John Cena: I Ate the Puke Burger

What happens when one of the biggest stars in wrestling history decides to completely start over? John Cena isn't who you think he is—and in this raw, deeply reflective sit-down with Trevor and Eugene, he proves it. From facing the fear of losing everything to questioning society’s obsession with success, the WWE legend turned bonafide movie star delivers a masterclass in self-awareness, aging, and what is takes to evolve beyond the roles that define us. He also opens up about his most personal choices, from why he doesn't want kids to healing his relationship with his father, before offering a powerful mindset shift on why we should replace the word "deserve" with "earn".

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Trevor Noah?

  What part of your body has taken the biggest hits? Like when you feel your body in the morning, is it your shoulders, is it your knees? Is there any part of your body where you go like?

• 0:12Speaker 01

  I was thinking of the hand. I was like...

• 0:13Trevor Noah?

  You're like, his hand is tired?

• 0:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's the bread and butter. That's the money maker, dog.

• 0:19Trevor Noah?

  Is there something that you have kept from your days of not having money that just still sticks with you?

• 0:25Speaker 02

  Uh, being broke. Like, I'm never going back.

• 0:28Trevor Noah?

  John Cena teaches us how to use deodorant.

• 0:31Speaker 02

  When you look at what we do, tons of crowd shots, crowds chant, they're literally like European football crowds.

• 0:39Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 0:40Speaker 02

  But we don't want them to shut up. We want them to keep being as rowdy as you can because if we perform to apathetic silence, it's really just kind of two guys in their underwear doing stunts.

• 0:50Trevor Noah?

  Sounds like a normal Saturday for you.

• 0:52Speaker 02

  Yeah. You know about that, right?

• 0:55Speaker 01

  Hey, I was too slow.

• 0:58Speaker 02

  You know what I'm talking about?

• 1:00Speaker 01

  Hey, I was too slow.

• 1:02Trevor Noah?

  They sometimes want to heal the relationship that they never had with their fathers by having kids.

• 1:06Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness. Wow. Wow, man, that's goosebumps. Wow, that's... Yeah.

• 1:13Trevor Noah?

  Do you still remember your bully, by the way? Because I remember my bully, and I'm always in... You don't remember where you bullied, first of all? I don't know if you were or weren't. Maybe you were the bully.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  It's happening now.

• 1:22Trevor Noah?

  Man, don't be like that.

• 1:23Speaker 02

  Nice. That was it.

• 1:26Trevor Noah?

  You saw me. I was like...

• 1:27Speaker 02

  Brother, get out of here.

• 1:29Trevor Noah?

  I just find it fascinating that everyone remembers their bully.

• 1:31Speaker 02

  Show me the doll where he touched you.

• 1:32Trevor Noah?

  I'm yet...

• 1:34Speaker 02

  What's a record you want to break? I said, "Life expectancy." I want as many days as I can get because it's beautiful. I don't want this to end, you know? Uh, and it will, and that's okay. But I have that appreciation. I think I've always had it. I just couldn't put it into words. My actions define that, like, yo, this dude is going for life. He's going at it.

• 1:57Trevor Noah?

  John Cena, everybody.

• 1:58Speaker 02

  That's it.

• 2:00Speaker 02

  It's a catchy tune.

• 2:05Trevor Noah?

  This is What Now with Trevor Noah.

• 2:11Trevor Noah?

  Earth can be a lot sometimes. Heat waves, gas prices, bad hair days. Why not go where life is good? Escape to Pluto TV. Turn off your problems and turn on your favorite movies and shows. You know, the ones you already love. From Anchorman, The Legend of Ron Burgundy, to Dirty Dancing, to Top Gun Maverick. From Alias to The X-Files. It's all here and all free. Go where the TV is always good. Escape to Pluto TV. Stream now, pay never.

• 2:46Speaker 03

  At Orismen Toyota of Richmond, we don't just sell cars. We build relationships that last long after you drive off the lot. That's why thousands of Richmond-area families trust us with all of their automotive needs. Orismen Toyota is your destination for new Toyotas, pre-owned vehicles, or Toyota service and parts. We're Central Virginia's Toyota truck headquarters with a selection of dependable and rugged trucks to match your ambition. Orismen Toyota of Richmond. Trusted tradition for over 100 years.

• 3:16Trevor Noah?

  This episode is brought to you by Verizon. Pretty much every brand offers rewards these days. But most of them, let's be honest, they aren't that rewarding. Well, starting now, Verizon's doing rewards different. Rewards your love all year round for every customer. They're introducing Verizon Dollars, which gives you cash back every month just for being a customer. That's it. Plus, you have the flexibility to use those glorious new dollars how you want. Shop with Verizon. Get gift cards for the brands that you love or transfer them to our partner programs. They're also introducing Verizon Shine, where now, every Monday,

• 3:59Trevor Noah?

  you can snag once-in-a-lifetime experiences like NFL tickets across the globe, all-inclusive music festivals, and the chance to meet your favorite stars. Plus, daily drops, tickets, and pre-sale access all week. So, let's recap. Cash back in your pocket every month with Verizon Dollars. And epic experiences from Verizon Shine every Monday all year round. Now, those are some rewarding rewards. Only from Verizon. Enroll today at Verizon.com.

• 4:31Speaker 01

  You know what I've never seen before?

• 4:32Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 4:33Speaker 01

  I saw it at your house. I saw this deodorant that doesn't smell like anything.

• 4:37Trevor Noah?

  Yeah. Just like a neutral... Wait, what's the point? Because you don't...

• 4:43Speaker 02

  It'll stop sweat.

• 4:44Trevor Noah?

  Thank you.

• 4:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:45Speaker 01

  Wait, it stops the sweat?

• 4:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 4:47Speaker 01

  And then you smell like what?

• 4:48Speaker 02

  Well, you can have a scent for that. You can have a cologne or a perfume. An eau de parfum.

• 4:53Trevor Noah?

  No, guys. Doesn't it throw you off that you put on... Because you always wear something that smells really nice.

• 4:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:58Trevor Noah?

  Doesn't it throw you off that then you're also putting on an underarm deodorant that smells different to that?

• 5:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, because the combat is different under there.

• 5:05Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but you don't need...

• 5:05Speaker 01

  Like, that's guerrilla warfare. That's trench warfare.

• 5:07Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but you don't need... You just need smell prevention.

• 5:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:10Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, that's all you need.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  So that just blocks the sweat?

• 5:12Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 5:14Speaker 01

  No, man. But it says scentless.

• 5:16Trevor Noah?

  Yes.

• 5:18Speaker 01

  It didn't say stop sweatness.

• 5:19Trevor Noah?

  No, that's what it does, though.

• 5:20Speaker 02

  That's what deodorant is. If it says deodorant, it's generally assumed that it stops the sweat.

• 5:24Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 5:26Trevor Noah?

  You know what gets me in my life sometimes? Is I go, "I can't believe John Cena has to teach you about deodorant."

• 5:33Speaker 01

  Well, he spent half of his life without a shirt.

• 5:35Speaker 02

  You're right. Lot of armpit sweat. Lot of armpit sweat.

• 5:40Trevor Noah?

  Ah, but this... Can I just say, thank you, man?

• 5:43Speaker 02

  It's been a while. Thanks for having me back.

• 5:45Trevor Noah?

  No, but not thanks.

• 5:46Speaker 02

  Eugene, nice to meet you. It's the first...

• 5:48Speaker 01

  Nice meeting you, man.

• 5:49Speaker 02

  First time we've met each other.

• 5:51Trevor Noah?

  Can't say, like...

• 5:52Speaker 01

  We're looking forward to this.

• 5:52Speaker 02

  Thanks for helping me dive into deodorant.

• 5:54Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, right? No, because you...

• 5:56Speaker 02

  Really testing my knowledge? Wait a second. No, it's not the purpose. I mean, it's to stop sweat. It's not... There's nothing to do with that.

• 6:03Trevor Noah?

  That'll just be like the episode title, "John Cena teaches us how to use deodorant." That's it. That's all he came to do. That's all he came to do. Uh, but no, man, you're busy. You're on the road, making movies, doing your thing. You know, you're just like...

• 6:17Speaker 02

  I appreciate that, but there's always time to just catch up with folks, man. There's always time. You know that.

• 6:22Trevor Noah?

  I love that about you. You just have like a... I've always wondered, is your vibe because of Massachusetts or is your vibe because of you?

• 6:30Speaker 02

  Ooh, uh, so what I'm hearing is, is it environmental or like, um, experience-driven?

• 6:38Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Phew. Because you have a very welcoming...

• 6:43Speaker 01

  Easygoing vibe.

• 6:43Trevor Noah?

  Warm, wise, folksy vibe to you.

• 6:46Speaker 02

  That's not Massachusetts. There's a term out there called "mass holes", and that is a real thing. So, wow, your explanation, thank you very much for the kind words.

• 6:57Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 6:58Speaker 02

  I would say that's less geography and probably more life experience. Yeah.

• 7:01Trevor Noah?

  How different are you to your siblings in that regard?

• 7:04Speaker 02

  Uh, I think we grow more similar every day.

• 7:06Trevor Noah?

  Really?

• 7:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think, you know, as we get into the, I guess, act three of our life, um, we're not trying to be heard as much. You know, I grew up in a household with four brothers, and we're all real close. My oldest brother's 52. I'm gonna be 50. And then it's 48, 46.

• 7:23Speaker 01

  50!

• 7:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 7:25Speaker 01

  There's no way you're turning 50.

• 7:26Speaker 02

  In April, I hope so. I haven't made it there yet, but I hope so.

• 7:29Speaker 01

  But you look good for 50.

• 7:30Speaker 02

  Thanks, man. I'll take, I look good and great.

• 7:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:34Speaker 02

  Half a century.

• 7:35Speaker 01

  I would have never guessed 50.

• 7:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're all real close, and I think, um, you know, growing up, you only got two parents. You struggle for identity and attention and like, who am I? Like, oh, my older brother was into theater and into tech.

• 7:50Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 7:51Speaker 02

  Uh, I kind of led the charge of playing sports. So then, like, I played football. So my older brother played baseball. And then my younger brother wrestled because he couldn't play football because I was like John's thing. And then baseball's Dan's thing. So it's like, um, I think we're less now searching for our identity.

• 8:07Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:07Speaker 02

  And more just enjoying the time we have with each other. So I think every passing day, we become more and more okay with who we are.

• 8:16Trevor Noah?

  So do you find that you... You know, because I was thinking about your life. Obviously, you know, I know you're coming to the show and we're gonna hang out with you.

• 8:22Speaker 02

  God, that's a nightmare.

• 8:24Trevor Noah?

  What do you mean?

• 8:24Speaker 02

  Thinking about my life? Son of a bitch. I don't wish out on anybody.

• 8:32Trevor Noah?

  I was, though, and I was going... You know, life is so interesting. So I was having this conversation with you the other day. I was going, um, when I was young, all I dreamed of was having a car that everyone would look at me in. That's all I wanted. I was like, man, I just want to be in a car and I want people walking by me like, "Whoa, look at that guy. And look at the car. Look at the guy." And then now, the last thing I want is for anyone to be looking at me inside any vehicle. You know what I mean? Like, I rented a car recently. We were doing shows in Cape Town. And it was a convertible. And then I dropped the top and then literally, like, two traffic lights. Some guy screamed out, I'll never forget. Whoever he was, he was a legend. Because you're like, "Trevor! Have sex with me, Trevor!" And I was like, "Well, the roof is going back up."

• 9:14Trevor Noah?

  But in my head, I thought...

• 9:15Speaker 02

  Pretty bold offer.

• 9:16Trevor Noah?

  No, it was amazing.

• 9:17Speaker 02

  Strong opener.

• 9:18Trevor Noah?

  I loved it.

• 9:18Speaker 01

  Especially because he was inside the car.

• 9:20Trevor Noah?

  Man, don't be like that.

• 9:21Speaker 02

  Yeah. Screaming at the top of his lungs, but he could have just asked.

• 9:27Trevor Noah?

  And and what I thought to myself is it's so funny how in life sometimes the thing you'll spend your entire childhood or your your young adult life hoping for becomes the thing that you either get over or start to want the opposite of. And I was wondering, like, when I was thinking of you getting dressed when you were a kid, like, trying to be as different as possible. Was that part of trying to find your identity, you think?

• 9:47Speaker 02

  Nothing's changed, man.

• 9:48Trevor Noah?

  You think so?

• 9:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. I look like a chocolate bar with pumpkin streaks, you know.

• 9:54Trevor Noah?

  I think now you like blend in.

• 9:55Speaker 02

  So I actually think I'm, uh, fa- fashion is, uh, expression. It's also you feel comfortable. I feel comfortable in this. This was me at like twelve, just the MC Hammer pants. And it was not a suit jacket. It was just like that kid in play, rayon top front.

• 10:12Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 10:14Speaker 02

  I'm kind of doing the same thing, you know. Um, it's it's interesting you bring that up. I think as we evolve, obviously, our we shouldn't be the same person we were yesterday.

• 10:23Trevor Noah?

  Right, yeah.

• 10:24Speaker 02

  And also, I don't think it's restricted to just being a young person. I think we're always searching for greener grass. I think that's human nature, right? You know, I got this, but yo, if I could only get this, life, I'd be on Easy Street. The the problem is that's it's not true. There there really is no easy street. There's just every situation comes with its own set of issues, uh, its own set of pros and its own set of cons.

• 10:44Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 10:44Speaker 02

  Uh, granted, that's, you know, you're on a relative scope. There there are people that are, you know, brought into this world who really have some steep hills to climb.

• 10:52Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 10:54Speaker 02

  And wanting to aspire to do more, that's great. But I think, at least in my experiences, when I focused on the if I just get this, I'll be happy.

• 11:04Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 11:04Speaker 02

  As soon as I get that, I'm just looking for the next thing.

• 11:07Trevor Noah?

  Hedonic adaptation, man.

• 11:08Speaker 02

  You know, so it's it's for me, it's more like, um, how can I move through space with with happiness that's not attached to material objects or even goal base? You know what I'm saying? How can I just live a good life?

• 11:20Trevor Noah?

  Yeah. How can you fall in love with the process as opposed to the the outcome?

• 11:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, man.

• 11:24Trevor Noah?

  That's one of the hardest things, though.

• 11:25Speaker 02

  Dude, it's not easy. That's and then like people throw that around in the pages of books and they'll talk about it on like motivational clips. That shit's hard.

• 11:33Trevor Noah?

  But it's because nobody sells us. You know what I've for myself, at least, what I've realized is nobody advertises the process to us in general, right? So if you think about it, you know, you and I have had this conversation. There are so many young boys who grow up dreaming of a Ferrari. And I mean, like, full on dreaming, oh, man, Ferrari, Ferrari, Ferrari. If I can get a Ferrari, I can get it. And they believe it. They truly believe that a Ferrari is the car that they want. But what we don't realize is none of us have ever driven it. But we all know that it's the car for us. We all believe that it's the car that'll come with a certain lifestyle. We'll and I always think so many of us are unlucky or lucky to bump into the thing and then experience this strange moment of like, where's the happiness?

• 12:19Trevor Noah?

  Because you go, if I get if I get the Rolex, the happiness comes. If I get the Ferrari, the happiness comes. If I get the fame, the happiness comes. If I get the promotion, the happiness comes. If I get the and a lot of these things do come with a level of happiness. You know, I I never say to people, don't want something. I always say to you, wanting is not the issue. But it's what you just said. Oftentimes, we want what we've never had, believing it'll give us something that we actually have had, which is a feeling. That always like throws me.

• 12:43Speaker 02

  And and I also think it's okay to like, man, I'm an auto enthusiast and, uh, I'm I'm wearing the crown. This is my one.

• 12:50Trevor Noah?

  What you what you got there?

• 12:51Speaker 02

  This is my one. Uh, I I used to get into the watch game, but I only have.

• 12:54Trevor Noah?

  What size? Do they have to add extra links?

• 12:56Speaker 02

  They sure they sure do.

• 12:57Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, I can see that. Look at this. Yeah, look at this.

• 13:00Speaker 02

  So it's weird that we, you know.

• 13:02Trevor Noah?

  Wow, guys. I can take the watch off while I'm wearing. I'll just wear it as a neckpiece.

• 13:07Speaker 02

  But you bring up Rolex, right?

• 13:08Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 13:10Speaker 02

  I got into collecting. I I'm I'm a collector of things and, uh, I got swept up in like watch mania. I don't care what the face says. The model is an Explorer two. And I fancy myself an Explorer also. So like, the story and the watch found me. It helps me define or it keeps me in check. Like, uh, the pocket watch I have on that has, uh, the Roosevelt coat, comparison is the thief of joy on the back and memento mori on the front.

• 13:40Trevor Noah?

  Oh, damn.

• 13:41Speaker 02

  If I think I'm drinking too much of my Kool-Aid, the front works to remind myself that I'm human and I'm gonna die. And if I get in a room where I feel like, oh, man, I don't feel like I belong. Well, comparison's the thief of joy, dude. You're good. Like, you're all right. And you'll like, you'll see me on red carpets, like, take this thing out and.

