#675 Building Wealth & Helping Others with Bill Pulte

Bill Pulte is the CEO of Pulte Capital. He is also the inventor of Twitter Philanthropy, a global movement to help our fellow humans. In this conversation, we discuss everything from Bitcoin to rising home prices to Pulte's advice on building wealth. Hope you enjoy this one! This episode is a condensed edit from Bill Pulte's 2 hour, in-studio appearance on The Best Business Show. You can watch the full show on my Youtube Channel. The Best Business Show streams live on Youtube every weekday from 11am-1pm EST. ======================= Matrixport, Asia’s fastest growing digital asset platform with $10 billion in assets under management and custody, it offers one-stop crypto financial solutions including fixed income, DeFi in 1-click, structured products, Cactus Custody™, spot OTC as well as lending. You can earn from high single digit with fixed income to high double digit yield with their Dual Currency Product. If you hold crypto and look for yield, this is the app you don’t wanna miss out. Go download the Matrixport App and enjoy a welcome offer of 30% APY on USDC here: https://invest.matrixport.com/en ======================= Gemini is a leading regulated cryptocurrency exchange, wallet, and custodian that makes it simple and secure to buy, sell, store, and earn bitcoin, ether, and over 40 other cryptocurrencies. Offering industry-leading security, insurance and uptime, Gemini is the go-to trusted platform for beginner and sophisticated investors alike. Open a free account in under 3 minutes at gemini.com/pomp and get $20 of bitcoin after you trade $100 or more within 30 days. ======================= Cosmos is building the Internet of Blockchains, marking a new era of interoperability, scalability, and usability. The free flow of assets and data between blockchains with bridges to Ethereum and Bitcoin will unleash the potential of DeFi, NFTs, and much more. Dive into Cosmos at cosmos.network/pomp

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Anthony Pompliano?

  What's up everyone, this is Anthony Pompliano. Most of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, simply the best podcast out there. Now let's kick this thing off.

• 0:11Anthony Pompliano?

  Bill Pulte is the CEO of Pulte Capital. He's also the inventor of Twitter Philanthropy, a global movement to help our fellow humans. In this conversation, we discuss everything from Bitcoin to rising home prices to building wealth. I really hope you enjoy this one. Bill's awesome and this one was a ton of fun. Before we get into this episode, though, I want to quickly talk about our sponsors. First up is Matrix Port. Have you lost your way in this low-yield environment while searching for a better store of value to beat inflation? Look no further. Invest with Matrix Port to get more out of your crypto. You can invest today and earn up to 30% annualized yields. Matrix Port is Asia's fastest-growing digital asset platform funded by two crypto veterans. With $10 billion in assets under management

• 0:53Anthony Pompliano?

  and custody, Matrix Port offers one-stop crypto financial solutions, including fixed income, DeFi in one-click, structured products, Cactus custody, spot OTC, and lending. You can earn from high single-digit with fixed income to high double-digit yield with their dual currency product. If you hold crypto and you're looking for a yield, this app you don't want to miss. Go download the Matrix Port app and enjoy a welcome offer of high yield on USDC for new users. Remember, I just did a podcast with Jihan Wu, one of the founders, and a lot of folks said they enjoyed it. So you can go listen to that and learn more about Matrix Port as well. Go check them out by downloading the Matrix Port app or go to matrixport.com. Next up is Gemini. Gemini is a leading regulated cryptocurrency exchange, a wallet,

• 1:37Anthony Pompliano?

  and a custodian that makes it simple and secure to buy, sell, store, and earn Bitcoin, Ether, and over 40 other cryptocurrencies. They offer industry-leading security, insurance, and uptime. Gemini is the go-to trusted platform for beginner and sophisticated investors like. You can open a free account in under 3 minutes at gemini.com/pomp and get $20 of Bitcoin after you trade $100 or more within 30 days. Head on over to gemini.com/pomp and you'll get that $20 of Bitcoin for free after you trade $100 or more within 30 days. Gemini, a leading regulated cryptocurrency exchange. Wallet and custodian. I'm a big fan and I think you will be too. Once you head over and check them out at Gemini.com slash pomp. Last but not least is Cosmos. Cosmos is building

• 2:20Anthony Pompliano?

  the internet of blockchains, marking a new era of interoperability, scalability and usability. The free flow of assets and data between blockchains and bridges to Ethereum and Bitcoin will unleash the potential of DeFi, NFTs and much, much more. You can dive into Cosmos at cosmos.network slash pomp. Again, cosmos.network slash pomp, or go click on the link in the description. Cosmos, the internet of blockchains, marking a new era of interoperability, scalability and usability. All right, let's get in this episode with Bill. I hope you guys enjoyed this

• 2:51Speaker 02

  one. Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only.

• 3:15Anthony Pompliano?

  Bill Pulte is here. July was the fourth consecutive month of record price appreciation, and it marked the highest annual rate of price growth since the index began in 1987. Absolutely nuts. The median existing home sales price in August of this year rose 14.9% from a year earlier to $356,700. That's right, there's a 15% increase in the median existing home sales price in America. Households that bought homes in May are spending almost 21% of their income on monthly mortgage payments, which is above the average rate for the past decade. And so, Bill, help us understand why exactly, uh, home prices are exploding like this. Like, is it actually a pretty complex situation in terms of why they're going up so

• 3:59Anthony Pompliano?

  much? But what's kind of your read on this? Well, I think you have to get back to basics, right?

• 4:03Speaker 03

  So supply and demand, everybody knows about supply and demand. Let's look at demand for a second. You have a situation where COVID happened and literally the federal government came in and started buying mortgage-backed securities. If the federal government hadn't bought the mortgage-backed securities, you'd have a real problem. Because liquidity would dry up in the mortgage bond market and the mortgage bond market is actually what creates a lot of liquidity. And, you know, in the mortgage industry. So you have this incredible fuel for demand, which is you have the federal government buying mortgage-backed securities. You have low interest rates, which were reduced even further in COVID. So on the demand side of things, you just have gasoline on the fire.

• 4:44Speaker 03

  And then on the supply side, you have the situation where COVID created, I would argue, potentially the biggest supply issue that the industry's ever seen in the form of, you know, starting, stopping, you have the lumber prices going up and all this stuff. So if you look at the demand and you look at the supply, it's just creating an environment pomp where, you know, the prices just have gotten to unbelievable levels. Now, the interesting thing will be what happens in, you know, as we get into 2022, halfway through, toward the end of, toward the end of 2022. Will some capacity come back online so you're able to get that supply up? If you can get the supply back up, what can happen is you can start to see some moderating in the prices.

• 5:26Speaker 03

  But for now, those two things affecting the supply and demand, as I described, are just creating an environment where, you know, good luck keeping it. It's like keeping a beach ball underwater.

• 5:38Anthony Pompliano?

  Help us understand like the supply chain disruptions, right? In terms of, I think most people are like, oh, I know that there's low interest rates. I kind of sort of know that people are looking for homes. So the demand side, they can wrap their head around, but the supply chain, I just, they don't see that every day, right? It's like, what do you understand is going on?

