Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi

It’s estimated that one in five Americans suffer from mental illness—but where does it come from and what can we do about it? Well, today we’ve got our man Da'Vinchi in the building, and he’s dropping some major gems on mental health. From his experience growing up with what he calls “straight monsters” to a recent stalker situation, he’s breaking down all the forces that have impacted him over the years. Then he shares some scorching hot takes on dating famous people and “pussy popping” in a game of “Here for It, or Nah.” See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Keke Palmer?

  Hello, my lovelies. This episode is brought to you by Airbnb, of course. And if you are in need of New Year rejuvenation, remember to check out Guest Favorites, a collection of the most loved homes on Airbnb to find your next winter retreat. Now, let's start the show.

• 0:21Keke Palmer?

  Hello, it's your girl, Keke Palmer here. And let me tell you, listener, you're in for a good time, as always. Today, I have the lovely actor DaVinci with me, and we're getting into the topic of mental health and getting to know who exactly DaVinci is. I want to know all about his approach to advocating for mental health, as well as his own personal story. I mean, this is gonna be fun, because, baby, this is Keke Palmer.

• 1:15Keke Palmer?

  Hello, Sharon.

• 1:16Speaker 01

  Hello, hello.

• 1:17Keke Palmer?

  I really love this, because I usually don't get to be here with you.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  You look so pretty.

• 1:22Keke Palmer?

  Thank you, you always look beautiful.

• 1:23Speaker 01

  Thank you so much, I be trying, you know.

• 1:25Keke Palmer?

  So I'm excited to talk to DaVinci. Are you familiar with him?

• 1:29Speaker 01

  I am not. The name sounds familiar. Give me a little backstory.

• 1:32Keke Palmer?

  So DaVinci is an actor. I actually met him with Trevor years ago, when he was on... He's done a lot of different shows, like Grown-ish, All-American. He's also done a lot of talking recently just about mental health for young black men. He's our age, and so I'm excited to talk to him about that, but also get to know him a little bit more, because he's continued to rise as a talent. And it's been a long time since I've spoken to him, so it's gonna be a lot of fun to just see what he's learned and how he's grown in this industry since then.

• 2:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, that sounds cool.

• 2:02Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, yeah. But speaking of mental health and getting into this topic, I think it's changed so much. I mean, obviously, I didn't grow up in your time, but just when I hear you talk about things when it comes to mental health, it seems as if there was a different dialogue surrounding it in your generation than it is now.

• 2:18Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 2:19Keke Palmer?

  What would you... How could you describe how it was for you guys back then when it came to the concept of mental health?

• 2:25Speaker 01

  Well, I, I just think, first of all, I'm very happy and excited that your generation is like, not afraid to use words like triggered.

• 2:34Keke Palmer?

  You always bring that one up.

• 2:35Speaker 01

  I don't even know what the hell that even meant, triggered, you know, my mother used to say, you're getting on my nerves, go outside and play, you know what I mean? Um, and I think that there's, I think culturally, it has a lot to do with it too. Because I know just like in the black community where I was raised and outside of Chicago, it was embarrassing to admit that you had postpartum depression, like what the hell is that? Get up and take care of your kids. You know what I mean?

• 3:02Keke Palmer?

  Damn, y'all was tough as hell.

• 3:03Speaker 01

  It was like, what you mean she can't get out the bed to take care of her kids? She's lazy, what's going on here, you know?

• 3:10Keke Palmer?

  My gosh.

• 3:11Speaker 01

  So, and then also to say you're crazy, well, you know, that's your, that's your crazy cousin, you know what I mean? So, it was a very much a stigma with saying you were depressed or you weren't feeling your best. But I actually had a couple of cousins who would check themselves into the hospital for rest.

• 3:30Keke Palmer?

  Really?

• 3:31Speaker 01

  Yeah, now that I think about it now, like, back then, we would just go, well, you know, so and so's in the hospital for exhaustion, they just.

• 3:39Keke Palmer?

  I know we laugh at that, but it's the way of saying it.

• 3:41Speaker 01

  And we would just, we would talk about like, what? You could just check yourself in the hospital because you're tired? Well, you know, it's the psych war, but yeah, they'll evaluate you for a few days and they just said they needed a break from their kids and they needed a break. So, that was kind of like the first time, and I was a young woman in my early twenties, and that was the first time I had heard you could check yourself in the hospital.

• 4:05Keke Palmer?

  Yeah.

• 4:05Speaker 01

  For rest.

• 4:06Keke Palmer?

  Yeah.

• 4:06Speaker 01

  But I thought it was absolutely crazy.

• 4:09Keke Palmer?

  How did you?

• 4:10Speaker 01

  And had no pun intended, but I just thought like, how did you? I just thought like, all of us are tired, you know what I mean? We all have kids, we all have to work.

• 4:18Keke Palmer?

  Let's be honest, it's tough, you know what I mean? And I think, um, it's really cool what you're bringing up because I think the concept of mental health, it's, it's as if somebody is broken or, you know, someone is stronger than the others, but really, some of us just have coping mechanisms. That the world deems as okay or normal. What I mean by that is when you're nervous or when you're anxious, you start telling jokes. That's me. That's I become performative when I'm nervous or when I'm anxious or when I'm going through a stressful time. The way that I dealt with it, it created an entire career for me.

• 4:54Keke Palmer?

  Or being a workaholic, you know what I mean? That's a socially acceptable one. So I think the the thing is, is like, it's not so much that some people deal with it better. I mean, yes, some people do have the tools, but if we're thinking about in this era where people didn't have the tools per se. Especially inner, you know, inner city or impoverished communities. Some people just had coping mechanisms that were socially acceptable. You know, a man, maybe he has a lot of sex. Maybe he's a sex side. That's something that, oh, it's socially acceptable, actually it's a problem.

• 5:25Speaker 01

  Now with me, I've just become more defensive, like, what do you mean? What are you trying to say? Or what? Those those sounds like fighting words. What's what's going on here?

• 5:36Speaker 01

  So, no, and you're right, and I I guess like also with my generation is so and so is crazy. And you think they'll never be better. You know what I mean? So the whole concept of you can go and get help and actually be better. That's new to me.

• 5:53Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, you can actually feel better. Yeah, I think that's a big thing, because sometimes you don't know that you're not feeling good. I remember something big, it was a big phrase with grandma, and it was a bit of a big phrase with you is you're making my nerves bad.

• 6:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're on my nerves, getting on my nerves.

• 6:07Keke Palmer?

  Getting on my nerves, my nerves is bad, and obviously we know that now is most likely it was just anxiety. You know what I mean? I'm anxious, I'm feeling a little bit uneasy. And a lot of times, you people go through their whole life feeling that way and not knowing that there's another way that they can feel.

• 6:25Speaker 01

  Right now, like with my mother, my mother had been molested as a child. Um, and so everything around our growing up was about molestation. It was about watch this person, watch that person, don't go alone with this person. When you're walking on the street, don't walk too close to doorways, uh, blah, blah. It was always so. Everything was about you could be potentially attacked.

• 6:53Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 6:53Speaker 01

  And so that brought anxiety. And guess what? I told you the same thing.

• 6:59Keke Palmer?

  Yeah.

• 6:59Speaker 01

  So it was like generational anxiety, you know?

• 7:02Keke Palmer?

  Yeah. So when it comes to your kids, how did that affect your mental health? Like, if you think about who you were before then. And when you started being on the receiving end of your own love that you were pouring into us. How do you think that changed you? Your, your, your state of mind?

• 7:18Speaker 01

  My kids changed me for the better. I was not the woman that, oh, I'm gonna get married and, you know, have a picket fence and all these kids. I was the woman like, I'm not having any kids. I came from a family of seven. I was the baby. Uh, so it was like, I'm not having any damn kids. And then when I met your father in college and we, you know, got, started dating and he wanted kids and I was like, okay, I guess I could have one or two kids or whatever like that. But what my kids showed me is that how loyal I am, what a loyal person I am. And so once I started having you, I became loyal to being a mother. I became loyal to that role. And what, and what my kids.

