Lauren Graham Returns

Lauren Graham (The Z-Suite, Parenthood, Gilmore Girls) is a Golden Globe-nominated actor, producer, and author. Lauren joins the Armchair Expert to discuss the day Lauren drove by Dax and thought he was Brad Pitt, giving up the ghost that she’ll ever be the kind of person that dresses like she has a real job, and having a maternal relationship with her TV mom on Gilmore Girls in the absence of her own mother. Lauren and Dax talk about both hating having their picture taken, how being a tutor for the Princeton Review was actually a racket, and the dichotomy of being a good hang. Lauren explains finding herself able to clinically think about a child the age her mom stopped being around, how being in commercials gave her a purpose as well as the illusion of being productive, and the confusion of originally thinking the title of her new show was “The Disease Suite.” Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ http://www.wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dan Rather and I'm joined by Lily Padman.

• 0:04Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 0:05Dax Shepard?

  We have my sister here today.

• 0:06Speaker 01

  You do.

• 0:07Dax Shepard?

  Not Carly.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  Nope.

• 0:09Dax Shepard?

  But my other sister Lauren Graham.

• 0:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:11Dax Shepard?

  Ah, love her.

• 0:12Speaker 01

  We love having a parenthood yin on.

• 0:15Dax Shepard?

  Lauren Graham, actor, producer, bestselling author. So impressive. Gilmore Girls, Parenthood, Bad Santa, Evan Almighty, Because I Said So. She has a new show out right now on Tubi.

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 0:27Dax Shepard?

  Free.

• 0:28Speaker 01

  We love free.

• 0:29Dax Shepard?

  We learned about Tubi in this episode.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  We did, yeah.

• 0:31Dax Shepard?

  The show is called The Z-Suite, which is a comedy exploring the tension between the generations, which is kind of the topic of the day on the show. We're doing a lot of generational stuff.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  You're right.

• 0:43Dax Shepard?

  This whole week is generation, really.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 0:46Dax Shepard?

  Wow.

• 0:49Dax Shepard?

  God, I love her.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:51Dax Shepard?

  Most stunning eyes in the biz.

• 0:52Speaker 01

  She's so fun and so smart.

• 0:54Dax Shepard?

  Ah, very smart.

• 0:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it.

• 0:56Dax Shepard?

  It's also Smart Week.

• 0:58Speaker 01

  My God.

• 0:59Dax Shepard?

  I know, there's a lot of things happening. This is all accidental. Please enjoy my sweet, sweet sister Lauren Graham. We get support from Quince.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Okay, can we talk about the fact that the holidays are already here? It's crazy. I feel like I blinked and now we're in gifting season, which I'm not really mad about because I do love giving gifts. And Quince is making it so easy to find something great for everyone on my list, including myself. Because let's be honest, self-gifting is a love language.

• 1:27Dax Shepard?

  Quince is seriously the gift that keeps on giving. Their high-quality staples are made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, 14-karat gold, and Italian leather. Full-on luxury quality at prices that won't wreck your holiday budget.

• 1:43Speaker 01

  It's the dream. The cashmere sweater's starting at $60, down jackets, wool outerwear, cashmere accessories. You and everyone on your list are staying cozy and looking incredible all season long.

• 1:54Dax Shepard?

  Well, I'm gonna tell you this, it just got chilly for the first time this year in California and I'm so excited. And I'm wearing my Quince cashmere right now.

• 2:01Speaker 01

  It's great.

• 2:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and I am going to gift this to some of my friends. I hope they're not listening.

• 2:06Speaker 01

  Quince is also more than clothing. They've got fine jewelry for your significant other. Leather bags for your bestie, hotel quality bedding to set up your guest rooms, chef grade cookware. That's an amazing thing they offer here and it's such a good gift because people don't like buying cookware for themselves, but it's very important. And they also have five star luggage, another good gift that people don't like buying for themselves.

• 2:28Dax Shepard?

  Give the gift of quality this holiday season. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show. This episode is brought to you by McDonald's. The Quarter Pounder with Cheese with Medium Fries and a Drink is now $8.

• 2:59Speaker 01

  What?

• 3:00Dax Shepard?

  Okay, I need to talk about something that doesn't get enough respect. The Quarter Pounder with Cheese. This is not a casual burger. This is a crafted burger. We're talking 100% fresh beef cooked right when you order it. No artificial flavors, no fillers, no preservatives, just beef doing what beef is supposed to do. And here's a detail I love. There's a cowbell sound in the kitchen. When somebody orders a Quarter Pounder with Cheese, a cowbell goes off and the grill master throws a fresh patty down. That's like having your own entrance music at McDonald's. I want a cowbell for everything in life. The onions are hand topped by someone who just knows the right amount. Two slices of cheese laid out in a star pattern, so every single bite gets cheese. And two pickles side by side, so you're never in a pickle desert.

• 3:44Dax Shepard?

  Every bite is accounted for. Someone engineered this thing with love. I love a Quarter Pounder.

• 3:50Speaker 01

  Me too. That's my order. It's a Quarter Pounder with Cheese. I love it. I didn't know they put so much effort that they did a star formation. I should have known because you can taste it when there's effort.

• 4:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the love. Don't tell anyone this, but I'll put two of them back in one sitting.

• 4:07Speaker 01

  I'm not surprised.

• 4:08Dax Shepard?

  The Quarter Pounder with Cheese with Fries and a Drink, now $8 for a limited time only. Only at McDonald's. For a limited time only, prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska, and California and for delivery. Fresh beef not available in Alaska and Hawaii. Offer not valid for delivery.

• 4:43Speaker 02

  I can't believe this is the setup now. Right? It's very fancy. It's been so long since you were here. I feel like I was one of the first people.

• 4:52Dax Shepard?

  You were. I looked today, you were April. So you were two months in. There's been 850 people since you.

• 5:01Speaker 02

  Are we on? Oh, yeah.

• 5:03Dax Shepard?

  We're always on. ABR. Go ahead. Tell me how it reminds you of Parenthood.

• 5:06Speaker 02

  I remember there were issues because Parenthood was shot very kind of freestyle.

• 5:11Dax Shepard?

  Economically.

• 5:12Speaker 02

  Sure, sure, sure. And some would say proscenium. We're like, we're doing like a school play. You never knew where the cameras were. But I remember one day, this was not your request. It's just something that happened. Suddenly there's a bounce board for Dax. And I remember everyone kind of being like, why does he get a bounce? I don't get anything. We're lighting us with a flashlight and Dax got some special.

• 5:33Dax Shepard?

  Here's what I told myself. I didn't request that.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  No.

• 5:36Dax Shepard?

  I looked so bad on the monitor. I was the only one who's like, we gotta light that nose differently. When someone puts a bounce board only under your face, you're like, oh, fuck, I am the ugliest member of this cast.

• 5:47Speaker 02

  That's insane. Remember the day that I was driving by and I thought you were Brad Pitt?

• 5:51Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I will never, ever forget it. You know, I went back and listened, actually, to your episode because it was seven years ago.

• 5:59Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh. Crazy. Wow.

• 6:03Dax Shepard?

  So I'm going back thinking, this is gonna be rough. This is gonna be month two. But I'm gonna tell you what, this is one of the first ones that I've gone back to that I totally liked it.

• 6:10Speaker 02

  Really?

• 6:11Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 6:12Speaker 02

  Why do you think that is?

• 6:13Dax Shepard?

  I think because I was panicked that I had to guide the thing somewhere at the beginning or that I had to manage what was happening. But you and I have such an effortless rapport that I was just really relaxed. I still interrupted too much. It's not great. But it's better than the other ones.

• 6:31Speaker 02

  Not to turn this into my interview of you, guys, but what has changed for you? Has it just evolved into now this is something that is better? That's a really long time to have any gig and you've spoken to so many. People.

• 6:45Dax Shepard?

  I think it's like acting at the beginning. I was so self-conscious and I stand where like I used to look at the lens on without a paddle. They had to rotoscope my eyes a bunch of times. I like look right into the fucking camera because I didn't know better. But by parenthood, you're just kind of existing. But that happened in this job too. Whereas like at the beginning, I had a lot of fear of am I doing a good job and how do you conduct an interview and all these kinds of things. And then just over time, I think I don't have any real fear around it at all.

• 7:11Speaker 02

  But also, it's so successful. Doesn't that change how you start your day?

• 7:17Speaker 01

  A lot of things for us, I think. The success of it. I think it's made the pressure a little more. The more we sign deals and start doing those things, then it's like, we gotta have big numbers. It almost took away the thing that we started with, which was like, let's just chit chat.

• 7:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the experience of trying to do good and trying to be in the top versus trying to stay in the top is a completely different pressure.

• 7:40Speaker 02

  Interesting. It really is.

• 7:41Dax Shepard?

  And I don't like that. It's not why we did it. But then you can't not start thinking like, well, I certainly don't want to watch us just decline over the next five years. I'd like to stay.

• 7:50Speaker 02

  Today is the day. Today is the day. Starts.

• 7:53Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 7:54Speaker 01

  Parenthood fans are so excited right now.

• 7:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. You're new to Instagram, right?

• 7:58Speaker 02

  I just joined Instagram.

• 8:00Dax Shepard?

  Congratulations.

• 8:02Speaker 02

  It'll be a year around my birthday.

• 8:04Dax Shepard?

  Well, comments, you learn things that I wouldn't otherwise have known. So I'm very aware that Parenthood is now back on Netflix and in Canada.

• 8:13Speaker 02

  Oh, okay.

• 8:14Dax Shepard?

  So there are a lot of Canadians right now that are tickled pink.

• 8:17Speaker 02

  Oh, great. I just spent a bunch of months in Toronto and it was just so nice. I'm not just saying that to pander to the Canadian fans.

• 8:25Dax Shepard?

  No, it's a legit great city now.

• 8:26Speaker 02

  It's a great city, but it's also a great country. And it was a relief to not be in a lot of dialogue about what's going to become of us. And just like the shopping's great, the restaurants were great. It was really fun.

• 8:39Dax Shepard?

  It's the most multicultural place on the planet.

• 8:43Speaker 02

  Selfishly, that just makes the food really good. When you're there for work, our big thing would be to have like a Saturday dinner and where are we gonna go? And we just had some incredible food.

• 8:54Dax Shepard?

  Bevy of offering.

• 8:55Speaker 02

  Yes, yes. But back to you.

• 8:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 8:58Speaker 02

  I want to tell you, because right around that time, you came over and asked May and I about doing a podcast.

• 9:06Dax Shepard?

  That's right. I pitched you.

• 9:08Speaker 02

  Yes, which I didn't understand. There are many things I feel partially because I wasn't on things like Instagram. I am often behind what is happening in our business. I can remember on Parenthood, May saying to me, I've just really stressed out about social media. And I said, what's that?

• 9:26Dax Shepard?

  You like literally what?

• 9:27Speaker 02

  I did not know what she's talking about.

• 9:29Speaker 01

  I'm jealous of you.

• 9:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, that's changed. I can remember a time when I thought that sitting and watching something on TV and then also having your phone was just like a cracked thing to do. And now I sort of do that. But we tried.

• 9:41Dax Shepard?

  You and May did.

• 9:43Speaker 02

  Years later, you're doing your own talk show. And I guess the way my brain works, because I love talk shows. And also, we're very different people, May and I, in terms of how we approach things. She's more fluid and fun.

• 9:54Dax Shepard?

  Jazz.

• 9:54Speaker 02

  She's jazz.

• 9:55Dax Shepard?

  And you're classical.

• 9:56Speaker 02

  And I'm Sinatra?

• 9:57Dax Shepard?

  Okay, right. Yeah, that's nice.

• 9:59Speaker 02

  I want segments. I want standards. I want a chorus. And then I want a refrain.

• 10:03Dax Shepard?

  With a groovy underbelly.

• 10:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, you know, you riff within it, but it's hard.

• 10:06Dax Shepard?

  How many did you do?

• 10:08Speaker 02

  We did essentially a pilot.

• 10:09Dax Shepard?

  Because my pitch to you, I remember.

• 10:11Speaker 02

  What was it?

• 10:11Dax Shepard?

  I wanted you guys to have basically like a homewares type podcast, because you're so into decor and building. And she's got a real eye for fashion. Over the years, people have asked me, shockingly, for my advice in this space. And my thing is literally pay attention. What do you talk about in your free time endlessly? I talk about trauma endlessly. And then that's kind of what the show ended up being. So I've been around you guys. You guys are horny for all this neat stuff. Truly invigorated by aesthetic.

• 10:41Speaker 02

  That's a fantastic idea. Ours was more, this is one of my best friends, and we are 20 years apart.

• 10:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 10:48Speaker 02

  So the concept was how do we come at things differently, but on the same subject? You ran out of material. What I now think about, but there's no need in this space. I have realized I read more than a lot of people. And I talk about what I'm reading.

• 11:04Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you were on a morning show and the co-host handed you three books. That's how known you are for being an avid reader.

• 11:11Speaker 02

  Spoiler alert, I had read them all.

• 11:14Dax Shepard?

  You played it off like they were all novel and new to you.

• 11:17Speaker 02

  I was so panicked. She was like, here's this beautiful gift. And I was like. I

• 11:22Dax Shepard?

  I've already given this to someone else because I read it all.

• 11:25Speaker 02

  But it was Jenna Bush and those are her pics and I read them partially because she picked them and so I am influenced as well in that space.

• 11:32Dax Shepard?

  So you'll follow people's book lists. Who do you follow?

• 11:34Speaker 02

  I don't even follow in the social media sense, but were you worried about your breath just then?

• 11:39Dax Shepard?

  Nicotine.

• 11:40Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 11:40Dax Shepard?

  Also, your eyes look so beautiful. You wouldn't forget, these are blue, right?

• 11:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, those are blue.

• 11:45Dax Shepard?

  Monica has a hard time remembering people's eye color, but yours are memorable.

• 11:48Speaker 02

  Well, so are yours. So we're on the nicotine still. I didn't know it came in a spray.

• 11:52Dax Shepard?

  Yes, this is the purest delivery system possible.

• 11:54Speaker 02

  Not the gum?

• 11:55Dax Shepard?

  Well, the mint and the lozenge.

• 11:57Speaker 01

  You did used to do the gum though, remember?

• 11:59Dax Shepard?

  No, I never was really into the gum.

• 12:00Speaker 02

  I remember you chewing the gum, huh?

• 12:02Dax Shepard?

  You remember these? I've been on these for 20 years.

• 12:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 12:05Dax Shepard?

  I dipped for a while, but I'm a year and I'm on top of that.

• 12:09Speaker 01

  So just Kristen on the gum?

• 12:10Dax Shepard?

  She was on the gum, yeah, yeah.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  She'd always say, give me a two.

• 12:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah. Well, she loves her nicotine. She's on the spray. We're a nicotine family.

• 12:16Speaker 02

  That seems off brand for her.

• 12:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, she has some things like that.

• 12:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, interesting.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  Pop out.

• 12:22Dax Shepard?

  See if you'll understand this wardrobe choice. It's been a long time since I wore this shirt.

• 12:26Speaker 02

  Is this Friday Night Lights?

• 12:27Dax Shepard?

  The thing I own that has the most connective tissue to parenthood.

• 12:30Speaker 01

  No, we had the mug.

• 12:31Speaker 02

  Is it our football team?

• 12:32Dax Shepard?

  FNL, Friday Night Lights.

• 12:34Speaker 02

  I said FNL.

• 12:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:35Speaker 02

  Then I thought I was missing a parenthood reference.

• 12:37Dax Shepard?

  Well, this is the closest I have.

• 12:39Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah, right.

• 12:40Dax Shepard?

  Knowing you're coming, I'm like, I want to do something parenthood-y, but I don't own anything parenthood-y, but I own this, which is connected.

• 12:46Speaker 02

  I don't know if I own anything parenthood-y either.

• 12:50Dax Shepard?

  Did you take any props or anything? Like I took the mugs, I took the luncheon at Signet's.

• 12:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, I maybe don't have this anymore. When I moved.

• 12:57Dax Shepard?

  Your Marie condo.

• 12:58Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm, which I kind of am always anyway. I feel it's an illusion, but that I will finally one day reach the point where my stuff is only what I need and nothing else and it won't bring anything in, but then you look at the jeans collection and it's like, can't stop.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  It's hard.

• 13:13Dax Shepard?

  How many pair of jeans do you think you have? You want Monica to go to first so you don't feel as bad?

• 13:16Speaker 01

  I have a lot of jeans. I got rid of a bunch recently too. I heard a new rule, two out, one in. So if you buy something, you have to get rid of two. I'm working on that.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  How many do you have? Do you fold them or do they hang? Okay.

• 13:28Dax Shepard?

  She's about 16. What are they called? Amour? Armoires, armoires.

• 13:32Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 13:32Dax Shepard?

  In her one bedroom apartment.

• 13:33Speaker 02

  A few armoires.

• 13:34Dax Shepard?

  Her entire apartment is armoires.

• 13:36Speaker 02

  That's too many armoires.

• 13:37Speaker 01

  I know, but the closet's too small.

• 13:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:40Speaker 01

  So I had to make more space for said jeans.

• 13:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:43Speaker 01

  I probably have 20 pairs.

• 13:45Speaker 02

  I probably have more than that. What I got rid of, which is bad, I got rid of the jeans that you would just wear to paint something. And I was like, these are all uncomfortable because they're like too fancy.

• 13:56Dax Shepard?

  Now I relate to that because I have several pair of jeans that I'm supposed to do work in. I see something, I'm like, oh, fuck, I was supposed to cut that down. And then I'm doing it and I'm ruining the new jeans. I'm like, I'm never, ever going to go inside and get eventized for my yard job.

• 14:09Speaker 02

  Eventized is great.

• 14:10Dax Shepard?

  I'm just going to ruin whatever pair of pants I have on.

• 14:12Speaker 02

  I also realized it's okay to have the jeans because I need to stop thinking I'm ever dressing like a person with a real job. Because especially here, where am I going?

• 14:22Dax Shepard?

  Like a pantsuit?

• 14:23Speaker 01

  Like blouses?

• 14:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, any of that. On this job, I finally played a character. May and I have a joke, which is defaulting to plaid, which has to do with wardrobe choices on most of the stuff. I mean, not Lorelai so much. She also had nice clothes for a job. But on Parenthood, May would be texting me, she'd be like, what are you wearing? And I was like, I don't, I'm defaulting to plaid. I'm just going to wear like another plaid shirt, sort of like a groovy-ish mom. So that's just kind of my life. And if you're going somewhere fancy, you're going to do a whole thing.