• 13:58Trevor Noah?

  For real? You'll you'll still have moments like that now in life?

• 14:01Speaker 02

  We all do.

• 14:02Trevor Noah?

  As John Cena. No, no, no, but I'm saying as John Cena. You you say we all do, but I'm in my head, I go, but not as John Cena.

• 14:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think I think that's.

• 14:09Trevor Noah?

  Like Jenny, like Jenny and I mean that for real.

• 14:10Speaker 02

  So again, I think that's the most difficult thing for people to conceptualize that, like, I've been very lucky in life. I know I'm aware of that. And I try every day to work hard to honor that luck. And also, I'm a human being. And when I stop losing the gambit of emotions of insecurity, embarrassment, shame, guilt, excitement, happiness, joy, when some of those start falling by the wayside, you you numb one, you numb them all. So like, I I feel all of that stuff. Doesn't matter who's on the poster, doesn't matter what the bank account says, doesn't matter the good days, the bad days, what time I play for dinner.

• 14:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 14:48Speaker 02

  I feel all that stuff because I'm human. And regardless of opportunities and and lottery tickets and luck, you you always feel that stuff. And I think we we have this vision of people that, uh, my bride and I say is like, must be nice. You know, like, oh, look at that. Must be nice. I don't know, man, because every situation, even if if you were born gold spoon in your mouth, never have to know what from a financial perspective, that comes with a whole list of issues that I don't even understand.

• 15:17Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 15:17Speaker 02

  The expectations, trying to walk in the shoes of who who got you that resource and luck.

• 15:23Trevor Noah?

  Keeping the gold spoon.

• 15:24Speaker 02

  Dog, I don't even know.

• 15:25Trevor Noah?

  Living up to the gold spoon.

• 15:25Speaker 02

  It's it's something I don't know about.

• 15:27Trevor Noah?

  Making other gold spoons. Hey, damn.

• 15:28Speaker 02

  But I look up, I look a level up and be like, ah, must be nice. They must have it easy. They have the resource to have freedom, that a set of problems I don't know about. But that doesn't mean they're not human. You know what I'm saying?

• 15:41Trevor Noah?

  I just in my head never thought John Cena. I guess we we often take for granted that we're always living inside ourselves. Do you know what I mean?

• 15:50Speaker 02

  Oh, that's enough. We see life through through this lens. Oh, that's it.

• 15:53Trevor Noah?

  But I'm I'm in myself, so I'm going like, mm, doubt, okay, worry, concern. I see you. I've never looked at you and thought that ever, ever, ever in my life. I've never thought to myself, I'll be like, oh, this is a wise guy, smart guy, funny guy, caring guy. But I've never thought to myself, no doubt, no doubt, you because because I'm not inside you.

• 16:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I mean.

• 16:13Trevor Noah?

  Man, hey, yo.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  Was he the guy screaming in my convertible?

• 16:15Trevor Noah?

  Hey, yo. Hey, yo.

• 16:19Trevor Noah?

  Your timing is amazing. Your comedy timing is, yo, man.

• 16:24Trevor Noah?

  Truly like, yeah.

• 16:27Trevor Noah?

  Have you ever done any type of stand up ever, like?

• 16:29Speaker 02

  No, I honestly, it's it's so odd how stand up runs so parallel to pro wrestling.

• 16:38Trevor Noah?

  Yay, yay. Don't do that to us.

• 16:40Speaker 02

  Uh, we're no, I'm I'm serious. There's so many parallels. First of all, uh, even at the highest level, most of the time, there are very rare cases. You pay your own way. You book your own travel. You organize your own life. Uh, you are responsible for your own gear. Um, it's the act is yours, right? Even though you're a part of this giant body. Uh, you're out there, uh, usually with one other person in front of thousands of folks who are hecklers and enthusiastic and they know they're part of the show. And you plan a routine in the back. But you also have to be ready to tell that first joke to crickets. And when the crickets happen, you gotta be like, change it up right now. Do this. Or

• 17:24Speaker 02

  if you have a whole elaborate thing planned and you go out and you look at each other and people are going nuts, scratch the plan, do this. So like, you have to be quick. You have to pivot. You have to know your audience. You have to know.

• 17:36Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 17:37Speaker 02

  Timing, every, uh, you you you guys are kind enough to say you have great comedic timing. I just think it's timing. Because pro wrestling, sports entertainment is timing. It's not what you do. You have to do things at the right spot. If you've been in the the guys who've been in the ring with me, I'm the loudest talker. If you're in the first six rows, you hear the match before the match.

• 17:57Trevor Noah?

  Oh, for real?

• 17:57Speaker 02

  I'd be like, come hit me. Give me the DDT. Do the and then I'll be like, we missed it. Wave it off. Don't do anything. Like, I I have never been as athletically skilled as the greatest talent in the ring. I'm always present and I'm always sensitive to the energy of the audience. And I think that was something that allowed me to have such a long career. It's like, it's not what I did. It's doing it at the right time.

• 18:19Trevor Noah?

  When you were doing it.

• 18:20Speaker 02

  Sense of timing, yes. Because funny can come out of nowhere. Funny can come from timing. You could you could hear somebody say something, be like, I got something for that.

• 18:28Trevor Noah?

  Right, right, right.

• 18:29Speaker 02

  You know when to land a joke. And you know, also being out there, uh, you know when the audience is like leaning forward with interest. So you or maybe you know that like, oh, that that didn't work.

• 18:39Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 18:40Speaker 02

  You know, in real time. And we're we're all gypsies. It's all road shows and it's a ton of town.

• 18:47Trevor Noah?

  Everything you're saying, in a weird way, I got goosebumps and then I was just like, this is.

• 18:51Speaker 02

  You start small.

• 18:52Trevor Noah?

  Surreal.

• 18:52Speaker 02

  You start working these POS places. They're like underground clubs, but in wrestling, it's like flea markets. My I I started performing in front of five people, five.

• 19:02Trevor Noah?

  This is exactly.

• 19:03Speaker 02

  It's.

• 19:04Trevor Noah?

  Stand up. I would have never said, the only other person who said this to me about their career like stand up is a stripper.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  I would I would honestly, uh, I would use that reference if the stripper was like a traveling stripper like.

• 19:18Trevor Noah?

  Okay, okay.

• 19:19Speaker 02

  One night, one night in Dallas, one night in Fort Worth, one night in Houston, one night in New Orleans. Cause you know, dude, a lot of it is just living the road life. If every set was at home, oh my God, you could walk home every day.

• 19:31Trevor Noah?

  Do you know what I literally said to you?

• 19:32Speaker 01

  We're having this conversation.

• 19:33Trevor Noah?

  Earlier today, no joke, this is what I literally talked to Eugene about is I said, one of the things that has stuck with me for as long as I can remember in comedy is how many comedians were committing suicide around the time that I started on the road in in in the United States. Cause in South Africa, we had such a small comedy scene, we still have a small comedy scene. So you spend more time at home.

• 19:55Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 19:55Trevor Noah?

  I always thought of it as a downside. I was like, I wish we had the road. I wish I came to the US. I was on the road. Nobody knew me. It was literally what you're saying. You're just that small act going around, paying your own way, getting from one place to the next. The club owner puts you on its flyers and everything. And then I would just hear comedians in the back room or in the in the green room go, hey, you hear about Tony, what up? Oh, yeah, shame. You hear about I would be an overdose and it was always like someone committing suicide or overdosing, always on the road, always by themselves.

• 20:23Speaker 01

  Hotel rooms.

• 20:24Trevor Noah?

  And it was, oh yeah, it was always like that, that, that, that dingy, lonely hotel room. Where you go, man, this person has just been by themselves trying to do something for such a long period of time. Experiencing glimpses of it, cause you see the audience, but they're not there for you.

• 20:41Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 20:42Trevor Noah?

  They're there for the main, the headliner.

• 20:43Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 20:43Trevor Noah?

  You you just you just got to sample it and maybe they liked you, maybe they didn't. And you go home and it's quiet and then you do it again. It's not even home.

• 20:51Speaker 02

  You go to like the Red Roof Inn or, you know, wherever, microtel or wherever you can stay, you know.

• 20:56Trevor Noah?

  No room service, like we're talking like that level of where it was.

• 20:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, where you're trying to watch every dollar being like, oh, man, I can split a room. When we when we wrestled, I'd split a room with six dudes. We'd do microtel, seventy nine bucks, six guys in a room.

• 21:07Trevor Noah?

  The first time I stayed in a nice hotel, like a decent hotel that has room service, there was food in the hallway. And I remember seeing someone had like a half eaten burger. And I was just like, what?

• 21:20Speaker 02

  What is this?

• 21:20Trevor Noah?

  What it what is? And then I I took it. I was like, this is.

• 21:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, I've I've done that, but I was I was actually quite, quite influenced when I did that.

• 21:32Speaker 02

  It wasn't it wasn't the first time I saw food in the hallway. It was a time where I needed food. I needed food, cause I knew the morning was gonna be rough and I needed food. Uh, gosh, there's a there's a bigger story there. Uh, we we got stuck in Ireland because there was a volcano. And we couldn't get back to the States to perform raw. It's actually the first time they like flew new guys in to do raw, like rookies.

• 21:55Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 21:56Speaker 02

  We got stuck. And the last thing you wanna do is leave us stuck someplace alone, idle with nothing to do. And boy, we had a great night and a friend of mine, um, Dylan, who is, who wrestled under the moniker Horn Swaggle and a friend, another friend of mine, Christian Cage, who was Christian in the WWE.

• 22:16Speaker 02

  Christian took Dylan to bed. Dylan was drunk. He had room service and ended up throwing up on his hamburger.

• 22:23Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 22:24Speaker 02

  Uh, that hamburger, Christian put him to bed, tucked him in. He said, dude, I'm gonna get the tray out, put the tray in the hallway. Flash forward two hours later, I am heavily influenced. And food is closed and there are no options available. And I look and I'm like, that burger's not even touched. I'm just gonna bring that inside. I ate the thing. And then I come down to breakfast the next morning.

• 22:52Trevor Noah?

  Oh, man.

• 22:53Speaker 02

  And I'm like, oh, man, you guys cool? You dipped out early and like, no, no, I he had some problems. I took him to bed. He puked on his hamburger. I put in the hallway. I was like, what?

• 23:05Speaker 02

  Wait, what room are you in? It's like on the you're on the third floor?

• 23:12Speaker 02

  And and I ate the puke burger.

• 23:16Speaker 02

  But it was, I needed it. I needed it.

• 23:18Trevor Noah?

  Oh, man.

• 23:20Speaker 02

  I needed it.

• 23:20Trevor Noah?

  You were like, this pepper and mushroom sauce.

• 23:24Speaker 02

  Man, I I have a feeling at that point, I didn't even know. Like I I heard the story in the morning and it's like, oh, yeah, that checks out.

• 23:31Trevor Noah?

  Did you tell them?

• 23:32Speaker 02

  No, no, that's we it happened, the unreal, the unraveling of the story happened in real time at breakfast. I'm like, yeah, you guys dipped out early. I had to take him to bed and God, he puked all over the room. He puked. I put his room service out there. I'm like, what? Wait, what? It's like a full burger and fries.

• 23:48Speaker 02

  You're on the third floor?

• 23:50Speaker 02

  I ate the puke burger. So it wasn't the first time I saw food, but in in a moment of necessity.

• 23:56Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 23:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's all nu- nutrition.

• 23:59Trevor Noah?

  I sometimes wonder if those experiences.

• 24:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, that sunk in.

• 24:04Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 24:05Speaker 01

  I was thinking about the burger.

• 24:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:07Trevor Noah?

  But if you didn't know, though, it's not the worst.

• 24:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, well.

• 24:10Trevor Noah?

  It's the knowledge of it that makes it worse.

• 24:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 24:12Trevor Noah?

  Otherwise, it's just like a Guinness flavored burger.

• 24:14Speaker 02

  That's probably what I thought it was, especially for me. Yeah, that's probably what I thought it was. Yeah.

• 24:19Trevor Noah?

  What what else is it gonna be?

• 24:20Speaker 02

  I think I had the fries too, man. I don't know.

• 24:25Trevor Noah?

  Is there is there something that you have kept from your days of not having money that like just still sticks with you?

• 24:31Speaker 02

  Uh, being broke, like I'm never going back. Uh, and and and I don't.

• 24:35Trevor Noah?

  It's like a fear that you have?

• 24:36Speaker 02

  Yes, it so I've I've worked really hard to turn the fear into, um, I guess, a realistic approach.

• 24:45Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  And I don't wanna speak in absolutes, the term never going back. You know, it just means I need to be responsible and make responsible choices.

• 24:53Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 24:54Speaker 02

  And, uh,

• 24:57Speaker 02

  that's the way I kinda move through space. Like, life has awarded me all this opportunity.

• 25:01Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  The worst thing I could do is piss it down the drain. So, uh, it's not that I don't live, I enjoy my life and I'm I'm I I honor the luck and and and live the life. Uh, yet every day I try to do so responsibly and make responsible decisions. I don't ever wanna go back. And I enjoyed the time where I was living in my car. I enjoyed the time when I, you know, I was leveraged to the hilt on credit cards just to try to learn how to wrestle.

• 25:26Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 25:26Speaker 02

  Uh, so, you know, living life at twenty one percent interest.

• 25:31Speaker 02

  That was it was a happy time and it was by choice. A lot of folks don't have that choice.

• 25:35Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, cause you chose to drive out and that's when you were like at the Gold's Gym, you were living in the car.

• 25:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, and again, I had I had safety back in West Newbury. My dad's like, you got a roof over your head anytime you want. I'm like, no, man, I gotta I gotta do this. I just, uh, my parents grew up, or I grew up with my parents and and we had times of prosperity and then real hard times. You know, my my dad's job was eliminated in the eighties. He was a real estate appraiser and that job became obsolete. It was absorbed by the banks. So we went to having from having a thriving business to having like no business overnight. And with five mouths to feed, five young mouths to feed and and his wife and himself. If we started stretching every dollar. So like going from prosperity to knowing that like, oh, there's there is another side to this. We made it. Everything was fine. I don't, you know.

• 26:21Trevor Noah?

  I see what you mean.

• 26:22Speaker 02

  But I just, um, I'm I'm gonna try my best to make consciously responsible choices relatively. And I'm I'm super good with budget. My bride keeps me great with that.

• 26:34Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 26:35Speaker 02

  I try to keep track of everything like I'm and that a lot of that is from wrestling. You you have to know the money coming in. You have to arrange your own, you know, we we perform in fifty states and foreign countries. You pay taxes and all that stuff. Like you you learn, you get like, um, financial lessons through street smarts. So a lot of that knowledge and and wisdom has helped me over the years. But even still today, I try to not let go of like, don't ever, don't ever not be aware of what's going on. Don't ever not be aware of where every dollar is going. Don't ever not be aware of the opportunities that are coming in. And by the way, it's gonna end. So make sure you're prepared and I it's not a job where you work thirty five years and it's done.

• 27:14Trevor Noah?

  Right, right.

• 27:14Speaker 02

  It could end with this interview. Like, everybody sees this interview and they're like, fuck that dude and it's lights out. It's done. You know what I'm saying?

• 27:21Trevor Noah?

  He ate what?

• 27:22Speaker 02

  Exactly, exactly. So it's it's a.

• 27:26Trevor Noah?

  I don't need him around my kids. I don't need him around my family.

• 27:32Speaker 02

  So I mean, that's it's it's a I understand it's a fragile business and I think.

• 27:36Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 27:37Speaker 02

  You know.

• 27:37Trevor Noah?

  But but you know, here's here's one of the things that I often think is a gift for us. And I mean us as in people who don't work in an industry that is sort of seen as stable. I think one of the gifts is that we are able to acknowledge something that is actually true for everyone. But is just less apparent in other jobs because your dad was doing something that was.

• 27:58Speaker 02

  Stable.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Very stable, very formal.

• 28:00Trevor Noah?

  Do you get what I'm saying?

• 28:00Speaker 02

  Overnight.

• 28:01Trevor Noah?

  I think of people who were working in factories when all of a sudden they automated. That was a stable job.

• 28:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:06Trevor Noah?

  I think of people now who are working, you know, in like law firms on a junior level and then A I is gonna come in.

• 28:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:12Trevor Noah?

  It was a stable job. I think of like that idea of stability is one that gets sold to us. And we make decisions in our lives and we believe, we truly believe this is stable, this is unstable. And I I sometimes think the gift of being in what's what's seen as like an unstable job or environment. Is that you just are aware of the instability.

• 28:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:32Trevor Noah?

  Whereas on the other side, it is just as man, people lose their job in the recession. Think how many jobs went away. Whenever industries shift, when economies move.

• 28:40Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:40Trevor Noah?

  You know.

• 28:41Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:41Trevor Noah?

  Detroit loses its industry, goes out and then it comes back and then it like life is unstable.

• 28:46Speaker 02

  It is, it is. And that's why I say like, oh, I'm never going broke. That's not true because that's beyond my control.

• 28:51Trevor Noah?

  Right, right. But you're just saying like, that's like the thing that sticks in your head.

