No Such Thing As A Sea Cucumber In A Haunted House

In our SPOOOKY Halloween special, Dan, James, Anna and Andy discuss coffins, spirits, zombies and jump-scares. Visit nosuchthingasafish.com http://nosuchthingasafish.com for news about live shows, merchandise and more episodes. Join Club Fish for ad-free episodes and exclusive bonus content at apple.co/nosuchthingasafish http://apple.co/nosuchthingasafish or nosuchthingasafish.com/patreon http://nosuchthingasafish.com/patreon Edited by James Harkin Produced by Leying Lee Team includes Tara Dorrell, Joe Mayo and Ethan Ruparelia

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Stop the podcast.

• 0:01Dan Schreiber?

  Stop the podcast.

• 0:02Speaker 00

  Hi, everybody. We are sponsored this week by Progressive.

• 0:05Dan Schreiber?

  That's right. So, everyone talks about how challenging it is to raise kids, but what about protecting them? I'm talking outlet covers, kitchen cabinet locks, baby gates. Where do you even start?

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• 0:22Dan Schreiber?

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• 0:27Speaker 00

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• 0:32Dan Schreiber?

  Don't wait. Get your quote today at progressive.com.

• 0:35Speaker 00

  Progressive Casualty Insurance Company affiliates and other insurers, not available in all states. On with the show.

• 0:41Speaker 02

  Chat GPT for Teens is designed to help teens learn, think critically and grow their skills. Chat GPT for Teens supports active learning by breaking concepts down, rather than giving teens the answer. Study mode helps teens work through problems and interactive quizzes test their knowledge and provide immediate feedback. Safety protections are on by default and parental controls offer families additional options like setting study hours and quiet hours. Visit chatgpt.com slash parents to learn more.

• 1:12Dan Schreiber?

  Hi, guys. Andy here. Before this week's show starts, I have a very exciting announcement to make, which is that I have written a book and it's out in a few days' time. It's brand new. I know many of you have bought my previous books and I'm so grateful you did. I hope you enjoyed them. This one is the book that I have wanted to write for about 20 years and have spent the last five years actually writing. It's about the idea that there are a million lives you could have lived, but only one you can live right now. It's funny and sad and true. I think it might be the most personal thing I've ever written. If you like Douglas Adams or Terry Pratchett, the way they make you laugh and make you think, this might be the one for you. I'd say it's also got notes of Matt Haig and Dungeon Crawler Carl.

• 1:56Dan Schreiber?

  The title of this new book of mine is Everything Happens So Much. It's about to hit shops in the UK and in the USA, under my new pen name, Andrew H Murray. If you search Everything Happens So Much, you should find it. In the UK, Waterstones and your nearest independent bookseller will have special signed copies. And if you prefer to listen to your books, the audiobook is read by the fantastic Izzy Sooty. You will know her from Peep Show and so much more. She has done a terrific job. She's absolutely nailed it. I'm so proud of this book, guys. This is November, so all the big guns have their own books out. But if you buy this book for yourself or for the fish fan in your life for Christmas, I can guarantee

• 2:37Dan Schreiber?

  you will give them a wonderful read. And if you order it now, a few days before publication, that will make a huge difference to its visibility. And finally, free me up to write the book of a thousand and one things that are surprisingly named after a person. Thanks again for this. The title once again is Everything Happens So Much. And now on with our spooky Halloween podcast.

• 3:11Dan Schreiber?

  Hello and welcome to another episode of No Such Thing As A Fish, a weekly podcast coming to you from the QI offices in Holborn. My name is Dan Schreiber. I am sitting here with Andrew Hunter Murray, James Harkin and Anna Tashinsky. And once again, we have gathered round the microphone, but this time for our very special Halloween show. So we've brought our four fav- thank you, Andy. We've brought our four favorite spooky facts from the last seven days. And in a particular order, here we go. With fact number one, and that is Andy. My fact is that some 17th century coffins have faces.

• 3:51Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 3:52Dan Schreiber?

  Do the whole show in that voice.

• 3:56Dan Schreiber?

  Let me take you to Farley Hungerford Castle in Somerset.

• 4:01Speaker 00

  Oh, have you been there?

• 4:02Dan Schreiber?

  I haven't been there, but I do want to go. But I will read the National Trust book as a, just as a non-combatant, you know, just to find out what's on at all the places. Just to find out if you want to go sometimes.

• 4:12Speaker 00

  And is that where you got this, from that book?

• 4:13Dan Schreiber?

  Exactly. So I was reading, I was just reading the entries about what's, what the National Trust has on its books. And they've got, in this place, Farley Hungerford Castle, these human-shaped lead coffins, which have these quite crude faces stamped into them or molded out of them. And they look really eerie. They're from the 17th century, around the time of the Civil War, proper Civil War, English Civil War. And the point about these coffins is that bodies were put in them and they would be embalmed in spirits. Another ghosty word.

• 4:42Speaker 00

  Spirits in spirits.

• 4:43Dan Schreiber?

  And I think the idea was to keep you together for resurrection, to keep you all united for resurrection. So you might and this actually is a belief that dates back to, I think, to ancient Egypt. The reason their coffins are all human-shaped was that if your body crumbled or if the mummification didn't work, at least you had your coffin, which was shaped like you, which had a face.

• 5:02Speaker 00

  Cause like, like you say, the Egyptians had faces on their coffins. Romans, some of them did as well. Like, it's, it's not that massively uncommon in history that people put faces on coffins.

• 5:13Dan Schreiber?

  No, you're right. But in the UK, quite unusual, I think.

• 5:15Speaker 00

  Yeah. And wait, you're saying the idea was that if your body inside is totally disintegrated, you can't resurrect just a hip bone. So you get the coffin instead, because it's less gross.

• 5:25Dan Schreiber?

  That was the Egyptian idea, certainly. And some Egyptian coffins had little wooden hands pegged to the sides, which

• 5:31Speaker 00

  Really?

• 5:31Dan Schreiber?

  Quite fun, actually.

• 5:32Speaker 00

  What were they for?

• 5:33Dan Schreiber?

  Just to be your hands in the next life.

• 5:35Speaker 00

  Oh, I see, right.

• 5:36Dan Schreiber?

  Just in case you needed hands. And I was on the National Trust's website where they talk about this. And apparently, uh, this is what they say. They drilled holes into these coffins. They'd give you a straw and you could taste the embalmed alcohol.

• 5:50Speaker 00

  Yummy.

• 5:51Dan Schreiber?

  Have a little sip. That's changed, that's changed these, that the National Trust no longer.

• 5:56Speaker 00

  Not even if you're a member.

• 5:57Dan Schreiber?

  Cause of woke.

• 5:59Speaker 00

  I thought if you're a member, you've got free parking and you've got to taste the embalming fluid. Taste the member.

• 6:06Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 6:08Speaker 00

  But then surely that will slowly over time remove the embalming fluid.

• 6:12Dan Schreiber?

  I think it did. And I think that's why they don't do it anymore.

• 6:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 6:14Dan Schreiber?

  And I think probably it was only ever something for the very bravest National Trust members to do.

• 6:20Dan Schreiber?

  And I can't work out what that would do to you. Would you have a bad day the next day on the toilet? Would it potentially kill you if you had too much of that stuff?

• 6:27Speaker 00

  I think if you had too much of anything, it'll kill you. And that stuff was for sure. But I think actually if it's spirits, it probably Just get you pissed? Yeah. Lovely.

• 6:36Dan Schreiber?

  Wow. This place, Farley, is, uh, it's pretty spooky, because they've got all these stories from the past. So the people who were buried are the Hungerfords. There was one guy who was called Sir Edward Hungerford. And his second wife was a widow who was living there. Her name was Agnes Cottle. Agnes Cottle murdered her first husband in Farley.

• 6:57Speaker 00

  And then he married, he decided that she was safe to marry.

• 7:00Dan Schreiber?

  There was a big old question of whether or not he was complicit to it. But what happened was is that they put him into the fire in the kitchen, into the furnace and just The first husband.

• 7:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 7:14Dan Schreiber?

  The husband that was killed.

• 7:15Speaker 00

  Yes. Otherwise, he's like, damn it, I knew I should have listened to all my friends who said she was a murderer. This was the worst, worst night ever.

• 7:23Dan Schreiber?

  Okay, so, so, oh, right. So, Dan, I just want to point out. Yeah. When you started speaking about Sir Edward Hungerford and his widow and the murder, that exit light started flickering. There's a little green exit light and it started flickering on and off and it's still flickering a bit now. And so is it, is it Edward Hungerford? What's he doing here? You know?

• 7:41Speaker 00

  Maybe the picture of that guy on the fire escape fleeing out of the door is based on Edward Hungerford.

• 7:46Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 7:47Speaker 00

  That's him.

• 7:47Dan Schreiber?

  I've always wondered who that's based on. So that might be

• 7:50Speaker 00

  Sir Ted.

• 7:50Dan Schreiber?

  That might be true.

• 7:52Speaker 00

  Um, Dan, I actually didn't get the swearing on the fire bit. Wait, so

• 7:56Dan Schreiber?

