Cooking In An Immigrant Time Warp With Maangchi (Reheat)

In 2007, Maangchi was 50 years old, a single mother of adult kids, and was addicted to online gaming. Her son suggested she post a cooking video to YouTube. Today she has 4 million subscribers and has taught fans all over the world how to cook traditional Korean food.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dan Pashman?

  As we turn to fall and the weather starts to cool down, I think of things like crunching leaves. I think of sharing from the sidelines of a soccer game, walking the dog in the woods. And when I think of doing all those things, I'm usually wearing something from LL Bean. Whether it's my puffer vest, my puffer coat, my scarf, whatever you're doing outside this year, you probably need something from LL Bean. Whether it's their boots, their Scotch plaid flannel, their rugged field coat, or more. Grab the layers and people you love and get outside. Visit llbean.com to shop the fall collection. LL Bean, be an outsider. As someone who has been lucky enough to go to Napa Valley, I can tell you, it's everything people say it is. Beautiful scenery, quaint, beautiful towns, and phenomenal food and

• 0:44Dan Pashman?

  drink everywhere you go. I don't even know that much about wine, but I know that every glass of wine I had in Napa Valley was excellent. I mean, there's no bad glass of wine and no bad meal. Choose between hundreds of wineries, tasting rooms, and chef-led restaurants from a low-key lunch on a vineyard terrace to a full tasting menu paired by the winemaker. Plan your trip at visitnapavalley.com.

• 1:07Dan Pashman?

  Hey there, Dan here with another Sporkful reheat for you. And I gotta say, look, in a world where it feels like every day it brings a new YouTube or social media sensation, if there's one thing that is warm and comforting and reliable on the internet, it is Mong Chi. She's a cookbook author who has been called YouTube's Korean Julia Child. When I interviewed her, we talked about why she decided to take her love of Korean cooking and bring it to the public, and how she feels about this YouTube channel she has now with millions of devoted followers. She's also a huge figure for Korean Americans and Korean adoptees, some of whom maybe are struggling to connect with their culture, and Mong Chi is sort of like their adopted internet grandma. And so it was great to get a chance to meet her, and I love everything she does. If I need a Korean recipe, I look to Mong Chi. Anyway,

• 1:51Dan Pashman?

  I hope you enjoy the conversation. And remember, if there's a vintage episode of the Sporkful you want us to pull out of the deep freezer, let me know, drop me a line, okay? I'm right here. Send me an email or voice memo to [email protected]. Make sure you include your first name, location, what episode you want us to hear, and why. Thanks so much, and enjoy.

• 2:11Dan Pashman?

  Do you still do the editing for your own videos?

• 2:13Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:14Dan Pashman?

  Wow. Did you have to learn how to use that software?

• 2:16Speaker 01

  All the time. I'm learning every day something new.

• 2:20Dan Pashman?

  This is Mang Chi, YouTube star and cookbook author. Her videos on how to cook traditional Korean dishes have been viewed hundreds of millions of times. She shoots them in her apartment and edits them herself. Pretty much the only thing she doesn't do is run the camera.

• 2:35Speaker 01

  And then I give a hard time to my camera person. Hey, you make me look so old.

• 2:43Speaker 01

  My poor cameraman. So, so all these things I'm directing. Are you doing now? This is?

• 2:51Dan Pashman?

  Yeah.

• 2:52Speaker 01

  What? I didn't know. I thought that you were just only talking before studying.

• 2:59Dan Pashman?

  Well, it's the same. The interview is also only talking.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  Okay, you make me so, so comfortable. That's why I didn't know.

• 3:05Dan Pashman?

  Yeah, it's very relaxed. We're just gonna have a nice...

• 3:06Speaker 01

  You're so tricky.

• 3:07Dan Pashman?

  Yeah.

• 3:07Speaker 01

  Because you didn't let me know. Okay, Mang Chi, start.

• 3:15Dan Pashman?

  This is The Sporkful. It's not for foodies, it's for eaters. I'm Dan Pashman. Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people. Each of Mang Chi's videos starts the same, with Mang Chi facing the camera, perfectly coiffed hair, often wearing a fascinator or other fancy hair clip. She's always waving almost maniacally and saying...

