Brittany Snow: My Husband Cheated On Me (FBF)

Join Alex in the studio for a sit down interview with Brittany Snow. Brittany talks about being the “camp counselor” in her friend group and how she’s gotten comfortable spending more time alone. She reminisces on some of her most iconic movies and tells the story of how her role in John Tucker Must Die inspired her to get back at an ex. Brittany also talks about directing her first movie and opens up about how the film was inspired by her own battle with body image. She gets real about all the ways an eating disorder affected her daily life, dating, and sex. Brittany reveals her rock bottom moment and shares how much better she is doing today. Then, Alex and Brittany talk all about codependent relationships, the current state of Brittany’s love life, and how she really felt watching her divorce play out so publicly. This episode includes discussion of disordered eating and suicidal ideation. Please keep this in mind when deciding if, how and when you’ll listen.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Alex Cooper?

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Fall is about finding pieces you love, making them your own and creating looks and spaces just right for the season. Whether you're updating a small apartment or a spacious home, drawn to timeless neutrals or bold seasonal touches, Ross makes it easy to imagine what's next and bring your fall vision to life. Ross makes fashion accessible to all with up to 20 to 60% off other retailers' prices on the brands you love. Find your nearest Ross at rossstores.com. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Southern New Hampshire University. Daddy gang, let's get real, okay? We like to make our own rules. Southern New Hampshire University gets it.

• 0:42Alex Cooper?

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• 1:00Speaker 01

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• 1:31Alex Cooper?

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• 2:15Speaker 03

  Brittany Snow, welcome to Call Her Daddy. I'm so excited to be here. I am so happy we are doing this. I DM'd Brittany like how long ago?

• 2:24Speaker 03

  A year ago, I think. It was a year ago? Well. I mean, you really made me work for it. I remember, well, I wasn't ready to, to be very public about anything, really. I get it. Um, and so I remember opening up the DM and being like, oh my God, Alex. And then being like, no. Just, just not gonna do that. So, um, it was, it took a while for me to come around. Well, I'm so happy you came around because I have been, wow, I've been thinking about you for a year in the least creepy way. It can be creepy. And now you're here. In my merch and I fucking love it. You look amazing. I didn't even realize how blue your eyes are until I'm staring at you with this blue on and it's like fucking insane. I'm gonna wear it all the time.

• 3:05Speaker 03

  You look great. You can keep it. You've been in the industry for over three decades. What is the most like un-Hollywood thing about you? That I've been in this business for three decades and I have absolutely no chill, no cool, no tact, no, um, I do everything wrong. I am incredibly, incredibly awkward. Um, in front of most people and I have this thing that I, I speak without thinking. And so just like in this podcast, I'm going to say something that I will regret. That's good for me though. That's good for me. Not for you. No, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. No, no, it's gonna be great. It's great for everyone because I think people instantly feel like, oh, this girl is an idiot. So I feel so much better about myself.

• 3:45Speaker 03

  Um, most people like that I meet that are fancy and stuff like that. I think they feel better that someone is bumbling and, and is somehow invited to the party. I think it makes you more likeable because I feel like everyone in Hollywood has like a couple of sticks up their butthole. And you're just kinda like, oh no, I'm just gonna be like myself. And like, even if you think I'm wild and insane, like, it's okay. Like, I'm right here. Wild I'll take. Um, yeah. Brittany Snow, she's like, woo, crazy. Party girl. Um, no.

• 4:24Speaker 03

  But yeah, I think after a while, there was no going around it. There was no way that I could be anything else. So I might as well just lean into it a little bit because it was so much more painful for me to try to be stoic and classy and try to be, you know, I guess with the stick.

• 4:42Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 4:42Speaker 03

  I don't even know where you get the stick, but I couldn't find one. And so it just, it never went up there.

• 4:48Alex Cooper?

  I am gonna say, I think I didn't know you were like this fun and bubbly. Like, I know, not to say I didn't think you were gonna, like, I'm like, oh, you're gonna be a weirdo. I just, I genuinely thought like, you are like a very like prestigious actress. You're, you know, you are like, you've been in fucking everything.

• 5:05Speaker 03

  The pacifier with Vin Diesel.

• 5:07Alex Cooper?

  That's the one. That really sealed the deal. Okay. But like, I didn't know what to expect. And you, I'm sitting across from you and I said it before we started filming, like, I feel like you're my friend from like, childhood that you're just like a very, you have a great energy.

• 5:21Speaker 03

  Thanks. I need this pump up before I start every interview.

• 5:24Alex Cooper?

  You're amazing, queen. Slay bitch. Let's go.

• 5:43Alex Cooper?

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Airbnb. So the other day I was just scrolling on my phone and one of those one year ago today notifications popped up. I usually don't pay much attention to them, but when I saw it was from my Napa trip with Lauren. I obviously had to go back through every single photo. I remember we drove up to Napa for a weekend and found the cutest farmhouse on Airbnb to stay in. The location could not have been more perfect. It was right by a vineyard and overlooked this beautiful golf course, which yes, Matt was very jealous of. During the day, we went wine tasting like a little cute couple.

• 6:28Alex Cooper?

  Then we brought our favorite bottles back to the house at night for cozy, long girl talks on the couch. Obviously, I Haven't had a drink in forever since being pregnant, so I cannot wait for wine nights again soon with my girlfriends. And now that holiday travel season is finally here, all of my group chats are going off with everyone trying to coordinate dates and just figure out where we're going to stay and where we're going to go next. But looking back through those photos reminded me that some of the best parts of a trip happen back at the house, right? Like, that's why I love booking a home on Airbnb. It literally gives everyone space

• 7:08Alex Cooper?

  to just spread out and it makes every trip feel more relaxed. You can even order groceries, which I love, for your trip through Airbnb and have everything from breakfast essentials to holiday snacks delivered after you arrive. If you're planning your Thanksgiving trip or any holiday travel this season, definitely check out Airbnb before you book. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Fall is about finding pieces you love, making them your own and creating looks and spaces just right for the season. Whether you're updating a small apartment or a spacious home, drawn to timeless neutrals, or bold seasonal touches, Ross makes it easy to imagine what's next and bring your fall

• 7:50Alex Cooper?

  vision to life. Ross makes fashion accessible to all with up to 20 to 60% off other retailers' prices on the brands you love. Find your nearest Ross at rossstores.com. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by SoFi, the everything app for smarter money. If your money is scattered across five different apps you never open, you're not in control. Your money should move you forward. With SoFi, you get award-winning banking, investing, borrowing, and more all in one app, so you finally know where your money is. Make your first move with SoFi Checking and Savings. Competitive APY, no account fees, a bonus when you join with eligible direct deposit. Terms apply. SoFi Bank, N A. Member, FDIC.

• 8:33Alex Cooper?

  When you're ready to invest or pay off that debt, everything you need is right there. As a SoFi member, you get access to SoFi Wealth's world-class financial planners to help you know what to do next. Get started today at sofi.com/callherdaddy. SoFi, get your money right. This is a paid advertisement by SoFi Technologies and is not intended to be financial advice. How would your friends describe you?

• 8:57Speaker 03

  I think the first word they would, they would probably say is sensitive,

• 9:03Speaker 03

  empathetic and probably passionate. There's no way that anybody can guess what I'm, like what I'm thinking. You know, I'm, it's always on my, on my heart is on my sleeve, shoulder, whatever. It's out there and I think that people either love that or hate that about me because I, I'll always say what's on my mind a little bit because I'm just too sensitive not to.

• 9:28Alex Cooper?

  I love that. I appreciate that. What role do you think you play in your friend group?

• 9:33Speaker 03

  I'm a little bit of the camp counselor in a way where I'm like, everyone together. We're going out to dinner and we're gonna like it and we're all gonna wear these cute outfits. And everyone's like, you know, stop, we have jobs and husbands and, and you don't. And, and I, I think also I am definitely the one that probably I, I need the most connection, I guess. I'm constantly in connection with my best friends. I wanna, I wanna hang out all the time. But lately, I think in the past year, I've gotten really good at being alone, which has not been my MO at all.

• 10:13Speaker 03

  Instead of being anxious about being alone, I'm actually very, very secure in it, which is nice.

• 10:19Alex Cooper?

  That's growth and that is the best feeling when you can get to that point. So I'm really happy for you.

• 10:24Speaker 03

  But I love being around my friends and doing activities.

• 10:26Alex Cooper?

