#2273 - Adam Curry

Adam Curry is an internet entrepreneur, former MTV VJ, and podcasting pioneer. He is the co-host, along with John C. Dvorak, of the "No Agenda" podcast. www.noagendashow.net This episode is brought to you by ZipRecruiter — 4 out of 5 employers who post on ZipRecruiter get a quality candidate within the first day. Try ZipRecruiter FOR FREE at ziprecruiter.com/rogan Go to https://www.expressvpn.com/ROGAN and find out how you can get 4 months of ExpressVPN free! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

  The Joe Rogan Experience. Training by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.

• 0:12Joe Rogan?

  Bullshit. I never got it until this year, but that's what they say.

• 0:15Speaker 02

  That's what they say. You get it within a couple of years, you get it, and then all of a sudden, you got it.

• 0:21Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I don't know who the fuck they are, but it's not bad.

• 0:23Speaker 02

  I could hear it the other day. I heard it.

• 0:25Joe Rogan?

  Stuffiness?

• 0:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 0:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I heard you. Yeah, I had it for like four days. I've had stuffiness. But the thing is, like, when I work out, I feel great. The way I can really tell, like, the way I judge whether or not I should even work out, is when I get in the sauna, in the cold plunge. If I feel tired and weak when I'm in there, then I know something's going on. It's not as simple as allergies.

• 0:43Speaker 02

  So I thought for 10 years, I had the Austin allergy. For 10 years. It was so bad. I'd go out to dinner, even when we moved out to Fredericksburg, we come into Austin, I thought it was Austin. I'm serious. I'm like, oh, Austin has given me this stuff. We go out to dinner, start eating, and then, my nose, my eyes, everything, just, and I have to always excuse myself, always have to have tissues in my back pocket. Then I got my teeth done, which we talked about, I think, the last time I was here. And Maverick, my periodontist, he did one of these 360 MRIs. He says, you know, man, you've got some low-level infection here. And that could be responsible for a whole bunch of stuff.

• 1:22Speaker 02

  Now, I'd had hearing aids for five years. So when he did the initial extraction, I think I took one or two shows off, and then I went back in the studio, put my headphones on, and like, whoa, I thought I hit something, you know, a volume knob or something. Came back.

• 1:39Joe Rogan?

  Your hearing came back.

• 1:40Speaker 02

  Because this was infected, and it was basically clogging up my sinuses, and that was affecting the hearing.

• 1:47Joe Rogan?

  Jesus. How can a mouth infection like that, it's very dangerous, isn't it?

• 1:52Speaker 02

  People have no idea how important oral health is. It's really, really critical. And also, I feel better, because, you know, I'm not fighting infection continuously.

• 2:02Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy. So how did it all start? Like, what was going on with your teeth? That like made all these.

• 2:08Speaker 02

  I had a, I had a bad start in life when, uh, when I was two or three, we're living in Uganda. And my parents would put me to sleep with a chocolate cookie. So I had kind of a bad start, you know? And I had a lot of work. I had, um, you know, just tons of fillings on my baby teeth. Everything was messed up. Then I had the big outboard headgear, which really traumatized me for life. Taking that to school, you know, I was like, I was one of those guys. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. It was bad. And, uh, about, um, uh, 10 years ago, maybe a little bit more. I went to the dentist here in, uh, in Austin and, you know, he's like, you know, we really got to start doing stuff.

• 2:49Speaker 02

  We got to start looking at repairing. And then this dentist started hitting on me and texting me and, you know, I'm like.

• 2:55Joe Rogan?

  Oh, great. Guy or girl?

• 2:57Speaker 02

  Guy.

• 2:58Joe Rogan?

  Damn.

• 2:59Speaker 02

  Like, no, no, no, no. So, and I knew that there was a Pandora's box.

• 3:02Joe Rogan?

  How wild is that? Like, what a risky move.

• 3:05Speaker 02

  It was so dumb. Like.

• 3:06Joe Rogan?

  You're a married, straight guy. It's like, yeah, I think I can get him though.

• 3:11Speaker 02

  We can get, we can, he can be on our team.

• 3:14Joe Rogan?

  That is such a ma- a man move. It's such a thing that men would do. It's so stupid.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  I'm here with some buddies of mine, you know, sending a picture. I'm like, no, no, no, no.

• 3:24Joe Rogan?

  They're all shirtless and fucking wearing cowboy hats.

• 3:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. I'm not going back. I'm good. And then Tina and I, you know, we got together. We moved out to Fredericksburg and she, and she's real big on, you know, preventative of anything. You know, her car has the oil, everything on time. Everything's all set. And her teeth, of course, are impeccable.

• 3:43Joe Rogan?

  That's not a good fit for you.

• 3:45Speaker 02

  Total.

• 3:47Joe Rogan?

  You need an organized lady.

• 3:48Speaker 02

  You have, I had a credit score of 350.

• 3:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh no.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  I didn't have credit card. I was just cash, you know, like, I didn't care. Like, you know, I had cash flow. Everything's good. I don't care. Uh, she straightened me out. Oh yeah. Oh, big time.

• 4:01Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Disorganized men very much need organized women. You just can't have one that turns into your mom.

• 4:08Speaker 02

  Oh, no, no. That was my first, that was my first wife.

• 4:10Joe Rogan?

  That does happen with some of them. Some of them, when you give them the reins and they start telling you what to do. All of a sudden, then it becomes very non-sexy.

• 4:18Speaker 02

  I will say props to my first wife. She kept me, that was the height of my show business fame, MTV. She kept me out of trouble. I, I did not, I did not participate.

• 4:28Joe Rogan?

  She was a good mommy.

• 4:29Speaker 02

  She was a good mom. And she's a good mom to our daughter, you know, so yeah, for sure.

• 4:35Joe Rogan?

  Well, you know, you change, they change, you need a different kind of a mom.

• 4:39Speaker 02

  Things, things change, things change. Yeah, so then, you know, I, I went through it. Yeah, it was like, um, uh, and that's also when I stopped smoking, you know, I, cause

• 4:50Speaker 02

  Maverick called me up, he said, hey, man, I'm gonna be operating on you in a week, you know, could you do me a favor and stop putting fire in your mouth? And I've been smoking weed and tobacco since I was 15. And I quit at that moment, I haven't, I didn't ever, I mean, I vape like a, like a crazy horse, but.

• 5:05Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's not good, is it?

• 5:06Speaker 02

  Well, that's a question.

• 5:08Joe Rogan?

  This is, you and I've gone over this and we will go back to it.

• 5:10Speaker 02

  It's a nicotine, uh, delivery device. Yeah, that's what it is.

• 5:14Joe Rogan?

  We'll get to that.

• 5:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, sure.

• 5:15Joe Rogan?

  So, so just cleaning out the infections, what was going on that that was fucking up your hearing? It was like, the whole area was inflamed?

• 5:23Speaker 02

  Yes, right by your sinuses. And so that, you know, everything's connected, you know, if you hold your nose, you can hear, you hear differently, so. Whatever it was doing, and it literally, just a couple of days after he extracted, though, he extracted more than that, but after he extracted those teeth, it just came back. And I didn't have horrible hearing loss, but it was enough where I was sick of saying, I'm sorry, darling, what'd you say? I'm sorry. And at the moment, you get to like, I didn't hear her, I'll ask her later. That's when I went, no, I gotta get hearing aids. I don't wanna, I don't, and it's, one of the biggest reasons men, um, uh, get depressed is when they can't hear and they kind of withdraw and it's a, it's a.

• 6:03Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 6:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's, oh, it's a real crisis. Yeah, anyone, you need to go, if you think, you just have your ears tested anyway, why not? I mean, you get your eyes tested, get your ears tested, get your teeth taken care of.

• 6:13Joe Rogan?

  So they find out your ears are not good, do they ever check for infections?

• 6:17Speaker 02

  No.

• 6:17Joe Rogan?

  Cause it seems like now you should get in the medical books.

• 6:20Speaker 02

  He, thank you. We, actually, he's been writing a paper on this for this very reason. And it's only because he did the 360 MRI that he saw it. And he also knew what to look for. It's his expertise, you know, he's, he's, when I met this guy, I was like, he's, you know, he's young, he's like in his 30s. I'm like, so why did you choose this profession? He says, I like operating. I really love doing that stuff. I'm like, okay, you you sound cool. And it turns out he's a pilot, you know, so we've become friends. Um, but yeah, he he says people have no idea. And so he has been working on a paper to publish about this very thing. It's just not known. I talked about on the podcast and people from all over the world like, really, man? You know, I've been having hearing issues. Get an MRI. Get a 360 MRI of your head.

• 7:04Joe Rogan?

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• 8:23Speaker 02

  You know, it's a it's an interesting subject because candy and sugar is really what caused all this horrible tooth decay in people. And the the goofy fucking solution that someone came up with along the way was putting fluoride in the water. Which is so goddamned insane that you're taking a neurotoxin and you're putting it in the water, but

• 8:46Joe Rogan?

  It, and again, like, I don't want to take even a political position on this. I just want to look at this, I want to look at this from a human lens. There is something that people do where even if something is obviously stupid, if it's a part of a system and there's enough air quotes "experts" that have endorsed this, regardless of the fact that we've seen time and time again throughout history that experts are compromised, experts are, you could put in, you could have a court case for a murder and bring in experts that will tell you he definitely did it and experts will tell you he definitely didn't do it.

• 9:26Joe Rogan?

  So we know this for a fact, but still, people argue on the side of the experts. And I've seen this about fluoride and it, it's so mind boggling. There are conclusive studies that show a direct correlation between high levels of fluoride in the local water and lower IQs. And it's a neurotoxin, we know it's bad for you in large doses. And yet, there are fucking people out there with college degrees who read the New York Times, who think they're sensible people that will get angry if you want to remove this neurotoxin from water because look at all the strides it's done in preventing tooth decay.

• 10:09Joe Rogan?

  And you just want to say, "Hey, man, fuck you. This is stupid."

• 10:14Speaker 02

  I went to dinner at Mitch's house, I call him.

• 10:16Joe Rogan?

  I'm a little upset.

• 10:17Speaker 02

  No, no, it's okay because, because we're sitting down, it's my wife, his wife, you know, he has one of those houses right on the airport where this plane rolls out of the garage, you know, out of the hangar.

• 10:26Joe Rogan?

  Oh, he's out of touch.

• 10:28Speaker 02

  Exactly. I paid for that. I like, I paid for that hangar. And, and we're sitting down and we're having a good time, you know, we're talking about stuff. He says, "So what do you think about fluoride? It should not be in the water." He's like, "You're wrong!" You know, and this is only a couple of years ago. And now he's come back and he said, "Oh, man, this is, I was..."

• 10:47Joe Rogan?

  Did he apologize?

• 10:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course. This was drilled into my head, like, but what I understand is fluoride is a byproduct of... Aluminum production. And a lot of this, you know, they had this fluoride waste product, basically, they needed to get rid of. And from what I understand, it was Alcoa, I could be wrong, but I think it was Alcoa, who made these deals. And who knows how they set that up with the American Dental Association, and that's how fluoride got into our water, and we got this kind of psy-op of it's good for you. I knew it was wrong in 2000, in 2000, and there was a book that came out called Legacy of Ashes. It was written by a guy called Tim Weiner, who used to be New York Times. And it was all about the CIA. And it's a great book, because my uncle is in it many times, Donald Gregg.

• 11:33Speaker 02

  He's still with us, he's 95 or 96. And he was really high up in the CIA, he was, you know, part of OSS back in the day. And in it, it talks about how the, how the agents would go in, fluoridate the enemy's camp water, so they could go in at night, and they could, they were docile, and they could pull them out, and they could kind of attack them. And I said, Uncle Don, is this true? He says, yeah, pretty much how I remember it. I'm like, well, of course. This, so the neurotoxin has been used in actual warfare in the water.

• 12:05Joe Rogan?

  To make people docile.

• 12:06Speaker 02

  Yeah. Docile and...

• 12:07Joe Rogan?

  And then the argument is so dumb, because, you know, my friend Eddie Bravo had a great point. Uh, he said, when you get toothpaste, uh, do you ever see toothpaste that says fluoride free? Why would they say that and advertise it?

• 12:23Speaker 02

  Toms.

• 12:24Joe Rogan?

  If fluoride wasn't bad for you? Why would they do that? Like, why would that be a selling point?

• 12:29Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 12:29Joe Rogan?

  If we've always looked for fluoride in toothpaste, my whole life. Crest, oh, fluoride, got it. You know, when you're going through the CVS, and you're grabbing stuff and throwing it back?

• 12:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:37Joe Rogan?

  It's always fluoride. You're always looking for fluoride. That's what kills the fucking germ. I don't want cavities, I don't have to go to the dentist.

• 12:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:43Joe Rogan?

  Give me that fluoride. But they're selling toothpaste without fluoride. Why is that? And the guy who was saying it to, like, he had this look on his face, like, he was like, he was trapped. Because he's just trapped, like, so you don't think fluoride is good for you? It's like one of those things, like, that's just what he just said, no. Just brush your fucking teeth. It's really that simple.

• 13:02Speaker 02

  As a kid, did you get those trays at the dentist? Do you remember those?

• 13:06Joe Rogan?

  What are the trays?

• 13:07Speaker 02

  It was, and so it would be, they'd say, we're gonna do fluoride treatment on you.

• 13:10Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah, they did that.

• 13:11Speaker 02

  And it was like, it's, it's, it's fruity. You know, and this gunk could be dripping back in your throat. You're gagging with this horrible, it's like, that's not, that's not Hawaiian punch.

• 13:20Joe Rogan?

  You get a D in English because you're fucking stupid.

• 13:23Speaker 02

  Pretty much the story of my life, Joe.

• 13:27Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, it's, it's so bad. It's really bad for you and it's not necessary. And we're being co-opted by something and someone. And I think we looked this up on the podcast, Jamie, didn't it come out of, there was some town in Texas, I believe, that had naturally fluoridated water, which occasionally, you know, just happens.

• 13:45Speaker 02

  We have it in hill country, the water is definitely naturally fluoridated.

• 13:48Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's, there's natural levels of different minerals and there's different stuff. And this one area had a, a fairly high natural level of fluoride. And these people had like great oral hygiene. Whether or not that was a convenient study that they pointed to, or convenient case they pointed to, to make the argument to get rid of all that fluoride. You know, this like, you gotta look many layers into all this kind of stuff. Cause they've been throwing fluoride in the water for how long? And how much money has been spent throwing fluoride in the water? And how many people have like built mansions and have fucking, you know, Mercedes Benz, they're tooling around it because they've been throwing fluoride in the water?

• 14:29Joe Rogan?

  And that's, that's a deep system to try to untangle after 50, 60 years of doing this.

• 14:34Speaker 02

  It's the petrochemical industry. That's where all our medicines come from. I was watching the Grammys and I don't really.

• 14:41Joe Rogan?

  Why? What's wrong with you?

• 14:42Speaker 02

  I know, well, I usually watch for the Satan segment. I would say, oh, okay, there it is, there's the Illuminati.

• 14:46Joe Rogan?

  There's always one.

• 14:47Speaker 02

  There's the, they didn't have one.

• 14:49Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy.

• 14:50Speaker 02

  Beautiful women in nice dresses and everything.

• 14:53Joe Rogan?

  Trump is president, they're a little nervous.

• 14:54Speaker 02

  Presidents are important for the culture.

• 14:56Joe Rogan?

  It's very important for the Satan people.

• 14:59Speaker 02

  They're in trouble.

• 15:00Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 15:00Speaker 02

  They're in trouble. Jesus is making a comeback, man. They're in trouble there.

• 15:04Joe Rogan?

  You gotta hide now, go back into the basement of Comet Pizza.

• 15:09Joe Rogan?

  Place that doesn't have a basement, by the way.

• 15:11Speaker 02

  We're reliably informed. And I hadn't really watched network television a lot, and there's a lot of commercial breaks, but the first 10 all had a pharmaceutical product which had never heard of, a name I can't remember, and side effects literally included death. I'm like, what is going on with this? And like, ask your doctor, I'm like, do I have this? Should I have this? Do I want this? I mean, is this going on with me? And people are all happy in the commercials. They're like, look, my skin looks good and I'm happy and I have a beautiful family. It's almost like we used to, you know, sell cars. Now they're just selling the pharmaceuticals.

• 15:44Joe Rogan?

  Well, that will be an interesting thing if RFK Junior gets in place. If RFK Junior gets in place and they stop this.

• 15:51Speaker 02

  Advertising.

• 15:52Joe Rogan?

  Advertising on, we are one of two countries on earth that allows, yeah, New Zealand and New Zealand's far more restrictive than us. We should be really restrictive about this because advertising works. You know, and there's advertising that doesn't bother me at all, like Chevrolet Corvette.

• 16:10Joe Rogan?

  You know, it's okay, it's fine. But when it can give you bloody diarrhea and suicidal ideology.

• 16:15Speaker 02

  Anal leakage.

• 16:16Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and you're just fucked up in the head and you're depressed and like, you don't know why, but now your zits are gone. Like, hey, slow down. That was not in that commercial with the lady dancing in the field with her child and the people at the picnic and they're all smiling and laughing and having a good time together. That looked like fun. Like, what, where's that part?

• 16:36Speaker 02

  Well, of course, you know, this was, they tried, they've all tried all kinds of things to stop this and, you know, First Amendment comes up, although we have stopped tobacco advertisements and there's all kinds of things that have been done throughout the years. But what happened with television is all the money, I mean, really 60, 70, maybe 80% of all the advertising income is from pharmaceutical companies. That's why there's also no reporting. Like, we're not gonna bite the hand that feeds us.

• 17:04Joe Rogan?

  That's the real problem.

• 17:05Speaker 02

  That's, that's it.

• 17:06Joe Rogan?

  That's the real problem. The real problem is that these news organizations are not.

• 17:10Speaker 02

  Not just news, not just news, everything.

• 17:12Joe Rogan?

  Right, everything. They're not independent. Like, even television shows, like, could you imagine if, let's say a network. Has a prominent news organization and that news organization is very popular and it's a big part of their ratings. And it's a reliable source of information for, you know, people that believe them. And they're sponsored by pharmaceutical drug companies, but then they also have a crime show.

• 17:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:38Joe Rogan?

  On, and this crime show wants to do a thing about an evil guy who promotes a vaccine that winds up killing a bunch of people and they hide the data. And then they arrest him at the end of the, the end of the show, like no fucking way.

• 17:49Speaker 02

  That's not getting me. No green light for you.

• 17:52Joe Rogan?

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You turn, gotta turn that guy into a meth dealer. That's a meth dealer now. Let's just do a couple of rewrites, simple rewrites of the script.

• 18:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, exactly.

• 18:02Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, this is a bad guy from Guatemala. Let's, let's come with us. He's fucking, he's definitely not from here. He's definitely not from Moderna. And they definitely aren't working in conjunction with the government to develop this thing and the government's profiting off of it. That's not real.

• 18:17Speaker 02

  Well, we've, I mean, I say that we're in the season of reveal. I've been saying this for about a year now because, and it's really happening real quick with what we're uncovering and starting to understa- I haven't seen your, your talk with Mike Benz.

• 18:29Joe Rogan?

  Benz dropped some fucking seeds yesterday. If we're, we're in the season of flowers. It's, it's, he's blooming today. Cause he was so nervous yesterday. Jamie was talking about it before, like he was making all these tweets like they were gonna kill him. Probably, yeah, it's probably been discussed.

• 18:44Speaker 02

  Hmm. Well, I, I think it's way too far beyond and I think, you know, I look at, um, Leave It To Beaver, I call her, who, who's the, the new press secretary. She's 27 years old.

• 18:55Joe Rogan?

  Oh yeah, she's good though.

• 18:56Speaker 02

  She's fantastic. She's younger than my, than my daughters.

• 18:58Joe Rogan?

  A gal, I don't think you should say Leave It To Beaver.

• 19:01Speaker 02

  I'm sorry, I'm sorry. That's just, that's how I remember her last name. All right. Caroline Leave It. I think it's Leave It. Thanks, Joe. Thanks. Thank you.

• 19:10Joe Rogan?

  So she, because we're old enough to remember when Beaver was a vagina. Most kids are like, I don't even know what the fuck they're talking about.

• 19:17Speaker 02

  Leave It To Beaver, what are you talking about?

• 19:18Joe Rogan?

  Name for a vagina, a beaver.

• 19:22Joe Rogan?

  Cause dudes didn't really have any derogatory names for dicks. It's just dick is the worst one. Like, "Oh, you're dick. Put your dick away, you fucking weirdo." You know what I mean? It was like, but Beaver-

• 19:31Speaker 02

  Well, we only had Pecker.

• 19:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 19:33Speaker 02

  You know, like-

• 19:33Joe Rogan?

  But Pecker's kinda cute.

• 19:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 19:35Joe Rogan?

  It's just a Pecker. Yeah. There's no like, real bad names for dick, other than dick.

• 19:40Speaker 02

  But she comes out, and-

• 19:42Joe Rogan?

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• 20:28Joe Rogan?

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• 21:12Joe Rogan?

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• 22:10Speaker 02

  She does this whole list of USAID, which is very little money. And I think our president is very smart. He's showing us things that enables people like Mike Benz and you and I to have these conversations about, you know, because it's not ideological that USAID, which is not USAID, this is like one of these, one of these psy-ops right up top, like you have Federal Express is not owned by the government. Federal Reserve is not owned by the government. USAID is the Agency for International Development, not aid. And we see on television, there goes another pallet onto the C-130. Aid, USAID from the American people.

• 22:47Joe Rogan?

  We're being nice.

• 22:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're being, we're being nice to people.

• 22:50Joe Rogan?

  We should be nice. We're the nice people of the world.

• 22:52Speaker 02

  But what these, and I'm sure Mike talked about this, you know, like LGBTQ, these, these dance parties and things, if you look at, I'm looking at these countries, like these are countries where we want to keep them away from Russia, overthrow the incumbents.

• 23:06Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 23:06Speaker 02

  And the way to garner support is to... And I really love how they added the Q. That just became so clear to me all of a sudden. If you sponsor LGBTQ, these are outcasts, these are people who feel that they've been marginalized. Then you add a Q, like, wait a minute, I can be queer, I'm different, I'm odd. You bring more people in, then you can bring the anarchists in.

• 23:27Joe Rogan?

  You can get A. They have the As in now.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, the As, I's, everything.

• 23:32Joe Rogan?

  But the As don't even have a dog in the fight.

• 23:34Speaker 02

  But that's the point. You want them to come to the party, come to the party, you're allowed to the party.

• 23:38Joe Rogan?

  That's why it's so long now.

• 23:39Speaker 02

  And I saw this, you know, AFD in Germany, you know, this is the, the extreme right party. And they wanted, um, you know, to slow or remove immigration. And, um, so now that there was a protest, uh, against the AFD, uh, you know, some, they're getting ready to vote now. And there's a hundred thousand people there. I'm like, wow, I do so, I thought, cause I know people in Germany, I have friends in Germany. They really are sick and tired of this immigration stuff. So where are these people coming from? And in the news report, right up front, there's a dude in a blonde wig with eye shadow saying, "We just wanna get along, we just want, can't we just be diverse?" I'm like, that's the psy-op.

• 24:18Speaker 02

  He, he's talking about himself. So he wants to feel included, which by the way, in America, you can do whatever you want. Call yourself whatever you want. People really don't have an issue with that. But they've just taken this and abused these people into their political agendas all over the world. And of course, it sparked something here in the States. If you look, the Democrat Party, there's, they're gonna die on this hill. They're still like, oh no, LGBTQ, they're taking away our rights because they know they can mobilize people to do that. And then you can throw in Palestine and all kinds of people.

• 24:53Joe Rogan?

  Did you see the city council thing in Worcester, Massachusetts yesterday? That's gone viral today?

• 24:58Speaker 02

  Which one is that?

• 24:59Joe Rogan?

  Jamie, did you see it?

• 25:01Joe Rogan?

  I'm seeing it right now on Twitter. Oh, yeah, yeah, pull this bitch up. I haven't seen it. There's a compilation of these people, like, absolutely freaking out. The best one's the compilation, if you can find the compilation. But it's all these LGBT people show up at this city council meeting to say there's like a trans genocide. It's one of those, dude. We're gonna round up in concentration camps, yeah.

• 25:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, five minutes long.

• 25:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, just give me, start from the beginning, give me, give me.

• 25:26Speaker 03

  Can you wrap up, please?

• 25:27Speaker 04

  Yes, I can.

• 25:30Speaker 04

  If you say that you're afraid of Trump and that's why you don't want city to be, the city to be a space, safe space for trans people, you better prepare for trans people to make this a very unsafe space.

• 25:41Speaker 02

  Oh, brother.

• 25:42Speaker 03

  I'm shaking right now. I don't want to be here. Can you wrap up, please?

• 25:48Speaker 03

  I'm sorry, am I taking too long pleading for my life?

• 25:51Speaker 05

  You remembered how many children I have and how many, and that two of them are trans.

• 25:55Joe Rogan?

  There it is. Yeah.

• 25:56Speaker 05

  I speak as both the B and the T in the LGBT.

• 26:02Joe Rogan?

  He's both.

• 26:02Speaker 04

  I'm multiply disabled. I have Ehlers-Danlos syndrome, which is a connective tissue disorder that causes me immense physical pain. I, um, I'm on the autism spectrum. And I have narcolepsy and I couldn't drive myself here, so I had to hide from my driver that I was in drag, which is not an easy thing to do in drag.

• 26:23Speaker 03

  I do not want to be here. It's my day off. I do not want to be in your DMs. I do not want to be in your email inboxes. I do not want my creativity writing diss tracks like Kendrick. I don't want to spend an hour applying glitter on my face so that you will hear and see me.

• 26:43Joe Rogan?

  What?

• 26:44Speaker 03

  I want you to listen to me.

• 26:46Joe Rogan?

  Let us remember that the. No, that's enough. So, it's like, you made me put glitter on my face, you piece of shit. Because everyone knows when you go to court, you have to have glitter on your face.

• 26:56Speaker 02

  These people, these people need hugs, they need love. I pray for them. The biggest way to psychologically manipulate people is, or there's three ways. Old people, puppies, and children. And the whole, and I followed this, it started around 2000. 2012, not coincidental when, you know about Smith-Mundt, the Smith-Mundt Act? So that's, you know, it was a law that was put in since the church commission, you can't propagandize the American people. Defense Department and others went to the government and said, "Well, you know, like, we're on the internet now. We might accidentally, you know, push some propaganda on people." It started with bullying in schools. I know, because John Dewaric and I, we followed it on no agenda. Started with bullying, then it was, um, we needed anti-bullying laws.

