Pod Insights Scamfluencers Sean Kingston: Beautiful Lies | 209 About this episode When Sean Kinsgston burst onto the music scene as a teenager, he seemed like a feel-good success story – an upbeat, clean-cut star collaborating with artists like Justin Bieber. But behind the glossy image was a far darker reality. Before Sean’s career even took off, his mother and sister had served time for identity theft. And when the money from his music could no longer cover the family’s bills, Sean steps into the same world of fraud. Using his name – and the names of his celebrity friends – he racks up hundreds of thousands of dollars in luxury goods and unpaid debts, convincing vendors that payment is always just around the corner. For a while, his reputation opens doors. But eventually, the goodwill runs out, the bills come due, and the fame that once helped Sean get whatever he wanted begins to close in on him.
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Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Sarah Hagi? Audible subscribers can listen to all our episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free right now. Join Audible today by downloading the Audible app.
0:08 Scaachi Koul? A note to our listeners. This episode contains a brief mention of sexual assault. Please listen with care.
0:22 Scaachi Koul? Sarah, do you still listen to the radio? Because I feel like I have not really listened to the radio since, like, high school.
0:28 Sarah Hagi? Thank you for asking, because I wake up to a radio alarm clock, an old radio alarm clock. And you will not believe the songs I wake up to.
0:38 Scaachi Koul? My god, you do?
0:40 Sarah Hagi? Yes, every morning.
0:41 Scaachi Koul? Okay, wow. Well, I wanted to ask you, like, what do you remember from songs on the radio? But I feel like you probably can really answer this.
0:51 Sarah Hagi? The songs, listen, the stuff they were playing before, they're still playing now.
0:56 Scaachi Koul? Okay.
0:56 Sarah Hagi? "Time Is Frozen." The stuff that was on the radio when you were listening to the radio last, that is still the number one played music. I woke up, I'm not joking, "Evanescence Bring Me To Life." I swear to god.
1:11 Scaachi Koul? Okay, great, great, great.
1:12 Sarah Hagi? Yes, I listened to the radio.
1:13 Scaachi Koul? Okay, great.
1:16 Scaachi Koul? So you're prepped for today's story, which will take us back to my mom's sedan. We're driving to school together. We're listening to Top Hits in 2007. Because one of the guys who sang a song that got stuck in your head for an entire semester is actually just another prolific scammer.
1:38 Scaachi Koul? It's December 17, 2023, and Ariel Mateos is standing in the den of a Fort Lauderdale mansion. The house is brand new and aggressively modern, with white marble floors and massive windows that overlook a backyard pool. Ariel works for Ver Ver Entertainment, a company that sells high-end entertainment systems. A few days ago, he installed one of the largest screens they offer, a 232-inch television. Today, he's back to explain to the client how the set works. Apparently, screens this big can be finicky to operate. Once the client signs off on the job, Ariel will get paid. But this isn't just any client. He's arguably an even bigger deal than the television itself.
2:21 Scaachi Koul? We're talking about R&B singer Sean Kingston. Sarah, you might remember Sean from his smash hit, 2007's "Beautiful Girls." Can you sing me a line or two? And if you don't, I'll scream.
2:34 Sarah Hagi? You think I'm falling for that?
2:36 Scaachi Koul? Come on.
2:36 Sarah Hagi? So that you can make fun of me singing "Beautiful Girls" forever?
2:40 Scaachi Koul? I would never. I have never made fun of anybody in my entire life. I'm just a little baby.
2:47 Sarah Hagi? Well, let's just say they'll have you suicidal.
2:52 Sarah Hagi? These "Beautiful Girls."
2:53 Scaachi Koul? Do you remember when they censored the song because of that line?
2:57 Sarah Hagi? Yes, and you know what?
2:58 Scaachi Koul? Canadian airwaves were too sensitive for it.
3:01 Sarah Hagi? And they were right, but it's what a strong emotion. A girl so beautiful, you want to kill yourself?
3:07 Scaachi Koul? I have only ever hoped to meet someone like that.
3:11 Sarah Hagi? It's very romantic.
3:14 Scaachi Koul? Well, when Ariel first negotiated this deal, Sean traded heavily on his celebrity status. For instance, he offered to make a promotional video for Ver Ver with his friend Justin Bieber in exchange for a discount. He even texted Ariel, quote, "Mark my words, your life is going to change after this." Ariel thought this sounded like a great opportunity. It's good exposure to all of Sean and Justin's wealthy friends, aka his ideal customers. So he agreed and only asked for a $30,000 down payment. Now, the remaining balance, another $47,000, is due. But when it's time to settle up, Sean is nowhere to be found. Ariel is annoyed. He has vendors and employees to pay.
3:58 Scaachi Koul? But it's not like he can just rip this enormous television off the wall and walk out of the house with it. Plus, Sean is a celebrity living in an eight-bedroom mansion. Surely, he's good for it, right? So Ariel follows up a few days later, but Sean dodges him again. So Ariel follows up again and again. On December 26th, more than a week after their in-person meeting, Sean finally responds with yet another excuse for why the payment hasn't come through.
4:27 Sarah Hagi? Sarah, can you read what he texted?
4:29 Scaachi Koul? Yes, he texts.
4:30 Sarah Hagi? Okay, I'm in Dubai. Time is way different. Let me check with mom. What is this riddle? What am I trying to? How do I get to the bottom of this? Who's mom? His mom?
4:43 Scaachi Koul? Well, Sean's mom is also his business manager.
4:46 Sarah Hagi? Oh, no.
4:47 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. But she's no more helpful than her son. New Year's comes and goes. By mid-January, Ariel still hasn't received the money he was promised. Eventually, Sean says he's still out of town, but tells Ariel to stop by his house. His cousin will have a check. When Ariel arrives, Sean's cousin is there, but he says that he doesn't know anything about a check. At this point, Ariel has had enough. Can you read what he sends Sean next?
5:15 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, he says, I'm stopped talking to you. I'll start talking to the world about who you really are. Yeah, I mean, that'll get him.
5:23 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, and he means it. Ariel contacts a lawyer and prepares to sue Sean. What Ariel doesn't realize is that he's not alone. Authorities have begun to notice that Sean has been pulling scams like this for years. This dispute over a luxury television will eventually become part of a much larger federal case, one that threatens to unravel the reputation Sean has built over nearly two decades. Somebody call 911. There's a fire burning in Miami, and it's Sean's life that's about to go up in flames.
