#33 Lily Tang Williams - I Fear the Country I Love is Becoming the Country I Left

Lily Tang Williams, who escaped communism under Mao's cultural revolution in China came to America with just $100. 🚨Shawn Ryan Show Sponsors 🚨 https://www.mybookie.com (use code SRS) https://goodranchers.com/shawn https://magbreakthrough.com/shawn Vigilance Elite/Shawn Ryan Links: Website - https://www.shawnryanshow.com Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/VigilanceElite TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@shawnryanshow Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/shawnryan762 Lily Tang Williams Links: Website - https://www.lilytangwilliams.com/ Twitter - https://twitter.com/Lily4Liberty Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/lily4liberty Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:30Shawn Ryan?

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• 1:49Shawn Ryan?

  This next episode is all about a woman's tale of what it was like going through the Mao Revolution in China, which basically...

• 1:59Shawn Ryan?

  Led to a one-party controlled China, the Chinese Communist Party. She escaped it. She moved here to the US of A. And now she comes on to not only tell her story, but also talk about the similarities of what was going on in China back then and what's going on in the US right now. This isn't for everybody. Some, a lot of people won't be able to stomach it. Some of you will be able to, and I appreciate you being here. Everybody, no matter what. Thank you for all the support. I love you all. Seriously, thank you for being here.

• 2:38Shawn Ryan?

  If you don't mind, head over to iTunes, leave us a review and sign up for our free email newsletter. Links in the description. All right, love you guys, enjoy the episode. Cheers.

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• 4:03Shawn Ryan?

  Lily Tang Williams, welcome to the Sean Ryan Show.

• 4:06Speaker 05

  Well, thank you for inviting me. This is great.

• 4:09Shawn Ryan?

  It's been a pleasure talking to you before we get here. And we've had a ton of people request you to come on the show.

• 4:15Speaker 05

  Wow.

• 4:16Shawn Ryan?

  And so here we are.

• 4:17Speaker 05

  Well, I'm honored. I did not know lots of people request you to interview me. I'm very encouraged to hear that.

• 4:23Shawn Ryan?

  Good. They absolutely did.

• 4:27Shawn Ryan?

  So I'm just gonna give you a brief introduction. Lily Tang Williams grew up in a very poor family in China during the Mao Cultural Revolution from 1966 to 1976, which we'll dive into a little later. Became a law professor at age 21. You left China for University of Texas in 1988. You were able to fool the CCP into coming here. And now, you're running for Congress in New Hampshire because you want to save America.

• 5:00Shawn Ryan?

  Am I missing anything?

• 5:03Speaker 05

  That's a pretty accurate.

• 5:06Shawn Ryan?

  Perfect.

• 5:06Speaker 05

  And a very good summary.

• 5:08Shawn Ryan?

  All right. Well, we always start every show with a gift. So here's your gift.

• 5:14Speaker 05

  Wow.

• 5:15Shawn Ryan?

  Any guesses?

• 5:18Speaker 05

  It's kinda heavy, the Sean Ryan Show. Can I open it?

• 5:22Shawn Ryan?

  Absolutely. That's what it's for.

• 5:24Speaker 05

  Oh. You know what? My first time opened gifts that's wrapped up was my 24th birthday on the campus of UTSD.

• 5:35Shawn Ryan?

  Nice.

• 5:36Speaker 05

  I know. My graduate school faculties and professors hold a birthday party for me. I was totally shocked and surprised. I had no idea. My birthday in China is a boiled egg. Oh my goodness, look! Oh.

• 5:52Shawn Ryan?

  Those are Vigilance lead gummy bears.

• 5:55Speaker 05

  Oh, I love gummy bears.

• 5:56Shawn Ryan?

  Made in the USA, not in China.

• 5:58Speaker 05

  Oh, I love gummy bears too.

• 6:01Shawn Ryan?

  Good.

• 6:01Speaker 05

  Thank you so much. Yes, you got your own brand.

• 6:04Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 6:05Speaker 05

  Oh, wow.

• 6:06Shawn Ryan?

  Well, yeah.

• 6:07Speaker 05

  You probably have lots of products named after your brand. Thank you so much.

• 6:11Shawn Ryan?

  You're welcome.

• 6:11Speaker 05

  Yeah, the three package of them. That will last me for a long time.

• 6:15Shawn Ryan?

  Oh, good.

• 6:17Speaker 05

  Especially on the campaign trail, right? Thank you so much.

• 6:20Shawn Ryan?

  Just can just set it down back there.

• 6:21Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 6:22Shawn Ryan?

  Perfect. So, before we dive in, I want to talk a lot about your upbringing in China, and then we'll get into some current events type stuff. But lately in the news, Nancy Pelosi just visited Taiwan. And China warned us that there will be repercussions if that happened, which they did just launch missiles right outside of Taiwan. What do you think about that? What are your thoughts on her visit?

• 6:51Speaker 05

  Well, my campaign actually issued a press release. I came out immediately to support Pelosi. And I tell people, as the only congressional candidate, Republican candidate running for Congress this year, I stand with Pelosi. I support her to show solidarity and stand with Taiwan. The same is so, I think America would look very weak if she did back down because there's threats from CCP, a thuggish government not elected by the people. Republic of China, which is Taiwan,

• 7:37Speaker 05

  has vibrant democracies and a lot more freedom than mainland Chinese. So let the CCP to control our elected officials' traveling itinerary? Gingrich went to Taiwan in the 90s. Why can Pelosi decide she wants to go with a delegation? I even tweeted, "If I was in the Congress, I would join her." I could be even, you know, because I'm truly bilingual, right? I mean, Mandarin was my native, you know, mother tongue language. We have to absolutely support Taiwan. That's truly an example for 1.4 billion Chinese on mainland

• 8:20Speaker 05

  to say Chinese people are capable of freedom and democracy and free market capitalism. So people need to understand Chinese government in Beijing is a one-party dictatorship.

• 8:38Speaker 05

  Not elected by people, that's why they don't care about the people. Remember the Covid?

• 8:44Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 8:44Speaker 05

  First response, any crisis, the local government officials, CCP officials want to cover them up. Because they might lose their job if the boss, top boss in Beijing find out, "Oh, you mishandled this." So they want to cover up because they don't care about people's sufferings. Because the only way they lose their job is get fired by their top boss in CCP. But not by the people, so people, actually Chinese people are the biggest victims of CCP government. Where Taiwan people, according to the poll, they saw what happened in Hong Kong, they don't want to go back to China. Because unification means they're gonna lose their democracy and freedom. Who wants to do that?

• 9:29Speaker 05

  Especially younger people in Taiwan. They learned from Hong Kong, they go, "Hey, one country, two cities don't even work."

• 9:37Shawn Ryan?

  What do you think their interest is in Taiwan? Why is it so, why are they so fixated on Taiwan? Despite possible repercussions if they interfere?

• 9:48Speaker 05

  They are afraid of Taiwan because as I said, Taiwan is a free country with democracy. And communists hate freedom and democracy. And you know what they worry about most? Is Taiwan is an example for mainland Chinese. So if they can collapse Hong Kong, control Taiwan, that means mainland Chinese, you know, will not know what the true freedom democracy is about. That's what communists do. They want to take over probably lots of places, include other free world countries

• 10:33Speaker 05

  because they hate their own people. Somebody wake up to say, "You know what? How come we live like slaves? We cannot vote, we cannot have freedom. I want in lockdowns, government tell us lockdown every 24 hours, go charge your Covid app to see if I can have another 24 hours freedom." That's what they're doing now.

• 10:51Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 10:52Speaker 05

  You look at Shanghai, you look at Shenzhen under lockdown, those are the most international wealthy cities in China.

• 11:00Speaker 05

  They look like dead. It's so sad to see that I don't, I think the China economy is about to collapse. Because of that, because of that, and they're trying to distract to say, you know, because they control all the propaganda to say, oh, demonize America, demonize Pelosi to visit Taiwan. She, she did not say anything unusual. She just said, we stand with Taiwan. We, we support democracy and freedom. There's nothing wrong with that.

• 11:32Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 11:32Speaker 05

  But the Chinese Communist Party now is doing all the trainings and all this stuff and I'm, I'm glad she actually kind of caught their bluff out.

• 11:42Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah, me too.

• 11:42Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 11:43Shawn Ryan?

  I never thought I would stand with Pelosi, but I do think that she did the right move.

• 11:47Speaker 05

  Well, that's what I'm saying. We don't have to be partisan on everything. When our elected politician do rising, we should give them the credit. And I, I, I don't know how many people were Republicans on her delegation. I suggest to her, she should take both party elected officials to go with her.

• 12:10Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 12:11Speaker 05

  But lots of Republicans already did before she showed up, but because she's like the number three, the most important person in the US politics, that's why China is making all the noise and threats.

• 12:20Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah. Well, let's get ready to dive into the interview. One last thing. I always take a, a question from my patrons over on Patreon. They're why I'm sitting here. They're why you're sitting here. They're our biggest supporters. And this one is from Paul Garrison, and I had to pick Paul because Paul has been suggesting you to come on this show for probably six months now.

• 12:46Speaker 05

  Wow, thanks, Paul.

• 12:47Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah, so Paul's question is, can the US avoid its own version of the Cultural Revolution through legislate, through legislature? Or will it take more homegrown, will it take a more homegrown approach through strong families and local communities banding together?

• 13:07Speaker 05

  Well, I think the Cultural Revolution I see in America has been going on for probably thirty-something years, maybe forty years. So it's not like some magic wand that we can just legislate from federal level um to change our culture. And I think that's a part of the communist, like, people's plan. Remember Yuri Mesmerov, who come out to say the communists have a plan for America?

• 13:44Speaker 06

  Mr. Besmianov was born in 1939 in a suburb of Moscow. He was the son of a high-ranking Soviet Army officer. Well, you spoke several times before about ideological subversion. That is a phrase that I'm afraid some Americans don't fully understand. When the Soviets use the phrase ideological subversion, what do they mean by it?

• 14:07Speaker 07

  Ideological subversion is the slow process, which we call either ideological subversion or active measures, активные мероприятия in the language of the KGB, or psychological warfare. What it basically means is to change the perception of reality of every American to such an extent that despite of the abundance of information, no one is able to come to sensible conclusions in the interest of defending themselves, their families, their community, and their country.

• 14:42Speaker 05

  Through four stages. That guy is a former KGB. He knows. He knows. He was defector. The number-one stage, he said, demoralize America. That kind of is like a... remind me of Mao's destroy the four old during the Cultural Revolution. Demoralize, like destroy four old. It's destroy old culture, ideas, custom, and habits. But why did Mao even? Mention that.

• 15:20Speaker 05

  What his agenda purpose to do cultural revolution in to destroy age old Chinese culture.

• 15:30Speaker 05

  Because he use cultural revolution to purge his political enemies within Communist Party.

• 15:38Shawn Ryan?

  Hmm.

• 15:38Speaker 05

  And lots of people might not know that. Um Mao was marginalized, lost his uh. Top leader status, lost a president president position to Mr. Liu Siaqi. Liu Siaqi wanted to reboot economy because Mao started the great leap forward. And those a few years, forty million people estimated to starve to death.

• 16:09Shawn Ryan?

  Forty million?

• 16:11Speaker 05

  Yes, forty million peasants, mostly in the countryside, poor rural villages. Who support his communism, supported Communist Party. Died of starvation. So that's something lots of people in this country don't know. I even did not know until I came to this country, my English got better. And I I was told from nineteen fifty eight to nineteen sixty one. There were three years natural disasters. Drought, flooding, bugs, blame everything else.

• 16:53Speaker 05

  Then the people were starving, because my dad told me he was living on one Chinese steamboat a day.

• 17:01Shawn Ryan?

  Oh, man.

• 17:02Speaker 05

  As a worker, full-time worker for state factories.

• 17:07Speaker 05

  And luckily, I I was born nineteen sixty four. But I heard three years natural disasters all my life in China. Unfortunately, lots of people still believe for that, they still don't know the truth today. I learned the truth after I come to this country. And I cried after I found out how many people die of starvation. And the people don't know the truth. And I was totally indoctrinated myself, so I did not know anything about that. I was just told to say, oh, you're lucky you have you have some food to eat now and you're not starving. Because my dad was a young man, very muscular, and he grew up as orphaned, he just want to fit his stomach.

• 17:51Speaker 05

  When he got recruited to go to work for state factory in in in city instead of, you know, work on the farm, you know, in a village where, you know, he become orphan. He never had one day of schooling, he could not read. My dad is a totally illiterate.

• 18:09Shawn Ryan?

  Oh, wow.

• 18:10Speaker 05

  I know that that's why they always tell me we are starving because we don't have education. Your mom there could not move up inside of Communist Party ranks. And you need to get the best education possible so you can have a better job. They were factory workers.

• 18:28Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 18:29Speaker 05

  Yeah. And so to answer Paul's question though, that I feel like a demoralization of America is already accomplished. Look at today's America. Our young people demonize America, call America systemic racist country. You got the CRT, social emotional learning, sixteen nineteen project, identity politics and transgender ideology in our schools. It's all about demoralize American and American families and turn kids against the nuclear families. So they belong to the state.

• 19:11Speaker 05

  I mean, how you cannot just legislate, oh, I'm gonna change people's mind or hearts. That requires time and work. That's why. They defend parental rights is my top second campaign issue. Because when you take away parental rights, like all the communist countries do, your kids become the property of the states. And they can push all kind of curriculum, information, privacy, tracking, data collection, indoctrination to schools. And parents have not no say in that. Look, they shut down schools. Did you have something about shutting down schools during the past COVID?

• 19:54Speaker 05

  And they're teaching all this crazy stuff. And teachers' union NEA said, we're gonna teach critical race theory in fourteen thousand school districts.

• 20:05Shawn Ryan?

  So you think the Cultural Revolution is already over?

• 20:08Speaker 05

  It's happening now. It's happening. But the demoralization to Amer- in America, according to, you know, um.

• 20:16Shawn Ryan?

  The demoralization.

• 20:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, it it's done. It has been going on for past forty years.

• 20:21Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 20:22Speaker 05

  And now, um, once you demoralize, and and and now we are, I think we're in the probably um, in the third third stage, which is a constant crisis after crisis after crisis, right? You demoralize, then you destroy, and then you uh you you create a crisis, crisis, and then you're trying to last the stage is trying to normalize it. When you're trying to normalize, after you already destroyed the traditional uh values and culture we have. So you normalize with what? With their control, with their power. So that would be like what, replace America? Is it socialism, globalism?

• 21:05Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 21:07Speaker 05

  Instead of individual liberty, and and and individual citizens' rights should not be infringed and guaranteed, actually, give to us by our creator, by God. You know, our rights pre-exist government, pre-exist even constitution. So, but they say so. Our young generations, for two generations now, they have been indoctrinated to believe otherwise, to believe in government. That's another thing, is by destroying their families, by destroying their, you know, their religions, and demonize religions, demonize capitalism, and capitalists and prophets, guess what they do?

• 21:51Speaker 05

  They want you to believe in government. And, you know, the worst religion in the whole world, in my eyes, is statism, is believing government, because they are the only ones who actually have monopoly in force. They have guns, they have prisons, and they can lock you up and take you away. You can hate a corporation all you want, but you don't have to buy their products, right?

• 22:21Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 22:21Speaker 05

  And you have some kind of competition, and hopefully, even with social media, big tech companies, but when government has monopoly in force and controls everything, that's what you get, like Communist China.

• 22:36Shawn Ryan?

  Let's move towards your upbringing in China during the Mao Cultural Revolution. What was it like growing up with that?

• 22:46Speaker 05

  Well, I was two years old, and my memory started in this row house, like a eight families, and living in this workers' row house provided by my dad's day factory. And all one story, and mom dead with children. And my memory started from there. One bathroom, one bathroom which is just big hole on the ground. So they dig a big hole in the ground. And then they put a divider in the middle. So one, one hole is for woman, one hole is for man.

