know what's going on in this building. Minimizing those distractions. You get home, oh baby, yeah, they should have done this. You don't even know. What you talking about it for? Like you don't, so he puts you on that mindset.

• 49:51Channing Crowder?

  They taught you how to talk to your kids and your old lady?

• 49:53Fred Taylor?

  No, I didn't say any of that. They didn't tell you minimize these distractions.

• 49:58Channing Crowder?

  I use the Steelers because they've they've had what, three coaches in 962 years or something? Tom Brady is starting quarterback for the Steelers at his prime. Tom Brady still winning six Super Bowls. Right? You you disagree with that?

• 50:12Fred Taylor?

  I can I can.

• 50:13Speaker 04

  Because of the player.

• 50:14Fred Taylor?

  Essentially, yeah.

• 50:15Channing Crowder?

  And then now you get rid of Tom Brady, you still don't draft well, you still have struggle with your roster as they sit here today, and they're still teaching them how to talk to their kids and be quiet with the media like. Bro, I'm just saying like that, I understand what you're saying where that stuff means something and all, you know, focus in. I don't think that creates success. I think great players create success.

• 50:36Ryan Clark?

  I'm going to say this. Lawyer Malloy, Rodney Harrison, Ty Law, Seymour, Teddy Bruski, Vince Wilfort.

• 50:45Channing Crowder?

  They list.

• 50:46Ryan Clark?

  Like those people. Are the Patriot way. Yeah. And they're doing that and they're what they are. And honestly, Bill Belichick, and this is my opinion. I believe he was always a stern coach. Because he started to have success, he became, at least to the outside world, he became colder. Because he understood through that success, I could be more of this and they can't question it because I'm winning a lot. Yeah. And I think that as that grew, now you have a Matt Patricia, or you have Bill O'Brien, or you have a Josh McDaniels, who probably actually at the time, isn't built that way. But it's what they've learned.

• 51:28Ryan Clark?

  Like if any of us, like if I'm around something that's extremely successful, it's like you said Freddie T, you start to look at it and try to figure out, okay, why is it successful? What about that can I emulate? What about that can I take into my life and try to be that helped me be successful as well? The problem is, if it takes you away from your authentic self, it actually makes you worse. Right? It actually makes you worse if it's now making me be something that I have, that I don't have the capability of being.

• 52:00Speaker 04

  You know, it's funny, but Tom mastered that. Because if you look at Tom Brady and entirety of his career in New England, and he gets to Tampa, he's a completely different person because he didn't have to mask it no more.

• 52:12Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 52:12Speaker 04

  The personality. What the fuck, funny as hell. He never had a Twitter. All of a sudden you get Twitter, he funny as hell, cracking jokes. I'm like, what the fuck this motherfucker been all this time?

• 52:22Ryan Clark?

  Toe up at the parade, drunk.

• 52:24Speaker 04

  Listen, and that's not something he just started, but the Patriot way forced him to be someone because he had to represent that organization and that slogan.

• 52:34Fred Taylor?

  I really think it just boils down to, because even Bill had some behind those cameras. Bill would, you know, Bill would say some funny shit in those meetings, bro. Like Bill, he's, he's not, as you said, he became colder.

• 52:46Ryan Clark?

  Yeah.

• 52:47Fred Taylor?

  But that, he didn't want to deal with the bullshit.

• 52:49Ryan Clark?

  Right.

• 52:49Fred Taylor?

  And that's what he tried to say. It's like, let's minimize the BS and keep the outsiders outside. And pretty much the Patriot way, pretty much like y'all had. The Steelers way. It's it's just really saying buying in, right? This is how the consistency of of our successes. This is how we get to stay there. Like if we all just buy in and just do it this way. This is our foundation. This is what we're built on. Don't let anybody interfere with it. They ain't teach nobody what to say to their kids. But they did say minimize the distractions. So you can, we want to give you an opportunity to be more successful. I can tell you this and I guarantee you this.