5:59 Speaker 02 Hi, I'm Kenya Barris.
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7:01 Speaker 04 The system may have given up on my mom, but I never will. Listen to My Mom's Murder wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all 10 episodes early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts.
7:22 Scaachi Koul? From Audible Originals, I'm Sachi Cole.
7:24 Sarah Hagi? And I'm Sarah Haggie.
7:25 Scaachi Koul? And this is Scamfluencers.
7:35 Scaachi Koul? When Sean Kingston first burst onto the music scene as a teenager, his image was upbeat and clean-cut. He spoke openly about overcoming homelessness and wanting to be a positive role model for his fans. What he rarely discussed was how he ended up on the streets in the first place because his mother and sister had gone to prison for identity theft. Years later, when the profits from Sean's music career can no longer pay the family's bills, he picks up where his mother left off. He racks up hundreds of thousands of dollars in debts by trading on his name and the names of his celebrity friends. But reputation can only take you so far. Eventually, the goodwill runs out. And when it does, the very fame that once opened doors for Sean will begin to close in on him. This is Sean Kingston: Beautiful Lives.
8:23 Scaachi Koul? To really understand Sean, we have to start with the woman who raises him, his mom, Janice Turner. Over the course of his childhood, she doesn't exactly model honesty or restraint. Janice is born in St. Catherine, Jamaica, in 1963. She later claims that her dad is Jack Ruby, a music producer who worked with acts like Bob Marley, which, if true, would mean she grew up around famous, successful musicians. Though, given Janice's complicated relationship with the truth, this claim is difficult to verify. In 1978, when she's about 15, Janice moves to the US, eventually settling in Broward County, Florida. In her 20s, she starts having kids. First comes a son, Kurt, and then a daughter, Kanima.
9:07 Scaachi Koul? In February of 1990, she gives birth to another son, Kishan, who everybody calls Sean. Janice is essentially raising the kids as a single mom, which makes it even harder for her when Sean turns out to be rebellious. So in 1995, when he's five years old, Janice moves the family back to Jamaica, hoping that her relatives there will keep him in line. That doesn't last, and the family returns to Miami in 1999. Sean is still rambunctious. At school, he's constantly mouthing off to teachers and getting into fights. He's charismatic, but has a temper, the kind of kid who commands a room and disrupts it at the same time. The only thing that seems to center Sean is music.
9:51 Scaachi Koul? He loves to sing, perform, and write lyrics. As a little kid, he would belt "I Will Always Love You" so hard that the veins in his neck would stand out. So Janice tries channeling Sean's energy in a more productive way. She buys him a home studio setup so that he can record himself.
10:09 Sarah Hagi? Wow, I mean, that is really supportive of your child's interests and maybe what they're good at. Pretty cool. I mean, I know, obviously, this is an episode of Scamfluencers, but I do think this specific move is nice.
10:22 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, I mean, it's an investment. This is the early 2000s, when digital technology is becoming more accessible and affordable. So, you know, for a parent trying to keep a kid out of trouble, it probably does feel like a worthwhile expense. And around this time, Janice launches a business called Dynamite Boutique. But by early 2004, she's facing financial troubles. One of her investors takes her to small claims court over unpaid debts, which means Janice needs to find a new way to bring in money. Through her church, she meets a woman named Immaculata, who mentions she's interested in buying a house. Janice sees an opportunity, so she tells Immaculata that she works in real estate and offers to help. As far as we know, Janice doesn't even have a real estate license.
11:07 Scaachi Koul? But she must seem credible because Immaculata sends her sensitive personal information, the kind needed to run credit checks and secure financing for a mortgage. But instead of helping her buy a home, Janice uses this information to open a checking account and a $7,500 line of credit in Immaculata's name. She also applies for a $41,000 car loan to purchase a Mercedes-Benz S500. Within days, Janice writes thousands of dollars' worth of checks from her fraudulent account. A few weeks later, she secures another loan, this time for a Mercedes C-Class. By February 2005, Janice has bought four cars on Immaculata's dime. Janice isn't acting entirely alone. She deposits some of the cash into her daughter Kanima's
11:52 Scaachi Koul? bank account, and 19-year-old Kanima helps pick up at least one of the new cars from the dealership.
11:59 Sarah Hagi? I mean, this is pretty crazy scamming that was set off just because she met someone who needed to buy a house. Like, she goes so far. But also, it's so twisted to have your teenage daughter, who is an adult but still a teenager, in on this scam. Like, implicating her is so terrible.
12:18 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it's not great. But for about six months, Janice is riding high. But then, in June 2005, she and Kanima are indicted on charges of making false loan applications and committing bank fraud. Immaculata finally checked her credit report and discovered loans that she hadn't taken out. And once she contacted the feds, they were able to figure out what was going on pretty quickly. They were also able to obtain surveillance footage of Janice and Kanima at banks and car dealerships. Both women ultimately plead guilty. Kanima gets probation, but Janice is sentenced to 16 months behind bars, which means she has to leave 15-year-old Sean in the care of friends and relatives. Janice hasn't been setting the healthiest example for her son.
13:03 Scaachi Koul? And now that Sean is forced to fend for himself, he'll be left to make his own way, drawing from the same mix of moral flexibility he's seen modeled at home.
13:16 Scaachi Koul? It's early 2006, and somewhere in Miami, 16-year-old Sean Kingston is falling asleep on a bus bench. In some ways, Sean looks older than he is. He's six foot three and stocky, but his soft, sweet baby face gives away that he's still a teenager. Sean is supposed to be staying with family while his mom is incarcerated, but that hasn't been going well. He's angry and lost and has no desire to be under anyone's thumb. His mom will later say that he was, quote, "so unruly that he left and went off on his own." Even though he chose to leave, it's still scary to be on the streets. So Sean resolves to never be in this situation again. He decides that he needs to get rich, so rich that when his mom gets out of prison,
14:00 Scaachi Koul? he can pick her up in her dream car, a red Continental GT with tan seats.
14:07 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, I mean, that is not a healthy motivation to want to get rich is so that you can impress your mom when you pick her up from prison.