• 23:32Speaker 05

  You can talk to each other, you can talk to your neighbors, you can hear each other. Doing number one, number two, have a conversations. And it just two breaks over the hole. So when you go to number two, number one as a little girl, you have to find the two breaks. So when the light bulb goes out, I was afraid to go to bathroom. We were too poor to afford a flashlight. And so, so everybody just had to buy a little potty for their apartment. So you, if you don't want to go to bathroom at night, you just do in your apartment, next day you can go dump it. And because uh.

• 24:10Speaker 05

  Everything belonged to the state, no private property ownership. So because it's a community housing, who cares to put a new light bulb on when light bulb go busted, right? So I was so afraid to go to bathroom at night. And because if you're not careful, you can fall backwards. And you'll be buried by human waste. And I think every couple of weeks, a pedant will come to dig out the human waste. And take to the agriculture field to use as fertilizer. That's why Chinese were trained, never, never eat salad, we did not have salad.

• 24:49Speaker 05

  Because it's not safe to eat raw food, have to be all boiled, high temperature to kill all the. You know, germs. And in what Chinese water, boil everything. Bottle waters were kind of luxurious item. When I first came to this country, it was my kind of old habits, like looking for boiled water. I was afraid to drink tap water. So, so I just remember that and the bugs were flying around. And the flies and worms were crawling on the, you know, that bath, you know, like a restroom floor. I was traumatized as a child.

• 25:34Speaker 05

  Because if you're not careful, when you go to that female hole, you could step on those bugs crawling on the floor. When you step on it, they make a horrible disgusting, it's a pop noise. By talking about it, I feel like I get goosebumps. I think I was traumatized by that. I just really absolutely hated that. And I hate everything crawling on the floor. You know, the biggest animal scares me. It's snakes crawling. I think it's associated with that. And then in the summer, they all become flies and flying around, constantly to make noise.

• 26:15Speaker 05

  We did not have any kind of cooling or heating, so winter was extremely cold. I had a frostbite on my left foot. Every year, I got the same spot, have frostbite as a little girl. And so they get really, really itchy because when I think when you get warm, but you got frostbite, and then you get warm, then you want to scratch it, they get itchy. And I always broke my skin and get infected. So after years now, just the scars are always there. And I don't know how much memory I don't remember because my dad and my younger brother recently told me,

• 27:01Speaker 05

  you know what, you're the one who threw away dad's some bare fat. Because I was asking last year, who threw away those bare fat? That got really mad and spanked me, saying I did it, but I didn't do it. My brother, which is five years younger than me, my baby brother, he said, you did it. You don't remember? I said, no, I saw somebody else did it. That was really mad.

• 27:30Speaker 05

  I don't know what happened. I, so I think that there are some memories I swept under the rug when you are traumatized. And I don't know when they're gonna come out. So another memory, I did not want to talk about it, avoid to think about it. And I discovered last year the truth.

• 27:51Speaker 05

  Is that my grandmother was babysitting me at the peak of Cultural Revolution, like sixty-eight, you know, sixty-nine, I was four, five years old.

• 28:06Speaker 05

  And my grandma's family and the whole neighborhood renowned this community water well as a source of water, twenty feet deep. And so you, so you go down there, you use little rope to get your bucket down there, get the water, then, then, you know, get the bucket up, that's how you get your fresh water and go boil it for your cooking and washing clothes. And one morning, everybody was looking at water well to say, come look, come look. I, I run there to took a look.

• 28:45Speaker 05

  I think I must immediately run away. Because I don't remember, I never ask question. I saw a dead man lick it

• 28:55Speaker 05

  on top of the water well. Oh, so scary. And, and why, I never ask why, I just run away and don't talk about it, I think I swim under the rock for many years. When I got sick last year in the hospital, I don't know why, I got COVID, I was sick, lying there, no visitor, doing nothing, very weak, just think about my childhood and close my eyes and and with what's going on in today's America, I would just, I don't know why, when you get so sick, so ill, all you think about your past. And I, I said, what happened to that man, who was that man, how come I never ask that question? So when I came home last year from hospital, I talked to my uncle in China,

• 29:38Speaker 05

  uh, uh, Wei Chen, to say, I recovered uncle, I will think about past, who was that man? My favorite uncle, one of three uncles who was part of Red Guards. He said that black family, black class member committed suicide. He could not handle the struggle sessions anymore. People start to Google struggle sessions under Mao's Cultural Revolution. So basically Mao

• 30:12Speaker 05

  Use the standard Marxist communist theory. People are divided into two giant groups, which we use them today. Oppressor versus oppressed. Who are the oppressors? Under Mao, five black classes. Rich, farmers, landlord, race, um, like a county revolutionaries. Whitest, bad influencers. So you got the three categories, very subjective. How do you define? They were black classes or the party.

• 30:53Shawn Ryan?

  They call them black classes?

• 30:55Speaker 05

  Yes, five black, five black versus five red. And, but under five black classes, they're all oppressors. So they're supposed to go to this public square to lower their head, to apologize for being black, to be publicly shamed. And the red guard throw rocks at them. Mao also shut down schools. So the urban youth had no school to go to. So they can do cultural revolution full time. Go eliminate your political enemies. I was a red child. Okay, here are these five red classes. Under oppressed.

• 31:41Speaker 05

  Workers, peasants.

• 31:45Speaker 05

  Like I'm a worker's child.

• 31:48Speaker 05

  Because actually I could be black if my grandfather was not killed. Because my grand, real grandfather I never met, had the land, had the money. Both grandfathers did. I never met the both sides, real biological grandfather. I only had the one grandmother I knew. And since I was little, and she's the one who babysat me. And she went through one year's struggle sessions too because her, my real grandfather died in Sichuan mountains. And she remarried, second husband was a red worker. But they found out. You were second wife of this.

• 32:32Speaker 05

  Leader in like outlawed outlawed group leader in Sichuan mountains. He must be killed as a county revolutionary, which will categorize all our families to be black. My grandma keeps saying, stick to her truth. She said, she keeps saying, no, my dead husband was killed by his own people. As a kind of part of outlaw group.

• 32:59Speaker 03

  Hmm.

• 32:59Speaker 05

  Over some dispute. But after one year investigation, my grandmother, you know, went through that one year, somebody pulled her back, standing up, apologized, did it, write self criticism and want her confess, confess, confess. She's keep saying, I have nothing to confess. I have a current husband who is worker, red class. And after one year investigation, God, thank goodness. Okay, you told the truth, your husband was not county revolutionary, he was killed by his old man.

• 33:40Speaker 05

  Okay, now you're categorized as red class. That's why then we all become red, otherwise, if you have one grandmother categorized black, the entire family is black. Unless one thing Mao urged young people to do.

• 34:03Speaker 05

  You can become red from black. If you delance your families, you come out publicly to say,

• 34:12Speaker 05

  my grandparents were born black, they were landlords. And I'm sorry, I apologize, I'm going to draw the line to delance my families. I will change my last name, like from Tang to Wang.

• 34:32Speaker 05

  Then I become red.

• 34:34Shawn Ryan?

  Were a lot of people doing that?

• 34:36Speaker 05

  Oh, so many, so many. Because young people don't know. Young people were brainwashed and they were pressured. They also totally trusting the propaganda. And Mao was like a god. We, we say every day, long never change my Mao. Hold a little red books, long never change my Mao. Long never communist party. Ten thousand years, double ten thousand years. I never challenged that. Like, is he god or is he human? No, I never asked that question. But I were just chanting every day. So the teenagers in the cities, urban youth.

• 35:20Speaker 05

  They were brainwashed and they were pressured. If you don't dilute your family, change your last name.

• 35:29Speaker 05

  You can never join Mao's students organizations. Like young pioneer, wear red scarf, red guard, communist youth member. And the communist party member were all the jobs. Best jobs are all for those, you know, communist group members. And today on Google, you can see this one guy is in his sixteen now. My uncle generation goes to visit this torture site where he saw his mother tortured to death by red guards. And apologized to say, Mom, I was sixteen, I did not know. I'm sorry. Heartbroken.

• 36:16Speaker 05

  And I feel sorry for those people who dilute their families. Thank goodness I didn't do that, you know?

• 36:24Speaker 05

  And he never got married. He feels public guilty all his life.

• 36:35Speaker 05

  But I believed what the party wanted me to believe. Black families, enemies of state. Torture them, throw rocks at them, send them to labor camps. And my, another horrible sight in my childhood memory is that.

• 37:02Speaker 05

  Sorry.

• 37:05Speaker 05

  Do you have that key? And I saw. Black, black class, black class people after stroke sessions. In this public square.

• 37:19Speaker 05

  Going on military trucks.

• 37:23Speaker 05

  They were going to get shot.

• 37:27Speaker 05

  I was scared to look at them to say it looks so pale.

• 37:33Speaker 05

  And the red guards were saying. Down with the black. Class enemies. Long live my mouth. And with soldiers. Behind those people, I was told.

• 37:51Speaker 05

  After they show off to all the people. They're the enemies of state, they're gonna get shot. And Chengdu had a public execution site. And.

• 38:06Speaker 05

  Sorry, those are two very, very scary and painful memories. And I do have a black. And class friends.

• 38:19Speaker 05

  I never asked the questions.

• 38:22Speaker 05

  And I come to this country and met lots of those people living in the States now tell me their family stories.

• 38:30Speaker 05

  And some lost family members, some committed suicide.

• 38:34Shawn Ryan?

  How many people were, do you think were executed that day?

• 38:37Speaker 05

  Well, ten years. That, that day I saw probably four people were in the military trucks. But according to the Communist Party official, official words.

• 38:53Speaker 05

  Twenty million people were murdered.

• 38:56Shawn Ryan?

  Twenty million people.

• 38:57Speaker 05

  During Mao's Cultural Revolution.

• 39:01Speaker 05

  Probably that also included one who could not handle struggle sessions, could not handle concentration camps and committed suicide. There were people who originally supported the party, intellectuals, scientists, professors, teachers, even the people who were um kind of wealthy, but they're young people, supported the party. But then later, because Mao's Cultural Revolution, all of a sudden, the party supporters become black class because they were born that way. See, that's another thing, you were born black,

• 39:46Speaker 05

  so you, you were guilty. Unless you change your last name, you dilute your family sometimes, and that is not enough. So they threw their supporters under the bus. I remember I watched this movie, black and white movie, called The Red, Red, about this New Yorker, you know, like a reporter. The same thing. They, they believe in communism until something horrible happened to yourself, make you ask a questions. Oh, this is what I'm chasing, I'm believing. Now I am the enemy myself. I, I got through into concentration camps

• 40:32Speaker 05

  and it just did not make sense. Some people couldn't handle it. They committed suicide.

• 40:40Speaker 05

  Even Deng Xiaoping's son, the leader of China, remember he's, one of his sons committed suicide during the Cultural Revolution, jumped off the building, become permanently handicapped, you know, lost his leg.

• 40:55Speaker 05

  I, I hope history will never repeat itself, but unfortunately, the tragedies and the horrors of this Cultural Revolution is not being talked about, not being taught to our school kids, college kids. And how hard it is for me to them, to see them waving a communist flag.

• 41:23Speaker 05

  Like Antifa kids, BLM kids, you know, BLM leaders come out to say we are trained Marxist. Do they even understand what that means? From my personal experience, what I had witnessed is what absolutely horrible and affect my life forever. But I did not know the truth. I was still chanting, I had no idea about the truth until I come to this country. And there are lots of people living inside of China still don't know the truth. They still believe three years natural disasters,

• 42:05Speaker 05

  people starving to death, not Mao's communism, central planning, economical policies. Communism means government takes away all means of production, controls everything from land to property, factories, natural, you know, resources and also media, schools, press, TV, radio stations. Everything is one party control. No judicial independence. All courts, all prosecutors, all teachers, all doctors, all reporters work for the government. One party control even today. So why do we believe any numbers from the CCP today,

• 42:50Speaker 05

  official numbers of economy, COVID cases and all that, according in God, you know, about Taiwan? You cannot believe them because their numbers are official, but our media do quote them. And so I start to,

• 43:10Speaker 05

  I think, ask questions. When Mao died, I was 12. I was 12.

• 43:20Speaker 05

  But I could not ask question publicly. We learned how to whisper to each other with our neighbors, with our families. I was always very inquisitive. I always ask. I saw people whispering each other, like neighbors in their apartment and my families. I would sit there and I'd be little girl to say, "Oh, what are you talking about?" I would ask questions. They told me, "Shh, shh." Very secretive because they're afraid. What you talk about will be reported to authorities. Because the party had block committees in every neighborhood.

• 44:03Speaker 05

  They called the Chinese Communist Party Block Committee. So they are in your neighborhood. And they know you, they know where you live. So you need to be careful what you talk about. So I was always tell, "Quiet, don't ask question, you're just child." I did not understand that. Because I, you know, I was a rich child, I was a class, you know, president and

• 44:31Speaker 05

  I was, I still had some brain left, I think. But I start ask question. Who lied to me? Mao was not God. He was a human, that's why he died. I got that. We were not taught science at all.

• 44:52Speaker 05

  We, I was so brainwashed that I could see Mao sometimes in the sky talking to me, like he was smiling behind the clouds.

• 45:08Speaker 05

  I tell people like, you know, the cartoon movie Simba look up and his father was talking to him, you know, it's like Mao was talking to me, smiling. And we had to burn wood to heat up wok to do stir fry in our outdoor kitchen. And Mao in the flame. I would see his face smiling at me. Because every day is Long Nui Chiang Mai Mao. We sing songs every morning before we start the Chinese mass. To say, my parents are dear, Chiang Mai Mao is more dear. And Mao is the rising sun from the east.

• 45:53Speaker 05

  All those revolutionary songs. So, I was totally brainwashed, even though I was a hungry child. But we were told we should be grateful. Taiwanese people were suffering, we need to go liberate them. America is an imperialist country, we need to defeat them. So, nothing has changed. They're still doing that kind of propaganda today, but just with the internet, it's harder to tell people now Taiwanese people are suffering and are hungry, you know. Think about, we lived on food rationing coupons. My parents and the two younger brothers.

• 46:35Speaker 05

  Family of five, per my parents' official position inside the state factories. We had the minimum food rationing coupons to use per month. To give you an idea how much we ate, we were allowed to get the proteins. Proteins that may include all the eggs. All the meats, doesn't matter chicken, beef, or pork, but beef was just unreachable. I think Chinese just, we just had a pork to buy with our coupons. And

• 47:10Speaker 05

  two point eight pounds of protein coupons for a family of five a month.

• 47:16Shawn Ryan?

  Um, two point eight pounds a month?

• 47:19Speaker 05

  Yes, you can have one day, one meal, family of five. So we were very, very hungry. As I said, I do not remember one single toy I had. When I had my birthday, people don't believe that. It's boiled egg, you were lucky to have boiled egg that day, they save for you, for your birthday. My mom was very sick, ill person. She was premature baby with lots of problems. I'm the oldest out of three children, so I was treated as adult since I was six years old.

• 47:59Speaker 05

  People believe communism is free, offer free stuff. It's lie.

• 48:08Speaker 05

  I was told by my parents and begged by my parents. At the age of six, when I was dying to go to school to learn how to read and write because my parents were illiterate.

• 48:23Speaker 05

  They begged me to stay home, to babysit my one-year-old infant brother.

• 48:32Speaker 05

  They could not afford his factory infant care. They could afford my next brother, younger brother, who is only seventeen months younger than me. When my grandma couldn't babysit anymore, they put him in childcare in my death factory. But the infant care cost more money. And they, they thought I was mature enough as a girl, as a big sister, to stay home babysit him.

