Could This Secret Destroy Our Family?

🔥 Microhabits for a Better Marriage. Download the Together app. On today’s episode, we hear about: A woman whose brother-in-law is cheating on his wife A wife waiting for her husband to follow through on his promise A husband pondering how to tell his wife he doesn’t want to foster parent Next Steps: ❤️ Get away with your spouse today! 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test 📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards 💭 John's Free Guided Meditation 🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. Go to Capstone Wellness to learn more. Get up to 20% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth. Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. Visit Hallow for a 90-day free trial. Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! Working knives for working people—Go to Montana Knife Company to see what’s available now! Explore Poncho Outdoors! Get 25% off your order at Thorne. Visit Zander Insurance or call 1-800-356-4282 for your free instant quote today. Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💰 George Kamel 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05Speaker 00

  I'm calling for the good of someone else. He had an affair about 12 years ago. And the affair ended, his wife found out. They've been okay, I guess, since the affair, he and his wife. Fast forward to about a year and a half ago, and I got a message from the woman that he was seeing, that they were seeing each other again.

• 0:29Dr. John Delony?

  Yo, yo, what up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show, coming to you live from Nashville. I'm live, you're not, but we're coming to you live, taking real calls from real people.

• 0:42Speaker 02

  We're not live.

• 0:44Dr. John Delony?

  We are right now.

• 0:45Speaker 02

  Right this second, but when people hear this, it's like three weeks later.

• 0:49Dr. John Delony?

  That's not our fault. If they were here right-

• 0:51Speaker 02

  Actually, it kind of is.

• 0:52Dr. John Delony?

  That is our fault. That is our fault. I guess we could release it live.

• 0:57Speaker 02

  Nope, not a chance.

• 0:59Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, you edit a lot.

• 1:01Speaker 02

  Yep, because I want to keep my job.

• 1:03Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, that's fair.

• 1:04Speaker 02

  And you have to feed your family. So you're welcome.

• 1:06Dr. John Delony?

  There is some comedy people who listen to, like, me live, and they're like, "Oh, oh."

• 1:12Speaker 02

  This is the unedited version.

• 1:14Dr. John Delony?

  This is the unedited. Let's go out to Denver, Colorado, and talk to Holly. What's up, Holly?

• 1:19Speaker 00

  What's up? How are you?

• 1:20Dr. John Delony?

  Awesome, how are you?

• 1:22Speaker 00

  I'm good, all good.

• 1:24Dr. John Delony?

  Excellent. You're not good, or you wouldn't be calling. Oh, maybe you are? Maybe you are, are you calling just because they-

• 1:28Speaker 00

  I'm good. I'm calling for the good of someone else.

• 1:31Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, nice. You're calling for a friend. That should be a new segment. Calling for a friend.

• 1:36Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 1:37Dr. John Delony?

  All right, so-

• 1:37Speaker 00

  That's perfect.

• 1:38Dr. John Delony?

  So what's up?

• 1:40Speaker 00

  Um, mine, I've been married for 37 years. My, uh, it's been a wonderful, wonderful ride. My brother-in-law, my husband's brother, very, very, very good guy. Not a, he's a nice guy, but he hasn't been a great guy. Um, he had an affair about 12 years ago. And, um, I found out by accident, he asked my husband to keep it a secret. I eventually found out, was very upset with the both of them for keeping secrets. Um, and the affair ended, his wife found out. Their grown adult children do not know.

• 2:21Speaker 00

  Um, they've been okay, I guess, the last, since the affair, he and his wife. Um, fast forward to about a year and a half ago, and I got a message from the woman that he was seeing, same woman, that they were seeing each other again. Um, yeah, uh, wasn't great, uh, went on for probably about another six months or so.

• 2:47Dr. John Delony?

  Um. What did you, what did you do when she reached out to you?

• 2:51Speaker 00

  You know, I listened. Um, I had spoken to her. She called me after the first affair and apologized for doing what they did to our family.

• 3:02Dr. John Delony?

  Did you know her?

• 3:04Speaker 00

  I did not. I did not. Um, she was very nice. She was very humble. She was kind about it, even though what she did was extremely wrong, um, what they both did.

• 3:18Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 3:18Speaker 00

  Um, and we let it go. That was, you know, all that time went by and it happened again. And she reached out to me and said, hey, um, I really need him to leave me alone. I, I don't want to do this again. We've been carrying on for a little bit. Can you please talk to him and tell him to stop contacting me? Um.

• 3:37Dr. John Delony?

  Whoa, whoa, hold on, hold on. That's wild.

• 3:40Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:41Dr. John Delony?

  That's, that's wild. Um, why would she reach out to you and not his wife?

• 3:47Speaker 00

  Because apparently they swore to each other that he didn't want his children to know. And she said that she would never do that to him. She had enough care and respect for him that he would never, she would never blow the whistle on him.

• 4:02Dr. John Delony?

  But she blew the whistle just dragging you into this thing?

• 4:05Speaker 00

  She did, you know, and that's when it became my business.

• 4:08Dr. John Delony?

  So, so the moment, the second phone call, the moment she hung up, did you tell your husband?

• 4:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 4:14Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And

• 4:15Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 4:16Dr. John Delony?

  Where

• 4:16Speaker 00

  No secrets.

• 4:17Dr. John Delony?

  Wh- wh- where are y'all now? Or where is this whole mess now?

• 4:21Speaker 00

  So, they ended it about a year and a half ago, the second time. The second time, his wife does not know. Still.

• 4:31Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, so now you're a part of the secret keeping?

• 4:33Speaker 00

  I always have been. His children don't know. My children do know. They found out by default. Um, and I had to explain it to them. They're grown. Um, they really don't want much to do with, with him. Um, but my husband, they're, he and my husband are very close. Uh, my husband defends him.

• 4:56Speaker 00

  And it's, it's caused an issue with, with our relationship. Um.

• 5:01Dr. John Delony?

  Well, you defend him too, because you started the call by saying he's a very, very good man.

• 5:07Speaker 00

  He's, no, he's a nice guy. He's not a good guy.

• 5:09Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Big difference.

• 5:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, big difference.

• 5:12Dr. John Delony?

  I know lots of really nice guys that I don't want around my kids.

• 5:17Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:17Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 5:18Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 5:18Dr. John Delony?

  I know, I know some really, like, just crass goofball, like, classically not nice guys that I would love around my kids because they're good men, right?

• 5:27Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 5:28Dr. John Delony?

  They're just morons, right? So.

• 5:30Speaker 00

  Exactly, yeah, they're just idiots.

• 5:31Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so this whole thing feels really tangled up, and so I want to pull it apart, okay?

• 5:37Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 5:38Dr. John Delony?

