My Husband Refuses to Get a Job

🔥 Microhabits for a Better Marriage. Download the Together app. On today’s episode: A wife whose husband refuses to get a job A mother scared to leave her kids with her parents A man struggling with his son’s transition Next Steps: ❤️ Get away with your spouse today! 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test 📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards 💭 John's Free Guided Meditation 🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. Go to Capstone Wellness to learn more. Get up to 20% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth. Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. Visit Hallow for a 90-day free trial. Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! Working knives for working people—Go to Montana Knife Company to see what’s available now! Explore Poncho Outdoors! Get 25% off your order at Thorne. Visit Zander Insurance or call 1-800-356-4282 for your free instant quote today. Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💰 George Kamel 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dr. John Delony?

  This is an ad for BetterHelp. If you've ever said, "I'm not in a crisis. I don't need therapy," I want you to reconsider. The time to take care of your mental health is before things fall apart. Talking to someone can help. Get started at betterhelp.com/daloni and save 10%.

• 0:15Speaker 01

  For the last year and a half, he's not been bringing in an income. So we've kind of blown through all our savings.

• 0:22Dr. John Delony?

  Why isn't he working?

• 0:23Speaker 01

  His goals are just so high. He's looking for like the perfect solution, the job or the business that he can finally like live out his dreams.

• 0:34Dr. John Delony?

  What up? What's going on? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show. And I'm so glad that you're here. Pull up a seat, whatever you happen to be doing, going for a walk, running through the airport, vacuuming the house, cleaning the car, whatever you're doing, I'm glad that you're here. We're talking about your mental and emotional health, your relationships, your marriages, your kids, anything you've got going on, pull up a seat and we'll figure out what's the next right move. If you want to be on the show, I'd love to have you on. I don't answer long, personal questions on social media, but I do answer them right here on the show. So click the link in the show notes and we will have you

• 1:19Dr. John Delony?

  on. Let's go out to Vancouver, British Columbia, and talk to a girl named Sue. What's up, Sue?

• 1:27Speaker 01

  Hi, Dr. Deloney.

• 1:30Dr. John Delony?

  How we doing?

• 1:31Speaker 01

  I'm, I'm hanging in there.

• 1:34Dr. John Delony?

  Hanging in there. Good. Well, I'm glad you called.

• 1:36Speaker 01

  Hanging in there.

• 1:37Dr. John Delony?

  Pull up a seat. What's up?

• 1:38Speaker 01

  Um, so I've got a situation with my husband and I guess my family. We're in a bit of a financial crisis. Um, for the last year and a half, he's not been bringing in an income and he just doesn't seem to have an urgency to helping solve this problem. So we've kind of blown through all our savings, um, in the last couple of months.

• 2:04Dr. John Delony?

  Why isn't he working for a year and a half?

• 2:06Speaker 01

  I, I don't know. I feel like he...

• 2:13Speaker 01

  He um.

• 2:14Dr. John Delony?

  This is gonna be a crazy request.

• 2:16Speaker 01

  He has.

• 2:16Dr. John Delony?

  Hold on, this is gonna be a crazy request. Don't feel like it. Tell me. Tell me, like. Use the words, the story I've made up is, and then tell me what you really think, not what you feel. Tell me what you think is going on here.

• 2:33Speaker 01

  I think two things. I think um. He knows that I will figure it all out and get food on the table. Um, and take care of. All the financial problems. And I also think he has um.

• 2:54Speaker 01

  His goals are just so high. He's looking for like the perfect solution. Um, to be. The job or the business that he can finally like. Live out his dreams and be that success he's just been trying to be.

• 3:13Dr. John Delony?

  Well, he hasn't been trying to be a success because success begins with grinding. At low levels of positions where you have no. Skills and you have to figure it out. Right? That's how success happens.

• 3:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 3:27Dr. John Delony?

  So he's not interested in that. It sounds like he's living his dream life, which is. Does he just sit around and play video games? Does he do nothing?

• 3:36Speaker 01

  No, it's not. It's just that he spends, like, he listens to podcast, podcasts, he does his devotions. He spends time like researching and writing about. Um, what he wants to do or his business ideas, but. There's no follow through.

• 3:54Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, so he is actively avoiding. He's using his spiritual life and his podcast life and his journaling life. He needs to get his head out of his journal and get a job or three jobs. Here's what's crazy.

• 4:08Speaker 01

  Tell him that. He says, I'm being selfish.

• 4:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:15Dr. John Delony?

  How long have you all been married?

• 4:18Speaker 01

  Um, almost seven years.

• 4:19Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 4:20Speaker 01

  It's our, both of us, it's our second marriage.

• 4:22Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And when did, when did this, when did this start? Did he get laid off?

• 4:29Speaker 01

  Um, he had a business with a friend and it went sour. But I, like, I feel like I gave him a lot of grace initially, like, you need to work through this. But now we're, it's, we're in dire straits here. And I'm exhausted.

• 4:45Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. So, paint me a picture of your financial situation.

• 4:55Speaker 01

  Um, well, our savings are all gone as of a few months ago. Um.

• 5:01Dr. John Delony?

  And are you blowing through savings? Are you blowing through savings, keeping the lights on and the mortgage paid? Are you blowing through savings like?

• 5:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:07Dr. John Delony?

  Is he buying new journals and things like that?

• 5:11Speaker 01

  No, no, it is, you know, keeping the lights on. Gas, groceries, paying the mortgage. But that savings is gone. Um, I pay the credit cards every month, just enough to put the new bills on. Um, the last few months, I've had to borrow money from family.

• 5:27Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, God. And he just still sitting at home?

• 5:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:32Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I, I gotta tell you, I, I have so little use for men like this. Um, I get grieving the loss of a close friendship, grieving the loss of a business. Like, there's some psychology, like, that's a, that's a big weight. I get that. And you don't grieve it by spending eighteen months or two years sitting, like, crisscross applesauce in the middle of a field, listening to podcasts. Like, you have to go to work.

• 5:59Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 5:59Dr. John Delony?

  You gotta go, you gotta, you gotta start grinding it out again. Because if he had gone to work two weeks after his business imploded, he would already be the manager of whatever business he, like, he already would have found his, like, a path towards something, right?

• 6:14Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:15Dr. John Delony?

  Most importantly, he would have found confidence again. He has no, he, that's all gone now. But that, like, talking about him does you and I no good, right? Because he's not here.

• 6:27Speaker 01

  No, I, yeah, but I feel desperate and.

• 6:30Dr. John Delony?

  Does he know that you feel desperate?

• 6:33Speaker 01

  He does.

• 6:35Dr. John Delony?

  So you sat down with him and said, here's, here's our situation. We're broke.

• 6:40Speaker 01

  Yep. We're broke. Um, I've said, like, I need him to get a job because I need to not spend my entire being worrying about food and life and a shelter, right? That I need my basic needs met without it all being on me.

• 6:57Dr. John Delony?

  And what does he say to that?

• 6:58Speaker 01

  Um, hmm. He thought I was being selfish because he was doing the best that he could.

• 7:08Dr. John Delony?

