Mustang GTD Drive; Czinger Factory of WTF; Q&A

Driving the Mustang GTD; we toured the Czinger and Divergent 3D factory; Matt tells us about the great Mustang day of 2025; and we answer a whole lot of Patreon questions including: Cars that journos loved but failed to sell? Top automotive pilgrimages Why do RVs people choose Wranglers? E34 BMW: better than E36 or no? Prettiest Mustang ever? Next US car brand to go under will be... Driving a Panoz is like... When you shouldn't mess with a Porsche intake Best / worst days at work And more! Recorded September 15, 2025 Show Notes: DeleteMe Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for DeleteMe. Now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your DeleteMe plan when you go to https://www.joindeleteme.com/TIRE and use promo code TIRE at checkout. MudWtr Start your new morning ritual & get up to 43% off your @MUDWTR with code tire at https://www.mudwtr.com/tire ! #mudwtrpod #ad Factor Go to https://www. FactorMeals.com/tire50off and use code tire50off to get 50% off your first box, plus Free Breakfast for 1 Year. *Offer valid for new Factor customers with code and qualifying auto-renewing subscription purchase. Quince Keep it classic and cool this fall—with long-lasting staples from Quince. Go to https://www. Quince.com/TIRE for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns Smalls For a limited time Smoking Tire podcast listeners get 60% off your first Smalls order PLUS free shipping when you head to https://www. Smalls.com/TIRE New merch! Grab a shirt or hoodie and support us! https://thesmokingtireshop.com/ Use Off The Record! and ALWAYS fight your tickets! For a 10% discount on your first case go to https://www.offtherecord.com/TST Want your question answered? Want to watch the live stream, get ad-free podcasts, or exclusive podcasts? Join our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/thesmokingtirepodcast Instagram: https://www. Instagram.com/thesmokingtire https://www. Instagram.com/therealzackklapman

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Matt Farah?

  What's up folks, welcome to the Smoke and Tire Podcast. Matt Farah here. On today's episode of the show, we went down to the Zinger Factory and saw some of the craziest stuff you've ever seen in your life. We're going to tell you all about that. Plus, I got an entire day by myself at a racetrack to absolutely rip on the new Mustang GTD, GT3, Dark Horse R, and Dark Horse. And I'm going to give you my track reviews of those cars right now. It's the Smoke and Tire Podcast. Let's go.

• 0:38Matt Farah?

  Hey folks, I thought the show was supposed to be at 3 today. There's a lot happening.

• 0:47Matt Farah?

  How is everybody doing? Zach and I had a fun morning down at the Zinger Factory, Zinger/Divergent 3D Factory. We got to see both, they're next to each other. Before, and I want to talk about that, because we drove the car and now we get to see how the car's made. And Zach has like the only three photos he wants to take.

• 1:11Matt Farah?

  But before we do, I have a correction, I have to issue a correction. I had a thing wrong. It's very important that you acknowledge when you're wrong and you make a correction. When we talked a couple of weeks ago about the BMW R12 9T motorcycle, I inaccurately referred, I said about the engine, that it was the 1200 last generation that still carries on. It's actually not accurate. It's actually like a much older generation, because what I neglected to mention is that the R12 9T has an air-cooled 1200cc BMW engine, whereas

• 1:56Matt Farah?

  the new GSs, going back 12 years.

• 2:01Matt Farah?

  To 2013 are all water cooled. So this isn't just one generation backs powertrain, it's way back. So that partially explains, you know, why like the quick shifter is not so refined and things like that. Because it is, it is actually the old, old powertrain, which is neat. Um, and different and cool and, uh, and I neglected to mention that because actually, to tell you the truth, I didn't really think about it. Which it should have been obvious because there isn't a radiator and fans on that motorcycle. Um, I suppose I didn't think about the fact that the GS is water cooled more so than not thinking about that this one was.

• 2:39Speaker 01

  Right, good point.

• 2:40Matt Farah?

  Um, either way, I got it wrong. Uh, a fan, uh, very politely corrected me with an incredibly thorough explanation. And, uh, now I'm correcting it for all of you folks.

• 2:51Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 2:51Matt Farah?

  Right. See, look, it does have.

• 2:53Speaker 01

  It's got a thing.

• 2:53Matt Farah?

  That's, that's gotta be an oil cooler. But I just looked at it and uncritically and I wasn't like, is this a radiator or a cooler? And look, if you, uh, some people are like, would hear me say that and go, but you're supposed to be a professional. And like,

• 3:09Matt Farah?

  I mean, yes, but also I, I don't know everything and if you, if I was told, okay, you know, okay. But like, I just like, nobody was ever like, hey, this is what makes this one different. And I just like, didn't think about it.

• 3:24Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, is, and it's a finned box on the front. That's right. So unless you looked at the lines really closely at the size of them. And even then, like, I wouldn't like go at the motorcycle.

• 3:32Matt Farah?

  It just wasn't.

• 3:33Speaker 01

  The lines can be small.

• 3:34Matt Farah?

  It just, yeah, it wasn't something that I thought about, but it is a difference and it's an important one. So there you go. It's basically the equivalent of the roof, you know, SCR. And then this new roof that they have that looks the same on the outside, but has an engine that looks the same, but is air cooled. You know, doesn't look the same, but like at first, if you weren't, if you didn't know, you'd go, what's different here? You know, so anyway, that's different. That is an important distinction. Now, uh, Zinger, we went down there this morning. I didn't post pictures yet. Actually, the pictures that are on my phone suck.

• 4:09Speaker 01

  We also couldn't take very many.

• 4:10Matt Farah?

  We couldn't take very many. That's a good picture. Um, so we talked about the car in last episode, right? That, that was last episode. Sorry. We started, we kind of recorded things out of order. So if I'm a little confused about what happened when it's been a busy week and things are not airing in the order they recorded.

• 4:30Matt Farah?

  We drove the car. It's absolutely crazy. Did thirty minutes on it last episode. Go listen to that. Um, so they were like, you really have to come see how it's made because that sort of defines how it. They wanted me to see how it was made first. I, the scheduling didn't work, but I promised that I would go and pretty nuts.

• 4:49Speaker 01

  It's amazing.

• 4:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Um, so Divergent 3D is the parent company of Zinger, um, cars, Zinger automobiles. And, um, and it, the car is, although the car is a very real thing and very serious business, it's a showpiece for the technology.

• 5:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:07Matt Farah?

  Which can be applied to aviation, uh, military, uh, boating, like submarines, like who fucking knows? Like everything.

• 5:15Speaker 01

  Anything you need to make that's made out of this kind of metal and that, you know, requires being stress tested in a certain strength.

• 5:22Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 5:23Speaker 01

  It, it can make, yeah.

• 5:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah. And so think airframes, but also sub, subframes for cars, chassis components for cars, uh, structural and braking components for cars. Um, I hadn't heard the term fluid manifold today, but they mentioned that a lot. It's essentially a 3D printed, um, structure that has multiple, uh, hoses, for lack of a better word, in it. So like rather than having, uh, three rubber hoses from point A to point B that runs somewhat in parallel, they have a single part that just has those things. So they're all the same, you know, and, and, uh,

• 6:08Matt Farah?

  and fit exactly, you know, every time. There's probably other advantages besides that, but like, that's one.

• 6:14Speaker 01

  It's just, they showed us so many different shapes and parts for so many different things, some of which we definitely could not take pictures of. But I feel like this picture, which we have up.

• 6:23Matt Farah?

  But we could say what they were.

• 6:24Speaker 01

  We can.

• 6:25Matt Farah?

  We saw missiles.

• 6:26Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 6:27Matt Farah?

  They, we can say that. They just, they said, did you see the say, the thing, the yes, no? No, the no column was like photos of the missiles and or names of the military partners.

• 6:41Speaker 01

  Oh, right, yeah.

• 6:41Matt Farah?

  But like, we could say the list of the companies that they made, there was, there was the Bugatti Torbion. They were making control arms and, and probably other things. We saw control arms. Uh, the Ferrari F80, they were making some bits for. And unidentified Aston Martin, I'm guessing it's the Valhalla, right? Uh, basically, it was pretty much like control arms and, and suspension type componentry that they were making for those companies.

• 7:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:10Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 7:10Speaker 01

  But the other ones.

• 7:11Matt Farah?

  And then we saw missiles.

• 7:12Speaker 01

  Saw missiles and, uh, other parts, but like what was, what they highlighted and what you can see in this photo, even though this is not a defense picture or a defense product picture is like, you can take something that used to be 200 parts.

• 7:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 7:24Speaker 01

  And turn it into like four.

• 7:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  Which, looking at that thing sitting on the stand was crazy, because you can look at it and you can go, oh, that bracket used to be an individual bracket that was affixed to this like fuselage.

• 7:36Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 7:36Speaker 01

  Now it is part of it, like literally all seamlessly done.

• 7:40Matt Farah?

  And, and the ladder structures used to be like bits bolted to bigger bits.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Right.

• 7:46Matt Farah?

  Bolted to bigger bits. And now it's just like one.

• 7:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:50Matt Farah?

  You know, and, and so what Lucas Zinger, who's real fucking smart, was saying was that they have a software where you, you know, essentially put in what you need the part to do and the shape that you need it to be. And it figures out where metal needs to be and where metal doesn't need to be. And it is capable of finding the perfect form.

• 8:19Matt Farah?

  Not just the outside form, but like the inside form. So there's like these weird honeycomb-y things they can do.

• 8:26Speaker 01

  Totally asymmetric too. That's when you really noticed the, I guess, success or the use of that program is when they would have like a piece cut open or almost unfinished and you'd go, oh wow, there's like a weird dongle hanging off of this end. I think one of the Bugatti control arms had that, but it was like, well, it just needed structure there. It needed thickness there, but not around it. And it ended up looking very like, like a melted wax almost. It's weird.

• 8:51Matt Farah?

  And then the other bit, which I think was for a drone actually. Um, I think it was one of the like intake bits for a drone.

• 9:00Speaker 01

  Oh yeah.

• 9:01Matt Farah?

  And it had cooling like, like it almost the inside of it was like a seashell. And it swirled the air like that was a cooling channels as the air like moved through it. It was like an air cooler and like an air to air heat exchanger basically. Just but with no moving parts or no, it was really cool.

• 9:23Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I imagine that that idea, either the company who commissioned that had had it or whatever, but you'd have to like, you know, build a fuselage and then get like some sort of twisted carbon thing that slides into there. And then it fixes in there and does it move around when it's up in the air? Is that a failure point and what's the strength of that thing? And now it's just all this whatever alloy, single piece honeycomb thing.

• 9:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 9:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:47Matt Farah?

  It's really.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  It's really, really cool. And we were watching it make something slowly, uh, cause it takes a while, but it was actually different than I expected. It was, it was very different than when you watch plastic 3D manufacturing or additive manufacturing.

• 10:02Matt Farah?

  It doesn't like squeeze it like, you know, toothpaste from a tube. Yeah. When it does it from dust and lasers, it's a bit different.

• 10:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:10Matt Farah?

  Uh, extremely wild.

• 10:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:15Matt Farah?

  The engine as well, we saw a powertrain on a stand. The engine itself, like the, the, the, the block was really small. I shockingly compact. Um, the heads were kind of normal size and it had, it had really big um, heat exchanger sort of air, uh, not airboxes, but like charge coolers um, sitting on top of it. The charge coolers were probably twice the size of the heads. It's a really small little thing. Uh, and then we saw the battery packs which were shot. They were, the battery bags were so small, I thought they were oil coolers. Like that's true, they're really narrow. Yeah. Uh, they look, they're probably four inches wide and maybe eighteen inches long and six inches tall.

• 11:00Matt Farah?

  And um, I, I thought they would have to be bigger than that to generate that level of power. But uh, just all around extremely cool. The circle of robots in the middle is very Iron Man. Yeah, the assembly area. The, the whole point of this, their three D um, business not, is that it's, it's actually far less wasteful. It's far, uh, it's a better use of material. What is the, it's, it's cost per kilogram? Yeah. I think it's, that's how they measure it costs. So they've been able to get it like much, much cheaper uh, cost per kilogram. And it used to be somewhere in the thousands, now it's somewhere in the hundreds.

• 11:42Matt Farah?

  And I think, did he say if it gets to one hundred, then it becomes viable for like regular cars instead of just I think so. Super exotic cars. Yeah. I got, I'll get the number right for the article, certainly we'll fact check it. But he said when they started, it was in the thousands of dollars per kilogram. It's been eight years, now it's like two hundred, three hundred dollars a kilogram. And if it gets to a hundred, then you could start using it for like nine elevens and stuff. And if it gets down to in eighty, seventy, then it's the kind of thing that could be done in really regular cars. But what, what he's, is crazy is they, their three D printing factory essentially is a fully modular assembly, meaning you build one factory

• 12:27Matt Farah?

  and that factory can then build anything. Hmm. And it can build anything like in quantity one or quantity one thousand or whatever. And so if you put these things around the world. And if they're making complex assemblies for cars or planes or whatever, like everything that you can make regionally doesn't need to be shipped by air or sea. You know, you can have very low impact production facilities, um, so you don't have to ship sub-frames from fucking Detroit all over the world or whatever.

• 13:07Matt Farah?

  Um, and, and according to Lucas, who I believe, that type of savings at the, at the manufacturer level, uh, can really compound.

• 13:18Speaker 01

  I'm sure. The cost of shipping frames or sub-frames or blocks or whatever, whatever heavy thing it is around the world, you know, because we've talked about this before, like there's stuff that gets built here, then shipped to Germany and then assembled over there or proving, you know, try it out over there and then sent over here. The, when the tariffs were announced, all the people talked about the crisscrossing of cars from like Mexico to America and back. So it might, um, you know, relieve some of that, uh, the capital expenditure.

• 13:46Matt Farah?

  Yeah. And then the cars like real fucking fast.

• 13:49Speaker 01

  The car is very fast. And it look, it looks, it doesn't, it doesn't get old to look at. It looks insane. It looks as fast as it is.

• 13:55Matt Farah?

