Marie Forleo: Unlock the Real Reason You’re Stuck (and How to Move Forward)

In this powerful interview, we sit down with a world-renowned coach and entrepreneur Marie Forleo who walked away from Wall Street, turned down Vogue, and built a global business by following one simple rule: if it’s not a full-body yes — it’s a no. We talk about burnout, fear of irrelevance, financial anxiety, choosing freedom over prestige, and why success without alignment just isn’t worth it. If you’ve ever felt trapped by your own ambition, this one will hit home. Links: Follow my Newsletter:⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://siliconvalleygirl.beehiiv.com https://siliconvalleygirl.beehiiv.com/ Companies & Products: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://Marinamogilko.co⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://Marinamogilko.co Instagram: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/siliconvalleygirl/ ⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.instagram.com/siliconvalleygirl/ YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@SiliconValleyGirl⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.youtube.com/@SiliconValleyGirl LinkedIn: ⁠⁠⁠⁠linkedin.com/in/marinamogilko⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://www.linkedin.com/in/marinamogilko/ X: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://x.com/siliconvalleymm⁠⁠⁠⁠ https://x.com/siliconvalleymm

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Progressive's Accident Response can contact emergency services if you're in a major accident. The only thing worse than someone you love being in an accident is not being able to help them. So Progressive is here to help when you can't. So get peace of mind knowing your loved ones are protected with Progressive's Accident Response. Learn more at progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Limited availability in California. Driver is responsible for emergency and towing charges not covered by the policy. Coverage subject to policy terms and conditions.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration blog, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required. Compatibility and availability varies 18 plus.

• 0:56Speaker 02

  You're tens of thousands of dollars in debt, and this thing sounds so stupid and cheesy. You're embarrassed to even say it out loud.

• 1:01Marina Mogilko?

  If you're in your career for 10, 15 years, magical things start to happen.

• 1:06Speaker 02

  I want to just burn it all down. You are either going to endure something, or you're going to enjoy it, right? Who do you think you are? And I sat on the church steps and I cried so hard because I hated my job so much. And I felt like I was going to bring shame on my family if I quit.

• 1:23Marina Mogilko?

  How do you keep this focus? How do you know you're doing the right thing? And not start switching?

• 1:29Speaker 02

  Is there revenue tied to it? Is there profit tied to it? Or are you operating from fear?

• 1:36Marina Mogilko?

  Marie, welcome to Silicon Valley Girls. I want to start with a question that you actually wrote a post on LinkedIn about making 2025 the best year of your life and the principles. How has it been going with the principles? How has 2025 been?

• 1:50Speaker 02

  I mean, so far, it is such a year of transformation for me. And this year's been going amazing because it feels like I'm entering this new phase of a lot more ease, a lot more play. And I've always been a really playful person. And just kind of unexpected ways that I'm showing up for me that feel really good. So, so far. So go ahead.

• 2:10Marina Mogilko?

  Can you share some of the principles that are working for you right now?

• 2:13Speaker 02

  So I think in terms of a principle, it's like really honoring what my nervous system is a big yes to versus what is a big no. You know, I kind of built my career and it was amazing from being in this place of saying, you know, I have this goal, I'm going to set this goal and I'm going to do whatever it takes to achieve it. And that's amazing. That's beautiful. But after having followed that for so long, I started reaching a point where I was like, it doesn't feel good anymore. You know, and the very things that have brought me joy or sitting at my computer all day long or operating a particular way, I was like, ugh, like it feels draining and almost like hitting a point of burnout. And now it's just a principle of really tuning in and slowing down a little bit and asking

• 2:56Speaker 02

  myself, does this idea, whether it's for a product or a service or an offering or hiring someone, or even in my personal life, how does this make my nervous system feel? And if I start feeling a sense of either dread or tightening or like, ugh, this sounds awful, I'm just such a no. And it feels like in many ways for me, my ego is taking a backseat. And ego's great. You know, ego can be a real service to getting us to do things in the world and take a stand for ourselves and believe in ourselves to create something. But I think you might reach a certain point where it feels like it's driving you rather than your true self driving the car.

• 3:32Marina Mogilko?

  Do you think this principle can be applied to someone who's just starting out their career? Because when you were starting, you're like,

• 3:37Speaker 02

  Yeah, absolutely. I think that's a really wise question and I don't know the answer. I think that you have to almost trust what that driving force is inside of you. And I think, you know, when I first started my business, honestly, I was rooted in a lot of excitement and passion for making a difference to other people. And in quite honestly, there was like a lot of fear and failure that was underneath it. You know, I had started my career on Wall Street, on the New York Stock Exchange, and I was super excited to find some way to make like a really good living and to make a difference to other people. But I just kept failing at that. I was not good at working for others. And I remember being on the floor of the exchange and I felt so blessed to be there. You know, I don't come from a lot of money. I was the first in my family to go to

• 4:20Speaker 02

  College. And so I was grateful to have like a steady paycheck and to be able to show up at this iconic center of finance and business in the whole world. But I remember showing up every single day and this little voice inside of me, Marina, kept saying, Marie, this isn't who you are. This isn't what you're supposed to do. This isn't who you're supposed to be. And I was like, I don't want to hear it. You know, like, I need this paycheck. I need the health benefits. Like, I don't have a plan B. But I kept ignoring that voice, ignoring that voice until one day, I remember showing up on the floor and I said to my boss, who was like a trader, I said, hey, you know, I'm gonna go out and grab some coffee. Is that cool? And he was like, absolutely. And I didn't leave to grab coffee. I actually made a beeline towards the nearest church, which was Trinity Church. So I was raised Catholic. I'd just gone to a Catholic

