Cosmic Queries – Our Galaxy and Beyond

Join Neil deGrasse Tyson and comic co-host Sarah Rose Siskind as they answer fan-submitted Cosmic Queries about our collision course with the Andromeda galaxy, how the Big Bang got its name, the Cosmic Microwave Background radiation, dark matter, and much more. NOTE: StarTalk All-Access subscribers can watch or listen to this entire episode commercial-free here: https://www.startalkradio.net/all-access/cosmic-queries-our-galaxy-and-beyond/ Photo Credit: NASA.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Welcome to StarTalk. Your place in the universe where science and pop culture collide. StarTalk begins right now.

• 0:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This is StarTalk and I'm your host Neil deGrasse Tyson, your personal astrophysicist. And today's edition of StarTalk is Cosmic Queries. Whatever the hell came off the internet, that's what we're doing today. And my co-host today, Sarah, hello.

• 0:39Speaker 01

  Hello Neil.

• 0:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's the first time we're doing this together.

• 0:41Speaker 01

  And I hope that I get initiated, I hope that there's some sort of weird induction process.

• 0:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you've got a whole comedy background, right?

• 0:48Speaker 01

  You have a whole comedy background.

• 0:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  With the Harvard Lampoon?

• 0:50Speaker 01

  I was at Harvard, I did not do the Lampoon.

• 0:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You didn't do the Lampoon?

• 0:54Speaker 01

  No, they were jerks when I was there, so they didn't take me.

• 0:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Is that how that works?

• 1:00Speaker 01

  That is how that works, actually the year that they don't take you, they become jerks. It's weird, like by law of the organization.

• 1:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So we're getting the Lampoon rejects.

• 1:09Speaker 01

  You've reached that low point.

• 1:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That low point.

• 1:11Speaker 01

  No, actually my dad was on the Lampoon and I didn't want to join for that.

• 1:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You have a comedic dad?

• 1:15Speaker 01

  I...

• 1:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So what is a dad joke of a comedic dad?

• 1:18Speaker 01

  Oh my god, they're worse.

• 1:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Are they better or are they worse?

• 1:20Speaker 01

  They're so much worse, they're so much worse.

• 1:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I get accused of dad joke, I just say something I think is kind of funny on Twitter. "Thanks dad." It's like, how did they know? How did they do this? I'm thinking I'm being clever, but I'm just being a dad.

• 1:37Speaker 01

  At least you have jokes, there's no mom joke territory.

• 1:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's true.

• 1:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's that about?

• 1:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't know.

• 1:44Speaker 01

  I'm just saying, standards here.

• 1:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because the weight of the world is on the shoulders of moms.

• 1:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, they don't have time to joke around, they ain't got time for that.

• 1:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's not a joking matter. So as usual, these questions are collected from our internet fanbase?

• 1:56Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  From Instagram, Twitter and Facebook. Very cool.

• 2:00Speaker 01

  Guy on the street.

• 2:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 2:02Speaker 01

  Totally legit.

• 2:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I don't know if you're better at pronouncing people's names than Chuck Nice. We'll decide that in this episode.

• 2:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, we'll see about that. I'm just gonna say it loudly and confidently, and I think it'll be convincing.

• 2:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And even if it's wrong, it's confident.

• 2:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. I mean, they don't know. They're not gonna bust in the door.

• 2:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No one else will know, you mean. They'll know. No one else will know.

• 2:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, they'll know.

• 2:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so what's the first question?

• 2:23Speaker 01

  All right, so the first one actually has a guide to pronouncing the name. It comes from Yaniv Koss, our Patreon, Patreon. And his name, he says-

• 2:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They'll get their questions answered first.

• 2:35Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. No, yeah.

• 2:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just buy this right.

• 2:37Speaker 01

  First-class citizen, absolutely, yeah. Blessed be his name. Yaniv is pronounced like Yaniv, and it rhymes with achieve. That's what it says on the question. Although, he addresses it to Chuck, which I'm gonna take as a personal. So, "My question to Dr. Tyson, are we near the center of the universe? And as a personal follow-up, is that center, as I've long suspected, me?"

• 3:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh.

• 3:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh, that's your follow-up.

• 3:05Speaker 01

  That's my follow-up, but this is just about the center.

• 3:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You are the center-

• 3:08Speaker 01

  I made it better.

• 3:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Sarah, you are the center of your own universe.

• 3:11Speaker 01

  Oh, thanks, Neil. All right, that's it. Interview's over.

• 3:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And, but you're not the center of anyone else's universe, nor the universe itself.

• 3:20Speaker 01

  All right, well-

• 3:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, the universe has no center. And just because you can put the noun and verbs together to make a sentence that sounds like it should have an answer, "Where is the center of the universe? Are we there?", does not require that it has an answer. For example, here's a question that you know not to ask. "Where is the center of Earth's surface?" Unless you're a flat-earther and think we have a disk, which would have a center.

• 3:45Speaker 01

  Which we all know you're a big fan of.

• 3:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Big fan, big fan. But this spherical Earth, you know to not even ask that.

• 3:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You know this. So, it turns out the universe has no center. Because everything in this universe was at the same place at the same time, and we call that the Big Bang. So, it kind of had a center, but it's not accessible today. You have to go backwards 13.8 billion years. And the whole universe was at its own center in that moment.

• 4:12Speaker 01

  It's interesting because a lot of the questions actually were kind of off this topic. And somebody even said explicitly, I can't imagine the universe as anything but a sphere. It seems almost innate that we think of it as like a physical space with a center.

• 4:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so, but that's, that's fine. I'm just saying, one way to visualize this is to take away one of the dimensions. Because our brains are too feeble to imagine four dimensions or five dimensions. Just take away a dimension and put the whole universe on the surface of a balloon. Draw little spiral galaxies. If you inflate the balloon, all the galaxies get farther away from all other galaxies. And if you were on a galaxy, you say, are we at the center? No, where is the center? Are you at the center? Nobody gets to say they're at the center. You know why? Because the center is not on that surface. The center is when the balloon was smaller, when the balloon was infinitesimal, 13.8 billion years ago. And when that happened, everybody was at the center.

• 5:10Speaker 01

  So I was at the center then? Okay, that's all I needed to know.

• 5:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  At that one moment.

• 5:14Speaker 01

  That's really all I needed to know. Thanks for.