  I actually think it gets better looking the more that you look at it. Folks, we gotta take a quick break from the action because Delete Me is supporting us today. They have been fabulous to us and so you should hear me out on them. I hate spam texts, fake calls, stupid emails, all this stuff that just comes in, clogs up my streams, my inboxes, my, my, uh, my DMs, everything. And it all comes through data brokers. When you sign up for websites, when you order things online, your data, it gets sold to data brokers and then they use it for nefarious things. Your name, your contact info, your social, your home address, even information about

• 14:39Matt Farah?

  your family members, it could all be, uh, compiled by data brokers and sold online. And Delete Me is here because it's the wire cutter top pick for data removal services. And it's someone with an active online presence. I use Delete Me. Privacy is important to me and here's how it works. You sign up, you give them the information that about yourself that you want taken off the internet. And then they go hunting, right? And a bunch of it can be automatically removed. A bunch of it requires further review. And after about a month, they send you a report. And I got my first report and it was like 1,100 instances of my stuff being out there. So we got rid of a bunch of that. Then a month later, see, they keep going.

• 15:24Matt Farah?

  It's not a one time thing. A month later, get another report. Same thing, but it's only like 300 and then it's 200. And it keeps going down and down and down. It's great. It really does work and my spam texts, spam calls have really gone down since then. You can do it too. Take control of your data. Keep your private life private by signing up for Delete Me now at a special discount for our listeners. You can get 20% off your Delete Me plan by texting the word REVIEW to the number 64,000. The only way to get 20% off is to text REVIEW to 64,000. That's REVIEW to 64,000.

• 16:07Matt Farah?

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• 17:29Matt Farah?

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• 18:14Matt Farah?

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• 18:59Matt Farah?

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• 19:40Matt Farah?

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• 20:25Matt Farah?

  That's 60% off when you go to Smalls.com/tire plus free shipping. Again, that is Smalls.com/tire. And now back to the show. I think the first time you look at one, it looks a little weird, but the more I look at it, the more I actually appreciate that thing.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  Fucking rad.

• 20:46Matt Farah?

  I mean, it looks great. I think it looks great, but it's like it's, you know, like a, like a, like, like some really good albums, you know, a movie that requires a second watching to really appreciate. The first time I saw one, the, the, just the pure aesthetic of it didn't stop me in my tracks, but now that like I get it and I drove it like, and I've seen them in different colors. I've seen the one without the wing, one with the wing, you know? Oh, okay. Now like, yeah, okay, maybe, maybe not in this color, but in this color it looks sick. And like, you know, that kind of thing.

• 21:20Speaker 01

  Tinted carbon always wins my heart.

• 21:22Matt Farah?

  Tinted carbon does work.

• 21:23Speaker 01

  There was a customer car, there was tinted carbon and it's always a good idea.

• 21:26Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I would, I could, I would find a way to do like my, a variant on my like rosé, you know, like the Casse or the, uh, frozen berry. I think that would be a crazy, if you could, if you could get the richness of it right, because I don't know, if you, if you make that a clear, it may not work. If you could though, it would be incredibly sick.

• 21:53Speaker 01

  I wonder if you could do a clear with a tiny bit of colored flake in it. I wonder if that, you know, not too much flake, because you don't want to obscure the pattern.

• 22:01Matt Farah?

  I don't know. I've never seen that. A clear with flake on the carbon. They had that, they didn't have a car, but they had one of these bucks that was a tinted British racing green.

• 22:14Speaker 01

  It was perfect.

• 22:15Matt Farah?

  Dude, in a room full of crazy shit, one little piece of, I was like, um, that one and the woman who's, I regret not getting her name. I looked up at her and I was like, you're the color person, right? She's like, I'm the color person. And not just because she had a bunch of these things in front of her, she looks exactly like Brenda from Manx.

• 22:36Speaker 01

  Lot, a lot like her, yeah.

• 22:37Matt Farah?

  I was like, Brenda? You have two jobs? Like, it looks exactly the same. Uh, but yeah, she has a fun job. And that, that.

• 22:47Speaker 01

  And those cool, they had the speaker covers with different finishes on them, you know, for to show a customer, like, hey, which of these, yeah. Which of these three things do you want to pick? It just looked awesome. And it's anodized, it's not just like painted plastic or whatever. It's super cool.

• 23:02Matt Farah?

  That's, man, that's really where, for that kind of money for a car, I think, I think you're getting the right amount of crazy.

• 23:11Speaker 01

  If you get that tour as a customer, you go, oh, wow, it's a good sell.

• 23:16Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, compared to, you know, compared to some other stuff out there, I think that this price for this car is actually a value.

• 23:24Speaker 01

  It, it seems special and unique, like literally from the atoms to the finished product, like, you know, not just, you, oh, it's fast, it's got these attributes. And like we've talked about almost ad nauseam about this car is, not only does it look different than anything else out there, and it feels and sounds different from anything else out there, it's constructed in a way that is different.

• 23:45Matt Farah?

  It looks like it was built by aliens.

• 23:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, from 20 years in the future. Uh huh, yeah, it totally does.

• 23:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Uh, shout out to them. That shit is fucking sick. That shit is.

• 23:55Speaker 01

  Like, look at this.

• 23:57Matt Farah?

  I don't know if a customer, how does a customer like? They need to have some kind of, do they have a public facing? Anything that customers can like, that like, not customers, like regular people can see?

• 24:09Speaker 01

  What do you mean?

• 24:10Matt Farah?

  Is there, is there like a fucking showroom somewhere for one? I should probably have the answers to these things.

• 24:15Speaker 01

  I think they sell them at Ogera and different places like that.

• 24:17Matt Farah?

  They have dealers, but I don't think the dealers have like, in, like a car you can go look at.

• 24:21Speaker 01

  Probably not.

• 24:22Matt Farah?

  If you get a, just, if you get a chance to go see one anywhere, you should try.

• 24:26Speaker 01

  And ask them to open the, uh, engine compartment.

• 24:29Matt Farah?

  The clamshell.

• 24:30Speaker 01

  The clamshell, cause then you can really see the subframe and stuff like, cause that's what we're looking at here. Like these crazy shapes that like, this looks like, you know, the, whatever this big support is on the top right, looks like a huge chicken breast. And that is one of the engine mounts.

• 24:42Matt Farah?

  What's really funny is it's, it's almost impossible to tell this photo that we're looking at, which is on Zach's Instagram, is, you have almost no idea what direction this photo is taken, like which way is up?

• 24:54Speaker 01

  Good point.

• 24:54Matt Farah?

  Like what are we looking at? Um, and it's, it's actually, so you're actually looking at Zach is, Zach's knees are on the, uh, rear left wheel hub. That's where your kneels, knees are.

• 25:09Speaker 01

  Right rear, but yeah.

• 25:10Matt Farah?

  It's right rear?

• 25:11Speaker 01

  I think it's right rear, yeah. Cause this, this is the back of the car.

• 25:15Matt Farah?

  Oh, the back of the car is to the left? Okay, yeah. I thought the shocks went the other way. No?

• 25:19Speaker 01

  No, in the front, the shocks go across, uh, which I have a video of, but not a picture.

• 25:25Matt Farah?

  I thought, okay, the shock is mounted that direction, not the other, okay, fine.

• 25:28Speaker 01

  Oh yeah, cause I, I remember, this is a screen grab from the video where it panned down. No, I, I get it, cause you look at this and it's like, it'd be a challenge to most people to say, identify a part of this car that, and, and just name it the same thing you've seen on their cars. Like find the A-arm, that's probably the easiest one, but after that, you know, there's pivot points where the shocks go, because it's, uh, what's it called?

• 25:48Matt Farah?

  Can'taliver.

• 25:48Speaker 01

  Can'taliver suspension. But like, what's the thing under the shock do? I don't know. Looks like a shell.

• 25:53Matt Farah?

  That looks like, uh, a decayed jaw, like, no idea.

• 25:58Speaker 01

  When we walked through, there was a shelf there and I said, these look like skulls. And they weren't, they were just like some component for something. I think it was a bunch of like the brake hub and whatever, but it looked like a bunch of, you know, cyborg skulls.

• 26:09Matt Farah?

  That would be a fun game down there. Body part or suspension part?

• 26:13Speaker 01

  Yikes.

• 26:14Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 26:14Speaker 01

  Super cool stuff.

• 26:15Matt Farah?

  Real, real, real crazy and, um, very, I, I...

• 26:22Matt Farah?

  You know, it's one of those times where you're like, oh, there's like, it's hard, it's hard for me to say this with a straight face because they also make missiles. But you could say, oh, the tech is being used for good, but like, it's, uh, it's also being used for some bad. I mean, I don't think like, I understand that, uh, that militaries need missiles. Uh, but like, you know, I think, I don't know. I, I wish I lived in a world that had less missiles, I guess, right?

• 26:52Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 26:52Matt Farah?

  I have mixed feelings about that, like, there are, there are militaries and they, they buy weapons and like, they buy them from somewhere and like, here's a company that does it, like,

• 27:03Speaker 01

  Right.

• 27:03Matt Farah?

  And they're like, seems like they're pretty good at it, like, and,

• 27:07Speaker 01

  When you look at the list of like the biggest defense contractors in the United States, like, I remember every time I see Boeing, I go, really? They make the friendly planes that work so well. They work pretty well, not so well.

• 27:17Matt Farah?

  So well.

• 27:17Speaker 01

  They used to be so, it worked, it used to work so well.

• 27:19Matt Farah?

  And these guys are contractors for the contractors. You know, yeah, so, but, uh, but yeah, it's hard, I, you know, I'm a little morally conflicted about missiles.

• 27:32Speaker 01

  Well, it's weird to see one there, like, being made. But also I'm like, this technology is, like, I am won over by it every time I see it. I think it's so fascinating and incredible to see.

• 27:44Matt Farah?

  It is.

• 27:45Speaker 01

  And to look at the shapes they can make and then, and then I step back and I go, that's gonna fly into someone's house. Like, oh, like, but look at these cooling ducts.

• 27:53Matt Farah?

  That's what I'm saying, yeah. It's a, it's a, it's a tough thing to like, you know, morally reconcile.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 28:03Matt Farah?

  Especially when like the cars are awesome, too. So, but like, all right, that was, so we're in, we live in a, for me, a little bit of a moral gray area. What am I gonna do? I don't fucking know, but I like the cars. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna stop them from their core business over there.

• 28:20Speaker 01

  I think that is a human experience where you, you know, you like this part of a thing, but this aspect of it makes you feel icky.

• 28:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah. I said, and I said that to Lucas and he was like, yeah, you know, God, I get it. Cars are pretty cool, right? Yeah, cars are pretty cool. You know, um, so, uh, so that was cool, but like, so this was crazy. Last week, I mean, last week, we started with the Zinger, uh, on Wednesday. I guess it was Wednesday last week. Um, and then, well, I started, started the week with a nine eleven in Georgia. Got home, Zinger twenty one C, drive, uh, on the mountains. And then Friday, I went to Chuck Walla and I spent the day with four of, uh, Fords.

• 29:06Matt Farah?

  Uh, the, the, the dark horse, the dark horse R, the GTD and the GT three. The, like, the real GT three race car.

• 29:15Speaker 01

  Is four Fords called a Fjord? Is that?

• 29:17Matt Farah?

  Oh, that's a good one. It's a good one.

• 29:20Speaker 01

  It's in your head.

• 29:20Matt Farah?

  I gotta make sure AJ gets that. Now, the story I'm doing is for Road and Track and, like, Road and Track paid for the track and shit. So I could do their story and, uh, and like, it's a great opportunity to get to do a story like this. There's shows, there's a lot of resources put into this story. Um, Multimatic employees flew in from far away to support me doing this. And, I mean, they brought multiple race cars. Um, they brought cars in, they rented an entire track for me for an entire day, which is crazy. My neck hurts, um, and my, my body is actually quite sore from number of race car I drove. I drove a lot. And when you, with a GT three, I've got to drive a couple of big name race cars before.

• 30:02Matt Farah?

  Every time, it's like, a little taste, get a little taste, you know? You get a couple, you get like two ten lap sessions maybe and like, and then you get to do some of your photos. And that's pretty much it. And that's, that's better than nothing. I'm not paying and, and it's for videos and like, I'm happy to be there. So when I show up, I didn't, it was, I was the, me and, and our photographer, Paul, was it. There was no, there was no editorial staff beyond me, like, no, there was like Ford guys with the, with the cars and the Multimatic guys and they were like, so, uh, what do you want to do? And I was like, well, like, you know, I'm going to start with the, start slow and go to fast, you know? And, and I'll probably do that a couple of times before lunch.

• 30:45Matt Farah?

  I'll go through, you know, the thing, go, go through it again, do some mounted shots. We'll break for lunch when it's really hot and then we're there till dark. I was like, we have so much time. This is so crazy. After lunch, I'll just like, jump around between cars, I guess. And then, okay, cool. Um, I was like, how many, I was like, I don't want to be, you know, greedy and, you know, it's your race car and everything. Like, how many, what's, what's an appropriate number of laps? You know, I just, you know, and you get, I'm doing a story, I'm not, you know, qualifying, and they're like, like, what do you mean? And I was like, uh, what, like, you know, 10, 15? Like, what's cool? And they're like, our instructions were full tank of gas, full set of tires. So, have fun. Like, the car's supposed to work. Yeah, like, yeah. It's not, it's gonna explode.

• 31:28Matt Farah?

  Have fun. So, um, and this was, this is the number one car. This was their, their, their development car. It's never actually raced. It's only done development work and, and stuff, but it has a lot of hours on it, and it's supposedly very good, and it also doesn't have the GT3 restrictors, restrictors on it. So, it's like 640 horsepower. Um, but, I mean, hilariously, going from the Zinger, two days later to this. This has half the power. Half the power, and the straight, and it weighs more. Boring. So, I was sort of like, you know, it's not like I was like, wah, wah, but like,

• 32:07Matt Farah?

  I, I knew, I was like, prepare yourself to be under, underwhelmed on the straightaways with this car. Now, fortunately, it's really loud. The straight pipes right there. It's so loud that it doesn't matter if it's not as fast in the straightaways. Well, and all, I mean, look, it's also on slicks and fucking with downforce and all this, but, so, um, so if you're a patron, you're gonna get to hear about, um, GTD a couple of days early. Don't fucking ruin it, okay? That's what being in the club means. Um, so I, I got a dark horse

• 32:47Matt Farah?

  to drive out there, just to get re-used to, and, oh my God, you want to talk about a car? Look, this is a lovely car. The engine's great, the gearbox is great, the brakes are really good. It's got Trefo RSs on it as a street car. CarPlay, instant, bang on, no, no issues, right? I don't love the big screens, but like- It's got that, it's got the quick button for CarPlay- It does. The Porsche doesn't have, right? Quick button for CarPlay, it's good. But the alignment on this goddamn thing, and the front tires, I drove it out to Palm Springs, this car is exhausting on the highway. It's fucking moving around, it's darting, you cannot drive this car with one hand. You can't do it.

