Jackie Tohn Returns

Jackie Tohn (Nobody Wants This, The Boys, GLOW) is an actress, comedian, and musician. Jackie joins Armchair Expert to discuss growing up on Long Island with two gym-teacher parents, discovering her BRCA mutation after her father’s cancer diagnosis, and becoming an advocate for genetic testing and preventative care. Jackie and Dax talk about clawing through Hollywood as a musician and comic, learning to pivot instead of wait for permission, and finally being able to calm down after Nobody Wants This. Jackie explains the exhaustion of making life-or-death choices, how anxiety changes once the thing you fear actually happens, and the freedom of not having to be “on” for every room. Check Allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds: https://www.allstate.com/ See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dax Shepard?

  Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Lily Padman.

• 0:03Speaker 01

  Hi.

• 0:04Dax Shepard?

  Hi. We have a friend in today.

• 0:06Speaker 01

  Our friend is here.

• 0:07Dax Shepard?

  She's returning.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 0:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, returning guest Jackie Tone. Jackie Tone is an actor and a musician. Nobody Wants This, Glow, The Boys, Gen V. We didn't even talk about The Boys with her. I love seeing her on The Boys because I'm obsessed with The Boys. I forget she's on it. Yeah, so she pops up and it's a pop out and I love it.

• 0:26Speaker 01

  Fun. Pop outs are fun.

• 0:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and she's here today and she's telling a very, very personal story that she's gone through simultaneously to all this wonderful stuff.

• 0:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 0:36Dax Shepard?

  And it's a harrowing tale. Please enjoy Jackie Tone. We get support from Quince.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  I have to say, I am so ready for fall. I want sweaters. I've been craving a true crisp morning where I actually need a jacket. I can't wait.

• 0:51Dax Shepard?

  I'm fully there. The second it dips below 70, I'm like, this is my season. Give me the layers, give me the boots, give me a reason to wear something other than a t-shirt. And honestly, that's why I love Quince because fall is when your wardrobe actually has to show up. And everything at Quince is 50 to 80% less than similar brands. We're talking 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters, starting at $60.

• 1:14Speaker 01

  $60. $60 for cashmere that you'd expect from a luxury brand without the luxury price tag. It's amazing. Gets me every time. It really shouldn't be real, but it is because they go straight to the factories, they skip the middlemen, and they just hand you the savings. The stuff isn't trendy. It's the kind of pieces you grab over and over because they work every time.

• 1:31Dax Shepard?

  The 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters for me are it. When I look at Steve McQueen, this man owned a couple of sweaters he wore all the time and he looks iconic.

• 1:40Speaker 01

  It's a uniform.

• 1:42Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:42Speaker 01

  And Quince isn't just about the clothes. They have hotel quality bedding, cookware, bath essentials, thoughtfully designed furniture. You can really go there and outfit your entire apartment or house. So if you're in need of any kind of fall refresh at home too, same quality, same attention to detail for every corner of your life.

• 2:00Dax Shepard?

  Find your next fall favorites at Quince. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day return. Now available in Canada and the UK too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was Armchair Expert. It's the best way to support the show. We get support from AG1. Fall is that time when your body and mind are getting ready for the winter. You're settling in, bracing for the cold. Your body's already running a deficit from the shorter days and broken sleep patterns. You don't want a nutrient deficit stacked on top of that, too.

• 2:36Speaker 01

  That's where your AG1 routine earns its spot. It's not fixing your sleep or your alarm time. It's giving your body what it needs so the dark mornings don't tank you before you even start. One scoop, cold water every morning before anything else.

• 2:48Dax Shepard?

  AG1 Next Gen has 75 plus ingredients, vitamins, minerals, pre and probiotics, superfoods, backed by four separate gold standard clinical trials. Key nutrient levels improved with three months of consistent use.

• 3:02Speaker 01

  That's the part people miss. It's not a one day fix. It's what happens when you stay consistent.

• 3:06Dax Shepard?

  It's an easy, everyday thing. I've added it to my morning routine and I'm going to tell you, I actually love the taste of it. It's like Pavlovian. I drink it and I know I'm going to get that little vitamin buzz.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  Well, that's also the thing. When you do it first thing in the morning, you already feel kind of self-esteem because you're like, I already did something good for myself.

• 3:24Dax Shepard?

  Yes. Go to drinkag1.com/dax and for a limited time, get a free immunity bundle, including a bottle of omega-3 fish oil and a bottle of vitamin D3K2 with your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro. That's drinkag1.com/dax. And after checkout, be sure to let them know that Armchair Expert sent you.

• 4:06Speaker 02

  This motherfucker.

• 4:07Speaker 01

  This motherfucker.

• 4:09Dax Shepard?

  Hi ladies.

• 4:10Speaker 01

  Hi sir. Is that a new shirt?

• 4:13Dax Shepard?

  It's an old shirt.

• 4:14Speaker 01

  Oh my god, it's a new old shirt.

• 4:15Dax Shepard?

  It's a new old shirt.

• 4:16Speaker 02

  It's explicitly not a new shirt.

• 4:19Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 4:19Speaker 01

  But it's new to me.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 4:21Dax Shepard?

  Do you have a new shirt on?

• 4:22Speaker 01

  I do have a new shirt on.

• 4:23Dax Shepard?

  You always have a new shirt on. And you guys have very similar shirts.

• 4:28Speaker 02

  I know we didn't even. Very similar costumes today. I almost didn't have a bra under mine when I thought, we're talking about the new yitters, maybe I should have a bra on.

• 4:36Speaker 01

  Well, or maybe you should've, you know, to go either way.

• 4:38Dax Shepard?

  I kind of feel like you should've gone raw dog on me.

• 4:41Speaker 02

  Oh god, well, there's still time. In the middle, feel free. Never know. Although it is like yours, it's the almost exact same material. It is see-through. You will see them.

• 4:49Dax Shepard?

  Oh great.

• 4:50Speaker 02

  It's not just like, if I wore that shirt, you'd see the nips.

• 4:52Speaker 01

  Well, we want these numbers.

• 4:53Dax Shepard?

  We want to see them, you know, we want to see the bra. We want to see your bra.

• 4:58Speaker 02

  I have to apologize, guys. I made a huge mistake. Not by coming here, but by, yeah.

• 5:03Dax Shepard?

  What's funny is there was a half moment where you were saying, "We have the same," and you were about to say, "material," to Monica. But I was like, "Hold on, what is she about to say? We have the same breasts now?"

• 5:17Speaker 02

  No.

• 5:18Dax Shepard?

  Like, I was wondering if that's where it was going.

• 5:20Speaker 02

  No.

• 5:21Speaker 01

  Well, there is a bit of a size difference.

• 5:24Speaker 02

  Are we D, we double D?

• 5:26Speaker 01

  We double.

• 5:26Speaker 02

  Oh yeah.

• 5:27Dax Shepard?

  Are we doubling our Ds?

• 5:30Speaker 02

  I used to be a 32D, believe it or not, them yitters. But now they're a B.

• 5:36Dax Shepard?

  Wait, hold on.

• 5:37Speaker 02

  They're smaller.

• 5:38Dax Shepard?

  You had 32D. We've known each other for...

• 5:41Speaker 02

  But here's what's crazy.

• 5:42Speaker 01

  Jackie had big, yeah.

• 5:43Dax Shepard?

  18 years.

• 5:43Speaker 02

  I will say, that makes me want to cry and feel excited at the same time, so...

• 5:47Dax Shepard?

  What, 18 years?

• 5:48Speaker 02

  Yeah. I don't know what you're talking about. That's not a real number. I'm 17, so having known someone 18, the math sort of doesn't. But my titties were from here.

• 5:56Dax Shepard?

  Okay, from the side of your rib cage, for the listener.

• 5:59Speaker 02

  Actually. Oh, we're recording?

• 6:02Dax Shepard?

  Always, yeah.

• 6:03Speaker 02

  Oh, I live. So my titty used to go from under my arm into here. And so in order for underwear not to dig into me, it had to be a D-size underwear. So it's a big, and then when I was getting my reconstruction, the doctor was like, if we went with your same width, your tits, your implants would be enormous.

• 6:24Speaker 01

  Really?

• 6:24Speaker 02

  Because my breast tissue literally was under my arm to here. And so I had these like nice wide and they were perky forever.

• 6:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 6:34Speaker 01

  Oh, do you think the width has to do with the perkiness?

• 6:37Speaker 02

  I do because there's so much, it's not like a little.

• 6:39Dax Shepard?

  There's so much lateral support.

• 6:41Speaker 02

  Yes, you have the lateral support, you have the whole rib cage sort of getting behind you.

• 6:45Speaker 01

  This is science.

• 6:46Dax Shepard?

  Counter theory.

• 6:48Speaker 02

  Please.

• 6:48Dax Shepard?

  Just you look at people, look at Monica's face, like, okay.

• 6:53Speaker 01

  I want to hear your counter.

• 6:55Dax Shepard?

  This gonna be.

• 6:55Speaker 01

  To the science Jackie just showed us.

• 6:57Dax Shepard?

  First of all, you guys are probably right. So I'm not saying that this would invalidate that theory. It's just, you see humans, we come in a lot of variety and there's just taut skin and loose skin. I've been fortunate enough to have been with enough nude ladies. I've seen a lot of different body types. And I, I wonder if it's just like an elasticity in your skin that you have a lot of or you don't.

• 7:20Speaker 02

  I don't know the answer and I don't think that that's invalidating what we're saying at all.

• 7:24Dax Shepard?

  Maybe some combination.

• 7:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, combo. I will also say, of course, I already knew, I was like, I'm going to come on this podcast and say too much because these are my people. But the doctor said to me, she was like, well, the good news is you're in your 40s, you'll get a little lift, they'll be perky for the rest of your life.

• 7:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:40Speaker 02

  And then I took my shirt off and she was like, okay, so not as much for you.

• 7:46Dax Shepard?

  We're not going to get as much vertical lift.

• 7:47Speaker 01

  That's a compliment.

• 7:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 7:50Speaker 02

  But she was like, okay.

• 7:52Speaker 01

  They were going to droop to the floor.

• 7:53Speaker 02

  And I was like, no, the girls have stayed put. God bless them.

• 7:56Speaker 01

  I know.

• 7:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 7:57Speaker 02

  There's a lot of things genetically I was not gifted with.

• 8:00Dax Shepard?

  And a lot you were.

• 8:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:01Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 8:02Dax Shepard?

  Yes, you're very attractive, you're very witty, you're very fast, you have a good voice. In fact, as we make this list, it's almost hard to feel bad for whatever.

• 8:11Speaker 02

  Wow, that's true.

• 8:11Speaker 01

  It feels like you kind of tricked us into giving you a lot of compliments.

• 8:15Speaker 02

  I did and we're staring into each other's eyes and I'll have it no other way. I'm going to put my lip on.

• 8:19Dax Shepard?

  Okay, put your lip on.

• 8:21Speaker 01

  Since you love physics.

• 8:23Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh, I do.

• 8:24Speaker 01

  So much.

• 8:25Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah. I'm a physics nerd.

• 8:28Speaker 01

  It looks really nice. I think Jackie's theory really makes sense. I believe it, because mine are also wide.

• 8:35Dax Shepard?

  I believe it.

• 8:36Speaker 02

  I remember doing a play years ago, and you know, like, you don't know what your friends, I mean, you have an idea what your friends tits looks like, but you really don't know.

• 8:43Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 8:44Speaker 02

  And then I did a play, and all the girls backstage were like, I can't believe those are your tits.

• 8:50Dax Shepard?

  Oh, people were really stopping and, yeah.

• 8:53Speaker 02

  So I learned in my twenties, like, oh, and then I saw everyone else's, and they were gorgeous to me.

• 9:00Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 9:00Speaker 02

  But definitely shaped differently than my personal yitters.

• 9:04Dax Shepard?

  Isn't it so stressful, our body parts? Like, at first, you're a girl, and you're like, I must, I must, I must increase my bust. You want knockers. But now, how buoyant are the knockers? What are the areola sizes? How long are the nip? Like, there's a million.

• 9:18Speaker 02

  Are they banana shaped?

• 9:19Dax Shepard?

  Yes, how misshapen are they? They're all gonna be a little asymmetrical.

• 9:23Speaker 01

  Skis?

• 9:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, those are great. We call them ski slopes or bananas. It's great. It's where the breast kind of just naturally comes up at the end.

• 9:31Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 9:31Dax Shepard?

  That's fun. That's exciting.

• 9:33Speaker 02

  It's super funny.

• 9:34Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, a lot of guys I know covet ski slopes. I don't even know why ski slopes work, because if you think about a ski slope just down, it should be ski jump.

• 9:42Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 9:42Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, downhill long jump.

• 9:44Speaker 02

  Of course. I think the catchy way to call it is a downhill long jump. That's right. That's right.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  I think it's a respectful way.

• 9:51Dax Shepard?

  Definitely.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  A respectful verbage for it.

• 9:55Dax Shepard?

  But the amount of stress we all have over our body parts, because it's like, you have a penis. Of course, as a boy, you want the biggest one among your friends. Immediately, you understand that's the goal. No one sits you down and tells you that, but those penises come out, and everyone's like, most drawn, like backstage at your play. All eyes go to the biggest penis.

• 10:15Speaker 02

  And you're just like, oh, shit.

• 10:17Dax Shepard?

  Guys are pumped. Yeah, wow, look at this, you know. And then you have the shape of your erection. That's its own.

• 10:24Speaker 02

  It's own thing.

• 10:24Dax Shepard?

  It's its own journey.

• 10:25Speaker 02

  Also balls.

• 10:26Dax Shepard?

  Balls.

• 10:27Speaker 02

  Oh my God. I remember when I was a teenager, I had a friend who had like enormous balls.

• 10:32Dax Shepard?

  Oh yeah, chimp.

• 10:33Speaker 02

  And his name was Brandon and he showed everybody all the time. We look back and obviously I think this would all be very not okay now. But it was like, someone would be like, yo, you gotta show everybody your balls. And he would just open up his zipper and take him out of his zipper and put him in his hand.

• 10:47Dax Shepard?

  He was good at it.

• 10:48Speaker 02

  He was good.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  How big were they?

• 10:49Speaker 02

  Fucking huge.

• 10:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 10:51Speaker 02

  Really big balls.

• 10:52Dax Shepard?

  Okay, now, now let me ask.

• 10:54Speaker 01

  Hanging balls.

• 10:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. Does that do anything to you? It doesn't, right?

• 11:00Speaker 02

  No.

• 11:00Dax Shepard?

  Like it doesn't, you don't think there's a primitive level?

• 11:02Speaker 02

  No.

• 11:02Dax Shepard?

  Let's just start with eight, great eight.

• 11:04Speaker 01

  Because there's so much semen in there?

• 11:05Dax Shepard?

  Great eight.

• 11:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:06Dax Shepard?

  If you're in a competitive breeding situation like chimps are, they don't know who's who's. They're all competing and everyone's fucking. The balls are enormous. They have the biggest balls mass ratio of any primate, right? The gorilla, which is enormous, can't even find them. They're two little peas because he's not competing with any other males. He's in charge. He has access to all the females. And so that predicts the balls is how much competition there is. So do you think in some primitive level, when you see those, well, this is what we were hoping as guys, but I'm learning now is not the case. You would see those enormous plums and go like, well, there's a fit.

• 11:41Speaker 01

  There's a lot of babies in there.

• 11:43Speaker 02

  You know what though? This semen could be, you know, fragmented.

• 11:46Speaker 01

  Rancid.

• 11:47Speaker 02

  Crooked. Could it just be all?

• 11:49Dax Shepard?

  Crooked come.

• 11:50Speaker 02

  It could be crooked come.

• 11:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:51Speaker 02

  It's a condition. Shoot completely that way. It never really gets in.

• 11:54Speaker 01

  That's so right.

• 11:56Speaker 02

  Direct straight to your asshole.

• 11:57Dax Shepard?

  He's in you, yet you're like, God, I'm getting my hair.

• 11:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 12:00Dax Shepard?

  It's in my hair.

• 12:02Speaker 01

  Oh my God, this episode is a mess. But on the flip side, two tiny pea sized balls then, like the gorillas also then kind of is high status. It's like, my balls are so small, I get, I get to pick where the semen goes.

• 12:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 12:20Dax Shepard?

  These guys are all shooting it out, like the old west from the hip.

• 12:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, because they have to.

• 12:24Dax Shepard?

  Spray, spray, spray.

• 12:25Speaker 02

  Spray, spray, spray.

• 12:25Speaker 01

  They have to.

• 12:26Dax Shepard?

  Well, I covet that guy's balls. What was his name? Brandon?

• 12:28Speaker 02

  Brandon.

• 12:29Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I wonder. They've held up.

• 12:30Speaker 02

  I would say they're probably like, don't you feel similar to, no. You got that weight on that scrotum and it's gotta be pulling them down.

• 12:40Dax Shepard?

  And the scrotum's so interesting because the scrotum's all over the place. It decides how long it wants to be, whatever the temperature is. So you don't even know if you have perky or saggy balls. It's like, ask me the temp.

• 12:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, the temp. Am I Colorado or am I fetus?

• 12:53Dax Shepard?

  Am I in Hawaii?

• 12:54Speaker 02

  Truly.

• 12:54Dax Shepard?

  They're long.

• 12:56Speaker 01

  It's calling nipples, I guess. They change.

• 12:58Dax Shepard?

  But isn't it sad? I feel bad for all of us, the stress over your areolas and the perkiness and the size. And you even said D cup thing, but maybe you're.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  And my whole life, people were like, there's no way you're a D. I'm like, check my bra tag. I don't know what to tell you.

• 13:14Dax Shepard?

  But you could just wear a G, right? And be like, check my bra.

• 13:18Speaker 02

  There's just so much room. The front fabric is like a sail. It's just like so much fabric. Yeah, exactly.

• 13:25Dax Shepard?

  You have a Birkin bag in your bra.

• 13:27Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 13:27Speaker 01

  Oh, like a Mary Poppins itch.

• 13:29Dax Shepard?

  We're fast forwarding, so let's catch up because that actually was one of my questions. And you've kind of already answered it, but alas. Tell us how you even discovered that you had the BRCA.

• 13:40Speaker 02

  Tell us why you're here.

• 13:41Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, B R C A one.

• 13:43Speaker 02

  Okay, my friends, it's nice to see you both. And I think, wow, we can start recording now. And we can go ahead and just turn the.

• 13:50Dax Shepard?

  Hit the record button.

• 13:51Speaker 02

  And the button that records it and go ahead and start that now. And then I start acting totally different. Well, thank you guys so much for having me here today. You know, I think it's really.

• 13:59Dax Shepard?

  Important that I spread this message of healing and journeying in my health.

• 14:03Speaker 02

  That too, and wise assery.

• 14:06Dax Shepard?

  Let's start with your parents.

• 14:07Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 14:07Dax Shepard?

  That seems like the appropriate phrase to start. We've had you many times and I'm sure we covered them a little bit, but both physical ed teachers. Yes, in Long Island. They were teaching in Brooklyn.

• 14:17Speaker 02

  They were teaching in Brooklyn, but I grew up on Long Island, so my parents are the best. And unlike so many Jewish families, cancer wasn't in the genes. We didn't think. Heart disease, we've talked about this, our dads, heart disease, stroke, high blood pressure.

• 14:31Dax Shepard?

  Any number of psychosomatic conditions.

• 14:33Speaker 02

  Oh, please. And actually psycho conditions and meds and anxieties, but all of it. And so last year, my dad found these lumps under his arm, which my mom, for the first few months, only called nodules. I think Jews have an aversion to saying the thing with the scary name. She was just like, and so daddy has these, daddy found these.

• 14:54Dax Shepard?

  Your father's nodules are back.

• 14:56Speaker 02

  Oh boy.

• 14:57Dax Shepard?

  We got a call this morning. Who was it? Your father's nodules.

• 15:01Speaker 02

  Your father's nodules. They called on the phone. I said, wow. So my dad found these bumps under his arm. And then by the time they were like, let's just get them out and we'll biopsy them. It turned out they were metastatic carcinomas. And we were like, what? Oh, okay.

• 15:17Dax Shepard?

  Metastatic means the cancer's traveled away from the original site of origin, right?

• 15:21Speaker 02

  And what's crazy is to this day, they cannot find the original site of origin. So he's some medical enigma where he has metastatic carcinomas that they do not know where they metastasized from.

• 15:34Speaker 01

  Oh, I love medical marvels.

• 15:35Dax Shepard?

  Why don't they think it's just breast cancer?

