Nick Jonas & Paul Rudd & John Carney

Paul Rudd and Nick Jonas are pushing themselves with their new film, POWER BALLAD. For Rudd, it's his first serious singing role in a film. For Jonas, it's a role that on the surface would seem familiar (a former boy band star) but pushes him to new dramatic heights. Here the two join Josh alongside their director John Carney (ONCE) to talk about collaboration, inspiration, motivation, and more. POWER BALLAD opens in select theaters 5/29 and nationwide 6/5. Tickets are now on sale. Watch on Spotify. If you’re subscribed to Spotify Premium, you don’t get any Spotify ads on my video. SUPPORT THE SHOW BY SUPPORTING OUR SPONSORS! Rula -- Rula patients typically pay $15 per session when using insurance. Connect with quality therapists and mental health experts who specialize in you at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.rula.com/happy⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ #rulapod Quince -- Go to ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Quince.com/HAPPYSAD ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠for free shipping and 365-day returns. Limited Time Offer–Get Huel today with my exclusive offer of 15% OFF online with my code happy15 at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://huel.com/happy15.⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ New Customers Only. Thank you to Huel for partnering and supporting our show! UPCOMING EVENTS! 6/16 -- Matt Smith in NY -- Tickets here Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  Low energy, unfocused, foggy? You might be dehydrated. Whether it's hot yoga, over 100 degree weather, or too much sun. Gator Light, with a specialized blend of five electrolytes, was scientifically designed to help move fluids into the body faster for rapid rehydration. Shop now at retailers nationwide. Gator Light: Hydrates Faster Than Water. Is it in you? Symptoms noted are signs of mild to moderate dehydration. Consult a healthcare professional if symptoms persist.

• 0:29Speaker 01

  Worst actor either of you were mistaken for?

• 0:36Speaker 01

  He's not gonna get... Neither of them are gonna get... They're massively famous guys. What idiot is gonna say, "You know, you look a little bit like Paul Newman"? Joe Jonas.

• 0:48Speaker 02

  Kevin Jonas.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  Yes. No, I see it. Yeah, yeah.

• 0:55Speaker 03

  Prepare your ears, humans. Happy, Sad, Confused begins.

• 1:03Josh Horowitz?

  Hey, guys, it's Josh. Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Today on the show, we've got a good one for you. Nick Jonas, Paul Rudd, filmmaker John Carney, talking all things Power Ballad and more. Hey, guys, how are you doing? Welcome to another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. I'm very excited to share this one. This is a great movie to talk about. Power Ballad's coming out soon. And to have Rudd in the house, Nick Jonas on the show for the first time, a filmmaker I love, John Carney, for the first time? Fantastic. Before we get to that, though, some reminders. Remember, check us out on Spotify. If you haven't checked us out on Spotify, now is a great time. And with Spotify Premium, you get no ads, no Spotify ads on our videos. So check us out on Spotify or Spotify Premium. This is really a special episode

• 1:48Josh Horowitz?

  because this was a live event taped at 92nd Street Y. You guys know I love to do my live events over there. And as you might imagine, an electric atmosphere. Nick Jonas brings out some passionate fans. Not a surprise, but also... Paul Rudd fans, I mean, I'm, if you had to start a Paul Rudd fan club, I might be the, the charter member. And not to mention John Carney. And I'm sure folks that listen or watch the podcast know and love John Carney's work, but let me just remind you quickly. He is the filmmaker behind Once, Begin Again, Sing Street, Flora and Son. As I say in this conversation, he's really carved out this very unique path. He doesn't make musicals per se, but he makes these beautiful

• 2:30Josh Horowitz?

  music-driven dramedies, I guess you would call them. They pull at your heartstrings. They feel true to life. I'm a sucker for them. And this new one, Power Ballad, is coming out May 29th in select theaters around the country and then June 5th wide. I really love this movie. I've seen it a couple of times. In a nutshell, this is kind of a two-hander. Nick Jonas plays a former boy band member, kind of at a crossroads in his career, trying to figure out what to do with his career, etc. His personal life, his professional life. Maybe rings true or not to his own experiences. And then we have Paul Rudd playing this wedding singer, fronting a band in Ireland. He's made

• 3:11Josh Horowitz?

  his life in Ireland, kind of never had the career he wanted as a singer-songwriter. And this chance encounter at this wedding leads to some bonding, some friction, some questions of ownership over art. And it is everything that you love in a John Carney movie. Really enjoyed this one. So for context, we take this actually before a screening of the movie at the 92nd Street Y. So you might hear me reference, you guys here in New York are about to see the movie. That's why I'm saying that. They were about to see the movie. But I purposely made this conversation work for folks that haven't seen the movie, of course. So I think you guys are going to enjoy this. And I mean, Paul, of course, is one of the funniest people on the planet. I always love talking to

• 3:53Josh Horowitz?

  him. I've known him for a thousand years. And to get Nick on the stage was really exciting. The fans really came out and were enthusiastic, as you might imagine, seeing Nick Jonas live. And then John Carney, who like, I'm kind of a fanboy for, as you can tell from me gushing about his movies. I mean, for me, Once is one of the all-time great movies. So that's the main event today. Remember Patreon, this is a good time to check out our Patreon, patreon.com/happy, say confused. We have a lot of bonus materials there right now because- The Patreon crowd includes a lot of Outlander fans and we shot this great Outlander sketch with Sam Heughan and Katrina Bolf and we made sure to do a lot of extra goodies for you guys that we're putting on the Patreon. So if you like Outlander at all, now is a great time to check

• 4:36Josh Horowitz?

  out our Patreon. Not only that, but you get early access and discount codes to all our live events. We have an event in June with Matt Smith. I believe it's June 16th, but check the show notes. It'll have the exact date, but that tickets are now on sale for that. So excited to have Matt back on the podcast. We've never done a solo live event, so he'll be in New York at 92nd Street Y, talking all things House of the Dragon, the new season and more. And yeah, there's some, there's some really like major people that are about to be on the podcast in June and July. I mean, not that we, we always get major people, but there are a couple of people that I will not announce yet that are just all time guests. One in particular, I can't believe is happening. I

• 5:19Josh Horowitz?

  have like goosebumps just even hinting at it, but you'll see it when you see it. Okay, that's about it. That's the preamble. Remember, put Power Ballad on your list of movies to see. May 29th, select theaters, June 5th around the country. And without any further ado, I think you guys are gonna love this one. This is me live at the 92nd Street Y with the director and stars of Power Ballad. Enjoy.

