Positive Thinking: How Changing Your Mindset Can Change Your Life Feat. Garrain Jones

The Secret to Transforming Your Life Starts in Your Mind What if the key to changing your entire life was as simple as shifting your mindset? In this episode, I bring together some of the most brilliant minds—Garrain Jones, Mauricio Umansky, Tom Bilyeu, and Tim Grover—to break down the undeniable power of your thoughts and how they shape your reality. Garrain Jones shares how forgiving those who hurt him, even the men who murdered his father, unlocked an entirely new level of freedom and success in his life. Mauricio Umansky reveals why financial success has nothing to do with wealth itself and everything to do with mindset. Tom Bilyeu exposes the lie that talent is enough and how he went from an "empty dreamer" to building billion-dollar businesses. And Tim Grover, the man who trained legends like Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant, explains why the obsession to win is what separates the best from everyone else. Each of these incredible minds offers a different perspective, but the message is the same: your mindset controls your reality. Whether it’s forgiveness, confidence, discipline, or the hunger to win, mastering your mind is the first step toward transforming your life. Key Takeaways: - Forgiveness is freedom – Letting go of resentment clears space for abundance. - Success doesn’t equal happiness – Your mindset determines your joy, not money. - Talent is a myth – Skills and success come from relentless effort, not natural ability. - Winners don’t just compete, they dominate – The greatest aren’t just good; they win at winning. - Your past doesn’t define you – Whether you were broke, doubted, or stuck, your mindset can rewrite your future. At the end of the day, success isn't reserved for the chosen few. It’s for those who make the decision to change, who commit to their growth, and who refuse to settle. Your mindset isn’t just a part of your journey—it is the journey. So, what are you doing today to start transforming your life? Thank you for watching this video—Please Share it and get the word out! What part of this video resonated with you the most? Comment below! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Ed Mylett?

  So hey guys, listen, we're all trying to get more productive and the question is, how do you find a way to get an edge? I'm a big believer that if you're getting mentoring or you're in an environment that causes growth, a growth-based environment, that you're much more likely to grow and you're going to grow faster. And that's why I love Growth Day. Growth Day is an app that my friend Brendan Burchard has created that I'm a big fan of. Write this down, growthday.com/ed. So if you want to be more productive, by the way, he's asked me, I post videos in there every single Monday that gets your day off to the right start. He's got about $5,000, $10,000 worth of courses that are in there that come with the app. Also, some of the top influencers in the world are all posting content and they're on a regular basis, like having the Avengers of personal development and business in one app. And I'm honored that he asked me to be a part of it as well and contribute on a weekly basis, and I do.

• 0:45Ed Mylett?

  So go over there and get signed up. You're going to get a free, tuition-free voucher to go to an event with Brendan and myself and a bunch of other influencers as well. So you get a free event out of it also. So go to growthday.com/ed. That's growthday.com/ed. I hear so many small business owners say the exact same thing. They just never have enough time in the day. Well, I measure time differently. I've compressed, condensed, heck, I've bent time. My first day is 6:00 a.m. to noon. My second day starts at noon and goes till 6:00 p.m. And my third day, 6:00 p.m. to midnight. I now get 21 days a week. Stack that up over a month, over a year, over five years, and my life's completely different than it would have been otherwise. And if you want to win as an entrepreneur, you have to compress your time too.

• 1:30Ed Mylett?

  And you definitely can't afford to waste it waiting weeks on a big bank for capital. Your best bet's to work with my friends at Cardiff. They know how to compress time for entrepreneurs. They get your business approved in minutes and funded the very same day. They're America's favorite small business lender, and for good reason. Over 20 years in business, over 12 billion deployed to small business across America. Stop letting bank delays slow down your momentum. Head to cardiff.co/ed. That's cardiff.co/ed. Cardiff.co. Real growth, fast funding. Cardiff, borrow better.

• 2:08Speaker 01

  This is the Ed Mylett Show.

• 2:13Ed Mylett?

  Hey, everyone. Welcome to my weekend special. I hope you enjoy the show. Be sure to follow the Ed Mylett Show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. This man has now reached millions of people with his message and completely changed his life. So, Garen Jones, welcome to the show, my friend.

• 2:29Garrain Jones?

  Thank you for being brave, but brave enough to create a platform like this. So, stories like mine have wings.

• 2:37Ed Mylett?

  You talk about, here's some of the steps that you went through to start to turn your life around that you weren't doing prior. So, I want you to just share some of these things. I'm not rapid fire, but like, I want to talk about them. Voluntary discomfort, which included some phone calls you made to certain people who I'm sure was uncomfortable. So, just take the bow around that.

• 2:54Garrain Jones?

  Yes. So, I didn't know that you can't change what you're not aware of. But I was changing, and I didn't realize that it was rapidly changing my life. So, everything I'm about to share with you is as I connect the dots, looking backwards. I saw the power of apologizing to somebody for something that I did when I was seven years old that I didn't know that she held. Like, I hit this girl over the head with a backpack when I was seven, and then I messaged her like six years ago. And I was like, "Hey, kids do the stupidest things. I know you don't remember this, but I just want to say that I'm sorry." She goes, "Number one, why did you do that?" I'm in tears right now. "Two, what about me made

• 3:38Garrain Jones?

  you do that?" "Three, um, the same thing is happening to my kids, and I don't know what to tell them." So, it was that moment right there. I was like, "Oh, people keep things. They remember how you make them feel." I wrote a list. And I didn't know it was gonna turn into as many people from kindergarten up to present date. I wrote a list of 250 names of everyone that I had ever impacted negatively, thought of negatively, not even in the physical, thought, negative thoughts. Wow.

• 4:20Garrain Jones?

  And anybody who'd ever hurt me with the intention of apologizing for my part and not expecting them, whatever their response was their response, I was clearing myself. I wanted to be truly free because you can't fight for something that you can only give to yourself, which is internal freedom. The person who molested me, people who jumped me, but I held on resentment for 30 years. I was like, I just want to apologize for when we had that fight. I want to apologize for holding resentment towards you for 30 years. They're like, what are you apologizing for? We were the ones who jumped you. And I was like, but I held on to

• 5:01Garrain Jones?

  the resentment. That resentment affects me. And so I just want to create the possibility of just having no negativity when I think of you. Sheesh. Instantly, freedom. So I did that for 250 people up until present date, including forgiving the two men, and I don't know where they are in the world, forgiving the two men who murdered my father, wholeheartedly, simultaneously. I'm watching all of this business come. I'm like, where are these people coming from? I forgive these two people, two new people come into my business. I let go of this thing, this new thing. It's almost like this universal

• 5:46Garrain Jones?

  order of this magic trick. I do this. And I spoke to my spiritual advisor, Monica Zans. She said, Garen, you released hate from your heart. These were all little subtleties of hate. So any level of resentment. And it doesn't matter what they do. The forgiveness is freedom and letting go of resentment will complete the cycle.

• 6:09Ed Mylett?

  Brother, whoa.

• 6:10Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 6:11Ed Mylett?

  One of the top things ever said on the show. Ever, ever, ever.

• 6:14Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 6:15Ed Mylett?

  Out of a bazillion episodes. I'm convinced what that is, by the way, is that you're, um, when you have negative stored energy in your body, either through holding.

• 6:24Garrain Jones?

  We come back to that again.

• 6:25Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, yeah. When you store it to your point, what either something you've done that you want to apologize for or forgiving someone else for trauma they've caused you. That energy is blocking you.

• 6:34Garrain Jones?

  Yep.

• 6:34Ed Mylett?

  And when you release that energy, your vibrational frequency increases tremendously. And that's when you begin to magnetize the things into your life that because we've all had those moments. You're like, I was thinking of so and so, and then they called me.

• 6:43Garrain Jones?

  Yep.

• 6:44Ed Mylett?

  That's when you're vibrating at a high frequency. But usually for most people, that is like once a year deja vu or some fluke thing. But you know this now that you're on the other side of it. When you do begin to live with this type of intention, when you are a vulnerable person, you're that frequency increases and it's just unbelievable. Perhaps all these things were already there, but your reticular activating system was blocking you from seeing, feeling or hearing them. Or perhaps they weren't there and now you're attracting them. But all I know is they've appeared in my life the last 30 years in ways that are what you would consider to be miraculous, which now has become habitual.

• 7:16Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 7:16Ed Mylett?

  Right? What was once miraculous is now habitual. And that can happen in everybody's life who takes some of the steps that we're talking about today. Putting yourself through voluntary discomfort, doing uncomfortable things. But the apologies, the forgiveness, these are real things. The other thing that you say about vulnerability, and I guess I want people to really hear this because there's different aspects. What we're going to talk about today that hit different people.

• 7:37Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 7:38Ed Mylett?

  But you're so right. I've only, I said this 20 years ago. I haven't said it since. So I know you didn't get it from me. It's yours. But causing people to feel safe in your presence is one of the great keys of being a leader of anything is that people can feel safe in your great father, great mother, great brother, great sister, great business person. Right? Great coach, great anything. People have a tendency to feel safe in your presence and you say the pathway to that happening ironically is to be what?

• 8:06Garrain Jones?

  Man, there's so, there's so much. There's so much to that. That's such a loaded question. But when, when you.

• 8:17Garrain Jones?

  Accept who you really are.

• 8:19Ed Mylett?

  And are willing to share it.

• 8:20Garrain Jones?

  Yeah, and you're willing to share it.

• 8:23Garrain Jones?

  And you're willing to create this, it's like a pathway. There's an energy that just comes through you through the presence of vulnerability.

• 8:33Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 8:34Garrain Jones?

  That level of openness, it taps into the voiceless or the, it taps into the voiceless part of you that you haven't yet given a voice. And so this, because you can't be what you can't see. So the second that you, you talk about something that most people won't talk about, and they can, they listen to who they relate to, and then they can relate to it, then all of a sudden, that part of them that they haven't given a voice goes,

• 9:05Garrain Jones?

  "I'm not alone."

• 9:07Garrain Jones?

  I learned this skill because in the scariest time of my life, where I'm still living in my car, I'm still, I was still $200,000 in debt. I got tired of living a life trying to put on a mask or pretend to be what everybody else thought I should be. And I say, you know what? And then Rihanna's song, "We Out Here Living Alive," had came on. It's like, "Out here living a lie." I couldn't get it out of my head. I was like, "No more." True freedom is power to possess your own mind. And like, use it in a way that uplifts yourself and other souls.

• 9:49Ed Mylett?

  Really good.

• 9:51Ed Mylett?

  It's really good.

• 9:51Garrain Jones?

  Drop the mic.

• 9:52Ed Mylett?

  He paused because I about fell out right there. That's really good. Keep going.

• 9:56Garrain Jones?

  I went on Facebook and the post is on Facebook right now. I say, "You think you know me? You have no idea. Here's what you know. You know, this, this, this, and this. You know, I've dated this person. You know, I was in this music video 15 years ago. You know, this, because this is what I told you. But what it really is, right now, I'm $200,000 in debt. I'm living in my car. I've cheated on every girlfriend I ever had. I have no relationship with my family." And I just put it all out, the scariest moment of my life. First message I got.

• 10:36Garrain Jones?

  Was from a stranger. It said, how did you have that kind of strength? When I read your testimony, I put the gun down. I put the gun down and it was in that moment, my purpose was birthed. I said,

• 10:57Garrain Jones?

  I know why I'm here. To speak, to be the voice of the voiceless or the parts of you that you haven't yet given a voice. And I know there's all those people doing all these other things. But when it comes to that deep, dark, treacherous place that people mask and they try to overcompensate and do all these other things. That's my playground.

• 11:20Ed Mylett?

  Yeah. That's so unbelievable. Uh, most people are listening to this on audio, so they didn't just see your face. But like I watched your face when you sat down. It's like, it was like a spiritual, soulful transformation in those moments. You can see it right now. It's happening again, right? By the way, thank you for listening to the audio and share the podcast today. But I have to tell you, like, it's all over you. Now, by the way, just when you think we're getting real foofy here. We're, you're not so foofy. You're pretty hardcore too. When you're frank with people. So there's this piece and then there's like, hey, bam. And I, I was watching some of your content the other day and like, damn. You literally said on something I watched, I don't feel sorry for you if you're broke.

