89 Creating a Quest to Find Purpose with Chris Guillebeau

"A quest can improve your life. A quest can bring purpose and meaning to your life too." - Chris Guillebeau Free resources and links to everything in the show here: lewishowes.com/89 Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This is episode number 89 with Chris Gilbo.

• 0:07Speaker 00

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:33Speaker 00

  What is up everyone? Thanks so much for hanging out with me today on the School of Greatness podcast. I've got a friend on today. His name is Mr. Chris Gilbo and he is a really interesting guy, actually. If you don't know who Chris is, I'm just going to share a few interesting facts. Uh, one is that he's visited every country in the world. So 193 countries he's been to. And he's done it through travel hacking, which he talks about on his blog over at ChrisGilbo.com. He also hosts the World Domination Summit, which is in Portland every summer. And I think this recent year had like 5,000 people or something crazy like that. It's a huge event. Lots of inspiring people come to that. He writes a number of books, including one called The Hundred Dollar Startup.

• 1:18Speaker 00

  And the one that we're talking about today, which is called The Happiness of Pursuit. Finding the quest that will bring purpose to your life. Now, I'm a big believer in purpose and my, my purpose, my mission is to serve 100 million people. To support them in discovering how to make a living around what they are most passionate about. Because I believe that's what's going to actually create deeper and more meaningful relationships. That's what's going to create healthy bodies. That's what people are going to feel good. They're going to want to work out more when they're doing what they love and they're making money doing what they love. Uh, there are going to be deeper relationships. There are going to be less cancer, less stress, less heart attacks.

• 2:03Speaker 00

  All these diseases, there's going to be less of them because people are going to be fulfilled. They're going to be happy because they feel like they have meaning, making money around doing what they love. Imagine if you could do what you love, hang out with the people you love, do the activities you love all day long and get paid to do it.

• 2:19Lewis Howes?

  That's what I'm up to. I'm up to teaching people how to do that. So we're here to talk about the quest and finding that quest that will bring you purpose to your life. So if you're trying to find that right now, you're in the right place. And I'm super excited to introduce to you to Mr. Chris Guillebeau right now.

• 2:45Lewis Howes?

  Welcome back everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. I'm super pumped today. I've got Mr. Chris Guillebeau on. What's up, Chris?

• 2:52Chris Guillebeau?

  Hey, man. How you doing?

• 2:53Lewis Howes?

  I am doing well. And we met, I think it was probably three years ago, actually, with Jonathan Fields introduced us in New York City. And I've been following you ever since and was following you before then. And you're in the middle of your your quest at this time, which was to visit every country in the world, correct?

• 3:12Chris Guillebeau?

  That's right.

• 3:13Lewis Howes?

  And do you remember what, how many countries you'd visited at that time?

• 3:18Chris Guillebeau?

  Oh, that's a good question. Yeah, three years ago, three years ago, I was kind of on that final third. So maybe about 140, 150 countries or so. There's 100, there's 193 countries in total. And then, you know, I did it over about 10 or 11 years. So I was probably in that in that final batch approaching some of the harder countries when we first met.

• 3:38Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. The harder countries, meaning not as fun to be in or hard to travel to? What does that mean?

• 3:44Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, not necessarily not as fun, just a little bit more problematic or difficult to get to. Challenging in terms of the flight logistics, challenging in terms of the visa permissions, you know, things like that. There's a, there's a lot of countries in Africa, many of which are great and wonderful. There's also some that are run by some pretty corrupt governments that aren't super excited about letting foreigners in. It's not just Africa. There's other places as well. And so that can be an adventure in itself. So it's, it can still be fun. But yeah, it was a, it was a challenge for some of them.

• 4:14Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Yeah, I'm actually going to Ghana next month for the first time.

• 4:17Chris Guillebeau?

  Oh, great. Well, Ghana is one of the good countries.

• 4:19Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 4:19Chris Guillebeau?

  So you'll have a great time.

• 4:20Lewis Howes?

  I'm just worried I had to get my shots, you know, to go to get the visa and get the for the passport or whatever. And I got like, three different shots and I got the flu like three days later.

• 4:32Chris Guillebeau?

  Oh, yeah, because your immune system is compromised or whatever. Well, now you'll probably be good for like 10 years or something with those shots. So that's, that's good.

• 4:38Lewis Howes?

  That's good. Yeah, I just don't want to get, I'm mosquitoes love me. So the whole malaria thing is kind of like scary to me. So I'm glad I had. Um, so you've got a new book out.

• 4:47Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah.

• 4:48Lewis Howes?

  It's called The Happiness of Pursuit. And it's finding the quests that will bring purpose to your life. And I believe this book has it all. I really like this book. And I'm excited about talking about this because you talk about the quest. And this is. This is kind of encompassing your story about your quest for all these different countries. But then also a lot of different stories from other people on their own quest. Now, my question is. Where did you first? What made you want to go on this quest of going to see every country?

• 5:22Chris Guillebeau?

  Hmm. Yeah, so for me, I initially loved traveling. I just kind of loved being out in the world. And I actually lived in Ghana and Liberia and Sierra Leone for.

• 5:32Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 5:32Chris Guillebeau?

  Several, several years, yeah, from 2002 to 2006, I lived in West Africa.

• 5:36Lewis Howes?

  Oh, wow.

• 5:37Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, I was volunteering for a medical charity there. And that was just a great experience. I kind of just transformed my life and gave me a new perspective on lots of different things. And I started traveling as part of that process, just around the region and then in Southern Africa. And then a bit in Europe as well. So I always liked traveling, but I'd also always been a goal setter. I always kind of liked, you know, like putting a target to something. Or I liked, you know, making lists of my projects and tasks. I really like, you know, making lists and crossing things off. That's how I've always kind of been motivated. And so at some point, I kind of had this idea like, okay, traveling is fun. But what if I could create some structure to it? And I initially had a goal of going to a hundred countries. I thought this would be kind of fun to do this like at some point in my life.

• 6:21Chris Guillebeau?

  And then I started getting closer to that, like I'd gone from 50 to like 75 or so. And then I said, well, for a real challenge, you know, um, let's, let's try to go to every country in the world. And so that, that actually like, that, you know, speaking of transformation, that also transformed a bunch of stuff for me. Because like just having structure to the, to the travel goal made so much more sense. And then I was like, I love the travel, but I also love the quest aspect.

• 6:45Lewis Howes?

  Interesting, interesting. And how long did it take you to do the, once you decided to go on the quest? Cause he, I guess he'd visited a bunch of countries before then.

• 6:52Chris Guillebeau?

  Right.

• 6:52Lewis Howes?

  How long did it take?