• 15:38Speaker 02

  They kind of do now.

• 15:39Dax Shepard?

  Okay, okay, okay.

• 15:40Speaker 02

  They kind of do now, but also if it's breast cancer, then they're not metastatic. It's just breast cancer.

• 15:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:46Speaker 02

  But for some reason, they know it's metastatic.

• 15:48Dax Shepard?

  So that must look different or something?

• 15:51Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 15:51Dax Shepard?

  Can I add a weird, interesting thing?

• 15:53Speaker 02

  You better.

• 15:53Dax Shepard?

  We talked to someone recently about extra nipples. And what we found out is that when people have those extra nipples, they often grow in the armpit. They're not like on your pec or your breast.

• 16:05Speaker 02

  Interesting.

• 16:06Dax Shepard?

  They're generally in your armpit, upper arm. This person had like two nipples.

• 16:10Speaker 01

  Breast tissue. It's just like a high up there.

• 16:12Speaker 02

  Additional breast tissue.

• 16:13Speaker 01

  Exactly. And they lactate.

• 16:15Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, that's where the nipples grew and they're functional.

• 16:19Speaker 01

  They're functional.

• 16:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. So anyways.

• 16:21Speaker 02

  So he finds this out. They can't figure out where the primary cancer is. And so he does this panel of genetic testing because if he's positive for this, it more likely would be pancreatic. If he's positive for this, it more likely would be colon. And he came back as BRCA positive, B R C A one positive.

• 16:40Dax Shepard?

  Tell us what that is.

• 16:41Speaker 02

  BRCA is a genetic mutation and you are positive. So I believe everybody has the BRCA gene. But I'm positive for a mutation of the BRCA gene that then unfortunately gives you a very high predetermination, very high chance of getting BRCA for women, breast and ovarian cancer. My dad tests positive. They say to him, tell your kids to get tested. Because if you have a daughter, that's really where the problem is. Men, often it doesn't even materialize.

• 17:14Speaker 01

  Really?

• 17:15Speaker 02

  There's an increased chance.

• 17:16Dax Shepard?

  But when you don't have ovaries or breasts.

• 17:18Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 17:18Dax Shepard?

  Except for your father, who might have extra nipples under his armpit.

• 17:21Speaker 01

  Did he get his nodules removed?

• 17:22Speaker 02

  He did.

• 17:23Speaker 01

  Then he was fine.

• 17:24Speaker 02

  Well, then he did radiation and I have the little video of him ringing the bell. And so he was like, they did a full CAT scan, PET scan, all the scans, cancer free.

• 17:33Speaker 01

  Great.

• 17:34Speaker 02

  And yet it metastasized somewhere.

• 17:36Speaker 01

  Strange. I get tested, I'm BRCA positive. And then I'm like, all right. I don't Google, I'm not Googling. I'm hypochondriac, I'm an erotic.

• 17:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, let's pause for half a second because, yeah, we need to know your disposition a little bit. We, you know this famous story. Monica and I were watching Kristen read her results from her 23andMe. She misread it, but she truly believed this. She's like, oh, I have early onset Alzheimer's thing, okay. And then, oh, I have the BRCA gene and then, oh yeah, mostly Polish.

• 18:08Speaker 01

  There was another one too. There were three horrible, horrible.

• 18:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, the ones, you almost don't want to take the test.

• 18:15Speaker 01

  Oh, we, oh, I have early onset Alzheimer's. Oh, I have BRCA. Oh, I have palsy or something, whatever. And then, oh man, I do that cilantro thing. It's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

• 18:29Dax Shepard?

  We've never seen anyone take news like this in our lives to this day. She was nonplussed.

• 18:36Speaker 02

  Is she really BRCA positive?

• 18:37Speaker 01

  No.

• 18:38Dax Shepard?

  No, she misread her thing, but she sincerely.

• 18:42Speaker 02

  Thought she was.

• 18:43Dax Shepard?

  Yes. And we got to see the real reaction. We were like, oh my God, we're kind of bracing for like, wait, we're gonna lose you in 18 months. So Parkinson's, Alzheimer's.

• 18:52Speaker 01

  That's what it was.

• 18:52Speaker 02

  We have a couple of months.

• 18:54Dax Shepard?

  Yes, let's start planning.

• 18:56Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 18:57Speaker 02

  It was, girls, girls come in here.

• 18:59Dax Shepard?

  I set her as like the far end of a spectrum.

• 19:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 19:02Dax Shepard?

  Right? And then, so where are you at on that spectrum?

• 19:06Speaker 02

  Well, I'm very proud of myself because I realized. As I think a lot of us do, when you are imagining something happening to you, you can catastrophize. You can have anxiety about it. You can be hysterical crying about it. And then the thing happens to you, and I was a machine.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:25Speaker 02

  Joe and I were supposed to go to England, Ireland and Scotland last summer, and we canceled the trip. And I went on a tour of Los Angeles, meeting the doctors that this oncologist told me I would need. I say that it's like someone handing you a nail and being like, build the house. And you're like, who?

• 19:46Speaker 02

  Where is the plot of land?

• 19:48Dax Shepard?

  Where's the what?

• 19:49Speaker 02

  Where's the how? Yeah. So that's basically what happened. They were like, you are BRCA positive, I found out. Good luck. And then a couple of days later, the doctor's office calls to schedule a surgery. And I'm like, what surgery? I just have this gene.

• 20:03Speaker 01

  Right.

• 20:03Speaker 02

  My dad got the nodules. My dad got the metastatic carcinoma's removed. Like, what surgery? Then I start really crying.

• 20:10Speaker 01

  Right.

• 20:11Speaker 02

  And then I find out that I need a gynecological oncologist, which is not a combination of terms I'm interested in.

• 20:18Speaker 01

  Right. Yeah.

• 20:19Speaker 02

  A regular oncologist to holistically look at the whole thing. A breast surgeon, a breast plastic surgeon, because those are two completely different jobs. The person that removes the tissue and the person that does the reconstruction.

• 20:30Dax Shepard?

  Do they leave you open while they just clock in? It's like tag team wrestling?

• 20:35Speaker 02

  It is like tag team wrestling.

• 20:36Dax Shepard?

  I just don't want them opening you up twice.

• 20:39Speaker 02

  This is a very interesting thing that I actually am excited to talk about, which is, you can do the surgery two different ways. Then the fifth doctor, because of course there's more than four, the fifth doctor is a genetic counselor. And it was the genetic counselor, this rad woman at Providence, who she looked at all my genetics and everything that they tested for. And she was who deemed that I had an 85% chance of breast cancer and a 65% chance of ovarian cancer. So I'm doing the ovaries soon, but I haven't done them yet. And I did the boobs first.

• 21:13Dax Shepard?

  Top down.

• 21:14Speaker 02

  Top down.

• 21:14Dax Shepard?

  Top down, yeah.

• 21:15Speaker 02

  That's why they called me a convertible in high school.

• 21:18Dax Shepard?

  You didn't know why until now.

• 21:19Speaker 02

  They knew this time would come.

• 21:20Speaker 01

  Wait, what a thing.

• 21:22Dax Shepard?

  That was good.

• 21:23Speaker 01

  Oh my God, that was really good, Jackie.

• 21:24Dax Shepard?

  Back to your assets.

• 21:25Speaker 02

  I love you guys. I love you guys. It's just genetics. So then I get these numbers and now, well, now I understand why the doctor's office called and said, when do you want to schedule your surgery? Your girl has 100 fucking percent chance.

• 21:39Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 21:39Speaker 02

  Eighty-five, I just, I get chills every time. And I start to sweat. Eighty-five percent.

• 21:47Dax Shepard?

  It's not a great number.

• 21:48Speaker 02

  Even 50/50, you go like, alright, I gotta get this done soon. Eighty-five, you're like, but glass half full, it is a number that you can't ignore. That makes me want to cry. That was exactly how I looked at it.

• 21:58Dax Shepard?

  Wait, repeat that? I got distracted six minutes ago with your convertible joke. Cause it was so good.

• 22:03Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 22:04Dax Shepard?

  And I thought there was another version of it. And then I was distracted by that. I'm owning it and I'm apologizing.

• 22:09Speaker 02

  I appreciate that.

• 22:10Dax Shepard?

  I was gonna say that, I thought they called you gas pump, cause you like to top off.

• 22:14Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 22:15Dax Shepard?

  Okay, sorry.

• 22:16Speaker 02

  Well, glad we got that out.

• 22:17Dax Shepard?

  We just wanted to get in a bit, a bit, you know, a bit blasting. And it was terrible, okay, sorry, sorry, sorry.

• 22:24Speaker 01

  No, I just said, glass half full is eighty-five is a number that you can't ignore.

• 22:29Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 22:29Speaker 01

  So you can't just be like, oh, maybe I'll deal with it, maybe not, no, you're dealing with it.

• 22:32Speaker 02

  And that's exactly the silver lining I looked at. Cause I said with my neuroses and my mental shit, you're giving me a number like forty-five?

• 22:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:41Speaker 02

  I'm going.

• 22:42Dax Shepard?

  Oh, you could go crazy.

• 22:43Speaker 02

  I could do advanced screening for years. They said before we do the double mastectomy, we want to make sure you don't already have cancer. So we're gonna give you an MRI. And then I found out that they didn't like what the MRI looked like on my way to present at the Creative Arts Emmys.

• 23:01Speaker 01

  Ah.

• 23:01Speaker 02

  So I'm in the car.

• 23:03Speaker 01

  You shouldn't be picking up the phone.

• 23:04Speaker 02

  I shouldn't have been picking up the phone, but these doctors are really hard to reach.

• 23:07Speaker 01

  Oh, true, yeah, you're right.

• 23:08Speaker 02

  And she said she'd call either way, so I didn't think it was a thing of only calling with bad news. Also, if I saw I missed a call, I would have been so fucking preoccupied.

• 23:16Speaker 01

  You're right.

• 23:16Speaker 02

  So I was like, I just answered. And she was like, I think everything's gonna be okay, but I don't know. And there's some suspicious cellular groupings, and I think we want to do another MRI. So I was scared and then I went and presented.

• 23:29Dax Shepard?

  How'd you present? Were you good?

• 23:30Speaker 02

  I think I've smashed it because I might be a psychopath.

• 23:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 23:35Speaker 02

  I've asked my therapist.

• 23:36Dax Shepard?

  You're a compartmentalizer.

• 23:38Speaker 02

  I mean, that's great. A compartmentalizer, though, I've realized during this journey to a point of like,

• 23:42Dax Shepard?

  Sociopathy.

• 23:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 23:45Speaker 02

  Survival. Truly. But I've asked my therapist, I've been like, I don't even know, looking back, how I did it. Yeah. I just did it. I just was like, these are the doctors I'm going to, and I am a machine, and I am getting these surgeries, and I am doing this. So, cut back to, I get the MRI, she doesn't like it again, and she's like, we're gonna biopsy.

• 24:05Dax Shepard?

  She's so fuzzy this woman.

• 24:07Speaker 02

  Can I say something?

• 24:08Dax Shepard?

  What do you like about it?

• 24:09Speaker 02

  Her standards are so high. And that's the other thing, I'm like, get off my back. Yeah. So then she doesn't like it again, and now she's like, we're gonna do a biopsy.

• 24:17Dax Shepard?

  Can I ask quickly?

• 24:18Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 24:18Dax Shepard?

  Why? We're getting in there and removing everything?

• 24:21Speaker 02

  That is a good question.

• 24:22Dax Shepard?

  Just so that we would notice start chemo as well, or something?

• 24:25Speaker 02

  I think, maybe. I actually don't know the answer, but what I think the answer is, is that if you have cancer, a double mastectomy is sufficient, but sometimes you can't keep your nipples. Depending on where the cancer is, if it's right there by your nipple, you're gonna lose your nipples. And if the cancer is here, they have to really focus on getting that tissue out, and getting everything out. And also, then you have to be starting with the PET scans and CAT scans, seeing if it's anywhere else.

• 24:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, okay, okay.

• 24:57Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 24:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, alright.

• 24:59Speaker 02

  With ovaries, the challenging part is there's no good screening for ovaries. It doesn't exist. It's 2026, and the screening does not exist.

• 25:08Dax Shepard?

  Meaning, they can give you an MRI on your ovaries, or no?

• 25:11Speaker 02

  They can do an ultrasound, so pelvic ultrasound, and they put the wand in, and they do the diagnostic. The problem is, your ovaries, speaking of gorilla balls, there are these little tiny grape-sized things in your body, and they just don't have the advanced surveillance. Like, with breasts, when you get an MRI and a biopsy, you can find out if you're stage zero, stage negative one. You can find out if there's a grouping of cells that they don't like, that they're gonna keep an eye on, that they're just gonna get them out of there before you're even stage one. Right. Like, breasts surveillance is best of the best in cancer land. I wanna tell everybody about the whole journey and what to expect, because it's crazy, and I somehow made it to my 40s without... Anyone talking to me about Brocca.

• 25:54Speaker 02

  I vaguely heard that it was maybe that thing that happened with Angelina Jolie.

• 25:58Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 25:59Speaker 02

  But I remember thinking like, oh God, that's so extreme. How her. How her to be like, you know what? I'm getting them taken off completely, which is what a lot of people thought was very extreme when I was doing it.

• 26:10Dax Shepard?

  Do you think the underlying current of that is like some weird jealousy over looks like, oh yeah, you're so hot, you don't even care if you cut off your boobs.

• 26:19Speaker 02

  Maybe.

• 26:19Dax Shepard?

  Do you think that was driving the anger?

• 26:21Speaker 02

  It's very possible socially, but my thing was more like, you know, she wears like Billy Paul Thornton's blood around her neck. Like she's so edgy. But like it turns out you have a hundred percent chance of getting cancer. What are you gonna do? Leave them there? Exactly. The time bombs.

• 26:36Dax Shepard?

  Turns out she wasn't edgy. She was super safe.

• 26:38Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 26:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 26:38Speaker 02

  She was just brilliant as she is.

• 26:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 26:41Speaker 02

  So basically when I got the MRI, then I went back for a second one. Then I had to go back for a third one. And then when I got my breast biopsied, I was just unlucky. And I was waiting in the biopsy office afterward. They numb your breast and it was my right breast. And so I'm sitting there and then I feel something soaking wet at my stomach. And I look down and it's not good. I am bleeding.

• 27:09Dax Shepard?

  Ooh, from the biopsy.

• 27:11Speaker 02

  Oh my God. And they had already stitched it and closed it.

• 27:14Dax Shepard?

  And am I crazy in thinking that that's a very controlled procedure? It's done with a scope and it seems like not something that would lead to great bleeding.

• 27:22Speaker 02

  That's right. And I'm out of it because I took a Xanax before the third MRI. Cause you're in the machine for 45 minutes, claustrophobic, the crazy loud noises. You're laying on your stomach, your tits are in like a hole in the MRI bed.

• 27:34Dax Shepard?

  A trough, thank you.

• 27:35Speaker 02

  A trough. Yeah. The hitters are in a trough.

• 27:37Dax Shepard?

  Tit trough.

• 27:38Speaker 02

  And I'm in a tit trough, of course. You have my other nickname in high school. And I'm in the tit trough and they do the biopsy. I don't feel anything. Everything's fine. I'm sitting in the waiting room because this is another crazy thing. They give you a mammogram. Right after you get a breast MRI. With a biopsy.

• 27:59Dax Shepard?

  It seems reversed.

• 27:59Speaker 01

  So they're squishing it all?

• 28:01Dax Shepard?

  We should flip that order.

• 28:02Speaker 02

  So I'm waiting in the room to do the mammogram. And that's when I realized, and I am like out of it. And I'm on a chill pill and I'm terrified. And I like an episode of Grey's Anatomy. I just like run into the hallway and I'm screaming. I'm not only screaming, this is me. It's loud all the time, but I'm not screaming.

• 28:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 28:19Speaker 02

  And I'm just going like, is there a nurse? I'm bleeding. And a woman comes by with like a trash can. She runs over to me and I'm like, I need a nurse. Thank you so much. And she starts laughing a little bit. She's like, I am a nurse. These are soiled linens. I'm not a janitor. And I was like, okay. And then she takes me into some woman's office. She was like, excuse us. The nurse in the office leaves and she's like opening this thing. And someone has to come up from downstairs and restitch. And it was like a whole.

• 28:44Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 28:45Dax Shepard?

  In her office?

• 28:46Speaker 02

  In somebody's office.

• 28:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow.

• 28:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was wild.

• 28:49Speaker 01

  So it just wasn't stitched correctly.

• 28:51Speaker 02

  They were asking if I took like Advil the five days prior. Cause my blood was, and I was like, I didn't. I'm a student.

• 28:57Speaker 01

  Yes, you are, you are a student.

• 28:59Speaker 02

  Don't take Advil, I won't.

• 29:00Dax Shepard?

  Also, I'm always insulted when the first line of inquiry is like, I fucked up.

• 29:04Speaker 01

  I know.

• 29:04Dax Shepard?

  I didn't sew my own breast up.

• 29:06Speaker 02

  Thank you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I didn't have the needle and thread, right?

• 29:08Dax Shepard?

  You must have had aspirin for breakfast. Didn't you? You little piggy, you love your aspirin.

• 29:14Speaker 02

  And I added milk. Cereal.

• 29:17Dax Shepard?

  Crunch, crunch, crunch.

• 29:18Speaker 02

  Crunch, crunch. So after that experience, even though I was already set on the surgery, I was like, well, I'm not doing more of these. I'm not doing more of these MRIs, biopsies. We think we find something, we don't find something. Those weeks where I was months, because you have to wait weeks in between. That time of chills again, was the worst time of the whole thing. Except the recovery was tough, but that time was the worst because I was like, oh no. What I'm out here waving my flag about is I partnered with the genetic testing company, Myriad, that discovered the BRCA gene. This company is unbelievable and you literally spit in a tube and it comes back. It's not even a blood test with your historical from your family, your genetic mutations and these. Cancer risks.

• 30:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and you had multiple things going on, right? Because also Ashkenazi Jews are 1 in 40. So you had a lot of compounding genetics, right?

• 30:10Speaker 02

  So this is what is nuts. So Myriad or any of these genetic testing companies, insurance will cover your test if you have these three things: young, rare, multiple. So if someone in your family has cancer, young, your mom or dad, you can get this covered by insurance. If there's multiple cancers, you also qualify. And if you have a rare, like my dad, male breast cancer is considered rare.

• 30:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, obviously.

• 30:36Dax Shepard?

  First time I've ever heard of it.

• 30:37Speaker 02

  Ever.

• 30:37Dax Shepard?

  Alan.

• 30:38Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 30:38Speaker 01

  And they're still not even saying it. I think there is like, there's some stigma or something. Like they're like, they won't say that it's breast cancer.

• 30:48Speaker 02

  My mother does that enough.

• 30:50Speaker 01

  They'd rather lie and say it's a metastasized cancer. It's like, not at all.

• 30:54Speaker 02

  100%.

• 30:54Dax Shepard?

  Sounds so manly. Your cancer rode in on a Harley. Goes by the name of metastasized.

• 31:01Speaker 02

  All of this to say, there's a fourth sort of unspoken reason that you should obviously get genetic tested other than rare, multiple, and young is Ashkenazi Jew.

• 31:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:14Speaker 02

  So less than, I don't want to say the exact number because I think it changes.

• 31:18Dax Shepard?

  Forgive me. Are the Ashkenagis mostly the Russian diaspora?

• 31:23Speaker 02

  Eastern European, yeah, Russian, Eastern European. And so what's crazy is, don't quote me on this, but the point is, the number is unbelievably small of the number of people who test positive for the BRCA mutation. It's like between 0.2 and 0.3% of the population.

• 31:38Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 31:38Dax Shepard?

  Very rare.

• 31:39Speaker 02

  Nobody has this. 1 in 40 Jews.

• 31:42Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 31:42Speaker 02

  1 in 40 Ashkenazi specifically Jews.

• 31:44Dax Shepard?

  Which is 2.5%.

• 31:46Speaker 02

  I don't know if it even is.

• 31:47Dax Shepard?

  1 in 40 is 2.5%. So if your, your, your, your national average is 0.2, this is tenfold.

• 31:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's 10 times. That's exactly right. I thought you were saying Ashkenazi Jews are 2.5% of the population. And I was like, oh no, there's about 18 of us left.

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:06Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 32:11Dax Shepard?

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• 32:56Dax Shepard?

