Tesla Releasing a Cheap Car in 2025? Best Bargains in Enthusiast Cars!

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Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:04Doug DeMuro?

  Hello and welcome to this car pod.

• 0:07Speaker 01

  I'm Kenan.

• 0:08Doug DeMuro?

  I'm Felipe. And there's a lot to talk about today. Let's start with the news. Aston Martin Valhalla, Valhalla, Vulcan Valkyrie. There's a lot of Aston Martins.

• 0:20Speaker 01

  There are a lot of Aston Martins.

• 0:21Doug DeMuro?

  Not, not like sold, just in the lineup. But they've re-announced, they've re-announced, and I say that because the Aston Martin Valhalla had been previously announced as a concept car back in 2019. It was gonna have a V6 hybrid.

• 0:35Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 0:36Doug DeMuro?

  Then in 21, they re-showed it and said production would start in 23. You don't find this to be exciting?

• 0:43Speaker 01

  I mean, it still doesn't exist yet.

• 0:45Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I know.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  So.

• 0:46Doug DeMuro?

  I know, because in 21, they said it'd be here in 23. Well, now it's 24, they say it'll be here in 26. Maybe every two years, they're gonna say it's gonna be here two years from now.

• 0:53Speaker 01

  Aston Martin, trying to keep the brand exciting, just keep teasing.

• 0:55Doug DeMuro?

  For the same car. I will tell you this, and this is something that I want you to be impressed by. Car has 1,064 horsepower, just like the new ZR1, same figure, 1,064. Is it the same engine? Yes. Same engine. Oh, love it. No, 1,064 horsepower, and get this, this is where you're gonna be blown, your mind is gonna be blown. Dry weight, 3650, so curb weight probably 38, 3900. It's a light, it's a lightweight. That's a joke.

• 1:21Speaker 01

  That's a joke.

• 1:22Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, it's almost too tight. A thousand of them are gonna be made, but you know, right now it isn't being made. It is gonna be a plug-in hybrid. It's a plug-in hybrid. It's a plug-in hybrid based on Mercedes AMG. But I, I agree with Kenan in the sense that I'm a little reluctant to get really into the details because we've been lied to before.

• 1:41Speaker 01

  Right. I mean, yes, it's another halo car for Aston Martin, but wasn't the Valkyrie also that? And that's.

• 1:47Doug DeMuro?

  This is like slotting below the Valkyrie. The Valkyrie is a halo car on a level that like Felipe will never attain as a person.

• 1:53Speaker 01

  Correct.

• 1:53Doug DeMuro?

  You know what I mean? Like, that's a four and a half million dollar. Are you saying they'll attain this? You, as a person, you will attain it. You won't have one of these. You will just like get to this level of humanity.

• 2:03Speaker 01

  So, hold on. So that's four and a half millions. Any price figures on what this is gonna be?

• 2:06Doug DeMuro?

  The last time they showed it, which was in 21, they said over a million. Now they're talking, no, I'm sorry, that was in 19, they said it over a million. Then in 21, they said around 800. So you gotta figure one and a half.

• 2:20Speaker 01

  Well, I'm glad that they really are. So they make a $4 million car. If you're not that rich, if you only have, if you don't have three commas in your net worth, you have two, then you can get this.

• 2:30Doug DeMuro?

  Well, that's, that's how it works.

• 2:33Speaker 01

  I know, but that's, it's just, I just don't care about like these ultra high end.

• 2:37Doug DeMuro?

  I also have really grown a little tired.

• 2:40Speaker 01

  Just weary.

• 2:41Doug DeMuro?

  The, another hypercar, another supercar, particularly from Aston Martin, which is a brand, when Ferrari announces an F80, I look at it. I, that's, that's something you have to focus on. When Aston Martin announces yet another.

• 2:51Speaker 01

  That's identical to one that they announced five years ago.

• 2:54Doug DeMuro?

  The Valkyrie, you're talking about the original Valkyrie or the Velour?

• 2:57Speaker 01

  No, no, the original Valhalla.

• 2:59Doug DeMuro?

  The Hya, the original one.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  Why did we pick the letter V? You know, in my family, we name all our pets starting with the letter T, and they've chosen V.

• 3:08Doug DeMuro?

  They've chosen V. It doesn't work as well with a car company because Ford found this out and they tried to do it with F and with E with the SUVs. They had Explorer, Escape. It was hard. Expedition, excursion. It's, marketing makes it challenging. Like, it's hard for consumers to distinguish. And as a consumer, I gotta be honest, I, it's Valhalla, Vulcan victory. I don't know. I don't, there's one called the Victor.

• 3:30Speaker 01

  Is there really?

• 3:31Doug DeMuro?

  The Valor.

• 3:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:34Doug DeMuro?

  I don't know. I don't know. The point is, this car is gonna be a plug-in hybrid, twin-turbo V8, 1064 horsepower. It'll be cool. It'll be like the SF90 and the Revuelto.

• 3:44Speaker 01

  What's the chance that Aston Martin goes bankrupt before this car actually gets out?

• 3:48Doug DeMuro?

  I know, everybody's all excited, like, oh, this is cool. It's a good chance. I will never forget, I, to this day, I was at the Mazda 6 launch.

• 3:56Speaker 01

  A car's not even on sale anymore, is it?

• 3:57Doug DeMuro?

  I was at the new Mazda 6 launch.

• 3:59Speaker 01

  It may still be on sale.

• 4:00Doug DeMuro?

  In 2017. And they were like, we're gonna have a diesel in six months.

• 4:04Speaker 01

  I remember.

• 4:05Doug DeMuro?

  And you know what? I'm still waiting. So I don't trust anything that any automaker ever tells me at any time ever until it is driving down the street in front of me.

• 4:15Speaker 01

  I, I don't, I don't totally disagree. So, I don't know. But yeah, to your point, it's worn the shine off of the really special cars because when there are a lot of something that are really special, it's no longer really special.

• 4:27Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 4:27Speaker 01

  And I think that, I'm sure it will be. Amazing, but.

• 4:31Doug DeMuro?

  Right, but all of them are amazing. There's so many tools for rich guys to go fast.

• 4:34Speaker 01

  I know.

• 4:35Doug DeMuro?

  And that's how you make money, but you gotta actually release the car and sell it. The problem is you don't necessarily make money that way if you don't have something behind it.

• 4:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:42Doug DeMuro?

  The F40 sells, sold and sells now because it's like got this historical panache. Just creating another thousand horsepower electric car or plug-in hybrid. There's, it doesn't, and McLaren has discovered this. These cars aren't incredibly easy to sell necessarily. Just because they make a $2 million car doesn't mean it sells out. Doesn't mean there's a ton of people who want to buy it. And especially with an Aston Martin brand name, you gotta kind of wonder. They should have a V12 too, you know?

• 5:06Speaker 01

  Do what Ferrari is not doing. Put a V12 in it.

• 5:09Doug DeMuro?

  And three pedals.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  Imagine if this had a V12 and three pedals.

• 5:13Doug DeMuro?

  Oh my God, people would be lining up to buy it. And by lining up, I mean they would sell out. It would be still hard, but it wouldn't be as hard as this.

• 5:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:20Doug DeMuro?

  Will be to sell. Speaking of cars that won't sell, skip onto that open top Mercedes thing.

• 5:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, we'll get to these. We'll get to all these stories.

• 5:27Doug DeMuro?

  That, tell me about this.

• 5:29Speaker 01

  So this is the AMG, the Mercedes AMG Pure Speed. So in addition to trying to copy Ferrari by building a car with no roof. Because this is the true Barca, they also gave it a stupid name.

• 5:39Doug DeMuro?

  They did.

• 5:39Speaker 01

  Um, but this car, so it's, it's an SL63 underneath. But what they've done is they've tried to tie into their Formula One heritage and put this bar. Now on Formula One cars, it's called the halo. The idea is that it's a piece of the structure of the car. If you flip it over, it will protect the driver. And it has saved.

• 5:55Doug DeMuro?

  No.

• 5:55Speaker 01

  It has genuinely saved lives. It's a really important thing in a Formula One car.

• 5:59Doug DeMuro?

  It's a very distinctive piece.

• 6:01Speaker 01

  Not particularly attractive.

• 6:02Doug DeMuro?

  Not attractive, but when you, when you look at that one car, it's one of the first things you see.

• 6:05Speaker 01

  Now, in a Formula One car, it's necessary. Now you'll notice that in, in the picture of this, and for those of you can't see, it's pretty close to the headrest. So your head is like about here, meaning that I don't think that does a whole lot in the way of safety necessarily.

• 6:18Doug DeMuro?

  Well, it, it probably is.

• 6:20Speaker 01

  It's probably.

• 6:20Doug DeMuro?

  Probably will, probably will hold the way to the car, is my guess.

• 6:24Speaker 01

  I don't think it's quite as effective as it is in a Formula One car, but nonetheless.

• 6:28Doug DeMuro?

  Regardless.

• 6:29Speaker 01

  Regardless. The things about, so, but basically underneath it's, it's an SL63. Same four, uh, four liter twin turbo V8, 577.

• 6:37Doug DeMuro?

  It's probably the same amount as the one in the V8. So the regular SL63 is $188,000 and the E Performance Hybrid is 200 plus.

• 6:46Speaker 01

  And there's no

• 6:47Doug DeMuro?

  This ain't gonna be around there.

• 6:49Speaker 01

  No, they, they, there's speculation Mercedes Benz hasn't come up with an official price for you. They say around $300,000.

• 6:54Doug DeMuro?

  Around $300,000 for windshieldless. Here's my problem with this vehicle. And by the way, I actually kind of like how it looks. I think it looks pretty cool. Here's my problem with this vehicle. We have learned from McLaren Elva, from Ferrari SP1 and SP2, and from, uh, what was the other? Aston Martin did it. A two, it had two like teardrop seats. I can't remember what it's called. That these cars don't sell. Like I met a lot of tasteless rich guys and I filmed their cars and even they wouldn't want, didn't buy the McLaren Elva. They were like, no, we're gonna buy all the other ones. We don't want Elva. So why did McLaren, why does Mercedes Benz think that a windshieldless car is the way to go?

• 7:34Speaker 01

  I think because they can't sell SLs anyway.

• 7:36Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 7:37Speaker 01

  So they're like, eh, do something different.

• 7:39Doug DeMuro?

  They did it once before.

• 7:42Speaker 01

  Oh, yes, they did.

• 7:44Doug DeMuro?

  They had another, they had another expensive performance car they couldn't sell.

• 7:48Speaker 01

  Yes, yes, yes, they did. And they, yes.

• 7:50Doug DeMuro?

  Pull it up. We want to see it.

• 7:52Speaker 01

  The Sterling Moss.

• 7:53Doug DeMuro?

  When Mercedes was trying to sell the SLR and for some reason had committed to a production of 3,500 units, which was about 3,300 units too many, they decided.

• 8:02Speaker 01

  Damn.

• 8:03Doug DeMuro?

  They decided to come up with a windshieldless version called the Sterling Moss, named after famous windshieldless race car driver Sterling Moss.

• 8:12Speaker 01

  He's an incredibly legitimate human being.

• 8:13Doug DeMuro?

  Man didn't have a windshield though. And so they came out with this.

• 8:17Speaker 01

  It looks better than an SLR.

• 8:18Doug DeMuro?

  It looks so much better. And honestly, when I see them, and I, which I don't, when I see pictures of them, I'm like, you know, that's actually pretty cool.

• 8:24Speaker 01

  It's so cool. I've never seen one in person. I would love to.

• 8:28Doug DeMuro?

  There's the, the Prince of Monaco's car collection has one. It's, there's a museum.

• 8:31Speaker 01

  Oh, thank you for that. Yeah. Oh, well, okay. Next time I'm there.

• 8:36Doug DeMuro?

  They also have the bubble top LS600 HSL.

• 8:38Speaker 01

  This, you know, not really the same. That, the SLR was a supercar at the time. This is just an SL63. Now they're only going to build 250 of these allegedly.

• 8:47Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, 250. That's probably a number that'll get it done.

• 8:50Speaker 01

  One hopes.

• 8:51Doug DeMuro?

  If they're 300 Gs, that's probably a number that'll get it done.

• 8:53Speaker 01

  Probably.

• 8:53Doug DeMuro?

  What, what do you think's gonna be a harder sell? The Aston Martin, whatever we just talked about, or the AMG SpeedShift?

• 9:00Speaker 01

  Well, on this, I'll tell you what, they give you helmets that have an intercon.

• 9:03Doug DeMuro?

  No, wait, wait, there's helmets?

• 9:04Speaker 01

  Yes, they're helmets that are aerodynamically designed to like fit in the car.

• 9:07Doug DeMuro?

  Well, first off, if you've got helmets, you don't need the bar to be structural. The helmet will support your weight. Second, yup, yup, you just learned something.

• 9:14Speaker 01

  Let me think about that a little harder.

• 9:16Doug DeMuro?

  Second, if you can talk to your passenger, then like, that's great, man. You don't need a motorcycle, you can just get a speed track.

• 9:25Speaker 01

  It's pure speed.

• 9:27Doug DeMuro?

  I'm not gonna.

• 9:27Speaker 01

  P is capital, S is capital.

• 9:29Doug DeMuro?

  There will be no situation under which that I refer to the car by that name.