• 6:53Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, I had been to, yeah, like you said, between 50 and 75 countries or so. So the whole thing I say is about 10 years, but probably six years, like once I formalized it and said, okay, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna actually try to go to all of them. And I didn't go back and go to the other 50, you know, I wasn't starting over. I was like, I'm gonna count whatever I've done so far.

• 7:12Lewis Howes?

  And how many, um, how many days were you traveling in those six years, I guess? Or how many days per year on average?

• 7:19Chris Guillebeau?

  Hmm, maybe about a hundred days on average per year. You know, it wasn't, it wasn't full time, um, but it was pretty frequent. I mean, sometime there was maybe half the time, but then there would be breaks to do other things. And then I kind of, you know, began a whole new career as part of this, which wasn't the intention at all in the beginning. Uh, and so that ended up kind of taking some, some different time and.

• 7:40Lewis Howes?

  Was that the, was that the travel hacking business?

• 7:42Chris Guillebeau?

  The travel hacking business. I was just starting writing a blog. Like I didn't have a blog in the beginning. I was just kind of doing my own thing and, and then I started writing about it and then community and books and all that stuff kind of came later. So it wasn't like a strategic business plan, you know, to go to every country in the world.

• 7:56Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 7:56Chris Guillebeau?

  Uh, it was a personal mission and then there ended up being some, some business goals, you know, along with it.

• 8:02Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And for those that don't know Chris or haven't, uh, you know, heard about his books and his, his website and the world domination summit, where I think had what like a thousand people at this year or?

• 8:12Chris Guillebeau?

  Uh, we have about three, between three and four thousand.

• 8:14Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh. Yeah. I remember the first year was like 500 and then it was a thousand. Now it's 4,000 and you had like the larger, I think you, I, I still haven't been, so hopefully one day I can come and I'd.

• 8:23Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, we'd love to have you there.

• 8:24Lewis Howes?

  Love to come. And, um, I think you, I saw online that like you guys were going for the world record of the biggest yoga, uh, session or something like that. Is that, did that happen?

• 8:35Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, last year, actually we set our first Guinness world record, uh, for the, the longest human chain formed on the water. So we had about 500 people like on the Willamette River, like forming this human chain, like linking hands, you know, and we got, got great video of that. Um, and so we decided like, once you do something once, it's a tradition, right? So this year we're like, well, we need a new world record. And it's kind of funny cause people started asking like in the fall, like, hey, what's the world record next year? And we're like, you know, we didn't know that there was going to be an annual thing. We thought it was just once, but, but yeah, so everybody wanted one. So this year, yeah, we set, um, the, the world record. For the longest yoga chain. So that was in Pioneer Courthouse Square, which is the main like downtown area of Portland, Oregon. And people did a series of poses, you know, like in sequence.

• 9:19Chris Guillebeau?

  It took up the whole area. We got some great footage of that too. So that was also fun. And that was, I think we had more than 800 people for that.

• 9:25Lewis Howes?

  Amazing.

• 9:26Chris Guillebeau?

  It was fun.

• 9:26Lewis Howes?

  What was it? What happened to the other 3,000 people? Why didn't they do it?

• 9:29Chris Guillebeau?

  Oh, they didn't. I don't know. They just did. They just like, that's it. You know, like, I want to come to the thing, but I don't want to set a record. So obviously, obviously, they're not allowed to come back next year.

• 9:37Lewis Howes?

  Nice. So you're married, right?

• 9:42Chris Guillebeau?

  I am.

• 9:42Lewis Howes?

  Now, did your wife go with you on this quest? Or was she more of a supporter from the sidelines?

• 9:47Chris Guillebeau?

  She's a traveler herself. You know, she's been to more than 50 countries of her own. But most of the quest was just me. Most of the quest was, you know, my own kind of thing. And she was with me in some of these countries. And we lived together when we were in Africa. We were married then. And the quest kind of began afterwards. So she was super supportive.

• 10:07Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. Okay. And in the book, you have lots of stories from different individuals about their quest and some really inspiring stories. I remember one at the end with Phoebe, which was like a tearjerker. I was like, oh, my gosh, this is crazy. But where did you find the people that you featured in this book?

• 10:25Chris Guillebeau?

  So I wrote a previous book called The Hundred Dollar Startup, and I used a case study model for that. And the whole, the whole, you know, perspective with that book was, okay, I want to tell people like how I've kind of created my own freedom business or whatever, but I don't want to just talk about myself. You know, because one, that's boring. And then two, not everybody can relate to one individual. So I really wanted to focus on a research process of going out and studying, you know, how people had built their businesses or achieved their freedom or whatever. And so it was kind of like, from that model, I applied it for the new book, The Happiness of Pursuit. And I looked for people, you know, all over the world who had undertaken quests. And it was a little bit of a different process this time, because if you look for people who started

• 11:06Chris Guillebeau?

  a business without spending a lot of money, it's a pretty clear and specific thing, you know? And there are a lot of people who've done that in different ways. Whereas when you talk about quests, it's kind of like, well, what is a quest? So what does that mean? And, you know, and as you said, how do you find them? So I guess I began with people in my community. I began with people that I New or I met on my travels, you know, it is a pretty broad community now. Um, with WDS with the folks coming, they tend to be really adventure minded. So there's a lot of folks doing different interesting things. I start with that, but then I don't, again, I don't want to be too insular and just, you know, look at my own folks or my own readers. Um.

• 11:43Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 11:43Chris Guillebeau?

  So we did a pretty broad call to action. You know, it was totally publicized. Um, lots of other blogs were writing about it. Some mainstream media was writing about it just to kind of, and we get a lot of stories back and some, many of them we can't use and that's fine, but the whole approach is gather a lot of, of interesting data and then see what, what the most interesting and compelling endeavor stories are.

• 12:03Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure. So, so what is a quest then? Can you define it?

• 12:06Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, a quest is, is a, is a long-term mission or goal or pursuit. Um, it does have an end. You know, a quest has a beginning and an end. Um, like we're all in a life journey. We're all doing lots of different stuff, but a quest is something that does have a destination in mind. Uh, even though it has a destination in mind, it is very much about the process. There's lots of incremental steps along the way. Um, you don't usually, you know, begin a quest, you know, one day and then finish it the next day. There's usually some amount of sacrifice or challenge in it. Um, there's an element of risk to it. And then, um, usually what happens is more often than not, um, the, the quester or the person pursuing the quest has changed, you know, in some fashion along the way. You're usually not the same person at the end as you were in the beginning.

• 12:51Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Okay. So there's some type of transformation.

• 12:54Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah. And sometimes you know what that transformation might be in the beginning and other times you don't. Um, and that's, that's part of embracing the uncertainty of a quest or even if, if, uh, some of the listeners don't relate to the word quest, you know, I, I, I do believe that, that all of us can embrace this value of adventure and, and maybe creating some structure around that value of adventure.