• 33:29Matt Farah?

  It's so tiring to go straight in a Dark Horse. I, I mean, I think the Ford guy said that the company, whoever the company is that preps the Mustangs here, puts track alignments on all these things, and it, and, and like, you can dial it back- Sure. It doesn't have to be like that, but he's like, "Yeah, you can also make it like that." Um, so, you know, I'll assume that they don't all like that, but this one was, oh my god, it was brutal. Now, it was fun on the track. It was a, I, I really, the, it's not really included in the story, um, for the magazine, but I ran, I hadn't been to Chuck Wall in about two years, so I ran like fifteen, twenty laps in it, and it's like a fun car.

• 34:09Matt Farah?

  Easy to drive, very nicely balanced, um, you know, decent, decent amount of grip, you know, with those Trofeo RSs, you know, for a street car, it really sticks pretty good. Um, the alignment's nice on track, you don't have to worry about it. Um, I did get the brakes hot after about eight laps, uh, so you probably want to do pads and fluid, because the hardware's definitely there, but- Dark Horse R is the, uh, the cup version of that, Mustang Challenge, um, and, uh, you can, uh, I got to drive Jim Farley's, uh, car, so shout out to Jim, thank you very much. Yeah, that was it. That's a GTD. No, no, go back. Uh, that's it, right there.

• 34:50Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it has, it has a similar livery to the GT3, but it's, uh, it is a, it's a Dark Horse powertrain, straight up. Um, it even has the, uh, rev match. They left the rev matching in, so it's on a toggle, you can just toggle it on, and they're like, everybody in the racing series, like, has their pride, and after about two test sessions, they leave it on. And I agree with him. If I was racing.

• 35:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:15Matt Farah?

  If I was actually racing and every, every 10th counted, I would use the auto rev matching. It was, it was pretty snappy in the Dark Horse R. You know, it's got a cage, the car, you know, it's stripped out. It has upgraded suspension. The Dark Horse R was really fun. These things are about 150 grand. And if I was joining a racetrack country club, this would be my first race car. This fucking car, it sounds like a NASCAR. The shift, the shifter's great. The steering is really sharp. It's got a shitload of grip on slicks. The brakes are ace. The balance is really good. You don't need, you know, you don't need traction control, stability control at all.

• 36:00Matt Farah?

  You sit, you know, really, really low in it.

• 36:04Matt Farah?

  And what they put like a small, like, you know, racing steering wheel on it, which makes the steering like really sharp, but because Mustangs have such like over boosted steering anyway, it doesn't feel like tiring. Super fun. Unfortunately, when we, we, after I did like a couple, a couple flyers, they were looking over the car, checking the tire pressure and they found a crack in one of the rotors.

• 36:27Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 36:27Matt Farah?

  So I couldn't continue lapping this at speeds. So I basically gave myself a really fun game, which was basically like, how fast could I get around the track without like braking essentially? And so I had a kind of a fun like 20 minute session where I was like, can I go quicker? Like, can I come out of every corner like really hard? And then find the exact right spot where like 5% brake was enough, but just slow down enough to like really huck it into the corner.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  Cause if you clamp too hard, you were.

• 37:03Matt Farah?

  Yeah. They essentially were like, look. We shouldn't, they weren't, they didn't say outright no, they're like, we shouldn't. If it, they weren't like if it was someone else, but they were like, I'm explaining to you, like, you, you really cannot use the brakes. Like, it's not that they're gonna, something's gonna happen, but like, we're a big corporation and liability wise, like, we don't want to take the risk of something happening. So like, you have to essentially drive it like for photos, like without the brakes. So like, that's the game I came up with. I was like, what about like five, literally 5% brake pressure? And they're like, that's probably fine. So I did that. And it was like, kind of an interesting game. Cornering speeds are really good on this car. I bet.

• 37:48Matt Farah?

  Um, so the GT3, uh, that shit is nuts. Um, I mean, it's, it's, it is a, it's, it's a, it's full on. This is, this is a, this is not a Ford, okay? This is, this is a multimatic product through and through. Uh, they were said over and over that there are three production parts on this car. Wow. And I'm pretty sure two of them are the outer and inner door handles. Cause those are stock. Uh, I, I don't, I didn't ask what the third was, but I didn't see it. You didn't see it?

• 38:26Matt Farah?

  Uh, you know, the engine is so low and so far back, you can't even believe it. Uh, it's obviously a dry sump. It is based on the production block, actually, but it's bored and stroked to 5.4.

• 38:45Matt Farah?

  Based on the block, does that mean they take the stock block? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah. They, they modify an OEM block. Yeah, they do not, it's not like it's a billet block with a stock displacement. Yeah, stock. Um, they also, um, the heads are the stock head, uh, uh, chamber design. But the stock car has variable intake, exhaust, uh, uh, variable valve timing on the intake and exhaust side. Um, the, this car only has it on the intake side because it never needs to be quiet and it never needs to pass emissions. Um, and then it also has, um, you know, better valve hardware that's designed to fucking run it, you know, 8,000 RPM for 24 hours. Whereas the street car isn't really designed to do that, obviously.

• 39:30Matt Farah?

  Um, sequential gearbox, um, it's X-Track.

• 39:36Matt Farah?

  Those have gotten really good. No more third pedal. And it's. So you're sitting in this thing, it's big. And, and, and you're, look at the, see how, see the, uh, see the windshield banner, how far down the windshield it comes? Yeah, wow. You sit so low that that is not a problem. It's not in your way at all. Not in your way at all. That is half the windshield for people listening. You're slammed on the floor. Fortunately, I fit in the seat. It was actually, is very, very comfortable sitting there, has air conditioning. And as long as you are moving at speed, the air conditioning is really effective. That is, air conditioning in race cars is a, is a, has been a great thing.

• 40:20Matt Farah?

  So, uh, let's, where should I start with this? It, apparently you're supposed to wear earplugs, which I, which I did not. I bet you are. And I didn't. Um, it's insanely loud, surprisingly. Uh, right? It's got these side pipes. It's unbelievable. And you get about 50% engine, about 50% gearbox whine. It's actually very well behaved at half speed. So not at like super low speeds. Every race car is like the gearbox with the straight cuts, just when you're trying to go slow for the photos, the 20 miles an hour, they hate that.

• 41:03Matt Farah?

  But this race car was better behaved than any other car I've driven. For those first two getting to know you laps where I'm shifting at five, you know, short shifting, light braking. It wasn't like shitty when the tires were cold. It wasn't shitty when the brakes were cold. I mean, you do have to warm things up, but, um, it wasn't a clunky piece of junk when you weren't doing that. So it was incredibly approachable, um, which was really nice. It has ABS or traction or anything? It has both of, it has, it has ABS, it has traction control and it has stability control. I drove it with the ABS on two out of 12. Wow.

• 41:47Matt Farah?

  So that, that's minimal ABS. That's, that's, yeah, low. I'm just, I'm just saying that the range of adjustment there, that's a lot of numbers. I thought it'd be like one to five or something. Well, they race in the rain. You know, they race in the rain and they want you to be able to to micro adjust it. All of them went to were one to 12. The traction control, the the yaw and the and and I drove with, I did, I never got the ABS to off. Nor I I don't want to drive with ABS off. That's I for some people, maybe there's a point of pride in driving hard with ABS off. I don't need to prove anything to anybody, but I did drive with traction stability control fully off.

• 42:25Matt Farah?

  And I felt good about that, actually. And this car, this car has no bad habits. I mean, it it it does exactly what you told it. The steering ratio, the inputs were crazy sharp, going back and forth from the GTD to this. Because after, you know, I I didn't drive the rest street dark horse anymore. And once the rotor was done on that car, you know, after lunch, it was like, and then there were two. And you have five hours. So like, you know, what do you want to do? So I just kept going back and forth between the GT3 and the GTD.

• 43:01Matt Farah?

  And the GT3, I would say, I did like two or three five lap sessions and then a couple of 10 lap sessions.

• 43:13Matt Farah?

  By the end, I felt like real nice. And and Mike, the multimatic guy, there was a couple multimatic guys. This guy was awesome. He started, he he basically, as he sees you getting more comfortable, they drop the tire pressures lower and lower. So you can keep going quicker. And the the full pros run like 24 PSI in a race. And he started me at 28 and he got me to 24 by the last session. And by the last session, I was fucking humming. Like, I went, I went by the last session as fast as my body would allow me to go. It would, they they were running telemetry, but what I didn't have was a ghost to chase.

• 43:57Matt Farah?

  So they'd never been to Chuck Wall before. So they were like, these are your times and you look great. But I can't tell you if this time means anything because this car's never been here before.

• 44:08Speaker 01

  Right.

• 44:08Matt Farah?

  So, we can look up, if you want to look up Chuck Walla times, my, my best time was a 140.0. So you, we can look up if that's good or not, but they said I was looking good and they said my feedback on the car was, was good. And that they were making adjustments based on that.

• 44:31Speaker 01

  What was your time?

• 44:32Matt Farah?

  140.0.

• 44:34Speaker 01

  Alright, well, according to fastest laps, you're faster than Randy Pope's in a GT3 RS by 15 seconds?

• 44:41Matt Farah?

  Well, that's a street car. I'm in a race car on slicks, so I fucking hope so.

• 44:44Speaker 01

  That's a lot, that's a lot though.

• 44:45Matt Farah?

  So wait, hang on, what, what do we have? Do we have a real race car?

• 44:48Speaker 01

  Uh.

• 44:49Matt Farah?

  Are there any real race cars up there? Someone else will have a, have it.

• 44:56Matt Farah?

  So I don't know if that's good. Someone else can tell me if that's good, but that was my fastest time. Oh wait, what, uh, that's, uh, did, oh wait, there are others, whatever.

• 45:05Matt Farah?

  Feel, it felt good. It, I went as fast as my fucking brain would let me go. I mean, I, I just, I would need, I need a, like I had Jordan Taylor at, at AMP. I would need another line to go, alright, well you broke here, but the car is capable of breaking 10 meters quicker, later. Uh, and I did not have that, so. The motorcycle track record is a 154.

• 45:34Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 45:34Matt Farah?

  Oh, here's another thing, by the way, I went, you can run this track either way. We went counterclockwise. So that will matter. I don't know which way there, oh, this is clockwise. So we went counterclockwise.

• 45:48Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 45:49Matt Farah?

  Look for CCW.

• 45:52Matt Farah?

  The, the car.

• 45:56Matt Farah?

  Was very, I, I really, really got, I really, really got to understand how far you can get with one full day of training in a car like this. That was enough for me to be like, I don't know if I'd be comfortable after one day of training, going wheel to wheel in this car. But I do feel like with a couple of days of training, which if you're planning on racing GT3 is nothing, then you could really be comfortable. I did not feel comfortable messing with the, the settings and shit while driving. I'm not, I don't know, I don't know how much you have to do to, to get there.

• 46:37Matt Farah?

  If I was messing with stuff, it was while I was stopped, not while I was lapping.

• 46:42Speaker 01

  Dude, so this, this person, this driver was in a KTM Expo GTX 2022 on slicks and they ran a 143.

• 46:50Matt Farah?

  Oh.

• 46:51Speaker 01

  I guess.

• 46:51Matt Farah?

  Oh, I guess I was running.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  Well, the title is 143 isn't fast enough, so I guess maybe they beat that.

• 46:55Matt Farah?

  Guess I was running pretty good.

• 46:57Speaker 01

  I think it's, I think you're fast, dude. Uh, oh yeah, here. I92 GT3 Cup 143.

• 47:02Matt Farah?

  Oh, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I think I got that wrong.

• 47:10Matt Farah?

  I don't think it was 140.0. I think it was 143.0.

• 47:18Matt Farah?

  I think it was 143.0 and not 140.0.

• 47:21Speaker 01

  Okay. I mean, still very fast company.

• 47:24Matt Farah?

  No, that, that sounds right. There's, I was, there's absolutely no chance that I was three seconds faster than a GT3 Cup car. Zero. I, I actually, in hindsight, I think I said it wrong and I think it's 143. I have this written down, by the way. My job, my, my primary job is to write this for an article, okay? I have, I have the documents. I think I got it wrong. It's not 140.0. I think it's 143.0. So either way, is that, that's the record in a cup car? That's the fastest cup car?

• 47:54Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, it's the fastest thing I have found in quick search.

• 47:56Matt Farah?

  Okay.

• 47:56Speaker 01

  But this is.

• 47:57Matt Farah?

  Well, so either way, decent.

• 47:59Speaker 01

  CCW, yeah.

• 47:59Matt Farah?

  All right. Yeah, decent. Sure. And go Ford.

• 48:06Speaker 01

  I like, I was about to say, I don't know any of these people's names, then I get to Dogbone, and I do not know who Dogbone is.

• 48:11Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 48:12Speaker 01

  You know, whoever this Enromano is, they're driving cup car and an expo.

• 48:16Matt Farah?

  Expo GTX. What is a crossbow GTX? That's the, is that, that's the racing crossbow, right?

• 48:21Speaker 01

  Definitely.

• 48:21Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Okay, well, okay, so the point of all this is, I guess, the GTD, isn't it? So, before I get there, I will say, I, here's why I'm me. I did that one great, my one best feeling lap, and I was like, nope, that's it. And I probably, and they're like, you got about 10 minutes of fuel left, and I went, nope, nope. Thank you very much. Good night and good luck, sir. Yeah, if I, if I went one more, off, for sure. And I think that this particular track makes me look better than I am, because there is no runoff here.

• 49:06Matt Farah?

  So if, you know, if we were at a track with a bunch of runoff, like Cota or something, Pat Long or Yorg or fucking, whoever Ford's factory driver is, is going so deep into the runoff every corner, and my brain isn't wired to do that. Chuck Walla has no runoff. It's curbing and then rocks.

• 49:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:23Matt Farah?

  So, the advantages that a comfy pro driver would take in line don't really exist at this particular track.

• 49:31Speaker 01

  Right, like when, when you watch F1 or something else, but they, they're 90, 95% of their car is over the line.

• 49:37Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 49:37Speaker 01

  But the tire just stays in, so that, you know, they don't get a five-second penalty.

• 49:41Matt Farah?

  Exactly.