  Well, I don't hate to say this, but the best he can do right now is not good enough. And I don't think he's being honest. This isn't the best he can do. Cause I know too many dads who get up at 5:00 AM and drive a bus. And then they go work a really crappy job and they swing home at dinner for 30 minutes with their kids and then they go back to a third job. Those men are doing the best they can.

• 7:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:35Dr. John Delony?

  And so my question for you is a scary question. What are you gonna do now? Cause you, you, you've run to the end of your, this roller coaster. It's out of track.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Mm hmm. It is.

• 7:48Dr. John Delony?

  So you're gonna put the house up for sale and move in with your family? What are you gonna do? Here's the thing. Your husband has effectively left you. He's just, hasn't moved out. He's just journaling about it. This isn't even about meeting emotional needs or sexual needs, like a lot of the calls on this show are. This is a guy that's watching his wife starve and he's like, yeah, I don't care. You're being selfish.

• 8:15Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 8:19Dr. John Delony?

  Um, I, I guess I, I wanna shine a light here because A, you're not crazy. B, I'm wondering if you're, the last, especially six months, five months, four months, as savings have dwindled to nothing and you're now playing a shell game of credit cards just to eat and keep the lights on.

• 8:37Speaker 01

  Mm hmm.

• 8:37Dr. John Delony?

  When we get in desperation mode, right? We get in desperate situations, we stop being able to see the big picture. Because we don't have the luxury of looking at the big picture because we're trying to survive today. Like, there's some great sociology on.

• 8:53Dr. John Delony?

  A poverty mindset versus somebody who has a wealth mindset. And sometimes it's as simple as if you've been worrying about how I'm going to get through today for long enough, you stop being able to consider you at 40, right? Even when you start getting money, you blow through it because I just, I'm just worried about today. And then tomorrow, I'll worry about tomorrow. But I don't have the luxury of thinking about next week, or next year, or two decades from now. And so I want to tell you, this is desperate, desperate times, and this man has left you.

• 9:25Dr. John Delony?

  He just hasn't had the, he doesn't have the gumption to move out.

• 9:35Dr. John Delony?

  And you can probably hear my frustration. I'm not angry, it's not my situation, but I'm pretty frustrated on your behalf. Because I have no use for men like this.

• 9:52Dr. John Delony?

  But I don't, I don't, I can't tell you what to do now.

• 9:54Speaker 01

  No.

• 9:54Dr. John Delony?

  You're not crazy, is what I'm telling you.

• 9:56Speaker 01

  No, I think, no, I just, I think I knew that these are words that you would say.

• 10:02Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 10:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 10:03Dr. John Delony?

  I know, but I know it's hard to hear. Just on, on the car ride over to the studios this morning, I was talking to a mom who recently lost somebody precious to her, and she knew what I was going to say, but saying it was really hard to hear. And I know that's, you're in the same boat, like, it's hard to hear that, but, um, if you can find the space to just zoom out, not 30,000 feet, 2,000 feet.

• 10:31Dr. John Delony?

  You're on an unsustainable trajectory, and this is not about YOLO and living our best life, and he doesn't meet my emotional, it's not that. You have an active parasite in your house that gets mad at you for wanting to keep the lights on.

• 10:50Dr. John Delony?

  That's madness.

• 10:53Dr. John Delony?

  Husband 101 is make sure your wife has food and a, and a roof, right?

• 11:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I guess that's always been my rule.

• 11:06Dr. John Delony?

  Well, it shouldn't be a rule. I mean, if that's how low the bar is, being married to you would be awesome, because it would be pretty easy, right?

• 11:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:16Dr. John Delony?

  You're not asking for the moon here, you're asking for lunch.

• 11:24Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:25Dr. John Delony?

  Do y'all own your home?

• 11:28Speaker 01

  Uh, we have a mortgage.

• 11:30Dr. John Delony?

  Sure. Do you have any equity in your house?

• 11:31Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah, we do.

• 11:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 11:34Speaker 01

  About 300.

• 11:35Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 11:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:37Dr. John Delony?

  Do you have family members you could move in with?

• 11:40Speaker 01

  Um, no, my family lives across the country.

• 11:45Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:46Dr. John Delony?

  Do you have such an amazing job that you can't move?

• 11:50Speaker 01

  Hmm, it's a pretty good job.

• 11:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, okay.

• 11:54Speaker 01

  Yeah, mm-hmm, yeah.

• 11:56Dr. John Delony?

  So, I don't want to put words in your mouth or in your-

• 11:58Speaker 01

  We have two- Yeah, like, he has two kids that live with us full-time and I have one that's still at home with us, too.

• 12:05Dr. John Delony?

  How old are they?

• 12:07Speaker 01

  Um, mine is 20 and his are 16 and 17.

• 12:13Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so, your 20-year-old, it may be time for you and him to have a hard conversation, or you and her to have a hard conversation.

• 12:20Speaker 01

  Right.

• 12:22Dr. John Delony?

  It's adult time.

• 12:24Dr. John Delony?

  And maybe they can start paying rent.

• 12:28Dr. John Delony?

  And as for his 16 and 17-year-old, have you adopted them?

• 12:30Speaker 01

  No.

• 12:31Dr. John Delony?

  Are you their stepmom?

• 12:33Speaker 01

  I'm the stepmom, yeah.

• 12:35Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Um, he needs to give you a plan in writing for how he's gonna feed his kids.

• 12:45Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 12:48Dr. John Delony?

  I hate to, to, man, I sound like I lack compassion here and I kinda, I do for him, I don't for your marriage. And I'm compassionate for your marriage, I hate it for y'all, both of y'all. Um, I always say if, if somebody files for divorce, the day you get those papers, you are no longer in a marriage, you are now in a business transaction.

• 13:12Dr. John Delony?

  And you don't have divorce papers in hand, but you have a divorced spouse continuing to sit in your house.

• 13:23Dr. John Delony?

  And I always, my rule number one when somebody gets married is, get a joint checking account, those days need to be over for you.

• 13:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 13:36Dr. John Delony?

  You've gotta, you've gotta begin to think, how am I going to be okay?

• 13:47Dr. John Delony?

  Because the person you pledged your life to is not interested in whether you're okay or not.

• 13:59Dr. John Delony?

  Am I being unfair?

• 14:02Speaker 01

  I'm, no, I, like, everything you're saying, I, I think I know from a

• 14:11Speaker 01

  logical place, right? It's just, yeah, and he's a nice guy.

• 14:17Dr. John Delony?

  You know what? He's not.

• 14:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:19Dr. John Delony?

  Because even, even jerks take care of their families.

• 14:24Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 14:25Dr. John Delony?

  It's not nice to watch your spouse turn to ash because they're so exhausted and to blame them for getting dust on things.

• 14:38Dr. John Delony?

  Right? That's not nice.

• 14:40Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 14:47Dr. John Delony?

  I, I'm heartbroken for you. I'm sorry.

• 14:52Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 14:53Dr. John Delony?

  I'm even more mad because he's got kids. He's got kids watching this play out. He's got kids that you're having to put food on the table for.

• 15:02Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 15:08Dr. John Delony?

  So if you don't mind me asking, what are you going to do?

• 15:16Speaker 01

  I don't know. I

• 15:22Speaker 01

  My part of me just wants to go back and plead with him again.

• 15:26Dr. John Delony?

  How many times have you done that?