• 5:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Allow me to remind you

• 5:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That the, the opening quote of my current book, Astrophysics for People in a Hurry, which is a really cheap plug for that book, but I had to say this.

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, I have to say, I grade that a C.

• 5:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A C, C minus, C plus? I opened it with just had to set you straight and say, the universe is under no obligation to make sense to you.

• 5:40Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, I remember that. I love that introduction.

• 5:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That, that's all it is. And that's, I put it in that book printed for the first time.

• 5:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, that was, that was a fantastic introduction because it was touching on a feeling you didn't realize you had.

• 5:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mmm, ooh, I like those.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, absolutely. It really tugged at that emotion. Okay, moving on to our next question. Uh, this one, it comes from user named Alimi AMCD98 on Instagram, who says, if all galaxies in the universe are expanding away from us, Then what is the cause for the Andromeda Galaxy being on a collision course with our own?

• 6:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Excellent question.

• 6:16Speaker 01

  I know.

• 6:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Beautiful. That's beautiful. So, let's go back to our rubber sheet analogy. And a moment ago, it was the surface of a balloon. Let's just put us all on a rubber sheet. And you have this rubber sheet that's expanding. So, you're my neighbor galaxy. And you're my closest galaxy. You, let's say you move away from me at one inch per second, let's say.

• 6:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You'll look to your neighbor galaxy, and you'll see it move away from you at one inch per second.

• 6:45Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It will see its neighbor galaxy move away from it at one inch per second.

• 6:50Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 6:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I will see your neighbor galaxy move away from me at two inches per second.

• 6:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I will see that galaxy's neighbor galaxy move away at three inches per second. So, the farther away you are from any point of observation, the faster is the measured expansion.

• 7:07Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because everything is expanding uniformly. And it just adds up.

• 7:12Speaker 01

  I thought everything was expand, was accelerated.

• 7:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's a whole, that's another level on top of this.

• 7:17Speaker 01

  That's over time.

• 7:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's on top of this that's happening.

• 7:20Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 7:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But that's, we, that will neither, we don't need to reference that now to get to answer his question.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  I see, okay.

• 7:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Basic, expanding universe. We are expanding.

• 7:30Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so, in other words, if you invoke that, then I would see, so as you go back in time,

• 7:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  the, you, you would see that the, the expansion was greater, okay? As the time had moved on. Because as you look out in the universe, you are looking back in time.

• 7:46Speaker 01

  Right.

• 7:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's right. So, you see things not as they are, but as they once were.

• 7:50Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 7:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Beautiful.

• 7:51Speaker 01

  That is gorgeous.

• 7:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Beautiful. In fact, there was an Italian movie called La Correspondenza.

• 7:57Speaker 01

  Uh, could you say that a couple more times, please?

• 8:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  La Correspondenza.

• 8:02Speaker 01

  Could you, uh, leave that as my voicemail message, please?

• 8:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it starred Jeremy Irons.

• 8:06Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 8:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it was a love story.

• 8:07Speaker 01

  Big fan already.

• 8:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Me too. He's a, I'm a big fan of his. It was a love story, and he played an astrophysicist. And he had a

• 8:15Speaker 01

  No wonder you liked that.

• 8:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He had a terminal disease. Had to go abroad. Uh, his love interest did not know he was ill.

• 8:23Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 8:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And he actually died. But he had preloaded letters to arrive to her long after he died. So that his spirit, his energy would still be alive in her heart. And this was analogized to starlight. A star may have died. But its light continuing to travel through space

• 8:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  reminds you of its continued existence long after it is gone. La correspondiente.

• 8:55Speaker 01

  Can I get that name again? That's absolutely gorgeous.

• 8:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah, it's beautiful.

• 8:59Speaker 01

  So the key to immortality is just send a bunch of mail that gets delayed. So the post office, when they're delayed in their mail, they're just like, we want to extend your legacy.

• 9:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, yes.

• 9:09Speaker 01

  That's because of the delay.

• 9:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They're doing it on purpose, yes.

• 9:11Speaker 01

  Exactly. You know, the question was asking about reference points of expansion, but I feel like I, since graduating from college, see my own reference point as expanding, like I am expanding away from myself.

• 9:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh.

• 9:25Speaker 01

  So fatso, everything is expanding.

• 9:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh. Well, so you expand from what you once were.

• 9:32Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 9:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Provided you view

• 9:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  college commencement as the beginning of learning rather than the end.

• 9:43Speaker 01

  That's true. I mean, isn't the, the last, the graduation speeches are called commencement, which means beginning, because you're supposed to.

• 9:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The whole celebration is a commencement.

• 9:51Speaker 01

  Right.

• 9:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then there's a commencement speech.

• 9:52Speaker 01

  Right.

• 9:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it's intended to mean beginning.

• 9:55Speaker 01

  Right.

• 9:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you would know there's a gate at Harvard uh, where if you enter Harvard Yard.

• 10:02Speaker 01

  Would I?

• 10:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Through that gate. Uh, as an undergraduate, you were there.

• 10:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  One of the gates says, enter to grow in wisdom.

• 10:10Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 10:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Have you read the other side of that gate?

• 10:12Speaker 01

  Leave to get dumber.

• 10:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it says, exit to serve better thy country and thy kind.

• 10:21Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 10:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, yeah, you exit and now you grow.

• 10:26Speaker 01

  I always found it ironic, though, that it is, there's a huge superstition about that gate, which is if you go through it before you graduate, that you won't ever get to graduate. Which, to me, feels like a very ignorant superstition to have about a gate.

• 10:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's a completely ignorant superstition for one of the highest institutions of the land to be holding forth.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, no, I was not into superstition.

• 10:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, but it still pervades Harvard.

• 10:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Stuporstition.

• 10:49Speaker 01

  Stuporst- I like that.

• 10:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Getting back to your fellow's question. So the nearby galaxy will be receding from you slower than all other galaxies that are farther away.

• 10:58Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 10:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay? Fact number one. Fact number two. All galaxies have movement relative to one another.

• 11:03Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 11:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay? And it turns out that the movement of Andromeda, at its distance from us, is greater than the expansion of the universe between us.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  Oh, so it's coming towards us?

• 11:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it can overcome the expansion of the universe, being so close to us. If the Andromeda Galaxy were at any farther distance, the expansion of the universe would override it.

• 11:27Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 11:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So generally, you have nearby galaxies colliding towards one another.