  You're like, answer my texts, bitch. Like where the fuck have you guys been? Let's go to dinner tonight. Okay? Let's talk about a couple of the movies that you've starred in that are so iconic. And then we're going to get to a new film. Um, but first Pitch Perfect, obviously I have to ask about it. It is like forever, just the best, best, best movie series. Can you talk to me, obviously you had some of the funniest people on set with you. Is there any like incredible hilarious memory that you have from that movie? That just comes to your mind when you can like tell us a little story?

• 10:58Speaker 03

  I mean, all of those girls are some of my best friends in some way. We also became such a family because when you're doing a movie with so much rehearsal time and then you also have to shoot after that, you're there wherever our location was for about four to five months and we became really, really close and all of us are very.

• 11:21Speaker 03

  Uh, somewhat similar to our characters in in different ways. I won't give away what how because that's blowing some of them up, but um, but I think that we all feel very connected to our roles in that group and how it's showcased in the movies. So I guess to answer your question about funny moments, um, I mean, anything that Rebel does is funny.

• 11:45Alex Cooper?

  When I interviewed her and she was doing an impression of Adam, um, Divine, I was like, I think I actually for the first time, just physically peed my pants in the middle of the interview. Her doing the impression of him and then I interviewed Adam and he tried to imitate Rebel. And that was a fucking disaster. Sorry, Adam, but like, and the two of their dynamic, it is like, you could just watch it forever. It's hilarious.

• 12:12Speaker 03

  And I think that that was the cool thing about all of our dynamics on the movie is that we did constantly, uh, we got along so well, but we constantly made fun of each other, which was sort of a camaraderie that we needed because going into those movies, we had no idea that they were going to become what they became. So we had a lot of fun poking fun at the fact that like, are we really making this type of movie?

• 12:32Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 12:32Speaker 03

  And are people gonna like it?

• 12:33Alex Cooper?

  I bet it didn't even sometimes feel like work because you're like, we're just like, half the time, I'm sure there's some people improvising and it's just like fun. So John Tucker must die. I, this movie, I feel like we just have to, I don't know who hasn't seen it, but to anyone that hasn't seen it, first of all, I think this changed my life. It really formed me as a woman. I remember being young and being like, never trust a man, which I'm like, I learned so much from that movie. If you can describe to people who haven't somehow watched it because they live under rock, can you describe like the premise of it?

• 13:04Speaker 03

  Sure. So John Tucker must die, um, which is hilarious because he doesn't die. We don't kill him. So anyone who wants to know if it's a horror or something or a thriller in any way, um, it's just about this guy who is the high school man and he's dating a bunch of girls at the same time, as you do in high school, not anymore. And, um, and all of us are in different cliques. Well, I'm, why did I just put myself in there? I'm not in the cliques. I'm not dating him. All of them are in different cliques and they all somehow get together by circumstance and find out that they're all dating him at the same time. So then I devise a plan for them all to get back at him and teach him a lesson.

• 13:47Alex Cooper?

  It is like, no, because honestly, it's like something I would have done in high school. Like, this is literally me. I think that's probably why I connected with it. I'm like, I would be like the mastermind that's like, listen to me. This is how we're taking this man down. This is how we're gonna kill him, okay? Figured it, really, not literally. Um, what is the pettiest thing you or a friend has done to get back at a guy that you've broken up with?

• 14:07Speaker 03

  Well, to be, to be completely fair, and this is, this sounds so lame.

• 14:12Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 14:13Speaker 03

  Because I had just done John Tucker Must Die. Um, and while I was shooting that movie, my boyfriend at the time, who was the first love of mine, um, and I, and I still have such fond memories for him. But at the time, we were on like a break, Ross Rachel vibe, and um, he was dating this other girl, and I found out about it. And so me and her, right after John Tucker Must Die, because I don't have any good ideas of my own, show up at his house together.

• 14:40Alex Cooper?

  No.

• 14:41Speaker 03

  Yeah. And he opens the door, and I remember saying to him, I think you owe us an explanation.

• 14:49Alex Cooper?

  You really took your character too far.

• 14:51Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 14:51Alex Cooper?

  He was like, let me like, really like, method act right now. I'm like, let me just like, get into character. Here we go. Oh, my God. What did he, what was his reaction?

• 14:58Speaker 03

  I remember him being shocked, but, but it didn't really help or work or anything. And then I remember saying bye to her and being like, that was weird, right? Like, why did we do that?

• 15:08Alex Cooper?

  Like, what was the plan? Like, what did you want him to say?

• 15:11Speaker 03

  What after was going to happen?

• 15:13Alex Cooper?

  Like, what was the goal? Honestly, when you are like, young and in love, you do some crazy fucking shit.

• 15:19Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, there were, there were things that I definitely did, even up to the, probably the point where I was, I think 27 is when I, I got my shit together a little bit. But until then, I look back and I am traumatized.

• 15:33Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, that's actually a really good age, I would say. I feel like at 27, I really started to like, ref- refine my craft, you know? Like, just tweak it a little bit so that if someone told the story of me, it wasn't giving, she's crazy. It was giving, you know, she's passionate.

• 15:51Speaker 03

  Passionate.

• 15:51Alex Cooper?

  But it's not the level of crazy that I used to be.

• 15:54Speaker 03

  Unhinged comes before 27.

• 15:57Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 15:57Speaker 03

  Not after.

• 15:57Alex Cooper?

  Not after. Anyone that's 28 right now, losing their shit, stalking their act, just keep going. Like, maybe put your benchmark at 30, you're gonna be fine. Now, on to. Your new movie.

• 16:09Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 16:09Alex Cooper?

  This is the first movie that you have written and directed called Parachute.

• 16:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 16:14Alex Cooper?

  First of all, just congratulations.

• 16:15Speaker 03

  Thank you.

• 16:15Alex Cooper?

  That is so incredible as someone that's been in the industry to take this leap. And also just I love it like as a woman, like showing people like you can fucking do everything. You can be in front of the camera, you can be behind the camera. So congratulations.

• 16:29Speaker 03

  Thanks.

• 16:30Alex Cooper?

  You've said that we all have our own parachutes or things we use to avoid addressing our feelings or confronting difficult situations. In your own life, what hardships have you tried to run from?

• 16:46Speaker 03

  Um, okay, let's.

• 16:48Alex Cooper?

  Here we go.

• 16:48Speaker 03

  Baby.

• 16:49Alex Cooper?

  Here we go.

• 16:49Speaker 03

  Um, uh, well, I think, you know, my, my naming of the movie of it being parachute is that I really do think we're all trying to lessen the fall, as cheesy as that sounds. Um, lessen the fall of just being with ourselves and feeling our feelings. I think now more than ever, it's we go on Instagram or we go on Tik Tok or whatever and we scroll. Um, to numb the, the pain of just being with our own feelings. Or we're trying to, to hit a dopamine, um, sort of like hit in a way to make us sort of ride the wave to the next moment. And I think that comes in all sorts of facets, but I think that they're very intertwined and

• 17:30Speaker 03

  can be subbed out for each other with social media, sex, alcohol, all these different ways that we're trying to lessen being with ourselves. And I think for me, I, I came from being a child actor that was very based in growing up with validation coming from achievement. And coming from you did really well on this, you get a reward, not only from my parents, but from, from just people on set or things in general. And so I started to become really. Addicted and and connected to the feeling of needing to get that hit. Um, and when I wasn't, I didn't feel like myself.

• 18:10Speaker 03

  And so I think probably I would have been addicted to something. It just so happened that I went on a diet before someone gave me drugs. I've never had a problem with drugs, but I think if someone would have given me drugs. It just one is the one is the before the other. And so I think what I was always trying to run from was the just normalcy of just being.

• 18:37Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 18:37Speaker 03

  And not having to achieve anything.

• 18:39Alex Cooper?

  You're so right. How many things we do to distract ourselves from being able to sit in silence and be okay with like, what's going on? Why are you sad? What happened in your childhood? Why are you like that? And everyone's like, no, quick social media. Oh, my God, let me watch this YouTube video. Oh, my God, let me watch this person and like, it's just, it's never ending. The main character in the movie deals with body dysmorphia and eating disorder. And I like you just kind of opened up about like, I know you've struggled with that in the past. That's why you wrote this movie. When you were younger, how would you describe your relationship to food?

• 19:11Speaker 03

  It was very based on um, connection to achievement, which is a weird thing to say, I guess. But I got a milkshake if I did well on an audition and I wouldn't get a milkshake if I didn't do well. And I think a lot of parents do this unknowingly in terms of you do well in your soccer game. We go out for, you know, cheeseburgers or if you lost, like, we need to go practice more. And so I think my reward center got all mixed up. Then couple that with the

• 19:43Speaker 03

  terrible amount of, you know, societal norms of how you look at yourself being a woman. Um, I think that was sort of like a culmination that that was hard. And I think I had to redefine. How food was not evil and it was also not something to be earned.