  This episode is presented by YouTube Premium. YouTube was already great, but Premium supercharges it. If you like YouTube, you'll love Premium. Try YouTube Premium for two months free at youtube.com/premium. Trial eligibility varies. Terms apply. Cancel anytime. Now let's get into today's episode. This episode is supported by Helix.

• 33:20Speaker 01

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• 33:30Dax Shepard?

  That's the dream. You just described one of my ideal fall nights.

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• 33:51Dax Shepard?

  Increasingly so.

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• 34:02Dax Shepard?

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• 34:22Speaker 01

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• 34:29Dax Shepard?

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• 35:11Dax Shepard?

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• 35:53Speaker 02

  So with Myriad, it's basically you spit in the tube and then you send it away and you get all these answers. And the reason that I really wish that I got miniature flags on Amazon, the reason that I'm out here waving the flag so hard is because I managed to get to this age and nobody said anything to me. How is that possible?

• 36:13Speaker 01

  I know.

• 36:14Speaker 02

  I will tell you a couple of things. The doctors that I used for the double mastectomy and the reconstruction, not only are they just such badasses, amazing women. Because of them and because of these genetic counselors and this amazing team that I was able to put together, I do actually feel the gratitude.

• 36:33Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. That's impressive.

• 36:34Speaker 02

  I feel. Real relief when I have my ovaries out and then all of the surgeries are behind me and I'm good to go. Even though I did already do the breasts, I am in between. Yeah. The two.

• 36:49Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so to make this trivial and not as important as it is, I am curious. If you came to me at one point and you said, okay, we're going to remove your penis. And you're going to design a new one. That's a very interesting proposition. What's that experience like?

• 37:06Speaker 02

  For so many women who messaged me, because I now talk to everybody on Instagram, asking who my doctor was and what size I went and what kind of implants I used.

• 37:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 37:16Speaker 02

  And the thing I think that's really, really oppressive about the whole diagnosis is there are 100,000 decisions. Every single thing is 5,000, everything. So it's like, which doctor you're using is so many decisions. Then you go with them and then it's like, when's the surgery? How long is the, do I do straight to implant while I'm asleep? Do I do two separate surgeries? Do I do expanders? And then do, when do I do the ovaries? I mean, that's the part that I think is fatiguing. Yeah. Every day, the amount of questions. So then I talked to a person who got the straight to implant. And then I spoke to somebody who did the two separate surgeries.

• 37:56Dax Shepard?

  How long do they wait in between if they wait?

• 37:58Speaker 02

  It's a while. For the two separate surgeries, my understanding, I didn't do this. My understanding is you get your breasts removed and then what they put in, you wake up with expanders in your skin flap, because there's no breast tissue there. And then they just keep adding, I think it's either air or water or silicone, whatever they're adding to the extender to fill out your boob. But I think there are these like, plastic things that are in there. And they feel interesting, from what I understand. You're also, apparently with the expanders, they're not like cute, round, like it's like an interesting thing there. I hear it's like a little bit. Why would anyone do that? I am afraid, I don't want to be judgmental at all. No, there's no judgment. I don't know. Right. I don't know.

• 38:43Speaker 02

  Like what the pro is. What the pro is. My understanding is that the pro often comes from doctors who say.

• 38:52Speaker 02

  Because doing the two in one is not new, but within the last 15 years. Like, it's not what they used to do.

• 38:57Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 38:58Speaker 02

  It used to absolutely be two surgeries.

• 39:00Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay, okay.

• 39:01Speaker 02

  And then, in fact, my doctor, this amazing woman, Dr. Caslith, she wrote the paper. She was like the head of plastics at Cedars for a couple of terms.

• 39:09Speaker 01

  Amazing.

• 39:10Speaker 02

  And she was like, this is doable. We don't need to be giving women two separate surgeries.

• 39:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 39:16Speaker 02

  And then there are other doctors who are like, my experience is that the healing is better and there's less chance, because there's a lot of things that can happen when you get a double mastectomy. So when you're looking into it, like necrosis is something which is terrifying. You're getting your tissue removed so close to your skin that like if they go too close to your skin, that piece of your skin dies, you could possibly need skin wrapping. There could be pain, I mean, chronic pain afterward. There's the phantom, there's something called an iron bra.

• 39:44Dax Shepard?

  Oh, no.

• 39:44Speaker 02

  So I'm looking all of this up beforehand.

• 39:46Speaker 01

  What's an iron bra?

• 39:47Speaker 02

  Your tits are so heavy. Everything is like heavy, but it's not heavy.

• 39:51Speaker 01

  It's mentally heavy.

• 39:52Speaker 02

  Oh, wow. So it's like a phantom limb or something.

• 39:55Dax Shepard?

  Pain expert.

• 39:56Speaker 01

  Fantastic episode.

• 39:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, one of the best of the year.

• 39:59Speaker 02

  Oh, I can't wait to listen. There's so many things that could happen. And speaking of gratitude, none of it happened. My tits look adorable.

• 40:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:07Speaker 02

  None of my skin is necrotic. The size was exactly right. Dr. Caslith and Dr. Richardson, they said, when they were looking, she goes, we're gonna prop you up when you're out and we're gonna put them in. And it's three women. It's her nurse and it's Dr. Richardson and Dr. Caslith. And we're gonna look at your boob and we're gonna be like, and we tried this bigger size and they just looked huge on you.

• 40:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:28Speaker 02

  And so then we went with this size. When I woke up, she was like, I hope you're happy. We made them a little bit smaller. And you know how many friends I have that said, especially with male doctors, they wake up and their tits are bigger than they agreed to.

• 40:38Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 40:40Dax Shepard?

  But also, I think the norm is, am I wrong? Women want bigger boobs. Like, you're in a unique situation.

• 40:46Speaker 01

  I was gonna stop you earlier when you said it. You said, you know, girls are like, I must, I must.

• 40:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, when they're kids.

• 40:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, when they're kids. That is not, not even my personal experience, but my experience with women. I have not heard that.

• 40:58Speaker 02

  I have a thought.

• 40:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:59Speaker 02

  When did you start growing boobs?

• 41:01Speaker 01

  Young, seventh grade.

• 41:03Speaker 02

  I didn't get my period till 10th grade. So I wore a padded bra and stuffed a little bit in ninth grade.

• 41:09Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 41:09Speaker 02

  Because I was a bored.

• 41:10Speaker 01

  Right.

• 41:11Speaker 02

  It was embarrassing. I was absolutely a plyboard.

• 41:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:15Speaker 02

  And it wasn't even real wood. It's so sad. And it was just like bad. And then I remember I wore the padded bra and boys started saying like, "Oh, you got boobs over the summer."

• 41:23Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh, sure.

• 41:24Speaker 02

  And I was like, "Okay, okay."

• 41:26Dax Shepard?

  There we go.

• 41:27Speaker 02

  I always wanted boobs because I never had them. Then there was a girl in my high school who had like triple D E G. Tiny as you. I don't know if I've ever seen it again in life.

• 41:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:36Speaker 02

  And sixteen years old.

• 41:37Speaker 01

  It's like if you are a woman or a girl who's flat, you're like, "Oh, I want some boobs." And if you have boobs, you're like, "Oh, I want less." Right. That's just the way it goes. But also, most people, I think, who get, well, I shouldn't say most. I don't know any of these percentages. Most people who get implants aren't getting double Ds. They're getting around Cs or Bs.

• 42:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, definitely now and in LA.

• 42:03Speaker 02

  Correct. It's changed.

• 42:04Dax Shepard?

  But we had thirty years where actually everyone got double Ds.

• 42:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, the only reason to get implants was like, if you're just going up a size, what's the point?

• 42:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 42:12Speaker 02

  But now, the other thing that's challenging is when you get breast implants. I was showing them pictures of the boobs that I liked and the sizes and the shape.

• 42:20Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so where did you find those pictures?

• 42:21Speaker 02

  Well, what's really funny is there's a drag queen named Bosco who's a trans woman. And she wore her real tits out on the runway of Drag Race.

• 42:29Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  And I said, "I have never seen fake boobs like this in my life." So I DM'd her.

• 42:34Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 42:35Speaker 02

  And I was like...

• 42:36Dax Shepard?

  I love your breasts.

• 42:37Speaker 02

  She wrote me right back and she sent me a picture. This is the other thing about this fucking journey. It makes me cry. The sisterhood. She wrote me right back. She sent a picture of the back of her implants card. Then when I spoke to my doctors about it, they were like, "Totally, we love that. I'm not sure how a teardrop would be on you and this." And just like, we talked all through it. And the other thing was I have friends who have breast implants. And my concern was that, because I don't have breast tissue. So when you put a breast implant, you would never. But if you did, it would go seamlessly in because you have plenty of breast tissue to go around it.

• 43:10Dax Shepard?

  Smooth out the edges.

• 43:11Speaker 02

  I could look like I have two half cantaloupes. Just round.

• 43:16Speaker 01

  Totally.

• 43:17Speaker 02

  And I was like, ooh, gagi. But there's nothing they could do. It doesn't look like that. If it does, it's because you're skinny and your rib cage, your chest bones are there.

• 43:25Speaker 01

  Right.

• 43:26Speaker 02

  This is ribs, right?

• 43:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 43:27Speaker 02

  I'm not right.

• 43:28Dax Shepard?

  Well, only one of us has made it to the semifinals on Jeopardy in this room, so.

• 43:32Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 43:32Dax Shepard?

  You can only.

• 43:34Speaker 02

  I was so confident. I was like, your ribs. And then I thought, oh, God, Dax is gonna know. That's not.

• 43:38Dax Shepard?

  No, that does feel high up for ribs, right?

• 43:40Speaker 01

  Well, like collarbone.

• 43:41Speaker 02

  Right.

• 43:42Speaker 01

  There's that.

• 43:43Speaker 02

  That whole, and so now I'm just like a genetic testing person where I'm like, we have this opportunity to find this out.

• 43:52Dax Shepard?

  Can someone just ask their normal GP, I want this test, or do you go online and order it?

• 43:56Speaker 02

  The Myriad one, you go online.

• 43:58Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 43:58Speaker 02

  It's learnmyrisk.com.

• 44:00Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 44:00Speaker 02

  It's so easy.

• 44:01Dax Shepard?

  Learnmyrisk.com.

• 44:03Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 44:03Dax Shepard?

  Go on there, you order it, you spit in the tube, you send it out, they send you back.

• 44:09Speaker 02

  Yep, and there's an app. I had my information right on the website. Oh, God, it's devastating. But you know, there's a big red plus sign in a circle and you're just like,

• 44:17Speaker 01

  Oh, boy.

• 44:17Speaker 02

  I have this.

• 44:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's the iconography for positive.

• 44:22Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 44:22Dax Shepard?

  Like a sunshine.

• 44:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, could you imagine? It's a, it's a smiling emoji with the crying. It's so happy.

• 44:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:29Speaker 02

  Hysterical laugh. It's so happy. I know that certain people, I guess, want, I don't know, they have a different theory of just like, I don't wanna know. I'll deal with it when I get there. And that's just not me, especially given that when I got my breast tissue removed, they found stuff in there. I have a screen grab of the pathology test results and the words are terrifying. Precarcinomic this and that. And when the doctor, Castle, called me with those results, she was like, almost, not shrieking, but almost like, we did it.

• 45:00Speaker 01

  Right.

• 45:02Speaker 02

  So sometimes we take people's breast tissue out and there's nothing in there and that's wonderful. And who knows if in 10 years it would have been something. Also with the RCA, they recommend you get your ovaries out before 40 and your breast removed before 40.

• 45:15Speaker 01

  Whoa.

• 45:15Speaker 02

  And I'm 45.

• 45:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:17Speaker 02

  And so it's like, you know, it becomes a borrowed time situation where you're like, uh, because the numbers increase after 40, obviously. And so she was like, there was stuff in there. We did it. That had to be one of the best days of my life. Even though I had to go through all this, I'm like, yo, that's crazy, dude.

• 45:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 45:33Speaker 01

  You're just living with it.

• 45:35Speaker 02

  And we talk about this too, which is so scary. My dad is the greatest, but my dad has been through so much shit. You know, he said, I made it this far so you could find out. He felt so bad about the bronca. I feel so bad you got this from me.

• 45:46Dax Shepard?

  Like he went shopping for it. I regret buying that. That was an impulse buy.

• 45:51Speaker 02

  I regret purposely putting that gene in you. So he was just so upset. And then when we look at the bright side, it's like, dude, you absolutely saved my life. Yeah.

• 46:01Dax Shepard?

  What's your anxiety level out of 10? Do you feel like that took it to zero? Or do you feel like, oh, I just don't like that I have that gene?

• 46:10Speaker 02

  Well, here's something which is crazy because you both know how neurotic I am. I have a friend who years ago, every single thing that ever happened to her, she had cancer in her brain. She was like, oh, my God, I have cancer. She had a really sore throat for a long time and she was like, it's 100%. I have cancer. Everything was cancer. I don't know why neither of her parents had cancer. I just was never that, not with cancer. I was just like, you know, I have nuts and I catastrophize, but it was never cancer. And so this happened, I had to recalibrate all of my mental bullshit of like, wait a minute. Now I have this thing that people get scared of their whole life. I don't, God forbid, have cancer, but I have this, you know,

• 46:49Dax Shepard?

  predisposition.

• 46:49Speaker 02

  I was gonna say proclivity.

• 46:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 46:53Speaker 01

  Isn't this like weird proclivity?

• 46:55Speaker 02

  Yes, God forbid. I love you that every time I knock you knock. I know it's gonna make me cry. I know.

• 46:59Speaker 01

  Do you know I knock? I'm a knocker.

• 47:01Speaker 02

  I'm a knocker too.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  I know. I knock all the time, but if I see you knock, I have to knock.

• 47:05Speaker 02

  It's making my heart explode. So.

• 47:06Dax Shepard?

  You guys are, yeah, you're knockers.

• 47:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:12Dax Shepard?

  Sorry. It just all, it all synthesized perfectly.

• 47:16Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 47:17Speaker 01

  Sometimes we get that.

• 47:18Dax Shepard?

  Do you guys want to think about a side podcast called Knockers?

• 47:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course I do. Oh, my God, that'd be great. Just like the sisterhood of the traveling tits of it all. One of my best friends, Ilse, I told her about this diagnosis and she was like, oh, my friend has this. Do you want to talk to her? And I was like, yeah, more than anything. So my whole life became, I met up with this woman, Nina. We sit down at Alfred on Ventura Boulevard. And I am kinda hysterical and I don't know what to expect. But now I've learned my numbers and I'm like, oh, I gotta do this. So now I'm looking for a medical team. I'm past that weird month where I didn't know if I was just gonna do advanced surveillance, as they call it. And I'm sitting down and I have tears in my eyes and she goes, let's go to your car. And I go, oh, okay, cuz I'm crying. And she goes, no, I'm gonna show you my boobs.

• 48:04Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 48:05Speaker 02

  And I think it'll make you feel better because they're outrageous.

• 48:09Dax Shepard?

  You're gonna love what you see.

• 48:10Speaker 02

  Baby.

• 48:11Speaker 01

  You're gonna wanna buy.

• 48:12Dax Shepard?

  You're gonna like the way you look.

• 48:12Speaker 02

  You're gonna like the way you look. So we went to the car. She lifts up her shirt and they're gorgeous.

• 48:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:18Speaker 02

  And they don't look fake at all. And they're just perky and her nipples were, and I was like, you got to keep, I didn't know.

• 48:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 48:25Speaker 02

  And she goes, oh, yeah. If you're getting preventative double mastectomy and you don't have cancer, which is why they do the testing, then you can largely keep your nipples.

• 48:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:36Speaker 02

  So my boobs look the same as they did before.

• 48:38Dax Shepard?

  This is very personal, but sensitivity, have we lost any sensitivity?

• 48:42Speaker 02

  Almost all.

• 48:43Dax Shepard?

  But that could return.

• 48:45Speaker 02

  It could return. I had a facial a couple of days ago and the woman was at my house and I felt her pull the sheet up and my tits were out. I didn't know.

• 48:54Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 48:56Dax Shepard?

  This could lead to all kinds of funny future.

• 48:59Speaker 01

  That's wild.

• 49:00Dax Shepard?

  Wardrobe malfunctions that you don't know about.

• 49:02Speaker 02

  I asked Kristen, whatever press we just did, I had a low cut thing and I said, let me know if my tits out. I won't know.

• 49:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:08Speaker 02

  I will not know.

• 49:09Speaker 01

  Okay, we're just gonna need to be using a lot of the tape.

• 49:11Speaker 02

  A lot of the tape and a lot of friendship of just being like, bub, bub, bub, bub, bub, bub.

• 49:14Speaker 01

  Even the nipple, you can't feel?

• 49:15Speaker 02

  No, no, especially the nipple. Nothing.

• 49:17Speaker 01

  So if we punched you?

• 49:19Speaker 02

  Baby, let's go.

• 49:20Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 49:21Dax Shepard?

  Like if you had to get punched.

• 49:25Dax Shepard?

  But I bet many surgeries, as you know, yeah, my whole shoulder was completely dead. Like the whole left upper quadrant of my body was just like zero feeling from all the nerves that were cut. They've all come back, unfortunately. Now I need to get one cut, but they all came back. So you might be shocked.

• 49:42Speaker 02

  And these doctors, they're out of this place called the Bedford Breast Center. That's all they do. They're just boobs all day. They're not at a hospital and there's like random plastic surgery they do. It's the Bedford Breast Center. Yeah. And so, not that it's experimental, but not all places do this. They do nerve sparing. There's an extra hour and a half added to my surgery because they reconnected nerves after they were cut. And I was like, is that going to equal phantom pain? And they were like, no, it actually lessens the chance of phantom pain. And so I can feel like here a little bit now. And it'll be exciting when I'll be like, oh, and this girl Nina, who famously showed me her boobs immediately, said she was so excited, like a year later, she was like, "Oh, I ran into the kitchen and I told my husband. I'm like, Evan, I feel my nipple."

• 50:24Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 50:24Speaker 01

  Okay, I have a question. So overall anxiety, this could go either way because you are an anxious person, as am I.

• 50:30Speaker 02

  Queen.

• 50:31Speaker 01

  I feel like I always thought, you know, something could be wrong or something might be wrong. And then when I have my seizures and I got diagnosed with epilepsy.

• 50:40Speaker 02

  I'm on the edge today. Everything's going to make me cry.

• 50:43Speaker 01

  Well.

• 50:43Speaker 02

  That's just so hard. I know. It's so hard. Okay.

• 50:46Speaker 01

  But it really helped my anxiety because I was like, oh.

• 50:49Speaker 02

  The fuck is wrong with me?

• 50:51Speaker 01

  It was like, oh, for one, it was like, I knew something was wrong. And then now it's vindicated first. Now it's vindicated. And then it's like, oh, but that bad thing, like the idea of having a seizure and then it's like, oh, I did have it and I'm fine.

• 51:03Speaker 02

  This is exactly what I was saying before.

• 51:04Speaker 01

  It helps in a weird way.

• 51:06Speaker 02

  This catastrophizing in life that we do, when you actually have the thing that you're terrified of, and you figure out the steps to get through it and you're better on the other side. If someone told me a year and a half ago that you're going to have an 85% chance of getting it, I don't know what I would have done. But then when you just tell me, there's not a chance, you have it. Go ahead, figure it out. There was no anxiety at that point.

• 51:29Dax Shepard?

  There's no time for any of that.

• 51:31Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 51:31Dax Shepard?

  It kind of makes you realize kind of how indulgent anxiety and fear is because

• 51:35Speaker 02

  I know.

• 51:36Dax Shepard?

  I say this all the time. It's like, all these things you fear, I've walked through many of them now and they're fine. They're weirdly fine. You show up, you arrive at the thing, you pick your dad up, you take him to the chemo, you're there, you talk to the person while you're there, you make that person laugh. You just walk through it all. Yet when you think about it, it's Seems completely insurmountable.

• 51:54Speaker 02

  Completely undoable.

• 51:55Dax Shepard?

  And what is the fucking utility of it? Like, why do we have such an outsized?

• 51:59Speaker 02

  It's so fucking annoying.

• 52:02Speaker 01

  Getting ourselves in situations.

• 52:04Dax Shepard?

  Sticky pickles.

• 52:05Speaker 01

  Sticky pickles, but it's too much.

• 52:07Speaker 02

  But don't they say, like, the reason we have it, we have anxiety and fear is like from the times when a lion would attack you? And now you have that level of anxiety, but it's because you don't know which cold medicine to buy.

• 52:19Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 52:19Speaker 02

  And you're like, I'm gonna get this and it's gonna fuck up my whole.