• 53:28Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Good times mean competitions between you and your friends. Like seeing who can throw some pigskin the farthest or rush the field the fastest. Winner gets an ultra. Because it's not just a superior like beer. It's also giving fans superior access to their favorite sporting events. Superior is worth playing for. Visit michelobultra.com slash superior access to enter. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026 Anheuser Busch InBev Michelob Ultra Beer, St. Louis, Missouri.

• 53:57Fred Taylor?

  If your ass was in New England, obviously Miami, New England, you know how.

• 54:02Channing Crowder?

  I was supposed to get drafted to England.

• 54:04Fred Taylor?

  You would be a better player, a better player than you were in Miami. A hundred percent.

• 54:09Channing Crowder?

  The scheme, the scheme was great. I played next to Teddy Bruski. I played next to Zach. Zach better than Teddy. Had JT, they had defensive ends and all that stuff. They had DBs and all. Fred, I was still going to party. I was still gonna hang out. I was still gonna run the streets. I would just mask it more because I knew they don't agree with that.

• 54:29Fred Taylor?

  And with all of that, you were gonna be a better player. As you just said, Zach was better than Teddy. I certainly agree with you that, with you on that. But I think if Teddy was other places, I don't know if he would be as great as he was as a Patriot. You feel what I'm saying?

• 54:45Channing Crowder?

  Yeah.

• 54:45Fred Taylor?

  And you, my friend, would be much better than you were with the Dolphins. Simply because you would have bought in. And you would have knew how to handle yourself a bit, but again, guys still party. Guys go to Boston, Providence, down to Foxwoods, guys hang out.

• 55:00Channing Crowder?

  I think the Patriots get a certain play, a certain type player that they know will buy in.

• 55:05Speaker 04

  That's the job.

• 55:06Channing Crowder?

  That's what they do. That's why they, that's why you see Tom Brady throwing to all these little, um, these little hobbits running around for years. He always had a four foot seven little white boy to throw to. If you give Tom Brady Ocho Cinco at his prime, you gave him that one year with Randy Moss, they went nuts. They had 50 touchdowns. But they wanted that certain type player. And I think they draft that certain type player.

• 55:28Ryan Clark?

  The other thing too, like, and this is sort of off the subject of pivot per se. And also remember now, NFL Sunday Ticket on YouTube TV right now, it's half off. Half off. Watch a Sunday afternoon out of market games. It's 50% off. Like, you know, Channing always looking for something cheap.

• 55:49Fred Taylor?

  I'm gonna give me that. Hey, but on some real stuff though, and this ain't even part of the ad, this ain't nothing. Check it out. I did it this past Sunday, watching the game, because Jacksonville was off. So I had the luxury of being able to watch all the games. So they have this little box at the bottom, and it gives you different games.

• 56:06Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 56:06Fred Taylor?

  Where you can select the different four, so they already kind of preset the four for you. Yeah, AFC, NFC, like, and you can just kind of use your remote to change the sound wherever you want it. It is so dope, bro.

• 56:17Ryan Clark?

  It is.

• 56:18Fred Taylor?

  I had a ball Sunday watching the game. And I be texting them, they be like, Freddie, we watching the game.

• 56:24Ryan Clark?

  We're watching the game, Fred.

• 56:25Fred Taylor?

  We already watching the game.

• 56:26Ryan Clark?

  I said, he's like, he's like, yep, Jacksonville just got a first down, Trevor Lawrence ran it. I know.

• 56:32Fred Taylor?

  I was, I was working that day though.

• 56:35Ryan Clark?

  Hey, Chan. Okay. Hey, I want to, we haven't talked, in the early season, it was the, the huge topic of conversation, what Deion Sanders was doing in Colorado.

• 56:46Fred Taylor?

  Oh, boy.

• 56:47Ryan Clark?

