Equations in Motion – Bowling with Dr. Dave Alciatore

How do you bowl a perfect 300? On this episode, Neil deGrasse Tyson and co hosts Chuck Nice and Gary O’Reilly discover Euler’s Equations of Motion and the cheat codes to bowling with physicist Dr. Dave Alciatore.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Welcome to StarTalk, your place in the universe where science and pop culture collide. StarTalk begins right now.

• 0:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This is StarTalk Sports Edition. Neil deGrasse Tyson, you're a personal astrophysicist and sports enthusiast, but I'm not enough to hold this show. I need my co-host who are Gary, Gary, former professional footballer in the UK.

• 0:32Gary O'Reilly?

  Hi Neil.

• 0:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Welcome, welcome back to the show, dude. Yeah, and how long have you been in the United States?

• 0:38Gary O'Reilly?

  Um, depends who you ask. I think it ranges from too, too long.

• 0:42Chuck Nice?

  The real, the real question is, how long have you been here legally?

• 0:45Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, legally. I have always been here legally, so that's, that's the good news. So that's no need to chase me down the street.

• 0:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, the ICE, the ICE Patrol.

• 0:56Chuck Nice?

  You're the Sting song. Sting has a song, "I'm an alien, I'm a legal alien, I'm an Englishman in New York."

• 1:02Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah, gentleman in New York.

• 1:04Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, that's you, buddy.

• 1:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And that other voice popped up, Chuck Nice, always good to have you, man. Always good to be here. I just want to say. Absolutely nothing. I was delighted to host your family for the weekend, and when we did, one early morning, you asked me for a jump rope, you went over to the side and you worked out with a jump rope, and I was so impressed by that, only to then realize you never really did any sports your whole life. Yes, um, however, double dutch is a sport.

• 1:29Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh! Is that in the Olympics? We're gonna see that in Paris.

• 1:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I think double dutch requires three people. Chuck, you can't double dutch with yourself. That's how good I am.

• 1:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So Gary, what do you have in store for us today?

• 1:44Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, this would be interesting, if not fascinating, ten-pin bowling. They say, right, but bowling, to get a perfect game means you score over 300, and if you have...

• 1:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's just regular, you said ten-pin, that's just regular bowling, right?

• 1:56Gary O'Reilly?

  That's ten-pin bowling, as opposed to crown green bowling, which is done on grass and all the other sort of varieties of...

• 2:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Lawn bowling.

• 2:01Gary O'Reilly?

  There you go. So if you have an average over 200, it's considered as an accurate indicator of a misspent youth. Right, it's also, it's also an indicator that this person may well understand more physics than you think. Imagine, right, you're there on the lane with a ball in hand, you're discussing oilers' equations of motion whilst chewing the fat about radius of gyration, all whilst wearing some dang ugly shoes that don't fit too good. And it's actually said, Chuck, and you'll love this, if you learn to read the oil patterns in the lane, you could find yourself with the cheat codes for a perfect game. And we must get into how that can work out for us if we want to hustle down in the pool lanes. What do you think?

• 2:46Chuck Nice?

  I love it. Yeah. I mean, I, I haven't bowled in many, many years, primarily because it's become a place where yuppies go to drink. It used to be, you know, like, I used to be in a league, Saturday morning, you went out, you bowled, it was great. Now you can't get a lane because it's a bunch of yuppies sitting around day drinking.

• 3:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But is yuppie still even a word?

• 3:08Gary O'Reilly?

  It is now.

• 3:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In the language?

• 3:09Chuck Nice?

  Oh, they're still, they're still around.

• 3:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I know they still exist, but is it a word?

• 3:14Chuck Nice?

  You're right. No, you're right. You're right. They're not, no, Neil, you're right. They're not yuppies anymore. They're hipsters.

• 3:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, okay. All right.

• 3:22Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I'm sorry. I got it. Yeah, they're hipsters.

• 3:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. So Gary, who, who, who do you have possibly has this kind of expertise?

• 3:31Gary O'Reilly?

  Well, surprisingly enough, he's a guest who's been on before. We knew him as, yes, Dr. Dave, the pool hustler, is now going, he's going to return today as Dr. Dave, Lord of the Lanes. Because he, he has some serious chops. He's bowled a perfect game. He has, he still has an average over 200. And you know what? Even I could work out, he was the guy to talk to.

• 3:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. Dave, welcome back to Startalk.

• 3:56Gary O'Reilly?

  Thanks, Neil. It's great to be back.

• 3:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, my gosh. I love calling Dr. Dave. I love that. Just, it's just, it's affectionate. It's more affectionate than just Dave, you know, Dr. Dave. So recently retired professor, emeritus, you don't look that old, at Colorado State University. Got your PhD in mechanical engineering at UT Austin. And I met my wife at UT Austin, by the way.

• 4:18Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah, I knew that.

• 4:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The woman who would become my wife. And you, you've got your own YouTube channel and Facebook page dedicated to pool. We knew that, but also to billiards. So, so you're the man. You demand. And so let me ask you, in your misspent childhood, how did bowling become part of this as well?

• 4:39Speaker 03

  Well, my, my early life dream was to be the Dr. Dave of bowling instead of the Dr. Dave of fool. All right. Cause I, yeah, I, I grew up, I basically grew up in a bowling alley. My, my mom worked at a bowling alley and luckily that bowling alley also had a pool hall in it. So it was just, it was just bliss, heavenly bliss for me, even as a child.

• 4:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so which are you better at?

• 4:58Speaker 03

  Um, I'm probably, uh, people will probably consider me a little bit better in the billiards, but, but I'm a strong bowler as well.

• 5:04Chuck Nice?

  What constitutes a strong bowler? I mean, it would have to come down to the numbers of your average.

• 5:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, of course.

• 5:13Chuck Nice?

  So what is the average that creates a strong?

• 5:15Speaker 03

  Anything over 200, like Gary mentioned, is, is considered strong, but, uh, you know, I've averaged close to 220. I'm averaging about 220 right now, partly because I got a brand new bowling ball, which we're going to talk about later. That's helped me boost my average.

• 5:26Chuck Nice?

  Right on, right on. Oh man, that means you got the fingers drilled for yourself. Yeah, that's a good feeling. You take the ball and it's just a big ball. It's, it's a sphere and you gotta go in and they drill the holes just for you.

• 5:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so Dave, uh, in my, uh, engineering physics classes, I remember learning all about sort of Euler angles and sort of the geometry of a rotating coordinate system. And my notes here tell me that, uh, Euler, Euler is a famous British mathematician from a century gone by, that you somehow invoke Euler equations to bowl a 300. I, I, you gotta get me, get me on that same page.