• 3:34Speaker 01

  Hi, everybody.

• 3:36Dan Pashman?

  She has a real warmth about her and so much passion for Korean food.

• 3:41Speaker 01

  You can make a possum at home, like this. Exciting.

• 3:46Dan Pashman?

  And she takes time to really cover every step of the process, like when she spent several minutes showing us how to clean and prepare a whole octopus, even turning the head inside out.

• 3:56Speaker 01

  And all disconnect. And then, inside out. Yay.

• 4:02Dan Pashman?

  Sometimes while she's cooking, she'll share a story.

• 4:04Speaker 01

  Funny story I have. When I was in Korea, we traveled, all my family, we traveled. I bought a huge octopus for my family. So I asked the lady, "Can you clean the intestine for me?" She said, "Oh, okay, I can clean it for you, but can I keep the head?" What kind of dealing is that? It was very shocking for me. Head has also a lot of meat and it's good. So I said, "No, I can do by myself." And then I brought it.

• 4:35Dan Pashman?

  The videos are not glossy, they're homey. No matter what Mang Chi is doing, you always feel like you're there in her kitchen with her while she cooks. Mang Chi is 63. She launched her YouTube channel 13 years ago in 2007. Today, she has 4 million subscribers. More than a million people have watched her make white rice. Later on, we'll get more into her videos and Korean cooking. But first, I wanted to learn more about her life before YouTube stardom. Because Mang Chi wasn't always Mang Chi. She was born Kim Kwang-sook and grew up on the southern coast of South Korea, in the port city of Yosu.

• 5:10Speaker 01

  Every morning, I woke up with that horn and the boo sound and also tong tong tong tong tong tong, the fishing boat. Early morning, those guys work so hard, you know, 4 o'clock AM, they just tong tong tong tong coming into this harbor to sell their fish they caught. And it was living exactly right near dock. Because my father's job, his business was getting involved with some seafood, you know, selling and auctioning. I always, I love this kind of, you know, some mood, atmosphere. Because people are just already start to working and carrying carriers, carrying heavy, you know, the fish.

• 5:50Speaker 01

  And like a mountains of some fishes in my house and fishermen come, you know, my father is auctioning, you know. So really, really busy, busy, busy. And I love this. Whenever I think about Yosu, my heart is beating. My heart is really beating and right next door, my mom's friend, who was running a small kind of bar for the, some fishermen or anybody workers, you know. She made some dunejanggo, Korean soybean paste soup with cabbage. And she makes a huge pot, you know, it's filled with this. And also she sell the makguli, you know, the rice liquor.

• 6:35Dan Pashman?

  Makki Lee is a traditional Korean alcoholic drink. As Mang Chi explains on her website, it's made by combining rice, yeast, and water with a starter culture. It's milky white, fizzy, and refreshing. It's also called nangju, which means farmer liquor. Because it's made with a lot of rice, it's filling. It was traditionally served to farmers as part of a mid-morning snack or lunch.

• 6:56Speaker 01

  The workers, you know, those guys are just, they'll warm their body with that hot soup. And Korean people love, love, you know, dounjang goo, soybean paste soup, and also makki lee. That's their breakfast. Every morning I smelled, I woke up with this smell, make me crazy. So these days, I keep making my fermented bean paste soup at home. At least once a week, I make this. Whenever I make, I taste this, I think about that memory, my good memory when I was young.

• 7:31Dan Pashman?

  That dounjang, or fermented soybean paste, is salty, a little sour, and very umami. It's similar to miso, which is also made with fermented soybeans. Dounjang is a big part of Korean cuisine. It gets added to a lot of dishes. In fact, it's so integral that in 2010, there was a South Korean film called "The Recipe." It was about a death row inmate whose last wish is for a bowl of dounjang jige, that fermented soybean paste stew. Those flavors of home became especially important to Mang Chi when she moved to America. So 1992, you came to the US with your ex-husband.

• 8:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:09Dan Pashman?

  He got a job teaching at the University of Missouri. And so you're 35, you come to the US with him. Am I right that you brought a block of fermented soybean paste with you?

• 8:20Speaker 01

  Oh my god, you read this for my first cookbook?