• 5:45Josh Horowitz?

  Hi, everybody. Hello. How's everybody doing? Welcome to the 92nd Street Y. My name's Josh Horowitz. I host a podcast called Happy Sag and Fuse and guess what? You're inside of it right now. Thank you for coming out tonight, guys. You're in for a really special treat tonight. I'm sure like many of you, I'm an obsessive fan of John Carney's work. How great a filmmaker is he. Once, Begin Again, Sing Street. No one uses music the way he does to tell stories about winners and yes, losers. He is the best. And this new film, I'm so thrilled to report, Power Ballad, is a really, really special piece of work. It opens in limited theaters, May 29th. It opens

• 6:29Josh Horowitz?

  June 5th around the country and you guys here in New York are very lucky because you're gonna get a chance to see the movie tonight. So you're in the right place.

• 6:40Josh Horowitz?

  You also don't just get a movie tonight. You get to see a few folks fill up these chairs. You ready for a conversation?

• 6:48Josh Horowitz?

  I'll just say before they come on out, not only does John do amazing work in this one, this is Nick Jonas's best acting work yet. He's awesome in this film. You're gonna love him in this.

• 7:00Josh Horowitz?

  We know Paul Rudd always delivers, but this is a Paul Rudd like you've never seen before. He's amazing. You're gonna, you're gonna absolutely love this movie. Without any further ado, please give a warm 92nd Street Y welcome to John Carney, to Nick Jonas, and to Paul Rudd. Come on out, guys.

• 7:36Josh Horowitz?

  That's a nice way to start.

• 7:38Speaker 05

  Yeah, thanks for that.

• 7:39Speaker 02

  I'm, I'm, I'm too dressed up.

• 7:44Josh Horowitz?

  No, you're perfect. Just the way you are.

• 7:46Speaker 02

  Thanks, Josh.

• 7:48Josh Horowitz?

  Good to see you all.

• 7:50Josh Horowitz?

  Congratulations on this film. These guys, as I said, they're in for a treat tonight, this movie. I've seen it a couple of times. You made me cry. Thanks for, thanks for that. Yeah, John does that, though, with all those movies. I like grownups crying is good. Yeah. What's your problem, man? Okay, before we get into teasing up what this movie is, since music is so important to the movie, what's, here's my, my icebreaker question. What performer band have you seen the most in concert in your lives? Who have you gone to see the most? And you can't say the Jonas Brothers, Nick. That doesn't count.

• 8:22Speaker 02

  Damn it.

• 8:25Speaker 02

  Uh, the Jonas Brothers.

• 8:28Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 8:34Speaker 02

  And maybe Elvis Costello.

• 8:35Josh Horowitz?

  Right. I thought you'd go with Rush. No? Rush must be up there.

• 8:40Speaker 02

  I've seen Rush, yeah, a few times, but, but Elvis Costello is, I've probably seen more than, I've probably seen him more than anybody else, I think.

• 8:48Josh Horowitz?

  Have you ever been pulled up on stage by Elvis to, to?

• 8:52Speaker 02

  No.

• 8:54Josh Horowitz?

  That's the danger of being a celebrity.

• 8:55Speaker 02

  My seats were never that good.

• 8:56Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, sorry.

• 8:59Josh Horowitz?

  Nick, what about? Very long arms.

• 9:03Speaker 05

  It's kind of a tie for me between Paul McCartney, we were just talking about, and Bruce Springsteen.

• 9:11Josh Horowitz?

  He just played MSG the other night. I was privileged enough to be there.

• 9:14Speaker 05

  Oh, how good was that?

• 9:16Josh Horowitz?

  The best.

• 9:16Speaker 05

  Yeah, the best. Love you, Bruce.

• 9:18Josh Horowitz?

  John, what about you?

• 9:19Speaker 06

  I'm gonna, I'm allowed to mention the band that I was in, because I'm no longer in them like Nick, so I'm gonna mention The Frames in Ireland, probably.

• 9:28Josh Horowitz?

  That works.

• 9:31Josh Horowitz?

  So, to set up this film a little bit, I alluded to John's amazing filmography. We were gushing backstage. We're all, including John, hopefully a fan of John's work. But you have, you have found such a distinct, interesting lane, and I don't know if it was haphazard, or like, directed, like, how you came to this, but no one uses music the way you do to tell these kinds of stories. How did we arrive at the filmography we did for John Carney?

• 9:57Speaker 06

  That's a good ques-- I mean, I'd like to say that it was a childhood dream, that I might, you know, by sure grit and determination, I've made come true, all on my own, which is kind of, I would like to say that. But like, all careers, you know, it's a bit of this and a bit of that, and then a bit of luck, and then a break, and then, not a break, what's the opposite of a break? A stumbling block that makes you strong, or whatever, you know? It is all of those things that led me to realize that I, I was gonna use the word talent, it's not a talent, it's a, an openness to, like, exploring the things

• 10:37Speaker 06

  that are going on in my head through film and music together. And realize that's not a bad thing, and there's a niche for that, and it's, it's the perfect size for me. I don't really want to get it any bigger than this, this is beautiful. So, don't recommend the film to anybody after you see it. You know, and, and that there's enough people to make me go, oh, that's a nice idea, and I could have a song here and a musical, you know? So, it's a, it's a series of kind of weird, and certainly music, I was in a band, I liked music, so all that helped. But I remember before doing Once, I was doing a TV show and people were saying, "You put too many needle drops. You know, you rely too much on music, movie. You know,

• 11:21Speaker 06

  it's a TV show." And then I thought, "I should, I should lean back from that." And then I just didn't. I leaned into it and made Once, which has more songs than, you know, any movie I've made.

• 11:31Josh Horowitz?

