Did Apple Actually Duo It?

New iPhones are officially here! Marques, Andrew, and David talk about the new iPhone 18 Pro phones and the newest foldable on the block, the iPhone Duo. There were also some interesting updates to the new AirPods 5 and Apple Watch Series 12/Apple Watch Ultra 4, so they spend some time discussing all of the updates as well. Of course, we wrap it all up with trivia. Enjoy! Links: MKBHD - iPhone 18 Pro/Duo Impressions video Apple - Apple Watch Paper This episode brought to you by: Airbnb: https://www.airbnb.com Granola AI: https://www.granola.ai/waveform Shopify: https://www.shopify.com/waveform Square: https://www.square.com/go/waveform Follow us on socials: Marques: https://www.threads.net/@mkbhd Andrew: https://www.threads.net/@andrew_manganelli David: https://www.threads.net/@davidimel Adam: https://www.threads.net/@parmesanpapi17 Ellis: https://twitter.com/EllisRovin Waveform Threads: https://www.threads.net/@waveformpodcast Waveform Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/waveformpodcast/?hl=en Waveform TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@waveformpodcast Join the Discord: https://discord.gg/mkbhd Intro/Outro music by 20syl: https://bit.ly/2S53xlC Waveform is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Support for the show comes from Google Gemini. You know that moment when curiosity strikes? You're exploring a new city with the family and a sculpture catches your daughter's eye. What is that? Who made it? With Gemini, you can snap a picture and get a fully interactive breakdown of its history, architecture, and even hidden secrets. Gemini is built for moments like that. Whether you're learning something new, solving a problem, or looking for your next favorite thing, Google Gemini is here to help. Download Gemini, Google's AI app, or visit gemini.google.com to learn more.

• 0:38Speaker 01

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• 1:08Speaker 02

  Doc on the right.

• 1:09David Imel?

  God, okay, so it's such a good idea.

• 1:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Unless you're lefty.

• 1:12David Imel?

  Unless you're left-handed, in which case, become right-handed.

• 1:15Andrew Manganelli?

  You're holding it wrong.

• 1:21Speaker 02

  Yo, what is up, people of the internet? Welcome back to another episode of the Waveform Podcast. We're your hosts, I'm Marquez.

• 1:26Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm Andrew.

• 1:27David Imel?

  And I'm David.

• 1:28Speaker 02

  And over at the producer desk, we have Adam and Ellis.

• 1:31Speaker 05

  Hello.

• 1:31Speaker 02

  We are video listeners, video viewers. You can already tell we're in a new place because it's Apple Event Week, and the news of the week is the event that happened here in California. And we figured before we flew home, we might as well use one of their nicely loaned podcast studio spaces to tell you guys all about what happened. So here we are.

• 1:49Andrew Manganelli?

  Because it's on a Wednesday, and we have to get this out.

• 1:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, we are.

• 1:51Andrew Manganelli?

  It's Thursday right now.

• 1:52Speaker 02

  We are crushing this, and this is gonna be great. But we do have a lot to talk about, so we should just jump directly into it. Now, I see here that we have this nicely organized doc where we have some of the more chill announcements first. AirPods first, watch first.

• 2:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Don't say thank you, because he's gonna say, but I'm going to go off script and miss all of the stuff you guys wrote.

• 2:10Speaker 02

  Let's stick with it, because retention, retention's very important, I say. But just to, just to make sure people know what's coming, we are talking about the AirPods, we're talking about the new watches. We are also talking about the new iPhone 18 Pro and Pro Max and the new folding iPhone Duo, which is all that we got. We did not get new base iPhone 18s. We did not get new iPhone Air or SE or anything like that. If you watch the impressions video, we know, we kind of assume that's coming like early next year. So we kind of like, they did the thing where they made room for the big important thing, and we talked a lot about foldable, and we will also talk a lot about foldable. But let's do the other stuff first.

• 2:46David Imel?

  Good, good. Great, okay. Well, I figured the way that I organized this document was sort of least updates to biggest updates.

• 2:54Speaker 02

  Nice, okay.

• 2:55David Imel?

  Which is kind of how Apple usually presents this stuff. They're like, you guys love AirPods, here's the same thing.

• 3:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, they actually started off by reminding us that iOS 27 exists and that Siri exists. So it's sort of re-announcement stuff for people who didn't watch Dub Dub.

• 3:09David Imel?

  I forgot about that. That was a big deal, because a lot of these people are buying new iPhones, but they didn't, they were not on the betas, they weren't on Beta 5, you know?

• 3:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:16Andrew Manganelli?

  I'd argue they started with a CEO passoff.

• 3:19Speaker 02

  That's true, also very true.

• 3:20Andrew Manganelli?

  We did. I liked the little Tim Cook, like, I'm not the main character, that's your guy. I thought that was a cute way to do it.

• 3:27Speaker 05

  He had such main character energy.

• 3:29David Imel?

  I mean, he always does, you know? He always does.

• 3:32Speaker 02

  He did nod it off to Turnus, who did the whole event, as we expected.

• 3:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Something we asked on our Man on the Street pod, which will actually come out after this, is, do we think, what was it, hello and good morning? Do we think that's a catchphrase or no? It sounds like he did not say that.

• 3:46David Imel?

  Hello and welcome.

• 3:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Hello and welcome. Hello and welcome, yeah.

• 3:49Speaker 02

  Is that, that's what he started with?

• 3:51David Imel?

  Only on the stream.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  On the stream.

• 3:52David Imel?

  In person, he said, wow.

• 3:54Speaker 02

  Okay, that's actually, I feel better about that, because whenever you see the little like lowercase hello text, I think that's like when you first boot an iPhone, that's what it says or whatever. And then, we all know, Tim Cook's sort of trademarked opening line at every keynote was good morning, maybe five, six, seven, eight, nine times, which is great. But then I was like, Turnus can't say good morning, he has to say something else. So what will he say? And I figured it would be a lowercase hello.

• 4:17David Imel?

  It kind of was.

• 4:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Lowercase hello?

• 4:19Speaker 02

  Specifically a lowercase hello.

• 4:20Andrew Manganelli?

  What's a lowercase hello sound like?

• 4:22Speaker 02

  Hello.

• 4:23David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 4:24Speaker 02

  And I think he could do it.

• 4:25David Imel?

  It's not like, you know, Tim Cook has this like radiating energy when he says good morning. It's good morning!

• 4:30Speaker 02

  It's a capital G and a capital M. Yeah, it was good.

• 4:33Andrew Manganelli?

  That was great.

• 4:34David Imel?

  It was pretty low.

• 4:34Andrew Manganelli?

  He was practicing that all morning.

• 4:37David Imel?

  You know? Turnus is very low-key, low-key.

• 4:40Speaker 02

  So they did, they did the CEO handoff, Turnus leaves the event, dives in. AirPods 5 is the first product we get. And as you said, probably the fewest amount of updates, but also pretty reasonably expected updates. It gets, the $129 price tier has ANC, it's more powerful ANC, and it has a non-wireless charging case, and I think it has slightly thicker mesh, so it has a little bit better passive cancellation as well. But then there's a $149 version that adds a wireless charging case and the little volume control on the stems from the Pros, which I really like. At this point, you basically have the Pros without the rubber tips.

• 5:20David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 5:21Speaker 02

  So, nice. That's, that's good.

• 5:23David Imel?

  And they sound pretty good. And yeah, it's interesting that if you pay $20 more to get the wireless charging case, and they just call it AirPods 5 with wireless charging case, you also get like the volume thing on the stem. For some reason, that's not on the standard model.

• 5:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:36David Imel?

  It also gets an extra hour of battery life over the version that doesn't have the wireless charging case.

• 5:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:41David Imel?

  And the total battery life is 20 hours on the non-wireless charging case and 22 on the wireless charging.

• 5:47Speaker 02

  Apparently, it's a slightly bigger battery in the case, too.

• 5:49David Imel?

  That's strange.

• 5:51Speaker 02

  I don't get it, it's two SKUs, but they are of two names.

• 5:53David Imel?

  I'm gonna say it's worth the $20.

• 5:55Andrew Manganelli?

  And you get the Find My Speaker, too.

• 5:57David Imel?

  Yeah, that's the other thing. You don't get a Find My Speaker on the, I don't even know why they're making the non-wireless charging version.

• 6:03Andrew Manganelli?

  This is, as a non-AirPods user, this was already very confusing to me, because I forgot that AirPods 4 had the, AirPods 4 and AirPods 4 with ANC, correct? So the way they described things in comparison, we're like, this is 50%, or 1.5x more powerful ANC over last year's model. But then the other one was just like, you actually get ANC, so I was just lost for the entire.

• 6:26David Imel?

  Last year, the AirPods 4, there was a version with ANC and a version without.

• 6:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:30David Imel?

  So now they both have ANC.

• 6:32Andrew Manganelli?

  But one has wireless charging.

• 6:33David Imel?

  But one has wireless, it's, I don't know why they made the cheaper version. I think just to keep it at that price point, I suppose.

• 6:40Andrew Manganelli?

  It is funny that it's with the wireless charging case, but the actual.

• 6:44David Imel?

  Is actually different.

• 6:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Is actually different with the stem, yeah.

• 6:46David Imel?

  Yeah, which is confusing, but.

• 6:48Speaker 02

  It's interesting. I think a lot of the software stuff is more interesting than the actual hardware. The live translate, I want to try. Obviously, the passive, the noise cancellation is always better for me in the silicon-tipped Pros that actually stay in my ears. But for the people who allegedly are out there that just don't want that, that really, really want the hard-tipped earbuds, and it stays in their ears, because they have the perfect ear.

• 7:11David Imel?

  Like Brandon. Brandon is the perfect.

• 7:13Andrew Manganelli?

  This is, we met someone yesterday that said that. This to me feels like, now you get the same headphone, and you just get to pick which one fits your ear better, which I think is a good thing. I think most truly wireless headphones, the worst part about them is finding one that fits your ear. Now you have two options for it without losing much else.

• 7:28David Imel?

  Yeah, so that's good, that was pretty basic. The next bigger thing that we'll shift to is the Apple Watch Series 12 and Ultra 4, which actually are, in my opinion, bigger upgrades than we usually get from the Apple Watch series upgrades, because they completely redesigned the bottom of the Apple Watch.

• 7:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 7:46David Imel?

  That's a bunch of different things.

• 7:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, I have two really big thoughts about them.

• 7:52David Imel?

  I'm excited.

• 7:52Speaker 02

  And I think the review has to dive into these thoughts. But we should first talk about the physical updates, which most of them are around like the cluster of sensors on the underside of the watch, which have been, you know, slowly evolving over the years. They've been adding a couple sensors here and there, but they completely redesigned them, add way more photo diodes, way more sensors, way more LEDs, more powerful and bigger LEDs. And all of this is in the name of measuring your heart rate way more frequently and way more accurately. And then they published a paper, which I'm gonna link below, because I think it's really interesting, where they come, they took a huge sample size of people and compared it to a whole bunch of other different wearables, including the Whoop, including wearable rings,

• 8:32Speaker 02

  and concluded with scientific rigor that it is the most accurate heart rate sensing wearable.

• 8:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, so they did publish a paper?

• 8:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:40Andrew Manganelli?

  That's what I was wondering yesterday during the event. I was like, where is this paper?

• 8:43David Imel?

  It's a public paper.

• 8:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Nice, okay, cool.

• 8:45Speaker 02

  Yeah. So that to me was, that's a direct shot at all this, like, we've, we've talked about all year, like, the Whoops and then the Whoop competitors, which is like, okay, obviously Whoop has their subscription, so people are attacking that. You have Fitbit Air, you have the Garmin, the, what is it called? The?

• 8:59Andrew Manganelli?

  The Circa.

• 9:00Speaker 02

  Circa, like, all of these are trying to directly essentially build Whoop, but for not as much money.

• 9:07David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 9:08Speaker 02

  And along comes Apple, no subscription for an Apple Watch. You get the Apple Watch, obviously it's in the ecosystem, but it's allegedly, well, now scientifically confirmed, just as accurate, if not more so, than a Whoop. And they redo the Health app, which is coming in an update later this year, that adds a lot of the interpretation of the data. Because there's always been a ton of data, but it's, the Health app's been just like a, like a doctor's office, just like tons of lists of stuff that it's been collecting.

• 9:35David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 9:36Speaker 02

  And it's not really fun to poke through there, but AI is gonna sort of, you know, unveil your sleep score and your health age and your readiness today and all that stuff. So that'll give you some recommendations.

• 9:46Speaker 05

  I wish you guys could have heard Andrew go off about health age yesterday when we were watching the event.

• 9:50David Imel?

  I don't even remember what I said. I was on a fury.

• 9:53Speaker 02

  It is such a direct, I mean, because Whoop, you know, Whoop does your Whoop age.

• 9:57Andrew Manganelli?

  A lot of things do. Garmin does a thing, everything does it now.

• 10:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, this is, it's directly, it's not cloning, but it's giving you the exact same set of features. So if you were choosing between any of these, if you're cross-shopping.

• 10:08Andrew Manganelli?

  It's great entertainment.

• 10:09Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:10David Imel?

  Yeah. There are so many small things about the updates to like the Health app and the way that they're tracking data that I feel like are direct attacks at the things that we're trying to attack the Apple Watch. Every year, the Pixel Watch is making a big deal about how many more times it tracks your heart rate over, like, compared to the Apple Watch. And now Apple just came in, and they're like, nope, we're doing it 60 times a minute now.

• 10:32Speaker 02

  60 times more frequently.

• 10:34David Imel?

  Yes.

• 10:35Speaker 02

  Every five seconds in the background polling for heart rate.

• 10:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 10:39Speaker 02

  All day, every day, all day during your sleep.

• 10:41David Imel?

  24 times more frequent heart rate variability readings compared to Series 11. Um, yeah. Okay. So the readiness thing and like the new health app redesign. My hot take is that they are preparing to release a Fitbit Air competitor because, yes. Look, look, this is not confirmed.

• 10:58Speaker 02

  I'm into this. I'm into that idea.

• 11:00David Imel?

  So a lot of the, the changes in the health app kind of bring all the stuff that you would normally look at on your watch into like this more visual design. Like they have this new pedal design inside the new health app.

• 11:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:10David Imel?

  That takes like all of these readings, like you were talking about. And usually it was just like charts and lists and all these things. You have to scroll, scroll, scroll. Now they have a whole tab that just has this pedal design that they call it, which is sort of looks like flower petals with things like your sleep score and like your readiness score and all these things. And it gives you sort of this barometer of how good you're doing in each thing. And if the more filled those bars are, the better you're doing.

• 11:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:35David Imel?

  And if you look at like the Fitbit Air or like the Whoop, this is the thing that they do really well is like when you actually look at your phone, that's the only surface you have to actually see your information.

• 11:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:47David Imel?

  On the Apple Watch, they designed most of that information to see on the Apple Watch screen. You're not opening the health app on your, on your phone that often.

• 11:54Speaker 02

  So putting that display in the health app prepares them to have an equivalent with no displaying your wrist.

• 11:59Andrew Manganelli?

  I just don't think they would want to do anything to get an Apple Watch off your wrist.

• 12:03David Imel?

  I think that there are a lot of people who just don't want to wear the Apple Watch that much. I mean, I think.

• 12:09Andrew Manganelli?

  I know you don't. I, I just don't think that's a big enough sample size of people. I think they, I think they want all of the extra Whoop competitive, Fitbit Air competitor, extra Garmin. I mean, Garmin's been doing this forever. Also, they want all those crazy metrics, especially with like an Apple Watch Ultra replicating Garmin kind of stuff.

• 12:25David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 12:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Totally makes sense. I just think they also want the, especially because they announced all this stuff, like the 15 second live rewind and listening all day kind of stuff. They want that on your wrist all the time.

• 12:36Speaker 02

  I have thoughts on that.

• 12:36Andrew Manganelli?

  And if a screenless one doesn't have that, they much prefer having.

• 12:40David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 12:40Speaker 02

  I do.

• 12:41David Imel?

  I think they're gonna offer both.

• 12:42Speaker 02

  I agree. It's kind of like, Apple would love to sell you an Apple Watch and if you, but I also think that the screenless fitness trackers are like a separate new growing category that if they don't offer anything, they're just going to leak Apple Watch users into that until they offer some equivalent.