  They got a kitchen, it was a Sweeney Todd style. They threw, you know,

• 7:58Speaker 00

  The corpse?

• 7:59Dan Schreiber?

  The corpse of the first husband into the fire to get rid of the body. And then she was just widowed. And it was only after he died, when she became a widow a second time, she was found guilty of the murder for the first husband. Yeah.

• 8:11Speaker 00

  Ah.

• 8:12Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah. So it's got a lot of spooky stuff there. Sounds spooky.

• 8:14Speaker 00

  Nice.

• 8:15Dan Schreiber?

  Very spooky.

• 8:16Speaker 00

  Um, other coffins that sort of have the corpse's picture on them were in Australia. This is, I didn't know about these, but this is tree trunk coffins. And these seem to exist in archaeology all over the place. There are quite a lot in Britain dug up in the Bronze Age. People who are just buried inside tree trunks, you dig it out. But in Australia, the Yongu people of the Northern Territory, they bury people in tree trunks for millennia, but they're naturally hollowed out by termites. And so you get to like, you lift the body up and you slot it all the way in. And then they put a little window in for them to look out of. And then they decorate the tree trunk with the tattoos that were on the person's body.

• 8:55Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, that's so cool.

• 8:56Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's a bit like a, like a robot outfit.

• 8:58Dan Schreiber?

  That's how the didgeridoos are made as well, isn't it? Like termites hollowing out tree trunks.

• 9:02Speaker 00

  Right.

• 9:03Dan Schreiber?

  Didn't know that. Really? Fairly sure, yeah. That's awesome.

• 9:06Speaker 00

  That'd be a very skinny person for the didgeridoo.

• 9:09Dan Schreiber?

  It would.

• 9:09Speaker 00

  Bury them in the didgeridoo.

• 9:11Dan Schreiber?

  Do you know what the difference is between a coffin and a casket? Because I didn't until I researched this fact. I just thought it was a, a word that was used in America, casket versus coffin. They're completely different things. They're not completely different. Let me row back. They're both used for the storage and transportation of dead bodies. Coffins have six sides. They're hexagonal, which is interesting, isn't it? When you think we're all buried in hexagons. That's, that is interesting. Sides.

• 9:35Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 9:35Dan Schreiber?

  And then the shoulder bit at the top and then the top. Yes. Six sides. Okay. That's a hexagon. Call me a liar. You can't. Right. Caskets are rectangular when viewed from above. Yeah, I see. And they were, they were brought in supposedly because people were a bit grossed out that coffins are slightly anthropometric, i.e. person-shaped. Yeah, yeah. But actually, I mean, I don't think many people have really found that off-putting or disturbing in any way.

• 9:59Speaker 00

  It's really unusual that the anthropometric one came first, because presumably it's much easier to make a rectangular coffin, right?

• 10:07Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they're a bit grander. They're a bit, they're often a bit bigger and they've got that big lid that opens. Yeah. It's like looking at modern day architecture. Like the old town of London is stunning, right? Versus these kind of new builds that look a bit more

• 10:21Speaker 00

  Completely disagree. I love like

• 10:22Dan Schreiber?

  You love a new build.

• 10:23Speaker 00

  Twentieth century architecture.

• 10:24Dan Schreiber?

  Wow.

• 10:25Speaker 00

  So hang on, you like the recta- you like the caskets?

• 10:27Dan Schreiber?

  You love a casket.

• 10:27Speaker 00

  You're all about the coffins, Dan.

• 10:28Dan Schreiber?

  I'm a coffin man. I'm going to be put in a niche. And what's that? A crack in the ground or space under a tree root or something. Just pop me in there. Your whole body? Yeah.

• 10:36Speaker 00

  Is that a thing that people do or?

• 10:37Dan Schreiber?

  It's a thing people used to do.

• 10:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, okay.

• 10:39Dan Schreiber?

  Before the coffin.

• 10:40Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 10:40Dan Schreiber?

  And I think it sounds rather charming.

• 10:41Speaker 00

  For me, a niche would normally be a small part of a room, like a little corner of a room.

• 10:46Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah. Wouldn't mind that, wouldn't mind that depending on the room. Don't want to go in the utility room, probably. So you want to go in a hole? That's like, that might be a solution for all the pothole problems in London. When you're dead, just pop you in a pothole.

• 10:56Speaker 00

  Sorted.

• 10:57Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 10:57Speaker 00

  It's not quite the natural thing I was thinking of.

• 11:00Dan Schreiber?

  But you like cycling. I love cycling. The worst thing for cyclists is a big old pothole. That's very true. So you would be helping your fellow cyclists. I would love that.

• 11:08Speaker 00

  And I would happily ride over you time after time.

• 11:12Dan Schreiber?

  So coffins with faces.

• 11:15Speaker 03

  Brings us to Egypt, obviously, sarcophaguses. I probably would have realised this, but didn't really think about it, that the images didn't look like the person who was inside, right? Tutankhamun didn't really look like that.

• 11:28Speaker 00

  Didn't have a gold face?

• 11:30Speaker 03

  He didn't have a gold face. They were basically idealised to make them look more like Osiris, who was like the god of death or whatever he was, the god of the underworld. So it looked a little bit like him, but not much. Now, if you weren't the pharaoh, then it probably looked nothing like you and might have looked actually more like the pharaoh. And the main reason seems to be, this is according to something I read from the website of Leeds Museum, because they have a mummy from the reign of Ramses the 11th. And they said that the coffin makers would use the same face almost all the time, because then they only had to memorise one face. And so like when Ramses the 11th was in charge, everyone had to have one that looked a bit like him.

• 12:12Speaker 03

  So you might still, you know, if you had sideburns and glasses, they might do Ramses the 11th with sideburns and glasses to make it look a little bit like you, but mostly you'd look like him.

• 12:21Dan Schreiber?

  That's nice. And that'd be a great version of Guess Who, wouldn't it? Where you've got all these sarcophaguses in front of you.

• 12:26Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 12:27Dan Schreiber?

  Does he look like Ramses the 11th?

• 12:29Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 12:30Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, great.

• 12:34Speaker 04

  Um, there are three sea graveyards in the UK. Didn't realise that.

• 12:38Speaker 03

  What's that?

• 12:39Speaker 04

  So let's say that you're, the deceased, uh, loved the ocean, maybe was in, uh, the navy or something and they want to be buried at sea. There were three official spots where you can bring a coffin out there and dump it into a graveyard as such.

• 12:52Speaker 03

  Gravesend? Is that one of them?

• 12:54Speaker 04

  It's not, it should be. It's, uh, New Haven in East Sussex, uh, the Needles Spoil Ground near the Isle of Wight and Tynmouth, Tyne and Wear. Um, those are the three spots. And the reason for this is they've designated that so that the tide doesn't carry a body back into the bay. You don't want bodies just rocking up, right?

• 13:14Speaker 00

  No.

• 13:15Dan Schreiber?

  So do you go, they didn't bury the coffin at sea? Did they put you in at sea without, without a coffin?

• 13:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think, I think it's just you, but I, I think if you did have a coffin, it needed to be really solidly held together so that the body doesn't escape.

• 13:29Speaker 03

  Escape?

• 13:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, you know, zombie.

• 13:31Dan Schreiber?

  Are you weighed down? You must be, otherwise you'd just float at sea.

• 13:35Speaker 03

  This is crazy.

• 13:36Speaker 00

  Yeah, wow.

• 13:37Speaker 03

  Or do they not burn people and then put the ashes down there? Or do they do like the Vikings did and then put you in a boat and set it on fire?

• 13:44Dan Schreiber?

  That's the dream, isn't it?

• 13:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, so no, it's, it's the body in this case, because you are allowed to just scatter ashes at any point in the sea. That's, that's a legal thing. Uh, well.

• 13:52Speaker 00

  Well, you can scatter ashes anywhere you like.

• 13:54Dan Schreiber?

  No, you can't. Oh my goodness. I know you have, I know you will have done, but there are all sorts of places which say, can you please stop scattering ashes here? Because there are lots of beauty spots where just people come and they're so popular that actually the ground is, is slightly sludgy now because everyone's done it.

• 14:09Speaker 03

  It's quite self-selecting because eventually they become so sludgy and ashy that no one wants to have their ashes put there anymore.

• 14:14Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, yeah. I can't believe you can be buried at sea.

• 14:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, and sorry, just a few more details on that. So it is bodies that go in and so they make sure it's these spots because you can, some bodies can occasionally drift and if they do drift, they can go into shore. So you also have to have identification tags on the person in case they do rock up on a, on a beachfront and you can go, oh, we know exactly who this is. So yeah, that is done. By the way, just related, have you heard of Coffin Bay Cemetery in South Australia?

• 14:41Speaker 03

  No.

• 14:41Speaker 04

  Okay. Do you know why it's called Coffin Bay Cemetery?

• 14:44Speaker 03

  Why?

• 14:45Speaker 04

  Because of Admiral Sir Isaac Coffin.

• 14:47Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 14:47Speaker 04

  First Baronet, Officer of the Royal Navy.

• 14:54Dan Schreiber?

  Brilliant.

