The D.C. Snipers: Murder Manipulation and a Lost Boy Pt. 2

In the fall of 2002, John Muhammad and his teenage accomplice Lee Boyd Malvo killed nearly 20 people across the mid-Atlantic and southern United States, paralyzing the nation with fear. Until a trail of careless mistakes finally led investigators to the pair sleeping in their Chevy Caprice at a Maryland rest stop. If you’re new here, don’t forget to follow Serial Killers & Murderous Minds to never miss a case! Want all 2 parts of every case all at once? Join Crime House+ and get both parts of each case dropped together on Monday ad-free. Join atcrimehouseplus.com http://crimehouseplus.com or if you’re listening on Apple Podcasts, tap “Try Free” at the top of this show’s page. Serial Killers & Murderous Minds is a Crime House Original Podcast, powered by PAVE Studios. 🎧 Need More to Binge? Listen to other Crime House Originals Clues, Crimes Of…, Murder True Crime Stories, Crime House 24/7, and more wherever you get your podcasts! Follow me on Social Instagram: @Crimehouse https://www.instagram.com/crimehouse/TikTok: @Crimehouse https://www.tiktok.com/@crimehouseFacebook: @crimehousestudios https://www.facebook.com/crimehousestudiosYouTube: @crimehousestudios https://www.youtube.com/@crimehousestudios

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Vanessa Richardson?

  Hi, everyone. Before today's episode, there's another show I want to tell you about. It's called What the Fact with Connor Tomlinson from Netflix's Love on the Spectrum and Carter Roy. Every week, they take three unbelievable true facts from history and tell you the full story behind them. Plus, Connor's infectious energy that'll make you realize history is the most fascinating thing on earth. Follow What the Fact wherever you listen or subscribe on YouTube at What the Fact Pod.

• 0:36Speaker 01

  This is Crime House.

• 0:42Vanessa Richardson?

  There's a saying that goes, "You are the average of the five people you spend the most time with." It's the idea that those closest to us have the most influence over our goals, success, and overall mindset. The thought is validating for those who feel surrounded by loyal friends, happy family, and reliable coworkers. For others who aren't so lucky, it could be the motivation they need to cultivate new relationships. And then there are those who don't even realize the impact others have on them. They might not realize the toxic influence someone has until it's too late. In the case of Lee Boyd Malvo, his mentor and father figure, John Muhammad, was more than toxic. He was deadly.

• 1:28Vanessa Richardson?

  John convinced Lee to commit horrific acts of violence. Eventually, Lee no longer recognized himself. And by the time he realized what had happened, there was no going back. He'd been transformed into a killer.

• 1:54Vanessa Richardson?

  The human mind is powerful. It shapes how we think, feel, love, and hate. But sometimes, it drives people to commit the unthinkable. This is Serial Killers and Murderous Minds, a Crime House original. I'm Vanessa Richardson.

• 2:10Tristin Engels?

  And I'm forensic psychologist Dr. Tristin Engels. Every Monday and Thursday, we uncover the darkest minds in history, analyzing what makes a killer.

• 2:20Vanessa Richardson?

  Crime House exists because of listeners like you. Want even more? Join Crime House Plus and get both parts of every story dropped on the same Monday, completely ad-free. No waiting three days for part two. Plus, Crime House bonus episodes every month. To join, go to crimehouseplus.com. Or if you listen on Apple Podcasts, tap "Try Free" at the top of the Serial Killers and Murderous Minds page. Before we get started, be advised that this episode contains discussion of abuse and murder, so please listen with care. Today, we conclude our deep dive into Lee Boyd Malvo and John Muhammad, better known as the DC Snipers. In the early 2000s, John and Lee terrorized the DC metropolitan area and the rest of

• 3:05Vanessa Richardson?

  the nation. They killed almost 20 innocent victims and injured even more, all so that John could get to his real target: his ex-wife. But despite all of John's planning, a series of careless mistakes finally brought them down.

• 3:22Tristin Engels?

  As Vanessa goes through the story, I'll be talking about things like how some killers become more crazed over time, why they may leave behind daunting messages for the police, and how the cycle of abuse can factor into murder trials.

• 3:37Vanessa Richardson?

  And as always, we'll be asking the question, what makes a killer?

• 3:46Vanessa Richardson?

  The best clothing investments are the ones you reach for day after day, and that is Quince's whole specialty. They craft elevated staples from top-tier materials, including washable silk, organic cotton, and pure 100% Mongolian cashmere. Starting at just $50, their cashmere sweaters are smooth, long-lasting, and remarkably affordable. My personal Holy Grail is their 100% European linen maxi skirt in classic mini gingham. It fits perfectly, it feels amazing, and it looks tailor-made for me. Alongside denim, Quince offers sleek leather bags, cashmere accessories, and 14-karat gold jewelry designed to finish off your look. Because they eliminate traditional middleman markups and source directly from ethical factories, prices are $50 to $100.