• 8:00Keke Palmer?

  You ate that one thing.

• 8:03Speaker 01

  And what my kids taught me was to love unconditionally. No matter what's going on. You know, there were times when we didn't have any money and we had to go to the payday loan place. And your dad would give the title to his.

• 8:23Speaker 01

  He would give the title to his car.

• 8:27Speaker 01

  We would go to Blockbuster.

• 8:32Speaker 01

  We would go to Blockbuster and get movies and um Little Caesar pizza and we would sit in the living room and

• 8:41Speaker 01

  and you guys would be so happy.

• 8:43Keke Palmer?

  Thrilled.

• 8:44Speaker 01

  So um.

• 8:45Keke Palmer?

  Thrilled.

• 8:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's what my kids taught me that you can have fun and you could um raise your children in a way that money wasn't important.

• 8:56Keke Palmer?

  Hmm.

• 8:57Speaker 01

  And loving each other is more important and if you got two cents use those two cents to bring whatever peace and happiness to your children. And so that's what you guys taught me that you don't need a lot of money um.

• 9:11Keke Palmer?

  I love what you're saying.

• 9:13Speaker 01

  You don't need a lot of money for your kids to have fun. You just need um a plan. You need a plan. So we had a plan. We would every so often we would take the title to the car. We would get like maybe two hundred fifty dollars, three hundred dollars and we would um go to Blockbuster. Sometimes we would take you guys to the movies.

• 9:34Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, we loved it. That was a big part of our lives for us.

• 9:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, my even now um Lawrence, my son, he would say, Mom, let's go to the movies.

• 9:43Keke Palmer?

  Yes.

• 9:43Speaker 01

  You know, and so he and I'll go on a date to the movies.

• 9:46Keke Palmer?

  Oh, we love it.

• 9:46Speaker 01

  And I knew that was because as a kid, we taught you all that you could escape.

• 9:53Keke Palmer?

  Yes.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  In movies.

• 9:54Keke Palmer?

  Yes, y'all did. You with that we could that we could that we could like but I wanna pull even further into what you're saying, which I think is important when we're talking about mental health um is you know, we maybe didn't have therapists and maybe didn't have the words.

• 10:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 10:11Keke Palmer?

  But I think one of our greatest sources of combating what you guys were dealing with being in poverty, having to work over, you know, crazy hours of the day, being away from your kids, trying to pay for the school was community. I think community is is a big thing that also when we're talking about the internet, that a lot of times that is And that also affects our mental health is having somebody having being able to have those people to sit on the leather couch and watch a blockbuster movie with.

• 10:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 10:40Keke Palmer?

  I think that also helps with what you're dealing with in life is being able to have somebody to lean on and call on having your family like. They ask me a lot of times, what is it that helps you get through? What is it that helps you stay around? It's my family.

• 10:51Speaker 01

  Right.

• 10:51Keke Palmer?

  You know what I'm saying? And I think that it's important that we do have these tools, right? Like, you know, going to, you know, saying a prayer, meditation, yoga. A therapy, et cetera. But let's get down into it and really say, you got to create a community.

• 11:04Speaker 01

  You have to.

• 11:04Keke Palmer?

  You have to create a community because we can't do it alone. And and I'm not saying you got, if you're not a churchy person, you you ain't got to go to church if that's not your religion, whatever. But the point and the concept of it is to commune with people so that you don't feel alone. You know, I started therapy. I remember when I first told you guys that I wanted to do therapy when I was seventeen. Um, you know, then I've been in therapy since I was seventeen till now and I'm thirty. But obviously, when I started my journey of therapy, I also tried to pull the whole family into therapy with me. Um, so I I want to hear about what your initial thoughts were then? And then what has your experience been with therapy since then?

• 11:47Speaker 01

  Right. I don't know if if I can remember my initial thoughts. I just knew you were in. You know, anguish and you wanted therapy. So I've just.

• 11:56Keke Palmer?

  Anguish is a great word.

• 11:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I just support that. You know, what I I my mother listened to me. She would always say, finish what you have to say. Say whatever you want to say, because you know, I want to hear it. It may not change my opinion. Um, but I want to hear what you have to say. So I did, you know, I raised my kids the same way. Say what you have to say. And you know, we'll go from there. And so I just know I remember supporting you, trying to support you.

• 12:21Keke Palmer?

  Mm hmm.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  Um, even though maybe I didn't understand it, you know, but I I I tried to support you. And for me, I started going into therapy when your father was going through the Deakony program. So we actually had to do a lot of one-on-one therapy and.

• 12:38Keke Palmer?

  I didn't know that.

• 12:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like a four-year course of. You know, retreats and couples therapy. Then later on, I started having like one-on-one therapy with a nun. Her name was Sister Mary Kay. And I used to call Sister Mary Kay and we would talk for maybe-

• 12:53Keke Palmer?

  Yep, I remember her from church.

• 12:55Speaker 01

  And she just, to me, was a very kind person. It's funny because Sister Mary Kay read your first book. And she told me to tell you, um, to protect yourself. And I said, what do you mean by that? She says, because she has such empathy. And when people have so much empathy, people try to take advantage of that. And she told me-

• 13:17Keke Palmer?

  Such an eerie thing for Sister Mary to say.

• 13:20Speaker 01

  Well, I just took it as she saw, she read your book and she saw how kind you are. And she, you know, whatever, premonition or whatever, you know, I'm not gonna put words in her mouth. She just wanted me to tell you to protect yourself. It's okay to be kind and empathetic, but everybody don't deserve that kind of attention from you. When I used to talk to Sister Mary Kay, I still talk to her, but, you know, not as much. But one of the techniques, and I know now there was a technique. At the time, I didn't know it was a technique, but she would go, okay, so let me get this straight, Sharon. This is what you're telling me? And then she would repeat back to me-

• 14:00Keke Palmer?

  Right.

• 14:01Speaker 01

  What it was I was telling her.

• 14:02Keke Palmer?

  That's important.

• 14:02Speaker 01

  And then for me to hear it coming from her, I was like, man, that is what I said. That's not, something is wrong with that.

• 14:10Keke Palmer?

  Right, though, but that's important.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  So that was a technique that she was using and I didn't even think of it as a technique. But then I saw it in a movie and I was like, Sister Mary Kay used to say that to me.

• 14:21Keke Palmer?

  She's good at what she does. She's been a sister for so long. I remember I used to tell her, but if God is up there, why can't I get to him?

• 14:28Speaker 01

  What did she say?

• 14:29Keke Palmer?

  She just, oh, Kiki.

• 14:34Keke Palmer?

  Okay, I'm gonna get into it with Da'Vinchi. Thanks, Mom.

• 14:36Speaker 01

  Well, shout out to Sister Mary Kay.

• 14:38Keke Palmer?

  Yes.

• 14:45Keke Palmer?

  Okay y'all, I'm here to spill the tea on how to level up your 2025 travel game. Listen, as we step into the fresh new year, it's time to shake things up and try something different. You know what they say, "New year, new adventures." And let me tell you, some trips are better in an Airbnb. As you guys know, I was recently tucked away in a fabulous lakeside cabin only a couple of hours away from the glitz and glam of Los Angeles. It had the works. We're talking game room, panoramic views of the mountains, a fully stocked kitchen that Tabitha Brown would be proud of. Okay, and my fave, a jacuzzi on the balcony. Yes, yes.

• 15:27Keke Palmer?

  Now, you best believe me and the fam had the epitome of cozy, posted up sipping on hot chocolate by the fire without a care in the world. And because we found this stunning house on Airbnb, we were super close to Big Bear proper and got all the tea from our hosts about the best spots in town. Child, we was hitting the slopes, popping downtown for shopping in the Village or for dinner at Sweet Basil Bistro. Yes, get into it. We were right in the thick of things and our hosts knew what they were talking about. Now, if you're feeling inspired and decided to hop on over to Airbnb to book yourself a little something, let me put you onto the truth. Guest favorites. Okay, these are the cream of the crop stays that other travelers are raving about.