• 5:05Speaker 02

  university. So I was kind of trained to look up when you're having a hard time. And I sat on the church steps and I cried so hard because I hated my job so much. And I felt like I was gonna bring shame on my family if I quit because again, what the hell am I gonna do? Go back to bartending and waiting tables? And so I did the one thing that I was told to do at that moment, which was call your father. And I took out my flip phone, which tells you that it is 1998. And so I'm doing the ugly cry with my dad on the phone. And I was like, I'm so sorry. Like, you and mom worked so hard to put me through college and I just want to quit. And I'm trying so hard. I don't know what to do. And like, in between all my ugly cries, my dad interrupted me. He was like, Ree, you've been working since you were nine years old. You've been babysitting. I'm not worried about you keeping

• 5:50Speaker 02

  a roof over your head. But here's the secret to life. You have to find something that you love to do because you're gonna be working for the next 40, 50 years. And once you find something you love, it's not gonna feel this way. It's like, I don't know how to tell you that. But if you need to leave this job because it's making you this sick that you're running out and crying on the church steps in the middle of the workday, you gotta go. And so that was my permission slip. But, you know, all I knew at that point in time, Was that I felt like I had some kind of gifts to make a difference in the world. And I wanted to create financial freedom for myself. And I didn't know how to do either one of those things. And so I really went through my mind and it was like, okay, I'm highly creative. I thought I was going to be an animator for Disney or a fashion designer. But my dad was also a small business owner, so I loved small business.

• 6:35Speaker 02

  And so those are the only two things I knew. And I was like, what's the combination of creativity and business? And I was like, I know, women's magazines. And so I got a job at Conde Nast Publishing. And it was like an assistant job at Gourmet Magazine, right? So I'm Italian American. I love to eat. It was in the ad sales department and I was like right next to the test kitchen. So all these editors would bring me snacks all day. I was like, oh, my goodness, this is amazing. Not to mention at that time, you know, when I was on Wall Street, it was like 99.9% men. And that was fine, but it was a very unbalanced, unintegrated environment. And so I was constantly like being hit on and I couldn't be taken seriously. I'm like, this sucks. So at the magazine, I was like, my boss was this powerful woman.

• 7:17Speaker 02

  My publisher was this, I was like, oh, my God, this feels like a much more kind of supportive, integrated, dynamic environment. This is going to be great. But like six months into that job, Marina, those voices came back again. It was like, Marie, this isn't who you are. This isn't what you're supposed to do. This isn't what you're meant to be. And I was just like, what is going on?

• 7:35Marina Mogilko?

  Can I pause you for a sec? Because I get these voices, even when I'm doing my most favorite thing in the world.

• 7:41Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 7:41Marina Mogilko?

  And I realize sometimes, or like oftentimes, you love 80% of it, but there are like 20 to 30% that you don't like and you just have to get through.

• 7:50Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 7:51Marina Mogilko?

  Is that where you still think or you think it's going to be 100%?

• 7:56Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no, no. I think in every area of life, every area of business, there are going to be portions that are not your favorite. And so I think it's about proportion and it's about honestly listening. Like, for example, parts of that job, being an ad assistant, like, you know, helping my boss put together presentations and learning about sales elements. Like, there were certain pieces of it that were really fun. But for me, I would say at least 80 to 90% of it, I'm like, this sucks. Like, I don't want to climb this corporate ladder. I didn't aspire to be the publisher of a magazine. So it really helped me. Get honest with me that like this still wasn't it.

• 8:34Marina Mogilko?

  Hmm. So you look at the end, in the end goal, do I like it or do I?

• 8:38Speaker 02

  Exactly. And honestly, like I was also looking from a financial perspective because I was like, how much does she make? You know, like all of the elements. And I was like, well, what am I doing here? If I'm not having joy every single day and I don't want to climb this particular ladder like that's not my rainbow. Does that make sense?

• 8:55Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, well, I feel like a lot of people these days, because you can change jobs, these days you can change so quickly.

• 9:02Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 9:02Marina Mogilko?

  I feel like a lot of people make this mistake of like, I don't like what I'm doing, so I have to change my niche completely and like, go from being a financial expert to like creator in fashion, for example, trying to.

• 9:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, go from like basket weaving to AI or who knows.

• 9:18Marina Mogilko?

  Do you, when do you think it's the right decision? And when do you think people should think about just tweaking the processes? Like maybe delegating something, getting rid of something, but staying in their niche?

• 9:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, absolutely. So if we're looking at this through a business context and you are running your own business, right? If that's what we're looking at through that lens with three businesses. I think it's really important to identify what your genius zone is. You know, we all know the 80 20 rule, right? Where 80% of our results are going to come from 20% of our inputs. And then the inverse, which I think is oftentimes more interesting and overlooked is also true. So 80% of our stress comes from 20% of our inputs. So if you kind of look at and analyze objectively in your business or three businesses, whatever you've chosen. And you start to really get honest between you and you of like, where are the big drains on your psychic energy? Your emotional energy where you're just like, oh my God, stick a fork in my, like, I cannot do this.