• 14:57Speaker 00

  Stop the podcast.

• 14:58Dan Schreiber?

  Stop the podcast.

• 15:00Speaker 00

  Hi, everybody. We are sponsored this week by Progressive.

• 15:03Dan Schreiber?

  That's right. So everyone talks about how challenging it is to raise kids, but what about protecting them? I'm talking outlet covers, kitchen cabinet locks, baby gates. Where do you even start?

• 15:13Speaker 00

  Yes, it is a nightmare. Well, protecting your home and your auto is a great place to start.

• 15:20Dan Schreiber?

  Progressive offers customised coverage options so you can be sure you have the right coverage for you and your loved ones.

• 15:25Speaker 00

  They're basically the outlet covers, kitchen cabinet locks and baby gates of insurance.

• 15:30Dan Schreiber?

  Don't wait, get your quote today at progressive.com.

• 15:33Speaker 00

  Progressive Casualty Insurance Company affiliates and other insurers, not available in all states. On with the show.

• 15:40Speaker 05

  Hi, I'm Jenna Ashkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.

• 15:54Speaker 03

  People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.

• 16:05Speaker 05

  And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you, you're not alone.

• 16:10Speaker 03

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorise all my food allergies.

• 16:16Speaker 05

  So join us and hear their stories and more, because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat, it's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At the Table, the food allergy podcast on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At the Table and start listening on the free iHeart radio app today.

• 16:38Speaker 04

  Okay, it is time for fact number two, and that is my fact. My fact this week is that for the last 30 years, a group of scientists have been trying their best to scare one specific lady.

• 16:51Speaker 00

  Imagine if she doesn't know and it's just that she keeps on being like, I just had the most horrible day again. What's going on? Piano fell out the sky just in front of me, saw five ghosts.

• 17:02Dan Schreiber?

  Clowns are back.

• 17:04Speaker 04

  Well, this is, this is kind of, uh, what they were trying to do. Um, this is, this is a lady who is only known as SM by the initials SM.

• 17:13Speaker 03

  Sarah Milligan.

• 17:14Speaker 04

  Sarah Milligan. Spike Milligan.

• 17:16Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 17:18Speaker 04

  Um, she's in her early 60s, that's what we know about her, um, but she's wanted to remain anonymous, but back in 1994, it was discovered that she's had a complete destruction of her amygdala in her brain. That's the bit that helps us to identify fear and so on, but with that gone, she just doesn't experience it. And so she's become known as the woman with no fear within the scientific community, uh, and one of the most neurologically important patients that they've had for the last few decades, because she's up for being studied. They do take her to haunted houses and make her walk through it and see if anything jump scares her. They do bring her to pet shops and they get animals like snakes and spiders put in front of her and she picks them up and just nothing doesn't register as anything.

• 18:02Speaker 03

  It feels like they're the same study, right?

• 18:04Dan Schreiber?

  It's, it's crazy. They keep doing things that would scare a normal person and she keeps on not being scared.

• 18:09Speaker 03

  This'll do it, this'll do it, guys. Why don't we?

• 18:12Speaker 00

  It's the same idea.

• 18:13Dan Schreiber?

  What if we play her some scary music? I don't think if she touched a tarantula, the scary music is gonna hack it.

• 18:18Speaker 03

  The tarantula thing's kind of interesting because she knows that it's scary and knows that spiders and snakes can be dangerous, but when you actually give them to her, she doesn't get scared. So it's not like she doesn't know they're scary, she just doesn't find them scary and her body doesn't react in the same way that our bodies would.

• 18:36Dan Schreiber?

  Exactly. So she, that was a bit where she was attacked at knife point and that was a very scary situation to be in, but she wasn't scared. And when the ordeal ended, she just walked off, she didn't run off, she just walked away. It's really strange.

• 18:47Speaker 04

  So we've, we've mentioned that before on a show, but what, what's worth pointing out is that wasn't part of the study. That was a rare, that was a, that was an event that happened in real life.

• 18:56Speaker 03

  Probably thought it was the scientists. She's like, oh, you guys again.

• 18:59Dan Schreiber?

  That's a thing she won't know now, will she? Genuine danger.

• 19:02Speaker 00

  I don't think, I just want to say in Defence of Science, you're definitely not allowed to randomly attack someone at knife point without them knowing they're being attacked. But she does have quite a lot of, um, unpleasant experiences for two reasons. She comes from quite a rough place that has a lot of crime anyway, but also if you don't feel fear, there's a reason we feel it, obviously, so we can escape difficult situations. So she just approaches them. And I find it really interesting that it's particularly with people and personal space where she's completely comfortable going nose to nose with someone, like touching the nose of a total stranger, she feels comfortable.

• 19:36Dan Schreiber?

  With her, with her nose?

• 19:38Speaker 00

  With her own nose, yeah.

• 19:39Speaker 03

  It's weird, she's, she's really comfortable on a panel with Rory Stewart. It's amazing.

• 19:47Speaker 04

  Have you seen that video of him this week?

• 19:49Speaker 00

  No. Oh, yes, I have.

• 19:51Speaker 04

  He just stares at this lady.

• 19:54Dan Schreiber?

  It's not even the stare, it's the thrust.

• 19:58Speaker 00

  But yeah, her ideal distance to be from someone, I think, is 1.1 feet, which is about half

• 20:03Speaker 03

  Ooh, that's close.

• 20:04Speaker 00

  as far as most of us. So, very awkward person to talk to.

• 20:09Speaker 03

  Yes. She has something called Urbach-Vief disease. That's what they call this thing, where you're not really scared of anything. And that's named after two people. They were both Austrian. One of them is Erich Urbach, who was head physician in a dermatology department in Vienna. But he had to escape Nazi persecution and ran to the United States in 1938. And Camille Wither served as a frontline physician during World War I. So they both, in their lives, had quite extreme fear, I would say. And then they studied this and gave it the day.

• 20:44Speaker 00

  And they have found the one thing so far that can scare them, haven't they? They did a study a few years ago where they exposed her to carbon dioxide inhalation. And that triggers a reaction in your brain that makes you think you're suffocating, even though you're not, because our brain can't detect an absence of oxygen. It can just detect too much carbon dioxide. And so they made SM inhale 35%. As in, they didn't make her, she can always say no to this. They asked her to inhale 35% carbon dioxide and she had a panic attack. And not only was she terrified, she was more terrified than most people are. And they actually did this experiment on two other people who have her illness as well. And they also had that reaction. And so it seems like it's something to do with, like, that fear is triggered by an internal

• 21:28Speaker 00

  chemical signature, because it's something that's going inside your body, rather than something you've seen or something you've heard.

• 21:33Speaker 04

  So they succeeded.

• 21:34Speaker 00

  She was terrified, they succeeded.

• 21:35Dan Schreiber?

  I don't know if they're still studying the lady.

• 21:38Speaker 04

  They, she seems to still be a part of studies, not for fear, but just for other elements now to do with the condition.

• 21:44Dan Schreiber?

  There have only been about 300 cases recorded, haven't there? It's a very, very rare thing, or only a few hundred in the medical literature. Here is an example of some people who like fear. This is an interesting one.

• 21:56Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 21:56Dan Schreiber?

  If you're on a date, fear can be a good thing.

• 22:00Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 22:00Dan Schreiber?

  So there was an experiment in the 80s by Dolph Zilman and Norbert Mundorf. Just good, normal names.

• 22:10Dan Schreiber?

  They showed a load of male students, I think this was American college students. The film Friday the 13th, Part Three, which I gather is a spooky one. And they were paired up with a female partner, right? Now, unbeknownst to the men, the students who were watching the film, the female partner was actually a scientist, a research assistant. Okay, so they were a-

• 22:29Speaker 03

  But then she took off her glasses and they went, "Oh my god, you're beautiful."

• 22:36Dan Schreiber?

  And so the women could control their responses based on the, because what the scientists wanted, right? And if the women showed distress during the film, the men reported enjoying the film twice as much.

• 22:45Speaker 03

  Oh, really?

• 22:47Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 22:47Speaker 04

  Yes. Why? I'm in that category. Can I give you my reason for why I am on that side?

• 22:54Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 22:54Speaker 04

  And see if it matches up with the science. So creep, thank you, thank you, James. Creep is one.

• 23:00Speaker 04

  No, I, on a date, if you are watching a scary movie, it tends to mean that your partner, if they are scared, might, like, hold into you. And that's a really fun experience on a date.

• 23:12Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 23:13Speaker 04

  So, yeah.

• 23:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 23:14Speaker 04

  That, for me, is a better experience. If I'm out with Fenella and we're watching a scary movie and she grabs at me because she's scared, that's great.

• 23:20Speaker 00

  Did the researchers jump into his lap?

• 23:21Speaker 03

  Yeah. So is that what they said? Is it about tricking people into hiding?

• 23:25Speaker 04

  It's not tricking, it's a by-product.

• 23:31Dan Schreiber?

  Let's just gloss over. That's nice.

• 23:34Speaker 03

  Whereas I think it's nice because they wet themselves.

• 23:39Dan Schreiber?

  God.