  And it was, it was fun at that point, because they was busting everybody's head. And now... They're still a team that's extremely competitive, but they have a losing record. You know, and Deion's coming under fire. Rich Eisen asked him about all the players that left. And Deion said, honestly, we had an honest conversation with like 20 of them. The other players just quit. You know, and it's like while you're winning, you don't really have to explain that. You know, but now you've gotten to this point and it's like, okay, I gotta let people know that no, I wasn't being what they thought or perceived as an a-hole in those things. The offense coordinator, who everybody loved,

• 57:30Ryan Clark?

  who left the job as a head coach to be the OC, has now been removed from play calling. When you think about Ocho, it was the destination for everybody. The way things have shifted on Colorado and Prime, when you look at that situation now, what are your thoughts?

• 57:51Speaker 04

  I mean, it's still the same. I expected him to turn that program around very fast, and he did that. He did that. And before the season started, he said he's six to eight dogs away from getting where he needs to be to be competitive throughout the entirety of a season. The interior is where they're lacking, offensively and defensively. That's it. That's it. And he's, I mean, obviously those issues are going to get fixed, you know, once the portal. And one of the 90% of anything when it comes to college football is recruiting. You think Prime will have a problem fixing that interior, offensive or defensive? It's gonna change. It's gonna change fast, too. So I'm not really worried about a losing record because he's already surpassed everybody's expectations anyway.

• 58:35Speaker 04

  They won one game the year before.

• 58:37Ryan Clark?

  Yep.

• 58:38Speaker 04

  One.

• 58:39Ryan Clark?

  They viewed different because of him, but yeah, you're right.

• 58:40Speaker 04

  They viewed much different. So my thoughts on it hadn't changed. People want to be all up in arms like, oh, the way he's coaching style, now he's losing. What did you expect him to do? He definitely wasn't going undefeated.

• 58:50Ryan Clark?

  No.

• 58:51Speaker 04

  You know, that wasn't gonna happen. But for what he's done in such a short amount of time with that program is commendable.

• 58:57Ryan Clark?

  Here's what I'm gonna say. When, last year, no one cared about Colorado.

• 59:03Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 59:03Ryan Clark?

  No one focused on them. No one paid attention to them. People didn't go to the games. They weren't putting them on TV every week. People in Colorado ain't care about Colorado, right? Ralphie was out there running for herself. She wasn't running for fans. She was out there getting exercise and allowing 20 people that chase him, or chase her, because it's actually a female, that chase her around the field to have a scholarship for chasing a a Bengal buffalo every Saturday. You gotta watch them warm up too, it's hilarious. I will say this, and it speaks to what he's done. They're the most average team in football that everybody plays like it's their Super Bowl.

• 59:47Channing Crowder?

  Oh, yeah.

• 59:49Ryan Clark?

  When they come to town, or when you go to Colorado, even if you believe, Oregon knew they were the better team. They knew it. But that coach spoke differently. He was on them differently. The level of intensity of that locker room was different because of who Deion is, because who Colorado had become. And I think there's a sense of difficulty, Chad, that being prime adds to winning football at that level. Like, it's great, because you get all the other stuff that you wouldn't get other places. There's a lot of teams better than them that everybody don't go to see. How do you get over that? How do you fix or adjust to the fact

• 1:00:32Ryan Clark?

  that you are getting everybody's best shot, even when you aren't the best team?

• 1:00:37Channing Crowder?