• 10:14Speaker 02

  You'll know where those things are that you, if you're in the beginning stages and you cannot afford to delegate it. Well, now we have AI and AI, you know, there's a lot of new tools that have never been available before. Or if you need to hire, delegate it out, find a partner, like there's many different ways to get those things off your plate. I think that realistically for most of us, you know, when I started my business, I was a solo person for probably like five or six years. That was my choice. And so I wore all the hats and I was not. Good at all of them. But once you start getting traction and you start getting revenue in the door and a little bit of profit, if you want to get to that next level, you do have to continue to peel away the things that drain you. Because your genius zone is where you're going to not only find the most joy, the most energy, but it's probably going to create the most value in the marketplace.

• 10:59Speaker 02

  And it's going to give you something that for me has been very, very important, which is longevity and sustainability.

• 11:05Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, this is what I noticed. Because if you're in your career for 10, 15 years, magical things start to happen.

• 11:12Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 11:12Marina Mogilko?

  If you're a good person, if you're hardworking, if you appreciate your art.

• 11:15Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 11:16Marina Mogilko?

  And I see it in the US and it's like such a game changer for me and for a lot of immigrants. Cause they're struggling the first years, but then guys just give it 10 years.

• 11:26Speaker 02

  That's right. And that's what happens if you actually really, really, really genuinely love the thing that you're doing. And you can again carve through that 60, 70, 80% is like joy, joy zone. And then maybe there's the 20% that feels a little bit laborious or it's tedious. And then there's a tool that I like to share called Bring the Party. So this is something that I learned from my folks who are amazing. When we were young and my dad would have these clients who wanted like a rush job and it was all in printing. So again, back in the day, we're talking like the eighties now. And rather than being away from my dad for the weekend, because he had to go handle all this work for the clients. What my parents chose to do is bring my brother and myself to the shop.

• 12:07Speaker 02

  And they would bring a boombox, they would get pizzas and we would literally help my dad complete a rush job, but we would turn it into a party. So he would give us little jobs that were legit jobs, like it wasn't just busy work. And so we felt very engaged in the process. Now, would we want to be working over the weekend? Not necessarily, but this tool of bringing the party is like you are either going to endure something or you're going to enjoy it, right? If you endure something that you have to do, like your taxes, like writing a pitch, any aspect of your business that absolutely must get done and at this stage in the game, you don't have anyone else or you don't have an AI agent or any support to do it. What are you going to do? Are you going to cry in your cereal and then drain all your energy? And then not have anything else to give?

• 12:51Speaker 02

  Your relationships or your health, or you can bring the party and enjoy it.

• 12:55Marina Mogilko?

  How do you bring party to taxes?

• 12:57Speaker 02

  So you can bring the party to taxes. Like if you have any great music, right? That you want, and you're like, all right, I'm going to play my best tunes and I'm going to give myself 10 minutes to just start my taxes. Like I may not have to finish them, but I'm going to have a little party while I do it. Because one of the ways around procrastination, especially for some type of task where you're just like, oh my goodness, I want to do anything else. I mean, you can bribe your friends to come over and do it with you. There are so many creative ways to bring a party to a task. But it's a really wise mental trick to not drain your energy, to get things done. And to really, on a more spiritual and soulful level, say like, this is my whole life. Like if you have to do it, why not enjoy it?

• 13:37Marina Mogilko?

  Can you walk me through the process of determining which task is worth bringing a party to? And which task is worth just dropping and like saying goodbye to completely?

• 13:46Speaker 02

  Oh, absolutely. You know, I think that's going to be so hyper-specific to each person. But I do believe that as human beings in general, especially as entrepreneurs, one of the things we have to watch out for is we start a particular process or we do something every single week. And then especially as you're building a team, everyone gets used to doing the same thing, the way that you've always done it. And whether it's once a quarter, once every six months, or at least once a year, to be able to step back and to ask yourself and your team, do we need to keep doing this thing? Just because we did it before and we thought we've always had to do it, is it really still necessary to continue? I think that's really important for content creators like you and I. Do you, you know what I mean?

• 14:28Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, you're like, maybe it's not bringing this joy. Like, should I continue?

• 14:31Speaker 02

  Yes. And or just because everyone else says you should do it. I'll give you a prime example for me. I remember when 2019 hit, right when my book was about to come out. One of my colleagues was like, Marie, you gotta get on TikTok. And it was like super early days and I just checked in. I was like, nope, not for me. Like I knew it wasn't for me and everyone was screaming at me, you're missing out, you're missing out.

• 14:55Marina Mogilko?

  I remember Carrie was like, TikTok.

• 14:58Speaker 02

  And you're like FOMO and all this stuff. And even now they're like, but aren't you? And I'm like, no. And I think it takes a lot of wisdom and it takes a lot of self-trust. I know we're going a little off that original question. But for most entrepreneurs, if you try and be everywhere and do everything all at once, especially in the beginning, you're going to wind out burning off and burning out really fast and quitting before you hit that magical seven, 10, 12 year mark where everything starts to come together. So I'm a big fan and a big advocate of making business success sustainable because we're living in a time where there's more information, there's more input, there's more data, there's more shiny objects, there's more everything than ever before. And I believe our brains and our bodies and our nervous systems are not quite dealt,

• 15:43Speaker 02

  they're not set up to handle this.