• 23:39Speaker 04

  And then the actual hot guy's going, "Be like, you're disgusting, go away." And I'm, I'm the only option left.

• 23:46Speaker 00

  Is that it?

• 23:47Dan Schreiber?

  And that's how I met your mother.

• 23:53Speaker 00

  Why? Why do they enjoy it? I would actually imagine it is about the vulnerability of the person next to you, makes you feel closer to them.

• 23:59Dan Schreiber?

  So, yeah, that probably is something. And in fact, this is interesting, they did it on women undergraduates too. So actual women undergraduates who were paired with male researchers. And apparently the women reported that they enjoyed the film more if their male companion appeared calm. So that is actually the opposite, you know?

• 24:13Speaker 03

  I remember reading studies, like, they sent people on dates, I think they might have even made TV shows out of this, where you put them in a scary situation, like, on top of a tight rope or something, and they're having dinner on top of a tight rope, tight rope, and that's supposed to make you, because you've had a shared experience.

• 24:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 24:29Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, yeah.

• 24:30Speaker 00

  That makes sense. I think, I think there is research that shows horror film is a good thing to go to, or a scare house. I, what I don't like about all these studies is that they assume things that aren't objectively scary are scary, such as Halloween 3, or whatever that film was. You know, they always pick quite crap films. Or, you know, who's really been scared of a haunted house over the age of nine? But I mean, you get, like, jump scares.

• 24:50Dan Schreiber?

  Not me.

• 24:50Speaker 00

  Okay?

• 24:51Dan Schreiber?

  For sure.

• 24:52Speaker 03

  Like, but jump scares affect anyone. It's Halloween now, you go to the cinema, watch a horror movie, people will jump when the jump scares come.

• 24:59Speaker 04

  Yeah, exactly.

• 25:00Dan Schreiber?

  I had to stop watching that film, The Woman in Black, and that stars literally Harry Potter, Daniel Radcliffe.

• 25:04Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 25:05Dan Schreiber?

  Right?

• 25:06Speaker 04

  It is a scary movie, though.

• 25:07Speaker 00

  It is scary. He's not wearing his wizard's hat.

• 25:10Dan Schreiber?

  I know, I was 40 minutes in and I just got a bit spooked and had to turn it off. And that's fine.

• 25:14Speaker 00

  That's unbelievable.

• 25:15Speaker 04

  But there is a thing as well, that if you meet someone in scary situations, in slightly traumatic moments, you mistake in your connection with each other. And statistically, you will end up breaking up with that person further down the line.

• 25:27Dan Schreiber?

  Why?

• 25:28Speaker 04

  I'm not sure.

• 25:28Dan Schreiber?

  Because it's not a real connection, it's only a spooky connection.

• 25:30Speaker 04

  Exactly. And I don't know if that's right, that was just the final moment in the movie Speed, where Sandra Bullock explains that statistically that will happen. Like, one of the last bits.

• 25:40Dan Schreiber?

  Because that's her and Keanu Reeves, right? Are they together for Speed 2?

• 25:43Speaker 04

  No.

• 25:43Dan Schreiber?

  Aha!

• 25:44Speaker 04

  So the science, the science works.

• 25:48Speaker 00

  She was right. I was thinking about that as well, is that when you say you enjoy a scary movie, a lot of people do enjoy being scared, right? And there's actually a person who studies fear called Margie Kerr, who is also Pennsylvania's main haunted house sociologist in residence, which I love that they have that.

• 26:07Speaker 03

  In residence, does that mean you're walking through the haunted house and she comes out with a clipboard?

• 26:11Speaker 00

  It's the scariest thing you can imagine, she's about to analyse your personality.

• 26:16Speaker 00

  You basically sign a waiver at the start that says, "I will allow myself to be studied as I enter this haunted house." And she'll, like, get your reactions as you go through. And she's learned lots about fear based on this. But she says, one of the things is that, she tests skin conductivity, because that's one of the best ways to tell if you've been scared, because you sweat a bit more if you're scared, and then it's more conductive. And she finds that the more stressed you are going in, the more relaxed you are coming out. And being afraid relaxes you. Huh? And actually, it does make sense, I think. And I think, James, you're about to take a guess.

• 26:51Speaker 03

  Like, what I think is, like, when you do exercise, you feel tired afterwards, right? So if you exert the kind of fear, then you don't have it in your body anymore. You exorcise it.

• 27:00Speaker 04

  Oh, this is a company that we need to do.

• 27:04Speaker 00

  Exorcise with, exercise with exercise.

• 27:07Speaker 04

  Oh, it's like Peloton but with ghosts.

• 27:08Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah.

• 27:08Speaker 04

  Okay. I'm in, take all of my savings.

• 27:12Dan Schreiber?

  You're, you're on a Peloton or on a treadmill, murderer behind you, chasing you. Yes. You can't-

• 27:18Speaker 03

  There's a thing that exists, which I've done, it was an app, I don't know if it still exists, but it used to be called Run Zombies.

• 27:24Dan Schreiber?

  Zombies Run.

• 27:24Speaker 03

  Oh, Zombies Run, yeah. And you would, like, go on a jog, and then you would have some music playing, and then it would be like, "Oh my god, there's zombies coming," and you had to run faster for that amount of time.

• 27:33Dan Schreiber?

  I've got the app on my phone and I've never dared do it.

• 27:34Speaker 03

  Oh, I've done it, yeah.

• 27:35Dan Schreiber?

  Is it great?

• 27:36Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's fun. I only did it for, like, a week.

• 27:38Dan Schreiber?

  Sure. Do you know who the lead writer on Zombies Run was?

• 27:41Speaker 00

  No.

• 27:42Dan Schreiber?

  Naomi Alderman, who's a brilliant novelist, who wrote that novel, The Power?

• 27:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:46Speaker 00

  Really?

• 27:46Dan Schreiber?

  You know, who developed the ability to zap.

• 27:48Speaker 04

  She's a, she's a Doctor Who writer as well.

• 27:50Dan Schreiber?

  She's deeply into the nerd world and all of this.

• 27:52Speaker 00

  And she wrote an app where she just had to write the words, "Quick, there's a zombie, run," repeatedly.

• 27:56Dan Schreiber?

  I imagine she dolled it up a bit. Yeah, yeah.

• 27:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, there was, it was like, it kind of sets the scene that, where you're in, and then suddenly the zombies come.

• 28:05Speaker 00

  That sounds fun, but Andy would have to turn it off after six minutes.

• 28:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, are you, are you scared of the amount of running you'd have to do? Or is it the zombie that is scaring you?

• 28:14Dan Schreiber?

  You're running away from zombies, that's scary.

• 28:15Speaker 03

  I've said before that I've been on zombie walks in London, slash runs. And then there's real actors who are the zombies. And then you get to a certain place, and then they come and attack you, and you have to run to the next checkpoint.

• 28:27Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 28:27Speaker 03

  And I broke my rib doing that.

• 28:29Speaker 04

  I remember you doing that, yeah.

• 28:31Speaker 03

  Tried to run around them, they tagged me on the back, because they don't, they tag you, pushed me into a wall, broke a rib, out of action for six months.

• 28:38Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 28:39Dan Schreiber?

  You sued, didn't you? You got, and you won big, you destroyed that company.

• 28:42Speaker 03

  Yeah, they lost an arm and a leg.

• 28:47Dan Schreiber?

  There we go.

• 28:48Speaker 03

  I regretted that, as I was saying.

• 28:49Dan Schreiber?

  Why regret that? I regret a simple, pure comedy.

• 28:54Speaker 00

  Anyway, look, that's not why this woman, actually, I think that probably could be why, and it's related, why it can relax us. But this also really makes sense. So when you're being really scared, then your lower regions of your brain, like your limbic system, just the animal regions, are really kicked into gear. So the stuff that's really worrying you, that's occupying the upper regions, your cerebral cortex areas, it's overtaken by the animal regions. So it's a bit like meditating, right? Seeing a horror film is like meditating. You go through the haunted house, and it's just these instinctive limbic regions that are activated. So you come out and you're, you've meditated, you can't think about all the stuff that's worrying you.

• 29:27Dan Schreiber?

  You can't worry about your mortgage when you're being chased by a mad killer.

• 29:29Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 29:30Speaker 03

  You can't think about the really awkward faux pas that you made earlier that day.

• 29:34Speaker 00

  Precisely.

• 29:35Dan Schreiber?

  God, yeah. Do you know what America's biggest fear is on this subject? There is a survey that's been running for 12 years.

• 29:41Speaker 03

  Is it woke?

• 29:42Dan Schreiber?

  It's not woke.

• 29:43Speaker 04

  It's something surprisingly close to what you guys are describing.

• 29:46Dan Schreiber?

  The Democrats? No.

• 29:48Speaker 00

  It's transgender toilets, isn't it?

• 29:49Dan Schreiber?

  It's not. Shall I say it? Two words, government corruption.

• 29:55Speaker 03

  Oh, really?

• 29:56Dan Schreiber?

  That's the biggest fear on the list.

• 29:59Speaker 03

  Drain the swamp.

• 30:00Dan Schreiber?

