Pod Insights Scamfluencers Giancarlo Parretti: The Italian Job | 152 About this episode When Thelma and Louise was being made in the early 1990s, production was in and out of financial trouble. Behind this shortage of cash was an Italian businessman and epic scammer named Giancarlo Parretti, who managed to buy multiple movie studios on two continents through falsified loans from a corrupt bank. Still at large in Italy, Giancarlo seems to be a scammer with nine lives.
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0:00 Sarah Hagi? Audible subscribers can listen to all our episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free right now. Join Audible today by downloading the Audible app.
0:14 Sarah Hagi? Sachi, I know you love power. What would you do if you were suddenly in charge of a movie studio? Uh, every movie would be a sequel to Robocop. Robocop would be 50 Cent. I would be Robocop's love interest. The movies are seven to 10 hours long. No cuts. OK, as you know, I never want to be in charge of anything ever. I am a proud follower. But I think I would maybe reboot Mr. Bean. Like, he kind of united the world, if you think about it. Oh, yeah. What if Mr. Bean and Robocop had a crossover and then they fell in love? Oh, Mr. Bean doesn't have those feelings,
0:57 Sarah Hagi? but maybe he could teach Robocop the ways of the world. No, they have to kiss. OK, well, Sachi, I think you'll be pleased to know I am bringing you yet another Hollywood scam story. Today's story is about a guy who claims to have started from nothing and yet managed to scam his way to the top of Hollywood's most iconic studios. You are going to love this.
1:26 Sarah Hagi? It's March 1990, and Hollywood's Dorothy Chandler Pavilion is crackling with excitement. That's right, Sachi. It's the 62nd Annual Academy Awards, and the show is just about to start. The enormous theater is packed with gorgeous A-listers and Hollywood bigwigs. Everyone's in their gowns and tuxedos, ready to celebrate the hottest films of 1989. For one audience member, this is an extra special night. Giancarlo Peretti has just walked the red carpet for the very first time. Giancarlo is a stout, squat Italian businessman with aggressively parted black hair, and he's relatively new to Hollywood. He's been in L.A. for about a year, and he's made the most of it. When he's
2:10 Sarah Hagi? Not hanging out at the private dance club he owns or holding lavish parties at his $9 million mansion. He's been trying to buy some of the biggest film studios in Hollywood. And just a few weeks ago, he made his wildest move yet. He agreed to pay more than $1 billion to buy MGM, the historic studio behind some of cinema's all-time classics like Gone with the Wind and The Wizard of Oz. And sure, the tabloids might be talking about Giancarlo's shady past and his legal issues back home, but at least they're talking about him. And now, he's at cinema's biggest night, sitting with celebrities like Spike Lee, Tom Cruise, and Morgan Freeman.
2:51 Sarah Hagi? The house lights go down, the music swells, and Billy Crystal walks out on stage. This is actually his first year hosting the Oscars. Billy starts firing off jokes. He talks about some of the night's big movies like Driving Miss Daisy and Tim Burton's Batman. He roasts Jack Nicholson and Shirley MacLaine. And then he makes this joke aimed squarely at Giancarlo.
3:15 Speaker 01 And right here in town, Hollywood has definitely taken on a foreign flavor. And Australia knows 20th Century Fox. MGM is being bought by an Italian who's promised only one small change. From now on, the line is not going to roar. He's going to be taking the fifth.
3:29 Sarah Hagi? Billy Crystal's, like, award show emblem is so dorky, like, in hindsight. This is such a cha-cha-cha joke. But the joke is basically that MGM, which, as you know, Sarah, the emblem is a lion, will now be in the mob and will have to take the fifth, which is when you say that you can't incriminate yourself on stand. Yeah, I mean, it is a pretty niche joke, but it gets a huge reaction from the crowd because people in the entertainment business have followed the deal closely, along with Giancarlo's legal issues. Everyone has the same question. Where does all his money come from? But Giancarlo does not appreciate the joke.
4:13 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo feels like he's being smeared with an anti-Italian stereotype. His big night has been ruined, all before the show even reaches its first commercial break. But for Giancarlo, Billy's jokes will soon be the least of his problems. Because once he takes ownership of MGM, he'll lead it into a debt-laden tailspin, and get the attention of law enforcement agencies all over the globe. Before it's all over, Giancarlo will have earned a place on Hollywood's Walk of Shame.
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6:10 Sarah Hagi? From Wondery, I'm Sarah Haggie. And I'm Sachi Cole. And this is Scamfluencers.
6:24 Sarah Hagi? The American film industry has always had a dark side. But when Giancarlo Peretti arrives in Los Angeles in the 80s, it's in a haze of financial crimes so flagrant that even the sketchiest Hollywood executives take notice. Like all legendary Hollywood figures, Giancarlo makes business look glamorous. He cut deals with foreign banks on yachts and bought himself a dance club so he could party till sunrise. But while he basks in the spotlight, behind the scenes, the FBI and Interpol start connecting the dots of his global scheme. An enormous financial scam involving a French bank, multiple European governments, and shady characters on at least two continents.
7:06 Sarah Hagi? I'm calling this one Giancarlo Peretti: The Italian Job.