• 16:12Keke Palmer?

  We're talking places with charm, character, and that special je ne sais quoi that'll make your 2025 unforgettable. That's how I found this gem. So go ahead, book that stay and make 2025 your year of exploration. Trust me, you won't regret it.

• 16:34Keke Palmer?

  Today's guest is someone who has really skyrocketed into the public eye over the last few years, thanks to his role on the hit sitcom Grownish, and more recently, his role as Southwest T on Black Mafia Family. Not only is he an amazing actor, but he's also outspoken about a cause that's important to me as well: mental health. Welcome to the show, my old friend, DaVinci.

• 16:56Speaker 02

  I appreciate you having me, Gigi.

• 16:58Keke Palmer?

  Now, guys, I am so excited to have DaVinci on the show because I've actually known him for a really long time. We haven't seen each other in a minute, but I met him right at the beginning of him jumping on Grownish. Do you remember that?

• 17:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 17:10Keke Palmer?

  With Trevor?

• 17:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, right.

• 17:13Keke Palmer?

  When's the last time you seen T?

• 17:14Speaker 02

  Um, honestly, it's been, it's been a minute too. It's been a minute too, actually. But we still, you know, hit each other on the Grams.

• 17:24Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, but I mean, you be working a lot, man. You, you, you always got a gig. I mean, All American, I watched you on there. You killed it on there. I love that show.

• 17:32Speaker 02

  Appreciate it.

• 17:33Keke Palmer?

  And then recently, I know you just finished this, what is it, the fourth season of BMF?

• 17:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, fourth season.

• 17:39Keke Palmer?

  So how are you feeling? How is that? How's that been going? I mean, the success has just continued to be succeeding. Like, what's, what, what are the vibes? How are you feeling as of late?

• 17:48Speaker 02

  I mean, it's, it's a blessing. Um, I'm not gonna lie. I'm really grateful that, you know, I'm maybe four years in on the show. You know, I, I started this business like six, seven years ago. And given how it usually goes for most people, I'm like, damn, I'm really need on the ASAP, so someone above is looking out for me. It's, it's been great. It definitely has its pros and cons, you know what I'm saying? It's not all great and beautiful, but, but overall, I, I would trade this for the world.

• 18:16Keke Palmer?

  I know, that's right. And it's so true what you said with the, you know, cause, yeah, six years is a short amount of time to have the success that you had. And I know it's going to continue, but how has it been adjusting to that? You know what I'm saying? Like, what, what kind of has been the journey of just like seeing how life, your life has changed, not only for you and your workload, but also how you're interacting with people? Cause people also, you know, are impacted by your success.

• 18:42Speaker 02

  Fact. Uh, I think fame is an interesting thing. Um, and it has a strange effect on a lot of people.

• 18:49Keke Palmer?

  Yeah.

• 18:49Speaker 02

  And and it's like when you're when you're becoming, you know, famous. Or like a celebrity as they call it. I kind of hate that term celebrity because I don't feel like I'm a celebrity. I just feel like I'm a regular person.

• 19:00Keke Palmer?

  Performer, yeah.

• 19:01Speaker 02

  Notoriety, but it's like you start realizing that you've entered this spotlight because of how people around you start treating you, how your family starts treating you, how everyone starts looking at you. And you really can't move the same anymore like at all, you know, I've I've dealt with stalkers, I dealt with, you know, people just have the sick fantasies in their head. You know what I'm saying? And and they're persistent as hell. Or like when you when you're running like now, boy, when I'm outside, I'm.

• 19:30Keke Palmer?

  Now, wait a minute. Tell me about this stalker because I feel there's a story here.

• 19:34Speaker 02

  Um, I don't even want to give this crazy person light on your show. Because I don't even know who it is, but I just feel like, you know, if I if I feed the beast right now, I'm talking about that motherfucker probably watches interview and they just be like, oh, I'm back. But but no, I think I think she learned a lesson because we know exactly who she is and the feds will be on her ass if she's trying to shit again. So.

• 19:58Keke Palmer?

  Okay.

• 19:59Speaker 02

  But uh, but yeah, nah, it was it was annoying, bro. It was like, it was like almost a year of just straight nonstop messaging sick sick person and a whole family got involved, like their whole family. And it's just like, it's just crazy to think like grown ass mothers and daughters will all be in on a sick, you know, thing. And it's just, yeah, it's it's it's why I don't even want to give it to them.

• 20:23Keke Palmer?

  I mean, I always feel like it's so unique with guys, like especially when it comes to the whole heartthrob gag. I mean, obviously, we have women that are sex symbols, heartthrobs, everything like that. But with guys, it does seem different, you know, like I remember even thinking about like just B two K when we was kids and they videos and it's like the girls are screaming and jumping and you know what I mean? So this whole heartthrob energy, I'm sure it does have, you know, comes with the strong suits, but clearly, as you just mentioned, it comes with some of its some of its negatives too and.

• 20:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:51Keke Palmer?

  When the girls is asking.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  I tell, I tell my friends that all the time. I'm like, bro, it's different from girl, from girls and guys. Like, I feel like if you take like a Justin Bieber, Selena Gomez, and they both huge and do really well in their, in their fields. But it's like, I think Justin Bieber probably got a little more crazy psycho fan.

• 21:12Speaker 02

  I know, like, it's, it's, I think, I think a girl just feel like she could get away with more. And it, and it takes, like, if, if my big ass is going to a police officer and reports something, six, three, two hundred pounds, like, yo, this girl is, they go, ah, second. You know what I'm saying? It's kind of just like the, you know, but then if something wild happened, then you get in trouble. You kind of, you damned if you do, damned if you don't. And it takes a while for people to take it serious more so, you know, when you take it the proper protocol.

• 21:36Keke Palmer?

  Oh, man. Okay. So we got crazy new workload, you know, quick success, um, but obviously well deserved. We got some crazy stalker fans, and then we have you really coming forward and speaking on, I think, an issue that is so important, especially for people that look like you, you know what I mean, a young handsome black man saying, hey, I want to talk about mental health. I want to advocate for that being something necessary for us to all start kind of like putting our attention towards. What made you want to start being vocal about that?

• 22:05Speaker 02

  I think when, when you really dissect the communities that we come from and you really just break down why we're struggling so much. I mean, of course, because of, you know, slavery being a huge factor. I mean, there was an entire system put in place, right, to keep us oppressed. They, they had certain laws and rules around that timeframe to where everything was coming together to create this narrative that basically black people are biologically inferior to white people. And then we can't do this, we can't do that, we can't do that. So I think when you look at our history in this country, especially, you gotta, you can't talk about them without realizing the, the traumatic stress that we went through, right?

• 22:48Speaker 02

  People don't really take into consideration when you have a group of people publishing articles and, and you have the neurosurgeons and doctors and psychologists saying certain things that repeated by social Darwinism. Like, yo, black people are biologically inferior to white people. Black people can't do this, we're more prone to this.

• 23:03Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, propaganda to justify slavery, a business.

• 23:07Speaker 02

  Exactly. And then, and then also the, the one rule that they had, one of many, like, black people, you can't build wealth. You can't have a mortgage, you can't pass down. So those things were literally created to keep us in this. Stress. Traumatic environment.

• 23:24Keke Palmer?

  State of survival. Yeah.

• 23:26Speaker 02

  Exactly. And and and now that, you know, we're free, so to speak, it's like. We don't really know what to do with that because we got so much trauma still, you know what I'm saying? And the thing about problems is like, a problem could happen for a day. Or a week or four years, but then the trauma from that thing lasts generation and generation and generation. So I think because we're still dealing with the trauma of that. And how, you know, the media portrays a lot of us and the lack of. Access to education, information that we have, I realize I'm like, yo, we are like. Kind of fucked. And a lot of people are, you know, the the mental health crisis in this country. Is become, it's not just a matter of black people anymore. It's everyone that's getting, you know, a lot of Asian kids are suffering from it and everyone, but.