• 13:00David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 13:00Speaker 02

  And so the, we've seen people, I'm an example. I have leaked out of Apple Watch into a screenless fitness tracker. And that's not everyone. That's obviously a small group of people, but Whoop is huge. Fitbit Air is huge. Lots of these screenless. It's eight in the morning. Lots of these feeless fitness trackers. Yeah, lots of these screenless fitness trackers are, are interesting products. And I think if Apple could find a way to make it ecosystem pull, they would.

• 13:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. I think, do we think the screenless fitness tracker is only popular because Whoop had all these very specific metrics and calculations and we're so much better than everyone else?

• 13:35Speaker 02

  No, you think it's a different type of person.

• 13:37David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 13:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know.

• 13:38David Imel?

  You're wearing, you're wearing a, a watch right now that's not a smart watch.

• 13:41Andrew Manganelli?

  I know, but I'm not wearing a screenless fitness tracker.

• 13:43Speaker 02

  I think the screenless fitness tracker is a slightly more health focused, slightly more athletic type of like buyer versus the, Apple Watches, it's the most popular watch in the world. It's the definition of like the baseline casual, I'm going to maybe get into this a little bit. So if they could offer something for the people who are like, I want more than the Apple Watch will give me, and I don't want the screen on my wrist and I want to run an ultra marathon and the Ultra Watch is not what I want. It's just a possible new thing to sell them.

• 14:10Andrew Manganelli?

  I think my reason for that is, I think everyone likes the Whoop because the metrics are different. Now everyone's copying it. I think more people are going to keep screen on their wrist now because they get the benefits of that with notifications and everything.

• 14:22Speaker 02

  I did think about that.

• 14:22Andrew Manganelli?

  They get all the new metrics. And I also think an ultra marathon's the number one time you want a screen on your wrist. Because you want all that stuff up to date. That's why Garmin dominates ultra marathon runners because you have a huge battery life with constant information feeding to you and you do not carry a phone with you.

• 14:38Speaker 02

  You know what? I did think about that, which is last year, it was so easy for me to leave the Apple Watch because there was no black one.

• 14:46Speaker 02

  There was only, there was only dark blue, which is, it's Series 11 is fine. It's a very nice watch. And I didn't want to wear the Ultra. So it was like, they didn't have a black one. It's like, you know what? I could, I could leave the Apple Watch. Now they have a Series 12 and it has all these new features and it has way more data. And there's a black one. And so I do see your point.

• 15:03David Imel?

  Do you miss having a screen?

• 15:05Speaker 02

  I don't. I don't miss having a screen.

• 15:07Speaker 06

  Yeah. No, yeah, I think a lot of people are like, oh my God, I can get all this without the annoyance of having a screen on my wrist.

• 15:13Andrew Manganelli?

  I think you guys are in a bubble too much.

• 15:15Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 15:16Speaker 02

  No, I, I don't miss the screen.

• 15:18David Imel?

  Air all the time.

• 15:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, I don't think people want.

• 15:20Andrew Manganelli?

  I think because no one wants the Pixel Watch. I think you guys are all thinking of these watches that no one really wants. But the Apple Watch is the most popular watch in the world. I mean, yeah.

• 15:29Speaker 02

  Because watch is one category and it's enormous. And this smaller, but growing category of not a watch, but a fitness tracker.

• 15:37David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 15:38Speaker 02

  The debate is how big is this category? Is it big enough to warrant Apple's attention to make something?

• 15:42Andrew Manganelli?

  All right. Well, neither of us, so what's the bet? How many years until this comes out?

• 15:47David Imel?

  Max two.

• 15:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Max two.

• 15:49David Imel?

  But I, I do think it's going to come out in a year.

• 15:51Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't think this comes out in two years.

• 15:53David Imel?

  The iPhone, Apple.

• 15:54Andrew Manganelli?

  No shock.

• 15:54Speaker 06

  No, it's not coming out ever.

• 15:56Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 15:56Speaker 06

  What would a screenless Apple Watch even be? Like the whole thing about the Apple Watch is.

• 16:00Speaker 02

  Well, it wouldn't be an Apple Watch.

• 16:02David Imel?

  Bands is crazy.

• 16:03Speaker 06

  I know, but like.

• 16:04Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm not saying they wouldn't make a good one. I'm just saying I don't think they're making it.

• 16:07David Imel?

  Just wear an Apple Watch bracelet and it just has the tracking.

• 16:09Speaker 06

  But don't all the, the screenless ones already plug into Apple Health? Like, like genuinely what would be the, the offering there?

• 16:16Speaker 02

  Apple would have to find a way to make theirs plug into the ecosystem better than everyone else's. And you're right, a lot of these do dump the data into Apple Health already, which is a great point. And I wonder what Apple, if, if they were to jump in, I don't think there's any way they do it without finding something to add to theirs that no one else can do.

• 16:33Andrew Manganelli?

  I would argue everything they've launched at this event is they're like, cool, stop buying that with your Apple Watch. You have it all on your Apple Watch now. There's no point of you getting a screen.

• 16:41Speaker 02

  That did feel like.

• 16:42David Imel?

  I agree with that, but I do think those are more targeted at the AI wearables that are going to come out, which.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  Okay, let's talk about that.

• 16:47David Imel?

  Let's get to that.

• 16:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, wait, wait. What's the bet? Yeah. I just wanted the bet to end. Two years? What are we doing?

• 16:51David Imel?

  A year from now.

• 16:52Andrew Manganelli?

  A year.

• 16:53David Imel?

  They're gonna launch it at the iPhone 19.

• 16:55Andrew Manganelli?

  All right. What's the, what's the, the stakes?

• 17:00David Imel?

  I don't know. Embarrass me somehow.

• 17:02Andrew Manganelli?

  No, we have to print out a full size picture of the other person's face and put it on your laptop for a year.

• 17:07David Imel?

  A year?

• 17:08Andrew Manganelli?

  A year?

• 17:08Speaker 02

  I love that. I think you have to drive to work for a week with a full size cardboard cut out of the other person in your car.

• 17:15Andrew Manganelli?

  That's just to get by.

• 17:15David Imel?

  Are you buying the cutout?

• 17:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:17Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, deal.

• 17:18David Imel?

  Look, if it makes the people who pass me on the highway think I have more friends than I do, then that's a win for me.

• 17:22Speaker 02

  All right, perfect. We'll do that.

• 17:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Lane is gonna hate that.

• 17:24David Imel?

  I'll do that.

• 17:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Or be very scared.

• 17:26David Imel?

  But be prepared to have a full size David in your car all the time.

• 17:29Speaker 02

  This is my other, and I'm not going to say it's a conspiracy theory, but the more, the more I listen to Apple talk about this watch, these watches, and specifically the new features that they added, which are sort of tied into the AI and software, the more I couldn't stop thinking about what we're expecting to come in this, this standalone AI device race. So for those who don't know, the Series 12 Watch and the Series, or the Ultra 4 have these new features where Siri taps into the S11 chip to essentially, and this is going to be an oversimplification, but constantly be listening for conversations or words to be said in the Apple Watch's microphone.

• 18:11David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 18:12Speaker 02

  And at any point to summarize that for you in the Siri app. There's two features. There's one that's called like live rewind, which is something just happened and I want a summary of the last 15 seconds. I hit a button on the watch and because it's always processing data, it takes that raw 15 seconds of audio, processes it in the secure exclave, doesn't ever go to the cloud or leave your device unencrypted, but gives you a transcription or a summary of what you were just listening to. It's going to be hard to explain to the public without saying your watch is constantly listening to you. They're gonna try, but that's one of the features.

• 18:45Andrew Manganelli?

  I know you like the other one more, but that demo to me felt so much like the, what kind of dog is this? Where you're taking the picture of the dog and the person standing right there? Like.

• 18:54David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 18:55Andrew Manganelli?

  Please read me the specials again while the waiter is standing right here.

• 18:58David Imel?

  That was the example.

• 18:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Hey, I missed that.

• 19:00David Imel?

  Andrew, in our briefing about this, multiple people were like, why wouldn't you just say, can you say that again? I, and they were like, you know.

• 19:07Andrew Manganelli?

  15 seconds just seems too short. Like you're, the person's still there. You can just clarify.

• 19:12David Imel?

  Okay. Apple is clearly very, very, very nervous about these features. They are both put under the audio intelligence umbrella, which is a new thing they're doing because they already have visual intelligence, smart branding, but they are so nervous because this is the thing the public's going to freak out the most at.

• 19:28Speaker 02

  It's opt on, opt in.

• 19:29David Imel?

  In, it's gonna be in beta. It's like every question we would ask, they were like, we're not really sure. And so give us feedback when you use it and we'll see, we'll maybe adapt the way it works. So they are just, they are like, they're stepping on coals right now. They're being very, very careful.

• 19:47Andrew Manganelli?

  So that's.

• 19:47David Imel?

  I just want to say there's a giant blowback already with meta glasses.

• 19:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Having every watch in the world potentially recording people is going to make a lot of people a lot of.

• 19:56David Imel?

  I think very nervous.

• 19:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Meta glasses are videos and used to, people are wearing them in like bathrooms and stuff. That's way weirder than.

• 20:03David Imel?

  Than a private conversation where the person's wearing an Apple Watch.

• 20:05Andrew Manganelli?

  I'm not saying this is fantastic and I agree with David that this is a very, Apple, Apple knows privacy is their thing. They know they're trying to tiptoe on this and make it as safe as possible, but yes.

• 20:15Speaker 06

  I'm sorry, Andrew, can you say that one more time?

• 20:17Speaker 02

  As you hold up your wrist. Just to, real quick, the other feature is that if you have it enabled during the day, in a separate new tab in the Siri app, there's a recap button, which will show you all day a sort of a summary of some transcriptions and important things you may want to remember from your day. And once again, these are very difficult features to market without essentially saying your watch is always listening to you for your convenience.

• 20:44Speaker 02

  So, that being said, I hear all of this. And then you think about, what are these rumors we've all been seeing about like, oh, OpenAI is gonna come out with some piece of hardware and their angle is gonna be something where essentially it's listening to you all the time to deliver some feedback or some value to you with AI processing that information. That is at least looming on the horizon. And I think Apple, with all of these features in the watch, has decided that this is their way of offering the equivalent of that before the OpenAI device comes out. And trying their best with the privacy angle of, okay, with the S11 chip and the secure exclave and the encryption and all of the way that we're processing it.

• 21:27Speaker 02

  I need to get like an exact explanation of how this feature actually works and how they explain it to the public, just to see how it lines up. But that's the other theory, which is like, the Apple Watches are specifically, like, there are teams of people working on these products. And there's definitely a group in a room that's like, we kill whoop with this. And then there's definitely also a group in a room that's like, we get ahead of OpenAI's new thing with this.

• 21:53Speaker 02

  So it is fascinating to see them like nervously go, I guess we have to do this with the watch. And here it is.

• 22:00David Imel?

  They made a big deal about the privacy stuff, but a lot of it is like very hard to explain to the public and even to me, because I still don't really understand.

• 22:09Speaker 02

  I got texts from people that were like, I don't like that feature.

• 22:12David Imel?

  Wow, yeah.

• 22:13Speaker 02

  Just straight up, that's the one thing they didn't like.

• 22:15David Imel?

  They say, Apple does not create or store audio recordings, which I guess, what is a recording?

• 22:22Andrew Manganelli?

  What is a recording?

• 22:24David Imel?

  This is literally what is a photo, because it is taking, when we asked them about this, we're like, how do you do that? They're like, oh, we're looking for signals. And I was like, yeah, words are signals, bro. Like, I don't, I don't really understand.

• 22:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 22:38David Imel?

  They're kind of reworking the way that this is explained to people.

• 22:41Speaker 02

  I almost want to try to explain it now, but I almost know I'm gonna get part of it wrong. But it's like, there are always sounds happening and feeding into the microphone. Kind of the same way your Google Home sits on your desk at home.

• 22:52David Imel?

  Yes.

• 22:52Speaker 02

  And isn't technically always recording. Or the way your Pixel sits on your desk and isn't always listening all the time. But when either a song starts playing, or you say, hey, the magic, hey, G words, it, the technology is good enough to, without recording you all the time, understand that that is a trigger to start recording.

• 23:12Speaker 06

  No, but David is right though, because it is record.

• 23:16Speaker 02

  It is.

• 23:16Speaker 06

  There's a memory buffer being filled.

• 23:19David Imel?

  So I think this is the, I think this is the technicality, is it's the memory buffer.

• 23:23Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 23:23David Imel?

  They're like, it's not stored, but it's put in RAM, and then we dump it out of RAM.

• 23:28Speaker 02

  When you ask for it, or when it identifies a signal in it.

• 23:31David Imel?

  RAM is storage and storage is RAM, basically.

• 23:34Speaker 02

  Which is true, that's why they have to explain it very carefully.

• 23:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Also, every example you just gave, no one believes. Everyone thinks my phone is listening to me all the time.

• 23:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:43Andrew Manganelli?

  My home pod, or my Google Home is listening to me all the time. So we're just in the stage where we kind of assume if it has an on button, it's listening to us.

• 23:51Speaker 06

  I don't know, I'm thinking about this more, because we do know that a lot of those devices are, like, there've been enough like leaks of data centers, like, oh, recordings of people's homes have come out. But maybe there is a wacky, wacky world where none of this audio is getting written to a buffer, it's getting passed through an ADD converter, and every bit is getting analyzed in real time and then dumped.

• 24:12David Imel?

  That's what they say is happening.

• 24:14Andrew Manganelli?

  My thought was just, it's not storing audio recordings, it's just transcribing every time it hears words, and now I have a transcription of things. Does that count as an audio storage?

• 24:22Speaker 06

  I don't think you can do a transcription without filling a buffer. I think that needs to go backwards and forwards.

• 24:27David Imel?

  They have to process data in order to, yeah.

• 24:29Andrew Manganelli?

  It has to be processed if it's giving you a daily brief at the end of the day.

• 24:33Speaker 02

  They gave a lot of credit.

• 24:34Andrew Manganelli?

  To understand what you were saying.

• 24:35Speaker 02

  They gave a lot of credit to the S11 chip in their explanations of it, specifically in these watches, which is that there is this new part of the chip which does a lot of this processing, that doesn't touch the other parts of the chip or the other memory of the system, never goes to your phone, et cetera. So that's what I want to dig into and trying to understand how this all works. I will say, if there's any company that the general public might trust to pull this off, it's maybe Apple.

• 25:01Andrew Manganelli?

  It is why they can't mess it up.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  Which is, yeah, why it's important that they explain it clearly, et cetera.

• 25:05David Imel?

  Which is why they called it a secure exclave too, that's like the whole reason it's an exclave and an enclave, because it's like separated from the rest of the chip.

• 25:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:13David Imel?

  And they have like an always-on processor going on. They also made a big deal about the fact that you can never access the raw data. Like, there is no way to access like the sound data that is happening either from a third party, from Apple themselves, et cetera. There are no speaker labels, so like when you get those transcriptions and stuff, they don't want you to be able to be like, oh, Andrew said that, or David said that. And that's, I think, a big deal because people, like, again, it's not only the person that's wearing the watch that has to be nervous, it's everyone around you. Like, when you see meta glasses and you're like, oh, God. They, Apple doesn't want a situation where people see an Apple Watch and they're like, I can't say anything.

• 25:47Speaker 02

  That would be worst case.

• 25:49David Imel?

  That would be worst case. It's also ended in encrypted. The other thing is, they said, you can set it up so that it only goes during certain times of the day, or during certain focus modes.

• 25:59Andrew Manganelli?

  That was the most confusing to me, because if I remember correctly, in the event, they said something like, you control when it's on, which to me immediately says, record, stop recording.

• 26:10David Imel?

  Which there is a button.

• 26:11Andrew Manganelli?

  There is, yeah. And that's, that's like a plod, a meeting notes, kind of like AI device thing of like, let's do this conversation.

• 26:18David Imel?

  Plod's the first one you went to?

• 26:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, probably because they've sponsored the podcast before, disclosure. But, but then it was like, oh, or maybe you just don't want it running at night. I was like, hold on, that's a very different thing.

• 26:31David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 26:32Andrew Manganelli?

  So this means it's running, and now you, you set up when you don't want it running.

• 26:36David Imel?

  Recording, running.

• 26:37Speaker 06

  No, this is good though, because now we can definitively know there's no ghosts. We're right on the edge. If it's running all night, paranormal activity could have never been made.

• 26:47Speaker 02

  Can you imagine waking up and seeing like an AI summary that's like, ghosts were having conversations?

• 26:51Speaker 06

  That's what I'm saying, now we'll know. Also, quick correction.

• 26:54David Imel?

  I sleep talk every night.