• 4:30Vanessa Richardson?

  Eighty percent lower than competitors. They even apply that honest pricing structure to home essentials like linen duvet covers and bath items. Find the fall pieces you'll reach for most at Quince. Download the Quince app for app exclusive offers or go to quince.com/murderous. Get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada and the UK too. That's Q U I N C E dot com slash murderous.

• 5:00Vanessa Richardson?

  By February of 2002, 41-year-old John Mohammed had brought his protege, 16-year-old Lee Boyd Malvo, into his plot to kill his ex-wife Mildred. John's end goal was to gain custody of his three young children, John Jr., Selena, and Taliba. His plan involved carrying out a killing spree as a way to make Mildred's eventual death seem random, but even though John planned to kill strangers, he started with someone he knew. On February 16th of that year, he'd instructed Lee to kill Kenya Cook in Tacoma, Washington. Kenya was related to a woman who'd helped Mildred get away from John. Afterward, John gifted Lee with a fake ID with the name John Lee Mohammed.

• 5:45Vanessa Richardson?

  It was John's way of symbolically adopting Lee as his own son, and it meant more to Lee than he was able to put into words. At the same time, John could tell Lee was shaken by what he'd just done, and to the military veteran, that kind of reaction was unacceptable. So despite his "fatherly" gesture, over the next few days, John was extremely abusive toward Lee. He berated him for being weak and forced him to play violent video games to remind him how to stay cool under pressure.

• 6:18Tristin Engels?

  I just want to take a quick moment to dispel any myths regarding video game use. The research generally does not support the idea that violent video games turn people into violent offenders. Millions of people play violent video games without committing violent crimes. Video games can desensitize people to violent imagery.

• 6:40Tristin Engels?

  But there is no evidentiary support that they will teach Lee to remain quote, "cool under pressure." He's not in an actual military simulation. It's not at that level of realistic, nor is he likely experiencing genuine life-threatening fear when he plays these video games. Jump scares maybe, but life-threatening fear is far less likely. But what John is effectively doing is teaching Lee that empathy, guilt, fear, and emotional conflict are signs of weakness that need to be suppressed, ignored, or overcome. And remember when Lee hesitated before killing Kenya? That was likely because of some empathy. And without that, though, future violence becomes easier.

• 7:24Vanessa Richardson?

  Well, John didn't just use video games to attempt to brainwash Lee. He also put the teenager through weapons training and physical drills. After about a month of all that, John felt like he'd honed Lee's killer instinct. They planned to strike in the Tacoma area again. However, in early March 2002, they were arrested for shoplifting food. Once they were out of police custody, John thought they should get out of Dodge. So they got on a bus to Tucson, Arizona, where John's sister lived. While there, they cased a nearby golf course and found a concealed area with a clear shot onto the links. On March 19th, they settled into their hiding spot while a 60-year-old man named Jerry Taylor

• 8:07Vanessa Richardson?

  was practicing, alone and unassuming. John gave the order, and Lee fired a single shot, hitting Jerry in the chest. He died instantly. Then either John or Lee ran onto the course and stole Jerry's cash and credit cards from his wallet. After that, they both fled to the nearest bus stop, but John stopped before getting on. He told Lee they should wait for the cops to show up. He wanted to witness the chaos they had caused. It made him feel powerful.

• 8:39Tristin Engels?

  Throughout the story, we've seen that John appears to be a highly controlling and dangerous person. He controlled what Mildred wore, he threw away her belongings and then gaslit her, he became jealous when her attention was directed toward his children, he stalked and threatened Mildred when she tried to leave. Again and again, we see him reacting aggressively when people exercise independence or move beyond his influence. And then he loses control when Mildred leaves. She obtains a protection order, she reports the children abducted, she changes her name and moves across the country. The people he most wanted to control are no longer under his control, so he plots his revenge and here we are.

• 9:22Tristin Engels?

  John saying that watching the police response made him feel powerful isn't surprising when you consider all of that. In fact, it fits him. For perhaps the first time in years, he isn't the one reacting, everyone else is. He knows something they don't know. He's directing events from the sidelines while everyone else will be scrambling to understand what's happening. That's a level of influence that he's never had before. This is all about control for him.

• 9:53Vanessa Richardson?