• 49:42Speaker 01

  Right.

• 49:43Matt Farah?

  Exactly. But, I, I mean, I had so much fun driving the race car, like, it's, I think, I think, I don't have what it would take to race that car. Like, I don't want to drive it in a field of other race cars. I think just me trying to push it myself on my, with no one else there, that was hard enough. Like, that, I, that was, that was, I found that to be a very rewarding challenge. But the, the challenge of racing it wheel to wheel...

• 50:16Matt Farah?

  I don't know, might be a little further than my, my desires. I don't think I would, I think there's other people that would push harder than I would push in a race like that. I think I'd want to race, race something. I'd want to race the dark horse R. I could, I can, I have time to think in between things in a, in a car like that. Whereas it's, it's even to run one lap in the GT3 for me is a, you know.

• 50:41Speaker 01

  I think graduating up is, it's you, it's how a smart person would go about racing. And if you win the lottery and you suddenly jump from getting your SCCA license in a Miata to I'm getting Ferrari Challenge now because I can afford it and the speeds increased so dramatically and everything happened so fast, there's a lot to get used to and that's probably why you end up with people going off.

• 51:02Matt Farah?

  The Multimatic guys are like, you, you wouldn't be surprised to find out how many people go from license to this because it's just, you know, money. You know, you, you can, you can hire a team, rent a car and he's like, you know, I go, I'm trying to tell them about the car and I'm like, I'm sorry, I'm, I'm probably not that good at like describing the nuances of race cars. He's like, well, there's pros. He's like, but you're better than, you know, the hedge fund guy, you know, who's like, my first race car is a GT3. He's like, you at least have like that idea of like what grip and dynamics and stuff are. I said, all right, cool. So that shit was fucking crazy. And now my neck is hurting. I'm wanting to do some

• 51:45Matt Farah?

  of those band exercises on my neck. Damn.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  Yeah. If you're good, well, before Cota, you probably should.

• 51:52Matt Farah?

  That's a street tire race. I'm running, we're running E92 M3 on street tires. So I'm not worried about my neck there. This, running 60 laps with downforce and full slicks, especially there. Chuck Walla is all third and fourth gear sweepers and that fucking bowl corner, which dude, the bowl in the GT3 was really something.

• 52:15Speaker 01

  That's gotta feel like Daytona.

• 52:16Matt Farah?

  It was, that was a, it was really one of those.

• 52:20Speaker 01

  Super cool. What a good, what a good day.

• 52:23Matt Farah?

  The, I'll tell you what, the GT3 makes curbs disappear. Just.

• 52:29Matt Farah?

  Just glide. Wow. And to segue, you know what else does? The GTD. Really? The GTD is made for hitting curbs hard. And it, this thing, this is, this is nice. This is, this is alright. You know, they're, they're asking a mega fuck ton of money for this car, for a Mustang. Mm-hmm. This blue, beautiful, absolutely beautiful blue car. They, thank God they brought a good car. I had to educate the multimatic guy. They were like, I was like, oh, thank God you brought a good car. They're like, yes, we have white, black, and blue. I said, use the white and black ones for crash testing.

• 53:11Matt Farah?

  Get some red, some yellows. Yeah. And I explained to him why press cars. And he was like, oh. And I was like, just thank you for bringing the blue. Cause this blue is beautiful. Um, this also, they were very clear to point out is a, is a multimatic product. This is, this is, and it drives like it. This is, this thing is fucking awesome. Um, uh, it's, okay, it's 815 horsepower. It's, uh, it's, it's a, it's a fuck ton of power. It's a huge amount of power. And it's that fabulous, the Tremec, uh, transaxle, the eight-speed. Um, similar to the GT500, upgraded a bit.

• 53:53Matt Farah?

  It has, uh, rear-mounted oil and transcoolers in what is effectively a hollow trunk. Uh, a huge amount of active downforce and aerodynamics, front and rear. This crazy swan-neck wing. Uh, they don't all have the swan-neck wing. That's a package, right? You can get the, or they all have the swan-neck. They don't, some of them have a fixed wing, then they have the active wing. I had the active wing, cause of course. Mm-hmm. Uh, and then it has the, the track mode drop, like the Generation 2 4GT did, where you have to be parked and it goes and like slams it. Uh, in this photo, it is in track mode, I think.

• 54:34Matt Farah?

  I think it gets like low and it goes back up when you turn the car off. So you can't shut it off in track mode.

• 54:42Speaker 01

  Can't hard park it?

• 54:43Matt Farah?

  Yeah, you can, you have to leave it running.

• 54:45Speaker 01

  The wing on this thing, it extends beyond the rear bumper.

• 54:48Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 54:49Speaker 01

  You need to put a red flag on it when you drive on the highway.

• 54:51Matt Farah?

  It is enormous. Yeah. Um, so.

• 54:57Matt Farah?

  Uh, it's and, and because of the center exit, a Kropovich exhaust, it does have a, a unique sound that I've not heard really from a Mustang before. It does sound different. It's cool. It's a metallic rasp, um, that typically you would get from German cars that you, that you get from here. Um, the body's carbon. This one had the interior carbon also. Uh, the Multimatic guys like removed the hood grates, uh, before the track. Um, which they said you don't really have to do, but it was a hundred degrees and they were like, can't hurt. Um, and so it has inboard, uh, inboard rear suspension, which you can't see in the mirror while you're driving

• 55:40Matt Farah?

  unless you tilt the mirror down. Um, but if the passenger like looks back there and I have a camera.

• 55:45Speaker 01

  There's a window where the backseat backrest would be.

• 55:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Yeah. And unlike the, the GT3 RS, you can fold the seats forward. So you can actually throw shit back there, which is good.

• 55:56Matt Farah?

  You know, Farley made a big deal about this going after the GT3 RS, which I think strictly on a lap time for lap time comparison is fair. I mean, they, they run, I think the three RS Manti is still quicker, but they're, but they're in, they're in the same, same league, you know, they're, they're both doing sixes, um, which is insanely fast, you know, regular, regular drivers aren't doing sixes in either of those cars.

• 56:22Speaker 01

  Yeah. The official time for the GTD is 652.

• 56:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah. And what's GT3 RS? It's a, it's a little better, but I think it's a little better.

• 56:32Matt Farah?

  But nevertheless, they, they're, they're, they're in the zone, right? Six forty-nine, yeah, so eight seconds. Absolute, six fifty-two to six forty-nine, that's three seconds. You said fifty-two. Oh, fifty-two, right, three seconds. Yeah, so that's, you know, different day, different driver, maybe, right?

• 56:50Matt Farah?

  So, I got, I only drove it on the street for maybe half an hour during lunch. My concern, because it has three twenty-five fronts and three forty-five rears, was that it would be even nastier to drive on the street than the Dark Horse, which has three oh-five fronts and I think three twenty-five rears or three fifteen rears. But, um, on the street, amazingly enough, it tramlined less than the Dark Horse. So it's just alignment thing? It's just an alignment thing. Yeah. Um, now, it did catch some edges, because these front tires are crazy wide.

• 57:30Matt Farah?

  Um, but it wasn't bad. It, it, it, my, my initial concerns about how it drives on the street, uh, may have been premature, because it actually seems to drive straight just fine, which is good. Um, that's, that's what we want. Um, now, and, and on the track, it's really good. Uh, the front rear balance is fucking awesome. I just turned everything off right away, not to brag, I just wanted to see like how it was. Man, talk about a car that does not do anything you don't tell it to do. Wow. Does all the things you tell it to do, it does nothing you don't, it's great.

• 58:10Matt Farah?

  Um, if you, it's, in, in some modes, I, the guy, the guy, Multimatic guy, bless his heart, kept telling me that it was gonna shift when I hit red line, even in manual mode. And maybe there's a mode where that does happen, but I hit, spin the, then the knee, hit M, and it didn't do that. If you hit red line, it banged the red line, perfect.

• 58:33Matt Farah?

  It's eight gears, so the gears are a little shorter, so it's the most people, if you consider a corner a quote second gear corner. In this, it's a third gear corner, particularly because you just have like monster torque across the thing. You don't need to sit at red line all the time. You can rev the engine a little lower and still go like real fast, so um. It's stupidly fast, obviously. I would say for the first.

• 59:02Matt Farah?

  Let's say 10.

• 59:06Matt Farah?

  Maybe the first. Yeah, the first like eight to 10 hard stops, like full bore. Threshold braking. For the first 10. The brakes are better than the GT3 car. Like. And then it and then it tapers off, and I'm not saying the brakes go away, you could easily run a full track day session with the brakes, but but but they go from. Holy motherfucking shit to simply very, very good. After about 10 stops on a hot day, but the first stops. I was like, what the fuck like huge, just just amazing braking performance, really good.

• 59:47Speaker 01

  Well, the front tires are.

• 59:48Matt Farah?

  And also.

• 59:49Speaker 01

  Wide as.

• 59:49Matt Farah?

  Three, three 25 fronts.

• 59:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:52Matt Farah?

  And three 45 rears and an active aero under braking. So you haven't, you have the use of an air brake to to a certain degree, it's not the same as a big McLaren flippy one, but it does do a thing. Um. And like. When you, if you break, because you're braking late now. When you turn in and you've got three 25 fronts, like the turn in is just sick. Going for compared to the GT3 car, it's got lazy steering, but for a street car, you know, a front engine, street car, the steering is very sharp. Um, but it's not, uh, it's not dirty like Ferrari, like, you know, Ferrari steering can be like, whoa.

• 1:00:32Speaker 01

  Too quick, yep.

• 1:00:32Matt Farah?

  For some people, it's, you know, especially like the F12, like before they started doing the rear steer stuff. Um, little little twitchy, this is like no problem.

• 1:00:41Speaker 01

  How's the feedback? Because I remember Dark Horse, that was one of my complaints about that car in the canyon was it was pretty numb.

• 1:00:46Matt Farah?

  Same, I mean, they've, you know, there's, there's not a lot there, I mean, you can tell what the front wheels are doing. But that's where GT3 RS, you know, has them dead to rights, uh, it's still a.

• 1:01:00Matt Farah?

  Fairly digital, you know, experience, in the same way it is in all the other Mustangs.

• 1:01:06Speaker 01

  Speaking of 3RS, quick correction, the 3RS did the 649, Manti, that was just the regular car, not the Manti car.

• 1:01:12Matt Farah?

  Oh, good.

• 1:01:13Speaker 01

  So I just wanted to add that correction.

• 1:01:14Matt Farah?

  Sure. Fair. So, uh, the 50/50 weight balance is absolutely crucial. It's mainly because you have that rear transaxle and because you have that cooling system at the rear. They've just, and because the wing is hanging off the back of the car. But you really do, like, that's so important because it just means that you can make these micro-adjustments in the mid-corner and you can really get the fucking hammer down super early and just dance it on the way out. Like, it's just fabulous. When you hit, like, at Chuck Waller,

• 1:02:00Matt Farah?

  where is the best, the best, because this is gonna be a little inside baseball if people have never been to Chuck Waller, but Zach's been there a lot. Okay. The front, running, uh, running counterclockwise, so you're passing the pit left to right.

• 1:02:13Speaker 01

  Pit's on your right side.

• 1:02:15Matt Farah?

  Yes, that, that, the front straight, the braking zone, has a chicane in it. And it's a chicane where you can take a lot of curbing. If your car can be steady under braking, you can take a lot of curbing. So, this car, I, I dove in before hitting the brakes, stood on the brake pedal about 20 feet before the curb and was full engagement over the curb and the car just went, huh.

• 1:02:45Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:02:45Matt Farah?

  Uh.

• 1:02:46Speaker 01

  It didn't go like, uh, uh, uh, anything weird?

• 1:02:48Matt Farah?

  No, it was really nice, yeah, right, oh, there we go, get us a little visual there. Yeah, so it's this chicane at the end of the front braking zone.

• 1:02:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're coming here from top right down here and you just, jupe.

• 1:03:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah. This is a, this is a very fun track Chuck Walla. It's really flowy. Um, it's a great endurance track because it's not very hard on brakes. Uh, this front braking zone, uh, and then the long back straight, uh, if you zoom out. Those are the only two hard braking zones. Um, and they're both followed by long periods of not braking. And so your brakes really don't get too hot. So you can run a good endurance race here. Um, I really like this track.

• 1:03:31Speaker 01

  It's really fun.

• 1:03:32Matt Farah?

  It's the middle of nowhere, but as long as you rent the cabin, it's alright.

• 1:03:35Speaker 01

  And there's good elevation, which obviously this doesn't show very well, but there's the, I mean, the bowl is fun, but you climb this hill on the back straight. And when you're going clockwise, the way this drops down from the back straight into the bowl is really exciting. It's only like a 30 foot, maybe 50 foot drop, but it's enough. And then of course, over here, this is what, what I will call Cayenne Hill where we almost had a big oopsie daisy in 2012 with a camera car.

• 1:04:00Matt Farah?

  Yeah. It's like, it's similar to Buttonwillow, um, this track, but it's, it's prettier than Buttonwillow. And it's, I think, uh, more fun and has 20% more elevation than Buttonwillow.

• 1:04:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I would say the elevation feels more natural here in Buttonwillow, like the hill.

• 1:04:18Matt Farah?

  Yeah. They just built mounds.

• 1:04:20Speaker 01

  Plop. It's just a plop. Yeah.

• 1:04:22Matt Farah?

  It's a plop. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I really, I really do like Chuck Walla.

• 1:04:26Speaker 01

  Chuck Walla is really fun.

• 1:04:27Matt Farah?

  So, okay. What else can I tell you about the GTD? Are there questions? Uh, we can't even have questions. We can talk about it.

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  Well, I have a quick funny GTD story to add. So I did Spike's Car Radio on Saturday and I decided to drive the dark horse up there because you were back in time. And I said, great, I'll drive that up. And he had never seen one before. He had no idea what it was, even though he likes Mustangs. So I get there, we park it and he goes, oh, a friend of mine is coming and he's bringing someone else who's bringing a Mustang. And I was like, who's your friend? His friend is like a police captain. This guy shows up. Police captain's friend who pulls in is Bo Bachmann.

• 1:04:58Matt Farah?

  Oh, that's hilarious.

• 1:04:59Speaker 01

  Driving his pink GTD.

• 1:05:01Matt Farah?

  Sick.

• 1:05:01Speaker 01

  Just up, just, I mean, upstate's dark horse, I don't care at all.

