John Edward: Stop Trying to “Move On” After Loss (Use THIS Daily Practice to Make Peace Without the Answers)

Today, Jay welcomes internationally recognized psychic medium John Edward for an eye-opening conversation about grief, healing, and the survival of consciousness. John shares how people often come to him hoping for closure after losing a loved one, only to realize that what they truly find is connection. Rather than “fixing” grief, his work helps people recognize that love continues beyond the physical world and that healing comes not from moving on from loss, but from reframing how we see it. Through his own journey from skeptic to seeker, John illustrates how curiosity and openness can lead us to deeper truths about life and beyond. Together, Jay and John break down the biggest misconceptions about mediumship, especially the fine line between skepticism and cynicism. John shares why healthy skepticism can actually be a gateway to discovery, while cynicism closes the door before anything begins. He also walks through the scientific studies that have examined his abilities, how he receives information through clairvoyance, clairaudience, and clairsentience, and why validation is at the core of every reading. John emphasizes that no one truly “needs” a reading, they need understanding. By reframing grief as the other side of love, he invites us to honor our emotions, say what matters while our loved ones are still here, and discover meaningful ways to carry their presence forward. From keeping traditions alive to sharing their stories, John reminds us that our connections don’t end, they endure when we choose to include those we’ve lost in our everyday lives. In this interview, you'll learn: How to Reframe Grief Into Growth How to Recognize Real Connection vs. Closure How to Tell If a Psychic Is Genuine How to Keep Loved Ones Present After Loss How to Talk About Death Without Fear How to Find Lessons Hidden in Grief How to Honor Your Loved One’s Legacy Grief may leave cracks in our hearts, yet those very cracks can become the places where light enters and strength is revealed. Each moment we choose to honor the past while embracing the present, we create space for deeper connection, renewed purpose, and lasting peace. Check out John’s latest book, Chasing Evil: Shocking Crimes, Supernatural Forces, and an FBI Agent’s Search for Hope and Justice. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty Join over 750,000 people to receive my most transformative wisdom directly in your inbox every single week with my free newsletter. Subscribe here. Check out our Apple subscription to unlock bonus content of On Purpose! https://lnk.to/JayShettyPodcast Get 50% Off Monarch, the all-in-one financial tool at www.monarch.com/PURPOSE What We Discuss: 00:00 Intro 00:28 Why Do People Really Go See a Medium? 01:11 Turning Grief Into Discovery 03:37 Skepticism vs. Cynicism 07:53 The Science Behind Psychic Studies 12:08 How Messages Are Received in a Reading 16:04 What Actually is a Psychic Medium? 18:10 Everything Is Energy 20:25 Red Flags to Look for in Readings 24:35 A Session That Changed Everything 30:20 Do We Ever “Need” a Reading? 33:03 Discovering Your Life Path 37:56 Challenges That Arise in Readings 41:36 Exploring Reincarnation and Consciousness 47:55 Choosing Between Fear and Love 49:40 When Grief Truly Begins 53:47 Say What You Need to Say Before It’s Too Late 57:42 Grief is the Other Side of Love 01:00:13 Finding Your Way Through Grief 01:02:12 The Truth About Time and Healing 01:05:27 Moving Forward When You Feel Stuck 01:07:08 Astrology as an Energetic Blueprint 01:10:42 Honoring and Living With Grief Every Day 01:12:13 Supporting a Grieving Parent 01:12:57 The Comfort in Knowing No One Really Dies Alone 01:16:22 Keeping Their Memories Alive After They’re Gone 01:19:38 Letting Go of Their Belongings to Heal 01:21:21 Internalizing, Not Externalizing Feelings 01:23:37 Chasing Evil Episode Resources: John Edward | https://johnedward.net/ John Edward | https://www.instagram.com/psychicmediumje/ John Edward | https://www.facebook.com/psychicmediumje John Edward | https://x.com/psychicmediumje John Edward | https://www.tiktok.com/@psychicmediumje See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:30Jay Shetty?

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• 1:12Jay Shetty?

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• 1:56Jay Shetty?

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• 2:10Speaker 02

  I don't think anybody needs a reading. Nobody really wants to stay with me. They want their loved ones and friends to be here in the physical world. I want people to recognize that a medium's not going to fix their greed.

• 2:19Jay Shetty?

  John Edward, welcome to On Purpose.

• 2:22Speaker 02

  Thank you for having me.

• 2:23Jay Shetty?

  It's great to have you here. It's not every day I get to sit down with a psychic medium and to dive into your mind, to dive into your work, to learn more about an area that I'm curious about as a form of healing and growth for people who need it and seek it out. And I think my first question to you is, what do most people come to you searching for? What are they seeking when they come to you?

• 2:47Speaker 02

  When a client first decides that they want to see a medium, they are thinking, I want to make that connection back with the person who's left the physical world. That seeking of what they think is closure is actually really connection. So I think what they think they are seeking as closure, when it becomes the connection, I want people to recognize that there's a survival of consciousness, that life and love are eternal, and that a medium's not going to fix their grief. So that's what they think that they're coming for, like they're going to be healed, they're going to be fixed. And I think, truth be told, it's going to actually set them on a path of discovery.

• 3:21Jay Shetty?

  How many people are disappointed that they're not going to get fixed and healed when they realize that's not the process? And how many people continue to actually say, no, I'm going to commit to this next phase?

• 3:32Speaker 02

  I don't know what the numbers would be, but I can go by feeling, right? I think that in every reading, no matter how amazing the information may be, you're always starting as a deficit, because nobody wants to sit with me. Nobody really wants to sit with me. They want their loved one and friends to be here in the physical world. So already starting at a deficit. I think that there's an expectation that somebody has when they go for a reading. I need to hear this. They need to say this. I need to know this. And then that kind of reflects back to them, then I'll be okay. And they may not hear that. They may not hear from the person that they want to hear from, or they may hear from multiple people. So there's always a level of expectation management, and I think disappointment that comes into a reading

• 4:15Speaker 02

  is that I always want people to be like, hey, if you're not ready for this... Don't go like process your grief in a different way because you can't make someone come through and you cannot make them say the things that you want them to say.

• 4:26Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, when people are coming, are they usually coming because they feel there was something I didn't say or something I didn't hear? Or is it that I just miss that person and I want to access them if they had some sort of dream experience revelation like where where's that need coming from for humans to want to connect with someone who's passed on?

• 4:48Speaker 02

  I think it's all of the above. I think people want to know that they're okay. I I'd start there. The physical death process takes them away from us and as a result of taking them away from us, it makes us feel absent. It makes us feel empty. It makes us feel vulnerable. And now I want to know, are are they okay? So what I want people to know is they are okay, but we are not. The grieving are not, and we're projecting onto them our not being okay. And I think the process of them coming through is to help assuage some of that to say, no, I'm okay. Now let's work on you. Like, I'm okay. Let's work on what my passing has now done. What are the obstacles and the blockages that are coming?

• 5:28Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, you know, you're very open to skeptics.

• 5:31Speaker 02

  I am.

• 5:31Jay Shetty?

  And I can imagine anyone who's listening or watching right now is just like, Jay, why are you doing this? What what's the point? Like, none of this works. It's not real. It's make believe. And you've probably heard every excuse in the book or every thing in the book because you've done this for a long, long, long, long, long time. What has been your approach to meeting a skeptic who right now is going, that is just not true. That's not possible.

• 5:58Speaker 02

  My approach is to come on the journey. And what I mean by that is I was that person. So at a very young age, I had a reading that put me on this path and I had no choice but to come to the understanding that this woman was legitimate with what she was doing because there's no way possible that she could have known what she had known. I ruled out that it was mind reading for the simple reason that she could not have known something that was gonna happen when it wasn't in my mind if I didn't know about it. So I'm an analytical person and I was like, okay, I need to understand what this is. How did she do this? And this woman told me that I had this ability and that in that first reading that I had with her, she said, you're gonna change the way millions of people look at this subject matter. I was fifteen years old. You know, and I jokingly say, it's like she could have said, I parked my spaceship in the backyard and I'll take you for a spin when we're done. Right?

• 6:42Speaker 02

  It it was like analogous to that. The reality is that sent me on a journey and I became a seeker. And I think that when we're seekers, that leads to exploration. And my exploration took me to the public library where I read every book back in 1985 on the occult. And I was insatiable with information. And my discovery, which raised my awareness, was this is common sense. Like, everybody has this, this isn't psychic, this is just basic, like, you know, we all do this. So I started asking questions. I would ask like high school friends, haven't you ever seen your dead grandfather? The answer was no. I said, you've never had an apparition? The answer was no. Have you ever had dreams that came true? The answer was no. So I started to recognize that maybe my understanding of myself at that time, I needed to reframe certain things.

• 7:26Speaker 02

  Then I went into the active development part. But before that, I was the person who was debunking the people that came to my grandmother's house to do readings. So I get it. But there is a difference between skepticism and cynicism. Skepticism says, I'm not sure, show me. Cynicism says, I'm sure, no matter what you show me, I'm not gonna believe you. And I think that you can't give somebody a belief system. And I'm down with people being skeptical. The only part that I think is not cool is when somebody defines a person's personal motivations. Because they don't know me. So, you know, I've had every possible scenario, you know, scammer, fraud, con, grifter, you name it. They kind of like fall off me now, 40 years of doing this, you're kind of like, it is what it is.

• 8:09Speaker 02

  But the reality is, I've put myself through positions of being studied and tested. I've read for people in positions. I've made sure that when I read, I'm giving information, not philosophy. So I just want people to come on that journey. You know, many years ago, there was a woman who sent me a letter. And I hope I get this correctly, she was an insurance fraud investigator. And she kind of took it on herself, like, I don't like him. I'm gonna, like, I'm gonna use my skill set and I'm gonna, I'm gonna follow him around. And so she came to different events. But before she did that, she went to the Skeptical Society meetings and she was armed with what the things to look for.

• 8:50Speaker 02

  And so she was looking for, you know, reading body language, verbal intelligence. Nation cues. And most importantly, she wanted to see if the same people were being read in different cities, that they were like, you know, actors that were connected. When all was said and done, she wrote me this amazing letter and she said, wow, I'm more concerned about the negative connotation that people are putting out about what you're doing than the reality that you are just doing what you're doing. And I'm still friends with her like 25 years later, right? And I remember like I got that letter and I just called her up and I was like, my name is Marcia. I was like, Marcia. And she's like, who's this? I'm like, it's John Edward. And she's like, oh. I said, I just wanted to personally say thank you for the letter because she did her due diligence. She came, she watched, she saw.

• 9:35Speaker 02

  And I think that when people do that with legitimate mediums, I think they will think differently because it's basically showing them that there's a process that's happening here. That is not to say that there aren't a ton of other people that are out there. Go on TikTok, you'll see them, right? Go on Instagram and YouTube and they're there. I see them, I block them constantly. Skepticism is helpful, so I want everybody to have that. But be objectively skeptical. Don't be judgmental and skeptical.

• 10:04Jay Shetty?

  What are the studies that you said that had been done on you to help prove or show some of the capabilities that you have? What would we see if we studied your brain or what's being scanned? What's being looked at?

• 10:16Speaker 02

  So the cool part for me is back in 1999, HBO was doing a documentary called America Undercover, Life After Life, and it was produced by Linda Ellerby and her production company, Lucky Duck Productions. And I had not done a lot of television. I was mostly a radio guy. I love radio because it was like interactive and live. But then they said that Dr. Gary Schwartz was going to be part of this and he was going to study this. He wanted to study us, you know, Harvard Yale guy, right? And I was like, how do I not do that? Like, one, I have a science mind, like, I like data, so I'm like, how do I not do this? And then a colleague of mine was invited, her name is Suzanne Northrup, and I was like, Suzanne, are you doing this? And she's like, how do we not do this? She's like, and you know, her, her joke was, how do we not sit in the seat?