• 49:05Speaker 05

  I, I said, no, no, no, I want to go to school. But they begged me, they say, well, we'll buy you a foreign movie ticket as a bribe. And which is not your reason to do, a foreign movie, movie ticket. And then we need your help, we cannot afford it, we still have to buy food.

• 49:26Speaker 05

  I remember I just cried for three days. I want to go to school.

• 49:34Speaker 05

  And, and this, you know, what can I do? I said, okay. I, I took the movie ticket.

• 49:44Speaker 05

  And I watched Romania, I think of fighting Nazis. And loved the foreign movie. Because when we're so pressed, we watch foreign movie, we saw foreigners in the movies. And especially we saw them hugging and kissing each other in the movies. It was like a, because in our culture, during most cultural routine, we, we don't show affections to each other. And. We were not allowed to date. Were not allowed to wear pretty clothes. Like what I'm wearing today, a Chinese silk blouse was banned. Because we're not the fall old.

• 50:28Shawn Ryan?

  Hmm.

• 50:29Speaker 05

  Old culture, custom, ideas and habits. When red guards loading door to door, people want to hide clothes like this or burn it and give away.

• 50:44Speaker 05

  Because if you get caught, you can go to stroke sessions and go to labor camps because you're capitalist, you're black class. So you had old stuff like this. Everybody is supposed to look the same. Girls look like a boys, approve hairstyles.

• 51:00Shawn Ryan?

  They even they even approve your hairstyles?

• 51:02Speaker 05

  Yeah, I cannot leave my hair down like this past shoulder. So you see my old picture online as a young pioneer, red guards. You have to braid your hair, have a piggy tails, ponytails or short hair. You cannot lay down here freestyle like this long. You must braid it, put up, you know. And but.

• 51:29Speaker 05

  But I wanted to go school anyway, so I had to stay home for a year. I watch for my baby brother and I was scared at beginning. Um, because the courtyard was very quiet. Under communist China during Mao, you must work, everybody must work.

• 51:50Speaker 05

  Include all women, all mothers. You cannot stay home to say, can I stay home with my babies? No. You have a guaranteed job with the state. But it's not up to you to choose what job, what position, you just must work.

• 52:09Shawn Ryan?

  How do they decide where you're gonna work?

• 52:12Speaker 05

  Everybody work for the state. So my mom worked for a local office supply factory in the neighborhood. My dad worked for big steel production factory. That's subject to, you know, all the way to Beijing and government control.

• 52:35Speaker 05

  He was recruited. My dad was orphan. He was recruited to work for them. They went to countryside, recruit young man who are very muscular. As I mentioned, my dad grew up as orphan. I never met my real grandparents from his side. Uh, he was illiterate. So he was managing one steam bong to another steam bong, starving all the time. So when they offered, recruited him to say, "Young man, you want to work for the new China? And, um, we'll get you two cities and have salary, you have three meals a day." Of course, he signed up. I think my dad was seventeen or something. And he was a orphan since five years old, grew up on the farm.

• 53:18Speaker 05

  Had to fight against bullies, cause he grew up as orphan and no education. And this is, my real grandfather had some land. And died of a strange disease where he spent all his wealth, money to treat himself and still died. Then my grandmother died in the countryside, working on two part-time jobs to feed her children. And when she got bit by a dog, got infected. She had no money to, to treat her infection, and she died. So all six kids become orphans. And my, I never met, um, all my mom, my dad's side's family members because of,

• 54:00Speaker 05

  I think two sisters just basically sold the married orphan to cook some food and marry somebody. A- and at very young age, and my dad was a kind of adopted by his uncle. He, because my dad was the youngest and his uncle did not have children. So they, "I don't have money, but you can work on the farm and make some, you know, feed yourself." So my dad was working as a bottom of the workers, but my dad was strong and relatively smart. But no education. So Communist Party wanted to promote him. And get him join the party. And trying to make him a supervisor of the floor work. He couldn't do it. He said, "I cannot read, I cannot do homework."

• 54:45Speaker 05

  They put him in workers college. He brought the homework home to say, "Can you help me do this?" And I quickly, he just gave up. He said, okay, I don't want promotion. I, I just want to go do my own cement, concrete worker job. And on the floor, because I cannot be a any kind of manager. But your food coupon is based on how much, you know, how high your position is. That's why we did not get much food. And I told people, we were so hungry. My uncle, when my grandmother was babysitting me, to say, hey, there are some rats running around in my grandma's courtyard. And he set up a trap and we got rat one day, one rat.

• 55:29Speaker 05

  And he, you know, put the rat meat and skin it, meat on the fire. And we suck on the bones, not much meat, of course, very little. But still, hey, it's something for you to suck on. But everybody learned to catch rats and they ran out very quickly.

• 55:44Shawn Ryan?

  You ran out of rats to eat?

• 55:46Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 55:46Shawn Ryan?

  That's how bad it was?

• 55:48Speaker 05

  Yeah, like today's, I saw that's today's, you know, Venezuela, people say that too. But we ran out. That's why when you're extremely poor,

• 56:00Speaker 05

  you don't have animals, animals are gone. Birds shut down by the fisherman to eat. Dogs, cats did not exist. And we had one dog in our community, five, eight families, right? Here, one bathroom, eight families. One family had a dog, all the kids loved their dog. And the police come in to say, it's illegal to have a dog. Either you kill it, eat it, or welcome come to get your dog and kill it, maybe eat it too. So my neighbor had to no choice.

• 56:40Speaker 05

  They, they, they put dog down and, and ate the meat. We, as kids, we were very sad. And that was the only dog I knew, actually. And, and later I come to this country, I had, I had a pet, my first dog. And they say, you so, once I got to school, after when you're babysitting, and I was so motivated.

• 57:12Speaker 05

  I will be best student and I will do very well. I have good memory. And I was seven years old when I started school.

• 57:23Speaker 05

  But I made one critical mistake. I was a little bit too confident. See, only the best students got nominated to join Miles

• 57:35Speaker 05

  um young pioneer, where you wear a red scarf. And the teachers were nominating best students called the three merit students politically correct, academic excellent and physically education physically fit. Called the three merit students, then you will get to be first one to join the young pioneer, wear the red scarf. I met all those criterias. I was best student. I made one hundred percent on every subject. I was very, very physically fit, doing all the physical education activities. I was a red child and I was politically correct. So I thought I would be the first one to join Miles

• 58:18Speaker 05

  young pioneer, wear a red scarf, become a red scarf girl. It was such an honor, privilege to be the one who wear the red scarf. And uh but I was told by my teacher, somebody reported on you because you were bragging about yourself. How wonderful you are and you'll be the first one to wear the red scarf. We're not gonna let you because you are too confident. You are full of yourself, basically. Criticized me, full of myself

• 58:56Speaker 05

  and too expressive. I was telling my girlfriend privately, I bet I'll be the first one to join.

• 59:06Speaker 05

  But she told on me.

• 59:09Speaker 05

  After that lesson, at the age of seven, I could not trust anybody.

• 59:13Shawn Ryan?

  So you're not allowed to be proud of yourself?

• 59:16Speaker 05

  No. I was told by my teacher, we are a collective society. Everybody should fit in, everybody should be the same. And your self-expression of confidence, bragging about yourself

• 59:39Speaker 05

  is a serious flaw. I, they say we're gonna hold you back. According to your grades, everything, you should be the first one joining, but we're not gonna nominate you to join where red scarf just because what you said privately to your friend.

• 59:58Speaker 05

  I, I dare not to say anything. I complained to my parents, they were brainwashed too. They said we, we agree with your teacher. Say Chinese have a traditional saying, the first bird flying out of forest get shot. So I was like a nail standing out and you get hammered down. So I learned my lesson.

• 1:00:27Speaker 05

  Do not trust anybody at the age of seven

• 1:00:32Speaker 05

  in a one-party controlled state. Don't trust your neighbors, don't trust your teachers, don't even trust your family members. Because family members, some belong to communist party.

• 1:00:49Speaker 05

  What I mean, everybody is encouraged to come out, to write diaries, to confess what you think yourself, also what you heard from your family members and your neighbors about anything not PC, politically correct. So if you hear anybody saying something challenging Mao or party, that's crime. Thought, crime existed. If you wear mouse, remember mouse, chairman mouse, big button?

• 1:01:29Shawn Ryan?

  Uh huh.

• 1:01:29Speaker 05

  Called a, if you wear the upside down accidentally, it's crime. You can go to jail.

• 1:01:38Speaker 05

  If you hold a cheer my mouth, a little red book to say long live cheer my mouth. But upside down, they think you are little country revolutionary. Everything was about politics. It was in your face every day. There's no downtime, there's no off the great living. And so you have to be very careful. I, it's like, it's hard to have any fun as a child. Our music has to be proved. Songs have to be all loyal to Mao and the party.

• 1:02:21Speaker 05

  And every day, this community housing, I lived there for fifteen years. Next to my junior high and high school. Six thirty in the morning, a big loudspeaker come on to say.

• 1:02:41Speaker 05

  Time to get up, time to go work, time to go school. Long live cheer my mouth, long live Communist Party. Here's the news, it's all very high pitched noise. Have you heard about Peking Opera? Mao's wife created very political Peking Opera.

• 1:03:01Shawn Ryan?

  Hmm.

• 1:03:02Speaker 05

  To sing red songs about Mao Party regime. It was awful. It was using high pitched voice but singing red songs. So we had to hear that.

• 1:03:20Speaker 05

  Once a while, my.

• 1:03:22Shawn Ryan?

  So they would, they would just have loudspeakers everywhere? And you'd be forced to listen to the propaganda all the time?

• 1:03:28Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's like, you know, it's like when you see the Nazi movies they have on the concentration camp. It's, but they don't have twenty-four hours day. They, they have in the morning. In the morning, then, time to get up, time to go school. So you cannot sleep in. It was that way when I was in college. I was in college from nineteen eighty-one to nineteen eighty-five. Long stop every morning, you could not sleep in. If you want to skip classes, uh, you just have to cover your ears. Once they turn it off and class already started, then you be quiet, then you can go back to sleep. That's how bad it was, it's like.

• 1:04:12Speaker 05

  We, we really, we really don't have any privacy. Don't have, so that's why you, you keep everything, I learned keep everything to yourself. Don't trust anybody. When I ask a questions.

• 1:04:27Speaker 05

  It's like a, by the way, I did have a couple crushes about my.

• 1:04:33Speaker 05

  Um classmates in middle school, high school.

• 1:04:38Speaker 05

  You know, that's natural, right? But we are, we're not allowed to date. One boy in middle school, I was class president. He come talk to me, oh no, the girl came talk to me to say, I'm so scared, what should I do? She receive a love letter from him.

• 1:04:58Speaker 05

  And basically, he had a crush on her, a pretty girl. In junior high. She got scared. She didn't know what to do, she come talk to me because my parents apartment just next to the school.

• 1:05:14Speaker 05

  I was so brainwashed, I was so politically correct. Of course, you know what to do. We're banned from dating. You give this letter to teacher.

• 1:05:26Speaker 05

  She did.

• 1:05:28Speaker 05

  And that boy later smiled again.

• 1:05:31Speaker 05

  He probably got a referral, went to private meetings, get criticized, probably even noted on his student file. Every child had a student file. Secret, your parents and yourself don't allow to see what's inside, that's how they track you. So if you get discipline action like this. Then you will get a. Write up in your student file.

• 1:05:58Speaker 05

  And of course, after I woke up this country, I feel guilty about what I did. I was a child. I did not know. And she and him just never smiled again. I don't know what happened to them privately. And so we were not allowed to date. That's why you are not allowed to look pretty, look like a girl, you know. I had to learn how to do makeup after I come to this country. I never learn how to do makeup. And essentially, most I did in college was a lipstick. And of course, we're all young, we don't need to make up. But but they say so everything is a bourgeois lifestyle. If you do anything that western people do, you will get criticized.

• 1:06:43Speaker 05

  So clothes like this, approved hairstyle, no dating. And once in a while, I hear a classic music. One minute during the news break on the radio, of government radio, all controlled by government. My neighbor, only one family out of eight, had a little radio. I said, that's so beautiful. I heard a classic music, piano, during the news break. Every day that time, during the news break, a short time, there is a classic music.

• 1:07:18Speaker 05

  After all that revolutionary operas and red songs. We we we we were deprived, beautiful music. So I begged them, it's dinner time, can I come in to listen to, next to the radio? Very close, I will not bother you eating dinner, because we're too poor to have a radio. And they led me in, and I want to go there, just concentrate myself into listen to a classic. Like sometimes violin, sometimes piano, sometimes it's a symphony, very short. Oh, I I I don't know what it is, it was magic. And my tears would come out, and I said, oh, this is beautiful, so beautiful.

• 1:08:03Speaker 05

  Oh, thank you so much, thank you so much. And so my entire childhood dream is like, Dad, when can we buy a radio? So I don't have to bother my neighbors and listen to it. We never had a radio, because my dad, mom, were not high enough. And they were always in debt, their entire life was in debt. Until I come to this country from my graduate school. Are a research assistantship job, five hundred dollars a month. I saved money, I helped my parents to pay off their debts. And uh, and my dad said, well, why do you need the? Radio, you have loudspeaker every day for news.

• 1:08:46Speaker 05

  And I need to go to work, I need to save money for a bicycle, a used bike. My dad is very hardworking, my mom sick all the time. So we all ran on my dad. And uh, he will get up early in the morning, go catch public bus. And bus were always so crowded. And uh, so people will fight to get on. Two times, two times my dad told me, he got locked down to the floor, lying down there. And uh, and bus drive by his ears. One time he come home really pale, he said I could be killed this morning.

• 1:09:26Speaker 05

  And uh, cause I got locked down and by the stronger people fighting to get on the bus to go to work. And uh, you could lose your job if you don't show up work on time, you, everybody had to fight and get up really early in the morning. So my dad's dream is to have a, a used bike. And uh, a, a, a little fan in the summer to blow air. Cause I, he saw me doing homework, I was sweat like a little pig, just like a. Covered with sweat on my face. And uh, they said, you know what, those are two priorities. I get myself used bike, or get your little fan to blow air in the summer for you to do homework.

• 1:10:08Speaker 05

  Cause I was good student and uh, my dad is very proud of me. So, so I never had a radio and uh, my dad did get his used bike. And later, uh, he had to borrow money to get me a little fan from my uncle. And uh, you know, pay back gradually later. And when, see, when people say they don't understand when they want the socialism, communism, look, what kind of life we had was a. Probably unbelievable, primitive poverty that people in this country will never. Know the details about it. And uh, as I said, I got a frostbite.

• 1:10:49Speaker 05

  And I even did not know about back to the bear fat story I mentioned to you earlier. But I don't remember it. What happened, my dad spent lots of money to get a bear fat. It's a superstition. If you get a bear fat, like a really fat, like a bacon, right? Bear fat is from bears. And put on my fingers in the winter were all so red and swollen and and like frostbite. They will go away, it will help. And of course, you can also use to fry food and to make a, you know, like a Chinese food certified. So he got them and he just sitting there.

• 1:11:34Speaker 05

  And I did not know. I did not recognize it was something valuable. I I saw was some trash in a little, you know, jar or something. And I'm the one who throw away, but I don't remember that. So, so I was public punished by my dad. But it's like last year, they told me, you did it, you throw away, not not you two younger brothers. If my baby brother, who is five years younger, remember that? He must be right because he's five years younger. I don't remember it. I throw under the rock. I don't know what happened. It must be too painful, too traumatized. And but my dad, bless his heart.

• 1:12:19Speaker 05

  You know, very hardworking. And because my dad had too much pride, too much human dignity. He would not put up with his communist party boss in his state factory. So when they treat him like dirt, like an animal. And the pounding table, my dad, that kind of guy were pound table back. And they trying to get rid of him for many years. And I remember in the eighties, um, late seventies. They said, hey, Mr. Tang, we want to send you to countryside to work. Remember, everybody work for the state.