• 26:55Speaker 06

  The most Apple way possible, the secure enclave was actually part of M4 and A18.

• 27:01David Imel?

  But this is an exclave.

• 27:03Speaker 06

  Sorry, exclave, I misspoke. But I think they just declined to mention it until, until this generation.

• 27:10David Imel?

  I know they have a new part of the processor that is separate from the rest of the chip.

• 27:14Speaker 06

  Totally, but I think they've been doing this processing on a separate part of the chip since M4 and 18. I'm like trying to find the exact confirmation, but when you Google around Apple Exclave, there's articles a year and a half old about it.

• 27:27David Imel?

  Okay, interesting, yeah. Well, this is all under the audio intelligence umbrella. So they are going to be walking very slowly, testing this stuff, it's opt-in, you can decide when to have it on. I do think that having it on in certain focus modes is kind of a cool idea. And again, this is a direct shot at all the dedicated AI hardware. And I think that there's a lot of things throughout this event, and we'll get to more of it.

• 27:50Speaker 02

  The first 20 minutes.

• 27:51David Imel?

  The first 20 minutes, where it felt like John Turnus was just like, yeah, you guys could go do your fun little thing. Like, he talked, okay, he talked about the phone, he said that the phone was something else, what did he call it, your intelligent, personal hub. That's what he called it. And I completely agree with that, because I've always called my phone David's PDA, because you know how you name your phone? Because phones are not just phones, they're, they're everything now, right? So his point was like, all the, we have a bunch of computers all over your body, and they can do everything that this dedicated AI hardware can do. So why would you ever buy that? And I feel like, to your point, Marquez, of getting ahead of OpenAI, he's just trying to plant that in people's heads. You don't need dedicated hardware.

• 28:32Speaker 02

  And I tend to think he's right.

• 28:34David Imel?

  I do.

• 28:34Speaker 02

  Like, this is what, this is what happened when I reviewed the Humane pin, which is, and we talk about Humane all the time, but their fatal flaw slash decision they had to make was, do we want this product to live alone without ever having to talk to your phone? Because one, we know we're not Apple and we cannot talk to the phone the same way Apple accessories can. And two, if we want this product to be used all the time and to collect all the information and whatever, we want the user to wear it all day and have it actually be useful, we need it to be with them even when their phone's not with them, and useful even when their phone's not with them. And so it has to live separate from the phone. As soon as it lives separate from the phone, it loses all the context of the phone, doesn't know any of your contacts, doesn't know any of your history, doesn't know any of your

• 29:18Speaker 02

  information, and it has to do all of that. And that was where it was doomed. And that's why my conclusion and a lot of other people were like, oh yeah, smartphones are still pretty great, and they can, they are a better starting point for whatever AI assistance you want in your life.

• 29:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Two things, one, I think Humane had like 17 fatal flaws, let's not just say it's one thing.

• 29:38Speaker 02

  But I do think that was like one of the fundamental ones, yeah.

• 29:41Andrew Manganelli?

  And yeah, it's, everyone keeps talking about dedicated, we're gonna get this dedicated AI thing. Apple's like, we're on every single person in the US pretty much already, we can just add this stuff to it, and you're wearing it already.

• 29:52David Imel?

  And the entire, the only thing that makes all of this new wave of AI stuff work is context. And every single piece of digital context that goes through your life goes through your freaking phone.

• 30:03Speaker 02

  Already on your phone.

• 30:04David Imel?

  You can't just do that with a new piece of hardware. Like, you'd have to fully commit every single service in your life to going through this new piece of hardware, which no one can do.

• 30:13Andrew Manganelli?

  And carry it with you all the time.

• 30:14David Imel?

  Carry it with you all the time. Like, OpenAI is supposedly, allegedly, making a speaker that you're supposed to carry around with you. Like, come on, guys. It's a Bluetooth speaker that you carry around with you?

• 30:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:25Andrew Manganelli?

  Wifi speaker, David.

• 30:28David Imel?

  Wi-Fi speaker. Okay, we, I want to just really quickly mention the actual physical new changes to the watches before we move on. So, Series 12, there's new ceramic, which Brandon is super happy about.

• 30:41Speaker 02

  So is Rich.

• 30:42Andrew Manganelli?

  So is Rich, yeah.

• 30:43Speaker 02

  Sort of.

• 30:43David Imel?

  Which is very happy about. They have a pearl white version and a night blue version. They're much more expensive. They're $8.99.

• 30:49Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 30:50David Imel?

  As opposed to the $3.99 of the aluminum. There's also a, there's new, two new natural options for the aluminum, which is like a natural gold and a one that's just called nat- it's radiant gold and one's just called natural. Those are 300 bucks more than the, the regular one, which is, they're all kind of expensive.

• 31:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, the ceramic's more expensive than the Ultra 4?

• 31:10David Imel?

  Yeah. No, it's the same. Oh, yeah, it is.

• 31:12Speaker 02

  100 bucks more than the base, yeah.

• 31:14David Imel?

  So that's kind of crazy. I don't know. Whatever.

• 31:16Speaker 02

  They're doing the thing where they offer a whole bunch of prices, a whole bunch of colors and finishes, and you just kind of pick which one you like. We saw a band for the watch Ultra that was titanium. It's an Hermes titanium band. It was $2,200 for the band?

• 31:31Andrew Manganelli?

  That happens every year.

• 31:32David Imel?

  That's it?

• 31:32Speaker 02

  You can, you can get in there deep with those, those watch bands, man.

• 31:36David Imel?

  Okay, Ultra 4.

• 31:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Wait, real quick, just on Series 12.

• 31:38David Imel?

  Yes.

• 31:39Andrew Manganelli?

  Rich noticed very specifically that it seems like the crown is almost like offset in all the stuff they showed on it. Did it, did you guys notice that at all?

• 31:46Speaker 02

  Offset in what way?

• 31:47Andrew Manganelli?

  It's like, it's always like sitting flush right across the, I'm doing hand gestures on a podcast. You could almost see the gap.

• 31:55Speaker 06

  There was a gap between the bottom of the crown and the wall of the watch and the, in the renders that they had in the event.

• 32:00David Imel?

  We'll have to look at that when we get it.

• 32:02Speaker 06

  It's so miniscule. Large gap, but it was, the, the crown was not flush against the body of the watch.

• 32:07Andrew Manganelli?

  It's one of those things where you see this for 12 generations. You're like, wait a minute, that looks different.

• 32:11David Imel?

  I also need to take a look at some, something I noticed during the hands-on time is it seemed like the bezels were slightly bigger, but I think what I, I was doing research on this and what it actually seemed like was that they made the body slightly larger of the, of the, and so the bezels feel bigger compared to the display. But I do think it's notable that the new Apple Watch wallpaper, that like built-in wallpaper is just a black OLED screen with like a few pieces of information. And it seems like every time they do that, it's to hide the bezel size. So we'll check that out when we actually get it, but, you know.

• 32:43Speaker 02

  I'm not too worried.

• 32:44David Imel?

  I'm not too worried, but, okay, Ultra 4, same $800 price. It has a larger battery. Now they say over two days of battery life, which I think is a big deal for them. And specifically aimed at Garmin and a couple of these other companies. They now have a max extended workout mode, which gives you 45 hours of battery life, which they said is enough for ultra marathon.

• 33:05Speaker 02

  They hit us with 100 mile run.

• 33:06David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:07Speaker 02

  They're like, this is good enough for running 100 miles, which I think is the final boss. I don't think you get any more intense of a long workout than this will last you a 100 mile run.

• 33:17David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:17Speaker 02

  So I think we've done it.

• 33:18David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 33:19Speaker 02

  I think we've gotten there.

• 33:20David Imel?

  And I think this is funny because when the first Ultra came out, if you remember, we interviewed, um, Hella.

• 33:25Speaker 02

  Hella, yeah.

• 33:26David Imel?

  And he specifically was like, yeah, I have to pass my Apple Watch off to my team to charge while I'm running because it won't last 100 miles. So I feel like this is like directly targeted at those people who have to buy other devices specifically for one task.

• 33:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:41David Imel?

  Which is just, you know, funny and whatever.

• 33:43Speaker 02

  You can hot swap Apple Watches.

• 33:46David Imel?

  You can?

• 33:47Speaker 02

  Yeah. Did you know that?

• 33:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Marcus is the only person that knows that in the whole world.

• 33:52Speaker 02

  I don't, oh, that's a good point. Probably not during the exercise.

• 33:54David Imel?

  You have to probably end the exercise.

• 33:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, you probably lose like 10 seconds of data.

• 33:57David Imel?

  Yeah. Well, yeah, but then you start a new workout and it's like, why is your heart rate 300 bpm? Uh, are you dying? Okay. We have so much left to get to, um, but we really have to take an ad break, so.

• 34:08Speaker 02

  Let's take a quick break, which means, we didn't forget. It's time for trivia.

• 34:18David Imel?

  This is crazy. You guys don't know, but for some reason the audio for us is like 2-bit.

• 34:22Speaker 06

  There's like a loose cable somewhere. That's like the only explanation.

• 34:25David Imel?

  And it's hilarious.

• 34:26Speaker 02

  It sounds like there's someone in the next room playing the sound.

• 34:31Speaker 06

  We'll see, we'll see.

• 34:32Speaker 02

  I'm so scared of where you're paying attention to every year.

• 34:34Speaker 06

  Here's the thing. You guys were paying attention. I've rewritten this question like three times because my question was just discussed, so.

• 34:41David Imel?

  Oh.

• 34:42Speaker 06

  Way to go. But I do have one.

• 34:45David Imel?

  Okay.

• 34:45Speaker 06

  Early on in their event, Apple noted how many Siri requests they get per day.

• 34:50David Imel?

  Oh, they did.

• 34:52Speaker 02

  Did they?

• 34:52Speaker 06

  Prices.

• 34:54Speaker 02

  And I remember when they said it, I was like, are all of those intentional or close?

• 34:58Andrew Manganelli?

  I was doing, oh, that's a good point.

• 34:59Speaker 06

  That's a good point.

• 35:00Andrew Manganelli?

  I was trying to do the math. It's like, is this only like averaging two people, two requests a day?

• 35:05Speaker 06

  Whoa.

• 35:05Speaker 02

  Anyway. How many?

• 35:07Speaker 06

  Prices right rules. How many times do people query Siri?

• 35:10David Imel?

  Is that like the amount of total Siri requests they get?

• 35:13Andrew Manganelli?

  Yes. Not individual people, total requests they get in a day.

• 35:17Speaker 02

  They did say it.

• 35:18Speaker 06

  They did say it.

• 35:18Speaker 02

  I was, I just want to tell you, I was paying attention.

• 35:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, you can prove it.

• 35:23Speaker 02

  I just don't remember this number at all.

• 35:25Speaker 06

  I've written this question so many times because you guys were actually paying amazing attention.

• 35:29Speaker 02

  My, my, uh, my knowledge of the Apple keynote is like in these chunks of like hyper-focus and then taking a quick 12-second break to live tweet and write things down. And then hyper focusing. That's where I'm scared of the question being because then I'm hyper focusing and I'm like, I know I just heard something interesting 12 seconds ago. I don't have the feature on my watch. I have no idea what they said.

• 35:51David Imel?

  When I was, when I was writing the podcast last night, the notes, I went back and like watched the different segments of the keynote and I was like, I don't remember this.

• 35:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:59David Imel?

  Because we're just, yeah, we're like taking quick photos, tweeting, we're like taking notes and like you, you're not paying as much attention.

• 36:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Our TV turned off halfway through and one turned back on.

• 36:08Speaker 06

  Yeah, we had to like emergency switch to a laptop. Also, the TV, we, we were so confused because the TV had really bad color accuracy and so it looked like John Ternus was wearing all black. And then we flipped on-

• 36:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Kept seeing like screenshots.

• 36:22Speaker 06

  Or like we'd flip on Speed Stream and he was wearing a red shirt and we were like, is there an outfit change that we have yet to get to?

• 36:29Speaker 02

  Wow. That's wild. Anyway.

• 36:31Speaker 06

  A burgundy.

• 36:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Where are you paying?

• 36:33Speaker 06

  They missed out. I know we have to go to, I wish they called it Ox Blood. I think that was.

• 36:38Speaker 02

  It's for sure one of the code names.

• 36:41David Imel?

  That would be amazing. Okay.

• 36:43Speaker 02

  Anyway, we'll think about that. Answers will be at the end like usual. We'll be right back.

• 36:46Speaker 06

  Ox Blood.

• 36:56Speaker 01

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• 37:27Speaker 05

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• 37:50Speaker 05

  Payday bars have a bone to pick with the other candy bars. Enough with the toppings and layers and stuff, kay? Payday bars are just salty crunchy peanuts and sweet caramel. Delicious. Payday Peanut Caramel Bar.

• 38:06Speaker 02

  All right, welcome back. You've made it this far into the podcast. You deserve iPhone chalk. Talk?

• 38:10David Imel?

  Chalk.

• 38:11Speaker 02

  I'm gonna start that over.

• 38:12Andrew Manganelli?

  I like that.

• 38:13David Imel?

  Why? I'll take chalk.

• 38:14Speaker 02

  All right, chalk. We're talking. No, you deserve the iPhone talk. iPhone 18 Pro, Pro Max and iPhone Duo. I guess since we're doing an order of most changes, we should save the, the fold for last. So the 18 Pros.

• 38:28David Imel?

  18 Pros.

• 38:28Speaker 02

  There's only a few really significant changes, and if you want to even call them significant, like new colors, they always do that. They have the obvious new one, which is-

• 38:37David Imel?

  They have two obvious.

• 38:38Speaker 02

  Ox Blood is what we're calling.

• 38:40Speaker 06

  Yeah, it's a, it's like a, it's like the color of leather, like you stain leather Ox Blood.

• 38:44Speaker 02

  I think it's a good visual for people, but it's also burgundy. It's like deep wine red.

• 38:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Wine.

• 38:48Speaker 02

  Wine red. Yeah. So that's, I think that feels like the flagship new color. There's also a glacier, which is like David's pants, maybe lighter than, it's like light blue, sky blue.

• 38:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 38:58Speaker 06

  Sky blue.

• 38:59Speaker 02

  Silver.

• 38:59David Imel?

  Calvin Valley is the same as ours.

• 39:01Speaker 02

  Exactly. Silver and

• 39:04Andrew Manganelli?

  And silver is a little

• 39:05David Imel?

  The silver is better.

• 39:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 39:07Speaker 02

  You're right.

• 39:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Ellis disagrees with you, but the silver is better.

• 39:09Speaker 02

  It's more uniform. Cause the last, the last silver one had like the glass cut out for wireless charging and everything was white.

• 39:15Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 39:16Speaker 02

  Now it's just more uniform.

• 39:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Closer color match.

• 39:19Speaker 06

  I liked my two-tone iPhone. I thought that was

• 39:21Andrew Manganelli?

  Ellis called it the panda yesterday. I was like, you don't, you don't understand.

• 39:24David Imel?

  You cannot, no.

• 39:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. There have been panda phones.

• 39:26Andrew Manganelli?

  There's a panda phone and it's a Pixel.

• 39:28Speaker 06

  I had a panda iPhone 4S when my fingerprint reader went bad and I replaced it with a white one.

• 39:34Speaker 02

  See, you see, you keep saying panda, but like that's some contrast. We used to have panda phones.

• 39:38Andrew Manganelli?

  That's true.

• 39:39David Imel?

  Like the

• 39:40Speaker 02

  The Pixel 2 was

• 39:41Speaker 06

  Crossing the Oregon Trail.

• 39:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Pixel 2 days, we were crossing the Oregon Trail, bro.

• 39:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, I felt like it.

• 39:47Andrew Manganelli?

  There was a lot going on back then.

• 39:48Speaker 02

  You could squeeze your phone back then.

• 39:50Andrew Manganelli?

  That's We had a few years before.

• 39:52Speaker 02

  Anyway, yeah, new gray silver. But there's also a all matte black phone and I just gotta say, that's the one that's calling my name. A lot of people have been asking me, I'm just spoiling it now. Are you gonna get a fold, Marquez? I think I'm gonna get a matte black Pro.

• 40:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Damn.

• 40:05Speaker 02

  Uh, so there's new colors.

• 40:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Second time he's mentioned the only thing he cares about.

• 40:08Speaker 02

  I just wanna make it clear, that's what's selling me.

• 40:10David Imel?

  What is it about phone manufacturers this year and making matte black? Cause Google did it too.