• 8:22Dan Pashman?

  Yeah.

• 8:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, at that time, I didn't know. America sells, Korean store sells Korean dounjang. I didn't know, I'd never been to America. So I have to prepare. How can I survive without dounjang? I couldn't imagine. So I made this major block at home. And just I brought all the way from my immigration, big bag.

• 8:46Dan Pashman?

  So Maechi was prepared for the worst. But as it turned out, even in 1992 Missouri, there were Korean markets around. She was able to get ingredients to make Korean food. She was especially happy to learn that oxtail, which is a delicacy in Korea, is pretty inexpensive here. After some time in Missouri, Maechi moved around a bit. She and her husband got divorced, and she ended up in Toronto. That's where she saw a job listing, looking for someone who spoke English and Korean and who'd studied education. Well, Maechi had gotten a master's in education, so she took the job, counseling Korean-Canadian women who had experienced domestic violence. And even in that role, food was key.

• 9:25Speaker 01

  Once a month, we had some self-help group, and they all went through domestic violence. And I want to make them feel kind of, today's I'm princess, you know? So I just, they come, and then I made a homemade kimchi for them. I want to make sure that they are my VIP. You know, so I just go to Korean markets, work. So I brought the good quality hot pepper place. Sometimes a frozen oyster. I want to add it. All of Koreans love that oyster kimchi.

• 9:59Dan Pashman?

  So you're cooking for these women because you wanted them to feel special?

• 10:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 10:05Dan Pashman?

  What was it about that work that appealed to you?

• 10:09Speaker 01

  Oh, because that, you know, I want to help people. And for example, somebody, you know, was had to go through after divorce or separation, and then especially they were abused, you know, physically, mentally, emotionally.

• 10:27Dan Pashman?

  I know that you said a lot of those women had just been through a divorce.

• 10:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:31Dan Pashman?

  So you had also been through a divorce. Did that help you be able to help them?

• 10:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. I didn't get this kind of help when I went through my own, you know, problems. But you make food and sharing this same food together. And this is, we are really connected. And when they taste this and they really know that I love them, also, you know, they love me. So I learn from them too.

• 11:01Dan Pashman?

  What did you learn from them?

• 11:03Speaker 01

  I learned from them, they are kind of a sturdy. And even though that kind of a situation, always they want to make a joke, funny. And, you know, usually like this kind of some, you know, woman who goes through this kind of hardship and easily you are supposed to be very negative. But my team was none like that. I, I want to them to say that, you know, that you guys are always encourage each other. Don't try to judge each other, just to give them only compliment. So, so what do we want is move forward, let's go.

• 11:56Dan Pashman?

  Maangchi took that same let's go attitude into a very different part of her life. Her biggest hobby at the time, video games. In 2003, Maangchi got really into online multiplayer role-playing games. Her favorite was called City of Heroes. She spent hours each night joining forces with players around the world and going on missions. Her characters in the game were never like healers. They were always powerful attackers. That's why she named one of them Maangchi, which is Korean for hammer.

• 12:26Speaker 01

  So one of my the healer friends asked me, hey, you are going to make a second character. Why don't you be healer this time? So I said, what are you talking about? I would rather go to medical school in real life.

• 12:43Dan Pashman?

  You want to be the hammer?

• 12:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:44Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 12:45Speaker 01

  Big sword.

• 12:46Dan Pashman?

  Maangchi says attacking is just more fun. She says she also loved the community of online gaming, connecting with people all over the place, plotting strategies with her teammates. I've read that you were, you said that you were addicted to online gaming. Is that true? You feel like you were addicted?

• 13:02Speaker 01

  I can say this because every day, at least three hours, I play a game. Even Saturday, Sunday, sometimes really, because I want to level up. Okay, my level is now only seven. Okay, second character, I like to make it 50 quickly. And then all I can do is just keep playing, keep playing. And sometimes I felt dizzy, dizzy, and then I had to lay down on my bed. Oh, my God.

• 13:35Dan Pashman?

  So it's 2007. Mang Chi is 50 years old. She's still living in Toronto, not working with the abused women anymore. She's a single mother of adult children, and she's addicted to online gaming. And it's at this point that her son comes to her and says, "Hey, Mom, you should start a YouTube channel. You're such a good cook. Feature your cooking." Coming up, Mang Chi the gamer is reborn as Mang Chi the YouTube star. Stick around.