• 15:27Speaker 01

  To do something, well, a lot, you know?

• 15:31Dr. John Delony?

  So let's, let's just chalk that up.

• 15:33Speaker 01

  Before the mortgage is due, it happens.

• 15:35Dr. John Delony?

  Let's chalk that up, too. That doesn't work. That plan doesn't work.

• 15:40Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 15:41Dr. John Delony?

  We're going to stop doing the same thing expecting different results.

• 15:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:46Dr. John Delony?

  I guess what, what I want you to spend time doing is asking yourself your "or what" statement.

• 15:55Dr. John Delony?

  And by the way, if the thought of getting divorced again, if the thought of breaking up again, if all that madness that you remember still like clearly is lodged in your body from last time this happened a decade ago, and you're just like, I'm not doing that again, great, I'll support you. But I want you to free yourself from walking in every day and looking at him and wishing he would be different. He's not going to be.

• 16:26Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 16:27Dr. John Delony?

  Then it's a choice to add existential weight to an already unbearable weight situation, right?

• 16:40Speaker 01

  Right.

• 16:40Dr. John Delony?

  It's like walking into the weight room and you know the weight you're about to lift or about your max, max, max, and you're already really sore and you're like, let's put some more weight on that bar. Like, don't do that to yourself.

• 16:58Dr. John Delony?

  But you gotta come up with your or what line. Is it 30 days? Is it 60 days? Is it, I'm putting the house up for sale?

• 17:06Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 17:06Dr. John Delony?

  And I'm gonna go rent us a place, I'm gonna go rent me and my son a place, or me and my daughter a place, and if you want to contribute financially to this new rental house, then you can. And I'll give you your 150 grand of equity and the house and then I'm out. And if you want to move in, here's gonna be my rules for moving in. But, I mean, y'all are in a dire situation.

• 17:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:32Dr. John Delony?

  And dire situations require decisive action.

• 17:39Dr. John Delony?

  Sorry you're in this situation. Thanks for calling, Sue. I'm really grateful. This is a tough, tough, tough set of decisions you have ahead of you. Call anytime. If he wants to call, I'd love to talk to him. Love to talk to him. When we come back, a woman asks how to relax and trust her parents with her kids so she and her husband can enjoy their anniversary trip. Be right back.

• 18:01Dr. John Delony?

  So I went into a local store the other day and I just wanted to buy a few things. And at checkout, here's what they wanted. They wanted my address, my phone number. They might as well have asked for my social security number, my fingerprints. They wanted all of this stuff from me and all I wanted was some paper plates and some cups and some gum. They wanted my soul. Every time you give out your cell number, your email address, or you buy something online, data brokers are grabbing your personal information and they're selling it to the highest bidder. This leaves you vulnerable to spam and to scams. This is a big part of why I use and recommend Delete Me. Your phone number, your home address, your family's information, where your kids go to school, all of the stuff is just floating around online, sitting on data broker sites,

• 18:45Dr. John Delony?

  and you've never even heard of these data broker sites. Delete Me finds your personal information online and they remove it for you. Not just once. They keep monitoring for your information and they clean it up month after month. You can close the gap between what you think is private and what actually is. You can't build a peaceful life if parts of your life are being bought and sold online without your permission. Go to joindelete.me/deloney and get 20% off an annual plan. That's joindelete.me/deloney.

• 19:19Dr. John Delony?

  Alright, so I started with Cozy Earth towels. They're amazing. And then I moved on to the Cozy Earth comforters and these big, giant, awesome blankets. And now, right now, I'm wearing Cozy Earth socks. I have Cozy Earth gear in every nook and cranny of my house and on my B O D Y, right? They are awesome. And recently, I got a pair of Cozy Earth Everywhere pants. I didn't need another pair of pants, but I got them. And like all other Cozy Earth gear, they're amazing. I want to tell you about these Cozy Earth sheets. Listen, these are not normal sheets. They're made from viscose from bamboo. You know what that is? I don't, but I do know this. They're soft, they're breathable, and somehow they keep me cool

• 20:01Dr. John Delony?

  without me feeling cold or too hot. They're amazing. They must have been made at Hogwarts. They're so great. Cozy Earth sheets help me sleep better. And here's the deal. Cozy Earth gives you a 100 night sleep trial on all bedding and a 10 year warranty on everything else. So there's no risk filling your house with Cozy Earth gear. Try Cozy Earth for yourself. Go to cozylearth.com/deloney and use code DELONY and you'll save up to 20% off your entire order. That's cozylearth.com/deloney. Use code DELONY. And if you get a post purchase survey, tell Cozy Earth you heard about their amazing gear right here on this show. All right, let's go to Jackson in my SSI, SSI PPI and talk to Jean. What's up Jean?

• 20:47Speaker 02

  Oh, not much. Just trying to raise babies and homestead and do all the things.

• 20:52Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, sweet.

• 20:53Speaker 02

  And planning a trip for my husband.

• 20:55Dr. John Delony?

  You're a YouTuber, huh? You love the tubes.

• 20:58Speaker 02

  Well, I wouldn't say YouTuber, but I did recently start a TikTok, so.

• 21:03Dr. John Delony?

  Yes, you did. It's one of the new rules of homesteading. You have to have a social media account to document it.

• 21:08Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Trying to do it all.

• 21:11Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, man. How long have y'all been giving the old homestead a run?

• 21:15Speaker 02

  Um, well, I would say off and on since we got married. My husband has always been a country guy, you know, all that. He's, you know, had dogs, horses, all the things. And now, you know, we still have our dogs, our hunting dogs, and I'm getting into baking bread and doing honeybees and making soap and all of that.

• 21:36Dr. John Delony?

  Are you making soaps?

• 21:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 21:39Dr. John Delony?

  Sweet.

• 21:39Speaker 02

  Doing it all. But our children, one of our children has eczema, so using the goat's milk soap has worked wonders for her. So that's really why we do it.

• 21:46Dr. John Delony?

  Excellent.

• 21:47Speaker 02

  I don't really sell a lot of it, but it's more just as a hobby.

• 21:51Dr. John Delony?

  Very cool.

• 21:51Speaker 02

  And gives me something to do, you know?

• 21:53Dr. John Delony?

  I love it. I love it. I love it. Okay, so how can I help? What's up?

• 21:57Speaker 02

  So I'm planning a trip for my husband and I. We've been married, this summer will be 10 years and.

• 22:03Dr. John Delony?

  Congrats.

• 22:05Speaker 02

  Thank you. It's our, my longstanding relationship.

• 22:08Dr. John Delony?

  Do you still like him?

• 22:09Speaker 02

  I do. I like him a lot.

• 22:11Dr. John Delony?

  Does he still like you a lot?

• 22:12Speaker 02

  I hope so. But last year, if you'd have asked me last year, I'd have said, no, I don't like him very much right now. We've been through a very hard time last year and we really need to get away.

• 22:23Dr. John Delony?

  Awesome.

• 22:25Speaker 02

  Both of us had to have emergency surgeries and it just kind of told us who was in our corner during that time.

• 22:30Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 22:30Speaker 02

  But that's a call for another day.