• 28:54Speaker 02

  And and talking to a lot of like first generation entrepreneurs, successful folks.

• 29:00Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 29:01Speaker 02

  It's like we all struggle with that same thing of like, I just gotta get enough security. And anyone would be like, dude, you'll you'll be the richest guy in the cemetery. Like, what?

• 29:11Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 29:11Speaker 02

  What's your problem? Like, let it go. So I am working hard to like, let it go.

• 29:16Trevor Noah?

  Okay, okay.

• 29:16Speaker 02

  Uh, but that's that's one thing that as soon as I got my first paycheck from W W E, I was like. Don't fuck this up. Save as much as you can. Be responsible. Enjoy. Invest in yourself, for sure.

• 29:29Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 29:29Speaker 02

  Uh, but man, this is gonna end and probably quickly. You know, I I had my eyes on like average lifespan for an athlete. It's three years.

• 29:37Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 29:38Speaker 02

  Be good. I I got lucky. You know what I'm saying? So I'm I'm I think. Time under tension has helped as well, but that's one thing that has just always been there.

• 29:50Trevor Noah?

  I always I always think we, you know, you don't have these conversations all the time. The the balance of being afraid of losing the thing. And then also understanding what thing you should actually be afraid of losing. So. One thing I've come to learn over time from people who've grown up in privileged or connected worlds. Is they've taught me that the real value that you possess isn't necessarily in what you have. It's in the understandings you develop and it's in the connections that you make. So I like I think of it this way. You know, funny enough, I just recently watched the like a few months ago, watched the the Hulk Hogan documentary.

• 30:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 30:30Trevor Noah?

  Was like a phenomenal insight into this man in a way that, you know, few people will ever get for themselves or for others. And I I watched another one. It was Mr. T. And again, and it's, you know, for me, watching these childhood heroes and seeing their journeys. And one of the things I did enjoy in watching these stories was not seeing the moments where things went bad for them. So they went from like. Struggling to doing well, to doing great, to then doing well, to then not doing well. But then seeing them having this like second chance on the other side because Mr. T will always be Mr. T.

• 31:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:05Trevor Noah?

  You can't take that away from him anymore. Hulk Hogan will always be Hulk Hogan, you know, rest rest in peace, but like he he would always be Hulk Hogan. You can't take that from him anymore. And I think that's one of the things that anyone who hasn't grown up with doesn't realize.

• 31:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:19Trevor Noah?

  Is the real thing that separates us who like experienced nothing and then went to something and then to everything. Versus somebody who sort of grew up with something and everything is they know that it can be done again. And they know that, you know what I mean, the access is the real thing. Like John Cena will always be John Cena.

• 31:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:37Trevor Noah?

  Even if you may not reach the the high the highs that you've reached before or the lows, you will never be just that guy. And and sometimes that gives me like a little moment to breathe where I go, okay, Trevor, breathe. Take a vacation, spend more time with your friends.

• 31:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, man.

• 31:50Trevor Noah?

  Say no to that gig.

• 31:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:52Trevor Noah?

  Because you you you will be able to make something out of something. Even if it may not get you to the same levels that you were before. Does that make sense?

• 31:59Speaker 02

  It makes perfect sense. The best bet's on yourself.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think in most cases, we're talking about goals and what people aspire to. I think I think sometimes those goals, that Ferrari. That fame, that wanting to have the money is just a replacement for experience.

• 32:12Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 32:13Speaker 01

  So someone who has that thing will be like, that's not all that life is.

• 32:16Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 32:17Speaker 01

  They've experienced it.

• 32:18Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 32:18Speaker 01

  But also the fear sometimes goes away as we get experience. So if you know that you can always replicate the magic in one way or the other, I mean, you're the king of pivots. I look at you and I go, you've. You've pivoted hard. I mean, from going to wrestling to acting seamlessly.

• 32:33Trevor Noah?

  And even before that rapping, do you know what I mean, bodybuilding? Yeah, you are the king of pivots, actually.

• 32:38Speaker 01

  Yes. So that's all experience. And nineteen year old John Cena wouldn't have been told that. They wouldn't have been told that if they choose one thing. And it doesn't work out, their life is over. But over time, nearing fifty, like I've done so many things. I've managed to pivot so many times.

• 32:53Speaker 02

  I also think um th- those are those are great points, by the way, and uh I I also think there's a. Once you've done it, once you've built a startup, you know how fucking tough it is.

• 33:06Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 33:06Speaker 02

  And like.

• 33:07Trevor Noah?

  Yes.

• 33:08Speaker 02

  It's not to say I will, I mean, it's like going to the gym, the weights stay heavy and I keep going back. I don't know why. But I know that it's.

• 33:15Trevor Noah?

  Relate.

• 33:16Speaker 02

  I know that it's gonna be.

• 33:18Trevor Noah?

  We don't go any, we don't even touch the door. Walk fast. There's a gym, this is us.

• 33:27Trevor Noah?

  So please pick another example. Just make us understand.

• 33:31Speaker 02

  I think I think it's just knowing, knowing how steep the hill's gonna be.

• 33:36Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 33:37Speaker 02

  You know, and uh in thinking about my life and like, well, hey, what do you what do you want each day to be like? Everybody always asks me like, what's on your bucket list? What are your next goals? I don't think of it that way. I just um I've really lensed out to be like, man, I just wanna be useful today. Like, what's the best way I can be useful today? And if that is, my wife has been clamoring for us to get like out of the work mode and into vacation. Well, the the best way I can be useful is to go somewhere that I've never seen before and fuck off.

• 34:09Trevor Noah?

  I like.

• 34:09Speaker 02

  Like completely. And I think. Knowing that, okay, if I got knocked back to zero, I I'd like to bet on myself.

• 34:19Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 34:19Speaker 02

  I I'm pretty sure I I would I would survive. I would traverse the obstacle. I also wouldn't have the freedom to be like, well, how can I be the most useful today? And the the definition of it would change. Okay, we gotta we gotta again build this thing.

• 34:34Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 34:34Speaker 02

  So we have the resources to look around and think in philosophical terms of like, how am I most useful today? Can I sit down with two guys and talk for an extended period of time about? Things that I never would have thought about when I'm struggling to pay the Mastercard bill.

• 34:50Trevor Noah?

  He always says this.

• 34:51Speaker 02

  Or keep the lights on. You know what I'm saying?

• 34:52Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, Eugene always says this. It's so great. Yeah.

• 34:56Speaker 02

  I I guess I just know how hard it is to get to that point of like. Food, shelter, rest taken care of, then loving connection taken care of and sense of purpose taken care of. All right, let's. Now I can think deeper about things and I really enjoy that pocket that I'm in.

• 35:11Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 35:11Speaker 02

  And I kinda just wanna, I wanna just keep playing jazz as long as I can. You know what I'm saying? I just don't, I don't, I don't wanna. But I I do know it's gonna alter and pivot and and change and end and uh I guess I guess right now I'm just. I'm enjoying what I got and I wanna try to to just be useful. And I know that if I get knocked back. Gosh, it's all right, here we go. The usefulness is the steep climb again. Let's go.

• 35:34Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 35:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I I think what makes me sad as I get older is. How many people don't have the same disposition as us? I think we look at the sunny side of life. We think to ourselves, things are gonna get better over time. One way or the other. I often look at people in a hospital. There was this book that I read of a a lady who was working in palliative care. People who were just dying in a hospice. And she said, ten out of ten, everyone who was asked, what would you? What would you want to be doing right now? They'll either say, I want to be outside. And what do you regret? Not spending enough time with my friends and family. None of them said I missed my job. None of them said I missed my money or my house or my bed. All of them said, if I could get out of this bed and just feel the sun or the wind or.

• 36:18Speaker 01

  Whatever weather it is, on my face, on my body, on my skin. And hear the laughter of my kids or hear my friends telling that old story that they've been repeating over and over again, my life would be made. You know, and I think we've sometimes we've built these little comforts around ourselves, these little mansions that become little prisons for us not to go outside, not to see. The sun, not to spend time with our friends. And we were talking about this earlier on, you were saying, you make, he actually makes an effort. For all of his friends to find themselves in one room, even those that don't know each other. And we just end up chatting and talking and just hanging out and traveling. And I'm like, I I you are blessed enough to, you'll never miss that.

• 36:58Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, well, whatever happens to you. Yeah, I've realized is this, is like. It's it's I I don't know how to like like clearly articulate it, but fundamentally, I I think of I think about it as asking yourself the question over and over again, because your situation constantly evolves. Hmm. Do does that make sense?

• 37:18Speaker 02

  It does.

• 37:18Trevor Noah?

  And and I think no one teaches us this. I wasn't taught this in life. I've never heard anyone teach it to to me or to somebody around me in life. But but basically, I go. When you are hungry, your primary goal is to get something to eat. That's all. So you go, I need to get something to eat. I need to get something to eat. I need to get something to eat. And you may become very good at looking for something, searching for something to eat. Hmm. What we often forget, though, is when we get the something to eat, we don't, we're not really good at switching over to now eating mode. We're still in hungry mode. And so now we're eating, but we're hungry. And that's where someone sometimes be like, hey, hey, slow down.

• 37:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:54Trevor Noah?

  Slow down. And you're like, but I'm hungry. It's like, no, no, no, you were hungry. Nervous. Now you are eating.

• 37:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:59Trevor Noah?

  And you want to try and slow that down so that you're eating now. You're not still in in hungry mode. Mm hmm. And then you find you you eat and you finish, and then you're like, all right, what am I gonna eat? It's like, but you just ate. You don't even spend time being full now.

• 38:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 38:12Trevor Noah?

  And I I think in life, we take for granted what that thing can do to us. Think about how many people. I I was guilty of it. Many people I know are guilty of my friends. I'll play the game with all the time. I go. Why did you start your job? Or why did you get into your career? Or why do you want to earn money? Why? They go like, oh, I want to do this. I want I want I want so that I can. And then I go, but then when you got to that place, did you do it? And they go, no. Well, you know, I mean, I I got the house and I, you know, I was lucky. I got married and I have the kids and yeah, but you know, now we got to get a bigger. And I'm like, oh, but okay, okay, what happens when you get there? Well, then, when we get there, I'll save and then I'll so that I can spend more time with my family and friends. Okay, then you get there. And I go, now do you spend more time? I wish I could, but do you know how much this house costs?

• 38:54Trevor Noah?

  And you know, we got the second car. So I mean, I can't just sit around it. So it's like, oh, but if you're not careful. Hmm. It's not that the one doesn't need to exist. It's you you have to remember what you're doing at each stage, and you have to keep asking yourself the question. Why did I want this? Am I there? Why did I want this? Am I there? Why did I want this? Hmm. Am I there? And then you, that's why you said that. That's where I think we find ourselves in the correct pockets, you know?

• 39:20Speaker 02

  There's I mean, there's there's a ton of nuance there, too. Uh, so

• 39:26Speaker 02

  even even even the situational approach of like, man, my purpose is a provider. So if if I have everything and we're safe, what the fuck am I providing? I need a bigger house. No, I gotta I gotta do this. I gotta go out and do this, because I wanna I wanna be a provider.

• 39:43Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 39:44Speaker 02

  I want to be a parent. A lot of a lot of my friends are having their empty nesters now, and they're sending their kids off. And a few of them have like fractured sense of purpose, because they're a parent. That's that's what they are.

• 39:56Trevor Noah?

  That's what they've been.

• 39:56Speaker 02

  And gosh, they've been they've been damn good. That's that's two decades. Think of that. Like, I I wrestled for twenty three years. It took me five years to understand it was coming to an end fast, to to plan the best way I could for the fans and the company to to prosper on the way out.

• 40:17Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 40:17Speaker 02

  And then to like change, like, I'm I wrestled. I'm I'm that doesn't define who I am. That is a thing that I did. And in doing that, gave me knowledge and wisdom and and skills that I can bet on myself. If I get knocked back to zero, they can help me pivot.

• 40:35Trevor Noah?

  Mm hmm.

• 40:36Speaker 02

  But I am not just a wrestler. So whenever he was like, oh, my God, you're retiring. What are you gonna do? I don't know. But I will wake up and be curious, and I'll find something. Like, I will I will do something.

• 40:48Trevor Noah?

  I'd love to know where you where you got that from, because, again, going back to, you know, the most recent example I can think of, the Hulk Hogan documentary. I watched this man who was very open, you know, and so I'm not saying this from my opinion. He's he's talking about how he fell in love with the Hulk.

• 41:07Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 41:08Trevor Noah?

  He he fell in love with what he represented, that character. He fell in love with what what it felt like in the streets. He fell in love with how he moved through rooms. And and then his family would talk about when he was home. They felt like they were dealing with the the shadow of the man.

• 41:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:22Trevor Noah?

  He he would just be like quiet. And it was like, Terry, is everything okay? Hmm. And Terry just wasn't the same. But Hulk, I mean, he would, you know, and and and he couldn't resist the allure of coming back to the ring. And then, you know, like, he goes for, you know, I don't know if it was WWF back then or when it changes. But then he goes to the other wrestling company and he goes and he he tries it again. And people are like, you're old, man, let it go. And he's like, no, because because that thing isn't just who you've become. It's also where you find yourself most useful. You know how to make the people cheer. You know how to make a room shake. You know how to make people scream. You see those little kids in the front go, yeah, John C, that John C. And now you just leave that behind.

• 42:05Trevor Noah?

  Like, when when you were preparing, I'd love to know, when you were preparing for the leaving part? And when you were, you know, when you were in your like your final wrestling matches and when you

• 42:16Trevor Noah?

  were there moments where you doubted leaving?

• 42:18Speaker 02

  No, not once.

• 42:19Trevor Noah?

  For real?

• 42:20Speaker 02

  Not once. Yeah, uh, my my biggest fear in that last year was getting hurt, so I wouldn't make all the dates. And like, just have to go out with like a whimper rather than the full final chapter.

• 42:33Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 42:33Speaker 02

  You know, um, and it's it's odd, because you gotta, you can you can either be super conservative and do very little.

• 42:42Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 42:42Speaker 02

  Or you can leave them with the impression they had of you at your highest, which I still I still feel. You know, I retired at forty nine, so I still feel at forty nine, like, there could be hints of me at thirty. I can, if I prep enough and if I recover enough.

• 42:58Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 42:58Speaker 02

  I'm not doing, I was used to doing five shows a week. I'm doing, you know, we did thirty six dates, that's it. So, um, it gave me enough recovery time. It gave me enough prep time

• 43:08Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 43:08Speaker 02

  to show when the light was on, it was me. And that was such a clear indicator of like, oh, it is time to go.

• 43:16Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 43:17Speaker 02

  Because you are you are barely hanging on. When you were a kid, or you when you were younger, twenties, thirties, even to late thirties, early forties. You could wake up off a two hour sleep, do morning media, talk people into the building at noon, get there, uh, help the merchandising department, talk to creative, plan your match, post show, drive to the next town, wake up and do it again. It you can, you can't ignore the data. That was the easiest, the most logical thing to like, it is time to go. Whenever it's like, dude, you look great. I feel great.

• 43:49Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 43:50Speaker 02

  I'm still relatively strong.

• 43:51Trevor Noah?

  Uh huh.

• 43:52Speaker 02

  I can get in there and wave my hand in front of my face. But I I don't ignore the data.

• 43:57Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 43:58Speaker 02

  Slower, older, more of a risk, younger talent that move faster and and more daring. Um, the math isn't in my favor of like.

• 44:07Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 44:08Speaker 02

  This is a pretty janky road ahead.

• 44:10Trevor Noah?

  We're gonna continue this conversation right after this short break.

• 44:15Speaker 02

  I'm talking like thirty days on, seven days off, thirty days on, seven days off, or less.

• 44:21Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 44:22Speaker 02

  And you're doing your own promotion.

• 44:23Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 44:24Speaker 02

  It so you spend more time as the IP

• 44:28Trevor Noah?

  Mm hmm.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  than you do as a human. This is why, when you talk to Ric Flair, whom I love and respect, even on his doc, uh, Richard Fleer is dead, I'm Ric Flair.

• 44:38Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 44:39Speaker 02

  Hogan, Terry, he went away a while ago. Like, I'm I'm Hulk. You you can't help but become the environment you're in the most.

• 44:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 44:48Speaker 02

  You know, uh, that's the so so when it's supposed to be real, you got these guys who are trying to convince, you know, fans to come in the building and see him, and they they assume the role, and it's really tough to shut the switch off.

• 45:01Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 45:02Speaker 02

  I think it it, gosh, it was a steep hill to climb for wrestling, but one of the best things they did is admit that it was entertainment. It is not pure sport.

• 45:11Trevor Noah?

  Everybody has that oddly specific thing that they're curious about. Maybe it's restoring old watches. Maybe it's Japanese ceramic making. Maybe it's watching someone explain why one bridge in a remote area of Norway is secretly better than all the other bridges in the world. YouTube always has exactly what you're looking for, even when you didn't know you were looking for it. With YouTube Premium, those deep dives feel even smoother. You get ad free viewing, but you also get background play when you need your hands free. And you get offline downloads, so you can keep watching wherever you happen to be, even if you happen to be off the grid. It's everything you already love about YouTube, just somehow even better.