• 14:19Dan Pashman?

  It's time to open up a can of advertisements.

• 14:26Dan Pashman?

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• 14:54Dan Pashman?

  As we turn to fall and the weather starts to cool down, I think of things like crunching leaves. I think of sharing from the sidelines of a soccer game, walking the dog in the woods. And when I think of doing all those things, I'm usually wearing something from LL Bean. Whether it's my puffer vest, my puffer coat, my scarf, whatever you're doing outside this year, you probably need something from LL Bean. Whether it's their boots, their Scotch plaid flannel, their rugged field coat, or more. Grab the layers and people you love and get outside. Visit llbean.com to shop the fall collection. LL Bean, be an outsider. Start the day strong with Quaker protein products. Quaker makes it easy and delicious to get a good source of protein. No matter what the day has in store, Quaker protein

• 15:36Dan Pashman?

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• 16:20Dan Pashman?

  for easy weeknight dinners. Welcome back to A Sporkful Reheat. I'm Dan Pashman. Hey, if you're not already following The Sporkful in your podcasting app, what are you waiting for? In Apple Podcasts and Spotify, go to our show page and click Follow. In other apps, it might be like a plus sign, or a subscribe button, or a heart. Whatever it is in your podcasting app, please do that thing. It's the best way to ensure you'll never miss an episode, and it's good for our show. So please, go ahead and do it right now while you're listening. Thank you. Now, back to Mangchi. So it's 2007, and her son suggests she start a YouTube channel

• 17:02Dan Pashman?

  where she shares her recipes for Korean food. And she does. Her first recipe, spicy stir-fried squid.

• 17:11Speaker 01

  Squid, you can't find it any grocery store, I think, the squid.

• 17:18Dan Pashman?

  Maangchi says she picked this squid dish because it's one of her favorites and because she thought it would let her show off her knife skills.

• 17:25Speaker 01

  Whenever I wield my knife, gut and my squid, all the Canadian friends, their eyes are really rolling, wow. So I wanted to, I wanted to some surprise people. Okay, this is the way that, you know, I learned from Yosu when I was growing up. Like kimchi is a kind of headache, a little bit. I need to think more, how to teach this more effective way. So stir fry the squid is a piece of cake.

• 17:59Dan Pashman?

  Since launching that first video 13 years ago, Maangchi's following has grown and grown. So this has gone from a hobby to a job. But her videos still have a homespun feel. The most elaborate graphics are an occasional caption that pops up in Times New Roman font, like when she's squeezing out cabbage and a caption pops up that says, "Give a little foot massage." As a food video personality, Maangchi is a throwback. For decades, food TV shows were what's called stand and stir. The host is at the counter, teaching you how to cook something. But these days, the big hits are either competition shows, or if they're gonna show you a recipe, it's like a one-minute BuzzFeed Instagram video. So it's more about entertainment than about teaching. You get a great feel for Maangchi's style when you watch the video she made

• 18:42Dan Pashman?

  about one of my favorite Korean dishes, bokki sam. Bokki sam is pork belly boiled in spices and served with a bunch of garnishes, kimchi, spicy radish salad, fermented shrimp, and then it's wrapped in cabbage leaves. In Maangchi's bokki sam video, she goes into detail, deboning, trimming, and washing the pork belly.

• 19:01Speaker 01

  This is three-layered pork belly. So there is some bones inside.

• 19:08Dan Pashman?

  Maangchi boils the pork belly, adding spices to the pot, explaining why she uses each of them. Then, while it's boiling, she shows you how to make the spicy radish salad with oysters. Before going back, she takes the pork belly out.

• 19:20Speaker 01

  This is so handsome, isn't he? Wow.

• 19:25Dan Pashman?

  When it's finally cool enough to eat, she wraps the pork belly, kimchi, and radish salad in a cabbage leaf and shoves the whole thing into her mouth in front of the camera.

