Hunter Schafer: Polyamory, Cheating & Fame (FBF)

Join Alex in the studio for an interview with Hunter Schafer. Hunter reveals why she is loving her current single era and how painful it was being cheated on for the first time. She discusses trying monogamy, why dating musicians is HARD, and what she’s looking for in her next relationship. Hunter also opens up about what it was like growing up as the pastor’s daughter in the South, her complicated relationship with fame, and how she wound up in Euphoria with no prior acting experience. Enjoy!

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Alex Cooper?

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• 0:44Alex Cooper?

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• 2:10Alex Cooper?

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• 2:35Alex Cooper?

  What is up daddy gang? It is your founding father, Alex Cooper with Call Her Daddy.

• 2:44Alex Cooper?

  Hunter Schafer, welcome to Call Her Daddy.

• 2:47Speaker 01

  Thank you so much.

• 2:48Alex Cooper?

  I am so happy you're here.

• 2:50Speaker 01

  Thank you. I'm so happy to be here. Like I just told you, not the, not the vape.

• 2:54Alex Cooper?

  Not the vape coming out as you're like, thank you so much.

• 2:56Speaker 01

  This is how comfortable I'm feeling right now. So, but this means the world to me. I just have to start off and say, because me, my sister, who you graciously led in this room,

• 3:06Alex Cooper?

  love.

• 3:07Speaker 01

  Put me onto your podcast during the pandemic and we were gagging and I'm just, I'm so excited to be here today.

• 3:14Alex Cooper?

  Okay. Little do you know, I really love you because I have to tell you a story.

• 3:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:17Alex Cooper?

  So I think it was a year ago, we were this close to each other and you had no idea probably. We were in Milan and I was sitting with.

• 3:25Speaker 01

  Were you at the Prada show?

• 3:26Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 3:27Speaker 01

  I do remember seeing you there. Okay.

• 3:29Alex Cooper?

  This is.

• 3:30Speaker 01

  Were you there?

• 3:31Alex Cooper?

  Okay, okay. Hunter's sister is in the room. She's saying she saw me freaked out. Okay. This is why life is so fucking stupid because I was standing with my videographer and I was like, oh my God, it's Hunter. And he was like, go say hi to her. And I was like, no, no, like, that's weird. That's weird. He was like, no, go say hi. I'm like, no, no, no. Like I believe one day we are gonna meet in a non like weird or like moment where I'm like fangirling.

• 3:51Speaker 01

  That's totally how I feel about people to like that I gag over is like, if I know that we are gonna, because you have that feeling about people sometime where you're like, I know I'm gonna kick you with this purse. I'm like, I don't want to fuck it up.

• 4:03Alex Cooper?

  But I'm so happy you're here.

• 4:22Alex Cooper?

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• 5:07Alex Cooper?

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• 5:50Alex Cooper?

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• 6:34Alex Cooper?

  Again, that's ziprecruiter.com/daddy. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by Ritual. We are learning so much about how the gut microbiome is key to our mental health, immunity, and of course digestion. And I just feel like I didn't know any of this until recently, which is a problem because this is literally everything that we do need to know to take care of ourselves. But did you know, because now I know, the gut microbiome shifts during pregnancy, ladies, and these shifts can impact mom and baby's health in pregnancy and postpartum. And that is why Ritual created Nadel Biotic, a specialized biotic with clinically studied strains for pregnancy and postpartum microbiome support

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  to support digestive health, mood, vaginal health, and baby's immune health. I have been trying so hard to take care of myself during this pregnancy, and I think something that has been very helpful is actually learning about the things that now I will carry, not only just during this pregnancy, but I will continue to take care of myself in a way that I really never have before. I think sometimes as women, we don't have the tools or we don't know what we're supposed to be doing. And so we sometimes just freeze and we don't do anything. And since having Ritual in my life, it has been so nice to have this daily ritual where I'm actually taking care of myself and my baby, which feels great. So whether you're pregnant, postpartum, or looking for everyday trusted daily gut support,

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• 8:25Speaker 01

  Okay, thank you. Um, you know, I, this is like, well, and we were just talking about this kind of, is like, I always feel like, like the image that I put out into the world, like on Instagram, whatever, is like, very much like the drag version of who I am. And it's like an image that I've put together to like, give to the world. And, and like, that is not how I dress and act. Real life and so but like this, I feel like your podcast is very about like.

• 8:54Alex Cooper?

  Cozy.

• 8:55Speaker 01

  Let's do like give realness and this is my, I I picked shit up off the floor and put a little stupid outfit together and that's what it, that's what this is.

• 9:04Alex Cooper?

  It's really cute and I'm happy that you're comfortable and that is the key here, like coziness.

• 9:08Speaker 01

  Yes, and RuPaul also, which, okay, can I just say that interview? Like face cracked me, like that interview impacted me so much and also I lived for her outfit, for her give with the, with the, oh my god.

• 9:22Alex Cooper?

  It was so incredible because I remember like you're kind of talking like similar with like Rue like presents a specific way and has these like cunt outfits that you're like.

• 9:30Speaker 01

  This is what I'm talking about, yes.

• 9:32Alex Cooper?

  And I remember when Rue showed up, I was like, oh my gosh. And I remember the rep was like, no, Rue really wanted to show up today, just as like Rue.

• 9:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:39Alex Cooper?

  And this is what like Rue would be wearing like around Rue's house. And I was like, okay.

• 9:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:43Alex Cooper?

  And so I love that you came just like cozy today.

• 9:45Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 9:46Alex Cooper?

  Um, you just bought a new house, like this year?

• 9:48Speaker 01

  Yes, I heard you did too.

• 9:49Alex Cooper?

  Yes.

• 9:50Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 9:50Alex Cooper?

  How is it going?

• 9:51Speaker 01

  Girl, oh my god.

• 9:52Alex Cooper?

  Girl.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  Okay, so I, I've been looking for a house for a few years. To be, to be a hundred percent honest, I have, like, I didn't grow up with, it's, it's a very surreal thing to be like making significantly more money than like anywhere where I came, like my parent, any with, anything that I grew up with.

• 10:14Alex Cooper?

  Yep.

• 10:15Speaker 01

  Um, you know, we're just pretty regular middle class. And now I'm like, I have a, I have a lot of fucking dough. And I have no idea how to, how to use it. And so I, and it scares me. And, and so like, at some point I had to be like, okay, I need to do something with, I mean, money.

• 10:34Alex Cooper?

  My money.

• 10:35Speaker 01

  And, uh, and so, um, yeah, I've, I've been looking for a house. I finally found this beautiful house. And, um, yeah, I've, I moved in. When September of last year.

• 10:47Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 10:48Speaker 01

  Um, and I've started on the whole like now I'm going to hire people to make. I tried doing the whole, I'm gonna buy furniture, buy my s- I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing.

• 10:59Alex Cooper?

  It's so fucking hard.

• 11:00Speaker 01

  Are you doing that?

• 11:01Alex Cooper?

  Oh my god, I literally left it to my husband, cause like back in the day.

• 11:04Speaker 01

  Your husband is, you let your husband do it?

• 11:06Alex Cooper?

  No, no, I know this sounds insane Hunter, but like Matt has incredible taste.

• 11:11Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 11:11Alex Cooper?

  He has like perfect taste.

• 11:12Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 11:13Alex Cooper?

  Now I just let him do his thing because I'm gonna be honest, I decorated my first New York City apartment where I first lived alone for the first time ever. And I was like, watch me bitch, like this is gonna be so gorgeous. I got the couch and the couch sat there for so long and I'm like, how do you make a space look good?

• 11:28Speaker 01

  This.

• 11:28Alex Cooper?

  And I see Pinterest and I see like even Urban Outfitters, like the, it looks so cute and then I buy it and it looks like fucking shit.

• 11:34Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 11:35Alex Cooper?

  So then I hire someone and now I hired my husband to do it, so.

• 11:38Speaker 01

  Amazing.

• 11:39Alex Cooper?

  If you want, he'll come over and.

• 11:40Speaker 01

  I wish, I wish I had a husband that had amazing taste. That is not my fucking case diva. I, I like, yeah, so I, I had, I went through the exact same spiral of like, okay, wait, I like, you know, I look at couches and then I'm like, wait, but, but like, and this is so, I, I hate, it's so like.

• 12:00Alex Cooper?

  It's okay, go off.

• 12:01Speaker 01

  First world, whatever, whatever.

• 12:02Alex Cooper?

  Go off.

• 12:02Speaker 01

  Uh, you know, like I look at this amazing couch, but then like if I spend a bunch of money on this couch and then I, but then the carpet.

• 12:08Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 12:09Speaker 01

  Changes everything.

• 12:10Alex Cooper?

  Huh?

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Girl, I'm, I'm like, I, I tried, I really tried and then I was like, no, so I, um, I hired, um.

• 12:18Alex Cooper?

  A designer?

• 12:19Speaker 01

  I, yeah, so, so have you seen Troye Sivan's, um, AD video?

• 12:24Alex Cooper?

  Insane.

• 12:24Speaker 01

  Insane. So I hit Troy up and, and he was very gracious in connecting me to those people. So they're doing it for me.

• 12:34Alex Cooper?

  God bless.

• 12:35Speaker 01

  And I'm, we are just getting started. Everything in my house right now is completely covered in sawdust, cause the roof just got done and it all came through the ceiling. It's insane. So, you know.

• 12:49Alex Cooper?

  Okay, well, it doesn't maybe matter because you're leaving.

• 12:52Speaker 01

  No.

• 12:53Alex Cooper?

  Can we talk about this?

• 12:54Speaker 01

  So this is all gonna happen while I'm away.

• 12:56Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 12:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:57Alex Cooper?

  Okay, so talk to me, you walk in here and you're like, bitch, you caught me at a great time. And I'm like, wait, why Hunter, why? You're, tell me.

• 13:04Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 13:04Alex Cooper?

  What is happening?

• 13:05Speaker 01

  Okay, so, so yes, you have caught me. And for this interview, a very, it, it, I've had a fucking week, my sister knows this. I've had a fucking crazy week. Um, so I, um, I got this, it wasn't necessarily an offer, but, but you know, people, the ca- casting people for this TV show came to me like, you know, a little over a month ago, and asked if I was interested. And I initially, um, and this is something we'll get into too, is, is, I don't think, you know, I feel like I did TV and that was such a great intro to acting.

• 13:44Speaker 01

  But since moving into films, I realized I love the film format so much more because it's so, it just, TV is so, it's a beast. It's a beast. And so I, I was really like, under the impression with myself that I was not gonna do TV again after Euphoria is over.

• 14:02Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 14:02Speaker 01

  But, um, and, and so I initially, I, I said, no, I don't think I can't, I mean, this sounds really cool, but I, I just don't think I can do it again. And then, um, and then, uh, you know, and then, so they went off and they went into, they tried, you know, they tried casting people and then they came back a little over a week ago and were like, hey, we just wanna gauge your interest again because we really think you are, could be really right for this. And so I was like, okay, I need a meeting with y'all to like, show me really what you're trying to accomplish. It was an amazing meeting. And I was like, fuck, I feel like the universe is like handing me this thing right now. It's not what I thought I was gonna give,

• 14:46Speaker 01

  but I feel like I have to do this. And, um, uh, can I say what it is? It's Blade Runner twenty ninety-nine. So, so there's, you know, the initial Blade Runner from the eighties, and there's twenty forty-nine from twenty nineteen. And so this is the continuation, twenty ninety-nine in TV show format. It's very cool.