• 12:04Ed Mylett?

  I don't feel sorry for people to tell me they have no money. This was interesting to me from everything we just said, I'm taking you the whole other direction of how I do this, right? I want people to see the whole perspective here. Um, and then you said, uh, people that say, hey, I don't feel seen. You said you kind of chuckle and laugh. So there's a part of you that's like, hey, and I think the reason that you do that is you know now so deeply that people can change, that you're not going to give them their BS ways of getting out of it. Right? But just talk about that for a second because like, It's one thing to be what we're both talking about, being vulnerable, sharing these parts of our souls, making people feel safe. These are all things that are beautiful for two masculine men to be willing to talk about.

• 12:41Garrain Jones?

  Absolutely.

• 12:41Ed Mylett?

  Same time, though. Same time. There's this other part, he's like, I don't feel sorry for you.

• 12:46Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 12:46Ed Mylett?

  And, and, and why is that? And, well, I want you to elaborate on it.

• 12:50Garrain Jones?

  Well, I'll tell you this, um, I'm a big context guy.

• 12:54Ed Mylett?

  Me too.

• 12:54Garrain Jones?

  So, in the same conversation, my story will always live there.

• 13:00Ed Mylett?

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:00Garrain Jones?

  The vulnerability of my story. So, but, Karen, you don't understand, I don't have any money. And I'm like, somebody said to me the other day, oh, no, it's, it's easy for you to talk about that. You, you, you have this big house and you have the wife and you have the, yeah, I've been saying the same thing when I was living in my storage unit and sleeping on bubble wrap, sleeping in an abandoned building. Y'all are just now catching up.

• 13:25Ed Mylett?

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:26Garrain Jones?

  You know, I've been, I, like, when I was living in my car, you probably had a home. I don't want to assume.

• 13:30Ed Mylett?

  By the way, I have a photo of the storage unit right there that he was living in, just so you all know.

• 13:35Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 13:35Ed Mylett?

  So, I, I have it. Keep going.

• 13:37Garrain Jones?

  So,

• 13:41Garrain Jones?

  it's, it's difficult, and now I can have empathy and compassion.

• 13:45Ed Mylett?

  Absolutely.

• 13:45Garrain Jones?

  But I wouldn't just come out if somebody was like, oh, you don't, I wouldn't just laugh in anybody's face.

• 13:51Ed Mylett?

  Sure.

• 13:52Garrain Jones?

  There's always context and my story that goes with it. So, if somebody's saying that and I'll be like, hey, I experienced the same thing.

• 14:03Ed Mylett?

  Mm-hmm.

• 14:04Garrain Jones?

  And you know what I did when I was living in my car? I went to Starbucks every single day and I wrote down 10 things that I'm good at, 10 things that I absolutely love to do, found a way to weave that. And then I, I went on Craigslist and I found a way to make money every single day. And then finally something hit. And then something else hit. So, what you're seeing now is the overflow of what I was doing when I was living in my car. It's almost like God was like, I want to see if you are really serious about what you say you want to do. Okay, pay me no money and I will still do it and I will do it to excellence.

• 14:45Garrain Jones?

  And that's what I did. So therefore, when the money does coming in now, like more money is coming in, I'm like, it doesn't surprise me. It makes sense because I put in the work.

• 14:53Ed Mylett?

  Well, the reason you did though, and this is important, you make a big, you paint this distinction. You didn't try, okay? You did this like your life depended on it. You say there's a big difference between, this and everybody really close. If you keep trying things, that is the lowest possible commitment level is to try. Now, I'm not saying, in my book, I literally have a chapter called "One More Try", so I believe in trying something again. But behind that, there has to be something in you that has already sort of pre-negotiated the price you're gonna have to pay, so that you're not constantly navigating the price you're paying. Because you talk about trying versus mastery.

• 15:33Garrain Jones?

  Yeah.

• 15:33Ed Mylett?

  And by the way, I think the money comes in, you're earning the money while you're trying to get good at something. But the money doesn't come in until you've mastered it typically, or at least increase your capacity to do it. Like in business, I earned most of the money I make now when I was broke years ago. It just comes in now, but I earned it back then when I was making an effort with no reciprocity. I was making an effort when nothing was coming in. In fact, I was making an effort as my life went backwards. So it was earned then, I'm just getting paid now.

• 16:05Garrain Jones?

  So good, so good Ed, so good.

• 16:09Ed Mylett?

  It's just true. And it's, that's the hard part of watching successful people because they behave in a particular way often when they get there. I didn't earn my money now, I earned it back then. And you, you had to make up, you cannot go from living in a damn storage unit, being incarcerated, blowing through a record deal, having a dad that's murdered, having someone try to murder you in your damn life, right? All these mistakes you've made. And like, I'm gonna, I'm gonna give it a go. That couldn't have been what it was. You don't go to where you are by giving it a go. So what's the difference?

• 16:47Garrain Jones?

  I would say the difference is that most people don't realize the value of not giving it a go. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna try it a time or two and see if it works.

• 17:00Garrain Jones?

  Here's what doesn't work.

• 17:03Garrain Jones?

  Everything that you've done up until this point where you felt like it didn't work. And then you kept doing that. So what you did is master it not working. So you're actually in mastery, any direction you go. So this is why I teach a lot at my retreats on energy transmutation.

• 17:25Ed Mylett?

  Tell us what that means.

• 17:26Garrain Jones?

  Yeah, who I was when I was sleeping around with all those women, breaking into cars and everything. That, there's an energy behind it. It's not the action, it's the energy behind it that's driving that level of success. That same person is the same person that messaged 900 producers, say, get my song on a record, get my song. And then in 30 days, I had 28 songs. And then two months later, I had a record deal with Ludacris. It was the same, I just transmuted the energy in a different direction. So you come into mastery when you're doing something over and over and over and over, like the little kid learning how to walk over and over and over and over and over. And walking is not even our natural state, it's something that we adapt into.

• 18:09Garrain Jones?

  So you adapt into mastery, mastery in excuses and security, devaluing yourself, devaluing people around you. And if you could see that you are actually in, you're actually a mastery-esque person. You just need to transmute that energy in a direction where it's moving you forward, not keeping you stuck or keeping you back. So all this is, is a redirection, because you can't see the picture while you're in the frame of what really matters to you. Staying in the same spot or moving forward and creating an extraordinary life for yourself and your family.

• 18:52Garrain Jones?

  I started caring that my mom was working at a job that was killing her. And then, and she's got these back-to-back surgeries, colostomy bag, barely alive. I started caring that maybe.

• 19:10Garrain Jones?

  Maybe I can do something about it. I started caring that I could support my daughter's mother and we can, we can come together and, and, and, and create Kaila's college fund. I started caring. You know what? I'm, I want my mom, I want to retire my mom. So what would that mean to put this energy into these actions? And whatever it takes, by 2015, I will have my daughter's college tuition paid for three years before she graduates high school. And by 2015, I'll be a multimillionaire. This is back when I was living in my car. By 2015, I'm going to retire my mom and it all happened.

• 19:56Garrain Jones?

  I started caring about the things that actually matter to me and I put all the energy in that direction.

• 20:01Ed Mylett?

  That's heart power, right?

• 20:02Garrain Jones?

  Yep.

• 20:03Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, you talk a lot about heart power and I think in life and, and business, you win with your heart, not your head. I think you have to have good strategies, right? But I think you win with your heart and most people aren't willing to put their heart into it. If you're listening to this, you gotta put your whole heart into it. If you're going to be in a really blissful, loving, incredible relationship with somebody, you have to have your whole heart in it, just like you do with your kids. If you're going to build a great business or a great body, you have to have your heart into it. Your heart's 50,000 times more powerful than your brain. The electrical current is, the power of it is. Now you get your head and your heart in congruency and you have that, now you're unstoppable. And that's really what you did. But the other thing you did, I'm just watching you, is you took advantage. You are leveraging part of your giftedness, doing what you do now, right?

• 20:46Ed Mylett?

  And I think for a lot of people, you know, that's part of the rub as well, is like, what's my gift? And, and, and understanding that you do have two or three gifts that are unique to you. So talk about leveraging your giftedness. Where is it? And then maybe a little bit of a tip for somebody to figure out if they don't know what maybe their giftedness could potentially be.

• 21:07Garrain Jones?

  What you were just talking about, that heart power?

• 21:11Garrain Jones?

  So the EKGs of the heart is like one of the most powerful frequencies in the world. Most people use more of their head than their heart. Well, um, if you imagine a little kid just tapping on your knee going, "Mom, mom, mom, dad, dad, dad, mom, mom," and that kid never being acknowledged,

• 21:32Garrain Jones?

  what do y'all think would happen to the relationship? 20 years from now with no acknowledgement, there wouldn't be one, because there would be no emotional closure. So the stuff you used to love to do as a kid,

• 21:50Garrain Jones?

  before you got influenced by the outside world, I'm just talking about the stuff you used to love to do that brought you the most freedom,

• 21:59Garrain Jones?

  is connected to the truest essence of your heart.

• 22:01Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 22:04Garrain Jones?

  So I had a young lady, and I'll wrap this up quick. I had a young lady say, "Oh," and she was like, "I don't know. I have the husband, I have the job, and, and, and I have the money. I just feel like something is missing." I said, "What'd you used to love to do when you were a kid?" She said, "I used to love..." instantly changed. "I used to love to dance." I was like, "How'd you, how did it make you feel?" It just made, it's like time stopped. "When was the last time you danced?" 20 years ago.

• 22:30Garrain Jones?

  And I literally said, "If you know what that relationship is like, if you ignored your kid for 20 years, now imagine your inner child, and every time, and every day that goes by, the thing that you used to love to do gets walked over and forgotten." That's the inner child going, "Mom, mom, mom, dad." So what's missing, or potentially, is the alignment of your spiritual self and your physical self wanting to come back home. And the "what's missing" part is me telling her, "Sign up for a dance class. Don't talk about, don't think about business. And when you go there, set a powerful intention that I'm gonna take the little girl inside of me dancing.

• 23:16Garrain Jones?

  Do it just once, once a week." She does it once a week.

• 23:21Garrain Jones?

  Libido comes back.

• 23:22Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 23:23Garrain Jones?

  The relationship with her husband starts thriving. Her business, she had quit that one, got another business. She was like, oh my God, it's like, well, the universe becomes plastic according to the thoughts that you give the most power and who she was being? Was living from the inside out and not the outside in.

• 23:43Ed Mylett?

  Beautiful.

• 23:44Garrain Jones?

  So that.

• 23:45Ed Mylett?

  That's so good.

• 23:45Garrain Jones?

  That right there, if the entire world could remember at least one thing you did as a kid that brought you the most joy. If you don't remember, ask somebody when you were a little kid, what did I naturally graduate? What color, what toy, what this, what did I gravitate towards? And just spend five minutes once a week with it. Watch what happens in 30 days.

• 24:11Ed Mylett?

  Okay, I'm gonna give you an example of how brilliant you are, okay? So one of my, I was thinking recently about one of my like happiest friends. Like just loves what he does, like, listen, there's, there's lots of sources of happiness in life. In fact, you are the source of your happiness, but when you're in the process of doing something that's your giftedness, you tap into it at a deep level. You're in the process of serving other people and we've done all the studies now. Actually, you get more dopamine in the process than the achievement. When you achieve something, actually there's a dopamine crash. It's the pursuit, it's the process, right? It's the actual work. One of my happiest friends did exactly what you've described and I'll validate your work with this. He's actually a lawyer and he's in his 50s and he's just, this dude's just a stud. He's super happy, but here's the story.

• 24:55Ed Mylett?