• 5:53Speaker 03

  Well, it's in part caused by the demand side. So I don't want to say, oh, it's just all supply. It's also the fact, as I said, that the federal government, and most people don't talk about this. I think it will actually happen in future elections. But people don't talk about it right now. The federal government has essentially gone in and bought large portions of the mortgage bond market. That's a, that's a. Huge issue. So I don't want to, I don't want to dismiss that. In terms of supply issues, you know, when COVID happened, I think that naturally all the manufacturers, and you see this across every, every industry, right? You guys see it too. And I'm sure everybody sees it with, with food and whatnot. But everybody, you know, forecasted, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna wind down, we're gonna, we're gonna, you know, tighten up our balance sheet, we're going to, uh, you know, slow things down.

• 6:39Speaker 03

  And then all of a sudden, you started to see the federal government come in the mortgage bond market. You started to see liquidity stay there. And there was a period of time where they didn't know what was going to happen with the mortgage bond market. And, um, and so, you know, naturally these home builders were saying, whoa, you know, I don't know if we should really be building this much. So then they had all of a sudden restart the race, right? And you, this time you're restarting the race with lower interest rates. You had the federal government buying the mortgage backed securities. And so, um, it's just been a natural game of catch up. And that's what it's been. I mean, it's, it's been unbelievable. I think it's been the biggest supply shock that the, the industry has ever seen. And I know we're seeing that in other industries as well.

• 7:21Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. What, what feels, uh, even worse is like when you get the home prices going up, some of that naturally was just going to happen by people wanting to move out of cities, move into suburban areas. You get the imbalance of supply, demand. So forget all the monetary and fiscal policy stuff. Like there already was going to be higher price points just because of this. When you layer in the monetary and fiscal policy stuff, then also it just explodes. I mean, 20% increase, right? In terms of home prices from July of last year to this year. Sure, you can say there's a base effect in terms of prices went down during the summer last year, whatever you want to say.

• 7:52Speaker 03

  No, you take the liquidity out of the mortgage market, you'll see those prices go down rapidly.

• 7:56Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. Why, why do you think the government buying the mortgage backed securities is so, uh, concerning?

• 8:00Speaker 03

  Because I, and I do think it is, but I'm not saying so much concerning as much as it's a reality now. I mean, the mortgage industry, you know, has had third party providers who provided liquidity, almost like a market maker type situation. But when the federal government, it's much like, um, you know, with interest rates and the government backstopping buying the government, when the government buys treasury bonds, right? It just creates this confidence that people have to keep the liquidity going. And so if you feel that the government's always going to bail you out in the, in the instance of mortgages, right? Are you going to be concerned as about risk as much as you would if there wasn't the government there?

• 8:43Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 8:43Speaker 03

  So if you take, if, if you take the risk off the table, you know, then you're looking back at, you know, some pretty risky things that can happen.

• 8:51Anthony Pompliano?

  One of the things I want to talk about, Bill, is when you think about your career and building, there's a lot of young people who watch this. What are some of the things that you learned early on that you're like, wow, if I had known that even earlier or things that maybe you know now that you're like, if I, if I had learned that stuff earlier in my career, I could have leveraged that, whether it was if you had been inside of a corporation, building your own business, or just kind of doing transactions, et cetera. What are some of those lessons learned?

• 9:15Speaker 03

  You know, I've been reflecting on that a lot lately because one of the things I've been doing is funding a lot of businesses with entrepreneurs, kind of like what you do. And, you know, it sounds crazy, but I would just say, you know, do the work, do the work. You know, so many people try to look for the short, the shortcut or the quick work or whatever. I'll give you an example. I just invested in an air conditioning business and the guy who runs it, he's below 30. I don't want to say exactly who he is. And he keeps looking and he's watching all these different podcasts and everything and his real talent is selling air conditioning. And I just said to him, I said, stop watching all these podcasts, stop reading all these books, just go sell the units door to door. And, you know, he doesn't want to hear that, but so I would just say, do the work, you

• 9:59Speaker 03

  know, watch the pump show, learn what you can here, learn what you can other places, but you just got to do the work. And I think that with this liquidity that's in the market right now, if you do the work, there are so many options to get paid for it right now. I mean, it's just ridiculous. I mean, can you believe that they're selling us, they're allowing us to buy Bitcoin at these prices right now? So, you know, go sell some air conditioning units or go sell, you know, whatever, right? And, you know, stack sats.

• 10:28Anthony Pompliano?

  How important do you think it is for young people? To learn like what I'd call like the basics of business. So accounting, selling, you know, kind of strategy, operations, like those key components versus, hey, I already know that I have an inclination to be good at sales.

• 10:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, if you're good at it, you should lean into it, I think, and hire the best people around you, right? At least that's how I've done it and everybody I know who's been successful, right? I mean, even you, you've hired people who, you know, round out your skill set. So, so, yeah.

• 10:54Anthony Pompliano?

  Just kind of lean into exactly what.

• 10:56Speaker 03

  Lean into what you do. Don't run away from it. People try to do it. Now, I do think that there are some basic things, right, that you can learn. For example, I think one of the things that, you know, good entrepreneurs, good young people can learn is finance, because finance to me is the language of, of business. And so, you know, a lot of people give a lot of different advice, you know, I'm trying to avoid giving advice and just saying, hey, do the work. And if you are going to learn, you know, some type of skill set to augment it, finance, because so often I run into these businesses, I'm sure you do too. I think sometimes you're, you're investing with people maybe who have more finance background. A lot of people I'm dealing with don't have a finance background and they don't really know how much money they're taking home at the end of the day. And, and the inability to know how much money you're netting

• 11:40Speaker 03

  after you pay the government, you know, a lot of people don't realize they, they have a business partner. And even if they don't have a business partner, and that is the federal government, because they have to pay 40% of their taxes. And so I think really understanding finance can really help you become a wealthy, you know, wealthy individual. Because if you, if you know your core skill set, you hit it home, you hire around it, and then you, you really understand finance to know how much you're netting and putting in the bank. You know, one day you'll wake up and you'll be wealthy and you gotta have, you gotta have $10 before you have $100. You gotta have $100 before you have $1,000, right? So you gotta have a million dollars before you have 10 million. And that was my experience too.

• 12:17Anthony Pompliano?

  It, it feels like there, there's a. Key component to um the way you talk about like I talk to founders all the time and they'll always say, hey, you know, I make I make $10 million to my business and they're talking about top line revenue.

• 12:31Speaker 03

  Correct.

• 12:32Anthony Pompliano?

  Right. And then you say, okay, well, what do you do after expenses? And then they'll give you a number.

• 12:37Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 12:37Anthony Pompliano?

  And then you're like, okay, now what after that? Like, yeah, like literally walk through it. And I think your point is that 10 million actually end up may being 2 million.

• 12:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 12:44Anthony Pompliano?

  Right?

• 12:44Speaker 03

  They say revenue is vanity and profitability is sanity.

• 12:48Anthony Pompliano?

  Ah, I like that.

• 12:50Speaker 03

  My grandfather taught it to me. And um, yeah, it was just a great one because everybody they go around to these industry trade shows, at least in our industry, beat their chest. Oh, look at how big my revenue is. And then, you know, it's like, okay, dude, but show me your bank account. How much did you take home at the end of the day? You know?

• 13:05Anthony Pompliano?

  I know John likes that.

• 13:07Speaker 04

  Yeah, I do. I also think it's a besides this business, it's personal finance as well, right? So

• 13:12Speaker 03

  That's what I mean by that.