• 13:12Lewis Howes?

  Got you. Okay. So, you know, some might say, well, just traveling to all these different countries, it sounds just like a hobby, something you like to do, but it, there's, there's a distinction between, uh, difference between hobby and quest.

• 13:23Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, I think so. I think so. I mean, I think like a hobby, yeah, something you like to do. I mean, and you like to travel. I mean, for me, it may be, maybe travel was initially a hobby. It was something I liked to do, but then I kind of created that focus or that structure around it. Again, it's not something that everyone can relate to, uh, which is why like for the book and for the study, I didn't want to just look at travel quests, you know, and that is my inclination since I'm a traveler. I like, I naturally kind of gravitate towards stories of, you know, there's a guy who walked across America, you know, over seven and a half months. Uh, there was a young woman who, who sailed around the world and kind of circumnavigated the globe in a small sailboat, sailboat. Uh, and she was the youngest person to ever do that. So I, I tend to like things like that, but I also wanted to focus on lots of different things. So there's some humanitarian quests.

• 14:06Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 14:07Chris Guillebeau?

  Uh, there's some academic quests, some quests in the arts, you know, people just kind of pursuing something. I guess it's kind of pursuing something to the exclusion of, of everything else, you know, or maybe not everything else, but you are making tradeoffs and choices, you know, to pursue that dream, you know, and you, you are saying no to some things in order to, to pursue this thing.

• 14:26Lewis Howes?

  Sure, yeah. There's a sacrifice.

• 14:28Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, definitely.

• 14:28Lewis Howes?

  There's a sacrifice. Yeah, you, I'm, I, you know, I read the story about the, the man who runs over 250 marathons. I was just like, I can't, I haven't run one, you know, it's incredible.

• 14:37Chris Guillebeau?

  I know, I can't even, I can't relate to that either, you know, I have run one marathon, but like, yeah, that's totally different than, uh, 250. So it's kind of funny, interesting because I had a lot of stories in the, like that in the first draft of the book and we did keep many of them. Um, but I got some feedback from my editor and he said like that, he's like, most people are not going to be able to, to relate to this at all. He's like, you know, they're going to read the story of the dude who ran 250 marathons and gonna be like, that's awesome. Like, good for that dude.

• 15:01Lewis Howes?

  I could never do that.

• 15:02Chris Guillebeau?

  Right, exactly. And so I tried as well to say like, hey, here, most of these stories are actually ordinary people, you know, who have just chosen to do something remarkable. Like they have been courageous, they have been brave, um, but they're doing something that you could do too, you know, and, and, and the central message of the book and the whole message I'm trying to put forward is not just a, a sociological study. It's, I'm, I'm trying to actually say like a quest can improve your life, you know, a quest can bring purpose and meaning to your life too.

• 15:28Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely, yeah. And I had a, you know, We had a little confusion on how I was gonna get the book from your publisher. And so I got two copies, actually, on the same day.

• 15:37Chris Guillebeau?

  Right.

• 15:38Lewis Howes?

  I gave one to my assistant and said, I want you to dive into this and let me know what you think. And she was like, it really got me excited because she's, she lives a great life, but she didn't have, she wasn't on a quest. And she really got excited, you know, not thinking like, I'm gonna go run 200 marathons, or I'm gonna do some crazy adventurous thing. But she was like, I think, I feels like I wanna go sew a hat for every person that I know. And I wanna like, do something crafty and like, get into this like, goal-setting quest, this journey, where I create something for people.

• 16:11Chris Guillebeau?

  That's great.

• 16:11Lewis Howes?

  Something like that, where it's not like this, you know, I'm gonna run across the world or sail a sailboat type of adventure, but it's a different type of quest that really speaks to her.

• 16:20Chris Guillebeau?

  Hmm.

• 16:21Lewis Howes?

  And that's why I think it's really cool, because it gives people a deeper sense of purpose, a deeper sense of meaning.

• 16:27Chris Guillebeau?

  Hmm.

• 16:27Lewis Howes?

  Um, and I'm, I'm always on a quest. You know, right now, I'm on the quest to make it to the Olympics.

• 16:33Chris Guillebeau?

  Right, right. That's fantastic.

• 16:35Lewis Howes?

  You know, there's definitely been sacrifice. There's been, you know, I moved states twice. I travel all over the world. I invest a lot of my own money in the training.

• 16:43Chris Guillebeau?

  Yep.

• 16:44Lewis Howes?

  I don't go to business events so that I can be, you know, with my teammates and, you know, all these different things. And there's definitely been injuries where I've been like, this sucks, and do I wanna keep going?

• 16:55Chris Guillebeau?

  Right, totally.

• 16:56Lewis Howes?

  So, I, I get it. But, um, what I love about the book, uh, you know, it's not just a bunch of cool stories about people, which it has, um, about other people's quests and adventures, but it really helps evoke people getting, figuring out what their own quest is, what calls them. And that's what I'm super pumped that it did for my assistant, Sarah.

• 17:16Chris Guillebeau?

  That's great.

• 17:17Lewis Howes?

  So, what are, one, one question, can anyone take on a quest?

• 17:23Chris Guillebeau?

  Well, first, that's a great story about Sarah. Thanks for sharing that.

• 17:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:27Chris Guillebeau?

  My best to her. You know, I feel like a lot of people are coming to this message. And again, it's not just my message, but a message of improving your life through some specific action. I think a lot of them come to it out of a sense of discontent or dissatisfaction. And it's not to say that they have a terrible life. Like you said, like Sarah's got a great life, but yet she still wants more, you know? And I think probably most of the people listening to this podcast are in the same place where they want to improve their lives. That's why they listen to the School of Greatness. You know, they want more. They want to challenge themselves. And so that's what this is about. It's about, you know, just creating greater happiness and not just happiness, but meaning and purpose by pursuing a quest. So can anyone do it? Well, of course, you know? It's not to say that everyone should, you know?

• 18:10Chris Guillebeau?

  I'm not a big fan of saying like, "You should do this."

• 18:13Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 18:13Chris Guillebeau?

  Uh, but I can just say like, from my life, like, when I thought about doing this, like way back, you know, I was intimidated by it. I was a little bit afraid of it in some ways, but I also couldn't stop thinking about it, you know? And I knew like, if I never did it, then I would regret it, you know? If I never attempted it.

• 18:30Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 18:30Chris Guillebeau?