• 19:38Speaker 01

  Pickled cabbage, sweet and sour, crunchy? Who invented the bosa? He or she must be really genius because it has all kinds of texture, flavor, taste, everything. Seafood, meat, and vegetables. It's one pouch. You have all kinds of diet, balance the diet. Invite your friends and family and make this and have fun. And let me know how yours turns out.

• 20:04Dan Pashman?

  I want to talk for a minute about bosa.

• 20:06Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 20:06Dan Pashman?

  Bosa is one of my favorite Korean dishes.

• 20:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:09Dan Pashman?

  But I struggle with sometimes with the best way to eat it. Because I feel like when I get it at a restaurant, the pork is often sliced kind of thick. It's kind of big. And it's hard to get everything all in one bite. What's the secret?

• 20:23Speaker 01

  Just make it small.

• 20:28Speaker 01

  I thought you were smart.

• 20:32Speaker 01

  You can just cut it off.

• 20:33Dan Pashman?

  You have to cut the pork belly vertical because you want a little bit of the meat and the fat in each bite. You can pull it apart with your hands, but then you get fat on one side and meat on the other, and that's no good.

• 20:43Speaker 01

  You can use chopsticks, you know, Korean metal chopstick, and you can cut or, you know, even you can use your finger, you know, so cut it off. And the red spicy radish salad I will eat separately. So you can eat it.

• 21:00Dan Pashman?

  This is making me hungry.

• 21:02Speaker 01

  I have a really good recipe for bosa.

• 21:05Dan Pashman?

  I know. What's the secret?

• 21:06Speaker 01

  Did you see?

• 21:06Dan Pashman?

  Yes.

• 21:07Speaker 01

  Oh my.

• 21:07Dan Pashman?

  The hazelnut?

• 21:08Speaker 01

  Oh my god. You gotta make this.

• 21:11Dan Pashman?

  And you're basically like braising the pork belly, and the secret ingredient is that you add hazelnut coffee.

• 21:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, hazelnut coffee. I learned this from one of my fellow Korean when I lived in Colombia, Missouri. And pork smell, kind of gamey smell, is gone. And little bit subtle, the hazelnut coffee smell is inside.

• 21:34Dan Pashman?

  Oh my god, I really want bosom right now. Maung Chi said it perfectly, like it has everything. It may be the perfect food. It has every aspect of deliciousness that I can think of. And you see, when you watch that video or listen to Maung Chi talk about the recipe, the way she explains every step. As I said, she has a master's in education. She puts a lot of thought into how she's gonna teach each dish.

• 21:56Speaker 01

  Whenever you teach even like a serious philosophy, your students are slipping. That's nothing, you know? You gotta make them awake. You need some tactic, right?

• 22:08Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 22:08Speaker 01

  So even most importantly is the best recipe. But how can you make it more a little bit entertaining? So I always think about, that's why all I can do is while I'm cooking, I'm wearing mostly blue jeans and t-shirts. What can I do? Only I put something on my head. Flower sometimes and hair change, you know? So like that's the kind of my way of entertainment.

• 22:35Dan Pashman?

  And is that why you like to mix up your look? Is for entertainment, just to give, make the videos more exciting?

• 22:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, make them excited, make them think that, oh, you know, what Maung Chi is wearing today? You know, something, that's true. Some children love them.

• 22:50Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 22:50Speaker 01

  Some children, even one of my readers says that, "My six-month-old baby loves you."

• 22:58Speaker 01

  And whenever I turn on your video, her eyes are just sparkly.

• 23:07Dan Pashman?

  Maung Chi's most popular video of all time is her recipe for traditional kimchi, with 13 million views. That one was actually featured in one of our past Sporkful episodes, called "Your Mom's Food." We looked at how children adopted from other countries and raised in America use food to connect with their cultures of origin. Skylar Swenson was adopted from Korea as a baby. As an adult, she got together with other Korean adoptees to learn how to cook Korean food. I played a clip of Skylar from Maangchi in the studio.

• 23:36Speaker 02

  We made kimchi together, watching this YouTube series by this woman. Maangchi, I think is her name.

• 23:44Speaker 01

  Hi, everybody. Today, we are going to learn how to make Korean traditional kimchi. There are so many hundreds of different kinds of kimchi. This is going to be...

