My Husband Cheated and got an STI

On today’s episode, we hear about: A wife struggling after discovering her husband’s secrets A woman wondering how to deal with her husband’s new income A mother and son trying to find common ground Next Steps: 📞 Ask John a question! Call 844-693-3291 or send us a message. 📚 Building a Non-Anxious Life 📝 Anxiety Test 📚 Own Your Past, Change Your Future ❓ Questions for Humans Conversation Cards 💭 John's Free Guided Meditation 🤘🏼 The Dr. John Delony Show Merch Connect With Our Sponsors: Get 10% off your first month of BetterHelp. Get up to 40% off with code DELONY at Cozy Earth. Get 20% off when you join DeleteMe. Visit Hallow for a 90-day free trial. Visit Helix Sleep for special offers! Explore Poncho Outdoors! Get 25% off your order at Thorne. Explore More From Ramsey Network: 🎙️ The Ramsey Show 💸 The Ramsey Show Highlights 🍸 Smart Money Happy Hour 💡 The Rachel Cruze Show 💰 George Kamel 🪑 Front Row Seat with Ken Coleman 📈 EntreLeadership Ramsey Solutions Privacy Policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:05Speaker 00

  I recently discovered that my husband's been using dating apps, including LGBTQ dating apps. It has led to him sleeping with someone, receiving oral, and he was also just diagnosed with HPV.

• 0:21Dr. John Delony?

  Geez, what a mess. I'm sorry. What up? What is up? This is John with the Dr. John Deloney Show, taking your calls from all over planet Earth on your relationships, your mental and emotional health, your physical, whatever you've got going on, I'll sit with you and we'll figure out what's your next right move. Go to johndeloney.com/ask if you want to be on the show. And please, please take two seconds and hit the subscribe button if you're watching this on YouTube, or if you're watching this, or if you're listening to this on podcast, whether it's on Spotify, whether it's on Apple, wherever you're listening to this, please just take a second and subscribe to the show. It makes such a huge, huge difference.

• 1:04Dr. John Delony?

  All right, let's go out to San Diego and talk to Bianca. What's up Bianca?

• 1:08Speaker 00

  Hi there.

• 1:09Dr. John Delony?

  How's it going?

• 1:10Speaker 00

  It's going.

• 1:12Dr. John Delony?

  What's up?

• 1:14Speaker 00

  Um, all right, so I guess I'm calling today to see your thoughts on whether or not I should stay with my husband after his infidelity and betrayal.

• 1:24Dr. John Delony?

  Hmm. Tell me more.

• 1:28Speaker 00

  Um, okay, so I, I recently discovered that my husband's been using dating apps, including LGBTQ dating apps throughout our entire relationship.

• 1:42Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 1:44Speaker 00

  Um, it has led to, more recently, um, him sleeping with someone, receiving oral, kissing another, and he was also just diagnosed with HPV.

• 1:59Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, man.

• 2:02Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:03Dr. John Delony?

  Have you got tested yet?

• 2:05Speaker 00

  I have. Um, we have a, a three-year-old and a two-month-old. So I had gotten my test done while I was pregnant and then we also went to the doctors again and they said that I'm gonna have to wait, um, to get more tests. But as of now, I don't have any symptoms. I don't have, everything was negative. Um.

• 2:30Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, HPV can hang around a while. Geez, what a mess. I'm sorry.

• 2:35Speaker 00

  Yeah, thank you.

• 2:37Dr. John Delony?

  What a nightmare. So I, I, I, I usually, almost, almost exclusively, I, I, I won't tell somebody you have to leave right now.

• 2:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:50Dr. John Delony?

  So I'm asking you,

• 2:53Dr. John Delony?

  but I don't mind asking questions that might open the doors for you to see, you know, your way in or out of, uh, out of a new situation. Um.

• 3:03Dr. John Delony?

  Tell me about your thoughts about why you would stay.

• 3:09Speaker 00

  Um, well, we, we do have our family and I know that, I know that he loves me. I just, I think I lost him somewhere along the way to himself and, um.

• 3:26Dr. John Delony?

  Let me change this, let me change that language around. He left you. You didn't lose him.

• 3:31Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:32Dr. John Delony?

  And I hate to say this, but you're not that powerful. He left you.

• 3:36Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:38Dr. John Delony?

  Do you get that difference? That sounds like a semantics difference, but that's a massive psychological shift.

• 3:44Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's true.

• 3:46Dr. John Delony?

  Cause one, you're trying to figure out what you did wrong

• 3:51Dr. John Delony?

  that he would be out hitting the streets while you're creating humans.

• 3:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 3:58Dr. John Delony?

  The other is exhaling and realizing I'm powerless and my husband chose while I was making humans inside my body to go endanger our entire family.

• 4:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 4:24Speaker 00

  I don't know, it's just, I guess it is, I mean, I know it has nothing to do with me. I, like, like you said, it's just that constant like, hey, well, what was I missing? What was I, and I know it wasn't me, and like, I mean, we've, we're both in counseling. He's, um, he's fighting for, for us staying together and to keep our family together. And he's stepped up in many ways, and, um, he's-

• 4:51Dr. John Delony?

  Do you have all the codes to his phone?

• 4:54Speaker 00

  Um, now I do, yes.

• 4:56Dr. John Delony?

  Are all the apps off the phone?

• 4:58Speaker 00

  Yes, everything's gone.

• 5:00Dr. John Delony?

  Have you seen his full test results?

• 5:04Speaker 00

  Um, yeah, he's, he's negative and everything, it's just, just that.

• 5:15Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so I guess the thing I would tell you is the marriage you had is over.

• 5:21Dr. John Delony?

  It doesn't exist anymore. The question is, are you going to be involved in building a new one with this man?

• 5:31Speaker 00

  I think that's why I'm calling, because I, I guess I'm scared.

• 5:35Dr. John Delony?

  You should be.

• 5:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:37Dr. John Delony?

  You would, you would be, um, your innate safety systems would not be working well.

• 5:45Speaker 00

  No.

• 5:45Dr. John Delony?

  If you weren't terrified.

• 5:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:52Dr. John Delony?

  He has a forever STD.

• 5:55Speaker 00

  I know, exactly. And that's what is terrifying for me too, because he's had it, and of course, I mean, he's my husband, we're sexually active, and, and it's like, I don't know what, what the future holds, and if I do have it, and it's dormant, and like, I, it's just, it's so unfair.

• 6:17Dr. John Delony?

  Yes, that's a great word.

• 6:21Speaker 00

  All of it has been very, very unfair, and, and it's not what I ever imagined to be going through.

• 6:34Dr. John Delony?

  So what must be true for you to be safe and to make sure you and these two kids are okay?

• 6:40Speaker 00

  Yes, I agree.

• 6:41Dr. John Delony?

  No, no, I'm asking you, what must be true?

• 6:45Speaker 00

  Oh, um, how do you mean?

• 6:52Dr. John Delony?

  Like, do you have money? Do you have a job?

• 6:55Speaker 00

  Um, no. So he's-

• 6:57Dr. John Delony?