• 45:56Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, one of my favorite YouTube Premium features is smart downloads. Because how many times have you gone somewhere and realized, ah, I forgot to download anything? And now you're on the way to the airport, and you're like, download, download, download, download. You're on the plane, download, download, download, download. There's no wifi. I wish I downloaded. Now, all of those things that you were gonna watch are are just on the internet. Smart downloads basically thinks ahead for you. It automatically downloads recommended videos based on what you like to watch. So even when you forget to prepare, YouTube Premium didn't. I love it. It's like packing for a trip and discovering somebody already remembered the thing you always leave at home. It's always the underwear. If you like YouTube, you'll love YouTube Premium. Sign up now for your free trial at youtube.com/premium.

• 46:41Trevor Noah?

  Terms apply. Cancel anytime.

• 46:45Trevor Noah?

  Fall has a way of turning an ordinary night into a reason to gather. Whether it is a football game, a Halloween party, or a dinner on a cold evening. Whole Foods Market makes those moments easier with comfort food, seasonal treats, and quality standards built into every aisle. Start with a Whole Foods Market Kitchen's lasagna, packaged soup, or a build-your-own-family meal from the prepared foods counter, which feeds four for $35. For game day, add made-in-house wings, frozen pizzas, and 365 brand chips and dips. The limited-time bakery lineup brings the season home with pumpkin blondies,

• 47:29Trevor Noah?

  apple brown butter cookies, and chocolate bourbon pecan pie. And with no artificial sweeteners like sucralose, artificial colors like red dye number 40, or high-fructose corn syrup store-wide, nothing gets in the way of the flavors you came for. Shop fall flavors with higher standards at Whole Foods Markets. I think one of the things you realize when you start caring about clothes is that simple doesn't have to mean basic. Because a t-shirt is a t-shirt until you find the right t-shirt. Ooh, then suddenly you're talking about the cut, the fit, the weight, the way it falls on your body. Then you're like, no, no, no, you don't understand. Look at the sleeve. And that's what I've really enjoyed about Quince.

• 48:12Trevor Noah?

  One of my favorite things is their Pima Cotton Lux Touch t-shirts. And it's become one of those pieces I keep reaching for. The cotton has this really smooth, premium feel to it. The fit is great, and it just lays really nicely. And I think that's what you sometimes take for granted with simple clothes. When they're done really well, they become the foundation of an entire outfit. You can throw on a jacket, a sweater, whatever you want, but everything works because you started with the right thing. That's what I like about Quince. It feels premium without feeling like you're trying too hard. It's effortless. So find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com.

• 48:55Trevor Noah?

  Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. Hello over there! Oh, and if Quince asks you where you heard about them, let them know it was What Now with Trevor Noah. It's the best way to support the show.

• 49:21Trevor Noah?

  What part of your body has taken the biggest hits? And like when you feel your body in the morning, is it your shoulders, is it your knees? Is there any part of your body where you go like?

• 49:30Speaker 01

  The hand. I was like...

• 49:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:32Trevor Noah?

  You're like, his hand is tired.

• 49:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's the bread and butter. That's the money maker, dawg.

• 49:38Speaker 01

  Now your face had to go with the hand.

• 49:42Speaker 02

  I'm pretty good, man. Honestly, I'm pretty good.

• 49:44Trevor Noah?

  Hey, man, that's blessed.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  And now that I don't have to worry about preparing for those performances, I can spend a lot of time.

• 49:51Trevor Noah?

  What was preparation? What was preparing for?

• 49:54Speaker 02

  It changes over the course of time.

• 49:56Trevor Noah?

  But give me like a general idea of like, how do you prepare for a wrestling match?

• 49:59Speaker 02

  So it went from literally just me doing a couple of jumps to the music hitting to running out there like a Tasmanian devil.

• 50:07Trevor Noah?

  No, come on, for real?

• 50:08Speaker 02

  For real, man. Like, to really having a flexibility protocol that would start two hours before the performance. I'd have to maintain like a certain warmth and heart rate, you know, an hour in to make sure you're always moving around and always stretching. I'd have to practice more, like the difficult things I knew I could do in my sleep, especially the strength-based stuff that I was known for. Because like, I could probably do that, but I'm not as strong as I used to be. So can we just go run through that just to make sure I can catch you?

• 50:43Speaker 02

  So a lot more preparation in like at noon time when you get to the arena, which means you're falling down a little bit more. I'm breaking a sweat at noon, and then I got all day to cool down, then I gotta break a sweat again. And the post, tons of ice, massage therapy, just making, gosh, even something as simple as like making sure you stay hydrated, like not over-caffeinated. Like just little, all the nuanced things that I never used to have to freaking worry about that all could play their part in like, oh, man, I just, my knee's done because I'm dehydrated.

• 51:17Trevor Noah?

  It's just a one mistake.

• 51:18Speaker 02

  I didn't warm up enough. And that's what the math tells you of like, dude, you feel good. And I've also, I've also seen it happen with a lot of my contemporaries. They'll get to a point where you get to the twilight of your career and you want to show the young performers you still got it. So what you're gonna do is you're gonna go out and do stuff that you shouldn't be doing

• 51:40Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 51:40Speaker 02

  to try to set the example of like, yo, I can go. And it doesn't look crisp, and you set yourself up for injury. So, you know, looking at the lessons that were put out before me and then just looking at the math, like, man, it is, it's time, it's time to go. And I love it. WWE is still like pulses through my heart. I'm putting on an event this winter with them called the John Cena Classic because I want to still be involved. So what's the pivot, right? The pivot is event promotion. Take the IP that everybody knows and the core values that this IP, this human being stands for, and build an event around that with a goal to be like the Arnold Schwarzenegger Classic.

• 52:24Trevor Noah?

  Okay, got it. Okay, got it.

• 52:26Speaker 02

  That way, those young, able-bodied performers can do the falling down. And I can be like, these people are awesome. And we have our event and I show up and I'm still part of it. That's the pivot. So I can still have my, I can still have the passion. I'm a fan first. I can still be a fan.

• 52:42Trevor Noah?

  I love that, actually.

• 52:43Speaker 02

  Don't walk away from the business, but walk away from like, again, goals change too. I want to be, I want to be a WWE superstar. That's what I want the most. Now I'm 50, I'm like, yo, I want to, I want to still do, I want to try to be, have a healthy, mobile lifestyle at 80. And I don't control if I make it to 80.

• 53:04Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but you want to be...

• 53:06Speaker 02

  But if I do, I still want those to be good year, good mobile years. So is getting in a car wreck, you know, 52 times a year, the best way to keep that going is probably not. So my perspective and goals changed too.

• 53:23Trevor Noah?

  I always think about how amazing it is that wrestling has been on the journey that it's been in terms of like in the zeitgeist. So like most young boys, I was watching wrestling my entire life.

• 53:35Speaker 01

  In your underwear?

• 53:36Trevor Noah?

  In my underwear?

• 53:37Speaker 01

  I'm asking.

• 53:38Trevor Noah?

  No, I wasn't watching in my underwear.

• 53:40Speaker 01

  Okay, sharp, carry on.

• 53:40Trevor Noah?

  But when Ultimate Warrior was a thing...

• 53:42Speaker 02

  There's a lot of folks that compete in their underwear.

• 53:43Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, when Ultimate Warrior was a thing, I probably was like, okay, it's underwear time.

• 53:47Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 53:48Trevor Noah?

  That was when, like, yeah, Ultimate Warrior was when I was like, that's when I was like, when I really got into wrestling and I would watch it when we could because we couldn't see it all the time in South Africa.

• 53:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, we couldn't.

• 53:58Trevor Noah?

  It would come on sporadically. You didn't have access to it.

• 54:00Speaker 01

  It was on a pay channel.

• 54:01Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, it was on pay channels. Literally couldn't afford it. It was almost like lore or something. Some matches I think I've seen, but kids just told me about them.

• 54:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's cool.

• 54:09Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, like literally, they'd be like, and then, and then Ultimate Warrior, and then, and I'll be like, I've seen it. It's like, no, I haven't seen it. I actually didn't see it. So I got into it at that stage. I grew up with it, you know. The whole journey is like the Stone Cold Steve Austin, that whole era, you know, like the, you know, the...

• 54:25Speaker 02

  The Rock.

• 54:25Trevor Noah?

  The Rock, even before that.

• 54:27Speaker 01

  Even before.

• 54:27Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, even before that, the Heartbreak Kid, like that whole era.

• 54:31Speaker 02

  Bret Hittman heart.

• 54:32Trevor Noah?

  Do you know what I'm saying?

• 54:33Speaker 02

  Undertaker, yeah.

• 54:33Trevor Noah?

  And then, and then I remember this period where I was like, wow, wrestling's fake. And then like, even remember the zeitgeist of people being like, wrestling's fake. And no, we don't like this thing. It's fake. And then it's interesting how wrestling has gone on this full journey where people were like, no, no, no. Oh, damn, this is even more impressive. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They know what they're gonna do.

• 54:51Speaker 01

  It's people like athletes, not actors. Yes.

• 54:54Trevor Noah?

  Because it was that... It's amazing how that's happened. And then on top of that, there's been this almost intellectual like resurgence, not even a resurgence because it wasn't there before. It's almost been a birth. When I look at wrestlers and how people listen to you guys now and the things you guys say and the thing, forgive me for saying this, but like, I thought you guys were all just like brawny jocks. And we loved it as kids, but in my head, I never thought to myself that like Triple H would say something that makes me go like, damn, Hunter, that's a, oh, wow, I gotta really listen to that. Listening to Hulk Hogan with all his flaws and everything, but still like...

• 55:32Speaker 01

  It was crazy to hear him talk, yeah.

• 55:33Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, the human behind it and then listening to you. And what do you think, or having seen that journey and that trajectory? Is it like, did we always have the wrong idea of wrestlers and who you guys were behind the scenes? Or do you think you all changed in that journey as well? What, you know?

• 55:52Speaker 02

  I think it's more complex than that.

• 55:54Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 55:55Speaker 02

  I think as performers in a day and age where they sold it as a shoot or as real, these are real fights, the personalities had less time away from the personality. And keep in mind, in the globalization of wrestling, when Vince McMahon took over in the early 80s, the schedule was arduous. I'm talking like 30 days on, seven days off, 30 days on, seven days off, or less. And you're doing your own promotion. It, so you spend more time as the IP than you do as a human. This is why, when you talk to Ric Flair, whom I love and respect, even on his doc, Richard Fleer is dead, I'm Ric Flair.

• 56:40Speaker 02

  Hogan, Terry, he went away a while ago. Like, I'm Hulk. You can't help but become the environment you're in the most.

• 56:49Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 56:49Speaker 02

  You know? So when it's supposed to be real, you got these guys who are trying to convince, you know, fans to come in the building and see him, and they assume the role. And it's really tough to shut the switch off.

• 57:02Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 57:03Speaker 02

  I think it, gosh, it was a steep hill to climb for wrestling, but one of the best things they did is admit that it was entertainment. It is not pure sport. Because it was dishonest. Now we're honest. So that was mid 90s, tough hill to climb.

• 57:19Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 57:20Speaker 02

  You gotta recorrect, you know, you gotta rebrand. But the audience has always been rabid, whether they thought it was real or they know that they're coming to a show.

• 57:29Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 57:29Speaker 02

  Wrestling has always been filmed, shot, consumed as the audience is just as important as the performer. Whether you know it or not.

• 57:38Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  When you look at what we do, tons of crowd shots, crowds chant. They're literally like European football crowds.

• 57:46Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 57:47Speaker 02

  But we don't want them to shut up. We want them to keep being as rowdy as you can because if we perform to apathetic silence, it's not, it's really just kind of two guys in their underwear doing stunts.

• 57:57Trevor Noah?

  Sounds like a normal Saturday for you.

• 57:58Speaker 02

  Yeah. You know about that, right?

• 58:02Trevor Noah?

  I was too slow.

• 58:05Speaker 02

  You know what I'm talking about?

• 58:06Trevor Noah?

  I hate you.

• 58:07Speaker 02

  I was too slow. You were embroiled in the story. You were engrossed.

• 58:13Trevor Noah?

  You loved me. You doubted all of my senses. Cause I was like, yeah, man. Then he was like.

• 58:19Speaker 02

  So I think it's.

• 58:20Trevor Noah?

  Drop kicked me in the chest.

• 58:21Speaker 02

  It was billed as real.

• 58:22Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 58:23Speaker 02

  It rebranded itself. And when you rebrand, it takes ten, fifteen years to get over.

• 58:28Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 58:29Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 58:30Speaker 02

  We got over and I, I was happy to be involved in a lot of that rebranding process. Also, the product goes through phases. You, you cater to your audience.

• 58:39Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 58:39Speaker 02

  The eighties Hulk Hogan was a nationalist, virtual, you know.

• 58:43Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 58:43Speaker 02

  Virtuous dude.

• 58:44Trevor Noah?

  Iran, it was that's the other time.

• 58:46Speaker 02

  Say your prayers, eat your vitamins, you know, do good. Uh, and then Stone Cold Steve Austin, the, the raw era was drink beer, flip off your boss. We're, we're, we are programming to an eighteen year old male.

• 58:58Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 58:58Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 58:59Speaker 02

  Like, that's it.

• 58:59Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 59:00Speaker 02

  And then, and then more families start to show up around the, around the time that I started.

• 59:05Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 59:06Speaker 02

  So we switched to, literally, we changed the rating of the program to PG, which means some of the, some of the stuff we can't do.

• 59:13Trevor Noah?

  Yes.

• 59:13Speaker 02

  Blood is no longer a thing.

• 59:14Trevor Noah?

  In South Africa, that's when grandmothers were watching and our aunts were watching.

• 59:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:18Trevor Noah?

  On Sunday.

• 59:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I never, but I didn't notice that it was so intentional.

• 59:22Speaker 02

  Well, here's the good thing about PG, you can ship it anywhere. A lot of countries won't take PG thirteen or MA content.

• 59:28Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 59:29Speaker 02

  If they know, if they know it's PG, now we can go global.

• 59:32Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 59:33Speaker 02

  That takes time, but after like fifteen years of doing that, everybody's like, yeah, I watch the wrestling. And I will say the success of content creators. So, you know, two thousand and eight, people start posting on social media, the advent of Instagram and the success of YouTube. It used to be like you were in movies or you were in television, you were actor. You played pure sport, you were an athlete. Wrestlers and none of that, they're just carnies. Like we used to be as carny folk.

• 59:57Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 59:59Speaker 02

  And then everybody started making content and there became multiple lanes to success. Multiple lanes to relevancy, to resource. So it's like, oh man, these people have a voice and they have influence. WWE was on the cusp of all that and our, our accounts, like our social accounts are off the charts. Our audience is super engaging. You can't ignore the math.

• 1:00:20Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:00:21Speaker 02

  You can't ignore the data. It also became okay to be in the crowd for a wrestling match. It used to be like a thing of like, ah, I've seen it.

• 1:00:30Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. And now it's like, I'm going and.

• 1:00:34Trevor Noah?

  You're right, it has changed.

• 1:00:35Speaker 02

  There, there are fathers and there are families that went when I was performing that now bring their families. And it's still relatively digestible for, for that type of audience.

• 1:00:44Trevor Noah?

  Right, yeah.

• 1:00:44Speaker 02

  So it's, we've just been around long enough after all these tectonic shifts and changes, where people are like, no, no, it's, it's fine, it's cool. And a lot of things happened in society to open doors for us. We're like, dude, it's still so fucking tough to like, get the baggage of being a carny worker off, like still.

• 1:01:05Trevor Noah?

  And what, in what way, shared?

• 1:01:07Speaker 02

  I can tell from a mile away if someone has no clue of what I do. That stuff's fake, right?

• 1:01:14Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:01:15Speaker 02

  That comment right there, it doesn't piss me off. It's literally like a, an indicator of someone's ignorance of like.

• 1:01:22Trevor Noah?

  With, with us as comedians, yeah.

• 1:01:24Speaker 02

  You don't understand.

• 1:01:25Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, with us, it's, they go like, oh, it must be fun, you just talk shit for a living.

• 1:01:28Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:01:28Trevor Noah?

  All day.

• 1:01:29Speaker 02

  You don't understand.

• 1:01:30Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:30Speaker 02

  So I guess, you know what I mean? We're all, we all wanna, you know, like that's, it's just that, that, uh, that, that weight of trying to extend to conversations outside of your comfort.

• 1:01:43Trevor Noah?

  I can only imagine.

• 1:01:44Speaker 02

  That's where guys like DJ, like the, the Rock, sorry, have just shattered the glass ceiling because, you know, him being the first guy, but then it's only like, oh, he's just the one. Everybody else is.

• 1:01:54Trevor Noah?

  Do you remember the first time somebody took you seriously? Do you remember the first time, obviously maybe it wasn't one moment, but where just somebody was like, huh?

• 1:02:03Speaker 02

  So honestly, I think it's an ongoing process. And I think that moment of huh, isn't taking me seriously. It's like, wow, that's a surprise. That's a pleasant surprise.