• 22:32Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 22:33Speaker 02

  Because whenever I wrote up my question and sent it in, I read it to my husband on Monday. He was like, you're adding too much information for this question. So you need to focus just on keeping, you know, doing with the children.

• 22:46Dr. John Delony?

  All right.

• 22:46Speaker 02

  But anyways, long story short, my husband and I, we've been married for 10 years this summer and I want to plan a trip. I've already got the room booked. I've got it all written out. I've got our places to eat all written down. I'm very organized when it comes to that. My problem is, is my parents. This is the first time we've left our children in six years.

• 23:09Speaker 02

  For more than a night.

• 23:11Dr. John Delony?

  Is that because you're an anxious person?

• 23:15Speaker 02

  Yes and no. Yes, because I lost our adopted child and I had a very traumatic childhood.

• 23:22Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 23:23Speaker 02

  Up until the time I was adopted. And so when I was writing this out, I told myself I wasn't going to cry. You know, I had to write everything down. I've got like three pages in my notebook in front of me with a pen. So I can write down what you have to say.

• 23:37Dr. John Delony?

  Awesome.

• 23:38Speaker 02

  But my children are the ages that I were, I was when my life turned upside down.

• 23:44Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. How old are they?

• 23:44Speaker 02

  I feel six and three.

• 23:47Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, six and three. Okay.

• 23:49Speaker 02

  Uh, my oldest one.

• 23:50Dr. John Delony?

  You want him to stay with your parents?

• 23:52Speaker 02

  Yes, sir. Because my, my husband's family, they work or live out of state.

• 23:58Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 23:58Speaker 02

  And my, my family lives 20 minutes down the road and we try to do as much as possible with them. And my, my parents are great when it comes to, you know, I know my kids are going to be safe. I know my kids are going to be taken care of. It's not that at all, but there are some boundaries that I put in place.

• 24:16Dr. John Delony?

  Like what?

• 24:16Speaker 02

  That every, okay, so.

• 24:19Dr. John Delony?

  And I want, I want you to hear what I'm doing because I want you to begin practicing this with yourself. Okay?

• 24:24Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 24:24Dr. John Delony?

  You have a, you have a thing you need to do. And you wrap that thing in so many layers of stories and emotions. And it makes the next thing you need to do really hard. It's like, it's like you need to walk over 20 feet from you. And you put on your muck boots and you keep stepping in deeper and deeper mud, which makes just that 20 feet to walk.

• 24:48Speaker 02

  That explains it.

• 24:49Dr. John Delony?

  And so I'm interrupting you on purpose because I want to get to the action step, okay? Because you've got so many layers around each one of these actions. So what are the boundaries you've put in place that your parents just throw away or ignore and run right through?

• 25:05Speaker 02

  So two of them are just things that just daily practices that we try to do at home that I try to keep up there. And one of them is with food. You know, we try not to do a lot of sugary sweets.

• 25:16Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 25:16Speaker 02

  Try to cut out the food dye. And I have learned that when they go to the grandparents, that's not always the case. You know, they go to grandparents' house, they only go over there like maybe once a week. So I can deal with that when they come back home. You know, one of our children has eczema and it is food related. And I'm like, I'll just give her, you know, oatmeal bath, do all the extra things if she has a flare up.

• 25:38Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 25:39Speaker 02

  You know, I'll, I won't die on that hill of the food. You know, the other one is the tablet time.

• 25:46Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 25:46Speaker 02

  And what they're watching on the tablet. And I've given a list of like mom approved stuff. And it's been like, oh, you know, they just click from one video to the other. And I don't want to sit there and, you know, sit on, sit beside them while they're on the tablet and monitor what they're doing.

• 26:05Dr. John Delony?

  Great.

• 26:05Speaker 02

  And I'm like, well, that's part of what I'm asking you to do because you can't just walk away if they're just click, click, clicking. Or download this app, you know, PBS Kids or whatever, and don't put them on YouTube, you know?

• 26:20Dr. John Delony?

  So if you, if you write this stuff out. And by the way, whether it's with family or with friends, my wife leaves a pretty detailed list.

• 26:30Speaker 02

  Right, and I do that too with most of the people.

• 26:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 26:34Speaker 02

  But this is where it comes to. So like, and the last one is like, I'm gonna die, the last one is the hill I'm dying on. You know, that is a major boundary for me and, and whenever I mention the last one, which I'll get to in just a second. And even with the other ones, oh, you're just being too sensitive, you're, you know, you're thinking too much.

• 26:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so what's, what's the third thing? What's the third thing?

• 26:56Speaker 02

  The third thing is, alright, so because of things that's happened to me in the past, I'm very protective when it comes to my children and who they're around and all of that. And my parents are not bringing people over that they're not supposed to or anything like that, so it's not that at all. It's just a few times that I've been over there and they've had all the grandkids. So I have two little girls and the rest are boys. The boys are very comfortable with themselves and they will strip down to their underwear and run around the house like little boys do. And that bothers me.

• 27:27Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 27:27Speaker 02

  Um, mostly because if we're comfortable with that now, because they're little and it's innocent and there's nothing wrong with it, you know, because they're, they're cousins and they're just children. If we're comfortable with it now, when they're little, when they're older, we'll still be comfortable with it. So I want to draw the line.

• 27:47Dr. John Delony?

  That's not a real, that's not a real leap.

• 27:49Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 27:50Dr. John Delony?

  Like, like, you, you will find, I, I've spent my career sitting with people who were sexually abused, okay? And so I'm, I'm insane about it with my own kids. And to assume that a three-year-old or a four-year-old little boy running around his underwear is gonna turn into a predator, that's not, that's not an honest leap.

• 28:11Dr. John Delony?

  That's you taking-

• 28:12Speaker 02

  I don't feel that. Like, I don't, I, I don't look at the kids and be like, oh, you're trouble, you know? But it's in my head and my nervous system is like, okay, I experience things that I shouldn't, I should not have at that moment. And I know, I know I'm overreacting, but I don't know how to tell my body to be like, okay, you need to calm down.

• 28:32Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 28:32Speaker 02

  You know, I don't know how to do that. And then whenever I bring it up and I try to talk through it with my mother, um, cause I don't talk about this stuff with my dad, but when I talk about it with my mom, it's, well, you know, you're overthinking it, you're overreacting, this is, you know-

• 28:51Speaker 02

  You know, you're just, you're just putting too much emotion and too much thought into this. But I'm like, these are my children and I have to protect them. And, you know, that's the way that I look at it. And I'm like, I know it's not normal and I know it's not okay. And I feel it so like, I feel it down in my chest that I want my kids to have a good time when they go over there and enjoy the cousins and enjoy being with my mom. But I'm having to leave them for four days. Is she just going to abandon every, every expectation, every boundary that I put in place? And just let the kids just run book wild? And whenever I get home, have to do damage control?

• 29:30Dr. John Delony?

  Well, there, there's damage control because they went to grandma's house and had a bunch of junk food. I'm okay with that.

• 29:35Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:35Dr. John Delony?

  That's what grandmas are for.

• 29:36Speaker 02

  I can deal with that one. Right. I can handle that one.

• 29:39Dr. John Delony?

  My, one of my kids has a severe peanut allergy.

• 29:43Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 29:44Dr. John Delony?

  I don't play with that.