• 27:39Speaker 02

  And we're literally going like, "What happened to sticks and stones will break my bones?" Or punch the bully in his nose. No, no, no. Then the teachers, and then we got hate speech laws, not actually laws, but, you know, hate speech punishments. And this kept building up until you guaranteed parents through the American Medical Association, the Pediatric Society, a- all of these different, um, trade groups, that if you don't transition your child, that child will commit suicide.

• 28:08Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 28:09Speaker 02

  And that's just, that is a horrible thing that they've done. Think about these parents who may or may not one day wake up and go, "What have I done? What have I done?"

• 28:19Joe Rogan?

  Well, there was, someone was talking about this the other day, that this is the real problem, is that so many parents have committed to doing this to their children, and they, they cannot face

• 28:28Speaker 02

  They can't.

• 28:28Joe Rogan?

  the reality of what they've done, and so they're gonna dig their heels in forever.

• 28:32Speaker 02

  And vote Democrat.

• 28:34Joe Rogan?

  And they're gonna talk about gender-affirming care.

• 28:36Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:36Joe Rogan?

  But the thing is, that's a small percentage of people in the general population.

• 28:41Speaker 02

  Thank God.

• 28:41Joe Rogan?

  And, thank God, but they're, they're overrepresented in the fact that they make it their whole life. And so they, they're, they're very loud and very vocal, and then they become a political beach ball. I talk about

• 28:51Speaker 02

  I heard you talk about that with Bridget.

• 28:53Joe Rogan?

  That's what it is.

• 28:54Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 28:54Joe Rogan?

  The political beach balls at a concert, they chuck them up in the air so we always have something to fight about, so we're not paying attention to like, the USAID stuff, or a lot of the stuff that's like, really important. And this is, uh, just a, a part of this inter-

• 29:09Joe Rogan?

  Tangled web of psyops that's been running our, our culture. I mean, I would say our government, but it's, it's everything, right? So it's the government has established its hooks in us and put fear and law and rules. And the more law and the more rules, the better, because the more likely you're gonna break a few of them. And then you're gonna shut the fuck up.

• 29:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:31Joe Rogan?

  And they, they've got these fucking things everywhere. And it's just allowing them to run this mafia business. And there's a bunch of people that are reasonable, educated people that have Stockholm syndrome. Like, they, they don't want to admit that even their people, their cherished heroes like Obama, was a part of this.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm, a big part.

• 29:53Joe Rogan?

  And that these, all these people that you think of as progressive Democrats, they were all a part of it. And fortunately today, we have the convenient access to YouTube. Instantaneously, where you can watch Obama in 2003 say some very MAGA things. Or you could watch Hillary Clinton go more MAGA than MAGA.

• 30:15Speaker 02

  About deportations.

• 30:17Joe Rogan?

  Yes, yes. And that if you stay, you have to pay a stiff fine.

• 30:22Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:23Joe Rogan?

  I mean, the whole thing is, it's cyclical, right? Like, this is why the left is now supporting war and censorship. It's, it's not real. It's not that there's a good group of kind, compassionate, educated people, and a bunch of fucking buffoons who are racist who want to bring that back to Confederate flag.

• 30:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:41Joe Rogan?

  That's not what's going on.

• 30:42Speaker 02

  No.

• 30:42Joe Rogan?

  There's people that are nice, kind people that also understand the value of hard work and reality, and kindness, and also sternness and rule of law. And you can't just let violent criminals out in the street. And hey, maybe you should do some actual rehabilitation with the fucking billions of dollars you make in the prison industrial complex, when there's no rehabilitation. Like, no real concerted efforts to completely change these people and studies.

• 31:11Speaker 02

  It's a mess.

• 31:12Joe Rogan?

  It can be done, it could be done, and it probably could be done with psychedelic drugs. They probably can do some things with people, especially nonviolent criminals that are trying to figure out like, why have I been stealing from people my whole life? Like, what the fuck is wrong with me that I, unless they're a legitimate psychopath, they have no empathy? There's, there's people that can be kind of woken up to why they're in this horrific pattern of continual abuse in their life, and there's, there's ways to do it. And Rick Perry has been really, like, brave in this case, because, you know, he's a former Republican governor of Texas, and That's right. And now he's advocating for Iba game therapy, particularly for veterans, for guys who

• 31:55Joe Rogan?

  come over, they've seen the most horrific shit, their brain is in a shambles, and they want to do something, and they, they have no, no help in these pills that just dull their mind, and make them feel detached from reality, and all these fucking antidepressants and things they give them, and they, they want to fucking end their life. And they can go and get therapy that it cures 80% of them with one dose, and it's like 95% with two doses? It's fucking nuts, man. And we've been hiding this because, because of the sweeping Schedule I Drug Act of 1970 that was put in place directly by Nixon to go after his political opponents.

• 32:40Joe Rogan?

  It was directly put in place to demonize the anti-war movement, and demonize the Civil Rights Party, and the Black Panthers, and anybody who was a problem with the government. So they just said, let's just make all these things that these people are taking on a regular basis completely illegal, not only just Schedule I, like, with no medical use whatsoever, things that people have been using for thousands and thousands of years. And it's all the same shit, it's all psyops, it's all psyops. Have you ever heard of the audience effect? It is a psychological theory that our behavior changes when we know we're being watched. And here's the thing, we are being watched. When you use the internet, data brokers

• 33:22Joe Rogan?

  Watch and record everything you do online, even if you're using a private browser. But you don't have to become a slave to the digital surveillance state. You can free yourself with ExpressVPN. With ExpressVPN, 100% of your online activity is rerouted through secure encrypted servers that hide your IP address. That means you can get to use the internet with real freedom and privacy. It's incredibly fast, it doesn't slow down your streaming or downloading, and it lets you connect instantly to secure servers in 105 countries around the world. ExpressVPN is easy to use. It takes just one click, and it works on all of your devices, even smart TVs.

• 34:04Joe Rogan?

  Use it on up to eight devices at the same time and protect your whole family with just one subscription. And the best part? Podcast listeners can get four extra months of ExpressVPN for free at expressvpn.com/rogan or by tapping the banner. That's expressvpn.com/rogan or tap the banner. If you're watching on YouTube, you can get four free months by scanning the QR code on screen or by clicking the link in the description.

• 34:35Speaker 02

  Well, the number one thing that happened around that time, of course, during Kennedy, is we realized that television was a big force. Television and radio.

• 34:45Joe Rogan?

  Oh yeah, they got that handsome guy.

• 34:46Speaker 02

  And if you listen to some of the debates, like, you know, it would sound on the radio like Nixon did better. I mean, it's amazing how this worked between radio and television, but then newspapers, we know the intelligence agencies were all writing stories. I mean, you look at CNN, you still see ex-CIA guy shows up. A little story, when I saw you sitting at the inauguration, and I think I texted you, I'm like, dude, I can't believe it, I see you sitting there, you're texting me American flag emojis and stuff like, and you and Trump, I'm like, oh, look at him, he's in a tuxedo. And I thought...

• 35:26Speaker 02

  So my li- in 1983, um, I was still a teenager and, um, I grew up in Amsterdam. Socialist country, the airwaves were controlled by the government, it was horrible, it was almost like Russia. Your phone was a gray phone and that was your phone. You couldn't get a different phone, you couldn't, it was illegal to unplug it from the wall. And I was doing pirate radio at a place called Radio Decibel in Amsterdam and we were playing-

• 35:53Joe Rogan?

  You were Christian Slater.

• 35:55Speaker 02

  In a way.

• 35:56Joe Rogan?

  You remember that movie?

• 35:57Speaker 02

  In a way, oh yeah, yeah. What was that called, what was that movie called?

• 36:01Joe Rogan?

  I don't-

• 36:01Speaker 02

  Maybe it's called Pirate Radio?

• 36:03Joe Rogan?

  It was crazy, they were trying to arrest him, remember?

• 36:05Speaker 02

  Well, so we all got arrested several times and we were playing 12-inch imports from your Chicago warehouse-

• 36:11Joe Rogan?

  You got arrested several times for doing pirate radio?

• 36:13Speaker 02

  Oh yeah, oh, they would always get, they would always come and arrest us-

• 36:15Joe Rogan?

  How'd they find you?

• 36:15Speaker 02

  We, we literally had the station name on the door. People would come around, we'd be smoking weed, we're hanging out, you know, we weren't making any money, we were basically paying to do it, you know, and we had this huge antenna on the roof-

• 36:28Joe Rogan?

  Did this ever come up when you got hired by MTV? Did they get nervous about that? Like, did they have to do a background check? Say, this guy's got a record.

• 36:34Speaker 02

  No, remind me to tell you my USAID story in a minute. Um, so no, but this is 1983 and I, and I felt, it was so, of course I was a gawky, awkward kid, I got tics, you know, I got the wrong hair, every, I got the wrong moped, everything's wrong, but on the radio, people were like, "Wow." And I was doing it in English, you can do that in Amsterdam. People were like, "Wow, it's so cool you got that black guy on your station." I'm like, "I'm black? Oh, cool." So I was, I was John Holden, the 23-year-old black guy who drives a Harley. But the point was, it was liberating, I could speak my mind and, and everything felt so stifling. Now we go forward, 1993, and I'm on MTV, I'm the hair of Generation X, I'm on Z100 in

• 37:15Speaker 02

  New York, number one station, and I'm also on the internet, you know, I'd set up MTV.com, it was very, very slim, we had dial-up modems at the time, and it was so restrictive. You can't, they let me do my own material, but they had censorship called a line producer. Like, "Oh, now we gotta burn that segment, you said something bad about Richard Marx." Oh, you said something that was off-color about Madonna. We can't do that. The radio was the same. It was, you know, like, read the liner card, you know, and then always end with Z100. And there was a guy at Sun Microsystems in San Francisco, and he said, "Adam, I see what you're doing with MTV.com on the web. That's cool. I'm gonna send you a computer." So he sends me this big Sun Spark workstation. He said-

• 37:58Joe Rogan?

  What year?

• 37:59Speaker 02

  93.

• 38:00Joe Rogan?

  So this is pre-Windows 95? So this is-

• 38:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's pre-Wi- yeah, go ahead.

• 38:03Joe Rogan?

  That's Windows, what is it, 3.8 or something like that?

• 38:06Speaker 02

  Oh, Solaris OS. It's Unix, basically.

• 38:09Joe Rogan?

  So it wasn't Windows back then, right? Like, what came before Windows 95?

• 38:12Speaker 02

  I had a Mac. No, I had an early Apple II.

• 38:15Joe Rogan?

  3.1, that's what it was.

• 38:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, 3.1 and an Apple II. I was more Apple guy at the time. And, and so I hooked it up to my 56K modem. Dial in, he says, "Watch this." And he says, and I'm on the phone with him, he says, "Watch this." And up on my screen pops a little player, and it's, and he's streaming in PC, we didn't have MP3s back then, PCM, pulse code modulation, Nine Inch Nails. I'm like, "This is broadcasting. I'm going to figure out how we use this thing for broadcasting, because think about how we can use this outside of all the systems." And so, 2003, now we're 10 years later, I've been very involved with RSS feeds and blogs, and I see my first iPod, and it's like, snap, crackle, pop, hold on a second.

• 39:02Speaker 02

  This is amazing. We can combine, this is a radio. This isn't, this is not, not a music device, it's radio. So I cobbled together this program that basically takes this RSS feed and then puts a program on, you know, as a, so the show was an album, and then each track was an episode number. And then I immediately started doing a show. I start, you know, what I do is just try to get people involved. That's how Daily Source Code started, because I was trying to get software developers in. And then, two years later, three years later, Steve Jobs is having a private conversation with me about putting this into, into the iPod and making it official, making a podcasting thing in iTunes. And I'm like, "This is so perfect, because now you have this RSS feed which you control.

• 39:46Speaker 02

  No one else can control what you do with your RSS feed, and you can, anybody can slurp that up and subscribe to your radio show." And then, 20 years later-

• 39:57Speaker 02

  I see the President of the United States wrapping up his campaign with Joe Rogan on a podcast, completely being himself, being a dude for, by the way, props for you sticking to your guns. I love that you did that. Now it's gotta be here. No restrictions on time.

• 40:13Joe Rogan?

  Well, he didn't impose any. He was more than willing to do it exactly how I do it.

• 40:18Speaker 02

  He understands it, but at that moment, then I see you sitting there, I'm like, "We just broke the elite messaging machine. Phase one, complete."

• 40:27Joe Rogan?

  Oh, because of you, dog.

• 40:28Speaker 02

  No, you, dog. You, dog, man. All glory to God. I think I was just used.

• 40:34Joe Rogan?

  I always give you your props. You were the first.

• 40:36Speaker 02

  I was just a vessel. It makes sense to me now.

• 40:39Joe Rogan?

  Well, I'm just a vessel too. I think that's the case with all of it.

• 40:42Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 40:43Joe Rogan?

  I say that to the guys at my comedy club. You know, like, they're always like so thankful that I built this comedy club. I'm like, "I think this thing built itself. I think it was just, I was a thing that it did through me. It caught me because it knew that, you know, I was capable of doing it and impulsive enough and brash enough to like say, 'Fuck it, let's just dump a bunch of money in this spot and see what happens.'"

• 41:06Speaker 02

  You were given gifts.

• 41:07Joe Rogan?

  I was given gifts.

• 41:08Speaker 02

  And you stuck with your gifts. And I know you're a very generous guy. I know you help a lot of people with all, not monetary necessarily, but just helping them, getting them on their feet, you know, like even, you know, Parker, I'm like, "Can I bring this kid? He's a big fan." You're like, "Absolutely, bring him in." You're a gracious guy. And so when you get whatever word it is to build a comedy club, you did.

• 41:29Joe Rogan?

  I think you have to do that. I think that's, the universe is testing you. And if you pay attention to yourself, you'll feel like, what's the right thing to do? Like, what's the thing, what is the greedy, impulsive thing to do? What is like the miserly thing to do? "Save it all. It's my money. Save it all." You know, that's the, you know.

• 41:46Speaker 02

  That usually doesn't, usually doesn't end well for those people.

• 41:49Joe Rogan?

  No, it's just, it's bad for you too, because it's, I always talk about this in terms of careers. Like, and I really try to put this in young comics' minds. There's an impulse that you will have when someone's doing better than you, and you'll be angry at them. It is a bitter, pathetic... Jealous, normal instinct that people have.

• 42:09Speaker 02

  The enemy, the enemy talking to you.

• 42:11Joe Rogan?

  It's just you have to recognize what that is. What that is, is you have a desire to be doing the same thing. This person is doing this thing. They are in the movie. They are on the TV show. They are headlining at the club. And you feel bad because it's not you. So you decide that they are bad. And so you start looking at them as a source of negativity towards you. And you don't do all the logical, objective reasoning that allows you to go, oh, no, no, no. They didn't do anything wrong. It's just me. And then those people who get really super big and famous oftentimes get very defensive and very elitist because they do understand that people are mad at them now. So then they're like, fuck those people. Those people are fucking losers. And it's bad for everybody. It's bad for everybody.

• 42:55Joe Rogan?

  The correct way to do it is to go, wow, look at what this person has accomplished. That's fucking amazing. That's inspiring. I want to do something like that with my life.

• 43:06Speaker 02

  Which is what America used to be. People would come to them.

• 43:09Joe Rogan?

  I think it is. I think it is.

• 43:11Speaker 02

  It's been covered up. It's been papered over by media, basically. That's why I'm so happy that we've broken through that elite messaging system. The way I was raised is in America, you can look at the guy with the Rolls Royce or the Cadillac or whatever and go, I want that and you can be that. And we've, we've kind of devolved into a, you know, it's international now, into a victim mentality. There's good and evil.

• 43:37Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's just a ploy. It's again, the same thing as fluoride in the water. It's a fucking psyop. It's a ploy. And it's a way to keep us, instead of empowering people to recognize that all these people that are successful are inspiration. That's what they are. They're fuel for you. You can use them. Whatever that person is singing at the Grammys, when Kendrick Lamar is doing the halftime show, when someone wins a fight, that's supposed to be inspiration. That's a fuel and you can use it correctly. You could, or you can fuck your whole life up by paying attention to other people and comparing yourself in a negative way. This is part of the problem. With kids and social media.

• 44:19Joe Rogan?

  Because kids are supposed to see like, oh, look at Bobby, he's nice to everybody and everybody likes Bobby. Be like Bobby. Like, look at Mark, he's fucking awesome at the guitar and everybody wants to go see him play. I want someone to come see me do something. I gotta, I wish I was as good at something as Mark is at guitar. And that's what's supposed to like raise us all up.

• 44:41Speaker 02

  But instead, we see a thousand followers and likes on someone blasting somebody in a funny way in a, in a video. This is a big part of the problem.

• 44:51Joe Rogan?

  But sometimes funny way blasting is important too, because that's my line of work. You gotta talk shit.

• 44:57Speaker 02

  Professional, Joe, you're a professional.

• 44:59Joe Rogan?

  How do you become a professional? You start off as an amateur. You start off.

• 45:03Speaker 02

  We can't all be a comedian or a comic. We just can't.

• 45:06Joe Rogan?

  A lot more can than you think. I think a lot more, there's a lot of people out there that have the inclination that just don't, don't get that spark. Which is also one of the things we're trying to do at the club, which is also why we have two nights of open mic nights.

• 45:18Speaker 02

  Oh, that's cool.

• 45:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we want to make it accessible. We want to make, this is like a place where there's, there's a real path. You can work on your act and you're gonna see guys like on a daily basis, guys like Ron White and Shane Gillis and. You know, there's people coming in and out of town that are doing my podcast. They're like the best of the best in the world. And they're coming to the club.

• 45:36Speaker 02

  Oh, this is the, the center of the universe now for comedy.

• 45:40Joe Rogan?

  It's amazing. It's amazing. And again, I think this was, I think it built itself. I think I just had to do it. I was like.

• 45:47Speaker 02

  I just gotta tell you, no, no, no. God loves you, Joe. He is at work in you. He's all over you and has been that way for a long, long time. There's no doubt in my mind.

• 45:57Joe Rogan?

  Well, whatever it is, I'm listening.

• 46:01Joe Rogan?

  And I go with it. But I think it all, like, too many things had to happen. Like, if you want to believe in fate, if you really want to believe in fate, I should believe in fate. Because especially with like this move here, too many things had to happen in line. It had to be the pandemic and it had to be me with young kids who just was very uncomfortable with the direction that LA was going. And then it had to be the George Floyd riots and the lockdowns. And then I had to come to Texas and go, oh, oh, there's other ways that people live. And I had known you for a long time and you lived here and you spoke very highly. And then my good friend Gary. Gary Clark Jr., he came here, uh, like before the pandemic and I remember talking to him on the phone. I'm like, why did you move back to Texas?

• 46:45Joe Rogan?

  He's like, man, I just cannot fuck with those people in LA. And Gary's like the realest dude I know. It's like one of the realest. Like, he doesn't give a fuck about fame, about... That guy cares about playing that fucking guitar and playing songs as good as he can. And that guy just locks himself up in a studio. He's got a studio on his house, at his house.

• 47:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's what you want.

• 47:04Joe Rogan?

  Locks himself up in there for 12 hours a day and it's just... That guy only gives a fuck about the art. Like, he's about the craft. And like, so all the bullshit that came along with living in Hollywood, like... He would just come hang out at the Comedy Store all the time. That was just because it was like, oh, you guys are real. Like, I can hang with you. We'd just be cracking up and hang... So when he came out here, it's like, fuck. And then Ron White came out here, I'm like, god damn it. And then, you know, it's, oh, I fucking love it. It's fucking airports, a breeze, no traffic, everyone's nice, it's the middle of the country. Oh, fuck. And then the pandemic happened and it just, it was like, it all pulled me to the spot. And then it had to be the Spotify thing and then it had to be the Comedy Store shutting down for a year.

• 47:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:46Joe Rogan?

  And then it had to be all the Comedy Store employees that I loved were all unemployed. And so then it was like, okay, let's fucking do this.

• 47:53Speaker 02

  Exactly what I'm seeing. I've seen that with every... That's why I started in 1983. I'm like, I see where the path was. I've always been doing, I've always been doing this stuff.

• 48:01Joe Rogan?

  And that's the thing about...

• 48:02Speaker 02

  It makes so much sense.

• 48:02Joe Rogan?

  Podcasting to me too, it was oddly compelling. Like, it didn't make any sense. I was making no money and I was busy.

• 48:10Speaker 02

  It was costing you money probably on bandwidth and stuff.

• 48:12Joe Rogan?

  It was definitely costing some money. And I had young kids and it was just like, why am I... Why am I spending my time doing this when I should be spending my time maybe doing something to make more money? Because especially back then, it was like, I, I wasn't doing Fear Factor anymore. So I wasn't really making the kind of money that I was making when I was on television. So I had a tour a lot. So I was doing stand-up and I was doing like way too many dates with the UFC. The UFC, although I love it to death, it's, I mean, that's the only job job I still have. I still work for somebody. But it's because I've been there for so long. But it was like 22 dates a year.

• 48:45Speaker 02

  Did they send you a W9?

• 48:47Joe Rogan?

  Um, I don't know, I think I'm an independent contractor. What's a W9? How's that work? I have an accountant.

• 48:53Speaker 02

  I was just messing with you.

• 48:54Joe Rogan?

  I'm like Joe Walsh. I have accountants paid for it all.

• 48:56Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's right. I got a Maserati. Maserati does two hundred and ten.

• 48:59Joe Rogan?

  One eighty-five. I lost my license.

• 49:01Speaker 02

  Now I can drive.

• 49:02Joe Rogan?

  I have a limo, ride in the back, lock all the doors in case I'm attacked.

• 49:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, great song.

• 49:07Joe Rogan?

  Life's been good to me so far.

• 49:09Speaker 02

  That's right. It's a great song.

• 49:10Joe Rogan?

  I use that song all the time. Everybody's so different. I haven't changed.

• 49:12Speaker 02

  You know, he's a ham radio guy, Joe Walsh.

• 49:14Joe Rogan?

  Is he really?

• 49:15Speaker 02

  He takes his rig out on the, he doesn't go on the road that much anymore. When he's on the road, he has this huge ham radio rig and that's like, I've been a ham for a long time. And that's like the, if you have a, we call it a QSL, uh, QSO, that's a, that's ham code for a conversation.

• 49:31Joe Rogan?

  Oh, okay.

• 49:31Speaker 02

  With Joe Walsh. Oh, man, there he is.

• 49:34Joe Rogan?

  Look at that. Joe Walsh is the fucking man, dude.

• 49:36Speaker 02

  He's awesome.

• 49:37Joe Rogan?

  Life in the fast lane. That dude changed the Eagles. The Eagles on their way to killing your testosterone and making women cry all day. And then all of a sudden, Joe Walsh comes along and now you've got life in the fast lane. Give me, give me that riff. Give me the beginning of life in the fast lane.

• 49:51Speaker 02

  Dun-dun-dun-diddly-dum-dum.

• 49:53Joe Rogan?

  Joe Walsh, it was this, it was wild rock and roll guitar attached to this beautiful voice and lyrics and songs and songwriting. Give me, give me this, Jamie. Give it to me.

• 50:06Speaker 02

  See how accurate it was? Dun-dun-dun-dum-diddly-dum-dum.

• 50:10Joe Rogan?

  But it was, there was a, there's a, you know, guitar, like I was talking about Gary, like here, oh, here we go.

• 50:16Speaker 02

  Close, close.

• 50:19Speaker 02

  Boom, boom, boom. Oh, all right. That's all we can do.

• 50:21Joe Rogan?

  That's all?

• 50:21Speaker 02

  We have, we get in trouble, get in trouble, get in trouble.

• 50:24Joe Rogan?

  Is that already gonna get us in trouble?

• 50:25Speaker 02

  Probably, probably.

• 50:26Joe Rogan?

  Fucking nonsense.

• 50:27Speaker 02

  You're screwed. Because here we have all these podcasts, you know, there's four and a half million podcasts, really only four hundred thousand update regularly. So it's not even that much. And that's global. They've, we.

• 50:39Joe Rogan?

  Oh, how dare you.

• 50:42Joe Rogan?

  You're teasing me.

• 50:43Speaker 02

  We can't play music in podcasts because of all these different entities that own it. And so, you know, if you, if you perform something on the radio or in a live stream, that's a performance, right? Which, you know, the club plays for that too, if you're playing any music. So that's ASCAP BMI. Then you have. Have the, um, the publishing right now because you download a podcast. Well, all of a sudden now you've made a copy of it. So that's another group over here. So you have the publishers, then the record companies have all the, and they, they just could never agree. And they've locked themselves in so tight that the biggest opportunity for music would be to play it on podcasts. They've just had, they've, they've painted themselves into a corner.

• 51:26Speaker 02

  And it's so, and we all know now that most artists, you know, you get 10,000 streams on Spotify. And you get a, you know, a penny after, after a couple of years.

• 51:36Joe Rogan?

  Did you see what Snoop Dogg, when he, he was going over? This episode is brought to you by Squarespace. If you're thinking about building a website, you should try Squarespace. I know because I use it. That's right. JoeRogan.com is powered by Squarespace. It has all the features that you need to create a standout website like an AI enhanced website builder, SEO optimization tools and seamless checkouts with mobile pay links. Head to Squarespace.com/Rogan for a free trial. And when you are ready to launch, use the offer code ROGEN to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp.

• 52:17Joe Rogan?

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• 52:55Joe Rogan?

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• 53:27Speaker 02

  Oh, it's horrendous. I'm sure it's horrendous. He got a thousand bucks.

• 53:31Joe Rogan?

  Billions of streams and you gotta check for forty-five grand.

• 53:34Speaker 02

  And Taylor Swift gets all the rest of the money. I mean, it's very odd.

• 53:37Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that because Taylor Swift owns her music? Isn't that the whole deal? Like, if you own your music, it's a difference.

• 53:42Speaker 02

  If you're the publisher. And, you know, this, I don't want to get too deep into Spotify and all that, but people are starting to move away from that and what I call the value-for-value model, where, uh, we actually built this with Podcasting 2.0 where you can say, you can send a boost, like, I want to send some money to this person straight from the app. So you can play it, you can play a song in the podcast as long as they've agreed to the, to the license, they own all their stuff, you can send the money. Uh, we just did Suzanne Santa, we had a, uh, I invited you to that.

• 54:12Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I couldn't make it unfortunately.