  He had been an entrepreneur till he was 30 and made a lot of money and was miserable. And he said, I just, I got to this achievement and I didn't get any happier. And he said, you know what? I started to think about when I was a little guy, like five, 10 years old, what did I really like to do? And he goes, you know, it's funny, I like to argue. I liked to argue. And he goes, and I was also the dude, if there was a fight on the playground, I'd go protect the small kid because he's a big dude. And he goes, so I started thinking, when I was a kid, what brought me the most joy? I loved to argue, like kind of debate with people and even as a young boy, we all have a child like that, right? So some of you have a child like that. And I would protect people. He goes, I think I want to be a lawyer. So this dude at 30 years old, went back, went to law school, got his law degree, and

• 25:39Ed Mylett?

  now has a law practice, and in his 30s, found his giftedness and his go zone by tapping into his heart. So this isn't all like this esoteric concept stuff. This is real stuff. And by the way, maybe that thing isn't what you're going to do for a living, it's going to be your hobby. For me, I loved to run when I was a kid. And I've had some major injuries to my legs playing baseball. It's a long story, but like, I really can't run like I used to. And so I recently ironically got into riding horses. And I'm like, what is it that I love so much about being with these horses? It's that I can run again and they can run faster than me. So it brings me to, these are all the pathways that when you listen to my show, you guys, and I put brilliant people in front of you and we get into this thing that you and I are doing right now.

• 26:23Ed Mylett?

  Open your mind up and go around it. You know what I mean? Like, think about all the places that there's applications of what we're discussing here. Because when you do, you'll understand the genius of his work. By the way, Garen has a book I didn't mention earlier called Change Your Mindset, Change Your Life: Lessons of Love, Leadership, and Transformation. It's been out for a while. It's, I read it prepping for this. It's outstanding. I feel like there's another book in you, by the way.

• 26:46Garrain Jones?

  Oh, no, it's coming.

• 26:47Ed Mylett?

  Okay, good. Because I really believe that there's another one.

• 26:49Garrain Jones?

  It took me five years to write that book because it's called Change Your Mindset, Change Your Life. Every time I kept growing, I kept changing. And my boy Preston was like, Garen, if you don't put that book out right now. So that was a younger version of me and I've evolved so much since then. There's.

• 27:05Ed Mylett?

  Well, by the way, one other thing they should know is you have this incredible book and you like had a learning disability or something in school, right? So it's like, whatever your excuse is, I want to put somebody in front of you who is probably going to take it away, everybody. Right? Like, you just take away people's excuses, but you also feed their dreams. You feed their spirit. This episode is sponsored by Ro. A lot of people assume GLP-1's cost a fortune, and that assumption keeps them from even looking into treatment. Ro helps people find a more affordable path to FDA-approved GLP-1 treatment. Ro wants to help people lose weight. That's why they have more affordable GLP-1 options, whether you're paying with insurance or cash. Ro's free insurance checker makes it easy to see if you're covered for GLP-1 injections. Just submit your insurance card and Ro handles the rest.

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• 29:55Ed Mylett?

  That was a great conversation. And if you want to hear the full interview, be sure to follow The Ed Mylett Show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. You'll never miss an episode that way. Tim Grover, welcome back to the show, brother.

• 30:06Tim Grover?

  Thank you so much.

• 30:07Ed Mylett?

  So let's take Kobe and Jordan, the two physically phenomenally gifted dudes, mixed with all the things that you have in the book about winning. Like if you want to think like Kobe Bryant and what Tim Grover did, read the book.

• 30:20Tim Grover?

  Right.

• 30:20Ed Mylett?

  If you want to think like MJ and the things that you learned from MJ and then that you took to another level, read the book, right? Did you ever work with a guy, don't say who, I know you wouldn't, but did you ever work with someone as physically gifted as either one of the two of them? That just lacked these things and so as a result, we don't know who they are?

• 30:34Tim Grover?

  Numerous.

• 30:35Ed Mylett?

  Really? As physically gifted?

• 30:36Tim Grover?

  Even more.

• 30:38Ed Mylett?

  Wow.

• 30:38Tim Grover?

  Even more. They were by far not my most physically gifted athletes. I worked with athletes that were jumped higher than MJ, who ran faster, who had better footwork than Kobe, but...

• 30:53Ed Mylett?

  Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant were not the two most physically gifted athletes you've worked with?

• 30:57Tim Grover?

  No.

• 30:58Ed Mylett?

  Whoa, okay. And then so when you would work with these guys and you'd be pushing them in training, there was a different resistance or fatigue or how was it different?

• 31:05Tim Grover?

  You know what? Ed, how many times have you had people come up to you and says, "I'll do anything to get where you're at"?

• 31:11Ed Mylett?

  Right, all the time.

• 31:12Tim Grover?

  Or "I'll do anything to work for you", until you tell them what your definition of anything is.

• 31:19Tim Grover?

  Your definition of anything is different than my definition of anything. I'll have an athlete, it's very simple. When I first start with them, when I was training numerous, say what time's the first workout? I'd say 3:30. I'll be like, "Okay".

• 31:33Tim Grover?

  It's 3:30 a.m.

• 31:35Ed Mylett?

  A.m.

• 31:36Tim Grover?

  I wouldn't tell them a.m. or p.m. I'd tell them 3:30.

• 31:41Tim Grover?

  So where's, myself, my staff, we're sitting at, waiting. Cause, you know, winning doesn't sleep and it doesn't understand why you, why you do.

• 31:50Ed Mylett?

  That's awesome.

• 31:51Tim Grover?

  So, then we come back at, we go, they roll in the gym about 3, 3:30, like, what are you doing here?

• 31:58Tim Grover?

  They're like, you said 3:30. No, no.

• 32:03Tim Grover?

  I said, you got the wrong time. And I said, when does a new day start?

• 32:10Tim Grover?

  And they look at me and goes, no, I said, no, the new day starts at 12:00 midnight.

• 32:15Ed Mylett?

  That's right.

• 32:16Tim Grover?

  That's a new day.

• 32:17Ed Mylett?

  Mm-hmm.

• 32:18Tim Grover?

  Alright. What are you waiting for?

• 32:22Ed Mylett?

  And even if you tell them, hey, MJ did this, Kobe did this, if they don't have it, they don't have it.

• 32:26Tim Grover?

  They don't have it.

• 32:27Ed Mylett?

  You think it's a lack of obsession? Like, you said, you've referenced a couple of times, like, sleep at night, your bed doesn't sleep and all that. One of the things that, I'll be honest with you, there's a lot in the book that hit me, and you guys go get the book. Winning, Tim Grover, Real Simple, get it anywhere books are sold. But, there's this part of the book, man, like, it almost made me cry audibly, reading it, but I did get water in my eyes, and I'm gonna get water even explaining it to you. Where you're talking about being asleep, and that you get these visitors at night. And I know those visitors, very, very well, I have them too. It's attached to my obsessions. And I don't think, I don't think the average person who wants to really win, understands the extent and degree of obsession required.

• 33:10Tim Grover?

  They don't.

• 33:10Ed Mylett?

  So, can you elaborate on that, visitors that you get at night?

• 33:14Tim Grover?

  Everybody thinks obsession is a bad word. It's not.

• 33:20Tim Grover?

  I love to use the people I, you're a great example. Ed.

• 33:27Tim Grover?

  Why? Why keep going? Look at the house.

• 33:31Tim Grover?

  Not only this house, the other house, and the other house, and the plane.

• 33:38Tim Grover?

  And if people paid very close attention to what was just said, probably about 20 minutes ago, what did you say? I don't consider my... I don't know if I consider myself a winner. That's obsession.

• 33:53Tim Grover?

  That's obsession. And I love to use your plane story as an example. You went from a very nice sized plane to even a bigger plane. But it's still not your 747. That's right.

• 34:07Tim Grover?

  It's not your 747. Alright, that's an obsession. That's a healthy obsession.

• 34:13Tim Grover?

  That's what gets you out of bed. That's what allows you to, when you get out of bed, when all the skeletons are lined up next to you and telling you, "You can't do this, you're not able to do this, you're not able to do this." You get up every single morning and you shake their hands and give them a hug and say, Yep. "What you got for me tonight?" Exactly. "I got you." Because you're a part, you're a part of me. You're a part of me. And people put some, it's funny. Winners bring, all of them, wherever they go.

• 34:47Tim Grover?

  And most individuals, the best part of them, the thing that allows them to win, the thing that allows them to be obsessive, the thing that allows them not to care what other people think, the things that allow them to deal with hatred, the things that keep them going when nothing else will, they keep in their closets. The best part of them, they keep in there because they're worried, "What are people going to think about me if I let those things out?" Don't, I, I always say this, alright? No.

• 35:23Tim Grover?

  Everyone says, "I'm afraid

• 35:28Tim Grover?

  to become that person." Yeah. You should be more afraid not to become that person. Be afraid not to become that person. You, you're a big thing about, you know, meet, uh, I wanna, what, at the end of the journey, Yep. You know, I wanna meet my better half and say, "Hey, what did you leave behind?" Or it's like, "Hey, this is the person." Shake hands with them. Shake hands with them.

• 35:55Tim Grover?

  If you can't become that person, you're never gonna be able to shake that person's hand.

• 36:00Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, I'd much rather, I live in more fear of, I live in way more fear of not becoming that person than I am about not trying to be him. Big time. But I do have, I want to stay on this for a minute. I get these visitors at night too that you get. So,

• 36:17Ed Mylett?

  I don't want people to think that winning is all like, rosy and glory and beautiful.

• 36:22Tim Grover?

  It's nothing.

• 36:22Ed Mylett?

  It's really not, and I'm not even, you have to know this, here's the real, I've never said this on the show. You have to really know these truths so that you can actually decide you still want to win.

• 36:37Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 36:37Ed Mylett?

  Right? Because what does come with becoming this way now at 50 and you're 56?

• 36:42Tim Grover?

  56.

• 36:42Ed Mylett?

  56, you look great.

• 36:45Ed Mylett?

  I've had 50 years of having these visitors in my life.

• 36:48Tim Grover?

  And they're not going away, Ed. They're not, that's what everybody wants to do, that people just want to sweep them under the rug. They want to keep them in the closet, they don't want to talk about them. That's what makes you successful, that's what makes you, that's what makes you special. That's what makes you different. And what do we say? Different scares people. Winners and winning scares people. And they don't want to win because of that. They're trying to win, they're trying to balance, they're trying to fit in. What do winners do? Very few of them have balance in their life. Maybe after they become successful, they try to balance a little bit more. Alright. There is no balance early.

• 37:32Tim Grover?

  They don't care what other people thinks. They're extremely obsessive, they know it.

• 37:40Tim Grover?

  And they don't mind telling you that they're chasing the next win. Because that's what fuels them. But when you, people come to you and say, "You've had enough," you know, "Why? Slow down, slow down, unwind."

• 37:58Tim Grover?

  I don't know about you, I do know about you, I should say that. We are at our most uncomfortable when people tell us to unwind. We like to be wound up. We like that, that's like a part of, that's, we have our, we have our unique ways of unwinding. We don't need anybody to tell us to unwind.

• 38:20Ed Mylett?

  My favorite way of unwinding is having some tequila with a buddy of mine who's another winner and talking about doing more winning.

• 38:24Tim Grover?

  Right.

• 38:25Ed Mylett?

  I was on Andy's show and I said, "Winning is more fun than fun is fun."

• 38:28Tim Grover?

  I remember that.

• 38:28Ed Mylett?

  And I just really believe that, like, it's actually what I like. Like, I like the pursuit of winning, I like the, I like, I like that I sincerely don't feel that way about myself, because I'm scared if I did. Like, I'm scared of, these visitors that I have are my fears, my worries, my hopes, my thoughts, my skeletons.

• 38:51Tim Grover?

  Yeah.

• 38:52Ed Mylett?

  You know?

• 38:53Tim Grover?

  They take all those forms, they take all those forms. And you don't know what form they're gonna take that night. And you know what? They're gonna sit at you with a table, they're all, they're not gonna, I, I put this in a book. When, when you travel, those skeletons are traveling with you on the plane.