• 24:12Speaker 02

  You know, looking at those statistics and looking at my community specifically and coming from where I come from, you know. I was fortunate enough to see two different dimensions in this world and not many people get this opportunity to just come from straight poverty. And then you make it out and you see that as I've been, as you're trying to enjoy the fruits of your labor here, you're kind of looking back like, damn, like, we are fucked. And you realize that, you know, you could give a man a fish, he eats for the day, but if you teach a man a fish, they eat forever. So it's just like, you could give back all you want, but it's just like.

• 24:40Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, but you gotta figure out the system in which they can actually get it from the root.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  Exactly. And that's when you start understanding the mechanisms in the mind and what mental health is, you know what I'm saying? And when you start breaking that down, it's just the ability to how your social emotional well being is. And um, a lot of, a lot of us don't think about that. So I should start understanding psychology. How it works, understanding the basic mechanisms, right?

• 25:07Keke Palmer?

  Well, so much of what you said was also important in terms of like, it's hard to even stop and think about stuff like this or in this way. When you're in a constant state of survival. And I do think it's important as an entertainer, somebody like you said, a celebrity, whatever people want to look at us as. You know, if, you know, if somebody does not have the resources to that education or to that information. Well, hell, if they're watching BMF or they may be checking into the baby, this is Keke Palmer podcast. Then maybe we can at least share the information, you know, from the resources that we've been able to have. To at least shine a light on on something that may click or that may resonate in that way. Um, you know, and then, you know, I I love also what you were saying about Harriet Tubman. Said something, I might butcher the quote, but you know, somebody was like, oh, how many

• 25:52Keke Palmer?

  slaves you freed, or it's amazing how many slaves you freed. And she said, well, I could have freed thousands more if they knew they were slaves.

• 25:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 25:59Keke Palmer?

  You know, and it's like Kanye said, the unpopular version. But ultimately, it's the idea that, yeah, you can't know what you don't know. And if you've never truly known mental freedom, if you never really knew what it felt like to actually just like know that you have a choice. Once you have all these options, all these choices, you still have to learn the mechanisms of how to activate it, how to know that, you know what I'm saying? And that's, that's what you're talking about in terms of, you know, we can help all we want, but how can we strap you with the tools? And I think that's something that any one of us, you know, that come from a sense of community that are in this position are constantly trying to figure out, like, how can I, how

• 26:44Keke Palmer?

  can I share this? How can I, what can I do?

• 26:48Speaker 02

  Exactly. That, that's why you have a lot of entertainers, whether athletes, musicians, actors, whatever, you know, they, they come across X amount of dollars and they end up broke. Because they don't have the tools. It's like, there is no way you should make X amount of millions and you end up broke, like you start building wealth. But we don't know that. So we just get the money and we, we just buy a whole bunch of liabilities because we wasn't taught. So there are a lot of times people look at us like, oh my God, they're ignorant, because they don't know. It's like, nah, if you was in our shoes, bro, you would have done the same thing. You just don't know better. You don't know what you don't know.

• 27:20Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, you don't know what you don't know.

• 27:21Speaker 02

  That's why I feel obliged to educate us, man, let people know that whatever you're doing at any given moment, you physically modifying your brain and become better at it. So just know like, whether it's bad, whether it's good, your brain is like, yo, I'm gonna make you an expert at doing nonsense. I'm gonna make you an expert at doing this. So it just really behooves all of us to just keep a, keep a sound mental diet.

• 27:42Keke Palmer?

  I want to get more into that and more into how you've found a sense of community that supports you in there. But before going there, I want to talk about the community that you're from. Because I know you're also Haitian American, your family's from Haiti, and you grew up in Brooklyn. Talk a little bit to me about like how you grew up.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I, I, you know, first generation Haitian, I was raised in the house of my grandfather. She didn't speak a lick of English, that's why.

• 28:04Keke Palmer?

  Wow, so wait a minute, what do you, what all do you speak?

• 28:07Speaker 02

  I speak French, French Creole.

• 28:09Keke Palmer?

  You better go off. Wait, wait, wait, so real quick, tell me, hey, girl, what's up? How you do that?

• 28:17Speaker 02

  Uh, uh, most of our community, so I can't lie.

• 28:20Keke Palmer?

  You hate that.

• 28:22Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:24Speaker 02

  You funny as hell.

• 28:25Keke Palmer?

  That is so dope.

• 28:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, it's funny because a lot of people don't know that. Um, but, uh, so, yeah, I grew up in that environment and I grew up with, you know, I grew up with straight monsters, man. I grew up with people that, that was just.

• 28:38Keke Palmer?

  Not monsters.

• 28:39Speaker 02

  Trying to outdo each other in cruelty. From where we're from, that's just all we knew. You know what I'm saying? When gangsters is just like, I'm gonna show you how much balls I got. Or like, yo, nah, you wanna be down, you gotta do X, Y, Z. And I just think that was just a reality, you know? I mean, that the media, what the media was showing up, was portraying, we was looking up to all the gangsters and me being the youngest, it's like, I had to prove myself that I could hang. So, I mean, and that led me to, you know, a lot of things that I wasn't proud of. I got arrested when I was 13 years old, first time I got arrested. Uh, the juvenile detention center, I had to court and all this stuff. But again, it wasn't because I was trying to be cool. It's just, that's all you know. And I think Napoleon Hill, one of my favorite authors,

• 29:22Speaker 02

  he was like, nature forces upon the minds of men, the influences of their environment. So, I would just be an influence on my environment. But after I started getting in a lot of trouble, my dad, um, he, he took me in with his second family, me and my other brother, him, we were the two youngest. And that right there, that changed me completely. I moved to Florida. That was a predominantly white school. And I stopped getting in trouble. I stopped getting D's and F's. I ended up graduating high school with a Bona 4.0 GPA. But.

• 29:49Keke Palmer?

  Okay.

• 29:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was, it was literally because of my environment, probably because I was scared to get my ass beat by my pops. But it was just like, but I just watched that change. But yeah, I grew around the wolves and the people that all these rappers be talking about, like, they, my, I really grew up around that. And that's why. I'd never try to promote that. I never try to perpetuate that. A lot of time, people look at me, they're like, yo, you should have been a good kid. You come from a two-parent household, dah dah dah dah. I don't come from none of that shit. But I just knew, I was like, yo, God bless me and be in this position. I'm not gonna perpetuate this stigma that I didn't create, that we didn't create. You know what I'm saying? We're perpetuating something that have nothing to do with us. That's not our culture.

• 30:29Keke Palmer?

  What I'm hearing in, in your words is not only accountability in how your surroundings influenced your actions, but also compassion in the ways in which you've addressed it? How did you kind of find the way to have that compassion for yourself? Because I think what happens a lot of times, especially what I see in our young black man, is, um, you know, people always talk about, or, or zero in on the day, oh, I don't have accountability, I don't have accountability. But it's hard to have accountability when there is no compassion that can then be accompanied with it. Um, you know, and everybody deserves to find self-compassion. So it becomes difficult to call yourself out if you don't know the tools to have compassion for your actions, when you know you maybe just didn't know you could make a better choice, or didn't figure out how to make a better choice,

• 31:14Keke Palmer?

  or didn't know why that was the choice you made to begin with. How did you find your path to being able to be accountable, but then also say to yourself, look, I was doing my damn best, you know, and I'm gonna do better? But, you know, how did you find that?

• 31:28Speaker 02

  I, I think the, the reason why I developed a lot of compassion and, and I hold myself accountable is because when I see my brothers, you know, when I see my brothers, cousins, and my friends that, you know, they literally lost their lives, man. Uh, some of them in jail until forever, for the rest of their life. Some of them died, some of them because of the streets and because of drugs and self-medicating when you're dealing with our problems. Niggas wanna, you know, just be smoked out, do whatever, and they, God forbid, they should get laced and some traumatic effect happens, which affects them on a neurological level, and then they go on a trip and they never come back. So now they fiends, now they unable to fiend.