  You got issue number one. Where you still have something in your spirit about the fact that your husband kept secrets from you a decade ago.

• 5:51Speaker 00

  Um, I don't. I, I

• 5:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 5:53Speaker 00

  Now, as time has passed, I, we don't have that kind of a relationship. I understand why he did it. He, his brother confided in him. Um, I respect that, but we have a very, very strict rule of not keeping secrets.

• 6:08Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 6:09Speaker 00

  He, I think he would tell me eventually. It just, it, he, he just didn't want it. He just wanted it to go away.

• 6:14Dr. John Delony?

  Right.

• 6:15Speaker 00

  And it didn't.

• 6:16Dr. John Delony?

  And it, and it, and it never does, but him keeping a secret from you, here's how we handle this in my house.

• 6:25Dr. John Delony?

  I would say something like to my wife, like, hey, somebody we know, somebody we care about, a family member just dropped a humongous bomb in my lap and asked me not to tell you about it, just know it's a big ugly mess. And my wife, who honors, just because of her work and what she does and what I do, she honors confidentiality. But here's what I wouldn't want her to do. I wouldn't want her to feel me carrying extra weight that I don't normally carry and her thinking there's something wrong with us.

• 6:54Speaker 00

  Right.

• 6:55Dr. John Delony?

  Right? So I don't need to know the details. She doesn't need to know the details, but each of us owes it to the other person because we're married. Hey, we're both carrying something ugly. But he, and so that's, that's issue number one. So you say you and your husband are good and square, awesome. Now, what's Thanksgiving?

• 7:11Speaker 00

  I do, I do have a little bit of resentment toward him because of the fact that he still continues to not defend his brother. He feels some sort of a, they had huge trauma as kids. Their trauma bond is thick with those two.

• 7:29Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 7:30Speaker 00

  And, and I understand that part of it as well. But I feel like it's just a little bit of betrayal and he needs to go to his brother and say, hey dude, that's not, what you're doing is not cool and you're affecting my family. And he hasn't done that. And that's, that's-

• 7:53Dr. John Delony?

  So your, your brother-in-law doesn't know that his mistress reached out to you?

• 7:57Speaker 00

  Oh yeah, he knows. I've told him everything. I've read him up and down. I've, I'm, I am not afraid to say what I need to say to him.

• 8:05Dr. John Delony?

  So, so let your husband have his relationship with his brother? Okay. Cause, cause that's, it's, I'd have no problem.

• 8:13Speaker 00

  They need each other.

• 8:14Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, yeah. I've got no problem with the ride or die aspect to it, but is any part of a good relationship? And this is what I call loyalty, right? Loyalty does not mean, like, I'll just do whatever you say all the time, forever. Loyalty means I'll be there when you need me and you better, you better believe I'm going to tell you the truth too. Loyalty is both sides of that, of that, of that, you know, scale, right? And so the, the men and women in my life that are most loyal to me, dude, they are there if we need to hide the bodies and they're going to let me know what they think about that. Right? So let him have that relationship with his brother. What I don't want you to sacrifice is your integrity. Cause you just said you don't mind saying what you want to say when you want to say it,

• 8:59Dr. John Delony?

  but you haven't told, you haven't told that woman, that you haven't told your sister-in-law at Thanksgiving, have you?

• 9:05Speaker 00

  No, we don't, we don't have much of a relationship. She's very private. She's very dependent on him.

• 9:10Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 9:10Speaker 00

  I let that, I let that go a long time ago. That's for them to figure out.

• 9:14Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So what's your concern?

• 9:15Speaker 00

  Crossing, because I'm still carrying this secret and it's causing me anxiety every time we see them because they're grown children think that they have this idyllic wonderful marriage and he's this great guy and I'm sitting there, well, my whole family is sitting there listening to this facade and it, it crosses every boundary that I've established for myself.

• 9:41Dr. John Delony?

  So what would, in another way of saying that, um, it sounds like you feel forced to become somebody you don't want to be from a moral and ethical standpoint.

• 9:56Speaker 00

  Yes, and to appease my husband and for him to continue this relationship with his brother.

• 10:03Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So who do you want to be?

• 10:09Speaker 00

  I, I, I want to be the person that tells the truth.

• 10:13Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So when I asked if you haven't, why you haven't told his, your sister-in-law yet, you said, well, I don't have a relationship with her. She's private. Again, that's, you're making it about her, yet the issue is you're struggling with the woman you see in the mirror because you're not whole with yourself. The word integrity comes from the word integer, whole, round, never stops, right? And you're incomplete inside your own chest.

• 10:40Speaker 00

  I'm trying to, I'm trying to please everybody else to make this.

• 10:43Dr. John Delony?

  That's right.

• 10:43Speaker 00

  Not, yeah.

• 10:45Dr. John Delony?

  And so there's a difference in saying to your husband, I respect till the end of the earth, you have a special relationship with your brother. I'm glad you have each other in fact. And if you're struggling with respecting him because he's not upholding his end of what loyalty is, which is to look at his brother and say, hey, this isn't who we are as men, or he's not wrestling with the reality that, no, that's who my brother is.

• 11:11Dr. John Delony?

  That's who he is for a decade.

• 11:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:15Dr. John Delony?

  Um, then, I mean,

• 11:17Speaker 00

  So take it or leave it?

• 11:20Dr. John Delony?

  Say that again?

• 11:21Speaker 00

  Take it or leave it?

• 11:22Dr. John Delony?

  Take what or leave it?

• 11:24Speaker 00

  The, the burden of carrying their secrets or?

• 11:28Dr. John Delony?

  No, it's not about that. It's about you looking at your husband and saying, hey, um, you're, you're welcome to do what you want to do in this relationship. This is who I'm gonna be.

• 11:37Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 11:38Dr. John Delony?

  And either I'm gonna have this conversation and I'll give you all 30 days because I'm not carrying this other woman. And by the way, I would block that other woman. She, that's a weird end around triangulation that I would not be a part of.

• 11:49Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 11:50Dr. John Delony?

  And, um, you could tell him, you married a woman of integrity. And for a year now, I've been carrying around this bag of lies and I can't participate. Or I'm not gonna make the phone call, but I'm not showing up to these family events anymore and pretending everything's okay.

• 12:07Dr. John Delony?

  And I don't think you have any responsibility unless you have a close relationship with your nieces and nephews and you feel like you're lying to them. You don't have a relationship to their adult kids. That's their, if they want to lie to their kids, they're gonna lie to their kids.

• 12:17Speaker 00

  I do have, I do have a relationship with them and that's part of the package.

• 12:21Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So I think sitting down, your husband is saying, I am being forced to be somebody that I abhor, that I don't want to be.