• 29:46Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:46Dr. John Delony?

  And so if they were to go to my parents or my in-laws, and by the way, this would never happen. So if they were and they're like, oh, it's just peanut butter. Get over yourself. I can't because you're going to kill my kid. Right?

• 29:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:58Dr. John Delony?

  And so if your kid gets, has food-related eczema stuff, it's got allergies to certain foods. If I'm going to send my kid to someplace that has a health-related concern. And by the way, I don't hear you saying this as some sort of internet-y health concern. Right? Like if he has, if your kids have nine Skittles that they're going to suddenly, I don't hear that at all. Like if my kid eats this kind of food, then they have a skin rash breakout.

• 30:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:25Dr. John Delony?

  Please don't give them this food. If the person says, oh, you're being ridiculous, then you can't see, I can't leave my kids there.

• 30:32Speaker 02

  Right.

• 30:32Dr. John Delony?

  Right? That's easy. And, and for you, it's an either or.

• 30:36Speaker 02

  Mm-hmm.

• 30:36Dr. John Delony?

  Um, when it comes to, and, and I don't want to put things out into the world, but I, I, I want to be honest with you. Cousins, extended family are prime abusers. So you're not crazy.

• 30:53Speaker 02

  Right.

• 30:54Dr. John Delony?

  And going to war with your body, when you say things like, I know this is irrational, I know this is dumb. It's not. You've been there. You've experienced it.

• 31:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:04Dr. John Delony?

  What I can't get to on this call is, and I want you to dig into it, either way, it's gonna be hard.

• 31:10Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:11Dr. John Delony?

  Which hard do you want to choose? Do you want to sit down and say, when we've gone through this list, my parents are gonna completely dismiss the things that we write down and give them a piece of paper that say, here's what we're asking for.

• 31:25Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 31:26Dr. John Delony?

  And by the way, this is gonna sound cruel, they get to do that. It's their house. It's their time.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  Right.

• 31:32Dr. John Delony?

  And then you can say, I can never go on a trip with my husband because, fill in the blank. And/or, I'm not gonna go on this trip, and I'm gonna be really sad that I don't have two parents who are willing to love my kids in a way and respect me and my husband.

• 31:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 31:51Dr. John Delony?

  Be sad about it. Or, they're gonna be fine over here. Of course, it's appropriate that kids, six-year-old girls don't change with boys. Of course. And if they think that's weird,

• 32:09Dr. John Delony?

  then my kids are not going over there.

• 32:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:12Dr. John Delony?

  Right? But if you think, you know what, they're gonna give them Skittles and Twizzlers, but they're gonna honor this stuff, they're not gonna have little boys running around being inappropriate.

• 32:24Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:24Dr. John Delony?

  And the kids are gonna change. Like, if you think that's gonna be true, then feel uncomfortable. And when you feel uncomfortable, have a code word with your husband that says like, ah, I'm feeling anxious. Ask your mom to text pictures of them a couple of times a day.

• 32:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:42Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 32:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:45Dr. John Delony?

  But either path is gonna be uncomfortable.

• 32:47Speaker 02

  Right.

• 32:48Dr. John Delony?

  Which path do you wanna take?

• 32:50Speaker 02

  I'd like for them to have that relationship with my family because, you know, I no longer have a relationship with my biological family.

• 32:58Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 32:59Speaker 02

  Um, and then my, my brothers and my sisters, we're all biolog- you know, we were all adopted together and I'm extremely grateful for the sacrifices. This is where the other emotions come in, that my husband was like, "You're adding too much into it, you know, just leave it as just how do you get over being anxious leaving the kids?" And this is the reason. I'm, I'm really grateful for the sacrifices that my, when I say my parents, my adoptive parents gave to us. Like, I'm, I'm extremely grateful for that and I don't want, you know, this is out there in the world and I don't want my mom to hear this and think that I'm ungrateful or I think that she's putting my children in terrible situations because that's not it at all.

• 33:43Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 33:44Speaker 02

  But when I bring these concerns to her and I say, "Look, I'm feeling this away," or "I don't like that y'all, you know, the, you know, the boys are just being boys and they're, they're boys," you know, "My kids have been raised with these little boys their entire life. They spent every day together for several years." You know, my oldest one was basically like a twin with the other cousin. They're six weeks apart, inseparable, you know?

• 34:11Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so it's, it's, it sounds like this is inside of you.

• 34:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:17Dr. John Delony?

  Is that-

• 34:18Speaker 02

  How do I, how do I fix that?

• 34:20Dr. John Delony?

  You, you don't fix it. You don't fix it. You work, you walk right through it.

• 34:25Dr. John Delony?

  You're not broken.

• 34:28Speaker 02

  I feel very broken.

• 34:29Dr. John Delony?

  You're not. Your body's doing what it should. It's trying to keep you safe. It's been down this road before.

• 34:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, I told, I told my husband yesterday, I was like, "I feel like I want to just light myself on fire than to deal with this because it would just be easier just to cancel the whole trip altogether."

• 34:45Dr. John Delony?

  It, I don't-

• 34:45Speaker 02

  And just take them with us.

• 34:46Dr. John Delony?

  I, maybe, but are you gonna bubble wrap them forever?

• 34:53Dr. John Delony?

  Or more importantly, you're gonna bubble wrap yourself forever. And is there a night between now and that trip that y'all can spend one night apart? And begin to practice?

• 35:05Speaker 02

  Well, we do that not very often because my, my mom wants the kids when it's fits into her schedule and my husband's family, they work full time, but we, we did. But on Sunday, she had both of my girls, they went and spent all day Sunday and spent the night. And then the, the boy cousins came over and they spent all day together. So it's kind of like a trial run of having

• 35:28Dr. John Delony?

  How'd it go?

• 35:29Speaker 02

  All four kids. They had a blast.

• 35:31Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 35:36Dr. John Delony?

  So you get to make a choice. Do you want to keep going to war with your body? Or do you want to have a season where I'm gonna practice healing?

• 35:46Dr. John Delony?

  And healing will not mean that what happened to you as a kid didn't happen. And healing will not mean that you and your parents, your adoptive parents, aren't gonna not see eye to eye on everything.

• 35:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:58Dr. John Delony?

  Healing means I can feel this way and I can go do the next right thing. I'm gonna take ownership of my life. The good stuff, the bad stuff, the scary stuff. But I refuse to stay a victim inside of this thing forever.

• 36:17Dr. John Delony?

  And healing is, yes, terrible things happened to me as a kid.

• 36:22Dr. John Delony?

  And healing is there are good people in the world.

• 36:27Dr. John Delony?

  And healing is things could go wrong again. And healing is I've done my due diligence. And in this situation, they probably won't.

• 36:40Dr. John Delony?

  And probably is important because they might. That's the world. But probably not.

• 36:47Dr. John Delony?

  And if I feel good about the probably not, then I'm gonna make the next right move for me and my husband. And ask yourself this, by the way. You have this big idea about a trip. This big idea about us getting away. Do you want to get away with him for four days? Is your marriage in a place that y'all want to go spend time together for four days? Is that gonna be good for y'all? Y'all gonna have fun? Y'all gonna look at each other in the eyes? Y'all gonna hold hands? Y'all gonna laugh? Y'all gonna make out? Make sweet, sweet, sweet, no kid around love? All, I'm just being ridiculous, but do you want to do that? Is there some anxiousness about what if this trip doesn't go well? Write this stuff down in your lists. Be honest with yourself. And come to a decision, I'm gonna stay at home from this trip. Or I'm gonna feel uncomfortable.