• 32:11Speaker 02

  I think when you just see the origin story of how it come out, it's like, you're like, nah, I can't perpetuate this shit, bro. It's just like, most likely, your life expectancy is probably like 21, or if you hit the right lick, maybe they'll say 25, but the amount of paranoia you've got, because it's ill-gotten gains. And you get, you get hit, bro. You get hit with football numbers.

• 32:38Keke Palmer?

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• 33:19Keke Palmer?

  The drama, the romance, it's a roller coaster of emotions, and I am strapped in for the ride. There's nothing else like it on TV, honey, and it's a classic. So tune in to watch The Bachelor premiere this Monday, January 27th, at 8/7c on ABC+. You can stream the next day on Hulu. Don't miss out. There will be a quiz next week.

• 33:44Keke Palmer?

  All right, so you were, you were talking about, because I was asking you about how you, how you found, you know, yourself having self-compassion. And what it sounds like to me is you was having compassion for how you seen some of your brothers in the community, you know, have troubles. And it almost sounded like you, you started to have compassion for yourself out of necessity. You know what I mean? Almost like a coping mechanism. Like, if I'm seeing my brothers in a community struggling like this, and I'm seeing the pathways in which how that happened, how can I look at myself and how can I maybe even, like, love on myself and, like, reroute and find solutions so that I don't turn to the same things they did? I literally was having a conversation about that with a close friend of mine not too long ago, a guy friend.

• 34:27Keke Palmer?

  You know, we were kind of going back and forth on that debate of like, you know, guys need to be able to be free to have more emotion, and guys need to be, and he was like, I don't know if it's so much that guys need to have more emotion, or they need to be telling everybody. Day feelings, I think it's like compassion. There needs to be more compassion in there. And I was like, damn, I never even really thought about it like that. But I think when we're talking about sometimes these romantic or platonic relationships back and forth with men and women, a lot of times what's missing is compassion because they're not necessarily able to know how to show compassion to themselves.

• 34:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly, exactly.

• 34:59Keke Palmer?

  How can I show compassion to you? Man, woman or otherwise, if I don't have compassion for me.

• 35:05Speaker 02

  Fact.

• 35:06Keke Palmer?

  That's deep. When is the first time that you heard someone mention mental health and you actually felt like you could see yourself in the conversation? Like, with somebody you felt you related to?

• 35:16Speaker 02

  Probably, this is probably a couple of years ago. I think this is probably like maybe like three, four years ago. And, and I think it's because I was realizing what mental health actually is. Mental health is just making sure you're just balancing your emotional well being in your head. You know what I'm saying? You're making sure there's a healthy balance, that you're relieving stress properly, you're not holding things in too much. And it's just like physical. I love working out, you know what I'm saying?

• 35:43Keke Palmer?

  I do. I agree with you so much on that. Working out will help your mind too.

• 35:47Speaker 02

  For a fact, for a fact. And then, and then the more you work out, it just make life easier. If you gotta go up a plexus, it's easy. You gotta go walk your dog, it's easy. If you got a long day on set, you know what I'm saying? You gotta do X, Y, Z, you gotta walk to wherever. It's just say your car breakdown, it's just easier to just move, you're not out of breath. And I just think when you start taking care of your mental health, it's the same way. But now, mental illness is a different thing. It's like when your mental health isn't at a healthy state anymore. So now there's an actual illness there, you know what I'm saying?

• 36:15Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's true. I'm so excited at the way that we are finding new ways to de-stigmatize what that means. Because we always talk about physical health and physical illnesses, but you know, yeah, like really de-stigmatize and say, look, man, mental health is just keeping your mental in a good space. When your shit start going crazy, you start being hella negative. Your vibrations is low, you ain't got nothing good to say about nobody. Shit, you may be sick, motherfucker.

• 36:43Keke Palmer?

  There's no silver lining. Shit, you need some help, fast.

• 36:49Keke Palmer?

  Um.

• 36:51Keke Palmer?

  Let me actually go deeper on that then, like, what are some ways when you know your mental health may be struggling? Like, what's the dialogue in your head that lets you know, oh shit, I gotta get myself back right real quick?

• 37:00Speaker 02

  I think, I think when I, when I get to a negative space, I don't see the silver lining or nothing, you know what I'm saying? I think, I think when you lose gratitude for a second, when, when you're not.

• 37:10Keke Palmer?

  Yes.

• 37:10Speaker 02

  When you're just, you're so present in your problem that you can't see the big picture. You know what I'm saying? Because sometimes your, your problem's just a speck of dust. But if you get, if you don't have the ability to step outside and like, you know what, I'm healthy, I can walk. I got my bills paid, I'm the risk, or, or if you don't and you can't, there's always something you could be grateful for.

• 37:31Keke Palmer?

  That's right.

• 37:31Speaker 02

  It's always, I don't care what level you're at in this world, there is always something you can be grateful for. And if you really, when you're able to see that, uh, that's what is good. But then when you can't see that at all, I think you really go through it. And if usually where I'm going to that, I'm probably gonna go work out, I'm probably gonna call someone, then. Uh, if it's so bad, you know what I'm saying, I'll go back into, you know, on therapies, just let things out. But, uh, but usually that's when I, I realize it's like when I'm highly stressed and I'm just mad as hell every little day.

• 38:01Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, yeah, I love that. Speaking of like calling somebody to vent, I mean, you said something important earlier that, you know, when you moved from your, the, uh, your older neighborhood with your grandmother and started living with your dad and that kind of impacted your life positively, positively, you started kind of changing from the street influence to just like, where is my life going, going to go now? Like, how am I going to evolve from here? Um, you know, I think that's one of the most difficult things for people to do in terms of leaving the streets is there's a sense of community there. Right? Like you think about why people join gangs or getting involved with anything. It's really a sense of like, I need, I need to have some type of community around me because I feel alone. There's so much loneliness and the way that we deal with that, it ranges, but it's not always necessarily positive.

• 38:44Keke Palmer?

  Um, even, even still, it's hard to leave that community behind because they did help you to some degree. So how was that for you, stepping away from maybe some of those people and those habits that was once your community to maybe a community that was more serving to where you're trying to go?

• 39:01Speaker 02

  Wow, that is a beautiful question, Kiki. That is a great question. Um, to be honest.

• 39:08Speaker 02

  I struggle with that every day. I think that's one of the hardest.

• 39:12Keke Palmer?

  It is.

• 39:12Speaker 02

  Things about success and it's and it's and it's bittersweet, you know, um. But I think, again, understanding psychology, right, and which is simply understanding how your brain works. You understand that the human mind do not like change because back then change could have resulted in you're probably gonna die if you leave your tribe. And we've been cavemen and like prehistoric dinosaur thinking human beings for way longer than we have been in this new society where we're exposed at a rate that no other no other human being has ever been exposed. Nowadays, you can go and just fly to China. You've been an entirely different culture. Back then, if you would have done that, you're gonna die in a different tribe. You don't get tried. You don't have the same tattoos.

• 39:53Speaker 02

  You don't have the same color, skin color. It's a wrap. So naturally, we don't like change. So I had to learn that and go against the grain because we are so evolved now that it's so different. So it's like I told my body, like, yo, bro, like you, if you don't make it out, this is your life. Like you see your life, you see the most successful hood nigga, got a couple G's in his pocket. While in doing X, Y, Z, but he's probably gonna end up dead or in jail. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, that is my reality and I want kids. So do I want my kids to go so? So I think what was was my wants and my purpose and my goal override that feeling, that animal instinct of wanting to stay.

• 40:38Speaker 02

  Sometimes you gotta override your animality to purpose. And once you have a purpose, it it becomes energetic. It's like it it it this adrenaline that rushing your body just it it supersedes everything else. It's just like, yo, as much as I like cookies and cupcakes and da da da da.

• 40:54Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, it's self preservation. It's self love is what you're describing, an immense amount of self love.