• 11:31Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because their gravity overcomes the expansion of the universe. This is how you have colliding galaxies at all.

• 11:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it's a great question.

• 11:39Speaker 01

  It is.

• 11:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's a matter of what is the distance to the object.

• 11:41Speaker 01

  It is interesting, because I was researching the collision course with the Andromeda Galaxy and our own, and it said the prediction was four billion years.

• 11:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I think it's a little longer than that, but...

• 11:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, because that's sooner than the sun is, like, set to collapse.

• 11:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so it's a technicality.

• 12:02Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 12:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The systems are huge.

• 12:03Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 12:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The Andromeda Galaxy and the Milky Way Galaxy, they're huge. So you have to ask, when are you going to say is the moment that they start colliding?

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 12:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What is that moment?

• 12:12Speaker 01

  Right.

• 12:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so is it when the outer reaches, the suburbs hit one another?

• 12:18Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 12:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  When their nuclei hit one another?

• 12:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Or when they settle down into one giant mass?

• 12:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Double the number of stars that the two separate systems had to begin with. And so if you add all that up, it's hundreds of millions of years for the system to settle into a new galaxy. So it's not accurate to think of it as a single moment.

• 12:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Time. So you could easily say it will begin as early as five billion years, but all the action.

• 12:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's gonna happen later.

• 12:48Speaker 01

  Okay, so you're more patient. Okay. All right. So moving on to our next question from Lucas Lantz on Instagram. Could it be possible?

• 12:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You're not Lantz, you're not Lance.

• 12:56Speaker 01

  Um, you know, I just did it confidently. I committed to Lantz.

• 12:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 13:00Speaker 01

  Uh, because it's fancy.

• 13:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 13:03Speaker 01

  Cause it says official.

• 13:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Lucas Lantz.

• 13:05Speaker 01

  It's Lucas Lantz and then official. So I pronounced it officially.

• 13:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, I mean, it's officially recognized.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  On Instagram, uh, says, could it be, yeah. Uh, could it be possible that a deja vu is a phenomenon where two different identical timelines in two different identical universes cross paths and create some sort of mental link between me in my timeline and me in the alternate timeline?

• 13:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes.

• 13:33Speaker 01

  Wow. Okay. And next question.

• 13:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I mean, I, I don't think we fully understand deja vu.

• 13:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Was it George Carlin who said, uh, sometimes I go into a place and I'm certain I've never been there before? That's a vuja de.

• 13:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I think it was George Carlin.

• 13:51Speaker 01

  I like that. Yeah.

• 13:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I actually, forgive me for not knowing what the literal translation of deja vu is.

• 13:58Speaker 01

  Yeah. It means already seen.

• 14:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Already seen. So the vu is the scene deja vu.

• 14:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, so, so I, I don't have a problem.

• 14:07Speaker 01

  With that theory?

• 14:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't, hypothesis.

• 14:10Speaker 01

  A hypothesis.

• 14:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 14:11Speaker 01

  Excuse me.

• 14:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There's the theory of gravity.

• 14:13Speaker 01

  Right, right, right.

• 14:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Relativity.

• 14:14Speaker 01

  Right.

• 14:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Quantum theory and Freddy's theory, right?

• 14:17Speaker 01

  I was about to say, yeah. Lucas Lantz.

• 14:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And Lucas.

• 14:21Speaker 01

  Lantz Tharid.

• 14:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Lantz Tharid. Uh, so I, I think there's more to learn from that.

• 14:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I think our brains are more complex.

• 14:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, we, we've come to recognize how complex they actually are, but just because something happens in your brain doesn't mean it is the measure of an objective reality. And most of human. Experiences. Um, do not, sorry, most of human curious brain phenomena

• 14:50Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 14:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  does not take root in objective reality.

• 14:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I have very low confidence that this idea will bear fruit.

• 14:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Déjà vu is intersecting parallel universes, simply because your brain.

• 15:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I could put you in a room, put, throw some simple drugs into you and you'll hallucinate. Look at what happens to your brain with the tiniest of chemical disruption.

• 15:14Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 15:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't have a more acute sense of reality, you have a lesser sense of reality.

• 15:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Reality is measured by recording devices in the room that you happen to be sitting. No, I saw a green clown and a bit.

• 15:27Speaker 01

  Right.

• 15:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yep.

• 15:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, sure you did.

• 15:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yep, yep, yep.

• 15:30Speaker 01

  Have you heard of A. E. Housman's poem about a penknife?

• 15:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No.

• 15:34Speaker 01

  He says, um, "I need but stick this in my heart and down will fall the sky and earth and heaven shall depart and all of you will die." And it's about how he thinks if he kills himself that the rest of the world will depart because that's what it feels like.

• 15:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I figured out that that's what the poem. Did you really think that poem needed explanation?

• 15:56Speaker 01

  You see, Neil, a poem is this phenomenon where.

• 15:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That was not one of the obscure poems.

• 16:03Speaker 01

  But no.

• 16:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The Midnight Ride of Paul Revere. This poem is about a man named Paul Revere.

• 16:09Speaker 01

  Right, right, right.

• 16:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Who rode a horse at midnight.

• 16:11Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 16:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, yeah, some poems thankfully don't need full.

• 16:15Speaker 01

  It was for the viewers at home, Neil. Um, no, but I, I like your, your response to his question about déjà vu and it being in your head. Um, it reminds me.

• 16:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What the, the, the point is.

• 16:27Speaker 01

  Yes, yeah.

• 16:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We read a lot of things, we see a lot of things and we don't retain active knowledge that they sit in our memories.

• 16:35Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 16:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We could have had things described to us and then we make a picture of what was described.

• 16:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You don't have déjà vu every place you go into.

• 16:43Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you don't even have it every day.

• 16:45Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 16:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Once a week, once a month.

• 16:47Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A couple of times a year. So of all the places you've been in, surely there's going to be one that matches up with some book you read, some movie you saw. I had déjà vu, uh, where was, I forgot where I was, in Louisiana, somewhere in the south. Uh, and.

• 17:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I was in some conference and we drove by a cemetery.

• 17:08Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Not a big one, kind of a church. You know the difference between a cemetery and a graveyard?

• 17:14Speaker 01

  Oh, they're spelled differently?

• 17:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes. A difference. You don't know the real difference?

• 17:18Speaker 01

  No, I really don't know the difference.

• 17:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm all proud of it because I only learned it like a week ago.