• 40:14Speaker 02

  They are finally listening to me.

• 40:17Andrew Manganelli?

  It only took

• 40:19Speaker 02

  They tuned in. They're tuned in. Yeah.

• 40:22David Imel?

  Fair enough.

• 40:22Speaker 02

  New chip inside, so A20 Pro chip. So we, again, we're just getting the pro phones, no baseline phones. So A20 Pro chip, it's a 2 nanometer chip now.

• 40:30David Imel?

  Speed's favorite feature.

• 40:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I just want to really quickly, we didn't mention that Speed was here.

• 40:35Speaker 02

  Speed was here.

• 40:35Andrew Manganelli?

  The couple of clips we saw from his stream were very funny.

• 40:38Speaker 02

  It is truly

• 40:40Andrew Manganelli?

  He put into it.

• 40:40Speaker 02

  He is a great example of free will, man.

• 40:42David Imel?

  He's so good.

• 40:43Speaker 02

  He, he, he went up to John Turnus, took the phone out of his hand and did a backflip. In the hands-on area. That was amazing. I just wanna say

• 40:52Andrew Manganelli?

  What Adam's referencing is, he's like looking at the fold on the, in the hands-on, on the like thing. And he just goes, it's so thin. It's, it's so thin. It's because of the A20 and all the compatible components. And uh, C2. And I was like, you are the greatest entertainer ever alive.

• 41:09David Imel?

  That's the equivalent of Jimmy Fallon going

• 41:11Speaker 02

  Tender is actually exactly the equivalent. Yeah.

• 41:15Speaker 06

  The C2 is a modem, right? Like no one has ever made a modem entertaining.

• 41:19Speaker 02

  I can see that he, he probably got pre, anyway, he, he was

• 41:23Andrew Manganelli?

  You watched the whole event.

• 41:24Speaker 02

  He was doing his best. Yeah.

• 41:26David Imel?

  But it's like based on the M6, cause the M6 was 2 nanometer. So they're using that technology, that process.

• 41:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:32David Imel?

  Six core CPUs, two super cores and four efficiency cores.

• 41:35Andrew Manganelli?

  What is a super core?

• 41:36David Imel?

  Okay.

• 41:37Speaker 02

  It's just a high performance core. They did just rename the high performance.

• 41:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, this is the cores they renamed.

• 41:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:42David Imel?

  Yeah. Super core. Seven core GPU, which they says has, which they say has up to a 40% performance increase. That is sort of a nebulous idea, like a 40% GPU performance increase. Do you get more frame rates on games? Do you get higher fidelity?

• 41:59Speaker 02

  A lot of these kind of feel like unlabeled graphs. We'll talk about the vapor chamber in a second. And one of the claims was like 50% more sustained performance.

• 42:09David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 42:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Compared to what?

• 42:10Speaker 02

  What? Like what does that actually mean?

• 42:12David Imel?

  Yeah, right.

• 42:13Speaker 02

  We will, we will find out. Is that longer? Is that higher threshold? Whatever. We'll find that out.

• 42:17David Imel?

  They had a separate neural, a second neural engine. So now they have 32 cores in their neural engine as opposed to 16. They're clearly trying to get in early with the AI stuff. They're trying to, like we said, they're trying to cut off the knees of everyone at the AI company. Or shoot an arrow in their knee or something.

• 42:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Where's this metaphor going?

• 42:35David Imel?

  It's about Skyrim.

• 42:37Speaker 02

  I'm sorry.

• 42:38David Imel?

  I was on Facebook yesterday and I saw a really cringe Facebook post I made when I was like 14. Um, and it was about

• 42:44Speaker 06

  Do you care to share with the class?

• 42:46Speaker 02

  It was definitely an arrow in the

• 42:47David Imel?

  It was arrow in the knee joke.

• 42:48Speaker 02

  Nice.

• 42:49David Imel?

  Which is not funny anymore.

• 42:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 42:51David Imel?

  Yeah. Okay. 50, I don't know. 50% increase in memory bandwidth. And it's, it's a new package. It's a new CPU or a new SOC package. It is actually physically wider than the A19.

• 43:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 43:05David Imel?

  That doesn't really matter to most people.

• 43:06Speaker 02

  They explained it as moving the memory off of the top of the CPU to directly next to the CPU, which obviously we don't think about that as meaning all that much, but that packaging means that they can more directly cool the CPU with that vapor chamber.

• 43:21David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 43:21Speaker 02

  And it's still being right next door. It makes it still accessible. I, I heard a really good analogy yesterday, which is like thinking about these, these CPUs as, or these system on a chips as like Manhattan real estate. Every little bit of it is so important. And if you wanna move something around or add something, you really have to consider everything around it.

• 43:40David Imel?

  Right.

• 43:40Speaker 02

  So the die getting a little bit bigger, but also being 2 nanometer, kinda balanced out, um, the fact that they're moving things around.

• 43:48David Imel?

  Which is funny to me, cause I remember when they invented stacked memory and they made a big deal about

• 43:52Speaker 02

  It was a big deal.

• 43:52David Imel?

  The RAM is closer to the chip, so you can move the data faster, et cetera. And now they separated it again, but I assume that they were like

• 43:59Speaker 02

  Right next door.

• 43:59David Imel?

  Yeah, it's right next door. They're neighbors. Yeah.

• 44:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:02David Imel?

  So yeah, they made a big deal about the better vapor chamber. Last year, if you remember, was the big vapor chamber year. That was like one of the big things about the 17 Pro.

• 44:11Andrew Manganelli?

  No, no, it was orange too.

• 44:12David Imel?

  It was also orange or clementine or whatever. They did also a big deal about the new vapor chamber, which is 3X larger.

• 44:20Speaker 02

  Three times the surface area.

• 44:21David Imel?

  The surface area.

• 44:22Speaker 02

  And essentially the entire mid-frame of the phone is, is thermal, like vapor. It's not, it's not all vapor chamber, but the whole mid, middle section of the phone is to, designed to wick heat away from the CPU.

• 44:35David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 44:36Speaker 02

  Which is a lot.

• 44:37David Imel?

  Which they say is 40% better. Again, better is a nebulous term. The battery life is quoted as being way better. They said that the 18 Pro now has 24 hours of usage. What, something I did appreciate. They, they quoted video playback and then also use, general use.

• 44:55Speaker 02

  Mixed use?

• 44:56David Imel?

  Mixed use, which is good, cause video playback, as we know, video decoding is now basically the easiest possible thing for a phone to do. And so they can quote 45 hours of video playback on the Pro Max, but they also gave mixed use. So mixed use, 18 Pro is 24 hours of usage, 18 Pro Max is 30. They said that, uh, the Pro basically has the same battery life as the Pro Max had last year.

• 45:20Speaker 02

  That's the thing that most contextualizer for me.

• 45:22Andrew Manganelli?

  That was the best. They also, they didn't just say this is better. They said this is the greatest iPhone battery increase ever.

• 45:29David Imel?

  Specifically on the Pro Max.

• 45:31Andrew Manganelli?

  On Pro Max.

• 45:31David Imel?

  On the Pro Max. Um, so that's a big deal. It does charge faster. They didn't give us wattage numbers. Uh, I'm excited to, you know, attach the little dongle thing that shows the wattage.

• 45:40Speaker 02

  Screen. Yeah.

• 45:41David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 45:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I ask a question about that?

• 45:43David Imel?

  Yes.

• 45:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Not that specifically, the batteries.

• 45:44David Imel?

  Yes.

• 45:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Is it silicon carbon?

• 45:46David Imel?

  They would not tell us. They, we asked this specifically, Marquez asked. They were like, it's a combination of the A20 chip. It's a combination of the thermal management and it's a combination of 2 nanometer. And we also elevated our battery technology.

• 46:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:02David Imel?

  So.

• 46:03Speaker 02

  And I wanted to ask, cause Apple famously doesn't give us capacities or like, or any of the numbers basically. So they're not gonna be like, yes, it's 80 watt charging with a 5600 milliampere battery. They're never gonna say that. So we're gonna get our hands on them and find out the numbers.

• 46:17David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 46:17Speaker 02

  But it is generally, I do think the 2 nanometer part is doing some heavy lifting on a lot of what's new with these chips. Which is exciting.

• 46:25David Imel?

  Yeah. So they said 50% charge in 15 minutes, which actually seems pretty good. That's pretty good. And they, they said that across the phones, like often when it has a larger cell, it charges faster because the 0 to 50 or 0 to 70 is obviously going to be faster than like 70 to 100. So usually the Pro Max is like a little bit faster, but they just quoted this across both devices, which I, which I found interesting. So maybe they charge at different wattages. That's for battery life. Camera, the big change was the variable aperture, which is on just the main camera. They didn't change the camera sensors at all.

• 47:01David Imel?

  So they had to do something else. They did make the aperture on the main camera very slightly wider.

• 47:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:07David Imel?

  Which is something.

• 47:08Speaker 02

  I'm very interested in how much of a difference this makes. Because as some of you listening have already started banging to your keyboards, this is not a new feature. We have had variable aperture cameras on smartphone cameras before, as early as the Galaxy S9.

• 47:22Andrew Manganelli?

  This is funny. There's a couple of things in this event that have happened already and then we went away from it.

• 47:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 47:29Speaker 02

  But exactly.

• 47:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Can you tell real quick, you guys got to see?

• 47:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:33Andrew Manganelli?

  What are in Pro controls, the four different apertures you can choose from? Because all we saw was in automotive is at 1.8 and then at max it was F4.

• 47:41David Imel?

  Wow, tell me you didn't watch Marquez's video.

• 47:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Marquez's video also doesn't even say it out loud. He just shows it on the We need, someone saying out loud.

• 47:49Speaker 02

  I'll give you all the detail.

• 47:50Speaker 06

  You know, he was there in the room when Marquez recorded the video, right? He literally watched the video.

• 47:55Speaker 02

  So in Apple's camera app, you can dial between F1.48, F1.8, F2.8 and F4.

• 48:03David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 48:03Speaker 02

  And I was also told that third-party apps will have infinite granular control. They can give a slider. If there was a camera app that wanted to, they could give you a slider for aperture.

• 48:14Andrew Manganelli?

  David just exploded.

• 48:15Speaker 02

  So

• 48:15Andrew Manganelli?

  I wish it would go higher than F4 though.

• 48:17Speaker 02

  Yeah. So Apple, Apple give us those four. I imagine the infinite slider is between F1.48 and F4.

• 48:23David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 48:25Speaker 02

  That being said, I played with this for a little while with the 18 pros. I, you know, it's hard to tell. I didn't get a bunch of sample photos, but like when we, when we first saw this on Samsung's phones like eight years ago, whatever it was, it was like, you want an F1, like a wide open aperture to take like a close up, like a portrait photo and have a natural fall off. Or if you're shooting at night to let the most possible light in. But that's not always ideal when you want a lot in focus. Maybe you're taking a landscape shot. Maybe there's a ton of light and you just want to stop down so it's sharper and you don't have to have a 10,000 shutter speed or whatever. So that made sense intuitively, but then we shot with them and it didn't make that much of a difference.

• 49:04David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 49:04Speaker 02

  We fast forward now to 2026. These are bigger sensors. These are more advanced phone cameras. So I'm curious if I will actually notice that F1.48 on this iPhone sensor, wide open will actually give me like a natural falloff, which is actually wider than the previous iPhone. And then if F4 on some landscape shot or some high brightness shot that I don't need it to be wide open, will actually look sharper. I want to try.

• 49:29David Imel?

  I don't really care. I, I think that like what's interesting about smartphone cameras for a long time was like, everything was always in focus and that was the biggest difference between a smartphone camera and a real camera. Was depth of field basically automatically told you whether something was a professional camera or not. Eventually these sensors got bigger and bigger and now we have some, it still has sort of that, you know, it has that like, that look where it looks a little bit plasticky.

• 49:54Speaker 02

  Fringy.

• 49:55David Imel?

  Fringy, weird stuff. So now, yeah, you can do this. My, my take on why they did this is one, they needed something to change. Two, they know that the cam, that the sensors are going to get bigger and bigger. And when I look at whenever we reviewed like the Sony phones with the 1.0 type sensors. Sony did not optimize those well, like they either they're blown out or there's so much depth of field that nothing's in focus. Because it's just like really, really narrow. And I think Apple is just trying to get ahead of that and kind of like prepare for a world where.

• 50:26Speaker 02

  That's valid. I think that this, yeah, I think this variable aperture would make a, would make the biggest difference on the biggest sensor.

• 50:36David Imel?

  Yes.

• 50:36Speaker 02

  So like if we had the 1.0 type sensor, when we take like, I take a lot of like, in my testing anyway, like close ups of like things in my hand or like right in front of me, just to see what the falloff is like. And I'll take a photo and part of the object I'm taking a picture of will be slightly out of focus.

• 50:51David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 50:51Speaker 02

  Which is annoying. It looks worse. And I think if you stop down that photo to F4, it looks much better.

• 50:57David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 50:57Speaker 02

  So, yeah, I don't know. Honestly, the biggest difference I saw was like the point lights. The little point lights, when I change the aperture, it would change to a different number of points on the star.

• 51:07David Imel?

  Yeah. So there are.

• 51:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, I was just saying, we were talking about this last night. It feels so similar to SA and S9 where the phones are exactly the same and they're just like, we need to change something, variable aperture. This is the iPhone 17 with some incremental upgrades and a variable.

• 51:22David Imel?

  I very much think that's mostly the case because.

• 51:25Speaker 02

  Matt Black, don't forget Matt Black.

• 51:26David Imel?

  Matt Black. A lot of their advertising and like even John Turner's before the event tweeted this like little video of this aperture skylight closing and like, like it was like blown out and then it condenses the light into a little circle. It seems like they needed something to be like, it's different, it's different, it's different. And this will be useful in the future and I wish that Sony would implement this in their phones too. I wish like eventually all, all smartphones are going to need variable aperture if you don't want everything to be out of focus. But yeah, for now it's basically pointless. It was crazy how big of a difference it is from like, if you change to F4, suddenly the sun stars are like, really sharp sun stars.

• 52:06David Imel?

  Generally with large lenses and large sensors, you don't really get that sun star until you stop down to like, F8, F9.5, F11, something like that.

• 52:16Speaker 02

  Yeah. That's just like the, this is so in the weeds, but like how many blades the aperture is.

• 52:21David Imel?

  If you have more aperture blades, it creates more of a circle.

• 52:23Speaker 02

  Did they say how many blades is?

• 52:24David Imel?

  There are six.

• 52:25Speaker 02

  Six.

• 52:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 52:26Speaker 02

  They weren't pretty in depth.

• 52:28David Imel?

  I did not notice that. I did not hear that. Yeah, there are six. They're, they said they're thinner than a human hair, which is kind of crazy.

• 52:33Speaker 02

  They have to be.

• 52:33David Imel?

  I guess they would be because hair is not that thin, to be honest. I'm just gonna say it. Anyway, yeah. So, so if you, generally lenses that are more expensive have more aperture blades because when you close down the, they're.

• 52:47Speaker 02

  Stay spherical.

• 52:47David Imel?

  Yeah, they stay spherical. Um, I don't want to get, I could get way too.

• 52:51Speaker 02

  We are getting.

• 52:52David Imel?

  I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Yeah, I'm sorry. I was, yeah.

• 52:54Speaker 06

  Well, I have one question about the blades before we move on.

• 52:57Speaker 02

  I studied the blades, just so you know.

• 52:59Speaker 06

  You're a blade master? That sounds like a thing from somewhere.

• 53:02Speaker 02

  While you were.

• 53:04Speaker 06

  David, it's my Beyblade. Um, wow.

• 53:09Speaker 02

  I was studying.

• 53:09Speaker 06

  Can you hear or feel them moving in the camera?

• 53:14David Imel?

  No, but it is, but you can see like when you press the, the aperture change buttons, you can see it like suddenly change. You can see the point lights like suddenly change. So it's really interesting. Yeah, I think it's pointless for now. I, they like had some cool images where it's like, there was a person with like holding like, they had an earring and so there was like the light on the earring that was like a sun star. And I was like, sure, whatever.

• 53:38Speaker 02

  That feels like on the level of like that phone that had like the S in the, in the like reflection on the back.

• 53:43David Imel?

  The OnePlus phone where they just like.

• 53:44Speaker 02

  Where they noticed it while they were shooting and they were like, let's talk about that. Like, sure.

• 53:49David Imel?