• 14:52Dax Shepard?

  I'm envious of your relationship with May.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  Really?

• 14:55Dax Shepard?

  First of all, it's the sweetest relationship. It really is special.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  It really is. I still get a little thrill when she'll text me back because it's not a given. And she's a mom now and she's working and she's in Ireland.

• 15:09Dax Shepard?

  She's hard to pin down.

• 15:10Speaker 02

  She's hard to pin down. If I can get her, I'll panic text her to just get as much out as I can. I'm really working with this.

• 15:18Dax Shepard?

  You feel very boxed in right now. You're claustrophobic.

• 15:22Speaker 02

  But it is a really special relationship. I feel really thankful for it. It is really flattering.

• 15:28Dax Shepard?

  Yes, because she's a blessing on planet Earth. She is one of my absolute favorite people I've ever met. And my envy is that I've been trying to hang out with her for 10 years. I literally have not seen her socially since we interviewed her. That was it. And I text her and we'll have an exchange and I'll be like, we're gonna hang out. I want to meet her baby so bad. And then I bump into you and like, you'll have just seen her.

• 15:46Speaker 02

  It's not as much as you think.

• 15:48Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 15:48Speaker 02

  And it really is like a Christmas. And some of them have to do with bribing her.

• 15:54Dax Shepard?

  She needs lawn equipment or something.

• 15:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm trying to think the last time, you know, they're in New York now.

• 15:59Dax Shepard?

  I don't even know that.

• 16:01Speaker 02

  Carlos, her baby daddy, is on Broadway in Hattie Town, which I feel happy to plug because he's fantastic in it. Carlos Valdez.

• 16:08Dax Shepard?

  Never even met him.

• 16:09Speaker 02

  He's really great. And so they're in New York for the next while.

• 16:14Speaker 01

  With the little baby?

• 16:15Speaker 02

  And then she got this job in Ireland. So she's in Ireland with the baby.

• 16:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 16:19Speaker 01

  That's a lot.

• 16:19Dax Shepard?

  Wow, wow, wow.

• 16:20Speaker 02

  It's a lot.

• 16:20Speaker 01

  Your relationship, does it mimic the show or is it more equal friends?

• 16:25Speaker 02

  It's more like equal friends, which is insane because she's young, but she's like an old soul.

• 16:30Dax Shepard?

  To put that in context, she's been on a set since she was a baby. She's been around adults, so she's the only person that I know that's that much younger than me that any reference I make, she gets.

• 16:39Speaker 02

  Yes, that mimics a person your own age. And also, this was sort of our concept too, when we tried to do a podcast is we've been in show business the same amount of time.

• 16:48Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 16:49Speaker 02

  She's wise. There are certain things that I would go to her about because she's one of those people like you are, and I assume like you are, who has a very definite opinion, which I'll really weigh a lot. I'll be like, I don't know. I don't want to hurt. I get kind of Pisces-ish about it.

• 17:05Speaker 01

  People-pleasy?

• 17:06Speaker 02

  And she'll be like, absolutely not. No, you can't do that. And I'll be like, right, right, no.

• 17:10Speaker 01

  Like, I know.

• 17:10Dax Shepard?

  Well, look at her on the show. She's wearing enormous clown glasses. No one else is allowed to do anything. And the third youngest person on the cast is wearing like enormous cartoon glasses.

• 17:18Speaker 01

  She knows herself.

• 17:19Dax Shepard?

  And she can put a boundary out. She advocates for herself too.

• 17:23Speaker 02

  Early on in the show, they had us go on some reality show. What was it?

• 17:28Dax Shepard?

  The Voice. I think it was The Voice. We had to stand in a weird spot. They cut to us for half a second.

• 17:33Speaker 02

  It was just me and May. It was a DreamWorks related thing.

• 17:38Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 17:39Speaker 02

  And I feel like Howie Mandel was on it. Is that?

• 17:41Dax Shepard?

  That's not America's Got Talent.

• 17:43Speaker 01

  Or one of the game shows. He did a game show.

• 17:46Speaker 02

  It was just like a little cut to us and she had these giant glasses on.

• 17:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 17:51Speaker 02

  And I remember being like, hey, are you sure about the glasses? Cause they weren't glasses she needed. It was just like a fashion moment and she wore them and everyone was kinda like, hey. And even after her dad texted her, grandma's concerned about the glasses.

• 18:06Dax Shepard?

  The one she wore on Parenthood begged the question, has she gotten a job cooking at Benihana? And that's like part of her character, like Cookie.

• 18:13Speaker 02

  Who's Cookie?

• 18:15Dax Shepard?

  If we were in Turks and Caicos seven years ago, there was a Benihana.

• 18:19Speaker 01

  Style.

• 18:19Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 18:20Dax Shepard?

  It wasn't an actual Benihana?

• 18:21Speaker 01

  I don't think it wasn't. We don't wanna take away from the Benihana name.

• 18:25Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:25Dax Shepard?

  And one of the cooks' name was Cookie and he had glasses on that were like literally two and a half feet wide.

• 18:31Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 18:32Dax Shepard?

  And covered his whole face. I think for most tourists, they loved Cookie, but it was like watching a mime the whole time. Like I had to leave.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  No, the kids were crying and so Kristen took them out and so it was just us two sitting at this big table with Cookie and Dax panicked. He's like, I can't handle Cookie right now.

• 18:48Dax Shepard?

  Play along with Cookie's routine. I didn't know how to give him what he.

• 18:52Speaker 02

  It's a lot to ask of the audience.

• 18:53Dax Shepard?

  It was so stressful.

• 18:54Speaker 02

  He did the thing where he like flips the egg into the hat.

• 18:56Dax Shepard?

  That's great. Do that. Put these enormous glasses.

• 18:59Speaker 01

  Poor Cookie.

• 19:00Dax Shepard?

  We saw him, didn't we? He was in a commercial for the place or so. Anyways, he's doing great. Cookie's doing great. But the thing I'll add that maybe you can't see or would sound arrogant to say is you guys are definitely girlfriends. That's for sure. But she admires you so deeply. She like really has looked up to you since the day you guys met. She has like what me and Tom Hanson have. Me and Tom Hanson are best friends, but also he's my dad. He's the dad I wanted. I think there's a lot of that happening.

• 19:28Speaker 02

  It's so healing when you have that. And I have had this in a couple very rare instances. There's something in the vast enough age difference that is not a family member that can. Mimic what you wish you had.

• 19:45Dax Shepard?

  It's like a nurturing relationship, which all friendships aren't necessarily nurturing by nature. More than just, oh, I'm in a bad mood. Give me advice about my girlfriend or boyfriend. This is more like, hey, anytime you need anyone to take care of you, I'd love to be that person. When you have that instinct towards somebody, it's very sweet and special.

• 20:02Speaker 02

  It is sweet and special, but I am not her actual mom. I don't have a responsibility there, except to my love.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 20:09Dax Shepard?

  You don't have to model some great behavior. You just have to be available.

• 20:14Speaker 01

  It's the best version of a familial relationship. It doesn't have all the baggage around it. It's like the purest. I've never thought of it like that. That's really true.

• 20:21Speaker 02

  I don't think I have either, but I also have that to some degree.

• 20:24Dax Shepard?

  You have it with your sister.

• 20:25Speaker 02

  Oh, I have a great relationship with my half siblings and the sister. We had the same mom. That loss is very bonding. She was a senior in college and graduated and then came to live with me. And that is very unique. But I was gonna say with my TV mom, Kelly Bishop, I also have one of those, you know, and especially not having my mom here, but I can still have a martini with Kelly and there's no pressure there for her or for me, really.

• 20:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but you're kind of getting that motherly feeling, right?

• 20:55Speaker 02

  It just would be hilarious. I mean, Kelly is such a, gosh, I've never thought about if they are similar at all. My mom was just such a unique, sensitive, very creative.

• 21:08Dax Shepard?

  A little naive, you said last time. A little trusting.

• 21:11Speaker 02

  Mm hmm. And Kelly's so like balls to the wall, you know?

• 21:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:15Speaker 02

  And she has her vulnerability, obviously.

• 21:17Dax Shepard?

  This runs the risk of sounding like women shouldn't be in the workplace. So I'm gonna acknowledge that. But I will observe in my own wife, tons on her shoulders. She's the boss of the set she's on, as are you. And there is one costume designer who she really wants on every job because that woman feels so maternal to her. And she will often just hug her throughout the day. And she said, I'll often just cry, but it's not sad cry. It's just, I feel so safe in this particular person's arms. And I like that throughout the day because there's a lot on her shoulders. And there's this whole acting the way you have to act in that role as a woman. I don't know. I just think it might be a bit more complicated.

• 21:59Speaker 02

  Then.

• 22:00Dax Shepard?

  When you're the boss.

• 22:01Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 22:02Dax Shepard?

  And you're a woman in this job. I think you need a soft place to land.

• 22:07Speaker 02

  For sure.

• 22:08Dax Shepard?

  I guess is what I'm saying.

• 22:09Speaker 02

  It was interesting doing this show I just did. It was a lot of things I hadn't done because there was no lead, lead of parenthood. We all had our strengths and moments. It wasn't the pressure on one person. It's just something has switched and I guess it's age appropriate. But I am still surprised to be the person people are looking to.

• 22:31Dax Shepard?

  They're looking to you to set the tone and vibe of this whole experience.

• 22:35Speaker 02

  And they care about my opinion, which I'm still like, really? I don't even know what I'm doing. And they're asking my opinion. This is a show where there's a lot of young people. And for many of them, it was their first or second experience.

• 22:49Dax Shepard?

  Yes, I watched it and no insult to anyone. They were all fresh faces for me. I'm also 50.

• 22:55Speaker 02

  I missed your birthday thing. I wasn't here.

• 22:57Dax Shepard?

  We canceled it.

• 22:58Speaker 02

  Oh, really?

• 22:58Dax Shepard?

  Because you weren't here.

• 23:00Speaker 02

  I wish that was true.

• 23:01Dax Shepard?

  You ruined my 50. I was gonna tell you after the interview. I was like, well, she's not coming then. Why the fuck are we doing this?

• 23:08Speaker 02

  But yeah, that was still surprising and it was fantastic. I had a director, producer who I knew, and that ended up being this huge, big piece of it. And I didn't realize until we were in it. I was like, thank God I worked with him. I know this guy. My boss is an incredible writer and really a great boss, much younger. It's like her second or third show. And so there was a lot of people asking my opinion and it can be lonely.

• 23:35Dax Shepard?

  Can I guess that you have to be the grown up? Like, we could be on set together. If you and I had a scene together, we could complain about the director. There was a whole strata above us and we could be little misfits who are bonded in this.

• 23:46Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 23:46Dax Shepard?

  But you can't take that role now. You can't shit on anyone. You can't complain.

• 23:50Speaker 02

  No, and even I had some day when one of the cast had a complaint about something. I was like, oh, I know it's bad or something. And you could see them perk up.

• 23:59Dax Shepard?

  They feel validated.

• 24:00Speaker 02

  Validated, but I was like, ooh. I can't really be doing that.

• 24:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, because your opinion means.

• 24:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, because then they go say, you know, Lauren, but so that was a surprising place to be. And it's like the thing I'm talking about, I'm always a little bit behind. I don't think it's bad because the people who have a very strong sense of their place and kind of who they are, that can go in the wrong direction. Or there's too much sense of importance, but it's a place you tend to have earned. And I need to be comfortable in those shoes. I always remember in Tina Fey's book, when she's talking about 30 Rock, she's comfortable as a writer, she'd been a performer, she hadn't been the lead of a TV show opposite Alec Baldwin. And she said, I realized at a certain point, I had to stop apologizing within my performance. Which is just a phrase I think about.

• 24:46Speaker 02

  I had a sense of, I don't want to be like, yeah, I'm the boss, but I mean, and sort of apologize.

• 24:51Dax Shepard?

  That's a very gendered thing.

• 24:52Speaker 01

  Well, yes, right.

• 24:53Dax Shepard?

  We'll have these brilliant fucking experts on there, professors, and they would say this astounding thing that their data just backed up and they go, or you know, that's at least what we found. It's like, oh, you didn't even need to say it at that point. You don't, you have the data. It's really baked in.

• 25:07Speaker 02

  And still being apologetic as women more than men.

• 25:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like adding a little escape for you to not feel so threatened that I just knew more than you.

• 25:15Speaker 01

  Staying likeable is a thing that women carry that men do not.

• 25:19Speaker 02

  Do they not, though?

• 25:20Dax Shepard?

  We do, I just think it's different.

• 25:22Speaker 01

  Well, being likeable for a man is that, is exuding confidence.

• 25:27Dax Shepard?

  It's true.

• 25:27Speaker 01

  They're not trying to balance being dominant and being submissive all at once.

• 25:32Speaker 02

  Right. This experience was positive. I balanced it pretty well. And then I watched this little thing on Instagram, maybe you guys have heard of it.

• 25:42Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, tell us.

• 25:43Dax Shepard?

  We just got on.

• 25:45Speaker 01

  I'm trying to get off of it, honestly.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  I know, I know. That actually was May. May was like, I think you've waited so long that the cooler move is to not do it at all. But I just felt pressured.

• 25:56Dax Shepard?

  You gotta got to, if you're realistic.

• 25:58Speaker 02

  Somebody said to me, you think you're not on social media, but you are, you're just not speaking for yourself. Others are, as Skimmer Girls in particular, just continues to have this presence.

• 26:08Dax Shepard?

  And let them come here directly from you. And also, you're an author. The authors we have in, they're on press tours actors could never even comprehend. You're killing yourself to get people to read a book. So if you have the opportunity to put that in front of millions of people's eyes, it'd be insane not to. But this is a pattern of yours.

• 26:25Speaker 02

  Uh oh.

• 26:26Speaker 01

  Ooh, we love patterns. Remember trauma earlier?

• 26:30Dax Shepard?

  First of all, I loved the Gilmore Super Bowl commercial. But I did remember, we would talk about doing commercials while we were shooting Parenthood. And you were just like, I just can't wrap my head around. You were so curious why Kristen and I kind of were just like, oh, fuck yeah, we'll go, we'll go sell some phones.

• 26:43Speaker 02

  This is a great example, which is my agent has been saying to me for a very long time, it doesn't now ding what you're trying to do as an actor or a writer. The best one is, I got this offer, when this stuff was still kind of early, sometimes when I don't know if I should do something, I'm like, what would so and so do? And I was like, this person would a thousand percent not do it. And I passed on it and that person ended up doing it.

• 27:06Dax Shepard?

  What? You chored up your decision with.

• 27:10Speaker 02

  And I was like, wait, what?

• 27:12Speaker 01

  That was the universe giving you a gift.

• 27:13Speaker 02

  That's maybe so. I feel differently about it now. And I felt differently also, the whole way it was approached was very respectful and I thought would be fun for people. Because that's the thing I think about, especially with Gilmore Girls fans, is this good for them?

• 27:27Dax Shepard?

  You just have to treat it exactly as you would treat a TV show you were offered. Which is like, is this good? Will this be fun to watch for 30 seconds?

• 27:34Speaker 02

  One of the things I, long ago, may have been concerned about is the separation between character and person. I wanted to be able to play different characters and ultimately in TV, you end up using so much of yourself. That separation isn't that broad unless you're on Downton Abbey or something. And even then, but yeah, I had a different kind of sense of preciousness.

• 27:55Dax Shepard?

  Well, when I was re-listening to the episode from seven years ago today, you were talking about this intense pressure you put on yourself out of college. And you had started early, yet now you were behind. And this terrible fear of making the wrong choice and fucking up, which was really present in your early life. And I think also the part of it is just, you know how hard it is to get here. You know how hard it is to end up on Gilmore Girls. Two dozen people have a show like that for the rest of their life. And so you. Are terrified you'll make the wrong decision and fuck it up and you'll make it go away because you went into this other thing. It's like, this is very consistent.

• 28:34Speaker 02

  I think I have it less so now.

• 28:36Speaker 01

  You started to say you saw something on Instagram that we got really derailed.

• 28:39Speaker 02

  I think it was gonna be positive, but I don't remember.

• 28:43Dax Shepard?

  This is a funny story from Fallon. You did post a cute picture of you with the billboard for the Z-Suite behind you in Times Square. But I think people might not realize this funny aspect of those billboards.

• 28:55Speaker 02

  Did we have one for parenthood? I was so thrilled by this. I was like, this has never happened before, which is not true. We would have Gilmore Girls on the barroom where Warner Brothers is, like a billboard. And it kind of didn't occur to me because, once again, a little bit behind, that now they're video.

• 29:12Dax Shepard?

  They're not paper anymore.

• 29:13Speaker 02

  They're moving pictures.

• 29:14Dax Shepard?

  There's not a guy with a fucking roller.

• 29:16Speaker 02

  Which we still have on Sunset. You know, there's still like a painted billboard. So someone had sent me a photo of it. First of all, I walked there from downtown. I was so excited. I was just like a dork. And then I get there and that area is not an easy place to just stand and not be doing something.

• 29:34Dax Shepard?

  It looks a little suspicious.

• 29:36Speaker 02

  Yeah, for sure. Then I didn't realize that it's not just my billboard. It's ads for 55 others. It's like Harrison Ford has a movie coming out and somebody's dropping a hot single. And like, so I'm standing there and the first time I missed it, this is the other problem. It makes me so frustrated because I don't want to be the person who's like, I don't know how to do this new fangled.

• 29:57Dax Shepard?

  There's more than that too, because you and I, we have bonded over this before. You and I fucking hate getting our picture taken. I don't ever need to see my face as long as I live again. So just the notion that I've got to take my own picture of myself at a really bad angle with a terrible lens, we're not set up for success right out of the gates.

• 30:12Speaker 02

  No. There's no part of me that's like, yeah, loving life. Like, it's not something I'm proud of. That's just how it is. And so recently I went to apply for something and they were like, send a recent photo. I was like, I don't have one. Like, I just don't have one. I'll send the billboard. So I'm standing there, waiting, waiting, waiting, waiting, because I missed it once, waiting to cycle through all these things. And people are like, kind of looking at me, which is my second worst nightmare. And then there was a guy who stands there to take people's pictures in Times Square. And he was genuinely like, what, I got competition now? And then I found the good spot, but the good spot was me standing, but I'm filming behind myself.