7:14 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo's story starts way before Billy Crystal's Oscar debut. A few decades earlier, 17-year-old Giancarlo Peretti is scrambling to put all his orders in. It's 1958, and he's a waiter on the Queen Elizabeth, a transatlantic ocean liner. Serving the ship's upper-class guests gives him the chance to rub elbows with people he could never meet in his tiny hometown. Giancarlo was born in 1941 in Orvieto, Italy. Like many of the scammers we cover, it's hard to pin down exact details of his early life. Most reports say he was the son of an olive merchant. But in the BBC documentary, "The Man Who Definitely Didn't Steal Hollywood",
7:58 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo claims he was abandoned as an infant on the steps of a church. He says he spent five years in an orphanage until a local woman adopted him. Giancarlo also says that in his teens, he worked as a waiter at a fancy hotel in London. According to him, he became the personal waiter of one of his regular customers, Winston Churchill. A reporter for Spy Magazine once contacted the company that owned the Queen Elizabeth and the London restaurant where Giancarlo says he worked. And neither had any record of him working there. Oh, okay. Good start. Good lying start. Whatever the truth actually is, it's clear that Giancarlo loves to give himself
8:40 Sarah Hagi? a cinematic origin story. But there is no denying he is a hustler. A friend who really did work with him at a restaurant in Orvieto later told the BBC that, quote, "All he wanted was money." Giancarlo's dedication on the cruise ship catches the attention of a man named Graziano Versato. Graziano is a powerful politician and businessman who looks a bit like an Italian Wallace Shawn. He's about two decades older than Giancarlo and admires his work ethic. Before long, Graziano offers the young man a job at his hotel he owns back in Sicily. Giancarlo takes a gig and pretty soon, he and Graziano become close. We don't know
9:23 Sarah Hagi? exactly how involved Giancarlo is in Graziano's business at this point, but in 1975, a police investigation reveals that Graziano's been running money for a notorious mob boss. Sometime after this, Graziano winds up getting shot in the arm. It's allegedly a fake assassination attempt to delay prosecution. And when he's in the hospital, Giancarlo is right there at his bedside. As soon as he recovers, Graziano leaves Italy and his wife puts Giancarlo in charge of all the business interests he's left behind, including a local soccer team. Giancarlo has denied that he ever had ties to the mafia, but he does pay the team every week from a bag full of cash.
10:08 Sarah Hagi? Oh, so now if you pay somebody in cash in a bag mysteriously, you're a part of the mob? That's a little anti-Italian. I mean, cash is king, so I have no issues with that. Cash is king. Well, now that Graziano's properties are under his control, Giancarlo has the capital and connections to start his own business career. And it seems like he's found his calling. Throughout the 70s and 80s, he buys and sells all kinds of businesses: banks, insurance companies, and tons of hotels. He even starts a chain of newspapers called Il Diario, which runs for a few years before going bankrupt. And then, in the mid 80s, he takes over a French newspaper and bankrupts it within a year.
10:53 Sarah Hagi? Nobody knows how to make money on news. Tale as old as time, eh? Tale as old as time. But while he's doing all of this, he's also building up his criminal record. By the end of the 80s, Giancarlo's convictions range from conspiring to commit bodily harm to violating securities law to straight-up fraud. Weirdly, though, nothing ever seems to stick. It could be Giancarlo's connection to Graziano, the corrupt state of Italian politics in the 80s, or just a lax justice system. But he never faces any serious consequences. It probably doesn't hurt that when Giancarlo was running his first newspaper, he became close friends with a few political power players, which comes in handy
11:38 Sarah Hagi? when he's caught trying to withdraw money from a bank using forged documents. Luckily, an Italian government minister sends an accountant to pay back the money Giancarlo tried to steal. And then the bank drops their charges. Giancarlo's connections are obviously great for helping him stay in business and out of prison. And they're about to introduce him to the perfect partner for his next set of business ventures in a new industry: the movies.
12:06 Sarah Hagi? It's 1987 at the glamorous Intercontinental Hotel in Paris. The wealthy and well-connected are enjoying breakfast when Florio Fiorini starts screaming at his business partner Giancarlo. Florio is a short businessman with a round face and square glasses. He's actually the accountant who helped Giancarlo get out of trouble that time he forged bank documents. And while most people might be put off by the idea of doing business with someone they met under these circumstances, Florio is not most people. He's a financial whiz with ties to the oil business. And Fortune magazine will later call him, quote, "one of the biggest, if not the biggest, political briber and money launderer in Europe."
12:51 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo and Florio are kind of a classic odd couple. Giancarlo is dramatic and extravagant, while Florio stays behind the scenes, organizing most of their financial deals. Here's how a journalist who knew them at the time described their dynamic in the BBC documentary.
13:08 Speaker 04 They were sort of like a traveling road show. Parretti would dominate attention. Well, Fiorini would be quiet, but he would be intelligent and answer questions precisely. Fiorini was more or less a normal person. Parretti was extraordinary in every way.
13:27 Scaachi Koul? They sound like Pinky and the Brain.
13:28 Sarah Hagi? Exactly. This is a classic pairing for a reason. This works.
13:33 Scaachi Koul? Uh huh.
13:33 Sarah Hagi? Anyway, the partnership does work well. Mostly, they buy existing businesses and strip them for parts. But they also set up an enormous network of shell companies to hide and obscure any shady dealings. This network is actually so enormous that Giancarlo keeps a double-sided flowchart in his house just to keep track of all the company names. Lately, Florio and Giancarlo have been dipping their toes into an industry that's brand new to both of them: the movies. Last year, a Catholic organization Giancarlo had worked with in the past asked for help producing a movie called Bernadette. It's about a French peasant girl who sees a vision of the Virgin Mary and eventually becomes a saint.
14:17 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo doesn't really care about movies, but he does love that the production process brings him into contact with one of the biggest A-listers in the world: the Pope. According to Giancarlo, they screen the film at the Vatican, and when it's over, everyone in the audience has to sit in silence for five minutes because the Pope can't stop crying.
14:40 Scaachi Koul? Is it a rule that you can't do or say anything if the Pope is crying?
14:44 Sarah Hagi? I feel like maybe it's just you're kind of caught off guard by the Pope crying, you know?
14:49 Scaachi Koul? Uh huh.
14:50 Sarah Hagi? Well, regardless of the Pope's emotional state, the religious material makes Florio uncomfortable. He wants them to take their names off the movie and separate themselves from the production. So Giancarlo recently met with Canon Group Inc., the American distributor in charge of Bernadette, to see if he could sell their stake in the movie. But he came away from that meeting with a new idea. And this morning, Giancarlo is explaining it to Florio. He says they should buy Canon. Florio thinks this is a very bad idea. Canon is currently being investigated by the SEC for fraud. They're carrying almost a billion dollars in debt, and they're teetering on the edge of bankruptcy.
15:34 Sarah Hagi? Sachi, can you read what Florio yells at Giancarlo over their fancy hotel breakfast?
15:40 Scaachi Koul? He says, "Parretti, may God strike you dead. I send you to sell a movie and you come back wanting to buy a whole studio with a billion dollars in debt." I cannot stress how much a billion dollars is in the 80s. It is so much money.