  But something that is very fun and interesting, they added Pro Controls, which I really like. Pixel has had this for a while now, so Apple's finally bringing it. Now, it's interesting because they don't have like a separate Pro Control menu. It's just at the top. It's like they added all these little settings at the top that you can change. And they have things like white balance. They have things like aperture shutter speed. The shutter speed thing is cool. I wish you could do more than one second. You can only do one second, which is kind of annoying. But now you can do things like you can do a second long, a second long exposure and you can like whip the phone a little bit. So you kind of get this like motion blur effect. It's just like nice to have more control over those things. And every year, Apple is going to add a little bit more of Pro Control,

• 54:32David Imel?

  but without giving you everything that third party apps have access to. So that's super nice.

• 54:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I have a question about that.

• 54:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 54:39Andrew Manganelli?

  They said customizable Pro Controls. Can you move the like buttons around?

• 54:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think that. I was messing with this. You can, I was able to remove and add different ones, but I wasn't able to change the order.

• 54:51David Imel?

  Oh.

• 54:51Speaker 02

  I'm not sure if I was just doing it wrong, but yeah, I could, you could long press one and be like, I don't need the histogram. I don't need shutter speed, but I do want ISO and manual focus. So you could pop those in and you tap it and it would go into the spot. They were always in the same order.

• 55:02David Imel?

  Something that was pretty interesting to me was that in a very Apple way, the white balance was not in Kelvin. They had like, I saw the white balance. It changes dynamically. It didn't give, it didn't say like 2200 or whatever.

• 55:15Speaker 02

  Mine did.

• 55:16David Imel?

  Really?

• 55:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, at the bottom. And it would like abbreviate it. It would say like 5.2. And I would slide it. It was like 4.8. But then when you look down at the bottom, it would say that's 5200.

• 55:24David Imel?

  Oh, that's how they do it.

• 55:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 55:26David Imel?

  That's actually smart.

• 55:27Speaker 02

  Just to like have a tiny little, oh yeah, at the top, yeah, at the top where they're indicating it. Yeah, it's like 5.2.

• 55:32David Imel?

  5.2. And I was like, did they just like compress the like 2200 to 7800 into like.

• 55:37Speaker 02

  Just the 5.2K is what they wanted to say.

• 55:40David Imel?

  Okay. So anyway, Pro Controls are really helpful. Um, I believe that's probably just going to be an iOS 27 feature. I think people might've said that.

• 55:48Andrew Manganelli?

  They didn't have that.

• 55:49Speaker 02

  I'm gonna be, I'm curious.

• 55:51Andrew Manganelli?

  Camera control how many years ago? I assume it came with Pro Controls.

• 55:54Speaker 06

  No, that's, that's just for being annoying.

• 55:55David Imel?

  Yeah, that's just, or launching the camera.

• 55:58Speaker 02

  So you're saying it's an iOS feature? I'm curious if they put this on the base iPhones. Because in the, in the Pixel.

• 56:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Who are those?

• 56:06David Imel?

  I didn't see anyone.

• 56:07Speaker 02

  When we get the, you know, the new iPhone 18, will it have Pro Controls? I don't think so. Like in the Pro Pixels, we get the Pro Controls in just the Pro phones and you don't get it on the base Pixels.

• 56:16David Imel?

  That's possible because they call it Pro Controls and Apple basically hasn't, like they did put ProMotion in the regular phone.

• 56:23Speaker 02

  Only thing that ever made the jump.

• 56:24David Imel?

  Only thing, and it still isn't LTPO, the ProMotion. It's like, it's not 1 to 120 Hz.

• 56:31Andrew Manganelli?

  You really don't think they're gonna add that to the base iPhone?

• 56:32Speaker 02

  I don't.

• 56:33Andrew Manganelli?

  Just because of the word Pro?

• 56:34Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 56:34David Imel?

  I think it's.

• 56:35Speaker 02

  Just because of the word Pro.

• 56:36Andrew Manganelli?

  That's wild.

• 56:38David Imel?

  Something else that they have, they have the audio mix feature, which kind of like zones in on certain things.

• 56:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Please explain this to us. The demo of that was just like, here's a guy playing the piano and it switches like, he's still playing the piano.

• 56:50David Imel?

  Yeah, but it like isolates it more, I guess.

• 56:52Speaker 06

  I just thought that was like narratively and cinematically, one of the funniest things they've ever seen. Like this very like sleek, like serious Apple event. Like.

• 57:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, the song was weird.

• 57:05David Imel?

  Okay. The cinematic mode now gets 60 FPS, which they specifically, and I appreciate this from Apple. They mentioned, this is so you can slow it down 2X times. And I was like, yes, never watch 60 FPS video. Always watch 30 at, at 0.5 speed.

• 57:20Speaker 02

  Very important.

• 57:21David Imel?

  Time lapse, you can now do in 4K. That's cool. Smart focus tracking, this was sort of a, sort of competing against like dedicated cameras. Because things like, you know, a dedicated Sony camera or something will track the subject even when it moves, when it gets occluded. And they mentioned you can like tap on a person like playing soccer or whatever, and if it gets occluded, it will stay tracked on that person. Which is a big deal. Like, um, a lot of dedicated camera companies have been doing this recently. Other big thing, they are supporting Synth ID from Google. This is the standard that basically leaves an invisible watermark on an image that you can ask Gemini or whatever, if it's a real photo.

• 58:01David Imel?

  However, they spent a quarter second on that because they said, we support Synth ID, but also we have a new thing called Apple Reference Image, which they say signs data at a pixel level at time of capture. Private cloud compute becomes, private cloud compute creates an unalterable reference image like a digital negative. I do not yet understand how this works. So I do not want. Want to say this is great or this is bad, but I do want to look into it. So when we have more time, I'm going to dive deeper into this. Most Apple thing ever, it is the XKCD comic of there are 17 competing standards. Let's create an 18th competing standard.

• 58:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, but this is on the most popular camera in the world.

• 58:41David Imel?

  Yeah, but.

• 58:42Speaker 06

  It's at the pixel sensor level or something.

• 58:44David Imel?

  Yeah, whatever. Yeah.

• 58:46Speaker 02

  Surely.

• 58:46David Imel?

  At the sensor level.

• 58:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Real quick to explain how it works if people didn't see it is that you can, I guess, through your phone, be able to any picture, see what the original photo taken was to see if there are any changes made through AI. But actually like physically see it, unlike these other things, which is like AI was used in here.

• 59:03David Imel?

  Correct.

• 59:04Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's interesting because sometimes we get photos that are gonna say AI was used, but it might be like to get a bird out of the background or something. Or the far more malicious versions, we can see like that is not even remotely close to what this.

• 59:16David Imel?

  But I think the problem with this is like if someone takes a photo on their phone and then they alter it or whatever, they're the only ones that have the digital negative. So if they're the ones that are trying to, you know.

• 59:28Andrew Manganelli?

  I assumed the digital negative follows it all of the time, just like in.

• 59:33David Imel?

  Yeah. Well, probably only if it's like edited, if that, if that metadata follows the image, which would have to be like supported by other third party editing programs.

• 59:44Speaker 02

  We were talking about this where he said this would be great for like Safari to have a little thing that pops up. If you see an image that was a reference image and it'll have like a, this is a real picture.

• 59:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Right. I mean, maybe I shouldn't have assumed, but I just assumed this followed the picture wherever it goes. Otherwise it feels.

• 59:59David Imel?

  I think that's the goal of it is for everyone to support it.

• 1:00:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, my guess is it's in the, the data.

• 1:00:04Speaker 06

  That's a good point, David. Like if I upload a picture to ChatGPT and say like, you know, make me Batman or something like that, and then I download a JPEG from ChatGPT.

• 1:00:13David Imel?

  I doubt that will be.

• 1:00:14Speaker 06

  Like, will I be able to right click it and be like, show me the reference image?

• 1:00:17David Imel?

  I don't think so. We'll find out.

• 1:00:18Speaker 06

  But it's baked into the pixel sensors.

• 1:00:20David Imel?

  Yeah, it's baked into the pixel, but not the iPhone.

• 1:00:23Speaker 06

  If it, if it does work like that, there's a, we have an amazing short opportunity on our hands. Of like pushing photos like to their absolute extreme and then make, making people guess what the original.

• 1:00:33David Imel?

  Also, by the way, the thing that breaks all of these things is screenshots.

• 1:00:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Oh, damn.

• 1:00:39David Imel?

  I remember when, you know, when the Content Authenticity Initiative came out, and we did a whole video on the Studio Channel about how this works and CP, C2PA. You can just take a screenshot and it's gone.

• 1:00:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, but I think the thing is that moving forward, we probably shouldn't trust any image unless we see a watermark on it like that.

• 1:01:01David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Like just assume it's fake.

• 1:01:03David Imel?

  And I think the point of this is that when you post an image online, someone can say, that's not real. And then you can back it up with, I have this digital negative, Apple says this is real, whatever. So it is, it is good that they're doing something like this. Also good that they're supporting Synth ID.

• 1:01:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:19David Imel?

  Whatever.

• 1:01:20Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't think this is for like our pictures of like removing a bird. So it's a prettier picture. I think this is for like, events are happening. Look at what's happening. Like here's a real picture.

• 1:01:29Speaker 02

  You can be like, I can confirm that this is, if it goes through the correct way.

• 1:01:32Speaker 06

  It solves the problem that Synth ID creates where like, I, I've heard a lot of creators talk about posting photos on Twitter that get the AI edited thing. And it's like, the only AI edit was like, I boosted the exposure.

• 1:01:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, on Photoshop or something.

• 1:01:46David Imel?

  I had the label when I didn't do anything.

• 1:01:47Speaker 06

  Exactly. So now the label can have, if you're really curious, you can actually see for yourself like, oh no, this is essentially the image that was taken.

• 1:01:55David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:56Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that's better.

• 1:01:57Speaker 06

  I mean, what's a photo of my right guys, but.

• 1:01:59David Imel?

  It's kind of cool because when they showed the, the digital negative version, it was like without the Apple processing too. It was like a more basic photo.

• 1:02:07Andrew Manganelli?

  I was just gonna ask.

• 1:02:08David Imel?

  It doesn't look like the photo looks when you like take it and then Apple does the processing, does the smoothing, does the exposure boost, whatever.

• 1:02:14Speaker 02

  Let me get that with that.

• 1:02:15David Imel?

  I know. I was like, can I just use that?

• 1:02:17Speaker 06

  Wait, so there are shadows?

• 1:02:19David Imel?

  There are shadows. There are shadows. We got shadows, boy. Okay, last big thing, um, that is actually two things because Marquez and I got a really interesting demo with a microscope.

• 1:02:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, they didn't, as far as I can tell, they didn't say this in the keynote.

• 1:02:32David Imel?

  They didn't.

• 1:02:33Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:02:33David Imel?

  Yeah, it was wild.

• 1:02:34Speaker 02

  So the dynamic island on the Pros is 25% smaller. Neat. I think in the keynote, they mentioned now there's more room for three live activities up there instead of two.

• 1:02:44David Imel?

  Cool.

• 1:02:44Andrew Manganelli?

  So much room for activities.

• 1:02:46Speaker 02

  What we didn't really get the details on, which I do think is fascinating, is the way they're doing that is just by taking the infrared blaster, basically the Face ID cluster, the infrared, and moving that behind the display. And they actually move it over to the left hand corner.

• 1:02:59David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:00Speaker 02

  So there is a bit of a different like pixel pitch and pixel matrix over that circle where the Face ID hole is.

• 1:03:09David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:09Speaker 02

  You would never know looking at the phone.

• 1:03:10Andrew Manganelli?

  It's like, I, I was like, was I not paying attention when you kept reading this during A roll last night?

• 1:03:16Speaker 02

  It was, it's, it was genuinely a cool thing to know. And then we even got to like stare at it, like under a microscope, you can see the difference in pixels.

• 1:03:22David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:22Speaker 02

  It's just kind of like what we're about to talk about with Duo, which is there are less pixels there in the top left corner. And so if you are pixel peeping really, really hard, you can see that it's a little bit pixelated in the top left corner. That's how they achieve the smaller dynamic island.

• 1:03:36David Imel?

  This is basically the same technology that they use for under display cameras, where they basically just leave gaps between the OLED and then the camera can like fill in that information.

• 1:03:44Andrew Manganelli?

  You can see it on the under display camera on the Duo.

• 1:03:46David Imel?

  Yeah, because they.

• 1:03:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, that's a separate.

• 1:03:48Speaker 02

  That needs way more information. This is just infrared, so they didn't have to drastically remove as many pixels.

• 1:03:53David Imel?

  Yeah. So it's interesting that they put it in the top left corner. They showed us a little demo with two little Apple logos, like one on the denser OLED and one on the one with gaps. If you look really close, you can see it, but again, it's in the top left corner. And they said, because now, you know, the, the Face ID camera has always been pretty wide. I think it was like three generations ago of iPhone, they made it like a wider sensor. So if your phone's just like sitting on the table, it'll still recognize you. It still has that power. So I think that's pretty cool. It makes the dynamic island smaller. It, it's, yeah, it's 25% smaller, but it also looks like shorter. It's kind of like strange and weird. Yeah. Now they have three live activities. We said that, that was, that was basically it. I don't know. That's pretty good.

• 1:04:36Speaker 02

  So the Pros are a hundred bucks more.

• 1:04:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:38Speaker 02

  Uh, 1,200 for a Pro, 1,300 for a Pro Max.

• 1:04:41Andrew Manganelli?

  So are all the old phones.

• 1:04:42Speaker 02

  All of the catalog of old phones they're still selling, also basically all a hundred bucks more. So the price hikes finally hit iPhones.

• 1:04:48David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:50Speaker 02

  But they are no longer the highest end phones Apple sells.

• 1:04:53Andrew Manganelli?

  It's very funny though, because you can say, you can't say anymore like, oh, just wait till the new one comes out and you can get the old one for cheaper.

• 1:05:00Speaker 02

  It actually went up a hundred dollars.

• 1:05:02David Imel?

  Yeah, everything, everything's more expensive.

• 1:05:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:05:05David Imel?

  But we'll talk about the most expensive thing right after one more quick break.

• 1:05:09Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 1:05:10David Imel?

  Trivia time.

• 1:05:14David Imel?

  That one sounded like a jukebox.

• 1:05:15Andrew Manganelli?

  I was gonna say, I was getting used to it and then the.

• 1:05:18David Imel?

  The static.

• 1:05:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Swapped it.

• 1:05:19Speaker 06

  Yeah. Trivia. I spent so much time on this like special like version where it's the combined, no, didn't, yeah, whatever.

• 1:05:25Andrew Manganelli?

  I love it. Well, during the AirPods 5 announcement, the actress was in the train station looking at departures. And two of the cities that trains were going to were delayed.

• 1:05:35David Imel?

  Come on.

• 1:05:36Andrew Manganelli?

  What cities were those trains going to?

• 1:05:38David Imel?

  That's diabolical.

• 1:05:39Speaker 02

  In the background?

• 1:05:40Andrew Manganelli?

  No, no, it was in screen. There were two shots of it too. It showed it twice.

• 1:05:44Speaker 02

  She's looking at it.

• 1:05:44David Imel?

  Yeah. So it's a shot of her in the foreground and the board in the background.

• 1:05:47Andrew Manganelli?

  They changed to delayed and then it changes.

• 1:05:49David Imel?

  I remember that.

• 1:05:50Andrew Manganelli?

  To that shot again, and you can see in the background that the two cities are delayed.

• 1:05:54David Imel?

  I'm not gonna get this.

• 1:05:54Speaker 02

  This should be worth 15 points each.

• 1:05:56David Imel?

  I don't even remember this ad at all.

• 1:05:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Three points per city if you get it.

• 1:05:59Speaker 02

  It's not even worth me trying to guess.

• 1:06:01David Imel?

  That is the exact time to tune out mentally from the keynote when that is happening. Because I was paying attention to other things.

• 1:06:08Speaker 06

  There's a hint here because she was in Los Angeles Union Station, uh, which was one of the subway stations. I transferred it on my way to high school. So that station is.

• 1:06:16David Imel?

  So I'm crossing LA off the list.

• 1:06:19Andrew Manganelli?

  Delete.

• 1:06:19Speaker 06

  Yeah, yeah. No, but, but they are two cities that have trains from Los Angeles.

• 1:06:24David Imel?

  I was gonna say.

• 1:06:24Speaker 02

  That's a good hint. It's not gonna help me.

• 1:06:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Funny that Apple pretends there's public transit in California.

• 1:06:29Speaker 06

  Oh, go home.