  As John rode the high of their Tucson murder, he still tried to keep tabs on his ultimate target, his ex-wife Mildred. To do that, he enlisted the help of a father's rights group, and in May of 2002, about two months after Jerry's murder, the group told him they'd tracked Mildred down in the Maryland suburbs of Washington DC, specifically an area known as Clinton. So John decided it was time for him and Lee to head east. In September of 2002, they took a Greyhound bus from Arizona to Maryland. As they sat quietly, watching the landscape rush by, John noticed the bus driver's backpack on the floor near her seat. Before he and Lee got off, John reached into the backpack and stole the driver's credit cards.

• 10:38Vanessa Richardson?

  It was enough to get them started in Maryland, however, the cards were soon canceled and they were in need of more money. So John revisited an earlier tactic, targeting restaurant workers leaving their shifts and carrying the cash they'd earned. And at some point, they obtained a new firearm. On the night of September 5th, they waited outside an Italian restaurant in Clinton. At 10:30 PM, the owner, 55-year-old Paul LaRufa, stepped outside. Lee shot him six times before he and John stole $3,500 from Paul, as well as his laptop. Then they fled. They didn't stick around this time, so they had no idea that Paul had lived.

• 11:22Vanessa Richardson?

  Unfortunately, he didn't see who'd shot him, so he wasn't able to give a description. Investigators stored the bullets from Paul's wounds as evidence, but they had little else to go on. Meanwhile, John knew he and Lee needed a more reliable mode of transportation, so he used the cash they stole from Paul to buy a dark-blue 1990 Chevy Caprice from an acquaintance in New Jersey. Now, he and Lee could travel wherever they wanted, whenever they wanted. To conceal their crimes even more, John cut a hole in the trunk of the car above the rear license plate. The opening was just big enough to fit the barrel of a gun. He also removed the back seats, so whoever was shooting could easily stay concealed.

• 12:06Vanessa Richardson?

  Now, the car wasn't just their means of travel, it was their hideout and their getaway. And about a week later, they struck again. One night, they pulled into the parking lot of a beer and wine store in Maryland, about seven miles outside of DC. At around 10 PM, the owner of the store, Arnie Zelkowitz, and an employee, Benny O'Broy, stepped outside. All of a sudden, a shot rang out, and Benny fell to the ground. He'd been hit in his lower back, but fortunately, he lived. Neither Benny nor Arnie saw who did it, but when the police arrived, an employee at a nearby restaurant said they spotted an older, dark-colored Chevy peel out of the lot right after the shooting.

• 12:51Vanessa Richardson?

  However, investigators assumed it was just another bystander leaving the shopping area, and they shrugged off the tip. So John and Lee were free to strike again, the very next night. On September 15th, they parked outside a liquor store just eight miles from Paul LaRufa's restaurant. As the store's owner, Mohammed Rashid, closed up for the night, Lee fired at him twice. Rashid was hit, and he fell to the ground. He was still alive, but he didn't get up. Something inside him told him to pretend he was dead. Moments later, John approached and started rifling through Rashid's pockets. Rashid remained still as John took his wallet and ran off.

• 13:34Vanessa Richardson?

  Then Rashid rolled over, pulled out his cellphone, which John had somehow missed, and called 911. A helicopter airlifted Rashid to the hospital, where doctors told him he'd be okay. After surgery, he told investigators that before he was shot, he'd seen a dark car in the parking lot with two men inside. Police once again ignored the tip about the car. However, they did note that the bullets recovered from Rashid's injuries came from the same kind of gun they believed had been used in the attack on Paul LaRuffa. While the authorities didn't officially link the two crimes, they took note of the similarities. And in the meantime, John was emboldened.

• 14:15Vanessa Richardson?

  He didn't know whether the police had connected things, but the possibility crossed his mind, and it excited him. John realized he didn't just want to be perceived as a local threat, but a national one.

• 14:29Tristin Engels?

  The fact that John's excited people are potentially connecting these crimes is what's most interesting to me psychologically. That seems like a shift in focus. The shootings are no longer just producing victims to make the appearance of random killings so he can successfully murder his ex-wife. They're creating recognition. People are talking about them, trying to understand them, and changing their behavior because of them. John is no longer anonymous, even if his name remains unknown. He is realizing his actions are becoming meaningful on a larger scale. And if he's attracted to power, which I think it's safe to say is the case, then that power just got exponentially bigger in his eyes.

• 15:11Vanessa Richardson?

  Do you think John actually has a clear motive? Or is he just driven by this desire to kill, and he's finding any excuse to do that?

• 15:19Tristin Engels?

  It's really hard to say for sure. But if John's sole objective was to kill Mildred, there were far simpler ways to accomplish that goal. He had previously gone to her house with a rifle. He was capable of planning and thinking strategically. He could have devised another method that did not involve numerous innocent victims. He could have used Lee, who had no obvious connection to Mildred, to do that, the same way he's using him right now. Instead, he created this plan that required repeated acts of violence against complete innocent strangers. That doesn't tell us exactly what his motive was or if he's just desiring to kill, but it does suggest that something more than Mildred's death

• 16:02Tristin Engels?

  may have been psychologically important to him. And the scale of the violence far exceeded what was necessary to accomplish what he alleges is his objective. And what we can say with relative certainty is John is driven by power and control. He's instrumental. He's manipulative. And he does seem to be enjoying this.