• 17:21Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 17:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so a graveyard is attached to a church.

• 17:25Speaker 01

  Oh, okay.

• 17:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Cemetery is wherever the hell it is.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 17:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hence, it's the yard. It's the yard of the church.

• 17:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah. So, I passed this cemetery. It might have been a graveyard. I didn't remember if there was a church near it. I said, and it was kind of at twilight.

• 17:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I was like, "I've seen this before, but I know I'd never been on that." So I had a déjà vu.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 17:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then the bus driver said, and we just passed the cemetery that was the backdrop in Michael Jackson's The Thriller.

• 17:54Speaker 01

  Oh!

• 17:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There you go. There you go.

• 17:57Speaker 01

  You know, and the weirdest thing is we've had this conversation before, Neil.

• 18:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We gotta take a quick break before we come back to Cosmic Queries, Popery Edition on StarTalk.

• 18:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We're back on StarTalk. Popery, Cosmic Queries, yes.

• 18:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Sarah, it's our first time together.

• 18:21Speaker 01

  Yes, it is. How am I doing so far? Am I okay?

• 18:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Twelve people observing, make sure that, because Chuck is normally like sitting right there.

• 18:29Speaker 01

  I know.

• 18:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And the Queries, people are phonetically spelling their name to help Chuck along.

• 18:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And you're up there reading the names for him.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  I'm doing my best. I'm doing my best impression of Chuck, actually. It's very subtle.

• 18:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There you go. So, collected from the internet, just a grab bag. Happy to feel, if I don't know the answer, I'll just tell you. Okay?

• 18:48Speaker 01

  Okay, just, yeah, loudly and confidently. All right, this one's actually my favorite question.

• 18:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Really?

• 18:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm just gonna throw it out there. From Brandon Bagley on Facebook, what would be a more accurate name for the Big Bang?

• 19:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There is no more accurate name.

• 19:04Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 19:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The Big Bang.

• 19:05Speaker 01

  Geez, wow.

• 19:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And what many people don't know is that there's a great astrophysicist, Sir Fred Hoyle, who was not a fan of the Big Bang, back when there was enough slop in the data to not have to vote strongly one way or another. He was convinced that the universe was in a steady state. He knew the universe was expanding, so how do you have an expanding universe that's also in a steady state? You would have the universe spontaneously create atoms out of the vacuum. And then they would make new galaxies, and they would mix in with the old galaxies. So statistically, the universe just looks the same forever.

• 19:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's been expanding forever, and it gets rid of the origins problem. Then, the idea of a Big Bang arose. This was consistent with Einstein's general theory of relativity. And then George Lemaître, who was a Belgian priest and mathematician, he figured out if you turn the equations backwards, all the universe would have been in one place at one time. Then there's a guy named George Gamow, who calculated what that should look like. And there'd be a residue left over from this moment. And it would be this background in microwaves. And so all this got laid out. And Fred Hoyle wasn't having any of it. And he pejoratively referenced this idea as the Big Bang.

• 20:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He was making fun of it.

• 20:36Speaker 01

  Right, but it stuck.

• 20:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It stuck.

• 20:38Speaker 01

  It stuck.

• 20:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And we're loving it.

• 20:40Speaker 01

  That's like when you get a nickname to stick, like you just, you know, you sort of appropriate it.

• 20:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yep, yep.

• 20:46Speaker 01

  You kind of use.

• 20:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Then they can't use it against you.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 20:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right. And so, so there was the thought that there was enough gravity to halt the expansion and have it repeat. That had philosophical attraction to people because it meant the universe didn't have to have a beginning.

• 21:05Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In total, just on a cycle. Who knows what cycle? Maybe it's been going on forever.

• 21:11Speaker 01

  A rinse, firm press.

• 21:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's right. This, this, this, this concept of a beginning, somehow people...

• 21:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  People either really want it or they really don't want it.

• 21:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 21:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right? There's a bifurcation of attitude towards it.

• 21:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like a Rorschach test.

• 21:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It is.

• 21:29Speaker 01

  People wanna see.

• 21:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It is. You know what my wife told me? Before she was my wife, but she has a degree in physics.

• 21:35Speaker 01

  Somehow still managed to be your wife after this comment?

• 21:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. No, no. She said, she wondered whether there was a split between men and women.

• 21:46Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 21:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  About the steady state universe and a cyclic universe.

• 21:50Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 21:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Men don't have the cycles.

• 21:53Speaker 01

  Right.

• 21:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Women do.

• 21:54Speaker 01

  Oh, that's interesting.

• 21:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. So just, just, what is your philosophical leaning towards an idea? And if that philosophy emanates from the life that you lead and know and resonate with, you could have this split between men and women. And so she hypothesized that.

• 22:11Speaker 01

  So then guys say like, oh, so the universe is like super big. Like it's like, trust me.

• 22:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, the universe is stable.

• 22:20Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, no, Fred Hoyle, I actually like, uh,

• 22:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He wanted the steady universe, not the cyclic, cyclic universe.

• 22:26Speaker 01

  He wanted to go steady.

• 22:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Go steady. Ooh, very good.

• 22:29Speaker 01

  He has a pretty good quote about it. He says that words like harpoons stick and are hard to pull out.

• 22:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hmm.

• 22:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hmm.

• 22:37Speaker 01

  I like that. I actually think that in answer to Brandon's.

• 22:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's a very whaler.

• 22:40Speaker 01

  I know. Part time. It was, he dabbled in whaling. He was a hobbyist.

• 22:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Fred Hoyle? Oh, you're making this up?

• 22:47Speaker 01

  Nobody dabbles in whaling. I'm glad that I could get you on that, though.

• 22:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I haul whales as a hobby on the side.

• 22:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 22:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  A part-time whaler.

• 22:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, so once he, he, he said it pejoratively, it stuck, then he had, he had nothing on us at that point. And then the observation confirming the prediction, Nobel Prize was given. But he went to his grave, pretty much still a denier of,

• 23:16Speaker 01

  Of the Big Bang.

• 23:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The Big Bang. So, so getting back to my point, if the question was what better word would I have, term would I have for it? There are people who, if the universe would recollaps and then start as a bang again, they, they call that the big crunch. I don't know why they wanted to say crunch. If you look up that phrase, it's, it's there. Cause.

• 23:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Gas clouds and stars, they don't go crunch.