• 1:06:31Andrew Manganelli?

  I will. It's in Northern California.

• 1:06:33Speaker 06

  I took Los Angeles' public transit to school every day for four years.

• 1:06:39David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:06:39Speaker 06

  It works.

• 1:06:40Andrew Manganelli?

  All right, Ford Motor Industries.

• 1:06:42David Imel?

  Well, we will again, learn at the end, those answers. We'll be right back.

• 1:06:56Speaker 02

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• 1:07:03Speaker 01

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• 1:07:20Speaker 01

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• 1:07:50Speaker 06

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• 1:08:05Speaker 02

  All right, welcome back. We last but not least, we should talk about the new form factor of an iPhone for the first time since it was introduced in 2007. There's a folding iPhone.

• 1:08:16Speaker 02

  It was the one more thing, but it was literally the biggest thing at the event, which is hilarious, but I enjoyed that anyway. So it's called iPhone Duo, starts at $2,000. I think we guessed maybe two episodes ago how much we thought this phone would cost, and I think all of us were over.

• 1:08:32Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, I think.

• 1:08:33David Imel?

  Well, there was, there was one podcast episode, I only know this because someone blue skied this at me, whatever that's called, skeeting. Where they, they said, wow, David, you guessed the price correctly. And I was like, I thought it was 2,400. And then there was apparently an episode many weeks ago where I said 2,000.

• 1:08:51Speaker 02

  Oh, all right.

• 1:08:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Weeks or years ago.

• 1:08:53Speaker 02

  It must have been a long time ago.

• 1:08:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Because someone also tweeted us that I think the first waveform episode ever, we were talking about the iPhone fold.

• 1:08:59Speaker 02

  Really?

• 1:09:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Something like that.

• 1:09:01Speaker 02

  Well, see, that's how long we've been waiting for this.

• 1:09:03David Imel?

  My expectations clearly creeped up, but yeah, the funny thing about this is it's still a $2,000 phone, but it feels affordable because of what we were expecting.

• 1:09:12Speaker 02

  Yeah. So the fundamentals of this phone are exactly what you've been seeing in the leaks and rumors. It is a smaller passport shaped book style foldable. It's a 5.4 inch display on the front. It's a one by 1.4 aspect ratio. 1.4, I believe notably is the square root of two, which is very important. When you open it, it is a 7.6 inch, oh, were you paying attention? Yeah, it's a 7.6 inch display, which is a 1.4 by one aspect ratio, but wide now. Yeah. They're both higher refresh rate, they're both bright. The outside has a corner cutout, there's no Face ID, there is just a Touch ID power button. The frame is titanium, it's a little heavier than some other folds. And then.

• 1:09:57Andrew Manganelli?

  Asymmetrical.

• 1:09:58Speaker 02

  It is asymmetrical at the front. This was a bigger deal to some, especially those who have used a bunch of foldables that are now basically all rectangular screens, but it's rounded on the right hand side and squared on the left hand side.

• 1:10:11Andrew Manganelli?

  Do you think that's why they call it Duo?

• 1:10:11Speaker 06

  I was waiting to ask that.

• 1:10:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Because it looks like a D?

• 1:10:14Speaker 02

  It kind of does look like the letter D.

• 1:10:16Andrew Manganelli?

  Hear the rumor of Duo till the last minute.

• 1:10:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:10:19David Imel?

  Yeah, I tweeted last week, it's kind of crazy that we don't know the name of this yet. And every reply was like, it's Ultra, you idiot. We've known this forever, it's Ultra.

• 1:10:28Andrew Manganelli?

  Marques shot a short last night right after A-roll and he goes like, it's the iPhone Ultra and puts it down like nailed that line. And we all paused for a minute. What'd you just say?

• 1:10:39Speaker 02

  I've been calling it the Ultra in my head. Yeah, so anyway, it is, yeah, it's that small, it's small size, 7.6 inches open. And there are many, many interesting little things about it that are different from some of the other foldables we have.

• 1:10:53David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:53Speaker 02

  The thing that we've all been comparing it to in our heads is the Samsung Galaxy Z Fold 8, which is also a small five and a half inch screen when it's closed and a seven and a half inch small rectangular screen when it's open. Dual cameras, like same idea of a phone.

• 1:11:07David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:08Speaker 02

  But there are, yeah, just a lot of little things that are different that we can sort of dive into each one. I tend to think almost every little thing about the fold is good and like well considered. And then there are just a small number of things that are a little odd to me.

• 1:11:22David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:23Speaker 02

  So, uh, let's just talk about the things that are different.

• 1:11:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:27Speaker 02

  Volume buttons are at the top of the phone. Not sure how they landed on that, but they're at the top instead of the right hand side. I think that's fine. I think that means you go right for higher volume, left for lower volume.

• 1:11:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:38Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that screams to me that this is a, like this is, turns into an iPad.

• 1:11:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:11:43Andrew Manganelli?

  It just really feels like an iPad when you do it on a iPad like that.

• 1:11:48Speaker 02

  Also on the outside of the phone, dual cameras, so it's an ultra wide, which is the same as the 18 Pro. And then a new 48 megapixel primary camera, which without much testing, I'm going to assume is on the same level as Samsung. It's like a smaller sensor, but it's the primary sensor.

• 1:12:02David Imel?

  Because it is even thinner than the iPhone Air when it's open.

• 1:12:05Speaker 06

  We're, we're so confused, all three of us who were in the hotel room watching the event, wrote down 12 megapixel telephoto.

• 1:12:12Andrew Manganelli?

  No, I figured it out after.

• 1:12:14David Imel?

  Yeah, during the keynote, they, they talk about that, but it's, it's just a digital crop.

• 1:12:19Andrew Manganelli?

  It's the same as the Air where it's a 48 megapixel main camera that then can be a bin to a 12 megapixel telephoto.

• 1:12:27Speaker 06

  Dude, I got fusioned.

• 1:12:28David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:28Speaker 02

  It's the fusion.

• 1:12:30Speaker 06

  I got freaking fused.

• 1:12:31David Imel?

  Confused.

• 1:12:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I said the wrong thing.

• 1:12:33David Imel?

  And it was about fusion.

• 1:12:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:12:35Andrew Manganelli?

  I said the wrong thing on Man on the Street, like to four different people.

• 1:12:38David Imel?

  Oh, no.

• 1:12:38Andrew Manganelli?

  And I'm just going to look like a moron.

• 1:12:40Speaker 06

  No, no, we both doubled down to like, no, we're pretty sure it's a standard and a telephoto.

• 1:12:44David Imel?

  I would have loved that, but no.

• 1:12:45Speaker 02

  But yeah, no, so that's that. And like you point out, it is thinner than an iPhone when it is open. So each half of it, sorry, iPhone Air, uh, which is probably why, uh, they didn't have enough room for Face ID in the, in the top of that thing. And so they did the fingerprint reader, power button.

• 1:13:01David Imel?

  I think it all can.

• 1:13:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Put in the MacBook, yeah, so yeah. I think it all confirms our thought of like iPhone Air is like one of the new fold that we're going to see. It's like, now we have two iPhone Airs with a haircut and.

• 1:13:12Speaker 02

  It even looks like it.

• 1:13:12Andrew Manganelli?

  It looks just like it.

• 1:13:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:14Andrew Manganelli?

  Can I tell you something that Marques told me on the way here that is a deal breaker? Was it in confidence? No. Okay. I was gonna say, do it anyways. There's no action button.

• 1:13:24David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:24Andrew Manganelli?

  That's crazy to me.

• 1:13:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:13:27David Imel?

  I don't use my action button as much as many of you do.

• 1:13:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Really?

• 1:13:30David Imel?

  I don't anymore.

• 1:13:31Andrew Manganelli?

  That is.

• 1:13:31David Imel?

  What?

• 1:13:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I used to use it more.

• 1:13:34David Imel?

  I was really into it the first year. I do, I mean, maybe we'll get more into this later, but you, you use it a lot.

• 1:13:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Well, every day.

• 1:13:40David Imel?

  When I had an iPhone.

• 1:13:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. I used it all the time. I ran my life through the action.

• 1:13:44David Imel?

  Adam, you gonna buy a Duo?

• 1:13:45Andrew Manganelli?

  Not anymore. I need the action button. That's like what I miss most about iOS was the action button.

• 1:13:50David Imel?

  Very interesting.

• 1:13:50Andrew Manganelli?

  And shortcuts.

• 1:13:51David Imel?

  Okay.

• 1:13:51Andrew Manganelli?

  But anyway. Can we talk about some of the software in the closed mode? I thought it was really interesting to see a dock on the right. The, why do I keep forgetting the name of the, like your wifi, your status icons, right? Are all in this like single like button now? They do a lot of cool software stuff in liquid glass that like right aligns everything. Sounds like you're gonna cut me off here.

• 1:14:13Speaker 02

  I thought it was a button too.

• 1:14:14Andrew Manganelli?

  It's not a button.

• 1:14:15Speaker 02

  It's not a button.

• 1:14:15Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:15Speaker 02

  It looks like a button. I pressed it many times, it doesn't do anything.

• 1:14:19Speaker 06

  It's round.

• 1:14:19Speaker 02

  You slide down, I know, it looks like a button. But when you slide down from the corner, then it expands and everything pushes down. I think you should be able to press it like a button.

• 1:14:27Andrew Manganelli?

  It's a button.

• 1:14:28Speaker 02

  It looks like one.

• 1:14:29Andrew Manganelli?

  It's, my thumb is attracted to it like a.

• 1:14:31Speaker 02

  There's about 15 seconds of me in 8K pressing it and nothing happening. I'm like, why is this not a button?

• 1:14:38David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:39David Imel?

  I have so many thoughts on the dock thing.

• 1:14:41Speaker 02

  Dock on the right.

• 1:14:41David Imel?

  God, okay, so it's such a good idea.

• 1:14:43Andrew Manganelli?

  Unless you're lefty.

• 1:14:45David Imel?

  Unless you're left-handed, in which case, become right-handed.

• 1:14:48Andrew Manganelli?

  You're holding it, you're holding it wrong.

• 1:14:49Speaker 06

  Can you not just like hold it upside down?

• 1:14:52Andrew Manganelli?

  I saw Marques said.

• 1:14:53David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:54Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know.

• 1:14:54David Imel?

  Well, then your selfie camera's on the bottom.

• 1:14:56Speaker 02

  Okay, okay, okay. Wait, I have to, I have to talk about this. I have to talk about this.

• 1:15:00David Imel?

  Okay, talk about the dock.

• 1:15:01Speaker 02

  This is what I like so much. Okay, macOS has a dock on the bottom, right? It is this area that you can technically use. If you use the, the full screen button, if you use the big green button, it fills the entire screen, full screen, whatever. But generally, most of the time, Windows and tabs and whatever are sitting above the dock. So it's this little area that's reserved for, you know, switching apps, doing these things, whatever, it's reserved. That's exactly what they did on the Duo, is that they left this little margin on the side of the screen that basically is a dock, which you can only have four icons. I wish you could have more apps, whatever.

• 1:15:38David Imel?

  Really bummed about that.

• 1:15:39Speaker 02

  But it makes it really easy to, to switch apps if you're right-handed. And when you're, when you have apps open and stuff like that, all of Apple's apps have now been redesigned to make it so all the toggles and stuff are on that side as well. They, something I noticed when I was using it is like a lot of notifications and stuff do not feel centered like they would on a regular iPhone where it comes in from the center. They're slightly to the left and at first your brain is like, this is kind of weird because it's offset. But you eventually kind of start to understand like, oh, this whole second, this whole side of the phone is just for interacting with.

• 1:16:16David Imel?

  You know what I'm getting flashbacks to?

• 1:16:17Speaker 02

  What?

• 1:16:18David Imel?

  The Samsung Galaxy Note Edge.

• 1:16:21Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, with the little.

• 1:16:22David Imel?

  Remember that phone?

• 1:16:23Speaker 02

  The stock ticker?

• 1:16:24David Imel?

  It was just a regular phone, rectangular, but then peeling off the right hand side of the phone was this little extra margin, which was like kind of a launcher and a clock and you could put little tickers in there.

• 1:16:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:35David Imel?

  Interesting.

• 1:16:36Andrew Manganelli?

  But that phone was terrible to use.

• 1:16:37David Imel?

  It was.

• 1:16:38Andrew Manganelli?

  No, I do, you're right. It's, it almost makes the actual content on the front fold a little more normal in terms of aspect ratio of a regular, because you just have this extra room for stuff. It would be awesome if the dock could be way bigger because you're dedicated in that room.

• 1:16:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:16:52Andrew Manganelli?

  But yeah, little buttons will come up, different things depending on what app you're in will all come right aligned.

• 1:16:56David Imel?

  And like, I'm sorry, software developers, because you're gonna have to make an iPhone Duo version of every version of your app with all the like buttons and stuff. But in the way that John Turner's like kind of describes what smartphones are now as a intelligent personal hub. Again, I love this idea that like it's a computer that you carry with you in your hand and in your pocket. And because of that, you have a dock, you have a usable area and you have a dock area. And I just think that's a really cool way to like rethink the idea of like a PDA or a smartphone that no one else has really done yet.

• 1:17:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Is there any way to hide the dock?

• 1:17:32David Imel?

  I couldn't find any dock customization.

• 1:17:34Andrew Manganelli?

  They're using all that, they're dedicating that space, so then it would just be empty. No, you can make it like, like an app full screen or something.

• 1:17:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:17:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Like you know how on, on Mac you can just.

• 1:17:43Speaker 06

  When apps are open, the dock is hidden, right?

• 1:17:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, the dock's hidden. Every app opens full screen, but as soon as you go home, the dock comes in from the right.

• 1:17:50Speaker 06

  No, this is, this is Apple, okay? It's a computer, but it's not like a computer.

• 1:17:54David Imel?

  Exactly, yeah. I don't know, yeah, I don't know.

• 1:17:56Speaker 02

  It's kind of like the same way on Android phones, or at least foldables, they slide the dock in from the bottom and then when you open an app, it hides. We've just gotten used to that coming up from the bottom because that's where docks usually are. But this one's on the right, it's more reachable.

• 1:18:08David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:08Speaker 02

  I want more customization of that dock.

• 1:18:10David Imel?

  For sure. 100%, 100%.

• 1:18:12Speaker 02

  So, yeah, that's really nice.

• 1:18:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:15Speaker 02

  You open the phone, you get this big, not huge, but bigger iPad mini type, uh, internal OLED display. And by the way, iPad mini is not OLED. It's just, this is the nicest seven and a half inch Apple display.

• 1:18:28David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:28Speaker 02

  And.

• 1:18:29Andrew Manganelli?

  You're talking about the animation?

• 1:18:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:18:30Andrew Manganelli?

  It's so. Good.

• 1:18:32David Imel?

  I know. It is maybe the most important piece of software on this phone.

• 1:18:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Which is so weird to say, but.

• 1:18:38David Imel?

  Every time I get excited about this, I feel like I'm a shill.

• 1:18:43Andrew Manganelli?

  I like literally can't think about it enough, like someone's gonna yell at me about thinking that.

• 1:18:46David Imel?

  It's such a basic thing, but for some reason, it's the most delightful possible thing. It does spark joy.

• 1:18:53Andrew Manganelli?

  People were describing it as like gradienting out, but when you really like look at it, so when it's closed and it opens, it's essentially leaving the screen behind and getting out of focus, right? And then because the screen feels like it stays there as you turn and see the screen on the interior, it's the same screen and you're like, whoa. And as you're opening it fully, you're starting to see the screen that's like invisible, that's it. And it snaps.

• 1:19:19David Imel?

  It makes you believe, it makes you believe that it's a real glass window.

• 1:19:23Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:24David Imel?

  Yeah, that you are just like moving this glass and it like, for some reason, there's the in-between animation that the, your eyes are collecting is like, as you're moving it and seeing that icon still being there.

• 1:19:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:37David Imel?

  It just makes it feel like you're opening a glass.

• 1:19:40Speaker 02

  Whoever was in charge of this animation cooked. Uh, I think this animation is really important for several reasons.

• 1:19:45David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:45Speaker 02

  One is you use the word glass, which is like liquid glass kind of falls into this. So like, that's convenient for them. But two is it intuitively gives you a little bit more of an understanding of the continuity that's happening, which is when you're closed, you have the thing that's on the single screen. When you open it, you kind of get an idea of I am extending something to the left of my current screen. So I'm like adding to the left.

• 1:20:07David Imel?

  Yes.