• 16:24Vanessa Richardson?

  Confident he could prove he and Lee were a major threat, John decided they should branch out. He was eager to see what kind of terror they could stoke across the nation. And the further he and Lee went, the more they unraveled.

• 16:45Vanessa Richardson?

  By September 2002, 41-year-old John Muhammad and 17-year-old Lee Boyd Malvo had killed two people and injured three more across three states. The authorities hadn't connected the dots across the different jurisdictions. And as John's confidence grew, he became fixated on the idea of stoking national fear. So next, he set his sights on the deep south. It's not clear why John chose this region specifically, but once they arrived, he and Lee didn't waste any time. At around 12:00 a.m. on September 21st, they pulled into a liquor store parking lot in Atlanta, Georgia. They turned off the engine and waited. 41-year-old Millian Waldemarion was closing up for the night

• 17:29Vanessa Richardson?

  when he noticed the dark blue Chevy outside. He didn't recognize it, so he stepped out to see what was going on. When he did, Lee fired and hit Millian in the head. He and John then stole his wallet and sped off. First responders soon flooded the scene. They rushed Millian to the hospital. Unfortunately, he died hours later. Atlanta detectives recovered the bullets, but at the time, they weren't aware of the shootings in other states. And since no one else had been around to see the blue Chevy, John and Lee quickly high-tailed it out of Georgia and into Alabama without any issues. Around 7:00 PM that same day, John and Lee shot two liquor store employees in Montgomery,

• 18:12Vanessa Richardson?

  24-year-old Kelly Adams and 52-year-old Claudine Parker. Kelly survived, but Claudine did not. This time, when police analyzed the scene, they found different pieces of evidence than what John and Lee had left behind before. Officers not only recovered bullet fragments that appeared to have come from an M16, but they also found a matching magazine. And when they analyzed the mag, they found fingerprints.

• 18:40Tristin Engels?

  Offenders are not always highly sophisticated. They're not always completely reckless either. In reality, they're often both. John and Lee have put in a considerable effort in planning their crimes and their targets, as well as their escape routes. But leaving some evidence at the scene isn't unusual. People tend to be good at planning for the risks they anticipate and much worse at planning for the ones that they don't. Another factor is success. The longer they avoid being caught, the more confidence they develop in their methods. And that confidence can gradually turn into complacency. They may begin focusing on what has worked in the past and pay less attention to potential mistakes.

• 19:21Vanessa Richardson?

  Police in Alabama had obtained crucial evidence, but unfortunately, the fingerprints weren't a match for anyone in their existing database. While multiple police departments struggled to zero in on their suspects, John and Lee headed next to Baton Rouge, Louisiana. And on September 23rd, they shot and killed a 45-year-old beauty store employee named Hong Im Ballinger. They stole Hong Im's purse before fleeing. As they escaped, another employee spotted their dark-colored Chevy. It's unclear what other evidence the Baton Rouge authorities gathered, but John decided it was time for him and Lee to head back to the DC area where his ex-wife Mildred lived. It seemed like he was making things up as he went,

• 20:05Vanessa Richardson?

  driven purely by a need to kill. Then around 6:00 PM on October 2nd, John and Lee shot and killed a 55-year-old man named James Martin in a parking lot in Wheaton, Maryland. They didn't steal anything from James like they had with previous victims. Instead, they sped off and found a rest area where they slept for the night. John was fully unchained now. Starting at around 7:40 AM on October 3rd, John and Lee killed four people in under two and a half hours. The first was 39-year-old James Buchanan Jr., a landscaper who was pushing a lawnmower when he was shot. As they drove off, Lee showed signs that he was becoming just as crazed as John.

• 20:48Vanessa Richardson?

  He laughed at the sight of the lawnmower continuing on without James.

• 20:53Tristin Engels?

  Laughter doesn't always mean something was funny in the way that we normally think of humor. Human beings laugh for many different reasons. People sometimes laugh when they're uncomfortable, frightened, overwhelmed, shocked, or struggling to process something emotionally. That said, there are a few reasons Lee could have responded that way. I mean firstly, humor is a defense mechanism. People sometimes laugh when they're confronted with situations that are uncomfortable to them because it creates distance from an experience or reality that is hard to process. It can also serve as a release of tension after a highly stressful event, and certainly sounds like that was a stressful event. Second, the laughter could be his way of aligning with John's expectations.