  And this, this film, as these folks will see, is really about the complexity, it's about a lot of things, but in part it's about the complexity of artistic inspiration and where that comes from and collaboration. So it feels appropriate to ask you what the inspiration was for, for Power Ballad. What's the, what's the initial idea and how did it grow into what they're about to see?

• 11:51Speaker 06

  Um, it was, it was, the really origins of it were simply sitting at a cafe and looking at this guy leave his house and go to work. Basically, I, I'm a real believer in, I think I mentioned this to you before, there's a great Irish writer, whose name will occur to me in a second, William Trevor. He lives in England, but he had a great line about, you know, as a, as a short story writer, you go down to the park, sit on a bench, and you see something, or you hear a conversation on the bench next to you, and all you're looking for is just enough to go back into your writing room. And it really rang true to me, and it was, it was nice to hear it put by somebody as great as this writer.

• 12:34Speaker 06

  So he was like, "Okay, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. That's all I need. I just need that one line of dialogue that that man gave that woman. That's enough for me to go off and write my story." So I'm very, I sit very open in, in, in the world, listening and watching people and realizing, actually, uh, you know, it's like that great line from The Naked Jungle, "There's eight million stories in the naked jungle. This has been one of them." Everybody's got an amazing story. And anyway, so I'm sitting in a cafe and this guy comes out of his, uh, house in Dublin, tired, kind of good-looking, sun, wraparound sunglasses, uh, bit of a rock star swagger, and he's got two things. One

• 13:17Speaker 06

  is a guitar over his shoulder, and I'm like, "Okay." And one is a little eight-year-old girl on his arm. And he's like, putting her into the back of the hatchback, and he's got the little pink schoolback over his back, over the other shoulder. And it was just something so great about the way he ha, he walked like... He had moves like Jagger. He had the walk. He had the vibe, but he was in a little hatchback, which is fine, coming out of a small house. And I was like, who is that guy? What's the conversation now that happens with his daughter when they're driving into school? And that was the kind of origin of like, okay, that's a story I really kind of want to tell.

• 13:55Josh Horowitz?

  Paul plays the little girl in the film.

• 13:57Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 13:58Josh Horowitz?

  Which...

• 13:59Speaker 02

  It was honestly the biggest acting stretch I think I've ever undertaken.

• 14:04Josh Horowitz?

  It's weird. I thought it would be mocap, but no, you just decided just to be the little girl.

• 14:08Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 14:09Josh Horowitz?

  It's a choice.

• 14:10Speaker 02

  I spent six months with little girls.

• 14:15Josh Horowitz?

  No, let me take that away. Let me take that away.

• 14:20Josh Horowitz?

  Should I give it back to him? Yeah, okay.

• 14:24Josh Horowitz?

  So, anyway, moving on.

• 14:26Speaker 02

  You could say that now, right? That's a...

• 14:27Josh Horowitz?

  No.

• 14:31Josh Horowitz?

  Let's talk-

• 14:31Speaker 02

  I love how worthy my answer seemed a minute ago. It was like, really?

• 14:35Josh Horowitz?

  It was really... I'll tell you now, the real inspiration is-

• 14:38Speaker 02

  Girls and what?

• 14:42Josh Horowitz?

  It's my fault. I'm sorry.

• 14:45Josh Horowitz?

  We'll be right back with more Happy, Sad and Confused.

• 14:51Speaker 07

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• 15:34Speaker 07

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• 15:45Speaker 07

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• 16:22Josh Horowitz?

  Let's talk a little bit more about the casting of these two gentlemen. I mean, for you, Nick, is it scary to play a role that, look, people are going to make connections as they probably should. You are playing Danny, who is in fact a former boy band member. There are some surface connections there.

• 16:40Speaker 05

  There are a few.

• 16:41Josh Horowitz?

  Is it, I mean, is it scary to play a character that has some more surface connections or less for you? Was that a red flag?

• 16:49Speaker 05

  It just depends. The script was so good that it sort of, it spoke to me beyond my personal connection to, you know, the character and ways in which we're similar. I had heard initially that John was working on something and heard a basic kind of logline about it. It was like, well, when the time's right, I'd love to set a meeting and talk about it. And in our first meeting, he kind of outlined for me the story and then we got into the script. And, and, you know, I think more than even just the thing you'll see here in a second, the movie plays, which are the central themes around songwriting and creativity. The thing that spoke to me was about family and the balance of ambition and family. And how far would you go to get everything you ever wanted and at what cost? And it was just so exciting to dive in.

• 17:34Speaker 05

  And, and yes, I will say that some of my experiences did help make it a little easier to understand this character. And you'll see, you'll see why in a second.

• 17:41Josh Horowitz?

  Hey John, it's very smart. You get like a free tech advisor right on on set.

• 17:45Speaker 06

  Yeah. It's exactly Nick. Nick brought so much more than I could have dreamed of to the role. It's hard to express what it was. It was like a mixture of. I guess it's just some weird intangible thing of experience when you have experienced as much as he has for so long. It's like you don't have to say much. So you're like, I really directed you very little. It was like, you know the way. And he was like, got it. And I guess has a resource of very interesting experiences.

• 18:20Josh Horowitz?

  For you, Paul, look, you've done a lot of different kinds of things in your career. And yes, you have sung on camera. Afternoon Delight, you were amazing, obviously, 40 year old version.

• 18:31Josh Horowitz?

  But this is new territory. I mean, this is not joke singing. This is real singing. You're playing a wedding singer, fronting a band and. I mean, did you know you had it in you? I mean,

• 18:44Speaker 02

  No, I mean, it it's true. I have. Like you said with Anchorman sung in films, but yeah, it's funny and that's make it's a little safer. It feels a little safer.

• 18:57Speaker 02

  So it was new territory. Be serious, earnest, vulnerable, and do it next to somebody who's really good at it and does it for a living.

• 19:10Speaker 02

  So it was exciting and it was a challenge that I was really enthusiastic to undertake. But I was, yeah, nervous about it for sure.

• 19:19Josh Horowitz?

  Is it more intimidating singing alongside Nick Jonas or Meryl Streep? Because you did do that in Only Murders as well.