• 37:32Dr. John Delony?

  I've done all my due diligence. The kids are gonna be fine. And the anxiousness is inside of me. And so I'm gonna walk right through the middle of it. That's your choice. Both paths are gonna be hard. I want to choose the path that's gonna lead me to where I want to be. And where I want to be one day is, I feel anxious about it. I make sure I cover all the variables I can. And then I want my kids to go have the time of their life. With friends, with family, in safe situations. And safe situations don't mean 100%. They never do. They never do. Thanks for the call. I'll be rooting for you, whatever you decide to do.

• 38:16Dr. John Delony?

  But personally, I hope you go on the trip. We come back, a man asks how to keep a relationship with his transgender son despite his personal beliefs. We'll be right back. I love talking about Helix mattresses. I have two people in my family who are getting married this summer. What did they ask me for? Helix mattresses. Why? Cause my whole family sleeps on them and we won't shut up about how great they are. Because Helix mattresses rule. They don't just build one mattress for every human being on the planet. They build a number of different mattresses just for you. Whether you're a side sleeper, a back sleeper, a hot sleeper, they build mattresses for Everybody. Here's what I want you to do. Get online and take the Helix Sleep Quiz.

• 39:00Dr. John Delony?

  It takes like two minutes and Helix will match you with just the right mattress for the way you sleep. No guesswork. This is one of those small decisions that can change how you show up every single day. Go to helixsleep.com/deloney and get 20% off site wide during their summer savings event. That's 20% off at helixsleep.com/deloney. And listen, this discount is only for my audience. With Helix, better sleep starts right now.

• 39:29Dr. John Delony?

  All right. Hey, take two seconds and like and share and subscribe and all those things. It matters. You taking a few seconds, doesn't cost anything, just to click on the things matters. Thank you so much. Let's go to Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Get some cheese and talk to Daniel. Hey, Daniel, what's up, brother?

• 39:48Speaker 03

  Hey, Dr. John, how are you?

• 39:49Dr. John Delony?

  I'm good, my man. What are you up? Sorry, what are you up to? I didn't even finish that sentence. That was weird. What's up?

• 39:55Speaker 03

  Well, um, I guess it starts with about two months ago, my son came out to me as transgender.

• 40:05Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, how old's your son?

• 40:06Speaker 03

  And 18.

• 40:08Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 40:10Speaker 03

  And I want to know how to be able to keep a relationship with him despite my biblical worldview.

• 40:19Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 40:19Speaker 03

  And how that fits in.

• 40:21Dr. John Delony?

  What does your biblical worldview say about being in a relationship with somebody you disagree with?

• 40:31Speaker 03

  Um, well, I still love it.

• 40:38Dr. John Delony?

  That's not what I asked. That's not what I asked.

• 40:39Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:40Dr. John Delony?

  What does your biblical worldview say about being in a relationship with people you disagree with?

• 40:47Speaker 03

  You don't run away.

• 40:49Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 40:51Speaker 03

  You face it head on.

• 40:53Dr. John Delony?

  And what does facing it head on mean?

• 40:58Speaker 03

  It means still enjoying quality time with him and mutual respect despite our disagreements.

• 41:09Dr. John Delony?

  That's what my biblical worldview says.

• 41:15Dr. John Delony?

  And you and I both know that if you have a child that you disagree with

• 41:24Dr. John Delony?

  and who's living a life that you disagree with

• 41:29Dr. John Delony?

  and you choose hospitality and respect and love and staying in relationship with.

• 41:38Dr. John Delony?

  And by the way, all relationships come with boundaries. That's not a free for all.

• 41:42Dr. John Delony?

  You know that that's going to cost you certain people you interact with. That's going to cost you looks. It's going to cost you, right? It's going to cost you because not everybody holds your same worldview, right?

• 41:56Speaker 03

  Right.

• 41:57Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. Um, did your child give you a new name they want to go by?

• 42:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:04Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So having had this conversation with multiple parents over the years, I'll tell you what I've told everybody and that I've seen it navigate well. Okay?

• 42:17Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 42:20Dr. John Delony?

  Did your child say that they've been thinking about this for a long time and it's been weighing on them, et cetera, et cetera?

• 42:28Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 42:28Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 42:31Dr. John Delony?

  You haven't been thinking about this for a long time. You're 60 days out, right?

• 42:36Speaker 03

  Right.

• 42:36Dr. John Delony?

  Were you pretty caught off guard by the conversation?

• 42:41Speaker 03

  Uh, yeah, yeah. He basically had a midnight confession because he couldn't hold on to it any longer.

• 42:47Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 42:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, he told me at midnight.

• 42:49Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, I want to first honor you for being a safe place for your child. Okay?

• 42:57Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 42:58Dr. John Delony?

  That means you're doing dad well.

• 43:02Speaker 03

  He says I am.

• 43:03Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 43:04Speaker 03

  Actually.

• 43:05Dr. John Delony?

  So I want to honor you in that.

• 43:09Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 43:09Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 43:10Dr. John Delony?

  For an 18 year old to come out and say that to their dad, they're, they're risking, I might not ever be able to have Thanksgiving dinner with my family again.

• 43:22Dr. John Delony?

  I may be getting cut off forever.

• 43:26Dr. John Delony?

  And so I want, I want you to acknowledge like that your child trusted you enough.

• 43:33Dr. John Delony?

  And that's a pretty cool thing.

• 43:37Speaker 03

  Yeah, I've been, I've been learning that.

• 43:38Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so that's number one. Number two, I've looked at countless 18 to 25 year olds.

• 43:48Dr. John Delony?

  And said, hey, your parents get a minute.

• 43:55Dr. John Delony?

  If you walk in this door and decide you're a different gender and a different name and a different whatever.

• 44:04Dr. John Delony?

  Your parents had a picture that every parent has when they have a child. And it includes Thanksgiving dinners 30 years from now. It includes Christmases 30 years from now. It includes hunting and fishing trips or bowling trips or art projects or whatever. And you 18 to 25 year old just changed that. They get a minute. They get to mess up and say the wrong things if they're doing it out of love and respect.

• 44:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 44:33Dr. John Delony?

  They get to really struggle with the name they gave their kid, suddenly not being allowed to be uttered in their own home anymore. That's hard.

• 44:45Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. So I'll tell you dad, you get a minute. And a minute is not a minute. It's a season.

• 44:53Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 44:54Dr. John Delony?

  And then you get to decide.

• 44:57Dr. John Delony?

  What you think.

• 45:00Dr. John Delony?

  Respect kindness hospitality means.

• 45:06Dr. John Delony?

  Does that mean I'm, I will go along with the new name you want me to, to call you?

• 45:12Dr. John Delony?

  Does that mean I'm going to. Refer to you as my daughter or as my, I'm going to keep calling you son because that's what you will always be like, you get to decide those things and then your child gets to decide, I want to be in a relationship with that, with you.