• 15:44Marina Mogilko?

  Not adjusted yet at all.

• 15:46Speaker 02

  So you have to have wisdom then when you go about your journey. And so going back to your original question about, well, how do we discern, you know, what to bring to Barty to, or what to drop or to delegate out? I think really ask yourself, first of all, is this a critical business function? Like, is there revenue tied to it? Is there profit tied to it? Is there any kind of data that proves that you should absolutely keep this going? Or are you operating from fear? Is this a fear rooted thing? Like, if I stop showing up in a particular place, or if I stop offering this particular revenue stream, if I stop doing this, am I going to lose relevance? Am I going to lose money? You know, like, you're kind of operating from a fear base.

• 16:23Marina Mogilko?

  I think it's always both, right? For a lot of pre-hours, yeah, TikTok, I might have had two deals and it's kind of growing.

• 16:29Speaker 02

  Yes. And for some people, there's joy there. Like, but for me, there wasn't. Does that make sense?

• 16:34Marina Mogilko?

  The joy would be the criteria for you.

• 16:36Speaker 02

  Absolutely. I cannot make myself do something I genuinely don't want to do for very long.

• 16:43Marina Mogilko?

  When were you able to mentally allow yourself to do that? Did it come with a certain number in the bank?

• 16:48Speaker 02

  No. So that's why when we were back at, remember Gourmet Magazine and I was telling the story? And I kept hearing that voice like, this isn't you, this isn't what you're supposed to be. So I actually went to, picking up that story, the HR department. I was like, look, I don't think I'm meant to be on the ad sale side. I thought that my creativity was still being underdeveloped and I was undernourished. So I said, I'd love to be on the editorial side of a magazine. If any job position opens up, please let me know, even if it's a pay cut. Something did open up at Mademoiselle magazine. I was like, this is gonna be it. Like, I'm working with fashion designers, photography, photo shoots. So glamorous, so fun. Get that position. And it was fabulous and novel for like six months. And then those voices came back again.

• 17:31Speaker 02

  And I was like, Marina, at this point, I felt like I was broken. I was like, all of my-

• 17:35Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, right? It keeps repeating.

• 17:36Speaker 02

  It keeps repeating. Maybe I have this cognitive deficit. I can't focus. Turns out I am ADHD. I didn't know that at that time. But it was around then that I stumbled upon an article online about a new profession at the time called coaching. Now, again, set in context, this is probably 1999, 2000. And it was all about this world of life coaching, which I will admit, as a Jersey girl, sounded really cheesy, stupid. But there was something in my heart that lit up like a Christmas tree, like nothing else before. So I had one voice in my head say, who do you think you are? No one's gonna hire a 23-year-old life coach. You haven't even lived life yet. You don't have what it takes to do this. Yet, I couldn't deny that my body was so on fire and so tingly.

• 18:21Speaker 02

  It was like the clouds parted and little angels were like, oh, like this is what you're supposed to do. So, cut to, I signed up for a three-year life coach training program that happened at night while I worked at Mademoiselle during the day. And then about six months later, I got a call from the HR department at Conde Nast. They had a promotion for me at Vogue. That was my fork in the road. You're either gonna go to Vogue, more money, more prestige, all the wonderful things-

• 18:47Marina Mogilko?

  The doors open, right?

• 18:48Speaker 02

  All the doors open and people understand what you do. Or you're gonna quit and start your own life coaching business at 23, which you have no idea to start a business. You're tens of thousands of dollars in debt and this thing sounds so stupid and cheesy, you're embarrassed to even say it out loud. Of course, I chose that one because it felt right. Even though it did not make logical sense, I had failed.

• 19:10Marina Mogilko?

  You could have done Vogue, got to meet all these people and then started a coaching business with all the access that you had.

• 19:18Speaker 02

  Yes, but I didn't choose that. I chose the path of like, I cannot work for someone else. I am not built to sit at a desk all day. I cannot do this any longer and keep failing. I will figure out come hell or high water, how to build this weird ass life coaching business that no one's ever heard of, that I am totally afraid of. So your question before was around, well, how does this, how do we develop this ability? Or when did you start developing this ability to listen to joy and have that be kind of the barometer?

• 19:44Marina Mogilko?

  You don't even hear yourself.

• 19:45Speaker 02

  Well, that member you were talking about that you have these voices inside you?

• 19:49Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, I have them all the times. And sometimes the next day I wake up and I'm like, what was that was yesterday? It was weird. Like, I'm glad I didn't listen to it.

• 19:58Speaker 02

  Yes. So this, you actually brought up a perfect point. One of the things that I've noticed over time is if that voice is consistent and keeps repeating, like not just over a day, not just over a week, but it's probably like a few months. And for some of us, it could be a year, you can trust that voice. But all of us, of course, have good days and bad days where we're like, I want to just burn it all down.

• 20:22Marina Mogilko?

  Exactly.

• 20:23Speaker 02

  And we're not going to make emotional decisions and burn it all down, you know, in that context.

• 20:28Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, I feel for a lot of women, like every month you have those days, you're like, goodbye, everyone.

• 20:34Speaker 02

  First of all, that's real. Like, one of the most realist things is the chemicals of hormones and how they impact every part of our experience of living, our decision-making, how we want to burn it all down, if we're crying our eyes out in the corner. And then the next day you wake up, be like, dude, I'm fine.