• 21:37Tristin Engels?

  Remember, by this point, John had repeatedly criticized empathy, distress, fear, and hesitation as signs of weaknesses. So if Lee had learned that those reactions were unacceptable to him, he may have felt pressured to respond with a reaction that didn't generate concern, especially if he felt he had to release some emotion, then laughter would be a safe one, one that signaled alignment with John. And lastly, it could very well be an indication of Lee's changing relationship to violence. Constant exposure to violence or violent imagery can cause desensitization. Whatever the case, it's a very different reaction than the one we saw with Kenya.

• 22:20Vanessa Richardson?

  As the two continued their spree, Lee seemed completely disconnected from reality. That morning, he and John killed two more people within a mile and a half radius: 54-year-old Prem Kumar Walakar, 34-year-old Sarah Ramos, and 25-year-old Lori Ann Luis Rivera. They shot Prem Kumar while he was filling his gas tank, Sarah while she waited for a bus, and Lori as she vacuumed her minivan at a gas station. These events marked a major shift in the investigation. Once so many murders occurred in quick succession, the police realized they may have a sniper on their hands, and that it was only a matter of time before they took yet another victim. Investigators acted fast.

• 23:04Vanessa Richardson?

  This time, a witness at the scene of Sarah Ramos's murder described seeing a white van with two men inside. Apparently, the van sped off right after Sarah was shot. Police put out a BOLO for the van, and soon tips came flooding in. However, John and Lee weren't driving a white van, they were in their blue Chevy. Hiding in plain sight, they went on to kill 72-year-old Pascal Charlotte in the city of DC that night. John shot Pascal as he stood on a street corner waiting to cross. Police in Maryland quickly connected with the DC police. They realized they were probably looking for the same shooter, who was clearly on the move. John must have sensed that police were catching on, because he decided to strike further

• 23:49Vanessa Richardson?

  away next time. He and Lee drove to Fredericksburg, Virginia, about an hour outside DC. On October 4th, Lee shot a 43-year-old woman named Carolyn Seewell. However, he and John didn't realize she survived. So John decided to scale things up again, but this time, he came up with a plan Lee never would have expected. John told Lee that he knew of a place where they could target multiple victims in one spot: a local middle school, specifically Benjamin Tasker Middle School in Bowie, Maryland. John also insisted that Lee be the one to pull the trigger as kids got off the bus in the morning. Lee was torn.

• 24:30Vanessa Richardson?

  He didn't want to let John down, but he also wasn't comfortable killing children.

• 24:36Tristin Engels?

  Lee is finding himself once again in another lose-lose conflict. And the last time Lee hesitated was when he encountered Kenya. He likely hesitated, as we discussed, because he identified with her. And to identify with someone, generally, there has to be some level of empathy. That is possibly what is happening here. Lee has been a vulnerable child throughout his life. And because of that, children may not feel like anonymous victims to him in the same way that adults do. They may feel more familiar, more relatable, or more deserving of protection. Another possibility is that children occupy a different moral category for many people. Even individuals who have committed serious violence

• 25:19Tristin Engels?

  sometimes maintain boundaries regarding children as targets. And having worked in prisons and jails for over a decade, I've seen this for myself. It's a very real limit. And whatever it is, this hesitation tells us that Lee still has independent values, and he's questioning what he is being asked to do, rather than accepting it without question, like he has with the rest of their victims. So children appear to be a boundary for him, and it's more likely than not that he identifies with their vulnerability, and he wants to protect that.

• 25:52Vanessa Richardson?

  Lee may have been apprehensive, but he no longer had a sense of right and wrong. The only thing on his mind was John's orders. So on the morning of October 7, 2002, Lee took his position in the woods near Tasker Middle School. At around 8:00 a.m., he saw he had a clear shot of 13-year-old Iron Brown. Lee didn't want to disappoint John, but he also couldn't live with himself if he killed an innocent child. So he found a middle ground. Lee aimed for Iron's abdomen instead of his head. Fortunately, Iron survived, but the attack marked a major shift in the national response to the shootings. Schools everywhere canceled outdoor activities and sports,

• 26:35Vanessa Richardson?

  and people actively avoided restaurants, supermarkets, and gas stations. John and Lee had achieved the kind of mass fear and confusion that John had wanted, but he wasn't about to stop. Over the next week, the pair killed three more people in Virginia: 53-year-old Kenneth Bridges and a 47-year-old FBI analyst named Linda Franklin. The news of the shootings became the top headline across the nation. Because so many of the crimes had been committed in the DC metropolitan area, the media branded the unknown killer "the DC sniper", unaware that a team of shooters was at large. Across the country, anxiety and panic skyrocketed,

• 27:18Vanessa Richardson?

  especially because people were still reeling from the 9/11 attacks just one year earlier. All anyone wanted was for the violence to stop. And soon, people started donating reward money to catch this ruthless killer. The pot grew into the hundred thousands, and that's when John realized the crimes could make him rich. When he realized how much reward money was being offered, John thought he could extort that money instead. Even though financial gain wasn't his original motive, John became blinded by dollar signs. He told Lee they'd try to get $10 million. But John's vision was short-sighted,

• 27:59Vanessa Richardson?

  and soon, his "get rich quick" scheme would land a target on his own back.