• 39:09Ed Mylett?

  They're my constant companion.

• 39:10Tim Grover?

  All the time. And if you notice, everyone looks at you and you fly on that plane alone. I've said, Ed's never been on that plane alone.

• 39:18Ed Mylett?

  It's true, it's true.

• 39:19Tim Grover?

  He's never been on that plane alone.

• 39:21Ed Mylett?

  They're with me all the time.

• 39:22Tim Grover?

  All the time. And you know what? When they look at his tequila bottles on the thing and they're finished, that's because they're drinking the best stuff also.

• 39:31Ed Mylett?

  I wonder who's drinking all that stuff, man? Stuff gets expensive. I just love this because this is the realest conversation I've ever had about really, winning, and it's the realest book about it. Like, like, it's, I don't, this isn't one of these Pollyanna things, like, it's not all rosy. No, there's a lot of it that sucks. And like, unless you wanna sign up, and by the way, I don't know if you've, I'm actually cool if you don't. Like, if you actually said, "Hey, I don't want all that stuff, I don't wanna, I mean, I don't relate to you, I'm not gonna hang out with you, you're not my kind of people." But I'd actually admire somebody who says, "I won't do these things that are in this book, and I know I'm not gonna win." Rather than say, "I wanna win and do none of the things that are in the book."

• 40:12Tim Grover?

  The people that can admit it, they've already won. The people that said, "This ain't for me." "This ain't for me." They're saying, "They know exactly who they are." "I'm good." "I'm good." Most people will settle for good, most people will settle for okay. All right. Very few people will settle for great, very few people will settle for unstoppable, very few people will settle for winning. I break things down three different ways. So, look at this, and I didn't even put this in a book, but I want to share this with you. You have individuals that compete.

• 40:47Tim Grover?

  Everybody competes, you know. You know, you play golf, you love golf.

• 40:50Ed Mylett?

  Sure.

• 40:51Tim Grover?

  You know, you go out and your golfing partner, I don't know, what's his real name?

• 40:55Ed Mylett?

  His real name is Kelly Gwynn, we call him Richard Cabeza. Dick Cabeza is head in Spanish.

• 41:00Tim Grover?

  I got it.

• 41:01Ed Mylett?

  Everyone that's wondering what that's his name, because half the people don't know, that's what Richard Cabeza means.

• 41:05Tim Grover?

  Right, everybody knows him, he's gonna be signing autographs.

• 41:08Ed Mylett?

  He does, he goes out and people are like, "I love you in my letter, man, can I get your..." He's had people take pictures with him. It's awesome.

• 41:14Tim Grover?

  Yeah, so... And I'll get into it a little bit later about that, but there's people that compete. All right, everybody knows how to compete at something. All right, and for most people, when they compete, they want to get to the, they want to just finish. That's their way, they just want to finish. All right. Now, to me, if you're that level person,

• 41:37Tim Grover?

  is that finish gonna lead to another win? It might not be, it might be in something else. If you're gonna run a marathon, all right, and you're not one of these top, elite marathon runners, you're not gonna win the marathon.

• 41:48Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 41:49Tim Grover?

  You're not gonna win. But, you have a mindset to say, "Hey, I'm gonna finish this marathon." Now, is that, when you finish that marathon, what else is it setting you up for? But there's people that go in there, they're just happy, they're just happy competing, they're just happy finishing, they're just happy to be in the race. Then you have people that win. All right, once.

• 42:09Tim Grover?

  They win once.

• 42:11Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 42:11Tim Grover?

  And how many individuals do you know, and you probably don't, well, I shouldn't say this. I said you know, not associate, where there's a big difference. That keep telling you about that win over and over again, no matter how long it's been.

• 42:25Ed Mylett?

  Gosh. Factoid.

• 42:27Tim Grover?

  Alright.

• 42:28Ed Mylett?

  I got it, man. You were quarterback in high school.

• 42:30Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 42:30Ed Mylett?

  I got it. You got your masters. I got it.

• 42:32Tim Grover?

  I got it. Alright. Then you have individuals that win at winning.

• 42:38Ed Mylett?

  That's really good.

• 42:40Tim Grover?

  They win at winning. So, they win over and over and over again.

• 42:48Ed Mylett?

  You think it's you think it's all it's cracked up to be?

• 42:52Tim Grover?

  No. But we don't know any other way.

• 42:56Ed Mylett?

  Best answer of all time.

• 42:57Tim Grover?

  Very something. Everybody, we just, we don't know any other way.

• 43:00Ed Mylett?

  Best answer of all time.

• 43:02Tim Grover?

  We just, we can't accept, we can't accept it any other way. We just can't.

• 43:06Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 43:08Tim Grover?

  I wrote a bestselling book.

• 43:10Ed Mylett?

  Crap.

• 43:10Tim Grover?

  I didn't have to do another book. You wrote a bestselling book.

• 43:13Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 43:15Tim Grover?

  You know? You have another, you have another book coming out. You don't you don't have to do any of this. But if you didn't, that would be more detrimental to you. You don't know, you don't know any, you don't know any other way.

• 43:36Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 43:37Tim Grover?

  You ju, you just don't.

• 43:39Ed Mylett?

  Yep. You think that, uh, by the way, I'm loving this. Just so you know, cause I know people that might be listening, say, this is a little bit dark, like, um, welcome to winning. Like, that's why you see so many people. I watched Nick Saban after he wins these national championships. He's gotten a little bit better at it the last couple of years. Have you noticed this?

• 43:57Tim Grover?

  Just a little bit though.

• 43:59Ed Mylett?

  Like 1% better.

• 44:01Tim Grover?

  Either his wife or somebody in his family told him.

• 44:04Ed Mylett?

  Hey, at least smile for the interview after, right? We can get back to work tonight. But you watch these prolific winners. So, I did love to watch MJ celebrate that win in the evening that he won, right? Or, you know, A few times I saw Kobe actually celebrate the win. But I know the next day they're back to work. I watched Saban. And like for years he'd win these national championships and you could already see the grimace on his face for the next year in the post-game interview.

• 44:31Tim Grover?

  In the post-game, yes.

• 44:32Ed Mylett?

  Right? And like I think people look at it, they go, well then is he? And I think to your answer, you're right. Like people say, well, is he really enjoying this? Yes, and he knows no other way. So maybe it's not all. I wonder if you ask, is it all it's cracked up to be? I think some people might say, no, but it's all I know. And it's better than the alternative of living with losing the rest of my life or not trying.

• 44:53Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 44:53Ed Mylett?

  Right?

• 44:56Tim Grover?

  There's a reason it's lonely at the top. And it's not because you want to be surrounded with other individuals. That's not the part people, when they talk about it's lonely at the top.

• 45:12Tim Grover?

  It's alone because nobody understands what's going on in here. Of what you went after you've just won, what you went through and you're already thinking about the next. You're already thinking about the next and people can't comprehend that. And there's people whispering in your ear and they're saying, enjoy it, enjoy. By the time they say enjoy it, you did enjoy it. Now you're already thinking.

• 45:37Ed Mylett?

  Yeah. Do you think it's that, I'm just thinking right now, I'm asking you this. Cause you watched this and you've done it in your own life. Like you've, you've had two careers. You've had a career where you helped, which you still do, where you help other people win. And then there became this point in your life where you became, you were individually winning as a speaker, as a coach, as a writer. It's an interesting thing to watch with you. You were the behind the scenes guy, then you weren't the behind the scenes guy. Do you think that? It's like a dopamine thing, like when they win, like they're already, they have to get another one, like immediately, like it's an addiction? Do you think winning becomes an addiction?

• 46:14Tim Grover?

  It is an addiction. And the only place where you can get that high again is the black market in your mind. It's the only place. Because you only know where that entrance is, you only know where that hit is, you only know what that drug, you only know what that drug is. And here's the crazy part about it. The next win has to be bigger, it has to be bigger, it has to be bigger, it has to constantly keep getting bigger and bigger and bigger.

• 46:39Ed Mylett?

  So true.

• 46:41Ed Mylett?

  It sounds like a sickness when you're listening to this, but I actually think it's beautiful. I actually think you were born to win. And you learn over a lifetime how not to. As a child, "Don't do this. Sit down. Be a good boy. Get in your place. Do this." Then the world starts treating you. And I think you move further and further away from your own nature. I think we were born to win. We were born to do something great with our life. I really, I don't know, that's a saying to me. And I feel a sadness when I meet somebody who's accepted a life of not winning. By the way, I'm cool with it. It's okay. I'm not judging you. But as someone who wants to pursue that expression of myself, or that...

• 47:22Ed Mylett?

  I just wonder what I would be like, you know, if I could... What it would be like, what I would be like if I could get to the next level. I'm fascinated with... Like, I think the people that I really like, enjoy, they're curious people. Like, I want the next experience. I don't want to live in the previous experience, like that guy who's like, "Hey, you know, I made a million dollars in 2009." And it was like in the mortgage boom, or with the crash, or whatever. I'm not really interested in living in those, in those times.

• 47:47Tim Grover?

  You're not, because it's always about, it's always about what's next. It's always about constantly staying in the range. It's constantly about changing your mindset. The language of winning for people that win is completely different than the language of winning from other individuals. No. You sit here and you talk to people, and they describe... When I talk to all my athletes, I said, "Describe winning in one word to me." And everybody would think about, you know, they would be like, "It's happy. It's, you know, it's euphoric. It's all those things." And it is. But those constant winners, their answers were, "It's unpolished." "It's uncivilized." "It's nasty." "It's hard."

• 48:33Tim Grover?

  "It's dirty."

• 48:36Tim Grover?

  "It's unforgiving."

• 48:39Tim Grover?

  And then Kobe comes up and says, "It's everything."

• 48:44Tim Grover?

  "It's everything." And if you think about it... And very few people are genuine about this. All right? And you know the ones that are, and you know the ones that aren't.

• 48:55Tim Grover?

  How do you feel when somebody's really close to you?

• 48:59Tim Grover?

  And they win? It's an unbelievable feeling.

• 49:02Ed Mylett?

  Unbelievable feeling.

• 49:04Tim Grover?

  How do you feel when you win? It's an unbelievable feeling, even though it's short-lived. How do you feel when your kids win? It's unbelievable.

• 49:12Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 49:13Tim Grover?

  All right.

• 49:16Tim Grover?

  That feeling is everything.

• 49:17Ed Mylett?

  It is everything.

• 49:19Tim Grover?

  That feeling is everything.

• 49:21Ed Mylett?

  It's amazing you just said that. I'm reading the book last night and I call my wife about halfway through the book. Because when you read your work, you know, even in the first book, you talk about in this book, the most controversial part of the first book was the dark side.

• 49:35Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 49:35Ed Mylett?

  You talk about it in this book. And then when you're reading this, you're like, this winning thing's mean. This winning thing's unforgiving. This winning thing doesn't give a shit if you sleep. This winning thing doesn't care, right? Like, you go through, you're like, gee, this is almost... And if you're not careful, guys, you would think, because this is truth. It flies in the face, everything you always hear. But you would think that it's not something that you really want. And the evidence of it, I said to my wife last night, I said, the evidence that you know winning is where you belong is how happy you are when you see your children doing it, if you have children.

• 50:06Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 50:06Ed Mylett?

  When your children win a spelling bee, or get straight A's, or hit a home run, or win a golf tournament, or do anything exceptional. The amount of joy you feel and pride when they win. I have a feeling that that's how God feels when he sees one of his children win. And I think this is something we all miss, that it is a grind, it is difficult. But if you ever wonder whether you belong winning, and that's the path you should pursue, just ask yourself a question about your children, if you have them, or your parents, or anybody that you love and care about. When they win, how do you feel for them? I literally said this last night.

• 50:39Tim Grover?

  So, I've heard you speak numerous times. And what people don't know about this, like, when we're on the stage together at the same event, I'll stay just to hear you speak.

• 50:48Ed Mylett?

  Vice versa, as you know.

• 50:49Tim Grover?