• 1:05:04Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:04Speaker 01

  But the dark horse, or sorry, the GTD one pulled in.

• 1:05:07Matt Farah?

  Did they do a show or did they just hang out?

• 1:05:08Speaker 01

  He was just hanging out.

• 1:05:09Matt Farah?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:05:09Speaker 01

  It looks incredible. It looks big.

• 1:05:11Matt Farah?

  Especially in Bo's like psych.

• 1:05:12Speaker 01

  Bo's color is cool, but the window to the suspension is rad. I mean, everything about it. It has a presence.

• 1:05:18Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:18Speaker 01

  It's a large vehicle.

• 1:05:19Matt Farah?

  Yeah, it's huge. Well, that's, so that's the one thing, like, the one thing I didn't get, and Ford says they're at, when the car comes to LA, we're absolutely gonna get one for a week, so like, whatever, but, but, um, it's enormous, right? And Mike Levine was there, and I was like, giving him some shit about the thing being enormous. And he's like, what does it matter on the track? And I was like, people are gonna park these at fucking Trader Joe's, dude. Like, there, it's the size of like an F-150. Like, it's huge. Um, but, that's, so I got my capsule experience on a, on a racetrack that I had all to myself. Does it feel big on the track? No, it doesn't feel big on the track when you have a whole track to yourself. It's fine. On a, in Malibu, it probably will feel enormous.

• 1:06:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. I wanna measure it. I'm curious how much bigger it is than...

• 1:06:07Matt Farah?

  We did the width. It's, it's pretty close to the width of an Aventador if you count the GTD's mirrors, but don't count the Aventadors. The Aventador has really long mirrors.

• 1:06:18Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:06:18Matt Farah?

  That, that accentuates its width, but, um, it's, it's big. I mean, it's like eight inches wider than a regular Mustang.

• 1:06:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, and because it's a front-engine car, the hood is very tall because of pedestrian crash standards.

• 1:06:31Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  So it's, it's a thick one. It's thick.

• 1:06:33Matt Farah?

  Yeah, not much you can do with it. So, so, other than the lap time, the vibe of it is so much different from the GT3RS that I don't think the comparison works. Uh, I, I just don't. Um, I, I do think that if you like Mustangs and you want the ultimate street legal track day Mustang, this is the best Mustang I've ever driven.

• 1:06:57Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:06:58Matt Farah?

  I mean, by a, by a margin, you know? The GT350R was incredibly special, um, you know, uh, 10 years ago, and they're still special now, absolutely. But this is another, this is a multimatic product. This is not a fucking Ford. It's barely a Ford.

• 1:07:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:14Matt Farah?

  At this point. Um, the, the way that it... And and like, what is it, what are the compromises for this thing? Well, you have no backseat, you have no trunk, you have very wide front tires. It's it's enormous and it's expensive. Those are your, those are your compromises. There aren't others. That's it. It it, the software, the UI, oh yeah, and and other downside is when you're sitting in it, there is zero difference from a dark horse to this. Other, I mean, it's an automatic, but so zero difference from a GT with a fucking Recaro's. It's Mustang. That that's it. Even, you know, the GT3RS, A, a 911 is much nicer than a Mustang.

• 1:07:59Matt Farah?

  But a GT3RS is nicer than a 911. They have unique door cards. They have, they have certain unique interior features that do go above and beyond. In a way, the GTD does not go above and beyond. Okay? So, um, but, but having said that, like, they just feel completely different. I mean, the vibe of the ultimate Mustang and the vibe of the quote ultimate Porsche, they're different vibes. They're, one is the Caribbean and and one is Hawaii. One is Paris and one is Rome. One is New York and one is fucking LA. You know, they're like, they're both sick, but like, they're just so different.

• 1:08:42Matt Farah?

  So, um, and like, is it worth? It's insanely expensive. That blue car was $460,000. Like, does it feel like that? Like, what does that mean? Like, what does it feel like? Not when you're sitting there parked, certainly doesn't. Um, you know.

• 1:09:02Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, and does a, does a GT3RS feel like the MSRP they charge? Now, it has different door cards. It does feel different than a 911, but does it feel like 300, 400 grand? It's just such a subjective question based on.

• 1:09:15Matt Farah?

  I, I think, yeah, no. I think it's, that's an insane number, too. But I think it's somehow more easily justifiable. I think um somehow but like I don't know I don't have the fucking kind of money anyway. They'll sell every one of these things, every one of these. There are enough rich Mustang enthusiasts that they don't even need to go outside that pool.

• 1:09:37Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:09:38Matt Farah?

  There won't, if you're not already like, you're not gonna be able to get allocation for this fucking thing.

• 1:09:42Speaker 01

  Not for a while, yeah.

• 1:09:43Matt Farah?

  So like, uh, it's amazing, it's amazing. Whatever it costs, it costs. Like, it's a fuck ton. It's a fuck ton.

• 1:09:53Speaker 01

  But it's, it is cool that it was made by Multimatic.

• 1:09:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:56Speaker 01

  Who made, I mean, the G, the Ford GT, I mean, they've made a lot of different, really high-end amazing race cars.

• 1:10:01Matt Farah?

  Honestly, if I had to do a track day in a 2017 to 2019 Ford GT. I'm not talking about the crazy Mark IV race car, but like the, the one that we drove down and carried. If I was gonna do a track day in that or the GTD, GTD.

• 1:10:16Speaker 01

  Why other than sound, or in addition to sound, I should say?

• 1:10:19Matt Farah?

  Uh, I just, uh, I think, uh, I'd be more comfortable pushing it harder. Like, it's, it was really fun to like push the GTD really hard, where I would be nervous about doing that in the GT. Because of its value and, um, I don't know, I've never tried to push a GT that hard to really see what would happen. I'm sure it's good.

• 1:10:45Speaker 01

  Well, it's funny is with this day, you had this, this ramp of Mustangs you warmed up to GTD. And there's no warm-up for Ford GT.

• 1:10:53Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 1:10:53Speaker 01

  There's no baby version and then, you know, uh, stouter version and then you're up in it, or GT.

• 1:10:58Matt Farah?

  Yeah, but I just, I found the Mustang to be not necessarily more exciting. Because visually, obviously, the GT is more exotic and exciting, but like, just in, in the way it, in the way it went through a corner, in the way it took a bump, in the way it, the brakes, the brakes were just like mind-blowing. Um, in, in the stability of it, when you really started to, to push it really hard. I just thought was exceptional across the board. Um, you know, the only things that I don't like about it are that in some ways it does feel kind of, you know, like the, the, you know, the interior's, you know, bland and Mustang-y.

• 1:11:39Matt Farah?

  And it's, and it's huge. Like, and those are things that, uh, neither I nor they are going to change. So like, it's, it's, it's just, it's fabulous to drive. It really is fabulous to drive.

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  It is a bummer that for a car that is this expensive and is made by people who are absolutely brilliant and can transform any material into anything they need to really, that they couldn't do something with like door card and little dash accent, something that just tells you.

• 1:12:07Matt Farah?

  There are some carbon bits, like this has a carbon dash trim thing.

• 1:12:11Speaker 01

  We can buy that on eBay.

• 1:12:12Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:12:13Speaker 01

  So that's what I'm saying is it'd be cool if they could judge up the outside, or sorry, the inside, because the outside looks insane.

• 1:12:20Matt Farah?

  Outside is thoroughly jushed.

• 1:12:21Speaker 01

  And if you look in the backseat, that's like, there's the whimsy.

• 1:12:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:25Speaker 01

  But it's, you have to look everywhere except right in front of you when you're driving the car. Mm-hmm. The only downside that I hear.

• 1:12:31Matt Farah?

  But like, fuck, I mean, it's, it's, it's at least on the track and on desert highways. I haven't got to take in the canyons yet. Well, we're gonna get to do a road driving video with one as just as soon as we get it. Um, but.

• 1:12:48Speaker 01

  So this panel right here, uh...

• 1:12:50Matt Farah?

  All the same, same as regular Mustang.

• 1:12:52Speaker 01

  So in the dark horse, when I was driving to Spikes.

• 1:12:54Matt Farah?

  Zach's talking about, there's a, there's a row of, uh, hard buttons sort of in front of the shifter.

• 1:13:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:01Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:01Speaker 01

  So when you press on those buttons in the dark horse at least, all of them moved a little bit. And if you press on the top of it, it doesn't activate any of the controls, but all of the buttons move, because it's all actually one piece of plastic.

• 1:13:13Matt Farah?

  It's all one, one plastic.

• 1:13:13Speaker 01

  You're hitting the button underneath the panel.

• 1:13:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:15Speaker 01

  I was just wondering, I just, that just left to my mind as I look at this. I'm wondering if it's a little better than this.

• 1:13:19Matt Farah?

  It's, I doubt it. It's probably exactly the same piece. Yeah, probably exactly the same piece. Um, I did do a few slides and it, while the 50/50 balance and the 800 horsepower are certainly good for sliding, I very easily hit the lock stops on the steering. There is none. I, I did, uh, the, the...

• 1:13:43Matt Farah?

  The last two corners before the front straight. Then Lee was sliding in 2012 in the yellow car. Two rights and then a left. Yeah, the big left and then the big right and then the big left. Yeah. So, the first one, pretty nice, little wiggly on the gather up. And then the last two were great, except I fucking hit the lock stops on both. And I was like, nope, that's it. So there's not a lot of angle on this car. So it's not optimized for a Durifto. I'm sure the turning radius is not good. I mean, those tires are so wide. Absolute dogshit.

• 1:14:19Matt Farah?

  You know what's funny is, I did it in track mode, which is lower. Now, the turning, the angle won't change. The tires are huge. Yeah, they're just big. Yeah, it's just not gonna do it. The car looks awesome, though. The fender flares. It did hold a third gear slide through the sweeper, right until I hit the lock stops.

• 1:14:36Matt Farah?

  That's it. Did you loop or did you just come snap? No, I gathered it up, but like, that was the end.

• 1:14:43Matt Farah?

  Uh, but man, it's a thing, though. It's fucking, this is, this car is sick. It's imperfect in ways that compromised machines are. In this case, it's just giant. But it's fast, it's balanced, it's a lot of fun to huck around a racetrack. And it's nice when you're driving slow, too. I mean, it's not clunky at all when you're slow, and it's a fucking regular car. It's great. Yeah, comfort mode is like, very chill. Super cool. Yeah, really, really nice. Good job, Ford. I wish it was half what it cost. I understand why it probably can't be, but like, at like, 200 grand, like, no brainer.

• 1:15:28Matt Farah?

  Absolute, you know, toe-to-toe with the ZR1, no brainer. But at, you know, 100K more than the ZR1. Ooh, you know, forget the GT3 RS. That's really where the comparison is gonna be. And we will have both at Performance Car of the Year, which will real... That's good. That's gonna be getting to go back to back with GT3. Not RS. We don't get an RS. It's the GT3 we're getting is a wing car with comfort seats and a stick.

• 1:15:58Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:15:59Matt Farah?

  So my guess is it doesn't win the lap times, but editor's choice, maybe. It's a contender for editor's choice. We got... I mean, this year's lineup is fucking heavy.

• 1:16:08Speaker 01

  This versus the R1.

• 1:16:09Matt Farah?

  This is the R1.

• 1:16:11Speaker 01

  Goliath, Goliath.

• 1:16:11Matt Farah?

  It's gonna be, yeah. I mean,

• 1:16:15Matt Farah?

  it's gonna be... It's gonna be a lot of fun. I can't wait to go back to back with this and the ZR1. It's gonna be really, really fun. But I'm just... I'm extremely impressed with what they're able to make this car do. It's fucking really good. It's very, very fun. And even with everything full off, like if you drive, you know, not stupid, it's great. No ill manners.

• 1:16:42Speaker 01

  Nice.

• 1:16:43Matt Farah?

  Really nice, yeah. You wanna get to questions?

• 1:16:46Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:16:46Matt Farah?

  You know what? Before we get to questions, um, I... Yeah. I am gonna have a little whiskey for questions. What do you say?

• 1:16:55Speaker 01

  I'm gonna skip.

• 1:16:55Matt Farah?

  Okay. But hold the fort for a minute. Uh, the live... Are there live people? They can wait.

• 1:17:01Speaker 01

  They'll wait.

• 1:17:08Speaker 01

  Someone did 145.

• 1:17:13Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, David. I think on lap meta, that was a... Oh, I closed the window. Um, I think it was like a Huracan Evo track car or something like that. So 143 is fast. And what is the power of this expo thing?

• 1:17:31Speaker 01

  Expo G.

• 1:17:42Speaker 01

  The Expo GTX 2020. Well, looks in every way like a race car. Let me go back for a second.

• 1:17:53Speaker 01

  Wow, crossbow, whatever you want to call it, KTM crossbow, GTX and GT2.

• 1:18:00Speaker 01

  6-speed sequential, 530 horsepower. And this car cannot weigh that much, car, whatever you want to call it.

• 1:18:10Speaker 01

  So, weight without fuel, so dry weight, I guess, let's call it 2,200 pounds, 2,300 pounds. 2,300 pounds. The Crossbow GTX, Matt Farah.

• 1:18:19Matt Farah?

  Yes, sir.

• 1:18:19Speaker 01

  Is a 530 horsepower car that weighs about 2,200 pounds dry. So, for you to be knocking on the door of that thing.

• 1:18:31Matt Farah?

  That's ripping.

• 1:18:31Speaker 01

  With a lot more weight. GT3 is way heavier. That's incredible.

• 1:18:36Matt Farah?

  Wow. Little Johnny Walker Blue. Let's keep it real.

• 1:18:41Speaker 01

  We got that from Hussein, right?

• 1:18:43Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:43Speaker 01

  We captured it from his bunker.

• 1:18:44Matt Farah?

  We did. All right, let's go to the people.

• 1:18:48Speaker 01

  We got some leftovers and then we got a bunch of new stuff.

• 1:18:50Matt Farah?

  Okay, well, we'll fucking, let's see what kind of energy we got, yo. Of course, if you want to ask questions for the live show, if you want to watch the live show, if you want to get the show before everybody else, if you want to get the show without ads, if you want to get extra bonuses and features and even extra podcast episodes entirely, patreon.com/thesmogentirepodcast. Not to mention, if you're in that kind of mood, by far, the best thing you could do for us as creators, as a fan, is join the Patreon. It's better than watching all the ads, it's better than watching us or listening on any platform. It's just the best thing that you can do. A couple leftovers from last show.