• 9:32Speaker 01

  What are you gonna call this then?

• 9:33Doug DeMuro?

  I like SpeedShift, which is what they call the transmission.

• 9:37Speaker 01

  You're gonna call this?

• 9:38Doug DeMuro?

  Do they still call that?

• 9:38Speaker 01

  Cause they did.

• 9:39Doug DeMuro?

  Andrew SpeedShift, buddy.

• 9:40Speaker 01

  Do they still call that?

• 9:41Doug DeMuro?

  Yup. I don't know.

• 9:42Speaker 01

  Yup.

• 9:42Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay, well, that's, that's gonna be a poor, uh, car that will, will sell well. But I, I gotta say, I think it's cooler than I wish that I thought it was.

• 9:50Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:51Doug DeMuro?

  Cause it's obviously a cynical attempt to sell some.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  Sell some sells.

• 9:54Doug DeMuro?

  At least the, the front end looks better than actual. This is gonna be sold in the United States?

• 9:59Speaker 01

  I'm not entirely sure it was going.

• 10:00Doug DeMuro?

  Also, it does have a windshield, sort of. Well, they, all the.

• 10:03Speaker 01

  I'm like, the, the, the Elba that doesn't, right? It uses air. No, it's optional, I believe in the Elba.

• 10:08Doug DeMuro?

  The Elba, and when you put the windshield on an Elba, it just looks like it's in 20 years. Wild. So it's four million bucks. Or, I mean, use their, their, their 38 grand.

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• 12:29Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay, what's, what was our, what was our next news story that we skipped over?

• 12:32Speaker 04

  To talk about, to talk about a forerunner.

• 12:33Doug DeMuro?

  Supercars that are never gonna sell. New forerunner pricing has been announced, and boy are people angry. The new forerunner's gonna start at some crazy amount of money.

• 12:40Speaker 04

  That number is lower than what they originally said.

• 12:43Doug DeMuro?

  Forty-seven seventies without destination, and destination charges these days are like seven.

• 12:47Speaker 04

  So forty-two or forty-one nine-nine, whatever it is.

• 12:49Doug DeMuro?

  It's like forty-two and, and, and change. Um, but that's a base model, four-cylinder, basie, basie, basie.

• 12:55Speaker 04

  That's what the current one starts at.

• 12:56Doug DeMuro?

  It's about what the current one starts at, but the current one bases with a V6.

• 13:00Speaker 04

  That's been around for three decades. It makes 200.

• 13:02Doug DeMuro?

  We like our four liter 200 horse. That's all we need.

• 13:06Speaker 04

  It might be before 400 fans complain. I'm sure it's 240 or something.

• 13:09Doug DeMuro?

  No, it's a big number. It's like 3 million.

• 13:11Speaker 04

  What is? It's rare that a car increases cost by like $45 or whatever the starting MSRP is.

• 13:17Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, well.

• 13:18Speaker 04

  And if the four runner is hybrid, right?

• 13:19Doug DeMuro?

  The higher trims are a lot more expensive.

• 13:21Speaker 04

  Well, sure.

• 13:21Doug DeMuro?

  Now, I did it.

• 13:23Speaker 04

  I did it.

• 13:24Doug DeMuro?

  I did a dollar by dollar comparison and some of the higher trims are like three, three to six grand more expensive.

• 13:28Speaker 04

  Do they also have adaptive cruise control and less?

• 13:31Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, this is the thing. This is the thing. Number one, people are up in arms because it's more expensive.

• 13:36Speaker 04

  Are people upset by this? I will thrill that it's.

• 13:38Doug DeMuro?

  It's more, it is more expensive. The base, you can't compare base to base.

• 13:41Speaker 04

  No, but you can get into a 4Runner for the same price. You can get into a 2024 4Runner that's been the same for literally 14 years.

• 13:47Doug DeMuro?

  14 years. Still has halogen running lights, the last car.

• 13:50Speaker 04

  And doesn't have adaptive cruise to stop if memory serves.

• 13:52Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 13:52Speaker 04

  It has a five speed automatic, probably.

• 13:55Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, you should see.

• 13:55Speaker 04

  It might be a four. I don't know.

• 13:56Doug DeMuro?

  The backup camera?

• 13:57Speaker 04

  Right.

• 13:57Doug DeMuro?

  The backup camera is like there's, they pay a guy to just tell you. Like a low wage.

• 14:04Speaker 04

  Um, it's cheaper than.

• 14:06Doug DeMuro?

  It's the same cost.

• 14:07Speaker 04

  I know that it's a smaller engine. I know it's a base trim, base trim, but still that's notable that it didn't increase more.

• 14:11Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, the higher trims did increase, but like three to six to five to eight grand. It's much more expensive. However, there's a couple of points I'd like to make. Number one, people are complaining about this also with Tacoma. Toyota's lost their minds. I was there. And by I was there, I mean, I ran a business where people were selling these cars. When these cars were selling for that and Toyota wasn't making the money, right? The TRD pros forerunners were priced at like 55 and people were flipping them for like 65.

• 14:36Speaker 04

  They're still at 55.

• 14:37Doug DeMuro?

  Toyota was sitting there thinking, why are we not making this money? And it's hard to fault Toyota for going after money that the market said was there. How the drawback is that flipper market has died. And so in a world where these cars were selling for 65 pretty regularly, they aren't anymore. And now Toyota's trying to go into that price point. It was bad timing, but people are complaining about these prices, MSRP's in the past, the MSRP was too cheap based on how the market viewed the value of the car.

• 15:03Speaker 04

  Also, there's, the current 4Runner, sure, there's a TRD Pro.

• 15:06Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 15:07Speaker 04

  It doesn't have nearly the level of offered equipment that the new 4Runner has.

• 15:10Doug DeMuro?

  It's probably about the same.

• 15:12Speaker 04

  Is it?

• 15:12Doug DeMuro?

  They got, Toyota doesn't develop new stuff. They got traction controlling, got multi-terrain select.

• 15:16Speaker 04

  They're doing more. They haven't really invested in the 4Runner.

• 15:17Doug DeMuro?

  It's a much better vehicle. I haven't driven it, but I've been in it and been around it. It is a modernized version of the car. That doesn't, however, necessarily-

• 15:24Speaker 04

  A couple grand more doesn't seem insane to me.

• 15:25Doug DeMuro?

  But that doesn't necessarily allow you to charge a lot more, just modernizing the car. It is expected as table stakes that you modernize the cars every few years.

• 15:32Speaker 04

  That's fair.

• 15:33Doug DeMuro?

  Usually, even a redesign, they don't upgrade up the price by three or five grand. My contention, though, is the market already showed that it was willing to pay these prices.

• 15:43Speaker 04

  4Runners are so hard to get.

• 15:44Doug DeMuro?

  They are, well, Grand Highlanders are hard to get.

• 15:47Speaker 04

  2D Pro and 2D Offroad, which are the top, 2D Pro, which is the top trim, is still hard to get.

• 15:52Doug DeMuro?

  It is. It is.

• 15:52Speaker 04

  And which is what the top trims are here.

• 15:54Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. It's still relatively hard to get. I think it's more of a production constraint than a cost situation. But the point remains that if they're production constrained, why not bump the price up? Because people are gonna still buy them and they'd rather make the additional. And I don't blame Toyota, and I think it's totally reasonable if that's what the market wants. And people complain all the time about markups, but if people pay them, then that's what the market wants. Like, that's how supply and demand works.

• 16:18Speaker 04

  Right.

• 16:18Doug DeMuro?

  This is, I went into Econ 101. This one named Bev taught it. Her name was Bev.

• 16:24Speaker 04

  Kenan, I will pay you, if I have a, I will pay you $10. If you could name all of the SUVs in Toyota's 2025 lineup.

• 16:34Doug DeMuro?

  Wow. Oh, my God. Can you?

• 16:35Speaker 04

  Yes, of course.

• 16:36Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, Kenan, go for it.

• 16:37Speaker 04

  I don't think you can.

• 16:38Doug DeMuro?

  10 crisp dollars. Shockingly crisp.

• 16:41Speaker 04

  Really, really.

• 16:42Doug DeMuro?

  What do you got? What do you got? Give us a couple.

• 16:44Speaker 04

  I recommend starting from smallest going to largest, cheapest going to most expensive.

• 16:47Doug DeMuro?

  I will tell you, one cut in front of me today that I would have forgotten in less than a second.

• 16:52Speaker 01

  There's no way I can do this.

• 16:54Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 16:55Doug DeMuro?

  You think you can name half?

• 16:56Speaker 01

  No.

• 16:57Speaker 04

  I will give you how many more you can name.

• 16:58Speaker 01

  Outside the 4Runner.

• 16:59Doug DeMuro?

  All right, come on. What do you got? No, you got, you know mine.

• 17:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, Sequoia.

• 17:02Speaker 04

  Six. I will give you this.

• 17:03Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 17:04Speaker 04

  Six. There's apparently one, two, six.

• 17:05Doug DeMuro?

  Good luck.

• 17:07Speaker 01

  All right, so 4Runners, Sequoia, uh, uh, yeah, I'm kind of, I don't know.

• 17:14Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, wait, wait, hang on, hang on. I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna do it. No, I'm gonna do it. Come on.

• 17:19Speaker 01

  I mean, I can do the same thing with you. Give me Ferrari's lineup. It'd be the same thing.

• 17:23Doug DeMuro?

  Can you?

• 17:24Speaker 04

  Name all of them?

• 17:25Doug DeMuro?

  I bet you'll forget some.

• 17:26Speaker 04

  I think I can.

• 17:27Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, go.

• 17:27Speaker 04

  All right, I'm gonna try to start, the Corolla Cross.

• 17:30Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 17:30Speaker 04

  The RAV4, yeah.

• 17:32Doug DeMuro?

  I'm gonna call the RAV4 Prime the same thing.

• 17:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, I agree.

• 17:35Doug DeMuro?

  They don't, but I agree.

• 17:36Speaker 04

  The, the Crown Signia.

• 17:38Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, this might happen.

• 17:40Speaker 04

  The Highlander, the Grand Highlander, uh, the 4Runner, the Land Cruiser, the Sequoia. I do feel like I'm missing one.

• 17:48Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, let's see.

• 17:52Speaker 04

  That's all of them. They, they don't sell the CHR anymore. That's all the ones that I can think of.

• 17:57Doug DeMuro?

  Well, that's riveting.

• 17:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's all of them.

• 18:00Doug DeMuro?

  Congratulations.

• 18:01Speaker 04

  Wait a minute, go through them one more time?

• 18:02Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, God.

• 18:03Speaker 04

  Oh, no, you did, you did. You said Highlander and Grand Highlander. Yeah. You got them all.

• 18:06Doug DeMuro?

  Congratulations.

• 18:07Speaker 04

  Thank you. You have $10 for me?

• 18:08Doug DeMuro?

  No.

• 18:10Speaker 04

  Yeah. He's over here talking.

• 18:12Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, wait, you know what? You forgot the regular Crown, which has the ground clearance.

• 18:18Speaker 04

  That's a great point.

• 18:19Doug DeMuro?

  Well done. I would have done it too, but I'm surprised you got Crown Signia.

• 18:22Speaker 04

  Although, like, I will say, this pricing kind of, when the 4Runner was announced at the same time as they were doing first drive of the Land Cruiser, we were all kind of like, how are they splitting this to have a Land Cruiser and a GX and an LX 600 and now LX 700?

• 18:35Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 18:35Speaker 04

  The pricing kind of makes it work.

• 18:37Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 18:38Speaker 04

  It's cheap enough. We were worried it'd be too expensive.

• 18:39Doug DeMuro?

  Like Land Cruiser. I don't understand.

• 18:41Speaker 04

  How much is a Land Cruiser?

• 18:41Doug DeMuro?

  Land Cruisers are like mid 50s.

• 18:43Speaker 04

  Well, they, they start 15 grand less.

• 18:44Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but the, for, to, to, to equal, equivalize, the, the, you'd pay about mid 50s.

• 18:49Speaker 04

  I'm kind of assuming that in like 2027, they'll announce a smaller.

• 18:53Doug DeMuro?

  You know what?

• 18:54Speaker 04

  Offroader SUV.

• 18:55Doug DeMuro?

  This is what's gonna happen.

• 18:56Speaker 04

  Cruiser, if you will.

• 18:56Doug DeMuro?

  I'm gonna tell you this. When we drive around, we will know. The real off-roaders bought a 4Runner and the guys who like to drive around and look cool bought a Land Cruiser. Because ultimately, the 4Runner has more stuff, beefier, better priced, but it doesn't have the name.

• 19:11Speaker 04

  Right.

• 19:11Doug DeMuro?

  The name, guys.

• 19:12Speaker 04

  What if they buy a GX 550?

• 19:14Doug DeMuro?

  I guess that's okay.

• 19:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 19:16Doug DeMuro?

  They should have a Sequoia Tierney Pro.

• 19:17Speaker 04

  Okay, move on.

• 19:18Speaker 01

  I'm kind of curious, one last point on the pricing. Could, for the first model year of the new one, I wonder what it compares like adjusted for inflation price model year of, of like the first model year of the old one. Like, how much does inflation play into like the price of this car? It doesn't, that doesn't seem that crazy to me.