• 30:51Dax Shepard?

  You gotta get that billboard and your face.

• 30:52Speaker 02

  Which is hard. You couldn't even tell it was me in the picture.

• 30:54Dax Shepard?

  Could've been me.

• 30:55Speaker 02

  It was freezing cold. It was tanned. It was freezing cold. I had like weird glasses on, like a hat.

• 30:59Dax Shepard?

  You look very cute.

• 31:00Speaker 02

  Thank you. Closer to me than you are now was a hot dog man.

• 31:03Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 31:03Speaker 02

  Who was also kind of looking at me, because as much as this is our world now, people are rightly like, what are you filming, lady? Like, I'm making a hot dog. What more do you need to know?

• 31:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it looks like you're pointing the camera at him.

• 31:14Speaker 02

  Yes. Yes.

• 31:15Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 31:15Speaker 02

  And so he, after a while, was kind of like, can I help you? You know, and I was like, I am so sorry. I am just tear- I felt so stupid. Anyway, this is my billboard. It was harrowing, but I got it.

• 31:28Speaker 01

  Oh, that's funny.

• 31:29Dax Shepard?

  But you said it took you 30 minutes.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  I think this is a sign of personal growth. I walked away, I was like, I saw it, it's fine. And then I stopped halfway down the block and I was like, Laura Graham, you walked up here through Times Square and this is a moment.

• 31:41Dax Shepard?

  Just do it.

• 31:42Speaker 02

  There's so many things I don't do because I'm too embarrassed.

• 31:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 31:45Speaker 02

  And so I was like, fuck, I'm gonna do it.

• 31:46Speaker 01

  Where did that come from?

• 31:48Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 31:49Speaker 01

  Some people are embarrassed.

• 31:50Speaker 02

  Really?

• 31:51Speaker 01

  I find it odd, too.

• 31:52Dax Shepard?

  We have one daughter, Delta, who doesn't have an ounce of self-consciousness in her.

• 31:57Speaker 02

  Good job.

• 31:58Dax Shepard?

  And what a thing to observe.

• 31:59Speaker 02

  What a thing.

• 31:59Dax Shepard?

  Your life can be so fun.

• 32:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 32:02Dax Shepard?

  I can't believe it. I mean, it's her mom.

• 32:03Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 32:04Dax Shepard?

  Kristen largely is quite unself-conscious. And what a fucking gift.

• 32:08Speaker 02

  That's the better question.

• 32:09Dax Shepard?

  We can't train her to do that. She just came out like Kristen.

• 32:12Speaker 01

  But modeling, she grew up seeing her. And I feel like, and you're interesting with embarrassment. You get embarrassed, but you also like getting embarrassed.

• 32:19Dax Shepard?

  That's my way of taking the power back, because I do get very self-conscious and very embarrassed. But I'm so stubborn. I refuse to let that be a defeat, so I have to. But now I genuinely do. Michael, I'll tell you, we were at the movies and I was carrying the biggest, like a comical... If you were directing this scene, you'd go, the popcorn's too big. They don't make them that big, right? I don't know how starving I was at that point, or I thought you and Jess were gonna take a lot of it. But I had a gallon of popcorn and I had sincerely a hundred ounce Diet Coke.

• 32:47Speaker 02

  Right.

• 32:47Dax Shepard?

  And then some Milk Duds or something. And we're walking and I slip as if there were a banana peel on the steps.

• 32:52Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh.

• 32:53Dax Shepard?

  And I go completely... Up in the air and land on my back and the fucking popcorn got thrown up in the air. It was cartoonish. And even before I land, I'm laughing so hard that I know I'm also gonna almost pee my pants. So like, once I land, I'm now pinching my penis because I'm afraid I'm gonna pee my pants.

• 33:10Speaker 02

  Were you literally pinching it?

• 33:11Dax Shepard?

  Yes, because I know to do that, if it's gonna be bad, I just put some pressure on that.

• 33:15Speaker 02

  So the embarrassing part was the popcorn?

• 33:17Dax Shepard?

  Yes. I'm very proud of the-

• 33:19Speaker 02

  There you are, a grown man.

• 33:21Dax Shepard?

  No, that's a guy who knows how to handle his business.

• 33:24Speaker 02

  True.

• 33:26Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

• 33:32Dax Shepard?

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• 33:58Speaker 04

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• 34:40Speaker 04

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• 34:55Dax Shepard?

  We get support from No Bull. The holidays can get hectic. You finally hit a post-summer routine and suddenly you're- On hosting duty every week.

• 35:05Speaker 01

  That's when you really need to ground yourself.

• 35:07Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. And that's why I keep my training routine through the holidays. It's the whole no bull idea. There's a no bullshit training brand built around consistency, honesty, and just putting in the work. It's not about adding more pressure to an already packed schedule. It's about having the gear and the habits to move through the season your way. My personal favorite, all three of the shoes are fantastic. The Outwork, the Outwork Flex and the Drive 2. I like the Drive 2 because it's a hybrid and I lift, of course, but I also like to do what's called box jumps. Right? I do a lot of jumping onto a little platform and I want a little more flexibility. And boy, do they deliver.

• 35:44Speaker 01

  And if you're a cardio person and you're running and you also need to be lifting.

• 35:49Dax Shepard?

  And the style is banging. I don't know what to say. Beautiful style, very breathable, very, very comfortable, lots of support. They were built for lifting.

• 35:57Speaker 01

  They also make a great holiday gift. You know, I love gifting. A purposeful one that actually supports someone's goals and routines. And it's not a gift that just ends up in the back of the closet.

• 36:06Dax Shepard?

  Stay stronger than the season. Head to nobolproject.com all holiday season to shop new deals every week. This episode is brought to you by Dell. Gifts mean more when they have the power to give more. They can inspire more discovery, give more confidence and unwrap more of who you are. This Black Friday, give a gift that goes beyond the box. The Dell XPS 13 laptop with a beautiful design and cutting edge performance. It helps you unlock more possibilities. It's the thinnest, lightest XPS laptop yet with touchscreen, a backlit keyboard and long lasting battery life to power you through your day. Built with a durable aluminum chassis, weighing just 2.2 pounds and Intel Core processors.

• 36:50Dax Shepard?

  It's fast, reliable and portable enough to keep up wherever you go. Visit dell.com to explore the possibilities of XPS. While shopping, you'll also find great perks like Dell Rewards. Fast free shipping, premium support and financing with flexible payment options. Plus you can find great deals on monitors and accessories. That means you can score a whole new setup now for less. This Black Friday sale is one you don't want to miss. Head to dell.com/deals. That's dell.com/deals.

• 37:25Dax Shepard?

  We get support from Superhuman. Look, I love what I do. The conversations, the ideas, the creative stuff. But there's this whole other layer of work that eats my day alive. The inbox that never ends, docs I need to get through, threads I'm behind on. And by the time I've dealt with all that, the stuff I actually want to focus on gets whatever's left. What I needed was something that just works where I'm already working. Not another tab to open, not another thing to set up. Superhuman Go, from the makers of Grammarly, is different. It's already right there, inside your email, your docs, your browser. You don't go to it. It's already working alongside you. You're deep in a long thread, highlight it, and it pulls the key points. About to send something important? It flags what doesn't add up before it leaves your hands.

• 38:10Dax Shepard?

  It knows your style, your workflows, and it just backs you up without getting in the way. A thought partner that's already up to speed, at your service, not after your job. So do yourself a favor and try Superhuman Go. From the makers of Grammarly. Find out more at superhuman.com.

• 38:35Speaker 02

  I don't think I've ever seen you be embarrassed because you have that way about you. And especially in this role, you're in charge. You know how to put the other person at ease and also be like, thank you so much, goodbye. You're the host of this moment of somebody coming up to you.

• 38:53Dax Shepard?

  And again, no, I'm just saying, I think that's a control thing. I think I was very self-conscious as a kid. And then I just at some point was like, we're gonna have to approach this differently. Because I mean, I'm just highly self-conscious, as is my other daughter, who's very much like me. They're in the same house with the same instruction. It's pretty wild.

• 39:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 39:10Dax Shepard?

  One question I didn't ask you last time is, how well do you think you could do on the SAT today? Our friend Lauren was a SAT tutor for the Princeton, like a good one.

• 39:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:22Dax Shepard?

  Princeton Review.

• 39:23Speaker 02

  That was a little bit of a racket, I have to say, in that my SATs were fine. I don't remember what they were.

• 39:29Dax Shepard?

  Like 1500 ish?

• 39:30Speaker 01

  That's really good.

• 39:31Dax Shepard?

  What are they out of? 16?

• 39:33Speaker 01

  1600 back then.

• 39:34Dax Shepard?

  Anything above 13 is pretty good?

• 39:35Speaker 01

  I think so.

• 39:36Dax Shepard?

  I don't even know.

• 39:37Speaker 02

  It was 13.

• 39:37Dax Shepard?

  I bet you were in the 15s.

• 39:39Speaker 02

  I don't think so, because I remember there was an expectation that I would score higher.

• 39:44Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 39:44Speaker 02

  That some teacher was like, "I'm surprised you didn't do better." That's always great, but I was a tutor in some capacity. I scored well enough on the test you had to take to teach the test, kind of thing, which was probably a sort of an SAT, and then you learn the test. And that made me a teacher of other tests I'd never taken. So it was a good gig. Having that gig just led to more teaching of tests.

• 40:08Dax Shepard?

  My two questions are, one, you would have had to inadvertently pick up the whole test at some point.

• 40:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:14Dax Shepard?

  Like I'm saying, if you would have taken it at the end of that job, you probably would have gotten a pretty outstanding score.

• 40:19Speaker 02

  Well, I don't know what the test is now. I think there's more free form writing, which there should be, because otherwise what you learn in learning how to teach that test is how to take a multiple choice test, which is how many you should eliminate. It's not really learning vocabulary or math or anything.

• 40:36Dax Shepard?

  It's like a tactical approach.

• 40:37Speaker 02

  And I'm not sure it would still work, but I think the way you have a good vocabulary is reading, writing, and I still read and write a lot, and I play every single New York Times game that is on the phone. Is that doing anything for me? I don't know.

• 40:50Dax Shepard?

  I think so. Connections is our obsession.

• 40:52Speaker 02

  Every single one. There's one that's called, I forget, but it's...

• 40:55Speaker 01

  Strands.

• 40:56Speaker 02

  Is Strands the one where you're doing the word?

• 40:58Speaker 01

  It's like a word search, but you can go all over the place.

• 41:01Speaker 02

  That's new, but there's the one where you have to do words.

• 41:04Dax Shepard?

  Letterboxd?

• 41:05Speaker 02

  Letterboxd, thank you.

• 41:06Dax Shepard?

  Thanks, Wabba.

• 41:07Speaker 02

  Letterbox. Letterbox is, I find, a good challenge because you have to use up all the letters within a certain number of words. Oh. You can repeat.

• 41:17Dax Shepard?

  That's a good one.

• 41:18Speaker 02

  You're sort of strategically like, how am I gonna work the queue in? Oh, interesting.

• 41:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 41:23Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 41:23Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so when you were doing that job, this is a very weird comparison, but I think of Epstein, right? He was like a teacher at a private school. He was lying about his credentials and teaching at a private school. And he wooed this man, whose kid he was teaching, who was a big investment banker, and ended up getting a job with that guy through having met through the kid. So, I went to your SAT thing and I was like, did you interact with all these privileged kids? And did the dads come and make moves on you? What was happening?

• 41:54Speaker 02

  No. At this time, I'm 22 or 3, so I'm still a little closer to the 18-year-olds.

• 42:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 42:03Speaker 02

  I remember, not in any kind of way, but I remember having a student where I was like, I would go out with this guy.

• 42:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 42:12Speaker 02

  But the thing I noticed the most.

• 42:14Dax Shepard?

  I would go out with this guy.

• 42:16Speaker 02

  Later, later. But I also led bike tours a couple of summers. And in those jobs, you don't really see the parents. This is more the thing where they're like, you guys good? Okay, bye. So the interaction with the parents was pretty low, I have to say.

• 42:30Dax Shepard?

  But the SAT tutor, you would do it in their homes?

• 42:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. I had more success as a waitress. Hmm, sure. Dated bartender.

• 42:37Dax Shepard?

  That's your weird fun dichotomy as a human, I think.

• 42:40Speaker 02

  That I'll date the bartender.

• 42:41Dax Shepard?

  Yes, because you have a healthy dose of anxiety and overthinking things. But there's also a side of you that understands restaurant culture and can get down.

• 42:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I think if I didn't have the other one, I'd be unbearable. I'm fun. I'm a good hang.

• 42:55Dax Shepard?

  You can party.

• 42:56Speaker 02

  And a restaurant is like a pretty good hang. But the other person who always asks, did people hit on me, is Ray Romano. Because among my many waitressing jobs, I was a cocktail waitress at the Improv in New York City, right out of college.

• 43:08Dax Shepard?

  You're beautiful, but you're... Hold on, don't fucking do this.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 43:13Dax Shepard?

  You were a fucking smoke show when you were younger. I've seen a lot of these pictures of... Of you recently.

• 43:18Speaker 02

  Dax.

• 43:18Dax Shepard?

  Super curly hair.

• 43:20Speaker 02

  I did not identify that way.

• 43:22Dax Shepard?

  But you were, you just missed it.

• 43:23Speaker 02

  Thank you. I also think I maybe gave off, first of all, I'm doing these jobs, these jobs are really hard. I just want to go home and go to sleep. I was always a person who had a long-term boyfriend or no thing. I was not like a dater, but the other person who always says, did I hit on you? Was Ray Romano at the comedy club.

• 43:38Dax Shepard?

  He wonders if he himself hit on you.

• 43:40Speaker 02

  He can't remember.

• 43:43Speaker 02

  He assumes he did. And he did not.

• 43:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's kind of an insult.

• 43:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And he's asked me more than once. I'm like, Ray, if I tell you one more time.

• 43:54Dax Shepard?

  What I hear is he really regrets not hitting on you.

• 43:57Speaker 02

  I'll take it. He's the best. But I do have a thing for, you know, comics are just real tough. But I love them so much.

• 44:05Speaker 01

  Well, they're challenging, which is a good thing and a bad thing.

• 44:08Speaker 02

  It's a rough life, but anyways, really fun. It's brutal.

• 44:11Dax Shepard?

  It's a mean, brutal world.

• 44:13Speaker 02

  And I can't imagine it now for people. My godson Clyde's buddy, they're 23, he's moving to New York. His dad is a successful screenwriter and he knows the business and he's going to New York to try his hand at stand-up.

• 44:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I applaud it.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  I remember from the club, people would sit in the back. They were supportive, I guess, but also there's that thing of like, maybe they'll die and then I won't die. You know, it's a real more cutthroaty thing. There's been obviously all this stuff around the Saturday Night Live 50th. I can't get enough. I've read every book. I have watched everything to do with it, but for my money, there was not enough time spent on people's auditions. And there's a whole series about it, but there's a thing where bill haters in the elevator and one of them had props and the other one didn't have props. It was like Andy Samberg and him and they're being like, shoot, I should have brought props. The other one being like, I shouldn't have props. That thing of like, how do you start these careers is so fascinating to me.

• 45:06Speaker 01

  When you say you didn't identify as the smoke show that Dax identified you as, then were you like, my quote, worth is in humor, is in being smart, those things?

• 45:16Dax Shepard?

  She skipped a grade.

• 45:18Speaker 02

  I skipped grade when I was little and I was one of the only kids in school whose mom was not around. So I think those two things were weird at the time. It teaches you to read a room and We all have a version of what our sensitivity is to reading the room. I think May has a really developed reading the room from being in a lot of rooms with a lot of older people and having a sense for your own success and protection of how am I going to get through this?

• 45:41Speaker 01

  How to survive it?

• 45:42Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so I think that maybe put me on a little bit of a back foot, being younger than everybody. And I could read to the degree that they skipped me out of kindergarten. Somehow I didn't borrow from that. This is a privilege and a really cool thing. I was always sort of trying to lay low. My dad remarried. I wasn't without women. Great aunts and friends and babysitters even who were fantastic, but it's not like having a mom in the house.

• 46:06Dax Shepard?

  Who you're staring at your whole childhood going, right, oh, and you put on makeup that way and you do this.

• 46:10Speaker 02

  Any of that.

• 46:11Dax Shepard?

  Oh, and she said hi to dad that way and he kind of blushed.

• 46:13Speaker 02

  And it's really driven home right now because my one sister has three kids, but my other sister has one who is a four and a half year old now, which is the age my mom sort of started to go. They live in Manhattan and I see them a lot. So I'm seeing this age.

• 46:32Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 46:32Speaker 02

  And this experience is not as present for me as it was, but clinically I can look at it, especially knowing this child as I do and see what that age is. I never really saw it.

• 46:42Dax Shepard?

  Imagine her now without her mom.

• 46:44Speaker 02

  Cannot imagine.

• 46:45Dax Shepard?

  I had the same story about my dad. I'm like, oh, I didn't ever have one, so I didn't pine for it. I didn't miss him because I didn't have it, but bullshit.

• 46:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, but my father did an incredible job. There was lots of family around. I had lots of cousins. Having this unconventional for that time, now it's less unusual.

• 47:01Dax Shepard?

  You were certainly the only kid in your whole high school being raised by their dad.

• 47:05Speaker 02

  By the high school, he was remarried. I was the only kid in elementary school who did not have a mom in the picture. And they were curious about it. The teachers would be like, who does your hair? Because it was still a more traditional time. It would always be a thing if there was a show and costumes needed to be sewn. And my dad would ask his secretary, you know, like stuff like that.

• 47:24Speaker 01

  Wait, I'm sorry. Did she?

• 47:25Dax Shepard?

  She went to England.

• 47:26Speaker 01

  She left. Okay.

• 47:27Dax Shepard?

  Pursuing a singing career at the time.

• 47:30Speaker 02

  She was pursuing all kinds of things. And I think they were so young. I don't know that she had an idea of what it was going to be.

• 47:36Dax Shepard?

  You're incredibly. Fair in the first interview to her and your dad. They were both very, very young. They got married and the dad took off to Vietnam for two years to be an interpreter. And they were in Japan.