  I know. Others included things like economic collapse and cyberterrorism. What happened to speaking in public, you know? Spiders.

• 30:08Speaker 03

  They must have, they must have primed these people, they must be in the middle of a survey of, like, who are you going to vote for? You know, who do you think was best for the economy? Are you worried about China?

• 30:18Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, all this stuff, yeah, yeah. But that, genuinely, for the last 10 years, the top fear has been government corruption.

• 30:23Speaker 04

  Well, that's actually the scariest room in the haunted house that Anna was talking about. You open the door and there's a few senators sort of colluding.

• 30:30Dan Schreiber?

  Dishing out his fat contract to a mate, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 30:32Speaker 00

  There's just a Man City player in the corner.

• 30:35Speaker 03

  And he doesn't get it, but he likes it.

• 30:43Dan Schreiber?

  Okay, it is time for fact number three, and that is Anna.

• 30:46Speaker 00

  My fact this week is that before lions could be reintroduced to Mozambique, the spirit lions had to be consulted.

• 30:56Speaker 00

  Sorry, I only remembered we were doing a scary episode halfway through that fact.

• 31:01Speaker 00

  This is the biggest move of lions ever in 2018. Twenty-four lions were shifted from South Africa to Mozambique to repopulate it with lions, which had been hunted away because their prey was all hunted, or the game was hunted away. And so there were no lions left in central Mozambique at all. And this was around a place called the Marimo Game Reserve. And the conservation effort was spearheaded by this hunter, actually, called Mark Haldane, who was a South African guy, and he wanted to reintroduce lions there. And he bought up this plot of land, but he wanted to check that the local people were okay with reintroducing a very deadly predator onto their land. And so by happy coincidence, he had a chat with them, and it turned out these people worshiped lions.

• 31:43Speaker 00

  Even though they don't have them anymore, they really revere lions and they all believe that lions are kind of their ancestors and all great people turn into lions when they die. And so it was perfect. And they said, okay, reintroduce the lions, but warning, it's not up to us whether they live or die, it's up to the spirit lions, as in our ancestors who are now lions. And their chief is a guy called Chief Toza. And the chief gave his personal blessing, but said they had to have a ceremony, which they did, and they had a big ceremony where the whole village came. They offered some coke, which I think is Coca-Cola, can't be sure, some Coca-Cola, some beer and some tobacco in plastic cups for the spirit lions, because that's their favourite.

• 32:26Speaker 03

  You all put cocaine in plastic cups?

• 32:28Speaker 00

  No.

• 32:29Dan Schreiber?

  I don't know how a spirit lion snorts coke, though, so that might actually be the best way.

• 32:33Speaker 00

  Maybe they just dive in like Al Pacino style into the cup. And yeah, they said, enjoy this beer. Do you mind protecting the village from the lions when they come? And it sounds like they've said yes, because it's been quite successful. But yeah, it's a very cool conservation effort and you see them doing the ceremony with this lion lying down asleep, fortunately.

• 32:49Dan Schreiber?

  I couldn't tell if it's an ancient idea of theirs, it's been going for a long time, but certainly there seems to be a recent origin story, according to Chief Toza, because it was his great, great grandfather who was at home one day and an invading army came from a neighbouring village and 12 of their best men came into his room with spears, and he somehow managed to kill 10 of them. And then the last two just got him in a corner and he then said, okay, stab me, stab me right in the chest. And as they did, he died and then a great spirit of a lion came out and the two men ran out and said, there's a giant lion in there and the town was left on its own.

• 33:27Speaker 00

  Yeah, and it's weird because normally those legends go so far back that it's like lost in the midst of time and you can be like, oh, so you do believe that he actually turned into a lion. But he is like, yeah, it's my grandad. Yeah, he just turned into a lion after he died. But yeah, I think they revered lions anyway, as is very common. It's a belief in Mondo, it's often called, across actually many, many parts of Africa. And it's been actually a problem in the past because it means you're more likely to get eaten by real lions. Because.

• 33:53Dan Schreiber?

  Because you go up to the lions, you tolerate them closer to you?

• 33:55Speaker 00

  It's not that, it's because when people have been attacked by lions in the past, an example of this was this outbreak of man-eating lions in Tanzania in the 1940s. They were called like the Ndjombe man-eaters. And they believe that the reason they've been attacked is because the lion is the spirit embodiment of someone who hates them, or that the lion has been cursed by a witch doctor. And so they refuse to believe that it's possible to get rid of the lion population because they're like, no, it's the gods are at work here, we can't do anything. So they'd have people saying, look, tell me where you see the lion, report it and we can kill the lion. And they'll often say, no, that's really stupid, these are the spirit lions, okay, they know what they're doing.

• 34:33Dan Schreiber?

  The grass up my nana? Screw you.

• 34:35Speaker 00

  Exactly, yeah. We'll get in even more trouble. So like these ones were left completely untroubled for about 15 years and killed some people, say, over 100 people in the 1940s.

• 34:47Speaker 03

  The problem with those guys was basically there's a pest called rindapest, which is really bad and you got it round there and it would kill all of your cattle. And so what they did to control rindapest is they killed all of the prey animals and then the lions didn't have anything else to eat. And so that's when they started going after the humans.

• 35:05Speaker 00

  Oh, don't take away their food.

• 35:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:08Speaker 00

  Go for you. And the hairless lions are the worst, manless males, which I didn't know was a thing, balding males, and it's caused by the same thing as baldness in human males.

• 35:18Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 35:19Dan Schreiber?

  Male passing baldness?

• 35:20Speaker 00

  Is testosterone.

• 35:22Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, really?

• 35:22Speaker 00

  Causes it. It's not that if you've got more testosterone, you go bald, it's just some people react to testosterone this way, but lions with more testosterone are bald.

• 35:29Dan Schreiber?

  Give bald people that, Anna, just give bald guys the thing of like, oh, you've got more testosterone, actually, you're a complete machine like Jason Statham. Just let them have that, come on.

• 35:37Speaker 00

  Jason Statham, Bruce Willis and you, virile. You know how you know it, you're shining paint.

• 35:42Dan Schreiber?

  Exactly, thank you.

• 35:43Speaker 03

  You know females kill more humans than males.

• 35:46Speaker 00

  Do they?

• 35:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:47Dan Schreiber?

  Lions?

• 35:48Speaker 03

  In lion, yeah. Certainly not in humans, I'm sad to say, but in lions, yeah. Lionesses tend to kill humans, but they do it like as a one-off usually, and then they go back to the normal diet. But if you have like a group of lions who consistently are killing humans and doing it again and again and again and again, then they're going to be the males.

• 36:07Speaker 00

  Really?

• 36:08Speaker 03

  Just overall females kill more.

• 36:09Dan Schreiber?

  The males get a taste for man flesh.

• 36:12Speaker 00

  Yeah, sounds like they do like the taste of it.

• 36:15Speaker 03

  I don't want to anthropomorphise it quite that much, but.

• 36:18Dan Schreiber?

  I'll do it, I'll do it. I'm trying to get on the side. So they like and respect lions in the real world as well as the spirit lions?

• 36:26Speaker 00

  Yes, yes, they do.

• 36:27Dan Schreiber?

  Because this, I think, is very interesting, because I assumed, when you hear about animal worship, I thought, oh, like the ancient Egyptians worshipped cats, right? And then you look into that just a fraction more and you find out they didn't worship cats in anything like the way that we would consider they should have done.

• 36:42Speaker 00

  Did they not?

• 36:42Speaker 03

  They didn't put like a shrine in the corner and put a cat on top of it and gave it milk and stuff.

• 36:47Dan Schreiber?

  Or Evian or anything like that. They didn't, no. I mean, what you do, James, is much closer to actual cat worship, right?

• 36:54Speaker 03

  I also will shave my eyebrows whenever my cat dies.

• 36:58Dan Schreiber?

  But the whole system did not involve being nice to cats. Basically, they thought any kind of animal, or lots of animals, could be vessels for the divine, so that includes cats, ibises, falcons, bulls, whatever. And then the thing you would do is, you know how if you go to a church, there's somewhere where you can buy a candle for like 20p? And then you light it up and you leave it there and that's the thing for you to say a prayer for, right?

• 37:21Speaker 03

  They also, they don't check that you put the money in, by the way.

• 37:23Dan Schreiber?

  Exactly.

• 37:23Speaker 03

  You could just light them.

• 37:24Dan Schreiber?

  Kuching.

• 37:27Speaker 03

  The number of 20ps I've saved.

• 37:29Dan Schreiber?

  It adds up.

• 37:31Speaker 00

  You are beating the system, James.

• 37:36Speaker 00

  Fuck the man.

• 37:38Speaker 03

  I'm going to keep some in my pocket when I'm buried, just in case there is an afterlife and I can be like, oh, look, sorry, I didn't forget, I've kept them in my coffin. You'll need those in hell.

• 37:52Dan Schreiber?

  But they mummified cats in the same way that we would think of candles for the church. You would buy a mummified cat and you would leave it as an offering for the gods.

• 37:59Speaker 03

  Right.

• 37:59Dan Schreiber?