• 12:29Dr. John Delony?

  You, you're asking me to be a liar and that's not who I am. You're asking me to be a person who's not, who doesn't have any integrity and that's not who I am. I can't play this game. And by the way, y'all put me in this position. It's not like you went digging. Their dishonesty brought it to you.

• 12:48Speaker 00

  Yes. Okay.

• 12:50Dr. John Delony?

  And as the old saying goes, not by my hand, but in my lap. Cause, cause if you keep everybody's secrets and you end, end up melting yourself in the process.

• 12:58Speaker 00

  That's what's happening.

• 12:59Dr. John Delony?

  Like for what? Right?

• 13:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's what's happening. And I don't, I don't, I don't want to do that. It's, it's, it's gotta, it's gotta stop. I can't, it's too heavy.

• 13:10Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Yeah, set it down.

• 13:13Speaker 00

  Alright.

• 13:13Dr. John Delony?

  But I'll, I'll challenge you as a part of being a person of integrity is not blindsiding people and not hiding from truth or not hiding from reality. Right? And by the way, Your brother-in-law will probably run you down. I can't believe she can't keep a secret. She's gonna blow up my whole family. And hopefully, your husband is of the character to say, A, don't talk about my wife. And B, um, bro, you did this.

• 13:41Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 13:43Dr. John Delony?

  Like, you blew up your family, not us.

• 13:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, I, I, I have empathy for him. He's hurting, and it's obvious. And I want him to find a better path and, and find some happiness. And I, I can't do that for him.

• 13:58Dr. John Delony?

  He doesn't want that. And you could want it for him all day long, but he's, I mean, he's made his bed for, with another woman for, for 12 years.

• 14:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:09Dr. John Delony?

  All right.

• 14:10Speaker 00

  Yeah. Wow, okay.

• 14:16Dr. John Delony?

  At the end of the day, all we can control is us.

• 14:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 14:22Dr. John Delony?

  Your thoughts and your actions, that's it. And it's, it feels powerless sometimes, but that should be a really empowering, an empowering thing to hear. All I can control is me. And at the end of the day, I want to be able to look myself in the mirror and say, I did the next right thing. And I'm a person who tells the truth. And I want to be able to look my spouse in the eye and say, I'm not, I don't respect you right now, or I'm not respecting this part of you because of this and this and this. And with all due respect, I, few bonds, few bonds, or more ride or die than a close brother or close sister, close family bonds. But when he looked at you 37 years ago and said, till death do us part, you became his number one.

• 15:08Dr. John Delony?

  And so, he gave you a sacred obligation, if you will. And said, we're in this. And I'm not gonna put you in positions that where you have to bury yourself.

• 15:19Dr. John Delony?

  That's unfair on his part. And he might say, this is why I kept secrets from you. This is why I didn't tell you. And y'all are gonna have to deal with that part of your marriage.

• 15:29Dr. John Delony?

  Because if keeping secrets and keeping facades is more important than connection and love, then your marriage has bigger issues, right? You all may be sitting around with a facade too. So be as honest as you can be, and direct as you can be, and give him a path to do the next right thing. And man, I'd block that woman. I don't play triangulation games. I'm out of those things. But I'm also not going to look somebody that I lied to him either. Thanks for the call, sister. We come back, a woman asks if it's reasonable to want to move closer to family if it means her husband would take a career and a pay cut. We'll be right back.

• 16:12Dr. John Delony?

  All right, this is going to sound wild, but I have a couple of pet lizards. And the other day, I went into a local pet store to get some crickets. And I just wanted to buy a few crickets. And at the checkout counter, they wanted my address, my driver's license, my phone number. I might as well have had to bring my social security card, my passport. Listen, I just wanted some crickets and they wanted my soul. Every time you give out your cell number, your email address, or buy something online, data brokers are there to grab your information and sell it behind your back to the highest bidder, leaving you vulnerable to spam and scams.

• 16:53Dr. John Delony?

  This is a big part of why I personally use and recommend Delete Me. Your phone number, your home address, pictures of your family, your family's information, and more, all of it is just floating around online in the background, sitting on data broker sites that you've never even heard of. Delete Me finds your personal information online and they remove it for you. Not just once, they keep monitoring for your information and cleaning it up month after month. You can close the gap between what you think is private and what actually is. You cannot build a peaceful life if parts of your life are being bought and sold online without your permission. Get Delete Me. Go to joindelete.me/deloney and get 20% off an annual plan. That's joindelete.me/deloney.

• 17:40Dr. John Delony?

  It all started with the Cozy Earth towels. These giant, awesome, absorbent soft towels. And then, I got Cozy Earth comforters and blankets. And dude, they were awesome, too. And then, I got some Cozy Earth socks. And now, Cozy Earth is in every nook and cranny of my house. I recently got a pair of the Cozy Earth Everywhere pants. Dude, I didn't know that I needed another pair of pants, but I got them. And like all the other Cozy Earth gear, they are incredible, especially during the summer months. And of course, I love my Cozy Earth sheets. Listen, they're made from viscose from bamboo. I don't know what that is. I don't know what that means. But I do know that my Cozy Earth sheets are soft and breathable. And somehow, they keep me cool without me freezing out

• 18:25Dr. John Delony?

  and without me getting night sweats in the middle of this hot summer. Cozy Earth sheets help me sleep better. And here's the deal. Cozy Earth gives you a 100-night sleep trial on all of your bedding and a 10-year warranty on everything else. So there's no risk to try out Cozy Earth for yourself. Go to cozylearth.com/Daloni and use code DALONI and you'll save up to 20% off your entire order. That's cozylearth.com/Daloni. Use code DALONI. And if you get a post-purchase survey, tell them you heard about Cozy Earth's amazing gear right here on the Dr. John Deloney Show.

• 18:59Dr. John Delony?

  All right, take two seconds and hit the subscribe, like, thumbs up. What is it? What else, Kelly? The share? Share? Share it?

• 19:07Speaker 02

  Yes, you can share it with someone that you think might need to hear that call. You can like, subscribe, comment. We love comments. I read them.

• 19:19Dr. John Delony?

  Your spirit is darker and colder than mine.

• 19:23Speaker 02

  Well, it's also my job, so...

• 19:25Dr. John Delony?

  Ayo. Let's go to Houston. Houston, home of the surging, surging Astros. And talk to Ashley. What's up, Ashley? Hi, thank you for talking to me today. Of course, thanks for calling. What's up?

• 19:40Speaker 03

  And my husband keep going back and forth with um whether we want to live here by the Astros or up north um.

• 19:48Dr. John Delony?

  How far up north?

• 19:50Speaker 03

  Wisconsin.