• 28:10Vanessa Richardson?

  For most of us, home security was never really about the house itself. It's about the people inside it, the ones you'd do anything to protect. A break-in leaves a permanent mark, even if nothing's taken, because it's the exact moment your home stops feeling safe. That's why I rely on SimpliSafe. Ever since setting it up, I get to leave the house without that nagging anxiety, knowing my family and my space are truly protected. What sets SimpliSafe apart is that while other systems only react once a break-in has already begun, SimpliSafe is engineered to keep threats away from your door in the first place. Their smart, AI-powered cameras watch for potential risks and instantly alert a live, US-based security specialist. In under 30 seconds, an agent can speak directly through the camera

• 28:54Vanessa Richardson?

  to confront an intruder, stopping them in their tracks and Requesting urgent 911 dispatch when needed. Knowing a threat is stopped outside before ever getting close to my family is what real peace of mind feels like. Join the more than 6 million people who entrust SimpliSafe with their home security. Right now, save 60% off and claim a free outdoor camera with professional monitoring when you visit simplisafe.com/serialkillers. That's simplisafe.com/serialkillers. And when you order, please write in serial killers and murderous minds in the checkout survey. It lets them know we sent you and really helps support the show. SimpliSafe, ahead of crime, in real time.

• 29:37Speaker 03

  Did you know a volcano once blocked out the sun and accidentally gave us Frankenstein? Or that the most feared pirate in the Atlantic, the man who terrorized an entire ocean, may never have actually killed anyone? Hi, I'm Connor Tomlinson. You might know me from Love on the Spectrum. History is my thing and has been my whole life.

• 29:58Speaker 01

  And I'm Carter Roy, and this is What the Fact. Every week, we take three of the wildest true things ever recorded and tell you the whole story behind them. The facts that sound made up, the stories that got buried, the moments that changed everything.

• 30:13Speaker 03

  Carter brings the history.

• 30:15Speaker 01

  Connor brings the facts, the tangents, and the occasional British accent.

• 30:19Speaker 03

  Pip, pip. The wildest stuff is real.

• 30:22Speaker 01

  And the real stuff is wilder than you think.

• 30:25Speaker 03

  New episodes every Wednesday. Follow What the Fact on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or subscribe on YouTube at What the Fact Pod.

• 30:40Vanessa Richardson?

  In early October of 2002, John Muhammad and Lee Boyd Malvo had gotten away with 14 murders and six non-fatal shootings. They felt like they were untouchable. As the authorities searched desperately for leads and members of the public donated reward money, John realized there was more to gain from their crimes. He decided they should try extorting money from law enforcement. He and Lee started using payphones to call the FBI tip line, as well as the Maryland authorities. They referenced crimes in other states, like the one in Alabama, and threatened to keep killing unless they got the money they wanted. But no one took the bait. Investigators were just too overwhelmed with all the incoming tips

• 31:24Vanessa Richardson?

  and couldn't act on each one right away. As their petty cash dwindled, John and Lee grew more frustrated.

• 31:31Tristin Engels?

  It seems like John's motives continued to shift throughout their killing spree, but in reality, it actually highlights the type of offender John really is. So initially, his violence appears connected to a specific objective involving Mildred. But as the attacks continue, his crimes generate fear, attention, influence, media coverage, and now potentially money. As a result, like you outlined, John is discovering new rewards and has become increasingly willing to exploit whatever opportunities the shootings create. Whether that's power, attention, control, recognition, or financial gain, the violence is the tool, and that is opportunism.

• 32:15Vanessa Richardson?