14:15 Scaachi Koul? I guess there are worse reasons, though, aren't there? While Sean's plan is to become a famous musician, at this point, he's primarily rapping, not singing, and he's performing under the name Franchise. Now, this is 2006, so if you're an aspiring artist who wants to break out, you're using MySpace. Think of it as the early aughts version of TikTok. Musicians post their tracks, build followings, and if they're lucky, catch the attention of industry leaders. Sean starts posting his music there regularly. He also finds music executives on the site and slides into their DMs. Here he is, years later, describing his strategy for reaching out to JR Rodham, a producer who's known for working with artists like 50 Cent, Rihanna, and Rick Ross.
14:58 Speaker 05 I sent him a message like, "Yo, please take your time out to check out my music, man. That's all I'm asking for. I'm not asking for much. I just really want you to listen to my music. Tell me what you think. I mean, I've been through a lot. I mean, I just really want you to take your time out to listen to my music." I copy and paste that message and send it to him five times a day.
15:14 Sarah Hagi? You know, there's so many stories like this where someone's just like, they're like, no shame, I'm gonna email them 100,000 times and eventually they'll respond because they'll get annoyed at me. And you know what? It usually doesn't work. Respect. I gotta say, respect to Sean Kingston.
15:29 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, I mean, Sean is tenacious. And he decides that if he wants to be taken seriously, he needs to be where the industry is. So he heads to Los Angeles where his older brother Kurt and some other relatives can offer him a couch to sleep on. Teenage Sean arrives with just $300 in his pocket and an enormous amount of confidence. And Sarah, he's got a reason to think that this will work. Thanks to his internet hustling, his song, "Life is Hard," hits number 20 on MySpace's indie charts. It's enough to get JR's attention. The producer finally writes back to Sean and invites him to come perform in person. Sean takes two buses to get to Culver Heights where JR's offices.
16:10 Scaachi Koul? It's intimidating to meet his hero, much less perform for him, but JR seems to like what he hears. Before long, he offers to sign Sean to his record label and pay him a $100,000 advance. Sean has gone from rags to riches in the blink of an eye, and his hard work and determination are about to be rewarded.
16:33 Scaachi Koul? A few months later, Sean is heading back to JR's studio. Only this time, he's not riding the bus. Instead, he's spending some of his advance on a cab. As they drive through Los Angeles, the driver is blasting the classics on the radio. Right now, it's Benny King's "Stand By Me." Sean can't get the song out of his head. And when he arrives at the studio, he mentions it to JR. "No one's ever sampled it before," he says. "Isn't that wild? Maybe they should try something with it." So they do. They start building a track around the song's famous progression. At first, the working title is "Suicidal," but eventually they rename it "Beautiful Girls." It marks a major shift for Sean. It's the first song where he sings instead of rapping.
17:19 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, I mean, I think it speaks to his genuine talent that he hears a song and is like, "Wait a second, no one's ever sampled it. Maybe we should. It's familiar. Everyone loves it. Everyone knows it."
17:29 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
17:29 Sarah Hagi? And that's how he get Beautiful Girls.
17:32 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, I mean, listen, it was an earworm. And his team is so excited about the song that they decide to scrap everything they've recorded so far and reposition him as a singer. They also change his stage name, since franchise doesn't really match his new softer vibe. JR is the one who suggests the name Sean Kingston. He wants everyone to know that this kid is from Jamaica. It turns out to be the right move. When Beautiful Girls is released in May 2007, it blows up, even beating out Rihanna's Umbrella for the top spot on the charts. Sean suddenly finds himself opening for artists like Gwen Stefani and Beyonce. His public image is very polished and clean cut. In interviews, he promises he'll never curse in his music and talks earnestly about wanting
18:16 Scaachi Koul? to be a positive role model. He's also an ambitious businessman. He forms a record label and starts signing talent to it as soon as he can. Of course, he can't resist a little flossing. He's still a teenager, after all. Here he is vlogging for the website WorldStar Hip Hop in 2008.
18:35 Speaker 05 Like, come on, man. Like, you see what I'm rocking right now? Like, I'm rocking... Let me show you. Like, look at this. That's a diamond link, man, my, my, dude. You know what I'm saying? Like, I can't even lie. Look at the watch. Come on, look at the ring. Look at the watch.
18:47 Sarah Hagi? I mean, yeah, that's kind of what it was at the time. You know, there was no Instagram, so you had to go to WorldStar Hip Hop and do like a little video showing everything at once, you know?
18:58 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, nothing worse. But while he may be keeping his lyrics clean, he is straight up lying about his personal story to make it sound more compelling. Like, Sean regularly talks about how he grew up learning about the music industry from his famous producer grandfather, but he died before Sean was born. Sean also emphasizes his time being homeless, but rarely clarifies that he was on the streets because he ran away from the place where he was supposed to be staying. Shawn also claims that his fame helps his mom receive better treatment while she's in prison, and that when she's released in late 2007, he's able to live out his fantasy of picking her up in her dream car. But according to court records, Janice was actually released from prison in March,
19:41 Scaachi Koul? a couple of months before "Beautiful Girls" debuted. His career looks like a miracle at this point. A kid with $300 and a MySpace page who becomes a chart-topping success. But the instability of his earlier life hasn't disappeared. It's just been papered over with a number-one hit and press coverage. And now that he has fame and fortune, he also has something new: something to lose. One thing no one can take away from Shawn is his work ethic. He releases his second album in 2009, two years after his first. It doesn't match his early success, but he does manage to produce another top-five single, "Fire Burning." A year later, at just 20 years old, Shawn is already recording a third album,
20:26 Scaachi Koul? which includes a collab with Justin Bieber. Shawn will later claim that around this time, the temptations of fame begin to get the better of him. He starts partying and says that Justin turns him on to lean, which is a mixture of codeine cough syrup, soda, and candy. Whether or not substances are to blame, the momentum he once had starts to stall. His track with Bieber, "Eenie Meenie Miney Mo Lover", peaks at just number 15 on the Billboard charts. It's respectable, but hugely disappointing for someone hoping a Bieber collaboration would catapult him back to the top. At this point, Shawn hasn't had a real hit in a couple of years. He's also growing increasingly frustrated with his label and feeling constrained by the contracts he signed
21:09 Scaachi Koul? when he was a 16-year-old trying to get his foot in the door. He wants more creative control, so he delays releasing the album he's been working on while he tries to make that happen. Shawn's frustration seemed to start showing up in other parts of his life. In 2010, while performing in Seattle, Shawn meets a 19-year-old fan at the meet-and-greet and brings her back to his hotel. Later that night, the fan files a police report accusing Shawn and two others of raping her. Sean denies the allegation, but his story isn't consistent. Sometimes he claims they had consensual sex. Other times, he says nothing happened between them at all. The police ultimately decide the fan isn't a credible witness and decline to press charges. Still, the incident adds to a growing pattern of volatility,
21:54 Scaachi Koul? and it won't be the last time Sean's poor judgment lands him in trouble. But next time, his recklessness won't just be a reputational risk. It will threaten his life.