• 11:01Speaker 02

  You know, how do you not put yourself in the seat? So it was myself, Anne Gammon, Suzanne Northrup, George Anderson, and Laurie Campbell. We were like five people that were, you know, lab rats, basically. And what they were doing is they were looking at EEGs, EKGs, and they, they, the first testing that we did, which was on the documentary, they put the woman that we read and they kind of looked at the data that came through. And then in science, when you do additional testing, as you know, that they have to replicate and extend data points. So we did that, and they introduced something called the silent sitter experiment. And then the third time we did that, there was another layer that they added in. And then he compiled all that data, and it ruled out that body language, verbal incitations, like, all of the things that the quote-unquote cynics would say were doing,

• 11:46Speaker 02

  they were able to establish, no, we're not. And here's the data. That book was written, it's called The Afterlife Experiments. And I foolishly thought, like, when the studies came out, and when the book got published, I was like, okay, we're gonna take this work to the next level now. Like, people are gonna go like, okay, there's like, science. Oh, no. They attacked the scientist. Now the scientist was crazy. And it was that moment where I recognized, it doesn't matter, right? 20% of the population are gonna believe, 20% of the population are not gonna believe. And some people fall, you know, somewhere within that range. So that's why I came to the place of, be skeptical, question everything, so they're not taken advantage by people who are claiming to do this and can't. Make sure you're getting information and validation, evidence that that person is talking to your relative,

• 12:31Speaker 02

  and they're not just giving you philosophy. And I travel around the world, I do events constantly. The first part of my events are always to establish that, because I want to protect people from like, you know, anybody walks in front of a crowd of people and says, who here connects with a butterfly? Well, guess what? Somebody's gonna connect with a butterfly, right? Every afterlife book has a butterfly on it, because it's the quintessential transformation. So I try to do the debunking of my own field while raising the bar and kind of trying to put out there what I think people should be looking for, in my professional opinion.

• 13:01Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I think that's the natural concern people have, is that... The human mind can project anything back onto itself. So when you say butterfly.

• 13:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:09Jay Shetty?

  It's like every single person in the room is thinking of that exact moment. It's almost like saying, don't think of a pink elephant. And then naturally, the whole room is thinking about a pink elephant.

• 13:19Speaker 02

  Well, what I do is I stand in front of the crowd and I'll say, I'm going to disappoint all of you right now. And they kind of get that look of like, what? I'm like, here's what I'm not talking about. And then I say, instead of me telling you, I'm going to show you why. And I go, who here connects with butterflies? And that's your sign. And then people raise their hand. And then I go through cardinals and hummingbirds and dragonflies and finding pennies, dimes and quarters. And then I go through feathers. And then I talk about seeing eleven, eleven and the other iteration of numbers. By the time I'm done, ninety percent of the room has raised their hand. And I'm like, all of that's off the table. I'm not going to bring it up. When we make connections today, we're going to go deeper. And you may have to think about something that's not on your top 10 list of what you want to hear.

• 14:02Speaker 02

  But as long as it's a fact and a validation, then it's letting you know that it's them coming through. And a lot of times, it's really trivial stuff, by the way. Conversations that just happened, things that, you know, they did when nobody else was around. But it supports that there is a survival of consciousness and that our loved ones and friends are still part of what we're doing.

• 14:17Jay Shetty?

  I want to talk about sessions with you, what they look like, because I, I almost want to have a conversation that helps people understand what the process looks like and feels like. And I was talking to my producer, I know I had a call with you before we booked this and everything. So she was saying to me that when you were on Zoom with her, you asked her if you could read her quickly or whatever the right language is, is that accurate? And she said, you asked her a question like, who's Chris? And Chris happens to be her ex-boyfriend.

• 14:44Speaker 02

  Oh my God, I remember this. I did this.

• 14:45Jay Shetty?

  And.

• 14:46Speaker 02

  Sorry, Paige.

• 14:47Jay Shetty?

  And she'd spoken to him, like she'd had an interaction with him like two days before that she was telling me.

• 14:52Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 14:52Jay Shetty?

  And it was just like, there is nowhere that you could have reset that. My, her page is a private page on social media, so you couldn't find it there. What are you experiencing? I want to know, like, almost, how are things revealed to you? Because that feels, when she was telling me that story, I was just like, that's incredible. Like, that's, that's.

• 15:12Speaker 02

  You should come to an event then.

• 15:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's.

• 15:14Speaker 02

  That's just the tip of the iceberg of like, the layers of like, what comes through.

• 15:17Jay Shetty?

  But I was just thinking, I was like, there's no way, unless you were family friends of a distant and you knew something. It's, it's a really hard thing to pull off for someone who's not.

• 15:24Speaker 02

  That's the good skeptical part. Like, that's what I want people to have, right? So I see, hear and feel energy. My abilities are clairvoyance, clearaudience and clearsentience.

• 15:33Jay Shetty?

  Explain those.

• 15:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, that translates, they're like French words. Like, clearaudience means clearhearing, clairvoyance means clearseeing, clearsentience means clearfeeling. And this is where I jokingly say there's absolutely nothing clear about it. You know, it should be like cloudyseating, cloudyhearing, cloudyfeeling. And then in this kind of like downloaded vibe, I'm basically telling you what it is that I'm seeing, hearing and feeling. And.

• 15:55Jay Shetty?

  So did you see the name, Chris? Did you hear it?

• 15:57Speaker 02

  I probably heard it. I probably heard it, right? Where it's like a download. So let me give you an example of what that means. You know, when you're reading a book or you're reading something, but your mind goes someplace else and you're thinking about something else? And then you have to go back and reread what it was? That's what it's like. So it's not an out loud voice. Nobody's yelling, Chris, you know? It's like I have two thoughts that are happening. So maybe somebody's asking me a question and while she's asking me the question, it's like, Chris, I'm like, can I ask you, like, who's, who's Chris? And in the case of a reading, it's just a lot of that. And then I put myself in the zone of receiving. And my style of reading actually changed from the University of Arizona Studies.

• 16:36Speaker 02

  Because the second time we went out there, they said, we're gonna do something called the silent sitter experience. And I'm like, okay, great. What does that mean? And they said, you're gonna sit there, they're gonna put the person behind you. And for the first 10 minutes of the reading, they're not gonna talk. And I about had colitis in that moment and I went, what do you mean they're not gonna talk? And they said, we wanna see if you can get information without the person having to say anything to you. And I remember thinking. I don't think I can do that. Like, I think I need them to validate like what's coming through. So like an athlete goes into training for a competition. Months leading up to that, all my clients, when they would come to me, I'd be like, "Hey, listen, I have to go through this like science testing.

• 17:21Speaker 02

  Can you not talk for the first ten minutes? Can you try not to say anything?" And they would be like, "Okay." And I recognized that I was already doing it. I just didn't know that I was doing it. Because I would stop people from trying to say something. Because if they gave me a bias, it might take me in the wrong direction. I'm also like by habit, and I have to stop myself from doing interviews. Like while I'm talking to somebody, I will drift over to a blank wall. Because what I do is I focus on a blank wall to see what I'm seeing in my mind's eye. So when I did my TV show Crossing Over, I didn't design this. But they came up to me and they showed me the sets. And the original set of Crossing Over had these big white sails all around the room. And I thought, "Why'd you guys put those there?" And they goes, "Oh, we thought that it looked great in these amorphous shapes."

• 18:06Speaker 02

  And I'm like, "Perfect. That's where I would focus. That's why I didn't look at the clients." So that's how information comes through. I see it, I hear it, and I feel it.

• 18:15Jay Shetty?

  And do you believe that anyone can go from cloudy to clear thinking, hearing, and seeing? Or is that something that you uniquely, obviously, the medium mentioned to you at fifteen that you had that? Could we all fine tune ourselves to that level, or is that...

• 18:31Speaker 02

  I think we can all fine tune ourselves to our level.

• 18:34Jay Shetty?

  Right.

• 18:34Speaker 02

  And there are a lot of people that, you know, with the success of Crossing Over and with the success of what I've done, I have had a lot of people like come out psychic medium. And I don't believe that they're all psychic medium. I think that they might be ridiculously psychic. And they would probably be better numerologists, tabariters, astrologers. But because they saw popularity with the word medium, they were like, "Oh, psychic medium." But they're flipping cards. "Psychic medium, but I'm doing astrology." It's like, "No, do what you do." And I come out of a healthcare background. So for me, it's like you have different specialities, right? So you have your doctors, you have your general practitioners, and then you have surgeons. So a medium is like a specialty of being a psychic. I think every person that does whatever metaphysical practice that they're doing

• 19:19Speaker 02

  is tapping into their intuition. And it gives them a framework, a boundary, something to work within. So I think everybody can do that. My goal is to get people to look at life through an energetic lens. And not to think that they need the medium, right? If you could raise your awareness to a point of paying attention to your intuition, then when you're making decisions, you're making decisions based upon not fear, but you're making decisions based on a feeling of this is good for me, or this is not good for me. And I think if most people just sit and just sit with what's happening around them, they're gonna go, wow, this feels not good. Maybe this is not a good person for me to be around. But then we talk ourselves out of that.

• 20:01Speaker 02

  No, but I've known them forever and they're, you know, and our families knew each other and blah, blah. But meanwhile, you're the one who's keeping the relationship going. That person's not doing anything for that. So I think if people sit with what they're feeling and they're true to what they're feeling, they can make better informed decisions. So I always want people to look at life through an energetic pair of glasses.

• 20:21Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, and then the next thing my producer said was that you asked her if she had any experience with suicide in her, you know, friends and family or in her life. And she's talked to me about it before. She has had someone in her life who died by suicide. And then you asked her if she had any artwork to do with that person. And she actually has tattoos on her body that are based on that relationship. And I was like, you know, that, to me, to do that over a Zoom call, I'm sharing all of this because this happened in real time. And, you know, it's not an event or just for people to get context of, of you doing this over someone that I know on my team.

• 21:04Jay Shetty?

  And I was thinking, wow, like, you know, it's, it's pretty amazing to be even to be able to do it across Zoom. How does that work?

• 21:13Speaker 02

  It's energy, right? So it's just energy. First, I have to say thank you because I can't tell you how many people I have been interviewed by, whether it be radio or television, where stuff would happen. And they would never bring something like that up. So the fact that you're doing that is just like, thank you.

• 21:28Jay Shetty?

  It's real, so I have to bring it up. It's that, you know, if I'm talking to my team and we're always having-

• 21:33Speaker 02

  That's just it, you don't have to.

• 21:34Jay Shetty?

  Oh, right, okay.

• 21:35Speaker 02

  You don't have to. And I can't tell you how many circumstances I've been in where that validation- Never happened. So gratitude, thank you. But it's energy, you know, it's just simply, simply energy. So there's somebody that I know that does healing work. His name is Charlie Goldsmith. And one of the things that I witnessed Charlie do was like, you know, a healing, a group healing, maybe over Facebook or whatever. And I was talking to my kids and I'm like, you know, it's kind of like interesting. I was like, I would think that as a healer, you would have to like, be next to the person to like, to heal them. And I see my kids look at me like, I'm like, what? And they just like, they'd like to kind of turn their head at me and they're like, do you need to be next to the person in order to connect with them? And I had that moment of

• 22:18Speaker 02

  like, oh, that should have been my answer, right? But look at me, I do what I do. And I still questioned like, the process of something, why? Because I didn't understand it. But once I put it in the frame of reference of, oh, I get it now. I get it. Okay, there it is.