  And these temples were basically massive cat farms where cats were raised, not treated very well.

• 38:03Speaker 03

  Terrific.

• 38:04Dan Schreiber?

  Killed, mummified. And that's why at these temples, they found literally millions upon millions of mummified cats, 2 million ibises, thousands of baboons, all mummified. And it's basically just an indication that you can, you know, use that as an offering.

• 38:19Speaker 03

  And they had like cat gods, didn't they? They certainly had ibis gods and baboon gods, where it's like half baboon, half human.

• 38:26Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, exactly, exactly. But, but it may be how we got cats domesticated in the first place is because the least wild ones survived longer or, you know, were bred for that and eventually some of them were kept as pets.

• 38:40Speaker 03

  Right.

• 38:40Dan Schreiber?

  But they didn't love cats, they didn't have any sort of nice cat stuff in the way that we would think of them having it. I know.

• 38:45Speaker 00

  They weren't watching cat videos all the time.

• 38:48Dan Schreiber?

  James, have you ever bought your cat a costume?

• 38:51Speaker 03

  No, I haven't and nor would I.

• 38:52Dan Schreiber?

  Okay, then you're part of the 83% of pet owners who have not bought their cat a costume.

• 38:57Speaker 00

  What constitutes a costume, do you think? Like, what about a hairband with ears?

• 39:02Dan Schreiber?

  Not a costume.

• 39:02Speaker 03

  To me, that is, why have you got cat ears on it?

• 39:05Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 39:05Speaker 03

  You're part of human ears.

• 39:06Dan Schreiber?

  You didn't say cat ears, there could be elephant ears or human ears, yeah. And that is a costume.

• 39:11Speaker 00

  Thank you for stepping in as my defender, Anna, because as I said it, I thought they wouldn't need the ears, hairband.

• 39:16Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that's not quite a costume. I think if you dressed it as Marie Antoinette, that's a costume.

• 39:20Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 39:20Dan Schreiber?

  Although that sounds amazing, actually.

• 39:22Speaker 04

  I saw a guy in Margate recently who was walking with his pug dog and they were both dressed the same, they were wearing the same cap.

• 39:27Speaker 03

  Both naked.

• 39:31Speaker 03

  And pissing on a lamp post.

• 39:35Dan Schreiber?

  I had to bag up his poo and hang it on a tree.

• 39:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, no. They were wearing like a flat cap, glasses and a grey t-shirt.

• 39:43Speaker 03

  Sorry, glasses?

• 39:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 39:44Speaker 03

  Pugging glasses?

• 39:45Speaker 04

  Yeah. I didn't have time to follow them to know what was happening.

• 39:49Speaker 03

  Why is the pugging glasses, sorry, how do you pick glasses on a pug?

• 39:52Speaker 04

  Because they were dressed the same and he wears glasses.

• 39:53Speaker 03

  It's like you're saying, you can't put lipstick glasses on a pug. I also liked you saying, I didn't have time to follow them to find out what was happening, rather than asking them.

• 40:03Dan Schreiber?

  I'm not going to get into a conversation with the guy who dresses a dog.

• 40:07Speaker 03

  I'm just going to follow him until it's clear what's going on here.

• 40:11Speaker 00

  Well, I didn't think it would have become clear.

• 40:13Dan Schreiber?

  It would have become clear.

• 40:13Speaker 00

  When he got to the dog and human fancy dress party.

• 40:16Dan Schreiber?

  There we go. There could have been a dog lookalike competition going on.

• 40:19Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, dogs and their owners.

• 40:21Dan Schreiber?

  Dogs and their owners, that does happen.

• 40:22Speaker 00

  Do you know lions, according to some traditions, cats were created when lions sneezed?

• 40:28Speaker 04

  Oh, okay.

• 40:29Dan Schreiber?

  Beautiful.

• 40:29Speaker 00

  Which is quite nice. In fact, and I say according to some traditions, I mean Islamic tradition. And it was on Noah's Ark that it happened. So this is one of the hadiths, in the hadith, yeah.

• 40:37Dan Schreiber?

  You'd be like stowaways if you were Noah. Where did you come from?

• 40:41Speaker 00

  Actually, it was Noah who did it himself.

• 40:44Dan Schreiber?

  Interesting.

• 40:45Speaker 00

  There was a mouse problem on Noah's Ark, which is weird because I thought there was only two mice. And again, this is according.

• 40:50Dan Schreiber?

  At the start of the voyage, you got two mice.

• 40:52Speaker 00

  Good point, shouldn't have got different genders, should you?

• 40:54Dan Schreiber?

  But you do need to.

• 40:54Speaker 04

  What's the point in saving them?

• 40:55Speaker 00

  No, sorry, that's the point, that's the point.

• 40:57Dan Schreiber?

  What the hell?

• 40:59Speaker 04

  I do what you said, God.

• 41:00Dan Schreiber?

  Another terrific point, two males of every species.

• 41:03Speaker 03

  And I know from reading the Bible that you love this kind of thing, God.

• 41:11Speaker 00

  Oh, God, yeah, the first few know it's fucked up.

• 41:14Dan Schreiber?

  Noah's wife going, what's wrong? Oh, you're not going to. Fucking believe what I did.

• 41:19Speaker 03

  Again. It would be Noah's wife, be Noah's best mate.

• 41:24Speaker 00

  Yep. Sorry. There was a mouse problem on the ark and all the other people on the ark complained. And so Noah said, okay, I'll ask God to do something. I'll ask Allah to do something. And Allah made the lion sneeze and out flew from its nose, cat.

• 41:40Dan Schreiber?

  That's nice.

• 41:41Speaker 00

  From the mouth, yeah.

• 41:42Dan Schreiber?

  First recorded cat allergy as well.

• 41:44Speaker 00

  Yes, it's an allergy if you're sneezing out a cat.

• 41:46Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, I think it must be.

• 41:48Speaker 00

  Must be. You're right.

• 41:51Speaker 04

  Hey, I've found another way in which the Mozambique lion has influenced the world. In 1969, Tippi Hedren, the actress, was over in Mozambique filming a movie called Satan's Harvest. And while she was there, they saw pride of lions moving into a vacated house. And they decided that they would centre a movie on the theme of this, in which the lions were the main players of the movie. It's Roar, a sort of comedy adventure using real lions on low budget. There were a number of insane injuries. Basically, everyone on set, virtually everyone, was bitten on the head by a lion at some point.

• 42:30Speaker 04

  You had the cinematographer, who was mauled by a lion on set, over 120 stitches were needed in the scalp, the back of his head. You had Noel Marshall, who was one of the directors and the husband of Tippi Hedren. And he was attacked multiple times. Tippi Hedren was attacked while she was on a tree. And the thing is, is that all these shots made it into the movie.

• 42:50Dan Schreiber?

  Did anyone die?

• 42:51Speaker 04

  No, but a bunch of lions did because there was a flash flood down in the valley where they were filming.

• 42:55Dan Schreiber?

  This film just gets funnier and funnier.

• 42:58Speaker 04

  It's a Halloween special. Terrifying stories. And, and a lot of famous lions from the local area were brought in because they couldn't import lions from Mozambique, which was the initial idea. So you had celebrity lions. So the antagonist was supposedly played by a tiger that was previously owned by Anton Lavey, who's the founder of the Church of Satan.

• 43:18Speaker 03

  Sorry, was, you're saying that a lion was played by a tiger?

• 43:22Speaker 04

  Sorry, is that what I said? Yes.

• 43:25Speaker 03

  No, I, I don't want to get, I don't want to get all union on your ass, but I do think that if you have a lion in a movie, it should be played by a lion.

• 43:34Speaker 00

  You are so woke, James, okay? Just more tiger actors available.

• 43:39Dan Schreiber?

  Do stripe blind casting for us.

• 43:43Speaker 04

  No, it was played by lion, but weirdly, a lion called Togar. So, uh, what, close to tiger.

• 43:49Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, sorry.

• 43:50Speaker 00

  Oh, so there were no tigers involved?

• 43:52Speaker 04

  No.

• 43:52Speaker 03

  Someone called their lion Toga?

• 43:54Speaker 04

  Yeah. The Church of Satan. Yeah.

• 43:56Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 43:57Speaker 04

  Anyway, as a result of this, the movie bombed, but Tippi Hedren set up the Roar Foundation, which is looking after all the lions that need looking after in America. And it, to this day, is one of the biggest charities out there for lions.

• 44:09Dan Schreiber?

  I'm not really worried about the lions. I'm mostly worried about the filmmakers. We set up a charity for them. God, the premiere must have been crazy, mustn't it?

• 44:17Speaker 03

  The carpet wasn't red to start off with.

• 44:23Speaker 00

  Stop the podcast.

• 44:24Dan Schreiber?

  Stop the podcast.

• 44:25Speaker 00

  Hi, everybody. We are sponsored this week by Progressive.

• 44:28Dan Schreiber?

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• 44:38Speaker 00

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• 44:45Dan Schreiber?

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• 44:50Speaker 00

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• 44:55Dan Schreiber?

  Don't wait. Get your quote today at progressive.com.