15:56 Sarah Hagi? I love the "may God strike you dead." You know, it's like-
15:59 Scaachi Koul? That's classic immigrant stuff.
16:02 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, you would say that, you know? They're already in the religious mindset.
16:05 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, that seems about right for these guys.
16:08 Sarah Hagi? Well, Giancarlo keeps making his case. He points out that Canon's not just a production company, they're also the largest movie theater operator in Europe. Giancarlo thinks they can make some serious money off this part of the business if they can pick it up for cheap right now. Plus, they'd be sitting on valuable real estate all across Europe. The more Giancarlo explains his idea, the more Florio has to admit there are upsides. By the end of breakfast, Florio is in. But there's one more hurdle to clear. To buy Canon, they'll need to get approval from Canon's bank. And this could be an issue.
16:49 Sarah Hagi? Florio and Giancarlo have no trouble bribing and cheating in Italy, but this is a bigger international deal. And their sketchy past could raise major red flags for a bank. Lucky for them, they're about to find someone on the inside who's just as ready to break the rules as they are.
17:09 Sarah Hagi? Not long after that dramatic breakfast, Giancarlo is at the Cannes Film Festival in the south of France. He's surrounded by movie stars, high-powered executives, and even royalty. Princess Diana is here. All across the city, people are mixing business with pleasure. They're partying at premieres and making big deals, and Giancarlo is ready to join them. Today, he's waiting in a corner room at the Carlton Hotel with the two men who currently own Canon. They're here to talk with a bank executive about Giancarlo's proposal to buy the company. The guy they're meeting is named Franz Hoffman. Franz is a Dutch banker in his early 50s,
17:51 Sarah Hagi? and he looks like a completely smooth Woody Harrelson. He's also one of the most powerful people in the film industry right now. That's because, in the 80s, a single European bank was one of the biggest sources of money for all Hollywood studios. The bank is called CLBN. It's the Dutch arm of a French bank called Credit Lyonnais. Under Franz's direction, CLBN has lent out almost $800 million to the American film industry over the last few years. This would be a little over $2 billion in today's dollars. Franz has given money to the companies who've produced The Terminator, Superman, and Rambo, among other blockbusters. Yeah, I mean, those are big movies.
18:36 Sarah Hagi? Those are undoubtedly big movies. And if they had not been made, our culture would be very different, and perhaps we would not have the RoboCops that we have now. Yeah, that makes total sense. Franz is also known for finding, let's say, creative workarounds for his clients. He's given out millions of dollars without asking for proper documentation. And he's not above saving a little of that money for himself. One year at Cannes, someone claims they saw him literally take a huge envelope of cash from a film exec on a yacht, though, of course, Franz denies this ever happened. So Giancarlo has every reason to expect that this guy's gonna be on his same shady level.
19:19 Sarah Hagi? But the second Franz walks into the room, the vibes are off. Before Franz even sits down, Giancarlo is doing what comes most naturally to him: offering a bribe. But Franz doesn't seem that into it. He looks uncomfortable, and it only gets worse from there. All through their meeting, Giancarlo keeps staring at Franz's female assistant, gesturing at his crotch to try and get her attention. To Giancarlo, this is just normal business stuff. But by the end of the meeting, Franz says outright that Giancarlo and Florio can't buy Canon. Giancarlo is shocked and angry. He can't figure out what went wrong. This is the part of a scam that always bums me out.
20:04 Sarah Hagi? When someone is deceptive already, clearly, but also like a piece of shit. So unfortunately, now we have somebody who is a liar and gross. Yeah, and Giancarlo doesn't do any self-reflection. He decides he needs to talk to Franz's boss. So the next day, he, Florio, and the Canon guys all head out to a meeting with Georges Vignan, the head of CLBN. They sit down on a beautiful, sunlit hotel terrace. And then like yesterday, this meeting goes really well. Georges is younger than Franz, even though he's his boss. He's in his early 40s with slicked-back hair, a pointy nose, and thick glasses. He looks kind of nerdy, but he's actually an ex-Foreign Legion paratrooper
20:48 Sarah Hagi? who once killed an enemy soldier with his own bayonet. And he seems like he commands a lot of respect in the film industry. All through their lunch, Giancarlo watches as stars and big-time producers drop by the table to chat. Giancarlo even gets to flirt with a few actresses. Best of all, whatever rubbed Franz a wrong way doesn't seem to bother Georges at all. By the end of the lunch meeting, he's agreed to let Giancarlo and Florio buy Canon. And not only that, he's gonna give them an extra $250 million to get the company back on its feet. I love that slimeball sees slimeball. And they are willing to share millions of dollars and power and control
21:33 Sarah Hagi? over something that I don't think either of them are equipped to run. Perfect. You know, it's exactly what you said. Game recognize game, Sachi. And of course, Giancarlo is thrilled. After they make the deal, as a thank you, he gives a bunch of CLBN employees drawings that he says are original works by Picasso. Then he flies Georges and his family to Bora Bora on a private jet for a nice vacation. The future is looking bright. Giancarlo's got money, a foothold in the movie business, and a boss who understands his vision. But his dreams are about to come up against an opponent who can't be bribed, seduced, or intimidated: the Dutch government.
22:18 Sarah Hagi? A few months after Cannes, George is facing uncomfortable questions about CLBN's habit of lending lots of money to Hollywood studios. The Dutch Central Bank, which is like the Netherlands' version of the US Federal Reserve, has finally noticed just how much CLBN is investing in Hollywood. They say the bank is concentrating too much money on risky investments in a single industry, and they tell George to diversify the bank's portfolio. But he doesn't want to do this. He likes the power and prestige of Hollywood. In fact, he likes it so much that he just put $30 million into yet another film studio. And it doesn't hurt that the kickbacks he got from this investment were enough to pay for his new yacht.