• 15:04Alex Cooper?

  Congratulations. That's like insane.

• 15:07Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 15:07Alex Cooper?

  And when you have meetings like that, when you say like, it goes well, like, what do you look for to make you feel comfortable?

• 15:13Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, so like, I, the acting thing. This all, like, I was, I was not looking to be an actor. It's not what I thought I was gonna do with my life.

• 15:23Alex Cooper?

  So crazy.

• 15:23Speaker 01

  Um, I still question whether it is. I've ju- so this week has been this whole process of being like, shit, I have, I'm being handed these incredible opportunities on a silver fucking platter.

• 15:36Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 15:37Speaker 01

  And while it might not be why I thought I was put on this earth to do, like, this is, this is what I'm being fucking called to do right now.

• 15:45Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 15:46Speaker 01

  And, and so that's been like a big processing moment and, um, and I think it's really allowing me to like head into this project and just like fully,

• 15:55Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 15:55Speaker 01

  like, like, just dive in headfirst and like give myself to it, you know?

• 15:59Alex Cooper?

  Okay, I have so many questions of just like how we got here and how you are doing. So you grew up in North Carolina.

• 16:06Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:07Alex Cooper?

  And obviously that's so fucking different than LA. What is your hometown like? Can you describe it?

• 16:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, so, well, so it's,

• 16:15Alex Cooper?

  Your sister is laughing. Why is she laughing? What's so funny?

• 16:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, you know, I, so I've, I, I really, I'm gonna be honest, I, I fucking hated North Carolina.

• 16:24Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 16:24Speaker 01

  Um, and, uh, growing up there, um, being queer, being queer in the South, anybody who's queer in the South knows, it's not fucking easy. It's really culturally, it's, um, in a completely different place than like the bubbles in the cities that we live in. Um, and I always knew that I didn't belong there and that I belonged in these spaces where I can like be myself and like not feel like, uh, there's a target on my fucking back all the time. I really hated it. And like, I, I'm not gonna lie, like, growing, growing up there, like, like, fucked me up. I have now come to love it because I can return there in all my bad bitchery

• 17:03Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 17:04Speaker 01

  and like know that I'm fierce and I don't feel like a fucking nuisance for existing in North Carolina now. So I, I love it now, but, um, growing up there, it was, it was tough. I did not like it. Yeah.

• 17:16Alex Cooper?

  What were you like as a kid? Like, in this environment, describe yourself.

• 17:20Speaker 01

  One of my, like, I guess afflictions with life is I have never been able to really help but be who I am. And, and, um, you know, so even before I transitioned, and I transitioned, um, in my first couple of years of high school, um, bef- but before I transitioned, you know, I'm just like, can I say? Bad words, I mean.

• 17:43Alex Cooper?

  Hunter.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  Like.

• 17:44Alex Cooper?

  Yes, please say.

• 17:46Speaker 01

  So I'm just like this little faggot, like I, and you know, I'm like an extremely high femme boy in this, you know, space of like, you know, boys are like very one way, especially in the South. Like it's just culturally what it is. Um, and but it, I mean, it's one of, I'm so thankful that I have not really been, been given a choice to be anyone but who I am. So I always stuck out like a sore thumb. Um, but I was, I loved like, have extremely artistic, um, pretty happy. I've always had like a, like a pretty easy access to like joy, um, I think. Um, so like despite my circumstances.

• 18:28Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 18:29Speaker 01

  You know, I, I, I look back on my childhood and despite being in a certain amount of pain, just for being who I am.

• 18:35Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 18:36Speaker 01

  I was a pretty happy kid, you know?

• 18:37Alex Cooper?

  That's amazing.

• 18:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 18:38Alex Cooper?

  Like if you're in the South, you're right. As like, growing up, if you are queer in the South, like still to this day, it's crazy to say like, kids are having a hard time. Even fucking California, they have a hard time, which is even fucking crazy to say. So when you're growing up in that environment, I know you have three siblings and you're the oldest.

• 18:54Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 18:54Alex Cooper?

  Being the oldest, was it hard to like open up to your siblings or were they like there for you? Like what was that dynamic?

• 19:00Speaker 01

  I would say the siblings ha- was, was on the easier end because I think that, uh, I mean, you, like me and, me and Hannah, like we, because we're so close in age, so we were in the same schools and, um, and because nobody really understood like what I was doing, I think, you know, we had our trials and tribulations as siblings. And we, but we, we've taught, you know, we've moved far, far beyond that now. And you know, my siblings are some of the closest people in my life now. Um, but, uh, but at the time, yeah, I think it was, it was a little tough for everybody because no one, and not even me understood what like,

• 19:42Speaker 01

  I was going through and why I stuck out like a sore thumb and you know, whatever.

• 19:46Alex Cooper?

  But as happy as you were, that like makes me sad for any kid that's like going through something that's like indescribable in your mind at that point. Did you have a hard time in school? Like what was your middle school like?

• 19:56Speaker 01

  Middle school was probably the hardest, actually.

• 19:59Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 20:00Speaker 01

  Um, you know, young teenage boys are. Are pretty gnarly, especially when they're confronted with like a like a kid who they just don't know what to do with like with they they don't they have no grasp of like queerness, whatever it is. So it's like, it's like, oh, like, look at this fact, like, look at this gay kid, like, they they just don't know what to do with it. And so they'll be mean, you know? Um, and, uh, and, you know, so that was like, that was always tough, just dealing with boys who don't

• 20:32Alex Cooper?

  Of course.

• 20:32Speaker 01

  get it. Um, eh, but I found my cute little nerdy friend group and, you know, and that was like my first experience of like, okay, if I find my circle, I can be myself and I'll be

• 20:45Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 20:45Speaker 01

  Okay, so, so that was, that was cool. But middle school is also when I realized I was gay or like, at that time, I thought I was a gay boy. So came out.

• 20:56Alex Cooper?

  Who did you come out to first?

• 20:57Speaker 01

  Uh, my friends, my friends. So like, and that's the thing of like, okay, I have this this network of support where even if I had my parents

• 21:06Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 21:07Speaker 01

  and don't accept, okay, these people will will get me. So they were the first people I told. And then I would, you know, tell my parents, tell my family, whatever.

• 21:15Alex Cooper?

  Your parents? So your dad was a pastor growing up?

• 21:17Speaker 01

  My parents are still pastors. Yeah. So my dad is a pastor. And my mom is, you know, she's ordained to be a pastor. She works in the children ministry ministry in the church.

• 21:28Alex Cooper?

  Okay, talk to me about that because just like thinking of like what you were going through as a young kid, being in the South and having your dad, like a part of the

• 21:35Speaker 01

  Going up in the church.

• 21:36Alex Cooper?

  How did that work out?

• 21:38Speaker 01

  It's, it's like another layer to it all of of and and thankfully, you know, I didn't grow up in cath- Catholicism or anything. And I hear about, you know, people in my community who grew up in that. And it's like, oh, girl, I'm so fucking lucky that I got to grow up in a normal, even though my parents are pastors and I'm very involved in the church and it in like a on the chiller side of Christianity Presbyterian church.

• 22:02Alex Cooper?

  Oh, my God, Catholicism is

• 22:04Speaker 01

  Like insane.

• 22:06Alex Cooper?

  Like you're gonna burn alive. You're like, I am?

• 22:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. So there was never like this, oh, you're going to hell. But then I would see things about just Christianity in general, where there are churches that like believe you're going to hell. And, and so there was, that was this whole complex that I had to get through till. And then, but thankfully, when I came out as gay to my parents, you know, I think they, I mean, I think anybody could have fucking told you by looking at me that I was, was gay at the time.

• 22:40Speaker 01

  So that was easier. Then the trans thing came on later on. That, that was a bit harder, but.

• 22:44Alex Cooper?

  Did you feel like, not even just you as an individual, like, did you and your siblings feel like you guys had this like expectation around you? Like, I'm thinking of like TV shows and I'm like, the pastor, like I'm thinking like Seventh Heaven back in the day. I don't know, like, did you guys feel like you had to like live up to this? Like, like reputation almost?

• 23:04Speaker 01

  I think it was there. And this is something that I definitely dealt with later on too in life. Of like, of like, you know, cause there's this whole like pastor's daughter, like trope, you know? And it gets kind of tough because obviously like what I do now is very like, I mean, my first job, when I had to tell my parents that I was doing a TV show, and in the first episode, I'm having anal sex with a forty-five year old and cutting myself in the arm, like all this stuff.

• 23:42Speaker 01

  And then, but my first thought is like, okay, they have to tell their congregation that their kids aren't gonna be on TV. And then their congregation who are just, you know, little old nice white Christian people from the South, are gonna watch this TV show and see me getting buttfucked. And, and it's like, it's like, oh my God, I'm like, I, so like, to a degree, I still do, like feel bad because that's something that they still have to deal with, you know, my movie coming out.

• 24:14Speaker 01

  In a couple of weeks, Kinds of Kindness, which I'm so excited about, my one scene in it, I got my titties out, girl. Like, it's, it's like, you know, and, and I have no personal problems with it, but it is something where I'm like, some people just don't, aren't gonna get it. And, you know, that's a whole other thing.

• 24:29Alex Cooper?

  How did your parents react when you told them? And also, like, how do you sit your parents down for that? Is that after the dinner table? Is it a phone call? Is it a FaceTime?

• 24:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:38Alex Cooper?

  Is it a letter?

• 24:38Speaker 01

  So I didn't tell them that I was in the process, in the audition process, because I really wasn't sure that I was gonna do it, because once again, I didn't think acting was my calling or anything. It's not my plan. It wasn't my plan. Um, so I didn't tell them until I had actually gotten the job. Um, which kind of left them in a situation, because it didn't really give them room to like, give their opinions or whatever. Um, but I think they were just like worried because that, you know, they don't come from this world. And sometimes I get really jealous of like my peers in this, um, in, you know, this industry that do have like family in it because,

• 25:19Speaker 01

  I mean, there's pros and cons, but, and, and for some, for a lot of reasons, I'm really happy that my family is in this completely separate world. But, but like the guidance part, I think that's what they were worried about is I think they, you know, even though they didn't know a lot about it, I think they know the nature of this industry can be very intense and they just didn't want me to get like fucked up by it, you know?

• 25:40Alex Cooper?

  That's a good point. And it also sucks, like you're, it's so crazy to think that like your first fucking acting job was Euphoria. Like, that is so baller, but it's also like, I get what you're saying. If you, if your family doesn't come from the industry at all, there's also this like natural judgment of like, are you about to fuck your life up? Like, oh my God, are you making the biggest like decision that is gonna like ruin your whole life?

• 26:02Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 26:02Alex Cooper?

  Where like other people that maybe like are more used to it, it's like, this is how it goes. Like, get the role.

• 26:07Speaker 01

  I just had to tell them. I had to be like, like, there, it is, I think I used the word risque. And I don't think.