• 19:34Speaker 04

  Did you know that in 2010, the 4Runner SR5 Sport Utility, which is the base, base trend?

• 19:40Doug DeMuro?

  SR30. Uh, start at thirty.

• 19:43Speaker 04

  Yeah, that makes.

• 19:44Doug DeMuro?

  So I mean, it feels like it's kind of.

• 19:45Speaker 04

  Twenty ten though, that's, that's only an increase of thirty percent since twenty ten. That's probably about what it probably about keeps up with inflation.

• 19:52Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, so I think it's probably, I mean, I was just thinking.

• 19:54Speaker 04

  And it's obviously a much better truck. I mean, this is on leagues better than.

• 19:57Doug DeMuro?

  Cheapest car, cheapest new car in America is eighteen grand. Like, things have kind of changed, you know? It's like, I don't think it's that crazy.

• 20:03Speaker 04

  To forty eight.

• 20:05Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, damn, we're getting a deal. Go buy a forerunner, it's a bargain.

• 20:07Speaker 04

  Cars in general have beat inflation, like they're cheaper than. Especially given what they offer. Yeah. Anytime I drive for a video, an eighties car, I'm like, I can't believe people paid the equivalent of like a hundred grand for this trash.

• 20:19Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 20:20Speaker 04

  It's like amazing. Like that six M three GT is a very cool car, but like.

• 20:25Doug DeMuro?

  Not for what it costs when it was new.

• 20:26Speaker 04

  You get into a new M three or M four and it's like, this is incredible to drive. That was like, people, that plastic, people bought that thing for that money.

• 20:35Doug DeMuro?

  And it was incredible, it was incredible at the time. That's how bad other cars were.

• 20:38Speaker 04

  Before we were, when will you drive a forerunner? Spring, March, I think they said.

• 20:42Doug DeMuro?

  Cool.

• 20:42Speaker 04

  I can't wait, I truly can't wait. I think it's so cool.

• 20:44Doug DeMuro?

  Cool.

• 20:45Speaker 04

  Already made my opinion. Okay, yeah, all right. Uh, Ironic five N is shown here because it's the only cool car that Hyundai makes. That's not true.

• 20:51Doug DeMuro?

  Yep.

• 20:51Speaker 04

  But.

• 20:51Doug DeMuro?

  Close.

• 20:52Speaker 04

  Um, you can now buy a Hyundai on Amazon.

• 20:55Doug DeMuro?

  Amazon dot com?

• 20:56Speaker 04

  Amazon dot com.

• 20:57Doug DeMuro?

  Jeff Bezos's website?

• 20:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, they, they, they announced a partnership like a year ago where you get to buy it. It's finally live.

• 21:02Doug DeMuro?

  Wait a second.

• 21:02Speaker 04

  In select markets.

• 21:03Doug DeMuro?

  Was, was it Hyundai you could buy at Costco also?

• 21:06Speaker 04

  Uh, Costco does have a bunch of manufacturer programs, but, but you can't buy them through Costco.

• 21:10Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, so now you can go on Amazon.

• 21:11Speaker 04

  You can go to Amazon, you can see all the inventory and then you can like legitimately start your purchase. You still have to go through a dealer. And as far as I can tell, it's only sort of available in our area. Because I tried and just get sent to the dealer website.

• 21:24Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, okay, so Ironic five N, there it is. Okay, I'm interested in Hyundai of Temecula and then you, you click on begin purchase.

• 21:31Speaker 04

  In theory, you can get full pricing information and financing information on Amazon. I have not seen this to be true and I've seen people talking online about how it just.

• 21:39Doug DeMuro?

  It's right here, it's right here.

• 21:40Speaker 04

  Gives you to that dealership to actually complete the purchase. But it, it, it's interesting.

• 21:44Doug DeMuro?

  They got rules about all this stuff.

• 21:45Speaker 04

  And also get twenty three hundred dollars in Amazon gift cards.

• 21:48Doug DeMuro?

  If you.

• 21:49Speaker 04

  Pretty solid for a limited time.

• 21:50Doug DeMuro?

  You can't buy it, you can't not buy a car to dealership. They, they, they got rules.

• 21:55Speaker 04

  So that, that's why the question.

• 21:56Doug DeMuro?

  Back in and it, oh, here, buy my new Hyundai.

• 21:58Speaker 04

  The question like, I, I'm glad they're doing this, I like innovation and how people buy cars. Clearly, we run cars in bed, so she's an innovation, how people buy cars, use cars. But like. Given these sales go to a dealership?

• 22:10Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. It's, it's, it's the concept. The auto make, the legacy automakers are seeing that what Tesla has, Rivian, Rust have done, which is they got a kiosk at the mall and you order a car and then a little robot delivers it. Ish. Um, and they want to do that, but they've got all these dealer agreements and there's all these laws and stuff. They can't really do it. But here you go. Three thirty seven a month for a venue.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  Great. Can you begin purchase?

• 22:32Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I can click on begin purchase.

• 22:34Speaker 04

  And then it'll send you to a dealer?

• 22:35Doug DeMuro?

  Probably the dealer will call me for the next decade.

• 22:37Speaker 04

  Correct.

• 22:37Doug DeMuro?

  See, somebody's signed up for a venue.

• 22:39Speaker 04

  But it is nice that you can see across dealers a little bit more easily. Obviously cars.com, car group, whatever, you can see that, but it's nice to have it in one place. Uh, and where you do all your shopping with it.

• 22:48Speaker 01

  Do you think eventually it'll be available on Prime and that will then?

• 22:51Doug DeMuro?

  It'll deliver in two days.

• 22:52Speaker 01

  That'll, yeah, that'll revolutionize the shipping industry, the car shipping industry, which is notoriously slow.

• 22:56Speaker 04

  I bet that they have thought about this a lot. Yeah.

• 22:58Speaker 01

  That would be amazing.

• 22:59Doug DeMuro?

  About a few.

• 22:59Speaker 04

  That would be amazing.

• 23:00Doug DeMuro?

  If I could go on, if I could go on Amazon and order like.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  Have it show up tomorrow.

• 23:04Doug DeMuro?

  Or like, like book service.

• 23:06Speaker 01

  Oh, well, that would be incredible.

• 23:08Doug DeMuro?

  Like, like, like I got my G-Wagon. I want to get Amazon to come service it.

• 23:13Speaker 01

  I'll be, I'd be afraid of that, but.

• 23:15Speaker 04

  I think my main takeaway is that this is not that notable.

• 23:17Doug DeMuro?

  It's not that notable, but it's unless, unless it does more. The concept of it is cool that you can shop on Amazon, but like, if you have to go through the dealer, if you have to do the whole process anyway, then it's just, it's an aggregator, like, like AutoTrader.

• 23:28Speaker 04

  And like financing through three or seven a month for that venue. And that's so dependent on your actual credit score.

• 23:33Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 23:34Speaker 04

  You're not going to get the real info for a while.

• 23:36Doug DeMuro?

  But so we're being lied to.

• 23:38Speaker 04

  More info is always good.

• 23:39Doug DeMuro?

  Being lied to about though is.

• 23:41Speaker 04

  Oh, yes.

• 23:41Doug DeMuro?

  No, go to the next one. I want to talk about the next one.

• 23:43Speaker 04

  No, no, the, the next one, not the previous one.

• 23:45Doug DeMuro?

  There, no, the Mustang.

• 23:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:48Speaker 04

  I, I thought it was a great segue to the Model Q.

• 23:50Doug DeMuro?

  No, this is not a lie. You know how they know that? Cause it's down to the thousandths of a second.

• 23:54Speaker 01

  Yes, that's right. The Mustang GTD has laid down a time on the Nürburgring. Six fifty seven point six eight five.

• 24:00Speaker 04

  Doug did not know what the Mustang GTD was.

• 24:02Doug DeMuro?

  No, I knew what it was. I knew what it was. I just like.

• 24:06Speaker 04

  What is it, Ken?

• 24:06Speaker 01

  It's a track focused version of the Mustang. It's supposed to be their halo car. So it's a three hundred thousand dollar, three hundred twenty five thousand dollar Mustang. Uh, this is eight hundred and fifteen horsepower, but it is a multimatic suspension system, which is incredible. They had it at the Quail and I got to really look at it. It's, it's beautiful.

• 24:23Speaker 04

  Like front engine? No, it's, it's, didn't they move the engine?

• 24:26Doug DeMuro?

  What? For the GT? No, wow. I imagine that's great. I don't know what it is.

• 24:29Speaker 01

  Man, you're a Corvette guy.

• 24:32Doug DeMuro?

  Anything. Now that we moved the engine, shouldn't they? So anyway, did a 657, 685, sub seven minute Nürburgring lap time, that beats the Courage GT. Fletch, any thoughts about that? Same time as the 918.

• 24:42Speaker 04

  Not an accomplishment.

• 24:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:45Speaker 04

  Beated the Courage GT. Barely an accomplishment.

• 24:47Doug DeMuro?

  The Courage GT is the greatest car ever built, though.

• 24:50Doug DeMuro?

  The Courage GT.

• 24:51Speaker 01

  Let's take a quick look.

• 24:53Doug DeMuro?

  Ask Walter Roerl.

• 24:55Speaker 01

  So look, so look, so here are the lists on Wikipedia, anyway, of the top times that have been laid down by production cars. So the AMG Project One takes the cake at 629, which is ridiculous.

• 25:07Doug DeMuro?

  That is 10 seconds faster than this GT2 RS with the performance kit on a damp track. Wow. The, I mean.

• 25:15Speaker 01

  I mean, that's like in a completely different league of automobile.

• 25:18Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 25:18Speaker 01

  But the Mustang is, I guess it's in the top 10 technically. It's down here below the 918, same time, basically.

• 25:26Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, because a lot of these cars are actually the same car with different drivers and different conditions. If you scroll up, like GT3 appears a couple times, GT3 RS here appears twice. I guess one's a 9 and two, one's a 9 and one, but the point is, though, that, that, yeah, it's radical SR8 appears twice.

• 25:39Speaker 01

  Now, Ford has said that they're not done yet. They're gonna, they think they can do better and they can shave off more time. But it is remarkable that the Nürburgring is a gigantic racetrack.

• 25:49Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 25:50Speaker 01

  With a lot of conditions. It can be raining in one part and dry and sunny in the other.

• 25:55Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 25:55Speaker 01

  It's huge. There are towns within it.

• 25:56Doug DeMuro?

  Within it.

• 25:57Speaker 01

  Did you know that?

• 25:57Doug DeMuro?

  I did know that, but like barely. Like, you go over bridges, like there's like towns in, in the Nürburgring.

• 26:05Speaker 04

  In.

• 26:06Doug DeMuro?

  Can you buy a house there? Yeah, you can't, but like a person could.

• 26:13Doug DeMuro?

  They don't let your kind over to the Nürburgring. I mean, you citizen.

• 26:17Speaker 01

  Fletch calls it the Nürburgring.

• 26:20Speaker 01

  But it, yeah, but nonetheless, it is impressive that a Mustang is included amongst, to be honest with you, a lot of Porsches in Mercedes.

• 26:27Doug DeMuro?

  It's the fastest American car. Fastest American car of all time. How much faster is it than the Ford GT? The one that they do, that Multimatic also does. Ford GT, oh, it's not on here, but my Ford GT did a 752. It took a minute off. Holy crap. What, what is the next American car on this list? Some sort of Viper, ACR Viper did 701 in 17.

• 26:52Speaker 04

  And apparently that testing ended in tire failure resulting in a crash.

• 26:55Doug DeMuro?

  Third attempt testing ended by tire failure resulting in a crash. So in other words, the Viper can do a 701, but only two laps. Then the tires fail and you die.

• 27:02Speaker 01

  Hey man, it's all he needs to do. Lay down on time.

• 27:04Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, yeah, that's true. Now I will say, I don't, I respect the Mustang GTD greatly, uh, having just found out about it today. But I do not respect any car that loses to the Aventador SVJ, which, which weighs more than a

• 27:20Speaker 04

  What does that mean?

• 27:20Doug DeMuro?

  bunch of hogs.

• 27:22Speaker 04

  What does that mean about all of your cars?

• 27:23Doug DeMuro?

  All of them are slower. And in fact, the SVJ has the fourth best lap time ever.

• 27:27Speaker 01

  All of them are slower. You don't say the Countach couldn't really throw it down, period.

• 27:32Doug DeMuro?

  Dude, aren't you blown away that the SVJ, it's faster than a 911 GT2RS, it's faster than a Radical SR8 LM, whatever the hell that is. It's faster than a AMG GT Black. The SVJ, you understand the SVJ is the big boy.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  I know. We kind of like, I don't want to say look down on it, but like when I see one, I'm like.

• 27:50Doug DeMuro?

  You think of that car as a, as a.

• 27:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. Heavy, big, fat is what you're saying.

• 27:56Doug DeMuro?

  The Beluga whale of supercars.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:59Doug DeMuro?

  I'm not, that thing weighs like.

• 28:00Speaker 01

  Amazing engine, amazing era, great all wheel drive system. And it's on, it was on Trafar.

• 28:04Doug DeMuro?

  When they did the Hummer EV, they benchmarked the SVJ for weight. They were like, if we just gotta get around there.

• 28:09Speaker 04

  Unfortunately for them, they were twice as heavy, but.

• 28:12Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 28:13Speaker 04

  They tried.