• 22:35Jay Shetty?

  So before we dive into more about the process that people actually come into, and I wanted to share those examples, just because I felt that they were, like you said, but they were just so real to me. Someone that I know, someone who's producing the show, who isn't coming to you for a particular need. And for them to still have that experience was pretty powerful. How can people watch out for anyone who's misleading them, taking their money, taking advantage of them? What are the things to look out for?

• 23:03Speaker 02

  So I think that if you see somebody that is saying stuff like, you have a curse on you, that like, you know, run, you know, you pay me money, I'm gonna take off that curse, pay me money, I'll light candles for you, like all of that kind of stuff, that that's red flag, red flag. Another red flag for me is when somebody who can't actually do a reading, they may be intuitive and psychic, but they're calling themselves a medium when they're not. And they then blame the person in spirit for not coming through. Like, they'll say something like, your dad's not evolved enough in spirit, he needs more prayers. No, he doesn't. That person just couldn't make the connection. So like, I will never blame my lack of connection on the person who's passed. I'll just say, I'm sorry, I can't make the connection, which means it's a me thing.

• 23:47Speaker 02

  I was live on a Larry King night, like, you know, doing readings. And there was somebody that called up and I got nothing, like absolutely nothing on this one person. And I said, I'm so sorry, I can't make the connection with you. And we go to commercial and Larry looked at me and he's like, It's like, I might believe you more now. I went, you believe me more now because I couldn't do the reading? He said, yeah, because you could have said anything. I go, no, I couldn't. I said, I had nothing. So because I had nothing, I could not say anything. So I think we have to look at being careful that people are not just giving philosophy. And that's a big one for me. Like when someone pontificates in a reading. And I always watch.

• 24:29Jay Shetty?

  Give an example?

• 24:30Speaker 02

  When somebody will not kind of feel like they're getting information, but then they get something, right? Hypothetically. And then there's a story that's built around it. Right? So if you know that the person's past, right? If it's a mother, it's a dad, it's whatever. There's personality traits. There's relationship dynamics that you may want to hear. Your mom wants you to know that she loves you and she's standing with you. And it's, it's swirly and it's flowery and it's, it's ornate.

• 25:02Jay Shetty?

  And everyone wants to hear it.

• 25:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:04Jay Shetty?

  Generally.

• 25:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, they, they, they definitely want to hear that. And, and I'll say that, but I'm going to say it differently. I'm going to be like, just so you know that they're okay. And they're coming through from a, from a place of love. Now, I have symbols. If I see pink roses, I know that they want me to express love. If I see pink roses with thorns on it, I know that they want me to express love, but they also want me to say in life, they couldn't do it. Can't hold the flowers, right? They're, they're thorny. So I don't like when people give philosophy as information. I don't like when people, you know, go for the low hanging fruit. Who here has the, you know, butterfly connection? Like all of those types of things. I, I, I think you need to be careful about things like that. If they're asking you for any type of like questions. Like I was watching something on, online one day.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  And the person said, in, in order for me to make the connection with you, I need you to tell me the relationship of the person who's passed, the name of the person who's passed, the date that the person's passed, and how they passed. And I about levitated out of my chair. I was like, wha- then what are you doing? Right? So if I'm doing a radio show, if I'm doing a call in, I might say to the person, hey, how can I help you? Do you have a question? And they may say, I'd like to try to connect my dad. That's it. And then I'm going to say, okay, I may not get your dad, but pay attention to everything that's coming through. And then I feel like my job is to interview who's coming through. Who are you? How did you pass? When did you pass? Any pertinent dates? And then ultimately, I'm looking for the why now. Right?

• 26:31Speaker 02

  So at the intersection of. You, me and the universe, why now? Why today? And what is that nugget that I have to mine for? That I'm gonna help them with? That's what I'm looking for in a session. Whether I'm in front of people or if I'm in a one on one.

• 26:46Jay Shetty?

  How did you, the first time you did this, feel? Because you're in that reading yourself at fifteen years old. How did you even end up there in the first place?

• 26:54Speaker 02

  Doing the-

• 26:54Jay Shetty?

  The reading that was done on you, that you heard, that you got the message.

• 26:57Speaker 02

  So my Italian side of the family, my grandmother, my mom, had psychics come to the house all the time. My dad was a New York City police officer, not a fan of the subject matter. Made sure that I was never around it growing up. Uh, my mom and dad divorced, moved into my grandmother's house. Paranormal hub of activity. And for about three years, when they would do stuff like that, I used to make fun of the people. You know, I would, you know, jokingly, I remember one guy that was a, a card reader that they had. And after like three people came out, the third or fourth person came out and I went, wait, let me guess. You're going to Florida. And the person went, yes, he said I'm going to Florida. How did you know that? I'm like, because you live in New York. Like, New Yorkers go to Florida and Aruba. Like, why is nobody going to Kansas? Right? So the reality was I was that person.

• 27:42Speaker 02

  So when I say I understand skepticism. But after I had that first reading, I went to debunk her. And I went to debunk her because my grandmother came out of the room crying. She made my grandmother upset. And I was like, what did this woman say to you? Very protective of my grandmother. And um, she said, no, she told me that Tony was with me. And then I felt bad. Cause I'm like, grandma, you were, Tony was my grandfather, Anthony. I was like, you were introduced as Mrs. Esposito.

• 28:12Speaker 02

  It's not a big stretch. It's gonna be an Anthony or a Tony in your family, no? And to my grandmother's credit, she said, if you don't believe that your grandfather, who loved me more than life itself, is still with me, that's like a you problem, not a me problem. And then she said, how would she know this? And then she proceeded to tell me things that apparently were true, that I did not know, having to do with my grandfather. So I didn't leave it there. Here's what I did. I went to the list of people that were in the room that this woman read before my grandmother to see who could, her name was Lydia Clark, who could Lydia have extrapolated that information from? And then given it to the oldest person in the room? None. There was nobody that that woman read before. So then my cousin went, my cousin's thirteen years older than I am.

• 28:58Speaker 02

  But she looked like she was the same age. And she came out and she was like, oh, my God. And I'm like, come on, bro, not you too. And she's like, you have to go, like, you have to go. She's like, I'll pay for you to go. And I looked at my mother like, could I go? And she said, you can go, but you better treat her with respect. And I said, oh, I'll treat her with respect. I'm just not gonna help her like the rest of you. So I went in armed with my like, attitude. And she said, can I have your high school ring? And I went, sure. I took off my ring and I handed it to her. And she went like this, did not look at me and then proceeded to give me information. That kind of sound, honestly, sounded batshit crazy. I mean, she literally said to me, you have highly evolved beings of white and gold light that are ready to work with you. And I'm here to put you on your path.

• 29:41Speaker 02

  And I, I remember like the way that she said it with such conviction. I'm like, oh, so she's crazy. Like, this is like, this is crazy. So I was like, okay. And then like part two of the reading made sense, but yet it didn't. But it did make sense. So she was two for two. And then the last part was where she just like rocked my world, like flipped me upside down. I was like, whoa, like, there's no way that she would know this. That set me on my path. And then from like 1985 to 1987, my readings were just what's happening now, what's coming up for a person. I had no interest in dead people. In 1987, my uncle died. That shifted my perspective. And I always tell people that when you have a perspective shift, that's where lessons come in. If you're open.

• 30:25Speaker 02

  I was open. And it was the first time I saw what grief does to a family. And then unfortunately, a year and a half to two years later, my mom was diagnosed with cancer. And then my world was just rocked. And that was a catalyst for me. That was a huge catalyst. And um, it changed everything because then it, then I was the client.

• 30:44Jay Shetty?

  Is that how you first used? The process was for yourself?

• 30:48Speaker 02

  I think before that. So from like 1987 to 1989, when a client came in to see me, I would apologize to them and say, hey, I know you're here because you want to talk about like relationship stuff and job stuff and like life. I go, but I'm also a medium. And so I'm gonna have to get that out of the way in the beginning. Is that okay? And people would look at me and go like, sure. And then I would do the first part of the reading where whoever's gonna come through is gonna come through. And then I got into what I thought was the real part, you know? Their life, like why they were here and how I can help them. And then I had this one woman where her dad, he was just loud. Like he just, and it was going, the session was like fifty, sixty percent over. And there was no letting up. Papa was not stopping. And then I looked at the woman, I remember saying, I am so sorry.

• 31:32Speaker 02

  I go, but I, I, I, I can't get into other stuff. I said, your dad's like legitimately like not stopping. And I, I say this often, it was the way she touched my hand. She leaned over and she touched my hand and said, it's okay. It's my dad. And I like looked at her, I was like, so you're okay spending your entire session with me just talking to your dad? Who's crossed? And she went, yeah. And that was like my first kind of like, oh, I didn't think people really like had an interest in that.

• 32:04Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 32:04Speaker 02

  And then I learned why people had an interest in that when my mom passed. So every reading I did for somebody else, I was kind of like doing for myself. It was reinforcing, you know, reading strangers. It was like, okay, well, if their mom was with them, then my mom was with me. And that's what really helped me with my grief. People always say like, you know, what helped you deal with your grief? I was like doing readings, just seeing the constant reinforcement, the validation, these people's reactions.

• 32:39Jay Shetty?

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• 33:22Jay Shetty?

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• 34:04Jay Shetty?

  Cards issued by JP Morgan Chase Bank, N A Member FDIC. Subject to credit approval, terms apply. This episode is brought to you by Mazda. The best habits are the ones we hardly notice, the ones that quietly shape the way we move through life, giving us the confidence to focus on what really matters. That's Mazda's approach to safety. Every Mazda is designed with proactive safety features that help keep you more aware, more connected and more engaged with your drive, so you can stay present behind the wheel. That commitment has earned Mazda recognition as Consumer Reports' safest new car brand. And as of July 2026, Mazda has won more 2026 IIHS Top Safety Pick Plus awards than any other car brand.

• 34:48Jay Shetty?

  Visit www.iihs.org to learn more. A lot can happen when an accident doesn't. Mazda, more of what matters to you. Visit MazdaUSA.com to learn more. Consumer Reports does not endorse products or services.

• 35:13Jay Shetty?

  At what point in their grief does someone have to come to really be open to it? Because everyone's going to miss someone they love. Most people are sad when they lose someone that they were close to, especially a mother, father, or grandmother, or whoever it may be, a best friend. At what point do they really need what you have to offer? Is it because it's been too long and they can't move on? Is it because they really feel that? Because I'm just trying to understand like what? I've lost people, but and this is just who I am. So it's I I've just I'm very at peace with the closest people I've lost in my life.

• 35:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 35:49Jay Shetty?

  And I feel like I still communicate with them, even not in a not in your way or in any direct way of listening that I'm not a social medium at all. Uh, or I don't believe I have those abilities, but I feel a connection to people in my own way.

• 36:03Speaker 02

  Right.

• 36:03Jay Shetty?

  So I'm at peace with that. So I guess I'm trying to understand what drives someone. And and at what point do they really that? Do they value and need what you have to offer?

• 36:12Speaker 02

  I think it depends upon the person.

• 36:14Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  But if I could just say, generally speaking, I don't think anybody needs a reading.

• 36:18Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 36:19Speaker 02

  And I think that's kind of maybe shocking to hear me say that when this is what I do for a living. But I've been saying that since I'm sixteen, like, I don't think anybody needs a reading.

• 36:29Jay Shetty?

  You know if you need one.

• 36:30Speaker 02

  I think they need an understanding. So I've always seen myself as being the teacher or the educator. And a reading can support what you believe or know, right? And that's important. But I think if we can get people to be fifty percent of the equation when someone passes and you are legit, still communicating with them, you're incorporating them in your lives. Like, I love the movie Coco for that purpose, right? It's like you're not forgetting the person, you're including them. I include my family and friends that have crossed in my daily lives. Like, I keep their presence very much with me because I talk about them. That doesn't mean that I'm in channel with them. I'm not I'm not having conversations, but I kind of am, right?