• 52:21Dax Shepard?

  I do think in the absence of real threats, all the mechanisms are still there, but there's nothing real to focus on.

• 52:28Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 52:29Dax Shepard?

  I mean, we're worrying about whether you're gonna die at 80 or 90. It's like, what?

• 52:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 52:33Dax Shepard?

  Are they gonna make it to teenage? Yeah, yeah, teenage years in the hunting and gathering society. So, yeah, I think we have all this architecture for it and no outlet for it. So we just start searching.

• 52:45Speaker 01

  To me, there are some things, like I started that doc, have you guys seen the doc about the girl who like drove the car into a?

• 52:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, crash or something?

• 52:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, exactly.

• 52:54Dax Shepard?

  I haven't watched it. Is it good?

• 52:56Speaker 01

  Started it. So this girl drove a car into a wall or something with her boyfriend and a friend. And those two died and she survived and now she's being like charged with murder or something? So, okay, I couldn't actually finish it because I started it and because it was clearly about teenagers in car accidents and dying, I felt so anxious. And I was like, there's too many teenagers in my life right now. I started to really have some panic and I was like, I don't think I can watch this because that's a real fear. These kids out on the road, driving around, these like little babies we know.

• 53:38Speaker 02

  Drunk on mushrooms.

• 53:40Speaker 01

  They shouldn't be out there. I don't like that, but because those are real premium fears, I think your brain can't really handle that level of like, these teenagers might end up in these horrible situations. So it's like, yeah, cough medicine. It like funnels into.

• 53:56Speaker 02

  Yes, the dumbest shit, of course.

• 53:58Speaker 01

  Sort of handle. Does that make sense?

• 54:00Speaker 02

  Yes. Howard Stern used to say this all. All the time, but like your brain can't even focus on dying for any length of time. You'll think of something else because your brain is not going to let you sit there and really focus on it.

• 54:11Dax Shepard?

  It's not a good zone.

• 54:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I've been thinking this a lot lately, and I guess the reason I've been thinking about it a lot is because of the fervor of anger and how upset everyone is politically and just kind of countrywide. And some part of me just keeps going, yeah, dude, you're on this planet for a minute. And you literally get to think about whatever you want and you get to get angry or upset or in love. You're just on this ride and you're going to be gone and we're here for some period and will be gone. And this planet was here for a minute and it'll be gone. It's like on some level, I think it's healthy to zoom out a bit and go like, yeah, all your concerns, although they are valid.

• 54:53Dax Shepard?

  There's a reality of how you're spending your time on this trip on this planet, which also needs to be evaluated and balanced.

• 55:01Speaker 02

  There's an old Bob Newhart sketch this is reminding me of, and he was a therapist on his show. And people would come into his, I feel like I may have told you this already, but people would come into his office on the sketch on the Bob Newhart show. And he was a therapist and he would sit there with his paper and pen and they would start saying all the things and he would go over to them and shake them and go, stop it.

• 55:25Speaker 02

  But my, my, my mother and my father, and they didn't, and it wasn't good and what they did to my son, stop it.

• 55:30Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 55:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:31Speaker 02

  And you just go like, stop it.

• 55:33Dax Shepard?

  This whole country just needs someone to grab by the shoulders and just go stop.

• 55:37Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 55:37Speaker 02

  And I have to say it to myself, and I think of that sketch and Jackie, stop it all the time. But what's really crazy is that this whole journey has not been an anxiety riddled journey. It's the antithesis. It's like, I am a machine who handles things.

• 55:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:54Speaker 02

  I just handle.

• 55:55Speaker 01

  Confidence, really. Confidence building.

• 55:57Speaker 02

  Who's she, bitch? I know, it's crazy.

• 55:59Speaker 01

  That's so cool.

• 56:00Speaker 02

  I know.

• 56:00Dax Shepard?

  I want to get really philosophic.

• 56:02Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 56:02Dax Shepard?

  Uh, death. Even if you walk through all of that.

• 56:06Speaker 02

  Jackie, step in that coffin.

• 56:08Dax Shepard?

  Rob's gonna pull out a

• 56:09Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 56:10Dax Shepard?

  Subcompact machine gun.

• 56:13Dax Shepard?

  Even if you work through, like so much of the catastrophization, right, of everything is like you stop at the big event and then you don't walk beyond that. Okay, someone died in a car accident. What's after that? And I think you have our own death to think about, which is like, truly, you're not gonna know.

• 56:28Speaker 02

  Right.

• 56:29Dax Shepard?

  Like, you're fearing something you can't experience. So what a waste, right? Because you're not gonna know. And that's that. So there's nothing to feel bad about on your behalf because you're not gonna suffer. There's no moment you're gonna be reflecting and going, oh, I wish I was still there. That's not what's gonna happen. So, okay, I don't need to feel bad for me because I'm not gonna experience any discomfort. So now we're just talking about the sadness of death is for the people that are left

• 56:52Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 56:52Dax Shepard?

  there, right? But even that, you need to think about all that. I've lost people. I've lost my father. I kind of love my dad more now than I ever have. I don't know. I don't know if that's where we would have gotten to if he made it to 100. I don't know. The love and the infusion of the people that are here, that's not going anywhere. You can't take that from me. I can miss my day to day interaction with you, but I think the best version of me would be like, fuck, yeah, I got to meet that person on this trip. So it's like, even if you start working through what it'll really look like on the other side of these things we're so afraid of. It's like, well, the person that died, they got no issues. It's the people that are alive. But then there's also all kinds of beautiful ways that the people who are then living get to channel that person and talk about the person like,

• 57:34Dax Shepard?

  you know, it's all manageable. We're not so fucking fragile.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  No, that is my takeaway. People ask all the time. They're like, so are you now like, don't sweat the small stuff? And I was like,

• 57:46Dax Shepard?

  bumper sticker on your car.

• 57:48Speaker 02

  Are you sick? Are you either sick or dumb? No, I'm gonna sweat the small stuff for fucking ever. Yeah, no, I am still just as upset about minutia as I was before this whole thing. But the big difference is that exact thing. There's this perspective shift where I'm not that fragile. I got it. Like, I am, uh, you know, I think in our lives, we're always told, you don't say good things about yourself. That's That's this, that's that. But I am a fucking badass warrior.

• 58:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:18Speaker 02

  Who did these crazy difficult things.

• 58:20Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 58:20Speaker 02

  And I just did them. And if you are going through this, you can do them.

• 58:25Dax Shepard?

  You'll just do them.

• 58:26Speaker 02

  When I'm DMing with anybody that's going through it, my first thing is I'm always just like, you got this. Even if you don't think you got, you do. You'll be on the other side of this. I was DMing with one girl who was like, I'm two weeks out and I'm so miserable. Am I ever gonna feel better? And I was like, queen, you will be dancing a soft shoe without having breast cancer. I mean, truly in three weeks.

• 58:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:49Speaker 02

  But two weeks sucks. Oh, it sucks.

• 58:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:52Speaker 02

  It sucks. And you don't want to talk about that because I want people to do what they need to do.

• 58:55Speaker 01

  No, but it's part of it.

• 58:56Speaker 02

  But it's like, it sucks. The recovery is rough.

• 58:58Dax Shepard?

  I will say the most eye opening part of my dad's cancer thing was taking him to chemo. And in that room was almost a hundred percent women in their thirties.

• 59:10Speaker 01

  Scared.

• 59:10Dax Shepard?

  And I was like.

• 59:11Speaker 02

  Oh, sick.

• 59:12Dax Shepard?

  Whoa.

• 59:12Speaker 02

  What's sick?

• 59:13Dax Shepard?

  This is not what I was expecting. I thought it was gonna be a bunch of old men who smoke cigarettes hooked up to these machines. And I was like, oh, there's a real epidemic. I know people have been saying it, but like to see it in person, the chemo room is just full of women with breast cancer. It's crazy.

• 59:27Speaker 02

  It's like the numbers of people who get breast cancer, it's like 20,000 people per state per year.

• 59:34Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my goodness.

• 59:35Speaker 02

  I mean, it's just a massive, that's an ish. So I'm sure there are states where it's 10 or 11. It's crazy. And I always say this too, but I'm a doctor person. I got a doctor for every part of my body. I go to the doctor. For something like this to get past me.

• 59:49Speaker 01

  Right.

• 59:49Speaker 02

  It's not like I'm my head in the sand person.

• 59:51Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 59:52Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 59:52Speaker 02

  I have a girlfriend who was helping me with some interior design stuff and she was like, yeah, my mom has it, but I just haven't been tested. And I was like, your mom has BRCA?

• 1:00:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:01Speaker 02

  And you're just raw dogging it.

• 1:00:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:03Speaker 02

  I didn't judge. In my mind, I did. I didn't out loud judge, but it's like, you gotta.

• 1:00:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:09Speaker 02

  I do really have trouble understanding, whatever you do with the information, I guess, is your choice. It's just really hard for me to wrap my brain around you knowing.

• 1:00:18Dax Shepard?

  That way, but I totally get it. And I'm fine with it.

• 1:00:20Speaker 02

  Not which way?

• 1:00:21Dax Shepard?

  My way is I'd rather know.

• 1:00:23Speaker 02

  I thought you were saying not know. And I was like, bro.

• 1:00:25Dax Shepard?

  No, but I understand it.

• 1:00:26Speaker 02

  I'm gonna shake you.

• 1:00:26Dax Shepard?

  I understand people who choose to not know. I think it's fine. And I think I have that feeling because. With my dad, I really tried to get him to do certain things. And after he was gone, I was like, A, what a waste of time that was. B, it was tension we didn't need. And guess what? That was his fucking journey to do however he want. Guess what? It wasn't my fucking business or my choice. And so when my stepdad got it, he made some nuts decisions. I became the spokesperson for the Prostate Cancer Foundation. So I could get him into a trial. I get him into this trial no one can get into. He goes, I want to play. He's like, yeah, I'm not gonna do it. And because I had already had my dad, I was like, cool, man.

• 1:01:11Dax Shepard?

  This is yours, dude. This is your ride and I totally honor it and I wasn't resentful. So I do totally respect people who are like, oh yeah, it doesn't interest me. I'm on the journey. I'm on, I'm cool with it. I'm fine with that. That's not what I would do. It doesn't bother me too much because I do think that's all you have for your autonomy. It's really you deciding and whether that to me makes no sense or not. It's like, it's the one thing you have.

• 1:01:35Speaker 02

  Yeah. And you decide if you don't want, and apparently, I mean, thank God a million times again, I don't know about chemo, but it's not uncommon for people to say, I think I'm all set. Oh, it's gonna make me cry. I think I'm all set. Yeah.

• 1:01:46Speaker 01

  I've done it. I've already.

• 1:01:48Speaker 02

  I don't wanna do this anymore.

• 1:01:49Dax Shepard?

  In the Atul Gawande way, you really do have to evaluate, is this a quantity play or a quality play?

• 1:01:56Speaker 02

  Hundred percent.

• 1:01:56Dax Shepard?

  Both are legitimate.

• 1:01:57Speaker 02

  What are we talking about for three weeks?

• 1:01:59Speaker 01

  Three weeks.

• 1:02:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:02:00Speaker 02

  I mean, even if you think it's years, but if you're gonna be in a bed the whole time.

• 1:02:04Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:02:05Dax Shepard?

  Let's compare 18 months to nine months, but nine months I can go on walks with my family in Europe. And the other version, I sit in a bed for 18 months and people come and cry next to me. Who's to say which one is?

• 1:02:14Speaker 02

  And look at me like I'm already gone. It's, I mean, it's right. I mean.

• 1:02:18Speaker 01

  Everyone gets to decide. Everyone gets to make their own decision.

• 1:02:21Dax Shepard?

  You occasionally hear these stories where it's like the dad didn't tell anyone he had cancer. Right? And everyone's so mad.

• 1:02:27Speaker 02

  So mad.

• 1:02:27Dax Shepard?

  And everyone's so shocked by that. But I did say to Chris, and I'm like, you know, I'm not ruling that out because. I don't wish to spend the last year of my life breaking everyone's heart I'm in love with. So sue me. I don't want my last year of my life with my girls looking at me with total sadness and I'm ruining their existence versus I'm still dying on the same day. And I might tell you three months before, so you can do whatever closure you want. It doesn't seem as crazy to me as when I would first hear about it. Like, guess what? It's my last year of life, motherfuckers.

• 1:02:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:03:00Dax Shepard?

  How do I want to spend it? Being pitied? That's my most hated fucking feeling.

• 1:03:03Speaker 02

  Me too.

• 1:03:04Dax Shepard?

  So, I don't know.

• 1:03:06Speaker 02

  It's a fucking tough one.

• 1:03:07Speaker 01

  If it's for them, you might want to ask now.

• 1:03:12Dax Shepard?

  Well, I brought it up the other day and it didn't go well.

• 1:03:13Speaker 01

  How would you want? Cause like, I prefer having time, being on the other side. Like, my grandfather was basically dying for so long.

• 1:03:24Dax Shepard?

  Too long.

• 1:03:24Speaker 01

  Too long. And it was hard, but I'm glad it happened that way. Because I did get to mourn his death before his body died. And that was good for me personally.

• 1:03:35Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:03:36Speaker 01

  Cause then by the time he died, I really could feel gratitude for him.

• 1:03:41Speaker 02

  And the time you were able to spend with him, given you had the information.

• 1:03:44Speaker 01

  And really say goodbye, really feel all the feelings. So if it's for the people in your life, you might want to give them the option.

• 1:03:52Dax Shepard?

  I'll just say for the record, I don't currently have any terminal diagnosis.

• 1:03:56Speaker 02

  Right, right, right. Yeah. Huge.

• 1:03:58Dax Shepard?

  And there might be a day when you ask me if I have that, when I say I'd rather not answer that. Cause I refuse to lie to you.

• 1:04:05Speaker 02

  Now I have to ask you every day. God damn it. And I have to carry around a piece of wood. It's exhausting. My poor nuts. My poor goddamn nuts.

• 1:04:16Speaker 01

  I have a quick question, please. When you got the diagnosis, did it do anything, or even when you got the surgeries? Did it do anything to your identity? Did it do anything to your female identity?

• 1:04:25Speaker 02

  I love that question. Believe it or not, it really didn't.

• 1:04:30Speaker 01

  Good.

• 1:04:30Speaker 02

  It didn't at all.

• 1:04:32Speaker 01

  I'm so glad to hear that.

• 1:04:33Speaker 02

  And I'm also speaking with people who are very worried about that. And I feel for them because my boobs are not why I feel like a woman. I mean, no part of me is. Really like a woman. I don't know. I've never been classically feminine in a lot of ways where like a wedding doesn't really speak to me.

• 1:04:53Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:04:53Dax Shepard?

  When you wore tux at your.

• 1:04:55Speaker 02

  I wore tux at my bot mitts. I had to learn from a friend the hard way how to celebrate when someone has an engagement ring. Cause I was like, oh, it's so pretty. And then she called me later and was like, I don't even know how to have this conversation with you. Everybody but you screamed and went crazy.

• 1:05:09Speaker 01

  Okay, but that's on, I'm sorry. I don't know who that is. That's on them.

• 1:05:12Speaker 02

  It is a little bit, but it's also like, I get it. I'm reacting to it in a way that I don't really want an engagement ring. I don't really care. It's not something that ever meant anything to me. And I think similarly, I've never been a woman who is like my sexuality and my femininity. You know what would make me lose my sense of self is if I woke up and I wasn't funny tomorrow. I'd jump off a bridge.

• 1:05:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, totally.

• 1:05:36Speaker 02

  But if I have to get a life-saving surgery. Also, I remember going on a carpet, truly way too soon after the surgery, because I'm disturbed. And I went to one of the award shows and a girlfriend of mine who was at the award show, who'd been through the whole thing and was who actually recommended the doctors to me. She DM me afterwards and was like, oh, my gosh, you look amazing. So excited. Let me know when your surgery is. Because she was like, you obviously didn't get it yet. You're at an award show doing amazing with new perky tits. And I was like, oh, no, I did it already.

• 1:06:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:06Speaker 02

  And so because of things like this, and because of what an amazing job they did, I think I'd feel differently if I was like, oh, my God, I got hatcheted.

• 1:06:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. And your value, you know, your value isn't placed there, but for some people it is.

• 1:06:19Speaker 02

  I know a lot of people writing to me too, being like, I'm not getting the reconstruction. I don't want to do it. That sounds like a headache. I'm like, okay.

• 1:06:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. Again, everyone makes.

• 1:06:31Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:06:37Dax Shepard?

  We get support from our presenting sponsor, YouTube Premium. Now, you already know I'm a big YouTube person. It's incredible on its own, but premium makes the whole experience feel enhanced. Like you don't realize how much better it can get until you try it. The biggest game changer for me, background play. I love long, two-hour deep dives, you name it, motorcycles, travel, cars.

• 1:07:02Speaker 01

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• 1:07:03Dax Shepard?

  For me. Cooking. Listen, with premium, you don't have to keep the screen open. So I can lock my phone, slide it into my pocket and listen to a podcast while I'm folding laundry or working out. It's also completely ad free, meaning when a narrator is building up to the climax of an insane story, there's zero interruption. And for travel, offline download saves the day. I love this one. Relying on airplane wifi can be a gamble, so I just download my favorite videos before takeoff. And with smart downloads, premium will automatically download new videos from channels you actually follow without having to lift a finger. I'm covered if I forget to download a video I want to watch, or even if there's no service. And the home run for me is that YouTube premium remembers exactly where I left off and lets me continue watching on

• 1:07:47Dax Shepard?

  another device from right where I stopped. So I can start a video on my TV while brushing my teeth and pick it right back up on my phone on my morning walk. So yeah, YouTube was already great, but premium supercharges it. If you like YouTube, you'll love premium. Try YouTube premium for two months free at youtube.com/premium. Trial eligibility varies. Terms apply. Cancel anytime. We are supported by Walden University. You know that feeling when you've been thinking about making a move, going after the degree, the promotion, the thing you keep telling yourself you'll get to someday? Walden University is built for that moment. For over 50 years, Walden has helped working professionals get the W, the knowledge, the skills and the confidence to create

• 1:08:31Dax Shepard?

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• 1:09:13Dax Shepard?

  Get recruiting. So I went down this rabbit hole the other day on real holiday jobs that exist and I couldn't stop. Somebody out there is hiring a ham glazer, a professional ham glazer. Another place is hiring a lead elf, implying a whole hierarchy of elves I had never even considered. Here's the thing, these jobs need real skills. People like that are hard to find. And whether you're hiring for one of these roles or any other role, the best way to find qualified people who are genuinely excited about your role is on ZipRecruiter. And right now you can try it for free at ziprecruiter.com/dax. Plus ZipRecruiter has a new feature that shows you the most interested qualified candidates first, so you meet the right people faster.

• 1:09:56Dax Shepard?

  No wonder ZipRecruiter is the number one rated hiring site based on G2. Let ZipRecruiter find the right people for your roles, seasonal or otherwise. Try it for free today at ziprecruiter.com/dax. At ziprecruiter.com/dax, meet your match on ZipRecruiter.

• 1:10:16Dax Shepard?

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• 1:10:42Speaker 04

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• 1:11:22Speaker 04

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• 1:11:45Dax Shepard?

  Okay, I want to transition to a couple of professional questions.

• 1:11:48Speaker 02

  Please.

• 1:11:49Dax Shepard?

  One is, I don't think we've talked about in your previous trips here, but when you were 18 after a semester at Delaware, you and Aggie Gold, your agent from Fresh Face Talent.

• 1:12:01Speaker 02

  I hate you.

• 1:12:02Dax Shepard?

  And your mother.

• 1:12:03Speaker 02

  Never hated you more.

• 1:12:03Dax Shepard?

  Came out to LA.

• 1:12:05Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 1:12:06Dax Shepard?

  On a break after the first semester. And you meet Jessica Biel and you end up living with her and her family in Calabasas. But the thing that was.

• 1:12:14Speaker 02

  In a gated community.

• 1:12:14Dax Shepard?

  There's so many interesting things to that.

• 1:12:16Speaker 02

  I don't know how you could possibly have a question about such an obvious thing.

• 1:12:19Dax Shepard?

  The one I'm most obsessed with is it said you guys met at a TV Guide.

• 1:12:24Speaker 02

  Awards.

• 1:12:26Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so just explain to me what the award show was that you met at and why you would have been there if you're a student at Delaware.

• 1:12:33Speaker 02

  The answer to the question is yes. So when I was 18, I came out on this break and I was friends with Ben Salisbury, who was the son on The Nanny. And I had been on The Nanny twice.