• 47:47Speaker 02

  Well, who he worked for was USAID, which is recently in the news for being somewhat dismantled.

• 47:53Dax Shepard?

  When I read that this morning, I was thinking, wow, yeah, you actually have a connection to that.

• 47:57Speaker 01

  Sorry, I got confused because we had talked at the beginning about her passing.

• 48:01Dax Shepard?

  She also died when she was sixty one.

• 48:05Speaker 02

  But then she got ill in her 50s.

• 48:08Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 48:09Speaker 02

  It was a pretty stressful path, but I would go to England to visit her. And then meanwhile, my father had my sister and my brother and a much more nuclear and traditional and very warm family. I had all the experiences in a way. I don't want to say that I had no confidence. I did and do. And also I think I didn't identify in high school. There were the girls who were the sanctioned hot girls. It didn't feel like a lack or anything and like I had a high school boyfriend. Not that that's the gauge, but I mean, it was a little bit. Do you feel like guys are into you? And I will say my mom, people would stop on the street. She both was beautiful, but also she really owned it. She dressed the part. She had a kind of swagger. I just was like, okay, that's not me. Like it wasn't a judgment even.

• 48:54Speaker 02

  It was just a different way of being and being in the world. And aging was difficult for her.

• 48:59Dax Shepard?

  I'm gonna stop psychoanalyzing you, but the one thing I'll add is I think whatever parent takes you, you'll have a loyalty to that parent that you have to. This just occurred to me interviewing Josh Brolin. Just think of the notion that you recognize these adults can split. If you just acknowledge that's a reality, one of your parents can bail. Presumably the other one could, I don't know. So you have this really deep loyalty. And so for me, I was like, I'm like my mom. I'm not like that guy that abandoned her. Well, I'm very much like him. It's taken me my whole life to recognize, no, in fact, I'm kind of a carbon copy of him. But I was defining myself in opposition of him because he didn't have qualities I admired. He wasn't around. So I don't know, maybe subconsciously you also identified more with your dad and wanted to identify.

• 49:43Dax Shepard?

  And he was a cerebral, competent.

• 49:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, and funded a party. And it was not even that I didn't want to be what my mom was. It's just so mystifying. I would go visit and yes, she was in a band or she was in fashion and people really reacted to her. My sister carries herself like she's got such incredible sophistication and great fashion sense. And I'm in like a high top Reebok, you know, it just was different. So it wasn't even a loss, obviously not having her in my life is a loss. And when we talk about identity and how you both are given yours and crafted as well.

• 50:18Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 50:18Speaker 02

  I was like, I like being one of the guys. I really comfortable there and that came with being fun and funny.

• 50:25Dax Shepard?

  The party that you are, how was the Super Bowl?

• 50:27Speaker 02

  Really fun.

• 50:28Dax Shepard?

  I've gone twice to work there. It's a little overwhelming for me.

• 50:31Speaker 02

  Totally overwhelming. Are you kidding with all the stuff we just talked about?

• 50:36Dax Shepard?

  And then I was telling Monica, I don't ever worry about terrorism. I just started thinking like, well, this would be an ideal place and I'm here and why? I don't even care.

• 50:43Speaker 02

  I mean, especially now and Trump was there. So on the one hand, more security, on the other hand.

• 50:48Dax Shepard?

  Great target.

• 50:49Speaker 02

  Sure. I was with Joel McHale. We love each other. He makes everything fun, but this was the same group because I went to Fox up fronts this year because Tubi is a Fox subsidiary. At the Fox up fronts, it was me, Joel, Jon Hamm, a couple, maybe other TV shows. TV now is football.

• 51:06Speaker 01

  Oh, 100%.

• 51:07Speaker 02

  It was like 10 football players. And again, girls guy, I was really happy there. Everyone's like three feet taller than me. I was just like, I love being around a bunch of shocks. Yeah, I was like, anyway. But also Hamm is great. Will Arnett was there. I was very comfortable. So our box was Joel, Rob Lowe, Gordon Ramsay, who was lovely. That made it fun. And then you're just there with snacks and people stop by, but you don't really see the game from there. People were like, how was the halftime show? I was like, it was this big. So what an honor to go and be asked.

• 51:44Dax Shepard?

  Last thing I wanted to say before we get to your show. We both have read the Cher biography.

• 51:49Speaker 01

  It's so good.

• 51:50Dax Shepard?

  How fucking good is that biography?

• 51:52Speaker 02

  Even if you don't care about Cher, which I don't know how you can't, it's such a snapshot of a different time.

• 51:58Dax Shepard?

  Oh my god.

• 51:58Speaker 02

  Of a different Hollywood, of a different Los Angeles.

• 52:00Dax Shepard?

  There was a strength to her version of her story that I thought, well, if you get to choose, that's the way to do it.

• 52:07Speaker 02

  It helped that she was wildly talented and to a certain degree, nobody was gonna mess with her.

• 52:12Dax Shepard?

  She did get her own leverage and broke free, so you're right. Since she landed on top, it's probably easier for her to see it that way.

• 52:18Speaker 02

  And I think as we do, she's replicating or finding familiar what was already going on in her life and her childhood, which was not a huge amount of stability. And my own version, I was out on my bicycle, I had a paper route at like 12. We didn't know the things we should be worried about as much as we know today. There's so much to worry about now and so many ways to worry and so much access to things to worry about. And it just was a different time. I even think when I first came here in 96 or 97, I had a little bit of money in the bank, I had done some commercials, which I wasn't too, you know.

• 52:52Dax Shepard?

  I almost wondered if the reason you didn't want to go back to them is like it represented something.

• 52:56Speaker 02

  No, I had a blast, but I'm doing commercials as like, you guys should try Liquid Death or whatever. Which, why is it called that?

• 53:03Speaker 01

  That's not a good commercial when you question the name.

• 53:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I don't think maybe there's a reason.

• 53:10Speaker 02

  Liquid Death, what could be more refreshing?

• 53:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:14Speaker 02

  No, I loved doing them, I made money. And also, even when we did that Walmart thing, there are a couple of skills I have that do not help me in any other realm except in the realm to which they belong. Like, if you tell me that something was 32 seconds and you need it to be 30 seconds, I can pretty much do that.

• 53:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:33Dax Shepard?

  You know, Monica's done more commercials than both of us combined. She's been in a hundred, because she's the most successful commercial actress I've ever met in my life. She regularly had five nationals running at the same time.

• 53:43Speaker 02

  And what is the world of it now? Is it still good?

• 53:46Speaker 01

  I haven't done them in a long time, too. It was good money, but not.

• 53:50Dax Shepard?

  It wasn't as good.

• 53:51Speaker 01

  No, that was the promise. Like, you could get this one commercial and you could get $250,000 and that never happened. But it wasn't. Fun little time.

• 54:00Speaker 02

  As an actor starting out, it gave you a day. Here's my day. I'm going to this audition. I'm gonna run into so and so. I'm gonna have lunch at the diner.

• 54:08Dax Shepard?

  You have the illusion of being productive.

• 54:09Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 54:10Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Okay. One thing you have to say to Monica, cause she's, I don't wanna say the biggest.

• 54:14Speaker 01

  I see it on your paper and I'm so excited.

• 54:17Dax Shepard?

  You're already titillated, right? But you've met Taylor Swift.

• 54:20Speaker 02

  I have.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  Oh, tell us everything.

• 54:22Dax Shepard?

  I learned this, this is fun backstage. I was flying to Lisbon with Lincoln and we had not had the passport and then we got it. And then we had this five hour layover for the next flight. And then, God bless the universe, you and Sam Pancake are at the counter. So we got to spend a couple hours in a lounge together, which was the longest time we had spent together in a couple of years. I cherish that little layover. But that's where I learned this story.

• 54:43Speaker 01

  With Sam Pancake.

• 54:44Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he's the most lovely talent. It's her best friend who's a really funny actor.

• 54:49Speaker 01

  Oh, fun.

• 54:50Speaker 02

  He's fantastic. I had a book that had come out the year before, but then the paperback came out. We did a live event and then we got asked to do another one. And then we were like, hold on, maybe this is what we're doing now for a while. And so were we going to Scotland, I think? Yeah. And it just was traveling with my buddy. We kinda made it into a show and he was like the moderator. It was really fun.

• 55:09Speaker 01

  Cool.

• 55:09Speaker 02

  But that's where we ran into you guys. I was at a small party. I know some people who know, I didn't know she was gonna be there. I just was trying to be so cool or something, but she was lovely and she asked about Gilmore Girls. She said, did you know it was gonna be such a thing? I just walk in, I don't wanna lean on this. I'm growing and maturing. But I assume no one knows anything and no one has seen anything.

• 55:33Speaker 01

  Which is literally impossible.

• 55:34Dax Shepard?

  That's how I move through the world as well.

• 55:36Speaker 02

  I think it's just safer that way, but it's not a false humility. I just assume she's a very busy person.

• 55:41Dax Shepard?

  It's best to start there. You're super pleasantly surprised when it's the other thing.

• 55:45Speaker 02

  This was a couple of years ago too. It's even grown since then. She just was really lovely. I'm friends with Jenny Hahn, who is the showrunner of The Summer I Turned Pretty, among other things. And Taylor had given them a song to use. It was part of the show. And so I sort of said, you know, Jenny Hahn? And she knew what I was talking about. And then I just was like, anyway, so. You're much younger, but I'm very intimidated by you.

• 56:11Speaker 01

  Were you or no intimidated by her?

• 56:14Speaker 02

  It was more like I didn't want to bother her, but we're at a small party. She had friends there. It's a version that I'm really trying to get rid of, which I've had with some actresses I have admired and worked with Diane Keaton and Meryl Streep. Of that thing where I'm like, surely you have other things to do, but now sometimes I'm in that position and I'm like, not really.

• 56:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like you think you're being respectful, but you could also be being read as aloof and disinterested.

• 56:39Speaker 02

  Oh, God.

• 56:40Dax Shepard?

  They could walk away thinking she had zero interest in me. We worked together for two months. She didn't ask me a single question.

• 56:45Speaker 02

  Right.

• 56:45Dax Shepard?

  I was in Godfather. She could have inquired about that. So you want to know anything?

• 56:50Speaker 01

  Even if they know what's happening, that's still sad for them. Probably like no one feels that they can come talk to me for real.

• 56:56Speaker 02

  I had that with Candace Bergen, too, in that movie that I did with Joel. She couldn't have been nicer. And we ended up sitting next to each other. I've read all her books. I've seen everything she's ever been in and I don't know. It's just sad. This is the day that it doesn't exist anymore. I'm going to talk your era off.

• 57:12Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 57:13Speaker 02

  Beware the next person who works with me because, oh, this is what I was gonna say. I've remembered the Instagram thing.

• 57:18Dax Shepard?

  Yay.

• 57:19Speaker 02

  Which is Tubi did a thing where they interviewed, they don't love being called the kids on the show, but we've all called them the kids. Where they were like, what's it like to work with Lauren Graham, which again is just a premise I would not have thought of. They were all super great and nice, but a couple of them said she's really professional. And I was like, I think I wasn't fun enough because I am very professional and there was a lot to consider. And it's the first season of a show and I'm a producer and sort of thinking about lots of things all the time. But I wanted them to be like, she's a laugh riot.

• 57:47Dax Shepard?

  Yes. I have the thing. They say the best advice, if you have a stalker or someone obsessed with you is you can't say anything. Cause no matter what you say, even if you're like, get out of my life. I can't stand you. They can twist that. I have that skill with a positive. I'll make it a dig.

• 58:01Speaker 02

  Oh, so I didn't have enough blue on?

• 58:03Dax Shepard?

  Even you being professional. It's like.

• 58:04Speaker 01

  It's like, that's a great compliment.

• 58:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 58:07Dax Shepard?

  Okay. So the Z suite. First of all, what did you think the name was when your agent told you?

• 58:12Speaker 02

  Sam and I were on tour. I was in the lobby of a hotel. We've been working together for so. So long, he knows how to tell me something. So he was like, there's a show. He was saving. It's on a network you've never heard of. Very end. But I actually, just jumping ahead, did not and do not view that as a barrier to entry. Having been on the WB when it was quite new and it is part of what I do think I'm starting to understand about the world of media that we're in, which is you never know.

• 58:41Dax Shepard?

  So this is why I ask in a non insulting way, do not try to find something negative. Explain Tubi to me.

• 58:47Speaker 02

  It is its own streaming platform. It is free. It is more like television as we knew it. It comes on some televisions. It is an app you can get on your phone. If you sign up, it still doesn't cost any money, but then you can download, you can record, you can use it as we use our apps. It has a really friendly interface. There's live, there's movies and they are starting to do original content. And we were their first scripted comedy. They've been incredible to work with. They've been really collaborative. They're excited too, which you don't necessarily get with your established things.

• 59:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they're more flexible and open. But we didn't even get to the punchline. So when he calls you.

• 59:27Speaker 02

  He's giving me all the stuff and he's like, this is the character. It's called the disease suite. And I was like, wait, it's a hospital show? I was like, that is a terrible title. And we went through the rest of the conversation with me still thinking, he did not correct me because he didn't understand what I was saying. So I was like, it doesn't sound like a comedy to me. Wait, who has a disease? Like, we really had four part conversation about it. He's like, that's not what I'm saying. Z suite, which by the way, because I am so out of corporate America, I didn't know that Z suite is a play on C suite, which is your executive lounge. And of course this is Gen Z takes over.

• 1:00:03Dax Shepard?

  I have a whole issue with C suite because this is now ubiquitous that everyone knows what a C suite is. And I don't understand why it's called C.

• 1:00:12Speaker 02

  CEO, CFO, COO.

• 1:00:14Dax Shepard?

  Only the people with a C.

• 1:00:16Speaker 02

  The chiefs. The chiefs office.

• 1:00:18Dax Shepard?

  All the chiefs.

• 1:00:19Speaker 02

  The suite where all the fancy people are.

• 1:00:21Dax Shepard?

  Okay. What's your baseline about Generation Z? I think there's a bunch. Of stereotypes about them, but I am suspicious. They're not the numbers that we think.

• 1:00:32Speaker 02

  No, what the show asks is who's more ridiculous? The people who have taken this corporate culture really seriously? Or these people who are trying to have a better time, work from home, have kooky parties involving llamas? And what I like about the show is that it really doesn't take a side. I'm as ridiculous as the kids are ridiculous. And it's fun because it's not meant to advocate for anybody.

• 1:00:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, skewer both sides.

• 1:00:58Speaker 02

  Right, the thing I value more than anything. I will do the disease suite. But I've got to have a good day with people that I like and trust and believe in and laugh with. We had that and you just don't necessarily get that.

• 1:01:11Dax Shepard?

  In a very healthy way. Seven years ago, we already felt this way, which is you get to a certain point where for me it was like, I'm not going to be in a Marvel movie. And yours was, I'm not going to be Sandra Bullock. And then at that point, I think a very healthy transition happens where you go, okay, so I'm going to focus on process because I'm not really in the results game as much anymore. But the process now means everything to me. And I think it's a very healthy thing to prioritize that.

• 1:01:35Speaker 02

  To get to a place where I already got more than I thought I would. I feel so grateful. Oh, now I get to do this without the pressure. There's still pressure and I want the show to come back and I want people to like it.

• 1:01:48Dax Shepard?

  Without the neuroticism.

• 1:01:49Speaker 01

  You already did it. You proved yourself. You've been on multiple things that are incredible.

• 1:01:52Speaker 02

  The fact that things are still kind of out there, it's huge.

• 1:01:56Dax Shepard?

  That's the thing that very few people get, which is something that just keeps getting enjoyed for a long, long time. It seems almost impossible and that's really rare.

• 1:02:05Speaker 02

  You know, if only I had merch.

• 1:02:08Speaker 01

  Oh, I was thinking that when you guys were talking about parent hoodie stuff. Big mistake for them not to do a parent hoodie.

• 1:02:14Dax Shepard?

  There were 13 cast members and we bought the gift. You know, we would cumulatively chip in on whatever we were getting the crew. And the amount of emails that would go back and forth to decide whether we're getting this mug or this fucking.

• 1:02:27Speaker 02

  Why was that such a hard?

• 1:02:28Dax Shepard?

  Oh, it was impossible. What was the brand of sweatshirt we get that was kind of Terry cloth?

• 1:02:33Speaker 02

  Oh, not a North Face, but the other one.

• 1:02:35Dax Shepard?

  The other one. Yeah, Hattie goes like, are we gonna go Patagonia tall neck? Are we going all the way with the puffer vest version?

• 1:02:44Speaker 01

  I love that.

• 1:02:45Dax Shepard?

  I know I was making among the lowest of all the actors and I was kinda like, get him a mug, man.

• 1:02:49Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:02:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I didn't say it, but I was like, guys.

• 1:02:54Speaker 02

  We tried to prorate it, but then it was sort of like, then people, that's right. It's like, that's not fair.

• 1:02:59Dax Shepard?

  Maybe I've told you this, maybe I haven't, but every job I had ever had in my life prior to parenthood, I made a point to find out what everyone was making.

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  How?

• 1:03:06Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I'd always figure it out.

• 1:03:07Speaker 01

  You just asked.

• 1:03:08Dax Shepard?

  I just got either getting a conversation or I'd get it out of them or I back channel through an agent. I would figure it out. I went into parenthood going, I'm purposely gonna not find out. And I was so happy on the show. I was like, if I find out Jabbar's making twice as much as me, how can I enjoy going to work? But I enjoy so much going to work until I find out my son is making more than me.

• 1:03:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:03:30Dax Shepard?

  But that was the first time I ever broke that habit. Boy, was it a blessing. So your character, Monica.

• 1:03:36Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:03:37Dax Shepard?

  She insisted as a nod to you that be her character's name. It was originally named Gail and you were.

• 1:03:43Speaker 01

  Like, that's not gonna work.

• 1:03:44Speaker 02

  We did fuss with the last name. I had various last names, cause you know, clearance.

• 1:03:48Dax Shepard?

  Which I never understand.

• 1:03:49Speaker 02

  I don't either, but I really cared about what her name was. And for a while she was Monica, a bunch of other things. And I was like, this doesn't sound like who I want this person to be.

• 1:03:59Dax Shepard?

  It's gotta be Padman, but not Padman.

• 1:04:01Speaker 01

  But we can't do that, cause that one's taken.