• 20:51Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  Completely fine. So it's wisdom to not act on that.

• 20:55Marina Mogilko?

  Is there anything that you do every single day or like every week to kind of develop this ear for your body? Is it meditation? Or maybe you work only particular hours?

• 21:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, you know, that has evolved over the years and I always like to pay attention to what I call, something I call my primary project. So the use of time, productivity, getting things done, that's always been. Huge obsession of mine. And then the past five or six years, I've really honed in on some skills and some practices that are rooted in mind science and also just common sense that helped me function at my best, especially as someone who has a very wild brain, an ADHD brain, which I don't think it's a limitation at all. And I've actually been told it's quite a gift and many entrepreneurs have it. So if my primary project, for example, like when I was writing Everything is Figureoutable and I was about to go on book tour,

• 21:44Speaker 02

  it actually involved my book launch, which was my vision. It was a combination of what if a TED Talk, a Beyonce concert and a block party had a baby? That's what I wanted to do. So I wanted to talk on stage. I wanted to dance on stage. I wanted it to be a full concert. And it was amazing. We sold out the Hammerstein Ballroom. It was so much fun. But I had not been dancing in that regard, or my ability to perform, since I was a Nike athlete back in the day. So I was like, okay, I need to train again. So in those times, the morning, like I'm not going to do a super like lengthy morning process of like meditation and journaling and all that stuff.

• 22:22Speaker 02

  I needed to get my ass in the studio and rehearse and perform for like a couple of months because that was my primary project. And other times, like when I was working on writing the book, the most important thing for me to do in the morning was to meditate and write. So it always is contextual and it's tied to whatever my primary project is in that stage and season of my life. Generally speaking, I find that movement and for me specifically dance and weight training are two of the things and yoga. I would throw yoga in there as well. The things that help my channel stay open, for as strange as that might sound. I think that for many of us, we spend so much time looking at our screens and we spend so much time sitting

• 23:03Speaker 02

  and so much time consuming information and podcasts and shows that we're oftentimes out of touch with our physical body. Absolutely. And so that movement practice, whatever it may be, for me clears my mental cache and has me much more receptive to what I like to call downloads, those intuitive downloads, those ideas, those breakthroughs that don't come. Arm grind.

• 23:27Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah. Let's talk about financial stability.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 23:30Marina Mogilko?

  You shared your background, you know, coming from a family, your, your family was immigrated from Italy, right?

• 23:35Speaker 02

  Um, not my parents, but my parents' parents.

• 23:37Marina Mogilko?

  Parents, parents.

• 23:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:38Marina Mogilko?

  You have, you have this immigrant mindset.

• 23:40Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 23:41Marina Mogilko?

  I grew up in Russia. We had one room that was shared with my parents. I could only, they could only afford one apple a week. So it was, and it lasted like that for seven years of my life. And then it was still kind of, we weren't really well off. So when I started making money, until this day, it's really hard for me to say no to brand deals. Just because I'm still that Marina.

• 24:02Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 24:03Marina Mogilko?

  Who's in Russia, whose parents can't afford the food.

• 24:06Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 24:06Marina Mogilko?

  Like, who am I to say no to this?

• 24:08Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 24:09Marina Mogilko?

  And it seems like a never ending game. So this fear of going back to that room never went away.

• 24:14Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 24:15Marina Mogilko?

  I wonder if it ever went away for you or you're still.

• 24:18Speaker 02

  So it's such a great question. It's a really important one because it speaks to something universal that I think all of us, it's useful to face. And it's like, what is enough? And when do you stop? And to answer very, very specifically, there was a point in my career when I remember talking to my financial advisors. And they sat me down and we did all of the different scenarios that you can run. And there's like one name, it's, it's kind of a brilliant name, which I love it. It's called retire tomorrow. And it's just a set of algorithms that they can run based on your investments and your spend and all those wonderful things. And they told me, Marie, you'll never have to work again. And Marina, I didn't believe it.

• 25:03Speaker 02

  And I, you do not like, I, I believed it. I understood I could receive that information, but on a cellular level, I didn't trust it. I didn't trust it.

• 25:14Marina Mogilko?

  Cause financial system can crush. That's my thing. You can tell me whatever you want.

• 25:18Speaker 02

  Absolutely. And so, and, but I also like simultaneously, I know myself, like I'm actually not a big spender. It has taken me personally, a few years, like four to five years to really thaw to the fact that I don't have to work anymore.

• 25:38Speaker 02

  And so it has been, and it continues to be a journey, like a spiritual journey of really tuning in and understanding from a very reasonable, logical place. Yes, of course, the markets could tank, everything could go away. And then I also have to face the reality, like if that world happens, all bets are off. Then we're in like a Hunger Games situation and it doesn't matter what I had in the bank. Does that make sense?

• 26:03Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, but still I'm like, but there will be crypto, there will be cash. I haven't had that, like real estate around the world.

• 26:09Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 26:10Marina Mogilko?

  This feeling of safety, like there's for me.

• 26:13Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 26:14Marina Mogilko?

  There is no level that's enough for that feeling to go away. It's like, sorry, feeling of unsafety. Like I feel unsafe all the time.

• 26:20Speaker 02

  Well, I think that's, and maybe, and this is just an invitation. This is something to consider for you to try on. It might not have to always be that way. It might not have to. Like if you're interested in exploring or going, huh? I'm willing to have that feeling of not being safe melt away and get replaced by something from the inside where my sense of peace and security comes from within. And trust me, I'm not just spitting out inspirational.