• 23:55Speaker 02

  She is this like super cute, glammed up Korean lady. She's fabulous. And she kind of walked us through how to make kimchi at home. And so it was this kind of very millennial American moment, watching a YouTube video about our ancient culture of origin of like how to make kimchi. So, yeah.

• 24:18Dan Pashman?

  And how did you guys feel about that experience?

• 24:21Speaker 02

  Oh, it was beautiful. I mean, it was so fun to be making ritual together. That is a unique Korean-American adoptee activity and teach ourselves, like bring ourselves up in America as Korean-Americans, because our white parents maybe aren't able to do that for us. We fought for that. We like taught ourselves how to have an understanding of that part of our identity that was lost.

• 24:49Dan Pashman?

  What do you, what do you think of that?

• 24:50Speaker 01

  Years ago, one lady, I met her and she said that, oh, if my birth mom is living with me, probably, just like Maangchi.

• 25:02Dan Pashman?

  She was sort of imagining that like you were her birth mother?

• 25:06Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm, yeah. And when I heard this, it just really touched my heart, really made me emotional. So I, I always hear this kind of story all the time. So adoptees, Korean adoptees, a lot of people so successful, so successful and very nice. I'm so proud of them. And these people want to learn Korean. They don't want to disconnect Korean, you know, culture, Korean heritage, and they like to learn. So food makes people connect to each other.

• 25:48Dan Pashman?

  So I put out to our listeners and asked them to write in with questions for you. Are you ready?

• 25:53Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 25:53Dan Pashman?

  This first one, this was a great question because this was actually one that I wanted to ask you. And then a listener separately came up with the same question. This was on Instagram from Amaretini, or maybe it's A-Maretini?

• 26:03Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 26:03Dan Pashman?

  Not sure. She wrote it, "What do you consider to be the top three essential banchan dishes?" Banchan, the little side dishes that come in Korean food. I was gonna, I was gonna say, if you were trapped on a deserted island,

• 26:17Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 26:18Dan Pashman?

  If you were trapped on an island and you could only have three banchan with you, what would be the three you would pick?

• 26:23Speaker 01

  Hmm. Kimchi.

• 26:26Dan Pashman?

  Okay.

• 26:28Speaker 01

  Kimchi. Second, braised soybeans, because it has protein. And number three is dengjang jjigae, soybean paste stew. As long as I have rice and these three items, I can live until 100 years old. I'm without missing anything. I can survive, no problem, yeah.

• 26:54Dan Pashman?

  Jed Lawler writes, "My kimchi comes out very sour, but without much funk, not much umami. What could be wrong?"

• 27:04Speaker 01

  How often you open this kimchi container? When you put it in the refrigerator, it takes two weeks to ferment. You always, every day open, at least hello and open. That's what Koreans do, because we eat every day.

• 27:19Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 27:20Speaker 01

  So if you make kimchi, when it starts fermenting, you can, you should turn it over a little bit. And then just press down. So kimchi brine is just submerged, kimchi submerged in brine. Then you can, your kimchi will be so tasty.

• 27:38Dan Pashman?

  This one came on Facebook from Elizabeth Dong. She says, "Right now, it seems really trendy to have processed cheese on Korean food." She says she went to a Korean barbecue place and they put a cup of shredded cheese on the side of the grill to melt. And she asks, "Am I supposed to dip my meat in it? Many Asian people have lactose intolerance, so when did this cheese love start to become a thing? And what's the best way to eat cheese with traditional Korean food?" First of all, I'm gonna divide this into two questions, because I'm curious now. Is this, have you seen this trend?

• 28:13Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, yeah, decades at least, you know, but even when I was living in Korea, the cheese is very kind of, you know, little new, very new things. Only the cheese is more available is craft, kind of a sliced, thinly wrapped one.

• 28:29Dan Pashman?

  Craft singles, like the American cheese.

• 28:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's the cheese, all, everybody thinks that that's the cheese. So some after there's some imseul cheese, kind of mozzarella cheese, and just made, produced in Korea. So they mix it together everywhere they try to put, you know, on the beef, sometimes, you know, rice cake, and quite delicious, even spicy rice cake on top, you know.

• 28:53Dan Pashman?