  And that's when you talk trash, you're gonna get everybody's best shot. That's why I say, there's never be another Coach Prime again. Anybody with as much lore as him, almost like an Ocho. Anybody with as much attention on him, they don't want to do that job. That job is hard. Like Ocho just said, you got it now, you got Coach Prime, who has plenty money, plenty respect. He's sitting in 17-year-old kids' living rooms, telling them how great they gonna be, and how I'm gonna watch out for, I'm gonna take you under my wing like I'm your father. Like, it is a difficult job to do. And when you put a target on your back, that's why they call it that. Because that motherfucker's trying to shoot you. And everybody wants to take their best shot. So, Prime is gonna really have to grind and recruit and do all the thing it takes to be a Nick Saban,

• 1:01:22Channing Crowder?

  to be a, who was it, Kirby Smart up there at Georgia. To do that, that's a difficult job. And these kids were ill-prepared to have that on them, to have that attention. Some were. Shador can play, like, there's some, there's some good players on that list. They got some receivers, Travis is, Travis is one of the best college players I've ever, ever seen in my life, to be honest. You need 80 in college. And you gotta have guys coming up behind that guy to prepare for the next year when he goes to the league. Prime just got there on a 11, a 1 and 11 team. We talked about four. He was going to fail and people were waiting for, it's like Floyd Mayweather when he was boxing. People were watching him to get knocked out, including me. And I love Floyd. I'm like, somebody sooner or later is gonna have to hit this little joker and catch him.

• 1:02:07Channing Crowder?

  Who was that, Pacquiao called him one time? And the whole party I was in jumped up. He got tapped and then he went commenced to whooping that boy's ass.

• 1:02:16Speaker 04

  No, that was, uh, that was Sugar, uh, Sugar Shane.

• 1:02:19Channing Crowder?

  Sugar Shane called him twice in one round and folks went crazy.

• 1:02:23Speaker 04

  And he didn't win, and he didn't win a round after that.

• 1:02:25Channing Crowder?

  I'm talking about whipped him like he stole something. Alicia cried probably in that fourth round. You know, she couldn't take it. She probably was in the back shaking and shivering, you know? And Floyd went to commence to whoop his ass. Deion doesn't have the, the, the, the dog right now.

• 1:02:39Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:02:39Channing Crowder?

  And O2 hit on the head. If I am a DB, I go play for Prime. If I'm a receiver, I go play for Prime. What does Prime know about left guard? What does Prime know about?

• 1:02:48Speaker 04

  I go play for Michigan.

• 1:02:49Channing Crowder?

  Three technique. How is Prime gonna get those big corn-fed sons of bitches in the middle of Wisconsin to come to Colorado? Cause that's what you need to be a good football team.

• 1:02:59Speaker 04

  It's Prime. I think it makes it that much easier. It makes it that much easier wanting to play for, for someone of that stature. Because if I was a lineman, that's where I, that's where I wanna go. Because you gonna have the same amenities before the, the same things you can get at your Michigan's and your other power five schools.

• 1:03:15Fred Taylor?

  I think it also comes down to consistency. You, you better believe Prime was ready to, to deal with this sort of adversity. I'm not sure if the players were, but I'm pretty sure he's done his best to try to get them in the mindset that it ain't gonna always be flowers, you know what I'm saying? So they've lost three in a row, but they're better than they were. You know, that message is still there. I think we still see the consistency in Deion with how he posts and his interviews and his faith and, and his optimism. All those different things I think are encouraging and he's able to still go into these homes. You know, people know he got a mouthpiece. So the family's gonna wanna say, I can send my kid here. And to get a life, to, to learn about life.

• 1:04:00Fred Taylor?

  Learn how to be a man. You know what I'm saying? Learn about what, what's gonna happen if I don't make it to the next level. And I think all of those things are assets for Deion. And, um, you know, people, one minute, they're gonna be able to talk about him. But the next minute, you know, they'll, they'll, they'll be able to praise him again. And he's gonna stay steady. Yeah, you know, he's gonna stay steady and he's gonna get his best.

• 1:04:23Speaker 04

  Remember what he said? Y'all taking shots at me now.

• 1:04:26Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, he said, y'all better get me now.

• 1:04:28Speaker 04

  Yeah, you better get me now. And I knew exactly what he meant.

• 1:04:30Ryan Clark?