• 19:26Speaker 02

  That's, yeah. That's a pretty, boy, I'm really batting a thousand, aren't I?

• 19:32Josh Horowitz?

  Setting the bar very high.

• 19:33Speaker 02

  Really? I know. I know.

• 19:37Speaker 02

  God, poor you and Meryl.

• 19:40Speaker 05

  The answer's obvious there. That's fine.

• 19:44Josh Horowitz?

  What were the first days like in terms of capturing what you had to capture on camera? Like, is there rehearsal period? Like, how do you kind of establish the connection, both musically and just as actor-to-actor? What do you remember the first days?

• 19:55Speaker 05

  Well, our first day was the scene where we kind of meet. Yeah, that's true, you haven't seen the movie. Well, it was really good, so...

• 20:04Josh Horowitz?

  You can act it out now if you want, just...

• 20:06Speaker 05

  Yeah, live reenactment. But you'll see, it's a scene where we connect on music and creativity and life and have a couple of drinks. There might be a joint in there and then things kind of go nuts from there. And we start, you know, the beginnings of a song that then take us on the journey of this movie. And that was our first day working together. I'd heard so many good things about Paul from mutual friends and been a fan forever. So I was thrilled to just be on set. Obviously, an intimidating first day and intimidating to be on screen with Paul. But I think everyone was so chill and the environment was such that, you know, John allowed us to play. Obviously, we had the parameters of, you know, what's needed to tell the story based on what's on the page.

• 20:48Speaker 05

  But to just get in there and have some fun and kind of be goofy and just do whatever felt really freeing up front. And he blew me away with his singing, which is gonna blow you away as well, I promise you. It's really incredible to see someone who's been such a... I mean this...

• 21:05Speaker 02

  Thank you. No...

• 21:08Josh Horowitz?

  Let him finish, Paul. He has more to say.

• 21:11Speaker 05

  Such a force throughout his entire career and continues to throw himself into situations that are different and new. And this was, you know, he's got an acoustic guitar on there, he's singing his heart out, and it was really impressive and hats off to you, sir. Well done.

• 21:24Speaker 02

  Thank you, Nick. I must say that it was made certainly easier by meeting Nick. He's such a great actor, great musician, but, boy, he made me feel comfortable right away. And, yeah, I think we clicked day one. I mean, we really got on well. And so, thank you.

• 21:49Josh Horowitz?

  Was singing part of your repertoire back in your bar mitzvah party starter days when you were a DJ?

• 21:56Speaker 02

  No, no, I was too busy organizing the limbo.

• 22:01Josh Horowitz?

  This is a true, you probably, a lot of you probably know this, that was an early side gig, side hustle.

• 22:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, when I was in school, I could work on the weekends. At, yeah, bar mitzvahs and weddings and birthdays, and I did that for about a year.

• 22:15Josh Horowitz?

  What was, what was your secret to getting folks on the dance floor, getting folks riled up?

• 22:19Speaker 02

  Well, it really depends on the age.

• 22:22Speaker 02

  If I wanted, if I wanted the kids to get out there, I knew that, like,

• 22:29Speaker 02

  like, can't touch this. Or, "Moni, moni."

• 22:34Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, sure.

• 22:35Speaker 02

  That was, that was a big one, but if I wanted the grandparents to dance, Glenn Miller.

• 22:42Speaker 02

  Swear to God.

• 22:45Josh Horowitz?

  Pipe in the Glenn Miller right now, let's see what happens.

• 22:48Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 22:49Josh Horowitz?

  What are all your philosophies at, at weddings? Are you the first on the dance?

• 22:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, I did it a while ago.

• 22:56Josh Horowitz?

  Well, your references kind of revealed that.

• 22:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. If I wanted the kids out there, I put on a little Jolson and they went crazy.

• 23:08Josh Horowitz?

  Are you guys first on the dance floor or last on the dance floor at weddings? What are, what's your philosophy?

• 23:14Speaker 06

  I don't go to weddings.

• 23:17Speaker 06

  I hate fucking weddings.

• 23:19Josh Horowitz?

  Wow.

• 23:20Speaker 06

  I hate them.

• 23:21Josh Horowitz?

  That's your hot take, okay.

• 23:22Speaker 06

  I love you, you love me in front of thousands of people.

• 23:24Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 23:25Speaker 06

  Oh.

• 23:25Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 23:29Speaker 06

  I got married to my, myself and my wife got married like 22 years after we met. For tax purposes.

• 23:40Speaker 02

  Sorry.

• 23:42Josh Horowitz?

  We thought he was a romantic until now.

• 23:44Speaker 02

  Well, I was gonna say weddings are really nice.

• 23:48Speaker 02

  They can be so fun.

• 23:51Speaker 02

  But to that, I don't know, probably right in the middle of the night, I'll get on the dance floor. That'd be the right song, too. Can't Touch This could probably get me out on the dance floor.

• 24:02Josh Horowitz?

  Don't forget about Glenn Miller. Come on.

• 24:04Speaker 02

  Of course, and Glenn Miller.

• 24:10Josh Horowitz?

  At the center of this film is this earworm of a song that's beautiful, and it really is. I mean, I can't imagine hanging a film on something this important that has to work in so many different ways in a film. I mean, when you get the script, does it come with like an MP3 of this song?

• 24:29Speaker 02

  Cassette.

• 24:31Josh Horowitz?

  An 8-track. Satellite. Right.

• 24:37Josh Horowitz?

  Does it come with the song?

• 24:38Speaker 02

  No, it didn't.

• 24:40Josh Horowitz?

  That's a lot.

• 24:41Speaker 02

  Which was interesting because, you know, so much hinges on it, and to read it and not know exactly what that song was going to sound like was an interesting experience. And then when we heard it for the first time, you know, it was great. And obviously, it needs to work, right?

• 25:03Josh Horowitz?

  It works, luckily, yeah. Not so luckily.

• 25:06Speaker 02

  Well, John and Gary Clark, who also writes a lot of the music, are great musicians. And, I mean, as you know, from John's other films, so talented, and they put so much into the songs themselves. So I think I never sweated. I kind of figured, oh, yeah, those two guys can crack it.