  Now, maybe you're thinking, craft singles on Korean food? But after US soldiers were stationed on the peninsula during the Korean War, some Koreans developed an affinity for American cheese. And then in 2012, a free trade agreement between the US and South Korea made American dairy much cheaper and more popular. Today, South Korea is the second biggest importer of American cheese after Mexico. They eat it in all the ways you'd expect, string cheese and pizza. But it's also been adapted into more traditional Korean dishes, like one of my favorites, budejige, or army-based stew. The other question here was, what's the best way to eat cheese with traditional Korean food?

• 29:31Speaker 01

  Hmm, I made buldak, cheese buldak, the spicy fire chicken. I added cheese on top, mozzarella cheese, it look like lasagna.

• 29:43Dan Pashman?

  It's interesting, you talk about how, you know, food in Korea continues to change and evolve like everywhere else. Korean people travel other places, they come back, other people come in. Food, you know, that's, that happens with food everywhere. And I know you've also talked about the idea of like this concept of an immigrant time warp, where your perception of the home country stays frozen in what it was when you left.

• 30:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, that's, that's a very good point about so many things. My immigrant friends, they were living, they are living in America 30, 40 years. No Koreans are doing this anymore, no Koreans are singing this song.

• 30:28Speaker 01

  Because they they enjoyed this karaoke song like thirty years or forty years ago in Korea. But these days, that's like a fossil song. So nobody's singing, so these guys are still. Yeah, these guys are still getting together, singing old songs. That's why my food is kind of quite authentic, I can say, good way. And my, so my readers say that sometimes they leave a comment, oh my, Maangchi's making this way. My grandmother used to make that way.

• 31:01Speaker 01

  They don't, their mom doesn't make, doesn't make that way.

• 31:04Dan Pashman?

  Right, right.

• 31:04Speaker 01

  So because I'm the kind of, I used to make that way when I lived in Korea.

• 31:12Dan Pashman?

  When Maangchi goes back to Korea to visit, she makes a point of checking out the new trends there, especially with street food, which she says is always evolving. Sometimes her readers ask for a dish she's not familiar with, so she researches it and creates a recipe. That happened recently with the hit South Korean film Parasite, which just won Best Picture at the Oscars. One of the big themes of the film is class and inequality. And I won't give anything away, but there's a pivotal scene where the wealthy mother calls her housekeeper and tells her to make a dish called ramdam, so it's ready for her kid when they get back. Now, all these people who saw the movie have been Googling, coming to Maangchi saying, how do we make ramdam? Now, we're gonna go down a bit of a rabbit hole here, because I started reading up on this a bit.

• 31:52Dan Pashman?

  The best piece I found on it is on Food52, we will link to it on our site, but here goes. The term ramdam was invented for the film. The dish is actually called chapaguri. Chapaguri is a very popular dish in Korea. It's made from combining two types of packaged instant noodles. A Chinese-inspired ramen, and then a Japanese-style udon made with a spicy Korean seafood broth. The subtitle translator for Parasite thought chapaguri would be too unfamiliar a term for English speakers. So he made up the term ramdam, it's a portmanteau from ramen and udon. Whatever name you want to give it, it's an inexpensive comfort food that Korean kids love. But here's the twist. In this scene in Parasite,

• 32:35Dan Pashman?

  the rich woman wants really nice steak put on top. This would be like me putting fresh-caught lobster on my kid's Kraft Mac and cheese. Parasite writer and director Bang Jun Ho explained the thinking behind using this particular dish in the movie. He told the L.A. Times, "This is something kids like regardless of the rich or the poor. But the rich wife couldn't stand her kid eating this cheap noodle, so she adds sirloin topping." Anyway, that's the story of Ram-don, which is really chapaguri with super fancy beef on top. And as Mang Chi told me...

• 33:09Speaker 01

  A few of my readers asked me, "Can you make a video?" And then I was thinking, maybe, why not? I never tasted before. I don't know anything about chapaguri, and I made a video.

• 33:21Dan Pashman?

  That video just went up a couple of weeks ago.

• 33:23Speaker 01

  Have you watched the Korean movie Sensational Days? That movie Parasite? I watched it twice.

• 33:31Dan Pashman?