• 26:14Alex Cooper?

  Just like a little risky.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  And then, cut to, cut to them at the premiere, like, I don't think my mom could even watch it, like, it's. You know, it's insane. It's insane.

• 26:27Alex Cooper?

  You're like, oh my god, it's almost like when you watch a movie with your parents that has a sex scene when you're young. Um, and you're pretending you're like going to get your ice cream at the time because it's so awkward. Meanwhile, you're like, so that's me. And I can't run away from this. Oh my god, god bless you, honestly. Like, that is strength within.

• 26:45Alex Cooper?

  I'm curious, though, when you were talking about kind of closing out that like chapter of middle school. Obviously, everyone needs a fucking outlet of like, I am dealing with all this shit. Like, I remember reading, like, you said you journaled. I don't know if it was in middle school, but like, what did you do to like, feel less alone with all these thoughts?

• 27:05Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, I think, and it's part of, it's just part of my nature too. And I think part of like, the pressure cooker that I sort of placed myself in, growing up in a place where I was so unhappy with my surroundings is, I, I really like devoted my, my free time and like my life to like, like my art. And, and at the time, it was visual arts where I put all my creative energy. But I knew that, that that is like my gift is like, I'm an artist and, and it's still, to this, like, I know that that's what I was put on this earth to do, was to like make stuff. But, um, but, uh, you know, at the time, it was visual arts. And so I did everything that I could to just kind of like, like,

• 27:50Speaker 01

  like, put all my energy into that. And, you know, it ended up being like my first job, like in high school, my first job was, um, contributing to, you know, making little watercolor comics for an online magazine and stuff, you know? And so that was like, this is what's gonna get me out of here and get me to where I want to be in life, you know?

• 28:10Alex Cooper?

  It's so, even hearing you say that, it's so hard in general, being a child, but like, at that point, it just sucks because like, there are so many kids that get to live their life and be like, not having to escape and get to like, go to the fucking playground and like frolic around. You being like, I was trying to like, use this as an escape so I didn't have to like, deal with like, what the fuck was going on in reality.

• 28:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:34Alex Cooper?

  Then you get to high school.

• 28:35Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 28:36Alex Cooper?

  Did you ever like, talk to anyone that you felt like actually understood you?

• 28:40Speaker 01

  Well, so, I mean, this is the thing is like, when the trans thing started coming up and that, that kind of started coming up with the onset of puberty.

• 28:49Alex Cooper?

  Mm-hmm.

• 28:50Speaker 01

  Which I was experiencing severe, like, levels of anxiety that no, like, you know, middle schooler, high schooler should be going through at that time. Um, for, especially around something that's, you know, quote unquote inevitable. Um, and, uh, and I realized that this like wasn't normal. Um, and then I turned to the internet, because I didn't even know what being trans was. I had no idea that you could, there were trans people in the world. Um, and, and that's the kind of isolating piece of like, growing up in the South, nobody talks about it. There's, there's no people in my line of sight, um, that like are this.

• 29:29Speaker 01

  Um, and, uh, and then so like I, you know, went to the internet, I looked on YouTube and found out like, oh shit, you can, this, it isn't my destiny, it doesn't have to be my destiny to become a fucking man and grow a beard, you know, and all that stuff. And then, but then it's the whole thing of like, okay, now that I know that this is my tea, I have to get everybody else on board, because I'm still a fucking kid, you know? Um, so that, and that was harder, because I didn't know what it was. My parents didn't know what it was.

• 29:59Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 30:00Speaker 01

  Um, and, and that was, that was a bit harder as far as like, you know, there were moments of, like, when I first came out where like, I told them like, I'm a girl and they were like, no, you're not, like, like, you know, and, but it's not, it's not because, I think they've always known like deep down, but like, they didn't, there's, there's, when, when you don't know like what it is, like, there's no way to like, like, real, or, or, I don't know, contextualize that.

• 30:29Alex Cooper?

  It's like the concept, like, when you say that, like, to actualize it.

• 30:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:33Alex Cooper?

  Like, people have a hard time, especially because like you're saying, like, no one around you guys, like, you could relate to.

• 30:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 30:39Alex Cooper?

  So you're coming to your parents with this information and like, obviously some parents are fucking. Fucking awful when it comes to this, but it sounds like your parents.

• 30:47Speaker 01

  They came along.

• 30:48Alex Cooper?

  Right. They were just like, I don't understand what you mean.

• 30:51Speaker 01

  Yeah. And I think they started realizing, cause this, when I, with the onset of puberty and everything is, is where my first, I've dealt with mental health, you know, for a while now, but that's when it first started showing up. Is in depression and anxiety and my grades started fucking up. And I became, you know, kind of, I was becoming a shell of a person and I think they could see that. And then they were like, shit, okay, this is, this is like, we gotta figure this out, you know?

• 31:22Alex Cooper?

  Right. And that's what's like so heartbreaking for houses that like, don't accept their child. Cause it's like, what, like let them be who they need to be because you're right. Like you're becoming a shell of a person because you're not like, who you authentically know you need to be inside. And everything is telling you one thing and then everyone's like, no, no, no, don't do that.

• 31:40Speaker 01

  Well, I think it's out of love. Like I, I think it's like, you know, and I think it's like, my parents' first reaction were, was, was like that because like, they love me. They want me to be okay. And I'm, I'm pitching them this insane idea that I wanna, I wanna chop my dick off and become a woman. Like, you know, like, like, uh, you know, and that's a very crude way of putting it. But it's like, just sort of like get my point across. Like, like, and, and I think no one wants anybody that they love to like endure a harder life than they have to. But sometimes that's, that's the fucking thing.

• 32:15Alex Cooper?

  What I, I love about you and like even sitting here, your energy is just like so incredible. And I think back to like younger you, obviously like going through it, but like, what kind of like traits, I don't know if that's the right word, but like traits, do you think like you gained through like having to really like endure a lot of like, turning inward within yourself and like betting on yourself and relying on yourself.

• 32:39Speaker 01

  Yeah. Being trans has been one of the great challenges of my life. And it sucks that I had to deal with it so, so young and that I live in a world that, you know, is constantly fighting me on that. Um, and it, and it absolutely fucked me up and I'm still dealing with the ramifications of that today. Um, but at the same time, I would not have it any other way because it has taught me. And it's why I'm so thankful for it. It has taught me that, uh, like the power of intuition and kind of like

• 33:16Speaker 01

  the proof that I have like a soul and you know, and like, um, and that there, and that like all the answers are inside of me, you know, and, uh, at least for my truth and my life and, and whatever. And, and like, that is like priceless and, um, and it's something that I use as, you know, a grounding force in everything that I do in my life now, you know? So, yeah, it's, I'm so thankful for it.

• 33:44Alex Cooper?

  No, first of all, like, thank you for sharing all that, cause I, I know it's personal and I really appreciate you opening up because like, when you're saying the intuition thing within yourself, it almost like made me cry, cause I'm like, that is so fucking real.

• 33:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:58Alex Cooper?

  And so many people watching this are probably gonna like.

• 34:01Speaker 01

  That's why I wanna share this.

• 34:02Alex Cooper?

  It's incredible. And like, just sharing your experience, like, that is like so powerful to be like, lean the fuck into what you feel, stop listening to what everyone else is saying. I know it's so fucking hard.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:14Alex Cooper?

  But when you can start to channel that, like, we all know what's best for ourselves.

• 34:17Speaker 01

  Exactly. Even when, and you can even like, you, it's so weird, like your layers of like consciousness and everything, cause you can totally, on surface level, be telling yourself something is right for you, when in reality, deep down, and you, and you know it's there, but you won't look at it, like you're only looking at this thing that you're telling yourself, but deep down, you know, you, you always know.

• 34:40Alex Cooper?

  You always know.

• 34:40Speaker 01

  You know?

• 34:41Alex Cooper?

  You can try to avoid it sometimes. I feel like that's literally.

• 34:43Speaker 01

  Yes, and you literally put yourself in your own psychosis of like, of like believing in this reality that is not actually your true, it's so crazy.

• 34:51Alex Cooper?

  I also appreciate, like, as we're kind of just going through your life, I wonder, and you could, you don't need to answer, but like, is it annoying sometimes? Because like, a part of, a big part of your life is like. This, this moment that you realize like, oh, like, I don't know if I'm like happy with the way that I was like born and I want to be this way. And like, I'm so happy with myself now, but like, is it annoying when you're in interviews that like, like I want.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  I've talked about this before.

• 35:19Alex Cooper?

  Cause I didn't want to be like, I didn't want to ask you about it. That's why I was like, oh, we got to high school in your life. Like, what happened in high school? Like, I would ask anyone on the show and I hope you know, like, you can talk about it as much or not as much as you want, but like, are you like, can we move on? Like, I'm this like.

• 35:32Speaker 01

  So I thought about this today because I just recently had an interview come out where I, I fucking. This was the longest interview I've ever done. It was two, like, four hour sessions. And so I really just was, I was hyped up on caffeine. I was yapping. I was talking about whatever I wanted to. And I did, I, I gabbed about how fucking frustrating it is. To constant, because like in interviews for like press things when I'm promoting a movie or something. It's oftentimes the first thing an interviewer will, will ask about because it's what makes me unique and they know that it'll get clicks, you know?

• 36:17Speaker 01

  But what's frustrating to me about that is I'm here to promote my work in a movie that has nothing to do with that. And you are just fishing for things that will get you clicks. And that's what's so frustrating to me about that. This today, when what I love about this podcast is like, is that you, like, we're talking about real shit and life and whatever. And I can't really talk about my life in full honesty without talking about it. And it is something I do believe, because I didn't really, fame is something that I'm like, I, I don't, like, I didn't really. I knew what I want to do, like, with my life often involves fame to some degree.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  It's not something that I thoroughly enjoy, but I do feel like I have been put in this position in order to.

• 37:10Speaker 01

  Help progress like the movement.

• 37:13Alex Cooper?

  But do you ever feel exhausted from that? Like it's not your fucking job to educate?

• 37:17Speaker 01

  All the time, all the time. And, and that's the thing. I don't like talking about like, just like educating people on like the fact like, bitch, Google is like, like literally, that's how I learned about it. So you can, you can certainly do it too. Um, but as far as like my experience and also helping other young trans people who might watch this or watch some of my other work, which sometimes I do incorporate my transes into my work, you know? That's who I'm doing it for, you know?

• 37:46Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, I feel like there's a difference between like genuinely and authentically, just like speaking about your experience. And people are like, oh, like, I like what she said there versus being like, so Hunter?

• 37:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:56Alex Cooper?

  In high school. And you're like, Jesus fucking Christ.

• 37:59Speaker 01

  I'm promoting uh, the Hunger Games. Why are you asking me about what it was like being a tranny growing up in the church? Like what the fuck are we talking about?

• 38:10Alex Cooper?

  No, I, I respect that. And I just wanted to hear from you because I bet it's fucking annoying. Speaking of high school.

• 38:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 38:16Alex Cooper?

  Did you like dabble with drugs and alcohol at all? Were you like pretty clean? Like?