• 25:31Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. I mean, not to reveal too much, but there's, for the Once fans out there, there's something to look out for.

• 25:38Speaker 06

  There is. Spot the Once reference.

• 25:40Josh Horowitz?

  Is this in the Once cinematic universe? Is there a John Carney cinematic universe?

• 25:43Speaker 06

  Couldn't afford any other song than the Once.

• 25:48Speaker 06

  By the time I paid, these guys is fucked.

• 25:53Speaker 06

  I was like, I was like Glenn, you know, you know that fucking song? Can you just give it to me free really quickly?

• 26:01Speaker 06

  No, it was, it was a self glorifying moment. The first thing is right. It was, it was a reference to another piece of art through one piece of art.

• 26:10Josh Horowitz?

  It's, it works. I was saying before, uh, this film does, did make me cry both times I, I saw it and as most of-

• 26:17Speaker 06

  I'm sorry about that.

• 26:18Josh Horowitz?

  No, I love it. I love, I love the way your films really break me down. But, um, do you, does your own work ever have that effect on you? Can it?

• 26:28Speaker 02

  John's work has that effect on me. I mean, I, I really love his films. I was so excited to do it because, uh, I really wanted to work with John. I think he has a way of tapping into just kind of what's beautiful about life, how music makes our lives better. And they're just such emotional, kind of, um, powerful films to me. And when I saw this for the first time, uh, it, it, I, I think it might've been the first time, maybe. And I was like, oh my God, that's so effective.

• 27:03Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 27:04Speaker 02

  But it's, uh, because of him. Yeah.

• 27:07Josh Horowitz?

  For, for you, Nick, what kind of songs or films tend to bring that kind of emotion to you? Is there a-

• 27:14Speaker 05

  Well, I'll say, there's a, a scene, or there's two scenes in this movie that, that, that I'm not in. And they, they hit me, um, super hard as a, as a father. And I think there's a real theme, which you'll see, I don't want to give anything away, but it's powerful stuff, family, that whole aspect. And then outside of that, when I cry in a movie, it's, it's The Lion King, probably. You know, things that I'm getting to watch with my daughter these days and, and kind of relive some of those experiences and those, the stories that, that shaped who I became. And then now I'm sharing that with her. It's a totally, uh, you know, special thing, uh, to experience. Um, and then always on planes, just got to cry on a plane, watching a movie. I don't know what it is. Yeah.

• 27:58Josh Horowitz?

  More Happy, Say Confused coming up.

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• 28:35Speaker 07

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• 29:23Josh Horowitz?

  One of the other themes that really resonated with me, I mean, is there's a real sense of that thirst for, that we all have sadly, I think, this external validation. And sometimes that's money, sometimes that's attention, and even when, if you're an artist...

• 29:40Speaker 06

  No idea what you mean.

• 29:41Josh Horowitz?

  I know, exactly. We're all perfectly well-adjusted human beings. But I mean, I guess the question I have for you guys is, do you think you'd be artists if you didn't have the successes that you've had in your career? Would you have stuck with, you have this other job, this other life? Do you think art still would have played an important part in your life, just for its own sake?

• 30:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, I do. I would have been doing this or trying like on a dinner theater stage, wherever I lived, wherever, I'd try and get a play going with people that are interested in doing it. I just think...

• 30:25Speaker 02

  That's just kinda...

• 30:29Speaker 02

  Who... It's just ingrained, I guess, in who we are, who we all are. Yeah.

• 30:34Speaker 05

  It's a great question, by the way.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 30:35Speaker 05

  Excellent question. The simple answer is, I think so, because I'm not really good at anything else.

• 30:43Speaker 05

  And there are a lot of times, I don't think I'm good at this, you know, things that I'm doing. And I think part of that need to keep getting better and growing and working with different people that challenge you is what drives me, in addition to my love for it. It's rare of it, it's just a joyful experience. Sometimes it's combined with those feelings of self-doubt or questioning oneself. But when you work with people like these guys and others, who I've been fortunate enough to work with, who make you better, make you stronger, it is absolutely worth the pursuit of it, even when it feels like, you know, if I wasn't doing this, I don't know where I'd be. So I'm glad that I still get to and that people still, to whatever degree, are allowing me to. So, thanks.

• 31:29Speaker 06

  It's hard to follow that. I would just go back to male modeling.

• 31:35Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. Well, when you've got this.

• 31:38Speaker 06

  When you have this, you don't need to worry.

• 31:41Speaker 02

  I didn't really hear what Nick said, because all the time, I was just thinking, "I think I just offended everyone that does dinner theater."

• 31:49Speaker 02

  It's not my intention. I've done it.

• 31:52Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah. My wife's one goal of canceling Paul Rudd has come to fruition.

• 31:58Speaker 02

  We started off strong with the little girl joke.

• 32:05Josh Horowitz?

  There's no "we" there, that was you.

• 32:09Josh Horowitz?

  Oh my god. Where are we at... This is random. Where are we at on music biopics? You make musicals that are not musicals. Like...

• 32:18Speaker 06

  Where am I on...

• 32:21Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, I want to hear from any of you guys.

• 32:22Speaker 06

  It's very interesting. Well, I'll answer it first, because I change my mind every few weeks, and I have to be careful, because I'm tentatively... Yeah, I've got an email in my inbox saying, "I believe you like this artist, but shall remain anonymous right now." You know, "Is there a way in for you?" Because I say no to those things quite a lot, just because I can't find a way to get personally into something.

• 32:51Speaker 06

  And some weekends, I'm like, oh, I'd love to know more about that singer-songwriter, or that person, or, you know, I'd love to know more about Aretha Franklin, or people that I can't find books on, or whatever, you know. And then I watch them, and I'm so frequently like, they so frequently are the, what is it, cradle-to-grave, straightforward, you know, that Aretha Franklin will never amount to anything type movies. You know, which like, what amazes me is you see something like Walk Hard.

• 33:24Josh Horowitz?

  This guy.