• 37:14Speaker 02

  So like, what what really is social media, right? When you do social media, people are posting their lives out there for the people that follow them to see it.

• 37:23Jay Shetty?

  Mm hmm.

• 37:24Speaker 02

  Your photos, your whatever you're doing, you're putting that out there. So you may not send it as a text to someone, but you're putting it out there for those to watch. We're living our lives and they're watching. So we're like the social media for them. We're like the reality show for them, actually. But they may or may not like your photo, but they may come through to you in a dream. They may come through that song on the radio, that scent or smell, that dragonfly, hummingbird, butterfly, penny, whatever those things are that is your pattern, all real, by the way. But I don't think anybody needs a reading. They need an understanding.

• 37:55Jay Shetty?

  Hmm. So let's say someone walks in to your space.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 38:00Jay Shetty?

  And they say, I've lost my dad, my mom, you know, some apparent. How does that walk me through the process?

• 38:07Speaker 02

  Sure. So if if I'm doing a one on one reading, or if I'm standing in front of a crowd of people.

• 38:12Jay Shetty?

  Let's do one on one.

• 38:13Speaker 02

  Yeah. So in a one on one session, and even in a crowd, nobody's saying anything to me. I'm going to sit with you. I'm going to tell you exactly what I'm seeing, what I'm hearing, and what I'm feeling. Sometimes if I'm in person, I'm going to do psychometry, where I'm going to ask to hold on to an object of yours. So I could tune into you. Just think key unlocked your energy. And I'll make sure that that object is only yours and yours alone, and that it's not related to anybody who's passed. Because I don't want to pick up their energy and read the energy and not make the connection. And then the first part of what I'm going to do is I'm going to look for where you're at in your life right now. And I may do that with numerology. I may like look at your personal year. And kind of see what what the lesson is, because that'll give me a frame framework for you. And then pass that.

• 38:50Jay Shetty?

  What does that mean? What's that?

• 38:51Speaker 02

  So.

• 38:52Jay Shetty?

  That's not yeah.

• 38:52Speaker 02

  So in numerology, there's a lot you can do, right? So every letter has a correlation to a number. And there are certain things that you can do numerologically. When I say you can do an entire chart with numbers, your birth name, your birth date. I have found for me, I like two things. I like a personals personal year, which is a yearly vibrational pattern that goes from birthday to birthday. And your life path, which is kind of like the number that you are, right? So like I'm a life path nine, which means I'm a life of service.

• 39:23Jay Shetty?

  How does someone know that?

• 39:24Speaker 02

  So the the life path, you would take your birth date, like the number, and add it all across. Right? So you take like if.

• 39:31Jay Shetty?

  I'm seven.

• 39:33Speaker 02

  Do you mind telling you, what's your birthday?

• 39:34Jay Shetty?

  Nineteen eighty seven. Oh, but you're taking the full.

• 39:36Speaker 02

  You have to take the month plus the date.

• 39:38Jay Shetty?

  Oh, so my month is September, so zero nine.

• 39:41Speaker 02

  Right, so that's nine.

• 39:42Jay Shetty?

  And then zero six, that's fifteen, and then nineteen eighty seven is the year I'm born.

• 39:48Speaker 02

  I think you were four, if I did the math correctly.

• 39:50Jay Shetty?

  We're just adding them all up?

• 39:52Speaker 02

  Add everything straight across.

• 39:52Jay Shetty?

  Okay, so it's fifteen, sixteen, uh, twenty-five, thirty-three, forty-four. Yeah, I'm a four.

• 40:02Speaker 02

  So you had everything.

• 40:03Jay Shetty?

  Forty, yeah.

• 40:03Speaker 02

  You keep getting it all together for your four.

• 40:05Jay Shetty?

  Four, yeah.

• 40:05Speaker 02

  So your life path is one of always laying the foundation groundwork for the future, working hard, communication and progress. Like, that's, that's who you are, no matter where you go. Whether you were a chef, doing what you're doing, or a politician, like, that's gonna be your life path. For me, no matter what I did, I'm gonna be a life path nine. For me, part of a life path nine is learning your lessons through letting go and loss. Perfect for my field, right? Because what I do, I work with people who are dealing with loss.

• 40:32Jay Shetty?

  How many life paths are there? How many?

• 40:33Speaker 02

  Nine.

• 40:33Jay Shetty?

  Nines?

• 40:34Speaker 02

  There's basically nine, and then you can count eleven, twenty-two, and thirty-three as, as master numbers.

• 40:38Jay Shetty?

  Could you tell me what the different ones do? So if someone's a life path, one, two, three?

• 40:42Speaker 02

  A numerologist could do that better.

• 40:44Jay Shetty?

  Right, right, right, got it.

• 40:45Speaker 02

  Then it can better, I mean, I, cursory, like, I can give you, like, you know, um, like, you know.

• 40:50Jay Shetty?

  No, no, no, that's fine, that's fine.

• 40:50Speaker 02

  Ones are working on, you know, the independence, and it's a life path of individualization, but there's, there's, there's specific people that, that's kind of like their specialty.

• 40:59Jay Shetty?

  We'll get one of them on, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 41:00Speaker 02

  But what I do like about a personal year in a reading is it gives me, like, okay, where are your lessons coming in? So if I know that somebody's going into a life path, I'm sorry, going into a personal year, that's a five, that's a big transformational year. Fives are about change, adaptation and transformation. So that lets me know, like, so now if I'm reading for somebody and I see that, if I see the energy of change, I now know, time-wise, it's probably gonna be within this window. So I like that. So that'll be the first part of the reading. And then the rest is gonna be like, who's coming through? And then.

• 41:32Jay Shetty?

  When you say who's coming through, are you like, closing your eyes? Are you holding their hand? Are you holding the object? Like, just walk me through the visual of that.

• 41:39Speaker 02

  The vision would be me on a headset, over the phone, uh, probably doodling on a piece of paper, and.

• 41:48Speaker 02

  Kind of focusing on what I'm seeing, hearing and feeling. And then I do treat it like an interview. So if I feel an energy coming in, I would say, okay, this feels to me like an older figure. Why do I do that? So I'll talk about people being above you to the side and below. Above you just means older. Below you just means younger. And then to your side would be a contemporary. Husband, wife, brother, sister, cousin, friend. So instead of going, I feel a man's energy. I try to place where I'm feeling it. Where do I think they go? And then I want to know what their relationship is. So I want to feel that. Then I want to know any important dates that are connected. Any initials or names that are connected. When they give me names, it's their way of telling me who they are, who they're with, or somebody who's here. And then it's just anchoring myself. And then I like to validate the validations. So I like to give something else that supports that.

• 42:33Speaker 02

  And the reason why I do that is it gives me the opportunity to build up a trust with who's coming through for when they give me something that the client doesn't understand. So then I know that I've now created some type of control in the environment that any variables that they don't understand, I can trust.

• 42:49Jay Shetty?

  How do you stop yourself from predicting, projecting, or connecting in a more logical, rational sense that we all would do?

• 42:58Speaker 02

  I think there's a little bit in there.

• 43:00Jay Shetty?

  Okay.

• 43:00Speaker 02

  I think there is a little bit in there where I have to go like, okay, I'm seeing this. This is what it makes me feel like.

• 43:06Jay Shetty?

  Right.

• 43:07Speaker 02

  And then I give that to the person.

• 43:08Jay Shetty?

  Like when you're interpreting the rose and the thorns, is that your interpretation?

• 43:13Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 43:14Jay Shetty?

  Or is that something that they get to?

• 43:15Speaker 02

  Right, so if I teach somebody how to read tarot, right, there's 78 cards in a deck. Before I have them read a book on it, or even the little pamphlet that comes, I want them to sit with that deck and create their own notebook, card by card, and write down what they think that card means. Because when they looked at it, it gave them a feeling. So they have to pay attention to that before you learn what the cards actually mean. So then you have like, kind of a dual.

• 43:42Jay Shetty?

  How much self-awareness does that require on their part, too?

• 43:44Speaker 02

  A lot.

• 43:45Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's the challenge, isn't it?

• 43:46Speaker 02

  A lot. And getting, getting out of your way. And, and there've been a lot of moments where, like, you get information and the person says, no. But the information doesn't change. Because if you do have that person, and that person is coming through. And the client says, no, I'm gonna go with what they're showing me. Cause what I'm hearing from the person is, no, that's not who I want. No, I don't have to think about that. But what they don't realize is that sometimes behind the person that they don't want to hear from is the person that they do want to hear from. And in my style, I am a little bit like a dog with a bone. I don't give it up because I feel like my job is to make sure that I say everything that I'm seeing, hearing and feeling. Because sometimes the biggest validation happens outside of the reading.

• 44:28Speaker 02

  When they go home, when they go home, when they talk to their family and they find out, oh yeah, we, we did have that, but we didn't talk about it. Nobody talked about that. It happens a lot.

• 44:38Jay Shetty?

  Do people often have people turn up in their readings that they don't know? Or is it generally people that you know?

• 44:46Speaker 02

  Most of the time it's gonna be.

• 44:47Jay Shetty?

  People that you know, yeah, that would make sense. No, I was just wondering.

• 44:49Speaker 02

  Most of the time, but there are moments where like there are connections that come in. And then the person will know about it until like they talk to somebody like, one of my favorite stories is I had a Saturday afternoon reading. It's my last reading of the day. Wonderful woman, sat down and I'm bombarding her with information. Like it was very clear to me. And she's like, yeah, I know how this works. She's like, so um, I'll go in your waiting room and then whoever's out there that this is for, we'll let them come in. And I looked at her, I was like, there's nobody in my waiting room. And she's like, well, there has to be. She's like, cause none of this is my family. She's like, so you know, um, I get what you do. I'm open. This is not for me. And I was like, it's kind of gotta be for you. I said, cause you're the, you're the only one here.

• 45:34Speaker 02

  And she's like, well, it's not like that. And I said, can I ask you what you do for a living? And she goes, me? She's like, I'm a, I'm a grief therapist. I was like, okay. And that's all I said. And she just went, oh my God. You just brought through my last five clients. So she had five clients that she saw that day. I brought through the people that her clients were coming to see. And she looked at me and said, What do I do with this? She's like, because they're not coming to me for mediumship. I was like, you are the psychiatrist or the psychologist. I go, you're gonna have to figure out how to do that on your end. I said, but these are the validations I came through. So she wound up working, I believe she wound up working that into a, you know, hey, I had this experience. Are you open to the world of energy?

• 46:18Speaker 02

  Is this something that you have ever considered? And it wasn't to get me clearly clients because there was no need now. The information came through in that way. So I like those moments because those are validations that happen after the fact.

• 46:30Jay Shetty?

  Where do you believe these people who have passed on exist? Because so there's, you know, I assume there's, there's a spiritual or religious version to what happens after death. And then there's the material world version of what happens after death. Like in my tradition, karma and reincarnation are really prominent belief sets in the idea that people are taking birth as, could be animals, could be people, could be, you know, regenerating.

• 46:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 47:00Jay Shetty?

  And, and there's lots of eastern.

• 47:01Speaker 02

  In my belief system as well.

• 47:02Jay Shetty?

  Right.

• 47:03Speaker 02

  Maybe not so much into the, the animals of it, but for the consciousness to keep coming back here to the classroom of life.