• 54:14Speaker 02

  All I had to say is, I invited Joe. That was all I needed to say. Um, and, you know, we had six people on stage, six different bands, and they all made between six and eight hundred dollars coming just from, from out there. There were not, there was maybe fifty, at the end of the night, maybe fifty people left, it's a Monday night, but they were all making more money than they had ever made on any other platform in their life, just because people can send it through the internet through, we actually use-

• 54:42Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that crazy that six hundred dollars for a performance that goes on the internet is the most they've ever made from the internet?

• 54:49Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 54:50Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that crazy? Like, you think about how many times they streamed, like, I found out about Suzanne from, um, online. Some dude named Balls of Steel sent me a message, and he said, "This is your new favorite song." And I was like, "What?" And it was Honey Honey, Angel of Death. They did an acoustic version on the top of a roof in downtown LA, and it was incredible. And I was like, "Oh, my God." And then I became friends with them, and-

• 55:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, she and Nick are great, and their baby is super cute.

• 55:16Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, adorable. Adorable. It's so cool to see her mom, I love it. But it's, uh, it's like, that, there's been so many streams on the radio, and the fact that you never made more than six hundred bucks is crazy. Like, something's broken.

• 55:29Speaker 02

  Well, that's because the publishers are getting all of that.

• 55:33Joe Rogan?

  Right, exactly.

• 55:34Speaker 02

  And then...

• 55:35Joe Rogan?

  But then, on the other hand, you get, you know, you can get really famous. Like, people like Tyler, the Creator, and all these different people that have blown up just from being on the internet, and then they do live performances.

• 55:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I still feel that...

• 55:51Joe Rogan?

  Someone's making money.

• 55:53Speaker 02

  Well, we know the publishers are making money. People say the record companies, but it's the publishers.

• 55:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they can't call them record companies anymore if they don't make records.

• 56:00Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 56:01Joe Rogan?

  For records!

• 56:02Speaker 02

  I was in my garage the other day, and I put my wall of fame in the garage, and I'm like, "Time to move this out of the house, like, I'm old enough now." And I'm looking at, like, there's a platinum record with a cassette, with a platinum cassette on it.

• 56:16Joe Rogan?

  Whoa!

• 56:17Speaker 02

  Like, do people even remember these days, where you got a platinum record with a cassette on it?

• 56:20Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy.

• 56:21Speaker 02

  For five million copies sold of a cassette tape?

• 56:23Joe Rogan?

  Jelly Roll gave us one of his platinum records. We got it out there in the hall.

• 56:26Speaker 02

  That guy, that guy is awesome.

• 56:28Joe Rogan?

  He's the best.

• 56:29Speaker 02

  Jelly Roll is...

• 56:30Joe Rogan?

  I love him to death.

• 56:31Speaker 02

  What a story.

• 56:32Joe Rogan?

  He's such a sweetheart. He's such a nice guy.

• 56:34Speaker 02

  And he's a big crossover artist, you know? The Christians love him, the country guys love him, the rock and rollers love him. It's like, he's the perfect, perfect crossover artist. If I were an evil record executive, "He's the perfect, he's the perfect crossover artist, Joe, we need to sign him!" That's what I'd be doing.

• 56:50Joe Rogan?

  Also, like, most unlikely looking to be the sweetest guy ever, with the fucking, all the face tattoos and everything.

• 56:55Speaker 02

  Just goes to show.

• 56:56Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 56:57Speaker 02

  You can't tell a book by its cover.

• 56:58Joe Rogan?

  No, you cannot.

• 56:59Speaker 02

  Ever, ever, ever, ever. So, anyway, back to that, it's just, it's a shame that we've, you know, the music industry has moved it into this protectionist place. And it's, I mean, even if you have a spin studio, you know, the Gestapo comes around, like, "Yo, you've got more, you've got more than 75 people a day here, you need to pay us more." And it's, you know, they're very litigious, the whole thing is just a mess, you know?

• 57:29Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Yeah, I mean, law is great because it protects you from scumbags, but law is not so great.

• 57:36Speaker 02

  But who's it protecting now because the artists are making no money?

• 57:38Joe Rogan?

  Exactly, yeah.

• 57:40Speaker 02

  Although it's become easier to, you know, to do your, your music at home. That's, I mean, I remember going to the Hit Factory in, in New York and hanging out, you know, watching people record records. That was amazing with, you know, the big machines and lots of people running around. That was cool.

• 57:55Joe Rogan?

  I think YouTube and social media presents very unique opportunities where a guy like Oliver Anthony can all of a sudden explode out of nowhere with one song. He's another sweetheart.

• 58:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, you had him on. I saw it. That was great.

• 58:09Joe Rogan?

  He was at the club the other day too. We were all hanging out.

• 58:10Speaker 02

  Oh, really? Where does he live?

• 58:11Joe Rogan?

  Um, I think he still, maybe he doesn't want people knowing.

• 58:15Speaker 02

  Okay, well, he lives in...

• 58:16Joe Rogan?

  I don't want to say.

• 58:17Speaker 02

  Around.

• 58:17Joe Rogan?

  But he, he was, I mean, back, was he, he was, he was in Virginia?

• 58:25Speaker 02

  West Virginia. Okay, yeah, West Virginia. That makes sense.

• 58:27Joe Rogan?

  Richmond, because Richmond, north of Richmond was the song.

• 58:29Speaker 02

  Right, right, right, right.

• 58:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that's where he was. I don't know if he's anymore.

• 58:33Speaker 02

  And, and God bless him because he stayed, he stayed away from the system.

• 58:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, we had a phone call. Yeah, I, I called him up when, when it would all started popping off for him.

• 58:43Speaker 02

  And he said, "I'm gonna sign you, boy. I'm gonna sign you to my Rogan Records. You're gonna make millions. Here, take this Cadillac. It'll be great."

• 58:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I sent the Cadillac right to his house. Um, that's the last thing you want to give that guy. You want to give him like a 1983 Chevy that's redone, you know, a pickup truck. Like an, an F-150 from the eighties that's like redone, the boxy ones.

• 59:04Speaker 02

  Yeah. Eight-track in the dash. Good to go.

• 59:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. No, he's a genuine guy. He's a really nice guy. And, uh, we had this conversation over the phone. He said, "People are offering me millions of dollars to do this and that and this." I go, "Stay independent." And he goes, "They keep saying I gotta strike while the iron's hot." I go, "No, no, no, no, no. Listen to me. You, you've already made it. All you have to do now is just keep doing what you just did, and you can do that, right?" I'm sure you have other songs. He goes, "Oh, I got a bunch of other songs." Then he sent me some of his other songs, which are just as good, if not better. And I was like, "Dude, you have talent. Talent is what you, that's what everybody needs." All this other stuff is people just trying to take advantage of you. Your talent, stay independent.

• 59:42Speaker 02

  That's what I mean about you, Joe. You are, you're a good guy.

• 59:45Joe Rogan?

  But I was already, I, I, I was already past that spot where he's at. Like, I'd been in that spot before, where people are offering you deals and stuff like that. I know what the, the trappings of that is. You're broke, and then all of a sudden, you have money. And like, for me, it worked out great. That, that happened to me in 1993. I got this big development deal with Disney, and I moved out to California to do a sitcom. But it was like, but it was, I wanted to be a comic, and then all of a sudden, I've got all this money that's coming from TV. I'm like, this is so weird.

• 1:00:14Speaker 02

  Was that news radio?

• 1:00:15Joe Rogan?

  No, that was Hardball. There was a, a baseball show that was on Fox that never made it.

• 1:00:19Speaker 02

  I was on MTV, man. I wasn't paying attention to any of that stuff.

• 1:00:22Joe Rogan?

  Well, actually, it actually started at MTV, because I got a development deal with MTV first.

• 1:00:27Speaker 02

  Really?

• 1:00:27Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but the development deal at MTV was like 500 bucks to do a pilot. I'm not kidding.

• 1:00:33Speaker 02

  Sounds like MTV.

• 1:00:34Joe Rogan?

  I'm not kidding. It was like 500 bucks. Something, maybe 5,000. I don't think it was, though. I think it was 500 dollars. And if I did the pilot, and the pilot was successful, they would have me locked in for some exorbitant amount of time. I think it was like five years, where I couldn't do anything other than MTV. And it was because they had a few people that became really famous off MTV and then left. And so they had decided that MTV is going to keep all of their talent.

• 1:01:02Speaker 02

  Which is the funniest thing, because when I got there in 87, VJs were expendable. They're like, you know, you're expendable, shut up, you know, we can, we can, now, they couldn't, because they brought me over from Europe, and I had a two-year contract. I think the first year was 150 grand, the second year was 175 grand, and I got a car service. And, and I could do radio, any, any radio I wanted to do. And so, and they, they, a lot of the, not they, but a lot of the people at the office really disliked me, because they'd be like, "Cut your hair!" I'm like, "No, I'm not gonna cut my hair." Why? They want you to cut your hair? They have a new creative direction for the, for the channel. I'm like, "No." And, you know, I, I had different lengths of hair throughout the years. But it's the 80s, man.

• 1:01:48Joe Rogan?

  That hair was gold.

• 1:01:49Speaker 02

  Have you seen the artists we're playing?

• 1:01:51Joe Rogan?

  Let me give you a photo of Adam Curry in eighty-eight.

• 1:01:56Speaker 02

  It's glorious.

• 1:01:57Joe Rogan?

  Glorious.

• 1:01:57Speaker 02

  I have the hair of Generation X. Don't call me a boomer.

• 1:02:01Joe Rogan?

  Look at that. Come on, who the fuck would tell you to cut that Farrah Fawcett? That's a beautiful head of hair. That's an amazing.

• 1:02:08Speaker 02

  Good times, brother.

• 1:02:09Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, imagine someone telling you that that probably that was like a huge hook, too.

• 1:02:14Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 1:02:15Joe Rogan?

  A lot of the ladies.

• 1:02:15Speaker 02

  Well, you know what Merv Griffin always said? What did she say? Merv Griffin always said, "People with big heads are successful on television." That's why he had Pat Sajak and of course Jay Leno.

• 1:02:24Joe Rogan?

  Jay Leno.

• 1:02:25Speaker 02

  Big heads, right? I don't have a big head.

• 1:02:27Joe Rogan?

  You have big hair.

• 1:02:28Speaker 02

  So, I had big hair, so I had a big head. Exactly. The formula worked.

• 1:02:32Joe Rogan?

  Right, there's no like little tiny headed dudes that are like, wow.

• 1:02:36Speaker 02

  No, no.

• 1:02:36Joe Rogan?

  What is that about?

• 1:02:37Speaker 02

  No, that works on YouTube now, but on television.

• 1:02:40Joe Rogan?

  Does it work on YouTube? He's got a tiny head that's killing it on YouTube.

• 1:02:42Speaker 02

  Anybody can be successful on YouTube.

• 1:02:44Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:02:45Speaker 02

  I mean, it's all kinds of interesting stuff.

• 1:02:46Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that to show you that the formula's bullshit, then? You know, like you got a guy like Mr. Beast, who is not like a classically good-looking guy who's got the biggest show in the world.

• 1:02:55Speaker 02

  That guy has, I mean, so I don't, people say he's a creator. I think he's a creation. He, he is a creation of YouTube and how it works. You don't have this, uh, because you're, you know, you're so established, but they, his team, and he's talked about this, micromanage every second of each video, every cut, every, the poster images, all these things. And it's all about time spent viewing. If one video does a minute thirty-eight and the other one does one forty, that other video is more successful. I mean, it's really, in order to, to like hook the algos, get everything rolling, you have to bring that down to a science.

• 1:03:35Speaker 02

  And of course, and this is not for you and I, I don't think, is you have to always keep feeding the machine. You gotta keep feeding it, feeding it, feeding it. You have to make your life a part of your YouTube channel, otherwise, you know, you drop off very quickly.

• 1:03:49Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, well, um, I just think he has a different approach. I mean, his approach is very like scientific. He's very, very intelligent about it. And I I'm a feel person, which is why I when I get people as guests, I never think like people sometimes people think, oh, you try to get like the biggest name guests because that'll be the most popular videos. I don't I don't do that at all. I only who do I want to talk to? That's exactly how I've always done it. So that's I'm gonna always do it. Do I want and if it happens to be Mel Gibson, you know, and he

• 1:04:22Speaker 02

  Great interview.

• 1:04:23Joe Rogan?

  He was great.

• 1:04:23Speaker 02

  He was. I mean, I'm like, that's for me. He's always Mad Max. When I was a kid, you know, we'd we'd play hooky from school. We go back. We'd and someone have a VHS. No, I had a Betamax. You had a Betamax. And like we're watching Mad Max and then Diana Ross in the round. I mean,

• 1:04:40Joe Rogan?

  Diana Ross in the round.

• 1:04:41Speaker 02

  We love Diana Ross. Like, oh, she's so awesome. But the Mad Max, man, that original. And he's standing there with his boots in the desert and at the beginning.

• 1:04:49Joe Rogan?

  Great fucking movie. Oh. He had a bunch of bangers, but he's just, he's an interesting guy, you know?

• 1:04:55Speaker 02

  And that blower on top of the the engine. I mean, the whole thing was just, we just love that.

• 1:05:01Joe Rogan?

  That was a fun movie.

• 1:05:02Speaker 02

  And then later, Lethal Weapon. And then and I didn't realize because I'd seen The Passion. Uh, which is, you know, uh, as a as a Jesus freak myself, like, that was like, whoa, that was a heavy movie to watch. And when he said, I didn't realize that I thought the whole thing was in Aramaic. And it was the subtitles that you were basically reading the subtitles. And his theory that it, you know, it it penetrates you differently. The story, I think, is so spot on.

• 1:05:27Joe Rogan?

  I think so, too. I mean,

• 1:05:29Speaker 02

  Really, really interesting.

• 1:05:30Joe Rogan?

  Well, he's a very underrated filmmaker, and I always point to Apocalypto as another example of that. There's no English in that movie. And it's a masterful movie.

• 1:05:38Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 1:05:39Joe Rogan?

  It's a great movie.

• 1:05:40Speaker 02

  That guy has a calling, man. He's he's doing a and talent. He's got just and he fought the system. He really, really fought the system so hard.

• 1:05:49Joe Rogan?

  What was fascinating about talking to him about what happened when he made The Passion of the Christ, because it was really, it wasn't that it was an anti-Jesus uh, reaction to that film. It was an anti-Jesus reaction to that film that was really made by the motion picture industry because he had gone outside the normal distribution system.

• 1:06:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:06:08Joe Rogan?

  So in creating that movie, he financed it himself. He went outside that he got a smaller distributor. And it did really well and they were like.

• 1:06:16Speaker 02

  Eight hundred million dollars or something.

• 1:06:18Joe Rogan?

  Exactly. So they're like, we gotta make sure this doesn't fucking happen again. And that's where the attacks came. And that's also where Jim Caviezel, his career completely stalled out. You would think the guy's in a gigantic blockbuster movie like that. Like he's gonna be in blockbuster movie after blockbuster movie after this. No, they kinda blackballed him.

• 1:06:35Speaker 02

  Yes. Well, and so you have a smaller studios now like um Angel Studios. And they're in Utah and they did uh they crowdfunded uh this uh The Chosen. Which is, you know, the story of Jesus. And it's, I mean, unbelievable. They're in their fifth season now. Completely outside the studio system, completely away from it. And it's all crowdfunding. At the end of the season, the credits are like fifteen minutes. Everybody who donated and everybody who donated, you know, X amount, they get to be extras on the set. I mean, it's a whole new way of looking at producing stuff.

• 1:07:12Joe Rogan?

  Interesting. Yeah.

• 1:07:14Speaker 02

  Then, of course, they went on to do the an apocalyptic movie called Homestead, which is a dog. It's so horrible. It's like, oh, what is this? I mean, it's.

• 1:07:23Joe Rogan?

  Oh, it's a bad movie?

• 1:07:23Speaker 02

  Oh, bad acting.

• 1:07:25Joe Rogan?

  Is it bad enough to watch it?

• 1:07:26Speaker 02

  No, no. Tina and I were watching. We're like, do we bail? No, ten more minutes. Do we bail? No, no, it's gonna happen. Do it. It's like, no, no, it was too bad. I mean, just like.

• 1:07:35Joe Rogan?

  It's hard to make a good movie.

• 1:07:36Speaker 02

  Of course it is.

• 1:07:37Joe Rogan?

  Well, imagine the amount of people that you have. If you have a bunch of idiots telling you to cut your hair. Imagine how many dumbasses you have in the background of the movie that are telling you what to do. All the money people. All the executives, like it's so, it must be so hard. You have to be like a Quentin Tarantino. Who's like, they just leave him alone, leave him alone, let him do his magic.

• 1:07:57Speaker 02

  He's an interesting. Have you met him?

• 1:07:58Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah. He's been on a couple of times.

• 1:08:00Speaker 02

  Interesting fellow.

• 1:08:00Joe Rogan?

  We hung out with him the other night. We went out to dinner with him, him and Roger Avery, who's also awesome. And then we went to the club and we hung out at the club.

• 1:08:08Speaker 02

  He's an interesting guy.

• 1:08:09Joe Rogan?

  And that's what he like, what he like requested to come to the club.

• 1:08:11Speaker 02

  Was he wearing his tracksuit?

• 1:08:13Joe Rogan?

  No, he was dressed normal.

• 1:08:14Speaker 02

  Oh, I saw him in LA when I was there for about a year. I was like, you see him like tracksuit.

• 1:08:18Joe Rogan?

  Track suits are comfortable.

• 1:08:19Speaker 02

  Track suit.

• 1:08:19Joe Rogan?

  I get it why the mob guys wear tracksuits.

• 1:08:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course.

• 1:08:22Joe Rogan?

  Once you wear one, you're like, oh, this is the way to do it.

• 1:08:25Speaker 02

  Adidas, man. Adidas, that's my uniform.

• 1:08:27Joe Rogan?

  I think the move is like stretchy jeans. Cause stretchy jeans give you all the feel of a tracksuit, but you don't look like a weirdo.

• 1:08:36Speaker 02

  I've become a hoodie guy, you know, much, much to my, my wife's chagrin. She's like, you know, I got friends of mine saying, hey, Federman. I'm like, eh, really, brother?

• 1:08:44Joe Rogan?

  Federman wore a hoodie to the fucking inauguration.

• 1:08:47Speaker 02

  That was a little wild. I mean, the hoodie was one thing, but the shorts, I'm like, well, you know, that's Federman, I guess.

• 1:08:53Joe Rogan?

  That's really who he is. I mean, it's kind of weird in that like, come on, everybody else is wearing a suit. But it's also kind of like, well, that's how he dresses 24 hours a day, like.

• 1:09:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, but you wore a tuxi- dude, you wore a button down for the president being in your studio. I was impressed by that.

• 1:09:08Joe Rogan?

  Well, I felt, I felt like I had to, the vice president too.

• 1:09:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:11Joe Rogan?

  It's like, I gotta wear something nice.

• 1:09:13Speaker 02

  It's because, you know, it's a little, it shows a little bit of respect.

• 1:09:16Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I didn't even clean the table off though. Well, you know, my friend, Harlan Williams is very happy that Dimitri was on the table.

• 1:09:21Speaker 02

  Oh, your snake.

• 1:09:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, he, he gave me a giant hug. He goes, Dimitri was on the table when you were interviewing the president.

• 1:09:27Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:09:27Joe Rogan?

  This is a gag that Harlan did. He said he had a tapeworm and then three hours into the podcast, he pulls out this fucking snake out of his pants. You gotta see Harlan, he's fucking, he's so funny and so unusual and so eccentric that like for him, like that was, it was such a huge thing to see the snake on the table that he pulled out of his pants.

• 1:09:46Speaker 02

  I get it. I get it. I mean, it was so interesting where, um, you know, and you've talked about the, the Harris campaign and all the stuff that they were saying. And, you know, it's like, well, we talked to his people. I'm like, his people? I think it's Jamie and then maybe one other guy?

• 1:10:03Joe Rogan?

  Well, I do have managers and they did talk to them.

• 1:10:05Speaker 02

  Oh, they did talk to them?

• 1:10:05Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but, but what they said just wasn't true.

• 1:10:08Speaker 02

  But yeah, I mean, it's not like you have a super big team here.

• 1:10:10Joe Rogan?

  No, it's a very, even the team outside of here is not that big. But it's, um. Just con- it's just normal political bullshit. They just lie. They cover their ass and they lie. I would have been very happy to have her on. And like I said, the goal was to release both of them the same day.

• 1:10:27Speaker 02

  That would have been great. That would have been fantastic.

• 1:10:30Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I was trying to figure out if that would be possible to do. You know, and that's what I wanted to do. I wanted to put them out both at the same time.

• 1:10:37Speaker 02

  But that's it. That's where we broke the mess- the elite messaging system. We broke it because they could not put her into the new system. They couldn't because they knew that she would fall down.

• 1:10:48Joe Rogan?

  Well, they just got scared. They could have. They could have put her in. I would have held her hand. I would have, we would have had a conversation. Not that I need to hold the vice president's hand. But what I meant was, no, I wouldn't have done that. I wasn't gonna vote for her.

• 1:11:02Speaker 02

  I don't know, Joe. She might have charmed you.

• 1:11:04Joe Rogan?

  But I was more than willing to strong man or steel man all of our positions to try to like, I wanted to, I wanted to know what would be the good in this and why, you know, and let the, even if it doesn't make any sense, express it the best way possible that you can. I will help you do that and then I'll ask you questions. But I'm not gonna be antagonistic. I'm not gonna be a shithead. I'm not gonna be, I have no desire to turn this into a viral clip thing. I'm not trying to do that.

• 1:11:31Speaker 02

  I don't think you've ever done that with anybody.

• 1:11:33Joe Rogan?

  No, I don't wanna, I never wanted that done to me. So why would I do that to someone else?

• 1:11:37Speaker 02

  That's why I wore this hoodie. Iron sharpens iron. That's, that's what you are, brother. You know, you, you get, bring people in. Iron sharpens iron. So a friend sharpens a friend. You're always, you know, I come here, I come here because I want to learn from Joe. I want my iron to be sharpened by Joe. You do that with everybody who's there.

• 1:11:53Joe Rogan?

  This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them, are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee free. No monthly fees, no overdraft fees, and thousands of fee free ATMs. But here's the real kicker. If you get their Chime card, it gives you 5% cash back on a Category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate crazy high. It's nine times the national average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/rogan. Takes a few minutes to sign up.

• 1:12:38Joe Rogan?

  Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and Chime card. Provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details. This episode is brought to you by Chime. And I know people don't usually get excited about banking, but Chime is doing something different and it's worth paying attention to. In a recent survey, they ranked the number one choice for new checking accounts in America. That means real people, millions of them, are choosing this over traditional banks. That's because banking at Chime is fee free. No monthly fees, no overdraft fees, and thousands of fee free ATMs. But here's the real kicker. If you get their Chime card,

• 1:13:23Joe Rogan?

  it gives you 5% cash back on a category you actually pick yourself. Your savings rate crazy high. It's nine times the national average. They're calling it the most rewarding way to bank. Go to chime.com/rogan. Takes a few minutes to sign up. Chime is a fintech, not a bank. Banking services and Chime card. Provided by Chime's bank partners. Terms and limits apply. Go to chime.com/disclosures for more details. Well, I just want whoever's in that seat to do the best they can, right? So like whatever it is, whether you're talking about quantum physics or whether you're talking about human psychology or ancient history. I want the best version of you

• 1:14:07Joe Rogan?

  and I want to like kind of help you get the best version out. And if you're running for president, I'd like to get the best version of that from you. And I think that

• 1:14:17Joe Rogan?

  The the whole system of of debates and public speeches and interviews is so bad for getting to know a human being.

• 1:14:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:27Joe Rogan?

  And I guarantee you, like, I've seen interviews where she's really funny. I've seen this one, I talked about it before, but I'll say it again. This is one interview, she's talking about meeting her mother-in-law for the first time.

• 1:14:37Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:14:37Joe Rogan?

  And her mother-in-law grabbing her face like, oh, you're so beautiful. And it's very funny.

• 1:14:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:42Joe Rogan?

  And she laughs, and she laughs in a genuine way. It's not like that sort of defensive laughter that she does sometimes where it seems like it's orchestrated. It was of a genuine laughter, and it was fun.

• 1:14:53Speaker 02

  Well, she's a prosecutor, that's why she kept going into prosecutorial mode. The same with the so-called debate with Trump. She was prosecuting him. So she has a switch that she just flips.

• 1:15:04Joe Rogan?

  Right, and she becomes an authority.

• 1:15:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, and then she, whereas our president, you know, he's kind of him all the time. They're eating the dogs. I think that won him the election, too. That was awesome. I mean, that's one of my favorite jingles of all time. They're eating the dogs.

• 1:15:18Joe Rogan?

  They're eating the cats.

• 1:15:19Speaker 02

  Are you kidding me? This is, that, that, that just, like, that, that's fantastic.

• 1:15:23Joe Rogan?

  Well, it is, uh, it's very interesting to watch, um, it all take place. It's, it's very interesting to, uh, watch this, uh, shifting of the consciousness of the country.

• 1:15:36Speaker 02

  The culture.

• 1:15:36Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and but also to see the reaction on the left, like, to see the really crazy people, like, those people that Worcester Town Hall thing. Like, that, it's interesting to see that, too, because you're gonna see these, like, really exaggerated grasps at retaining relevancy. Like, really exaggerated, over the top.

• 1:15:56Speaker 02

  Well, they're crying out for help, is what they're doing. They're, they're crying out for help, they've been psy-oped. I mean, I, I, I'm only on X, I've, I gave up Facebook and Instagram, I'm not interested. And X, I really only use as kind of an inbox, you know, people will, you know, send me stuff and things for the show. Uh, but early on, when, um, uh, Blue Cry was still a, uh, a secret project within Twitter that Jack Dorsey was running. I knew some people who were in that secret project. And so I have an account. And I went on there the other day, I'm like, oh, my lord, this is horrible. These people are spinning up and spinning out and just going nuts with each other. It's, and, and it's like,

• 1:16:37Speaker 02

  I don't know how we have to figure out a way. And, you know, President Trump says success will bring us together. I think that's probably true. But, you know, we can't just. Um, I'm a little worried that we're all gonna be stomping on them. You know, it's like, ah, look at these stupid libs looking, you know, they're idiots, they're crazy. And I, I just feel that, you know, you gotta, you gotta love them and not hate them. You don't have to forget what they've done or what they've said, but they have been abused by multiple entities and systems within our own government and political organizations.

• 1:17:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, also they're in this feedback loop.

• 1:17:16Speaker 02

  Yes, sir.

• 1:17:16Joe Rogan?