• 33:25Speaker 06

  There's like, you see Walk Hard, there should never be another musical biopic after that. Because it's so, it's like, it's like if somebody came along to you and said, do you want to make a film about like glam rock English rockers who like, talk like that? You'd be like, Spinal Tap, you can't make, that's done. And to me, every brilliant pitfall of the biopic, all of the mines that you could step on are hilariously done in that movie, but they're still making biopics of people.

• 33:57Josh Horowitz?

  I do think.

• 33:58Speaker 06

  I mean, I should be careful now.

• 33:59Josh Horowitz?

  The snapshot ones I enjoy the most. You were in, you played the great John Lennon. Your John Lennon is the ultimate depiction of John Lennon in cinema, I would say, yes.

• 34:09Speaker 02

  Well, we haven't seen the new ones about to come out.

• 34:12Josh Horowitz?

  Have you given Harris Dickinson any advice for playing John?

• 34:14Speaker 02

  You know, it's funny, he hasn't called.

• 34:16Josh Horowitz?

  Weird. What was the research process for that? Was it a long one?

• 34:27Speaker 02

  The research for playing John Lennon?

• 34:30Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, in Walk Hard.

• 34:33Speaker 02

  The night before, we had to film that scene, Justin Long and I, Justin Long played George Harrison, and we watched Hard Day's Night, and we were watching, we were trying to just watch as much stuff on The Beatles to see if we could get the voices down. There was no chance in hell I was going to be able to do it, and Justin is incredible. He, but we were panicked. But thankfully, they really were not hinging the film on an accurate portrayal.

• 35:14Josh Horowitz?

  Are you playing Paul Stanley, though, in a Kiss film? Is that something that's potentially happening?

• 35:19Speaker 05

  Potentially being the operative word there. I'm, you know, hopeful that it comes together, but there's a lot of factors and things that are still up in the air. But it would be amazing to do that and to get to tell that story.

• 35:33Speaker 05

  It is a biopic, I'm sorry.

• 35:36Josh Horowitz?

  It'll be one of the good ones, though, don't worry.

• 35:37Speaker 05

  It's a good one, yeah.

• 35:39Speaker 06

  Plus, they make billions of dollars and people really enjoy them. I'm an asshole, I don't like weddings.

• 35:45Speaker 06

  I'm just a curmudgeonly old Irish Larry David or something.

• 35:48Josh Horowitz?

  It's okay.

• 35:50Speaker 06

  I'm actually not like this, am I?

• 35:52Speaker 05

  Not at all, no.

• 35:53Josh Horowitz?

  Nick's the only one that hasn't said anything controversial tonight. It's been you and Paul.

• 35:57Speaker 05

  It's not too late.

• 36:01Speaker 06

  I'd be like going back to my wife, said, "Do you want to get married and go and see a biopic together?"

• 36:06Josh Horowitz?

  Speaking of your wife, do I have this right? She's in the film and is very same in role.

• 36:10Speaker 06

  Yeah, Marcela Plonket is my wife, and she plays Paul Rudd's wife in the film, and she has to kiss him, which was, which was, uh...

• 36:17Josh Horowitz?

  Not weird at all.

• 36:18Speaker 06

  Shocked my children no end. It was very hard to... And then, and then he would say things to her, and Paul would have a scene with Marcela, and you'd say things to her, and people would be like, "That's so profound what he's saying." And I'd be like, "I said that, I shouted that to you a week ago." And they're like, "Yeah, but you're not Paul Rudd."

• 36:40Speaker 06

  It just sounds really horrible coming from you.

• 36:43Josh Horowitz?

  If, and the music in this film is fantastic, this is not an inconceivable idea, if you get nominated for this earworm amazing song you guys are gonna hear, you could perform at the Oscars. Are you game, Paul, Nick?

• 36:58Josh Horowitz?

  Paul?

• 36:59Speaker 06

  Boy, talk about putting the cart before the horse.

• 37:04Josh Horowitz?

  I'm putting it out into the universe, I want to be first.

• 37:10Speaker 06

  When the film wins an Oscar for best song?

• 37:14Josh Horowitz?

  At the 25-year retrospective.

• 37:22Josh Horowitz?

  So that was a maybe?

• 37:24Speaker 02

  You're still... I thought the laugh applause was just going right into the next...

• 37:28Josh Horowitz?

  No, I'll find something. Okay, let's see. Uh, some questions from the audience. Maureen has better questions than I do, don't worry. What music do you listen to, gravitate to, when preparing for your roles on set? Do you often have playlists for different characters? Is that something that you find useful? Either of you?

• 37:47Speaker 05

  Uh, sometimes. I mean, it depends. On something like this, I was... I was kind of reflecting on my own, you know, sort of, chapter of trying to find myself musically and... And so I went back to a couple playlists that I made back in 2014, 15, and the things that were really inspiring to me at that time. And it was, it was nice. It kind of put me back in that place, but, you know, for something like... Jumanji, I don't really have a whole lot of...

• 38:16Speaker 05

  I was just sort of, "Oh, there's a tiger!" And then we...

• 38:21Speaker 05

  That's great.

• 38:23Josh Horowitz?

  There are some big musical sequences in Avengers: Doomsday, as I understand it. There's a lot, a lot of... I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm joking, I'm sorry.

• 38:29Speaker 02

  So excited there.

• 38:31Josh Horowitz?

  You're like, "What?" Never mind, never mind. Uh, this is a question for Nick. How does your relationship with performing change when you're acting as a musician versus being yourself on stage?

• 38:45Speaker 05

  Well, I, um... I think that, you know, being on stage is, I'm singing my songs and kind of sharing my stories for the most part. And with this, it was, it was really exciting to take the music that John and Gary had written and sort of think of, of who that guy's gonna be with that music and what that looks like. Even vocally, there were things that I approached differently. Subtleties that, you know, maybe no one will notice, but for me, it was important to kind of take that on. But it's just a matter of, yeah, telling my own stories and then telling someone else's and, and using their words and... You'll see, once you see it, it runs deeper than, than just the songs, but those bigger themes and what... How the music connects to that. And I think John did an excellent job, as he always does, of, of

• 39:28Speaker 05

  making sure all the thoughts are clear and concise and heartfelt, but that there's music at the center of all of it and that it's being used in a way to, to, you know, propel the story, make it more engaging and, and not just, "Oh, here's a great music sequence."