• 47:10Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 47:10Speaker 02

  And that probably is the thing that freaked me out the most when my mom passed. Because I was 19 and I'm like, if I live to be 90 years old, when I cross over, I want to see her. I don't want to get there and have somebody say to me like, you know, you missed her, she's in Jersey now. Like, you know, that was like a concern for me.

• 47:27Jay Shetty?

  And she doesn't look like that anymore.

• 47:28Speaker 02

  Right.

• 47:28Jay Shetty?

  From a reincarnation.

• 47:29Speaker 02

  She's not that energy. So I, I've talked to people who do the reincarnation, past life aggression, like therapy stuff. Because I was like, go to the specialist, get the information, find the data. And the way they explained it to me is that if the entirety of the consciousness is not necessary to incarnate, then you could still make your connection with the oversoul, the, the bigger super consciousness, even though there might be multiple lifetimes that that person is still working through. I'm like, I can work with that. That, that made me feel, um, that made me feel confident that I'll see her again.

• 47:58Jay Shetty?

  You're saying that there's a space between which that person is reincarnated or not is where you're getting them. And so if they've already fully reincarnated as a new being, you can't.

• 48:09Speaker 02

  No, I'm saying that I don't think that we, I don't believe that we fully. reincarnate, like in the entirety.

• 48:15Jay Shetty?

  Oh.

• 48:15Speaker 02

  So like if we take this glass of water, the amount of water, if this whole thing is consciousness, our soul.

• 48:22Jay Shetty?

  Mm hmm.

• 48:22Speaker 02

  A portion of this might have multiple incarnations.

• 48:25Jay Shetty?

  Yes, yes.

• 48:26Speaker 02

  At different periods of time simultaneously.

• 48:29Jay Shetty?

  Oh, simultaneously.

• 48:30Speaker 02

  Simultaneously over decades around the globe. You know, and this is where I say to people.

• 48:35Jay Shetty?

  Do you mean simultaneously, i.e. like the multiverse, like having multiple versions of the same person? Or that that consciousness is passed through multiple bodies over?

• 48:43Speaker 02

  That.

• 48:43Jay Shetty?

  Yes, right, okay, fine.

• 48:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, that. And at at different times, right? So.

• 48:48Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, eastern traditions would believe that the consciousness is what remains the same. And that same consciousness passes through from the body that looks like me today to whichever body I end up in my next life, to whichever body I had in my past life. But it's the same consciousness that has lived in all those bodies.

• 49:04Speaker 02

  Right.

• 49:05Jay Shetty?

  Which has had multiple mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters and.

• 49:07Speaker 02

  And you've been in the same maybe family tapestry.

• 49:09Jay Shetty?

  Potentially.

• 49:10Speaker 02

  Just in different, different roles or or or connections.

• 49:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 49:13Speaker 02

  But going back to the like, where are they? I equate it to the internet. When people ask me that question, I go, where's the internet? And they get quiet and I go, you can't go there with a physical body, but you can access it. So you can access this dimension.

• 49:29Jay Shetty?

  Mm hmm.

• 49:29Speaker 02

  So it's like the internet. It's it's it's a dimension that you can access and you can connect with and you can communicate with and to and through.

• 49:37Jay Shetty?

  But often that you're saying that you're not interacting with them in their new form. You're interacting with them at the consciousness level. Which has lived all of these forms.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 49:45Jay Shetty?

  And you're just connecting them to the current person or.

• 49:48Speaker 02

  Right, so.

• 49:50Jay Shetty?

  Experience of that.

• 49:50Speaker 02

  To give it as a different analogy, it's like if you take a famous actor, you know, that actor's had so many movies.

• 49:57Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 49:57Speaker 02

  And so many different roles, but at the core, they're the actor.

• 50:00Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 50:01Speaker 02

  With different character names and different backstories and.

• 50:04Jay Shetty?

  That's a great analogy, I like that.

• 50:05Speaker 02

  That's how I look at it.

• 50:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, right. So you're connecting to Tom Cruise from the first Top Gun.

• 50:09Speaker 02

  That's exactly the analogy I was thinking in my head.

• 50:11Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, not Tom Cruise from the recent.

• 50:13Speaker 02

  Cocktail, right.

• 50:15Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, or anything else, yeah. That that's interesting to hear, yeah, that's, I've never heard it explained that way. And yeah, karma reincarnation has been something that's always fascinated me. And Ian Stevenson's book, Old Souls, was always a beautiful scientific exploration of it, I felt.

• 50:31Speaker 02

  And Dr. Brian Weiss, when you look at Many Lives, Many Masters and all all of his materials, he was very influential for me, you know, at at that point in my life because. I needed to know, like, you know, if I, cause I, I had a very early experience where I was taking on a cruise as a kid. And Puerto Rico was the first stop and walking through old San Juan. I became kind of paralyzed in the middle of one of the streets. And the person I was with kept walking, my aunt, and she came back and she looked at me and she said, what's up? And I went, I was here before, but I wasn't John. Like at 12, I said that. You know, get that perplexed, look like you haven't left New York, what are you talking about? And I was like, no, there's something at the end of this block with birds and nuns.

• 51:17Speaker 02

  And at the end of the block, there was like remnants of a building that had a plaque that said, you know, a miracle happened there. And it was next to something that said, Park at the Palomas. A 12 year old was like, help, like, why do I, like, why do I know this? Like, what does that mean? And for three years, I really suppressed that until I had that reading. And then when I had that reading and that sent me down the spiral of studying, somebody talked about reincarnation. You know, you're raised Catholic, reincarnation is not an option for you if you're Catholic. Like that, that is not something that you, they discuss in, you know, religious CCD. But now here, this, you know, book I'm reading is talking about different philosophies and reincarnation is one of them. And right next to that was something called past life recall.

• 51:55Speaker 02

  And past life recall would be where you had the exact experience that I did, which was you're in a place that you have never, ever been before. And you know it. And add in the phrase, but I wasn't John. Just kind of like, was like, oh my God, wow, this, I had that. So I kind of feel like when people do a deep dive into the world of energy or spirituality, they'll have those same awakenings. The important part about it is to keep the ego out of it. Because the ego gets in the way of your progress. Need a little bit of it to kind of like go like, okay. But soon as the, soon as the ego self. And this world, marry, the lessons stop. And I think we have to continue to be, I'm forty years in this year. I'm still a student of the universe.

• 52:40Speaker 02

  I still wanna be better. I'm still evolving into like who I'm supposed to be. Cause I'm still here in this body, which means I'm still learning.

• 52:48Jay Shetty?

  For someone who feels like the process feels spooky, or we've seen too many exorcist movies, or you know, whatever it is, it's like that. I think the visual that you have is from movies because you've never seen it.

• 52:59Speaker 02

  The stereotype.

• 53:00Jay Shetty?

  In real life, and so you have this stereotype version of like, God, you're letting spirits back in and like, they're coming to visit you and you know that, how much of that is real, true? How does that, how does that fit in the world?

• 53:11Speaker 02

  Well, I think we, we have two motivations in life, right? Fear or love? So if we're coming from the place of love, then we understand that where there's love, there's connection. It's fine. When we're coming from the place of fear, that means that we're allowing some religious dogma to get in the way. You know, when somebody wants to throw the Bible out and start, you know, quoting Bible based, Bible verses and all that kind of stuff, save it. Like, I'm gonna be like, I'm not gonna do that with you. There's a lot of stuff that's written in the good book where it's just ridiculous and preposterous. And people argue over it and bad things happen as a result, right? So for me, it's energetic based. I feel like I'm painting a portrait of energy and how somebody frames that portrait. Is there religious upbringing or not? But I'm, I see this as being more scientific and energy based.

• 53:55Speaker 02

  And that's not scary for me, that's educational. So I feel like I lean into the education, I lean into the empowerment. I lead into helping to enlighten people in their, on their path, like wherever I'm, wherever I'm meeting them. If I'm meeting them here today for the first time, I'm hoping that this is sparking something in them where they're going like, oh, I should, I should meditate, yes, yes, you should meditate. Oh, I should learn about, you know, my numerology. Yes, that has nothing to do with me, that has to do with them. Like they, multiple books that people can go do. So I feel like part of my job is to raise awareness and teach. And wherever I meet that person, helping them on their journey of grief, that's my job.

• 54:32Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I appreciate what you said at the start, which was this idea of we usually come to this process, wanting to check if the person's okay. But it actually becomes about the person who's checking to become healed and grow. Talk to me about grief and where we almost miss out on the growth, or how we don't process it well.

• 54:53Speaker 02

  We could be here for hours on that one. Let's start with, let's say, somebody who is diagnosed and they're terminal, right? Many times, families will not tell the person that they're terminal, because that would just be too hard for them. The soul knows they're leaving. The consciousness knows it's going to be passing. So now we're just going to, what, wait a month, three months, six months, until that person leaves the physical world? And nothing gets said. Nothing gets talked about. Nothing's communicated. And I think we rob that person, that individual, as well as ourselves, the opportunity to say the things that maybe you want to hear, or need to hear, or need to say, or they need to say. So I think, starting from a place of, where does grief really begin?

• 55:36Speaker 02

  It comes in with the understanding that something's ending. Right? So you can grieve the ending of high school. You can grieve the ending of college. You can grieve the ending of your job. There's no death in that. You can grieve the ending of a relationship. The ending of a friendship. So grief is grief in various different ways. But when we're talking about not acknowledging that grief, that's the problem. So I think we have to start with acknowledging the grief, and then expressing it, not suppressing it. So say the things that you need to say to the people while they're here, and give them the opportunity to say it back. Because so many people sit in front of me with that look of, did they know that I love them? I don't know. Did you tell them? You know, tell them, say the things, you know? Have those conversations.

• 56:19Speaker 02

  If you know somebody's passing, and they're not going to be here in 10 years, but you're getting, you know, you're going to get married in five years. Ask them what they want to know about your wedding. Have that conversation. I think it's not morbid, or morose, or maudlin. I think it's healthy to talk about grief.

• 56:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, and it's almost, have you ever had anyone, almost when you're reading, where they go back and go, yeah, you never told me how much you loved me? Like, can I get?

• 56:44Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. Oh, oh my God. Oh, yeah. Yes, very much so. Or the release of something. Like, they're hearing something in the reading. I remember reading for someone. She was 70 years old. And her stepdad came through, and the message was, it's not your fault. Like, his passing was not her fault. And she had had an argument with him, and went to high school. And he took his own life. And she lived with that for fifty years, sixty years, whoever old she was, feeling like it was her responsibility. Her whole life she lived with that. So, you know, that's a, that's an extreme example.

• 57:25Speaker 02

  But I think there were a lot of people that just need to have the reinforced understanding, right? So I want everybody to, to, to do it now, like say the things now. So that if you, you know, I have, I have a thing with my kids, right? When they were younger, I would say to them, in case I get abducted by aliens. And they would laugh. But then that usually was followed up with a really heavy conversation. So I couched it in a way that they would participate in it. And, um, you know, I think my son was twelve, we were on a walk. And he goes, Daddy, I get the whole like psychic thing. He goes, but what age did you become obsessed with alien abduction? And I was like, I'm not. And he's like, hmm, you kind of are. And I'm like, no, dude, I'm really not like, why are you saying that? He goes, well, you always say in case I get abducted by aliens. So I laughed, I was like, well, I think you're old enough to understand this.

• 58:10Speaker 02

  I go, just, I go, I mean, if I'm no longer existing on this dimension and I'm now existing on a different dimension, I'd want you to know the things that we talked about. He goes, do you mean like in case you died? I went, yes. He goes, well, that's not funny. I go, not meant to be funny, meant to be a conversation starter. So for your listeners, your viewers, use that phrase. Watch the people's reactions, they'll laugh. But then you, you're ice breaking, you're, you're literally kind of setting up the opportunity to have a conversation that might be serious.