• 1:13:01Speaker 06

  Uh huh.

• 1:13:02Speaker 05

  If they want to send you to go some wor- work. It's not family package, you go there work by yourself. It's very common back then, families are separated. So my dad could go to this countryside work. It's like one, it's like a, take two whole day's bus to go there.

• 1:13:22Speaker 05

  And to work, maybe come home visit once a year or something. My mom would be home with three babies, my dad refused to go. Say, boss, my wife is a premature baby, very sick, all the time. I got to stay close to my three kids. They rely on me to take care of them. And my wife goes to hospital all the time. And so he said, I cannot go.

• 1:13:50Speaker 05

  And then they always trying to fire him. So finally, as soon as he turn only like, I think about forty five or something. They called early retirement to say. No more job anymore, retire earlier. And my dad thought, you know what?

• 1:14:11Speaker 05

  If I retire earlier, I could start my own business. That was after Cultural Revolution. Under Deng Xiaoping, people allowed to have their own business. Like even straight vendor business. My dad is very handy, mechanical. Oh, I can fix bicycle, I can fix tricycle. He said, okay, I would take early retirement instead of going to countryside to work. My wife and kids left along. And that way, I can just make more money even, because he can work longer hours too. And they will not give him a stay license. You require city license. To have a business on the street to fix people's bicycles. So my dad said, well, why?

• 1:14:56Speaker 05

  Because you are retired worker. You have a salary. We need to get a license to other people who don't have any jobs at all. My dad said, that's not right. My salary is barely keep my family fit. We have family of five. My wife is sick all the time. I need to make extra money. And my dad is such a man with dignity. He did not figure out. He need to come up with lots of cash to bribe. If he did the bribe, he might get his license. But instead, he was just man of integrity. He did not do it. He just did illegally. So he worked in a so-called black market. He worked at night to fix people's bicycles. He also.

• 1:15:41Shawn Ryan?

  Fixing bicycles was a black market occupation?

• 1:15:44Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 1:15:45Shawn Ryan?

  Wow.

• 1:15:46Speaker 05

  I know you cannot imagine that. And because they refused to give you license by the city officials. It's called a chengguan. They were their government. And so my dad actually later fix a tricycle. So people who that time, if you carry passengers around inside the city when people need the transportation, right? Not everybody had a bicycle or want to use bicycles. So he would, you know, transport passengers. Come on, then you get in. And he will, he's strong. So tricycle, then two passenger can sit on the back. And my dad did that illegally.

• 1:16:29Speaker 05

  And he got robbed many times. And one time, um, somebody bit his nose, broke his nose. Bleeding and and he run to the hospital, could not call cops. How can you call cops if you're working illegally, right? I mean, they the government confiscated his his tools, his tricycle before. So he dare not to report. And they took all his money, all his cash too. Then he would just manage to borrow money and start over again. Get a, you know, and he said, you know, no matter how hard it is, how dangerous it is, but it's still money.

• 1:17:12Speaker 05

  That's I, that's why, you know, I would say the government regulations take people's rights to make a living away and sell back to you. It's called a occupational license here. Yeah, but my dad, that's how he, he, he, he worked like this for many years to put me through college. Remember to go to college, even though the government recruited me at the age of seventeen, when I passed the college exam, nationalized college exam. And I was a rich child, my file all very politically correct, no problem with family

• 1:17:55Speaker 05

  and the best score. And I was, I wanted to go to study law because as I said, I started to ask questions. I need to search for truth. And but then, where did I get the food money? My dad hard earned money, cash from illegally working in the evenings of the street to give me food every month, food money every month when I was in college. Four years from when I was seventeen to twenty-one.

• 1:18:29Shawn Ryan?

  Wow.

• 1:18:33Shawn Ryan?

  That is unfathomable.

• 1:18:40Speaker 05

  Yeah, and the people say, well, you were red class, you could have good life in communist country because you were workers, workers rule, that's what the, you know, Karl Marx said, the workers rule, the great proletarian cultural revolution under Mao. Everybody suffered, everybody. You, if you are on top of the one percent, you're okay. I'm sure Chairman Mao had all the meat he wanted and dated all the women, played with as many women as he wanted according to his private doctor's book, the private life of Chairman Mao, because he was a god, he was emperor, and he can do whatever he wanted, and we could not even look pretty.

• 1:19:24Speaker 05

  We could not date and could not make a living. And Mao had a famous saying.

• 1:19:33Speaker 05

  If someday, everybody in China can eat roasted beef in soy sauce with potatoes. Then communism would be fully fulfilled. Just afford to eat that dish.

• 1:19:48Speaker 05

  I can eat that dish every day. Even later, after China's economic reform. My relatives could afford that dish better than in the past, you know. And China economy got better, not because communism is because the economic reform opened up. And it basically adopted free market capitalism a little bit. But with still central controlling and planning. And then the economy just took off. But that's what they sell you communism. Tell you, we can give you free healthcare, free childcare, free education. And give land back to the peasants.

• 1:20:28Speaker 05

  That's what the Communist Party promised, Mao promised to all the Chinese before nineteen forty nine. And that's when, remember they were fighting Japanese first, actually the most time was Nationalist Party. Shanghai's government called that time, remember was Republic of China. That was actually the government. Before the Communist government called Republic of China. Under Guo Mingdam, Nationalist Party. They did most of fighting against Japanese. And Mao was recouping, reorganizing. And and then later had the civil war.

• 1:21:12Speaker 05

  You know, Communist Party fighting Nationalist Party. And the Nationalist Party left. So Republic of China um gone to Taiwan.

• 1:21:25Speaker 05

  And, and people don't know the history to say, oh, Taiwan is a part of China. If you really study history, that's not true. Taiwan was under Japan for many years. Taiwan was an island. When Chiang Kai-shek had to flee China. And then they went to Taiwan. And many years later, Taiwan become a democracy. More than one party dictatorship. And because Chiang Kai-shek died and his son become the president. And the transition to democracy and free country. And become one of the four dragons.

• 1:22:08Speaker 05

  We call the little aging dragons, four of them, you have Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore. And what is another country, that time Hong Kong, when Hong Kong was under British rule. Very good economy. But, but they trying to indoctrinate all the mainland Chinese for years. We got to go liberate Taiwan. And they use a patriotic education. Trying to push down on Hong Kong students. Who was subject to British's rule for many years. Who resisted centralized education indoctrination by Beijing. That's how the Hong Kong students had umbrella movement. Like two thousand thirteen, two thousand fourteen, led by students.

• 1:22:54Speaker 05

  And they Joshua Wong. Now in the jail, after two thousand nineteen. The Hong Kong protest against the China's imposing national security laws. So Hong Kong is gone. And people got to realize. Who are the enemies of communist? It's the people who believe in freedom, democracy. Separation of the powers, judicial independence.

• 1:23:29Speaker 05

  They hate them, so they hated Hong Kong, they hated Taiwan, and they hated, they still hate. America, if you look at China's propaganda today, inside of China, through CCTV, they're not propaganda. Um, basically demonize America. I have a Chinese girlfriend in North Carolina. She married to an American citizen. Her family told her in Chi- in China, her family in China told her, do not come home with, with him, with your American husband. He's not welcome. That tells you today CCP, how much propaganda that is to brainwash its people.

• 1:24:14Speaker 05

  It's very sad that the 1.4 billion Chinese are enslaved. But with consent.

• 1:24:27Speaker 05

  They were under zero COVID lockdown, testing every day. No food for 10 weeks, my friends were starving in Shanghai, trapped inside their apartment for 10 weeks. They had money, but they could not go out, stay home, their doors were burned. Bob wires on the community building stairs, you could not get out. Totally disarmed.

• 1:24:52Speaker 05

  Even under lockdown like that. And people still supported, lots of them still supported the party.

• 1:25:00Speaker 05

  Can you believe that? My family in China have no idea what I'm saying here. If they knew, they probably would criticize me.

• 1:25:13Speaker 05

  My uncle who went to countryside, my three uncles went to countryside for 10 years. After Mao finished using the young people, Red Guards in the cities. And they were become violent. They were fighting each other on the streets. And the generals told Mao to say, you got to do something with those young people. He started another campaign. Down to the mountains. Get a re-education by the peasants. Send them away to the countryside. You have no choice as parents. You could keep one kid, youngest, stay home. So my grandparents, my grandmother, my step-granddad,

• 1:25:58Speaker 05

  they only got to keep my aunt at home, youngest. All three uncles sent to countryside for ten years. And you are allowed to come home once a year.

• 1:26:09Shawn Ryan?

  That's it, once a year?

• 1:26:10Speaker 05

  Yes. My grandma cried every time when my uncles, my especially my favorite second uncle came home. I always want to see him. He was sent to the um rural countryside near Burma. You know, in southwest China. And grandma will always cry when he leaves. I remember I was still in elementary school.

• 1:26:35Speaker 05

  I gave him nine pennies. I had nine pennies saved up from Chinese New Year sometimes. Oh, uncle, you be gone. I only see you once a year. Here, take this. He cried too.

• 1:26:51Speaker 05

  And he come home. No wife. No job. No skill. No high school diploma. And only were allowed to come home if you're single. If you get married in the countryside, your household registration will be in the countryside. If you marry somebody in the countryside, you were not allowed to come back to the cities. For that reason, none of my uncles took a wife.

• 1:27:24Speaker 05

  From seventeen to twenty seven.

• 1:27:28Speaker 05

  And he came home, had to run out friends or arrange to meet somebody to get married. Because you have nothing, you don't know anybody, then time is running out. He had to start to date people. Then subject to one child policy, he had one child, my, my, my cousin. So, but a lot of those generation people though, Red Guards, some of them still not awake because you don't know the truth. They will talk about their life, they will laugh about it. My uncle's very bitter, but still, they don't know the truth. I have my family ask me to mourn Mao's death every December on his birthday.

• 1:28:12Speaker 05

  Mao died in nineteen seventy six. He's a mass murderer. But my family say, let's take a one minute to have a memorial for him.

• 1:28:28Speaker 05

  Human sorrow, human tragedy. And I really, I just become speechless. I cannot tell them.

• 1:28:38Shawn Ryan?

  When did the one child policy start?

• 1:28:41Speaker 05

  In the eighties.

• 1:28:42Shawn Ryan?

  In the eighties?

• 1:28:43Speaker 05

  Yeah, when under Mao, it's kind of weird. Under Mao, Mao said,

• 1:28:50Speaker 05

  be a mom is glorious, have as many kids as you want. I remember my Chinese teacher had nine kids. No birth control. Because he said, we got to show the world, we have lots, lots of people. And

• 1:29:07Speaker 05

  I heard he had no compassion when people crying, holding his hand, kiss his hand, telling him about poor families. He no smile and no laughter. When people told him during a so-called mass famine, like people are starving to death, he had no reaction. We got lots of people, yeah. Twenty million, no big deal, or something like that. I don't know if it's true or not. It's very scary that somebody like that, people worship him like a god.

• 1:29:46Speaker 05

  But he has no, he has no respect to human life. And, but then all of a sudden, he died. And the Communist Party had a new leader.

• 1:30:01Speaker 05

  And they wrote into law, say, push for one child policy. Because the China economy was just about to collapse completely. And after Mao's death, and Deng Xiaoping said,

• 1:30:17Speaker 05

  let, let, let some people get rich first, let's reboot our economy.

• 1:30:23Speaker 05

  And, and it's also country population growth. They blame bad economy on too, too big population.

• 1:30:31Shawn Ryan?

  Too many people.

• 1:30:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, too many people, incredible. It's your political ideology, your system completely failed.

• 1:30:40Speaker 05

  More people in this country, but I say that's not real communism. You know, how many people have to die to prove to you real communism, socialism works? One hundred million people died in one hundred years under communism. How many experiments do you want? So, if they know the real history, if they know they, what happened to us during Mao's Cultural Revolution, you would think history should not repeat.

• 1:31:20Speaker 05

  But today's China is already in Cultural Revolution 2.0.

• 1:31:28Speaker 05

  The Chairman Xi wants to have common prosperity. So that's why you look at his policies, that he took over basically lots, lots of private, huge industries and companies. A billionaire, Jack Ma, was forced to retire, also disappeared for a few months because he dared to criticize China regulators on economy.

• 1:31:58Shawn Ryan?

  Didn't, didn't the CEO of Alibaba disappear too?

• 1:32:01Speaker 05

  That's him, Jack Ma.

• 1:32:02Shawn Ryan?

  That's him?

• 1:32:03Speaker 05

  That's him, Alibaba CEO, and his company.

• 1:32:07Speaker 05

  Also was told cannot go public in Hong Kong. Say how could a private company get so rich? It's of course, there's a power struggle. I heard that, you know, lots of companies billionaires got rich under Jiang Zemin. The, you know, former president and Jiang's faction and Xi's faction are constantly fighting each other to gain power, to gain control. So when Chairman Xi came to power two thousand twelve. It's ten years now, that's why he's subject to another third term coming in the fall. He changed the China Constitution to allow unlimited presidency.

• 1:32:50Speaker 05

  But when he become.

• 1:32:53Shawn Ryan?

  He's the one that changed that?

• 1:32:56Speaker 05

  Well, so-called voted by ninety-nine percent of nine, ninety-nine percent, um, um, you know, people of Congress, which is upper step, people's Congress. China's Constitution says

• 1:33:12Speaker 05

  all Chinese parties are under dictatorship of China's Communist Party. Read that. So, but under Deng Xiaoping,

• 1:33:25Speaker 05

  he did say we should have term limit. So Deng limited himself to two terms or five years, ten years. And same thing happened to Hu Jintao and Jiang Zemin. But Xi come to power, he got rid of that. So people should know that. Why?

• 1:33:47Speaker 05

  He has, we call him a, um, new Mao. New Mao.

• 1:33:53Shawn Ryan?

  He's that bad.

• 1:33:55Speaker 05

  He's a hardcore communist.

• 1:33:59Speaker 05

  And so they, even celebrities were quiet now in China. All the YouTuber celebrities, famous actress, actors and billionaires and millionaires got rich from my past China's um limited free market capitalism and allow private industries and private enterprises. And um and they were kind of staying low file, keep their head down now. And sometimes they disappear. China is famous for disappearing people. In my row house, community housing courtyard,

• 1:34:43Speaker 05

  I heard two neighbors disappeared. Their family never find out what happened to them. I don't know what happened, I was a child. But my dad told me, yeah, they're gone, they went to business trip, they're just gone. And the people still disappear today in China. And there are dark prisons called prisoners of conscience. And the human rights lawyers, if you practice human rights as a career, as a lawyer, that's a very dangerous career for you to have in China. If I stay in China, I could be in the jail too by saying what I'm saying. And because I thought when you go study law

• 1:35:26Speaker 05

  is really to protect people, to promote the justice and equality. No, I was told in law school that law is a tool for the party to use to govern the masses. So all the Chinese people just masses.

• 1:35:53Speaker 05

  I was depressed. So remember I was, I was asked question at twelve years old. At seventeen, I went to law school. I was asking question again. So I wanted to study law. To help my country to become a society, a rule of law. And heard my professor telling me that. Then I got depressed again. I was lost soul for two years after Ma's death. And now I was lost in law school. What should I do with my life?

• 1:36:30Speaker 05

  So I become rebellious teenager. That's my awakening started happening. It's I become rebellious teenager in college. And we were subject to departmental education mandates. So when I first went to law school nineteen eighty one, which is college degree for four years. And they banned us also from here laying down still.

• 1:36:55Speaker 05

  Ban dancing parties. And the ban blue jeans. Blue jeans is western lifestyle. Cannot wear blue jeans to go to school campus. And but we were rebellious, we didn't care so much. So we would just constantly had our hair wet. And it's like, oh, my hair is wet, I just had shower, I cannot put up, I need to get dry. So here lay down pass you sure we constantly fighting with the, you know, guards at the gate. Because my dormitory was outside. And so eventually, um, we got a boombox to play music on the hallway of dormitory. Dormitory lights shut off at ten P M. As adults, college students, we had a curfew.