• 13:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, 33% of millionaires never made over 100K, which I think is an unreal stat to speaking, it speaks to money management and the ability to turn that $10 into $100 and $100 into $1,000.

• 13:26Speaker 03

  And when we use finance, we use all these words, all these labels. Finance is just a fancy way, in my opinion, for saying math, right? And so I understand the math of how you keep score in your business. I mean, that's really what you're doing, right? I mean, it's like, it's like playing in a football game and not having an accurate scoreboard. And you got to have an accurate scoreboard. Otherwise, you know, what are you, what are you playing the game for?

• 13:47Anthony Pompliano?

  Here's a wild stat for you that I was talking to our father over the weekend. And he said this to me, and I literally was like, I don't believe you. And so of course, he as soon as we got off the phone, sent me like 17,000 links to like prove to me that uh, that it was right. But uh,

• 14:02Speaker 03

  Can you guys do a show with your parents sometime?

• 14:06Speaker 04

  Oh, he, my dad would love it.

• 14:09Anthony Pompliano?

  Well, we will discuss and negotiate with him. Uh, the uh, study that he

• 14:15Speaker 03

  Can I be their agent?

• 14:16Anthony Pompliano?

  No.

• 14:19Anthony Pompliano?

  Because all we'll offer is, hey, listen, we'll come see you guys if you don't do the

• 14:22Speaker 04

  We just heard about the math and you got to get the finances ready.

• 14:27Anthony Pompliano?

  So this study shows that they surveyed 10,000 millionaires. It's the Ramsey Solutions conducted the largest survey of millionaires ever, 10,000 participants, and the top five careers of people who become a millionaire. They have engineers, they have accountants. They have management and they have attorneys are four of the five. What do you think the fifth one is? So engineer, accountant, management, attorney. The fifth one is one you would not expect. That is the highest career or the highest concentration of millionaires in a single occupation. Salespeople? No. Agriculture? No. Lawyers, doctors? Uh, so attorneys are in there, but yeah. Teachers.

• 15:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Engineers, accountants, management, attorney and teachers. And he was telling me, he was like, yeah, one of the top five professions for people to become a millionaire is a teacher. And I think most people are conditioned. Percentage basis, yeah. Well, most people are conditioned to think, hey, teachers don't get paid a lot of money. They get paid forty, fifty, sixty thousand dollars, depending on if it's public or private. But they know math. Where they are, well, even better than that is they're super disciplined. The, well, the person that ends up becoming a teacher from like a psychological standpoint, they're not trying to go buy a yacht, right? They're not trying to go buy the Ferrari. They usually end up being, uh, somebody who, hey, I want to go to work. I want to, I want to teach people that they live within their means. They have a kind of financial discipline and they'll become a millionaire.

• 15:55Anthony Pompliano?

  And so it makes sense, you know, you think engineers, uh, and, and management or attorneys, they make a lot of money. They have kind of high top line, uh, income. And so, okay, they become a millionaire. But when you look at accountants, like, okay, they, they understand accounting, like they'll figure it out. But teachers, I think is like really interesting because it completely dispels one of the things that most people think is true is like, oh, you have to make a ton of money. Most teachers really don't make that much money, right? But it is, uh, one of the top five careers for millionaires. That makes me feel good hearing that. Why? That teachers are doing well financially. Cause it's always been the narrative. Someone just said in the comments, it's cheating because they can get summer jobs. Like, no, that's not how this works. They have two jobs. That's an all time comment. So I just quickly searched the average salary of a teacher and salary.com has it

• 16:40Anthony Pompliano?

  between forty thousand and seventy thousand. ZipRecruiter has it between sixteen thousand and forty thousand. Uh, and then Glassdoor has it between thirty thousand and sixty thousand. So let's call it somewhere between, you know, twenty to maybe sixty or seventy thousand dollars, uh, to be a public school teacher. And, uh, we know that thirty-three percent of millionaires, like John said, have never made more than a hundred K in a single year. Um, and one of the top five professions to become a millionaire is a teacher. So it's pretty damn cool when you start to understand. So what's the thought process behind that? You can either make a lot of money or you can be really disciplined and save a lot of Holy grails, you do both. Right is you have incredible earning potential. You make a ton of money and then on top of that, you're financially disciplined. And so you actually end up getting there faster. You end up compounding it and whatever. But even if you don't make a lot, like, again, think about it.

• 17:23Anthony Pompliano?

  If you if you start working at the age of 22, right, and you get paid $50,000 a year, I'm not a mathematician, but you only need to work 20 years. And now you've been paid a million dollars of top line income. Now you've got expenses, you gotta pay taxes, you gotta do all this stuff. So but you can also invest. You can invest, you can do all this stuff, right? But like, you've already been paid a million dollars by the time you're 42 years old. And you're only making $50,000 a year and you're a teacher. So what happens if you become financially disciplined? And let's say that you can save a big portion of that. Well, okay, now you've been working for 30 years, then 40 years, right? Like, at some point, by the time you hit retirement, if you've been paid $50,000 a year, you literally made 2 million bucks in top line revenues. It's to kind of Bill's point, it's not how much you made, it's how much did you keep?

• 18:03Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 18:04Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And so if you just put, let's say, a double that, right? Now it's not 50, it's 100. Well, in 10 years, you've literally made a million dollars in top line revenue.

• 18:14Speaker 05

  Yeah. And this applies, some people in the comments are giving us a hard time because it's we're it's like we're saying teachers are millionaires. And the point is really

• 18:21Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, they are. No, they literally are. It's one of the

• 18:23Speaker 05

  That's what the stats says.

• 18:24Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. I didn't make it up. Like, like, literally, teachers are millionaires. Like, it is one of the top five professions to become a millionaire in the United States.

• 18:32Speaker 05

  But it could be applied to anyone at that income level is my point.

• 18:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Oh, for sure. Yeah. I'm not saying that they're getting paid a million dollars a year and that's how to become a millionaire. I'm saying that they likely have a propensity for living within their means more so than anybody else. Like, we all went to school. I don't remember a teacher show up in a Corvette, right? Like, I don't remember them spending like lavishly. Frankly, most of them kind of showed up to school and they probably were wearing the same clothes that they'd worn for a while. And like, it was just like, that's just what they do. They go to school, they teach, you know, during the school year, and then they leave.

• 19:01Speaker 03

  Well, to the point about the math, you know, they have to count what resources they have because there's little of it, right? So they have to count in order to feed themselves. Where I think people get into trouble is especially in business and you start selling products, for example, and to your point, you can look at the revenue line item and you can say, oh, my God, look at how much money I'm making. And that revenue can be very deceiving, right? So it doesn't surprise me.

• 19:26Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. What do you think are some of the key things that you did in your life from like, a finance standpoint, in terms of not maybe not understand? What to do, but uh like good habits that you have that you're like, okay, if doesn't matter if you make a gazillion dollars a year or you make one dollar a year. If you have these types of habits, like I think that really puts you on the right path.

• 19:46Speaker 03

  I would say, you know, how I made my first, let's say, million or $2 million, which was really, really important to me, uh, because that really gave me the confidence to, to go forward was that I bought businesses, uh, or I bought into things that had cash flows. And what I mean by that is I bought positive cash flowing things. A lot of people like to buy negative cash flow. And I know you like to start, you know, small and incubate and lose money.