• 1:04:04Dax Shepard?

  Cause I am not Indian and that might.

• 1:04:06Speaker 01

  Well, we have some recreation stuff might pop up for you.

• 1:04:10Speaker 02

  Yes, exactly. There were various McSomebodies, Monica McBubba, none of those cleared.

• 1:04:15Speaker 01

  Okay. Well, we land on Monica Marx. I like that.

• 1:04:19Dax Shepard?

  But we meet you and you're winning a huge award for being an incredible advertising agent. Is that what we call them?

• 1:04:27Speaker 02

  Executive. I run an advertising agency. Called Atelier, yes.

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:04:32Dax Shepard?

  Which is a big word we talk about all the time.

• 1:04:35Speaker 01

  Ding ding ding for us.

• 1:04:36Dax Shepard?

  You can't imagine how much you just walked into.

• 1:04:39Speaker 01

  He hates.

• 1:04:40Dax Shepard?

  Cause I was taught that name by Monica, who's a fashionista. And I said, you watch, they're gonna start calling Subway an atelier.

• 1:04:48Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:04:49Dax Shepard?

  It's gonna be like artisan.

• 1:04:50Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:04:51Dax Shepard?

  Where it's like, it'll mean nothing.

• 1:04:53Speaker 02

  But it makes you feel like it's worth the $10 you're paying for the sandwich. Yeah.

• 1:04:57Dax Shepard?

  The artisan sandwich from the atelier shop, Subway.

• 1:05:00Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:05:01Dax Shepard?

  You're super well established. You fuck up an ad campaign. You say all somethings matter.

• 1:05:06Speaker 02

  I say all vibes matter. It's for vibes headphones. And this was something, I cannot tell you how many conversations we had about what is believable, even in the world of comedy, that this person who's the head of this thing, who's risen up, what's a believable mistake that would get her canceled, that we think would have gotten through, yet is tone deaf?

• 1:05:27Dax Shepard?

  Tone deaf, not racist. That's the kind of the line we want to straddle.

• 1:05:30Speaker 02

  That's exactly right.

• 1:05:32Speaker 02

  Be like, oops, I didn't realize.

• 1:05:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, all vibes matter. In the right context, you could not put those two together.

• 1:05:37Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 1:05:39Dax Shepard?

  So that spells your demise. And you also have a young woman that works for you, and she's worked there for 168 days, only 43 of which were in the office, and she thinks she's ready to run the place. This stereotype, I do have a few friends who own businesses, who, they have some young employees that are completely shocked they're not vice president within like a year of work.

• 1:05:58Speaker 02

  I know plenty of these stories, because that was something too, where I kept saying to people, is this believable? And they were like, oh, yeah. I have a million examples. It's just growing up differently.

• 1:06:07Dax Shepard?

  It's probably exaggerated and also quite real.

• 1:06:09Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:06:09Dax Shepard?

  I was almost thinking, when I was doing my research on you, I'm like, I wonder if part of it is, it's totally not their fault. They would have been at an age where they watched Mark Zuckerberg start the biggest company on earth at 26 years old. There would be a lot of examples for them that we certainly didn't have. So some of it, I think, is not even their fault.

• 1:06:27Speaker 02

  Right, no.

• 1:06:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, by the time you're 26, you should own Facebook.

• 1:06:29Speaker 02

  It's also parenting changes, and we see, it's why all these generations get named, because whatever the cultural experience their parents were having, I was more latchkey kid, where she's probably fine.

• 1:06:41Dax Shepard?

  We'll find out tonight at nine when I get home.

• 1:06:42Speaker 02

  That's right. And then there's more of like a helicopter thing that happened. I just always remember this statistic, and I don't even know what generation it applied to, but that kids had a tough time picking up a water pitcher and balancing it, because so much had been done for them. Nobody was like, you pour the thing. So like, things like that.

• 1:07:03Speaker 02

  But I think of that as like, you wouldn't think as a parent, ow!

• 1:07:07Dax Shepard?

  You're really at war with that.

• 1:07:09Speaker 02

  Well, it's just reminding me how much I play with my hair. Just things you wouldn't think of as a parent, like I need to make sure my child has basic motor skills.

• 1:07:16Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, God.

• 1:07:18Dax Shepard?

  I knew a family who, yeah, their kid didn't learn to walk very, very late. And my mom was like, of course not. The kid gets picked up and carried everywhere. Doesn't need to walk. Kid's a genius. So why would it waste any time learning to walk?

• 1:07:33Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:07:39Dax Shepard?

  This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Every family has that one holiday tradition nobody actually enjoys, but everyone keeps doing because stopping it would feel like a federal offense. For me, it was a specific meal situation that I will not name because my family listens. But at some point you have to ask yourself, am I doing this because I love it or because I'm afraid of what happens if I don't?

• 1:08:02Speaker 01

  Yes, and that question applies to so much more than the holidays. I think a lot of us carry these invisible rules about how we're supposed to spend the holidays, who we're supposed to see, what it's supposed to look like. And when you start unpacking that with a therapist, you realize half of your stress is coming from rules you didn't even write.

• 1:08:18Dax Shepard?

  This is where BetterHelp can be a great resource during the holidays. BetterHelp does the initial matching work for you so you can focus on your therapy goals. A short questionnaire helps identify your needs and preferences, which means they typically get it right the first time. If you aren't happy with your match, switch to a different therapist at any time from their tailored recs.

• 1:08:38Speaker 01

  I just love therapy. I've been avoiding it recently, or not avoiding it, but I was like, oh, I'm busy, I'm busy, I'm busy. I haven't canceled, canceled, canceled. But then I-

• 1:08:46Dax Shepard?

  You start feeling it.

• 1:08:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, because then I had it this past weekend and I was like, oh my God, and just thank God, thank God for her. Yeah.

• 1:08:54Dax Shepard?

  BetterHelp is now in-network with more than 125 health plans with many copays as low as $15 for eligible members. And if you don't have eligible insurance or live outside the US, you can still get 20% off your first month. Sign up and get 20% off at betterhelp.com/dax. That's betterhelp, H E L P, dot com slash DAX. We get support from no bull. The holidays can get hectic. You finally hit a post summer routine and suddenly you're on hosting duty every week.

• 1:09:27Speaker 01

  That's when you really need to ground yourself.

• 1:09:30Dax Shepard?

  Exactly. And that's why I keep my training routine through the holidays. It's the whole no bull idea. There's a no bullshit training brand built around consistency, honesty, and just putting in the work. It's not about adding more pressure to an already packed schedule. It's about having the gear and the habits to move through the season your way. My personal favorite, all three of the shoes are fantastic. The Outwork, the Outwork Flex, and the Drive Two. I like the Drive Two because it's a hybrid. And I lift, of course, but I also like to do what's called box jumps.

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 1:10:01Dax Shepard?

  Right? I do a lot of jumping onto a little platform and I want a little more flexibility. And boy, do they deliver.

• 1:10:06Speaker 01

  And if you're a cardio person and you're running and you also need to be lifting.

• 1:10:11Dax Shepard?

  And the style is banging. I don't know what to say. Beautiful style, very breathable, very, very comfortable, lots of support. They were built for lifting.

• 1:10:19Speaker 01

  They also make a great holiday gift. You know, I love gifting, a purposeful one that actually supports someone's goals and routines. And it's not a gift that just ends up in the back of a closet.

• 1:10:28Dax Shepard?

  Stay stronger than the season. Head to nobolproject.com all holiday season to shop new deals every week.

• 1:10:42Speaker 02

  When I'm around friends, kids and stuff, I'm like, she's fine. Don't worry about it.

• 1:10:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you get canned and then you build an entire replica of your office in your home, which is fantastic. Now these young kids start running the agency.

• 1:10:55Speaker 02

  They really bonded with each other, which was fantastic. And that's one of the positives of being on location in a first season of a show. They had each other and they really hung out together and it seemed like had a good time. I was busy being professional, so.

• 1:11:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:11Dax Shepard?

  Studying for the next day.

• 1:11:13Speaker 01

  That's the plight of the boss. The boss. Right. It really is.

• 1:11:16Dax Shepard?

  Here's a joke in this show that I have unfortunately heard people in my life claim they have, which is one of the younger workers is late and he says, I have time blindness.

• 1:11:26Speaker 02

  Yeah. I know.

• 1:11:28Speaker 01

  That's a thing.

• 1:11:29Dax Shepard?

  You haven't heard that?

• 1:11:30Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:11:31Dax Shepard?

  I've now heard people our age claim to have time. Boy, this is a new concept.

• 1:11:35Speaker 02

  That same character also says he's audibly fragile when someone's too loud.

• 1:11:39Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 1:11:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's wonderful.

• 1:11:41Speaker 01

  Oh, that's great.

• 1:11:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I'm sort of awful in my own ways and it was so many things I hadn't done or hadn't done in a while. I wanted there to be a core of what is believable and what is just heartbreaking about being replaced.

• 1:11:55Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:11:56Speaker 02

  And losing, it's not just the job, it's relevance and sense of self.

• 1:12:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, was all this worth it? And I'm disappearing, the world's changing and none of it was for anything.

• 1:12:06Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:12:07Dax Shepard?

  You're so fun to work with. I'm really jealous of those people and I miss it so much.

• 1:12:12Speaker 02

  I know, it was a good time. And that was one time when the genuine kids on Parenthood would be like, ugh, I can't make it to yoga. And I was like, you have no idea how good you have it and you better be thankful and someday you're gonna call me from a show and be like, I had to work 14 hours.

• 1:12:25Dax Shepard?

  It's all gonna go downhill from here. This is as good as it'll ever get.

• 1:12:27Speaker 02

  It was just the most wonderful group of people, the most wonderful material, the most wonderful Jason Kadam's, the most wonderful hours.

• 1:12:34Dax Shepard?

  You got to actually act nearly the whole time you were there, which is impossible.

• 1:12:38Speaker 02

  We were super lucky.

• 1:12:40Dax Shepard?

  You keep dodging this question in every interview, but I'm gonna pretty much make you answer it.

• 1:12:45Speaker 02

  Great.

• 1:12:46Dax Shepard?

  You're a part of a phenomenon, which is Gilmore Girls, and certainly we saw Will and Grace come back in a very satisfying way for everybody involved. This seems insane that we wouldn't be doing this show again.

• 1:12:59Speaker 02

  Well, we did it for Netflix.

• 1:13:01Dax Shepard?

  Yes, you did four movies.

• 1:13:03Speaker 02

  I don't know, because they definitely didn't read anything then, but there seems to have been a mixed reaction in terms of feeling satisfied that the people got what they wanted. For me, it was a incredibly satisfying, beautiful, cried every day experience. I could mark some growth I felt I had in terms of that character, that time working with Amy. It felt different. So all the stuff that I loved about it was the same and then it was better and different and the more grown up version. How do you honor those? People who have kept it alive. Is it giving them more? Is it doing what Reese Witherspoon's doing with Legally Blonde, L, the prequel? Is this a Captain Marvel multiverse?

• 1:13:47Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:13:48Speaker 02

  Want to follow whoever or do you try to go back?

• 1:13:51Dax Shepard?

  What I think Will and Grace did right is they gave you exactly what you had the first time.

• 1:13:55Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:13:55Dax Shepard?

  We can accept that the story's now progressed.

• 1:13:58Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:13:58Dax Shepard?

  But you gotta keep it in our really familiar, fun.

• 1:14:01Speaker 02

  That's a really good point. I always say, and it's not me trying to get out of the question. It is literally what I could picture, given everyone's lives and schedules, is Christmas movie.

• 1:14:11Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:14:12Speaker 02

  Because that's what I think the Brits do so well with their beloved shows.

• 1:14:16Dax Shepard?

  Oh, man.

• 1:14:16Speaker 02

  Is that you get a Christmas special. It's not episodes, but it's seeing all your friends together again. It's one of the reasons I thought the Walmart commercial was so sweet, where are they now?

• 1:14:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:14:26Speaker 02

  Because speaking to, have you seen the most recent Bridget Jones?

• 1:14:29Speaker 01

  Not yet.

• 1:14:30Speaker 02

  I'm obsessed with the books, obsessed with the movies. I think they did an incredible job. Renee is incredible in it. It gives you what that character always was, which is a single girl trying to understand the dating world.

• 1:14:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:41Speaker 02

  Which you couldn't do. You had to make her single again.

• 1:14:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:14:44Dax Shepard?

  Yes, the engine of the whole thing was her being single.

• 1:14:46Speaker 02

  That's right. And then she's out. It's the same dynamic.

• 1:14:49Dax Shepard?

  Also, dating's the whole thing that still happens. It's actually real.

• 1:14:53Speaker 02

  But dating has changed.

• 1:14:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:14:55Speaker 02

  So it's like, how do you re-enter that?

• 1:14:57Speaker 01

  Is there something weird, though, about, weird maybe isn't the right word, but a little unsettling about seeing the person from so many years ago in the exact same spot they were?

• 1:15:09Speaker 02

  I don't know. I mean, also, we don't look the same. There's no way you should or could be the same.

• 1:15:14Speaker 01

  Exactly, yeah.

• 1:15:15Speaker 02

  And so I don't know.

• 1:15:17Dax Shepard?

  But that's TV.

• 1:15:18Speaker 02

  Well, that's aging. It's just being a person.

• 1:15:20Dax Shepard?

  Crosby's never gonna learn. You're never gonna learn. That's the premise of.

• 1:15:23Speaker 02

  But the problem is where we left the characters, not the problem, but now Lorelai and Luke got married. Now Rory's maybe having a baby, so it's not gonna be necessarily the two of us circling the gazebo. You have to add Ed Herman, God bless his past. It just can't be the same, which is why I view it as best served in a holiday, in a sort of limited.

• 1:15:44Speaker 01

  I think that's right.

• 1:15:45Dax Shepard?

  Some people don't ever change.

• 1:15:46Speaker 01

  I know. I don't. I don't know if it gets less funny and more like, oh, Friends was my number one. I could not have loved it more.

• 1:15:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:15:54Speaker 01

  And I'm glad they never did that. I'm glad it ended and they did it. It can live like that for me forever.

• 1:16:01Speaker 02

  Because I do still get asked, is it literally just better to leave them wanting more?

• 1:16:05Speaker 01

  I know. That's kind of how I feel.

• 1:16:07Dax Shepard?

  You're not doing commercials.

• 1:16:08Speaker 01

  No, it's not.

• 1:16:10Dax Shepard?

  I'm gonna tell you right now, they have the thing. You can't erase it. You can't make it disappear. You can't dishonor it. All these fears. You give them this other thing, maybe they'll like it or they won't like it. It's not gonna impact that.

• 1:16:21Speaker 02

  Thank God it isn't up to me. And what I have clearly said is if somebody calls me to do it, I'll do it.

• 1:16:27Dax Shepard?

  I don't desire to act at all, but I deeply miss Being Not Parenthood. And there is a version of that show I would probably do.

• 1:16:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:35Dax Shepard?

  If it were eight episodes or 10 episodes, I could manage my now real job. My fear is more is like going back to your high school. But I don't think so because we were already like full-fledged adults. And when I see you, it lights me up every time. And when I'm with Trailing, which I spent a lot of time with Trailing, I'm just enamored with being around him. None of that's changed.

• 1:16:53Speaker 02

  You have reminded me that I'm angry about your friendship with Larry.

• 1:16:56Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:16:57Speaker 02

  I knew him first.

• 1:16:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:58Speaker 02

  I went to college with him.

• 1:16:59Dax Shepard?

  I might have put more effort in.

• 1:17:01Speaker 02

  You probably did. And you're in town more.

• 1:17:03Dax Shepard?

  Yes, I'm in town more.

• 1:17:04Speaker 02

  But can I please come play with you guys sometime when you have dinner? Maybe the reason that show went away is once you get to someone having cancer, I mean, when you're on these family shows, there's only so many stories. They don't tend to go on for 10 or 12 years. I mean, this is us is an example, but they didn't go that much longer.

• 1:17:25Dax Shepard?

  Right. I mean, we did six years. That's about as long as you can do it. And I won't even give a fuck. I don't care how it turns out.

• 1:17:31Speaker 01

  That's the problem. You just want it for you.

• 1:17:33Dax Shepard?

  I just wanna go hang out with you guys. I love you.

• 1:17:35Speaker 02

  I love you.

• 1:17:36Dax Shepard?

  From the bottom of my heart, I love you.

• 1:17:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, this was so nice of you to came.

• 1:17:39Dax Shepard?

  The Z-Suite is out now on Tubi and it's free. It's network TV for free as a streamer. I'm in.

• 1:17:45Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 1:17:46Dax Shepard?

  So everyone watch the Z-Suite. Spelt Z S U I T E. So glad we got to hang out. You and I have had sauna plans for about a year and a half. And I said, should we have done this interview?

• 1:17:57Speaker 02

  Other people say, let's have lunch. Dak says, come over and sweat your face off.

• 1:18:02Dax Shepard?

  Let's get stronger together.

• 1:18:03Speaker 02

  In a bathing suit, which is like, that's not where my.

• 1:18:07Speaker 01

  That's why he doesn't like that.

• 1:18:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:18:10Dax Shepard?

  Maybe that's why a lot of people aren't taking my offer up. They don't want to be in a bathing suit.

• 1:18:13Speaker 01

  It might be a red flag who does take you up on that offer.

• 1:18:16Speaker 02

  Are there takers?

• 1:18:18Dax Shepard?

  Mostly other men. I love you.

• 1:18:20Speaker 02

  Love you.

• 1:18:20Dax Shepard?

  I love you.

• 1:18:21Speaker 01

  We have to give you props really quick because you make the best banana bread I've ever had in my entire.

• 1:18:26Speaker 02

  Oh, I haven't made that in so long.

• 1:18:27Speaker 01

  During COVID, you made it and we had it and it was so good.

• 1:18:32Dax Shepard?

  You've been derelict in your duties.

• 1:18:33Speaker 02

  I have. I used to make a really good cinnamon bread, too.

• 1:18:35Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:18:36Dax Shepard?

  And maybe you can lure May over and I can see her because that's the only way I'll see her.

• 1:18:39Speaker 02

  I will. We'll do that when they're back.

• 1:18:41Dax Shepard?

  All right.

• 1:18:42Speaker 02

  All right.

• 1:18:42Dax Shepard?

  Love you again.

• 1:18:43Speaker 02

  Love you. Get this microphone out of my way.