• 1:02:15Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:02:15Speaker 02

  It's still, and it's a, it's a struggle, like that's the hard thing that I don't mind doing. That's the, how can I be useful today? I will spread the good word that these performers are able bodied, athletic, they can speak publicly, there's no second takes. They're out there doing whatever they want. They travel the world, they're responsible for themselves, they know failure and embarrassment. Like they also know elation and they know hard work. I can be a good ambassador to try to help melt that, those problems.

• 1:02:41Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:42Speaker 02

  And of course, the, the connections we have being owned by TKO, which is owned by WME, having deals with ESPN, having deals with Netflix, just the.

• 1:02:51Trevor Noah?

  It's become more mainstream, it's become more connected as well.

• 1:02:53Speaker 02

  You can't ignore the fucking math.

• 1:02:55Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, okay.

• 1:02:56Speaker 02

  The program.

• 1:02:56Trevor Noah?

  That makes sense.

• 1:02:57Speaker 02

  Across the world, people watch and love what we do. And the fact that major corporations and, and major providers have been like, yeah, they watch it, so I'll put it on. And the world has been like, oh, I'm no longer embarrassed to be a wrestling fan? Then this is great. And everybody else comes out and says, this is great. But it's, it's, I mean, we could, we could do a whole show on like the complex nuances of how wrestling became comfortable. And it's still, we're still working. You know what I'm saying? We're still working towards it. It's, it's, um, I think they'll always, of course, we're not gonna reach everybody. There'll always be people who don't understand what we do, just like this. All you do is talk shit.

• 1:03:32Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:03:33Speaker 02

  And hopefully one at a time, we can change some minds.

• 1:03:37Trevor Noah?

  I love this as just like a journey, but, but what, what you've made me realize is these pivots are a lot closer to like tectonic shifts than they are to just.

• 1:03:47Speaker 02

  Man.

• 1:03:48Trevor Noah?

  You know, the way that, that's, that's one, that's one illumination you're giving me now.

• 1:03:51Speaker 02

  Those diamonds aren't made overnight.

• 1:03:53Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but it's really like, oh man, it's this gradual shifting. It's like, oh, you see the planet, uh, the continent now? I was like, no, no, no, no, no. That took a long time to get to where, yeah.

• 1:04:05Speaker 02

  And here's like, my, my performing years are over. And I knew when I started, I'm like, oh man, it's gonna be past my, past my performing life that hopefully this is gonna change. So it's, you're working on a project.

• 1:04:18Trevor Noah?

  That you'll never get to.

• 1:04:20Speaker 02

  Distilling forty-five year old whiskey when you're forty years old. Like I may never taste this out of the bottle, out of the barrel, but like you still, you still do the work. It's about the journey, it's not about the get.

• 1:04:29Trevor Noah?

  But I think in, in, it's funny, I think in life, that is oftentimes when the most progress is made. And if, if we look at society, I think we are increasingly living in a society where people no longer wish to participate in any project that they may not yield the rewards of.

• 1:04:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, not planting trees, which.

• 1:04:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, we're not.

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  Trees they won't enjoy.

• 1:04:48Trevor Noah?

  There you go. We, we, I'm, I'm noticing that less and less. And I also understand some of it. It's because like the pay it forward thing, you know, like obviously if you take it into, let's say, the economy, people who can't afford to buy a house today because of how housing prices have, have ballooned versus incomes, et cetera. They go, then why should I participate in the next round or why should I, or why should I? And it's so interesting how quickly that thing can break in society. Where somebody then goes, well, if, if I'm not going to be the wrestler who, then why should I help you guys reform the wrestling thing? Does that make sense?

• 1:05:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:05:23Trevor Noah?

  And yet you are literally part of the reason the young superstars in wrestling are a thing now is because you, you literally had to build something for them that you would not experience the full reward of. You, you, you get what I'm saying?

• 1:05:40Speaker 02

  I do, and folks before me did that and folks before.

• 1:05:43Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but that awareness is something that I think most of us do not have in life. It's hard to have it.

• 1:05:48Speaker 02

  I, I would agree. Uh, and, and many times we see life through our own eyes. We don't think outside ourselves, you know? And that's okay. If, if I have a young performer that says, I just wanna go fucking gangbusters and be the most, I wanna be a household name. And they do it for selfish, sociopathic reasons. Let's, let's, let's turn it up to eleven, okay? Becoming a household name helps, whether they're trying to do it for me or not.

• 1:06:15Trevor Noah?

  Oh, okay, I like this.

• 1:06:16Speaker 02

  They're trying, like every household name we produce.

• 1:06:20Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:06:21Speaker 02

  Helps everybody. And whether their intentions are good or flawed, if the business can remain, as long as we don't shut the lights out.

• 1:06:29Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:06:30Speaker 02

  Every household name helps.

• 1:06:33Trevor Noah?

  I see why everyone goes, why aren't you gonna have kids?

• 1:06:37Speaker 02

  Me?

• 1:06:37Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, I see it.

• 1:06:38Speaker 01

  You don't have kids?

• 1:06:39Speaker 02

  No, uh, whoa, man, you came out, came out the gate with the parent shame.

• 1:06:44Speaker 01

  I'm sorry.

• 1:06:45Speaker 02

  Should I be ducking that? I'm just kidding, that's, that's fine, it's fine. Let's lean into that, go ahead, something's on your mind, sorry.

• 1:06:51Speaker 01

  I take it back, I take it back.

• 1:06:52Speaker 02

  It's cool, man, it's okay. It's all right.

• 1:06:55Speaker 01

  I'm kidding.

• 1:06:55Speaker 02

  I can't tell you how many times I heard that, though. You don't have kids?

• 1:06:58Speaker 01

  You don't have kids?

• 1:06:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, like, just like that. Yeah.

• 1:07:00Speaker 01

  Why, how? Tell us more.

• 1:07:02Trevor Noah?

  But you see, this is why, I get it now.

• 1:07:04Speaker 01

  You'd make such a cool dad.

• 1:07:05Speaker 02

  My sperm has never fertilized an egg. That's how I don't have kids.

• 1:07:09Speaker 01

  I love the science behind it. His favorite topic sperm, yeah, look at him. Look at how excited you got him. You, you wanna hear him saying it more?

• 1:07:17Trevor Noah?

  Oh, boy.

• 1:07:18Speaker 02

  My ejaculate is.

• 1:07:20Speaker 01

  Look, look, look at what you're doing to my friend, look.

• 1:07:23Speaker 02

  The fallopians to get to the ovaries to get that one.

• 1:07:28Speaker 02

  That has not happened. That is the reason I don't have kids.

• 1:07:32Trevor Noah?

  Oh, man. Yeah, but I I get I get why. So I'm I'm sure you know this. So at the risk of saying something you've heard a thousand times, maybe you haven't. I think it's because people

• 1:07:46Trevor Noah?

  will seldom bump into human beings who they

• 1:07:52Trevor Noah?

  in an altruistic way, almost wish that they would make more human beings.

• 1:07:56Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:07:57Trevor Noah?

  Does that does that make sense? So when I I now understand because like that's something that's followed you for like, I don't even know how many years. I've seen you answer that question so many times. No, I don't plan to have kids and you know, and that's even when I met my my current wife, my first date, that was the conversation you guys had is just like.

• 1:08:15Speaker 02

  Which I think is important.

• 1:08:15Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, before the fries. He was like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

• 1:08:18Speaker 02

  Hold on. Those look good, but wait, just one second.

• 1:08:21Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:21Speaker 02

  What's your stance on family?

• 1:08:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:24Trevor Noah?

  So, but I can.

• 1:08:25Speaker 01

  Never heard that question me ask.

• 1:08:26Trevor Noah?

  But I can see why people go, ah, but but John, what?

• 1:08:30Speaker 02

  So.

• 1:08:31Trevor Noah?

  Because everyone wishes that they would have had a dad or everyone wishes that someone would have had a dad. That is this nuanced, this thoughtful, this like caring, this, do you understand what I'm saying?

• 1:08:43Speaker 02

  Goodness, I appreciate all that, but then let's so let's lean into that, right? Just because someone thinks I would be good at something.

• 1:08:51Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:51Speaker 02

  Is that reason enough to do it? And it is not a commitment where if like four months in, I'm like, you know, this wasn't my thing.

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  Orphanages.

• 1:09:02Speaker 02

  I'm kinda.

• 1:09:03Speaker 01

  Those buildings are great for that.

• 1:09:05Speaker 02

  I'm gonna pivot.

• 1:09:07Speaker 01

  Those buildings were created for second thought.

• 1:09:10Speaker 02

  I'm just gonna pivot.

• 1:09:11Speaker 01

  They were like, the fries, maybe let's try to truffle fries. Just take away the.

• 1:09:15Speaker 02

  I'll also lean into the I'll lean into the second half of your comments, like those who envision like, man, I I wish I had a father figure like that or this person. The time I've had to live life is how I've developed the wisdom, is how I've developed the nuance.

• 1:09:34Trevor Noah?

  Oh, boy.

• 1:09:36Speaker 02

  Because I'm here, I'm I'm present. Like when when I'm here with you guys, my wife is curious and independent. We love each other, we respect our space. She's doing something in New York.

• 1:09:46Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:09:46Speaker 02

  And I have no fear in what she's doing and I have full trust in what she's doing, which allows me to be here with you guys.

• 1:09:50Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:51Speaker 02

  Fully to maybe learn something, to develop a little, maybe another layer of the onion, like that. It's it's the time without those commitments.

• 1:10:00Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:10:00Speaker 02

  That have led me to be who I am. So if I did have those commitments, I wouldn't be who I am. It's all hypothetical.

• 1:10:05Trevor Noah?

  Yes, everything is a compromise. We just have to be willing to choose which compromise we want to make.

• 1:10:12Speaker 02

  And the the thing that makes this question so difficult is I'm on the wrong side of the math. Everybody has kids. Well, that's that's not necessarily true, but a majority of the folks do. They aspire to have a family. So because I don't want to, I'm an oddball.

• 1:10:27Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:10:28Speaker 02

  Like, what the what the fuck is wrong with you?

• 1:10:30Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:30Speaker 02

  Like, what's I'm I just wanna choose to be over here in my lane in life and I understand that that is not the majority.

• 1:10:38Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:38Speaker 02

  So, living in that small bracket, you gotta answer a lot of questions. And that's okay, because it also makes me think about like, man, am I second guessing anything? And I'm not. I'm not. I'm still like so interested on what's out there. And gosh, I like I know, I I know I I know what the commitment is.

• 1:10:58Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:10:59Speaker 02

  You know what I mean?

• 1:10:59Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:11:00Speaker 02

  And, uh, man, even even like, my dad was a great dad, raised five of us, worked his ass off. Yet, me growing up, I wanted him to be somebody he wasn't. And like, I'm talking growing up, fuck that, to like forty five years old. I wanted my dad to be something he wasn't. And then at forty six, I was like, man, maybe I'll just try to meet that some bitch where he's at. And now we have a much better relationship. Gosh, what a what a steep hill to climb for my old man. A forty five year commitment, maybe looking for a good relationship with his son. And just because I'm over here thinking, I want you to be somebody and you're not that person.

• 1:11:39Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:40Speaker 02

  And hoping that maybe one day it turns around and and not knowing if it's gonna or not, and it's really not in your control, you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't I don't know, man, I just.

• 1:11:48Trevor Noah?

  I'm with you.

• 1:11:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:11:49Speaker 01

  But it's crazy. It's so refreshing to hear a man speak about parenthood. Because obviously, our gender sort of makes us fathers automatically. People never assume that you're looking at your capacity to be present. You're looking at, am I emotionally, am I emotionally capable of being there for this person long term? Am I even interested in being there? Because everyone assumes that at a certain age, as a man, you can be a father.

• 1:12:15Trevor Noah?

  In fact, you, yeah, if I can expand on that, it's more than that. It's it's also that there isn't an expectation in a way. Does that make sense?

• 1:12:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:12:22Trevor Noah?

  So so it's like, if I'm hearing it, it's almost like people go with a woman, if she's like, oh, I can't, then they're like, yeah, then you shouldn't do it if you'd. But with guys, they're almost you're like, oh, but busy. They're like, you can be busy. You don't need to be around. You're just a dude, man. You just get the sperm and you're good. And but you know what I mean? It's so interesting that you've said that. Whether it's society at large, whether it's us, whether it's not, it feels like for a long time, people have sort of gone, oh, no, there is no emotional burden or there is no emotional expectation or very little.

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:53Trevor Noah?

  On being a father.

• 1:12:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:54Trevor Noah?

  You just have to be a provider and then you've done a good job. And like, here you are going, no, no, no. I consider the emotional ramifications of this, not just for myself, but for the potential human being I may meet on the other side. And that's how I'm making the decision.

• 1:13:07Speaker 02

  And also, it it's it's my life.

• 1:13:11Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 1:13:12Speaker 02

  You know, like I, that's that's where that's where this work line of work is fragile.

• 1:13:17Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:18Speaker 02

  Because when you say like, man, this is my go around. And I'm choosing to go this direction, that might turn a lot of folks off. But again, I I'll stake my claim on like the fact that I've been able to absorb all of these moments.

• 1:13:33Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:34Speaker 02

  Without my attention being split or fractured has led me to be the the man I am today, which I I look at the guy in the mirror and he ain't perfect, tons of flaws, but I love that dude. And I'm I'm super at peace and I still wanna do more and experience more and I I just, it's it's my life, it's my, it's that's what that's a choice I made.

• 1:13:55Trevor Noah?

  Have you have you ever noticed how people will question your decision to not partake in something with like a higher level of judgment? But if you are on the opposite side of it and you regret it, then they'll be like, but then why'd you do it? You ever noticed that?

• 1:14:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:14:12Trevor Noah?

  So like, yeah, for instance, if you go, I don't drink. People are like, what do you mean you don't drink? You're like, yeah, I don't want I don't drink. I don't want to drink. Then like people are like, what? You don't drink? Come on, man. Just try the, come on, man. You don't know what you made. How you gonna?

• 1:14:25Speaker 01

  Just one.

• 1:14:25Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but then if you drink and then afterwards you go like, yeah, I drank, but I didn't, you know, in my life and what? Then people are like, you shouldn't have done it then.

• 1:14:32Speaker 02

  Done it. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:14:34Trevor Noah?

  There are many people who have kids who then say, I wish I didn't have kids. And then their kids or other people will judge them and go, well, then why did you do it? Why do you like, well, because you guys kept asking me why I don't have kids and I should have a kid. And then I said, I don't want a kid. And then I had the kid. And now you're going, why did I have the kid? And now I had the kid and I didn't. You see what I'm saying?

• 1:14:51Speaker 01

  And what I love about your explanation about the relationship that you and your father had or that you wish you had until you were forty five is you didn't choose to make a human being to heal you. You became the father that you wish your dad was to yourself. You were present, you were driven, you were there, you did everything, you did everything. You didn't create a human and go, I'm gonna try. Because a lot of a lot of guys do that. They sometimes want to heal the relationship that they never had with their fathers by having kids.

• 1:15:17Speaker 02

  Oh, my goodness. Wow. Wow, man, that that's goosebumps. Wow, that's. Yeah, uh, I did not do that. But yeah, that is, wow, that's that hit me like a ton of bricks. That's it. That is a good one. That makes me think, yeah, it's, man, yeah, you're right. Well, I'm I am glad that I finally met my dad, where is that?

• 1:15:41Trevor Noah?

  That's beautiful.

• 1:15:42Speaker 02

  And and gosh, we we're doing great. And I'm also, uh, I'm I'm also okay on my stance. And, uh, I think making those tough choices.

• 1:15:52Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:53Speaker 02

  That are against popular opinion, but deep down, you know, it's the direction that you wanna go in.

• 1:15:58Trevor Noah?

  So hard.

• 1:16:00Speaker 02

  That's now, I gotta walk the talk. I gotta live my life. I gotta try every day to have joy in my life. I gotta try every day to be useful. I gotta keep my curiosity. So in saying no to one thing, I've gotta commit to be to walk in the talk. So it does hold me accountable. Not saying that I I wouldn't be those things.

• 1:16:17Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, but I know what you mean.

• 1:16:18Speaker 02

  But like, hey, I'm saying no to this because I believe I can travel in this lane. Well, fucking, let's go. Let's go to work. You know what I mean?

• 1:16:26Trevor Noah?

  Yeah. Don't press anything. We've got more. What now? After this?

• 1:16:31Speaker 02

  And I remember in two thousand and ten, we had a movie meeting in Houston about like this dog shit movie. And the guys were like, I don't know if you're right for it. Like it

• 1:16:44Speaker 02

  it was like, it was fucking dog shit. And the guys making the movie were like, I don't know if we can go with you. They get up and leave. I look at Dan, I'm like, man, we're never making movies again, are we? And this is like my agent. He's supposed to be like, no, no, no. He's like, no, we're never making movies again. Straight up, like, nah, dude, it's, but hey, what he did was, feedback sandwich, no, we're not. We are gonna find another way.

• 1:17:10Trevor Noah?