• 23:39Speaker 01

  Right.

• 23:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Potato chips crunch. Crunchy things crunch.

• 23:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The universe is not crunchy, right? So I just thought it was not the big crunch, it'd be the big squeeze.

• 23:49Speaker 01

  Huh. What about just the really big bang to convey this? I mean, it seems to me like, like, it's also, even if it were the big bang proper, it's not exactly an explosion.

• 24:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, we accept that the signature looks like if you exploded a grenade, for example, or how about the chrysanthemum fireworks? You know that one?

• 24:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 24:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right. Well, some of them, they are volume filling, right? And so the outer edge, well, how did it get out that far? And reveal itself at the same time, something that only went halfway far out?

• 24:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right? It must have been going twice as fast.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  Huh.

• 24:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Because they both sort of exploded at the same moment, but one is twice as far away as the other. It got, it was moving twice as fast. That's an explosion that started this. So it's not completely wrong to think of it as an explosion. Except that when we think of explosions, we think of an explosion in the pre-existing space.

• 24:56Speaker 01

  In space, right.

• 24:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Whereas this is the explosion of space and time.

• 25:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And matter and energy itself. So it's of a very different nature, but you get a little bit of the ways of insight into it if you think about it as an explosion. Then you say, okay, I'm done with that. What more is it to me? And then you learn that it's the expansion of space and then you move on to deeper ideas.

• 25:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. I mean, well, now the big problem with the term the big bang is there's trademark encroachment from the TV show.

• 25:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah. So I don't know if you knew this. If you Google the big bang theory, the TV show comes up before the creation of the universe.

• 25:32Speaker 01

  The universe should sue.

• 25:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  For me, I'm thinking. I... am I happy about this? Or sad about... is it good that people are watching the show?

• 25:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's got scientists. So my personal jury is still out on that. I don't know if that's good or bad. It just is.

• 25:50Speaker 01

  We'll take it up with the show later. Um, alright. Hey, this comes from Grady Butler IV on Facebook.

• 25:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He's got a Roman numeral.

• 25:58Speaker 01

  Right. Oh, does he? Yeah, he absolutely does. Um, so we don't mess around.

• 26:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Chicks dig the Roman numerals, I'm told.

• 26:04Speaker 01

  Oh, uh, do they?

• 26:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't know.

• 26:06Speaker 01

  Neil deGrasse Tyson the fourth?

• 26:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I have no Roman numerals behind my name.

• 26:12Speaker 01

  Uh...

• 26:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Why are they Roman numerals? Why don't you use Arabic numerals? That's just not as cool.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. Or you could just do like irrational number numerals.

• 26:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes!

• 26:20Speaker 01

  You know, to the pi. You...

• 26:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Neil deGrasse Tyson the pi.

• 26:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, you have a son. Why didn't you do like Neil deGrasse Tyson E or something?

• 26:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah, no, because I don't... That's not how I roll.

• 26:29Speaker 01

  That's not how you roll?

• 26:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  My name does not manifest in either of my two children.

• 26:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, I've never understood the desire to be like, "Mm, that's gonna be me. Property of Sarah."

• 26:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right. I just... That's not what I do.

• 26:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. Okay. That's good enough for me. But Grady the Butler the fourth, after we've hated on his name, from Facebook says, "Hey, Dr. Tyson, so I've heard a lot about..."

• 26:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We weren't hating on his name. We were...

• 26:51Speaker 01

  Considering it.

• 26:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Celebrating his name. Wondering whether the day will come where they'll use Arabic numerals.

• 26:58Speaker 01

  Okay. "Hey, Dr. Tyson, so I've heard a lot about cosmic microwave background radiation, what we were just talking about. A lot of physicists mention it, but don't really explain it. So what exactly is it?"

• 27:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah. That's a great question. So, in the early universe, it was really, really hot. So hot that the atoms were all ionized. So, they lose their electrons. So you have this soup of negatively charged electrons and atoms that want the electron but can't hold on to them because the soup of energy is so high. It turns out that electrons wreak havoc on light. If you're a light beam and you try to get through a crowd of electrons, you're not getting through. The electrons see you will scatter you to and fro.

• 27:45Speaker 01

  So they're like bouncers?

• 27:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They're bouncers.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 27:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  They will push you, scatter you, uh, reverse you. So there are no free sightlines through ionized gas. There's no free sightlines through plasma.

• 28:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's why the sun is opaque. It's just gas.

• 28:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You punch your fist through it. Nothing's gonna stop you. You'd be vaporized, but holding that complication aside.

• 28:13Speaker 01

  Right. It's not a minor setback.

• 28:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There is that, there's no surface there for you to touch down on. It is a glowing plasma. And I had a tweet in reference to that with my end of the sun tweet. Uh, a few, you know, when was that? Back in March? And I forgot the whole tweet. Something like in five billion years, when the sun dies, it will expand, its plasma surface will expand and engulf the orbit of Mercury and Venus. It will render Earth a burnt cinder before it vaporizes us as we go up in a puff of smoke into the vacuum of space.

• 28:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Have a nice day.

• 28:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That was the tweet. The point is, I'm referring to the sun as plasma.

• 29:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The early universe was once all plasma.

• 29:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay. At the temperature that the sun was. So what happens as we expand, we cool. Oh, now there's not so much energy to ionize the atoms and all the electrons find an atom. Clearing the deck for light to transmit freely. Now the free electrons are no longer there to bat to and fro the light that wants to pass through. So we now make complete atoms and light emerges at 3,000 degrees.

• 29:36Speaker 01

  So before there was a plasma state of matter, but no light?

• 29:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, this plasma, it's sorry, it's a glowing, it's glowing just the way the sun is. It's light.

• 29:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 29:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, there's definitely light.

• 29:45Speaker 01

  Could anyone, like if there was?

• 29:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, you just can't see through it.

• 29:48Speaker 01

  I see, okay.

• 29:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You see it, you just don't see through it.

• 29:51Speaker 01

  I see, okay.

• 29:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now watch. It expands and cools, electrons join, universe becomes transparent. The universe expands by a factor of a thousand.

• 30:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it turns out, the amount you expand is a factor in how much colder it is.

• 30:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If it was a thou- if it was 3,000 degrees in that moment, what's a, what's 1,1000th that temperature?

• 30:18Speaker 01

  Of 3,000?

• 30:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 30:19Speaker 01

  Three?