• 28:14Doug DeMuro?

  It wasn't a full roll cage in Trafar, so we don't accept that as a real time.

• 28:17Speaker 01

  Well, no, everybody else is on. It's like.

• 28:19Doug DeMuro?

  The roll cage probably even added even more weight.

• 28:23Speaker 01

  Right. But nonetheless impressive. Good for Ford.

• 28:24Doug DeMuro?

  Let me ask you a question. Go back to the lap time list. And this is a serious question. I just want you to think about it. You don't have to answer.

• 28:29Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 28:30Doug DeMuro?

  AMG Mercedes driver clearly is Maro Engel.

• 28:33Speaker 01

  Engel, yeah.

• 28:34Doug DeMuro?

  Okay. He got, he did the lap time in the AMG one.

• 28:36Speaker 04

  He's good on Maro.

• 28:38Doug DeMuro?

  Lamborghini's driver is Marco. You think they. You think they, you know, do you think that Mauro thinks he's faster because he doesn't have that extra ladder?

• 28:47Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. Maybe, maybe it's the name that carries the weight.

• 28:52Doug DeMuro?

  They fight about this?

• 28:53Speaker 04

  No, I think they're venerable.

• 28:54Speaker 01

  I think they they leave it on the track.

• 28:57Doug DeMuro?

  All right. What's our last news story? There's some sort of Tesla thing.

• 29:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:00Doug DeMuro?

  Didn't look that interesting.

• 29:01Speaker 04

  We're gonna talk about this for 10 seconds. Apparently, according to a report from Douchebank, uh, Tesla will have a new one. No, I'm gonna say it weirdly on purpose. Deutsche Bank. Um, Tesla will will be revealing in Q1.

• 29:14Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 29:15Speaker 04

  A sub $30,000 with tax credit, 37.5 if there is not a tax credit anymore, uh, EV. It will apparently be based on an existing platform and we will believe it when we see it.

• 29:25Doug DeMuro?

  Can I tell you something about Tesla and affordable vehicles? I've been hearing my whole life that Tesla was about to release a, like when they came out Model 3, there was gonna be a 35,001. Never happened. When they came out Cybertruck, there was gonna be a $60,000. What they do is they announce the vehicle, they announce the price point. This is Tesla's strategy. They announce the vehicle, they announce the price point, they come out with more expensive ones and then quietly they cancel two years into production. The base one saying they couldn't make it work. This has happened multiple times.

• 29:50Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 29:50Doug DeMuro?

  So I don't, I don't buy it.

• 29:51Speaker 04

  Also, they haven't come out with a refreshed model Y yet, although it will come out soon Jupiter or whatever they're calling it.

• 29:56Doug DeMuro?

  Ooh Jupiter.

• 29:57Speaker 04

  I don't, I might not be right. I can't remember.

• 29:59Doug DeMuro?

  If it was asked.

• 30:01Speaker 04

  They should be really coming out with new product lines when they.

• 30:04Doug DeMuro?

  Well, the cars are, the, the cars are intended to be timeless. So like the Model S came out in 12 and it hasn't changed.

• 30:10Speaker 04

  And people are gonna write it and be like, this is hot. One faceless in 16.

• 30:14Doug DeMuro?

  Right. Listen, if my wife thinks it looks the same, then it looks the same. You know what I mean? Like, like, like you and me know it changed because they put a grill on it or they took the grill off.

• 30:20Speaker 04

  Took the grill off.

• 30:21Doug DeMuro?

  Whatever. That doesn't count.

• 30:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 30:23Doug DeMuro?

  Right? When a, when a new.

• 30:24Speaker 04

  Ken doesn't know that there's an updated model.

• 30:25Doug DeMuro?

  No, no, no.

• 30:26Speaker 01

  Yes, I do. It was nicknamed the, it was nicknamed the Highlands, which wasn't actually a thing. We saw it. It was a wonderful car.

• 30:31Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 30:32Speaker 04

  But he can't tell apart.

• 30:32Doug DeMuro?

  No, no.

• 30:33Speaker 01

  Yes, I can. I can tell.

• 30:34Doug DeMuro?

  You can tell apart.

• 30:35Speaker 01

  Especially the rears. Yeah, especially the rear.

• 30:37Speaker 04

  Different tellers.

• 30:38Doug DeMuro?

  But I actually.

• 30:39Speaker 04

  What about the car that's off?

• 30:40Speaker 01

  A little different.

• 30:41Speaker 04

  What if the car's off?

• 30:42Speaker 01

  Huh?

• 30:42Speaker 04

  What if the car doesn't have on? Is it on? I don't need to be on.

• 30:45Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, I think I'm all fine.

• 30:47Speaker 04

  All right.

• 30:48Doug DeMuro?

  I can tell.

• 30:49Speaker 04

  Regardless, I have a lot of, um, I'm holding my breath for this one because the Roadster came out in what year?

• 30:54Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, they announced that it was 19.

• 30:58Speaker 04

  Right.

• 30:58Doug DeMuro?

  They announced the Roadster in the fall of 19, five years ago. That was the LA Auto Show. We were coming home from the LA Auto Show and they announced it five.

• 31:07Speaker 04

  Oh, the Valhalla will be out before for the Roadster.

• 31:09Doug DeMuro?

  Man, the Valhalla and the Tesla Roadster are in a race to see which. The funny thing is by the time those cars come out, they're not interested anymore. When the Roadster, I, I was, I did this video about this the other day. When the Roadster came out, was announced, it was a thousand horsepower.

• 31:21Speaker 04

  Whoa.

• 31:22Doug DeMuro?

  Sub two seconds, you're sixty. Right. Now, that's a lot of stuff has a thousand horsepower. We had a Corvette in the office that some guys brought down on a truck. That had a thousand horsepower.

• 31:32Speaker 04

  Right.

• 31:32Doug DeMuro?

  The Tesla Roadster was like a space age future car with a thousand horsepower. Dudes are just bringing cars to us on trucks with a thousand horsepower now. Something to think about for you.

• 31:44Speaker 04

  He doesn't think about a thousand horsepower.

• 31:45Doug DeMuro?

  No.

• 31:46Speaker 04

  His max is three ninety-four, am I right?

• 31:48Doug DeMuro?

  That's right. That's right. Between four and five hundred is all the more you need on the road.

• 31:51Speaker 04

  Well, unfortunately, you're invited to the panel in that number.

• 31:53Doug DeMuro?

  Nope.

• 31:55Speaker 04

  Any of your car.

• 31:56Doug DeMuro?

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• 32:42Doug DeMuro?

  Says, "Stop suffering in regular pants and give the gift of comfort this holiday season." "For a limited time only, our listeners get 20% off when you use the code CARS at checkout." "That's 20% off with the code CARS at publicrec.com." "After your purchase, they'll ask you where you heard about them." "Please support our show and tell them we sent you." "And say goodbye to pants that put up a fight." "Because when comfort meets style, you've found Public Rec."

• 33:09Speaker 04

  So you can stop talking.

• 33:10Doug DeMuro?

  There was a lot of news this week. We gotta move on though to other segments. We gotta move on to other segments. We cannot talk about the Ferrari Cadillac thing. We'll do it next week. Other segments. Volkswagen sent us a cease and desist letter. Filippo doesn't want to talk about it. We're not gonna talk about it.

• 33:22Speaker 04

  We'll talk about it next week.

• 33:23Doug DeMuro?

  We got legal things going on here.

• 33:25Speaker 04

  We'll talk about it next week.

• 33:26Doug DeMuro?

  The cease and desist was about some van.

• 33:29Speaker 04

  We'll talk about it next week.

• 33:30Doug DeMuro?

  It had nothing to do with anything bad we said on the battlefield. Like, I insulted the Atlas Cross Sport on the pod last week. No cease and desist.

• 33:36Speaker 04

  Did you really? I forgot about it, just like I do about the Atlas.

• 33:40Doug DeMuro?

  It's called the Cross Sport, okay?

• 33:43Speaker 04

  Who knows?

• 33:43Doug DeMuro?

  It is.

• 33:44Speaker 04

  All right.

• 33:45Doug DeMuro?

  You're thinking of a sport cross. That's the Lexus.

• 33:47Speaker 04

  We'll talk about the van next week.

• 33:48Doug DeMuro?

  We had a van on the site.

• 33:49Speaker 04

  We'll talk about the van next week.

• 33:51Doug DeMuro?

  Or something.

• 33:52Speaker 04

  They have a tri.

• 33:53Doug DeMuro?

  Volkswagen body kit. They told us to take it down. Apparently, we're not allowed to discuss it.

• 33:57Speaker 04

  We will next week.

• 33:59Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, okay. Next, I want to talk about Consumer Reports. This is a news story, but we're gonna talk about it like we're talking about cars. Consumer Reports came out with their ratings of reliability, which in my opinion are very dull and I don't care.

• 34:11Speaker 04

  However, I used to read every car review that Consumer Reports did from like 2004 to probably 2012.

• 34:17Doug DeMuro?

  Dull and boring, you repeat yourself. We'll move on.

• 34:21Speaker 04

  Kel, surprise.

• 34:22Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 34:23Speaker 04

  Can you pull up the list?

• 34:24Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, Consumer Reports comes out with this list. I, it's unbelievable. They say that the Rivian is the least reliable brand.

• 34:32Speaker 04

  Before we get into this, can I talk, can I say something about Consumer Reports?

• 34:35Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, they're getting connected.

• 34:36Speaker 04

  They, so they're actually based in Yonkers, New York, but they do have a test track in Connecticut in a town called East Haddam where I once lived.

• 34:42Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, that's not... Anyway, so they announced this and Rivian is the lowest of all the reliable cars. Go down to the very bottom, there's Rivian. Hanging out with Cadillac. Dude, I'll tell you something. Where's Ram? Why are there only 22 brands? I want Ram. Ram would be, so far it's off the list.

• 34:59Speaker 04

  Agreed. Actually, you'll know the no FCA brand except for Jeep is on the list at all.

• 35:03Doug DeMuro?

  They don't do FCA. Consumer Reports decided years ago to just stop doing FCA.

• 35:08Speaker 04

  Do you think of when they're reading to Stellantis and not us here?

• 35:11Doug DeMuro?

  Anyway, here's my issue with this.

• 35:13Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 35:13Doug DeMuro?

  I love consumer reports generally, but a few years ago, maybe 10 now. They they started to really include technology and complaints about the in car technology. And that meant that for a long time Lexus was dinged pretty badly and went down because it was bad. Right. So like it's it's changed a little bit from like, will my car break down to is the infotainment easy to use?

• 35:35Speaker 04

  Right.

• 35:35Doug DeMuro?

  So consumer reports used to send out surveys to owners of the cars. And after two or three years, they'd get data. I agree with you. A lot of people, consumer reportsy type people probably don't understand or like Rivian's technology.

• 35:49Speaker 04

  It might be bad. A lot of the Rivian screens have some issues.

• 35:52Doug DeMuro?

  The type of people who buy Rivian's are happy to be guinea pigs and have their car break a little bit just to be like the first and coolest.

• 35:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:59Doug DeMuro?

  And like their big complaint might be about the tech or like the screen freezing or whatever, which is a problem, but that's very different than my car breaks down.

• 36:05Speaker 04

  My car has stranded me. It has failed to transport me, which is the primary function of a vehicle.

• 36:09Doug DeMuro?

  Which is why I I like I think about these a little bit differently than I once did, once I added that, because it does, it like I as a consumer care less about.

• 36:17Speaker 04

  Cause like.

• 36:18Doug DeMuro?

  Technology liabilities.

• 36:19Speaker 04

  I'm looking at Subaru and I'm like, are those transmissions problematic?

• 36:21Doug DeMuro?

  No, Subaru's got it all figured out. Starlink. No, the ascent's good now. There was a couple of years of ascent where you were driving on the freeway. And it would it would stop and then catch on fire simultaneously. And if you were still in the car after the fire started, then little men would come out of the cargo area and beat you to death. That was it was only a two year problem.

• 36:42Speaker 04

  Also.

• 36:42Doug DeMuro?

  It was only a two year problem.

• 36:43Speaker 04

  A question was, I mean, like Land Rover's not on here.

• 36:46Doug DeMuro?

  They don't have, they don't, there's not a lot of brands. I find the whole thing to be questionable.

• 36:52Speaker 04

  But like there's truth to this, and this is also where I would look for like, will my mother in law have a problem with her car?

• 36:58Doug DeMuro?

  Right.

• 36:59Speaker 04

  And you you wouldn't get your mother in law into a Rivian. I'll tell you that right now. She and her husband said something about looking at Land Rovers. What is your mother-in-law drive at the moment? Super outback. Super outback. And she's number one. She's talking about Land Rovers.

• 37:11Doug DeMuro?

  Okay, we're not allowed to talk about that. Kenan, give us your topic, which is about Maserati, and I love it.

• 37:17Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 37:17Doug DeMuro?

  The great thought exercise.

• 37:18Speaker 01

  Maserati, as we know.

• 37:20Doug DeMuro?

  Noted bad company.

• 37:22Speaker 01

  Yes. Make some.

• 37:24Speaker 04

  Can we just go to their website? I don't even know what they sell anymore. The Grecoli, the Levante and the. And I saw Grecoli the other day on the road. And it's just like a.