• 1:37:40Speaker 05

  Ten P M, all the lights came off. Ten P M. So as college kids, we could not sleep. And we were learning how to dance in the hallway. With the boombox, you know, like cassette, play cassette. Play dancing music to practice our footsteps, you know. And because we had to run into um dormitory bathroom at night. It's one location in the hallway. So they had to keep the lights on in the hallway. And one year later, finally. Um, they say, okay, you can have dancing parties now. The eighties was like China's cultural relishance. Remember that leads to Tiananmen Square nineteen eighty nine students protest?

• 1:38:24Speaker 05

  We had a Hu Yaobang as the China's new premier.

• 1:38:31Speaker 05

  He wanted to have political reforms. Besides economical reforms under Deng Xiaoping to say. You know. Chinese people should decide. What kind of country, what kind of political system they should have. He did not even say two-party system. He did not say overthrow the Communist Party. He just say we should discuss that. Maybe we should talk about. Democracy. Then. He got marginalized. He lost his position. When I was, I think that time in the eighties. And. That's another story about then leads to Tiananmen Square. Massive peaceful protest.

• 1:39:16Speaker 05

  But I was in college, oh, now we can have dancing parties and I we can wear whatever we want to. And our pictures transitioned from black and white. To Kodak. Color film. All the stream vendors were sending Kodak color film. And I start to wear very. Bright colorful clothes. And I was told not to in in in the high school and middle school. And. And I went to dancing parties almost every weekend. And. I learned disco. Like we're twenty years behind. And. But we studied, we we learned disco. I just just be able to.

• 1:39:59Speaker 05

  Shake your booty, shake your body anyway you say fade with a very. Fast beat music. We feel sense of liberation. Sense of. Freedom. Oh, that was the. Best time of my life in college up to that point. And. I did skip classes because I lost interest in the legal system they want me to study. And I was very interested in foreign students and faculties on campus. There were some exchange students. And we invite them to our parties, so all private party inside dormitory.

• 1:40:40Speaker 05

  And ask them, hey, what are your country like, what are your country like, my English was very bad. I I couldn't understand much. But one American student. Changed my life. And he met me at a dancing party. He said Lily.

• 1:40:59Speaker 05

  I want to show something from America. And gave me his student exchange building address. I want to visit him. And all foreign students and buildings. And have guard, all Chinese students will have guards, all buildings have guards, security guards. Nobody is like a, a old lady or man retired, watch everything. So I had to go fill it up. Who I'm gonna visit, time in, time out, what I'm gonna talk about. And where's my address, what major I have as college student. So I went to his room. I thought I was gonna, I had no idea what to expect. You know, something from America, cool, awesome.

• 1:41:44Speaker 05

  And he actually showed me a pocket constitution. He said, have you heard of this? I said, no.

• 1:41:54Speaker 05

  And he, I said my English is not good. But he read to me, I remember, oh, I remember. My English is good enough to remember. That all men are created equal.

• 1:42:11Speaker 05

  And I, I said. This is your founding document, what do you mean? And he told me that, Lily, it doesn't matter, you're Chinese, you're woman. You have yellow skin. Say our founding fathers in America believe. All humans are born equal and they are. Children of God. Your rights come from your creator, not from any government. You, by being you, have individual right.

• 1:42:50Speaker 05

  I've never heard that before. I was getting emotional when I talk about this. I said, my life hopes came on. I say, I'll come back. I thought our talk was so fascinating. I say, I'll come back. And so I went back another time and because my English just wasn't good enough. And then he went through couple more with me, Bill of Rights. And I learned, hey, I have an individual right from first session. So second time when I go back to visit him, I did not register.

• 1:43:30Speaker 05

  I said, well, I have a right. I have right to talk to this person. Why should I register? Tell them what we're talking about and let them to track me. I have some common sense that they don't want, they don't like this. I can get into trouble by telling them what I'm talking about. So I basically just, the lady has to go to bathroom, pour a tea, just watch out, right? When she's gone temporarily, I just tiptoe run upstairs. And, and tiptoe run down. It makes good movies up there. Yeah. And, and I just remember he told me all those rights.

• 1:44:10Speaker 05

  Speech, religion, and the press, assembling, and the second amendment right. I was very impressed. Really, really, you have this. Oh, I just saw this country is awesome. So I still could understand lots of stuff and I just remember those rights. I say, this country would be awesome for me to come someday if I have to give up on China. He puts America into my head and the individual rights will never go away.

• 1:44:49Speaker 05

  So that they come. I graduated. I wanted to think Shanghai is so bad because I don't want to go back to my home province is very isolated next to Tibet, Sichuan province. And not many foreigners there. Most importantly, Shanghai is international open commerce city, then you have more foreigners, you have more business and and of course, uh, I wanted to stay in my same law school to teach. That's only way I can stay in Shanghai. We did not have a job market. When you graduate, everybody get a sign job.

• 1:45:28Speaker 05

  And I'm supposed to go back where I come from. I had to make lots, lots of extra efforts to to ask, please, please, can I stay in Shanghai? Can I get a? We were the first graduating class at the law school class. So we had five positions out of sixty students. And I wanted to ask for one of them for me to stay in Shanghai. And I think I might be the only two, one of the two students from outside Shanghai get that job because mostly they just maybe stay in Shanghai or something and and but it's so it it takes extra effort.

• 1:46:12Speaker 05

  And so, so they say, well, you, you are very, very sociable. You have good personality. Maybe you can stay in Shanghai, teach part-time and manage law firm on campus part-time. And because China was rebooting the economy and start to go international and nineteen eighty-five under the opening up reform, so so all the law school graduates naturally can practice law because we're so short of people. Remember colleges are closed under mouth. So we're the first graduating class. Now they probably require you have master degree or PhD to teach. So I was lucky to say, okay, with my bachelor degree, I can teach and I can be lawyer.

• 1:46:56Speaker 05

  And I loved my law firm job because my academic dean is expert on international law. So he and I would go travel to um, some big companies to consult with them. And I can be his assistant and also receive clients at our law firm on campus. But my teaching job, I love the students.

• 1:47:22Speaker 05

  But I had to be academically um restricted. There's no academic freedom, you need to teach what is allowed and PC. And so. I was told that be careful your students. My, people don't understand China universities or schools, they need to understand now. We have two lines of supervision. So every department on campus has Communist Party Committee and Academic Dean. And you have a president, chancellor of university. They have a party secretary. Who has more power is party secretary.

• 1:48:07Speaker 05

  So my department, you know, like a committee chair is very powerful.

• 1:48:14Speaker 05

  So so we have to, in order to teach in law school, you must join the party. Otherwise, they question your loyalty. So I was put on probational status for a year.

• 1:48:29Speaker 05

  On the party. To see how I behave, how I, you know, be politically correct. But as I said, because I was fighting with my Communist Party um committee boss to worry about my lifestyle. What is lifestyle? Anything you to, you do, you're doing with your personal freedom time. It's a lifestyle problem. He always say I have lifestyle problem. Means I went to dancing parties with my friends, with my, even some of our students are like when you're, I mean, I was twenty one, right? Twenty two there when you're younger. And then.

• 1:49:11Speaker 05

  And I was dating a boyfriend from Shanghai.

• 1:49:17Speaker 05

  And I was visiting his parents' home in Shanghai with his parents' invitation. Even share a bed with, you know, their daughter. And my party boss told me I have a lifestyle problem. I said, well, I said, well, I said, professor, what if your daughter is in out of state? You know, you would love to, for her, to have a whole family to go to, have a home meal. Because my family are so far away. And, but she said, you should not go to visit people's families before you marry them.

• 1:49:58Speaker 05

  You know, it's like a constant, like, bother you what you do with your free time and then what you teach in the classrooms. So within the first year of my law school faculty member, I was fighting him. And, and that's when I think I kind of decided. Maybe China is not for me. I was not happy. I was oppressed. And I cut my hair short. I wore suits all the time, trying to look more mature. And you see some pictures I took. I really was depressed, third time. And after I become assistant professor of a prestigious law school in Shanghai.

• 1:50:42Speaker 05

  But so what? I wasn't happy. I was feeling oppressed. Can I imagine I go through my life like this for the rest of my life? I, I just couldn't. My friends who left China come to United States, mail me pictures. That was like eighty-six, eighty-seven that time.

• 1:51:05Speaker 05

  I saw beautiful an American, you know, rural country and animals and cows and farms and. And he he said, my friend said, America was such a presenting very well. Cause I'm happy and sociable, you know, very assertive with me. He said, you should come here because he can sense I'm I'm I'm really depressed at that time. So he encouraged me, say, hey, just apply for some graduate school. So I start to apply for graduate school. I quickly realized if I want to come to America.

• 1:51:43Speaker 05

  I need to change my strategy right now because I need to get a permission to quit my job. If you don't get the permission to quit, you have to pay back all your past year salaries.

• 1:51:55Shawn Ryan?

  Oh.

• 1:51:56Speaker 05

  And you need a permission from your leaders to go apply for private passport.

• 1:52:03Speaker 05

  Then I have to get a visa. So I said, oh, if I'm going to set my heart now to really escape China for good. How I'm going to get permission to leave if I keep kind of fighting with my boss? So I start to sell my lips, go to political study meetings weekly. And speak up, support the party, because I used to sit on there just quiet. And they can tell me, they can tell that I was challenging them silence by not saying anything. By look at their face and look into their eyes. And.

• 1:52:43Speaker 05

  So I have to change all that strategy to create a different kind of perception in order to leave. I got a, I met an American professor on college campus. And I asked him to sponsor me, say, I need to get out China. Can you help me? I need an American citizen is willing to sponsor me because I don't have money. I don't have family and friends. How I'm gonna allow to even get an enrollment acceptance and without scholarship or without money? How I'm gonna support myself? I I not not like other Chinese students, they all come here, study math, science, engineering, they can get a scholarship.

• 1:53:22Speaker 05

  I studied law in China. I could not get into law school, so I just want to go to graduate school for any social study majors.

• 1:53:31Speaker 05

  And and my English was bad. So my sponsor actually told me, I will sponsor you, but also I get you help. With one graduate school, the dean was my next door neighbor. So so next door neighbor was the dean of the School of Social Work in UT Austin, Texas. So I say, yes, please help. And my English is not good. I cannot pass GRE. I can barely pass TOEFL. TOEFL is like a, any foreign student must pass the English test to be accepted by stu- by colleges.

• 1:54:06Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:54:07Speaker 05

  Yeah, so so I got waived the GRE, which is a graduate school test. And to say, we'll waive that and we'll lower your TOEFL exam. And I will be your sponsor, so you could go get a enrollment, a notice, and get accepted. Then when you apply for passport and visa, you also have to show us all those financial paperwork. And so I went to um

• 1:54:37Speaker 05

  the passport local police station seven times. Before I went that, I went to my party boss. I got accepted by a graduate school. Can I please, please

• 1:54:52Speaker 05

  quit my job and go to apply for my passport? He said, well, consider your performance in the past years pretty good. And uh but you still need to sign agreement. He made me to sign agreement to say after your master's degree is done, even on your own time, on your money, did not cost a penny, you need to come home to serve your country. Okay? And or if you don't come back, there'll be two consequences. Number one.

• 1:55:27Speaker 05

  What gonna kick you out of CCP? I said, no problem. I was forced to join in order to have a teaching job in the school. Number two is kind of tough. Number two, they will send my household registration personnel file back to Chengdu. Back to Chengdu, where I grew up, I was born, my hometown. Because Shanghai is the first tier city, Chengdu is the second tier city, capital of Sichuan. To go from second tier to first tier city is very difficult, even today. You you are tracked by your household registration.

• 1:56:10Speaker 05

  If you don't have legal status in one city, you don't get the benefits. So if they kick my file all back to Chengdu, that means if I fail in this country, I do go back to China. And I cannot go back to Shanghai. I have to go back to Chengdu to get a job there.

• 1:56:30Speaker 05

  And I hesitated for one minute. I signed it, said no problem. I I will stick to the agreement. But in my heart, I said, I better make it. Otherwise, I have to go back my hometown, go back where I started.

• 1:56:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:56:49Speaker 05

  And where I was born. And so then my sponsor lent me money. Applied, you know, um, to have a visa and apply, I mean, for graduate school. And bought me an air ticket to fly to United States. I remember when I got visa after three tries. And everybody was shaking hand with me and touch my hair. Uh, because there were so many students lining up, long line to get visa. Once you get a visa, they feel like you, one foot, it's already in the US. So they want to touch your hair.

• 1:57:29Speaker 05

  And to feel the good luck, to give them some good luck, so they can get a visa next time. Oh, they said, oh, congratulations, touch my hair, said you one food is already in the US. And I was smiling too, I was so happy. So, because all I need now is the air ticket. And of course, we um, we have to go health screening, you know, do whatever legal way required by the US. And for student visa and and I then I and I flew for the first time, I actually. Flew home from Shanghai to Chengdu to say goodbye to my families, to say, you know, um, dad.

• 1:58:11Speaker 05

  I I will, I don't worry about finances, I will get rich, I will help you pay off for your debts. And my parents were in debt, that's why I had to raise, I had to raise one hundred dollars for my friends. One dollar equal lots of Chinese yuan, so it's like a several friends gave me the money. I, you know, I write down and I will pay you back with interest. I need the money, my parents had no money, I also raised money for my trip back home. First time take this airplane trips quicker, I didn't have time. And and my dad was crying, you know, this is second time he lost his salary. He lost salary before, when you get paid, they give you cash and somebody could rob you.

• 1:58:54Speaker 05

  And when you take a bus or something and he was so afraid to tell my mom to say. I cannot tell your mom, she'll get so mad, she'll get so sick, she might pass out. And I said, dad, don't worry, I will help. So I use some money I raised, gave to my dad and paid my own way. Back to Shanghai, raised more money, so by the time I come to United States nineteen eighty eight. May eleventh, I had one hundred dollars, five twenty dollar bills, all borrowed. And and later I discovered I was in the hole with my sponsor, twelve hundred dollars in debt to him.

• 1:59:36Speaker 05

  Cause he write down all the expenses for me to apply for graduate school, air tickets and all that. And I promise pay him back. And I I couldn't speak English. But when I arrived at Austin, Texas, um after like two stopovers, one was in Japan. And the first time I get out of China, like within like two hours, I was in Tokyo airport. It was like a totally different world. I just remember Japanese people were so polite and so clean there. And constantly ball, you know, I was doing the same thing. And I stopped by Denver. From Denver, I saw the Rocky Mountain, so beautiful.

• 2:00:18Speaker 05

  And then I flew over Austin, Texas, and my sponsor and picked me up. The picture you saw. My first day in America at Austin Airport with a huge, big smile. And that was the one he took. I'm very grateful he took that, otherwise I will have nothing to show for it. But I was so, so happy. After that day in my life, I will always call that. And that was my happiest day in life, you know, up to that day, which is two months. And before my twenty fourth birthday.

• 2:00:52Shawn Ryan?

  Wow.

• 2:00:54Speaker 05

  Now we can take a break.

• 2:00:55Shawn Ryan?

  You wanna take a break?

• 2:00:56Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:00:57Shawn Ryan?

  Let's take a break.

• 2:00:57Speaker 05

  Yeah, take break, drink water, use bathroom and because now we're gonna focus on what happens to me. After I started my new life in this country, right?

• 2:01:09Shawn Ryan?

  Yep.

• 2:01:09Speaker 05

  And and the same, so that was thirty four years ago. So, that's a long time.

• 2:01:16Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah, it is.

• 2:01:16Speaker 05

  But first twenty years, I was I was just learning, learning, learning. I was not political. I was not totally awake.