  This echo chamber and they, they don't have outside people that are kind. And, you know, everybody outside is the enemy and they're, they're trying to like, they're trying to make their way through life like all of us. But without forgiveness, you don't, you have nothing. Like, you, you have to be able to forgive people.

• 1:17:34Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:17:34Joe Rogan?

  You have to. Without that, there's nothing.

• 1:17:36Speaker 02

  Well, you, you remain trapped in your own prison.

• 1:17:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, and you're also, you have enemies forever that could have been your friends. There's no reason for it. It's not good for you, it's not good for them. And it's just like this stubborn inclination that a lot of people have to stick with that. Like, fuck those people forever, for life. You really shouldn't do that. It's not good.

• 1:17:56Speaker 02

  Well.

• 1:17:57Joe Rogan?

  Especially if those people feel bad. If they apologize and they realize they've made mistakes. Yeah, like, that's what life's about. You, you gotta be able to understand that in the past you've made mistakes and grow. And if we, the people that have made mistakes and grown, do not accept the people that are currently making mistakes and growing, well, then we're hypocrites.

• 1:18:16Speaker 02

  Well, that's the same with COVID. You know, I know many people who either lost their job or were forced to take something they didn't want to take. And they, they will never forgive them. Like, I won't forget. Now, forgiving is not the same as forgetting, obviously. But they, they can't bring themselves to forgive those who were caught up in a massive psychological operation. And they are, they're held in their own prison of anger. And it's with their own family members. I mean, that. It's almost like, did that happen? That just went, we're now back. What are we doing? All these things have gone so fast. We, you know, we had an attempt on, uh, on a, on a president's life.

• 1:18:58Speaker 02

  And it's like, we don't know anything and all the, what, what, what just, I mean, we're like, our heads are on a swivel spinning around. Like, what is going on? And I think.

• 1:19:07Joe Rogan?

  And the drones.

• 1:19:08Speaker 02

  You know.

• 1:19:09Joe Rogan?

  What about the drones?

• 1:19:10Speaker 02

  So the drone thing, for me, it was so odd. First of all, there is a base over there and they, they're testing some, some drone technology. But people in the United States, but really around the world, this is how we go through life. We go through life looking down. I'm a pilot, I fly helicopters, airplanes. I'm looking up at the sky all the time. There's a lot going on. There's a lot happening in the sky. And then the minute some.

• 1:19:32Joe Rogan?

  What have you seen?

• 1:19:32Speaker 02

  All kinds of things, Joe. I've seen the Starlink satellites go over my house.

• 1:19:37Joe Rogan?

  Those trip people out.

• 1:19:38Speaker 02

  It's amazing. It's like, whoa, and you know, it's like eight or nine in a row, like, whoa.

• 1:19:43Joe Rogan?

  Fast, dude.

• 1:19:43Speaker 02

  Very fast. And they seem pretty low, actually. Like sixty miles up and like, um, but, and of course, you know, once it becomes a story, then every, I know all these people with drones are like, dude, I'm gonna get in the news, I'm flying my drone. They got six foot diameter drones flying around. Of course, I mean, aliens and Chinese drones, they always want to have their red and green anti-collision lights on.

• 1:20:07Joe Rogan?

  It's important.

• 1:20:08Speaker 02

  It's like, I was like, no, no. And of course, there was some, you know, some actual, um, legislation that they wanted to pass, which happened that same week, which was to get Chinese drones out of America, um, the DJI drones. They don't want them. Um, they want to give.

• 1:20:24Joe Rogan?

  They passed that the same week that this is going on?

• 1:20:26Speaker 02

  Dude, same week, same week. That's, that's why they psy-op all of these, uh, local people. And they're all, yes, oh yeah. It was, it was the, it was the.

• 1:20:37Joe Rogan?

  These motherfuckers.

• 1:20:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, they wanted the DJI, DJI drones no longer to come in and, you know, but really for, for law enforcement to also have local authority over drones, which they didn't have. And now they had, they're gonna have that as well. So they can say, hey, you with the drone down, we're doing something important here.

• 1:20:55Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:20:56Speaker 02

  So it's always. Remove your freedom, trust me. Whatever the sign, yeah, that was the same time and all I had to, I looked at this like, okay, I'm trained myself like, let's go take a look, what's going on? Oh, that's interesting, isn't it?

• 1:21:09Joe Rogan?

  Well, this is another argument for deregulation too, because when it comes to innovation, the issue with drones is that if you want like a really high level sophisticated drone in America, you have to have a pilot's license.

• 1:21:22Speaker 02

  You do.

• 1:21:22Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, this is, this is a, that's a big deal and the FAA is very involved in the policing of.

• 1:21:29Speaker 02

  Well, you need that. I mean, you need that for our skies, obviously.

• 1:21:33Joe Rogan?

  100%. China don't have that, bro. They just, they got a social credit score system and no freedom.

• 1:21:39Speaker 02

  I talked to a lot of guys who do, our audience who just got people in every, you know, we've trained them, you're producers, you know, something about one particular topic, you, you have an obligation to let us know. So we have all these guys, drone for hobbies, drones for law enforcement, drones for news, and they also, you know, these DJI drones, they're so much better than the US drones. They're just better. They got better stuff, better technology, better cameras. So they, you know, they're like, I don't want to lose this and, you know, I guess they will.

• 1:22:10Joe Rogan?

  Without the free market, the innovation's going to be stifled. If the innovation is only available to the highest level military contractors, that's crazy, like especially when it comes to drone technology, like you're competing with China and they're doing these enormous light shows with a fucking dragon flying through the sky. Have you seen some of those things?

• 1:22:27Speaker 02

  I saw, seen them fall out and hit people.

• 1:22:31Joe Rogan?

  Gotta crack a few eggs if you want to make an omelet out of them.

• 1:22:34Speaker 02

  I hear you. I'm glad, don't go to drone shows for this very reason, Joe. I'm careful, I'm careful about that.

• 1:22:39Joe Rogan?

  That's probably like those air shows where they fly jets around, like I'm not going to be on the ground.

• 1:22:43Speaker 02

  No, I don't go to those. That's why I like Starlink, because Starlink is really first and foremost a military system. And, and very smartly, I think Elon is very good at, at marketing. It's like, let's give this to the people. You know, so that's, everyone, I mean, I have it as a backup at home. I have fiber, but I have a Starlink. Of course I, I want to have this. But it's really a military system.

• 1:23:07Joe Rogan?

  Dude, I took one with me to the mountains in Utah when I went hunting.

• 1:23:10Speaker 02

  Worked perfectly.

• 1:23:11Joe Rogan?

  It's the size of this pad.

• 1:23:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, the, the to-go, the little, little to-go thing.

• 1:23:15Joe Rogan?

  It's incredible. You can make phone calls, you can do FaceTime, all from the mountains, the middle of nowhere.

• 1:23:19Speaker 02

  I know, I know. It's, it's, we used to dream of, I think I had databelt.com at one point. I dreamt about, you know, wouldn't it be great if we all have these satellites and they're circling around? And we call it the data belt and we'd have all this stuff and, you know, all these things. I can just see the delight of, and of course, a lot of, it's SpaceX. These are very sophisticated NASA people, you know, it's all kind, the best of the best is in there. I think he knows how to hire the right people. And, but he's smart at how he markets that. He really is.

• 1:23:52Joe Rogan?

  Well, the newest thing is they've teamed up with T-Mobile.

• 1:23:55Speaker 02

  Saw that, yeah.

• 1:23:56Joe Rogan?

  So you have Starlink on cellphones now?

• 1:23:57Speaker 02

  Compatible phones only, Joe.

• 1:23:59Joe Rogan?

  Right. So you've gone to flip phone now?

• 1:24:02Speaker 02

  I've gone to flip, yeah.

• 1:24:03Joe Rogan?

  So are you texting me on that thing?

• 1:24:05Speaker 02

  No, I, we do it on Signal, so I do that from my computer.

• 1:24:09Joe Rogan?

  Oh, boy, you're a weirdo. So now you've gone completely flip phone? So you don't text anybody anymore?

• 1:24:14Speaker 02

  No, I can text, I can text message, but we've-

• 1:24:16Joe Rogan?

  But it's like T9?

• 1:24:17Speaker 02

  No, no, there's actually, so, I still have my Graphene OS, which is the de-Google'd stuff.

• 1:24:23Joe Rogan?

  In that?

• 1:24:24Speaker 02

  No, you can't put that on here. So this is Android, but all I really have on here is text messaging, RCS.

• 1:24:30Joe Rogan?

  Can I see it?

• 1:24:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I'm still a green bubble.

• 1:24:32Joe Rogan?

  This is a big flip phone.

• 1:24:34Speaker 02

  $63. And it's from Caterpillar, baby.

• 1:24:37Joe Rogan?

  Whoa, so this is like for job sites?

• 1:24:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:24:39Joe Rogan?

  I bet your battery lasts a year. How long is the battery?

• 1:24:42Speaker 02

  Literally two days if I don't charge it, keeps going. Oh yeah, it's no problem.

• 1:24:46Joe Rogan?

  And so this is Android and you have a touchstone, a touchscreen?

• 1:24:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, if you, if you text, it pops up. Now, it's, the whole thing is, it's hard to use and that's why I like it. Because I don't want, it's a trap.

• 1:25:01Joe Rogan?

  Well, reading your text messages is a trip.

• 1:25:03Speaker 02

  What am I saying?

• 1:25:04Joe Rogan?

  No, they're so small. This is crazy. How do you get back?

• 1:25:09Speaker 02

  Uh, use the, the back button on the keyboard.

• 1:25:12Joe Rogan?

  Oh my God, that's hilarious.

• 1:25:15Speaker 02

  So I-

• 1:25:15Joe Rogan?

  This is hilarious.

• 1:25:16Speaker 02

  So in a pinch, I can bring up a webpage. In a pinch, I can bring up my email.

• 1:25:21Joe Rogan?

  Right, but it makes it complicated.

• 1:25:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, so I'm hindering myself so that I'm not enslaved to it. And actually, I hear from our daughters, you know, that there's a lot of kids who are doing this now. They, because they want to be more present.

• 1:25:36Joe Rogan?

  So if you want to send a text message, like if you want to get into your messages, what are you using to send a text message?

• 1:25:42Speaker 02

  Well, here, I'll show you.

• 1:25:43Joe Rogan?

  Are you doing like T9?

• 1:25:44Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no, so.

• 1:25:46Joe Rogan?

  You're typing, you have a little tiny keyboard that comes on this little tiny screen?

• 1:25:50Speaker 02

  Look, emojis, emojis for my wife.

• 1:25:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, cute.

• 1:25:51Speaker 02

  See, you just hit that and then up pops the keyboard. But you can also swipe, so you can just swipe, swipe around.

• 1:25:58Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god, this keyboard's hilarious.

• 1:26:00Speaker 02

  You can also, you can also do.

• 1:26:02Joe Rogan?

  I'm gonna try to write hello, hello.

• 1:26:04Speaker 02

  My wife will be like, what's going on? Yeah, it's probably auto completing.

• 1:26:07Joe Rogan?

  This is terrible.

• 1:26:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, you gotta, I have it in swipe mode. So just swipe along the letters.

• 1:26:12Joe Rogan?

  I don't know how to do that.

• 1:26:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, just.

• 1:26:14Joe Rogan?

  B, L, L, nope. Hi, Sense, nope, didn't work.

• 1:26:17Speaker 02

  Nope, yeah.

• 1:26:18Joe Rogan?

  I have fat ass fingers too, man, this is not gonna work.

• 1:26:20Speaker 02

  It's, it's not easy. And, but I, you know, it's like, I just need to, I like talking to people now too. Like, it's a great phone for talking to people.

• 1:26:31Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, talking to people's better.

• 1:26:32Speaker 02

  And you know what's cool?

• 1:26:33Joe Rogan?

  Do you have navigation on this thing?

• 1:26:34Speaker 02

  No, well, I could put it on there.

• 1:26:36Joe Rogan?

  But then the government would be following, bro.

• 1:26:37Speaker 02

  It won't work, but you know, you talk to someone like, eh.

• 1:26:41Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:26:41Speaker 02

  Satisfying.

• 1:26:42Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, that is satisfying.

• 1:26:44Speaker 02

  And look, has little alerts if I get a text message so I can see.

• 1:26:47Joe Rogan?

  So if somebody tells you, hey, the meeting got moved to 10pm.

• 1:26:50Speaker 02

  I don't have meetings, Joe.

• 1:26:51Joe Rogan?

  Well.

• 1:26:53Speaker 02

  No, no.

• 1:26:54Joe Rogan?

  Our dinner reservations got changed, you'll get it.

• 1:26:57Speaker 02

  Uh, yeah, you know, it's, Dvorak, my partner on No Agenda, he, he literally has a phone in his drawer. And he never takes it out. He has decided, no, I don't use navigation. He lives in San Francisco, he wants to, you know, wants to keep his mind sharp by driving around. He says, whenever I need a phone, I just turn around to someone and say, hey, man, can I use your phone for a second? There's always someone with a phone, he says. So if I really needed to look something up, I just ask him for it and it's, and good to go.

• 1:27:28Speaker 02

  You know, you get the feeling that you need this thing, but you really don't.

• 1:27:33Joe Rogan?

  Well, you definitely don't if you have a laptop.

• 1:27:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:27:36Joe Rogan?

  And.

• 1:27:37Speaker 02

  And spend dedicated time doing certain things.

• 1:27:39Joe Rogan?

  Right, especially like if you, I can't keep up with emails. It's impossible. It just doesn't, doesn't make sense.

• 1:27:45Speaker 02

  See, that's basically all I do.

• 1:27:47Joe Rogan?

  I can't do it. It doesn't work.

• 1:27:48Speaker 02

  I have filtering and all kinds of stuff. There's like people who will email me 15 times a day.

• 1:27:54Joe Rogan?

  Okay.

• 1:27:54Speaker 02

  And, well, the thing is, of those 15 messages, there's one gem in there.

• 1:28:00Joe Rogan?

  Right, but you have to check them every day. Otherwise, in three days, you've got 45 fucking messages. That doesn't make any sense.

• 1:28:05Speaker 02

  How many?

• 1:28:05Joe Rogan?

  Forty-five.

• 1:28:06Speaker 02

  Hundred. Forty-five hundred messages.

• 1:28:09Joe Rogan?

  From that one guy.

• 1:28:09Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, but, but I, but I put him in his own email box.

• 1:28:13Joe Rogan?

  Oh, I see.

• 1:28:13Speaker 02

  And so then, you know, like when I'm prepping for the show, like, no, no, no, no, I can just see.

• 1:28:18Joe Rogan?

  Right, and then maybe.

• 1:28:19Speaker 02

  Boom, maybe, check that out. Yeah. So I'm a real, that's a, I'm a real information manager. That's, by the way, I am not a big believer in the benefits of AI at this moment. Um, but if it can fix my email, then I'll believe it. And so far, no one's done that with email.

• 1:28:37Joe Rogan?

  How could it possibly fix your email?

• 1:28:38Speaker 02

  It should know what I want to see and what's relevant to me based upon, how about the transcript of my show? Or, I mean, all these wonderful inputs I can give it. How come it can't do that? It's, no one has fixed email for me. When you do that, then I'll be a little more, little more of a believer in AI. Right now, I think it's a great parlor trick. I think it's keeping the stock market afloat. Um, you know, we've gone through three AI winters. Even has his own wiki page, AI Winter. It, it comes and goes, you know? At a certain point, it was, uh, List was the programming language and then, you know, that went away and then funding dries up and, you know, now it's like, what? We don't really need a hundred million dollars to build a model? Oh, but wait a minute, they stole that from you so you can copy. I'm, I run.

• 1:29:24Speaker 02

  These models at home on my own computer, I run the llama model, which is Meta. They've open sourced it. I've run the French one, whatever their frog model, whatever they call it. And then DeepSeek, you can also just load that on your own computer. And it's not very impressive. I mean, it's just not. The error rate is too high. So I'm skeptical of it really taking off. And I certainly don't think it's sentient or anything of that kind.

• 1:29:54Joe Rogan?

  I think it's on its way. And I think also the versions that we're getting are not the versions they're currently working on. And the people that I know that are in the loop at the highest levels of AI are alarmed, including Elon. I had a conversation with Elon. We went to, we were in line together to go to church the day of the inauguration. It just happened to be right next to him. And we just walked through together. I'm like, hey, what's up? And that's all we wanted to talk about was the leaps that Grok AI is making. And he's like, it's like weekly, we're shocked. And I think this thing is exponential. And when they start attaching large language models to quantum computing,

• 1:30:38Joe Rogan?

  it's going to get very, very weird.

• 1:30:41Speaker 02

  That's the pivot I'm waiting for when people start.

• 1:30:43Joe Rogan?

  That's coming, man. And that's going to be like an asteroid hitting the Yucatan.

• 1:30:47Speaker 02

  You know, we've been waiting for quantum computers to actually work for 30 years, and it's always 10 years away. And right now, it's 10 years away.

• 1:30:56Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, but right now, they're able to do things with them. You know, they're able to solve very complicated algorithms.

• 1:31:01Speaker 02

  One, there was, I'm not an expert in this, but there was one computation they did. And, you know, that may be a computation it could do. It's not necessary that you can give it any computation.

• 1:31:13Joe Rogan?

  But you know that the computations that it's doing are so insanely complex that they believe it's proof of the multiverse?

• 1:31:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, I've heard this.

• 1:31:21Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you're not, you're not buying it.

• 1:31:23Speaker 02

  No, not at all.

• 1:31:24Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 1:31:24Speaker 02

  Not for a second.

• 1:31:25Joe Rogan?

  How come?

• 1:31:26Speaker 02

  Because I.

• 1:31:27Joe Rogan?

  How dare you.

• 1:31:28Speaker 02

  I know, I'm a Luddite, I'm a Luddite, look at me.

• 1:31:31Joe Rogan?

  How dare you crush my dreams.

• 1:31:32Speaker 02

  I believe in this.

• 1:31:32Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:33Speaker 02

  I've got no smoke shaglin' in my car. For a number of reasons. One is, I'm not using it. I am, I am the techno guy. I've always been early in computers, early in the internet, and I just can't find a use for it. When I find a, it does some simple things, it's very good at language. Honestly, if I'm look, if I was like, okay, here's my situation, I'm looking for Bible scripture. It'll come up with something good, and then I can say, and read it to me like a, like a Baptist pastor. And it'll go, hey, brother, you know, you know, he'll do all that stuff. But, okay, you know, it has all of the translations of the Bible in it, and so it can, it can predict reasonably what scripture will work.

• 1:32:15Speaker 02

  It's usually not all that great. It can do term papers, it can do, you know, we're in a position now where people are putting their resume into ChatGPT, sending it off, you know, thousands of people are sending off for a job. And the other end, the people are taking that resume, putting it in ChatGPT and saying, please summarize this resume. I mean, that's insane. I mean, we're, it's like, what are we doing here? That doesn't make any sense. If it can fix my email, I'll be very impressed. That's all I want. That's all I ask for.

• 1:32:43Joe Rogan?

  Particular puzzle, though, that's the thing.

• 1:32:44Speaker 02

  Everyone's email is a puzzle. It's like, you know, the spammers get around stuff and they figure it out. And you, you say, report a spam, then it comes back in a different way, and, you know, every, and how many older people especially, but even people our age who get scammed by, you know, these emails that look pretty convincing. And then the minute you click, you know, then you're, they're like, oh, I should put my password in, and then, then you're gone, you're done. There was, there's a phone scam going around right now, which is unbelievable. They had me going for 15 minutes. I got a call, uh, it was eight o'clock in the morning, right at eight o'clock, and I'm about to walk the dog, so I press it to voicemail.

• 1:33:26Speaker 02

  I come back, I listen, this is the sheriff, um, uh, from, um, um, Travis County, and it had a 512 number, and, you know, I need to talk to you urgently. I'm like, okay, this is kinda messed up. I call back, I get a, I get someone, oh, I want Sheriff so-and-so, yeah, hold on a second, we'll transfer, I'm hearing, you know, like, police radio chatter in the background, the guy gets on, and he's saying, well, you were an expert witness, you were called to be an expert witness in a case. I just happened to, and maybe this is not coincidence, I was asked to testify on someone's behalf in a, in a case, and so you were supposed to be an expert witness in this case, you didn't show up, uh, so, you know, you've basically broken federal law, and, you know,

• 1:34:09Speaker 02

  we have to come and pick you up, and we have to, you know, or you can pay a fine. And, and then I'm like, okay, and it, and it just kept on going, and I'm like, whoa, hold on a second, it sounded so real, and then at a certain point, he's like, well, you need to go, you need to get a coupon to send this money, I'm like, I'm gonna call my lawyer. You can't call your lawyer, I have a do not hang up, uh, uh, order, I have to walk you through the whole process, I'm like, okay, now I got it. But that was 10, 15 minutes later, and a lot of people have fallen for this one. It's re, it's good.

• 1:34:42Joe Rogan?

  Super sophisticated, huh?

• 1:34:43Speaker 02

  Very sophisticated.

• 1:34:44Joe Rogan?

  So is that overseas? Are they like spoofing a number?

• 1:34:47Speaker 02

  No, I mean, these were American voices. It sounded like a sheriff, it really did, and the deputy sounded like a deputy, I mean, it was sophisticated. It's good.

• 1:34:56Joe Rogan?

  Wow. How much was the fine?

• 1:34:58Speaker 02

  Like, uh, 3,000 for this, for this infraction, and 2,000 for that infraction, you know, for these two different things.

• 1:35:06Joe Rogan?

  And then you're gonna bank transfer, so they're gonna get your bank numbers.

• 1:35:08Speaker 02

  But, I mean, at that point, I, I caught on, like, no, hold on a second, you know.

• 1:35:13Joe Rogan?

  How'd you get off of it?

• 1:35:14Speaker 02

  I said, I'm gonna call my lawyer, and he's like, no, no, I'm like, you can't tell me I can't call my lawyer, this is bull crap, and then, and I had to calm down, I'm like, I said to Tina, I said, listen to what just happened to me, this is crazy. Some people I know in our, in our, in Fredericksburg actually went all the way.

• 1:35:31Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 1:35:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, older people, you know, and they were afraid, they're like, oh, authority.

• 1:35:37Joe Rogan?

  That's how they get ya.

• 1:35:38Speaker 02

  I'm sure you've got the the one that says, uh, this is my favorite Bitcoin scam. It's like, uh, okay, I've installed a spyware on your computer. And I saw what you were doing, looking at that porn site, and I've recorded everything. And I'm going to release it all to your to your friends and on your social media. If you don't send me $2,000 in Bitcoin right away, don't even think about contacting the authorities. Have you gotten that one?

• 1:36:03Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:36:04Speaker 02

  They've sophisticated it even more now. Will they they'll use your name and your address. Like, I know you live at this address. It's it's freaky, man. So that kind of stuff will be nice if we could have AI protect us from that.

• 1:36:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:18Speaker 02

  If it can do all these wonderful things, focus on that. Help people, save people now.

• 1:36:23Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, cut out, cut out the scamming.

• 1:36:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:36:25Joe Rogan?

  Cut out. Speaking of scamming, what do you think about shitcoins?

• 1:36:30Joe Rogan?

  Like, what's what's your take on, like, Hoc2a coin?

• 1:36:33Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:36:33Joe Rogan?

  Melania coin and?

• 1:36:35Speaker 02

  Those are more meme, more meme coins.

• 1:36:37Joe Rogan?

  Um, shitcoins, right? Isn't that what a meme coin is?

• 1:36:40Speaker 02

  Any, so the only coin I believe in is Bitcoin. And we've talked about this before.

• 1:36:45Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:36:45Speaker 02

  In fact, I looked it up, hoping you would bring it up. Two years ago, when I was here the last time, Bitcoin was around $40,000. Today, it's close to $100,000.

• 1:36:54Joe Rogan?

  Damn.

• 1:36:55Speaker 02

  This will continue to go up, uh, until we're long gone. Um, it's very interesting. So I don't believe in in shitcoins at all, because if you have, Bitcoin has no CEO, there's no one in charge of it. It's literally tens of thousands of people around the world who run these nodes that make it open and make it run. And keep it at this 21 million coin limit.

• 1:37:18Joe Rogan?

  I'm totally down with Bitcoin.

• 1:37:19Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:37:20Joe Rogan?

  I'm with you.

• 1:37:21Speaker 02

  Good.

• 1:37:21Joe Rogan?

  But I think the shitcoin thing is fascinating, that anybody can create a coin.

• 1:37:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:37:27Joe Rogan?

  You know, like Jamie has a pull it up Jamie coin. I don't know if you know that.

• 1:37:30Speaker 02

  Well, but you.

• 1:37:31Joe Rogan?

  Not make it. Don't put that on me. Do not. It's out there now.

• 1:37:36Speaker 02

  I mean.

• 1:37:36Joe Rogan?

  Now that you just said it, now that we just said it.

• 1:37:38Speaker 02

  No, because we brought it up yesterday with the Boneyard guy, with John Reeves. And we said, you should have your own coin, get the Boneyard coin. And now apparently somebody made one. So this is, you bring this up in context of scams because they are scams.

• 1:37:51Joe Rogan?

  It's trouble.

• 1:37:52Speaker 02

  So if, if I wanted to make a quick, quick amount of money, I'd have a shit coin and have my bots ready. And I'd say, hey, Joe, have you heard about my, my curry coin? And you'd be like, no, wait, and it would come out and it would skyrocket. My bots would sell it. I would make a lot of money and it would be dumped right away. It's a scam over and over and over.

• 1:38:12Joe Rogan?

  But what if you don't sell it?

• 1:38:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, then, then you'll have empty bits worth nothing.

• 1:38:17Joe Rogan?

  But if you, so it's only available for pump and dumps?

• 1:38:20Speaker 02

  That's what, that's the only thing it's good for. It's, it's not good for anything else.

• 1:38:24Joe Rogan?

  What about if you wanted to use it to finance charity? Is it possible to do that?

• 1:38:30Speaker 02

  Bad idea, bad idea.

• 1:38:31Joe Rogan?

  Is it a bad idea?

• 1:38:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, you know, a lot of charities now, they will accept Bitcoin. And why is that good? Because people have Bitcoin, and I have some Bitcoin, you know, I've, I've been saving my Bitcoin for a long time. Instead of selling it, to which I then have to pay capital gains over the difference between what I bought it for and sold it at. I can give it to the charity. I can still take my, my tax deductible write-off. They can do one of two things. They can convert it right away into dollars, no capital gains, because it's the same, the same minute. So I've actually been able to give more than I would have. Or, oops, or they can, um, they can sell some of it and hold some of it for a longer term. I really, really believe in Bitcoin and what we're seeing now. There is something interesting going on.