• 1:19:30Matt Farah?

  Uh, Flying Monkey, "The electric G-Wagon has been declared a flop by Mercedes due to poor sales, but loved by journalists and reviewers. Can you think of other cars in the past that got high praise but were complete failures with the public and didn't sell?" Yes, but first can I just say that I think maybe in two years, a used electric G-Wagon may be my next daily driver fuck-around car.

• 1:19:56Speaker 01

  Cause the depreciation is probably insane.

• 1:19:57Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I bet it's crazy cheap. Yeah, we're gonna have to revisit that in two years, cause Hannah loves a G-Wagon. So, that could be the kinda thing that we could find for fucking nothing, yeah. Um, what else was praised well but didn't sell very well?

• 1:20:14Speaker 01

  Every Lotus.

• 1:20:15Matt Farah?

  Yup.

• 1:20:16Speaker 01

  Um, it sold pretty well.

• 1:20:19Matt Farah?

  Every, look up, like, every Motor Trend Car of the Year is like a fucking flop.

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  Except for Porsche stuff.

• 1:20:25Matt Farah?

  Right.

• 1:20:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:26Matt Farah?

  Um, hmm, I mean, apparently the Alpine A110 does not sell very well, even though everyone who drives it seems to think it's the greatest thing ever.

• 1:20:36Speaker 01

  Small, light sports cars in general, maybe, just don't do that great.

• 1:20:39Matt Farah?

  Caterhams.

• 1:20:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, for sure.

• 1:20:41Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:20:42Matt Farah?

  Disrespectfully agree, that's a good username. "Last week on vacation, I drove up Pike's Peak. It was wonderful but terrifying because it confirmed I have a fear of heights. Are there other automotive pilgrimages I can put on my list that are maybe a bit lower to the ground?" Sure. Um, certainly Car Week is one. Uh, going to any number of iconic racetracks to watch a race, that's, I guess, the equivalent of going to all the baseball stadiums or whatever, right?

• 1:21:11Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:21:12Matt Farah?

  Um...

• 1:21:12Speaker 01

  You could go to events, like, you could go to the Daytona 500, or you could go to Gridlife to, like, watch people drive and race, and then, that way you don't have to get too high off the ground. Oh, Monster Jam?

• 1:21:26Speaker 01

  Not really a pilgrimage, but you can just go to it.

• 1:21:28Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I would say that's a pilgrimage.

• 1:21:31Speaker 01

  Oh, what is it? Million Dollar? Well, that's probably on half the ground. Million Dollar Highway in Colorado is amazing.

• 1:21:35Matt Farah?

  It is, but it's that that goes up a mountain.

• 1:21:38Speaker 01

  That's true.

• 1:21:39Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Hmm. Route 66?

• 1:21:44Speaker 01

  Death Valley. That goes down from mountains, but choose your your month wisely.

• 1:21:49Matt Farah?

  Hmm. It's a bit. Is a pilgrimage a road trip or like, because you could you can come here to California and see where they filmed the iconic Race Wars scene from Fast and the Furious? A lot of people want to do that, by the way.

• 1:22:04Speaker 01

  Really? They want to go and they want to go to the tuna place store and the Fast and Furious house.

• 1:22:09Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I usually just take them to Neptune's Net. The house and the tuna store, not good. Dance of the Carvoyants. Ah, a little Pearl Jam reference in there. How come I see an RV flat towing a vehicle? Nine times out of 10, it's a two-door base Jeep Wrangler. Is there something specific about a Jeep that makes it good for flat towing or runabout? Yeah, I think it make I think a two-door Wrangler, I don't know what makes it. It might be easier to hook up a flat tow bar to the front of it, just because it's like, I don't know, solid axle or whatever, like.

• 1:22:41Speaker 01

  And I think they probably have the the space that's open for a winch. You can probably just put a flat tow thing in there.

• 1:22:45Matt Farah?

  Probably. There's probably some very easy way, but also like if you're a traveling person, like retired or whatever, whatever, and you wanted a a car that could do any adventure, you know, a two-door Wrangler is a pretty good choice for towing behind an RV. I mean, you can take the top off if you're somewhere nice. If you're going like skiing, you could drive it in the snow. You can, you know, it's an old school automatic transmission, so you just throw it, put it in neutral easily, which makes it good for flat towing. I think that it's light. A Wrangler is a pretty light, light vehicle.

• 1:23:23Speaker 01

  I was looking. It seems like they're all about 3,000 pounds. 85 CJ is 26 to 2900. Not bad.

• 1:23:31Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, it's got a small footprint.

• 1:23:34Speaker 01

  Easy to maneuver.

• 1:23:35Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I think it's a great choice. Great choice for towing behind your RV. Yeah. My vanos is bleeding.

• 1:23:43Matt Farah?

  I drive past a body shop on my commute and it's starting to accumulate crashed Teslas. Are replacement parts still an issue? I haven't heard that in a while. I don't know.

• 1:23:52Speaker 01

  I don't know either.

• 1:23:53Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Everything clean but the ashtray. If the SSC to Watara is a Corvette to Pagani. What is a Corvette? Wait.

• 1:24:06Matt Farah?

  Is a Corvette Pagani, what's a Corvette 911? Oh, no, that, right. So that's sort of not how that works. The answer to what is the Corvette to a 911 is just Corvette. Is an actual Corvette.

• 1:24:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:24:19Matt Farah?

  Right?

• 1:24:20Speaker 01

  I don't think there's anything in between, right?

• 1:24:24Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, there is nothing else that has a rear engine flat six configuration. So you can't, there's no like one to one, but like-

• 1:24:31Speaker 01

  Well, you came in.

• 1:24:32Matt Farah?

  Sure.

• 1:24:33Speaker 01

  It's mid, but-

• 1:24:35Matt Farah?

  Sure. Yeah.

• 1:24:37Speaker 01

  I guess that is it.

• 1:24:39Matt Farah?

  No, the, the, that's not how that works. The metaphor was, doesn't work like that. The answer to what is the Corvette of 911s is Corvette. Like, I'm sorry, it just is. Like, that's, that's why I used Corvette of Pagani's. Because Corvette of other things was already taken by the actual Corvette. Sorry about that. Trying to be a dick like that. Klapman's freshman dorm bed. How well, how well screwed together are E34 BMWs? Are they more like E39s or more like E36s? That's a good question, and I'm gonna say that they are, uh, more like E36s.

• 1:25:21Matt Farah?

  But like, they're more expensive, so they're, the materials and some, the seats and some things are better.

• 1:25:27Speaker 01

  Maybe, I, I don't know. Uh, they were built from 87 to 96, so maybe if you get the ones that were made in the late 80s, maybe they're glued using the toxic stuff that works versus the biodegradable stuff that didn't work in the 90s. Uh, I don't know, my mom had an old, not an M5 or anything, but I don't remember it having as many interior clinkety clunks as E36 I've ever been in.

• 1:25:50Matt Farah?

  Well, it was a much more expensive vehicle, so it was put together better to begin with. But I think E46 and E39 go together and are built about the same. And E34 and E36 are built at about the same quality.

• 1:26:10Matt Farah?

  It may also be that the E34s that I've been in the presence of have just been nicer cars. Like Zuckerman's E34s are like amazing, but other ones I've seen are like kinda shitty. Browser's freaking out, trying to open this link to show you what they're talking about. Instagram handle on my window, have we had any more discussions about having a meetup in the northeast? No. Did we ever have discussions about having? Well, doing something in Seattle, yeah. That's the northwest. Oh, sorry. The northeast. Monticello Car Club, let us know. No, I mean like, I don't know if I had talked, meetups are a strange thing.

• 1:26:54Matt Farah?

  I was thinking of live podcasts, so. If, if the live podcast tour happens, there will first be a west coast one and then there would be an east coast one. We, we have to do baby steps. If I'm, if I go to something on the east coast, I would certainly share that I was going to be there, but I don't have any plans. I may, it is possible I may go to the Hilton Head concourse with my dad.

• 1:27:21Matt Farah?

  Can't, oh wait, so Bad Gardener says, have you seen the 912 Barca on Instagram, most Monaco car ever? Yeah, look at that. It's a, it's a 912 turned into a jolly, basically? Kinda, yeah, uh, sorry. Like they have the doors taken out, uh, it's a convertible. It looks like there may no, may not be a top at all. It has the doors taken out, it looks like there are teak panels.

• 1:27:51Matt Farah?

  Right? Is there, can we scroll through these images? Yeah, we've got, we've got a tie down, like a cleat and a rope. Whoa, look at the floor. Yeah, teak floors, like, those are, in some ways they're like a sailboat, in other ways they look like this cutting board that I have that's designed to catch crumbs of bread. It looks like a sauna floor. Right. Water can just fall through, no problem. Yeah. Uh, as long as those floors don't like raise the height of the floor too much. In general, I absolutely love this vibe. I wonder if it's structurally sound? Um, but I 10 out of 10 would roll around, oh, look at that bimini. That top is weird. The bimini is crazy. What is it covering really? Like?

• 1:28:35Speaker 01

  Your head, half your head, sort of?

• 1:28:38Matt Farah?

  Yeah, is there another angle of this? This overhead view is very, very odd. I want to see... I do like the teak outboards and the shape of the cutouts is very similar to a BMW Z1.

• 1:28:50Speaker 01

  I just want to show this to the audience more because Switcher Cast was having a conniption. That's the weird top, alright, and then, yeah, Z1 doors.

• 1:28:57Matt Farah?

  Teak bumper, hell yeah, on the teak bumper. I would, I would ask them to make a teak bumper for my 911 just because, oh, and then it's like, was that a hose? It's a hose. It has a, it has a water tank.

• 1:29:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, that is the same hose they have at, at our dog park at our building.

• 1:29:14Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:14Speaker 01

  They have one of those to wash dogs.

• 1:29:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah, so this would be to hose off your feet before you get back in your car at the beach.

• 1:29:20Speaker 01

  Got it.

• 1:29:20Matt Farah?

  It's actually kind of a boss move. I, dude, I'm about this. I'd, I would roll that on Intucket. But from 10 feet away, it doesn't look like it's probably, like, it's probably $600,000. And from 10 feet away, it looks like Rob Ferretti cut it with a sawzall.

• 1:29:35Speaker 01

  It does, yeah, I mean, the colors don't help. When you get up close, the colors look amazing, but from far away, especially with this camera, dark wheels, they just disappear. The whole thing looks like someone's ratty 911 they chopped up. You get close, then you can tell it was expensive.

• 1:29:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, but I do like where their head is at and I think that these, these,

• 1:29:56Matt Farah?

  the restomod beach car is a, is a good genre and should be explored. Fiat Jollies are great, like, I'm obviously Team Manks, 100% shit like this, like, yeah, let's fucking do all of that, that sounds great.

• 1:30:14Matt Farah?

  Holy, what, okay, Matt's missing Countach part. We're gonna find out what that part is and how expensive it is. Since it's a Mustang day, what is the most beautiful Mustang ever?

• 1:30:28Matt Farah?

  Zach and I are gonna have wildly different answers.

• 1:30:31Speaker 01

  Maybe, I don't know.

• 1:30:32Matt Farah?

  Most beautiful?

• 1:30:33Speaker 01

  I mean, that's, I think, like,

• 1:30:38Speaker 01

  I think 67 GT350 was very good. And then...

• 1:30:48Speaker 01

  You know what, the SN95.

• 1:30:51Speaker 01

  If you lower it, I think actually has a really good shape to it. Especially with the Terminator front. You need to lower balance. Otherwise, it's too tall.

• 1:30:58Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:30:59Speaker 01

  But that's a pretty good looking car.

• 1:31:00Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I mean, for me, the most beautiful Mustang ever is the SN95 Celine S351.

• 1:31:12Matt Farah?

  And that's where it's at for me. We can stop there. Specifically, an S351 Speedster. Now, that is a ridiculous vehicle that is not elegant by most people's standards. But in terms of...

• 1:31:28Speaker 01

  Oh, the George Foreman car?

• 1:31:30Matt Farah?

  That one is triple fucking yellow, but like, yes, different color.

• 1:31:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, that is a good looking car. Great looking car. Body kit, even with, yeah, the convertible, or Speedster, whatever.

• 1:31:42Matt Farah?

  In the right color, this is fabulous.

• 1:31:45Speaker 01

  I think these were quite shapely, and I love the proportions of headlights and the front intakes and all that stuff.

• 1:31:52Matt Farah?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:31:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:53Matt Farah?

  And mine, when I was a kid, was a clone. I cloned a Cobra R. So mine looked a little different. I didn't go this direction with mine, but it was... If, you know, I think I've talked about it, but if I found the right SN95 Celine Speedster, that might be something I was interested in. Can't unshitbox this. Bought the Notice Canyon Black Pearl as my first collector-grade watch. Thank you very much for your support. Recommendations on tools and cleaning regular care items for watch maintenance and storage. Well, I clean my watches with a very soft toothbrush and hand soap.

• 1:32:36Matt Farah?

  That's it. Just like the hand soap I wash my hands with and a soft ass tooth... Like, literally, my old toothbrush. When I retired it from my teeth, it cleans my watches. And like, there are people who are like, "Don't use a toothbrush." But like, then they buy some crazy expensive watch brush that's fucking made in the toothbrush factory.

• 1:32:53Speaker 01

  Exactly, yeah. It's made by Oral-B.

• 1:32:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Don't get a toothbrush with stiff bristles, the softest bristles you can. And then warm soap. And like, once in a while, if your watch is like, real grimy, the super secret, toothpaste. But like you don't want to use toothpaste all the time because it is abrasive and like over time, yeah. And I wouldn't use toothpaste on gold, but on a steel watch, once a year, little toothpaste polish, not so bad. Still use the toothbrush, same joint, just a quick scrub, not too much, not too heavy, but it's nice and it makes your watch smell minty. Put it back on, fresh.

• 1:33:32Matt Farah?

  And you know, tools, you get a spring bar tool, buy a nice spring bar tool. If you really give a shit on fucking Amazon, get a set of watch screwdrivers. There's like the cheap set, if it's your, if you've never had anything, get the cheap set, it's 20 bucks. That'll get you two years. And then you'll start breaking them and then you go, okay, now I'm committed, now I want a good set. The good sets may be 75. If you want to commit now, just get the good set now, it'll last you the rest of your life. So you get a good set of screwdrivers, you get a good spring bar tool, and then you're in business, that's it. If you really care, get a, you can get a loop. Like I, I, my reading glasses now help me when I'm working on my watches, but like having a loop does make it easier to change straps and do shit like that.