• 20:14Anthony Pompliano?

  That's true.

• 20:14Speaker 03

  Is if you focus on, uh, positive cash flow entities, you can make your life a lot easier, in my opinion. And what happens is you get compounding working for you. You get the, the, it's almost like a law of nature, compounding. It can work for you or against you. And so I would just say, you know, be a little bit patient. Now, it took me several years to make that first million or two. But then, once I figured that out and I got the law of compounding working for me, it just went like straight up like a hockey stick. So, you know, again, this is unsexy advice, right? But, uh,

• 20:46Anthony Pompliano?

  But it works.

• 20:47Speaker 03

  Buy, yeah, it works. Buy cash, buy positive cash flowing things. It could be anything. It could be an apartment, could be a REIT, could be a business, could be whatever. And just let it sit there and cash day after day after day. Cause if you look at the bank account, day after day after day, you say, wow, I'm not making that much money. But then when you start looking at it, you know, after 30 days, 60 days, 120 days, right? This stuff starts to pile up. And over a period of years, you know, you'll wake up in three or five years and you'll be worth a shitload of money. And then, sorry, I don't know if I can swear on this.

• 21:15Anthony Pompliano?

  You can say whatever you want.

• 21:16Speaker 03

  And then,

• 21:17Anthony Pompliano?

  It's the internet.

• 21:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, I know. But like Jimmy's channel, you can't say anything bad on it. Cause I don't know. But I forget what I was saying. But so anyway, so if you just compounded over time, you know, uh, you know, I think that if I had to start all over again, that's what I'd do.

• 21:33Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. Uh, one of the things that we talk about a lot is how this weekend, so you can go out They make a thousand bucks, right? So just like all these ideas and one time Joe.

• 21:42Speaker 03

  Which is crazy because I think when we graduated from college, I don't know. I mean,

• 21:48Anthony Pompliano?

  Thousand dollars was a lot.

• 21:49Speaker 03

  That was, I mean, it was right. So, yeah, I mean, a thousand dollars still a lot.

• 21:54Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 21:54Speaker 03

  I say one dollar is a lot, but yeah.

• 21:56Anthony Pompliano?

  It's a lot, but, but the amount of purchasing power for a thousand dollars today, even versus, you know, two thousand five, two thousand ten, like anywhere in that timeframe, you know, look at the inflation level, right? We've literally just in the last year, thirty eight percent of all dollars right in the last eighteen months have been printed inflation. The official numbers are up over five percent. So I mean, it's, it's pretty crazy how much purchasing power has been lost. But one of the things that we, we talked about was jokes was basically like, hey, if I want to make a thousand dollars, what I would do is I actually go to the local country club and I would caddy. Basically, I'd go surround myself with rich people, right? And in some weird way, like some money would fall out of their pockets into mine, right?

• 22:33Speaker 05

  I, I think too, like the, the difference too is like, are you looking to build something sustainable that can grow and scale and make more money and become something with enterprise value or whatever, right? Like that's one scenario. But if you tell me you have until the end of the weekend and make a thousand dollars, like what's the most high upside thing I can think of? That's probably manual labor that you actually have to go outside and go do something for. It's probably the country club, right? You go to a golf course and you caddy for some people and you try to find your way to get some cash. Other than that, it's going to be hard to start something within twenty four, forty eight hours online and build something.

• 23:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, but even then, like, let's say you put away the thousand dollars. So let's say you put it in Bitcoin or something else. Over time, that will compound to be significant. And, you know, I think a lot of people could look at you pump and think, oh, wow, you know, pump's so successful and, you know, he's investing in all these businesses and everything, but you're kind of an outlier in a sense that, you know, you have access to deals that very few people have and whatnot. So somebody might be watching this and they might not have the access to the VC channels, for example, that you have. Excuse me. And so.

• 23:31Anthony Pompliano?

  It's a horrible idea to angel invest if you're basically sitting pretty much anywhere in the world other than, you don't have to physically be in these geographies anymore, but you have to. Be in the networks. And if, you know, I just go out on the street and I just ask people like, hey, anyone starting a business I want to invest? I'm gonna lose money for sure.

• 23:48Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 23:49Anthony Pompliano?

  Because it's just you.

• 23:50Speaker 03

  But let's say, let's do that reverse. So let's say you go out to the street and you say, hey, put your thousand dollars in this REIT. I don't know, making up some, you know,

• 23:59Speaker 03

  some, some REIT. I mean, yeah, they could depreciate it, but are they going to lose money doing that?

• 24:05Anthony Pompliano?

  Probably not.

• 24:05Speaker 03

  Probably not, right?

• 24:06Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. Well, the REITs, and then also you could even do it for not all businesses, but a lot of businesses.

• 24:11Speaker 03

  The S and P 500, you know?

• 24:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Oh, yeah. You can even.

• 24:14Speaker 03

  Go buy the SPY, you know, go buy the Q's.

• 24:16Anthony Pompliano?

  You can even go and, uh, and invest in local businesses, right? We, we had somebody come on, Cody Sanchez, who basically talked all about like, uh, one of the businesses that she bought into was she went to somebody, they owned a, like a mailbox business, which was kind of like, if you ever go to the post office and they have like P O boxes, similar type of business, but it was the local mom and pop one. And, uh, she went to them and said, hey, I love your business. Uh, I think that maybe you need help, you know, either marketing or kind of getting the word out, uh, but I'd like to buy into the business. And so she gave them, you know, not a small amount of money, but, but also not millions of dollars. I don't know, what, fifty, hundred thousand dollars, whatever it was. Uh, and she bought like, I think it was maybe a third of the business and the business was doing, you know, two hundred fifty thousand dollars in, uh, cash flow.

• 25:00Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:00Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And she's like, wait a minute, I just bought like, this is like a no brainer type deal.

• 25:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:05Anthony Pompliano?

  And so you don't necessarily have to go and invest in the next, in next Facebook to be able to make money, right? It's the reason why there is so much asymmetry in early stage technology is because there's so much risk. Right? Like you, you basically are getting paid for the risk that you're taking. I think people forget that point about it, right? Is they always want to say, oh, I can make a bunch of money. Everyone always looks at the upside. But the downside is zero versus a REIT or something like that, that, you know, again, sure, on a very, very outlier case that could happen. But the S and P 500 is not going to zero.

• 25:35Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 25:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And so the risk is very different. So you should expect that you can get a 30% return in the S and P 500 and have, you know, what's the downside? Uh, maybe it goes down 30% and the government steps in and, and, you know, pumps liquidity in the market like it did in May of last year or March last year? Okay. Like that's a pretty good trade off.

• 25:51Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 25:52Anthony Pompliano?

  And then if you look over a long period of time, like the stock market is not allowed to go down. Right? You know, like it has to keep going.

• 25:58Speaker 03

  It's not that instant gratification. You can't look at it every day and say, oh, wow, look at how much money I made or whatever. I mean, maybe buy something with more volatility like Bitcoin, but the SPY over time, you know?

• 26:09Anthony Pompliano?

  Make money.

• 26:09Speaker 03

  The damn thing just keeps going.

• 26:11Speaker 04

  It's the classic saying, uh, timing the market, not timing the market, compounding. If you, if you don't know anything about investing, compound, compounding is the greatest thing in the world.