• 38:21Speaker 01

  So, and that's something that I think the, the church thing that I'm pretty thankful for is, is I did, you know, I, I would smoke weed with my friends and I, and now I've learned to, I've come to learn, I fucking hate, weed is not for me. I cannot smoke it. And I had this really horrible experience with it, like when I was like 18, 19 or something where I like, I smoked and I literally thought I was in hell and then I've never done it again. So I'm like really off of it. Uh, that's the only thing that I kind of dabbled with. And then like, you know, drinking here and there.

• 38:55Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 38:56Speaker 01

  But never really getting into it. That's been more of like a early twenties thing, you know?

• 39:02Alex Cooper?

  You need to be like in your room. Like by yourself, or that can be scary, or with one friend that you trust.

• 39:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:08Alex Cooper?

  And like ease in.

• 39:09Speaker 01

  Yes, cuz that's my thing with weed is, is like, cuz some people can just smoke and just like, kiki and bitch, that is not how, like, when I have smoked weed in the past, I become non-verbal. I'm on the floor and like a creature, like that's, that's just when I have smoked, that's what, that's my tea, that's what I give.

• 39:32Alex Cooper?

  Terrifying.

• 39:33Speaker 01

  And, and you can't do that around, especially people you don't know, then you're gonna psych yourself out and.

• 39:38Alex Cooper?

  Like Hunter, you're like.

• 39:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:42Speaker 01

  No.

• 39:43Alex Cooper?

  And also they're like, it's weed, like it's not that deep.

• 39:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. It is that deep. I think weed is one of the most psychedelic drugs on, on the fucking planet. I mean, that's a stretch, but like it's, it's, it's, I think it is very psychedelic.

• 39:58Alex Cooper?

  Um, okay, let's talk about euphoria.

• 40:15Alex Cooper?

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• 41:00Alex Cooper?

  I feel like once November hits, everyone's either just like booking holiday travel or trying to coordinate where they're gonna end up. And even though it's so fun, it can kind of be a lot. And that is why Airbnb has become my family's favorite way to travel. Has different needs around the holidays, but Airbnb makes it easy to book a spot that kind of just checks all of your boxes. Having one place where everyone can hang and cook and slow down, it just makes the trip that much more special. So before the holiday rush really kicks in, find a place where everyone can actually gather, relax, and make memories together with Airbnb. Call Her Daddy is brought to you by SoFi, the everything app for smarter money. If your

• 41:41Alex Cooper?

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• 42:26Alex Cooper?

  intended to be financial advice. Okay, let's talk about Euphoria.

• 42:30Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 42:30Alex Cooper?

  I think I read somewhere, but like, I don't know if you've ever actually like told the whole story like on a show where I can just hear you.

• 42:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:37Alex Cooper?

  Tell me the story of how you got the role and like how it all came to be.

• 42:41Speaker 01

  Um, I, I was taking Gap year.

• 42:42Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 42:43Speaker 01

  Um, and modeling in New York at the time. I got scattered over Instagram, blah, blah, blah. I go to model. I'm like, I want to make some money. That's not what happened, by the way. But, uh, I left modeling in debt. Um, but, uh,

• 42:55Alex Cooper?

  You can dream.

• 42:56Speaker 01

  That's another, that's another story. Anyways, I'm doing like my model give. Um, and you know, right as I'm getting ready to like, like go to college, um, because that was my plan. I was gonna save up money, whatever, go to college. Um, then this casting call comes about, um, and I see it floating around on Instagram. And then my agency tells me that they have asked me to come in. And so this happened with, there are a handful of trans girls working. There's a Lot more now. There's like a handful of trans girls working in modeling at the time. We'd all gotten asked to come in for this, for this um audition. And I was really like, I don't know, because it's like trans and like, and it's, you know, not written by a trans.

• 43:40Speaker 01

  I'm like, I don't know. And then, uh, but I, I go in because they really want me to and because I'm like, okay, let me, let's just like see what this is about. And I went in, uh, and by the way, I've no acting experience. I have no idea what I'm doing. Um, so I got in and the, the great thing is that they essentially just wanted me to play myself. Um, so I got to basically just like be myself with lines. And I think that whatever it was, it worked for them, you know, so I keep getting callbacks, callbacks, callbacks. Um, eventually they fly me out to LA for like a final audition. Um, in front of all these HBO execs in this crazy room.

• 44:21Speaker 01

  And then I find out later that afternoon that um I got the role and, you know, and I was still teetering on like, do I? This is was not my plan and this changes everything. And I have to be completely honest, then I saw the, the paycheck, the, the, the per episode and I was like, this is more money than I've ever seen in my whole entire life. I, I don't think I can say no to this. Um, um, and, and frankly, at that point, I had also read more of the episodes. I really liked the show, you know, so it's, it's like, it's a combination of those things.

• 45:02Speaker 01

  Um, and um, and I really liked the uh showrunner, Sam, uh, we had had really good meetings and I was like, okay, I feel like, and it's the same thing that keeps happening where I'm being handed this thing. I think I have to take it. Um, and so I did.

• 45:19Alex Cooper?

  It's so crazy that like you had no interest in fame and obviously like I'm assuming like once you took the show, you guys didn't know it was gonna be like what it was gonna be.

• 45:30Speaker 01

  So well, I think we all knew it was something special when we were making it. We all like we loved the first season. It was so magical. Like we all loved it so much. And we, I mean, we still like we look back on it as as like, wow, like, like we all got to grow up inside of this thing together. It's really special.

• 45:50Speaker 01

  But yeah, I didn't, we didn't know that it was going to become what it did. Yeah.

• 45:56Alex Cooper?

  Can you like, take me to that moment where you're like realizing like the show's out, fame is happening, everyone knows your name like?

• 46:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's one of the most surreal things I've ever been through because it's, because you're still the same person. So I'm still the same person. But then the entire world's relationship to you changes like that. And it was, I'm not gonna lie, it was really, it threw me for a fucking loop. And thank God, we all, the cast and I came up in this together and we were able to like, like lean on each other in this just like really surreal experience.

• 46:42Speaker 01

  Because I don't know how I could have fucking handled it if, if, if I didn't have them and you know, like particularly Zee, who's one of my best friends in the world to this day and and, and she, you know, thankfully she had had some experience with fame already and, and we were really close by the time. We really like kind of, you know, fell in love with each other as friends in the first season and she was able to help me through all of that too, but it was very surreal. And I wouldn't say I had no interest in fame because I knew fame could get me the things that I wanted to do in life and I knew that could be a tool, but it's not like I had any person. And I still don't really have any personal like.

• 47:25Speaker 01

  I don't personally gain anything from it. If anything, it's just like made existing in public a little harder as a socially anxious person. But like, um, but it's a, it's an amazing tool to like get what I want and to make what I want to happen.

• 47:41Alex Cooper?

  No, it's so interesting you say that because I, people always say like, oh, people think they want fame and money. But if you just hand them money, then they actually don't even need the fame.

• 47:51Speaker 01

  That, that part.

• 47:52Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 47:53Speaker 01

  Because bitch, if, if I could walk away from all of this with the money and, and not have, oh.

• 48:00Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 48:01Speaker 01

  Life would be.

• 48:02Alex Cooper?

  Right. And some people like it. Like I get that, but like.

• 48:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. So people do, and some people are meant for it. Some people were like, like this is what you were supposed to do, diva.

• 48:11Alex Cooper?

  Do you have a moment where you were like, found yourself like very overwhelmed by it all? And you like were shutting down?

• 48:18Speaker 01

  Um, so I, I remember some of the first moments of getting recognized in public happening. Um, like I think me and Barbie were at a cafe and you know, the first like four episodes or something were out and it hadn't really started. Um, but then, um, but we're just at a cafe, money, our own business. And, and then we have people start coming up to us and it's the first time this has ever happened to me. And it, and it, and it's just really surreal. And then I think the moment that I really realized things were changing was I was in New York doing press. And it's one of those interviews, I forget what it's called, but it's like, it's like kind of public because they do the interview in this like corner glass.

• 49:03Alex Cooper?

  Oh, like the Today Show vibe where it's like.

• 49:05Speaker 01

  Today Show.

• 49:06Alex Cooper?

  Oh, I forget what it's called.

• 49:08Speaker 01

  People can see you from the inside. And, and you know, so I walk in to do this interview and everything's kind of normal. And then by the time I come out from doing the interview, a crowd and paparazzi have amassed and then.

• 49:23Speaker 01

  We get followed around and my, my mom is there with me too. And we get followed around by these paparazzi for the rest of the day. And just coming from what I come like, and it was, I like, I couldn't fucking process it. And it was, it's, it's scary because like getting followed and having people scream at you and stuff. It's, it, it puts you in like, like a fight or flight, like, it's like, like, because you know, you, you can understand on a surface level what's happening, but your body doesn't know that.

• 49:56Alex Cooper?

  And you feel like you're in a cage because you're like, well, I can't open my car door.

• 49:59Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 49:59Alex Cooper?

  So you're just kind of like, I'm sad.

• 50:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:02Alex Cooper?

  Is your mom like, what the fuck?

• 50:03Speaker 01

  I think, I, I mean, my mom was great because I think she knew that I was really overwhelmed. So she was just there for me.

• 50:10Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 50:10Speaker 01

  But I think we both, at the end of that day, had, were, were just like, what the fuck?

• 50:16Alex Cooper?

  Just happened.

• 50:17Speaker 01

  Yeah. And, and then, you know, it's kind of never been the same since.

• 50:20Alex Cooper?

  Well, and I appreciate you sharing, like, you're like, I'm a socially anxious, anxious person. So like naturally, this isn't something that I'm like, let's go. Like, how do you, in moments where your life is feeling too Hollywood, like, how do you come back to being like Hunter yourself? Not like Hunter Schafer, like Prada, Vogue, all the things.

• 50:39Speaker 01

  Yeah. And it's taken a while, but I've, I've created this dichotomy between the Hunter Schafer that I give to the world. And then like Huntie, who that's what my friends call me and everything, like, like those are two different people. And so like she, the famous hunter is kind of like my drag. And having those be separate is so important for my fucking sanity.

• 51:03Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 51:04Speaker 01

  Um, and it's also, I have, it's one of my greatest gifts in this life is I have wonderful, wonderful friends and family. Um, and, and they're people, a lot of them have been around.

• 51:18Speaker 01

  Before I got famous and so they know me and and you know, don't really can't really project my drag on to me like they know me for me um and uh um and so having them there is just like priceless. Yeah.

• 51:36Alex Cooper?

  That's amazing that you've like been able to figure that out pretty quickly because that takes some people like a really long time.

• 51:41Speaker 01

  Was not quick.

• 51:42Alex Cooper?

  Right. Okay. Well, even though like you don't think it's quick, some people literally get to the point where like at the end of their career, they're like, I should have like disconnected more. And I do think, thank God, you have your friends and family that are like, you're hunty bitch and don't forget it. Okay? We're gonna treat you like you're just hunty and you're not Hunter Schafer and we're not gonna treat you different.

• 51:58Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 51:59Alex Cooper?

  That causes people to become monsters that they're like, do this for me and do this for me. And then you're not even a real human. You're a robot.