  Then I would always have that in the back of my mind, right? Like, "Maybe I could have done that," right? And maybe you felt the same thing about, you know, going for the Olympics, you know? It's like, it may work, it may not. And that's exactly how I felt about the going to every country. Like, I could get stopped along the way. That would suck. But that would be better than, you know, looking back, you know, 10 years and saying, like, "I had this idea, never did anything about it," you know?

• 18:52Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. Yeah. Um, so what are some questions you ask the reader so they can start thinking about their own quest?

• 19:00Chris Guillebeau?

  What excites you? What motivates you? Uh, is there something that you like to do that no one else understands? That's actually a pretty common thing in quests. A lot of things that people really kind of pursue or go all out in. You know, it's something that they really love and maybe the passion is kind of infectious. Like we can watch it from the outside. We're like, that's pretty crazy, but we wouldn't necessarily want to do it ourselves, you know? Whether it's knitting the 10,000 hats, you know, or the guys with the marathons or running across America or whatever. Is there something that you're really into that nobody else is? If that line of thinking isn't helpful, maybe also think about what bothers you? What troubles you? Right? Like what problems?

• 19:43Chris Guillebeau?

  There's all these problems in the world, like which is the one that really troubles you the most and what can you do something? You know, what can you kind of take on maybe as part of your challenge? And you're pursuing your own big dream, but you're also making the world a better place at the same time. A lot of people kind of find their answer in that line of thinking.

• 19:59Lewis Howes?

  I was gonna ask you about that question because, you know, a lot of people ask, you know, what are you passionate about? What excites you? But I like the question, what bothers you?

• 20:06Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, sure.

• 20:07Lewis Howes?

  That's what I was asking you about because, you know, if there's something that's kind of nagging you in the back of your head constantly or your body feels this like naggingness of something that bothers you, then I feel like that's a great reason to go towards the quest at that moment too, so.

• 20:21Chris Guillebeau?

  It's a stirring. It's a stirring that you have. Maybe it's even a calling or something, you know? And you're the one who's qualified to do something about it, right? If you're the one who's most bothered by it, you know, I really believe you're qualified to do something about it.

• 20:34Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. What were one or two of the most outrageous stories you heard in this search? Maybe that you used or maybe that you didn't use?

• 20:43Chris Guillebeau?

  Outrageous stories? Okay, that's interesting. We talked about, you know, the 215 marathon guy who ran a marathon every single day for a year, just about. There's also the story of John Francis, who was bothered by something. He was an environmentalist and he was really troubled by this oil spill in the San Francisco Bay. And he decided to stop using motorized transport. And he just decided, I'm gonna stop using cars. I feel like I'm contributing to this problem in some ways. I'm gonna stop. So he did that for a little while. And then he realized he was only going like halfway there because he would meet people and he would explain that he, like he felt like. They're like, they felt like he was judging them, you know?

• 21:27Chris Guillebeau?

  And he was kind of being judgmental about this and, and so he decided to provide an even better life example and he stopped speaking. And so he took a vow of silence that lasted for more than seventeen years.

• 21:37Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 21:38Chris Guillebeau?

  So for more than seventeen years, you know, he didn't speak and he didn't use motorized transport. He walked all across America. He actually earned a master's degree and a PhD without speaking.

• 21:47Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 21:47Chris Guillebeau?

  As this whole, whole protest ended up, you know, changing a lot of policy, um, bringing a lot of people on board for this, uh, environmental crusade that he had. So that's a pretty outrageous story. It's also maybe a little bit unrelatable as well.

• 21:59Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 22:00Chris Guillebeau?

  Because nobody wants to take a vow of silence, right?

• 22:02Lewis Howes?

  Jeez.

• 22:02Chris Guillebeau?

  So if I could give you one more story.

• 22:04Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, please.

• 22:05Chris Guillebeau?

  Maybe it's not, maybe it's not super outrageous, but, uh, again, interesting and relatable. I like the story of Sasha Martin, who is from Oklahoma and she grew up overseas. Um, she had a family that kind of lived in Europe in different places, but then relocated to Oklahoma. She married this guy and had a kid and wasn't able to travel. But she did want to kind of bring her family up with an international perspective. And so she had a degree in culinary arts and she thought, well, I can't visit every country in the world. Um, but she decided to cook a meal from every country in the world. And she did it like with a full on production. You know, it was like every Friday nights, like she would be researching throughout the week. She would be getting recipes, you know, she would post a photo of the flag and play music from that country.

• 22:49Chris Guillebeau?

  She became like this whole thing that involved her family. Other people started getting interested in it. She, she posted the recipes online. People started following. I really, really loved that project because again, you know, she did this from her home in Oklahoma. It brought a lot of meaning and transformation to her life and then other people started caring about it as well.

• 23:06Lewis Howes?

  I like that one a lot. Yeah, that was a really cool story. Um, what is the difference of intellectual awareness of mortality and emotional awareness of mortality?

• 23:17Chris Guillebeau?

  This was something that I noticed as I talked with all these different people who'd done these crazy projects. I noticed that they had a few things in common, some of which I didn't really expect going in. And this awareness of mortality was something that a lot of these people doing these projects had. And when I talk about the difference between intellectual awareness and emotional awareness, I guess the intellectual awareness is something that all of us have. We know that everybody dies. We know that life is short. We know that, you know, we're here for a while and then we're gone and, you know, what happens after that is up for debate. But the emotional awareness is more personal. It's more, okay, not just everybody dies, but someday I will die.

• 24:00Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, my days are numbered and, you know, every day gets closer to the end. And it's not meant to sound, you know, terrifying or bad or something, but a lot of people I talked to just were kind of focused on this point of urgency, focused on this, this reality of like, hey, I've got this limited time here. I don't even know exactly how long it is, right? And how can I, you know, put that to best use? And that's why they kind of chose to do things like Phoebe wanted to see more birds, you know, than anyone else in the world and kind of structured her whole life around that for decades. And she received a terminal diagnosis of cancer, which, which fortunately was inaccurate and she was able to live for many years after that. But when she received that diagnosis, you know, the first thing she thought was, oh no, there's so many more things I still want to do.

• 24:45Chris Guillebeau?

  So a lot of people were just driven by this urgency of, you know, I want to really make my life count.

• 24:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. In which way do questers see mortality then?

• 24:53Chris Guillebeau?

  I think they, they see it as something to be mindful of.

• 24:59Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 25:00Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, not necessarily something to be afraid of, but something to be aware of, something to be, you know, maybe, maybe just kind of not focused on all the time, but just kind of there in the back of the mind.

• 25:10Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. How, or what do people have in common who go on personal quests?

• 25:20Chris Guillebeau?