• 6:10Speaker 03

  Well, I don't, honestly, I don't use the math when I bowl, but the math does affect the physics on the lane. Uh, the Euler's equations, Euler, Euler did many things, but one thing it contributed to dynamics is the Euler's equations of motion that describe gyroscopic effects. And these new bowling balls take advantage of these gyroscopic effects.

• 6:27Chuck Nice?

  Wow. And I'm going to be very honest because I don't care when I look ignorant because it happens all of the time. I, I thought the Euler lanes were the greasy spots on the floor.

• 6:43Chuck Nice?

  I actually, I actually thought maybe there are slick spots on the lane itself.

• 6:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, this is spelled E U L E R.

• 6:52Speaker 03

  Maybe Euler, maybe Euler was the first guy that oiled the lanes. They call him the Euler.

• 6:57Chuck Nice?

  Right, exactly. So it's Euler, E U L E R. Okay.

• 7:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so, so here's an interesting, interesting observation and then I'll, I'll pass over to, to, because, because Gary is, is gonna drill you for the whole hour we got here. So, so, um, what I remembered most about the Euler equations in my sort of engineering physics was, normally when we think of something rotating, we think of only one axis. And so Earth is rotating or, or a top is rotating that is spinning. But if you have rotation in more than one axis simultaneously, then interesting things happen, right? So, so, so here, here's the ball trying to roll down the lane. And so that's an axis of rotation is rolling.

• 7:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But then you put a little spin on it on top of the rolling that's happening. And so the ball doesn't go in a straight line. It curves. So are you telling me you thought all this out and you, and, and really, really? And it's not just practice?

• 7:59Speaker 03

  Well, to play the game well, it's all about practice. But, uh, you know, good bowlers take advantage of the oil patterns, which we can talk about. And the ball, the ball, the ball manufacturers take advantage of these gyroscopic effects. So if you had a homogeneous ball, a solid sphere, it has holes in it, but let's forget that for now. And you spin it and you throw it down the lane, it's gonna spin on the same circumference the whole way down the lane. And this is actually, uh, this is actually directly from billiards when we looked at the Mace shot. A Mace shot in billiards is the same as a curve ball in, in bowling. All right? Now, if the ball is a sphere, a solid sphere, when it's, when it's trying to curve, it's spinning. And, uh, Coriolis figured out that, that, that, uh, the direction of the friction does not change during the curve.

• 8:42Speaker 03

  Same thing on a, on a pool table. So what that, what that, uh, suggests is that a stripe of oil is gonna build up on that ball along one circumference. You get a circle of oil building up on the ball as it's traveling down the lane. Now that's bad because the oil is slick. And when the ball hits.

• 8:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So he is literally talking about oil.

• 8:59Speaker 03

  There is oil on the lanes. It's actually a petroleum product. It's not crude oil. It's actually mineral oil based, but it's a very, very clean looking oil, but it's, it's slick.

• 9:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so Chuck, you were even wrong in your ignorance. That's pretty bad.

• 9:13Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, well, you know.

• 9:15Speaker 03

  Neil.

• 9:16Chuck Nice?

  What can I say? This is where I'm a Viking. This is where I'm a Viking.

• 9:18Speaker 03

  Anyway, this... Go ahead.

• 9:21Chuck Nice?

  You gotta be good at something. Even if it's good at being wrong.

• 9:26Gary O'Reilly?

  All right, Dave. So, I mean, we've got multiple axes of rotation, and that's all happening. But to drive this, apart from the ball themselves, you've got a weight block inside. Now, they come in eight different shapes, and they're not all asymmetrical. They're offset as well, aren't they?

• 9:44Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 9:46Gary O'Reilly?

  So how is that then impacting on these oilers' equations of motion? And how the ball does its thing?

• 9:53Speaker 03

  That's the critical piece here. So again, if you have that solid ball, it doesn't have this weight block in it. It builds up this stripe of oil. Now, the oil is not consistent over the whole lane to the lane. They put most of the oil in the first two-thirds of the lane. The last third is mostly dry. It has a little bit of oil. That's where most of the curve occurs, in the last third of the lane. But if the ball is picking up oil the whole way down the lane, it's going to slide more during that curved section. All right, so these weight blocks, it's asymmetric. As Neil's pointed out, if you have a ball, you're spinning it about one axis. It's moving down the lane. Friction is creating a torque or moment about another axis. That causes this weird wobbling effect. The ball actually does this weird wobble thing. You can see me on video what I'm doing. But it gives you like different circles of oil on the ball. So that new ball surface is touching the lane the whole way down.

• 10:38Speaker 03

  So it doesn't build up oil on one stripe. And when it hits the drier part of the lane, it has virgin olive oil. It has a virgin oil-free surface to help it curve more.

• 10:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So Dave, let me get, if I understand this correctly, the first part of the journey of the ball is on oilier... It's on oilier surface than the last section?

• 11:00Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 11:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So... Where it's oily, you're not going to get much friction to curve the path.

• 11:08Chuck Nice?

  Bingo.

• 11:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is that correct? Okay, so I always wondered why the ball curved more in the last... I've seen this and I never understood why, so that's why.

• 11:19Chuck Nice?

  It breaks hard.

• 11:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It breaks harder.

• 11:21Speaker 03

  Yeah, bowlers call that the back end. You want to have a strong back end where it curves hard and creates a good entry angle into the pins, which we can talk about later also.

• 11:29Gary O'Reilly?

  If we've spent enough time and sort of examined bowling and come to the conclusion that Euler's equations, motions are involved, surely now there has to be an optimal speed, an optimal angle of approach, because otherwise I'm sticking that straight in the gutter. And we've got this configuration of pins, this triangular configuration, and we've all seen it. What, it's a seven and a 10 split where the two furthest pins away from each other are left and you've got a spare to try and clear them up. So how do I get out of that? By using a bit of science, by thinking, right, there's an optimal speed, there's an optimal angle of approach, or am I daydreaming?

• 12:08Speaker 03

  No, you're right on, right on topic. Let's talk about the pin numbering briefly because I'm going to refer to them at times. So the pins are in a triangle pattern. The head pin, the one in front, is called the one pin. But then they're numbered...

• 12:18Chuck Nice?

  That is so, so surprising.

• 12:22Speaker 03

  But then the number, this is surprising too, the next row is two and three. Then it goes four, five, six. Then it goes seven, eight, nine, 10. All right, so Gary just mentioned the seven, 10 split. That's a bowler's nightmare. You have the far two pins in the corners that you leave as a spare, and it's pretty much impossible to convert, but it can be made mostly through luck. But let's getting back to a strike. How does a bowler give themselves the best chance of getting a strike? You might think, throw it right down the middle and hit that head pin right in the center. Well, that's the worst possible thing you can do. But that's what most beginner bowlers try. They try to throw it in the middle.