• 44:58Speaker 00

  Progressive Casualty Insurance Company affiliates and other insurers, not available in all states. On with the show.

• 45:05Speaker 05

  Hi, I'm Jenna Ashkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel. People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic. In a big way that defined a lot of my childhood. And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you, you are not alone.

• 45:36Speaker 06

  One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.

• 45:42Speaker 05

  So join us and hear their stories and more, because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At the Table, the food allergy podcast on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At the Table and start listening on the free iHeart radio app today.

• 46:04Speaker 04

  Okay, it is time for our final fact of the show, and that is James.

• 46:08Speaker 03

  Okay, my fact this week is that zombies exist.

• 46:14Speaker 03

  But only in the sea cucumber world.

• 46:20Speaker 03

  Very nice. So this is an article from Discover magazine about a species called Solus fabrici. It's a species of sea cucumber whose severed tissue can survive for years after you remove it. And there was basically a group of scientists from Bigelow Laboratory for Ocean Sciences, headed by someone called Rachel Sipler. And they found this kind of tiny foot from a sea cucumber. It's called a tube foot. It's what they use for feeding and for moving around. And they realised that it had been in seawater for ages and it hadn't decayed. And not only had it not decayed, but it seems to be doing quite well. And they thought, this is strange. And then they did a load more experiments and they found that these tiny bits of sea cucumber

• 47:03Speaker 03

  can live for a long, long time. And after it was, you'd be sure that they're dead and they're not attached to any other bit of sea cucumber. They've stayed alive and no one really knows why. And in the paper, they call them real life zombies.

• 47:16Speaker 00

  Are they eating?

• 47:18Speaker 03

  They seem to be somehow absorbing dissolved amino acids directly from seawater.

• 47:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 47:24Speaker 03

  And obviously I've just read that directly because I don't really know what it means. But yeah, they can somehow get some kind of nutrition. And they've not seen them grow into a complete sea cucumber yet, but we do know that sea cucumbers can regrow from very small parts.

• 47:38Speaker 04

  Yeah. What they seem to be saying is that it's, it's like when a lizard loses its tail, it will grow back a tail. But this is a case where they're suddenly wondering, is the tail going to grow back a lizard? It's, it's a bit that should not regenerate back into a sea cucumber, yet it's still alive. Do you know what the craziest thing about this is? Is that they studied three little bits of just sections of a sea cucumber that should just die and rot. For three years they studied it and then they published their paper. And because they published this result, they decided, let's stop the experiment and just chuck it away. They hadn't even died at that point. So you're going three years in going, we don't know how long this will go for.

• 48:17Speaker 03

  They don't even know how it would fare in a haunted house. They haven't done that experiment on it yet.

• 48:23Speaker 00

  Sometimes you run out of funding. You can't afford to keep that seawater tub in the corner.

• 48:29Dan Schreiber?

  It is mad. I really like it.

• 48:31Speaker 04

  It's incredible.

• 48:31Dan Schreiber?

  Sea cucumbers in general are just totally loco things. And we, they're actually episode one of No Such Thing As A Fish Veterans.

• 48:39Speaker 03

  Really?

• 48:40Dan Schreiber?

  Yeah, I had a little look back at, you know, all the times, because we've mentioned them in a few places over the years. Episode one, they breathe and eat through anus.

• 48:49Speaker 00

  Do you know, we've mentioned them, and I just feel like we need to apologize to sea cucumbers at this point. We've mentioned them 11 times and eight of those 11 times, we were specifically talking about their anuses. So I just think, I want to say, they've got good anuses, but there's more to them than that.

• 49:04Speaker 03

  Shall we just quickly talk about the anuses for a little while? Just for a little while, because they poo out a lot of stuff, right? One sea cucumber poos out about 1.3 ounces of poo every day. If you were to take all of the sea cucumbers who live on a particular reef in Australia called Heron Island Reef, they make enough to poo out five Eiffel Towers worth of material.

• 49:29Dan Schreiber?

  Right.

• 49:30Speaker 03

  A day? That's a year.

• 49:32Dan Schreiber?

  That's still a lot.

• 49:33Speaker 03

  Still a lot. It's 300 times less than you thought, but it's still a lot.

• 49:36Speaker 04

  I know.

• 49:36Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 49:37Speaker 04

  Your bar for what is an amazing amount, suddenly it's a bit questionable to me.

• 49:41Dan Schreiber?

  I've got very broad parameters on what I'll be amazed by.

• 49:43Speaker 03

  But here's one interesting thing that I think, right? So they poo out nutrients into the sea. And that includes calcium carbonate and corals can use that calcium carbonate from the sea cucumber poo to create the coral reefs.

• 49:58Speaker 00

  Nice.

• 49:59Speaker 03

  And then another fact we probably said on this show is parrot fish like to eat coral reefs. And then they poo it out to make sand on some coral beaches. And so that coral sand on coral beaches could have been pooed twice before it became sand.

• 50:15Dan Schreiber?

  It's crazy. That's so good. That's perfect. Because they have this nickname, the janitors of the sea. But they're the janitor who cleans by pooing, you know?

• 50:24Speaker 03

  Hey, you know, that book you were going to write about really skillful janitors.

• 50:28Dan Schreiber?

  Oh my god.

• 50:29Speaker 03

  Hong Kong Fui.

• 50:30Dan Schreiber?

  Genius janitors, Hong Kong Fui.

• 50:32Speaker 04

  Jon Bon Jovi.

• 50:33Dan Schreiber?

  Jon Bon Jovi, Matt Damon in Good Will Hunting.

• 50:35Speaker 04

  Good Will Hunting.

• 50:38Speaker 03

  We only need another 997.

• 50:42Dan Schreiber?

  No, but it is really important for coral reefs and various other ocean environments that they're doing this pooing. Because they make nutrients that were buried in sediment available to the corals by eating the sediments and then pooing them out. So they're keeping the whole thing in circulation. So it's called bioturbation, not a word I've heard before, which is pretty cool. I just think they're brilliant.

• 51:03Speaker 00

  They are. And they come in such amazing variety, partly because they don't have skeletons. They used to have skeletons hundreds of millions of years ago, evolved out of them, didn't need them. So their bodies can be molded and shaped into all sorts of different contortions. And so you get beautiful ones. You get sea pigs, which look, genuinely look like pigs. They've got like snout suckers on their snout that look a bit like pigs.

• 51:26Speaker 03

  Any sea pugs?

• 51:29Speaker 03

  With glasses and a flat cap?

• 51:31Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, in Margate, probably.

• 51:35Dan Schreiber?

  Some hipster will be walking in Margate.

• 51:37Speaker 04

  It was a sea pug, wasn't it?

• 51:40Speaker 03

  I remember going to my sea cucumber human lookalike competition.

• 51:48Speaker 00

  And you inflated and deflated your legs, as they do.

• 51:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, so that's how they get, because I watched footage of it walking, this little piggy. And it does look like they're moving their legs, but it's all hydraulics, isn't it?

• 51:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, they squirt water into them and it churns up the floor. So it has the advantage of stirring up food on the floor so it can eat it. And they live in the abyss, which I didn't know that it had a specific definition in the sea. The abyss is any seafloor that's six kilometres down or lower. And it's not the lowest, because the lowest is the hadal zone. And that's where you get the abyss, which is the lowest of the like flat seabed. But then the hadal zone is the trenches.

• 52:29Speaker 03

  Depends on like how much light can get through or something.

• 52:32Speaker 00

  Oh, the diagrams I've seen are like, it probably is exactly the same either way. But like the abyss is three to six kilometres and then hadal is the trenches that you get, which go down even deeper.

• 52:42Dan Schreiber?

  Is that like Hades?

• 52:43Speaker 00

  Yes, like Hades.

• 52:45Speaker 03

  Back on to the anuses. One fact that we've said on this before multiple times, I think, might have been that you get fish who live in the anuses of sea cucumbers. One part I didn't know about that is there are some rare sea cucumber species who don't like the fishes living in there. Like normally they don't really mind it so much because I don't know why, maybe they just keep them clean or something. But they they kind of put up with it. But there are some species that don't like the fish living there and they've developed anal teeth to keep unwanted fish out of their anuses.

• 53:18Speaker 04

  Evolution is just wonderful, isn't it? Anal teeth is amazing.

• 53:22Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's a metal band, isn't it?

• 53:25Dan Schreiber?

  That is a good name for a metal band. Um, one more thing on the anuses. So sorry, guys.

• 53:29Speaker 00

  I'm sorry.

• 53:30Dan Schreiber?

  No, but their their defence is very interesting and I don't think we've mentioned it. So one of their defences, which we have mentioned, is that they can just get into a niche. Ah, as I will after death, and then go hard. So they go very, very rigid once they're in the niche and then they cannot be got out for love or money.

• 53:46Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 53:46Dan Schreiber?

  Brilliant. But then the other thing they can do in extremis is they can violently eject their innards from their anus. And those are coated in poison. So if something's trying to eat them, they just get coated in this poisonous goo. And then they flee and will grow them back over many months. You know, it takes ages to recover from that. But if the attack persists, even after they've expelled their innards, they have one more button that they can push. And this is a thing called the kuke nuke. So good. They explode themselves, basically. The predator is just blasted with these sticky tentacle organs, which then expand twentyfold in size. So it's like having horrible poisonous expanding foam gunk inside you.