• 41:00Speaker 02

  I love all my cousins and my brothers, but it's just like, man, I got to go. Because if we all fuck, our lineage, our bloodline is done. And I looked at it like that. I'm like, yo, if I stay in this too, our bloodline is finito. So I'm just like, what I can do is get the fuck out of here. In doing that, y'all might be mad for a little bit, but now all the mortgages are paid. All the bills are paid. You see what I'm saying? So I would say it would, it would, it would have been a ride. I just.

• 41:24Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, you had to learn to see the forest from the trees, see the bigger picture. But to that point, to anybody that's listening, like, what do those, what, I mean, you have to list every step, but what does some of those steps look like? Stepping away from habits and people that maybe aren't currently serving you in the best way? Like, is that just not picking up the phone this week? Is that being communicative and saying, hey, look, man, I can't do this?

• 41:44Speaker 02

  I would, I would say first of all, first off, you gotta have a good relationship with God. And, and what, what I've learned, what I've learned.

• 41:52Keke Palmer?

  Come on.

• 41:53Speaker 02

  What I've learned in my struggle, not trying to preach, but it's just like, you gotta, you.

• 41:57Keke Palmer?

  Preach, brother, preach.

• 41:59Speaker 02

  You gotta hit rock bottom, because when you hit rock bottom, you know who, who's the rock at the bottom was just God. And then the minute you get to that point, where you at that level, none of your friends matter no more. None of your friends or family don't matter.

• 42:11Keke Palmer?

  Shit, family either.

• 42:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, your friends, family don't even matter anymore. And, and I think, and that's what, that's the, you know, when I'm ignoring all the calls, someone call, hang up. Someone call, don't pick up, change my number, block them, you know what I'm saying? But to me, it's just like, I got the relation, I got my relationship with God. No matter what happens, I'm straight.

• 42:30Keke Palmer?

  We have to pull this out because what you're speaking to is so important in, I believe, helping us resist external confirmations and validations, which are sometimes so necessary. We're human beings, right? We want to see things that we, we want to have things we can touch, see and feel that let us know we're on the right track, or that we're not alone, or we feel comfort, et cetera. But in the words of Lekhan, I mean, he maybe never said these words, but obviously his teachings are about language, his teachings are about language. And I know language can be difficult for people. So I'm not saying you gotta be this kind of religion, that kind of religion. But when we talk about God, we're talking about that, that thing that lives in each and every one of us, that's deep, deep inside, that is always there for you, whether you want to lean into it or not.

• 43:12Keke Palmer?

  And when you absolutely go through rock bottom and the external validations are no longer confirming you to be who you think you are or who you want to be, there's no other way, or other place you can go than inside. And then you realize, damn, it was always there all along. And I wish that I could articulate it further than that, but that's why. We say God. We say God because that's what, that's what it is. That's that feeling. That's that thing. And one hundred percent, I couldn't agree with you more, man. When I have gone through the most horrible times in my life. I remember as a kid, when me and my family, they didn't understand what I was going through. I, I remember when I got a call from Will Smith saying, look, I've been through the same thing. You're gonna get there. You're gonna be, when you're the first person in your family, when you're stepping out, you're breaking generational curse curses, when you're doing something different.

• 43:53Keke Palmer?

  It feels lonely, but you're not alone. And all I had was me, my journal, and that inner voice, that inner thing that I can never be disconnected from. And that's, that's God for me. And so I, I, I, I agree so much, man. It's so true. And it really, it's, it's hard. It's, it's unfortunate that, that sometimes, um. You know, you have to be stripped to some degree to get to that point. But every, everybody has a version of it.

• 44:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, dis- discipline is the key. I, I think without discipline, a man and a woman don't stand a chance against life. You, you gotta be, you gotta be disciplined. And sometimes the same what you say no to other people, they don't realize that you're saying no to yourself. You know what I'm saying? But, but they don't even have the level of consciousness to understand that type of thinking. So to them, it's just like, like you, you just like. The, the coolest thing about being humans is, is a cool thing, but it's also a scary thing. It's like, if you have ten giraffes, you have ten fucking giraffes. You had ten zebras, you have ten zebras. Ten dollars, you have ten dollars. You have ten humans, it's not ten humans. Some of these human beings are just built different, bro. You can't talk to them like, or you can talk to this human being or a way to talk to yourself. You just.

• 45:02Speaker 02

  I had to come in terms of that in peace. And I'm like, oh, my nigga.

• 45:06Keke Palmer?

  That's tough.

• 45:06Speaker 02

  Damn, even though we both speak English, we speak a different level of English. To where it's just like, your ones and needs and my ones and needs is completely different, bro.

• 45:16Keke Palmer?

  Yes. Yes, it's so true. That is, that is, that's the like whole coexisting gag. It's so, I don't know if you saw Deadpool recently, but I love this little moment. Did you see Deadpool?

• 45:25Speaker 02

  No, I didn't, I didn't watch it. I wanna watch it. I heard it's good.

• 45:28Keke Palmer?

  It was really good. I've seen it like twice now, but anyway, another, another conversation for another day. Um, somebody we have in common that we both love who taught me a lot, just about like. Self-awareness, self-power, manifesting your dreams, like not always being the product of where you're from is Tupac Shakur.

• 45:47Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 45:47Keke Palmer?

  I know he's somebody that you really love, that you speak about as well. If you could pick one thing or a couple of things like that, his story or his music or who he was as an artist, how it impacted you, like, what would it be?

• 45:58Speaker 02

  So, OK, wow, you asking question, you asking some good ass questions. I think I gotta start this off. I think if I was born in a different family, I probably would have been a scientist because

• 46:11Keke Palmer?

  Ooh, OK.

• 46:13Speaker 02

  My ability to observe and draw conclusions and come up with different type of hypothesis and theories, X, Y, Z, it's like it's my greatest asset. And I studied Tupac closely and I watched how he was when he was in high school, that drama kid, innocent kid.

• 46:29Keke Palmer?

  Yeah.

• 46:29Speaker 02

  And how he was just talking and he was just talking about his art. He was so flamboyant and just like different than.

• 46:36Keke Palmer?

  Theater kid.

• 46:36Speaker 02

  Then him turned into the hit him up, you know what I'm saying? Pac was just completely different Pac and it was just his environment. It was a matter of his environment that completely changed. This guy had a really good heart, but he went out into the world, he was around certain gangsters, he started seeing a certain side of life that kind of turned his heart. So, I looked at that and was like, I gotta make sure no matter what I do in this world, no matter where God take me, I keep my heart the same way it's been in the beginning, right? I can't, I can't change that. Also, when Pac was arrested and when he was locked up, he was reading a lot, like Pac is the reason why I started reading books, because he made it look cool to read. And the thing is, it's like, you know, when you come from a certain environment, nobody's reading, but you're not gonna do that.

• 47:20Speaker 02

  But if you see a gangster reading, you're like, oh shit, like they read too? Like, and then you start realizing, you know, when people say certain things, like you wanna hide something from a black man, put it in a book. So, I just started, I started reading a lot because of Pac, I started learning about our history, where we come from and why, why, like, you know what I'm saying, that the system was set up the way it is, why Pac was saying certain things, like, oh, we all run around suicidal strapped and how we, when him saying certain things like, stop, niggas is lucky if we bust out this shit.

• 47:49Keke Palmer?

  What's, what's that mean? What's that mean?

• 47:51Speaker 02

  He said, we're all run around suicidal strapped, you know what I'm saying? And then.

• 47:56Keke Palmer?

  Oh, yes.

• 47:57Speaker 02

  And then he was and he was and he was all saying like he was stuck niggas lucky if we bust off and shit. He was just saying like, bro, there's an entire system put in play. For you to be stuck, like you really have to understand this and like a lot of some people are listening to music. And we're really not getting, but we're just like, yo, like. It's uh, there's, there was an entire nation. This is so deep, the ones founded this country said, we have to keep this group in bondage no matter what. You know what I'm saying? And he talks about that all through music, which that made me be like, yo, let me start doing, he's like, what is he talking about? We stuck. You know what I'm saying? Like, how are black people, like, you go, we like, oh shit.

• 48:38Keke Palmer?