• 52:05Speaker 01

  No, you're like, yeah, it's it's it's psycho and it's sad to watch because it you, you know, we we do watch it happen to people sometimes. Yeah.

• 52:13Alex Cooper?

  Obviously, I have to ask, is season three happening? Like, what are we doing?

• 52:16Speaker 01

  Girl, um, you know, obviously, I like, the real tea is I have no

• 52:22Alex Cooper?

  No idea.

• 52:23Speaker 01

  Fucking idea what's going on. Um, and you can ask literally all of the cast. Um, and it's, um, you know, it's, I mean, here's the real tea is that a lot has happened. Um, but at least for me and knowing where the rest of the cast is at and everything to, I mean, a lot has happened. We have had, um, and it's hard to talk about, but, um, you know, we've had deaths. Um, uh, girl, getting emotional.

• 52:58Speaker 01

  And, um,

• 53:02Speaker 01

  it's, um, I think everyone feels a certain, um, sense of.

• 53:10Speaker 01

  Oh, girl, sorry.

• 53:12Alex Cooper?

  Oh, it's okay.

• 53:13Speaker 01

  Um, anticipation, um, for like, if we are supposed to do this season three of like, um, obviously, I'm still coming to qualms with what's happened, um, and losing people that we, uh, really loved and we're a part of this family and everything, you know? Um, and, uh, and I think season, if we do go back, it's, um, it's, that's gonna be tough. I mean, and I think there's a world in which we can channel that into making it a beautiful season three, if it is supposed to happen. But I think, you know, that shit really threw everyone for a loop.

• 53:56Speaker 01

  So, eh, on an emotional level, and then there's, you know, all these, you know, industry, whatever, political things that are, that go into whether or not this is happening. But that's emotionally, I think, where a big part of what's happening.

• 54:13Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 54:13Speaker 01

  To, you know?

• 54:15Alex Cooper?

  I'm so fucking sorry and like, it, it clearly, like, you were obviously so close. When you even talk about the cast, I'm just so sorry because like, when you talk about like this rise, like, this is, this became like your family.

• 54:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:29Alex Cooper?

  Like, these are people that you were like, fuck, I don't know how to handle this. None of us know how to handle this. Let's all lean on each other. So like, I can't imagine, and I'm so sorry, and like.

• 54:36Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 54:37Alex Cooper?

  There is no right or wrong, whether you guys come back or don't.

• 54:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:40Alex Cooper?

  It's been one of the most incredible rides.

• 54:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:42Alex Cooper?

  And you guys have done such an incredible job.

• 54:44Speaker 01

  I'm so thankful for it.

• 54:45Alex Cooper?

  Thank you for giving your life to something that has like, really brought so many people, like, entertainment and happiness and like, there's a lot of themes that I think people have like, loved that are very progressive and have just like helped a lot of people. So whether it comes back or not.

• 54:59Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 55:00Alex Cooper?

  We love you all.

• 55:01Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 55:01Alex Cooper?

  And we support you.

• 55:02Speaker 01

  Thank you, and thank you for being, being real with me.

• 55:05Alex Cooper?

  Of course.

• 55:05Speaker 01

  And let me give my emotional tees and whatever.

• 55:08Alex Cooper?

  Girl, do your fucking thing.

• 55:08Speaker 01

  Cause it's still, I'm still.

• 55:09Alex Cooper?

  Of course.

• 55:10Speaker 01

  Still in it, girl. It's, it's crazy.

• 55:12Alex Cooper?

  Grief is a motherfucker and it's not linear. And some days you'll see a picture in it.

• 55:16Speaker 01

  I know.

• 55:16Alex Cooper?

  Or like, a, a thing in the street and you're like, it's.

• 55:19Speaker 01

  It'll hit me on the fucking toilet. I don't know, but it's just like, you know, it's.

• 55:23Alex Cooper?

  You never know.

• 55:24Speaker 01

  It's crazy.

• 55:24Alex Cooper?

  You never know.

• 55:41Alex Cooper?

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• 56:23Alex Cooper?

  And once you find something you like, Revolve will show you similar options so you can build off of that. This is my favorite aspect of shopping on Revolve. I'm like, oh, I really like this sweater. And then all of a sudden, they're like, shop the whole look. And then there's the pants, and then there's the purse, and then there's the shoes, and then there's the jewelry, and then there's the sunglasses. And I'm like, oh, my God, I just put all this in my cart and I never, I didn't have to do much. It's really nice. Also, you can find the best brands, keep coming back to shop new arrivals daily, and find inclusive sizing. Listen, hot girl energy, hot mom energy, whatever era you're in, Revolve has the outfit for it. Revolve has the hottest brands, new arrivals shopping daily, and pieces you'll wear over and over again.

• 57:01Alex Cooper?

  Go to revolve.com/chd and use code C-H-D for 15% off your first order. This is a paid ad by BetterHelp. I always think it is so important to find time to take care of myself because I think self-care for me, a lot of times, is getting some alone time, even if it's just go on a 10-minute walk outside. Self-care can obviously look different at different stages of life, and the ways that we practice it often evolve over time. But one possible way to take care of yourself is through therapy. Therapy with BetterHelp, one of the leading online therapy platforms, can be a space to prioritize your mental health, reflect on where you are, and check in with yourself with over 30,000

• 57:43Alex Cooper?

  Therapists worldwide, BetterHelp has served millions of people globally. BetterHelp makes it easier to fit therapy into your routine with flexible ways to connect that work for different schedules and lifestyles. Plus, BetterHelp therapists have at least three years and 1,000 hours of hands-on experience, and they hold required education, training, and certifications. You can meet with a range of professionals from marriage and family therapists to social workers, counselors, you name it, they have it. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try. Sign up and get 10% off at betterhelp.com/daddy. That's better H E L P dot com slash daddy. Okay, I'm gonna shift our energy and we're gonna play Would You Rather?

• 58:25Speaker 01

  Oh shit.

• 58:25Alex Cooper?

  And then we're gonna get into dating.

• 58:26Speaker 01

  Okay, yeah, we're reorienting.

• 58:28Alex Cooper?

  Okay, okay, okay.

• 58:29Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 58:30Alex Cooper?

  Here we go. We're gonna play Would You Rather? Would you rather wear Euphoria-style makeup every day for the rest of your life or never wear makeup again?

• 58:39Speaker 01

  Never wear makeup again. Easy. No, no shade to Euphoria makeup.

• 58:42Alex Cooper?

  No, of course.

• 58:43Speaker 01

  I just am a no-makeup girlie.

• 58:44Alex Cooper?

  Love it. You're gorgeous.

• 58:45Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 58:45Alex Cooper?

  Um, okay. Would you rather send a nude to the wrong person or accidentally send a sext to your mother?

• 58:57Speaker 01

  That's insane, Alex Cooper. That's such a fucking crazy question. Um, I would, well, it depends on who's getting the nude. Because like my friends and I, like, we, we, you know, they see me naked. It's no big deal.

• 59:15Alex Cooper?

  You may be like, you send it to an ex.

• 59:17Speaker 01

  But what if I fucking send it to my mom? Then that's, might just be as bad as the sext. Um, um, you know, I think, you know, my mom has seen me get buttfucked on television. I think she can handle an accidental sext and we can recover from that.

• 59:35Alex Cooper?

  I love that. That says so much about you and your mom.

• 59:37Speaker 01

  What would you do?

• 59:38Alex Cooper?

  Honestly, I guess I was gonna say the nude, but again, it depends who it's to. Because if like I'm looking cute, I'm like, oh my god. It's like accidentally send it to an ex, I'm like.

• 59:47Speaker 01

  Yeah, but, right, that's, you know.

• 59:50Alex Cooper?

  Not bad. But if it's to like a coworker?

• 59:53Speaker 01

  Or like a producer and executive? No, ma'am. Absolutely not.

• 59:57Alex Cooper?

  I think my mom, depending on the level of the sex.

• 1:00:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:00Alex Cooper?

  Like if it's like a choke on your cock situation, um. I'm like, Mom.

• 1:00:06Speaker 01

  This is such a crazy question.

• 1:00:09Alex Cooper?

  And I wrote it. I'm like, what is wrong with me?

• 1:00:11Speaker 01

  I pray for both of us that we never have to deal with that.

• 1:00:14Alex Cooper?

  Me too.

• 1:00:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:00:15Alex Cooper?

  Me too. Um, what is your opinion on sexting?

• 1:00:18Speaker 01

  Um, it's like, I've tried. I've had, I've had cute moments with it. Never, it's never ideal, I would say.

• 1:00:28Alex Cooper?

  It's exhausting.

• 1:00:29Speaker 01

  It's exhausting.

• 1:00:29Alex Cooper?

  For me personally.

• 1:00:30Speaker 01

  I, I personally, I hate texting in general.

• 1:00:33Alex Cooper?

  Done.

• 1:00:33Speaker 01

  Um, I, if you, if we need to, if we're gonna talk, FaceTime me. You know, I'm a FaceTime girl. Uh, so the texting, oh, no.

• 1:00:41Alex Cooper?

  Have you ever reused a nude?

• 1:00:43Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:00:45Alex Cooper?

  The best.

• 1:00:45Speaker 01

  Absolutely.

• 1:00:46Alex Cooper?

  Perfect use of your time.

• 1:00:47Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:00:47Alex Cooper?

  You're like, ooh, let me go into the storage closet.

• 1:00:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:50Alex Cooper?

  Let me pick out which one I'm loving today.

• 1:00:51Speaker 01

  Go to the library, you pick it out. Yeah, get that shit out there.

• 1:00:55Alex Cooper?

  Okay, here we go.

• 1:00:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:56Alex Cooper?

  Drunkenly hook up with a friend who you know has feelings for you. And you don't have feelings back. Or you have to get back with your most recent ex for a month.

• 1:01:10Speaker 01

  Um, so, uh, okay, actually, you know what? No, like, I, so, uh, my friendships, um, especially a lot of my, I, I come from a lot of lesbians in my circle. Um, and I don't know how many lesbians you've talked to, but most of everybody has already had sex with each other and probably will again. And that is very much the case for me and my, like, like lesbian friend group. Um, so that would probably be no problem if that happened.

• 1:01:44Alex Cooper?

  Easier. Have you ever hooked up with a friend and regretted it?

• 1:01:47Speaker 01

  Hmm. Hmm.

• 1:01:52Speaker 01

  I don't know. I don't really regret too much. Um.

• 1:01:58Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:01:58Speaker 01

  No, I mean, there's, I've definitely like drunkenly done things where I'm like, ooh, girl, like that, like, like, that didn't need to happen, but it's not, no, no shade, no, no, nothing.

• 1:02:10Alex Cooper?

  Okay, okay, fair.

• 1:02:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:11Alex Cooper?

  What is going on in your dating life? Are we single?

• 1:02:13Speaker 01

  Right now?

• 1:02:14Alex Cooper?

  Are we dating?

• 1:02:15Speaker 01

  No, we are, I'm single as fuck.

• 1:02:18Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:02:19Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:02:20Alex Cooper?

  Are you loving it?