• 20:02Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, cuz like I'm curious, did you have anyone in the industry ever make comments about your body? Or was this a like very personal internal thing you were struggling with?

• 20:13Speaker 03

  There was a movie that I um I had just gotten help. Um, I'm very young at this point, but I had just gotten help and um I gained a bunch of weight during that time. Um, and it was it was half because I was healthy and half because I didn't know how to balance. And I think a huge part of my recovery has been balance. But I got on set, the first day on set, they said. You're too big, we need you to lose weight. And so I went on, they put me on a diet, they got me a nutritionist, they got me a trainer. And the other people in the movie got to go to set, normal hours, but I had to work with a trainer at like five o'clock in the morning.

• 20:55Speaker 03

  And it sort of set up this belief system, I think that it doesn't really matter if you're health. This is a long time ago, it doesn't really matter if you're healthy, it matters what they're gonna see.

• 21:06Alex Cooper?

  But do you remember like sitting in that room when you had just gone through recovery? You're like feeling better about yourself and then you sit down and they say that to you like. What did you feel when they immediately said that to you? Do you remember?

• 21:19Speaker 03

  Yes, this is how fucked up it was. I I thought, they're right.

• 21:25Speaker 03

  Yeah, which now makes me wanna cry cuz I cuz I think there's no way that that was correct. But I think I was, I'm so hard on myself and so I'm and I wanted to be great and sexy and and beautiful that I thought, okay, this is a goal for me to to get right.

• 21:43Alex Cooper?

  So also just so sad as women, like you can do so much work, but. It's like we're fighting against a system that is conditioned us since the beginning days to like believe like there is this one body standard that is you will get treated differently, you will get different jobs. If you look this way, like if you're thin, you get X, Y, Z. And so like as much work as you can do on yourself and like you said, feel healthy, the minute someone looks at you and makes a comment, especially to a woman about her body. It is so fucking hard for us to not immediately internalize it and be like, I gotta get skinnier. Like it's, you can do so much fucking work, but it's, it's also just so fucked up how people feel so comfortable to even say that.

• 22:26Alex Cooper?

  But at the end of the day, it's like, oh yeah, they think they know they're gonna make more money if you look a certain way. And so it's just like.

• 22:30Speaker 03

  It's a societal thing. It's, it's in, it's in the workplace. It's in every sort of, it's on social media to, to be honest, the most. Is that this is the norm and that we need to adhere to the norm, but what it, the norm is ever changing and so different person to person. So I don't know.

• 22:50Alex Cooper?

  When you look back, I'm curious, like, do you remember a specific moment where you realized that your relationship to food was different than your friends around you?

• 23:04Speaker 03

  Definitely, because I remember thinking, um, I remember thinking that I was obsessing about something that other people could kind of take or leave. And as a, as a teenager, it became such a, an obsession, which now I really understand. The obsession of that was a way to leave my body. So I wasn't even connecting to this thing I thought I was solving. I was actually disassociating. I was, I was becoming obsessed with something that was sort of this goal over here. And I think a lot of addicts in general become connected to the obsessing more than they become.

• 23:41Speaker 03

  I mean, that's a generality that I don't know. You know, I'm not a doctor, but, but I do think that that's a part of it. And so when I was a teenager, I would collect magazines and, you know, fitness magazines and all these different things to try to get there. And my friends would look at them and think, Leonardo DiCaprio is not in this magazine. Like, why are we reading this?

• 24:02Alex Cooper?

  Like Brittany, where is Rod Pitt?

• 24:05Speaker 03

  We want the fallout of Leo. To go up on the wall.

• 24:09Alex Cooper?

  And you're like, no, look at this woman.

• 24:11Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 24:11Alex Cooper?

  Got it.

• 24:12Speaker 03

  And I think that was the first time I was like, oh, why am I so into this? What is this gonna solve for me? But I think, um, I think it was useful in a way. And I, I, I talk about this with my charity, September Letters. There was an article in, in a magazine, in a fitness magazine, in, intermixed with all of the do this in Pilates and eat this. There was a, a story about a girl with an eating disorder and she was sort of explaining her OCD with, um, the obsession of it. And I ripped out that magazine article and I thought, this girl has what I have. She's doing the same thing. So I put it in my back pocket and, um, I wanted to keep it as a, as a way of a hope

• 24:54Speaker 03

  that there was something and someone out there that had the same thing that I did. And then later, it kind of came full circle because I did a magazine article for people and I shared my story. And I talked about how I found that magazine article. And there was a girl at a coffee shop who was behind me and she started crying. And I turned around and she pulled out my magazine article from her back pocket. And she was like, I carry this around as something, as a, as an example of hope that I'm, that I can get better. And I was like, okay, well.

• 25:28Alex Cooper?

  I did it. Like you.

• 25:29Speaker 03

  Maybe not did it, but you know, it mattered, those.

• 25:31Alex Cooper?

  Of course. No, like you did something that ended up, how you felt about the magazine that you first saw. It ended, you ended up doing the same exact thing to affect another woman, which I think is so beautiful and it's so sad because I do believe there is good in social media in us doing this. Like, I can't imagine so many people are gonna listen to this and so many women are gonna be like, oh my God, I needed this episode. I've been doing this. I like, I think there's so much positivity that can come, but unfortunately I do think there's more negativity because of how over saturated and over comfortable, I feel like people have gotten on the internet to just like sling shit out that's just like, we're not thinking before we post.

• 26:15Alex Cooper?

  And I think it's really harmful. What was your like, rock bottom moment where you realized like, I need to get help?

• 26:23Speaker 03

  I, well, it's in parachute. It's what, it's what parachute's about, the movie. And although it became many people's stories in this way, the, there was a moment that I.

• 26:34Speaker 03

  I mean, people are gonna see the movie, so I guess I should get comfortable talking about it. But I thought that it would be better. This is a lot for Call Her Daddy. This is trigger warning all the way, you know, to hell. But what I tried to encapsulate with the images in it as well is that I don't even think sometimes it's it's about the the act of wanting to to hurt yourself as much as you just want your brain to stop. And I just wanted my brain to stop. And so um, I think that at that moment, there was a there was a thing that happened to my brain that said, yeah, but it'll be okay if you're skinny. And that was the moment I said, no more, no more. Is that gonna be the thing that solves anything anymore?

• 27:18Speaker 03

  But this is this is not just me. I I would be hard pressed to find many people who have been through something like this that that haven't had a moment like that or felt like that was an answer, and it's not. And there are so many people that have gotten through it. Um, and I I sound like I'm being really dramatic, and I'm hoping that I'm not, but I think that hopefully I can be an example that it does get better.

• 27:43Alex Cooper?

  I hope I can like ease your mind for a minute right now. Like, first of all, this is not too dramatic or heavy for Call Her Daddy. This is like the exact place we should have this conversation because of how many women listen to this podcast and how many women look up to you and you have a voice and you do have a platform and you're so talented and to put your experiences into a movie that so many people are gonna be able to watch and connect to like, full stop, this is not dramatic. This is real life and you experience this.

• 28:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:14Alex Cooper?

  And also, I think it's so incredible to talk about this. So someone watching this is going to be where you were how many years ago and be like, wait, maybe tonight I don't have to harm myself.

• 28:28Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 28:29Alex Cooper?

  Maybe I should go to someone and ask for help.

• 28:31Speaker 03

  Mm hmm. That's what this is about, right? I think so. And I think that's what I guess people keep asking me, why did I do the movie? Why did I make the movie? And I think because I didn't have a movie like that when I was going through it. And I didn't even think what I was doing was necessarily uh. I I thought I was very alone in in it. So if that helps, if this helps, people really look up to you. And so I just hope that. Yeah, there is some, not that I'm some martyr either. Like I I don't have all the answers and I don't have a guidebook, but I I definitely know that it's possible.

• 29:05Alex Cooper?

  What do you think is the biggest misconception people have about? Eating disorders and body dysmorphia and body image issues?

• 29:15Speaker 03

  That it's self indulgent or vain or about food. It's not about food. It's not about how you look. I mean, topically, maybe, but I think underneath it's it's. Really about an obsession of trying to disassociate and not be. With yourself, with with actually like in your body. It's better to just kind of obsess about something else. And the achievement and the dopamine hit you get by losing weight or or something like that. That's so much more of the. Of the intricacy than it is about just not eating.

• 29:53Alex Cooper?