  You have a place to live?

• 6:59Speaker 00

  He's our main provider. Um, I, he, so there was like a little bit, there was financial abuse going on. He's the main provider and he was trying to hide everything from me. So it was constantly like going back and forth, getting me, you know, joint bank accounts. And so once I finally, you know, confronted him and everything's been coming out, I demanded all of our banking information. And that's when I found out that all of the dating apps and, um, he was going to strip clubs while he was out of town and he has a drinking problem. He's had a drinking problem. Um, so-

• 7:41Dr. John Delony?

  Have you pulled your credit report to see what he's taken out on, in your name?

• 7:46Speaker 00

  Um, no. He doesn't have that information.

• 7:50Dr. John Delony?

  He 100% has that information.

• 7:54Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 7:55Dr. John Delony?

  100% he has your name and social security number.

• 8:03Dr. John Delony?

  Which is all it takes to open up a mortgage, credit cards, a line of credit, HELOC.

• 8:14Dr. John Delony?

  It's all it takes.

• 8:16Dr. John Delony?

  So here's what I'm hearing. I'm hearing a woman that fully doesn't know what the bottom of this well is.

• 8:25Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:26Dr. John Delony?

  Because you don't believe you have all the information, do you?

• 8:30Speaker 00

  Um, I mean, yes, no.

• 8:34Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, that means no.

• 8:37Speaker 00

  I guess, I mean, he, you know, he, he's told me and gone into detail of everything that I've shared with you so far. But I feel like, I don't know, that's like part of like, well, well, that questioning of like, is that really everything? Is that, you know, this has been going on for so many years. We've been together for seven and a half years and married one. So it's like, I find it hard to believe that that's it.

• 9:08Dr. John Delony?

  But you have to understand, every, every year of your relationship has been

• 9:14Speaker 00

  A lie.

• 9:14Dr. John Delony?

  A lie.

• 9:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 9:20Dr. John Delony?

  I'm not, I'm hearing somebody who is desperately trying to hang on to an imaginary thing that existed, that never existed.

• 9:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 9:40Speaker 00

  I don't know, it's just like, I, I feel like that, and then I can also tone.

• 9:45Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 9:48Speaker 00

  And I'm not trying to justify or

• 9:50Dr. John Delony?

  No, no, it's a, it's a disorienting, like, your whole world as you knew it is not what it was, right?

• 9:57Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 9:58Dr. John Delony?

  Your feelings should be all over the place. What you know to be true should feel all over the place. You should be both pissed off at yourself for not seeing it and/or knowing something wasn't right and just ignoring it. Like, all of that is true.

• 10:12Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 10:13Dr. John Delony?

  So there's not a roadmap here.

• 10:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, you know.

• 10:19Dr. John Delony?

  But you can write a roadmap for tomorrow.

• 10:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 10:25Dr. John Delony?

  And that starts with, can I trust you?

• 10:33Speaker 00

  Because that's like, question if I would be able to build that trust.

• 10:38Dr. John Delony?

  Right.

• 10:40Speaker 00

  Um, and I think, like, of course, like how you said, like, my life slips upside down. I'm like constant here and constantly there, getting pulled in every direction. And he's, you know, trying really hard. He's going to his individual therapy. We're doing couples therapy. He's two months sober now. Um, he's gonna be going to like, um, an AA or some type of group. Um.

• 11:10Dr. John Delony?

  But you still haven't exhaled yet, yet. You're still waiting for the other shoe to drop.

• 11:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:16Dr. John Delony?

  And you can't build in anything new until you've totally exhaled.

• 11:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 11:24Dr. John Delony?

  So maybe he did, man. Maybe he cleared the deck and told you everything.

• 11:30Dr. John Delony?

  I can imagine a world where I almost, it's, it's, it's, this is gonna sound insane if you've never been in the side of this, this hurricane. But the longer you can keep wondering if there's something else out there, the longer you can put off having to deal with this is what is true.

• 11:50Dr. John Delony?

  Because you can keep some sort of an investigative hat on

• 11:56Dr. John Delony?

  instead of just looking at the ash that was your life.

• 12:02Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's where I've been kind of coming to terms with. If it's just, not necessarily something that I need to let go, but something that like I, I can't keep pushing and pushing and trying to find more, trying to investigate or discover more, I guess.

• 12:20Dr. John Delony?

  What, what else are you gonna find?

• 12:24Speaker 00

  I don't know.

• 12:25Dr. John Delony?

  I mean, I mean, what else to be like, ah, there it is. You know what I mean? Like what?

• 12:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:29Dr. John Delony?

  Unless it's like a family member or something that he was with, like I, or like a close family friend or something. I, I, like, what else would you keep digging and digging and digging for?

• 12:39Speaker 00

  I guess it's like, if it really's, like, if there's more people.

• 12:47Dr. John Delony?

  Than the three you know about?

• 12:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:50Dr. John Delony?

  I guarantee you there is.

• 12:54Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:55Dr. John Delony?

  There's not a doubt in my mind. And there's not a doubt in your mind either.

• 12:59Speaker 00

  Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And I've told him that.

• 13:03Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 13:10Speaker 00

  I

• 13:13Speaker 00

  I I know like with everything that's happened and us talking and and like I said, it has nothing to justify or clarify or or make anything that he's done okay. But I do know, I feel like there's

• 13:30Speaker 00

  childhood trauma. That gives context.

• 13:34Dr. John Delony?

  Absolutely. Context is not an excuse.

• 13:37Speaker 00

  But exactly. It's, it's not an excuse. It's a choice that he made repeatedly.

• 13:45Dr. John Delony?

  And now he's endangered the life and health of your baby and of you.

• 13:50Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 13:56Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 14:00Dr. John Delony?

  I'm sorry.

• 14:03Speaker 00

  Thank you.

• 14:06Speaker 00

  Definitely not been an easy pill to swallow.

• 14:14Dr. John Delony?

  I think the, the place where I would start if I were you is

• 14:21Dr. John Delony?

  60 to 90 today chunks. Cause the temptation is to make forever declarations at this moment. Sometimes in the middle of a crisis, things go on a week by week or month by month basis. And so my challenge to you is to the best you can, clear the fantasy away.

• 14:43Dr. John Delony?

  And what you want so desperately to be true. And just choose reality for a brief time. And you, I've only been able to do this. I've only seen people be able to do this with a pen and a paper. Write down, here's what is true.

• 14:59Dr. John Delony?

  And here's what must be true for us to establish or reestablish trust in the next 30 days.

• 15:08Dr. John Delony?

  And then in 30 days, we're going to reevaluate, or 90 days. Here's what must be true.

• 15:14Dr. John Delony?

  No phone, no access to the checking account. I just simply don't trust you at all. You spent this much money at strip clubs. You spent this much money on dating apps to go hook up with other people. You still haven't been honest with me. You don't have tons of dating apps over six years. Spend your away time in, in strip clubs and only get caught with the two or three people in your... Like, that's just not how that works.

• 15:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly.