  Yeah, I think though, like I love to watch lessons unfold publicly. Because Prime's consistency is a lesson for everyone. Because what it says is, I wasn't behaving this way because I was up. I was behaving this way. I had this level of faith. I had this level of belief because I'm me. Because my entire life, this is the way I've been. When I walked into your son's house, when I walked into your house, and I said, this is what I'm going to provide for them, win, lose, or draw, I'm gonna continue to do that. That level of consistency is not only honorable to me, it's admirable. Because it's hard, right?

• 1:05:14Ryan Clark?

  It's hard when you're losing and the shots. Cause he was taking the shots while he was winning. Like, let's not act like everybody in the world was happy they were up. Because they weren't. And they were taking the shots and they were waiting for him to fall. And now that he's fallen, the shots keep coming, but he does not change. Right? He does not change his messaging. He does not change his treatment of people. He does not change his love for the people he coaches. No, you're gonna try to make adjustments and make things right. Because life, when it comes to football, is about wins and losses. And I think the other thing, and I think Channing said it too, that's important is, no matter what happens at Colorado,

• 1:05:56Ryan Clark?

  it can never make Deion Sanders a failure. That's a different level of comfort to have. Right? That if this team never becomes a national champion, it doesn't take away from how I was raised. How being raised that way led me to be where I was. How I was having conversations and thoughts of ending it all, when everybody thought I should be on top, and how God brought me out of that. And now what I'm giving to these young men, that the fact that I have a gold jacket is something nobody ever talks about. The fact that I'm the best that's ever done it at my position, I don't have to live on that because of who I am now. That's a different level of confidence to be able to pour into those young men.

• 1:06:41Ryan Clark?

  And it made me think about Ocho earlier. We were having a conversation and I won't necessarily bring up the exact conversation. It was the three of us, we were in Chan's dressing room. I think Chan was in his drawers at the time. Fortunately, these still had the booty in them. Like you had not, you had not rubbed the booty out of these yet.

• 1:07:02Channing Crowder?

  Yeah. Ocho, how often you throw your drawers away?

• 1:07:05Speaker 04

  I'm not sure. I'm not sure.

• 1:07:08Channing Crowder?

  You've been wearing drawers for years, right?

• 1:07:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, I just wash them over and over and over.

• 1:07:11Channing Crowder?

  Yeah, see.

• 1:07:12Speaker 04

  He don't wash them.

• 1:07:14Ryan Clark?

  Chad, you were talking, you know, you talked earlier about your experience going to Canada. And you mentioned there are things that you do, you cannot come back from. And you were giving us an example of something, you know, that's going on in life since. And you said, you know, because of that experience, I learned how to handle this. I spoke earlier about how much you've grown and getting to watch you. Like I said, you know, I sent you a text. I was like, bro, that was excellent, man. I love it. Talk a little bit about how your experience through life has changed you as a man? And where you are now maturity wise as compared to where you have been as an actual adult?

• 1:07:56Speaker 04

  Right. I think before, I was, I lived life a little reckless. I lived life a little reckless, took everything for granted, especially when I was playing. Being honest, almost invisible in a sense. And I wasn't doing anything wrong, you know, went in the streets, running the street. You know, even back then, I didn't party, I didn't club. Just I was, I was.

• 1:08:20Speaker 04

  On a personal level and as an individual and as a man that had responsibilities at the time, I was moving reckless. And the man upstairs had to sit me down and take some things away, you know, to get me to see that and understand you ain't moving right. Even though I wasn't doing anything wrong that could, that can, you know, die, death, jail, nothing, nothing that magnitude. So with that, losing everything and then coming back and being able to get it all again, I got clarity. Can see the light at the end of the tunnel. Okay, this is why. Oh, now I get it. Because if I was still moving like that, it's impossible. None of these opportunities, there's no way I would've got this. Well, you know what?