  That's what is frustrating. It's like when people, you're so right, think it's vain. Whatever it is, it's all a control mechanism. Like you're saying, because you have a lack of control in your life and inside of you where you're trying to dissociate. So it's the one thing that you're like. I can handle this here and you don't have to think about what's going on upstairs. Like you said, this movie is about talking about these distractions. Sure, to some people it's food, to other people, like you said, it's sex, it's alcohol, it's drugs. Um, it's hurting ourselves in some capacity to not feel what we're actually going through.

• 30:26Speaker 03

  Or even like lesser known ones like gossiping or just being a about drama or just being the person that's in everyone's business. I mean. You're sort of doing these emotionally unavailable things because you can't just sit with yourself. So it's better to go over here, go over here. Um, and I think that a lot of people get that. Misconstrued because they think, oh, eating disorders are one thing. Alcoholism is one thing. And they're really. Quite similar. They're just using a different mechanism.

• 30:56Alex Cooper?

  When I mentioned, like, obviously, recovery is not just this, like, clear path. Like, where are you at in your journey?

• 31:04Speaker 03

  I mean, a better than I ever have been, which I think is such a marking of how I was able to do this movie and write about myself and have this conversation. I think I have a lot of perspective and I'm a lot able, more able to sit with myself and I have this really cool new voice in my head that I'm like, hey, girl, where you been? Um, that that started, you know, I think probably 10 years ago that I pretty much always see the different perspective and things. Which is huge. Something terrible will happen and another voice in my head will come in and be like, well, let's think about this from another perspective.

• 31:44Speaker 03

  You know, maybe it wasn't that, it was this. Um, I don't really have black and white thinking anymore. I have very gray thinking, which is such a huge marking of of good recovery, I think. Um, and not in like a Pollyanna way either. I just kind of see the good in things a lot.

• 32:01Alex Cooper?

  It's amazing. How did your relationship with your body impact? How you approached sex in your life?

• 32:11Speaker 03

  That is a great question and so layered because I think in my earlier years, it was difficult to be in my body. And I bless my ex-boyfriends when I was in my early twenties before recovery. Truly bless them because it was really hard for me to understand sex in the way that was healthy because I had to actually be in my body and I was letting people see me. And that was really hard for me. Um, and then more and more, and especially now I have so much recovery and autonomy and like

• 32:53Speaker 03

  confidence in my body now that I've never had before. I mean, I was naked in X. So if that says anything.

• 32:59Alex Cooper?

  Right. But that's like a huge step. I feel like probably for you, right?

• 33:03Speaker 03

  That's why I took it to be honest. I was scared shitless, but I think it was such a. Such a goal for me, and I hate to use the word goal since I've I've dragged that through the mud this whole podcast, but but I but I what I wanted to do was be able to have that sort of confidence of playing a character that was brazen in her body and and bold and it not get into my head.

• 33:26Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 33:26Speaker 03

  And that and yeah, it was it was really about balance.

• 33:30Alex Cooper?

  You did it.

• 33:31Speaker 03

  I did it.

• 33:32Alex Cooper?

  What kind of guys, growing up and during this time of your life, like, were you going after?

• 33:40Alex Cooper?

  Who were you pursuing, Brittany? What were you up to over there?

• 33:43Speaker 03

  Have you seen a side by side of all my exes? Because I have.

• 33:47Alex Cooper?

  I have too. Why don't you explain it to people that have?

• 33:51Speaker 03

  Well, you can go on Google and I definitely had a type. Um, uh, God bless me, Brittany, for when you were young. Um, I think, you know, I've had a lot of therapy.

• 34:03Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 34:04Speaker 03

  And, um, I think that I I was going after people that sort of

• 34:13Speaker 03

  made sense in my mind and and that were lovely and and very kind to me. And I've never dated anybody who was like an asshole.

• 34:21Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 34:22Speaker 03

  Um, which which I know seems weird when you look at my dating history, but, um, but they weren't, they were all lovely. Um, but I think I went for a type of guy that made my

• 34:34Speaker 03

  the things that I thought I was lacking make sense, if that makes sense.

• 34:37Alex Cooper?

  So trying to like almost fill the gaps of where you were like, I'm not feeling great about this, but they bring this to my life, so they feel that for me.

• 34:46Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 34:46Alex Cooper?

  But when we get into therapy, as we know, Brittany, it's like, no, you've got to be whole on your own, because then you'll pick a complete different partner.

• 34:54Speaker 03

  Completely different.

• 34:54Alex Cooper?

  Because no one will have to fill any gaps. They can be an individual, you can be an individual, and then you just come together.

• 34:59Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 35:00Alex Cooper?

  Okay, fascinating. I know a huge theme also in this movie is codependent relationships. Have you ever been in one?

• 35:07Speaker 03

  Well, it's about, the movie is about what really happened. I I got into a codependent relationship with with a a guy who, um, is still a friend of mine.

• 35:19Alex Cooper?

  Hmm.

• 35:20Speaker 03

  And I think it was, it was, I think all relationships, especially before therapy, are sort of these.

• 35:30Speaker 03

  Microcosms of what you what you dealt with in childhood because it feels like home. And so it feels like, oh, that thing that I was missing from my mom or dad. I'm going to somehow recreate in a relationship. And I know I'm not talking about anything that people don't know. But I do think it it's really interesting with codependency because I never had someone really unconditionally take care of me in that way. Um, and so I got addicted to someone saving me a little bit and I thought that that was love.

• 36:01Alex Cooper?

  Can you talk about that, like your childhood? What do you mean you weren't taken care of?

• 36:06Speaker 03

  I think I love my parents and my and I won't even talk ill about them at all.

• 36:14Speaker 03

  But I think that it and a lot of parents were like this in this generation too. It was very conditional. It was very, um, I got, you know, an anxious attachment style for a good reason because I I I got a reward system like I was saying. So I think that when I had someone who was just like, anything you do is great. And I'm going to be there for you no matter what. If you fail, if you win. I mean, it was just like gold.

• 36:44Alex Cooper?

  Right. You're like, whoa.

• 36:45Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 36:45Alex Cooper?

  I don't like have to do this. And then if I don't do this, I like get punished or I don't get attention or I don't. Wow, that is interesting.

• 36:52Speaker 03

  But then I started to it's it started become becoming very evident that, um,

• 36:59Speaker 03

  that it became codependent in a way of of being addicted to that savior saved cycle. Um, and and I think that was the relationship that got me into recovery.

• 37:11Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, because I while you're saying that I'm thinking about it like it's so hard to spot. But then when you're in a codependent relationship, like all of a sudden you do eventually, I feel like most people get to that point where like you feel like you've been saved, the person's there and there's still this void. And you're still like, wait, what like, why am I not fulfilled? Why am I not happy? It's like, because a partner can actually not solve what you're lacking and what you're missing. You have to solve that. And so it's a Band-Aid. It feels good for a minute. Like you said, they would come in, you're like, oh, this is fucking good. But really, it's just they're like covering the tracks of what your parents didn't give you. And then once they do that, then you're feeling cozy and then you're like.

• 37:57Alex Cooper?

  Wait, but I still am feeling kind of like shit on these days. And then you realize like it actually has nothing to do with the person across from you. Of course, a partner can influence how you feel about yourself. But when you're looking for someone to fill the gaps, once the gaps are all filled, then it's like, why do I still feel empty in moments?

• 38:14Speaker 03

  Yeah, I and no person can. They're all just going to bring out these things in you that that you need to go and look at for yourself.

• 38:25Alex Cooper?

  Well, I do have to ask you. Okay, first of all, here we go.

• 38:30Speaker 03

  Let's do it.

• 38:30Alex Cooper?

  Here we go. Let's go. Well, first of all, are you single?

• 38:49Alex Cooper?

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• 39:35Alex Cooper?

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• 40:17Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 40:18Alex Cooper?

  What?

• 40:19Speaker 03

  I am, I am.

• 40:19Alex Cooper?

  Wait, that was kinda like.

• 40:22Speaker 03

  I am.

• 40:23Alex Cooper?

  You are?

• 40:23Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:24Alex Cooper?

  But are you like, talking to people?

• 40:26Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:26Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 40:27Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:28Alex Cooper?

  Cause if you were like, single, single, you'd be like, absolutely. I saw a little like, yeah. So you're, you're, you're dating?

• 40:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, I've been, I've been, let's use air quotes here.

• 40:40Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 40:40Speaker 03

  Um, single, weirdly, um, I'm not saying weirdly, like it's so weird for me to be single. I'm saying weirdly because it's, it's very easy for me to get in a relationship.

• 40:48Alex Cooper?

  Got it.

• 40:49Speaker 03

  And I've been actively trying to be alone and be with myself and just feel the feelings and not have to band-aid it with sparkly, shiny, you know, emotional thing.