• 15:42Dr. John Delony?

  Right? It's just not, I mean, it just is what it is. But what must be true for the next 60 days? And you get to change your mind.

• 15:54Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 15:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay? And then in 60 days, let everybody know in 60 days, we're going to come back to this table and I'm going to give you a new roadmap for reestablishing trust.

• 16:05Dr. John Delony?

  And you have to know that every step along the way, he can say, "This sucks. I'm out. I'm not doing that. I'm not giving you my phone. I'm not, I'm not sharing the checking account numbers with you anymore."

• 16:18Dr. John Delony?

  And that means you're going to have to begin asking questions right now. Very unfair, very un...

• 16:27Dr. John Delony?

  Unbelievable questions like about economic security. You're going to have to go get a job, potentially.

• 16:32Speaker 00

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:33Dr. John Delony?

  You're going to have to have some way to support yourself if this happens again. And all the data points towards this will happen again.

• 16:41Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:43Dr. John Delony?

  And then you get 60 days. And then you get 60 more days after that.

• 16:48Dr. John Delony?

  And then maybe you get 120 days after that. But we're going to slowly, if this thing's going to make a run, we're going to slowly rebuild trust. And while you're writing out on this list, like, "What must be true for me to reestablish trust? I need you home. No phones in the house. No..." Fill in the blank. By the way, pull your credit report before, right, right when you get off this call. There's three free credit reports. Um, hang on the line and we'll get you the email address to them. But you can pull them and they're free. Kelly, what are they?

• 17:16Speaker 02

  Well, you can go to freecreditreport.com.

• 17:18Dr. John Delony?

  That's it. Freecreditreport.com. It'll pull credit reports from all three reporting agencies and you can just get a broad look about any debt that has been pulled in your name and everything you owe.

• 17:32Dr. John Delony?

  You may say, "I'm not interested in rebuilding this thing. It never was what I thought it was and there's not enough..." Like, what I thought was metal is just rusted dust and I can't rebuild this. Or, "All right, we're gonna rebuild it. Here's what must be true. And maybe he meets 60 days, then he meets the next 60 days, and then he meets 120 days, and all of a sudden you look up and he's six months sober and y'all are making this thing work." But I'm not gonna tell you yes or no. I'm gonna tell you, the odds are very much stacked against you because you've got somebody who's quote-unquote "got caught." You've got someone who may or may not have given you an STD, maybe, may or may not have given your baby an STD, and he still hasn't told you the full truth.

• 18:17Dr. John Delony?

  And you don't have all the answers, so it's hard when you're still swimming before you put your feet on the ground. And you gotta put your feet on the ground before you stand all the way up and begin to rebuild something.

• 18:29Dr. John Delony?

  So, Bianca, you call me anytime you want to, and I wish you the best. I have it in my guts that you would leave if you knew a way to do that. Financially, relationally, legally. And so maybe sitting down with a lawyer and asking, "What would this even look like?" Not that you're gonna leave, but just so you have some information. Because I've, hearing a woman who feels like you've got no options and no moves, and I want to reestablish your safety with information and with relationships, you gotta have a couple of women in your life that you call, a therapist you reach out to, that will walk with you during this really difficult time. Thanks for the call, sister. Call anytime we can help.

• 19:12Dr. John Delony?

  We come back, a woman asks how to embrace her husband's newfound wealth.

• 19:19Dr. John Delony?

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• 20:44Dr. John Delony?

  Let's go to the 512. Just got back last night from Austin, Texas and talked to Annie. What's up, Annie?

• 20:51Speaker 03

  Hey, John, how are you?

• 20:52Dr. John Delony?

  I'm great. How are you?

• 20:54Speaker 03

  Good. I've got a little bit of a probably maybe silly question compared to some of your other calls, but...

• 21:00Dr. John Delony?

  You can't get any sillier than some of the calls I get here. You are all right. What's up?

• 21:05Speaker 03

  We'll try it. How do I change my relationship with or attitude towards money and wealth? And the context is my husband is on a very clear two to three year path to, you know, life-changing generational wealth, which is awesome. Like, it's been a big life goal of his. Like, he's going to succeed. It's going to be awesome. Although I don't know it's only a number until, like, it's real. But like, it's just not what I want and it, like, makes me scared of what the future holds. I've just never, ever, ever wanted money like that. And it just, I don't know what to do about it.

• 21:43Dr. John Delony?

  How long have you been married?

• 21:44Speaker 03

  I don't know how to do it. Seven years. Seven years.

• 21:47Dr. John Delony?

  How after almost a decade are y'all just having this conversation that your two life goals are this far apart?

• 21:53Speaker 03

  Well, it, he, when we got together, he already, he was already independently wealthy. He'd already had one business. He was making it. Um, I had a successful career. Um, I was very happy with it. I, I would call us right now, we're just happily upper middle class. Um, and I'm happy with it. He's always had this goal and I'll be honest, but like, how often does someone succeed at that level? It's not that I didn't believe him. It was like, I'm, I can be there for you if and when, like, it doesn't matter if you don't make it. Like, I love you. It doesn't matter if you don't make that much money. I love you. But like, I, he's actually gonna make it. And you know, that's, I, I don't know. How many people did it actually happen to? I think that was just my thinking. Um.

• 22:36Dr. John Delony?

  So, wh- why does, why does money scare you?

• 22:40Speaker 03

  I just feel like it's like, when everything gets so easy, because money makes things easy. When it gets so easy, like, how do you still?

• 22:49Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, sister, it doesn't make things easy. It gives you options. It does not make things easy.

• 22:55Dr. John Delony?

  It gives you tons of options. But man, it, it, things are complex and complex and on top of complex.

• 23:02Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yeah. I guess it's just more like, it just, you're right. You're right. Maybe in the day to day living, like, things feel easier. Like, you can have convenience, you can have all that type of stuff.

• 23:13Dr. John Delony?

  Sure.

• 23:13Speaker 03

  I think I'm trying to protect my kids from that. I don't want them, like, growing up with that. And he, he agrees with that. So, like, we're on the same page with that. But like, I don't know how that looks. I don't know how to keep discipline when it's just, everything can be at your fingertips. Like, I just don't know how to set that up and keep us all on the right path of what I feel like is the right path for, like, our characters and who we are, when there's so much access to anything and everything at all, at any time.

• 23:37Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so this tells me two things. Either, A, and maybe both. A, you already see signs of concern with who your husband is, and this is going to pour gasoline on that. Or, you grew up with a relationship with money where it was those people spent money on that kinda crap, and we, us, we don't do that. That's not who we are.

• 24:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, I so I was probably what people would consider a silver spoon growing up myself. Um, private elite high school, college paid for by my parents. Um, but we were around much more money than we had. So it was like we kind of were forced to be the responsible ones about the money around the people who were doing.

• 24:23Dr. John Delony?

  You had to go on budget ski trips to Aspen?

• 24:26Speaker 03

  Yes. No, it was not.

• 24:30Dr. John Delony?

  You had to share a private jet instead of just take your own.