• 26:20Anthony Pompliano?

  John has got some fire one liners today.

• 26:23Speaker 04

  What'd you say earlier? Uh, uh, many hands, many hands make light work.

• 26:27Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 26:27Speaker 04

  Which is very true.

• 26:29Speaker 03

  When I was like 21, I, I asked Mitt Romney, it was kind of weird. And I don't know him well at all, but I asked him, I said, you know, what, what's the key to your success at Bain Capital? And he said, my key is I buy something for the right price and I have a spinning ball effect. And to me, the spinning ball was always that compound interest. So at Bain, I guess, you know, this is what he was arguing to me. And it's just always stuck with me since I was like 21, right? And so, I don't know, I just, I just try to like literally, other than give away my money on Twitter, which frankly, I like to use the compounding to fund what I'm doing on Twitter. But, um, you know, that's what I try to do every day, you know?

• 27:09Speaker 03

  Buy stuff that's low, that's spitting out cash and then just have that spinning ball effect.

• 27:15Anthony Pompliano?

  We all like Bitcoin, right? I think you like Bitcoin. Uh, I don't care what you invest in, like it almost doesn't matter what you invest in, right? Um, as long as you get invested, cause you get started, you have a kind of skin in the game, you'll start paying attention. You'll start learning and all this type of stuff. But one of the things that, um, we ran into over and over and over again was, uh, lots of people said, hey, I want to invest, but my biggest cost outside of rent and food, credit card debt or student loan debt, et cetera. So they have these products that allow you to refinance that stuff, lower rates. Like there's a huge advantage of doing that. And then the other piece that people forget is budgeting and saving. And so they have a whole like budgeting, saving tools kit that essentially shows you, it's kind of what you were talking about earlier. Like how much money do you take home? A lot of people don't know that, but also how much money are you making?

• 27:58Anthony Pompliano?

  Like one of the things we talk about a lot is, uh, I always laugh, I see like these like, uh, kind of, uh, personal finance folks sort of like, you know, Bill, you should try to spend $200 less a month. And somebody's like, dude, I spend a thousand dollars a month, right? I'm a young kid, like where do you want me to carve out $200 of my thousand dollars of expenses? What they're probably better off doing is go. Figure out how to make 500 bucks extra a month, right? So the, the kind of a mindset of abundance, rather than, hey, how do I not make more money? And it always shocks me how many people are like, I'm not going to buy Starbucks today. Like, I'm going to save the five dollars. Like, I don't know if that's necessarily going to make you rich, but like, I like the mentality. But the actual actionable thing for people, if you don't make a ton of money. Yeah, just go, go figure out, how do you make an extra 500,000 bucks?

• 28:43Anthony Pompliano?

  Even if you make 60 grand a year, 70, 80 grand a year, an extra 1,000, 1,500, 500 dollars a month can be meaningful. Especially if it's all going to investing versus trying to.

• 28:52Speaker 03

  Especially now when people, a lot of people aren't willing to do the work, right? And so, like you said, you can make so much money right now, I think. I don't think, I don't know if this is going to go on forever, by the way. I mean, I hope that the economy is as strong as it is.

• 29:06Speaker 04

  So do you mind talking about your personal portfolio a little bit? Like what, uh, what, not necessarily financial advice, but what, what you see as opportunities and what you kind of like?

• 29:15Speaker 03

  Sure. So I own a lot of the QQQ, so the technology ETF. I own a lot of the SPY and then I own a lot of Bitcoin.

• 29:24Speaker 03

  So, yeah, I own a lot of Bitcoin. I mean, I mean, not as much as I probably should, but it's a lot. So.

• 29:31Anthony Pompliano?

  And what is the reason behind Bitcoin and the QQQ?

• 29:37Speaker 03

  Well, the queues are getting beat up this week because of interest rates a little bit. But, um, my thought is that the queues are businesses that are almost like monopolies. They're almost like cartels. It's sad to say, but they are. And so to my point earlier about buying the spinning ball effect, I mean, Google is a spinning ball. It's going down the street and it's generating, I mean, what, did, did you guys hear this? Google's revenue is like 30% growth rate? I mean, this is insane. After it's been growing as fast as it is, and now it's growing another 30%. And its EBITDA margins, I don't know if you guys have seen this, but their EBITDA margin is like 30, 35%. I mean, these things, I mean, they should be broken up, right? But they're like cartels. So I say to people, especially people not of means, I say, you know, and again, this is not investment advice.

• 30:21Speaker 03

  But I say, you know, go buy the cartels, go buy, go buy the monopolies. Like, if that's the game we have to play, if that's how it's been rigged, buy the monopolies, buy those, buy those big companies. So I, I hold a lot of equity risk. I don't view it as a risk and it is risk, but.

• 30:37Anthony Pompliano?

  Do you hold bonds?

• 30:38Speaker 03

  I don't.

• 30:39Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. I, I feel like that's probably the biggest thing.

• 30:41Speaker 03

  No gold.

• 30:44Anthony Pompliano?

  I feel like that's probably the biggest thing.

• 30:45Speaker 03

  Gold is a currency, you know, in my opinion. Bitcoin is a commodity, in my opinion, and I think it's becoming more of a currency, which is, which is gonna be really exciting, I think.

• 30:54Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, the, the part to me is if we went and talked to folks that we know that are 60, 70 years old, everyone is 60, 40, like that was the standard. When you go talk to younger people, you know, maybe 50s, maybe down into some 40s, they still have 60, 40, especially the financial advisors that still come out of that world, whatever. John's 25 years old, how many of your friends got 40% in their portfolio in bonds?

• 31:18Speaker 05

  I don't know, we talked to Dylan the other day, he said he's over 100% allocated.

• 31:23Speaker 03

  To what?

• 31:23Speaker 05

  To Bitcoin.

• 31:25Anthony Pompliano?

  Said he was taking out 0% interest rate credit cards last year to buy Bitcoin. But, but I, but I think that's the whole thing is like, I actually don't know if I have a friend who, outside of traditional money management, like they're managing a fund where the mandate is to hold some bonds, I don't think I could tell you a single friend I have that owns bonds. I'm in my early 30s, right?

• 31:45Speaker 05

  Certainly no one that manages their own personal portfolio.

• 31:48Speaker 03

  So let me ask you a question to our earlier question earlier, who's buying the mortgage bonds?

• 31:53Anthony Pompliano?

  Oh, it's all the government. Yeah, the, here's the, the craziest part of all of this.

• 31:58Speaker 03

  Investors are buying mortgage bonds.

• 32:00Anthony Pompliano?

  I wonder if we can figure out the average pension investment portfolio allocation.

• 32:07Speaker 03

  But these are negative real rates, real negative interest rates, right? You have the interest rate less inflation.

• 32:14Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, all right, so here is, uh, all right, we have the average allocations for 2019, average asset allocations in the Fortune 100 pension portfolios. So Fortune 100 companies in their pensions, here's the average asset allocation. Now, the average distribution by class, 50% of it is in debt, right? So all sorts of various debt instruments, 3.3% in cash. Equity is 36%, private equity is 2%, real estate is 2%, hedge funds 2%, and others 3%.

• 32:54Anthony Pompliano?