23:03 Sarah Hagi? Thankfully, George did a background check on Giancarlo and Florio after their luncheon Cannes. He learned that they have incredibly checkered pasts, including allegations of fraud and bribery. He also knows they own a huge network of interconnected shell companies, presumably so they can move money without investigators nosing around. So in response to the Dutch Central Bank's warning, George reaches out to his new Italian partners and asks if he can start funneling some of the bank's money into their shell accounts. And of course, Giancarlo and Florio are more than happy to help. After all, what's a little money laundering between friends? Sarah, I am always saying this to you. It's a sign of respect
23:47 Sarah Hagi? if your friend helps you launder money. Mm-hmm. And you know what? George's plan works. The shell companies give him the shield he's looking for. Soon enough, CLBN is able to go back to business as usual. In fact, it all works so well that around this time, George actually gets a promotion. Credilitonés, the bank that owns CLBN, makes him their head of European lending. But this isn't going to stop George from focusing a lot of his attention and energy on Hollywood. Now that George is one of the most powerful men in European finance, the stage is set for him and his two Italian proteges to take Hollywood by storm. They've successfully taken over one studio.
24:30 Sarah Hagi? But they're not done yet. And they're going to go follow the playbook of every sequel in Hollywood by going bigger.
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25:42 Sarah Hagi? The first thing Giancarlo and Florio do with Canon, their new Hollywood production company, is actually pretty surprising. They make a good business move. They take a portion of the $250 million they got from CLBN and pay off some of Canon's debt. This ensures the company won't go bankrupt, yet. With Canon back on more solid footing, Giancarlo feels free to start dipping into the company's coffers and living the high life. In 1988, Giancarlo moves to Los Angeles with his wife and their three kids. He starts spending a lot of time with a new friend, the producer and fellow Italian expat, Dino De Laurentiis. Sachi, have you heard of this guy?
26:28 Scaachi Koul? No, but he sounds like somebody who worked with, like, Al Pacino. Am I right?
26:33 Sarah Hagi? You know what? You are right. He does have a Pacino connection. And even if you don't know him by name, you have seen his work. Dino's produced a huge range of Hollywood movies, including Blue Velvet and Serpico, which starred Al Pacino. He's famous for taking big swings on ambitious projects. And now, he's taking a big swing on Giancarlo. Dino introduces him to other Hollywood bigwigs, and even lets Giancarlo host a party at his lavish hilltop estate. Giancarlo immediately starts trying to live like his new mentor. He buys a $200,000 brown Rolls Royce, just like the one Dino drives,
27:14 Sarah Hagi? and even takes over his friend's luxurious office on Wilshire Boulevard. But Giancarlo doesn't stop there. He buys himself a private jet, and he moves his family into a $9 million house with seven bedrooms, a tennis court, and a pool. The walls are hung with art. He tells his guests our original works by Goya, Murros, and Picasso, just like the drawings he gave to the CLBN executives as gifts. Now that he's got a home base in Hollywood, Giancarlo throws huge bashes at his mansion. He serves his guests pasta, expensive wine, and cigars. When he gets frustrated that Hollywood clubs
27:56 Sarah Hagi? don't stay open as late as the Italian ones he's used to, he buys himself a private, members-only nightclub called Tramp. And he quickly becomes a regular on the dance floor of his own club. When he's not out dancing, he's hanging out at an upscale restaurant called Madeo. People stop by to pay their respects, just like they did at George's table back at Cannes. Giancarlo is finally living his A-list dream, all paid for with CLBN loan money that's meant to be financing Canon Productions. Around this time, Giancarlo also picks up another cliched and extremely disturbing Hollywood habit.
28:39 Sarah Hagi? He puts three young Italian actresses on the Canon payroll, including a former Miss Universe contestant. One magazine later reports that these women are actually his, quote, "mistresses", and that they've been paid to "service him sexually". He buys them jewelry and promises them acting lessons, which, of course, never happen, never mind any actual parts in movies. However, when Giancarlo tries to grope Dino De Laurentiis's daughter, Raffaele, at a party, she reportedly punches him in the face.
29:14 Sarah Hagi? Well, yeah. Appropriate response. In fact, perhaps not even enough. She should have done it twice. The most appropriate response. In December of 1988, Giancarlo hosts a massive Christmas party at his mansion. He even flies George in from Europe. And his generosity doesn't stop there. In the middle of the party, he gathers a few of his closest friends, including George and another CLBN executive, into the library. There, he presents them with a special Christmas gift: stock certificates for a publicly traded company he's just acquired. The mechanics of this are complicated, but basically, in a few months, Giancarlo's production company is going to buy up this company
29:58 Sarah Hagi? and use the acquisition to funnel a bunch of money into the pockets of its owners. In this case, his friends at the bank. It's essentially a huge bribe. The next day, just to seal the deal, he flies George out to Bora Bora again. All of this is classic Giancarlo: bold, extravagant, and incredibly illegal. And it works. Before the end of the year, CLBN extends Giancarlo's line of credit. Their business dealings and their fates are only getting more intertwined. And eventually, it's going to have serious consequences for everyone involved.
30:42 Sarah Hagi? By 1990, Giancarlo has made himself a player in Hollywood. But the American media doesn't know what to make of him. When he appears on Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous, host Robin Leach calls him "the new king of Hollywood." But the LA Times interviews one industry insider who says that, quote, "He mostly talks about food, movies, and his private plane." And even this doesn't seem totally true. Giancarlo doesn't really know anything about movies. In one interview around this time, he has to ask a PR person what he should say his favorite movie is. When she suggests Gone with the Wind, he says he's never heard of it. That's obviously bad for a movie executive,
31:27 Sarah Hagi? but I will say, a lot of-
31:29 Scaachi Koul? Movie executives don't watch movies. They don't know what makes a good one and all they talk about is food and their plane.
31:38 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, it seems like he's honestly fitting right in.
31:40 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
31:41 Sarah Hagi? Even though he doesn't seem to know much about movies, Giancarlo has told reporters he wants to take charge of some of the biggest production companies in Hollywood, as well as the French company Pathé Cinema. Pathé is actually the second oldest film company in the world and they own the work of a lot of important European directors. Taking over Pathé would be a huge feather in Giancarlo's cap and might even earn him the respect of Hollywood's elites. Giancarlo wants to own Pathé so badly, he literally changes Canon's name to Pathé Communications Corporation. It's like the business equivalent of calling his shot. He also hires a well-respected Hollywood exec named Alan Ladd Jr.