• 24:32Speaker 03

  But yes, I mean, we're around like celebrities and like that's what the world we grew up in. And that wasn't us. And so I think I just internalized like, just we just didn't have that. But all of our friends and all of the people around us did. So I don't know if I just internalized like how to be responsible with it, or just like, that's just not me. I don't know what it was, but it's just, I've never been motivated by money ever. Like, it's just not been my motivator whatsoever. Like, never asked for a raise a job that I had a very good paid job at. Just given, right? Like.

• 25:03Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, but that doesn't make, that doesn't, um, Rich Mullins is a famous theologian, and you may not even be a person of faith, but I love his statement. He said, um, Christians are often as proud of the things they don't have as people of immense wealth are of the things they do have.

• 25:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:20Dr. John Delony?

  It's the same pathology, just on the other side of the barbell.

• 25:24Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:24Dr. John Delony?

  And when I was driving an old, old, old, used truck, not a cool one, but like an embarrassing one, the number of times someone would pull up next to me in a Lexus, and I'd be like, I can't believe that, man, that was me. That was my problem. That was my story that I invented about that person. Because I don't know if that person gave away $25 million, and if that's a used look, I don't know. I don't know their story.

• 25:45Speaker 03

  Right.

• 25:45Dr. John Delony?

  Right?

• 25:45Speaker 03

  Right.

• 25:46Dr. John Delony?

  The only thing you can control is who you are going to be with or without resources. And so let me talk to you about, like, talk to me about your husband. What signs are you already seeing that, oh, he is, this is not going to be good? This is going to be giving somebody who struggles with alcoholism a big case of expensive bourbon?

• 26:09Speaker 03

  No, I'd say there's two. One is, even at our, like, convenience is just, like, key to him. So, like, a little bit of laziness, I think, that might, like, scares me a little.

• 26:19Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 26:20Speaker 03

  And then two, this one's out of control, and I know what you think about gambling, but he sports bets on the side, like, it's not out of control right now.

• 26:27Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 26:27Speaker 03

  Right, like, I, I know it's not, but, again, when you have access to...

• 26:32Dr. John Delony?

  Do y'all share your money?

• 26:34Speaker 03

  Uh, in effect, yes. Um, we have a shared account. He owns businesses, though, so a lot of it moves in and out of those that I just...

• 26:40Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so let's come to an, let's be honest as we can, okay? Let's be transparently honest. You have no idea what he does with his money?

• 26:47Speaker 03

  Not all of it, correct?

• 26:48Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, so you don't know? And I would not have a career in front of a microphone or off a microphone if

• 26:57Dr. John Delony?

  people who thought, no, this particular thing is under control.

• 27:02Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:02Dr. John Delony?

  You have something in your spirit that says, yeah, I just don't know?

• 27:07Speaker 03

  No.

• 27:08Dr. John Delony?

  Is that fair?

• 27:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's a question.

• 27:13Dr. John Delony?

  So, here's, like, what I would love for you to do is, money is just a symptom. Money's just, it's a, it's a, I don't know, I mean, it's a, it's a tool.

• 27:23Dr. John Delony?

  The bigger question is beginning to ask yourself, who are we? Who is he? Who am I going to become now, right now in this marriage? What would happen to us if the job, if suddenly they launch an AI app tomorrow that eats your husband's business? And it goes away, right? Who knows? Or if he is the chief shareholder of Nvidia and he's going to cash out in a couple of years? You're not going to have a trillion, like, either way, y'all have to still look at each other across the table and say, who are we going to be?

• 27:52Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:54Dr. John Delony?

  And if you are feeling unsafe as this thing gets bigger and bigger... Then you gotta be able to put that on a table. And if your marriage partner's all in with you, both feet in the boat, then they gotta be able to hear that and say, okay, what must be true for us to both feel safe in this deal?

• 28:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:15Dr. John Delony?

  Is there a fear that he's gonna cash out? And he's gonna cash all the way out of you two?

• 28:20Speaker 03

  Um, is it a fear specific to him? No.

• 28:25Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 28:25Speaker 03

  Is it a fear that like that happens?

• 28:28Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah. Have you ever said that to him?

• 28:30Speaker 03

  No.

• 28:31Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 28:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:36Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 28:39Dr. John Delony?

  What other fears have you not said to him?

• 28:43Speaker 03

  Um,

• 28:46Speaker 03

  that it's more about the kids and how they'll grow up.

• 28:51Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. I would love for y'all to have that conversation right now. Are you already seeing signs of my kids aren't gonna work? My kids aren't picking up their own clothes. We'll hire somebody. Are you already seeing that?

• 29:00Speaker 03

  Um, no, but like not specific to kids, but more like he's like, let's get live and help. I'm like, I don't, I don't want them to have like, I don't want it myself and I don't want that for them.

• 29:13Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 29:13Speaker 03

  Um.

• 29:14Dr. John Delony?

  And so ask the question beneath the live and help. What would live and help provide for us?

• 29:19Speaker 03

  For him, convenience and not having to do the work.

• 29:23Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 29:25Dr. John Delony?

  And putting it on the table, saying, hey, it's a big value of me that our kids are model. That even when you have all the money in the world, you still do your own laundry. How old are your kids?

• 29:34Speaker 03

  Eleven months and four.

• 29:36Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, God, I was gonna say if they're 16 and 18, y'all can wait for two years and then get whatever you want. But like, okay, y'all are just starting from the floor up.

• 29:42Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 29:44Dr. John Delony?

  Eleven months and four. That tells me you're seeing things already that you don't like.

• 29:51Speaker 03

  Um, I've just heard that line. Maybe you just said it or maybe you said it before that like money exacerbates things. And I'm just, yeah, I'm, I don't know what that means and what that looks like for us. Yeah.

• 30:04Dr. John Delony?

  I'm interested. I'm curious about your fear of like, cause you have an 11 month old now. You have a new marriage.

• 30:14Dr. John Delony?

  What about the, like inviting another human into the house has made you really concerned?

• 30:22Speaker 03

  Like it literally is that it changes the dynamic of your family. Like why?

• 30:29Dr. John Delony?

  Yes.

• 30:30Speaker 03

  I wouldn't want another human in here where it's like, I would be tiptoeing around like, I couldn't be myself if there's someone else here, you know, like, so.

• 30:41Dr. John Delony?

  I'm curious about why, why you're apprehensive to say that.

• 30:46Speaker 03

  Uh, well, I have, I mean, he would have been helping now if he could. I've said no so far. So that one is on the table. But because that's the most extreme, because that's just the easiest to say is the most extreme. It's the easiest to say no to.

• 30:59Dr. John Delony?

  Does he help with diapers?

• 31:01Speaker 03

  Um, he helps when asked. He helps with dishes. He helps, um, he does trash. Um, yeah.

• 31:09Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And I'm asking that just to ask, I'm trying to get to the core of your question because I'm hearing a woman who's increasingly feeling less safe in her own skin.

• 31:18Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 31:20Dr. John Delony?