• 1:39:17Speaker 02

  Uh, our dollar is in big, big trouble. And President Trump knows this. This, this falls into kind of the tariffs, uh, talk. Um, have you heard about stable coins?

• 1:39:28Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:39:29Speaker 02

  Okay. Do you mind if I just give you a little?

• 1:39:31Joe Rogan?

  Go ahead, sure.

• 1:39:32Speaker 02

  Our monetary system, it really started after World War II, 1944. Um, we were nearing the end of the war, D-Day was coming, or maybe it just happened. It was, we're getting pretty close. And, um, uh, Europe in particular was very worried that after the war, they would fall into the same Great Depression that happened after World War I, when we had the Great Depression. So they brought in all the, uh, all the economists and all the... All the money, people got on the Queen Mary and went to the States to Bretton Woods. You've heard of Bretton Woods, probably. No. The Bretton Woods system, okay. So Bretton Woods is just this resort. They all got together and they decided that they would have a new monetary system for the entire world. I'm not an economist, but I've looked at this long enough to understand it.

• 1:40:15Speaker 02

  And when they came out after two weeks, he said, okay, we're going to have this thing called the International Monetary Fund, the IMF. And they're going to manage the interest rates or they manage the currency exchange between all the individual countries with the US dollar as the reserve currency. So we became the money of the world and we back it by gold. And the idea was one dollar could always be exchanged for 35 ounces of gold. And, you know, when you're the reserve currency, everyone has to have the dollar. So everybody wanted our dollar. What did we do? We signed the Marshall Plan. We sent tens, you know, just billions of dollars over. All our companies went into Europe, started building factories.

• 1:41:00Speaker 02

  And, and, you know, so all, so the dollar kept going in. All these other currencies kind of came a little bit weaker because we were so strong with our money. And then people got a little worried about the dollar. They looked around and went like, hey, do you guys have the gold to back that up in Fort Knox? Of course we didn't because we just kept printing money and sending it over. And then you get into this thing called the Triffin Dilemma. And that means that when you are the reserve currency, your currency is basically overvalued and you can't export anything. And that's exactly, and I'm skipping over a lot, but that's where we are today. Our products are too expensive to ship to China and sell in China because of the value of our dollar.

• 1:41:41Speaker 02

  This is why President Trump is saying, hey, all our money is flowing out towards you. We need to get some of that back, so we're going to raise tariffs. I think it's a short-term solution. So I think two things will happen. One is we have this sovereign wealth fund, which you've heard him talk about, the sovereign wealth fund. So in that will be the value of, you know, our, our public land that the government owns and all kinds of other things will be valued at this astronomical amount. And in that will also be the strategic Bitcoin reserve that the president promised. Now we get stable coins. This is, this is a crazy, crazy thing that's happened.

• 1:42:22Speaker 02

  There's this, so a stable coin is a digital dollar. It's, it's pegged to the dollar, so it's always a dollar and you can pay with this through the internet, through, you know, apps and everything. Um, it's already being used all over the world. The only reason it's worth a dollar is because the stable coin company that creates it, they have debt and paper to back it up. So they buy America's debt. They get treasury bonds or T bills, which actually pays a, a dividend. So you get interest on that. And for each dollar they have bought in treasuries, they can create a stable coin. So if you look at the company Tether,

• 1:43:04Speaker 02

  they have bought more of the United States debt than most countries. They have a hundred and sixty billion dollars worth of US debt. And for each of those dollars, they've created a stable coin, which now people can use all over the world transacting. And what's their business? It does like 50 people in the company. So they have a hundred and sixty billion dollars at four percent interest annually. They're making bank just for, just for holding this debt. So I think President Trump is very smart and he's seen that we can flood the world with our stable coin. And you kind of get a two for one. So you, you, you create, you create a dollar of debt, but then you create another dollar on top

• 1:43:46Speaker 02

  that can be used all over the world as our, as the reserve currency. And that should probably result in, I don't know, the, the Mar-a-Lago Accord or some new monetary system that we're going to have to come up with, um, to really have our dollar be valued properly, but also still remain the reserve currency and remain the strong export country that we need to be because, you know, what do we do? We don't make anything that, that we sell abroad, you know, we, we can't all be. You know, serving each other burgers and fries and washing each other's cars and cleaning each other's homes. We have to, we have to build something. And all of that went overseas. Everything, everything we got, all of the stuff on this table. This, you know, it didn't

• 1:44:31Speaker 02

  come out of his butt. This is from China. (laughing) Although, I don't know. (laughing) So, so there's something big coming, really big, and it has to happen. And, um, Trump is a very meta guy. People misunderstand. He under, he's gonna refi the country. That's what he, he's a real estate guy. He's gonna, he's gonna figure out a way to refi it, and it'll, it'll be digital. And a lot of the Bitcoiners don't like this because they like Bitcoin to be the money that the whole world uses. You know, that may one day happen, but you know, now it's more like the digital gold. You know, you can, you can keep your, your value in it. And you know, I can send a billion doll, if I had it, I could send

• 1:45:13Speaker 02

  a billion dollars to another country, to another person in 10 minutes, and you know, no one can stop me. Um, so it's a very useful tool, but it hasn't quite turned out to be money or currency, uh, the way it was originally intended. But it's going to be a very important part of it. I think you'll see Bitcoin, uh, be a part of that strategic reserve. It's ver, it's easier than sending gold, you know, than, oh, I'm gonna ship you a billion dollars worth of gold. I need, you know, armored cars, I need dudes, everything, uh, security and ships and whatever. Um, so it'll be a part of it, and you'll still be able to use it between people. Um, but it looks to me like stablecoin and Tether in particular

• 1:45:58Speaker 02

  is going to be the, the future of, of the US dollar payments. And this is where a lot of people on the right, certainly, are very afraid of, um, control grid, you know, because a stablecoin is not necessarily like Bitcoin. You can stop it, you can control it, you can see who sent what to whom. There's a lot of fear about this. Um, and particularly, um, although I don't see any maliciousness, um, this fear that Elon and the PayPal mafia and Peter Thiel, all guys you've met, all guys you've had on the show, I think are actually quite nice people.

• 1:46:34Speaker 02

  That they're going to bring in the new with AI and we're all going to be locked in and, you know, Stargate will bring cancer mRNA vaccines that'll be mandated. I mean, people are spinning up over this stuff. And I'm not saying that they necessarily wrong or there should be no concern. Uh, but we are moving towards a digital dollar and it will have aspects of control. Which is why I like the backup of Bitcoin, so I can still transact and do things without anybody being able to stop it. And you're gonna get none of that with a shitcoin, nothing.

• 1:47:07Joe Rogan?

  When FTX, that scandal, what, what were they trading in? Was that all meme coins? Was that different cryptos? Is there, is there a difference between meme coins and established crypto coins?

• 1:47:18Speaker 02

  Well, an, an established, anything but Bitcoin has someone who can, who can change the ledger, who can change the blockchain. Bitcoin, you can't do that. It has, it's, it's a beautiful system. The checks and balances are immutable. I mean, that, that's the beauty of, of Bitcoin. Any other blockchain that is owned or operated by a company or people can be and will be manipulated. And FTX was one of those. What I believe FTX was really used for was slush fund into Democrat Party and politician, not just, also to some Republicans as well.

• 1:47:58Speaker 02

  Um, that kid, that Sam Bankman-Fried, he got abused by his parents, I think. I'm just alleging this. I don't want to get sued over it. But when you see what, what was going on there and the money that was just being, you know, slushed right through into different foundations.

• 1:48:12Joe Rogan?

  Democratic operatives, right?

• 1:48:13Speaker 02

  Big time. They had, they had nonprofits and all kinds of, uh.

• 1:48:17Joe Rogan?

  And he was the number two donor to the Democratic Party.

• 1:48:19Speaker 02

  That's right. That's right. That's right.

• 1:48:21Joe Rogan?

  And you're doing that to kind of buy your way through this.

• 1:48:24Speaker 02

  That's what it seemed like to me, yeah.

• 1:48:26Joe Rogan?

  Cause you're doing shenanigans, you know?

• 1:48:27Speaker 02

  Big time.

• 1:48:28Joe Rogan?

  And, and they're all also doing amphetamines and, and polyamorous relationships in the Bahamas, like.

• 1:48:34Speaker 02

  It's a polycule, Joe. It's just a polycule. I mean, it was, it was sad for these kids because they were just all excited and doing stuff and, you know. I mean, when I've been in, I've raised money from Kleiner Perkins and Sequoia Capital. And, you know, when you get them all googly Gaga over, oh, this guy was so cool. He was sitting in the pitch meeting and he was playing a video game. He's such a genius. I mean, what? Are you kidding me?

• 1:49:02Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 1:49:03Speaker 02

  Venture capital investors are not necessarily the most sophisticated.

• 1:49:07Joe Rogan?

  Well, they want results and if they're getting results, they'll put on the blinders.

• 1:49:12Speaker 02

  What I, I was just reading about Elizabeth Holmes.

• 1:49:15Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah. I love that story.

• 1:49:17Speaker 02

  She got screwed.

• 1:49:19Joe Rogan?

  She got screwed?

• 1:49:19Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:49:20Joe Rogan?

  How so?

• 1:49:21Speaker 02

  Well, okay. So she was in a situation where the so-called smartest investors in the world, which included Colin Powell. And, you know, everyone was in on this deal. Everyone's like, you gotta get your money in now, you know, bring everybody in. We got this big fund. This is gonna be it. This is the blood test. It'll change medicine. And, you know, they hyped her up. They put her in the magazines. They got, you know, she was looking like the female Steve Jobs. And she got caught up in it and falsified.

• 1:49:52Joe Rogan?

  Agency away from her. She changed her voice. She started dressing like Steve Jobs. She started lying about results.

• 1:49:58Speaker 02

  This is.

• 1:49:59Joe Rogan?

  She fired people that didn't go along with it.

• 1:50:01Speaker 02

  Yes. But does she deserve to go to jail for 10 years for ripping off people who were stupid?

• 1:50:07Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 1:50:08Speaker 02

  Really?

• 1:50:09Joe Rogan?

  Well, you can't rip people off.

• 1:50:10Speaker 02

  I think you have restitution and things that you can do.

• 1:50:14Joe Rogan?

  Hundreds of millions of dollars people lost. Like, that's not restitution. You don't have that money. You're not gonna pay it back because your product sucks. So they've dumped all this money and lost.

• 1:50:24Speaker 02

  It's a civil crime and there's, there's definitely some blame on the investors. But the investors were too big to look stupid. So I think they pushed a little bit more on her than she does. I'm not trying to defend her, her falsification.

• 1:50:39Joe Rogan?

  Jail at all?

• 1:50:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, but not for 10 years.

• 1:50:42Joe Rogan?

  How long? Couple of days?

• 1:50:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, just a couple of days. Yeah, just enough to transition, Joe. Yeah, just enough to come and become a dude and then we're good to go. No, I mean, the.

• 1:50:52Speaker 02

  It's just another example of of big money being stupid and they maybe they could just admit that, you know, like they pushed her. I know how it goes. I know. I remember we had a pod show, which was, you know, a lot of sophisticated investors, Kleiner and and Sequoia, you know, this is like same people Elon. I met Elon when when they launched Tesla. I was at the at the hangar where they where they did the first test drives. It was it was interesting. And I was like, this guy seems like on the spectrum. He's not really talking much. It's like, what's going on here? You know, it's like, what's happening with this? And, you know, so we were doing

• 1:51:35Speaker 02

  podcasting. So this is right after, maybe a year after Steve Jobs put it into into iTunes and the and the iPod. And and so there was money coming in. And, you know, the first thing they said is, you've got to be in San Francisco. Well, if you want a media company, where's the last place you want to be is San Francisco? You need to be LA or New York. No, no, no, you got to be here. And

• 1:51:56Joe Rogan?

  Why did they want you to be in San Francisco?

• 1:51:57Speaker 02

  So they could come and see the office and check out the operation and make sure their money's being spent well.

• 1:52:02Joe Rogan?

  Oh.

• 1:52:04Speaker 02

  And

• 1:52:04Joe Rogan?

  How often are they gonna visit?

• 1:52:06Speaker 02

  Oh, you have no idea. They're always dropping by and like, what's going on? And so you're doing reports and it's

• 1:52:11Joe Rogan?

  Oh, they just want to hang out with the cool guy.

• 1:52:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, that too, maybe. But then, you know, it was definitely a struggle. We were actually kind of profitable for a bit there. But it was, you know, like, GoDaddy ads with promo codes, you know, code Bongino. I mean, it's like, you know, it was like, yeah, is it are people really listening? Are they just using the codes? And there was there's always a lot of scams in

• 1:52:36Joe Rogan?

  Like the honey scam?

• 1:52:38Speaker 02

  Well, no, not like that. No, there's there's scams of, you know, when companies need to, we didn't do this, but when companies need to raise more money in Silicon Valley, then they'll buy some traffic from bots. And I'm sure it happens on with comedy videos too. People like, I need some traffic on this video. Let me buy some bots on something.

• 1:52:54Joe Rogan?

  Oh, you definitely can do that, right?

• 1:52:55Speaker 02

  Right, of course. But then at a certain point, um, YouTube had come out, you know, and oh, YouTube, everyone has to do video now. You gotta do video, you can't do audio, gotta do video. And then it got even worse, like we sat in a, in a board meeting and like, have you seen Joost? Juice, Ju- I'm like, do you remember Joost?

• 1:53:14Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 1:53:14Speaker 02

  J O O S T.

• 1:53:16Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:53:16Speaker 02

  It was the guys who, who built Skype. They built this video platform that was basically a peer-to-peer streaming television shows.

• 1:53:23Joe Rogan?

  Hmm.

• 1:53:24Speaker 02

  And there was no doubt about it. You've got to go video, be more like Juice, make your interface like Juice. So the, at a certain point, you're like, well, what am I gonna do? Am I gonna risk running out of money? Am I gonna listen to what they say? Do they really know what they're talking about? And ultimately, you know, the company ran for 10 years and no one exited. You know, it just kind of got folded into other things. So it was not a great investment, uh, of their money or my time, honestly.

• 1:53:52Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's kind of amazing that the big video platform is still just YouTube. And now, you know, YouTube just passed Netflix now is the most watched thing on television.

• 1:54:00Speaker 02

  Oh, they're, they're the big, they're not even counted in the streaming, uh, data, in the streaming wars. But yeah, they're the big, I have YouTube TV. I don't, I cut the cable, I don't watch, I don't have cable anymore. It's like, I've just.

• 1:54:11Joe Rogan?

  I watch YouTube on TV more than I watch anything. Cause there's so much variety, there's so many different things you can search. The fact that you could essentially find anything, like if I'm interested in, you know, some particular region of the world of ancient history, I just pu- punch that into YouTube. And I have hundreds if not thousands of videos on it.

• 1:54:30Speaker 02

  It took them a long time, um, to get, I think, to make that profitable inside of Google. Because if you, if you see how many videos are being uploaded daily and transformed into digital video. And I mean, it's, it's crazy, the amount of computation that goes into YouTube and the amount of bandwidth that is being sent. So I think it took a long, they never really reported the numbers. They've only done that in the past couple of years of how much revenue. Now, of course, YouTube is, is making bank. I mean, it's really, it's an incredible system.

• 1:55:02Joe Rogan?

  It's shocking that no one has come up with anything even remotely close.

• 1:55:04Speaker 02

  It would take too much money. It's so. So much investment that goes into doing that. It's it's it's a lot. I mean, you remember your bandwidth cost back in the day, pre Spotify. You know, think how how do you solve that when you have a hundred million videos being posted every single day?

• 1:55:20Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you can't.

• 1:55:21Speaker 02

  I mean.

• 1:55:22Joe Rogan?

  You'd have to have billions of dollars in startup money and then then you're still struggling to get people to use your app. Like, you remember that one company that came up? Was it Quibi? What was it?

• 1:55:33Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:55:34Joe Rogan?

  Was that what it was? They spent so much money.

• 1:55:36Speaker 02

  Was it Katzenberg? Katzenberg and um.

• 1:55:40Joe Rogan?

  I do not remember.

• 1:55:40Speaker 02

  It was a Hollywood thing. It was.

• 1:55:42Joe Rogan?

  It was Hollywood thing.

• 1:55:42Speaker 02

  I think it was Quibi, Jamie.

• 1:55:43Joe Rogan?

  And they got a bunch of famous people to do short videos.

• 1:55:47Speaker 02

  Short drama and they put two billion dollars in and.

• 1:55:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 1:55:51Speaker 02

  Gone.

• 1:55:52Joe Rogan?

  They blew it real quick.

• 1:55:54Speaker 02

  Because you can't.

• 1:55:56Joe Rogan?

  Can't manufacture something that goes viral.

• 1:55:58Speaker 02

  No, you can't. And that's kind of like TikTok. We talked about TikTok last time, I think, I was here and. You know, obviously, it's not an issue now that China is spying through TikTok because it's still here. I think, as I told you then, I. I think it's because they were eating Silicon Valley's lunch, you know, doing four billion dollars, taking away revenue from them. And just looking at the people who sponsored the bill, it seemed like they had a lot of. Um, donations from Google and Amazon, you know, that just seemed to me like there might be some some issues there. But what people misunderstand about TikTok is it's not.

• 1:56:36Speaker 02

  Just about the videos and the and the format and how it flies by. It's about the shop. The shop is their magic sauce. If you look at the back end, um, the influencers who get paid on TikTok, they have this whole back end with. Rankings and who sold more stuff. Half the videos on TikTok, once you get out of your algo, half of them are about products. And people are, you know, just selling products and it's all from China and it's all been coming in under the eight hundred dollar de minimis. Um, tax regulation. So there's no, there's no import duty or anything paid on it. They they actually have, I think. TmU now has. warehouses in America.

• 1:57:18Speaker 02

  So it's just Chinese crap that we're buying over and over again as wildly successful. It's not really about the ads on on. Do you get ads on TikTok? A lot of ads?

• 1:57:28Joe Rogan?

  I don't use TikTok.

• 1:57:29Speaker 02

  Okay, good. Yeah, I got. So when it was gonna go away. I'm like, I gotta get this app. I gotta see what happens. You know, it's like, this is gonna be crazy. So I get the app. And I'm using my my graphene OS phone so I can lock off all access. All it all it had was my location. Can't hide that from the IP address and my name. So I'm.

• 1:57:49Joe Rogan?

  You can get TikTok on a graphene phone?

• 1:57:51Speaker 02

  Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And you can actually block it from accessing your contacts, blocking.

• 1:57:56Joe Rogan?

  But still, that was too much for you. You had to go to a flip phone. That's interesting.

• 1:57:59Speaker 02

  Well, that was my it's my experimental thing. And so all it knew was Adam Curry in the hill country. And it went, I think it went Curry, black name. Hill country is probably about fifty churches where he is. Boom, right away. I'm getting black preachers. Bring hellstone brim. Oh, yeah. And it's just like and on and on and on. It's been phenomenal. So and some of these guys are pretty good. The ones that fall back, you know, it's like and the guy catches them every single time. And so their algorithm is just give that person more of what they want. They're not. They're not trying to do like us. Like in like, you know, Meta or I'm not sure about X, how that works, but.

• 1:58:41Speaker 02

  Let me inject some people who are against it or have a counter a counter argument like when. Uh, when I was on the last time and I talked about my my coming to Jesus. Dude, there were TikTok videos with millions of views of just this, you know, this is one bit. And and if you looked at it one time, it just you get the same over and over again. They get all kinds of Jesus stuff back and forth. That's all. Not anyone going, yeah, you guys are crazy. You know, this is no good. None of that. So it's a very friendly. It's kind of the Chinese model. It's like, give people what they want and don't try to. Interject them or spin them up or get them angry and then throw an ad in their face when they're all emotional. So it's very different. It's very different. Cause I don't know if it'll be.

• 1:59:26Speaker 02

  Worth anything to anyone buying it unless you have the shop portion. Without that, I don't know. I don't think.

• 1:59:31Joe Rogan?

  Don't you think they'd have all that too?

• 1:59:34Speaker 02

  You gotta have the products. You gotta have the cheap Chinese products. That's the problems. Like, do you have that stuff?

• 1:59:41Joe Rogan?

  You'd have to be buying them from China.

• 1:59:44Speaker 02

  Yeah. It's fun for, you know, for us, like, oh, you know, different crazy people. I mean, Dvorak uses it all the time. He's in an algo of just nut jobs. You know, he's like, "Blue hair, look at this." He plays clips on the show. I'm like, "Dude, you gotta do something else with your life during the day."

• 2:00:01Joe Rogan?

  It's just amazing how many of those kooky people are getting so much traction. And that was the thought, that it was a Chinese psy-op, that they were accentuating all these people, and that was like ruining the culture of America, because it was showing you all these blue-haired psychopaths with beards and lipstick and nail polish.

• 2:00:19Speaker 02

  It's really, so I heard the same thing from, I heard people saying, "Dude, you're wrong. They want to get rid of TikTok because that's where MAGA lives." I'm like, huh? And then it was, because that's all they got. They got MAGA.

• 2:00:32Joe Rogan?

  Right, because that's what offends them.

• 2:00:33Speaker 02

  Exactly, exactly. So, it's just, it's very, social media, the internet in general was kind of a bad idea. It's kind of, it's good for many things, but there's two sides of the same coin. There's good and bad. I mean...

• 2:00:49Joe Rogan?

  Why would you say it's a bad idea, though? I think it's a great idea.

• 2:00:52Speaker 02

  Well...

• 2:00:52Joe Rogan?

  I mean, you were just talking about it, to shift the balance of information.

• 2:00:56Speaker 02

  Because of the psy-ops. If we're not aware of the psy-ops, you know, the DARPA, the Defense Agency Research Project.

• 2:01:03Joe Rogan?

  Agency.

• 2:01:04Speaker 02

  Agency? I had too many agencies in there, DARPA. Since the 70s, they've been looking at social networks. And really, in the, there's a, ah, there's a guy, he can't work the law of large numbers. And they figured out that in a computer network, regardless of the content, depending on, if you have enough nodes, you can predict where the information will flow. So, if I'm talking about something here, if they boost the right nodes, they can predict where that information will go. And that's, that's how, I don't think even Elon can stop that from happening. It's not an algorithm thing. It's it's literally like a law of nature thing that just it that's the way it will flow.

• 2:01:49Speaker 02

  And you can start injecting things to the right nodes and you'll propagate some message. And I mean, it I think it's happening all the time, everywhere. I mean, it it you once you start looking, it's like, well, where's that coming from?

• 2:02:03Joe Rogan?

  Well, I think we need to educate people on how to um how to digest social media. And, you know, I think you should treat it the same way you treat junk food. You know, and I think there's certain aspects of social media that are really interesting and I like them. I mean, most of what I get on social media is what my friends send me. So that's how that's how I do it.

• 2:02:28Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 2:02:28Joe Rogan?

  And this is how I stay sane. Is like my friends send me wacky things and I go, oh, my God, what is this? Like my me and my friend Christina Pizitzky, she sends me like the the nuttiest like trans activists screaming and nutty guys who think that they're women. And then me and Tom Segura, we exchange murder videos, murder.

• 2:02:49Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 2:02:49Joe Rogan?

  And and car accidents and animal attacks. And then, you know.

• 2:02:55Speaker 02

  Before breakfast?

• 2:02:57Joe Rogan?

  No, I try not to in the morning, but sometimes I have to check my text message because I have business stuff. I have things, things going on, you know, guests and this and that. And so I do check, but, you know, it's just it's very intoxicating to just sit there on the toilet and just start scrolling.

• 2:03:13Speaker 02

  Toilet scroller.

• 2:03:14Joe Rogan?

  But you gotta, you know, you gotta develop discipline and discipline is important for every aspect of your life. And you just you have to know like when you've had too much.

• 2:03:21Speaker 02

  But that's that's not easy for young kids.

• 2:03:24Joe Rogan?

  Right, it's not, but I think they can learn just like they've learned everything else in this world.

• 2:03:28Speaker 02

  But you need parental guidance and most of the parents are hooked on it themselves.

• 2:03:33Joe Rogan?

  Well, I think they need a message, you know, and I think this conversation is part of that message. You know, I think kids need to realize like you are wasting time. Like if you spend two hours just scrolling through TikTok, you have wasted time. And there's stuff that you probably should be doing and you're gonna be depressed if you don't do those things. You're gonna feel weird, you're not gonna feel satisfied, you're not gonna feel like you're on a good path. You're gonna like not have a lot of uh respect for yourself. If you just like sit on the couch all day and scroll through TikTok, which many people listening to this have done. A whole day, just sitting there, eating chips, scrolling through TikTok and just wasting your day. That is possible to do.

• 2:04:13Joe Rogan?

  I think there's ways that you can incorporate it into your life where it's interesting. You know, and I've got good algorithms now, especially on YouTube. But pretty good algorithms on Instagram too, where most of the stuff it's showing me is stuff I'm actually interested in.

• 2:04:31Speaker 02

  Do you get those videos when you're interested in a topic and then there'll be like five different videos that are being suggested to you and about five minutes in you're like, this is just an AI voice that's that's cobbled a whole bunch of old things together and it's a new version of it.

• 2:04:45Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:04:45Speaker 02

  I'm not learning anything.

• 2:04:47Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's always those. There's always those too.

• 2:04:49Speaker 02

  A lot of that.

• 2:04:49Joe Rogan?

  I think YouTube is the best because like I'm interested in specific subjects, right? Like I'm a car nut. I love old cars in specific particular.

• 2:04:58Speaker 02

  This, by the way, lots of people love restored things.

• 2:05:03Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 2:05:03Speaker 02

  People love restored cars. We love you have, I think, do you still have your car?

• 2:05:09Joe Rogan?

  Which one?

• 2:05:09Speaker 02

  Uh, the Corvette?

• 2:05:11Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:05:11Speaker 02

  I mean beautifully restored, just just peak, last time I saw it, which was I think in LA.

• 2:05:16Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:17Speaker 02

  This is what I think the president is doing. He's trying to restore us back to being that great American muscle car. And I think people, everybody loves a beautiful restored muscle car. You know what I mean?

• 2:05:31Joe Rogan?

  Well, America's making real muscle cars right now. Like this is one of the rare times where America's got very exciting automobiles that are out now. You know, we've talked a bunch of times about the Corvette ZR1, which is breaking all these lap.

• 2:05:46Speaker 02

  That's the, is that the mid-engine?

• 2:05:48Joe Rogan?