32:24 Sarah Hagi? to run the company's film unit and give him an air of legitimacy. He makes a $150 million bid for Pathé and the deal actually goes pretty far until the French government steps in. Now, the details of this whole thing are a little messy. Some newspapers at the time report that Giancarlo's bid to buy the company was successful, but it seems like the French government intervenes after he had already put the money in, but before he could fully take control. CLBN might not have minded Giancarlo's sketchy past, but the country of France apparently has higher standards.
33:03 Scaachi Koul? Do you know how bad you have to be for France to be the governing body that stops you?
33:09 Sarah Hagi? Yeah.
33:09 Scaachi Koul? You have to be so bad.
33:10 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, you have to be pretty messed up. As all of this is going down, The Wall Street Journal runs a piece on Giancarlo's criminal past in Italy and Business Week runs a story claiming that Giancarlo has ties to the mafia and that he's been laundering loan money through a network of shell companies. He puts out a statement denying all of this, but it's a huge blow to the image he's trying to portray of a legit Hollywood player. And it's not just the press who are on his case. Back in Italy, the authorities have started to investigate the collapse of the newspaper chain that Giancarlo founded and then bankrupted. He's been charged with falsifying balance sheets.
33:52 Sarah Hagi? Giancarlo's not the only one with authorities breathing down his neck. The Dutch central bank has been getting on CLBN's case again. But this time, they don't just issue a warning. They impose a limit on the amount of money the bank is allowed to give out to any one client. Of course, George, Giancarlo, and Florio already have a system for dealing with this. They can just move money around into different shell companies to make it look like they're setting things right. So now, all Giancarlo has to do is lay low and press pause on his crazy business deals until things settle down. But Giancarlo just can't help himself.
34:33 Sarah Hagi? And in the face of so much suspicion, he's about to make his biggest move yet.
34:42 Sarah Hagi? Sachi, when I say the name MGM, what do you think of? I think about Leo the Lion, the mascot in the MGM logo and his big roar. Yeah, that is undeniably iconic. And I don't know, it just seems like one of those things you are always aware of if you've seen movies, is the MGM logo and the fact that it's a big company, right? Mm-hmm. Well, the studio has been around since the 20s and has been one of the most prestigious names in cinema. Their logo, as you mentioned, a roaring lion, is an iconic symbol of classic Hollywood. But by 1990, MGM is a shell of its former self.
35:23 Sarah Hagi? Over the previous few decades, the company has lost a ton of money, produced way fewer movies, and burned through multiple CEOs, including one guy they hired after he was fired from another studio for embezzlement. At this point, MGM is bleeding money, and the owner is looking for someone to take it off his hands. So when Giancarlo and Florio offer $1.25 billion for MGM, the owner accepts with a few conditions. He doesn't trust that these two jokers actually have access to this much money, so he says they have to come up with it in four months. Until then, they have to pay him non-refundable deposits of $50 million a month.
36:08 Sarah Hagi? It's a pretty high bar to clear, but Giancarlo agrees.
36:13 Sarah Hagi? The press reception around all this is skeptical, to say the least. The LA Times runs an article about how nobody in the industry thinks Giancarlo can really afford MGM. His company has been steadily losing money. And it's only produced one actual movie since he took charge, a Sean Connery, Michelle Pfeiffer vehicle called "The Russia House." Have you ever heard of this movie?
36:40 Scaachi Koul? I did not know the two of them were in a movie. This feels like a fake 30 Rock movie, honestly, looking at the poster.
36:49 Sarah Hagi? It feels like the kind of movie Netflix would make now and you'd never watch.
36:53 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
36:54 Sarah Hagi? But actually, things are worse than these Hollywood insiders realize. There's no CLBN loan money left, which means Giancarlo and Florio have just agreed to an enormous business deal with absolutely no money to follow through on it. Giancarlo will have to tap into all his connections and raise over $1 billion. It's a tall order, but Giancarlo gets off to a surprisingly promising start. An executive at Time Warner agrees to give him $650 million in exchange for video game rights to some of MGM's movies. The deal gets far enough along that Giancarlo gives the Time Warner exec one of his Picasso drawings he's famous for handing out as a thank you gift.
37:39 Sarah Hagi? But the guy wisely sends a drawing out to be insured, and surprise, surprise, the appraiser tells him that it's a fake. The exec gets spooked and pulls out of the deal.
37:52 Scaachi Koul? It's so funny because I think gifting the Picasso is such a common movie executive thing. There's an old story about Robin Williams and how he took a pay cut when he did Aladdin under the condition that he wouldn't be used for a certain percentage of marketing products, of merchandising. And they did it anyway, and then he didn't do the second movie, and then there was this changeover at Disney, and then the new executive gifted him a Picasso to get him to do the third movie, which worked, which is why he is in the third.
38:23 Sarah Hagi? Movie and not on the second. And you know why that probably worked? Because it wasn't fake. Giancarlo is really messing up and he doesn't have much time left to fund the MGM deal. But things are about to get even worse. The Italian authorities finish their investigation into the collapse of Giancarlo's newspaper and he's convicted of fraud in absentia. He gets sentenced to three and a half years in prison back in Italy. Giancarlo appeals, but it's too late. The news travels across the Atlantic and by awards season, Giancarlo's conviction has become juicy Hollywood gossip. This is when Billy Crystal makes that joke about him.
39:05 Sarah Hagi? At this point, everyone is tired of his antics and he's going from eccentric European mogul into LA laughingstock. But for Giancarlo, the show must go on. And it's his last desperate encore that will bring his whole life in Hollywood crashing down.
39:26 Sarah Hagi? About seven months after Giancarlo buys MGM, he's in a car with Florio in Palm Springs. They're heading home from a meeting with a potential investor. After their funding from Time Warner fell through, they got an extension on raising money for the MGM deal. But they still have to pay that non-refundable $50 million a month and their hemorrhaging cash. They've managed to scrape together some deals, but they're still $600 million short and the clock is ticking. But the executive they just met with could be the answer to their prayers. He's an oil billionaire with an interest in media and he's nice enough to send them back to the airport in a car with his own personal driver.