  So the largest holding in the Fortune 100 pension portfolios is debt. It's bonds, it's all sorts of kind of debt-like insurance. And so when you start to think about that, like, what are they holding? They have to be losing money on it. There's, I don't know of any credible debt that you can buy or bond that is producing more than a 5% return. Right? So you're just losing on a real rate basis, and the pension funds have 50% of their assets there.

• 33:25Speaker 03

  So on the topic of Bitcoin, and I'm sure I'm gonna ask you this later too off air, so I might as well ask you now. But, so, you know, the unknown, right? Do you ever think about the unknown as it pertains to Bitcoin?

• 33:41Anthony Pompliano?

  Like, what is the unknown?

• 33:42Speaker 03

  Bitcoin risk, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I promise I'm not trying to spread FUD. But I'm just saying.

• 33:47Anthony Pompliano?

  What are your questions? Let's just go right through all your Bitcoin questions.

• 33:50Speaker 03

  I mean, I don't know. Do you ever think about the unknown?

• 33:55Anthony Pompliano?

  Unknown in terms of unknown person who created it? Unknown what's gonna happen in the future?

• 34:00Speaker 03

  Something could ever happen to it.

• 34:01Anthony Pompliano?

  I mean, if you said to me right now, let's do, we'll do first the bear case for Bitcoin, then we'll talk about the bull case. The bear case for Bitcoin would be, it's a global store of value today. It's obvious that people have adopted this, grown into a trillion dollar asset. But unlike what the Bitcoin proponents believe, Bitcoin won't cross over into becoming a currency, and therefore that will drastically hamper kind of the addressable market. The most it could grow to is gold, which is basically a store of value, isn't really used to go purchase things on a day-to-day basis. And therefore, yes, there may be more upside, but it's kind of a capped upside. Okay, that would be one critique of Bitcoin that people can make. The second one is, eventually, we're gonna figure out who Satoshi is, and if we figure out who Satoshi is, that's gonna be a bad person, and we're not gonna wanna know who

• 34:45Anthony Pompliano?

  it is, and like, there's gonna be negative impact. Again, maybe, but unlikely.

• 34:52Anthony Pompliano?

  The next thing is, nobody's using it for specific use cases like being able to actually do cross-border payments, all stuff, it's slow, it's expensive, it's got like all these like technical issues with it. And then there's an argument of the unknown of like, the government's gonna clamp down on it in the future.

• 35:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, I don't think they can shut it down.

• 35:10Anthony Pompliano?

  They're gonna regulate it, they're gonna tax it, they're gonna shut it down, they're gonna outlaw it, they're gonna do all this type of stuff. If you take every single one of those things, none of them are a 0% chance. But what is the, 2% on each of those? Right? Each thing has one, 2% chance? And so, okay, sure.

• 35:27Speaker 03

  And I'm not even talking about those. I'm just, you know, maybe it's totally uneducated, it's just, one thing that gives me a little bit of trepidation is, I trust Elon Musk a lot. And you look at his conviction around Bitcoin versus Dorsey, and it just, it makes you think, you know, well, what are his thoughts on, I mean, I know he owns a lot though, right?

• 35:52Anthony Pompliano?

  From what I understand, it's a material part of his net worth, personally, on top of SpaceX testing.

• 35:57Speaker 03

  Maybe he's, maybe he's, you know.

• 35:59Anthony Pompliano?

  I think, I think the best argument somebody could make, and what I think is the biggest risk to Bitcoin, it really pisses the critics off, because it has nothing to do with anything external. There's still a development process, there is still a upgrade process to Bitcoin, and it's incredibly methodical, it's incredibly intentional, it's slow on purpose, lots of kind of filters and security checks, etc. But technically, a code, there could be a bug in the code that's introduced.

• 36:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, and so I guess.

• 36:27Anthony Pompliano?

  It's like shooting yourself in the foot, right?

• 36:29Speaker 03

  Could that happen, or, I mean, anything could happen.

• 36:31Anthony Pompliano?

  I mean, literally, you know, electricity in the world could shut off, because a meteor hit the earth, right?

• 36:36Speaker 03

  But if you think about it, the governments can't shut it down, can't have nuclear war shut it down, right? I mean, I guess, I mean, you have to have nuclear bombs all across the world, right?

• 36:46Anthony Pompliano?

  And even then, you probably still would shut it down, there's still gonna be one computer.

• 36:50Speaker 03

  somewhere that is running that software. It's kind of like Elon last night. Somebody was saying like, oh, should the government shut it down? Or I don't know. And he's like, he's like, they can't or something. Or what did he say?

• 37:01Speaker 04

  We were talking about it. Um, he basically said that they can't, they, they can't kill Bitcoin.

• 37:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 37:06Speaker 04

  Right?

• 37:06Anthony Pompliano?

  The, the piece that I think most people forget about all of this is when you have an asset that isn't going to get shut down, the game theory takes over. So let's say that, uh, there's, uh, four of us in a room. You say, I'm not going to buy any and neither is anybody else. So you're in the camp of nobody adopts it. John is in the camp of saying, uh, I'm not going to adopt it, but somebody else is. Joe's in the camp of, I'm going to adopt it and nobody else is. And I'm in the camp of, I'm going to buy it. So is everybody else, right? If you kind of think of a, a kind of a four or two by two grid as like a game theory. If nobody adopts it like you, nothing changes in the world. If you're in John's seat, you don't adopt it and everyone else adopts it, you're last, right?

• 37:51Anthony Pompliano?

  To adopt it. That ends up being a really bad situation, both from a security standpoint and also a financial standpoint. If you're in Joe's position, which is he adopts it and nobody else adopts it, then you end up being way ahead of everybody else. But it almost doesn't matter because the value of the market is determined by, is there demand for an asset, right? That's true of every asset since the beginning of time. So actually everyone is financially incentivized to do what? To participate, but it's also driven by everyone else participating. And that's where you get value in an asset. So from a game theory standpoint, you get hurt by not participating. And you don't necessarily get hurt if you participate and others don't.

• 38:34Anthony Pompliano?

  But the trend is everyone's participating, right? So it's like, that was the kind of game theory in 2009, 2010. Now there's no question are other people going to do this? So the game theory takes over. It's like, yeah, you, you should participate. And again, it could be point one percent of your entire net worth, right? It doesn't mean you got to go do a lot or whatever. But the game theory is really strong here.

• 38:56Speaker 03

  Yeah, and you know, to be clear, I don't, I own a lot like, cause it, because in dollars, it makes me think like, wow, I own a lot of Bitcoin. Like, I should really make sure I know what the hell's going on with this thing. And I think I've done the due diligence, but I own a little over 10%, which is not a lot in terms of when you, I mean, you own like, what, 95% of your net worth in the damn thing?

• 39:17Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 39:18Speaker 03

  I mean, so, so when I ask the question about the unknown unknown, and you know, your mind could go a zillion different directions. It just, how do you get the confidence to go from 10% to 95%?

• 39:33Anthony Pompliano?

  Your 10% is in the new digital financial system.

• 39:37Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 39:38Anthony Pompliano?

  You're 90% in the legacy financial system.

• 39:41Speaker 03

  Couldn't they say that about Ethereum, though?

• 39:43Anthony Pompliano?