• 1:18:48Dax Shepard?

  I sure hope there weren't any mistakes in that episode, but we'll find out when my mom, Mrs. Monica, comes in and tells us what was wrong.

• 1:18:57Dax Shepard?

  Are you so happy to be wearing your raincoat?

• 1:19:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:02Speaker 01

  It's a good part, I guess.

• 1:19:03Dax Shepard?

  That's his brown lining.

• 1:19:05Speaker 01

  Brown lining, literally.

• 1:19:07Dax Shepard?

  I was on the road at 6:00 AM this morning.

• 1:19:09Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:19:10Dax Shepard?

  Driving to Anaheim, California, home of Disneyland, as you may know.

• 1:19:13Speaker 01

  I do know that.

• 1:19:14Dax Shepard?

  Thriving suburb in the greater metropolitan area, yes. To go to Expo West.

• 1:19:22Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:19:23Dax Shepard?

  Do you know about Expo West?

• 1:19:25Speaker 01

  Nope.

• 1:19:26Dax Shepard?

  I don't know a ton either.

• 1:19:27Speaker 01

  Okay, even after having gone?

• 1:19:29Dax Shepard?

  That's right.

• 1:19:29Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:19:30Dax Shepard?

  Seventy thousand attendees.

• 1:19:32Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:19:33Dax Shepard?

  It's a huge trade show for consumer products.

• 1:19:37Speaker 01

  All kinds?

• 1:19:39Dax Shepard?

  Grocers, products, buyers, suppliers, founders. And Sharon Beasley and I, Karen Weekly, were on stage being interviewed.

• 1:19:51Speaker 01

  Oh, you were interviewed? Oh, I thought you guys were like trying to sell your product.

• 1:19:54Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's happening. Yeah, I had to come back to work for my real job.

• 1:19:58Speaker 01

  Are they still there?

• 1:19:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they're still there.

• 1:19:59Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:20:00Dax Shepard?

  Wandering the halls of a huge convention. Seventy thousand attendees.

• 1:20:04Speaker 01

  That's great.

• 1:20:05Dax Shepard?

  Rob, Google, how many cities in America have more than seventy thousand?

• 1:20:09Speaker 05

  So I'm getting fifty thousand or more. There's five hundred and ten urban areas in the US with a population.

• 1:20:15Dax Shepard?

  Out of fifty states, that's like ten per state.

• 1:20:17Speaker 01

  Okay, that's.

• 1:20:18Dax Shepard?

  I don't know what that does for us, but I feel like it's relevant.

• 1:20:21Speaker 01

  Not, not, not a lot for me personally.

• 1:20:23Dax Shepard?

  What I'm saying is this would be in the top 500 cities in America for population, had this group incorporated into a city while they were watching this interview.

• 1:20:32Speaker 01

  Okay, great. I'm just thinking about all these products, you know?

• 1:20:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, a lot of products. It's crowded space.

• 1:20:37Speaker 01

  So many products and...

• 1:20:42Dax Shepard?

  Go ahead.

• 1:20:42Speaker 01

  I just, like, do we need more products? Unless it's filling a space.

• 1:20:51Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:20:51Speaker 01

  I do think you are filling a space with Ted Seekers. I don't think there's a lot of good N A beer.

• 1:20:57Dax Shepard?

  I do too.

• 1:20:58Speaker 01

  So I, I support that product.

• 1:21:01Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:21:01Speaker 01

  But overall, like, everyone has a product.

• 1:21:06Dax Shepard?

  Yep.

• 1:21:06Speaker 01

  And I think I'm gonna say, I declare I'm against it.

• 1:21:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh my goodness, what a controversial stance. Well, you like capitalism and you like the marketplace.

• 1:21:18Speaker 01

  Of course. So it's not an anti-capitalist stance. It's more just like, do we need it, guys?

• 1:21:23Dax Shepard?

  More of an enough already?

• 1:21:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. It's a little bit more of an enough already, mixed with like, everyone famous has to have some product, like, not you again, not you.

• 1:21:34Dax Shepard?

  No, no, it could be, go ahead, go ahead.

• 1:21:35Speaker 01

  No, I, I don't mean you.

• 1:21:36Dax Shepard?

  That's why I love talking about Ted Seekers, because this was not a cash grab. No one approached me. All these other, there's another guy with a, a celebrity with a beer brand. And he's very openly on a talk show saying like, he got approached by people. They handed him five things at a boardroom meeting and said, basically, will you put your name on this?

• 1:21:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:53Dax Shepard?

  So this is like, me and Aaron created a beer we wouldn't be embarrassed to order at a bar.

• 1:21:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:21:58Dax Shepard?

  Right? We're not like, hey, do you have little duels? Could you bring it in a Budweiser?

• 1:22:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. I also think selling products is great. I have no beef with people who kind of, who do, who are doing that.

• 1:22:07Dax Shepard?

  We made it for ourselves and then we thought, oh, maybe people would also want it.

• 1:22:11Speaker 01

  But I mean, even people who like, don't really care about the product, but are like, look, I can, I can slap my name on this and get eyes on it and I think it's fine. I don't have any, I don't really have a problem with some of this bad things that other people might have problems with.

• 1:22:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:26Speaker 01

  But I do think like, when I go to, to...

• 1:22:31Speaker 01

  Target, I'll say.

• 1:22:32Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, it's a great place to go.

• 1:22:33Speaker 01

  And there's like so many tequilas.

• 1:22:40Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:22:41Speaker 01

  They're all one kind of tequila. It's all, they're all a celebrity brand tequila of, of one variety. It's not like they like put in a ton of effort to make it, you know, I think we recently talked about Paul Feig. Paul Feig has a gin.

• 1:22:55Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:22:56Speaker 01

  But that's like his passion.

• 1:22:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, he's virtually a chemist.

• 1:22:59Speaker 01

  Yes. And so that's great to me, but just.

• 1:23:02Dax Shepard?

  And my passion's partying.

• 1:23:04Speaker 01

  It was.

• 1:23:05Dax Shepard?

  No, it is. That's what Ted Ziegler's all about. You can still fucking rage. You don't have to have alcohol.

• 1:23:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, but do you think you rage?

• 1:23:12Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my God, yes. Aaron and I party hard.

• 1:23:15Speaker 01

  Poke holes in your business.

• 1:23:16Dax Shepard?

  Barbecue, laughing, screaming, five of them, not the sip one.

• 1:23:21Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:23:21Dax Shepard?

  Empty can. It's a party.

• 1:23:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I think most people think when they hear party, they think like club, 4 a.m. like.

• 1:23:29Dax Shepard?

  Oh, they, they're not thinking about it correctly.

• 1:23:31Speaker 01

  I, I agree.

• 1:23:32Dax Shepard?

  Parties is a state of mind and I'm gonna drop into a carefree tomorrow never comes attitude. That's a party to me.

• 1:23:41Speaker 01

  I'm about parties too, then.

• 1:23:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, we party. We fucking get down here. What are you talking about? This is a major party.

• 1:23:47Speaker 01

  I'm just telling you what the colloquial observation of the word party.

• 1:23:53Dax Shepard?

  That they think it has to involve being intoxicated.

• 1:23:56Speaker 01

  And being out late. People think partying is being out late and they don't party with me because I'm in bed by eight.

• 1:24:03Dax Shepard?

  Yes, yes, yes. But Aaron and I will be out late. Okay?

• 1:24:07Speaker 01

  Rarely.

• 1:24:08Dax Shepard?

  Rarely.

• 1:24:10Dax Shepard?

  But we would.

• 1:24:11Speaker 01

  Be honest that it's rare.

• 1:24:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but we would.

• 1:24:14Speaker 01

  You used to get panicked because you haven't taken your sleep aids.

• 1:24:16Dax Shepard?

  I'll give you a prime example. Aaron and I will be, which happens often, we're both binging a show together. And it's midnight, we should go to bed and I go, you just want to fucking party? And he's like, yeah, let's fucking go. And that means we'll watch till maybe 3 a.m. Because tomorrow's not coming. That's tomorrow Dax's problem.

• 1:24:39Speaker 01

  BTDTI. That's like how I live. I watched all of Running Point on Saturday. I watched the whole show.

• 1:24:45Dax Shepard?

  Right. Let it rip.

• 1:24:47Speaker 01

  Late and I guess I was partying.

• 1:24:49Dax Shepard?

  Yes. I don't think we should let the people, just people who are getting intoxicated, own the space, partying.

• 1:24:56Speaker 01

  I, I, I like it. You're reclaiming.

• 1:24:58Dax Shepard?

  That's right. Wait, back to, I wanna, I wanna spend a little more time on this, cause I think, I think you're representing

• 1:25:07Dax Shepard?

  how a lot of people feel. Like, oh god, this guy's got a vodka now.

• 1:25:13Speaker 01

  Right. I don't mean to, yeah.

• 1:25:15Dax Shepard?

  But I think a lot of people feel that way.

• 1:25:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:25:17Dax Shepard?

  And I guess I can see it from both sides.

• 1:25:21Speaker 01

  Well, let me be clear really quick. To me, it's not about like, oh, this guy has, it's not about the, the guy or the girl or the whatever. It's not about the person. It's about the space. It's like, guys, we just don't need another one of these.

• 1:25:36Dax Shepard?

  Right. You're more like, the category is.

• 1:25:41Speaker 01

  Get a little creative. Look and see what's needed, then do that.

• 1:25:45Dax Shepard?

  That's what's cool about Danny.

• 1:25:47Speaker 01

  Ricardo.

• 1:25:48Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:25:50Dax Shepard?

  Nope. Danny DeVito. He did le mature, what is it? Limoncello?

• 1:25:55Speaker 01

  I love limoncello.

• 1:25:56Dax Shepard?

  Limoncello. Like, when we did, went in Rome 18 years ago. He had limoncello, cause that's his drink.

• 1:26:03Speaker 01

  This is the same with beauty. Beauty insiders also feel like this, like, wow. Everyone has a makeup brand or a beauty brand. Something. And I agree, but I also think there is some space there. Like, I do like the people who are coming in with a more diverse color palette.

• 1:26:27Dax Shepard?

  Okay, sure. Browns and light browns.

• 1:26:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, cause there's a lot of.

• 1:26:31Dax Shepard?

  Whitey.

• 1:26:32Speaker 01

  There's, well, there's just a lot of variation within darker colors and that, that's not available.

• 1:26:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:39Speaker 01

  I was just asking Simone yesterday. I was like, what did you put on my face again for, for the SAG Awards? And she was like, I used two.

• 1:26:46Dax Shepard?

  She had to do some.

• 1:26:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, you gotta use.

• 1:26:48Dax Shepard?

  Chemistry.

• 1:26:49Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:26:49Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I was only gonna, not that anyone cares, I don't even know why I'm saying this, but I'm going to. If you look at the last six spirits that were created and then became valued at over a billion dollars or multiple billions of dollars. The truth is four of those five are celebrity driven, whether it's Conor McGregor, or it's the handsome Clooney, McLoney.

• 1:27:18Speaker 01

  George Clooney, but his is good.

• 1:27:20Dax Shepard?

  Well, yeah, they could be good or they could be.

• 1:27:23Speaker 01

  I guess, but I guess with that, I didn't even know that was his brand.

• 1:27:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:26Speaker 01

  I was drinking it, Casamigos.

• 1:27:28Dax Shepard?

  Casamigos, shout out.

• 1:27:29Speaker 01

  Yes, I was drinking that.

• 1:27:31Dax Shepard?

  He already exited, I think.

• 1:27:32Speaker 01

  Oh, good for him.

• 1:27:35Speaker 01

  And then I was, then I learned, like, I think he invested in that, right?

• 1:27:40Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he was right out in front of it.

• 1:27:41Speaker 01

  Oh, he was?

• 1:27:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah. There's several, they have worked. And what you have to acknowledge is if you're a distiller, a distiller or a distillery, breaking through this insanely cluttered space is nearly fucking impossible.

• 1:27:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:27:55Dax Shepard?

  You would really have to spend hundreds of millions of dollars marketing this product.

• 1:28:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:01Dax Shepard?

  Or you get The Rock to talk about it on his Instagram. You save yourself several hundred million dollars.

• 1:28:06Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:28:07Dax Shepard?

  And it breaks through. So it's like.

• 1:28:09Speaker 01

  But that's selling. That's like, he's the spokesperson. I'm fine with spokespeople.

• 1:28:14Dax Shepard?

  No, he started that. He's one of the founders.

• 1:28:16Speaker 01

  That's what I'm saying. That's different. Starting something, founding something, having your own idea and doing it to me is, is like,

• 1:28:25Speaker 01

  now I'm, now I'm confused about what I'm even saying.

• 1:28:28Dax Shepard?

  And me too a bit, which I think is the sign of a good conversation is you're like trying to figure out what your position is midway through.

• 1:28:34Speaker 01

  I don't care. Everyone can do it however they want, but there's just a lot of products out there.

• 1:28:38Dax Shepard?

  I want to explain the landscape and why it's irresistible for distilleries and, and, you know, spirits.

• 1:28:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:46Dax Shepard?

  Because you, you almost can't do it to just have like a novel recipe and try to penetrate.

• 1:28:52Speaker 01

  I agree. Like Kristen was with Spindrift for a while.

• 1:28:55Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:28:56Speaker 01

  That to me is great. Like she likes the product.

• 1:29:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:00Speaker 01

  And it exists and she is helping promote it. She's a spokesperson. But I think if she on her own was like. And like you guys did with Hello Bella because you felt like that there was a need.

• 1:29:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:12Speaker 01

  But if she on her own.

• 1:29:13Dax Shepard?

  People on a budget to have the same shit we have.

• 1:29:15Speaker 01

  Yes, but I think if she on her own was just like, what product shall I make now?

• 1:29:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:22Speaker 01

  Okay, I'll make vodka.

• 1:29:26Dax Shepard?

  Right, and I don't drink.

• 1:29:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, or just anything. It's like she didn't do that and I appreciate that. Like, I think just being hired is great.

• 1:29:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:36Speaker 01

  I am, please hire me to be a spokesperson.

• 1:29:40Dax Shepard?

  No, I think you just.

• 1:29:41Speaker 01

  No, this is, theirs is nuanced. I would like to be a spokesperson for your product that already exists, but I don't want to clutter the market with a new one.

• 1:29:50Dax Shepard?

  Don't you think it might be fair to also acknowledge is like however you feel about the new celebrity uh, product is virtually just how you feel about that celebrity. Because like when Clooney does it, you're like, oh, cool. He's super classy and elevated and I bet his tequilas top shelf and you won't get a hangover.

• 1:30:07Speaker 01

  And it is.

• 1:30:08Dax Shepard?

  And then you see, I don't even want to say a name, but you know, there's like a whole legion of people you would see with the product and be like, well, I don't even like their vibe. To begin with. And it reeks of cash grab.

• 1:30:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's all part of it.

• 1:30:27Dax Shepard?

  I'll have everyone know if it makes them feel better. I have lost hundreds of thousands of dollars on Ted Seekers.

• 1:30:35Speaker 01

  No, I made this clear that I, I think that's different.

• 1:30:40Dax Shepard?

  Mine's also a mission to be with my two friends.

• 1:30:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's great. Everyone do whatever they want. Just do it.

• 1:30:47Dax Shepard?

  And I don't care if you think I'm a, I'll just, yeah, I guess it is important to me that everyone recognizes this, this is not a cash grab. No one came to me. This is all self-finance and I'll probably lose my shirt. But again, I'm having a blast with Aaron Aaron. We were at a fucking convention just now on stage. Cash grab's in the right, yeah, there's the right, listen, I'm a part of some.

• 1:31:05Speaker 01

  Everything's fine, me too. Everything's fine. Everyone's doing great.

• 1:31:09Dax Shepard?

  Everyone's trying to make it. What else? How was your weekend? We haven't discussed weekends.

• 1:31:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:14Dax Shepard?

  Tell me.

• 1:31:14Speaker 01

  Um, as I said, I watched all of Running Point, really enjoyed it. I miss that half hour comedy vibe a lot.

• 1:31:21Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:22Speaker 01

  It's such an ea- it's just easy. It's breezy. It's fun. It's it's sexy. It's I like it.

• 1:31:31Speaker 01

  So I watched all that. Oh, speaking of on my Instagram this week because it's it's Mindy Week, although when this comes out, it won't be Mindy Week.

• 1:31:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's past.

• 1:31:39Speaker 01

  It will have passed. But um, it's Mindy Week. So every day this week, I'm posting on stories. An old episode of ours that is connected to Running Point. So like yesterday, I posted Kate's old episode.

• 1:31:54Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:31:55Speaker 01

  Today I posted Ike's first appearance.

• 1:31:57Dax Shepard?

  How first?

• 1:31:58Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then there's more to come.

• 1:32:01Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:32:01Speaker 01

  We've had a lot of those people on.

• 1:32:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, who else?

• 1:32:04Speaker 01

  Max.

• 1:32:05Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, Max Greenfield.

• 1:32:07Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:32:08Dax Shepard?

  Sweet Max, who I love.

• 1:32:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:10Dax Shepard?

  Well, I'm glad you finished that whole you plowed right through.

• 1:32:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:14Dax Shepard?

  It felt great and you woke up and felt good in the morning.

• 1:32:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was I was very happy.

• 1:32:18Dax Shepard?

  You didn't feel you didn't feel guilty for partying too hard. Yeah, good.

• 1:32:21Speaker 01

  No, I didn't. I felt great about it.

• 1:32:23Dax Shepard?

  Wonderful.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  What else did I do? Oh, I had a big catch up session um with my viewing crew because we were behind and we watched White Lotus and Severance. We were behind. So we had to watch two Severance, two White Lotus.

• 1:32:38Dax Shepard?

  You have not introduced me to this viewing crew concept. This is you just dropped it on my lap.

• 1:32:43Speaker 01

  No, I told you.

• 1:32:44Dax Shepard?

  I'm super familiar with the viewing group.

• 1:32:45Speaker 01

  I told you, Anna, Julia, Jess and I watched that. Watched Severance and White Lotus.

• 1:32:49Dax Shepard?

  I you told me you had watched an episode. I didn't realize it was a commitment and a viewing crew. And a weekly.

• 1:32:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a weekly Sunday.

• 1:32:58Dax Shepard?

  What fun.

• 1:32:58Speaker 01

  Sunday, I make dinner.