• 12:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, I think a gutter shot is worse than hitting the front pin. I'm just, you know, of all the worst things you could do, I'm thinking a gutter shot is worse.

• 13:04Speaker 03

  That's right. But if you throw it straight, you want it to hit off-center slightly. That's how you can get a strike. But the problem is when it comes in straight, the ball deflects off the pins a little too much and it doesn't have enough power to drive through the center. And you often leave what's called the five pin, the one in the middle. Sometimes you'll leave a 10 pin on the far corner because the ball's not coming in strong enough to send the other pins toward the 10. All right, so bowler, they want to come in at an exact 6 degree entry angle. All right, this isn't random. There's been extensive testing, extensive testing, lots of simulation to find this optimal angle.

• 13:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Chuck, that was my problem. I was coming in at 7 degrees the whole time.

• 13:43Chuck Nice?

  And I was 5 in the head.

• 13:44Speaker 03

  Neil, that's your problem, man. That's your problem. 7 degrees is not 6. It's not 6.

• 13:48Chuck Nice?

  Oh, oh, oh my gosh. Yeah, you were doing 7 minute abs. It's 6 minute abs.

• 13:55Speaker 03

  You might think a bigger angle's better. Like, you might think, if I can get 7, isn't that better than 6? Well, at some point, it's coming into the pins a little too steep and it just kind of tunnels through and doesn't spread them as well. So people have found this 6 degree angle to be kind of optimal. It sounds like a small angle, but you have to curve it a fair amount because it's only curving in that last part of the lane, and the lane is really long and skinny. So to get an angle, you have to curve it significantly.

• 14:18Chuck Nice?

  Yeah. And is that the pocket?

• 14:20Speaker 03

  Bingo. For a right-hander, it's called the 1-3 pocket. You're hitting the 1 and 3 pins first. And it's also called the Manhattan side. You don't want to go in the Brooklyn side. That's kind of embarrassing to a good bowler. You know? Because the term came from, you know, people in Manhattan, they have to cross over the bridge to get to Brooklyn. All right, so if you cross over, if you cross over the head pin, you're hitting the left side, that means you weren't very accurate. You're hitting on the Brooklyn side, we call it.

• 14:45Chuck Nice?

  So is the gutter the Jersey side? What's up? What's up? Tell the truth. What's going on?

• 14:51Gary O'Reilly?

  So what if I just get brute force and ignorance to start bowling and just barrel one down there? Would it just be simple enough to just say it's velocity? Or are we into spin rates? And, you know, if I want to get this angle of approach and we're playing with a lane that isn't uniform from start to finish?

• 15:08Speaker 03

  You bring up a good point because that entry angle's critical, but the other critical thing is momentum. You know, the weight of the ball and the speed of the ball both contribute to your pin action, how well you bust up those pins. So if you can throw a heavier ball faster, it's going to help, assuming you can get that angle, which is harder. The faster you throw it, the more difficult it is to curve it enough to get that angle. But if you can, if you can spin a lot, so bowlers want a lot of rev rate. You know, good bowlers, top pros, they can, they can spin the ball almost 10 revolutions a second. So it's a, it's a pretty fast spin. So you want to spin it as much as you can, so you can throw it as fast as you can and still get that six degree entry angle. That's the, that's the secret sauce of bowling.

• 15:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Are you, are you saying that if a person is weaker, they have to use a lighter bowling ball? And all other things being equal, they will not be as successful at bowling? Because they're using a, a ball with less mass.

• 16:04Speaker 03

  Now, some pros, you know, 16 pounds is the maximum allowed weight. And for, for many years, all pros use 16 pounders. But now they're migrating closer to 15. And you might think, well, why are they giving up that, that free momentum? Well, they can throw the 15 ball, 15 pound ball faster. So they can actually get, and they can spin it more.

• 16:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it's a trade off between the kinetic energy of its speed and the momentum you get from its mass, I guess. There's two of those.

• 16:30Speaker 03

  Again, the main thing you want is momentum. You want, you want mass or weight and you want speed. You want both, but yeah.

• 16:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, here's something that I thought was happening and maybe not. And then we're going to take a quick break and we'll come back and pick this up some more. Does the spin, picking up on what Gary said, does the spin of the ball, other than altering its direction of impact? Does it help knock a pin sideways better? Rather than bowl it down forward and help to create more sideways action? Helping you get those side pins a little better? Does that, is that a thing?

• 17:07Speaker 03

  Uh, not really, because most, most, most bowling shots, you have three, three kinds of phases. You have the slide phase where it's spinning like mad, but sliding through the oil, very little friction. It's curving just a slight amount. Then you have the, uh, the curve phase where the friction is really grabbing and it's changing the direction of the ball. And during that curve phase, it's actually losing that side spin. And when it's done with the curve phase, it's actually mostly rolling. Mostly rolling in a straight line at the desired angle at the end. So it has very little. Excess spin left over when it's hitting the pins.

• 17:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I forgot that. Of course, if you're spinning it and it's responding to that spin by friction, it's slowing down that spin. Of course that's gonna happen. Wow. Okay, guys, we've got to take a quick break, but when we come back, more on how to bowl a 300 in 10-pin bowling on StarTalk Sports Edition.

• 18:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We're back, StarTalk Sports Edition. We're talking about bowling, how to be good at bowling. No, how to be perfect at bowling. There is such a thing as perfect. You bowl a 300. And our special guest today, Dr. Dave Alciatore. Did I pronounce your name correctly?

• 18:29Speaker 03

  Right on. For the French side of my family, what the Italian side of my family likes, Alciatore.

• 18:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Alciatore. I'd way prefer that, but I don't want to offend the French side. So, Dr. Dave, we've had you on before talking about billiards, and that was a fascinating show, one of my favorites. And only to learn that you have further expertise, because part of your childhood, you grew up in a pool hall, because your mother worked there. That meant you grew up in a billiard hall, which also had pool tables, but that meant you got free games. That's probably what that meant.

• 19:02Speaker 03

  You got that right.

• 19:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So maybe you're good, maybe you're good at bowling because you played for free, not because you actually studied the equations. Now, fess up.

• 19:12Speaker 03

  Are you telling me I got a free ride, Neil? Are you telling me I got a free ride, man?

• 19:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Confess your privileges here, right? This is what you gotta do. So, so tell me more. You mentioned this oil on the, you know, none of us are thinking that there's oil on the, none of us non-experts are thinking that. Anyway, could you just give us a little more details about why is there oil there and how you have come to exploit that fact?