  Soon, John and Lee tried out a new method to get their money. On October 19th, 2002, they traveled to Ashland, Virginia, about 90 miles south of DC. Lee ventured into the woods behind a restaurant, where he thumbtacked a note to a tree. The note outlined their demands, which included $10 million. But that wasn't all. Lee and John still possessed a stolen credit card from Arizona. It had been canceled, and they wanted it reactivated with unlimited access to any ATM worldwide. They provided all the card info. Once the note was in place, Lee settled into a spot with a clear view of the restaurant. And just before 8:00 PM,

• 32:57Vanessa Richardson?

  he shot and wounded 37-year-old Jeffrey Hopper as he and his wife walked to their car. Local investigators, along with agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, arrived on the scene. The ATF's gunpowder-sniffing dog led them into the woods, directly to the tree where Lee had left the list of demands. But it turned out, that wasn't all he'd left behind. Lee also discarded an empty snack food bag on the ground. Investigators saved it, analyzed it, and realized it was covered in fingerprints. Between that and the credit card information, FBI agents were confident they could zero in on a suspect. Pretty soon, they realized the card had been canceled a month earlier, after it was stolen

• 33:42Vanessa Richardson?

  from a Greyhound bus driver in Arizona. This was one of the first key discoveries that helped the authorities realize just how far-reaching the sniper murders really were. And as agents continued digging, they noticed a record of a recent tip caller who'd mentioned a fatal shooting in Alabama. The FBI contacted the Alabama authorities and learned that the shooting was not only real, but that they'd obtained prints from a discarded gun magazine. This discovery blew the case wide open. Pretty soon, the FBI and DC-area police realized that those prints were not only a match for the ones found on the snack food bag, but that belonged to a teenage boy named Lee Boyd Malvo.

• 34:27Vanessa Richardson?

  Lee's information had been entered into a federal database after he and his mother once tried to illegally enter the US. But that wasn't the only thing they found in his file. Apparently, Lee's mother, Una, had recently entered a bitter custody battle with a man named John Muhammad. According to Una, Lee had run away to live with John, and John had told Una he intended to adopt Lee. Now, authorities had two suspect names. It was the first time they realized John and Lee might be working together. Now, it was just a matter of tracking them down. Unfortunately, they didn't work fast enough.

• 35:07Vanessa Richardson?

  On October 22, 2002, John and Lee shot and killed a 35-year-old man named Conrad Johnson on the top step of the commuter bus he drove in Aspen Hill, Maryland. When investigators combed the scene, they found another note, but it didn't contain demands, nor did it contain any potentially identifying information. It simply read, quote, "Your incompetence has cost you another life," end quote.

• 35:35Tristin Engels?

  This note serves no practical purpose. It doesn't help them obtain money or advance their objective. It certainly doesn't help them avoid being captured. It's just communicating for the sake of communicating, which tells me there's a desire to influence, criticize, or interact with law enforcement beyond what's actually necessary. They're also shifting responsibility and blame for their actions onto law enforcement. That signals that John is positioning himself as the person of power and authority, which is not unlike what he's done in his relationships with Mildred or even Lee. The gaslighting, the coercion, the manipulation, the Darvo. Abusers are great manipulators and understand the importance of narrative control, which we talked about in episode one.

• 36:19Tristin Engels?

  What's happening here could reflect John's growing confidence, his need for recognition or enjoyment from taunting police, or maybe a combination of these, which is often the case. The police have gone from obstacles to audience, and an audience makes him feel powerful.

• 36:36Vanessa Richardson?

  John seemed to enjoy taunting the police, but he had no idea that his past mistakes would soon be his own demise. Investigators were digging up old records on John and learned about his history of domestic abuse. They quickly found Mildred and took her and the children into protective custody, foiling the original intention behind his plan. And John's history of abuse wasn't all they found. Detectives also scoured traffic logs and discovered that John had a 1990 Chevy Caprice registered under his name. They finally realized they weren't looking for a white van at all. And now they put a BOLO out on the Chevy's license plate number.

• 37:17Vanessa Richardson?

  About two days later, on October 24th, 2002, a Maryland driver spotted the Chevy at a rest stop and called the police. And at 3:15 a.m., a SWAT team surrounded the car, with John and Lee sleeping inside. When they woke up and realized what was happening, it was too late. They had nowhere to run. The D.C. sniper's reign of terror was over.

• 37:49Vanessa Richardson?

  With John and Lee finally in custody, the entire country breathed a sigh of relief. The families of their victims could properly grieve. But as far as true justice was concerned, the real work was just beginning. Since the crime spanned several states and involved different violations, federal authorities pursued the charges they felt were most likely to lead to convictions. John was charged with one count of capital murder in Virginia and six counts of first-degree murder in Maryland. He was also charged with conspiracy, committing murder during an extortion scheme, and possessing weapons while under a domestic order of protection. Lee received the same murder charges in Virginia and Maryland, as well as committing murder during an extortion scheme.

• 38:34Vanessa Richardson?

  The prosecution and the public wanted to see John and Lee pay severely for their crimes. And when John went to trial, it was clear they'd get their wish. In November of 2003, John Muhammad was convicted of capital murder and received the death penalty. Two years later, he was found guilty on the remaining six counts of murder. When Lee went to trial, his attorneys hoped that John's convictions would work in their favor. They called a psychologist to the stand, who said John was a mastermind who brainwashed Lee. The lawyers used this argument to build an insanity defense. They said that between the violent trainings and the fact that John had isolated Lee from

• 39:16Vanessa Richardson?

  his loved ones, Lee had entered a dissociative state. In other words, he'd completely lost touch with reality.