40:12 Sarah Hagi? But while Giancarlo and Florio discuss the meeting in the backseat, Giancarlo makes a series of incredibly anti-Semitic comments about the executive. He's speaking Italian, so he probably thinks he doesn't need to worry. But the limo driver also speaks Italian and can understand everything Giancarlo is saying. So when Giancarlo and Florio show up for their second meeting a few days later, the oil executive tells him he knows exactly what they said about him. Sachi, can you read what he says to them next? He says, quote,
40:47 Scaachi Koul? You have a choice. You can get out of this office in the next 30 seconds, or I'm going to throw you through this window.
40:54 Sarah Hagi? Perfect. And that is also something that happens in Brobo Cop.
40:59 Sarah Hagi? Also, it's like after flying so high on his charms and all these idiotic things he did that put him up top, and he keeps making these stupid mistakes right before a deal is like all but signed. It's good schadenfreude. I feel great. Well, he's still that same scrappy striver who made his way from an orphanage to the sound stages of Hollywood. So unbelievably, Giancarlo manages to pull together yet another deal. Giancarlo and Florio create an incredibly tangled web of loans, bribes, and backroom deals. They disguise some of their shell companies as legitimate outside investors to make themselves look like a better prospect
41:44 Sarah Hagi? to potential partners. Giancarlo promises an Italian media company the rights to play MGM movies on TV and pay-per-view. And somehow, they convince CLBN to lend them an obscene amount of money again. After weeks of desperate negotiating, they manage to cobble together a billion dollars to finally buy MGM. Giancarlo and Florio have no concrete plan to deliver on any of their promises or pay anyone back, but they don't care. All that matters is that they won. The deal closes on November 1, 1990. Despite having done this show for such a long time, and we've covered so many scammers,
42:29 Sarah Hagi? I'm always shocked at how people are able to fundraise like this. Like how they were able to find this much money to buy something that they have no business owning. There are all these people out here with stupid amounts of money who are just willing to give it away, knowing that they're dealing with a scammer. And yet, here we are, just being normal.
42:53 Sarah Hagi? To celebrate, Giancarlo and Florio host a huge party on the MGM studio lot. Everybody pops champagne and a real 400-pound lion parades around the set. Apparently, Giancarlo screams "No, me manja!" when he sees it. That's Italian for "Don't eat me." After the party, he puts out a press release saying the company is going to be, quote, "the most powerful Euro-American communications group of the 90s." Against all odds, Giancarlo has pulled off a deal for the Hollywood history books. But unlike the grand epics of cinema, this moment doesn't spell "the end." Giancarlo has written a lot of IOUs,
43:38 Sarah Hagi? and they're all about to come due.
43:46 Speaker 04 Hi, I'm Kenia Perez. And I'm Malcolm Gladwell. We're back for season two of our Audible original podcast, The Unusual Suspects. We'll sit down with extraordinary guests from the worlds of art, film, literature, comedy, and wellness to hear from their unexpected stories of success. And who do we have this season? Well, we'll talk with Grammy-winning artist Anderson Paak, athlete Rich Roll, portrait artist Amy Sherald, Oscar-winning director Ron Howard, legendary writer David Sedaris, and many more. These conversations are more intimate than last season, wouldn't you say? I would. Listen to season one of The Unusual Suspects wherever you get your podcasts and sign up for a free trial Audible to listen to season two in the Audible app or by subscribing to Apple Podcasts.
44:33 Scaachi Koul? Imagine you're reading Pride and Prejudice, except you're not reading it. Harris Dickinson and Marissa Abella are reading it to you on Audible. Her barbs sting you.
44:42 Speaker 06 His coldness sends a shiver up your spine. Your heart aches, your ears burn. You yearn for Elizabeth and Mr. Darcy to profess their undying love for one another. You can't bear it any longer. Well, maybe a chapter longer. Performance is so good, you'll give love a second chance. Audible. Stories that speak to you.
45:13 Sarah Hagi? For Alan Ladd Jr., being the head of film production at Pathé should be an exciting new chapter in his already storied career. Alan, whose friends call him Laddie, has a boyish face and a toothy grin. He's best known for having been the president of 20th Century Fox in the late 70s, where he famously greenlit the original Star Wars. He's a popular and respected guy in the industry. But on the very first day after Giancarlo takes over MGM Studios, Alan arrives at work and hears shocking news. Giancarlo's first order of business is to fire a ton of the company's financial staff. And then he installs his 21-year-old daughter in a key finance position.
45:58 Sarah Hagi? Over the next few months, Alan watches in horror as things at MGM start to go steeply downhill. The studio starts running a deficit of $1 million per day. They bounce a six-figure check to Dustin Hoffman, withhold a letter of credit to Sean Connery, and miss an important interest payment on one of their bonds.
46:21 Scaachi Koul? I don't know that I would want to withhold money from Dustin Hoffman or Sean Connery. I would be worried about my personal safety.
46:29 Sarah Hagi? Well, Hollywood is a small town, and word quickly gets out about Giancarlo's erratic behavior. A few months after buying MGM, he throws a huge gala dinner party supposedly to raise money for something called Sachi. It is called the National Council on the Aging.
46:50 Scaachi Koul? In all fairness, I do think we need a council on aging, the aging, whatever we are calling it.
46:55 Sarah Hagi? What does that mean?
46:56 Scaachi Koul? I did look it up, and a table was 10 grand.
47:01 Sarah Hagi? What is the aging? Are you talking about Alzheimer's? Are you talking about dementia?
47:05 Scaachi Koul? I think it's elder care. I think it's elder care.
47:08 Sarah Hagi? On the aging?
47:10 Scaachi Koul? Sure, he's... English is not his first language.
47:13 Sarah Hagi? You're right. And also, this obviously doesn't exist, therefore, who cares?
47:17 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it's not real. It's not worth getting mad about.
47:19 Sarah Hagi? Well, it should be a coronation for the new owner of MGM, but unlike the parties he hosted when he first got to Hollywood, the guests here are C-list at best, and the vibes are bad. Alan sits as far away from his boss as possible. In fact, Alan will later tell Vanity Fair that this is when he gets fed up with Giancarlo. Alan is preparing for the release of the movie Thelma and Louise. He knows he's got a hit on his hands, but MGM's messy state of affairs is making everything chaotic. At one point, production loses control of the literal film. A processing lab holds it hostage because Giancarlo refuses to pay them.