• 1:33:00Dax Shepard?

  The funnest times of my whole life were watching Sopranos on Sunday nights and making Italian food.

• 1:33:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:33:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:07Speaker 01

  So fun.

• 1:33:08Dax Shepard?

  Got a gooch.

• 1:33:08Speaker 01

  But the problem is when you miss.

• 1:33:11Dax Shepard?

  Got a Gich.

• 1:33:12Speaker 01

  It's a problem.

• 1:33:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, when you get it, it's a got a Gich. And when you miss, it's a got a Gich.

• 1:33:18Speaker 01

  Are you in Sopranos?

• 1:33:19Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'm in Sopranos.

• 1:33:19Speaker 01

  Okay, got it. Um, yeah. No, it's a, it's like, then we have four to watch. That was a lot.

• 1:33:27Dax Shepard?

  When you miss a week of viewing, I thought you meant when you miss cooking.

• 1:33:31Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:33:32Dax Shepard?

  Cause that would be a got a Gich.

• 1:33:34Speaker 01

  Okay, yeah.

• 1:33:35Dax Shepard?

  Missing would be, oh, Maron. Maron. Okay.

• 1:33:39Speaker 01

  Okay. Um, so we had to watch four episodes.

• 1:33:42Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my God, that was your Sunday?

• 1:33:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, which was also very fun.

• 1:33:45Dax Shepard?

  That's fun.

• 1:33:45Speaker 01

  It was fun. But then the Oscars were also on.

• 1:33:49Dax Shepard?

  Oh, and you gotta watch those.

• 1:33:50Speaker 01

  So I had to watch pieces of that. So it was a lot of television consumption over the weekend.

• 1:33:55Dax Shepard?

  I had a television party too, because I got early screeners for Drive to Survive. And I had the boys over.

• 1:34:03Speaker 01

  Cool.

• 1:34:04Dax Shepard?

  To watch. And, um, yeah, what a show. What a show. Boy, do they build the suspense for the season, which kicks off in a week.

• 1:34:12Speaker 01

  Fun.

• 1:34:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh, can't wait. Testing happened. Some surprises, some big, exciting surprises.

• 1:34:20Speaker 01

  How's my boyfriend? Does he do well? Does he?

• 1:34:23Dax Shepard?

  Who's your current boyfriend?

• 1:34:24Speaker 01

  Toto. He's one of my boyfriends.

• 1:34:26Dax Shepard?

  Now he's your boyfriend?

• 1:34:27Speaker 01

  He's definitely been one of my boyfriends since he came on the show.

• 1:34:31Dax Shepard?

  Since he came on the show, but prior to that, yeah, it was Ricardo or bust.

• 1:34:35Speaker 01

  Well, Ricardo's still, but he's not there.

• 1:34:38Dax Shepard?

  He's a got a Gich. Uh, Ricardo.

• 1:34:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, Danny.

• 1:34:42Dax Shepard?

  Danny Ricardo. You can't even look. Um, yeah, great Toto. What a charming son of a bitch. He gets you several times in the three episodes. I, yes, he's so playful.

• 1:34:54Speaker 01

  God, he really is so playful.

• 1:34:55Dax Shepard?

  But back to testing, Carlos Sainz, who we love, sexiest man on the grid, best lay, father is a legend.

• 1:35:02Speaker 01

  Poopoo pants.

• 1:35:04Dax Shepard?

  Don't say that about him. He was unceremoniously let go of Ferrari to make room for Lewis Hamilton.

• 1:35:12Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:35:12Dax Shepard?

  And what was great is that the first half of the year, Carlos was destroying. He was beating Leclerc, who I love, but it was fun. Cause he's like, oh, you're gonna fire me and keep Charles. Let me beat Charles for a while. Very exciting.

• 1:35:26Speaker 01

  This is great.

• 1:35:26Dax Shepard?

  He went to Williams, always a bottom three team. In testing first test session, Carlos Sainz had the fastest lap in a Williams.

• 1:35:36Speaker 01

  That's awesome.

• 1:35:36Dax Shepard?

  Talk about a little bit of poetic justice.

• 1:35:38Speaker 01

  We love a comeback.

• 1:35:40Dax Shepard?

  Underdog.

• 1:35:40Speaker 01

  An underdog.

• 1:35:42Dax Shepard?

  This is straight underdog. You know, I have very specific compartments for my stories as we learned on the last fact check.

• 1:35:48Speaker 01

  What do you mean? Way I forget.

• 1:35:50Dax Shepard?

  Well, I was like, no, no, this is a climbing the ladder, becoming a CEO story. This isn't a dreams come true story. That's too broad of a blanket.

• 1:35:56Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:35:57Dax Shepard?

  So this one is specifically underdog.

• 1:35:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, but it's like underdog.

• 1:36:02Dax Shepard?

  Revenge.

• 1:36:03Speaker 01

  It's rev- that's what it is. It's not underdog, I don't think.

• 1:36:06Dax Shepard?

  Well, he's on an underdog team.

• 1:36:08Speaker 01

  I know, but it's like.

• 1:36:09Dax Shepard?

  There's two stories happening.

• 1:36:10Speaker 01

  It's just hard to call him an underdog.

• 1:36:12Dax Shepard?

  But the Williams story is an underdog story. And then the Carlos Sainz is a revenge is a dish best served hot and straight up your ass on week one of testing.

• 1:36:21Speaker 01

  And I won't clean my ass after.

• 1:36:22Dax Shepard?

  Don't say that.

• 1:36:24Speaker 01

  It's my opinion. I mean, that's the world we live in. Opinions.

• 1:36:28Dax Shepard?

  Are facts.

• 1:36:29Speaker 01

  Say it and it's a fact.

• 1:36:30Dax Shepard?

  That's right. Opinions are facts. Don't talk back.

• 1:36:34Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, all right. Well, that's fun. You had a viewing party.

• 1:36:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that was a really good time. Had a double date on Saturday night at a steakhouse by the people who do Sugarfish.

• 1:36:46Speaker 01

  Oh, nice.

• 1:36:47Dax Shepard?

  And you can expect it's the steak version of Sugarfish.

• 1:36:51Speaker 01

  Where, what?

• 1:36:52Dax Shepard?

  Matu.

• 1:36:53Speaker 01

  Oh, I've been there.

• 1:36:54Dax Shepard?

  You have?

• 1:36:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, the Philly, they do also have Philly.

• 1:36:57Dax Shepard?

  The Philly cheesesteak.

• 1:36:58Speaker 01

  So good.

• 1:36:59Dax Shepard?

  Oh my God, that was dessert. We got this crazy like all in meal and the dessert was that frigging.

• 1:37:04Speaker 01

  It's so unreal.

• 1:37:07Dax Shepard?

  I mean, people in Philadelphia are gonna slit my throat, but it's the best Philly cheesesteak I've ever had and I've had them in Philadelphia.

• 1:37:12Speaker 05

  It's a wagyu, right?

• 1:37:13Dax Shepard?

  It's a wagyu. You mispronounced it, but yeah.

• 1:37:16Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 1:37:18Dax Shepard?

  Got a gooch.

• 1:37:19Speaker 01

  Oh, you've been hanging out with too many bros.

• 1:37:21Dax Shepard?

  No, I haven't.

• 1:37:22Speaker 01

  Now you talk like that.

• 1:37:23Dax Shepard?

  One evening with Aaron and Aaron, who are not bros.

• 1:37:26Speaker 01

  Aaron and Aaron are not the bros I'm talking about.

• 1:37:28Dax Shepard?

  They're not bros at all.

• 1:37:29Speaker 01

  I love them.

• 1:37:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, they're very un-bro.

• 1:37:31Speaker 01

  I know, that's why I love them.

• 1:37:32Dax Shepard?

  We went and saw the Led Zeppelin documentary yesterday.

• 1:37:35Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 1:37:35Dax Shepard?

  In IMAX.

• 1:37:37Speaker 01

  Fun. Actually, I was thinking about that. This is a Easter egg. You know, you.

• 1:37:45Dax Shepard?

  Can't wait to watch you tap dance around this. I already know what's coming. And I'm like, watching you play. You're like testing the ice, see if you're gonna fall through before you say it.

• 1:37:53Speaker 01

  I know. For someone who is pretty risk averse, I'm really not. I step on the ice all the time.

• 1:37:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you're mixed messies for sure.

• 1:38:01Speaker 01

  I do think you connect with bro culture. Like, in your head, you think that. Like, you grew up in Michigan, and, you know, it's dirt road, and you have all these bros. And, and then other kinds of bros in Detroit. Like, you really connect with that idea.

• 1:38:23Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay. So far, I can agree with you. I can hang with the bros. Like, I'm totally comfortable in that.

• 1:38:28Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:38:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:29Speaker 01

  But I think you sometimes identify, sometimes, well, maybe it's just when you're with them. I don't know. But I, and I mean this as a huge compliment.

• 1:38:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:38:40Speaker 01

  You are not one.

• 1:38:42Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I know.

• 1:38:42Speaker 01

  And like, your bros.

• 1:38:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:45Speaker 01

  Are sweet boys.

• 1:38:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, the Aaron's.

• 1:38:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:49Dax Shepard?

  All my friends from Michigan are sweethearts.

• 1:38:50Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:38:51Dax Shepard?

  We fist fought a lot, but we, all of them are very sweet boys.

• 1:38:55Speaker 01

  That's, like.

• 1:38:57Dax Shepard?

  I think that.

• 1:38:57Speaker 01

  There's a distinction for me.

• 1:38:59Dax Shepard?

  If I dare, I'm now on the ice. I think you had some pretty binary categories. And I don't know that you had the category of boys who are super sweet to their moms and their sisters, and also fought at the bar. And I think that's the category that the Aaron's and I are in.

• 1:39:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's, that's right. I think the bro culture that people talk about.

• 1:39:24Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:39:25Speaker 01

  Is different, is different than what you have and what you're doing.

• 1:39:30Dax Shepard?

  I do too.

• 1:39:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:32Dax Shepard?

  I think a lot of the bro culture without naming names.

• 1:39:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:36Dax Shepard?

  Is in deep search of masculinity.

• 1:39:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:39Dax Shepard?

  And I think I've been lucky enough to achieve a lot of that masculinity.

• 1:39:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:44Dax Shepard?

  Like, I think there's a lot of guys who act tough, who they've never challenged themselves to find out if they are. And they have this fear that they're not, and they're kind of compensating. So.

• 1:39:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:39:56Dax Shepard?

  I can hang in those circles because I am often the thing some of these guys are purporting to be, but I don't act like a blowhard. Or I try not to act like a blowhard.

• 1:40:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, but like, some people do, do put it to the test, like Rogan. Like, he goes and he's like into UFC.

• 1:40:15Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, he trains. He's, yes, yes. But his story, as I've learned from other people, is he was a bullied kid. He's short. I think he was bullied and I think he didn't want to ever feel that again. And I think he made himself strong and learned how to fight. And I think he's, he's, I'm assuming he's kind of honest about that.

• 1:40:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, but he's, he's choosing still to surround himself and build a, a, a life that's, that's still like that.

• 1:40:47Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare.

• 1:40:59Dax Shepard?

  I think it could be misleading if you only evaluate Rogan by the 15 most flagrant guests he's had. Instead of the dude's done 2,000 episodes of his show and he's also really good friends with Chappelle. He, I think he's a comedian first. He, I think if we were to interview him, I think he would most identify, he's a comedian. UFC's not. First, he's much happier in a green room with all comics.

• 1:41:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:41:26Dax Shepard?

  I think that's his allegiance in his tribe. And then I think as I'm crazy into cars, he's crazy into UFC. And then that that invites UFC fighters. Now those guys, yeah, I'm not, a lot of them, you know, I don't have much to defend about.

• 1:41:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:41:41Dax Shepard?

  Their worldview, but I don't know that it's entirely fair to graph on to Rogan, who his 15 craziest guests are, because he also has.

• 1:41:50Speaker 01

  That's fair.

• 1:41:51Dax Shepard?

  Other guests in the opposite direction. If there's anything I'll say about him, he's incredibly fair about everyone there's kind of welcome. If anything, he's just really attracted to the super provocative ideas. Sometimes they're on the left, sometimes they're on the right. He, I listened to a speech he made the other day that was like, I'm not, I'm not in either of your club. What I think is crazy is to be in a club. So I don't think he is, he himself self identifies as much as the left thinks he does with being a conservative. But I think he's a bit of a big bad wolf on the left and I don't, I personally don't think he is.

• 1:42:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, I don't know that I'll say he's a big bad wolf, but do I think he's, do I think he contributes to a culture that I think is problematic? Yes. Do I, and, and that doesn't mean he himself necessarily is that. But I think he feeds the, that group. What they want, and then they get off on it.

• 1:42:49Dax Shepard?

  Well, again, I think they listen to the 15 episodes that we would then talk about in droves. And then they.

• 1:42:56Speaker 01

  They, I mean, he obviously is the biggest show in the world.

• 1:42:59Dax Shepard?

  Oh, by, by 510x.

• 1:43:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's not, it's not that they're picking and choosing. He, he has a huge audience that he, I, I believe cares to keep as you should.

• 1:43:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:12Speaker 01

  And, and I think that means feeding, feeding it.

• 1:43:17Dax Shepard?

  See, that's where I might disagree. I don't think he's led by his audience at all. Like, I think he is actually insanely true to who he just is. That's why I respect him a lot. I don't think he's chasing that audience. I think he's him and a big swath of the country loves that.

• 1:43:35Speaker 01

  Mm hmm. Yeah.

• 1:43:37Dax Shepard?

  I see other people chasing that and trying to be opportunistic about that.

• 1:43:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:44Dax Shepard?

  And I, I just don't think that's him. I think he's been the same fucking dude for 12 years.

• 1:43:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:43:49Dax Shepard?

  On his show.

• 1:43:49Speaker 01

  I only wondered because. Again, Easter egg, we have someone coming out and we have, we have two people coming out that are, in my opinion, well, one of them especially is quite atypical ish.

• 1:44:03Dax Shepard?

  Atypical or atypical?

• 1:44:05Speaker 01

  Atypical of our guests.

• 1:44:08Dax Shepard?

  Sure, sure, sure.

• 1:44:09Speaker 01

  And the type of conversation even is different.

• 1:44:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:44:14Speaker 01

  And, and I did think, I wonder what would happen, like in an alternate universe, what would happen if I wasn't here? Not in this, in, in this show.

• 1:44:28Dax Shepard?

  Oh, uh huh.

• 1:44:29Speaker 01

  If it was Dax solo.

• 1:44:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:31Speaker 01

  What would happen with the show? Who would it be? What would it be? I mean, there's, I think there's no way to know because of like the, the alchemy, you can't, you can't tell.

• 1:44:40Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:44:40Speaker 01

  But I did, you know, after I was like, oh man, I wonder, then we went out and your friends were here, Aaron's, the Aaron's were here. And I was like, oh, I don't, it wouldn't be that.

• 1:44:52Dax Shepard?

  I think the way you can test it is I've gone on these people's shows and I'm just still me. I'm talking about trauma and addiction and being vulnerable.

• 1:45:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:01Dax Shepard?

  Even in the, the lion's den of these dudes.

• 1:45:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:45:04Dax Shepard?

  But again, I, I am, I have the gift of having done all the stuff. I don't ever feel like I need to inflate or bona fide my masculinity.

• 1:45:14Speaker 01

  Prove yourself.

• 1:45:15Dax Shepard?

  I know. I'm so comfortable, like when it goes into those zones that I actually like, if it's about cars or a great boxing match, I do like that stuff, but I don't ever need to join.

• 1:45:26Speaker 01

  You're not bragging about those things.

• 1:45:28Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:45:28Speaker 01

  But also I, but I do, I was thinking, yes, you're right. I, I think you would be talking about trauma and you would be, whatever, you know, I, I agree, you are you, but I was, and this is not a, this is not a pat on my back, because it was you who said that I should be here.

• 1:45:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:52Speaker 01

  I do think it's just so fucking important to have a woman in the room. I mean, we've had so many people.

• 1:45:58Dax Shepard?

  One that's empowered.

• 1:45:58Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:45:59Dax Shepard?

  Like if you were to guest on one of their shows, it would be dicey. I don't, you know, it would be hard.

• 1:46:05Speaker 01

  It would be hard. It would be hard.

• 1:46:09Dax Shepard?

  But these people are on your show.

• 1:46:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I, yeah, well, yeah, sorry. I mean, I mean, as hosts.

• 1:46:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:46:17Speaker 01

  Like, it is really important to have a woman there. It changes the dynamic of everything, even if I'm silent.

• 1:46:27Dax Shepard?

  Absolutely, absolutely. Now, now you, now, what I would, now I would agree with is the guest, one of the two, would have gone further. Now, I wouldn't have joined him, but he would have certainly gone further. Well, here's where we might disagree. So, yes, in this situation, of course, I couldn't be more grateful you're here at all times. And this show absolutely needs you. Now, I don't mind at all if there's a podcast with five guys talking about guy shit. That's okay. We don't need a, we don't have to have a woman there. And we don't need a man when there's a podcast of five women talking about women's shit. I don't think we need representation in all places. It's, it's plenty fine if girls have a podcast and boys have a podcast. That doesn't bother me at all.

• 1:47:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:47:09Dax Shepard?

  And boys can go ahead and talk about the UFC the whole time and who paid for dinner, all that stuff. That like, that shouldn't, that's not the enemy, I don't think.

• 1:47:19Speaker 01

  Yeah. Again, I, I don't think it's the enemy. I think they should be able to do that. I, there's, I'm not like, you can't, but I think.

• 1:47:27Dax Shepard?

  Like, if women's shows don't need a man, which they don't, I don't think men's show need a woman.

• 1:47:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, then we get into like, women are talking about the things that aren't being talked about, because that is not a group that gets a lot of attention in that way. Like, they're talking about not getting paid. That is important to talk about, right? Like, I don't think men on the men's podcasts are saying, like, yeah, women aren't getting paid.

• 1:47:55Dax Shepard?

  That's, to me, sounds like you're saying one is superior to the other. That one has an ethical drive and the other one is inane and so.

• 1:48:02Speaker 01

  No, I didn't say that's that's putting words in my mouth.

• 1:48:05Dax Shepard?

  I know. I'm telling you what it sounds like. It sounds like you're saying a women's show is needed and they're they're a part of some kind of good movement. And the men's one is is not.