  And sometimes when people have kids, this happened in my house, when we had kid one and then kid two, I didn't know what to do. I felt so useless in my own house. I tried to solve that through work. Now I was working in education, so I wasn't going to ever make life-changing money, but like I, I was just doubling down on that. But that's what I'm trying to get at. It doesn't sound like that's the case here.

• 31:45Speaker 03

  No, I don't think, I mean, I mean, what do, so even as right now, I had a great career, which chose myself to walk away from the career to take the care of the kids right now. But like, even if I wanted to go back, like, I can't go back. I mean, like, if we're going to have that money, it's silly and stupid. Like, so the kind of that has been decided for me to.

• 32:07Dr. John Delony?

  Said who?

• 32:09Speaker 03

  No one, but like who hasn't, who has that money and has a wife that works? I mean, like, that's just not.

• 32:16Dr. John Delony?

  The vast majority of people I work with. And have worked with for my whole career. I'm not saying it's right or wrong. I'm just saying that narrative isn't, isn't a true story. That's a story that you've told yourself and that might be one of your values and that's great. But if increasingly you being out of the workforce and your husband sort of sharing money, but I don't really know how things are working and I just keep hearing these more zeros getting added on to the sale of this potential business one day and you're increasingly feeling less and less and less safe, then I want to put that on the table. And I don't know that going back to work cures it, but it might.

• 32:57Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 32:58Dr. John Delony?

  Or the fear of money may be just where your anxiety dart game landed and you're feeling more and more anxious as you, as you feel less and less control of your own life.

• 33:08Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's probably more it. Yeah.

• 33:11Dr. John Delony?

  Because here's the fear. My fear is you solve the money thing, like y'all get, he's like, ah, fine dude. I'm a great, maybe he's a great guy, like, oh yeah, they will put all in the same account. You can see on my business accounts, that's no problem. And it will just move to the next thing because you're not dealing with the core issue, which is I'm feeling less and less purpose, less and less skills, or I don't know, this is me just spitballing here, throwing spaghetti against the wall. But if you quit a high paying job where you're very successful to be a stay at home mom, then your husband comes home and is like, I want to hire some help full time. I can imagine being like, well, crap, what did I just do? You know what I mean? Like, I'd feel pretty small.

• 33:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, I think that's a good way to put it. Like, I just don't even know, like, what is my role?

• 33:56Dr. John Delony?

  There it is.

• 33:56Speaker 03

  In that scenario, like.

• 34:00Speaker 03

  There's some expendables.

• 34:03Dr. John Delony?

  Okay, there it is. You said it.

• 34:05Speaker 03

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 34:09Dr. John Delony?

  And if you have everything, you can just hire it out.

• 34:13Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 34:13Dr. John Delony?

  And now you're married to somebody who's got resources to the end of the moon and back.

• 34:19Dr. John Delony?

  And even your language, he's gonna make a lot of money.

• 34:22Speaker 03

  I know.

• 34:23Dr. John Delony?

  I would love, if it's, if it's safe, I would love for you to be able to sit at the table and say, "Hey, with all of these resources that are coming our way, with you wanting to hire help that I quit my job to really take on,

• 34:42Dr. John Delony?

  if we're gonna hire private tutors and private schools and, and like, I'm beginning to feel expendable in my own house.

• 34:52Dr. John Delony?

  And I feel like I'm gonna have a purpose here."

• 34:55Dr. John Delony?

  So have the conversation now, before the big check comes. It's much easier to have this conversation philosophically, when there's so much more on the table, before all that money starts coming in.

• 35:10Dr. John Delony?

  Thanks for the call. And if you, hey, if you just get a ton of money, you don't know what to do with it, hang on the line, I'll get you my Venmo, and you can just send it this way.

• 35:20Dr. John Delony?

  I would give some to Kelly, she's so old, she doesn't even have Venmo, she doesn't know where, I'll write her a check. I'll cut her a check. That'll probably be good. And she can put under her mattress with the rest of her coins and her, her T-bills. Thank you so much for the call. You are awesome. We come back, a mother and a son ask for help on how to agree on watching horror movies in a faith-based home.

• 35:44Dr. John Delony?

  We talk a lot on this show about boundaries. You know, emotional boundaries, relational, financial, but there's one boundary that almost nobody talks about. Boundaries in your digital life. Right now, your personal information, like your phone number, your address, even where your kids go to school, sitting on countless gnarly websites that you have never heard of. And you didn't give them permission to have that information, but it's out there. And let's be honest, that's not just annoying. That's violating. That constant exposure creates this low level hum of anxiety in the background of all of our lives. Something always feels off. Somebody's always watching us or trying to profit off of us. That's why I use Delete Me.

• 36:25Dr. John Delony?

  Delete Me goes after the data brokers and the people finder sites that collect and resell your information without your permission. They track down your info and they remove it and every few months, they send you a report showing you exactly what they did. Taking control of your digital life is about boundaries and it's about peace. So, go to joindelete.me/deloney to save 20% off so that you can have digital boundaries and digital peace. That's joindelete.me/deloney.

• 36:58Dr. John Delony?

  All right, let's go out to Penny in Denver, Colorado. Hey Penny, what's up?

• 37:04Speaker 04

  Hi Dr. John, how are you?

• 37:05Dr. John Delony?

  I'm doing great. All right, I'm gonna bring on Logan here. Is Logan your son Penny?

• 37:12Speaker 04

  Yes, Logan is my son.

• 37:14Dr. John Delony?

  How old is he?

• 37:16Speaker 04

  Seventeen.

• 37:16Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, this is gonna be fantastic. All right, I'm gonna bring on Logan here. Logan, you there? Yeah, I'm here. Hey John. All right. Dude, you sound like you're 36, that's fantastic.

• 37:29Dr. John Delony?

  I talked like this until I was like 28, that's great, man. All right, so we got Penny and Logan. What's up everybody? Penny, you go first. How can I help?

• 37:38Speaker 04

  Okay, well, um, I just wanna throw out there that I have been listening since you started and so Logan's been raised on Dr. John in a sense.

• 37:47Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, I'm sorry Logan.

• 37:51Dr. John Delony?

  I'm sorry man.

• 37:53Speaker 04

  So, this is my question and um, he was actually the one that suggested we were having a conflict around horror and he was the one that actually suggested that uh, I gave you a call. Cause he said, "Well, Dr. John listened to crazy music and watched horror movies, maybe you should call him."

• 38:11Dr. John Delony?

  Logan, I am profoundly not well. I don't know why you would call me, but all right, let's do this.

• 38:17Speaker 04

  All right, so the question is, is what are your thoughts and suggestions on how to support our son's interests and passions at 17 while keeping him safe and holding true to our values and beliefs in this case when it comes to horror movies, violent video games and edgier questionable music?

• 38:33Dr. John Delony?

  Ah, okay. Man, Logan, why'd you do this to me, man?

• 38:40Dr. John Delony?

  All right, so Penny, tell me.

• 38:45Dr. John Delony?

  Give me the backstory here.

• 38:48Speaker 04

  Okay, so we are a faith-based family and I was lucky enough to grow up in a very strict Christian home and.