• 1:09:03Speaker 04

  The way I was moving back then, there's no way I could attain this as well. So me understanding why he made me sit my ass down and take some stuff away from me to bring me to the point I'm at now. And it's made me a better man, a better individual, a better person. Not much of me has changed, but I moved differently than I did before. Moved differently. And I'm saying this, I'm trying to navigate through it without, you know, without giving the table legs, if you get what I'm going. I know what you mean.

• 1:09:35Fred Taylor?

  How much of losing Hurricane P plays a role in that?

• 1:09:41Speaker 04

  Goddamn Hurricane.

• 1:09:50Speaker 04

  A little bit, a little bit. I miss my baby. That's a good jog. I appreciate you jogging that memory. But a little bit, a little bit. I think about it a lot. Visit the, visit the gravesite sometimes, right? And the first thing I ask, I say to myself, why y'all always talk about y'all loved me when y'all was here? Y'all motherfuckers, I'm talking now, talking to my mom and my grandma, y'all motherfuckers buried next to each other and ain't nobody gave me a sign yet.

• 1:10:19Speaker 04

  Y'all always talk about y'all, how you, tell me something right now. And I'm talking to the grave and still to this day, man, I have yet to get that sign and just, or acknowledgement of just some sort. And people say, the signs are right in front of you, you probably missed them. No, I didn't, because I've been waiting on them. I've been waiting on something. And everything I do now is to make sure I make them proud. And they always say, oh, they watching, they praying for you. Because I always say, well, RC, and you know, you mentioned too, I'm trying to get a better understanding, how the hell I got to the point I am now. I ain't figured it out yet. How? How is it possible? Who praying? Because the two most important people in my life are gone. So the opportunities I've been afforded now, still to this day, obviously there are people in my corner

• 1:11:05Speaker 04

  that have done a phenomenal job, that have done a phenomenal job. Man, Doug has been a wonder. He's been a joy for me and a blessing in many ways. Sherrell has been a blessing in many ways to this point. And also, I definitely got to give credit to those I have kids from. Those I have kids from have been a good foundation for me. And the fact that I didn't do things the traditional way. But the way I did do them, I've been afforded the opportunities I have because of those I've had kids from. Because they kept everything level. Because that foundation on that end was always strong. Because if that foundation over there wasn't strong, I wouldn't be able to do what the fuck I'm doing now.

• 1:11:48Speaker 04

  And so I always give them credit when I have opportunity to tell them how thankful I am. Because they're doing what I'm doing now today, with the train rolling again, it wouldn't have been possible without.

• 1:11:59Ryan Clark?

  You mentioned the train rolling again. What was it like in between the times the train was rolling though?

• 1:12:07Speaker 04

  It was quiet. It was quiet. Boy, and I had a good six, seven years of silence. Good six or seven, that's a long time, boy. Silence, a lot of gaming, a lot of boxing, a lot of playing soccer, a lot of, that's it. Then all of a sudden, it took, it took one. I think it might have been ESPN. ESPN did something. And once ESPN did something, then everybody say, oh.

• 1:12:39Speaker 04

  It just, it just started coming in like clockwork. So like the past four, four years now, blessed have been raining like out of nowhere. And I, I still can't grasp why, but I see it as another test. I think you're doing it on purpose. Let me see if you're gonna make them same mistakes you made last time when I had to take everything from your ass.

• 1:13:00Speaker 04

  Now that's how I see it now. So I'm always on my Ps and Qs, really seeing what's gonna happen. He gonna throw something at me, let me see if he gonna take the bait.

• 1:13:10Ryan Clark?

  Wow.

• 1:13:11Speaker 04

  And that's how I look at it. Honestly, so I'm, I'm actually, I mean no disrespect. I'm actually mind fucking myself in not the messing up.

• 1:13:21Speaker 04

  And it's working for me.

• 1:13:23Ryan Clark?