  Earth can be a lot sometimes. Heat waves, gas prices, bad hair days. Why not go where life is good? Escape to Pluto TV. Turn off your problems and turn on your favorite movies and shows. You know, the ones you already love. From Anchorman, the legend of Ron Burgundy, to Dirty Dancing, to Top Gun Maverick, from Alias to The X-Files. It's all here and all free. Go where the TV is always good. Escape to Pluto TV. Stream now, pay never. Therapy is one of those things lots of people talk themselves out of without even realizing it. Like it's too expensive or it's too overwhelming figuring out even where you're gonna start.

• 1:17:55Trevor Noah?

  But Rula is one way to make that first step feel a lot more doable. Offering accessible, affordable therapy that fits your needs. Sign up in just a few minutes and get matched with a therapist who fits what you're looking for. Need to talk to someone quickly? Appointments are often available as soon as the next day. And with insurance, sessions average around a fifteen dollar copay. You can also see estimated costs upfront, so there's a lot more clarity going in. And in terms of outcomes, ninety three percent of Rula patients report symptom improvement. If therapy's been sitting in the back of your mind, Rula is a pretty simple way to take that first step. So, turn off the talk track that's keeping you from progress and head to rula.com.

• 1:18:40Trevor Noah?

  That's R U L A dot com to find a therapist the easy way.

• 1:18:48Speaker 04

  Who took notes? Anyone? With Monday Note Taker, the meeting ends and the plan already exists. Action items, owners, deadlines. Go to monday.com, the AI workspace platform.

• 1:19:06Trevor Noah?

  But I love that you and your dad had, I love that you had that in the life.

• 1:19:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:19:11Trevor Noah?

  You know, I think for so many people, like with my mom, she had like a really tumultuous relationship with my grand. And in the last few years of my grand's life, she was forced to live with my mom. And the best way I can put it, they fell in love with each other.

• 1:19:26Speaker 02

  That's great.

• 1:19:27Trevor Noah?

  Do you get what I'm saying?

• 1:19:28Speaker 02

  I do.

• 1:19:28Trevor Noah?

  They they met each other where they were, they learned a different side. And my mom always says she's eternally grateful for those years. Cause she goes, those were the years that were everything. Like, she goes, everything else almost doesn't matter.

• 1:19:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:19:40Trevor Noah?

  Those were the years.

• 1:19:41Speaker 01

  That was their relationship.

• 1:19:42Trevor Noah?

  And all it kept me thinking was for all of us in life, as I go, man, I said this to you, I was like, I just hope for everyone out there. I may your parents live long enough that they heal the wounds they inflicted upon you. That's all I, just because a lot of the time it's time.

• 1:20:00Speaker 02

  It is, it is, man. I mean, like I said, it was 45 when I realized like, that's not fair to my dad.

• 1:20:07Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:08Speaker 02

  Fuck, what am I doing? We're all healthy.

• 1:20:11Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:11Speaker 02

  We're all thriving. Like, he did a good job.

• 1:20:14Trevor Noah?

  But without time.

• 1:20:16Speaker 02

  You can't get to that, and some folks never get there.

• 1:20:19Trevor Noah?

  Do you ever think about how old you were when your dad, how old your dad was when you were that age? Do you ever think about, I think about that all the time and it blows my mind.

• 1:20:26Speaker 01

  Freaks me out as well.

• 1:20:27Speaker 02

  So like my dad at 50 now?

• 1:20:29Trevor Noah?

  So how old was your dad when he had you?

• 1:20:32Speaker 02

  Oh my goodness, that'd have been 45 years ago, he's 82, so. Yeah, I mean, well.

• 1:20:37Trevor Noah?

  Thirty something.

• 1:20:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, late, mid 30s, mid 40s.

• 1:20:40Trevor Noah?

  I always find that that's, that's often the time, it's the strangest thing.

• 1:20:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, about 30, yeah.

• 1:20:44Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but it's the strangest thing that'll happen to us.

• 1:20:46Speaker 01

  And what were you do, at 30, you had how many kids?

• 1:20:48Trevor Noah?

  Yes.

• 1:20:49Speaker 02

  At 30, I was his second.

• 1:20:51Trevor Noah?

  Think about that.

• 1:20:51Speaker 01

  And you had a wife?

• 1:20:52Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:20:53Speaker 01

  And a job.

• 1:20:53Speaker 02

  And he was about to have another the next year, another two years after that, another two years after.

• 1:20:57Speaker 01

  And at 30, what were you doing?

• 1:20:59Speaker 02

  At 30, I was riding a lightning bolt.

• 1:21:04Speaker 01

  Isn't that crazy that you live these parallel lives?

• 1:21:07Trevor Noah?

  But that's what I'm saying, I always, I always think that gives, that's one of the things that has helped me find grace.

• 1:21:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:21:12Trevor Noah?

  Is to sometimes remind myself, I go, man, my mom had me when she was 20, what? Which was normal then, but I'm like, twit, I even tell her when we hang out, I go, lady, forgive yourself for everything, cause I'm like, I don't know what you were doing at 20. In fact, I don't even, I wish I could go back in time and as a child, look at you and be like, lady, you don't know what you're doing, relax.

• 1:21:32Speaker 01

  Let's figure it out together.

• 1:21:32Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, because I looked at you like you're supposed to know what you're doing, but I'm like, at 20, relax.

• 1:21:37Speaker 02

  You kind of still finding yourself.

• 1:21:39Trevor Noah?

  Exactly, but with time, though, you can get to the place where you may meet them, they may, it's just, man, that, to have the blessing of time in a relationship is one of the things I wish everyone can experience. It's beautiful. And it, for me, it's like, I don't know, man, your life is just this, you know, I, I, I think about all of the things you've been lauded and applauded for. One of the biggest being, you know, holding the record for Make-A-Wish. And I, I won't lie, maybe it's like a fear thing in me, maybe it's like a, it's, it's not like a selfishness, but I, I found myself wondering every time I'd read that, I'd go, how do you hold your heart through all of that? Because it's beautiful when you're going out to these kids and you're meeting them and you're making their day.

• 1:22:23Trevor Noah?

  And, but I can't imagine how many letters you've gotten afterwards when the kids have passed away. And, and how, like, do you know what I mean? How, how do you hold those two things, the joy and elation that you bring? And then also the tragedy that you're experiencing at a rate that few human beings in the world will ever experience?

• 1:22:40Speaker 02

  So I've, I've talked about this a little. My, my peace in that puzzle is to provide escape, to provide a much needed day off for not only a child, but a family that the math isn't on their side.

• 1:22:55Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:56Speaker 02

  They're, they're, they're the anomaly. You know, the life expectancy exists for a reason, because we've got a bunch of people and they live to be this, hey, you're supposed to make it to whatever it is now. Loss is tough for everybody. The toughest losses are like the ones where y'all, you didn't, you didn't get a fair shot. You know what I'm saying? If, if you're supposed to make it to 75, how you calling it quits at six? You know, like, that's, that's tough.

• 1:23:24Speaker 02

  My, my peace in, in that journey is to provide escape and to be a conduit for joy. And if I cannot do that, if I'm not able to fulfill those duties, walk away. I don't, I don't do much with Make-A-Wish outside of WWE. Because I believe that the environment does not, is not the correct conduit for joy.

• 1:23:51Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:23:52Speaker 02

  Bring a kid to a movie set, unless they're a movie junkie, of which I've done. We've put Make-A-Wish kids in movies. Those are long, boring days.

• 1:23:59Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:00Speaker 02

  It's very patient, nothing really happens. We do things over and over and over again. And for a young person who probably is, has an awareness of time that most young people don't have.

• 1:24:11Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 1:24:12Speaker 02

  Not a good experience.

• 1:24:14Trevor Noah?

  Wow.

• 1:24:14Speaker 02

  But you bring them in to an arena at five o'clock when they skip the line. And they get in a private room and everybody comes to say hi to them. And like, then we sit down and we kick it, like, hey, I'm wearing this stuff, you guys, where are you guys sitting? What's your signs say? Awesome, you want to see anything out there tonight? Tips, strategy? And they'll be like, oh, man, you do this, do this. And I, I plan the action. So I can go back and do it. And I know where they're at, and I go, thanks. And it doesn't, it doesn't mess up the show. I'm not going into business for one consumer.

• 1:24:46Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but no, man.

• 1:24:48Speaker 02

  It's a conduit for joy. So again, knowing the room, I love the Make-A-Wish charity. I also don't do it a lot outside of WWE. Because it's not like, it's not the escape, it's more of a burden.

• 1:25:01Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:01Speaker 02

  You have to travel the families and then they get to a place and it's like, ah, this kind of wasn't what I thought. Even the most shy kids, even, even the kids that are up against it, who have just enough wherewithal to travel, everybody gets a day off.

• 1:25:18Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:25:19Speaker 02

  Of those, however many the number is, everyone gets a day off, everybody. And, and like, that's the thing, I don't, I don't do the thing selfishly just to keep doing it.

• 1:25:32Trevor Noah?

  No, I know what you mean.

• 1:25:33Speaker 02

  This is not the, this is not the environment for that.

• 1:25:36Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:25:37Speaker 02

  We need to get him to the show, you know what I'm saying? And that's why kind of my chapter there is, is closing. And it should be Roman's turn, it should be Cody's turn, it should be Seth's turn, it should be Javon Evans' turn, it should be Braun Breaker's turn, and Charlotte Flair and Becky Lynch. They need to be the conduit for joy. And I think it's understanding what you're doing and also understanding that like, yo, just because I've, I've helped promote this thing and some folks who use me as the face of this thing, it's time to pass it on.

• 1:26:07Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:26:07Speaker 02

  Very much like wrestling. I'm on the front of the poster, but like, it's time, it's time to go. So being able to, to be that conduit is just understanding what you're doing. And the experience, the wisdom, the lessons I've learned, I value every, every fucking second. I tell people I love that I love them. I don't, I don't protect the word, I tell people, I don't protect it, but I don't waste it. It's, it's earned every time it's said, but I won't hold it back. If, if the moment is right and I, I realize like, my God, I love this person, I love you. And just understanding that no one controls, like, life expectancy is a thing, it's a statistic. But nobody controls when we check out, dude.

• 1:26:51Trevor Noah?

  Not a guarantee.

• 1:26:52Speaker 02

  Not at all. And I've seen, I've seen these families have so much joy. And like, what the fuck is my problem? You know what I'm saying? That doesn't mean blind optimism.

• 1:27:06Trevor Noah?

  No, but yeah.

• 1:27:07Speaker 02

  That doesn't mean like true positive mental attitude, that means feeling all the feels.

• 1:27:11Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:12Speaker 02

  But also like, wow. All right, let's, let's do what we can to course correct, let's get back in a, in a good mind state if we can. And, and also like, hey, man, we're all, we're all just renting, all of us.

• 1:27:26Speaker 02

  You know, I don't, I don't know if enough people look at that and process that. Like we, every one of us is, is going back to the ground, you know what I mean?

• 1:27:36Trevor Noah?

  We're all just renting.

• 1:27:38Speaker 02

  We are.

• 1:27:38Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:39Speaker 02

  We are, and, and the gets, the Ferraris, the houses, it's not yours. You're just, you're just taking care of it to the next person. That's it. Literally, this is gonna find its way to somebody. My suits went to a thrift store. I donate suits when I don't wear them, I donate suits. Some lady was like, I found 10 John Cena waistcoats. Yeah, those are mine, cause they're just going on.

• 1:28:00Trevor Noah?

  Who wears your size?

• 1:28:02Speaker 02

  I don't know, but they can make a couch out of it. This would be nice.

• 1:28:11Speaker 02

  Love seat maybe.

• 1:28:15Trevor Noah?

  Are there, are there things that you, um, that you don't get from acting that you miss from wrestling?

• 1:28:21Speaker 02

  There's nothing like WWE.

• 1:28:23Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:23Speaker 02

  There's, there's nothing like it. It is, and I guess that's the thing. Like I struggled. I got kind of like run out of the movie business. And then my goodness, you want to talk about being lucky. I got a second chance.

• 1:28:33Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:28:35Speaker 02

  It's just a different thing. And when I was in my twenties, uh, because of a business model decision. It's like, hey, you're going to Australia to do this movie. Why? Cause we're open in our own studio. And if we make you guys movie stars, more people will come to the arenas.

• 1:28:49Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:50Speaker 02

  More people arenas. That sounds fucking dope. Let's go do this movie. What do you mean I have to wait around for eight hours? What do you mean? It's that we can't do this. We can't just shoot this eighty-five pages now and I can go back to doing the thing. I wanted to, fuck, I was twenty performing in front of crowds, being athletic, like.

• 1:29:08Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:08Speaker 02

  I came from football. So it's like, man, this is, I know football never was going to work out for me, but like this is it. Like this is, this is what I want to do. I'm doing this other stuff. So what I want to do can be better. And a lot of times, you know, you, you, you do ancillary things to, to build the thing. But my heart wasn't in it. And then as I kind of looked at what I was doing, I mean, I played the same character on television. For WWE for twenty years.

• 1:29:33Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, wow.

• 1:29:34Speaker 02

  And then somebody comes along and be like, hey, we'll, we'll give you the versatility to create something. You just need to have a better mindset on those patient days. You know, I, of course, then I was in my late thirties. You get a little wiser, take your foot off the throttle a little bit.

• 1:29:49Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:29:49Speaker 02

  Appreciate the process, appreciate that every job is important.

• 1:29:52Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:53Speaker 02

  It gave me a newfound respect for making film and now I'm as passionate about it. And that was the breaking point of like, hey, man, put the effort you put into WWE into this and just see where it takes you. But don't complain if it doesn't work, if you're not doing the same. Cause you busted your ass in the gym and it got you to WWE and you took the effort and put the same amount of effort in WWE. And man, you, you, you've navigated some waters. Let's put the same thing into this. Just fucking leave it all out there. And you're going to have some good ones and you're going to have some bad ones and eventually it's going to be over. But at least you know, when you look back on it, I look back on that first chapter.

• 1:30:31Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:32Speaker 02

  My heart wasn't in it and I got run out of town for it.

• 1:30:34Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:30:35Speaker 02

  I did a lot of bad movies.

• 1:30:36Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:30:36Speaker 02

  Because I wanted to be elsewhere. It's like doing an interview with you guys, trying to get information out of me. And I'm like, what the fuck? It's tough. It's tough when you have a guess. It's a dead stick.

• 1:30:46Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:46Speaker 02

  You know?

• 1:30:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:48Speaker 02

  I'm putting everything I got. I'm giving you guys everything I got. I'm trying to engage. I'm trying to be present. I, I want this time with us together. At the very least, if nobody fucking watches it, to be productive for us.

• 1:30:59Trevor Noah?

  That's what we always say.

• 1:30:59Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying?

• 1:31:01Trevor Noah?

  Rolling, you've still got to be like, man, did we have a good time or did we not have a good time? Otherwise, what are we doing?

• 1:31:06Speaker 02

  And I believe that people are attracted to, oh man, that seems like a fun time.

• 1:31:10Trevor Noah?

  You're not wrong.

• 1:31:11Speaker 02

  So when I have that, that confidence, that, that, that's where all like this shit came from, just having a good time. And then when I take that effort, that confidence, um, into another avenue, we have ourselves a pivot. But it, it, that's, people think it like, and then you pivoted to movies. No, that was a, that was ten years of failure. Fucking failure doing movies that nobody watched to the point where I couldn't even walk on red carpets. Who the fuck are you? Or like, uh, get auditions. No one would talk to me.

• 1:31:41Trevor Noah?

  Damn.

• 1:31:42Speaker 02

  And then my, my, it's not my manager and my agent. He's like my business better half. Like we are yin and yang in the same thing.

• 1:31:50Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:51Speaker 02

  Uh, he's right outside. And I remember in two thousand and ten, we had a movie, uh, meeting in Houston. About like this dog shit movie. And the guys were like, I don't know if you're right for it. Like it.

• 1:32:05Speaker 02

  It was like, it was fucking dog shit. And the guys making the movie were like, I don't know if we can go with you. They get up and leave. I look at Dan, I'm like, man, we're never making movies again, are we? And this is like my agent. He's supposed to be like, no, no, no. He's like, no, we're never making movies again. Straight up, like, nah, dude, this, but hey, what he did was feedback sandwich. No, we're not. We are going to find another way. So I read the news, uh, I hosted live shows. Uh, I just stayed polishing my skills. I took feedback. Well, what got us here? Why have we done this?

• 1:32:40Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:40Speaker 02

  Dude, your fucking heart's not in it and you're not as serious about it. And I hear you talk ad nauseam about WWE. Those folks that are successful on that Hollywood side, they talk ad nauseam about Hollywood.

• 1:32:51Trevor Noah?

  Yeah. You know, it's funny you say that. This is, um, this is, there's this, um, there's this, uh, YouTuber, I guess, or I don't know which platform he's on. But either way, he's a content creator and really fantastic. What he does is he does these press junkets. Where you know, you know where they go and interview you guys for the movies and, and you know, I'm sure you, you've done a million of them.

• 1:33:10Speaker 02

  Just came from, just came from one.

• 1:33:11Trevor Noah?