• 38:59Dr. John Delony?

  Are you saying lucky facetiously or are you saying lucky like you really feel lucky?

• 39:03Speaker 04

  It was both. It was definitely both, but I mean, we didn't celebrate Halloween. There was.

• 39:09Dr. John Delony?

  The devil's Halloween.

• 39:10Speaker 04

  No secular music in the house. There was.

• 39:12Dr. John Delony?

  Yes.

• 39:13Speaker 04

  Um, there was no Steven Spielberg in the house. So there was.

• 39:17Dr. John Delony?

  Oh dang, no Harry Potter, I'm assuming, huh?

• 39:20Speaker 04

  Definitely no Harry Potter. I mean, that was past my, my time. And so that was the, that's where I've, that's my background. And so we, we had this little boy who began showing interest in darker things, probably starting at the age of three. Started with pirates and then it was skeletons and skulls and all the Egyptology things and it's just kind of moved on from there. And so my husband and I have tried, we've worked really hard to try to meet him in the middle, but it's still very uncomfortable and it's really,

• 40:00Speaker 04

  really hard to navigate what's okay and what's not okay without making Logan feel like he is, he's being dismissed or his interests are not being valued or, um, yeah. And then at the same time, some of it really is really concerning stuff. But now we're at 17 and so he's almost an adult and how do we continue to have these conversations? We do a lot of like looking up reviews and I have him read the reviews before he does them and we make sure that, you know, certain movies are maybe not overly sexualized or there's

• 40:42Speaker 04

  not child possession of demons and things like that. But it's still, it's still a conflict and it's been a conflict for years with music, with video games and with horror.

• 40:53Dr. John Delony?

  So Penny, before I talk to Logan, can I just say this?

• 41:00Dr. John Delony?

  You are maybe the most thoughtful parent I've ever heard speak on this topic before.

• 41:10Dr. John Delony?

  Meaning, um, it's easy to be dismissive. And it's me, it's easy to, um, lack empathy just on basic human curiosity, especially with young folks.

• 41:27Dr. John Delony?

  And it's also really, um, humbling for a parent to say, this is how I was raised and these are my values. And maybe I'm not seeing the whole picture here, but I do feel strongly about something. And almost, I, I've never heard somebody articulate like you just did, which is you don't want to dismiss Logan and the things he's into and the things he finds exciting or interesting. At the same time, there's something in your guts that says, like, I don't know why someone would put this in their, in their, in their mind. So, high five to you. Good for you. All right, Logan, tell me about you, brother.

• 42:02Speaker 05

  Hey, John, yeah, um, so, you know, I've been an avid horror fan for a while. Um, you know, it's always been like, there was only like a really short period where I was a kid for the stuff actually scared me. And then I started finding it cool more than scary.

• 42:15Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 42:16Speaker 05

  Um, and it's just, you know, it's been like, and especially, you know, with like, um, I'm metalhead, you know, all the way, love, love heavy metal. Um, and it's just been, I don't know, it's something that's, you know, been more difficult to try to explain why I find this stuff interesting.

• 42:32Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 42:33Speaker 05

  Um.

• 42:34Dr. John Delony?

  When you say, when you say it doesn't scare you anymore and now it's just cool, what's cool?

• 42:41Speaker 05

  Um, like I find instead of like, you know, let's say you're watching a horror movie and there's some creepy monster crawling down the hallway. And instead of being like, oh, you know, I don't like that, that's, you know, scary or like getting at the scare factor, look into it, look, you know, like, I like its design. I like how it moves. It's really cool. That's a really cool idea for a monster. Never thought about it being, you know, you know, looking like that. Or, uh, you know, I just love the way it looks, the way, you know, the thought that went into it, just the monster itself, I think is interesting.

• 43:09Dr. John Delony?

  Tell me about your love of aggressive music.

• 43:13Speaker 05

  Um, I don't know. I've always liked, um, like, uh, power metal is my favorite.

• 43:18Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 43:18Speaker 05

  Uh, genre of metal. Um, I mean, I like.

• 43:20Dr. John Delony?

  Top three favorite bands, go.

• 43:23Speaker 05

  Oh, um, let's see, your Sabaton, Power Wolf and Iris.

• 43:29Dr. John Delony?

  Penny, he's a lost cause, I'm sorry to tell you.

• 43:33Dr. John Delony?

  These bands are just not good. I'm just kidding Logan, just kidding. Yeah, it's not, it's not the content, they're just not good bands, but, uh, anyway, I'm just playing. Uh, Logan, I'm messing with you. So, um,

• 43:46Dr. John Delony?

  trying to think of a, of an avenue here.

• 43:52Dr. John Delony?

  Often when,

• 43:56Dr. John Delony?

  here's been my experience.

• 44:00Dr. John Delony?

  I grew up in a strict faith-based home, okay? And I remember watching a scary movie at some point, and my dad, the homicide detective, I remember him saying, "I can't imagine somebody watching that for entertainment."

• 44:17Dr. John Delony?

  And he said that from a place that he saw whatever movie was on, happened to be on, he saw that in real life. And so I remember being like, "Oh gosh, yeah, you're right." And that's like this, what you're talking about, like, "Ooh dude, I can't believe how they pulled that off", especially when it comes to monsters or gore, like, it was a, it was a, this sounds so dorky, like there was an artistic kind of, I want to see how then, why they did that. But when I begin to peel back, like, why am I, two parents are still married, I've got good friends, I've got good community, why on Christmas Day? Every Christmas for 16 straight years, I went to downtown Houston and was part of a punk rock show.

• 45:01Dr. John Delony?

  And I could have been with my family around the fire, right? And when I, we didn't have a fire, but when I dug into it, that form of extreme stuff was the only place where I had any sort of feeling alive.

• 45:20Dr. John Delony?

  And I didn't find it in other places. I didn't even find it. I did find it in some competitive sports. But I remember being, I was a Texas high school football player, dude. There'd be like 7,000 people watching every one of our games. But I'd watch my, my, my fellow teammates like banging their heads on lockers before the ga- I remember being like, dude, we're playing a game. What are we, what are you doing? Right? And so, um, but that was a place where I felt alive. So get beneath the artistic and like the explanation. What does this stuff do inside your chest? I'm interested in that. And maybe your experience is different than mine.

• 45:54Speaker 05

  Uh, like, uh, could you like kind of explain what you mean a little more?

• 45:57Dr. John Delony?

  Where else do you feel alive than when the music is pulsing on a movie and you know a bad guy's coming? And you know, you've, you've, somebody texted you and said, do this one, or you read on the internet like, hey, this one is super gory, or this one's really crazy. Where else do you feel alive outside of that environment or at a metal show?

• 46:19Speaker 05

  Um, so I'm also a extremely like it is, uh, my main hobby is Magic the Gathering.

• 46:26Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 46:27Speaker 05

  Um, so I play that. That's, you know, every, you know, I love, love playing that with just about anyone.