22:09 Speaker 06 Journalist Tristan Redman goes where no son-in-law should ever go. Deep into his wife's family history, digging up the cold case of who murdered her great-grandmother. Because, I should mention, he thinks the murderer might actually be the beloved family patriarch. For the best bingeable series like Ghost Story, listen to the Audible True Crime Podcast wherever you get your podcasts.
22:30 Speaker 03 Dr. Seuss's Cat in the Hat and Fish are back for a whole lot of wonderfully whimsical fun. What happens when you switch bodies with your best friend? Discover a caveman frozen in ice? Or make an alien so angry, he threatens to destroy the planet? Find out in season two of the Cat in the Hat podcast. The Cat and Fish are traveling the world in the great catastrophic cacophony cruiser, meeting genies, clown professors, cave trolls, and extraordinary characters along the way. With clever wordplay, imaginative rhymes, original songs, and stories celebrating curiosity, empathy, and creative problem solving, every adventure brings something new to discover.
23:12 Speaker 03 It's a world of wonderful words, big imaginations, and plenty of heart for the whole family. Listen to the Cat in the Hat podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all 20 episodes early and ad-free right now.
23:38 Scaachi Koul? It's May 2011, nearly a year after Sean allegedly assaulted a fan in Seattle. Now 21, Sean is off the coast of Miami, on the water, surrounded by friends. He's been partying all day, and he's currently sitting on a jet ski alongside a beautiful girl named Cassandra. Sean revs the engine and slams on the gas. The beach, his friends, and the other jet skis all disappear from sight. He can feel Cassandra behind him clinging and yelling something in his ear. Sean looks ahead and realizes he's rocketing straight towards a low bridge. He jet skis out here all the time, but right now, the tide is higher than he's used to, and there's no way he can get underneath the bridge. The wind is whipping in Sean's face as the jet ski barrels ahead.
24:23 Scaachi Koul? He tries to turn, but he's going too fast, like 70 miles an hour too fast, and it's too late. The world goes black. The next thing Sean knows, he's waking up in the hospital. They did, in fact, hit the bridge. Cassandra made it out without any major damage, but Sean's lungs were crushed, and he arrived at the ICU in critical condition. Doctors were able to stabilize him, and Sean spends 11 days recovering in the hospital. Then, just as the doctors start talking about discharging him, Sean feels a sudden stabbing pain in his chest. He calls for help before losing consciousness. Doctors discover that Sean had torn his aorta.
25:08 Scaachi Koul? He undergoes open-heart surgery and spends nearly two more weeks in the hospital, doing intensive rehab and physical therapy. Finally, Sean is cleared to go home. Sean's brush with death is national news. Once he's well enough, he talks to a Today Show reporter about surviving the gruesome crash and open-heart surgery. This happened, and you nearly died twice.
25:30 Speaker 05 Yeah.
25:31 Scaachi Koul? Why do you think you lived?
25:33 Speaker 05 I think my work is not done. I think it was just like, you know, it wasn't my time yet.
25:39 Sarah Hagi? I remember this. Oh, my God, I just remembered. It was a huge deal. I mean, everyone legitimately thought he was going to die. It was like one of those miraculous recoveries, right?
25:48 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it was a bad accident. And publicly, Sean frames the incident as a second chance. But privately, the aftermath is really hard on him. The sound of the ocean makes him anxious, which is a big problem when you live on the water. And he doesn't seek therapy to help with what seems like post-traumatic stress. Instead, he leaves Florida and moves to LA. He also hands over control of his business affairs to someone he trusts: his mom. And almost immediately, problems begin to surface. In 2012, the landlord of the Miami mansion Sean had been renting sues him and his mom, alleging that they trashed the place, causing tens of thousands of dollars in damage. He also claims they broke their lease by moving out early.
26:33 Scaachi Koul? Sean and Janice don't respond to the lawsuit, which means it goes against them by default. They have to pay the landlord $55,000. That kind of debt wouldn't be a big deal if Sean's hits were making bigger headlines than his legal fees. But they're not. In 2013, two years after the jet ski accident, Sean finally releases his third album. It features Wiz Khalifa, but commercially, it's a bomb. At this point, Sean is more reliably on TMZ than on MTV.
27:05 Sarah Hagi? It's really funny because I haven't really ever thought about his music career outside of Beautiful Girls. I just kind of assumed he was a one-hit wonder. But I didn't realize how hard he was trying to make something happen and how, you know, he had like these legitimate songs with people who were really popular at the time, and it just never quite worked out.
27:23 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. And while he's trying, Sean's legal issues accumulate. The woman who accused him of rape back in 2010 files a civil lawsuit. Sean settles out of court, claiming that it's not because he did anything wrong. He just doesn't have time to deal with litigation right now. Sean is back in the news again in 2014, this time for allegedly beating up a club promoter over a late payment. A few months later, one of his cars is repossessed outside of a club on the Sunset Strip. Then, in 2015, Avi Davidoff, who goes by Avi Dejulier, sues Sean. He alleges that, over the last few years, Sean has purchased more than $200,000 worth of jewelry without paying. According to Avi, he and Sean were close,
28:07 Scaachi Koul? and he repeatedly gave Sean the benefit of the doubt. But at this point, he's fed up with waiting for his money. Sean's people tell TMZ that Sean has absolutely paid Avi for his bling, but he never files any court paperwork to prove it. So, once again, a default judgment is settled against Sean, and he has to pay Avi back. Of course, Sean has an explanation for why he keeps ending up in debt.
28:30 Speaker 05 If I'm late on one payment, it's not I'm late on the payment because I don't have the money to pay you. I'm late on the payment because my mom had my business, and she's all over the place doing the main things at once because I don't have a business manager.