• 58:38Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What I, I love that. I, I really love that. And I think it's so important to be able to normalize some of these conversations because it's so much harder to change afterwards. And I think part of my piece is because I've always lived in a way to say how I feel in the moment and

• 58:54Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 58:55Jay Shetty?

  Say what I believe and make sure people know how loved they are. And even if they didn't know how to reciprocate or respond to it in the moment, I was always happy to express how I felt because I just never wanted to feel that way.

• 59:07Speaker 02

  You want to hear a really kind of, kind of cool, but somewhat unique thing that happens?

• 59:12Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 59:13Speaker 02

  So I could be reading for somebody and I could bring mom and dad through. I could bring their husband through. I could bring their grandmother through. I could bring their friends through. The moment I bring in their pet, the moment their dog comes up. Their cat comes through. That's the moment where they're going to lose it. They're going to absolutely lose it. And sometimes in a really, really big way. And I'll, you know, I'll kind of make a little like joke and be like, wow, look at that. Like all your family right now is going, the dog rates more than I do, right? But here's the thing. What does that dog do to that person? Unconditional love. That pet shows you unconditional love. It's a reciprocal energy. You love it, it loves you. There's nothing that gets in the way of that.

• 59:57Speaker 02

  So I use it as a teaching tool when it happens and say, listen, look at what took place. It's about connection. It's about communication. So I always want people to say the things, you know, if you're leaving the house, I don't care you're in a rush. Let the people that you're leaving know how you feel about them. Because what if you don't come home?

• 1:00:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What about when people have had really poor experiences with people? And so they're coming to you because there's trauma. There may have been emotional or other types of abuse. There may have been, people have just had painful experiences with this person, but they love them too. It's messy, right? Like that's what, that's what love is. It's not, oh, I loved them, I missed them. It could be complicated. And I imagine if they're coming to you, there's some, there's some layers to their love that need to be explored. How do you help them and guide them through this already difficult process? But with the emotions that could come back of like, yeah, you didn't tell me you loved me. We, I treated you that way because of X or whatever it may be. Like, how, how does that work? What does that look like?

• 1:00:57Speaker 02

  So one, again, for people who are listening, I want to establish that everything that comes through is going to come through in pieces and it's not conversational. It'll come across in pieces and I will symbolically interpret what that is. That's number one. Once I go down that path of helping them to understand and establish what's coming through, and I know it's being validated by like the way I validate stuff. It is not always easy when you are hearing from someone who's crossed that was in that exact relationship dynamic. But oftentimes, the person that's coming through is coming through to assuage that feeling of guilt or disappointment or anger to help them. The hard part about that is that as the medium, you kind of feel like you now represent that person, so you could feel that coming back at you.

• 1:01:41Speaker 02

  So I'm not a therapist, and I will say, I don't know if you work with a therapist, but maybe you may want to have a conversation with someone that can help you move through this.

• 1:01:50Jay Shetty?

  Right, so you actually encourage them to meet experts in particular things.

• 1:01:54Speaker 02

  Oh, God, yeah. I think a lot of my, a lot of, I mean, I've had, I've had moments where I sit with someone for about five minutes, and I'm very clear. I go, do you trust me? And they go, of course, I trust you. That's why I'm here. And I'm like, I'm, I'm, I'm supposed to get you someplace else. What you're looking for is not me. And they're like, what do you mean? I'm like, you need to work with an astrologer.

• 1:02:17Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:17Speaker 02

  Where you're at, I can't help you. I could read you, but it's not going to help you, and I think it's going to be a waste of your time and money. So how about we save your money? And let's just have a chat. And I'll usually spend the time with them anyway. And then I find the astrologer that I think that they're supposed to work with. And I always trust that.

• 1:02:35Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What do you think grief teaches us about love?

• 1:02:38Speaker 02

  Grief is the other side of love. And if, I used to work in a hospital, and when people would have open heart surgery, they're given, you know, the, the heart pillow that you're supposed to hold on to. So if you cough or sneeze, that you don't affect your, you know, your scars in the, in the surgery. And I always imagined that heart pillow. One says love, and the other side says grief. And I think throughout our lives, we're holding the love side close. But when we lose a person, it flips to grief. And I think honoring our grief, honoring our feelings, not ignoring them, gets us back to the other side of that pillow, which is the other side of grief, and that's love. So I think grief teaches us about love and appreciation and communication. And that's the goal.

• 1:03:29Jay Shetty?

  This episode is brought to you by Amtrak. You know that feeling when you're already tired and you haven't even gotten there yet? That's where Amtrak comes in. Leave the driving behind and settle into a comfortable seat with plenty of room to stretch out. Catch up on work with wifi, grab a snack at the cafe car, or just sit back and enjoy your favourite podcast. Choose a seller or North East Regional and get there without the stress of getting there. Visit amtrak.com to plan your next trip. This episode is brought to you by Vinted. Value can be found anywhere, even in the clothes sitting untouched in our closets. That's where Vinted comes in. Vinted is a second-hand marketplace app where you can sell clothes you no longer want and

• 1:04:13Jay Shetty?

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• 1:05:29Jay Shetty?

  What do you say to someone who just feels like they'll never experience joy again?

• 1:05:34Speaker 02

  I like to validate their feelings and say that you won't feel the kind of joy that you had before. But you can find joy in different ways and take them on that journey with them. So it's not just the absence physically, but that you still have the connection with them. I can never remember, I never remember what it's called, but there's Japanese art where when things get broken.

• 1:05:57Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, ketsu ga.

• 1:05:58Speaker 02

  Yes, and they put it back together and it's got the golden glue. It actually highlights the cracks. I feel like grief is highlighting the cracks. We put ourselves back together because we have to, but we're never seen the same way again. How, how, how could you, you know? My son's middle name is after two boys that have passed, both named Michael. And one of the, one of the boys, he's a boy's man, he was a firefighter in nine 11, Michael Kiefer. And uh, his mom, when I read for her, she's a powerhouse of a lady, she's a powerhouse of a mom. And she told me a story once and she said, somebody asked her, how you doing?

• 1:06:40Speaker 02

  And she said, well, there was the me before nine 11 and there's the me after nine 11. No greater phrase can be said because we all have that. There's the you before the event and there's the you after the event. And I think when you recognize that there's a different version of you now. And again, that's in every way that you can grieve, by the way, it's not just death, right? If you've gone through a divorce, there's the you before the divorce, there's the you after divorce. If you broke up with a long-term friendship, there's the you before that, the you after that. How, how do you navigate life in this new way? Trying to be the old you can't, doesn't work.

• 1:07:14Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that validation piece is so important.

• 1:07:16Speaker 02

  Huge.

• 1:07:16Jay Shetty?

  Even hearing you just say to someone that, yeah, you won't feel the joy you felt before. In one sense, it's so freeing. Because we're trying so hard to feel that joy again and knowing that you won't is is liberating because it stops you from chasing and pursuing something that isn't gonna happen again.

• 1:07:39Speaker 02

  But it also could be a free fall.

• 1:07:40Jay Shetty?

  Tell me about that.

• 1:07:41Speaker 02

  So when my mom passed, the morning that she passed, I had to go, long story, but pick up a tuxedo to be in a family wedding that I promised I would I would do in case she did pass and and she passed right before the wedding. So that morning I was like sitting in my car and I looked up at the window of the room that she had just passed in maybe three hours earlier. And my first thought was, nobody's ever gonna care what time I come home again. I had no boundaries. And I was like, that's a scary feeling. There was no nobody to tell me no. There was nobody to stop me. There was nobody that was gonna be like, you shouldn't do that because nobody, nobody would probably dare at that time. It was a scary feeling.

• 1:08:23Speaker 02

  So in life, when you find yourself in a place of questioning something like I did, right? And you could be thirty six doing that, you have a feeling that could be like free falling. And that's a scary place. You know, you don't know if there's a net. You don't know if somebody's gonna catch you. And then with that grief, maybe you stop talking to people and you shut down. Or maybe you start drinking, or maybe somebody puts on forty seven pounds, whatever the the thing is. So it could be a, it could be a scary thing to recognize that life's never gonna be the same. Joy's not gonna be there. So how do you work through that? You know, having a reading, not gonna fix you. Having an understanding about readings can do,

• 1:09:05Speaker 02

  can help give you an understanding of putting one foot in front of the other, knowing that there's a survival of consciousness and that they're still, they're still with us.

• 1:09:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, we've all heard the cliche time heals all wounds, but sometimes it feels like things get harder as you get further away from them.

• 1:09:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, because sometimes it feels like it was a different lifetime. Sometimes it feels like, like, like it's a, it's a book like I had so many amazing experiences with my mom after she passed. And I shared them. And, you know, there's like a whole purple coat story I put in my first book. And one of the things that I remember one day was probably like, maybe seven, eight years after she died. And I was telling the story. And I got very good at explaining the details of the story. I knew the beats of the story. I knew how people are going to react to the story. And then the story was over. And I remember not feeling it. And I was like, oh, oh, that's not good. I'm like, this is like a really personal, powerful moment for me.

• 1:10:06Speaker 02

  And I think I'm not going to share that for a while. And I stopped telling it. And I remember being at events and people were like, oh, my God, can you tell your mom's purple coat story? And I'd be like, you know, I actually, I can't right now. I set a boundary. Because I wasn't feeling it anymore. It almost became like flat. And it was too powerful of a story for me. And I needed to own it again. So I think sometimes when you're grieving, we go to places that become superficial. And I think that we have to make sure that we never lose the depth of what that emotion is. And that depth of what the person is.

• 1:10:48Speaker 02

  And for anybody that's watching this, journalize, write down your feelings. Don't forget what it is that you're feeling. Because you want to make sure that you're you're honoring yourself, but you're also honoring them. Because sometimes we go through these moments of like, I'm going to forget this. I'm going to forget their voice. I'm going to forget that this happened. I'm going to forget. Write it down.

• 1:11:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, my wife was extremely close to her grandmother. Who passed away a couple of weeks ago.

• 1:11:11Speaker 02

  Oh, I'm sorry.

• 1:11:12Jay Shetty?

  And she was ninety one, I think, when she passed away. And she had a beautiful send off and really special and peaceful. And it's amazing. My wife was by her bedside for four months in hospital and home wherever. And my wife had the foresight, probably like, maybe now like six, seven years ago, to interview her grandma. And so she had all this video of

• 1:11:35Speaker 02

  How awesome is that?

• 1:11:36Jay Shetty?

  Asking her questions and stories. And so when she was preparing her speech for the funeral, which was such an emotional thing for her to do. It was filled with all these stories that she had from this video that they would never have known. And yeah, I I feel like there's such a need to interview your parents and interview your families before they're not here anymore.

• 1:11:57Speaker 02

  I love that.

• 1:11:58Jay Shetty?

  Because it's there's so many stories your parents haven't told you, even though you think you know them. And I did that, I interviewed my mom maybe a few years back now, maybe five, six years ago, just at a dinner table. We didn't record it, I wanted to record it, but I learned so much about my mom that I would never have known and it brings you so much closer and. So whether you're an interviewer or not, it's a it's a beautiful thing to do while someone's still here.

• 1:12:23Speaker 02

  Shared connection.

• 1:12:24Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:25Speaker 02

  It's a shared connection.

• 1:12:26Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What do you do when you meet someone who tells you they're stuck in their grief? And they're just stuck with processing, I'm sure you hear that a lot.