• 2:01:23Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:01:23Speaker 05

  So that's that's the that's the weakening process, yeah.

• 2:01:30Shawn Ryan?

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• 2:02:12Shawn Ryan?

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• 2:02:33Shawn Ryan?

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• 2:03:16Shawn Ryan?

  Like on call, literally, on delivery. Anyways, comes to your door, they're all individually packaged.

• 2:03:26Shawn Ryan?

  Like this, some good looking meat, right? Throw it in the freezer. You thaw them out. You never run out of meat for dinner. So, so you can have meat every single night. That's right carnivores. So what I need you to do is go to goodranchers.com/shawn. You're gonna get $30 off your first order and they're gonna ship you your meat for free. It's like a dream come true. So anyways, once again, go to goodranchers.com/shawn and get your meat shipped to your front door today.

• 2:04:12Shawn Ryan?

  All right Lily, we're back from the break. We just got to the part where you got to the US. You've been here for a little bit and, but I wanted to ask a question. What was, if there was any, was there any propaganda? Any negative propaganda toward the United States that they were telling you about before you made the trip to Austin, Texas?

• 2:04:35Speaker 05

  Um, when I was growing up as a child, um, of course China was close to the world. So every day, um, um, I think America, um, supposed to be an imperialist country. And there, I saw cartoons, I saw posters and, and the wars and, and talk about defeat. American imperialism all the time. Yep. And of course after China's opening up and Americans started to build in China. Foreign capitals coming and then, and that kind of demonization reduced.

• 2:05:15Speaker 05

  I remember my first, um, American movie I watched, I liked very much was translating into Chinese. It was like a gun was the way. We about the civil war and Jiang Denver um.

• 2:05:32Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:33Speaker 05

  I feel so sad when he died. He was um singing all their country and folk songs and beautiful voice and.

• 2:05:41Shawn Ryan?

  Why would they let you come to the US if we're an impure country?

• 2:05:45Speaker 05

  Well, remember um when China opening up and and they started to allow um exchange. Students programs, so the foreign students are able to go to China. And and Chinese students were able to apply for schools in the US. That was the beginning of the international exchange um programs. Um so but you had it was not easy, you had to apply, you had to get permission to leave. So as a result, there were also um student scholars were sent overseas to study on government money.

• 2:06:27Speaker 05

  So some of those we have to be careful, some of those were tied to the CCP, work for the government. They went to universities, laboratories and and so we have to be careful with that. But at the beginning, though, China was a focus on reboot the economy.

• 2:06:42Shawn Ryan?

  Okay.

• 2:06:42Speaker 05

  Because they were less focused on political ideology. And then Deng Xiaoping said, no matter, you know, if you're a black cat or white cat. If you can catch a mouse, you're a good cat. That means let some people get rich first. So my neighborhood, the first guy who ever left the state factory job was a young man who said. I'm going to start a restaurant. And he was the first one got rich in my poor neighborhood. He worked day and night on his restaurant. He was the first one bought a motorcycle besides everybody was still riding bicycles.

• 2:07:25Shawn Ryan?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:07:25Speaker 05

  And later he built a. Kind of little bit more um modern and housing for his parents uh in the countryside. By the time I went to college and he was the only one who had the money to give me a gift. A little pink long sleeve shirt. I wore that shirt because it was brand new clothes I got. And to walk into my college campus nineteen eighty one.

• 2:07:54Shawn Ryan?

  Oh.

• 2:07:55Speaker 05

  Yes, I remember. I don't know where he is today. I'm all lost in touch. But I remember that very, very well. They brave entrepreneurs, Chinese, who left the government guaranteed job to start their own business and they got rich quick. Because China was just wide open, no private entrepreneurs who were doing all kind of business.

• 2:08:15Shawn Ryan?

  So that just picked up rapidly?

• 2:08:17Speaker 05

  Yes, yes, uh which I support. I think um people were tired of poverty, tired of starvation. So when people could start their own business, they want to keep more what they earned. And look, the results, you know, it just took off. It worked.

• 2:08:34Shawn Ryan?

  Well, I got some questions. There's been a, I have a lot of questions, actually. And I know a little bit about some of this stuff, but I would really like to get your perspective on it since you lived it. And so one thing that I've always been interested in hearing about is the social credit scores. That's going, that are, that are going on over there. Can you explain a little bit about what that is?

• 2:08:59Speaker 05

  So in my last part one story I talk about, they tracked everybody from birth to death, right? My parents had to get permission to get married. And once you get married, you have to go to your local police station to register as a household formed. And when you add each child, you have to add a child into their household registration. And all the information is there. You get a little booklet. Okay, where you live, who you work for, and and how many people in your um household you get the benefits with that. You open up bank account, you go to hospital, you go to schools, you get your coupons with that.

• 2:09:41Speaker 05

  And when you become individual, like in student, you get a student file, track individual. When you become a worker, then you get a personnel file and continue tracking you. So, social credit system supposed be based on the traditional Chinese paper tracking. But now it's digital digitalized. They got, I guess, idea from a westerns, um, FICAT score, right? Yeah. They give you score to see your financial um status. And your behaviors, if you're worse, let for the people to lend you money, so you can pay them back. They call the social credit, because they discovered, wow, this big tech is so convenient to track people.

• 2:10:26Speaker 05

  Everybody got a cellphone, if you just tie to their cellphone with everything they do. And, you know, they they were tracking people anyway by the papers, but now it's so easy. You cannot delete anything once you track them by cellphone too, right? So, they started experiment in some uh big cities. I think now it's implemented all over the country. And they, basically, they used all different province um. Some credit agencies um by the provincial government. And to develop a system um to say that.

• 2:11:09Speaker 05

  Everything is on your cellphone, so show social credit not just about your financial behavior anymore. Like, you you own money, did you pay back on time, you own somebody stuff, did you pay your mortgage on time? Now, social credit means, how many Facebook groups, oh, not Facebook, China don't use Facebook, banned. Um, how many online, like, groups you have? What did you say on online? And did you say anything anti-government? Did your friends say anything anti-government in those groups on WeChat? So, you are judged not just by your own speeches, behaviors. But you also are judged by the social networks you belong to. They say you belong to fifty WeChat groups.

• 2:11:54Speaker 05

  And some of those group members say something not politically correct, needs to be censored. That can affect your score. And also, they put everything on your phone to, like, a.

• 2:12:10Speaker 05

  Let's see, they start, normally they start with one, everybody get one thousand points, right?

• 2:12:17Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah, everybody, hold on, everybody starts with what?

• 2:12:20Speaker 05

  With one thousand points.

• 2:12:22Shawn Ryan?

  One thousand points?

• 2:12:23Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, that's a starting point. So if you behave seven one, you share, you study Chairman Xi's Red App. And you see something, you share something, that's good, they want you to share, you get the points. And you, you, you, you don't owe any debt. And you comply with everything. And the ones you can get a bad point is okay, you owe lots of debt, you don't pay back. So your financial situation credit is bad. And you see something, they don't think it's right. Either on social media, on your, on your phone, because everything is done on your phone now with apps and stuff and watch and share.

• 2:13:06Speaker 05

  And um, let's say if they catch you um, going to churches, you're not supposed to go in church. And because the churches stay sectioned, you have to go to Chinese state permitted churches. If you get caught, go to other places like home church, which is banned, then you get a reduced points. And once your points getting so low, like below six hundred or something. Then when you go to buy train ticket, airplane ticket, they say, well.

• 2:13:44Speaker 05

  Your credit, your social credit score is so low, delayed, you cannot travel. Cannot borrow money to buy anything. Your kids can be affected by you, credit score cannot go to the best school possible. Cannot get a promotion, cannot get a mortgage, a business loans. So everything is, is a political size, it's just a lot more than fake a score now. So I say that's so dangerous with covid right now. Everybody has a QR code on the phone. So when they want to find out. What is your status by testing you every day, right?

• 2:14:28Speaker 05

  Um, it's a code has to stay green color. So if you go to get tested, if they say, well, we test you and your code is red or orange. You lose your freedom, you cannot go out.

• 2:14:45Shawn Ryan?

  Wow.

• 2:14:46Speaker 05

  So you still got to go swipe it, you got to go swipe and your phone app and QR code stay green. You can have your permitted freedom. That's why you see the big cities now all go nuts. Used to be bustling, busy cities, people have small business, going to restaurant to eat and movie theaters and shopping.

• 2:15:10Speaker 05

  I just saw a video last night about Shenzhen, which is like the um. One of the most open international special economic zone city in Shenzhen next to Hong Kong. It's like a ghost town.

• 2:15:25Shawn Ryan?

  Really?

• 2:15:26Speaker 05

  Very few people outside, shopping, dining.

• 2:15:28Shawn Ryan?

  Where are they going? Are they all stuck inside?

• 2:15:32Speaker 05

  There's long line, testing.

• 2:15:34Shawn Ryan?

  Everybody's getting.

• 2:15:35Speaker 05

  Covid nineteen testing. And my friend in Chengdu just said, oh, I was a house quarantine for five days. I had to learn how to cook because he used to run his wife to cook, it happened to be his wife. Was traveling somewhere else in a hotel and he was quarantined, could not go out for five days because one positive cases in his district. Everybody's getting locked up.

• 2:16:02Speaker 05

  So he said, oh, I cook some simple meal, show us picture, said five days, five days. I was going crazy, he said. At least I could teach some classes online, otherwise I don't know what I'm gonna do because five days by yourself at home. And you couldn't go out, you had to cook something. But in Shanghai, my friends were locked down for ten weeks. They run out of food to cook. Then you then government deliver your food and there was corruption, high prices. So they were hungry, they have money, they are retired lawyers. They were hungry and so I'm just afraid see this kind of system.

• 2:16:41Speaker 05

  Already affected leaders in the free world. Did you save vaccine passport? Yes, similar to China's social credit system, tracking people. And you saw right now E S G score, have you heard about E S G score? Um, environmental, social governance score. Which is adopted by um S P five hundred global rating agency to rate. Cities, state government, private corporations, public traded corporations. Your score based on climate change. Like let's say Utah state.

• 2:17:26Speaker 05

  The state treasurer said, my state is financially responsible, but we got a not so good E S G score. Because they judge you by climate change standards.

• 2:17:41Speaker 05

  How many companies you have in in terms of renewable energies? How many oil gas companies you have in your state? It's a political size, you have to comply with their narratives. With this kind of, I called almost like a new agenda, global agenda. Make you comply, affect our supposed be financial market, capital market. Like a did learns, did they learn something from China's social credit system? So long term, if you think about it, they can do this to our state agent, states, cities.

• 2:18:23Speaker 05

  And the public treaty companies, and they're gonna tell you, small business owner, private company business. And they're gonna tell you individuals later. Everything is subject to permission and license from the government.

• 2:18:38Speaker 05

  On politics, their political talking points, so everybody got to comply and told the lie. Otherwise, get cancelled. Look what they're doing now, cancelling media, like comedian's shows. You have to say the right words, you get censor words. That's exactly what happened, right? In in under mouth, words are censored. Scientists, artists, musicians, all have to be careful to be PC. Dangerous stuff.

• 2:19:04Shawn Ryan?

  Does that tie in with the camera systems as well? In one podcast, or or I think it was a podcast, I had heard you mention that there are there is one camera per every two citizens in China with facial recognition technology.

• 2:19:22Speaker 05

  Yes, they use this uh western technology to make those lots of facial recognition cameras. So you can have millions people walking in the city. Everywhere you go has a facial recognition cameras. And also equipments to recognize your voice. When you go apply for a new cellphone in China, you scan your face. And you record your voice. So everything that on your cellphone later is tied to that. There's no privacy, you cannot go hiding. A- as a foreigners, when you go to China, when you maybe when you go through customs.

• 2:20:07Speaker 05

  And now you know why Olympics athletes, when they went to China, they were recommended, don't take your cellphone. Take a uh like a cheap, one-time disposable use phone.

• 2:20:18Shawn Ryan?

  A burner phone?

• 2:20:19Speaker 05

  Burner phone or even laptop, so that you don't have something and get it installed. And then start to track, monitor everything going on on your phone. Uh it's a it's a totally um surveillance state.

• 2:20:36Speaker 05

  They they don't think we deserve any kind of privacy. And I I read this funny joke, one government official use his phone um to pay for prostitute, got immediately arrested. It's like, how stupid are you? You don't know how they out of it? They're also trying to get rid of cash. In China now, your banking record, your bank account, you, everything is connected with app on your phone. So when you use your phone to pay for stuff, it's all tracked.

• 2:21:13Shawn Ryan?

  Well, they're doing that here now too. I mean, what was the? They just came out with um, I can't remember the dollar amount, but I think it's if you have, is it if you spend more than, I can't remember the amount.

• 2:21:29Speaker 05

  What?

• 2:21:29Shawn Ryan?

  If you spend more than, or if you have a certain amount in your bank account, then the government tracks.

• 2:21:36Speaker 05

  Well, remember, remember, used to be.

• 2:21:40Shawn Ryan?

  Five thousand?

• 2:21:41Speaker 05

  Used to be ten thousand dollars.

• 2:21:43Shawn Ryan?

  Five hundred, it's five hundred dollars.

• 2:21:44Speaker 05

  Now it's like a, it become like five thousand. I even don't know what is the current number now. Um, that's why the big banking, subject to government regulations, in the name of, remember, used to be in the name of anti um terrorism war, right?

• 2:22:03Shawn Ryan?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:22:03Speaker 05

  Then they're gonna track everything. You think every cash you withdraw, um cash, could be potentially drug money you take or you deposit. And I was told by my bank, a few years in Colorado, anything over five thousand dollars, at the end of the day, they send all their record from the bank to this government source.

• 2:22:26Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:22:26Speaker 05

  A site. And.

• 2:22:29Speaker 05

  That's why you know why people like cryptocurrency, right?

• 2:22:34Shawn Ryan?

  Well, China banned that too, correct?

• 2:22:36Speaker 05

  Well, they don't want competition.

• 2:22:39Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:22:39Speaker 05

  They want their own cryptocurrency. You know, China are trying to promote one and it did not take off and they banned Bitcoin. They banned lots of cryptos, but still they just created black market. People still use that because lots of Chinese, we all see Chinese today. Their monies are stuck in China. So how do they get them out? Uh, you know, and, and so sometimes they have to figure out creative way or private way. So they look at the blockchain technology and they also look at the offshore. Um, business accounts like that's why, you know, Hong Kong, they just took over Hong Kong.

• 2:23:20Speaker 05

  And because actually lots of businesses use Hong Kong that time to do business and to also wash money. And but now they they all have to, you know, really um, keep their head down. When you talk about public facial recognition camera law, I remember the goal is to have six hundred million. Public facial recognition cameras throughout the whole China.

• 2:23:47Shawn Ryan?

  Six hundred million?

• 2:23:49Speaker 05

  Yeah, we have one point four billion Chinese. China has one point four billion Chinese. United States, think about, we have like a three hundred, what, three hundred thirty million people?

• 2:24:00Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:24:01Speaker 05

  Is that scary number to even think about it? And the voice recording? I, I, I don't know how people feel and if you go to Hong Kong now because Hong Kong lost to China control. As a foreigner, you go to Hong Kong. Um, because they impose national security law to Hong Kong. So if you have American passport, but you go there, say something, it's a threat to CCP. In the name of national security law, they can arrest you, lock you up. Yeah.

• 2:24:33Shawn Ryan?

  I guess I won't be visiting China anytime soon.

• 2:24:37Speaker 05

  Or you have to be careful what you say.

• 2:24:41Shawn Ryan?

  I've already said enough.

• 2:24:44Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:24:45Shawn Ryan?

  Do you think this, do you think they're trying to do that with the entire world? And that's what the TikTok thing is? I mean, the TikTok, TikTok's basically, it's essentially an enormous Chinese spy operation.