  Some of the things that we've talked about, um, you know, they are passionate or excited about something or bothered by something. Um, they do tend to be pretty focused, you know, on this thing. Early in the interview, I mentioned making lists. You know, I've always, I've always been a list maker and I was, you know, pleasantly surprised to see that a lot of the people I talked to were also list makers. They really liked, you know, documenting their progress, you know, they, they liked kind of like making notes and being able to see like, okay, today I did this and the next day I did this and here's how I'm, um, you know, far along I'm getting in my goal. Um, those are the first few things I think of.

• 25:57Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. And how important is belief?

• 26:01Chris Guillebeau?

  I think belief is, is important and you, you have to believe in the project or the quest or whatever it is you want to do, uh, even if no one else does, right? So sometimes you're like, a lot of people we talked to experienced their own personal doubt. Maybe they experienced naysayers. Uh, in some cases their friends and family were supportive of them. Uh, in other cases they weren't. Uh, you know, in some cases friends and family were downright negative. Um, and that's a whole like issue of its own, but I, I think, you know, as long as they believed in it, that was the, that was the most important thing. Like they certainly needed support in some fashion.

• 26:35Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 26:36Chris Guillebeau?

  No doubt. Um, but the kind of the primary thing is you have to believe in this, uh, even if no one else does.

• 26:41Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. I mean, obviously a quest, a lot of the times it's probably doing something that people aren't going to understand why you're doing it. And it sounds like, and so you mentioned that there, you know, people are going to judge you and have judgments on the quest. And you mentioned that people will say one of two things. If it's successful, they'll say you were brave, courageous, competent. If it failed, then you'll say you're, they'll say you were stupid. It was risky. You're naive and arrogant.

• 27:04Chris Guillebeau?

  Right.

• 27:04Lewis Howes?

  So how do people deal with, or how did you deal with judgments of people, um, you know, supportive or negative, I guess, along your journey?

• 27:13Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah. I thought about that, that a lot as I was, you know, undertaking the quest, especially when I was going places like Iran or Eritrea where I was deported or Pakistan where I like arrived about a visa and, and like I was okay. You're like, you know, some bad things happened to me along the way. I was okay. But, uh, you know, there was a chance that, that something might not have been okay. And I, I like it really not okay. And I realized, you know, like if, if something really goes wrong, there are going to be a lot of people who just say, he's so stupid, right? You know, he's just crazy. Crazy to take on that real like, what was he thinking like going to these places like for no good reason, you know, I realize that. And then of course, like, you know, I finished, everything's okay. And they're like, wow, I was so brave, you know. So the judgment is always applied, you know, afterwards. So, you know, I guess, I guess you just try to hold it all lightly. You try to

• 27:57Chris Guillebeau?

  hold like the praise and the criticism at a little bit of a distance, you know, and and really focus on what are the core motivations. Like, you know, for me, I thought a lot of times, like, why am I doing this? Like, I really need to be clear on why I'm doing this. And if I'm doing this for any other reason, other than the personal challenge that it invokes in me and and how I feel when I think about, you know, taking on this challenge and going to every country. If I'm doing it for any other reason, that's really dangerous, you know, it's really unhealthy, I think.

• 28:24Lewis Howes?

  You mean if it's like, oh, I want to do this to make money or to start a business, sort of praise or ego?

• 28:30Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, exactly. Praise or ego probably be the biggest thing. Like, you know, there's, there's people watching me, so I got to do this. You know, I just feel like that's, that's a little bit dangerous, you know?

• 28:37Lewis Howes?

  Interesting, yeah. Um, you talked about goals. How important is it to have subgoals in a quest? Because you talk about like, kind of breaking down, uh, you know, a whole continent and countries inside of the countries and all these different things. How important are the subgoals in a quest? Because 250 marathons, I'm like, how do you even, how you even imagine and fathom how long that will take you?

• 28:59Chris Guillebeau?

  Sure, sure, sure. So, so any good quest involves challenge or sacrifice, as we mentioned, and, you know, like, if your, if your quest is to like, go to the corner store and get coffee or something, it's not really a quest, you know. And, you know, if it's gonna take years or whatever the time period is, then it's extremely helpful to have some milestones along the way. You know, so in my case, it was like, okay, every country in the world, 193 countries. Well, you know, those countries can be divided into region, you know, they can be divided numerically, like the milestone is the first 100 countries. Like, I remember going to Sri Lanka and walking on the beach at midnight there. I was super jet lagged. But I was also really excited. So I was like, this is 100. Like, this is a huge milestone. And I feel

• 29:41Chris Guillebeau?

  like those stepping stones, um, just give you confidence as you go along. You know, if you can divide things, uh, you know, into those subgoals or sub-processes, it just kind of helps you like, you know, keep that momentum as you, as you move along. There's, there's one other story that, that, you know, when I was first starting, this guy Posted this negative comment for me and he was like, well, it just takes enough time and money, you know, to go to every country in the world, not a huge deal. You know, and at first I was really offended, you know, like you are when you get a negative comment. I was like, oh, I can't believe this guy, like it's.

• 30:11Lewis Howes?

  It's one person out of thousands.

• 30:13Chris Guillebeau?

  I know, like, what a jerk or whatever, right? But then I actually kind of like, okay, like, so forget that guy, who cares about that guy? But let's think about the comment. Um, time and money actually is kind of helpful, you know, to break things down and to look and see, okay, what is involved, you know, what is involved? How much time will this take? You know, what is the financial cost? And what are the other costs? There's probably some uncertain costs. There's probably some other things I haven't considered, but actually thinking logically really helped me a lot as I, as I worked through the journey.

• 30:41Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, interesting. And what, what, let's just talk about the, um, criteria for you for being in a country. Was it you had to be there for 24 hours? You had to see a landmark? You had to speak to someone and have a meal? What was the criteria?

• 30:55Chris Guillebeau?

  I didn't have a ton of specific criteria. I didn't count, uh, layovers or airport stops, like actually I had to be in the country. And in most cases I'm staying at least a few days. Uh, I mean, as I mentioned, I also lived in West Africa for years. I had lived in the Philippines for two years when I was younger. Um, you know, some countries I'd been to for several months or several weeks. Uh, but then there's also a number of places that I went to for a short period of time, you know, a couple of days and I'm okay with that.

• 31:20Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 31:20Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, it's, it's fine. I mean, for me, I wasn't, the goal wasn't trying to be an expert on all 193 countries.

• 31:26Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 31:26Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, in the world, um, so I'm, I'm much more of a generalist.

• 31:30Lewis Howes?

  Got you. And do you speak any other languages?

• 31:33Chris Guillebeau?

  Not very well. You know, really not well. I mean, I, I speak conversational French from having lived in Africa and, um, Spanish when I have to, but, uh, I'm really not, not skilled in that area.

• 31:44Lewis Howes?

  You can get around if you need to.

• 31:46Chris Guillebeau?