  It could be what you buy whatever asset you want, right? And guess what? The market's going to determine who wins and loses. I'm most comfortable with, and I have the most confidence in Bitcoin. Because here's the other thing that I think happens in the crypto world that people misunderstand, is I think of the risk spectrum in, let's call it the crypto industry. On the far left, you have the least risky asset, Bitcoin. It is kind of the, the, the blue chip, largest, most decentralized, longest track record, etc.

• 40:10Speaker 03

  A thousand percent.

• 40:11Anthony Pompliano?

  In crypto, least risky, most conservative asset. On the other end of the spectrum, you have crazy things that people are coming up with, all kinds of tokens and, and schemes and innovations and, and experiments and whatever, that you can go buy for a penny, right? So you have, on one end, super conservative, on the other end, you have super risky. When you look at the crypto industry, what most people are doing is they come into the industry, and the people who end up going way out on the risk curve, they literally say, oh yeah, of course Bitcoin's going to work, but I want better returns than Bitcoin. They're chasing something that is higher or better performing than Bitcoin alone. And so what I think about is the reason why Bitcoin is so attractive, is I actually don't need to have the best returning asset. I don't need to be greedy.

• 40:56Anthony Pompliano?

  I want the thing that has a great economic return, but also I know it's gonna be around in 50 years.

• 41:02Speaker 03

  So let me ask you, do you have anxiety about not putting the rest of your 5% in Bitcoin?

• 41:07Anthony Pompliano?

  No, because a lot of that ends up being, and when I use percentage, it's usually liquid net worth. I've got cash and then I still make some private investments as well. So in some crazy way, like if I invest in a company that then is using the Lightning Network, like it's not Bitcoin exposure, but you know,

• 41:26Speaker 03

  That's pretty close.

• 41:26Anthony Pompliano?

  It's, it's definitely related. The other piece of it is-

• 41:30Speaker 03

  By the way, tell me if we're going off topic too.

• 41:32Anthony Pompliano?

  No, this is perfect. I'll talk about Bitcoin all day long. So will they.

• 41:37Speaker 03

  Well, I think these are a lot of questions a lot of people have and you're like the Bitcoin guy. I mean, if you want to know about housing, I'll tell you about it all day long.

• 41:44Anthony Pompliano?

  If you compare what I just talked about in the crypto world of like conservative on one end, super risky on the other end of the crypto industry. If you look at the regular financial world, like the legacy financial world, Bitcoin is the most risky asset you could buy. Right? And then like maybe bonds or cash or something is on like the other end. And so the beauty of sitting in like that Bitcoin seat is that all of the crypto guys and girls who are like way out on the risk curve. They're like, this is like the most like, what are you doing? Right? Like, that's not going to drive you great returns.

• 42:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, they call you a boomer.

• 42:17Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. But the legacy finance world, like I go talk to, you know, big hedge funds, they're like, what are you doing? Like, that is the craziest thing I've ever heard. That's actually probably where you want to be.

• 42:27Speaker 03

  I agree.

• 42:27Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? Like, I know there's way crazier things that you could do in the world, but I also know that there's way safer things you could do in the world. So like-

• 42:35Speaker 03

  But 95% is very respectable. You don't say that that often, do you? I mean, I hear you say it once in a while.

• 42:42Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. I mean, it's a, it sounds like a crazy number until you just say, no, I just denominate my life and my portfolio in Bitcoin. So it's no different than dollars, right? If you have a hundred percent, most people, right? In dollars, in dollar-denominated bonds or dollar-denominated assets, you essentially have a hundred percent exposure to what I think of as the legacy financial world.

• 43:05Anthony Pompliano?

  And so if you ask me right now, gun to my head, which financial world has the most room to grow moving forward? Well, the legacy world is like, we've had it for, you know, 100 plus years, right? Like it's been here. There's just not that much future growth to it versus we get this crazy stuff. And it's why like the stock market, everyone's freaking out over 2% drop, right? I mean, literally right now Bitcoin could drop 5% and no one would even care. It's just like, yeah, of course it goes up and down, you know, 3, 5, 10% a day.

• 43:33Speaker 03

  Are you surprised it's not higher now?

• 43:36Anthony Pompliano?

  I don't know if I'm necessarily surprised it's not higher. Hindsight bias is real strong because you kind of understand why it's not higher. But I would be very surprised if it doesn't go much higher through the end of this year. Like if we didn't at least get a new all time high, something happened that I either didn't understand, didn't foresee, or just missed, right? All time high is only 20k away. It's like a 50% move from here, which again, sounds crazy in legacy terms in Bitcoin crypto world, like, you know, that's like, could happen in a week. And then on top of that, it's like, once it breaks through the all time high, like, where does it go? And we've had how many people come

• 44:17Anthony Pompliano?

  on and you hear everything from 80 to somebody recently said 400,000 this year, like,

• 44:22Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:23Anthony Pompliano?

  And, and they all have a good explanation. And you're like, yeah, all 80 to 400,000 is all possible, right?

• 44:29Speaker 03

  That's funny.

• 44:29Anthony Pompliano?

  So we'll see. How do you think about buying stocks versus like more Bitcoin or anything that's like more like alternative investor private markets?

• 44:39Speaker 03

  Well, I've been thinking about upping my percent of Bitcoin. So I've recently gone over that 10% amount and it's growing because it's getting to be bigger, you know, but.

• 44:52Anthony Pompliano?

  Do you rebalance? That's another thing that I see a lot of institutions love to rebalance, but in some weird way, you're basically taking your best performers and you're cutting your exposure versus just make the investments and then just let them turn into whatever they.

• 45:07Speaker 03

  Yeah, not really. I mean, in the early days, I was selling a little bit of Bitcoin, but that was because it just went up so quick that you were just like, what the, you know, what is going on here? You know, and I always get worried about the psychological phenomenon of like confirmation bias. And it's like, okay, like, yeah, I think it's going up because I know why it's going up. But do I really know why it's going up? And it keeps just going, you know? So. So no, I don't really.

• 45:32Anthony Pompliano?

  Imagine being one of these guys that has a billion dollars of it or, you know, $5 billion of it and it keeps going off, right?

• 45:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, since you must think you're a genius.

• 45:42Anthony Pompliano?

  Gets pretty crazy, right? I mean, Joe and John is the best story, I think we told on this on the show before is Joe called me one day and John had bought Bitcoin, I don't know, whenever it was, and he goes, yo, you gotta talk to John. And I was like, why? And he's like, John said he ain't gonna make it to 20K. It was at like 11. And I was like, what do you mean? And he goes, yeah, he said, dude, this thing goes to 20, I'm selling.

• 46:04Speaker 03

  And now, what percent of your guys' money do you have in it?

• 46:08Speaker 05

  Very similar amount.

• 46:10Speaker 03

  95?

• 46:11Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 46:11Speaker 03

  How about you?

• 46:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm probably in the, I gotta do some calculations, but I'm probably in like the 90s.

• 46:17Speaker 03

  I hope I don't buy more today.

• 46:19Anthony Pompliano?

  But here's, but here's what you have to remember is it's also different when you're younger, when like.

• 46:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, but I'm 33, right? And I see it and I see Bitcoin is play, you know, as plain as day, right?

• 46:32Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah.

• 46:33Speaker 03

  I don't understand people who don't see it, but.