  Honestly, bro, like I love that. Like that is, you know, like we have these natures of, of who we are. And there's these things that are innate to us that happen very naturally. And sometimes what we know is the right thing, or what other deem is the right thing, aren't the things that are easiest for us to do. You know, and it's like, it's like working out. It's like putting in effort to anything. Sometimes you gotta get that goal or have something that says, this is why I have to go do it. And if that's the, if that's the way you have to be in order to have yourself on the path of quote unquote righteousness, ain't nothing wrong with that.

• 1:14:06Fred Taylor?

  No, I just wanna say, it's just, it's your responsibility to yourself. You know, just going back to that, and, and a lot of times, this, this really is, you can sum it up with one word and just call it growth. Like, that's where you are. You look at your, your, your mom, you think about your mom, you tell yourself, damn, baby girl, we've come a long way, I, I thank you for that. You know, and then you, you're able to lend yourself a favor and, and really just grow up, man. I lost my grandmother. And the only reason I, I say this is, uh, because these guys, I was told that they're coming to her wake. This guy got a million jobs, he'd never take a day off. So for him to, you know, take a day off and, and show up, um...

• 1:14:55Fred Taylor?

  That's love. I appreciate you, bro.

• 1:14:58Speaker 04

  For sure, man.

• 1:14:58Fred Taylor?

  Chan, I appreciate you. AZ, I appreciate you.

• 1:15:03Fred Taylor?

  And that's family. So I think about my old girl too, you know, and that was the reason I asked you about Hurricane Pete. Because sometimes you can kind of look over to your left or right, and things that you're thinking, you can remember those smiles and it'll make you feel better. You can remember those moments that'll make you stop thinking something negative. Or wherever your mind was, it'll help you kind of fly away with them. So that's why I asked you if that helped you become a better person.

• 1:15:31Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:15:31Fred Taylor?

  From that point that you lost her. Because I feel myself kind of shifting into a state of forgiveness and learning how to become a better person. And I appreciate these two more than I probably ever appreciated anybody in my life because they've helped me become a better person. I still got a lot of work to do, you know, because I just wanted to share that. But I wanted to ask you, bro, in all of that, you know, everything from Chad and the antics, I would love to see what Chad would do in his day and age in football with the lax in the rules and the things you could do.

• 1:16:06Speaker 04

  Still be getting ran over by Ray?

• 1:16:09Fred Taylor?

  No. And with that, the jobs, the appearances, the opportunities, just everything that you've done, at what moment, what has been your biggest pivot in all of that in life?

• 1:16:21Speaker 04

  My biggest pivot?

• 1:16:22Fred Taylor?

  Your biggest pivot?

• 1:16:25Speaker 04

  I'm much more disciplined than I was before. To those that mean the most to me and not taking it for granted.

• 1:16:35Speaker 04

  Because I wasn't before. I treated a lot of people, you know, the closest people that are to me like they were disposable. Next, next. You know, that attitude, I can find that again, next. And then understanding, you know, what I have now,

• 1:16:53Speaker 04

  how important it is and the timing of when it came in my life, it came for a reason.

• 1:16:59Speaker 04

  And when they came in, there was a certain, a certain, a certain feeling, a feeling that I hadn't had before. You know, they say normally when a man finds the right person, you know, they're willing to change. And there's nothing you could do. You can't force it. They just, they just do it on their own. And I've done that. I've done that. There's a certain discipline that I have in the way I move right now. I've never done it before. I don't know, maybe it's growth, whether it's maturity, but I don't think it's that. I think it's what I have attained to this point. Those that have come into my life have changed me for the better. That discipline, the word discipline is something I never had unless it had to do with football.

• 1:17:45Speaker 04

  When it came to football, anything sports related, trying to play, discipline, 10, I'm checking every box. Outside life, shit, and I'm all over the place. I'm all over the place. And one of the funny things about it is I use all y'all as, you know what? I like the way R.C. move. If I want to be, get where I want to get to in this area of my life, I got to be more like that motherfucker right there. Just taking little stuff from everybody that's around me because you are what you surround yourself with.

• 1:18:15Ryan Clark?