• 41:01Alex Cooper?

  Totally.

• 41:02Speaker 03

  And so, yeah, I've not, I've been in and out of things a little bit, but nothing concretely. And so, um, until, you know, we'll see.

• 41:11Alex Cooper?

  Okay. So last year.

• 41:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 41:15Alex Cooper?

  You went through a very public divorce with your ex. Your ex-husband went on a reality show and there was a situation with another woman that just played out and you had no idea it was happening until it aired for the world. What did you feel when you saw this play out for the world to see?

• 41:32Speaker 03

  I will preface this with,

• 41:35Speaker 03

  they've taken up, and I, and I'm collectively calling them all they, cause I don't know any of them. Um, except my ex-husband, they took up a lot of energy and emotion and time and real estate in my head. And, um, I don't wanna give them any more time and energy because then they would win. And they would get what they wanted, which was getting my time and energy and attention.

• 42:05Speaker 03

  I was not aware of a lot of things.

• 42:13Speaker 03

  And I'll say that. So I will say, what people think happens, happened.

• 42:21Speaker 03

  And

• 42:24Speaker 03

  I

• 42:27Speaker 03

  think that there's also in my experience with this and how I processed it, there's a lot of,

• 42:35Speaker 03

  grace that I give myself and also I can own.

• 42:44Speaker 03

  There's a part of this that I'm not, I don't have a part in. They messed up. Um, but, but I, I, I am trying, I tried, I tried very hard to see it all from every side and, and release that anger because it doesn't serve me.

• 43:00Alex Cooper?

  At some point when you're moving on from something, it's like you don't want to give things air. I think as a woman watching it, I got triggered because like I

• 43:14Alex Cooper?

  have had a not exact same similar situation, but like I've seen things online of someone I was dating in the past and I was like,

• 43:23Alex Cooper?

  sorry, what? And it warps your perception of like, how can you trust people? Like it's such a,

• 43:30Speaker 03

  Or how can you trust yourself? Which I think was, I think the saddest part about the whole thing was I was, I didn't, I didn't see any of, I was, what? Like, um, and to trust yourself after that and be like,

• 43:49Speaker 03

  I have a, I have a good sense of character.

• 43:54Speaker 03

  There was some,

• 43:58Speaker 03

  I had instincts and I think because I was in love, I didn't trust them.

• 44:01Alex Cooper?

  Yeah. That's what I feel like, which is the worst is when you get a little space from it. We kind of always know. But like, there's so many reasons we don't want to know because it looks all good and most of it feels good, but there's like a tiny thing in your head that's like, and you're like, no, get out of here. Like everything is fucking good. Like we are thriving over here, but it's not. And I guess like, I just now like thinking you're fabulous and getting to know you, I can't help but just ask like,

• 44:34Alex Cooper?

  How do you, how, I feel like you're kind of a private person.

• 44:37Speaker 03

  Specifically with my relationships, a hundred percent.

• 44:40Alex Cooper?

  Yeah. So how do you, how did you just like handle like fuck him and that all them for a minute? Like, how do you handle internally? People fucking coming at you and wanting to know something so personal that like this person betrayed you, like they took it so public and you didn't have a say in it. Like, how did you recover from that? Like, and how are you recovering from it?

• 45:02Speaker 03

  I think that was the hardest part was the not being able to, not be, not because anyone silenced me, just that I was not going to play that game.

• 45:14Speaker 03

  I don't have the anger that I think that I, I think people wanted me to have in terms of like, I wasn't,

• 45:23Speaker 03

  it was so like, what? I just didn't even want to go there, you know?

• 45:28Alex Cooper?

  I get what you mean. You're like, I know people want you to put out this big statement, like I saw it. And you're like, the fuck?

• 45:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, I, I, of course I saw it.

• 45:41Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 45:41Speaker 03

  You know?

• 45:42Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 45:42Speaker 03

  Watched it with my dog, so.

• 45:45Alex Cooper?

  By yourself?

• 45:49Speaker 03

  Whatever. I, it's like, now I can laugh about it because I think it's so.

• 45:53Alex Cooper?

  It's insane.

• 45:54Speaker 03

  It's insane and it's so funny. Like, it's so crazy.

• 45:57Alex Cooper?

  Is there anything like closing out that chapter of your life that you feel like was like very misconstrued on the internet? Like, that you could clarify right now?

• 46:15Speaker 03

  I think I would say

• 46:18Speaker 03

  that it, yes, what happened, happened. And I think what people.

• 46:25Speaker 03

  You know what it's alluded to in the press is some is true. But what I do think, you know, which the press can't do thankfully is the intricacies of. There was love there. There was, there was a marriage there. There was, there was so much love and.

• 46:44Speaker 03

  And I think that that gray is hard to understand because. It's much more salacious and interesting that it's just like. He did this and she did this and.

• 46:57Speaker 03

  And I think that's what I would want to. I guess. Put out there is that I think a lot of people go into relationships where someone hurts them, but, but. That I don't regret it. I don't regret anything that happened because I loved that time that we had when we had it.

• 47:16Alex Cooper?

  Did you know her?

• 47:20Speaker 03

  Which one?

• 47:23Alex Cooper?

  Well. Any of them?

• 47:28Speaker 03

  No.

• 47:30Alex Cooper?

  You had no clue? And then it slowly just. Bomb.

• 47:37Speaker 03

  I did not. I did not know like what was going on. I think as someone who's so.

• 47:48Speaker 03

  Hands on with my career.

• 47:53Speaker 03

  I think I was just completely shocked that I didn't have a handle on reality in that way. Like.

• 48:02Speaker 03

  Um, that was, that was shocking.

• 48:04Alex Cooper?

  Who did you call first?

• 48:07Speaker 03

  I. Went over to a friend's house.

• 48:13Speaker 03

  It was, it was. It was the worst day.

• 48:16Alex Cooper?

  It's more the situation. It's like. So relatable for women when it happens and it's like you feel like you've been hit by a truck. Because at your reality has been completely distorted because you're like, everything I believed is changed. And you have to basically pick the pieces up by yourself and it's a really. Really fucked up situation. If anyone is listening has felt it, you know what I mean of like, you want to say fuck you to the person, but you're also like, wait, five seconds ago, you were my person? How does it change on a dime? It does. And so like the picking up of the pieces by yourself, when forty eight hours ago, you had this person and a life together.

• 48:59Alex Cooper?

  It's really disorienting, but I feel like if you have any like closing advice for women right now, generally of just like, when you experience someone

• 49:14Alex Cooper?

  betraying your trust and disrespecting you in a relationship, like what have you found has given you strength? To move forward and trust yourself after something like that has happened to you?

• 49:30Speaker 03

  It doesn't happen right away because I think the the shock and the nervous system that and the breakdown of the the familial sort of system of safety is destroyed because this person is your home and your home is burnt. So I think what happened for me, which is, you know, and I won't speak about this specifically because I think this goes with a lot of my past relationships or or things that I tell my friends, which is to actually start realizing and seeing them as real people and not this idealized version of what you thought or what you built. But who they are really and the intricacies of of

• 50:15Speaker 03

  taking the the shine off a little bit and and really getting into the brass tacks of like, did this really work? Because if it did, it wouldn't have happened. And and that's really hard to hear because I think a lot of us want to be like, it's it's them and blah, blah, blah. But like, it is. But I think that there's nuance in the fact that.

• 50:43Speaker 03

  They must not be happy.

• 50:45Alex Cooper?

  It's so true. And like, you're so right, Brittany. It's like, I know it's so hard to hear, especially if there's someone like today you found out and you're like, oh, my God, what do I do? There is something to be said of having

• 51:01Alex Cooper?

  enough like, respect for yourself to know. If this person did this to me, why would I want to be with someone that could ever disrespect me?

• 51:13Speaker 03

  And that's, that is that, that has been such a gift for me. People keep telling me like, what did you feel afterwards? And I'm like, I'm grateful in a weird way because it was a neon fucking sign. It was like bigger than this.

• 51:27Alex Cooper?

  You're like, and double, triple.

• 51:29Speaker 03

  So I didn't ever have to worry if I'm,

• 51:34Speaker 03

  you know?

• 51:34Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, like, like, you'll never doubt. You'll never doubt, like, that wasn't meant to be. And that's what I think. Leaving that conversation, it is helpful for women to hear, like, someone that has just recently gone through something that like, is unfortunately, really fucking relatable. And we all go through it, probably at some point in your lifetime. If you haven't, fuck you, you're lucky. Um, it is like, staying really, really clear on who the fuck you are and what you deserve and not allowing yourself in the wake of the loss in the first couple of months to romanticize something, like, being grounded of like, no, no, no, hold on.