• 26:47Marina Mogilko?

  Is that what worked for you?

• 26:48Speaker 02

  Yeah, it actually has because I think one of the things that is really fascinating and kind of useful about coming from nothing or existing in a period where you've got like tens of thousands of dollars of debt is you know what that feels like. And then if you were able to climb out of something like that before, well, that means that you have what it takes to figure it out again.

• 27:07Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, but you're in 20.

• 27:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's all right. I think that there's truth in that. And yeah, you have different energy levels, a different point of life. But what you have when you're older is wisdom and experience and connections, which I didn't have way back then. So I also think what's useful too, what's cool about just going through different decades, we have this assumption sometimes that who you are is who you are, you know? And I'm always going to want these kinds of things and I'm going to want this kind of life. And these my priorities are going to be uber important to me. And I'm always going to want the biggest or the best. Or, you know, you kind of have this notion of who you are and maybe it's fixed. And you're like, I'm always going to be this way. And what life has taught me is that. That's not true.

• 27:48Speaker 02

  But coming back to you, I'm just gonna say that my hope for you, person to person, soul to soul, woman to woman, I know for a fact that you can feel that sense of safety and security from within. That doesn't mean financial situations won't go up and down, but I think it's gonna be such a gift that you'll be able to give to yourself. And I know it's possible if it's something that you that you want.

• 28:09Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, I think it's also something that keeps us going, right? Especially immigrants.

• 28:12Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 28:13Marina Mogilko?

  And you're like, but should I drop this feeling if it's the one that's...

• 28:17Speaker 02

  Oh, that's actually let you are, can we peel into that a little bit?

• 28:21Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah, yeah, let's do it.

• 28:21Speaker 02

  Because that's super fun. There is an idea and a notion that I think many of us have been taught. I've certainly been taught it, that if you don't have hunger, that if you don't keep that hunger alive, that somehow you're gonna lose your edge, that somehow you're gonna fall behind, that somehow you're gonna slip out of relevance. And every single one of those thoughts, at least for me, is rooted in fear. It's rooted in fear of losing something. It's rooted in fear of, again, becoming irrelevant or missing out or falling behind or other people are gonna get ahead or I'm gonna lose everything I worked so hard for.

• 29:01Speaker 02

  And the more I've been pushing against that dogma and testing it, it's not true. It's like creation can happen at so many different levels. And for me, what my experience has been is the desire to create comes less from a desire to prove or keep or retain or clench or hold on to. And it's coming from a much deeper, more expansive and playful and easeful place, which is not something that I'm used to, just to be clear.

• 29:31Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah.

• 29:31Speaker 02

  I'm used to pushing, I'm used to grinding, I'm used to like, get out of my way and I will make it happen. That's useful, that's awesome. But it's almost like, you know how a piano has 88 keys? I've been playing on 44 for the first part of my career, which is that push, that grind. Again, it's useful skills.

• 29:48Marina Mogilko?

  This is what gets you there.

• 29:49Speaker 02

  Yes, that's what we love it. But what if there's a whole other range to play in? And so that's what I'm interested in exploring. I ain't losing that. That's a part of me. That's never gonna go away. But it's kind of like overtraining a muscle. Do you know what I mean? And it gets boring a little bit.

• 30:05Marina Mogilko?

  That makes total sense.

• 30:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, so you have that range. So when you need to push, when you need to grind, when you need to have that hunger, it's like, oh, I can fire that up. That's well worn in me. But what about this whole other side?

• 30:15Marina Mogilko?

  Love it.

• 30:16Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 30:16Marina Mogilko?

  So what's the metric you optimize for these days?

• 30:18Speaker 02

  The metric I optimize for is honestly, like, from a business perspective, I'm like, is it easeful, joyful money? Like, can I show up and create a product, a service, or an offering where it's like in that 80 to 90% genius zone for me? And there is no nervous system dread? If there's something like, oh, all your customers and your audience wants, and they want it so bad, and everybody wants it. I'm like, dude, if I don't want it, it is a psychic, emotional, energetic drain. And at some point, it's gonna be a detriment to the bottom line. It's gonna be a detriment to my ability to serve and my team. Like, everything's gonna go down at some point if I don't obey my inner truth. So from a money standpoint, like, you know,

• 31:01Speaker 02

  and of course, there's the difference between the business side and the personal side. So I think one of the joys at hitting the stage that I'm at is like, I don't have to work for the money. So now I want to reshape things where it's like, oh, I'm working because things are really exciting, because I can bring something to the market, or I can create something that's gonna make my customers' lives so much easier. But I'm gonna do it in a very artful and playful way.

• 31:25Marina Mogilko?

  Do you see more progress there?

• 31:26Speaker 02

  Do I see?

• 31:26Marina Mogilko?

  Or like, does it grow faster than when it's coming from the fear or like the hustle?

• 31:31Speaker 02

  It's actually, it feels like it's just making the entirety of my life better and more rich, if that makes sense.

• 31:39Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah.