• 37:32Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, the. Levante is canceled. Quattroporte is canceled.

• 37:35Speaker 04

  Levante is canceled.

• 37:36Doug DeMuro?

  Levante is canceled. In an, in an, in an age where SUVs reign supreme.

• 37:40Speaker 04

  Is this their?

• 37:40Doug DeMuro?

  This is it.

• 37:41Speaker 04

  Okay, you can go to models on the top left.

• 37:43Doug DeMuro?

  Well, MC20, oh, it's there. In an age where SUVs reign supreme, Maserati somehow. But only leftovers, they're not selling it anymore. It's not new. These, the Quattroporte same, they're not, there's not a new one. In an age where SUVs are everything, Maserati somehow managed to like miss on an SUV and they had to cancel it. Name an SUV that's been canceled. Like, it's insane.

• 38:04Speaker 04

  Right.

• 38:05Speaker 01

  It's the MC20.

• 38:06Speaker 04

  Oh, okay. The Cello is the, is Cello. Is the convertible.

• 38:10Doug DeMuro?

  Don't do that.

• 38:10Speaker 04

  You gotta do it. So GT2.

• 38:13Doug DeMuro?

  So anyway, they have three cars. So the question, your question is?

• 38:17Speaker 01

  My question is, the brand is fledgling. Well, they're really struggling here, we'll say. I think their brand equity is low. Um, well, so my question is. It's a fact, not an opinion. What would you do to fix Maserati?

• 38:33Doug DeMuro?

  There's only one real option if you're.

• 38:35Speaker 04

  Bankruptcy and receivership.

• 38:36Doug DeMuro?

  I, I would just close it down.

• 38:38Speaker 01

  Close it.

• 38:39Doug DeMuro?

  Not gonna lie. Like, I mean, like, if, if, if you're Philantons, which owns Maserati, you have this and Alfa Romeo, which sells.

• 38:47Speaker 01

  A car?

• 38:48Doug DeMuro?

  The one that's also a Dodge is also the Grecoli.

• 38:51Speaker 01

  But Maserati has stronger brand equity than Alfa Romeo in this country.

• 38:54Doug DeMuro?

  No, you're wrong. There is, Maserati has a real future. It's just not being managed particularly well. What I would do, I would really start to think about what I would want to do about all these brands. I would.

• 39:04Speaker 04

  You gotta consolidate.

• 39:05Doug DeMuro?

  I would, I would have an everyman brand like Chevrolet. I would have maybe Alpha be the luxury brand and maybe Maserati be a higher tier sports car brand. And that's it. Just those three.

• 39:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 39:15Doug DeMuro?

  And no more Chrysler or Dodge or Ram, whatever you want. Combine those into one brand. It probably can't be called Dodge because it has some difficult name recognition. Then again, you can't come out with a Chrysler Ram. They probably had these conversations. But the point is.

• 39:27Speaker 04

  That's because they split off Ram from Dodge for.

• 39:29Doug DeMuro?

  God knows what. That was really a bad idea. The good news is they're all sold at the same dealership, so it never mattered to anybody and nobody took the time to learn it. But, um, Maserati. What would you make? Like the MC20 has not had the response. Offroad SUV. Absolutely. For their luxury performance brand? Yes.

• 39:47Speaker 01

  I think.

• 39:47Doug DeMuro?

  G-Wagon. You ever heard of the G-Wagon? Do you know about the G? It's square and boxy and they're sold out for 77 years. The Cayenne?

• 39:54Speaker 01

  I think that, I, no, there's something to that. I think, I, in my opinion, I think that Maserati should kind of do, this is a watch analogy that you might not get.

• 40:03Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, boy.

• 40:04Speaker 01

  It's, they should do, they should be like the Tudor to Rolex. Rolex has a subsidiary brand that was called Tudor. And they, for a long time, were, they were referred to as the poor man's Rolex. Everybody wanted Rolex. But Tudor now has, they started making more truly watches that enthusiasts like myself actually want to own. And they have been tremendously successful and you can't get a Rolex. In the same way that you can't, it's not easy to get a Ferrari, even if you have the money. You have to be on a list and you have to do all this stuff. I think they should build stuff that like people would actually want to buy and that Ferrari refuses to build. So in my opinion, like if they want to do a, they, they want to stay sporty and build a sports car, fine. Give it a manual transmission, make it mid-engine, make it something real cool, interesting.

• 40:44Doug DeMuro?

  That the brand, the main brand equity is with non enthusiasts.

• 40:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:49Doug DeMuro?

  Like that's not untrue. Care about. I think. You go to a person in the street, they're like, oh, what a cool. Yeah. Luxury car, sports car. Rebuilding this brand with enthusiasts would take Herculean effort. Well, like we, they've lost.

• 41:01Speaker 01

  They're clearly trying. The MC20 was a clear try and it's a wonderful car.

• 41:04Doug DeMuro?

  It is.

• 41:05Speaker 01

  But they don't, they don't sell them when they do. It's for, you know, two thirds of MSRP with 10 miles on it.

• 41:11Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, resale's been tough. Um, but I think that enthusiasts are not the answer. I agree. The Maserati brand is flashy among regular people and enthusiasts have long ago kind of started to view it as a joke. Yep. And not kind of started, like when the G-Racalay came out and almost everyone I see is a rental car.

• 41:28Speaker 04

  That was

• 41:28Doug DeMuro?

  It was hard when you had it too, especially the like

• 41:30Speaker 04

  It was surprisingly good. It is too expensive.

• 41:33Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I, I agree with you Doug that it's not an enthusiast. I agree with you that it's not an enthusiast brand. They don't have no enthusiast cred. So they gotta just go for like luxury. But there's no brand that's doing that that successfully. Mercedes maybe, but they're struggling.

• 41:45Speaker 04

  No brand's doing luxury? You know about Lexus? You know about Akira? Akira is killing it right now.

• 41:50Doug DeMuro?

  Rolls Royce exists.

• 41:51Speaker 04

  Um, but different level, like Jaguar is not, not doing well.

• 41:56Doug DeMuro?

  Well, no, but Mercedes Benz is doing well.

• 41:59Speaker 04

  No, I'm not to call Maserati a startup brand, but like Jaguar is not doing well. Genesis is not doing well. Uh, who else has tried to go?

• 42:06Doug DeMuro?

  What about Mercedes Benz, BMW and Audi and Lexus?

• 42:10Speaker 04

  So is that where you would put this? Cause you kind of implied that Alfa Romeo would be in that category.

• 42:13Doug DeMuro?

  I know, but what can you do? You have to put it there. You can't actually make Maserati an expensive brand. The cars don't sell to people who have a lot of money. They sell to people who have some money.

• 42:22Speaker 04

  To be fair, Honda and Kia have existed by having very similar shared product lines.

• 42:26Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 42:27Speaker 04

  So you could have an Alfa Romeo and a Maserati brand that I've

• 42:30Doug DeMuro?

  I don't think there's, I don't think there's enough daylight there.

• 42:33Speaker 04

  The luxury.

• 42:34Doug DeMuro?

  I don't think there's enough daylight there. That they're Italian, they're both Italian. They, neither of them have great niches.

• 42:39Speaker 04

  Alfa Romeo could go enthusiast.

• 42:41Doug DeMuro?

  I don't, yeah, it could go enthusiast. Maybe that's the plan. Maybe you do, maybe you do an Alpha into the enthusiast brand. And maybe a luxury. Car like the MC20 and you send the Grecale and stuff to, to Maserati.

• 42:52Speaker 04

  The Grecale is too sporty. You think to go more comfortable.

• 42:55Doug DeMuro?

  That would, that would go to Alpha. And, and you, you do like a three row for Maserati and you do like luxury vehicles for Maserati. And maybe that's where you'd go with it.

• 43:05Speaker 04

  Can you throw that on this list of vehicles? What is at the bottom?

• 43:08Doug DeMuro?

  G22 Strada.

• 43:10Speaker 04

  Folgora?

• 43:10Doug DeMuro?

  That's the electric Gran Turismo.

• 43:12Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 43:13Doug DeMuro?

  So that's the thing. They claim to have 28 models, but they actually have three.

• 43:18Speaker 04

  They just lied.

• 43:18Doug DeMuro?

  The old trick.

• 43:19Speaker 04

  But that's it. That's interesting. Alpha would suit the enthusiast brand better.

• 43:23Doug DeMuro?

  I would argue though, that just having talked this through, you can't actually do this.

• 43:27Speaker 04

  Nine presumably the only Ghibli that they have.

• 43:29Speaker 01

  Hundred and nine you can buy it on our site for literally 10% of that.

• 43:33Doug DeMuro?

  The problem, the problem is now that we've talked this through, I, I really don't think there's room for Alpha and Maserati. I think you make Maserati sort of an enthusiast luxury brand like a BMW and go that direction and keep Chrysler as the everyman brand or Dodge. And that's it. That's all you do. That's it. And gee.

• 43:48Speaker 04

  I think Alpha has more cred than Maserati.

• 43:50Doug DeMuro?

  That's wrong on levels that it's actually physically difficult for me to explain to you.

• 43:54Speaker 04

  I do see more Ghiblies than I do Julius.

• 43:56Doug DeMuro?

  To geeky car enthusiasts who like brown diesel station wagons. Yes, that's true. To regular people, you walk down the road and you're like Maserati, people like, damn, Maserati.

• 44:04Speaker 04

  I think you could keep all.

• 44:06Doug DeMuro?

  We should start. I do not.

• 44:07Speaker 04

  So the thing I heard about Genesis.

• 44:08Doug DeMuro?

  Fewer brands is better. Dude, look what Ford did. When I was a kid, Ford had Ford, Lincoln, Mercury, Jaguar, Land Rover, Aston Martin, Volvo.

• 44:16Speaker 04

  Yep. You're missing a few.

• 44:18Doug DeMuro?

  I probably am, right? And you know what they turned it down to? Ford and Lincoln. That's it.

• 44:22Speaker 04

  And they really should have trimmed it further.

• 44:24Doug DeMuro?

  Oh, he doesn't like Lincoln.

• 44:26Speaker 04

  I love Lincoln. I, I'm legitimately saddened when I think about how poorly Lincoln sell.

• 44:31Doug DeMuro?

  I do.

• 44:31Speaker 04

  Cause I think that their SUV lineup is fantastic.

• 44:34Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. I wish they had put more investment into the Lincoln brand. They could legitimately compete if they tried. Like GM has been trying with Cadillac for a long time. Lincoln tries.

• 44:41Speaker 04

  The Lincoln products are good.

• 44:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, they are.

• 44:43Doug DeMuro?

  Maybe the Coach store?

• 44:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:45Doug DeMuro?

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• 45:24Doug DeMuro?

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• 46:07Doug DeMuro?

  That's 20% off plus free shipping with the code cars at manscaped.com. Okay, we got to talk market report. There's a lot of market report, market report items to discuss. By the way, the market report is brought to you by the Cars and Bids app. The Cars and Bids app, like Cars and Bids, but an app.

• 46:24Speaker 04

  You can download it on the iOS App Store right now on your iPhone.

• 46:27Doug DeMuro?

  You can download it on the iOS App Store right now on your iPhone or your iPad.

• 46:30Speaker 04

  You don't even need an iPad.

• 46:31Doug DeMuro?

  You have an iPad, if you have an iPod Touch. Yeah, if you even have one of these, you could do it, although we call that, just use your browser. Can you do it on a computer?

• 46:41Speaker 04

  You cannot download the app on the computer now.

• 46:43Doug DeMuro?

  It's a missed opportunity for Cars and Bids.

• 46:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, okay, can I start this?

• 46:46Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 46:47Speaker 04

  Can we talk about the Sapphire?

• 46:48Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, what's the deal? We got a Sapphire on the site. This is a Lucid Air Sapphire.

• 46:53Speaker 04

  Which there's not been any public auction results that I've seen for Lucid Air Sapphire.

• 46:56Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 46:58Speaker 04

  I have been defending this car to no end internally among coworkers.

• 47:02Doug DeMuro?

  It's cool.

• 47:03Speaker 04

  And people don't get just how cool it is, and I find that frustrating.

• 47:06Doug DeMuro?

  You know what though, Farah made a point, I was on his pod yesterday.

• 47:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, when did that come out?

• 47:09Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I don't know. He made a good point though, about this and all the other ones. The super fast one and the non-super fast one, when you're driving them.

• 47:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, they're the same. But you would know that you have 1,234 horsepower.

• 47:21Doug DeMuro?

  You would know, but like, okay, oh, you don't, so you drive the 850 horsepower one and you're like way behind?

• 47:29Speaker 04

  I know, but it's just, it's cool.

• 47:31Doug DeMuro?

  Like, like his point was like.

• 47:32Speaker 04

  It's rare that I think power is cool, but it's cool.

• 47:35Doug DeMuro?

  His point was like a V6 Charger versus a Hellcat. Like you drive those around, it's different at all, like everywhere. You can feel it, you can hear it. That's not

• 47:44Speaker 04

  Isn't the Sapphire kind of different? Isn't there, do you drive it? Like the suspension setup is

• 47:47Doug DeMuro?

  It is. The Sapphire is a tremendously exceptional car, but I thought that about the, the Dream Edition that I drove also.