  Is the mid-engine 1,000 horsepower Corvette.

• 2:05:52Speaker 02

  Tina won't let me buy one. I'm like, let me buy.

• 2:05:55Joe Rogan?

  Why not?

• 2:05:55Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:05:57Joe Rogan?

  You gotta put your foot down.

• 2:05:58Speaker 02

  No, no, I'm good. I'm good.

• 2:06:00Joe Rogan?

  Oh, mommy tells you what to do.

• 2:06:01Speaker 02

  No, no, no. She's like, that's a douchebag car. So yeah, for me, it would be kind of douchey.

• 2:06:05Joe Rogan?

  Why?

• 2:06:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean.

• 2:06:07Joe Rogan?

  It's awesome.

• 2:06:08Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 2:06:08Joe Rogan?

  Don't think that way. That's silly.

• 2:06:10Speaker 02

  Ever since I started flying 350 miles an hour, I don't care about how fast they go on the ground, Joe.

• 2:06:15Joe Rogan?

  It's not even how fast you go.

• 2:06:16Speaker 02

  It's just.

• 2:06:17Joe Rogan?

  Well, that's why I like old cars, because it's not even how fast.

• 2:06:20Speaker 02

  I had a C5 though. I did have a long time ago.

• 2:06:22Joe Rogan?

  Those are cool.

• 2:06:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:06:23Joe Rogan?

  They were, they were a little shitty, actually. They really got good around C7. C7 was nasty.

• 2:06:28Speaker 02

  That heads up display was cool though. It was like.

• 2:06:30Joe Rogan?

  Oh, C5 had a heads up display?

• 2:06:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, it had a heads up.

• 2:06:32Joe Rogan?

  Look at that. That's the new one. That's the ZR1. Come on, son. That is not a douchebag car. That's a goddamn American work of art.

• 2:06:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:06:39Joe Rogan?

  That's a fucking American work.

• 2:06:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, it's nice. Can I get my dog in it though?

• 2:06:44Joe Rogan?

  Look at that.

• 2:06:44Speaker 02

  Can I get my dog?

• 2:06:45Joe Rogan?

  How big's your dog?

• 2:06:46Speaker 02

  Ninety-five pounds.

• 2:06:47Joe Rogan?

  What is he?

• 2:06:48Speaker 02

  She is a.

• 2:06:50Joe Rogan?

  She, sorry.

• 2:06:51Speaker 02

  Great Pyrenees Akbash rescue mutt.

• 2:06:53Joe Rogan?

  Oh, that's cute.

• 2:06:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, completely white.

• 2:06:55Joe Rogan?

  I didn't mean to misgender your dog.

• 2:06:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, she's very angry.

• 2:06:58Joe Rogan?

  Look how awesome that looks, man. You don't have to take your dog everywhere. Reward yourself, Adam Curry. You're the pod father. Get a fucking Corvette. Look at that thing.

• 2:07:06Speaker 02

  That's beautiful.

• 2:07:07Joe Rogan?

  It's a cockpit inside of that thing.

• 2:07:08Speaker 02

  That is beautiful.

• 2:07:09Joe Rogan?

  And the performance of that is unparalleled. It's like, it's an amazing automobile.

• 2:07:13Speaker 02

  A friend of mine, he just, we, cause he's a real American car.

• 2:07:17Joe Rogan?

  Real American hero.

• 2:07:19Speaker 02

  He just bought a Tesla Model Three. And he bought it for the autopilot. He says, I wish this came in sixteen cylinder, you know, multi-turbo. He says.

• 2:07:29Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:07:29Speaker 02

  But he says the autopilot, he just loves that. He loves autopilot.

• 2:07:34Joe Rogan?

  I have a S, the Plaid. I have a Plaid Tesla, the four-door larger sedan.

• 2:07:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, does have the autopilot?

• 2:07:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:41Speaker 02

  Full self-drive?

• 2:07:42Joe Rogan?

  It's incredible. It's incredible. I don't use it that much. I like to drive. But just the capability of the car is amazing.

• 2:07:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:07:48Joe Rogan?

  The speed and the effortlessness in which it merges with traffic and just takes off.

• 2:07:54Joe Rogan?

  With no sound.

• 2:07:55Speaker 02

  Beautiful, man. It's beautiful. Yeah.

• 2:07:57Joe Rogan?

  But it's different. So I like, I like old air-cooled Porsches.

• 2:08:02Speaker 02

  I had a nine eleven a long time ago.

• 2:08:04Joe Rogan?

  They're not fast. They're not fast in.

• 2:08:05Speaker 02

  Cause you're manual, manual?

• 2:08:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, always.

• 2:08:08Speaker 02

  The truck clutch, like, ah, ah, you gotta push that thing in?

• 2:08:11Joe Rogan?

  Well, it's, they're floor-mounted too. They're different. The old Porsches are different. But it's, um, what they are is a, of physical experience. It's like a ride. It's a fun, exhilarating experience where you hear the. You hear the engine, you're shifting the gears yourself. It's exciting and engaging. And that is more important to me sometimes than just speed. Like, I don't need to go fast. It's not even about going fast. It's about.

• 2:08:38Speaker 02

  The whole, the whole, the whole experience.

• 2:08:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, you're feeling the rear end break a little with your ass, you know, as it fucking kicks sideways.

• 2:08:45Speaker 02

  Modern cars, man, doesn't work anymore. We used to put Porsche engines into VW buses back in the day.

• 2:08:51Joe Rogan?

  Oh, Jesus.

• 2:08:51Speaker 02

  That was awesome. You can fit it in a Beetle too. You can fit a Porsche engine into a body.

• 2:08:58Joe Rogan?

  Oh yeah, a lot of people have done crazy Beetle transformations where they've hyped up Porsche engines and put them in the back of those things. Yeah, there's a whole like modding community of Beetle freaks that take Beetles and.

• 2:09:10Speaker 02

  They're Volkswagen. They're Volkswagen. Remember how many there were in the seventies coming in from Germany? We all had a, I had a thirteen oh three. I loved my Beetle. It was the best.

• 2:09:19Joe Rogan?

  My friend Jimmy had one. He had a Beetle. It was just cheap on gas. It was easy to drive.

• 2:09:25Speaker 02

  Mine was like, I, like I had to jumpstart it because the lock had broken.

• 2:09:31Joe Rogan?

  So you jumpstarted every time you got in?

• 2:09:33Speaker 02

  Every time you got in and then I'd lost my gas cap and so I've just had a rag in there.

• 2:09:37Joe Rogan?

  Oh God.

• 2:09:38Speaker 02

  And if I went around the highway to the right and if my tank was too full, then gas would leak out and my front tire would start to slide off.

• 2:09:47Joe Rogan?

  Oh Jesus.

• 2:09:47Speaker 02

  It was back in, you know, we were eighteen, you know, you know, just like, eh, gotta drive this thing. It was great. I loved, that was a good. We weren't scrolling on TikTok, Joe Rogan. We were doing dangerous stuff.

• 2:10:00Joe Rogan?

  That's true.

• 2:10:01Speaker 02

  We were jumpstarting our cars and we were.

• 2:10:03Joe Rogan?

  I think we're lucky that we've seen both. We've gone through, we grew up in a time where there was no internet and you were going outside to do things and people did physical activities. But then as we got older, we recognized that there's this new technology that's connecting the whole world in this weird way. And we're getting to experience it as people who know the world before that. I think we're real lucky.

• 2:10:25Speaker 02

  Well, you're, you're a big part of, of a change, certainly in young men. I mean, I've seen so many young men who follow you and follow your workout regime and follow, you know, listen to you. They listen to you about what you're saying about health, about food. And that's a, that's a, you're an important voice in that regard. You've really, really helped a lot of young men in our country and far beyond. I mean, I know you don't take compliments like this well, but you're, it's very important what you've done.

• 2:10:54Joe Rogan?

  Very happy if that's true.

• 2:10:55Speaker 02

  Very important what you're doing.

• 2:10:57Joe Rogan?

  There's a lot of young men that just feel like real disconnected to the world. Nothing seems to be anything that is interesting to them. And they're being pushed into this box where someone's trying to turn them into a fucking Chihuahua. You know, like this is like the evolution of the wolf into the dog. That's what's happening with men. Like for some reason, men are supposed to be neutered.

• 2:11:17Speaker 02

  You know.

• 2:11:19Speaker 02

  There's um, in the six, so I've been, ever since I uh, I got saved and become a believer, there, I've really learned about our American history and I've been blown away by how much, because there's a lot of, you know, you can talk about the sixties and when they outlawed psychedelic drugs and put it on schedule one, that was the exact same time when the bible was basically taken out of school and it was, you know, and, and um, I think the church in general, you know, kind of went into itself and kind of, you know, became, you know, a thing you do over there on Sundays.

• 2:11:55Joe Rogan?

  Can we pause real quick? Because I have to take a leak real bad.

• 2:11:57Speaker 02

  You gotta pee?

• 2:11:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Let's pause, we'll come back, we'll talk about Jesus. We'll be right back.

• 2:12:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:12:02Joe Rogan?

  Alright, we're back.

• 2:12:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, oh man.

• 2:12:04Joe Rogan?

  Much better, right?

• 2:12:05Speaker 02

  Ah, thank you, thank you.

• 2:12:07Joe Rogan?

  So, we were gonna talk about the vaping thing, because you were saying that there's nothing wrong with vaping.

• 2:12:12Speaker 02

  Well, I didn't say there's nothing wrong with vaping.

• 2:12:14Joe Rogan?

  So, what is that? Can I see it?

• 2:12:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:12:16Joe Rogan?

  Can I hold it?

• 2:12:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:12:17Joe Rogan?

  So, this is a brick, man, you could hurt somebody with this. If you wanted to fuck somebody up, if you get a good grip.

• 2:12:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, no, you just, yeah, it's like brass knuckles almost, like holding a roll of pennies.

• 2:12:28Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, this, no, you wouldn't do that, you're gonna break your hand. That's all silly.

• 2:12:32Speaker 02

  That's why I carry my gun.

• 2:12:34Joe Rogan?

  That's probably better.

• 2:12:36Speaker 02

  That's the battery, the battery.

• 2:12:37Joe Rogan?

  This is heavy.

• 2:12:38Speaker 02

  So, it's, so when I gave up, I've always.

• 2:12:41Joe Rogan?

  Can I take a pull of this?

• 2:12:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, so it's the top, the top button, yeah, press it and just suck.

• 2:12:45Joe Rogan?

  What is the flavor of this?

• 2:12:47Speaker 02

  Uh, tobacco-ish.

• 2:12:48Joe Rogan?

  Tobacco-ish?

• 2:12:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's tobacco, basically, so.

• 2:12:57Joe Rogan?

  That was a little hit.

• 2:12:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, you kinda got a.

• 2:12:58Joe Rogan?

  You take a big one, right?

• 2:12:59Speaker 02

  Let it warm up a little bit, let it, yeah, press the button and then, yeah, there you go, it's crackling, yeah, yeah, go, go, go, go, go. There you go.

• 2:13:11Joe Rogan?

  That's definitely different than the gas station ones.

• 2:13:14Speaker 02

  Oh, you don't want those. This is organic juice. It's got 0.3% nicotine. I wind my own coil made out of silver. The cotton is American-made cotton, not from China. No, I've got into this.

• 2:13:30Joe Rogan?

  Cotton? What's the cotton for?

• 2:13:31Speaker 02

  So, if you look at the mechanism, see?

• 2:13:36Joe Rogan?

  Okay.

• 2:13:37Speaker 02

  So the cotton sucks up the juice and then the coil warms up.

• 2:13:40Joe Rogan?

  So the cotton's like the filter?

• 2:13:42Speaker 02

  No, the cotton has the juice in it and then when the coil warms up, it creates the vapor from the juice that's in it.

• 2:13:48Joe Rogan?

  So do you have to constantly refresh the cotton?

• 2:13:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:13:52Joe Rogan?

  And so you just dunk your cotton in the juice?

• 2:13:54Speaker 02

  No, no, no. No.

• 2:13:56Joe Rogan?

  The juice is inside?

• 2:13:56Speaker 02

  It's in the tank, yeah. It has little wires in there, so it crawls up.

• 2:14:00Joe Rogan?

  And so you just put new cotton in every now and again?

• 2:14:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, and winds a new coil from time to time.

• 2:14:03Joe Rogan?

  How long do you have to wait before you put new cotton in?

• 2:14:05Speaker 02

  It depends. I do it usually once every couple of days.

• 2:14:09Joe Rogan?

  That doesn't give me the weird head rush that the gas station ones do.

• 2:14:12Speaker 02

  That's Chinese crap.

• 2:14:13Joe Rogan?

  That's what I like, though. I like that weird head rush.

• 2:14:16Speaker 02

  Good luck to you.

• 2:14:17Joe Rogan?

  I like the first hit. That's what you like off those, the gas station vapes. It's like you're chasing a dragon. You get that first hit and you're like, first hit's like, ah, so relaxing. And then after that, you never get that again.

• 2:14:30Speaker 02

  So I really got into this. There was a store in Fredericksburg called Vaporicious. They've retired now. They've retired. Jerry and Kathy, and they're two old hippies from a...

• 2:14:42Joe Rogan?

  Why do they make it so unwieldy?

• 2:14:44Speaker 02

  Well, you can get all kinds of different versions, but I'm a serious user, so I need this whole battery. I have a whole kit with me, man. I got a screwdriver to open this up and put a new battery in.

• 2:14:53Joe Rogan?

  And that doesn't fuck with your lungs or your health or anything like that?

• 2:14:56Speaker 02

  No, I've never felt this good.

• 2:14:58Joe Rogan?

  Okay, and so this is different juice. So what is the ju... Because the thing about the actual oil is the issue, right?

• 2:15:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:15:05Joe Rogan?

  And this is a thing like a lot of these cheap ones that you're buying off the gas station.

• 2:15:08Speaker 02

  You don't know what's in there. This is glycol, which is, it's essentially the same stuff that's in the theatrical mist machines.

• 2:15:15Joe Rogan?

  Okay.

• 2:15:16Speaker 02

  Only much watered down. And all it does is just produce vapor. And so what is vapor? Well, it's mainly water. And of course, you're mixing it with nicotine. And nicotine, you know, that's the piece that I've always liked. About smoking, but now I don't get the tar, I don't get all other contaminants and I also don't get high, you know, I stopped, I kinda stopped. I used to smoke a lot of weed. I stopped, it's just, I haven't felt like doing it anymore, you know, like a glass of wine, but no, and so this, I do have gorilla grip on it, it's like everywhere I go, I'm like, where's my vape, where's my vape? So I'm fully, fully aware I'm addicted to more the, the

• 2:15:59Speaker 02

  motion of it, because all, I mean, I would, I would roll up, you know, I could roll them with one hand behind my back, I've been doing it so long. So a real spliff with tobacco, with weed, and then it would go out and I put it down and I come up, pick it up again. At a certain point, it was like three in the morning, I'd wake up like, I think I'll go, roll a, roll a joint, you know, I smoke a whole spliff, go back to bed. I mean, it got to be a little, I was smoking a lot, you know, and without it, I'm very productive, Joe.

• 2:16:29Joe Rogan?

  Isn't that crazy?

• 2:16:29Speaker 02

  I gotta tell you, I'm super productive, I'm doing all kinds of things.

• 2:16:33Joe Rogan?

  Nicotine is very good for productivity.

• 2:16:34Speaker 02

  And for me.

• 2:16:35Joe Rogan?

  As is caffeine.

• 2:16:36Speaker 02

  It can, well, those, those are my two drugs, you know, caffeine and nicotine. I, I kinda, I kinda dig it, I really do, it's nice.

• 2:16:43Joe Rogan?

  They're very good for productivity.

• 2:16:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, is it, is there any bad stuff? I mean, I know it constricts your blood flow in your mouth and in other parts probably, I mean, obviously you're putting something in your stream, so it, I don't know, but you like those, those pouches?

• 2:16:57Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, I do, but I, I wanted to see what happens if I took time off and I went out of the country for five days and didn't bring them, and I was fine. Didn't bother me at all. I was like, I was, I was wondering if I'd be like itching for one.

• 2:17:10Speaker 02

  Like, I'm okay on the plane, I can fly to Europe, I'm like, you know, I'm, I'm okay, I don't, I don't need to vape.

• 2:17:15Joe Rogan?

  Can you go in the bathroom and just get a quick one in there on the plane?

• 2:17:19Speaker 02

  You know, this is a very bad idea. You do not want to be caught vaping on the plane.

• 2:17:24Joe Rogan?

  Oh, really?

• 2:17:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, of course.

• 2:17:26Joe Rogan?

  Will that set off a fire alarm?

• 2:17:28Speaker 02

  Um, I don't know.

• 2:17:30Joe Rogan?

  Can you blow it right into the toilet?

• 2:17:31Speaker 02

  Uh, no, you can do what they call zero, zero, zero vape, which is basically you inhale and you just hold it in.

• 2:17:38Joe Rogan?

  Until the air goes away.

• 2:17:39Speaker 02

  Until nothing comes out.

• 2:17:40Joe Rogan?

  Oh, wow.

• 2:17:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, or, you know, I've done one of these, like.

• 2:17:43Joe Rogan?

  And then go under your jacket? Yeah, I know, I've seen people do that at the movie theater and stuff.

• 2:17:47Speaker 02

  That is, that is not approved behavior, so I do not condone that, you know. It's okay, I can handle not, not vaping for eight hours.

• 2:17:56Joe Rogan?

  So what's in the gas station ones? When you're getting that?

• 2:17:59Speaker 02

  Who knows?

• 2:17:59Joe Rogan?

  What's in the oil?

• 2:18:00Speaker 02

  Who knows? It, who knows? That's maybe what killed some people early on in COVID, you know? It might have been bad, a lot of THC, of course, these pre-made cartridges. You just don't know what's in it. It's like, no, don't, don't vape that stuff. Do not vape the pre-made things. I mean, this is fun. You get to learn how to do it, it's manufacturing, you know? It's a, you get into, I can really get into it, like, I got this, this diameter silver wire and fi- you know, you do five, um, five loops or six loops for different impedance. Oh, yeah, there's a whole, I mean, this tank, you know, this thing is like, it's, you, you try different, I have, must have 18 different vapes that I've tried, like, this is the one.

• 2:18:43Joe Rogan?

  Somebody gave me one at one point in time, it was like, it was carrying around a phone. It was like I was carrying around, it was the size of your flip phone.

• 2:18:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:18:50Joe Rogan?

  And I was like, this is ridiculous.

• 2:18:52Speaker 02

  That's me, baby. That's me.

• 2:18:54Joe Rogan?

  I don't want to have another heavy thing in my pockets or in my fanny pack, it's like.

• 2:18:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, this is, this is okay, I mean, it's all right, and then this thing.

• 2:19:02Joe Rogan?

  But you decided that the phone was too invasive even with the graphene OS.

• 2:19:07Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:19:08Joe Rogan?

  And you had a.

• 2:19:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, because you could still do everything, just not being tracked, and, and so I used to go to bed, you know, we'd go to bed at the same time, you know, we, we always watch some stupid, like, we're in season seven of Seinfeld right now, you know? So we'll watch a half hour of stupidity and, and then we go to bed, and I used to be on my phone, you know, for half an hour scrolling stuff or whatever, and then, you know, okay, I'm tired, yeah, because my brain has been working overtime on whatever inputs I'm giving it, and now. Now I'm like, well, there's nothing to scroll, so I just go to bed and I'm out in three seconds. I'm like, I sleep. And I sleep all the way through and I wake up in the morning, I'm refreshed, I feel good. I don't look at social media the first hour I'm up. I mean, I do Bible readings and stuff and devotionals and my text a buddy of mine.

• 2:19:55Speaker 02

  And I'm ready, man.

• 2:19:56Joe Rogan?

  Do you do social media in the morning?

• 2:19:59Speaker 02

  No, no, almost not at all.

• 2:20:01Joe Rogan?

  So when you do it, you do it from a computer? If you check it out at all?

• 2:20:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:20:06Joe Rogan?

  And when you do that, one of the questions I had about that, does that do voice to text?

• 2:20:11Speaker 02

  It can.

• 2:20:11Joe Rogan?

  From Andrew? Oh, that's a game.

• 2:20:13Speaker 02

  However, of course, when you do that, Google is basically keeping your transcript. There's a company in Austin called Futu.

• 2:20:22Joe Rogan?

  Wait a minute, so if you just text, it doesn't keep your transcript?

• 2:20:25Speaker 02

  Oh, I'm sure it does, but if you, I'm not sure what, how much of that it does, but when you read, when you speak into it, it goes to the Google servers, the Google server then transcribes it and sends it back to your phone. It's not happening on the phone. It's happening on Google servers and they probably keep all of that, or my voice, or whatever. There's a company in Austin called Futu, F U T O. And they have an open source voice to text system that don't keep your transcripts. And they're some good guys, I've been messing with that. It's not quite as fast as Google.

• 2:20:57Joe Rogan?

  Would that work on that phone?

• 2:20:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, you can install it, yeah, just as an extra keyboard.

• 2:21:01Joe Rogan?

  But do you ever send messages with Google Voice or with, with voice to text on that phone?

• 2:21:06Speaker 02

  I've been using Futu.

• 2:21:08Joe Rogan?

  Oh, you have, on that phone?

• 2:21:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:21:10Joe Rogan?

  So I use it on my phone all the time, like when I'm in my car, I press the little button to, for Apple Series.

• 2:21:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, so, you know, who knows what Apple's doing with that, you don't know.

• 2:21:19Joe Rogan?

  Sending it right to China, all the memes.

• 2:21:21Speaker 02

  Maybe, maybe, I don't know, it's alright, it's okay. So I went to Boston, you live in Boston, didn't you? So we went to go see the Doobie Brothers and...

• 2:21:33Joe Rogan?

  When was this?

• 2:21:34Speaker 02

  Last year.

• 2:21:34Joe Rogan?

  Really, they're a lot, they're around.

• 2:21:36Speaker 02

  Yes, and it was wild, it was, it was in Massachusetts, it was one of these, you know, like amphitheaters that's half covered. And we were the youngest people there. And people were sparking weed, you could smell the whole, they're like 80-year-old dudes smoking Doobies, it was amazing. And the Doobie Brothers play, and it was like, what this, it was, the first 45 minutes is...

• 2:22:02Speaker 02

  Damn dude, this is from our album from five years ago. Dude, we want China Grove, you know, you know, give us Long Train running. So eventually they get into that, but then they would like Michael McDonald, What a Fool Believes. You know, I love that song. He would do it syncope like what instead of doing the song like we all remember it. He'd do what a fool believes like, no, no, don't do that. It was really disappointing, but the opening act was Steve Winwood. Steve Winwood's now almost 80 years old and I get goosebumps just thinking about it. He railed, he wailed, he did, you know, Mr. Fantasy from Traffic.

• 2:22:40Joe Rogan?

  Sure.

• 2:22:40Speaker 02

  Which that's three quarters of that song is guitar solo. And he's just like, and go and the crowd is going nuts. And he has all these young kids with him and you could, you see the close up on the screens and they're like, dude, look at, look at what he's doing. It was amazing. I bring it up because the next day, did you go back up to Plymouth?

• 2:23:03Joe Rogan?

  Did I go to Plymouth?

• 2:23:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:23:04Joe Rogan?

  Massachusetts, sure. Plymouth Rock?

• 2:23:06Speaker 02

  Right. So Plymouth Rock is kind of disappointing because it's like, it's a rock. It's just a rock and there's a structure around it and like, okay, you know, it's a rock. And there's a little sign next to it that says, um, we don't know that this was really the rock, but some guy in church who was 90 years old at the time said, yeah, I think this was the rock. So that's the rock. You were talking about the Georgia guide stones a few episodes ago with somebody. Did you know that we have an actual guide stone in America in Plymouth?

• 2:23:38Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 2:23:38Speaker 02

  It's called the Monument to the Forefathers. I'd never heard of this. It's about two blocks in and it's, I think arguably the largest granite structure in the world, in America certainly, but maybe in the world. It was completed in 1890 and it is the guide stone of America.

• 2:23:57Joe Rogan?

  And if you. How do I not know about this?

• 2:23:58Speaker 02

  No one knows about this. This is here, check it out. The thing is huge.

• 2:24:02Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 2:24:03Speaker 02

  And it's literally in a, in a cul-de-sac, a residential area.

• 2:24:07Joe Rogan?

  Really?

• 2:24:07Speaker 02

  There's no road.

• 2:24:08Joe Rogan?

  How old is that?

• 2:24:09Speaker 02

  It was completed in 1890 after 50 years of building it.

• 2:24:13Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 2:24:14Speaker 02

  And so this is the formula for America. This is why I was going before our pee break. The formula for America, this, so they constructed this so that if we ever lost our way. We could find our way back. You know, when they talk about America was built on Christian values, like, what does that mean? What does that even mean, Christian values? I mean, even the word Christian is like, that was actually a slur back in the day that they came up with for Jesus believers. So, in the Middle East faith, that's her name, faith, and it's four sides. And one is law, education, morality, and liberty. And has all these cool inscriptions. It's really something amazing to see. And I believe that's the formula that we need to get back. You actually, you live like this. You're, Joe Rogan lives

• 2:24:59Speaker 02

  these four sides. You live, you understand law, morality, education, and liberty. And if we can get back to that, you know, that would be just, in fact, so all of our, all of our early presidents, all of them lived by the Bible. Every single one of them. They, they wrote about it. They studied it. 1778, the first act, one of the first acts of Congress was to print a Bible for everybody. So I brought you, this is done by a group called the Wall Builders. And David Barton, he has all, this is, these are the receipts. So that's, it's a Bible, but it has, three quarters of that book is writings by our early presidents,

• 2:25:44Speaker 02

  all the way up through, through Reagan. And this David Barton guy, he has all of these originals. I think he lives in Alito, Texas. And it shows you what our code was in the early days, up until the 60s. And that's when, you know, we got this big argument about, oh, we can't have, you know, you know, the whole, the First Amendment is the right to establish a religion. And that has been perverted throughout the years to say, well, you can't have, you know, the Bible in schools, and the government can't tell you to do this, and you can't be talking about, they used, the, the Hall of Congress used to be a church. I mean, that, that's how we started. And you don't have to necessarily be a believer

• 2:26:26Speaker 02

  or saved by Jesus, just to understand where we came from, and the basic tenets of law, where those Guys created it from, you know, the receipts are in the Declaration of Independence. Our, our Bill of Rights, our amendments, our rights, not that the government gives us. You know, they all say the government shall not infringe, the government may not do this. It's what the government could not do because we had rights given to us by our Creator. And I think if we got back to a little bit of that in America, we might get a bit more on path. Which is why certainly all the, all the Jesus freaks are like, ah, President God. President Trump is talking about God. He says God saved him to, to save America.