  You know, I will stay. The last time I heard you speak was at an event, and you were talking about a golf tournament you were with, with your son.

• 50:56Ed Mylett?

  With Max, yeah.

• 50:57Tim Grover?

  With Max.

• 51:00Ed Mylett?

  It's an intense story.

• 51:01Tim Grover?

  Yeah, it was...

• 51:02Ed Mylett?

  We went from playing golf to winning.

• 51:04Tim Grover?

  Yes.

• 51:05Ed Mylett?

  That was the decision. Like, to your point, like, your book. And by the way, I've said this early in the interview. Little words from people, a caring statement, a little bit of access to some information. And I've said this many times, just haven't said it to you, but like I thank you because, you know, I've had people say, "Oh, your son gets all your stuff." And yeah, he also has talked to Grover. He's also talked to Grover. And just so you guys know, I really, truly believe that one of the reasons that my son is excelling is you. And your information, little whispers you get, a little direct message, a little text message, a little access to a call like you've done for my son. And I think that's the other thing that people don't know, winners are generous.

• 51:43Tim Grover?

  Extremely generous. Extremely. You know why? Because they're truthful. They tell you how it is. It's not, it's not rainbows. It's not unicorns. It's not sprinkles. This is what it takes. This is what it takes. And other people, they'll tell, they don't want to, we talk about the stuff nobody else wants to talk about.

• 52:07Tim Grover?

  Does that make us bad people? In many people's eyes, it does. But it also where the few people that are going to hold your connoisseur, we're going to tell you the truth. And where people are going to say, you know what? Everybody else, sugarcoated it. These individuals told me exactly how it is. That's what the book Winning is about. Now, I don't want people to think that it's all this thing. If you read the last chapter of the book.

• 52:34Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 52:35Tim Grover?

  It kind of ties everything in and it explains

• 52:40Tim Grover?

  why winners go through this journey.

• 52:42Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 52:43Tim Grover?

  Why they go through this journey. Because I have this thing, it's like everyone talks about it's the journey. It's journey, it's not the destination. Well, to me, why the hell are you taking a journey if you don't know where the hell the destination is? What are you just amissly going to be running around? Alright, every time, when you get on your plane, or you get in your car, you know exactly, you're going from here to here. Now, you may have to take a detour to go somewhere else to do whatever you're doing, but you're like, this is where we're going. You had a post a couple of days ago, man, it's nice to own a jet because all of a sudden I gotta go wherever, wherever your destination was.

• 53:21Ed Mylett?

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• 54:06Ed Mylett?

  Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com/ed for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash ed. So you know, I've been trying to take my health and my morning routine to the next level. And I used to do a whole bunch of different stuff, tons of different supplements, and then I found All-in-One in a drink with IM-8. IM-8 is the way to simplify your supplement routine, finally, once and for all. 16 supplements replaced 90 ingredients across nine major organ systems in one drink. You can have all these supplements for $2.61 a day. I've changed my mornings. The whole IM-8 routine has changed my mornings.

• 54:49Ed Mylett?

  I feel great and I bring energy to the entire day. Go to im8health.com/ed10 right now or click the link in the description and use code ED10 for a free welcome kit, five free travel sachets, plus 10% off your order. That's code ED10 at im8health.com/ed10. Code ED10 at im8health.com/ed10. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Very short intermission here, folks. I'm glad you're enjoying the show so far. Don't forget to follow the show on Apple and Spotify. Links are in the show notes. Now on to our next guest. I'm excited because a really good friend of mine is here today.

• 55:34Ed Mylett?

  He's also got a new show out on Netflix right now. What's the name of that show?

• 55:38Mauricio Umansky?

  Called Buying Beverly Hills.

• 55:39Ed Mylett?

  Buying Beverly Hills. And so if you have ever watched that show, you recognize that beautiful voice of my friend Mauricio Yamasaki. Welcome, Mo.

• 55:47Mauricio Umansky?

  Ed, how are you? It's so good to be here with you.

• 55:49Ed Mylett?

  You used the word, and this thinking that you just said is contrarian thinking. Okay, it's contrary to culture. It's contrary to popular opinion. To start the agency was a contrarian move. You actually have that as part of the work in the book called Be Contrarian.

• 56:04Mauricio Umansky?

  Yep.

• 56:04Ed Mylett?

  Does that mean don't always participate in group think like everybody does it? And be constantly innovating? Because you also talk about that in the book, too.

• 56:12Mauricio Umansky?

  I think that's exactly what that means. You know, it's think on you. It's think. You know, don't follow. I remember, you know, another thing that my grandfather and my father always used to say to me. They used to say, when everybody's buying, you sell. When everybody's selling, you buy.

• 56:26Ed Mylett?

  Interesting.

• 56:27Mauricio Umansky?

  Right? Like, that's what a contrarian is.

• 56:29Ed Mylett?

  I do that, by the way. I am always, I just put a post out about this, Mo, the other day. I'm like, when everyone is thinking one way, I try to always think the other. When they're all going one direction, like, no one makes money in the pack. Nobody gains market share in the pack. Nobody gains a great life in the pack.

• 56:44Mauricio Umansky?

  I mean, it's like what we're dealing with right now, the First Republic Bank, right? Like, is it the time to buy?

• 56:50Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 56:51Mauricio Umansky?

  It's down 85%.

• 56:52Ed Mylett?

  I know. It's a good bank. I gotta be careful.

• 56:54Mauricio Umansky?

  It's a great bank.

• 56:57Ed Mylett?

  Debating the same thing myself. I'm like, I kind of get what's happening, but man.

• 57:01Mauricio Umansky?

  That's contrarian thinking, right? Like, you're not following everybody, you know? By the way, I'm not telling anybody you're gonna go buy.

• 57:07Ed Mylett?

  Me either. 100%, not at all. I should amend that good bank thing. It's a bank! I'll just leave it at that. It's a bank. I don't know if it's a good bank or not. I gotta be really, really careful about that. Do you, uh, do you think, by the way, I'm loving our conversation. It's really cool for me to have, like, this part of my friend that I see, like, revealed to me in detail, like, the science behind the art. Because, you know, I've always admired the things that you do and how you go about doing them. But now I understand the processes to which you do them. I want to go all the way back for a minute, because it's one of my favorite stories in the book. Because you just said it. I think a lot of people that get into sales don't realize you are self-employed, but you have to operate like you own your own business. You have to think like an entrepreneur. A lot of people do this. They have a full-time job. They work like 12, 14 hours a day.

• 57:51Ed Mylett?

  All of a sudden, they get to be an independent contractor of a job, and they think they're on vacation. They work two, three hours a day. I'm like, no, when you do that, you actually have five jobs. You have 11 jobs. It's going to require more work, sheer momentum to get it off the ground. And you kind of caught that entrepreneurial bug, you call it in the book, young with this thing with your dad, right? This story. And I think this is illustrative of thinking like an entrepreneur. And it's one of my favorite stories in the entire book because it explains you to me and it explains a lot of your success to me. So tell us that.

• 58:20Mauricio Umansky?

  Another recession, my father came up to me and he said, you know, Mauricio, it's time to either work or go to school. But I'm not going to pay for you to be a dumbass anymore. And you know, like just pretend you're going to school, right? And I literally said to my dad, I go, give me a couple of days and I'll get back to you and that you know what I want to do. And he was supportive of me going to school if I was going to go to school, right? I just wasn't supportive of me going to school if I was, you know,

• 58:44Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 58:45Mauricio Umansky?

  Going to go to the bars.

• 58:46Ed Mylett?

  Right, right.

• 58:48Mauricio Umansky?

  And I got back and I said, Dad, I'm going to come work for you. And he just taught me so many things, man. He taught me the value of the penny, right? Like which is in my book and you guys will love that. It's a great story. It really just makes everything so real. And it just teaches, you know, it helps you teach your kids, you know, how to save. It helps you teach yourself how to save and how to, you know, understand that value. Because, you know, I always tell everybody, there's 100 pennies in the dollar. Right? The day you can figure out how to give me 102, I'm in. I'm your partner.

• 59:17Ed Mylett?

  Says that in the book.

• 59:19Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah, yeah. Right? So, you know, we go through that whole process and he teaches me how to fight for cents, literally. Like I would, you know, I'd come back and I'd be like, Dad, I sold, you know, 100,000 yards for 97 cents. And he'd be like, yeah, go back and give me 99 cents. I'm like, really? Like, yeah, you start adding that up and adding that up and it adds up to a lot of money. Yeah, right? But then eventually, it's like, you know, you're in sales. You're creating your own momentum. You're creating your own things. You get that entrepreneur bug, you know, and I Ended up meeting, you know, somebody that we sold fabric to that was struggling and I loved their brand. It was nine oh two six five. It was a clothing line. The guy was awesome. His name's Bron Royalens. He started the company.

• 59:57Mauricio Umansky?

  A really brilliant guy. He was actually a makeup artist. He used to do all the makeup artists for Justine Bateman and Woody Harrelson. And he like had all these amazing people that were his, you know, his people. And, um, but, but you know, they didn't have credit. It was a startup, et cetera, et cetera. And I'm sitting there in front of these guys and I'm thinking to myself, well, these are the fabrics I sell. Like I have, I've got all of this shit, you know, sitting in my warehouse, like, right? So now you start thinking as an entrepreneur and you start taking your salesman job into this next piece, which is like, how do I build a business? Right? And so from there we built a business, right? And we built something else, you know, so.

• 1:00:34Ed Mylett?

  And there's an exit out of it too, right?

• 1:00:35Mauricio Umansky?

  And there, yeah, yeah, there was an exit. We sold it. It was not, it was not a profitable exit for me. It was more of an exit that got me out, um, and I paid all my debt and I paid all my people and I walked away with it. But, but, but yeah, but it was a great learning lesson.

• 1:00:50Ed Mylett?

  What is, what is, uh, let's talk about your public you for a minute. What, what has that been like for you to go from a guy who's, you know, a guy working every single day to now? There's this like unprecedented notoriety in your life, right? Like Kyle's. The most well-known housewife, I think is probably say on.

• 1:01:13Mauricio Umansky?

  I would say by far.

• 1:01:14Ed Mylett?

  By far, and the most well-known franchise. And then obviously that's transcended over and doesn't hurt you in building your brand either. But I wonder what impact that's made on you, your family, your life, the good and the bad of it. What comes with that?

• 1:01:29Mauricio Umansky?

  There's both. There's tremendous sacrifices that are made.

• 1:01:32Ed Mylett?

  What, like what?

• 1:01:33Mauricio Umansky?

  You know, and there's obviously the good, right? Um, the sacrifices are, uh, you know, I mean, is it nice to be able to go in and, uh, and call and get a reservation at, you know, a restaurant that most people can't, you know, get a reservation? Yeah, it's great. You know, but now you walk in and, you know, there's also. A thousand cameras on you.

• 1:01:52Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:52Mauricio Umansky?

  Right?

• 1:01:53Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:53Mauricio Umansky?

  And you're the public eye and people are, you know, talking about you and making stuff up about you and all kinds of different, you know, things, you know, it's like, I mean, having, you know, to me, having, uh, that was definitely a sacrifice I made, that, that the privacy of life, the being, just, just being private, being, you know, um, and I don't know how else to say it, it's like literally just being private.

• 1:02:16Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, I know, I know what you mean.

• 1:02:17Mauricio Umansky?

  Um, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's amazing, right? And you, and, and so many people want to be publicly known and they want the notoriety and they want the celebrity status and all of those things, but, you know, people don't realize what a huge sacrifice comes with that.

• 1:02:33Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:33Mauricio Umansky?

  And, um, and it's not necessarily bad, it also brings money.

• 1:02:38Ed Mylett?

  Right, the benefits of building a brand, all those other things, right?

• 1:02:40Mauricio Umansky?

  Benefits, I have made it very clear and I, you know, if it wasn't for The Real Housewives of Beverly Hills, uh, if it wasn't for television, like, I, I think we would have still grown, I think we'd still have an amazing business, right? Because, you know, before I ever got on television, I was already the number one agent in the, in, in California. But there was no way I would have built the business I had as fast as I have without television.