  That's true.

• 1:18:16Speaker 04

  And I don't have entourage. I don't run with a bunch of people. But if I want to get to a certain level and change the way I maneuver, maneuver after all these years, I got to, I got to, I got to pinch and pull from somewhere.

• 1:18:29Ryan Clark?

  That's true.

• 1:18:29Speaker 04

  Pinch and pull from those that are closest to me.

• 1:18:33Speaker 04

  And that, that's just, and smart. And that's even in the, in the media stuff too. You be on ESPN, I be jotting down notes and shit, stealing some of your words. So if you hear me on my other show using some of your phrases, you know, just know, just know, hang with me.

• 1:18:46Ryan Clark?

  They for everybody, man. You know, I think what's, you know, we're gonna, and we can end it now. What's fascinating about you, and I don't think you recognize it. I think we, we deal with it with Fred a lot of times. And having to make him realize who he is and who he was to all of us as a player. You know, and the way that we see him and saw him. Like, you the homie. Now, you our actual friend. You know what I mean? And like, when we sit down here and when we sat down, I was like, man, well, let's just try to bring Ocho in or Chad in, and we could just have a conversation. Because you too, like, what we talking about? And I was like, everything. And then like, you sit down, and Fred starts to ask you a couple of questions,

• 1:19:29Ryan Clark?

  and I'm like, well, hell, I want to ask him some questions. You, you forget like, all that you've accomplished, all that you've done, all that you are doing, and truly how big of a star you are, man. And like, I am so happy for you now, because even though it was quiet for a spell of time, it wasn't supposed to be in the sense of what you had accomplished to that point, but it was necessary for you to be here. And I think that's the beauty of it, man. And I love you, bro, and like, just keep doing it.

• 1:20:05Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, most definitely.

• 1:20:06Ryan Clark?

  My dog. Damn, this, this turned out to be something different. That was a good motherfucker ending.

• 1:20:12Channing Crowder?

  That's a good show, boy.

• 1:20:13Speaker 04

  Appreciate you, dog.

• 1:20:15Channing Crowder?

  They can keep that. Throw them motherfuckers away.

• 1:20:17Ryan Clark?

  Hey, Stanker, baby. Boy, y'all funny.

• 1:20:20Speaker 04

  What's up, baby?

• 1:20:23Ryan Clark?

  I miss you, Stanker.

• 1:20:25Speaker 04

  Wait, come on, don't do that.

• 1:20:26Ryan Clark?

  Ooh, Stanker, baby. Hey, Stanker, baby.

• 1:20:31Speaker 04

  Hold on, hold on, let me take this picture.

• 1:20:36Ryan Clark?

  Stanker, baby on three. One, two, three. Stanker, baby.

• 1:20:44Speaker 04

  Hey, why you embarrassing me like that, man?

• 1:20:46Ryan Clark?

  You know, next week, welcome to Inside the NFL. Presented to you by BMW. To my right, I got Stanker, baby.

• 1:21:00Channing Crowder?

  I like that.

• 1:21:02Ryan Clark?

  We for sure, we for sure.

• 1:21:05Channing Crowder?

  Don't be like, say that shit in normal conversation. So, the Eagles are struggling, Stanker, baby.

• 1:21:15Speaker 04

  Hey, like Stank a Baby said earlier. Stank a Baby said earlier. They gotta run that route tighter to the hash. Come on, man. Hey, don't do me like that. Boy, Stank a Baby Predicto.

• 1:21:29Speaker 04

  Boy, I can't wait till we get to Stank a Baby Predicto.

• 1:21:58Speaker 05

  Every game day, you show up for your team. Now, it's your time.

• 1:22:08Speaker 05

  Ask your prescriber about Wegovy. Someaglutide injection, 2.4 milligrams a GLP-1. Call 1-833-4-WEGOVY or visit wegovy.com to view the medication guide and to learn more about Wegovy. Why wait?