• 1:34:16Matt Farah?

  It's, you feel like a dork, but like you see better. Well, you feel like you're a safe cracker. Or that too. Street parked, favorite and least favorite localized road designs, i.e. the jug handles in Jersey or Texas frontage roads. Okay, my favorite are roundabouts. Roundabouts, and I've been so surprised to see them in many red states, places where I would have not thought to see progressive road design, like Arizona and where, where I fucking, North Georgia, I just was, roundabouts. Fucking fabulous, all over the place. The worst, those Michigan U-turns, those stink.

• 1:34:59Matt Farah?

  Like in Woodward, all the, you, you can't cross anywhere, you have to make these, it's similar to the jug handle, it's basically a jug handle. New Jersey jug handles stink. Texas frontage roads also suck.

• 1:35:10Speaker 01

  I don't mind them that much. I just think they're, they seem redundant. Like, everyone's going the same speed as the highway. There's so many lanes and they stretch for such a long time. It's like, it's the gentlest off-ramp. It's just, uh, and you know, and then they drop you into like a four-lane, you know, frontage road. So, I'm sure there's a reason for it, but...

• 1:35:27Matt Farah?

  I like, I like the really old highways, like the Hutchison River Parkway and the Merritt in Connecticut and here, here the 110 freeway where the, the on-ramps are so short because they're from like the twenties that you get to use launch control in like a Turbo S.

• 1:35:41Speaker 01

  You have to.

• 1:35:42Matt Farah?

  Yeah, you like have, and, and no one's like, has a problem with that.

• 1:35:44Speaker 01

  It's a safety issue if you don't, yeah. If you're in a Versa, God help you.

• 1:35:48Matt Farah?

  I like when an exit ramp on or off is designed for funsies. That's a good, you know, a good, nice camber on there. Let me load up the front end a little bit.

• 1:35:58Speaker 01

  I think whoever designed those short on-ramps here, they either had like a built muscle car in the sixties and they're like, eh, people will figure it out.

• 1:36:05Matt Farah?

  Uh, quadrofoli O-Face. Next car brand to die in the US, gotta be a Stellantis member. Uh, it does seem that way, doesn't it?

• 1:36:17Speaker 01

  It just, I'm just waiting for when Chrysler...

• 1:36:19Matt Farah?

  Chrysler, it has to be Chrysler.

• 1:36:20Speaker 01

  Their product gets absorbed by someone else because they make one thing.

• 1:36:23Matt Farah?

  Yeah. I mean,

• 1:36:28Matt Farah?

  well...

• 1:36:29Speaker 01

  Well, ooh, a question. Are they saying it has to be a US brand? Oh, it has to be a Stellantis member.

• 1:36:33Matt Farah?

  Next car brand to die in the US.

• 1:36:36Speaker 01

  It could also be, uh, struggling a lot, like Nissan, having some trouble.

• 1:36:41Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Nissan would probably be acquired for sure, right? There's gotta be some value left in that. I think it's possible that Fiat just exits the US entirely. Like, have you, is the new Fiat 500 like on sale here?

• 1:36:59Speaker 01

  I don't know. That's a good question.

• 1:37:00Matt Farah?

  What Fiats can you buy right now? Like, I don't even know what Fiats it is, it is possible to even buy today.

• 1:37:11Matt Farah?

  Fiat or, I mean Chrysler just has a Pacifica.

• 1:37:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:37:16Matt Farah?

  Maybe they just renamed the division Pacifica. Why do they even have models?

• 1:37:20Speaker 01

  Uh, so Fiat, well, most of the models on their website are from 2024.

• 1:37:24Matt Farah?

  Uh huh.

• 1:37:25Speaker 01

  So...

• 1:37:27Matt Farah?

  The 500e Giorgio Armani?

• 1:37:31Matt Farah?

  RIP, baby. Fiat, 20, these are all 2024 models, wow.

• 1:37:38Matt Farah?

  Okay?

• 1:37:38Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:37:39Matt Farah?

  Okay.

• 1:37:39Speaker 01

  So it could be them.

• 1:37:41Matt Farah?

  So maybe, yeah, maybe Fiat. Uh, Christie Yamaguchi main, nice. Um, okay, interested in a Miata. Yeah, talk to me about NC versus NB. I prefer the NC. It's, it's a much bigger vehicle by Miata standards, which does translate to room inside.

• 1:38:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, and the interior does feel like a big step forward, a little more livable. And, and I know it's like, was it 200 pounds heavier, but?

• 1:38:11Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:11Speaker 01

  It's still a very light car.

• 1:38:13Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:13Speaker 01

  And as we experienced with the, uh, turbo setup from flying Miata, it's a very, very fun car. So I, I would go NC if I was gonna go back to it.

• 1:38:23Matt Farah?

  Uh, if we could make a vi- uh, Matt Ferris million piece Countach, if we could make a video about, if we can make a video without worrying about cost or numbers, what would it be about?

• 1:38:43Matt Farah?

  Like...

• 1:38:48Matt Farah?

  I would make, you know, I would try to make that, that show that everyone tells me can't be made, basically, which is the quote, "Bourdain of Cars Show", which can be done and should be done, but someone needs to be.

• 1:39:05Speaker 01

  Uh, I always wanted to do the Learn to Drive Everything series, but now that has basically been done by Rob Dom and other people, but if I didn't have to worry about money, that's what I would do. I'd just go around to different, every single different kind of driving vehicle school, including buses and shit, and just learn how to drive that stuff.

• 1:39:22Matt Farah?

  Uh, Tim A. says, "Have we seen Larry's GT3 for sale on bat?" That's really funny. I was, I didn't know he was selling it. Um, but I was on Bring a Trailer today and I saw a car and I was like, "Oh, that looks like Larry's." I didn't realize it was, actually is. Um, yeah, I know why he's selling it. I do know why. Uh, he talked to me about it for a while. He, he, he doesn't, um, great photo. He, uh, he just doesn't have time and energy to drive it in a way that it deserves to be driven. He's got a kid right now who, um, who is very into baseball

• 1:40:06Matt Farah?

  and he spends all his time doing baseball stuff with the kid and he can't take the GT3 to do that. And when he's not doing that, he's doing other stuff and he just doesn't have time to drive it. And he has, he said when he's, when he's on, uh, you know, it was his dream to buy a GT3 and now he's had it for whatever, a year or something. And he, you know, he found himself like running errands in it just to drive it for something. You know, when he bought it, or a year, a year or so before he bought it, he was, he was really going to the track a lot and whatever. And then, you know, he kind of, he moved on from that. So, so he, he thought it was a, it was a very expensive car. And, uh, who's, and, uh, huh, sorry.

• 1:40:51Matt Farah?

  It was a very expensive car and he, he said, you know, "I could, I could free up some capital to do some other things I wanted." And, and, you know, he's got four other cars or something, you know? Yeah, he talked to me about it. I said, "Get fucking rid of it, dude." It's a GT3. If you really, if you really, really care, you can buy another one someday, you know? Uh...

• 1:41:15Matt Farah?

  Bush did 997. Do you have any Venturi experience or know anyone who's owned one? I know my Venturi experience is only coming through Matt Ivanhoe at the Curated Collector. The Curated Collector? Is that what he's called? What's Matt Ivanhoe? The Cultivated Collector. That's Matt Ivanhoe. The Cultivated Collector. Uh, and it's Venturi. Venturi, not Venture. V-A-N-T-U-R-I. It's a weird French car. Uh, Venturi 400. And, um, this is the one that we had here at West Side Collector Car Storage. Wow. They called it like the French F40. It was similar power and I drove it once. It drove weird.

• 1:41:59Matt Farah?

  It drove, um, sort of like a fast, like a Lotus Esprit kind of thing. It was that, that sort of vibe. Cool looking car. I mean, generally a very attractive car. I forgot about this thing was at, uh, it was here years ago, right? And I forgot about it. When we first opened, it was out here. Great shape. Really good looking cars. Yeah.

• 1:42:21Matt Farah?

  It's got, you know, it's like an F355. Kinda, yeah. From Timu. Yeah. A little bit. From France. Right. Um.

• 1:42:30Matt Farah?

  Okay, uh.

• 1:42:33Matt Farah?

  Keep going down? Hold on. Uh.

• 1:42:38Matt Farah?

  I think we've answered that one. Um.

• 1:42:43Matt Farah?

  Uh, keep going.

• 1:42:46Matt Farah?

  That's a fun band. That's a fun name for a user, but I don't want to answer the question right now. Uh, Into The Void. Do we have any experience with Panos? Very curious about these cars. I drove an Esperante once. It drives a lot like, it has a, you know, has a Mustang Cobra powertrain. Um, but it's sort of like, it, it, it's, it drives nicer than a Mustang Cobra. I think they're kind of weird looking. Uh, they were, I mean, reasonably successful as race cars. Pretty fast cars. They're pretty fast. Um, I only drove the one once though, but I, I smile if I see one around. John Hennessy you until next, oh, John Hennessy you next Tuesday.

• 1:43:25Speaker 01

  So funny.

• 1:43:26Matt Farah?

  Pretty funny. Uh, obviously, they're cheap for a reason. But at what point does a 2009 Mercedes 600 V12 become an actual goodbye? 10K, 5K? Like,

• 1:43:45Matt Farah?

  when you can just like leave it on the side of the road when it breaks, I guess?

• 1:43:49Speaker 01

  I think it's, it's really a finance question for the person asking too. I mean, this could, fun engine, you can do some fun things with the car.

• 1:43:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:55Speaker 01

  But if it breaks in any significant way, it will be so expensive.

• 1:44:00Matt Farah?

  Yeah, like the reason it's like at 5K, you still are gonna have a catastrophic failure that will total it. Like, there is no price at which it's a good idea. Like, cuz, cuz it's like, instead of what? You know, like, it's, it's, are we cross shopping it again? Is the ga- is the game that we're cross shopping it against the, the hypothetical $30,000 hatchback? And so if I get it for 20 and I have to spend 10, like, no. But if I, because that won't work. But if I get it for 5 and my cushion is 25, does that make sense? So that's the math. The problem is,

• 1:44:39Matt Farah?

  the lines don't like cross. Like, there is, it, it never makes sense. So the, it's like, it only makes sense if you can throw the car in the garbage. Like, if you're a person not of means, trying to make this hack work for you ain't gonna fucking happen.

• 1:44:58Speaker 01

  It could be very painful.

• 1:44:59Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:00Speaker 01

  I would, I would refer to the forums because they might be able to tell you, you know, you, hey, you can swap the air suspension for coils and you can do this thing, but just expect every computer that controls the HVAC to explode. But maybe you can end up with a...

• 1:45:15Speaker 01

  Beater drift car with a V12 that'll last six months.

• 1:45:17Matt Farah?

  The problem, yeah, like not, these 600s have so many unique parts over the other car. Like, everything is expensive on them. Regular shit is. I don't know, I don't know where the math works at all. It may not.

• 1:45:30Speaker 01

  I think it's very subjective math.

• 1:45:32Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:32Speaker 01

  It's, it's up to you. How, how much is that car worth?

• 1:45:36Matt Farah?

  If it costs five grand and your budget is a hundred grand, it makes sense. Cause you can just drive it and when it breaks, you just leave it on the side of the road, take off the tags. And now you can go buy a $95,000 car. You've had your fun. That's when the math makes sense, when the car is a literal throwaway item. If you wanted to go drive off-road a thousand miles, buy one of those for five grand would be great.

• 1:46:05Matt Farah?

  Jim Kana says, checking out an auto check report on a certified pre-owned car recently. I noticed an accident. The report gave no indicated area of the car. It said only police.

• 1:46:19Matt Farah?

  Car runs and drives beautifully. I don't see any signs of respray. Have you ever seen this and do you know what this means? Have you ever seen police?

• 1:46:29Matt Farah?

  Was it rear-ended by a cop?

• 1:46:31Speaker 01

  That would be very funny.

• 1:46:32Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Was it?

• 1:46:37Matt Farah?

  It said police.

• 1:46:40Matt Farah?

  I've never, I've never seen police. Can you?

• 1:46:46Speaker 01

  I wonder if you can ask the police?

• 1:46:48Matt Farah?

  Uh, maybe?

• 1:46:52Matt Farah?

  I don't know.

• 1:46:53Speaker 01

  Ask Auto Check. You should hit their contact us.

• 1:46:55Matt Farah?

  You can probably call Auto Check and find out. Get a PPI, is all I'm saying. Dre from Houston.

• 1:47:04Matt Farah?

  Okay, wait.

• 1:47:07Matt Farah?

  Oh, alright. Okay, any movies or shows where the hero car in reality would be the downfall of the hero?

• 1:47:16Speaker 01

  Uh, oh yeah, what did I watch? Gray, okay, Gray Man. It's like two years old, they made it on Netflix with, um, Ryan Gosling. It's a good action movie, whatever. He doesn't have to emote much. He, he got, his acting chops took a break. He shoots people. But Audi obviously sponsored it. And there's a scene where he is rescued by an Audi that is extremely damaged in many ways and yet continues to run flawlessly. So I think there are so many movies where a car continually gets crashed into, but because they sponsored the movie, it just keeps working. Uh, was it Fast 9 or 10 Dodge, like outrunning the, the, you know, underwater explosion thing? And like, there's no way any of this would continue to function.

• 1:47:56Matt Farah?

  Almost every chase sequence, the cars would just be falling apart before the end of the chase sequence. The Roger Farah Podcast, four years after it came out, is the base C8 something noteworthy for under 100K? Cross shopping it with a 991.2 C2 or higher mileage SPDK. Like, not like fully base, but if you get the Z51 and the good stuff, then sure, yeah, they're great cars.

• 1:48:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. They're well under 100 now.

• 1:48:28Matt Farah?

  Yeah, really well known, yeah. I mean, I guess if they're talking about getting a new one. But I would get Z51, I'd get Mag Ride, I'd get the, I would get all of the performance stuff you can afford. Puff the Magic Draken, that's fucking cool. Um, okay, looking to get in my first Porsche, leaning towards a 718. Uh, have good budget, obviously. I prefer the looks and exhaust howl of the RS Spider. However, I already have a crazy car, a Draken, that's more comfortable with earplugs for a long drive and I don't want another. I'm thinking I could reroute the intake of the RS to reduce the noise or make

• 1:49:11Matt Farah?

  a valve setup, but would that solve the noise problem or would the top still be loud?