  Well, I mean, that's the foundation of what of how, I mean, James Baldwin speaks to that a lot, but he also speaks to. The reality that if I treat one people this way, then you also won't realize how badly I'm treating you. And I think that's what a lot of people are waking up to is because it's easy to be like, oof, who are they treating? Black folks crazy. Let them not black. Until you realize that they're treating black people crazy, but they're also treating me poorly. But they wanted me to focus on just this so that I wouldn't actually start focusing on this. And that's why it's so important that we come together, which. You know, I think we're, we're in interesting times where that could be a possibility where I have people that are like, I remember as a kid, like, you know, going to school and.

• 49:18Keke Palmer?

  The conversations around blackness and what I was up against was just not even a conversation. And then we had movies like Dear White People. And now we have conversations like the one we're having right now. And so, you know, it's like, I didn't even know words like microaggression existed until like. Six, seven years ago. So it's like, you know, it's people are waking up to the realities that I think a lot of people like Tupac Shakur. You know, in his way, in his fashion, just like James Baldwin, you know, just like Toni Morrison, you know what I'm saying? With racism being, being meant to be a distraction, you know what I mean? Like, the country is built on something rudimentary, which is ultimately slavery of all. And only a few.

• 49:56Speaker 02

  Because of capitalism, man. I be, I be telling my friends, I be telling some of my white friends, just I'm like, bro, you a nigga too now.

• 50:04Keke Palmer?

  Like we all.

• 50:07Speaker 02

  We should really team up, like.

• 50:09Keke Palmer?

  No, for real, like we really need to power range this shit.

• 50:12Speaker 02

  It's, it's not about color no more, but we was just the first, like, we was just the start. It's pretty capitalism, you know what I'm saying? That's really what it is.

• 50:21Keke Palmer?

  Last question. What is something that you would say to someone that's having trouble figuring out? And I'll say specifically black men. You know what I'm saying? Obviously, everybody struggling with mental health for a million. Every little different group, many marginal, we all have something.

• 50:34Speaker 02

  That.

• 50:35Keke Palmer?

  But as a black man, I think it's important to hear from other black men. How would you assist in words or tangible practices that can help a black man that ain't never ever, you know, partook in nothing like this before? Figure out how to approach his mental health?

• 50:51Speaker 02

  I would say, first off, I think you need to find somebody to talk to. Whether, and he could be a good friend. You don't even got to pay for therapy. It could be a good friend that you guys hold each other accountable. And if you don't have a good friend around, then definitely look for a therapist. And if you cannot afford that, go on YouTube. Type in your favorite celebrities or authors, or just type in motivational videos. Start listening to some human beings speak on positivity. Start doing that. That is very important. And if church don't resonate with you, if pastors don't resonate with you, look for a motivational speaker. Look for something that you like, and then just start diving into that world.

• 51:35Speaker 02

  I think we have a lot of access to information in this day and age to where it's like, if you can't have someone to talk to, if you can't go to therapy, you can't do it for whatever reason, try to go on YouTube. And I'm sure one of those options are probably going to work. And in doing that, then just start, start being honest with yourself. Start, I would write down what's making you mad and why. And then, and then just write it down. Because a lot of times, writing it down is the first way you could actually see the problem. You can see the problem and just try to find solutions to it. Then start, start meditating. Start, start, you know, just taking in a lot of positive things. Start cutting negative things out of your circle. Whatever's bringing you sadness and making you mad yourself, start removing that out of your circle.

• 52:18Speaker 02

  And I think you got to switch your mental diet up for like 30 days, and I swear you're going to start seeing results. And that's from me, what I do, I meditate. A lot. That's guided meditations on YouTube. You can literally type in ten minute meditation for anxiety. Ten minute meditation for depression. Ten minute meditation for whatever. And then boom, and it is a guided meditation. Then I started reading certain books, certain movies, certain songs, certain things. I don't even watch no more. And I honestly-

• 52:43Keke Palmer?

  So I'm hearing self-reflective journaling, inundating yourself with positive things, whether it be books, specials, YouTube documentaries. I'm hearing using the internet as a source of self-discovery, which is like something very personal to me. I remember when I was seventeen, I started going to this website called thinkexist.com and you just click a word. Like for me, I would put in like stress or anger or sadness. And then all these amazing quotes from amazing philosophers would come up. And that's how I discovered Aristotle and really the teachings of Buddhism, like all of that. Um, so I really relate to that. And I'm also hearing, you know, find somebody that you feel safe with. Like when you said you don't have a friend or somebody to talk to.

• 53:24Speaker 02

  Right. And yeah, and most importantly, just, just limit your distractions. I think social media, it's a big uh tool to be stressed, have a lot of anxiety and then just suffer a lot mentally. So I personally, after, if I'm not posting for like fan engagements or whatever, I'm not on social media. I delete it all the time. Uh, it's just not good to keep looking at different images that have nothing to do with the next and comparing yourself with people and then just all that stuff. It's just like, that's not where you should spend most of your time. Cause that right there, there's too many, there's too much information out there that's leading to that, making a lot of human beings depressed and sad. So I'll just limit that out. You cut the distractions out and then you start focusing on what really matters.

• 54:09Keke Palmer?

  DaVinci, I could talk to you for hours. I actually feel like we did talk for hours the first time that we had met. I feel like I remember us going off on some deep ass discussions.

• 54:19Speaker 02

  That was a fact.

• 54:19Keke Palmer?

  Just brought back memories. So we're gonna have to really do this again. Um, I don't wanna keep you too long, but, but, but, but, I'd love to finish our conversation with a little quick game. Is that okay with you?

• 54:30Speaker 02

  Let's do it. Let's do it.

• 54:32Keke Palmer?

  Okay. The game is called hear for it or not. And it's pretty simple. I'll name something and you just have to tell me if you hear for it or if you, if you not. Ready? Okay. Astrology. Hear for it or nah?

• 54:44Speaker 02

  Nah.

• 54:45Keke Palmer?

  So you don't know you're rising or you're moon?

• 54:48Speaker 02

  Nah, I think it's cat. I think it's a

• 54:51Keke Palmer?

  Oh my gosh, you're so hilarious.

• 54:54Speaker 02

  Nah, I think there's truth in it, but I don't think we have the accurate truth. There's something that powerful that you could predict X, Y, Z. The way they make buying a fucking house so goddamn hard in this country. Ain't no fucking way that that information is just so damn accessible that it could really help you. Ain't no way.

• 55:13Keke Palmer?

  You literally sound like an air sign saying that. Okay.

• 55:17Keke Palmer?

  Ghosting, as in you ghosting someone else. Here for it or not?

• 55:23Speaker 02

  Air sign saying that.

• 55:25Keke Palmer?

  You do. Air signs say shit like that. Are you an air sign?

• 55:27Speaker 02

  I'm a leaver. I don't know.

• 55:32Keke Palmer?

  Yes, you're an air sign. Yes, you are. That's like the air sign shit. Y'all are always so in the wind and so above it all.

• 55:42Speaker 02

  What was your second question?

• 55:44Keke Palmer?

  It was ghosting, as in you ghosting someone else. Are you here for it or not?

• 55:49Speaker 02

  I'm here for it for my mental health, absolutely.

• 55:51Keke Palmer?

  I already know. Come on, mental health. I had to ghost you? Now that's good. Now that's T-Bo. I love that one. I'm gonna have to steal that. Look, honestly, for my mental health, I just have to, you know. That's why you ain't talked to me in 10 years.

• 56:04Speaker 02

  Right. You ghosted me in mental health. I ain't mad at that.

• 56:07Keke Palmer?

  Okay, um, hmm, oh, daily journaling. Here for it or not?

• 56:12Speaker 02

  I'm here for it.

• 56:13Keke Palmer?

  Period. I know you said, I figured you were gonna be here for that because you give that. And you said that that's what you do. So amazing. Same here. Dating other famous people. Here for it or not?

• 56:23Speaker 02

  Nah.

• 56:25Keke Palmer?

  Literally.