  If I need to, yeah. But then I feel like that's a, that's a valid criticism, maybe some of my, my travel. But I also feel like I would say, well, okay, you know, sure, I should be better at that. I agree. But I would also say like, you, you shouldn't let anything hold you back. You know, like I was able to do this without, without that skill, you know, so.

• 32:03Lewis Howes?

  And that wasn't your goal to learn a hundred new countries, a hundred new languages or whatever? Like, uh, there's, who's the guy who does that?

• 32:09Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, there's a few different guys.

• 32:10Lewis Howes?

  Seems like Benny something.

• 32:11Chris Guillebeau?

  Benny, Benny Lewis is one, one of the guys who's done like, I don't know, eight or 10 languages. Probably another language since we, since we've started this podcast.

• 32:19Lewis Howes?

  It's crazy.

• 32:19Chris Guillebeau?

  But yeah, there's some people really into that, so that's great.

• 32:21Lewis Howes?

  So what's the biggest skill that you developed over these six years while traveling?

• 32:27Chris Guillebeau?

  Confidence. Probably the ability to know that I would be okay. The ability to know that I I I would be able to figure anything out, you know, like. I I could I could make all kinds of mistakes and I actually made more mistakes at the end of the journey than I did in the beginning, which I thought was interesting. Because in the beginning, I was super like careful about, you know, like checking everything in advance and like packing and repacking and like worrying a lot and making sure I had information in multiple places like those things you do when you travel.

• 32:57Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 32:57Chris Guillebeau?

  And and toward the end, I just didn't care.

• 32:59Lewis Howes?

  Screw it, screw it.

• 33:00Chris Guillebeau?

  It's gonna be fine, you know, it's gonna be fine, like if something can go wrong and I'll figure it out. So so for me, the biggest skill wasn't learning languages or learning something practical. It was maybe just just that confidence or that ability to to know I'd be okay.

• 33:15Lewis Howes?

  So did that confidence actually create laziness towards the end of the journey or the quest?

• 33:20Chris Guillebeau?

  Perhaps, perhaps, sure, yeah, no, that's that's also a valid point, yeah, in some ways, uh. In some ways, I think I could also say I took parts of it less seriously towards the end. Um, I don't want to say like I phoned it in, I just didn't care or something. That would be an exaggeration, but I do think. You know, it was kind of like after the first hundred and sixty countries or something, then like the final, you know, thirty, it is kind of like, well, today I'm going off to Chad. You know, not really thinking about that, I'm thinking about my other stuff and I'll think about Chad when I get there.

• 33:48Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 33:49Chris Guillebeau?

  But so that maybe that's probably also why it's good that the quest hasn't ended. You know, because I don't think I would have wanted to keep doing it for four hundred countries that, you know, if there were four hundred countries, let's say.

• 33:59Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 33:59Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, I think I think maybe it's good that I had that end in sight.

• 34:02Lewis Howes?

  Wow. What was the biggest lesson you learned? Uh, I would say confidence would be like a skill. What would be the biggest lesson you learned about the world and then the biggest lesson you learned about yourself?

• 34:15Chris Guillebeau?

  Hmm, yeah, that's a great question. I guess, um, you know, start with the obvious is like, I think all of us have our own worldview. And that's, that's fine and normal. It's based on our own culture, our own experience, our own upbringing, et cetera. And then, you know, once you start traveling, I mean, one of the beautiful things about traveling, especially if you, if you really go to experience other cultures, you know, if you really do, you know, make an effort to speak with people and go and see what life is like in different religions or just different institutions. You, you kind of just realize like, okay, actually, uh, maybe my way is not right, or my, my, maybe my way is right for me, but there are other ways, other ways of thinking, other, other ways of life. And that's actually really interesting. I, I, I really feel like

• 34:58Chris Guillebeau?

  the, the novice traveler always, like goes out and has some experience and says, wow, like people everywhere are just the same, you know? Like people in China, they think just like us or in India. I really don't think that's true. I actually think people really have unique culture and identity around the world and that's the fun part of it. You know, that's what, that's what's interesting and good, right? So I guess just kind of a, a general humbling is, um, is how I would put it. I would say, like, wow, like, life is really different in West Africa. Like you'll see when you go to Ghana.

• 35:26Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 35:26Chris Guillebeau?

  And, and that's great. Like, I'm so glad that life is not the same everywhere around the world.

• 35:30Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. Interesting. So we're always told to think outside the box or hear this, think outside the box, but you talk, you talk about getting in the box idea. Can you talk about what get in the box idea is?

• 35:43Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah. Getting in the box is about restricting your creativity and restricting your ideas because we all have so many ideas and sometimes that leads to stagnation or to not doing anything. And

• 35:55Lewis Howes?

  Too many options means no decisions.

• 35:57Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, exactly. And so I guess for me, part of what's helped in, into the creative process in general, whether it's, it's writing books or something like a quest is, is to restrict those options. And to, to kind of, you know, paint some corners around myself and say, okay, here, here is the box, right? Like everybody's always saying, as, as you mentioned, like get out of the box, you know, blah, blah, blah. Um, but for the quest, it's helpful to have these parameters. Here's what a country is, you know? I get questions about this too, like how many countries are there? I'm like, well, I use the the UN list. You know, I use the list of United Nations member states. There are other lists out there. There are other places, other geographical places which are kind of debatable and like it's this geopolitical

• 36:37Chris Guillebeau?

  conflict over whether they are a country or not. That's totally fine, but I I feel like you you need to have a box. You need to have a parameter. So for me, like, that's the parameter I I chose and you know, I I feel like I feel like this is helpful in life is to say like here are here are the the guidelines or the the rules in which I'm gonna live my life or pursue this project and I'm the one who's making those, right? That's what you should do for your life, like no one else is doing this, but I feel like if it's self if it's self applied, then it's good.

• 37:01Lewis Howes?

  You've got to create that, yeah. So how many other countries or sort of countries are there on different lists that you haven't visited?

• 37:11Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, um, so it depends on the list, you know, the UN list, a hundred and ninety-three. Um, there's other places like Kosovo, which are recognized, you know, by some governments and not by others, um, Taiwan. You know, as an independent entity in many ways, um, but is not a UN member state, um, Palestine, places like that. I've actually been to most of those, most of those disputed areas. Um, so if you count maybe two hundred-ish countries, I've probably been to a hundred and ninety-eight, a hundred and ninety-nine.

• 37:40Lewis Howes?

  Wow, where where have you not been?

• 37:42Chris Guillebeau?