• 1:03:02Ed Mylett?

  And you talk about that, so building a network and building a brand, maybe you're not going to be on The Real Housewives of whatever, but I think business has become not just about who you know anymore, but about who knows you. And that's why social media does matter and why building a brand for any entrepreneur out there, I believe there's value to, do you, do you agree with that?

• 1:03:21Mauricio Umansky?

  A hundred percent, and, and you nailed it, you don't need television to build the brand.

• 1:03:26Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 1:03:26Mauricio Umansky?

  I mean, like, uh, let's be clear, it certainly helps.

• 1:03:29Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 1:03:30Mauricio Umansky?

  Um, it gets it out there, but not everybody, you know, there's not, you know, ten million shows or a hundred million shows, right? Like, there's only so many seats out there, as you said. And, uh, but you could, I've seen amazing brands built, you know, by, by, you know, with other methodologies.

• 1:03:44Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, but by, by building social media, by building referral bases, by, but you talk about that and having a network, like, because you also say in the book, and I just think this is brilliant stuff, this is just stuff people don't do in friendships, like one thing I try to do even with you or other friends of mine. Just time to time, I just go, hey man, I'm thinking about you. I love you. You okay?

• 1:04:02Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:03Ed Mylett?

  Anything, right? And there's a principle of this in the book for business too. I want you to stay on this point, which is to stay in touch. Because this is, you're not, most people in sales or in their career think that they're building for like just this year. They don't think that they're building a company. So you're planting seeds often right now that you won't even harvest to get a client or referral three, four, five years from now. So talk about that.

• 1:04:25Mauricio Umansky?

  Hundred percent. And it's, it's so important. Like, you know, I have approximately 2,000 salespeople that work for me right now. And I get to see the way they act all the time, right? You see the guy that makes the $5 million sale, they make a hundred grand and you know, they're off to Cabo.

• 1:04:41Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:04:42Mauricio Umansky?

  Boom, right?

• 1:04:43Ed Mylett?

  Dang it, yes.

• 1:04:44Mauricio Umansky?

  Bye. Like, where are you going? I'm off to Cabo. I'm like, dude, you finally made some money. Okay, like.

• 1:04:51Ed Mylett?

  Keep the momentum going.

• 1:04:51Mauricio Umansky?

  Get it going on, like, you know, and then it's like, you know, and then it's, you know, I'll use me, right? As, as, as a real concrete situation, you know, I sell the Playboy mansion.

• 1:05:01Mauricio Umansky?

  You know, hundred million dollar deal, right? Multi-million dollar commission. I'm in the next day in the office.

• 1:05:09Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:05:10Mauricio Umansky?

  And like five people come up to me, five of my salesmen come up to me, they're like, congratulations, but what are you doing here? And I was just thinking to myself, well, where else would I be? You know, they're like, well, why aren't you on vacation? I'm like, cause this deal ended. What's next? I can't re-bring this deal back, right? Like, it's gone. It's not gonna, so what am I tomorrow? What am I three months from now? What am I seven months from now, right? And, and as soon as that ends, it ends.

• 1:05:35Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:05:35Mauricio Umansky?

  Right?

• 1:05:36Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:05:36Mauricio Umansky?

  And that's what these, that's what people don't understand. So when you're planting those seeds, when you're staying in touch, you're staying in touch for the future.

• 1:05:43Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:05:44Mauricio Umansky?

  For the next thing.

• 1:05:45Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:05:45Mauricio Umansky?

  Right?

• 1:05:46Ed Mylett?

  Why is it that people don't get this?

• 1:05:47Mauricio Umansky?

  It's unbelievable to me.

• 1:05:48Ed Mylett?

  It's the big separator. Now we're going into it, guys. This is a big old separator. Here's what I think happens. You actually say it in the book. That's why like,

• 1:05:56Speaker 07

  I told you, you said, did you get my book? I said, dude, I read it this weekend. I read your entire book in two days and I know you. So I know a lot of the stories in the book, right? But it's this good. So I'm like, yes, damn it, scream this. And one of the things you say is like, don't believe your press clippings. Like, don't believe the hype about you. Here's what happens to most people. They get a little bit of success and then they start believing the crap about them. Like, oh, I can do this whenever I want, or this is. I actually, this is probably, because I don't think you do it the way I do it. But I play a little scared. Like, I, I don't, you're so confident, I don't think you, but like, it's similar. I play a little scared. Like, when I get a good deal or something good's happened, I've had an exit or, you know, this show's doing really well.

• 1:06:38Speaker 07

  I'm like, okay, I gotta do something to keep it going or do it better. I don't go, yay, I'm the greatest podcast host in the world. It'll just grow on its own now.

• 1:06:47Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:47Speaker 07

  But that's what a lot of, you must see with your salespeople all the time. Like, they believe the hype or even recognition. I was at your event, I was the speaker at your event. The best thing you do in your culture is how much you love on your people and they have a good time and you recognize them. I do that really well in my companies, too. It's a double edged sword sometimes, though. Because one, you're saying you're amazing, you're great. And a lot of people are like, yeah, I sure am. I'm gonna celebrate. And they live off last year's production or award for the next two years. And they wake up, they're like, wow, I can't get a deal done. I lost my mojo. Because they believe the hype.

• 1:07:16Mauricio Umansky?

  Yep. The seeds you plant today are for tomorrow, not for today, right? And it's, you're so right, Ed. And, you know, one of the things that I just keep thinking about is, you know, you and I are so similar in different ways.

• 1:07:28Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:07:29Mauricio Umansky?

  Right? Similar and different.

• 1:07:31Speaker 07

  Yep.

• 1:07:31Mauricio Umansky?

  But, you know, when you and I, you know, you invited me to play the member guest at, you know, the Madison, and you and I are just these competitive

• 1:07:38Speaker 07

  Yeah.

• 1:07:38Mauricio Umansky?

  Son of a guns. Right?

• 1:07:39Speaker 07

  We didn't win, by the way.

• 1:07:41Mauricio Umansky?

  We didn't win. But that damn ball, that last punch just hit the pin.

• 1:07:46Speaker 07

  Damn, dang it.

• 1:07:47Mauricio Umansky?

  I'm still pissed, anyway. But it was, you know, and golf is a game of life. We always talk about it, right? But you and I are in there and we're like, you know, when I'm hitting a bad shot, like you're, you know, you're making me feel like it's okay to hit the bad shot. And when you're hitting and when you're not, you know, it's super on, I'm making you feel like, you know, and I'm pumping you up because I know how good you're gonna hit that next shot and you're pumping me up because you know how that could, you know, and it's that whole thing, right? That's what we have to do with our, with our, with our, with our people. Yes, exactly. That's, and that is the, the, the life that we have to create. Are you good at that? Like making people feel good about themselves, making them feel that you believe in them, you pour belief into them? I think I'm pretty good at that. I think that that's one of those things that we can always be better and can always continue to work on because, you know, it goes back to time and it goes back to the balance of time. Like I could be great at it, but if I don't have time and I don't put the effort, I suck.

• 1:08:33Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah, you know, the other thing you're good at doing is, um, by the way, guys, we're covering a lot of stuff in a short window here. I'm loving this conversation. But you, the other thing you do is you have surrounded yourself with people who are good at the stuff you aren't good at doing. One of the most important things to do.

• 1:08:48Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, so talk about that a little bit because I don't think a lot of entrepreneurs do it. They're like, I'm gonna do everything. They micromanage every single little thing, or they deplete their energy doing stuff they're not really that good at and don't have a proclivity for. And then they don't have the energy and juice to go do the things that really move the needle in their business. You are really good at moving the needle in your business because you don't deplete your energy most of the time doing stuff you're not good at or don't enjoy.

• 1:09:13Mauricio Umansky?

  I think one of the most important traits that a person can have, a business person, a person in anything, is being able to really self, um, self-analyze. Yes. Your strengths and weaknesses. Mm-hmm. And not trick yourself that you have strengths where you have weaknesses and not, you know, because most people, they trick themselves. That's, that, it, I mean, I think that's one of the biggest mistakes I see in people is that they trick themselves. They think they're good, they pretend they're good at something, or they think they're good at something that they kinda suck at. Yes. Okay? And being able, be able to be self-analytical and understand your weaknesses is probably the most important thing because then you can hire to your weaknesses.

• 1:09:58Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:09:59Mauricio Umansky?

  Right, and I hire to my weaknesses. And I also hire what I think is amazing brains that don't necessarily think like me. I don't need another human being next to me that thinks exactly the way I think so that we could be all day long. Hey bud, are we **** great? We're the best, yeah, yeah, let's do it red, yeah, red, red.

• 1:10:23Mauricio Umansky?

  Right, I need somebody like, no, I want blue, like, that's not red, you know, like, and why? Right, now, now I need the brain. Why do you want blue? Okay, now, I might be the boss, I might end up picking red. But I want to hear every damn reason you want blue, okay? And, and then, and then it's up to me whether I pick it or not.

• 1:10:43Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 1:10:43Mauricio Umansky?

  Right, but I want to hear it.

• 1:10:45Ed Mylett?

  This is two things we have in common. If I was to say there's a trait that you and I really, really share in common, that we do well. By the way, we both have things we don't do very well. So what we do, like that, you know, golf sometimes, but, um, but actually, what we both do well is we ended up in our lives becoming self-aware enough to know the things we were good at. And we've spent most of our business lives and personal lives playing to those strengths. And not, that's why we're relatively young men that have had some real success. Because I haven't wasted a bunch of time trying to get really good at things I'm just not good at doing. And the other thing that we have in common, you're really good at that, Mo. The other thing we have in common is that, um, I don't have to be right all the time. If someone is smarter than me in a meeting or a decision, I will defer.

• 1:11:29Ed Mylett?

  My ego can get too big, I'm sure, but it's not too big. The, doing it right is better than it being my idea in business all the time. And I think you're really, really good at that, too.

• 1:11:38Mauricio Umansky?

  And by the way, not being right all the time is potentially even more important in your relationships.

• 1:11:43Ed Mylett?

  How do you mean?

• 1:11:44Mauricio Umansky?

  Boyfriend, wife, girlfriend, you know, you, you, you, you don't, you know, I, I see so many friends of mine. And they fight with their wives, they fight with their husbands, they fight with their boyfriend, girlfriend. And, and they're really fighting just because they need to be right. Right, if you can learn that you just don't always have to be right, you know, it could go a long way in your relationship.

• 1:12:05Ed Mylett?

  Really true. I do that with Cristiano. A lot of the times I'll say, hey, listen, I don't need to win this.

• 1:12:11Mauricio Umansky?

  Right.

• 1:12:12Ed Mylett?

  This is not about me winning and you losing, or me right and you wrong. Sometimes it's just like, we can even agree to disagree, or I'll just take your idea and we'll go with it a lot of the time because life's pretty damn short. At the end of your life, you're like, man, I won 11 of 12 fights with my wife. Yeah, there's no, the scoreboard doesn't matter in this stuff at all, yet we do it. By the way, we do it even in negotiations and deals too.

• 1:12:33Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:33Ed Mylett?

  I'm sure you've had that even in escrows where they're going the wrong way. You're like, no, I'm right.

• 1:12:36Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:37Ed Mylett?

  Well, it doesn't matter if you're right. What matters is the deal gets closed, right? And you gotta be able to defer when you do it.

• 1:12:41Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:41Ed Mylett?

  You've had a glimpse into the most successful financially successfully, financially successful people in the world and famous people in the world.

• 1:12:52Ed Mylett?

  Let us in a little bit. Tell us whether or not those people are any happier than, like say your mom and dad when you were growing up, or people that you and I both know that don't have financial means or success. Is there a, do you see any correlation in how, are they happier, less happy, more stressed, less stressed?

• 1:13:09Mauricio Umansky?