• 52:16Alex Cooper?

  Listen to what this person did to you. Like, this person is like, you know what I mean? Like, you just have to kind of, you're right, be realistic and you can cry. Like, I feel like sometimes people are like, get over it. Like, make sure you surround yourself with friends that are like, cry, snot in the fucking tissue. Like, you should be sad because you're mourning something that you didn't have control over the ending of. But like, then move the fuck on.

• 52:38Speaker 03

  I, I really, really shout out and give such thanks to my friends who just.

• 52:46Speaker 03

  Laid there with me and they didn't try to fix it and they didn't try to because there's nothing to fix. There's nothing to change. It is what it is and they just like let me just be. And that's what I needed that at that time. And you know, I listened to a lot of woo woo self help podcasts, but a huge part of of changing and growing is what I think is just like sitting in that pain and not trying to fix it in trying to and just, I don't know, it makes resilience possible.

• 53:19Alex Cooper?

  I do want to know though with divorce, because I do think women, there's such a stigma of like, oh God, you gotta start over and like, how are you gonna do that? And men have it so much easier and it's such fucking bullshit like, what have you learned about yourself through this divorce?

• 53:37Speaker 03

  Oof. So much and honestly, I'm not this type of girl, so I will preface that with with that blanketed statement, but I'm so proud of myself. And I'm I'm never proud of myself, but I think that it was really, really crazy for a minute, but I think like anything, I just, there was this one time that I texted a girl from Pitch Perfect, one of the one of the Bellas. And I said, what do you do in this situation? How are you handling? How did you handle this emotion? Um, cause it's so, it's so much pain that I didn't know if I could do it. And she she just said, you just sit there.

• 54:22Speaker 03

  You just sit there and you just take it and you just exist, just exist. And I just remember sitting there being like, okay, I'm just gonna exist. And I'm just like, and it passes and then you just realize.

• 54:38Speaker 03

  Oh, it this stuff is so ephemeral in a way like it's just it it does hurt, but it comes and goes. And I think that that sort of impermanence can be an example for so many things in life.

• 54:50Alex Cooper?

  So true. That's like, again, it's the hardest thing. And it's like what we go back to when we were talking about, you know, struggling with an eating disorder where you're like, oh, my God, if only like I could just get out of my head. But it's like, but it does get better if you do get help. It's it is the same thing with everything in life. Like there is, you're right, there is this impermanence where like in the moment, it feels like, oh, the ship's going down. We're fucked. Like, how am I gonna get through this?

• 55:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:14Alex Cooper?

  And then one day you fucking wake up and you're like, huh.

• 55:18Speaker 03

  I feel better.

• 55:18Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 55:19Speaker 03

  And I don't know how.

• 55:20Alex Cooper?

  Then one day you're sitting on Call or Daddy and I ask you if you're single and you're like, ah, well, let me talk to you about my roster bitch like, and it's like, life goes on.

• 55:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 55:29Alex Cooper?

  Had you ever been cheated on before?

• 55:33Speaker 03

  Yes. Mm hmm. And ooh, do I love dealing with that in therapy?

• 55:39Speaker 03

  Girl, cuz you know, here's the thing. Fuck them for doing that.

• 55:43Alex Cooper?

  Right, of course.

• 55:43Speaker 03

  To be honest.

• 55:44Alex Cooper?

  Of course.

• 55:45Speaker 03

  But underneath that, I can't control that. And what am I gonna be angry for the rest of my life and draw, you know, holes in their eyes?

• 55:52Alex Cooper?

  Like a little doodle doll, like fuck you.

• 55:54Speaker 03

  But but what I can do with that is look at my part of like, I picked them. And maybe that was something that I should have looked at because because maybe I was doing something from my childhood of like needing that validation or that sort of conditional love and the fighting for the like, are they gonna think I'm hot? You know, like whatever. And it's like, I don't wanna, I don't do that anymore.

• 56:23Alex Cooper?

  What is something that you have like you put up with in the past that now that you've like become centered with yourself and you can look back at past relationships, you're like, I will never put up with this anymore?

• 56:36Speaker 03

  I had an ex tell me that I couldn't wear sweatpants.

• 56:40Alex Cooper?

  Sorry, what? He would fucking hate me. Holy shit, who is this man?

• 56:44Speaker 03

  I will not tell you, but um, yeah, oh, yeah, that they that they signified giving up, which I love the description as well. Um, so.

• 56:54Alex Cooper?

  I'm just getting started, bitch. Giving up?

• 56:57Speaker 03

  Giving up.

• 56:58Alex Cooper?

  Relaxed, cozy, comfortable, thriving.

• 57:02Alex Cooper?

  thriving

• 57:03Speaker 03

  I was like, I can look hot in sweatpants.

• 57:06Alex Cooper?

  You can look so fucking sexy in sweatpants. Let me be the first to tell you.

• 57:12Speaker 03

  So I think that guy in general, although young, young, like a young soul. Um, and, and also we're friends now, so it's fine.

• 57:22Alex Cooper?

  Right, right, right. And you wear sweatpants every time you see him.

• 57:24Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah. Oh, my friends got me a ring that is engraved sweatpants.

• 57:27Alex Cooper?

  No.

• 57:28Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 57:28Alex Cooper?

  Well, it's just.

• 57:29Speaker 03

  When, when we broke up because they were like, girl, where are your fucking sweatpants?

• 57:32Alex Cooper?

  Yeah. Well, it's also just so sadly indicative of like male female relationships where it's like, why do men feel fucking comfortable saying that shit to women when it's like, we would never say, oh, don't wear, well, I would say, don't wear your fucking khakis bitch like, but it's like, why, you know what I mean? It's such a, it's such like a demeaning statement that you're like, why?

• 57:54Speaker 03

  I think he had an idea of what sexy bedtimeness was and it didn't incorporate sweatpants. I don't know. Um, but I think that's, that's marketing and also shitty, you know, things given to men as of,

• 58:12Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 58:12Speaker 03

  this is what a woman is supposed to do.

• 58:14Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 58:15Speaker 03

  You know, and I think that bleeds into a lot of relationships too, is that, I think men think that there's this generalization of what women should be like.

• 58:24Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 58:25Speaker 03

  And I'm sure you've dealt with this a lot too, but I think a lot of times I've dealt with in relationships, where like a guy thinks they want a boss. They think they want the girl that comes in, in his, in a suit and then changes into sweatpants because she's fucking tired. But they don't really sometimes because they want to provide and they want you to have dinner. And all this stuff where you're like, are we in 1940?

• 58:49Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 58:49Speaker 03

  Um, and I think changing that and actually having guys pull up and be like, if you want a boss, you're going to get a boss and she's going to wear sweatpants because she's been working all day.

• 58:59Alex Cooper?

  Right. And she's paying for this fucking dinner and this fucking house bitch.

• 59:02Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 59:02Alex Cooper?

  So bow down. Okay?

• 59:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 59:04Alex Cooper?

  No, I appreciate that because I get we're talking about sweatpants, but it's just.

• 59:09Speaker 03

  It's indicative of other things.

• 59:10Alex Cooper?

  The theme is. No, and I I agree with you. I think there's a lot of men, it also goes back to porn, like they see this and they're like, oh my god, like this needs, it's not realistic. Every porn star I've ever talked to is like, it is the fakest thing I've ever done in my life. Like, I am faking it. This is fake. This is the what you see is fake. What you see squirting out is fake. Like, it's all fake. And so it's like, I think men have such a warped perception of what they want women to be. They need to educate themselves and and get up to speed because I'm exhausted. Seeing men treat women like, why aren't you acting like a Barbie doll? Like, why aren't you wearing lingerie to bed? And it's like,

• 59:51Alex Cooper?

  you put on a fucking G-string bitch. Like, I'm done with this. Like, it's exhausting. Okay, so you've learned that. What else are you gonna take away from like, you're never gonna deal with from past relationships?

• 1:00:01Speaker 03

  I think I fall in love with with, and then this is before, not not anymore. But I really fell in love with people who had potential. Um, I saw it in them, like, let's go, us against the world, we are a team, baby. Um, and there wasn't evidence that that was true sometimes. Sometimes there was, but I think I I I won't put up anymore with with just potential because it's an idea. And although I think it's different than believing in someone and their ability and their drive, because I think that's sexy. But I think that there's there's there's a difference.