• 1:12:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:45Dax Shepard?

  Playing to remind everyone, Young Fran Drescher.

• 1:12:48Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:12:49Dax Shepard?

  And then.

• 1:12:50Speaker 02

  Sort of Young Fran Drescher, but a different incarnation of her. So first I played her second cousin and then I played a girl in the classroom that was supposed to be.

• 1:12:59Dax Shepard?

  Flashback.

• 1:13:00Speaker 02

  Basically exactly like her. I'm friends with Ben, he's one of my only California friends. And he knew that I loved Jessica Biel. And he was like, just, you know, people call her Jessie. I'm like, okay, I still hope one day to be able to utilize that. So he was invited to the TV Guide Awards, which were hosted that year by Drew Carey.

• 1:13:17Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:13:18Speaker 02

  Of course, but it was the most, I mean, low rent doesn't even cut it. I will have to Google like what a TV Guide Award even looks like.

• 1:13:25Dax Shepard?

  So you were his date?

• 1:13:26Speaker 02

  I was like his friend date and our moms were friends. And so it was me and Ben, I believe his mom and my mom. And then Jessica Biel was there, who I loved.

• 1:13:37Dax Shepard?

  Was she nominated for a TV Guide Award?

• 1:13:38Speaker 02

  Probably.

• 1:13:39Speaker 01

  Of course.

• 1:13:39Speaker 02

  She must have been.

• 1:13:40Dax Shepard?

  Seven, seven, seven?

• 1:13:41Speaker 02

  Seven, seven. And Ben was probably nominated for The Nanny because that was still on. So maybe it was like, you know, best kid, the TV Guide Awards, like best kid actor. They used to also have like the Young Hollywood Awards.

• 1:13:51Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:13:51Speaker 02

  And that I. Of it. Oh, I coveted going to the young Hollywood. I really wanted to be involved, but I wasn't getting hired at that time at all.

• 1:13:59Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 1:14:00Speaker 02

  So I was Ben's plus one and then I met Jesse Beal there. He was like, Jackie, this is Jesse. And I just was immediately like, oh dude, I love you. I'm obsessed with you.

• 1:14:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:09Speaker 02

  And she was like, oh, thanks so much. She has a deeper voice than me, which is crazy.

• 1:14:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:12Speaker 02

  She's like, oh, thanks. Thanks so much, dude. And then we became immediate friends.

• 1:14:16Dax Shepard?

  Okay, but really quick, that's already a rare event. She's already on TV.

• 1:14:20Speaker 02

  Correct.

• 1:14:21Dax Shepard?

  She goes to TV Guide Awards. She meets you and she's like, yeah, I have space to start hanging out with you. Is weird, no?

• 1:14:27Speaker 02

  Weird.

• 1:14:27Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:28Speaker 02

  But we were immediately like, our personalities, similar to me and KB, we're like, you wouldn't necessarily think, but then it just works.

• 1:14:36Dax Shepard?

  There's a symmetry.

• 1:14:37Speaker 02

  Similar thing with KB. I mean, she wasn't a TV star yet, but when we met, we were like, oh, there was like an immediate game recognizing game, like funny, snarky.

• 1:14:46Dax Shepard?

  But very complimentary. You guys are in very defined lanes that are not the same.

• 1:14:49Speaker 02

  Correct. I, for example, am not America's sweetheart.

• 1:14:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, no.

• 1:14:53Speaker 02

  We, however, are in similar lanes.

• 1:14:55Dax Shepard?

  Yes.

• 1:14:55Speaker 02

  So Jess, we became super fast friends. We exchanged numbers. And then the next day I was leaving on like four days and I was like, oh, what, what are you doing? And she was like, oh, let's go. I'm going to Ty Bo.

• 1:15:05Dax Shepard?

  Oh.

• 1:15:05Speaker 02

  Remember Ty Bo?

• 1:15:06Dax Shepard?

  Oh, Ty Bo boxing.

• 1:15:07Speaker 02

  Billy Blanks.

• 1:15:08Dax Shepard?

  Billy Blanks, BB.

• 1:15:09Speaker 01

  I have not heard, babe, the term Ty Bo in 20, 30 years.

• 1:15:14Speaker 02

  Truly. And then she was who convinced me, I don't know that she admits this, but she is who convinced me to drop out of college.

• 1:15:21Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:15:22Speaker 02

  And it wasn't a hard convince.

• 1:15:23Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:15:24Speaker 02

  I was like, I can't live here. I have nowhere to live. She was like, live with my family. And I was like, see you, Delaware.

• 1:15:30Dax Shepard?

  So that part is the interesting. So when she was on Seventh Heaven, what ages were you guys?

• 1:15:35Speaker 02

  I was 18, she was 17.

• 1:15:37Dax Shepard?

  Okay. So that's why she lived at home and her parents were like, absolutely invite your friend you just met to live in our home. Cause I gotta be honest, when my girls come home from the TV Guide Award show and they tell me someone's moving in, I'm gonna go, that's not happening.

• 1:15:48Speaker 01

  Well, you know who's gonna say it is happening? Kristen.

• 1:15:51Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 1:15:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'll go to Nashville, I guess, and ignore the whole situation.

• 1:15:55Speaker 02

  I mean, when I first met Kristen, there were seven people living in her home.

• 1:16:00Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:16:01Speaker 02

  At a minimum.

• 1:16:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:16:02Dax Shepard?

  Same when I started dating her. And I was just like, do I dare broach this? I'm like, Any of these seven folks paying rent?

• 1:16:08Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:16:08Dax Shepard?

  No, no, not one of them.

• 1:16:09Speaker 01

  And it paid off because those people are Ryan and Amy and other people. Jedidiah. Exactly.

• 1:16:15Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 1:16:16Speaker 01

  Who have given back quite a lot.

• 1:16:18Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:16:18Dax Shepard?

  Did you feel awkward living in a family's home? Or did you dropped right in? You're no problem for you.

• 1:16:24Speaker 02

  You already know. I am a person.

• 1:16:27Speaker 01

  Mom, can you bring me soup?

• 1:16:28Speaker 02

  Kim Beal, Jess's mom, taught me how to write a check.

• 1:16:30Speaker 01

  Aww.

• 1:16:30Speaker 02

  Because I moved out of the house. So literally like taught me how to pump gas. I moved out of the house so young. I went to college for one semester. I'd barely had my like driver's license for a year. I was so young.

• 1:16:42Speaker 01

  Aww.

• 1:16:43Speaker 02

  And my parents, to their credit, well, once they knew I was moving in with this like TV star's family and my parents met her parents and everything was super sweet. And I wasn't going to stay for long. It was just to like get me on my feet and get me out here.

• 1:16:54Dax Shepard?

  How long did you stay? Three years?

• 1:16:56Speaker 02

  It was seven, it was seven years. It's coming up on seven. It's coming up on 25 at the end of this month. It was like less than six months.

• 1:17:03Speaker 01

  Were you guys just out on the town together?

• 1:17:05Speaker 02

  Always.

• 1:17:05Speaker 01

  Oh, that's really fun.

• 1:17:06Speaker 02

  We were like putting on wigs and dressing crazy and going to friends' parties at like UCLA.

• 1:17:10Speaker 01

  That's so cute.

• 1:17:11Speaker 02

  The pictures from that time are crazy. Also, when she invited me to Tybo, this is so good. I think it's going to be a Tybo class. Like it's like taking a Pilates class and they're like, this is Joseph Pilates. You're like, no.

• 1:17:24Dax Shepard?

  Oh, right.

• 1:17:24Speaker 02

  It was Billy Blanks who taught the class. And in the class was Brandy Sinbad, me and Jessica Biel.

• 1:17:33Dax Shepard?

  Fuck, yeah.

• 1:17:34Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 1:17:34Speaker 02

  I wish there was a picture from that.

• 1:17:36Dax Shepard?

  That's a better cast than was at the TV Guide Awards. For sure. No, another thing I wanted to say about your career is I think it started with a question. I was going to ask the question. You've toured both as a musician and you've toured as a stand up. I just want to confirm my hunch, which is, is it easier to do music?

• 1:17:55Speaker 02

  Oh, by a million miles.

• 1:17:57Dax Shepard?

  Like you can even enjoy your free day before you perform that night?

• 1:18:01Speaker 02

  If I was still playing, I'm not doing stand up as much anymore, hardly ever. And I'm not playing music as much anymore. And It's a little weird. I remember when I was a kid and my aunt was like, I was learning guitar when I was like 18 and she was like, I used to play guitar. And I remember thinking like, you used to, you play guitar, you play guitar. I haven't picked the guitar off the wall in, I mean, a long time. My guess is I was, as you've known for 20 years, clawing. My whole career has just been this absolute, I was gonna say grift, but it wasn't, I wasn't pulling one over on anyone. It just was like, ha, I'm touring as a musician, I'm touring as a stand-up, I'm trying to get on TV, I have an agent, my agent dropped me, I'm on American, I'm just

• 1:18:42Speaker 02

  like, what can I do? Because all I want to do is make art and be a professional personality. So why do I monetize this? I got on, Nobody Wants This, and like, I just calmed the fuck down. Even on Glow, I was like, how do I get, how do I get, what do I get? How of all the people on this show can I be the one who pops? There's 15 of us. How do I maximize this opportunity?

• 1:19:08Dax Shepard?

  Because it's the last one I'm ever gonna have.

• 1:19:10Speaker 02

  No, no, well, of course. And then, it was for a while and I lost my health insurance for years after Glow. And then finally got a Weird Energy commercial campaign, which was literally California only, which made me got my health insurance back in like 2022 or 2023.

• 1:19:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so what started as a question about touring.

• 1:19:29Speaker 02

  Got sad.

• 1:19:30Dax Shepard?

  No, it got quite good. It makes me think of, I think the first time I ever cried on the show was Gordon Keith. We were interviewing him live in Dallas and he was telling a story about he was staying in our house, we weren't out of town. And he just went through my big book of Alcoholics Anonymous, and in the first page are like, all these different dates that have been scratched out. I got sober this time, then I got sober again this time. And so what's funny is I look at that page and I'm a little bit like, oh my God, I'm such a failure. I just couldn't do it right. Yeah, and Gordon Keith's like, I looked at this thing and I was like, dude, this is a guy who won't quit. And I was like, oh, fuck, dude, that really fucked me up. Because I will never give myself that kind of pat on the back. But yeah, throughout all things, I'm a dude who won't give up.

• 1:20:15Speaker 01

  And there's a date that isn't crossed out. You know, it's beautiful.

• 1:20:19Dax Shepard?

  It's smudged.

• 1:20:22Speaker 02

  Because I did lines of coke off it, but it's not crossed out.

• 1:20:25Dax Shepard?

  But I'm looking at this long road you've been on. Now you're touring and again, I did the same thing where I was just like, dude, I'll do whatever thing's working slightly better than the other things. Like I write, okay, or I direct, or I do this, or I do stand up.

• 1:20:38Speaker 02

  I was like, oh, that's what it is now? Okay, I'll sing now.

• 1:20:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so I look at your thing and I'm like, this fucking bitch wouldn't quit. It's so rad. This bitch wouldn't fucking quit.

• 1:20:48Speaker 02

  That makes me freaking feel so good.

• 1:20:50Dax Shepard?

  That's something to be more proud of than having succeeded right away.

• 1:20:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, I agree.

• 1:20:56Speaker 02

  Oh, my God. Understatement, not succeeded right away.

• 1:20:58Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and it's kind of like a testament to it is a war of attrition also. Most people have moved home by now.

• 1:21:05Speaker 02

  And we've talked about this and I talk about you often in interviews where I talk about how the first time I did your pod, you said a similar thing to me, similar to what your boy said about the crossing the dates out. There was a turning point for you where when you're 37 and you still haven't gotten the job and you're in your one bedroom apartment with your 15 year old RAV4.

• 1:21:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:26Speaker 02

  No one's high fiving you for your persistence.

• 1:21:29Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:21:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:21:30Dax Shepard?

  They're worried about you and they feel bad for you.

• 1:21:32Speaker 02

  No one's congratulating you.

• 1:21:33Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:34Speaker 02

  And then the next year I get glow and then I'm doing all this press and everyone going like, your persistence is so admirable and good for you, but six months prior, it was like, we hanging it up, we getting a job.

• 1:21:47Speaker 01

  Jackie, you ready?

• 1:21:47Speaker 02

  And you pointed that out to me and I was like, oh, yeah. That's crazy. The other reason when I talk about it in therapy, I'm like, I might be like something's broken.

• 1:21:56Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 1:21:57Speaker 02

  Maybe in a good way.

• 1:21:58Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm. Probably in a good and bad way.

• 1:21:59Speaker 02

  Uh huh.

• 1:22:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:00Speaker 02

  Where like a lot of people just, they're not gonna, I have family members that went on two job interviews and it's too much.

• 1:22:06Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:22:07Speaker 02

  They were told no both times and they're switching careers now because it's just, oh, that's not an exaggeration.

• 1:22:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:22:13Speaker 02

  And now they're doing something else because the first job didn't work out and now I am putting a fucking garlic and a cross to that whole career. One rejection, I couldn't count them with a gun to my head.

• 1:22:23Speaker 01

  You can't.

• 1:22:23Speaker 02

  I mean, it's gotta be thousands.

• 1:22:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, you can't survive here with that.

• 1:22:26Dax Shepard?

  Yes and no because. What I admire about you, and I think it's what I did as well, which is like, I just kept pivoting. Also, you were like, I'd be happy being a singer at the tours. You wanna invite me to that party? I'm there.

• 1:22:38Speaker 02

  Hundred percent.

• 1:22:39Dax Shepard?

  You wanna invite me to the acting party? I'm there.

• 1:22:41Speaker 02

  Hundred percent.

• 1:22:42Dax Shepard?

  I also think, yes, you shouldn't give up after two, but I also think a lot of people just aren't willing to keep trying different things. You're like so hell bent on this one version it has to be.

• 1:22:54Speaker 02

  The other thing is, it's impossible to say if you're not getting hired because you're just not good.

• 1:23:01Dax Shepard?

  It's hard to know.

• 1:23:02Speaker 02

  Hard to know.

• 1:23:03Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it's really hard to know.

• 1:23:05Speaker 02

  And then it's like, well, it is a little psychotic if you're like, okay, you're almost 40 and you still haven't been really hired in any meaningful way. That means.

• 1:23:12Dax Shepard?

  With any security.

• 1:23:13Speaker 02

  For any stability or security. So it's like, that same thing happens to people who just don't have the goods.

• 1:23:20Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:23:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:21Speaker 01

  It's very tricky.

• 1:23:23Speaker 02

  But with me, I was lucky because I was getting enough validation from big people that were like, we're gonna give you a development deal. We're gonna make you a show. And then just the show didn't go. So I was like, well, somebody thought I was cool enough to like, try and make something with.

• 1:23:37Speaker 01

  You had bites.

• 1:23:38Speaker 02

  It's not like my opinion. I'm like, taking in the feedback of this business.

• 1:23:42Dax Shepard?

  And you have the advantage of performing live, which is very encouraging.

• 1:23:46Speaker 02

  That's the ticket too, is when I started really doing stand up, this was probably a couple of years before, well, five years before Glow. That changed my whole life too, because speaking of pivoting, I was no longer waiting for the phone to ring. I'm a joke machine.

• 1:23:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm just gonna go out there.

• 1:24:00Speaker 02

  Pitching for people. So I'm out, I'm on the town. Managers, comedy people saw me. I went and did Montreal Comedy Festival. I'm in action.

• 1:24:08Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:24:08Speaker 02

  And that's the number one piece of advice I give. And pivoting is really good too, but the number one piece of advice I give is like, diversify your portfolio, bitch. Do not sit there and be like, I'm an actor, I'm waiting. You can't wait for the phone to ring. And if you're an actor, you better start writing and directing and make your own shit, because no one's looking for you.

• 1:24:24Speaker 01

  Especially now, there really is no excuse. You can make stuff all day long, you can put it on Instagram, you can put it on YouTube.

• 1:24:30Dax Shepard?

  And we will dismiss you as influencers.

• 1:24:31Speaker 02

  Yes, exactly.

• 1:24:33Speaker 01

  You're gonna have to get used to that.

• 1:24:35Speaker 02

  Thick in that skin, because it's happening.

• 1:24:37Dax Shepard?

  Okay, my very last question. I think about this often. I mostly think about it when I'm at my men's meeting because there's a bunch of men on different rungs of the ladder.

• 1:24:50Speaker 02

  Of the success ladder?

• 1:24:51Dax Shepard?

  Of the success ladder, the Hollywood success ladder and the financial ladder. There's many status ladders. And I can see for some of these guys, I can feel that they think their position on that rung is important to me or that I even evaluate it. But when you're having those feelings, you're certain other people have decided you're not high status enough for them. And just on the other side, I'm lucky enough now to be on the very high rung of that ladder. And I've been on a very low rung of the ladder. And I now realize from the high rung, I don't think about what anybody has accomplished or how much money they have. Like, it's all in our own heads.

• 1:25:32Speaker 02

  A hundred percent.

• 1:25:33Dax Shepard?

  So I'm just wondering, have you had any kind of reckoning with that? Because like you and I have been friends for 18 years. I'm not more friends with you now that you're on Nobody Wants Us and I'm not less friends with you. It has no impact on.

• 1:25:45Speaker 02

  None.

• 1:25:46Speaker 01

  Honestly, less friends with you because you're busy.

• 1:25:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the only thing. It's like, I'm kind of swamped.

• 1:25:51Speaker 01

  Like she like can't hang out.

• 1:25:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:25:52Dax Shepard?

  But do you know the thing I'm talking about? And then once you get it, you gotta go like, oh.

• 1:25:57Speaker 02

  I will say what it has afforded me is more of a calm. I'm not so fucking thirsty. I don't have to be funny in all situations.

• 1:26:06Speaker 01

  That's very self-aware of you to say, by the way. I'm impressed by that.

• 1:26:09Speaker 02

  Thanks. I also, I remember years ago, meeting like some of my favorite comedians, feeling this need to rise to the occasion. Yeah. Because I know they're funny. They don't know I'm funny. And there's that thirst of like, you don't even mean to. And I'm not over there like doing a soft shoe, but I'm being like real bitty. And you just get to a point in your life and you're like, well, it's just nice to. You know who's a really great inspiration in this way is Sarah Silverman. Have you guys had this genius on?

• 1:26:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:26:36Speaker 02

  Many times? Okay. Well, just something that's amazing about her is like she's never been a bitty person. She's one of the best to ever do it, in my opinion. She's absolutely a genius and a trailblazer and she's so calm.

• 1:26:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:26:48Speaker 02

  Tig is another example. You realize that the greats are fucking chilling. What are you doing? And then when I'm somewhere now and someone's like bit city. I'm like, oh, okay. But I get it. And similar to what you were saying a second ago, it's like they feel insecure. So I don't fault them for that.

• 1:27:03Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:27:04Speaker 02

  Like if someone's guessing on, nobody wants this and they're doing a lot of bits in the hair and makeup trailer. It's like, that's me.

• 1:27:09Speaker 01

  There's something in hearing about it.

• 1:27:11Speaker 02

  That's me. And I'm not like, okay, try hard. It's like, yeah, you want people to remember you and think you're cool. And I get that.

• 1:27:17Dax Shepard?

  You have one shot. You keep having this one shot.

• 1:27:20Speaker 01

  It's sweet. And it's like, ah, this industry.

• 1:27:22Speaker 02

  I know. It's a nightmare. It's an absolute psychological warfare nightmare. And I think that for me is what, now that I'm here and I'm moderately successful and I feel I'm doing well and I have my health and all the things, I'm just like, oh, I don't. You know what's really interesting? I went to acupuncture. This woman recommended this amazing acupuncturist. She and her daughter, they're this tall. They have black like bob hair.

• 1:27:49Speaker 01

  Cool.

• 1:27:49Speaker 02

  They look like that woman from The Incredibles.

• 1:27:52Speaker 01

  Yes, I was just thinking that.

• 1:27:53Speaker 02

  They're Korean and they have thick Russian accents.

• 1:27:56Dax Shepard?

  Oh, interesting.

• 1:27:57Speaker 02

  And they are fascinating.

• 1:27:58Dax Shepard?

  Mixed messages.

• 1:27:59Speaker 02

  And they are acupuncturists in Silver Lake, the mother daughter team.

• 1:28:02Speaker 01

  Ooh.