• 2:24:56Speaker 05

  People have to understand how China's system works. China is one-party dictatorship, the largest totalitarian regime in the whole world. And if a company gets that big, right? And Chinese entrepreneurs are pretty smart. They created lots of good product. But there's one thing they cannot escape, China's national security law. One-party dictatorship. Any company in China is subject to the one-party rule. TikTok on your kids' apps and have all their data.

• 2:25:40Speaker 05

  If the Chinese government says, peace, sip, I need all your users' data, they have to turn over.

• 2:25:50Speaker 05

  They, they are, they are not like us, like, oh, I want to protect the privacy. I, I cannot turn that over to you. My government always trying to get data on private citizens and, and you know, um. But in China, you have no choice. Or you lose your business, you get shut down. You know, billionaires disappear or, you know, forced to leave their positions, retire earlier, and force them to give to charities all the time, you know? And, and you also saw how dangerous this is. You saw what happened to trucker freedom in Canada.

• 2:26:28Shawn Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:26:29Speaker 05

  Trudeau, they learn a lot from Chinese Communist Party. So they shut down people's bank account. If you're a trucker, you don't want to comply to vaccine mandate, vaccine passport. You cannot withdraw money. And look what's going on in China today. That because the real estate bubbles start to burst, people who were paying for mortgages have not got their house built yet, their apartment built. And.

• 2:27:00Speaker 05

  And after they locked down, they want to bank to the to to get the money out.

• 2:27:07Speaker 05

  Bank around. No, you cannot with your money. So people start protesting and and they get beat up. In Henan province, there are some other cities. Now it's got more and more cities. People come out to say. We stop paying for mortgages. We have not got our apartment supposed to be built. And some company only went bankrupt, it will never build. We start paying for mortgages. And so because people cannot get the money from their bank. I mean, how do they I mean, they need the money to to to live. So they all just also just stop paying for mortgages. So hey, I cannot even afford food and rent. Why should I pay for mortgage? You will never deliver.

• 2:27:48Speaker 05

  I think the China economy economy right now is a it could have a financial or is already having a financial crisis. But you don't hear that. They want to censor that information. Remember, they control all the media. And they they don't talk about it.

• 2:28:04Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:28:05Speaker 05

  And China's debt is very high. Um, like two hundred fifty percent of their GDP. Their economy is big, supposed to be. If their number is even trust the word, eighteen twenty dollars GDP, then two hundred fifty percent of GDP is their debt. So but also they private citizens money deposit. It's lots of their, you know, cash and and. And banks assets, but now people stop paying for mortgages. How is this going to collapse China, economy and CCP and affect the world, financial market?

• 2:28:48Speaker 05

  And economy because unfortunately, so many people today still rely on China for the supply chains. And.

• 2:28:57Shawn Ryan?

  I think the whole world does.

• 2:28:58Speaker 05

  Yeah, the whole world does. It's like when you want to section Putin, but you rely on Putin for oil, for lots of supplies. And and for even food and fertilizer from Ukraine, of course, you're going to suffer consequences. So so I have been calling out that free world countries.

• 2:29:21Speaker 05

  Have been infiltrated by CCP.

• 2:29:24Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:29:25Speaker 05

  They have spent lots of money through their united front. What Chinese call.

• 2:29:32Speaker 05

  United front oversee branch to.

• 2:29:36Speaker 05

  Get money into Confucius Institute into our schools and colleges for past eighteen years. It, you know, I think last year, um, the last one just finished in New Hampshire. And but now the Confucius Institute funded by government by CCP is changing name. To very good name called Chinese International Education Foundation.

• 2:30:01Shawn Ryan?

  Really?

• 2:30:02Speaker 05

  Yes, and so that way they can use that to fund money into our. Colleges and still continue to um push for their agenda. In in, you know, indoctrinate our students, not just Chinese students coming here to study, have. University exchange programs and, you know, even Harvard, you know, like the. I mean, lots of the private university got lots of money from China. Uh, in the past and failed to report to our, you know, the, the, the federal government department of education is supposed to disclose that. So.

• 2:30:37Shawn Ryan?

  Well, they're setting up these companies all over the world that it's, you know.

• 2:30:41Speaker 05

  They bought lots of company during Covid too.

• 2:30:44Shawn Ryan?

  They're setting up companies all over the world. They pay the company and then the company donates the money to. The school or the business or or.

• 2:30:52Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 2:30:52Shawn Ryan?

  Whatever, so it's not.

• 2:30:55Speaker 05

  We need to follow their money. You are right. Follow their money. It's dark money. Called a dark money funded into our schools, nonprofit organizations, government, even interfere with our elections. Um, I don't know if people noticed that last year when Chinese professor was speaking Mandarin. He was bragging about.

• 2:31:18Speaker 05

  Interferes into US elections. He said, uh, wait, wait, that means Chinese government, we could not fix Trump. But now we have the friends in the highest US government. And that video got took down immediately, but lots of people like uh, shot it.

• 2:31:39Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:31:40Speaker 05

  Record it and keep the record. So they show you where they stand. They can buy companies, they can invest in your own local economy, create jobs. Buy land, they're trying to buy land and building this infrastructure for agriculture business in North Dakota right now, near Grand Fork. Our military base. And I was on their North Dakota TV to say, no, don't do it. You need to absolutely oppose this. And Senator Cotton has a bill to to ban Chinese firms tied to CCP from buying land. In America, I agree. I support that, you know why?

• 2:32:24Speaker 05

  As foreigners, even as a Chinese citizen in China, you are forbidden to buy land. Per Constitution of China, land belongs to the state. They could belong to the people, uh, people, the state, whoever has power. So you foreign companies, foreigners and Chinese citizens all cannot buy land. Why are we so naive? Let them come here, oh, Chinese firms come here to buy business, buy company. And set set up the buildings and went just shut down by FBI quietly in our capital. They could use Huawei, the very advanced surveillance equipment.

• 2:33:06Speaker 05

  To actually um, spy on our capital and our politicians, military's communication network. I, we have been very, very naive. And also, people thought, hey, China economy is good now, maybe we just keep doing business with them. And they will become like us, a democratic country. The opposite has happened.

• 2:33:32Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:33:32Speaker 05

  Yeah, very dangerous.

• 2:33:34Shawn Ryan?

  Let's talk about some of the concentration camps over there and I've heard you mention organ harvesting as well. How?

• 2:33:44Shawn Ryan?

  Common is organ harvesting.

• 2:33:47Speaker 05

  Well, I left China in nineteen eighty eight. In the nineties, my dad even told me there's this massive meditation practice called Qi Gong, later called Fa Leng Gong. Fa Leng Gong basically is a kind of a branch of, um, you know, Buddhist, um, movement to meditate. So it's a health practice. Uh, you sit down, you meditate, um, you know, kind of similar to yoga, but it it's more traditional Chinese style. And for a long time you meditate, it's very good for, um, health reasons. Some people cannot cure their health issues except doing this.

• 2:34:31Speaker 05

  So at beginning, the government promoted, the lots of people, Communist Party members also benefit from this practice and got cured. And, um, but they had like one time one hundred million members. And Chinese Communist Party only had like ninety million members. So they were huge. So one time their member was falsely arrested. So the Fa Leng Gong practitioners went to Beijing, near the compound of all the officials, just sit down there, meditate, and kind of like a peaceful protest. Jiang Zemin was the president that time.

• 2:35:14Speaker 05

  And he saw that as absolutely threat to the power, dominant power of CCP. So he banned it. Once he banned it in the nineteen, nineteen ninety nine, so this, that means anybody who practiced that gets arrested. And estimate one million people.

• 2:35:36Speaker 05

  Got arrested and disappeared into the dark prisons and without due process.

• 2:35:43Shawn Ryan?

  How many people?

• 2:35:44Speaker 05

  A many.

• 2:35:46Shawn Ryan?

  A million?

• 2:35:46Speaker 05

  Yes, without due process.

• 2:35:48Shawn Ryan?

  For meditating?

• 2:35:50Speaker 05

  For meditating, for practice this Falingong. And they're very healthy people because, you know, this is good for your health to practice this. Um, I heard that I was already in this country. I had to learn about that. And I heard all of a sudden China um was accused to use their organs while still their life. Because Chinese culture do not encourage people to donate organs. They want to die as a whole body. And there's no cultural tradition of, oh, I'm gonna donate my organs to save another life.

• 2:36:29Speaker 05

  But now you can go to China, you know, there's phone conversations and records and test money to show. You can get a liver, you can get a uh kidney for about one hundred seventy, one hundred eighty thousand dollars per each. And waiting for three weeks.

• 2:36:51Shawn Ryan?

  Three weeks?

• 2:36:52Speaker 05

  They're fresh, very fresh. And the whistleblower start to tell people, once, once they come out to say, I was forced to take organs. I couldn't do it. I, I, I, you know, escaped and. And the United Nations were urged to investigate. China denied it. And some western countries, like I think European countries like Great Britain, maybe Canada, all condemned it. And forbidden their um organ tourists go to China to schedule for organ transplant surgery. Because they said that's crime against humanity. I was just in DC, um, middle of July.

• 2:37:34Speaker 05

  I marched with the Falingong practitioners, two thousand of them, at the, at the Capitol. Every year, um.

• 2:37:43Speaker 05

  Then, uh, June, I think it's July twentieth. Uh, it's the, and their anniversary to be banned and they will protest here. And they were so decent people, they were meditate, they were march. And they will hold the signs to, you know, to against this crime against humanity, stop. Organ harvesting. Um, I think we need to really come out strongly, support these people. Their, their base is in New York, but they go to DC and in New York, they protest and every year.

• 2:38:14Shawn Ryan?

  Whose organs are they harvesting?

• 2:38:16Speaker 05

  They Falun Gong practitioners. Uh, they're healthy. Um, I saw some pictures that they will give you injection, like if you were in the prison, they give you injection. Where you were kind of passed out and they take your organs and take your cornea from your eyes. Yeah.

• 2:38:37Shawn Ryan?

  So they're taking it from prisoners?

• 2:38:39Speaker 05

  Yes, and they die, then they die. And here's another thing, I-

• 2:38:45Shawn Ryan?

  And just for the record, it's prison in China doesn't necessarily mean you're some type of a felon.

• 2:38:53Speaker 05

  No, those are Falun, there's a-

• 2:38:55Shawn Ryan?

  You could have a, maybe a low social credit score.

• 2:38:59Speaker 05

  But they are Falun Gong practitioners, that means they are prisoners of conscience. Because their religious belief and they practice meditation. So there's no trial, no due process, you don't know who is the person. So they go there, keep them and they test them, they keep track of their health. And when they have, uh, when they need your organs and you have a match. Then you get to choose and pick and basically murder you for organs. Some people say the Xinjiang, like a Uyghur's cultural genocide is going on. Maybe they are also, if they run out of Falun Gong practitioners, they might have to look at the

• 2:39:41Speaker 05

  cultural genocide Xinjiang Uyghur people who got arrested in the prisons. Maybe they could be also the target. Uh, they're saying is so China is one of the five Security Council of United Nations and the Council of Human Rights, uh, Council.

• 2:40:00Speaker 05

  No investigations.

• 2:40:02Speaker 03

  None.

• 2:40:03Speaker 05

  I think that the western free world countries really need to come out strongly to condemn this. And also tie that human rights violations abuses with our trade deals with China.

• 2:40:20Speaker 05

  I I'm just worried, I want to warn our business people. Think about what is long term consequences of you, just focus on profit money making inside the China market. Remember Lenin said, let's deal with capitalists, let let them make a rope sell to us. Or buy rope from them, but we will use the same ropes to hand them later.

• 2:40:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:40:46Speaker 05

  So we need, I mean, why should we continue to do business with a country like that? I'm calling for decoupling from a P R C market. If you're still doing business buying from them, it's time to evaluate your options. Of course, as our country needed to bring our manufactured homes back here. Cut the regulations, cut taxes to give incentive for business people to manufacture their products here, to provide services here.

• 2:41:21Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 2:41:21Speaker 05

  But if you cannot compete, you have so much government rate tapes and control and the high regulations, climate change. That's why gas prices so high, you know, we have to buy from other countries, inflation is high. And and there are so many things that is caused unnecessarily by our bad democratic controlled government policies. That so we rely on China, we rely on Middle East for oil and and rely on Russia, I mean Europeans heavily rely on Russia. And doing business with those not friendly countries were hurting ourselves, were hurting our national security because you cannot even negotiate

• 2:42:01Speaker 05

  from the position of for strength, was so weak as a country right now in the eyes, China's laughing at us. That's why they can threaten us and they can threaten us in policy to go to Taiwan. Let a unelected totalitarian regime to threaten democratically elected our representatives.

• 2:42:25Speaker 05

  Is this a wake up call? We should have wake up earlier, long time ago. Instead of right now, Biden is weak. So he's already talking about, you know, let go of lots of tariffs. And because, you know, we need China for lots of products and stuff. It's time to decouple from China's economy. If they're gonna threaten us like this, eventually, they're going to use a force to take Taiwan. They will not even care what we stand as the US government, as the people of the US. So we have to really take this very seriously. China is our biggest national security threat right now, not Russia.

• 2:43:11Shawn Ryan?

  What do you think, why do you think, excuse me, why do you think China is 100% behind Russia right now?

• 2:43:21Speaker 05

  Because they share these similar ideologies.

• 2:43:27Speaker 05

  Remember, Soviet Union was a communist Bolshevik country? And China has been always controlled by one party dictatorship. They have a more common ground than China with Western countries with the US. Democracy, freedom, personal liberties.

• 2:43:51Speaker 05

  They hate that. It's like, oh, you're gonna let your citizens, individual citizens have right to vote? And the right to criticize government? And the right to do like their business without our control? Without, you know, complying with our laws? You are a threat to us. It's all about their power, their control. That's what communists do. They don't value individual rights, freedom, liberty, and the private property. So all they capitalists want to sell China something. You know, now it's time to question long term, what's gonna happen if you continue to do this?

• 2:44:36Speaker 05

  Without hold China accountable for their human rights abuses? No, they can just threaten the United States whenever they want to. They were threatening to shut down Pelosi's airplane.

• 2:44:48Speaker 05

  What are they gonna do next? What if they really take Taiwan? Are we ready to have the free world totally shut down China's economy? Because they will use a force attack Taiwan, a truly democratic, you know, country. They might say, oh, Taiwan is part of us. Well, that's what they say. Well, that's why US has been very, very ambiguous about, oh, we, we, we, we have one child policy. And, you know, but we also will back Taiwan. So that's like a since nineteen seventy nine. Carter administration threw Taiwan under the bus, made a deal with Communist China. That's where we are today.

• 2:45:33Speaker 05

  But our elected officials can go to Taiwan, can talk to them, can call, can do business. And they can, if they want to, whatever they call it, maintain status quo. But we need to morally stand up for Taiwan. We need to militarily sending whatever equipments they need. And then they need to hurry up. I heard there are some deals got delayed by Biden administration. And Taiwan is under risk right now. So we need to do lots of things right. If you don't decouple with China, now how do you do economic sanctions against China? If they invade Taiwan. Why are we still allowing Chinese big firms come to Wall Street?

• 2:46:17Speaker 05

  And, you know, you take advantage of our free markets and capital investment. Lots of dollars, lots of dollars. Include some pension funds in the United States, invest in China, maybe managed by BlackRock. Very big in China. And so we need to look at all expect right now, reevaluate what we have been doing in the past, like twenty something years since China joined WTO, the World Trade Organization.

• 2:46:46Shawn Ryan?

  What is, what do you think China's end game is? What is their, what is their goal? Is it world domination?

• 2:46:54Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 2:46:55Shawn Ryan?

  Is that what it is?

• 2:46:55Speaker 05

  It's called Xi Jinping's Chinese dream. He called that Chinese dream.