• 39:43Josh Horowitz?

  How do you accomplish the concert scenes? I mean, is it movie magic? Or are there some big crowds there? Or like what's?

• 39:49Speaker 06

  Um, all the wedding. Well, again, you haven't seen the movie. But, uh, so I don't want to be careful how I give my answer. But, um, it was a mix. There's this, yeah, there's a mix of like old school, silly, like got the crew running around behind the camera to try and meet us at this angle with a bit of green screen next to, um, some actual CGI which we threw in and stuff like that. So it was kind of like a nice mix. There's nothing too trick, tricksy or anything like that.

• 40:20Josh Horowitz?

  Well, the fact that I'm asking the question is good. It's a good sign because I couldn't tell what was.

• 40:24Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 40:25Josh Horowitz?

  Catherine would like to know what surprised each of you about working with each other? What's the biggest surprise? I mean, I assume you tried not to go in with preconceived notions, but.

• 40:35Speaker 02

  Uh, yeah, I, you know, I'd seen Nick act before and I thought he was really good. And so I can't say this was a surprise. Um, but, uh, I'm, I'm really just amazed at how good he is. And that, there you go. You know, that, um, and, you know, Nick is such a thoughtful person and, and when it's a, you know, he, it's a very deft performance and I feel like I can, I know what's going on in his head in almost every moment by what's going on in his eyes.

• 41:17Speaker 02

  And there are moments when I finally saw the film, um, that just, I felt it in my chest. And so, uh, it wasn't that I was surprised, but just kind of continually impressed by him. And we all know what a great musician he is, but he's a hell of an actor, yeah.

• 41:42Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 41:44Josh Horowitz?

  You don't have to reciprocate.

• 41:47Speaker 05

  I will gladly. I mean, I've said it before, but you know, the music part of this is a huge task for anyone. You know, if that's been your only thing you've been doing for your career, but Paul is, you know, obviously Paul Rudd, the Paul Rudd. And that first day on set, it was just wild to see, you know, he grabbed his guitar, started singing and just let it ring. And it was kind of just a magical thing to get to experience. Also, side note, while we were doing that scene outside, we saw the Northern Lights.

• 42:22Speaker 02

  Yeah. That's the first time I ever.

• 42:25Speaker 05

  It was a magical thing, yeah. The other thing that was surprising was that he knows everything there is to know about Ireland and is so beloved by the Irish people. He's basically Irish. And it was fun. I had no idea you loved it as much as you do, but that's beautiful. And then with John, in a lot of ways, I feel like, you know, he directs like a musician, because he is a musician, and so there's a fluidity to it that's so helpful. It makes you feel free to try things and know that it may not be right, but it'll get you to a better place. You know, often in songwriting, you'll throw out a line that you know is bad that gets you to the better line. And I appreciated the fact that it was just a really loose and free environment. And I think because when I've watched his

• 43:10Speaker 05

  films and you can see how technical they are, I thought maybe it would be more rigid. But it was so surprising just how free and fun it was.

• 43:17Josh Horowitz?

  Nice. So we end the Happy Second Fuse podcast with the profoundly random questionnaire. John and Nick have never been on the podcast. You're gonna have to come on at some point solo. You're coming back soon too, I hope. But here we go. For all of you guys, you can all jump in however you like. Dogs or cats?

• 43:36Speaker 05

  Dogs.

• 43:37Speaker 02

  Dogs.

• 43:38Speaker 05

  Cats.

• 43:41Josh Horowitz?

  Tracks.

• 43:42Speaker 02

  Maine Coon cats.

• 43:44Josh Horowitz?

  Okay. What do any of you collect? Are you collectors of anything specific?

• 43:52Speaker 05

  Um, yeah, I'm starting to collect, um, first edition or first prints of, of like, children's books.

• 44:00Speaker 05

  So that my daughter can have a little collection of her own one day.

• 44:04Speaker 05

  So that's, yeah.

• 44:05Josh Horowitz?

  Nice.

• 44:06Speaker 02

  Sorry, come on, how can we fucking follow that?

• 44:13Speaker 02

  Well, I'll tell you what I'm doing for my daughter.

• 44:20Speaker 05

  Yeah, sorry.

• 44:22Josh Horowitz?

  Your, your collection of anti-wedding books that you're...

• 44:27Josh Horowitz?

  Anything, Paul?

• 44:28Speaker 02

  Um, yeah, I, I, I tend to, like, I like historical memorabilia.

• 44:34Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 44:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:34Josh Horowitz?

  What's the prized possession? Give me an example.

• 44:38Speaker 02

  Uh, I, I have, um, an, an invitation to the grand opening of the Brooklyn Bridge.

• 44:47Josh Horowitz?

  Whoa.

• 44:48Speaker 02

  Uh, but it was actually F A O. Schwartz's invitation.

• 44:53Speaker 02

  That's pretty cool. What a reaction. I was expecting that reaction. I just, I, I, I, I think it's, um... Did he go?

• 45:01Josh Horowitz?

  Is it, yeah. Still valid?

• 45:03Speaker 02

  If he, if he did, he, he held on to the invitation. I, I don't think he turned it in. I don't know. But, uh, you know, I, I think that's, I, I'm, I am fascinated by history and, and in particular, like, that bridge and the construction of that bridge is a really fascinating story. And when I, I, uh, found that, I, I, uh, was very excited.

• 45:23Josh Horowitz?

  Love it. Anyone have a favorite video game of all time? Very important question. What do you got?

• 45:29Speaker 06

  Max Payne.

• 45:30Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 45:32Speaker 05

  Super Smash Brothers.

• 45:36Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 45:40Speaker 02

  The crowd goes wild.

• 45:44Speaker 02

  Top that, Paul.

• 45:47Josh Horowitz?

  Dig Dug.

• 45:51Josh Horowitz?

  Oh my god, alright. Uh, okay, quickly, the last few, I want to let you guys go and let them see this movie. Uh, this is an important one. Dakota Johnson asked me this, I ask everybody, would you rather have a mouthful of bees or one bee in your butt?