• 1:00:42Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, I feel like it gets so scary and I've had that before and I bet it's very relatable for women listening, like, when you have a guy in front of you and you have all these ideas of what they can be, we need to start being more accountable with ourselves of like, but what is he showing you? And it's like, well, no, no, no, but no, no, look at what he's saying and what he's doing every day, like, get your head out of the clouds, but it's hard. And I think that's also just coming from the standpoint of being a woman. We've been taught to just like, Make everyone comfortable and like, and look at things like, I don't know, I feel like we just have moments where we try to make the best of things. And instead, it's like, girl, what is he showing you?

• 1:01:25Alex Cooper?

  It's hard. What we're talking about is like, us also as women, like just trying to get validation. It's like all we know. It's like, did they tell you you're pretty? Did they tell you you're thin? Did they tell, like, did you get, do a good job? It's like, we're constantly just fighting to be validated because we already are starting from below zero as women. It's like, we aren't men. We're living in a man's world. Like, you're already at a disadvantage. So we're looking externally for all of these things. And then when you start dating, it gets fucking psychotic because you're like, do I like him? Or do I just like really need that like little validation tonight at that date? Like, which is it?

• 1:02:04Alex Cooper?

  But eventually, it's, it's, it's exhausting. But then it's, I found, once you exhaust yourself enough.

• 1:02:11Speaker 03

  Well, I actually ended up having to, like really start listing it out in my head. Like, I'm like, he yelled at a waiter once.

• 1:02:18Alex Cooper?

  Oh, Brittany.

• 1:02:19Speaker 03

  I know. And I was like, that wasn't the like, bye.

• 1:02:24Alex Cooper?

  Peace and you can pick up the bill. Okay. Goodbye. Good day, sir. Oh, my God.

• 1:02:29Speaker 03

  Yeah. And then like, and then I like snapped out of it and I was like, whoa, whoa, where am I?

• 1:02:34Alex Cooper?

  But we can avoid those things and we can pretend it didn't happen. Like, I have done that before and this is so fucking embarrassing. But like, I've done something similar where like they do that. And then I pretend I didn't see it. Like, I'm like, oh my God, like, where's my hair tie? And it's like, I just saw this man be rude to a fucking waiter, but you don't want to see it. Because you have, you have an agenda in your head. And that didn't fit the script. I'm like, you know, like, I want to go out with you again. Cause what, you're feeling this one thing that I'm liking right now. So like, that waiter issue never happened. But then eventually you look at yourself in a couple of months, still talking to him and he's like, doing it now to you and he's doing, and you're like, okay, well, I saw this like fucking five months ago, but here we are.

• 1:03:10Speaker 03

  But I was listening to your episode with Camila Cabello and you guys were talking about the like slow burn as opposed to like the firecracker thing. And that is something that I really, really have, has been hugely helpful for me lately. Is this, is just slow and steady, baby. Just like really slow and steady. And I do think that it works because. Because you're gathering information.

• 1:03:37Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 1:03:37Speaker 03

  You're just like gathering slowly.

• 1:03:39Alex Cooper?

  I think it's also so healthy to think about it in that way because slow burn doesn't mean we're like fucking flat line on the first date. It's not like, I'm like, oh my God, like you are so boring, I'm gonna fall asleep, but like, let's go for a second, just in case, like, no, there's, there is a spark. But it's not to the point where you're like leaving so overwhelmed because again, usually that means.

• 1:04:00Speaker 03

  Chemical.

• 1:04:01Alex Cooper?

  It's chemical.

• 1:04:02Speaker 03

  It's chemical and it's something in your, I forgot what podcast it was, but it was saying that like, if it's chemically and it's like fizzy and it's like nervous and your nervous system is going, then it's triggering the child in you that found something in the child in them. And you guys are like doing that nervous energy thing. And that's not real, that's not safe. That's, oh my God, this is like my mom and like, I can fix this.

• 1:04:25Alex Cooper?

  You're like, I love you. Like, let me solve all your problems. Let me do my savior complex right now. Put me in, coach. And it's like, oh my God, no. You can, what you want is a mature relationship where you can look at the person and be like, I actually see we have similar interests.

• 1:04:44Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:04:44Alex Cooper?

  We have a very like similar values. Like, that is what you need to focus on. If you yell at the, what was his name? I wish I get Ricky, knock it off. The waiter deserves better, okay?

• 1:04:58Speaker 03

  I, and of course I did the thing where I was like, I'm so sorry.

• 1:05:01Alex Cooper?

  No.

• 1:05:01Speaker 03

  I, it's, it, it's totally fine. He doesn't need the noon. It's, yeah.

• 1:05:07Alex Cooper?

  And then you went on another date with him?

• 1:05:09Speaker 03

  Oh my God, so many.

• 1:05:12Alex Cooper?

  But you needed to learn it yourself. And then did you what? Did you eventually just not talk to him again?

• 1:05:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:05:18Alex Cooper?

  Yeah. Or no, you're like, no, I have a date tonight, I have a date tonight.

• 1:05:21Speaker 03

  No, no, no. Nope, not.

• 1:05:23Alex Cooper?

  No, it's over.

• 1:05:24Speaker 03

  No.

• 1:05:24Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:05:24Speaker 03

  We are.

• 1:05:25Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:05:25Speaker 03

  Dunzel Washington.

• 1:05:26Alex Cooper?

  So what is, thank you. What is your approach to dating right now? And like, are you, and I know this is like too premature, but like, are you open to getting married again in the future? Or are you just not even thinking about that right now?

• 1:05:54Alex Cooper?

  Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ross. Fall is about finding pieces you love, making them your own and creating looks and spaces just right for the season. Whether you're updating a small apartment or a spacious home, drawn to timeless neutrals or bold seasonal touches, Ross makes it easy to imagine what's next and bring your fall vision to life. Ross makes fashion accessible to all with up to 20 to 60% off other retailers' prices on the brands you love. Find your nearest Ross at rossstores.com. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Shopify. I feel like it's that time of the year where everyone starts to slow down a little bit. We're reflecting on this past year, maybe even, you know, we're writing down a few

• 1:06:39Alex Cooper?

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• 1:07:24Alex Cooper?

  And for businesses, that also means fewer carts abandoned and more sales. I also love that Shopify lets me run my entire business straight from my phone so I can upload new merch, check on orders and see what you guys are loving from literally anywhere. It does save me so much time and it lets me actually enjoy the season while growing the business. So are you ready to add entrepreneur to your list of accomplishments? Head to Shopify.com/daddy. That's Shopify.com/daddy.

• 1:07:57Alex Cooper?

  Are you open to getting married again in the future? Are you just not even thinking about that right now?

• 1:08:02Speaker 03

  That's a good question because I vacillate a little bit because I think. It's a huge, you're getting married soon. So you, so I can't, you know, destroy this too much.

• 1:08:14Alex Cooper?

  Marriage is fucking off, Alex, run. I'm like, no, okay, fuck off, Matt, we're done.

• 1:08:18Speaker 03

  No, you're already married, right?

• 1:08:19Alex Cooper?

  No.

• 1:08:20Speaker 03

  Oh, I thought you got the license and everything.

• 1:08:21Alex Cooper?

  Oh, what? Oh, that's, oh, you're right. Oh, I am legally married.

• 1:08:24Speaker 03

  Do you not know?

• 1:08:25Alex Cooper?

  Oh, my God. I'm like, am I married?

• 1:08:29Speaker 03

  Wait, did I get that wrong?

• 1:08:31Alex Cooper?

  You're right.

• 1:08:32Speaker 03

  Oh, I love that I'm telling you about you.

• 1:08:34Alex Cooper?

  I love that you're, Matt, it seemed like, Alex, I am married. Well, no, to be fair, I was waiting for the 90 day thing. I think by now, I think I am legally married, but my wedding is coming up.

• 1:08:45Speaker 03

  Right, right.

• 1:08:45Alex Cooper?

  So those are different.

• 1:08:46Speaker 03

  That's what matters.

• 1:08:47Alex Cooper?

  That's, yeah, yes, you're right. Weddings matter, marriage matters more, and I am married, and this is good to know. Note to self, Alex, you're fucking married to you dumb bitch. I am married. I, I think so. Let me check.

• 1:09:02Speaker 03

  It's like a technicality. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:09:03Alex Cooper?

  Technicality. Anyways, back to you telling me I shouldn't get married.

• 1:09:06Speaker 03

  No, no, no, I'm not going to tell you because here's the thing. Marriage is fucking awesome.

• 1:09:11Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:09:12Speaker 03

  And I love to be married. I really thrive in relationship. I do.

• 1:09:15Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:09:16Speaker 03

  And I think that there's something so beautiful about the like, you know this, the coming together and being like, we got each other. Partnership, teammates. I do, I love that idea. Um, I do, I, I, I vacillate a little bit of like, can you have that without the paperwork? Just because I've been on the other side, but I also am a hopeless romantic. I love love. I can't help it. Um, and so I, I would love to be able to believe in marriage again. And I, and I date to, um, you know, I'm dating to, to find my person.