48:01 Sarah Hagi? Alan's been calling Giancarlo every day, asking for money, or at least some explanations, but of course, he hasn't been getting either. Alan's dream job is turning into a nightmare. He and everyone else at MGM are trapped in the car with Giancarlo as their new boss has his own showdown with the law. And soon, they're all going over the cliff.
48:27 Sarah Hagi? It's the spring of 1991, and Charles Meeker is starting to think he made a mistake taking on his new client, MGM. Charles is a Princeton graduate with a wide forehead and a square jawline. He's in his late 40s, and he's a partner at an LA law firm, working as an entertainment lawyer. He occasionally produces B-horror movies on the side, so he knows the movie business and how some of its shadier players operate. A few months ago, his firm got called in by CLBN to help them manage a delicate situation. CLBN was worried about MGM and its new owner, Giancarlo. A few of the studio's creditors have actually gotten together and threatened to sue, and if they're successful,
49:11 Sarah Hagi? MGM will have to pay $300 million of debt within 60 days. The company would go bankrupt, which would invite a lot of unwanted government scrutiny. CLBN doesn't want anyone looking too closely at their banking relationship with Giancarlo, so they hired Charles to prevent this by negotiating a deal with the creditors, and he pulled it off. The only person who doesn't like this new arrangement is Giancarlo. Because as part of the deal, he gets demoted. He still works at MGM, but he's no longer the head of the company. Plus, Crediliones now has taken over voting control of a bunch of MGM stock.
49:52 Sarah Hagi? But while Giancarlo is finally facing consequences for his stupidity, Charles is getting praise for pulling off this life-saving deal. In May of 1991, Crediliones asks Charles if he wants to be the president of MGM. He says, yes. Charles probably knows that Giancarlo isn't going to enjoy having a new boss. And things go south fast. Sachi, can you read what Giancarlo reportedly screamed at Charles after working for him for just one month?
50:24 Scaachi Koul? Yes, he says, "I want you to understand, meekers, that I am really crazy. I want you to understand that I am really dangerous. I am very dangerous. Do you understand, meekers? I'm very dangerous."
50:39 Sarah Hagi? I'm starting to think he might be a little dangerous. I'm starting to think that's what he wants us to believe, yeah. You don't have to tell me twice. Well, Charles has heard the rumors about Giancarlo's mafia ties. He also knows that Crediliones executives have hired armed guards for security just in case. So when Giancarlo makes this threat, Charles takes it seriously. And he does the first reasonable thing any of Giancarlo's coworkers have done so far. He calls the FBI and the SEC. He even takes it a step further by hiring a retiring head of the FBI's L.A. Bureau to start looking into Giancarlo independently. The authorities start investigating Giancarlo pretty much immediately.
51:23 Sarah Hagi? And of course, he panics. On June 14th, he tries to convene a board meeting to revoke the bank's control of MGM. Crediliones responds three days later by fully seizing control of the company and firing Giancarlo altogether.
51:40 Sarah Hagi? Charles probably isn't shocked when Giancarlo flees the country to escape all the ongoing investigations. So Charles turns his attention to running MGM. About a year later, he learns that Florio has been arrested in Switzerland and is being held on fraud charges related to one of their holding companies. Then, Charles hears that American authorities are looking to press charges against officials at Credilionès even while the bank sues Florio. About a year after Florio's arrest, Charles resigns as the head of MGM. He managed to negotiate a big-time distribution deal for the company, but Credilionès is also actively working to sell the studio.
52:23 Sarah Hagi? Charles is getting out while the getting is good. Luckily, he has a great escape. He owns a winery in Sonoma. Finally, a couple of years later, in October 1995, Giancarlo is caught. He is suspected of misappropriating $100 million meant to go to MGM. He was back in America to give a deposition in his lawyer's office in downtown Los Angeles. The BBC later asks him why he returned to the country where he was being investigated. Giancarlo says he had no fear because he didn't do anything wrong. Charles must finally breathe a sigh of relief and probably treats himself to a very generous pour of wine.
53:07 Sarah Hagi? But anyone hoping for a clear-cut ending to this saga is going to be disappointed because Giancarlo has a different vision for his final act. Giancarlo's unraveling sets off a legal firestorm on both sides of the Atlantic. His web of crime spans multiple continents, branches of government, and an enormous mess of companies. It's so complicated that different authorities start trying to pick it apart from different angles. In France, there's a massive investigation into fraud and conspiracies at Credilionès. The press jumps on the story of the bank's involvement with the imploding MGM. CLBN executives are forced...
53:50 Sarah Hagi? To defend themselves in the press and in front of the government, and a few of them, including George, very quickly retire. Others are reassigned to new posts in new countries. And Sachi, you'll never believe this, but in the middle of all this scrutiny, the bank's headquarters mysteriously catch fire in May 1996. This is the luckiest man in the world. I've never been so lucky. Sometimes fires just happen and there's no cause. That's true. There is no reason, they just spontaneously erupt. While during all of this, Florio has been in a Swiss prison writing his memoirs on a typewriter. But Giancarlo is harder to pin down. After his arrest,
54:35 Sarah Hagi? he manages to get released from jail after just 10 days due to mistakes on his extradition paperwork from the French government. No one sees him in the US again until the fall of 1996, when he comes back to face charges relating to the whole MGM debacle. In October, he's convicted of perjury and evidence tampering. He's released on bail until his sentencing in the new year, where he could face up to 10 years in prison. But of course, Giancarlo's always got one more trick up his sleeve. In January of 1997, just days before he's due to be sentenced, he jumps bail and goes back to Italy. In the BBC doc,
55:17 Sarah Hagi? his former PR agent says she had seen Giancarlo at his house the night before. And this is what Giancarlo promised.
55:24 Scaachi Koul? He said, "I will defend my name. I will defend my ownership. I will be there on my word." He fled that night.
55:38 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, I bet he did.