• 1:28:03Speaker 02

  Okay. And you want to talk about crying? I went in there and the woman was like, the first thing, she was asking me about my ailments. And I was telling her about the breasts and everything. And she goes, you need to. And she's just going like this really slow. She's like, calm your nervous system in her thick Russian accent. Calm your nervous system. And I was telling her this whole story. Then she gave me a hug because someone just met me and she goes, you don't have to entertain anybody.

• 1:28:29Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:28:31Dax Shepard?

  Well, then I'll have no value.

• 1:28:33Speaker 02

  Truly. I mean, well, then what am I?

• 1:28:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:28:35Speaker 02

  One of those fucking seaweed people that Ursula turns the mermaids into with the big eyes. And I'm just fucking, I was like, what is, what, what?

• 1:28:43Speaker 01

  What's the point?

• 1:28:43Speaker 02

  But I just like, it was.

• 1:28:45Dax Shepard?

  Wow. She saw right through you.

• 1:28:46Speaker 02

  Immediately.

• 1:28:47Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:47Speaker 02

  So I was probably like, wow, I did this and I had to do this. And I did the mistake, I did, I had to do the boobs, but I'm going to do the over. Like you know how I'm like trying to lighten it for someone else so they can handle it.

• 1:28:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:28:56Speaker 02

  So she's like, what have you been going through? And I'm doing the song and dance. And she said, you don't have to entertain anybody.

• 1:29:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's wonderful.

• 1:29:03Dax Shepard?

  It's a very sweet way to say it, too.

• 1:29:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:29:05Speaker 02

  Whoa.

• 1:29:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, because what if she had been like, just knock off the bits?

• 1:29:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, truly. Enough, enough, enough, enough.

• 1:29:10Dax Shepard?

  Knock it all off.

• 1:29:11Speaker 02

  Enough, just so rude.

• 1:29:13Speaker 01

  Stop it.

• 1:29:14Speaker 02

  Stop it, shaking, stop it. But it was just so profound and like, even though now I'm sitting here being like, so I don't have to do this thing anymore. That was a month ago.

• 1:29:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:23Speaker 02

  And this acupuncturist, I was like doing a soft shoe number four. Because I just was telling her about my trauma and so I was trying not to make it heavy. I could just as easily have like, taken a breath and calmly just given her, she's like, you need to have a new mantra and it's this and you have to say it like this. And it's, it sounds so trite. It's whatever, I don't care, in that like, huh, breathy. Also, Joe and I were talking about like, when the student is ready, the teacher appears. Like, how many times in my life, people have been like, you want to calm the fuck down?

• 1:29:53Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:54Speaker 02

  I can trouble you two, relax.

• 1:29:56Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:29:56Speaker 02

  But this time, you could hear it. I just was like, oh, yeah, I need to breathe, bro.

• 1:30:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:30:02Speaker 02

  On one.

• 1:30:05Dax Shepard?

  Well, Jackie.

• 1:30:06Speaker 02

  I love you guys.

• 1:30:07Dax Shepard?

  I love you.

• 1:30:08Speaker 01

  We love you so much.

• 1:30:10Speaker 02

  Okay, everybody, the four reasons that you should be getting genetic tested. Rare cancer, repetitive, multiple cancers, young cancer, or if you're an Ashkenazi Jew, get your test at learnmyrisk.com.

• 1:30:24Speaker 01

  I'll probably do it anyway. I'm not one of those.

• 1:30:26Speaker 02

  You should.

• 1:30:26Speaker 01

  But I'm like, I'm gonna just do it.

• 1:30:27Speaker 02

  You should, why not?

• 1:30:28Dax Shepard?

  Why, it's so easy to spin it, too.

• 1:30:29Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:30:30Dax Shepard?

  I spin them all day long, just for fun.

• 1:30:31Speaker 02

  Truly, you really do.

• 1:30:32Speaker 01

  You do.

• 1:30:33Speaker 02

  He loves his.

• 1:30:33Speaker 01

  Dipping.

• 1:30:34Speaker 02

  Yeah. You and Tim.

• 1:30:35Dax Shepard?

  I love you.

• 1:30:35Speaker 02

  I love you guys. This was so special. Thank you for having me.

• 1:30:39Speaker 01

  Happy to have you all.

• 1:30:39Speaker 02

  It's my freaking favorites.

• 1:30:40Dax Shepard?

  We'll do it again soon.

• 1:30:41Speaker 02

  Bye, everyone, I love you.

• 1:30:42Speaker 01

  See you on season three.

• 1:30:43Speaker 02

  Wow, oh, yeah, I'm on Nobody Wants This.

• 1:30:47Dax Shepard?

  Just a quick reminder that as part of our summer break, here's a rerun of one of our favorite fact checks.

• 1:30:56Speaker 01

  I have an update.

• 1:30:57Dax Shepard?

  You have an update?

• 1:30:58Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 1:30:58Dax Shepard?

  What is it?

• 1:30:59Speaker 01

  I was right again.

• 1:31:00Dax Shepard?

  Oh, wow. Great.

• 1:31:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:01Dax Shepard?

  It feels so good to be right, doesn't it?

• 1:31:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. So remember when I said you were right about my period?

• 1:31:05Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:06Speaker 01

  And I gave you a whole thing about that?

• 1:31:07Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:07Speaker 01

  You were wrong.

• 1:31:08Dax Shepard?

  Oh, OK. So it's a bad day for me and a good day for you.

• 1:31:10Speaker 01

  And I was right the whole time.

• 1:31:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:13Speaker 01

  The day I said is the day, which is today.

• 1:31:16Dax Shepard?

  Congratulations.

• 1:31:17Speaker 01

  Thank you. It came.

• 1:31:18Dax Shepard?

  So now we have, we still don't know why you had your clothes on backwards.

• 1:31:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:31:22Dax Shepard?

  That's still a big question.

• 1:31:23Speaker 01

  The original mystery remains.

• 1:31:25Dax Shepard?

  My mom liked being right so much, she made up a song. And you'd hear her singing it occasionally throughout the house. And it was, it's such a good feeling to know that you're right.

• 1:31:34Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:31:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. There were more lyrics, but that's the, I guess the chorus.

• 1:31:39Speaker 01

  That was the main takeaway. Do you think you really like, because you grew up hearing that, you really embodied it?

• 1:31:45Dax Shepard?

  I just know it feels great to be right.

• 1:31:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, but it's like, do you know because of the song or do you know?

• 1:31:50Dax Shepard?

  I heard the funniest thing once from an editor, a film editor, who had cut some, a couple of movies from an actor. And he said, yeah, you know, his thing is if he, if he has his way, his character's arc is that he'll find out he was right the whole time.

• 1:32:10Dax Shepard?

  Instead of learning a lesson.

• 1:32:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:12Dax Shepard?

  His lesson will be he'll found out, he'll find out he was right the entire time.

• 1:32:15Speaker 01

  That's really funny. It does feel good to be right.

• 1:32:19Dax Shepard?

  It does. It's just important not to gloat. You know? I guess that's all you can do.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  And I guess it's good to tell other people when they're right, like I do.

• 1:32:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:29Speaker 01

  Even though you were wrong.

• 1:32:30Dax Shepard?

  I was wrong. Yeah. You know, this was just a topic last night in a, in a 12 step meeting, which was in the book, it said something about big shotism, you know, like.

• 1:32:41Speaker 01

  What's it say?

• 1:32:42Dax Shepard?

  Uh, you know, just like that we have to avoid big shotism.

• 1:32:45Speaker 01

  Don't be a big shot.

• 1:32:46Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And I was thinking maybe the best you can do. Is you just don't say anything like you're gonna think things. I don't know that you can control whether you think something. It's just like the thought pops into your head. And really, again, the space between your thought and your actions. Therein lies peace, or whatever the saying is. Freedom, therein lies freedom. So I was thinking like, no, I still have some pretty grotesque thoughts. I've just gotten good at not saying them. And that's, I feel like that's all I can, I'm capable of, and I'm proud enough of that.

• 1:33:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, yes, I don't think we can control our thoughts, but we can control everything else.

• 1:33:28Dax Shepard?

  After the thought.

• 1:33:29Speaker 01

  So we must.

• 1:33:31Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, increase our bust. We must, we must.

• 1:33:34Speaker 01

  We don't have to do that. Everyone's boobs are gray.

• 1:33:37Dax Shepard?

  I'm trying to increase my bust pretty regularly. I'm doing bench press, which is for the pectorals.

• 1:33:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, but you don't have to increase. No one has to increase their bust. No, it's not a must.

• 1:33:48Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:33:48Speaker 01

  It's a choice.

• 1:33:49Dax Shepard?

  But it is from Grease.

• 1:33:50Speaker 01

  No wonder I hate it.

• 1:33:52Dax Shepard?

  Oh, yeah, that's right. You don't like Grease.

• 1:33:54Speaker 01

  I don't know if I'm odd to say that.

• 1:33:55Dax Shepard?

  The only person in the world that does, because I don't like musicals. And even I'm like, it's, it's fun.

• 1:33:59Speaker 01

  Really?

• 1:34:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. We made out under the dock.

• 1:34:04Speaker 01

  Please stop.

• 1:34:06Dax Shepard?

  Is that song in particular, one you hate?

• 1:34:08Speaker 01

  I don't like any of the songs. You know, my brother, when he was just a young baby boy.

• 1:34:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:14Speaker 01

  He would be crying in the car. He was a baby. And my mom put the Grease soundtrack on and he.

• 1:34:22Dax Shepard?

  To sue them?

• 1:34:23Speaker 01

  Yes, and it worked, and especially this one song. And so we, I had to listen to it on repeat.

• 1:34:31Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:34:31Speaker 01

  To keep him from crying.

• 1:34:33Dax Shepard?

  I got it. You've associated it with your brother's annoying behavior.

• 1:34:36Speaker 01

  It's separate.

• 1:34:37Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:34:38Speaker 01

  I already hated it.

• 1:34:39Dax Shepard?

  That's what's going on.

• 1:34:40Speaker 01

  I already hated it. You know, it's so funny when you think back, like, my brother also was obsessed with the Backstreet Boys.

• 1:34:45Dax Shepard?

  Interesting.

• 1:34:46Speaker 01

  As a little boy.

• 1:34:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's cute.

• 1:34:48Speaker 01

  It's so cute. And I'm sure I was mean to him about it.

• 1:34:53Dax Shepard?

  Of course you were. Does he want to go to the Sphere? Aren't they?

• 1:34:56Speaker 01

  I, exactly. I thought about it recently. I was like, oh, he should go to that. That's his favorite band.

• 1:35:01Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, when he was six. I still like everything I liked when I was six musically. Like, I never came to hate anything that I once loved musically.

• 1:35:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:35:11Dax Shepard?

  Have you?

• 1:35:12Speaker 01

  I'm trying to think. I mean, I just liked so much Top 40 that I'm sure. I mean, it's hard to say. Now, if I heard it, I'm associating it with that time. So of course I'll like it.

• 1:35:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:24Speaker 01

  But, but do I like it? Probably not.

• 1:35:26Dax Shepard?

  Well, this brings up an update for me. So my deepest superstition, as you already know, you know, what's my deepest superstition?

• 1:35:32Speaker 01

  Uh, putting hats on.

• 1:35:34Dax Shepard?

  There's one worse than that. Where it really is like, it's, it, oh, I'm like, oh, my God.

• 1:35:39Speaker 01

  Can you give me a hint? Cause I do want to guess.

• 1:35:41Dax Shepard?

  It's musical.

• 1:35:43Speaker 01

  Oh, you have to listen to a song. There's a certain song you have to listen to twice.

• 1:35:48Dax Shepard?

  If I hear it accidentally, I have to.

• 1:35:50Speaker 01

  And which one is it again?

• 1:35:51Dax Shepard?

  Stepdad used to play this song like at full volume. And it was like, again, it's associated with like maximum chaos.

• 1:35:57Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:35:58Dax Shepard?

  My brother and him fighting. And that song was always playing. And I just got it in my head that like, if I heard it once, I had bad luck and then I had to hear it again. But I was not allowed to touch his record player. And he had the album, so I had no control over it. The song is Jump by Van Halen. Well, jump.

• 1:36:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:15Dax Shepard?

  So I was in Nashville and because I'm in my old cars, uh, and they don't have any way to play my phone through some of them. I was listening to the radio a ton.

• 1:36:24Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:36:25Dax Shepard?

  So I was driving down the road by myself and all of a sudden Jump came on.

• 1:36:29Speaker 01

  Did you slam?

• 1:36:30Dax Shepard?

  My first thought, well, my trick is if I hear it on the radio, I know this is a total workaround that everyone will call bullshit on. But I'll turn the channel to another channel, then turn it back. And I try to count that as a second.

• 1:36:40Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:36:41Dax Shepard?

  Which is, we both know that's bullshit, but that's the best I can do.

• 1:36:43Speaker 01

  Okay, listen, there's no rules because it's all made up.

• 1:36:47Dax Shepard?

  It's all asinine. Yes, yes. I don't know why, but this song came on when I was in Nashville and I go, we're done with this.

• 1:36:55Speaker 01

  Good job.

• 1:36:56Dax Shepard?

  We're done with this.

• 1:36:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:57Dax Shepard?

  And I'm not gonna try to listen to it twice. And then I go, and in fact, I'm adding it to my liked songs. So now it is in my liked songs, which I listen to all the time. And it comes on once and I'm like, it's a great fucking song. And you're gonna get over it and you're gonna love.

• 1:37:13Speaker 01

  Immersion therapy.

• 1:37:14Dax Shepard?

  You're gonna enjoy it. So I've been listening to it one time randomly a lot.

• 1:37:18Speaker 01

  And does your nose slowly bleed when you listen only once?

• 1:37:22Dax Shepard?

  No, my eyes tear black like Wednesdays.

• 1:37:25Speaker 01

  And have you had any bad luck since you started this?

• 1:37:29Dax Shepard?

  No, nothing discernible. No, in fact, I feel like I'm on good luck. Uh, I'm on a good luck wave. I, um, I've discovered this documentary, the Cowboys documentary, not the cheerleading one, which is also great.

• 1:37:42Speaker 01

  Great.

• 1:37:43Dax Shepard?

  But a history of Jerry Jones buying the Cowboys. Are you watching it, Rob?

• 1:37:47Speaker 05

  I am not.

• 1:37:48Dax Shepard?

  Buddy, I don't, I haven't liked a doc this much since Last Dance.

• 1:37:52Speaker 01

  You don't, what? You just asked Rob because he's a boy?

• 1:37:56Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh, cuz he loves football.

• 1:37:58Speaker 01

  Cuz he loves football, not cuz he's a boy.

• 1:38:00Dax Shepard?

  On the row, I go, Monica, have you seen the doc on the row?

• 1:38:03Speaker 01

  But I love Last Dance, you know that.

• 1:38:05Dax Shepard?

  I know you do. Have you seen it, Monica?

• 1:38:08Speaker 01

  Can you, can you admit that you could have just asked everyone?

• 1:38:12Dax Shepard?

  I could have, but I would, if there was a row documentary, I wouldn't ask Rob.

• 1:38:17Speaker 01

  Rob does like football, that's fine.

• 1:38:19Dax Shepard?

  He loves.

• 1:38:19Speaker 01

  Also, he might love to watch the doc on the row. It's probably great, it's probably gonna be great. I'm gonna make it and produce it.

• 1:38:26Dax Shepard?

  I had a really strong feeling you hadn't watched the Cowboys documentary. Unfortunately, I was correct.

• 1:38:31Speaker 05

  That America's team, the gambler and his Cowboys?

• 1:38:34Dax Shepard?

  The gambler and his Cowboys.

• 1:38:35Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:38:36Dax Shepard?

  It's awesome. I do think you should watch it. This was all to encourage you to watch it. I'm not leaving you out. I just wanted to see if I could get a two-way encouragement to you to give it a shot.

• 1:38:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:38:46Dax Shepard?

  Because you do not need to care about football.

• 1:38:48Speaker 01

  Peer pressure.

• 1:38:50Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so you don't want me?

• 1:38:52Speaker 01

  Okay, so just, just be regular.

• 1:38:54Dax Shepard?

  You wanted me to ask if you've watched it and then no, not recommend it?

• 1:38:58Speaker 01

  That's not what happened. I, I just didn't want you to specifically ask the male in the room about a doc.

• 1:39:05Dax Shepard?

  Football lover.

• 1:39:06Speaker 01

  When you just equated it to Last Dance. So we know it's not just for, I don't like basketball.

• 1:39:14Dax Shepard?

  You don't like basketball, yeah.

• 1:39:17Speaker 01

  And I, and The Last Dance is basically my favorite show that's ever happened.

• 1:39:20Dax Shepard?

  I know, it's a great one.

• 1:39:22Speaker 01

  Anywho, okay, so you want me to watch it, or you think everyone should watch it?

• 1:39:26Dax Shepard?

  It's incredible.

• 1:39:27Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:39:28Dax Shepard?

  What characters. Jerry Jones is such a character. Can I just give you a taste of what happens? So he is a very young guy and he is, I guess, a wildcat, they call him. Maybe that's not the right term, but he is buying oil fields, hoping to strike oil.

• 1:39:45Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:39:45Dax Shepard?

  He is so over-leveraged. He's like fifty million dollars in debt as a young man. And he just keeps gambling. And when he describes the oil well he hits, the noises it was making, and when it just started gushing, and then that one oil well made him a hundred million dollars.

• 1:40:04Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:40:05Dax Shepard?

  And then he immediately took that money and bought the Cowboys.

• 1:40:08Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 1:40:09Dax Shepard?

  And the Cowboys are the most valuable sports team in the world.

• 1:40:14Speaker 01

  Yes, I knew that.

• 1:40:15Dax Shepard?

  Every sport included.

• 1:40:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:17Dax Shepard?

  Like a thirteen billion dollar value of that team.

• 1:40:21Speaker 01

  Wild.

• 1:40:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and then he grabs this coach out of college, Jimmy Johnson, and it's just a great story.

• 1:40:30Speaker 01

  Do you think it's because he has two Js?

• 1:40:32Dax Shepard?

  It makes it really great that the alliteration's there.

• 1:40:35Speaker 01

  But like, he has two Js, so he's like, the only people I can hire, it's like a small pool, because it has to have two Js.

• 1:40:41Dax Shepard?

  They were on a championship college football team together, and they knew each other forever. And, did you ever watch The U?

• 1:40:48Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, the thirty for thirty.

• 1:40:50Dax Shepard?

  You did?

• 1:40:50Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:40:50Dax Shepard?

  So he was the coach that was like, yeah, you guys-

• 1:40:52Speaker 01

  Ron, did you?

• 1:40:53Speaker 05

  I did not, no.

• 1:40:55Speaker 01

  Well, well, well, look at that.

• 1:40:58Dax Shepard?

  If you remember, Jimmy Johnson was the one that was like, yeah, be black, don't listen to this bullshit that you're a thug.

• 1:41:06Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:41:07Dax Shepard?

  He's cool.

• 1:41:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, he is cool.

• 1:41:09Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. And those two, the owner and him, you know, it's tough to share glory.

• 1:41:15Speaker 01

  It's tough to share glory.

• 1:41:16Dax Shepard?

  It's tough to share glory. I'm not done with it, and I don't ever want it to end.

• 1:41:20Speaker 01

  That's fine. I love when there's a show like that.

• 1:41:23Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:23Speaker 01

  That was Too Much for me, the show Too Much on Netflix.

• 1:41:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, I did start it per your recommendation, and I love it.

• 1:41:31Speaker 01

  Right?

• 1:41:32Dax Shepard?

  It's great.

• 1:41:33Speaker 01

  It's so-

• 1:41:34Dax Shepard?

  It does give me anxiety.

• 1:41:36Speaker 01

  Okay, tell me.

• 1:41:37Dax Shepard?

  Because she's so fragile. Like, anything could-

• 1:41:43Dax Shepard?

  She could unravel over almost anything. And so it does trigger my like, oh my God, if I was around someone who was always like, I don't know if they're gonna unravel at this moment is very stressful to me.

• 1:41:55Speaker 01

  I don't know how far you're in, but it's, it's interesting the way they.

• 1:41:58Dax Shepard?

  I love him. He's so hot. He's so hot.

• 1:42:03Speaker 01

  So hot. I listened to this one thing on it that I thought broke it down really, really well, where they were like, this show does such a good job of highlighting the highest or like the most manic parts of a relationship, the beginning and the end, because she's come, she has this other relationship she has come out of.

• 1:42:22Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:42:23Speaker 01

  And it's very tumultuous.

• 1:42:24Dax Shepard?

  She's making some really wild.

• 1:42:26Speaker 01

  Isn't she so funny?