• 2:27:10Speaker 02

  I mean, this is, a president is a big deal when he does stuff like that. And you can see, just look at the people around us, Russell Brand, Tucker Carlson, Candace Owens. I mean, there's a lot of people who are now starting to see this. And I know you love history, that's why I bought that for you. Because when you see where it comes from, a lot of things start to be clear. And that, that sculpture, that was like, I had no idea it was there. I'd never heard of it, it's not in any books, but it's kind of a template for where we came from. And I think it's, it's kind of important that we look at that as well as, you know, all the other things that we're looking at now with AI and social media.

• 2:27:50Speaker 02

  And we can't just be sitting around for four years going, yeah, Trump, yeah, Elon, stomp the libs. We've got to find some spirituality, one way or the other. It doesn't have to be God, I would like it to be, but people got to find that.

• 2:28:04Joe Rogan?

  I think you're saying some wise things. And I think that people need some sort of a moral and ethical structure to live their life through. Jordan Peterson always has this thing, like, whether or not, if you believe in God, if you live like you believe in God, you follow, but you will live a better life. And that is true.

• 2:28:23Speaker 02

  I believe it.

• 2:28:24Joe Rogan?

  I think that's true.

• 2:28:25Speaker 02

  I believe it, absolutely. And it's, it's very simple things. Yeah, it's very simple things, you know, it's, the Ten Commandments aren't that hard, you know. It's like, that's your, that's your law. If you believe that government, I mean, government is an extension of, of God. If you believe that he instates governments, and I think that. I think that God gave us Joe Biden for four years. I really do. He said, y'all gotta take a look. He has humor too, by the way. Like, you should take a look. And there's a story, I think it's Daniel, about King Nebuchadnezzar. And King Nebuchadnezzar, he did not follow God's law.

• 2:29:06Speaker 02

  And so God turned him into a donkey, basically, and he was out grazing for seven years, eating grass. I'm like, that sounds a lot like President Biden, that he just turned him into a grass eating donkey who had nothing left, you know? So, this...

• 2:29:21Joe Rogan?

  Well, you have to see what happens when things go sideways, to really understand it. That's why people who grow up in poverty really can appreciate success a lot more than someone who's a trust fund kid, right?

• 2:29:33Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 2:29:33Joe Rogan?

  You have to know what it's like when things go bad. And our country just experienced four years of being governed by people other than the elected leader. And it's pretty clear now.

• 2:29:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:29:44Joe Rogan?

  And, you know, the way Mike Johnson laid it out, that Biden didn't know what was in some of the executive orders.

• 2:29:49Speaker 02

  I didn't sign that, yeah.

• 2:29:51Joe Rogan?

  Which is kind of crazy.

• 2:29:52Speaker 02

  Crazy, man.

• 2:29:53Joe Rogan?

  I mean, it's interesting, because some of that, like, how much can you attribute it to faulty memory? And how much of it is actually they passed things by his desk? I don't know. But, at the end of the day, we got to see that this was not a good direction. This is a terrible direction. And I think that was like, one of the biggest mistakes that Kamala Harris did. Was when she went on The View, and they asked her, "What would you do differently?", and she said, "Nothing",

• 2:30:14Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:30:14Joe Rogan?

  Which is crazy.

• 2:30:15Speaker 02

  But also, look at President Trump. I mean, can you take a more wrong guy in the auspices and the opinion of presidential and everything? And he learned a lot during his first term. I mean, this was a turnaround of epic proportion, epic proportion. And I know lots-

• 2:30:35Joe Rogan?

  What's the biggest political comeback in the history of the world?

• 2:30:38Speaker 02

  It'll be in the history books. This show will be a part of that. It's going to be incredibly important for us to look back on this, because, you know, like, it's often the misfits. You know, that's who we've got to love the most. So when I see the blue-haired people, I'm like- Like, I really wanna love them. They probably wouldn't understand it, but.

• 2:30:59Joe Rogan?

  Crazy, chaotic energy. If they just found something they loved and pushed it into that, they'd be better off. But it's also, it's like, what damaged them up into that point? Like, what kind of a life did they live that left them in this place where they're thirty five years old, weeping in front of a city council meeting? Like, who are they and what went wrong? And this is the thing, is like, we kind of encourage this victim mentality.

• 2:31:21Speaker 02

  We do.

• 2:31:22Joe Rogan?

  And we reward it. It has social credit to it. And you, you know, you get to be in a special class of people. And you get to say outrageous things. And people allow you to. And that's not good for anybody. Just like, you have kids. You know what it's like.

• 2:31:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:31:37Joe Rogan?

  It's not good for kids. Like, you gotta tell them, like, well, that's not real. You can't do that. That's not yours. Like, there's things that you have to learn. And if you reward victim mentality, then people look to become victims. And so that, like, when that lady laid out all of her fucking physical ailments and all of her problems, as if that makes any of the things she's saying make sense, because she has all these problems. Like, no, that's not, that's not how the world works.

• 2:32:04Speaker 02

  You're right. It's been rewarded and it's been rewarded by political operations, mainly to get votes and to bring. These people have a vote, too, you know?

• 2:32:13Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:32:14Speaker 02

  They can vote, so bring them in.

• 2:32:15Joe Rogan?

  This is a part of the psyop of USAID.

• 2:32:18Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:32:18Joe Rogan?

  And the psyop of just the government in general, these control structures that are essentially put in place to make sure that they remain in power.

• 2:32:27Speaker 02

  You know John Perkins?

• 2:32:28Joe Rogan?

  Yes.

• 2:32:29Speaker 02

  Have you ever had him on?

• 2:32:30Joe Rogan?

  No, I have not.

• 2:32:30Speaker 02

  Oh, man. Cause he wrote about this, you know.

• 2:32:33Joe Rogan?

  Economic hitman.

• 2:32:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, confession of economic hitman. Wow. I mean, basically, USAID, that's what they do, but also State Department. So, you know, Marco Rubio seems like a good guy. I'm kind of liking him, but they've got intelligence units inside there. There's all kinds of things that happen with State Department. So I hope that also gets uncovered.

• 2:32:53Joe Rogan?

  Well, Mike Benz was explaining yesterday. I was like, this is, seems so intertwined. Like, how are you gonna, what can be done in four years? He goes, no, this is gonna take fifty years. More. It's gonna take forever to unwind. He goes, you have to understand how deep these tentacles go. And he laid it out in four and a half hours yesterday. I probably talked for three minutes for the whole podcast. I'm not kidding.

• 2:33:17Speaker 02

  With Mike, you gotta like, can I get the transcript of this show and go over it slowly? Cause he goes fast, man. He goes fast.

• 2:33:23Joe Rogan?

  The thing that will happen is viral clips of specific things that he highlights and says that are very significant are gonna go out. And those are already out. And I'm sure they're all over X right now as we're speaking.

• 2:33:35Speaker 02

  And I love that Doge is, I was skeptical because, you know, we heard of this during the Reagan administration. Reagan wasn't gonna do all this. He was gonna make government efficient, and of course it didn't. When I hear that they're gonna do the same thing to the military, amen, man.

• 2:33:50Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Well, they have to be accountable to, to an audit.

• 2:33:53Speaker 02

  Yes. They haven't done one ever.

• 2:33:55Joe Rogan?

  Well, the Pentagon's failed seven of them. And the, the thing is like fraud's real. We know it's real and we know people are pilfering. And if you go unchecked for long enough, that becomes a part of the way people do business. And once that's established, and it's been established for decades, then it's very difficult to stop. Because as soon as you start investigating it, people go to jail. And so they're gonna try to stop you from investigating it. They're gonna, they're gonna try to like bury records and it's gonna get wild.

• 2:34:24Speaker 02

  As, as I'm sure Mike told you, and I can't wait to see it, it's not just fraud. It's, it is the actual system. Instead of us being open and I think like Trump is doing, like, hey, we're just gonna have tariffs on you. NATO, you don't like it? Boom, we're not gonna protect you. Uh, you know, we're gonna be fair about this. You can't just be ripping us off. We've been doing all these subversive things with money that's just going to NGOs and nonprofits. I mean, the whole Ukraine thing.

• 2:34:52Joe Rogan?

  He highlighted all of this.

• 2:34:54Speaker 02

  Did he, did he play the Victoria Nuland recorded phone call?

• 2:34:57Joe Rogan?

  No, he didn't. But he showed the Biden thing where he said, you know, the prosecutor had to be fired or they wouldn't get the billion dollars in loans.

• 2:35:04Speaker 02

  Right, right.

• 2:35:05Joe Rogan?

  And son of a bitch.

• 2:35:07Speaker 02

  Well, Victoria Nuland in 2014, the Russians, I think, they released it, they recorded a phone call and she's literally talking. To the ambassador, okay, we want to put this guy in the government, that guy in the government, this guy in senate, Klitch, leave him outside, he can be the mayor or whatever. I mean, that's, that's not cool. We have some stuff to repent for when all this comes out. And we should pick ourselves up and move forward and just be honest. I think we, I think we can do it with a lot of honesty, too.

• 2:35:35Joe Rogan?

  I hope so. But the problem is, there's a lot of people that are going to be in deep trouble. And they're going to try to stop that from all this accountability.

• 2:35:43Speaker 02

  Was Mike bullish or bearish on it?

• 2:35:46Joe Rogan?

  Well, he's, you know, he's in the storm, you know, it's like, you don't, no one knows exactly what's going to happen when you're in the middle of the hurricane, you're telling people what's going on. And that's where he is right now. I mean, I asked him, how do you sleep? He goes, I don't.

• 2:35:58Speaker 02

  He needs prayers. He needs some prayers, for sure. We'll cover him.

• 2:36:02Joe Rogan?

  And I think his, uh, his fight is very noble. And he's right. He's right, and he's accurate. And the, the amount of information that guy's got in his head is astounding.

• 2:36:12Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:36:12Joe Rogan?

  And, uh, he can, I mean, he's pulling it all off the top of his head while we're talking because he lives this constantly.

• 2:36:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:36:18Joe Rogan?

  You know, he used to work at the State Department, uncovered all this stuff, been chasing it down forever. And he is a, you know, legitimate historian on this.

• 2:36:27Speaker 02

  And it's, and thank you for giving him that platform. He's, and thank you for giving Trump a platform and all the things you've done. But the people, when they think of CIA and, you know, these types of agencies, they always think, you know, dart guns and, you know, secret stuff. But no, it's really subversive writing articles. And my whole family kind of comes from military and intelligence background. So I've heard, you know what I learned? This is crazy. So my uncle was big in the CIA. He was, he was the national, he was basically Tulsi Gabbard to, uh, Bush Senior when he was VP. And then, you know, like, uh, Iran-Contra happened and, you know,

• 2:37:05Speaker 02

  he basically became ambassador to Korea. Um, he was exonerated, but he was moved out to a different post. My, my aunt passed away a couple of years back. And when my cousin was doing her eulogy, she said Aunt Meg was actually outranked Uncle Don in the CIA. She ran the Russia desk, spoke fluent Russian, but had promised never to tell anybody, not even her own kids. I'm like, what? Aunt Meg spoke fluent Russian and ran the Russia desk for the CIA and outranked Uncle Don? Like.

• 2:37:44Speaker 02

  That's some crazy stuff, crazy. And all those folks, you know, they remember Russia as the real, real bad guys. I mean, I went to, um, this is my own USAID story. So in 1988, I think it was, we had the Moscow Music Peace Festival. Do you remember that?

• 2:38:00Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 2:38:01Speaker 02

  Um, and this is before the wall came down and it was, uh, I was the only MTV person who went. We went on a 727 from Newark. It was Ozzy Osbourne, uh, basically Black Sabbath. It was, uh, Bon Jovi, Motley Crue, Skid Row. We stopped in Germany to pick up the Scorpions.

• 2:38:20Joe Rogan?

  What was that flight like?

• 2:38:22Speaker 02

  Dude. So here, dude, dude, this, you'll love this.

• 2:38:28Joe Rogan?

  Look at you guys.

• 2:38:29Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, there you go.

• 2:38:31Joe Rogan?

  Wow.

• 2:38:31Speaker 02

  So the reason-

• 2:38:32Joe Rogan?

  You were filming things even back then.

• 2:38:34Speaker 02

  So the reason this happened was-

• 2:38:38Joe Rogan?

  Look at you.

• 2:38:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah, there you go. Tico Torres from Bon Jovi. I mean, so Doc McGee, who was the manager of Bon Jovi and Motley Crue. His, uh, I'm, I'm paraphrasing the story, but I'm pretty sure it's correct.

• 2:38:54Joe Rogan?

  That was Ozzy. I just realized that was Ozzy and Sharon Osbourne. Like, who are those people?

• 2:38:58Speaker 02

  Look at Sharon, look at Sharon. She's like a-

• 2:39:01Joe Rogan?

  A kid.

• 2:39:02Speaker 02

  And like a, a British housefrau, nice roly poly, she's not the, no O face for her. So-

• 2:39:09Joe Rogan?

  O face?

• 2:39:09Speaker 02

  Ozempic, yeah. So-

• 2:39:12Joe Rogan?

  Look at Ozzy.

• 2:39:16Speaker 02

  So Doc McGee's Learjet had been caught smuggling in like, you know, bales of, of marijuana into Florida. And his get out of jail free card was he was supposed to organize an anti-drug and alcohol concert in Moscow.

• 2:39:35Speaker 02

  Right, so this is where I'm pretty sure USAID came into it and the CIA. And so this was supposed to be a complete drug-free, alcohol-free, we're all gonna go there, we're gonna do a huge one-night concert, we're there for a week. On the plane, Ozzy is so drunk. He, he's so drunk. Yeah, so we're in the back there and he's, he's at the, at the lavatory mid, mid, mid plane. And it's someone else is in there and he's like, "Shh, shh, shh." And she'd go, "Oh, Ozzy." And he pees his pants right there in the aisle. Like, holy crap. Ozzy peed his pants.

• 2:40:19Speaker 02

  "Shh." So, this was a wild trip. And I got a briefing beforehand by some dudes in suits. I, you know, this is 88, so I don't, you know, I wasn't really thinking USAID, CIA. And they're like, "Here's the deal, you're gonna be there. Do not talk to any women, don't go to any hookers, do not take any hookers to your room. They're all gonna be KGB and, you know, you don't want any part of this and, and there's gonna be, our people are gonna be watching you." KGB hookers? KGB hookers. We actually did go to the hooker boat, which is pretty wild. It was a boat? Yeah, they had a prostitute boat. The ugliest hookers in the world is like, nah, no one's gonna... Pirates. We all, we all kinda went to go check 'em out. We're, we're in the hotel, they, they literally, this is, you know, Soviet Union still, they

• 2:41:04Speaker 02

  literally turned on the heat in that part of the city, it was winter. And the mattresses were made of straw and you had to bribe the lady for a phone call. You'd reserve it 24 hours in advance, you have to give her tuna fish and toilet paper rolls. It was wild. Wow. Middle of the night, I'm with Sebastian Bach from Skid Row. We're outside, we go to Red Square, we're drinking vodka on Red Square at 3:00 in the morning, walk back to the hotel. There's the Moscow Hells Angels show up. And they're on like these Yugoslav motorcycles and they're popping wheelies and falling off. And we're like, "What's going on?" Then this, this Russian official comes up with, he had the really big hats. And he's like, "Tap, tap." Tap on the back of one of the merch trucks and all he wanted was T-shirts.

• 2:41:49Speaker 02

  And so, you know, gave him a whole bunch of T-shirts. Everybody leaves crazy. So we have this concert and the kids are go- they went nuts. Of all the bands, Bon Jovi, Motley Crue, Ozzy. They all knew Ozzy. They could, they were all singing phonetically. They, they, you know. "Crazy Train" they didn't know the words, you know, but "Crazy Train" kind of came out of their mouth. And, and what was-

• 2:42:13Joe Rogan?

  Look at this.

• 2:42:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was in- you can see all the-

• 2:42:16Joe Rogan?

  Can you give me some volume?

• 2:42:17Speaker 02

  There's some military in front, I think. There it is. Look at that.

• 2:42:22Joe Rogan?

  "Flying high again."

• 2:42:32Speaker 02

  Wow. So here's the kicker. The Scorpions had a number one hit, "Winds of Change." "The winds of change." You don't remember the song. And it was the only song they did not write. And that song was the anthem when the wall came down, which happened liter- oh, here you go.

• 2:42:55Joe Rogan?

  The CIA- Did the CIA write a power ballot to bring down the USSR? What?

• 2:43:01Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 2:43:02Joe Rogan?

  Is that real?

• 2:43:03Speaker 02

  I think so. I think so.

• 2:43:05Joe Rogan?

  I don't remember that song. Can we play some of that song and cut it out, Jamie?

• 2:43:10Joe Rogan?

  Play it for us and cut it out. We'll, we'll cut this part out of the show, folks. Just go listen to Scorpions.

• 2:43:16Speaker 02

  What a shame, man. We could be psyopping more Germans.

• 2:43:22Joe Rogan?

  1990.

• 2:43:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:43:24Joe Rogan?

  Wow. Man, it's a good fucking song.

• 2:43:26Speaker 02

  Yeah. A CIA writes his, baby.

• 2:43:28Joe Rogan?

  That's crazy that CIA wrote a banger.

• 2:43:31Speaker 02

  A huge banger. A huge- and the cra- here's the funniest part. So when the wall comes down, this is number one. Like, you know, it was 1990. And, and I think, I can't remember, I think they might have been phonetically singing along with it in Lenin Stadium when we were there. Cause it was, it was a number one hit. It was everywhere, this song.

• 2:43:49Joe Rogan?

  This is a year before the wall came down?

• 2:43:51Speaker 06

  This song was written, uh, after the concert, like in response to the concert.

• 2:43:56Speaker 02

  Okay, yeah, okay. There, you know, I told you I don't have it all right, but- But.

• 2:44:00Joe Rogan?

  But the CIA wrote it.

• 2:44:01Speaker 02

  The CIA wrote it. They had, probably had it in the archives.

• 2:44:03Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god.

• 2:44:04Speaker 02

  The funniest thing was, so huge in Europe at the time was Baywatch. You know, you know the whole, have you ever had Hasselhoff on?

• 2:44:11Joe Rogan?

  No.

• 2:44:12Speaker 02

  There's a funny guy. This guy, he's.

• 2:44:14Joe Rogan?

  He was on Fear Factor.

• 2:44:16Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 2:44:17Joe Rogan?

  He did Celebrity Fear Factor.

• 2:44:17Speaker 02

  Did you like him?

• 2:44:18Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, he was a nice guy.

• 2:44:19Speaker 02

  I mean, I've met him a couple of times, you know, he had to go to the bathroom a lot at the time, but you know, whatever. MTV Beach House, like, his manager be like, David, I think you need to go to the bathroom to get some energy.

• 2:44:29Joe Rogan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:44:31Speaker 02

  Anyway, um, but, so, you know, the story of Baywatch is phenomenal because he self-financed it. Nobody wanted it in America. And it became this monstrous global hit everywhere except America in the beginning. And, you know, he became wildly successful, rich. And Germany is where it was number one. It was just for years, number one Baywatch. And so Hasselhoff, or as they say, der Hoff, is, hallo Deutschland, hier ist der Hoff. Everyone knew him. He was standing on top of the wall with a sledgehammer and he claims that he brought down the Berlin Wall.

• 2:45:09Joe Rogan?

  Was Baywatch a psyop? Is that what you're gonna?

• 2:45:12Speaker 02

  I don't know, but.

• 2:45:13Joe Rogan?

  Oh my god. Well, this is also part of the thing that Mike Benz got into with the music business. That they do sort of finance these, you know, disruptive kind of songs and political movements.

• 2:45:26Speaker 02

  Sure, of course, of course. I mean, yeah, yeah. It's a powerful tool now.

• 2:45:31Joe Rogan?

  That's that, um, the book about Laurel Canyon.

• 2:45:34Speaker 02

  There he is, there he is.

• 2:45:35Joe Rogan?

  Look at him.

• 2:45:36Speaker 02

  He's bringing down the wall.

• 2:45:37Joe Rogan?

  What is he singing?

• 2:45:41Joe Rogan?

  Oh, he was a pop star, right?

• 2:45:42Speaker 02

  Disco hits, he had these poppy hits, yeah.

• 2:45:45Joe Rogan?

  And.

• 2:45:45Speaker 02

  Freedom, baby. I did it. And he's got this glittering jacket on and everything. Awesome. American icon, ladies and gentlemen.

• 2:45:52Joe Rogan?

  Not even glittery, that's an LED jacket. Like, that jacket's got a battery.

• 2:45:56Speaker 02

  And of course, we loved him from Knight Rider, you know, he was a cool dude, you know, he had this, we all wanted a kit, a kit watch, you know, which we now have, of course.

• 2:46:03Joe Rogan?

  Huge overseas, right?

• 2:46:06Speaker 02

  That's it. That was, it was because of Baywatch and he had a whole music career going on and, oh yeah. Oh man. Good times in the old days, bro. Good times. We had so much fun back in the early days.

• 2:46:17Joe Rogan?

  That's so crazy that that song was written by the CIA. That Laurel Canyon thing is really interesting because I really dismissed it at first. I was like, come on, the government didn't have nothing to do with the rock and roll movement, but kinda seems like they did. What is it, Strange Times in the Canyon? What is that book called again? Is that it?

• 2:46:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:46:41Joe Rogan?

  Something along those lines?

• 2:46:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:46:43Joe Rogan?

  It's a weird book, man.

• 2:46:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:46:44Joe Rogan?

  I read the book and I was like, what the fuck? Like, how much of this is?

• 2:46:48Speaker 02

  But you know, when, in the 60s, when the agents were infiltrating Europe, it was all literature, art, music. They were bringing everything they could, art especially, you know, just, and that was really at the time to make sure that...

• 2:47:00Joe Rogan?

  Weird scenes inside the canyon.

• 2:47:02Speaker 02

  To make sure that the Russians didn't take over Europe, you know, there's all these, all these things that they were doing.

• 2:47:07Joe Rogan?

  Well, they also did it with the modern art movement.

• 2:47:09Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 2:47:10Joe Rogan?

  Like Jackson Pollock is a complete creation, which totally makes sense, because I was like, who's paying for this? Like, help me out.

• 2:47:18Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 2:47:18Joe Rogan?

  Like, no, don't you see the way the splatters are like, no, I don't...

• 2:47:21Speaker 02

  That's why we're all questioning you, Joe Rogan. Yeah, what USAID connections do you have?

• 2:47:26Joe Rogan?

  I think I skipped the system. I think somehow or another, they fucked up and let me through.

• 2:47:31Speaker 02

  Look at me, my whole, my whole family's intelligence and military. I was a pirate radio guy in 1983. What the, they must have been like, this guy's lost. We can't, we can't, we can't use him. He'll be no good.

• 2:47:40Joe Rogan?

  I mean, the real kooky people probably think you're my handler or something, because you created podcasts.

• 2:47:44Speaker 02

  That's right, yeah.

• 2:47:45Joe Rogan?

  Because there is that thought that like, this is one of the things that comes up now all the time, and we talked about this on CNN, we're saying that there's a whole financed and backed right-wing ecosystem that's created these podcasts.

• 2:47:57Speaker 02

  Where's my check?

• 2:47:58Joe Rogan?

  Well, this, this is just stupidity. This is the problem where, when you look at some conspiracies, you think, oh, well, that applies to all things.

• 2:48:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:48:07Joe Rogan?

  That, no, there's actually some things that are organic for some weird reason.

• 2:48:10Speaker 02

  What, what I think we'll see, um, you know, the first thing after the election is, we need a Joe Rogan on the left. We need a Joe Rogan. Well, you know, guys, you basically had a Joe Rogan on the left, but you were so crazy that Joe started to think right, you know?

• 2:48:23Joe Rogan?

  They didn't want me. That was the thing.

• 2:48:25Speaker 02

  They didn't want you?

• 2:48:26Joe Rogan?

  But it's, that's all the psy-op working against them, because in the past, they could take someone like me and demonize... them and it would be effective and they could just remove you from the airwaves.

• 2:48:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 2:48:36Joe Rogan?

  And then remove you as a problem because you're not playing by the rules. But now people go, oh, you know what? I think he's the one who's actually telling the truth. Let's stop listening to them. And so then CNN crashes and then faith in mainstream media crashes and faith in podcasts rises.

• 2:48:51Speaker 02

  I think what we'll see though is, and it may come from YouTube, we'll probably see them try to hype someone up to become the Joe Rogan of the left.

• 2:49:00Joe Rogan?

  Oh, they're already definitely doing that.

• 2:49:02Speaker 02

  Who do you think it is?

• 2:49:03Joe Rogan?

  I don't care. Let them try.

• 2:49:05Speaker 02

  All right.

• 2:49:05Joe Rogan?

  But the thing is, it's not going to work unless that person's authentic.

• 2:49:09Speaker 02

  Without authenticity doesn't work.

• 2:49:10Joe Rogan?

  Hear a person long enough, you know what the fuck they're really saying. You know whether or not.

• 2:49:16Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 2:49:16Joe Rogan?

  You know, I'm wrong all the time. I'm, you might not agree with me. That's all great, but I'm not gonna lie. And that's the difference.

• 2:49:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:49:23Joe Rogan?

  And it's a lot of these people are just propagandists and they're also trying to make an argument for something without looking at the other side, which instantaneously, I know now you're propagandizing. Now you're not, you're, now you're bullshitting me.

• 2:49:38Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:49:38Joe Rogan?

  I always try to look at the other side of everything.

• 2:49:42Speaker 02

  I know you do.

• 2:49:42Joe Rogan?

  As a human, I think it's an important quality. As a person who's like broadcasting to millions of people, it's a very important quality. But it's an important quality for human beings. Like know why you think about something like no, is this just a knee jerk reaction? Or is this well thought out? Is, are you being objective? Or are you try, are you captured by this ideology that you're a part of to the point where you're just ignoring? Like this is the thing that I find fascinating about all this USAID stuff. Because there's so many people that are so against Donald Trump dismantling the organization that they're not looking at the craziness of all the propaganda that's being exposed. They somehow or another are gaslighting

• 2:50:22Joe Rogan?

  themselves and all their followers to say that, no, this is aid. People are gonna starve to death. There's food that's rotting. Meanwhile, they, I think, I'm pretty sure even when they passed this thing where they were trying to put a stop on USAID, they gave exemptions for food and medicine.