• 1:02:20Speaker 01

  I am loving it. So, yeah, so, I mean, you know, like, I think it is perfect for what I, where I'm at in life right now. Um, cause especially given this past week's stuff where I am about to undertake this enormous project. And the last time I did it, you know, I was in my first relationship when I first started Euphoria. And, um, I didn't know going into it how much of me it

• 1:02:51Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:51Speaker 01

  takes. And I really live in that world when I'm doing it. And, uh, and, you know, like, that relationship didn't end up working out because I just had no capacity to like

• 1:03:00Alex Cooper?

  be in a relationship.

• 1:03:02Speaker 01

  So I think it is so perfect that I am single as a Pringle right now. Um, cause I get to just dive in headfirst into this. Um, but, um, but, um, yeah, my last relationship was like, it's where we've, we hit the year mark a little bit ago.

• 1:03:20Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:03:21Speaker 01

  Um, since we broke up. So, yeah.

• 1:03:23Alex Cooper?

  Do you prefer someone in the industry or not in the industry?

• 1:03:26Speaker 01

  Um, it's not really a, I mean, this is, it's still tough and I still like, don't totally know, but, you know, cause I've done both. Um, and, uh, it, they both are really nice for their own reasons because obviously, and I have this with my friendships too, where like, I, my job and my life that I live requires me to be on standby. All the ti- I found out that I'm spending the rest of the year in Europe, like, not even a week ago. And, and, and, and, you know, it's, like, it's hard to maintain

• 1:04:05Speaker 01

  relationships. And so the people that have stuck around in my life know that I operate on this level where like, you know, and, and it's all like, my best friendships are like this, where like, we can go a month or however long and not talk. And then when I, when I come back or when they come back, we can pick right back up where we left off. That's how I operate in my relationships. I, like, it's just how it is right now. Um, and, uh, and so, yeah, like with the relationships too, it's, it's like, it's, it's nice.

• 1:04:35Speaker 01

  Dating other people in the industry because they also work like that.

• 1:04:39Alex Cooper?

  Right, so I get it. Like, they're like, they're not gonna be annoyed that you're like leaving for a certain amount of time.

• 1:04:43Speaker 01

  Cause I've had friendships end because they're just like, girl, like, like, what's going, where are you? Yeah.

• 1:04:50Alex Cooper?

  You're like, I have work.

• 1:04:51Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:04:51Alex Cooper?

  Yeah. Okay, what is the best first date you've ever been on?

• 1:04:56Speaker 01

  Best first date I've ever in, I, hmm, so the date, like, dates is like, not re- I'm just now getting into like the era of my life where like I'm an adult and I feel like more like the, the idea of someone asking me on a date or me asking someone on a date, like a first date where you go to dinner and you like get to know each other. Like, I haven't done a whole lot, like, a lot of, like, my previous stuff is like, we start out as friends or random hookup, blah, blah, blah, blah. Um, and then it turns into whatever it is. Um, but I would like, I would like the dating thing. It sounds fun.

• 1:05:40Alex Cooper?

  No, okay.

• 1:05:41Speaker 01

  Did you go on a fucking date?

• 1:05:43Alex Cooper?

  First date with your husband? I did. It was like the best first date I ever had, which is annoying because I hate that. Like, I feel like some dates could be great first dates and then they like turn out to be fucking shit. It turns out that he wasn't a dick. He actually was a lovely guy and I ended up marrying him. Um, but I've had good first dates, but I've had awful first dates before. I also think like, it is more normal sometimes to just like go from friends and then all of a sudden you're just like hanging out at your house, your apartment and like, that's fine too.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:09Alex Cooper?

  Have you ever had it where like, after a first hookup, you're like, oh my fucking god, the chemistry was so insane. Like, I must see this person again.

• 1:06:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:06:16Alex Cooper?

  So you've had that before?

• 1:06:17Speaker 01

  Absolutely. Yeah. And that's, that's tends to be when those, like, what will turn into a relationship. Yeah.

• 1:06:24Alex Cooper?

  Okay, who is currently your celebrity crush?

• 1:06:27Speaker 01

  Oh, god. Oh, god. Um, let's see, who is not offensive to say that you won't have to run into next week?

• 1:06:37Alex Cooper?

  Oh, no. Um, let's see.

• 1:06:44Speaker 01

  I don't know. I can't like

• 1:06:49Alex Cooper?

  Actor?

• 1:06:50Speaker 01

  I'm trying to think.

• 1:06:51Alex Cooper?

  Musician.

• 1:06:52Speaker 01

  No, well, I have a type.

• 1:06:54Alex Cooper?

  Okay, oh, what's your type?

• 1:06:56Speaker 01

  I, I love a musician.

• 1:06:57Alex Cooper?

  True.

• 1:06:57Speaker 01

  I've dated a couple now.

• 1:06:59Alex Cooper?

  I think I've seen that.

• 1:07:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:00Alex Cooper?

  I think I've seen that.

• 1:07:01Speaker 01

  I've dated a few now. Um, I, I love a musician.

• 1:07:04Alex Cooper?

  One with like, long hair, one with like, short hair.

• 1:07:09Speaker 01

  You know, it's like the little sucker in me that's just like, oh my god, you are so charismatic and you will play the guitar, whatever. And I'm like, goo goo ga ga.

• 1:07:22Alex Cooper?

  Has anyone ever written you a song?

• 1:07:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, and, and trust me, they know what they're doing too. They know what they're doing with that. And, and but it, it works. Oh my god.

• 1:07:34Alex Cooper?

  Like on the guitar, just like sitting on the bed?

• 1:07:37Speaker 01

  You know, yeah, or, or like, you know, send it to you, you know, like, you know, yeah, it's, uh, it, it works. I have fear for anyone who, who has this happen to them, because you're, you're done, you're gone, you're

• 1:07:51Alex Cooper?

  You're done.

• 1:07:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:52Alex Cooper?

  If you meet another musician, do you think you're gonna be like, I have to break the curse and the pattern, or are you gonna go back? Are you talking to any musicians right now? Like, if you find a musician that you like again?

• 1:08:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:03Alex Cooper?

  Are you gonna just go right back in?

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  Oh, girl. Um, I mean, no. So like, the thing that's tough with musicians, or at least in, in like, my line, or like with successful musicians who are like, doing tours and stuff is, is, is like, it's, I mean, and it's, I guess it's the same thing with actors where they have to go off for however many months and tour. And, and then I'm working for how, it's like, it's very hard. So I don't know if that is like, in my path again, because I've done it and I've tried it and really tried to make it work. And it's just very hard. And I don't have, at least at this point in my life, I don't have the capacity to like,

• 1:08:41Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:08:42Speaker 01

  figure out how that works. Maybe someday though, we'll see.

• 1:08:45Alex Cooper?

  Do you like how I like let you off the hook? I'm like, okay, you don't have to answer.

• 1:08:48Speaker 01

  I'm like, I really wanted to give an answer.

• 1:08:50Alex Cooper?

  You'll tell me after.

• 1:08:51Speaker 01

  It's like,

• 1:08:52Alex Cooper?

  You'll tell me after.

• 1:08:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:53Alex Cooper?

  Do you fall in love easily?

• 1:08:54Speaker 01

  So I, like, falling in love is like, so, like, it's, I'm still like, figuring out like, what it means. Because I've been in love with people who are like, Still some of my best friends to this day and um and like we were definitely like in love at that point, but it's changed in its nature and I still love the shit out of this person, but it's not like

• 1:09:24Speaker 01

  that infatuation that so I feel I it's there's a part of me that's like is being in love like just a deep infatuation and then like that sort of subsides and then it just becomes like you just love

• 1:09:36Alex Cooper?

  Love the person.

• 1:09:37Speaker 01

  I don't know. It's sort of funny, but I also I know what being in love i- it's like a whole body like you know, right?

• 1:09:44Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I think that makes sense. I think you're like at that point in your life where you're like experiencing these relationships.

• 1:09:50Speaker 01

  Been through it enough now?

• 1:09:52Alex Cooper?

  Yes, but like you may find someone at some point that you're like, oh,

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:58Alex Cooper?

  wait, that is different than infatuation.

• 1:10:00Speaker 01

  Right, right.

• 1:10:01Alex Cooper?

  That's when you'll know is when you're like, oh, wait.

• 1:10:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:03Alex Cooper?

  Cause love for me when I was younger, like it really, I went through a point where it was just infatuation. Then I was like, is this love or is this infatuation?

• 1:10:09Speaker 01

  Right.

• 1:10:09Alex Cooper?

  And then I think when I met Matt, I was like, oh, this is like different.

• 1:10:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, with my past relationships, I've been like if we were in love, in love, like I know what that is. Yeah. Yeah, and it's confusing. You know what I'm saying?

• 1:10:23Alex Cooper?

  Well, cause it feels different with every partner also.

• 1:10:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I also don't believe in like one true love necessarily.

• 1:10:29Alex Cooper?

  I completely agree. Um, how do you handle when people like public opinion on your like romantic relationships?

• 1:10:35Speaker 01

  That is something that I have learned is um, so my last relationship was my first public relationship. Um, I don't know if I'll ever do it again. At some point when you're doing it, it gets just too hard to

• 1:10:52Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:53Speaker 01

  to like, I mean, you can try to hide it, but like whatever, but I'm also I've I've also come to this point just with fame in general where like people are gonna say what they're gonna say and I really don't give a shit. Um, uh, cause like, you know, I get called a man. Hundreds of times on the internet, every single day. It's like, it's like, I'm, I'm so used to like the

• 1:11:16Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 1:11:16Speaker 01

  Just fucking idiots, just like saying

• 1:11:19Alex Cooper?

  Shut up.

• 1:11:20Speaker 01

  Bullshit all the time. So like, it's, you know, on one hand, it's like, I don't care. And then on another hand, it's like, if you don't, like, obviously, a relationship is, is like, personal and private and, and like, you should not be, you need to eliminate as many factors that are gonna make it

• 1:11:39Alex Cooper?

  Facts.

• 1:11:40Speaker 01

  More complicated than it needs to be, if you can. So, I don't know. I'm, it's something, when I start dating again or something, I'll, I'll

• 1:11:48Alex Cooper?

  Well, I think it's interesting too, like you said, like, this was your first, like, public relationship?

• 1:11:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:53Alex Cooper?

  And I think there's pros and cons where you're like, finally, we can just like, be.

• 1:11:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:57Alex Cooper?

  And like, we can go into an event together, like, as we would want to naturally do, but then you're like, people are taking pictures and then people are staring.

• 1:12:03Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:12:03Alex Cooper?

  And then when you break up, someone like me is asking you about it.

• 1:12:06Speaker 01

  Girl.

• 1:12:06Alex Cooper?

  And you're like, Alex, don't ask.

• 1:12:08Speaker 01

  Well, no, I'm excited to be talking about

• 1:12:10Alex Cooper?

  Okay.

• 1:12:10Speaker 01

  Love and everything. Like, it's not like, it's not like things that I don't wanna talk about necessarily.

• 1:12:15Alex Cooper?

  Right.