  Great question, and you know, it's, it's a, there's no, there's no straight up answer to that. You know, everybody's different. I can tell you that successful people have an easier time, you know, they have the means to be happy. That doesn't make them happy. Okay, right, that your mindset, your life, your way of being, you know, the way you look at life, that makes you happy, right? But having the money and having success and having, you know, a beautiful house, an ability to jump your plane, all of that stuff, it makes it probably a little easier to set your mindset up, right? You also probably have the ability, if you have money, to have coaches that can coach you in mindset.

• 1:13:54Mauricio Umansky?

  They have the ability to have, you know, to hire, you know, people to help you, right? Where if you don't have that, it doesn't make you unhappy, but you just have less means to, you know, to, to, you have to work harder yourself.

• 1:14:12Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:12Mauricio Umansky?

  By the same token, you have less distractions. So there are a lot of people that can, you know, that, you know, love to go, you know, and by the way, what does that money mean, right? Like, to somebody with, you know, a $350,000 job, right, like,

• 1:14:27Mauricio Umansky?

  That could be, that, that's money. Right?

• 1:14:30Ed Mylett?

  Sure.

• 1:14:30Mauricio Umansky?

  They don't need to have ten million dollars. Okay? They can live great on that. Have a simple life, have a nice, you know, a, a, and, and be super happy, surf every morning.

• 1:14:41Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 1:14:41Mauricio Umansky?

  Right?

• 1:14:41Ed Mylett?

  You and I have friends that are doing just that.

• 1:14:43Mauricio Umansky?

  And they're super duper happy, right? So, so to me, the, the, you know, you, suffering is hard.

• 1:14:51Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:51Mauricio Umansky?

  Right?

• 1:14:52Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:53Mauricio Umansky?

  Having a job, you, you, you could be happy at any stage, but, but, and, and you could be unhappy at any stage. I have seen some really miserable billionaires.

• 1:15:01Ed Mylett?

  Me too.

• 1:15:01Mauricio Umansky?

  Really miserable billionaires, uh, that have absolutely everything. And have absolutely nothing going on in their life. Okay? And I have seen some valet parkers that are thrilled to be alive.

• 1:15:17Ed Mylett?

  You're right. Yeah. It's interesting that I just, today, when we're recording this, um, I just had this show come out with this study that was done at Harvard. It's an eighty-five year long study, dude, and they studied two thousand young men. A thousand of them were Harvard, uh, sophomores, from probably pretty privileged backgrounds. Wealth abundance, most of them, and then another thousand from, of boys from, like, broken, underprivileged, privileged families in Boston. Poverty. They studied them their entire life. Like, everything about them, not just like surveys, like in-home meetings, brain scans, MRIs, talk with their kids. And there is a correlation to exactly what you just said, which is that there's no correlation between massive wealth and, and happiness. But there is a correlation if you can't have your needs met.

• 1:16:02Ed Mylett?

  If you can't meet your needs and pay your bills and eat decently and have a nice place to live and take care of your family in need and emergencies. That suffering does cause a lack of happiness, but the massive abundance doesn't necessarily do it. So you're, what you've seen in your laboratory of your life is really true. How about this? Any through lines on financially successful people? Cause I've met, it's really hard for me, I'll meet somebody that's like, man, what does that guy have in common with that lady who's also wealthy? And I've had a hard time, like, Taking away like what do they have in common? I think what I've seen is there's a level of confidence in their chosen craft that might separate them. But has there been a difference that you've observed in financially abundant people?

• 1:16:47Ed Mylett?

  A through line with them and personality traits or behaviors they have that help them generate that wealth as opposed to those that don't?

• 1:16:54Mauricio Umansky?

  A hundred percent. And let's throw away the Lucky Sperm Club, right? Let's throw away the inheritance money, right? And let's just talk about the wealthy, you know, people that are self-made, right? To me, they have, there's a couple of characteristic traits that are there that make them, that are core traits. Competitive, needing to win, right? Like, that to me is a super, a great trait that is a common trait amongst people. There's one trait that I've seen a lot of wealthy, successful people that I happen to think is a bad trait. Okay? Greed. Okay? And like, let's just start with those two, right?

• 1:17:38Mauricio Umansky?

  Like, there's a lot of greedy wealthy people out there and they're greedy because they need a lot of money and they just want money and they want money and they want money and they keep bringing it in, right? But their decisions that they make in life are made from greed and therefore, you know, you know, the people that work for greedy people are generally not as happy as people that work for competitive people.

• 1:18:01Ed Mylett?

  Really, that's true. Man, very true.

• 1:18:03Mauricio Umansky?

  Right? It could be a huge company, they could be kicking some ass, they could be making all the money in the world, but all their employees have a terrible culture. They have a terrible, you know, they [bleep] hate it, right? Like, they're making money, but they're not happy people, right? Or you can work at a company where the culture is, you know, amazing and, you know, you're the head guys, you know, so to me, those are two traits that, you know, and the other trait that makes, that seems to be a common trait, and you said it, and you said it and I have it, is fear.

• 1:18:35Ed Mylett?

  You do have it too.

• 1:18:36Mauricio Umansky?

  We, I definitely have it. I forgot, I meant to go back to that. Um, that fear is a very common trait. The fear of having a house over your, you know, head, you know, the fear of being able to provide for your family and your kids, the fear of putting food on the table the next day, the fear, you know, like all of that, right? And particularly if you've had it and lost it.

• 1:18:55Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:18:55Mauricio Umansky?

  Right? You've had the bankruptcy, you've had the whole thing, and then you rebuild again. And then it's like, and you, and when you're an entrepreneur, you put everything at risk, because that's what an entrepreneur does, right? And so there's ups and there's downs and there's that. But that's the commonality that just continues to, to bring you back, right? Um, and then hopefully keeping it.

• 1:19:14Ed Mylett?

  Okay, that surprises me about you, because I'm a very fear-driven person. I've leveraged fear all of my life. I mean, I think the way I got wealthy was, I didn't, I don't even know that I wanted to be wealthy. I think I was afraid of being poor.

• 1:19:25Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:26Ed Mylett?

  And then even at this stage, I still leverage fear on myself pretty regularly. But I think you can almost see that on me. I'm a pretty intense wound-up dude a lot of the time, whereas you, it seems like it's bubblegums and rainbows most of the time when I'm around you, because you're so positive. Even this thing, story you tell in the book where you come home and Kyle says, how was your day? And you, you're like, it was the greatest day of my life.

• 1:19:49Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:50Ed Mylett?

  And so there's this mindset of yours. So how do you nuance that duality of staying super positive? Because this is really profound stuff that you're saying right here, that only really mo, like, I think, I think the thing I admire about you is there's a level of, um, genius with so much humility that you're unaware of your genius. Like, I actually am not totally sure you know every reason why you've been successful, because you have so much humility for a dude with such genius. So how, do you know how you nuance, like, living in some fear, leveraging it, but at the same time, you're a really positive, optimistic person?

• 1:20:26Mauricio Umansky?

  Yeah, a hundred percent. Um, I'm extremely op- uh, optimistic, uh, super positive guy. Um, but I can also tell you, you know, I had kids, um, you know, very young, right? Um, when I married Kyle, and I met Kyle, I already had a five-year-old daughter, right? And I was twenty-five years old. Um, I had Alexia at twenty-six. Um, you know, I had Farah, you know, so I had three kids before I was thirty, okay? And I can tell you that I I definitely have kind of that old world lifestyle where, you know, I'm a man and I need to provide for my family and I need to, you know, I am the provider even though I wanted

• 1:21:10Mauricio Umansky?

  to make sure, you know, Kyle that made every decision in her life, right? I never wanted to hold her back. If she made money, if she did stuff like that was just extra, right?

• 1:21:18Ed Mylett?

  Become a lot of extra.

• 1:21:19Mauricio Umansky?

  Right? You know, but I never wanted to have that be her pressure. I needed to be the provider. And so, you know, because I was so young with kids, I definitely, you know, and again, I was, you know, I was borrowing money from my grandfather, from Kyle's mom, from my father, you know, in order to keep a roof over my head, right? And in order to keep a roof over my kids' heads and to give them, you know, a perceived good life so that I can, you know, you know, make them feel confident and all of that stuff. And so because of that, I developed a fear of losing, which also despite all the risks I've taken, despite all the things I've done, I can tell you that I've had so, I've been so conservative on so many investments that I've probably have left a lot of money on

• 1:22:04Mauricio Umansky?

  the table.

• 1:22:05Ed Mylett?

  Me too.

• 1:22:06Mauricio Umansky?

  Okay? Because I haven't been willing to take that risk. So I have that fear.

• 1:22:10Ed Mylett?

  Me too.

• 1:22:11Mauricio Umansky?

  I'm just a positive son of a gun.

• 1:22:12Ed Mylett?

  No, by the way, me too. By the way, I think sometimes guys like us are the ones that remain wealthy though, when they get there. And I have that risk aversion too. It's so interesting how similar we are on this stuff. Now, you said a good life. We don't have that much more time. One of my favorite conversations ever is today. Cause I get to see this side of you that I know, but it's being revealed and then the rest of the world figures out, oh, that's how this dude did this. That's how I could do it. And success leaves clues. And Mo wrote a lot of the clues in this book of how to become successful. This gentleman to my left, just to give you a background, this guy parlayed a 990 SAT score.

• 1:22:49Ed Mylett?

  Into a multi-billion dollar company that he built. And we're gonna get into your head about how you did that, but I'm overwhelmingly impressed with Impact Theory, which is an organization that he and his wife Lisa started the last few years that is really making a difference in the world, just like his company Quest Nutrition did. And so, Tom Bilyeu, thank you for being here today.

• 1:23:08Tom Bilyeu?

  Thank you for having me, man. I'm so excited to be here. We flipped the script before, so...

• 1:23:13Ed Mylett?

  I've been on his program and now finally I get you here. Were you like this young? So, I know you didn't have the best SAT scores in the world, but I've been around you enough now. I consider you a freak, which is a compliment coming from a guy like me.

• 1:23:28Tom Bilyeu?

  No, no, no, I take it as such.

• 1:23:28Ed Mylett?

  I think you know what I mean. You're uniquely driven and wired to pursue greatness and to make an impact, no pun intended, in the world at a level that most people have not yet realized they're capable of, even though they are. And so, did you know this young? If we went back and looked at this kid who grows up in Washington State, was there already these obvious insights and clues that you were gonna turn into this guy? What were you like as a young guy?

• 1:23:55Tom Bilyeu?

  There definitely were not clues. So, when I was a kid, I didn't show any signs of promise, to be really fair. And my own mother, when I left for college, like she, I almost chickened out and I was like, "I don't wanna go, I wanna just stay home." And she was like, "No, no, no, you need to go, you need to go," pushes me out of the nest. And then, literally, every day since, she's tried to claw me back. So, one day, like, I don't know, three or four years ago, I said to her, "Mom, like, you were the one that kicked me out. Like, I wouldn't have left if you hadn't pushed me. So, why did you push me?" And she said, with no malice whatsoever, "I just always assumed you were gonna fail."

• 1:24:32Ed Mylett?

  Oh, my gosh!

• 1:24:32Tom Bilyeu?

  And now, she had never been like, "Always my biggest cheerleader, always rooting for me, telling me I could do it." But quietly, just inside, she was like, "You didn't show any drive." So, the one thing I will say is, I was grandly ambitious. I always said, "I'm gonna be rich, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do that," always, always, since the time I was a little kid. But I didn't have the drive to see it through. So, I really, really was an empty dreamer when I was a kid. And it was learning to... Hate that in myself, if I'm completely honest.

• 1:25:00Ed Mylett?

  Yes.

• 1:25:00Tom Bilyeu?

  And to not allow myself to be an empty dreamer, to force myself to get the skills to actually execute against it, to not be in any way, shape, or form pacified by saying I'm gonna do something, which is actually super dangerous. Most people just thinking about the fantasy of what they're gonna do gives them some partial sense of, "Oh, I've done it." Whereas, I stopped letting that be okay for me, which largely came down to embarrassment I felt around my wife working when I had no job. And that was the time, she was my fiance at the time. But that was when I really started to go, "Okay, you've made a lot of promises to this woman and you're not on a path to keep any of them."