  Uh, actually, so I mentioned Palestine, I actually have not been to Palestine, so I would love to go there at some point. Uh, Western Sahara is essentially its own state. It has been for decades, um, but it's just not able to gain recognition, uh, because of Spain, because of Morocco. It probably never will, at least not for the foreseeable future. Uh, I haven't I haven't been to Western Sahara. Um, so there's there's a number of of places like that. And then there's some broader lists. Um, for people who really get into this, there there is like a list called the Traveler's Century Club and that lists a whole lot of islands. It lists like islands, uh, that are that are essentially, they they they kind of belong politically to some country somewhere, but they're essentially independent because they're so geographically remote. And I've been to a number of those places, but there's there are many more.

• 38:26Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, got you. There's a great quote in the book that says it's better to be at the bottom of the ladder you want to climb than to be at the top of the one you don't. Can you speak into that for a moment?

• 38:37Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, I think that was from a guy who was a musician. And when he first started his music career, he talked about how excited he was to play a gig when there'd be like five people there or something, you know? He's making like 10 bucks or nothing, you know? And he talked about how in many ways, like you could look at that and say like he's unsuccessful or whatever, like this is not much of a start, but he was super excited because he was like, this is what I want to do and this is what I want to be and I'm willing to start at the bottom. You know, he said, it's better to be at the bottom of the ladder and climb than to have some job that sucks or not to say that every job sucks, right? But to be on some trajectory that is not what I want to do. Even if I'm successful at it, I'd much rather be struggling, you know, working my way up

• 39:21Chris Guillebeau?

  something that I believe in than to be really successful in something I don't.

• 39:25Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, that's pretty cool. Nice. Is there ever a time to quit a quest?

• 39:31Chris Guillebeau?

  Sure. I think so. I think, you know, I don't think, I don't think the advice of like just keep going, you know, universally applies. I think, I think it depends on a lot of things. I think maybe it depends on how far along you are, right? So, you know, for me, the quest was 10 years, you know? How long, how long is the quest for the Olympics? Like, how much time have you put into that?

• 39:51Lewis Howes?

  Well, it's been, shoot, since 2008, I started, I guess, the quest. And so I don't even know, what is that, six years so far?

• 40:02Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah.

• 40:03Lewis Howes?

  And the next Olympics is 2016 in Rio. We're, we're a very small chance of qualifying. So I'm on the Olympic team for the USA, but they only take one country from North and South America. So there's a lot of countries in South America that are, that are better than us right now. So we'd have to do something incredible to make it, make it a possible. But I'm going to keep going for as long as my body is able to go.

• 40:24Chris Guillebeau?

  Sure, of course.

• 40:25Lewis Howes?

  And it may take another four, eight years, I don't know.

• 40:29Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, definitely. I guess, you know, so when I say it depends on like how far along you are, I mean, You know, you have, first of all, you have to, you have to still believe in it. I think, you know, there are plenty of times when you say it sucks, right? There's something about it sucks, but that's different from not believing in it, you know?

• 40:43Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 40:43Chris Guillebeau?

  And I also focus on that question of regret that we touched on earlier, like, you know, I think it's always helpful to ask yourself, okay, if I stopped now, would I regret it later?

• 40:51Lewis Howes?

  Mm hmm.

• 40:52Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, and if you're able to honestly answer and say like, actually, no, I don't think I'll, like, this is something I wanted to do for a while, but now I want to do something different. I don't think I'll regret it later, then you might as well stop, right? Why, why kill yourself? You know, if it's not something that you believe in, I guess, you know?

• 41:04Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 41:05Chris Guillebeau?

  And so that's why I think the timeframe matters a little bit, because if I felt that way in year one, you know, of the 10 year quest, then I probably should quit, right? Because why, why kill myself for 10 years for something I didn't believe in? But, you know, if I felt that way in year nine, maybe my advice to myself would be like, just suck it up, you know, because the end is in sight, you know, you've made it, you've made it this far.

• 41:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 41:26Chris Guillebeau?

  You don't, you don't want to be like the guy who went to like,

• 41:28Lewis Howes?

  Almost made it.

• 41:29Chris Guillebeau?

  Most, almost, almost every country, you know, like, doesn't, doesn't sound so good.

• 41:32Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. Uh, yeah, so obviously your, your story took, you know, a decade, a lot of stories took, uh, a number of years in the book. So how did you feel when you accomplished it? And is there a sense of sadness or pure excitement, uh, at the end?

• 41:49Chris Guillebeau?

  It's complicated. I felt, I, I did feel excited and, and, and proud and, and, but I also felt kind of weird, you know, I, I felt kind of like, okay, like, now what? You know, because I, I had worked toward that for such a long time and, and this was actually something that was really quite common. Like, I feel like I didn't do the greatest job answering that question earlier. A lot of people, as they approached, you know, the end of their quest, um, there was a, you know, kind of a sense of sadness or alienation, or kind of like, what's next? You know, a little bit of confusion. I experienced a lot of that. It's a complicated thing. When you work towards something for a long period of time. You know, and and then you achieve it. Um, it's great. So I think it helps to kind of, you know, decompress and debrief for that a little bit. And then I guess, you know, before too much longer,

• 42:33Chris Guillebeau?

  you gotta think, okay, what's next? You know, I don't want to live in that identity of something that that's already in the past.

• 42:38Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 42:38Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, I wanna, I wanna live for the present and build for the future.

• 42:41Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, yeah. So where was the last country that you visited?

• 42:46Chris Guillebeau?

  The last country was Norway, actually. And we chose Norway because uh, maybe about thirty countries prior to that, I realized that Norway was Norway was the last European country um, that I hadn't been to. It's it's a very safe and stable country. It's really easy to get to. Uh, I didn't want any uncertainty, like as I approached the end.

• 43:06Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 43:06Chris Guillebeau?

  You know, I guy, cause I, the whole goal was to end on my thirty fifth birthday. And I had planned it that way for seven years. And so, you know, I didn't want to be like in Sudan or something on that birthday. And then also a bunch of, a bunch of my friends and readers wanted to come along too. And so I didn't want to be responsible for bringing them to a war zone or something, you know?

• 43:23Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 43:23Chris Guillebeau?

  Um, so we, we chose Norway and and that's where we ended uh, just last year.

• 43:27Lewis Howes?

  So on the last day in Norway, as you're flying home or wherever you're flying to next, what was coming up for you as you're packing up, getting ready to realize that this is your last flight for this quest heading away from the last country?

• 43:43Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, it was weird. It really was weird because, yeah, I'm just, I'm just packing my bag like I've done like every single day, essentially, you know, for the past ten years, I've been on the road a hundred, a hundred days a year or whatever. And but uh, you know, you're right, there's, there's no new country coming up, you know, like I'm going home through Hong Kong. And I've been to Hong Kong many times, so that's, that's fun. Um, but they've always, but there's always been like something ahead, you know, it's always, like even if I'm going home to, to Portland, Oregon, where I live, there's gonna be another country the next month. Uh, so it was, it was just a reflective, reflective time. But I think ultimately, like hopefully, you know, what I do with my life will be greater than just visiting every country in the world. So I guess, so in some ways I was happy to just say, okay, you know, mission accomplished. What's next?