• 45:31Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 45:32Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 45:33Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 45:37Dr. John Delony?

  And it's gonna come down to, hopefully, um, let me put it this way. In this particular conversation, over the last, especially 10 years, it gets all or nothing real, real quick. And I just reject that on its face.

• 45:56Dr. John Delony?

  Because no relationship on planet Earth is all or nothing. Right?

• 46:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:03Dr. John Delony?

  None, zero. Not with spouses, not with kids, not with pets, not with any, anything. There is no all or nothing relationship.

• 46:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:16Dr. John Delony?

  And 18 to 25 year, oh, 18 year olds, their frontal lobes aren't fully developed yet, right? So that can be a hard thing for them to stomach.

• 46:24Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm.

• 46:25Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 46:27Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:29Dr. John Delony?

  So walk me through, walk all of us through. What's the last 60 days been like for you?

• 46:37Speaker 03

  Uh, is, is, just kinda start from the beginning?

• 46:41Dr. John Delony?

  No, no, no, I, I'm just interested in, in, like, your, your child's not on the phone. And so, it's gonna sound crazy, I'm, I'm less interested in their story, I'm interested in yours.

• 46:54Speaker 03

  Okay. Uh, well, I, I, I will say, he, he did, when he came out, he was, like, this is how it's gonna be. And I think the wisest thing I did is not say too much.

• 47:09Dr. John Delony?

  Excellent.

• 47:11Speaker 03

  Um, cause again, it was, he dropped a bomb on me, so, um, and, like, I've been praying every single day, cause I don't know what to do.

• 47:23Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 47:24Speaker 03

  And I didn't even tell a single person for two weeks.

• 47:30Speaker 03

  Um, I do have my friend and his wife who've been very supportive. They've helped me a lot, uh, just someone to talk to. We have not told my family yet. So you're like the fourth person I've told, so.

• 47:49Dr. John Delony?

  Just me and you and a couple of million people, dude, we're good.

• 47:52Speaker 03

  Right. You know, I knew what I was getting into and I was okay with that. Um, it's gotta happen anyway. So, um, but yeah, I, I, you know, when it's like a loss, I, I feel like, like when I held him in my arms and he was born.

• 48:10Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 48:11Speaker 03

  All of that's gone. It's, it's like, this isn't how it's supposed to be.

• 48:14Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 48:15Speaker 03

  You're supposed to, I raise you up as well as I can. You meet a nice girl, you get married and have some babies. It's like, I don't even, I don't even know if I'm gonna get grandkids.

• 48:26Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 48:27Speaker 03

  And I have one child.

• 48:29Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And do you hear you, what, what you're experiencing is what I was, you, you just, you just put skin and bone on what I was saying earlier, which is you had a, you, you're holding this baby and kids don't understand this. I didn't understand this until I held my first, my, my first kid. It's amazing how you hold this kid and a boom, a 60 year story shoots out from you. And, and by the way, our stories as parents, that's not fair to the kids, but it happens. It just isn't is, right?

• 48:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 49:00Dr. John Delony?

  And, um, you're allowed to grieve that like crazy.

• 49:12Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's a good way of putting it. That's, that's what I've been doing for the last two months.

• 49:19Dr. John Delony?

  And I don't want you to hold on to this particular story as forever either.

• 49:25Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 49:26Dr. John Delony?

  Right? Cause it's easy to go, well, now I'm never gonna have grandkids and now my family lineage stops with, with me. I'm it. I'm the last, I'm the last male with my name. Like all those stories now that are gonna shoot out from you, um, those are as made up and fragile as the one that you had when you first held your son.

• 49:51Speaker 03

  That's not nice to hear.

• 49:52Dr. John Delony?

  I know, I know, I know. But here's the thing, it's truthful.

• 49:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 49:58Dr. John Delony?

  Every single parent on planet Earth creates a story the moment they they hold their first kid.

• 50:06Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:08Dr. John Delony?

  And it's hard when our kid comes in and says, this story is different now. And by the way, to a much lesser degree than what you're experiencing, it's different when you instantly think, my kid's gonna become a doctor, my kid's gonna change the world, my kid's gonna be a star athlete. Like, parents just come up with stories. It just happens.

• 50:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:30Dr. John Delony?

  And then your kid says, I'm not going to law school, I'm going to to puppetry camp. I'm not going to, right, right? And then you're,

• 50:37Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:37Dr. John Delony?

  You get frustrated at your kid, but what you're really doing is you're grieving the story. And also, if you're a good parent,

• 50:45Dr. John Delony?

  you begin projecting out, life's gonna be really hard for you.

• 50:54Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 50:54Dr. John Delony?

  And again, taking off the transgender conversation, if you think, I want my kid to be a physician so that they don't have to worry about money like I did growing up. And then they tell you, hey, I want to go be a forest ranger and make forty one thousand bucks a year.

• 51:13Dr. John Delony?

  If you're a parent and you're like, no, I want to tell all my friends that my kid's a doctor, well, then you're a jerk. But if you think, oh, I wanted you to have a three hundred thousand dollar salary, now you're giving a forty one, your life's gonna be hard.

• 51:25Dr. John Delony?

  You're, of course, you're gonna grieve that for your kid.

• 51:30Dr. John Delony?

  And then we have a choice. Do I want to then walk alongside you and say, okay, then you're gonna be the best freaking forest ranger that ever lived? You're gonna honor that job, you're gonna work hard, I'm gonna teach you how to budget, man, because things are gonna be tight.

• 51:43Dr. John Delony?

  Maybe I'm gonna make a little bit of extra money on the side so that I can pitch into the college fund for your kid, right? So you start saying, okay, how am I gonna walk alongside you? And for you, your kid comes out and says, I'm changing genders, I'm changing names. You automatically know your life's gonna be hard. And then you also realize, oh, your life has been really hard and you've kept it all inside your chest. I'm sorry you had to do that alone.

• 52:08Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 52:09Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 52:13Dr. John Delony?

  But I, I, you get to, you get to, uh, let me say it like this. You, you get to determine the boundaries you want to place on this relationship.

• 52:31Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 52:31Dr. John Delony?

  And then your kid gets to decide that they want to be in a relationship with you.

• 52:41Dr. John Delony?

  And by the way, I would, I would refrain from making forever statements. I would say for the next 30 days, I'm going to really wrestle with the name change. Cause I gave you this name and it's hard for you to come back and say, nope, here's my new one.

• 52:56Dr. John Delony?

  It's hard.

• 52:57Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 52:59Dr. John Delony?

  It's hard when I've bought you jeans and t-shirts for every Christmas for the last whatever. And now you want me to buy you a dress, like that's hard for me.

• 53:08Dr. John Delony?

  And that's you not keeping secrets, that's you being honest in this conversation.

• 53:15Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 53:16Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 53:17Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 53:18Dr. John Delony?

  And honesty and giving somebody a path to relationship with you. I think that's noble and that's good. They get to decide whether they walk it or not.

• 53:32Speaker 03

  I, I think I've kind of been doing that without really thinking, you know, without having that in my mind. I think that's how I've been going about it.

• 53:43Dr. John Delony?

  I would, after having this conversation with so many parents over the years, I'd almost guarantee it. Because you were safe enough for your son to come talk to you.