• 39:24Tristin Engels?

  That's a very high burden to meet. But first, let's discuss what a dissociative state is. It's a disruption in the normal integration of consciousness, memory, identity, perception, or awareness. People experiencing dissociation may feel detached from themselves, disconnected from their surroundings, emotionally numb, or as though events are happening in a dream. In severe cases, they may have memory gaps or feel like they're observing themselves from the outside. It doesn't mean that they've lost touch with reality like they're describing necessarily. They're still oriented, they know who they are, they know where they are, they know what's happening around them, they're just experiencing it differently.

• 40:06Tristin Engels?

  That's where I think the defense argument becomes more complicated if they're arguing that alone. Based on what we've discussed, there is evidence that Lee was, in fact, isolated. He was manipulated, dependent on John, and subjected to repeated psychological influence. Those factors could potentially affect judgment, autonomy, decision-making, and certainly contribute to dissociative symptoms. So the idea that Lee was profoundly influenced by John is not unreasonable at all. But that's very different from proving that he was legally insane or completely detached from reality. Legal insanity means that because of a mental disease or defect, they were unable to appreciate

• 40:48Tristin Engels?

  the wrongfulness of their actions at the time of the offense. And throughout all of this, across multiple states, there's also evidence that Lee did understand what he was doing. He took steps to avoid being caught, he followed plans, and he recognized the consequences of failure. Those facts can make it more difficult to argue that he was in a dissociative state. I think the stronger argument for the defense, legally and forensically speaking, is that his thinking, judgment, identity, and decision-making may have been heavily shaped by a relationship with someone with a lot of influence over him. That said, I don't think that is enough to satisfy the legal standard of insanity, which

• 41:33Tristin Engels?

  varies by jurisdiction. And I have never met nor evaluated Lee personally, but criminal responsibility cases are notoriously hard to prove.

• 41:45Vanessa Richardson?

  In the end, the insanity defense did little to help Lee. In December of 2003, he was found guilty on all the same murder counts as John. However, the jury decided not to sentence him to death, and he received life in prison without the possibility of parole. It's unclear whether the two ever spoke again after their trials, and seven years later, on November 10, 2009, 48-year-old John Muhammad was put to death. As of this recording, 41-year-old Lee Boyd Malvo is serving out his life sentence at Keene Mountain Correctional Center in Virginia. Although in 2020, changes to Virginia law made him parole-eligible, so far, it's been

• 42:27Vanessa Richardson?

  denied, but a court has ruled that he needs to be resentenced, which hasn't happened as of this recording. In the time since the shootings, Lee has come to realize how much of a hold John had over him and the sheer amount of evil he carried out under John's orders. He's told reporters that he was a monster for what he did. Tragically, that realization came far too late.

• 43:05Vanessa Richardson?

  Thanks so much for listening. Come back next time for a deep dive into the mind of another murderer.

• 43:11Tristin Engels?

  Serial Killers and Murderous Minds is a Crime House original powered by Pave Studios. Here at Crime House, we want to thank each and every one of you for your support. If you like what you heard today, reach out on Instagram at @crimehouse. Don't forget to rate, review, and follow Serial Killers and Murderous Minds wherever you get your podcasts. Your feedback truly makes a difference.

• 43:33Vanessa Richardson?

  And to enhance your listening experience, join Crime House Plus and get both parts of every story dropped on the same Monday, completely ad-free. No waiting three days for part two, plus Crime House bonus episodes every month. To join, go to crimehouseplus.com, or if you listen on Apple Podcasts, tap "Try Free" at the top of the Serial Killers and Murderous Minds page.

• 43:59Vanessa Richardson?

  Serial Killers and Murderous Minds is hosted by me, Vanessa Richardson, and forensic psychologist Dr. Tristin Engels, and is a Crime House original powered by Pave Studios. This episode was brought to life by the Serial Killers and Murderous Minds team: Max Cutler, Ron Shapiro, Alex Benedon, Lori Marinelli, Natalie Pritzowski, Sarah Kemp, Alyssa Fox, Dana Rossi, Sarah Batchelor, Kaylee Pine, and Carrie Murphy. Thank you for listening.

• 44:33Vanessa Richardson?

  If you're looking for your next podcast, check out What the Fact with Connor Tomlinson from Netflix's Love on the Spectrum and Carter Roy. Every week, they take three unbelievable true facts from history and tell you the full story behind them. Follow What the Fact wherever you listen, or subscribe on YouTube at What the Fact Pod.