• 1:20:08Speaker 02

  So when it's open, whatever is on that right-hand screen, when you close it from the left, you are aware that that is what's going to stay on your screen.

• 1:20:14David Imel?

  It's still there. Yes, the continuity.

• 1:20:16Speaker 02

  So it's, it's, it's intuitive, but it helps you to understand what you're going to get when you close it.

• 1:20:21David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:22Speaker 02

  And it's very fast. And this, I didn't expect to hit me as hard as it did, but a lot of foldables, I've been using these for years. And Dave 2D talked about in his video, but we've just gotten used to there being a little bit of a delay. When you close a foldable, there's just a beat and then it's ready to go.

• 1:20:36David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:37Speaker 02

  And you open it and there's a beat and it's ready. And there's just a little beat. And sometimes there's like a fun animation, like butterfly wings or whatever on your wallpaper or something. Uh, but this one, by the time I like swivel it open as fast as I can, like the inside screen's already open. And by the time I close it, by the time I start to see the outside screen, it's already on.

• 1:20:55David Imel?

  It's so cool.

• 1:20:56Speaker 02

  So it's a really fast animation.

• 1:20:58David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:58Speaker 02

  I will not lie and say I didn't see any bugs. I did see some foldables bug out in the hands-on area and bug out as we were testing them.

• 1:21:05David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:05Speaker 02

  And I imagine this is a really hard animation to make it work perfectly every time. But for all of those reasons, I really wanted to work perfectly every time because it's really good.

• 1:21:14David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:14Speaker 02

  So that is like the thing, I posted a short of it. It's like the thing that helps you understand what's different about this foldable. Everyone appreciates that.

• 1:21:23Andrew Manganelli?

  It had like 20 million views by the end of last night.

• 1:21:25Speaker 02

  It literally has 20 million views on Twitter.

• 1:21:27David Imel?

  My entire feed was just UX designers losing their minds.

• 1:21:30Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. It, by the time I think I had gotten back from recording Pod, the top comment on the Galaxy subreddit was, why can't Samsung do this? And by the time I woke up this morning, someone already put the animation out of Samsung's phone.

• 1:21:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, which is, I want to see how well that worked. Cause if that's a third party, like how do they do that?

• 1:21:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Third party.

• 1:21:46Speaker 02

  And is it gonna work?

• 1:21:47David Imel?

  Perfect.

• 1:21:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's not built, yeah. It's still cool though.

• 1:21:51David Imel?

  Yeah, and it makes sense to me why we knew everything about the Duo's hardware, but we had no idea how the software was gonna work. Like Apple keeps that on lock because this is the stuff that actually separates them from those other companies and makes people like them and the intuitiveness. The other super intuitive thing that I thought was really cool is when you open the device and you know, you get the same continuity of the display from the front camera, and then you sort of extend it to the left. Normally on your phone, you have multiple like home screens, right? You swipe to the right, you swipe to the left and it shifts everything. And it's like, oh, we're on a new page, new page, new page. But on the Duo, when you have it open and you swipe to the right or you swipe to the left, everything kind of just flows.

• 1:22:32David Imel?

  And so it's almost as if there's one big like homepage that you can't see.

• 1:22:37Speaker 02

  It's a big canvas of pages.

• 1:22:39David Imel?

  You're just moving, you're like shifting the canvas back and forth. And the way that the animation works makes it feel like there's, there's just all of these apps that are sitting on your screen and widgets and whatever. And you're kind of just like shifting the page back and forth.

• 1:22:52Speaker 06

  So the home screen like scrolls instead of being paginated?

• 1:22:55David Imel?

  Yes, it scrolls instead of paginated.

• 1:22:57Speaker 02

  Well, no, no, it is paginated.

• 1:22:58David Imel?

  Well.

• 1:22:58Speaker 02

  But it, the animation as you move between pages helps you to understand that they're like separate. So like on a, on a Oppo Find N6, you swipe and all, all of it moves at once.

• 1:23:10David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:11Speaker 02

  But on the Neo, or sorry, the Duo, on the Duo, you swipe and like page, page.

• 1:23:17David Imel?

  Yeah, it's like.

• 1:23:18Speaker 02

  And that little set, that little distinction helps you understand that there's another page here and there's another page here. So it's a clever.

• 1:23:24David Imel?

  It's a subtle animation flow, but it feels really cool. And even when you swipe into the app drawer, it's not like, oop, we're on the app drawer page. It's like the app drawer like flows in on the right side and flows back out.

• 1:23:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:36Speaker 06

  The Apple do flow.

• 1:23:37David Imel?

  It's, yeah. It's kind of hard to explain, but I think when we get it on video, it'll be easier to see.

• 1:23:43Speaker 02

  Definitely.

• 1:23:43David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:44Speaker 02

  But yeah, that inside screen, man, it is.

• 1:23:46David Imel?

  Paper-like.

• 1:23:47Speaker 02

  Really good, really, really good. So the two things that make it great, one is it has this, they called it a nano texture finish, but it's some sort of an anti-glare finish on top.

• 1:23:56David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:57Speaker 02

  That makes it both really, really good at rejecting reflections.

• 1:24:01David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:01Speaker 02

  Really good, really good at hiding the crease and really smooth to the touch with your finger as you, as you actually scroll.

• 1:24:08David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:08Speaker 02

  Um, and, and yeah, this is one of the least crease visible foldables ever. It's not invisible, but on the scale of like first gen foldables to today's foldables, like with N6, this is right next to N6 with best I've ever seen.

• 1:24:24David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:24Speaker 02

  You can run your finger over it and feel it a little bit, but it's pretty close to not there.

• 1:24:28Andrew Manganelli?

  It's smart. I mean, like, we've gotten to the point, enough companies have made folding phones, creases have been getting better, but the number one way to see a crease is a weird light reflection.

• 1:24:38Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:24:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Cut light reflections out.

• 1:24:39Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:24:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Crease kind of goes away.

• 1:24:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:41Andrew Manganelli?

  There are always going to, it is anti-reflection, still has reflections in some spots. I see people clipping out one frames out of everyone's video like, oh my God, there's a giant crease in that. It's like, you are going to see it at some point on any phone. I don't know if we will ever get past that. But it's, it was a smart move.

• 1:24:56Speaker 02

  Yeah. And as you look at content on the display, it really like the bezels are even all the way around. There is a display, under display selfie camera, so it's uninterrupted. Uh, but it looks mostly uninterrupted, so it looks really, really good. Now you want to talk about that camera?

• 1:25:12Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, we can talk about that camera. Nailed the crease, that camera did not nail.

• 1:25:16David Imel?

  Real quick on the crease before we get there, they are using a titanium backplate and that was Samsung's big innovation in the foldable too.

• 1:25:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:23David Imel?

  Was that also helps get rid of the crease a little bit.

• 1:25:25Speaker 02

  I also heard, and maybe I'm making this up in my head, I heard carbon fiber back structures or something like that. There's a lot of engineering in the hinge that I might not be quoting perfectly.

• 1:25:33David Imel?

  And there's like 10 layers of display panel as well that they use. So anyway, we can get to the under display camera now.

• 1:25:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. Okay, so they do have the selfie camera on the front display. It's a corner cutout and they do have, when you open it up, on the right-hand side, top middle, uh, behind those pixels is an under display selfie camera. We've seen this before, okay, in Samsung foldables. They've tried this for a couple of generations and the idea was that they have this pixel matrix that has gaps between pixels and they have to, yeah, they have to shine those pixels twice as bright when the display is on, because it's half as many pixels. But it does a decent job at sort of like covering the hole.

• 1:26:12David Imel?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:26:12Speaker 02

  And then when you actually open the camera, it blacks out all those pixels and the camera can see through it. But it doesn't look great. Those, those pixels. Yeah, the, the, well, I don't actually, I guess I don't mind as much the like slightly pixelated look.

• 1:26:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I wanted to ask you, I talked about David, with David in the car this morning. I've seen some videos where I don't know, pre like it activating, just when you're using the, the interior screen. I've seen some videos where I don't notice it. I've seen some videos where I can't not see it. And it's very annoying, like it's very visible. I was, I said to David, it reminds me of like, if you take two colors of paint that are very contrasty, they look like they should be apart. When you take two colors of paint that are supposed to be the same colors but are off, it's infuriating. So like, once you see that and you know it's supposed to be hidden, but you can see it, it's really frustrating and it's really obvious.

• 1:27:06Speaker 02

  It's one of those things where I wonder how much it being on camera and like the moray of like those pixels being in focus is like amplifying it a little bit. In person, I didn't mind it so much. Um, what I am more bummed about is how bad it makes the footage from the camera look. Now, this is to be fair, probably the least used camera on the device. Like you'll use it for some FaceTimes and maybe for some selfies if you really want to. I have a sample video from it in my hands-on video where you can tell.

• 1:27:31David Imel?

  Yeah, it's not great.

• 1:27:32Speaker 02

  Doesn't look that good.

• 1:27:33David Imel?

  It's hazy for sure. Um, but like I said, we had this years ago. Samsung tried this. They never really got dramatically better. And then they just stopped and they just started doing the whole punch cut out again and everyone was fine with it. And it looks like a good quality camera again. And now Apple's doing it and it doesn't look that much better. Like we see a lot of new things. Apple waits till the right moment, jumps in, does it their way. This isn't like better than Samsung's version. So I wonder how long this lasts. Personally, I prefer this to a giant cutout. Really? Yeah. A giant? I never wanted Samsung to go back to the regular camera. Interesting. Cause I think Apple thinks this way too, where they're like, we would prefer that we have this mostly uninterrupted interior display. Feels more magical.

• 1:28:16David Imel?

  Yeah. And then when you do use the camera, it shows up, but you just generally don't. And even if you did for like FaceTime or whatever, who cares about like if the, if it's like ultra sharp for FaceTime, you know, it's like the zoom camera. It's the FaceTime camera.

• 1:28:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it's like one of those things though, that it's maybe it's not perfectly sharp, but now the more variables you introduce into it, like weird lighting conditions, I'm assuming are going to be affected even stranger than it. So like if you FaceTime outside is now the whole thing going to be in crazy washed out.

• 1:28:45David Imel?

  Yeah, it is hazy.

• 1:28:47Andrew Manganelli?

  The more variables, it's kind of like how we say, oh, you can take a photo on the iPhone one in good lighting and it's going to look great.

• 1:28:53David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:54Andrew Manganelli?

  We, we think, I thought it used to be bad. It's the variables. Now we have a camera that's like, it can handle anything and that doesn't feel like it's gonna handle.

• 1:29:02David Imel?

  This is probably going to be really bad.

• 1:29:03Andrew Manganelli?

  Awful.

• 1:29:04David Imel?

  Like especially bad. Some of the, some of the first gen under, under display selfie cameras, when I take a photo in the office, uh, the overhead lights would get like doubled because the pixels, you could see the pixels through, it'd look like you were looking from behind the screen. I remember this. It was bad. And I, you know, we'll take this into other conditions. Apple's perfectly lit environment revealed that it looked meh, but we'll see. I think that they just think about what is the amount of time that people spend using the screen versus using the camera on the interior of the screen. Which is probably the calculus they did and they're like, people almost never use this camera. Let's make it look better.

• 1:29:38Andrew Manganelli?

  That's my argument to get rid of it.

• 1:29:40David Imel?

  Get rid of entirely.

• 1:29:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Get rid of the inside. You can't FaceTime then. That's fine. Close the phone.

• 1:29:45David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:45Andrew Manganelli?

  It's a duo.

• 1:29:46David Imel?

  It's such, it does make sense to FaceTime with that interior. Cause now you have bigger screens of the other people you're talking to.

• 1:29:51Andrew Manganelli?

  If I'm opening up the thing, it's because I want to watch something more than I want to be a part of.

• 1:29:56David Imel?

  You want to watch another person's face?

• 1:29:58Andrew Manganelli?

  No, I want to watch, I'm not going to open it up to like.

• 1:30:01David Imel?

  Yeah, but they have to see you.

• 1:30:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Close it. I mean, like use the phone closed with the front cam.

• 1:30:05David Imel?

  Yeah. But what if you have two people, what if there's three people on FaceTime? Now you can see their faces better because it's.

• 1:30:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Everyone has been getting along fine with their regular phones. That doesn't mean we can't make things better.

• 1:30:15David Imel?

  What about the FaceTime where you tilt it halfway and it's pointed at you from across the room and you prop it up?

• 1:30:20Andrew Manganelli?

  That's cute. That's real cute, but my argument is the inside screen is for watching things and doing things. And if they want to make the hit, take the hit and like just remove the inside camera and be like, the inside screen is perfect because it's beautiful. It's like the nano texture is sick. It's like a great display.

• 1:30:37David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:37Andrew Manganelli?

  Just remove the camera. It's fine.

• 1:30:39David Imel?

  So we have all three, we have all three spectrums. We have make it a whole bunch cut out. I think it's fine. Get rid of it entirely.

• 1:30:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Remove it.

• 1:30:48David Imel?

  Yeah. So.

• 1:30:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Ellis says make it crumple.

• 1:30:50David Imel?

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I also think because we have the nano texture on the rest of the display and you don't see any reflections, that portion does reflect more light. Like if you, if you like tilt the phone in different directions, the rest of the phone is like not really reflecting that much, but you see it more.

• 1:31:07Andrew Manganelli?

  Like catches the light.

• 1:31:08David Imel?

  It catches more light. Yeah. So, you know, I don't know. It's not a huge deal. Uh, you can now use the Apple pencil with USB C on both the outside and the inside.

• 1:31:18Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah. Not yet.

• 1:31:19David Imel?

  Later this year. You will be able to.

• 1:31:22Speaker 06

  Wait, only the USB C one? You can't use Apple pencil too?

• 1:31:25David Imel?

  Okay. The reason for this almost definitely is because you have to be able to charge the pencil and Apple is so scared of selling people pencils that only magnetically charged to iPads that you can't.

• 1:31:36Speaker 06

  Charger.

• 1:31:37David Imel?

  You can't. Yeah. The only way. You mean like a separate dock charger?

• 1:31:41Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:31:41David Imel?

  I guess, but.

• 1:31:42Speaker 06

  What do you mean you guess?

• 1:31:43David Imel?

  Yeah. I guess you could, they could, Apple could just sell us new chargers.

• 1:31:46Speaker 06

  It's a piece of plastic that big with a magnet in it. Like this is not rocket science.

• 1:31:50David Imel?

  They could easily sell the pro. I mean, it is annoying that you can't use the pencil pro on the pro, like the big iPhone. But I think they're just afraid of selling people.

• 1:32:01Andrew Manganelli?

  I think that is. It just stinks for someone who has an iPad already and maybe like is carrying it and that's where it's charging and you could pop it off and use it on your phone instead.

• 1:32:08David Imel?

  Something is cool. Someone brought an iPad mini, um, to the demo area to show like the difference. The size is barely different of the actual display, but it makes the iPad mini look like it's 20 years old.

• 1:32:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Cause of the bezels.

• 1:32:21David Imel?

  They gotta refresh the iPad mini. They have to. The iPad mini is one of the most neglected, high potential products. I love, but what if it had an.

• 1:32:28Andrew Manganelli?

  The Apple thing I own and it.

• 1:32:29David Imel?

  I got my dad one too. I love the iPad mini, but what if it was an OLED and had like a really nice screen with an anti-reflective finish and like thinner bezels? Oh, hey, look, you've got an iPhone Duo. Look, it's iPhone Duo. It would, it would look.

• 1:32:40Andrew Manganelli?

  The hinge is broken.

• 1:32:41David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:42Speaker 06

  How, how long do you think we have to go before someone attempts to fold an iPad mini and thinking it's a duo?

• 1:32:48David Imel?

  Derek, everything. He's gonna do it. Yeah. IP68, fully, uh, dust and water resistant. Phone, second foldable? Pixel 10 Pro fold in this. 11 Pro fold too. Oh, 10 Pro fold and, sorry.

• 1:33:02Andrew Manganelli?

  10 Pro fold was the first one.

• 1:33:03David Imel?

  Was the first one. And 11 Pro fold. Yeah. And now this. Yeah. And now this. So that's nice.

• 1:33:07Andrew Manganelli?

  One other thing where if we're speaking about Zach is they had a very specific part where they mentioned the antenna parts and that they were reinforced. Cause they looked very similar to where the Pixel fold antennas are, which is where Zach keeps snapping them, but they specifically said there's reinforcements in those.

• 1:33:22David Imel?

  Zach is like challenging. That's gonna be one of the hardest videos to watch, dude. Yeah. When he puts sand in that thing? Oh my god.