• 47:54Speaker 04

  Well, the, sorry, did you Dream Edition or Dream Performance Edition? Cause we discovered last week that there's about a hundred fifty horsepower difference.

• 48:00Doug DeMuro?

  I had a gold one. I had a gold one. I went up to their, to their facility in the bay. I drove a gold one around. That's what I remember.

• 48:09Speaker 04

  Performance? No. Was it a thousand one horsepower or was it nine hundred seven?

• 48:13Doug DeMuro?

  It was gold. Does that help?

• 48:15Speaker 01

  You're proving his point. It doesn't make a difference.

• 48:18Doug DeMuro?

  But I think that's

• 48:18Speaker 01

  Truly though, it is proving my point. Like they're all, these are all amazing cars. And yes, the Sapphire is the coolest of

• 48:23Speaker 04

  And it has better suspension and like

• 48:25Doug DeMuro?

  It does. It drives better. It's better.

• 48:27Speaker 04

  It's just cool though. I want people to recognize and know that it's cool. Now unfortunately, everybody walking by in the street would think that you have a seven hundred dollar a month lease special, but you will know that you have a thousand thirty, thirty four horsepower.

• 48:39Doug DeMuro?

  I agree that it's totally cool. It is an amazing car. It was awesome to drive. I think that about basically all Lucids. I think they are bargains. I'm not sure what happens to the company long-term.

• 48:46Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 48:46Doug DeMuro?

  But they are incredibly good, nice.

• 48:48Speaker 04

  The luxury.

• 48:49Doug DeMuro?

  Gravity is not the best looking SUV in the world.

• 48:51Speaker 04

  Oh, wow.

• 48:52Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 48:52Speaker 04

  Anti-gravity over here. Nice. Ken, think about it. Your M5 has, you think it's powerful.

• 49:00Speaker 04

  Multiply that horsepower by three.

• 49:02Doug DeMuro?

  Bring that, elongate your M5 hood.

• 49:05Speaker 04

  And then add fifty two more.

• 49:07Speaker 01

  Right. The difference is when I drive my car, I know it's special. That's the difference. I don't need to.

• 49:13Doug DeMuro?

  That's an interesting point. This car has the same level of visual distinction from a regular's Lucid.

• 49:18Speaker 04

  As your M5.

• 49:19Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. Like wheels and

• 49:20Speaker 04

  And probably more suspension upgrades.

• 49:22Speaker 01

  This is the M5. When you see the M5 and a five forty driving on the road, for instance, like you can tell like the whole stance is different.

• 49:28Doug DeMuro?

  You can sort of tell this. I will say in terms of car, in electric cars that like an enthusiast would look at and say, wow, this is one.

• 49:36Speaker 01

  That's the thing. Like the M, like the M5, it was louder than the five forty. It had, you know, exhausts.

• 49:42Speaker 04

  Sure. Sure.

• 49:43Speaker 01

  It was And ITBs. Yeah. The throttle response. Let's not even get into that. It was a different experience to driving though, and it also had a hot, it wasn't just the power. It was the handling was better.

• 49:54Doug DeMuro?

  Well, yeah, that's true on this too.

• 49:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:55Doug DeMuro?

  And you have.

• 49:56Speaker 01

  But the difference is this is electric and it's just like, it's already fast as hell as it is. And so like it really, power performance is not.

• 50:03Doug DeMuro?

  Well, it is cool. It is interesting and it will be interesting to see what it brings.

• 50:07Speaker 04

  We've noted.

• 50:08Doug DeMuro?

  FSR P two fifty. Okay, pull up C eight Corvettes because this is, I've started noticing this too. I want to talk about some cheapies, cars that have gotten cheap. There, there was a long time where cars weren't cheap. They're back, go down. We've been selling C eight Corvettes, not the Z O six, but regular C eight Corvettes in the low fifties.

• 50:23Speaker 04

  I mean, we had one that are in the high forties.

• 50:25Doug DeMuro?

  These cars are getting affordable and you know, it's interesting. They make a ton of them. You see them everywhere. They're not as special as they were when they came out. But for like two solid years, these red sticker or above.

• 50:35Speaker 04

  They're eighty.

• 50:35Doug DeMuro?

  The performance level that this car offers at this number is.

• 50:39Speaker 04

  If you're a cheaper, modern mid engine car, like this is not just a Corvette.

• 50:44Doug DeMuro?

  Like, yeah. Alfa Romeo four C.

• 50:47Speaker 04

  Barely cheaper.

• 50:48Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I know.

• 50:49Speaker 04

  Like this is an insane amount of performance.

• 50:52Doug DeMuro?

  BMW I three.

• 50:53Speaker 04

  Oh, interesting.

• 50:56Doug DeMuro?

  I would call that rear engine.

• 50:58Speaker 04

  Calm down.

• 50:59Doug DeMuro?

  BMW I eight.

• 51:00Speaker 04

  Is this ending in the rear?

• 51:01Doug DeMuro?

  I don't know. Who, no one knows.

• 51:02Speaker 04

  It's rear engine on it.

• 51:03Speaker 01

  Man, that's impressive. This person put on sixty thousand miles on in four years.

• 51:07Speaker 04

  The reality is that prices are going down because people have driven them a lot in the last.

• 51:10Doug DeMuro?

  And they're getting older. I mean, this is a four, this is now a four, five year old car. C eight honestly is due for a refresh, which is hard to believe. Like it's getting.

• 51:16Speaker 04

  That's a good point.

• 51:16Doug DeMuro?

  It's already getting there. When we still think of it as the new Corvette, that's how I always tell people.

• 51:20Speaker 01

  Still looks great.

• 51:21Doug DeMuro?

  But damn, it is a total bargain when you think about the performance level. Five hundred horse with dual clutch. It is fast. It looks, some people love how it looks. Some people don't. It's certainly striking. It looks modern.

• 51:33Speaker 04

  Looks like a exotic sports car.

• 51:36Doug DeMuro?

  It looks like an exotic sports car in a way that Corvette didn't sense the C two, right? I mean, it's cool and it's, these things get in the fifties, sixty, the forties, these are going to follow Corvette. They're, they're appreciating less than regular Corvettes, but they're going to get there.

• 51:48Speaker 04

  Are they?

• 51:49Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, they are.

• 51:49Speaker 04

  Something.

• 51:50Doug DeMuro?

  You'll be able to pick one up at for twenty six.

• 51:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, he won't, but yeah.

• 51:53Doug DeMuro?

  No, he'll be like, you know, in three years he'd be twenty two.

• 51:55Speaker 01

  Right, exactly.

• 51:56Doug DeMuro?

  I'll wait.

• 51:57Speaker 01

  What do you expect?

• 51:58Doug DeMuro?

  On the subject of cheap cars, because that's a great one. Look up Focus RS, please. You know about this?

• 52:03Speaker 04

  I've been watching it.

• 52:03Doug DeMuro?

  Why are you, why are you buying?

• 52:04Speaker 04

  I've thought about it.

• 52:06Doug DeMuro?

  You've, you see this, Ken?

• 52:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, I have.

• 52:08Doug DeMuro?

  We, we sold one for 20 grand.

• 52:10Speaker 04

  That is so cool for 20 Gs. For a nice blue one especially.

• 52:13Doug DeMuro?

  To me, a 20 grand Focus, Performance Focus is an ST, which is probably now a $9,000 car. Like, this is, this was like the king car. When I, when this came out, it was like, they're bringing the RS to America. This is so cool.

• 52:24Speaker 04

  I know.

• 52:24Doug DeMuro?

  It's so amazing. It was so fast. It looks so cool.

• 52:27Speaker 01

  It looks so good.

• 52:27Doug DeMuro?

  And by the way, this isn't even some crappy, horribly modded, off-color, stupid one. This is the one.

• 52:33Speaker 04

  That is the one.

• 52:33Doug DeMuro?

  This is it. If I wanted one, and I do, I would get this.

• 52:37Speaker 01

  Almost 100,000 miles.

• 52:38Doug DeMuro?

  They're getting driven, for sure. But go back, it wasn't an outlier sale.

• 52:42Speaker 04

  No, no, they're all around this.

• 52:43Doug DeMuro?

  They're all.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  That means the head gasket's been replaced.

• 52:45Doug DeMuro?

  20,000, 22,000, these are both 100 cars.

• 52:47Speaker 04

  The nicest ones are the 30s.

• 52:49Doug DeMuro?

  The nicest ones are in the low 30s, but you can get for low 20s, they'll buy you a Focus RS. It's a fast, fun, like, exciting.

• 52:56Speaker 04

  Cool.

• 52:56Doug DeMuro?

  Do we even need the STI anymore? We got this.

• 52:59Speaker 01

  I've always thought these were so cool.

• 53:01Doug DeMuro?

  They're so cool. Why'd you get one of these? Drive around for 20 Gs in that?

• 53:03Speaker 01

  Nah, I, I can't.

• 53:04Doug DeMuro?

  People would think you're so cool. I would think you're cool.

• 53:06Speaker 04

  He would hate it just like he hated the W.

• 53:07Speaker 01

  You'd like me in an S-Class too, so, and a Cayenne Turbo ski. Both also very cool. But no, I have always thought the, and they're incredible to drive. Even the ST also is so much fun to drive. I cannot believe that they're finally, finally getting like.

• 53:22Doug DeMuro?

  Those are 20, C8 Corvettes are 50, and new body S-Class is almost, are 16.5.

• 53:29Speaker 04

  For, for 40 grand, you could buy a Focus RS and a new body S-Class.

• 53:31Doug DeMuro?

  A new body S-Class. 40 Gs will put you in a, that's a two-car solution for 40,000 US.

• 53:37Speaker 04

  I can't believe anything about it.

• 53:38Speaker 01

  That's a good one.

• 53:40Speaker 01

  I, I really do want, like, you know, when they killed this car off, I was so sad because, like you said, finally, we got an RS, and they were selling. They sold well, people loved them, and enthusiasts, beloved by journalists and enthusiasts alike, and they sold them, and then Ford was like, nah.

• 53:56Speaker 04

  Well, they started not to bring the Focus at all, or the Fiesta at all to the US, which is why they killed it.

• 54:00Speaker 01

  Yep. But it's, it's just such a shame. I wish that had kept going, because we finally, they can't, like, we had.

• 54:05Speaker 04

  The next one was even better.

• 54:06Speaker 01

  I know.

• 54:07Doug DeMuro?

  I love the

• 54:08Speaker 01

  I wish they hadn't, but nonetheless.

• 54:10Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 54:10Speaker 01

  Also, but it's okay because you can still get one of them. They're really enjoyable cars.

• 54:15Doug DeMuro?

  This one, this one down here, 30,000 mile, one owner car sold for 25.

• 54:20Speaker 04

  Three years ago, I sold a base Ford Focus hatchback with a stick with 110,000 miles for six grand. How, how, how long till we get to these?

• 54:31Doug DeMuro?

  Those won't go down to that level. But these, but WRX STIs do indicate where these will go, which means they'll go into the mid teens to low, low like 12, 12 grand.

• 54:40Speaker 04

  And you're right, STs are 10.

• 54:42Doug DeMuro?

  STs are 10. That's the bargainous car. If you're watching this right now and you don't already have a Focus ST, go.

• 54:47Speaker 04

  Honestly, I agree with that.

• 54:48Doug DeMuro?

  Everybody's like, what should I get for 10 grand? It's fun. And my answer is often like, honestly, 10 grand, if that's all your budget is, you should really be focused on just trying to find a normal, rational, reliable car. Disagree. Go back. I want an ST. I want a.

• 54:59Speaker 04

  Five to 10.

• 55:00Doug DeMuro?

  Oh my God. Well, that's not the real.

• 55:02Speaker 04

  No.

• 55:03Doug DeMuro?

  No, there you go. CX4.

• 55:05Speaker 04

  Believe that.

• 55:05Doug DeMuro?

  95, $100 car. This is, this is an amazing car.

• 55:09Speaker 04

  Also, that's post-FS. I would have spent background.

• 55:12Speaker 01

  No accidents, also 103,000 miles.

• 55:14Doug DeMuro?

  I love driving Focus STs. The steering is so quick.

• 55:17Speaker 04

  You either have a Mark 7 GTI or a Focus ST, they're the same price.

• 55:20Doug DeMuro?

  Focus unquestionable. They were stick only. They had the cool wheels.

• 55:23Speaker 04

  They did.

• 55:23Doug DeMuro?

  And it just felt like some European thing we weren't supposed to get, proven by the fact that they gave it to us for a few years, then they pulled it right back.

• 55:29Speaker 01

  Exactly. My friend Steven had one and it was so much fun to drive.

• 55:32Doug DeMuro?

  They were also a lot more powerful than Mark 7 GTI. Didn't these have 252?

• 55:36Speaker 01

  Of course, right. I think that's right.

• 55:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 55:37Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah. That's a big number. Yeah. Yeah. The GTI had 200.

• 55:42Speaker 04

  Or 220. Who knows? Who knows?

• 55:44Doug DeMuro?

  Not 250.

• 55:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, agreed, agreed. And I've referred, I loved my base sportback.

• 55:50Doug DeMuro?

  You floored it in this thing and it went straight, even though I'm telling you, this was fast. That train, that engine was so potent. It was like, it felt like a V6.

• 55:58Speaker 04

  The RSL or the ST?