• 19:51Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, my gosh, that's the moon if you live in Texas. That's not up north. That's that's that's another solar system. Oklahoma is up north.

• 20:01Speaker 03

  It's pretty cold up there.

• 20:03Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, wow. Okay, so.

• 20:05Speaker 03

  But.

• 20:06Dr. John Delony?

  You don't you don't you don't take leave in Texas lightly. Yeah, what's the question?

• 20:11Speaker 03

  Uh, well, for us to make that move, um, I think I'd be a happier, well-rounded mother and wife. Uh, but the career he has here in Texas is is slim up there. So he would be changing careers. And in doing so, be taking a substantial pay cut. Um, so the decision is to move up north for my mental health. Or stay in Texas and be financially secure.

• 20:38Dr. John Delony?

  Well, that's that's a no-brainer, but the way you phrase that. Is, I mean, tell me, tell me more about your mental. What about changing locations is gonna quote-unquote help your mental health?

• 20:50Speaker 03

  Well, so it's just my husband, myself, and my three kids here. We've got a very small circle, no family, you know, very few friends. Um, and I feel like I'm, go ahead.

• 21:02Dr. John Delony?

  Let me interrupt you because when when you get on this train and it heads out, that's a story you've told. I can already tell you've told that story to yourself over and over. You told it to your husband. Why do you have a small circle? Why have you chosen that?

• 21:15Speaker 03

  Um, I think as a stay-at-home mom, it's it's maybe harder to meet people and and sometimes you meet people and maybe you don't click with that person. So it's this never-ending cycle of playdates that end up going nowhere because the moms don't click or the kids' ages don't line up. You change schools, you change daycares, you change extracurricular activities. And um, it's hard to build a a long-term circle.

• 21:43Dr. John Delony?

  It's very hard. And it's also hard to change jobs and careers and move literally entirely across the country. Both of those are hard.

• 21:53Speaker 03

  Absolutely.

• 21:55Dr. John Delony?

  Um, one of the concerns I have, do you have family up north? Is that why you want to go home? Go, I mean, go go up north?

• 22:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 22:02Dr. John Delony?

  Who's up there?

• 22:03Speaker 03

  Uh, we've got mom and dad, brothers and sisters. I've got grandparents, aunts and uncles, cousins.

• 22:10Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So I, I, yes, if, if you are struggling with your mental health and you need to do something else, whatever that thing is, move, change jobs, whatever, that's, your well-being and your relationship with your spouse and your relationship with yourself, it's always more important than money, always, right? And, um, I'm always, I always want to keep two truths in, in hand, okay? Truth number one is people were storytellers and we often fantasize where we're not. And so it, it's like you'll pick yourself up and drop yourself in the middle of aunts,

• 22:53Dr. John Delony?

  uncles, cousins, grandparents, et cetera. Maybe that would be wonderful, but maybe you get to see them a couple of times a year on holiday, or once a year on holiday, and everyone's on their best behavior, and there's food out, and there's laughter, and there's telling the old stories again, and the same rhythms and routines, and we're not clicking, and the kids don't line up, that will be present there too.

• 23:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, my husband does tell me something similar, you know, that we, currently we see them once a year on vacation, and he says, I have this, you know, rose colored, colored glasses where, yeah, everybody's gathered round, we're laughing, we're having a good time, but that's not the reality of, of their day-to-day life.

• 23:36Dr. John Delony?

  He's right, he's right.

• 23:38Speaker 03

  But then I come back to Texas, and it's hard to not envision even getting to see them once every other month, you know, six times a year would be so much better.

• 23:49Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 23:50Speaker 03

  Than once.

• 23:51Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so that's.

• 23:52Speaker 03

  And not only for just me, but my, my kids as well.

• 23:54Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 23:55Speaker 03

  You know, they have a small circle here.

• 23:56Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, so that, that's truism number one, and, and I, you're, I think your husband's right, is it's easy to just pick yourself up and say it's gonna be a holiday, 365 days a year, and it's absolutely not. There's gonna be way, way, way more days. You're a stay-at-home mom with a few kids, by yourself. And your cousins are working and your sisters and brothers are working and their families are working and you'll get together maybe once a week, once every two weeks, maybe, maybe. And, but you'll have games and you'll have school and you'll have kids growing up like, like that's all reality. The second truism here is the one I want to focus on.

• 24:32Dr. John Delony?

  And that is this, wherever you go, new job, new spouse, new person on the side, new raise, new million dollars, you will go with you. And so when people tell me they need to do something else for their mental health and they're not in an abusive situation, I always want to pause. Because if you're struggling with anxiety, you're struggling with depression, you're struggling with things right now in your real life, those things you will go with you wherever you go. And so, if it's hard to connect, if it's hard to just drop your shoulders, if it's hard to be like, oh, man, I had a couple of moms over and our kids played, they're

• 25:16Dr. John Delony?

  fine, they were nice, they're fine, they're not going to be my people. I would want to dig into that, what prohibits you from going, going again and then going again? Right? What is it about you that has kind of closed that circle off and said, I don't want to meet, I don't want to get close to people here in Houston?

• 25:35Speaker 03

  You know, I think we've been kind of planning to move up there for so many years that I've put things on hold here.

• 25:45Dr. John Delony?

  There you go, there you go. You haven't lived where your feet are. Yes, you haven't lived where your feet are. And that is a recipe for anybody to feel untethered and feeling untethered is a recipe for hanging on to the past or projecting into the future, which is anxiety, depression, all those things, right?

• 26:05Speaker 03

  Yeah. I mean, I've told him before, if I could, I mean, if I could like release myself of this, like, strong desire to go up there, I would. I guess I, I feel like he's, in a way, led me to believe that eventually we will be there. So, it's this back and forth that's been going on.

• 26:30Dr. John Delony?

  And I, I would dig into that. Because if he said, I'm going to work here for three years and then we're moving and now we're on year 10, yeah, I would sit down and say, hey, I've, I've got some integrity concerns. Here was our plan that we made together and it seems like you've unilaterally changed the plan. Right?

• 26:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, I do. Yeah, I feel the plan does get changed. I mean, we own some land up there currently that I thought eventually we'd build on and that's been years. You know, we try to reach a dollar amount goal wise as the finish line and we reached that goal and then that gets moved as well.

• 27:11Dr. John Delony?

  Hmm, yeah.

• 27:12Speaker 03

  And I know he's kind of climbing the ladder in his position here in Houston and I know how difficult it would be to make a certain amount of money and then have to step away from that.

• 27:23Dr. John Delony?