• 1:33:29Andrew Manganelli?

  I think it always is for any phone.

• 1:33:30David Imel?

  And you know, you're gonna watch it too.

• 1:33:32Andrew Manganelli?

  That's a, with the new YouTube views, that's a 75 million view video. He snaps that in half.

• 1:33:37David Imel?

  Yeah. That's true. Um, okay. So they've got two colors. They have like this pearlescent white, which.

• 1:33:44Andrew Manganelli?

  The best color.

• 1:33:45David Imel?

  Eh. And then they had a, like a midnight blue. What was it called?

• 1:33:49Speaker 06

  Black.

• 1:33:49David Imel?

  Sunset. No, it's like night sky. Dark sky, night sky, something like that. I'm gonna just.

• 1:33:54Andrew Manganelli?

  They rhymed when they said both of them together.

• 1:33:56David Imel?

  Yeah. Oh, pro. Yeah. Oh, yeah. They.

• 1:33:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Starlight and night sky.

• 1:34:00David Imel?

  Yeah. Starlight, night sky. That's night sky is the better color. This is like a Jeopardy question. Starlight, night sky, iPhone Duo.

• 1:34:09Speaker 06

  No, it's star white.

• 1:34:10Andrew Manganelli?

  Star white.

• 1:34:11David Imel?

  Star white. Star white.

• 1:34:12Speaker 06

  Starlight is like the, the yellowy MacBook color.

• 1:34:15David Imel?

  Why would they do that? Looked like that. Star white and starlight? That's confusing.

• 1:34:19Speaker 06

  And then they went with burgundy.

• 1:34:22David Imel?

  Hey, I'm a. Wine barrel. Look, for a first gen, I, I'm going to call this first gen, for a first gen foldable from Apple. I think they overall did a pretty good job. I, I mentioned that there are things I don't like. I don't love that it's only four items in the dock. Like let me put five or six, like let me customize that more. I don't love that it's only two cameras, but that's about as it's good, as good as it's gotten for this form factor. Like the big ultra one has had triple cameras, but this isn't the big ultra one. Yeah. I think $2,000 is a pretty good price. I just, I, yeah, I think the animations and the software would really make this phone. Yes. Speaking of the software, there's a few things that I want to talk about with it. Um, they obviously had to bring more use cases

• 1:35:07David Imel?

  to the fold to actually entice people to have the fold. Some of them are a little silly. Some of them are kind of intuitive. Some of them are things that the Android manufacturers have done that are either good or bad. Uh, one of them is kind of weird and interesting is you can now, you know, standby mode. There's standby.

• 1:35:25Speaker 06

  Do not, do not call.

• 1:35:26David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:28Speaker 06

  Watch it. Cause it's the greatest feature Apple has ever released in anything.

• 1:35:31David Imel?

  I didn't say it was bad.

• 1:35:32Speaker 06

  You said it was weird.

• 1:35:34David Imel?

  Yeah. Okay. Their implementation's kind of weird.

• 1:35:36Speaker 06

  It's awesome.

• 1:35:37David Imel?

  You have, okay. Do you remember the Lenovo, Lenovo Yoga Book 9i?

• 1:35:41Andrew Manganelli?

  Of course.

• 1:35:42David Imel?

  The first foldable laptop, or at least 360 hinge laptop.

• 1:35:47Andrew Manganelli?

  Your point, David? Don't talk bad about my iPad.

• 1:35:50Speaker 06

  The new, the new alarm clock thing, the, the tent mode with the underglow.

• 1:35:54Andrew Manganelli?

  Beautiful.

• 1:35:55David Imel?

  It's cool. Okay. So here's what this is. Uh, you can put in tent mode. It's weird that we put everything in tent mode.

• 1:36:01Andrew Manganelli?

  Go on.

• 1:36:02David Imel?

  You got a big, you got a big clock on the right. You got a big time and then you got a little calendar and you don't need to be charging it now. Uh, because it can go down as low as one hertz. So now you can just have it on your bedside table.

• 1:36:15Speaker 06

  Don't forget the glow.

• 1:36:16David Imel?

  What do you mean the glow? It wakes you up with a soft underglow.

• 1:36:19Speaker 06

  Yes.

• 1:36:19Andrew Manganelli?

  The screen, interior screen can glow.

• 1:36:22David Imel?

  Okay. That's actually kind of cool.

• 1:36:23Andrew Manganelli?

  It's sick.

• 1:36:23David Imel?

  Because like the Philips Hue lamp and stuff that they have like sunrise lamps and their whole thing is that there's a glow next to your face and that wakes you up.

• 1:36:30Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know how much that's gonna be.

• 1:36:31David Imel?

  Those cost a lot of money.

• 1:36:32Andrew Manganelli?

  It looks cool.

• 1:36:33David Imel?

  It looks cool. You know, it's, are you going to tent mode all the time, Ellis?

• 1:36:37Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't think I would have bought one.

• 1:36:38David Imel?

  Yes.

• 1:36:39Speaker 06

  But yeah.

• 1:36:40Andrew Manganelli?

  Yesterday, when we recorded our podcast yesterday, he was like, we were talking to a guest who came on, and he goes, oh, tent mode is so sick. I do really hope they make a stand that's a wireless charger that you can put stand mode on. And she goes, and it would charge from the inside.

• 1:36:53David Imel?

  Yeah, that work. Yeah, you'd have to, you can slap it. By the way, does that make sense?

• 1:36:57Speaker 06

  So you, you, you can put a camera that sees light through the screen, but God forbid, a little wireless electricity goes through that thing.

• 1:37:04David Imel?

  Well, it have, it's like a big.

• 1:37:06Andrew Manganelli?

  There's a lot.

• 1:37:06David Imel?

  There's a lot of Z dimension.

• 1:37:08Andrew Manganelli?

  There's a lot between that coil.

• 1:37:09David Imel?

  Yeah, there's a lot.

• 1:37:10Speaker 06

  They have a trillion dollars.

• 1:37:12David Imel?

  They have five trillion dollars, let's be clear.

• 1:37:14Speaker 06

  They'll figure it out.

• 1:37:15David Imel?

  Okay, so other little changes, they did the thing that we've done since the beginning of time with foldables that I just don't really understand where, you know, you can have the big video with playing back when it's sideways, or you can fold it 90 degrees, and then there's playback controls and the video is smaller.

• 1:37:32Andrew Manganelli?

  I've never done that.

• 1:37:33David Imel?

  I have no idea why people care about this.

• 1:37:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, just use the example of like a live stream with chat on the bottom. That makes way more sense. Maybe you do want to read the chat on the bottom.

• 1:37:42David Imel?

  But see the Netflix version?

• 1:37:44Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:45David Imel?

  This is a very specific to Netflix implementation.

• 1:37:48Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, so the Netflix app, you fold it halfway, the top half is playing your video, the bottom half is generating like a glowy, diffused reflection of the bottom of your video so that you can kind of.

• 1:38:01David Imel?

  It feels immersive.

• 1:38:03Andrew Manganelli?

  It's like those TV lights that you can have that like.

• 1:38:05David Imel?

  It's exactly.

• 1:38:06Andrew Manganelli?

  Exactly.

• 1:38:07David Imel?

  It's exactly like that.

• 1:38:09Andrew Manganelli?

  Cool.

• 1:38:10David Imel?

  Cool.

• 1:38:10Andrew Manganelli?

  I guess.

• 1:38:11David Imel?

  Yeah. It's very weird.

• 1:38:13Andrew Manganelli?

  First thing I asked was, can I turn that off? It's weird.

• 1:38:15David Imel?

  Yeah, and then they have a feature that I think a lot of other foldables have where it's basically universal copy paste between apps, which is cool. So you can, you can have two apps open and you can do the thing where you can like press and hold on an image and it'll cut it out and you can drag it into another thing. I don't know how many people are going to use this. They always use like keynote as an example, which is a soft, a piece of software that I do, I've never known a single person that has.

• 1:38:40Andrew Manganelli?

  This is more for like emails or texting for me.

• 1:38:43David Imel?

  Yeah, yeah, emails and texting is really nice because see you have your email open and you've got an image and you want to text it to someone, you can just drag it.

• 1:38:49Andrew Manganelli?

  I also found it super useful for like two factor.

• 1:38:52David Imel?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Open up like all the, and then just drag it over.

• 1:38:54David Imel?

  And these are things that every other foldable has had for a very long time. So they're, they're doing all that stuff. They just also implemented the small things like the tent mode, which is, you know, strange.

• 1:39:04Andrew Manganelli?

  My takeaway from like my very limited, brief early hands on, and this, this comes out in October, so we'll have like a month to do on this, but like my, I'm used to using like the, the Z Fold 8 and like the latest generations of foldables from other companies. And they're all, they all feel like very, to me, very intentional. Like I get that phone and I, when I open it up, I'm like deciding to be productive with it. And that's like an event and then I close it and it's over. But the, the duo feels like a little playful. It feels like it's way more willing to go back and forth between open and close. The animations are very thoughtful. It's, it feels more fun to use despite being not any more functional. They heard LSA, there's no more whimsy in tech and that animation had some whimsy to it. We got a little hint of it.

• 1:39:49Speaker 06

  They listened.

• 1:39:50David Imel?

  It did. So yeah, also it uses the new C2 modem, which is supposed to be faster than C1X. It adds 5G millimeter wave for people who care, which is one person. It has 50% charge in 20 minutes, which is nice. It's fairly quick.

• 1:40:06Andrew Manganelli?

  All day battery.

• 1:40:07David Imel?

  All day battery life, baby.

• 1:40:08Andrew Manganelli?

  Trademark.

• 1:40:09David Imel?

  They got a trademark.

• 1:40:10Andrew Manganelli?

  24 hours of charge when using both screens equally.

• 1:40:13David Imel?

  Which looks, the interior display is always going to use a lot more power. So I'm at least glad that they give us these averages.

• 1:40:19Andrew Manganelli?

  I need to test.

• 1:40:20David Imel?

  That's kind of nice.

• 1:40:21Andrew Manganelli?

  I don't know how to use that number. The numbers were, I appreciated them giving us more numbers, but they were kind of confusing.

• 1:40:27David Imel?

  They are confusing. Also, it's eSIM only worldwide, which is a little bit different because usually European models of iPhone Pros have eSIM.

• 1:40:35Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:40:35David Imel?

  I mean, having a physical.

• 1:40:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Max out the battery.

• 1:40:37David Imel?

  That's about it. Yeah. So it comes out October 23rd with pre-orders on a tour 16th and again, $19.99. So we're gonna go to trivia now.

• 1:40:46Andrew Manganelli?

  Let's do it.

• 1:40:49Andrew Manganelli?

  We've been typing today.

• 1:40:50David Imel?

  You got my letter?

• 1:40:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Guys, could you scroll all the way down and read what I wrote?

• 1:40:54Speaker 06

  Worldwide, how many times per day do people query Siri?

• 1:41:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Price is right?

• 1:41:01Speaker 06

  Price, yes, Price is Right rules. If you go over, you are eliminated.

• 1:41:06Andrew Manganelli?

  From Apple campus.

• 1:41:07Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:41:07Andrew Manganelli?

  We'll have security come and take you out.

• 1:41:09Speaker 06

  Because we can do that.

• 1:41:10Andrew Manganelli?

  There's actually a hole below your chair and it'll just open up.

• 1:41:12Speaker 06

  Whoa.

• 1:41:12Andrew Manganelli?

  No, it's more of a very compressed spring that shoots you out of the roof.

• 1:41:17Speaker 06

  All of Apple campus is actually a convertible for that reason.

• 1:41:20Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:21Speaker 06

  Then by convertible, I mean there's no ceiling.

• 1:41:23Andrew Manganelli?

  I was like, do you guys hear that? And it's because it's the trivia music. The trivia music is just white noise in my head at this point.

• 1:41:30Speaker 06

  All right, everyone read out your answers. Actually, David wins.

• 1:41:36David Imel?

  What did David say?

• 1:41:36Andrew Manganelli?

  We're spaced out by like two billion each. I wrote one billion.

• 1:41:40Speaker 06

  David, it was 2.5 billion.

• 1:41:42Andrew Manganelli?

  That's 2.5. I thought it was 3.5, so I went a little under. I put 3.2.

• 1:41:47David Imel?

  I wrote five billion. I was too high. Okay.

• 1:41:50Andrew Manganelli?

  All right. During the AirPods 5 announcement, what cities were the trains going to that were delayed?

• 1:41:58David Imel?

  From LA?

• 1:41:59Andrew Manganelli?

  Sure.

• 1:41:59David Imel?

  Is Pasadena a different city than LA?

• 1:42:01Speaker 06

  It is a different city, but it's not far enough to warrant getting on a big old train.

• 1:42:05Andrew Manganelli?

  Yeah, you could walk there. It's very walkable California.

• 1:42:07David Imel?

  Right.

• 1:42:08Andrew Manganelli?

  This is basically two California cities and I'm having.

• 1:42:11David Imel?

  That are in the general.

• 1:42:12Andrew Manganelli?

  If you were paying attention.

• 1:42:14Speaker 06

  You want another hint?

• 1:42:15Andrew Manganelli?

  I, it won't help.

• 1:42:16Speaker 06

  One of them is a macOS version.

• 1:42:18Andrew Manganelli?

  I have a hint for you. I was gonna actually write this before, but only because Adrian kept saying it yesterday.

• 1:42:24Speaker 06

  Flippity, flip, oh, you're gonna get it wrong then.

• 1:42:26Andrew Manganelli?

  Then I'm just wrong. I'm not even.

• 1:42:27Speaker 06

  Hey!

• 1:42:28Andrew Manganelli?

  There were two studios.

• 1:42:30Speaker 06

  Why do you know what that is? That's where I grew up.

• 1:42:33David Imel?

  Oh.

• 1:42:33Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 1:42:34David Imel?

  Oh, that's where I've heard this. Okay, that's where I've heard this.

• 1:42:36Andrew Manganelli?

  Is that one of the places? There were two cities. You could have put two cities.

• 1:42:39Speaker 06

  Your city is in Los Angeles. Yeah.

• 1:42:42Andrew Manganelli?

  Okay, no.

• 1:42:43David Imel?

  I wrote San Diego as one.

• 1:42:45Andrew Manganelli?

  And what's the other one?

• 1:42:45David Imel?

  Sonoma, which is not.

• 1:42:47Andrew Manganelli?

  That is not. San Diego, you got it.

• 1:42:50David Imel?

  Yo.

• 1:42:51Andrew Manganelli?

  That's three points. I said it was worth three points.

• 1:42:52David Imel?

  I've heard of that city before.

• 1:42:53Andrew Manganelli?

  Bro, I'm getting cooked in trivia. Andrew, what did you put? I put Monterey. No, that's unfortunate.

• 1:42:59David Imel?

  Yeah. So where was the other one?

• 1:43:01Speaker 06

  Ventura.

• 1:43:02Andrew Manganelli?

  Ventura.

• 1:43:02David Imel?

  Ventura. The city. Dang. All right. Well, hey, thanks for tuning in. Thanks for watching and listening. Of course, get subscribed to all the channels. Obviously for more podcasts, if you're subscribed here, you're going to see the man on the street episode that we shot or that y'all shot right after the event, talking to people.

• 1:43:21David Imel?

  And if you subscribe to the MKBHD channel, you'll see reviews of these things when they all come out. If you subscribe to the autofocus channel, you'll see videos shot on the new iPhones. If you subscribe to the studio channel, you'll see the behind the scenes of us coming here to shoot the event. So it's all happening. It's tech-ember. It's loaded. Thanks for watching. Catch you guys very soon. Later. Peace.

• 1:43:38Andrew Manganelli?

  Bingo. Thanks again to the team that let us set up here again. Always a pleasure. And because it's Thursday, Adam has to edit this at less than 24 hours. So it's really saving us.

• 1:43:49David Imel?

  And we're on West Coast time, so I have hours left.

• 1:43:51Speaker 06

  Just Adam.

• 1:43:52Andrew Manganelli?

  Just, yeah, just Adam. Ellis is, um, Waveform is produced by Adam Malina and Ellis Robyn, partner with Vox Media Podcast Network, and our outro music was created by Vincenzo.

• 1:43:59David Imel?

  Bingo.

• 1:44:00Andrew Manganelli?

  Let's go.

• 1:44:11David Imel?

  Everyone's got a hard question about AI. Your job, your kids, where it's going.

• 1:44:17Speaker 01

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• 1:44:35Speaker 01

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