28:42 Sarah Hagi? That is because you're late on the payment, though. Like, you can't say it's my mom's fault because I don't have a business manager. She is your business manager, and she's late paying it back.
28:52 Scaachi Koul? It also doesn't matter why you're late on the payment. If you're late on the payment, you're late.
28:56 Sarah Hagi? There's clearly some sort of mental stuff happening between him and his mom, that's for sure.
29:02 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. It's weird, isn't it? Sean may claim that he's completely innocent, but he's about to get into even more legal trouble. And this time, there's no way for him to pretend that he isn't scamming on purpose.
29:17 Scaachi Koul? It's late July 2016, a little more than a year since Sean defaulted on the Avi Dejulier lawsuit. Sean is at a store called Aquamaster in New York's Diamond District. He's 26, and his commercial peak may be behind him, but he still loves expensive chains, watches, and rings. One by one, he picks out pieces for himself: a rose gold watch with 25 carats worth of diamonds, a tennis necklace sporting 35 carats, a Cuban link ring and bracelet. By the time he's finished, the total for his nine items is around $300,000. Now, even famous musicians don't walk around with that kind of cash on them, so Sean pays a $1,000 deposit. He tells the store that his business manager will wire the rest of the money in the next day or two.
30:02 Scaachi Koul? Once that's done, he'll return to collect his purchases. But instead of arranging a wire transfer, Sean has someone from the record label he owns deposit a $270,000 check into Aqua Master's bank account. Then, his mom writes a check for $31,500 to cover the remaining balance and deposits it as well. A few days later, Sean returns to Aqua Master and tells them to verify his payments. When they log into their account, they see the pending funds, so they give Sean his jewels. Aqua Master assumes this is a wire transfer, which can't be undone. But it isn't. The cash that Sean deposited is a mirage. It's all from checks that are about to bounce.
30:46 Scaachi Koul? When Aqua Master notices that $300,000 has gone missing from their bank account, they sue Sean, Janice, and both of their companies for the missing money.
30:56 Sarah Hagi? You know, it's clear he has this real fake-it-till-you-make-it energy right now. I don't know if it's because he legitimately believes he will make it and that people will just kind of ignore this because he'll get so successful, but I do think that he's just insanely entitled.
31:14 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
31:17 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, he is. And once again, Sean ignores the charges against him. Unfortunately, the media does not. Though he hasn't had a hit in years, Sean continues to give good content. So in early 2017, TMZ catches up to him at an airport and gets him on record bragging about how the diamonds he's wearing are worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. Sean offers an explanation for why people should be mad at his jewelers and not at him.
31:44 Sarah Hagi? Everybody goes through that. Totally. You're gonna have a time in your career where stuff gets slowed down and, you know, you're not doing as much shows and the jewelry... Jeweler is supposed to be able to say, okay, you know what? Since you spent over a million, let me wait till everything, you know, get right and just be like, okay, cool. Okay, so his rationalization is that the jeweler should believe in him? Like, because he was once successful? The jeweler should believe in him enough that he will be successful again and be able to pay him back? Because he once did spend that money?
32:11 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
32:12 Sarah Hagi? That's not how it works. That is crazy. That is an insane thing to say out loud. It's like, they should know I will get rich again. What? No, they don't, idiot.
32:22 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it actually gets even worse because he also talks about how all jewelers are family, which is likely a reference to how New York's diamond district is largely run by Orthodox Jews. So Sean's comments are antisemitic at worst and like, really dumb and weird at best. In 2018, the judge in the Aqua Master case files a default judgment against Janice and Sean and orders them to pay the $300,000 they owe. At this point, Sean's options are limited. He's still bound to his original record contracts, the ones that don't give him the kind of creative freedom he wants. And right now, he's better known for his legal disputes than his hits. So he decides to spend a few years laying low, writing music for other artists and staying out of the limelight.
33:08 Scaachi Koul? Sean is a legitimately talented songwriter. His credits include Jason Derulo's hit, What You Say, and Iaz's Replay amongst other hits. But generating success for others isn't enough. Sean craves the spotlight. Writing hit songs for other people just doesn't hit the same as being onstage. Sean is determined to make a comeback. And when he does, he'll claim to be a changed man. But Sean is still up to all of his old tricks. And this time, he might be finding a few new ones, too.
33:40 Scaachi Koul? Three years later, in 2021, Sean is sitting in a white room lined with chain link fencing. He's wearing a short-sleeved, black button-down and, of course, a diamond-encrusted watch.
33:52 Scaachi Koul? He's here today to give his first big interview in years for Adam 22's hip hop podcast, No Jumper. Sitting next to Sean is his new manager, a music industry veteran who goes by the name Wan G. Wan seems distracted, but Sean is still happy to have him here because this is Sean's career relaunch. He spent the last few years mostly behind the scenes, making music for other artists and licking his wounds. It was frustrating to hear people call him a one-hit wonder or ask why he doesn't make music anymore, when in reality, he's been writing songs this whole time. So Sean's been self-soothing the way he always does, with diamonds and gold. Last year, he was charged with grand theft over non-payment
34:34 Scaachi Koul? for, you guessed it, more jewelry and more watches. But now, he's ready to focus on the future. He explains that Wan G helped free him from his restrictive record industry contracts. Sean adds that he signed with a new label and that he used his advance to settle old debts. He even offers advice to younger artists.
34:54 Speaker 05 Now, I got a testimony. I could tell, I could inspire new artists and show them the way and let them know, you don't gotta get all that jewelry. You don't gotta get all that. Invest in some property.
35:03 Sarah Hagi? This is total bullshit. I don't know why he's still hanging on to this idea that he's, can inspire people and is inspirational and is someone to look up to, because he clearly isn't. And also, it's like, nothing really bad happened to him in his career. He didn't have hits, and then he's still got an opportunity to do songwriting, which is really lucrative.
35:21 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
35:21 Sarah Hagi? Like, I'm trying to see what he thinks he deserves, because this is better than basically anyone who tries to enter the music industry.
35:29 Scaachi Koul? Mm-hmm.
35:29 Sarah Hagi? Also, why is he telling people to not buy jewelry? He can't even afford it, and he's still buying it somehow, and he's telling people they don't need it? What? Come on.