• 46:31Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 46:32Speaker 05

  At least just about anyone, you know, just because I love it so much. But that's definitely a place, um, definitely, you know, with like certain friends. Um, and yeah, those are like, and then, yeah, I would say those are mostly the main places.

• 46:46Dr. John Delony?

  So this idea, like you love fantasy and escapism and new worlds and new creations and all that.

• 46:53Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 46:54Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And mom, what about that, you say it's really makes you uncomfortable. What is it? What about it makes you uncomfortable?

• 47:02Speaker 04

  Um, I think the things that make me feel uncomfortable are...

• 47:11Speaker 04

  Uh, desensitization to what's like to true horror and to true suffering. Sure. Um, Logan definitely struggles with being encountered with real suffering and will actively avoid that, whether that's on a news prop program or something like that. Uh huh. Um, that I've observed that that makes him very uncomfortable. And so my husband and I have, we don't understand the inconsistency, um, of being able to sit with something that can be so grotesque. Uh huh. Um, on the screen, but having such a hard time sitting with human suffering around

• 47:51Speaker 04

  him. So that's one thing that makes me feel uncomfortable. Um, I think often there is horror for the sake of horror and there is no, um, like we talk with Logan a lot about context, like there needs to be context to what you're watching. So is there, what is the storyline? How is the story arc? How are the characters developed? One thing we did do is you watched the whole Stranger Things series together. Uh huh. And I think both of us, and we read Harry Potter together. That was a little earlier, but like I didn't read Harry Potter. I, there's all this hype around Harry Potter

• 48:32Speaker 04

  and then I read it and I would say our family is an avid Harry Potter family. Sure. And we, we were able to, you know, good and evil clearly defined. Also, um, you know, flawed characters, how they grew, how they changed. So I think that I, I, I struggle with seeing, uh, the story arc in some of these movies and video games, um, understanding redemption or lack of redemption. There's no redemptive value to it.

• 49:05Speaker 04

  I know that there is some, but I struggle with finding it more. Like, I know that there's, you know, there are some great authors, Ted Decker and Big Pretty, and they are able to shine a light on darkness. And they're able to illuminate that and help people understand the difference between dark and light.

• 49:21Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, I mean, in some case, yeah, I get that in some cases, but, and again, that's gonna like, they're, they're trying to attempt to arc you back to a particular faith belief, right? But like, I get what you're saying. Here's the impasse y'all are gonna find yourself. Logan, when do you turn 18?

• 49:38Speaker 05

  Uh, next July.

• 49:39Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. And are you going to school? Are you a senior right now?

• 49:44Speaker 05

  I'm a junior and I do homeschool.

• 49:47Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, so you homeschool. So when do you go to college? Are you going to college?

• 49:50Speaker 05

  I'm not entirely sure yet. I'm still deciding that.

• 49:53Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Here's the world you find yourself in, and I'll tell you, the more you fight this, the more unnecessary chaos and frustration and rage you're gonna bring to your life and to your parents.

• 50:06Dr. John Delony?

  Fortunately, or unfortunately, I'll go with fortunately, but you live in their house.

• 50:13Dr. John Delony?

  And so, when you live in somebody's house, you say, and you're 17, you're not even 18 yet, so you have to, but, "I'm gonna live here, which means I'm gonna be subject to the rules. I work at this place, which means I gotta dress a certain way, not super great, but sorta. I gotta, like, sorta be on time, right? Like, I, I, I subject myself to this set of rules, so I get the benefits of a paycheck, right? That is the worst thing a 17-year-old can hear from an old man like me, but that's just the truth.

• 50:43Dr. John Delony?

  And if you choose to go to trade school after that and live two more years at mom's house rent-free, it will come with whatever crazy restrictions they choose to put on you.

• 50:52Dr. John Delony?

  And, so, there's just a metabolizing of that. Like, you're right. If y'all don't want me watching X or watching Y, I, I don't like it, but I get it, because this is your house. And the more you can make peace with that, um... Quite honestly, this, you can have more peace in your life. Um, on the other side of it, Penny, I will tell you, there's a nat- I would love to look for outlets. Cause Logan sounds like a kid, like a young man who is interested in, or Logan, are you artistic? I don't, I'm, I'm talking to you like you're not here. Are you into art and art like, tell me about that.

• 51:31Speaker 05

  A little bit, on and off. I mean, um, I used to be a lot more and then, I don't know, I just never like practiced all that much.

• 51:38Dr. John Delony?

  Okay. Tell me about fantasy stuff. Like what is it about fantasy that you love? The escapism?

• 51:44Speaker 05

  Um, I don't know. It was like, fantasy is like, I don't know, it always, it almost scratches an itch for me. Like it's not even like about like getting out of my own world or whatever. It's just that I enjoy the setting and the characters and like the, you know, story arcs that fantasy follows. Just so much. And I'm not entirely sure why. Like, you know, I love Lord of the Rings. Um, I love all, almost all of Brandon Sanderson's stuff. Um, love C.S. Lewis.

• 52:12Dr. John Delony?

  If you could see the nerds in the booth back here pumping their fists, dude. They're all cheering back here, by the way. So Penny, if nothing else, I work with a group of guys who are atomic nerds. And they're great men that I would trust my kids with. They, they, they've all grown up well. There's one guy in the booth back here that I wouldn't trust on my kid, but other than that, everybody's doing pretty good. But Lo- like, so Logan, I want to honor that. I think that's awesome. I think that's cool. My challenge to you would be, A, looking for places where you can plug into real people. That's why like, I think the, um, what is it? Magic the Gathering? I wouldn't know a Magic the Gathering card if somebody put it in front of me. But every time I hear about coworkers of mine or friends of mine, whatever, playing, I love it.

• 52:57Dr. John Delony?

  Because they get together with other people, sit around a table.

• 53:01Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 53:02Dr. John Delony?

  I personally am completely out on chaotic first person shooter games. Unless you're going to head to the military and become a drone operator.

• 53:13Dr. John Delony?

  And the, the connection, the connective tissue there is just not, it's not healthy. Um, and I could do a whole other thing about that, but we don't need to bore you with that right now. And now they're all booing me back there in the booth. They're like, boo.

• 53:28Speaker 05

  And I only, um, at the moment, I only have one, only, well, it was one game that was a hard won battle, but I got it, um, at the end and I've played through that game very many times, but I only just have the one game at the moment.

• 53:41Dr. John Delony?

  Okay.

• 53:44Dr. John Delony?

  I guess the best thing I could encourage you guys to do is to continue these conversations, Penny. And encourage you in your, because y'all are having the right conversations and I love the fact that you're like, fine, we're all gonna read Harry Potter together and you're like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. And Logan, I hope that you will honor your, your parents when they say like, hey, um, I'm making up movies here. Silence of the Lambs is a masterpiece and it's pretty dark and there's some redemption at the end and, uh, that's different than Beastmaster 19, Return of the Slaughterfest, right? There's just, there's differences there, right?

• 54:26Dr. John Delony?