• 56:26Speaker 02

  Nah, what? That is like two crazy lies. Like, somebody has to be safe.

• 56:32Keke Palmer?

  Bingo. I was like, I feel like we both have that same vibe where it's like we're trying so hard to straddle what we do for our jobs and just having that grounded, simple simplicity. Like, just being able to feel real and not everything being so heightened.

• 56:48Speaker 02

  Like, I don't think, and this is very unpopular and I might get shit for that, but I just don't think it's conducive. To a healthy life, like, like, human beings, we're creatures of habits, right? Whenever you're not in a state that you, there's a habit, there's a system, already you're not gonna be, uh, happy. There's gonna be depression, there's gonna be anxiety. So we fly all that shit, like, that's already playing with our brains. Like, that's not healthy, right? We're supposed to be still somewhere else. We know what's happening on Monday, Friday, Tuesday, next week, dah dah dah. Tomorrow you could be in Australia filming a damn thing. You know what I'm saying? So one person in this situation gotta be safe. Whether it's the man or what, whatever.

• 57:24Keke Palmer?

  Oh, I never.

• 57:26Speaker 02

  Kid is done, the kid is done.

• 57:29Keke Palmer?

  I don't think I was really able to articulate that, what you said right then. But that's exactly what it is.

• 57:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, it works.

• 57:35Keke Palmer?

  It's the stability, the stability factor. You, you know, we don't have any stability. We gotta be just doo, doo, doo, doo. And it, it, you know, and my family for me, like, that is what I always looked for too, and the romantic partner is what I had in my family. They was my stability. I knew I could count on them. I knew this and that, I knew, you know what I mean? As opposed to just, how we both on two different sides of the world, that's just too much.

• 58:00Speaker 02

  That's what I'm saying, it's, yeah, like, two kids, like, one person.

• 58:04Speaker 02

  And, and, and the thing is, there is nothing wrong with that job either. And I do, I will say this, I hate when men be like, oh my God, my wife, we divorced and she's trying to take her. Yeah, nigga, she deserved it. She deserved it. If she was handling what she was handling, she's the reason why.

• 58:19Keke Palmer?

  Come on!

• 58:19Speaker 02

  That mental peace to do X, Y, Z. But they're just so dumb and they're not aware, and they can't even think about it for real. But yeah, she deserved it, cause that job is disappointing as flying and filming whatever fucking Marvel movie you're filming. So I, I, I will say that.

• 58:33Keke Palmer?

  They are literally gonna be starving the way you ate up this podcast, okay? They are going to be starving, cause you're eating down, okay? All right, last one. I know you haven't really done this yet, but I'm just curious. Directing and producing, here for it or not?

• 58:50Speaker 02

  I'm here for it. I'm here for it, for sure.

• 58:52Keke Palmer?

  Period. I would totally be in your movie, because I can already tell by you, by your, you, you would be able to really give some good direction and some insight to the character. I could already see you directing. It, it, it's coming from you, from you naturally. Oh, oh, but I feel like I've gotta ask this for the girls. This is the one question that I knew I had forgotten. I'm glad I remembered it before I let you go. Which is, you said, and you say often, that you really want kids. I'm curious, and this is for the ladies listening. Is your interest for kids just as strong as your interest in being married?

• 59:27Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 59:28Keke Palmer?

  Okay, why so? This is not a trick question, I'm just curious.

• 59:33Speaker 02

  No, I just, I just believe in a family nucleus and I think having a mother and father in a household just increases the success chance of the, of a child. And another reason why that for a long time, they was destroying the family nucleus in a black household. They understood that there's a mother and father in the house that increases the chance of that slave kid, that Negro to become successful. So you gotta destroy that, you gotta make the woman ahead of the household and emasculate them out. Like this was, this was a science that you can look this up, like this is what they realized. You know what I'm saying? And that's why for a while in the, in America, even with the welfare system, that if you had a man in the house, you can't qualify, a man has to be out the house. You know, there's different games.

• 1:00:12Keke Palmer?

  Yeah, we did section eight.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, to destroy the family nucleus, but that's the most important thing in this world. That's why a lot of other countries that when we're looked at as a laughing stock of wealth, they, they value that. A lot of other countries value family. I think without a family nucleus, there's, there's nothing, like you need a team in this world. You need a team. You need, just like, just, I mean, hell, it's like an entertainment, manager, agent, lawyer. That's what mother and father, that's what that is. You need a village. You know what I'm saying? So, so I definitely understand the importance of that. And I've watched what that did to my family, not having both of that in my house. You know, a lot of my, my brothers, a lot of stuff would have been avoided if, if it was both things in the house. You know, both parents in the house. So I definitely value that and I respect that a lot.

• 1:00:55Speaker 02

  I think that right there could single-handedly help the black community tremendously. If we start promoting promiscuity and nigga, mother and father in the house and you twerk on your damn husband. Do that, I think right there.

• 1:01:08Keke Palmer?

  No more pussy popping on a handstand?

• 1:01:10Speaker 02

  You have to tell you.

• 1:01:14Speaker 02

  If we promoted that hat like to say equal with the promised opportunity that we promote, man, I think we'll see a huge change in the black community.

• 1:01:23Keke Palmer?

  I'm here for the equalness. I'm here for the equalness. We can have some pussy popping.

• 1:01:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:01:27Keke Palmer?

  And we can have some, you know, I do.

• 1:01:29Speaker 02

  Right now is here, this pussy popping. I think it just need to be like here at least, you know what I'm saying? Pussy popping is fun. You need a little bit.

• 1:01:36Keke Palmer?

  I love how the pussy popping is still slightly above, but then like closer.

• 1:01:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, you could have that. Like it's good to have the we go and cakes and cookies and shit like that. But you need the green. You need your water. You need your, you know what I'm saying? You need both to have a good world. That's a garden right there, you know? And if only you have one.

• 1:01:52Keke Palmer?

  I am beyond here for you. Okay, DaVinci, and I'm just so glad you've never changed. You're still that same person that I met those six years ago, even with all your success. And I know it's going to continue. I can't wait for us to both keep riding this wave together and see where else we meet again.

• 1:02:08Speaker 02

  No, thank you so much. I appreciate all that. And by the way, I gotta give you your flowers. You are a legend. Like I grew up watching.

• 1:02:15Keke Palmer?

  Stop!

• 1:02:16Speaker 02

  To be here right now, just having this conversation with you. I mean, we talk outside of this, but this is kind of crazy. Like I managed to bust my ass so hard in life that I'm sitting at the table right now talking to you, you know what I'm saying? You are a goat. You're not even.

• 1:02:31Keke Palmer?

  Oh my God!

• 1:02:32Speaker 02

  Like you, you're a legend. So honestly, kudos to you and your family and everyone that contributes to your success. Cause you a legend, bro, for real, bro. So thank you.

• 1:02:41Keke Palmer?

  That means the world. Thank you. Thank you.

• 1:02:47Keke Palmer?

  I feel like DaVinci is such an old soul and I really respect him for speaking about the causes that are important to him and sharing his views. I'm always gonna be cheering him on and I hope you will too. Well, that's a wrap for this one, but don't worry, don't stress. I'll be back next time. Because you know it's your girl.

• 1:03:17Keke Palmer?

  Enjoy Baby This is Keke Palmer on the Wondery app, wherever you get your podcasts, and now on YouTube where you can watch full episodes. Subscribe to the Wondery channel on YouTube and don't miss any episodes. You can listen to Baby This is Keke Palmer early and ad free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.

• 1:03:41Keke Palmer?

  Baby This Is Keke Palmer is hosted and executive produced by me, Keke Palmer. Lucas Segal is our post-producer. Music supervisor is Scott Valesquez. Our original theme song was written and performed by me, Keke Palmer. For Team Kiki, my producer is Sharon Palmer. For Wondery, our managing producer is Olivia Fonte. Our producer is Tristan McNeil. Senior producers are Lizzie Bassett and Candice Manriquez-Redd. Our executive producers are Dave Easton and Marshall Louie.