35:38 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it doesn't really make any sense. And the interview doesn't even help the sales numbers for Sean's new album. When it comes out a few months later, it flops. At this point, Sean's career is basically a nostalgia play. Luckily for him, nostalgia is a hot commodity. Even though he hasn't had a hit since the early 2000s, he still gets invited to play festivals and concerts, including a trip to Art Basel. And he gets paid hundreds of thousands of dollars for these appearances, so he's earning plenty. But he's spending plenty too, almost every dollar he earns. And despite what he said on the podcast, Sean's appetite for luxury goods hasn't slowed down. Only now, his methods for acquiring- ...them change. Instead of depositing and then cancelling checks,
36:22 Scaachi Koul? he sends fabricated wire transfer receipts meant to reassure sellers that his payment has been initiated. Sean does this so often that by November 2021, his mom texts him with a warning. Can he read it, Sarah? She writes, quote,
36:36 Sarah Hagi? "Lawyer says if one more jeweler says anything, they will treat it as a criminal case." Really? It's like, one more? I don't know. I feel like that there's been kind of enough. He's flying so close to the sun.
36:50 Scaachi Koul? Well, Sean seems unbothered. Instead, he responds by asking for her help in making just one more fake wire transfer receipt to pay a man for yet another watch. Janice chastises him for spending money he doesn't have when he's supposed to be working on his album. But she still agrees to help. He's putting her in a weird position since she's his mom and his employee. Sean's plan is to tell the jeweler that he's filming a music video with Justin Bieber today. But he isn't. He gives his mom the jeweler's number and tells her to text him first thing in the morning to say shooting is delayed because Justin has the flu. Sean is hoping the guy will think that he's been paid and gets sick of hanging around. So he'll just get out of Miami
37:34 Scaachi Koul? and leave Sean with a free watch.
37:37 Sarah Hagi? I mean, this is just such an elaborate lie for a free watch?
37:42 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
37:42 Sarah Hagi? It's such a long story, and all he wants people to hear is Justin.
37:46 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. I mean, it's a lot of work for just like a piece of jewelry. And worse is, once they have that settled, Sean asks his mom to send him 200 bucks so he can buy some headphones. Sean has a system in place, and it hasn't failed him yet. Sure, sometimes he gets taken to court, but the only consequence is paying back whoever he owes money to. And sometimes, the court doesn't follow up enough to even force him to do that. But the accusations are piling up. And when Sean hires Ariel Mateos to install that massive TV a few years later, he basically signs the warrant for his own arrest.
38:25 Scaachi Koul? It's May 2024. Sean is at Fort Irwin, an Army training base in the Mojave Desert, for a performance. He's waiting for the meet and greet when he hears some shocking news. Federal agents have raided the Florida home he shares with his mother, and Janice has been arrested and charged with theft and wire fraud. As soon as he hears the news, Sean knows the jig is up. But there's no escaping a literal Army base. All he can do is wait for agents to show up and arrest him, too. Sean's faced legal trouble before, but this time, things are different. First of all, these charges are criminal, not civil, which could mean jail time. And prosecutors are alleging that he and his mom stole nearly $1 million worth of luxury goods. Sean is able to post bail pretty quickly.
39:10 Scaachi Koul? But when he checks his phone, the nightmare only gets worse. His arrest is all over TMZ and social media. It's like he's watching his youthful dream being taken apart in front of him all over again. But he wants to keep up a cheerful facade. So that afternoon, he posts on his Instagram. Sarah, can you read what he says?
39:29 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, he says, "People love negative energy. I'm good, and so is my mother. My lawyers are handling everything as we speak." I don't know if you can chalk that down to negative energy. It is a thing that's actually happening.
39:44 Scaachi Koul? Like, yeah.
39:45 Sarah Hagi? You know, there's not like an energy being put out. You did something.
39:48 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it's pretty real. Well, Sean keeps this act up as the legal proceedings start and even uses local news footage of his mom's arrest in a music video. I'm gonna play you a little bit of it. Sarah, can you describe it?
40:02 Sarah Hagi? What is going on with these people? I just don't know what he's trying to say. Like, I guess it's like, why was my mom arrested? But like, that's pretty humiliating for his mom to have footage in his music video. And then like, in the next scene, he's like trying on a grill or something.
40:15 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
40:16 Sarah Hagi? I feel like he's really exploiting the situation in a way that makes him look worse, but he thinks is like, good for his career.
40:24 Scaachi Koul? I mean,
40:25 Sarah Hagi? it's not even like a cool crime, you know? Like, come on.
40:28 Scaachi Koul? He needs a crime where he can flick a cigarette in public.
40:30 Sarah Hagi? Yes, it's one that is in movies, or something that's cool.
40:34 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. Well, Sean has gone from the spotlight of fame to the crosshairs of federal law enforcement. His promising career and his clean-cut image are about to be tested in the court of law and public opinion.
40:51 Speaker 02 Hi, I'm Kenya Barris.
40:53 Speaker 03 And I'm Malcolm Gladwell. We're back for season two of our Audible original podcast, The Unusual Suspects.
40:59 Speaker 02 We'll sit down with extraordinary guests from the worlds of art, film, literature, comedy, and wellness to hear from their unexpected stories of success.
41:06 Speaker 03 And who do we have this season? Well, we'll talk with Grammy-winning artist Anderson Paak, athlete Rich Roll, portrait artist Amy Sherald, Oscar-winning director Ron Howard, legendary writer David Sedaris, and many more. These conversations are more intimate than last season, wouldn't you say?
41:22 Speaker 02 I would. Listen to season one of The Unusual Suspects wherever you get your podcasts and sign up for a free trial Audible to listen to season two in the Audible app or by subscribing to Apple Podcasts.
41:40 Speaker 02 There are books that change how you see the world, and there are books that change how you see yourself. In a new podcast series, A Great Book with Barack Obama, President Obama sits down with a series of surprising and sharp guests to explore six books that have shaped his life and perspective on the world. From Song of Solomon and the Fire Next Time, to All the Pretty Horses and Gilead, the president is joined by guests like Tom Hanks and Ta-Nehisi Coates to reflect on how these timeless stories shaped his thinking on everything from fatherhood to leadership and discover together what they tell us about the world we live in and the world we want to create.