  And people can go through their whole life with neither of those films in their minds, but there is something to be said for, one of those is just pure non-redemptive garbage and one of those is maybe not good for the soul, but there is a darkness and a, an arc to it, like, like you said Penny. So I guess where I'd get concerned for both of you is if you both give up on each other.

• 54:51Dr. John Delony?

  I don't want to be in the position to say, or I'll just say, I don't want, I'm, I'm not gonna be in the position to say, these movies are okay, these movies are not okay. I will tell you that Logan's about to be 18 and your influence on him, I hope lasts beyond 18. And any sort of lasting influence has to shift from, I control you because legally you can't do anything in this house, to like you've been doing, hey, let's read the reviews, let's talk about, what about this even is appetizing or appealing? Or I'm gonna watch the first 15 minutes of this with me and you gotta explain why this is even a thing.

• 55:29Dr. John Delony?

  And so, because we're gonna shift and Logan, it's you choosing, which is a nutty thing to ask a 17-year-old, you choosing to believe, even when it doesn't feel like it, my mom and dad care about my mind and my spirit and dude, when you get some images in your head, they never leave. And this massive desensitization that's happened across our culture, dude, there will be hell to pay for it. There's no question about it. We're paying it right now. Everything seems to be not real when we see it through a screen. And there's a lot of real, live hurt and pain going on in the world that we just don't feel anymore because it's all melted away on the screen. So I'd say this,

• 56:13Dr. John Delony?

  keep struggling with this thing together. And Penny, that's not an easy answer. And Logan, that's not an easy answer. But the struggle tells me y'all are still engaging in relationship and you're still going back and forth. And sometimes Penny, you're gonna go, huh, fine. And sometimes Logan, you're gonna have to say, I don't like it, but I trust my mom and dad that they love me and they're trying to keep garbage out of my spirit, man. So best of luck to you. Good luck. And if you solve that, let me know.

• 56:41Dr. John Delony?

  Actually, you won't solve it, so you don't have to let me know. Thank you so much for the call.

• 56:46Dr. John Delony?

  This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Most of us are guilty of oversharing with the wrong person at one time or another. Or maybe you're like me and you're just a bit of an overshare all the time. Let's be honest, our entire culture is based on oversharing and everyone is giving everyone else mental health advice all of the time. Some of it may be good, but a ton of the advice floating around is nonsense. And as fun as it can be to talk about everyday stuff with everyone you meet, when you need help with relationships, anxiety, depression, or other clinical issues, they may not have the right answers. You may need real guidance from a licensed therapist who follows a strict code of conduct. And that's why I recommend reaching out to my friends at BetterHelp.

• 57:30Dr. John Delony?

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• 58:15Dr. John Delony?

  All right, Kelly, am I the problem?

• 58:17Speaker 02

  All right, this is from Jessica in Charleston, South Carolina.

• 58:21Dr. John Delony?

  Awesome.

• 58:21Speaker 02

  And she writes, "I'm 35, I have three young boys, five, six, and seven. They're very close in age and they're just boys. They fight and wrestle, play with swords, play ninja, pirate, and tumble around all the time. They're not fighting like they hate one another, they love play fighting and rolling around. They're loud, they're filthy most of the time, they rarely wear shoes outside. You get the picture. They're also polite, and they do well in school, and they make friends easily. But I'm starting to see a trend of moms not inviting my boys to things because we quote unquote can't handle all three, or only inviting one boy, or saying that my boys are just too wild. Am I hurting them socially by allowing them to have fun with wrestling and fighting,

• 59:05Speaker 02

  or am I trying to befriend the wrong moms?"

• 59:08Dr. John Delony?

  Oh, great question.

• 59:15Dr. John Delony?

  I mean, this is hard to answer without knowing them, because I know there's a context there, but in the way she wrote that email, she, I hear a mom who is loving the life she's creating for her rambunctious wild boys, and I guess I want to honor that. And I don't ever want someone to quash the spirit of somebody. At the same time, wrestling and rambunctiousness and fighting has a context. And equally important when you're raising young boys is what my wife has kindly termed "time and place," which is, I fully understand that you and Hank need to crash into each

• 59:56Dr. John Delony?

  other, and for some reason you have to make those jokes that I just don't think are funny, but you all seem to think they're hilarious. But he also needs to learn there's a time and place, that you don't do that at a dinner table, you don't do that at a friend's house. When you walk into somebody's house, you take your shoes off and you say, "Yes, ma'am," and "No, ma'am," and you're shaking. Like, so that may be the missing link here, which is, there's a fine line between celebrating the rambunctiousness that is young boys and being feral. And there's a fine line between being respectful and, and being, what's the right word?

• 1:00:35Dr. John Delony?

  The words just left my head. Um, being compliant, like, I'm gonna squash who I am to make you happy. Right. And so I guess I need more context with those boys, but hopefully that framework helps. What do you think?

• 1:00:48Speaker 02

  I understand, um, and I mean, in her friend's defense, probably taking all three of them would be a lot.

• 1:00:55Dr. John Delony?

  Well, you know what? That's a good point. Like, as kids get older, there is, they're gonna have, like, the eight-year-old's gonna have, there's a big difference between six and eight and eight and 10, then there is four and six, right? So that is gonna happen more and more and more as they get older. And you'll have a younger son whose big brothers are starting to leave and go do other stuff, and he's gonna get mad and upset, what? That's just, that's life right there. So you're exactly right on that.

• 1:01:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think someone expecting to take all three of your children, whether they're perfect little angels or, you know, rambunctious boys, is a lot.

• 1:01:27Dr. John Delony?

  Yes.

• 1:01:27Speaker 02

  So you invite them over, or, because they also do need to learn to play with other children.

• 1:01:32Dr. John Delony?

  Yes, yes, yes, yes.

• 1:01:33Speaker 02

  And abide by the rules at that person's house. But when they're at your house,

• 1:01:37Dr. John Delony?

  Let them rip.

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  Have at it.

• 1:01:38Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't think it's she's wrong or right.

• 1:01:40Dr. John Delony?

  Yeah, that's the time and place, yeah. And we all know snooty other parents who are like, mm. And so, no, if somebody's looking down their nose at your child, or more specifically at you, they're opting out. If somebody's calling out behaviors and actions in your own kids that drive you crazy that you know is a problem, then

• 1:02:00Dr. John Delony?

  you gotta deal with those.

• 1:02:01Speaker 02

  Right, or if they're calling out bullying, or, um, your child's roughhousing went too far, you know, they're mean.

• 1:02:07Dr. John Delony?

  They're breaking stuff in my house.

• 1:02:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, they're hurting my child, then that's a different thing.

• 1:02:11Dr. John Delony?

  My mom got many of those phone calls from neighborhood mothers growing up. So, gosh, so many of them. Um, and it's important to learn time and place, right? So, good call. Yeah, there's not really, uh, am I the problem here on this one? I need more context to really be able to make a call. But, um, I do love the question, and every parent has some time for reflection. Um, and the more parents reflect, man, the better we are all gonna be. Thank you so much for the calls. Love you guys. Stay out of trouble. Bye.