• 54:28Dan Schreiber?

  And that blasts and sort of holds the predator in place and the sea cucumber tries to escape that way.

• 54:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, I think they're like spider webs, aren't they? But way more scary, but like silly string, actually. It's a better example.

• 54:41Dan Schreiber?

  It's exactly like silly string.

• 54:42Speaker 00

  And you just get all in a tangle and make a fool of yourself.

• 54:44Speaker 04

  There's a permutation on that, which is the sea apple, which is a type of sea cucumber. And they look amazing. They've got tentacles which are all feathery. They look really beautiful, but they also shoot mucousy stuff out of their butt whenever they need to hit a predator. And then their version of what you said with the nuke moment is they expand their body to twice the size. It means that the current just picks them up and swooshes them out. So it's almost like pulling a parachute open.

• 55:09Speaker 00

  Oh, yeah, that's really cool.

• 55:10Speaker 04

  It's an ejector seat.

• 55:11Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 55:11Speaker 04

  Naturally built into them.

• 55:13Speaker 00

  What do they have in common with sheep?

• 55:18Speaker 03

  Sea cucumbers.

• 55:19Speaker 00

  Yeah, with mythical sheep.

• 55:25Speaker 03

  Maybe someone escaped from a cyclops by hiding underneath them.

• 55:33Speaker 00

  You've got almost exactly the right answer.

• 55:36Dan Schreiber?

  Very good.

• 55:36Speaker 00

  Almost exactly. It's not a cyclops because they're not real, of course, but as you say.

• 55:41Speaker 03

  You said mythical.

• 55:46Speaker 00

  They have this to call with mythical sheep, but in the real world, it can't be a cyclops.

• 55:50Dan Schreiber?

  Why did your pub quiz fail, Anna?

• 55:54Speaker 00

  Look, I'm giving him 99%. So Odysseus, of course.

• 55:57Dan Schreiber?

  The percentage based score insists.

• 56:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 56:03Dan Schreiber?

  How did you do on the pub quiz? Well, I got a two, one, so I don't know.

• 56:09Dan Schreiber?

  Sorry.

• 56:10Speaker 00

  Odysseus, of course, escaped the cyclops by clinging to the underside of a sheep. And sea pigs, in fact, the aforementioned sea pigs. When scientists went down and studied them on the ocean floor, they found that baby crabs ride underneath them to hide from predators. And they in fact found that 96% of young king crabs were found on the underside of sea pigs. That's basically where they live.

• 56:32Speaker 04

  That's amazing.

• 56:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, so nice.

• 56:34Speaker 03

  Very nice.

• 56:35Speaker 00

  So well done, James. You get a free bottle of wine.

• 56:38Speaker 03

  Can I give you the name of some sea cucumbers and you have to tell me why they got that name?

• 56:42Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 56:43Speaker 03

  Difficult sea cucumber. This is Holothuria difficile.

• 56:48Dan Schreiber?

  Difficult to find.

• 56:49Speaker 03

  Not quite.

• 56:50Speaker 04

  Difficult to buy for.

• 56:53Speaker 03

  Yes, very good.

• 56:55Speaker 00

  Order really specific stuff in a restaurant, like gluten intolerant, lactose intolerant, vegan.

• 57:00Speaker 03

  It probably reflects the taxonomic challenges researchers faced when identifying it.

• 57:05Dan Schreiber?

  Cool.

• 57:07Speaker 03

  The impatient sea cucumber.

• 57:10Speaker 04

  That's who's dining with the difficult sea cucumber. Just fucking order.

• 57:17Speaker 04

  I'll have the burger as is. Thank you.

• 57:23Speaker 03

  No, the impatient sea cucumber, which is Holothuria impatience. It's probably because when scientists got it for the first few times, it just expelled its insides really, really quickly. You know, doing that mucousy thing, but whenever they got it, they just did it straight away. And the stubborn sea cucumber.

• 57:39Dan Schreiber?

  Very hard, very rigid, death or stubborn.

• 57:44Speaker 03

  Not that, no. And it's also not that when they go to a restaurant with the other two sea cucumbers, they say, I only had the starter.

• 57:55Speaker 04

  Refuses to change its ways if put into a different environment.

• 57:59Dan Schreiber?

  That's good.

• 58:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm going to give you that. Well, I'll give you a first for that. Basically, the aquariums have a very hard time keeping them alive. And so they're stubborn because they keep dying.

• 58:11Speaker 00

  What? That's great inflation if that's how you first.

• 58:15Dan Schreiber?

  That's sea cucumber blaming, isn't it? They are really hard to track. Scientists find it a complete nightmare to track a sea cucumber. Because they are, they're just, they look like sausages, don't they? They're just ocean sausages, really.

• 58:28Speaker 04

  So you think most scuba divers are going, well, that's just a sausage.

• 58:30Dan Schreiber?

  No, no.

• 58:34Speaker 03

  Did you see any sea cucumbers down there now? Just sausage after sausage.

• 58:38Dan Schreiber?

  Thousands of eccentrically coloured sausages. Weird. No, it's because they can't be tracked. So if you attach a tracker to them, they just get rid of it. If you inject a tracker into them, they just push it out of their body. If you dye them, the dye disappears. They're like the Jason Bourne of the ocean.

• 58:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 58:57Dan Schreiber?

  In that they cannot be traced. I love that.

• 58:59Speaker 00

  I've never seen the Bourne Identity, but that actually makes me want to.

• 59:02Dan Schreiber?

  Oh, my God, it's so good.

• 59:03Speaker 00

  So stuff is inserted into him and he's constantly expelling it.

• 59:07Dan Schreiber?

  Yes.

• 59:09Speaker 00

  Sounds amazing.

• 59:10Dan Schreiber?

  It's a really good film.

• 59:12Speaker 04

  He shoots a lot of baddies, but not with a gun. It's anal mucus. And of course, Matt Damon's very used to playing janitors, so this was a fitting role.

• 59:27Speaker 04

  Okay, that is it. That is all of our spooky spooky facts. And if you, thank you, Andy, again. And if you would like to write to us about any of the things that we've said, we're all online. I'm on at Shriverland on Instagram, James.

• 59:42Speaker 03

  I'm on Instagram at nosuchthingasjamesharkins.

• 59:47Speaker 04

  Andy?

• 59:47Dan Schreiber?

  I'll follow you. I'm at Andrew Hunter M, so you'll see me when I follow you on social media.

• 59:54Speaker 03

  I don't think you follow anyone who follows you, do you?

• 59:57Dan Schreiber?

  I'm constantly on broadcast mode.

• 1:00:01Dan Schreiber?

  Sorry for being a professional.

• 1:00:04Speaker 00

  It is tiring, though.

• 1:00:07Speaker 04

  You can get to us as a group as well, Hannah. Where do they go?

• 1:00:10Speaker 00

  Yeah, you can go to Instagram at nosuchthing or email podcast at qi.com.

• 1:00:14Speaker 04

  Yes, podcast at qi.com. Send us all of your best facts there because we will pick them out and use them as part of our bonus Monday show, which is called Little Fish. We love, love, love getting them, so do send them in. And if you don't have a fact you want to share, but you've got an extra bit of knowledge about a thing that we've said, then write in as well. Because Andy collates those and brings all of that to our bonus secret show, which is called Drop Us A Line. And that can only be found if you're a member of the secret club fish. Patreon.com slash clubfish. You'll find all the details there. Otherwise, come back next week. We're going to have another episode ready for you. Thanks as ever to Ling Li, Ethan Ruparelia, as well as the larger Fishbuster gang here at QI Towers.

• 1:00:59Speaker 04

  And we will see you again next week. Goodbye.

• 1:01:13Speaker 04

  She's been thinking about this sleepover all week, but I think about her food allergies all the time.

• 1:01:18Speaker 03

  Fortunately, her doctor prescribed Zolair, omalizumab. It's proven to significantly reduce allergic reactions if a food allergy accident happens. Zolair 150mg is a prescription medication used to treat food allergy in people one year of age and older to reduce allergic reactions due to accidental exposure to one or more foods. While taking Zolair, you should continue to avoid all foods to which you are allergic. Don't use if you are allergic to Zolair. Zolair may cause a severe, life-threatening allergic reaction called anaphylaxis. Tell your doctor if you ever had anaphylaxis. Get help right away if you have trouble breathing or if you have swelling of your throat or tongue. Zolair should not be used for the emergency treatment of allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis. Zolair is for maintenance use to reduce allergic reactions, including anaphylaxis, while avoiding food allergens.

• 1:01:58Speaker 03

  Serious side effects such as cancer, fever, muscle aches and rash, parasitic infection or hardened circulation problems have been reported. Please see zolair.com for full prescribing information. Ask an allergist about Zolair. This is an advertisement for Zolair paid for by Genentech and Novartis.

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• 1:02:40Speaker 03

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