• 30:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Three. Right now, the universe is 3 degrees. How'd you do in your math class? Uh, so, what color light is 3 degree light? Because 3,000 degree light is like reddish.

• 30:32Speaker 01

  Right.

• 30:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ember. That light has now red-shifted. To today, that temperature went from 3,000 degrees to 3 degrees because it got diluted from this expansion. What color is 3 degree light? Microwaves.

• 30:49Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 30:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Period. Period. Mike, we are bathed in the microwave remnants of the formation of the universe.

• 30:59Speaker 01

  The cooling of the universe.

• 31:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Cooling of the universe. And now, if you go back in time, that there won't be microwaves. Those would be, uh, red and then right on up to white and...

• 31:11Speaker 01

  Ultraviolet, is it?

• 31:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, there's some ultraviolet in it, but it was not that hot. You get ultraviolet, 20,000 degrees, 30,000, 50,000. This is much cooler than that. I'm just saying that we see microwaves because of how, how late we are in the universe.

• 31:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Relative to the formation of this. And we call it the cosmic microwave background.

• 31:29Speaker 01

  Which, to me, sounds like something like somebody with munchies in college is looking at a cosmic microwave.

• 31:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I don't know if you're old. When did you graduate college?

• 31:37Speaker 01

  2014.

• 31:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  24. It's like yesterday!

• 31:40Speaker 01

  Uh, I mean...

• 31:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's yesterday!

• 31:42Speaker 01

  1914, 1914.

• 31:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Let me pinch your cheek. Oh, yes, yes. So, so, in the day, when you had to get up off your ass to change the TV channel, if you put the TV channel between two channels, this is before remote controls.

• 31:57Speaker 01

  What happened? Universe collapsed? What, god, what happened?

• 32:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Collapse of the space-time continuum.

• 32:03Speaker 01

  How did we not destroy the world?

• 32:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, you don't get clean signals that are broadcast.

• 32:07Speaker 01

  Right.

• 32:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But, because you're, this information's coming through an antenna. And so what you have is what we call static.

• 32:12Speaker 01

  Right.

• 32:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's the snow.

• 32:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's on the screen. Some percent of that snow is the cosmic microwave background.

• 32:19Speaker 01

  Wow, oh my god.

• 32:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Few percent of it.

• 32:21Speaker 01

  That's...

• 32:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You're measuring it, yeah, it's everywhere.

• 32:24Speaker 01

  That's intense, and so now that we don't have TVs where you have to change the channel, it doesn't exist anymore. You can't deal.

• 32:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It no longer works.

• 32:32Speaker 01

  Should I leave?

• 32:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right.

• 32:34Speaker 01

  Boy, that's awesome, okay, all right, we have time for a very short question before we go to break. Uh, this one comes from Antonio Montoya, I don't think that's your real name.

• 32:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Antonio Montoya.

• 32:45Speaker 01

  God damn. Uh, from Facebook says, "How far must I travel to see the backside or the reverse view, reverse view of the Big Dipper?"

• 32:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh.

• 32:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, interesting, right?

• 32:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh, you know, I forgot how way, how far away the Big Dipper is, I just forgot.

• 33:02Speaker 01

  Hmm, just say something confidently.

• 33:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But I can tell you this, that the Big Dipper stars are not sort of in a line.

• 33:09Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 33:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And if they were in a line, you could go to the other side and then see the Big Dipper in reverse, but if they're not in a line, you can't do that. So, I've done this exercise with all the constellations, and none of them look like...

• 33:22Speaker 01

  You have a lot of free time now.

• 33:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Me and the universe go way back. So, you go to the other side of these constellations, they look nothing like what they would do from this side.

• 33:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As they would from the other side, from above or below.

• 33:35Speaker 01

  It wouldn't just be reversed.

• 33:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, it's not just reversed. Here's something you do, I did this with classes, it's fun, get a long room that can go completely dark, give seven people, uh, pen lights, or just their, their smartphone will work, and orient them in the shape of the Big Dipper, bring some really close and some farther away, then have them turn on their lights, and you turn off the main lights of the room. Stand at the end of the room, you have no sense of the distance to them because you can't see them.

• 34:01Speaker 01

  Right, just the brightness.

• 34:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just the brightness, so it's all you can see, and you see a perfect Big Dipper. But as you start moving closer to them, Big Dipper's completely gone. It's got, so there's nothing real about these constellations, contrary to what millions of people in the world think, who get their instructions for their day's life from the stars. So, take a quick break, our last break, before we get to the third and final segment of Cosmic Queries.

• 34:29Speaker 01

  Exciting conclusion.

• 34:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hope, please. Sarah will be right back.

• 34:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We're back, StarTalk. I'm Neil deGrasse Tyson. We are in the popery edition of StarTalk. Sarah, keep it coming.

• 34:48Speaker 01

  Okay, alright, so the first one comes from Lynn Hughes in Fall City, Washington. She says, "I get discouraged by all the anti-science rhetoric these days. How do you stay so positive? What do people ask that gives you hope? And what responses are most helpful when talking to science skeptics?"

• 35:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Hmm. There's no such thing as a science skeptic.

• 35:10Speaker 01

  Just a dumbass?

• 35:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's like saying I'm a...

• 35:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm a gravity skeptic.

• 35:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 35:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I'm a skeptic that the sun exists. No, there's no such thing as a science skeptic.

• 35:22Speaker 01

  You are a science skeptic skeptic, is what you are.

• 35:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes.

• 35:25Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 35:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, if I think I understand what that means.

• 35:28Speaker 01

  Skeptic squared.

• 35:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, what do I do? Why do I stay positive? I'm... It's because everyone likes beating politicians over the head. And they simply bring forth the... In an ideal case, and in most cases, they bring forth the wishes of their electorate. So, if you're beating a politician on the head, you're really attacking the electorate.

• 35:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As an educator, for me, the target of my affection and interest will always be the people.

• 35:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And not the politicians that they elect.

• 36:03Speaker 01

  It's like getting mad at a scale, instead of getting mad at your weight.

• 36:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Exactly. I want to repeal the law of gravity, because I gained three pounds last week.

• 36:10Speaker 01

  Right.

• 36:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's not how it works. So, I think of myself as an educator in that context. And to equip the general public with the methods and tools to analyze the moving frontier of science, to process information about what is the state of science in the world? And what is science and how and why it works? And hope springs eternal? My favorite quote of them all is that, "And this too shall pass."