• 1:49:15Speaker 01

  I think the question is with the car work.

• 1:49:17Matt Farah?

  Yeah, reroute the intake system. I mean, I wouldn't, why would, I wouldn't bother doing any of that.

• 1:49:23Speaker 01

  Or a valve setup, I don't think that's a good idea.

• 1:49:25Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I mean, if you really want to... Get a fa- just get a demand motor in a Cayman or a Boxster if you want a really fast Boxster and without having to deal with that. I mean, the, the top is still pretty loud. Like, it's a we- a single-layer top, non-insulated, like, um, it's, it's not great for long drives. It's okay. It's not great. It's not what that car is about. I, I, fuck. I wouldn't get the RS and then fuck up the intake noise.

• 1:49:54Speaker 01

  Right. Of course, you spend a lot of time

• 1:49:55Matt Farah?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:56Speaker 01

  engineering that and messing with it could change so many things, probably void your warranty. So I would not do that.

• 1:50:02Matt Farah?

  Uh, waymo hand jobs from women I hardly know. Have you ever had an HPDE instructor give you completely contradictory directions? Whether it's proper line, too much slip, too little slip, etc. It seems like each person is different. How do you handle that? Uh, especially if you have a preference for a driving style that's not the instructor's style. For context, I'm in an A group with lots of solo experience and I'm working towards being an instructor. Uh, yeah, I mean,

• 1:50:36Matt Farah?

  who you have teach you is important.

• 1:50:39Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:50:39Matt Farah?

  And now that they have data, I don't want someone in my fucking car anymore. And I don't think they want to be in my car anymore. Um, for a not, not prohibitive amount of money, you too can get telemetry. Uh, and compare a, a line with a, with a, with a pro or have a pro review your lines and see if you can be accelerating or braking or turning differently based on video and that without having someone in the car. Um, I've never had two different instructors give me contradictory directions on the same day. Cause I've never taken HPDE instructors. I've always done schools and that's fine. I'm spoiled.

• 1:51:23Matt Farah?

  And not everybody can do that, but, so it's never happened, but that's funny.

• 1:51:28Speaker 01

  I've got, I haven't had it back to back, but I've seen people who are instructors and ridden with them and they drove a very different way from other instructors. So I don't know how to, like, if you get back to back, if you get different advice corner to corner with someone, that would be very confusing. Ask for clarity and then maybe hop in with a different instructor if you don't think that you like their style.

• 1:51:47Matt Farah?

  Yeah. My venous is bleeding. That's pretty fun. Uh, how do you feel about retro style wheels? Particularly, uh, yeah, there's, I, I like retro style wheels when they're done right, but it's a pretty fine line.

• 1:52:05Speaker 01

  It has to be constructed well also, like built well and look, look perfect.

• 1:52:09Matt Farah?

  Yeah. Um, Jethro Null requests an anything but cars episode. That's interesting.

• 1:52:18Speaker 01

  Maybe we could do that as a pro show?

• 1:52:20Matt Farah?

  That's a more Patreon pro show. Yeah. Anything but cars could be a pro show for September, maybe.

• 1:52:30Matt Farah?

  Okay, hang on. Uh, my other car is your mother. That's funny. Uh, looking for a Porsche 997S Cabriolet manual for 70,000. That's a ton of money for one of those, isn't it? I just sold a 997S manual earlier this year for like 42 grand. Uh, with an additional 10K set aside for maintenance. I live in, in New York City. I drive primarily on Long Island. Okay. Trying to decide between a C2S or C4S, or is it worth waiting until I can afford a turbo? Well, hang on a minute.

• 1:53:08Matt Farah?

  Do you, if you're not driving in like snow and I, literally, I mean, snow, not rain, snow. You do not need an all wheel drive Porsche. Don't need it. Car's fine in the rain. You don't need the all wheel drive. So. Why are you trying to decide between a C2S and a C4S? And I don't mean that to be insulting, like, is it because you want to drive this car?

• 1:53:38Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:53:38Matt Farah?

  As your only car throughout the winter? My guess is not. Cause if you have 70 to spend on this car, that's not your daily, probably. Right? Like, I don't think you should get a 4S. I don't, if you don't, unless you're driving the snow, I would skip it. Turbo, different story. Different feel.

• 1:53:59Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:54:00Matt Farah?

  Different car.

• 1:54:00Speaker 01

  You're almost buying it for the engine instead of for the, uh, drivetrain. Or for the all-wheel drive versus two-wheel drive.

• 1:54:06Matt Farah?

  I mean, should I, should you wait until you can afford a turbo? I don't know. Do you, would, would you rather have a turbo? I mean, if you think you can afford a turbo in six months, then don't get this now. And that, if that's what you want. But like, is that what you want? Uh, they're different cars. You know, if it's your first Porsche, you probably don't need a turbo.

• 1:54:29Speaker 01

  I think if it's your first one, do a 997S and just have the experience. Enjoy the two-wheel drive. It'll be a little lighter. The steering will be different than the four-wheel.

• 1:54:37Matt Farah?

  Especially in 997s, the, there's a big difference in steering. The newest, the newer the car, the less the front drive matters. The older the car, the more it matters. All right. Two more and then we're.

• 1:54:52Speaker 01

  These are the last four, period.

• 1:54:53Matt Farah?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:54:54Speaker 01

  We could probably just speed run.

• 1:54:56Matt Farah?

  All right. Uh, I don't know, whatever that thing is at the bottom.

• 1:55:01Speaker 01

  What?

• 1:55:02Matt Farah?

  The la, whatever that car is.

• 1:55:03Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:55:04Matt Farah?

  Find what that is.

• 1:55:05Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:55:05Matt Farah?

  Hickory dickory dock, the rod has windowed my block. And that is very fucking good. Every job has its good days and bad days. What is an example of a great day at work? And what is an example of a shitty day at work? In the automotive journalism field? I mean, I just told you about a great day. I got a whole racetrack to myself. And even another, a day before, like, a great day is a day where you get to drive something good, learn something new, experience something about cars that maybe you've never experienced before. Uh, you know, maybe improve your driving skills. Maybe you fucking nail a slide for camera. Maybe you look like a hero because you did something cool. Those are good days.

• 1:55:48Speaker 01

  Cars and the car works.

• 1:55:49Matt Farah?

  Car works.

• 1:55:50Speaker 01

  No one gets hurt, nothing bad happens, all that stuff.

• 1:55:52Matt Farah?

  That's a great day. A bad day is it could be a day where you're not doing anything related to cars. You're like fucking just sitting at home editing for 10 hours or you're selling ads or doing emails. Or a day where you have an insane transit to get somewhere. And then when you get there, you get like six laps of a track and then you fucking fly, you know, 30 hours each way to go somewhere like, um, you know, it's, it's, it's nice to say you went to Spain. It's nice to say you drove X car, but if it was really, it could have been any hotel. It could have been any racetrack anywhere. You didn't, you weren't in Spain.

• 1:56:37Matt Farah?

  You were just somewhere with a racetrack and it took you forever to get there. You didn't get paid for that forever to get back. And oh, by the way, the car is not that interesting to the general masses. And so you make a video that makes no money.

• 1:56:50Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:56:50Matt Farah?

  So a bad day at work isn't the wor- a bad day at work, it means you crashed the car. That's the worst day at work or you get hurt. Second to that, a bad day at work is you put in a huge amount of time for something that doesn't return any money. And also where the experience wasn't very good.

• 1:57:09Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:57:09Matt Farah?

  We've done plenty of gigs that made no money, but they were super fun or super unique. Or something happened that made it awesome and you went, I don't give a shit if I made money or not. That was sick. Going to Morocco to drive the Dakar in the Sahara Desert. Probably made some money, think so, don't care, doesn't matter.

• 1:57:27Speaker 01

  King of hammers.

• 1:57:27Matt Farah?

  King of hammers.

• 1:57:28Speaker 01

  Had a great time, video didn't do great.

• 1:57:29Matt Farah?

  Great time, no money. That, that's one of those, but um, long way, bad time, not a car that's not interesting enough to draw attention. Followed by no money. There's your trifecta of shitty day at work.

• 1:57:45Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:57:45Matt Farah?

  Yeah, cuz you've just spent a huge amount of time somewhere not home. For something that just, you know, it's not, it's not your fault. You did the same thing, like you did the job, but like, sorry, people don't give a shit about the car. And therefore you don't get to make money today.

• 1:58:08Matt Farah?

  All right, last two, and then I get to have ad reads. Woo-hoo. Oh, three, sorry. How do you, uh, jacking off the record says, uh, how do you think Chinese EVs would sell if they were allowed here, assuming they're tariffed like other Chinese goods? That's a math problem I don't know. I don't know, I, I, I, I, someone can do the math, I guess, but my understanding of Chinese EVs is that they are fucking shockingly cheap compared to what we get here.

• 1:58:41Speaker 01

  And people say that they seem to operate pretty well until there's like some sort of, you know, big problem, or there's these stories that pop out like, oh, the brakes don't work on this thing, or the car that was driving around in the parking lot by itself with nobody in it, stuff like that. But I, I think at the core of it, if you were able to sell them here and they were a lot cheaper than any of the competition, which is what they are selling for in other countries, they would probably do really well because ultimately, you know, folks here just want to buy something that works, that costs less than whatever existing option they have.

• 1:59:12Matt Farah?

  I was talking to someone yesterday in Malibu, someone who works for an OEM, I don't want to say who he is, just in case, who, in case it's, you know, a thing. But he was saying that he was kind of jealous. He works for an OEM that, that is heavily EV. And, uh, he was jealous. He said, basically, all the suppliers, the way, the way that they're networked and it's much more fluid, streamlined, they're not just like locked into Google or Apple or whatever. And, and so all the UIs and stuff just like work way better, you know, over there. Uh, Jin in Taconic State Parkway, uh, if I wanted to open a car storage place in New York or Westchester, do I think it would do well? Why or why not?

• 1:59:59Matt Farah?

  I don't want to open any car storage places anywhere I have to fly to. That's not a great way to do business unless you're that kind of person. And granted, you know, my parents live in that area. So if I was gonna have to fly somewhere, that's not the worst place I could fly to. It's really far, though. And, um, and people have big houses there. I was gonna say, they seem to have more land. People have big houses, big garages. There is a place there now called Collector Car Garage. It might actually be a Hagerty something now, but, um, but they've been open for probably 20 years. Uh, maybe, yeah, 20 years, maybe more. Um, but they do well.

• 2:00:41Matt Farah?

  Um, there's probably room for another one somewhere for sure. Um, but the demand is not really there. I mean, if you get into Manhattan, if you could get really, you know, close, close, um, then you'd have something. But I don't want to do that. And it wouldn't make more money than doing one here. And I don't, I just, I don't care, you know, about having property there. Like, it's same as anywhere else. Getting on a plane to go visit retail establishments stinks. Don't want to have to do it. Last one, lucky man to count on both hands, the one I love. Pearl Jam is coming in heavy.

• 2:01:21Matt Farah?

  Um, thoughts on the central seat 1300 pound, 250 horsepower analog automotive G H P K? Uh, as a former lease owner, the idea of this is very pleasant. When you start to get this light, 1300 pounds, I start to get concerned. It seems like there's, that's not enough weight to have car. My Manx is 1500 pounds. So this looks like an Elise. This is not an Elise? Is it based on an Elise? Oh, is someone making like a full carbon body Elise, a center drive? Yep. Center drive.

• 2:02:06Matt Farah?

  Okay, so it looks like someone has made a center drive carbon bodied Elise. Well, that's cool. See if we go to configurator. Oops. So here's, it'll be cool if the steering is good.

• 2:02:20Matt Farah?

  You know, when you, when you move the steering to center seat, sometimes it gets a little wonky. I've never driven a car that was converted to center seat, center steering, from left-hand drive or right-hand drive steering, where it didn't change the feel of it.

• 2:02:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, it looks like they build Elise copies or something, but maybe the VHPK is a even smaller lighter version of the Supersport.

• 2:02:44Matt Farah?

  No, they, they're basically taking S1 Elises. This is a resto mod company. They're, they're taking S1 Elises and making carbon bodies and shit like that. Yeah. They take, they, they restore and modify Elise, S1 Elises is what they're doing. Which like, cool. Like, I get that. But like, I,

• 2:03:08Matt Farah?

  1300 pounds is a little too light for me. I don't need to be quite that light.

• 2:03:14Speaker 01

  Just a little heavier than a motorcycle.

• 2:03:15Matt Farah?

  Yeah, I don't need to be quite that light. I, I bet you it's fun. I bet you it's cool, but it could also be fragile. And, um, getting into an Elise is hard enough without the seat being in the fucking middle. If that has a roof on it, I can't get in that. You know, I need to take the top off just to get in it.

• 2:03:37Matt Farah?

  But okay. I get it. I, I, I, I think they will probably find a few takers, you know?

• 2:03:44Matt Farah?

  Well, thanks, everybody. That's been fun. Appreciate you. We got it. We got. So I'm going out of town. On the road and track, uh, seaside to Sierra, the 23rd to the 28th, and then we, I go straight to Performance Car of the Year from there. And then I go straight to Pebble Beach where I play around golf with my dad and then come home. So I'm gone. 23rd to the 6th. And what I'm saying is we are gonna have so much podcasting in between now and the 23rd. We do another show tomorrow. I don't know what the fuck we're talking about. And then on Thursday, I have a double header with Motoman George Notaris at 2:00 PM, followed by Nicole Mu from the morning to the afternoon.

• 2:04:24Matt Farah?

  Now Nicole Johnson is coming in at 4:30. So I got a double header in the afternoon. Sands, Zach. Yeah. That will be awfully interesting. And then we have another show before I leave, right? Yeah. One more show before I leave. On the weekend. Yeah, on the weekend or Monday. Yeah. So patrons are going to be getting just punched in the face with podcasts in the next five days. But then it's going to be trickled out to everybody else, you know, over the next two and a half weeks. And that's how we have to do it because I have to travel. So the Mustang story is going to be in the next issue of Road and Track Print.

• 2:05:04Matt Farah?

  As is my written Zinger 21. It's going to be, those are going to be both in the same issue. So I have to finish both those pieces this week. Yikes. And we'll have a Zinger video soon. But first we'll have a Mustang GTD video Thursday, the 17th. All right. See you later. Bye.