• 1:42:27Dax Shepard?

  Oh, she's, she's incredible.

• 1:42:29Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 1:42:30Dax Shepard?

  She's incredible. And Lena's great when she's on, yeah.

• 1:42:34Speaker 01

  It's, it's, it's a really good show.

• 1:42:36Dax Shepard?

  Really great cast, really great station.

• 1:42:38Speaker 01

  Well, that's when I was rewatching Girls and I was seeing all these people that she, that they cast before. I was like, God, yeah, some people just really have that knack.

• 1:42:49Dax Shepard?

  They have been high.

• 1:42:49Speaker 01

  Like Mike White.

• 1:42:51Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, like White.

• 1:42:52Speaker 01

  Mike White had Will Sharp and Megan Fahey on the same season of White Lotus, which means he's a genius.

• 1:43:00Dax Shepard?

  He is a genius.

• 1:43:02Speaker 01

  Anyway, Cowboys, you love them? I'm gonna watch.

• 1:43:04Dax Shepard?

  It's so good. It's so good.

• 1:43:06Speaker 01

  Now, I am coming off of some good luck as well.

• 1:43:09Dax Shepard?

  You are, okay.

• 1:43:10Speaker 01

  Because it's birthday luck still.

• 1:43:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:13Speaker 01

  I still have birthday luck and people who listen will remember that at the Bowery, I got a tassel, 11/11, the room, this is incredible.

• 1:43:23Dax Shepard?

  Yep.

• 1:43:24Speaker 01

  Wow, big story, tassel. For my birthday, we went to the Four Seasons and went to the pool. I had to get a room for that.

• 1:43:34Dax Shepard?

  Yep.

• 1:43:34Speaker 01

  So guess what my room number was? You already know, 11/11.

• 1:43:39Dax Shepard?

  Um, 12/12.

• 1:43:40Speaker 01

  11/11 again.

• 1:43:43Dax Shepard?

  Oh, my gosh. This should be your first tattoo.

• 1:43:47Speaker 01

  I actually thought that.

• 1:43:49Dax Shepard?

  I bet you did.

• 1:43:50Speaker 01

  I already thought it, which is why I can't get it, because I guess it's a cliche.

• 1:43:54Dax Shepard?

  Do a lot of people have 11/11?

• 1:43:55Speaker 01

  No, but it's like if you thought and I thought, we all thought it.

• 1:43:58Dax Shepard?

  Or it's just so on brand for you. I don't know.

• 1:44:01Speaker 01

  I don't know. I'm not gonna get any tattoos.

• 1:44:03Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:44:04Speaker 01

  But if I was, um, I think it might be that.

• 1:44:08Dax Shepard?

  You could get XIXI.

• 1:44:11Dax Shepard?

  It wouldn't be so obvious.

• 1:44:12Speaker 01

  I know, but you know, I'm not really into Roman numerals.

• 1:44:14Dax Shepard?

  Those, that's pretty, that's pretty basic stuff.

• 1:44:16Speaker 01

  It's not even, it's just like.

• 1:44:18Dax Shepard?

  It's basic.

• 1:44:19Speaker 01

  It's not for me.

• 1:44:20Dax Shepard?

  It is basic.

• 1:44:21Speaker 01

  Oh my God.

• 1:44:25Dax Shepard?

  Wait, is this real?

• 1:44:26Speaker 05

  I think so.

• 1:44:28Dax Shepard?

  Okay. So for the listener, Rob just put up a photo of Jennifer Aniston, Jen Aniston, and seemingly she has 1111 tattooed on her wrist.

• 1:44:38Speaker 01

  Oh, or maybe, oh my God.

• 1:44:42Dax Shepard?

  My God, yeah. Now you can't because if she, if we ever interview her and you have the same tattoo as her.

• 1:44:49Speaker 01

  But now I have to.

• 1:44:50Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that tipped it.

• 1:44:52Speaker 01

  It was always meant to be.

• 1:44:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:44:56Speaker 01

  Should I get one? Like, cause I, since I don't really want anyone to see, you think I could just get a really tiny one in between my, um, big toe and my second toe?

• 1:45:05Dax Shepard?

  Toes are rough. The skin rubs off a lot. Uh, fingers, digits, they can be tough. Like my bell's not holding up like the rest of my tattoos.

• 1:45:14Speaker 01

  Well, how bad have you ever gotten one in here?

• 1:45:17Dax Shepard?

  It's hard. Yeah, I guess that skin's, uh, it's hard for the tattoo to stay there for whatever reason. I don't know why.

• 1:45:26Speaker 03

  Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare.

• 1:45:32Dax Shepard?

  We get support from Skims. So Monica just informed me that she's a girl's girl and I nodded like I knew exactly what that meant.

• 1:45:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, but the girls who get it, they get it.

• 1:45:44Dax Shepard?

  Okay. But for those of us who are clearly not girls, walk me through it.

• 1:45:47Speaker 01

  Well, you know how much I love my Skims fleece joggers because the plush fleece is so soft. It's cozy. It's really comfortable without feeling too heavy. Well, I went to friend them and she would not stop talking about how comfy they were. She almost didn't give them back to me, which was upsetting, but I'm a girl's girl. So I let her have it.

• 1:46:05Dax Shepard?

  Great, great, great.

• 1:46:06Speaker 01

  So the sleep sets are awesome because they are very soft and comfortable, but they're cute. If I'm in my sleep set, I feel fine about going down the street to pick up my food. I'm still looking cute, but I'm comfy and I'm cozy.

• 1:46:19Dax Shepard?

  Roger.

• 1:46:20Speaker 01

  Really fun thing to do is if you're going on vacation with your girlfriends to get matching Skims pajamas. I've done this with Callie and it is so fun. First of all, the pics are so cute. But also it's just fun and friendship.

• 1:46:32Dax Shepard?

  So a girl's girl is looking out for your friends with better loungewear. I get it. Am I one of your girls now?

• 1:46:38Speaker 01

  You are. You and the other girlies can shop my favorite loungewear and pajamas at skims.com. After you place your order, be sure to let them know we sent you. Select podcasts in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows.

• 1:46:58Dax Shepard?

  Do you want to hear my maximum Sim event of my entire life, other than when I guessed the song you were, you had made up, Xanthum Gum?

• 1:47:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:47:05Dax Shepard?

  That still is like, that can't have happened.

• 1:47:08Speaker 01

  I know.

• 1:47:09Dax Shepard?

  Um, Xanthum Gum.

• 1:47:15Dax Shepard?

  Okay, so I wrote this script called Send Lawyers, Guns and Money.

• 1:47:19Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:47:20Dax Shepard?

  And it was about my last week of drinking in Kauai.

• 1:47:23Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:47:24Dax Shepard?

  And while I was writing it, I'm just like swimming in the Warren Zevon song, Send Lawyers, Guns and Money. Do you know that song?

• 1:47:32Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:47:32Dax Shepard?

  Okay, I'll cover my face and sing it to you. I took home the barmaid, ding ding ding ding ding, like I always do. How was I to know she was with the Russian too? Hey, and it's send lawyers, guns and money. The shit has hit the fan. So as I'm writing this script, and it's about my last week in Hawaii abusing, I decide I should learn to play that guitar. I should learn to play that song on the guitar. So I go on YouTube and I'm trying to find some footage of him playing that so I can look at the chords. And I find this video of him in a small venue and he's talking to the crowd.

• 1:48:14Dax Shepard?

  And he says, I wrote this song after, oh, I gotta add, my last week of, of, of drinking in, in Hawaii was, I was taking a vacation between movies because I was exhausted and I needed a break.

• 1:48:27Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:48:28Dax Shepard?

  It didn't turn out to be a replenishing trip, as you can imagine.

• 1:48:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:48:32Dax Shepard?

  So he goes, um, yeah, I wrote this song after a couple of years of hard work and I decided to take an aisle, a trip down to the islands of Hawaii. And after a week of improbable danger and something, I decided I shouldn't take vacations. I took home the barmaid and I was sitting at the computer going, what the fuck? This song is about his week in Hawaii?

• 1:48:58Speaker 01

  That's wild.

• 1:48:59Dax Shepard?

  I thought it was gonna evaporate into the clouds at that point.

• 1:49:02Speaker 01

  My dad was helping your sim even before we met.

• 1:49:06Dax Shepard?

  Well, it's all been orchestrated from 1987. You don't even, we don't even know if I existed before 1987.

• 1:49:12Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:49:13Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:14Speaker 01

  Because even for you, that was the best year of your life.

• 1:49:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:17Speaker 01

  So like, it's all really, it's stinky.

• 1:49:21Dax Shepard?

  Fucking stank.

• 1:49:22Speaker 01

  Really stinky in here. Anyway, so birthday luck is continuing.

• 1:49:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:27Speaker 01

  Um, birthday weekend, weekend was really nice. Ended up at the, oh, I wanted to check something, maybe another sim moment.

• 1:49:37Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:49:38Speaker 01

  Um, can I look up when War Dogs was? I'm gonna, I already did. 2016, dang.

• 1:49:47Dax Shepard?

  Oops.

• 1:49:48Speaker 01

  One year off. Okay, because in 2016, it was my birthday.

• 1:49:58Speaker 01

  And Kristen planned.

• 1:50:00Dax Shepard?

  You're turning 29?

• 1:50:02Speaker 01

  I guess.

• 1:50:03Dax Shepard?

  No.

• 1:50:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, I was turning 29 and Kristen planned an escape room party for me and her and you and a group of people. It was, it was really exciting. We get there, go inside, we're ready to escape. And she had accidentally booked it for the wrong day.

• 1:50:22Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:50:23Speaker 01

  Which was fine. It was like, what are we gonna do now?

• 1:50:25Dax Shepard?

  Textbook bell.

• 1:50:26Speaker 01

  It is.

• 1:50:27Dax Shepard?

  This is kind of her move.

• 1:50:28Speaker 01

  It happens.

• 1:50:28Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:50:29Speaker 01

  So, you know, it was like, what are we gonna do now? And we pivoted plans. It was your idea.

• 1:50:35Dax Shepard?

  Uh huh.

• 1:50:35Speaker 01

  You said, let's go to the chateau.

• 1:50:38Dax Shepard?

  And have some bolognese.

• 1:50:39Speaker 01

  Have bolognese. I had never been there and I'd been trying to go for a long time.

• 1:50:44Dax Shepard?

  Sure.

• 1:50:45Speaker 01

  And it was really exciting and fun. Then we saw War Dogs. That was like a big birthday, I remember, and it was a good pivot and the bolognese was so good and it was very exciting.

• 1:50:55Speaker 01

  And on my birthday, it was a lazy day. I stayed at the Four Seasons. So then I like woke up and I was just lazy. Callie told me I should order a milkshake in my robe.

• 1:51:08Dax Shepard?

  Oh wow.

• 1:51:08Speaker 01

  Room service. I didn't.

• 1:51:09Dax Shepard?

  Oh, okay.

• 1:51:10Speaker 01

  Um, but I won't.

• 1:51:11Dax Shepard?

  That's a rough way to start your day.

• 1:51:12Speaker 01

  That's why. I was like, it's too early.

• 1:51:14Dax Shepard?

  Be downhill from there.

• 1:51:14Speaker 01

  But it also sounded nice, but yeah.

• 1:51:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:17Speaker 01

  Anyway, and then, um, I went to Sunset Tower. Oh, I went shopping. I got myself a cute outfit. And I went to Sunset Tower and then Sunset Tower turned into the chateau where I had bolognese for dinner.

• 1:51:33Dax Shepard?

  You did?

• 1:51:33Speaker 01

  I did. And I thought, oh my gosh.

• 1:51:35Dax Shepard?

  Did you see anyone?

• 1:51:36Speaker 01

  No, I don't think so. I don't really look.

• 1:51:38Dax Shepard?

  You don't see very well.

• 1:51:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't have good eyes.

• 1:51:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:40Speaker 01

  Um, and I thought it was its 10 year anniversary, but I guess it was its nine year anniversary.

• 1:51:47Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 1:51:48Speaker 01

  So that is not as sim as I wanted it to be.

• 1:51:51Dax Shepard?

  Okay, it's still great.

• 1:51:53Speaker 01

  Still great.

• 1:51:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah. That's a fun tradition.

• 1:51:56Speaker 01

  It is a fun tradition. Maybe I'll, maybe that'll be a new tradition.

• 1:51:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:52:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:52:02Dax Shepard?

  You wanna ask Monica out?

• 1:52:05Speaker 01

  Oh yeah. Speaking of this.

• 1:52:06Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:52:07Speaker 01

  I probably shouldn't do it like this with this like long, this like long face.

• 1:52:11Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, it sounds like bad news is coming.

• 1:52:12Speaker 01

  It's not bad news. Great news. Great news for the world. Travis and Taylor are engaged.

• 1:52:18Dax Shepard?

  Oh, right, yeah.

• 1:52:19Speaker 01

  And everyone is happy and I'm so happy. She seems so happy. It makes me feel really. Um, fuzzy like she got it all and she deserves it and I, I love it and it's hopeful.

• 1:52:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, great.

• 1:52:33Speaker 01

  You know, Lincoln said that they like announced it. They either announced it or like a teacher, the teacher came like into the classroom and told everyone.

• 1:52:41Dax Shepard?

  Oh, really? Yeah, it's all-girls school.

• 1:52:42Speaker 01

  All-girls school. This is incredible. Anyway, um, but I, I forgot that the whole reason they're together is their podcast. New Heights. He, so he went to the concert to try to give her his phone number. Yes. And, but he didn't. He couldn't see her. So then on the show, his brother asked, how was the concert? He said, well, I'm kind of butt hurt because I really wanted to talk to her, but she doesn't talk to people before or after shows. And I wanted to give her my bracelet. It has my phone number on it.

• 1:53:16Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:53:18Dax Shepard?

  That's cute. Oh, did he put his phone number in the bracelet?

• 1:53:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:20Dax Shepard?

  Oh, that's adorable. Yeah, yeah.

• 1:53:22Speaker 01

  And look, that got him a wife.

• 1:53:26Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:53:27Speaker 01

  And here we are.

• 1:53:28Dax Shepard?

  One of the more coveted wives out there. Yeah.

• 1:53:32Speaker 01

  Yes. And here we are almost eight years in to this show and I have zero husbands.

• 1:53:38Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, but, but, but.

• 1:53:42Speaker 01

  Okay, so I don't mean to complain.

• 1:53:44Dax Shepard?

  She heard that.

• 1:53:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:53:46Dax Shepard?

  And then she reached out and he said, yes.

• 1:53:48Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 1:53:49Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, there's a lot of people in the comments that are saying you're hot. They want to meet you, but see, you.

• 1:53:56Speaker 01

  Go ahead.

• 1:53:57Dax Shepard?

  You have said many times you don't want to date a listener.

• 1:54:00Speaker 01

  Unless they're Taylor Swift.

• 1:54:02Dax Shepard?

  Okay, okay.

• 1:54:04Speaker 01

  Also, she wasn't a listener. Just got back to her.

• 1:54:07Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 1:54:08Speaker 01

  Okay, so who, like, I mean, I could on here, you know what's unfair? I, I would look crazy and he didn't look crazy. And that's.

• 1:54:17Dax Shepard?

  Well, he had a lot going for him. No, it's not.

• 1:54:20Speaker 01

  Well, I have a lot going for me. What do you mean?

• 1:54:23Dax Shepard?

  No, it's, it's, it's inherently adorable that this enormous football player.

• 1:54:30Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:54:31Dax Shepard?

  This gruff bone crusher made a Taylor Swift bracelet.

• 1:54:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:54:36Dax Shepard?

  So you have to do something as completely out of the box as that. That's what made that so adorable. It's like, oh, wow, that guy made a bracelet with his number for Taylor Swift.

• 1:54:46Speaker 01

  It was really cute.

• 1:54:46Dax Shepard?

  There's a lot to the product, you know, it's not.

• 1:54:48Speaker 01

  So what am I supposed to do? Like go beat someone up? And then have scars on and like talk about that?

• 1:54:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I mean, get good with a butterfly knife and pull a butterfly knife. Like you gotta, you gotta put the same effort he put into it.

• 1:55:01Speaker 01

  It takes like four minutes to make a friendship bracelet.

• 1:55:04Dax Shepard?

  You have to start by pursuing someone, which he did. Yeah. So yeah, you're gonna have to pursue like he did. And then he got the woman of his dreams.

• 1:55:13Speaker 01

  Okay, you're, yes, that is all true. This is all correct, but, and I'm kidding. And I do think, maybe I'm wrong, but I wanna be honest.

• 1:55:23Dax Shepard?

  Feeling to know that you're right.

• 1:55:25Speaker 01

  I wanna be honest. I think if a girl did that, did that exact thing, he did.

• 1:55:32Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:33Speaker 01

  Went to Chris Martin's show.

• 1:55:35Dax Shepard?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:55:35Speaker 01

  Wanted to give him a thing, didn't get to, went on her podcast and was like, ugh, like I didn't get to give him my phone number. I'm sad about that. I don't think people would think it was as cute as what happened.

• 1:55:51Dax Shepard?

  Again, you're trying to frame it as female male.

• 1:55:53Speaker 01

  I'm just asking. I'm not trying to say it's sexist, but I'm really trying, like, I'm being honest.

• 1:55:57Dax Shepard?

  Well, you said if a girl did that.

• 1:55:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:56:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah. So you are framing it as a, there's a double standard between men and women.

• 1:56:03Speaker 01

  But I'm not trying to make it. I'm just being honest about the fact that I think I even would be like, that's not cute.

• 1:56:09Dax Shepard?

  If he had gone to a Shania Twain concert, hoping to bump into her and give her a number, that's not what it was. You're, you're really ignoring the fact that it was a huge NFL player that was a Swifty. That was such a, that, that's such a unique thing. That's what's happening there. It's not that he's male or female. It's that here, here's the last guy you expect to be a Swifty is a Swifty.

• 1:56:32Speaker 01

  Well, then, okay, so then that's, so if you're reversing it.

• 1:56:37Dax Shepard?

  You going and finding some grungy punk rock dude and you come and bring him flowers or something, you know, that's.

• 1:56:43Speaker 01

  That's just not my type.

• 1:56:44Dax Shepard?

  Right. But that's why that's not a story. But it's not because you're a woman. It's because it's not this crazy first time you've ever heard this.

• 1:56:52Speaker 01

  Yeah. Was he a Swifty or was he just wanting to date her?

• 1:56:56Dax Shepard?

  I think he's a Swifty.

• 1:56:57Speaker 01

  Well, now.

• 1:56:58Dax Shepard?

  Knows to make the bracelet.

• 1:56:59Speaker 01

  Now he's a Swifty.

• 1:57:00Dax Shepard?

  I bet he's a Swifty. A lot of, Andrew Schultz is a huge Swifty.

• 1:57:04Speaker 01

  I know. So then if a lot of people are Swifties, then why would it be?

• 1:57:10Dax Shepard?

  Mostly.

• 1:57:12Dax Shepard?

  Women are Swifties. I've been to a show. It's ninety plus percent female.

• 1:57:17Speaker 01

  Hmm, yeah, I guess.

• 1:57:19Dax Shepard?

  That might be an exaggeration.

• 1:57:20Speaker 01

  Now we're doing like.

• 1:57:20Dax Shepard?

  It's, it's, it's very female.

• 1:57:22Speaker 01

  Okay, well, whatever. I guess this is getting twisted.

• 1:57:24Dax Shepard?

  So if you were like, if there was like some punk band that only dudes liked, Megadeth.

• 1:57:29Speaker 01

  Ew.

• 1:57:30Dax Shepard?

  See, this.

• 1:57:31Speaker 01

  I don't even know what that is, but I'm never gonna date a death guy. Pro death, not even pro.

• 1:57:38Dax Shepard?

  We're trying to make this apples to apples. So you would have to have entered into the most masculine scene. And people go like, oh, my God, this cute little girl.

• 1:57:48Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:57:49Dax Shepard?

  Likes these.

• 1:57:49Speaker 01

  Oh, my God, that guy kinda looks like you on the right.

• 1:57:53Dax Shepard?

  Oh, boy, that's not flattering.

• 1:57:54Speaker 01

  No, different hair. What do you mean? He's not, he's not unattractive.

• 1:58:01Dax Shepard?

  That's a story. That's, that's my point, is you showing up at that show, is you showing up at a Slayer show and you're in love with the drummer is hilarious.

• 1:58:10Speaker 05

  This is them now, so they're maybe a little older for it.

• 1:58:12Dax Shepard?