• 19:35Chuck Nice?

  And why don't you guys just get a rag?

• 19:39Speaker 03

  Well, there is a form of rag and the automated machine that puts down the oil. This is a computerized machine that puts the oil down in certain patterns. And it's not always the same pattern. Typically, in a league situation, they give us a fairly easy pattern. An easy pattern is where most of the oil is in the middle. And then the oil doesn't go down the lane as far. All right, that's the optimal situation. And one reason is if you throw the ball across the oil, like from the left, if you're right-handed, you'll start to the left a little bit. If you throw it across the oil, it goes out. If you throw it out too far, it gets to the dry part of the lane sooner. And then it curves more. If you don't throw it out far enough, it stays in the oil and slides.

• 20:22Speaker 03

  And that's how you optimize your chances to get a strike. You have strategy based on how the oil is put down. The optimal strategy.

• 20:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, when you said throw it out, you mean the distance between where you release the ball and where it hits the wood?

• 20:35Speaker 03

  Well, that is one variable that some people adjust. But mostly, I mean, you're throwing it more to the right. If you're right-handed, if you throw it more to the right, it hits the dry part of the lane sooner. And that lets it curve sooner. And you can still get a strike. You throw it too far to the left, it stays in the oil and doesn't curve as much. And you can still get a strike. So you can be sometimes if you have your optimal strategy for the oil pattern, and you're throwing it in the best possible place, you give yourself the widest margin for error. Sometimes as much as like six inches, six to 10 inches. You can be off by that much and still get a strike.

• 21:09Chuck Nice?

  And how much does alcohol come into play? When making these calculations mentally?

• 21:18Speaker 03

  Well, people that tend to get tense, alcohol is actually a booster because it helps them relax a little bit. But that only works to a point. And then there's a difference between perceived and actual performance, Chuck.

• 21:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Of course.

• 21:31Speaker 03

  And alcohol makes your perceived performance amazing. You think you're, you think.

• 21:37Chuck Nice?

  Well, clearly, clearly, you've been to one of my conferences.

• 21:41Speaker 03

  So.

• 21:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So Gary, he's, he's all yours, Gary.

• 21:43Gary O'Reilly?

  All right. So I have to, I have to imagine now I'm bowling, but the pattern of oil that's been laid down in the lane isn't fixed. It's going to change every time a bowl goes down it. So now I've got an organic situation that's changing in front of me. So is it, is it kind of like a major cheat code? Once I learn how to read the pattern, read the oil movement as balls, bowls go down it and then distribute oil in different places on the lane?

• 22:11Speaker 03

  Well, there's three things there, Gary. One is you have to know what the pattern of oil is. You know, they put down different patterns on different, different lanes or in pro tournaments, they actually put down a different pattern on each of the two lanes that they're bowling on just to make it more challenging. And they have, sometimes they use a totally different ball and sometimes they stand in a totally different place and throw it with a totally different speed and direction on each of those two lanes. That's the ultimate challenge. But again, in a league, they're putting down pretty much the same pattern for us every week. And, you know, I've learned to find the optimal way to throw the ball to give myself the best chance of getting a high score.

• 22:44Chuck Nice?

  And, and how many balls, how many balls are you able to use if you're playing like a real tournament game? Can you say, okay, for my spares, I'm going to have a lighter ball or a heavier ball. Uh, for my first throw, I'm going to use a lighter ball and then I have my second lane ball. I mean, are, what, are there rules?

• 23:01Speaker 03

  No, there's no limits on the number of balls you can use. In fact, a pro, they might have, it might sound ridiculous, but they might have like 15 to 20 balls at, you know, available. And they might change balls in the middle of a match, you know, if, if it's not working out, if they're reading, if they're reading something in the oil pattern that, that they didn't anticipate. So there's no limit on the number of balls. So imagine carrying a golf ball, a golf, a golf bag, a golf bag full of these bowling balls around.

• 23:26Speaker 03

  Yeah. But typically, most league bowlers, they have like their, their strike ball, their curve ball, and they have a spare ball. Spare ball is usually made out of a hard plastic that has very little friction, very smooth surface. Even if you can, and the beauty of that is you can throw it your normal way. You throw a strike shot, which is your most consistent throw. And it's spinning like, like heck, but it just goes straight. Yeah, you can aim straight at the pin to get that spare. Yes.

• 23:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Interesting.

• 23:50Gary O'Reilly?

  So how do you know, once you get to the back end of the lane, that you've got certain things going on with the oil distribution on the surface? How do you tell? You're not allowed to walk down there and look at it? Or can you read it from the way the balls are moving?

• 24:06Speaker 03

  The last thing, Gary. All right, so let me go back. So first, you have to know what the pattern of the oil is that they're putting down. Then you have to know, how does that pattern change over time as you throw balls? Because the ball is picking up oil when it's going down that slick part of the lane. And that oil is so you're actually removing a little oil from the first part of the lane. And then it's carrying that oil down. So as the night goes on, as the games go on, and the oil's getting pushed down the lane. And it's getting pushed in the area that your ball's curving. All right, so it tends to give you less curve as the night goes on in that area. All right, so a good bowler has to adjust. They can't see the oil, like you pointed out, Gary. They have to adjust based on the reaction of the ball.

• 24:50Speaker 03

  So when the ball's starting to come in light, we say, it's not curving as much. We would typically move our feet to the left and aim a little bit to the left. That way, we're hitting fresh oil and we're hitting fresh, dry lane down the last third of the lane.

• 25:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Man.

• 25:04Gary O'Reilly?

  So you've got to have a lot of experience to be able to read the oil patterns on the lane and then have the knowledge to know what will happen.

• 25:13Chuck Nice?

  But you just said they changed the oil patterns as well. So just to make it interesting.

• 25:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Not in the middle of a game. They start with different starter patterns, right?

• 25:24Chuck Nice?

  What I'm saying, before the game, do you guys get to throw? How many practice throws do you get to throw? Because that's not fair. You're starting a competition and you don't know what the terrain is.

• 25:33Speaker 03

  Exactly. We have to practice. Even in the league, they give us five or 10 minutes of practice. And that whole time, I'm hunting around. I'm hunting around, adjusting my speed, adjusting my spin, adjusting my aim point to try to find that optimal place to throw the ball. So that is critical in practice. You have to identify that.

• 25:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  To Gary's point, it's not that you can see the oil at all times as the tournament progresses. You are reading what is happening to the balls that are thrown and judging what the oil distribution is in that hole.