• 55:59Doug DeMuro?

  The ST.

• 56:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 56:00Doug DeMuro?

  I can't, oh.

• 56:01Speaker 01

  What if Fiesta STs?

• 56:03Speaker 04

  Uh, the same price.

• 56:04Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 56:04Speaker 04

  Very annoying.

• 56:05Doug DeMuro?

  I would actually make the argument though, that the Fiesta is just as fun. Get one of these instead of the Focus.

• 56:08Speaker 04

  Fessers are more.

• 56:10Doug DeMuro?

  I just told you to buy the Focus.

• 56:11Speaker 04

  No, no, okay. There's a lot of it. The Fiesta ST is known to be a better driver's car.

• 56:16Doug DeMuro?

  It's more fun.

• 56:16Speaker 04

  But the Focus ST, you can actually drive places.

• 56:18Doug DeMuro?

  And it's much faster.

• 56:19Speaker 04

  And it's legitimately much more practical. I literally drove 50,000 miles in a regular Focus. And it was comfortable. It was great on the highway.

• 56:27Doug DeMuro?

  It's interesting to see it's at the same price level. I don't know which one I would pick.

• 56:30Speaker 04

  Incredibly, Fessers are cheaper.

• 56:31Doug DeMuro?

  But I would more expensive. And from now on, anyone who comes to me saying they got 10 grand to buy a car, what should I get? The answer, well, 100% of the time be Focus ST. You know how Miata is always the answer?

• 56:40Speaker 04

  No.

• 56:41Doug DeMuro?

  No, I'm Focus ST.

• 56:42Speaker 04

  I'm keeping with my answer, which is if you got 20.

• 56:44Doug DeMuro?

  Volvo V60.

• 56:46Speaker 04

  And if you got 20, you're in.

• 56:47Doug DeMuro?

  Volvo V60.

• 56:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, they're like 8 to 12.

• 56:49Doug DeMuro?

  Why does he do this to us?

• 56:50Speaker 04

  Because he's just, and it's, but if you have 20, 25 and Ford Focus RS.

• 56:56Doug DeMuro?

  Did not, this is a manual hot hatch. Volvo V60 is like a car you drive to your Scandinavian Christmas.

• 57:01Speaker 04

  I want more space. For those who can't see, Felipe's wearing a Scandinavian Christmas party sweater.

• 57:05Doug DeMuro?

  I'm wearing a sweater. We gotta get on to the questions. We gotta get on to the questions. He's wearing a sweater. It's 84 degrees today. This week is very warm here. It just feels Christmasy and so he's got to.

• 57:15Speaker 04

  It's time.

• 57:16Doug DeMuro?

  We gotta get on the questions. The questions are brought to you by Kennet. Kennet, he does things.

• 57:21Speaker 04

  I do.

• 57:23Doug DeMuro?

  If you want to ask a question, go to carsandbids.com, click on the community tab. And then there's a post there that says, ask questions. And then you ask your question and we'll answer the question, no matter how brilliant the question is.

• 57:34Speaker 04

  Ooh.

• 57:34Doug DeMuro?

  Thank you.

• 57:35Speaker 04

  Nice.

• 57:35Doug DeMuro?

  First question from Sam Panamera. If Kim Jong Un made you his successor, which single car model would you force every North Korean citizen to drive? This was the highest upvoted question. I haven't often thought about what I would force my impoverished population to drive. Obviously, a Kira.

• 57:53Speaker 04

  But which?

• 57:53Doug DeMuro?

  So I think that the question, how many, like what, what car can you import many, many, many of? Well, that's the thing. So here's what you gotta think to yourself. For cheap. What deal could you strike? You know what? Like if I went to a cure and was like, hey, look. No, that that makes the answer clear. Nissan Sentra.

• 58:07Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's gonna be Nissan.

• 58:08Doug DeMuro?

  All Nissan Sentras. Why? Because they, no, I'm not, I'm not. They're desperate for sales. I'm talking about, how could they, they scratched my back, guys. Like if I went to a cure and said, hey, I'll give you some, uh. You get NSX for yourself. Maybe you give me a 10, 12 NSXs. Or if I went to Stellantis and said, hey, look, I'll buy Dodge Hornets. I'll do it. No one else will, but I will. I'll buy a hundred thousand of them for my impoverished people. But you gotta make me a night vision four, five, six estate. You go, you go, go to, you obviously go to Alpha, you get the Tonale, which is the same car. And then you say that all your physicians drive Alphas. And then you get an 8C for yourself. Yeah, 8C, if I was, if I was a desperate, an 8C is not a hard buy. It's like, they're like 200 and they're pretty available.

• 58:49Doug DeMuro?

  I want a night vision four, five, six.

• 58:53Doug DeMuro?

  Venice. Yeah, Venice. Let's be clear. I want plebeian crap. Or, or sedan, a four door. Which, by the way, was also called the Venice. Did you know that? So there was, it was the four, five, six Venice. They come out with this one off car and they just, the four, five, six Venice and the four, five, six Venice estate. Creative. It's an interesting question because you'd want something that people could work on and be as reliable. You don't actually want to give them a Tonale because they'll break down and then what's the point? Oh, you want to seem like a benevolent. Well, no, just you don't want to deal with it, you know? I don't want anything that I couldn't get something from the automaker. So you're saying you want Toyotas. I don't want, what can Toyota give me? Well, if you get a link. GT1, that's not enough.

• 59:31Speaker 04

  Some people would say the LFA, but you're not into that.

• 59:33Doug DeMuro?

  I don't want no LFA. Maybe they put a manual transmission in it and make it attractive. I would take an LFA. Not possible. Of course, a hundred thousand cars would they sell in a week? Yeah, but I'm doing a one off order here. I'll keep the factories running for a week. I, I think I buy up every Focus ST around. For your populace? Yeah, why not? Okay, that's insane. Remember that guy who was buying all the Broncos on the site and stuff? Yeah. We thought shipping them maybe? Yeah.

• 59:57Speaker 04

  We didn't, we didn't look.

• 59:58Doug DeMuro?

  Into it though. But okay. Next question from Verity. What happened to Alanis? We had Alanis King. She, she worked with us. She made videos with us. We did a complete rehash of our content. And we don't do the same videos we used to, and we kind of brought it all in physically in studio. Alanis lives out of the state. And she worked with us for a couple of months and we liked her and it was, it was a reasonably good situation. But we changed what we do and that, that changed. And so Alanis went, I mean, in a world of content creators, there's kind of always a going and coming. We had Zach Clapton do some content for us too. I don't know if that's going to continue. There were other people, weren't there?

• 1:00:35Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:00:36Doug DeMuro?

  And now it's gone. Uh, but we love Alanis. I still love Alanis. I follow her on everything and I think she does great content. I seriously, truly mean that. But instead we have Filippo now. Uh, next question. What is the worst car that currently costs over a hundred thousand dollars from B W Smith? We just looked on the Maserati website.

• 1:00:53Speaker 04

  Maserati.

• 1:00:55Doug DeMuro?

  I'd already answered. So is it more or less overpriced than SL 55 AMG?

• 1:00:59Speaker 04

  No, dude.

• 1:01:00Doug DeMuro?

  That Ghibli was a hundred nine baht. That Ghibli was a hundred nine baht. What could they put in a Ghibli to make it worth a hundred nine?

• 1:01:06Speaker 04

  Good point.

• 1:01:06Doug DeMuro?

  What could they put? A hundred nine thousand dollars check in the car?

• 1:01:10Speaker 04

  I have no disagreement.

• 1:01:12Doug DeMuro?

  I mean, that's the, uh, yeah.

• 1:01:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:01:16Doug DeMuro?

  That's the answer. Next question from JDM fan three, four, five. If you were all given the money to equivalent to your car collection, would you buy back all of your cars today or buy different cars? I would buy the exact same cars except for a white Ford GT.

• 1:01:29Speaker 04

  Yep. Well, my, my car collection is worth conservatively.

• 1:01:33Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but you're the only one of us who answers that you would buy different cars. If, if both of your cars were gone today, you'd buy completely different cars.

• 1:01:39Speaker 04

  I sometimes daydream about a tree falling on the car.

• 1:01:43Doug DeMuro?

  Cause then it would force him to make a decision.

• 1:01:44Speaker 04

  I specifically avoid parking your trees. It would allow me to make a decision.

• 1:01:48Doug DeMuro?

  It would force him for once in his life to make a decision.

• 1:01:51Speaker 04

  Constantly, but I, I can't justify the transaction costs and changing a car.

• 1:01:56Doug DeMuro?

  Went up to Rancho Santa Fe. That was eye opening for me. We had an hour to pick cars and at minute 56, me and you had three of the four picked and we were upset that we had made, made so many choices. And he's sitting there like. I see by my choices, by the way, I had a great X5 50E. I had a 997.2 and I had some other car. But it was great.

• 1:02:16Speaker 01

  We both had a GT3s. He had a Bentley. I, yeah.

• 1:02:19Doug DeMuro?

  I know. I had a 997 GT3. I had a Bentley and he's over here like, oh. So anyway, the point is Filippo doesn't know how to make choices, but he would buy different cars. I would, it's more that I don't want, I can't justify changing cars, but I would choose different cars if given the opportunity.

• 1:02:35Doug DeMuro?

  Sorry, if given the requirement.

• 1:02:36Speaker 01

  You know, you can sell it and another individual will give you money.

• 1:02:40Doug DeMuro?

  And therefore. You have to deal with a bunch of, there's a bunch of, of work.

• 1:02:44Speaker 01

  No, no.

• 1:02:45Doug DeMuro?

  I like, I like all of my cars.

• 1:02:48Speaker 01

  You guys will run an auction website.

• 1:02:49Doug DeMuro?

  I would just want a different experience if I were buying something again.

• 1:02:53Speaker 01

  Yeah. So get a different experience. You get a different experience and then you say, nah, because you just.

• 1:02:58Doug DeMuro?

  I like my experience. No, no, I like my experience. I just don't want to deal with the changing, but if something else happens and I have no choice. If I have to go out and buy a car anyways, I may as well buy something new.

• 1:03:09Speaker 01

  This is the problem with Filippo. You have learned it and heard it right here.

• 1:03:12Doug DeMuro?

  I said by this.

• 1:03:13Speaker 01

  Problem with Filippo. And by the way, Kenan and I both answered yes unequivocally. I wouldn't even consider it. If, if all them burnt tomorrow, I would start the search for a new Countach, Cura GT and Ford. I would have three days of mourning first, but then I would.

• 1:03:24Doug DeMuro?

  Of course, there'd be days of mourning. A year, there'd be a, there'd be a mourning period that ends on the car's birthday.

• 1:03:30Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a long time for me because it just happened.

• 1:03:32Doug DeMuro?

  Now it is, but if it happened in the spring, it'd only be a six month mourning period where you took the bus.

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  Oh, that would be awful.

• 1:03:38Doug DeMuro?

  Okay.

• 1:03:38Speaker 01

  Wait, so can I ask a question? Okay. We were talking about your sports cars. You have a couple of daily drivers.

• 1:03:42Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, I would still get an Alltrane.

• 1:03:43Speaker 01

  But would you, when you were waiting for your Defender, you bought a car for a year?

• 1:03:47Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:48Speaker 01

  Would you, would you do the same thing of like, I, I want to find the right Sequoia. I want to find the right Alltrane.

• 1:03:53Doug DeMuro?

  No, the right Sequoia, I, we already know what it is. It's pretty easy to find. You could negotiate me a deal by getting zero off.

• 1:03:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:59Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:01Speaker 01

  And you wouldn't be on a lookout for specific spec. You would just buy the suit.

• 1:04:05Doug DeMuro?

  No, I'd get this another white one.

• 1:04:06Speaker 01

  And then what if there's one for sale?

• 1:04:08Doug DeMuro?

  There is. They're more common now because there's a couple more model years that have happened. Uh, free 450 all trains, same deal. I might look for a new one, but probably not. I want to order, I want to order my new one through my buddy Amir at Mercedes Benz at Temecula. Shout out to Amir. Okay, but I'm not ready yet. Alec Metz 2011, given the opportunity to drive it, would you fly overseas to review the Gordon Murray T50? No. Uh, next question. It just doesn't.

• 1:04:31Speaker 01

  Doug hates that car.

• 1:04:32Doug DeMuro?

  Kenan is bad at me, but all right.

• 1:04:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it is.

• 1:04:35Doug DeMuro?

  Yell at me. I'll take it.

• 1:04:37Speaker 01

  Yumum, the, in the 1990s, McLaren introduced a car called the F1. And you probably looked at him and like, ooh, yawn. It doesn't say Ferrari on it. And you would have turned down that opportunity too, and you'd look like a complete numpty. And here we are. It's, it's the, the designer of the F1 has built another car with one of the most exciting naturally aspirated engine currently for sale. Nah. Now for him, admittedly Doug does not like to travel. He wouldn't go to Los Angeles to review this, I don't think.

• 1:05:07Doug DeMuro?

  No, you'd go to LA.

• 1:05:08Speaker 01

  You go to LA for a T50. You wouldn't go like.

• 1:05:12Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I'd go to Phoenix if Kenan came with me.

• 1:05:15Speaker 01

  Oh, please. I'll go.

• 1:05:16Doug DeMuro?