• 31:39Speaker 02

  And I feel like in many ways, like, we're having this conversation where I'm at the baby phases of this next stage for me. So I don't even have enough data points to be able to share with you yet. But maybe we'll have a conversation in like two or three years and I'll be like, oh, my God. Marita, I have to, you know what I mean? I'll have so much more to share. But it's exciting. It's really exciting. And I will tell you, as someone who's always been like, in many ways, there's a lot of dichotomy within me. Like, when I first started and throughout my whole career, I've had so much insecurity about not being good enough. But there's been other sides of me where I'm like, no, I can do this. And I've made it happen. And I think what is interesting and fascinating and what feels so wonderfully energizing at this

• 32:21Speaker 02

  point, where the confidence doesn't feel like it's rooted in any kind of bravado or proving. And it feels really, really just easy.

• 32:30Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah.

• 32:31Speaker 02

  And that for me feels like, whoo, what a weight off my shoulders.

• 32:34Marina Mogilko?

  I don't have to prove anything.

• 32:36Speaker 02

  That's right. That's right.

• 32:37Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah. And you don't have to answer if you don't want.

• 32:39Speaker 02

  Oh, it's okay.

• 32:40Marina Mogilko?

  What about the kids? Like, you made a decision to not have biological kids?

• 32:43Speaker 02

  Oh, yes, yes, yes. So that was actually another body truth that I always knew. So I remember, you know, before I was, my partner now, Josh and I, we've been together for 22 years. And early on, you know, when I was dating and just so excited and like, college and after college, and I would have all these like, great relationships and these guys that I would date, they'd be like, okay, and then we're gonna get married, and then we're gonna have kids, and we're gonna move back to New Jersey. I'm like, wait, what? Like, are you not looking at this being? Like, that's, that's not on my agenda. So the truth of the matter is, people have always asked, they're like, well, wait, no, you're gonna change your mind and you're gonna die alone. And I'm like, I hope I die alone. Like, I don't want to take anyone down with me.

• 33:26Speaker 02

  I've just never wanted, I've never, it's like, it's never been a calling. And I think that that is such a sacred choice to bring life into the world, that you have to want it with all of your being. And I was lucky enough that when Josh and I met, he already had a son. So I like instantly got a nine year old boy, and he's now 30. And so it was perfect. Cause I was like, do you, do you want more kids? And he's like, if you really wanted them, like, it's not a problem. And I was like, no, I don't want them. No. He's like, cool. And I was like, oh, my God, I just hit the jackpot. It was, it was literally a body truth for me. And

• 34:09Marina Mogilko?

  You never regretted it?

• 34:10Speaker 02

  Not a second. Like,

• 34:13Marina Mogilko?

  That's a very powerful thing to realize that, you know?

• 34:17Speaker 02

  Yes, not a second. And it comes back to kind of where In many ways, we started our conversation, which was around, I feel like my mom really gave me a gift of like, understanding that everyone has intuition and everyone has this small inner voice inside and to really honor that. So in her context, so she was raised in a Catholic school. And so the nuns really drilled into her and she, she basically taught me that. She's like, Marie, everyone has a direct line to God. You don't need to go to the church. You don't need to go to everywhere. Like, you just have to listen to this little inner voice inside. My inner voice was very clear since I was a child that I was not meant to have biological kids. Throughout my entire life, it's all been like, this is not your path.

• 34:57Marina Mogilko?

  Did your parents ever had a bad reaction to this?

• 35:00Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, my mom was like, what is wrong with you? Like, but you know, my dad's pretty chill and he, I've never even heard him get angry in my whole life, but my mom, for a long time, was like, real pissed. I was like, if you want another kid, go adopt one. I literally, I was like, how do you not know this about me? And she's like, yeah, but everybody. I was like, not everybody, not this one. So, yeah, I got shit about it from a lot of people.

• 35:22Marina Mogilko?

  Yeah. No, it's, but it's, it's a new perspective. Well, for me, at least, like, I'm from a very traditional background. Like Russians.

• 35:30Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 35:30Marina Mogilko?

  Three kids.

• 35:31Speaker 02

  Well, Italians, too. It's like, where are they?

• 35:33Marina Mogilko?

  Huge families, right?

• 35:34Speaker 02

  Absolutely. Yeah, no, no, I've, I've definitely been the kind of outlier, like weird one. But I cannot disobey my inner truth.

• 35:43Marina Mogilko?

  Let's wrap up with a question that I feel like a lot of people are going through this phase where there's so many shiny things and we talked about them and you're like, oh, this is not happening. I've been doing this for a year. I don't see, you know, any progress. I should probably chase this shiny thing.

• 36:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 36:01Marina Mogilko?

  How do you keep this focus? How do you know you're doing the right thing?

• 36:06Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 36:07Marina Mogilko?

  And not start switching?

• 36:08Speaker 02

  Oh, that's such a great question. Well, I think a few things. In my own experience, one of the best moves that I made, and this was just me, because I know my own risk averseness, especially when it comes to money. I am not a human who thrives under like intense financial pressure. So here's what that looked like for me.

• 36:28Speaker 02

  When I decided to start my own coaching business, I did go back to what I was doing to help put myself through college, which was waiting tables. I was a personal assistant. I cleaned toilets. I taught dance. I did so many different things to keep a roof over my head in New York City because I did not want my coaching business to be the source, my only source of income because I knew it would make me desperate. I knew that energy would be so repellent. So it took me five to six years of having bridge jobs, part-time jobs, until I really got my act together, where my confidence and my ability to coach and my ability to do everything really started to gel. And so I think it was such a gift in that way

• 37:13Speaker 02

  because it allowed me to really perfect my art and my craft, if that makes any kind of sense. And I was-

• 37:20Marina Mogilko?