• 36:43Speaker 01

  That's pretty good. Uh, how did that go over with your kids when you were being grounded?

• 36:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right. So, yeah, I've, the anti-science, it'll come back and bite everyone in the ass. I don't beat people over the head. I say, "Look, if you don't like science, here are the consequences. You will die sick and hungry and poor."

• 37:05Speaker 01

  But just that?

• 37:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just that, that's it. Innovations in, I've said this a zillion times, innovations in science and technology are the engines of tomorrow's economy. And not only that, it will assure a continued access to your health, your wealth, and your security. Without which, just move back into the cave and throw rocks. Cause that's where you belong, if you were always a person in denial.

• 37:34Speaker 01

  I think to the question she asked about how you stay so positive, I know for one thing, you have a great sense of humor about it. Like, some people-

• 37:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, okay, no, so, no, I don't have a sense of humor. I don't think of it, okay. I think of it just that the universe is hilarious.

• 37:48Speaker 01

  Oh, 100%.

• 37:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I'm revealing this, and I'm revealing this to whoever will listen. So, cause I'm not actually telling a joke, right?

• 37:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Have I told a jo- no. But the universe is funny. So, so, and I found that people learn more when they're laughing, or at least when they're smiling as a minimum.

• 38:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, why not celebrate the hilarity of the universe? In ways that have people, uh, enable, empower people to learn ever more.

• 38:20Speaker 01

  And go to comedy shows with comedians, cause they'll learn about the universe.

• 38:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Love me some comedians.

• 38:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Uh, okay, so, moving on, sort of in the same vein, PsyHunter on Instagram asks, "Why do flat-earthers still exist?", question mark, exclamation point, question mark, exclamation point.

• 38:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so, flat-earthers, I've analyzed this problem.

• 38:41Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 38:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I've concluded that the existence of flat-earthers is the manifestation, the simultaneous manifestation of two facts. One, we live in a country, the United States, that protects free speech. Two, we live in a country, the failed educational system.

• 39:04Speaker 01

  Combine those two.

• 39:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Combine those two, you have flat Earthers.

• 39:07Speaker 01

  The, the flat Earth hypothesis for the existence of flat Earthers. I kinda love that of flying science. They exist in an unstable state of rage.

• 39:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It appears to be stable, but it's, I'm not, so, so I say, go ahead, think Earth is flat. I'm not gonna stop you. It's a free country. At least we tell ourselves that. It's a free country. So, it, but, you should not look for a job to head NASA, right? There's certain, certain job categories you should stay clear of. And, not only for those, there's folks who are like afraid of the number 13.

• 39:42Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 39:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right?

• 39:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, there are elevators that don't go to the 13th floor.

• 39:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  More than half of elevators have no 13th floor. I studied this.

• 39:50Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh.

• 39:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Along Broadway in Manhattan, you can't go to every building. But Broadway has plenty of tall buildings.

• 39:55Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's statistic, it's about half.

• 39:57Speaker 01

  So, is that floor empty, or is it just the 14th?

• 40:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  For some buildings, it goes from the 12th floor to the 14th floor.

• 40:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  For some buildings. For other buildings, they put all the mechanicals on that floor.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh.

• 40:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's still a floor.

• 40:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's still a floor, but they hide it.

• 40:14Speaker 01

  It like...

• 40:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mechanicals.

• 40:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, now what were we talking about?

• 40:18Speaker 01

  Flat Earthers. It still exists.

• 40:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. So, free speech, go right ahead.

• 40:25Speaker 01

  You look exhausted by this topic.

• 40:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, no. It's, it's, I'm not gonna fight you. If you wanna think about it, go ahead.

• 40:32Speaker 01

  You know, you're...

• 40:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just get, you know, there are plenty of jobs for you. If you're superstitious about the number 13, plenty of jobs for you.

• 40:42Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 40:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Go right ahead. But, and let's hope the people who are hiring also know how that should go down. Because if they don't, that's the end, beginning of the end of an informed democracy.

• 40:54Speaker 01

  I think that there's a lot to why people think the Earth is flat, because it seems to be this comforting, like conspiracy theory that like scientists are trying to cover up knowledge that we don't know yet.

• 41:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's just odd that anyone would think scientists would be leaders in covering up knowledge. That we somehow would be conspiring.

• 41:16Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 41:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That somehow we're all conspiring to make the world look like it's getting hotter.

• 41:23Speaker 01

  Right.

• 41:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You might say, well, why?

• 41:24Speaker 01

  Personal advantage.

• 41:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What exactly? What could possibly motivate us?

• 41:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As a diverse community of scientists?

• 41:32Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 41:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And?

• 41:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't know. I'd have so I I'm too tired. I'm too old. I can't chase people.

• 41:41Speaker 01

  I wish that these mics were droppable. Uh, unfortunately, they're in a steady state condition. Um, okay, let's see. Here's a very interesting one. I've never considered before. Mr. Nate Cap on Instagram asks, could there be a universe inside a black hole?

• 41:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes.

• 41:57Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 41:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, next one.

• 41:59Speaker 01

  Next question, lightning round. Okay.

• 42:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Uh, so the equations of spacetime.

• 42:05Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 42:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As you follow them across the event horizon toward the singularity, allow an entire new universe to open up in front of it.

• 42:14Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 42:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So as you fall into a black hole, your time ticks slower and slower. And?

• 42:22Speaker 01

  It's a great anti-aging technique.

• 42:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, well, well, shh, yes, yes, it is.

• 42:26Speaker 01

  Exfoliating.

• 42:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I don't know about the exfoliating. So so you do this and time changes for you. So as time changes for you, you will see the entire future history of the universe unfold before your very eyes.

• 42:40Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 42:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As the new spacetime opens in front of you.

• 42:43Speaker 01

  It's very hard to remain funny and have jokes when you just constantly blow my mind, Neil.

• 42:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  What?

• 42:49Speaker 01

  So are you tempted then to like go into a black hole because you could see?

• 42:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If I had to die, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 42:54Speaker 01

  That's how you would go?

• 42:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah. Better get hit by a bus or die in a cancer or something.

• 42:58Speaker 01

  Oh, absolutely.

• 42:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah, I'll die falling into a black hole.

• 43:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, right. Spaghettification.

