How The Powerless Become Powerful | Don't Look For The Third Thing

Why is self-command and self-knowledge so elusive? How can we find it? Well, Epictetus can show us the way, as he did for Marcus and Hadrian and countless others over the centuries.💡 We designed our How To Read Epictetus (A Daily Stoic Guide) as a personal field guide —part book club, part masterclass, part daily practice. It’s designed to help you not just read the words of Epictetus, but live them—to turn his timeless wisdom into real change in your own life and the lives of those around you. And if you get the guide before July 26th, you’ll receive a private invitation to an exclusive LIVE Q&A with Ryan Holiday, where he’ll go deep on all things Epictetus, Stoicism, and how to apply these ideas right now, in today’s world. Head to dailystoic.com/epictetuscourse to learn more and get your book, guide, and bundle today!👉 Get How To Read Epictetus (A Daily Stoic Guide) & all other Daily Stoic courses for FREE when you join Daily Stoic Life | dailystoic.com/life📓 Pick up a signed edition of The Daily Stoic Journal: 366 Days of Writing and Reflection on The Art of Living: https://store.dailystoic.com/📖 Preorder the final book in Ryan Holiday's The Stoic Virtues Series: "Wisdom Takes Work": https://store.dailystoic.com/pages/wisdom-takes-work🎙️ Follow The Daily Stoic Podcast on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dailystoicpodcast🎥 Watch top moments from The Daily Stoic Podcast on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@dailystoicpodcast✉️ Want Stoic wisdom delivered to your inbox daily? Sign up for the FREE Daily Stoic email at https://dailystoic.com/dailyemail🏛 Get Stoic inspired books, medallions, and prints to remember these lessons at the Daily Stoic Store: https://store.dailystoic.com/📱 Follow us: Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, TikTok, and FacebookSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info. 📢 Share | ⚙️ Manage Subscription

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05Ryan Holiday?

  Welcome to the Daily Stoic Podcast, where each day we bring you a Stoic-inspired meditation, designed to help you find strength and insight and wisdom into everyday life. Each one of these episodes is based on the 2,000-year-old philosophy that has guided some of history's greatest men and women, help you learn from them, to follow in their example, and to start your day off with a little dose of courage and discipline and justice and wisdom. For more, visit DailyStoic.com.

• 0:56Ryan Holiday?

  How the powerless become powerful. Hadrian had everything. He could do anything. He commanded an enormous army. He had access to the smartest advisors and the most illustrious men in the world. He could send for anyone, summon anyone. And yet, here he was, traveling more than 500 miles from Rome to the distant Greek city and Roman colony of Nacopolis to attend the lectures of a former slave? It's pretty incredible and beautiful, too, no? There is something poetic about Hadrian, then the emperor, sitting like an eager student at the foot of a man

• 1:40Ryan Holiday?

  whose name literally just meant "acquired one." And yet, in this instance, was the slave not then the master? Was that not the powerless conquering the powerful?

• 1:54Ryan Holiday?

  Marcus Aurelius, a lifelong student of Epictetus and the adopted grandson of Hadrian, contrasted the great conquerors of the world against the wise men of history. And he believed that the thinkers came out the better because, he explained, the philosophers knew the what, the why, and the how. Their minds were their own. Isn't that what we're after? How can we seize that power? How can we reverse fortune as Epictetus did? Well, that's what we're talking about this month here at Daily Stoic. We're studying the life of Epictetus. July is going to be Epictetus Month. It's going to be a deep dive into the life, the lessons, the legacy of one of history's greatest philosophers.

• 2:37Ryan Holiday?

  And if you want to join us, you want to go deeper, we'd love to have you. We did this guide on Epictetus, and we're doing kind of a book club about him, and I'd love to have you in there. If you want to learn how to read Epictetus, sign up right now at dailystoic.com/epictetuscourse. I'll link to it in today's show notes, of course. But basically, it's this structured companion to help you engage with Epictetus, the way he's meant to be engaged, as a teacher of practical daily tools for living. The same things that Hadrian was trying to incorporate in his life, I'm trying to incorporate in my life and thousands of Stoics all over the world are after as well. I think what we find in Epictetus is action over theory, right?