• 1:48:13Speaker 01

  No, it's just representation. It's just that that group needs, they do need more platforms to talk because there aren't. There aren't that many. So it is good to have. I don't mean I'm not. I also think the women should have men on. I think it's.

• 1:48:29Dax Shepard?

  Like, I don't think The View needs a man. I don't think Alex Cooper needs a man. I think there's a.

• 1:48:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're. Yes, that's true.

• 1:48:34Dax Shepard?

  There's tons of very successful shows that are female led. And that's awesome. And they don't need anything. They are doing the show they want to do and the audience who's consuming it wants that show.

• 1:48:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, I agree.

• 1:48:49Dax Shepard?

  And I the same has to be applied to the guys.

• 1:48:52Speaker 01

  I agree. I agree. But I do think there's a lot of ideas. Currently, I mean, not even ideas. We know. We know what's happening to men. Men are suffering. They are tanking. And I don't. I often think some of these things don't help that.

• 1:49:12Speaker 01

  Personally, for them, I think they get very riled up and then they're just continuing to do to go on this course that is not going to pull them out of any of these ruts.

• 1:49:23Dax Shepard?

  I'm just saying, I don't think they have advice for how the female dominated show should be or shouldn't be. I don't think they're telling anyone how your show should be or how female shows should be. But I think a lot of those men would feel like, why are you even telling us what our show has to be? Like, just don't listen to our show. If you don't want to hear

• 1:49:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's.

• 1:49:45Dax Shepard?

  a bunch of talk about fighting and stuff. Who cares?

• 1:49:49Speaker 01

  No, the reason to care is the implication it has on a huge group of this country. Sort of a currently like kind of disenfranchised male. And they're like rallying around.

• 1:50:02Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:03Speaker 01

  And.

• 1:50:03Dax Shepard?

  I mean, as they should.

• 1:50:05Speaker 01

  But it's not working. It's not getting them out of any of these bad situations that they're in.

• 1:50:11Dax Shepard?

  I hate to say this. It is working because they got their president in there.

• 1:50:14Speaker 01

  And they're all suffering.

• 1:50:16Dax Shepard?

  I mean.

• 1:50:17Speaker 01

  Literally, all of those people are

• 1:50:20Dax Shepard?

  I'm not agree.

• 1:50:21Speaker 01

  freaking out right now because I don't have any money and they can't buy anything and everything's gone.

• 1:50:26Dax Shepard?

  I don't want Trump to be president. I don't agree with, I mean, name the thing that's going on.

• 1:50:34Dax Shepard?

  But if the disenfranchised, if you make those folks black, take them out of that they're white men. The black community totally disenfranchised. You get hip hop, you get rap, you get this empowering art that comes out of it. And for anyone who was sitting on the sidelines telling Ice Cube how he should be dealing with the situation when he's got tons of raps about shooting people and hating white people, the people that were on the outside telling him how he should deal with growing up in South Central. We would both agree they should shut the fuck up. Because that's the disenfranchised group and you're hearing their voice now. So now there's another disenfranchised group. And they're doing what generally people do that are disenfranchised. They bond together over that.

• 1:51:18Dax Shepard?

  And then they try to get someone they think is going to represent their cause. And those people won the election.

• 1:51:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. And they're gonna, and it sucks for them.

• 1:51:31Dax Shepard?

  Your opinion is they'll, they'll suffer more under this president.

• 1:51:34Speaker 01

  That is fact.

• 1:51:35Dax Shepard?

  I don't think they're going to benefit. But what I can say is we don't know the result because four years isn't up.

• 1:51:41Speaker 01

  But what we started just talking about is that they, they got their president and they did.

• 1:51:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:47Speaker 01

  And my opinion is that their president, that they all got fucking fooled. And I don't think that, I do think there's a, maybe not a responsibility. I would, I would find it to be my responsibility. If we had a show, if our show, if I started looking at our audience and I was like, hmm. Our audience is all believing something that I don't think is actually correct. And is actually going to lead them to suffer. I would want to do something here to try to help, help correct that while keeping them.

• 1:52:27Dax Shepard?

  I just think if your goal is to help this disenfranchised group, I think saying your conclusion is they got fooled, which is if I'm them and I hear you say, you all got fooled, what I'm hearing you say is you're smarter than I am and I got fooled and I'm a fool. I think a good chunk of men feel like all they've been hearing for 10 years is how terrible men are.

• 1:52:52Speaker 01

  I know, yeah.

• 1:52:53Dax Shepard?

  I really believe that.

• 1:52:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:52:55Dax Shepard?

  And I think it's pretty predictable that this group that's being told they're toxic and terrible for 10 years is going to at some point go, well, then fuck you.

• 1:53:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:08Dax Shepard?

  And I think that's what you're seeing. And I think if our continued approach is to tell all of them that they're terrible.

• 1:53:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:14Dax Shepard?

  You're going to see more of this. I think if you want young men to be on our side, you have to invite them. And I think you have to make it seem like they're welcomed and would, we'd be delighted to have them.

• 1:53:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:27Dax Shepard?

  And I think the messaging towards men over the last decade has not made a lot of them feel that way.

• 1:53:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's probably, I'm sure that's right.

• 1:53:37Dax Shepard?

  And I think even if they don't have a job, they're, let's say they're unemployed today and then they're unemployed in four years. But at least someone got up and said, hey, I'm not apologizing that I was born male and I'm sick of hearing the bullshit. Maybe that win for them would be better if they're unemployed on both sides of it.

• 1:53:54Speaker 01

  Okay, then they can live their life like that. Like that's, I.

• 1:53:58Dax Shepard?

  Well, that's a, I think that's a really.

• 1:54:01Speaker 01

  It's very unfair, in my opinion, for you to say that, like ever, so women.

• 1:54:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:54:07Speaker 01

  Have to do what women always have to do, which is placate men.

• 1:54:15Speaker 01

  Because they have the power and say like, oh my God, it's so, you guys are so great. Please come over. We, we love you.

• 1:54:25Dax Shepard?

  There's a huge gap, Monica, between you're so great and just you're so shitty. I think, and you, you could argue and win that it's justified. So, yes, I think my general feeling about women is much more positive than your general feeling about men. And you could argue that that's totally justified because they're the patriarchy, they commit the sex crimes, they do all the murdering. Those are great reasons and I, I'm not even going to argue, but I do think my overall opinion of women is higher than your overall opinion of men. And I think I, I feel it. Do you think that's an accurate assessment? That you, your overall opinion of men is much, is lower than my opinion of women?

• 1:55:05Speaker 01

  Than your overall opinion?

• 1:55:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:07Speaker 01

  Um, yeah.

• 1:55:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:09Speaker 01

  Again, but yes, for like being a woman in America, that's not, I, I mean, I, I don't know how to combat. Like you, you, you did just kind of put me in a, you did paint me in a, in a way like, yes.

• 1:55:22Dax Shepard?

  I know.

• 1:55:22Speaker 01

  Because of men.

• 1:55:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And I get it. And I get it. And it's justified. So if you're a man, and I'm a man, and yes, there are pedophiles that are men and there's rapists that are men and there's a lot of bad men. But if you paint me with the same brush as those men, if you're conflating me with those other people, now I'm a group and now I have a group identity.

• 1:55:44Speaker 01

  But that's not fair to, I don't think. We have so many men who come on this show, experts and, and celebrities. I'm not, when they walk in, I'm not like, well, I don't trust you, or I'm not sure if I like you. I, I'm like, yes, I like you until I, until.

• 1:56:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:56:04Speaker 01

  Something is said or done that I, where I don't.

• 1:56:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I never experienced it when we're interviewing a guest.

• 1:56:11Speaker 01

  No, but that's me interacting with men in the world.

• 1:56:13Dax Shepard?

  I, I experienced it when we do Armchair Anonymous and we're listening to a woman's story. That's when I observe it. What's like, there's no benefit of a doubt to the man that's being talked about. You'll generally go to, you know, they're a terrible, the girl who shit on her boyfriend and he threw up and, you know, that's where I'll notice it, where I, where I'll go like, well, I think Monica's opinion of men is pretty low. She's, you know, quick to assume the, the man in this story is the problem and not the woman, or that it would be equal.

• 1:56:45Speaker 01

  Maybe.

• 1:56:46Dax Shepard?

  And I think a lot of people feel that way. And again, men have earned that. But I'm not that man. And so many of the men are not that men. And we don't like it.

• 1:56:56Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:56:56Dax Shepard?

  Just like you wouldn't like any negative stereotype about Indians or women. You wouldn't like it.

• 1:57:02Speaker 01

  But if I'm behaving in that stereotype, I, it's for you to lump you in is a little like.

• 1:57:09Dax Shepard?

  Well, I'm a man.

• 1:57:10Speaker 01

  But I know you.

• 1:57:11Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:57:12Speaker 01

  You're my, it's not like you're a random man I know. My opinion of you is based on you and you and me. It is not about any, anything stereotypical.

• 1:57:23Dax Shepard?

  Right. I can tell you, I go to Kristen's cabaret show and there's a woman host of it. It's her show. And she does seven minutes on the world would be perfect if there was an island and it just had women on it and there was no men. And all the women clap in the audience. That's a real thing. That's totally fine to say in public right now. And in fact, gets applauded. And I'm a dude in the audience and I'm like, this is a weird, we're in a weird pattern right now, where this is not only fine, but applauded. And I'm looking at the seven men in the room and I'm like, yeah, this is weird. There's never been, it's just, if, if that was the same thing that was being done and men were

• 1:58:03Dax Shepard?

  going, dream world is an island with no women and everyone clapped, I'd go, I would go, you guys are fucked.

• 1:58:10Speaker 01

  No, I know. But, but it's, I think there's some contradictions here because also when these standups are making jokes about women or other people of other races or whatever. And in your response, which I, I think is correct, is if you don't like it, don't watch it. This is the same thing. Why, why is it, if it's a woman doing it, it's like, that's really bad. But the, when men say something sexist, you can, you say like, well, just, yeah, that's not for you. Don't watch it.

• 1:58:44Dax Shepard?

  No, I'm never laughing that a guy goes, women suck and men should all be together. I've never enjoyed a standup routine or laughed at a joke that that was that complicated. Her entire thing was just, wouldn't it be great if there were no men? Now, had she crafted an incredible joke and it was funny, I would laugh at it for sure. I don't have that big of a chip on my shoulder. I'm just saying, that's a weird vibe and I'm in that kind of often. And I'm pretty evolved and I still go, ugh, this is, I don't want to be a man in this room. I don't know why you hate men across the board. I don't think you should hate me. And I am semi-evolved, so I'm imagining all these other kids that are unemployed and hearing that sentiment and just going like, okay, I guess it's us against them.

• 1:59:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't think most of the people in the country are hearing the woman at the cabaret show. I think that's very Los Angeles and very New York. I don't think that is happening.

• 1:59:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but do you agree at all that that's a weird thing or no?

• 1:59:43Speaker 01

  What's a, to say that?

• 1:59:44Dax Shepard?

  The cabaret show I went to.

• 1:59:46Speaker 01

  I think it's silly. I don't agree with that, but I think her saying it is, is not, is, yeah, when some people are saying it, just like men are saying bad shit too. And I, and I'm just like, if we're gonna say that it's okay for those people to be saying those things and we just can like have, you know, we cannot listen or they can speak to their people.

• 2:00:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:00:10Speaker 01

  Then I think that has to be allowed anywhere.

• 2:00:13Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, I'm only pointing out that that's happening.

• 2:00:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, again, it's happening on both sides.

• 2:00:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:20Speaker 01

  Like crazy.

• 2:00:21Dax Shepard?

  But I, and I don't think that, that cabaret host needs a male and present. She's fine to do that and her followers.

• 2:00:28Speaker 01

  She probably does fucking need a man there that she likes. She does. That, actually, that's exact, that's a perfect point. If she had someone there that she did trust and know and like that was a man.

• 2:00:39Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 2:00:40Speaker 01

  I doubt that would be her opinion. But the fact that she is so potentially, I don't know anything about this person, but is so siloed off and.

• 2:00:51Speaker 01

  And that so much so that that is her opinion that the world would be would be better with no men.

• 2:00:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:57Speaker 01

  That to me is an indication that she needs to have some more men in her life that are good.

• 2:01:01Dax Shepard?

  I think that's a some, I don't think that's a single digit opinion.

• 2:01:05Speaker 01

  But it's but it to me, that is a silo. That's an issue with silos. And that's exactly my whole problem with these shows that are, I think, intensifying a silo. And I think you're right. It is happening on both sides.

• 2:01:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:22Speaker 01

  Where people are only speaking to one group and these thoughts are getting and opinions are getting so extreme. Like, we should eradicate entire sex and gender.

• 2:01:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:32Speaker 01

  Like, no, that's wild.

• 2:01:34Dax Shepard?

  I just think it's a real bad idea for just squaring off like, okay, it's on. It's men against women. And I think a lot of people feel that way. And I think that's a bad.

• 2:01:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:01:45Dax Shepard?

  I think that's gonna have a bad fucking outcome.

• 2:01:47Speaker 01

  Bad. And I this like now after an hour is circling back to the what I was saying, which is, I think there would be less of it's men versus women if men and women were in rooms together a lot more and building trust.

• 2:02:00Dax Shepard?

  I do too.

• 2:02:01Speaker 01

  Oh, my God. A long walk there.

• 2:02:05Dax Shepard?

  It was an entertaining walk. I think a lot of people will have heard their opinions voiced.

• 2:02:09Speaker 01

  Okay, facts. Lauren, sweet Lauren.

• 2:02:14Dax Shepard?

  Lauren Graham. Boy, we got a taste of her, what she was saying with the young kids watching Gilmore Girls. Because she left the garage and we were in the yard and Delta had a friend over from school.

• 2:02:25Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 2:02:26Dax Shepard?

  And that friend was freaking the fuck out. Delta was like,

• 2:02:28Speaker 01

  She was.

• 2:02:29Dax Shepard?

  Is Lauren on a show called Gilmore? What is it? Gilmore Girls. And I'm like, yeah, she the Gilmore Girl.

• 2:02:37Speaker 01

  Oh, that it's still going.

• 2:02:39Dax Shepard?

  An 11 year old.

• 2:02:41Speaker 01

  That's really cute. Um, yeah, special to be on a show that just like keeps finding its audience.

• 2:02:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:48Speaker 01

  All right. So the book club, Jenna Bush Hager's book club. These are the books, The Wedding People, Blue Sisters, The Mighty Red, The Motherless Land, Devotions, The Life Cycle of the Common Octopus, and This Is a Love Story. Those are the last, that's from August of last year till now.

• 2:03:08Dax Shepard?

  Have you read any of those?

• 2:03:09Speaker 01

  No, I'm still reading Intermezzo.

• 2:03:12Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:03:13Speaker 01

  So.

• 2:03:13Dax Shepard?

  So stay tuned.

• 2:03:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, and we'll come back to you next week with that riddle. How long has May been in show business? Ninety-four, When a Man Loves a Woman, she was six.

• 2:03:22Dax Shepard?

  Okay, thirty-one years.

• 2:03:24Speaker 01

  Oof.

• 2:03:25Dax Shepard?

  Thirty wonderful years.

• 2:03:26Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:03:27Dax Shepard?

  That's crazy.

• 2:03:28Speaker 01

  And then ninety-three.

• 2:03:29Dax Shepard?

  She beat me by a decade.

• 2:03:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, she was on Friends. And then Lauren was in ninety-three, so she did beat her by one year.

• 2:03:36Dax Shepard?

  Okay, thirty-two years.

• 2:03:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, the Howie Mandel game show that they went to visit is called Take It All.

• 2:03:46Dax Shepard?

  Did they take it all? Oh, they were just watching, they weren't contestants.

• 2:03:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't think they were contestants. But this is ding ding ding, sort of back to that riddle that we haven't shared. Um, Take It All is a game show where the final two contestants choose between keeping their money or taking it all. The contestant who chooses Take It All wins all the money and prizes from both contestants. If both contestants choose Take It All, they both lose.

• 2:04:10Dax Shepard?

  Prisoner Games.

• 2:04:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly, Zombardo.

• 2:04:13Dax Shepard?

  Non-cooperate, non-cooperative.

• 2:04:14Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 2:04:16Dax Shepard?

  Games.

• 2:04:16Speaker 01

  Oh, the SNL four-part series, SNL fifty, Beyond Saturday Night, includes an episode that explores the Saturday night live audition process. It's on Peacock, if anyone is interested. The movie she did with Joel McHale, A Merry Friggin' Christmas with Robin Williams. How long did This Is Us run? Six seasons, one hundred and six episodes. You guys ran six seasons, one hundred and three episodes.

• 2:04:41Dax Shepard?

  Oh, they beat us.

• 2:04:43Speaker 01

  Barely.

• 2:04:43Dax Shepard?

  Just resumed Paradise last night, same writer.

• 2:04:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:04:46Dax Shepard?

  Episode eight was banger.

• 2:04:48Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm behind then.

• 2:04:49Dax Shepard?

  Oh, oh. Yeah, it's bad, it's all caught up to what our screeners were.

• 2:04:54Speaker 01

  Oh, great.

• 2:04:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, tasty, we all watched it, the Aarons, the girls, me last night. Yeah, Aaron was on his second viewing of it. You know, Aaron sees absolutely every show.

• 2:05:06Speaker 01

  That's good.

• 2:05:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:08Speaker 01

  I think that's fun.

• 2:05:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:11Speaker 01

  Oh, man. Yeah, well, I'm excited. I'm excited to keep watching. Um, all right, that's it.

• 2:05:17Dax Shepard?

  That was all?

• 2:05:17Speaker 01

  Lauren.

• 2:05:18Dax Shepard?

  All right. We love you, Lauren.

• 2:05:20Speaker 01

  We really do. She's a nice...

• 2:05:21Dax Shepard?

  I really love you.

• 2:05:22Speaker 01

  I really want her banana bread.

• 2:05:24Dax Shepard?

  Me, too, but I can't even have it.

• 2:05:27Speaker 01

  If she brings it, you have to eat some. This is Letterman all over again.

• 2:05:31Dax Shepard?

  I had to put a tux on.

• 2:05:33Speaker 01

  Yep, that's right.

• 2:05:35Dax Shepard?

  All right.

• 2:05:36Speaker 01

  Okay, love you.