  So Mang Chi may have some immigrant time warp, but between her readers and her regular trips back to Korea, she stays in the loop. And when she goes back, she does more than just check out the latest food trends. There's a custom in South Korea where people visit their ancestors' graves and bring food and drinks. Recently, Mang Chi went back to her hometown in Yosu, that port city on the southern coast. When she was there, she visited the grave of her father, the seafood auctioneer.

• 33:59Speaker 01

  I pretended that my father is sitting in front of me, just by myself, you know, "Great father, I'm here." And I know that he cannot eat, but ever since I was young, like my grandmother, she always used to tell me, "Oh, today is some, you know, my grandfather's death anniversary day. All family got together. Food is a lot, so your grandfather is going to visit middle of the night." So I have some kind of idea, like I just pretended that, okay, he's listening to me.

• 34:33Dan Pashman?

  And did you tell him about your YouTube channel?

• 34:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, I said, my father, when he was alive, and he was always proud of me. He, one time, I used to do some interpretation for my CD, and there was a Biennale, kind of art festival. My father was so proud of me. And, wow, you are, my daughter speaks English well. Even just the only small part, you know, uh, my part for my community, made him so proud. So now I'm a Maangchi. If he were alive, probably he's busy bragging about me.

• 35:18Dan Pashman?

  Well, Maangchi's dad would definitely have a lot to brag about now. Her 2015 cookbook is one of Amazon's top Korean cookbooks of all time. Her new one, out now, is called Maangchi's Big Book of Korean Cooking. In it, she dives deeper into Korean cuisine and adds a bunch of new recipes, including sections on healthy meals from a Korean Buddhist temple, and also make-ahead meals for Korean lunchboxes. This episode is produced by me, along with senior producer-

• 35:43Speaker 03

  Emma Morgenstern.

• 35:44Dan Pashman?

  And producer-

• 35:45Speaker 04

  Harry Huggins.

• 35:46Dan Pashman?

  Our editor is-

• 35:47Speaker 03

  Tracy Samuelson.

• 35:49Dan Pashman?

  The show is mixed by-

• 35:50Speaker 04

  Jared O'Connell.

• 35:51Dan Pashman?

  Music help from Black Label Music. The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher. Our executive producers are Chris Bannon and Daisy Rosario. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.

• 36:00Speaker 05

  And I'm Tyler Nevens from Redding, Connecticut, reminding you to eat more, eat better, and eat more better.

• 36:19Dan Pashman?

  This reheat was produced by-

• 36:21Speaker 03

  Gianna Palmer.

• 36:22Dan Pashman?

  The team that produces The Sporkful today includes me, along with managing producer-

• 36:26Speaker 03

  Emma Morgenstern.

• 36:27Dan Pashman?

  And senior producer-

• 36:27Speaker 06

  Andres O'Hara.

• 36:29Dan Pashman?

  Our engineer is-

• 36:29Speaker 04

  Jared O'Connell.

• 36:30Dan Pashman?

  The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher Studios. Our executive producer is Camille Stanley. And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app? Yes, the SiriusXM app, it has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated- By genre and era, plus live sports coverage. Does your podcasting app have that? And there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more. It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one. And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to siriusxm.com/sporkful. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.

• 37:07Speaker 07

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• 37:38Speaker 03

  This podcast is supported by Nurtac ODT. Remedy Pant. We know you didn't ask for an interruption, but migraine doesn't wait for the right moment to interrupt either. It just barges in, takes your time, and throws everything off. So when migraine takes your time, take Nurtac. It's for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura in adults. Nurtac can provide pain relief in two hours, which can last up to two days. Ask your healthcare provider if Nurtac is right for you, because your time is for you, not migraine. Don't take if allergic to Nurtac ODT. Allergic reactions can occur even days after use. Get help right away for trouble breathing, rash, swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or throat. High blood pressure and Raynaud's syndrome can occur. Get help for high blood pressure, numbness, coolness, pain, or color changes in fingers

• 38:23Speaker 03

  and toes. Common side effect is nausea. For full prescribing information, call 1-833-4-NURTC or visit Nurtac.com. All right, back to your podcast, playlist, or whatever's keeping you going today.