• 26:04Speaker 03

  And a good player.

• 26:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  From the behavior of the ball.

• 26:06Speaker 03

  A good player has to also realize, did that ball react like it did because I threw it a little bit too fast? Or because did I get a little extra finger in it and spin it a little bit too much? But a good player is aware of all that. And a good player also has to be accurate enough. It's no, it's no use reading what the ball does unless you can throw it in the, in the place you're aiming every time.

• 26:24Chuck Nice?

  Make the, you gotta make the adjustment. And can you learn something from the way your opponent is throwing?

• 26:28Speaker 03

  Oh, definitely. Yes. Yes. Every, every, uh, every throw is information.

• 26:32Gary O'Reilly?

  Concentration. It's intense concentration, isn't it?

• 26:35Speaker 03

  Oh, you gotta, just like any sport, you don't want to be too intense the whole time. You gotta be focused and you gotta pay attention and, and observe, but you don't want to be like, you're not, you're not super intense staring the whole time.

• 26:46Gary O'Reilly?

  No, but.

• 26:47Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, tell that to Tom Brady.

• 26:48Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 26:50Gary O'Reilly?

  So there's a thing called the curve ball strategy, which sounds like a baseball term, but it's not. It's, it's applied to tempting bowling. So is that a successful strategy to cope with changing oil pans?

• 27:02Speaker 03

  Oh, yes. We throw, any good bowler throws a curve ball to get that, that optimal six degree entry angle. That's critical. You have to curve the ball to have the ball come into the pocket at the good angle. And the amount of curve is affected by the oil as the oil chan, and as oil changes over the night, you get that, the amount of curve changes and you're constantly making adjustments. Uh, but you're right. A curve ball is critical to bowl well. Uh, I'm sure there's been some 300 games from people that throw the ball straight, but it's very rare. Now these bowling technologies, like the, the weight block they put in the ball that, that allows it to get this gyroscopic effect that prevents the oil from building up on one stripe. When those, when that top, and that, when that technology came out about in the nineties, 1990s, the number, the average, uh, the bowling averages in leagues and the number of 300s

• 27:47Speaker 03

  per year increased dramatically. And, you know, this is a problem.

• 27:52Chuck Nice?

  But so tell me exactly what that is.

• 27:53Speaker 03

  What, what is?

• 27:55Chuck Nice?

  The block.

• 27:56Speaker 03

  The weight block. Yeah. So bowling ball, again, is not a homogeneous sphere. If it were, you would, you wouldn't get gyroscopic effects. And the ball would build up a, a ring or circumference of oil as it's going down the lane, and that would reduce the friction when it hits the dry part because it's spinning on this oil. So because they're inside the ball, a ball is consists of what's called a cover stock. It's usually an inch or so thick of material on the outer part. There's a core inside of that. It's a different material, usually harder. And then inside the core, there's a weight block. And it's, as Gary mentioned, it's not always symmetrical. It's, it's, it's like a, uh, generally the shape of like a little football, but it has, sometimes it has nodular shape. It's, they have, they have all these patented shapes that the different manufacturers come

• 28:39Speaker 03

  out, come out with for marketing mostly. But they have different shapes that are asymmetric and they're placed in the core. They're cast inside the core in asymmetric directions. And when they drill your ball, uh, there's a little plug that tells them what the axis of this core is. So when they drill the holes, they can decide what angle to put these holes at relative to the axis of the core. And now all that contributes to two things. It contributes to the gyroscopic effects and it contributes to what's called the radius of gyration, which we talk about, which you talk about also.

• 29:09Gary O'Reilly?

  I can't help wondering, right? Cause I don't think ten pin bowling was initially started knowing that you'd oil the lane. So A, who came up with that clever idea? And B, what happens if you don't oil the lane?

• 29:22Speaker 03

  Well, that's great points, Gary. Yeah, the oil originally was to protect the wood, to treat the wood and also to limit friction. All right. Cause if you, if you had a totally dry wood surface and...

• 29:33Chuck Nice?

  Well, you end up with a big rot in the middle of the lane. Yeah. You'll be three gutters.

• 29:38Speaker 03

  Their ball would be like a trench digger.

• 29:41Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 29:42Speaker 03

  Uh, so they first, you know, they, they conditioned the lanes with the oil to treat the wood and also to reduce the friction so the wood wouldn't get damaged too easily. Um, and in the early days, people threw the ball straight, you know, and then, then the oil was there and then somebody, just like in, just like in billiards, one day somebody put a piece of leather on the end of the tip and then they were able to put spin and then they started, they, a whole new world of shots opened up. Same thing with bowling. Somebody one day said, oh, what if I spin the ball? It's going to slide through the oil and then curve. Does that help me? They didn't know at first, but through experience they learned it helps a lot curving that ball.

• 30:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Has there ever been a Bugs Bunny shot where they throw the ball, but the ball doesn't leave their hand and the ball drags them down?

• 30:23Speaker 03

  Funny you should say that because as, you know, I live in Colorado and it's very dry normally, but I played in the tournament this past weekend and there were a lot of people on the bowling lanes and it was getting a little warm. My thumb starts to swell, it get a little humid and then all of a sudden, the hole gets a little sticky. And actually, the ball stuck to my thumb, uh, once and it, it, it didn't come out of my hand until my hand was way up in the air and the ball went flying like 15 feet up in the air vertically and it pulled me with me and I barely caught myself. See, the problem, if you, if you don't catch yourself, you go flying Superman style and you land in this hole, you go sliding down the lane, just like the ball.

• 31:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so that can't happen.

• 31:02Chuck Nice?

  Either that or you just leave your thumb inside of a ball.

• 31:04Speaker 03

  Ouch. Well, it does hurt.

• 31:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Otherwise, we'd have to add another law to the cartoon laws of physics to, to understand what happened there. Well, we're gonna take a quick break and when we come back, we want to learn more about bowling fashions, or rather, what's up with the shoes? Why, and, and whose idea was it when, "I'll just wear shoes that other stank people wore just before me." Like, who came up with that idea and why?

• 31:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We're back, StarTalk Sports Edition, all about tenpin bowling and the physics of it. We got David Alciatore, unknown to us previously when we had him on before talking about billiards, that the man is also a bowling shark. And very impressed by this. Dave, I want to pick up a point that you started talking about, but I want to, I want to ask a little more deeply. You're saying today, the ball has three components to it in its manufacture. An outer shell, let's call it, like, my analogy is earth crust, okay? An outer shell, then we have a mantle, a go inside, but in the core, is a thing that's not centered. It's

• 32:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  off-center. So, tell me what would happen if I mounted the ball with, on an axis and then spun it. Would it just wobble? Is that what it would do? What's the consequence? What's the spinning consequence to the ball for putting something in there that's off-center?