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42:46 Scaachi Koul? It's August 2024, and at midday, Miami is sticky with heat. Janice Turner winces as she steps outside of the air-conditioned courthouse and into the humid air. She and Sean are both dressed for court in crisp, white button-downs. They're leaving an arraignment for their trial. Together, they've been charged with six counts of wire fraud and conspiracy. At the bottom of the courthouse steps, Janice spots a small camera crew from a local news station. Usually, she loves it when people pay attention to Sean, but not today. She doesn't want any publicity for this perp walk. Their cars are parked around the corner from where the reporters are waiting, so she and Sean try something unexpected.
43:27 Scaachi Koul? They literally make a run for it, trying to reach the cars before anyone sees them. It doesn't work. A crew from WPLG Local 10 rushes after them, giving chase. Sean, it looks ridiculous running like that, man. Come on. Sean manages to duck into a waiting Escalade without saying a word. Janice is right behind him, her red sandals slapping hard on the sidewalk. She's furious, and she wants the reporters to know it, so she yells "Bye!" and flips them the bird as she runs away.
43:55 Sarah Hagi? Okay, that's pretty funny. Gotta hand it to her. That's a funny reaction and makes for every reporter's dream clip, really.
44:05 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, she really gave it to them. Well, a few months later, on March 27, 2025, the trial begins. Throughout the proceedings, Janice and Sean try to project calm, like this is all just a big misunderstanding. Sean walks in and out of the courthouse carrying a Bible, and the only comments he gives to reporters are "Thanks to his fans for supporting him." But inside the courtroom, the testimony starts to pile up, and there are a lot of witnesses, like this jeweler who Sean lied to about the Bieber music video, Ariel, who installed that massive TV, a luxury car salesman, a family friend who sometimes manages Sean, and even a second jeweler. At some point, Janice decides to take control of the narrative by taking the stand in her
44:50 Scaachi Koul? own defense. It's a notoriously dangerous legal strategy, and it's a last-minute decision. Her lawyer warns repeatedly that she doesn't have to do this, but Janice wants to tell her side of the story.
45:04 Sarah Hagi? I am so irate right now. Nothing bothers me more than when people think in a legal setting, someone needs their side of the story. No, no, no, no, no. You don't need to talk. Okay, you're the one who's in trouble with mounting evidence. You cannot talk your way out of this, you idiots. Don't speak.
45:23 Scaachi Koul? Well, at first, it goes smoothly because she's being questioned by her own lawyer. Janice makes sure to emphasize that 35-year-old Sean is financially irresponsible and doesn't always understand how much money he has or doesn't have. She also says that people are constantly trying to take advantage of him and that it's her job as a mother to protect him. So when she thinks Sean might be getting into a shady business deal, say, buying a several hundred thousand dollar watch from some guy he met online, her alarm bells go off. That's when she might have her accountant create a fake wire receipt to send off to the guy. Then the seller will give Sean the watch and go away, giving her time to investigate him and make sure he's legit.
46:06 Scaachi Koul? If the seller checks out, then she'll actually pay him what he's owed.
46:11 Sarah Hagi? I don't know what universe these people think they exist in. Like, I don't even know what else to say. The things they think people will accept as an excuse and be like, "Oh, that's what you were doing." Like, are you crazy? Are these people crazy?
46:29 Scaachi Koul? Well, the opposing lawyer doesn't seem to buy it either. Not even when Janice explains that she has her accountant print pending on the fake wire transfer receipts that she sends. Well, most of them. Sometimes they just said "sent" instead. Whoops. The cross-examination does not go as well. Janice tries to explain that she was only trying to protect her son from swindlers and groupies. She says this stuff happens in the music industry all the time, but the prosecutor doesn't seem to get it. Janice adds that Sean's label frequently fails to pay her and that when this happens, she files a civil lawsuit to get her money back. None of this aggressive criminal nonsense. But the prosecutor keeps hammering on about how she took stuff from people without paying.
47:14 Scaachi Koul? Janice does her best, but by the end of her testimony, she seems frustrated and annoyed, and maybe even a little rattled because this did not land the way she had hoped. Janice has done so much to influence the course of her son's life, and this may have been the most impactful and destructive move of all.
47:35 Scaachi Koul? The next day, Sean sits in court, waiting to find out his fate. He has to know that his mom's testimony yesterday didn't exactly help. And when the jury comes back after only three hours, well, it's not looking good. But still, hearing the verdict is a gut punch. When the judge declares that Sean has been found guilty, he bursts into tears.
47:56 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, I mean, I wonder how much this was like a reality-shattering moment for him, because, you know, him and his mom seem to really be in denial about their crimes. So I do think there was like a part of him that knew there was no chance, but also hoped maybe people would be like, oh, they're good people, and he'll be famous again.
48:13 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. Well, Sean is released on a $100,000 bond while he waits for sentencing. Janice isn't so lucky. The judge seems to think that she's a flight risk based on her testimony. As sentencing approaches, Sean and his team submit a memo asking for leniency. Some of the letters are genuinely moving. For instance, a family friend talks about how Sean once babysat her son so she wouldn't have to miss work while he was sick. And an 11-year-old neighbor describes the time that Sean helped him fix his bike. His sister, Kanima, also speaks highly of Sean's character and generosity. She blames a lot of Sean's problems on his jet ski accident and the fact that he never got therapy after his near-death experience.
48:54 Sarah Hagi? Well, I'm sure that did not help the problem. I don't think it was just because of the jet ski accident, which I'm sure was terrible, but, you know.
49:03 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
49:03 Sarah Hagi? Come on.
49:04 Scaachi Koul? Well, Kanima also writes in support of Janice, praising her mother's generosity, selflessness, and deep faith. What she doesn't mention is the time that her mother pulled her into her own criminal activity. As the case progresses, Sean's money troubles continue. By June, his attorney has dumped him for being unable to pay his bills and suggests that Sean might need a public defender. But ultimately, Sean finds someone who's willing to take on his case. In August, sentences are handed down. Janice gets five years, while Sean receives three and a half. Sean's new lawyer almost immediately files an appeal, but he can't stop Sean from reporting to the federal detention center in Miami. Sean refuses to let lockup make him disappear.
49:49 Scaachi Koul? In September, he calls into a South Florida radio show. Here's Sean talking to the host, Papa Keith, about how being in prison has actually been a blessing.
49:58 Speaker 05 God does stuff in different ways for different reasons. You know, I felt like he sat me down to get my mind right and get back focused and get a better life. I'm trying to go. This call is from a federal prison.