  Well, I mean, the money, money gives you margin, money gives you options, money is, I mean, you work the job so you can have the life you want, right? And most people get that backwards. They try to get a job they want and they try to cram some sort of life into that. And that's backwards. But really, the conversation is to clear the deck completely and ask yourselves, you and your husband get together and say, what kind of, what kind of world do we want to create? Because we get to choose. And every one of those worlds will come with sacrifice and with change and with shifting and all that kind of stuff. And every one of those choices comes with hard things.

• 28:04Dr. John Delony?

  But I can tell you as somebody who lived in Texas for 40 years, and then we packed up and moved across the country, we left our friends, we left our families, I didn't just leave friends, I left 40-year friendships. Right? And we left our families. And part of the thing we did was we budgeted for a lot of trips. We had a line item and a budget for years for flights and for gas. Because part of us coming here was, we're going to go back. And also, my wife did a way, way better job than I did. She immediately plugged in and said, if I'm going to be well and whole, I'm going to choose to live right here where my feet are and I am going to have to make good, close

• 28:49Dr. John Delony?

  friends. And she's got some ride or die friends. I struggled with that because I left some long-term friendships. And over the past several years, I've really put an anchor down. And I tell you what, man, I sleep different now.

• 29:05Dr. John Delony?

  Right? And she recently told me, it shocked me. Uh, we were driving somewhere and I said, hey,

• 29:13Dr. John Delony?

  we haven't talked about this in years. Like, do you, do you still want to be buried back XYZ place in, in Texas? And she said, nope. She'd bury me in Tennessee. It's more my home is.

• 29:26Dr. John Delony?

  And for two Texans who lived for 40, you know this, like for, I mean, that was a wild, like wow. You know what I mean? That was a big shift.

• 29:33Speaker 03

  Yeah. Oh, I guess I just, um,

• 29:39Speaker 03

  I mean, I, I could come to terms with staying here.

• 29:42Dr. John Delony?

  Don't come to terms, come to terms with the life you want. And if, if that picture of your life is, I want to be surrounded by grandparents and family and jillions of cousins, et cetera. And there's a reality to that, then let's put that on the table. But it sounds like you've had a, I thought we were gonna, and heat your husband's like, I thought we were gonna. And y'all had, were saying the same words, but y'all had different pictures of what you thought your life was gonna look like and feel like. And so in the process of, I thought we were gonna, and I thought we were gonna, now y'all are further apart than ever.

• 30:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, I definitely don't think he thought this is how it was gonna, you know, happen once we had kids together.

• 30:25Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 30:26Speaker 03

  I was completely fine, but I, I had a different circle, of course, too, before I had kids.

• 30:31Dr. John Delony?

  Sure. Sure. How old are your kids?

• 30:34Speaker 03

  I've got nine, five and two.

• 30:36Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 30:37Speaker 03

  And you know, the older, my oldest, the older he gets, I just, I see him not having a relationship with his grandparents, with his cousins. Um, it's, I, I have this mom guilt about it and I feel bad. Um, that they don't have something that I had and, and cherish so much growing up myself.

• 30:59Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. And so A,

• 31:03Dr. John Delony?

  that's real.

• 31:05Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, feel that.

• 31:09Dr. John Delony?

  And B, your children's lives are not your life.

• 31:15Dr. John Delony?

  And trying to run it back in any shape or form or fashion is a fool's errand because you're trying to give them what you had and they have different lives. It's a different time, it's a different planet, it's a different everything.

• 31:27Dr. John Delony?

  And that doesn't mean that wanting, I think more families should be closer to more families. I get that totally.

• 31:36Dr. John Delony?

  Totally get that.

• 31:39Dr. John Delony?

  And my wife and I make extra, like, we, I mean, it's tough, but we make extra sacrifices to make sure our kids know some of their extended friends and our extended friends and family. I get that totally.

• 31:55Dr. John Delony?

  But also, my kids have a different life than I had.

• 31:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:01Speaker 03

  I mean, what's a safe amount of time? Or how do I just come to the conclusion that if this is what we choose?

• 32:13Speaker 03

  When those feelings come up that I'm sad because it's Easter and my entire family's together and we're not there? Or my son has a pre-K graduation and I see grandparents with their grandkids and my kids don't have that. How do I

• 32:32Speaker 03

  not dwell on that and not spend, not let it just ruin the occasion?

• 32:37Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 32:39Dr. John Delony?

  I'm of the belief now, and I've changed my mind over this, over the last several years, I don't believe we can help the initial feeling. I think a feeling's come.

• 32:50Dr. John Delony?

  I think they're wired in because of genetics, because of personal experiences. I think we have feelings. I think we get to choose the moment we get that feeling, however small or however big it is, to then go do the next thing for us, the next right thing. And so if you see, um, if you're at a pre-K graduation and you see a bunch of grandparents and you are looking at your kid who's looking down at you from the stage and they're beaming, holding their certificate,

• 33:23Dr. John Delony?

  feeling that pang of, ah, I wish Grandma and Grandpa were here. That's real. You can't, you can't, you can't run from that. That's a real feeling inside your real body.

• 33:33Dr. John Delony?

  And then sometimes a quickly, quietly whispered prayer saying, "Miss you, Grandma and Grandpa." And then a moment of gratitude for, "Look at all these other kids. Like, that's awesome." And then recognizing, "I chose to do, I chose this life for me, for my kids, for everybody." And then I'm gonna, I'm gonna try to be as present as I can in that moment. And by the way, that takes practice. That's not something you can just, a switch you can flip on and off. And sometimes you just gotta deal with, "I'm sad. I wish they were here." "I wish they were here." And if you wanna move, I think there's another layer here.

• 34:17Dr. John Delony?

  If your husband's really good at his job, and he's quote-unquote "climbing the ladder," or whatever, and he's doing that stuff well, wherever he drops himself, in whatever town, he's gonna make his way through the ranks at whatever place he shows up at. If he's good at what he does. If he's good with people, and he does his work with excellence, and he works really hard, and he's fun to be around, he's gonna make his way through whatever profession. My fear for you guys is that you have fantasized about not being where you are. And that you're, it, yes, it's gonna be awesome.

• 35:00Dr. John Delony?

  And yes, it's gonna be cool to be around cousins, like, to try to run back your childhood. And at the same time, it's not gonna be, it's, you're gonna go with you. Your feelings are still gonna be in the middle of your chest. And in fact, there's a play, a chance that it all works out great, and there's also a chance that it hurts worse. Because you're, you're my sister, my cousin, y'all are supposed to be here. Well, we gotta work. We got this. Timmy's got soccer. Billy's got violin practice, or whatever.

• 35:32Dr. John Delony?

  Do you and your husband have a good marriage?

• 35:35Speaker 03

  You know, I mean, I, I think we do. I think this is, you know, really the biggest issue we have because it, it comes up more often than it should.