• 1:12:15Speaker 01

  Like, I've, I've learned a lot. And something that I really love about all my relationships is I, like, you know, even if like, bad shit has happened in them or whatever, or they have like, fucked me up to some degree or something, that they have all, I all, I feel like all of my relationships, I've come out knowing that it taught me something about myself and about people. And that's like, I feel really thankful for that, you know?

• 1:12:38Alex Cooper?

  Absolutely. I feel like that's like the best takeaway from any relationship, anything in life, even if it's not romantic.

• 1:12:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:43Alex Cooper?

  It's a friendship, it's a work relationship. I was, when I was researching you,

• 1:12:48Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:12:48Alex Cooper?

  Um, I was reading something where like, your former co-star slash relationship.

• 1:12:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:53Alex Cooper?

  He kind of like talked about like, his need for like, to get out of like, his codependent tendencies.

• 1:12:59Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:13:00Alex Cooper?

  I'm sure you read this.

• 1:13:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:13:01Alex Cooper?

  Were you on the same page? Like, is, is a breakup like, where you're like, blindsided? Or like, were you okay?

• 1:13:07Speaker 01

  Yeah. So, so like, he, he said that, um, and, but that, that breakup, um, was, uh, it was like a mutually, like,

• 1:13:17Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:17Speaker 01

  It was a mutually agreed upon, and it was, it's one of the clean Or breaks up, breakups I've had of like, we both recognize that this is not working and we can't do this. We gotta go our own separate ways and uh it was so, so hot. Cause we really, we really loved each other, you know, and he's, he's a really special person and I love his soul and everything. And it by no means was that really, that was, it was messy, you know, but, but um, but uh it was a clean, it was a clean. Parting and um, and he has a lot to work on and I also have a lot to work on like.

• 1:13:58Speaker 01

  And, and like, and so I think that's also why I'm in this like era of like, I'm gonna, I gotta figure my shit out. Because that was, we had a really good thing and, but there, there were things in our own selves that had nothing to do with each other. That kept coming up in the way of the relationship, you know, so.

• 1:14:17Alex Cooper?

  One hundred percent.

• 1:14:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:18Alex Cooper?

  What are you like in a relationship?

• 1:14:20Speaker 01

  Um, I think it's different for every one, like it's really different with every kind of person too. Cause I've been, I used to exclusively date not men. Um, and uh, and this, this last relationship was my first relationship with a man, a cis man, you know? Um, and uh, um, and so in, and it's, it's different. It's very different than that, like uh dating, I've dated trans women, I've dated uh trans men, I've dated cis women. And, and all of, you know, I've kind of been around the buck and it changes.

• 1:14:58Speaker 01

  It like, it, the transness is really interesting because everyone interacts with it differently. Everyone has their own like, you know, like, like way of approaching it. And I have my own way of approaching that relationship with that kind of per, it's, it's, it's interesting. It's a sort of like code switching. Yeah, no, I'm, I'm excited to like talk about it.

• 1:15:20Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, this is interesting.

• 1:15:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I'm so thankful for my first relationship. Um, uh, and I've talked about this before too, um, it was with a trans woman, um, and uh. And it was my entrance into sex, romance, all of that stuff. All of those were firsts in that relationship and it was with another trans woman. Thank God, thank God. And I'm so thankful, and we're still friends to this day, too.

• 1:15:48Speaker 01

  That, you know, she kind of like showed me the ropes because, you know, dating as a trans person is, it's complicated, let me tell you. It's, it's, it's not easy. And to know in my first relationship and in my first, like, really being in this mutual love thing, you know, first time having sex, that I got to do it with somebody who completely understands my gender. It's incredible. Oh, I'm so thankful for it.

• 1:16:19Speaker 01

  And, and that's, and so I'm really thankful that I started out with other trans people because there's, there's sort of being trans or having trans people in your life. There's a lens that you sort of acquire and, and it's something that like ignorant people who have no idea how to, how to like engage with trans people or think about trans people. They don't have the lens that allows them to see whatever person as the gender that they are presenting as or whatever. And this is a lens that you acquire as you like, you know, spend more time with trans people and everything. And so like knowing that that lens is there with whoever I was with. Amazing.

• 1:17:02Speaker 01

  And then it's interesting branching out from there into like cis people, cis women or cis men where I'm not sure that they have the lens, even with hookups or whatever. This is a constant anxiety I've had with hooking up with like cis women or something is that I'm worried, especially also because I'm pre-op, that maybe are they seeing something in me that I?

• 1:17:28Speaker 01

  That is not part of what I give or something and they might want and I've had hookups before with like cis women where they've wanted me to like fuck them or something like a like a guy and it's because I have a dick and like that's like and then like that coming up in a hookup and being like, oh god, like it's tough. But then you will find cis people who do know and and just get it and that's what was so amazing about my ex-boyfriend was from the get-go, never, never a fucking, he saw me exactly for who I was, which is amazing.

• 1:18:09Alex Cooper?

  It's amazing too. I appreciate you describing this too because like

• 1:18:13Speaker 01

  It's kind of hard to

• 1:18:14Alex Cooper?

  No, but like I'm I'm keeping up with you because what I, first of all, I'm so happy for you and I know everyone doesn't have that experience is like the fact that you were with someone you felt so safe with and you were like, oh, you get me because we're similar.

• 1:18:27Speaker 01

  So it's it's a privilege to come across people in romance and sex and dating where where that lens is there.

• 1:18:35Alex Cooper?

  If someone understandably is like, I don't know, like what you want and they come to you like vulnerable of like, I really like you, like, are you open to like?

• 1:18:44Speaker 01

  That's such a turn on. Oh my god.

• 1:18:46Alex Cooper?

  Like, tell me what you want.

• 1:18:47Speaker 01

  They are coming because the, you know, it puts it puts their intention on the table of, oh, I like you. I do want to do this with you. I'm just, I'm just a little inexperienced here. Love that. Love that. Amazing. It's it's when they don't and they don't know what they want or they want something that I'm not capable of giving, then it's like sticky and gross.

• 1:19:10Alex Cooper?

  So your first relationship with a guy, like just like a guy that was

• 1:19:14Speaker 01

  Also my first monogamous relationship. Everything else had been polyamorous because that's what I came up in. That's how I learned relationships. And I kind of touched on it before. I've, I had like, I had built up a complex against men.

• 1:19:26Alex Cooper?

  Understandable.

• 1:19:26Speaker 01

  And so like because most, if not all of my deeply painful experiences I've had in life have been with men. And so I really like came into this complex of I never want to let a man back close to me in my life. I don't see a world in which it's possible. Really, I was kind of Um, like it it was, you know, my bear, I put up walls and and kind of had been the dying, denying the fact that I am attracted to men and I do want to date and whatever men and that that's okay and I need to let my walls down. And so that's what was so amazing about

• 1:20:07Speaker 01

  my last relationship too, is also, and that's kind of what was cool about the public aspect is this is a straight guy who is in the music scene too. And and and um, and we are in a public relationship. He's dating a trans woman and he's he's completely straight. He's only dated cis women before. And he's toting me around, happy to be my boyfriend in in front of the world. And people are saying horrible nasty shit because because it's like, oh, you know, oh, you're so he gay, he didn't, he didn't care at all. And that was something that really showed me too, where I'm like, okay, you really, yeah, you see me for, you

• 1:20:51Speaker 01

  know, and you love me for that.

• 1:20:53Alex Cooper?

  Did you guys have conversations before going out in public together? Like, were you anxious at all?

• 1:20:58Speaker 01

  I was anxious, but I was also just head over heels in love and happy to be doing it. And, you know, it conversations absolutely should have been happening, but also I was like 22, 23, I didn't, you know, I was just like, I'm in love. I look, this person is so much fun, you know, whatever. Um, so it should have been a thing, but it was.

• 1:21:21Alex Cooper?

  But I think also just to.

• 1:21:23Speaker 01

  And listen, like, I like, I've said all these amazing things with him. He was not perfect. And it's no secret. It's out there in the world. Um, you know, and it's part of why the relationship ended is is I um, I got cheated on for the first time. And he said, he's talked about this too, like in his song, you know, he writes about it. So it's, it's, it's fine to be talking about it today. And it's like part of my truth, but that like fundamentally changed me as a person. And it was this whole process of like realizing that cheating has nothing to do with you.

• 1:21:56Alex Cooper?

  At all.

• 1:21:57Speaker 01

  And and and it has everything to do with that person and whatever kind of pain they're in or whatever they're dealing with.

• 1:22:05Alex Cooper?

  It's it's all that, but it's so hard. I would say, because in the moment, it feels like it's all about you. Yes. You're like, what did I do wrong? And then eventually, I love that you're obviously like a year out, you're clearly at that place where you're like, I can, you know that and you're saying it with confidence. But in the moment, you're literally like.

• 1:22:21Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. And and then as a trans woman also, with a man who has never dated that before, then it's your my my mind. You know, and I knew it wasn't the truth and and we both know that I have no doubt.

• 1:22:36Alex Cooper?

  But you can't help but your brain goes there.

• 1:22:37Speaker 01

  My brain, because of the way I've been socialized as a trans woman, like, and and it's been this like crux in my life of like, why? Life has been so hard sometimes. I was like, oh, my God, like, is this it? Like, am I? Can I just not like? Like, you know?

• 1:22:52Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:53Speaker 01

  But so it's cuckoo bananas.

• 1:22:55Alex Cooper?

  How did you find out?

• 1:22:56Speaker 01

  Um, so I I kind of knew, you know, you always, you always kind of know.

• 1:23:01Alex Cooper?

  The gut.

• 1:23:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, the gut. Um, um, and because I kind of knew, I went into the phone, you know? Yeah.

• 1:23:08Alex Cooper?

  Hunter, welcome to.

• 1:23:10Speaker 01

  Which I am not, I'm not proud of.

• 1:23:12Alex Cooper?

  I'm not proud of either. I've done it before, but the amount of people that have sat here and been like, it's it's fucking normal. Because when your intuition is like hitting you in the face, you're like, OK, fine, I'll look.

• 1:23:22Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:23:22Alex Cooper?

  And the reason you're looking is because you fucking kind of know something.

• 1:23:25Speaker 01

  Yeah. And this stuff, oh, it makes me so nervous to talk about this stuff because I really, I have no interest in letting the public into what happened and everything. I absolutely, I want to make this very clear, I have absolutely no fucking desire to like, like, because what happened with that was between me and him and and I want to keep it and I want to protect that. But but at the same time, I'm also like, I'm here to, I'm here to talk about my truth and whatever, you know?

• 1:23:54Alex Cooper?

  And he wrote a song and like, yes, and I agree with you. I also think like. I wish people knew sometimes, like you, some things like are super deep in the moment. And then when you're having a conversation, like there's no ill will. You've literally said, like, you were in love with this person. It was, it ended amicably, like, it's okay.

• 1:24:12Speaker 01

  And he's, and he's the same way about it. Cause he's, he's the same kind of way. Like where I don't think he has any interest in letting the public in either, but, but we both are yappers at the end of the day. And we're going to talk about, like, it's hard doing like the bullshit, like,

• 1:24:26Alex Cooper?

  Yeah, bitch, I'm calling daddy. Let's fucking go.

• 1:24:28Speaker 01

  Like, yeah, you know?