• 1:12:35Speaker 02

  So when I hear someone's stuck, I usually try to get them to go work with it if they're not working with a counselor on some level. And sometimes they'll tell me, oh, I did that didn't work. And I will remind them that there's multiple counselors, it might not have worked with one, maybe find someone that you do click with. But I will look at trying to get them to have their astrological chart done. Here's why. If they look at their chart, when that person passed, it's like snapshot of like, what was the syllabus you were spiritually supposed to be learning? And I like people to look at that because then it gives it gives a meaning and a context to the pain. It's like diagnosing an energetic thing. I like that.

• 1:13:15Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:15Speaker 02

  I like I like people to do that. And this is where like, you know, people are like, you know, he's talking about numerologists, he's talking about an astrologer, he's talking about. I do that a lot. I feel like as a as a practitioner.

• 1:13:26Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:26Speaker 02

  For me, it's got to be like, how do I best serve this client?

• 1:13:28Jay Shetty?

  No, absolutely. I mean, I I coach people and I'm constantly introducing them to sleep experts and therapists.

• 1:13:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:13:36Jay Shetty?

  And.

• 1:13:37Speaker 02

  And and you probably know.

• 1:13:39Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:39Speaker 02

  A lot about all of the things that you're sending them to, but it's not what you do.

• 1:13:44Jay Shetty?

  It's not my expertise.

• 1:13:45Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:13:46Jay Shetty?

  And I may not be.

• 1:13:47Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 1:13:47Jay Shetty?

  Specifically trained in it. And so it's better that someone else can come in and step in. And and I think people need groups of people around them to heal, not one person. And again, going back to the ego point, I don't believe I have any power to heal anyone or be the person who solves all their problems. And often I found a collective is healthier for that person as well.

• 1:14:07Speaker 02

  Agreed.

• 1:14:07Jay Shetty?

  I was gonna ask you though, can you talk to us about the difference? With real astrology and then your horoscope that the version that has become astrology today.

• 1:14:17Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:14:17Jay Shetty?

  Because I think the challenge is, and I asked that question because astrology again is a big part of eastern traditions.

• 1:14:23Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:14:24Jay Shetty?

  I have not only heard of but seen incredible things happen through astrology from true astrologers who are not doing, you know, your daily horoscope.

• 1:14:35Speaker 02

  Right, not the pop astrology.

• 1:14:36Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, not the pop astrology.

• 1:14:37Speaker 02

  Not your base astrology.

• 1:14:38Jay Shetty?

  I have no issue with it, just what's the difference? Because I think when people say go and see an astrologer, it's like, I don't think we even know what that means today.

• 1:14:45Speaker 02

  So by, by my definition, it's somebody who's dedicated their lives to understanding and they still are on their journey of, you know, deep dive learning, delving into the past to understand the present and maybe what the future looks like. It means having your natal chart looked at, which would need your birthday, the time and location that you were born. And then if you don't have that time, they can do something called rectification, where you give them events in your life and then they kind of like retrofit where they think your planets are. And then they will kind of look at your, your life and kind of tell you who you are. Now, the control freak in me, when I have a client that I'm going to send to an astrologer. So I have a platform called Evolve Plus, right?

• 1:15:27Speaker 02

  So on Evolve Plus, I have various creators that I've worked with that I send my clients to. Certain clients need certain people with their expertise and what they do. So I usually give them a directive. So I look at astrology like an MRI. You don't MRI your entire body. Most of the time, I mean, you can now, but you normally you would just, you're going for a specific reason. So I would say, okay, well, if you're in Aries, then you're gonna have Saturn in your chart. Maybe go see how Saturn is gonna play out for you. So now there's an intro into your chart. But in that specific example, I would say, hey, I lost my person on, you know, December thirteenth, twenty twenty two. What is the lesson?

• 1:16:09Speaker 02

  You know, I had a reading with John Edward and he said that I should look at like, what's the lesson I'm supposed to be learning from that? I think the more information we get regarding the lessons we're here to learn can help us to move through

• 1:16:22Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:22Speaker 02

  whatever the stagnant stuck part of it is.

• 1:16:25Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's a better question, too, as opposed to what's going on in my life right now.

• 1:16:30Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:16:30Jay Shetty?

  Which is a bit more broad and open.

• 1:16:32Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:16:33Jay Shetty?

  And kind of could be like, yeah, well, right now this planet is making this happen and this it's more like a weather forecast.

• 1:16:38Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:16:38Jay Shetty?

  Rather than being specific and like, what lesson am I going to learn right now? What what it's needed of me right now?

• 1:16:44Speaker 02

  I'm also not a fan of the word predictions, right? So like when I'm doing a session or if I see somebody as a practitioner and they kind of predict stuff, I'm more of a projector. I like to say, these are projections from where you are. If you don't like some of this, try to make the changes now so you can adapt that, right? No different than health, like right now your test results are showing this, your lab results are showing this. If you don't change this, these numbers are going to go up, that can cause this. That's how my brain works. I used to work in a laboratory. So it's like when I'm doing a reading, I'm seeing the energy projections and I'm like, hey, this is the line of probability that you're flying on. You know, you may want to shift this.

• 1:17:17Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:17Speaker 02

  Or, hey, this is awesome, you know, guess up, keep going.

• 1:17:21Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I think that's the language which that's needed in some of these traditions, too. It's because when you think about the conversations you have with your doctors, there's a lot of diagnosing going on. They're the ones you could read the scan you can't, right? Like if if I saw a scan of my spine, I wouldn't know the difference because I'm not trained, but I trust the doctor knows how to do that.

• 1:17:41Speaker 02

  Correct, hopefully.

• 1:17:42Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, hopefully, hopefully, yeah. How do how do we, how do you honor your grief without letting it define you?

• 1:17:49Speaker 02

  Living with it, like I I feel like owning it, living, living with it, saying the person's name, making sure that you're you're including them, journalizing. Sometimes people feel like nobody wants to hear me talk about my person anymore. You know, I'm I'm too, I'm too much, it's too much, it's overwhelming, they don't want, they they're tired of me always bringing him up or her up. Living with that, acknowledging it, writing about it, journalizing about it, and making sure that they're not forgotten, because that means that you're not forgetting your connection to them. And then I'll make it about living grief as well. Let's say you had a relationship with somebody, a thirty year friendship, and or it's a sibling, and all of a sudden you have a falling out with that person, and now there's no contact.

• 1:18:34Speaker 02

  That's a painful moment for you. So I ask people to mine for the positivity in that, because half of that relationship is positive. It doesn't mean that you'll ever, like, I have people that are out of my life. They will not have access to me again. They've, that's not happening. But when I reflect back on my time with them, it's not negative. Like, I know that negative things might have brought us to where we're not connected now, but I'm not gonna take away my past.

• 1:18:59Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:00Speaker 02

  I had a great time with you. I had a great time for the time that we were spending together. So I'm not going to be spending negative energy mourning the negative side of it.

• 1:19:09Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:09Speaker 02

  I get the negative side. I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna reminisce about the positive stuff.

• 1:19:13Jay Shetty?

  Hmm. Yeah, I have a friend who sadly lost, tragically lost their child at like two weeks old, and they named it. You know, and, and that's been a really big part of their grieving is being able to say the name, you know, not forget, not.

• 1:19:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, if anybody's listening to this.

• 1:19:29Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:30Speaker 02

  Or for who is listening to this, if you have somebody that you know that's lost a child, please say their name.

• 1:19:35Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 1:19:36Speaker 02

  You're not gonna offend the parent. They want, they want that child to matter. Doesn't matter if that child was two days old, or twenty-two years old, or forty years old. They want their child to be remembered. So you're not gonna make them sad by saying their name. You're gonna, you're gonna make them feel connected, and that you're honoring that person.

• 1:19:57Jay Shetty?

  Well said. How can someone find peace if they were not with their loved one in their final moments?

• 1:20:04Speaker 02

  So COVID taught us that, right? COVID happens, and people can't be with their loved ones and friends when they're passing. So what I want everybody to know is that nobody dies alone. When we leave the physical world, nobody passes alone. And you might say that's not true because nobody was there. I mean that people come for us. We have loved ones and friends that are waiting for us, that are there. And if you're at someone's deathbed, they may do things where they're having deathbed visions. They may call out to a person. You may sense that yourselves. There's always people that come for us. So if you were not able to be with the person when they transitioned, please know that they were not alone. There's always people, sometimes pets, that that that come for us. So nobody passes alone.

• 1:20:47Speaker 02

  And you could set up a schedule to make sure that grandma's not alone. And that everybody's gonna be with her. She'll never be alone. That one moment where grandma was alone may be where grandma transitions. And the reason why is people will choose who they want to be with when they pass. And if it's too painful to leave while that person's there, they'll wait till that person's not. So if you were not able to be there, please don't take offense to that. Don't think that you failed them. They may not have been able to pass with you in the room.

• 1:21:15Jay Shetty?

  Because they loved you too much.

• 1:21:16Speaker 02

  Because they loved you too much. We can't, we can't hold them back. Our grief can't hold them back once they left the physical world. I think we can't hold them back while they're here, though. Because if we have that energy of please don't go, please don't go, please don't go, they may not go.

• 1:21:29Jay Shetty?

  That's, I mean, yeah, that's reassuring for so many people who are trying to time that moment perfectly.

• 1:21:35Speaker 02

  And that's why if you say to somebody, it's okay.

• 1:21:39Speaker 02

  They may transition right after that because you've given them permission. You've released them as best as you can.

• 1:21:44Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Well, that's the push and pull, isn't it? When you love someone, you don't want them to leave. And at the same time, you don't want them to be in pain.

• 1:21:51Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 1:21:52Jay Shetty?

  And so until you're willing to let go and recognize that that's better for them. There is some energetic force that makes them hold on and stay on as well.

• 1:22:04Speaker 02

  So I have a phrase that I use with my kids, but I think it's applicable when it comes to grief as well. I have an aunt that said, you know, she's like, I know you're really close with your kids. She's like, but you're getting to the grown up. You're gonna have to let them go. And I said, I'll never let them go.

• 1:22:16Jay Shetty?

  You said?

• 1:22:17Speaker 02

  I said, I'll never let them go, but I will let them grow. And I feel that when it comes to grief. We may have to let them go physically, but let us grow together until we are able to connect again.

• 1:22:30Jay Shetty?

  That's beautiful. I feel like when people leave that with the way I felt that with my my wife's grandmother passing, it was so peaceful and she left so much peace because she was this radiant, vibrant, you know, deeply conscious powerhouse of a woman. She left like this, you know, really peaceful, sweet celebratory energy, which was hard because it wasn't, you know.

• 1:22:55Speaker 02

  And a legacy of love for the family to kind of stay connected, right? As a result.

• 1:22:59Jay Shetty?

  Exactly, absolutely.

• 1:23:00Speaker 02

  She gave the language, she gave the energy, she set the structure. My grandmother, I'm I'm feeling from from you, like my own grandmother. You know, the level of any of my cousins watching this right now or listening right now, they they're they're immediately thinking about my grandmother in the same way because she inspired family, she inspired connection and love.

• 1:23:19Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:23:20Speaker 02

  Sometimes through guilt, but it still worked.

• 1:23:22Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, exactly, exactly. How can people connect with people they've lost in their life on a daily basis? You mentioned earlier that you do that. I was talking about how how I do that. How do you suggest people do that and keep that person alive in their life? And is that healthy?

• 1:23:41Speaker 02

  I think it's healthy. I think it's important. I think telling stories to people that never knew them, like I never knew my grandfather. I never met him. My grandfather died before I was born. My mom did an amazing job at making him a three dimensional figure for me, from explaining what he looked like, how he was emotionally like positive and negative, by the way, like she just made him a real person that I kind of felt like I knew him. So it would be like if you go see a movie and I'm not going to get a chance to see the movie and you now tell me all about the movie.