55:41 Sarah Hagi? You know, he's really good at like, doing the movie type lines of like, "I'll defend my name."
55:47 Scaachi Koul? Of course.
55:47 Sarah Hagi? "I'll do this," and then being like, "Actually, I'm just gonna run."
55:50 Scaachi Koul? It's kind of his thing.
55:52 Sarah Hagi? Well, Giancarlo puts out a statement through his lawyer arguing that he technically didn't do anything wrong since his bail agreement didn't prevent him from traveling. The press speculates that he's trying to avoid extradition since he also has charges pending against him in France, where the punishment can be even more severe. There's an Interpol red notice out for him, which basically means that if he ever leaves Italy, he could be arrested and extradited to the United States to finally stand trial. So in one sense, he's trapped in Italy, but he also got away without serious consequences. Giancarlo Peretti managed to get out of this saga the way he went into it. Blatantly scamming and not really getting punished for it.
56:36 Sarah Hagi? And, of course, he's managed to give his whole story a classic Hollywood ending. As of August 2024, a Hollywood producer is shopping a movie script based on his crimes. And in September, the BBC released its documentary about Giancarlo. He participated in the documentary, telling his whole life story. But eventually, he stopped talking to them because he didn't like the documentary's name.
57:06 Sarah Hagi? Sachi, you, uh, you're kind of Hollywood-adjacent in many ways. You know, you got all those documentaries, you're always on TV. Do you feel like you want to find a way to get a billion dollars now?
57:18 Scaachi Koul? No, I don't think, I don't think it's gonna come to me as easily as it seemed to have come to these guys.
57:24 Sarah Hagi? I think you should just be a little more charming, dude.
57:27 Scaachi Koul? Oh, charm is not my problem. I have so many problems, that is the only thing keeping me afloat.
57:31 Sarah Hagi? That's why it's funny.
57:32 Scaachi Koul? I mean, this is such a frustrating story because there's just a million dudes in movies who are like this and are not considered scammers and are considered actually moderately successful despite being full of shit.
57:44 Sarah Hagi? It's funny because you also mentioned at one point, like, a lot of execs don't watch movies or read books. Based on movies they're trying to get or whatever. And I feel like many industries, Hollywood is kind of based on inventing value of certain actors or businesses or studios and creating a hype machine around it. And I think what is so crazy about this is, I guess, the involvement of real government banks and officials who were all for it. Yeah, I mean, I think the thing that bothers me about this scam is it's like there's all these places that are kind of in cahoots. Like, there are these investors who are feeding into it, banks that are feeding into it, other rich movie executives feeding into it,
58:27 Sarah Hagi? and then like the entertainment industry that always feeds into this. It just feels like a scam where the material that you need to eat to keep the scam going is everywhere. Yeah, and it's not a scam until someone decides it is one and then everyone jumps away and is like, actually, this is super bad and I'm not a part of it at all. Yes. It's crazy because people in Hollywood want so much respect as like legitimate business people and artists and whatever, whatever. And then, you know, you read something like this and, quite frankly, many other stories that involve some sort of Hollywood aspect. Everyone's just cosplaying as something else. No one's actually doing anything. Yeah, I mean, that's an easy place to hide your fraud
59:08 Sarah Hagi? because the way movies are made is subjective and chaotic and expensive. It is easy to sort of just like hide your money and hide the fact that you're full of shit. Yeah, and we've done quite a few episodes of this show, I'd say. And I think one common thread here is that it's really easy to scam anyone in a creative industry. It's actually the easiest thing you could do. It's easier than making good work. Yeah. Greater likelihood of having a scam be successful than having your movie made, unfortunately. So rob a bank. Wow. What would you say your lesson is here? My lesson is that being Italian sounds fun. Does it? They have fun insults. They have good turns of phrases, you know? Okay, yeah, okay. Well, you be Italian and I will rob a bank.
59:54 Sarah Hagi? I don't think I'm gonna be Italian, but let's just rob a bank, who cares? Okay.
1:00:06 Sarah Hagi? Follow Scamfluencers on the Audible app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to all episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free by joining Audible.
1:00:16 Sarah Hagi? This is Giancarlo Peretti, The Italian Job. I'm Sarah Haggie. And I'm Sachi Cole. If you have a tip for us on a story that you think we should cover, please email us at [email protected] . We use many sources in our research. A few that were particularly helpful were The Predator: How an Italian Thug Luded MGM, Brought Credit Lianas to Its Knees, and Made the Pope Cry by David McClintock in Fortune Magazine, A Hollywood Mystery by Alan Sutron and Michael Seapley in the LA Times, and the BBC documentary, The Man Who Definitely Didn't Steal Hollywood, directed by John Dower. Emma Healy wrote this episode. Additional writing by us, Sachi Cole and Sarah Haggie. Eric Thurm is our story editor. Fact checking by Lexi Peery.
1:00:59 Sarah Hagi? Sound design by James Morgan. Additional audio assistance provided by Augustine Lim. Our music supervisor is Scott Velasquez for Fries on Sync. Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock. Our senior managing producer is Callum Flus. Janine Cornolo and Stephanie Jens are our development producers. Our associate producer is Charlotte Miller. Our producer is Julie McGruder. Our senior producers are Sarah Enni and Ginny Bloom. Our executive producers are Jenny Lauer Beckman, Marshall Louie, and Erin O'Flaherty for Wondery.
1:01:40 Speaker 04 A trucker merges onto the I-10 in New Orleans. He checks his mirrors. The lane is clear. And then, boom, impact. A pickup truck, seemingly out of nowhere, scrapes down the side of his 18-wheeler, multiple passengers inside. One man flees the scene. And the driver of the pickup? He doesn't seem all that upset. It didn't feel like a regular accident, because it wasn't. Across the city, truckers are getting sideswiped, all on the same stretch of the same freeway. And behind many of the cases is one person, a Hollywood stunt woman. Turned personal injury lawyer named Vanessa Moda. This podcast is a story about fake accidents that lead to real consequences and a scheme that ends in betrayal and murder.
1:02:25 Speaker 04 Listen to Over My Dead Body: Operation Side Swipe wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all episodes early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.
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