• 1:24:29Alex Cooper?

  Um, getting over a breakup, like, not even specifically talking about him anymore, but like, for you. And what you were kind of saying, which I think is like a lot for your confidence. And like, as a trans woman, you're like, fuck, like, am I not? And you almost like stopped your sentence. You're like, am I not? Like, what came up for you when that happened? Like, am I not?

• 1:24:48Speaker 01

  Um, it, um, uh, yeah, I mean, it, like, really, like, I mean, like I said, it, it like fundamentally changed me and it's still something that I am working through, but I think-

• 1:25:05Alex Cooper?

  Fundamentally changed you? What do you mean?

• 1:25:06Speaker 01

  Uh, just in that, I don't think I understood, um, cause I had never been in a monogamous relationship before. So I really, my understanding of relationships and love and everything really was rooted in like polyamory and queerness and sort of the way that that world works, which is very open. And I don't, I think I, I honestly, I kind of looked at people in monogamy and be like, oh, like you're, you're cheating on yourself, la, la, la, la, la, which is, which is also what RuPaul said in that interview. And you were like, no.

• 1:25:38Alex Cooper?

  I literally was like, Ru, I just got married. Lay off.

• 1:25:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know. And she was like, sorry bitch.

• 1:25:45Alex Cooper?

  Literally looking at me and just like, was like, sorry.

• 1:25:48Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:25:49Alex Cooper?

  Oh my god.

• 1:25:49Speaker 01

  Oh my god. And you know what? I, so I don't know where I totally land on it now. I, cause I've done both.

• 1:25:55Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:55Speaker 01

  And, and you know, uh, and I think there's validity in both. And it's really a choice and it comes down to

• 1:26:01Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:01Speaker 01

  the each individual thing. But coming from that as my background and the way I learned love, I really looked at monogamy as like a, like, you're shorting yourself and whatever. And then I got into a monogamous relationship. Oh bitch, I, I get it. I get it. Um, uh, like, yes, I know, no, oh, oh, I loved it. Oh my gosh. But then it opens up the door for that kind of betrayal, which is a different world of pain.

• 1:26:33Alex Cooper?

  Were you open to the concept of monogamy? Like, did he initiate or did you initiate? Or you both did?

• 1:26:37Speaker 01

  Oh, no, I, I was open to, because you know, I'm coming, that's what I'm coming from. So I, you know, I even, like, at the beginning, you know, I, like, we had talked about it, but, you know, that's not, that's not what we, either of us, I don't think, really wanted with, with that. And, uh, and, um, yeah, and, um, you know, I think, uh, I mean, yeah, yeah.

• 1:26:59Alex Cooper?

  Are you open to monogamy ever again?

• 1:27:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, absolutely. I really feel like, you know, I've done, I've done both now. And, and like, I, I know I can be in either of those positions, but I really liked monogamy.

• 1:27:13Alex Cooper?

  It's fucking powerful.

• 1:27:14Speaker 01

  It's really cool.

• 1:27:15Alex Cooper?

  It's like your heartbroken.

• 1:27:17Speaker 01

  You're like, fuck, I hate this shit. Back to Polly. Fuck you. No, but like, now I see the fault in Polly, because Polly is so much work. It's so much work. It's so, it, monogamy is so easy, because it's just like, it's very simple. It's just like, I mean, you have to communicate a lot in either way, but with polyamory, you bring other people into that and other people's relationships and whatever, and it's fine, but then you have to communicate not only about your own relationship, but about, if, if that's in the contract for you, about the other relationships that are happening and how that weighs and how to balance that with the person's, your primary partner's feelings, all that. It's like so much work. Yeah.

• 1:28:01Alex Cooper?

  It's so much work and like, you're fucking busy.

• 1:28:03Speaker 01

  I'm, I'm too busy right now, which is, you know, what I said, monogamy or polyamory, I'm too busy right now.

• 1:28:09Alex Cooper?

  Okay, let's talk about the new movie that's coming out by the time this episode comes out. Cuckoo. Um.

• 1:28:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, right. That's what I'm, that's why I'm here. That's why I'm here to promote my fucking movie.

• 1:28:18Alex Cooper?

  And like, oh my god, okay, like, monogamy, like, this is Call or Daddy. And the reason I love having these conversations, though, is like, I get it, we can do like a pre- This junket of like, no one, no one wants to know more than anything about you. And then we want to go see the movie because of you.

• 1:28:34Speaker 01

  And that's why I want to do this podcast, because I fuck, I fuck with this.

• 1:28:37Alex Cooper?

  I'm so happy you're here. A horror movie. Your first lead role?

• 1:28:41Speaker 01

  So this is my first, this is the first movie I ever got. It's not the first movie that has come out, but uh, it's the first movie I ever filmed. And it's my first lead role. Um, and.

• 1:28:52Alex Cooper?

  Are you so excited?

• 1:28:53Speaker 01

  I'm so excited. I love this movie and it really feels like a baby, like, like, and it was my first, you know.

• 1:29:01Alex Cooper?

  Okay, um, horror. I'm such a little fucking bitch when it comes to horror. I'm literally like.

• 1:29:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's happening?

• 1:29:07Alex Cooper?

  Happening. Like, how did you decide on this genre? Like, did you love?

• 1:29:10Speaker 01

  Well, I love horror. I grew up loving horror. And I also think it's, it's so fun stylistically, particularly with this director too. It was less about the genre and even the script and the story. I, I just, I watched this director's, um, who's Tom and Singer. His first film and it's his only other piece of work, I think, that's like out in the world that you can like go buy on Amazon and watch. Um, but it's called Loose and I saw Loose and I was like, oh my God, I have to work with this person on whatever capacity. And, um, and in that audition process, I, I like, I fought for that role. Um, and I got it. Yeah, and, um, I, I love this movie.

• 1:29:53Alex Cooper?

  Um, I know this is probably like a dumb question to ask, but like the process of filming like a horror film, like. Me. Do you ever get like scared? I'm literally terrible. Like, do you ever, it's not like that, though.

• 1:30:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, like, like, yeah, well, no, because there were some scary parts because we were filming in the bitch. In an abandoned. Um, yeah, here we go. An abandoned, like, twenty acre.

• 1:30:24Speaker 01

  Post-World War II military village like module that had been abandoned for fifty years. We're shooting at night in these abandoned buildings that have just been sitting there for years. That was scary, but thankfully I the casting crew and every, oh, such a big family. I loved making this movie with them. Um, and so, you know, we were, it was so familial, you know, it was only like when you're like, oh, you have to go walk to your trailer alone and you're like in the woods in the middle of Germany and it's like, bitch, what? But it's kind of scary. Um, but, um, otherwise, no, I mean, I'm, you know,

• 1:31:04Speaker 01

  like in the scenes where I'm scared, you know, I have to be scared, obviously, but.

• 1:31:10Alex Cooper?

  I'm just coming from the perspective where like, I'm trying to think of like a movie that you'd be like, why were you scared about that? Like honestly, some scenes in like Vampire Diary scared me, you know what I mean?

• 1:31:18Speaker 01

  I still haven't seen Vampire.

• 1:31:19Alex Cooper?

  No, it was great, but like, okay, let me, um, like Halloween Town, did you ever watch the movie? No.

• 1:31:23Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:31:24Alex Cooper?

  I was scared.

• 1:31:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, the Disney movie?

• 1:31:26Alex Cooper?

  That, no, no, no, that was scary. I remember that. Yeah. Yeah, I remember. I'm literally so afraid of like, or like on Disney shows, if it was like the like Halloween episode, I'd be like. Oh, yeah. No, those were scary.

• 1:31:39Speaker 01

  They were.

• 1:31:39Alex Cooper?

  Twitches, did you ever watch?

• 1:31:40Speaker 01

  Twitches.

• 1:31:41Alex Cooper?

  Twitches and the dark cloud that, that, oh my God, that's so scary. You remember that?

• 1:31:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, girl. Yeah.

• 1:31:48Alex Cooper?

  So good. Honestly, like a little pathetic, but I'm so excited for you because obviously you being like, having this lead role, like, it's crazy to, this is why I love talking to you because you started this interview being like, I didn't even know if I wanted to be a fucking actress. And I like get this call and I'm like, making no money from modeling and I get that call and I'm like, I guess I'll do it. Now your life has changed. How has your approach, since now you're like getting on a plane tomorrow, right? To go to Europe, like, how has your approach changed though to like?

• 1:32:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:32:17Alex Cooper?

  Being an actress?

• 1:32:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. So I, you know, cause I was fine. I, I was like, you know, I was really under the belief for like a few years into it, that like, okay, I'm just doing this for right now and it's helping.

• 1:32:28Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:29Speaker 01

  My career, whatever. I'm making money. This is great. But I don't know if I like, if this is what I'm supposed to do. And then now I'm in this place where I've, I've, because I've been doing it and I get it now because also you have to, you have to know, like, I'm learning how to act on the spot with the first two seasons of Euphoria. And everything like, like, thank you.

• 1:32:49Alex Cooper?

  You wouldn't even know.

• 1:32:50Speaker 01

  Thank you, but like, I'm, I'm learning, I like, I didn't understand the craft. I had no idea what I was doing and I finally, in that process and in this process of like, just like, take, like, letting this career happen to me, I have fallen in love with the craft. And now I'm at this place where I'm like, okay, maybe this isn't what I thought that I was put on this art to do.

• 1:33:11Alex Cooper?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:11Speaker 01

  But this is just another form. I get to put all my creative energy that I used to put into my journals and in my art and everything into this. And I understand how that works now and I've fallen in love with it. So now it's at this great point where I'm like, okay, this, this is, this is one of my superpowers. This is what I can do and, um, and I love it.

• 1:33:33Alex Cooper?

  Hunter, I'm going to be honest, it, this was like one of my favorite interviews.

• 1:33:36Speaker 01

  Oh, no, stop!

• 1:33:37Alex Cooper?

  No, seriously, like, sitting across from you, I'm like, inspired and also like, this is why I love what I do. Because I've watched you, I see your social media, but like, sitting with you for an hour and whatever, like, you're fucking awesome.

• 1:33:52Speaker 01

  Thank you. You too, girl.

• 1:33:54Alex Cooper?

  It's just so cool because actresses, we don't get to see and even musicians, like, we don't get to see as much, obviously, of your personality when you're like, playing these characters.

• 1:34:01Speaker 01

  We're putting our drag in the world.

• 1:34:02Alex Cooper?

  Exactly. But today, you coming here, like, stripped down, like, being yourself and like, opening up, I'm like, thank you so much.

• 1:34:09Speaker 01

  And thank you for giving me the, it's, it's, I'm, I'm nervous about like, you know, showing the world, like, you know, my real tea, you know, I'm, that, it scares me. But, but to do it with you, thank you for making the space and everything and, and like, just being here and kiki-ing with me. That's what this felt like.

• 1:34:28Alex Cooper?

  You're amazing. I literally could keep going, but like, I know we have to stop, but I love you.

• 1:34:31Speaker 01

  Thank you. I love you too. This was great.

• 1:34:48Alex Cooper?

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• 1:36:15Alex Cooper?

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• 1:36:57Alex Cooper?

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