• 1:24:15Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:16Speaker 02

  You give me the plot, you give me the characters, you the cinematic of it, all of it. And I feel like I've seen the movie now because you did such a good good job describing it. Well, I'm happy she did that because she gave me language and that language is what I had to use with my kids for her. And I will have conversations with my kids legitimately where I'll be like, make sure you tell my grandkids this. And my daughter will be like, you tell your grandkids. Meaning like, you ain't going anywhere. But the reality is, what if I'm not here? That is a reality. I may not be here when they have kids. So I'm having that conversation with them. Make sure you tell my grandkids this. Make sure that they know about this. So I think having the conversation is important. Communicating with people that you know will never know them or meet them.

• 1:25:01Speaker 02

  So that you're keeping this three dimensional archetype of a personality present. Cause really what it's do is keeping a bridge between you and them. And, and, and doing that. On my Instagram, I, I think it was April. I was feeling my mom. I was just thinking about her and you know, she's been gone 30 years. And I was like, I'm gonna post a photo. And I, I, I posted it. It had nothing to do with birthdays, anniversaries. I was in a moment, I was feeling my mom. I posted a photo of my mom. It was me honoring her. So you know, I have this like image in my mom, uh, image in my head of my mom being in the afterlife going, look, my son posted a photo of me on Earthagram. Look, let's go look, you know? But it's where I'm honoring, I'm keeping that person.

• 1:25:45Speaker 02

  Food. Food is another way that you can honor someone. So with my grandmother, we, we talked about, you know, your wife's grandmother. And with my grandmother, I lived with her. She had arthritis. So she used to cook every Sunday for a lot of people. So she'd be like, come help me. So I cooked with her. I didn't know at the time how important that was. Like that I had like my grandma's recipes that I could, if I wanted to make at Christmas time, strufula, I can make strufula for the family. Not that I do, but, but I could if I wanted to, right? So there's a tradition that gets passed down. So what are the legacies? What are the traditions? Food, like music.

• 1:26:28Speaker 02

  All of those things are, are ways to keep them present and, and allow them to still be part of our lives.

• 1:26:34Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, those are beautiful. Love those. Really helpful for people who are going through it right now. What's your take on keeping things that they owned and? Physical items.

• 1:26:44Speaker 02

  Again, I think that depends upon the person. My thing is, they don't care. Nobody ever comes through going, "You gave away my car. You know, you threw out my clothes." Like, they don't care. The value for them is love and connection, not articles, not things. They don't come through when people are fighting over the house. They don't talk about stuff like that. They don't take sides because in the physical world, material things matter. That doesn't matter there. The true, true value of the world, energy, universe is love and connection, communication. That's what they value. That's what they come through, you know, mostly about. But I think for some people, they're in positions where they can't keep a house, right?

• 1:27:25Speaker 02

  So if someone can't keep a house and they know that their, let's say their spouse, loved the house, they lived and breathed for the house, for the garden, they put their entire life into that. And now they have to sell the house because they can't afford it. That's devastating on top of the loss. So I've had so many readings where people come through saying, "It's okay, you can sell the house. You're not losing me." But that's great to be released of that. But that person still is losing their house. So now they're going to grieve the loss of the relationship and they're going to grieve the loss of the house. So what's the solution? And an example like that, I say, hire a real estate photographer to come in and film your house in that three-dimensional thing, so you can always have a walkthrough of the house that you remember.

• 1:28:09Speaker 02

  Because you don't have to be in the house in order to feel the house. You could legitimately walk through that house anytime you want. So you find ways to navigate and kind of experience your grief, but to work with it and through it.

• 1:28:21Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. So a question that I have, John, is I feel like for a lot of people, they can become a sort of dependency on a lot of this work. And it can start to become somewhat of a crutch. Obviously, we all need time to process, we need time, but it can become something that you just fall back on all the time. How do you help someone move on or move through that? Because it can kind of feel self...

• 1:28:47Jay Shetty?

  Fulfilling to just sit in this space, try and get affirmation and validation, but not really do the work and apply and move forward.

• 1:28:55Speaker 02

  So I think it's a really powerful question. And I think it's really important that people don't look at this work as a crutch. It should be something that is an asset to their way of life and the way of their thinking. So we should never externalize our feelings, whether it be love or grief. We should be internalizing those moments. And I think I was very kind of like, you know, lucky because I was popular like from the beginning of my career. So it was hard to get back in to see me. So I could keep a buffer between people. But before that kind of like happened, I would say to people when they would say, you know, when can I come back and see you again?

• 1:29:37Speaker 02

  I'd be like, a year, nine months, like take, take some time. And they'd be like, that's a long time. I'm like, well, yeah. But when I used to work at a psychic fair, when I first started, the same people would show up like every like two or three weeks. And they had the same questions. And I remember saying to this one woman, I'm like, can we let something like life happen here? I was like, cause I feel like I should be coming over for dinner now. Like, I feel like we're friends and I don't really feel this is professional. And then I had another client that I jokingly fired her. And I just was like, I cannot read you anymore. And she was like, why? I go, because he is never leaving his wife for you. I was like, I'm not the right person for you. I'm not going to tell you what you want to hear. So I think it's important to set boundaries.

• 1:30:21Speaker 02

  So I set boundaries with clients all the time. Like, I'll just be like, you know, you can't come back and see me. If I'm doing a Zoom group and I recognize somebody, I will literally say to them, I can't read you. You know, I've just, I've just seen you. I remember you like, I don't want to remember you. So.

• 1:30:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Your new book kind of took you to different lengths, almost outside of your, outside of your comfort zone.

• 1:30:43Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:30:44Jay Shetty?

  To really uncomfortable spaces beyond what you'd usually do.

• 1:30:48Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:30:49Jay Shetty?

  Talk to me about how Chasing Evil even came about.

• 1:30:52Speaker 02

  So Chasing Evil is the 30 year culmination of me assisting an FBI agent, now retired, on his casework. And he, like multiple other people, did not believe in the subject matter, except he took it to another level. He heard me on radio. I do a lot of radio, live call-ins. He heard me multiple times. And he thought I was a fraud, a grifter, and a con, as he puts it. And he came to me under the guise of a real cold case that he was working. And he wanted my assistance. He brought nine items, five of which were pertaining to the case, four of which were control items that had nothing to do with the case.

• 1:31:35Speaker 02

  And in the beginning of my meeting with him, I separated the four things that did not belong to the case. Got his attention. He had arranged for the woman that was missing, her daughter, to be on standby, because he heard me make connections with people on the radio. So he thought, you know, put me on the phone with the woman. The woman comes through, I solve the case. That didn't happen. But I wound up reading for him and gave him information that was applicable to his life. And then information that when he went home, he had to get validated from his parents, things that he did not know. So his world got a little bit rocked, right? He got the reality of what a reading looks like, the validation, and said, can you use your ability to help me?

• 1:32:15Speaker 02

  And there was a sense of duty that I kind of had. Now, the ironic part is my dad was a New York City police officer and told me, don't sully my name with this BS that you're doing. And never let me find out that you're like working with the police. Like, like, just don't do that. And I didn't. And by the way, I really didn't have an interest in it. And with great respect with this book and this process, I still don't have an interest in it. It's not where my passion lies. My passion is not into crime solving. My passion is to help everyday people. In the same way that when I did, you know, crossing over in TV shows, I hated when they brought celebrities on, because I didn't want to reach celebrities. That's not my thing. Chasing Evil was different. I got pulled in with Bob, and it took me on a journey that I wasn't expecting.

• 1:33:00Speaker 02

  It forced me to... Review that although I had thought I did the work where my dad was concerned, apparently I didn't. And I might have been seeking some patriarchal approval by helping him. And we had some great success working together. And there's multiple cases. There's a lot of sadness. And I felt, again, the word was duty, to try to help this man on his path. I say openly, I didn't solve anything. I did for him what I do for my clients. I gave him information. He used that information and he solved his cases.

• 1:33:41Jay Shetty?

  And what book would you recommend to my audience who wants to learn about your work from a foundational level and to really dive into it?

• 1:33:50Speaker 02

  I have a book called Infinite Quest. And that book is on a platform that I created called Evolve Plus TV. That's probably where I would send people because Evolve Plus TV is a one-stop destination where you're going to hit all the things that we talked about. You know, we have somebody that does past life regression therapy on there. We have numerologists on there. We have astrologers on there. And they're all people that I work with. Like, I've worked with them, sent clients to. So I kind of brought them together in like one spot. And on Evolve Plus, people have the opportunity to set up a profile. We do a ton of live streams. So there's multiple opportunities to interact, evolve, learn and grow. But the book Infinite Quest is on my channel, under Books. And then I have an eight-part development workshop that's on there called Project U.

• 1:34:34Speaker 02

  And it's all geared towards helping people to do exactly what it is, evolve.

• 1:34:38Jay Shetty?

  So if anyone's feeling very curious after this conversation, they should go to Evolve Plus.

• 1:34:42Speaker 02

  EvolvePlus.TV, yep.

• 1:34:44Jay Shetty?

  Amazing. John, thank you so much for your time, your energy, your insight. It's remarkable. It's something, like I said, I'm so curious about. I'm really fascinated by the way you present it. I feel like I've learned so much.

• 1:34:56Speaker 02

  Thank you for having me.

• 1:34:56Jay Shetty?

  And yeah, was there anything I didn't ask you that you wish I asked you?

• 1:35:00Speaker 03

  No, these are really thought provoking questions.

• 1:35:03Jay Shetty?

  Okay.

• 1:35:03Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:35:03Jay Shetty?

  Good, I'm glad. Well, thank you so much again, honestly.

• 1:35:06Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:35:06Jay Shetty?

  And yeah, I look forward to learning so much more. And this, the book sounds fascinating, so I'm excited for people to dive into it as well because.

• 1:35:13Speaker 03

  The feedback has been like off the hook. It's probably the best reviewed book that I've been a part of.

• 1:35:17Jay Shetty?

  I mean, it does. The stories just sound incredible.

• 1:35:20Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:35:21Jay Shetty?

  Congratulations.

• 1:35:22Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 1:35:22Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, thank you. Amazing. If this is the year that you're trying to get creative, you're trying to build more, I need you to listen to this episode with Rick Rubin, on how to break into your most creative self, how to use unconventional methods that lead to success, and the secret to genuinely loving what you do. If you're trying to find your passion and your lane, Rick Rubin's episode is the one for you.

• 1:35:46Speaker 03

  Just because I like it, that doesn't give it any value. Like, as an artist, if you like it, that's all of the value. That's the success comes when you say, "I like this enough for other people to see it."

• 1:35:59Speaker 04

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• 1:36:28Speaker 05

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• 1:36:31Speaker 06

  On October 2nd.

• 1:36:32Speaker 05

  Causing massive water displacement and triggering a tsunami. They all keep the blame on me.

• 1:36:37Speaker 06

  Tom Cruise is. Digger got us into this mess, and Digger's gonna dig us up. From the director of Birdman and The Revenant.

• 1:36:45Speaker 05

  What would happen if I stopped brewing? You start, you freeze to death, that's what.

• 1:36:49Speaker 06

  With great power comes great deniability.

• 1:36:52Speaker 05

  I'm not the first daddy.

• 1:36:53Speaker 06

  Digger. See the trailer online. Only in theaters October 2nd. Rated R. Under 17. Not a middle without parent.

• 1:36:58Speaker 07

  Ugh, I hate Mondays.

• 1:37:00Speaker 05

  King's Hawaiian cinnamon swirl bite?

• 1:37:01Speaker 07

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• 1:37:04Speaker 05

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• 1:37:07Speaker 05

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• 1:37:09Speaker 07

  But Taylor Hansen's making my day way better with these new soft and swirly King's Hawaiian cinnamon bites.

• 1:37:13Speaker 05

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