• 46:08Speaker 06

  I actually, I'm not sure, I think you said a mouthful of bees?

• 46:11Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah, you heard it.

• 46:12Speaker 06

  Or a bee, one bee in, it sounds like something my nine-year-old boy would ask me. And then we'd talk about it for ages.

• 46:18Josh Horowitz?

  Exactly.

• 46:20Speaker 02

  Well, it is true, you have to get, like, where exactly in the butt?

• 46:27Speaker 02

  Right, I mean?

• 46:27Josh Horowitz?

  Right, I mean, pretty far up it, I would say.

• 46:32Speaker 06

  I think that would be nice for some people.

• 46:33Josh Horowitz?

  Yeah.

• 46:36Speaker 02

  Not so much for the bee.

• 46:42Speaker 06

  Wow.

• 46:43Josh Horowitz?

  Okay.

• 46:44Speaker 06

  What did you do today at school? What did you do today, John? Well, I was on stage with Paul, and we were talking about bees in your arsehole.

• 46:53Josh Horowitz?

  Last three, quickly, what's the wallpaper on your phone? Anybody?

• 46:59Josh Horowitz?

  What do you got?

• 46:59Speaker 02

  I have a beautiful garden.

• 47:02Josh Horowitz?

  Right, right, right, right.

• 47:04Speaker 02

  I got the one where it switches out, so it's like a bunch of different photos. It's a good setting, if you don't have it on there, just do it.

• 47:12Speaker 06

  My kids.

• 47:13Josh Horowitz?

  Oh, sorry, your kids, yes. See, he's a good person, after all.

• 47:16Speaker 06

  Not my kids, just, not my kids, just kids.

• 47:23Josh Horowitz?

  It's not my fault, just for the record. Last actor either of you were mistaken for?

• 47:35Speaker 06

  He's not gonna get, neither of them are gonna get, they're massively famous guys.

• 47:38Speaker 02

  You'd be surprised.

• 47:39Speaker 06

  What idiot is gonna say, you know, you look a little bit like Paul Newman?

• 47:50Josh Horowitz?

  Uh, Kevin? Jonas.

• 47:51Speaker 06

  Yes. No, I see it. Yeah, yeah.

• 47:58Speaker 06

  I actually got, I have a good short story about that. When we made that movie once, we were in America for the first time ever. I'd never been here and we were sitting, we were in a cafe. And I don't know if all of, any of you are gonna get this, but I'll try it anyway. And we were inside and there was a fortune teller on the pavement outside that her, I think her husband just sort of dropped her there. And she was like outside with the little thing over like that. And she was telling fortunes during the night. And we came out of the place and I had a cigarette outside and like this. And she says, you know, cross, cross my pam. And I, and I was like, I don't have the money, blah, blah, blah. Goes on like that. And she makes me sit down eventually and like $20 and give it to her. And she looks at my hand and she's, oh, yes, yes, yes, like this.

• 48:40Speaker 06

  And goes through and tells me everything about my life and all this stuff and children and blah, blah. And then at the end of it, she says, and I'm a big fan. And I had just arrived in New York. Once was tiny, nobody knew it, a few odd arty people knew it. And she wasn't one of them. And I was like, no, it's not, it couldn't, you couldn't. And Marcel, my wife was like, maybe she's seeing, maybe she's just a huge movie buff. And she happens to have seen like an obscure Sundance movie. And I was like, are you sure? And she said, yes, I love what you do. And I was like, what? And she said, um, and then she said, uh, you know, uh, uh, um, Harry Potter. Very good. No, no, not, not in Harry.

• 49:24Speaker 06

  And then she mentioned some other movie, like an English movie. And I start to realize she thinks that I look like David Thewlis.

• 49:34Speaker 06

  The, the English actor.

• 49:35Josh Horowitz?

  Right actor.

• 49:36Speaker 06

  Who then 20 years ago I met and I told him that story. And he was like, oh, that's really fucking funny. And I said, yeah, so like, I know how long you live for.

• 49:47Josh Horowitz?

  I got your fortune. Yeah, exactly. That's amazing.

• 49:53Josh Horowitz?

  Amazing. At last, worst noted director has ever given you, what jumps to mind? Yeah, can't be John.

• 50:04Josh Horowitz?

  Or something that's generally unhelpful, if you can't think of a specific thing.

• 50:09Speaker 05

  I had a director tell me, just, yeah, uh, one more time, but this time, a lot better.

• 50:17Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 50:19Josh Horowitz?

  Got it.

• 50:20Speaker 05

  Wasn't him, I promise.

• 50:22Speaker 02

  Nothing really comes to mind. I, uh, yeah. I'll take any note anybody wants to give me.

• 50:29Speaker 06

  There's a New Yorker, there's a really funny New Yorker, um, cartoon that the director is saying, "Okay, cut. Now go again, but this time you're good at acting."

• 50:41Josh Horowitz?

  Perfection. All right. As I said, you guys are in for a real treat. Not only did you get this wonderful conversation, but you're about to see Power Ballad, which is fantastic. I know you're gonna wanna spread the good word. This film is out in theaters May 29th in select theaters and then June 5th around the country. Please, uh, like I said, spread the good word and give it up one more time for John Carney, Nick Jonas, and Paul Rudd, everybody!

• 51:01Speaker 05

  Thanks, everyone.

• 51:15Speaker 03

  And so ends another edition of Happy, Sad, Confused. Remember to review, rate, and subscribe to this show on iTunes or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a big podcast person. I'm Daisy Ridley, and I definitely wasn't prepared to do this by Josh.

• 51:34Speaker 03

  Hey, I'm Ashley, host of Crime Salad, and every week, my husband Ricky joins me as my partner in crime. We know the true crime space is crowded, so we skip the loud, bubbly small talk and get straight to the facts of the most gripping cases. If you wanna see what we're all about, check out our recent two-parter deep dive, She Saved Him: Can You Save Her, covering the baffling Rebecca Zahao case. If you want a true crime podcast that feels authentic and respects the details, come check us out. Search Crime Salad wherever you get your podcasts.