• 35:45Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 35:46Speaker 03

  I'm, my fear is I'm gonna eventually resent him for me thinking he's keeping me here in Texas.

• 35:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 35:56Speaker 03

  And why, you know, when he sees how upset and distraught I am frequently, why isn't that enough to make him say, okay, let's go?

• 36:08Dr. John Delony?

  You have a great point. And if he was on the phone with me, he would probably say the opposite. I'm working so hard to give her the life that neither of us had.

• 36:18Speaker 03

  Absolutely.

• 36:19Dr. John Delony?

  We go home a couple of times a year. Neither of us had this kind of money. We're able to give our kids this, this opportunity and that opportunity. And by the way, Christmas is not as fun as she remembers it when we get home.

• 36:31Dr. John Delony?

  And Thanksgiving is not as great as she remembers it when we get home.

• 36:35Dr. John Delony?

  And you, like, I don't know what it, I'm working as hard as I can for her. I don't know what it is about this amazing life we've built here that she's so unhappy with.

• 36:47Dr. John Delony?

  He'd probably say the same thing just on the other side, right?

• 36:50Speaker 03

  Oh, he does. And, and I, I do see his point. Um, he does very well for us and we don't want for anything. And I don't want that to go unappreciated. It's just these feelings that I just can't shut off.

• 37:08Dr. John Delony?

  Sure. I want you to do the work of two things, two homework assignments for you. I want you to be very clear, not, I had this, so my kids have to have that. Right? I, I call that Uncle Rico syndrome. It's a little bit more sensitive when it comes to family because I think relationships with kids and their grandparents is sacred. And I think, I love the idea of kids and cousins all being big masses of, I, I love that. Um, it's not always reality for most people.

• 37:37Dr. John Delony?

  But I want you to actually be honest with yourself. What do you think that is gonna give you?

• 37:45Dr. John Delony?

  Day in and day out. The second thing is, I would love for you to commit to 60 days, 90 days, 120 days of, "I'm gonna plug in fully here. I'm gonna pretend I live here forever." What conversations would I have with my neighbors? What conversations would I have with my kids, their friends? Would I have a house full of 13-year-olds and 9-year-olds or 2-year-olds? Whatever the ages of your kids are? Would I call other moms? Right? Like, I'm gonna pretend this is where I live, forever.

• 38:24Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 38:25Dr. John Delony?

  And what does actually plugging in here look like? Because if you always have a foot in Wisconsin, you're never gonna be where you fully are.

• 38:35Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's true.

• 38:37Dr. John Delony?

  Thanks for the call, sister. I'm really grateful. We come back, a man asks how to support his wife's desire to foster while being honest that he doesn't feel ready. We'll be right back. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Summer is here and everything is gone awry. The kids are out of school, routines are out the window, we're traveling, we're getting home, we're doing laundry at weird times of the day, we're sleeping less. Listen, if you're not careful, you can end up running on fumes. If you don't slow down and take care of yourself, all that stress does not just go away. It shows up in your body, in your work, in your relationships, in your interactions with your kids and your spouse, in your patients, everywhere.

• 39:20Dr. John Delony?

  And if you've recently been in therapy or seeking help and you've stopped because your schedule's gotten bonkers, it's important to keep finding ways to get the help you need. And that's why I'm a big fan of BetterHelp. BetterHelp is an online therapy platform that matches you with a licensed therapist based on your goals and preferences. All of their therapists follow a strict code of conduct and you can message your therapist and schedule sessions right inside the app. If it's not the right fit with your first therapist, you can switch anytime at no extra cost. Get the help you need. Go to betterhelp.com/deloney and get 10% off. That's betterhelp, H-E-L-P, dot com slash deloney.

• 40:00Dr. John Delony?

  All right, let's roll out to Indianapolis, Indiana, Indianapolis, Indi- don't look at me like that, Kelly. I can read good. And talk to Eric. What's up, Eric?

• 40:12Speaker 04

  How's it going?

• 40:14Dr. John Delony?

  Good, man. How are you?

• 40:16Speaker 04

  Good, good. Hey, thanks for taking my call.

• 40:18Dr. John Delony?

  You got it. What's up?

• 40:20Speaker 04

  I'm calling because my wife really wants to do foster care and I really struggle with that. I don't feel the same way. I don't know what to do with that. I love my wife and I want her to be happy, but I don't want to like allow myself to like get pushed into it or pulled into it and then wrestle with potentially like resentment or feeling trapped in a life that I don't like. And so I don't know how to navigate that. Like, how do you, what's a helpful way to converse as a couple and decide on this? This one of those things you push through because like nobody's ready to foster, like nobody's ready to have a kid, or what?

• 40:59Dr. John Delony?

  I mean, fostering is different than having a kid. Those are different things. And fostering is a huge, huge, huge blessing and a huge responsibility. It's hard, right?

• 41:12Dr. John Delony?

  I would be careful about trying to nail down Jell-O and the Jell-O is quote unquote, "a life I don't like," right? Because you don't know. You don't know what it will feel like to have that extra responsibility and that extra anchoring and that extra like, "Yeah, like I'm doing good in the world. I get to love a little kid like wildly, right? And I get to watch my wife come alive."

• 41:41Dr. John Delony?

  Probably this is one of the reasons you married her because she has a big heart, huh?

• 41:45Speaker 04

  Yes, yes.

• 41:53Dr. John Delony?

  Like if you're honest, what scares you? What do you think's gonna happen?

• 41:57Speaker 04

  Oh, man.

• 42:00Speaker 04

  Life, like, already just feels, um, very busy. Um, feels like overcommitted. I don't feel like I have enough time myself. Um, and so, yeah, I think that's, like, mostly what concerns me.

• 42:17Dr. John Delony?

  Do you have young kids?

• 42:19Speaker 04

  No, we don't. No, we wanna have kids, but I think we're probably unlikely to naturally.

• 42:26Dr. John Delony?

  What makes you think that?

• 42:27Speaker 04

  And so, that's... We've had some, like, fertility tests and stuff, and so, it looks like it might be a difficult road for that.

• 42:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Um, and I've been down that road personally, so, uh, shout out to you guys. It's hard. It's hard. Um, can I ask a personal question?

• 42:46Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 42:46Dr. John Delony?

  Where does the infertility challenges lie?

• 42:52Speaker 04

  Uh...

• 42:54Dr. John Delony?

  I just, uh, you just cut out.

• 42:58Speaker 04

  Uh, on my end, with me. I had to do, like, six months of chemo when I was, like, fifteen or sixteen. And I'm pretty sure that's what hit me in.