• 2:50:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, and certain, yeah.

• 2:50:40Joe Rogan?

  So you're hearing these bullshit stories of like food that's rotting now and people are gonna go starving. Everyone's dying of AIDS. Like.

• 2:50:47Speaker 02

  Well, you have figures who people see as authority because they have a million followers and likes and then they'll, they'll believe that and it typically doesn't work. I mean, it's like

• 2:50:57Joe Rogan?

  I think it works, but it works for less people. There's people that want to, they want to be lied to. They want to believe the cult. They want to drink the Kool-Aid. They, they want to.

• 2:51:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:51:07Joe Rogan?

  And that is where they've dug their heels in and now this is where they, they stay.

• 2:51:11Speaker 02

  When you see Rachel Maddow, who has come back, you know, for the first hundred days, she's doing a show every single day and she's blatantly lying. I mean, literally, like, factually, clearly lying. A lot of people won't watch anything. You know, they've been told, uh, Joe Rogan is a part of the bro casting and, you know, the, the, this right wing conspiracy all funded by whatever to, you know, to propagandize and people are going to go over there and they're going to believe what she says. And, I mean, I have family members who, who truly believe that President Trump will take away their social security. Like, he's saying quite the opposite. And by the way, he can't take it away. Only Congress can take it away. USAID, created by executive order by President

• 2:51:53Speaker 02

  Kennedy, can be shut by executive order by President Trump. That's just a fact.

• 2:51:57Joe Rogan?

  Also, what they're doing is they're highlighting, there's people that are supposedly 150 years old that are getting social security.

• 2:52:03Speaker 02

  Awesome. I need some of that.

• 2:52:05Joe Rogan?

  There's some weird shit going on with social security.

• 2:52:08Speaker 02

  But you know what happened? This, I think this is, this is what we're not being told, but I have a lot of cis admin friends. From what I understand, the Doge team, four guys initially, they were in, so the treasury is like our bank account. It's, you know, it's just, it's one system and it sends payments through the Federal Reserve system and they, all they needed to do, January 21st at midnight, they were in there, they got all the payments. They've had that at Mar-a-Lago. They've been, you know, because I've heard this, that they've been going through it like, hey, there's no reconciliation. There's, there's just a payment with no, no purchase order or no confirmation that the work was done. I think at this point, they're just sitting back going, huh, you know, they can, they can release more information whenever they want. Department of Education is going to

• 2:52:52Speaker 02

  be next. You're going to see a lot of Common Core craziness. I mean, remember that, Common Core? Um, the Pentagon, um, I hope they do the State Department too, because there's a lot going on there.

• 2:53:03Joe Rogan?

  It's going to be interesting to see what resistance.

• 2:53:06Speaker 02

  Well, the people who are squealing are the ones you want to pay attention to.

• 2:53:09Joe Rogan?

  Right. Well, that's the thing is that first of all, the one, we were talking about this the other day. Me and my friends are saying, part of the problem is these people can't conspire right now because all their phones are tapped. Everybody that, for sure.

• 2:53:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:53:24Joe Rogan?

  Like if they're investigating you, if they're investigating these things, like the, the power that they have.

• 2:53:29Speaker 02

  Is astronomical.

• 2:53:30Joe Rogan?

  It's crazy. The power that they have to look into people's emails, look into people's phones, find out what text messages they're sending. They can look into your signal.

• 2:53:37Speaker 02

  Pegasus, baby.

• 2:53:38Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, they're looking at everything. So the, the idea that they're not doing that, if they're in the middle of some fucking multi-trillion dollar investigation into rampant fraud, so they know that this is going on, so they can't conspire. And then they also have to worry about people taking deals. So there's gonna be some people that squeal.

• 2:53:54Speaker 02

  Good point.

• 2:53:55Joe Rogan?

  And so then you don't know who's your fucking enemy and who's your friend. And everywhere you talk, you go to have a lunch with someone, he's wearing a fucking button camera.

• 2:54:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:54:02Joe Rogan?

  You could be fucked. And so they're not united right now.

• 2:54:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:54:06Joe Rogan?

  And this is why it's working. And this is why they're able to release all this information and everybody's in this hot panic right now.

• 2:54:14Speaker 02

  Yeah. So they're squeezing them. They're squeezing them because they, they have it all. And thank God for James O'Keefe too, man. He's, he's done some interesting stuff over the.

• 2:54:22Joe Rogan?

  He certainly has.

• 2:54:22Speaker 02

  Over the years, you know, he's like gets people to, it's amazing how many guys will open up when they think they're on a date with a hot chick or a hot guy, whichever, whichever one that happens to be and like, oh yeah, oh yeah, man, I'm doing all this. Yeah, we do, oh, we don't care. We, we just hated Trump and you know, it's like, whoa, these people, they need to learn how to shut up.

• 2:54:44Joe Rogan?

  I think he just got another video that he released today.

• 2:54:46Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah?

• 2:54:47Joe Rogan?

  There was another video today about people going around the Doge system to try to like still, still do the same work.

• 2:54:54Speaker 02

  Bro.

• 2:54:55Joe Rogan?

  Well, there wasn't, there, there was an issue with.

• 2:54:57Speaker 02

  Season of reveal, Joe.

• 2:54:58Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Wasn't there an issue with FEMA releasing, is this true?

• 2:55:02Speaker 02

  Well, so FEMA paid $59 million for illegal, illegal entrance into our country for them to stay at the Roosevelt Hotel, which is double the, the room rate. Have you ever stayed at the Roosevelt Hotel?

• 2:55:16Joe Rogan?

  I did way back in the day. And the Roosevelt Hotel, by the way, is owned by Pakistan.

• 2:55:20Speaker 02

  Yes, right. And it was a dump. It was, everyone was smoking weed in their rooms. I mean, I was there maybe 10 years ago. 11 years ago, I stayed at the Roosevelt Hotel.

• 2:55:30Joe Rogan?

  It was falling apart a little bit.

• 2:55:31Speaker 02

  It was, oh, it was very cheap, you know, right there on 42nd Street. So they were paying double the room rate, but this wasn't, this isn't just in, in the United States. This has been happening all over the world. This is a gigantic scam.

• 2:55:46Joe Rogan?

  Four federal employees were fired Tuesday over payments to reimburse New York City for hotel costs for migrants. Department of Homeland Security officials said the workers were accused of circumventing leadership to make the transactions, which have been standard for years through a program that helps with costs to care for a surge in migration. However, officials did not give details on how the four had violated any policies. But they, they put a freeze on the payments.

• 2:56:12Speaker 02

  He said luxury hotels was kind of funny.

• 2:56:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, in quotes. So, did they definitely do it? So far, so I, wasn't Anderson Cooper disputing it? He was saying yesterday, yeah, he was talking to Sununu, and he called him a dick. Said, don't be a dick.

• 2:56:29Speaker 02

  Go to Chicago, all the hotels on, on the Miracle Mile are all, all migrant hotels. Because it was super good money. I mean,

• 2:56:37Joe Rogan?

  Crazy.

• 2:56:38Speaker 02

  But that's everywhere in the world. That's the same in Europe. A big hotel change, like, you can't get a hotel room because they've got migrants for double the price.

• 2:56:46Joe Rogan?

  Well, this is also something that the Biden administration lied about, because they said the FEMA funds were not being used. But they were.

• 2:56:52Speaker 02

  I'm with President Trump that it's better, you know, when, when Helene happened, what happened there was really beautiful, because every, everything fell down. Even the own, you know, North Carolina's, their, their own state government, no one really was doing anything. And it was funny enough for the first time I've ever seen ham operators actually be successful. But, you know, the helicopter guys were all going out there. Everybody was pitching in, people were driving from all different states to come in and help people. I mean, I, I don't have a helicopter anymore, but I literally called up the airfield. I said, fill them up. Here's my credit card. Fill that one, fill, just fill them up. Fill up until, you know, until this limit that I have. Fill up the, fill up these, I know

• 2:57:37Speaker 02

  what it costs. You burn a lot of money in a helicopter. This was, this is. How America works, it really works well when we help each other out in all kinds of circumstances. And we've become so reliant on the government, so reliant that, you know, Uncle Sam is going to come in and save us. And it turns out, they're not really efficient at it, they're not really good at it. A lot of money gets stuck and flows to other places. We've got to come back to loving our neighbor and knowing your neighbor. How many people don't even know their neighbor anymore?

• 2:58:10Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 2:58:11Speaker 02

  This is critical. This is, and I think you have this, you know, when Clinton was president, everything changed in America. All of a sudden, oh, that's not sexual relations. Oh, you can do that to me, baby. That's not actually sex. You know, all these kinds of things. That sets a tone. It sets a cultural tone. And Trump is setting a cultural tone of, let's get this done. Let's, let's stop getting ripped off by other people, by ourselves, and let's be successful together. And it's a short amount of time. So I hope that...

• 2:58:47Joe Rogan?

  But isn't it interesting that half the country doesn't see it that way?

• 2:58:50Speaker 02

  Well, less than half.

• 2:58:51Joe Rogan?

  Half the country sees it as a constitutional crisis.

• 2:58:54Speaker 02

  Well, that's just, that's just a term. It's not a, it's not a constitutional...

• 2:58:57Joe Rogan?

  I know, but it's interesting. That's what's being... Top FEMA official is fired over payments to New York City migrant shelters. Trump administration fired the Federal Emergency Management Agency's chief financial officer and three others after Elon Musk misleadingly claimed the agency had used disaster relief funds for migrant services. Wait a minute, is this New York Times?

• 2:59:14Speaker 02

  This is just going to be back and forth, back and forth forever.

• 2:59:17Joe Rogan?

  Misleading. What is misleading about it?

• 2:59:19Speaker 02

  Nah, whatever.

• 2:59:20Joe Rogan?

  So let's see here. New York City officials raced to clarify that the federal money had been properly allocated by FEMA under President Biden last year, adding that it was not a disaster relief grant and had not been spent on luxury hotels. Nonetheless, just two hours after Mr. Musk's post, FEMA's acting director Cameron Hamilton announced the payments in question have all been suspended, even though most of the money had already been dispersed and that personnel will be held accountable. But is this a recent payment? And did they put a freeze on payments? Even if the payment had been properly allocated by Biden?

• 2:59:52Speaker 06

  What I was reading is they just pulled the money out of, uh, bank accounts.

• 2:59:56Joe Rogan?

  Who did?

• 2:59:57Speaker 06

  It says Trump administration. Trump revokes $80 million from New York City after threat. I'm seeing this on multiple websites, but I don't know.

• 3:00:04Joe Rogan?

  See, can you go to the title there on Daily News? Oh, hold on, sorry.

• 3:00:10Joe Rogan?

  You just had it there.

• 3:00:11Speaker 02

  That's right here, too.

• 3:00:11Joe Rogan?

  Oh, Trump revokes $80 million from New York City after threat to clawback FEMA cash used to care for migrants. But it's still, it's still money to care for migrants and they still put a freeze on that money to care for migrants.

• 3:00:24Speaker 02

  That's your constitutional crisis.

• 3:00:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:00:27Speaker 02

  We're in a constitutional crisis because of what's happened to our country.

• 3:00:30Joe Rogan?

  But that's, that seems like gaslighting to justify spending $80 million to pay for migrants, which they shouldn't have done.

• 3:00:39Speaker 02

  No.

• 3:00:40Joe Rogan?

  But it is not just that. It's fly these people there, fly them into the country, let them into the country, and then pay for them with EBT cards, with debit cards.

• 3:00:51Speaker 02

  Well, a lot of that was the economics.

• 3:00:52Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:00:52Speaker 02

  I have a friend, former New York banker, and he said, "We always win as long as our population is growing. We will beat China long-term because their population is declining." And he says, "That's why the borders are open, is because we need, you need, it's just like economics. You need more people, and with more people, your economy grows one way or the other."

• 3:01:12Joe Rogan?

  I think it's a multifaceted argument, because I think that's-

• 3:01:14Speaker 02

  I'm just telling you what the bankers say.

• 3:01:16Joe Rogan?

  I think there's some truth to that, but I think also they were trying to buy votes.

• 3:01:20Speaker 02

  That, yeah, I mean, all of that's a part of it.

• 3:01:22Joe Rogan?

  Well, you saw the thing in New York where they were trying to let people who are illegals vote in regional elections.

• 3:01:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, so that's your constitutional crisis, right?

• 3:01:31Joe Rogan?

  That is a constitutional crisis.

• 3:01:33Speaker 02

  Here's the thing that I hope, and I'm working to make this happen, so we have great podcasts, you know, your podcast is, we can't, not everybody can be a Joe Rogan and we can't just all be looking at national news. What has happened at a local level is radio stations, you know, they all got bought up, they're all, you know, consolidated, no one has local programming anymore. There's almost no local newspapers, even local television stations, they're all going away. Now is the time to create a podcast for your town, your burg, your city, your community.

• 3:02:12Joe Rogan?

  Wasn't Gavin Newsom doing that, like, right after the election? Didn't he start a podcast?

• 3:02:17Speaker 02

  Well, I don't know about Gavin Newsom, that's not-

• 3:02:20Joe Rogan?

  I think he did. I think that was their idea to try to combat the podcast like this.

• 3:02:25Speaker 02

  We don't need that. We need local voices. You know, all the advertising locally has been slurped up by Facebook. You know, that's where you advertise. I've started, I've started a local, a local thing in Fredericksburg. And people really love it. They lo- oh, wait a minute, there's something going on in Fredericksburg? And all they have is Fredericksburg rant and raves on a Facebook page. Will you imagine what a mess that thing is? That is crazy. That's no good. Rant and rave now, that's no good. And so, I'm actually, I started a thing called Godcaster.fm. And it's, it's tailored towards helping radio stations do this, but I think churches are content factories.

• 3:03:07Speaker 02

  And they're not just all talking about Jesus and God, they're doing stuff in the community. That's what, that's what churches used to do. You know, and they're doing stuff at the high schools, and you got kids in there. I want a thousand podcasts, you know, within a year, all over America of local people. And it's so easy to do now. It's become so possible. And I think that local communities will even sponsor it. That's the next level, that's my phase two. That's the next level we have to get to, is where people just get a microphone, talk to your city council person. You know, this is nuts. All, all it is, is national news, presented by heads on television. And who needs that nonsense?

• 3:03:45Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 3:03:46Speaker 02

  You know, and you're, you're an exception, and you're really important, but we need to have this at a local level. And it's never been a better, you want to start a podcast and be able to actually make a living out of it? In your local community, I guarantee people will support it. I guarantee people will want to be a part of it. And I hope that that happens. That's, that's what I'm dedicating myself to now.

• 3:04:06Joe Rogan?

  That's awesome.

• 3:04:07Speaker 02

  Getting these local, hyper-local podcasts.

• 3:04:10Joe Rogan?

  That's a great idea.

• 3:04:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:04:11Joe Rogan?

  I think what you're saying is all of it's hopeful, right?

• 3:04:14Speaker 02

  I'm very hopeful, Joe, of course.

• 3:04:16Joe Rogan?

  Which is great. I mean, because being cynical kind of sucks. You know, especially when this really is a very unique time of possibility. There's a lot, a lot of things are happening right now.

• 3:04:27Speaker 02

  It's a perfect time.

• 3:04:28Joe Rogan?

  And it also feels like even to the people that didn't want what Donald Trump is doing, the idea to keep going with what was happening before, where you had someone running for president that never went through the primary.

• 3:04:42Speaker 02

  That was constitutional crisis.

• 3:04:44Joe Rogan?

  That's real.

• 3:04:45Speaker 02

  Right there.

• 3:04:46Joe Rogan?

  The soft coup against Biden, all that. That should disturb you that that didn't, well, it should be good that that didn't work. Cause that's not good for anybody because if they can keep doing it that way, then you never have a primary again.

• 3:04:58Speaker 02

  Well, primaries, of course, are up to the party. It's not necessarily a constitutional thing, but that should tell a Democrat, people who vote Democrat and are part of, I've never been a part of a party. I'm not that interested. I vote for people. Um, but that should tell them something like, there's something bad going on here.

• 3:05:14Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, there's some shenanigans going on. They could have had a primary.

• 3:05:17Speaker 02

  Like, what was it like in DC when you went for the inauguration? Was it just like show business for ugly people? There were a million people all over the place.

• 3:05:25Joe Rogan?

  Million people all over the place.

• 3:05:26Speaker 02

  Was it nuts?

• 3:05:28Joe Rogan?

  It was weird. You know, I did a lot, yeah, very weird. Cause you go into, I went to a lot of these things. I went to a few of these things, like these dinners and stuff, balls. And it's a lot of people that donated a lot of money. And so it's very transactional and everybody's hyper aggressive to get photographs and talk to people. And they, they interject themselves into conversations, interrupt, stand right in front of people that you're talking to and want pictures and want to introduce themselves. And it's, it's very entitled and very transactional. And, but I think that's always been the nature of politics, particularly with people. The reason why they were there is because they donated a substantial amount of money.

• 3:06:05Speaker 02

  A million bucks of poppy.

• 3:06:07Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, which is nuts. Like how much, how did this many people have a million dollars to donate? This is crazy.

• 3:06:12Speaker 02

  Amazing, isn't it? A lot of people got a million bucks. It's like. It's all that USAID money.

• 3:06:19Joe Rogan?

  I don't know what it is.

• 3:06:20Speaker 02

  Well, there are a lot of successful people in the world who have that, who can access that kind of cash, but wow.

• 3:06:26Joe Rogan?

  But there's a lot of hope. It was a very positive, obviously, because the winners were all there, but it was, it was a very optimistic vibe, which felt good. And even the speech, when he gave his inauguration speech, I mean, that was pretty fucking wild.

• 3:06:41Speaker 02

  I love the, I love the black pastor from Detroit.

• 3:06:44Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:06:44Speaker 02

  He was channeling MLK. He was just like going crazy. It was odd. You were sitting maybe like five rows behind Hillary Clinton.

• 3:06:52Joe Rogan?

  Mm hmm.

• 3:06:53Speaker 02

  Did you smell sulfur?

• 3:06:54Joe Rogan?

  I smelled everything. I saw Bill and made eye contact with Bill, me and Bill staring at each other for a while.

• 3:07:01Speaker 02

  He's larger than life, even though he's kind of frail now. I mean, he's still, it's kind of an imposing guy.

• 3:07:06Joe Rogan?

  They're in the room with you, you know, it's like, there, it's a different kind of a celebrity. Like, I remember when I went to see the Rolling Stones at Coda, I was blown away. I'm like, Mick Jack is right there. Like, that's actually him and he's dancing.

• 3:07:21Speaker 02

  And he's this big, his butt's that, that wide.

• 3:07:23Joe Rogan?

  He's a stick, but it's, he's right. You know, he has two trailers that he brings with him that are just a gym.

• 3:07:30Speaker 02

  Oh, it doesn't surprise me.

• 3:07:31Joe Rogan?

  Two of his, he works out every day.

• 3:07:33Speaker 02

  What is he, like 78?

• 3:07:34Joe Rogan?

  He's a thousand years old.

• 3:07:35Speaker 02

  And he had, uh, open heart surgery and all.

• 3:07:38Joe Rogan?

  Like recently.

• 3:07:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 3:07:39Joe Rogan?

  Recently had heart surgery.

• 3:07:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's an amazing guy. Really, truly is.

• 3:07:43Joe Rogan?

  Fucking loves it, man. And they put on a fucking hell of a show. But my point is like, that's one of those things where you're like, I can't believe that's really him. And that's what it's like when you're like looking over there, you're like, holy shit, that's George W. Bush.

• 3:07:55Speaker 02

  Do you think it was the real Biden or the daddy long legs Biden?

• 3:07:59Joe Rogan?

  I think it was a real one.

• 3:08:00Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 3:08:01Joe Rogan?

  I think.

• 3:08:02Speaker 02

  Cause you've seen the daddy long legs guy, right?

• 3:08:03Joe Rogan?

  He wasn't too tall. Yeah.

• 3:08:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was like.

• 3:08:05Joe Rogan?

  That one guy was nuts.

• 3:08:07Speaker 02

  And he's jogging to the helicopter. I'm like, nah.

• 3:08:09Joe Rogan?

  Nuts. Like, I want to know the story about that. Like, is that, is there any paperwork on who that guy actually was?

• 3:08:15Speaker 02

  I'd love.

• 3:08:16Joe Rogan?

  Cause that was not Joe Biden. That's a guy with a mask on.

• 3:08:18Speaker 02

  The mask things are real. I can tell you, I can tell you this from family, from family experience.

• 3:08:24Joe Rogan?

  You could see them online. Oh, from family experience.

• 3:08:26Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 3:08:26Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:08:27Speaker 02

  Uh, in nineteen sixty seven, uh, let's just leave the family members out of it. But someone brought home a colleague from work and the colleague had dinner and had coffee. And then, uh, uh, at dessert, the wife was sitting there, been talking to this person. And then this colleague took off his mask and it was someone who the wife knew extremely well and had no idea. Nineteen sixty seven.

• 3:08:54Joe Rogan?

  Whoa.

• 3:08:55Speaker 02

  So imagine what they can do now. The stuff that that CIA light lady shows on the YouTube video.

• 3:09:00Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:09:01Speaker 02

  That's, I think that's just old. I mean, it's amazing. Sixty seven, that stuff already existed and worked.

• 3:09:07Joe Rogan?

  How come they couldn't get somebody Biden's height?

• 3:09:10Speaker 02

  You know, that's Tina says that too. I said, you know, they just didn't care at that point, just like they needed someone who had his cadence, which I think is harder to do to, to be kind of, you know, like that stumbling, bumbling.

• 3:09:21Joe Rogan?

  Also, like, how many people do you bring this to?

• 3:09:24Speaker 02

  Like, you know. And what is that guy doing now? He needs a broadcast.

• 3:09:26Joe Rogan?

  That guy's dead.

• 3:09:27Speaker 02

  He's, he's got no.

• 3:09:28Joe Rogan?

  That guy's the bottom of the ocean.

• 3:09:30Speaker 02

  What gig does he have now?

• 3:09:31Joe Rogan?

  Took that guy fishing.

• 3:09:33Speaker 02

  I hope not, but it's, it's possible. Yeah. So there's.

• 3:09:36Joe Rogan?

  Who knows?

• 3:09:36Speaker 02

  There's a lot of that going on. I mean, we've spotted throughout the years Hillary Clinton had, I know she had a double. Uh, and it was actually women who noticed it, like she's carrying her handbag on the other shoulder. It's like no woman switches that up. That never happens. And you look at her like, yeah, she does look a little different.

• 3:09:54Joe Rogan?

  But it's also, isn't that a mind fuck though? Cause then you start looking at everybody like, that's not the real one.

• 3:09:59Speaker 02

  Are you Joe Rogan?

• 3:09:59Joe Rogan?

  Yeah. Who's, what happened? Who is it?

• 3:10:02Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's pretty crazy stuff. Yeah. I hope, I hope some of that comes out too, you know? It would be great to know these things.

• 3:10:08Joe Rogan?

  It would, it would be great to stop lying.

• 3:10:11Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 3:10:12Joe Rogan?

  You should stop lying.

• 3:10:13Speaker 02

  Basically.

• 3:10:13Joe Rogan?

  You should not have a fake, I mean, is there some sort of national security explanation that you could give for why you would have to have a fake president?

• 3:10:21Speaker 02

  Well, I mean, holy moly, have you ever seen the Kevin Kline movie?

• 3:10:25Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 3:10:26Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, there it is.

• 3:10:27Joe Rogan?

  Wag the Dog?

• 3:10:28Speaker 02

  There's your... Was it? No, not Wag the Dog. Uh, Dave.

• 3:10:32Joe Rogan?

  Ah, right, right, right.

• 3:10:34Speaker 02

  Exactly, yeah. I mean, sure, I mean, this, this happens all the time, these things.

• 3:10:39Joe Rogan?

  Bizarre.

• 3:10:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, who knows, you know? But, again, season of reveal, we're learning things, we won't learn everything, but we will become a lot wiser, I'm, I'm convinced of it, and I'm excited. I am sixty years old and super excited and very bullish on the future, particularly of the United States, and I'm seeing the influence we're having in Europe. I'm seeing it, people like, "We don't want this," and it's tougher for them. Like, the UK, they don't really have a First Amendment like we do.

• 3:11:08Joe Rogan?

  Right.

• 3:11:08Speaker 02

  So, it's like, you hurt someone's feelings on Facebook, you're going to jail. I mean, so they, they got a lot of work to do. Um, but, you know, I think Germany has a shot, you know, I think, uh, the Netherlands has Gier Wilders, uh, France are really pushing back hard on, on Le Pen and, and, uh, right-wing people, Viktor Orban in Hungary, I mean, there's, there's a, there's, at a certain point, the people will just not take it anymore, and it could get ugly over there, but, they, people are people, I mean, we've had revolutions ourselves, we've been pretty good at it.

• 3:11:40Joe Rogan?

  Yeah.

• 3:11:41Speaker 02

  You know, of course, we got guns, you know, that was a smart move, founders.

• 3:11:45Joe Rogan?

  Yeah, First, First and Second Amendment were both...

• 3:11:48Speaker 02

  The Second Amendment is there to protect the First, as far as I'm concerned, you know, and I, I am, I'm bullish, I really am, I'm excited, Joe.

• 3:11:56Joe Rogan?

  I am too.

• 3:11:56Speaker 02

  Oh, good.

• 3:11:57Joe Rogan?

  All right.

• 3:11:57Speaker 02

  Good.

• 3:11:58Joe Rogan?

  Well, thank you, brother, it's always great to sit with you.

• 3:12:00Speaker 02

  Joe.

• 3:12:00Joe Rogan?

  Thanks for starting this whole thing.

• 3:12:01Speaker 02

  No, brother, thank you so much for what you do, brother, thank you, Jamie, appreciate you guys so much.

• 3:12:06Joe Rogan?

  Um, tell everybody where they can watch No Agenda.

• 3:12:09Speaker 02

  NoAgendaShow.net, uh, you can't watch it, it's only a podcast, it's on all...

• 3:12:13Joe Rogan?

  Or listen.

• 3:12:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, only listen, yeah, only listen, we're too ugly, uh, we don't want, we don't, we don't want you to look at us and get it, and get it on the modern podcast app at PodcastApps.com, that's, uh, so you won't, you, we won't disappear overnight from Apple or some other platform, that's what we want.

• 3:12:30Joe Rogan?

  My man, thank you, brother, appreciate you.

• 3:12:32Speaker 02

  Thank you so much, brother.

• 3:12:33Joe Rogan?

  Bye, everybody.