50:11 Sarah Hagi? Um, yeah, I'm sure everything that happens to him is actually a blessing because it's teaching him to be better. This guy just can't take the L. You committed crimes and now you're in prison. You're a scammer.
50:22 Scaachi Koul? Well, Sean claims that he has tons of music ready to release when he gets out. He says he's also working on a book about the truth of what happened to him. As of this recording, Sean is still in prison and his appeal is in process. But just in case, he recently came up with a new strategy, asking Donald Trump for a pardon. His plea includes letters from rapper Safari Insoluble, as well as prank YouTuber Jack Doherty, who originally went viral for flipping two markers at once. Jack writes that Sean and his mom got caught up in what he calls a, quote, "complex business misunderstanding", and says that criminalizing something like this isn't the America he believes in. Like so many cultural artifacts from the early aughts,
51:07 Scaachi Koul? Sean's rise now seems somehow hollier and more naive in retrospect. Maybe that's what makes the fall feel inevitable. Sean wanted to be seen as an inspiring story worthy of the lifestyles of the rich and famous. But in the end, his story is more suited for a show like Scamfluencers.
51:27 Scaachi Koul? I love when weird figures from the aughts did crime. Because it's like, I kind of want to think about you again and you've given me a reason.
51:36 Sarah Hagi? A part of me thought I would maybe empathize with him a bit more because maybe there was a scheme he got wrapped up in. But I think how easily he fell into scamming when he wasn't getting number ones, to me, is telling that, like, he just felt very much that he was owed something.
51:51 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, I think what's so stupid about this particular scam Scam is it's like you were already kind of famous. And when you're famous, people just like give you stuff. And there's always a way to scam your way into like a gifting room.
52:05 Sarah Hagi? Yes, exactly.
52:06 Scaachi Koul? At like a lousy award show. And he was running a scheme for like not enough money, like $300,000. Like a $300,000 watch here and there, that's not enough.
52:17 Sarah Hagi? Also, it's like, no one is paying attention to you. You having this thing that will show up and maybe one photo that someone takes of you won't. Like, what do you think that's gonna do? People are gonna take you seriously? There was no greater like, oh, let's make this last. Like, let's have some longevity here. Let's even turn it into a Ponzi scheme. It was like so direct in this weird way.
52:38 Scaachi Koul? Yeah. I mean, do you kind of feel sorry for him? Because it seems like he came by this through his mom, who was really keyed up to pull some of this stuff.
52:47 Sarah Hagi? I feel bad for him, but you know, it gets to a point where you can't really blame mommy anymore. It was all very, very avoidable. And again, he did find success. I don't think everyone who's had a quote unquote one hit wonder can successfully start writing big top 100 hits. So to me, his circumstances never got bad enough to do what he did.
53:11 Scaachi Koul? I feel like his is a story about someone who couldn't be gratified by just being a producer or being a songwriter. Like, it needed to be him. It had to be him front and center. I mean, like scamming for the kinds of diamond jewelry that you wear as a rapper is a very particular kind of ploy.
53:27 Sarah Hagi? I feel like the strategy could have been more hanging around the right people for long enough. The Justin Bieber phase didn't last long enough.
53:34 Scaachi Koul? Mm hmm. Do you feel like you learned any lessons today?
53:37 Sarah Hagi? Yes, don't fake it until you make it. People say that all the time, but.
53:41 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
53:42 Sarah Hagi? It rarely does work for people. Like, it rarely works to fake it till you make it, because you're gonna have to deliver at some point.
53:49 Scaachi Koul? Fake it after you make it.
53:51 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, absolutely. I wish he believed in himself more in a different way.
53:56 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, me too. Wrong direction.
54:00 Scaachi Koul? Haggy, would your mom ever help you do crime for jewelry? Because I know for a fact mine would.
54:08 Sarah Hagi? Absolutely not. Are you kidding me? My mom is, she's strict. I really do think if I was committing a crime like that, she'd be like, well, that's what you did. Bye.
54:17 Scaachi Koul? That lady would, uh, she would drive the getaway car. Okay, but if you did do the crime, would your mom then turn you in? Because my mother would also turn me in.
54:27 Sarah Hagi? No, I think, I don't think she would. She wouldn't help me, but maybe she wouldn't put me in prison. She just kind of would be like, figure this out. But who knows? You know, the power of a mother's love is crazy, so.
54:39 Scaachi Koul? We were really raised by different people.
54:46 Scaachi Koul? Follow Scamfluencers on the Audible app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to all episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free by joining Audible. From Audible Originals, this is Sean Kingston, Beautiful Lies for Scamfluencers. I'm Sachi Cole.
55:02 Sarah Hagi? And I'm Sarah Haggie. If you have a tip for us on a story that you think we should cover, please email us at [email protected] . We use many sources in our research. A few that were particularly helpful were The Kingston Kid by Jonathan Cunningham for the Miami New Times and various trial reports from the local ABC affiliate, Local 10. We also relied on the dogged celebrity reporting of TMZ.
55:26 Scaachi Koul? Zan Romanoff wrote this episode. Additional writing by us, Sachi Cole and Sarah Haggie. Olivia Brierley was the story editor. Our senior producers are Sarah Enni and Ginny Bloom. Our associate producer is Charlotte Miller. Our managing producer is Desi Blaylock. Fact checking by Kalina Newman. Sound design by James Morgan. Additional audio assistance provided by Augustine Lim. Our music supervisor is Scott Velazquez for Phrase on Sync. The executive producer for Audible is Jenny Lauer Beckman. The head of creative development at Audible is Kate Navin. The head of Audible Originals North America is Marshall Louis. The chief content officer is Rachel Giatza. Copyright 2026 by Audible Originals LLC. Sound recording copyright 2026 by Audible Originals LLC.
56:15 Scaachi Koul? Depeche, the host of Against the Odds from Audible Originals. In each episode, we share thrilling true stories of survival, putting you in the shoes of the people who lived to tell the tale. In our latest series, we track the story of Hugh Glass, the real-life revenant that inspired the 2015 film starring Leonardo DiCaprio. In 1823, Glass was brutally mauled by a grizzly bear in present-day South Dakota and left for dead. His survival depended on trekking through 350 miles of wilderness alone with grave injuries. But he was driven by his thirst for revenge. Follow Against the Odds wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all episodes of Against the Odds early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts.
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