  Build that confidence, really.

• 37:21Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 37:21Marina Mogilko?

  It's all about the confidence in what you're doing.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  And it also gave me enough time to figure out what the hell I was doing and to build a following. I wanted to bootstrap. You know what I mean? I didn't feel comfortable. I was so afraid of money. I didn't trust myself, nor did I even understand the world of getting fun. Like, that was all so foreign to me that I wanted to build this thing from the ground up just using whatever I could pull together myself. And so I think that, to answer your question, like, when someone's like, "Oh, I've been doing this for a year and nothing's happening." Or I think it does depend on the kind of business that you have, if you're venture funded or you're bootstrapping. But for me, I only have my experience, which was you have to love what you're doing and believe in it so much and know that there's other people that can help you figure out what may be the business disconnect

• 38:08Speaker 02

  or tweak your offer or your marketing or whatever. But I think you have to come back and ask yourself this question. Do I want to keep devoting time and energy to this, even if it might not work out? Like, if you want guaranteed money, go get a job.

• 38:23Speaker 00

  Progressive's Accident Response can contact emergency services if you're in a major accident. The only thing worse than someone you love being in an accident is not being able to help them. So Progressive is here to help when you can't. So get peace of mind knowing your loved ones are protected with Progressive's Accident Response. Learn more at progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Limited availability in California. Driver is responsible for emergency and towing charges not covered by the policy. Coverage subject to policy, terms, and conditions.

• 38:54Speaker 01

  This episode is brought to you by Google Chrome. You think you know a browser, but Gemini and Chrome? That's new. It can help you with practically anything on the web, like restoring a vintage motorcycle from a 50-page restoration block, or finally break down that long article you've had open for weeks. Gemini and Chrome is here for it. Ready to make anything online make sense? There's no place like Chrome. Check responses set up required. Compatibility and availability varies 18 plus.

• 39:18Marina Mogilko?

  Love that. So are you enjoying the process?

• 39:22Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 39:22Marina Mogilko?

  Are you willing to do it for the next X amount of years because you enjoy it?

• 39:26Speaker 02

  Because you enjoy it and because you think it's making you a better person and because you believe in the product or service that you're offering. And if you're honest with yourself, you're like, I haven't really hit it yet. Like, you have to have real 10-10 talks with yourself. Are you just believing some inner lore? Or someone you saw on TikTok or YouTube or Instagram is like, I made a gajillion dollars.

• 39:44Marina Mogilko?

  And they might be lying.

• 39:45Speaker 02

  And they are probably lying. And the one thing I'll just share is like, I've been doing this for so long. And so I've had a front row seat to so many wonderful humans. And we're all human and we're all imperfect. But I've met too many people that it is very shiny on the outside. And there are big kind of ego tied numbers that they're throwing out. But I do also know that they're broke in all the ways, that there's not necessarily that much money in wealth being built. And they're really afraid and they're in a bad place behind the scenes. So don't believe everything that you hear. Don't believe everything that you see. And if you believe in your idea, your product or your service,

• 40:29Speaker 02

  and you want to keep going for it, it's like, do whatever it takes. Have those side gigs, have whatever. So you can give this thing the chance that it needs to thrive.

• 40:36Marina Mogilko?

  I love it. Because you need at least, you would say, seven years?

• 40:40Speaker 02

  No, I mean, it could happen sooner. I've honestly seen people. Especially if they have other experience that they can parlay. Like if someone was in sales for a particular company, or maybe they were an excellent PR person, and they could take those skills, parlay and leverage them into their business, they might start seeing amazing results in like six months or a year. And amazing is contextual and it's subjective, right? If you start seeing some traction, you're like, oh, my God, this is just like, I know if I just give this more time, it could grow. That's what I started to see. I started to just get a little bit of traction. But it took me, again, I'm a slowpoke, so you don't, there's no hard and fast rule. But it may take some people a couple of years to start really getting in their groove, and that's OK. Like, you're on your own timeline, and you don't need to prove anything to anyone but yourself.

• 41:22Marina Mogilko?

  I love it. Thank you so much.

• 41:24Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 41:25Marina Mogilko?

  This was so therapeutic for me as well. You're amazing, Marie. Thank you so much for taking the time. And guys, please comment down below. What was your key takeaway from this conversation? I'm looking forward to reading your comments. And see you soon on this channel. Bye.

• 41:39Speaker 00

  Progressive's Accident Response can contact emergency services if you're in a major accident. The only thing worse than someone you love being in an accident is not being able to help them. So Progressive is here to help when you can't. So get peace of mind knowing your loved ones are protected with Progressive's Accident Response. Learn more at progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Limited availability in California. Driver is responsible for emergency and towing charges not covered by the policy. Coverage subject to policy terms and conditions.

• 42:10Speaker 04

  When you shop Kroger delivery, you can expect the savings you love and fresh groceries delivered right to your door. From delicious produce to everyday essentials, enjoy the convenience of delivery and the trusted selection you've come to know from Kroger. Because bringing you fresh, quality groceries is what we do best. Right now, enjoy free delivery on orders of $50 or more with your digital coupon. Restrictions apply. See site for details. Kroger, fresh for everyone.