• 3:22Ryan Holiday?

  We find sort of universality. Of course, he's also got his share of modern champions. And so we're going to explore all that in How to Read Epictetus, a Daily Stoic digital guiding course, and we're having a big conversation about it, which I would love to see you in. As I said, dailystoic.com/epictetuscourse, and you can get your copy of Epictetus at a discount, all that over there at dailystoic.com/epictetuscourse. And remember, if you're a member of Daily Stoic Life, you'll get this course and all our other courses for free. So check all that out, and I will see you in there when we get together on July 26.

• 4:10Ryan Holiday?

  Don't look for the third thing. The Stoics teach us that doing well is its own reward. To do the right thing, to see someone helped by it, this is enough. To go around expecting thanks, what Marcus Aurelius describes as the third thing, that is to miss the point. It's being greedy. Keeping score not only misses the purposes of being good, it's foolish. Sets you up for disappointment. If you're going to do some accounting, look at it from the other direction. How many people have helped us? What do we owe them in return? Think about clearing some debts this week and consider forgetting any notion of others owing you.

• 4:51Ryan Holiday?

  This is from this week's entry in the Daily Stoic Journal, 366 Days of Writing and Reflection on the Art of Living, together by myself and the wonderful Steve Hanselman. You can buy this anywhere books are sold. I sell a bunch of signed copies, personalize it, usually write "Prepare and Reflect" in the Daily Stoic store. You can buy that at store.dailystoic.com. Then we've got two quotes from Marcus to think about today. "One person on doing well by others immediately accounts the expected favor in return. Another is not so quick, but still considers the person a debtor and knows the favor. A third kind of person acts as if not conscious of the deed, rather like a vine producing a cluster of grapes without making further demands, like a horse after its race, or

• 5:35Ryan Holiday?

  a dog after its walk, or a bee after making its honey. Such a person having done a good deed won't go shouting from rooftops, but simply moves on to the next deed, just like the vine produces another bunch of grapes in the right season." It's Marcus Aurelius's Meditations 5:6. It's such a beautiful image, like plants produce fruit. They don't even reap the benefits of that fruit. They just do it because that's their nature, that's their job. And then we have one more. "When you've done well and another has benefited by it, why, like a fool, do you look for the third thing on top? Credit for the good deed or favor in return." That's Marcus Aurelius's Meditations 7:7:3.

• 6:15Ryan Holiday?

  Anytime Marcus is repeating himself in meditation, I think it's illustrative. And I think he is doing what we all do, right? He did something good. Then he was disappointed that it either wasn't recognized or he was frustrated that it was interpreted incorrectly. Or like, imagine you're Marcus Aurelius. You're, you're trying not to be corrupted by power. You've seen what your horrible predecessors have done and you're being attacked for it. You know, he says that the rewards of being a leader is to, to do good things and earn a bad reputation. You still get attacked. If you're going through life, looking for this third thing, and I do this all the time myself. If you're going through life, looking for that third thing, you're going to be disappointed all the time. And you're going to question why you were doing the good thing.

• 7:00Ryan Holiday?

  Cause if you're doing it in this quid pro quo, one hand washes the other. You do a thing, they do a thing. You start to go, this is a sucker's payoff. Like I'm doing the right thing and I'm not getting anything for it. I'm going to stop doing the right thing. No, the Stoics want you to think, no, the, the right thing is your job. You do the right thing because it produces pleasure for you. You do the right thing because that's what you were put here on this planet to do. You do the right thing because it's the right thing. Don't look for the third thing. Do the right thing because it's the right thing. That's this week's lesson. And as we said in the little meditations, forgive the debts that others owe you and be very diligent about paying your debts to all the people who have selflessly done good things

• 7:44Ryan Holiday?

  for you and this world over the years.

• 7:51Ryan Holiday?

  Hey, it's Ryan. Thank you for listening to the Daily Stoic Podcast. I just wanted to say, we so appreciate it. We love serving you. It's amazing to us that over 30 million people have downloaded these episodes in the couple of years we've been doing it. It's an honor. Please spread the word, tell people about it. And this isn't to sell anything. I just wanted to say, thank you.