• 43:08Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I've got some close, personal friends that, in a very similar situation, it's tough. Um, I mean, they're an N equals one, and this doesn't work out for everybody, but I can tell you that exact situation. And, um, they just, they're on foster number two, and it's been a gut-wrenching, amazing, scary, terrifying, life-changing, wonderful adventure.

• 43:33Dr. John Delony?

  And, um, I've spent time with both of their foster kids, and both of them are amazing and super challenging and all that stuff altogether.

• 43:41Speaker 04

  Um, yeah.

• 43:43Dr. John Delony?

  If there's any shame or guilt on your end, I want you to be honest about that and head directly into that. As though you don't wanna capitulate to a plan B for your wife because you can't give her kids.

• 43:59Dr. John Delony?

  And if you're wrestling with that, I want you to be honest about it, okay?

• 44:02Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 44:03Dr. John Delony?

  And that's hard.

• 44:07Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't feel like, yeah, I don't, I haven't really experienced that. I mean, I know there was nothing really that I can could do about it. Like, I was just stuck with, you know, doing chemo.

• 44:20Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I mean, of course, of course. It's not, it's not a matter of guilt like, I screwed something up. But if you married somebody and all she's wanted since she was a little girl's kids and she chose you, that's hard, right? That's just hard. This is what it is. And you, nobody did anything wrong, but life just handed this to both of you, right?

• 44:41Dr. John Delony?

  The second part of it is, man, if you're, if you're quote unquote, already overcommitted, or you don't have any time for yourself, I would say you have a wild scheduling issue.

• 44:52Dr. John Delony?

  How old are you?

• 44:54Speaker 04

  Uh, thirty-three.

• 44:57Dr. John Delony?

  All right, can I be a jerk for a second? Is that cool?

• 45:00Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 45:01Dr. John Delony?

  Like, if we're, if we were hanging out, having a drink, just eating nachos, I would take a drink before I said this. My daughter was just in the booth because my wife had to go to a doctor's appointment and she dropped my daughter off, who got to hear the first call and a half. By the way, she was not impressed. She's ten, not impressed at all.

• 45:21Dr. John Delony?

  And I have two kids, a high school kid, an elementary school kid, plus a full-time job, plus I'm on the road all the time, plus my wife's got two jobs, and I'm writing a book, like, and I go do stand-up comedy and I play in a band. Where do you not have time?

• 45:37Dr. John Delony?

  You get what I'm saying?

• 45:39Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 45:40Dr. John Delony?

  Like, I, I feel like I've got a pretty busy life and I've got a pretty amazing wife and

• 45:50Dr. John Delony?

  there's seasons when I don't have time, but like, tell me what you're experiencing where you don't think you could, you don't have quote unquote, space.

• 45:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 46:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, so, I mean, I, uh, own a coffee business with my family, so that keeps us, uh, pretty busy, just like, running that and probably in like a growth season there, so there's some thoughts about, about that. Um, I also, just like, things around the house, like, the more we put on our calendar, the more chaotic and disorderly the, the house feels, and that's, that might be a big one, just like, coming home and it's just like, feels chaotic, and we're working on buying this house for my grandpa, it's kind of like a fixer-upper, and so like, I just see these projects when I'm at home,

• 46:43Speaker 04

  and I see these projects when I'm at work, and it's just like, constantly kinda spinning. I try to block out evenings or whatever, just to, like, turn everything off, um, so I'm not just always spinning, but, uh, those are probably like, bigger, the bigger ones, I guess, specifically.

• 47:03Dr. John Delony?

  So, remember, remember these, these truisms, okay?

• 47:07Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 47:07Dr. John Delony?

  We work so we can live, we don't live to work.

• 47:11Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 47:12Dr. John Delony?

  And the reason we work is to help people, and as a bona fide caffeine addict, I applaud you, thank you for putting coffee into the world, and hopefully it's good coffee. As someone who loves family businesses, I'm, I honor you for working with your family, because that's hard, right? But we do those things so that we can have the life we want.

• 47:36Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 47:36Dr. John Delony?

  Right? Not the other way around. And if you want to take on a cool project and resurrect your grandfather's old house and fix it up, and you and your wife want to do this together, that's amazing and awesome, but that's, that's a life you're entering into, it's not a bunch of crap you have to do so that, then you can, quote-unquote, turn it all off.

• 47:55Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 47:55Dr. John Delony?

  What I have found is, when people open their eyes in the morning, and they try to get through their day, so they can get to the recliner at the end of the day, they've built a life of misery for those, for themselves.

• 48:10Dr. John Delony?

  And what I want to do is get to the end of the day and collapse in my pillow because I worked really hard. And I had a day full of laughter and relationships and adventure and hard work and is sometimes tiny little amounts of fun or whatever. Right? I can just tell you this, in a million years, in a million years, 22 year old me would have never for a second believed that when I open my eyes nowadays, I can't wait to get up and go into my garage home gym and work out with my 16 year old son. Ever.

• 48:46Dr. John Delony?

  I could never have imagined that when Turnstile was coming to town, the first person I would text is my son saying, you finally get to come to a real mosh putting show with your old man.

• 48:56Dr. John Delony?

  Never in a million years would I think I'm scanning the country music concerts to take my son or my daughter to.

• 49:03Dr. John Delony?

  Everything changed. And I could only see it on this side of the fence.

• 49:10Dr. John Delony?

  And so what I don't want you to do is to imagine all, the math doesn't work. I'll say it that way. Right? You will have less sex for a season and then it will come back. You'll have less money forever and ever. Amen. Right? Like you'll be busy. You'll always have that sense of there's another human being relying on us.

• 49:31Dr. John Delony?

  And so the algorithm on this side of the fence never makes sense. But I tell you what, man, I did not realize what being alive was.

• 49:42Dr. John Delony?

  Until I was on the other side of that fence with two kids looking at me saying, hey dad.

• 49:51Dr. John Delony?

  And so I, I can't tell you, if you say, hey, I don't want to foster, your wife is owed that level of honesty and integrity.

• 50:01Dr. John Delony?

  And please, please, please don't just quote unquote, do this to keep her happy. That little kid that you take in deserves more than that.

• 50:11Dr. John Delony?

  And yes, there is no, there's no like right time.

• 50:17Dr. John Delony?

  Like you're never going to be not busy enough or the house will be just perfect enough or whatever.

• 50:24Dr. John Delony?

  Right? But I promise you this, man, when you're 90 and you're in a rocking chair on the front of an old creaky porch, holding your wife's wrinkled up hand.

• 50:38Dr. John Delony?

  And y'all have had a series of foster kids and you end up adopting a few of them and y'all have a wild, exhausting, frustrating, adventure-filled life. I promise you won't look at each other and say, "Man, I wish we hadn't have done this and we'd changed the cabinets."