• 43:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 43:03Speaker 01

  All right. Okay. So like moving on to our next question. Uh, oh, I like this one. Roger Ratchuba on Facebook. Asked, does E equals mc squared, does that equation work with dark matter and dark energy?

• 43:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  As far as we know, we have no reason to think it wouldn't. So whatever it is that's causing the dark energy, if it one day shows itself to have mass, it's going to join, uh, the rest of all of the the mass out there as a, uh, as a constituent. Um, if, uh, now dark energy, we don't know what that is. If it has mass, we don't know. So, um, but yeah, equals mc squared is fundamental. In fact, it's true for everything. Everything.

• 43:50Speaker 01

  Huh.

• 43:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'll give you an example.

• 43:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 43:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If you take a spring

• 43:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  and dissolve it in acid.

• 43:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay? And then measure the temperature of the acid. You'll get some value. If you take a spring, compress it first. Pumping energy into it. And put that in the acid and dissolve the acid.

• 44:12Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 44:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The temperature of that acid is higher than the temperature of the acid that you dissolved the un sprung spring.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  Huh, okay, so it takes the energy, the

• 44:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 44:22Speaker 01

  potential energy?

• 44:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right. So equals mc squared, that E and that M work no matter what.

• 44:27Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 44:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It is completely fundamental to all phenomenon in the universe.

• 44:31Speaker 01

  Huh. Yeah, it's, I mean, it's interesting. I, I tend to view dark matter and dark energy as sort of like normal matter and energy, but with like an evil goatee.

• 44:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 44:40Speaker 01

  Sort of evil twin cousin. And then I imagine E equals mc squared was sort of the

• 44:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Why are goatees evil?

• 44:44Speaker 01

  I don't know. I

• 44:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It'll be early illustrations of the devil, maybe head goatee.

• 44:48Speaker 01

  Potentially. I don't know. Somehow it got the, the branding of the goatee went downhill. It was some guy maybe who started it. The mustache, I, I feel like is making a comeback. You're in luck. Um, you have a mustache soul patch situation, I feel.

• 45:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah, soul patch.

• 45:03Speaker 01

  Is that

• 45:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mustache, I've never shaved the upper half of my mustache in my life.

• 45:06Speaker 01

  The upper

• 45:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Doesn't grow. Yeah.

• 45:08Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, it kind of, it's kind of hovering around the lip.

• 45:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, that's the lower half of the upper lip.

• 45:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 45:14Speaker 01

  Um, so, uh, I always figured that equals mc squared would have some sort of like inverse relationship with dark matter, dark energy.

• 45:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, just if it's matter at all or energy at all, it can fit into that equation and convert to the other.

• 45:25Speaker 01

  Wow, okay.

• 45:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No matter what.

• 45:26Speaker 01

  Dark, okay.

• 45:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, yeah.

• 45:27Speaker 01

  It's just more evil.

• 45:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's dark.

• 45:31Speaker 01

  Give me that.

• 45:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Energy, yeah.

• 45:34Speaker 01

  Uh, okay, all right, let's see. My next question, and I think probably our final question for

• 45:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We have time for one more question.

• 45:41Speaker 01

  Yes, okay, so this

• 45:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We never did the lightning round, yeah.

• 45:44Speaker 01

  We didn't do a lightning round? Oh, okay. Uh, uh, so our last one comes from King J. Mathias on Instagram. What are your thoughts?

• 45:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  King?

• 45:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, apparently it's a king. Um, so thank you, your honor, your royal, your highness for reaching out to us on Instagram.

• 46:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Of what?

• 46:02Speaker 01

  Um, probably Instagram, I'm guessing, or his mom's basement. Um, alright, so King J. Mathias on Instagram asks, "What are your thoughts on China planning to get rid of all the space junk with lasers?"

• 46:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ooh.

• 46:15Speaker 01

  You hear about this?

• 46:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so, so, space junk is bad?

• 46:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In fact, I think we haven't been visited by aliens because they saw the space junk and said, "Forget that." Y'all just...

• 46:24Speaker 01

  Messy, I don't want to deal with it.

• 46:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right, right. Put my ship at risk because you're garbage.

• 46:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And, so, a couple of things you can do with lasers. You can vaporize the target, you can accelerate it out of, out of orbit.

• 46:38Speaker 01

  Right. Put it on a different planet.

• 46:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, but, uh, you can do multiple things, but I, I will say that that's a big cleanup job, because it's not like a spilled thing on the floor.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In your kitchen, it's scattered all over the solar system.

• 46:56Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 46:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, it scatters all over the solar, and then you hope it doesn't come, come around to kill you again.

• 47:01Speaker 01

  Right.

• 47:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Ideally, we would vacuum it all up and send it into the sun where it will vaporize.

• 47:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Or bury it or something.

• 47:06Speaker 01

  That, that somehow feels like a cop-out. It somehow feels like, you know, we should just be having less junk out there.

• 47:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We should have, handle our own junk.

• 47:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Don't pass the buck to the sun.

• 47:15Speaker 01

  That's the sort of cosmic sweeping under the rugs.

• 47:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, in one of the most famous books ever written on gravity, it's called Gravity.

• 47:22Speaker 01

  I was, I don't know what I was expecting.

• 47:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, it's Gravitation. There is a, they talk about a black hole and how you could use it to cycle garbage.

• 47:31Speaker 01

  Wait a second, we see a black hole, this like giant cosmic phenomenon.

• 47:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Beautiful cosmic phenomenon.

• 47:36Speaker 01

  Great place to put our garbage.

• 47:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, in case Earth gets too filled up with garbage, non-biodegradable garbage, just toss it into the black hole. So, Sarah, we gotta call it?

• 47:45Speaker 01

  I think we do.

• 47:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Sarah, thank you, it's your first time!

• 47:48Speaker 01

  I survived, I'm still alive!

• 47:50Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  First time!

• 47:51Speaker 01

  It was, was it good for you? It was good for me.

• 47:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It was okay for me.

• 47:55Speaker 01

  I'll take it, I'll take it.

• 47:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, we need up, upside potential there. Uh, you have been watching, and possibly more likely, listening to StarTalk. Sarah, thanks for being on the show.

• 48:06Speaker 01

  Thank you for having me.

• 48:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I am Neil deGrasse Tyson, your personal astrophysicist, and as always, I did you.

• 48:12Speaker 01

  Keeps looking up.

• 48:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Very nice.