• 1:09:52Alex Cooper?

  I think that's absolutely the right way to look at it. Like, of course, like you would love one day, like maybe, but I think a lot of times we can get, dating's exhausting.

• 1:10:05Speaker 03

  Oh, my God.

• 1:10:05Alex Cooper?

  And it can get infuriating, but I do think everyone who has been in love at one point and you don't, and we don't even need to take away from past loves. It's like, that feeling is amazing. When you are with someone you love, and then even if they become a piece of shit later, like you can just remember those good moments. When you're dating, it's like you are dating to find the even better version of that feeling. And I think that is, that should make people feel hopeful of like,

• 1:10:33Alex Cooper?

  Put in a little bit of work for like a year to two years to three years to five years to then have a lifetime with someone like it's it comes. We just have to be fucking patient, but it is annoying. I like it can be annoying, but then it also can be really fun.

• 1:10:46Speaker 03

  I I think that some of my favorite women right now are like still dating after heartbreak. I mean, that's huge. It's so strong. To be able to put yourself out there like that again, and to believe that you are worthy after

• 1:11:00Alex Cooper?

  Totally.

• 1:11:01Speaker 03

  Something bad happens in that way. That's fucking badass. So I and you have to believe in yourself in order to know that you can withstand your own mind in the in the battle of that.

• 1:11:14Alex Cooper?

  I agree, and I think because women are so judged based off of our age and our looks and all the things and society tells us like you're dead by thirty. Like, I'm like, oh my god, like feeling my best as I'm entering this new era. Like, fuck you. I think we can also just start to say fuck it and just like do what makes you feel good. Like, don't, don't be afraid to put yourself out there. Date, have fun, like we're alive once. Give it a fucking try. Meet people, connect with people. Like, if you can change your perspective on it, I think when people look at us like, oh, like, have you found the one? Like, no. And that's so exciting because that means they're out there and you're gonna figure it out.

• 1:11:57Speaker 03

  There was some great advice that someone gave me where they're like, if you're looking for them, they're looking for you. And it was so simple, but I thought, oh, yeah, like if you're out there and I feel like I'm pretty cool, then someone's out there that's pretty cool too. That's like, where is she?

• 1:12:12Alex Cooper?

  Where is she? And one day you're gonna walk in and they're gonna be so nice to the waiter. You're like, oh my god, this is totally the right guy for me. What is your best quality that you bring to a relationship?

• 1:12:24Speaker 03

  Hmm, the more.

• 1:12:28Speaker 03

  Surface one, I guess is I I'm I'm pretty fun. I'm a good time. Um, whether or not you like me or not, you're gonna have a good time.

• 1:12:35Alex Cooper?

  Love.

• 1:12:36Speaker 03

  Um, uh, not sexually, or maybe, but um, but like, I meant like, I meant more like on the day, like good banter, good conversation, you know.

• 1:12:47Alex Cooper?

  You're gonna have men clip this when you go on dates and then be like, I want this. What is this? You're like, oh, let me take you for a ride. Not sexually, but maybe.

• 1:12:56Speaker 03

  Just a good time means so many different things nowadays.

• 1:12:59Alex Cooper?

  Yes, it does. It does.

• 1:13:01Speaker 03

  But I had to, you know, explain that. But I think emotionally, I am extremely I I like, I really, really get into the the nitty gritty with somebody like I I go hard for them. I like I'm super passionate about what they're passionate about. I really am like a great partner because I just love, I love that teammate aspect and I love, I think like in relationships too, we don't listen enough. And I really like to listen when I'm in a partnership.

• 1:13:33Alex Cooper?

  What is your take on if you don't fight in a relationship? It automatically means you're in a healthy relationship.

• 1:13:41Speaker 03

  I completely disagree, and I know this from experience.

• 1:13:44Alex Cooper?

  Yep.

• 1:13:45Speaker 03

  Um, because I think men, and this is another generalization, because it's not true for everyone. I do think men have learned that that having that sort of emotional like eh, fight is much more of a woman's thing. Saying what you feel and let's fight about it now. And they've been trained to stuff it down. It doesn't really matter. Let's talk about it tomorrow. Um, and I always think that sometimes is isn't detrimental to a relationship sometimes. Because I do think that there's a lot of, there's a lot of love and, you know, companionship and collaboration to be had in the. The normalcy of of good fighting.

• 1:14:24Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:25Speaker 03

  Not yelling at each other and throwing things, but coming from two perspectives.

• 1:14:29Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, I mean, it, it, yeah, I feel like it comes down to communication, like. I feel like there are so many relationships that people can look back and be like, we never fought, AKA like, we never really talked, we talked.

• 1:14:41Speaker 03

  AKA, you probably never had sex because intimacy, it's conflict is intimacy. And so is really talking to them and so is sex and so it's so, I think it's intertwined.

• 1:14:54Alex Cooper?

  It's a good point. Or it's like the most disconnected sex and you're like literally thinking of someone else and you're like. And then he's like, do you like that? You're like, oh, yeah, yeah, sorry. You're like literally out of body thinking about someone else like.

• 1:15:08Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:15:08Alex Cooper?

  If you really break it down, and that's why it is like kind of like. Beautiful when you get out of relationships and have a little bit of time to reflect, it all comes together for you. Everything that you were blinded by in the relationship, you're like, huh, that is fascinating that I put up with that. Or we both put up with that, like we both got okay with that situation.

• 1:15:29Speaker 03

  Totally.

• 1:15:29Alex Cooper?

  It's a really weird cycle that you can get into and you don't see it until you're out of it and you're like.

• 1:15:34Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:15:35Alex Cooper?

  God damn.

• 1:15:36Speaker 03

  And I'm glad that's why I've waited a year to talk to you, to bring it back to the beginning.

• 1:15:41Alex Cooper?

  I love it.

• 1:15:41Speaker 03

  Because I do have so much more perspective on, I think I would have, if I would have come here a year ago, I would have been so angry. And I would have not been able to see also my part in things of like, who was I there? Cause I was there too, you know?

• 1:15:57Alex Cooper?

  Totally.

• 1:15:57Speaker 03

  Um, and I think a lot of times we get so bogged down on the, the situation and what happened that we don't look at it from the other side. And um, I know what I need to change going into my next relationship of who I want to be.

• 1:16:11Alex Cooper?

  So true. Let's close out one more time with your movie, Parachute. I, I'm so inspired by you and what you are doing with the themes in this movie. Can you just give like a little final pitch to the daddy gang of like, I feel like men and women, but like specifically for the ladies listening, like, why should they see this movie and like, what do you think it will do for women when they watch?

• 1:16:42Speaker 03

  I hope it's a, it's a combination of being incredibly romantic and a beautiful love story, but something that I feel is connected to everybody. And something that maybe sheds light on a feeling you didn't know how to put into words. That would be my pie in the sky, I hope, is that you maybe feel like this, but you didn't know how to, to formulate that until you saw it. And I've, I think my biggest compliment that I've gotten from people seeing the movie, specifically men who don't have to have these issues as, as most, as many women.

• 1:17:21Speaker 03

  They say to me, wow, I, you know, my sister has this, my mom had this, my whatever, or you know, guys too. But I didn't understand it and now I have a little bit more context of how painful it is. And it's changed my perspective on it.

• 1:17:35Alex Cooper?

  It's fucking amazing.

• 1:17:37Speaker 03

  That's what I would hope.

• 1:17:37Alex Cooper?

  Again, I, I think what's fun about having conversations like this is like, the struggles that you've had through your life and everything of like you sitting here earlier being like, there was a point where like, I didn't know if I could keep going. Going through something that's also so relatable and heartbreaking and divorce and like, all these like very humanistic struggles that we all can relate to. I think it's encouraging to see you sitting here right now being like, I'm figuring it out. Cause that, there is, you know, there are someone that literally, one of those things is happening to them right now and this interview could be something that they're like, alright, I'm gonna keep pushing. Cause I just watched Brittany and

• 1:18:19Alex Cooper?

  goddamn, look where she's at and that can be me in a year. So, thank you so much for coming on and talking with me and you're the shit and

• 1:18:27Speaker 03

  You're the shit.

• 1:18:28Alex Cooper?

  Thank you so much for coming on.

• 1:18:29Speaker 03

  Thank you so much for having me. This was awesome.

• 1:18:30Alex Cooper?

  No, seriously, thank you.

• 1:18:46Alex Cooper?

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