• 53:52Dr. John Delony?

  But it sounds like you're walking alongside an 18 year old, making some big life choices. Some big announcements, um, as well as you possibly could.

• 54:07Dr. John Delony?

  And even the, the parents I've met with over the years that are

• 54:14Dr. John Delony?

  celebrating their kids coming out as transgender.

• 54:19Dr. John Delony?

  They still, they still weep because the picture is different now. They still grieve because I had this thing. I gotta change my picture now.

• 54:28Dr. John Delony?

  Even if we're celebrating and throwing a party.

• 54:33Dr. John Delony?

  It's still, it's still a big shift and big change, but it sounds like you and your child are handling this about as good as you can. And so you get to decide what biblical worldview means to you. You get to decide what action steps I'm going to take and you get to decide the boundaries of what we're gonna, what I'm gonna allow in my house. And then your kid gets to decide whether we're in on that.

• 54:57Dr. John Delony?

  I will tell you, I've never heard a parent in all my years of sitting with teenagers and with young adults and their families. I've never heard a parent say, "I wish I had cut off the relationship sooner." I have heard over and over again, "I would do anything to have that first conversation back."

• 55:19Dr. John Delony?

  I've heard that over and over again.

• 55:23Dr. John Delony?

  And it sounds like you chose, it's gonna be quiet and listen, which is always the best approach for any big announcements from kids, especially one as challenging as, "I want to change my name and my gender and here's my rules for being my parent now."

• 55:41Dr. John Delony?

  Sounds like you handled it perfectly.

• 55:44Dr. John Delony?

  Call anytime as you head into this. Sounds like you're doing a pretty, pretty great job. And for all parents experiencing this, you get a minute. You get a minute. Thanks for the call, brother. We'll be right back.

• 55:59Dr. John Delony?

  I'm excited to tell you about a brand new sponsor on the Dr. John Deloney Show, Capstone Wellness. I've spent the vast majority of my career working with teenagers and young adults and their families. I know from personal experience how hard it is to find help and care for a teenager or young adult. It can be a nightmare. If you're a parent and your teenage or young adult son aged 14 to 28 is struggling with trauma, addiction, mental health challenges, or other destructive behaviors, and you're running out of options, I want you to consider residential treatment care. Capstone Treatment Center is a residential treatment program for young men. In this live-in therapeutic setting, your son can fully step away from the chaos of

• 56:40Dr. John Delony?

  the world for a few months or longer and into a structured environment with trained licensed clinicians. This is daily intensive work that has the power to transform your son's life and your family's life. And listen, I know the folks at Capstone. It is Christ-centered, but they care for all types of people in all walks of life. If somebody close to me had a son who needed that level of help, or if my own son needed this level of help, Capstone would be my very first call. Residential treatment is a very serious investment in money, time, and energy, because the level of care is completely different than anything you've ever seen or experienced. Financial aid and other support is available. Go to

• 57:21Dr. John Delony?

  capstonewellness.com/deloney to learn more. That's capstonewellness.com/deloney.

• 57:30Dr. John Delony?

  All right, we're back. Kelly, what's up?

• 57:33Speaker 04

  All right, so I have a question about the Together app. And this is one that I haven't... This is a question for me, too, because I'm not really clear on what you... what's meant by this.

• 57:43Dr. John Delony?

  I'm always very clear, Kelly.

• 57:45Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. Clear as mud. That's you.

• 57:48Dr. John Delony?

  As a what?

• 57:49Speaker 04

  Mud.

• 57:50Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, I thought you said a bud. And I was like, dude, don't bring your weed-smoking stuff in here.

• 57:55Speaker 04

  That's not what I said. That's not the saying. Nobody says that.

• 57:59Dr. John Delony?

  Clear as bud.

• 57:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 58:00Dr. John Delony?

  When you get high, that's what you say. You just don't remember. Okay, go ahead.

• 58:03Speaker 04

  Anywho, all right. You say tension is the door to connection.

• 58:07Dr. John Delony?

  Yes.

• 58:08Speaker 04

  What does that mean in... in the sense of like, a marriage?

• 58:14Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, so...

• 58:16Dr. John Delony?

  Tension is the door to connection. That is, that's not only, I know, I'm restating the, I'm restating it. God, the worst. Tension is the doorway, not only applies to marriage, as it applies to a relationship with kids, your boss, yourself, your body, exercise, any of that. The thing that feels hard. Can I give you a sideways example?

• 58:42Speaker 04

  Please do.

• 58:42Dr. John Delony?

  I'm gonna be clear as mud.

• 58:44Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 58:44Dr. John Delony?

  I was backstage at an event that I was speaking at, that Jaco, the Navy SEAL was also speaking at. And we're, somehow we got to talking about pull-ups.

• 58:56Speaker 04

  As one does.

• 58:57Dr. John Delony?

  As, as, as two dudes do. And I said something along the line, this is probably six years ago now, I said,

• 59:06Dr. John Delony?

  "I can't do that many pull-ups." And in very Jaco way, he said,

• 59:13Dr. John Delony?

  "You can do one." And I was like, "Oh, yeah." And it started with doing one. And I had this tension that was, "I can't do that thing. I can't do 10 pull-ups, I can't do 20 pull-ups, whatever. You can do one." And so I literally got home from that trip and I went down to my basement gym and I just did one. And then the next day I did one, and the next day after that I did two. And it was, it was a, the tension, like me going around it with a story that I can't do that thing, was not the solution there, to getting stronger, to navigating that problem. It was going right through it. And so, in your marriage, tension is the doorway.

• 59:54Dr. John Delony?

  I can't talk to him about that. He never, she always. That is the place, is the path to walk directly into. And that's why, like, sitting down and saying, "I've made up a story that you will never help me with the laundry." Because you think it, you're beneath, you're above it. Um, you think this is a beneath you task, you think this is not your, quote-unquote, "your job in the house." The story I've made up is, we don't have as much sex as I would like to have because you don't think I'm attractive. You don't like, that tension is, it puts everything on the table and that's the path towards bringing people together. The more you avoid the tension, the more, let me put it this way, um, conflict deferred is conflict amplified.

• 1:00:38Dr. John Delony?

  The more you go around tension, the more tense it gets, the bigger the tension gets and it eventually explodes. And so tensions the doorway in the Together app, sometimes the thing that pops up is, write a note and leave it on your spouse's pillow about two or three things you're grateful for. I'm not doing that. They're not gonna read it. They will roll their eyes. I don't even have three things I could say. Boom, there's the tension. I'm gonna walk right through it. I'm gonna put the note down. And that's where we're gonna find connection. And so that's what I mean by that.

• 1:01:15Dr. John Delony?

  Is that clear as mud for you?

• 1:01:17Speaker 04

  That was clear as mud.

• 1:01:18Dr. John Delony?

  So tension is our doorway. Kelly, you're mean to me. The story I'm telling myself is, it's because I'm handsome and really smart and you just feel like less than when you're around me. And that makes me feel sad.

• 1:01:33Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's the reason.

• 1:01:36Dr. John Delony?

  See? Tension gone.

• 1:01:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, just woof.

• 1:01:39Dr. John Delony?

  Love you guys, bye. Whoa, that was a good noise. Woo!