• 50:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:55Dr. John Delony?

  I can promise you that.

• 50:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:01Dr. John Delony?

  And also, it sounds like I'm berating you, I'm not. If fostering is not for you, it's very, very hard. Very hard. Navigating the court system, learning this kid's story as it unfolds, like, all that is really, really hard. It's not for everybody.

• 51:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:22Dr. John Delony?

  And so if it's not for you, be honest.

• 51:24Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:25Dr. John Delony?

  Um, it changes you. And it's, I tell you what, man, like, I, few people do I salute more than those who choose to enter into foster care. And step, I mean, that is, that's, that's a team, a family that is heading into really messy lives and saying, "We're gonna be the change we wanna see in the world." That's a high, high calling and/or it's a high, high form of service. Because regardless of what parents are going through, regardless of what parents are struggling with, or doing or not doing, those little kids, man. So shout out to you, brother.

• 52:10Dr. John Delony?

  I wish you guys the best. Thanks for the call. We'll be right back. I've seen the data. So many of you avoid talking about life insurance because it forces you to imagine things that you don't wanna think about. Here's what you need to remember. Life insurance is not really for you. It's protection for the people you love and the people who depend on you. I recommend term life insurance from Zander Insurance. When a family loses someone they depend on, the last thing they need is financial chaos on top of the deep grief. People don't always realize how much they carry for their family every day. Childcare, meals, transportation, paying bills, holding everything together.

• 52:53Dr. John Delony?

  Term life insurance helps protect your family so they can focus on grieving and healing and not scrambling to figure out money. Xander is the company that I've used for years, long before I had a show, because I trust them. Xander makes buying term life insurance simple. Their team shops top-rated companies for you. They work for you, not the insurance companies. And they help you understand your options in plain language, and they help you find coverage that fits your family and your budget without pressure, gimmicks, or confusion. You don't need a sales pitch, you need protection for your loved ones. Go to Xander.com to get a quote today. That's Xander with a Z dot com.

• 53:36Dr. John Delony?

  All right, Kelly, something awesome happened. What is it?

• 53:38Speaker 02

  All right, so this was, I think I've mentioned before, there's an Instagram channel out there called Good News Movement, and I love it. It's just happy, joyful things that are happening in the world.

• 53:49Dr. John Delony?

  That's better than the Instagram joys forward me from the other channel you follow called Bowel Movement. I'm glad. Tell me about Good News Movement. That sounds way better than what you usually send me.

• 54:00Speaker 02

  Nothing that you ever say will be featured on this channel. Let's start with that. No, so this was one that they posted the other day, and it's a little long, so bear with me, but I thought it was pretty awesome, and it ties into a lot of the things we talk about. So, someone posted, "I'm a cashier at a grocery store, night shift, 10:00 PM to 6:00 AM. You see the same people, insomniacs, night workers, people avoiding empty homes. Last week, a man came in through my line at 2:00 AM, bought $17.23 in groceries, paid with a $20 bill. When I handed him his receipt, he stared at it for a full minute, then looked at me and said, 'Can I ask you something weird?'" "Sure," I said. "Can you write something on this receipt?" "Anything, just something a human would write to another human." I was confused.

• 54:45Speaker 02

  Like what? Anything he said. Your name, the weather, a smiley face, I don't care. I just need proof that someone saw me today. He said it so matter-of-factly that it was like it was a normal request. I grabbed my pen, wrote on his receipt. "Hope you have a good night, from Marcus." He folded it carefully, put it in his wallet. "Thank you. You're the first person who has said anything to me in six days." Then he left. Oh, man. Couldn't stop thinking about it. Six days without human conversation. How is that possible? Started paying attention. The woman who buys her cat food at 3:00 a.m. but never speaks. The guy who gets his coffee and doughnuts at 4:00 a.m. headphones in. The teenage girl who buys single-serve meals, eyes down. We're all here, same stores, same hours, completely alone together. So I started doing something.

• 55:30Speaker 02

  Writing on receipts. Little messages. "You matter. Someone sees you. Hope tomorrow's better." Did this for two weeks, no one said anything. Thought maybe I was being weird. Then one night, the cat food woman, 3:00 a.m. She got her receipt, read it, looked up at me. First time we'd made eye contact in eight months. She said, "So you're the one writing these?" I nodded. She started crying, right there at the register. "I'm going through a divorce, living alone for the first time in 32 years. These notes are the only kind words I've gotten in months. I've been saving them. I have 14 of them on my fridge." She showed me a photo on her phone, her fridge, covered in grocery store receipts, my handwriting all over them. "You've been talking to me," she said. "I just didn't know how to talk back." Words spread somehow.

• 56:14Speaker 02

  The coffee guy, the teenager, they started talking. To me, to each other. The store at 3:00 a.m. became different, less lonely. People started showing up just to talk, not even to shop, just to exist around other humans who were also awake when the world was sleeping. My manager noticed. "Why are people hanging out at the store at 3:00 a.m.?" "They're lonely," I said. "They need somewhere to be." "Expected to get in trouble." Instead, he did something I didn't expect. He put a bench outside the store with a sign that said, "The 3:00 a.m. bench, for anyone who needs somewhere to be." People started using it. The cat food woman, the coffee guy, the teenager. Strangers becoming friends because someone put a bench outside a grocery store. The first man came back, the one who asked for the original receipt.

• 56:59Speaker 02

  2:00 a.m., same as before. But this time, he wasn't alone. He brought his neighbor, David. David's going through something, and I told him about this place, and about you, and about the bench. They sat outside for an hour just talking. When they left, the man handed me something. A receipt, from six months ago. The first one I ever wrote. He'd laminated it. Kept this in my wallet every day. On bad days, I read it. Proof that someone saw me. You saved my life with a grocery store receipt that night, Marcus. Thought you should know. The bench is there every night now. People show up, 2:00 a.m., 3:00 a.m., 4:00 a.m., when sleep won't come. When loneliness feels too heavy. When they need proof that someone sees them. They sit, they talk, they exist together.

• 57:41Speaker 02

  All because one man asked for something human on a grocery store receipt. All because loneliness is an epidemic that nobody talks about. All because sometimes, being seen is the difference between surviving and giving up. I still write on receipts, every single one of them, because you never know who's counting the days since someone spoke to them. You never know whose fridge is covered in your handwriting. You never know when "Have a good night" is the only good night someone will have. So I write, every time, for everyone. Because being seen matters. Being seen saves lives.

• 58:13Dr. John Delony?

  Awesome. I won't even add anything to that. That's beautiful. Go out and see you, folks. Love you guys. Bye.