• 2:47:03Speaker 05

  It's not Chinese people's dream. Chinese people are the biggest victims of their own regime and government. They're not treated as human beings. So Chinese dream is CCP Xi Jinping dream. By twenty forty nine, it's on their agenda.

• 2:47:25Speaker 05

  PRC will become the dominant power economically, largest economy in the world. They're second largest right now after US.

• 2:47:36Speaker 05

  Militarily and politically. That's why they used the Silk Road Initiative. One like a one one bell, one road. Being scholars, international debt trap, investing in developing countries. I went to South Africa two thousand eighteen. As soon as I get off the um major airport. A big sign, back of China leads Africa people to prosperity. And they gave money um as loan to Sri Lanka. Sri Lanka final bankruptcy, right, is come, you know, they took over.

• 2:48:20Speaker 05

  Um the Sri Lanka's airport, once they stop paying the debt, they could not make the payment. And China took over Djibouti, uh Africa country as a military base there because they also use the Silk Road Initiative. Um people start wake up to say, maybe this is dead trap. You know, very, very good interest, um low interest loan to big infrastructure projects. But as soon as you cannot pay, uh they take over, you lose power to negotiate. And guess lots of those governments anyway. Croppings everywhere.

• 2:48:59Shawn Ryan?

  There, I mean.

• 2:49:00Speaker 05

  Like, who knows what they're doing with their money, right?

• 2:49:02Shawn Ryan?

  For the goal to be global domination, they're doing a pretty damn good job. And they're doing everything that they should be doing.

• 2:49:12Speaker 05

  Right.

• 2:49:12Shawn Ryan?

  And they're gonna take it without firing a shot.

• 2:49:14Speaker 05

  And they're doing BRICS now. So BRICS, like, uh, like, uh, the western countries have, like, a G seven, right? And they want to their own, you know, like, uh, alliance. So, used to be the, you know, the, you know, BRICS and the, that means, you know, like, I think, um, you know, India, China, Russia, and, um, some countries in it, um, now they're gonna expand it. They just talked to North Korea and Iran and all those, uh, not friendly countries with US.

• 2:49:49Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:49:49Speaker 05

  To invite them to join China's BRICS alliance.

• 2:49:56Speaker 05

  So we have to be very smart about what we're doing before it's too late. And, uh, they, uh, the communists, people might be naive to think after falling of Berlin War, that, uh, oh, you know, communism took a pause, took a break. No. China's communists learned from that. They do not want what happened. Today, collapse of Soviet Union happened to them. So they are very, very, um, savvy in terms of how we are going to maintain power, influence, controlling the world. Their people are hungry, starving, but they spend lots of money overseas.

• 2:50:41Speaker 05

  And to formalize this, to buy foreign companies, foreign government, corporations, even YouTuber influencers, they created those YouTubers who can make China look wonderful. There are some all over the world. You can tell, they, they probably got money from China and they, they talk to their narratives. And I watch both because, uh, even in also Mandarin Chinese, so get to know what they're talking about, what is their argument. And guess what? They bought AMC, our movie theater chain owned by Chinese firm.

• 2:51:22Speaker 05

  All the newspapers in this country, Chinese Mandarin newspapers, they were the big shareholders, Chinese were. Look how many of them interview me, except the NTD TV and the airport times. Those are the media empire started by Falun Gong practitioner, they are anti CCP. All the rest, they don't interview me. I am the only Republican candidate in the whole country right now for Congress, born and raised in Communist China.

• 2:51:57Shawn Ryan?

  Well,

• 2:52:00Shawn Ryan?

  earlier today, off camera, you mentioned that the CCP has been in contact with you, has threatened you. What, how are they contacting you? What are they threatening you with?

• 2:52:12Speaker 05

  Well, I wanted to, I wanted to actually go back to China, visit my family, friends, 2019. I think they discovered me right before my trip from social media on Facebook. I post something people like, share a lot. I talk about how, you know, I came to this country with nothing, now I'm living American dream and I fled tyranny and poverty, come here. I was educator. I'm still on the Speaker Bureau for VOC, Victims of Communism and Moral Foundation based in DC, to educate our kids in middle school, high school, colleges.

• 2:52:56Speaker 05

  And I also go to long parties and organizations, grassroots and and, you know, to speak about my personal experience, horrors of communism, socialism. Because I discovered, they need eyewitness like me to go. And they discovered me because of my speaking for past five years as, you know, educator, speaker. I have lots of followers, so when I post something, they get to share like a lot. And they discovered me. Then they start to come on to attack me, troll me, and threaten me. And 2015.

• 2:53:35Speaker 05

  I had my AR-15 picture front of US flag. That picture was seen by 1.3 million people on social media, online. I, I warn people that, you know, the largest killer, the champion of mass killer is always a tyrannical government. Look what happened Tiananmen Square. And I got threatened. They even threatened my children. And I, I think the threat come, I think at that time, it was overseas or something, so I totally ignore that.

• 2:54:12Shawn Ryan?

  What, how did they threaten you? What did they say?

• 2:54:15Speaker 05

  Oh, most of them just say, oh, you look so scary by holding down that AR-15. And one guy later, my husband found out he was based in UK. And he said, watch out lady, like I'm going to, um, use that to, like, what do you call the crush your daughter's head or something, my children, my, my daughter. And so-

• 2:54:41Shawn Ryan?

  How do you know that's CCP?

• 2:54:43Speaker 05

  I don't know. I don't know that. But, so we let that go because that was 2015, one gun picture, right? My AR-15 picture talk about, but the CCP spies are everywhere in the world, not just in the US, in free world, all over. And my husband did a call, we did a call FBI and then said, oh, don't worry, it's like a trace to somebody in UK. We also reported to Facebook. Then 2019, there were long stop, like 12 of them, some dressed, some is white, some is Chinese, some is Indian looking. And they, they threatened me in both Chinese and English, bad English, and they copy paste, copy paste. Call me all kind of bad names, call me say agent, traitor, you know, like yellow dog.

• 2:55:25Speaker 05

  And, and don't you ever want to come back to China or to Asia? It's like they own the Asia now. I cannot even go to maybe Thailand or something. Whenever they have a trading, then they can use national security law. And you know, like whoever they want, you know, this foreign country has to, you know, send the people they want back to China. So I had to cancel my trip. Then most recently-

• 2:55:53Speaker 05

  This February, I was already running as a congressional candidate. I did, I announced in January, I put on social media. I, oh, I'm gonna speak in Cache County of Utah. As keynote speaker for Republican Committee, two hundred, like two hundred fifty people, Republicans came to listen to my talk. And then one Chinese spy showed up out of two hundred fifty people, nobody knew who he was, a Chinese man in his thirties. Come to tape my whole thing, paid seventy-five dollars for the dinner event. And then I told people at table, you all been brainwashed by her. Our leaders are fathers.

• 2:56:38Speaker 05

  They're not like the United States, elected by the people, then left, never say hi to me. And the people thought that was strange, odd, so they told me about it. And Feng Jiang, that's the name, and they have his email address. And on the way drive to the speaking site in Salt Lake City, I saw one school had a sign there, Confucius Institute. That means their people are there nearby, so they saw me, told me on my social media, oh, I'm gonna speak there. Here's where you can register, pay money, and come, and he come. So that's why now, from now on, I don't put my location on social media.

• 2:57:18Speaker 05

  And when I went to California, speak to the, um, at the memorial for June Fourth Tiananmen Square massacre. They hired a security guard for the event. And, uh, cause you know, as somebody from New Hampshire, we have constitutional carry in New Hampshire. But I cannot do anything when I go to other, you know, um, state, big blue states and cities, you know. And so I'm telling people, because my unique voice and my stories, I can make impact in this country. And I cannot be corrupted, I will tell the truth. That's why I got lots of attacks, and not just CCP, maybe they will find no money attacks through my opponents in this race.

• 2:58:01Speaker 05

  And, uh, but I said, well, I survived Mao's Cultural Revolution. I will survive everything, liberty is my north star. I will do whatever I can to tell my stories, I cannot be silenced, I cannot live in fear.

• 2:58:21Shawn Ryan?

  You know, Lily, we covered a lot of ground and I want to start to wrap this up. But one of my biggest fears is that China has over 3,000 years of archived records, wisdom to pull from. We have less than 250 years of wisdom to pull from. And I, you know, if you look at it that way, the odds aren't, the odds aren't great when you have 3,000 years of knowledge to draw from as compared to what we have, 250. What's it gonna take for us to pull away from this?

• 2:59:04Shawn Ryan?

  And to get out, and, and, and, and, and to get out from under the China influence?

• 2:59:11Speaker 05

  I am a kind of terrified for our country. And I have been educated for five years, say, how the Marxist indoctrination happening in our schools. And I'm a very stark supporter of school choice, educational freedom account, and the parental rights and parental control. I've been telling people that what is going on today in America? I call that neo-Marxist cultural revolution I saw in China.

• 2:59:51Speaker 05

  There are lots of, I categorized 12 tactics and similarities between the one I survived and the, the current one is happening in the USA. But of course, it's not more scale, it's in selective places. But in, in terms of massive student indoctrination that are happening regardless, you live in red state, blue state, public schools. Why?

• 3:00:22Speaker 05

  Should the people wake up to ask why their parents lost control of what their kids are taught in schools? Why our teachers today are almost like a trained social justice warriors? Want to force down your kids through about critical race theory? About 1619 project? About social emotional learning? About transgender ideology into our kids? And if we as parents feel passionate against that and speak up at the school board meetings?

• 3:01:03Speaker 05

  Then you got the federal government could target you as a potential domestic terrorist? Are you kidding me?

• 3:01:13Speaker 05

  Parents who love their kids? Who don't want this kind of crap to indoctrinate their kids?

• 3:01:21Speaker 05

  I feel terrified because I see this similarity. For example, five red classes, five black classes. Under oppressed, oppressed. Happening here. There's a whole bunch of categories by some federal agencies now, if you dig into it, by whistleblowers. Whistleblowers. What kind of groups are oppressors? What kind of groups are under oppressed? It's scary, this similar. You're white male, you're born racist. So you're born by association, you're born guilty by something you cannot control.

• 3:02:04Speaker 05

  And you're guilty by something you said you did many years ago, they're gonna cancel you? Like lots of people lose jobs and careers, business because what they said done in the past. I don't know what else can come back to bite you? Like they can dig into 20 years ago. But they're so righteous. And I can be, I was called having extremism in New Hampshire after my first debate. And the New Hampshire Democrats tweeted the Granite Stateers in New Hampshire will reject my extremism.

• 3:02:43Speaker 05

  What is my extremism? I love America. I live in American dream. I don't want indoctrination in our schools. I do not think America is a systemic racist country. I believe in civil rights movement have come in long way. I love people to be united and to be, you know, like all created equal. I'm a people of color, minority, business, woman, and just love this country. I want to tell my stories, but I'm extremist. So if you don't believe in government and create a massive dependency on government, I use taxpayers' money to fund all those big government projects. Include all the government schooling without parental,

• 3:03:29Speaker 05

  you know, consent and control. I'm extremist. And I have seen conservatives got shut down, churches closed, and people are afraid to speak up. I have Democrats who write it to me anonymously to say, Lily, thank you for what you're doing. And we will vote, but we're afraid to speak up right now. We will lose our job, we will lose our careers. How many good teachers trapped inside of our schools, but afraid they walk activists? Look at our military, people are being fired because they could not get the religious exemption, vaccine mandate.

• 3:04:16Speaker 05

  And they're trying to offer, Army trying to offer fifty thousand dollars, sign up bonus for six years' service, but you have to get vaccinated. Use taxpayers' money to offer people, lots of young people I met, they don't want to join because the mandate, because the political size Army. So we are hurting our recruitment goal, we're hurting our readiness, China's laughing to the bank. Yes, our military is all focused on social issues, but not the readiness. And our federal agencies, are they still on people's side? Are they still swear to defend our constitution rights? And our politicians who are so divisive?

• 3:05:02Speaker 05

  And our people, lots of them don't know what's happening in China, what's happening in this country, what are happening in history, what's happening in Venezuela. I just met a Uber driver last night, dropped me off and my hotel said, "Lillian from Venezuela, my family are hungry, stuck there. I've been here, I'm illegal here for four years now, and I love America. I'm like you, I'm worried about America. Why are they all using similar tactics and terms here?" Equity, for example, is communist term, equal outcome. But the Corporation Trainings, called the Les Wines Trainings, D E I,

• 3:05:46Speaker 05

  D E I, Diversity Equity, and including trainings, all talk about equity. But they only talk about equity of skin color, of race and skin. But they don't want diversity for ideas, personalities, skills, talents. Most important diversity in my mind is actually diverse ideas, thoughts, voices, and problem-solving solutions. No, they don't talk about that. You have to toe the left line. I'm just worried about this country is becoming more and more like the country left. But I have a face in American people.

• 3:06:30Speaker 05

  I have a face in our constitutional republic that if people wake up, if people get to the truth, and there will be a massive walking away from that kind of far-right, far-left, far-radical ideologies. And we don't want to go down this socialist path. But there are one hundred members of progressive caucus people in the US Congress right now. And I will be a lumber when I get into Congress, like AOC, right? I mean, it's more than just a quad, there are like one hundred of them. And they all want socialist policies. And my Democrat opponent, Congresswoman Custer, has been there for ten years.

• 3:07:14Speaker 05

  She votes for those policies, she votes with them.

• 3:07:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:07:17Speaker 05

  And, and talk about equity all the time. You cannot have equal outcome without doing socialism and communism, which is use government force to redistribute wealth.

• 3:07:30Speaker 05

  Period. So we should not even use that term. But everybody is probably use that term from the left side. It it it really scares me and other immigrant to say, what's going on in America? It's really, I I always tell them, please, if you have good immigrant story, share that with me on my YouTube channel. We need more and more immigrants. Stand up, speak up to save our country now from this taking over destruction of, you know, far-left socialist policies, ideologies. Otherwise, we we have no place to go. This is our new country.

• 3:08:09Shawn Ryan?

  Yeah. Well, how do people find you?

• 3:08:13Speaker 05

  Um, they can go to my website, lilytangwilliams.com. I'm uh, um, having lots of interviews like this. My published articles, endorsements on there. And if all the grassroots people could donate twenty bucks and ten bucks each hour, really appreciate. I'm a grassroots Kennedy. I'm not establishment Kennedy. So I'm outraged in my primary. And the primary is September thirteenth. And I call my grass, my campaign is truly a grassroots movement, almost like a populist movement for life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness.

• 3:08:55Speaker 05

  And because we are human beings as individual person. And I am on social media, Facebook page, Lillie for Congress. I'm on Twitter, I'm on Instagram. I have YouTube channel, English and Mandarin Chinese. I'm a, I'm a very, very stark supporter of all our constitutional rights. Um, especially on Second Amendment, I'm the long compromised Kennedy. Without our Second Amendment rights, we cannot defend our other rights at all. And so I hope people will support me and donate to my campaign. If you're in New Hampshire, please also volunteer and share my messages, share my, um, interviews.

• 3:09:39Speaker 05

  And we're gonna win this. It's not about me. This is about our liberty, our American dream at stake.

• 3:09:49Shawn Ryan?

  Well, I just wanna wish you the best of luck and thank you for coming on.

• 3:09:53Speaker 05

  Well, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

• 3:09:56Shawn Ryan?

  You're welcome. We'll be watching.

• 3:09:59Speaker 05

  Yes, please. God is good since I come to this country. So, I believe God. I believe that ultimately goodness will prevail. Liberty will prevail. And the world, population who love freedom and love democracy will prevail in this world.

• 3:10:22Shawn Ryan?

  Alright.

• 3:10:23Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 3:10:24Shawn Ryan?

  Thank you. Like I said, best of luck.

• 3:10:27Speaker 05

  I appreciate it.

• 3:10:28Shawn Ryan?

  Cheers.