• 44:26Lewis Howes?

  Right. So, so would you say it's important to debrief uh, after a quest and um, you know, to make sure that there's no quest hangover, so to speak, or, you know?

• 44:37Chris Guillebeau?

  I think it's hard to avoid the quest hangover. I definitely had that. And most people do in some way. Um. It's important to process and people process differently. You know, some people do do process through debriefing, uh, through talking with others. Maybe some people are more internal processors, maybe some people are writers. Or, you know, I do think it's important to think it through one way or another.

• 44:58Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. So what's the next unreasonable quest for you?

• 45:01Chris Guillebeau?

  The next unreasonable quest, I don't think, uh, I'm not gonna go to the moon. You know, I'm not gonna go like outer space. I mean, probably like a million people have said like, oh, you know, Richard Branson, he's got this thing where you can go to space, you know? Like, that's awesome. That's cool. But I don't think that's that's me right now. Uh, I think for me, you know, the the journey was transformative in lots of ways. And one of the ways was in the beginning, I was really focused on myself and I was really focused on doing my own thing and that was fine. But, you know, thankfully throughout the process, so many other people came along to engage and participate and be part of this, you know, thing called community, which I really didn't understand before. And I feel like, you know, the next focus, at least for me, not sure how the quest aspect will come into play,

• 45:44Chris Guillebeau?

  but the next focus is definitely on on that community element, um, on helping people live unconventional lives, whatever that looks like for them. And I think hopefully ultimately that that will be, as I said, even more meaningful than going to every country or whatever.

• 45:56Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. So it's really about serving others to achieve their own quest.

• 45:59Chris Guillebeau?

  Woo.

• 46:00Lewis Howes?

  And, um, you know, discover that, explore that and, and, you know, create possibilities for people to do that, which I think is pretty cool. Uh, so you don't see yourself doing a a journey or a quest.

• 46:11Chris Guillebeau?

  Maybe a different kind, maybe a different kind. Yeah. Maybe I'll knit 10,000 hats. We'll see.

• 46:16Lewis Howes?

  Ah, I like it. Yeah. In two thousand, uh, on page 2000, oh, sorry, 2000. Page 219, I'm looking at it right now. You've got a a timeline of disasters and pitfalls and mistakes. A little graphic, which I think is pretty cool. Um, there's lots of good stuff in this book. Um, I want people to make sure to check this out. Where can they check this out? Where can they go to?

• 46:37Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah. So they should be able to to ask for the happiness of pursuit at any bookstore or on amazon.com. Uh, they can can connect with me at chrisgillivoe.com, which no one can ever spell. But you can put up a link somewhere.

• 46:48Lewis Howes?

  I'll link it up.

• 46:49Chris Guillebeau?

  Yeah, they type in anything close to it on Google, they'll probably come to me.

• 46:52Lewis Howes?

  Sure, yeah. I'll make sure to have it all linked up in the show notes. Um, a couple last questions for you.

• 46:57Chris Guillebeau?

  Sure.

• 46:58Lewis Howes?

  What are you most grateful for?

• 47:02Chris Guillebeau?

  I'm grateful for a lot of things. I'm most grateful for freedom and independence. I'm most grateful for the ability to to make my own choices and to not be constrained, you know, by poverty or by choices other people have made. I'm grateful to be able to make my own choices.

• 47:22Lewis Howes?

  What do you feel like is your biggest gift to the world?

• 47:27Chris Guillebeau?

  I really have no idea. That's a tough one. I feel like somebody else has to answer that. Right? Like, how do you know what's your greatest gift to the world? I'm not sure.

• 47:34Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, okay. And final question, then. We'll get back to that. I'll ask other I'll ask other people what your greatest gift to the world is. Final question, then. It's what I like to ask all my guests at the end.

• 47:45Chris Guillebeau?

  That's a great question.

• 47:46Lewis Howes?

  It's what is your definition of greatness?

• 47:51Chris Guillebeau?

  Continuously improving your circumstances. Continuously improving your circumstances and the circumstances of others. Maybe always trying to do better.

• 48:01Lewis Howes?

  I love it. Chris Giliboe, you are a gem of a human being. I appreciate you. I acknowledge you for taking on your own quest, even as unreasonable and crazy it may sound for a lot of people, and for completing it and for sticking it out and for serving a new world of possibilities for people in a community that is able to take this on in their own life now. So, thank you so much for all that you do. The pursuit of the I wanted to say the pursuit of happiness. The happiness of pursuit. Finding the quest that will bring purpose to your life. Everyone, go check it out. I'll have it linked up in the show notes. Awesome read. Highly recommend it. Buy a copy for your friends as well and pass it out specifically to someone who you think doesn't have a purpose in their life

• 48:45Lewis Howes?

  yet. So, Chris, I appreciate you so much, my man. Thanks so much.

• 48:49Chris Guillebeau?

  Thank you so much, Louis. It's a huge honor. Thank you.

• 48:57Speaker 00

  I hope you guys enjoyed this episode with Chris and make sure to go back to the show notes over at lewishouse.com/89. You're gonna get all the links, you can check out his book, see Chris's site, and connect with him over on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and all that good stuff. If you guys haven't yet, please subscribe to us over on iTunes. When you hit the subscribe button in your podcast app, it really helps increase the rankings, it helps spread the message to other people who might be interested in the School of Greatness and its message. So it would mean a huge, it would mean so much to me if you did that. And leave us a review if you have yet to leave a review. I appreciate

• 49:38Speaker 00

  you guys so much. It means the world to me. I get constant messages from listeners in my inbox and over on Facebook and Instagram from people listening, and the difference it's making in their lives by what they're receiving from the guests I bring on. So thank you guys so much for taking the time to send those messages, and it just really means a lot to me. So I really appreciate it. I post some of them every now and then on Facebook. I'm just so touched by what you guys say and how it's supporting you, that it really wants me to just continue to do an awesome job for you guys and continue bringing on incredible guests to share their wisdom with you. And, you know, I'm right

• 50:21Speaker 00

  there with you. I'm learning along the way as we go. So the questions I ask are questions for me as well. I want to know this information, and I want to continue to better myself, and hopefully I get to do that with you guys at the same time. So it means a bunch so much, and I'm very, very grateful and blessed for all of you. Again, thank you guys so much for all that you do, for making this show incredible. And you guys know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.