• 46:36Speaker 05

  John, I think that's the light bulb, right? Is like, once you realize that and you, you think of it in the context of like, it's inevitable, right? To some degree, you start aggressively figure out how you can acquire more, right? And knowing that it's constrained supply, all you're looking at is the demand becomes a no brainer.

• 46:52Anthony Pompliano?

  You want to hear a story I never told anybody before?

• 46:54Speaker 05

  I like the philanthropy aspect.

• 46:55Anthony Pompliano?

  In 2018, I took 50% of basically my net worth, my portfolio, whatever you want to say, and I put it in Bitcoin and it happened to be near the bottom of the bear market in 2018. In December, I think the bottom was like December 14th or whatever.

• 47:14Anthony Pompliano?

  And I remember walking around, because Bitcoin had been, it had gone from 20 to 6,500 and there's like this like puke down. I remember walking around New York City and just like thinking to myself, like, you're either insane or like you know something that they all don't see or know or whatever. And I had been paying attention to it for, you know, a number of years, whatever, at that point, maybe two, three years, whatever it was.

• 47:38Anthony Pompliano?

  I remember saying to myself, this is likely what the housing short trade, the dot com bust, like, like all these different things is it's a combination, not only of the information that you have been able to spend time and learn and do all that, but also the way that you evaluate it, the way that you analyze and understand, or at least think you understand how it's going to play out or whatever. And at some point, you just got to say to yourself, like, you just trust yourself, right? At least for me. And, and so I was just like, all right, screw it. And I knew that the reason why I did 50 was because I was willing to lose that. Right? I was like, look, at that point, I was, you know, I don't know.

• 48:16Speaker 03

  So would you be willing to lose the 95% of you now?

• 48:19Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah. Which is why I'm comfortable doing that. Right? But it's because I've got high earning potential. I'm still young. Like, I could recover. If I was 45 or 50, I wouldn't do it. It's all about like, I think a lot about, um, there's a book, Richard Weiser, Happier, uh, I think it's the name of it by William Green. And he basically goes out and he interviews, like, the top 25 investors he can find. And so he has this guy, Pat Brey, who's like famous for just emulating Warren Buffett. He has, um, Nick Sleep, he's got a bunch of these guys that he goes and he talks to and he's basically like, what are you doing? He even interviews Charlie Munger for the book or whatever. And there's two key things that I learned in that book that

• 49:01Anthony Pompliano?

  surprised me. One, majority of the best investors in the world, high, high, high concentration in their portfolio. It's like Charlie Munger only owns three stocks. Yeah. Right? It's like Berkshire Hathaway, Costco, and I forget what the, the third one is. And you're like, wait, what? Like, now Berkshire owns a bunch of different, you know, businesses, whatever, but like, he only owns three stocks, I think.

• 49:20Speaker 03

  So what do you think the chances are, though, if you're investing in those three companies and having enough knowledge to beat the S and P?

• 49:31Anthony Pompliano?

  I think that's kind of like table stakes at this point, right? Is if you go back to, somebody was telling me this recently, so bear with me if the stats aren't exactly right. But if you go back and you look at all the ICOs from 2017, right? And you look at them today, the scams, that like, all the things that literally, and I was one of the biggest people saying like, hey, I'm not investing in any of this, this is all nonsense to me. It's up like 300% today. And so you're like, literally things that I personally believe have no value, right? That like, a lot of people were pointing at being like, this is literally a scam. It's still up a ton. And the reason why that ends up happening is it's not because it's valuable, it's because you're betting on an industry that ends up growing so significantly.

• 50:16Anthony Pompliano?

  And so you're betting on something that's small and ends up growing up. And so when you think of it that way, like, why would you end up actually investing in the legacy market? Like, you could be, what was the hamster that's beating the S and P? Mr. Doc. Did you hear about this?

• 50:30Speaker 03

  Mr. Doc.

• 50:31Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And he is, Mr. Doc, he's like, Doc's Capital. Yeah. He's running around, he's got a hamster, and he's running around, and he's beating the S and P. Why? He's literally doing it with assets that are going up significantly more than the S and P. Yeah. Right there with the Bitcoin 100K hat.

• 50:45Speaker 03

  Now we're in business.

• 50:47Anthony Pompliano?

  Now we're in business.

• 50:48Speaker 03

  No, but seriously, the reason that I take it so seriously is not just because of my own family and, and, you know, trying to provide for my family with money, but if I can figure out how to compound, to our point earlier, returns over a period of time, you know, my capital, I look at it as helping fuel a lot of this transaction volume that's going across Twitter for the poverty angle. So it's, it's a very helpful discussion.

• 51:12Anthony Pompliano?

  I completely agree. Before we move to wrap up here, I have one question, and then if we get to 5K likes, Joe's giving away a thousand bucks. We didn't hit, we didn't hit 5K yet. All right, Bill.

• 51:26Speaker 03

  We're close.

• 51:27Anthony Pompliano?

  What do you think Bitcoin's price goes to this year in 2021?

• 51:31Speaker 03

  Well, I'll give you that, but I think that it's going to be a million dollars a coin.

• 51:36Anthony Pompliano?

  Okay.

• 51:37Speaker 03

  Not this year necessarily, maybe not this cycle, but I think pretty soon it will be.

• 51:44Speaker 03

  I think that if we get another momentum in the market, it's just my opinion. And, you know, these things they trade with momentum, you know, even like MSTR stock, it trades with momentum. If we get an upward momentum, and let's say that there's continues to be this high inflation print. Yeah, there's no ceiling to where it could go, but I would say, you know, 75, I think it'll at least be at 75.

• 52:09Anthony Pompliano?

  So new all time high this year?

• 52:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 52:11Anthony Pompliano?

  And then you think that at some point in the next couple of years, a million dollars?

• 52:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think probably mid next year, I think that it will get, it will get harder.

• 52:21Speaker 03

  Just the growth in the economy, I think will be harder on stuff. And I do think Bitcoin, and we may disagree on this, I do think Bitcoin, at least from what I've seen, tends to trade like a commodity from what I've seen.

• 52:34Speaker 03

  And I've been a little disappointed with it the last couple of weeks at how, you know, how, how much it traded even with the market, but I guess that's, you know, that's, it's probably nothing compared to what it used to be, right?

• 52:47Anthony Pompliano?

  It happens, it tends to be a non-correlated asset, but there are periods where it gets high correlation. And a lot of it's the macro stuff where people just start saying, hey, this is a risk asset or whatever. And also it used to be a much different audience that held Bitcoin. As you get into now more financially savvy folks with it, then you're going to have them trade it like it's another stock or another commodity in their portfolio versus historically, those people who they didn't care about the financials.

• 53:11Speaker 03

  And again, this is out of my circle of competency, so I don't really know it, but you know, you asked, so that's what I think.

• 53:17Anthony Pompliano?

  Where can we send people to find out more Twitter philanthropy?

• 53:20Speaker 03

  Teamgiving.com, teamgiving.com, that's the big philanthropy, or that's the big 501(c)(3) that we've set up where people with legitimate needs can go and it will be vetted by an experienced team. So we haven't figured out the decentralized way yet, but just given the demand, we didn't want to just rely on GoFundMe. So it's been a great, a great thing, working with the team at TeamGiving and, you know, just if you see somebody and your heart tells you to donate, great, if not, it's all good.