  You know, yeah, you gotta find the equivalent of Megadeth or Metallica of this era. And people go like, oh, that super cute liberal little podcast host loved that crazy maniac rocker. That's a story.

• 1:58:28Speaker 01

  But I'm gonna push on back on that, like, it's not, it's not crazy for any man to like Taylor Swift. She's a, she's a very cute blonde, pretty girl with a, with a talent.

• 1:58:46Dax Shepard?

  I think it's crazy and the, and the reaction would substantiate that, that a, that one of the most gruesome NFL players was a Swifty. That is, that's why it was so contagious.

• 1:58:57Speaker 01

  Versus wanted to go on a date with her.

• 1:58:59Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I'm saying Swifty.

• 1:59:01Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:59:01Dax Shepard?

  When I heard it, it was like, this guy knows about the bracelets. He made her a bracelet. He's a Swifty.

• 1:59:05Speaker 01

  Okay, can, we can't, you're saying it so like you know a hundred percent and we don't. Cause he went there, he said he went there.

• 1:59:15Dax Shepard?

  Cause he was a Swiftie, he's in love with her and he wanted to give her a number.

• 1:59:18Speaker 01

  He, he, he wanted, yeah, he wanted to give her.

• 1:59:21Dax Shepard?

  You're saying he just wanted to fuck her.

• 1:59:22Speaker 01

  No, I'm not saying that. I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying he liked her. Like he was like, I want to date that girl. That girl seems awesome. She's pretty. She's talented. She's cool. I want to date her. Like I think a lot of men think about Taylor. I will say, and I don't know about the Megadeth community, but my guess is, um.

• 1:59:44Dax Shepard?

  Great backstory. Dave Mustang was in Metallica and left. He got kicked out of the band and then started that band, which became their big rival.

• 1:59:52Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 1:59:53Dax Shepard?

  Right, Rob? Is that the story?

• 1:59:54Speaker 05

  Yeah, he's in the doc talking about how it haunted him, even though he sold 15 million records still.

• 2:00:01Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 2:00:01Dax Shepard?

  Still thought about getting kicked out of Metallica.

• 2:00:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, um, I'm sure a lot of women want to date and marry them.

• 2:00:11Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:00:11Speaker 01

  Marrying Megadeth, I'm going to just say as a whole.

• 2:00:14Dax Shepard?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:00:15Speaker 01

  Is, um, a real choice, like.

• 2:00:17Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you don't want to, and I.

• 2:00:19Speaker 01

  Well, I don't know. I've never met them, so maybe I'd love them.

• 2:00:21Dax Shepard?

  They're also way older.

• 2:00:22Speaker 01

  Okay, I don't care.

• 2:00:24Dax Shepard?

  Again, I'm saying the equivalent of Megadeth.

• 2:00:26Speaker 01

  I know, but I'm just saying, I think that's like a real choice. And, um, I think dating Taylor is, is like dating, um, Bradley. Or like Timmy, or like someone huge in the popular zeitgeist, not niche.

• 2:00:49Dax Shepard?

  Okay. Uh, they're enormous. They sold 50 million.

• 2:00:52Speaker 01

  Okay, great. I'm proud of them.

• 2:00:53Dax Shepard?

  Metallica's not niche at all. Metallica's.

• 2:00:55Speaker 01

  I know, but.

• 2:00:55Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:00:56Speaker 01

  But no, it's still niche to date.

• 2:00:58Dax Shepard?

  What I think, we have a different opinion. I think what was charming about the entire Travis Taylor story is that this big NFL player was a sweetie at heart because he was a Swiftie.

• 2:01:08Speaker 01

  He's a sweet boy.

• 2:01:09Dax Shepard?

  And I think an equally big story would be that this sweetie liberal little girl is into this crazy off the chain band. That's the story that I'm seeing. Other people would also find that charming. And the members would be, the guys, the women that came to shows, I've been to these shows, the ones that came that were attracted to Megadeth, they looked like they were in Megadeth.

• 2:01:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 2:01:34Dax Shepard?

  You don't. If you showed up in the row with flowers, that's a story.

• 2:01:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, but I just don't like that music very much.

• 2:01:42Dax Shepard?

  No one think you're crazy. They'd be so charmed by how unexpected this obsession is of yours.

• 2:01:46Speaker 01

  Right. I guess you're right. There's an element of unexpected. I'm just, the problem is I'm not unexpected.

• 2:01:55Dax Shepard?

  Yes, you are in areas that you don't have any interest in.

• 2:01:58Speaker 01

  What do you mean?

• 2:01:59Dax Shepard?

  You don't like Metallica.

• 2:02:01Speaker 01

  That's what I'm saying. That's expected. I'm saying I'm not, I'm saying the problem is I'm not unexpected. The things I like are expected.

• 2:02:09Dax Shepard?

  Right.

• 2:02:10Speaker 01

  So this is the problem, is my point.

• 2:02:12Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:12Speaker 01

  So I'm not gonna be able to go to Megadeth.

• 2:02:16Dax Shepard?

  You're gonna give flowers to the same guy every girl likes already.

• 2:02:20Speaker 01

  Should I say it? That it's Josh O'Connor?

• 2:02:22Dax Shepard?

  Say it. I don't know why we're holding back.

• 2:02:24Speaker 01

  But he is dating someone.

• 2:02:25Dax Shepard?

  He's not always gonna be dating someone.

• 2:02:26Speaker 01

  Maybe he is, and I wish them well if that's true. Josh O'Connor is extremely attractive, and I find him very cute and endearing and fashion.

• 2:02:35Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:36Speaker 01

  And he is exactly expected for who I would like.

• 2:02:40Dax Shepard?

  That's right.

• 2:02:41Speaker 01

  So it's not gonna come as a shock, but I guess I'm calling it in, but I'm not, because that's actually rude, because he's dating someone.

• 2:02:49Dax Shepard?

  Like, if you tried to date Ben Shapiro?

• 2:02:52Speaker 01

  Dax.

• 2:02:54Dax Shepard?

  I'm saying if you tried to date Ben Shapiro.

• 2:02:57Speaker 01

  You're putting me in a tough stick.

• 2:02:58Dax Shepard?

  He would absolutely notice that happen. He'd be like, you're kidding me. She, she wrote me a letter and likes me? Of another right wing, it wouldn't break through the clutter.

• 2:03:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's fine. I'm not, I can't go against my values. I don't think Travis went against his values. And I don't think, me, it wouldn't be going against my values for Megadeth either, because I don't know, well, unless, again, I'm not really pro that, so maybe it is against my values, but I...

• 2:03:28Dax Shepard?

  You think about it a lot, and so do they, so that's a good match made in heaven.

• 2:03:35Dax Shepard?

  They're just more mega of what you already are.

• 2:03:38Speaker 01

  That wouldn't be a good match. I need someone to

• 2:03:41Dax Shepard?

  You need someone.

• 2:03:42Speaker 01

  The death talk, you know?

• 2:03:44Dax Shepard?

  That's true. That's true. Should we do some facts?

• 2:03:47Speaker 01

  Sure.

• 2:03:48Speaker 05

  You should date the singer of Ghost. That's, that's some equivalent.

• 2:03:52Dax Shepard?

  Or if Monica hit on one of them.

• 2:03:53Speaker 01

  Oh!

• 2:03:54Dax Shepard?

  I was gonna say Guar.

• 2:03:55Speaker 05

  Guar was on there.

• 2:03:57Dax Shepard?

  Tried to date one of the Guar guys.

• 2:03:58Speaker 05

  I think they're older.

• 2:04:00Dax Shepard?

  Show up at your Guar. I know they're too old, but that guy doesn't look terribly young either.

• 2:04:04Speaker 01

  Creeps, Rob. What?

• 2:04:06Dax Shepard?

  Where do you see Guar?

• 2:04:07Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:04:10Speaker 05

  I gotta get a good one.

• 2:04:11Dax Shepard?

  Truly, you'd stop the whole show. If you got up on stage during Guar and presented one of them with like an axe, like a custom engraved axe.

• 2:04:20Speaker 01

  Oh my god. I'm gonna have nightmares about that.

• 2:04:26Dax Shepard?

  People, that would make national news.

• 2:04:29Speaker 01

  Oh my god, I, take that down. That is truly scary.

• 2:04:34Dax Shepard?

  They like shoot blood out of their guitars.

• 2:04:35Speaker 01

  Penis. Oh.

• 2:04:37Speaker 05

  Oh yeah, they have like, here, wait, I got one more.

• 2:04:40Speaker 01

  Spikes on his penis.

• 2:04:40Dax Shepard?

  Show the whole band. That one was a little intense.

• 2:04:44Speaker 05

  This guy, his penis is out.

• 2:04:47Dax Shepard?

  Oh, he's got several penises.

• 2:04:48Speaker 01

  Penis is out.

• 2:04:49Dax Shepard?

  He's got several.

• 2:04:50Speaker 05

  I mean, it's not, it's not his real penis.

• 2:04:52Dax Shepard?

  No, they're prosthetics.

• 2:04:53Speaker 05

  They shoot like blood.

• 2:04:54Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, and he's got two of them.

• 2:04:56Speaker 01

  You guys.

• 2:04:57Dax Shepard?

  Oh, there's the whole gang.

• 2:05:00Speaker 01

  This is so unfair. I have to date Guar?

• 2:05:03Dax Shepard?

  No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying you have to date Guar. I'm saying if you want it to be the same story.

• 2:05:09Speaker 01

  But it's so unfair.

• 2:05:10Dax Shepard?

  It's gotta be that crazy where people go like, I can't believe Monica likes Guar.

• 2:05:15Speaker 01

  I don't think it's gonna work out with me and Guar.

• 2:05:17Dax Shepard?

  Oh, let's put it another way. Now, he's turned a corner, but there was a period where Marilyn Manson could have been the thing. Cause he, right after Bowling Kalimbine, and all we really knew was like, wow, this guy's way fucking smarter and more thoughtful than we knew. And you were super into it, and you came this little good girl

• 2:05:37Dax Shepard?

  from a podcast and you approached him.

• 2:05:39Speaker 01

  I'm not a good girl.

• 2:05:40Dax Shepard?

  It would, it would, it would catch his attention.

• 2:05:44Speaker 01

  I am not interested in people who like to scare other people. Okay?

• 2:05:50Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, so it's not gonna happen.

• 2:05:52Speaker 01

  Anyway, um, Guar, call me.

• 2:05:58Dax Shepard?

  Hit me on Instagram, Guar.

• 2:06:01Speaker 01

  Okay, so he's he has nasal polyps, unfortunately.

• 2:06:05Dax Shepard?

  Jason?

• 2:06:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:06:06Dax Shepard?

  Phew, that sounds rough.

• 2:06:08Speaker 01

  Nasal polyps are soft, painless, non cancerous growth that develop in the lining of the nose or sinuses. They are often associated with chronic inflammation and can cause nasal congestion, a runny nose, and impaired sense of smell.

• 2:06:21Dax Shepard?

  Do you think I have nasal polyps?

• 2:06:23Speaker 01

  Um.

• 2:06:24Dax Shepard?

  I thought I had allergies, but maybe I have some. I doubt I have polyps because I get the screen all the time, the uh, the butt exam, colonoscopy, and they've never found a polyp. So I don't think I'm polyp prone.

• 2:06:36Speaker 01

  Are they looking in your nose?

• 2:06:37Dax Shepard?

  No, but I'm I'm thinking if you're a polyp-y person, you're a polyp-y person.

• 2:06:41Speaker 01

  I don't want to make that connection.

• 2:06:43Dax Shepard?

  Everyone get a colonoscopy.

• 2:06:44Speaker 01

  Um.

• 2:06:46Dax Shepard?

  Wow, though, that's those are all my symptoms.

• 2:06:47Speaker 01

  No, you have a, you can smell things.

• 2:06:49Dax Shepard?

  I don't know. Remember I smelled your shirt the other day and I couldn't smell anything?

• 2:06:52Speaker 01

  No, you walked in and you were like, something smells funny that no one else smelled. And then I assumed it was my vintage shirt.

• 2:06:57Dax Shepard?

  Maybe I was smelling my polyps. Maybe they smell musty.

• 2:06:59Speaker 01

  Well, that's possible. Well, anyone can get them. They're more common in adults, particularly those with conditions like asthma or allergies. Treatment options range from medications to surgery, depending on the size and severity of the polyps. So he want, he needs surgery, but he doesn't want to get it.

• 2:07:17Dax Shepard?

  Scary.

• 2:07:18Speaker 01

  Very scary.

• 2:07:19Dax Shepard?

  And when you're, that's your career.

• 2:07:21Speaker 01

  I know.

• 2:07:21Dax Shepard?

  Getting in there and messing around, monkeying around.

• 2:07:24Speaker 01

  Although, you know what's funny, speaking of surgeries and people getting plastic surgery?

• 2:07:30Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:31Speaker 01

  You know, it is like, people are really willy nilly with their, their face and their face is what got them there in the first place.

• 2:07:40Dax Shepard?

  It's the moneymaker.

• 2:07:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's tricky.

• 2:07:42Dax Shepard?

  I think facelifts have evolved. I think they too have like gone through the same radical progress all medicine has. I think they're different than. In the seventies when Burt Reynolds was getting them, you know?

• 2:07:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, more people are getting them, that's for sure.

• 2:07:59Dax Shepard?

  They're different now, too. I think there's like different versions that you can get that aren't just like, you know, the Burt Reynolds kind.

• 2:08:06Speaker 01

  I don't know. I think it's still like, it's still in a

• 2:08:10Dax Shepard?

  Still Burt Reynolds?

• 2:08:10Speaker 01

  Surgery, I think. But yeah, like you gotta be careful.

• 2:08:14Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, I keep hearing they're very common. Are you hearing this too?

• 2:08:17Speaker 01

  A lot of people apparently

• 2:08:19Dax Shepard?

  Yes, apparently.

• 2:08:20Speaker 01

  Have them. I

• 2:08:22Dax Shepard?

  Have you had one?

• 2:08:23Speaker 01

  No.

• 2:08:24Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:08:25Speaker 01

  No, but then

• 2:08:26Dax Shepard?

  I would love one, but when could I do it? When would I be able to recover? We're on camera every day of the year. Yeah.

• 2:08:32Speaker 01

  Um, I don't think you should get it. Like I

• 2:08:36Dax Shepard?

  I'm not good looking enough. Like, that's not my brand. You know, if I was like a pretty boy or gorgeous, I'd have to. That's my thing.

• 2:08:43Speaker 01

  Well.

• 2:08:43Dax Shepard?

  And I'm just kinda like, someone wrote in a comment, I, oh, cause I talked to camera to explain why the episode wasn't up. And a guy wrote, your face looks like a scrotum.

• 2:08:53Speaker 01

  Okay, but Dax, that's also because

• 2:08:55Dax Shepard?

  Is that accurate?

• 2:08:56Speaker 01

  No, it's not. But I did watch the video and I was like, why is he holding it like that?

• 2:09:02Dax Shepard?

  You thought it looked like a scrotum too?

• 2:09:04Speaker 01

  I did not think that, but I did think, um, he, he is putting zero effort into like making himself look how he actually looks. Like it was like held it kind of a weird angle.

• 2:09:18Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you know why?

• 2:09:19Speaker 01

  And then you're like rubbing your eyes.

• 2:09:20Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, you know why?

• 2:09:22Speaker 01

  Why? You're on the toilet?

• 2:09:23Dax Shepard?

  A, I was, I was on the couch and I'm like, I gotta address this. It's so frustrating that people think we just didn't put an episode out.

• 2:09:29Speaker 01

  Right.

• 2:09:30Dax Shepard?

  And then I'm in my house and my kids are running around and like, I'm not trying to show too much of my internal, personal space. So I'm like trying to find an angle where you know, kids are running by.

• 2:09:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:09:40Dax Shepard?

  That, you know, and I, so I think it was a, it was a function over fashion.

• 2:09:45Speaker 01

  I understand.

• 2:09:45Dax Shepard?

  Decision.

• 2:09:46Speaker 01

  I understand.

• 2:09:47Dax Shepard?

  But the problem's been fixed and it's down now. Anyway.

• 2:09:50Speaker 01

  The epis- oh, it's, it's, you took the post down?

• 2:09:52Dax Shepard?

  It no longer was relevant.

• 2:09:53Speaker 01

  Oh, wow. Well, then no one can see what we're talking about.

• 2:09:55Dax Shepard?

  You were a little disappointed with the angle.

• 2:09:57Speaker 01

  Well, I was like

• 2:09:58Dax Shepard?

  He's really gotten reckless.

• 2:09:59Speaker 01

  I wish he could have. Talk to me about this before he did it. And then also like, we could have held the camera a little different or something. Anyway, um.

• 2:10:09Dax Shepard?

  Because people find everything like what's funny is so many, I kept seeing in the, the comments like, yeah, shut the door, the AC's on. And then I immediately get defensive and I'm like, the door was open? They think that we had the door open, the AC was on? No, they're talking about a little piece of paper that says on the door, shut the door, the AC's on, that they're reading backwards. It's not lit.

• 2:10:28Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:10:28Dax Shepard?

  I had to dig in this video to see what the hell they were talking about.

• 2:10:32Speaker 01

  Oh, wow.

• 2:10:33Dax Shepard?

  And that's what it was. That's why like, I had to hold it. We're just, you know, you can't see anything.

• 2:10:37Speaker 01

  Come in here and done it. This space is already exposed. Like, so just like check, you know, just like maybe check in with me. I have a lot of.

• 2:10:46Dax Shepard?

  You have a lot of thoughts about it.

• 2:10:47Speaker 01

  I have a lot of experience in, um, PR. Okay. Broken Bo Records. We said he joined in 2003, 2003.

• 2:11:02Dax Shepard?

  2003?

• 2:11:03Speaker 01

  2005.

• 2:11:05Dax Shepard?

  2005.

• 2:11:06Speaker 01

  According to the internet.

• 2:11:07Dax Shepard?

  Okay.

• 2:11:07Speaker 01

  Did Waylon Jennings have a history of cheating? Yes, he had a reputation for infidelity during his marriage to Jesse Colter. While they were a couple known for their strong partnership and love, both in life and music, Jennings also struggled with substance abuse and infidelity, which was openly discussed in Jesse Colter's autobiography.

• 2:11:27Dax Shepard?

  Ooh, I should read that.

• 2:11:28Speaker 01

  Yeah, you should. Um, okay. The Vegas shooting. I was really grateful that he talked about it.

• 2:11:36Dax Shepard?

  Me too.

• 2:11:37Speaker 01

  Cause that's a really vulnerable, hard thing to talk about.

• 2:11:40Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:11:40Speaker 01

  And I was happy that he did, impressed that he did.

• 2:11:44Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:11:44Speaker 01

  It was in 2017. It was really bad. Deadliest mass shooting, uh, by a lone gunman in American history.

• 2:11:54Dax Shepard?

  Horrendous.

• 2:11:55Speaker 01

  Horrendous. Um, and.

• 2:11:58Speaker 01

  I can't imagine being

• 2:12:01Dax Shepard?

  At this show, yeah.

• 2:12:02Speaker 01

  Being the person that has all these people here.

• 2:12:05Dax Shepard?

  You know, if that happened at our, a live of it,

• 2:12:07Speaker 01

  Oh my.

• 2:12:08Dax Shepard?

  The guilt I'd have over.

• 2:12:09Speaker 01

  Oh my god. Um, but then we talked about SN, him doing SNL, and then he was saying that he wrote his own, like, he was like, I'm not having anyone write anything for me for that. Um, so he wrote with his people, I guess. And he said this, "I'm Jason Aldean. This week, we witnessed one of the worst tragedies in American history. Like everyone, I'm struggling to understand what happened that night, how to pick up the pieces and start to heal. So many people are hurting. There are children, parents, brothers, sisters, friends, and they are all part of our family. So I want to say to them, we hurt for you and we hurt with you. You can be sure that we're going to walk through these tough times together every step of the way, because when America is at its best, our bond and our spirit are unbreakable."

• 2:12:53Speaker 01

  And then he played Tom Petty's "I Won't Back Down", because he had just passed away.

• 2:12:57Dax Shepard?

  Yeah.

• 2:12:58Speaker 01

  A lot happened.

• 2:13:00Dax Shepard?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:13:01Speaker 01

  So, um, oh, and it was Gal Gadot.

• 2:13:05Dax Shepard?

  Was the host.

• 2:13:06Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm. Um, okay, well, that's it.

• 2:13:11Dax Shepard?

  That's it? All right, love you.

• 2:13:13Speaker 01

  Love you.