• 32:45Speaker 03

  Yes. Great questions, Neil.

• 32:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, so this asymmetry is what enables the gyroscopic effects. All right, and the asymmetry comes from the shape of this core. It also comes from what angle do they drill the holes of your ball? It also comes from what angle do you spin the ball about as you throw it? So the ball's spinning about some axis. The ball has this asymmetry. Friction's acting on the ball. It causes the ball to do this gyroscopic precession or wobble or oscillating rotation, whatever you want to call it. And that creates what's called track flare. The oil doesn't build up under circumference. The oil creates these tracks that are flared out and separated. And when you get your ball back after you throw it, you can actually see these oil patterns on the ball. It's called track flare. And you can see these different stripes of oil on the ball

• 33:33Speaker 03

  at these weird angles all around the ball.

• 33:36Chuck Nice?

  Oh, my God. That's why every time you watch bowling on television, which, by the way, I never do.

• 33:43Chuck Nice?

  Because I have a life and, you know, Saturday afternoons for me are very busy. But every time you see these guys approach the lane, they have like this cloth and they're like polishing their ball, which I had no idea why they did that.

• 34:02Speaker 03

  Bingo. They're moving the oil. You want that ball to be... I never knew that. Generate as much friction as possible. You also want your throw to be consistent. So you don't want to have oil on it and have the oil build up over time. You want to get rid of that oil.

• 34:14Chuck Nice?

  I just thought they really liked the...

• 34:18Chuck Nice?

  I was like, man, that guy is proud of that ball.

• 34:20Speaker 03

  They want it.

• 34:21Chuck Nice?

  Look at him. He's just like, yeah, baby, it's okay. Daddy's got you, baby. Daddy's got you.

• 34:27Speaker 03

  And they want to shine it up so they can see their pretty face in the reflection, too, huh?

• 34:33Gary O'Reilly?

  So knowing this is happening and the weight block is offset, I will now have to structure my technique to bring the best out of that particular setup on the ball. So it's always been a one-handed thing for me, watching bowling any time. But now the successful way is a two-handed bow, which sounds a little bit like my mother would do, to be fair.

• 35:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, the two-handed throw is actually fairly new thing and it's not, it's actually not widespread yet.

• 35:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It is not new. No, Chuck did it when he was a baby.

• 35:13Chuck Nice?

  I was gonna tell you, that was invented by three-year-olds.

• 35:18Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, next thing you're gonna be, next thing you're gonna tell me is they put gates up over the gun.

• 35:26Gary O'Reilly?

  But so there's a, there's something called fingertip grip, which...

• 35:30Speaker 03

  Now, that is something, that is something. A fingertip grip is something that's, that's prevalent. Everybody, any decent bowler, they don't stick their, their middle finger and index finger all the way into the ball, up to the middle knuckle. They only put the fingertips in. Or in the span, the span of the holes, the fingertips are much farther from the thumb than the balls you would see in a bowling alley. The balls you can use, the fingers, the finger holes are pretty close together. But any good bowler, the ball, the fingers are further apart. You just put your fingertips in the ball, the index finger and middle finger. Fingertips, then your thumb, that gives you a wider span. And when you want to apply spin, those fingers are the last things that come out, the two fingers, index finger and middle finger are the...

• 36:08Gary O'Reilly?

  Does that mean the holes aren't drilled as deeply then?

• 36:10Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 36:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's right.

• 36:11Speaker 03

  They don't need to be, yes.

• 36:12Chuck Nice?

  And, and so that gives you, it's like you're flicking the ball at the very end. You're kind of giving it a whip. It's like a whip effect on the ball.

• 36:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so if the holes aren't as deep, that means the balls are more symmetric.

• 36:24Speaker 03

  Well, the thumb hole's still deep, but, and, and, and yeah, but when they drill the holes in the ball, it does create asymmetry. And, but they, when they, when they, these weight blocks, part of the issue is they, they put it off-center slightly. So when they drill the holes, it, it tends to balance it a little bit. So that's, that, that's kind of, that's balanced, but most balls are actually not perfectly balanced. Um, but that's okay.

• 36:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But here's something, in Vegas, proper dice have holes drilled for the numbers and refilled with another sort of putty that has the same density as the material that they drilled out. So, so the numbers are in white dots and the dice are red typically, right? And so, so now there's no side that weighs more than any other because of that. If you have dice where it's just holes and that's it, it's a non-symmetric dice.

• 37:16Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 37:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it will not give you equal...

• 37:18Speaker 03

  And they go to extremes to make sure those dice are balanced as well.

• 37:22Chuck Nice?

  Not in my neighborhood, they didn't.

• 37:25Gary O'Reilly?

  So the question we, Dave, the question we have to ask is why do bowling shoes look like they've been stolen from a 15th century medieval festival?

• 37:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And who convinced us that I should agree to stick my feet into somebody else's stank feet that have been there right before I arrived?

• 37:45Chuck Nice?

  And what is the incidence of athlete's foot amongst bowlers?

• 37:50Speaker 03

  Well, luckily, bowling alleys have a thing called Lysol. They spray Lysol on these shoes to help limit that, Chuck. But answering Gary's question, why do they look like they do?

• 38:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, she didn't say she sprays it in to stop it. She says she sprays it to limit it. Yeah, you caught that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:06Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, that's a, that's a very, very important distinction, Neil.

• 38:10Speaker 03

  You know, any, any good bowler has their own shoes, obviously, but, you know, the general population doesn't have their own bowling shoes. You can't expect that. So you have to provide them. You have to provide them. And isn't it awesome, Gary, that they look so retro cool? They don't look like medieval English stuff. They look like retro cool American, dude.

• 38:24Gary O'Reilly?

  No, not having that.

• 38:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what they tell themselves.

• 38:26Chuck Nice?

  Every time I see them, I'm waiting for Richie Cunningham to come pop in on the door.

• 38:30Gary O'Reilly?

  So the thing, Dave, there's got, there's got to be a reason why you have to have those shoes. You can't just come in and bowl in your own sneakers or something. What, is there something special about these shoes apart from the fact they look like they're from the 15th century?

• 38:43Speaker 03

  Very special. The, the part under your toes is actually a piece of leather that allows the foot to slide more easily on the wood surface, on the lane. And the heel is actually more like a rubber. All right? And that serves as your brake. It's not really sticky rubber, but it's kind of a hard rubber. But if you try to bowl like in tennis shoes or something, you're gonna, you're not gonna slide, you're gonna stick, and you might do the Superman thing into the oil. You don't want to do that. So you want to, you'll want to slide in toward that foul line where you release the ball. And the bowling shoes allow you to do that. And the heel, the rubber heel lets you put on the brakes if you're sliding too much.