  There, there you go. And people ask you the same question. They ask, it's everything about the movie as well and your character and your this and your that and your that. And it's so nice to see people who are thinking of new ways to do this. What he does is he takes, um, a movie and he basically breaks it down into its color palette. If that makes sense. So like every scene in the movie, he cuts into a slice and it becomes like a barcode of color. And then what he does to actors and directors is when they're on the press tour, he goes like, yo, let's do a, let's do a like a quick, a quiz. I'm going to pull this color palette up and then I'll give you like three movies that you've been in or that are big or whatever. You tell me what movie you think it is. But I'm talking about, imagine I showed you a barcode.

• 1:33:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:33:52Trevor Noah?

  That was like blues and greens with a little bit of red here, but like thousands of lines like.

• 1:33:59Trevor Noah?

  And to your point, you should see the difference between the actors and the directors. But like some of the actors will just be like, oh yeah, that's a, oh, that could be, I saw one the other day of Tom Cruise. He was like, you see the thing you're talking about? I was like, yo, this guy likes his movies, man. He likes making movies. He likes, he, he was like, oh, wait, wait, wait. Uh, Eyes Wide Shut. Yeah, yeah. The purple, the scene that the purple, and he, and, and I'm watching him, watching that. I was like, oh.

• 1:34:27Speaker 01

  He loves it.

• 1:34:28Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, but that's why the, the, that's why the Mission Impossible is what it is. And that's why the Top Gun is what it is. And that's why.

• 1:34:34Speaker 02

  That's why he's had a fifty year.

• 1:34:36Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, that's, but it's exactly what you just said. Some people go, I want to be famous. Then they choose the shortcut to fame, which is acting or whatever. Some of them are successful, some are not. But then the ones that are really successful in any field, whether it's fame, business, whatever it may be. We take for granted what you just said. Their eyes light up at the opportunity to wax lyrical about the thing.

• 1:35:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:02Trevor Noah?

  You should have seen his eyes.

• 1:35:04Speaker 02

  And I agree with you. I think that's in any discipline.

• 1:35:06Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, it really is.

• 1:35:07Speaker 02

  Talk to comics, they're, they're about it, especially as soon as you get higher tier, higher you go.

• 1:35:13Trevor Noah?

  We're obsessed with it.

• 1:35:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:35:14Trevor Noah?

  We're obsessed. That, that obsession and joy.

• 1:35:17Speaker 02

  Artists, like, and that's just, it's not even creative. Uh, financial management.

• 1:35:22Trevor Noah?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:35:22Speaker 02

  You know, restaurant scene, hospitality business, like, uh, man, car builders. I know, I know some custom, it's, it's anybody.

• 1:35:29Trevor Noah?

  What cars, what cars do you have, by the way? You said you're a car collector. What do you?

• 1:35:32Speaker 02

  I have a varied amount of stuff that is a, it's a color code, right? It's a barcode.

• 1:35:38Trevor Noah?

  Okay. What's your favorite? Just give me a favorite.

• 1:35:40Speaker 02

  So, so that's a two-part question. My current, my current daily driver is a twenty twenty-five Civic Type R. I'm waiting, I'm going to wait for the twenty twenty-seventh.

• 1:35:51Trevor Noah?

  I did not expect that answer.

• 1:35:52Speaker 02

  I have been lucky enough to be the voice of Honda now for, gosh, it's got to be six years.

• 1:35:57Trevor Noah?

  But I'm like, okay, I didn't expect that answer.

• 1:35:59Speaker 02

  Uh, I knew about every model they had. And I remember when I, I signed with them, they're like, we're going to give you a car. What do you want? You want the Accurate NSX? I'm like, no, I want to drive a Honda. I want a boost blue Type R and I want the carbon fiber kit. And they're like, how do you know about these options? Like you picked the right guy. So I'm on my second Type R. Uh, I'm going to hopefully switch it when the twenty twenty-seventh's come out because I got some new mods that I like. The reason I like it is it's a true five C car. It's a hatchback. It's my ride to the airport and everywhere else. I know it will start because a lot of the other stuff that I have is beautiful, not necessarily reliable.

• 1:36:32Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:36:33Speaker 02

  But it's still beautiful. Um.

• 1:36:35Trevor Noah?

  Jay Leno spends most of his time on the side of the road.

• 1:36:37Speaker 02

  In the shop, yeah.

• 1:36:38Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, on the side of the road. Fixing is one thing. Fuck. Jay Leno spends most of his time on the side of the road. He's got like a, a personal tow guy.

• 1:36:47Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:47Trevor Noah?

  That's how often his.

• 1:36:48Speaker 02

  And he, he has some eclectic stuff that is just real tough to make reliable.

• 1:36:53Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, I know you can't.

• 1:36:54Speaker 02

  My favorite car, I still have the first car I ever bought with my own money.

• 1:36:57Trevor Noah?

  What is that?

• 1:36:58Speaker 02

  It's a nineteen eighty-nine Jeep Wrangler. And I bought it at Santa Monica Motors Two on Santa Monica Boulevard. Uh, I traded in the car that I used to live in, my Lincoln Continental, which was like half gift from my dad, half money from me. Uh, the first car I ever bought outright was this Jeep. It had sixty-five thousand miles on it. And I was like, man, if I can just get like ten thousand miles on it, I'd be fine. And I still have it. It's got a hundred and eighty-five thousand miles on it. It lives a nice, comfortable retired life up in Massachusetts. Only comes out on sunny days, but it is like fully restored, but not the exterior. I still have all this sun patina, all the rust, but if you look underneath, it is like brand new because I want it to run. I don't want to be stuck.

• 1:37:39Speaker 02

  And I, I can never sell it. Like I can never, I can get another eighty-nine Wrangler, but I can't ever get that one. And like, that was the first thing I did when I was like, man, you're a paid professional wrestler and you're about to move to Kentucky. You need a car. I'm buying this Jeep. So that was, that was the first car I bought with my own money.

• 1:37:57Trevor Noah?

  I love that that car is in some ways a metaphor of you. Like you go, the car, I just want to get ten thousand miles out of it. Wrestling, you were like, I just want to get three years out of it. And then now you're like, oh, I, you know, I'm going to have this long run and look what it's done for me. But hey, I want to treat it easy. I'm not going to drive it every day now.

• 1:38:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:38:15Trevor Noah?

  I want it to live a long, healthy life. I want to bring it out on Sundays. I got to keep the knees healthy.

• 1:38:19Speaker 02

  I, maybe a, maybe a, maybe a through line there is just, it's, it's all enjoyable, man. Like I still enjoy.

• 1:38:26Trevor Noah?

  It's a deep appreciation that you seem to have. It's just like a, do you always have this or did something happen in your life that switched things up?

• 1:38:31Speaker 02

  So I feel in doing reflection that I've always been lustful for life.

• 1:38:40Speaker 02

  Even decisions of like, man, I'm going to not get my ass kicked. Not by learning how to fight and beat the shit out of people.

• 1:38:46Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:46Speaker 02

  But by lifting weights. So people just won't bother me anymore.

• 1:38:48Trevor Noah?

  You're talking about being bullied?

• 1:38:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I, and I can still dress from.

• 1:38:51Trevor Noah?

  Do you still remember your bully, by the way? Cause I, I, I remember my bully. So I, and I'm always in, you don't remember your, were you bullied, first of all? No, I don't know if you were or weren't. Maybe you were the bully.

• 1:39:01Speaker 01

  It's happening now.

• 1:39:02Trevor Noah?

  Oh, man, don't be like that.

• 1:39:04Speaker 02

  That was it.

• 1:39:05Speaker 01

  You, you saw me, I was like.

• 1:39:07Speaker 02

  Brother, let's get out of here.

• 1:39:08Trevor Noah?

  I just find it fascinating that like everyone remembers their bully.

• 1:39:11Speaker 02

  Show me, Lindell already touched you.

• 1:39:12Trevor Noah?

  I'm yet, I'm yet to remember. I'm yet, I'm yet to meet a person.

• 1:39:17Speaker 01

  Who doesn't remember?

• 1:39:17Trevor Noah?

  Who doesn't remember their bully. I'm talking about like, super A-list movie stars. I'm talking about presidents. Um, musicians, CEOs. I don't care who you are in life and what you've done. A father, you're a father of, say you're a grandfather. And I go, who bullied you? And then they'd be like, James D. It's like, you remember your bully?

• 1:39:35Speaker 02

  Of course I do. And I'm, I'm so grateful for him because again, right? Harkening back to the kid's decision. It's tough. You're gonna piss off a lot of people. I pissed off a lot of people with the way I dressed. It just didn't fit. And the music I listened to, the way I styled my hair. I was like, this was rap music in the late eighties, early nineties, dude. High-top fades, rayon polka dots, airbrushed overalls, starter jerseys worn backwards, like. In not just Massachusetts, West Newbury, Massachusetts. The town population is eleven hundred people.

• 1:40:06Trevor Noah?

  Oh, good.

• 1:40:07Speaker 02

  And it, it was a hundred percent white.

• 1:40:09Trevor Noah?

  Some would even say you're asking for it.

• 1:40:13Speaker 02

  Some would say, especially those people who took advantage of that situation.

• 1:40:17Trevor Noah?

  I know, I know.

• 1:40:18Speaker 02

  So I'm faced, I'm faced with a choice. Life is gonna be tough if I keep doing this.

• 1:40:22Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:22Speaker 02

  Hmm. But this is really who I am. I'll get through the tough.

• 1:40:26Trevor Noah?

  Huh.

• 1:40:27Speaker 02

  I don't wanna, I don't wanna just conform. I wanna be who I am. I wanna live life my way. Okay, how can I, how can I traverse the waters? Maybe if I beef myself up, people will stop fucking with me. Cause the last thing you wanna do, you get into a room, you're like, I don't wanna mess with that.

• 1:40:45Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:45Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying? So I tried to.

• 1:40:47Trevor Noah?

  Do I think I can take him? No.

• 1:40:48Speaker 02

  I, fifty fifty shot. I'm not gonna give him, you know, that's, that's an easy way to do that. So. I, even making that decision, the decision to, to go to boarding school, um. Where and why I went to college, uh, changing my major, like, uh, there's a string of decisions that maybe at the time. From twelve to fifteen to nineteen to twenty-four to thirty, like, I didn't know that. Life is the greatest gift.

• 1:41:17Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:41:18Speaker 02

  But I did, because my decisions indicate that. You know, like.

• 1:41:22Trevor Noah?

  It's like you didn't know it, but you felt it.

• 1:41:24Speaker 02

  Like, um, the spidey sense of like, this is opportunity, go. You know, like, I don't know what's gonna happen, but go, go for it.

• 1:41:31Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:41:32Speaker 02

  And it's all, that's, uh, I, I don't, I'm not perfect in my batting average, but I think I got, I think I got more.

• 1:41:38Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:41:38Speaker 02

  More awareness than failure of awareness. You know, and again, a lot of that is just being able to be. Be able to pivot, be able to have that freedom of like, man, I don't, I don't have a lot of other responsibilities. This thing comes up, you want me to go where? What? Now? Sure, let's go.

• 1:41:54Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:41:55Speaker 02

  Like, I've always been, let's, let's fucking go. This, this might be something. So I, now I'm, I'm truly grateful for life. Like, it is the best gift. Somebody asked me today about the Make-A-Wish thing. They're like, what's, what's a record you wanna break? I said, life expectancy. I want as many days as I can get.

• 1:42:16Trevor Noah?

  Oh.

• 1:42:16Speaker 02

  Cause it's beautiful. I don't, I don't want this to end, you know? Uh, and it will, and that's okay. But I have that appreciation. I think I've always had it. I just couldn't put it into words.

• 1:42:27Trevor Noah?

  Got it.

• 1:42:28Speaker 02

  My actions define that like, yo, this dude is going for life. He's going at it. And the, the decisions weren't always gonna get me from not being broke. Like, uh. No kidding, dude. I, I was happy. I was living a happy life. When I was sleeping in my car, like I had, I had joy in my life.

• 1:42:45Trevor Noah?

  Right, right, right.

• 1:42:46Speaker 02

  And again, by choice.

• 1:42:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:48Speaker 02

  Here's a tough thing. Do you want the easy route? Conform with the bullies or go back home? Or do you want the tough route?

• 1:42:53Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:54Speaker 02

  I think I've always been okay to be like, there might be potential in tougher route. I think I'm gonna take that.

• 1:42:58Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:42:59Speaker 02

  You know?

• 1:42:59Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, it's, it's the more rewarding part, right? The path less traveled. You discover something new, you find yourself.

• 1:43:05Speaker 02

  Really tough.

• 1:43:06Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's, but I always think that that, that is the risk and the reward of it.

• 1:43:11Speaker 02

  It's, uh, it's similar to, to reflecting on self.

• 1:43:14Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:14Speaker 02

  A lot of, a lot of folks ain't ready for it, man. A lot of folks can't be like, man, this is where I really messed up in life. Or like, these are the things I could change about myself, or maybe I gotta work on this, or these are my strengths, or what am I even doing? Or what, what's my purpose? What are my core values? All, any of that. Reflection is great and it sounds good in a Instagram, uh, post or like, uh, some, but it's also very difficult. It's very difficult to do, but the reward, man, the reward is like. The yield is, is, you can't calculate it, cause you don't know what, what's possible after you're willing to course correct. Figure out who you really are, be honest with yourself and what you want.

• 1:43:53Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:54Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying?

• 1:43:55Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, that honesty's tough, though.

• 1:43:56Speaker 02

  But the yield, man. Like, the yield of, of facing parent shaming and being like, nah, it's cool. It's all right. And, and, but like, you're gonna, not you, because you're joking, but someone who genuinely was like. I don't, your mind will change when you have kids. That interaction is gonna last five minutes.

• 1:44:15Trevor Noah?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:44:16Speaker 02

  They're gonna go away and I'm left with my life.

• 1:44:18Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:44:19Speaker 02

  And, um, I still, after that interaction, I'm like, hmm. Good pitch, but I'm still in the, I'm in the place where I'm at.

• 1:44:26Trevor Noah?

  Forget that, though. I think as humans, we forget that. We forget how often the interaction for them was less than a snippet. And we're gonna go off and live our lives. We make it seem like when they leave, they're gonna be off somewhere being like. Honey, are you okay? I can't sleep. I don't know if John Cena's gonna have kids tonight. I just, I can't sleep, man.

• 1:44:44Speaker 02

  Well, here's, here's another difficult thing, and that's why, like, um. Being in the creative space is so fragile.

• 1:44:51Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:44:52Speaker 02

  Because if someone comes up and says, you don't get it, you'll, you'll change your mind when, when you have kids. And, and I politely say, okay, thank you for the perspective.

• 1:44:59Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:00Speaker 02

  They could walk away being like, John Cena's an asshole.

• 1:45:02Trevor Noah?

  Oh.

• 1:45:03Speaker 02

  And that might be the only five minutes I get with them. Maybe it's less than five minutes. Maybe it's ninety seconds.

• 1:45:07Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:08Speaker 02

  You know, and because I see this person, that, oh, like, there's the guy, or there's the person. I, I need to, I would like to interact with that person. You have no clue what they're going through. You have no clue what's on their plate for the day. You have no clue what just happened to them. And on top of that, my interaction with that person is gonna formulate an opinion about that person. Not their creative work. It's gonna correlate. It's gonna get all lumped into one thing. So, man, the, the patience of moving through space with, with kindness and empathy is something I've really worked on. Because one human being at a time is, is the ability for me to hopefully keep playing dress up for a living.

• 1:45:46Trevor Noah?

  Oh.

• 1:45:46Speaker 02

  And it also, it, it helps course correct my nihilism. Uh, it, it makes me grateful for life, like, a lot of that stuff. Like, um, but again.

• 1:45:58Speaker 02

  One bad interaction. And, and nowadays, there's folks who like prey off of the bad interactions.

• 1:46:03Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, now, now some people have turned it, obviously because of social media, they try and engineer a bad interaction. They try and fabricate it. They try and create a thing, the thing, but I, I, we had a, you, again, it's so funny you saying these things. We, we often bump into, it's almost like an energy.

• 1:46:18Trevor Noah?

  But I, I said to Eugene the other day, one of the things that gave me peace was understanding. That I did not get to where I was from one interaction.

• 1:46:28Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:46:28Trevor Noah?

  And so no one could take it away in one interaction.

• 1:46:31Speaker 02

  You're right. You're right.

• 1:46:32Trevor Noah?

  And I think that's an important thing, like, for everyone to remember. It doesn't matter where you are, how you work. It's like. No, no, no. Don't, don't minimize your successes to one thing. Because they weren't. So don't let one person threaten to take them all away from you.

• 1:46:45Speaker 02

  You're, you're very right. And, uh, and that, that, you're correct. Uh, Paul Heyman had a, a very nice quote in his Hall of Fame speech. I've been canceled ten times and I got up eleven. Like, you're right. No, no one thing can define the totality, depending within moral, within moral code.

• 1:47:03Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:04Speaker 02

  Um, also, just understanding that, hey, man, when I leave the house. I become a, an, an interactive piece for people.

• 1:47:15Trevor Noah?

  Oh, damn.

• 1:47:16Speaker 02

  No, that's.

• 1:47:17Trevor Noah?