  But he's not allowed to come to the car review. He's only like keeping the company in the hotel room.

• 1:05:20Speaker 01

  Never mind.

• 1:05:22Doug DeMuro?

  God. Um, look, my thing about the T50 is I just, there's so many modern hypercars and it's.

• 1:05:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, but this one has a manual and it's an NAV12. It's what we want.

• 1:05:33Doug DeMuro?

  Valkyrie's got an NAV12.

• 1:05:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, and it's a tip. This is a six-speed manual.

• 1:05:38Doug DeMuro?

  I got this Countach is a manual, this one. Like, I don't, what's, what's new? What's different? It looked Gordon Murray made it.

• 1:05:43Speaker 01

  That's the point. It's, the point is that it takes that analogness to its final conclusion.

• 1:05:50Doug DeMuro?

  I just, they're touting it like it's the greatest thing in the world. It's a little weird looking, to be honest.

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  It is weird looking.

• 1:05:55Doug DeMuro?

  To be honest, it's also a little like McLaren F1 derivative. Like, oh, you like that one? Here's this one. Look, it looks the same as a family. Like, ooh, we're having a roll.

• 1:06:02Speaker 01

  There are concessions that had to be made at the time.

• 1:06:04Doug DeMuro?

  And we named it after Gordon Murray because you know who that is.

• 1:06:06Speaker 01

  It's like, what's his?

• 1:06:07Doug DeMuro?

  Company. Yeah, but.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  Are you saying Enzo Ferrari was driven because he named all his cars after?

• 1:06:12Doug DeMuro?

  Let me tell you something, there's nobody, there's nobody named Ram, alright? Sometimes you just name a company because, because that's what you're trying to, you know, accomplish. Not, you're not naming it after yourself. I mean, there was a guy named Dodge Chrysler, you know?

• 1:06:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:25Doug DeMuro?

  You're missing the point, okay? I don't know, I just haven't got, and then there's a dot in the name. I know that's silly, but like, it really is a car that it seems like they have come out with to try to appeal to these geeky car people.

• 1:06:38Speaker 01

  That's you, you are a geeky car person, but that's us, that's what we do. This is, you will drive it one day and then just like all these other cars you've been moaned driving, then you drive it, it's like, it's the greatest thing I've ever driven. The P1 Monzante, you thought, oh, it's so stupid, I have to get in a race a couple of, you came back, would not shut up about it. It will be the same thing with the T50, you'll mark my words, I'll put this day on my calendar too. Oh, you can't, but it's, it's, you couldn't get one if you wanted to, I think.

• 1:07:01Doug DeMuro?

  But what do they cost?

• 1:07:02Speaker 01

  I think they started at, I want to say it was like, I want to say it was like two and a half as well.

• 1:07:07Doug DeMuro?

  So this is another problem. Two point eight million dollars. Why would I spend two point eight on a car from an, from a new brand that's like?

• 1:07:13Speaker 01

  Because the car it's derivative of is 20.

• 1:07:16Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, but I could get an F50 for 2.8. I could, I could call up Assad, I could call up Assad today, he's in, he's in, he's in Moscow.

• 1:07:24Speaker 01

  That car has been melted to the ground, it doesn't exist. No, you cannot get an F50 for 2.8, that's outrageous and ridiculous.

• 1:07:31Doug DeMuro?

  They sell low threes.

• 1:07:32Speaker 01

  That, is that 2.8? I didn't think so. It's a couple hundred thousand dollars?

• 1:07:38Doug DeMuro?

  My point is. You said, that's probably, you gotta, and then, and then you gotta put on all these options that are.

• 1:07:43Speaker 01

  Well, it starts there.

• 1:07:44Doug DeMuro?

  Well, you have to get the medullate seats because the medullate seats are really cool, they look like, and then you gotta get the stitching on the steering wheel, and the stitching on the reggaeton wheels.

• 1:07:50Speaker 01

  No, so just get in the car.

• 1:07:53Doug DeMuro?

  Silver. That's not true.

• 1:07:54Speaker 01

  That's not true, as you know.

• 1:07:55Doug DeMuro?

  Four options, and most of them were silver.

• 1:07:57Speaker 01

  Get in that car and shift your own gears and listen to the V12 that sits behind you.

• 1:08:01Doug DeMuro?

  I just can't get into it, I just, I, I, this is gonna be a controversial opinion that people are gonna hate me for, but I just don't think it's cool. I just don't like, when I think about what a cool car is, it doesn't hit me that the GMA T dot 50, the Gordon Murray Academy T dot 50 is cool. It doesn't feel cool.

• 1:08:18Speaker 01

  It's so.

• 1:08:18Doug DeMuro?

  It feels like tri.

• 1:08:21Speaker 01

  Having heard it go around the racetrack? It's

• 1:08:24Doug DeMuro?

  Well, maybe I need to get in it. They keep telling me that I can't. They're like, we'll get you a T33. I guess they're trying to sell those. They're like, we can't get you a T50.

• 1:08:31Speaker 01

  T33 looks better.

• 1:08:32Doug DeMuro?

  I could, I could get a T50 to, to, to drive. There's a few people.

• 1:08:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think at some point you will. And I look forward to the day that that happens and you tell me that I was right and it was.

• 1:08:41Doug DeMuro?

  May, maybe you're right. I, I'll take it. I take it all back. I am into the T50 vaguely. I don't know. I just.

• 1:08:47Speaker 01

  No, be true to who yourself. You hate it and that's okay. You're wrong.

• 1:08:50Doug DeMuro?

  Disappointed so often by these modern cars.

• 1:08:52Speaker 01

  I understand, but this has a manual.

• 1:08:54Doug DeMuro?

  Is that the only thing we're looking for? Would I be into, would I be into the 765 LT if it had a manual transmission?

• 1:09:00Speaker 01

  Eighteen thousand, I think. It's an insane car.

• 1:09:03Doug DeMuro?

  You get my point though.

• 1:09:04Speaker 01

  You get my point. It's, it's, this is like, we talk, bemoan the analog driving experience in those cars.

• 1:09:09Doug DeMuro?

  Okay.

• 1:09:10Speaker 01

  That's it.

• 1:09:10Doug DeMuro?

  Question for you then. Mr. T dot five zero. Suddenly you got three mil. What are you buying?

• 1:09:18Speaker 01

  A 50.

• 1:09:20Doug DeMuro?

  Okay. What do you buy it after the F50?

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  Really nice 40.

• 1:09:24Doug DeMuro?

  Yup. What do you buy it after that?

• 1:09:26Speaker 01

  Uh, for three mil.

• 1:09:28Doug DeMuro?

  And GTP.

• 1:09:29Speaker 01

  You get Courage T, you get a V, you get a She.

• 1:09:32Doug DeMuro?

  GTV.

• 1:09:32Speaker 01

  GTV.

• 1:09:33Doug DeMuro?

  Two seventy five.

• 1:09:34Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:09:34Doug DeMuro?

  You get a Counta.

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  For a lot less than three.

• 1:09:36Doug DeMuro?

  Well, I'm not saying you have to spend every penny of it. What the hell?

• 1:09:39Speaker 01

  Oh, that's what I was doing. Thinking cars that are worth in around three.

• 1:09:43Doug DeMuro?

  Three cap.

• 1:09:44Speaker 01

  Oh, three cap. Well, it's free. The F50 would be all.

• 1:09:47Doug DeMuro?

  Yeah, okay, F50. But after that, you get on a 40, then after that.

• 1:09:50Speaker 01

  So three mil just keeps happening. It's really.

• 1:09:52Doug DeMuro?

  Keeps happening. It's an infinite month. We're on your list. That's what I'm saying. How, how far down is the T50?

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  It ain't.

• 1:09:57Doug DeMuro?

  It's a.

• 1:09:58Speaker 01

  Would you, for three, for cars that are worth around that, it's probably in the top 10. You're right that it's not like in the top three or five.

• 1:10:05Doug DeMuro?

  Interesting.

• 1:10:05Speaker 01

  But it's up there.

• 1:10:06Doug DeMuro?

  That, that's.

• 1:10:07Speaker 01

  What also is three mil? Like what?

• 1:10:09Doug DeMuro?

  No, no.

• 1:10:10Speaker 01

  I can't, I don't fit.

• 1:10:11Doug DeMuro?

  What, what like Pagani is three million dollars? So what, what?

• 1:10:15Doug DeMuro?

  Uh, I don't know anything about.

• 1:10:17Speaker 01

  I wouldn't even.

• 1:10:18Doug DeMuro?

  No, but.

• 1:10:19Speaker 04

  What are you competing against? The Utopia, which is also a stick.

• 1:10:24Doug DeMuro?

  That's true. Why aren't you talking about Utopia like you're talking about T dot 5.0? Gordon Murray Academy. Why are you talking about Utopia? Utopia is a stick. It's also 3 mil. Why are we talking about Utopia? You got some Pagani anti-bias here. You're just into Gordon Murray.

• 1:10:36Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:10:37Doug DeMuro?

  That's the problem. They're both sticks.

• 1:10:38Speaker 01

  Because Utopia looks exactly like the car that.

• 1:10:40Doug DeMuro?

  So what? They both look cool.

• 1:10:42Speaker 01

  It is.

• 1:10:45Doug DeMuro?

  Fan on the back.

• 1:10:46Speaker 01

  It's not a naturally aspirated V12.

• 1:10:48Doug DeMuro?

  For God's sake, where's those goalposts? So I can't see them. They've been moved so far.

• 1:10:52Speaker 01

  I don't like turbo lag. And you know what? The T50 doesn't have turbo lag.

• 1:10:55Doug DeMuro?

  Give me a break. It's 16,000. You think it doesn't have lag? If you're at the 2,000 mark, you think it's a 16? You think it just does that?

• 1:11:03Speaker 01

  It does. It revs incredibly fast. You know nothing. You haven't read any of the.

• 1:11:10Doug DeMuro?

  I drove a Valkyrie. It's fast, but 12,000 RPM takes some time to get to. And by the way, they figured out turbo lag. They solved that. They solved that in the XJ220.

• 1:11:19Speaker 01

  You think that Pagani has clocked those turbos? The problem is not the lag.

• 1:11:23Doug DeMuro?

  Why don't you think they have? Pagani makes great cars.

• 1:11:25Speaker 01

  I saw the fire extinguisher go off on the car on accident when it was sitting at Quail.

• 1:11:28Doug DeMuro?

  And it was the best car I've ever driven in my life. It was the best car in my life.

• 1:11:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, Zonda came out 25 years ago, 30 years ago.

• 1:11:35Doug DeMuro?

  Proves that Utopia should be better. This was not intended to be a 10 minute question.

• 1:11:38Speaker 01

  Yet here we are. Oh, you're infuriating. You know nothing.

• 1:11:41Doug DeMuro?

  All right, that's the end. We have to stop here because we've gone way, way over. There's probably ads all over this podcast, which I apologize for. And I apologize for Kenon too, or maybe for myself. I don't know.

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  Apologize for yourself. I think people agree.

• 1:11:52Doug DeMuro?

  Let's get the car. Let's get the car. Someone give us a T50, T dot 5.0 Gordon Murray Academy, and we'll see if I'm right or if you're right.

• 1:11:58Speaker 01

  Yes, please send us one.

• 1:12:00Doug DeMuro?

  All right, let's do that. Let's drive the car and then we'll report back.

• 1:12:02Speaker 01

  I'll ride around. We can all free going in.

• 1:12:04Doug DeMuro?

  That's true.

• 1:12:05Speaker 01

  People can sit there and look bored on this.

• 1:12:06Doug DeMuro?

  It's one of them three seaters?

• 1:12:07Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, it is. Like the new Kia Tally Ride.

• 1:12:10Doug DeMuro?

  Would you be into the Speedtail if?

• 1:12:13Speaker 01

  You had a manual?

• 1:12:14Doug DeMuro?

  He's not wrong.

• 1:12:16Speaker 01

  Didn't look like a salamander.

• 1:12:17Doug DeMuro?

  The Tally Ride steering wheel's still on the left.

• 1:12:19Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:12:19Doug DeMuro?

  In the T dot 5.0 Gordon Murray Academy, it's on the middle.

• 1:12:22Speaker 01

  I know, but I'd appeal to the other category of our listeners.

• 1:12:25Doug DeMuro?

  Can I tell you something? The McLaren Speedtail, the McLaren Speedtail, you can charge on a charging pad.

• 1:12:30Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:12:32Doug DeMuro?

  Can you charge the Gordon Murray Academy?

• 1:12:34Speaker 01

  Need it because it's an N A V12.

• 1:12:40Speaker 04

  Well, fair point.

• 1:12:40Doug DeMuro?

  I would accept a plug-in hybrid if it meant that I could have a charging pad. Thank you all for watching. Sorry about that Volkswagen van situation.

• 1:12:49Speaker 04

  We'll talk about it next week.

• 1:12:50Doug DeMuro?

  Talk about it in a few months.

• 1:12:51Speaker 04

  Next week.

• 1:12:52Doug DeMuro?

  And absolute pleasure. Mercedes Pure Speed. Go pick one up.

• 1:12:56Speaker 04

  Our best podcast yet.

• 1:12:57Doug DeMuro?

  Our best podcast ever. Gordon Murray Academy.

• 1:13:00Speaker 04

  Goodbye.