• 1:25:37Ed Mylett?

  Wow. Our stories are unbelievable. I did not know that, and our stories are unbelievably paralleled. I was in the same situation, by the way, where I was sort of an entrepreneurial unemployed guy while she was paying our rent, right? So I relate to that, too. How does, I'm just curious, I wanna make sure I just, I think you're one of the great American business stories.

• 1:25:56Tom Bilyeu?

  Wow, man, thank you.

• 1:25:57Ed Mylett?

  And not only because of the wealth that you've accumulated, but because of, this word's overused, but it's so true with you, because of the impact you're making in the world because of your success. That's what I admire. As you know, that's what I'm trying to do with the Max Out program, too, and just with my life. So, what I don't get is this connection, so just help me understand it, because you know that I know your story, I'm fascinated by it. How do you get from a 990 SAT into USC?

• 1:26:23Tom Bilyeu?

  How I got into USC itself, this, this makes me a little sad. This is one part of the story I wish were a little different. I cheated all through high school. So, the one thing that, yeah. So I graduated in the top 10 of my class, and the-

• 1:26:39Ed Mylett?

  You were a good cheater.

• 1:26:40Tom Bilyeu?

  I was a good cheater. And, and this is one thing I will say, people talk about network and they talk about charisma and all, it's, it's just real. And so, I was nice. And that got me a long way. I, I remember in 7th grade, so one of the guys I would later cheat off of in high school becomes my absolute best friend in the universe, but he's on the spectrum, right? The autism spectrum. And in 7th grade, he wouldn't talk to anybody. And so, I, I turned around one day and I was very outgoing at that time. time in my life, which I consider myself now just a dyed in the wool introvert. But at that time, the role in the family that I played was the jokester. So I was used to getting laughs and getting my self esteem from my ability to make people laugh. So I turned around to him in seventh grade, I point at him and I'm like, my mission in this class is to get you to talk.

• 1:27:26Tom Bilyeu?

  And so inside he was thinking, oh, my God, somebody actually cares.

• 1:27:29Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:30Tom Bilyeu?

  And so then it became like, we just started attracting to each other. And he is still to this day, probably the smartest person I've ever met.

• 1:27:37Ed Mylett?

  Wow.

• 1:27:37Tom Bilyeu?

  Um, and so it just became this sort of unlikely pairing. But to give you an idea of like, how weird this kid was, and but we're still close to this day. So he, he talks of himself like this. My mom said, if he doesn't start acknowledging me when I say hello to him, he's not allowed to come over anymore. She would literally say straight up to his face, hi, and he would say, nothing. It was super weird. And so I was like, dude, you just gotta say hi back. And so he credits me with teaching him like social skills and I credit him with helping me graduate high school, basically. So, but I always believed.

• 1:28:10Ed Mylett?

  Graduating high school.

• 1:28:11Tom Bilyeu?

  Literally, and I always believed that I could do the work, but that other things were more important to me. So I told myself a total bullshit story, which was that, hey, I could be working and earning these grades. But I'd rather like learn how to be, how to talk to girls and how to like socially engage. It's total BS, I'm well aware of that now. But at the time, it really felt totally justified. And I was like, they're not teaching us things that are going to help anyway. Nobody can answer why algebra is going to be useful to me. And so I just felt like that was fine. But when I went to college, day one, I said, okay, I'm going to be taking on a massive amount of debt. I'm learning the thing that I love. This is what I want to do with my career, so I better actually know how to do it.

• 1:28:52Tom Bilyeu?

  So the phrase that I repeated in my head over and over and over was A or F, sink or swim. I will not cheat, not even one. It doesn't matter.

• 1:28:59Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 1:29:00Tom Bilyeu?

  Either one of those is acceptable. The only thing I care about is that I do every bit of work myself. And so, and I stuck to that. So my grades in college are reflect, and I did better in college than I did in high school.

• 1:29:11Ed Mylett?

  And you didn't, is this true that you, you were going to, you want to be a filmmaker?

• 1:29:14Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes.

• 1:29:15Ed Mylett?

  Right?

• 1:29:15Tom Bilyeu?

  Very much.

• 1:29:16Ed Mylett?

  But you didn't know that there was a difference? Difference between USC Film School and USC?

• 1:29:20Tom Bilyeu?

  Dude, welcome to growing up in Tacoma. So first of all, like, nobody really knew how this all worked. So I went to USC because my dad had a friend who made almost an offhanded comment. My dad was like, oh, my son wants to go be a filmmaker. And the guy was like, oh, USC is the best film school in the world. And so my dad comes home and goes, I hear USC is the best film school. So I was like, well, I guess I'm going to USC then. Literally, I didn't even think beyond that. It is the only film school that I applied to. I applied to one state school and then to USC, and that was it.

• 1:29:48Ed Mylett?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 1:29:49Tom Bilyeu?

  And I got into USC, and I just thought the way college worked was you tell them what your major is, right? People talk, you declare your major.

• 1:29:56Ed Mylett?

  Right.

• 1:29:56Tom Bilyeu?

  So I thought, cool, I'll go declare my major. And then in the prep, so I've already committed, I've already said I'm going to USC. I've turned down the other offer that I had at the state school. It's done. I'm going to USC, taking the financial aid package, all of it. Then they come to your town and they orient you to like what it's gonna be like, and they show you pictures and all this stuff, and I was so excited. And then, I don't know if I asked a question or if it just came up, and they said something about how to get into the film school, it's a separate application process. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 1:30:24Ed Mylett?

  Your heart dropped.

• 1:30:24Tom Bilyeu?

  What do you mean? Literally, my heart dropped through the floor. And I was like, oh, God. And so then I was like, what are the requirements? And they said, well, we'd like to see a 1300 on your SAT. And I was like, what do I do now? And that was the beginning of like real panic.

• 1:30:38Ed Mylett?

  So what did you do?

• 1:30:39Tom Bilyeu?

  So I go to USC and I'm like, somehow I'm gonna figure this out. And you have mandatory counseling. And I go to the counseling and they look at what I've signed up for, and I've signed up for film classes like I'd already been accepted to the major. And they said, Tom, listen, right now, you're gonna end up spending a fifth year at this school because statistically, you are more likely to get into Harvard Law than you are into USC Film School. Do not do this. We see people do this every year. Get out of these classes, take normal general education requirements. And I was like, no, no, no, I'm gonna get in, I'm gonna get in. And it's the one time in my life where someone looked me point blank in the face, and they said, you are going to fail. Like, it's not a question of if, you are going to fail, you are going to spend a lot of money. And they were doing it from the position of like, look, I don't want you to waste the money.

• 1:31:20Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 1:31:20Tom Bilyeu?

  But they were so aggressive about it. And there was something in them telling me that I couldn't do it. That was like, I'm definitely doing this. And so I found there was a guy that was on the admissions committee who offered like you could go join him for lunch. And so I went, he made the offer to like a class of 350 people and I was the only one who showed up. And I was like, how is this possible? So I said to him, look, I got a 990 on my SATs, what do I do? I really want to get into film school. And he said, Tom, SAT stands for Scholastic Aptitude Test. It's supposed to tell me how well you'll do on college. You've already missed the freshman class, you're not gonna be, you're not gonna get accepted then. So you can only get accepted as an incoming junior, but as an incoming junior, I don't care about your SATs because I have two years of college to look at.

• 1:32:04Tom Bilyeu?

  So he said, if you don't want me to worry about your SATs, just get good grades. So I said, cool. For the next two years, all I'm gonna do is get good grades. I didn't date, I didn't party, I didn't drink, I literally didn't leave my dorm room. I worked, I put my head down for two years and I just worked. And I got, if it wasn't a 4.0, it was like a 3.95 or something. So it's never that clean. Like I want my story to be, hey, I learned that if I just put my head down and work my ass off, I can get whatever I want. That is unfortunately not what I learned because I believed at the time, you're either talented or you're not. So I wasn't in film school to become a filmmaker. I was in film school to learn the technical side. How do you turn on a camera? Where do you put a light? Things like that. But I thought you either have the ability to tell a story or you don't. So I believed myself to be a natural filmmaker.

• 1:32:49Tom Bilyeu?

  I just believed I had talent. And so I go to film school and everything is proving. So first I gamble, right? And I take all the film prerequisites, even though they tell me not to. I get into film school, so that feeds my ego. Then second, my, so you have two classes that are like testing you to see where you're at as a filmmaker. And I smash it. First class, smash it. And your second class, you have to team up. And basically, everybody wants to direct. And anybody that wants to be a cinematographer that's good, all the directors are fighting for them. And so not only did I get the cinematographer everybody wanted, but I got to direct. And then we killed our film. It was amazing. So now I'm like, I'm the shit.

• 1:33:28Tom Bilyeu?

  Like literally every egotistical belief that I had about myself being naturally talented is just, is just happening for me. It's effortless, I'm not even putting that much. Energy into, I mean, other than the physical production, which is exhausting. But I'm not like trying to be more artistic. I'm trying to learn how to turn on cameras and stuff like that. But I'm just a naturally talented filmmaker.

• 1:33:46Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 1:33:47Tom Bilyeu?

  So, everything in college is leading towards, only four people in your class get to direct a senior thesis film. So, all the people, everybody else crews, but four people get to direct. And I was chosen as one of the four.

• 1:33:59Ed Mylett?

  Wow.

• 1:33:59Tom Bilyeu?

  So, literally, the narrative in my head is, I am naturally talented. You either have it or you don't. And I have it, and I'm very grateful that I have it.

• 1:34:07Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 1:34:07Tom Bilyeu?

  And then I make my senior thesis film. And it is the most catastrophic, horrific, crash and burn, embarrassing thing I've ever gone through. The class is making fun of me. They're cutting up reels of my film to make a joke out of it. I mean, it was, it was abysmal.

• 1:34:22Ed Mylett?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 1:34:22Tom Bilyeu?

  And in that moment, I realized the cold, hard truth. And this is, when I tell this story, people think, oh, now he's just being hard on himself or being overconfident. I'm telling you right now, I didn't have talent. And so, in that moment, I realized, I don't know how to tell a story. So, whatever natural talent looks like, I didn't have it. It was so bad, I stole the master from the school.

• 1:34:40Ed Mylett?

  No way.

• 1:34:41Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes, because I never wanted it to be seen again. So, like that, like, this is a really, so that leads into the darkest period of my life.

• 1:34:48Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 1:34:48Tom Bilyeu?

  So, I graduate, and you would think, hey, but you worked so hard to get into film school. Why isn't that the ringing narrative? And it just wasn't. The ringing narrative was, you thought you were talented, you're a fool, you don't know anything. And I couldn't afford to furnish my apartment. So, I was literally laying on the floor of my apartment. I had an air mattress, but I was laying on the floor of my apartment.

• 1:35:08Ed Mylett?

  With a degree from SC.

• 1:35:09Tom Bilyeu?

  With a degree from SC, taking every remedial job that I can get, because I, now my ego is so crushed.

• 1:35:14Ed Mylett?

  Smashed.

• 1:35:14Tom Bilyeu?

  I need to be the smartest person in the room. It's like the only thing I have left. Well, at least I'm naturally smart. So, I just put myself in dumber and dumber rooms, which means I'm making less and less money. I'm selling video games retail at one point. I mean, it was really bad.

• 1:35:26Ed Mylett?

  You're putting yourself in dumber and dumber rooms so that you were the smartest person in that room.

• 1:35:30Tom Bilyeu?

  Correct.

• 1:35:30Ed Mylett?

  Got it.

• 1:35:30Tom Bilyeu?

  I wouldn't interview for a job unless I knew this person at some point in the interview will say, why are you interviewing for this job? You're better than this.

• 1:35:39Ed Mylett?

  It's interesting to me, the takeaways you have from experiences, because in life, it's not the experiences that put us, it's the meaning we take from them. And it's interesting to me that even you getting into film school, even, your takeaways are deeply unique and very self-aware.