• 39:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it's all about the friction?

• 39:17Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 39:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just the right, not too much, not too little?

• 39:20Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 39:22Speaker 03

  Now, good bowlers, they have a sense, they have a sense for, we kind of do this kind of instinctively. Using that heel, like if we're sliding too much, we can kind of sense that immediately. We don't think about it. And then we apply a little more pressure to the heel. So it all happens, you know, with experience, you, you take advantage of that leather and that rubber to control your slide optimally, because the surface gets dirty sometimes. Those teenagers that throw the ball with two hands, sometimes they, they get their sticky fingers all over stuff.

• 39:46Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 39:47Speaker 03

  And they get the lanes dirty and...

• 39:50Chuck Nice?

  Well, that's, that's why, that's why they shouldn't be allowed in the alley.

• 39:53Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 39:54Chuck Nice?

  I under, I understand that, you know, bowling is supposed to be a family sport, but some, just for certain family members, you know.

• 40:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But how about if you bowl while you're still holding your beer? Is that allowed?

• 40:04Speaker 03

  Uh, no. In fact, uh, good bowlers don't like when you have anything, any food or drink in the lane area. You know, you have to be in the back, you have to be back where the carpet is, you know, and by the counter. They don't want you to have any kind of food products.

• 40:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Bowlers would go out of business if they didn't allow eating the, what's with the, the chips and dip.

• 40:24Speaker 03

  And the pizza, yeah.

• 40:25Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 40:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, but there's lots of places to eat and drink behind the lanes.

• 40:29Chuck Nice?

  Gotta have nachos.

• 40:30Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:30Chuck Nice?

  Gotta have nachos. Um, yeah.

• 40:32Gary O'Reilly?

  What about the pins? Sorry, Chuck. Go ahead.

• 40:35Chuck Nice?

  Go ahead, no.

• 40:35Gary O'Reilly?

  What about the pins, Dave? Because they are getting brutalized every time you throw a 16, 15 pound ball down the lane. How are you ensuring that their integrity is there? Because they're just, I mean, what are they made of now? Are they still made of wood?

• 40:52Speaker 03

  Well, they were forever. You know, bowling's pretty old. It's like, it's literally thousands of years old. The Egyptians had a form of bowling. All right. And, but for a long time, it was made out of wood and they were turned on a lathe to give them that, that distinctive S shape. And the wood pins, you know, they, they get chipped, they get cracked, you know, and they had to be replaced, you know, fairly often. But nowadays, they are synthetic. A really tough material. And the good thing about the synthetic pins is they're more consistent. You know, wood has grain and wood has different properties in different directions and in different portions. But the synthetic pins, they're more, you know, they're more consistent and uniform. And that's probably contributed to the higher scores over the years as well. You know, if things are more consistent and then these machines that put down the oil, if they're better, if the, if the machines that spot the pins in the correct places

• 41:37Speaker 03

  are more accurate with tolerances, if all that stuff is better, then we can bowl better. And that's what's happened over the years. Scores have gotten higher.

• 41:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  How rare is a 300? How rare is a 300?

• 41:46Speaker 03

  Oh, well, even league bowlers like myself bowl 300s every once in a while. Uh, this, this past weekend, I bowled a 279 and that-

• 41:53Chuck Nice?

  That's not a 300.

• 41:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I said 300!

• 41:56Speaker 03

  I'm letting you know. I'm letting you know.

• 41:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Don't play that game!

• 42:00Speaker 03

  I'm letting you know how hard it is. So the 379, I had one shot where I threw it what I thought was perfect and I had what's called a ringing 10-pin. The 10-pin's the one in the corner and the pin in front of that is the 6-pin. And if the entry angle isn't exactly perfect, that you don't hit it in exactly the right place, that 6-pin just wraps around the 10. Sometimes it touches it and the 10-pin just ringing in place. It's ringing in place. And that was the only mistake. I had all strikes except this one ringing 10. So it's very hard.

• 42:27Chuck Nice?

  Ah, that's why they call it a perfect game.

• 42:29Speaker 03

  I know. If you want to be perfect, you gotta be perfect.

• 42:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If it's not perfect, it's not perfect.

• 42:33Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 42:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, correct me if I'm wrong, correct me if I'm wrong. So to bowl a 300, you have to roll 12 consecutive strikes?

• 42:41Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 42:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is that correct? Okay. So, has anyone bowled two 300 games in a row?

• 42:46Speaker 03

  Yes, people have bowled three, three, three 300 games in a row. That gives you a, a perfect series of 900.

• 42:51Chuck Nice?

  Ah.

• 42:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wow, okay. So now how many in your case?

• 42:54Chuck Nice?

  Now, based on that, I'm just gonna say, it ain't that hard.

• 42:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 42:58Chuck Nice?

  Okay? I'm just saying, I've never heard of a pitcher who's thrown three perfect games in a row.

• 43:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think bowling a 300 is easier, I think it's easier than getting a, a hole-in-one in golf, for example. It's easier than throwing a perfect game in, in baseball. Uh, but it's still hard. It's still hard.

• 43:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's still hard. So, so for you, uh, so how many perfect games have you bowled in your life?

• 43:21Speaker 03

  Only one. But I've had many, I've had many 279s.

• 43:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I asked you about the other game. Okay.

• 43:27Chuck Nice?

  I know, that's like saying, that's like, Chuck, how many standing ovations have you had? Well, one time, four people in the back stood up, but then I saw that they were just going to a concession stand.

• 43:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right, so here, I'll make you feel a little better, you ready? So, how many strikes in a row had you thrown before it and after it? So that we can now get the total number of consecutive strikes that you've ever thrown.

• 43:58Chuck Nice?

  Oh.

• 43:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, and we keep track of that. We know. We know what that number is. Mine is 18. So I threw 18 strikes in a row.

• 44:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, very good.

• 44:06Speaker 03

  And one time I threw, one time I threw 16 strikes in a row and didn't get a 300. In fact, both games were like in the 250s or 260s, which is like mediocre.

• 44:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't get it. How can you, if 12 in a row is a 300, how does 16?

• 44:20Speaker 03

  Over two games, over two games.

• 44:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh.

• 44:23Speaker 03

  So like I got the last.

• 44:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Eight and eight.

• 44:25Speaker 03

  Yeah, like the last eight, yeah, the last eight of the first game, the first eight of the second game.

• 44:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah.