  No, but it's true. I'm just saying that the fact that you're articulating it.

• 1:47:20Speaker 01

  Spot on. Yeah.

• 1:47:21Speaker 02

  And, and I'm not perfect, but I'm, I've gotten, I'm better than I was yesterday. And, and like I said, it, it helps me with empathy. It helps me with kindness. If someone comes up and is disrespectful, when they walk away, I'm like, man, I don't know what kind of day they had.

• 1:47:33Trevor Noah?

  People can be disrespectful to you?

• 1:47:36Speaker 02

  So.

• 1:47:36Trevor Noah?

  See, that blows my mind again. In my, maybe again, it's because my, my, I still have my wrestling child brain. I do not perceive, I cannot think of a person coming up to John Cena and being disrespectful. So, like in my brain, I just can't think of that.

• 1:47:49Speaker 02

  There, there are a lot of folks who'd be like, man, I can't, I can't see John Cena being disrespectful to someone. And that, if I have been, it certainly wasn't intentional, unless I believe, I believe respect is a boomerang. If you throw none out there, you'll get none back. Uh, but there might be a chance where like. I'm going to the flight, I'm going to a flight and I gotta make it. Or I'm going from A to B.

• 1:48:09Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:48:10Speaker 02

  Like, yo, can I, like, dude, if you wanna walk with me or whatever, or I just don't have time.

• 1:48:13Trevor Noah?

  Ah, yeah.

• 1:48:14Speaker 02

  That might be like, fuck this, this fucking guy.

• 1:48:16Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:17Speaker 02

  You know?

• 1:48:17Trevor Noah?

  Well, I think it's because a lot of the time, people, you know what really helped me was my, my youngest brother. He's wise beyond his years. Twenty years younger than me. He'd always drop, he'd just like throw a gem into my life, like a lightning bolt of a gem. One day he said to me, cause he, he would experience this with me, you know? And then one day he said, you know, bro, one of the things we should never take for granted is. That you are the highlight of their day.

• 1:48:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:41Trevor Noah?

  And they don't understand that they're not the highlights of yours. And not in a shit way.

• 1:48:45Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:48:46Trevor Noah?

  He's just going like, to them, it's like, oh my God, you just walked into, you walked into a supermarket.

• 1:48:51Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:48:52Trevor Noah?

  In your head.

• 1:48:52Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:48:53Trevor Noah?

  In their head, for some person, they're gonna like, Trevor Noah just walked into a supermarket. And you're like, no, I just walked in, I'm, I need to grab this. I'm grabbing a Band-Aid, the fingers cut them. They're like, whoa, what are you doing? You wanna grab yourself? I'm like, my fingers bleeding. Yeah, can I get a selfie? Wait, my finger, I'm bleeding, I'm bleeding. They're like, I don't mind, can we get a selfie? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm, I'm gonna die. Okay, can we get the selfie first? Yeah, okay, look, man. I just, and then you realize, oh. It's just two people seeing a completely different reality in the same space.

• 1:49:19Speaker 02

  Which is, which is common in a lot of interactions.

• 1:49:21Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:22Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:49:22Speaker 02

  And again, like. Increase that empathy knob a little bit.

• 1:49:26Trevor Noah?

  Huh.

• 1:49:27Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying?

• 1:49:27Trevor Noah?

  I like this.

• 1:49:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's no one, very few, very few people are malicious.

• 1:49:34Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, that's true.

• 1:49:35Speaker 02

  And they're just trying to do the best they can with managing their emotions and like seeing something they is unique.

• 1:49:41Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, surprise.

• 1:49:43Speaker 02

  There are a few, like I said, you throw no respect out, you'll get no respect back.

• 1:49:47Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:49:48Speaker 02

  And I will be stern, but that has nothing to do with me thinking I'm above anyone. Respect is a core value of mine. And if we can't relate as humans, and if I can see that like you're not in the business of trying to manage your emotions, you're just being a dick, well, I will, I will close off some walls. And, and you can, you can inch your way back in.

• 1:50:09Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:50:09Speaker 02

  With a little bit of diplomacy, but like, man, you can't, you can't treat a human being like that. And that's, those are very rare cases. Most times when I say like, people will be disrespectful to me. It's how I want to be treated. Well, who the fuck knows how I want to be treated?

• 1:50:23Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:50:25Speaker 02

  You know, like I, I really prefer people coming up and saying hello, because that's human, human contact. I love that stuff, but it's more like, yo, can I get a picture? It's can I get a picture?

• 1:50:36Trevor Noah?

  Well, take, already you've taken it.

• 1:50:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I don't have a say in the matter.

• 1:50:40Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:50:40Speaker 02

  But also I understand that they're probably just, I didn't want to bother you. I'm just trying to take a few seconds. I get like, or like people shooting video from you from long lens to be like, I just didn't want to interrupt you.

• 1:50:51Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:51Speaker 02

  Okay, I get that. I, I kind of feel like a, an exhibit, but, but I also understand where you're coming from.

• 1:50:58Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:59Speaker 02

  You know, so like, um, I don't know, very few people like outright malicious.

• 1:51:04Trevor Noah?

  It's a nice way to live life, man. It's a nice way.

• 1:51:06Speaker 02

  It's, bro, very few people out there are like, I'm gonna wake up today and fuck that guy over. Like, think of how many times you woke up and said that.

• 1:51:15Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:15Speaker 02

  You at home watching this. Think of how many times you said that. And, and there have probably been a few days, right? There's probably been a few days, but it's not a lasting thing.

• 1:51:23Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, that's not who you are.

• 1:51:24Speaker 02

  It's not a lasting thing.

• 1:51:25Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:26Speaker 02

  So you're, I'd like to believe that humanity by and large is not malicious. I'm not saying that there's not.

• 1:51:31Trevor Noah?

  No, no, yeah, it's, I think it's the correct way.

• 1:51:33Speaker 02

  The majority of the folks are just trying to do the best they can and live, live a good life for them and theirs. You know what I'm saying?

• 1:51:39Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, I get it. You know what makes this hang crazy is I, I, I get to watch my friend through you. There's so, there's so many things that you guys spoke about that I see in him and I try to explain to him and he's like, oh, man, I don't understand. The sunny disposition that he has, there's so many times where emotionally he's rescued me from situations where I was like, there's no end to this thing. And he's like, let's keep going. And I keep saying to him, whenever we're hanging out, how did you know this thing was gonna work? It's the same thing that you have, this intuition, this heightened sense of intuition that you have to say, if this keeps going, somewhere is around the corner, there's a good result for all of us. And also the, the empathy that you show to people that love you and love your work.

• 1:52:22Trevor Noah?

  I've seen it in action and I'm like, no one is out there to try and ruin your day. And you always give people a chance to just express themselves and you forgive them for their transgression sometimes of seeming rude, but you just move on with your life and you never let that slice of.

• 1:52:35Speaker 05

  I mean, I try, yeah.

• 1:52:36Trevor Noah?

  Of action just to ruin your day.

• 1:52:37Speaker 05

  It's not perfect, but you try.

• 1:52:38Trevor Noah?

  It's so weird to see how, how you guys express the same emotions and sympathy to people.

• 1:52:43Speaker 02

  When, when'd you, when'd you start with all this? How long you been in this?

• 1:52:46Trevor Noah?

  So it's, it has now been 22 years.

• 1:52:50Speaker 02

  I, I think time is a good, you talked about time with relationships.

• 1:52:55Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:55Speaker 02

  So now let's, let's widen it and just not regulate it to relationships. I think time gives you that perspective on life, especially if you're open minded and curious. If you are set in your ways, man, I go back to West Newbury and there's still the same folks sitting at the same seats and they, they've aged, but they haven't aged here.

• 1:53:12Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:53:14Speaker 02

  I believe 20 years in the creative space and the creative business is enough time for you to have thoughts and be like, man, I, yeah, this is, this is good. I should be all right. And, and also develop perspectives of like, it's not all I am, it's not all that defines me. I'm not, but like that's, I, I like hear that because I think you've, you've had the time under tension that it takes to think of greater things.

• 1:53:39Trevor Noah?

  Time under tension, I love that.

• 1:53:41Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying?

• 1:53:42Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:43Speaker 05

  Think of greater things.

• 1:53:44Speaker 02

  You just, you're not focused on like, uh, man, I gotta do this set, which you, yes, when I go out to do a match or when I go to a scene.

• 1:53:50Trevor Noah?

  That's when the focus happens.

• 1:53:51Speaker 02

  Sure, but then afterwards you can, you can think about a, a, a larger things. You can, you can reflect on all the years.

• 1:53:57Trevor Noah?

  So where do we find you now in life? Like, if we, if we talk about these stages and we talk about these cycles, you know?

• 1:54:03Speaker 02

  So.

• 1:54:03Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:04Speaker 02

  By the calendar, I'm at the half century mark.

• 1:54:06Trevor Noah?

  Okay.

• 1:54:06Speaker 02

  So that's pretty crazy, right? Half century, fuck.

• 1:54:09Trevor Noah?

  What are you doing for your 50th, by the way?

• 1:54:11Speaker 02

  So I've thought about it. Uh, my, the people I love in my life are very fragmented and to try to hurt all the cats and get them all together in one space is very selfish. Um, it's just my wife and I and we're, life has been very lucky to us. So I think instead of on a day to be like, all right, it's the birthday, let's go. I think for my 50th year on the planet, I want to actively make trips to the people I love.

• 1:54:37Trevor Noah?

  Look at this guy.

• 1:54:37Speaker 02

  And spend some time in an environment that they feel most comfortable.

• 1:54:41Trevor Noah?

  Look at this guy.

• 1:54:42Speaker 02

  And, uh.

• 1:54:43Trevor Noah?

  Intuition.

• 1:54:43Speaker 02

  And, and just enjoy the company of, of those folks, you know? And it's, it's, I'm not going to a hundred places. It'll, it'll be, I got a small core group, but it's, I would say it's like eight folks. And, uh, that's the initial idea of like, well, what do I really want to do? I wanna, I love connecting and spending time with people I love. And dude, I will lean, you have learned, I will lean into some fucking conversation.

• 1:55:06Trevor Noah?

  Oh, no, that's, I mean, that's what.

• 1:55:08Speaker 02

  I love bouncing, bouncing these ideas around and all the people I love, they all, they're not yes people, they all challenge me, they all call me out of my bullshit. We're all focused on growth and being better than we were yesterday in our own different lanes.

• 1:55:20Trevor Noah?

  Right.

• 1:55:20Speaker 02

  We're not carbon copies of each other. Not everybody's like a, a muscle bound dumbass jock. Like it's, we got, we got, like the X-Men, we got people with different talents. So I, I really think spending a year with intent to connect with people I love is probably a good way to celebrate a half a century on the rock.

• 1:55:37Trevor Noah?

  You know what I always love about moments like this? Cause that's beautiful, but I always love, just my comedy brain goes, there's like one friend who's like, honey, isn't it, isn't it, isn't it John's 50th? It's like, yeah, yeah, it is, it is. Oh my God, I wonder what he's gonna, I wonder what he's got planned. I mean, it's John, so we're probably, he's probably gonna invite us somewhere amazing. We're all gonna go, I mean, we're gonna be on a trip out of this world.

• 1:55:57Speaker 02

  Cut to like.

• 1:56:00Speaker 02

  Hey, uh, happy birthday. You got, you got mac and cheese for dinner?

• 1:56:06Trevor Noah?

  Did you bring your old Jeep?

• 1:56:07Speaker 02

  Can I? You got an extra seat? You don't? Can I, I'll sit on the dining board, is that okay? Is that good? We good? No, we're not good? I'm gonna, surprise, I'm gonna show them. I brought beers.

• 1:56:21Trevor Noah?

  Man, John, this has been amazing, man. Thank you.

• 1:56:22Speaker 02

  Dude, it's great to see you again.

• 1:56:23Trevor Noah?

  This is like, thank you. Truly amazing.

• 1:56:25Speaker 02

  Man, when, uh, so we, we have a, a past relationship of conversation, which means we can kind of get into some minutia. You jumped right in and like with, with bold topics and beautiful thoughts, man, it's very insightful stuff. So to be able to sit down with essentially, we've known each other a little bit.

• 1:56:42Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:42Speaker 02

  And somebody new and to be able to, to spend two hours of life like, oh, man, I, I got some takeaways from this and I'm gonna walk out of the room better than when I walked in.

• 1:56:50Trevor Noah?

  Ah, this guy. You feel the same.

• 1:56:52Speaker 02

  Two hours.

• 1:56:52Trevor Noah?

  More than the same. Thank you.

• 1:56:53Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:56:54Trevor Noah?

  For real, man, this has been.

• 1:56:55Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 1:56:55Trevor Noah?

  A true joy and, and happy birthday.

• 1:56:58Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:56:58Trevor Noah?

  Happy birthday.

• 1:56:59Speaker 02

  Still got some time?

• 1:57:00Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, no, but happy birthday. When is it? We give it to you ahead of time.

• 1:57:02Speaker 02

  April 23rd.

• 1:57:03Trevor Noah?

  Happy birthday.

• 1:57:04Speaker 02

  I gotta start planning now if I'm gonna make this thing happen.

• 1:57:06Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:57:07Speaker 02

  So, uh, I, I'm crossing my fingers, I hope that's where we, where we get.

• 1:57:10Trevor Noah?

  You deserve every single year of those 50 years.

• 1:57:12Speaker 02

  Okay, so check this out, right? What a way to end.

• 1:57:13Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:57:15Speaker 02

  I've eliminated the word deserve from my vocabulary.

• 1:57:19Trevor Noah?

  Say more.

• 1:57:21Speaker 02

  I've replaced it with the word earn.

• 1:57:23Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:57:24Speaker 02

  Because if I say, well, I deserve that, that means I feel as if it's entitled to me. I have to say, I earned that and I have to be accountable for the earn. A lot of folks, we use that word deserve and it becomes a slippery slope.

• 1:57:43Trevor Noah?

  Hmm.

• 1:57:43Speaker 02

  So it's amazing. That's the, like the last piece of conversation that we have.

• 1:57:46Trevor Noah?

  And that's the word that you've been pondering for.

• 1:57:48Speaker 02

  I have eliminated the word deserve and replaced it with the word earn because it makes you accountable and makes you question. Like, yo, I, man, I deserved that car. Switch the word.

• 1:57:58Trevor Noah?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:59Speaker 02

  I earned that car. Fair play.

• 1:58:02Trevor Noah?

  Huh.

• 1:58:03Speaker 02

  I deserve happiness.

• 1:58:04Trevor Noah?

  Well, I've earned happiness.

• 1:58:05Speaker 02

  I've earned happiness. Fair play. Like, I don't, it's weird, like I heard that, I'm like, I don't use it, but when you say it, I immediately just hear the word earned. And for you to be like, you've earned the right to spend a year kicking it with friends. Fuck, yeah, I feel comfortable saying that. I've earned that. But that's it, I'll, I'll leave you with that one to think about.

• 1:58:25Trevor Noah?

  No, absolutely, you've earned it.

• 1:58:26Speaker 02

  Replace deserve with earn.

• 1:58:28Trevor Noah?

  Yeah, you've earned.

• 1:58:28Speaker 02

  Cause it makes you accountable for what's going on.

• 1:58:30Trevor Noah?

  Love it.

• 1:58:31Speaker 02

  Damn.

• 1:58:31Trevor Noah?

  Love it. John Cena, everybody.

• 1:58:34Speaker 02

  That's it.

• 1:58:35Trevor Noah?

  Bam, bam, bam, bam.

• 1:58:36Speaker 02

  It's a catchy tune.

• 1:58:37Trevor Noah?

  Da, da, da, da. What? Ah, this was dope, man. This was too dope. Thank you.

• 1:58:45Trevor Noah?

  What Now with Trevor Noah is produced by Day Zero Productions in partnership with SiriusXM. The show is executive produced by Trevor Noah, Sanaz Yamin and Jess Hackel. Rebecca Chain is our producer. Our development researcher is Marcia Robiu. Music mixing and mastering by Hannes Brown. Random other stuff by Ryan Pardue. Thank you so much for listening. Join me next week for another episode of What Now?

• 1:59:17Speaker 05

  Walmart shoppers, meet the debit card designed with you in mind. The Walmart Money Card offers up to $75 cash back on purchases at Walmart each year. Early direct deposit, overdraft protection and so much more. When Walmart is your everyday store, you need a card to match. That's the Walmart Money Card. Open your account today. The Walmart Money Card is issued by Green Dot Bank, member FDIC. Fees, terms and conditions apply. Visit walmartmoneycard.com to learn more.

• 1:59:44Speaker 06

  When an intruder approaches a home, they expect a camera. What they don't expect.

• 1:59:49Speaker 05

  Stop, this is simply safe. Police are on the way.

• 1:59:51Speaker 06

  Using smart AI cameras, live US-based agents help deter intruders in under 30 seconds. Don't just record a break in, stop it from ever happening. Plans starting around a dollar a day. Right now, get 60% off your new system with professional monitoring at simplysafe.com/sxm. 30 seconds response time requires monitoring plan with outdoor protection starting at $49.99 a month. Visit simplysafe.com/licenses for alarm license information.