• 44:31Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You know, that's like Chuck, the baseball analogy here is where you have multiple relief pitchers combining to pitch a no hitter.

• 44:39Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 44:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's what that is.

• 44:41Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 44:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You staple it together.

• 44:42Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 44:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, yeah, so no one pitcher gets a no hitter, but they all sort of participated.

• 44:47Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:47Chuck Nice?

  So has it ever happened to you where it's the last throw of the game? Because the 10th frame, you just get three throws.

• 44:55Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 44:56Chuck Nice?

  But if you pick up the spare, but has it ever happened where on the, in the 10th frame, the last throw, you screw up your perfect game?

• 45:06Speaker 03

  No, I've never done that, but that is very common, very common.

• 45:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I have a friend who did that and he got 299. That's it.

• 45:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, you can get a 299, 298, 297. But if you miss, if your miss is somewhere in the middle of the game, you get a 279. That's the highest you can get if your miss is in the middle of the game, 279.

• 45:21Chuck Nice?

  Got you.

• 45:22Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, go back to the lane, then you've got the arrows, because the lane itself is a series of, I don't want to call it tanks, but.

• 45:29Speaker 03

  Boards, yeah.

• 45:29Gary O'Reilly?

  There you go. And they all have, there's little arrows in there. And I'm obviously, they're used as guidelines. Are there any other kind of markers on the real estate? That you can use to key off and get a better strike?

• 45:44Speaker 03

  Yeah, there are other markers. There's a row of little circle marks in front of the arrows. The arrows are about 15 feet down the lane, and that's what most bowlers use to aim. You don't want to be gazing down at your ball or gazing at the foul line. You want to be gazing at your distant target, about 15 feet down the lane. So that's what most bowlers are looking at. They're trying to hit a certain board. Between the arrows, there's boards. You can actually see the individual boards of the lane. There's five boards per arrow, and there's seven arrows across the lane. So there's, yeah, let's see, there's 39 boards total. There's seven arrows, but there's two gaps on each side of the arrows. Anyway, all right, so, yeah, most bowlers are aiming at a particular board.

• 46:28Speaker 03

  The boards are about a one inch wide, and so good bowlers can hit their target within about an inch fairly reliably. Two inches, the pros are within an inch. You know, league bowlers like me, we can get within two inches pretty reliably the whole night. We can hit our target within two inches, but if your speed is off a little bit, if you throw it a little too slow, it curves too soon, and you don't get a strike. You throw it a little too fast, it curves too late. If you don't release your fingers the exact same way, you don't get the same amount of spin. So you don't get the same curve. So there's so many variables. Isn't it amazing?

• 46:59Chuck Nice?

  I am almost, I am almost developing a healthy respect for bowling.

• 47:04Speaker 03

  Well, thank you, Chuck, because I was perceiving a very strong disrespect earlier.

• 47:09Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I'll tell you the truth. I felt it too, Dave.

• 47:15Speaker 03

  I didn't like him dissing my 279s, man. That's, oh, God.

• 47:19Chuck Nice?

  No, no, this is, I have to tell you, Dave, that I think a lot of people suffer from this bias where because everyone can go bowling, people are under the impression that everyone can bowl. You know, or bowl well, or it's not as difficult as you just let us see, which it seems like it's a game of true precision.

• 47:44Speaker 03

  But at the same time, this is the beauty of bowling and billiards. You can be terrible and still have a great time. That's what I love about billiards and pool. Anybody can enjoy it.

• 47:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's a beautiful thought.

• 47:55Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 47:56Gary O'Reilly?

  David, has anyone tried to sort of change the game? Um, make it more, you know, sexier, more interesting? Or is it as good as it's ever gonna get as we find it right now?

• 48:08Speaker 03

  Well, like most sports and games, we don't wanna change anything. Alright, in fact, these new balls that kind of revolutionize the game and kind of increases scores a lot, you know, purists don't like that. Cause it changes the game and then you can't compare today's performance to the past performance. So we want the game to stay the same. But having said that, technology has changed a little bit and technique has changed somewhat. We briefly mentioned the two-handed bowling. Alright, so most bowlers had their fingertips in the ball and their thumb in the ball. But these two-handers now, they only put their fingertips in the ball. And they need the other hand to help support the ball so it doesn't fall off when they're about to release it, they have to help support it. So they go down the lane, holding the ball with both hands, they had their fingertips in the ball only. And when they release it, they can put way more spin on the ball because they're not hampered by the thumb.

• 48:54Speaker 03

  Everything's about those two fingers that spin the heck out of the ball and give a tremendous

• 48:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Revving. Your other hand can help spin it also, is that correct?

• 49:01Speaker 03

  No, the other hand is just there for support. They don't use that because you know, when you're releasing the ball, the other hand comes off. You're just using the other hand to get you to that release point. Then the fingers do everything.

• 49:12Chuck Nice?

  So how about this, because I just invented a version of bowling in my head.

• 49:16Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 49:16Chuck Nice?

  Uh, which is you take the hardest shots and you rank which shots are most difficult. And then the pin configuration, you can choose to get the most points. So of course the 7-10 would be worth the most. And you know, uh, the one pin by itself would be worth, worth the least. And then you can figure out these configurations and then you get to actually choose which ones you will try in order to, to, to score more points.

• 49:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Interesting.

• 49:52Speaker 03

  I like it. I like it.

• 49:53Chuck Nice?

  You know, so, yeah.

• 49:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So basically each setup has a different difficulty level.

• 49:57Chuck Nice?

  Yes, thank you.

• 49:58Speaker 03

  And if you get, if you get behind, if you get behind the game, you can take on the more challenging, uh, patterns, yeah.

• 50:04Chuck Nice?

  Right, right, so you can all, you can always come back and win depending on which level of difficulty you choose, uh, uh, to, to roll your ball.

• 50:14Speaker 03

  I'm gonna give you a little credit for that, even though you disrespected me earlier, Chuck, I'm gonna say, I'm gonna give you some credit, that's a good idea, man.

• 50:20Gary O'Reilly?

  I think you've taken the sport in a new direction Chuck.

• 50:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Dr. Dave, it's great to have you back and I'm afraid to ask you what else you are a world's expert in.

• 50:31Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 50:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We might find that out on another invite.

• 50:33Chuck Nice?

  Street dice is next.

• 50:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Chuck and Gary, always good to have you, man. So that's a wrap on our StarTalk Sports Edition. Bowling, how to be an expert, know some physics.

• 50:48Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 50:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's the takeaway from this, know some physics. All right. And have a mom who used to work in a bowling alley. Combine those two, you're a winner every time. Neil deGrasse Tyson here, your personal astrophysicist. Keep looking out.